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Speaker 1: Hey, guys, Saga and Crystal here.

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Speaker 2: Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election,

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Speaker 2: and we are so excited about what that means for

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Speaker 1: This is the only place where you can find honest

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Speaker 1: not exist anywhere else.

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Speaker 2: So if that is something that's important to you, please

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Speaker 1: dot com.

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Speaker 3: Good morning everyone, It's Friday, June nineteenth. You're at Breaking

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Speaker 3: Points and we have an amazing show as always, don't we, folks.

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Speaker 2: Happy plan, Yeah, a lot of breaking developments right as

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Speaker 2: we're coming on here this morning too.

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Speaker 4: That's right.

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Speaker 3: We've got Crystal, Emily Ryan and I'm so happy to

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Speaker 3: be back.

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Speaker 4: I was gone for two weeks. I was out east.

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Speaker 3: Coaching a team to a championship fifty years in the making.

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Speaker 3: Then I have and referring to the IRGC in Iran,

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Speaker 3: well played.

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Speaker 4: I've been It's nice to be stateside, but long time coming.

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Speaker 5: So yeah, you were down a bit in the fourth quarter,

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Speaker 5: but yeah you really pulled it out.

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Speaker 4: Gotta watch out for those refs.

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Speaker 3: But now we're here and we've got a lot of

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Speaker 3: new war updates over the last twelve to twenty four hours.

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Speaker 4: Ryan, where are we at in this moment?

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Speaker 5: So yesterday the Israelis launched another offensive inside Lebanon and

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Speaker 5: it was repelled rather ferociously. It looks like at least

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Speaker 5: four Israeli soldiers were killed, many others wounded. It's it's

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Speaker 5: unclear how many HESBLA fighters were killed, although it does

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Speaker 5: according to the Lebanese Ministry of Health, it seems like

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Speaker 5: at least twenty eight civilians were killed.

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Speaker 6: Over the last twenty four hours.

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Speaker 5: They started knocking down buildings, I believe in Nabatia there

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Speaker 5: was a huge civilian residential complex taken down, as well

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Speaker 5: as bombings of other nearby villages, and Israel was planning

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Speaker 5: a massive retaliation for this, which to me is a

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Speaker 5: kind of interesting way of conceptualizing your role.

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Speaker 6: In the world.

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Speaker 5: You know, this is an an occupying army who is

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Speaker 5: in their neighboring country trying to push further in suffers

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Speaker 5: casualties as a result of that, and then announces that

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Speaker 5: it is the victim of a terrorist attack.

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Speaker 6: They referring to the as blow as.

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Speaker 5: Terrorists, and is then going to launch further attacks on

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Speaker 5: civilian infrastructure throughout Lebanon. Iran told the United States and

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Speaker 5: Jeremy is reporting this for drop site later today that

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Speaker 5: if Israel continues at pace with this behavior, they're going

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Speaker 5: to start attacking Israel without warning.

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Speaker 6: They're not going to do this hole, Okay, we're mad.

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Speaker 5: We're going to launch a demonstrative strike to show that

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Speaker 5: we are angry.

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Speaker 6: They're just going to start hitting them. And so we had.

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Speaker 5: A overnight or overnight here in the East coast during

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Speaker 5: early morning throughout the day, series of negotiations between Hesbela Rum,

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Speaker 5: the United States Israel broker by Cutter, and they announced

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Speaker 5: a renewed ceasefire between Israel and Hezbola that was to

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Speaker 5: take effect at four pm local time, which is as

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Speaker 5: we're recording this, that would be a little bit more

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Speaker 5: than an hour ago. So as we speak, they are

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Speaker 5: in a renewed ceasefire. So by the time you guys

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Speaker 5: are watching this, you can check to see whether or not,

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Speaker 5: you know of hostilities have actually halted, but Israel is

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Speaker 5: claiming that it does not require them to withdraw from

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Speaker 5: the territory that they're occupying, and that it still allows

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Speaker 5: them to what they call confront threats they and it's

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Speaker 5: still also, according to Israel, allows them to continue destroying

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Speaker 5: civilian infrastructure throughout southern Lebanon. They're trying to effectively make

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Speaker 5: southern Lebanon uninhabitable so that when the hundreds of thousands

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Speaker 5: of people who have been displaced return, and they are

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Speaker 5: actually returning like now, like once the ceasefire was reached,

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Speaker 5: they started coming back, trying to make it so that

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Speaker 5: there are no homes to return to Andy. They claim

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Speaker 5: that they can continue to do that under the terms

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Speaker 5: of this ceasefire. I highly doubt that that has considers

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Speaker 5: either of those provisions to be consistent with what they

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Speaker 5: understand a ceasefire to be. So what Iran's reaction to

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Speaker 5: that is going to be remains to be seen. They're

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Speaker 5: supposed to have talks in Geneva right now, those aren't happening,

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Speaker 5: and it appears that it's because of this. The US

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Speaker 5: said it was logistical difficulties. I don't know, booking the room.

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Speaker 5: I guess, you know, they thought they thought it was

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Speaker 5: you know, Jared thought it was Wick Coff's you know,

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Speaker 5: job to like book the room with Coffla. Chared was

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Speaker 5: supposed to book the conference room.

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Speaker 6: And there's like a.

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Speaker 5: There's like a European dental conference there, and so they

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Speaker 5: got it instead. So now there's I guess scouting for

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Speaker 5: new locations. The Pakistanis were claiming that the Iranians couldn't

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Speaker 5: make it for some religious reasons completely made up as well.

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Speaker 2: What's kind of interesting, though, isn't it that rather than

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Speaker 2: just saying this is a problem and we're not going forward,

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Speaker 2: they're both trying to come up with some excuses and

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Speaker 2: cover for.

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Speaker 5: The sure they all still wants to go forward, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 5: that's yeah, yeah, Well.

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Speaker 2: I mean to state what is abundantly obvious. This just

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Speaker 2: underscores how fragile and tenuous this entire situation is and

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Speaker 2: how easily Israel could destroy the whole thing. And we're

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Speaker 2: going to play some of the comments from jade Vance

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Speaker 2: where he is quite critical of Israel. On the very

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Speaker 2: same day, though, Trump gets asked, oh, if Iran attacked Israel,

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Speaker 2: would you defend them, and he said, of course, So

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Speaker 2: you know, we've got a lot of We've got tough

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Speaker 2: rhetoric genuinely, you know in public from Trump and JD

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Speaker 2: vance tough rhetoric VI the israelis is it going to

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Speaker 2: be matched with actions of raining them in? Because otherwise

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Speaker 2: this is never going to work, And that is exactly

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Speaker 2: what Iran has been testing this whole time. That has

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Speaker 2: been one of the big questions in their heads as well.

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Speaker 2: Will the Trump administration actually do what it takes to

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Speaker 2: restrain Israel because otherwise there's no possibility of a deal

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Speaker 2: going forward. So needless to say, it is an ominous

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Speaker 2: development that before they could even make it to the

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Speaker 2: locale of the first day one of negotiations, the thing

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Speaker 2: is already you know, falling apart.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, suple things also, oh go ahead.

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Speaker 5: I was just add one other thing that it doesn't

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Speaker 5: get discussed much, but there are Iranian politics at play here.

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Speaker 4: You know.

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Speaker 5: We had a story yesterday over at drop site which

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Speaker 5: I recommend people read from mos and Resisscide, who's reporting

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Speaker 5: from Tehran about if you're just listening to this headline,

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Speaker 5: internal debate rages in Tehran over deal with Trump. There

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Speaker 5: is a huge faction inside of Iran who does not

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Speaker 5: trust the United States thinks that this is a giant

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Speaker 5: kind of round of theater that is just aimed at

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Speaker 5: allowing the US and Israel to kind of restock and

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Speaker 5: re arm, get some oil into the global economy, and

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Speaker 5: then restart the war on them. And so that faction

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Speaker 5: inside Iran is going to be looking for any opportunity

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Speaker 5: that presents itself from the US Israeli side to say, see,

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Speaker 5: we told you forget about this. We should we never

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Speaker 5: should have agreed to this. This is always fake. What

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Speaker 5: we need to do is inflict more pain on them.

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Speaker 5: So that's that's in the background of of and shows

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Speaker 5: I think why kind of a Ragchi and Gollibuff have

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Speaker 5: to be a little bit delicate in how they They

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Speaker 5: can't just show up in Geneva with these insults being

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Speaker 5: carried out, you know, in front of them, Otherwise it

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Speaker 5: empowers the others. And moch Taba kamen A put out

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Speaker 5: this very interesting statement yesterday which is in that story

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Speaker 5: saying that he doesn't agree with the ceasefire. The MoU

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Speaker 5: he that he personally doesn't like it, but he has

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Speaker 5: deep respect for his civilian leadership Posesskian Radsheet, Galliboff, and

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Speaker 5: he's going to allow their judgment to override his. And

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Speaker 5: then he says they have complete responsibility for this, So

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Speaker 5: he's he's holding on to that's their vance. Yes, like wait,

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Speaker 5: he saw Trump do that, and he's like, oh, you

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Speaker 5: can do that. He's like, okay, I'm doing that.

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Speaker 6: If this works, some good with it. If not on

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Speaker 6: these three guys.

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Speaker 8: Meanwhile, doesn't doesn't have a JD vance and he's getting

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Speaker 8: You're seeing the the rascheting up of the rhetoric from

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Speaker 8: the Bengal yeers and the like, Asraeli elections coming up

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Speaker 8: as well, and just to Crystal's point, that's kind of

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Speaker 8: a question for everybody.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, looking at the Gaza ceasefire deal, I.

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Speaker 8: Have a sort of soft theory that I think it's

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Speaker 8: probably not going to sound ridiculous, but it's basically that

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Speaker 8: Trump likes to do these almost like ribbon cutting style

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Speaker 8: signing ceremonies and he'll say he's he ended eight wars,

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Speaker 8: he was trying to get the Nobel Peace Prize, and

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Speaker 8: then he understands media enough to understand that something goes

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Speaker 8: to the back burner and it's burned into the public's

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Speaker 8: mind as a ceasefire deal, it's burned into the public's

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Speaker 8: mind as the end of a conflict, and then he's

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Speaker 8: really angling for the public relations element of the war

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Speaker 8: being over in him being the person to bring us

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Speaker 8: even though he was also the personal start of the war,

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Speaker 8: but him being the person to have ended it. And

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Speaker 8: so it is interesting to compare it with what happened

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Speaker 8: in Gaza, because that has essentially been meaningless after the

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Speaker 8: first like what five days, maybe.

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Speaker 7: Not even five days.

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Speaker 8: So it's a question because I haven't followed that as

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Speaker 8: closely as you guys have, but it seems entirely plausible

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Speaker 8: to me. It'll be harder to do with Ron, but

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Speaker 8: it seems entirely plausible to me that what he thinks

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Speaker 8: he can do is set this on the back burner essentially.

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Speaker 3: Well, perhaps we can find some answers with our friend

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Speaker 3: jd Vance, who has been on a book tour for

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Speaker 3: his new book Communion, but also some harsh language for

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Speaker 3: the Israelis. Let's start with this clip right here, And

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Speaker 3: this does bother.

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Speaker 9: Me is that you've seen people within BB's cabinet who

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Speaker 9: have come out and attacked the deal and in some

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Speaker 9: ways very personally attack the President of the United States.

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Speaker 4: And I guess my message to them would be twofold

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Speaker 4: number one.

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Speaker 9: Donald J. Trump is the only head of state in

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Speaker 9: the entire world who is sympathetic to the nation of

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Speaker 9: Israel at this moment in time, and he happens to

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Speaker 9: be the head.

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Speaker 6: Of state of the world's superpower.

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Speaker 9: If I was in the cab cabinet of the Israeli government,

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Speaker 9: I might not be attacking the only powerful ally that

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Speaker 9: I have.

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Speaker 4: Anywhere left in the entire world. And the second message

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Speaker 4: I would give to some of those cabinet members.

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Speaker 9: Phbe, to his credit, has not gone down this path,

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Speaker 9: but to some of these cabinet members in Israel who

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Speaker 9: are attacking the President of the United States. The other

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Speaker 9: thing that I would say is that over the last

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Speaker 9: three months, two thirds of the defensive weapons that have

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Speaker 9: protected your homeland have been built by American hands and

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Speaker 9: paid for by American tax dollars. The problem for Israel

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Speaker 9: is not Donald J. Trump, and anybody in Israel who

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Speaker 9: thinks their biggest problem is the President of the United

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Speaker 9: States needs to wake up and smell the reality of

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Speaker 9: the situation that country is in Emily.

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Speaker 4: What do you make of that? Are are are they

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Speaker 4: going to wake up and smell the reality?

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Speaker 8: Well, it's been framed as the Tucker carlossification of jd

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Speaker 8: Vance in the last twenty four hours, which is really amusing,

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Speaker 8: by the way, because Jdvance has foreign policy opinions like

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Speaker 8: this basically since after he came back from the war,

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Speaker 8: he started shifting on these types of things, and it's

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Speaker 8: been known to everybody.

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Speaker 7: This is why jd Vance and Tucker Carlson got along.

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Speaker 8: So that is just a particularly i think, cynical and

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Speaker 8: weird way to the little jd Vance who's expressing what

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Speaker 8: a lot of younger conservatives definitely believe it is going

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Speaker 8: to be the position of the Republican Party in ten,

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Speaker 8: let alone, like twenty years, as younger people start to

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Speaker 8: take over more and more control in the party.

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Speaker 7: So just to watch the backlash to that, like we

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Speaker 7: are in what.

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Speaker 8: Months, I don't even know, June, We're in June right now,

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Speaker 8: and he's talking like this now, that is mild.

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Speaker 7: That is mild.

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Speaker 8: And to see the Mark Levin freak out has been,

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Speaker 8: I guess, amusing, but it's also really annoying because they

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Speaker 8: have no idea what they're talking about, and they're being

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Speaker 8: so cynical, and they're so obsessed with their own pet projects.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, it is head spinning to see the

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Speaker 2: It is head spinning to see the immediate one to

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Speaker 2: eighty shift in rhetoric from Trump. You know, jd Vance

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Speaker 2: has just kind of kept quiet throughout the Iran war.

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Speaker 2: Let Mark or Rubio take the lead, you know, in

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Speaker 2: much more comfortable selling the war and much more comfortable

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Speaker 2: ideologically with it. But you know, Jadie Vance told Trump, Okay,

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Speaker 2: I've got my issues with it, but I'm going to

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Speaker 2: support you, and he has done that. So it is

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Speaker 2: hend spinning to see the abrupt shift, especially given that

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Speaker 2: this is the administration that has you know, criminalized even

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Speaker 2: to a greater extent than the Biden administration did pro

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Speaker 2: Palestine protest and has had a complete crackdown on, you know,

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Speaker 2: anyone expressing very similar sentiments to what the Vice Press

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Speaker 2: of the United States is now expressing. So I have

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Speaker 2: to put that out there. The other thing, in Ryan,

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Speaker 2: I'm curious for your take on this. That's interesting is

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Speaker 2: he's actually lying because there has been a total fore

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Speaker 2: we're going to have an Israeli journalists on actually shortly

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Speaker 2: who can give us some more insights into the political

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Speaker 2: dynamics within Israel. Well, there has been a total meltdown,

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Speaker 2: there is no doubt about it. There are a lot

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Speaker 2: of strong things being said about Donald Trump the public,

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Speaker 2: Israeli public who loved him five seconds ago, has now

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Speaker 2: turned on him as approval rating has fallen off a cliff.

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Speaker 2: But actually, no one in Netanyah whose cabinet, to my knowledge,

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Speaker 2: has said anything personally detracting Donald Trump. To me and Ryan,

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Speaker 2: it seems like Jadie Vance is trying to give Trump

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Speaker 2: that impression that there are personal insults coming at him

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Speaker 2: from the net Yahoo government to try to stiffen his

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Speaker 2: resolve to have a hard religne with them.

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Speaker 10: I don't know what you think.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, even even Ben Gavie and I can put up

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Speaker 5: his post that Emily was referencing.

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Speaker 6: Is doing the like.

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Speaker 5: So this is this is one of his more genocidal remarks.

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Speaker 5: For every tear of an Israeli mother on thy eleven,

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Speaker 5: these mothers must weep all of leban and must burn.

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Speaker 5: And then he says, with all due respect to the Americans,

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Speaker 5: Israel must make it clear to the entire world that

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Speaker 5: the blood of our sons and the security of our

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Speaker 5: citizens are not forfeit. All of Lebanon must burn. And

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Speaker 5: then you know, to obliterate, to crush the term. And

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Speaker 5: then Arachi says, this is not a rant by a

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Speaker 5: random lunatic, it's a public post by the national security

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Speaker 5: minister of the Israeli regime. The genocidal death cult headquartered

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Speaker 5: in Tel Aviv is a threat to all of humanity.

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Speaker 6: So even in his.

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Speaker 5: Genocidal death cult phase, he's fank vera sing with all

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Speaker 5: due respect to the Americans, And yes, you're exactly right

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Speaker 5: that they're trying to like kind of put it on vance.

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Speaker 5: They call it the vance mou'. It's the same thing

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Speaker 5: that a lot of Republicans have done throughout the last

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Speaker 5: decade when they've been upset with Trump. They'll say, it's

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Speaker 5: his advisors, you know that, And it's an ancient thing.

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Speaker 5: The king is never wrong. He just it's his advisors.

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Speaker 5: From my watching and curious, how Christoph, you're seeing the

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Speaker 5: same thing. It's it's kind of on the one hand,

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Speaker 5: it's like always delightful to see this kind of thing unfold.

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Speaker 5: At the same time, I feel like I'm watching in

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Speaker 5: real time the Republican Party that was anti war in

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Speaker 5: twenty twenty four won election, launched a bunch of wars,

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Speaker 5: reclaiming the anti war mantle again. And it's like, I

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Speaker 5: don't want them to stop their anti war rhetoric. I

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Speaker 5: don't want them to stop with this restraint. I want

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Speaker 5: the JD events wing to like prevail in their intramural contest.

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Speaker 5: But also I'm like, you guys already did this whole thing. Yeah,

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Speaker 5: and then as soon as you were elected, you launched

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Speaker 5: a war of choice against Iran and have not really

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Speaker 5: restrained Israel and Gaza or much in Lebanon.

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Speaker 6: I hope you do. Hope they do.

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Speaker 5: I'd like to see it, you know, escalate, see their

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Speaker 5: rhetoric escalate to actually stop this. But it's like it's

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Speaker 5: a little frustrating. It's like, really, we're going to do

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Speaker 5: this again. At some point you lose some credibility on

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Speaker 5: on your ability.

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Speaker 10: To your whole anti war.

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Speaker 6: At the same testuring just music to my ears. So

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Speaker 6: you know, I'm a soccer for it.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I'm just skeptical of like I think we

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Speaker 2: all should have a lot of skepticism that this is

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Speaker 2: all going to go off with on hitch that we're

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Speaker 2: going to get through sixty days of flawless negotiations, that

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Speaker 2: some new redlines aren't going to be inserted, because I mean,

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Speaker 2: how many times are we going to be lucy with

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Speaker 2: the football with this idea that Trump is going to

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Speaker 2: be anti war and he's going to stick to literally

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Speaker 2: any principle that he has ever articulated. So yeah, of

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Speaker 2: course I share that skepticism, and I also share like

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Speaker 2: a little bit of I'm enjoying the Shapiro the Live

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Speaker 2: in tears. I'm consuming that as much as anyone. I'm

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Speaker 2: certainly I loved what you guys did putting the sad

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Speaker 2: music with the with the tiers the other day. But

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Speaker 2: I also in the back of my head are like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: but day, at the end of the day, I'm probably

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Speaker 2: going to win, Like they're probably going to get the

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Speaker 2: last laugh and before this administration is very likely.

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Speaker 8: Yeah, I agree, And before the guest jumpson, I just

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Speaker 8: want to say, like, that's actually it's so insane about

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Speaker 8: the people who rallied around Trump for the last four

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Speaker 8: months is that they were saying trust the president, trust

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Speaker 8: the president, the president knows best and they were the

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Speaker 8: ones who anytime you're projecting an ideological idea on a

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Speaker 8: Donald Trump, you're gonna end up with egg on your

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Speaker 8: face every single time, because the man is not ideological.

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Speaker 7: His view is pragmatic.

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Speaker 8: Now we can disagree on whether it's actually pragmatic, but

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Speaker 8: it's what he believes is pragmatic.

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Speaker 7: At any given moments.

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Speaker 8: Like first term he was going to do a deal

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Speaker 8: with Nancy Pelissi on DAKA, you always end up with

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Speaker 8: egg on your face. So for the last four months,

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Speaker 8: for the people who've been agitating for a war with

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Speaker 8: Iran literally for decades, to bear hug Donald Trump so

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Speaker 8: flamboyantly and then to turn around, they were saying, don't

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Speaker 8: criticize Trump, you're ruining the coalition.

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Speaker 7: Well, first of all, hilarious.

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Speaker 8: Second of all, it's so funny because they were the

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Speaker 8: ones that made the mistake of acting like it wasn't

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Speaker 8: just that Trump had pragmatically sided with them, but he

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Speaker 8: had given them a decisive ideological victory. And now they're

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Speaker 8: left holding the bag with egg on their faces and

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Speaker 8: trying to pin it very desperately on JD.

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Speaker 4: Vance.

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Speaker 8: So it's it's just any time you're trying to project

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Speaker 8: an ideological, ideological victory. If you're seeing it the mere

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Speaker 8: image of your ideology and Donald Trump, it will change

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Speaker 8: and not learning that less than ten years in is

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Speaker 8: just unbelievable.

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Speaker 4: And the reason why JD.

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Speaker 3: Vance is allowed to pick up the anti war football

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Speaker 3: and make these statements in a sense, or why it's

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Speaker 3: still wide open for him, is because on the other side,

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Speaker 3: the Democratic leadership has completely abdicated.

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Speaker 4: Any kind of ground here.

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Speaker 3: I mean, their concerns are process concerns at the head

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Speaker 3: of Democratic leadership that they just didn't do this the

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Speaker 3: right way. But they were very happy to have this war,

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Speaker 3: and you know, with Joe Biden over the last two

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Speaker 3: years of his presidency gave them everything they.

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Speaker 4: Wanted short of this war.

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Speaker 3: And now the Israelis are kind of like a dog

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Speaker 3: that has caught the car and don't know what to

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Speaker 3: do about it with Trump.

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Speaker 4: So that is also why JD.

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Speaker 3: Vance is allowed to make statements that you could never

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Speaker 3: see Chuck Schumer or any other part of the Democratic

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Speaker 3: leadership say on these issues. So until yeah, they start

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Speaker 3: saying that stuff, the lane is wide open for JD.

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Speaker 3: Vance to be the anti war candidate in twenty twenty eight,

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Speaker 3: and I think that'll be.

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Speaker 2: Reckoning is yeah, Yeah, that reckoning is definitely unfolding in

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Speaker 2: the Democratic Party as we speak though.

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Speaker 5: Right now.

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Speaker 2: I saw the establishment Democrats notched another loss up in

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Speaker 2: Maine now that they've done their rank choice tallying in

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Speaker 2: one of the congressional districts there, and you see the

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Speaker 2: ascent of the Grand Platiners the Abdullah side, and a

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Speaker 2: new poll came out that shows him leading their chosen candidate,

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Speaker 2: Haley Stevens, and Mallard mcmahr really falling off a cliff

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Speaker 2: after she attacked Hassan and positioned herself on that side

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Speaker 2: of the party.

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Speaker 10: So that is definitely unfolding right now as we speak.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Mcmarros at like zero percent with people under forty four,

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Speaker 3: that's like not a cliff, That is a a I

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Speaker 3: don't know, some sort of chasm that that she's at

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Speaker 3: the bottom of. But incredibly Ryan, we do have a

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Speaker 3: guest that we're going to let in right now. Why

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Speaker 3: don't you introduce our guests for us?

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Speaker 5: All right, so to get a little bit more of

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Speaker 5: the perspective from the Israeli political and media class, were

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Speaker 5: joined out by Noga Tonpalsky joining us from Jerusalem.

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Speaker 6: Thanks Noga for being here, My pleasure.

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Speaker 5: All right, So we earlier we played a clip of

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Speaker 5: Jade Vance saying, look, President Donald Trump is the last

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Speaker 5: world leader who has any affection whatsoever for Israel. So

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Speaker 5: I would suggest to the Israeli you cabinet and Naw's

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Speaker 5: ministers that maybe they don't trash the last guy who

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Speaker 5: likes them. He had even more pointed remarks if you

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Speaker 5: can believe that, on the Ross do that podcast with

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Speaker 5: the New York Times. I want to play this and

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Speaker 5: get your reaction to how the kind of Israeli classes,

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Speaker 5: political classes responding to this.

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Speaker 6: Here's but Jadvan, You've seen people in their system, Ben

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Speaker 6: Gavier and Smoke Fridge who've attacked the deal, and I

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Speaker 6: guess my response to them would be, what is your

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Speaker 6: exact proposal?

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Speaker 4: And you know your You're a country of nine million people.

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Speaker 9: You can't just kill your way out of solving every

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Speaker 9: single national security problem that you have.

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Speaker 5: Pretty sharp in direct comments, sorry to sound like me

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Speaker 5: almost so, no, like, what has the what has the

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Speaker 5: response been among the government and also the media class there?

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Speaker 11: Well, it's a complicated question, actually, and I think that

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Speaker 11: jd Vance's comments are more sophisticated than they may appear

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Speaker 11: at first glance. He's using every possible tool to provoke

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Speaker 11: and to put down. You know, these really outrageous figures

440
00:22:52,040 --> 00:22:56,200
Speaker 11: that Prime Minister Natanya who appointed to top ministries in

441
00:22:56,400 --> 00:22:59,399
Speaker 11: a desperate effort to shore up his hold on power.

442
00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:04,320
Speaker 11: In case you think I'm exaggerating, Ben Vier, the guy

443
00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:08,879
Speaker 11: we're talking about now, and Betzali Smotrich, the Finance minister

444
00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:12,800
Speaker 11: no less, and a few others were defined by the

445
00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:17,240
Speaker 11: former head of the Mosad, Tamir Pardo as quote like

446
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:21,520
Speaker 11: the KKK. So we have to keep that in mind.

447
00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:25,840
Speaker 11: And what jade Evan's doing is doing by even putting down,

448
00:23:26,080 --> 00:23:28,560
Speaker 11: you know, the real number of the Israeli populations that

449
00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:33,720
Speaker 11: you can't just murder. Everyone is telling these KKK guys basically,

450
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:36,200
Speaker 11: your time's up. You can't just keep saying whatever you

451
00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:39,240
Speaker 11: want as they have for the last almost three and

452
00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:42,879
Speaker 11: a half years. While Joe Biden was president, this didn't

453
00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:45,920
Speaker 11: seem to bother the Republican Party very much, but now

454
00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:48,639
Speaker 11: that it's Donald Trump who's getting under the skin of

455
00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:53,000
Speaker 11: the extremists, they don't like it very much. Back in DC,

456
00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:56,000
Speaker 11: and what we're hearing, I think is that the Israeli

457
00:23:56,160 --> 00:23:59,920
Speaker 11: political class, it won't surprise anyone to hear, has basically

458
00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:03,600
Speaker 11: been mute. They have nothing to say in response. And

459
00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:07,760
Speaker 11: when I say they, I'm really saying he, the Prime

460
00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:12,159
Speaker 11: Minister of Israel, in this crucial and critical time, hasn't

461
00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:16,200
Speaker 11: shown his face in public in days, hasn't even put out,

462
00:24:16,320 --> 00:24:20,280
Speaker 11: you know, one of his favorite pre tape videos. I

463
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:23,800
Speaker 11: think he doesn't know what to do. And the Israeli

464
00:24:23,960 --> 00:24:27,680
Speaker 11: media class, I have to say, across the board, from

465
00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:32,480
Speaker 11: Nittaielle fans who are in absolute apopleptic and sort of

466
00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:36,200
Speaker 11: profane shock right now, all the way across the board

467
00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:41,719
Speaker 11: to Nitthanielle's opposition, they also seem in shock. It appears

468
00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:46,840
Speaker 11: that everybody in Israel in power bought nitaniel Who's line

469
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:50,000
Speaker 11: that he was, you know, Donald Trump's bestie somehow, his

470
00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:54,680
Speaker 11: unique bestie, Donald Trump, you know, was going to be

471
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:59,080
Speaker 11: the one to treat Benjaminsanieu differently somehow. And I think

472
00:24:59,280 --> 00:25:02,119
Speaker 11: what we're seeing is a real moment of almost numb shock.

473
00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:06,080
Speaker 11: And among the Israeli population there really is a lot

474
00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:09,080
Speaker 11: of fear and confusion. I think most Israelis are not

475
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:14,920
Speaker 11: particularly knowledgeable about the States. They're not particularly knowledgeable about

476
00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:17,960
Speaker 11: the English language. They hear this stuff. I think they

477
00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:22,480
Speaker 11: feel frightened by the security situation, very confused by the

478
00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:23,959
Speaker 11: diplomatic kerfuffle.

479
00:25:25,119 --> 00:25:27,280
Speaker 2: No that I'm curious for you to help us understand

480
00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:32,760
Speaker 2: where the largest political fishers lie in Israel, because you know,

481
00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:35,240
Speaker 2: we have talked a lot on our show about Ben

482
00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:37,760
Speaker 2: Gavere and Smotrich. We put up his, you know, insanely

483
00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:41,320
Speaker 2: genocidal comments about how for every Israeli soldier who was killed,

484
00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:44,240
Speaker 2: one thousand Lebanese mothers should weep and all of this,

485
00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:47,640
Speaker 2: and how Lebanon should burn. But I'm curious how much

486
00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:51,920
Speaker 2: their ideas have purchased throughout society, because, for example, in

487
00:25:52,119 --> 00:25:54,440
Speaker 2: a poll that was published by Haaretz, they found that

488
00:25:54,760 --> 00:25:58,000
Speaker 2: eighty two percent of Jewish Israeli support the forcible expulsion

489
00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:02,600
Speaker 2: of Palestinians from Gaza. Six percent actually support expelling Palestinian

490
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:06,000
Speaker 2: citizens from within Israel. I know there have been protests

491
00:26:06,000 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 2: against net NYAHUO in Israel, but they tend more to

492
00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:13,000
Speaker 2: focus around tactics versus the brutality or the morality of

493
00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:16,639
Speaker 2: what is being done to Palestinians and or on net

494
00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:20,520
Speaker 2: Nahu's own corruption. So where do you see the most

495
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:25,680
Speaker 2: significant political fishers lying right now between the net Nyahoo

496
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:28,520
Speaker 2: government and you know, a public that you described as

497
00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:29,880
Speaker 2: sort of scared and confused.

498
00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:34,880
Speaker 11: Well, fos, First of all, those are pretty shocking figures

499
00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:36,720
Speaker 11: that you just quoted, and in order to be able

500
00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:38,240
Speaker 11: to respond to them, I'd have to know a little

501
00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:42,000
Speaker 11: bit more about which poll you're quoting, because Hawraz has

502
00:26:42,080 --> 00:26:45,840
Speaker 11: published all manner of different polls put out by different

503
00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:48,760
Speaker 11: put in the field, by different institutions with different tensions,

504
00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:52,400
Speaker 11: and I'm just not sure what I'm just referring to there.

505
00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:55,680
Speaker 2: I've got one people here for you from Penn State.

506
00:26:56,040 --> 00:26:59,920
Speaker 2: It's from Penn State University, this particular one. And understanding

507
00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:01,840
Speaker 2: that you you know, haven't had I didn't send this

508
00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:03,280
Speaker 2: to you an advanced to have a chance to take

509
00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:03,720
Speaker 2: a look at it.

510
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:05,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's also this poll right here from N twelve

511
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:08,439
Speaker 3: News is a Paul on Trump after the MoU with Iran.

512
00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:11,200
Speaker 3: Seventy one percent of Israelis do not trust Trump to

513
00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:13,840
Speaker 3: preserve Israel's interest in a final deal with Iran. Just

514
00:27:13,960 --> 00:27:18,640
Speaker 3: thirteen percent still believe in Trump, so where's that distinction

515
00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:19,840
Speaker 3: for you?

516
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:24,800
Speaker 11: Well, I have a lot to say, but first of all,

517
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:27,720
Speaker 11: I want to address Crystal's questions about the Fishers in

518
00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:31,080
Speaker 11: the Israeli polity just as a general question, without addressing

519
00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:33,640
Speaker 11: the Poles specifically. That's okay, and then I'll come back

520
00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:39,479
Speaker 11: to the polls. Israeli society right now is really falling apart,

521
00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:43,520
Speaker 11: and so it's very hard for me to respond in

522
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,399
Speaker 11: any kind of scientific precision to what the Fishers are

523
00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:50,680
Speaker 11: because what you're seeing in Israel is a country that

524
00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:58,520
Speaker 11: was a fairly confident, very prosperous, fairly successful small country,

525
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:02,840
Speaker 11: and a difficult neighborhood that had really prospered over the

526
00:28:02,960 --> 00:28:07,000
Speaker 11: last ten or so years leading up to October seventh,

527
00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:13,000
Speaker 11: and that social fabric has simply collapsed in a way

528
00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:15,359
Speaker 11: that I think has happened much faster than most people

529
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 11: could imagine possible, and has had so many shocking aspects

530
00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:22,120
Speaker 11: that it really is difficult to dress. But the first

531
00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:26,600
Speaker 11: thing that happened before the war is that on January fourth,

532
00:28:26,800 --> 00:28:30,440
Speaker 11: twenty twenty three, Prime Minister Natagna, who announced a coup

533
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:36,480
Speaker 11: de ta flat out Latin America style, his Justice Minister

534
00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:40,280
Speaker 11: announced a live press conference, which wasn't a press conference,

535
00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:44,800
Speaker 11: and simply said I'm announcing the first phase of a

536
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 11: reform in the administration of the state. And really it

537
00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:52,800
Speaker 11: didn't remind me of anything more than some Argentinian colonel

538
00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:59,040
Speaker 11: in the nineteen eighties. And that simply tore open Israeli society.

539
00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:01,959
Speaker 11: When you talk about the protests, the massive protests, hundreds

540
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:04,520
Speaker 11: of thousands of people on the streets in a country

541
00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:08,680
Speaker 11: of ten million. That was during that period in which

542
00:29:09,240 --> 00:29:14,160
Speaker 11: nataie who simply made explicit his efforts to really take

543
00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:17,080
Speaker 11: control of all of the levers of power in the state.

544
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:21,000
Speaker 11: And since then, for Nitaniello, things have just gone downhill

545
00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:26,200
Speaker 11: in the sense that you know, October seventh was a

546
00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:30,320
Speaker 11: repudiation of what was even called the Nitaieou doctrine. Right,

547
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:33,520
Speaker 11: his theory of how to keep how to stave off

548
00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:38,160
Speaker 11: any grappling with the Palestinian issue. Everything blew up in

549
00:29:38,280 --> 00:29:42,440
Speaker 11: Israeli's faces, and what you have now is simply a

550
00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:47,239
Speaker 11: fractured society in which a coup de't ta launched by

551
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:50,840
Speaker 11: the government has been I would say somewhere over fifty

552
00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:55,800
Speaker 11: percent successful. The former Chief Justice of Israel, Iron Barak,

553
00:29:56,600 --> 00:30:00,400
Speaker 11: he says that Israel can no longer be considered a demandocracy,

554
00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:03,920
Speaker 11: that there is now one man rule in Israel, and

555
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:08,240
Speaker 11: Israelis are not adapting happily to one man rule, and

556
00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:12,560
Speaker 11: they're not adapting happily to forever wars. And the polling

557
00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:15,560
Speaker 11: to go back to that has been I would say,

558
00:30:15,680 --> 00:30:21,280
Speaker 11: particularly unreliable and I don't know, you know, infelicitous, however

559
00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:23,320
Speaker 11: we want to put it, because first of all, I

560
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:25,840
Speaker 11: have no idea about any Penn State poll I don't

561
00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:29,000
Speaker 11: know who they have working for them. In Israel. By

562
00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:32,080
Speaker 11: and large, the quality of polling in Israel, of public

563
00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:35,560
Speaker 11: polling is very, very low, And the only way to

564
00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:38,240
Speaker 11: really know what's happening, I think, with any clarity is

565
00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:40,600
Speaker 11: to see trends. Like if you look at polling over

566
00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:43,640
Speaker 11: period of two years public polling, you can see where

567
00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:48,280
Speaker 11: the trends are going. The polling on this war, both

568
00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:50,800
Speaker 11: if you think of this war as the two year

569
00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:54,720
Speaker 11: eight month war since October seventh, or if this latest

570
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:59,040
Speaker 11: bit of war since the twenty eighth of February is

571
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:04,400
Speaker 11: particularly fraud because Israelis were asked in a way something

572
00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:07,760
Speaker 11: that I consider trick questions. By and large, for example,

573
00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:12,800
Speaker 11: they were asked in most polls, do you support fighting

574
00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:16,800
Speaker 11: to keep the northern border safe? And then that was

575
00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:19,240
Speaker 11: translated in much of the media, including much of the

576
00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:22,360
Speaker 11: foreign media, as you know, ninety eight percent of Israeli

577
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:26,600
Speaker 11: support war. It's not actually true because when you asked Israelis,

578
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:30,680
Speaker 11: as other more internal polls, did how do you feel

579
00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:34,880
Speaker 11: about Israeli strategy and the war in Lebanon? Those numbers

580
00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:38,040
Speaker 11: were not even half. And so what you actually see

581
00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:39,880
Speaker 11: when you try and go in depth in Israel is

582
00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:43,920
Speaker 11: a very confused population. When you talk to people here,

583
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:47,040
Speaker 11: when you talk to people in the north, whoever's still

584
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:51,040
Speaker 11: left there, what you get is rage and confusion. And

585
00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:53,320
Speaker 11: I want to just underscore what I just said. One

586
00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:56,000
Speaker 11: of the reasons that these polling is to a great

587
00:31:56,080 --> 00:32:01,000
Speaker 11: extent crap. When residents of the Israeli North are being polled,

588
00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:03,920
Speaker 11: at least half of them are no longer residents of

589
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:07,840
Speaker 11: the Israeli North. The most important the largest Israeli city

590
00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:11,920
Speaker 11: on the very northern border, Kiryachimona City. I don't want

591
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:13,520
Speaker 11: to say and make a mistake, but I think it

592
00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:16,080
Speaker 11: was a city of about twenty thousand people before the war.

593
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:19,960
Speaker 11: Has less than half of its population right now. And

594
00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:22,240
Speaker 11: the reason you're not hearing about it in the media

595
00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:26,240
Speaker 11: is a successful effort by the Israeli government to basically

596
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:29,960
Speaker 11: cover it up, cover their failure not to provide security

597
00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 11: for the northern border up. So they allowed no formal evacuations,

598
00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:39,320
Speaker 11: no compensation, and basically it's a situation in which anyone

599
00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:43,080
Speaker 11: wealthy enough or with enough family has escaped the north.

600
00:32:43,600 --> 00:32:48,000
Speaker 11: It's unlivable there. They're drones hitting every day. Their images

601
00:32:48,320 --> 00:32:50,800
Speaker 11: of kids of those families who don't have word to flee,

602
00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:54,480
Speaker 11: kids throwing themselves on the sidewalk, trying to get to

603
00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:58,400
Speaker 11: school while air raid sirens sound. It's like scenes out

604
00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:01,840
Speaker 11: of World War two movies. But very few people are

605
00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 11: getting killed, in part because so many have fled, and

606
00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:07,160
Speaker 11: in other part because the population is well trained and

607
00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:10,200
Speaker 11: they either are staying at home, not working, keeping their

608
00:33:10,280 --> 00:33:14,560
Speaker 11: kids at home, falling into poverty, or they have bomb

609
00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:15,560
Speaker 11: shelters nearby.

610
00:33:16,160 --> 00:33:16,480
Speaker 6: And so.

611
00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:21,280
Speaker 11: You know, Donald Trump, hearing that there was a double

612
00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:24,800
Speaker 11: drone attack in northern Israel, says, you know, it's nothing.

613
00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 11: Why is nisainno overreacting like it was just a little

614
00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:33,120
Speaker 11: tiny attack. It doesn't count. What he's saying isn't completely ridiculous,

615
00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:36,200
Speaker 11: right because no one was killed, But the fact that

616
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:40,880
Speaker 11: no one was killed covers up the primary fact, which

617
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:44,160
Speaker 11: is that life is unlivable on the Israeli North.

618
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:48,560
Speaker 8: Can I ask how the upcoming elections in a way

619
00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:51,960
Speaker 8: that Americans might not fully understand, could be influencing the

620
00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:57,120
Speaker 8: reactions of bengavir' Smotrich, also Netanyahu himself and people who

621
00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:59,880
Speaker 8: are anti l food in Israel because you break down

622
00:33:59,920 --> 00:34:02,560
Speaker 8: some of the dynamics surrounding the MoU but within the

623
00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:04,760
Speaker 8: context of electoral politics, Noga.

624
00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:08,560
Speaker 11: Yes, I can, and I'm going to apologize ahead of time,

625
00:34:08,600 --> 00:34:10,480
Speaker 11: but I want to take a step back before I

626
00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:14,360
Speaker 11: respond to you, because Israel is really really in like

627
00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:19,480
Speaker 11: a critical life support type situation in which, to my knowledge,

628
00:34:19,640 --> 00:34:22,399
Speaker 11: all of the leaders of the opposition, certainly former Prime

629
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:25,640
Speaker 11: Minister and of Tally Bennett, who gets intel briefings on

630
00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:28,440
Speaker 11: the level of the Prime Minister, former Defense Minister, of

631
00:34:28,520 --> 00:34:32,239
Speaker 11: Vigdor Liebermann, all of these are right wing guys. No

632
00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:36,040
Speaker 11: nothing radical about them, kind of the old school solid

633
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:39,880
Speaker 11: right wing. They have said that they have information that

634
00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:43,920
Speaker 11: the Likud Prime Minister at Tanyao's party is attempting to

635
00:34:44,160 --> 00:34:49,560
Speaker 11: either postpone, or cancel or manipulate the upcoming elections. And

636
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:51,719
Speaker 11: so when I answer your question, what you have to

637
00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:55,520
Speaker 11: know in the background is that there's immense anxiety in

638
00:34:55,680 --> 00:34:59,279
Speaker 11: Israel relating to these elections or what the hell is

639
00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:03,480
Speaker 11: going to happen? I hope I can speak this way. So,

640
00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:08,920
Speaker 11: for example, under Israeli law, which this government explicitly and

641
00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:12,800
Speaker 11: overtly tramples on, but under Israeli law, elections have to

642
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 11: be held by October twenty seventh. In other words, the

643
00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:18,680
Speaker 11: government does nothing. That is the date set for elections.

644
00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:23,719
Speaker 11: The government is doing nothing despite really significant efforts by

645
00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:26,759
Speaker 11: many of nataia Who's coalition partners to try and bring

646
00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:30,480
Speaker 11: the elections up, not to have this kind of horrific

647
00:35:30,680 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 11: October twenty seventh date with all of its terrible echoes

648
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:37,720
Speaker 11: for this government. Netania Who is just pushing and pushing

649
00:35:37,760 --> 00:35:40,480
Speaker 11: and pushing the election away, and they are real fears

650
00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:46,120
Speaker 11: about what kind of manipulation or worse he may be attempting.

651
00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:51,400
Speaker 11: In this context, what you have right now is who

652
00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:55,319
Speaker 11: is Israelis have never before seen him, right, He's really

653
00:35:55,400 --> 00:35:57,879
Speaker 11: the most dominant figure I think it's fair to say

654
00:35:57,880 --> 00:36:02,520
Speaker 11: in Israeli political history he's never been a beloved politician

655
00:36:02,719 --> 00:36:07,680
Speaker 11: in Israel. Ever, he has been feared, he has been respected,

656
00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:10,640
Speaker 11: he's been ignored. For a lot of the time that

657
00:36:10,719 --> 00:36:13,320
Speaker 11: he was Prime minister. In part thanks to him, and

658
00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:16,800
Speaker 11: in great part not Israel was doing well enough that

659
00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:20,040
Speaker 11: people could ignore their leaders. And if he had made,

660
00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:23,920
Speaker 11: you know, like antics internationally or embarrassed Israel at the

661
00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:27,160
Speaker 11: UN even people who never voted for him, never liked him,

662
00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:29,480
Speaker 11: were happy to ignore it. For a long period of time,

663
00:36:30,040 --> 00:36:34,680
Speaker 11: that's become impossible. And today everything he does and everything

664
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:38,000
Speaker 11: he doesn't do is seen in the prism of what

665
00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:41,839
Speaker 11: does this mean for elections? And will we have elections? Now,

666
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 11: what I'm saying to you, I think other Israeli analysts

667
00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:49,279
Speaker 11: who you might speak to would say, I'm exaggerating. Right,

668
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:52,200
Speaker 11: of course, there will be elections, and it may well

669
00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:55,880
Speaker 11: be that there will be elections, as there must be. However,

670
00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:59,759
Speaker 11: I know for sure that he is trying for their

671
00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:02,600
Speaker 11: not to be regular elections. So that's one of the

672
00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:07,960
Speaker 11: diconomies here. Prime Minister in NATANIAO domestically politically inside Israel,

673
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:14,360
Speaker 11: is simply trapped in a spider web, a sticky spider

674
00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:17,440
Speaker 11: web of his own making. And I don't see what

675
00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:20,200
Speaker 11: his way out will be. So he has this reputation

676
00:37:20,280 --> 00:37:23,479
Speaker 11: of being a magician, right, but what he has done

677
00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:28,360
Speaker 11: is promise Israelis. Let's say, in the last year two things.

678
00:37:29,080 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 11: One is he's mister Security. He is back to presenting

679
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:37,000
Speaker 11: himself as the only guy who can guarantee Israeli's security,

680
00:37:37,120 --> 00:37:39,080
Speaker 11: border security, national security.

681
00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:40,320
Speaker 7: And he has.

682
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:44,800
Speaker 11: Adopted this pose despite having been Prime Minister on the

683
00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:48,200
Speaker 11: day of the worst security catastrophe in Israeli history. And

684
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:50,880
Speaker 11: I think, I think it's fair to say one of

685
00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:53,879
Speaker 11: the worst terror attacks in known history and modern history,

686
00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:56,799
Speaker 11: since we have this concept of terror, right ony, two

687
00:37:56,920 --> 00:38:00,279
Speaker 11: hundred people killed in Israel in a single day. It's

688
00:38:00,280 --> 00:38:06,480
Speaker 11: an astonishing failure. But nonetheless, he has promoted himself this way.

689
00:38:06,520 --> 00:38:09,200
Speaker 11: And this is because he assumed that he was going

690
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:12,160
Speaker 11: to get a victory shot, right. He kept touting what

691
00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 11: he called total victory. He even had it emblazoned on

692
00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:17,839
Speaker 11: like Trump like hats. He took one as a gift

693
00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:21,080
Speaker 11: to Donald Trump. Total victory. And when you look at

694
00:38:21,120 --> 00:38:25,000
Speaker 11: what's happening now, there is total non victory on the

695
00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:31,240
Speaker 11: southern border with Gaza Hamas is resurgent. There is absolutely

696
00:38:31,400 --> 00:38:35,320
Speaker 11: no victory. There's something very close to defeat on the

697
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:39,440
Speaker 11: northern border with his Bala, where four soldiers. These are

698
00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 11: drafted soldiers, So basically eighteen year old kids got killed

699
00:38:43,080 --> 00:38:45,320
Speaker 11: today in a tank that was blown up by his Bala,

700
00:38:46,080 --> 00:38:50,120
Speaker 11: where people can't live normal lives. And then now this

701
00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:54,720
Speaker 11: catastrophe with Iran, and that dovetails with his second promise

702
00:38:54,800 --> 00:38:58,040
Speaker 11: to Israelis, which is I've got Trump in my back pocket.

703
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:01,960
Speaker 11: I'm Trump's best friend. It doesn't matter that the rest

704
00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:04,439
Speaker 11: of the world hates us, because I have Donald Trump.

705
00:39:04,480 --> 00:39:07,799
Speaker 11: I bring you Donald Trump. And I just heard today, incidentally,

706
00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:12,560
Speaker 11: that the Lecoute party had planned has already like you know,

707
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:17,640
Speaker 11: filmed and put into some drawer, an entire campaign, like

708
00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:22,680
Speaker 11: a video campaign, electoral campaign that hearkens back to the

709
00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:27,640
Speaker 11: twenty nineteen Natagnelle campaign in which he had these massive

710
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:31,440
Speaker 11: banners that covered entire Skyskirpers in Tel Aviv showing him

711
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:34,560
Speaker 11: shaking hands with Donald Trump, and the logo at that

712
00:39:34,719 --> 00:39:36,799
Speaker 11: time was I'm in another league.

713
00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:39,000
Speaker 4: Right elba.

714
00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:43,759
Speaker 3: If there are elections now, it seems like there are

715
00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:47,680
Speaker 3: people to the right of Nan Yahoo in the Lacud party,

716
00:39:47,840 --> 00:39:51,040
Speaker 3: and then there are some more liberal people to the

717
00:39:51,120 --> 00:39:54,120
Speaker 3: left of Nan Yahoo that say very similar things.

718
00:39:53,920 --> 00:39:56,320
Speaker 4: About the war about Gaza.

719
00:39:56,880 --> 00:39:59,480
Speaker 3: Is there a candidate that you see in Israel that

720
00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:03,200
Speaker 3: would actually really create a meaningful political difference if there

721
00:40:03,239 --> 00:40:04,080
Speaker 3: are elections?

722
00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:10,440
Speaker 11: I think any other candidate right now leading a party

723
00:40:11,440 --> 00:40:14,200
Speaker 11: were he to win. Unfortunately I say he because there

724
00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:16,680
Speaker 11: are no women leading any parties in Israel right now.

725
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:20,960
Speaker 11: I think what would make a significant difference, a difference

726
00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:24,919
Speaker 11: that could be really astonishing in fact. And I don't

727
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:26,880
Speaker 11: know what exactly you mean when you say to the

728
00:40:27,040 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 11: right of Nataiaho, because Nataia, who has very happily adapted

729
00:40:31,680 --> 00:40:42,560
Speaker 11: himself to the most extremist, racial supremacist theocratic narratives, threats Natania,

730
00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:47,239
Speaker 11: who has not castigated any of his ministers for saying

731
00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 11: any of the outrageous things they've said. Netanyahu and his

732
00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:56,160
Speaker 11: Leycoup party launched their first what looked like a campaign

733
00:40:56,280 --> 00:41:01,480
Speaker 11: video a week ago, and it is an overtly racist video.

734
00:41:01,880 --> 00:41:03,799
Speaker 11: I mean, there's just nothing else you can say about

735
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:07,560
Speaker 11: it that it's racist fear mongering. So I'm not sure

736
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 11: that there are a lot of people to the right

737
00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:13,560
Speaker 11: of Nitagniell who right now, I think Nataillo is either

738
00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:17,720
Speaker 11: much more to the right than people thought, including myself

739
00:41:17,840 --> 00:41:19,480
Speaker 11: during many years in which he appeared to be a

740
00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:23,400
Speaker 11: sort of standard issue right wing prime minister, or like

741
00:41:23,560 --> 00:41:28,680
Speaker 11: other people say, he's beholden to these extremes because he's

742
00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:32,279
Speaker 11: on trial for corruption, his trials not going well. He

743
00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:38,400
Speaker 11: has basically cut off Israel's diplomatic ties, including you know,

744
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:41,480
Speaker 11: to the EU, which is Israel's number one trading partner.

745
00:41:41,960 --> 00:41:45,000
Speaker 11: He now appears to have lost Donald Trump, at least

746
00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:48,359
Speaker 11: in the sense of public diplomatic support. I don't think

747
00:41:48,400 --> 00:41:50,279
Speaker 11: that jd Vance would be speaking the way he is

748
00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:55,800
Speaker 11: without an okay from the President. And so I consider

749
00:41:55,920 --> 00:42:00,440
Speaker 11: natagnia who the face of the ultra right wing in Israel,

750
00:42:00,520 --> 00:42:02,920
Speaker 11: and I do think that any other one of the candidates,

751
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:08,319
Speaker 11: including pretty significantly right wing candidates who oppose him, would

752
00:42:09,560 --> 00:42:13,800
Speaker 11: change the panorama in Israel completely, among other things, because

753
00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:17,040
Speaker 11: everyone who is running against him, first of all, believes

754
00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:21,719
Speaker 11: in rule of law. Ntayahu overtly no longer believes in

755
00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:24,719
Speaker 11: rule of law. When we see him sort of unfettered

756
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:27,640
Speaker 11: on the diplomatic stage, you have to know that in

757
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:32,960
Speaker 11: the domestic Israeli stage, he is much more unbound and unleashed.

758
00:42:33,040 --> 00:42:39,720
Speaker 11: His government openly disobeys Supreme Court rulings, openly uses racism

759
00:42:39,800 --> 00:42:43,640
Speaker 11: as a tool. And I think that anybody else, whether

760
00:42:43,719 --> 00:42:45,640
Speaker 11: we like them or not, or agree with them or not,

761
00:42:45,800 --> 00:42:48,480
Speaker 11: would just be a major qualitative change.

762
00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:52,880
Speaker 5: So enough Tally Bennett is maybe you tell me if

763
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:56,560
Speaker 5: I'm wrong. Probably his primary opponent at this at this

764
00:42:56,719 --> 00:42:59,800
Speaker 5: point can walk us through what he meant. So this

765
00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:02,560
Speaker 5: Jerusalem Post reported and he said this publicly, so it

766
00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:05,680
Speaker 5: doesn't matter where it was reported. He said, quote the

767
00:43:05,880 --> 00:43:08,920
Speaker 5: clock for Iran regime change to start as soon as

768
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:13,319
Speaker 5: government in Israel changes. And the term of the net

769
00:43:13,400 --> 00:43:16,040
Speaker 5: Yahu government began with the civil war, continued with the

770
00:43:16,120 --> 00:43:18,120
Speaker 5: massacre of the seventh of October, and ends with historic

771
00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:21,200
Speaker 5: failure against iran'sid Bennett, So what does he mean and

772
00:43:21,280 --> 00:43:25,840
Speaker 5: what would a what would a Bennett government mean for it? Like,

773
00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:27,880
Speaker 5: what does he mean He's going to continue to do

774
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:30,560
Speaker 5: regime or he's going to start regime change? You know,

775
00:43:30,640 --> 00:43:32,919
Speaker 5: if he takes powers, does that mean the next Prime

776
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:34,759
Speaker 5: minister is going to be trying to get us to

777
00:43:35,719 --> 00:43:37,800
Speaker 5: go to war again with the Iran or is he

778
00:43:37,920 --> 00:43:42,960
Speaker 5: talking about kind of stoking internal unrest and doing some

779
00:43:43,160 --> 00:43:45,759
Speaker 5: type of a coup in Iran like? And how how

780
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:50,520
Speaker 5: in general would Israel look under him if he came

781
00:43:50,600 --> 00:43:52,839
Speaker 5: back to power. So what he had like six months

782
00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:54,720
Speaker 5: in twenty twenty one or something as prime minister?

783
00:43:56,480 --> 00:43:58,160
Speaker 11: He was prime minister for a year and a half,

784
00:43:58,520 --> 00:44:04,919
Speaker 11: and he was surprisingly I would say, middle of the road,

785
00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:10,279
Speaker 11: standard issue responsible prime minister given what was known about

786
00:44:10,360 --> 00:44:13,520
Speaker 11: him ahead of time. Before I answer your question, Ryan,

787
00:44:13,600 --> 00:44:15,200
Speaker 11: if you forgive me, I just want to point out

788
00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:18,319
Speaker 11: something in that Jerusalem Post headline that you showed, which

789
00:44:18,440 --> 00:44:23,680
Speaker 11: is that this is an ai translated translation of a

790
00:44:24,040 --> 00:44:27,319
Speaker 11: Hebrew language article I believe from ma Ariv who that's

791
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:30,000
Speaker 11: a fairly right wing outlet that partners you see of

792
00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:31,400
Speaker 11: the Seven in October.

793
00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:32,600
Speaker 6: Yeah, I noticed that too.

794
00:44:33,280 --> 00:44:36,239
Speaker 11: So the reason I'm bringing this up is look at

795
00:44:36,239 --> 00:44:40,640
Speaker 11: the Jerusalem Post. The first tab it has our conferences. Right.

796
00:44:41,200 --> 00:44:44,160
Speaker 11: The Jerusalem Post used to be a real newspaper, English

797
00:44:44,239 --> 00:44:47,040
Speaker 11: language newspaper in Israel. Today I don't think we can

798
00:44:47,120 --> 00:44:50,319
Speaker 11: really consider real media. It's sort of a right wing

799
00:44:50,440 --> 00:44:55,040
Speaker 11: conference organizing platform that still has a media outlet, And

800
00:44:55,120 --> 00:44:57,040
Speaker 11: the reason I want to point out the translation is

801
00:44:57,120 --> 00:44:59,239
Speaker 11: I can tell you what I think oftally Bennett said

802
00:44:59,280 --> 00:45:02,839
Speaker 11: for my knowledge of him. But this is the kind

803
00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:06,960
Speaker 11: of mistakes that often happen when foreign journalists try and

804
00:45:07,040 --> 00:45:10,440
Speaker 11: cover Israel and the only people they know are kind

805
00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:13,520
Speaker 11: of Israeli techies who speak English and they read what

806
00:45:13,640 --> 00:45:16,320
Speaker 11: looks to be like English language media, and much of

807
00:45:16,360 --> 00:45:20,000
Speaker 11: it is really problematic, and most Israelis are not that

808
00:45:20,200 --> 00:45:23,120
Speaker 11: sophisticated and are much more provincial. So I just want

809
00:45:23,160 --> 00:45:25,840
Speaker 11: to point that out because it's a nice hook seeing

810
00:45:25,880 --> 00:45:30,680
Speaker 11: that mistake there. Yeah, my guess of what Naftali Bennett

811
00:45:30,760 --> 00:45:35,120
Speaker 11: was trying to say there is something quite different than

812
00:45:35,200 --> 00:45:38,080
Speaker 11: the way it's interpreted I think in English. My guess

813
00:45:38,160 --> 00:45:42,040
Speaker 11: is that he's speaking internally to Israelis who are terrified

814
00:45:42,080 --> 00:45:45,040
Speaker 11: of Iran and want to see regime change in Iran,

815
00:45:45,600 --> 00:45:48,320
Speaker 11: and what he is saying to them is, remember I

816
00:45:48,520 --> 00:45:51,879
Speaker 11: was a responsible prime minister. He's I don't think he's

817
00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:54,880
Speaker 11: talking about either an internal fomenting an internal coup in

818
00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:59,040
Speaker 11: Iran or another war. I think what he's talking about

819
00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:04,040
Speaker 11: is rebuild Israeli diplomatic ties, trying to re establish sanctions

820
00:46:04,080 --> 00:46:07,760
Speaker 11: which are now gone against Iran, trying to tell reassure

821
00:46:07,840 --> 00:46:11,760
Speaker 11: Israelis that he will be able to create again circumstances

822
00:46:12,120 --> 00:46:17,160
Speaker 11: in which the Iranian Islamist regime will appear weak and fragile,

823
00:46:17,560 --> 00:46:20,400
Speaker 11: as opposed to powerful and victorious as it is appearing

824
00:46:20,480 --> 00:46:20,879
Speaker 11: this week.

825
00:46:22,200 --> 00:46:22,399
Speaker 4: God.

826
00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:27,200
Speaker 5: So, the one thing I've been asking people Israelis on

827
00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:31,360
Speaker 5: social media, and I haven't gotten a quote, an answer

828
00:46:31,600 --> 00:46:33,800
Speaker 5: satisfying answer. Yes, I'm curious if you could answer it.

829
00:46:34,560 --> 00:46:38,239
Speaker 5: There's been so much rage at and Griffin put up

830
00:46:38,280 --> 00:46:40,919
Speaker 5: the poll of the Israeli public. Who knows the polls

831
00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:42,880
Speaker 5: right or not, but it is rarely public turning on

832
00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:46,520
Speaker 5: Trump and feeling betrayed and feeling like and you describe

833
00:46:46,560 --> 00:46:51,560
Speaker 5: the shock and the and the fear. My question has

834
00:46:51,640 --> 00:46:54,840
Speaker 5: been okay, but what like what did you think was

835
00:46:54,880 --> 00:46:58,600
Speaker 5: going to happen? Like you don't want this agreement. I

836
00:46:58,760 --> 00:47:01,640
Speaker 5: understand that the Republicans and Democrats here in the United

837
00:47:01,680 --> 00:47:03,600
Speaker 5: States don't like the terms of the MoU. They don't

838
00:47:03,680 --> 00:47:05,520
Speaker 5: like the sanctus are being left. I understand they don't

839
00:47:05,640 --> 00:47:10,160
Speaker 5: like those things, But what is the alternative, Like, how

840
00:47:10,280 --> 00:47:13,719
Speaker 5: did the Israeli public and the Israeli political class see

841
00:47:13,800 --> 00:47:17,080
Speaker 5: this unfolding in a way that led to something different,

842
00:47:17,120 --> 00:47:20,359
Speaker 5: like do they really want us to go back to war?

843
00:47:20,480 --> 00:47:21,319
Speaker 6: Like do they think that.

844
00:47:22,920 --> 00:47:26,120
Speaker 5: Renewing the war effort was a smart thing to do

845
00:47:26,239 --> 00:47:28,680
Speaker 5: and would actually lead to a better situation. We had

846
00:47:28,719 --> 00:47:31,239
Speaker 5: reported a couple of weeks ago at drop site that is,

847
00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:35,560
Speaker 5: Israel's ballistic missile interceptor capacity was down to double digits,

848
00:47:36,200 --> 00:47:40,880
Speaker 5: that they were extraordinarily reliant on the US Navy ballistic

849
00:47:40,920 --> 00:47:46,520
Speaker 5: missile interceptors, which themselves were significantly depleted, and that the

850
00:47:47,120 --> 00:47:51,239
Speaker 5: is that the Iranians retained a significant number of their

851
00:47:51,320 --> 00:47:52,760
Speaker 5: hypersonic ballistic missiles.

852
00:47:52,800 --> 00:47:53,839
Speaker 6: And that's just on that front.

853
00:47:53,920 --> 00:47:56,600
Speaker 5: That's that's before you get to the drones, and that's

854
00:47:56,680 --> 00:47:59,680
Speaker 5: before the houthis kind of enter the fray and shut

855
00:47:59,719 --> 00:48:02,520
Speaker 5: down bubble NEMDA straight.

856
00:48:02,920 --> 00:48:04,400
Speaker 4: So what are they like?

857
00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:09,640
Speaker 5: So that's the question, like what what alternative path that

858
00:48:09,760 --> 00:48:13,040
Speaker 5: has any rationality to it would lead to a better

859
00:48:13,160 --> 00:48:17,719
Speaker 5: outcome that they feel like Trump betrayed them by not

860
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:20,560
Speaker 5: going down? Well what am I missing here? Because I

861
00:48:20,600 --> 00:48:24,480
Speaker 5: don't see any other path apart from I tried the war.

862
00:48:25,280 --> 00:48:27,080
Speaker 5: War didn't work, Like why would it work again?

863
00:48:30,560 --> 00:48:32,720
Speaker 11: So I mean, this is a question we could discuss

864
00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:35,879
Speaker 11: for an hour, right in part because we are all

865
00:48:35,960 --> 00:48:39,480
Speaker 11: of us living in an era of I think, irresolvable

866
00:48:39,600 --> 00:48:44,279
Speaker 11: political paradoxes and also non rationality. You're asking for a

867
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:47,359
Speaker 11: rational response, and you're in this case, you really are

868
00:48:47,640 --> 00:48:50,000
Speaker 11: like screaming up the right tree. Because I have gone

869
00:48:50,080 --> 00:48:53,640
Speaker 11: the zerk in recent weeks, and I've even, you know

870
00:48:53,760 --> 00:48:57,759
Speaker 11: something I never do, gotten into someone Twitter TIFs with

871
00:48:57,960 --> 00:49:01,840
Speaker 11: Israeli right wingers who are a dancing this notion that

872
00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:06,920
Speaker 11: to me was clearly a fantasy from the start, something

873
00:49:07,120 --> 00:49:09,520
Speaker 11: cheap that they were trying to sell the Israeli public

874
00:49:09,640 --> 00:49:12,680
Speaker 11: as they desperately cling to power, which was the US

875
00:49:12,800 --> 00:49:16,239
Speaker 11: is about to strike again. Israelis have been living in

876
00:49:16,360 --> 00:49:19,239
Speaker 11: a bubble that is very cartoonish and that is not

877
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:25,320
Speaker 11: at all rational, in which I think. I think, certainly

878
00:49:25,960 --> 00:49:28,840
Speaker 11: what I call the BB block right, I don't consider

879
00:49:28,920 --> 00:49:31,840
Speaker 11: this particularly right wing. I don't think that the Natanielle

880
00:49:31,880 --> 00:49:34,399
Speaker 11: government has any right wing achievements that it can show

881
00:49:34,520 --> 00:49:36,440
Speaker 11: in the last three years three and a half years

882
00:49:36,480 --> 00:49:38,759
Speaker 11: it has been in power. So it's become kind of

883
00:49:38,920 --> 00:49:41,759
Speaker 11: a cult of personality, a little bit like the Republican

884
00:49:41,840 --> 00:49:48,320
Speaker 11: Party and they sold Israel a fantasy. Now it's entirely

885
00:49:48,480 --> 00:49:53,160
Speaker 11: possible that nataielle who himself was not lying when I've

886
00:49:53,239 --> 00:49:56,280
Speaker 11: observed n'ataia who the few times I've managed to observe

887
00:49:56,360 --> 00:49:59,840
Speaker 11: him up closed, mostly those days that I've attended his trial.

888
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:03,560
Speaker 11: Ntsaneo appears to me more and more a figure who

889
00:50:03,880 --> 00:50:08,640
Speaker 11: genuinely has drunk his own kool aid, who genuinely inhabits

890
00:50:08,680 --> 00:50:12,200
Speaker 11: a kind of alternate reality. And so I think that's

891
00:50:12,280 --> 00:50:14,719
Speaker 11: one of the things that may have made him quite persuasive,

892
00:50:15,920 --> 00:50:19,480
Speaker 11: because he's not lying, because he's sharing his deep belief

893
00:50:19,640 --> 00:50:20,560
Speaker 11: right so.

894
00:50:21,280 --> 00:50:25,040
Speaker 6: Israeli style, it's not if you believe.

895
00:50:24,760 --> 00:50:25,960
Speaker 7: It, that's right.

896
00:50:26,080 --> 00:50:27,239
Speaker 11: But there's something to that.

897
00:50:30,239 --> 00:50:33,080
Speaker 6: I think, oh, it is when it comes to presenting

898
00:50:33,360 --> 00:50:34,080
Speaker 6: your vision.

899
00:50:35,560 --> 00:50:39,040
Speaker 11: So again I'm not I'm trying to explain something to

900
00:50:39,080 --> 00:50:41,520
Speaker 11: you without making excuses, because this really is a matter

901
00:50:41,600 --> 00:50:44,680
Speaker 11: that has enraged me. And the reason I have been

902
00:50:44,840 --> 00:50:47,719
Speaker 11: enraged as a journalist working in Israel is because I

903
00:50:47,920 --> 00:50:52,440
Speaker 11: think that the politicians in the ruling class, and really

904
00:50:52,480 --> 00:50:57,759
Speaker 11: an astonishing swath of the Israeli media just have collapsed

905
00:50:57,880 --> 00:51:07,600
Speaker 11: into jingoistic, superficial tinpot narratives, right. I think that the

906
00:51:07,719 --> 00:51:12,200
Speaker 11: Israeli media, with significant exceptions of excellent journalists who have

907
00:51:12,360 --> 00:51:16,440
Speaker 11: very bravely done a really good job. But the overriding

908
00:51:16,600 --> 00:51:20,560
Speaker 11: narrative in Israel has been Donald Trump loves us, and

909
00:51:20,680 --> 00:51:24,520
Speaker 11: he's gonna fly in like Superman and he is gonna

910
00:51:24,719 --> 00:51:27,600
Speaker 11: save our asses. And it doesn't matter. This is the

911
00:51:27,680 --> 00:51:31,640
Speaker 11: Natagniel line. Doesn't matter. If Emmanuel Macron hates us, screw him.

912
00:51:32,360 --> 00:51:35,600
Speaker 11: We've got Donald Trump. This I mean to say that

913
00:51:35,719 --> 00:51:39,680
Speaker 11: this is an irresponsible line. Doesn't begin to explain it

914
00:51:40,120 --> 00:51:45,680
Speaker 11: for a country whose catastrophic vulnerability was revealed on October seventh.

915
00:51:46,360 --> 00:51:49,040
Speaker 11: I mean, think about it, right, the betrayal of Israeli

916
00:51:49,160 --> 00:51:52,880
Speaker 11: national security by putting all Israeli interests just in the

917
00:51:52,960 --> 00:51:55,320
Speaker 11: hands of Donald Trump, when he is known to be

918
00:51:55,480 --> 00:51:59,080
Speaker 11: someone who betrays his closest allies, and he's known to

919
00:51:59,160 --> 00:52:02,520
Speaker 11: be someone with very fickle opinions, even on matters of

920
00:52:02,560 --> 00:52:06,720
Speaker 11: global import it almost leaves you without words.

921
00:52:07,400 --> 00:52:07,560
Speaker 4: Right.

922
00:52:07,760 --> 00:52:13,120
Speaker 11: So there have been all along extremely prominent Israeli voices

923
00:52:14,080 --> 00:52:17,560
Speaker 11: saying from the start, there's no strategy to this war

924
00:52:17,600 --> 00:52:21,000
Speaker 11: with Iran, There's no strategy to the war in Lebanon,

925
00:52:21,480 --> 00:52:25,440
Speaker 11: and our national security is being endangered by this fantasy.

926
00:52:26,040 --> 00:52:29,280
Speaker 11: And some of them include some opposition leaders. Yeah, your Golan,

927
00:52:29,480 --> 00:52:31,799
Speaker 11: a former deputy chief of staff of the Israeli Army

928
00:52:31,800 --> 00:52:35,720
Speaker 11: who's head of the largest sort of mainstream center left party,

929
00:52:36,680 --> 00:52:41,760
Speaker 11: and others, certainly people former intel leaders for IDF, chiefs

930
00:52:41,800 --> 00:52:45,960
Speaker 11: of staff, and the former prime ministers, not just Naftali Bennett,

931
00:52:46,000 --> 00:52:49,120
Speaker 11: but Ehud Olmert, who really has gone out on a limb.

932
00:52:49,239 --> 00:52:52,800
Speaker 11: So all along there have been voices in Israel, important

933
00:52:52,880 --> 00:52:56,759
Speaker 11: voice is saying this is ridiculous, there's no strategy, and

934
00:52:56,840 --> 00:53:00,320
Speaker 11: those voices have been amplified more and more as the

935
00:53:00,400 --> 00:53:05,239
Speaker 11: weeks went on. But again, Israel is stuck. I think

936
00:53:05,320 --> 00:53:09,160
Speaker 11: in a way that many Americans can relate to, because

937
00:53:09,239 --> 00:53:11,400
Speaker 11: Donald Trump is in power in the White House and

938
00:53:11,520 --> 00:53:14,360
Speaker 11: he has for now a majority in both houses of Congress.

939
00:53:14,480 --> 00:53:18,920
Speaker 11: So even if a majority of Americans disagree with him,

940
00:53:19,200 --> 00:53:22,359
Speaker 11: or if some people feel kind of voters remorse at

941
00:53:22,400 --> 00:53:24,800
Speaker 11: this moment, I know for many Americans there's a feeling

942
00:53:24,880 --> 00:53:27,360
Speaker 11: like there's nothing we can do, and that is something

943
00:53:28,440 --> 00:53:30,959
Speaker 11: first of all real and Israel and Nataneo still holds

944
00:53:31,000 --> 00:53:35,359
Speaker 11: on to his tiny but powerful majority that he won

945
00:53:35,520 --> 00:53:40,120
Speaker 11: back in decend November twenty twenty two, and he has

946
00:53:40,360 --> 00:53:44,040
Speaker 11: stoked this narrative of inevitability if my way is the

947
00:53:44,120 --> 00:53:46,840
Speaker 11: only way and anyone else is a trader, and I

948
00:53:47,000 --> 00:53:51,080
Speaker 11: mean this using the word trader against the media. He's

949
00:53:51,160 --> 00:53:53,759
Speaker 11: called the media enemies of the state. He calls his

950
00:53:53,840 --> 00:53:58,040
Speaker 11: opponents traders. He can't stop talking about a candidate that

951
00:53:58,120 --> 00:54:02,200
Speaker 11: you didn't mention yet, Ryan Godie Eisenkott. He's someone I

952
00:54:02,239 --> 00:54:05,799
Speaker 11: would suggest keeping an eye on. He's less well known.

953
00:54:06,719 --> 00:54:09,239
Speaker 11: He doesn't speak polished English. In a way, he's an

954
00:54:09,280 --> 00:54:12,600
Speaker 11: anti Nitaniahu. He's a former chief of Staff of the

955
00:54:12,800 --> 00:54:16,600
Speaker 11: army and he's one of these two guys along Benny Gunz,

956
00:54:16,920 --> 00:54:19,960
Speaker 11: who kind of decided to shoulder the burden and they

957
00:54:20,080 --> 00:54:25,080
Speaker 11: joined this national government emergency government on October eleventh, twenty

958
00:54:25,160 --> 00:54:27,880
Speaker 11: twenty three. But he was the first to leave it

959
00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:31,920
Speaker 11: and Godi asenkoutt, Sorry, no, so yeah, I.

960
00:54:31,920 --> 00:54:33,960
Speaker 4: Think we're gonna have to probably leave that there. Today.

961
00:54:34,000 --> 00:54:35,600
Speaker 3: Maybe we can have you back on and talk more

962
00:54:35,640 --> 00:54:39,560
Speaker 3: about the elections that we hopefully occur, that we hope

963
00:54:39,680 --> 00:54:43,719
Speaker 3: occur in Israel soon. But thank you for how illuminating.

964
00:54:43,760 --> 00:54:47,120
Speaker 3: This was Noga. Where can people find your journalism?

965
00:54:48,840 --> 00:54:53,319
Speaker 11: Well, I appear very often on France twenty four TV

966
00:54:53,480 --> 00:54:57,560
Speaker 11: and English. I'm on Twitter at En Turnopolski, I'm on

967
00:54:58,480 --> 00:55:02,280
Speaker 11: the World on NPR fairly often, and I write articles

968
00:55:02,360 --> 00:55:03,480
Speaker 11: in different outlets.

969
00:55:04,160 --> 00:55:06,920
Speaker 3: Okay, we'll definitely link to that in the description. Thank

970
00:55:06,960 --> 00:55:09,280
Speaker 3: you so much for joining us today, and we definitely

971
00:55:09,320 --> 00:55:10,880
Speaker 3: hope to speak to you more in the future.

972
00:55:11,840 --> 00:55:13,560
Speaker 6: Thank you so much, Thanks Nogut.

973
00:55:16,360 --> 00:55:17,719
Speaker 4: All right, well that.

974
00:55:17,880 --> 00:55:21,839
Speaker 3: Was the Israeli perspective, But why don't we uh move

975
00:55:21,920 --> 00:55:25,560
Speaker 3: back over to the United States perspective for a sec Emily,

976
00:55:25,880 --> 00:55:28,880
Speaker 3: there are some people in the GOP with some for

977
00:55:29,280 --> 00:55:33,200
Speaker 3: some the very first time ever harsh words for our

978
00:55:34,040 --> 00:55:34,840
Speaker 3: brave president.

979
00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:36,840
Speaker 4: Let's start with let's.

980
00:55:36,640 --> 00:55:38,920
Speaker 8: Pause, though not the first time ever, the first time

981
00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:42,040
Speaker 8: since many of them were like virulently never Trump is

982
00:55:42,560 --> 00:55:43,800
Speaker 8: twenty sixty hmm.

983
00:55:43,960 --> 00:55:48,440
Speaker 3: Okay, timeline correction. But let's start with friend of the show, Batya,

984
00:55:48,840 --> 00:55:49,920
Speaker 3: let's take a listen.

985
00:55:50,520 --> 00:55:52,960
Speaker 12: Went into this. The President laid out three main goals.

986
00:55:53,000 --> 00:55:54,520
Speaker 12: He said he wanted to get rid of their navy.

987
00:55:54,560 --> 00:55:56,440
Speaker 12: He wanted to get rid of their ballistic capabilities, and

988
00:55:56,520 --> 00:55:58,120
Speaker 12: he wanted to get rid of their ability to achieve

989
00:55:58,120 --> 00:56:01,440
Speaker 12: a nuclear weapon. I don't see any of that in

990
00:56:01,480 --> 00:56:04,320
Speaker 12: this MoU Of course, they promised not to pursue a

991
00:56:04,400 --> 00:56:07,360
Speaker 12: nuclear weapon. Guess what. They promised that to President Obama

992
00:56:07,440 --> 00:56:10,160
Speaker 12: as well, and then they lied and cheated. Right, their

993
00:56:10,200 --> 00:56:12,600
Speaker 12: word means nothing, which is the whole point of going

994
00:56:12,719 --> 00:56:14,359
Speaker 12: after them in this military way.

995
00:56:14,440 --> 00:56:14,560
Speaker 8: Now.

996
00:56:14,760 --> 00:56:16,960
Speaker 12: The one thing that I found the most distressing is

997
00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:19,480
Speaker 12: that Vice President Vance has been the only member of

998
00:56:19,600 --> 00:56:22,520
Speaker 12: the cabinet who's out there defending this, and he keeps

999
00:56:22,600 --> 00:56:25,080
Speaker 12: implying that the people who have a problem with it

1000
00:56:25,160 --> 00:56:28,640
Speaker 12: are somehow you know, warhawk want an endless, you know,

1001
00:56:28,880 --> 00:56:31,600
Speaker 12: ground swell of ground troops on the ground in order

1002
00:56:31,640 --> 00:56:34,360
Speaker 12: to finish the deal. I find that very insulting. I

1003
00:56:34,440 --> 00:56:37,319
Speaker 12: don't want that we had them on the ropes. They

1004
00:56:37,400 --> 00:56:40,800
Speaker 12: have never been as weak as they were last Friday,

1005
00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:44,400
Speaker 12: right before the President agreed to this exact goal, and

1006
00:56:44,520 --> 00:56:48,279
Speaker 12: I just do not understand pressure. In sixty days, when

1007
00:56:48,280 --> 00:56:50,040
Speaker 12: they have all their money back, they're going to be

1008
00:56:50,239 --> 00:56:53,320
Speaker 12: much stronger and much less likely to agree to anything

1009
00:56:53,680 --> 00:56:56,839
Speaker 12: that would make this not just better than the JCPOA,

1010
00:56:57,160 --> 00:56:59,080
Speaker 12: but just as good as the JCPOA.

1011
00:57:00,040 --> 00:57:01,239
Speaker 4: I think nobody was saying.

1012
00:57:02,920 --> 00:57:04,960
Speaker 8: Nobody was saying a week ago that we had them

1013
00:57:05,000 --> 00:57:06,920
Speaker 8: on the ropes. I mean maybe a couple of people,

1014
00:57:07,280 --> 00:57:09,160
Speaker 8: but nobody was saying that a week ago. And this

1015
00:57:09,320 --> 00:57:12,520
Speaker 8: is like the I get why people are saying, oh,

1016
00:57:12,680 --> 00:57:15,359
Speaker 8: jd Vance has the straw mand that the only option

1017
00:57:15,719 --> 00:57:19,320
Speaker 8: is thousands of ground troops and more and more months

1018
00:57:19,560 --> 00:57:23,160
Speaker 8: in war and quagmire. But the argument is that the

1019
00:57:23,320 --> 00:57:26,320
Speaker 8: only other options would inevitably lead to that, So it's

1020
00:57:26,320 --> 00:57:28,479
Speaker 8: actually not a straw man. The argument is, of course,

1021
00:57:28,560 --> 00:57:31,440
Speaker 8: like I know our viewers understand that, but the argument

1022
00:57:31,560 --> 00:57:34,360
Speaker 8: is that anything else that you do is going to

1023
00:57:34,480 --> 00:57:37,520
Speaker 8: inevitably lead to ground troops. There is not any other

1024
00:57:37,680 --> 00:57:40,760
Speaker 8: option that doesn't look like escalation, So make the argument

1025
00:57:40,880 --> 00:57:43,160
Speaker 8: for escalation. But nobody a week ago was saying that

1026
00:57:43,200 --> 00:57:44,920
Speaker 8: we had them on the ropes, and that this was

1027
00:57:45,200 --> 00:57:46,840
Speaker 8: everyone was saying, we need to do more to get

1028
00:57:46,880 --> 00:57:47,600
Speaker 8: them on the ropes.

1029
00:57:47,640 --> 00:57:49,200
Speaker 7: So it's just it's head spinning.

1030
00:57:49,640 --> 00:57:54,320
Speaker 2: I mean, for Batya, her entire worldview, whether it's this

1031
00:57:54,960 --> 00:57:57,400
Speaker 2: or whether it's you know, her view of Israel is

1032
00:57:57,440 --> 00:57:59,840
Speaker 2: this great moral actor, or whether it's the idea of

1033
00:58:00,040 --> 00:58:02,480
Speaker 2: Trump is some true champion of the working class. It

1034
00:58:02,640 --> 00:58:06,800
Speaker 2: all depends on complete and utter delusion and disconnection from reality.

1035
00:58:07,160 --> 00:58:10,880
Speaker 2: So it does not surprise me that once again she's

1036
00:58:10,920 --> 00:58:14,440
Speaker 2: pushing this idea that we had a run on the ropes. Now,

1037
00:58:14,640 --> 00:58:17,880
Speaker 2: President Trump told you straight out at the g seventh Summit,

1038
00:58:18,240 --> 00:58:20,120
Speaker 2: they had us on the ropes. We had a few

1039
00:58:20,160 --> 00:58:23,080
Speaker 2: weeks to go before what unfolded was what he described

1040
00:58:23,160 --> 00:58:24,240
Speaker 2: as bedlam.

1041
00:58:24,760 --> 00:58:25,600
Speaker 10: That's why we're here.

1042
00:58:25,880 --> 00:58:30,000
Speaker 2: We're here because you and your ideology and your ideological

1043
00:58:30,080 --> 00:58:32,439
Speaker 2: brethren pushed us towards this war.

1044
00:58:32,840 --> 00:58:35,760
Speaker 10: Trump, you know, a big boy, decided himself. He thought

1045
00:58:35,800 --> 00:58:38,680
Speaker 10: this would be some legacy building piece gets us into this.

1046
00:58:39,200 --> 00:58:42,240
Speaker 10: It was a disaster. We lost, and this is the

1047
00:58:42,320 --> 00:58:43,280
Speaker 10: inevitable result.

1048
00:58:43,560 --> 00:58:45,880
Speaker 2: But rather than grappling with that, she has to spin

1049
00:58:46,000 --> 00:58:49,680
Speaker 2: some delusional fantasy of, oh, actually, if we'd just bombed

1050
00:58:49,720 --> 00:58:51,920
Speaker 2: them one more time, one more around, you know, if

1051
00:58:51,960 --> 00:58:54,160
Speaker 2: we blew up a few more little girls schools, then

1052
00:58:54,480 --> 00:58:57,720
Speaker 2: we could have had victory in hand. It's so utterly

1053
00:58:57,800 --> 00:59:01,200
Speaker 2: preposterous and literally no one will leave that, and.

1054
00:59:01,400 --> 00:59:04,520
Speaker 5: The discrepancy between the reality and the way that she's

1055
00:59:04,720 --> 00:59:08,400
Speaker 5: describing it is about as vast as you could possibly get.

1056
00:59:08,680 --> 00:59:12,240
Speaker 5: According to her, you can't trust Iran's word in these

1057
00:59:12,280 --> 00:59:15,800
Speaker 5: diplomatic agreements, because yes, they've previously said that they would

1058
00:59:16,080 --> 00:59:18,320
Speaker 5: not pursue a nuclear weapon, but she says they lied

1059
00:59:18,360 --> 00:59:22,560
Speaker 5: and they cheated. According to the IEA, which was monitoring

1060
00:59:23,000 --> 00:59:27,720
Speaker 5: Iron's compliance with the JCPOA, they were in compliance up

1061
00:59:27,840 --> 00:59:31,400
Speaker 5: until the moment that the US, for no reason other

1062
00:59:31,480 --> 00:59:33,360
Speaker 5: than the fact that Obama's name was on the deal,

1063
00:59:34,120 --> 00:59:37,200
Speaker 5: walked out of the deal, just unilaterally walked out of

1064
00:59:37,240 --> 00:59:41,160
Speaker 5: the deal. Trump then re enters negotiations last year and

1065
00:59:41,240 --> 00:59:45,680
Speaker 5: in the middle of those negotiations kills the negotiators. Then

1066
00:59:45,840 --> 00:59:49,760
Speaker 5: he re enters negotiations again, and in the middle of

1067
00:59:49,840 --> 00:59:55,360
Speaker 5: those negotiations kills the negotiators, including the head of the country.

1068
00:59:58,200 --> 01:00:00,800
Speaker 5: And they are the ones that are pplicitus and can't

1069
01:00:00,840 --> 01:00:05,880
Speaker 5: be trusted, like there has in the annals of negotiations

1070
01:00:05,920 --> 01:00:10,680
Speaker 5: and diplomacy in the last several hundred years. I don't

1071
01:00:10,720 --> 01:00:15,000
Speaker 5: think you can compile a track record as duplicitous as

1072
01:00:15,040 --> 01:00:18,800
Speaker 5: what Trump stacked up from twenty eighteen to twenty twenty six,

1073
01:00:19,880 --> 01:00:22,120
Speaker 5: like unilaterally walking away from a deal that was agreed

1074
01:00:22,160 --> 01:00:25,160
Speaker 5: to in good faith, then twice killing the people that

1075
01:00:25,240 --> 01:00:28,080
Speaker 5: you're claiming to be negotiating with with surprise attacks twice,

1076
01:00:29,320 --> 01:00:31,600
Speaker 5: and then for Baya to come on the back end

1077
01:00:31,640 --> 01:00:34,040
Speaker 5: of that and say that Iran is duplicitous and can't

1078
01:00:34,040 --> 01:00:34,960
Speaker 5: be trusted.

1079
01:00:36,400 --> 01:00:40,920
Speaker 6: Like there has Like it's.

1080
01:00:40,760 --> 01:00:45,200
Speaker 5: Almost a lower lumer level of just pure racism and Islamophobia,

1081
01:00:45,560 --> 01:00:48,440
Speaker 5: because her only argument would be, well, they're Muslims running

1082
01:00:48,440 --> 01:00:52,120
Speaker 5: and Muslims and evildoers, so therefore they just inherently as

1083
01:00:53,200 --> 01:00:55,600
Speaker 5: as the creatures and monsters they are, can't be trusted

1084
01:00:56,200 --> 01:00:58,520
Speaker 5: when the actual record is.

1085
01:00:58,560 --> 01:00:59,000
Speaker 13: What it is.

1086
01:01:00,520 --> 01:01:02,400
Speaker 6: Just that part alone is like, what are you what

1087
01:01:02,520 --> 01:01:03,520
Speaker 6: are you talking about?

1088
01:01:03,680 --> 01:01:06,480
Speaker 3: Well, Ryan, she's not alone because we have leadership on

1089
01:01:06,560 --> 01:01:10,520
Speaker 3: both the Republican and Democratic side voicing similar concerns.

1090
01:01:10,520 --> 01:01:12,320
Speaker 4: Why don't we take a listen to this next clip?

1091
01:01:12,960 --> 01:01:16,960
Speaker 8: Ins dollars to save predict lunatics who want to murder us.

1092
01:01:19,360 --> 01:01:20,240
Speaker 4: Is not a good idea.

1093
01:01:20,920 --> 01:01:25,280
Speaker 9: I think the President unfortunately, is receiving bad advice.

1094
01:01:25,040 --> 01:01:25,440
Speaker 14: On this deal.

1095
01:01:25,480 --> 01:01:26,720
Speaker 7: I was just going to ask you about there on

1096
01:01:26,880 --> 01:01:28,360
Speaker 7: do what do you think about it?

1097
01:01:29,840 --> 01:01:32,560
Speaker 15: This whole clear deal now no better than what we

1098
01:01:32,680 --> 01:01:36,760
Speaker 15: had back at twenty fifteen, back when Barack Obama cut

1099
01:01:36,880 --> 01:01:40,800
Speaker 15: the deal. And that's where Donald's Trump winds us up.

1100
01:01:41,000 --> 01:01:43,920
Speaker 7: After all of this, what a faris.

1101
01:01:47,560 --> 01:01:48,240
Speaker 4: We went to work?

1102
01:01:48,320 --> 01:01:48,800
Speaker 16: Who is that.

1103
01:01:51,040 --> 01:01:53,560
Speaker 4: Doing something in the streets that were moves? The streets

1104
01:01:53,600 --> 01:01:56,240
Speaker 4: were being used speacefully before our invasion.

1105
01:01:56,400 --> 01:01:56,760
Speaker 13: And now.

1106
01:01:58,520 --> 01:02:01,360
Speaker 14: In the future it's going to get access to his

1107
01:02:01,480 --> 01:02:02,440
Speaker 14: frozen assets.

1108
01:02:02,480 --> 01:02:03,880
Speaker 4: And what is run giving up for this?

1109
01:02:05,040 --> 01:02:05,400
Speaker 6: Nothing?

1110
01:02:06,120 --> 01:02:10,280
Speaker 11: Nothing, They're merely reaffirming what they've said before about their weapons.

1111
01:02:10,400 --> 01:02:13,440
Speaker 4: All I've seen is public reporting about it. That's a

1112
01:02:13,480 --> 01:02:14,440
Speaker 4: public reporting to.

1113
01:02:14,520 --> 01:02:17,520
Speaker 14: Me, suggests we're giving up an awful lot more to

1114
01:02:17,600 --> 01:02:19,600
Speaker 14: get a lot less than the Jason.

1115
01:02:19,360 --> 01:02:22,240
Speaker 8: P Away Absolutely stunning to see Lindsey Graham walk away

1116
01:02:22,280 --> 01:02:22,800
Speaker 8: from a camera.

1117
01:02:23,200 --> 01:02:26,360
Speaker 7: That's right, you don't see that every day.

1118
01:02:26,440 --> 01:02:27,920
Speaker 2: Put that he was headed to see if they're on

1119
01:02:27,920 --> 01:02:33,440
Speaker 2: any UFC fighters still hanging around, just check in to

1120
01:02:33,520 --> 01:02:35,000
Speaker 2: make sure they all got down safely.

1121
01:02:35,280 --> 01:02:38,200
Speaker 10: They could be, yeah, I mean ted crews there.

1122
01:02:38,560 --> 01:02:42,000
Speaker 2: Of course, with the hard criticism, which I mean, hey,

1123
01:02:42,360 --> 01:02:44,840
Speaker 2: he is consistent, right, The Republicans have been talking about

1124
01:02:44,840 --> 01:02:47,320
Speaker 2: the quote unquote palats of cash that Obama gave away

1125
01:02:47,400 --> 01:02:50,720
Speaker 2: to the Mullahs, the scary Mulla's for years, even though

1126
01:02:50,840 --> 01:02:54,120
Speaker 2: that was their money. We're talking about unfreezing assets, which again,

1127
01:02:54,240 --> 01:02:56,960
Speaker 2: are there money, something that Trump actually explained quite well.

1128
01:02:57,000 --> 01:02:59,439
Speaker 2: He was like, look, at some point, we should probably

1129
01:02:59,440 --> 01:03:01,840
Speaker 2: give that money if we want to maintain our credibility

1130
01:03:01,840 --> 01:03:05,560
Speaker 2: in the global financial system. But you note Cruz doesn't

1131
01:03:05,600 --> 01:03:09,200
Speaker 2: have the stones to actually criticize Trump. It's he's getting

1132
01:03:09,280 --> 01:03:12,840
Speaker 2: I think he's getting bad advice. So, you know, him

1133
01:03:13,320 --> 01:03:16,720
Speaker 2: taking that line because they know how fragile his ego

1134
01:03:16,880 --> 01:03:18,479
Speaker 2: is and that this is the game he has to play.

1135
01:03:18,560 --> 01:03:19,360
Speaker 10: I mentioned this yesterday.

1136
01:03:19,360 --> 01:03:20,800
Speaker 2: I mean it's a similar tactic to sort of what

1137
01:03:20,920 --> 01:03:25,960
Speaker 2: Joe Kent did of he resigned, But then his commentary

1138
01:03:26,120 --> 01:03:29,240
Speaker 2: was never critical of Trump. It was always if anyone

1139
01:03:29,480 --> 01:03:33,760
Speaker 2: can resolve the situation, it's our great strong leader, Donald Trump,

1140
01:03:33,800 --> 01:03:36,440
Speaker 2: who was doing everything amazing and perfect right up to

1141
01:03:36,560 --> 01:03:39,200
Speaker 2: this moment when he was misled by the Israelis and

1142
01:03:39,640 --> 01:03:41,200
Speaker 2: forced into war by the Israelis.

1143
01:03:41,240 --> 01:03:42,560
Speaker 10: So they're doing their own version of that.

1144
01:03:42,760 --> 01:03:45,000
Speaker 8: Well, I want to say, I don't think anybody has

1145
01:03:45,360 --> 01:03:47,800
Speaker 8: paid enough attention to this. I actually think Joe Kent

1146
01:03:47,920 --> 01:03:51,000
Speaker 8: may have, because he talked like that helped us get

1147
01:03:51,040 --> 01:03:56,200
Speaker 8: out of the war. Honestly, because Trump basically followed the

1148
01:03:56,400 --> 01:03:58,440
Speaker 8: Kent path to get it.

1149
01:03:58,600 --> 01:04:02,760
Speaker 7: Like Kent was like, cut the losses, gets.

1150
01:04:02,000 --> 01:04:06,440
Speaker 10: This, now we should just yeah a deal. We should

1151
01:04:06,440 --> 01:04:09,720
Speaker 10: just knok away walk Away were still closed.

1152
01:04:10,120 --> 01:04:12,440
Speaker 7: So I mean, I know, but I think he nudged

1153
01:04:12,480 --> 01:04:12,920
Speaker 7: him this.

1154
01:04:13,080 --> 01:04:14,640
Speaker 8: I don't know if that it was Joe Kent, but

1155
01:04:14,720 --> 01:04:20,000
Speaker 8: I think projecting that strategy was ultimately helpful. And another

1156
01:04:20,040 --> 01:04:22,720
Speaker 8: person who did that I think carefully was Tretah And

1157
01:04:23,200 --> 01:04:25,760
Speaker 8: I think it may have actually ended the war for now.

1158
01:04:25,920 --> 01:04:26,880
Speaker 7: We'll see, we'll see.

1159
01:04:27,080 --> 01:04:29,000
Speaker 2: I think what ended the war for now was oil

1160
01:04:29,040 --> 01:04:31,320
Speaker 2: executives coming to the White House and being like, there,

1161
01:04:31,560 --> 01:04:34,720
Speaker 2: let me tell you, buddy, China has actually saved our

1162
01:04:34,800 --> 01:04:37,960
Speaker 2: ass because they decided to import way less oil than

1163
01:04:38,040 --> 01:04:40,720
Speaker 2: they were and they had a large reserve, and they

1164
01:04:40,800 --> 01:04:43,800
Speaker 2: are very advanced in terms of renewable tech that is

1165
01:04:43,880 --> 01:04:46,240
Speaker 2: only going to hold out so much longer before we're

1166
01:04:46,280 --> 01:04:49,040
Speaker 2: going to have real problems. And he also said something

1167
01:04:49,200 --> 01:04:51,680
Speaker 2: in his presser that I thought was interesting that didn't

1168
01:04:51,680 --> 01:04:53,800
Speaker 2: get clipped as much, but he was talking about how

1169
01:04:53,920 --> 01:04:56,880
Speaker 2: like every time there was a piece deal, the markets

1170
01:04:56,920 --> 01:04:59,280
Speaker 2: went up, and then when there was war, the markets

1171
01:04:59,320 --> 01:05:01,160
Speaker 2: went down. And so I looked at that that was

1172
01:05:01,240 --> 01:05:04,000
Speaker 2: like the markets. They're more brilliant than any single person.

1173
01:05:04,480 --> 01:05:06,640
Speaker 2: We have to listen to the markets. I think he's

1174
01:05:06,680 --> 01:05:09,120
Speaker 2: telling the truth there. That that was his logic was like, oh,

1175
01:05:09,560 --> 01:05:12,520
Speaker 2: the markets respond well to peace. Let me see if

1176
01:05:12,600 --> 01:05:14,400
Speaker 2: I can do something in that direction.

1177
01:05:15,200 --> 01:05:15,720
Speaker 10: So I don't know.

1178
01:05:15,880 --> 01:05:17,400
Speaker 2: Maybe Joe Kenna had something to do with it. I

1179
01:05:17,440 --> 01:05:19,120
Speaker 2: would love to think that Trita had something to do

1180
01:05:19,240 --> 01:05:20,840
Speaker 2: with it. I think it probably had a lot more

1181
01:05:20,880 --> 01:05:23,120
Speaker 2: to do with him watching the lines go up on

1182
01:05:23,200 --> 01:05:25,640
Speaker 2: the market and the lines go down on our strategic

1183
01:05:25,680 --> 01:05:26,560
Speaker 2: patrol and reserve.

1184
01:05:27,040 --> 01:05:27,240
Speaker 13: Yeah.

1185
01:05:27,240 --> 01:05:28,080
Speaker 7: I don't disagree with that.

1186
01:05:28,160 --> 01:05:30,440
Speaker 8: I think when people put rhetoric that frames it a

1187
01:05:30,480 --> 01:05:31,720
Speaker 8: certain way in a silver platter.

1188
01:05:31,800 --> 01:05:33,560
Speaker 7: For him, it's helpful though, if that makes sense.

1189
01:05:33,440 --> 01:05:35,280
Speaker 10: Like if you if you can, like he can sort

1190
01:05:35,320 --> 01:05:36,000
Speaker 10: of grab onto it.

1191
01:05:36,560 --> 01:05:39,240
Speaker 3: Yeah right right, yeah here for Emily, the free price

1192
01:05:39,360 --> 01:05:41,560
Speaker 3: is gonna call to deport Joe Kent next.

1193
01:05:42,000 --> 01:05:43,520
Speaker 4: Sorry, Ryan, go for what you're going to say.

1194
01:05:43,560 --> 01:05:48,280
Speaker 5: So just actually to Crystal's point, he mentioned Hoover in

1195
01:05:48,880 --> 01:05:52,080
Speaker 5: separate occasions in that in that hour long press conference

1196
01:05:52,160 --> 01:05:54,600
Speaker 5: that he gave, and he said, he said, I don't

1197
01:05:54,600 --> 01:05:57,440
Speaker 5: want to be a Hoover, Like he really cares about

1198
01:05:57,560 --> 01:06:01,880
Speaker 5: how he's remembered he has. He mentioned before Carter that

1199
01:06:02,000 --> 01:06:04,800
Speaker 5: he was very nervous about a rescue operation or going

1200
01:06:04,880 --> 01:06:07,600
Speaker 5: in to get the uranium because what if the helicopters

1201
01:06:07,640 --> 01:06:09,920
Speaker 5: go down and then he becomes Carter as a result

1202
01:06:09,960 --> 01:06:12,800
Speaker 5: of that. And so the two presidents I think that

1203
01:06:12,880 --> 01:06:15,840
Speaker 5: are seared into his mind as failures in the last

1204
01:06:15,880 --> 01:06:19,160
Speaker 5: one hundred plus years are Hoover and Carter. And he

1205
01:06:19,840 --> 01:06:22,840
Speaker 5: absolutely he wants his name, you know, bringing out on

1206
01:06:23,600 --> 01:06:27,760
Speaker 5: monuments and statues and buildings and airports. He doesn't want

1207
01:06:27,800 --> 01:06:31,440
Speaker 5: to be associated with because he knows that you can

1208
01:06:31,560 --> 01:06:36,320
Speaker 5: become a symbol of like weakness and failure like Hoover.

1209
01:06:36,840 --> 01:06:39,240
Speaker 5: And he's like, never mind, I don't want that. He

1210
01:06:39,280 --> 01:06:41,720
Speaker 5: thought he was going to be the guy that Yeah,

1211
01:06:41,720 --> 01:06:42,680
Speaker 5: he thought he was going to be the guy that

1212
01:06:42,800 --> 01:06:45,240
Speaker 5: ended the Iranian Revolution and that would be his thing.

1213
01:06:46,640 --> 01:06:49,960
Speaker 5: He clearly sees that's not going to happen. So to

1214
01:06:50,040 --> 01:06:52,840
Speaker 5: get some marginal advantage at the risk of becoming Hoover,

1215
01:06:52,960 --> 01:06:53,640
Speaker 5: He's like, forget it.

1216
01:06:53,680 --> 01:06:54,040
Speaker 6: I'm out.

1217
01:06:55,000 --> 01:06:58,600
Speaker 3: So Ryan, your boy or our boy Julian of Dropside,

1218
01:06:58,640 --> 01:07:03,080
Speaker 3: our boy on the Hill has and talking to more politicians,

1219
01:07:03,160 --> 01:07:05,000
Speaker 3: more GOP let's take a listen.

1220
01:07:05,280 --> 01:07:07,400
Speaker 11: Doing in Iran. He went in with no plan, he

1221
01:07:07,480 --> 01:07:10,560
Speaker 11: had no plan to get out, and we are the losers,

1222
01:07:10,600 --> 01:07:12,640
Speaker 11: and Iran is laughing all the way to the bank.

1223
01:07:13,120 --> 01:07:14,720
Speaker 6: Dropsites Julian Andreoni here.

1224
01:07:14,800 --> 01:07:17,280
Speaker 7: Now that President Trump has signed the Memorandum.

1225
01:07:16,840 --> 01:07:19,320
Speaker 17: Of Understanding to end the war with Iran, one might

1226
01:07:19,360 --> 01:07:21,840
Speaker 17: expect senators who criticized the war while that was going

1227
01:07:21,920 --> 01:07:24,760
Speaker 17: on to come out in support of this new piece

1228
01:07:24,800 --> 01:07:27,360
Speaker 17: that's been reached. Regardless of how much of a loss

1229
01:07:27,400 --> 01:07:30,160
Speaker 17: the details seemed to signify, you wouldn't expect them to

1230
01:07:30,240 --> 01:07:32,840
Speaker 17: get more hawkish and try to drag the US back

1231
01:07:32,880 --> 01:07:35,000
Speaker 17: into a war that they didn't support in the first place.

1232
01:07:35,360 --> 01:07:37,000
Speaker 17: I wanted to test this theory, so I came up

1233
01:07:37,000 --> 01:07:39,600
Speaker 17: to Capitol Hill and asked senators about President Trump's comments

1234
01:07:39,640 --> 01:07:40,640
Speaker 17: at the G seven summit.

1235
01:07:40,760 --> 01:07:41,680
Speaker 6: Let's see what they had to say.

1236
01:07:41,760 --> 01:07:46,120
Speaker 14: All of a sudden, a lot of these senators who

1237
01:07:46,400 --> 01:07:52,800
Speaker 14: were willing to completely ignore their constitutional responsibilities with respect

1238
01:07:52,840 --> 01:07:57,400
Speaker 14: to getting into the war, suddenly you're interested in making

1239
01:07:57,400 --> 01:07:58,720
Speaker 14: it harder to get out of the world.

1240
01:07:59,040 --> 01:08:02,920
Speaker 15: I think as lack of understanding of that foreign policy

1241
01:08:03,480 --> 01:08:07,800
Speaker 15: and a total capitulation to Iran and an insult to

1242
01:08:08,120 --> 01:08:13,440
Speaker 15: our partners in the Middle East who have been attacked

1243
01:08:13,560 --> 01:08:14,880
Speaker 15: by Iran as part of.

1244
01:08:14,920 --> 01:08:19,400
Speaker 17: This, our partners in the Middle East, that Democrat on

1245
01:08:19,479 --> 01:08:22,800
Speaker 17: arm what exactly gives the US jurisdiction.

1246
01:08:23,680 --> 01:08:28,040
Speaker 11: Iran is the leading state sponsor of Iran and its

1247
01:08:28,120 --> 01:08:31,480
Speaker 11: proxies have terrorized the world for over forty.

1248
01:08:31,600 --> 01:08:33,760
Speaker 14: Hours and been with us.

1249
01:08:33,840 --> 01:08:36,040
Speaker 1: We we are their mental enemy.

1250
01:08:36,439 --> 01:08:38,880
Speaker 13: They're going to reap They're going to take that billion

1251
01:08:39,000 --> 01:08:41,320
Speaker 13: dollars the Trump is turned on for him in this

1252
01:08:41,560 --> 01:08:43,840
Speaker 13: m o U, and they're going to build more bombs

1253
01:08:43,880 --> 01:08:45,520
Speaker 13: and say death to America.

1254
01:08:46,640 --> 01:08:48,000
Speaker 6: If Saudi already had them.

1255
01:08:48,080 --> 01:08:50,000
Speaker 18: They've never threaten to kill us and haven't been killed

1256
01:08:50,120 --> 01:08:53,679
Speaker 18: us for decades, right, Iran has And so I was, well,

1257
01:08:54,439 --> 01:08:57,080
Speaker 18: you know, tried to go or you would ever say

1258
01:08:57,120 --> 01:09:00,519
Speaker 18: that's something that makes sense, change and be in a

1259
01:09:00,560 --> 01:09:02,879
Speaker 18: position that we are all once or twice they don't continue.

1260
01:09:03,000 --> 01:09:06,560
Speaker 3: Lot people would disagree, all right, that's a flavor I

1261
01:09:06,600 --> 01:09:07,320
Speaker 3: misspoken said.

1262
01:09:07,320 --> 01:09:11,640
Speaker 4: It was just you a p It was a bipartisan reflections.

1263
01:09:11,280 --> 01:09:13,280
Speaker 10: Mostly Democrats there, mostly Democrats.

1264
01:09:13,280 --> 01:09:15,599
Speaker 2: I think it's only work Scott at the end, right, Yeah,

1265
01:09:15,640 --> 01:09:18,960
Speaker 2: I mean, look, I Chris Van Holland great response about

1266
01:09:19,840 --> 01:09:22,360
Speaker 2: you know, they were totally cool with hey, President, you

1267
01:09:22,400 --> 01:09:24,120
Speaker 2: can go to war, and now that we want a piece,

1268
01:09:24,160 --> 01:09:26,919
Speaker 2: they're like, oh, Congress means to weigh ins. I appreciate

1269
01:09:27,000 --> 01:09:30,200
Speaker 2: his response there. There is a lot of people, a

1270
01:09:30,240 --> 01:09:32,360
Speaker 2: lot of people are just completely missing the mark. I mean,

1271
01:09:32,439 --> 01:09:36,320
Speaker 2: Jackie Rosen's comments there were disgraceful, you know, just very

1272
01:09:36,400 --> 01:09:37,960
Speaker 2: I mean they sound like a you sound like a

1273
01:09:38,040 --> 01:09:42,599
Speaker 2: Republican criticizing the Obama deal. Oh it's week o, you know, capitulation. Look,

1274
01:09:42,680 --> 01:09:46,479
Speaker 2: it's true, we are having to capitulate. That problem is

1275
01:09:46,560 --> 01:09:48,760
Speaker 2: the war. The problem is not the getting out of

1276
01:09:48,840 --> 01:09:51,080
Speaker 2: the war. And yet she's doing the whole you know,

1277
01:09:51,200 --> 01:09:53,600
Speaker 2: right wing song and dance, which just feeds into the

1278
01:09:53,960 --> 01:09:56,680
Speaker 2: neo con talking points and leads us back to a

1279
01:09:56,840 --> 01:09:59,120
Speaker 2: logic of that's why we need to go back to

1280
01:09:59,240 --> 01:10:01,280
Speaker 2: the war, that's why we need to hit them even

1281
01:10:01,320 --> 01:10:03,800
Speaker 2: harder and send the ground troops and have our men

1282
01:10:03,840 --> 01:10:07,960
Speaker 2: and women die in larger numbers in Iran. So, yeah,

1283
01:10:08,640 --> 01:10:12,400
Speaker 2: there's some there are some Democrats who you know, have

1284
01:10:12,520 --> 01:10:14,519
Speaker 2: said reasonable things, and I think it's fine to be

1285
01:10:14,640 --> 01:10:17,720
Speaker 2: critical of how we got here, but there's far too

1286
01:10:17,800 --> 01:10:21,599
Speaker 2: much of the Fox News sounding talking points. I got

1287
01:10:21,640 --> 01:10:23,280
Speaker 2: into a little back and forth with Tim Miller the

1288
01:10:23,320 --> 01:10:25,160
Speaker 2: Bulwark about this, because he was like, this is a

1289
01:10:25,240 --> 01:10:26,240
Speaker 2: gift to the Mullas.

1290
01:10:26,720 --> 01:10:27,439
Speaker 7: No, it's not.

1291
01:10:27,800 --> 01:10:31,680
Speaker 2: First of all, like I hate the Mullah's language is

1292
01:10:31,880 --> 01:10:35,000
Speaker 2: very you know, very fox News coded. But also it's

1293
01:10:35,040 --> 01:10:37,439
Speaker 2: not a gift. This is what you have to do

1294
01:10:37,560 --> 01:10:40,400
Speaker 2: when you lose a war, which is what happened here.

1295
01:10:41,040 --> 01:10:43,360
Speaker 2: So you know, there is not a better deal on

1296
01:10:43,479 --> 01:10:45,639
Speaker 2: the table at this moment, because we lost the war,

1297
01:10:45,720 --> 01:10:47,960
Speaker 2: and because we really don't have any other good options.

1298
01:10:48,080 --> 01:10:51,720
Speaker 2: This is the best of the terrible options that are

1299
01:10:51,760 --> 01:10:54,360
Speaker 2: available to us, given the fact that we entered this

1300
01:10:54,479 --> 01:10:55,160
Speaker 2: war to begin with.

1301
01:10:56,720 --> 01:10:58,360
Speaker 6: Yeah, that's a really good point. It's not a gift.

1302
01:10:58,400 --> 01:11:01,240
Speaker 5: We entered into negotiations with them in the twenty tens

1303
01:11:01,240 --> 01:11:04,879
Speaker 5: because we wanted something from them. We wanted some regional stability,

1304
01:11:05,160 --> 01:11:07,120
Speaker 5: wanted them to agree to give up their you know,

1305
01:11:07,240 --> 01:11:10,240
Speaker 5: nuclear you know, to give up the nuclear program, a

1306
01:11:10,240 --> 01:11:12,920
Speaker 5: lowan and inspectors, so that the US could then kind

1307
01:11:12,960 --> 01:11:15,080
Speaker 5: of pivot away from the Middle East and go worry

1308
01:11:15,080 --> 01:11:16,960
Speaker 5: about our other problems in the world. Like we wanted

1309
01:11:17,000 --> 01:11:19,880
Speaker 5: something from them, they gave it to us, and then

1310
01:11:19,920 --> 01:11:23,719
Speaker 5: we when we ripped it up, and so like Elizabeth

1311
01:11:23,720 --> 01:11:27,040
Speaker 5: Warren's right, like we didn't. We don't have anything better

1312
01:11:27,200 --> 01:11:29,519
Speaker 5: than we had in twenty fifteen. In fact, it's probably worse.

1313
01:11:30,200 --> 01:11:32,080
Speaker 5: And the cost of all these lives, and not just

1314
01:11:32,160 --> 01:11:35,240
Speaker 5: the lives, the like reimposition of all those sanctions on

1315
01:11:35,320 --> 01:11:38,040
Speaker 5: a country of ninety million people, Like the amount of

1316
01:11:38,760 --> 01:11:42,960
Speaker 5: hunger and misery and lives that were you know, whose

1317
01:11:43,000 --> 01:11:47,800
Speaker 5: trajectory was was altered dramatically, Like the destruction of you know,

1318
01:11:48,160 --> 01:11:51,240
Speaker 5: professional educational opportunities for ninety million people. It never really

1319
01:11:51,240 --> 01:11:54,640
Speaker 5: gets discussed, but to a miserate a country of that

1320
01:11:54,800 --> 01:11:59,200
Speaker 5: size is producing an amount of human suffering among a

1321
01:11:59,280 --> 01:12:04,720
Speaker 5: completely in population, and not only for nothing but to

1322
01:12:05,760 --> 01:12:09,400
Speaker 5: kind of move us backward from what our stated objectives were.

1323
01:12:10,160 --> 01:12:14,920
Speaker 4: Yeah, Emily, final thought, here will the GOP.

1324
01:12:15,240 --> 01:12:18,840
Speaker 3: Will the Republicans eventually come to terms with this and

1325
01:12:19,520 --> 01:12:22,880
Speaker 3: following Trump's footsteps, start supporting him in this endeavor, or

1326
01:12:23,000 --> 01:12:27,200
Speaker 3: will they continue to have pushback on this deal?

1327
01:12:28,439 --> 01:12:30,839
Speaker 7: I mean, I suppose it just depends on what happens

1328
01:12:30,920 --> 01:12:31,479
Speaker 7: going forward.

1329
01:12:31,520 --> 01:12:33,920
Speaker 8: I expect that it'll crumble, but it will probably crumble

1330
01:12:34,120 --> 01:12:37,040
Speaker 8: in a slightly lower profile way, as we were talking

1331
01:12:37,040 --> 01:12:38,680
Speaker 8: about earlier in the show. I don't I mean, I

1332
01:12:38,800 --> 01:12:42,400
Speaker 8: just I don't know. But the bottom line is that

1333
01:12:42,680 --> 01:12:45,320
Speaker 8: it was the same thing. After on January seventh, twenty

1334
01:12:45,400 --> 01:12:49,080
Speaker 8: twenty one. You could hear the sigh of relief in Washington, DC,

1335
01:12:49,520 --> 01:12:52,320
Speaker 8: especially coming from the Senate, because people thought they were

1336
01:12:52,400 --> 01:12:55,400
Speaker 8: just done with Donald Trump, and then very quickly they

1337
01:12:55,479 --> 01:12:59,600
Speaker 8: realized that thirty percent of Republican voters were still hardcore

1338
01:13:00,200 --> 01:13:04,320
Speaker 8: in Trump's corner, and so most like most American voters,

1339
01:13:04,320 --> 01:13:09,800
Speaker 8: aren't like deep foreign policy ideologues. They're pragmatic, and it's

1340
01:13:09,880 --> 01:13:12,799
Speaker 8: it's partially what people saw in Donald Trump as a benefit,

1341
01:13:12,960 --> 01:13:15,320
Speaker 8: but they stick with Trump. If you have thirty percent

1342
01:13:15,479 --> 01:13:20,080
Speaker 8: of Republican voters who are attached to Donald Trump, you

1343
01:13:20,200 --> 01:13:23,120
Speaker 8: really can't get away from that because it's too for

1344
01:13:23,240 --> 01:13:27,200
Speaker 8: your own reelection purposes. It's too hard to sort of

1345
01:13:27,280 --> 01:13:30,120
Speaker 8: sever ties with Trump. So that always means that on

1346
01:13:30,280 --> 01:13:32,639
Speaker 8: individual policies, yes, they can be critical. They can try

1347
01:13:32,640 --> 01:13:34,960
Speaker 8: to put daylight between themselves and Trump, as Ted Cruz

1348
01:13:35,000 --> 01:13:35,639
Speaker 8: did just there.

1349
01:13:36,080 --> 01:13:37,960
Speaker 7: That's why they're immediately taking.

1350
01:13:37,760 --> 01:13:39,759
Speaker 8: Up a lot of what you're hearing in Israel about

1351
01:13:39,920 --> 01:13:44,040
Speaker 8: the vancification or the Tucker carlsonification of jd Vance. That

1352
01:13:44,160 --> 01:13:46,599
Speaker 8: this is the Dvance Deal, the Vanced Deal, the Vance Deal,

1353
01:13:47,000 --> 01:13:49,160
Speaker 8: and so that's already a preview of how they're trying

1354
01:13:49,160 --> 01:13:54,320
Speaker 8: to handle this. But there's no severing ties with Trump

1355
01:13:54,400 --> 01:13:57,960
Speaker 8: basically unless you're Tom Tillis or Bill Cassidy.

1356
01:13:57,760 --> 01:14:00,400
Speaker 7: And you don't need to get elected again. Yeah, in

1357
01:14:00,439 --> 01:14:02,640
Speaker 7: that case you can do it, but otherwise.

1358
01:14:02,320 --> 01:14:05,840
Speaker 4: No, All right, Well that does it for that.

1359
01:14:06,360 --> 01:14:10,880
Speaker 3: Ryan, you did an interview recently with malt Kiros and

1360
01:14:10,920 --> 01:14:11,679
Speaker 3: Julia Gonzalez.

1361
01:14:11,680 --> 01:14:12,560
Speaker 4: Tell us a little bit about that.

1362
01:14:13,640 --> 01:14:13,840
Speaker 6: Yeah.

1363
01:14:13,920 --> 01:14:16,960
Speaker 5: Last weekend, Hassan Piker went to Denver for a rally

1364
01:14:17,160 --> 01:14:20,240
Speaker 5: with may Lot Kiros, who's running against Diana de Guet

1365
01:14:20,479 --> 01:14:24,759
Speaker 5: in Colorado, and Julie Gonzalez, who was running for Senate

1366
01:14:24,800 --> 01:14:27,800
Speaker 5: against John Hickenlooper, the incumbent Democratic Center. Both of them

1367
01:14:27,840 --> 01:14:31,880
Speaker 5: are within striking distance in this June thirtieth primary. They're

1368
01:14:31,880 --> 01:14:34,160
Speaker 5: also going to be joined, i believe by Donovan McKinney

1369
01:14:34,200 --> 01:14:38,439
Speaker 5: and Justin Pearson, who are kind of rising stars.

1370
01:14:38,840 --> 01:14:40,160
Speaker 6: I'm releive Michigan and.

1371
01:14:40,240 --> 01:14:46,600
Speaker 5: Tennessee and venue after venue after venue after signing the

1372
01:14:46,680 --> 01:14:49,800
Speaker 5: contract with them, canceled with the final and we'll talk

1373
01:14:49,800 --> 01:14:52,280
Speaker 5: about this in the interview with the final venue, telling

1374
01:14:52,360 --> 01:14:54,439
Speaker 5: them you didn't tell me this was a new Nazi rally.

1375
01:14:55,560 --> 01:15:02,960
Speaker 5: This is this is two African American politicians, one Ethiopian American,

1376
01:15:03,840 --> 01:15:07,880
Speaker 5: one Chikanah and then Hassan Piker would be the only

1377
01:15:07,960 --> 01:15:10,960
Speaker 5: kind of whiteish, even remotely whiteish.

1378
01:15:11,160 --> 01:15:13,760
Speaker 6: Person at this rally UH.

1379
01:15:13,960 --> 01:15:16,240
Speaker 5: And they ended up having to move it to the

1380
01:15:16,760 --> 01:15:20,840
Speaker 5: capital steps because everybody else they called around was told,

1381
01:15:21,320 --> 01:15:24,360
Speaker 5: we've been told not to not to rent to you guys,

1382
01:15:25,479 --> 01:15:27,439
Speaker 5: and so the real estate industry there.

1383
01:15:29,280 --> 01:15:34,320
Speaker 6: I think there have been plenty of populist candidates who.

1384
01:15:34,320 --> 01:15:37,439
Speaker 5: Have run UH and their interest clash with the real

1385
01:15:37,520 --> 01:15:40,320
Speaker 5: estate lobby, and they don't get blocked by venues. So

1386
01:15:40,439 --> 01:15:44,000
Speaker 5: I don't think this is primarily a real estate lobby

1387
01:15:44,320 --> 01:15:46,920
Speaker 5: kind of class issue. I think this is these are

1388
01:15:46,960 --> 01:15:50,640
Speaker 5: all anti genocide candidates, and I think this is a

1389
01:15:50,800 --> 01:15:52,800
Speaker 5: kind of a pro Israel pushback.

1390
01:15:54,160 --> 01:15:54,240
Speaker 8: So.

1391
01:15:56,720 --> 01:16:00,639
Speaker 3: Particular lightning around Yeah, okay, well let's let's hear from

1392
01:16:00,680 --> 01:16:02,439
Speaker 3: them about all that, and we'll see you on the

1393
01:16:02,520 --> 01:16:03,000
Speaker 3: other side.

1394
01:16:04,080 --> 01:16:06,640
Speaker 5: So, in a rather shocking development that cuts against our

1395
01:16:06,720 --> 01:16:09,639
Speaker 5: idea that we are a free society that encourages debate.

1396
01:16:10,240 --> 01:16:14,240
Speaker 5: Last weekend in Denver, a series of town halls, a

1397
01:16:14,320 --> 01:16:18,120
Speaker 5: series of political rallies were canceled as one venue after

1398
01:16:18,240 --> 01:16:24,360
Speaker 5: another shut down the ability of major political candidates to

1399
01:16:24,520 --> 01:16:29,840
Speaker 5: host an event there. Hassan Piker, the notorious streamer at

1400
01:16:29,880 --> 01:16:32,680
Speaker 5: this point kind of the focus of Third Way and

1401
01:16:32,760 --> 01:16:36,439
Speaker 5: the centrist element of the Democratic Party, was supposed to

1402
01:16:36,600 --> 01:16:41,040
Speaker 5: rally with congressional candidate may Lot Kiros and Senate candidate

1403
01:16:41,280 --> 01:16:46,519
Speaker 5: Julie Gonzalez, but venue after venue canceled, and so the

1404
01:16:46,720 --> 01:16:49,040
Speaker 5: event later had to be moved to in front of

1405
01:16:49,120 --> 01:16:53,040
Speaker 5: the state Capitol, which is apparently still public space. We're

1406
01:16:53,040 --> 01:16:55,759
Speaker 5: going to be joined by them in a moment. Actually,

1407
01:16:55,840 --> 01:16:58,640
Speaker 5: let's just bring them on right now. Julia Gonzalez and

1408
01:16:58,680 --> 01:17:01,639
Speaker 5: may Lot Kiros. Thank you, Thank you Julie for being here.

1409
01:17:02,600 --> 01:17:04,000
Speaker 13: Thank you so much for the opportunity.

1410
01:17:04,479 --> 01:17:06,680
Speaker 6: May Lot, thank you really appreciate it.

1411
01:17:07,520 --> 01:17:08,439
Speaker 16: Yeah, I happy to be here.

1412
01:17:08,960 --> 01:17:10,400
Speaker 6: And so I wanted to start with.

1413
01:17:10,439 --> 01:17:13,960
Speaker 5: A clip from Deep Badasha, who is a political consultant

1414
01:17:14,200 --> 01:17:14,479
Speaker 5: may A Lot.

1415
01:17:14,560 --> 01:17:16,040
Speaker 6: Is he on your campaign? Is that right?

1416
01:17:17,000 --> 01:17:18,560
Speaker 16: He's a volunteer at the campaign.

1417
01:17:18,439 --> 01:17:22,040
Speaker 5: Volunteer, volunteer in your camp. So he was, he was organizing,

1418
01:17:22,080 --> 01:17:24,479
Speaker 5: he was getting the venues together. He's done this with

1419
01:17:24,680 --> 01:17:29,400
Speaker 5: his with his team countless times. And here here's here

1420
01:17:29,479 --> 01:17:33,000
Speaker 5: he is briefly on the day that this is going down,

1421
01:17:33,400 --> 01:17:37,240
Speaker 5: talking to Stan Piker about what had unfolded and listened

1422
01:17:37,240 --> 01:17:39,960
Speaker 5: closely because this is a rather disturbing situation.

1423
01:17:41,040 --> 01:17:42,960
Speaker 19: And we show up the day up. So today we

1424
01:17:43,120 --> 01:17:46,120
Speaker 19: go in there and he looks pretty emotional and he's like,

1425
01:17:46,240 --> 01:17:49,080
Speaker 19: he's like, I've been getting blown up my phone all

1426
01:17:49,200 --> 01:17:52,320
Speaker 19: morning from people who own this place and the people

1427
01:17:52,320 --> 01:17:54,120
Speaker 19: who own like the lots, the people who own malls

1428
01:17:54,120 --> 01:17:58,160
Speaker 19: around here, like high up in like corporations, saying you

1429
01:17:58,280 --> 01:18:00,559
Speaker 19: can't do this event here. He said, people were thrown

1430
01:18:00,600 --> 01:18:05,160
Speaker 19: in with defamation lawsuits, that deflamation lawsuits, and then me

1431
01:18:05,240 --> 01:18:06,880
Speaker 19: and my wife are attorneys and were like, that's not

1432
01:18:06,960 --> 01:18:08,880
Speaker 19: how this defamation would work at all. That's not how

1433
01:18:08,960 --> 01:18:09,519
Speaker 19: this would work.

1434
01:18:10,040 --> 01:18:11,160
Speaker 7: And he was spooped.

1435
01:18:11,400 --> 01:18:13,200
Speaker 19: He's like, people blew up my phone. I've never seen

1436
01:18:13,240 --> 01:18:14,719
Speaker 19: this before. I'm a small business.

1437
01:18:14,840 --> 01:18:15,760
Speaker 9: I can't do this.

1438
01:18:15,880 --> 01:18:17,920
Speaker 19: They're telling me it's a safety risk. And this is

1439
01:18:17,960 --> 01:18:20,400
Speaker 19: the craziest thing is he's like, you didn't tell me

1440
01:18:20,479 --> 01:18:23,280
Speaker 19: it was a neo Nazi rally, and I was like, okay,

1441
01:18:23,720 --> 01:18:26,920
Speaker 19: what and you were there? Yeah, yeah, I was shocked

1442
01:18:26,960 --> 01:18:28,760
Speaker 19: when he said that, and I was like, first off,

1443
01:18:28,800 --> 01:18:32,320
Speaker 19: look at the poster. It's like three black candidates. Julli

1444
01:18:32,320 --> 01:18:34,880
Speaker 19: Gonzales was Latino and then a Turkish muslim man.

1445
01:18:35,000 --> 01:18:38,320
Speaker 6: What kind of neo Nazi rally is that? So a

1446
01:18:38,439 --> 01:18:39,400
Speaker 6: neo Nazi rally?

1447
01:18:39,400 --> 01:18:44,559
Speaker 5: These are progressive populist candidates running in Colorado, Julia running

1448
01:18:44,600 --> 01:18:49,760
Speaker 5: against Senator Heck and Looper or the incumbent democrat May Lott.

1449
01:18:49,760 --> 01:18:55,320
Speaker 5: You're running against Diana Guett, incumbent democrat there. I don't

1450
01:18:55,360 --> 01:19:00,400
Speaker 5: know anything about a neo Nazi platform. It's like absolutely

1451
01:19:00,400 --> 01:19:03,680
Speaker 5: mind boggling. Julie, I want to start with you. Have

1452
01:19:03,800 --> 01:19:09,479
Speaker 5: you heard anything since then about who led this pressure

1453
01:19:09,560 --> 01:19:11,960
Speaker 5: campaign and how this happened.

1454
01:19:13,800 --> 01:19:19,799
Speaker 13: I'll just say that genuinely, to see cancelation after cancelation

1455
01:19:19,880 --> 01:19:26,479
Speaker 13: after cancelation was pretty unprecedented. And I haven't heard since

1456
01:19:27,120 --> 01:19:33,080
Speaker 13: the rally concluded any more, you know, game playing with

1457
01:19:33,280 --> 01:19:36,320
Speaker 13: any of our other events, and so I'm grateful for that.

1458
01:19:36,760 --> 01:19:40,519
Speaker 13: But what is clear in this moment is that the

1459
01:19:40,640 --> 01:19:46,240
Speaker 13: oligarchs and the corporations that they control are really trying

1460
01:19:46,360 --> 01:19:50,479
Speaker 13: to build a campaign to stop working people from taking

1461
01:19:50,560 --> 01:19:53,799
Speaker 13: the power that is rightfully ours in this upcoming election.

1462
01:19:54,880 --> 01:19:58,679
Speaker 5: Yeah, so you're running against Diana to Gett, who's longtime

1463
01:19:59,200 --> 01:20:03,640
Speaker 5: Democrat and Democratic. In comment, she seems to be pretty

1464
01:20:03,680 --> 01:20:09,400
Speaker 5: concerned the election is coming on June thirtieth. Did you

1465
01:20:09,520 --> 01:20:13,320
Speaker 5: get any sense of where this pressure came from.

1466
01:20:15,120 --> 01:20:18,840
Speaker 20: Well, the congresswoman has been signaling to her donors for

1467
01:20:18,920 --> 01:20:22,840
Speaker 20: about a week now to levy some horrifically racist and

1468
01:20:22,960 --> 01:20:24,639
Speaker 20: dangerous attacks against myself.

1469
01:20:25,040 --> 01:20:27,120
Speaker 16: On the morning of the event, she.

1470
01:20:27,640 --> 01:20:31,320
Speaker 20: Made a post accusing Hassan Piker of anti Semitism and

1471
01:20:31,400 --> 01:20:35,200
Speaker 20: being a bigot. So while I don't know exactly who

1472
01:20:35,280 --> 01:20:37,559
Speaker 20: was responsible for this, I know who has been calling

1473
01:20:37,680 --> 01:20:41,080
Speaker 20: in her donors and her supporters to attack me and

1474
01:20:41,160 --> 01:20:43,879
Speaker 20: to attack the ideals and the policies of this campaign.

1475
01:20:44,360 --> 01:20:47,360
Speaker 20: And so ultimately this comes down to the people versus

1476
01:20:47,400 --> 01:20:50,360
Speaker 20: the oligarchy. This comes down to people in power trying

1477
01:20:50,400 --> 01:20:54,600
Speaker 20: to suppress speech and to silence our descent against the

1478
01:20:54,680 --> 01:20:56,160
Speaker 20: system as it exists today.

1479
01:20:56,280 --> 01:20:59,760
Speaker 16: And it didn't work. We took this rally to the

1480
01:21:00,040 --> 01:21:01,280
Speaker 16: little steps and within just.

1481
01:21:02,000 --> 01:21:04,200
Speaker 20: A few hours notice we had over a thousand Denver

1482
01:21:04,320 --> 01:21:07,519
Speaker 20: rights show up and hear our message and rally with

1483
01:21:07,680 --> 01:21:10,000
Speaker 20: us for our fight for a better world.

1484
01:21:11,240 --> 01:21:12,679
Speaker 5: May a lot, and then I'll have the same question

1485
01:21:12,720 --> 01:21:17,479
Speaker 5: for Julie basically, but what is it that, in your perspective,

1486
01:21:17,479 --> 01:21:21,320
Speaker 5: has given you kind of the opening? Traditionally, in kind

1487
01:21:21,320 --> 01:21:24,800
Speaker 5: of American politics, if you've been in office for decades,

1488
01:21:25,360 --> 01:21:28,479
Speaker 5: your name recognition is so high, You've done so many

1489
01:21:28,640 --> 01:21:30,840
Speaker 5: chicken dinners and so many potlucks, and you've met so

1490
01:21:30,920 --> 01:21:32,519
Speaker 5: many people in the district that it's very hard to

1491
01:21:33,040 --> 01:21:34,439
Speaker 5: kind of unseat and incumbent.

1492
01:21:35,040 --> 01:21:37,320
Speaker 6: What is it that has given the opening here?

1493
01:21:38,600 --> 01:21:41,720
Speaker 20: You know, I think there's certainly a mix of factors. Right,

1494
01:21:41,800 --> 01:21:43,720
Speaker 20: this is one of the most anti incumbent cycles that

1495
01:21:43,760 --> 01:21:46,639
Speaker 20: we've ever seen. The Democratic Party is looking at really

1496
01:21:46,760 --> 01:21:50,360
Speaker 20: abysmal approval ratings, and the electorate is ready for a change.

1497
01:21:50,520 --> 01:21:52,360
Speaker 16: But ultimately it's because we put in the work.

1498
01:21:52,680 --> 01:21:55,120
Speaker 20: We've been in this race for over eleven months now,

1499
01:21:55,200 --> 01:21:57,160
Speaker 20: and we started it off with me, my friend and

1500
01:21:57,240 --> 01:21:59,639
Speaker 20: a dream, and it was just us talking to voters

1501
01:21:59,680 --> 01:22:02,320
Speaker 20: and book stores and coffee shops and bars and restaurants

1502
01:22:02,360 --> 01:22:05,400
Speaker 20: and parks, meeting the voters where they're at having conversations

1503
01:22:05,400 --> 01:22:07,120
Speaker 20: about what kind of world they want to live in,

1504
01:22:07,200 --> 01:22:08,680
Speaker 20: what kind of country they want to see, and what

1505
01:22:08,800 --> 01:22:11,439
Speaker 20: kind of policies and leaders they want to see fighting

1506
01:22:11,520 --> 01:22:14,439
Speaker 20: for us. And we've been making having those conversations for

1507
01:22:14,560 --> 01:22:17,400
Speaker 20: eleven months and the people we spoke with spoke with

1508
01:22:17,479 --> 01:22:21,080
Speaker 20: their neighbors, their coworkers, their family friends, and we've reached

1509
01:22:21,120 --> 01:22:23,360
Speaker 20: a point now where there are enough Denver rights that

1510
01:22:23,600 --> 01:22:26,599
Speaker 20: know that there's a real progressive challenger in this race,

1511
01:22:26,680 --> 01:22:28,800
Speaker 20: that we don't have to settle for another thirty years

1512
01:22:28,800 --> 01:22:31,840
Speaker 20: of complacency, and that we can and do deserve better.

1513
01:22:33,080 --> 01:22:33,240
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1514
01:22:33,439 --> 01:22:37,040
Speaker 5: And Julie John Hickenlooper is you know was correct, was

1515
01:22:37,080 --> 01:22:40,559
Speaker 5: mayor of Denver, ben senator now for.

1516
01:22:42,080 --> 01:22:42,720
Speaker 6: Quite some time.

1517
01:22:43,880 --> 01:22:46,559
Speaker 5: Kind of a well liked, you know, jovial kind of figure,

1518
01:22:47,720 --> 01:22:53,639
Speaker 5: but maybe appropriate for a different Colorado. Has something changing

1519
01:22:53,720 --> 01:22:57,560
Speaker 5: in Colorado that has put him out of step and

1520
01:22:58,600 --> 01:23:00,280
Speaker 5: out of step with the current mood.

1521
01:23:01,439 --> 01:23:02,040
Speaker 16: Absolutely.

1522
01:23:02,760 --> 01:23:07,880
Speaker 13: Look, I started organizing everyday people twenty years ago around

1523
01:23:08,000 --> 01:23:12,400
Speaker 13: affordable housing issues, educational justice concerns.

1524
01:23:12,040 --> 01:23:13,120
Speaker 16: And immigrant rights.

1525
01:23:13,600 --> 01:23:16,560
Speaker 13: And we did that work back when it was bipartisan

1526
01:23:16,640 --> 01:23:20,200
Speaker 13: to be anti immigrant, and we have done the work

1527
01:23:20,400 --> 01:23:24,879
Speaker 13: over the years to flip Colorado from being a trifecta

1528
01:23:25,000 --> 01:23:28,479
Speaker 13: red state to now being a trifecta blue state. I'm

1529
01:23:28,560 --> 01:23:32,559
Speaker 13: proud of that work. And yet to see that John

1530
01:23:32,640 --> 01:23:38,040
Speaker 13: Hickenlooper is still engaging in the politics of centrist incrementalism

1531
01:23:38,800 --> 01:23:42,719
Speaker 13: does not meet the rage that Colorado's are feeling about

1532
01:23:42,720 --> 01:23:45,599
Speaker 13: the fact that they're working harder than ever and still

1533
01:23:46,439 --> 01:23:51,920
Speaker 13: can barely afford the cost of housing, groceries, gas, health care, childcare.

1534
01:23:53,360 --> 01:23:55,559
Speaker 13: And so to see that he has gone and voted

1535
01:23:55,600 --> 01:23:59,639
Speaker 13: for not one, not two, but ten different Trump Cabinet

1536
01:23:59,680 --> 01:24:04,240
Speaker 13: nominees in the second Trump administration, second only to Fetterman,

1537
01:24:04,800 --> 01:24:08,759
Speaker 13: demonstrates that he is not prepared to leave. He's also

1538
01:24:09,000 --> 01:24:14,040
Speaker 13: gone and skipped six different debate opportunities and is just

1539
01:24:14,240 --> 01:24:18,960
Speaker 13: trying to bone it in and mail it in. And look,

1540
01:24:19,040 --> 01:24:22,040
Speaker 13: I think Colorado's are hungry for change, and that's why

1541
01:24:22,560 --> 01:24:26,479
Speaker 13: our campaign is building so much momentum on the ground.

1542
01:24:26,880 --> 01:24:29,800
Speaker 13: It's clear we're not going to out fundraise Pick, but

1543
01:24:29,920 --> 01:24:32,479
Speaker 13: we sure as hell are going to outorganize him. And

1544
01:24:32,560 --> 01:24:35,599
Speaker 13: that's clear across the state of Colorado.

1545
01:24:37,320 --> 01:24:40,040
Speaker 5: And I saw a recent Paul had you had him

1546
01:24:40,080 --> 01:24:42,120
Speaker 5: and I think forty one and you at thirty four,

1547
01:24:42,240 --> 01:24:44,560
Speaker 5: which is, you know, obviously'd rather be ahead if you're you,

1548
01:24:44,720 --> 01:24:48,559
Speaker 5: but if you're the incumbent, being under fifty is usually

1549
01:24:48,680 --> 01:24:55,000
Speaker 5: a frightening sign. You know, heading into the election, how

1550
01:24:55,040 --> 01:24:57,880
Speaker 5: are you feeling and what's your sense of whether or

1551
01:24:57,920 --> 01:25:00,799
Speaker 5: not you're going to have kind of the name recognition

1552
01:25:00,880 --> 01:25:03,719
Speaker 5: and the resources to get out there by June thirtieth.

1553
01:25:04,400 --> 01:25:05,559
Speaker 16: Absolutely, what is.

1554
01:25:05,720 --> 01:25:08,760
Speaker 13: Clear in this moment is that no one's coming to

1555
01:25:08,840 --> 01:25:13,679
Speaker 13: save us but us and Colorado's as we've been traveling

1556
01:25:13,760 --> 01:25:17,960
Speaker 13: the state. Just yesterday, I was in north northern northwestern

1557
01:25:18,000 --> 01:25:21,800
Speaker 13: Colorado in Steamboat Springs talking to voters there, and they

1558
01:25:21,840 --> 01:25:25,800
Speaker 13: were so excited to hear from a candidate who's willing

1559
01:25:25,880 --> 01:25:30,080
Speaker 13: to just show up. It should not be that loa bar,

1560
01:25:30,640 --> 01:25:33,680
Speaker 13: and yet that is where we're at right now. And

1561
01:25:34,640 --> 01:25:38,400
Speaker 13: when we talk about the issues that are impacting our lives,

1562
01:25:38,680 --> 01:25:41,519
Speaker 13: the fact that billionaires and the corporations that they control

1563
01:25:41,920 --> 01:25:47,160
Speaker 13: are increasingly driving up profit and maintaining a status quo

1564
01:25:48,000 --> 01:25:53,679
Speaker 13: that lines their pockets while making us work three jobs

1565
01:25:53,720 --> 01:25:56,920
Speaker 13: plus a side hustle just to afford the basics. That

1566
01:25:57,200 --> 01:26:00,280
Speaker 13: is why even though John Kick Andlooper look get it,

1567
01:26:00,400 --> 01:26:06,040
Speaker 13: he enjoys basically universal name id, but Colorado's also cannot

1568
01:26:06,120 --> 01:26:08,960
Speaker 13: name a single thing that he has led on and

1569
01:26:09,160 --> 01:26:13,440
Speaker 13: fought for. And that's why we are gaining such incredible

1570
01:26:13,479 --> 01:26:16,960
Speaker 13: momentum here in the polls, and we have the opportunity

1571
01:26:17,040 --> 01:26:20,759
Speaker 13: to make history in Colorado and send a direct message

1572
01:26:21,080 --> 01:26:25,480
Speaker 13: to Chuck Schumer that his days of hand picking candidates

1573
01:26:25,640 --> 01:26:29,520
Speaker 13: are over and his days of supporting do nothing Democrats

1574
01:26:29,680 --> 01:26:30,120
Speaker 13: are done.

1575
01:26:31,280 --> 01:26:35,280
Speaker 6: And would you support Senator Schumer?

1576
01:26:35,640 --> 01:26:38,600
Speaker 5: Is it possible if you, let's say you win, you

1577
01:26:38,680 --> 01:26:42,200
Speaker 5: win election, or are you looking for somebody new to

1578
01:26:42,320 --> 01:26:44,240
Speaker 5: lead the Senate Democrats.

1579
01:26:45,760 --> 01:26:48,960
Speaker 13: I believe that Chuck Schumer has done a fine job

1580
01:26:49,439 --> 01:26:55,080
Speaker 13: of managing effectively the Democratic Party's dissent into fascism instead

1581
01:26:55,320 --> 01:26:58,519
Speaker 13: of leading the charge to fight tooth and nail against it.

1582
01:26:58,880 --> 01:27:01,519
Speaker 13: And so I will not be voting for Chuck Schumer

1583
01:27:01,600 --> 01:27:05,200
Speaker 13: to continue on as the majority leader of our caucus

1584
01:27:05,680 --> 01:27:10,800
Speaker 13: and instead want to fight for someone who will end

1585
01:27:10,960 --> 01:27:14,600
Speaker 13: our addiction to corporate pack money and dark money and

1586
01:27:14,880 --> 01:27:19,000
Speaker 13: instead return our Democratic Party to being a party driven

1587
01:27:19,120 --> 01:27:23,160
Speaker 13: by and dedicated to fighting for working people.

1588
01:27:23,880 --> 01:27:27,120
Speaker 5: And it may lot take one of the clearest indications

1589
01:27:27,160 --> 01:27:29,360
Speaker 5: that they're taking your race extraordinarily seriously, is there are

1590
01:27:29,400 --> 01:27:32,519
Speaker 5: now a bunch of attack ads. Super pack called Mile

1591
01:27:32,640 --> 01:27:36,000
Speaker 5: High Accountability is out with an ad saying that Trump

1592
01:27:36,120 --> 01:27:41,240
Speaker 5: loves you and Trump loves democrats like you. What you

1593
01:27:41,320 --> 01:27:43,880
Speaker 5: know is it are you are you seeing on the

1594
01:27:43,960 --> 01:27:47,519
Speaker 5: ground any impact of the negative advertising, and.

1595
01:27:49,040 --> 01:27:49,400
Speaker 4: How are you.

1596
01:27:49,439 --> 01:27:50,040
Speaker 6: Responding to it?

1597
01:27:51,520 --> 01:27:54,360
Speaker 20: Ironically, a lot of these advertisements are actually introducing me

1598
01:27:54,439 --> 01:27:57,320
Speaker 20: to a lot of Denver rights who immediately see the

1599
01:27:57,520 --> 01:28:03,479
Speaker 20: advertisement and see it as outlandish and cartoonish, even and

1600
01:28:03,880 --> 01:28:06,760
Speaker 20: especially when you can go straight to my website and

1601
01:28:06,920 --> 01:28:09,400
Speaker 20: our platform and see that I haven't called for any

1602
01:28:09,400 --> 01:28:11,560
Speaker 20: of the things that they're accusing me of calling for,

1603
01:28:12,720 --> 01:28:15,520
Speaker 20: and to also see that the congresswoman herself.

1604
01:28:15,560 --> 01:28:17,160
Speaker 16: Is putting up attack ads against me.

1605
01:28:17,320 --> 01:28:22,560
Speaker 20: She tried signaling to her super packs to attack me for,

1606
01:28:23,360 --> 01:28:26,559
Speaker 20: you know, standing up against genocide and you know, taking

1607
01:28:26,600 --> 01:28:28,759
Speaker 20: in the context of violence in the way that it happens,

1608
01:28:28,800 --> 01:28:30,400
Speaker 20: because it never happens in a vacuum.

1609
01:28:30,960 --> 01:28:32,840
Speaker 16: And when they didn't take the bait, she started posting

1610
01:28:32,920 --> 01:28:33,439
Speaker 16: it herself.

1611
01:28:33,920 --> 01:28:38,680
Speaker 20: And these advertisements have been incredibly racist and incredibly dangerous

1612
01:28:39,360 --> 01:28:43,080
Speaker 20: to the situation, And so I think it shows that

1613
01:28:43,160 --> 01:28:46,160
Speaker 20: they're scared I think it shows that Demi rights are

1614
01:28:46,280 --> 01:28:48,120
Speaker 20: are are making it very clear that they're ready for

1615
01:28:48,200 --> 01:28:51,000
Speaker 20: a change. And more than anything, I think it shows

1616
01:28:51,040 --> 01:28:55,000
Speaker 20: that the congresswoman wasted these last eleven months in her

1617
01:28:55,120 --> 01:28:57,400
Speaker 20: responsibility to make her case to the voters and why

1618
01:28:57,439 --> 01:29:00,240
Speaker 20: she should get a sixteenth term on top of the

1619
01:29:00,320 --> 01:29:02,760
Speaker 20: thirty years that she's really failed to meaningfully show up

1620
01:29:02,760 --> 01:29:05,639
Speaker 20: for the voters of this district. And now it's clear

1621
01:29:05,680 --> 01:29:08,320
Speaker 20: as day to the voters here as well that with

1622
01:29:08,439 --> 01:29:10,240
Speaker 20: the attack ads that are coming in, that she doesn't

1623
01:29:10,240 --> 01:29:12,160
Speaker 20: actually have a case to be made based on her

1624
01:29:12,240 --> 01:29:15,639
Speaker 20: record or based on her platform, and voters are seeing

1625
01:29:15,720 --> 01:29:18,599
Speaker 20: that our campaign, one that is grassroots and people powered

1626
01:29:18,800 --> 01:29:22,160
Speaker 20: and is supported by multiple members of the city Council,

1627
01:29:22,280 --> 01:29:24,360
Speaker 20: of the State House, of the state Senate, of different

1628
01:29:24,400 --> 01:29:28,240
Speaker 20: progressive organizations and unions across the district, that we are

1629
01:29:28,280 --> 01:29:30,920
Speaker 20: the real progressives in this race, and that it's time

1630
01:29:30,960 --> 01:29:31,519
Speaker 20: for a change.

1631
01:29:32,640 --> 01:29:35,799
Speaker 5: And Julie, what are you leading with in the campaign

1632
01:29:35,880 --> 01:29:40,640
Speaker 5: when it comes to trying to reach voters, like what

1633
01:29:40,800 --> 01:29:43,320
Speaker 5: is the what are the critical issues that you're finding

1634
01:29:43,400 --> 01:29:46,360
Speaker 5: are separating you from center hick and Looper.

1635
01:29:47,320 --> 01:29:50,400
Speaker 13: First and foremost, I'll show up I will do the

1636
01:29:50,560 --> 01:29:55,559
Speaker 13: work and listen to everyone, not only when it's easy,

1637
01:29:55,640 --> 01:29:59,760
Speaker 13: but especially when it's hard. And we know that we

1638
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:04,040
Speaker 13: we have the solutions at the ready that we don't

1639
01:30:04,080 --> 01:30:08,920
Speaker 13: need to spend time doing blue ribbon commissions or UH

1640
01:30:09,120 --> 01:30:12,080
Speaker 13: study groups about we know what the solutions are. Look,

1641
01:30:12,080 --> 01:30:16,599
Speaker 13: it's Medicare for all. It is universal child and elder care.

1642
01:30:17,080 --> 01:30:20,760
Speaker 13: It is ending the dark money and the influence that

1643
01:30:21,120 --> 01:30:25,360
Speaker 13: corporate packs and the billionaires and corporations who control them

1644
01:30:26,280 --> 01:30:30,800
Speaker 13: currently play in our politics. And my goodness, it is

1645
01:30:30,880 --> 01:30:34,840
Speaker 13: about lowering the cost of everyday life so that Colorados

1646
01:30:35,040 --> 01:30:40,519
Speaker 13: cannot just survive but actually thrive. And to me, when

1647
01:30:40,760 --> 01:30:46,920
Speaker 13: we are talking about the issues with Colorado's across the state,

1648
01:30:47,080 --> 01:30:50,080
Speaker 13: you know, we've been traveling the Four Corners and Fort Morgan.

1649
01:30:50,160 --> 01:30:53,400
Speaker 13: We've been all across the front Range, talking to folks

1650
01:30:53,560 --> 01:30:56,920
Speaker 13: in not only the urban corridor in you know, the

1651
01:30:57,000 --> 01:31:00,479
Speaker 13: heart of Denver, but also in rural Colorado and talking

1652
01:31:00,560 --> 01:31:07,080
Speaker 13: to farmers and ranchers who are barely able to make

1653
01:31:07,240 --> 01:31:12,000
Speaker 13: ends meet given the increased cost of tariffs and everything else.

1654
01:31:12,960 --> 01:31:16,200
Speaker 13: Everyone is ready for a change in order for us

1655
01:31:16,320 --> 01:31:19,360
Speaker 13: to advance the politics that meets the moment now let

1656
01:31:19,400 --> 01:31:22,479
Speaker 13: me just say this. I believe that not only do

1657
01:31:23,360 --> 01:31:26,280
Speaker 13: Democrats need to go and build a governing majority right

1658
01:31:26,400 --> 01:31:31,439
Speaker 13: flips red seats blue and do the work to win

1659
01:31:31,840 --> 01:31:35,800
Speaker 13: those seats, but we've also got to go and look

1660
01:31:35,840 --> 01:31:39,000
Speaker 13: at the caliber of Democrats that we send to DC

1661
01:31:39,240 --> 01:31:43,200
Speaker 13: from the safe blue states like Colorado. And that's where

1662
01:31:43,240 --> 01:31:46,880
Speaker 13: we have this incredible opportunity in a head to head

1663
01:31:46,960 --> 01:31:51,920
Speaker 13: challenge against a man who has been in politics for

1664
01:31:53,240 --> 01:31:56,640
Speaker 13: over twenty years as mayor of Denver, governor of Colorado,

1665
01:31:56,760 --> 01:31:59,240
Speaker 13: and now in the US Senate. Colorado is in a

1666
01:31:59,400 --> 01:32:03,240
Speaker 13: unique position because those are we are in a state

1667
01:32:03,479 --> 01:32:05,960
Speaker 13: that has never elected a woman to serve in any

1668
01:32:06,240 --> 01:32:09,439
Speaker 13: of those roles. We have the opportunity to make history

1669
01:32:09,800 --> 01:32:10,679
Speaker 13: through this campaign.

1670
01:32:11,920 --> 01:32:15,280
Speaker 6: And it may may a lot to me.

1671
01:32:15,439 --> 01:32:19,400
Speaker 5: One of the biggest problems facing this country is the

1672
01:32:19,680 --> 01:32:23,920
Speaker 5: yawning kind of wealth inequality. And so as we have

1673
01:32:24,439 --> 01:32:27,720
Speaker 5: more and more cent a millionaires and more and more billionaires,

1674
01:32:28,280 --> 01:32:31,639
Speaker 5: as we try to kind of address the various crises

1675
01:32:31,680 --> 01:32:35,600
Speaker 5: that are facing working people in this country, that leaves you,

1676
01:32:35,680 --> 01:32:38,280
Speaker 5: you know, you basically have three different options of you know,

1677
01:32:38,400 --> 01:32:40,559
Speaker 5: finding the resources to go about doing that. You can

1678
01:32:40,840 --> 01:32:43,599
Speaker 5: kind of borrow money, which then kind of inflates away

1679
01:32:43,640 --> 01:32:47,160
Speaker 5: the wealth of the middle class. You can tax the

1680
01:32:47,720 --> 01:32:51,599
Speaker 5: kind of middle and upper middle class, or you can

1681
01:32:51,720 --> 01:32:56,080
Speaker 5: tax the billionaires. Where where is Colorado at this point

1682
01:32:56,160 --> 01:32:58,360
Speaker 5: on a on a wealth tax? Because to me, from

1683
01:32:58,400 --> 01:33:02,120
Speaker 5: a political but also a fiscal perspective, if we continue

1684
01:33:02,200 --> 01:33:07,519
Speaker 5: to tax work but not wealth, we're going to continue

1685
01:33:07,760 --> 01:33:12,360
Speaker 5: just kind of having people fight among each among each

1686
01:33:12,400 --> 01:33:15,160
Speaker 5: other and developing new things to fight about.

1687
01:33:16,360 --> 01:33:19,840
Speaker 20: Yeah, that's exactly right, and Coloradans are more tuned into

1688
01:33:19,920 --> 01:33:22,320
Speaker 20: that than ever. In fact, I would argue that one

1689
01:33:22,360 --> 01:33:24,120
Speaker 20: of the policy positions I have that has been the

1690
01:33:24,160 --> 01:33:26,640
Speaker 20: most popular with dever voters has been the fact that

1691
01:33:26,720 --> 01:33:29,800
Speaker 20: I'm calling for taxing the rich and taxing the ultrue wealthy,

1692
01:33:29,960 --> 01:33:34,080
Speaker 20: the billionaires and now the trillionaires included, but also talking

1693
01:33:34,120 --> 01:33:37,040
Speaker 20: about the priorities of our budget right now, you know,

1694
01:33:37,200 --> 01:33:40,080
Speaker 20: calling for cutting the Pentagon budget by ten percent, something

1695
01:33:40,120 --> 01:33:43,400
Speaker 20: that the Congress women voted twice against, even when we

1696
01:33:43,520 --> 01:33:45,719
Speaker 20: were in the middle of a pandemic and we're sorely

1697
01:33:45,960 --> 01:33:49,519
Speaker 20: in need of those resources. Making sure that our budget

1698
01:33:49,600 --> 01:33:51,559
Speaker 20: is actually in line with our values and in line

1699
01:33:51,600 --> 01:33:56,240
Speaker 20: with our priorities and guaranteeing healthcare and housing and nutritional food,

1700
01:33:56,320 --> 01:33:59,400
Speaker 20: and public education and public transit to the people of

1701
01:33:59,479 --> 01:34:03,400
Speaker 20: this country is paramounts, and instead we are sending billions

1702
01:34:03,439 --> 01:34:07,760
Speaker 20: and billions of dollars abroad to fund genocidal wars. It's unacceptable,

1703
01:34:07,960 --> 01:34:11,160
Speaker 20: and the voters of this district are very, very, very

1704
01:34:11,280 --> 01:34:14,080
Speaker 20: ready to see leadership who's actually going to call out

1705
01:34:14,120 --> 01:34:17,400
Speaker 20: the people who are responsible for the widening inequality in

1706
01:34:17,439 --> 01:34:20,840
Speaker 20: this country and in our economy, because ultimately, I think

1707
01:34:20,880 --> 01:34:24,800
Speaker 20: where Democrats have failed in being able to meaningfully turn

1708
01:34:24,920 --> 01:34:27,880
Speaker 20: out working class people is that we have failed to

1709
01:34:27,960 --> 01:34:32,960
Speaker 20: actually call out who's responsible for the collapsing economy and

1710
01:34:33,080 --> 01:34:35,560
Speaker 20: the way that those people have been attacking our democracy.

1711
01:34:35,600 --> 01:34:38,000
Speaker 20: And those are the billionaires in the corporations who kept

1712
01:34:38,040 --> 01:34:40,759
Speaker 20: our prices high, who burned our planet and are profiting

1713
01:34:40,800 --> 01:34:44,240
Speaker 20: from genocide. And when you take money from these billionaires,

1714
01:34:44,280 --> 01:34:48,040
Speaker 20: from these corporations, you are holding yourself accountable to them.

1715
01:34:48,360 --> 01:34:50,720
Speaker 20: And that's why we have to make sure that in

1716
01:34:50,840 --> 01:34:54,200
Speaker 20: every primary, at any level of office across the country,

1717
01:34:54,560 --> 01:34:57,040
Speaker 20: that we are only giving our votes to the people

1718
01:34:57,320 --> 01:35:01,680
Speaker 20: who are running grassroots, people powered campaigns. This campaign is

1719
01:35:01,680 --> 01:35:04,799
Speaker 20: supported by over eight thousand individual donors with an average

1720
01:35:04,840 --> 01:35:07,360
Speaker 20: donation of fifty bucks. Because I'm not running to represent

1721
01:35:07,439 --> 01:35:09,600
Speaker 20: mightied interests. I'm running to represent the people of this

1722
01:35:09,800 --> 01:35:13,000
Speaker 20: district and working people who have been trying to get

1723
01:35:13,080 --> 01:35:15,360
Speaker 20: by for too long and deserve not just to get by,

1724
01:35:15,439 --> 01:35:16,360
Speaker 20: but to actually thrive.

1725
01:35:17,479 --> 01:35:20,599
Speaker 5: And last thing for both of you, not to put

1726
01:35:20,600 --> 01:35:22,840
Speaker 5: you on the policy spot here, but there's currently a

1727
01:35:22,920 --> 01:35:26,400
Speaker 5: bill in Congress by Don Bayer over in the House

1728
01:35:26,479 --> 01:35:30,240
Speaker 5: and Chris van Holland over in the Senate that introduces

1729
01:35:30,280 --> 01:35:35,000
Speaker 5: a significant tax cut for working people and pays for

1730
01:35:35,120 --> 01:35:37,559
Speaker 5: it with a star tax on millionaires. If I were

1731
01:35:37,560 --> 01:35:40,760
Speaker 5: writing it, I'd throw in a wealth tax on that too,

1732
01:35:40,880 --> 01:35:43,479
Speaker 5: not just taxing income, because the wealth is really where

1733
01:35:44,360 --> 01:35:48,120
Speaker 5: the money is. But there's also some pushback in kind

1734
01:35:48,120 --> 01:35:51,679
Speaker 5: of progressive circles that say that you shouldn't cut taxes

1735
01:35:51,720 --> 01:35:53,360
Speaker 5: on working people because cutting tax.

1736
01:35:53,200 --> 01:35:55,920
Speaker 6: Across the board is wrong at this moment.

1737
01:35:56,280 --> 01:35:59,280
Speaker 5: And also everybody kind of you know, you undercut the

1738
01:35:59,400 --> 01:36:03,559
Speaker 5: idea of you know, support for taxation if everybody isn't

1739
01:36:03,560 --> 01:36:07,800
Speaker 5: paying in. I think that's absurd. I think people don't

1740
01:36:07,960 --> 01:36:10,840
Speaker 5: like paying taxes, and if you cut their cut, working

1741
01:36:10,840 --> 01:36:12,320
Speaker 5: people's taxes a little bit. They're not all of a

1742
01:36:12,320 --> 01:36:15,000
Speaker 5: sudden going to say, well, I used to like the

1743
01:36:15,080 --> 01:36:16,960
Speaker 5: idea of taxation, but now that I'm paying a little

1744
01:36:16,960 --> 01:36:21,160
Speaker 5: bit less, No, not so much anymore. But so, Julia,

1745
01:36:21,160 --> 01:36:23,759
Speaker 5: to start with you, Chris van holland Candy, the general

1746
01:36:23,840 --> 01:36:27,320
Speaker 5: idea that you want to shift the tax burden upwards

1747
01:36:27,360 --> 01:36:30,880
Speaker 5: and reduce it on working people. The details obviously can

1748
01:36:30,960 --> 01:36:33,160
Speaker 5: be you know, worked out down the road. But where

1749
01:36:33,160 --> 01:36:36,240
Speaker 5: are you on that in that debate among the tax

1750
01:36:36,320 --> 01:36:37,840
Speaker 5: on tax policy.

1751
01:36:39,160 --> 01:36:43,960
Speaker 13: Is what is absolutely crystal clear is that we need

1752
01:36:44,320 --> 01:36:49,360
Speaker 13: to reflect ensure that our tax code reflects the reality

1753
01:36:49,479 --> 01:36:55,639
Speaker 13: in this country where billionaires, brillionaires and the corporations need

1754
01:36:55,760 --> 01:36:59,200
Speaker 13: to actually pay their fair share. Because look, it's clear

1755
01:36:59,280 --> 01:37:02,679
Speaker 13: working people like me, I live in an affordable housing unit.

1756
01:37:02,760 --> 01:37:07,120
Speaker 13: This isn't theoretical to me. Working people are. We are

1757
01:37:07,200 --> 01:37:11,479
Speaker 13: doing our part. But the reason why there is so

1758
01:37:11,640 --> 01:37:18,880
Speaker 13: much dark money being thrown into our political climate, right

1759
01:37:18,960 --> 01:37:23,200
Speaker 13: into our elections and into corporate lobbying, is to maintain

1760
01:37:23,240 --> 01:37:27,600
Speaker 13: a status quo that lines the corporation's pockets, makes the

1761
01:37:27,720 --> 01:37:32,280
Speaker 13: rich richer, and keeps working people paying the tab. And so, yeah,

1762
01:37:32,360 --> 01:37:34,920
Speaker 13: while I agree there are certainly details to get into

1763
01:37:35,760 --> 01:37:40,560
Speaker 13: in terms of ensuring that our tax policy is reflective

1764
01:37:40,640 --> 01:37:45,360
Speaker 13: of the needs of the American people. Broadly, the idea

1765
01:37:45,600 --> 01:37:49,680
Speaker 13: of taxing the rich and also taxing their wealth is

1766
01:37:49,720 --> 01:37:53,920
Speaker 13: something that I wholeheartedly support, may.

1767
01:37:53,800 --> 01:37:55,400
Speaker 5: A lot, what about you, because I agree on the

1768
01:37:55,439 --> 01:37:58,679
Speaker 5: superpack point. Anytime I see five million dollars getting dropped

1769
01:37:58,720 --> 01:38:00,720
Speaker 5: into a house race or the person doesn't even live

1770
01:38:00,920 --> 01:38:03,559
Speaker 5: in that district and like they have too much money.

1771
01:38:05,000 --> 01:38:07,559
Speaker 20: They do have too much money, And I think it's important,

1772
01:38:07,680 --> 01:38:09,600
Speaker 20: you know, for us, so look at all sides of

1773
01:38:09,680 --> 01:38:12,839
Speaker 20: this issue. When we're talking about the poverty wage index,

1774
01:38:12,880 --> 01:38:16,120
Speaker 20: which is the floor of taxation in this country, you know,

1775
01:38:16,400 --> 01:38:20,120
Speaker 20: it's based on a calculation that's decades out of date, right,

1776
01:38:20,240 --> 01:38:22,479
Speaker 20: It's based on the cost of food times three. And

1777
01:38:22,560 --> 01:38:24,880
Speaker 20: if the poverty wage index was actually accurate to the

1778
01:38:24,920 --> 01:38:26,560
Speaker 20: cost of living in this country today, it would be

1779
01:38:26,600 --> 01:38:29,120
Speaker 20: a lot closer to something like forty to forty five

1780
01:38:29,160 --> 01:38:32,600
Speaker 20: thousand dollars for a single individual. And so while I

1781
01:38:32,720 --> 01:38:37,080
Speaker 20: do there is evidence that American tax payers do find

1782
01:38:37,240 --> 01:38:39,840
Speaker 20: pride and paying into their taxes, they do find it

1783
01:38:39,920 --> 01:38:42,280
Speaker 20: to be a duty as citizens. We have to make

1784
01:38:42,320 --> 01:38:44,800
Speaker 20: sure that our taxes make sense, and right now, I

1785
01:38:44,880 --> 01:38:47,280
Speaker 20: think a lot of working people are struggling and being

1786
01:38:47,640 --> 01:38:50,599
Speaker 20: are being crushed. I think it's important that we're also

1787
01:38:50,680 --> 01:38:53,160
Speaker 20: focusing on the kind of programs that would guarantee things

1788
01:38:53,200 --> 01:38:56,479
Speaker 20: like housing and healthcare and intuition free public college, so

1789
01:38:56,560 --> 01:38:59,360
Speaker 20: that those social safety nets are there as well. But

1790
01:38:59,439 --> 01:39:01,200
Speaker 20: I do think there's something to be said about the

1791
01:39:01,240 --> 01:39:03,519
Speaker 20: pride that Americans feel in paying their taxes, but we

1792
01:39:03,600 --> 01:39:05,519
Speaker 20: do have to make sure that our taxes are fair

1793
01:39:05,880 --> 01:39:08,799
Speaker 20: and right now, the effective tax rate for most working

1794
01:39:08,880 --> 01:39:12,479
Speaker 20: people is somewhere around thirty thirty percent, whereas you have

1795
01:39:12,600 --> 01:39:15,919
Speaker 20: people like Jeff Bezos and Michael Bloomberg and Mark Zuckerberg,

1796
01:39:15,960 --> 01:39:18,600
Speaker 20: we're paying effective tax rates of less than one percent.

1797
01:39:18,400 --> 01:39:19,920
Speaker 16: Because of how they've gained the system.

1798
01:39:20,160 --> 01:39:22,800
Speaker 20: And when you have the Irs Chief estimating that we

1799
01:39:22,920 --> 01:39:26,439
Speaker 20: are losing out on one trillion dollars in revenue because

1800
01:39:26,880 --> 01:39:29,320
Speaker 20: of tax evasion and because of the loopholes that we've

1801
01:39:29,400 --> 01:39:33,200
Speaker 20: integrated into the system, because of lobbying through these very

1802
01:39:33,400 --> 01:39:37,000
Speaker 20: powerful interests and billionaires and corporations. We're missing out on

1803
01:39:37,120 --> 01:39:39,800
Speaker 20: a lot of resources that would actually be helping working

1804
01:39:39,880 --> 01:39:42,240
Speaker 20: families in this country. And so It's an all encompassing

1805
01:39:42,280 --> 01:39:44,600
Speaker 20: issue with a lot of different factors to take a

1806
01:39:44,680 --> 01:39:46,320
Speaker 20: look at. But I do agree with you that a

1807
01:39:46,360 --> 01:39:48,760
Speaker 20: wealth tax has to be a part of this conversation.

1808
01:39:49,160 --> 01:39:50,559
Speaker 20: I mean, I'd want to look a little bit more

1809
01:39:50,600 --> 01:39:53,640
Speaker 20: into Ben Holland's bill on addressing this.

1810
01:39:54,280 --> 01:39:56,160
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think, and I'm sure you guys agree that

1811
01:39:56,240 --> 01:39:59,160
Speaker 5: if we were spending less money on kind of pointless wars,

1812
01:39:59,400 --> 01:40:02,000
Speaker 5: people would p I feel better if the money, if

1813
01:40:02,000 --> 01:40:05,240
Speaker 5: they saw the money going to help themselves and their

1814
01:40:05,280 --> 01:40:09,240
Speaker 5: community and their state and the country, then that's different

1815
01:40:09,760 --> 01:40:14,400
Speaker 5: than just seeing it get launched off into a mountain

1816
01:40:14,680 --> 01:40:15,400
Speaker 5: somewhere in Iran.

1817
01:40:16,280 --> 01:40:19,200
Speaker 13: It is clear that when we are being told as

1818
01:40:19,240 --> 01:40:22,160
Speaker 13: the American people that we do have enough money for

1819
01:40:22,280 --> 01:40:26,439
Speaker 13: bombs and for ballrooms, but not for healthcare, not for housing,

1820
01:40:27,240 --> 01:40:31,839
Speaker 13: not to do the work to hold those corporations to account,

1821
01:40:32,120 --> 01:40:36,560
Speaker 13: that something is deeply wrong with our politics. And it

1822
01:40:36,680 --> 01:40:39,439
Speaker 13: is part of the reason why I think that the

1823
01:40:39,560 --> 01:40:43,400
Speaker 13: Democratic Party has some stule searching and some work to do.

1824
01:40:44,840 --> 01:40:48,680
Speaker 13: Over fifty percent of the voters across this state have said, hey,

1825
01:40:48,800 --> 01:40:52,240
Speaker 13: a pox on both your houses and are choosing neither

1826
01:40:52,360 --> 01:40:57,880
Speaker 13: party but instead registering to vote as unaffiliated voters, they

1827
01:40:58,000 --> 01:41:02,200
Speaker 13: get to choose which ballot they vote in in this

1828
01:41:02,320 --> 01:41:05,880
Speaker 13: upcoming primary. And you know, for a long time there

1829
01:41:05,920 --> 01:41:10,400
Speaker 13: has been this idea that, oh, unaffiliated voters are more moderate,

1830
01:41:10,520 --> 01:41:13,960
Speaker 13: they are more centrist, we need to cater to them

1831
01:41:14,200 --> 01:41:17,599
Speaker 13: and not ask for too much. What we're finding as

1832
01:41:17,640 --> 01:41:20,080
Speaker 13: we're going and talking to Colorado's across the state is

1833
01:41:20,120 --> 01:41:24,720
Speaker 13: that no, they are more progressive than what the Democratic

1834
01:41:24,840 --> 01:41:28,960
Speaker 13: Party has been serving them and are hungry for change,

1835
01:41:29,080 --> 01:41:32,599
Speaker 13: are excited to vote for someone who is a battle

1836
01:41:32,680 --> 01:41:37,479
Speaker 13: tested progressive who has done the work both organizing out

1837
01:41:37,520 --> 01:41:41,120
Speaker 13: in community and in the state Senate in order to

1838
01:41:42,479 --> 01:41:45,400
Speaker 13: upgrade the caliber of leadership that we send to d

1839
01:41:45,600 --> 01:41:46,519
Speaker 13: C from Colorado.

1840
01:41:47,280 --> 01:41:52,200
Speaker 5: All Right, Well, if the intention of canceling those rallies

1841
01:41:52,400 --> 01:41:54,680
Speaker 5: was to kind of suppress attention to the campaigns, I

1842
01:41:54,720 --> 01:41:57,840
Speaker 5: think it kind of backfired over the past several days.

1843
01:41:57,920 --> 01:42:01,200
Speaker 5: With day Senator juli Gonzalez May lot Caro's election is

1844
01:42:01,760 --> 01:42:02,439
Speaker 5: June thirtieth.

1845
01:42:02,800 --> 01:42:04,519
Speaker 6: Thank you both so much for joining me.

1846
01:42:06,439 --> 01:42:07,120
Speaker 7: Opportunities.

1847
01:42:08,040 --> 01:42:11,799
Speaker 3: All Right, that was Ryan's interview with a lot Kiros

1848
01:42:11,880 --> 01:42:14,600
Speaker 3: and Julie Gonzalez. Ryan, how are the polls looking for

1849
01:42:14,840 --> 01:42:15,200
Speaker 3: for them?

1850
01:42:16,520 --> 01:42:16,600
Speaker 8: Uh?

1851
01:42:18,600 --> 01:42:21,839
Speaker 5: May lot looks like down seven something like that. Julie's

1852
01:42:22,000 --> 01:42:25,040
Speaker 5: also in the hunt. No, so these are these are

1853
01:42:25,400 --> 01:42:26,320
Speaker 5: these are real races?

1854
01:42:27,080 --> 01:42:30,400
Speaker 4: Yeah? Okay, well this was a packed show.

1855
01:42:31,120 --> 01:42:34,200
Speaker 3: Uh just two remaining here right at the end, but

1856
01:42:34,360 --> 01:42:36,920
Speaker 3: we wanted to wish you all a happy weekend.

1857
01:42:37,000 --> 01:42:39,680
Speaker 4: Anything you gotta gotta plug Ryan before we get out

1858
01:42:39,680 --> 01:42:43,960
Speaker 4: of here. No no plugs, all right, folks, Thank you

1859
01:42:44,120 --> 01:42:46,200
Speaker 4: so much for listening. This was Breaking Points.

1860
01:42:46,200 --> 01:42:48,720
Speaker 3: If you want to join and become a member of

1861
01:42:48,720 --> 01:42:51,760
Speaker 3: support our reporting, that's Breakingpoints dot com. If you're having

1862
01:42:51,800 --> 01:42:55,719
Speaker 3: any issues with your subscription over at Supercast, that's support

1863
01:42:55,960 --> 01:42:57,800
Speaker 3: at supercast dot com.

1864
01:42:58,160 --> 01:43:01,120
Speaker 4: And we will see you all on Monday. Have a

1865
01:43:01,160 --> 01:43:01,880
Speaker 4: good weekend. Bite