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Speaker 1: Welcome to another edition of The Johns Little Podcast, brought

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Speaker 1: to you by Citizens, the official bank at the Giants.

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Speaker 1: I am John Schmelk. Very excited to welcome back to

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Speaker 1: the show for a second time. He joined us back

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Speaker 1: I think early September, late August to preview the season.

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Speaker 1: We said we join up again before the draft, and

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Speaker 1: here he is former NFL general manager Ran Carthon.

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Speaker 2: Ran, it's good to talk to you, man. How are you, man?

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Speaker 3: I'm good man. Like we were just talking about off

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Speaker 3: air feeling old went out of town one day this week,

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Speaker 3: came back with a cold wik immune system. It's just

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Speaker 3: life is life.

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Speaker 1: And dude, I've been dealing with like hippercitis for like

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Speaker 1: six weeks and I haven't been to play basketball. It's

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Speaker 1: been absolutely killing me. But it's this old man problems.

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Speaker 1: That's pretty much what it is.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Absolutely, but hey, I wouldn't have it any other way.

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Speaker 3: Glad I'm above ground having these problems. Then the other

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Speaker 3: side of it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you're absolutely right. And look, this is the fun

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Speaker 1: type of year, right for people like you. This is

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Speaker 1: where you guys, you know, run your craft, make your money.

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Speaker 1: So the Giants here you kind of go through free

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Speaker 1: agency and what kind of start a big picture first? Right,

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Speaker 1: you go through free agency, you try to fill as

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Speaker 1: many holes as you can so you're not trapped in

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Speaker 1: terms of what you want to do in the draft.

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Speaker 1: But a lot of these giants signed, as least some

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Speaker 1: of them were one of your deals, like Greg Newsmith

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Speaker 1: corner or Donald Mooney, Calvin Austin a wide receiver. They

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Speaker 1: haven't gotten a guy that you would think is going

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Speaker 1: to be their starting right guard. Yet when you think

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Speaker 1: about guys on one year deals and then you start

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Speaker 1: thinking about the draft, do they even kind of enter

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Speaker 1: your thought process ran in terms of when you assess

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Speaker 1: your needs or is drafting a guy such a long

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Speaker 1: term proposition? You almost act like those one of your

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Speaker 1: guys almost aren't even here, you know what I mean?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? No, the one of your guys are you know,

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Speaker 3: in most cases are they're bridges? Right? Because you can't

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Speaker 3: just assume, well, we'll get this guy in the draft, right.

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Speaker 3: You don't know how the draft is going to fall.

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Speaker 3: You don't know what moves are going to be made

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Speaker 3: around you that will prevent you from getting a guy

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Speaker 3: you cover it, you don't. I mean, obviously the folks

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Speaker 3: within the Giants front office. They're doing their homework, they

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Speaker 3: have their sources, they have their resources to find out information,

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Speaker 3: but you can't lean on that. And so when the

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Speaker 3: opportunity presents itself for you to be able to get

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Speaker 3: a bridge, specifically a player you know or you've coached

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Speaker 3: or coached against that you think can help you and

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Speaker 3: help establish a new way, because it's different from being

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Speaker 3: a program where the head coach has been around a

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Speaker 3: long time versus a new head coach coming in that

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Speaker 3: wants to implement his way of doing things. And you

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Speaker 3: need purveyors of your message. You need guys that can

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Speaker 3: carry your message throughout the locker room and be the

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Speaker 3: epitome of what you want the Giants program to be

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Speaker 3: moving forward. So those one year deals just kind of

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Speaker 3: help you bridge the gap just in case you're not

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Speaker 3: able to address those positions via the draft.

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Speaker 1: I think that makes sense when you look when you

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Speaker 1: assess your needs as a general manager, when you go

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Speaker 1: into a draft rand, how much do you look two

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Speaker 1: years down the road. This is a thing I did

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Speaker 1: on our Big Book kickoff live show last week and

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Speaker 1: say all right, well, I'm going to have a whole

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Speaker 1: disposition in twenty two twenty seven in this spot, In

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Speaker 1: this spot, I'm worried about that. Just an example, the

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Speaker 1: Giants right now don't have a garter or center under

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Speaker 1: contract for the twenty twenty seven season.

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Speaker 2: I might think that's a problem.

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Speaker 1: How much are you looking two years down the road

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Speaker 1: and not just that this year when you're thinking about

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Speaker 1: who you're going to draft.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I always say you got to have one foot

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Speaker 3: in the current year and one in your eyes out

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Speaker 3: in the coming years, right, because it's all it's forecasting.

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Speaker 3: You got to see the future to a degree or

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Speaker 3: understand what's coming in the future. How hard is it

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Speaker 3: going to be to re sign Kievon Thibodeau after this

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Speaker 3: year with the amount of money that that position is getting,

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Speaker 3: and whether you feel like him or any other pass

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Speaker 3: rusher is worth the money they're getting, that's the market.

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Speaker 3: It's like the housing market. You know, you may not

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Speaker 3: want to pay those prices for a home in a

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Speaker 3: specific neighborhood, but if you want to live in that neighborhood,

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Speaker 3: that's the price you're going to have to pay. And

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Speaker 3: so for the Giants right especially at the address position,

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Speaker 3: those are what I call first world problems. You know,

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Speaker 3: you have three legitimate guys, three guys that we know

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Speaker 3: can play in the league, that can get after the quarterback.

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Speaker 3: And so now you put yourself in a position where

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Speaker 3: if you don't want to pay Thibodeau after a couple

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Speaker 3: of years, and you know, you have Abdul Carter and

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Speaker 3: someone that you believe that can be a solid replacement

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Speaker 3: for Thibodeaux or or Brian Burns for that matter. However

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Speaker 3: they decide to do it within their organization. But you know,

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Speaker 3: to answer your question, you have you have to have

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Speaker 3: you know, your foot in twenty twenty six and this

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Speaker 3: cycle of player acquisition, but with your eyes to twenty

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Speaker 3: seven and twenty eight.

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Speaker 2: Now. The other thing, too, Ran, is that freegency is

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Speaker 2: not over right.

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Speaker 1: The first wave is over, you can argue the second

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Speaker 1: wave is over, but there's still a bunch of guys,

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Speaker 1: mostly veterans, that are still out there.

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Speaker 2: You know, maybe these guys are waiting for more money

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Speaker 2: to come your way.

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Speaker 1: Maybe these guys just don't want to do the offseason program

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Speaker 1: and they're happy to, you know, sign in July and

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Speaker 1: show up for training camp. How much do you consider

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Speaker 1: the conversations you might have had as a general manager

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Speaker 1: with some of the freegents that are still available. I'm

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Speaker 1: thinking let's say, for say example, Greg Van Roe for

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Speaker 1: the Giants, he was the start of the last two

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Speaker 1: years of right guard. He's still a free agent. He

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Speaker 1: signed laning the process his first year here. When you're

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Speaker 1: thinking about what you have to do in the draft

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Speaker 1: based on needs and maybe what free agents you think

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Speaker 1: you can still get in the building even after the

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Speaker 1: draft you get to mad June and July things like that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean you're looking at that. You're still monitoring,

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Speaker 3: you're having you know, whether if you're the Giants, whether

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Speaker 3: it's you know, Brandon Brown or Dennis Hickey or whomever,

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Speaker 3: Tim McDonald, those guys are still staying in touch with

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Speaker 3: these agents. Of the free agents that are out there,

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Speaker 3: they're kind of keeping their eyes and their ears to

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Speaker 3: the street, understanding what the market is, how much of

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Speaker 3: the money is drying up. Because if you're a free

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Speaker 3: agent and you're still on the street because you're holding

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Speaker 3: out what the hopes are having more money, you're just

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Speaker 3: a bad business person, right because the money's the money's

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Speaker 3: drying up. And then now teams are going to have

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Speaker 3: to I mean, it's already budgeted for. But you got

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Speaker 3: a budget for your draft picks, right, and who knows

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Speaker 3: what may happen on draft now you may acquire more picks,

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Speaker 3: which now you know, adds to that budget that you've

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Speaker 3: allocated for being able to sign the draft picks, and

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Speaker 3: you got to have operating expenses heading into the season,

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Speaker 3: and so that money is drying up. But I think,

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Speaker 3: you know, for let's use the example you said, Greg

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Speaker 3: van Roten. I'm sure they've been talking to his you know,

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Speaker 3: his people and again new regime, so you know, the

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Speaker 3: Greg van Roten fit may not necessarily fit, but I'm

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Speaker 3: sure it does. And so the conversation is probably being

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Speaker 3: had with his team just in terms of, hey, we're

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Speaker 3: still interested. What do you guys have you know, if

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Speaker 3: he wants to take his time. You know, there may

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Speaker 3: be some other things that we're not you know, privy

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Speaker 3: to that may be going on, but you're having those conversations.

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Speaker 3: You're keeping your ears and your eyes open to it.

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Speaker 3: I know, for myself, I think it was, yeah, my

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Speaker 3: first year in the chair, signed DeAndre Hopkins late in

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Speaker 3: the process, and I think but I think he got released.

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Speaker 3: I think he had a post June one designation, but

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Speaker 3: it was all things that we had understood what were

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Speaker 3: going on, still understanding that there are some cap casualties

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Speaker 3: who may be cut, just again with the understanding of

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Speaker 3: what's to come that forecasting I was talking about.

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Speaker 2: Previous Yeah, exactly.

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Speaker 1: And if not Van Rohden, then you know, Daniel Folele

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Speaker 1: was someone that was with Harba.

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Speaker 2: Kevin Zeitler was someone that was with.

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Speaker 1: Harball, right, and one of those guys that guard that

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Speaker 1: you think can kind of bring in and play that

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Speaker 1: spot if you don't end up drafting one of those players.

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Speaker 1: All right, let's talk about the draft process.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 1: As a general manager, what did you get out of

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Speaker 1: this part of the process where you're going to pro day's,

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Speaker 1: you're seeing guys work out, you're doing the thirty visits.

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Speaker 1: What are you trying to achieve in this you know,

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Speaker 1: last run up of three four weeks before the draft.

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Speaker 3: Well, I'll be honest with you. Always call this is

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Speaker 3: I called the earlier part of process everyone being nosy, right,

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Speaker 3: is because everyone's trying to figure out what the next

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Speaker 3: person is doing, who likes who, who's showing up where.

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Speaker 3: So you know, for me, pro day. For some of

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Speaker 3: the guys that I may not have been able to

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Speaker 3: see move around live, I would like to see them

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Speaker 3: move around live again. For me, it's I take a

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Speaker 3: different approach to it because I lean heavily on the

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Speaker 3: tape and what the tape has shown me over the

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Speaker 3: last couple of seasons. But like certain positions, and I

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Speaker 3: talked about this somewhere I was on air this week,

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Speaker 3: like the quarterback position, you know, I want to be

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Speaker 3: at the pro day to see how his teammates respond

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Speaker 3: to him, to see how people in the building react

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Speaker 3: to him, see how he engages with people in the building,

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Speaker 3: because to me, that tells you a lot about the

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Speaker 3: person and the human because I'm a big believer in

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Speaker 3: not being able to get the right type of person

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Speaker 3: to come into and you know, and insert them into

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Speaker 3: not only the organization, but your city and your state

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Speaker 3: because they have to be good people. So that type

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Speaker 3: of stuff is important. But then also again and I

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Speaker 3: have some of the stuff here in front of me,

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Speaker 3: just going back in my research, because I was just

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Speaker 3: recently at the Universe of Miami's Pro Day where the

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Speaker 3: Giants came out, had a large contingency of people there

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Speaker 3: those are some of the things I pay attention to

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Speaker 3: as well. I look at the trends like you know,

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Speaker 3: for example, if back in the day with the Pittsburgh Steelers,

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Speaker 3: if Mike Tomlin, Kevin Colbert, and I want to say,

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Speaker 3: Dan Rooney, if they were all at a pro day,

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Speaker 3: you knew they were really interested in a particular player, right.

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Speaker 3: And so those are like the little things, those little

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Speaker 3: type nuggets I'm looking at and trying to figure out. Okay,

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Speaker 3: I saw Joe Shane, I saw Brandon Brown. You know,

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Speaker 3: I saw this person. I saw this person, I saw

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Speaker 3: Dennis Hickey. I'm like, Okay, who are they interested in? Right?

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Speaker 3: And give that gives you tips because now if you're

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Speaker 3: sitting there within a certain range, then you know, okay,

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Speaker 3: and they've top thirty visited this guy, there's a chance

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Speaker 3: that they're looking here. So we may and it's a need,

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Speaker 3: so we may have to position ourselves to move ahead

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Speaker 3: of them if there was a player that we specifically covet.

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Speaker 3: But just in terms of the evaluation process, I think

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Speaker 3: I think I used the combine in the pro day

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Speaker 3: more so to confirm what I've seen on tape.

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Speaker 2: That makes sense.

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Speaker 3: You know, if a guy goes out and he runs

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Speaker 3: four to three, then now I could go back to

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Speaker 3: my notes and say, hey, man, I thought this guy

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Speaker 3: could really run on tape. So I'm not wild. And

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Speaker 3: just because he runs four to three doesn't mean I'm

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Speaker 3: moving him up four rounds, you know, on my draft board,

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Speaker 3: just because he ran a specific time, I lean heavily

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Speaker 3: on the tape, and I judged more so the play

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Speaker 3: speed than a necessary time speed.

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Speaker 1: Well, you talk about play speed, and you're right, you

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Speaker 1: do watch that on tape. How much did you use

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Speaker 1: and how useful did you find some of the college

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Speaker 1: GPS data that you guys get now in terms of

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Speaker 1: they give you actual play speed, some changing direction stuff sometimes.

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Speaker 1: How much did you use that and how useful was

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Speaker 1: that in conjunction with the tape and some of the

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Speaker 1: time stuff at the combine.

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Speaker 3: No, you use it, you know, obviously as a part

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Speaker 3: of it. The greatest example I love to give is

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Speaker 3: when I was in San Francisco and we were in

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Speaker 3: the draft process and we were watching Dre Greenlaw, the linebacker,

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Speaker 3: and I think in his pro day he may have

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Speaker 3: ran like four to seven, and we were like, I

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Speaker 3: don't know if that time is right, like he plays

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Speaker 3: so much faster than for seven, and so you know,

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Speaker 3: we everyone was stumped, right, everyone was stumped. And it

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Speaker 3: didn't help. Like dre was five or eleven under two thirty

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Speaker 3: and then you run for seven. You're like, that's kind

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Speaker 3: of an ugly card that you're looking at on the

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Speaker 3: draft board. But then we was like, okay, well let's

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Speaker 3: use our resources. Let's contact you know, our sources at

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Speaker 3: University of Arkansas, and let's let's get some of these

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Speaker 3: GPS times. Well, you get the GPS times and you

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Speaker 3: see that he's reached twenty miles an hour, he's reached

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Speaker 3: twenty one miles an hour. And this was back at

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Speaker 3: a time where the GPS times they just gave you

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Speaker 3: that one good urse. But now the GPS times can

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Speaker 3: give you that max speed and how long they were

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Speaker 3: able to hold that max speed, which I think is

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Speaker 3: as a better indication of how fast someone is versus

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Speaker 3: that one quick burst. You don't know what that burst was.

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Speaker 3: You don't know if he was in chase mode because

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Speaker 3: he got beat, you know, and he's just just laying

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Speaker 3: it all on the line, and so you know, it's

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Speaker 3: it's a better indication now of those, you know, for

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Speaker 3: the speeds you know, because again you're watching play speed

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Speaker 3: you can understand better because i mean, let's face it,

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Speaker 3: some guys just can't run afford them, right, and that's

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Speaker 3: just is what it is. Or you have those guys

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Speaker 3: that it's you don't have pads on and you've trained

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Speaker 3: for it and you're just running in a straight line

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Speaker 3: for forty yards as fast as you can. Well we

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Speaker 3: all know. And John, you've been around the game a

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Speaker 3: ton of years. You know, when you're playing on the

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Speaker 3: actual football field, instincts have a pardon to it, right,

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Speaker 3: So if you don't you could be you could run

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Speaker 3: for it too, But if you don't know where you're going,

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Speaker 3: you're not going to move as fast, right, So so

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Speaker 3: all those things come into account. But to answer your

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Speaker 3: larger question, you used the GPS times to kind of

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Speaker 3: again confirm what you've seen on tape.

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Speaker 1: And also, you can run really well when you're in

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Speaker 1: shorts and a T shirt when you're wried about guys

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Speaker 1: hitting you, you might not be running as fast on the field, Diner,

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Speaker 1: which is.

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Speaker 2: Part of the scenario there as well.

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Speaker 1: Joined by Rank Carthon, he's the coast with Ryan Wilson

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Speaker 1: on the with the First Pick the podcast on CBS.

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Speaker 1: We thank you for joining us. You mentioned traits when

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Speaker 1: you're told about Dre green Law. Did you have thresholds

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Speaker 1: at each position? How hard and fast were you with

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Speaker 1: those thresholds in terms of height, weight, length stuff like that.

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Speaker 1: I feel like this draft class there's a lot of

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Speaker 1: outliers at a lot of different positions, Like, so, how

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Speaker 1: did you treat those traits and kind of what you

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Speaker 1: found were your thresholds at positions and just kind of

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Speaker 1: how you work through that part of it.

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Speaker 3: Oh, yeah, we definitely had Again, we're in the data

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Speaker 3: age now, and so you have all the historical data.

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Speaker 3: You know, based on your offensive, defensive, special team systems.

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Speaker 3: You have specific size, size, speed, length thresholds. One of

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Speaker 3: the cool things that this whole Shanahan, McVeigh, Lafleur Tree

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Speaker 3: specifically with their offenses, they have what we would have

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Speaker 3: meetings that we call profile meetings, profile tape meetings, where

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Speaker 3: every position coach would put together a profile of what

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Speaker 3: they wanted their room to look like. So, if you're

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Speaker 3: a wide receiver coach, you're gonna come in and you're

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Speaker 3: gonna have your your wide receiver profile tape meeting. You're

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Speaker 3: gonna have what you want your EX to look like,

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Speaker 3: what you want your Z to look like, what you

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Speaker 3: want your F. And then they even win as far

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Speaker 3: as given us the prototype right. So at the prototype

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Speaker 3: X Julio Jones proto type Z is you know Davonte

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Speaker 3: Adams prototype F. You know, let's say Wes Welker or whomever. Well,

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Speaker 3: whatever it is that you're wanting out of those positions,

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Speaker 3: and then give us clips. You get clips of how

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Speaker 3: you know, when we say, hey, double up at the

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Speaker 3: line of scrimmage, here's ten clips on what we're talking about.

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Speaker 3: You know, when we're talking about being able to stack,

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Speaker 3: you know, the corner at the line of scrimmage, here's

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Speaker 3: what we're talking about. So you get those tapes and

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Speaker 3: what that allows. It makes the scout's job easier because

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Speaker 3: now you can take the guesswork out of it. You

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Speaker 3: know specifically what fits in your system. And the cool

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Speaker 3: thing for you guys is you guys have a new

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Speaker 3: defensive coordinator in Denard Wilson, who I've worked with at

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Speaker 3: two different stops. We work together at the Saint Louis

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Speaker 3: Slash La Rams and then we work together most previously

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Speaker 3: in Tennessee. He has that for his defense, right, he

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Speaker 3: knows exactly what he wants at every single position, what

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Speaker 3: it looks like. It can give you the example of

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Speaker 3: what it looks like. So it's gonna make the scout's

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Speaker 3: job easier to pull defensive players that fit the Nard system.

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Speaker 3: Same thing with the new pass game coordinator and obviously

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Speaker 3: worked with him here, Brian kaller Head. Because of his

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Speaker 3: previous experiences, he knows exactly what he wants in the quarterback. Now,

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Speaker 3: you guys are in a unique position because you already

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Speaker 3: have a quarterback, but you know, moving forward, what does

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Speaker 3: he want out of the backup quarterback? What are the

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Speaker 3: traits that he's looking for? And having the next guy

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Speaker 3: behind Jackson Dart So that's going to make the scouts

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Speaker 3: job easier. And again you go back, I mean, just

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Speaker 3: take it all the way down to the top of

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Speaker 3: John Harball. When John Harbaugh took over as the head

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Speaker 3: coach of the Baltimore Ravens, the Raven Way, if you will,

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Speaker 3: had already been established. There are only certain teams in

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Speaker 3: the league where it's the Baltimore Ravens, it's the Pittsburgh

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Speaker 3: still is. When you say those two franchises names, an

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Speaker 3: image of what that player looks like immediately comes to

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Speaker 3: your head, right, And that's what the Giants used to

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Speaker 3: be back in the day when it was a par

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Speaker 3: sales team. You knew exactly, you know, what a New

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Speaker 3: York Giant looked like. It was a literal Giant, you

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Speaker 3: know what I mean. And so I think you guys

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Speaker 3: will get back to that way where there be a

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Speaker 3: certain fit of type, of certain fit InStyle of player

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Speaker 3: that will symbolize what the New York Giant is.

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Speaker 1: All right, So I guess before we get to the

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Speaker 1: Giants by pick at five, then we should probably talk

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Speaker 1: about what you think this offensive defense might look like

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Speaker 1: and what they're looking for, right you Ever, you have

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Speaker 1: a lot of experience on defense with Dinard Wilson, as

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Speaker 1: you mentioned. I was going to get that at the end,

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Speaker 1: but I think we should do it now. What do

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Speaker 1: you think this defense is going to look like? What

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Speaker 1: is he looking for and in terms of how he

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Speaker 1: wants to fill out the corner position, the linebacker spot,

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Speaker 1: just what is going to be the personality of this

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Speaker 1: defense and what type of players will be looking for?

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Speaker 3: You? Well, I can tell you the personality of the

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Speaker 3: defense will be about dogs. It'll it'll all be about dogs.

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Speaker 3: And I don't know how much I'll say, you can

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Speaker 3: beep it out on the edit, but Dinard has an

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Speaker 3: acronym dog d A w G A discipline with grit,

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Speaker 3: And that's what That's what this defense will look like,

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Speaker 3: a bunch of discipline with grit. And so you're going

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Speaker 3: to see guys flying around, being violent, obviously within the rules,

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Speaker 3: you know, playing to the echo of the whistle, and

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Speaker 3: just initiating contact right, not sitting back waiting on things

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Speaker 3: to happen, but dictating the tempo themselves. That's what the

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Speaker 3: defense will look like. I'm interested to see what the

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Speaker 3: offense is going to look like, obviously with with with

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Speaker 3: Matt Naggy coming over as the offensive court.

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Speaker 1: Because you got Naggy, you got Roman, you got Callahan,

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Speaker 1: all the kind of three different systems, right, I'm really

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Speaker 1: curious to see what it looks like.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and I'm I'm you know, I'm obviously real, you know,

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Speaker 3: real curious about that myself. Just more so really to

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Speaker 3: see what the passing game is going to look like

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Speaker 3: in the concepts. Now again, hey if we're being realistic.

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Speaker 3: There's only so many different route combinations that you can

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Speaker 3: come up with at this point. But it'll be interesting

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Speaker 3: to see how that all comes together.

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Speaker 2: How is it shotgun? Is it under center?

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Speaker 1: Like?

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Speaker 2: I want to see all that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and and I think you will just because of

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Speaker 3: you know, just Naggy's let's call it West Coast system background.

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Speaker 3: I think Callahan has the same background as does Greg Roman.

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Speaker 3: I think they've all evolved just based off of the

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Speaker 3: players that they've had. But I think all three guys

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Speaker 3: foundation is the West Coast offense, So I think you'll

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Speaker 3: see more of those concepts. Has just evolved to a newer,

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Speaker 3: to a newer way of getting there.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think John Harbot is still gonna want

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Speaker 1: to have a you know, the head coach's personality is

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Speaker 1: gonna come out in this right, So it's gonna be

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Speaker 1: a physical, run oriented offense, I think, first and foremost correct.

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Speaker 3: No, I think so. And I was thinking about that

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Speaker 3: before we were coming on, just in terms of where

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Speaker 3: the Giants could go at five, because I think they're

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Speaker 3: gonna I mean, we all know the draft starts at two,

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Speaker 3: and I think by the you know, the closer we

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Speaker 3: get to it, I don't know that. I think that

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Speaker 3: even that picture will probably number two pick will come

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Speaker 3: a little bit more clear, and so I ultimately do

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Speaker 3: think the wild card right now is the Arizona Cardinals

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Speaker 3: and where they'll go, which I think you know, and

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Speaker 3: I know we'll get to it here in the second.

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Speaker 3: But I think there'll be a nice little clump of

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Speaker 3: players for the Giants at five. I think there may

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Speaker 3: be a perfect world scenario. But then I also think

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Speaker 3: there'll be a nice clump at five that they'll be

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Speaker 3: choosing from.

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Speaker 2: Hoddle up. Get in here. If you're lined up here,

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Speaker 2: you gotta go over the middle with at the score great.

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Speaker 3: How do we make that happen?

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Speaker 2: I don't know, but Citizens does make sense of your

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Speaker 2: money with Citizens Official Bank of Eli Manning.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think there will be two. All right, folks,

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Speaker 1: we'll get to the pick right now, but don't forget

434
00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:35,800
Speaker 1: the Giants on The podcast is brought to you by Citizens

435
00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:37,919
Speaker 1: Official Bank at the Giants from game day celebrations, your

436
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437
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438
00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:44,960
Speaker 1: dot com slash Giants. All Right, ran So let's talk

439
00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:47,760
Speaker 1: about it. Pick number five here. I don't think we

440
00:20:47,840 --> 00:20:49,920
Speaker 1: know exactly who's going to be available, so we'll kind

441
00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:52,520
Speaker 1: of talk about a clump of players. Let's start here.

442
00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:55,320
Speaker 1: Where does your like kind of first tier of top

443
00:20:55,359 --> 00:20:57,399
Speaker 1: top guys in this class? And I think I have

444
00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:01,479
Speaker 1: I'll kind of push Mendoz's this, he's a quarterback. They're separate.

445
00:21:01,720 --> 00:21:04,520
Speaker 1: But I think I have three position guys that I

446
00:21:04,560 --> 00:21:07,359
Speaker 1: have kind of in my top top tier above everybody else.

447
00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:11,119
Speaker 1: I'm curious kind of where you have that line drawn,

448
00:21:11,560 --> 00:21:13,639
Speaker 1: maybe four, where you have that line drawn where you

449
00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:15,800
Speaker 1: first get that drop off in this year's draft class.

450
00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:22,320
Speaker 3: Well, I think the ultimate drop off, let's just say.

451
00:21:22,359 --> 00:21:24,399
Speaker 3: You know, I don't want to. I feel like the

452
00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:26,640
Speaker 3: number that first came to my mind is kind of low.

453
00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:29,200
Speaker 3: But I think the.

454
00:21:29,160 --> 00:21:31,119
Speaker 1: First mine, I mean, look, I have, I got Reese

455
00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:35,640
Speaker 1: styles downs and then kind of Bally's hovering around there,

456
00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:37,919
Speaker 1: Ban's hovering around there, and that's kind of what my

457
00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:40,399
Speaker 1: first group looks like, with Delane and Tate kind of

458
00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:41,560
Speaker 1: hovering as well.

459
00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:44,120
Speaker 2: It's it is. It isn't a big blue chip group

460
00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:44,879
Speaker 2: this year. It's just not.

461
00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:47,760
Speaker 3: No, it's it's definitely not but from you know, from

462
00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:51,920
Speaker 3: that standpoint, you know, I love our velies. I've been

463
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:54,800
Speaker 3: a Caleb Downs fan for a very, very, very long time.

464
00:21:55,320 --> 00:21:58,000
Speaker 3: He was actually the first player I evaluated from this

465
00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:01,440
Speaker 3: year's draft class, and I did that probably two weeks

466
00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:03,960
Speaker 3: after last year's draft, just because I had been waiting

467
00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:06,159
Speaker 3: so long to be able to watch him and actually

468
00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:07,000
Speaker 3: evaluate him.

469
00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:07,760
Speaker 2: I did the same thing.

470
00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:11,520
Speaker 3: That's funny, but just always been a big fan of his.

471
00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:15,119
Speaker 3: But I think as you go, I think there are

472
00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:19,480
Speaker 3: certain players that I think will be better pros than

473
00:22:19,520 --> 00:22:23,680
Speaker 3: they were college players. One player I'm super duper intrigued

474
00:22:23,720 --> 00:22:27,680
Speaker 3: by is the wide receiver Chris Brassel out of Tennessee.

475
00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:33,080
Speaker 3: And it's unfortunate that Giants fans have the history with

476
00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:38,880
Speaker 3: Jalen Hyatt and they kind of clump Chris Brassel into that.

477
00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:42,800
Speaker 3: And the hard part for anybody, I believe, is evaluating

478
00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:46,320
Speaker 3: these receivers out of this University Tennessee offense, because if

479
00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:49,000
Speaker 3: they're not on the front side of the route progression,

480
00:22:49,119 --> 00:22:51,480
Speaker 3: then they're on the backside, just walking off the line

481
00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:54,880
Speaker 3: of scrimmage. It's not because they're lazy or they don't

482
00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:58,199
Speaker 3: play hard. It's just what they're taught right, and so

483
00:22:58,240 --> 00:23:00,560
Speaker 3: you don't really get to see those guys running variety

484
00:23:00,600 --> 00:23:03,920
Speaker 3: of routes. But if you watch the film close enough,

485
00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:07,399
Speaker 3: where you pour through enough film, you see all the

486
00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:09,000
Speaker 3: traits you need to see out of a guy like

487
00:23:09,080 --> 00:23:13,120
Speaker 3: Chris Brasel to say that he can definitely do it.

488
00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:17,200
Speaker 3: Coming into the season, I had Jordan Tyson ranked as

489
00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:21,000
Speaker 3: my number one wide receiver because I thought you saw

490
00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:25,239
Speaker 3: him perform more like a number one wide receiver, you know,

491
00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:27,960
Speaker 3: as opposed to Carnell Tate. Not taking anything away from

492
00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:30,760
Speaker 3: Cardinal Tate, I think he's just had the luxury of

493
00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:34,639
Speaker 3: planning with so many great players that it allowed him

494
00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:37,000
Speaker 3: to have a lot of one on one matchups on

495
00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:41,080
Speaker 3: the backside. So I think the big talk right now,

496
00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:46,480
Speaker 3: probably among scouts, amongst coaching staffs, is is Carnell Tate

497
00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:51,120
Speaker 3: a legitimate number one wide receiver? Right? And then how

498
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:56,919
Speaker 3: much is the hamstring injury concerns gonna affect Jordan Tyson

499
00:23:57,680 --> 00:23:59,840
Speaker 3: moving forward? I think if you're looking at all things

500
00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:03,240
Speaker 3: can considered, and Jordan Tyson is indeed healthy and the

501
00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:07,000
Speaker 3: hamstring issues that he's had aren't an issue, I think

502
00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:09,119
Speaker 3: to me, he is still the number one wide receiver

503
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:13,920
Speaker 3: in his draft class, because again, you've seen him play

504
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:16,760
Speaker 3: a variety of position. He's played outside, he's played inside,

505
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:19,880
Speaker 3: he's played ACTU, he's plays he's played def and you

506
00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:23,600
Speaker 3: knew at crunch time and Arizona State had a drive

507
00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:25,720
Speaker 3: a guy to have it drive the ball was going

508
00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:29,240
Speaker 3: to Jordan Tyson and the other team knew it too,

509
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:32,960
Speaker 3: and he still made plays. Whereas, again with a guy

510
00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:36,040
Speaker 3: like Carnell Taate, you know, he played the opposite of

511
00:24:37,359 --> 00:24:40,199
Speaker 3: Jeremiah Smith, who got a lot of the you know,

512
00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:42,920
Speaker 3: the coverage looks for they're rolling double coverage over to him,

513
00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:45,600
Speaker 3: and yet and still Ohio State was still looking to

514
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:47,399
Speaker 3: get the ball to Jeremiah Smith and those got to

515
00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:51,240
Speaker 3: have it moments. So but yeah, I think this year's

516
00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:55,520
Speaker 3: draft class may not have the the magnitude of blue

517
00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:59,159
Speaker 3: chip players which you typically want to take in the

518
00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:01,640
Speaker 3: top five to ten. I don't know that a lot

519
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:04,040
Speaker 3: of draft class come out with ten blue chip guys.

520
00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:05,280
Speaker 2: Oh no, absolutely not.

521
00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:09,040
Speaker 3: But I think this year's draft class in particular, probably

522
00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:12,119
Speaker 3: once you get to about the twenty two range, I

523
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:16,720
Speaker 3: think twenty two to let's just broaden it, let's say

524
00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:20,120
Speaker 3: from twenty two to fifty. They're probably all very similar

525
00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:24,320
Speaker 3: and it just becomes your flavor, what you like, what

526
00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:27,560
Speaker 3: you prefer. But I think you can make an argument

527
00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:31,320
Speaker 3: for most of those guys in that top fifty or

528
00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:33,879
Speaker 3: the back half of the fifty to you can make

529
00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:35,560
Speaker 3: an argument for them to go on the back half

530
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:36,600
Speaker 3: of the first round.

531
00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:39,359
Speaker 1: No, Bren, I'm with you one hundred percent. Let's go

532
00:25:39,400 --> 00:25:41,960
Speaker 1: to Downs. You mentioned him very quickly because he did

533
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:45,320
Speaker 1: not test. He's not going to test. He's not big, right,

534
00:25:45,359 --> 00:25:47,680
Speaker 1: He's just over two hundred pounds, he's only six feet,

535
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:51,000
Speaker 1: he's not super long, So you know, it's hard to

536
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:53,440
Speaker 1: put him in that Kyle Hamilton Derwin James class because

537
00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:56,439
Speaker 1: those guys are big physical freaks, right, Downs isn't. But

538
00:25:56,920 --> 00:25:59,639
Speaker 1: like you you watch him, I just feel like the

539
00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:01,920
Speaker 1: way he can read route combinations, he's always in the

540
00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:04,600
Speaker 1: right place. He's dynamited at the line of scrimmage. He's

541
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:07,720
Speaker 1: a great tackler, he's smart, he's versatile. These kind of

542
00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:09,679
Speaker 1: versatile slot guys now are kind of in vogue in

543
00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 1: the National Football League. But how much do you think

544
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:14,399
Speaker 1: about the fact that he didn't test. He doesn't have

545
00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:18,159
Speaker 1: the elite traits, he's a safety and then you're picking five.

546
00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:21,080
Speaker 1: So how do you put all that together? He's one

547
00:26:21,080 --> 00:26:22,920
Speaker 1: of my top players, But how much do you take

548
00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:24,280
Speaker 1: those other things into consideration?

549
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:27,920
Speaker 3: Well, the testing thing, here's what I tell you, John,

550
00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:31,600
Speaker 3: and this is really for me, you and let's call

551
00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:34,600
Speaker 3: it the viewing public. Moving forward. A lot of these

552
00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:38,360
Speaker 3: guys aren't going to test anymore moving forward, right, these players,

553
00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:41,639
Speaker 3: I think they realized their power or the power that

554
00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:43,879
Speaker 3: they have in a way that our generation did it.

555
00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:46,680
Speaker 3: Our generation we showed up at the combine, we did

556
00:26:46,720 --> 00:26:49,320
Speaker 3: whatever you know they told us to do. And if

557
00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:52,000
Speaker 3: you weren't comfortable running your forty led and said, hey,

558
00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:55,359
Speaker 3: I tweaked my hamstring training right, or you know, you

559
00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:58,399
Speaker 3: came up with something. But these guys now will just

560
00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:00,919
Speaker 3: flat out tell you I'm not running. That just is

561
00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:03,399
Speaker 3: what it is. I think you look at Marvin Harrison Junior.

562
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,520
Speaker 3: He didn't do a single thing yep throughout his and

563
00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:12,120
Speaker 3: still went top five. Right again, I don't think any

564
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:14,480
Speaker 3: of these guys are gonna run. Travis Hunter didn't run

565
00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:18,040
Speaker 3: last year. But I think for a guy like Caleb Downs,

566
00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:22,320
Speaker 3: I think he has so much great take on that

567
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:25,040
Speaker 3: you can go back and view. I don't. I don't think.

568
00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:27,240
Speaker 3: I don't think there's anybody out there that believes Caleb

569
00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:29,880
Speaker 3: Down was Downs was gonna run a four to three, right,

570
00:27:29,920 --> 00:27:32,200
Speaker 3: I don't think anybody believed that. I think at best

571
00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:34,159
Speaker 3: you probably thought he would be in the four four

572
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:38,320
Speaker 3: six range. I always said four four eight to probably

573
00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:41,800
Speaker 3: four or five one, which which for safety will be

574
00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:45,920
Speaker 3: is plenty fast. But what I've always loved about him,

575
00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:47,359
Speaker 3: I mean, you go all the way back to his

576
00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:50,640
Speaker 3: freshman year at Alabama, he led Alabama and tackles as

577
00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:54,359
Speaker 3: a true freshman, like name the last person that's done that.

578
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:56,800
Speaker 3: And then he went and had the impact he's had

579
00:27:56,840 --> 00:28:01,480
Speaker 3: at Ohio State and then the specifically this last year

580
00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:05,840
Speaker 3: he plays in an NFL style defense where he's asked

581
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:08,040
Speaker 3: to do a lot. There was a lot on his plate,

582
00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:13,440
Speaker 3: from a multi aligned situation to him being the primary communicator.

583
00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:19,200
Speaker 3: You know, back there, you mentioned that nickel safety hybrid

584
00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:21,760
Speaker 3: role and he did such a great job at it

585
00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:25,600
Speaker 3: again and also playing in the post and also being

586
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:31,680
Speaker 3: a great tackler. I noticed this whole positional value thing, right,

587
00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:35,240
Speaker 3: and I if he's one of your top football players

588
00:28:35,720 --> 00:28:39,920
Speaker 3: on your board, and no matter where you're sitting, if

589
00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:41,440
Speaker 3: you know this guy is going to be a Pro

590
00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:45,360
Speaker 3: Bowl player, why not take him right Because if you

591
00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:48,800
Speaker 3: don't take him now, then guess what four years from now,

592
00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:52,480
Speaker 3: five years from now, if he chooses, if the other team,

593
00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:54,480
Speaker 3: if they get to an impass where they can't get

594
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:56,719
Speaker 3: a contract done, then you're going to be paying them

595
00:28:56,760 --> 00:28:59,680
Speaker 3: twenty five million dollars a year to get him in

596
00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:02,840
Speaker 3: your right, which is to me saying you made a

597
00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:05,360
Speaker 3: mistake the first time anyway and passed up on them.

598
00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:08,720
Speaker 3: So I think there are, like you said before, leading

599
00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:12,640
Speaker 3: into all of this, there are outliers and there are

600
00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:15,800
Speaker 3: certain guys that you say, well, this guy's different. And

601
00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:17,960
Speaker 3: the reason why I think he's a difference maker is

602
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:19,640
Speaker 3: not only on the field, but I think he's a

603
00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:23,880
Speaker 3: culture changer, you know, in your locker room. I was

604
00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:29,640
Speaker 3: fortunate enough this summer to attend David Mullagetta's Elite week

605
00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:33,280
Speaker 3: that he has for all his clients, and there was

606
00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:35,480
Speaker 3: a ton of high school kids there, it was college

607
00:29:35,560 --> 00:29:38,120
Speaker 3: kids there, it was NFL guys there, and Caleb Downs

608
00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:40,800
Speaker 3: was one of them, and I had the opportunity to

609
00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:44,680
Speaker 3: watch him work out and be amongst pros and see

610
00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:48,640
Speaker 3: how he handled himself, and he was a consummate pro

611
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 3: that entire weekend, and I walked away and pressed, you know,

612
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:53,160
Speaker 3: with him even more.

613
00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 1: Would you put Sonny Styles into that same group as

614
00:29:57,040 --> 00:29:58,800
Speaker 1: a character guy, a guy that can help change a

615
00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:02,080
Speaker 1: defense as a middle lineback, talk about that does meet

616
00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:04,320
Speaker 1: all the thresholds and checks all the boxes on trades

617
00:30:04,360 --> 00:30:04,720
Speaker 1: and testing.

618
00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:06,600
Speaker 2: He certainly does that. The tape was very good.

619
00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:09,120
Speaker 1: Would you put Styles into that same type of category

620
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:11,480
Speaker 1: ran when you evaluate these defenders at the top of

621
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:12,080
Speaker 1: the class.

622
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:15,760
Speaker 3: No, I definitely would. And just in terms of just

623
00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:19,640
Speaker 3: who he is off the field, met him at the combine,

624
00:30:19,840 --> 00:30:24,000
Speaker 3: interviewed him for CBS Sports and you immediately walk away like,

625
00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:28,760
Speaker 3: damn if this kid doesn't make it as a football player,

626
00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:31,040
Speaker 3: Like I could see him in the corporate boardroom, yeah,

627
00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:33,680
Speaker 3: you know, and just the way he carried himself and

628
00:30:34,080 --> 00:30:37,040
Speaker 3: loved that about him. I think the Sunny Styles thing

629
00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:40,680
Speaker 3: is interesting because I think I think there's a ton

630
00:30:40,680 --> 00:30:43,360
Speaker 3: of upside there. This is only his second year playing,

631
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:47,959
Speaker 3: you know, playing linebacker after moving down from safety, So

632
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:50,240
Speaker 3: I think I think he is one of the guys

633
00:30:50,240 --> 00:30:52,800
Speaker 3: where that where the arrow is still pointing up. I

634
00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:55,840
Speaker 3: think his best ball is still ahead of him, because

635
00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:58,560
Speaker 3: I did see a significant jump from twenty twenty four

636
00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:01,240
Speaker 3: to twenty twenty five. Twenty twenty four, I saw a

637
00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:05,800
Speaker 3: guy that was hesitant, that didn't necessarily always knew what

638
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:09,760
Speaker 3: he was seeing. And even from his block destruction standpoint,

639
00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:13,160
Speaker 3: it was, you know, he looked he was more willing

640
00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:15,400
Speaker 3: to out athlete the block. And what I mean by

641
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:19,959
Speaker 3: out athlete the block was not necessarily used at you know,

642
00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:22,600
Speaker 3: very good arm length that he had to create the

643
00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:25,400
Speaker 3: separation from the blocks. Everything was running under the block

644
00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:28,800
Speaker 3: or trying to beat the block to a certain point

645
00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:31,840
Speaker 3: where we know at this level, these guys are I

646
00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:33,920
Speaker 3: tell all the young guys that I talk to, I'm like, hey,

647
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:37,200
Speaker 3: you're going to getst grown men who are married with mortgages, like,

648
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:39,400
Speaker 3: they're not going to let you young boys come in

649
00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:42,440
Speaker 3: and make them look foolish. And so these guys understand angles,

650
00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:45,760
Speaker 3: they understand their scheme, and they set you up one

651
00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:51,320
Speaker 3: move ahead, two plays ahead. And so I think from

652
00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:55,680
Speaker 3: a human standpoint, he belongs in that category. I think again,

653
00:31:55,720 --> 00:31:58,080
Speaker 3: depending on where you see his upside and your fit,

654
00:31:58,240 --> 00:32:01,080
Speaker 3: and I can see him going as high as four

655
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:05,680
Speaker 3: to the Titans. Sunny Styles. I know Robert Sala was

656
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:10,160
Speaker 3: enamored with Tremaine Edmonds, who you guys just signed him

657
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:12,440
Speaker 3: coming out. I believe that year we had picked nine,

658
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:17,240
Speaker 3: and I know that, you know, if Robert Sala could

659
00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:21,240
Speaker 3: have had his way, probably likely would have taken Tremaine

660
00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:24,160
Speaker 3: Edmonds at nine. So now that he does have his way,

661
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:26,600
Speaker 3: you have a similar style player that can do a

662
00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:29,520
Speaker 3: lot of the things in that defense that you need

663
00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:31,600
Speaker 3: out of the middle linebacker position that I don't think

664
00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:35,360
Speaker 3: the Titans currently have or you know, in terms of

665
00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:38,560
Speaker 3: they have a great young tackler and Cedric Gray, but

666
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:42,480
Speaker 3: being able to carry that deep crossing route to turn

667
00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:44,880
Speaker 3: run and use your height, your length to affect that

668
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:47,800
Speaker 3: throwing window for the quarterback. They just don't have that

669
00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:50,719
Speaker 3: right now. So I could see sunny Styles going as

670
00:32:50,800 --> 00:32:53,120
Speaker 3: high as four, possibly to the Titans.

671
00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:55,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, a guy that can do Fred Warner type things,

672
00:32:55,640 --> 00:32:57,400
Speaker 1: not that he's Fred Warner, but the guy that can

673
00:32:57,440 --> 00:32:57,680
Speaker 1: do that.

674
00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:02,479
Speaker 3: And I will say, John, it was funny because I

675
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:06,240
Speaker 3: think Tremaine and I'm you know, I'm just trying to

676
00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:08,840
Speaker 3: go back to my mental Roaldecks, but I think Tremaine

677
00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:11,880
Speaker 3: might have been one of the top guys who are

678
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:14,440
Speaker 3: on the board in terms of the linebacker position. And

679
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:16,720
Speaker 3: like I said, if Coache Sala probably could have had

680
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 3: his way, probably would have liked Tremaine at nine. But

681
00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:23,240
Speaker 3: then in the third round of that same draft class,

682
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:26,440
Speaker 3: he got his consolation prize, which was Fred Warner.

683
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:29,200
Speaker 2: Which not a bad consolation prize I always give.

684
00:33:29,280 --> 00:33:32,240
Speaker 3: But I do always give coach Salah and Demiko Ryans

685
00:33:32,360 --> 00:33:35,240
Speaker 3: the full credit when it comes to Fred Warner and

686
00:33:35,400 --> 00:33:38,719
Speaker 3: his development because Fred had never played in the box

687
00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:42,160
Speaker 3: in college. He played kind of a big nickel, kind

688
00:33:42,160 --> 00:33:45,880
Speaker 3: of detached from the formation. But the moment we brought

689
00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:47,840
Speaker 3: him in on a visit, they were like, this guy

690
00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:50,040
Speaker 3: can play Mike, he could be our Mic and lo

691
00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:53,640
Speaker 3: and behold end up drafting a Hall of Famer in

692
00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:54,280
Speaker 3: the third round.

693
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:56,760
Speaker 1: Given everyone else that you know is on the board

694
00:33:56,800 --> 00:33:58,560
Speaker 1: and who might be available, who else would you have

695
00:33:58,640 --> 00:34:02,680
Speaker 1: in consideration ran for the Giants at five? Given Harbaugh,

696
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:05,360
Speaker 1: the coaches with the franchises, needs all that stuff. Who

697
00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:07,360
Speaker 1: else would you be thinking about at five if you

698
00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:08,320
Speaker 1: were running the Giants?

699
00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:10,440
Speaker 3: Right? So, I think in recent years, and I had

700
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:14,719
Speaker 3: to deal with this my second year. Right, we were

701
00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:17,560
Speaker 3: picked six where we picked six?

702
00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:18,120
Speaker 1: Uh?

703
00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:20,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, we were picked six because I think the Giants

704
00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:22,799
Speaker 3: were where did they take Milik Neighbors? Was it four?

705
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:27,919
Speaker 2: Oh? Boy, yes, I think that's perfect. I will double

706
00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:30,160
Speaker 2: check that. Yeah, I number five.

707
00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:35,319
Speaker 3: Was it because I know it went in order? It

708
00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:37,000
Speaker 3: went Mylak neighbors.

709
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:38,680
Speaker 2: And six neighbors was sixth.

710
00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:41,319
Speaker 3: Neighbors was six. So what picked it? We had? Yeah,

711
00:34:41,320 --> 00:34:43,480
Speaker 3: so we had seven that year, So it was five

712
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:47,719
Speaker 3: six seven. Chargers had five, Giants went six, and then

713
00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:50,560
Speaker 3: the Titans we were seven. And so we were sitting

714
00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:53,520
Speaker 3: there and we had a clump of guys and we

715
00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:58,960
Speaker 3: were like, in any form or fashion, Joe Alt, Elite Neighbors,

716
00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:02,279
Speaker 3: JC Latham, If one of those three are there for

717
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:05,640
Speaker 3: us at seven, that's who we're taking. And so I

718
00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:08,280
Speaker 3: look at this year's draft class kind of being similar

719
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:12,400
Speaker 3: for the Giants. Obviously, like we talked about, the draft

720
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:17,520
Speaker 3: starts at two. I think the I think the Jets,

721
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:19,840
Speaker 3: of all things, the Jets kind of hold cards for

722
00:35:19,920 --> 00:35:23,080
Speaker 3: the Giants, right, So there have been talks about I

723
00:35:23,120 --> 00:35:25,600
Speaker 3: think the I think the Jets pick is going to

724
00:35:25,680 --> 00:35:31,359
Speaker 3: come down to rvel rees and David Bailey is what

725
00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:37,600
Speaker 3: I think it'll come ground to. And then so let's

726
00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:41,640
Speaker 3: just assume the Jets take David Bailey at two and

727
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:45,759
Speaker 3: then so now it becomes the Jets, I mean, excuse me,

728
00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:50,080
Speaker 3: the Cardinals. Now you're sitting there at three, and I

729
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:53,759
Speaker 3: think they'll be choosing between CC mile Noora from the

730
00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:58,280
Speaker 3: University of Miami and rvel Reese. Right, I think they'll

731
00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:01,600
Speaker 3: be deciding between those two. And then the Titans are

732
00:36:01,640 --> 00:36:05,360
Speaker 3: sitting there at four. Conventional wisdom says they want an

733
00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:07,560
Speaker 3: edge guy. Know a lot of the mock drafts in

734
00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:12,960
Speaker 3: recent times say the running back Jeremiah Love will be

735
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:17,640
Speaker 3: available to them there at four. Just don't know that

736
00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:20,840
Speaker 3: they'll do that. And so I think, you know, again,

737
00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:23,560
Speaker 3: sunny styles will come in to fold there and then

738
00:36:23,600 --> 00:36:26,680
Speaker 3: they're the Giants at five. So I think some combination

739
00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:31,840
Speaker 3: for me, let's call it rvel Reeves, let's call it

740
00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:35,719
Speaker 3: CC Man Noah, and let's call it Jeremiah Love. Right,

741
00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:40,640
Speaker 3: it's some form of those three will be there within

742
00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:42,799
Speaker 3: that top five. I think that's who the Giants will

743
00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:45,280
Speaker 3: be choosing from. And then I think that next tier,

744
00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:47,480
Speaker 3: which is hard to say a next tier in the

745
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:51,239
Speaker 3: top five, but I think that will be the ideal three.

746
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:53,839
Speaker 3: Then I think after that, I think some version of

747
00:36:54,400 --> 00:37:01,040
Speaker 3: possibly Sunny Styles or Caleb Downs will be there based

748
00:37:01,040 --> 00:37:04,759
Speaker 3: off of who's the best available. Now, the unfortunate part

749
00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:07,239
Speaker 3: for a guy like David Bailey, you can't go back

750
00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:12,320
Speaker 3: to back with another edge rusher in the top five again,

751
00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:15,560
Speaker 3: knowing that you still have Keevon and Thibodeau on your roster.

752
00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:18,000
Speaker 3: That's more of a luxury pick, you know, I would

753
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:21,680
Speaker 3: think with David Bailey. But Arvel Reese is intriguing to

754
00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:25,200
Speaker 3: me because I view him more as an off ball

755
00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:32,080
Speaker 3: linebacker and and I know he's He's told me specifically

756
00:37:32,120 --> 00:37:34,200
Speaker 3: that if he's playing in a three four defense, which

757
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:36,920
Speaker 3: will be the base defense of the Giants, that he

758
00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:40,000
Speaker 3: wants to play outside linebacker. And I understand that, but

759
00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:44,120
Speaker 3: I think that's more so him forecasting the second contract.

760
00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:46,600
Speaker 2: And he's a smart agent.

761
00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:50,640
Speaker 3: Right that outside linebackers get paid more than inside linebackers.

762
00:37:50,640 --> 00:37:53,400
Speaker 3: But I think to maximize his ability, I think you

763
00:37:54,000 --> 00:37:56,439
Speaker 3: play him off ball and based downs, and I think

764
00:37:56,520 --> 00:37:59,239
Speaker 3: in those sub packages kind of how you guys use

765
00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:01,480
Speaker 3: our dual Carter some you walk them around, put them

766
00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:04,120
Speaker 3: in that spinner type role and you can get in

767
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:08,640
Speaker 3: your NASCAR package right and have you know, Thibodeau and

768
00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:11,360
Speaker 3: Burns on the outside, and then you walk a dude

769
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:15,120
Speaker 3: Carter and RVL Reese over guards and then you let

770
00:38:15,120 --> 00:38:18,920
Speaker 3: those guys work the guards, and so you know, I

771
00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:21,319
Speaker 3: think it'll be I think that'll be that next tier

772
00:38:21,840 --> 00:38:25,680
Speaker 3: forever in a day. It always had Cardinal Tap pumped

773
00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:29,799
Speaker 3: at number five for the Giants. I think as we

774
00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:32,759
Speaker 3: go throughout the process, I don't know that that will

775
00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:37,359
Speaker 3: factor in because again you took and I pose this

776
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:43,719
Speaker 3: question to my co host Ryan Wilson on air. I

777
00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:46,680
Speaker 3: was like, would you take Elak neighbors or Carneal tape?

778
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:48,920
Speaker 2: Oh, it's not even close, right.

779
00:38:48,840 --> 00:38:51,120
Speaker 3: And so that that's kind of my point. You know,

780
00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:53,759
Speaker 3: like you're taking another receiver in the top five, and

781
00:38:54,400 --> 00:38:57,640
Speaker 3: there's such a gap between who they are as players.

782
00:38:57,640 --> 00:39:00,239
Speaker 3: You know, Malik is a legitimate number one wire receiver,

783
00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:04,200
Speaker 3: Like that's that's never been a question. So I don't

784
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:06,919
Speaker 3: know that Cardnel tape were factory anymore at five.

785
00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:08,920
Speaker 2: If you want to know how to manage two minutes

786
00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:11,120
Speaker 2: of crunch time football, I'm your man. But if you're

787
00:39:11,160 --> 00:39:13,920
Speaker 2: wondering about a long term financial plan, you should talk

788
00:39:13,960 --> 00:39:16,600
Speaker 2: to Citizens. Hey, I can also talk long care. I'd

789
00:39:16,640 --> 00:39:19,000
Speaker 2: like to learn about a million routine. Yes, I knew

790
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:22,160
Speaker 2: I could help make sense of your money with Citizens.

791
00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:23,600
Speaker 1: All Right, the two guys want to ask you about

792
00:39:23,640 --> 00:39:25,160
Speaker 1: on the follow ups, and I appreciate you taking the

793
00:39:25,160 --> 00:39:27,800
Speaker 1: time this morning, Ran Francis Marionoa, you mentioned how do

794
00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:28,319
Speaker 1: you view him?

795
00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:30,040
Speaker 2: I mean, the Giants just resigned Luminore.

796
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:32,080
Speaker 1: Could you start him in a guard and then maybe

797
00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:34,080
Speaker 1: plan to move him back out to tackle once Luminoor

798
00:39:34,160 --> 00:39:36,880
Speaker 1: is gone? Do you view him as a jolt level

799
00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:39,920
Speaker 1: tackle prospect? And then one guy you didn't mention is

800
00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:43,360
Speaker 1: Monsieur Delaine, who I think is tape is phenomenal to

801
00:39:43,400 --> 00:39:45,160
Speaker 1: pick a corner in the top five, I like him

802
00:39:45,160 --> 00:39:47,560
Speaker 1: to be a little bit longer, just my personal preference.

803
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:50,239
Speaker 1: Do you view those guys as as part of that

804
00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:52,680
Speaker 1: elite tier in this in this class?

805
00:39:53,120 --> 00:39:56,440
Speaker 3: Well, the thing is with Ceci Maut Noah all Fall,

806
00:39:56,520 --> 00:39:59,279
Speaker 3: I had him as my number one guard, like that's

807
00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:00,759
Speaker 3: where I had him on my board. I had to

808
00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:04,600
Speaker 3: miss my number one guard and a lot of it too.

809
00:40:04,680 --> 00:40:08,560
Speaker 3: I don't just look at your measurables, right, like six

810
00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:10,920
Speaker 3: y five, you know, three hundred and twenty pounds, Like

811
00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:11,360
Speaker 3: I don't.

812
00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:13,160
Speaker 1: Just look at that like a guard to me on tape,

813
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:14,640
Speaker 1: that's how he moves at least two day.

814
00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:17,520
Speaker 3: But here's the thing, and so like, I look at

815
00:40:17,520 --> 00:40:21,520
Speaker 3: your body structure, right, like what is your body structure?

816
00:40:23,040 --> 00:40:27,640
Speaker 3: If you look at Peter Skearsky when we drafted him

817
00:40:27,680 --> 00:40:30,239
Speaker 3: at eleven, Peter was six four, I think he was

818
00:40:30,280 --> 00:40:33,560
Speaker 3: three hundred and twenty pounds, but you looked at Peter's

819
00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:36,799
Speaker 3: body structure and it looked like a guard. Like I

820
00:40:36,840 --> 00:40:40,560
Speaker 3: think Trent Williams is six' four and he's three hundred

821
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:42,920
Speaker 3: and twenty pounds coming, Out but you look At trent's

822
00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:47,120
Speaker 3: body structure and he's built, angularly built like a, tackle,

823
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:49,680
Speaker 3: Right and SO i look at. That AND i remember

824
00:40:49,719 --> 00:40:56,200
Speaker 3: seeing Cc malnoa at the twenty twenty Five pro day

825
00:40:56,360 --> 00:40:59,040
Speaker 3: just walking around AND i was, like, oh he kind

826
00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:02,160
Speaker 3: of looks like a, guard like walking around now seeing

827
00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:05,720
Speaker 3: him at the proday this past, week like he looks

828
00:41:05,760 --> 00:41:09,040
Speaker 3: like a. Tackle his body looks really good because and

829
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:11,160
Speaker 3: he wanted to show, off so he had his shirt,

830
00:41:11,160 --> 00:41:14,680
Speaker 3: off you, know and He you, know he looked, good

831
00:41:15,560 --> 00:41:18,560
Speaker 3: but what it did was even prior to The pro,

832
00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:21,440
Speaker 3: DAY i went back AND i watched a lot of

833
00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:24,720
Speaker 3: the playoff tape playing, him watching him have to block

834
00:41:24,840 --> 00:41:28,759
Speaker 3: elite pass rushers on the edge at, tackle and to your,

835
00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:33,120
Speaker 3: POINT i wasn't so sure that he had the initial

836
00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:36,000
Speaker 3: quickness off the line in his past. Set but here's

837
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:40,719
Speaker 3: WHAT i. Learned he makes it look so easy that

838
00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:43,719
Speaker 3: we don't take that as he has the quickness in

839
00:41:43,760 --> 00:41:46,000
Speaker 3: the twitch in his. Body if you can get your

840
00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:48,439
Speaker 3: hands on the Film john of that pro, day you watch.

841
00:41:48,520 --> 00:41:52,120
Speaker 3: Him it was one specific drill where they drop a

842
00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:55,080
Speaker 3: tennis ball and he has to come out. Pull he's

843
00:41:55,160 --> 00:41:57,680
Speaker 3: running full speed and he has to dip and scoop,

844
00:41:57,800 --> 00:42:01,080
Speaker 3: underhand scoop the tennis ball off the around and still

845
00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:06,040
Speaker 3: move like it was. Flawless his ability to bend at the,

846
00:42:06,080 --> 00:42:08,960
Speaker 3: way not just be a wastebender and come Over, ford

847
00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:11,239
Speaker 3: but to be able to bend his knees. Scooping he

848
00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:14,279
Speaker 3: looked like a pass rusher running the, hoop being able

849
00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:17,160
Speaker 3: to and get that low and SO i think he

850
00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:20,960
Speaker 3: could play, TACKLE i asked. HIM i interviewed him after

851
00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:24,120
Speaker 3: The Pro day and asked, him where have teams talked to?

852
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:26,600
Speaker 3: Him do they talk to him about? Guard talk to

853
00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:29,120
Speaker 3: him about? Tackle and he was, like, LISTEN i just

854
00:42:29,160 --> 00:42:31,360
Speaker 3: want to be one of the start in. FIVE i

855
00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:33,359
Speaker 3: don't care if it's, GARRED i don't care if it's.

856
00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:36,360
Speaker 3: Tackle DO i BELIEVE i can play? Tackle, yeah BUT

857
00:42:36,680 --> 00:42:38,920
Speaker 3: i want to be a starter AND i want to

858
00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:40,759
Speaker 3: be one of to start in. Five and so for,

859
00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:45,560
Speaker 3: me what made me ultimately move him back to tackle

860
00:42:45,680 --> 00:42:48,960
Speaker 3: is because and make him the number one tackle is

861
00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:52,280
Speaker 3: BECAUSE i think you're getting a starting tackle and a starting,

862
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:55,480
Speaker 3: Guard AND i think no matter how you shake, it

863
00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:59,440
Speaker 3: you know you have illumina or back and you get

864
00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:02,520
Speaker 3: him and, say, hey this is the succession. Plan. Right

865
00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:05,840
Speaker 3: there have been a lot of great offensive tackles and

866
00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:07,800
Speaker 3: some guys have gone on to Be hall of. FAMERS

867
00:43:07,840 --> 00:43:10,720
Speaker 3: i Think Jonathan ogden started his first year at guard

868
00:43:10,800 --> 00:43:14,080
Speaker 3: for The Baltimore. Ravens there have been a ton of

869
00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:16,080
Speaker 3: guys that have come through that started their careers at

870
00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:19,240
Speaker 3: guard ultimately kick out the tackle and have, long productive.

871
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:21,680
Speaker 3: Careers AND i see the same for c Smou.

872
00:43:21,719 --> 00:43:25,640
Speaker 1: Nor do you Think delane would match What Dinard wilson's

873
00:43:25,640 --> 00:43:27,320
Speaker 1: looking as a. Corner do you think he's not quite

874
00:43:27,360 --> 00:43:27,880
Speaker 1: long enough for?

875
00:43:27,960 --> 00:43:29,600
Speaker 3: That, NO i think he. DOES i think he one

876
00:43:29,680 --> 00:43:32,759
Speaker 3: hundred percent heat fits. There BUT i just think right,

877
00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:35,000
Speaker 3: NOW i think top five is a little too rich

878
00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:39,560
Speaker 3: to take take. Corner AND i, say and, Again i'm

879
00:43:39,560 --> 00:43:45,040
Speaker 3: a big Monster delayne. FAN i remember him jumping off

880
00:43:45,080 --> 00:43:47,480
Speaker 3: the tape very early That clemson Game week. ONE i

881
00:43:47,520 --> 00:43:50,399
Speaker 3: think he had you, know anywhere from three to five

882
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:53,320
Speaker 3: pass breakups that. GAME i think he really established. Himself

883
00:43:53,719 --> 00:43:57,720
Speaker 3: but for me, personally coming into the, YEAR i Had

884
00:43:58,120 --> 00:44:01,359
Speaker 3: jamat McCoy From tennessee as my number one, corner AND

885
00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:04,799
Speaker 3: i thought If jamal McCoy had worked out at The

886
00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:08,440
Speaker 3: combine and put up some impressive, NUMBERS i thought he

887
00:44:08,440 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 3: could have re established himself as the number one corner

888
00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:14,440
Speaker 3: in the. Draft and that's why specifically for Monsor, DELAYNE

889
00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:18,520
Speaker 3: i don't know that you go top five, there you,

890
00:44:18,520 --> 00:44:20,600
Speaker 3: know BECAUSE i THINK i think if all things were,

891
00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:25,799
Speaker 3: equal AND i don't know if if McCoy's just not,

892
00:44:25,920 --> 00:44:28,439
Speaker 3: healthy or the advice that he's getting from his team

893
00:44:28,520 --> 00:44:33,200
Speaker 3: and those around him to not do anything thus, far you,

894
00:44:33,239 --> 00:44:36,240
Speaker 3: KNOW i think that. Hurt AND i believe someone texted

895
00:44:36,280 --> 00:44:39,000
Speaker 3: me the other day That Monsor delayne ran in the

896
00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:42,040
Speaker 3: four threes you, know at his pro, day WHICH i

897
00:44:42,080 --> 00:44:44,560
Speaker 3: think that was a. Question people question whether he had the.

898
00:44:44,600 --> 00:44:49,040
Speaker 3: Speed but AGAIN i say that If jamal McCoy had

899
00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:51,080
Speaker 3: worked out at the combine and he didn't necessarily have

900
00:44:51,120 --> 00:44:53,759
Speaker 3: to run four, threes, right had he worked out at

901
00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:56,600
Speaker 3: the combine and showed you, know the movement skills that

902
00:44:56,680 --> 00:44:58,560
Speaker 3: you saw on, tape BECAUSE i think he probably has

903
00:44:58,600 --> 00:45:01,600
Speaker 3: the best ball skills you, know in this class at

904
00:45:01,640 --> 00:45:04,319
Speaker 3: the corner. Position had he worked out and showed those

905
00:45:04,360 --> 00:45:06,520
Speaker 3: same movement skills and ran, WELL i think he could

906
00:45:06,600 --> 00:45:08,759
Speaker 3: easily established himself as the top corner in his.

907
00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:11,160
Speaker 1: Class all, right last two, questions, RAND i appreciated the

908
00:45:11,160 --> 00:45:11,880
Speaker 1: time you've given us this.

909
00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:13,120
Speaker 2: Morning you Mentioned Jeremiah love.

910
00:45:13,160 --> 00:45:16,040
Speaker 1: Briefly how much would you consider him at five if

911
00:45:16,040 --> 00:45:18,200
Speaker 1: you're The, giants you have two young running backs on

912
00:45:18,280 --> 00:45:20,319
Speaker 1: rookie contracts THAT i think if you're The, giants you

913
00:45:20,480 --> 00:45:23,680
Speaker 1: Like love obviously would be an upgrade, there but there

914
00:45:23,680 --> 00:45:25,920
Speaker 1: are other spots that maybe you could use bigger. Upgrades you,

915
00:45:25,960 --> 00:45:27,839
Speaker 1: know you can find the top running back in free,

916
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:30,120
Speaker 1: agency you, Know Kenneth Walker may what fifteen million dollars a.

917
00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:30,400
Speaker 2: Year this.

918
00:45:30,440 --> 00:45:32,040
Speaker 1: Year you can find those guys if you need. Them

919
00:45:32,440 --> 00:45:34,960
Speaker 1: how much would you consider love here if you're The

920
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:37,000
Speaker 1: giants and You're John harbor And Joe shane trying to

921
00:45:37,040 --> 00:45:38,360
Speaker 1: reshape this roster in the coach's.

922
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:41,960
Speaker 3: Image, NO i THINK i think he definitely needs to be.

923
00:45:42,080 --> 00:45:44,920
Speaker 3: Considered and, again And i'm glad you said what you,

924
00:45:44,960 --> 00:45:47,520
Speaker 3: said like you can find him in free. Agency it

925
00:45:47,560 --> 00:45:50,080
Speaker 3: goes back to WHAT i was. Saying if you pass

926
00:45:50,120 --> 00:45:53,040
Speaker 3: on him now and then four years from now you

927
00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:56,480
Speaker 3: have to go pay. Him let's call it seventeen, eighteen

928
00:45:56,600 --> 00:45:59,560
Speaker 3: nineteen million dollars a, year like when you could have

929
00:45:59,680 --> 00:46:02,759
Speaker 3: draft him and at least got five years out of

930
00:46:02,840 --> 00:46:05,799
Speaker 3: him and possibly a six year with a franchise. Tag

931
00:46:06,200 --> 00:46:08,839
Speaker 3: like to, me that defeats the. PURPOSE i think he

932
00:46:08,960 --> 00:46:11,359
Speaker 3: is a bell cow. RUNNER i think you can turn,

933
00:46:11,400 --> 00:46:16,640
Speaker 3: around give him the. LOAD i think he would take

934
00:46:16,680 --> 00:46:18,759
Speaker 3: a lot off Of Jackson dark's. Plate he can catch

935
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:21,799
Speaker 3: the ball out of the. BACKFIELD i think he is

936
00:46:22,239 --> 00:46:25,919
Speaker 3: head and. Shoulders there's PROBABLY i said this way from

937
00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:28,840
Speaker 3: him to the number two. Person it's probably the biggest

938
00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:32,160
Speaker 3: gap of every position in this draft. Class AND i

939
00:46:32,200 --> 00:46:36,040
Speaker 3: think that you can't always. Assume And i'm a running,

940
00:46:36,080 --> 00:46:37,920
Speaker 3: back SO i get defensive when people, say, oh you

941
00:46:37,920 --> 00:46:42,719
Speaker 3: can find those, guys, Right BUT i also, think, yeah

942
00:46:42,760 --> 00:46:45,360
Speaker 3: you can find productive players LIKE i, mean we saw The.

943
00:46:45,400 --> 00:46:49,200
Speaker 3: Giants they Took scatterable where they took, him Took Tyrone

944
00:46:49,200 --> 00:46:51,920
Speaker 3: tracy where they took, him and have gotten solid production

945
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:55,000
Speaker 3: out of. Him but let's be, real AND i know

946
00:46:55,120 --> 00:46:57,680
Speaker 3: this is a. Sore so you, Know giants fans excuse

947
00:46:57,760 --> 00:46:59,719
Speaker 3: Because giants fans have been on my ass all year

948
00:46:59,760 --> 00:47:02,920
Speaker 3: because that Game Jackson dart a c, plus you know

949
00:47:02,920 --> 00:47:09,080
Speaker 3: WHAT i. Mean but, WHATEVER i don't think any of those,

950
00:47:09,120 --> 00:47:12,279
Speaker 3: guys whether It's Cam scatibo Or Tyrone, TRACY i don't

951
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:15,400
Speaker 3: think those guys have given The Giants Saquon barkley.

952
00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:17,719
Speaker 2: Production, no absolutely, fair you know WHAT i.

953
00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:20,560
Speaker 3: Mean AND i and SO i say that to say

954
00:47:20,600 --> 00:47:22,680
Speaker 3: And i'm not saying BECAUSE i don't Think Jeremiah love

955
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:26,920
Speaker 3: Is Saquon. BARKLEY i Think Saquon. BARKLEY i Think Bijon.

956
00:47:27,080 --> 00:47:30,160
Speaker 3: ROBINSON i THINK i think that those guys were, unicorns,

957
00:47:30,680 --> 00:47:34,200
Speaker 3: Right and BUT i do think That Jeremiah love is

958
00:47:34,200 --> 00:47:37,200
Speaker 3: is a good back that can that can be what

959
00:47:37,239 --> 00:47:40,799
Speaker 3: the giants need more so in a way Than Cam

960
00:47:40,880 --> 00:47:44,719
Speaker 3: scattabo And Tyrone. TRACY i, think you, KNOW i Think

961
00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:48,759
Speaker 3: scatabo And Jeremiah love will give you that you, know

962
00:47:48,840 --> 00:47:52,360
Speaker 3: proverbial thunder and, lightning, right BECAUSE i think with scatabol

963
00:47:52,360 --> 00:47:54,799
Speaker 3: you got to protect him from. Himself you, know he

964
00:47:54,920 --> 00:47:57,560
Speaker 3: only you, know knows one way to, run and we

965
00:47:57,680 --> 00:47:59,960
Speaker 3: both know that that will lead to a shorter career

966
00:48:01,040 --> 00:48:05,400
Speaker 3: in the, league you, know running like. That and you,

967
00:48:05,440 --> 00:48:07,160
Speaker 3: KNOW i don't think either one of those guys would

968
00:48:07,160 --> 00:48:10,480
Speaker 3: be second contract guys and that you're paying, for you,

969
00:48:10,480 --> 00:48:12,279
Speaker 3: know for the long hold in terms of the two

970
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:14,400
Speaker 3: that are currently on the. Roster SO i Think Jeremiah

971
00:48:14,440 --> 00:48:18,440
Speaker 3: love should definitely be in that conversation at. Five BUT

972
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:21,960
Speaker 3: i think if it comes down to, it and you

973
00:48:22,000 --> 00:48:25,560
Speaker 3: KNOW Rvl reese is there OR Cc malanoa is, THERE

974
00:48:25,640 --> 00:48:29,080
Speaker 3: i think you're getting a comparable player at a bigger

975
00:48:29,160 --> 00:48:31,239
Speaker 3: need than you would be at the running back.

976
00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:33,520
Speaker 1: Spot i'm with you on, that all, right final one,

977
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:36,040
Speaker 1: Here ran thirty. Seven you mentioned from twenty two to,

978
00:48:36,080 --> 00:48:38,000
Speaker 1: fifty these guys are all kind of the, same, Right

979
00:48:38,280 --> 00:48:40,200
Speaker 1: so where do you think you're gonna find kind of

980
00:48:40,239 --> 00:48:42,040
Speaker 1: like one of the thickest positions where you think The

981
00:48:42,040 --> 00:48:43,920
Speaker 1: giants could find some value for what they.

982
00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:45,359
Speaker 2: Need at thirty, SEVEN i.

983
00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:48,040
Speaker 3: Think thirty seven would be you, know let's just let's

984
00:48:48,080 --> 00:48:49,840
Speaker 3: just call. It let's just Say Rvel reese is not

985
00:48:49,960 --> 00:48:54,160
Speaker 3: on the board and you Go. MALANOA i think thirty

986
00:48:54,200 --> 00:48:56,359
Speaker 3: seven would be the spot where you would look at

987
00:48:56,400 --> 00:48:59,879
Speaker 3: the receiver or the inside. Linebacker, AGAIN i Think Chris

988
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:03,000
Speaker 3: razo is worth the conversation there at thirty. SEVEN i

989
00:49:03,040 --> 00:49:05,439
Speaker 3: think a guy Like Jacob rodriguez out Of Texas tech

990
00:49:05,560 --> 00:49:09,200
Speaker 3: is worth the, conversation you, know at thirty seven as

991
00:49:09,200 --> 00:49:14,520
Speaker 3: an inside. Linebacker SO i think that's WHERE i think

992
00:49:14,560 --> 00:49:18,000
Speaker 3: perfect world for The, giants probably right, now if you

993
00:49:18,040 --> 00:49:21,800
Speaker 3: want to maximize the, BOARD i Think malanoa at five

994
00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:26,880
Speaker 3: will solve a current a current, problem but a future

995
00:49:26,920 --> 00:49:30,440
Speaker 3: problem as. Well, right so you get your, guard you

996
00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:32,319
Speaker 3: get you a player that can be your guard this,

997
00:49:32,440 --> 00:49:35,200
Speaker 3: year but then kick out and the tackle in the coming.

998
00:49:35,280 --> 00:49:38,560
Speaker 3: Years but then, again you're sitting there at thirty seven

999
00:49:38,680 --> 00:49:42,440
Speaker 3: and you have the opportunity to get A Chris brazzl

1000
00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:47,160
Speaker 3: or trying to look at the. Makeup so you Signed Darnelle,

1001
00:49:47,200 --> 00:49:50,560
Speaker 3: mooney you Signed Calvin afsin the. Third you still Got

1002
00:49:50,640 --> 00:49:53,520
Speaker 3: Darius slayton, there who is ironically, ENOUGH i, know you

1003
00:49:53,600 --> 00:49:57,640
Speaker 3: know my, dad but my dad And Darius slayton's dad

1004
00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:02,440
Speaker 3: graduated high school, together and, yeah so they're best. Friends

1005
00:50:03,440 --> 00:50:08,520
Speaker 3: so and so you Have Darius. Slayton Obviously Malik neighbors

1006
00:50:08,640 --> 00:50:10,760
Speaker 3: is coming. BACK i don't think a guy Like Casey,

1007
00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:14,600
Speaker 3: concepcion you, know because to, me now you're getting smaller

1008
00:50:14,640 --> 00:50:17,839
Speaker 3: and smaller in your in your wide receiver. Room so

1009
00:50:17,880 --> 00:50:21,480
Speaker 3: a guy Like Chris, brazzle maybe A Omark cooper junior

1010
00:50:21,520 --> 00:50:23,880
Speaker 3: if he's, there depending, on you, know the style of

1011
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:28,160
Speaker 3: wide receivers that you're looking. For but, again A Jacob

1012
00:50:28,239 --> 00:50:32,560
Speaker 3: rotriguez type guy at that inside linebacker spot WHERE i

1013
00:50:32,560 --> 00:50:34,439
Speaker 3: think would be a really good. FIT i, mean let's

1014
00:50:34,480 --> 00:50:37,680
Speaker 3: see how how it all shapes. Out what If AND

1015
00:50:37,719 --> 00:50:40,200
Speaker 3: i don't See Peter woods falling all the way down

1016
00:50:40,200 --> 00:50:42,800
Speaker 3: to thirty. Seven but that's a conversation Of Peter woods

1017
00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:45,920
Speaker 3: is available at thirty. Seven it's a conversation Of Caleb

1018
00:50:45,960 --> 00:50:48,680
Speaker 3: banks From florida is available to you at thirty. Seven

1019
00:50:49,080 --> 00:50:50,719
Speaker 3: so you just got to play them because all those

1020
00:50:50,760 --> 00:50:56,960
Speaker 3: spots are, indeed, indeed needs for the giants as well as.

1021
00:50:57,000 --> 00:50:59,759
Speaker 3: Safety what if a manual McNeil warren is available to

1022
00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:02,839
Speaker 3: you thirty, seven a true, ballhawk a guy that can

1023
00:51:02,880 --> 00:51:05,080
Speaker 3: go get, it A colton hood in this in the

1024
00:51:05,120 --> 00:51:09,040
Speaker 3: second round out Of. Tennessee SO i think at thirty

1025
00:51:09,040 --> 00:51:11,360
Speaker 3: seven they'll have their their plethora of. Picks BUT i

1026
00:51:11,400 --> 00:51:13,719
Speaker 3: think in the perfect, world let's call IT C C

1027
00:51:13,880 --> 00:51:20,560
Speaker 3: maonoa at five and A Jacob rodriguez Or Chris brass thirty.

1028
00:51:20,560 --> 00:51:23,080
Speaker 1: Seven and then you mentioned dark very quick. Guy you

1029
00:51:23,120 --> 00:51:25,239
Speaker 1: know you don't have to talk about your. Grade where

1030
00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:26,920
Speaker 1: do you think he needs to take the next step

1031
00:51:27,000 --> 00:51:30,239
Speaker 1: right to start to become that franchise guy based on

1032
00:51:30,280 --> 00:51:32,920
Speaker 1: what you saw off as rookie Tape, LISTEN.

1033
00:51:32,640 --> 00:51:34,680
Speaker 3: I, mean AND i want to go back and defend

1034
00:51:34,719 --> 00:51:38,840
Speaker 3: myself at MY c plus. RIGHT i think there's a

1035
00:51:38,880 --> 00:51:41,359
Speaker 3: lot of us in this world that we. Turn they

1036
00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:43,239
Speaker 3: turn their nose up at A c plus, there but

1037
00:51:43,280 --> 00:51:45,840
Speaker 3: there's a lot of US c plus people walking around

1038
00:51:46,400 --> 00:51:49,160
Speaker 3: in this earth right? Now sure you know WHAT i.

1039
00:51:49,239 --> 00:51:52,360
Speaker 3: Mean SO c plus is a is a very passing.

1040
00:51:52,480 --> 00:51:55,680
Speaker 3: GRADE i think the next step For Jackson dart is

1041
00:51:56,520 --> 00:51:59,600
Speaker 3: just seeing the feel better in terms of his passing.

1042
00:51:59,600 --> 00:52:02,400
Speaker 3: ABILITY i thought they got to a point at the

1043
00:52:02,440 --> 00:52:06,040
Speaker 3: earlier part that if number one was, open he would

1044
00:52:06,120 --> 00:52:08,760
Speaker 3: hit number. One BUT i think if number one wasn't

1045
00:52:08,760 --> 00:52:11,759
Speaker 3: open before he got to his second, window he would

1046
00:52:11,840 --> 00:52:14,239
Speaker 3: kind of peek at the rush a little, bit, Right

1047
00:52:14,600 --> 00:52:16,560
Speaker 3: and THEN i think that kind of allowed him to

1048
00:52:16,600 --> 00:52:19,759
Speaker 3: flee the pocket prematurely, sometimes so see him to feel

1049
00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:21,480
Speaker 3: a little bit. Better but you can say that about

1050
00:52:21,520 --> 00:52:24,080
Speaker 3: all rookie, quarterbacks right because that's a part of their.

1051
00:52:24,160 --> 00:52:27,319
Speaker 3: Maturation they're going against these tough. Defenses one THING i

1052
00:52:27,360 --> 00:52:30,480
Speaker 3: can tell you right now is that OTAs will be

1053
00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:33,239
Speaker 3: held for him Because dinard is going to throw everything at,

1054
00:52:33,320 --> 00:52:36,440
Speaker 3: him so he can prepare for, that which will make him,

1055
00:52:36,480 --> 00:52:39,200
Speaker 3: better you, know come. Fall but then the other part,

1056
00:52:39,239 --> 00:52:42,160
Speaker 3: too AND i THINK i think everybody would agree on.

1057
00:52:42,160 --> 00:52:44,239
Speaker 3: This he's got to protect himself, better know when to

1058
00:52:44,280 --> 00:52:46,520
Speaker 3: give his body up for a first down or a

1059
00:52:46,560 --> 00:52:48,959
Speaker 3: touchdown versus when to live to see the next, down

1060
00:52:49,040 --> 00:52:51,960
Speaker 3: get his pass down slide or get the ball out of.

1061
00:52:52,000 --> 00:52:54,759
Speaker 3: Bounce and SO i think he'll ultimately be. FINE i

1062
00:52:54,800 --> 00:52:57,560
Speaker 3: Know Brian callahan is going to coach, him you, know very,

1063
00:52:57,560 --> 00:53:00,800
Speaker 3: hard very. Well and the cool thing for him having

1064
00:53:00,800 --> 00:53:03,520
Speaker 3: A Brian callahan as the level of communication that he's

1065
00:53:03,560 --> 00:53:06,480
Speaker 3: going to be able to have to you, know Let

1066
00:53:06,520 --> 00:53:09,319
Speaker 3: cally know what he, likes what he doesn't like in

1067
00:53:09,440 --> 00:53:12,239
Speaker 3: terms of the, calls which will help put him in

1068
00:53:12,239 --> 00:53:13,040
Speaker 3: the most successful.

1069
00:53:13,040 --> 00:53:15,720
Speaker 2: Spot, ran tell the folks where they can find. Everything

1070
00:53:15,719 --> 00:53:16,359
Speaker 2: you're up to you right.

1071
00:53:16,360 --> 00:53:18,520
Speaker 3: NOW i mean you can come check us out on

1072
00:53:18,560 --> 00:53:22,520
Speaker 3: with The First pick, podcast myself And Ryan. Wilson i'm

1073
00:53:22,560 --> 00:53:25,680
Speaker 3: mainly ON Cbs. SPORTS i do some hits with my

1074
00:53:25,719 --> 00:53:29,359
Speaker 3: Man Bruce murray On SIRIUS Xm. Radio we come on On.

1075
00:53:29,400 --> 00:53:33,239
Speaker 3: MONDAYS i guess it's twelve to Three Eastern standard, time

1076
00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:37,440
Speaker 3: so you catch me on all those. Platforms giants, fans

1077
00:53:37,920 --> 00:53:42,000
Speaker 3: leave me, alone, please like you guys like tore me

1078
00:53:42,040 --> 00:53:43,960
Speaker 3: anew and you should have showed me some. LOVE i

1079
00:53:44,040 --> 00:53:48,600
Speaker 3: come from The giants, tree Like i'm a baby. Giant.

1080
00:53:49,560 --> 00:53:52,160
Speaker 3: Please can we be? Friends can we just hug it

1081
00:53:52,160 --> 00:53:53,160
Speaker 3: out and just be? Friends?

1082
00:53:53,200 --> 00:53:55,480
Speaker 1: PLEASE i Think giant fans will be in a much

1083
00:53:55,520 --> 00:53:58,959
Speaker 1: better mood around this time next, year hopefully if everything goes. Well,

1084
00:53:59,120 --> 00:54:00,880
Speaker 1: RAN i apologize that does not mean to keep you this,

1085
00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:01,880
Speaker 1: long but this is.

1086
00:54:01,960 --> 00:54:04,240
Speaker 3: Fun you, know you, know you KNOW i love talking

1087
00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:07,279
Speaker 3: ball and uh you know anytime you, called when you, said,

1088
00:54:07,280 --> 00:54:09,560
Speaker 3: hey let's do it, AGAIN i was, like let's let's

1089
00:54:09,600 --> 00:54:10,680
Speaker 3: figure out the, time let's get it.

1090
00:54:10,719 --> 00:54:13,719
Speaker 1: Done you're the, man you just kept throwing. Goal that,

1091
00:54:13,800 --> 00:54:15,759
Speaker 1: mate great. Information that's all the time we have in

1092
00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:17,920
Speaker 1: The Giants little podcast brought to you By Citizens Official

1093
00:54:17,960 --> 00:54:18,279
Speaker 1: bank of The.

1094
00:54:18,320 --> 00:54:20,200
Speaker 2: Giants we will see you next. Time everybody