WEBVTT - Weirdhouse Cinema: Demon Pond 0:00:02.440 --> 0:00:08.719 Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio. 0:00:13.119 --> 0:00:15.320 Hey, welcome to Weird House Cinema. 0:00:15.360 --> 0:00:18.599 This is Rob Lamp and this is Joe McCormick, and 0:00:18.760 --> 0:00:21.560 today we're going to be talking about the nineteen seventy 0:00:21.640 --> 0:00:26.239 nine Japanese fantasy drama Demon Pond, directed by Massive hero 0:00:26.360 --> 0:00:29.360 Shinoda with music by Esau Tomida. 0:00:30.000 --> 0:00:32.159 Yeah, this is a film that had been on my 0:00:32.240 --> 0:00:35.000 radar for quite a bit, and I was eager to 0:00:35.000 --> 0:00:37.440 cover it when you brought it up, because in my 0:00:37.600 --> 0:00:39.920 memory I had watched a good chunk of this film 0:00:39.960 --> 0:00:43.479 on a flight maybe a year or so ago. Turns 0:00:43.520 --> 0:00:46.559 out I realized this once I started rewatching it. Oh, 0:00:46.600 --> 0:00:49.280 I actually watched the whole thing on the flight, but 0:00:50.080 --> 0:00:52.000 that might have been a red eye. I don't remember. 0:00:52.080 --> 0:00:54.120 But you know, it was one of these flights where 0:00:54.120 --> 0:00:56.040 I'm coming in and out and watching the film. You know, 0:00:56.440 --> 0:01:00.240 either there's some sort of distraction or I'm falling to sleep. 0:01:00.840 --> 0:01:03.319 And this is not a dig on this movie at all, 0:01:03.360 --> 0:01:06.040 but this is a very very easy film to fall 0:01:06.280 --> 0:01:10.640 fall asleep too. It's a film that invites transference into 0:01:10.680 --> 0:01:14.280 the dream realm because it has such an elegant soundtrack 0:01:14.400 --> 0:01:17.680 that's very soothing in many of its stretches. It also 0:01:17.800 --> 0:01:23.240 has this dreamlike visual vibe. Everything feels like the world 0:01:23.280 --> 0:01:25.600 feels like it is in a constant state of twilight 0:01:25.680 --> 0:01:29.800 or gloaming. So it is a sleepy film in all 0:01:29.800 --> 0:01:30.520 the best ways. 0:01:31.200 --> 0:01:34.440 It's a film that convinces you that you may already 0:01:34.480 --> 0:01:36.600 be dreaming. Yeah, so it's a little bit easier to 0:01:36.920 --> 0:01:40.840 slip into the actual state. We were talking just before 0:01:40.840 --> 0:01:43.600 we started about it. I for a moment was trying 0:01:43.600 --> 0:01:45.400 to make the case that, you know, it's got to 0:01:45.440 --> 0:01:47.960 be easier to fall asleep during the first half of 0:01:48.000 --> 0:01:50.600 the movie, before all the goblins show up and things 0:01:50.840 --> 0:01:53.360 get really crazy, you know, when it brings in all 0:01:53.400 --> 0:01:57.520 of the fantasy Kabooki elements, but not really even once 0:01:57.560 --> 0:02:00.720 all of the wildness starts, I think it's still kind 0:02:00.720 --> 0:02:02.400 of wants to pull you into dream world. 0:02:02.600 --> 0:02:06.360 Yeah, yeah, I think so. Now. You mentioned already that 0:02:06.400 --> 0:02:10.040 you could classify this as fantasy romance. I've also seen 0:02:10.440 --> 0:02:13.960 discussions of it as a work of folk horror. But 0:02:14.120 --> 0:02:15.360 I think at the end of the day, this is 0:02:15.360 --> 0:02:17.079 one of those films to just so much more than 0:02:17.120 --> 0:02:21.040 any classification. We could just you know, bust out and 0:02:21.400 --> 0:02:25.000 throw at it. Much has been written about exactly what 0:02:25.160 --> 0:02:28.239 Demon Pond is and where it stands in the history 0:02:28.240 --> 0:02:31.960 of Japanese cinema, but I guess in broad strokes, it's 0:02:32.040 --> 0:02:35.560 essentially a film adaptation of a very this was what 0:02:35.600 --> 0:02:39.239 a seventy eight film. No, seventy ninety film. It's a 0:02:39.280 --> 0:02:42.960 seventy nine adaptation of a seventy eight staging of a 0:02:43.080 --> 0:02:45.040 nineteen thirteen kabuki play. 0:02:46.240 --> 0:02:51.080 Yeah, which is interesting because this is also considered part 0:02:51.440 --> 0:02:54.120 of the I guess it would be becoming at the 0:02:54.120 --> 0:02:56.840 tail end of this but part of the Japanese New 0:02:56.880 --> 0:03:01.040 wave cinema movement. So it's it's very old and new 0:03:01.120 --> 0:03:03.280 at the same time, and you feel that in multiple ways, 0:03:03.320 --> 0:03:08.960 even in the story itself, but also in the elements 0:03:08.960 --> 0:03:12.079 that are coming together because it's taking this ancient art 0:03:12.120 --> 0:03:15.160 form as taking kabuki theater and I think some other 0:03:15.280 --> 0:03:18.520 older traditions as well, and wrapping it up in a 0:03:18.639 --> 0:03:20.200 very novel cinema style. 0:03:20.720 --> 0:03:23.919 Yeah, there's I think most discussions you're going to see 0:03:23.960 --> 0:03:26.600 about this film are talking about some sort of merging 0:03:26.639 --> 0:03:29.600 taking place generally, you know, like you said, new wave 0:03:29.680 --> 0:03:35.040 in old school new and old traditions, like more modern, 0:03:35.440 --> 0:03:43.400 westernized and western conscious Japan versus deeper Japanese traditions. Stage 0:03:43.480 --> 0:03:47.680 meets the screen. Traditional Japanese stage symbolism from both kabuki 0:03:47.800 --> 0:03:51.760 and no theater collide with the more naturalist film styles 0:03:51.800 --> 0:03:54.800 that are summoned in many stretches of this film, and indeed, 0:03:55.000 --> 0:03:57.640 the original play was apparently, in many ways a counter 0:03:57.760 --> 0:04:01.960 to naturalist theater in Japan. Naturalist theater in Japan is 0:04:02.000 --> 0:04:06.520 inspired by Western theater traditions. So modernity meets tradition, urban 0:04:06.560 --> 0:04:11.000 meets rural politics and folklore, and the human world collides 0:04:11.040 --> 0:04:13.320 with the natural world in ways that are both subtle 0:04:13.400 --> 0:04:14.920 and just utterly bombastic. 0:04:15.440 --> 0:04:18.920 Yeah. So, a very simple summary of the plot is 0:04:18.920 --> 0:04:22.839 that it concerns a man who goes out wandering in 0:04:22.920 --> 0:04:26.240 the countryside on holiday. It's a man named Gakawin, who 0:04:26.400 --> 0:04:29.479 is a school teacher, very much a man interested in 0:04:29.520 --> 0:04:33.640 the sciences, in rationalism. He's a school teacher, and he 0:04:33.680 --> 0:04:36.719 goes out to the mountains and the countryside, comes to 0:04:36.760 --> 0:04:40.800 a village that is parched with drought, and there he 0:04:40.920 --> 0:04:45.040 encounters a couple of people, a strange, enigmatic woman and 0:04:45.680 --> 0:04:48.480 her husband who turns out to be a long lost 0:04:48.520 --> 0:04:51.280 friend of his, a friend who vanished three years earlier, 0:04:51.839 --> 0:04:55.080 and reigniting his friendship with this man, and meeting and 0:04:55.160 --> 0:04:57.880 learning about his new wife, who is a woman from 0:04:57.920 --> 0:05:01.159 this village. The three of them sort of become wrapped 0:05:01.240 --> 0:05:05.400 up in this legend that concerns the village, a bell 0:05:05.520 --> 0:05:09.680 that hangs over the village, and an apocalyptic potential, you know, 0:05:09.800 --> 0:05:14.000 a great disaster and calamity that could come and fall 0:05:14.080 --> 0:05:17.440 upon the people of this valley here if traditions are 0:05:17.480 --> 0:05:20.640 not kept to. And this does involve the titular demon 0:05:20.720 --> 0:05:24.479 pond and the power that lies beneath it, And so 0:05:24.760 --> 0:05:27.400 it ends up bringing in a lot of different themes. 0:05:27.400 --> 0:05:29.400 When I started trying to count them up in my mind, 0:05:29.440 --> 0:05:33.760 I was like, Wow, this movie it has it involves 0:05:33.760 --> 0:05:35.680 more than you would think it does. I guess like 0:05:35.680 --> 0:05:38.400 you were just saying, like urban and rural ideas things 0:05:38.400 --> 0:05:41.320 about politics. I think, weirdly, this is a political film. 0:05:41.320 --> 0:05:43.520 It kind of from that description doesn't sound like one, 0:05:43.560 --> 0:05:47.480 but it is one. And yeah, ideas of tradition and 0:05:47.520 --> 0:05:51.839 modernity and science and rationalism and promises that how important 0:05:51.839 --> 0:05:55.400 it is to keep or pise keep promises and you know, 0:05:55.640 --> 0:05:59.599 even when it doesn't feel like they're important. And another 0:05:59.640 --> 0:06:04.000 thing that so interesting about it is the way that 0:06:04.160 --> 0:06:07.000 the movie jumps between tones. 0:06:07.520 --> 0:06:07.719 Yeah. 0:06:08.360 --> 0:06:12.279 That almost the entire first half of this movie is 0:06:12.320 --> 0:06:18.839 a quiet, subtle, strange character drama that is entirely realistic 0:06:18.920 --> 0:06:23.520 with no fantastical elements. It just has just has characters 0:06:23.640 --> 0:06:26.400 kind of exploring a landscape and talking to each other 0:06:26.920 --> 0:06:29.479 and getting weird vibes. There's a lot there is a 0:06:29.520 --> 0:06:33.039 lot of apprehension and feelings of the uncanny in the 0:06:33.080 --> 0:06:38.080 first half, but nothing actually supernatural happens. And then suddenly 0:06:38.080 --> 0:06:40.080 in the middle of the movie there is a hard 0:06:40.160 --> 0:06:41.840 shift into goblin world. 0:06:42.360 --> 0:06:45.080 Yeah, and the Goblin starts showing up. It's a little 0:06:45.160 --> 0:06:49.000 jarring at first because it's because, as we'll discuss, like 0:06:49.040 --> 0:06:52.039 they have kind of the vibe of like goofy live 0:06:52.080 --> 0:06:55.440 action yokai characters from various Japanese jokai. 0:06:55.000 --> 0:06:58.120 Films broad comedic performances. 0:06:58.000 --> 0:07:00.680 And with the superior lighting in this picture, they also 0:07:00.800 --> 0:07:03.320 reminded me a little bit of the goblins in Ridley 0:07:03.360 --> 0:07:08.120 Scott's Legend, especially since you know they're engaging in cackling 0:07:08.360 --> 0:07:09.840 conversations about things. 0:07:10.520 --> 0:07:13.640 I would almost wonder if this movie inspired Legend. 0:07:13.880 --> 0:07:15.280 Yeah, that's very possible. 0:07:15.480 --> 0:07:16.600 You know, it seems like it could have. 0:07:16.840 --> 0:07:19.200 Given the sort of film they were trying to make 0:07:19.280 --> 0:07:21.960 with Legend, I think this would be a natural thing 0:07:22.040 --> 0:07:22.880 to look at. 0:07:22.960 --> 0:07:27.040 Yeah. Yeah, And so of course all of this character 0:07:27.120 --> 0:07:30.400 drama and the fantastical elements come together for you know, 0:07:30.400 --> 0:07:32.000 I don't want to spoil too much right here at 0:07:32.000 --> 0:07:34.480 the beginning, but just to let you know, we are 0:07:34.520 --> 0:07:36.920 going to be talking about the plot in exquisite detail 0:07:36.920 --> 0:07:38.400 as we go on. So if you want to see 0:07:38.440 --> 0:07:41.360 the movie without things being spoiled, this would be a 0:07:41.360 --> 0:07:43.960 good time to stop and you know, go watch it yourself, 0:07:44.240 --> 0:07:47.800 because we will talk in detail. But it builds up 0:07:47.840 --> 0:07:51.800 to a terrifying apocalyptic conclusion that really kind of had 0:07:51.840 --> 0:07:52.840 my jaw on the floor. 0:07:53.120 --> 0:07:56.560 Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And I want to note too that 0:07:56.960 --> 0:07:59.360 in addition to the you know, the lighting and the 0:07:59.600 --> 0:08:02.000 way that you can everything looks like it's in Twilight, 0:08:02.280 --> 0:08:04.920 everything is also really lush in this picture. And in fact, 0:08:05.280 --> 0:08:09.800 they filmed in Hawaii and Brazil in order to capture 0:08:10.080 --> 0:08:13.720 all of that that lushness of the of vegetation. And 0:08:13.760 --> 0:08:19.360 then ultimately some of the torrential aquatic elements that are 0:08:19.400 --> 0:08:20.880 going to be in play late in the picture. 0:08:21.440 --> 0:08:24.920 Yeah, the greenness of vegetation is a very important part 0:08:24.960 --> 0:08:27.000 of this movie. Yeah, as is water. 0:08:28.600 --> 0:08:30.760 All Right, at this point you might be wondering, well, 0:08:30.760 --> 0:08:34.160 where can I watch Demon Pond? Well, Criterion is going 0:08:34.240 --> 0:08:35.800 to be your main source for this film, one way 0:08:35.880 --> 0:08:38.559 or another. I'm to understand. For a very long time, 0:08:38.600 --> 0:08:41.199 this was not available until a four K restoration was 0:08:41.240 --> 0:08:46.000 put together with the approval of the director and its 0:08:46.000 --> 0:08:49.800 main star, And this is the version you're going to 0:08:49.840 --> 0:08:52.240 find out there in the world right now. So yeah, 0:08:52.280 --> 0:08:57.080 Criterion either via their physical release disc which I rented 0:08:57.120 --> 0:09:00.880 from Atlanta's own videodrome, or you can on the Criterion 0:09:00.920 --> 0:09:03.560 streaming channel, which is also a great source for this 0:09:03.600 --> 0:09:04.960 sort of thing. But on top of that, there are 0:09:04.960 --> 0:09:09.240 also some other streaming platforms that also allow you to 0:09:09.360 --> 0:09:10.160 rent or buy it. 0:09:10.960 --> 0:09:13.720 Did you happen to see the review online? Where was it? 0:09:13.920 --> 0:09:17.120 John from Videodrome who said he spent years trying to 0:09:17.160 --> 0:09:19.440 figure out what this movie was that he saw it 0:09:19.480 --> 0:09:20.240 a long time ago. 0:09:21.000 --> 0:09:23.600 I didn't read his review, but I like his reviews 0:09:23.640 --> 0:09:27.080 in general, and so that's a strong sign from him. 0:09:27.520 --> 0:09:30.640 Yeah, But anyway, while I was thinking, also, it speaks 0:09:30.640 --> 0:09:32.680 to the idea that for a long time this was 0:09:32.760 --> 0:09:35.720 not particularly available. I guess there had been a VHS 0:09:35.800 --> 0:09:39.240 release a long time ago, but I think maybe a 0:09:39.240 --> 0:09:41.480 lot of people were in that situation of like having 0:09:41.520 --> 0:09:44.199 seen it in some way and a VHS release maybe 0:09:44.200 --> 0:09:46.079 and then not remembering what it was or not being 0:09:46.120 --> 0:09:48.720 able to find it on DVD or on Blu Ray 0:09:48.800 --> 0:09:49.760 until more recently. 0:09:49.960 --> 0:09:53.120 Yeah, so the version that's out now is terrific. It's 0:09:53.120 --> 0:09:56.360 also traveled around. There has been a chance to see 0:09:56.400 --> 0:09:58.839 it on the screen on the big screen in recent 0:09:58.920 --> 0:10:02.320 years and probably in the future as well. I believe 0:10:02.600 --> 0:10:08.240 Videodrome co hosted a showing of it at the Tara 0:10:08.320 --> 0:10:11.000 Theater here in Atlanta. I've also seen that it played 0:10:11.000 --> 0:10:14.440 at places like MoMA, So you know, it's made the rounds. 0:10:14.480 --> 0:10:15.640 A lot of people have gotten to see this on 0:10:15.679 --> 0:10:20.440 the big screen, and again in the quality that it deserves. Yeah, 0:10:20.520 --> 0:10:22.720 the extras on that Blue Array are really nice, by 0:10:22.720 --> 0:10:24.040 the way, They're not a ton of them, but what 0:10:24.240 --> 0:10:27.560 is on there is very informative. Particularly, there's a really 0:10:27.640 --> 0:10:30.720 nice piece on the film by noted film scholar Dudley Andrew, 0:10:31.280 --> 0:10:34.240 and I'll refer back to some of the things that 0:10:34.520 --> 0:10:36.120 Andrew points out as we perceive. 0:10:36.679 --> 0:10:38.600 Okay, should we talk about the people who made this? 0:10:38.880 --> 0:10:42.599 Let's do it starting at the top with a director, 0:10:42.679 --> 0:10:46.760 Masahiro Shinoda, who lived nineteen thirty one through twenty twenty five, 0:10:47.880 --> 0:10:51.000 Japanese director central to the Japanese New Wave movement of 0:10:51.000 --> 0:10:53.720 the fifties, sixties, and seventies. Now, Joe I had not 0:10:53.760 --> 0:10:56.959 seen any of his films before, so you'll have to 0:10:57.000 --> 0:10:58.920 jump in if you have more familiarity with some of 0:10:59.000 --> 0:11:02.719 these titles. Okay, his best known works, and clue, let's 0:11:02.720 --> 0:11:04.520 see sixty four's Pale Flower. 0:11:05.280 --> 0:11:07.960 Well, that's actually the other Shinoda movie I've seen. I 0:11:08.240 --> 0:11:11.360 just watched that one the other night, and that one 0:11:11.400 --> 0:11:15.360 is also amazing. It is a it's a realistic drama, 0:11:15.400 --> 0:11:18.000 so there are no fantastical elements in it. But it 0:11:18.040 --> 0:11:20.960 is a I think, I guess considered a neo noir. 0:11:20.960 --> 0:11:25.000 It's a noir film about a yakuza gangster who just 0:11:25.040 --> 0:11:28.840 gets out of prison and then gets involved with a 0:11:29.040 --> 0:11:31.800 woman that he meets at a gambling parlor who is 0:11:32.480 --> 0:11:36.320 on this thrill seeking streak. This woman is engaging in 0:11:36.559 --> 0:11:41.280 self destructive behaviors, seeking more and more dangerous, higher risk thrills, 0:11:41.760 --> 0:11:44.560 and this man is falling in love with her at 0:11:44.559 --> 0:11:47.040 the same time, and then I don't know, there's a 0:11:47.040 --> 0:11:49.960 lot of other interesting drama going on. So I thought 0:11:50.000 --> 0:11:52.960 that movie was fantastic, and maybe we can talk some 0:11:53.040 --> 0:11:58.240 more about it as we go on. But a really interesting, dark, complicated, 0:11:58.320 --> 0:12:01.600 character driven noir that I greatly enjoyed. 0:12:01.760 --> 0:12:04.920 Oh excellent. Let's see how the works include sixty nine's 0:12:04.960 --> 0:12:07.760 Double Suicide. This one is based on a puppet play, 0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:13.080 I believe, traditional puppet play, seventy one, Silence, seventy four's Somiko, 0:12:13.760 --> 0:12:17.480 seventy fives Under the Blossoming Cherry Trees, and eighty one's 0:12:17.520 --> 0:12:19.319 Island of the Evil Spirits. 0:12:20.240 --> 0:12:22.360 I have not seen any of those other ones, but 0:12:22.400 --> 0:12:25.800 I did want to flag I have seen Martin Scorsese's 0:12:25.840 --> 0:12:29.760 adaptation of Silence, the adaptation of the same novel that. 0:12:30.040 --> 0:12:32.120 Oh, of course, i'd forgotten about that connection. 0:12:32.200 --> 0:12:35.640 Yeah, yeah, yeah, that Shinoda's Silence is based on, which 0:12:35.679 --> 0:12:41.040 is about Catholic missionaries in Japan hundreds of years ago. 0:12:41.559 --> 0:12:43.680 And it's been a while, but I remember really liking 0:12:43.720 --> 0:12:46.160 Scorsese Silence, so I would be very interested to see 0:12:46.200 --> 0:12:47.679 Shinoda's take on it as well. 0:12:48.040 --> 0:12:50.560 All right, well, I was looking into some of these titles. Again, 0:12:50.600 --> 0:12:53.680 I have not seen any of them aside from Demon Pond, 0:12:54.200 --> 0:12:57.320 but Cherry Trees and Evil Spirits are I think they're 0:12:57.360 --> 0:13:00.000 generally considered to be either horror or at least whole 0:13:00.240 --> 0:13:04.400 adjacent with Under the Blossoming Cherry Trees concerning a mountain 0:13:04.400 --> 0:13:07.200 man who beheads his many wives to prove his love 0:13:07.240 --> 0:13:09.760 to an alluring woman he meets in an enchanted forest. 0:13:10.440 --> 0:13:13.960 Wow. Yeah, and I would I would absolutely watch a 0:13:13.960 --> 0:13:16.440 Shnoda horror movie. I'm on board. 0:13:16.600 --> 0:13:19.839 And Island of the Evil Spirits. I've seen it, I 0:13:19.840 --> 0:13:22.440 say again, I've seen it classified as maybe horror adjacent. 0:13:22.440 --> 0:13:24.200 But this one is this is that this is a 0:13:24.280 --> 0:13:29.120 murder mystery, a detective story, a detective can duchy murder mystery. 0:13:29.960 --> 0:13:33.800 And then yeah, many other works as well from Shnoda, 0:13:34.880 --> 0:13:39.520 but Demon Pond certainly stands out as well. This is 0:13:40.000 --> 0:13:41.760 this is I think often held up is one of 0:13:41.840 --> 0:13:43.840 his best, and it's also one that is I think 0:13:44.280 --> 0:13:48.679 it has been celebrated more recently via this four K restoration. 0:13:49.280 --> 0:13:51.560 It's gotten to make the rounds. You know, a whole 0:13:51.600 --> 0:13:55.839 new generations of people have been exposed to this picture. Yeah, 0:13:56.000 --> 0:13:57.840 so what. We'll have a lot more to say about 0:13:58.240 --> 0:14:01.280 about his directorial as we proceed here. 0:14:01.840 --> 0:14:04.600 Yeah, but I will just say, as of the past 0:14:04.640 --> 0:14:07.240 couple of days, my first exposure to his work, I'm 0:14:07.280 --> 0:14:09.280 a new devoted fan. 0:14:09.520 --> 0:14:13.880 Awesome now getting into the writing here. The original source 0:14:13.960 --> 0:14:19.960 material here is an older kabuki play by Koka Izumi, 0:14:20.280 --> 0:14:24.720 who lived eighteen seventy three through nineteen thirty nine. Japanese 0:14:24.720 --> 0:14:28.840 pre war novelist, writer and kabuki playwright. His work is 0:14:28.840 --> 0:14:33.400 often singled out for his romanticist supernatural tales that were 0:14:33.440 --> 0:14:38.360 influenced by much earlier Edo period works. Multiple films have 0:14:38.480 --> 0:14:41.920 been based on his writings a few during his lifetime, 0:14:41.960 --> 0:14:44.920 you know, from the nineteen thirties and then Demon Pond 0:14:44.960 --> 0:14:49.440 has been adapted more than once. I think most recently, 0:14:49.480 --> 0:14:51.600 I think there's a two thousand and five adaptation by 0:14:51.760 --> 0:14:54.880 Takeshi Mikhay, but I don't know. I don't know anything 0:14:54.920 --> 0:14:57.400 about it. I love that director as well, but I'm 0:14:57.440 --> 0:15:00.280 not sure he's varied enough in his outl but that 0:15:00.280 --> 0:15:03.280 there's at least from my standpoint, there's no telling exactly 0:15:03.280 --> 0:15:03.840 what that's like. 0:15:04.520 --> 0:15:07.200 Is it a silly version or a torture version or what. 0:15:07.400 --> 0:15:10.280 He Yeah, he contains multitudes. He's capable of so many 0:15:10.320 --> 0:15:22.840 different things, all right. Then the writers here that have 0:15:22.920 --> 0:15:26.880 adapted this older work, we have two names. There's so 0:15:27.000 --> 0:15:30.720 Tomu Tamura. I couldn't find any dates in this individual, 0:15:30.760 --> 0:15:34.120 but a Japanese screenwriter best known for The Ceremony in 0:15:34.160 --> 0:15:36.880 seventy one, Boy in sixty nine and Death by Hanging 0:15:36.920 --> 0:15:42.640 in sixty eight. And then also there's Horohiko Mimura nineteen 0:15:42.680 --> 0:15:45.560 thirty seven through two thousand and eight, Japanese screenwriter also 0:15:45.640 --> 0:15:48.120 known for sixty eight's I the Executioner. 0:15:48.480 --> 0:15:52.440 Now, Rob, I expect that, like myself, you were impressed 0:15:52.480 --> 0:15:54.640 with most of the cast. But I think the most 0:15:54.680 --> 0:15:57.400 striking performance in the movie that we're gonna have to 0:15:57.640 --> 0:16:03.960 talk about here is the double role played by Tamasaburo Bando. 0:16:04.720 --> 0:16:11.400 Yes, yes, Bando plays both the wife of one of 0:16:10.600 --> 0:16:16.160 our I don't know, expatriates of the the urban world, Yuri. 0:16:16.640 --> 0:16:22.880 And then this actor also plays Princess Shirayuki, who is 0:16:23.320 --> 0:16:25.040 of the supernatural realm as well. 0:16:25.120 --> 0:16:28.720 Learn yeah, the dragon princess of the Demon Pond and 0:16:28.880 --> 0:16:33.640 the enchanting possibly enchanted woman that Gakuin meets when he 0:16:33.640 --> 0:16:34.560 first comes to town. 0:16:34.800 --> 0:16:41.760 Right right, So, Bando was born nineteen fifty and remains 0:16:41.800 --> 0:16:46.120 like pretty much a superstar of the kobuk world. And 0:16:46.320 --> 0:16:49.920 of note, he is an on a Gata, and on 0:16:50.000 --> 0:16:54.400 Agata is a male actor who specializes in female kobuki 0:16:54.520 --> 0:16:58.280 stage roles. And this there's so I mean, there's so 0:16:58.400 --> 0:17:00.320 much to say about about this. We're not even can 0:17:00.320 --> 0:17:02.920 be able to really do more than dip our toes 0:17:02.960 --> 0:17:08.359 in this topic. But basically, the Onagata approach originated around 0:17:08.359 --> 0:17:12.760 sixteen twenty nine after female kabuki performers were banned by 0:17:12.800 --> 0:17:16.679 the Tokugawa Shogunate, so male actors had to step in 0:17:16.720 --> 0:17:20.800 and do all these roles and this and having male 0:17:20.920 --> 0:17:23.359 actors step into play the female characters. This ended up 0:17:23.400 --> 0:17:28.400 developing into its own highly refined performance art form, and Bando, 0:17:28.640 --> 0:17:32.719 still active today as of this recording on stage at 0:17:32.760 --> 0:17:35.280 any rate at the age of seventy five, has long 0:17:35.359 --> 0:17:39.959 been considered the predominant living embodiment of Onagada, and at 0:17:40.000 --> 0:17:42.919 the time this film was made. Was a superstar, like 0:17:43.600 --> 0:17:46.440 we have to just like we don't tend to think 0:17:46.480 --> 0:17:49.480 about this, I guess, you know, maybe in Western context 0:17:49.560 --> 0:17:52.160 to imagine like somebody representing like a really old school 0:17:52.200 --> 0:17:57.440 traditional performance style being a superstar as they are doing 0:17:57.520 --> 0:18:00.760 modern cinema. But he was a huge name and he 0:18:00.800 --> 0:18:03.280 had a lot of sway over the production. 0:18:04.400 --> 0:18:07.200 Yeah, I'm trying to think of a comparison. I don't 0:18:07.240 --> 0:18:09.240 know if there really is one. I mean sort of 0:18:09.359 --> 0:18:13.399 like if there was a superstar opera singer in American cinema, 0:18:13.440 --> 0:18:15.480 but even I think that doesn't really capture it. 0:18:15.720 --> 0:18:19.080 Yeah, yeah, yeah. The only thing I get like what 0:18:19.119 --> 0:18:21.760 if you had a superstar boxer playing a boxer in 0:18:21.800 --> 0:18:23.240 a movie. But then that's it's the difference. It's not 0:18:23.280 --> 0:18:25.920 a performance art, not directly a performance art. 0:18:25.960 --> 0:18:29.400 So yeah, and it doesn't have the interesting gender connotations here. 0:18:29.400 --> 0:18:32.920 Yeah yeah, yeah, And we'll come back to the gender 0:18:32.960 --> 0:18:34.840 comment to some of it here. But again, whole books 0:18:34.880 --> 0:18:36.840 have been written about this, even just like the gender 0:18:37.480 --> 0:18:38.840 studies aspect of this. 0:18:39.800 --> 0:18:42.120 But I do just want to emphasize again that Bando 0:18:42.440 --> 0:18:47.800 is a fascinating, spellbinding presence on camera here and you 0:18:47.880 --> 0:18:52.080 can tell how much went into making the characters he 0:18:52.160 --> 0:18:56.359 portrays just exude magic even when they're not speaking, and 0:18:56.400 --> 0:18:58.240 the more so when they you know, they have these 0:18:58.280 --> 0:19:02.159 strange monologues that are very different. They're not exactly the 0:19:02.200 --> 0:19:08.920 same character that, like Yuri is a very apprehensive, reserved, 0:19:09.560 --> 0:19:13.679 kind of haunted character, whereas the Dragon Princess is highly 0:19:13.760 --> 0:19:17.960 expressive and emotional and regal fight, yeah, regal and fighting 0:19:18.000 --> 0:19:22.199 against the constraints that are put on her. And so 0:19:22.400 --> 0:19:24.720 there are these very different characters, but both of them 0:19:24.800 --> 0:19:27.720 there is just enchantment pouring out of them, and a 0:19:27.720 --> 0:19:29.320 lot of that comes down to Bando. 0:19:29.640 --> 0:19:32.960 Yeah. Dudley Andrew pointed out that many viewers outside of 0:19:33.040 --> 0:19:38.200 Japan probably didn't and or don't realize that these two 0:19:38.400 --> 0:19:41.200 key female roles are played by a male actor. And 0:19:41.280 --> 0:19:43.320 I have to admit that on my first viewing that 0:19:43.520 --> 0:19:45.879 you know, on the on the airplane a year or 0:19:45.920 --> 0:19:47.760 so back, this was my case as well. I had 0:19:47.760 --> 0:19:50.359 gotten into this film relatively cold, just knowing that, you know, 0:19:50.840 --> 0:19:53.760 good things were thought about it. Yeah, And I had 0:19:53.760 --> 0:19:56.040 no idea until I came back from my rewatch. 0:19:56.480 --> 0:19:58.520 Yeah, I knew before I went into the movie, So 0:19:58.560 --> 0:20:00.399 I can't say what I would have known other wise. 0:20:00.480 --> 0:20:04.879 But yeah, I mean the characters. The characters are fully embodied. 0:20:05.080 --> 0:20:07.720 Yeah, so yeah, we'll have a lot to say about Bando, 0:20:07.720 --> 0:20:09.760 and I'll come back to on a little more about 0:20:09.760 --> 0:20:11.800 on Agada here in just a second, but just talking 0:20:11.800 --> 0:20:16.800 about Bando's film career. His film roles include a supporting 0:20:16.920 --> 0:20:21.960 role in Sijen Suzuki's ninety one film Yumiji, and the 0:20:22.080 --> 0:20:25.359 role of none other than the writer is Zumi in 0:20:25.400 --> 0:20:29.119 the nineteen eighty eight film Tokyo the Last Megalopolis. This 0:20:29.200 --> 0:20:32.560 is a film adaptation of the popular Japanese fantasy epic 0:20:32.920 --> 0:20:37.639 The Tale of the Imperial Capital by Hiroshi Atramata. This 0:20:37.680 --> 0:20:40.119 is a movie that I haven't actually seen it, but 0:20:40.760 --> 0:20:42.200 I've been aware of it for a long time, and 0:20:42.240 --> 0:20:44.199 I think a lot of international fans might know of it, 0:20:44.359 --> 0:20:47.520 especially due to a couple of factors. First of all, 0:20:48.640 --> 0:20:51.560 hr Giger worked on a particular design for this picture, 0:20:52.160 --> 0:20:55.600 so when you start pulling up Giger's film credentials and 0:20:55.880 --> 0:21:00.480 credits run across this title and you may dig deeper. Also, 0:21:00.680 --> 0:21:03.120 it makes use of a character that served as possible 0:21:03.720 --> 0:21:06.760 partial inspiration for the Street Fighter video game character that 0:21:06.800 --> 0:21:08.800 Western audiences know as m Bison. 0:21:09.320 --> 0:21:15.000 Oh interesting, Yeah, but captain, yeah, that kind of dark 0:21:15.160 --> 0:21:16.120 general character. 0:21:16.560 --> 0:21:19.879 Yeah, so well we may have to come back to 0:21:19.880 --> 0:21:22.760 that if we ever watch a street Fighter film, we 0:21:22.840 --> 0:21:24.720 might there's there is, of course. 0:21:24.560 --> 0:21:27.080 A particularly good one, maybe on a Thursday. 0:21:28.640 --> 0:21:31.399 So Bando began acting at a very young age seven, 0:21:31.480 --> 0:21:34.040 I believe, as part of his recovery from polio, and 0:21:34.160 --> 0:21:38.200 rose to become, in the words of Yuko Mashima, living 0:21:38.320 --> 0:21:43.159 proof of the vitality of kabuki, which, which again is 0:21:43.200 --> 0:21:48.760 a may sound like a very strong credential, but it 0:21:48.800 --> 0:21:51.760 seems to match up with this guy's celebrity and then 0:21:52.040 --> 0:21:56.800 just how how well everyone regards him in kabuki, especially 0:21:57.440 --> 0:21:57.879 his father. 0:21:58.520 --> 0:22:01.359 Sorry, my understanding is he didn't just do kobuki roles, 0:22:01.680 --> 0:22:04.520 in did mainstream cinema roles as well. 0:22:04.160 --> 0:22:07.040 Right, But I'm to understand that his father had forbidden 0:22:07.119 --> 0:22:11.080 him from acting in any thing besides kabuki, and it 0:22:11.080 --> 0:22:13.800 was only after his father's death. I'm to understand that 0:22:13.800 --> 0:22:16.440 Banda really began to break out into other forms of theater, 0:22:16.800 --> 0:22:21.200 other types of roles, including cinematic performances. But he would 0:22:21.280 --> 0:22:24.159 break out and portray even male characters, such as in 0:22:24.200 --> 0:22:27.160 the ninety four film Nostagia, in which he plays both 0:22:27.160 --> 0:22:31.280 a male and a female character. So I mentioned that 0:22:31.480 --> 0:22:34.280 the Bando was a huge star at this point, but 0:22:34.440 --> 0:22:38.919 also he'd never really done film before, so working for 0:22:39.000 --> 0:22:42.080 the first time here with extended close up shots, which 0:22:42.080 --> 0:22:46.000 of course don't really exist in live theater or certainly 0:22:46.040 --> 0:22:49.159 in the traditional context of theater, and so he was 0:22:49.240 --> 0:22:52.040 very particular about the way his face looked and requested 0:22:52.040 --> 0:22:55.040 a number of extra takes on things to get everything 0:22:55.040 --> 0:22:58.960 where he wanted it to get. So I think that 0:22:58.960 --> 0:23:02.040 that added to some of the complexity of the shots. 0:23:03.160 --> 0:23:07.479 But well, sometimes I think people might not realize this 0:23:07.560 --> 0:23:09.840 if you don't have experience acting, but acting for the 0:23:09.840 --> 0:23:12.640 stage and acting for film are actually quite different art 0:23:12.720 --> 0:23:16.440 forms because there's so much, you know, the camera being closer. 0:23:16.480 --> 0:23:18.720 There's a lot of subtlety that can be captured on 0:23:18.800 --> 0:23:22.239 film that doesn't really come across on stage. So this 0:23:22.320 --> 0:23:24.840 is an oversimplification, but in a lot of ways, stage 0:23:24.880 --> 0:23:28.880 performances have to be bigger, they have to be less subtle, 0:23:29.200 --> 0:23:31.720 they have to be louder. Your movements have to be 0:23:32.240 --> 0:23:35.160 you know, more projected to you know, reach people at 0:23:35.160 --> 0:23:39.040 a distance. And yeah, film performances bring in these new 0:23:39.160 --> 0:23:42.480 levels of kind of quiet variation and subtlety that can't 0:23:42.480 --> 0:23:45.520 be seen from the distance of an audience in a theater, 0:23:46.160 --> 0:23:49.359 and so they're different art forms to master. The lots 0:23:49.359 --> 0:23:50.560 of actors do both. 0:23:50.320 --> 0:23:52.760 Of course. Now I want to come back to the 0:23:52.800 --> 0:23:54.520 Onagada tradition for just a second. 0:23:54.560 --> 0:23:54.760 Here. 0:23:55.280 --> 0:23:58.080 There are, of course, traditions of cross gender acting spread 0:23:58.080 --> 0:24:02.359 across various cultures and throughout time. I go as so 0:24:02.480 --> 0:24:04.400 far as to say it's an essential part of human 0:24:04.440 --> 0:24:10.679 performance and storytelling, but Onagata is particularly fascinating in its depth. 0:24:11.240 --> 0:24:14.439 I've read that there's like a particular like feminine energy 0:24:14.520 --> 0:24:19.720 that one has to bring into your daily life according 0:24:19.760 --> 0:24:24.679 to the philosophy of the Onagata way. And so naturally 0:24:24.760 --> 0:24:27.440 there's a lot to unload here on a gender studies level, 0:24:27.480 --> 0:24:30.119 because on one side you have the embracing of the 0:24:30.160 --> 0:24:34.480 feminine energy by male identifying performers to better perform these roles. 0:24:35.040 --> 0:24:38.480 And then there's the historic through contemporary exclusion of females 0:24:38.480 --> 0:24:42.639 from mainstream, mainstream traditional kabuki. So again, whole books have 0:24:42.680 --> 0:24:45.680 been written on this subject, and I did see one 0:24:45.720 --> 0:24:49.040 that looked particularly fascinating if anyone out there wants a 0:24:49.080 --> 0:24:52.440 deeper dig into all of this, and it is Onagata 0:24:52.520 --> 0:24:57.240 a Labyrinth of gendering in Kabuki theater by Maki Isaka 0:24:57.960 --> 0:24:59.960 looks looks like a great book. I was reading just 0:25:00.040 --> 0:25:01.520 a little bit of it, but didn't have time to 0:25:01.560 --> 0:25:07.159 really go deep. Yeah, and so again Deadly andrew and 0:25:07.200 --> 0:25:09.320 others have pointed out you could go into this film 0:25:09.359 --> 0:25:11.240 and not know anything about the only god of tradition 0:25:12.480 --> 0:25:15.320 and you would be perfectly entertained, and there would be 0:25:15.359 --> 0:25:20.399 plenty of other things to think about. But Deudlely Andrews 0:25:20.440 --> 0:25:23.959 stresses that you know, we we absolutely shouldn't overlook a 0:25:24.000 --> 0:25:28.040 pretty groundbreaking kiss in the film between the character of 0:25:28.160 --> 0:25:34.000 Yuri and the character of Akira ther her husband in 0:25:34.040 --> 0:25:37.000 the film. So this is this is essentially, you know, 0:25:37.080 --> 0:25:39.560 outside of the context of the of the film, this 0:25:39.680 --> 0:25:43.360 is a same sex kiss, not the first same sex 0:25:43.440 --> 0:25:47.080 kiss in Japanese cinema, but still a pretty important one 0:25:47.160 --> 0:25:50.240 and would have been, you know, groundbreaking for the time. 0:25:50.920 --> 0:25:54.360 This comes at a really pivotal moment in the film too, 0:25:54.480 --> 0:25:58.640 because the character you called him Accura. I've always said 0:25:58.640 --> 0:26:00.320 that name Akira. I don't know if I've been saying 0:26:00.320 --> 0:26:00.720 it wrong. 0:26:00.960 --> 0:26:04.720 I have also always said Akira is certainly thinking about 0:26:04.720 --> 0:26:09.159 the anime picture Akira and Akira Krasawa and so forth. 0:26:10.640 --> 0:26:14.600 Dudley Andrew was saying Akera, and I kept thinking I 0:26:14.640 --> 0:26:19.639 was hearing Akera in the Japanese language of the film, 0:26:20.000 --> 0:26:23.400 so I could be wrong. I may jump back into 0:26:23.400 --> 0:26:26.320 saying Akira here as well out of habit. 0:26:26.400 --> 0:26:29.840 If nothing else, well, I apologize if I'm saying it wrong. 0:26:30.600 --> 0:26:32.520 Akira is going to be easier for me to say 0:26:32.560 --> 0:26:34.200 because I've always said it that way, saying I will 0:26:34.200 --> 0:26:39.399 probably hope the character the character Akira in this scene, 0:26:39.440 --> 0:26:41.960 this is in the moment when so it happens in 0:26:41.960 --> 0:26:45.560 a flashback, and it's in the moment when he is 0:26:45.680 --> 0:26:50.840 explaining to his long lost friend Gaku and explaining how 0:26:50.880 --> 0:26:54.440 he fell in love with the character Yuri, who gok 0:26:54.440 --> 0:26:56.320 going up to this point has been very skeptical of, 0:26:57.119 --> 0:26:59.840 and so it's kind of the moment where they get 0:27:00.080 --> 0:27:04.280 over this disagreement about Yuri and Gacko and is kind 0:27:04.320 --> 0:27:07.040 of brought over to a curras side and understands how 0:27:07.080 --> 0:27:10.640 he loves her, and this kiss is like what cements 0:27:10.680 --> 0:27:13.880 it in the flashback through which the story is told. 0:27:14.040 --> 0:27:18.200 So it's a pivotal, dramatic moment and it's very important 0:27:18.200 --> 0:27:20.480 in the film, and it's powerful when it happens. 0:27:20.560 --> 0:27:22.760 Yeah, and it's a real kiss. I was afraid on 0:27:22.880 --> 0:27:25.640 my rewatch, knowing about the gender roles. I was afraid 0:27:25.640 --> 0:27:28.439 they were gonna fudge it, you know. But it's a 0:27:28.560 --> 0:27:33.920 legitimate kiss. Yeah, all right. Well, speaking of the character Akira, 0:27:34.480 --> 0:27:38.280 Akira Hagawara is played by Go Kato, who lived nineteen 0:27:38.320 --> 0:27:41.960 thirty eight through twenty eighteen, Japanese actor whose other credits 0:27:42.000 --> 0:27:46.320 include sixty seven Samurai Rebellion and nineteen seventy two's Lone 0:27:46.359 --> 0:27:49.520 Wolf and Cub Baby cart Ta Haites. This is the 0:27:49.560 --> 0:27:52.680 third Lone Wolf in Cub movie in which he plays 0:27:52.880 --> 0:27:57.000 a Ronan character that I think is the central antagonist 0:27:57.359 --> 0:28:01.480 or an important antagonist in the picture. Okay, this is 0:28:01.520 --> 0:28:04.040 not one of the Lone Wolf and Cub movies that 0:28:04.240 --> 0:28:08.400 was edited together to make Shogun Assassin, which we previously 0:28:08.520 --> 0:28:11.439 watched on House Cinema. This would be the yeah, the 0:28:11.440 --> 0:28:16.800 third one after those two. Okay, but yeah, anyway, Kato 0:28:16.920 --> 0:28:19.600 heir Award winning Japanese actor who rose to fame in 0:28:19.760 --> 0:28:25.119 Samurai Rebellion sixty seven opposite Toshiro Mafuni. So he played 0:28:25.280 --> 0:28:29.080 Mafuni's character's son, and his other credits include sixty five 0:28:29.200 --> 0:28:32.440 Sort of the Beast, The Long Darkness in seventy two 0:28:33.280 --> 0:28:36.000 Let's See, and Death of a Tea Master in eighty nine, 0:28:36.680 --> 0:28:39.280 active until his passing. And he had a long TV 0:28:39.360 --> 0:28:43.240 career as well. All right, and then we have Gakawin, 0:28:43.400 --> 0:28:49.120 and Gokowin is really he's really our structural protagonist, even 0:28:49.160 --> 0:28:50.560 though he doesn't have top billing here. 0:28:51.040 --> 0:28:54.120 Yeah, the movie becomes less about him as it goes on, 0:28:54.200 --> 0:28:56.480 but certainly for the first third were just with him. 0:28:56.640 --> 0:29:02.080 Yeah. Yeah. And he is played by Sutomu Yamazaki, Award 0:29:02.080 --> 0:29:05.880 winning Japanese actor whose credits include multiple Kurosawa films, most 0:29:05.880 --> 0:29:12.160 notably sixty five's Redbeard in eighties Kaigamusha. Yeah, let's see, 0:29:12.720 --> 0:29:15.120 those are some of our main characters. We're not gonna 0:29:15.120 --> 0:29:17.160 be able to list everyone here, and certainly there are 0:29:17.160 --> 0:29:20.640 a lot of great crab and fish actors, yes, and 0:29:20.840 --> 0:29:24.480 you know, you know we can't. We can't list everybody. 0:29:25.240 --> 0:29:29.880 There is a priest character. Priest Shikami and he's played 0:29:29.880 --> 0:29:32.920 by Koji Nanbara, who of nineteen twenty seven through two 0:29:32.920 --> 0:29:36.000 thousand and one. He stood out to me because Japanese 0:29:36.040 --> 0:29:38.960 actor who played a crucial role in the ground breaking 0:29:39.040 --> 0:29:43.240 nineteen sixty seven sage in Suzuki Assassin film Branded to Kill. 0:29:44.200 --> 0:29:47.120 That's a big one. That's one that I've considered doing 0:29:47.160 --> 0:29:48.240 for weird house cinema. 0:29:48.920 --> 0:29:51.840 Is this one? This is the Shinto priest. The one, 0:29:52.200 --> 0:29:54.680 yeah is he's sort of one of the ones most 0:29:54.760 --> 0:29:57.480 on board with the diet member. Is a plot to 0:29:57.600 --> 0:29:58.760 do a human sacrifice. 0:29:58.840 --> 0:30:02.160 Yeah, yeah, there's yeah, he alongside yea, the diet member. Yeah. 0:30:02.160 --> 0:30:04.880 There's a whole host of human characters in the village 0:30:04.960 --> 0:30:08.920 and then a whole host of supernatural characters in the 0:30:09.280 --> 0:30:12.840 underwater realm. And yeah, everybody's great in their role. Be 0:30:12.920 --> 0:30:15.720 it something that is in The human characters tend to 0:30:15.720 --> 0:30:17.880 be a lot more believable and naturalistic, and of course 0:30:18.280 --> 0:30:22.480 the spirit characters are ranged from being somber and theatrical 0:30:22.520 --> 0:30:27.160 to just like outright goofy you know, so, yeah, it 0:30:27.240 --> 0:30:27.880 varies greatly. 0:30:28.400 --> 0:30:32.800 Yeah. Well, also, I think the moral coding of the 0:30:32.840 --> 0:30:36.760 different character groups is interesting because you might think based 0:30:36.800 --> 0:30:39.520 on the structure that the Dragon Princess is like the 0:30:39.600 --> 0:30:41.760 villain of the film. You know, she's the great evil 0:30:41.800 --> 0:30:45.280 baddie to overcome, but not really, She's somewhere in between. 0:30:45.320 --> 0:30:48.520 She's just a complex character with her own desires that 0:30:48.680 --> 0:30:52.240 is neither really good nor bad. She just wants something 0:30:52.280 --> 0:30:58.040 that's kind of oblique to her involvement with humans and 0:30:58.080 --> 0:31:01.520 her responsibilities to them. I would say, if the movie 0:31:01.640 --> 0:31:05.840 has a real human villain, it is the bloodthirsty diet member. 0:31:05.960 --> 0:31:09.720 Yeah, yeah, yeah, all right, let's skip ahead behind the 0:31:09.720 --> 0:31:12.640 camera for just a couple of credits here. This is 0:31:12.720 --> 0:31:16.920 definitely a visual effects picture, and there's actually a feature 0:31:16.960 --> 0:31:19.840 rite about the visual effects on the Criterion collection disc. 0:31:20.120 --> 0:31:22.200 I ended up not really diving into that one because, 0:31:22.280 --> 0:31:25.760 weirdly enough, despite this being a film with great special effects, 0:31:25.760 --> 0:31:28.280 I feel like the special effects are almost the least 0:31:28.320 --> 0:31:31.960 notable part about it. There's so much else to talk about. Yeah, 0:31:32.000 --> 0:31:34.480 but they're really well done. And it's a high budget affair. 0:31:35.120 --> 0:31:40.040 Yeah yeah, some great other world underwater sets where you 0:31:40.080 --> 0:31:42.240 can't even identify exactly what this is supposed to be. 0:31:42.320 --> 0:31:44.840 Are they in a cave under the pond? What is it? 0:31:44.880 --> 0:31:46.400 I don't know, and then we have that great water 0:31:46.480 --> 0:31:50.000 spout laid in the picture. You know, we'll come back 0:31:50.040 --> 0:31:53.040 to that. But the visual effects are credited to Minora Nakano, 0:31:53.520 --> 0:31:56.200 who of nineteen thirty nine through twenty twenty one. Lots 0:31:56.200 --> 0:31:59.480 of great Japanese SI special effects credits for this guy, 0:31:59.760 --> 0:32:03.640 beginning with mathra Versus Godzilla in sixty four. Oh, okay, 0:32:03.680 --> 0:32:06.400 which we've talked about. That's one of our selections. 0:32:06.960 --> 0:32:08.920 Clearly, there is a lot of great miniature work in 0:32:09.000 --> 0:32:12.200 this so you can see the interface with giant monster movies. 0:32:12.320 --> 0:32:15.840 Yeah, yeah, And I think particularly he did optical effects 0:32:15.880 --> 0:32:20.480 in animations in mathra Versus Godzilla, and then his subsequent 0:32:20.520 --> 0:32:23.840 films include the nineteen seventy four Thai co production Hanaman 0:32:23.960 --> 0:32:27.920 versus seven Ultraman, which we also watched perfect yep. Seventy 0:32:27.960 --> 0:32:32.280 seven is the Last Dinosaur. Seventy eight's the Bermuda Depths. Oh, 0:32:32.280 --> 0:32:35.640 that's one we've talked that we've talked maybe talked about it. 0:32:35.640 --> 0:32:40.200 It's not good, it's kind of jawsy, but it's I 0:32:40.240 --> 0:32:42.120 think that's the one with a killer sea turtle. 0:32:42.400 --> 0:32:45.400 Yeah. Is that the one with Carl weathers? Oh? 0:32:45.520 --> 0:32:48.240 Wait, that sounds right, Okay, maybe we'll put a question 0:32:48.280 --> 0:32:51.960 mark wearing very very short short. 0:32:52.920 --> 0:32:55.440 And then oh, this guy also worked on seventy eight's 0:32:55.440 --> 0:32:59.120 Message from Space, which was another early Weird House Cinema selection, 0:32:59.800 --> 0:33:02.640 and then after that he did Demon Pond and his 0:33:02.680 --> 0:33:06.200 other credits include eighty eight's Doomed Megalopolis. The last one 0:33:06.240 --> 0:33:09.720 Megalopolis Akira kurosaw was Dreams in nineteen ninety, which we 0:33:09.760 --> 0:33:10.640 also covered. 0:33:10.360 --> 0:33:11.080 On Weird House. 0:33:11.320 --> 0:33:14.440 Wow. Yeah, the Cat in nineteen ninety one, and then 0:33:14.480 --> 0:33:18.360 a film from ninety seven titled Cat's Eye that has 0:33:18.360 --> 0:33:21.280 no relation to the Stephen King adapticians Japanese film. 0:33:21.440 --> 0:33:25.000 So completely without our knowledge, we have been running a 0:33:25.000 --> 0:33:29.320 Minoro Nakano fan podcast. Yeah, like we're just doing his 0:33:29.360 --> 0:33:30.120 whole catalog. 0:33:30.240 --> 0:33:34.320 Yeah, yeah, all those films have great special effects, all right. 0:33:34.360 --> 0:33:38.080 Then finally, this film famously features a score by he 0:33:38.200 --> 0:33:41.880 Saw Tomita, who lived nineteen thirty two through twenty sixteen. 0:33:42.120 --> 0:33:45.600 This is actually our second to meta score. We previously 0:33:45.640 --> 0:33:48.400 discussed him in our episode on the sixty eight film 0:33:48.480 --> 0:33:53.720 Black Lizard, which is a great, beautiful weird picture, but 0:33:54.080 --> 0:33:56.440 the music on that one is on the for the 0:33:56.440 --> 0:34:01.520 most part, I think non electronic and as we discussed, 0:34:01.600 --> 0:34:06.000 like the story goes concerning Tamita, is that around nineteen 0:34:06.080 --> 0:34:10.200 sixty eight or shortly thereafter, he heard the Windy Carlos 0:34:10.280 --> 0:34:13.359 album Switched on Bach And is. 0:34:13.320 --> 0:34:17.719 This the one famously featured in Clockwork Orange or related 0:34:17.719 --> 0:34:20.319 to it? Well, related to it, yeah, because of the 0:34:20.320 --> 0:34:21.759 Beethoven in that. 0:34:21.719 --> 0:34:25.320 Yeah, and with the Moge synthesizer work. So the story 0:34:25.360 --> 0:34:28.360 goes that to me, to heard this work and almost 0:34:28.360 --> 0:34:32.000 immediately flies to the US to bring a Moge synthesizer 0:34:32.040 --> 0:34:34.680 back with him. I don't know how immediate it is, 0:34:34.719 --> 0:34:37.279 but like in my mind of imagining, he hears the 0:34:37.320 --> 0:34:40.960 album and just head straight to the airport. Yeah, doesn't pack, 0:34:41.200 --> 0:34:45.319 just brings back the synth, but love it. However it 0:34:45.360 --> 0:34:49.720 actually went down. Yeah, Tomita gets into it and becomes 0:34:49.719 --> 0:34:52.960 a pioneer in his own right of electronic music and 0:34:53.040 --> 0:34:56.680 space music. Like I've read that with tomto Like one 0:34:56.680 --> 0:34:59.279 of the things is that he he kind of like 0:34:59.360 --> 0:35:02.600 Wendy Carlos is a legend and and and her work 0:35:02.680 --> 0:35:06.279 is you know, absolutely undeniable, but like to meet is 0:35:06.320 --> 0:35:07.920 one of those who like kind of takes it then 0:35:08.480 --> 0:35:11.200 and goes to like another level with it as well, 0:35:11.239 --> 0:35:15.120 like ends up going into this spaceier zone, like certainly 0:35:15.160 --> 0:35:18.480 doing his his spin on the classics as well, but 0:35:18.560 --> 0:35:21.200 then finding this like sort of sci fi space zone 0:35:21.200 --> 0:35:22.600 in which to explore as well. 0:35:23.000 --> 0:35:27.320 And you get both in Demon Pond. You get electronic 0:35:27.480 --> 0:35:32.760 adaptations of classical symphonic works and then you also get 0:35:33.080 --> 0:35:35.520 just weird wacky space music. 0:35:35.640 --> 0:35:38.040 Yeah, and it gets funny at times. There's a couple 0:35:38.080 --> 0:35:39.520 there are a couple of moments where the music is 0:35:39.560 --> 0:35:44.640 really goofy, in that moge synth goofy way. Like. There 0:35:44.440 --> 0:35:47.560 are a number of like electronic pioneers would get into 0:35:47.560 --> 0:35:49.719 this sound a little bit, and sometimes I don't know, 0:35:49.760 --> 0:35:51.399 for my own part, it's a little harder to listen 0:35:51.480 --> 0:35:52.680 to those, because I, you know, I just want to 0:35:52.719 --> 0:35:56.319 hear like the really like serene samples of early synth work. 0:35:56.360 --> 0:35:58.359 But early synth work can get really goofy as well, 0:35:58.360 --> 0:35:59.719 and it's it's great in its own way. 0:36:00.160 --> 0:36:03.279 There were this is gonna sound like a horrible comparison, 0:36:03.400 --> 0:36:05.760 and I don't mean it this way because I love 0:36:05.880 --> 0:36:08.080 to meet us score here. But there were a couple 0:36:08.080 --> 0:36:10.760 of parts in the movie where the like the funny 0:36:10.880 --> 0:36:14.400 music when the goblins were doing their antics. Reminded me 0:36:14.560 --> 0:36:18.879 of the synth the synth score in the Star Wars 0:36:18.960 --> 0:36:23.880 Holiday Special when you've got you know, when there's like 0:36:24.120 --> 0:36:27.839 I think it's acrobatics or something are happening, that kind 0:36:27.880 --> 0:36:29.080 of thing. There was a bit of that. 0:36:29.280 --> 0:36:30.960 The synth world is going to have to come back 0:36:30.960 --> 0:36:33.000 to that sound, I think, And then you know, ten 0:36:33.080 --> 0:36:34.920 years down the road, that's all anybody's going to be 0:36:34.920 --> 0:36:35.480 talking about. 0:36:35.920 --> 0:36:36.600 I can't wait. 0:36:37.640 --> 0:36:41.799 But yeah, the Jen Alpha style, but to me of course, 0:36:42.440 --> 0:36:45.239 and goes on to become a legend in his own right, 0:36:45.719 --> 0:36:50.000 known for such works as Let's See Electronics, Electric Samurai, 0:36:50.080 --> 0:36:52.760 Switched on Rock, seventy six is the Planets, and seventy 0:36:52.760 --> 0:36:55.040 eight's Cosmos You'll. 0:36:54.840 --> 0:36:57.680 Find the Planets. Sorry, is that Holst? Do you know? 0:36:58.280 --> 0:37:01.040 I'm not sure off the top of my head. Maybe 0:37:01.080 --> 0:37:04.480 I'd have to look up that work. Okay, But because 0:37:04.560 --> 0:37:07.080 he again, he did do a certain amount of taking 0:37:07.120 --> 0:37:11.080 older works and then giving them the synth treatment, and 0:37:11.120 --> 0:37:13.520 you'll find loads of his work wherever you get your music. 0:37:14.000 --> 0:37:21.520 I don't think this particular score has ever received proper release. However, 0:37:21.600 --> 0:37:24.799 I was looking around for it. It looks like there's 0:37:24.920 --> 0:37:27.960 there's some sort of collaboration that he did with Bando 0:37:28.120 --> 0:37:31.200 around seventy eight, but I don't think it's direct. It's 0:37:31.200 --> 0:37:35.040 not the score, it's not the soundtrack or anything, but 0:37:35.560 --> 0:37:40.160 they should put it out. I'd love to listen to this. Yeah, yeah, 0:37:40.320 --> 0:37:42.480 so yeah again. This score is great. It has these 0:37:42.520 --> 0:37:45.799 spacier segments, but then he also makes use of contemporary 0:37:45.840 --> 0:37:49.560 European motifs from music from the period the film takes 0:37:49.560 --> 0:37:55.799 place in, so in particular Mazorski and WSA music. You'll 0:37:55.840 --> 0:37:57.719 hear that multiple times. 0:37:58.440 --> 0:38:02.200 The Mussorgski that's going to be Night on Bald Mountain. 0:38:02.480 --> 0:38:06.399 So that comes in in fact in a particularly hilarious 0:38:06.520 --> 0:38:10.160 musical moment where we're watching some of the goblins go 0:38:10.239 --> 0:38:15.160 about their business and we're first getting the comedic dup 0:38:15.239 --> 0:38:18.360 to dupe music and then for it with no warning, 0:38:18.520 --> 0:38:21.440 hard shift into electronic Night on Bald Mountain. 0:38:22.120 --> 0:38:24.360 It's great. I would totally listen to most of the 0:38:24.400 --> 0:38:28.440 score if it was released properly, but you know, when 0:38:28.520 --> 0:38:30.120 in the context of the film, it's a pretty great 0:38:30.120 --> 0:38:31.560 way to listen to it as well, because then you 0:38:31.600 --> 0:38:34.520 get the sonic experience and these fabulous. 0:38:34.160 --> 0:38:36.759 Visuals Another thing I want to point out about to 0:38:36.840 --> 0:38:39.480 me to score that's so wonderful in this movie is 0:38:39.520 --> 0:38:44.759 that it sounds like the visual and conceptual themes. The 0:38:44.800 --> 0:38:48.359 movie is about a demon pond and a creature that 0:38:48.520 --> 0:38:52.600 in many ways embodies water. Water is a core texture 0:38:52.680 --> 0:38:55.000 of the film. About the lack of water or an 0:38:55.000 --> 0:38:57.600 excess of water is so much of what the story 0:38:57.680 --> 0:39:01.439 is about. And the music sounds like like water. There 0:39:01.520 --> 0:39:04.840 are these musical motifs that sound like whirlpools that have 0:39:04.880 --> 0:39:08.239 a swirling quality. There are musical motifs that sound like 0:39:08.360 --> 0:39:13.279 bubbles rising through water. It's amazing how watery the sound is. 0:39:13.640 --> 0:39:16.360 Yeah, and then obviously there is the added element of 0:39:16.400 --> 0:39:20.680 this being like the bleeding edge of modern technological music 0:39:21.080 --> 0:39:26.560 combined with these elements of much more deeply rooted performance tradition. 0:39:27.200 --> 0:39:37.880 Yeah, okay, are you ready to talk about the plot? 0:39:37.960 --> 0:39:40.200 Yeah, let's board the train, let's walk the bridge, let's 0:39:40.200 --> 0:39:40.480 do it. 0:39:40.880 --> 0:39:44.160 Okay, And warning once again, folks, this we're going to 0:39:44.200 --> 0:39:45.880 talk about the plot in a lot of detail. So 0:39:45.960 --> 0:39:49.640 if you want to go in without spoilers, go without. 0:39:49.719 --> 0:39:52.719 You know, the spoilers we've already done. Go now, go go, 0:39:53.040 --> 0:39:56.680 you come back later. So we begin with a text 0:39:56.760 --> 0:40:01.120 legend and this bubbling effervescent electronic score, and the text 0:40:01.160 --> 0:40:05.240 in translation reads on the border between Fukui and Gifu, 0:40:05.440 --> 0:40:08.680 there is a pond called Demon pond. According to an 0:40:08.680 --> 0:40:11.880 ancient legend, a dragon dwells at the bottom of this pond. 0:40:12.840 --> 0:40:15.680 And then we open on a scene which is this 0:40:15.960 --> 0:40:20.480 large pond surrounded by forested mountain sides with lush green 0:40:20.680 --> 0:40:24.520 trees all around, and the slopes on either side framing 0:40:24.560 --> 0:40:27.720 this u shaped horizon that shows just the sky beyond. 0:40:28.640 --> 0:40:30.520 And then on the bank on the nearest side of 0:40:30.560 --> 0:40:35.080 the pond, there is a single lone architectural feature. It's 0:40:35.120 --> 0:40:38.320 a Japanese tory e. You've probably seen these at Shinto 0:40:38.360 --> 0:40:41.600 shrines and other places in Japan. This is a little 0:40:41.600 --> 0:40:45.080 structure that looks like a doorway leading from nothing to nothing. 0:40:45.160 --> 0:40:48.000 It's made of two vertical posts a few feet apart, 0:40:48.480 --> 0:40:50.920 and then a couple of cross posts joining at the top. 0:40:51.200 --> 0:40:53.719 And these can be simple like this one is, or 0:40:53.760 --> 0:40:56.120 it can be more complex with kind of a flaring 0:40:56.160 --> 0:41:00.919 of the posts or shingles or other decorations. But it's 0:41:01.000 --> 0:41:03.480 like a doorway standing in the middle of nature and 0:41:03.480 --> 0:41:07.040 these are symbolic gateways that indicate the transition from a 0:41:07.160 --> 0:41:09.400 mundane space to a sacred space. 0:41:09.840 --> 0:41:12.799 And that's pretty much what this whole first for opening 0:41:12.880 --> 0:41:15.600 moments of this film is about where we're venturing into 0:41:15.600 --> 0:41:16.120 the sacred. 0:41:17.000 --> 0:41:19.720 So the text on screen continues, it says the time 0:41:20.080 --> 0:41:23.879 was the summer of nineteen thirteen, and then we get 0:41:24.080 --> 0:41:26.280 a title and the credits come in, and the music 0:41:26.360 --> 0:41:29.920 swells and becomes really huge and regal, with these heavy 0:41:30.000 --> 0:41:33.840 hollow bells ringing and a climbing theme that sounds like 0:41:33.960 --> 0:41:37.399 voices and adulation. So it's a very powerful musical moment 0:41:37.440 --> 0:41:41.279 at the beginning. But the action resumes in a train car. 0:41:41.480 --> 0:41:44.359 We see passengers watching out the windows as the train 0:41:44.480 --> 0:41:48.120 rolls through the country, and there is a bespectacled man 0:41:48.239 --> 0:41:50.919 in a linen suit and a hat that looks sort 0:41:50.920 --> 0:41:53.560 of like a pith helmet. It's got a very Safari 0:41:53.560 --> 0:41:58.320 looking hat, and he is closely inspecting a topographic map 0:41:58.400 --> 0:42:02.040 with a magnifying glass. He kind of zooms in on 0:42:02.120 --> 0:42:04.719 a place on the map that shows a body of 0:42:04.760 --> 0:42:07.880 water called Demon Pond, and then later we see him 0:42:07.920 --> 0:42:11.560 looking through a reference book of drawings of various plant species. 0:42:11.680 --> 0:42:14.840 So the feeling we get about this guy is that 0:42:14.920 --> 0:42:17.200 he's a man of the sciences and he's interested in 0:42:17.239 --> 0:42:17.960 plant life. 0:42:18.320 --> 0:42:19.680 Yeah, he's a naturalist. 0:42:20.400 --> 0:42:22.520 So we will learn that this man is named gaku 0:42:22.600 --> 0:42:26.200 and Yamasawa. He is a school teacher, an amateur botanist, 0:42:26.560 --> 0:42:28.960 or maybe a professional botanist, I'm not quite sure. A 0:42:28.960 --> 0:42:32.480 school teacher and a botanist from the big city. He's 0:42:32.520 --> 0:42:36.319 out rambling in the countryside for his summer vacation. At 0:42:36.320 --> 0:42:38.640 a remote stop, he gets off the train with this 0:42:38.719 --> 0:42:41.799 big backpack and he begins hiking further up into the 0:42:41.800 --> 0:42:46.799 mountains on a footpath. There's this feeling of leaving civilization 0:42:47.000 --> 0:42:52.080 further and further behind. This is actually a something I 0:42:52.200 --> 0:42:57.920 really associate with Japanese fantastical films in general, kind of 0:42:58.560 --> 0:43:02.719 step wise retreat from the world of the city and modernity, 0:43:02.840 --> 0:43:06.600 where you see multiple stages of becoming less and less 0:43:06.600 --> 0:43:10.440 connected to the city world, with like first you're on 0:43:10.480 --> 0:43:12.279 the train, then you get off the train, and then 0:43:12.320 --> 0:43:15.080 you go into a more isolated place, and then from there, 0:43:15.840 --> 0:43:18.160 like the first place he goes to on this footpath 0:43:18.920 --> 0:43:22.719 is this big rope bridge spanning a ravine, This long 0:43:22.800 --> 0:43:25.239 bouncy rope bridge and we see him walking over it 0:43:25.280 --> 0:43:29.040 and see the water rushing below. But then after this 0:43:29.440 --> 0:43:32.759 there's even less kind of human infrastructure, Like he emerges 0:43:33.800 --> 0:43:37.040 into this swamp or marsh and he's looking at specimens 0:43:37.120 --> 0:43:39.680 under a microscope, and then we see him crossing some 0:43:39.800 --> 0:43:43.480 kind of desert with this scrubby vegetation and parched white earth, 0:43:44.239 --> 0:43:46.759 with these mirages of heat rising from the ground. So 0:43:46.800 --> 0:43:49.200 it's like at each step he's just getting more and 0:43:49.239 --> 0:43:50.840 more into a different world. 0:43:51.160 --> 0:43:52.440 Yeah, yeah, absolutely. 0:43:53.040 --> 0:43:54.719 There's a part in the middle of when he's in 0:43:54.760 --> 0:43:57.239 the desert here where he drains the last of the 0:43:57.320 --> 0:44:00.840 water from his canteen and he happens to notice nearby 0:44:01.000 --> 0:44:04.560 a porcelain baby doll discarded and lying on the ground. 0:44:05.840 --> 0:44:09.200 And so he hikes on from this desert into another 0:44:09.400 --> 0:44:12.840 forested highland and eventually comes to a mountain village that 0:44:12.960 --> 0:44:16.160 seems almost as dry as the desert below. There's vegetation 0:44:16.280 --> 0:44:18.480 all around, but there's a kind of camera filter that 0:44:18.560 --> 0:44:22.480 creates a CPA tone, so everything looks dead. All the 0:44:22.560 --> 0:44:27.080 vegetation is dead and dry, so the plants are desiccated, 0:44:27.239 --> 0:44:30.279 and the field crops or these gray husks, and at 0:44:30.320 --> 0:44:33.680 one point Goaquin collapses on the road, but he manages 0:44:33.719 --> 0:44:37.000 to pick himself up and keep going. And there are weird, 0:44:37.239 --> 0:44:41.560 eerie soundscapes here, like in one place extremely loud bugs 0:44:41.600 --> 0:44:45.759 like cicadas screaming, and in another place a sound. It's 0:44:45.880 --> 0:44:49.279 uncanny because there is a sound like howling wind, but 0:44:49.560 --> 0:44:52.759 we see on the screen that nothing is moving like 0:44:52.880 --> 0:44:56.360 visually the air looks still. And in this howling but 0:44:56.480 --> 0:45:01.160 still place, Gokuin encounters a lone cow just wandering and 0:45:01.200 --> 0:45:03.919 lowing on the road. It seems almost like a cow 0:45:04.000 --> 0:45:06.880 that is suffering or in pain, maybe for need of water. 0:45:08.239 --> 0:45:12.680 But it's very disconcerting atmosphere. And then he wanders further 0:45:12.719 --> 0:45:15.040 into the village. The whole time he's there he sees 0:45:15.080 --> 0:45:18.319 no one the houses. All around there are houses, but 0:45:18.760 --> 0:45:20.720 nobody's coming in and out of them, and the streets 0:45:20.719 --> 0:45:24.280 are empty. Eventually he finds a well and he runs 0:45:24.280 --> 0:45:26.840 to the well with excitement. He's eager for water. But 0:45:27.040 --> 0:45:29.640 when he gets there, he drops a rock in waiting 0:45:29.680 --> 0:45:31.920 to hear the splash, and there is none, as just 0:45:31.960 --> 0:45:36.480 a dry clack when it hits the bottom. So disappointed, 0:45:36.840 --> 0:45:39.239 he walks further into the village past a banner that 0:45:39.239 --> 0:45:43.760 says prayer for rain, until finally he crosses paths with people. 0:45:44.560 --> 0:45:47.479 The people seem to be in a funeral procession. They're 0:45:47.520 --> 0:45:51.320 marching past in a column, wearing kimono with faces painted white, 0:45:51.760 --> 0:45:55.719 and they're holding huge, tall bouquets of fake flowers and 0:45:55.840 --> 0:45:58.600 other plants I think made out of paper or some 0:45:58.680 --> 0:46:01.640 of the craft. And with them is a two wheeled 0:46:01.680 --> 0:46:04.920 cart bearing an open coffin with a dead man inside, 0:46:05.120 --> 0:46:09.480 surrounded by a kind of silver tinsel looking substance. And 0:46:09.640 --> 0:46:14.960 the procession stops briefly when a bon show bell sounds 0:46:15.000 --> 0:46:17.279 from a perch on a hill above the rest of 0:46:17.280 --> 0:46:21.440 the village, and we get a kind of cutaway. We 0:46:21.520 --> 0:46:24.799 see the belfry up above the village. It's you know, 0:46:24.920 --> 0:46:27.879 it's within visual distance, but it's a good ways up 0:46:27.920 --> 0:46:30.880 and somebody, an old man, appears to be ringing the 0:46:30.880 --> 0:46:34.840 bell with this big log that's on a rope, and 0:46:34.960 --> 0:46:38.480 Gakuin checks his pocket watch it is six o'clock. And 0:46:38.520 --> 0:46:42.640 then the procession moves on and here the wind begins 0:46:42.680 --> 0:46:44.920 to blow and it kicks up dust. They get stuck 0:46:44.960 --> 0:46:48.440 in Gakuwin's eyes, so he's holding a handkerchief to his 0:46:48.480 --> 0:46:51.280 face and he runs inside a nearby building for shelter. 0:46:52.000 --> 0:46:54.560 Once inside the building, he sees a group of men 0:46:54.640 --> 0:46:58.719 sitting in a circle talking and they're talking about the bell. 0:46:58.840 --> 0:47:01.000 One is like, not that bell again, there's no need 0:47:01.000 --> 0:47:04.120 to ring it, and then another one says, but the 0:47:04.160 --> 0:47:07.279 demon pond will overflow, a flood will come, and then 0:47:07.320 --> 0:47:10.040 another says that's just superstition, but whether it's true or not, 0:47:10.120 --> 0:47:13.680 at this point of flood would be welcome. And then 0:47:13.719 --> 0:47:16.239 the people in the house finally notice Gochowin in their 0:47:16.440 --> 0:47:19.359 entry way. He explains that he's got dust in his 0:47:19.400 --> 0:47:21.839 eye and he asks for water to wash it out, 0:47:22.400 --> 0:47:24.960 and the men are like, what you want water? Are 0:47:24.960 --> 0:47:27.880 you kidding? And then a woman comes out from the 0:47:27.920 --> 0:47:32.040 other room and kindly offers to help him. She's like, here, 0:47:32.080 --> 0:47:34.520 let me help you. And her solution is she offers 0:47:34.560 --> 0:47:39.800 to express breast milk into his eyes. Yes, and Gogowin 0:47:39.920 --> 0:47:43.000 is disturbed. He tries to be polite like he thanks her, 0:47:43.040 --> 0:47:46.640 but he quickly leaves. So something has gone horribly wrong 0:47:46.760 --> 0:47:48.520 at this village related to water. 0:47:48.960 --> 0:47:54.040 Yeah, yeah, this is such an awkward and largely uneerrotic 0:47:55.200 --> 0:47:59.520 interaction here, Like, clearly Gagawin is just completely thrown off 0:47:59.520 --> 0:48:00.000 guard here. 0:48:00.440 --> 0:48:03.279 Yeah, So he leaves the village and wanders into the 0:48:03.320 --> 0:48:06.080 woods further up the mountain side. He's still holding the 0:48:06.120 --> 0:48:09.520 handkerchief to his eye. But these woods do not appear 0:48:09.560 --> 0:48:13.600 parched like the village below. Here, it's shady green under 0:48:13.640 --> 0:48:15.880 the tree canopy, and there are all these ferns and 0:48:15.960 --> 0:48:19.120 small plants on the forest floor. And then Gakawin hears 0:48:19.160 --> 0:48:21.719 the sound of trickling water, so he hunts it down 0:48:21.760 --> 0:48:25.000 and he finds a little stream, washes his face, removes 0:48:25.000 --> 0:48:27.680 the dust from his eye, fills his canteen, and takes 0:48:27.680 --> 0:48:29.960 a drink, and we see him kind of stand up 0:48:29.960 --> 0:48:32.200 and his face is just covered in water. He's like 0:48:32.560 --> 0:48:36.320 he has been infused with essence of wetness and feels 0:48:36.440 --> 0:48:39.600 very revived. So if it's this green just up the 0:48:39.680 --> 0:48:42.280 hill from the village, why is the village so parched. 0:48:43.000 --> 0:48:46.799 It's a mystery one we'll have to to investigate. 0:48:47.360 --> 0:48:50.520 So he feels very revived, and he ventures further up 0:48:50.520 --> 0:48:52.640 the mountain as the sun is setting, and he comes 0:48:52.680 --> 0:48:56.120 across a little hut and a shrine. This is the 0:48:56.200 --> 0:48:59.200 house where somebody was ringing the bon schow bell earlier 0:48:59.239 --> 0:49:01.839 at six o'clock when he saw the funeral. So there's 0:49:01.880 --> 0:49:04.240 the belfry there on the side, and the area around 0:49:04.320 --> 0:49:07.080 this little house is very wet. There's like a small 0:49:07.200 --> 0:49:11.240 pond and a trickling brook with lush water grasses all around. 0:49:11.280 --> 0:49:14.040 So the drought has not reached this place that's just 0:49:14.120 --> 0:49:16.000 a little bit away from the rest of the village. 0:49:16.160 --> 0:49:18.520 And this is definitely a scene where we get an 0:49:18.600 --> 0:49:23.920 overwhelming sense of that sunset, twilight gloaming vibe. And in fact, 0:49:24.160 --> 0:49:26.359 at this point I also actually felt a little bit 0:49:26.360 --> 0:49:30.759 of anxiety because this reminded me very strongly of the 0:49:30.800 --> 0:49:35.160 sky and the lighting in house in that scene where 0:49:34.920 --> 0:49:38.799 where the head comes up from the well. So I 0:49:38.880 --> 0:49:41.080 was like, oh, man, something weird is about to happen, 0:49:41.120 --> 0:49:43.960 and something is weird is about to happen in some ways, 0:49:44.000 --> 0:49:48.279 but not on the level of cackling bottom biting head 0:49:48.360 --> 0:49:49.719 from the bottom of the well. 0:49:50.160 --> 0:49:52.640 Yeah, I know exactly what you're talking about. Yeah, the 0:49:52.719 --> 0:49:57.520 light becomes tremendously orange and it's the silhouette of the 0:49:57.560 --> 0:50:01.719 mountain is ominous. But anyway, so behind the house on 0:50:01.760 --> 0:50:04.719 the hill there's a woman kneeling in the grass at 0:50:04.719 --> 0:50:09.040 the water's edge. I think she's washing produce or washing food, 0:50:09.520 --> 0:50:12.960 and she begins speaking to Gacawan without turning around. She 0:50:13.040 --> 0:50:16.560 tells him the bell he heard ringing earlier is rung 0:50:16.640 --> 0:50:19.880 only three times a day, at dawn, at dusk, and 0:50:19.960 --> 0:50:22.640 late at night, and it may not be struck any 0:50:22.680 --> 0:50:25.400 other time. She says, if you are walking by, please 0:50:25.480 --> 0:50:27.799 do not strike it with that stick in fun, do 0:50:27.920 --> 0:50:31.040 not be mischievous. So it's interesting she knows he has 0:50:31.080 --> 0:50:32.960 a stick, even though she has not turned around to 0:50:33.000 --> 0:50:36.680 look at him. And there's a slow zoom on Gakawan. 0:50:37.520 --> 0:50:42.200 Very quiet, eerie music starts to play. He becomes curious, 0:50:42.680 --> 0:50:45.279 like there's drought in the village below, but up here 0:50:45.280 --> 0:50:48.360 at the house there's plenty of water, and he asks 0:50:48.400 --> 0:50:51.600 the woman about this, and she explains that it gushes 0:50:51.640 --> 0:50:54.640 from a spring. And then they have this moment where 0:50:54.640 --> 0:50:56.880 they talk about how when the water, when the flowing 0:50:56.880 --> 0:51:00.120 water hits a rock, it tinkles, and the way they 0:51:00.120 --> 0:51:03.080 say it, the way they say it in Japanese has 0:51:03.120 --> 0:51:06.919 a little automatopoia. They say like it's ding ding ding ding, 0:51:08.000 --> 0:51:10.879 like a ringing bell or like a harp, and then 0:51:11.000 --> 0:51:13.080 they talk about how the valley that they're in I 0:51:13.080 --> 0:51:15.000 think is the valley that plays a harp or the 0:51:15.080 --> 0:51:17.880 valley of harp music. But then she goes on to 0:51:17.920 --> 0:51:20.720 explain that the real source of the water that's around 0:51:20.719 --> 0:51:24.880 their house, that's coming out of the spring is Demon Pond. 0:51:24.960 --> 0:51:28.919 The water comes from Demon Pond, and Gakuwin takes interest here. 0:51:29.200 --> 0:51:31.880 He tells her that he saw Demon Pond on the 0:51:31.920 --> 0:51:34.200 map and he came here in part because he wanted 0:51:34.200 --> 0:51:37.080 to see it. And she tells him that there is 0:51:37.120 --> 0:51:39.840 a legend that a dragon sleeps at the bottom of 0:51:39.880 --> 0:51:44.560 the pond. Quote it carries poison. The villagers say that fearfully. 0:51:45.040 --> 0:51:47.560 The rocks change color in the water to purple and 0:51:47.640 --> 0:51:52.080 green rouge granules seen at times. It's very beautiful. The 0:51:52.160 --> 0:51:55.640 villagers say the dragon's scales have been shed. They say 0:51:55.680 --> 0:51:59.759 it is fishy, dirty, uncanny, and that the water is poisoned. 0:52:01.520 --> 0:52:04.759 I like the ambiguity of the description here. I don't 0:52:04.760 --> 0:52:07.759 know exactly what's causal from one statement to the next, 0:52:07.880 --> 0:52:10.560 but it's a little bit hair raising, especially since he 0:52:10.600 --> 0:52:14.120 already drank the water. He becomes very concerned. He's like, well, 0:52:14.160 --> 0:52:16.160 I drank the water from the stream, I washed my 0:52:16.239 --> 0:52:18.040 eyes in. It is something going to happen to me. 0:52:18.440 --> 0:52:20.920 I do love the idea of the dragon scales. The 0:52:20.960 --> 0:52:22.960 shed scales are in the water. Yeah. 0:52:23.000 --> 0:52:27.399 Yeah. And the woman, you know, he's concerned, but she says, 0:52:27.440 --> 0:52:30.600 you know, the villagers are suspicious, but we drink the water, 0:52:31.320 --> 0:52:33.240 meaning her and the people who live at this house. 0:52:33.960 --> 0:52:36.399 We haven't met anybody else there yet, but we drink 0:52:36.400 --> 0:52:39.640 the water and nothing happens to us. So that makes 0:52:39.640 --> 0:52:42.759 the villager suspicious of them, Like, you know, if the 0:52:42.760 --> 0:52:44.960 water is poisoned, but they drink it and they're fine. 0:52:45.000 --> 0:52:50.239 Maybe they're witches or something. That's the implication. And Gakuin 0:52:50.360 --> 0:52:53.160 drops his compass into the water by accident. The woman 0:52:53.239 --> 0:52:55.680 retrieves it for him, and then finally, here we get 0:52:55.719 --> 0:52:59.120 a revelation of the woman's face as she uncovers her 0:52:59.160 --> 0:53:02.879 hair turns to look at Gakawin. This is the woman 0:53:02.960 --> 0:53:08.880 played by Tamasaburobando, and the film suggests that something strange 0:53:09.080 --> 0:53:12.440 is happening. We don't again, it's not clear exactly what 0:53:12.480 --> 0:53:16.160 it is, but upon seeing this woman, Goquin is shaken 0:53:16.640 --> 0:53:21.080 and the music is again bubbling swirling, effervescent and magical, 0:53:21.640 --> 0:53:23.960 and this is one of the parts where Tomita really 0:53:24.000 --> 0:53:28.120 manages to make the music sound like water. So they 0:53:28.160 --> 0:53:33.640 have this strange, enchanted form of eye contact, and Gakowin 0:53:33.719 --> 0:53:35.600 asks if he can stay for a cup of tea. 0:53:35.760 --> 0:53:38.280 The woman says yes, she's trying to be a good host, 0:53:38.760 --> 0:53:41.360 and so she goes inside the house. And then Gakawin 0:53:41.400 --> 0:53:43.719 looks down at the compass of his that fell into 0:53:43.760 --> 0:53:46.280 the water, and it's spinning all around like in Bermuda 0:53:46.360 --> 0:53:48.640 Triangle movies. I bet there's a scene like this in 0:53:48.640 --> 0:53:49.560 the Bermuda depths. 0:53:49.600 --> 0:53:51.560 Yeah, it's all but smoking here. 0:53:52.120 --> 0:53:57.160 Yeah. So inside, the woman who we learn is named Yuri, 0:53:57.920 --> 0:54:02.239 talks with her husband Akira or Akira, the handsome young 0:54:02.280 --> 0:54:05.799 man with silver hair, and Akira asks Yuri to ask 0:54:05.840 --> 0:54:08.360 the traveler if he has a good story to tell, 0:54:08.719 --> 0:54:11.120 and we see that Akira is working over a text 0:54:11.200 --> 0:54:14.600 called Collection of Old Legends, so this is a narrative guy. 0:54:14.680 --> 0:54:20.279 He's looking for legends. All through these scenes, Rob, I 0:54:20.280 --> 0:54:22.560 wonder what you think about this. I feel like there 0:54:22.600 --> 0:54:28.520 is consistently something strange about Uri, not something bad, like 0:54:28.600 --> 0:54:32.200 she is portrayed as polite and a good host. There's 0:54:32.200 --> 0:54:37.360 nothing nefarious about her, but there is an uncanny distance 0:54:37.600 --> 0:54:41.520 and hesitation in her behavior, like she is out of 0:54:41.680 --> 0:54:45.480 place or living in the wrong world, but also with 0:54:45.600 --> 0:54:49.239 these dimensions of anxiety, like she's living in fear of 0:54:49.239 --> 0:54:51.680 something that cannot be spoken of. Do you know what 0:54:51.719 --> 0:54:52.319 I'm saying here? 0:54:52.400 --> 0:54:54.120 Yeah? I think that's a good point. This is also 0:54:54.520 --> 0:54:57.919 the scene though, is there's a lot to unpack here 0:54:58.040 --> 0:55:04.440 because she's also behaving and she's she's treating a wanderer 0:55:05.040 --> 0:55:06.960 who has come up and is asking for aid, and 0:55:07.000 --> 0:55:10.520 so like she's navigating certain social norms here. But then 0:55:10.560 --> 0:55:14.000 we quickly see that there is the white haired gentleman 0:55:14.160 --> 0:55:19.520 is is remaining hidden, and she's somehow navigating this as well. 0:55:19.600 --> 0:55:21.839 So yeah, all of these elements make for a scene 0:55:21.880 --> 0:55:24.719 that is on one level, like very straightforward, like a 0:55:25.200 --> 0:55:29.120 wanderer is being greeted with tea and then later some fruit, 0:55:30.360 --> 0:55:33.040 But then there's also something else going on, perhaps on 0:55:33.120 --> 0:55:33.880 multiple levels. 0:55:34.280 --> 0:55:38.680 Yeah yeah, yeah, so she's she is displaying kindness and hospitality, 0:55:38.719 --> 0:55:44.120 but there's also this level of apprehension. Yeah yeah, yeah, 0:55:44.320 --> 0:55:47.720 So Gakuwin sits with your EA outside on the veranda 0:55:47.840 --> 0:55:50.400 and they have tea and chilled pairs while they talk. 0:55:50.560 --> 0:55:52.760 Yeah, we see him eat one, but it later sounds 0:55:52.800 --> 0:55:54.280 like maybe he ate like six pairs. 0:55:55.520 --> 0:55:57.000 Yeah, it seems like maybe he's had a lot of 0:55:57.040 --> 0:56:00.279 fair Also, Gaquin is a skilled peeler of pairs. Do 0:56:00.320 --> 0:56:02.239 you see he takes the entire skin off in the 0:56:02.280 --> 0:56:04.719 one the one long strip? Yeah. 0:56:04.800 --> 0:56:06.839 Yeah, I've been trying to lick my apples that way 0:56:06.880 --> 0:56:09.760 these days, but I still end up making a mess 0:56:09.800 --> 0:56:11.440 that I guess I haven't refined it. 0:56:11.920 --> 0:56:14.040 I like to eat the apple peels. I'm a big 0:56:14.080 --> 0:56:14.560 peel fan. 0:56:14.640 --> 0:56:17.239 Oh yeah, yeah, well I've been Yeah, I still eat 0:56:17.239 --> 0:56:18.880 the peels, but I've been trying to do the whole. 0:56:18.960 --> 0:56:21.040 Like I'm gonna sit here and like use a knife 0:56:21.080 --> 0:56:23.440 to like cut off little slivers of the apple and 0:56:23.480 --> 0:56:23.719 eat it. 0:56:23.760 --> 0:56:26.160 Oh I do do that. Yeah, I'm not a bite 0:56:26.200 --> 0:56:28.240 into the apple person. I like to cut off pieces. 0:56:28.320 --> 0:56:30.520 Yeah, I've largely been a bite into the apple person. 0:56:30.520 --> 0:56:32.760 But then sometimes like I'm ot at the computer I'm working, 0:56:32.800 --> 0:56:35.440 I'm biting into apple, sprays apple juice on the screen. 0:56:35.480 --> 0:56:37.400 I gotta clean that up. But now I'm trying to 0:56:37.440 --> 0:56:40.319 cut the apple and I'm still slinging juice around the room. 0:56:40.360 --> 0:56:42.040 So I don't know. I've got to work on my form. 0:56:42.400 --> 0:56:46.200 So actually what I'm doing recently is we've gotten my 0:56:46.280 --> 0:56:48.800 daughter likes apple, but only the inside doesn't want the peels. 0:56:48.840 --> 0:56:50.400 So I'm trying to cut it in a way that 0:56:50.520 --> 0:56:54.160 creates peel pieces and non peel pieces and equal measures 0:56:54.160 --> 0:56:55.680 so that I can, you know, do one and then 0:56:55.760 --> 0:56:57.960 the other and I eat the peel pieces. 0:56:58.239 --> 0:57:01.279 As she's seen one of those the apple peelers, where 0:57:01.320 --> 0:57:03.319 you like lock it into the device, and. 0:57:03.200 --> 0:57:07.200 We've actually got one of those, we just haven't used it. 0:57:07.200 --> 0:57:09.400 It's like it takes some setting up. 0:57:09.840 --> 0:57:12.600 I remember from the past. It only makes sense if 0:57:12.600 --> 0:57:15.359 you're doing like large scale apple peeling for some sort 0:57:15.360 --> 0:57:16.560 of a culinary project. 0:57:17.360 --> 0:57:20.400 Wow, this has been peel talk, Yeah, Robin Joe. So 0:57:21.720 --> 0:57:24.960 back to the movie. So we learned that we learned 0:57:24.960 --> 0:57:28.440 from the conversation between Gacawin and Uri that this house 0:57:28.560 --> 0:57:31.080 used to be a temple storehouse, but the temple burned 0:57:31.080 --> 0:57:34.200 down long ago, and that's why there is a sacred 0:57:34.240 --> 0:57:36.360 bell here because it used to be a temple. I 0:57:36.360 --> 0:57:39.400 feel like this detail it's only mentioned in Passing and 0:57:39.440 --> 0:57:42.320 doesn't come up again. There's something about the idea of 0:57:42.360 --> 0:57:45.520 the temple burning down long ago and this Belfrey being 0:57:45.560 --> 0:57:48.640 a remnant that kind of ties in with themes that 0:57:48.680 --> 0:57:52.560 will become more important later on about what really is tradition, 0:57:52.760 --> 0:57:56.120 what types of tradition are worth honoring, and you know, 0:57:56.320 --> 0:58:00.320 do we does do the obligations of the past still 0:58:00.400 --> 0:58:08.600 linger and things like that. But again, uh, Gakuin is thankful. 0:58:08.680 --> 0:58:11.600 He tries to be a good, you know, a good 0:58:11.720 --> 0:58:15.040 guest and tries to pay for the hospitality. At one 0:58:15.120 --> 0:58:17.600 point he says something about this being a tea house. 0:58:17.600 --> 0:58:20.000 So I don't know if he if there is confusion 0:58:20.000 --> 0:58:23.360 about whether this is just somebody's house that he's being 0:58:23.400 --> 0:58:25.560 offered tea at, or if it is a tea house 0:58:25.600 --> 0:58:26.880 that serves customers. 0:58:27.480 --> 0:58:29.360 Yeah, yeah, he says something of the effective like, oh, 0:58:29.400 --> 0:58:31.439 it's a temple. I knew it wasn't just a tea 0:58:31.480 --> 0:58:32.120 house or something. 0:58:32.200 --> 0:58:36.000 Yeah, okay, maybe that's what it was. Yeah, But he 0:58:36.080 --> 0:58:38.200 tries to pay for the hospitality. Uri says that she 0:58:38.240 --> 0:58:40.640 will not accept payment in the form of money, only 0:58:40.680 --> 0:58:42.920 in the form of him telling her a great story 0:58:43.040 --> 0:58:46.680 of the strange from his travels, and this seems to 0:58:46.760 --> 0:58:50.080 raise Gakuwain's suspicions. We will learn why in a bit, 0:58:50.760 --> 0:58:52.760 But he starts to tell a story from etches In 0:58:52.840 --> 0:58:56.960 Province about a dumpling that was transformed into something that 0:58:57.000 --> 0:58:59.440 gets interrupted by the next big plot beat. Though I 0:58:59.480 --> 0:59:00.720 wanted to hear the dumpling. 0:59:00.480 --> 0:59:02.320 Stone, I know I was. I felt the same way, 0:59:02.400 --> 0:59:05.200 like what does it transform into? Because I've I've read 0:59:05.240 --> 0:59:08.440 some stories from I can't remember offhand off it was 0:59:08.640 --> 0:59:11.560 of Japanese origin or Chinese origin, but of dumplings coming 0:59:11.560 --> 0:59:13.680 to life and essentially running around as little people. 0:59:13.800 --> 0:59:16.920 So he says something about it going under the veranda 0:59:17.120 --> 0:59:19.640 or something. But yeah, it doesn't finish the story because 0:59:19.960 --> 0:59:23.680 as Gakuwin speaks inside, Akira is listening and he hears 0:59:23.720 --> 0:59:27.560 his voice and he's he freezes. Akira is deeply troubled 0:59:27.880 --> 0:59:31.720 because he recognizes Gakuwin's voice, and at one point he 0:59:31.760 --> 0:59:34.880 peeks out through the door and Gakawin sees him. Gaquin 0:59:34.920 --> 0:59:38.360 seems to recognize him as well. So here I'm gonna 0:59:38.400 --> 0:59:41.160 shift a bit from the more moment to moment narration 0:59:41.320 --> 0:59:45.080 into some summary of what follows. So it turns out 0:59:45.280 --> 0:59:48.800 Akira and Gakuin are long lost friends. They were once 0:59:49.160 --> 0:59:53.760 like brothers. But three years ago Akira disappeared without a trace, 0:59:54.480 --> 0:59:58.560 not a single word to his friends or family. Gakuin 0:59:58.680 --> 1:00:02.160 knew that a Kira a disliked city life and thought 1:00:02.240 --> 1:00:04.720 he may have fled to live in the country, but 1:00:04.840 --> 1:00:07.360 nobody knew for sure, and many were afraid that he 1:00:07.400 --> 1:00:11.240 had died. It turns out, in reality, what happened is 1:00:11.280 --> 1:00:15.640 that Akira went traveling north from Tokyo to collect strange 1:00:15.760 --> 1:00:18.440 local tales and legends for a book he was writing 1:00:19.160 --> 1:00:22.240 because he's some sort of folklore scholar. And then, just 1:00:22.440 --> 1:00:25.880 like Gakawin, Akira had been drawn to this village because 1:00:25.880 --> 1:00:28.680 he saw the demon pond on a map and wanted 1:00:28.720 --> 1:00:32.280 to see it in person. Except when he arrived. At 1:00:32.280 --> 1:00:34.439 this point, all we learn is that he met Uri, 1:00:34.640 --> 1:00:37.120 They fell in love, and they got married, and they 1:00:37.120 --> 1:00:40.880 have been living here together ever since. But why didn't 1:00:40.920 --> 1:00:44.080 Akira let his friends and family know there is something 1:00:44.160 --> 1:00:48.000 strange going on here again, an unspoken tension or reticence. 1:00:48.480 --> 1:00:52.360 For example, Akira's he's got silver hair when we first 1:00:52.400 --> 1:00:55.160 see him, and he later reveals to Gaqawain that it's 1:00:55.160 --> 1:00:57.840 a wig, Like, why is he in disguise in his 1:00:57.920 --> 1:00:58.320 own house. 1:00:58.400 --> 1:01:01.800 Yeah, out in the such a rural setting. Yeah, who's 1:01:01.800 --> 1:01:03.720 gonna see him? Who's he hiding from? 1:01:03.920 --> 1:01:07.400 Also, Uri in particular seems to be afraid of Gakuwin 1:01:07.520 --> 1:01:12.680 finding out Akira's identity. Yuri says, you know, with this, 1:01:12.800 --> 1:01:15.400 with this kind of pitiful fear. She says, if you 1:01:15.480 --> 1:01:18.000 go away with him, I'd be and then she just 1:01:18.080 --> 1:01:21.640 trails off in fright, like something terrible will happen to 1:01:21.640 --> 1:01:25.080 her if he's not there with her. H And at 1:01:25.160 --> 1:01:28.680 first Yuri manages to talk Akira out of revealing himself 1:01:28.680 --> 1:01:31.400 to Gakawin, but eventually Akia can't stand it. This is 1:01:31.480 --> 1:01:34.160 like after Gakuwin has already left and it starts raining. 1:01:35.400 --> 1:01:37.880 Akira goes after him, finds him in the woods and 1:01:38.040 --> 1:01:40.360 admits who he is, So he invites his old friend 1:01:40.360 --> 1:01:42.160 to stay the night at their house, and they spend 1:01:42.200 --> 1:01:45.240 a long time that evening catching up. Gakuwin has a 1:01:45.280 --> 1:01:48.440 lot of questions about Uri, rob I wonder what you 1:01:48.560 --> 1:01:53.560 make of like what is the source of initially of 1:01:53.640 --> 1:01:58.040 Gakuwin's suspicion about her, because she's been nothing but nice 1:01:58.040 --> 1:02:02.360 to him, and and in fact, even in the first 1:02:02.360 --> 1:02:05.520 time they meet. He seems rather taken with her, like 1:02:05.560 --> 1:02:08.200 he's kind of entranced by her, but also a little 1:02:08.240 --> 1:02:13.240 bit unsettled. So is it just that she's just giving 1:02:13.320 --> 1:02:16.600 off vibes? Is it magical kind of frightening energy or 1:02:16.640 --> 1:02:17.960 is there something specific? 1:02:18.360 --> 1:02:20.880 I mean, I think it is a general thing like that, 1:02:20.960 --> 1:02:23.120 you know, she has a kind not like a straight 1:02:23.200 --> 1:02:26.200 up spooky vibe, but there is an ethereal nature to her. 1:02:26.440 --> 1:02:30.680 There's the whole disappearance of Akira, and then maybe there's 1:02:30.720 --> 1:02:34.680 also a bit playing with the folkloric elements that the 1:02:34.760 --> 1:02:37.680 trope that we see in at least some Japanese folk 1:02:37.720 --> 1:02:41.880 tales of some sort of a spirit bride that comes 1:02:41.960 --> 1:02:44.960 into someone's life and changes that life one way or another. 1:02:45.360 --> 1:02:48.320 Yeah, there will be other character elements that come in 1:02:48.400 --> 1:02:50.720 later that I think may explain part of this, and 1:02:51.040 --> 1:02:52.919 we'll talk about that when it comes up. But yeah, 1:02:52.960 --> 1:02:56.600 at this point I wonder to what degree he really 1:02:57.040 --> 1:02:59.320 is afraid of her being magical in some way because 1:02:59.320 --> 1:03:02.360 he asks a He's like, is she a sorceress? And 1:03:02.440 --> 1:03:06.960 Akira is like no, what makes you say so? But anyway, 1:03:07.320 --> 1:03:10.400 they talk and they decide that since Gachowin came here 1:03:10.400 --> 1:03:12.240 to see the demon pond. They are going to go 1:03:12.280 --> 1:03:14.200 out tonight and see it together. So it's a five 1:03:14.280 --> 1:03:17.160 kilometer walk through the woods, and then there is a 1:03:17.600 --> 1:03:20.720 there's a very gun on the mantelpiece, you know, Chekhov's gun. 1:03:20.760 --> 1:03:23.080 You kind of seen where they're like, there may be 1:03:23.160 --> 1:03:25.240 bamboo and vines to cut through on the way to 1:03:25.320 --> 1:03:28.640 demon pond. So we must take our sickles and oh no, 1:03:28.720 --> 1:03:31.920 the sickles are dull, Yuri, would you please sharpen our sickles? 1:03:32.560 --> 1:03:35.560 So like Uri working the sickles on the wet stone 1:03:36.040 --> 1:03:38.440 in the spring while the two men put on their shoes. 1:03:39.360 --> 1:03:41.080 There's it's an eerie moment. 1:03:42.600 --> 1:03:44.320 Yeah, we know it's going to pop up back up 1:03:44.360 --> 1:03:45.000 again for sure. 1:03:45.520 --> 1:03:49.640 One of them says it looks really sharp now. So 1:03:49.800 --> 1:03:54.280 also in the scene, Gakuin makes little comments to Akira 1:03:54.320 --> 1:03:58.760 about escaping, and Yuri is frightened about them leaving. She 1:03:58.840 --> 1:04:01.040 says that she's going to feel so lonely. She actually 1:04:01.040 --> 1:04:03.840 clutches a doll. It's a pitiful thing, like, you know, 1:04:03.960 --> 1:04:07.200 clutches a doll, Like there's a kind of return to 1:04:07.320 --> 1:04:08.880 childhood and her fear here. 1:04:09.120 --> 1:04:11.840 Yeah, I mean, already there's so many you could begin 1:04:12.040 --> 1:04:14.439 just taking little bits of string and mapping them out 1:04:14.520 --> 1:04:17.320 different elements of the plot. Because we have this doll here, 1:04:17.360 --> 1:04:19.800 we have that doll in the desert that we saw. 1:04:20.040 --> 1:04:22.440 The doll in the desert looked very European, and this 1:04:22.520 --> 1:04:27.080 doll looks more authentically Japanese, at least in my eye. 1:04:28.040 --> 1:04:30.960 There's also this like this escape element. 1:04:31.120 --> 1:04:31.320 Right. 1:04:32.120 --> 1:04:35.600 We have characters that we've discussed as escaping the urban 1:04:35.680 --> 1:04:39.760 world to venture into the rural, escaping the modern to 1:04:39.840 --> 1:04:42.840 go into the traditional, and now the reverse is being discussed. 1:04:51.600 --> 1:04:54.120 So we should note. On the night that our main 1:04:54.200 --> 1:04:58.160 characters meet, there is a brief rainstorm, but it's so brief. 1:04:58.280 --> 1:05:00.200 By the time the villagers are able to get out 1:05:00.200 --> 1:05:02.600 their buckets and pails to catch the rain, it's over, 1:05:02.800 --> 1:05:04.800 so it's like the weather is taunting them a lot 1:05:04.800 --> 1:05:07.720 of disappointment. Then there is also a very important scene 1:05:07.720 --> 1:05:13.160 here where the politician shows up, the local member representing 1:05:13.200 --> 1:05:16.600 the village in the Diet. The character's name is Koso 1:05:17.120 --> 1:05:18.480 and a Kuma, but I think I'm just going to 1:05:18.520 --> 1:05:22.000 call him the Diet member. The politician arrives by car 1:05:22.080 --> 1:05:24.440 with bags of rice for the villagers and there is 1:05:24.640 --> 1:05:28.440 much rejoicing because of the rice. So he comes in 1:05:28.480 --> 1:05:30.360 and you know, the people take the rice out there. 1:05:30.400 --> 1:05:32.000 There's like one guy in the village who's the big 1:05:32.040 --> 1:05:34.720 tough wrestler guys. I think he's helping them move the 1:05:34.800 --> 1:05:38.440 rice in. Uh, and they like spill the rice all 1:05:38.480 --> 1:05:40.640 over the floor of the house they're moving them into, 1:05:40.720 --> 1:05:43.120 and the villagers are just scooping it up by by 1:05:43.240 --> 1:05:44.680 with their hands in a frenzy. 1:05:44.880 --> 1:05:48.240 Yeah. Yeah, so there's almost all there's a lack of decorum, 1:05:48.280 --> 1:05:50.680 even such as their excitement for the rice. 1:05:51.320 --> 1:05:54.840 There is also a scene where a man is out 1:05:55.000 --> 1:05:57.960 hunting a fish that flops in the shallow mud of 1:05:58.000 --> 1:06:00.960 a pond under a sign that says no fishing aloud, 1:06:01.440 --> 1:06:04.520 and he's singing a great song. This is the translated 1:06:04.600 --> 1:06:07.960 lyrics of the song are there's no lack of goblins, 1:06:08.080 --> 1:06:10.480 which is just like, I want that to be a 1:06:10.600 --> 1:06:12.080 book title, album title. 1:06:12.120 --> 1:06:14.720 Great. I was thinking this could be straight up a 1:06:14.800 --> 1:06:16.200 rocky ericson song right here. 1:06:16.360 --> 1:06:20.320 Just yeah, there's no lack of goblin. Yeah, there's no 1:06:20.440 --> 1:06:23.680 lack of goblins. They come in many shapes, one eyed monster, 1:06:23.880 --> 1:06:28.880 water imp goblin, cat, bucking echo, goblin, cat Goblin of 1:06:28.920 --> 1:06:32.640 the sea. Then there's that one with an egg like face, 1:06:32.720 --> 1:06:34.560 and I think we see that one, think we do. Yeah, 1:06:34.600 --> 1:06:35.080 he's spooky. 1:06:35.280 --> 1:06:35.440 Yeah. 1:06:35.760 --> 1:06:37.680 So the fisherman, I don't know if he's actually a 1:06:37.760 --> 1:06:41.640 fisherman or just in this moment opportunistically has caught a 1:06:41.680 --> 1:06:43.840 fish in his hat. I'm gonna call him the fisherman. 1:06:44.480 --> 1:06:46.680 He catches a fish in his hat and decides he's 1:06:46.680 --> 1:06:49.400 gonna sell it to the assemblyman and get a good price. 1:06:50.160 --> 1:06:52.240 On the way back to the village, though, he's carrying 1:06:52.280 --> 1:06:54.920 this fish in his hat, and he stops to peek 1:06:55.040 --> 1:06:57.960 in the window of Yuri and Akira's house, and he 1:06:58.040 --> 1:07:02.440 sees Yuri by herself, and then she slowly turns to 1:07:02.560 --> 1:07:06.040 look at him through the window, and then suddenly he 1:07:06.160 --> 1:07:09.400 is frozen with fear and then shouts in pain because 1:07:09.480 --> 1:07:13.280 a crab has crawled onto his foot and pinched him. 1:07:14.000 --> 1:07:16.000 So he, I think, takes this as some kind of 1:07:16.000 --> 1:07:19.400 horrible sign. He drops the fish into the little pond 1:07:19.520 --> 1:07:23.120 beside the house, and then we see the crab crawling 1:07:23.160 --> 1:07:26.040 down a rock into the pond as well, and then 1:07:27.200 --> 1:07:30.760 he's gone. He takes off in terror, and we're about 1:07:30.800 --> 1:07:33.200 fifty minutes into the movie at this point, and then 1:07:33.240 --> 1:07:36.120 it takes a turn because now we get our first 1:07:36.240 --> 1:07:40.440 encounter with supernatural creatures. Clear like whatever's going on with 1:07:40.640 --> 1:07:44.560 Uri she it could just be weird energy. Up to 1:07:44.600 --> 1:07:48.520 the you know, there's nothing explicitly magical, but now we 1:07:48.560 --> 1:07:53.240 get our first explicitly supernatural creatures. The music becomes strange 1:07:53.320 --> 1:07:56.840 and whimsical, and we zoom down into the magic of 1:07:57.320 --> 1:08:01.840 pond World and meet the humanoid spirit embodiment of the 1:08:01.880 --> 1:08:04.920 fish that was caught. Is this the carp spirit, the 1:08:04.920 --> 1:08:08.320 one they call car plators? Oh yeah, yeah, the of 1:08:08.400 --> 1:08:12.120 the carp and the crab that saved him. And so 1:08:12.240 --> 1:08:16.680 the fish spirit is a inhumanoid form, is a gleaming, 1:08:16.960 --> 1:08:20.800 slime covered black mass in the moonlight who looks like 1:08:21.120 --> 1:08:24.559 he's got this giant, soggy bloom of hair around his head. 1:08:24.920 --> 1:08:29.360 And the crab spirit is very crabby. He's painted bright red. 1:08:29.479 --> 1:08:32.559 He has these huge claw hands, prosthetic claw hands, and 1:08:32.600 --> 1:08:35.639 he walks with a hunched posture. He is more aggressive, 1:08:35.680 --> 1:08:38.400 the more aggressive of the two rob I don't know 1:08:38.400 --> 1:08:41.120 if you have any other notes on on our first 1:08:41.160 --> 1:08:42.800 goblins here, but they're wonderful. 1:08:43.000 --> 1:08:48.000 They are wonderful, there's a death. These are not necessary. 1:08:48.000 --> 1:08:50.120 There's not really yokai. But again they remind me a 1:08:50.160 --> 1:08:53.240 lot of yokai movies, live action yokai movies from Japan. 1:08:53.960 --> 1:08:57.479 There is, they look great, but there is not an 1:08:57.520 --> 1:09:02.080 attempt here to make the crab man look more than 1:09:02.160 --> 1:09:05.120 like twenty five percent crab. I don't know, right, you know, 1:09:05.160 --> 1:09:08.639 Like he's it's very obviously a man with crab arms. 1:09:08.680 --> 1:09:11.840 And then the fish spirit is looks mostly like a 1:09:11.880 --> 1:09:16.639 grimy human. But they have the essence of these animals 1:09:16.680 --> 1:09:19.559 that they are portraying, and it would works, but it's 1:09:19.680 --> 1:09:23.800 very well, it strikes a very comedic cord for sure. 1:09:24.320 --> 1:09:27.040 The crab guy is, he's just like a wild guy 1:09:27.120 --> 1:09:31.720 with crab claws painted red. And the fish is the 1:09:31.760 --> 1:09:34.360 fish could be like a member of the band corn 1:09:34.520 --> 1:09:39.719 covered in like crude oil. Yeah yeah, yeah, so yeah. 1:09:39.760 --> 1:09:44.360 And they have spirit banter too, like they're they're buffoonish characters. 1:09:45.000 --> 1:09:48.400 They get angry at the discarded sedge hat that the 1:09:48.439 --> 1:09:51.160 fishermen had used to catch the fish in, so they 1:09:51.200 --> 1:09:53.320 stomp on it, and then they decide that it's not 1:09:53.479 --> 1:09:56.679 actually the hat's fault that the fish was caught Also 1:09:56.720 --> 1:09:59.360 the hat starts talking, the hats like, not my fault. 1:10:00.120 --> 1:10:02.680 Yeah, if you just saw this sequence, you would have 1:10:02.840 --> 1:10:05.519 a totally different idea of what Demon Pond would be about. 1:10:06.000 --> 1:10:10.360 You would not at all get the strange, quiet, haunted 1:10:10.840 --> 1:10:14.800 feeling of everything that's happened up to this point. But yeah, 1:10:14.840 --> 1:10:18.240 so it becomes very goofy and funny. The hat says, 1:10:18.280 --> 1:10:19.880 it's not my fault, and then they throw the hat 1:10:19.880 --> 1:10:22.600 in the air and lands on the head of a 1:10:22.640 --> 1:10:25.920 shrine statue. They say, look how it flies, just like 1:10:25.960 --> 1:10:29.360 a man's head, suggesting that sometimes they behead people and 1:10:29.400 --> 1:10:33.120 throw their heads. So, I guess these are I don't know, dangerous, 1:10:33.320 --> 1:10:35.080 dangerous crab and fish spirits. 1:10:35.280 --> 1:10:40.320 Yeah, they're they're not overly kind concerning humanity, and we'll 1:10:40.320 --> 1:10:41.400 see more of them a bit. 1:10:41.680 --> 1:10:45.559 No, they don't like humans. And they so they say 1:10:45.600 --> 1:10:47.800 they're going to travel to the fish's parental home, which 1:10:47.800 --> 1:10:50.519 we assume is Demon Pond. They're going to Demon Pond, 1:10:51.240 --> 1:10:53.679 and they talk about the Princess of the Pond. They say, 1:10:53.720 --> 1:10:56.160 does she have any intention to let it rain? And 1:10:56.200 --> 1:10:58.559 they say, ah, the drought, it's none of her business, 1:10:58.560 --> 1:11:01.479 it doesn't concern her. And then they start talking about 1:11:01.479 --> 1:11:05.040 something that will become important dragon princess lore. They say, 1:11:05.080 --> 1:11:09.040 she loves the young man of Singja Pond at King Gamine. 1:11:09.400 --> 1:11:12.720 She thinks of him constantly. They say, why can't she 1:11:12.840 --> 1:11:15.120 just spread her sleeves and fly to go see him, 1:11:15.520 --> 1:11:18.759 Because she can't do that because if she leaves Demon Pond, 1:11:19.000 --> 1:11:21.519 there will be a terrible flood and the whole valley 1:11:21.560 --> 1:11:24.400 will be submerged. But then the crab says, oh, what 1:11:24.520 --> 1:11:27.360 of it, that would expand my habitation. Let the village 1:11:27.400 --> 1:11:28.639 become a muddy marsh. 1:11:29.120 --> 1:11:29.920 Gotta love crab. 1:11:30.360 --> 1:11:34.519 Yeah, And they also passed the bell. They talk about 1:11:34.520 --> 1:11:37.000 how if the bell is not wrung, the flood will 1:11:37.040 --> 1:11:39.720 be unleashed and the world will become a paradise for them. 1:11:39.720 --> 1:11:42.400 So they're kind of looking forward to this, And this 1:11:42.560 --> 1:11:46.240 is the moment when the music they're like regarding the bell, 1:11:46.360 --> 1:11:48.880 and suddenly the music goes from this whimsical boot dey 1:11:48.920 --> 1:11:51.200 boop stuff into the night on bald Mountain. 1:11:51.800 --> 1:11:54.479 Yeah, we're switched on Mazorski at this point, I guess. 1:11:54.880 --> 1:11:57.760 Yeah. So they're cavorting in the moonlight and they sing 1:11:57.800 --> 1:12:00.559 a song, actually a kind of eerie song called turn 1:12:00.640 --> 1:12:04.839 the mountain into a river. Later, we see them encounter 1:12:05.000 --> 1:12:08.040 another animal water spirit on a journey to the Demon Pond. 1:12:08.479 --> 1:12:11.080 This is an old man hobbling through the woods with 1:12:11.160 --> 1:12:14.800 these catfish barbles hanging from his face. We learn that 1:12:14.840 --> 1:12:18.600 he is called Black Catfish Priest, a catfish who was 1:12:18.600 --> 1:12:22.280 turned into a monk. And he's got a letter from 1:12:22.400 --> 1:12:25.360 the gentleman of Sinja Pond to deliver to the princess 1:12:25.360 --> 1:12:26.160 of Demon Pond. 1:12:26.320 --> 1:12:30.200 Uh oh, yeah, and I love Black Catfish Priest. He's tremendous. 1:12:30.240 --> 1:12:31.880 He's great, great makeup here. 1:12:32.960 --> 1:12:35.800 So Also at this point, Akira and Gakowin are on 1:12:35.880 --> 1:12:38.920 their journey to the Demon Pond, and Akira recounts the 1:12:39.040 --> 1:12:42.960 legend of the pond to Gakuwin. It goes like this 1:12:43.120 --> 1:12:46.960 quote men fought the water. The village seemed doomed at 1:12:46.960 --> 1:12:50.080 that time. A holy man can find the Dragon God 1:12:50.200 --> 1:12:54.080 to that pond. The dragon the dragon God said, my 1:12:54.200 --> 1:12:57.240 freedom is lost, as I pledged to save men from drowning. 1:12:57.680 --> 1:13:00.720 Cast a huge bell, ring it thrice each day to 1:13:00.800 --> 1:13:03.920 awaken me and remind me of my promise. I long 1:13:04.080 --> 1:13:07.080 for freedom to move around, to have my own way, 1:13:07.479 --> 1:13:11.000 to forget the pledge making the water of this pond overflow. 1:13:11.479 --> 1:13:14.240 In gaining freedom, I care not how many men and 1:13:14.320 --> 1:13:17.479 beasts perish. And yet the pledge will be kept. But 1:13:17.560 --> 1:13:19.960 I must be reminded of it lest I forget. Do 1:13:20.080 --> 1:13:24.599 not neglect to ring the bell. Okay, So the story 1:13:24.640 --> 1:13:28.200 again is, Yeah, the dragon god is confined against its 1:13:28.320 --> 1:13:32.639 will to the demon Pond and I, and it wants 1:13:32.680 --> 1:13:34.400 to get out, and if you let it get out, 1:13:34.520 --> 1:13:36.280 it is going to cause a flood. But it has 1:13:36.360 --> 1:13:38.479 promised it will not leave, and you've got to remind 1:13:38.560 --> 1:13:40.559 it of its promise three times a day with the bell. 1:13:40.800 --> 1:13:46.360 So an ancient, an ancient pact, an ancient promise preventing cataclysm, 1:13:46.840 --> 1:13:50.599 and tradition is essential to secure the pact. 1:13:51.040 --> 1:13:54.360 That's right. Also, we get some flashback here where Akira 1:13:54.880 --> 1:13:57.519 tells the story of how he came to take over 1:13:57.760 --> 1:14:01.200 the bell. So he says that an old man tended 1:14:01.240 --> 1:14:03.960 to the bell for fifty years before he arrived, and 1:14:04.040 --> 1:14:07.000 when Akira first came three years ago, he stayed with 1:14:07.080 --> 1:14:09.240 the man in his house. This is the house Akira 1:14:09.320 --> 1:14:12.639 now lives in. But one night, upon returning from ringing 1:14:12.680 --> 1:14:16.000 the bell, the old man collapsed and the dying man 1:14:16.080 --> 1:14:18.639 begged a Kira. He's like, take over my duties. If 1:14:18.640 --> 1:14:21.960 no one rings the bell, everyone will die. And at 1:14:21.960 --> 1:14:24.439 first Akira he agrees to this promise, and he does 1:14:24.479 --> 1:14:27.559 it just to placate a dying man. He intends to 1:14:27.640 --> 1:14:30.120 ring it only once and then convince someone from the 1:14:30.200 --> 1:14:33.640 village below to take over for him. But when he 1:14:33.720 --> 1:14:36.600 explains the legend to the villagers, the villagers are not 1:14:36.720 --> 1:14:39.040 bought in on this. They just laugh in his face. 1:14:39.400 --> 1:14:42.120 No one believes the story, and so nobody's willing to 1:14:42.200 --> 1:14:45.000 do it. So it falls to Akira. He has to 1:14:45.000 --> 1:14:47.360 go back and keep ringing the bell because nobody else 1:14:47.360 --> 1:14:50.679 will take over. A few other scenes in here, there's 1:14:50.680 --> 1:14:53.880 a scene where we get to see the villagers feasting. 1:14:53.960 --> 1:14:58.080 They're going and gorging themselves on the polished rice that 1:14:58.120 --> 1:15:01.200 the politician brought. But I was wondering what did they 1:15:01.240 --> 1:15:03.519 cook it with? They don't have any water, Like, did 1:15:03.560 --> 1:15:05.519 they have to use breast milk to make their rice? 1:15:06.600 --> 1:15:08.960 Maybe they were able to get just enough rain water 1:15:09.040 --> 1:15:09.320 for this. 1:15:09.920 --> 1:15:13.719 Yeah, So the fishermen who got pinched by the crab 1:15:13.760 --> 1:15:16.559 spirit is here and we learn in this scene that 1:15:16.600 --> 1:15:19.439 he has a reputation about town as a scoundrel, like 1:15:19.479 --> 1:15:21.680 the men mock him for always hanging out by the 1:15:21.680 --> 1:15:26.200 belfry hoping to see Uri. And then also at this time, 1:15:26.240 --> 1:15:29.559 we see Yuri at home having a weird communion with 1:15:29.640 --> 1:15:32.760 the moon and with her doll. She talks about how 1:15:32.760 --> 1:15:35.559 the night is so long and she is alone, and 1:15:35.600 --> 1:15:39.479 then she repeats the song she heard the spirits singing 1:15:39.520 --> 1:15:42.400 through the wall. She starts singing, turn the mountain into 1:15:42.520 --> 1:15:47.240 a river, which is a little bit frightening, and it 1:15:47.280 --> 1:15:51.559 implies that there is some connection between the spirit world 1:15:51.600 --> 1:15:53.320 and the physical world. I mean, I guess we already 1:15:53.320 --> 1:15:56.839 saw that in that the crab spirit did pinch the fishermen, 1:15:57.320 --> 1:16:00.639 and also Yuri has been hearing their songs sings it too. 1:16:03.080 --> 1:16:07.200 So Crab Karp and Black Catfish Priest make their way 1:16:07.240 --> 1:16:11.200 down into the layer of the Dragon Princess under Demon Pond, 1:16:11.680 --> 1:16:15.479 and they pass through this wonderfully bizarre cave set that 1:16:15.680 --> 1:16:18.439 is kind of hard to describe, but it's full of 1:16:18.520 --> 1:16:22.400 these roots and mud, and it's populated with all sorts 1:16:22.400 --> 1:16:27.560 of humanoid spirit creatures where you've got various fish, turtles, frogs, 1:16:27.760 --> 1:16:32.160 crab and then other less watery demons, just assorted demons 1:16:32.160 --> 1:16:34.760 and goblins of muck that I can't really see an 1:16:34.800 --> 1:16:36.080 animal comparison for. 1:16:36.160 --> 1:16:38.280 That, kind of like egg face dude is here. 1:16:38.479 --> 1:16:41.280 He's kind of Cyclopean with a cone head or an 1:16:41.360 --> 1:16:44.160 egg head, and he's making like a vulcan salute with 1:16:44.240 --> 1:16:49.639 his fingers. And the catfish priest here before he meets 1:16:49.680 --> 1:16:52.760 the dragon princess he makes he becomes anxious about the 1:16:52.800 --> 1:16:56.040 contents of his letter. He's like, what if it tells 1:16:56.040 --> 1:16:59.040 the dragon princess to cut him up and eat him? 1:17:00.040 --> 1:17:02.360 And then he remembers a story of a time when 1:17:02.400 --> 1:17:04.920 he got in trouble with his own pond lord because 1:17:04.960 --> 1:17:07.599 he was watching a beautiful woman bathe naked in the water, 1:17:08.080 --> 1:17:10.639 and the other spirits think this is hilarious. A lot 1:17:10.640 --> 1:17:14.479 of like crab and fish spirit antics here again, these 1:17:14.560 --> 1:17:19.760 these comedic performances. And then the crab decides to use 1:17:19.800 --> 1:17:22.800 its scissors to cut open the letter box so they 1:17:22.840 --> 1:17:25.200 can read what's in the letter. But before they can 1:17:25.240 --> 1:17:27.880 read it, a voice cries out and says, away with 1:17:27.960 --> 1:17:31.639 you creatures of mud, like, oh no, here she comes, 1:17:31.680 --> 1:17:35.280 and we finally meet the dragon Princess. So things are 1:17:35.280 --> 1:17:39.320 getting real. Now once again, this is this is Bando 1:17:39.520 --> 1:17:43.439 also in the performance as the Dragon Princess. The Dragon 1:17:43.479 --> 1:17:47.320 Goddess is an elegant queen in a red gown embroidered 1:17:47.320 --> 1:17:51.040 with flowers and gold lining. She has this beautiful crown 1:17:51.120 --> 1:17:54.719 of gold and crystal with these dangling pieces that sway 1:17:54.800 --> 1:17:58.599 when she moves. Her face is pale with kabuki makeup, 1:17:59.360 --> 1:18:02.280 so she has a scented eyebrows and deep red lips. 1:18:02.840 --> 1:18:05.519 And she kind of swoops in with her retinue, which 1:18:05.520 --> 1:18:09.960 includes all kinds of figures, these monstrous samurai and these 1:18:10.000 --> 1:18:13.800 ghostly women with faces painted white. And she takes the 1:18:13.880 --> 1:18:18.320 letter from Catfish and tries to read it. First, she 1:18:18.360 --> 1:18:21.120 says how irritating it is to read a letter by moonlight, 1:18:22.000 --> 1:18:24.599 And then one of her servants says, oh, you know, 1:18:24.680 --> 1:18:27.880 your majesty, as the incarnation of the Dragon God, your 1:18:27.920 --> 1:18:31.400 own radiation. The implication is should be enough to read by, 1:18:32.000 --> 1:18:34.680 and it's true enough. She glows and then reads the 1:18:34.760 --> 1:18:38.839 letter by her own glow, and we come to understand 1:18:38.840 --> 1:18:42.160 it as a very good love letter, very well written, 1:18:42.280 --> 1:18:46.240 gentle and beautiful in its language, and the Dragon Princess 1:18:46.320 --> 1:18:49.840 is smitten. She desperately wants to go to Singapond and 1:18:49.960 --> 1:18:53.280 be with this other pond lord. He must be a great, 1:18:53.400 --> 1:18:58.479 awesome pond lord, so she wants that. But her nurse, 1:18:58.560 --> 1:19:01.400 who is an older woman with the catlike appearance and 1:19:01.439 --> 1:19:05.840 these and like wispy white hair, the nurse reminds her 1:19:06.000 --> 1:19:09.479 of her duty. She cannot leave. The nurse makes it 1:19:09.479 --> 1:19:12.160 clear she's like, I'm not saying I love humans. I 1:19:12.160 --> 1:19:14.439 don't care whether they live or die. In fact, she 1:19:14.479 --> 1:19:18.240 refers to them as monkeys without tails. But she says 1:19:18.360 --> 1:19:21.320 a promise is a promise, and the princess cannot break it. 1:19:21.800 --> 1:19:24.840 The princess reacts to this with rage. She tries to 1:19:25.040 --> 1:19:28.720 order her soldiers to go and destroy the bell, but 1:19:28.800 --> 1:19:31.160 her nurse rebukes her again and tells her no, she 1:19:31.200 --> 1:19:34.800 cannot command this. And then the nurse starts trying to 1:19:34.880 --> 1:19:37.720 bargain or compromise. She tells her like, look, you only 1:19:37.760 --> 1:19:39.760 need to wait a little bit longer. It won't be 1:19:39.840 --> 1:19:42.439 thirty or fifty years, just a little bit longer before 1:19:42.479 --> 1:19:44.960 you can be free. And I was trying to think, 1:19:45.320 --> 1:19:47.960 what's going on here is the nurse. Does the nurse 1:19:48.080 --> 1:19:51.639 think she's telling her? The truth is she reasoning, pretty 1:19:51.680 --> 1:19:54.280 soon they'll forget to ring the bell, and then you'll 1:19:54.280 --> 1:19:56.240 be free of your pact, and then you can flood 1:19:56.280 --> 1:19:59.600 the valley and go be free. Or is she just 1:19:59.680 --> 1:20:02.240 trying to kind of like tide her over. I don't 1:20:02.280 --> 1:20:03.960 know really what the nurse is thinking. 1:20:04.400 --> 1:20:06.160 Yeah, that's a good point though about like if you 1:20:06.280 --> 1:20:08.640 just keep if you just keep at it, you know, 1:20:08.720 --> 1:20:12.080 don't but break the pledge, the humans are going to 1:20:12.120 --> 1:20:14.800 forget about it, and the bell's not going to be wrong, 1:20:14.840 --> 1:20:15.599 and then we're free. 1:20:16.120 --> 1:20:18.720 Yeah. Yeah, So I don't know. Maybe the nurse is 1:20:18.760 --> 1:20:20.360 just trying to get through one day at a time. 1:20:20.439 --> 1:20:25.400 But the Dragon Princess, she's furious. She wanders around the 1:20:25.479 --> 1:20:29.200 dark cavern and she says, a yearning, a yearning heart 1:20:29.280 --> 1:20:32.640 will overcome all barriers. I am unwilling to wait, and 1:20:32.680 --> 1:20:35.680 she's just acting out these feelings. She can't stand it. 1:20:36.560 --> 1:20:38.920 And then here it also turns into I mentioned that 1:20:38.960 --> 1:20:41.320 there are multiple scenes of this in the movie, of 1:20:41.760 --> 1:20:44.960 a kind of moral bargaining, where the princess starts making 1:20:44.960 --> 1:20:48.559 a lot of excuses for doing what she knows is wrong. 1:20:49.160 --> 1:20:53.080 She talks about how humans break their promises all the time. Yeah, 1:20:53.280 --> 1:20:57.280 they break their promises. She also says promises are arbitrary, 1:20:57.840 --> 1:21:00.360 and then she says, my ancestors made this play out 1:21:00.400 --> 1:21:03.520 of convenience. Why should I be bound by what they pledged? 1:21:04.479 --> 1:21:07.120 And again her servants and advisors tell her that she 1:21:07.200 --> 1:21:10.400 cannot break the pledge, and they remind her, you know, 1:21:10.479 --> 1:21:12.840 if the humans ever fail, if they ever fail to 1:21:12.920 --> 1:21:14.920 ring the bell three times a day, you are free 1:21:14.960 --> 1:21:17.400 and can leave at your own will. But until then 1:21:17.760 --> 1:21:22.479 you have to do your duty. But she she's like, no, no, no, 1:21:22.560 --> 1:21:25.560 And so she leads her retinue to the bell. And 1:21:25.760 --> 1:21:28.360 so her whole like drenched court comes out of this 1:21:28.520 --> 1:21:32.599 pondly other world and out into the area of the bell, free, 1:21:33.600 --> 1:21:36.519 and they're standing there with like the wind whipping at 1:21:36.560 --> 1:21:39.320 her hair and clothes. And she says she doesn't care 1:21:39.400 --> 1:21:42.879 if there is divine punishment. Love is more important. Quote 1:21:43.000 --> 1:21:46.920 how blissful to dissolve in the stream of affection. Let 1:21:46.920 --> 1:21:50.160 my body be crushed to pieces, my soul will still 1:21:50.240 --> 1:21:53.240 yearn for him. Is hope as faint as a firefly's 1:21:53.320 --> 1:21:57.120 dim light. And I love this part because maybe I'll 1:21:57.160 --> 1:22:01.320 mention some more parallels later. But so self destructive love 1:22:01.360 --> 1:22:04.280 and passion is a major theme of Pale Flower as well, 1:22:05.000 --> 1:22:07.639 so something in both of these Shinoda movies I've seen. 1:22:16.880 --> 1:22:20.000 So the princess is getting ready to do the unthinkable, 1:22:20.120 --> 1:22:23.879 to violate her packed and destroy the bell, whatever divine 1:22:23.880 --> 1:22:27.439 punishment may come to her. But then she is she's 1:22:27.520 --> 1:22:32.599 given pause because she hears Yuri singing, and from this 1:22:32.880 --> 1:22:36.559 example she learns that when separated from a loved one, 1:22:37.120 --> 1:22:41.080 singing to oneself can provide comfort, like her nurse is saying, yes, 1:22:41.160 --> 1:22:44.080 it's exactly that, Yes, singing to yourself can be comforting, 1:22:44.760 --> 1:22:47.000 and this kind of causes her to come to her senses, 1:22:48.120 --> 1:22:50.600 and she talks about, you know, if the bell were destroyed, 1:22:50.720 --> 1:22:53.680 innocent good people would die too. The implication is that 1:22:53.800 --> 1:22:56.360 like Yuri, who seems to be an innocent good person, 1:22:56.400 --> 1:23:00.479 would perish, though general opinion of the villagers remains low. 1:23:01.200 --> 1:23:04.080 And then Yuri herself comes out to ring the bell 1:23:04.120 --> 1:23:06.160 because Akira is away for the night, so she comes 1:23:06.200 --> 1:23:08.679 out to ring the bell, and once she rings the bell, 1:23:08.760 --> 1:23:11.479 like hits the log into the bell, the princess and 1:23:11.560 --> 1:23:14.240 all of the other creatures are sent reeling. They are 1:23:14.360 --> 1:23:18.200 drawn by some powerful force like a hurricane back to 1:23:18.320 --> 1:23:19.520 the Demon pond. 1:23:19.360 --> 1:23:22.439 Almal shades of a night on bald Mountain, right, Yeah. 1:23:21.960 --> 1:23:24.400 Yes, actually, so we see them like whipped about by 1:23:24.400 --> 1:23:28.759 this magical wind and slow motion, which is interesting because 1:23:28.800 --> 1:23:32.320 it's like the reminder of the bell is physically efficacious. 1:23:32.479 --> 1:23:35.799 It's not just psychological for the spirits, it literally forces 1:23:35.880 --> 1:23:40.840 them back. And there is this strange, beautiful gravity defying 1:23:41.160 --> 1:23:44.720 kabuki dance when we watch the dragon princess sinking down 1:23:44.720 --> 1:23:48.479 beneath the water, and then at the same time we 1:23:48.520 --> 1:23:50.559 see her sinking into the water, and at the same 1:23:50.600 --> 1:23:54.200 time in the mundane world, Akira and Gakuin are at 1:23:54.240 --> 1:23:57.760 the physical demon pond, standing at the edge, and we 1:23:57.840 --> 1:24:00.280 don't see them encounter each other at all. Is a 1:24:00.360 --> 1:24:03.280 kind of different world's thing, parallel worlds in a way. 1:24:05.000 --> 1:24:07.240 So this is the scene where Gakuwin and Akira kind 1:24:07.240 --> 1:24:11.719 of compare worldviews. Like Gakuwen is a man of science 1:24:11.800 --> 1:24:16.040 and rationalism, Akira is a lover of legends and myths. 1:24:16.640 --> 1:24:20.640 Gakuwin does not typically accept magical reasons for things, like 1:24:21.240 --> 1:24:24.080 Akira says, you know, but if the pond is not magical, 1:24:24.120 --> 1:24:26.599 why is it that no leaf rests on the pond's 1:24:26.600 --> 1:24:30.040 surface and Gakuwan gives an explanation related to the wind, 1:24:30.360 --> 1:24:32.679 though I think it's interesting that he makes an exception 1:24:32.840 --> 1:24:35.760 for Yuri. He is frightened of her, and he tells 1:24:35.800 --> 1:24:39.840 Akira that she is not human. Gakuwin wants Akira to 1:24:40.040 --> 1:24:43.519 leave his wife and escape with him. There's something strange 1:24:43.560 --> 1:24:45.960 about her and about this place, and he's in danger, 1:24:46.320 --> 1:24:49.639 and Akira becomes angry. He violently resists this, and they 1:24:49.640 --> 1:24:52.479 have a brief fight where Akira knocks down his old 1:24:52.520 --> 1:24:55.800 friend and forces him to apologize. And at this point 1:24:55.840 --> 1:24:59.679 I think another motivation for Gakuwin comes into focus. Maybe 1:24:59.720 --> 1:25:03.640 why he's feeling so strange about Uri. It's not just 1:25:03.840 --> 1:25:08.520 the vibes she's giving off. It's also maybe jealousy, jealousy 1:25:08.560 --> 1:25:11.960 of the fact that she has had his old friend 1:25:12.040 --> 1:25:15.280 for all these years and he has not, So there's 1:25:15.320 --> 1:25:17.519 a jealousy there. And then I wonder also if it's 1:25:17.600 --> 1:25:20.400 jealousy the other way, like he finds her beautiful and 1:25:20.560 --> 1:25:23.000 is attracted to her in a way and is jealous 1:25:23.040 --> 1:25:26.320 of Akira because it seems that Gakuin does not have 1:25:26.560 --> 1:25:30.280 a family of his own. This scene gives way into 1:25:30.840 --> 1:25:33.800 what we were talking about earlier, where Akira remembers, like, 1:25:33.840 --> 1:25:36.120 there's a flashback to how he fell in love with Uri. 1:25:36.200 --> 1:25:38.640 He remembers the day that he met her. He was 1:25:38.680 --> 1:25:42.200 planning to leave the village, but then they met at 1:25:42.280 --> 1:25:46.440 opposite at ends of opposite docks jutting into this shallow marsh, 1:25:46.840 --> 1:25:50.360 and she tells him that she found papers that he 1:25:50.479 --> 1:25:53.280 left behind on which he recorded the legend of the 1:25:53.320 --> 1:25:56.479 Bell and the Demon Pond, And in this instant he 1:25:56.560 --> 1:25:58.800 falls in love with her, and he can't leave because 1:25:58.800 --> 1:26:02.479 he can't bear the thought of Yuri in particular being 1:26:02.560 --> 1:26:05.040 killed in the flood, so he stays to tend to 1:26:05.080 --> 1:26:08.559 the bell and becomes her husband. He doesn't seem to 1:26:08.560 --> 1:26:10.559 be all that bothered by the idea of anybody else 1:26:10.600 --> 1:26:12.479 in the village being killed in the flood, but if 1:26:12.560 --> 1:26:16.680 Yuri were killed, he's like, that would be unacceptable. And 1:26:16.760 --> 1:26:20.000 we see them falling in love in a montage set 1:26:20.000 --> 1:26:23.599 to again these strange electronic pads with the swirling sounds, 1:26:23.920 --> 1:26:26.320 and they embrace and kiss and they talk about the 1:26:26.320 --> 1:26:29.880 moonflowers and settle into the house by the belfry. Now 1:26:30.000 --> 1:26:33.200 next we get into the final showdown of the movie, 1:26:33.240 --> 1:26:35.439 which is set up by a long sequence where the 1:26:35.560 --> 1:26:39.000 villager is presided over by the politician the diet member. 1:26:40.040 --> 1:26:43.679 Now that they have feasted on polished rice, they begin 1:26:43.840 --> 1:26:46.639 to talk themselves into the idea that there is only 1:26:46.720 --> 1:26:49.360 one way to solve the drought and bring rain, and 1:26:49.479 --> 1:26:53.640 that is to have a human sacrifice. I think the 1:26:53.680 --> 1:26:56.120 diet member is the one who first suggests it, and 1:26:56.200 --> 1:26:59.479 they decide they have to sacrifice the most beautiful young 1:26:59.520 --> 1:27:03.400 woman in town. So there is searching around for which 1:27:03.400 --> 1:27:06.000 woman will be sacrificed. Do they argue about it? Like 1:27:06.479 --> 1:27:09.000 the guy who caught the carp earlier has to defend 1:27:09.040 --> 1:27:13.200 his own daughter against being sacrificed by implying that she 1:27:13.360 --> 1:27:16.759 is sexually promiscuous, humiliating her in front of the town. 1:27:17.160 --> 1:27:19.280 But there's maybe a sense that he's making it. He's 1:27:19.320 --> 1:27:21.080 like youths come in the night or something like that. 1:27:21.360 --> 1:27:23.960 Well, he's like making it up, and she seems humiliated. 1:27:24.040 --> 1:27:26.080 Yeah, I mean, yeah, she's humilated either way. But also 1:27:26.080 --> 1:27:29.479 where are these youths with no sign of them? But 1:27:29.520 --> 1:27:31.040 he's saying what he has to say to save her life. 1:27:31.080 --> 1:27:32.000 At least that was my read. 1:27:32.479 --> 1:27:35.519 But the blood thirst tests to turn to somewhere, and 1:27:35.600 --> 1:27:37.719 I think it is him that suggests what about Yuri, 1:27:38.360 --> 1:27:41.280 And there's a kind of there's a kind of vengeful 1:27:41.360 --> 1:27:45.479 jealousy suggested here because I think he sees her from Afar, 1:27:45.640 --> 1:27:47.800 but he can't have her, and this turns into a 1:27:47.880 --> 1:27:51.080 kind of resentment where he suggests her, you know, she 1:27:51.600 --> 1:27:55.519 should be the one punished. So then led by the 1:27:55.600 --> 1:27:59.080 village elders, like the mainly the diet member, but then 1:27:59.120 --> 1:28:02.519 also the village has man, the schoolmaster, and the Shinto priest, 1:28:03.040 --> 1:28:06.719 the villagers head up to the house and they capture Yuri, 1:28:07.640 --> 1:28:09.559 saying that they're going to tie her to an ox 1:28:09.680 --> 1:28:12.160 and slaughter her on the mountain side. Actually, first they 1:28:12.200 --> 1:28:14.040 lie to her. They tell her, oh, we're not going 1:28:14.080 --> 1:28:15.639 to kill you, just we'll tie you to the ox 1:28:15.680 --> 1:28:18.240 and then we'll kill the ox. But that is obviously 1:28:18.240 --> 1:28:23.559 not their attention, and so Akira and Gakawin on their 1:28:23.560 --> 1:28:26.880 way home, they hear the commotion and they come to 1:28:27.760 --> 1:28:32.160 Yuri's rescue, and this turns into a big long argument 1:28:32.240 --> 1:28:35.360 and confrontation with the crowd where the two of them 1:28:35.400 --> 1:28:38.080 try to convince the crowd not to do this, but 1:28:38.200 --> 1:28:41.840 the bloodthirsty leaders, especially the diet members push the crowd 1:28:41.840 --> 1:28:45.559 to move ahead. So first Akira very bravely defends his 1:28:45.640 --> 1:28:48.120 wife and will not step aside for them. Like they 1:28:48.160 --> 1:28:50.360 try to tell him that he'll be fine, they'll leave 1:28:50.439 --> 1:28:52.479 him alone if he'll give her up, but he won't. 1:28:53.200 --> 1:28:57.120 And then Gakawin appears to their rationality and argues against 1:28:57.200 --> 1:28:59.360 what they're doing. Like there's one part where the Shinto 1:28:59.439 --> 1:29:02.759 priests say to him, you sound like a Buddhist priest preaching, 1:29:04.320 --> 1:29:06.920 and Gaquin then, I don't know if he's telling the 1:29:06.960 --> 1:29:10.400 truth here he says, I am a priest. I didn't 1:29:10.400 --> 1:29:12.479 fully understand the implications of this part. 1:29:12.600 --> 1:29:15.880 Yeah, I wasn't sure if he was speaking metaphorically or 1:29:15.920 --> 1:29:18.400 if this is just another dimension to his character. Because 1:29:18.600 --> 1:29:21.719 one thing I do get from Goquain is like quite fitting, 1:29:21.840 --> 1:29:24.920 is like he's a man that has a foot in 1:29:24.960 --> 1:29:26.960 different worlds, you know, like he is a teacher and 1:29:27.000 --> 1:29:30.640 a naturalist, and maybe he is a priest or in 1:29:30.680 --> 1:29:33.519 some sense is a priest, and therefore the things that 1:29:33.560 --> 1:29:37.320 he's doing that are very modern are also deeply rooted 1:29:37.360 --> 1:29:40.960 in things that are very traditional, Like a naturalist is 1:29:41.080 --> 1:29:42.439 kind of a priest in some way. 1:29:42.960 --> 1:29:44.439 Yeah, yeah, I can see that. 1:29:44.600 --> 1:29:47.519 Especially when you're considering Shintoism and so forth. 1:29:47.800 --> 1:29:49.880 Well, I want to get into the idea of traditionalism 1:29:49.880 --> 1:29:52.679 in just a minute here, but first I'll finish describing 1:29:52.680 --> 1:29:55.000 the scene by saying that after this, the diet member 1:29:55.040 --> 1:30:00.679 gets up and he gives this vicious, bullying, demagogic sermon 1:30:01.280 --> 1:30:04.760 about sacrificing for the national spirit. Like he talks about 1:30:04.800 --> 1:30:08.439 how real men, real warriors, used to kill their own 1:30:08.479 --> 1:30:11.080 wives before going into battle so that they would not 1:30:11.240 --> 1:30:14.800 think of home, only of victory. And it's that kind 1:30:14.800 --> 1:30:18.320 of he's like, and he accuses the people defending ury 1:30:18.400 --> 1:30:22.000 of being snivelers and weak, and he kind of rouses 1:30:22.040 --> 1:30:24.800 the bloodlust of the crowd and accuses Akira of being 1:30:24.840 --> 1:30:28.439 a traitor. And then there's an interesting moment where Akira 1:30:28.520 --> 1:30:31.080 confronts the diet member. He's like, well, if somebody has 1:30:31.120 --> 1:30:33.439 to be brave and die, how about you? How about 1:30:33.439 --> 1:30:38.200 you take this sickle and kill yourself? And Akira shames 1:30:38.240 --> 1:30:40.679 the whole crowd. He says, do you not remember tradition? 1:30:41.280 --> 1:30:44.440 And he speaks of these traditional stories where human sacrifice 1:30:44.479 --> 1:30:48.800 went wrong. But this leads into something I thought was 1:30:48.800 --> 1:30:54.400 actually really interesting about the traditional status or lack thereof, 1:30:54.600 --> 1:30:59.960 of human sacrifice. Most movie narratives or most fictional narrative 1:31:00.200 --> 1:31:05.400 generally where the characters debate the institution of human sacrifice. 1:31:05.439 --> 1:31:07.960 I think most of the time this is about old 1:31:08.040 --> 1:31:12.280 ways versus new So the human sacrifice is presented as 1:31:12.280 --> 1:31:16.280 an ancient tradition that must be continued, and then you 1:31:16.360 --> 1:31:20.280 have characters representing new ways of thinking that doubt or 1:31:20.400 --> 1:31:23.920 resist it. But I think that is not the case here. 1:31:24.000 --> 1:31:25.719 That is not how it's being presented. 1:31:25.800 --> 1:31:27.920 Yeah, we have kind of an inverse Wickerman here. 1:31:28.280 --> 1:31:32.120 Yeah. Yeah. The human sacrifice plot put into motion by 1:31:32.120 --> 1:31:36.720 the villagers and the diet member especially feels improvised and 1:31:36.960 --> 1:31:42.400 half cocked at best. Its relationship to tradition is one 1:31:42.439 --> 1:31:48.160 of a compromised, half remembered imitation of some ancient practice 1:31:48.640 --> 1:31:52.960 that is resorted to out of a shameless desperation and cruelty. 1:31:53.360 --> 1:31:56.800 It is not a faithful attempt to keep the old 1:31:56.800 --> 1:32:01.479 ways alive, and Akira makes an appeal against it by 1:32:01.560 --> 1:32:06.000 appealing to tradition. So I think that's really interesting and 1:32:06.439 --> 1:32:09.360 it actually this is where I think some of the 1:32:09.400 --> 1:32:12.640 subtle political themes of the film come out, because I 1:32:12.680 --> 1:32:18.000 know Massa hero Shanoda generally is understood as having been 1:32:18.160 --> 1:32:24.960 very opposed to right wing nationalism and right wing authoritarianism, 1:32:25.439 --> 1:32:29.000 and this film is sometimes interpreted as having those themes. 1:32:29.439 --> 1:32:31.679 And it does make me think about how a lot 1:32:31.760 --> 1:32:38.360 of right wing nationalist movements appeal to a simulacrum of 1:32:38.400 --> 1:32:42.559 the past because they appeal to a past that never 1:32:42.800 --> 1:32:46.240 actually existed. What they're trying to create is actually a 1:32:46.439 --> 1:32:51.960 new thing that is calling itself a restoration of the past. 1:32:52.680 --> 1:32:57.040 Yeah, yeah, I was thinking about this too. We see, unfortunately, 1:32:57.120 --> 1:33:01.240 see numerous echoes of this in our contemporary world, calls 1:33:01.280 --> 1:33:06.280 for intolerance and blood lust that are rooted in some again, 1:33:06.360 --> 1:33:09.120 like you say, some half remembered imitation of the past. 1:33:09.560 --> 1:33:13.040 Yeah, So I detect that kind of critique in this movie, 1:33:13.120 --> 1:33:17.360 that there's something about people thinking that they are enacting 1:33:17.400 --> 1:33:20.840 a tradition and like retrieving the wisdom of their ancestors, 1:33:20.840 --> 1:33:23.920 but actually they're just bumbling into viciousness. 1:33:24.040 --> 1:33:26.920 Yeah. And the traditions, especially in the context of this film, 1:33:27.040 --> 1:33:30.400 the traditions are what is keeping cataclysm from taking place. 1:33:30.800 --> 1:33:35.200 Ye, these they're acting opposite that. Yeah, they don't understand 1:33:35.240 --> 1:33:39.639 the tradition. What they think tradition is yeah. So anyway, 1:33:39.720 --> 1:33:42.640 this leads all into a physical fight at the belfry 1:33:42.720 --> 1:33:46.479 where Akira, Uri and Gakawin they they are chased onto 1:33:46.520 --> 1:33:50.560 the belfry by the village's war the villagers warriors and swordsmen. 1:33:51.120 --> 1:33:51.479 Uh. 1:33:51.520 --> 1:33:57.360 And in this final confrontation, Uri she kills herself, I 1:33:57.400 --> 1:34:00.040 think to I think the idea is she's trying to 1:34:00.080 --> 1:34:01.120 save Akira. 1:34:00.960 --> 1:34:03.360 With that tool with the sickle. 1:34:03.520 --> 1:34:09.360 Yes. And after this happens, in despair, Akira cuts the 1:34:09.439 --> 1:34:12.599 cords of the log that is used to ring the bell, 1:34:13.200 --> 1:34:17.280 so the bell remains unwrung at dawn as dawn breaks, 1:34:17.720 --> 1:34:21.719 and this leads into the final apocalyptic conclusion of the story, 1:34:21.720 --> 1:34:25.040 because now the pact has been rent, has been sundered, 1:34:26.160 --> 1:34:28.280 it has been you know, they've they've cut the cord. 1:34:28.360 --> 1:34:30.639 They broke their end of the pact, and so the demon, 1:34:31.280 --> 1:34:33.960 the Dragon Princess, is no longer bound by her end. 1:34:34.400 --> 1:34:38.759 And so the sky darkens and this giant water spout 1:34:38.880 --> 1:34:41.759 comes up out of the demon pond and pours into 1:34:41.840 --> 1:34:45.479 the sky. And now too late, the villagers beg Akira 1:34:45.520 --> 1:34:47.880 to ring the bell, but nothing can be done at 1:34:47.880 --> 1:34:52.519 this point. And then comes a tidal wave that flows 1:34:52.680 --> 1:34:56.519 over the mountain and not only destroys everything in the village, 1:34:56.960 --> 1:35:02.559 but destroys the land itself fundamental rends the landscape. This 1:35:02.600 --> 1:35:05.599 part is it has some miniature work and some camera 1:35:05.680 --> 1:35:09.200 tricks to show these horrible like these tidal waves rushing 1:35:09.240 --> 1:35:12.200 over the village as the people are running away in terror. 1:35:12.880 --> 1:35:17.040 There's one shot of the like the cowardly, you know, 1:35:17.160 --> 1:35:19.880 vicious diet member and the other leaders are like up 1:35:19.920 --> 1:35:22.120 on the top of a house and people are trying 1:35:22.160 --> 1:35:24.200 to crawl up onto the house for safety, and they're 1:35:24.200 --> 1:35:26.719 like kicking them to get them to, you know, come down. 1:35:27.200 --> 1:35:29.080 But eventually everyone is washed away. 1:35:29.360 --> 1:35:31.760 Yeah, and speaking like shifting tones in this movie, like 1:35:31.800 --> 1:35:36.439 now we're in full blown disaster movie mode and special 1:35:36.479 --> 1:35:39.800 effects movie mode, tremendous water spout. 1:35:39.880 --> 1:35:43.240 And it's terrifying. Yeah, And so everything is just destroyed 1:35:43.760 --> 1:35:48.960 and then finally the only person left is Gakawin. Everyone 1:35:49.160 --> 1:35:53.040 Gakawin survives by tying himself with a rope to the 1:35:53.080 --> 1:35:56.080 post of the belfry, which it turns out in the 1:35:56.200 --> 1:36:00.280 end is the only structure left standing. And get a 1:36:00.280 --> 1:36:03.800 final vision of the liberation of the Dragon Princess where 1:36:04.080 --> 1:36:07.840 she rises out of the pond elated and she flies away. 1:36:08.000 --> 1:36:11.360 She's depicted. Maybe there is a more direct to Japanese 1:36:11.400 --> 1:36:13.840 inspiration for this, but what it actually looked like to 1:36:13.880 --> 1:36:18.080 me was she looks like an angel in a Renaissance 1:36:18.080 --> 1:36:21.280 European painting, like drifting with you know these kind of 1:36:21.320 --> 1:36:24.680 like other figures kind of reclining against her as they 1:36:24.720 --> 1:36:28.640 all flowed up into these rays of light from the clouds. Yeah, 1:36:28.680 --> 1:36:31.479 and the implication is finally she is free and she's 1:36:31.520 --> 1:36:33.840 going to sin Japan to meet her love, to be 1:36:33.920 --> 1:36:36.200 reunited or not. I don't know if they've ever been 1:36:36.280 --> 1:36:40.439 united before, to meet her love from Afar, the lord 1:36:40.439 --> 1:36:41.160 of Sinjapond. 1:36:41.760 --> 1:36:44.920 Yeah, Yeah, an impressive ending here, because then we're left 1:36:44.920 --> 1:36:50.320 with Gokuin on the like the edge of this tremendous waterfall. 1:36:50.320 --> 1:36:54.360 And this is actually Igazoo Falls in Brazil, so there's 1:36:54.520 --> 1:36:56.960 not a Japanese location, but they needed something that just 1:36:57.160 --> 1:37:01.320 seemed like this cataclysmic, you know, this much water has 1:37:01.360 --> 1:37:05.720 been unleashed by demon Pond and to your point, the 1:37:05.800 --> 1:37:08.439 idea that the world has just been shaken and changed 1:37:08.479 --> 1:37:08.840 by it. 1:37:09.240 --> 1:37:13.240 The entire landscape is transformed into these rocks and waterfalls, 1:37:13.280 --> 1:37:17.040 and only the belfry is left, the only structure of 1:37:17.120 --> 1:37:20.639 human creation left here is a reminder of the promise 1:37:20.680 --> 1:37:22.719 that was kept for so long and then broken. 1:37:23.120 --> 1:37:35.320 Yeah, so quite a finish to the film. 1:37:35.439 --> 1:37:38.000 So we've talked about a lot of the themes as 1:37:38.040 --> 1:37:40.920 we went through talking about the plot, but it's just 1:37:41.040 --> 1:37:43.600 so rich with things to think about the way the 1:37:43.640 --> 1:37:47.639 movie treats the relationship between humans and nature. That there 1:37:47.760 --> 1:37:50.920 is a power in nature that is only kind of 1:37:50.960 --> 1:37:54.240 barely held back, and that we are ants compared to 1:37:54.280 --> 1:37:58.160 the power of nature, and we just operate with complete 1:37:58.160 --> 1:38:01.160 obliviousness to that power most of the time and don't 1:38:01.200 --> 1:38:04.839 respect it at all until we do something to screw 1:38:04.840 --> 1:38:08.040 it up and unleash the devastating potential of that power 1:38:08.120 --> 1:38:13.800 upon ourselves. There's a lot about fidelity and duty, keeping promises, 1:38:13.920 --> 1:38:18.240 keeping to one's duties, and the difference between the kinds 1:38:18.240 --> 1:38:20.640 of situations people can be in, or the types of 1:38:20.680 --> 1:38:25.400 personalities that cause one to be to have fidelity to 1:38:25.439 --> 1:38:28.120 a promise or keep to a tradition versus wanting to 1:38:28.240 --> 1:38:31.160 violate and break it. There are, as we were talking 1:38:31.160 --> 1:38:34.960 about just a minute ago, these political themes where I 1:38:34.960 --> 1:38:39.640 think it's doing something really interesting with like trying to 1:38:39.720 --> 1:38:46.880 deny a kind of bloodthirsty right wing politics the authority 1:38:46.920 --> 1:38:51.640 of associating itself with tradition, And I think that's an 1:38:51.680 --> 1:38:57.520 interesting move. Talking just I think it generally is about 1:38:58.800 --> 1:39:02.439 that respecting tradition comes with a sense of humility. That's 1:39:02.479 --> 1:39:06.919 an important thing, like that one cannot actually respect tradition 1:39:07.040 --> 1:39:09.720 from a place of arrogance. 1:39:10.439 --> 1:39:11.719 Yeah, I know, that's a great point. 1:39:11.920 --> 1:39:12.080 Yeah. 1:39:12.080 --> 1:39:13.840 I think in general, like this film is just such 1:39:14.040 --> 1:39:18.800 a fertile bed of ideas concerning these themes that you 1:39:18.880 --> 1:39:22.040 can I feel like you can rewatch it multiple times 1:39:22.080 --> 1:39:25.880 and you can sort of draw different connections each time. Yeah. 1:39:25.920 --> 1:39:28.720 So yeah, tremendous. Oh. 1:39:28.800 --> 1:39:31.479 Also, one thing I wanted to revisit. I don't know 1:39:31.479 --> 1:39:33.200 if you have any thoughts on this. Maybe we'll just 1:39:33.240 --> 1:39:38.680 have to ponder it. But demon ponder it is that 1:39:38.840 --> 1:39:43.680 both this movie and Pale Flower have this seems like 1:39:43.800 --> 1:39:46.000 or maybe it's just these two movies, who know, who knows, 1:39:46.040 --> 1:39:48.120 they're the only two Shanoda movies I've seen, But I 1:39:48.160 --> 1:39:50.879 thought it was interesting that both of them have scenes 1:39:50.920 --> 1:39:55.799 of people talking themselves into or giving justifications for doing 1:39:55.920 --> 1:40:00.360 what is clearly the wrong thing to do. That's a 1:40:00.520 --> 1:40:04.320 process that I find very interesting, like the justifications people 1:40:04.360 --> 1:40:08.240 come up with for doing what's wrong. But that both 1:40:08.320 --> 1:40:11.760 movies have scenes where characters dwell on this. You see 1:40:11.760 --> 1:40:14.880 them working themselves up into doing the wrong thing. 1:40:15.320 --> 1:40:20.480 M yeah, yeah, that's a good point. And you know, 1:40:19.960 --> 1:40:22.240 we watch movies all the time where people do the 1:40:22.280 --> 1:40:25.120 wrong thing. If people just did the right thing, what 1:40:25.200 --> 1:40:26.160 kind of movie would you have? 1:40:26.240 --> 1:40:26.439 Though? 1:40:26.520 --> 1:40:28.479 Of course, sometimes people complain about that. They're like, oh, 1:40:28.520 --> 1:40:30.320 the characters in this movie, they were so stupid, they 1:40:30.320 --> 1:40:33.719 did the wrong things. But mistakes have to be made. 1:40:33.760 --> 1:40:37.320 That's what greases the wheels of narrative half the time. 1:40:37.520 --> 1:40:40.960 Yeah, but I like that it's showing that it's not 1:40:41.040 --> 1:40:44.599 always easy to do the wrong thing. Sometimes it takes work. Yeah, 1:40:44.800 --> 1:40:46.920 like sometimes you got to really convince yourself. 1:40:47.040 --> 1:40:47.479 Yeah. 1:40:47.600 --> 1:40:52.840 Yeah, and yeah, so other things. Just to mention a 1:40:52.840 --> 1:40:57.280 few of the things I noted about Pale Flower. One 1:40:57.280 --> 1:41:01.320 thing that I really liked in the cinematography of Pale Flower, 1:41:01.360 --> 1:41:03.600 and I wonder if you see any connections here, is 1:41:03.640 --> 1:41:07.000 that in Pale Flower, we see a lot of shots 1:41:07.000 --> 1:41:11.840 of people through other people, like the subject people in 1:41:12.000 --> 1:41:16.480 scenes are in the background framed by people in the foreground. 1:41:17.360 --> 1:41:19.920 Something about that seemed kind of significant, And I don't 1:41:19.960 --> 1:41:21.920 really know if there was an equivalent to that in 1:41:21.960 --> 1:41:24.320 Demon Pond, but you just wanted to throw it at you. 1:41:24.360 --> 1:41:28.280 Having not seen that other film, You do you think 1:41:28.320 --> 1:41:31.760 it sort of frames the interconnectedness or social dynamics of 1:41:31.840 --> 1:41:35.040 different groups, because I could it would be interesting to 1:41:35.040 --> 1:41:37.320 go back and look at some of the especially the 1:41:37.439 --> 1:41:40.400 townsfolk scenes in this movie with that in mind. 1:41:40.800 --> 1:41:43.320 Yeah, yeah, I guess that would be interesting. A lot 1:41:43.320 --> 1:41:48.519 of times it creates a feeling of social claustrophobia but 1:41:48.560 --> 1:41:52.760 also alienation. Like it something about the way these people 1:41:52.800 --> 1:41:56.920 are framed suggests that they are surrounded by people and 1:41:57.000 --> 1:42:00.080 can't get away, but also do not fit in and 1:42:00.280 --> 1:42:01.759 are not part of the group. 1:42:01.920 --> 1:42:05.160 Oh wow, very much, very much on point with this 1:42:05.200 --> 1:42:09.040 film as well, that we see those themes explored multiple times. 1:42:09.280 --> 1:42:13.200 Another thing that's pretty cool in Pale Flower is a 1:42:13.400 --> 1:42:16.320 focus on physical ritual, which you can definitely see in 1:42:16.320 --> 1:42:19.080 this movie. In Pale Flower, it's not religious ritual. There's 1:42:19.200 --> 1:42:21.320 no religion at all that I recall in that movie, 1:42:21.360 --> 1:42:25.080 but a big focus on ritualized gambling scenes. So the 1:42:25.160 --> 1:42:28.879 characters go to these gambling parlors and we see the 1:42:28.920 --> 1:42:33.240 cycle of the games repeat with these there are a 1:42:33.240 --> 1:42:36.240 lot of sights and sounds that happen in sequence over 1:42:36.280 --> 1:42:39.320 and over, and they're kind of hypnotic. With the dealers 1:42:39.520 --> 1:42:42.800 in these gambling in these games, chanting as they call 1:42:42.880 --> 1:42:45.680 for bets, and the clacking of these cards as they 1:42:45.680 --> 1:42:48.760 go through to the next motion seem to very I 1:42:48.760 --> 1:42:51.480 don't know, I noticed a connection there with the emphasis 1:42:51.479 --> 1:42:53.799 on the physical process of ritual in this movie. 1:42:53.920 --> 1:42:58.439 Interesting. Yeah, I don't know enough about say, American gambling culture. 1:42:58.479 --> 1:43:01.960 Really the comment I'm wondering, are we seeing something We're 1:43:01.960 --> 1:43:05.400 talking about something distinctly Japanese, because there certainly plenty of 1:43:05.400 --> 1:43:08.559 examples where like the Japanese version of the thing takes 1:43:08.600 --> 1:43:13.280 on like additional physical ritual in a very evocative way. 1:43:13.320 --> 1:43:15.719 Like just thinking, this is not a maybe this doesn't 1:43:15.720 --> 1:43:17.559 compare greatly with what we're talking about, but I think 1:43:17.600 --> 1:43:21.240 of like cocktail culture in Japan, something I have gotten, 1:43:21.600 --> 1:43:23.680 I have had the opportunity to witness firsthand, with like 1:43:23.720 --> 1:43:26.479 the shaving of the ice and the way a drink 1:43:26.560 --> 1:43:29.120 is prepared and it takes on, it has a sort 1:43:29.120 --> 1:43:30.320 of theater all its own. 1:43:30.720 --> 1:43:35.400 Yeah. Yeah, there's a feeling of care and attention taken 1:43:35.520 --> 1:43:38.519 at multiple steps than a process that are repeated over 1:43:38.560 --> 1:43:43.200 and over, and a big emphasis on interesting and pleasing 1:43:43.280 --> 1:43:46.559 repeated sites and sounds as we go through those steps 1:43:46.560 --> 1:43:52.240 over and over. Yeah. Yeah, anyway, so I recommend Pale Flower. Also, I'm, 1:43:52.520 --> 1:43:54.519 like I said, I'm a new Shinoda fan. Now I 1:43:54.600 --> 1:43:57.000 want to see all these movies, all right. 1:43:57.040 --> 1:43:59.240 Well, as we close out here, we would love to 1:43:59.280 --> 1:44:01.599 hear from folks out there who have thoughts on other 1:44:01.640 --> 1:44:05.600 Shinoda movies or certainly Demon Pond. If you had the 1:44:05.680 --> 1:44:08.559 chance to see it back in the day and whatever 1:44:08.680 --> 1:44:11.200 form was available to you, or if you've had the 1:44:11.280 --> 1:44:13.080 chance to see it on the big screen or via 1:44:13.680 --> 1:44:16.519 the Criterion releases, let us know we would love to 1:44:16.560 --> 1:44:18.559 hear from you. We'd love to carry this discussion on 1:44:19.000 --> 1:44:22.960 into future episodes of Listener Mail. Just a reminder for 1:44:23.000 --> 1:44:24.960 everyone out there that Stuff to Blow Your Mind is 1:44:25.000 --> 1:44:28.640 primarily a science and culture podcast, but on Fridays we 1:44:28.680 --> 1:44:30.880 set aside most serious concerns to just talk about a 1:44:30.880 --> 1:44:34.200 weird film on Weird House Cinema. And we've been doing 1:44:34.280 --> 1:44:36.439 these episodes for a while while Now I was looking back, 1:44:36.479 --> 1:44:38.080 it's like, have we been doing like five years of 1:44:38.120 --> 1:44:40.000 Weird House cinema? Is that even possible? 1:44:40.040 --> 1:44:40.559 Could it be? 1:44:40.680 --> 1:44:41.000 Really? 1:44:41.240 --> 1:44:42.080 I guess that's right. 1:44:42.160 --> 1:44:45.120 Yeah, maybe so we've been doing it all wet as. 1:44:45.000 --> 1:44:47.760 Like it just started. Really the past five years have 1:44:47.800 --> 1:44:48.920 been meant something. 1:44:49.040 --> 1:44:52.599 Yeah, yeah, we started during the pandemic. I think yeah, 1:44:52.640 --> 1:44:55.280 we did yeah, early, early and pandemic. So at this 1:44:55.360 --> 1:44:58.680 point we've covered a slew of films. So if you 1:44:58.720 --> 1:45:00.640 want to go back and look at all of them, 1:45:00.680 --> 1:45:03.679 you'll find a full archive of Weird House Cinema episodes 1:45:03.680 --> 1:45:05.559 wherever you get your podcasts in the Stuff to Blow 1:45:05.600 --> 1:45:09.960 your Mind podcast feed. Also, if you're on letterbox dot com, 1:45:10.000 --> 1:45:11.960 look us up there. Our username is weird House and 1:45:12.040 --> 1:45:13.639 we have a nice list of all the movies we've 1:45:13.640 --> 1:45:15.920 covered over the years, and sometimes there's a peek ahead 1:45:15.920 --> 1:45:16.960 at what comes out next. 1:45:17.360 --> 1:45:21.000 Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer Jjposway. 1:45:21.160 --> 1:45:22.559 If you would like to get in touch with us 1:45:22.640 --> 1:45:24.920 with feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest 1:45:24.960 --> 1:45:26.920 a topic for the future, or just to say hello, 1:45:27.000 --> 1:45:29.360 you can email us at contact apt Stuff to Blow 1:45:29.400 --> 1:45:44.040 your Mind dot com. 1:45:37.160 --> 1:45:40.120 Stuff to Blow your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For 1:45:40.200 --> 1:45:43.000 more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, 1:45:43.160 --> 1:45:46.400 Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.