1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:10,280 Speaker 1: Col Zone Media on January twenty sixth, twenty twenty five. 2 00:00:11,520 --> 00:00:17,759 Speaker 1: Matthew Huddle died. That much we know for certain. Usually 3 00:00:17,800 --> 00:00:20,079 Speaker 1: I tell you a story that's old enough that the 4 00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:23,160 Speaker 1: ink is not only dry, but it's begun to fade 5 00:00:23,200 --> 00:00:27,400 Speaker 1: a little. The reports are in, the motions have been filed, 6 00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:32,560 Speaker 1: argued and ruled on. The official story is set in stone. 7 00:00:32,840 --> 00:00:36,279 Speaker 1: That's not the case today. As I'm writing this. There 8 00:00:36,280 --> 00:00:40,400 Speaker 1: are still questions left unanswered. There is a state police 9 00:00:40,400 --> 00:00:45,400 Speaker 1: investigation into an officer involved shooting still underway. But Matthew 10 00:00:45,479 --> 00:00:50,600 Speaker 1: Huddle is dead. That much we know. Just days before 11 00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 1: he died, he'd gotten some long awaited good news. His 12 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 1: uncle Dale was coming home. Both men were among the 13 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:02,360 Speaker 1: nearly sixteen hundred people pardoned by Donald Trump in one 14 00:01:02,360 --> 00:01:04,760 Speaker 1: of his first actions after being sworn in his president. 15 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:09,160 Speaker 1: Matthew had already served his six month sentence, but when 16 00:01:09,160 --> 00:01:11,720 Speaker 1: the pardons came through, Dale Huddle was just a few 17 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 1: months in to a two and a half year term 18 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:17,600 Speaker 1: at a prison in Illinois. On the afternoon that he died, 19 00:01:18,240 --> 00:01:22,600 Speaker 1: Matthew Huddle was driving somewhere in Jasper County, Indiana. I 20 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:25,400 Speaker 1: don't know where he was going, but I do know 21 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 1: he wasn't supposed to be driving, and according to the 22 00:01:28,319 --> 00:01:33,160 Speaker 1: Jasper County Sheriff, he was speeding. I can only assume 23 00:01:33,200 --> 00:01:36,680 Speaker 1: that the altercation that allegedly ensued began after the sheriff's 24 00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:39,560 Speaker 1: deputy discovered that Huddle did not have a valid driver's license. 25 00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:42,840 Speaker 1: The deputy claims Huddle resisted when he tried to place 26 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:45,800 Speaker 1: him under arrest, and it was during this altercation that 27 00:01:45,840 --> 00:01:47,880 Speaker 1: the sheriff says the deputy discovered that Huddle was in 28 00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 1: possession of a firearm, which he was not legally allowed 29 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:55,560 Speaker 1: to have, the final moments of Matthew Huddle's life will 30 00:01:55,960 --> 00:02:00,600 Speaker 1: eventually be settled in some sort of official report. Maybe 31 00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:04,240 Speaker 1: they'll release the deputy's body worn camera footage. Maybe his 32 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:07,800 Speaker 1: family will file a lawsuit. The final page hasn't been 33 00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 1: written yet. I don't have the answers. All I have 34 00:02:12,080 --> 00:02:14,440 Speaker 1: is a sad story, but a man who believed in 35 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:21,280 Speaker 1: nothing and died on the side of Indiana State Road fourteenth. 36 00:02:21,600 --> 00:02:42,399 Speaker 1: I'm Molly Conger in This is Weird, Little Guys. At 37 00:02:42,440 --> 00:02:47,320 Speaker 1: noon on January sixth, twenty twenty one, President Donald Trump 38 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:51,240 Speaker 1: took the stage at the Ellipse, a generally unremarkable patch 39 00:02:51,240 --> 00:02:53,640 Speaker 1: of grass between the White House and the Washington Monument. 40 00:02:55,320 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 1: More than fifty thousand of his supporters had been standing 41 00:02:57,840 --> 00:03:00,520 Speaker 1: out in the cold all morning waiting to hear from him. 42 00:03:01,919 --> 00:03:05,359 Speaker 1: For months, he'd stoked the fires of a growing conspiracy 43 00:03:06,919 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 1: the election had been stolen. He gave speeches, held rallies, 44 00:03:11,880 --> 00:03:16,799 Speaker 1: fired off late night tweets, and filed lawsuits for those 45 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:19,639 Speaker 1: who wanted to believe. There seemed to be mountains of 46 00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 1: evidence of a deep and systemic rot. But the lawsuits 47 00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:29,040 Speaker 1: were failing, the votes were counted, and time was running out. 48 00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 1: Today was the day that Congress would have the final 49 00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:34,839 Speaker 1: say in the twenty twenty election, and less than two 50 00:03:34,880 --> 00:03:38,120 Speaker 1: miles away, legislators were taking their seats in the Capitol 51 00:03:38,120 --> 00:03:43,000 Speaker 1: Building to certify the election. The crowd at the Ellipse 52 00:03:43,040 --> 00:03:45,200 Speaker 1: had come from all over the country to be a 53 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:49,760 Speaker 1: part of history, and as their president spoke, many of 54 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:52,400 Speaker 1: them heard the permission they'd been waiting for. 55 00:03:54,800 --> 00:03:57,320 Speaker 2: And we fight, We fight like hell. 56 00:03:57,640 --> 00:03:59,760 Speaker 3: And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going 57 00:03:59,800 --> 00:04:00,960 Speaker 3: to have country anymore. 58 00:04:04,480 --> 00:04:08,400 Speaker 1: This profound corruption would have to be excised by force 59 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:12,320 Speaker 1: before this grave injustice could be done. He'd all but 60 00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:16,760 Speaker 1: confirm that for them, And then, in the final seconds 61 00:04:16,760 --> 00:04:19,360 Speaker 1: of his speech, before he was played off the stage 62 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:23,560 Speaker 1: by his favorite song, The Village People's Gay Anthem YMCA, 63 00:04:25,080 --> 00:04:27,080 Speaker 1: he gave the crowd their marching orders. 64 00:04:28,160 --> 00:04:31,320 Speaker 3: So let's walk down Pennsylvania Avenue. 65 00:04:31,800 --> 00:04:33,080 Speaker 2: I want to thank you all. 66 00:04:33,400 --> 00:04:37,160 Speaker 3: God bless you, and God bless America. 67 00:04:37,240 --> 00:04:39,520 Speaker 2: Thank you all for being here. This is incredible. Thank 68 00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:40,120 Speaker 2: you very much. 69 00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:46,400 Speaker 1: Some in that crowd, perhaps anticipating the instructions he would 70 00:04:46,400 --> 00:04:49,320 Speaker 1: give at the end of his hour long speech, never 71 00:04:49,360 --> 00:04:52,880 Speaker 1: even heard him say that line. They'd already started walking 72 00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:55,320 Speaker 1: the mile and a half to their final destination that day, 73 00:04:56,440 --> 00:05:03,520 Speaker 1: the Capitol Building. Most certainly already know how that day ended. 74 00:05:04,440 --> 00:05:06,159 Speaker 1: Even if you live in a cave in the woods 75 00:05:06,160 --> 00:05:09,360 Speaker 1: without access to the internet, you can't possibly have escaped 76 00:05:09,400 --> 00:05:13,559 Speaker 1: this news. Thousands of Trump supporters descended on the United 77 00:05:13,560 --> 00:05:18,560 Speaker 1: States Capitol Building. They tore down police barricades, They engaged 78 00:05:18,600 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 1: in a pitched battle with the Capitol Police on the 79 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:24,680 Speaker 1: steps outside, and some of them forced their way into 80 00:05:24,720 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 1: the building. People died. United States Capitol Police officer Brian 81 00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:34,839 Speaker 1: Sicknick passed away on January seventh after suffering a series 82 00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 1: of strokes. His cause of death was eventually ruled to 83 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:42,120 Speaker 1: be natural causes, though several neurologists have argued that the 84 00:05:42,160 --> 00:05:45,279 Speaker 1: events of the prior day almost certainly contributed to his death. 85 00:05:46,920 --> 00:05:49,880 Speaker 1: Qute On believer Ashley Babbitt was shot as she forced 86 00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 1: her way into the building through a broken window. Roseanne 87 00:05:53,680 --> 00:05:57,880 Speaker 1: Boylen was trampled by the stampeding crowd, though her official 88 00:05:57,920 --> 00:05:59,960 Speaker 1: cause of death was ruled to be an amfetamine overdose. 89 00:06:01,680 --> 00:06:04,359 Speaker 1: And Kevin Greeson had a heart attack on the Capitol 90 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:09,120 Speaker 1: grounds this week. As I was combing back through my 91 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:14,080 Speaker 1: own videos of that afternoon, I discovered that I had 92 00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:17,919 Speaker 1: captured the moment that I realized I was watching a 93 00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:18,720 Speaker 1: man die. 94 00:06:20,400 --> 00:06:22,080 Speaker 3: Over the roar of the crowd. 95 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:25,560 Speaker 1: You can hear someone next to me say they've been 96 00:06:25,560 --> 00:06:30,040 Speaker 1: giving him chest compressions for way too long. And then 97 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:33,240 Speaker 1: there's my own voice. I know it's my voice, but 98 00:06:33,279 --> 00:06:36,560 Speaker 1: I don't remember saying it from years in the past. 99 00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:41,839 Speaker 1: I heard myself say he's going to die, and a 100 00:06:41,839 --> 00:06:44,000 Speaker 1: few minutes after that, I saw his dead body being 101 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:49,440 Speaker 1: carried away. Surely other people saw him too, but no 102 00:06:49,480 --> 00:06:51,520 Speaker 1: one seemed to react at all to the sight of 103 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:56,640 Speaker 1: a corpse making its way through the crowd. Over the 104 00:06:56,720 --> 00:07:00,599 Speaker 1: last four years, federal charges were filed against nearly sixteen 105 00:07:00,960 --> 00:07:05,960 Speaker 1: hundred members of that crowd. Nearly thirteen hundred had been convicted, 106 00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:08,560 Speaker 1: with another three hundred cases still open as of the 107 00:07:08,560 --> 00:07:12,960 Speaker 1: four year anniversary of the riot. Those cases will never 108 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 1: go to trial, though, because last month, hours after being 109 00:07:16,920 --> 00:07:20,520 Speaker 1: sworn in as president for the second time, Donald Trump 110 00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:25,040 Speaker 1: issued a blanket pardon, pardoning almost every single one of them, 111 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:28,440 Speaker 1: with the small exception of a handful of rioters who 112 00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:35,360 Speaker 1: only had their sentences commuted. There are those who would 113 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:38,600 Speaker 1: rewrite the story of that day, people who would tell 114 00:07:38,600 --> 00:07:41,200 Speaker 1: you that it was a peaceful protest, that they were 115 00:07:41,400 --> 00:07:45,320 Speaker 1: patriots and tourists, that they couldn't have known that their 116 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:49,000 Speaker 1: conduct was unlawful. I'm not sure there's anything I can 117 00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:52,160 Speaker 1: do to change anyone's mind. The evidence to the contrary 118 00:07:52,160 --> 00:07:56,920 Speaker 1: is readily available, but it's never seemed to matter. I 119 00:07:56,920 --> 00:07:59,720 Speaker 1: could tell you that I saw a man, eyes red 120 00:07:59,760 --> 00:08:04,640 Speaker 1: with pepper spray and wide with wild determination, pry a 121 00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:08,600 Speaker 1: metal drain grate out of the ground with the end 122 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:12,480 Speaker 1: of an American flagpole, before pressing back into the fray 123 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:16,320 Speaker 1: with his newly acquired weapon. I could tell you I 124 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:19,600 Speaker 1: saw a man with a literal pitchfork sprinting down the 125 00:08:19,640 --> 00:08:24,440 Speaker 1: Capitol lawn. I could spend the next year covering a 126 00:08:24,480 --> 00:08:29,960 Speaker 1: different January sixth rider every week, painstakingly tracking their affiliations 127 00:08:29,960 --> 00:08:34,760 Speaker 1: with militias and white supremacist street gangs. But I don't 128 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 1: really want to. There's plenty of media about the men 129 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:41,520 Speaker 1: who were there that day. Whole books have been written 130 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:45,800 Speaker 1: about them, Whole podcasts have dedicated themselves to that work. 131 00:08:47,559 --> 00:08:50,120 Speaker 1: There are some weird little guys who ended up there 132 00:08:50,120 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 1: that day, but I'll get to But I can't bear 133 00:08:54,400 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 1: the thought of returning to that well for too many stories, 134 00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:02,440 Speaker 1: because one of those stories are kind of the same. 135 00:09:04,440 --> 00:09:06,960 Speaker 1: While the seditious conspiracy at the heart of the violence 136 00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:10,360 Speaker 1: was cooked up by oathkeepers and proud boys, men with 137 00:09:10,440 --> 00:09:14,439 Speaker 1: an ideological commitment to violence and ties to organized groups 138 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:19,920 Speaker 1: dedicated to carrying it out, most of the crowd was 139 00:09:19,960 --> 00:09:23,840 Speaker 1: made up of men far too ordinary to be considered 140 00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:28,280 Speaker 1: a weird little guy. And maybe that in itself is 141 00:09:28,320 --> 00:09:33,640 Speaker 1: a subject worth exploring. How could an ordinary man end 142 00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:36,720 Speaker 1: up crawling over broken glass on his way to break 143 00:09:36,760 --> 00:09:40,600 Speaker 1: into a Senator's office. How could a reeltor from the 144 00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:44,720 Speaker 1: suburbs step over a woman's dead body in his haste 145 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:49,120 Speaker 1: to physically confront a member of Congress. How did men 146 00:09:49,200 --> 00:09:51,719 Speaker 1: with back the blue bumper stickers on their brand new 147 00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:55,840 Speaker 1: forward pickup trucks end up fistfighting cops on the steps 148 00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:59,760 Speaker 1: of the Capitol. I don't think I'm equipped to answer 149 00:09:59,760 --> 00:10:04,240 Speaker 1: the but I can try to tell you the sad 150 00:10:04,320 --> 00:10:10,840 Speaker 1: story of how one of them ended up dead. Matthew 151 00:10:10,880 --> 00:10:14,880 Speaker 1: Huddle did not vote for Donald Trump in the twenty 152 00:10:14,920 --> 00:10:19,880 Speaker 1: twenty election. Perhaps he would have, It's impossible to say, 153 00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:23,560 Speaker 1: but he'd lost his right to vote years ago after 154 00:10:23,600 --> 00:10:28,320 Speaker 1: his first felony conviction. He struggled with alcohol addiction for 155 00:10:28,400 --> 00:10:32,000 Speaker 1: his entire adult life, racking up charges for driving while 156 00:10:32,040 --> 00:10:36,679 Speaker 1: intoxicated at a pretty alarming rate, and he was back 157 00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:39,319 Speaker 1: in jail for yet another dui in November of twenty 158 00:10:39,360 --> 00:10:43,600 Speaker 1: twenty when the election took place. He was fresh off 159 00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:46,079 Speaker 1: this stint in the county jail when his uncle Dale 160 00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:50,680 Speaker 1: asked him for a favor. He needed a ride to Washington, 161 00:10:50,760 --> 00:10:54,880 Speaker 1: d c. The reason given in the court documents is 162 00:10:54,880 --> 00:10:58,640 Speaker 1: that Dale, at sixty nine years old, had poor eyesight 163 00:10:58,760 --> 00:11:04,320 Speaker 1: and quote should not drive, especially at night. But I'm 164 00:11:04,320 --> 00:11:07,360 Speaker 1: not sure how to square that with the knowledge that 165 00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:11,240 Speaker 1: Dale was at that time employed as a delivery driver 166 00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:15,280 Speaker 1: at an auto parts store. Nor has any explanation offered 167 00:11:15,320 --> 00:11:17,760 Speaker 1: as to why Matthew agreed to drive his uncle seven 168 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:22,319 Speaker 1: hundred miles from Indiana to DC without a valid driver's license. 169 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 1: In Matthew's own words, though he had nothing better to 170 00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:32,679 Speaker 1: do at the time, so he agreed. According to his defense. 171 00:11:32,400 --> 00:11:38,320 Speaker 3: Attorney, matt is not a true believer in any political movement. 172 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:41,959 Speaker 3: He cannot legally vote, and he knows very little about 173 00:11:41,960 --> 00:11:45,640 Speaker 3: politics and does not follow it. He is somewhat distrustful 174 00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:48,280 Speaker 3: of the government in general, but he did not know 175 00:11:48,320 --> 00:11:51,160 Speaker 3: if the twenty twenty election was stolen or. 176 00:11:51,160 --> 00:11:57,160 Speaker 1: Not, so he claims he was only there that day 177 00:11:57,200 --> 00:12:01,600 Speaker 1: as something to do a favor for his uncle, and 178 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:03,880 Speaker 1: he thought maybe he would be a historic event that 179 00:12:03,920 --> 00:12:08,280 Speaker 1: he could document through photos and video, and he did. 180 00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:12,400 Speaker 1: He took quite a bit of video that day, recording 181 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:14,719 Speaker 1: himself as he and his uncle made their way down 182 00:12:14,800 --> 00:12:16,959 Speaker 1: the National Mall after listening to Trump's speech at the 183 00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:22,400 Speaker 1: Ellipse as the Capitol came into view, Matthew Huddle says, 184 00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:26,320 Speaker 1: allowed to no one in particular. We're going to see 185 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:30,559 Speaker 1: if we can get inside. But moments later he turns 186 00:12:30,559 --> 00:12:33,320 Speaker 1: to his uncle Dale and says he's not sure they're 187 00:12:33,360 --> 00:12:35,560 Speaker 1: going to be able to get close because of the 188 00:12:35,559 --> 00:12:41,000 Speaker 1: police presence. His uncle replies, quote, I think we ought 189 00:12:41,040 --> 00:12:44,320 Speaker 1: to bum rush the Capitol building arrest them all. We've 190 00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:47,920 Speaker 1: got enough people to do that, and Matthew agrees they 191 00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:53,439 Speaker 1: could try to get close. By two pm, they were 192 00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:55,440 Speaker 1: deep within the mass of rioters at the base of 193 00:12:55,440 --> 00:12:59,360 Speaker 1: the steps at the west entrance of the Capitol. Police 194 00:12:59,360 --> 00:13:02,360 Speaker 1: on the steps firing flash bangs and tear gas canisters, 195 00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:06,360 Speaker 1: trying to keep the crowd at bay. In his video, 196 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:09,640 Speaker 1: as described in the court filings, Matthew was surprised by 197 00:13:09,640 --> 00:13:13,720 Speaker 1: the flashbangs and asks if the cops are shooting a cannon. 198 00:13:15,640 --> 00:13:18,240 Speaker 1: I didn't manage to dig up the video evidence filed 199 00:13:18,280 --> 00:13:22,800 Speaker 1: in his case, but based on the description of flashbangs 200 00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:27,920 Speaker 1: and scattered chants of you say, you say, and it 201 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:32,800 Speaker 1: being shortly after two pm, here's my best guess at 202 00:13:32,840 --> 00:13:57,120 Speaker 1: that exact moment being described, Oh yes, that is my 203 00:13:57,320 --> 00:13:59,880 Speaker 1: little squeal of surprise at the sound of the flash bangs. 204 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:06,079 Speaker 1: I was having a weird afternoon and it was chaotic. 205 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:10,520 Speaker 1: At this point, the crowd was starting to press forward 206 00:14:10,600 --> 00:14:14,840 Speaker 1: and engage with the officers. No longer a mere observer 207 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:19,040 Speaker 1: of history, Matthew Huddle joined them. He and his uncle 208 00:14:19,080 --> 00:14:20,880 Speaker 1: Dale fought their way to the front of the crowd, 209 00:14:20,960 --> 00:14:23,200 Speaker 1: where rioters were tearing down the bike racks that had 210 00:14:23,240 --> 00:14:25,840 Speaker 1: been set out in a feeble attempt to keep people 211 00:14:25,880 --> 00:14:29,880 Speaker 1: off the stairs. As officers struggled to keep the metal 212 00:14:29,880 --> 00:14:31,600 Speaker 1: bike racks out of the hands of the men who 213 00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:35,920 Speaker 1: were trying to seize them as weapons, Dale Huddle lunged forward, 214 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:40,040 Speaker 1: jabbing his wooden flagpole into an officer's stomach, knocking him 215 00:14:40,040 --> 00:14:44,440 Speaker 1: off his feet. During the battle on the stairs, Dale 216 00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:48,040 Speaker 1: is seen in an officer's body worn camera footage screaming 217 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:51,640 Speaker 1: at them, saying things like, look back there, there's a 218 00:14:51,720 --> 00:14:55,320 Speaker 1: million of us. You think you can stop us, and 219 00:14:56,080 --> 00:14:58,080 Speaker 1: it's going to get real ugly if you don't let 220 00:14:58,160 --> 00:15:00,440 Speaker 1: us in. Man, it's going to get real U We're 221 00:15:00,480 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 1: coming in. And at some point he turns to his 222 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:07,440 Speaker 1: nephew and points up at the Capitol building and he says, 223 00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:12,880 Speaker 1: we're going in the front door. But Dale Huddle never 224 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:16,880 Speaker 1: did make it inside. The men got separated on the steps. 225 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:19,920 Speaker 1: The officers who'd been trying to hold them at bay 226 00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:23,520 Speaker 1: retreated under attack, giving Matthew Huddle an opening to run 227 00:15:23,560 --> 00:15:27,800 Speaker 1: up the stairs, but Dale stayed behind and kept fighting. 228 00:15:28,640 --> 00:15:30,960 Speaker 1: Instead of taking his chance to climb the steps and 229 00:15:31,160 --> 00:15:36,200 Speaker 1: actually go inside, he followed the retreating officers, continuing the attack. 230 00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:41,120 Speaker 1: Another video shows the old man, red faced with tears 231 00:15:41,160 --> 00:15:43,680 Speaker 1: streaming from his eyes from pepper spray unloaded by a 232 00:15:43,760 --> 00:15:48,160 Speaker 1: rioter behind him, and he's charging toward an officer trying 233 00:15:48,160 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 1: to rip his gas mask off, and then he tries 234 00:15:51,520 --> 00:15:55,960 Speaker 1: to wrench the baton out of another officer's hands. With 235 00:15:56,040 --> 00:15:59,320 Speaker 1: his uncle preferring to stay behind and fight, Matthew followed 236 00:15:59,360 --> 00:16:01,400 Speaker 1: the crowd through the now open doors on the upper 237 00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:07,120 Speaker 1: West Terrace. In his own video, he says we're going 238 00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:12,400 Speaker 1: in as he crosses the threshold. And for sixteen minutes 239 00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 1: he just wandered around in there. He didn't hurt anyone, 240 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:23,840 Speaker 1: he didn't steal anything, he didn't break anything. He really 241 00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:28,640 Speaker 1: was just kind of wandering around. It's hard to square 242 00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:33,360 Speaker 1: the reality of the situation with his behavior. On one hand, 243 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:35,600 Speaker 1: you have to assume he knew what he was doing 244 00:16:35,720 --> 00:16:39,440 Speaker 1: was wrong. He hadn't actually engaged in any of the 245 00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:42,920 Speaker 1: violence outside, but he knew full well he was only 246 00:16:42,960 --> 00:16:45,960 Speaker 1: standing inside that building because men like his uncle had 247 00:16:46,040 --> 00:16:48,240 Speaker 1: fought their way through a police line to clear the 248 00:16:48,280 --> 00:16:53,880 Speaker 1: path to the stairs. But once he's inside, he's trying 249 00:16:53,880 --> 00:16:57,440 Speaker 1: to chat up the cops. He sidles up to one 250 00:16:57,440 --> 00:17:01,200 Speaker 1: officer and casually asks him, has this ever happened to 251 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:06,480 Speaker 1: you guys before he briefly joined in with a group 252 00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:12,240 Speaker 1: of guys just marching around chanting us say, us say. 253 00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:15,240 Speaker 1: Another rioter asked him if he knew what floor the 254 00:17:15,320 --> 00:17:20,280 Speaker 1: legislators were on, and, oddly, considering he claimed to know 255 00:17:20,440 --> 00:17:23,080 Speaker 1: nothing about the situation he'd found himself in that day, 256 00:17:23,960 --> 00:17:28,879 Speaker 1: he answered confidently the third floor. And then he thought 257 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 1: for a moment and turned to a nearby police officer 258 00:17:32,520 --> 00:17:36,480 Speaker 1: and asked the cop if the legislators had already gone 259 00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:40,600 Speaker 1: down to the basement, and by that point the Senate 260 00:17:40,680 --> 00:17:45,600 Speaker 1: chambers had indeed been evacuated through the underground tunnels. And 261 00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:48,320 Speaker 1: as the group piles into the elevator, leaving Huddle behind, 262 00:17:49,200 --> 00:17:51,800 Speaker 1: he turns back to his phone, which is still recording, 263 00:17:51,840 --> 00:17:56,680 Speaker 1: and he narrates into his video, they went up third 264 00:17:56,720 --> 00:18:02,240 Speaker 1: floor to the offices. He would later tell the FBI 265 00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:04,639 Speaker 1: that when he told that group of rioters they should 266 00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:07,320 Speaker 1: head up to the third floor, he was actually trying 267 00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:10,800 Speaker 1: to divert them away from members of Congress, who he 268 00:18:10,880 --> 00:18:16,160 Speaker 1: assumed were already being evacuated through the underground tunnels. Either way, though, 269 00:18:16,240 --> 00:18:19,400 Speaker 1: that is a curious level of insight into the building's 270 00:18:19,520 --> 00:18:22,240 Speaker 1: floor plans for a man who said he was just 271 00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:28,040 Speaker 1: somebody else's ride. After getting maced again, the novelty of 272 00:18:28,080 --> 00:18:31,359 Speaker 1: being inside the building seemed to have been wearing off. 273 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:37,240 Speaker 1: Officers were relatively futilely trying to convince people to leave, 274 00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:40,359 Speaker 1: trying to direct them down a hallway and towards an exit, 275 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:43,840 Speaker 1: and Huddle says into his video that he has a 276 00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:47,719 Speaker 1: bad feeling about that that might be a trap, so 277 00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:52,159 Speaker 1: he found his way to a different exit. Outside, he 278 00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:54,439 Speaker 1: found his uncle Dale again, and the two men just 279 00:18:55,119 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 1: hung around outside on the Capitol grounds for a few hours. 280 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:00,400 Speaker 2: Went home. 281 00:19:15,359 --> 00:19:17,600 Speaker 1: In the days after the Huddles returned home to Indiana, 282 00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:21,840 Speaker 1: the FBI set to work identifying the rioters. Those who 283 00:19:21,920 --> 00:19:26,200 Speaker 1: assaulted federal officers were understandably a high priority, and the 284 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:29,280 Speaker 1: bureau released images of those suspects, each identified by the 285 00:19:29,320 --> 00:19:34,320 Speaker 1: letters AFO for assault on a Federal Officer and given 286 00:19:34,359 --> 00:19:39,440 Speaker 1: a unique number. Just three months after the riot, photos 287 00:19:39,480 --> 00:19:42,639 Speaker 1: of AFO two nine to nine went up on the 288 00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:47,600 Speaker 1: FBI's website. Over the next few months, more than a 289 00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:51,639 Speaker 1: dozen tips came in about AFO two nine nine, but 290 00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:54,800 Speaker 1: none of them were right. It sounds like it was 291 00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:59,120 Speaker 1: facial recognition that Gotdale Huddle. The charging documents just say 292 00:19:59,160 --> 00:20:03,440 Speaker 1: that law enforcement databases were used to match the images 293 00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:08,640 Speaker 1: to his passport photos, and by August, FBI agents were 294 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:12,560 Speaker 1: watching Dale Huddle. They surveilled him at his home and 295 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:16,679 Speaker 1: his workplace several times in late twenty twenty one. In 296 00:20:16,720 --> 00:20:19,920 Speaker 1: March of twenty twenty two, they approached his boss, who 297 00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:23,480 Speaker 1: identified Dale in several photos from the riot and provided 298 00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:26,080 Speaker 1: records showing he'd taken off work the week of January sixth, 299 00:20:26,119 --> 00:20:30,920 Speaker 1: twenty twenty one. Both Matthew and Dale Huddle were eventually 300 00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:35,600 Speaker 1: charged and arrested. In November of twenty twenty two. Dale 301 00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:37,160 Speaker 1: was picked up in the parking lot on his way 302 00:20:37,160 --> 00:20:41,159 Speaker 1: into work one morning, and Matthew was for reasons not 303 00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:46,840 Speaker 1: entirely clear to me arrested in Boise, Idaho, and both 304 00:20:46,920 --> 00:20:50,840 Speaker 1: men would eventually take plea agreements, just like over one 305 00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:54,480 Speaker 1: thousand others of the approximately thirteen hundred January sixth defendants 306 00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:59,639 Speaker 1: who'd been convicted before those blanket pardons. Matthew pled guilty 307 00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 1: to a scene misdemeanor count of entering and remaining in 308 00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:06,840 Speaker 1: a restricted building and was sentenced to six months. He 309 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:09,480 Speaker 1: finished serving that sentence in July of twenty twenty four. 310 00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:14,040 Speaker 1: Dale bled guilty to a single felony account of assaulting 311 00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:17,720 Speaker 1: an officer with a dangerous weapon, specifically for jabbing that 312 00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:20,360 Speaker 1: officer with his flagpole during the struggle on the stairs. 313 00:21:21,720 --> 00:21:24,119 Speaker 1: He was sentenced to thirty months in July of twenty 314 00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:27,000 Speaker 1: twenty four, meaning he was one of about two hundred 315 00:21:27,080 --> 00:21:30,080 Speaker 1: January sixth defendants who were actually still in federal custody 316 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:33,879 Speaker 1: at the time of the pardons. And like I said, 317 00:21:34,520 --> 00:21:40,399 Speaker 1: almost everyone who is convicted led guilty, actually going to 318 00:21:40,520 --> 00:21:44,240 Speaker 1: trial in a federal criminal case is pretty rare, a 319 00:21:44,280 --> 00:21:47,960 Speaker 1: fact we've talked about before in other episodes. It's not 320 00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:51,200 Speaker 1: really a good system. There is a lot of pressure 321 00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:53,679 Speaker 1: to take a plea deal, and that may not always 322 00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:58,440 Speaker 1: be fair. In Dale's case, though, I think the plea 323 00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:03,679 Speaker 1: was absolutely the right call. A few days after his arrest, 324 00:22:03,800 --> 00:22:07,119 Speaker 1: after he'd been released on bond, a CBS News reporter 325 00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:11,080 Speaker 1: from Chicago, knocked on his door in a conversation that 326 00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:14,960 Speaker 1: lasted more than seven minutes, much to his attorney's dismay. 327 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:20,159 Speaker 1: I'm sure the reporter pulled out a printed copy of 328 00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:26,199 Speaker 1: the criminal complaint. You know, they're saying that this is that, 329 00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:29,159 Speaker 1: this is you, that you know you have a flag 330 00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:32,040 Speaker 1: pole and that you're assaulting an officer. 331 00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:34,520 Speaker 2: Well, you know they were trying to take the pole 332 00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:36,520 Speaker 2: from me, the flag from me. As you can see, 333 00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:39,440 Speaker 2: they're bent over backwards trying to get the pole away. 334 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:43,560 Speaker 2: That's what looks like an attack. It was not that thought. Okay. 335 00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:47,359 Speaker 2: So you're saying in court you'd like to see video. Absolutely, 336 00:22:47,480 --> 00:22:50,000 Speaker 2: I will see testimony and body camps as well. But 337 00:22:50,119 --> 00:22:55,000 Speaker 2: you you agree this is you? Absolutely, Okay. I'm not 338 00:22:55,080 --> 00:23:00,520 Speaker 2: ashamed of being there. It was our duty as patriots. 339 00:23:02,119 --> 00:23:05,399 Speaker 1: First of all, never admit to a crime on camera, 340 00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:08,120 Speaker 1: even if you don't think you're guilty of it. Don't 341 00:23:08,119 --> 00:23:11,760 Speaker 1: say you did it, don't talk to the reporter. And 342 00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:15,080 Speaker 1: second of all, I'm not sure they were trying to 343 00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:20,160 Speaker 1: take my flag is a great defense given the context here. 344 00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:24,600 Speaker 1: Even if this picture did show an officer trying to 345 00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:28,560 Speaker 1: take Dale's flagpole away from him, it's not like he 346 00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:32,800 Speaker 1: was taking candy from a baby. Dale Huddle was not 347 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:35,280 Speaker 1: the only man out there that day using his American 348 00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:40,520 Speaker 1: flag as a deeply ironic weapon. A link the criminal 349 00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:42,480 Speaker 1: complaint in the show notes, and you can see the 350 00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:46,440 Speaker 1: picture they're talking about on the second page. The officer 351 00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:50,800 Speaker 1: is leaning back, almost as if he could be engaging 352 00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:53,000 Speaker 1: in a sort of tug of war over the flagpole. 353 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:58,080 Speaker 1: But Dale's right about one thing. Pictures can be deceiving. 354 00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:05,359 Speaker 1: The officer isn't leaning back, he's falling down because an 355 00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:07,439 Speaker 1: old man poked him hard on the torso with a 356 00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:12,120 Speaker 1: big stick. And while Matthew's lawyers had argued that their 357 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:14,560 Speaker 1: client had no real opinion on the twenty twenty election 358 00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:17,720 Speaker 1: one way or the other, that he simply found himself there, 359 00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:21,639 Speaker 1: Dale's lawyers did have to concede that he was a 360 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:25,919 Speaker 1: true believer in that on camera interview right after his arrest, 361 00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:29,480 Speaker 1: he told the reporter that he still believed the election 362 00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:32,119 Speaker 1: had been stolen, and he believed he'd been following a 363 00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:33,680 Speaker 1: lawful order from his president. 364 00:24:36,080 --> 00:24:38,560 Speaker 2: And do you believe that Trump invited you there and 365 00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:43,879 Speaker 2: that he wanted you to overthrow, invite us to go 366 00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:47,719 Speaker 2: down there? Issues seen out film, let your voices be heard? Okay, 367 00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:52,800 Speaker 2: But do you think he encouraged violence? Well, I just 368 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:56,080 Speaker 2: sat there or stood there with half a million people 369 00:24:56,200 --> 00:25:01,080 Speaker 2: listening to a speech. And in that speech, both Juliani 370 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:03,080 Speaker 2: and hisself said we were going to have to fight 371 00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:09,000 Speaker 2: like hell to save our country. Okay. Now, rather it 372 00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:13,000 Speaker 2: was a figure of speech or not, it wasn't taken 373 00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:16,320 Speaker 2: that way, right, You didn't take it as a figure 374 00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:16,800 Speaker 2: of speech. 375 00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:22,880 Speaker 1: No, So they couldn't really say that he didn't mean it, 376 00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:28,240 Speaker 1: and instead they argued that he'd been tricked. He was 377 00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:30,600 Speaker 1: seventy years old in twenty twenty one. He was a 378 00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:34,840 Speaker 1: blue collar worker who didn't even own a computer. From 379 00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:39,240 Speaker 1: the defense sentencing memo, he is. 380 00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:42,439 Speaker 3: Not knowledgeable about the Internet. He was not aware that 381 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:47,120 Speaker 3: Facebook and other social media platforms use machine learning algorithms 382 00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:51,360 Speaker 3: to individualize ads and to dictate content based on previous cliques. 383 00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:55,119 Speaker 3: Mister Huddle believed that the news he was reading was 384 00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:58,399 Speaker 3: covering the general scope of mainstream media, and that it 385 00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:02,359 Speaker 3: was a representation of current events from his viewpoint. The 386 00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:05,680 Speaker 3: vast majority of the media agreed that the democratic process 387 00:26:05,680 --> 00:26:12,440 Speaker 3: had been undermined by fraud. 388 00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:14,560 Speaker 1: And I don't doubt that he and many men just 389 00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:19,919 Speaker 1: like him have absolutely rotted their brains on Facebook, clickbait 390 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:23,679 Speaker 1: right wing news. I have no trouble believing that he 391 00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:26,720 Speaker 1: was trapped in a cycle of seeing nothing but memes 392 00:26:26,760 --> 00:26:29,240 Speaker 1: where a minion in a maga hat is spreading election 393 00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:34,919 Speaker 1: misinformation or links to stories on sites called patriot windnews 394 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:39,680 Speaker 1: dot biz with headlines like deep state destroyed, new election lawsuit, 395 00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:43,959 Speaker 1: bombshell rocks DC swamp. I have a separate email account 396 00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:46,240 Speaker 1: where I get one hundred emails that look like that 397 00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:49,480 Speaker 1: every single day. I know exactly what his Facebook feed 398 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:55,199 Speaker 1: looked like, so that part's probably true. But I wish 399 00:26:55,560 --> 00:27:00,360 Speaker 1: that the government, with their vast investigative resources, had dug 400 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:05,520 Speaker 1: into a curious incident in Dale's past, because I don't 401 00:27:05,520 --> 00:27:08,480 Speaker 1: think this was the first time that dale Huddle got 402 00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:10,359 Speaker 1: worked up about the need to go to war with 403 00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:14,840 Speaker 1: the government. Now, to be clear, dale Huddle had no 404 00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:19,760 Speaker 1: criminal history. That's true. The government didn't miss something that 405 00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:23,520 Speaker 1: egregious and I'm even willing to believe the Defense memo 406 00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:26,720 Speaker 1: is being truthful when they say that at seventy years old, 407 00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:31,359 Speaker 1: Dale wasn't a member of any extremist groups. But I 408 00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:37,639 Speaker 1: found a picture, a single photograph taken on November fourteenth, 409 00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:41,680 Speaker 1: two thousand, and if I had the kinds of resources 410 00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:44,800 Speaker 1: that the government has, I would have tried to find 411 00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:49,119 Speaker 1: out more about this picture. It's just one picture in 412 00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:53,239 Speaker 1: the newspaper, snapped by an Associated Press photographer, and it's 413 00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:57,840 Speaker 1: a picture of Dale Huddle with a flag. Unlike the 414 00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:00,200 Speaker 1: photo of Dale using an American flag as a that 415 00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:04,400 Speaker 1: on January sixth, this photo shows a slightly younger Dale 416 00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:06,920 Speaker 1: Huddle and he's trying to figure out how to affix 417 00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:10,159 Speaker 1: his Gadsden flag, you know, the one with the snake 418 00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:12,720 Speaker 1: that doesn't want to be stepped on, and he's trying 419 00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:19,160 Speaker 1: to affix it to the window of a church. November fourteenth, 420 00:28:19,200 --> 00:28:22,240 Speaker 1: two thousand, was the first day of a ninety two 421 00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:27,200 Speaker 1: day standoff with US marshals at the Indianapolis Baptist Temple. 422 00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:32,160 Speaker 1: After years of litigation, a federal judge had finally given 423 00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:35,760 Speaker 1: the order for the church to vacate the premises for 424 00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:39,640 Speaker 1: seventeen years, the Indianapolis Baptist Temple under Pastor Greg Dixon, 425 00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:45,280 Speaker 1: had not been paying its taxes. You're probably saying, wait, 426 00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:50,000 Speaker 1: I thought churches were tax exempt, and they are. That's true. 427 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:55,600 Speaker 1: Churches are generally speaking automatically exempt from federal income tax, 428 00:28:57,040 --> 00:29:00,320 Speaker 1: but if they have paid employees, they still have to 429 00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:05,560 Speaker 1: withhold and remit employment tax. And the Indianapolis Baptist Temple 430 00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:07,800 Speaker 1: had been refusing to do that since nineteen eighty four, 431 00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:11,800 Speaker 1: and so by the year two thousand they owed the 432 00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:17,800 Speaker 1: irs over six million dollars. And this was an intentional, 433 00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:22,239 Speaker 1: deliberate act. They didn't forget that they had to do 434 00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:26,600 Speaker 1: payroll tax. They didn't make a mistake. The church had 435 00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:30,720 Speaker 1: originally been incorporated in nineteen fifty and for almost thirty 436 00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:34,400 Speaker 1: four years the church had a valid employer identification number. 437 00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:37,440 Speaker 1: They filed paperwork with the state to keep their corporate 438 00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:40,440 Speaker 1: entity in good standing. They paid employment taxes to the 439 00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:45,160 Speaker 1: federal government. And then in nineteen eighty three, Greg Dixon, 440 00:29:45,240 --> 00:29:48,000 Speaker 1: who'd been the pastor at the church since nineteen fifty five, 441 00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:53,520 Speaker 1: changed his mind. He transferred all of the church's assets 442 00:29:53,600 --> 00:29:58,120 Speaker 1: into an unincorporated religious society and then he changed the 443 00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:02,240 Speaker 1: corporation's name, which had previous been Indianapolis Baptist Temple. He 444 00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:07,080 Speaker 1: changed it to Not a Church Incorporated, and so the 445 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:11,080 Speaker 1: church itself no longer exists on paper at all. And 446 00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:14,360 Speaker 1: Dixon is using this not a Church corporate entity to 447 00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:18,160 Speaker 1: run a group called the American Coalition for Unregistered Churches. 448 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:22,800 Speaker 1: It would later be known as the Unregistered Baptist Fellowship. 449 00:30:24,720 --> 00:30:28,640 Speaker 1: Greg Dixon believed that doing business with the federal government 450 00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:33,800 Speaker 1: was against his religion. Having to do things like tell 451 00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:36,520 Speaker 1: the irs that your church would like to be recognized 452 00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:39,120 Speaker 1: as a five oh one C three tax exempt entity 453 00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:44,640 Speaker 1: or filing paperwork with the state actually contravenes the authority 454 00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:46,920 Speaker 1: of Christ and if you make him do it, you're 455 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:52,200 Speaker 1: violating his religious liberty. The unregistered Church movement wasn't just 456 00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:55,120 Speaker 1: refusing to pay their taxes. They wanted to avoid almost 457 00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:59,440 Speaker 1: any contact with the government. Churches shouldn't have to abide 458 00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:03,640 Speaker 1: by bill codes or zoning laws, or get fire inspections. 459 00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:07,440 Speaker 1: Babies shouldn't have birth certificates. A wedding shouldn't involve a 460 00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:10,840 Speaker 1: marriage license. In fact, no one should have any kind 461 00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:14,360 Speaker 1: of license. Many of the articles I found about this 462 00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:17,800 Speaker 1: movement make sure to add that they do believe that 463 00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:20,680 Speaker 1: they can use the United States Postal Service, but it 464 00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:26,720 Speaker 1: is a sin to use zip codes. The almost complete 465 00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:29,920 Speaker 1: overlap of guys who don't want to pay their taxes 466 00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:32,240 Speaker 1: and guys who are willing to take up arms against 467 00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:36,200 Speaker 1: the government is something I'll surely explore in depth in 468 00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:39,640 Speaker 1: an episode dedicated to some character in the tax protest 469 00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:43,560 Speaker 1: or movement, But the reason for it is probably pretty obvious, 470 00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:48,120 Speaker 1: and Pastor Greg Dixon wasn't just refusing to pay his taxes. 471 00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:55,480 Speaker 1: He wanted war. In nineteen ninety two, Greg Dixon gave 472 00:31:55,480 --> 00:32:00,240 Speaker 1: a speech at an event nicknamed the Rocky Mountain Rendezvous 473 00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:03,680 Speaker 1: after the siege at Ruby Ridge. A Christian identity preacher 474 00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:07,440 Speaker 1: in Colorado put out the call the disparate elements of 475 00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:10,720 Speaker 1: the radical right needed to put their heads together and 476 00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:16,200 Speaker 1: come up with a strategy. Klansmen, Neo Nazis, anti Semitic pastors, 477 00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:21,400 Speaker 1: militia leaders, Neo Confederates, tax protesters, bigots, and anti government 478 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:26,520 Speaker 1: extremists of all stripes convened in Colorado, and all the 479 00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:30,320 Speaker 1: big names were there. Willie Muther Peers from National Alliance, 480 00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:35,920 Speaker 1: Richard Butler from Arian Nations, Louis Beam, Kirk Lyons, James Wickstrom. 481 00:32:36,040 --> 00:32:38,520 Speaker 1: As Kathleen Blue wrote in her book Bring the War Home, 482 00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:43,800 Speaker 1: the militia movement as we know it today emerged from 483 00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:49,160 Speaker 1: the leaders, organizations, and tactics of white power organization. And 484 00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:52,880 Speaker 1: this meeting is widely regarded as the birthplace of the 485 00:32:52,920 --> 00:32:58,720 Speaker 1: modern American militia movement. And so at the Rocky Mountain Rendezvous, 486 00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:03,360 Speaker 1: just before Louis Beam's beach about leaderless resistance, pastor Greg 487 00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:06,160 Speaker 1: Dixon took the stage to call for the establishment of 488 00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:13,040 Speaker 1: Christian militias, declaring we are at war. And Greg Dixon 489 00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:16,800 Speaker 1: was hardly new to organized racism. In the nineteen seventies, 490 00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:20,160 Speaker 1: his church had hosted meetings of a group called Americans 491 00:33:20,200 --> 00:33:25,240 Speaker 1: for America, a KKK affiliated organization that opposed school integration. 492 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:30,280 Speaker 1: Indiana's Grand Dragon Bill Cheney was a member of the congregation, 493 00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:34,520 Speaker 1: but in the early nineties he was at the bleeding 494 00:33:34,760 --> 00:33:39,400 Speaker 1: edge of a new frontier in white power. All that 495 00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:42,960 Speaker 1: to say, this old picture of Dale Huddle outside of 496 00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:47,800 Speaker 1: a church might sound terribly innocuous. Maybe that's his church, 497 00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:50,760 Speaker 1: and maybe he didn't know why his pastor wasn't paying 498 00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:57,920 Speaker 1: his taxes. But it was not. Dale Huddle isn't even Baptist. 499 00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:00,840 Speaker 1: He grew up Lutheran, but has been a member of 500 00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:04,280 Speaker 1: a non denominational megachurch called the Family Christian Center since 501 00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:06,600 Speaker 1: nineteen eighty eight, ever since his mother died. 502 00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:08,360 Speaker 2: No. 503 00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:12,319 Speaker 1: Dale Huddle had no direct connection to this church that 504 00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:16,759 Speaker 1: I can find, but a call had been put out. 505 00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:20,680 Speaker 1: In September of two thousand. After years in court, a 506 00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:24,480 Speaker 1: judge gave the order they had until noon on November 507 00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:28,560 Speaker 1: fourteenth to get out of the building. The government was 508 00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:31,839 Speaker 1: taking possession of the property, and US Marshals were authorized 509 00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:37,280 Speaker 1: to use force if necessary. Michigan Militia leader Norman Olsen 510 00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:39,880 Speaker 1: ordered militias around the country to do their duty and 511 00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:44,080 Speaker 1: defend the church, telling his followers that this was going 512 00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:48,400 Speaker 1: to be Waco Part two. Charlie Puckett of the Kentucky 513 00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:51,400 Speaker 1: Militia was there on November fourteenth. As congregants waited for 514 00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:55,359 Speaker 1: the US marshals to arrive and with news crews rolling 515 00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:58,600 Speaker 1: in the parking lot, Pastor Dixon asked the contingent of 516 00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:02,040 Speaker 1: klansmen who showed up to s for him to maybe 517 00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:05,480 Speaker 1: stay outside the church, but he didn't ask them to 518 00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:11,080 Speaker 1: leave or disavow their support. And that's when this photo 519 00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:16,319 Speaker 1: was taken on November fourteenth, two thousand, parking lot full 520 00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:21,400 Speaker 1: of klansmen militia men standing by, and Dale Huddle is 521 00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:25,520 Speaker 1: outside the Indianapolis Baptist Temple trying to figure out how 522 00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:29,960 Speaker 1: to hang a Gadsden flag on the windows. He'd driven 523 00:35:30,040 --> 00:35:33,879 Speaker 1: two hours from his home in Crown Point and there 524 00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:36,600 Speaker 1: was no Facebook in two thousand. He didn't see a 525 00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:40,759 Speaker 1: meme that convinced him to go to Indianapolis. There's no 526 00:35:40,800 --> 00:35:43,080 Speaker 1: indication that he was a member of any of the 527 00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:45,400 Speaker 1: militia or clan groups that were there that day, but 528 00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:48,759 Speaker 1: it does seem quite possible that he got the same 529 00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:55,040 Speaker 1: message they did about showing up for Waco Part two, 530 00:35:55,280 --> 00:35:58,359 Speaker 1: and just so this threat isn't left hanging, the big 531 00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:00,520 Speaker 1: crowd that showed up on day one of the standoff 532 00:36:01,560 --> 00:36:06,719 Speaker 1: got board and went home. US marshals obviously did not 533 00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:10,800 Speaker 1: want Waco Part two, so they just kept their distance 534 00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:14,520 Speaker 1: and waited them out. It took three months, but in 535 00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:17,000 Speaker 1: February of two thousand and one they did seize the building. 536 00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:21,640 Speaker 1: No one was injured, but Greg Dixon was carried out 537 00:36:21,640 --> 00:36:39,200 Speaker 1: on a stretcher because he refused to walk. So that's 538 00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:42,760 Speaker 1: a rather lengthy aside just to contextualize a single twenty 539 00:36:42,760 --> 00:36:45,960 Speaker 1: five year old photograph that doesn't prove anything at all, 540 00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:51,000 Speaker 1: But it left me wondering if the US Marshals had 541 00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:54,400 Speaker 1: taken a heavier handed approach at the Indianapolis Baptist Temple, 542 00:36:55,239 --> 00:36:59,040 Speaker 1: would I be looking at two photos twenty years apart 543 00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:03,120 Speaker 1: of Dale Huddle trying to skewer a cop with a flagpole. 544 00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:07,080 Speaker 1: His lawyers argued that he was just a confused old 545 00:37:07,120 --> 00:37:08,960 Speaker 1: man who didn't know how to use the internet, and 546 00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:11,279 Speaker 1: he got tricked into believing he needed to go to 547 00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:16,120 Speaker 1: DC to stop the steal. But the possibility that twenty 548 00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:19,480 Speaker 1: years earlier, some militia newsletter tricked him into thinking he 549 00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:23,160 Speaker 1: needed to stop a different theft, that of church property 550 00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:28,879 Speaker 1: by the irs, really changes the story for me. Back 551 00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:31,960 Speaker 1: in twenty twenty one, though, after the riote of the Capitol, 552 00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:35,720 Speaker 1: Matthew Huddle was just living his life as usual. Matthew 553 00:37:35,800 --> 00:37:40,000 Speaker 1: Huddle's life as usual involved getting charged three separate times 554 00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:42,960 Speaker 1: between July and November for driving with a suspended license 555 00:37:44,640 --> 00:37:47,480 Speaker 1: as a habitual offender whose driving privileges had been revoked 556 00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:51,160 Speaker 1: after repeated to UIs each new offense of this kind 557 00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,680 Speaker 1: was a felony. In August of that year, his son's 558 00:37:54,719 --> 00:37:58,400 Speaker 1: mother died of a drug overdose. He filed for bankruptcy 559 00:37:58,440 --> 00:38:00,920 Speaker 1: that same week, and filing show he owed more than 560 00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:04,600 Speaker 1: thirteen thousand dollars in child support to a different woman, 561 00:38:05,040 --> 00:38:08,640 Speaker 1: the mother of his daughter. Neither of those children were 562 00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:12,839 Speaker 1: in Matthew's custody after his conviction. In his January sixth case, 563 00:38:13,480 --> 00:38:17,759 Speaker 1: his lawyers wrote that he had a quote great relationship 564 00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:22,600 Speaker 1: with his son. I hope that's true, and even if 565 00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:25,200 Speaker 1: it's not, my heart breaks for a teenage boy who 566 00:38:25,239 --> 00:38:27,439 Speaker 1: lost his mother to an overdose in twenty twenty one, 567 00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:30,319 Speaker 1: he saw his father go to prison in twenty twenty three, 568 00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:33,680 Speaker 1: and then he lost his father entirely just last month. 569 00:38:35,120 --> 00:38:39,800 Speaker 1: But great is the only word used there to describe 570 00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:43,279 Speaker 1: a relationship that I suspect may have been more complicated 571 00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:47,839 Speaker 1: than that. In two thousand and nine, Matthew Huddle flew 572 00:38:47,840 --> 00:38:50,640 Speaker 1: into a rage after his son, who was just three 573 00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:53,880 Speaker 1: years old at the time, had what court records describe 574 00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:58,360 Speaker 1: as a bathroom accident. It's a very normal thing for 575 00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:00,759 Speaker 1: a three year old to do at that age. You're 576 00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:03,080 Speaker 1: still sending a change of pants with them to school 577 00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:08,680 Speaker 1: just in case. What's not normal, though, is beating a 578 00:39:08,719 --> 00:39:11,879 Speaker 1: toddler so severely that he can't sit down for a week, 579 00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:18,040 Speaker 1: and the court records call it a spanking. But nothing 580 00:39:18,080 --> 00:39:20,960 Speaker 1: I could find offered me any kind of explanation for 581 00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:25,080 Speaker 1: how a spanking could leave bruises on a child's neck. 582 00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:30,319 Speaker 1: After Huddle died last week, several of the articles I 583 00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:34,239 Speaker 1: read about his death quoted an attorney who had been 584 00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:37,440 Speaker 1: representing him in his dui cases for nearly twenty years, 585 00:39:38,640 --> 00:39:40,840 Speaker 1: and his lawyer says that the man he'd known was 586 00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:44,719 Speaker 1: not violent. I don't know what else you call this, 587 00:39:46,440 --> 00:39:49,000 Speaker 1: I guess in that lawyer's defense, it does look like 588 00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:52,359 Speaker 1: he'd hired a different attorney when he was charged with 589 00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:57,839 Speaker 1: beating his son and his son's mother. After Matthew Huddle 590 00:39:57,840 --> 00:40:00,880 Speaker 1: blood guilty in twenty twenty three to that single misdemeanor 591 00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:03,200 Speaker 1: charge of entering and remaining in a restricted building on 592 00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:07,600 Speaker 1: January sixth, his lawyers asked for a sentence of probation 593 00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:12,520 Speaker 1: with no jail time. They cited his lack of ideological 594 00:40:12,560 --> 00:40:15,239 Speaker 1: motivation for being there, his need to be there for 595 00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:19,600 Speaker 1: his children and his tragic backstory and struggle with alcoholism. 596 00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:25,319 Speaker 1: And there is a strange and tragic backstory here, but 597 00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:28,200 Speaker 1: they don't actually get into it in this court filing. 598 00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:33,399 Speaker 1: This part I pieced together from state court records, old newspapers, 599 00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:37,600 Speaker 1: and Facebook posts. After serving his sentence for beating his son, 600 00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:40,480 Speaker 1: he was released from jail in twenty thirteen, and he 601 00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:44,000 Speaker 1: very quickly took up with a new girlfriend. Based on 602 00:40:44,040 --> 00:40:46,279 Speaker 1: the apparent age of a photo of their daughter that 603 00:40:46,360 --> 00:40:50,080 Speaker 1: he posted online in twenty fifteen, she had to have 604 00:40:50,160 --> 00:40:53,560 Speaker 1: been pregnant with Huddle's child before she ended her marriage 605 00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:58,480 Speaker 1: to another man. I have said this before, comes up 606 00:40:58,960 --> 00:41:03,839 Speaker 1: often oddly, but I don't care about that. Her infidelity 607 00:41:03,880 --> 00:41:08,640 Speaker 1: is between her, her husband, and her boyfriend. I only 608 00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:14,120 Speaker 1: mention it because of a curious coincidence of dates. The 609 00:41:14,200 --> 00:41:19,040 Speaker 1: same week her divorce was finalized, someone shot Matthew Huddle. 610 00:41:21,040 --> 00:41:23,800 Speaker 1: There's a single mention in the local newspaper in February 611 00:41:23,880 --> 00:41:26,759 Speaker 1: twenty fifteen, just a few days after his daughter's mother 612 00:41:26,840 --> 00:41:30,960 Speaker 1: finalized her divorce, that Huddle had been shot in what 613 00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:35,240 Speaker 1: was only described as quote an incident between family members, 614 00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:39,440 Speaker 1: and The article quotes an officer who says that no 615 00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:42,360 Speaker 1: one was taken into custody at this time, and he 616 00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:44,600 Speaker 1: wouldn't say how the shooter was related to the victim. 617 00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:49,040 Speaker 1: I couldn't find any court records that indicated the charges 618 00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:52,520 Speaker 1: were ever filed against anyone, but I could only check 619 00:41:52,600 --> 00:41:54,719 Speaker 1: the names I thought of his suspects. So it's a 620 00:41:54,719 --> 00:41:58,319 Speaker 1: bit of a needle in a haystack whoever it was. 621 00:41:58,360 --> 00:42:02,439 Speaker 1: Though someone close to him shot Matthew in the back 622 00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:05,160 Speaker 1: of the knee and left him with a lifelong injury, 623 00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:09,680 Speaker 1: and three years later, in twenty eighteen, he was asleep 624 00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:11,680 Speaker 1: in his bed when he woke up to two men 625 00:42:11,840 --> 00:42:17,520 Speaker 1: beating him with baseball bats and hammers. The local newspaper 626 00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:21,279 Speaker 1: reported the attack was motivated by a child custody dispute. 627 00:42:22,560 --> 00:42:25,960 Speaker 1: One of the assailants, Kurt Falkenberg, was in a relationship 628 00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:29,560 Speaker 1: with the mother of Huddle's son. The other man was 629 00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:33,680 Speaker 1: Falkenberg's uncle, Jeffrey Martin, though the two men were only 630 00:42:33,719 --> 00:42:37,920 Speaker 1: a few years apart in age, and the men focused 631 00:42:37,960 --> 00:42:41,560 Speaker 1: their blows on Huddle's left leg because they knew he 632 00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:43,719 Speaker 1: had a metal rod in there from the surgeries he'd 633 00:42:43,760 --> 00:42:46,000 Speaker 1: gotten after getting shot in the leg in his last 634 00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:50,760 Speaker 1: domestic dispute. Much like the story of Matthew and Dale Huddle, 635 00:42:51,360 --> 00:42:53,920 Speaker 1: this story of a very stupid crime committed by an 636 00:42:54,040 --> 00:42:59,520 Speaker 1: uncle and a nephew ends tragically. As Falkenberg and Martin 637 00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:05,080 Speaker 1: fled the scene, they crashed. Falkenberg, who had been driving, 638 00:43:05,239 --> 00:43:09,000 Speaker 1: was pronounced dead at the scene. Officers responding to the 639 00:43:09,040 --> 00:43:11,520 Speaker 1: car accident, which put another driver in the hospital with 640 00:43:11,560 --> 00:43:15,040 Speaker 1: two broken legs, found an open bottle of whiskey in 641 00:43:15,080 --> 00:43:19,279 Speaker 1: Falkenburg's car, and they eventually found Jeffrey Martin passed out 642 00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:24,960 Speaker 1: drunk in a creek bed on the side of the road. 643 00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:29,920 Speaker 1: The following year, in twenty nineteen, Matthew Huddle was diagnosed 644 00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:33,759 Speaker 1: with cirrhosis of the liver. Twenty years of alcoholism had 645 00:43:33,800 --> 00:43:37,480 Speaker 1: finally caught up to him. The dui he got that 646 00:43:37,520 --> 00:43:39,200 Speaker 1: summer was the one that put him back in jail 647 00:43:39,239 --> 00:43:41,480 Speaker 1: until shortly before he drove to Washington, d c. In 648 00:43:41,560 --> 00:43:46,840 Speaker 1: January of twenty twenty one. Now I've read a lot 649 00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:50,719 Speaker 1: of sentencing memos. That's the document filed at the end 650 00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:54,080 Speaker 1: of a case after a guilty plea or a guilty verdict, 651 00:43:54,560 --> 00:43:58,239 Speaker 1: where each side makes their case one last time. Not 652 00:43:58,320 --> 00:44:01,960 Speaker 1: about guilt or innocence. Now that's settled, but about what 653 00:44:02,000 --> 00:44:05,600 Speaker 1: they think the punishment should be. And we have an 654 00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:10,840 Speaker 1: adversarial court system. Everyone is technically ethically bound to be honest, 655 00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:12,880 Speaker 1: and the purpose of the courts is supposed to be 656 00:44:12,920 --> 00:44:16,759 Speaker 1: to seek the truth, but really everyone is there to win, 657 00:44:17,800 --> 00:44:20,080 Speaker 1: to have their version of the truth ruled to be 658 00:44:20,360 --> 00:44:23,840 Speaker 1: the most true. So I'm really used to seeing a 659 00:44:23,880 --> 00:44:29,279 Speaker 1: defense attorney's sob story and a prosecutor's exaggeration. But I 660 00:44:29,400 --> 00:44:34,360 Speaker 1: wonder maybe if Matthew Huddle's lawyers really were telling a 661 00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:40,640 Speaker 1: mostly true story. He didn't vote, he couldn't. His family 662 00:44:40,680 --> 00:44:44,000 Speaker 1: doesn't seem very political. No one in his family has 663 00:44:44,000 --> 00:44:47,640 Speaker 1: ever donated so much as a dollar to any federal election. 664 00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:53,800 Speaker 1: And he did have a long history of making spectacularly 665 00:44:53,880 --> 00:45:00,160 Speaker 1: bad decisions and finding himself in some really outlandishly bad situation. 666 00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:04,080 Speaker 1: I mean, he got his legs broken in two unrelated 667 00:45:04,160 --> 00:45:09,480 Speaker 1: domestic disputes. That doesn't even sound possible. So maybe Matthew 668 00:45:09,560 --> 00:45:13,359 Speaker 1: Huddle is the only January sixth defendant who really did 669 00:45:13,480 --> 00:45:16,960 Speaker 1: end up there by accident with no ideological motivation or 670 00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:21,319 Speaker 1: violent intent. Plenty of them claimed that in court, and 671 00:45:21,360 --> 00:45:25,640 Speaker 1: it never really rings true. But maybe for Matthew Huddle, 672 00:45:25,960 --> 00:45:28,560 Speaker 1: wandering into the Capitol that day was just the same 673 00:45:28,680 --> 00:45:32,359 Speaker 1: kind of criminal accident he was often finding himself in, 674 00:45:33,640 --> 00:45:35,960 Speaker 1: like driving away without paying for a tank of gas 675 00:45:36,080 --> 00:45:38,160 Speaker 1: because he was too drunk to figure out how to 676 00:45:38,200 --> 00:45:41,880 Speaker 1: operate the payment system, but somehow not too drunk to drive. 677 00:45:44,520 --> 00:45:46,560 Speaker 1: When I first saw the news that had recently pardoned 678 00:45:46,640 --> 00:45:49,720 Speaker 1: January sixth defendant had been shot and killed while resisting 679 00:45:49,800 --> 00:45:53,200 Speaker 1: arrest during a traffic stop, I can't say that I 680 00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:57,000 Speaker 1: was surprised, but I was wrong in my initial assumption. 681 00:45:58,320 --> 00:46:00,960 Speaker 1: I figured a guy who found himself on that trajectory 682 00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:04,400 Speaker 1: would be I don't know, as sovereign citizen or a 683 00:46:04,440 --> 00:46:06,680 Speaker 1: guy who'd done real violence at the Capitol, a guy 684 00:46:06,680 --> 00:46:10,359 Speaker 1: who had violent plans for the future. Surely those two 685 00:46:10,400 --> 00:46:13,520 Speaker 1: facts about his life being at the Capitol that day 686 00:46:13,600 --> 00:46:16,600 Speaker 1: and dying the way that he did. Surely those two 687 00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:21,600 Speaker 1: facts would be directly related. But I'm not sure they are. 688 00:46:24,320 --> 00:46:27,239 Speaker 1: It's unwise to speculate about the altercation that may have 689 00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:29,520 Speaker 1: occurred in the minutes before Huddle was shot and killed 690 00:46:29,560 --> 00:46:32,759 Speaker 1: by a Jasper County Sheriff's deputy. I don't know what 691 00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:35,760 Speaker 1: happened there on the side of Indiana State Road fourteen. 692 00:46:36,800 --> 00:46:39,360 Speaker 1: We don't know what was said, or why things escalated, 693 00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:44,120 Speaker 1: or where exactly the deputy saw the gun, but I 694 00:46:44,160 --> 00:46:46,359 Speaker 1: do know that Matthew Huddle was due back in court 695 00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:49,600 Speaker 1: next week for a status conference on a stack of 696 00:46:49,640 --> 00:46:54,719 Speaker 1: still unresolved felony cases for driving without a license, just 697 00:46:54,840 --> 00:46:58,280 Speaker 1: days after getting his federal pardon. He was probably happy 698 00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:02,000 Speaker 1: for his uncle Dale, but he'd already done his federal time, 699 00:47:02,120 --> 00:47:04,320 Speaker 1: and now he was looking down the barrel at another 700 00:47:04,320 --> 00:47:07,399 Speaker 1: stay in the county jail, and when those blue lights 701 00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:10,319 Speaker 1: came on behind him, he probably knew that this would 702 00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:15,799 Speaker 1: be yet another felony charge. He had a long list 703 00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:21,280 Speaker 1: of state charges. A federal pardon did nothing for him. 704 00:47:21,760 --> 00:47:24,400 Speaker 1: In the end. It didn't matter who the president was. 705 00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:37,840 Speaker 1: But I guess it never really did matter to Matthew. 706 00:47:40,360 --> 00:47:42,560 Speaker 1: Weird Little Guys is a production of Cool Zone Media 707 00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:46,560 Speaker 1: and iHeartRadio. It's research, written, and recorded by me Willy Conger. 708 00:47:47,160 --> 00:47:50,799 Speaker 1: Our executive producers are Sophie Littterman and Robert Evans. The 709 00:47:50,840 --> 00:47:54,040 Speaker 1: show is edited by the wildly talented Rory Gagan. The 710 00:47:54,040 --> 00:47:57,320 Speaker 1: theme music was composed by Brad Dickert. You can email 711 00:47:57,360 --> 00:48:00,439 Speaker 1: me at Rubuguy's podcast at gmail dot com. I will 712 00:48:00,480 --> 00:48:03,200 Speaker 1: definitely read it, but I'm not going to answer it. 713 00:48:03,200 --> 00:48:07,200 Speaker 1: It's nothing personal. You can exchange conspiracy theories about the show. 714 00:48:07,200 --> 00:48:09,239 Speaker 1: We have the listeners on the Weird Little Guy subreddit. 715 00:48:10,160 --> 00:48:12,880 Speaker 1: Just don't post anything that's going to make you one 716 00:48:12,920 --> 00:48:13,920 Speaker 1: of my weird Little Guys.