WEBVTT - Cheney’s Bold Bet on Impeachment 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:02.920 This is Bloomberg Business Week. I'm Carol Masser and I'm 0:00:02.920 --> 0:00:05.760 Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stanobek. We're here every day bringing 0:00:05.760 --> 0:00:08.240 you the latest news from the world's of business and finance, 0:00:08.320 --> 0:00:12.120 plus technology, politics, economics, all harnessing the power of Business 0:00:12.119 --> 0:00:15.600 Week reporters and editors, not to mention our journalists and 0:00:15.640 --> 0:00:18.080 analyst in more than one and twenty countries. You can 0:00:18.120 --> 0:00:21.720 download Bloomberg Business Week on iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg dot Com. 0:00:21.880 --> 0:00:23.600 You can also listen to our radio show at two 0:00:23.640 --> 0:00:26.319 pm Eastern Time on Bloomberg Radio or watch us on 0:00:26.360 --> 0:00:30.680 YouTube search Bloomberg Global News. A lot of developments on 0:00:30.720 --> 0:00:33.920 the vaccine and COVID nineteen front Today Jane Jay's experimental 0:00:33.960 --> 0:00:37.000 one shot COVID nineteen vaccine generating a long lasting immune 0:00:37.040 --> 0:00:40.199 response in an early safety study. So we've got that 0:00:40.320 --> 0:00:42.120 right now. We've got ninety two and a half million 0:00:42.159 --> 0:00:45.600 cases death surpassing one million, and as for the vaccine 0:00:45.640 --> 0:00:47.600 roll out, more than thirty two point four million shots 0:00:47.600 --> 0:00:51.440 have been given worldwide. Let's bring in our guest, Gig Grandfall. 0:00:51.560 --> 0:00:54.240 She is at the Johns Hopkins University Bloomberg School of 0:00:54.240 --> 0:00:57.240 Public Health, supported by Michael or Bloomberg, founder of Bloomberg 0:00:57.320 --> 0:01:00.160 LP and Bloomberg Philanthropies. Her background is amazing as an 0:01:00.200 --> 0:01:03.280 Associate Professor Senior Scholar in the Department of Environmental Health 0:01:03.320 --> 0:01:08.680 and Engineering, and she's an immunologist by training. Among things 0:01:08.720 --> 0:01:12.240 she has authored and one is Preparing for Bioterrorism, the 0:01:12.240 --> 0:01:15.400 Alfred Peace Loans Foundations Leadership in Biosecurity. She's on the 0:01:15.400 --> 0:01:18.240 phone in Baltimore, so let's get to it. G g Um. 0:01:18.440 --> 0:01:19.760 The one thing Tim and I really want to ask 0:01:19.760 --> 0:01:22.080 you about is a story we just talked about about 0:01:22.080 --> 0:01:26.280 a New York congressman who got UH the vaccine two 0:01:26.400 --> 0:01:29.840 shots and still diagnosed with COVID nine team, how do 0:01:29.880 --> 0:01:34.760 we need to kind of understand how that can happen? Yes, So, 0:01:35.120 --> 0:01:39.040 vaccines are not UM. They're not a like a kevlar 0:01:39.160 --> 0:01:43.680 vest for for viruses. UM. They are a training program 0:01:43.720 --> 0:01:47.400 for your immune system and and we look at UM 0:01:47.560 --> 0:01:50.960 how effective they might be. UM. So some of the 0:01:51.040 --> 0:01:55.920 vaccines are like effective. That means that if you and 0:01:55.960 --> 0:01:59.040 I were both exposed and you were vaccinated and I 0:01:59.080 --> 0:02:03.400 was not, your risk of coming down with COVID is reduced. 0:02:03.520 --> 0:02:07.520 So it's not zero and UM and we don't know 0:02:07.640 --> 0:02:11.119 there are lots of variables involved. Um, you know, how 0:02:11.160 --> 0:02:14.519 long was it after the second shot before he came 0:02:14.520 --> 0:02:17.720 down with COVID, whether or not there was some failure 0:02:17.760 --> 0:02:20.920 along the way. Um, so all these things could uh 0:02:21.080 --> 0:02:25.440 could interact with his his protection. But um, but yeah, 0:02:25.520 --> 0:02:29.359 it's it's not Uh, nothing is add percent in this world. 0:02:29.400 --> 0:02:32.040 But um, but definitely the vaccine has been shown to 0:02:32.120 --> 0:02:35.240 be protective for most people. Do you get concerned when 0:02:35.280 --> 0:02:38.359 you see stories like this news stories like this because 0:02:38.400 --> 0:02:41.320 it could give people the wrong impression about the efficacy 0:02:41.600 --> 0:02:46.280 of a vaccine or about the need to get vaccinated. Sure, 0:02:46.880 --> 0:02:49.760 because you know, we were humans we love stories, right, 0:02:49.880 --> 0:02:53.840 and um, sometimes the stories don't tell the um what 0:02:53.840 --> 0:02:57.079 what it was actually true for most people statistically we 0:02:57.120 --> 0:03:01.120 don't think in terms of population. So that true, especially 0:03:01.160 --> 0:03:04.280 when it comes to any sort of adverse events from 0:03:04.440 --> 0:03:08.960 them from a vaccine. Um. You always worry about that 0:03:09.000 --> 0:03:12.560 because bad things happen to people all the time. And 0:03:12.600 --> 0:03:15.880 if it's connected to a vaccine and a story, Um, 0:03:15.960 --> 0:03:18.040 the two things might not have anything to do with 0:03:18.080 --> 0:03:20.920 each other. But um, but it could be you know, 0:03:21.000 --> 0:03:24.000 linger in somebody's mind. And as fact, how they think 0:03:24.040 --> 0:03:27.239 of the vaccine, does the variants that are coming out 0:03:27.280 --> 0:03:31.359 in terms of COVID impact You know, even if you've 0:03:31.400 --> 0:03:35.000 got a vaccine, could you get the virus? Get get 0:03:35.080 --> 0:03:36.720 are you more could you are you more likely to 0:03:36.760 --> 0:03:39.160 get the variant versus the original COVID nineteen I guess, 0:03:39.160 --> 0:03:42.520 is what I'm asking. Sure, So right now, UM, we 0:03:42.600 --> 0:03:46.680 think that the vaccines are protective against these new variants 0:03:46.680 --> 0:03:53.320 that we've been discovered. But unfortunately, I'm I'm worried because, UM, 0:03:53.360 --> 0:03:56.720 you know, viruses mutate all the time, all the time, 0:03:56.760 --> 0:03:59.440 and so one of the things that we need to 0:03:59.480 --> 0:04:03.920 do is to limit their opportunities to mutate. And um, 0:04:04.000 --> 0:04:08.240 and that means driving down but that's through vaccination for 0:04:08.440 --> 0:04:13.400 masks and everything else. But UM, when we have these variants, UM, 0:04:13.440 --> 0:04:15.920 it looks like the vaccine will protect. But I just 0:04:15.960 --> 0:04:18.480 worry about you know, the next ones that we discuss 0:04:18.960 --> 0:04:22.200 go go with us. I think about all of those 0:04:22.240 --> 0:04:24.279 movies that are made about you know, the virus, the 0:04:24.320 --> 0:04:28.080 things that mutate and how they become you know, in 0:04:28.120 --> 0:04:32.040 a fictional world. UM, just difficult to kind of overcome. 0:04:33.080 --> 0:04:38.479 What's the worst case scenario of mutation in this virus? 0:04:40.040 --> 0:04:44.400 The worst case scenario for this UH, for this virate, Well, um, 0:04:44.520 --> 0:04:46.640 there there are lots of different things that the virus 0:04:46.680 --> 0:04:49.839 doesn't do now that UM that it could do, and 0:04:49.920 --> 0:04:53.400 so we want to make sure it doesn't become more severe, 0:04:54.240 --> 0:04:58.440 more severe disease UM, have an expanded population that it 0:04:58.480 --> 0:05:01.960 causes more severe di is in UM. But what I 0:05:02.000 --> 0:05:05.120 think is the most serious concern right now is just 0:05:05.279 --> 0:05:10.040 making sure that it doesn't um evolve away from the vaccine. 0:05:10.120 --> 0:05:12.560 So we don't want it to escape from the vaccine, 0:05:12.680 --> 0:05:16.160 and and the quicker we can get this under control, 0:05:16.400 --> 0:05:19.640 the more likely we won't have to worry as much 0:05:19.680 --> 0:05:22.120 about that it might be in the future that we 0:05:22.200 --> 0:05:25.960 need to update the vaccine UM saying it will be 0:05:26.720 --> 0:05:29.240 a longer time in the future than you know than 0:05:29.320 --> 0:05:32.120 these variants might suggest. Well, thanks for our producers. I 0:05:32.120 --> 0:05:34.280 know that one thing that you have looked closely at 0:05:34.320 --> 0:05:37.560 is the politicization not just of the entire pandemic, but 0:05:37.720 --> 0:05:40.800 of the vaccine and the administration of the vaccine. What 0:05:40.839 --> 0:05:43.320 do lawmakers need to do in order to make it 0:05:43.400 --> 0:05:46.080 less politicized? So we can truly round the corner here, 0:05:46.120 --> 0:05:49.400 and we only have about forty seconds, Okay, Yeah. I 0:05:49.400 --> 0:05:52.520 mean you just really need to put um everything on 0:05:52.560 --> 0:05:54.960 the science and make decisions based on the science and 0:05:55.040 --> 0:05:57.680 admit that you know. Science changes, and so then that 0:05:58.320 --> 0:06:01.240 what you know about of the disease and what you 0:06:01.320 --> 0:06:04.960 can your plans that will change as well. But UM, 0:06:05.000 --> 0:06:07.479 if you always stick to what you know, then you 0:06:07.520 --> 0:06:11.720 don't have to worry about about being wrong um and 0:06:11.839 --> 0:06:14.599 just acknowledge that you know. Things change. But we're doing 0:06:14.600 --> 0:06:16.480 the best you can with the knowledge and science that 0:06:16.520 --> 0:06:19.480 we have available. I wanted to go to what Charlie 0:06:19.560 --> 0:06:22.880 was talking about with Johnson and Johnson's one shot vaccine. 0:06:22.880 --> 0:06:25.240 It's it has not been a proof for emergency use authorization. 0:06:25.279 --> 0:06:28.800 We are still awaiting further information and data from a 0:06:28.839 --> 0:06:32.200 clinical trial. But I'm wondering just about the one shot 0:06:32.360 --> 0:06:34.599 element here. How big of a deal is it that 0:06:35.120 --> 0:06:39.000 this could there could be a one shot vaccine coming out? Oh, 0:06:39.040 --> 0:06:42.320 it's such a big deal. So we only have gotten 0:06:42.480 --> 0:06:46.640 the phase UM one and two data for Johnson and Johnson, 0:06:46.720 --> 0:06:50.120 so we are still waiting to hear about the efficacy 0:06:50.200 --> 0:06:52.560 which will come in in the phase three data. So 0:06:52.839 --> 0:06:55.160 that's what we're still waiting for the data. So I 0:06:55.200 --> 0:06:58.480 don't want to get too excited. But um, it's a 0:06:58.600 --> 0:07:04.560 one shot vaccine and it requires regular refrigeration. It's not 0:07:04.720 --> 0:07:07.560 one of these you know, needing to have an exotic 0:07:07.720 --> 0:07:10.520 minus a d degrees refrigerator, which is what you need 0:07:10.560 --> 0:07:13.760 for the visor and not so lesser degree than madiurnal vaccine. 0:07:13.880 --> 0:07:17.600 So UM, it's it's very exciting from a logistics point 0:07:17.600 --> 0:07:20.760 of view, because, UM, this is a hard enough task 0:07:21.600 --> 0:07:25.560 as it without having to add these additional logistical burdens. 0:07:26.440 --> 0:07:29.680 It's like it sounds to me like, you know, this 0:07:29.760 --> 0:07:33.239 is pretty impressive, right, yeah, I mean, and as you said, 0:07:33.640 --> 0:07:37.640 it's early going. When do we expect to get that later? Uh? 0:07:37.680 --> 0:07:43.280 And key UM stage study. I've heard that we should 0:07:43.320 --> 0:07:46.640 expect it in the in the next couple of weeks, 0:07:46.760 --> 0:07:49.920 next two or three weeks, and that plans are to 0:07:50.240 --> 0:07:53.160 have late February early March at least. The last Ti've 0:07:53.600 --> 0:07:57.160 i've heard UM to have them submit the data for 0:07:57.760 --> 0:08:01.360 UM the process to hopefully get emergency to use authorization. 0:08:02.040 --> 0:08:05.840 So it's it's some weeks away. There are some concerns 0:08:05.880 --> 0:08:09.880 I read about how manufacturing is not quite up the 0:08:10.080 --> 0:08:14.040 level that they want. UM. Hopefully they can correct whatever 0:08:14.160 --> 0:08:17.880 issues they are having but um but yeah, it's it's 0:08:17.920 --> 0:08:20.400 in Hopefully in the next couple of months, we will 0:08:20.440 --> 0:08:23.600 have another vaccine online. The vaccines that have been approved 0:08:23.600 --> 0:08:26.800 for emergency use authorization here in the US from MODERNA 0:08:26.880 --> 0:08:30.320 and from from fisor BioNTech. They use messenger RNA technology. 0:08:30.360 --> 0:08:32.480 How is the technology or or the the way the 0:08:32.559 --> 0:08:37.120 vaccine is manufactured. How's that different in the Johnson Johnson one. Yeah, 0:08:37.120 --> 0:08:40.040 so that is using an ad no virus vector which 0:08:40.120 --> 0:08:43.600 can't UM as in the previous segment hurt. It can't 0:08:43.640 --> 0:08:46.960 replicate in humans, so it's not um you don't have 0:08:47.040 --> 0:08:52.000 to worry. You cannot get um covid from this vaccine. UM. 0:08:52.280 --> 0:08:55.000 But it is a different factor, a little more traditional 0:08:55.320 --> 0:09:00.000 UM vector to be used for for for um different 0:09:00.080 --> 0:09:03.880 types of vaccine. So um, it's it's just another product 0:09:04.320 --> 0:09:07.360 like the others. Um uh. It will have a few 0:09:07.400 --> 0:09:10.360 side effects, so people just need to be aware that 0:09:10.640 --> 0:09:14.160 they might have a headache, they might have a store arms, 0:09:14.559 --> 0:09:18.480 things like that, but that you know, they can before 0:09:18.760 --> 0:09:22.520 fore armed, you know, so they that they can um 0:09:22.760 --> 0:09:25.080 be prepared for that. I understand. It was also the 0:09:25.120 --> 0:09:29.119 same science that was used in Jane Jay z Bolo vaccine, 0:09:29.320 --> 0:09:31.680 Zekea and a few other things. Okay, I gotta ask you, 0:09:33.120 --> 0:09:35.720 this is something that I don't quite understand, you know, 0:09:35.920 --> 0:09:39.560 the kind of problems we've had with the vaccine rollout. 0:09:39.760 --> 0:09:42.960 What happened? Where was the breakdown? Because I feel like 0:09:42.960 --> 0:09:45.400 we had a ton of conversations over the summer that 0:09:45.440 --> 0:09:48.000 we knew it was coming, We knew the vaccine several 0:09:48.400 --> 0:09:52.160 we talked about distribution logistics. What happened do you think 0:09:52.200 --> 0:09:56.560 in terms of getting it out to people. I think 0:09:56.559 --> 0:10:00.800 we'll learn more as the weeks go on had happened there? 0:10:00.840 --> 0:10:03.520 Because I think there were always going to be some hiccups. 0:10:03.520 --> 0:10:07.280 But one thing is for sure, the stimulus still UM 0:10:07.360 --> 0:10:11.040 included money for distribution, and that was not present before. 0:10:11.280 --> 0:10:15.680 So the other problem is that UM that states are 0:10:15.760 --> 0:10:19.600 doing a lot more than UM than probably they should 0:10:19.640 --> 0:10:22.680 be doing. There is UH just at least been the 0:10:22.720 --> 0:10:26.800 case for all aspects of UM the COVID response, where 0:10:27.360 --> 0:10:31.720 UM every state is UH doing their own plan instead 0:10:31.760 --> 0:10:35.840 of having UM much more aggressive federal UM you know, leadership. 0:10:36.480 --> 0:10:39.760 And so I think that that situation will change in 0:10:39.800 --> 0:10:42.840 the in the coming weeks and UM and so hopefully 0:10:43.160 --> 0:10:46.079 people will get used to the logistics and laws really quickly, 0:10:46.080 --> 0:10:48.319 if you can in fifteen seconds, do you anticipate by 0:10:48.360 --> 0:10:51.880 summer will have the majority of our population vaccinated or 0:10:51.880 --> 0:10:55.040 maybe even sooner? I hope so. And that should be 0:10:55.080 --> 0:10:58.840 our goal because um, we need to get to prepare 0:10:58.880 --> 0:11:02.200 for these very and this vaccination is a huge way 0:11:02.240 --> 0:11:05.640 to get everybody going in the economy going again. Great stuff, listen, 0:11:05.640 --> 0:11:08.680 Thank you so much, Really appreciate your expertise. Gig Gronvill, 0:11:09.000 --> 0:11:11.320 Senior Scholar at the Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security 0:11:11.360 --> 0:11:13.960 and Associate Professor at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of 0:11:13.960 --> 0:11:17.320 Public Health, of course, supported by Michael R. Bloomberg, founder 0:11:17.360 --> 0:11:21.240 of Bloomberg LP. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol 0:11:21.280 --> 0:11:25.640 Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic from Bloomberg Radio. 0:11:26.040 --> 0:11:29.439 So Big Business, Tim, Yeah, we've been see it backing 0:11:29.440 --> 0:11:31.800 away from President Trump after the Capitol Hill riot, and 0:11:31.840 --> 0:11:35.400 while that could be an opportunity for Democrats, it's likely 0:11:35.480 --> 0:11:37.760 not to play out that way. So reporting for Bloomberg 0:11:37.760 --> 0:11:40.680 business Week, business Week editor Peter Coy on the phone 0:11:40.720 --> 0:11:43.480 in New Jersey along with Bloomberg Business Week Editor Joe Weber, 0:11:44.040 --> 0:11:47.480 he's on the access line in Brooklyn. Uh. You know, 0:11:47.600 --> 0:11:50.440 it has been interesting to see big business, you know, 0:11:50.679 --> 0:11:53.839 in terms of how quickly and probably understandably, Joel that 0:11:53.880 --> 0:11:59.480 they've been backing away from this president. Do we have Joel? 0:12:01.000 --> 0:12:04.160 I think we're having a little trouble getting Peter. I wanted, Peter, 0:12:04.240 --> 0:12:06.480 do we have you? Yeah? I can answer that question. 0:12:07.720 --> 0:12:11.400 They have definitely backed away. I mean, what I said 0:12:11.400 --> 0:12:14.760 in my article is that the bridge between Trump and 0:12:14.840 --> 0:12:17.960 the big business was never as solid as it might 0:12:18.000 --> 0:12:22.360 have appeared, but now it's inflaming ruins. It's just completely destroyed, 0:12:22.400 --> 0:12:27.480 probably irreparable. Of course, that's with Trump. That doesn't necessarily 0:12:27.480 --> 0:12:32.280 mean the bridge between the big business and Republican Party 0:12:32.600 --> 0:12:34.839 is irreparable. I think that is reparable, and that's what 0:12:34.960 --> 0:12:38.520 we're gonna be watching for over the next few years. 0:12:38.559 --> 0:12:42.000 So the big question, though, Peter, is what the Republican 0:12:42.080 --> 0:12:44.040 Party looks like over the next few years, because there 0:12:44.040 --> 0:12:46.320 are segments of the Republican Party right now that aren't 0:12:46.400 --> 0:12:52.440 the traditional pro business uh no, low regulation and free 0:12:52.480 --> 0:12:56.160 market right correct, correct, correct, that's all right. The issue 0:12:56.240 --> 0:12:59.679 is now that a big Trump is put at imprint 0:13:00.000 --> 0:13:04.360 Republican Party He's pulled in new sets of voters and 0:13:04.559 --> 0:13:09.599 who are more populist and are suspicious of big business. 0:13:09.600 --> 0:13:13.080 That elaps a big business the CEO just as much 0:13:13.080 --> 0:13:17.280 as their suspicious of academic and government and media elites. 0:13:17.720 --> 0:13:21.440 They don't give big business a pass, and so that 0:13:21.520 --> 0:13:25.480 makes it tough for organizations like the Business Roundtable, the 0:13:25.559 --> 0:13:30.160 US Chamber of Commerce, the National Association of Manufacturers. Joe Weber, 0:13:30.200 --> 0:13:31.840 I think we've got you, now, come on in on 0:13:31.840 --> 0:13:34.000 the conversation. Yeah, you don't need me, though, you can 0:13:34.040 --> 0:13:38.400 just stick with Peter that you know Peter the There 0:13:38.480 --> 0:13:42.760 is this opportunity here UM for Democrats. And we think 0:13:42.800 --> 0:13:47.760 about big business and it's largely historically been UM been 0:13:47.840 --> 0:13:51.040 something that feels like it's drifted more towards GOP than 0:13:51.160 --> 0:13:54.319 than Democrats. And yet there's this kind of a jump 0:13:54.360 --> 0:13:58.480 ball moment. And what is the opportunity really for for 0:13:58.600 --> 0:14:04.480 Democrats here to take advantage of this moment? Now, they 0:14:04.520 --> 0:14:07.800 have always been segments of the business community that were 0:14:07.840 --> 0:14:13.360 more favorable towards the Democrats. Tech was until fairly recently 0:14:13.400 --> 0:14:16.480 and now, but that serve marriages on the rocks a 0:14:16.520 --> 0:14:20.640 little bit. UM. But the the opportunity the jump all 0:14:20.800 --> 0:14:25.640 you call it, okay, Look already we've seen that the 0:14:25.680 --> 0:14:29.720 stock markets responded pretty well to the prospects of a 0:14:29.760 --> 0:14:35.000 Biden victory, and when the two Democrats won in the 0:14:35.040 --> 0:14:39.760 open seats in Georgia, which gave the Democrats the Senate control, 0:14:40.240 --> 0:14:43.880 stock market went up on that news. So people are 0:14:43.920 --> 0:14:48.600 expecting two things from Biden that are favorable for big business. 0:14:48.640 --> 0:14:52.720 One is that he'll probably bring on more stimulus COVID 0:14:52.720 --> 0:14:56.000 relief bigger dollars, and two that he might be more 0:14:56.080 --> 0:15:00.840 effective than Trump has been at arresting the coronavirus arise epidemic. 0:15:01.320 --> 0:15:03.960 If he succeeds in both of those, that would be 0:15:04.000 --> 0:15:08.560 great for corporate profits and therefore for stock prices. So 0:15:08.680 --> 0:15:13.360 what about how much of this is just big businesses 0:15:13.560 --> 0:15:17.680 backing away from Trump because of of last week and 0:15:18.200 --> 0:15:21.240 allonging for a GOP that it looks a lot more 0:15:21.280 --> 0:15:24.320 like it did pre Trump. That's I think that's most 0:15:24.360 --> 0:15:26.160 of it. It's it's not so much that they're in 0:15:26.200 --> 0:15:29.240 love with Biden. There's still a lot of suspicion of Biden, 0:15:29.520 --> 0:15:32.800 especially because the Democratic Party platform is quite liberal and 0:15:33.000 --> 0:15:36.240 the most liberal has been in decades. Um they look 0:15:36.240 --> 0:15:37.800 at a lot of things that Biden wants to do 0:15:37.840 --> 0:15:40.400 and say, know, we don't want to go there, but 0:15:40.800 --> 0:15:45.680 Trump is you know, the obviously the breaking point was 0:15:45.760 --> 0:15:48.800 the invasion of the capital, which he seemed to incite. 0:15:49.400 --> 0:15:54.640 Um just shocked people. Organizations the National Associated Manufactors conventionally 0:15:54.760 --> 0:16:02.080 fairly true true read Republican group, uh almost right wing 0:16:02.080 --> 0:16:04.120 in them in the past. And yet they were the 0:16:04.120 --> 0:16:07.080 first ones out with the statement calling this sedition and 0:16:07.320 --> 0:16:12.560 asking Biden asking, I'm sorry, Pence to uh try to 0:16:12.760 --> 0:16:15.120 get the cabinet to invoke the amend but that Trump 0:16:15.160 --> 0:16:17.960 re moved from office. You know what's interesting though, I 0:16:18.000 --> 0:16:21.640 think for so long and but a while ago, Peter, 0:16:21.800 --> 0:16:27.320 that we thought, you know, business was beholden only two Republicans. 0:16:27.360 --> 0:16:30.280 But if you look at donations and you put it 0:16:30.320 --> 0:16:34.720 out your story that especially when Democrats call control Congress, 0:16:34.800 --> 0:16:37.880 you find groups like PE oil and gas, real estate 0:16:37.920 --> 0:16:43.520 companies tend to give a lot to the Democrats. Yeah. Yeah, 0:16:43.640 --> 0:16:50.440 it's very much opportunistic giving by these organizations. They want 0:16:50.440 --> 0:16:52.360 to give to people who I think they can help 0:16:52.400 --> 0:16:56.600 them with their agenda. Democrats rise up and gain a majority, 0:16:56.640 --> 0:16:59.320 then suddenly they want to curry favor with them. So 0:16:59.320 --> 0:17:01.880 it's very clear from the chart the tears of the story. 0:17:02.360 --> 0:17:05.119 And so with the Democrats controlling the White House and 0:17:05.240 --> 0:17:07.879 both House of the Congress this time, I think that 0:17:08.000 --> 0:17:11.879 could be strong giving to Democrats for at least the 0:17:11.880 --> 0:17:16.200 next two years. Peter, what about um uh this idea 0:17:16.240 --> 0:17:19.679 of of you know, we're in this moment that obviously 0:17:19.760 --> 0:17:22.600 has been inflamed. We're going to see what inspires of 0:17:22.680 --> 0:17:25.760 the next week. And I'm curious, like you know, from 0:17:25.760 --> 0:17:28.760 from your reporting, does it suggest that business will just 0:17:28.800 --> 0:17:31.760 stay on the sidelines for a while or will someone 0:17:31.880 --> 0:17:34.800 get back in and sort of like start to to 0:17:34.960 --> 0:17:39.879 angle sooner than that? You know they have they operate 0:17:39.920 --> 0:17:43.119 on multiple levels in the public. You don't hear a 0:17:43.160 --> 0:17:45.280 lot from them, like they don't really enjoy talking to 0:17:45.359 --> 0:17:49.000 people like me because you know, ask uncomfortable questions. But 0:17:49.040 --> 0:17:51.560 that doesn't mean they're not operating. They're very much in 0:17:51.680 --> 0:17:55.119 their lobbying day to day. So they're not on the 0:17:55.160 --> 0:18:00.000 sidelines at all. They're pushing their agenda and that will continue. 0:18:00.080 --> 0:18:03.000 You um, if anything will be stepped up now that 0:18:03.080 --> 0:18:07.560 we have a new UH Congress and a new president. Well, 0:18:07.680 --> 0:18:10.280 I do wonder Peter, does business help kind of, you know, 0:18:10.680 --> 0:18:12.960 help with the reboot of the Republican Party and help 0:18:13.080 --> 0:18:17.680 in the maybe perhaps redefinition definition of them, Like how 0:18:17.680 --> 0:18:22.359 do you see it? Um? Yeah, they it's not so 0:18:22.440 --> 0:18:23.720 much that they want to go in a new direction. 0:18:23.760 --> 0:18:25.479 They kind of want to go back to you. They 0:18:25.520 --> 0:18:32.280 kind of like that deregulation, low taxes. Um. But but 0:18:32.600 --> 0:18:36.240 it's that's the caricature that the big business is not 0:18:37.240 --> 0:18:40.919 um entirely against all kinds of regulation. In my article 0:18:40.960 --> 0:18:45.600 details several areas in which the big business, if anything, 0:18:46.640 --> 0:18:49.840 we melt against some of the deregulatory measures of the 0:18:49.880 --> 0:18:53.000 Trump administration. Well, definitely something to think about with everything 0:18:53.080 --> 0:18:55.240 else that's going on into kind of how we we 0:18:55.320 --> 0:18:58.440 get our way back. Peter, Um, always great. Peter Koy. 0:18:58.560 --> 0:19:01.640 He is Bloomberg Business Week Economics editor on the phone 0:19:01.640 --> 0:19:03.479 in New Jersey. Check out his story in the magazine 0:19:03.520 --> 0:19:06.439 Bloomberg Business Week. Getitor Joe Webber joining us on the 0:19:06.480 --> 0:19:09.920 access line in Brooklyn. This is Bloomberg Business Week with 0:19:10.000 --> 0:19:14.720 Carol Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic from Bloomberg Radio. 0:19:15.160 --> 0:19:17.480 So all this week politics and the happenings in and 0:19:17.480 --> 0:19:19.600 around the nation's capital, no doubt about it. It has 0:19:19.640 --> 0:19:22.240 been our top story topped off with the second impeachment 0:19:22.280 --> 0:19:25.480 of President Trump, writing about it, and the one high 0:19:25.560 --> 0:19:28.160 ranking House Republican who has stuck her neck out when 0:19:28.200 --> 0:19:31.119 it comes to this, Representative Liz Cheney of Wyoming. You 0:19:31.240 --> 0:19:33.159 caught up with him earlier today on Quick Take, Am 0:19:33.200 --> 0:19:35.760 I talking about Josh I did? Yeah, Josh Greeney's national 0:19:35.800 --> 0:19:38.240 correspondent for Bloomberg Business Week, and he joins us now 0:19:38.320 --> 0:19:42.160 on the throne from Washington, d C. Josh, I cannot 0:19:42.200 --> 0:19:44.400 get enough of this column that you wrote last night 0:19:44.640 --> 0:19:50.840 about Liz Cheney's bold bet on impeachment. Did it backfire? Well? 0:19:50.840 --> 0:19:52.480 I don't think we're gonna know for a little while, 0:19:52.640 --> 0:19:56.480 but but certainly her going out and making the searing 0:19:56.680 --> 0:19:59.240 statement against Trump saying, there, you know, he's portrayed the 0:19:59.320 --> 0:20:02.040 United States, it's violated as over the office and his 0:20:02.160 --> 0:20:05.800 oath to the Constitution. UM. I think she probably expected 0:20:05.840 --> 0:20:09.160 to hope for a bigger following among Republicans. In the end, 0:20:09.200 --> 0:20:13.680 only nine other Republicans voted for her to support Trump's impeachment. 0:20:14.280 --> 0:20:15.960 But I think the real asset test is going to 0:20:16.000 --> 0:20:19.040 come in the months and years ahead, as you know, 0:20:19.080 --> 0:20:21.560 Trump fades from the scene. A bit. Part of the 0:20:21.600 --> 0:20:23.879 bet she was making is the future of the GOP 0:20:24.119 --> 0:20:25.760 is going to be something more along the lines of 0:20:25.800 --> 0:20:28.000 what it used to be. I mean Cheney before she 0:20:28.080 --> 0:20:31.640 came to Congress, Um was a very well known Neo 0:20:31.760 --> 0:20:35.920 Cohn who had uh serious conservative views like her father, 0:20:36.040 --> 0:20:38.480 former Vice President Dick Cheney. I think part of the 0:20:38.480 --> 0:20:41.120 bet here is that she can steer the party back 0:20:41.160 --> 0:20:44.240 in that direction. But having said that, uh, you know, 0:20:44.359 --> 0:20:46.400 just just in the day or so since the vote, 0:20:46.440 --> 0:20:49.200 in the week or so since the riots, it's pretty 0:20:49.200 --> 0:20:54.320 clear from from UH polls that the majority of Republican 0:20:54.400 --> 0:20:57.639 voters are sticking with Trump. So something is going to 0:20:57.760 --> 0:21:00.119 have to change in order for her bet to be 0:21:00.200 --> 0:21:03.040 proved to be the right one, uh politically. But but 0:21:03.080 --> 0:21:05.240 I do think it's probably too soon to make that judgment. 0:21:05.359 --> 0:21:09.000 So does she accurately represent the people of Wyoming and 0:21:09.000 --> 0:21:12.320 the people put her in office, Well, she certainly does not. 0:21:12.600 --> 0:21:15.200 In terms of the vote she took to impeach Trump. 0:21:15.240 --> 0:21:18.480 Trump won Wyoming last November. I think it was seventy 0:21:19.080 --> 0:21:22.240 six percent, and he's one of the red estates in 0:21:22.280 --> 0:21:25.879 the country. So so certainly a lot of supports for 0:21:25.960 --> 0:21:30.560 Trump there. Uh And then speaking to people internoun Wyoming 0:21:30.600 --> 0:21:32.879 politics for this column, they said, look, there's going to 0:21:32.960 --> 0:21:35.240 be unhappiness. It is gonna ruffle a lot of feathers. 0:21:35.840 --> 0:21:38.879 But that being said, Cheney, you know that the Cheney 0:21:39.000 --> 0:21:43.200 name has a long and story history in Wyoming politics. Um, 0:21:43.240 --> 0:21:46.280 you know she isn't she isn't. Uh knew she has 0:21:46.320 --> 0:21:48.399 a serious base of support. I think there's a lot 0:21:48.440 --> 0:21:51.480 of good will toward her in Wyoming, just generally leaving 0:21:51.520 --> 0:21:54.240 aside the issue of Trump and his impeachment. So most 0:21:54.240 --> 0:21:56.160 people I talked to thought she would have no real 0:21:56.240 --> 0:21:59.719 problem surviving and timing wise, this is probably good for 0:21:59.720 --> 0:22:01.720 her in the sense that she was just reelected to 0:22:01.720 --> 0:22:04.280 another two year House term in November, so it's gonna 0:22:04.280 --> 0:22:06.399 be quite a while before she has to face voters again. 0:22:06.760 --> 0:22:09.680 What's the potential upside of this becoming a leader within 0:22:09.720 --> 0:22:12.959 the party, I mean, if she does successfully sort of 0:22:13.000 --> 0:22:15.919 forged her own path away from President Trump with a 0:22:15.960 --> 0:22:20.880 handful of other Republicans, what's the potential upside she faces. Well, 0:22:20.920 --> 0:22:24.000 you know, I think in the best possible world, you know, 0:22:24.040 --> 0:22:26.520 the upside she'd have is that you know, the party 0:22:26.600 --> 0:22:28.359 is going to face a reckoning after Trump, and that 0:22:28.480 --> 0:22:30.639 maybe when he's no longer in the Oval office and 0:22:30.720 --> 0:22:33.840 not splashed on Fox News all the time, assuming the 0:22:33.880 --> 0:22:38.879 social media platforms keep him curbed, that his influence on 0:22:38.920 --> 0:22:42.480 Republican politics will wane um in much the same way 0:22:42.520 --> 0:22:44.679 Sarah Palems did ten years ago. You know, for a 0:22:44.680 --> 0:22:48.120 while there she was the hottest thing Republican politics. Everyone 0:22:48.200 --> 0:22:51.240 covered her endorsement, was afraid of her criticism, you know, 0:22:51.280 --> 0:22:53.399 but eventually she kind of blew away and and and 0:22:53.440 --> 0:22:57.760 didn't exert any real lasting influence. Personally, I think Cheney's 0:22:57.800 --> 0:23:00.640 best case hope would be the thing like that would 0:23:00.640 --> 0:23:03.240 happen with Trump. The two years from now, the world 0:23:03.280 --> 0:23:05.840 will have long moved on Biden, the Democrats will be 0:23:05.840 --> 0:23:10.000 in charge, unifying thing among Republicans will be opposed Biden, 0:23:10.520 --> 0:23:13.280 and that Cheney will be seen as someone who, you know, 0:23:13.480 --> 0:23:16.840 bravely ventured out and broke with the trumpets at a time. 0:23:16.880 --> 0:23:19.040