WEBVTT - ‘I Was Ruthless About Killing Complexity’: HSBC CEO on Rewiring the Bank 0:00:02.720 --> 0:00:08.240 Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News. 0:00:10.240 --> 0:00:14.840 I was definitely ruthless about killing the complexity and the 0:00:14.920 --> 0:00:18.000 drag in the back. There is massive potential in this bank. 0:00:18.600 --> 0:00:21.960 Some of it needed to be unleashed. Things don't become 0:00:21.960 --> 0:00:25.520 complex by design. They end up becoming complex by lack 0:00:25.560 --> 0:00:29.240 of focus. You need it, We need it to be agile. 0:00:29.400 --> 0:00:33.240 So bringing the focus at the simplification will allow you 0:00:33.320 --> 0:00:34.400 to start dealing with it. 0:00:36.280 --> 0:00:39.440 I'm franc I Laqua and this is Leaders, the podcast 0:00:39.479 --> 0:00:44.080 that explores what drives the world's most influential people. Joining 0:00:44.120 --> 0:00:48.280 me this week is CHARLEL. Hendri, the chief executive of HSBC, 0:00:48.520 --> 0:00:51.600 one of the world's biggest banks, in the top job 0:00:51.640 --> 0:00:54.840 since September twenty twenty four, he's not shied away from 0:00:54.840 --> 0:00:59.040 the difficult decisions, including a huge restructure and slashing thousands 0:00:59.080 --> 0:01:02.800 of jobs, and while some might consider his methods ruthless, 0:01:03.440 --> 0:01:07.880 HSBC's share price has responded positively. It's roughly doubled to 0:01:07.920 --> 0:01:11.640 a record high. Andre El Hydrie's tenure after an eventful 0:01:11.720 --> 0:01:14.440 first year, I wanted to catch up with him and 0:01:14.480 --> 0:01:18.400 really dig into those management decisions, understand how he's evolved 0:01:18.440 --> 0:01:24.520 as a leader and hear how he's thinking about Ai Rash. 0:01:24.560 --> 0:01:25.880 Thank you so much for speaking to us. 0:01:25.920 --> 0:01:27.240 Great to be with you, Francine. 0:01:27.400 --> 0:01:29.679 We were counting how many languages you spoke. 0:01:30.120 --> 0:01:34.800 Eight, So I've studied eight languages. Other people should judge 0:01:34.840 --> 0:01:35.560 if I speak them. 0:01:35.959 --> 0:01:38.280 Do you have a love for languages. 0:01:38.360 --> 0:01:42.119 I'm fascinated by languages because if you're fascinated by cultures, 0:01:42.640 --> 0:01:46.920 then you're fascinated by understanding how they think and how 0:01:46.920 --> 0:01:50.040 they express themselves, and that basically naturally links you to 0:01:50.280 --> 0:01:51.480 understanding their language. 0:01:51.560 --> 0:01:53.960 Can you only be a good leader if you understand people? 0:01:54.880 --> 0:01:58.640 I think you have to definitely listen, and if you 0:01:58.640 --> 0:02:01.639 can listen in their own language, then even better. 0:02:01.880 --> 0:02:04.320 You grew up in Lebanon, yes, and what was your 0:02:04.560 --> 0:02:05.600 early childhood like? 0:02:06.160 --> 0:02:09.160 So I grew up in Lebanon. At age eighteen, I 0:02:09.320 --> 0:02:14.240 moved to France for my university. I then picked an 0:02:14.280 --> 0:02:17.880 internship in Germany, and by coincidence, I ended up doing 0:02:17.919 --> 0:02:22.239 an internship in banking. So I went back to Paris 0:02:22.280 --> 0:02:26.839 to finish my postgraduate degree in finance, statistics and economics 0:02:26.880 --> 0:02:30.280 because I enjoyed it, of course, and I picked up 0:02:30.320 --> 0:02:33.200 my first job in Japan and then back to London 0:02:33.600 --> 0:02:36.919 at that time up until the time where HSBC hired me, 0:02:36.960 --> 0:02:38.400 and that was exactly twenty years ago. 0:02:38.639 --> 0:02:40.560 At the time, you wanted to be an engineer, So 0:02:40.600 --> 0:02:42.160 what attracted you to finance? 0:02:43.040 --> 0:02:46.160 So I absolutely wanted to be an engineer. I studied 0:02:46.200 --> 0:02:49.840 as an engineer, and as you know, back to your 0:02:49.919 --> 0:02:52.600 question about languages, I had studied German for about ten 0:02:52.680 --> 0:02:54.919 or twelve years at that time, so I wanted to 0:02:54.960 --> 0:02:58.239 do an internship in Germany. The only internship I managed 0:02:58.240 --> 0:03:01.639 to land was an internship on the trading in Frankfurt. 0:03:02.200 --> 0:03:05.320 So I took it and then I got addicted to it. 0:03:05.760 --> 0:03:06.839 What did you like about it? 0:03:07.560 --> 0:03:10.239 I like the pace, but at that time, remember there's 0:03:10.280 --> 0:03:12.920 a lot of financial engineering, so you're still using a 0:03:12.919 --> 0:03:16.400 lot of your engineering skills. It still happens right and 0:03:16.639 --> 0:03:19.359 all sorts of you know, it's highly transferable to finance. 0:03:20.320 --> 0:03:24.360 I liked the accountability. I like the early responsibility you 0:03:24.400 --> 0:03:26.400 can get. So this is where it started. 0:03:26.960 --> 0:03:28.639 Did you always want to be a leader? Were you 0:03:28.680 --> 0:03:29.639 a leader as a child. 0:03:30.440 --> 0:03:35.080 It's difficult to define what a leader is, especially if 0:03:35.240 --> 0:03:38.119 leader a child. If it's a matter of living up 0:03:38.680 --> 0:03:42.880 with high standards and high values and high integrity and 0:03:42.960 --> 0:03:47.040 being able to project that around you. Then, yes, that 0:03:47.160 --> 0:03:50.000 started very early with me, But there are certain traits 0:03:50.000 --> 0:03:52.320 and leadership that really resonate with me. The first one 0:03:52.360 --> 0:03:55.960 is you lead by example. You walk the talk. You 0:03:56.080 --> 0:03:58.720 demonstrate that things apply to you as they would apply 0:03:58.840 --> 0:04:01.320 to anybody else, that you expect them to be applied to, 0:04:01.400 --> 0:04:03.360 and you don't never make an exception for yourself. 0:04:03.520 --> 0:04:06.040 When you look at leadership, how does I guess? The 0:04:06.120 --> 0:04:09.320 young formative ears, you know, give you a sense of 0:04:09.560 --> 0:04:10.520 who you will become. 0:04:10.720 --> 0:04:13.160 You learn, and you feel what is right and what 0:04:13.280 --> 0:04:16.960 is not right, and a number of people around you, 0:04:17.000 --> 0:04:20.760 including my direct family, my parents, kind of form part 0:04:20.839 --> 0:04:23.520 of how you think and what ethical standards you set 0:04:23.560 --> 0:04:27.359 yourself and the integrity by which you operate. And then 0:04:27.600 --> 0:04:32.040 sometimes around you you feel things aren't right or aren't fair, 0:04:32.080 --> 0:04:35.920 and it's very important to stand your line, to hold 0:04:35.960 --> 0:04:36.360 your line. 0:04:36.520 --> 0:04:37.920 That's difficult. How do you do that? 0:04:38.240 --> 0:04:42.280 It is difficult. Discipline, It's very important to hold the discipline, 0:04:42.360 --> 0:04:45.680 and it's very important to think of yourself as your 0:04:45.680 --> 0:04:48.440 own brand. If you want your own brand to remain 0:04:48.520 --> 0:04:52.239 the brand of integrity, then it's very important you stick 0:04:52.240 --> 0:04:52.520 to it. 0:04:52.800 --> 0:04:54.800 I've heard, I mean, some chief executive see it as 0:04:54.920 --> 0:04:58.000 you know, they decided from very early on who they 0:04:58.040 --> 0:05:00.440 did not want to be. Is it true using who 0:05:00.440 --> 0:05:02.680 you do not want to be or who you want 0:05:02.720 --> 0:05:03.760 to be what's easiest? 0:05:04.120 --> 0:05:07.080 I think both go hand in hand. It's very important 0:05:07.080 --> 0:05:12.200 to realize who you want to be, and by competison, 0:05:12.279 --> 0:05:16.880 realize also what are the traits you absolutely do not appreciate, 0:05:16.920 --> 0:05:19.080 do not to regard, and therefore that you want to 0:05:19.120 --> 0:05:20.000 stay away from. 0:05:20.200 --> 0:05:22.440 Talk to me about your I guess your your favorite 0:05:23.000 --> 0:05:26.960 pre CEO job at HSBC. Do you have you know 0:05:27.480 --> 0:05:29.760 a place in the world where you really kind of 0:05:29.800 --> 0:05:32.080 had to hone in on your leadership skills and understand 0:05:32.120 --> 0:05:32.599 the culture. 0:05:32.839 --> 0:05:35.599 I've spent twenty years at HSBC now, and there isn't 0:05:35.600 --> 0:05:38.880 a single geography on the planet where I spend that long. 0:05:39.320 --> 0:05:41.240 So there is a sense of belonging for me to 0:05:41.400 --> 0:05:45.200 HSBC that that supersedes any kind of physical attachment to 0:05:45.240 --> 0:05:48.320 any place with HSBC. I don't know if I can 0:05:48.600 --> 0:05:52.160 count now, however, many dozens and dozens and dozens of times, 0:05:52.520 --> 0:05:56.040 probably hundreds to places like Hong Kong, you know, one 0:05:56.040 --> 0:05:59.520 of the two HSBC home markets the midd least where 0:05:59.520 --> 0:06:03.039 I spend many years for HSBC, specifically in Dubai, but 0:06:03.160 --> 0:06:06.320 also rolling around the whole of them, at least Europe, 0:06:06.400 --> 0:06:10.400 of course, the US, Asia and as a whole. It's 0:06:10.440 --> 0:06:13.280 just amazing the opportunities you have to get there, and 0:06:13.320 --> 0:06:17.280 every time you're there, you spend time, you create more connections, 0:06:17.360 --> 0:06:20.560 you have an even deeper understanding. If I ask I 0:06:20.640 --> 0:06:22.720 bring ten people in the room and ask them how 0:06:22.720 --> 0:06:26.280 many geographies they worked for for HSBC, you would find 0:06:26.320 --> 0:06:31.719 people who tell you more than ten. That kind of experience, frankly, 0:06:31.839 --> 0:06:32.440 is unique. 0:06:32.520 --> 0:06:34.400 But if you look at, for example, some of the 0:06:34.440 --> 0:06:36.520 Wall Street banks are more cut through, but they pay 0:06:36.560 --> 0:06:38.880 their people a lot more. Is that something that you 0:06:38.920 --> 0:06:39.440 worry about. 0:06:40.200 --> 0:06:43.640 I mean, it's very important that we reward our people fairly, 0:06:43.839 --> 0:06:47.600 we reward our people competitively, and we reward performance. But 0:06:47.640 --> 0:06:50.720 that's not the only component. The other component is what 0:06:50.880 --> 0:06:53.600 is the environment in which they operate? Who are their colleagues, 0:06:53.720 --> 0:06:57.480 their bosses, what is their purpose? Who are they serving? 0:06:57.880 --> 0:07:00.520 Why they're serving them? Can they be their truths? Can 0:07:00.520 --> 0:07:03.240 they operate with the highest integrity standards as they wish to? 0:07:03.880 --> 0:07:06.000 All of that kind of form part of the value 0:07:06.040 --> 0:07:09.280 proposition HSPC offers it employees, and this is what makes 0:07:09.320 --> 0:07:13.360 the kind of equation collectively work for all our colleagues. 0:07:15.920 --> 0:07:19.160 After the break, we discuss how George al Hedri approached 0:07:19.440 --> 0:07:27.600 hspc's biggest restructure in a decade. Everybody has to make 0:07:27.640 --> 0:07:31.160 decisions big or small, but not everyone runs a bank 0:07:31.240 --> 0:07:34.560 with two hundred thousand employees. When al Hedri took over 0:07:34.600 --> 0:07:38.200 a CEO, he really wasted no time making his mark, 0:07:38.440 --> 0:07:42.560 ushering in a big restructure and laying off thousands of employees. 0:07:43.360 --> 0:07:46.160 So I was curious to understand how he thinks about 0:07:46.200 --> 0:07:49.360 company wide challenges and what gave him the courage to 0:07:49.440 --> 0:07:54.040 move so fast and so decisively. So talking to me 0:07:54.240 --> 0:07:56.720 about when you get the call that you've been appointed 0:07:56.760 --> 0:07:59.080 as chief executive, what's your first thought? 0:07:59.600 --> 0:08:01.960 Of course, the first thought is to be humbled and 0:08:01.960 --> 0:08:07.960 honored for being given this fantastic responsibility. But what really 0:08:08.000 --> 0:08:11.200 mattered for me is what I can do for this bank, 0:08:11.560 --> 0:08:14.000 not who I was or what my title was in 0:08:14.040 --> 0:08:16.320 this bank. Now it so happens, there's a lot you 0:08:16.320 --> 0:08:19.680 can do as a group CEO in terms of affecting 0:08:19.800 --> 0:08:24.840 change or affecting bringing potential to the bank. So it 0:08:24.880 --> 0:08:27.960 was therefore the great opportunity for me to be able 0:08:28.000 --> 0:08:29.720 to do what I really set out to do and 0:08:29.760 --> 0:08:32.120 what I had the full support of the board to do. 0:08:32.280 --> 0:08:35.320 You moved fast? Does a chief executive need to move 0:08:35.400 --> 0:08:37.600 fast to kind of say right, this is the change 0:08:37.640 --> 0:08:39.000 and this is what we need to be and is 0:08:39.040 --> 0:08:42.080 it all on you or did you governed by consensus? 0:08:42.400 --> 0:08:44.760 A few things on that. The first one is there 0:08:44.800 --> 0:08:48.800 is massive potential in this bank. Some of it needed 0:08:48.840 --> 0:08:52.679 to be unleashed, It needed to be unlocked, and some 0:08:52.760 --> 0:08:56.240 of that unlocking of the potential had to go through 0:08:56.280 --> 0:08:59.000 re engineering the bank, rewiring the bank so that we 0:08:59.000 --> 0:09:02.600 can unlock this POTENTI then, having been the bank twenty years, 0:09:02.640 --> 0:09:06.160 operating in a number of geographies and businesses and functions myself, 0:09:06.320 --> 0:09:09.480 I've built a lot of experience and a very large 0:09:09.520 --> 0:09:13.720 network of colleagues who have been also feeding their input 0:09:13.840 --> 0:09:16.840 and their concerns, which kind of forms a big set 0:09:16.880 --> 0:09:21.840 of action book if you want. And then, third, very importantly, 0:09:22.240 --> 0:09:24.840 I was already sitting at the board as a group 0:09:25.320 --> 0:09:28.640 cf or before I took the coole, and all these 0:09:28.640 --> 0:09:32.439 conversations I was having with my board and if you 0:09:32.559 --> 0:09:35.120 have the support of the board, you of course have 0:09:35.320 --> 0:09:37.400 the kind of right to be able to act quickly. 0:09:37.520 --> 0:09:39.800 But what was the most difficult thing about that first 0:09:39.840 --> 0:09:42.080 restructuring plan? Because you have to get rid of units 0:09:42.120 --> 0:09:44.600 that maybe you're attached to having worked here for so long, 0:09:44.720 --> 0:09:46.960 there's people that you like that maybe you've had to 0:09:46.960 --> 0:09:50.960 move around again. Was it intellectual or are you ruthless 0:09:50.960 --> 0:09:51.400 about it? 0:09:51.800 --> 0:09:55.960 I was definitely ruthless about killing the complexity and the 0:09:56.040 --> 0:09:58.559 drag in the back. The most difficult part is when 0:09:58.600 --> 0:10:01.240 you have to separate with some of your colleagues. I 0:10:01.280 --> 0:10:04.840 think we've been very thoughtful, We've been very considered it. 0:10:04.960 --> 0:10:08.000 We've done it, hopefully the right way and the most 0:10:08.040 --> 0:10:11.040 respectful way for the benefit ultimately of the firm and 0:10:11.080 --> 0:10:14.360 its customers. You need it, We need it to be agile, 0:10:14.480 --> 0:10:16.920 we need it to be ready for a modern world, 0:10:16.960 --> 0:10:18.600 and to be that, we need it to be simple. 0:10:18.960 --> 0:10:22.560 And therefore, you know, kind of everything then drives what 0:10:22.679 --> 0:10:24.840 decisions you take from that mission statement? 0:10:25.000 --> 0:10:27.080 How did the bank become so complex? And again, this 0:10:27.200 --> 0:10:29.920 is something that actually most organizations have to face as 0:10:29.960 --> 0:10:34.760 they grow. I guess there's various factions or a lot 0:10:34.840 --> 0:10:37.760 of companies actually could just become much more simple and simplified. 0:10:38.280 --> 0:10:39.120 What did you see? 0:10:39.640 --> 0:10:42.920 Entropy is a feature. Entropy tends to increase, which means 0:10:42.960 --> 0:10:46.600 complexity if you do nothing about it, tends to increase 0:10:46.720 --> 0:10:50.760 rather than decrease. So things don't become complex by design. 0:10:51.080 --> 0:10:54.840 They end up becoming complex by lack of focus. So 0:10:55.120 --> 0:10:58.680 bringing the focus at the simplification will allow you to 0:10:58.679 --> 0:11:01.880 start dealing with it. That's the first observation. Section observation 0:11:02.240 --> 0:11:05.040 is you have to be extremely methodical. What has created 0:11:05.120 --> 0:11:09.400 the complexity? How can it be addressed methodically? Try to 0:11:09.440 --> 0:11:12.920 identify ways to be simple. Some of the ways to 0:11:12.920 --> 0:11:15.560 be simple is to decide not to do certain things, 0:11:15.600 --> 0:11:18.000 and this is why we exited a number of activities. 0:11:18.160 --> 0:11:23.480 The third thing is when you're taking structured decisions, you 0:11:23.559 --> 0:11:26.760 have to start from the top. You can't take structured 0:11:26.760 --> 0:11:29.199 decision from the bottoms up. This is why the first 0:11:29.240 --> 0:11:34.160 decision structurally I've taken relates to simplifying the group operating committee. 0:11:34.559 --> 0:11:37.200 We moved from more than twenty people to about twelve. 0:11:37.600 --> 0:11:42.320 More importantly, we moved from zero percent singular accountability everything 0:11:42.400 --> 0:11:46.400 had dual or multiple accountability to now about sixty percent 0:11:46.640 --> 0:11:50.560 of our revenues generated under singular accountability, so that's important. 0:11:50.720 --> 0:11:53.480 And then the last thing, Francine is to be patient. 0:11:53.720 --> 0:11:56.800 We're not solving simplification overnight. It's going to be a 0:11:56.880 --> 0:11:59.200 journey and we have to be relentless at that journey, 0:11:59.320 --> 0:12:02.800 quarta after water, month after month until we get the 0:12:02.840 --> 0:12:05.720 desired outcomes. And that journey is still on, like we're 0:12:05.760 --> 0:12:06.400 not there yet. 0:12:06.679 --> 0:12:09.120 But as a big chief executive of a big bank, 0:12:09.320 --> 0:12:13.280 you basically have the shareholders that you need to please, 0:12:13.280 --> 0:12:15.680 so simplification may be help with them understanding what the 0:12:15.720 --> 0:12:18.560 bank wants to become. You have your clients, and then 0:12:18.600 --> 0:12:21.599 you also have the employees. How difficult is it to 0:12:21.679 --> 0:12:24.200 juggle these? You know, three masters. 0:12:24.640 --> 0:12:28.679 So there is one consideration, which fortunately the three masters 0:12:28.720 --> 0:12:31.480 align on, is being best at what you do. Your 0:12:31.480 --> 0:12:33.760 customers want you to be the best at what you 0:12:33.840 --> 0:12:38.040 serve them. With customers take your shareholders will pay you 0:12:38.080 --> 0:12:40.080 for what you're best at doing. They won't give you 0:12:40.160 --> 0:12:42.760 valuation for something that your average. They will give you 0:12:42.840 --> 0:12:46.720 valuation for where you really command, where you're an authority 0:12:46.840 --> 0:12:49.360 in being able to provide that service or that product 0:12:49.400 --> 0:12:52.360 and that market. So the shareholders aligned to be the best, 0:12:52.480 --> 0:12:55.080 and then our colleagues want to win. Our colleagues are 0:12:55.080 --> 0:12:57.800 in a competitive landscape and they want to win, and 0:12:57.840 --> 0:13:00.760 they basically thrive when they're when we're doing living the 0:13:00.800 --> 0:13:04.280 best we can and when we're delivering best outcomes and 0:13:04.360 --> 0:13:07.160 we're basically the best at what we do. So you know, 0:13:07.200 --> 0:13:09.640 you take this as a guiding thread and you say, 0:13:09.720 --> 0:13:13.440 let's focus on that focus where we can grow in 0:13:13.600 --> 0:13:19.200 areas where we're the most competitively advantaged, and then everybody aligns, colleagues, 0:13:19.240 --> 0:13:20.280 clients and shareholders. 0:13:20.400 --> 0:13:22.160 Is that why you learned Mandarin? You want it to 0:13:22.200 --> 0:13:24.760 be the best for HSBC. Yeah. 0:13:24.760 --> 0:13:27.440 I don't think I'm the best at HSBC speaking Mandarin, 0:13:27.520 --> 0:13:28.280 that's far from it. 0:13:28.360 --> 0:13:30.080 But you're the first co two speak Mandarin. 0:13:30.640 --> 0:13:34.520 Possibly, Yes. I think what is important is to gain 0:13:34.640 --> 0:13:38.960 access to understanding the culture in which HSBC operates, and 0:13:39.000 --> 0:13:42.959 obviously one of the very important cultures within HSBC as 0:13:42.960 --> 0:13:45.880 a whole, but that is probably one of the least 0:13:46.000 --> 0:13:50.079 understood for say, people living in you know, in London 0:13:50.240 --> 0:13:53.880 like I'm living now, is understanding the Chinese culture. And 0:13:53.960 --> 0:13:56.080 you know, if you really want to understand the Chinese 0:13:56.200 --> 0:13:58.920 way of thinking, the way of reasoning, the way of 0:13:59.080 --> 0:14:03.839 negotiating or engaging or presenting simply, then there is no 0:14:03.920 --> 0:14:06.640 better way than kind of put the pain and trying 0:14:06.679 --> 0:14:10.920 to learn the language and see how it's done in 0:14:10.960 --> 0:14:11.679 the language. 0:14:11.880 --> 0:14:14.120 It was quite bold because you took a sabbatical for it. 0:14:14.160 --> 0:14:16.560 Was it a difficult decision or did you automatically know 0:14:16.640 --> 0:14:19.080 this was the right way to answer service your clients. 0:14:19.320 --> 0:14:21.280 First, I knew if I really wanted to make a 0:14:21.360 --> 0:14:26.120 leap frog in my early starts in Mandarin, it needed 0:14:26.240 --> 0:14:28.200 much more time than I could give it. Now I'm 0:14:28.280 --> 0:14:30.840 proud to say I still take lessons. Whether I'm progressing 0:14:30.920 --> 0:14:33.040 or not, I don't know, but I'm still taking lessons. 0:14:33.040 --> 0:14:35.800 I'm maintaining that you know that job. But there needed 0:14:35.840 --> 0:14:37.920 to be a leapfrog at the start, which is sabbatical 0:14:37.960 --> 0:14:38.400 as I helped. 0:14:38.640 --> 0:14:40.120 Was it for yourself or was it for the bank? 0:14:40.160 --> 0:14:42.600 Because it's interesting it was it was Mandarin and nothing 0:14:43.040 --> 0:14:44.320 and not something else. No. 0:14:44.440 --> 0:14:46.840 Well, look, I mean I've taken six month out and 0:14:46.880 --> 0:14:48.680 there are a number of things I achieved during those 0:14:48.680 --> 0:14:51.040 six months, some of them personal, some of them professional. 0:14:51.080 --> 0:14:53.320 But yes, it was full on. 0:14:55.840 --> 0:14:59.000 When we come back. Jejahal Hedri tells me how artificial 0:14:59.040 --> 0:15:07.880 intelligence is shaping HSBC and the future of banking. The 0:15:07.960 --> 0:15:11.680 future is AI, and in our conversation, el had remade 0:15:11.760 --> 0:15:15.480 that very evident. But bringing colleagues along for the ride 0:15:15.720 --> 0:15:21.320 is one of his new leadership challenges. Talk to me 0:15:21.360 --> 0:15:24.320 about in simple terms, right, how you see the bank 0:15:24.360 --> 0:15:25.160 in five years. 0:15:25.480 --> 0:15:28.080 The world is moving fast. We need to move fast. 0:15:28.360 --> 0:15:30.360 Our customers are moving fast. We need to move fast. 0:15:30.400 --> 0:15:33.560 Their needs today will be different tomorrow, their goals today 0:15:33.560 --> 0:15:36.440 will be different tomorrow, and we need to be continuously 0:15:36.440 --> 0:15:39.360 adapting to their evolving needs and their evolving goals. 0:15:39.440 --> 0:15:39.680 Right. 0:15:39.800 --> 0:15:42.160 There are the few key components that can achieve this. 0:15:42.480 --> 0:15:46.400 Most importantly, the first component is the human touch. Okay, 0:15:46.840 --> 0:15:50.000 we're still in a very much believer in a model 0:15:50.120 --> 0:15:53.480 where they'll always be a person to talk to. So 0:15:53.760 --> 0:15:57.160 we invest in our relationship management, we invest in our 0:15:57.600 --> 0:16:01.000 people's skills and capabilities, we invest in our peace people simply. 0:16:00.880 --> 0:16:02.400 So we're not being replaced by AI. 0:16:02.960 --> 0:16:06.000 So that's the second component is we absolutely need to 0:16:06.040 --> 0:16:10.960 be innovation ready and embrace it and enable our capabilities 0:16:11.000 --> 0:16:14.800 and be able to embrace in number of emerging payments 0:16:14.880 --> 0:16:18.440 through blockchain or tokenized deposits, all of which we launch, 0:16:18.520 --> 0:16:21.080 by the way, but you know that's an evolving world, 0:16:21.320 --> 0:16:24.720 but also being gen AI ready in particular, I mean 0:16:24.760 --> 0:16:27.880 AI has been with us for fifteen years, but gen 0:16:27.920 --> 0:16:31.040 AI is clearly bringing something new to the equation. Now 0:16:31.040 --> 0:16:35.040 we have more than one hundred cases, of which about 0:16:35.080 --> 0:16:38.440 half of them are already alive in production that are 0:16:38.680 --> 0:16:42.200 transformational and they're going to change the way we as 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:46.840 humans operate. And while we as humans will not be 0:16:46.960 --> 0:16:50.360 replaced by AI, if we don't know how to embrace 0:16:50.440 --> 0:16:55.920 it and upskill ourselves using it, we will become obsolete. 0:16:56.080 --> 0:16:58.920 So this is why my call to our colleagues has 0:16:58.960 --> 0:17:01.240 been to bring all all of them along the journey 0:17:01.320 --> 0:17:05.040 of how can we best use GENI opportunities Because for 0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:07.600 those who don't use them, there is a real risk 0:17:07.680 --> 0:17:10.080 that they will be displaced. But those who will use 0:17:10.119 --> 0:17:12.040 them are going to be part of the future. 0:17:12.119 --> 0:17:14.080 But if you're a young kid today and you want 0:17:14.119 --> 0:17:15.520 to get into banking, what do you study? 0:17:16.080 --> 0:17:19.000 Let me try to answer it with two prong approach. 0:17:19.119 --> 0:17:22.879 The first one GENI specific. Right, we now rolled to 0:17:23.280 --> 0:17:28.040 one hundred and seventy thousand of our colleagues internal productivity 0:17:28.080 --> 0:17:32.040 tools that can materially improve their capabilities of reading documents, 0:17:32.040 --> 0:17:38.800 reading emails, writing documents emails, queering challenging processes. One hundred 0:17:38.840 --> 0:17:41.320 and seventy thousand of our employees, I mean, so soon 0:17:41.400 --> 0:17:44.240 all the way to the two hundred plus thousand employees. 0:17:44.320 --> 0:17:46.680 Of course, I will be monitoring usage. I'll be monitoring 0:17:46.720 --> 0:17:49.760 super usage. Those will be the most you know, kind 0:17:49.760 --> 0:17:54.600 of influencing among their colleagues to drive the utilization. But 0:17:54.720 --> 0:17:59.400 utilization is not optional, because that's how people remain very 0:17:59.440 --> 0:18:02.000 relevant in the future workforce five years down the road. 0:18:02.359 --> 0:18:06.360 But we're using JENI in wealth, we're using GENI in markets, 0:18:06.400 --> 0:18:10.800 We're using GENI in contact centers. We're using JENI. Of 0:18:10.840 --> 0:18:14.679 course in technology. Now thirty thousand of our technologists engineers 0:18:14.720 --> 0:18:17.960 are enabled with GENI. The speed at which we're able 0:18:18.000 --> 0:18:24.240 to patch, for say, code weaknesses or kind of vulnerabilities 0:18:24.760 --> 0:18:28.720 is ten times faster already now than was the case 0:18:28.760 --> 0:18:30.840 last year. Ten times are we're. 0:18:30.680 --> 0:18:31.960 Not talking in twelve months. 0:18:32.040 --> 0:18:34.399 In twelve months, we're not talking we're not talking some 0:18:34.440 --> 0:18:37.560 productivity in five years. We're talking productivity already here. This 0:18:37.720 --> 0:18:40.880 is a huge transformation. So you can imagine how important 0:18:40.880 --> 0:18:43.480 it is now. I go back to the first part 0:18:43.480 --> 0:18:45.439 of your question from the scene, is what are the 0:18:45.480 --> 0:18:48.399 skills that are needed for banks? I would say there 0:18:48.440 --> 0:18:51.960 is no one particular skill that's going to be critical, 0:18:52.320 --> 0:18:54.720 but it is going to be the ability to learn. 0:18:55.520 --> 0:18:57.639 Because you can come in a bank coming from an 0:18:57.680 --> 0:19:02.440 engineering background, from a technology background, from an accounting background. 0:19:02.480 --> 0:19:05.879 But once you're in the bank, your career, the customer's 0:19:05.920 --> 0:19:08.920 expectation are such that you're going to have to continue 0:19:08.920 --> 0:19:11.280 to do art and a few think you know it all. 0:19:11.359 --> 0:19:15.639 Then there's no place for those In an evolving landscape today, 0:19:15.760 --> 0:19:19.880 the most important learning capability is how to best embrace 0:19:20.280 --> 0:19:23.240 gen AI and innovation in general. 0:19:23.440 --> 0:19:25.520 Are you surprised that these, you know, tariffs and trade 0:19:25.560 --> 0:19:29.000 barriers that have been erected really in twenty twenty five 0:19:29.480 --> 0:19:31.920 haven't had that much of a material impact. 0:19:32.160 --> 0:19:34.520 So a couple of things here, Francine that are interesting. 0:19:34.520 --> 0:19:37.160 The first one is tariff in and of themselves aren't 0:19:37.160 --> 0:19:39.720 a new feature of global trade. There've always was forms 0:19:39.720 --> 0:19:43.000 after What was more new in twenty twenty five is 0:19:43.040 --> 0:19:46.040 the speed at which both traffs have been erected, but 0:19:46.119 --> 0:19:49.520 also deals have been negotiated to reduce tariffs or removed there. 0:19:49.560 --> 0:19:54.120 So that was kind of the new feature. What's also 0:19:54.240 --> 0:19:57.040 important to note is that yes, trade found its way, 0:19:57.080 --> 0:19:59.520 and we've seen trade patterns between Asian and Middle East, 0:19:59.600 --> 0:20:02.080 or within in Asia, or to some extent also between 0:20:02.119 --> 0:20:05.320 Asia and Europe that have outgrown some of the corridors 0:20:05.320 --> 0:20:08.160 that have taken you know, that that have been slower 0:20:08.240 --> 0:20:10.359 in terms of trade growth, or that have taken a 0:20:10.760 --> 0:20:15.320 kind of setback in terms of trade growth. What's most 0:20:15.440 --> 0:20:20.640 important with the reconfiguration of trade patterns is that based 0:20:20.680 --> 0:20:24.840 on our internal research, we believe the addition to GDP 0:20:25.119 --> 0:20:28.560 that these new trade patterns within Asia will bring to 0:20:29.000 --> 0:20:33.600 Asia will three times more than offset the loss of 0:20:33.680 --> 0:20:36.840 GDP that will be, you know, due to the reduction 0:20:36.920 --> 0:20:40.320 of trade with the US. So there is clearly you know, 0:20:40.440 --> 0:20:42.920 value creation when we see Asia buying Asia and the 0:20:43.040 --> 0:20:46.160 trade these trade patterns and these trade corridors grow because 0:20:46.200 --> 0:20:49.560 they're driving not only trade, but they're driving FTI, they're 0:20:49.640 --> 0:20:52.479 driving employment, they're driving domestic growth as much as it 0:20:52.520 --> 0:20:53.160 is trade growth. 0:20:53.520 --> 0:20:55.720 I mean, this year, the next couple of years seems 0:20:55.760 --> 0:20:57.960 to be much more complicated because of geopolitics. You have 0:20:58.000 --> 0:21:01.000 this massive fight between the US and China, Europe somewhere 0:21:01.000 --> 0:21:03.000 in the middle of the UK has to find its footing. 0:21:03.480 --> 0:21:07.880 How difficult is it to navigate geopolitics as HSBCCO. 0:21:08.320 --> 0:21:12.760 So look, there is always a guiding north star in 0:21:13.160 --> 0:21:16.960 managing international kind of relationship is what do our customers 0:21:17.000 --> 0:21:18.640 need from us? Because at the end of the day, 0:21:18.680 --> 0:21:21.840 whatever we're doing, we're doing it because we have customers 0:21:21.880 --> 0:21:24.320 asking us to help them with or to deliver it 0:21:24.359 --> 0:21:28.399 for them. Right, So, as long as you believe on 0:21:28.440 --> 0:21:31.480