1 00:00:09,664 --> 00:00:13,104 Speaker 1: Mission Implausible is now something you can watch. Just go 2 00:00:13,144 --> 00:00:16,823 Speaker 1: to YouTube and search Mission Implausible podcasts, or click on 3 00:00:16,864 --> 00:00:20,864 Speaker 1: the link to our channel. In our show notes, I'm 4 00:00:20,904 --> 00:00:22,064 Speaker 1: John Cipher. 5 00:00:21,664 --> 00:00:24,104 Speaker 2: And I'm Jerry O'Shea. We have over. 6 00:00:23,904 --> 00:00:27,344 Speaker 3: Sixty years of experience as clandestine officers in the CIA, 7 00:00:27,504 --> 00:00:29,704 Speaker 3: serving in high risk areas all around the. 8 00:00:29,624 --> 00:00:33,104 Speaker 4: World, and part of our job was creating conspiracies to 9 00:00:33,184 --> 00:00:34,504 Speaker 4: deceive our adversaries. 10 00:00:34,784 --> 00:00:37,504 Speaker 3: Now we're going to use that experience to investigate the 11 00:00:37,504 --> 00:00:40,543 Speaker 3: conspiracy theories everyone's talking about, as well as some you 12 00:00:40,584 --> 00:00:41,224 Speaker 3: may not have heard. 13 00:00:41,304 --> 00:00:43,584 Speaker 4: Could they be true or are we being manipulated? 14 00:00:43,703 --> 00:00:50,784 Speaker 3: We'll find out now on Mission Implausible. So today's guest 15 00:00:50,824 --> 00:00:54,024 Speaker 3: is comedian Ben Palmer, whose deadpan prank style has made 16 00:00:54,064 --> 00:00:56,784 Speaker 3: him one of the sharpest satirical voices online. Where there's 17 00:00:56,904 --> 00:01:00,743 Speaker 3: exposing the absurdity of political culture, trolling public figures, or 18 00:01:00,784 --> 00:01:03,624 Speaker 3: turning a simple phone call into a miniature social experiment. 19 00:01:03,744 --> 00:01:05,904 Speaker 3: Ben's heads a way of making people laugh first and 20 00:01:05,944 --> 00:01:08,584 Speaker 3: then realize they've also been thinking about something much bigger. 21 00:01:08,624 --> 00:01:10,143 Speaker 4: So Ben, thank you so much for. 22 00:01:10,104 --> 00:01:10,744 Speaker 3: Being here with us. 23 00:01:11,104 --> 00:01:12,063 Speaker 2: Thank you for having me. 24 00:01:12,624 --> 00:01:14,384 Speaker 3: Nah, So, I don't know if people are following you 25 00:01:14,384 --> 00:01:16,384 Speaker 3: and they should follow you online. But you have this 26 00:01:16,503 --> 00:01:20,063 Speaker 3: incredible ability as a comedian to sound completely calm while 27 00:01:20,104 --> 00:01:22,143 Speaker 3: the world around you is morally on fire. 28 00:01:22,423 --> 00:01:24,744 Speaker 4: So ben you have I'll say prank. I don't know 29 00:01:24,744 --> 00:01:27,503 Speaker 4: if that's the word you'd use, but you've gone after 30 00:01:27,904 --> 00:01:31,624 Speaker 4: successfully like all sorts of bad guys, right, I mean 31 00:01:31,783 --> 00:01:33,423 Speaker 4: sort of pyramid schemes. 32 00:01:35,304 --> 00:01:37,503 Speaker 5: I joined a group interview for a devil corps. These 33 00:01:37,544 --> 00:01:40,423 Speaker 5: are companies that post misleading job ads to lure people 34 00:01:40,423 --> 00:01:43,344 Speaker 5: into one hundred percent commission pyramid schemes and cult like 35 00:01:43,384 --> 00:01:44,423 Speaker 5: office environments. 36 00:01:44,544 --> 00:01:47,384 Speaker 2: Sorry one second, great, what is this on the chat? 37 00:01:47,984 --> 00:01:48,383 Speaker 6: Say again? 38 00:01:49,064 --> 00:01:50,904 Speaker 2: What is this that you just posted on the chat? 39 00:01:51,744 --> 00:01:54,064 Speaker 2: But this is being this being one hundred percent commission? 40 00:01:54,464 --> 00:01:55,624 Speaker 7: Am I the all want of uzes? 41 00:01:56,544 --> 00:01:57,264 Speaker 2: I see it too? 42 00:01:57,944 --> 00:01:58,663 Speaker 6: Also see it? 43 00:01:59,024 --> 00:01:59,344 Speaker 2: Oh? 44 00:01:59,464 --> 00:02:00,664 Speaker 6: Is this one hundred percent commission? 45 00:02:01,344 --> 00:02:04,144 Speaker 3: No, we are We offer fifty dollars an hour basic 46 00:02:04,264 --> 00:02:06,824 Speaker 3: guaranteed plus opportunity to make commission. 47 00:02:06,984 --> 00:02:09,104 Speaker 6: I'm sorry, I don't know what happened there. It must 48 00:02:09,104 --> 00:02:11,184 Speaker 6: have been. Does it say it's from me? I just 49 00:02:11,224 --> 00:02:14,504 Speaker 6: see it's from like a uhh. 50 00:02:16,624 --> 00:02:20,264 Speaker 4: And people trying to report their neighbors. 51 00:02:20,984 --> 00:02:24,384 Speaker 5: I made a website for reporting illegal immigrants, and sometimes 52 00:02:24,424 --> 00:02:26,984 Speaker 5: people end up on the website thinking that it's real. 53 00:02:27,144 --> 00:02:29,544 Speaker 5: And somebody wanted to report a man that they suspected 54 00:02:29,584 --> 00:02:31,864 Speaker 5: to be an illegal immigrant that lives in their neighborhood. 55 00:02:31,864 --> 00:02:33,704 Speaker 5: So I reached out to see if I could help. 56 00:02:33,784 --> 00:02:36,544 Speaker 8: There is one person who comes and he's non speaking, 57 00:02:37,224 --> 00:02:41,664 Speaker 8: non English speaking, and when he pulled into the driveway, yeah, 58 00:02:41,904 --> 00:02:43,624 Speaker 8: and the lights all was on. 59 00:02:43,984 --> 00:02:45,824 Speaker 5: They're using electricity in the home. 60 00:02:46,304 --> 00:02:50,024 Speaker 2: Yes, and that is definitely suspicious. 61 00:02:50,504 --> 00:02:50,824 Speaker 3: Yes. 62 00:02:51,624 --> 00:02:56,904 Speaker 8: Sometimes people bring packages and he will leave with different packages. 63 00:02:57,424 --> 00:02:58,624 Speaker 8: He will leave with something else. 64 00:02:58,744 --> 00:03:00,663 Speaker 5: Do you use Do you use Amazon yourself? 65 00:03:02,064 --> 00:03:02,264 Speaker 8: Yes? 66 00:03:02,344 --> 00:03:05,704 Speaker 5: I do, Okay, so you've had different different packages as well. 67 00:03:06,784 --> 00:03:10,024 Speaker 8: M We heard a very very loud noise one night. 68 00:03:10,064 --> 00:03:13,704 Speaker 8: My boyfriend heard and we heard a very loud bang 69 00:03:13,984 --> 00:03:16,704 Speaker 8: or smash or you know whatever it was that he heard. 70 00:03:16,944 --> 00:03:18,864 Speaker 8: The first thing he thought of was, g I hope 71 00:03:18,864 --> 00:03:20,064 Speaker 8: they're not running a meth lab. 72 00:03:20,864 --> 00:03:23,704 Speaker 5: I have some really great news about the individual that 73 00:03:24,064 --> 00:03:24,824 Speaker 5: you called about. 74 00:03:25,104 --> 00:03:25,344 Speaker 2: Yeah. 75 00:03:25,344 --> 00:03:27,464 Speaker 5: When I showed up, I actually he was listening to 76 00:03:27,504 --> 00:03:30,104 Speaker 5: Michael Jackson. But you've been hit by You've been struck 77 00:03:30,184 --> 00:03:34,864 Speaker 5: by a smooth criminal. So yeah, anyways, that I thought 78 00:03:34,864 --> 00:03:37,624 Speaker 5: that was funny. Because you were actually investigating to see 79 00:03:37,664 --> 00:03:39,384 Speaker 5: whether he is a criminal. 80 00:03:41,264 --> 00:03:44,424 Speaker 4: Kindergarten teachers trying to report their parents right for being 81 00:03:44,824 --> 00:03:47,664 Speaker 4: possibly illegal aliens and having a Spanish accent. 82 00:03:49,504 --> 00:03:53,264 Speaker 5: So we're looking to deport the parents and leave the 83 00:03:53,384 --> 00:03:54,464 Speaker 5: child right. 84 00:03:54,504 --> 00:03:56,264 Speaker 8: Like I said, I don't know if they're here illegally. 85 00:03:56,384 --> 00:03:59,424 Speaker 8: I just think it's odd, you know, it's very odd. 86 00:03:59,504 --> 00:04:01,504 Speaker 8: I mean they seem like nice people or whatever. But 87 00:04:02,264 --> 00:04:04,944 Speaker 8: I looked him up in our files, so I was like, oh, 88 00:04:05,864 --> 00:04:08,384 Speaker 8: she was born in the Hunters and he's born in 89 00:04:08,424 --> 00:04:10,904 Speaker 8: Alsaba or you know. They drop off their kid. 90 00:04:10,824 --> 00:04:13,704 Speaker 5: Every day, so their kid is their kid a student 91 00:04:13,984 --> 00:04:18,144 Speaker 5: at your school? Yeah, okay, so now you want to 92 00:04:18,183 --> 00:04:20,584 Speaker 5: get his parents deported. 93 00:04:21,264 --> 00:04:25,704 Speaker 8: Well, I'm just saying if they're taking up resources from 94 00:04:25,784 --> 00:04:29,024 Speaker 8: our county, I'm not into illegal people being here. 95 00:04:29,784 --> 00:04:30,024 Speaker 2: Sorry. 96 00:04:30,024 --> 00:04:33,063 Speaker 5: No, I'm just writing this down from my own personal notes, 97 00:04:33,063 --> 00:04:39,664 Speaker 5: and my supervisor teaches at school wants kindergarten child's. 98 00:04:39,024 --> 00:04:42,143 Speaker 2: Parents to make it sound terrible. 99 00:04:42,344 --> 00:04:43,344 Speaker 8: You make it sound like it's. 100 00:04:43,264 --> 00:04:45,544 Speaker 5: Terrible, but oh well, I'm just writing down. 101 00:04:45,424 --> 00:04:46,503 Speaker 6: What you're telling me. 102 00:04:46,743 --> 00:04:51,464 Speaker 4: Okay, So, what have it been your favorite victim so 103 00:04:51,544 --> 00:04:55,183 Speaker 4: far aside from John and I later? 104 00:04:55,224 --> 00:04:58,104 Speaker 5: So far, you guys are my top two victims. No, 105 00:05:00,984 --> 00:05:04,224 Speaker 5: I would say it's funny to say victims. I mean 106 00:05:04,823 --> 00:05:06,904 Speaker 5: I kind of just let them have the floor sometimes, 107 00:05:06,984 --> 00:05:11,023 Speaker 5: you know, with these deportation calls. Just let them talk 108 00:05:11,063 --> 00:05:13,143 Speaker 5: and say what they have to say, and try to listen. 109 00:05:13,424 --> 00:05:15,743 Speaker 5: And then if I hear anything that sounds like it 110 00:05:15,784 --> 00:05:17,544 Speaker 5: could get a little pushback, or I give them a 111 00:05:17,584 --> 00:05:21,823 Speaker 5: little pushback, maybe question a few things, or see some hypocrisy. 112 00:05:21,943 --> 00:05:24,344 Speaker 5: With the kindergarten teacher that was like acting like I 113 00:05:24,383 --> 00:05:26,904 Speaker 5: was writing down what she was saying on a piece 114 00:05:26,943 --> 00:05:30,743 Speaker 5: of paper. Okay, So wants to deport child, Okay, So 115 00:05:30,743 --> 00:05:32,583 Speaker 5: if you want to leave the do you want the 116 00:05:32,623 --> 00:05:34,384 Speaker 5: parents to say with the kid during the child or 117 00:05:34,383 --> 00:05:37,024 Speaker 5: do you want the okay, deport parents, leave child? 118 00:05:37,303 --> 00:05:41,903 Speaker 2: Okay? What else? Like we're taking her order? Almost I 119 00:05:41,943 --> 00:05:43,024 Speaker 2: just wanted for the audience. 120 00:05:43,264 --> 00:05:49,303 Speaker 4: Basically, you spoofed an ICE website or something like that, 121 00:05:49,344 --> 00:05:53,264 Speaker 4: and people were calling into Ala Nazi Germany, calling in 122 00:05:53,303 --> 00:05:55,024 Speaker 4: to report their friends and neighbors. 123 00:05:55,104 --> 00:05:57,623 Speaker 5: Yeah, well, in case the whole Department of Homeland Security 124 00:05:57,664 --> 00:06:00,463 Speaker 5: is listening. I never say that I'm with ICE. I 125 00:06:00,503 --> 00:06:04,424 Speaker 5: never use ICE's logo or mentioned ICE ever. If anyone 126 00:06:04,464 --> 00:06:07,344 Speaker 5: asks if I'm ice, I never confirm that, but yeah, 127 00:06:07,503 --> 00:06:11,904 Speaker 5: I have a website and a hotline for reporting illegal immigrants. 128 00:06:11,943 --> 00:06:16,863 Speaker 5: Now reporting to who is the question. I never say 129 00:06:16,863 --> 00:06:18,143 Speaker 5: who you're reporting them to. 130 00:06:18,784 --> 00:06:21,704 Speaker 3: People are glad to report them anyway, and. 131 00:06:22,024 --> 00:06:25,583 Speaker 5: You know my I also have some parody slapped on 132 00:06:25,704 --> 00:06:27,824 Speaker 5: the website. If you read that, it's the site is 133 00:06:27,863 --> 00:06:32,664 Speaker 5: for parody or satirical purposes, sociological purposes, So there's those 134 00:06:33,144 --> 00:06:36,144 Speaker 5: that information is on there too. But people they make 135 00:06:36,183 --> 00:06:38,944 Speaker 5: a lot of assumptions and they feel like they're safe, 136 00:06:38,984 --> 00:06:40,943 Speaker 5: and they say some foul things to me because they 137 00:06:40,984 --> 00:06:43,464 Speaker 5: think I'm one of their good guys. 138 00:06:45,104 --> 00:06:47,664 Speaker 3: What's interesting is like these videos they feel like social 139 00:06:47,743 --> 00:06:49,943 Speaker 3: experiments disguised as bits. 140 00:06:50,344 --> 00:06:52,703 Speaker 5: When I first started doing it, I think it was 141 00:06:52,743 --> 00:06:55,863 Speaker 5: just in response to the election, the most recent election, 142 00:06:56,144 --> 00:07:00,023 Speaker 5: and like the what the topics of that time were. 143 00:07:00,224 --> 00:07:03,784 Speaker 5: Now obviously that those these same issues are prevalent today 144 00:07:03,984 --> 00:07:07,383 Speaker 5: and probably will be in the future. But like you know, 145 00:07:07,383 --> 00:07:11,464 Speaker 5: I'm always looking for the new you know bit, I 146 00:07:11,584 --> 00:07:14,664 Speaker 5: was doing that fake AI stuff so that until just 147 00:07:14,744 --> 00:07:19,784 Speaker 5: making fake websites looking like actual AI, whether it be Chat, 148 00:07:19,784 --> 00:07:24,304 Speaker 5: GBT or rock. I have a website that looks just 149 00:07:24,344 --> 00:07:27,583 Speaker 5: like chat GBT, and sometimes people end up on the 150 00:07:27,584 --> 00:07:30,544 Speaker 5: website thinking that they're writing to the actual chat GBT, 151 00:07:30,824 --> 00:07:33,784 Speaker 5: but they're writing to me. One person said, can you 152 00:07:33,824 --> 00:07:36,264 Speaker 5: please give me one funny story? I said sure, it's 153 00:07:36,304 --> 00:07:38,224 Speaker 5: going to take me about sixteen months to write that. 154 00:07:38,744 --> 00:07:40,464 Speaker 5: You good to hang out for a minute, and they 155 00:07:40,464 --> 00:07:43,344 Speaker 5: said yes. I said, okay, see in sixteen. 156 00:07:44,744 --> 00:07:45,744 Speaker 2: And then yeah. 157 00:07:45,784 --> 00:07:49,343 Speaker 5: With this particular website, I started off just by texting 158 00:07:49,384 --> 00:07:53,384 Speaker 5: people that were leaving there, that were filling out the 159 00:07:53,384 --> 00:07:54,824 Speaker 5: form and trying. 160 00:07:54,584 --> 00:07:55,504 Speaker 2: To get people deported. 161 00:07:55,984 --> 00:07:58,024 Speaker 5: And then when I started calling them on the phone, 162 00:07:58,024 --> 00:07:59,704 Speaker 5: it opened it up a little bit because you can 163 00:07:59,744 --> 00:08:02,144 Speaker 5: hear people's son of voice. You get to hear them 164 00:08:02,224 --> 00:08:05,224 Speaker 5: and get to know them a little bit more. I 165 00:08:05,224 --> 00:08:08,624 Speaker 5: have a website for reporting illegal immigrants, and people end 166 00:08:08,704 --> 00:08:10,504 Speaker 5: up on it thinking that it's legitimate. 167 00:08:10,624 --> 00:08:12,704 Speaker 6: I had one person who wanted to report. 168 00:08:12,344 --> 00:08:14,984 Speaker 5: The Hispanics at the local food pantry and also the 169 00:08:15,064 --> 00:08:17,064 Speaker 5: Hispanics working at the chicken plant. 170 00:08:16,864 --> 00:08:19,384 Speaker 7: And they trained their kids to the people back in 171 00:08:19,504 --> 00:08:21,144 Speaker 7: line so they get more food. 172 00:08:21,184 --> 00:08:23,224 Speaker 6: So you said that they're non deserving. 173 00:08:23,464 --> 00:08:26,703 Speaker 7: Very well, the thing is, but they're illegal. They don't 174 00:08:26,704 --> 00:08:27,824 Speaker 7: speak English. 175 00:08:27,864 --> 00:08:30,064 Speaker 5: So do we want them getting less food or do 176 00:08:30,104 --> 00:08:31,464 Speaker 5: we want them just to get deported? 177 00:08:32,104 --> 00:08:35,784 Speaker 7: Deport them? And then they go upstairs. They're allowed to 178 00:08:35,824 --> 00:08:38,624 Speaker 7: take free showers, They're allowed to take their kids up 179 00:08:38,664 --> 00:08:41,584 Speaker 7: there to get baby formulas and diapers. And I just 180 00:08:41,664 --> 00:08:42,384 Speaker 7: have a problem with it. 181 00:08:42,424 --> 00:08:43,223 Speaker 8: I pack taxes. 182 00:08:43,264 --> 00:08:45,384 Speaker 6: I'm upset they're cleaning their bodies. 183 00:08:45,944 --> 00:08:47,784 Speaker 7: Yes, we don't want them. 184 00:08:47,624 --> 00:08:48,784 Speaker 2: To smell good. 185 00:08:49,463 --> 00:08:52,064 Speaker 6: I know, we want them to keep being unclean. 186 00:08:52,624 --> 00:08:56,544 Speaker 7: We do, we do? I guess we do. Who's paying 187 00:08:56,544 --> 00:08:59,184 Speaker 7: for the water, who's paying for the electricians? It's not them. 188 00:09:01,504 --> 00:09:04,024 Speaker 5: Then it started becoming that it seems like we're doing 189 00:09:04,024 --> 00:09:05,424 Speaker 5: a social experiment here. 190 00:09:06,744 --> 00:09:08,224 Speaker 3: What are we learning from that experiment? 191 00:09:08,624 --> 00:09:08,983 Speaker 2: So far? 192 00:09:09,184 --> 00:09:12,223 Speaker 5: What I'm learning is people think that it's their duty 193 00:09:12,384 --> 00:09:15,104 Speaker 5: to tell on these people and to turn people in. 194 00:09:15,384 --> 00:09:20,424 Speaker 5: And regardless of whether it's their neighbor or a kindergarten 195 00:09:20,504 --> 00:09:23,864 Speaker 5: student in their school where they're teaching at, they go, oh, 196 00:09:23,904 --> 00:09:26,104 Speaker 5: I thought I was supposed to do this. That's one 197 00:09:26,144 --> 00:09:30,544 Speaker 5: pattern I've seen a rise very common. Also seen people 198 00:09:30,744 --> 00:09:34,824 Speaker 5: reporting for very personal reasons. Didn't like the way they 199 00:09:34,904 --> 00:09:38,144 Speaker 5: looked at my girlfriend, had that one, Yeah, they looked 200 00:09:38,144 --> 00:09:39,984 Speaker 5: at my girlfriend a little too long. 201 00:09:40,064 --> 00:09:40,784 Speaker 2: I didn't like that. 202 00:09:41,064 --> 00:09:45,824 Speaker 5: Also, oh my ex is now with them, and they 203 00:09:45,984 --> 00:09:47,703 Speaker 5: cheated on me with this person. 204 00:09:47,984 --> 00:09:52,184 Speaker 2: Let's see if we can get this person deported. Yeah. 205 00:09:52,184 --> 00:09:54,264 Speaker 5: So like some of these, I'm like, I try to 206 00:09:54,264 --> 00:09:56,624 Speaker 5: find the humor in but also I have to be careful. 207 00:09:56,624 --> 00:09:58,744 Speaker 5: I try to mess with people's personal lives and stuff 208 00:09:58,744 --> 00:09:59,264 Speaker 5: like that too. 209 00:09:59,944 --> 00:10:05,184 Speaker 4: So John and I we've served in you know, authoritarian 210 00:10:05,223 --> 00:10:07,904 Speaker 4: countries where people is afraid to tell the truth and 211 00:10:08,144 --> 00:10:11,704 Speaker 4: they do like inform on each other, right, and so 212 00:10:11,784 --> 00:10:13,904 Speaker 4: you're looking around. It's the only time you can tell 213 00:10:13,944 --> 00:10:15,704 Speaker 4: the truth is when you drink a little bit, and 214 00:10:15,703 --> 00:10:17,584 Speaker 4: you're like, I think these I can get away with this, 215 00:10:18,103 --> 00:10:23,144 Speaker 4: but it is. It is really interesting in human nature 216 00:10:23,744 --> 00:10:25,984 Speaker 4: what people will do to get along and survive and 217 00:10:25,984 --> 00:10:28,184 Speaker 4: think what they can get away with. I can recall 218 00:10:28,864 --> 00:10:33,584 Speaker 4: sitting with a guy from a really authoritarian country. He 219 00:10:33,744 --> 00:10:36,264 Speaker 4: finally we've been hit a couple of drinks and he's 220 00:10:36,264 --> 00:10:39,304 Speaker 4: telling me how great his country is. And finally he 221 00:10:39,504 --> 00:10:43,064 Speaker 4: like lowers his voice, looks around after the third beer, 222 00:10:43,064 --> 00:10:47,264 Speaker 4: and goes, our leader really isn't so great. And the 223 00:10:47,343 --> 00:10:51,864 Speaker 4: point was he finally realized I wasn't gonna report him right, 224 00:10:51,944 --> 00:10:57,184 Speaker 4: because they're all basically terrified that their family or friends 225 00:10:57,264 --> 00:11:00,983 Speaker 4: will inform on them. And for this, when I hear 226 00:11:01,064 --> 00:11:05,784 Speaker 4: Americans doing exactly what like East Germans would have done 227 00:11:05,904 --> 00:11:09,024 Speaker 4: under the old regime, or what goes down in Robert 228 00:11:09,304 --> 00:11:12,424 Speaker 4: much as Zimbabwe, you know, where people inform on each 229 00:11:12,463 --> 00:11:14,664 Speaker 4: other to get ahead or to stick it to their 230 00:11:14,744 --> 00:11:17,664 Speaker 4: boss or to their ex lover, it just says to 231 00:11:17,703 --> 00:11:20,384 Speaker 4: me that Americans aren't really so different than anybody else. 232 00:11:20,904 --> 00:11:24,424 Speaker 4: In fact, this is a scary thing, and I'm glad 233 00:11:24,424 --> 00:11:26,424 Speaker 4: you're exposing it because I think a lot of people 234 00:11:26,424 --> 00:11:26,784 Speaker 4: are like. 235 00:11:26,703 --> 00:11:27,664 Speaker 2: I couldn't damp in here. 236 00:11:28,184 --> 00:11:30,463 Speaker 4: I would never turn into I would never turn in 237 00:11:30,583 --> 00:11:31,504 Speaker 4: and Frank. 238 00:11:31,384 --> 00:11:34,264 Speaker 5: And the Americans, these people are calling the hotline without 239 00:11:34,304 --> 00:11:35,424 Speaker 5: alcohol in their system. 240 00:11:36,304 --> 00:11:40,504 Speaker 3: Yeah, well you think you think. 241 00:11:42,504 --> 00:11:46,343 Speaker 5: During these conversations, were you like recording under like did 242 00:11:46,384 --> 00:11:48,144 Speaker 5: you have a wire on or are you just taking notes? 243 00:11:48,784 --> 00:11:52,223 Speaker 4: No? No, no, so like in some of your parodies, But 244 00:11:52,343 --> 00:11:55,944 Speaker 4: for real, we're trying to we're trying to actually build trust, 245 00:11:56,304 --> 00:11:58,544 Speaker 4: because it's almost the opposite of what you're doing. These 246 00:11:58,583 --> 00:12:01,304 Speaker 4: are people who are like actually telling the truth for 247 00:12:01,343 --> 00:12:04,784 Speaker 4: the first time, actually saying it. I will tell you 248 00:12:04,864 --> 00:12:08,464 Speaker 4: this people in the US military now, officers that I've 249 00:12:08,463 --> 00:12:11,343 Speaker 4: talked with, like now we're looking over both shoulders before 250 00:12:11,384 --> 00:12:14,424 Speaker 4: they criticized like this administration, which is something that had 251 00:12:14,463 --> 00:12:18,224 Speaker 4: never happened before, because they're actually afraid that another officer 252 00:12:18,304 --> 00:12:20,784 Speaker 4: is going to hear this and ran them out. So yeah, 253 00:12:20,824 --> 00:12:23,583 Speaker 4: this is this has never been a thing in the US, 254 00:12:23,784 --> 00:12:26,383 Speaker 4: maybe in the mcarthy times that people when people were 255 00:12:26,384 --> 00:12:27,224 Speaker 4: concerned about. 256 00:12:26,984 --> 00:12:27,504 Speaker 2: That kind of thing. 257 00:12:27,504 --> 00:12:28,824 Speaker 4: I don't want to be a downer on this, but 258 00:12:28,864 --> 00:12:31,304 Speaker 4: I'm just saying that this is where this is where 259 00:12:31,343 --> 00:12:33,744 Speaker 4: my head went as a former agency officer. 260 00:12:33,904 --> 00:12:36,343 Speaker 2: That's my goal as a committee to depress the masses. 261 00:12:39,144 --> 00:12:42,703 Speaker 2: It's a little more thoughtful than that, No, totally. Yeah. 262 00:12:42,904 --> 00:12:43,104 Speaker 7: Yeah. 263 00:12:43,824 --> 00:12:45,703 Speaker 3: One of the ones you did one with Ted Yoho. 264 00:12:45,864 --> 00:12:48,983 Speaker 3: I think it was a former hardcore right wing congressman. 265 00:12:49,223 --> 00:12:51,463 Speaker 3: But he's always like the perfect person to prank. It 266 00:12:51,463 --> 00:12:54,304 Speaker 3: was so funny because he's such a dick, Like so 267 00:12:54,384 --> 00:12:56,424 Speaker 3: when you did that, like, what what did you come away? 268 00:12:56,504 --> 00:12:59,824 Speaker 3: Did you come away thinking like he's uniquely gullible or 269 00:12:59,864 --> 00:13:02,503 Speaker 3: that a lot of political culture runs on these people 270 00:13:02,544 --> 00:13:05,144 Speaker 3: wanting to feel important in the room and they want 271 00:13:05,144 --> 00:13:07,864 Speaker 3: this opportunity to talk to people behind the curtain. What 272 00:13:07,984 --> 00:13:09,024 Speaker 3: was your takeaway from. 273 00:13:08,904 --> 00:13:12,343 Speaker 5: That, Ted Yo, Well, that was like an accident, like 274 00:13:12,463 --> 00:13:16,144 Speaker 5: he I had no I'd never intended to go after 275 00:13:16,223 --> 00:13:18,384 Speaker 5: him or have him be a part of anything. 276 00:13:18,583 --> 00:13:20,743 Speaker 2: He filled out a form. 277 00:13:20,463 --> 00:13:23,664 Speaker 5: On a website that a fan made as a joke, 278 00:13:24,504 --> 00:13:28,304 Speaker 5: which didn't get any responses barely, mostly spam, and every 279 00:13:28,384 --> 00:13:30,384 Speaker 5: now and then some real people would fill it out 280 00:13:31,103 --> 00:13:33,064 Speaker 5: and then out of nowhere. And this is over the 281 00:13:33,064 --> 00:13:37,544 Speaker 5: course of like almost two years. We got him filling 282 00:13:37,544 --> 00:13:40,463 Speaker 5: out the forum on the website thinking that this social 283 00:13:40,504 --> 00:13:43,864 Speaker 5: media website parody is real. It's actually the social media 284 00:13:43,904 --> 00:13:47,184 Speaker 5: company Parlor. And even though on the site it says 285 00:13:47,223 --> 00:13:49,344 Speaker 5: this is a joke, like in a fine print, like 286 00:13:49,384 --> 00:13:50,703 Speaker 5: you just scroll down and look and it says this 287 00:13:50,784 --> 00:13:52,384 Speaker 5: is a joke, and then there's jokes all over the 288 00:13:52,424 --> 00:13:55,384 Speaker 5: site like it's obviously and it looks nothing like the 289 00:13:55,424 --> 00:13:58,024 Speaker 5: actual I don't know how he ended up on it, but. 290 00:13:58,024 --> 00:13:59,343 Speaker 2: That actually, you know, it made sense. 291 00:13:59,384 --> 00:14:01,544 Speaker 5: The more I got to know him, and the more 292 00:14:01,583 --> 00:14:03,904 Speaker 5: things started becoming more and more obvious to him, like 293 00:14:03,944 --> 00:14:07,343 Speaker 5: that he's being messed with, he still just wouldn't get it, 294 00:14:07,744 --> 00:14:09,704 Speaker 5: and so I was like, this man is, yeah, like 295 00:14:09,703 --> 00:14:13,383 Speaker 5: you said, uniquely gullible. Also, I think part of it 296 00:14:13,424 --> 00:14:16,864 Speaker 5: is he felt we empowered him and made him feel 297 00:14:17,024 --> 00:14:20,304 Speaker 5: like he was the man because we came to where 298 00:14:20,344 --> 00:14:24,344 Speaker 5: he was at Liberty University with a camera and we 299 00:14:24,424 --> 00:14:27,024 Speaker 5: had all his podcast equipment for him, and we're going 300 00:14:27,104 --> 00:14:30,264 Speaker 5: to help him record and make a show free of charge. 301 00:14:30,304 --> 00:14:34,224 Speaker 5: By the way, very nice. And even when people were 302 00:14:34,224 --> 00:14:37,024 Speaker 5: rewarding him, they go, hey, there's somebody here. That's these people. 303 00:14:37,344 --> 00:14:40,544 Speaker 5: They told him they're the TikTok disruptors. That's what they 304 00:14:40,544 --> 00:14:43,664 Speaker 5: said to him, and he goes he tells me, He goes, hey, yeah, 305 00:14:43,664 --> 00:14:45,744 Speaker 5: they told me you guys the TikTok disruptors. And he's 306 00:14:45,784 --> 00:14:47,184 Speaker 5: like kind of laughing about it, and he's like, yeah, 307 00:14:47,664 --> 00:14:52,744 Speaker 5: is TikTok's Chinese? And I'm like what. I'm like, what 308 00:14:52,784 --> 00:14:56,064 Speaker 5: are you talking about. I'm like also worried that we're 309 00:14:56,104 --> 00:14:57,904 Speaker 5: going to get kicked out of this place and not 310 00:14:58,024 --> 00:15:00,504 Speaker 5: have anything to come home with. But I've been doing 311 00:15:00,504 --> 00:15:02,624 Speaker 5: this for months and I'm like, this is the end 312 00:15:02,624 --> 00:15:04,664 Speaker 5: of this. I'm not doing this anymore after this, because 313 00:15:04,904 --> 00:15:07,904 Speaker 5: it has to stop at some point. I think what 314 00:15:08,384 --> 00:15:10,304 Speaker 5: raised the stakes is when I messed with him in 315 00:15:10,304 --> 00:15:13,664 Speaker 5: front of one of his colleagues, Michelle Bachman. Yeah, that's 316 00:15:13,664 --> 00:15:16,744 Speaker 5: when he goes, now I'm embarrassed, and now she's embarrassed, 317 00:15:16,784 --> 00:15:20,624 Speaker 5: and this is very awkward, and now I'm upset. And 318 00:15:20,624 --> 00:15:23,184 Speaker 5: that's when he realized okay, finally, okay, yeah, I'm being 319 00:15:23,264 --> 00:15:25,143 Speaker 5: messed with. But before all that, there's a lot of 320 00:15:25,184 --> 00:15:26,984 Speaker 5: clues and a lot of things it has never. 321 00:15:27,024 --> 00:15:27,584 Speaker 2: Picked up on. 322 00:15:28,944 --> 00:15:31,184 Speaker 5: Ted had the ability to be a nice person because 323 00:15:31,224 --> 00:15:34,984 Speaker 5: he's really nice to me. He chose to call AOC 324 00:15:35,064 --> 00:15:38,184 Speaker 5: and F and B and then instead of going, hey, 325 00:15:38,264 --> 00:15:41,224 Speaker 5: I made a mistake. I lost my cool. I apologize, 326 00:15:41,264 --> 00:15:43,024 Speaker 5: he goes, no, no, I never said that, and she's 327 00:15:43,104 --> 00:15:46,144 Speaker 5: just being dramatic. So that was part of the reason 328 00:15:46,144 --> 00:15:48,664 Speaker 5: why I even wanted to put that man through all that, 329 00:15:48,704 --> 00:15:51,424 Speaker 5: because I'm like, well, let's get a little vindication here, 330 00:15:51,544 --> 00:15:54,344 Speaker 5: because he admitted to me, Oh yeah, I called her that, 331 00:15:54,744 --> 00:15:59,383 Speaker 5: but I lied to Congress about it. I just felt 332 00:15:59,384 --> 00:16:00,744 Speaker 5: like at that point, it was like, I need to 333 00:16:00,784 --> 00:16:02,304 Speaker 5: keep going just for people to see this. 334 00:16:03,504 --> 00:16:06,144 Speaker 4: So John, why don't you tell everyone about this spy 335 00:16:06,304 --> 00:16:07,384 Speaker 4: tour that you're guiding. 336 00:16:08,224 --> 00:16:10,344 Speaker 3: I am very excited to report that I'm working with 337 00:16:10,464 --> 00:16:14,824 Speaker 3: Tradecraft Travel and Kensington Tours, which is known for luxury travel, 338 00:16:14,944 --> 00:16:18,144 Speaker 3: and they're starting a series of international travel experiences focusing 339 00:16:18,184 --> 00:16:20,064 Speaker 3: on the history and practice of espionage. 340 00:16:20,224 --> 00:16:22,104 Speaker 2: Espionage. Isn't that what we used to do? 341 00:16:22,384 --> 00:16:22,504 Speaker 4: Well? 342 00:16:22,544 --> 00:16:25,784 Speaker 3: I think anyone listening to this podcast knows that by now. 343 00:16:25,824 --> 00:16:28,744 Speaker 3: But worse an, I apologize, I'm stealing your thunder even 344 00:16:28,744 --> 00:16:31,424 Speaker 3: in your old stopping ground to Berlin. You're co hosting 345 00:16:31,464 --> 00:16:34,144 Speaker 3: the first one of these, right, Yeah, it's pretty exciting. 346 00:16:34,184 --> 00:16:37,224 Speaker 3: So it's a Cold War espionage tour. We're calling it 347 00:16:37,384 --> 00:16:41,264 Speaker 3: dead Drops and Double Agents. It's ten days in Berlin, Leipzig, 348 00:16:41,384 --> 00:16:42,264 Speaker 3: Prague and Vienna. 349 00:16:42,744 --> 00:16:46,144 Speaker 4: Very very Cold War. These are incredible cities. Well, John, 350 00:16:46,264 --> 00:16:49,104 Speaker 4: be sure to tell them about the secret way that 351 00:16:49,144 --> 00:16:53,864 Speaker 4: the Berlin Wall actually fell, the world's greatest screw up. 352 00:16:54,264 --> 00:16:56,824 Speaker 4: Very few people know the real story, and you're one 353 00:16:56,864 --> 00:16:57,184 Speaker 4: of them. 354 00:16:57,224 --> 00:16:59,704 Speaker 3: For anyone who wants to find out more about this tour, 355 00:16:59,904 --> 00:17:03,664 Speaker 3: we'll be doing an informational zoom session on May nineteenth, so. 356 00:17:03,624 --> 00:17:07,944 Speaker 4: It's April twenty twenty seven. Go to Tradecraft travel dot 357 00:17:07,984 --> 00:17:11,944 Speaker 4: com to learn about the Dead Drops a Double Agents trip. 358 00:17:11,864 --> 00:17:15,064 Speaker 3: Or email Jack at tradecraft travel dot com. If you 359 00:17:15,184 --> 00:17:17,944 Speaker 3: mentioned mission implausible, you can get one hundred dollars off 360 00:17:17,984 --> 00:17:27,464 Speaker 3: the cost of the trip in your fake deportation tip 361 00:17:27,504 --> 00:17:30,664 Speaker 3: line material shocked you more like the volume of people 362 00:17:30,824 --> 00:17:34,304 Speaker 3: contacting it, or how casual. Some of the complaints were like, 363 00:17:34,824 --> 00:17:37,304 Speaker 3: are you surprised at how nasty Americans can be? 364 00:17:37,864 --> 00:17:40,664 Speaker 2: No, okay, I've been no. 365 00:17:40,664 --> 00:17:45,024 Speaker 5: No, I've been responding to people like this online as 366 00:17:45,264 --> 00:17:49,304 Speaker 5: fake Walmart or fake whoever. And these are people that 367 00:17:49,344 --> 00:17:52,544 Speaker 5: are of the same ilk that are mad because Walmart 368 00:17:52,544 --> 00:17:54,584 Speaker 5: aired a commercial that had a gay person in it 369 00:17:54,704 --> 00:17:58,384 Speaker 5: or something like that. So I've seen a lot of 370 00:17:58,424 --> 00:18:02,624 Speaker 5: these this kind of energy just online. First, no, no, 371 00:18:02,624 --> 00:18:05,624 Speaker 5: no surprise, some sadness with the oh you're reporting a 372 00:18:05,664 --> 00:18:07,904 Speaker 5: five year old that's really sad, you know, but not 373 00:18:08,544 --> 00:18:09,144 Speaker 5: no surprise. 374 00:18:09,624 --> 00:18:11,704 Speaker 4: Also engage with people who are there's no way around it, 375 00:18:11,704 --> 00:18:15,744 Speaker 4: who are predators right from the pyramid schemes, who we're 376 00:18:15,744 --> 00:18:18,944 Speaker 4: basically trying to steal your time and money and fuck 377 00:18:19,024 --> 00:18:21,944 Speaker 4: up your life. So how do you what's your sense 378 00:18:21,984 --> 00:18:24,304 Speaker 4: of the people on the other end of the line 379 00:18:24,584 --> 00:18:26,664 Speaker 4: who you know are lying to you. I mean they're 380 00:18:26,664 --> 00:18:29,104 Speaker 4: in a different almost a different category aren't they. I mean, 381 00:18:29,144 --> 00:18:31,184 Speaker 4: these are people who are trying to like stick it 382 00:18:31,224 --> 00:18:31,584 Speaker 4: to you. 383 00:18:32,064 --> 00:18:34,464 Speaker 5: I think with those people you can laugh a little bit. 384 00:18:34,464 --> 00:18:39,304 Speaker 5: More people are getting screwed over, but it's less okay, 385 00:18:39,424 --> 00:18:41,744 Speaker 5: hatred because of what you look like or don't look like. 386 00:18:42,144 --> 00:18:46,064 Speaker 5: There are equal opportunity scam artists. They're actually like, yeah, 387 00:18:46,064 --> 00:18:48,824 Speaker 5: we would love for an illegal immigrant to come join 388 00:18:48,864 --> 00:18:52,904 Speaker 5: our company. Some of it it's just funny, almost, like 389 00:18:52,984 --> 00:18:56,984 Speaker 5: you how obvious it is that what they're doing, and 390 00:18:57,264 --> 00:18:59,384 Speaker 5: they think that I don't know that I go down 391 00:18:59,384 --> 00:19:01,944 Speaker 5: these rabbit holes like those are the devil Core companies. 392 00:19:02,064 --> 00:19:04,664 Speaker 5: There's like a whole there's so many of them, and 393 00:19:04,704 --> 00:19:07,104 Speaker 5: they're like very rampant, and they really do prey on 394 00:19:07,824 --> 00:19:10,544 Speaker 5: college students and people that are just very desperate for work. 395 00:19:10,584 --> 00:19:13,384 Speaker 5: But really they're just using them for a month or 396 00:19:13,424 --> 00:19:16,784 Speaker 5: two until they get burnt out and quit. I joined 397 00:19:16,784 --> 00:19:19,864 Speaker 5: a job interview for a company that scams other businesses. 398 00:19:20,064 --> 00:19:22,664 Speaker 6: Are you guys all interviewing for this for this job? 399 00:19:23,064 --> 00:19:23,344 Speaker 3: Yes? 400 00:19:23,864 --> 00:19:26,304 Speaker 5: Okay, we'll just let you know. This company is a scam. 401 00:19:26,744 --> 00:19:29,544 Speaker 5: They scam people. They send people stuff in the mail 402 00:19:29,824 --> 00:19:32,344 Speaker 5: and then they try to charge them for it. So 403 00:19:33,144 --> 00:19:35,704 Speaker 5: I just hope you all aware of it. They have terrible. 404 00:19:35,344 --> 00:19:38,024 Speaker 6: Reviews on Google if you see it, So just a 405 00:19:38,104 --> 00:19:38,544 Speaker 6: heads up. 406 00:19:38,544 --> 00:19:40,984 Speaker 5: You'll be working for a scam company, a company that 407 00:19:41,064 --> 00:19:45,464 Speaker 5: actually tries to steal money from people, and then they 408 00:19:45,504 --> 00:19:48,624 Speaker 5: just keep going through people. They're just churning out people 409 00:19:49,104 --> 00:19:51,424 Speaker 5: to get their work done, and then only a few 410 00:19:51,464 --> 00:19:54,384 Speaker 5: of the people make a little money. That's like, how 411 00:19:54,464 --> 00:19:56,704 Speaker 5: is this? I don't get how this is still happening. 412 00:19:56,744 --> 00:19:58,824 Speaker 5: That's why I can do stuff. I'm like, wait, why 413 00:19:58,944 --> 00:20:01,344 Speaker 5: is this happening? It shouldn't be happening. 414 00:20:01,424 --> 00:20:03,384 Speaker 3: Hey, we have some people here can go after so 415 00:20:04,744 --> 00:20:10,664 Speaker 3: foreign intelligence services, the Russians for example, and others have 416 00:20:10,744 --> 00:20:14,904 Speaker 3: done this, Indians, Turks, North Koreans, others. What they'll do 417 00:20:15,024 --> 00:20:17,064 Speaker 3: is they'll use cutouts, what they will pretend to be 418 00:20:17,104 --> 00:20:18,984 Speaker 3: one of these people and they'll reach out to somebody. 419 00:20:18,984 --> 00:20:21,104 Speaker 3: They'll find sort of people on gaming sites and others, 420 00:20:21,104 --> 00:20:23,304 Speaker 3: and they'll reach out and say, hey, I'm trying to 421 00:20:23,344 --> 00:20:25,384 Speaker 3: get a package sent from a place to place. You 422 00:20:25,384 --> 00:20:27,464 Speaker 3: could really help me out. I'll send you, you know, 423 00:20:27,584 --> 00:20:30,104 Speaker 3: five hundred dollars a bitcoin if you just pick up 424 00:20:30,104 --> 00:20:31,824 Speaker 3: this package here and take it to this place or 425 00:20:31,864 --> 00:20:34,024 Speaker 3: what have you. And there's been a variety of these 426 00:20:34,024 --> 00:20:37,944 Speaker 3: things in Europe, Canada, other places where they're essentially setting 427 00:20:38,024 --> 00:20:40,104 Speaker 3: up hits and things, so someone will pick up a 428 00:20:40,104 --> 00:20:42,264 Speaker 3: package that has a bomb in it and bring it 429 00:20:42,304 --> 00:20:43,984 Speaker 3: to a place so it's meant to blow up on 430 00:20:44,024 --> 00:20:46,584 Speaker 3: an airplane or something like that. And so we're seeing 431 00:20:46,584 --> 00:20:47,864 Speaker 3: a lot of this, guys. So those would be good 432 00:20:47,864 --> 00:20:50,064 Speaker 3: people for you to to prank if you could send 433 00:20:50,064 --> 00:20:50,904 Speaker 3: you some money. 434 00:20:50,664 --> 00:20:55,424 Speaker 5: And thanary Also yeah, yeah, I like I try not 435 00:20:55,464 --> 00:20:57,344 Speaker 5: to prank people who are killing people. 436 00:20:57,864 --> 00:21:00,584 Speaker 3: You are pranking some people who could be dangerous, and 437 00:21:00,704 --> 00:21:03,784 Speaker 3: think some of these powerful for congress people, some of 438 00:21:03,824 --> 00:21:05,984 Speaker 3: these people could be really angry that they've been look 439 00:21:06,184 --> 00:21:09,544 Speaker 3: foolish in a viral thing. And then these, like you said, 440 00:21:09,624 --> 00:21:12,784 Speaker 3: these predatory companies, some of those things tie back to 441 00:21:12,984 --> 00:21:15,224 Speaker 3: some pretty dangerous criminals. Are you worried at all about 442 00:21:15,264 --> 00:21:17,784 Speaker 3: your safety and health? Is there been any threats against 443 00:21:17,784 --> 00:21:18,744 Speaker 3: you or anything like that? 444 00:21:18,744 --> 00:21:21,864 Speaker 5: That's a good question. No, I haven't had any specific threats. 445 00:21:21,904 --> 00:21:24,224 Speaker 5: I've had people that go, hey, I reported you to 446 00:21:24,264 --> 00:21:25,224 Speaker 5: the FBI. 447 00:21:26,864 --> 00:21:28,664 Speaker 2: Also the CIA, by the way, So I don't know 448 00:21:28,704 --> 00:21:29,224 Speaker 2: if you guys. 449 00:21:31,064 --> 00:21:33,584 Speaker 4: That's why we're doing this man where this is an interview. 450 00:21:34,224 --> 00:21:37,064 Speaker 2: Yeah exactly. I said, Oh, I'm doing their podcast next week. 451 00:21:39,304 --> 00:21:42,824 Speaker 4: So Ben, you are really careful when you do these 452 00:21:43,544 --> 00:21:46,344 Speaker 4: not to lie right, and not to tell an untruth, 453 00:21:46,664 --> 00:21:48,824 Speaker 4: and not to represent yourself as what you're not. You 454 00:21:48,824 --> 00:21:50,864 Speaker 4: get people to believe these things. Do you have a 455 00:21:50,984 --> 00:21:54,424 Speaker 4: lawyer sitting next to you saying whatever you do, don't 456 00:21:54,464 --> 00:21:57,424 Speaker 4: say your ice or don't say you're this it's a parody. 457 00:21:57,464 --> 00:21:59,184 Speaker 4: But do you you have to be careful about that? 458 00:21:59,264 --> 00:22:01,224 Speaker 4: Do you worry? Do you have a lawyer and you're like, 459 00:22:01,224 --> 00:22:03,184 Speaker 4: where your boundaries are, what you're allowed to say, what 460 00:22:03,224 --> 00:22:03,504 Speaker 4: you're not. 461 00:22:04,424 --> 00:22:08,704 Speaker 5: Recently, after the Washington Post article, the Department of Homeland 462 00:22:08,784 --> 00:22:11,984 Speaker 5: Security a statement saying they were aware of my channel 463 00:22:12,104 --> 00:22:14,664 Speaker 5: and that they strongly condemn it. I did have a 464 00:22:14,704 --> 00:22:16,584 Speaker 5: lawyer reach out and I sent them some calls and 465 00:22:16,624 --> 00:22:18,464 Speaker 5: they're kind of looking at it in like a very 466 00:22:18,504 --> 00:22:21,664 Speaker 5: casual manner. But no, I don't really have anybody on 467 00:22:21,744 --> 00:22:24,184 Speaker 5: retainer or like a go to person that I'm like 468 00:22:24,544 --> 00:22:27,344 Speaker 5: that's an expert in this particular field. I do have 469 00:22:27,384 --> 00:22:30,744 Speaker 5: some help, though, somebody who's like, yeah, I'm really interested 470 00:22:30,784 --> 00:22:32,424 Speaker 5: in this, I want to help and if anything were 471 00:22:32,424 --> 00:22:35,023 Speaker 5: to ever happen, they say, yeah, we would love to 472 00:22:35,224 --> 00:22:37,904 Speaker 5: help you if they ever went after you or try 473 00:22:37,904 --> 00:22:40,984 Speaker 5: to scare you through in prison or something. The safety 474 00:22:41,104 --> 00:22:42,904 Speaker 5: question though, you know, I'm going to be touring and 475 00:22:42,944 --> 00:22:46,904 Speaker 5: doing comedy at clubs throughout the United States, maybe eventually 476 00:22:47,584 --> 00:22:51,144 Speaker 5: overseas as well, and so yeah, it's something I is 477 00:22:51,144 --> 00:22:51,984 Speaker 5: on the back of my mind. 478 00:22:52,024 --> 00:22:54,704 Speaker 4: I have to say when I watch these things, you 479 00:22:54,784 --> 00:22:57,384 Speaker 4: are so good with this dead pit right down to 480 00:22:57,424 --> 00:23:00,464 Speaker 4: your eyes. It's like you wouldn't know except you laughed 481 00:23:00,464 --> 00:23:03,104 Speaker 4: a couple of times. You look like a complete like 482 00:23:03,744 --> 00:23:06,304 Speaker 4: bumble fuck and which right down to you, like your 483 00:23:06,344 --> 00:23:08,504 Speaker 4: shirt's not quite button in your hair is like and 484 00:23:08,864 --> 00:23:11,704 Speaker 4: you look you making yourself look like prey, like a 485 00:23:11,744 --> 00:23:15,224 Speaker 4: guy who doesn't know, and you seem so freaking gullible, 486 00:23:15,744 --> 00:23:18,864 Speaker 4: And it's half the fun is like he isn't right. 487 00:23:19,984 --> 00:23:29,024 Speaker 9: Our guest, He just loses like a idiot. 488 00:23:31,104 --> 00:23:33,704 Speaker 5: I like it, No, I like it. I'll take it. 489 00:23:34,504 --> 00:23:35,904 Speaker 5: That's just how I look. I think I just have 490 00:23:36,024 --> 00:23:39,624 Speaker 5: to look sometimes a little disheveled, and you do. I 491 00:23:39,624 --> 00:23:42,184 Speaker 5: can play dumb, for sure. I can definitely play dumb. 492 00:23:42,344 --> 00:23:45,744 Speaker 5: I've I don't know I'm I think it all goes 493 00:23:45,784 --> 00:23:48,144 Speaker 5: back to like how I was raised and stuff like that. 494 00:23:48,304 --> 00:23:50,624 Speaker 5: I was always the youngest, I was always the person 495 00:23:50,664 --> 00:23:53,144 Speaker 5: that's not speaking and more listening, and so I think 496 00:23:53,184 --> 00:23:55,064 Speaker 5: I've been able to use that to my advantage a 497 00:23:55,104 --> 00:23:59,064 Speaker 5: little bit. Like now, I just try to pretend like 498 00:23:59,144 --> 00:24:01,344 Speaker 5: I don't know what's going on, maybe a little behind 499 00:24:01,624 --> 00:24:04,184 Speaker 5: listening to what they're saying, trying to figure it out 500 00:24:04,624 --> 00:24:08,104 Speaker 5: by asking the questions that I'm asking. It seems like 501 00:24:08,144 --> 00:24:10,904 Speaker 5: I actually I'm looking for an answer, but it's really 502 00:24:10,944 --> 00:24:12,904 Speaker 5: like I'm actually pointing out something. 503 00:24:24,784 --> 00:24:27,184 Speaker 3: Do you think that social media somehow has trained people 504 00:24:27,304 --> 00:24:30,464 Speaker 3: to like constantly spout personal opinions so that they think 505 00:24:31,384 --> 00:24:33,824 Speaker 3: these systems are out there for them to serve their 506 00:24:33,864 --> 00:24:37,024 Speaker 3: personal grudges. People seem to be very comfortable. They assume 507 00:24:37,064 --> 00:24:39,304 Speaker 3: that there's all this stuff out there that they are 508 00:24:39,424 --> 00:24:42,104 Speaker 3: meant to be bitching about or whining about, or putting 509 00:24:42,104 --> 00:24:44,704 Speaker 3: out personal grudges. Is this something that would have succeeded 510 00:24:45,344 --> 00:24:47,344 Speaker 3: twenty years ago or fifteen years ago? Did you do 511 00:24:47,424 --> 00:24:48,024 Speaker 3: this kind of thing? 512 00:24:48,304 --> 00:24:51,304 Speaker 5: Well, I've been doing stuff like this for a while now. 513 00:24:51,344 --> 00:24:54,344 Speaker 5: I think it's like maybe twelve or thirteen years. I 514 00:24:54,384 --> 00:24:56,424 Speaker 5: started doing stand up in two thousand and eight, and 515 00:24:56,424 --> 00:24:58,624 Speaker 5: then maybe six seven years after that, I started like 516 00:24:59,384 --> 00:25:01,904 Speaker 5: responding to people on the internet and you know, messing 517 00:25:01,944 --> 00:25:04,944 Speaker 5: with people online. And then, yeah, I think it's just 518 00:25:05,024 --> 00:25:08,704 Speaker 5: evolved into that for sure, Like it's just some more commonplace. 519 00:25:08,744 --> 00:25:10,824 Speaker 5: Like you're saying, then always used to be like that. 520 00:25:11,424 --> 00:25:14,424 Speaker 5: The internet used to be like a fun playground, almost 521 00:25:14,664 --> 00:25:15,744 Speaker 5: somewhere you go to learn. 522 00:25:16,144 --> 00:25:18,624 Speaker 4: So a lot of what you do is passive. People 523 00:25:18,664 --> 00:25:21,984 Speaker 4: write into you, and have you experimented more or thought 524 00:25:21,984 --> 00:25:26,784 Speaker 4: more about writing to Christino more, the vice president, trying 525 00:25:26,784 --> 00:25:29,184 Speaker 4: to get in front of them to ask so to 526 00:25:29,304 --> 00:25:32,704 Speaker 4: reach out and go after specific individuals. 527 00:25:33,344 --> 00:25:36,304 Speaker 5: Yeah, I do that too. I do you know the 528 00:25:36,384 --> 00:25:40,944 Speaker 5: reporter bit works. I will get a website or an 529 00:25:40,984 --> 00:25:44,624 Speaker 5: email that looks like it's an actual publication that they're 530 00:25:44,624 --> 00:25:46,384 Speaker 5: familiar with, and then I reach out to them with 531 00:25:46,464 --> 00:25:49,304 Speaker 5: a made up quote that seems a little off to 532 00:25:49,344 --> 00:25:51,904 Speaker 5: try to get a dialogue going. When you're talking about 533 00:25:51,944 --> 00:25:54,704 Speaker 5: emailing Christy Nome or things like that, it's you know, 534 00:25:55,344 --> 00:25:58,224 Speaker 5: good luck getting a response or emailing the vice president. 535 00:25:58,744 --> 00:26:02,704 Speaker 5: But if you email like your state representatives, a lot 536 00:26:02,744 --> 00:26:04,784 Speaker 5: of times you go straight to their inbox. They don't 537 00:26:04,904 --> 00:26:08,264 Speaker 5: have an assistant, and they'll email you back. You said 538 00:26:08,264 --> 00:26:11,384 Speaker 5: something like learning about like scammers and things like that. 539 00:26:11,824 --> 00:26:15,824 Speaker 5: I always try to learn hackers and scammers. If it's 540 00:26:15,864 --> 00:26:17,624 Speaker 5: like a new thing or something I don't know about, 541 00:26:17,664 --> 00:26:19,744 Speaker 5: I try to learn about it because I can use 542 00:26:19,824 --> 00:26:23,544 Speaker 5: those tricks with what I do, and sometimes they inspire me, 543 00:26:23,864 --> 00:26:26,184 Speaker 5: Like I think what inspired pretending to be chat GPT 544 00:26:26,424 --> 00:26:28,544 Speaker 5: was like when it first came out. I also read 545 00:26:28,584 --> 00:26:31,504 Speaker 5: about hackers who they would rely on people to make 546 00:26:31,544 --> 00:26:35,704 Speaker 5: typos when they go to websites AmericanExpress dot com. But 547 00:26:35,984 --> 00:26:37,824 Speaker 5: the E is next the W is next to the 548 00:26:37,864 --> 00:26:40,784 Speaker 5: E on the keyboard, so they get American w XP 549 00:26:40,944 --> 00:26:43,624 Speaker 5: R E S S dot com. Then it looks just 550 00:26:43,664 --> 00:26:46,024 Speaker 5: like AmericanExpress dot com. You log in, now they have 551 00:26:46,144 --> 00:26:49,744 Speaker 5: your log into American Express. So my first chat GPT 552 00:26:49,904 --> 00:26:54,264 Speaker 5: website was cjatgpt dot com because the G is next 553 00:26:54,304 --> 00:26:55,144 Speaker 5: to the H. 554 00:26:55,304 --> 00:26:57,224 Speaker 2: So looking for I. 555 00:26:57,184 --> 00:26:59,744 Speaker 5: Don't know if you have any picking your brains, if 556 00:26:59,784 --> 00:27:01,624 Speaker 5: you have any things like that where you're like, oh, 557 00:27:01,624 --> 00:27:03,664 Speaker 5: Ben might be able to use something like that. 558 00:27:03,624 --> 00:27:06,264 Speaker 2: Or tricks to the trade. That's what I'm here for. 559 00:27:07,984 --> 00:27:11,504 Speaker 3: How often so you're doing this kind of stuff, what 560 00:27:11,544 --> 00:27:14,264 Speaker 3: percentage of them workout and end up being funny that 561 00:27:14,304 --> 00:27:14,824 Speaker 3: you use it. 562 00:27:14,984 --> 00:27:18,304 Speaker 5: Sometimes the challenge is that they're just like like our 563 00:27:18,344 --> 00:27:22,224 Speaker 5: old pal ted he's extremely gullible, and they just don't 564 00:27:22,264 --> 00:27:24,464 Speaker 5: get it until you rub their face in it. And 565 00:27:24,544 --> 00:27:28,023 Speaker 5: so that also becomes a challenge because I'm saying things 566 00:27:28,104 --> 00:27:30,264 Speaker 5: and then just like ah, yeah, yeah, because they just 567 00:27:30,304 --> 00:27:32,864 Speaker 5: have no idea that there would be anybody out there 568 00:27:32,944 --> 00:27:35,704 Speaker 5: doing something like this. So that's a challenge. 569 00:27:35,944 --> 00:27:36,864 Speaker 2: Yeah. 570 00:27:37,264 --> 00:27:39,704 Speaker 5: Like I had the person who wanted to deport people 571 00:27:39,744 --> 00:27:42,984 Speaker 5: working in the chicken plant, and I said, we got 572 00:27:42,984 --> 00:27:45,064 Speaker 5: to replace them. So let's put a job hosting out 573 00:27:45,064 --> 00:27:47,344 Speaker 5: for the chicken plant and I'll call the plant by 574 00:27:47,344 --> 00:27:49,384 Speaker 5: the way and we'll talk. And then she just believed 575 00:27:49,384 --> 00:27:51,704 Speaker 5: everything I said, even though she never even told me 576 00:27:52,144 --> 00:27:55,424 Speaker 5: what the name of the chicken plant was. I had 577 00:27:55,424 --> 00:27:57,704 Speaker 5: someone else. I go, she's mad, Oh yeah, I saw 578 00:27:57,744 --> 00:28:00,184 Speaker 5: one girl driving a nice car, and so I want 579 00:28:00,224 --> 00:28:00,944 Speaker 5: her to port it. 580 00:28:00,984 --> 00:28:03,904 Speaker 2: I said, I said, hey, we saw that girl. We 581 00:28:03,944 --> 00:28:05,744 Speaker 2: talked to her. He said you saw her, the girl 582 00:28:06,544 --> 00:28:07,304 Speaker 2: with a nice car. 583 00:28:07,424 --> 00:28:09,544 Speaker 5: Yeah yeah, And then they just I was like, yeah, 584 00:28:09,584 --> 00:28:11,464 Speaker 5: they asked us to u I asked her if she 585 00:28:11,504 --> 00:28:13,384 Speaker 5: could downgrade to a bicycle. 586 00:28:13,544 --> 00:28:15,064 Speaker 2: She said no, she didn't want to do that. 587 00:28:15,384 --> 00:28:18,264 Speaker 5: And she goes, oh, man, I figured she wouldn't want 588 00:28:18,264 --> 00:28:21,464 Speaker 5: to do that. Like so you're just like, that's where 589 00:28:21,504 --> 00:28:23,504 Speaker 5: you're like, you want I want my stuff to be 590 00:28:23,504 --> 00:28:25,464 Speaker 5: as funny as possible. Sometimes you're like, is it really 591 00:28:25,544 --> 00:28:30,064 Speaker 5: that funny? If they're just so dumblets can help them 592 00:28:30,064 --> 00:28:32,744 Speaker 5: have a little bit of pushback, you know, like comedy's 593 00:28:32,744 --> 00:28:34,504 Speaker 5: got the straight man and the wild man. 594 00:28:34,544 --> 00:28:37,224 Speaker 2: You can need a little pushback to. 595 00:28:37,184 --> 00:28:39,504 Speaker 4: Be clear, though you've not hit anybody calling and say 596 00:28:40,104 --> 00:28:42,464 Speaker 4: I want to pick tomatoes for three dollars an hour 597 00:28:42,584 --> 00:28:45,344 Speaker 4: and they're taking my job. I want to pluck chicken 598 00:28:45,424 --> 00:28:46,504 Speaker 4: for minimum wage. 599 00:28:47,064 --> 00:28:49,664 Speaker 5: Yeah, exactly like the one lady reported the girl at 600 00:28:49,704 --> 00:28:52,344 Speaker 5: the grocery store because she didn't speak good English, but 601 00:28:52,384 --> 00:28:54,664 Speaker 5: she still helped her find water. She goes, she goes, 602 00:28:54,704 --> 00:28:56,944 Speaker 5: I don't want you going in there guns blazon or anything. 603 00:28:57,144 --> 00:29:02,264 Speaker 2: Just check it out. Just check it out. Don't go 604 00:29:02,344 --> 00:29:03,264 Speaker 2: in there guns blazing. 605 00:29:04,904 --> 00:29:08,544 Speaker 5: You want us to be the chill deportation agents. 606 00:29:10,144 --> 00:29:12,624 Speaker 3: Who's easier to satirize ordinary people with this sort of 607 00:29:12,664 --> 00:29:16,024 Speaker 3: wild confidence or like powerful people with no self awareness. 608 00:29:16,064 --> 00:29:19,224 Speaker 2: Ted was an ordinary person before he got into Congress. 609 00:29:19,264 --> 00:29:21,784 Speaker 5: He's just a veterinarian. I think he was good at 610 00:29:21,824 --> 00:29:25,064 Speaker 5: that job, but not everyone should be responsible for her. 611 00:29:25,184 --> 00:29:28,184 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, saying yes or no to a bill. 612 00:29:29,024 --> 00:29:32,104 Speaker 4: Right, Well, I mean Senator Mark Mark Wayne Mullin. Right, 613 00:29:32,144 --> 00:29:33,904 Speaker 4: he ran a he ran his dance. 614 00:29:33,704 --> 00:29:38,824 Speaker 3: Plumbing plumbing in the plumbing shot and DHS is a huge, sprawling, 615 00:29:38,984 --> 00:29:43,544 Speaker 3: difficult organization with people with guns and can deport. It's 616 00:29:43,584 --> 00:29:45,944 Speaker 3: a huge organization that does a lot of different things, 617 00:29:45,944 --> 00:29:48,064 Speaker 3: a coast guard, all this kind of stuff. The notion 618 00:29:48,144 --> 00:29:50,304 Speaker 3: that if you've never run anything except for like a 619 00:29:50,304 --> 00:29:53,904 Speaker 3: tiny little thing, and you don't have any experience in 620 00:29:54,264 --> 00:29:56,664 Speaker 3: security or law enforcement or anything, it's like you're gonna 621 00:29:56,744 --> 00:29:58,584 Speaker 3: run this thing like you're not an exec. 622 00:29:59,144 --> 00:30:01,864 Speaker 2: It's unbelievable to me. Someone like him who loses his cool. 623 00:30:02,024 --> 00:30:05,184 Speaker 5: That also just shows like he can be manipulated because 624 00:30:05,224 --> 00:30:07,824 Speaker 5: he's very he's emotional. But yeah, I gonna be best 625 00:30:07,824 --> 00:30:09,544 Speaker 5: friends with him and then flip the script on it 626 00:30:09,584 --> 00:30:11,344 Speaker 5: and then he'd be real mad. But that'd be funny 627 00:30:11,344 --> 00:30:12,224 Speaker 5: because he'd be so mad. 628 00:30:12,304 --> 00:30:14,384 Speaker 3: I would. I'll look forward to that one. 629 00:30:15,064 --> 00:30:17,744 Speaker 4: So ben as far as you know, are we the 630 00:30:17,784 --> 00:30:19,864 Speaker 4: first two CIA guys you've ever talked with. 631 00:30:20,624 --> 00:30:22,504 Speaker 5: As far as I know, Yeah, as far as you know, 632 00:30:22,544 --> 00:30:24,304 Speaker 5: you are the first. I hope you are the first 633 00:30:24,344 --> 00:30:24,904 Speaker 5: g CIA. 634 00:30:25,784 --> 00:30:27,464 Speaker 2: Do you have any questions for us? 635 00:30:27,664 --> 00:30:30,824 Speaker 5: I have questions, like it's going back to me, like 636 00:30:30,904 --> 00:30:33,104 Speaker 5: what can you what can you look at when you 637 00:30:33,144 --> 00:30:35,984 Speaker 5: look at my stuff and you go, maybe Ben could 638 00:30:36,104 --> 00:30:37,944 Speaker 5: use a little guidance here. 639 00:30:38,104 --> 00:30:40,224 Speaker 2: Maybe Ben could get maybe even a warning. 640 00:30:40,264 --> 00:30:42,224 Speaker 5: You go, hey, Ben, you need to watch out for this. 641 00:30:42,784 --> 00:30:45,464 Speaker 5: Watch if you see something like this, watch out anything 642 00:30:45,504 --> 00:30:46,984 Speaker 5: to help. As far as I don't know, I think 643 00:30:47,024 --> 00:30:48,624 Speaker 5: you're better than we are, Like we oft would have 644 00:30:48,664 --> 00:30:50,544 Speaker 5: to be. You know, we use a fake alias to 645 00:30:50,784 --> 00:30:53,624 Speaker 5: meet someone, to pretend we're someone or not. Jerry could 646 00:30:53,624 --> 00:30:56,744 Speaker 5: pretend to be a a German businessman or something. But 647 00:30:56,824 --> 00:30:58,424 Speaker 5: you're better at it than we are. So like I 648 00:30:58,464 --> 00:31:01,064 Speaker 5: think you should be coming in and doing some training classes. 649 00:31:01,664 --> 00:31:02,824 Speaker 2: I would love you to help. 650 00:31:04,384 --> 00:31:07,064 Speaker 5: So when you were doing those things, were you studying 651 00:31:07,144 --> 00:31:10,424 Speaker 5: like pretending to be a German person. You're studying a 652 00:31:10,464 --> 00:31:13,904 Speaker 5: lot I imagine like studying. Oh German people they act 653 00:31:13,984 --> 00:31:16,784 Speaker 5: like this, they say this, there's things like that. So 654 00:31:16,824 --> 00:31:19,104 Speaker 5: you don't get found out. 655 00:31:19,344 --> 00:31:21,304 Speaker 4: So I'm not going to speak for myself, but I 656 00:31:21,384 --> 00:31:24,784 Speaker 4: do know one guy who went under deep cover, and 657 00:31:24,904 --> 00:31:29,144 Speaker 4: deep cover is a very anti American person, and you know, 658 00:31:29,224 --> 00:31:32,224 Speaker 4: he would be like death to Jews, death to Americans. 659 00:31:32,504 --> 00:31:35,544 Speaker 4: And he was like living with in this milieu Wheness 660 00:31:35,744 --> 00:31:39,504 Speaker 4: was and he was actually like a kid from California, right, 661 00:31:39,784 --> 00:31:44,344 Speaker 4: But when he came out and he'd get off the 662 00:31:44,344 --> 00:31:47,184 Speaker 4: airplane and he you know, in the States. Now, he's 663 00:31:47,224 --> 00:31:49,584 Speaker 4: like he can go back to being who he was initially. 664 00:31:49,984 --> 00:31:52,264 Speaker 4: It's like, you know, talk to him, like, how did 665 00:31:52,304 --> 00:31:54,144 Speaker 4: you feel when you're like He's like, no, man, you 666 00:31:54,144 --> 00:31:57,664 Speaker 4: don't understand. When I'm there and I'm doing it, I 667 00:31:57,944 --> 00:32:01,664 Speaker 4: really think it. I really believe when I'm saying death 668 00:32:01,704 --> 00:32:04,704 Speaker 4: to America. It's like it's with my heart. I fucking 669 00:32:04,824 --> 00:32:07,264 Speaker 4: believe it. It's the only way you can survive it. 670 00:32:07,344 --> 00:32:09,624 Speaker 4: In the back of my head, you know, there's this 671 00:32:09,704 --> 00:32:12,584 Speaker 4: little space where like, I know it's not true, but 672 00:32:12,624 --> 00:32:15,144 Speaker 4: he says, but it's the emotion. It's like if I 673 00:32:15,184 --> 00:32:18,024 Speaker 4: took a light detector test, I would believe it. And 674 00:32:18,944 --> 00:32:21,824 Speaker 4: people have the ability to cognitive distance, people have the 675 00:32:21,864 --> 00:32:25,344 Speaker 4: ability to compartment it's not even acting is the wrong word. 676 00:32:25,464 --> 00:32:28,504 Speaker 4: You got to take on that persona really live it. 677 00:32:28,504 --> 00:32:30,744 Speaker 4: It's hard to explain unless you've actually done it. 678 00:32:31,384 --> 00:32:33,304 Speaker 3: Yeah, But the thing is if you're a you know, 679 00:32:33,384 --> 00:32:36,064 Speaker 3: because we grew up we're like history majors. Then we 680 00:32:36,064 --> 00:32:38,584 Speaker 3: did languages, and we lived overseas, we have culture and 681 00:32:38,704 --> 00:32:40,664 Speaker 3: worked on politics and foreign affairs issues, and all of 682 00:32:40,664 --> 00:32:42,464 Speaker 3: a sudden you're trying to pretend you're a businessman. You 683 00:32:42,504 --> 00:32:44,864 Speaker 3: have to spend some time to try to get that 684 00:32:45,384 --> 00:32:47,504 Speaker 3: mindset and how people do that, and the lingo and 685 00:32:47,504 --> 00:32:50,504 Speaker 3: the language, like even in your own language, if you're 686 00:32:50,504 --> 00:32:52,624 Speaker 3: a lawyer, you're a business person. If you're an act, 687 00:32:52,904 --> 00:32:55,144 Speaker 3: they have a complete different vocabulary. So it just takes 688 00:32:55,144 --> 00:32:56,424 Speaker 3: some time in preparation. 689 00:32:56,624 --> 00:32:59,224 Speaker 5: Just makes you think of that scene from Inglorious Bastards 690 00:32:59,264 --> 00:33:00,304 Speaker 5: where he holds up the number. 691 00:33:00,704 --> 00:33:03,544 Speaker 4: Yeah, they's but the way he holds it up was 692 00:33:03,624 --> 00:33:04,864 Speaker 4: like that was the what key? 693 00:33:04,944 --> 00:33:06,264 Speaker 2: Then he was American? 694 00:33:06,544 --> 00:33:08,264 Speaker 3: Yeah, And the way we eat our food, we eat 695 00:33:08,384 --> 00:33:10,744 Speaker 3: like with the right hand with your fork and then 696 00:33:10,784 --> 00:33:12,624 Speaker 3: you put it down and put the knife in there, 697 00:33:12,624 --> 00:33:14,264 Speaker 3: like most places don't do that. 698 00:33:14,824 --> 00:33:17,064 Speaker 5: Yeah, did you ever have when you're in these roles, 699 00:33:17,104 --> 00:33:19,384 Speaker 5: did you ever have like a lot of fear when 700 00:33:19,384 --> 00:33:20,144 Speaker 5: you're doing it. 701 00:33:20,104 --> 00:33:22,584 Speaker 3: Fear that you might do something wrong, like pressure on 702 00:33:22,664 --> 00:33:24,584 Speaker 3: yourself as how I would say it, because it's important 703 00:33:24,904 --> 00:33:27,384 Speaker 3: when you're doing something, you're trying to either protect the 704 00:33:27,384 --> 00:33:30,664 Speaker 3: person you're with or so you're almost afraid that you'll 705 00:33:30,904 --> 00:33:33,424 Speaker 3: make a mistake more than you're afraid of the things 706 00:33:33,464 --> 00:33:36,104 Speaker 3: around that. And even like if you're signing, you know, 707 00:33:36,144 --> 00:33:38,544 Speaker 3: in an alias, like sometimes you're so used to signing 708 00:33:38,544 --> 00:33:40,184 Speaker 3: your name, you start you're gonna write your regular name 709 00:33:40,184 --> 00:33:42,504 Speaker 3: and you realize, oh shit, I'm signing a different name here, 710 00:33:42,504 --> 00:33:43,824 Speaker 3: and then you got to change the run. 711 00:33:43,984 --> 00:33:45,384 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a the agency. 712 00:33:45,424 --> 00:33:47,184 Speaker 4: We have a suit in him, so we don't use 713 00:33:47,224 --> 00:33:49,744 Speaker 4: our real names when we're like signing things. But you 714 00:33:49,824 --> 00:33:52,024 Speaker 4: sign that name more than you sign your real name. 715 00:33:52,224 --> 00:33:56,704 Speaker 4: What's important is you can't you can't pretend to be 716 00:33:56,824 --> 00:34:00,304 Speaker 4: somebody to someone who knows a lot about something. So 717 00:34:00,384 --> 00:34:04,944 Speaker 4: if you're with like a no shit businessman who sells supercomputers, 718 00:34:05,224 --> 00:34:07,904 Speaker 4: you can't pretend to be a supercomputer salesman. You got 719 00:34:07,904 --> 00:34:11,104 Speaker 4: to find somebody who doesn't know much about super supercomputers, 720 00:34:11,184 --> 00:34:13,664 Speaker 4: and then you can, like you can do that, then. 721 00:34:13,663 --> 00:34:16,703 Speaker 2: You know, right, yeah, that's right. Yeah, because yeah, I 722 00:34:17,104 --> 00:34:17,904 Speaker 2: watched the NBA. 723 00:34:18,024 --> 00:34:20,143 Speaker 5: If if someone tried to pretend to be a fan 724 00:34:20,183 --> 00:34:22,104 Speaker 5: of the NBA and talk to me about the players, 725 00:34:22,183 --> 00:34:24,584 Speaker 5: I'd be able to pick up on it quickly, quickly, yeah, 726 00:34:24,824 --> 00:34:27,064 Speaker 5: Or if you watch them and play a sport, you're like, oh, yeah, 727 00:34:27,064 --> 00:34:29,344 Speaker 5: that person you can tell. And you've been playing basketball 728 00:34:29,344 --> 00:34:31,343 Speaker 5: your whole life. Now this person's handles are off. 729 00:34:31,464 --> 00:34:35,783 Speaker 4: It's the same people pretending to be CIA officers. So 730 00:34:35,864 --> 00:34:37,944 Speaker 4: we have a certain our goal, we have a certain 731 00:34:38,024 --> 00:34:41,544 Speaker 4: like lexicon that we use, and if someone's pretending to 732 00:34:41,584 --> 00:34:43,984 Speaker 4: be a CIA officer, one of the first tells is 733 00:34:44,024 --> 00:34:47,184 Speaker 4: they say I'm a CIA agent. Like we never say agent. 734 00:34:47,384 --> 00:34:47,584 Speaker 2: Right. 735 00:34:47,824 --> 00:34:51,944 Speaker 4: We do bump into people who pretend to be in 736 00:34:52,104 --> 00:34:55,743 Speaker 4: CIA yet impressed girls or like whatever it is and 737 00:34:56,263 --> 00:34:58,504 Speaker 4: didn't work for me. You know, it would take like 738 00:34:58,544 --> 00:35:00,584 Speaker 4: basically two or three minutes to figure out whether they 739 00:35:00,584 --> 00:35:01,904 Speaker 4: were really on the inside or not. 740 00:35:02,183 --> 00:35:04,344 Speaker 3: It's like the people of the military that stolen veilor 741 00:35:04,384 --> 00:35:06,423 Speaker 3: stuff with Yeah, it's exactly figure o all this stuff. 742 00:35:06,424 --> 00:35:08,064 Speaker 3: And I try to pretend like a real person in 743 00:35:08,104 --> 00:35:10,584 Speaker 3: a military unit pretty quickly can figure out when someone's 744 00:35:10,663 --> 00:35:11,264 Speaker 3: lying to them. 745 00:35:11,304 --> 00:35:13,824 Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure. Does you ever have any close calls? 746 00:35:14,223 --> 00:35:17,104 Speaker 3: Nothing's coming to mind with me, because, like Jerry says, 747 00:35:17,223 --> 00:35:20,903 Speaker 3: is setting the situation to your benefit because you're trying 748 00:35:20,904 --> 00:35:24,744 Speaker 3: to accomplish something, right, You're trying to set the environment 749 00:35:24,904 --> 00:35:27,823 Speaker 3: so that you're going to succeed. So, you know, going 750 00:35:27,864 --> 00:35:30,544 Speaker 3: into something and winging it where there's a good chance 751 00:35:30,544 --> 00:35:32,623 Speaker 3: you're going to fail, is not this what you're trying 752 00:35:32,623 --> 00:35:35,303 Speaker 3: to do. You're trying to orchestrate, choreograph things so that 753 00:35:35,424 --> 00:35:37,343 Speaker 3: the person falls into And that's what you're doing, right. 754 00:35:37,344 --> 00:35:39,623 Speaker 3: You're trying to choreograph and set it up with the 755 00:35:39,743 --> 00:35:42,183 Speaker 3: kind of questioning so that people fall into it like 756 00:35:42,783 --> 00:35:44,984 Speaker 3: and so that's sort of what we're doing as well. 757 00:35:45,064 --> 00:35:47,384 Speaker 4: This does remind me of a friend of mine. She 758 00:35:47,544 --> 00:35:50,104 Speaker 4: was in this one situation and she was with some 759 00:35:50,183 --> 00:35:52,104 Speaker 4: band people and she you know, we're always looking like 760 00:35:52,223 --> 00:35:53,904 Speaker 4: where can we like if it goes bad, how do 761 00:35:53,944 --> 00:35:54,584 Speaker 4: I get out of here? 762 00:35:54,584 --> 00:35:55,304 Speaker 2: What's my xpillo? 763 00:35:55,504 --> 00:35:57,144 Speaker 4: But she was in a place where she couldn't easily 764 00:35:57,143 --> 00:35:59,303 Speaker 4: get out and she's with two or three bad guys 765 00:35:59,304 --> 00:36:01,823 Speaker 4: that wasn't in English. And then they said okay, so 766 00:36:01,904 --> 00:36:04,584 Speaker 4: now it's time to talk about Cia, and she's like, 767 00:36:04,864 --> 00:36:08,783 Speaker 4: oh fuck, and like somehow they know and they're like, 768 00:36:08,904 --> 00:36:10,983 Speaker 4: whatever we do, we got to make sure Cia never 769 00:36:11,024 --> 00:36:13,904 Speaker 4: finds out about this. And she's like, oh my god, 770 00:36:15,984 --> 00:36:18,223 Speaker 4: they could never know and she's like, yeah, that can 771 00:36:18,304 --> 00:36:18,864 Speaker 4: never happen. 772 00:36:18,904 --> 00:36:20,383 Speaker 3: We don't want to take up much more of your time. 773 00:36:21,183 --> 00:36:24,104 Speaker 3: Where can people find this stuff they haven't met you before, 774 00:36:24,143 --> 00:36:26,984 Speaker 3: or senior stuff before, and if you can tell us about, 775 00:36:27,064 --> 00:36:28,663 Speaker 3: you know, what else you're going to be doing in 776 00:36:28,663 --> 00:36:29,984 Speaker 3: the future, so people can look for that. 777 00:36:30,504 --> 00:36:33,783 Speaker 5: Yeah, Palmer Trolls is where you can find me on 778 00:36:33,864 --> 00:36:38,663 Speaker 5: all social media. That's my last name, Palmer and then 779 00:36:38,783 --> 00:36:41,464 Speaker 5: t R O L l s. But Ben Palmer is 780 00:36:41,504 --> 00:36:44,424 Speaker 5: my name and I'm. 781 00:36:44,263 --> 00:36:45,703 Speaker 2: Going to be doing a new tour soon. 782 00:36:45,904 --> 00:36:48,904 Speaker 5: But if you go to Ben Palmer's mooving dot com, 783 00:36:49,223 --> 00:36:51,544 Speaker 5: that's where you can do that. I tell people are 784 00:36:51,544 --> 00:36:54,144 Speaker 5: going to move to their city for a couple of days, 785 00:36:54,504 --> 00:36:56,223 Speaker 5: but then I got to move back home after that. 786 00:36:57,464 --> 00:36:59,064 Speaker 2: Right now, you can vote on where you want me 787 00:36:59,104 --> 00:37:01,584 Speaker 2: to move. I think Chicago's in the league so far. 788 00:37:05,984 --> 00:37:09,703 Speaker 1: Mission Implausible is produced by Adam Davidson, Jerry O's, j 789 00:37:10,183 --> 00:37:15,143 Speaker 1: John Cipher, and Jonathan Stern. The associate producer is Rachel Harner. 790 00:37:15,384 --> 00:37:19,183 Speaker 1: Mission Implausible is a production of honorable mention and abominable 791 00:37:19,223 --> 00:37:21,183 Speaker 1: pictures for iHeart Podcasts.