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Speaker 1: My My new favorite lunch that I make for myself

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Speaker 1: is the Jennifer Aniston salad.

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Speaker 2: Has heard about this?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you make a salad Jennifer and cucumber mint parsley.

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Speaker 3: It's feta. It's delicious.

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Speaker 4: Oh you've lost will forever at feta.

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Speaker 1: So anyway, you know, I ran and we stumbled across this.

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Speaker 1: I actually it was from when we went on our

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Speaker 1: rafting trip. They they made this for lunch on one

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Speaker 1: of our stops and or made a version of this,

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Speaker 1: and so I was like looking up like quenwa chickpea

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Speaker 1: feta salad, and then it came up as the Jennifer

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Speaker 1: Aniston salad. I was like what and so I you

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Speaker 1: what they say is that she ate this every day

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Speaker 1: when she was on the set of Friends or whatever.

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Speaker 1: But I just thought it was so weird, like of

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Speaker 1: all the things to have named after you, like as

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Speaker 1: an actor, to have a salad named after you. So

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Speaker 1: I was wondering, if you guys could be could have

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Speaker 1: anything named after you, what would it be?

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Speaker 5: The Jennifer Aniston salad, the wild.

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Speaker 2: Salad, the Wilfred no no chick beas just steak.

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Speaker 5: It's it's just it's it's just actually of Iceberg Lattice.

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Speaker 5: That's all. It is, just after that of Iceberg Lattice.

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Speaker 5: I don't know what would you want named after you, Danielle, Oh,

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Speaker 5: I think I got one?

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Speaker 4: What go for you?

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Speaker 6: Well, if you hit a certain number of miles on

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Speaker 6: an airplane like on and they name a plane after you,

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Speaker 6: like a new plane is named after you, something like

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Speaker 6: that would be cool.

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Speaker 2: So you want like a big like an actual odd yeah.

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Speaker 5: Like a thing named after like like that would be cool.

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Speaker 6: Ship and the ocean on the high side, Yes, exactly, Like,

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Speaker 6: Oh that'd be of course everyone would get it wrong

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Speaker 6: and be like, oh man, are you flying on the Friedle?

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Speaker 1: Like no one would get it right ever, Yeah, it

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Speaker 1: would just they didn't even spell it wrong.

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Speaker 5: Exactly. It would invariably become the Freedle. But yeah, like it.

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Speaker 5: I think I take a plane. I think that'd be

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Speaker 5: really cool.

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Speaker 7: Oh man, I don't know it mine would probably, I'd

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Speaker 7: probably want it'd probably be a food relate if I

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Speaker 7: think about all my favorite things. It would be a

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Speaker 7: food related thing or it would be a nat related thing, right.

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Speaker 4: I would live official are the official Oreo?

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Speaker 5: I love that.

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Speaker 7: I would really like that yeah, that that that would

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Speaker 7: be mine. I would have to but it would yeah,

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Speaker 7: because it wouldn't be.

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Speaker 4: Something healthy like a solid.

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Speaker 7: It would have to be something like a like an

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Speaker 7: oreo to Pangorreo, or like.

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Speaker 4: You said, a McDonald's meal. Would you say to Pangorreo,

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Speaker 4: that's a pretty good one. We should we should pitch that.

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Speaker 5: We should Uh yeah, no, I think a McDonald's. Oh

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Speaker 5: if we could do a McDonald's meal too.

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Speaker 4: Oh man, if we could do a Pod meets World

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Speaker 4: McDonald's meal.

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Speaker 5: And like I want my Pod meets Yes, Oh, that'd

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Speaker 5: be awesome.

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Speaker 4: That sounds good. I could do McDonald's today.

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Speaker 5: I can do McDonald's every day.

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Speaker 1: I could do McDonald's right now, let's get it delivered

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Speaker 1: while we're while recorded.

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Speaker 4: Uber eats McDonald Welcome to Pod Meets World. I'm Daniel Fischel,

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Speaker 4: I'm writer Strong, and I'm Wilfredell.

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Speaker 7: When I innocently asked the guys, hey, either of you

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Speaker 7: two remember the writer of this episode. On a recent recap,

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Speaker 7: it was Will who jumped in and said, yeah, Kevin Kelton,

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Speaker 7: I like that guy. And then in classic Pod meets World,

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Speaker 7: Fashion Rider and I remembered absolutely nothing about him, but

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Speaker 7: we were thrilled when Kevin did reach out to Will

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Speaker 7: after the podcast episode aired to thank him for having

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Speaker 7: a working memory and now here he is about to

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Speaker 7: talk to us about what he remembers. As a writer

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Speaker 7: and producer on Boy Meets World, Kevin technically had one

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Speaker 7: of the more impressed of pre Boy Meets World resumes

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Speaker 7: on staff. He had already worked on the Variety show

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Speaker 7: Fridays with a young Green coworker named Larry David. He

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Speaker 7: had a story by credit on The Jeffersons, and spent

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Speaker 7: nineteen eighty three through nineteen eighty five as part of

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Speaker 7: the Fraternity of writers working at New York's thirty Rockefeller

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Speaker 7: Center on Saturday Night Live, where he was Emmy nominated

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Speaker 7: throw in three episodes of a Different World and five

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Speaker 7: episodes of Night Court, and by the time he had

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Speaker 7: his first script with Boy Meets World in nineteen ninety five,

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Speaker 7: this guy was killing it. He wrote season two's Pop Quiz,

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Speaker 7: the episode where Sean and Corey Steele an upcoming assignment

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Speaker 7: for mister Turner's apartment, and in season three he penned

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Speaker 7: Are Beloved and Possible Rewatch Favorite City slackers. The heart

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Speaker 7: is a lonely hunter, and I never sang for my

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Speaker 7: legal guardian, and for good reason. With all this experience,

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Speaker 7: he'd go on to write the book The Sitcom Writer's Cookbook,

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Speaker 7: and also three novels, and now, almost thirty years later,

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Speaker 7: he will join three of the child stars he once

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Speaker 7: worked with and not focus on his time with Steve Martin,

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Speaker 7: Jay Leno or Lorne Michaels. Nope, Yeah, he's going to

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Speaker 7: talk about the time he wrote the episode where Will

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Speaker 7: somehow nailed an impossibly.

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Speaker 4: Cool pool trick on his first try. So welcome to

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Speaker 4: Pod meets World.

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Speaker 7: Someone writer, and I will never forget a second time writer.

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Speaker 4: Kevin Kelton.

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Speaker 8: Hi, I'm Kate.

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Speaker 9: Hudson and I'm Oliver Hudson. And at last I checked for.

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Speaker 8: Siblings and this is sibling revelry.

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Speaker 9: We're full blood siblings, the only full blood.

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Speaker 8: Sibling and our family well not in the world, I mean.

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Speaker 5: No, in the whole world.

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Speaker 9: This is it, like no one anyway, We're back with

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Speaker 9: season four. I can't believe his.

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Speaker 8: Guys, I'm so excited, bigger and better than ever. You

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Speaker 8: might be asking yourself, what is bling revelry?

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Speaker 9: Yeah, well we just made it up. There is no

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Speaker 9: sibling revelry. It's reveling in your sibling and.

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Speaker 8: It's fun because we've decided to open it up, you know,

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Speaker 8: to really like all kinds of different siblings. And it's

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Speaker 8: going to be an awesome season.

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Speaker 9: So listen to Sibling Revelry on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or.

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Speaker 8: Wherever you listen to pop.

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Speaker 1: God, Danielle, you're like intermittently skipping and freezing around for me.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that's you, because I'm on I'm on Ethernet. You

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Speaker 4: it's you. I'm hardwire.

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Speaker 7: You interrupted a site about whose Internet is failing?

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Speaker 3: I love it because I do a podcast too, and

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Speaker 3: we have this argument every week. Oh yeah, and I

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Speaker 3: thought it was only because we were such a low

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Speaker 3: scale podcast. So the national podcast also have the same discussion.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, whose internet is failing?

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Speaker 3: Now I'm just messing up.

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Speaker 7: So first of all, Kevin Wrighter and I would like

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Speaker 7: to apologize for not remembering you.

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Speaker 1: Yes, I'm so glad you said that picture though, because

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Speaker 1: the second I saw the picture, I was like, oh yes.

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Speaker 7: When you send the picture and I saw your face,

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Speaker 7: I was like, of course there is so yeah, we

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Speaker 7: were totally blown away by the City Slackers episode it is.

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Speaker 7: I mean, not only are maybe our favorite episode of

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Speaker 7: season three, but if I had to guess, like, of

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Speaker 7: all the season one, two and three episodes, city Slackers

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Speaker 7: might be my favorite.

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Speaker 3: I don't disagree.

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Speaker 6: It was a great as it was going around the

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Speaker 6: B story, good a story, Feenie being Feoenie.

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Speaker 5: I mean, that was a great episode.

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Speaker 4: What do you remember about that week?

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Speaker 3: Well, you know, I have memories of the episodes. I

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Speaker 3: actually went back and rewatched them. I don't have a

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Speaker 3: lot of specific memories from production, but I do remember

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Speaker 3: one Bill Daniels story that I thought I would tell.

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Speaker 5: When I first came on the show.

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Speaker 3: And you guys are writers, so you know this. Actors

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Speaker 3: generally don't like parentheticals, yep, because they think that you

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Speaker 3: are telling them what to do, how to do their job.

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Speaker 3: And I was warned early on in my tenure there

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Speaker 3: not to do that for Bill Daniels because he'll call

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Speaker 3: you on it. Well, somehow I let a parenthetical slip

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Speaker 3: into one of his speeches. I think it was in

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Speaker 3: City Slackers, and sure enough we get to the reading

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Speaker 3: on whether it was whatever our Monday morning was. I

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Speaker 3: forget what day we did the readings Friday, and he

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Speaker 3: calls me over. And I never really talked much to Bill,

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Speaker 3: and he calls me over. He says, I have a

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Speaker 3: question for you about the script. And he turns to

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Speaker 3: a page and he reads like one of your lines,

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Speaker 3: and then he reads his follow up or he gets

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Speaker 3: to his follow up line with the parenthetical in it,

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Speaker 3: and he goes, oh, parenthetical, And without looking up, he's

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Speaker 3: looking right at the script just as he would do

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Speaker 3: as if he was mister Feeni. He goes, I see

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Speaker 3: you're doing my job now, and behold me and everyone

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Speaker 3: around like gasp.

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Speaker 5: Oh, there was nothing quite like that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, when you when Bill calls you on the carpet,

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Speaker 3: you have been called on the carpet.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, there was nothing quite like getting Uh.

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Speaker 6: They were always they were rare, and they were always

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Speaker 6: intelligent little cutdowns from Bill that would occasionally happen. It's

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Speaker 6: just he would he would just kind of every once

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Speaker 6: in a while, give you a little bit of a job.

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Speaker 6: But they were jabs that were beautifully timed, wonderfully thought out.

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Speaker 5: But it was like, oh, yes, I see you're doing

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Speaker 5: my job now.

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Speaker 1: What's so interesting about hearing that story? For me is like,

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Speaker 1: is that when I think about it, And of course

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Speaker 1: this is obvious, he had more experience than anybody else

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Speaker 1: on the set. Well, you know, and that's that's as

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Speaker 1: a kid, I obviously he felt like he had more

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Speaker 1: experience than me.

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Speaker 2: But for you writers too, he had years of experiencing.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, but you know, so interesting the cast. First

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Speaker 3: of all, I can't say enough about the cast. You

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Speaker 3: guys were all wonderful on and off the set. But

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Speaker 3: we could give you guys anything, and you delivered on it.

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Speaker 3: It was really a pleasure.

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Speaker 7: That's so kind When you rewatched the episodes and what

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Speaker 7: kind of emotions came up for you? How did you

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Speaker 7: feel rewatching your work this many years later.

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Speaker 3: Well, first of all, I'm a sucker for my SAP scenes.

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Speaker 3: So in that last scene in City Slackers or in

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Speaker 3: the Heart is a Lonely Hunter when writer's character when

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Speaker 3: Sean is on the picnic with his girlfriend, you know,

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Speaker 3: I choke up, even though I wrote your stuff. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: but looking back on it, it's hard. Yeah. I mean you

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Speaker 3: guys again, you know what it's like to watch your

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Speaker 3: own work, your your own worst self critic, So a

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Speaker 3: lot of it. Yeah, it's not the most fun to

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Speaker 3: go back and watch it, but I do appreciate the

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Speaker 3: quality of the episodes absolutely.

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Speaker 7: We also I really loved I never sang for My

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Speaker 7: Legal Guardian, which we just recently watched and recapped.

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Speaker 4: So you saying that you are a sucker for your sappy.

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Speaker 7: Scenes, you did write some of the more emotionally charged

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Speaker 7: episodes of our show.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well, first of all, I think that that's the

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Speaker 3: direction that Michael was taking us in that third season.

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Speaker 3: But also I came in. I mean, you guys know

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Speaker 3: my background. I have a very broad background, eclectic background

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Speaker 3: in television writing. So when I came onto the show,

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Speaker 3: I really didn't have a TGIF sensibility, and I was

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Speaker 3: hired off of a Fraser spec to give you an example. Interesting,

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Speaker 3: and so you know, my goal, like everybody in the nineties,

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Speaker 3: my goal was to work on a must TV show.

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Speaker 3: And yeah, the shows I liked were the obvious ones.

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Speaker 3: Larry Sanders, which wasn't must see TV, but f Frasier, Yeah,

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Speaker 3: Mad About You. I just absolutely adored. So my particular

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Speaker 3: kind of push in that third season because everybody was

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Speaker 3: talking about aging up the show. How can we age

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Speaker 3: up the characters age up the show, and we all

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Speaker 3: had that goal, but we had different ideas of how

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Speaker 3: to get there. And my idea was to play to

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Speaker 3: the characters that weren't as well utilized or weren't as

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Speaker 3: much of a focus, which is why I like to

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Speaker 3: write stories about mister Feenie with the boys out of school. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: you know, take Sean's relationships to a different level, putting

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Speaker 3: Will at a job at an internship. I really liked

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Speaker 3: writing for you characters and taking you to new places

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Speaker 3: and trying to write a little bit more of that

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Speaker 3: kind of like musty tvous sensibility. Now, I'm not so

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Speaker 3: egocentric as to think that I totally succeeded, but I

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Speaker 3: tried to push.

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Speaker 4: Those those muscles you absolutely did.

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Speaker 7: So I want to go back to some of your

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Speaker 7: your jobs that you had before you joined us on

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Speaker 7: Boymet's World, and one of your first jobs was on

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Speaker 7: the variety show Fridays.

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Speaker 3: That was my first comedy writing job. Yeah. I had

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Speaker 3: a job in television before that on a game show

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Speaker 3: called Face the Music, and then I got the Friday's job.

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Speaker 6: And so wait, I have I have a Friday's question, Danielle. Yes,

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Speaker 6: if you mind if I pop in. So this was

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Speaker 6: this was the Michael Michael Richards was on Fridays? Was not?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, were you there for the famous uh scene that.

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Speaker 6: Happened with it was with Andy Kaufman? With Andy Kaufman?

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Speaker 6: Were you there when that?

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Speaker 3: I had left the show a couple of weeks before that,

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Speaker 3: my contract had run out for that season. But I

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Speaker 3: have some strong opinions on that. I don't think any

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Speaker 3: of that was real.

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Speaker 5: And really, yeah, do you guys know what I'm talking about?

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Speaker 5: Danielle and Ryder?

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Speaker 2: What's the story?

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Speaker 6: Okay, well, okay, this is so this is one of

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Speaker 6: the arguably one of the most famous stories in television history.

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Speaker 6: At this point, can you tell us what it was, Kevin?

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Speaker 6: Since you were there, I mean, on the show, can

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Speaker 6: you tell us what went down?

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Speaker 3: Sure? So Andy Kaufman was known for put ons, so

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Speaker 3: he came on to Fridays and in his monologue he

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Speaker 3: was talking about how he could do anything. You know,

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Speaker 3: it's live, there's nothing they could do, and he would

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Speaker 3: do act like Andy making crazy faces, and during the

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Speaker 3: course of all of the sketches, he would kind of

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Speaker 3: break the fourth wall here and there. So finally we

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Speaker 3: get to the last sketch of the episode, and as

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Speaker 3: it plays out, Andy started going totally off camera and saying,

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Speaker 3: I can't do this anymore, started cracking up. This sketch

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Speaker 3: is too silly, I can't do this. And it builds

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Speaker 3: into an argument that builds into a fight with Michael Richards,

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Speaker 3: that builds into a fist fight with Jack Burns, who

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Speaker 3: was one of the producers and the host of the show,

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Speaker 3: or the MC of the show. It was all a

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Speaker 3: put on. Now, I wasn't there, and I have heard

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Speaker 3: a lot of people say a lot of things, but

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Speaker 3: I know Andy. I saw Andy Kaufman in the early seventies.

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Speaker 3: You know, my brother is a stand up comedian. That's

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Speaker 3: how I got into comedy. And so when I was

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Speaker 3: in college. When I was home from college, I would

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Speaker 3: hang out with him at the New York comedy clubs

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Speaker 3: because what would be more fun for a twenty year

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Speaker 3: old kid than going to comedy clubs and hanging out

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Speaker 3: with the comedians. And I saw Andy Kaufman pulling this

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Speaker 3: stuff back in nineteen seventy five, so it's all you know,

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Speaker 3: it's all a put on. He was great at it.

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Speaker 3: It was a lot of fun I'm just surprised so

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Speaker 3: many people really believed it was real.

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Speaker 1: Oh well, there's probably a level of like, there's probably

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Speaker 1: only like, like, even if it was a put on,

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Speaker 1: there were probably still crew.

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Speaker 2: Members who didn't know what was happening, right, A.

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Speaker 5: Genius, Right, yeah, that's what it was. Genius.

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Speaker 6: He would some people would be on on the joke,

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Speaker 6: other people wouldn't, so then the rumors themselves would become

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Speaker 6: part of the lore where it's like, wait, no, I

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Speaker 6: heard it was a rumor. I heard it was a

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Speaker 6: put out. No no, no, I was on that crew.

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Speaker 6: It wasn't a putt like that was part of his genius.

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Speaker 1: I kind of respect that. I kind of respect that,

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Speaker 1: but I also would hate to work with that. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know what I mean, but tolerate that, Like I

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Speaker 1: totally get it from like a distant like cultural perspective,

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Speaker 1: but being a professional in the industry, like I want

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Speaker 1: to rely on my fellow professionals, do you know what

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Speaker 1: I mean? Like, yeah, the point is that you don't

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Speaker 1: do those kinds of things to each other or.

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Speaker 3: Story. And I didn't work on this show, but when

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Speaker 3: he was on Taxi in the second or third season,

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Speaker 3: he wanted to bring on Tony Clifton as a character,

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Speaker 3: and he made them create a separate contract for Tony Clifton.

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Speaker 3: So they write this episode. Tony Clifton shows up and

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Speaker 3: during the course of the first two or three days,

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Speaker 3: he shows up with a couple of hookers on his arms.

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Speaker 3: I hope it's I can say that on the podcast.

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Speaker 9: You can.

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Speaker 5: Of course you can, of course you can.

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Speaker 10: And he seems the biggest jerk and I'm using a

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Speaker 10: kind word that one can be, to the point where

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Speaker 10: he got so bad they actually had to fire him.

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Speaker 3: Midweek, they fired Andy Kaufman as Tony Clifton, and that

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Speaker 3: next week there's there or that weekend they're trying to

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Speaker 3: figure out what are we going to do now we

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Speaker 3: we you know, we're down one cast member and Ed

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Speaker 3: Weinberger gets a call from Andy Kaufman saying, Hi, I

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Speaker 3: hear there was a problem with Tony last week. What happened?

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Speaker 5: And he was he was he would never break the character.

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Speaker 6: It was him and Bob Zamuda, right, Bob's they were

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Speaker 6: always in on the jokes, and he would he would

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Speaker 6: sit there and say like he's apparently in his dressing

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Speaker 6: room dressed like Tony Clifton at one point getting a

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Speaker 6: call as Andy Kaufman saying Andy, we have to fire

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Speaker 6: Tony and him going, oh geez, that's so he's not

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Speaker 6: gonna take it well and tell and then he like

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Speaker 6: bashed up the set. I mean, yeah, it was one

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Speaker 6: of those things where he either thought it was brilliant

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Speaker 6: or you couldn't stand him, and there was kind of

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Speaker 6: no in between, right, But yeah, that was I mean,

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Speaker 6: we were when Danielle was reading your credits. This is

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Speaker 6: another one of those times where I wish I could

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Speaker 6: when we build the time machine we've talked about, I

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Speaker 6: could go back and talk.

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Speaker 5: To you on the set about being I mean, what

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Speaker 5: years were you on snl.

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Speaker 3: Oh eighty eighty three to eighty five, two seasons, the

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Speaker 3: ninth to tenth season, so that was the last year.

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Speaker 3: It was the last year that Eddie Murphy was in

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Speaker 3: the cast. And then the season with the Marty Short

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Speaker 3: Billy Crystal Christopher.

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Speaker 6: Gets my god, So you did you you were there

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Speaker 6: with with with Hey you I see you with it.

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Speaker 5: With the swimming, I don't I'm not a snchronized swimmer.

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Speaker 6: Swimmers one of the one of the best skits of all.

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Speaker 3: Time unbelievable sketch. Yeah, yeah, written I think by those

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Speaker 3: three guys, Marty, Chris and Harry. Sure.

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Speaker 7: What are some of your favorite memories from SNL Oh, gosh.

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Speaker 3: So many of them? Right? You know? I wrote a

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Speaker 3: sketch that was a film piece about a high school

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Speaker 3: chess coach that acts like Bobby Knight on the sidelines,

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Speaker 3: growing as antrum every time a kid moves a rook

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Speaker 3: or something. And that piece got a lot of critical acclaim.

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Speaker 7: And yes, my husband loves that sketch.

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Speaker 5: When he throws the chair, He's like chucking the chair

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Speaker 5: and all this. It was hysterical.

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Speaker 3: So that, yeah, so I wrote that. That was one

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Speaker 3: of the fun pieces.

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Speaker 1: Uh.

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Speaker 3: That second year for me was was just great. I

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Speaker 3: was working with a couple of other writers. We kind

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Speaker 3: of formed an informal three person writing team. Got a

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Speaker 3: lot of material on and Yeah, the great thing about

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Speaker 3: SNEL was it taught you how to produce, because when

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Speaker 3: I was there, Dick Ebersol was the executive producer. I

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Speaker 3: never worked for Lord Michaels, but Dick let you kind

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Speaker 3: of produce your own sketches, so you learned how to

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Speaker 3: problem solve on the set as well as how to write.

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Speaker 3: I'll tell another story. I hope you don't mind me

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Speaker 3: telling these stories. I wrote a mister Robinson's neighborhood. I

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Speaker 3: didn't create the character, but you were allowed to write

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Speaker 3: for Eddie's character. So I wrote the sketch. And if

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Speaker 3: you recall mister Robinson, there was a second there was

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Speaker 3: a franchise where he always went to a board, a

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Speaker 3: board that had the word of the day on it. Yes,

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Speaker 3: he would introduce the word of the day. And the

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Speaker 3: sketch that I wrote was that mister Robinson comes in

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Speaker 3: carrying a picnic basket and he explains that he found

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Speaker 3: a basket on his doorsteps and it was his bastard baby.

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Speaker 3: So the word of the day was bastard.

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Speaker 5: It was bastard, bastard.

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Speaker 3: And remember here's what happened. I wrote a sketch. The

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Speaker 3: word of the day was bastard, and mister Robinson always

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Speaker 3: went to the board and said, here's the word of

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Speaker 3: the day. And then he would say the word and

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Speaker 3: say can you say this, boys and girls. Well, we're

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Speaker 3: rehearsing the sketch, and you know it's going to be

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Speaker 3: on the show. We're rehearsing the sketch and Dick comes

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Speaker 3: up to me and says, we've got a problem. Bill Clotworthy,

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Speaker 3: who was the censor at the time, the Standards and

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Speaker 3: Practices guy, says, we can't do bad. You got to

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Speaker 3: change it. So I said, okay. So I go back

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Speaker 3: to my office. I come up with six alternatives. I

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Speaker 3: run them all by Eddie. He rejects everyone. He says,

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Speaker 3: I want bastard. It's the only funny one. So I

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Speaker 3: tell Dick that Eddie doesn't want any of the ones.

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Speaker 3: He said, well, you created this problem, you fix it.

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Speaker 3: I'm twenty seven years old, it's my first year on SNL.

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Speaker 5: Oh my god.

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Speaker 3: I don't know what to do. So I think it

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Speaker 3: over and I go to the censor, Bill clott Worthy,

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Speaker 3: and I say, hey, Bill, what if the word of

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Speaker 3: the day is bastard? But Eddie doesn't say it out loud,

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Speaker 3: He just points to it, and we have a cover line.

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Speaker 3: And Bill says, but Eddie always says to the word

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Speaker 3: of the day. I said, what if he doesn't say

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Speaker 3: it this week? He says, if you could promise me

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Speaker 3: that he won't say it on air, I'll up that.

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Speaker 3: And so I wrote a cover line which was Eddie

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Speaker 3: going to the board pointing to that word and saying,

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Speaker 3: here's the word of the day, boys and girls. Can

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Speaker 3: you use this word in a sentence? Cab drivers can?

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Speaker 3: And that got a big laugh and that covered it.

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Speaker 4: So wow, unbelievable.

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Speaker 5: I love these I love all these stories.

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Speaker 11: Oh my gosh, how now?

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Speaker 5: What got you into television work?

435
00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:32,800
Speaker 6: What made you want to join the beautiful, wonderful, amazing

436
00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:33,480
Speaker 6: world of TV?

437
00:22:34,400 --> 00:22:37,960
Speaker 3: So I had never grown up thinking about being in entertainment.

438
00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:40,800
Speaker 3: I loved comedy. I have three older brothers. We would

439
00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:43,600
Speaker 3: watch comedians on TV, we would listen to comedy albums,

440
00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:47,360
Speaker 3: but it never occurred to me that this was a career.

441
00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:51,080
Speaker 3: My older brother Bobby became a stand up comedian in

442
00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:54,399
Speaker 3: the mid seventies. I mentioned that, and I was hanging

443
00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:56,720
Speaker 3: out with him, going to the clubs and then hanging

444
00:22:56,720 --> 00:23:00,000
Speaker 3: out afterwards with all of his friends. His best friend

445
00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,880
Speaker 3: and was Larry David. So I was around Larry all

446
00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:05,960
Speaker 3: the time before Larry David was famous. But I also

447
00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:09,280
Speaker 3: hung around with Leno and a little bit with Seinfeld.

448
00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:13,080
Speaker 3: So I was hanging around with these guys and I

449
00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:15,640
Speaker 3: just learned how to write comedy, helping my brother write

450
00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:19,679
Speaker 3: his act and then watching them all, you know, shoot

451
00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:22,080
Speaker 3: lines at each other and punch up each other's acts.

452
00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:24,639
Speaker 3: And I would, you know, go back to college and

453
00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:26,679
Speaker 3: send material to my brother and he would use some

454
00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:29,280
Speaker 3: of it and told me why some of it wouldn't work,

455
00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:31,880
Speaker 3: and we would have brotherly arguments. I'd say, you've got

456
00:23:31,880 --> 00:23:33,919
Speaker 3: to try this, and go no, it'll never work. So

457
00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:35,239
Speaker 3: then I said, well, if you're not going to use

458
00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:37,679
Speaker 3: this material, I'll do it and stand up. And I

459
00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:40,600
Speaker 3: started doing some stand up, and one thing led to another,

460
00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:42,920
Speaker 3: and after college, I just drove across country and said,

461
00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:44,760
Speaker 3: I'm going to try this writing thing and if it

462
00:23:44,800 --> 00:23:47,800
Speaker 3: doesn't work out, I'll go home and this will be

463
00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:49,800
Speaker 3: my gap year or wear my bridge year, whatever you

464
00:23:49,800 --> 00:23:51,280
Speaker 3: want to call it, and I'll go home and get

465
00:23:51,280 --> 00:23:54,520
Speaker 3: a real job. And I was there for another forty years,

466
00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:55,919
Speaker 3: so I guess it worked out.

467
00:23:56,240 --> 00:23:58,120
Speaker 5: And so you started in New York, then.

468
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:00,719
Speaker 3: Well, I grew up on Long Island, New York, went

469
00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:02,959
Speaker 3: to school in upstate New York. But as soon as

470
00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:04,960
Speaker 3: I got out of college, I realized that to be

471
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:07,119
Speaker 3: a comedy writer had to be in LA. So I

472
00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:08,520
Speaker 3: need to La.

473
00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:10,199
Speaker 5: Where I'm just curious where in Long Island were you?

474
00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:12,080
Speaker 3: Rockville Center on the south Shore.

475
00:24:12,119 --> 00:24:14,679
Speaker 6: That's exactly where my dad's from. My dad graduated from

476
00:24:14,760 --> 00:24:15,439
Speaker 6: Rockville High.

477
00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:17,080
Speaker 3: You mean Southside High School?

478
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:18,160
Speaker 5: A Southide High school?

479
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:20,639
Speaker 6: Yes, correct, he went to Southside High and my my

480
00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:21,880
Speaker 6: wife is from Hicksville.

481
00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:23,800
Speaker 5: Oh my so yeah, so.

482
00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:25,800
Speaker 6: We're big Long We're big Long Island people. I always

483
00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:26,920
Speaker 6: like to check where people are from.

484
00:24:26,920 --> 00:24:29,159
Speaker 3: It's possible that your dad and I were in the

485
00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:31,800
Speaker 3: same class, are close to it, because I'm about twenty

486
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:32,840
Speaker 3: years older than you.

487
00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:38,240
Speaker 6: Yeah, no, my dad is eighty five, so I'm guessing.

488
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:39,360
Speaker 5: A different high school class.

489
00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:42,760
Speaker 7: Wait, so how did you go from working with all

490
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:45,920
Speaker 7: of these like comedic geniuses to working with a bunch

491
00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:49,720
Speaker 7: of goober kids on boy Meet's work for yourself?

492
00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:52,040
Speaker 4: I mean, sure, sure I could for me.

493
00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:56,120
Speaker 3: First of all, of course, I disagree with that qualitization.

494
00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:57,840
Speaker 3: Just made up a word qualitization.

495
00:24:58,000 --> 00:24:58,480
Speaker 8: I like it.

496
00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:03,359
Speaker 3: I disagree with that characterization of you guys. You know,

497
00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:05,960
Speaker 3: my first several years were all in sketch comedy, to

498
00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:08,359
Speaker 3: the point where I was having trouble breaking into sitcoms.

499
00:25:08,720 --> 00:25:10,840
Speaker 3: But I knew that I was cut out for sitcoms.

500
00:25:11,040 --> 00:25:13,879
Speaker 3: It was just that my agents couldn't break me in.

501
00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:17,760
Speaker 3: So finally, in the late eighties, I started getting sitcom jobs,

502
00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:21,200
Speaker 3: and I did a couple of very short lived shows,

503
00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:23,960
Speaker 3: one on Fox, another one on NBC. Then I got

504
00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:28,080
Speaker 3: onto a different world and did some time there, than

505
00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:31,159
Speaker 3: I did Night Court for a few seasons, get a

506
00:25:31,160 --> 00:25:35,240
Speaker 3: few other shows, and you know, every season if the

507
00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:37,919
Speaker 3: show you were on ended, you had to come up

508
00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:41,560
Speaker 3: with a new gig. And my agent put me into

509
00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:44,200
Speaker 3: Boy Meets World, and Michael liked my stuff, and here

510
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:44,840
Speaker 3: we are.

511
00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:47,920
Speaker 1: So Kevin, what I love hearing about is like, how

512
00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:49,960
Speaker 1: I mean's so much? It seems like so much of

513
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:52,000
Speaker 1: being a writer is about being a part of a community.

514
00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:56,400
Speaker 1: You know, Like, yes, all of these experiences you're describing

515
00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:59,560
Speaker 1: are like groups of writers getting around making each other laugh.

516
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:02,600
Speaker 1: What what was the community of the writing staff of

517
00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:04,480
Speaker 1: a Boy Meets World? Like, how did it compare it

518
00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:06,800
Speaker 1: to like the other communities of writers that you were

519
00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:07,199
Speaker 1: parts of?

520
00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:11,720
Speaker 3: It was very close. Now, like every job there's going

521
00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:14,159
Speaker 3: to be in there's going to be bad days and

522
00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:17,239
Speaker 3: internal bickering and what have you. But it was a

523
00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:20,600
Speaker 3: really good staff, especially well the staffs that I worked

524
00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:25,159
Speaker 3: on I really enjoyed a lot of funny people. We

525
00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:27,760
Speaker 3: had some great times. But yes, you get into a

526
00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 3: writer's room and it's you know, it's it's Dorwindian. You

527
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:36,480
Speaker 3: have to produce, you have to get stuff in, and

528
00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:39,760
Speaker 3: you're competing against your fellow your friends because that you know,

529
00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:42,120
Speaker 3: you spend eight ten hours a day with that group

530
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:46,119
Speaker 3: of people, they become your closest friends. So but I

531
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 3: really loved it. I mean, bus Gang and Blutman were great,

532
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:52,040
Speaker 3: and Jeff, as you know, it's just such a great guy,

533
00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:56,920
Speaker 3: both Jeffs, Jeff Manel and Jeff Shearman. David was fun

534
00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:01,280
Speaker 3: to work for. Matt Nelson, Oh god, what a talented

535
00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:03,800
Speaker 3: guy he was. And we had some other writers there

536
00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 3: who you may not remember because, like me, they weren't

537
00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 3: on for a long time, but Judy Tole and Susan

538
00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:13,720
Speaker 3: Sherman and Dona Trueho, they were all just great to

539
00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:14,400
Speaker 3: hang out with.

540
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:16,600
Speaker 4: Yeah, so much fun.

541
00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:20,639
Speaker 7: Do you remember any stories you may have pitched or

542
00:27:21,400 --> 00:27:23,280
Speaker 7: things that you may have, you know, suggested in the

543
00:27:23,320 --> 00:27:25,119
Speaker 7: writer's room that didn't end up making it.

544
00:27:25,960 --> 00:27:29,040
Speaker 3: I don't remember specific episodes, but I do remember in

545
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:31,800
Speaker 3: that second season again, as we were talking about trying

546
00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:35,920
Speaker 3: to age up the show. My angle that I kind

547
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:37,840
Speaker 3: of pitched to I don't know whether it ever made

548
00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:39,479
Speaker 3: its way to Michael, but I pitched it a lot

549
00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:42,080
Speaker 3: in the writer's room and probably mentioned it to David

550
00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:45,360
Speaker 3: and to Jeff McCracken was that I thought it would

551
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:50,720
Speaker 3: be interesting to keep Sean at Turner's house but also

552
00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:53,720
Speaker 3: have Will graduate high school and move in with them,

553
00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:57,160
Speaker 3: and have that become more of an equal home base

554
00:27:57,240 --> 00:28:02,800
Speaker 3: to the Kitchen. So, you know, great, First of all,

555
00:28:03,119 --> 00:28:07,960
Speaker 3: I listen, I think all three of you are fabulously talented.

556
00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:10,639
Speaker 3: So I hope you don't mind my saying Will, I

557
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:14,399
Speaker 3: was a particular, a particular fan of your work. I

558
00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:16,560
Speaker 3: loved writing for all of you, but will you you,

559
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:20,480
Speaker 3: I mean, you always all delivered. But I really thought

560
00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 3: it would be fun to get Will in that environment

561
00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:28,640
Speaker 3: with Turner, with Sean obviously, having Tapanga and Corey coming over,

562
00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:33,200
Speaker 3: having Alex's character being there as well. You know again,

563
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:36,120
Speaker 3: I was thinking Seinfeld friends, Fraser.

564
00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:39,760
Speaker 1: And a group of young guys sort of living together,

565
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:42,040
Speaker 1: and like, oh, that makes so much sense. I mean,

566
00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:44,360
Speaker 1: it's kind of what ended up happening with Jack, with

567
00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:46,960
Speaker 1: Jack and Sean in the season five and six.

568
00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:48,160
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, that's so cool.

569
00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:51,440
Speaker 1: Oh we could have done so it would have kept

570
00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:52,280
Speaker 1: Alex around, and.

571
00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:53,960
Speaker 2: It wuld have kept thinking of Alex.

572
00:28:54,200 --> 00:28:56,520
Speaker 7: Do you do you remember Kevin there being a lot

573
00:28:56,560 --> 00:29:00,440
Speaker 7: of conversation about ways that they could involve that you guys,

574
00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:04,200
Speaker 7: could involve Alex Dsayer's character, mister Williams into the show,

575
00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:08,160
Speaker 7: because that's one of our real only criticisms of season

576
00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:09,360
Speaker 7: three is that.

577
00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:12,160
Speaker 4: He felt like it was he was so wasted.

578
00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:14,680
Speaker 7: He was such a talent, and yet we knew they

579
00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:16,280
Speaker 7: wanted to age up the show, but it didn't really

580
00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 7: seem like they knew how to do it.

581
00:29:18,280 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, first of all, we were all tremendous fans

582
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:23,360
Speaker 3: of Alex's. He always delivered. He was a great guy.

583
00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:26,640
Speaker 3: I never felt that there was an issue with his

584
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:29,520
Speaker 3: character other than well, first of all, I think they

585
00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:33,800
Speaker 3: only you know, contracted him for a handful of episodes, right,

586
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:36,960
Speaker 3: and and that was probably a budgetary thing. Now I

587
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:41,040
Speaker 3: could be wrong about that, but that's that's my vague memory.

588
00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 3: I don't remember that we struggled. We liked writing for him,

589
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:48,640
Speaker 3: but we had, you know, the major characters were you guys,

590
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:50,720
Speaker 3: so we had to really focus the stories on you,

591
00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:53,080
Speaker 3: and he would come. You know, he was there to

592
00:29:53,120 --> 00:29:58,880
Speaker 3: be Turner's kind of mouthpiece or you know, his confidant.

593
00:29:59,640 --> 00:29:59,960
Speaker 4: Yeah.

594
00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:04,560
Speaker 7: Right, Do you remember Will's pool shot in the episode

595
00:30:04,560 --> 00:30:07,200
Speaker 7: that you wrote where he nails that pool shot.

596
00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:11,360
Speaker 3: I just rewatched it again for this, and you know,

597
00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:14,840
Speaker 3: I heard you guys talking about those pool scenes. When

598
00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:18,080
Speaker 3: you talked about that episode, Will, I didn't recall that

599
00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:21,920
Speaker 3: you had worked with a professional pool shark, and I

600
00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:24,960
Speaker 3: didn't realize that you had done some of those shots.

601
00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:28,360
Speaker 3: Or maybe I realized it and didn't remember. But yeah,

602
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:31,680
Speaker 3: that last shot of the show, which was the final

603
00:30:31,720 --> 00:30:34,880
Speaker 3: shot of the pool game, was really cool when you

604
00:30:35,000 --> 00:30:36,000
Speaker 3: sank every ball.

605
00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:40,959
Speaker 6: Yes, chef Chef Anton who now does underwater scuba magic

606
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:43,160
Speaker 6: where we're still trying to figure out exactly what.

607
00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:45,960
Speaker 5: That is and how we can get involved.

608
00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:46,560
Speaker 3: Yeah.

609
00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:50,080
Speaker 7: Yeah, So where did you go after you left Boy

610
00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:50,720
Speaker 7: Meets World?

611
00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:53,360
Speaker 4: Where did you go and why did you leave us?

612
00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:57,480
Speaker 3: I anticipated this question so as I think I made

613
00:30:57,640 --> 00:31:00,880
Speaker 3: very clear so far. I had this image of myself

614
00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:06,959
Speaker 3: as a musty TV writer, and I got offered a

615
00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:10,440
Speaker 3: new NBC show that was going to be part of

616
00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:13,040
Speaker 3: the so called Musty TV Family. It was going to

617
00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:16,680
Speaker 3: be on and did go on on NBC on Tuesday

618
00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:19,920
Speaker 3: nights between Matt about You and Fraser. It was hammocked

619
00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:23,000
Speaker 3: in between him. It was called something So Right, and

620
00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:27,840
Speaker 3: it starred Jerry Burns and Mel Harris. Yes, I remember

621
00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:33,000
Speaker 3: this as two divorcees each have kids of their own

622
00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:35,800
Speaker 3: and they get married and it's about a blended family.

623
00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:39,000
Speaker 3: And there too their exes coming in because they were

624
00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:42,479
Speaker 3: still the fathers and the mothers of the kids. So

625
00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:48,200
Speaker 3: I got offered that and I really wanted to do it. So,

626
00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 3: you know, my agent said, you know, Michael's not going

627
00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:53,120
Speaker 3: to like it if you if you leave the show,

628
00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:55,600
Speaker 3: I said, can I can I just run it by

629
00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:57,880
Speaker 3: them and see what they say. So I went to

630
00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:00,240
Speaker 3: McCracken and I discussed it and he said, well, well,

631
00:32:00,280 --> 00:32:02,320
Speaker 3: you know, I don't think Michael's going to react to

632
00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:04,400
Speaker 3: well to this. You guys know Michael, you know.

633
00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:05,520
Speaker 5: Yeah.

634
00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:07,600
Speaker 3: And I was always a little intimidated by Michael, who,

635
00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:10,840
Speaker 3: by the way, maybe the best showrunner I ever worked for,

636
00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:12,480
Speaker 3: certainly up in the top three.

637
00:32:13,200 --> 00:32:13,480
Speaker 5: Wow.

638
00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:17,200
Speaker 3: But you know, Michael could be intimidating. So I went

639
00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:19,680
Speaker 3: and sat down with him and you know, he already

640
00:32:19,720 --> 00:32:21,600
Speaker 3: knew what I was coming in for. Quis McCracken had

641
00:32:21,640 --> 00:32:24,600
Speaker 3: laid the groundwork and I told him, and you know,

642
00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:27,920
Speaker 3: he was cool about it. He said, listen, if that's

643
00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:29,400
Speaker 3: what you want to do, that's what you want to do.

644
00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:35,320
Speaker 3: You know, godspeed. But I always felt that maybe there

645
00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:37,120
Speaker 3: was a little bit of hard feelings there and I

646
00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:39,920
Speaker 3: kind of I kind of feel bad about how I

647
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:43,600
Speaker 3: handled it. But you know, that's a career, right, you

648
00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:43,920
Speaker 3: moved on.

649
00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:46,440
Speaker 1: You you got to go from job to job or

650
00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:48,560
Speaker 1: you know, you got to pursue your It's just a bummer.

651
00:32:48,600 --> 00:32:51,000
Speaker 1: The show didn't didn't last. You know, That's that's the

652
00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 1: problem about show business. It's like you got to work

653
00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:55,320
Speaker 1: just as hard and give it your all, and then

654
00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:58,640
Speaker 1: the show can get canceled or you're not right and grace.

655
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:02,360
Speaker 3: Shows with great writing staffs are great casts get canceled,

656
00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:05,200
Speaker 3: and shows that maybe aren't as deserving go on for

657
00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:09,480
Speaker 3: many years. But What Boy Meets World, You know, as

658
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:11,040
Speaker 3: I look back on it, and you guys have talked

659
00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:12,680
Speaker 3: about this on the podcast, which by the way, I

660
00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:17,200
Speaker 3: listen to almost every week, thank you, it's grown so

661
00:33:17,320 --> 00:33:22,640
Speaker 3: much in status and as an iconic series. And I

662
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:25,360
Speaker 3: think we're all so much, you know, so proud of

663
00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:28,760
Speaker 3: the work now that we did because it's it stood

664
00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:29,600
Speaker 3: the test of time.

665
00:33:30,360 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 4: Absolutely.

666
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:32,920
Speaker 7: I want to ask you, because you mentioned that Michael

667
00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:34,680
Speaker 7: was one of the best showrunners you ever worked for.

668
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:37,280
Speaker 7: What was it like to work for Michael? What were

669
00:33:37,320 --> 00:33:39,320
Speaker 7: some of your favorite parts of working with him? Tell

670
00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:40,840
Speaker 7: us more about your experience with that.

671
00:33:41,400 --> 00:33:44,000
Speaker 3: Okay, Well, my favorite thing is the way he handled

672
00:33:44,320 --> 00:33:49,320
Speaker 3: a network. You know, as as you guys know, in television,

673
00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:51,440
Speaker 3: there's a lot of fancy titles. You know, you're a

674
00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:55,400
Speaker 3: consulting producer, a story editor, a co executive producer, but

675
00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:59,960
Speaker 3: the reality is it's there's the showrunner and there's everyone else. Yeah,

676
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:02,640
Speaker 3: and Michael was the showrunner, as you know, and so

677
00:34:02,800 --> 00:34:04,959
Speaker 3: he was the one that dealt with the networks, and

678
00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:09,399
Speaker 3: he didn't take any guff from the networks. They gave

679
00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:13,040
Speaker 3: his They gave him their notes, and he pretty much

680
00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:15,360
Speaker 3: ignored them where he took the ones that he wanted.

681
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 3: But he knew how to manage the network as well

682
00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:21,120
Speaker 3: as any showrunner I've ever seen, because some just crumble

683
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:25,160
Speaker 3: under network notes. The other thing that was amazing about

684
00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:29,400
Speaker 3: Michael is he didn't stay in the room because he

685
00:34:29,480 --> 00:34:32,400
Speaker 3: was busy running the show. So David Kendall ran the

686
00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:35,919
Speaker 3: room the seasons that I was there. But if we were,

687
00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:39,160
Speaker 3: you know, struggling with a script at eleven pm twelve

688
00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:42,640
Speaker 3: pm at night, Michael would come in and Michael could

689
00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:46,879
Speaker 3: just he'd say, what's the problem, and David would kind

690
00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:49,840
Speaker 3: of explain it, and Michael would start riffing and he

691
00:34:49,880 --> 00:34:53,919
Speaker 3: would just add lib a scene. He would just riff

692
00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:57,080
Speaker 3: a scene. We're all just sitting there doing nothing except

693
00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:00,359
Speaker 3: laughing at his lines. But he could write when when

694
00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:04,719
Speaker 3: I'd say eighty percent of the episodes of those two seasons,

695
00:35:05,360 --> 00:35:07,719
Speaker 3: if you got to the second act scene that was

696
00:35:07,760 --> 00:35:10,880
Speaker 3: the heartfelt scene and there was a long monologue for

697
00:35:10,920 --> 00:35:13,680
Speaker 3: one of the characters, there's a very good chance that

698
00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:16,200
Speaker 3: Michael wrote that in some form or fashion.

699
00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:20,000
Speaker 5: Right, Yeah, Yeah, he did have that. We heard that

700
00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:21,080
Speaker 5: from a number of people.

701
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:23,879
Speaker 6: Jeff McCracken, two who knew him the longest, would say

702
00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:25,360
Speaker 6: that he would be with him an improv class and

703
00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:26,560
Speaker 6: he was always the funniest guy there.

704
00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:28,040
Speaker 1: He's just I was going to say he had that

705
00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:30,080
Speaker 1: a bill of an acting background too, you know what

706
00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:30,359
Speaker 1: I mean?

707
00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:31,000
Speaker 2: Like he came.

708
00:35:31,120 --> 00:35:33,560
Speaker 1: He started as an actor, and so I think he

709
00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:36,440
Speaker 1: always thought of writing primarily as a sort of an

710
00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:37,400
Speaker 1: acting exercise.

711
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:38,360
Speaker 2: So it's interesting to hear that he.

712
00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:39,680
Speaker 5: Would so fast.

713
00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:41,560
Speaker 6: I mean, when you work with Michael, I mean, he

714
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:44,080
Speaker 6: was his mind. The way his mind worked comedically was

715
00:35:44,520 --> 00:35:47,520
Speaker 6: unlike almost anybody I've ever met in my life, so fast,

716
00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:51,000
Speaker 6: and he at times you could tell, and I saw

717
00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:53,920
Speaker 6: this more on Girlmy's World. He would block everything out,

718
00:35:53,960 --> 00:35:57,080
Speaker 6: including at times too I think a detriment, but block

719
00:35:57,120 --> 00:35:59,359
Speaker 6: out almost everybody else in the room or anything going on,

720
00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:01,960
Speaker 6: and would just be typing and you're kind of watching

721
00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:03,800
Speaker 6: it happen on the screen and it's hysterical.

722
00:36:03,840 --> 00:36:08,000
Speaker 5: I mean. He was just really really good at us. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

723
00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:08,400
Speaker 5: I mean, and.

724
00:36:08,719 --> 00:36:12,120
Speaker 3: He knew the show as most showrunners do. He knew

725
00:36:12,200 --> 00:36:15,120
Speaker 3: it so well, and he just had a sense for

726
00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:18,000
Speaker 3: what was right for Topanger, or what was right for Sean,

727
00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:20,080
Speaker 3: or what was right for Eric.

728
00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:22,360
Speaker 4: Yeah, and so other people.

729
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:24,680
Speaker 7: I have to ask you about because we noticed just

730
00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:27,920
Speaker 7: how many episodes they wrote in season three.

731
00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:30,520
Speaker 4: What do you remember about Blutman and bus Gang.

732
00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:33,839
Speaker 3: Well, first of all, very funny guys, had a lot

733
00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:37,880
Speaker 3: of fun with them. How is Howard bust Gang is

734
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:39,960
Speaker 3: one of the funnier writers that I've worked with. He

735
00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:42,759
Speaker 3: was a joke machine. Yeah, he just came up with

736
00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:46,560
Speaker 3: line after line after line. Blutman was also very funny,

737
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:49,480
Speaker 3: maybe a little bit more of a story guy. And

738
00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:51,439
Speaker 3: they turned out a lot of material, and they knew

739
00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:55,800
Speaker 3: the show so well. They really felt a personal connection

740
00:36:55,920 --> 00:37:00,759
Speaker 3: to the show, maybe even deeper than anyone else on

741
00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:04,960
Speaker 3: the staff. They really were boy meets world writers to

742
00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:07,759
Speaker 3: their core, and that's why they stayed with the show

743
00:37:07,800 --> 00:37:08,600
Speaker 3: as long as they did.

744
00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:12,359
Speaker 4: Yeah, do you keep in touch with anybody from the show?

745
00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:16,319
Speaker 3: A little bit? On Facebook? I keep in touch with Mark,

746
00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:20,040
Speaker 3: I keep in touch with Jeff, and very occasionally David.

747
00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:22,880
Speaker 3: Like during the writer's strike, I would see him post

748
00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:25,640
Speaker 3: photos of him picketing, and I would like it make

749
00:37:25,680 --> 00:37:28,279
Speaker 3: a comment. Because I'm no longer in Los Angeles, I

750
00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:30,839
Speaker 3: would have been there picketing if I had been in LA,

751
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:33,600
Speaker 3: but I wasn't going to fly into town just to picket.

752
00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:34,600
Speaker 5: Where are you?

753
00:37:35,440 --> 00:37:37,520
Speaker 3: I live outside of Austin, Texas now.

754
00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:38,280
Speaker 5: I moved here.

755
00:37:38,320 --> 00:37:40,160
Speaker 3: Oh nice, almost four years ago.

756
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:41,320
Speaker 4: Wonderful.

757
00:37:42,040 --> 00:37:44,520
Speaker 6: I have one more question about the people you worked

758
00:37:44,560 --> 00:37:47,640
Speaker 6: with because she was kind of one of the unsung heroes.

759
00:37:47,680 --> 00:37:49,200
Speaker 6: She's not here anymore, and she went on to do

760
00:37:49,239 --> 00:37:51,279
Speaker 6: some pretty amazing things. Can you talk a little bit

761
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,400
Speaker 6: about Judy tole Yes, Judy.

762
00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:57,840
Speaker 3: Actually I knew Judy from our comedy days together. We

763
00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:00,520
Speaker 3: started in stand up around the same time and we

764
00:38:00,520 --> 00:38:05,240
Speaker 3: were quite friendly. Judy was just such a lovely person,

765
00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:11,520
Speaker 3: very funny, very brash in a good way, and she

766
00:38:12,239 --> 00:38:14,440
Speaker 3: was great to have in the room because she kept

767
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:17,080
Speaker 3: things lively. One of the things that happens in a

768
00:38:17,120 --> 00:38:20,520
Speaker 3: writer's room, especially when you get to twelve o'clock, one o'clock,

769
00:38:20,560 --> 00:38:23,399
Speaker 3: two o'clock in the morning, is people start to run

770
00:38:23,440 --> 00:38:27,880
Speaker 3: out of energy and it could become really problematic. But

771
00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:30,120
Speaker 3: you need someone there like a Judy Toll and a

772
00:38:30,160 --> 00:38:33,080
Speaker 3: Mark Blutman frankly, who can keep the energy up when

773
00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:36,640
Speaker 3: everybody else is kind of fading. And Judy was great

774
00:38:36,680 --> 00:38:40,240
Speaker 3: at that. We lost her at a very young age,

775
00:38:40,280 --> 00:38:42,960
Speaker 3: as you know, thirty nine years old. I believe I

776
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:47,120
Speaker 3: know it was to cancer, and yeah, we were Actually

777
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:49,280
Speaker 3: we knew each other before she came on the show,

778
00:38:49,800 --> 00:38:52,120
Speaker 3: and probably the person that I knew best.

779
00:38:53,239 --> 00:38:55,360
Speaker 6: Yeah, because she also went off into the whole Larry

780
00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:58,560
Speaker 6: David World after Boy Meet's World, and was also on

781
00:38:58,680 --> 00:39:00,480
Speaker 6: camera and some of the stuff that they were doing there,

782
00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:02,000
Speaker 6: and she was just so talented.

783
00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:07,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, in the original Curb Your Enthusiasm movie, yeah, they

784
00:39:07,560 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 3: shot for HBO, she played one of the network executives.

785
00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:12,799
Speaker 5: And she was great. She was so good in it.

786
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:14,960
Speaker 6: And I remember seeing her and I know she was

787
00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:17,200
Speaker 6: good friends with Kathy Griffin, and I ran into her

788
00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:18,240
Speaker 6: in a movie theater and.

789
00:39:18,360 --> 00:39:20,600
Speaker 5: We got to talk as adults a little bit.

790
00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:23,560
Speaker 6: It was after she had left the show, and then

791
00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:26,160
Speaker 6: hearing she had passed was just Yeah, she was super,

792
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:27,240
Speaker 6: super talented.

793
00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:30,920
Speaker 3: And one last thing that I'll share with you guys is,

794
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:33,799
Speaker 3: as you can imagine, just as it was kind of

795
00:39:33,840 --> 00:39:36,799
Speaker 3: weird for you to be fifteen years old and Will

796
00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:39,200
Speaker 3: you were just a little bit older, I think, and

797
00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:42,080
Speaker 3: working in television, it was a little weird for us

798
00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:45,480
Speaker 3: to be working with teenagers. And one of the reasons

799
00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:47,560
Speaker 3: that you didn't know me that well was I felt

800
00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:50,160
Speaker 3: a little awkward around you, guys, because I thought you

801
00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:55,319
Speaker 3: were so freaking cool. I thought I thought you were

802
00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:57,240
Speaker 3: the coolest fifteen year old in the world.

803
00:39:57,320 --> 00:40:00,440
Speaker 4: He really was. He was I was.

804
00:40:00,760 --> 00:40:03,200
Speaker 3: I mean, first of all, you you were all heart

805
00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:05,880
Speaker 3: throbs in your own way. You know that the audiences

806
00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:09,000
Speaker 3: would treat you like the Beatles, you know that. And

807
00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:11,880
Speaker 3: one day I was walking from the parking lot into

808
00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:15,480
Speaker 3: the building and I see a parking space with a

809
00:40:15,520 --> 00:40:18,040
Speaker 3: really cool car in it and said, Riders Strong on it.

810
00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:20,840
Speaker 3: And I went into the office and I asked somebody,

811
00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:23,839
Speaker 3: I said, is that for writer's parents so they could

812
00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:26,799
Speaker 3: drive him to the set. He said, oh no, he

813
00:40:26,840 --> 00:40:29,960
Speaker 3: has his driver's license already. He drives himself. Here. You

814
00:40:30,000 --> 00:40:33,960
Speaker 3: were like sixteen years old, and I thought he stars

815
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:37,200
Speaker 3: on a television show. He's like a sex symbol and

816
00:40:37,280 --> 00:40:39,680
Speaker 3: he drives at sixteen, Who is this kid?

817
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:48,320
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, he's Rider Strong. And that Z three looked

818
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:50,239
Speaker 6: like a small version of the Batmobile.

819
00:40:50,239 --> 00:40:53,480
Speaker 4: It was sockery.

820
00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:58,280
Speaker 2: It's all downhill. Since it's all I just got older.

821
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:02,680
Speaker 5: That's funny, Kevin.

822
00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:04,360
Speaker 7: I want to give a shout out to your brother,

823
00:41:04,400 --> 00:41:06,719
Speaker 7: who you mentioned was a stand up comedian. He did

824
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:11,120
Speaker 7: Carson like something like nine times in the eighties, which.

825
00:41:11,239 --> 00:41:13,880
Speaker 3: To be exactly wow, Yeah.

826
00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:14,799
Speaker 4: That's unbelievable.

827
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:17,239
Speaker 7: Please tell us his name, I mean, and give us

828
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:18,439
Speaker 7: tell us a little bit about him.

829
00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:22,040
Speaker 3: So his professional name is Bobby Kelton. He started in

830
00:41:22,040 --> 00:41:26,240
Speaker 3: the mid seventies. His contemporaries were Jay Leno, Larry David,

831
00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:30,719
Speaker 3: David Letterman. They all started around the same time. And

832
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:32,640
Speaker 3: of course those guys went on to be a lot

833
00:41:32,719 --> 00:41:37,720
Speaker 3: more famous than Bobby did. But he still performs in Florida,

834
00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:40,880
Speaker 3: not as much as he used to. But yeah, he

835
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:43,160
Speaker 3: did all those shows in the eighties. He was on

836
00:41:43,239 --> 00:41:47,160
Speaker 3: Carson and Griffin and Mike Douglas and Dinah Shore, and

837
00:41:47,200 --> 00:41:49,719
Speaker 3: he worked you know, in Vegas and other places like that.

838
00:41:50,080 --> 00:41:54,000
Speaker 3: And again that's how I learned the business, was by

839
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:57,000
Speaker 3: us Moses, through him and through his friends. So if

840
00:41:57,080 --> 00:41:58,840
Speaker 3: it hadn't been for Bobby, I don't know where I

841
00:41:58,840 --> 00:42:00,840
Speaker 3: would have ended up. I would have been an accountant

842
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:01,800
Speaker 3: or a lawyer or something.

843
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:06,520
Speaker 1: You must have had a like a funny childhood home, though,

844
00:42:06,719 --> 00:42:09,200
Speaker 1: I mean, like did well at dinner tables.

845
00:42:09,320 --> 00:42:12,680
Speaker 2: Must have been jokes after jokes, right, like it was.

846
00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:15,640
Speaker 3: And again I was the youngest of four boys. And

847
00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:18,880
Speaker 3: when we were young, like I said, we loved comedy

848
00:42:19,560 --> 00:42:22,520
Speaker 3: and we had we would play games. Now, when I

849
00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:25,840
Speaker 3: say games, you're probably thinking of softball or stickball, or

850
00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:30,440
Speaker 3: or some board game. Our games were actually something that

851
00:42:30,640 --> 00:42:34,480
Speaker 3: a word now that we know as improvisation. We had

852
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:38,719
Speaker 3: running characters and we would just add lib scenes with

853
00:42:38,800 --> 00:42:43,640
Speaker 3: these running characters over and over and over again and again.

854
00:42:43,680 --> 00:42:45,440
Speaker 3: We didn't know what we were doing. We didn't know

855
00:42:45,600 --> 00:42:49,560
Speaker 3: that improvisation existed. We had never heard of Second City. Yeah,

856
00:42:49,840 --> 00:42:53,720
Speaker 3: but we would just make up these scenes, like, for instance,

857
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:58,200
Speaker 3: one of them was Uncle Jack, and the storyline was

858
00:42:58,239 --> 00:43:02,400
Speaker 3: it was sort of like a wily coyote kind of

859
00:43:02,400 --> 00:43:05,839
Speaker 3: a thing where my oldest brother Bruce played Uncle Jack

860
00:43:05,880 --> 00:43:08,000
Speaker 3: and I was the young Master, and the storyline or

861
00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:10,560
Speaker 3: the backstory was that my parents had died in a

862
00:43:10,600 --> 00:43:14,719
Speaker 3: car crash and I had inherited millions of dollars and

863
00:43:14,800 --> 00:43:17,799
Speaker 3: so my uncle was now taking care of me and

864
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:20,239
Speaker 3: constantly trying to kill me off for the money, and

865
00:43:20,280 --> 00:43:25,480
Speaker 3: it would always backfire, and it's great. We even had

866
00:43:25,520 --> 00:43:28,200
Speaker 3: an opening that we did it at the beginning of

867
00:43:28,200 --> 00:43:31,000
Speaker 3: every game where my other brother Mike played like the

868
00:43:31,040 --> 00:43:34,799
Speaker 3: butler and he would get the call where he was

869
00:43:34,880 --> 00:43:37,960
Speaker 3: being told that my parents were killed in a car crash,

870
00:43:38,040 --> 00:43:40,960
Speaker 3: and they would go hello, uh huh, I see okay,

871
00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:45,120
Speaker 3: thank you very much, and that was how the show,

872
00:43:45,160 --> 00:43:46,400
Speaker 3: and that was how the game began.

873
00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:48,960
Speaker 4: Wow, so much fun.

874
00:43:49,440 --> 00:43:52,120
Speaker 3: So yeah, we didn't know that we were training ourselves

875
00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:56,360
Speaker 3: for careers in comedy. And two of my brothers, Bruce

876
00:43:56,400 --> 00:43:58,960
Speaker 3: and Mike, are now attorneys. Bruce is actually a judge,

877
00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:02,040
Speaker 3: a federal judge in California, and he was the funniest

878
00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:05,120
Speaker 3: of the four of us, and he's now a federal judge.

879
00:44:05,160 --> 00:44:07,120
Speaker 3: So go figure out, well, did you go up?

880
00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:08,080
Speaker 5: Did you grow up watching?

881
00:44:08,120 --> 00:44:11,080
Speaker 6: I mean, at the time, sketch comedy was essentially in

882
00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:13,200
Speaker 6: its infancy, unless you go back to things like the

883
00:44:13,239 --> 00:44:15,280
Speaker 6: movies like Hell's of Poppin' and things that are old

884
00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:16,000
Speaker 6: school stuff.

885
00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:19,920
Speaker 5: There wasn't a whole ton of sketch comedy around at

886
00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:20,359
Speaker 5: the time.

887
00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:23,320
Speaker 3: Well there was, it was in a different form. Of course.

888
00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:27,360
Speaker 3: Your show of shows was long before I was television.

889
00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:31,280
Speaker 3: But there was Carol Burnett, there was Las Sunny and Cherr,

890
00:44:31,320 --> 00:44:33,280
Speaker 3: which actually did some decent sketches.

891
00:44:33,440 --> 00:44:35,080
Speaker 5: I guess they did a few.

892
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:38,160
Speaker 3: Things like that. So and I would watch those shows again,

893
00:44:38,239 --> 00:44:41,680
Speaker 3: not thinking that I was trading myself for anything, but

894
00:44:41,760 --> 00:44:44,120
Speaker 3: I would watch those with my dad or with my brothers,

895
00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:50,400
Speaker 3: and it just sunk in and I remember watching SNL

896
00:44:50,680 --> 00:44:54,719
Speaker 3: that first season and I would watch the credit roll

897
00:44:54,880 --> 00:44:57,080
Speaker 3: because I was already starting to be kind of like

898
00:44:57,960 --> 00:45:02,800
Speaker 3: aware of writers, hyper focusing on it. And one week

899
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:05,520
Speaker 3: there was a new name in the credits, the name

900
00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:09,040
Speaker 3: James Downey. Now I don't know whether you guys know

901
00:45:09,080 --> 00:45:12,480
Speaker 3: who Jim Downey is, but he ended up being probably

902
00:45:12,520 --> 00:45:15,319
Speaker 3: the greatest writer on Saturday Night Live. He worked there

903
00:45:15,360 --> 00:45:19,280
Speaker 3: for some forty years on and off. But I remember

904
00:45:19,320 --> 00:45:22,040
Speaker 3: seeing his name new to the credit roll and going,

905
00:45:22,280 --> 00:45:24,560
Speaker 3: who is this guy? How did he get that job?

906
00:45:24,600 --> 00:45:27,040
Speaker 3: Where did he come from? And years later I got

907
00:45:27,040 --> 00:45:29,319
Speaker 3: to work with him, so that was kind of a

908
00:45:29,360 --> 00:45:29,880
Speaker 3: thrill for me.

909
00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:34,799
Speaker 5: Jim Downey, Yeah, you're right. Carol Burnett was amazing. I mean, yeah,

910
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:35,759
Speaker 5: oh yeah.

911
00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:38,240
Speaker 3: I would argue that that was the best sketch comedy

912
00:45:38,239 --> 00:45:39,759
Speaker 3: show ever I could.

913
00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:41,600
Speaker 6: It'd be hard to disagree with that. But they also

914
00:45:41,719 --> 00:45:44,359
Speaker 6: kept in the breaking and all the lat I mean,

915
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:46,560
Speaker 6: it was oh yeah, yeah, Kevin.

916
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:47,960
Speaker 1: I want to ask you about your novel. So you've

917
00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:50,879
Speaker 1: written you've moved into writing fiction now.

918
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:54,640
Speaker 3: Yeah. So when I retired from television and then I

919
00:45:54,680 --> 00:45:56,920
Speaker 3: had a couple of other jobs that were writing related,

920
00:45:56,960 --> 00:46:00,440
Speaker 3: in the corporate field. Then I retired and moved to

921
00:46:01,440 --> 00:46:05,200
Speaker 3: uh A, excuse me, to Arizona, to Texas and uh

922
00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:09,000
Speaker 3: I just started writing novels, and uh I don't know

923
00:46:09,000 --> 00:46:10,880
Speaker 3: whether I'm good at it, but I've written five of

924
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:14,759
Speaker 3: them in the last two to three years. I've also

925
00:46:14,800 --> 00:46:18,600
Speaker 3: written a book about television writing. I teach television television

926
00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:22,359
Speaker 3: writing through UCLA Extension, and I decided to take all

927
00:46:22,360 --> 00:46:24,319
Speaker 3: of my lessons and turn them into a how to

928
00:46:24,400 --> 00:46:29,160
Speaker 3: book about TV writing. So, yeah, I've written five novels there.

929
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:33,400
Speaker 3: They were really like novella's. They're really short novels, and

930
00:46:33,920 --> 00:46:34,560
Speaker 3: I'm kind.

931
00:46:34,360 --> 00:46:37,080
Speaker 5: Of the comedy or yeah, what's the genre.

932
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:39,719
Speaker 3: So they're all different. The first one that I wrote

933
00:46:39,840 --> 00:46:43,920
Speaker 3: was a dark satire, a dystopian satire on marriage and divorce.

934
00:46:44,040 --> 00:46:48,040
Speaker 3: It's called super Vows and it's about a world. Do

935
00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:55,520
Speaker 3: you guys know what covenant marriages? Have you heard about? Okay?

936
00:46:55,520 --> 00:46:58,440
Speaker 3: Covenant marriage is kind of this rule. It's legal in

937
00:46:58,520 --> 00:47:01,560
Speaker 3: a couple of states Louisia and Arizona and maybe one

938
00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:05,160
Speaker 3: other state. But it's basically a religious based marriage where

939
00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:09,400
Speaker 3: you're agreeing to live together for life and you agree

940
00:47:09,440 --> 00:47:12,560
Speaker 3: not to divorce. Now, it is possible to get divorced

941
00:47:12,560 --> 00:47:14,839
Speaker 3: in a covenant marriage, but you have to go through

942
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:18,239
Speaker 3: a lot more hoops than you would in a regular marriage.

943
00:47:18,400 --> 00:47:21,400
Speaker 3: So these things are meant to last a lifetime. And

944
00:47:21,480 --> 00:47:23,600
Speaker 3: I read an article about this at some point in

945
00:47:23,640 --> 00:47:26,680
Speaker 3: the early two thousands, and I thought, well, if that

946
00:47:26,840 --> 00:47:30,600
Speaker 3: catches on and people start marrying for life, that's going

947
00:47:30,680 --> 00:47:32,799
Speaker 3: to have a lot of bad consequences and a lot

948
00:47:32,840 --> 00:47:42,160
Speaker 3: of ramification to the society. Yeah, exactly, So there you go.

949
00:47:42,239 --> 00:47:45,000
Speaker 3: So if you read super Vows, you might find a

950
00:47:45,040 --> 00:47:47,560
Speaker 3: little bit of that in that book, because it's essentially

951
00:47:47,640 --> 00:47:52,080
Speaker 3: about a world where covenant marriages become the new in thing.

952
00:47:53,360 --> 00:47:57,919
Speaker 3: A couple that's a very hot kind of The main

953
00:47:58,040 --> 00:48:01,560
Speaker 3: characters are three young actors that are sort of like

954
00:48:02,840 --> 00:48:06,759
Speaker 3: Ben Affleck and Mini Driver and Matt Damon.

955
00:48:06,760 --> 00:48:07,120
Speaker 4: Just like this.

956
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:10,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was thinking about this early this morning. Guys

957
00:48:11,440 --> 00:48:13,319
Speaker 3: in your twenties. I would have cast you in a

958
00:48:13,400 --> 00:48:16,280
Speaker 3: minute in the movie version of this book. You guys,

959
00:48:16,360 --> 00:48:18,520
Speaker 3: you three would have been great. You would have been perfect.

960
00:48:18,719 --> 00:48:20,080
Speaker 3: If they had come to me and said we want

961
00:48:20,120 --> 00:48:21,600
Speaker 3: to cast the use three, I would have said yes

962
00:48:21,600 --> 00:48:23,240
Speaker 3: and a heartbeat.

963
00:48:22,760 --> 00:48:25,000
Speaker 6: Which one of us is married to Danielle for life.

964
00:48:25,040 --> 00:48:25,960
Speaker 6: I'm just curious.

965
00:48:26,719 --> 00:48:29,400
Speaker 3: Your character is married to Danielle for life. I won't

966
00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:34,480
Speaker 3: say what. Will's excuse me, what writer's character does?

967
00:48:35,040 --> 00:48:38,520
Speaker 4: Yeah, I need to read this.

968
00:48:38,880 --> 00:48:39,719
Speaker 5: I need to read this.

969
00:48:40,760 --> 00:48:42,759
Speaker 3: So that was my first novel. I hope you don't

970
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:44,680
Speaker 3: mind me talking about the books. My second one is

971
00:48:44,719 --> 00:48:49,600
Speaker 3: based actually on my life, very loosely. I married a

972
00:48:49,600 --> 00:48:53,319
Speaker 3: woman who's a former ballerina. She danced across Europe in

973
00:48:53,400 --> 00:48:57,719
Speaker 3: her twenties and danced all over She even danced with

974
00:48:57,880 --> 00:48:59,080
Speaker 3: Nouriev at one point.

975
00:48:59,239 --> 00:48:59,719
Speaker 5: Wow.

976
00:49:00,040 --> 00:49:03,080
Speaker 3: And of course she no longer does that. She's now

977
00:49:03,120 --> 00:49:07,560
Speaker 3: a plates instructor. And we each had our first marriages,

978
00:49:07,600 --> 00:49:09,759
Speaker 3: we had our kids, we got divorced. We met in

979
00:49:10,760 --> 00:49:14,080
Speaker 3: our fifties. So I wrote a book about a couple

980
00:49:14,239 --> 00:49:17,319
Speaker 3: loosely based on that, what would happen if a ballerina

981
00:49:17,400 --> 00:49:21,239
Speaker 3: meets a comedy writer and their worlds collide. So that

982
00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:24,319
Speaker 3: one is called pat de Deux And you can find

983
00:49:24,320 --> 00:49:26,520
Speaker 3: that one on Amazon. And if you look at the cover,

984
00:49:27,040 --> 00:49:29,080
Speaker 3: you'll see a ballerina on it, and it's a picture

985
00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:31,280
Speaker 3: of my young wife's cool.

986
00:49:31,360 --> 00:49:32,720
Speaker 4: There you go, so sweet.

987
00:49:33,680 --> 00:49:37,400
Speaker 3: And then the last book it's really a trilogy of

988
00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:42,800
Speaker 3: novellas that are a little bit more adult oriented, maybe

989
00:49:42,840 --> 00:49:46,160
Speaker 3: not for some of your younger listeners. And this is

990
00:49:46,239 --> 00:49:49,719
Speaker 3: about it's three stories, one about a woman in her twenties,

991
00:49:50,120 --> 00:49:52,200
Speaker 3: one about a woman in her thirties, and what about

992
00:49:52,239 --> 00:49:56,080
Speaker 3: a woman in her forties, And it's about how their

993
00:49:56,160 --> 00:49:59,719
Speaker 3: romantic lives are different, how a woman's romantic lives are

994
00:49:59,719 --> 00:50:02,280
Speaker 3: different from her twenties to her thirties to her forties.

995
00:50:03,040 --> 00:50:05,840
Speaker 3: And what I found was, you know, you write a

996
00:50:05,840 --> 00:50:09,000
Speaker 3: book and then you design a cover or two. And

997
00:50:09,080 --> 00:50:12,000
Speaker 3: I used to put my covers into Facebook groups for

998
00:50:12,520 --> 00:50:14,880
Speaker 3: other writers, saying, Hey, which one do you like better?

999
00:50:15,719 --> 00:50:17,359
Speaker 3: And they'd say, well, what's your book about? And I'd

1000
00:50:17,400 --> 00:50:20,480
Speaker 3: give them the pitch, And then I was surprised to

1001
00:50:20,480 --> 00:50:24,400
Speaker 3: find about thirty percent of the woman got really hostile

1002
00:50:24,920 --> 00:50:27,640
Speaker 3: because they didn't like the idea of a man writing

1003
00:50:27,680 --> 00:50:33,040
Speaker 3: a novel about women. And the pushback I got was incredible.

1004
00:50:33,640 --> 00:50:37,320
Speaker 3: So I got some intimidated that I released those that book,

1005
00:50:37,400 --> 00:50:41,520
Speaker 3: or those three novellas. You could buy them individually on Kindle,

1006
00:50:41,719 --> 00:50:44,040
Speaker 3: or if you buy the paperback of the hardcover all

1007
00:50:44,080 --> 00:50:46,359
Speaker 3: three or in one book. But I released them under

1008
00:50:46,400 --> 00:50:49,680
Speaker 3: the name KB Kelton. I used my initials. I figured

1009
00:50:49,960 --> 00:50:53,040
Speaker 3: maybe if they don't know who wrote it, Yeah, yep,

1010
00:50:55,160 --> 00:50:56,000
Speaker 3: that's interesting.

1011
00:50:56,239 --> 00:50:59,319
Speaker 7: So do you like writing for TV or do you

1012
00:50:59,360 --> 00:51:00,440
Speaker 7: like writing books better?

1013
00:51:00,880 --> 00:51:05,560
Speaker 3: Oh, writing for books so much more. I get so

1014
00:51:05,640 --> 00:51:09,239
Speaker 3: much more out of it because the only person I

1015
00:51:09,280 --> 00:51:12,000
Speaker 3: have to answer to is me, And as you well know,

1016
00:51:12,080 --> 00:51:15,880
Speaker 3: in television, it's never really your work. You know, you

1017
00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:18,320
Speaker 3: have to take network notes, you have to take executive

1018
00:51:18,320 --> 00:51:20,879
Speaker 3: producer notes, and then you have to make changes during

1019
00:51:20,920 --> 00:51:23,080
Speaker 3: the week, and there's a writing stuff that's punching up

1020
00:51:23,120 --> 00:51:29,560
Speaker 3: your work. These novels reflect my sensibility, and frankly, I'm

1021
00:51:29,600 --> 00:51:32,040
Speaker 3: more proud of them. I once added up because you know,

1022
00:51:32,320 --> 00:51:35,800
Speaker 3: I worked on some hit shows, and I once added

1023
00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:39,080
Speaker 3: up how many people have seen shows that I have

1024
00:51:39,120 --> 00:51:43,040
Speaker 3: a credit on, not necessarily written by but as a producer,

1025
00:51:43,080 --> 00:51:46,640
Speaker 3: as a staff writer. And I think that the audience

1026
00:51:46,719 --> 00:51:49,319
Speaker 3: for my work. I know this is going to sound egotistical.

1027
00:51:49,960 --> 00:51:53,160
Speaker 3: I think it's close to a billion people. Wow, But

1028
00:51:53,600 --> 00:51:56,200
Speaker 3: and that includes you know, two years of Boy Beats World.

1029
00:51:57,000 --> 00:52:01,080
Speaker 3: But my books have been read by few hundred people.

1030
00:52:01,640 --> 00:52:05,920
Speaker 3: But I'm so much prouder of that work. Because it's

1031
00:52:06,440 --> 00:52:08,239
Speaker 3: it's lasting. You know, I could point to that and

1032
00:52:08,280 --> 00:52:12,360
Speaker 3: say this is purely me, It's not filtered through anybody

1033
00:52:12,360 --> 00:52:13,319
Speaker 3: else's sensibility.

1034
00:52:13,760 --> 00:52:18,440
Speaker 6: Yeah, very very briefly, taking Boy Meets World out of

1035
00:52:18,480 --> 00:52:21,040
Speaker 6: the equation because we know, obviously that's my my favorite

1036
00:52:21,040 --> 00:52:23,800
Speaker 6: show you've ever done in your favorite show ever? Obviously,

1037
00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:29,200
Speaker 6: what television project are you most proud of without you know, yeah,

1038
00:52:29,239 --> 00:52:30,359
Speaker 6: Boy Me's World not in the mix.

1039
00:52:30,480 --> 00:52:34,319
Speaker 3: Well, it's Saturday Night Live obviously. You know, it's such

1040
00:52:34,360 --> 00:52:37,200
Speaker 3: an iconic show, and there's so much creative freedom there

1041
00:52:37,520 --> 00:52:41,120
Speaker 3: that certainly was pretty high on the Mark Night Court.

1042
00:52:41,480 --> 00:52:45,600
Speaker 3: You know, people remember fondly. Frankly, all of them were jobs,

1043
00:52:45,680 --> 00:52:47,480
Speaker 3: more or less. That doesn't mean that I didn't enjoy them.

1044
00:52:47,520 --> 00:52:49,240
Speaker 3: That doesn't mean that I don't think I'm the luckiest

1045
00:52:49,239 --> 00:52:52,080
Speaker 3: guy in the world to have been there. But they

1046
00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:55,359
Speaker 3: were all you know, you know, they I never got

1047
00:52:55,400 --> 00:53:01,360
Speaker 3: to work on my sein film, my Frasier, so uh.

1048
00:53:01,520 --> 00:53:05,400
Speaker 3: I enjoyed all of my jobs, but those two stand

1049
00:53:05,440 --> 00:53:09,400
Speaker 3: out because they seem to have been so so appreciated

1050
00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:14,360
Speaker 3: over the years by other people. M and Boy Meets World. No,

1051
00:53:14,480 --> 00:53:16,520
Speaker 3: I'm very proud of the Boy Meets world. I went

1052
00:53:16,560 --> 00:53:19,360
Speaker 3: back and again. You know, when I watch some of

1053
00:53:19,400 --> 00:53:24,200
Speaker 3: those scenes, Danielle, just watching you in that truck stop

1054
00:53:24,760 --> 00:53:27,279
Speaker 3: with the women, I think her character was named I

1055
00:53:27,320 --> 00:53:31,360
Speaker 3: forget Luanne was with the character's name, but you know,

1056
00:53:32,480 --> 00:53:34,560
Speaker 3: Danielle did some great work in that scene. In so

1057
00:53:34,600 --> 00:53:38,080
Speaker 3: many other scenes, I think about will you as Eric

1058
00:53:38,120 --> 00:53:41,760
Speaker 3: at the at the TV station, as the in Jurne writer,

1059
00:53:42,160 --> 00:53:46,120
Speaker 3: you know, you in City Slackers, in you know, reading

1060
00:53:46,320 --> 00:53:51,040
Speaker 3: Phoene's diary. Uh, just really proud to have worked with

1061
00:53:51,040 --> 00:53:53,280
Speaker 3: you guys and seen you guys bring my words to life.

1062
00:53:54,000 --> 00:53:55,440
Speaker 5: Oh man, so cool.

1063
00:53:55,920 --> 00:53:58,759
Speaker 6: And then we're going to do the marriage vow. We're

1064
00:53:58,800 --> 00:54:00,680
Speaker 6: going to have to get that. We're going to lose

1065
00:54:00,719 --> 00:54:03,319
Speaker 6: twenty years. Yeah, forties. It's gone to be in our

1066
00:54:03,320 --> 00:54:03,759
Speaker 6: forties and.

1067
00:54:04,520 --> 00:54:05,720
Speaker 2: Twenty year olds in our forties.

1068
00:54:06,400 --> 00:54:08,720
Speaker 3: You guys may not know this. The new House speaker

1069
00:54:08,800 --> 00:54:11,600
Speaker 3: Mike Johnson, he is in a covenant marriage.

1070
00:54:12,000 --> 00:54:12,680
Speaker 2: That makes sense.

1071
00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:15,799
Speaker 3: So when I heard that, you know, he's not necessarily

1072
00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:18,680
Speaker 3: my taste in politics. But when I heard that, I said,

1073
00:54:18,760 --> 00:54:20,800
Speaker 3: right on, because people are going to be googling covenant

1074
00:54:20,840 --> 00:54:22,439
Speaker 3: marriage and they're going to come us to my book.

1075
00:54:24,520 --> 00:54:28,799
Speaker 7: I love that, so final question for you, looking back

1076
00:54:29,040 --> 00:54:33,000
Speaker 7: thirty years later, with so many incredible shows on your

1077
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:36,480
Speaker 7: IMDb page, what are your overall feelings of Boy Meets

1078
00:54:36,520 --> 00:54:39,600
Speaker 7: World And did you ever think you would still be

1079
00:54:39,640 --> 00:54:41,399
Speaker 7: talking about it three decades later?

1080
00:54:41,680 --> 00:54:44,799
Speaker 3: No, No, I did not realize if you would ask me,

1081
00:54:44,840 --> 00:54:46,479
Speaker 3: which of the shows that I worked on would become

1082
00:54:46,920 --> 00:54:50,440
Speaker 3: iconic hits that would stand the test of time. It

1083
00:54:50,520 --> 00:54:53,000
Speaker 3: didn't occur to me that a TGIF show would do that,

1084
00:54:53,040 --> 00:54:59,440
Speaker 3: but it happens. You know, watching the shows again, you

1085
00:54:59,440 --> 00:55:02,600
Speaker 3: know there are there were jokes that maybe I would

1086
00:55:02,640 --> 00:55:06,680
Speaker 3: have done differently, Like every writer you know has second

1087
00:55:06,680 --> 00:55:11,360
Speaker 3: thoughts when they watched their their material after it's been produced.

1088
00:55:12,080 --> 00:55:16,759
Speaker 3: But I'm so proud, especially of the dramatic scenes, the

1089
00:55:16,840 --> 00:55:22,160
Speaker 3: scenes with Sean and Turner, the scenes where mister Feeney

1090
00:55:22,480 --> 00:55:25,440
Speaker 3: wasn't just being you know, a teacher, but was making

1091
00:55:25,440 --> 00:55:28,759
Speaker 3: a life lesson point and you know, I was just

1092
00:55:28,760 --> 00:55:31,399
Speaker 3: reading this morning. I'm sure you guys know this. There's

1093
00:55:31,440 --> 00:55:34,080
Speaker 3: a couple of episodes that Disney doesn't want to show

1094
00:55:34,120 --> 00:55:38,480
Speaker 3: anymore because they deal with adult themes. But you know,

1095
00:55:38,760 --> 00:55:41,680
Speaker 3: Disney is going to be Disney. But we should be

1096
00:55:41,719 --> 00:55:43,640
Speaker 3: so proud to have worked on a show that did

1097
00:55:44,040 --> 00:55:47,280
Speaker 3: deal with those themes, dealt with them honestly and tried

1098
00:55:47,320 --> 00:55:49,560
Speaker 3: to tried to influence people for the better.

1099
00:55:49,960 --> 00:55:51,760
Speaker 4: Absolutely couldn't agree with you more.

1100
00:55:52,120 --> 00:55:54,440
Speaker 7: Well, Kevin, thank you so much for being here with

1101
00:55:54,520 --> 00:55:57,719
Speaker 7: us today and for remind I mean, I can't believe we,

1102
00:55:57,920 --> 00:55:59,719
Speaker 7: for even half a second, had forgotten you. You have

1103
00:55:59,719 --> 00:56:03,160
Speaker 7: such an incredible mind, and just getting to talk to

1104
00:56:03,160 --> 00:56:04,759
Speaker 7: you and getting to know you a little bit better

1105
00:56:04,800 --> 00:56:07,040
Speaker 7: has been such a joy this morning.

1106
00:56:07,239 --> 00:56:09,200
Speaker 3: You guys are so kind and I really enjoyed it.

1107
00:56:09,239 --> 00:56:10,919
Speaker 3: I was a little nervous coming in, but you were

1108
00:56:11,239 --> 00:56:13,080
Speaker 3: very pleasant and I really had a great time.

1109
00:56:14,200 --> 00:56:16,880
Speaker 6: You also mentioned so not just your novels, which everybody

1110
00:56:16,880 --> 00:56:18,319
Speaker 6: should go out and look at, but you also mentioned

1111
00:56:18,320 --> 00:56:19,440
Speaker 6: that you do a podcast as well.

1112
00:56:19,480 --> 00:56:20,080
Speaker 5: What's it called?

1113
00:56:20,160 --> 00:56:23,040
Speaker 3: Oh, I do a podcast called The More Perfect Union.

1114
00:56:23,239 --> 00:56:26,080
Speaker 3: I co host it with three or four other people

1115
00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:29,399
Speaker 3: depending on the week, and we talk about politics and

1116
00:56:29,920 --> 00:56:34,560
Speaker 3: pop culture, mostly about politics, and we've been doing that

1117
00:56:34,600 --> 00:56:38,759
Speaker 3: for eight years now. Actually I think we're on nine sees.

1118
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:39,960
Speaker 2: Oh, I got to check the cheese.

1119
00:56:40,080 --> 00:56:42,800
Speaker 5: So you were the first podcast we were early on.

1120
00:56:43,640 --> 00:56:46,880
Speaker 3: And here's a very quick story. So we come up

1121
00:56:46,920 --> 00:56:49,319
Speaker 3: with this name, The more Perfect Union, and we start

1122
00:56:49,400 --> 00:56:51,760
Speaker 3: our podcast and at first we have like fifty sixty

1123
00:56:51,760 --> 00:56:54,520
Speaker 3: people listening a week. It's our friends, right, And then

1124
00:56:54,560 --> 00:56:57,760
Speaker 3: one week, all of a sudden, we had eight thousand listeners,

1125
00:56:57,800 --> 00:56:59,840
Speaker 3: and then the next week we had ten thousand downloads.

1126
00:57:00,040 --> 00:57:02,440
Speaker 3: We got up to sixteen thousand downloads at one point,

1127
00:57:03,040 --> 00:57:06,200
Speaker 3: and I couldn't figure out what happened. So I do

1128
00:57:06,239 --> 00:57:08,880
Speaker 3: a little googling, and I find out that there's another

1129
00:57:08,960 --> 00:57:14,840
Speaker 3: podcast produced by Radio Labs called The more Perfect Podcast.

1130
00:57:14,960 --> 00:57:18,160
Speaker 3: It was a short year getting slickover. We got people

1131
00:57:18,360 --> 00:57:20,680
Speaker 3: were googling for that, and they found us and they

1132
00:57:20,800 --> 00:57:23,600
Speaker 3: stuck with us. We still don't have that many listeners,

1133
00:57:23,640 --> 00:57:26,320
Speaker 3: but we have a decent size audience for a small podcasts.

1134
00:57:26,800 --> 00:57:29,200
Speaker 3: And yeah, we talk about the news of the week.

1135
00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:32,480
Speaker 3: It's it leads a little left, so it may not

1136
00:57:32,560 --> 00:57:35,120
Speaker 3: be for everybody's taste, but we try to be fair

1137
00:57:35,200 --> 00:57:36,880
Speaker 3: and we have a lot of fun doing it. Our

1138
00:57:36,920 --> 00:57:39,000
Speaker 3: slogan is real debate without the hate.

1139
00:57:40,440 --> 00:57:42,760
Speaker 2: Totally checking it out. That's totally.

1140
00:57:43,080 --> 00:57:44,640
Speaker 4: Thank you, Kevin, It's great to see you.

1141
00:57:44,720 --> 00:57:46,520
Speaker 3: Thanks Ken, thank you so much.

1142
00:57:46,800 --> 00:57:47,960
Speaker 5: Bye bye.

1143
00:57:48,520 --> 00:57:52,720
Speaker 7: What a sweetheart, gosh and what an interesting cool brain.

1144
00:57:53,440 --> 00:57:56,120
Speaker 2: Interesting cool brain is exactly the right way to put it.

1145
00:57:56,120 --> 00:57:58,840
Speaker 1: It's a comedic like I just love when somebody has

1146
00:57:58,880 --> 00:58:01,640
Speaker 1: like trained themselves how to do this skill set and

1147
00:58:01,680 --> 00:58:04,800
Speaker 1: then did it like so well. But then I also

1148
00:58:04,800 --> 00:58:06,920
Speaker 1: love that he's like admits that it was a job,

1149
00:58:07,400 --> 00:58:09,240
Speaker 1: like he figured out how to do the job. He

1150
00:58:09,320 --> 00:58:12,160
Speaker 1: mastered the skill of comedy. But he likes writing novels more.

1151
00:58:12,200 --> 00:58:13,400
Speaker 1: You know, it seems like he's got a lot of

1152
00:58:13,480 --> 00:58:14,800
Speaker 1: interest and a lot of I don't.

1153
00:58:14,680 --> 00:58:16,840
Speaker 5: Know, it's just so cool cool. I just wish I could.

1154
00:58:16,840 --> 00:58:18,920
Speaker 6: I should have talked to her about the day and

1155
00:58:19,000 --> 00:58:20,600
Speaker 6: you could talk to him back in the day where

1156
00:58:20,600 --> 00:58:23,240
Speaker 6: I could have talked about SNL and Night Court and all.

1157
00:58:23,120 --> 00:58:25,960
Speaker 5: These incredible shows that these people have. I know exactly

1158
00:58:26,000 --> 00:58:28,120
Speaker 5: what's your own head, It doesn't matter, you know.

1159
00:58:28,440 --> 00:58:30,040
Speaker 1: Well, I know exactly what he's talking about about being

1160
00:58:30,040 --> 00:58:33,120
Speaker 1: intimidated too, because I remember feeling that Girl's world too, Like, yeah,

1161
00:58:33,160 --> 00:58:35,560
Speaker 1: you know, you reach this point you're like, these kids

1162
00:58:35,560 --> 00:58:38,080
Speaker 1: are these kids are into stuff that make no sense

1163
00:58:38,120 --> 00:58:39,880
Speaker 1: to me. I'm not even going to try and like

1164
00:58:40,040 --> 00:58:43,760
Speaker 1: hang out with them too much. Yeah, the kids from

1165
00:58:43,800 --> 00:58:46,240
Speaker 1: Girlmy's World as much as like pretty well actually, but

1166
00:58:46,480 --> 00:58:48,760
Speaker 1: it takes you have to like sort of like do it.

1167
00:58:48,800 --> 00:58:49,520
Speaker 2: You have to, you know.

1168
00:58:49,760 --> 00:58:52,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, and if you're on the writing staff, you're already

1169
00:58:52,240 --> 00:58:54,160
Speaker 1: to slightly removed from a lot of production.

1170
00:58:54,440 --> 00:58:57,360
Speaker 2: So yeah, Ah should have talked to him more back then.

1171
00:58:57,360 --> 00:58:58,920
Speaker 5: I know you wish you wish you could go back

1172
00:58:58,920 --> 00:58:59,800
Speaker 5: and talk to all these people.

1173
00:59:00,680 --> 00:59:03,160
Speaker 7: Great guy, Well, thank you all for joining us for

1174
00:59:03,200 --> 00:59:05,400
Speaker 7: this episode of Pod Meets World. As always, you can

1175
00:59:05,400 --> 00:59:08,200
Speaker 7: follow us on Instagram pod Meets World Show. You can

1176
00:59:08,240 --> 00:59:10,720
Speaker 7: also send us your emails Podmeets World Show at gmail

1177
00:59:10,760 --> 00:59:11,320
Speaker 7: dot com.

1178
00:59:11,360 --> 00:59:14,840
Speaker 4: And we have merch.

1179
00:59:16,160 --> 00:59:18,520
Speaker 5: Oh boy, that too much? That too much?

1180
00:59:18,720 --> 00:59:19,400
Speaker 4: It is gutturall.

1181
00:59:19,440 --> 00:59:20,680
Speaker 5: I felt that too much? You like that?

1182
00:59:20,720 --> 00:59:21,280
Speaker 4: I like you that.

1183
00:59:21,400 --> 00:59:23,920
Speaker 5: I feel it in your shoes your shoes, Pod.

1184
00:59:23,720 --> 00:59:25,920
Speaker 4: Meets Worldshow dot com.

1185
00:59:26,200 --> 00:59:28,240
Speaker 7: And if you want to pick up Kevin's how to

1186
00:59:28,320 --> 00:59:32,080
Speaker 7: book on television writing called The Sitcom Writer's Cookbook with

1187
00:59:32,120 --> 00:59:34,320
Speaker 7: some tips on how you can write your own version

1188
00:59:34,400 --> 00:59:37,280
Speaker 7: of Boy Meets World or SNL. It is available now

1189
00:59:37,320 --> 00:59:40,720
Speaker 7: on Amazon again. It is called The Sitcom Writer's Cookbook

1190
00:59:40,720 --> 00:59:43,040
Speaker 7: by Kevin Kelton and writer Send us out.

1191
00:59:43,520 --> 00:59:44,280
Speaker 2: We love you all.

1192
00:59:44,600 --> 00:59:45,920
Speaker 3: Pod dismissed.

1193
00:59:47,160 --> 00:59:49,840
Speaker 1: Pod meets World is an iHeart podcast producer hosted by

1194
00:59:49,920 --> 00:59:53,920
Speaker 1: Danielle Fischel, Wilfordell and writer Straw. Executive producers Jensen Karp

1195
00:59:53,920 --> 00:59:57,120
Speaker 1: and Amy Sugarman, Executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo,

1196
00:59:57,320 --> 01:00:01,160
Speaker 1: producer and editor, TaRaSu Bosch, producer, Maddam engineer and Boy

1197
01:00:01,200 --> 01:00:04,240
Speaker 1: Meets World Superman Easton Allen. Our theme song is by

1198
01:00:04,320 --> 01:00:07,680
Speaker 1: Kyle Morton of Typhoon. Follow us on Instagram at Podmets

1199
01:00:07,680 --> 01:00:15,040
Speaker 1: World Show or email us at podmetsworldshowat gmail dot com.

1200
01:00:14,640 --> 01:00:14,680
Speaker 6: M