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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you should know, a production of I

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Speaker 1: Heart Radio. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark,

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Speaker 1: Charles W. Chuck Brian is with me as always. Jerry's

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Speaker 1: here too. And if you put the three of us together,

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Speaker 1: stir us around, Shake us up a little bit. Put

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Speaker 1: in a raw egg white. Shake us again, Add some mice.

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Speaker 1: Shake us the third time until your hand can't stand

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Speaker 1: the outside of the shaker any longer. Pour us into

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Speaker 1: a coupe or coupe, depending on where you are into

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Speaker 1: the world. Put a real deal marischino cherry not that

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Speaker 1: can you buy the grocery store in US. And a

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Speaker 1: nice little swizzle stick. You've got stuff you should know.

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Speaker 1: I just added a little egg white to my my

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Speaker 1: chuck B drink. What's your chuck B drink? It's my

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Speaker 1: spin on the bee's knees. It's the chuck B. It's

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Speaker 1: in b e yes, sure, neat. So there's honey in it.

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Speaker 1: Whiskey and crem to manth right. No, I do a

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Speaker 1: shot of gin of a blond dart. You got laon

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Speaker 1: dart at your house? No, you want to send me some? Sure,

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Speaker 1: it's uh, it's a local. Uh. It's from old fourth

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Speaker 1: word distillery. It's it's a ginger lemon liqueur. That's pretty cool. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And then I add a little pineapple gum syrup, just

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Speaker 1: a little bit, because that goes a long way, I

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Speaker 1: can imagine. And then what else do I add? At

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Speaker 1: ginger bitters? You gotta have a lemon juice? What about

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Speaker 1: honey honey syrup? Okay? Right? Like I make mountain honey syrup.

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Speaker 1: Not not sure because then it just sits at the

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Speaker 1: bottom like a dumb viscus thing right saying, don't look

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Speaker 1: at me. And then I chake the cred out of it.

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Speaker 1: I've got these beautiful vintage seventies coops. Then I add

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Speaker 1: a little lemon twist. But I've added the egg white

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Speaker 1: this last time, and it just you know, he gives

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Speaker 1: it that lovely little phone on top. It really does

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Speaker 1: you do you add the egg white first, and then

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Speaker 1: shake for a few seconds, and then add the ice. No,

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Speaker 1: I had everything together, and I just I shake till

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Speaker 1: my arms swall off and it bombs up really lovely. Gotcha,

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Speaker 1: You don't have to shake his heart. If you shake

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Speaker 1: for a little bit first without ice, and then add

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Speaker 1: the ice, it's Um, it's way faster and your arms

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Speaker 1: will thank you. I shake for the temperature, not so

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Speaker 1: much as for the phone, gotcha. Yeah yeah, yeah, I

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Speaker 1: like it to be And I freeze my glass like

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Speaker 1: ten minutes ahead of time because I like it to

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Speaker 1: be so cold. It's like that's the key to the

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Speaker 1: Chuck B. Yeah, I'm with you, I'm with you. I

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Speaker 1: want one right now now, yeah, for real, right now now.

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Speaker 1: So I think, Chuck, you deserve a Nobel Prize and

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Speaker 1: awesomeness for coming up with the the Chuck B and

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Speaker 1: naming it too. That's a great name. Thanks. Okay. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you couldn't get a Nobel Prize and awesomeness if you

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Speaker 1: wanted to, because it doesn't exist, although something similar does.

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Speaker 1: It's called the Nobel Peace Prize. Really yeah uh, And

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Speaker 1: that's the focus of this one. I mean, we could

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Speaker 1: probably put out a four part series on the entire

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Speaker 1: Nobel slate. We're not going to do that. But we're

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Speaker 1: not gonna do that. This is mainly about the Peace

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Speaker 1: Prize because Pieces where It's at Ask anybody, anybody, ask Bono. Sure,

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Speaker 1: he'll say, I hate the name you two and pieces

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Speaker 1: where It's at. He doesn't like the name you two. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that just came out this week. He said he's never

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Speaker 1: really liked the name. Who came up with at the edge?

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Speaker 1: I think so or no, no, no, I think it

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Speaker 1: was maybe a manager at the time suggested it and

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Speaker 1: they went with it and he didn't love it. And

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Speaker 1: now he says he didn't like it. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: Come on, bonno, shut up. It's a great name. He's like,

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Speaker 1: I haven't been in the press for a while. What

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Speaker 1: can I Yeah, exactly, that's probably about right. I haven't

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Speaker 1: been on the cover of Catholic magazine in months. He's

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Speaker 1: probably one of Nobel Peace Prize he is not. Okay, no,

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Speaker 1: but I'm sure he's won some other humanitarian awards. But

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Speaker 1: he has too, because we'll see, like anybody, anyone can

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Speaker 1: be nominated for a Nobel Peace Prize. There's no great

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Speaker 1: honor in that. I mean there is some, especially if

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Speaker 1: the person nominating you like genuinely means it and you're

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Speaker 1: actually nominated by more than one person. But as far

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Speaker 1: as the Nobel Prize Peace Prize Committee is concerned, group

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Speaker 1: of Norwegian people who take this very seriously, Um, there's

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Speaker 1: no real honor in that you have to really win

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Speaker 1: the prize, or at least make it onto the actual

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Speaker 1: short shortlist to really kind of be significantly um within

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Speaker 1: the warmth glow, the warm glow of the Nobel Peace Prize. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, we'll get into nominations later, but you know,

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Speaker 1: several hundred people are nominated, and people like Mussolini and

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Speaker 1: Stalin and Hitler have been dominated. Yeah, so not not Yeah,

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Speaker 1: And I'm gonna nominate us one day. I'm gonna become

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Speaker 1: a political science professor. I'm a nominate nominators for a

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Speaker 1: joint award. And how about this, We'll throw out a

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Speaker 1: bit of mystery here that will explain later. Maybe we'll

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Speaker 1: find out if Bonos was nominated in fifty years. So years.

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Speaker 1: That's great good foreshadowing there. So I'm pretty sure everybody

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Speaker 1: who has ever heard of the Nobel Peace Prize is

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Speaker 1: aware that it's named after Alfred Nobel. And I would

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Speaker 1: say that a significant portion of those people probably know

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Speaker 1: that Alfred Nobel is one and the same as the

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Speaker 1: Alfred Nobel who invented dynamite. Wouldn't you say? Yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: one of those I think early cocktail party facts that

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Speaker 1: people like to throw around, yeah, because it kind of

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Speaker 1: stands out. Alfred Nobel created an explosive that was probably

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Speaker 1: killed a lot of people in his lifetime, but then

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Speaker 1: upon his death bestowed or endowed a prize um that

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Speaker 1: was dedicated to promoting peace in humanitarian issues and keeping

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Speaker 1: things nice and chill, I think is how he put

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Speaker 1: it in his will. Yeah, although the one New York

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Speaker 1: Times article you since said that during his lifetime, dynamite

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Speaker 1: wasn't really you for war yet mm hmm, more operation

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Speaker 1: plowshare type purposes, you know, blast digging tunnels, John Henry style. Right,

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Speaker 1: So okay, all right, but um, he was an industrialist

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Speaker 1: and there was at least there is at least a

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Speaker 1: story that we'll get to that suggests that he was

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Speaker 1: equated with warfare at the very least his he was

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Speaker 1: following in a family legacy of creating things that, if

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Speaker 1: if weren't directly used for warfare, certainly could be. His

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Speaker 1: father Manuel kind of kicked the whole thing off when

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Speaker 1: he moved the family to Russia and started creating um

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Speaker 1: weaponry for the Russians at the time, I think in

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Speaker 1: the late nineteenth century. Yeah, they were, I mean, it

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Speaker 1: was kind of he was kind of Tony Stark in

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Speaker 1: a way, and his dad was, uh, now, I can't

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Speaker 1: think of it was dad Tony Stark's dad, um Oscar

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Speaker 1: from the Odd Couple. We can picture the actor. I

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Speaker 1: can't think of the elder Stark anyway. Felix from the Couple, Sure,

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Speaker 1: Felix Odd Couple. Stark was his name. But the point

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Speaker 1: is his dad made a lot of money in the

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Speaker 1: you know, sort of munitions business, in the arms business,

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Speaker 1: like a ton of money, and moved his family from

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Speaker 1: Sweden to Russia, where his children were raised with a

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Speaker 1: silver Russian spoon in their mark in their mouth, had

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Speaker 1: private tutors and it was a little bit of a

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Speaker 1: Tony Stark thing. Like he the kids ended up brilliant

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Speaker 1: because they had the money to sort of pay for that,

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Speaker 1: you know. I just as a little side note, Chuck,

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Speaker 1: I read an article recently. I cannot remember where where

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Speaker 1: I read it, but it was basically like critiquing the

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Speaker 1: Iron Man franchise, yeah, for promoting the military industrial complex,

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Speaker 1: because they really glorified him as this kind of like

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Speaker 1: you know, weaponry industrialist, advanced weaponry kind of guy, and

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Speaker 1: like that's his whole jam and Um, I thought that

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Speaker 1: was a pretty interesting take, because I mean, I'm sure

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Speaker 1: there's plenty of people out there who are Iron Man

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Speaker 1: fans who hadn't really stopped to think about that. You know.

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Speaker 1: That's just like part and parcel with it. Well, I mean,

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Speaker 1: that's a major plot point in the very first one,

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Speaker 1: was him going back against all that and realizing that

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Speaker 1: he had led to so much war and devastation. And

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Speaker 1: now that's why he kind of changed his tune and

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Speaker 1: started the Avengers and started blowing things up in a

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Speaker 1: very private way. Really, Okay, I wonder if the person

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Speaker 1: who wrote the article like me hadn't seen the first one.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. Interesting, but so um, so Alfred was

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Speaker 1: following his father's footsteps, right, Um. Eventually he was he

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Speaker 1: he um was a very worldly, very well educated person.

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Speaker 1: He was tutored by the best tutors that St. Petersburg,

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Speaker 1: Russia had to offer. Um. He spoke five languages. He

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Speaker 1: was very well versed in literature and chemistry. Apparently said

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Speaker 1: once that he could digest philosophy as well as he

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Speaker 1: could digest a mule, maybe even better. But he was

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Speaker 1: also but he didn't really fart. He did he made

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Speaker 1: the arm farting noise because that's physics, right right. Um, So, uh,

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Speaker 1: he was a he was an odd duck in a

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Speaker 1: lot of ways, and he lived too long ago to

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Speaker 1: pin down in today's terms, but you could call him that.

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Speaker 1: He was Uh, he kicked around in Europe. Um, he

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Speaker 1: was a very wealthy person, kicked around Europe. Um kind

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Speaker 1: of was a dilettante and stuff he was interested in.

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Speaker 1: But it was also very brilliant. But apparently described himself

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Speaker 1: as a missingthrope and a bit of a loner. I think, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean he never got married, never had kids. I

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Speaker 1: think when he described himself as having a pitiful half life,

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Speaker 1: the quote in full was pretty sad because he he

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Speaker 1: basically says, the doctor should have killed me right after

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Speaker 1: I was born. Really, it's very hard on himself. Uh,

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Speaker 1: despite being a brilliant guy. Um. He eventually started to

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Speaker 1: work in nitroglycerin along with his other emial and there

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Speaker 1: was a tragic accident in eighteen sixty four where a

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Speaker 1: meal and I think four other people died in an explosion.

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Speaker 1: And for a while there, in fact, you could not

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Speaker 1: uh in Sweden, you could not work with nitroglysts, and

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Speaker 1: for a while and experiment with it because of that. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: because I think his family was Swedish and background. Um,

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Speaker 1: so they must have moved back to Sweden at this time.

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Speaker 1: Where else the people in Russia had been like why

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Speaker 1: did you that was a weird low Sweden, just mind

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Speaker 1: your own business. But um, I guess Alfred was living

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Speaker 1: in Sweden at the time because in response to that

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Speaker 1: law he moved his lab off short so think about this.

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Speaker 1: His friend, his brother and other people who has probably

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Speaker 1: probably knew all died in an explosion. That's a grizzly

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Speaker 1: death at the very least for the survivors who have

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Speaker 1: to clean up afterwards. Right, that's a big deal. And

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Speaker 1: he still was like, I'm going to keep pursuing nitro

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Speaker 1: glysts and studies, and and did so by moving his

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Speaker 1: lab out under a barge on the lake um somewhere

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Speaker 1: in Sweden. Yeah, it's I'm not going to pronounce that

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Speaker 1: lake because then I'm gonna do it wrong. My laren,

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Speaker 1: there you go, muller in, Yeah, because there's a oom out,

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Speaker 1: that's right. But he eventually uh came up with dynamite

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Speaker 1: because it was a bit more stable of a form

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Speaker 1: of explosive and sold a lot of it, made a

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Speaker 1: ton of money, selling it to Australia and the States

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Speaker 1: and all around Europe, Western Europe. And you know he

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Speaker 1: I think he ended up with more than three hundred

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Speaker 1: and fifty patents to his name, So he was he

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Speaker 1: was a consummate inventor, uh, inventing all kinds of things

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Speaker 1: and making tons and tons of money along the way.

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Speaker 1: I think in the end he died with um and

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Speaker 1: this is very important. We'll get to his will and

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Speaker 1: how it was used. But he died with close to

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Speaker 1: ten million bucks, which for back then was like three

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Speaker 1: hundred and change today. Yeah, like a lot of million,

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Speaker 1: three hundred million, not three backwards. It didn't deeply Yeah, um.

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Speaker 1: He subscribed to that Garfield poster from the eighties where

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Speaker 1: Garfields standing in front of a mansion, in front of

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Speaker 1: a Lamborghini, et cetera. It says he who dies with

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Speaker 1: the most toys wins. You remember that poster. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: was in the Garfield I was too, But even at

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Speaker 1: the time, I was like, this is a this poster

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Speaker 1: is wrong. Yeah, I don't know about that message. And

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Speaker 1: what's the deal with Lasagna. It's strange. Plus Also, it

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Speaker 1: was all live action to like it was a real photograph,

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Speaker 1: and then they just drew Garfield over it, which is

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Speaker 1: not a good combination to begin. It never looks good. So, um,

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Speaker 1: here's where we reached this point where that I referred

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Speaker 1: to earlier, where there's a kind of a lower a

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Speaker 1: legend around Alfred Dobell and why he went from inventing

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Speaker 1: stuff that make things go boom to bestowing or endowing

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Speaker 1: a major award, the Nobel Prizes, in particular the Nobel

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Speaker 1: Peace Prize. And there's a really great story that may

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Speaker 1: or may not be true about an obituary that was

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Speaker 1: accidentally printed about him before he died. And how about

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Speaker 1: this cliffhanger style. We'll get to that story right after

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Speaker 1: a break. Yes, this is quite a cliffhanger. All right,

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Speaker 1: I'm on the cliff. I'm hanging there like Tom Cruise,

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Speaker 1: a mission impossible. Whatever. As the story goes, some people

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Speaker 1: say it's a myth. I think it's a pretty good

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Speaker 1: story either way. Is that when Alfred's brother Ludwig died

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Speaker 1: in a French newspaper got it all wrong and thought

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Speaker 1: that Alfred had died, which is a very interesting experiment

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Speaker 1: to think about if you could read your obituary while

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Speaker 1: still alive, Like, what would that look like? I thought

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Speaker 1: about that a little bit. Then I was like, no

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Speaker 1: one would even write an obituary for me. That would

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Speaker 1: be The saddest thing. Is the New York Times to

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Speaker 1: be like pooh, but at any rate, or maybe a

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Speaker 1: French newspaper would get it wrong. But they called him

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Speaker 1: the merchant of death, and that said he his wealth

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Speaker 1: came from the invention of new ways to mutilate and kill. Um.

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Speaker 1: The fact that they may not have used dynamite specifically

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Speaker 1: for war during his lifetime is if the New York

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Speaker 1: Times is correct, um, he still had his hand in

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Speaker 1: many kinds of munitions. So the reason that people are

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Speaker 1: suspect about this maybe being apocryphal is that historians have

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Speaker 1: been unable to actually locate an original copy of that article. Yeah, well,

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Speaker 1: just not to say it did not exist. But even

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Speaker 1: if it didn't, it's definitely a story worth relating because

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Speaker 1: at point Alfred Nobel definitely did go from misanthrope who

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Speaker 1: was a loner um who just liked to kick around

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Speaker 1: Europe to dying and in a very big shock to

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Speaker 1: everybody in particular his heirs who were expecting to inherit

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Speaker 1: that three fifty million dollars, saying this is what I

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Speaker 1: want you to do with my my vast wealth. I

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Speaker 1: want you to set up a prize that promotes the arts,

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Speaker 1: the sciences and peace. And here's how we're gonna do it.

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Speaker 1: That's right, other people say. And this was a pretty

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Speaker 1: pivotal relationship in his life. But at one point he

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Speaker 1: hired a woman named Bertha of On Suttner to work

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Speaker 1: for him, as I guess it would be sort of

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Speaker 1: like an executive assistant these days, and that was for

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Speaker 1: a misanthrope, ended up being one of his closest friends.

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Speaker 1: Worked for him until she got married, and she was

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Speaker 1: a peace activist writing a book called Laid Down Your Arms.

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Speaker 1: And some people say that he may have been um,

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Speaker 1: not trying to curry favor, but just influenced by her. Yes, um.

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Speaker 1: And she actually won the Nobel Peace Prize in nineteen

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Speaker 1: o five in part because of her influence on the

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Speaker 1: Nobel Peace Prize even being created. So I think they

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Speaker 1: definitely even thought contemporaneously that she definitely had a huge

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Speaker 1: hand in his his kind of change of heart, because

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Speaker 1: apparently before he was one of those mutual assert destruction

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Speaker 1: types where he's like, no, no, if you have like

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Speaker 1: if you could use dynamite to blow everybody up at once,

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Speaker 1: and everybody realizes that you can blow everybody up at once,

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Speaker 1: they're just gonna stop fighting, which you know kind of works,

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Speaker 1: but you know that that's not really a very peaceful stance.

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Speaker 1: And apparently he changed his team before he died, and

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Speaker 1: there were many more weapons to come. You know, he

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Speaker 1: didn't know that at the time, but he didn't think

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Speaker 1: about like, oh, wait a minute, but what if they

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Speaker 1: made something worse than dynamite, right, and then oh, I

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Speaker 1: don't know, escalate to nuclear arms one. Um. So he

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Speaker 1: passed away in eight December ten, Uh, I think, so sure,

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Speaker 1: let's go with that. It's definitely December ten. Yeah. I

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Speaker 1: think it was because it took a few years uh

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Speaker 1: to get to the very first prize in nineteen o one.

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Speaker 1: Because he had lived sort of all over, like you

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Speaker 1: you were talking about um when he was young and

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Speaker 1: even when he was older. He had a place in France,

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Speaker 1: he lived in Sweden some, he spent time in Russia,

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Speaker 1: he spent time in Italy, so there was a lot

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Speaker 1: of um legal wrangling to do when he changed his

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Speaker 1: will towards the end in a I don't know if

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Speaker 1: it was haphazard, but it definitely had some holes in

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Speaker 1: it enough that his family could complain about it and

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Speaker 1: sort of tie it up legally for a few years,

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Speaker 1: which they definitely tried to. And there's another great story

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Speaker 1: to um that his executor, the executor of his estate,

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Speaker 1: was very worried that some of the French we're going

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Speaker 1: to try to put a claim on them on his fortune.

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Speaker 1: And so he actually gathered his money millions of dollars,

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Speaker 1: so this is about three fifty million hours today in cash,

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Speaker 1: put it on a stage coach and drove it through

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Speaker 1: the streets of Paris to the Swedish embassy to deliver

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Speaker 1: it safely, to make sure it made it to Sweden

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Speaker 1: with a revolver on his lap, because apparently people would

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Speaker 1: crash into you at the time with their carriages, like

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Speaker 1: a bump and run kind of thing, right putting in

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Speaker 1: a carriage, and they would have had quite a paid

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Speaker 1: day had they realized that this guy had three fifty

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Speaker 1: million dollars inside. Yeah, and you know, the word gets

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Speaker 1: out and all of a sudden it's crash city, that's right.

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Speaker 1: So the first prize finally gets awarded, like they figured

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Speaker 1: this out. One of the other reasons that it took

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Speaker 1: so long to chunk was not just the legal wrangling

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Speaker 1: by the heirs, but the fact that Nobel basically said,

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Speaker 1: here's what I want you to do with the money.

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Speaker 1: You go figure it out, um, And so it took

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Speaker 1: a little while to figure it out. Like he I

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Speaker 1: saw it put that he um endowed an institution that

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Speaker 1: didn't exist yet, and that he left it to his

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Speaker 1: errors to create it. And there was actually a potential

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Speaker 1: that it just wasn't going to be followed through, that

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Speaker 1: it was gonna be too into a headache, or that

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Speaker 1: his heirs really should have the money. Um. But finally

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00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:08,800
Speaker 1: they got it worked out and they started um releasing

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Speaker 1: the first are giving out the first Nobel Peace Prize

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Speaker 1: in one and apparently from the outset it was it

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Speaker 1: was a very well known prize. It didn't start quietly

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Speaker 1: and then build over the years. From the get go,

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Speaker 1: people knew about the Nobel Peace Prize. Yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: from what I saw, just doing something like this create

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Speaker 1: a large cash prize was very unique for the time. Uh, now,

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Speaker 1: to give out a big prize with an award, like

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Speaker 1: a cash award attached to it is you know, you

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Speaker 1: see that a lot these days, but back then it

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Speaker 1: was um. Just the fact that it was a cash

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Speaker 1: prize was a big deal. And a couple that with

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Speaker 1: the fact that this, along with the uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: the other Nobel prizes, this was a piece award and

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Speaker 1: it was the creator of dynamite, and we make big

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Speaker 1: hay about that now, but they also did the same

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Speaker 1: back then. Yeah, and that was a huge cash prize too.

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Speaker 1: I mean even out of the get out of the

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Speaker 1: gate it was worth about a million dollars, So I

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00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:09,600
Speaker 1: mean like it was a lot of money that was

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Speaker 1: suddenly given for people promoting peace. So yeah, I think

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Speaker 1: it was innovative, and then it was you know, the

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Speaker 1: it was a big cash prize. And then the inventor

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Speaker 1: of dynamite is the one who did it, who was

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Speaker 1: already a very well known figure internationally too. So the

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Speaker 1: way he went about funding it too was interesting. He

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Speaker 1: didn't just assume that that nine million bucks would be

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Speaker 1: forever money. So he said, here's what we're gonna do.

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Speaker 1: I want you to invest this money. And then the

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Speaker 1: prize money will be doled out from the money that

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Speaker 1: that money makes from the interest and so over the years.

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Speaker 1: It's not like a set amount. It's sort of varied

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Speaker 1: over the years depending on how his investments went. Um.

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Speaker 1: But like you said, in today's dollars, it started off

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Speaker 1: at about a million, and it's usually I think since

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Speaker 1: like the eighties, it's been about that every year. Yeah. Um.

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Speaker 1: And so one I think one of the original intents

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Speaker 1: possibly was that it's kind of like a genius grant

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Speaker 1: where you're, you know, you get a million dollars for

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Speaker 1: your work, and you're you're meant to continue on with

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Speaker 1: this work. You don't have to worry about running around

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Speaker 1: getting grants or you can just focus on the work

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Speaker 1: part because you're doing such a good job. But um,

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Speaker 1: and I think that some people keep the money with

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Speaker 1: the other Nobel Prizes, the ones for like literature and physics. Um.

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Speaker 1: But I do know for a fact that for the

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Speaker 1: Peace Prize, it is customary and traditional, though it's not

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Speaker 1: you're not obligated to, but it's customary to donate that money. Um,

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Speaker 1: which is pretty cool. I mean, wouldn't you just immediately

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Speaker 1: question your decision as the Nobel Committee if the recipient

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Speaker 1: just kept the money, like thanks for the money, this

387
00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:50,560
Speaker 1: is it's gonna go a long way to paying off

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Speaker 1: that r V I crashed. Uh, they would question that.

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Speaker 1: But as one of the rules will probably pepper in

390
00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:59,440
Speaker 1: rules you in there, there are no takes these backseas. No.

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Speaker 1: No matter what you do, you could you could get

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Speaker 1: the Nobel Priest Peace Prize. And and some people have

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Speaker 1: gone on to do some not so peaceful things and

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Speaker 1: they're sort of admonished. But UM, no takes these back seas. No,

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Speaker 1: And there's no appealing it. Like if you knew that

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Speaker 1: you were nominated and you think this was bs Nobel

397
00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:24,320
Speaker 1: Committee because totally passed me over. I was the right one,

398
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Speaker 1: they won't even hear it. Like there's no process for

399
00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:29,360
Speaker 1: you to appeal it. That's just not not do that.

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00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:33,240
Speaker 1: I don't know some people out there who would do that.

401
00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:37,600
Speaker 1: I should have won forget Mawala, Yeah right, what would

402
00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:42,320
Speaker 1: you do? Right? No way? So UM. One of the

403
00:22:42,320 --> 00:22:45,239
Speaker 1: other things there was like a positive feedback loop that

404
00:22:45,359 --> 00:22:48,600
Speaker 1: happened to between the awards and the people that UM

405
00:22:48,840 --> 00:22:54,000
Speaker 1: received the awards over time is that the the awards

406
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:58,119
Speaker 1: started to become associated with some like towering figures on

407
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Speaker 1: the international stage, um heads of state, people who um

408
00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:12,600
Speaker 1: essentially founded modern humanitarian, secular religions, like just really important people.

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Speaker 1: So on the one hand, the Nobel Peace Prize being

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Speaker 1: awarded the Nobel Peace Prize just puts a huge glow

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Speaker 1: over you for the rest of your life. Um. Olivia

412
00:23:23,119 --> 00:23:25,760
Speaker 1: helps us with this one, and she put it like, um,

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00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:29,120
Speaker 1: it's it's the being having been awarded the Nobel Priest

414
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Speaker 1: Prize is usually in the first line of a famous

415
00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:34,480
Speaker 1: person's obituary who received it, right like that. They don't

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Speaker 1: save that for the middle or the end. It's like

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00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:38,879
Speaker 1: the first thing. It's that important. But at the same time,

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Speaker 1: as you're kind of bestowing this honor onto huge figures

419
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Speaker 1: that go on ideally to become even bigger figures, they

420
00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:50,919
Speaker 1: kind of in turn reflect that glow back onto the

421
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Speaker 1: Nobel So it's this positive feedback loop where it just

422
00:23:54,320 --> 00:23:57,640
Speaker 1: keeps becoming more and more important, which is really saying

423
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Speaker 1: something because there's a lot that has been criticized over

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Speaker 1: the years in rightfully so, and to the Nobel Committee's

425
00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:06,639
Speaker 1: Peace Prize committees credit they've accepted this criticism and you know,

426
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:09,800
Speaker 1: publicly wrestled with it from time to time. Um, but

427
00:24:09,920 --> 00:24:13,679
Speaker 1: despite like some really big stumbles, like that prize is

428
00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:16,760
Speaker 1: not diminished in stature one bit and in the general

429
00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:20,879
Speaker 1: public's eyes. No. And you know, they've even said that

430
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:25,119
Speaker 1: they hope that it uh will continue to inspire people

431
00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:28,320
Speaker 1: to do well. Like you can't win the Nobel Peace Prize,

432
00:24:29,440 --> 00:24:31,240
Speaker 1: there's a lot of pressure on you after that to

433
00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:34,719
Speaker 1: keep that train rolling, you know, yes, yes, And one

434
00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:37,000
Speaker 1: of the reasons that they're doing that too, or that's

435
00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:38,640
Speaker 1: what I should say, that's one of the reasons they

436
00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:40,960
Speaker 1: have the rule that, um, it can only go to

437
00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:43,160
Speaker 1: living people, because the hope is that you can take

438
00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:45,920
Speaker 1: this prize and do even bigger stuff, which there's a

439
00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:50,760
Speaker 1: there's a critic I can't remember his name who basically said, um,

440
00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:53,719
Speaker 1: that's great and and like that's a really good thing

441
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:56,240
Speaker 1: to do. But it's also very risky business because people

442
00:24:56,280 --> 00:25:01,080
Speaker 1: don't always you know, grow into the expectations of the

443
00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:04,080
Speaker 1: Nobel Committee. You know, as far as the Nobel Prize

444
00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:08,280
Speaker 1: being bestowed on somebody earlier in their career goes. Come on,

445
00:25:10,359 --> 00:25:12,680
Speaker 1: I know who that was. That was, j Alfred poppy Pants.

446
00:25:13,560 --> 00:25:16,920
Speaker 1: Mm hmm. What a disappointment, but out of left field

447
00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:20,080
Speaker 1: to everybody had such high hopes for him. So as

448
00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:24,040
Speaker 1: far as the process goes, UM, the technical definition is

449
00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:26,280
Speaker 1: that should go to the person who has done the

450
00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:29,280
Speaker 1: most or best work for a fraternity among nations, for

451
00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:32,520
Speaker 1: the abolition or reduction of standing armies, and for the

452
00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:37,720
Speaker 1: holding and promotion of peace Congress. And it is decided

453
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:42,359
Speaker 1: upon by what's known as the Norwegian Nobel Committee, which

454
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:46,800
Speaker 1: it's in itself is five people appointed by the Storting,

455
00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:50,280
Speaker 1: which is Norway's legislative body. And this is just one

456
00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:53,720
Speaker 1: way that it differs from the other awards. The other

457
00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:57,480
Speaker 1: awards there are Swedish committees. Um, they're given out in Sweden.

458
00:25:57,560 --> 00:26:01,280
Speaker 1: This is he went all Norway the Peace Award and

459
00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:05,879
Speaker 1: all Sweden with the others. Yeah. Um. And he never

460
00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:11,240
Speaker 1: explained why. But historians, including people on the like Permanent

461
00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:15,359
Speaker 1: Nobel Staff, Nobel Peace Prize Staff UM, have kind of

462
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:19,320
Speaker 1: suggested that at the time there was UM, there was

463
00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:23,280
Speaker 1: a union between Sweden and Norway UM, and they were

464
00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:26,359
Speaker 1: starting to split, and apparently to Nobel and probably a

465
00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:28,920
Speaker 1: lot of other people, Norway seemed to be the more democratic,

466
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:33,480
Speaker 1: the more peaceful and peace oriented UM of the two nations,

467
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:36,359
Speaker 1: so he just kind of either trusted them more or

468
00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 1: maybe wanted to shine a spotlight on that, or maybe

469
00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:42,320
Speaker 1: in that way he was trying to to UM create

470
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:46,480
Speaker 1: public expectations for Norway to continue along that way. Maybe.

471
00:26:46,520 --> 00:26:49,600
Speaker 1: So that's a good point. If you are selected as

472
00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:52,560
Speaker 1: a committee member, you're there for six years unless I

473
00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:55,160
Speaker 1: guess you quit, but you have a six year term.

474
00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:57,840
Speaker 1: You can come back for another term and get reelected.

475
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:02,480
Speaker 1: And so far everyone has been a Norwegian national in

476
00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:05,879
Speaker 1: the committee, even though you don't have to be. No,

477
00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:08,359
Speaker 1: it's not a it's not a rule. UM. There's also

478
00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:11,840
Speaker 1: assistance UM, Lots and lots of research assistance. There's some

479
00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:16,200
Speaker 1: that are appointed, there's some permanent ones too, UM, and

480
00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:20,560
Speaker 1: you need assistance and advisors because there's a lot of

481
00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:24,439
Speaker 1: people that get nominated every year. I think on the

482
00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:28,920
Speaker 1: order of usually three hundreds something people get nominated and

483
00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:33,239
Speaker 1: UM as part of the process you are UM you

484
00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:35,520
Speaker 1: have to like research those people like. You can't just

485
00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:37,640
Speaker 1: be like, well, i've heard some good things about that guy.

486
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:40,480
Speaker 1: I heard that guy doesn't tip very well, So we're

487
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:42,359
Speaker 1: not gonna give it to him and just leave it

488
00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 1: at that, Like there is thorough research. The recipients are

489
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:49,240
Speaker 1: thoroughly vetted, not just to make sure that they are

490
00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:51,600
Speaker 1: worthy of the prize, but I think also because the

491
00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:55,320
Speaker 1: Nobel Committee wants to protect its reputation too. They don't

492
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:57,640
Speaker 1: want to miss anything. So there's a lot of research

493
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:01,840
Speaker 1: that goes into investigating the the nominees who make that

494
00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:04,800
Speaker 1: short list. Yeah. I actually got my hands on Malala's

495
00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:08,720
Speaker 1: case file. Oh there are pages and pages and pages,

496
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:10,919
Speaker 1: and at the very end it just said, also great tipper,

497
00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:17,320
Speaker 1: that put her over the edge. I believe it too.

498
00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:19,359
Speaker 1: I didn't get my hands on that casepole by the way,

499
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:24,080
Speaker 1: thank you. Uh who is on this committee? Used to

500
00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:28,320
Speaker 1: be there could be real deal politicians, but eventually they said,

501
00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:30,200
Speaker 1: you know what, that may be a conflict of interest

502
00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:34,959
Speaker 1: to have like active politicians and political leaders. So you

503
00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:38,240
Speaker 1: can't be an active government leader at this point. Um,

504
00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:41,920
Speaker 1: So they're mainly retired politicians now right, which is a

505
00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:44,520
Speaker 1: little better. But and it makes sense too, because you'd think,

506
00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 1: you know, they'd be like, well, hey, actually Norway really

507
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:49,760
Speaker 1: needs a lot from Brazil right now, so make sure

508
00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:52,640
Speaker 1: that the president of Brazil gets it. You don't want that,

509
00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:55,400
Speaker 1: and you would hope that retired politicians are a little

510
00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:59,000
Speaker 1: less like that. But uh yeah, but again this is

511
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:01,240
Speaker 1: the These are the committees that have the final say,

512
00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:05,000
Speaker 1: but they rely heavily on the reports written up by

513
00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:08,640
Speaker 1: the advisors. Yeah, that happens. I think the nominations are

514
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:12,120
Speaker 1: due by the end of January. Then in February March

515
00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:15,800
Speaker 1: is when all this research is going on. Uh to

516
00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:18,160
Speaker 1: where this initial research and they would let down to

517
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:21,720
Speaker 1: twenty or thirty. They can also nominate their own people

518
00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:24,800
Speaker 1: if they want as a committee, and then through March

519
00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:29,000
Speaker 1: in August, the big time research happens. And this is

520
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:32,440
Speaker 1: when they're actually deciding the winner from that whittled down

521
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:36,160
Speaker 1: list of from three plus. Yeah, and I guess they

522
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 1: announced in October and then finally on December tenth, the

523
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:44,400
Speaker 1: actual ceremony where the winners bestowed the Nobel Peace Prize

524
00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:48,160
Speaker 1: happens in in Oslo. I believe that's right on the

525
00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:53,680
Speaker 1: anniversary of his death. Also, just little housekeeping here, can't

526
00:29:53,680 --> 00:29:56,160
Speaker 1: have more than three laureates win the award in any

527
00:29:56,200 --> 00:30:00,520
Speaker 1: given year, but you can be an organization. So Doctors

528
00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:04,400
Speaker 1: Without Borders is one. The Red Cross has one three

529
00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:08,400
Speaker 1: times uh plus the very first one which went to

530
00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:12,680
Speaker 1: Henri do Not who started the Red Cross. So technically

531
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:15,320
Speaker 1: they've gotten four awards, so you can get more than

532
00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:21,120
Speaker 1: one award, yes, um, yes. And the only other thing,

533
00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:23,160
Speaker 1: the only other rule, well, there's plenty of other rules,

534
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:25,240
Speaker 1: but one of the other big rules is, like we've said,

535
00:30:25,560 --> 00:30:28,680
Speaker 1: you cannot get the award posthumously. It happened one time,

536
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:35,360
Speaker 1: uh to um dog Hammer's guard Hammer Scold Hammer School.

537
00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:39,200
Speaker 1: I mean, that's a tough word. Dog Hammer Scold. He

538
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:42,640
Speaker 1: was the guy who oversaw the the the true like

539
00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:48,000
Speaker 1: creation in um Um Expansion and I guess the guy

540
00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:50,479
Speaker 1: who really set the tone for the Unit United Nations

541
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:55,160
Speaker 1: as a sensibly a peace seeking body. And he played

542
00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:59,720
Speaker 1: black Metal two, which was weird. Yeah, he always were

543
00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:03,440
Speaker 1: the heavy, heavy mess Gara triangles under his eyes, this

544
00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:07,480
Speaker 1: cool look, but really surprising when you look at that name.

545
00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:14,600
Speaker 1: That's that's black Metal all the way Marston or Yeah,

546
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:17,800
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm sure we're pronouncing that wrong too.

547
00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:20,960
Speaker 1: There's a lot of I think Nail that's not a

548
00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:23,960
Speaker 1: very good hotel chicken name. It draws too much attention

549
00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:28,160
Speaker 1: to because they say, how do you spell that? You right? Mark?

550
00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 1: Can you pronounce that again, No, I can't say it

551
00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:34,040
Speaker 1: anyway you want, goodness, So I guess we'll talk a

552
00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:37,040
Speaker 1: little bit about nominations, because we keep saying things like,

553
00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:39,520
Speaker 1: hundreds of people are nominated and it really isn't even

554
00:31:39,520 --> 00:31:42,600
Speaker 1: an honor. Um. We're not saying it's not an honor,

555
00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:44,440
Speaker 1: but we're saying that a lot of there's been a

556
00:31:44,480 --> 00:31:46,959
Speaker 1: lot of dicey nominations over the years, so much so

557
00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:51,480
Speaker 1: that the Nobel Committee actually says, hey, just because you

558
00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:56,200
Speaker 1: get nominated doesn't mean you can imply that you're affiliated

559
00:31:56,240 --> 00:31:59,400
Speaker 1: with us in any way at all. And there's this

560
00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:02,320
Speaker 1: weird I don't know if it's weird, but there's a

561
00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:05,640
Speaker 1: fifty year rule that we alluded to earlier about finding

562
00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:07,800
Speaker 1: out if bono what had been elected in fifty years.

563
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:11,000
Speaker 1: Supposedly that is under lock and key for fifty years

564
00:32:11,520 --> 00:32:15,760
Speaker 1: by the person nominated and by the nominator. They're not

565
00:32:15,760 --> 00:32:19,560
Speaker 1: supposed to say anything either. But you sent those articles

566
00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:22,719
Speaker 1: that there was a bit of a conflict there, like

567
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:26,840
Speaker 1: one said that if word gets out, it's uh been leaked,

568
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:29,720
Speaker 1: but other people said, no, it doesn't even get leaked.

569
00:32:29,720 --> 00:32:33,120
Speaker 1: It's purely speculations. So I'm not sure how it works.

570
00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:36,560
Speaker 1: But you're not supposed to reveal it for fifty years. No,

571
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:40,960
Speaker 1: but they're probably people who are who qualify as nominators,

572
00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:44,440
Speaker 1: who could care less what the Nobel Peace Prize committee

573
00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:48,720
Speaker 1: thinks of them, and especially if they're one currying favor

574
00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:52,120
Speaker 1: with whoever that they they've nominated for the Peace Prize.

575
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:53,840
Speaker 1: You're gonna send an email saying like, hey, you know

576
00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:56,800
Speaker 1: I nominated you for a peace prize like that that

577
00:32:56,840 --> 00:32:58,640
Speaker 1: could happen. I wonder if you can get that revoked

578
00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:01,520
Speaker 1: though I don't know as a nominator, you know that

579
00:33:01,600 --> 00:33:03,480
Speaker 1: like that should be the punishment, like keep your mouth

580
00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:06,880
Speaker 1: shut or you're not getting you can't vote next year? Yeah?

581
00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:12,040
Speaker 1: What is that? Um Omerita? What's that? Isn't that the

582
00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:17,320
Speaker 1: mobs like vow of silence? Is it? I think it is?

583
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:20,120
Speaker 1: I don't remember. Was that for the loud in there

584
00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:23,600
Speaker 1: somewhere your own your own life? No? No, it's a

585
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:27,320
Speaker 1: it's a a little bit of both, Okay. Um, So

586
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:30,040
Speaker 1: we talked about nominators, Chuck. There's a lot of people

587
00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:33,400
Speaker 1: out there who are qualified to nominate somebody for the

588
00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:36,480
Speaker 1: Nobel Peace Price. So again, anybody can be nominated for

589
00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:40,040
Speaker 1: the Nobel Peace Prize, but a small fraction of humanity

590
00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:42,959
Speaker 1: can actually do the nominating. Uh if you are an

591
00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:46,760
Speaker 1: elected official, uh in at the national level of any

592
00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:49,520
Speaker 1: government in the world, you can. So if you're a

593
00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:53,120
Speaker 1: congress person or president or vice president or Secretary of

594
00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:58,120
Speaker 1: the Treasury or secretary of commerce, who cares, you can

595
00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:01,200
Speaker 1: nominate somebody for the Nobel Peace Prize right now? Is that?

596
00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:05,600
Speaker 1: What I didn't get is is that automatic? Like if

597
00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:08,280
Speaker 1: you if you hold an office like that, it's automatic? Yes,

598
00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:10,920
Speaker 1: Well what about other ones? What about if like because

599
00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:16,320
Speaker 1: another some professors can are they invited to be a nominator? No? Um,

600
00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:20,680
Speaker 1: they they apparently for the other Nobels, the Swedish Nobels

601
00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 1: for like literature and physics and all that, they actually

602
00:34:24,239 --> 00:34:27,759
Speaker 1: actively seek people out. They recruit people to do the nominations.

603
00:34:28,200 --> 00:34:31,399
Speaker 1: This is more like I think you or I could

604
00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:34,000
Speaker 1: send in a nominating letter. They just wouldn't take it

605
00:34:34,040 --> 00:34:37,360
Speaker 1: into consideration because we're not qualified with our credentials. So

606
00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:41,040
Speaker 1: I think part of accepting a nomination is verifying that

607
00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:45,480
Speaker 1: the person doing the nominating is credential qualified to to

608
00:34:45,480 --> 00:34:48,879
Speaker 1: to make that nomination. Okay, fair enough, that's my take

609
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:51,800
Speaker 1: on it. That's great. I love it. You should be

610
00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:54,160
Speaker 1: able to lose those credentials though. I think I think

611
00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:57,239
Speaker 1: you're right. I think you should be stripped of them. Uh,

612
00:34:57,280 --> 00:34:59,800
Speaker 1: they should take your saber and break it over their knee,

613
00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:03,520
Speaker 1: send you out into the to the frontier to live

614
00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:08,640
Speaker 1: as a as a scorned cowards, revenant style. Now have

615
00:35:08,680 --> 00:35:12,640
Speaker 1: you ever seen that show Branded? Now? Oh, last I

616
00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:16,160
Speaker 1: was referring to. There's a great fifties Western, like black

617
00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:19,400
Speaker 1: and white Western TV show called Branded. I think it

618
00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:22,160
Speaker 1: was Chuck Connors who there was an attack on a

619
00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:24,680
Speaker 1: FOURT and something happened, but he was mistaken as like

620
00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:27,239
Speaker 1: a deserter, and so he was kicked out of the

621
00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:30,800
Speaker 1: cavalry and he's basically spending the entire show like getting

622
00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:34,400
Speaker 1: his clearing his name and like helping people along the way.

623
00:35:34,760 --> 00:35:36,960
Speaker 1: But he had this like half saber that they left

624
00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:40,239
Speaker 1: him with the handle in the first half, and um

625
00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:42,279
Speaker 1: that he used. I think he's sharpened into like a

626
00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,520
Speaker 1: short sabers. It was pretty pretty cool show if I

627
00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:47,359
Speaker 1: remember correctly. And now that I'm saying, yeah, I haven't

628
00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:49,439
Speaker 1: seen it since I was like ten, So if it's

629
00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:51,919
Speaker 1: like super racist and I'm just haven't seen in a while.

630
00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:55,880
Speaker 1: Please forgive me in advance. Yeah, it probably is. Josh

631
00:35:56,080 --> 00:36:01,160
Speaker 1: likes racist shows, right, he admitted it, young John. Uh.

632
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:05,719
Speaker 1: The metal itself is worth talking about. Um. They were

633
00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:08,600
Speaker 1: until nineteen eighty made from twenty three care gold. Now

634
00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:11,879
Speaker 1: it is eighteen Carrett green gold, which is a gold

635
00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:15,759
Speaker 1: silver alloy plated with twenty four Carrott gold. Uh. This

636
00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:18,000
Speaker 1: is another way that differs from the Swedish medals, and

637
00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:23,040
Speaker 1: that this one is designed, um differently. It's designed by

638
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:27,800
Speaker 1: a sculptor named Gustav Vigland and on the front has

639
00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:31,560
Speaker 1: Alfred Nobel's image, which again is different from the Swedish one.

640
00:36:32,360 --> 00:36:36,080
Speaker 1: And I keep on to say Swiss and they I

641
00:36:36,120 --> 00:36:38,799
Speaker 1: think there are three men with some Latin on the

642
00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:42,480
Speaker 1: back for the peace and brotherhood of men in Latin.

643
00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:51,399
Speaker 1: That would be pro pace at fraternitate gentium propo. Did

644
00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:54,320
Speaker 1: you take Latin? No? You just some know that somebody

645
00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:56,560
Speaker 1: I picked that up somewhere along the way, and for

646
00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:58,839
Speaker 1: some reason it's always stuck with me. Prop All right,

647
00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:01,680
Speaker 1: Well now I know I'll know it forever. What pautch

648
00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:05,000
Speaker 1: a or just the whole thing, just the part? Oh sure? Yeah,

649
00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:08,200
Speaker 1: And then you get your name and grave of course,

650
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:11,440
Speaker 1: so it doesn't get mixed up with you know, and

651
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:16,239
Speaker 1: customs or whatever. Right. So um, so okay, so I

652
00:37:16,239 --> 00:37:18,160
Speaker 1: think we've reached a point. Oh you want to take

653
00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:21,279
Speaker 1: a break before we go on. Yeah, okay, we're gonna

654
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:22,880
Speaker 1: take a break everybody, and then we're gonna come back

655
00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:24,839
Speaker 1: with some more great stuff. So don't go anywhere, because

656
00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:49,520
Speaker 1: you're gonna love it. Okay. So we kind of alluded

657
00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:52,920
Speaker 1: earlier to the idea that, um, the Nobel Peace Prize

658
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:56,239
Speaker 1: Committee is like when they give a prize, it's not

659
00:37:56,320 --> 00:37:59,640
Speaker 1: just like, hey, good work, it's hey, keep doing good work.

660
00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:02,720
Speaker 1: You know, the world's watching you. So there's there's actually

661
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:06,880
Speaker 1: been since there's different people who have served on the

662
00:38:06,880 --> 00:38:09,600
Speaker 1: committee over the years, the committee as a whole is

663
00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:13,480
Speaker 1: kind of taken different routes to deciding who should get

664
00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:17,279
Speaker 1: what award. And there's a legal scholar named Roger p

665
00:38:17,480 --> 00:38:20,920
Speaker 1: Alfred out of Notre Dame UM and he says that

666
00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:24,399
Speaker 1: you can pretty much divide the era um or the

667
00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:28,800
Speaker 1: history of the Nobel Peace Prize into different eras depending

668
00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:31,480
Speaker 1: on the committee, and that basically leading up to World

669
00:38:31,480 --> 00:38:37,160
Speaker 1: War Two it was mostly like pacifist committees UM or

670
00:38:37,239 --> 00:38:42,560
Speaker 1: like peace committees, peace congress is like Nobel Is specifically

671
00:38:42,600 --> 00:38:45,120
Speaker 1: called out in his will. And then after World War

672
00:38:45,160 --> 00:38:47,319
Speaker 1: Two and then into the Cold War, it started to

673
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:50,960
Speaker 1: kind of shift a little. Yeah. You know people who

674
00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:55,759
Speaker 1: put democracy forward, a lot of humanitarian and human rights

675
00:38:55,760 --> 00:39:00,200
Speaker 1: individuals and groups UH, people like Desmond two two and

676
00:39:00,239 --> 00:39:03,840
Speaker 1: Nelson Mandela and Malala UM. Jimmy Carter got one in

677
00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:07,040
Speaker 1: the early two thousand's for his post presidency work that

678
00:39:07,080 --> 00:39:13,760
Speaker 1: he's done. People like that, UM, I think that they

679
00:39:13,840 --> 00:39:16,560
Speaker 1: can give it to and many times have given it

680
00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:21,320
Speaker 1: to UH and sometimes to some controversy. People on UM

681
00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:25,919
Speaker 1: different sides of an issue. UM, like the ninety three

682
00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:29,080
Speaker 1: Nelson Mandela got it along with F. W. De Clerk.

683
00:39:29,800 --> 00:39:32,719
Speaker 1: You might remember from our apartheid episode. He was the

684
00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:37,680
Speaker 1: South African president who negotiated UM to end apartheid UM

685
00:39:37,719 --> 00:39:41,759
Speaker 1: with Mandela and other black leaders. So sometimes sometimes they'll

686
00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:44,359
Speaker 1: do something like that, mix it up and say, you know,

687
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:47,440
Speaker 1: these two people broke here this even though they're on

688
00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:51,120
Speaker 1: different sides of the of the issue. Initially, yes, so

689
00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:55,520
Speaker 1: they've they've tried that. It was successful with Mandela and

690
00:39:55,600 --> 00:39:59,520
Speaker 1: the Clerk UM. At the same time they tried that.

691
00:39:59,600 --> 00:40:02,200
Speaker 1: They had tried it twenty years earlier for the nineteen

692
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:05,840
Speaker 1: seventy three award. They tried to UM give it to

693
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:10,520
Speaker 1: Henry Kissinger and Uh lay Duke To, who was North

694
00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:14,759
Speaker 1: Vietnamese UM politician and he helped broker the end of

695
00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:19,520
Speaker 1: the UM the Vietnam War between Vietnam and the United States,

696
00:40:19,520 --> 00:40:22,759
Speaker 1: although the Vietnam War continued on and lay Duke To

697
00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:26,920
Speaker 1: actually was the only person Uh in the history of

698
00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 1: the Nobel Peace Prize to turn it down because he

699
00:40:29,640 --> 00:40:31,319
Speaker 1: had to share it with Kissinger. And he said that

700
00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:34,800
Speaker 1: the award put the invader and the invaded as equal,

701
00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:37,640
Speaker 1: and I mean even taking the idea that it was,

702
00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:40,759
Speaker 1: you know, a joint award between Kissinger and lay Duke too.

703
00:40:41,360 --> 00:40:43,759
Speaker 1: A lot of people have said, like, you can't give

704
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:47,080
Speaker 1: a Nobel Peace Prize to Kissinger. He's a war hawk.

705
00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:50,360
Speaker 1: He was, he was a war criminal. A lot of

706
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:54,520
Speaker 1: people think like he did some really awful stuff, carpet

707
00:40:54,520 --> 00:40:58,680
Speaker 1: bombing's civilian like just to hundreds of thousands of civilian deaths.

708
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:02,160
Speaker 1: UM asked elation of the war like a secret war

709
00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:05,319
Speaker 1: in Cambodia. UM, all sorts of terrible stuff. We'll have

710
00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:08,560
Speaker 1: to do a uh um episode on Henry Kissinger one day.

711
00:41:08,600 --> 00:41:11,280
Speaker 1: But um, that's a good example of a controversial winner

712
00:41:11,280 --> 00:41:14,680
Speaker 1: and also a split Nobel Prize winner and also somebody

713
00:41:14,719 --> 00:41:18,120
Speaker 1: turning down the Nobel. Yeah. Um. A lot of times

714
00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:21,480
Speaker 1: they will admonish people in retrospect, even though there are

715
00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:24,120
Speaker 1: no takes these back seas, like we mentioned. Uh they

716
00:41:24,120 --> 00:41:26,320
Speaker 1: will say, hey, we give you a Nobel Peace Prize

717
00:41:26,360 --> 00:41:27,920
Speaker 1: and then you went on to do some not so

718
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:32,000
Speaker 1: peaceful things. Even admonished Barack Obama who won in his

719
00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:38,560
Speaker 1: first year presidency for things like drone strikes and overthrowing Kadafi. Um.

720
00:41:38,680 --> 00:41:42,560
Speaker 1: So you can get your your hands banked afterwards. Again,

721
00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:45,920
Speaker 1: they can't they can't really do anything, but they can

722
00:41:45,960 --> 00:41:49,080
Speaker 1: say you're very publicly you're not living up to this

723
00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:52,359
Speaker 1: prize that you earned, and that's the expectation. Yeah, I mean,

724
00:41:52,360 --> 00:41:54,719
Speaker 1: and that's a problem with with That's part of that

725
00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:56,960
Speaker 1: thing of like giving out awards to people who are

726
00:41:56,960 --> 00:41:59,799
Speaker 1: still alive and still in their careers, you know. Um.

727
00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:04,120
Speaker 1: And song Suki from me and mar was like this

728
00:42:04,280 --> 00:42:09,040
Speaker 1: huge democratic activist and I guess everybody just presumed that

729
00:42:09,120 --> 00:42:12,040
Speaker 1: she was also a peace activist too, And when she

730
00:42:12,320 --> 00:42:17,399
Speaker 1: finally came to power. Um, she actually oversaw a lot

731
00:42:17,480 --> 00:42:21,799
Speaker 1: of UM like basically war crimes carried out by her

732
00:42:21,800 --> 00:42:26,640
Speaker 1: troops against minorities within her country, which really surprised a

733
00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:29,080
Speaker 1: lot of people. UM. And I think it's surprised the

734
00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:34,200
Speaker 1: Nobel Committee. Um. There's an Ethiopian prime minister named Abiy Ahmed.

735
00:42:34,840 --> 00:42:38,280
Speaker 1: He won in two thousand nineteen because he helped finally

736
00:42:38,400 --> 00:42:42,520
Speaker 1: end the civil war between Ethiopia and Eritrea, which is

737
00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:44,680
Speaker 1: a big deal. I mean that that that civil war

738
00:42:44,760 --> 00:42:48,000
Speaker 1: been going on for since the nineties, I believe. But

739
00:42:48,719 --> 00:42:52,400
Speaker 1: a short time after that, he also oversaw ethnic cleansing

740
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:55,560
Speaker 1: in a region where minority has lived in his own

741
00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:59,279
Speaker 1: country as well. So, UM, it seems dicey to give

742
00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:01,600
Speaker 1: it to a head of because there's so much dirty

743
00:43:01,600 --> 00:43:04,120
Speaker 1: business involved in just being ahead of state in the

744
00:43:04,160 --> 00:43:08,279
Speaker 1: twentie and twenty one century that I just I can't

745
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:10,960
Speaker 1: imagine giving it to I can't see them giving it

746
00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:13,920
Speaker 1: to another head of state again, especially after Obama too.

747
00:43:14,160 --> 00:43:16,160
Speaker 1: They got swept up in that the you know, the

748
00:43:16,160 --> 00:43:20,359
Speaker 1: whole two thousand, two thousand eight Hope campaign, and gave

749
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:22,280
Speaker 1: it to him within a few months of him becoming

750
00:43:22,280 --> 00:43:25,960
Speaker 1: president in two thousand nine. Yeah, it was, and they

751
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:27,960
Speaker 1: even said it was premature. And even at the time

752
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:31,319
Speaker 1: people Democrats and Republicans alike thought it was a premature,

753
00:43:32,480 --> 00:43:35,440
Speaker 1: kind of a miss step. Really. Um. So I'll bet

754
00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:37,440
Speaker 1: they don't give it to another head of state again

755
00:43:37,480 --> 00:43:40,000
Speaker 1: in any time you and I are still alive. MM.

756
00:43:40,239 --> 00:43:43,480
Speaker 1: I could see that for sure. I mean they you know,

757
00:43:43,520 --> 00:43:45,359
Speaker 1: they do their own thing because they can, but they

758
00:43:45,360 --> 00:43:49,560
Speaker 1: certainly don't love these controversies. Um. The fact that Gandhi

759
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:51,359
Speaker 1: never got one is is a sort of a big

760
00:43:51,400 --> 00:43:55,480
Speaker 1: stain on the the committee. He was nominated either five

761
00:43:55,600 --> 00:43:59,439
Speaker 1: or six times over the years and never got it. Um.

762
00:43:59,520 --> 00:44:02,960
Speaker 1: Some people will say that, oh, Gandhi was to India

763
00:44:03,000 --> 00:44:06,399
Speaker 1: centric and he was a nationalist. Other people say that

764
00:44:06,520 --> 00:44:10,520
Speaker 1: there were violent protests that he certainly didn't um call for,

765
00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:16,960
Speaker 1: but uh, we're done because of the things he was doing. Um.

766
00:44:17,160 --> 00:44:19,880
Speaker 1: Other people say, well, that's just a symptom of this

767
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:24,759
Speaker 1: eurosentrism that the Nobel Committee has, which is like, up

768
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:28,560
Speaker 1: until nineteen sixty, I think it was almost exclusively Americans

769
00:44:28,560 --> 00:44:31,960
Speaker 1: and Europeans that got it, and then since then there's

770
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:35,040
Speaker 1: been quite a few you know, non Europeans and Americans,

771
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:38,520
Speaker 1: but people will still criticize and say, yeah, but even

772
00:44:38,520 --> 00:44:41,799
Speaker 1: when it goes to a non European or American, it's

773
00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:45,680
Speaker 1: someone that's probably aligned with their interests in some way. Yeah,

774
00:44:45,680 --> 00:44:48,359
Speaker 1: because we said earlier that, um, you know, you can

775
00:44:48,760 --> 00:44:52,319
Speaker 1: some people divide the eras of the Nobel Prize up

776
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:55,520
Speaker 1: in one of those eras as pro democracy, and the

777
00:44:56,160 --> 00:45:00,760
Speaker 1: Nobel Prize Committee has definitely like cast their lot um

778
00:45:00,800 --> 00:45:04,080
Speaker 1: among the democratic part of the world order, like they're

779
00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:09,200
Speaker 1: pro democracy, which doesn't account for communism and other, um,

780
00:45:09,440 --> 00:45:16,480
Speaker 1: other political ideas that would have them turn a blind

781
00:45:16,480 --> 00:45:18,960
Speaker 1: eye I guess to people who are doing good, peaceful

782
00:45:19,040 --> 00:45:22,160
Speaker 1: work but aren't necessarily pro democracy, I think is one

783
00:45:22,200 --> 00:45:25,960
Speaker 1: of the big criticisms. Yeah, that's a sliper slope, it

784
00:45:26,040 --> 00:45:30,840
Speaker 1: really is. And I mean like, yeah, no, it definitely is.

785
00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:33,160
Speaker 1: And I don't think anybody's saying like, hey, you should

786
00:45:33,160 --> 00:45:35,960
Speaker 1: turn your back on democracy. I think what they're saying

787
00:45:36,040 --> 00:45:39,200
Speaker 1: is is like, hey, just because somebody's you know, pro communist,

788
00:45:39,239 --> 00:45:43,680
Speaker 1: if they're doing more activist peace work than anybody else

789
00:45:43,719 --> 00:45:45,880
Speaker 1: on the planet, don't don't overlook them, I think, is

790
00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:49,920
Speaker 1: the point. Yeah, like get put in his day, right,

791
00:45:51,120 --> 00:45:55,839
Speaker 1: I wonder how many times he's been nominated. Oh, I'm

792
00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:59,239
Speaker 1: sure there have been some interests that have nominated him,

793
00:45:59,280 --> 00:46:04,719
Speaker 1: don't you think. Definitely? Yeah, where they got the poison right?

794
00:46:05,719 --> 00:46:07,719
Speaker 1: I probably shouldn't even say that out loud. Oh that's

795
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:12,360
Speaker 1: the other thing we can't. You can't nominate yourself. Oh yeah,

796
00:46:12,480 --> 00:46:16,120
Speaker 1: that seems obvious, but yeah that's a rule. Um yeah,

797
00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:20,360
Speaker 1: I mean imagine the Peace Prize winner who nominated himself

798
00:46:20,400 --> 00:46:23,080
Speaker 1: for herself. Yeah, you couldn't do that. There is an

799
00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:26,319
Speaker 1: alternative award that some people say we should look to,

800
00:46:26,400 --> 00:46:29,960
Speaker 1: which is the Right Livelihood Award, known as the Alternative

801
00:46:30,000 --> 00:46:35,560
Speaker 1: Nobel Um. Swedish German writer Yakob von UKs Kool created

802
00:46:35,560 --> 00:46:39,640
Speaker 1: this nineteen eighty after he went to the Nobel Committee

803
00:46:39,640 --> 00:46:42,880
Speaker 1: and the foundation said, hey, why don't we add prizes

804
00:46:42,880 --> 00:46:47,359
Speaker 1: for the environment and one that promotes perspectives from other

805
00:46:47,400 --> 00:46:52,239
Speaker 1: people that aren't necessarily European or American And they went nah,

806
00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:54,680
Speaker 1: And he said, all right, so I'll create my own

807
00:46:54,840 --> 00:46:59,960
Speaker 1: prize and they'll say great, no one cares. I don't

808
00:47:00,000 --> 00:47:02,120
Speaker 1: like they said that. They said, get out. Well, yeah

809
00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:05,080
Speaker 1: I saw that. They politely turned it down. Yeah, I'm

810
00:47:05,120 --> 00:47:07,600
Speaker 1: sure it was all above board. But the Right Livelihood

811
00:47:07,600 --> 00:47:09,719
Speaker 1: Award is what some people say we should look to,

812
00:47:10,760 --> 00:47:13,240
Speaker 1: but I've never heard of it, so they're not certainly

813
00:47:13,280 --> 00:47:16,680
Speaker 1: not marketed well. So apparently he funded it, and he

814
00:47:16,719 --> 00:47:20,200
Speaker 1: also offered to fund those two additional um Nobel prizes

815
00:47:20,560 --> 00:47:24,880
Speaker 1: by selling his stamp collection. Oh really, isn't that cute?

816
00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:27,120
Speaker 1: How much money to get for that? He had a

817
00:47:27,120 --> 00:47:30,839
Speaker 1: million dollar stamp collection apparently at the time. Hey, not bad.

818
00:47:32,280 --> 00:47:35,880
Speaker 1: So that's it. That's the final word on Nobel Peace Prizes.

819
00:47:35,920 --> 00:47:39,359
Speaker 1: What do you think? I think it was pretty good? Yep,

820
00:47:39,520 --> 00:47:41,640
Speaker 1: same here. And if you think it was pretty good,

821
00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:45,240
Speaker 1: then stick around for some pretty good listener mail. Because

822
00:47:45,520 --> 00:47:48,600
Speaker 1: Chuck said pretty good, I said pretty good, and I

823
00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:50,719
Speaker 1: said listener mail, which of course means it's time for

824
00:47:50,719 --> 00:47:56,879
Speaker 1: a listener mail. Hey guys, I have to push back

825
00:47:56,920 --> 00:47:59,360
Speaker 1: a little here on something you said in your cookie podcast.

826
00:48:00,120 --> 00:48:03,560
Speaker 1: The point was made that brownies are technically cookies, bar cookies.

827
00:48:04,360 --> 00:48:06,239
Speaker 1: Chuck wasn't on board, but Joshua was, and I just

828
00:48:06,280 --> 00:48:09,200
Speaker 1: can't let it go you guys. I turned over all

829
00:48:09,480 --> 00:48:13,920
Speaker 1: night over this one. How can a brownie be a cookie?

830
00:48:13,920 --> 00:48:17,400
Speaker 1: Cookies are made from dough brownies. Like Josh said, uh,

831
00:48:17,440 --> 00:48:20,239
Speaker 1: you can't be a batter like cake, but brownies are

832
00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:23,680
Speaker 1: definitely batter. Cookies can be made into large pan size

833
00:48:23,680 --> 00:48:27,279
Speaker 1: street brownies have to be made that way. You can't

834
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:29,359
Speaker 1: make individual brownies on a pan because of the nature

835
00:48:29,360 --> 00:48:31,360
Speaker 1: of the batter. They have to be cut into pieces

836
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:33,920
Speaker 1: like cake. Lemon bars are brought up as another example

837
00:48:33,920 --> 00:48:36,240
Speaker 1: of a bar cookie, but lemon bars have a bottom,

838
00:48:36,280 --> 00:48:38,799
Speaker 1: crust and filling more like a pie and can't be

839
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:42,719
Speaker 1: baked individually either. I have to think that the ability

840
00:48:43,080 --> 00:48:46,480
Speaker 1: to make individual items on a pan and the classification

841
00:48:46,520 --> 00:48:49,840
Speaker 1: of the pre baked components dough versus batter versus spilling

842
00:48:50,360 --> 00:48:53,879
Speaker 1: or crucial parts of what separates these desserts. Maybe there's

843
00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:55,960
Speaker 1: something I'm missing in the bar cookie designation that makes

844
00:48:55,960 --> 00:48:58,719
Speaker 1: it appropriate, but otherwise I just can't get on board

845
00:48:58,719 --> 00:49:01,600
Speaker 1: with calling brownies cookies. If anything, I think they belong

846
00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:04,320
Speaker 1: in the cake family and lemon bars in the pie family.

847
00:49:04,960 --> 00:49:06,560
Speaker 1: I love you guys in my family and I will

848
00:49:06,560 --> 00:49:11,600
Speaker 1: continue to enjoy your work. Danielle from Anaheim, California, or Man,

849
00:49:11,640 --> 00:49:15,359
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, this is daniel Okay. When we you said

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00:49:15,400 --> 00:49:21,560
Speaker 1: it in the French way. Yeah, exactly. Sorry Daniel, Um, sorry, Uh.

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00:49:21,680 --> 00:49:23,359
Speaker 1: And I think I don't know if it's gonna make

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00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:26,440
Speaker 1: you feel better or worse that I've actually come around

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00:49:26,440 --> 00:49:29,040
Speaker 1: to the idea that brownies are not cookies. Hey, look

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00:49:29,040 --> 00:49:32,960
Speaker 1: at there, everybody. It's true. The batter fact just completely

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00:49:33,040 --> 00:49:35,959
Speaker 1: undermines the idea that they're cookies. If they're made from batter,

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00:49:36,120 --> 00:49:38,840
Speaker 1: so they can't be cookies. I I agree, And I

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00:49:38,880 --> 00:49:42,480
Speaker 1: think the idea that lemon bar is actually more related

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00:49:42,520 --> 00:49:46,000
Speaker 1: to pie, as Daniel put it as, pretty persuasive too.

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00:49:46,080 --> 00:49:48,799
Speaker 1: So just forget I ever said the whole thing about

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00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:51,399
Speaker 1: brownies being cookies. Throw some meringue on a lemon bar

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00:49:52,000 --> 00:49:56,000
Speaker 1: that's a piece of pie. Yeah, it totally is, especially

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00:49:56,000 --> 00:49:59,799
Speaker 1: if you cut it in like a little triangle wedge. Uh. Well,

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00:49:59,840 --> 00:50:02,000
Speaker 1: if you have been tossing and turning all night and

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00:50:02,080 --> 00:50:04,120
Speaker 1: have to get something off your chest to us, we

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Speaker 1: want to hear it. You can send it in an

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00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:13,240
Speaker 1: email to stuff podcast at i heart radio dot com.

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Speaker 1: Radio Stuff you Should Know is a production of I

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00:50:21,400 --> 00:50:25,279
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