1 00:00:04,078 --> 00:00:09,318 Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio, 2 00:00:15,438 --> 00:00:18,678 Speaker 1: Hey Darreon Welcome Back. It is the Book of Joe 3 00:00:18,758 --> 00:00:23,678 Speaker 1: Podcast with me, Tom Berducci and without Joe Madden. This 4 00:00:23,838 --> 00:00:27,558 Speaker 1: time Joe's away for the holidays. Wishing him and all 5 00:00:27,598 --> 00:00:30,758 Speaker 1: of you a very happy new year, a great twenty 6 00:00:31,318 --> 00:00:34,558 Speaker 1: twenty six. What I wanted to do first of all 7 00:00:34,638 --> 00:00:39,718 Speaker 1: is wish a very happy birthday to a baseball legend 8 00:00:40,078 --> 00:00:47,118 Speaker 1: and even more importantly a good friend, mister Sandy Kofax. Yeah, unbelievably, 9 00:00:47,238 --> 00:00:51,638 Speaker 1: Sandy Kofax, forever young, is turning ninety years old. I 10 00:00:51,678 --> 00:00:55,758 Speaker 1: know that's hard to believe. He looks great, and every 11 00:00:55,758 --> 00:00:58,038 Speaker 1: time I go to Dodger Stadium in the postseason, I 12 00:00:58,038 --> 00:01:01,238 Speaker 1: look forward to seeing Sandy Kofax down there and his 13 00:01:01,398 --> 00:01:06,118 Speaker 1: seat field level by home plate. Sandy Kofas have always 14 00:01:06,158 --> 00:01:11,318 Speaker 1: been fascinated by him. Just the integrity, humility, and the 15 00:01:11,358 --> 00:01:14,798 Speaker 1: conviction of Sandy Kofax. Besides obviously one of the great 16 00:01:14,878 --> 00:01:18,438 Speaker 1: left handed pitchers of all time, Sandy Kofax was known 17 00:01:18,558 --> 00:01:22,118 Speaker 1: as the left arm of God. And at this time 18 00:01:22,158 --> 00:01:24,678 Speaker 1: of year, we talk a lot about the Hall of Fame, 19 00:01:25,518 --> 00:01:28,238 Speaker 1: and my hall of fame ballot is in the mail 20 00:01:28,278 --> 00:01:30,878 Speaker 1: on its way to Cooperstown. Those ballots will be announced. 21 00:01:30,918 --> 00:01:35,198 Speaker 1: The results of that will be announced in January. Sandy Kofax, 22 00:01:35,198 --> 00:01:37,238 Speaker 1: to me, is one of these inner circle Hall of 23 00:01:37,278 --> 00:01:40,238 Speaker 1: famers where you don't have to look at the numbers. 24 00:01:41,038 --> 00:01:45,318 Speaker 1: He defined baseball in that era, and when you look 25 00:01:45,358 --> 00:01:49,518 Speaker 1: at the stretch that he did have, it defines greatness 26 00:01:49,878 --> 00:01:52,478 Speaker 1: in probably a more of a brief period of time 27 00:01:52,558 --> 00:01:55,478 Speaker 1: because of his arm injury than anybody wanted to see. 28 00:01:56,278 --> 00:01:58,958 Speaker 1: I mean, check this out. From nineteen sixty one, nineteen 29 00:01:58,998 --> 00:02:01,438 Speaker 1: sixty three to nineteen sixty six, you're talking about a 30 00:02:01,438 --> 00:02:07,358 Speaker 1: four year period, Sandy Kofax averaged two hundred ninety eight 31 00:02:07,598 --> 00:02:11,958 Speaker 1: innings a season with a one point eighty six er. 32 00:02:12,798 --> 00:02:16,078 Speaker 1: Let me say that again, over a four year period, 33 00:02:16,718 --> 00:02:20,558 Speaker 1: he averaged just about three hundred innings per year with 34 00:02:20,638 --> 00:02:24,558 Speaker 1: a sub to er. I mean, that is crazy. I 35 00:02:24,598 --> 00:02:26,798 Speaker 1: know it was a depressed hitting environment back then in 36 00:02:26,838 --> 00:02:30,238 Speaker 1: the sixties, but my goodness. He also, by the way, 37 00:02:30,278 --> 00:02:34,478 Speaker 1: you talk about big game pitchers career era in the 38 00:02:34,478 --> 00:02:39,958 Speaker 1: postseason zero point nine to five. That is the lowest 39 00:02:40,158 --> 00:02:42,718 Speaker 1: of the more than two hundred pitchers who have started 40 00:02:42,758 --> 00:02:47,918 Speaker 1: at least five postseason games. The greatness of the man 41 00:02:48,158 --> 00:02:50,798 Speaker 1: was even greater in the biggest moments. That is a 42 00:02:50,838 --> 00:02:54,638 Speaker 1: testament to a true champion. But yeah, think about how 43 00:02:54,758 --> 00:02:58,878 Speaker 1: his career began too. And I love this story because 44 00:02:58,958 --> 00:03:01,518 Speaker 1: remember he was signed at a Brooklyn in nineteen fifty five, 45 00:03:01,598 --> 00:03:03,918 Speaker 1: a bonus baby had to be carried on the major league. 46 00:03:04,998 --> 00:03:07,278 Speaker 1: Was really just a hard thrower who had no idea 47 00:03:07,318 --> 00:03:09,158 Speaker 1: where the ball was going. And it was pretty much 48 00:03:09,198 --> 00:03:11,838 Speaker 1: that sort of pitcher with some peaks and valleys for 49 00:03:11,878 --> 00:03:14,758 Speaker 1: the first five or six years of his career. And 50 00:03:14,798 --> 00:03:17,958 Speaker 1: then it was a spring training game in nineteen sixty one. 51 00:03:18,518 --> 00:03:21,918 Speaker 1: The Dodgers back then trained at Dodgers Town in Vero Beach, 52 00:03:22,198 --> 00:03:25,318 Speaker 1: still my favorite spring training destination of all time. By 53 00:03:25,318 --> 00:03:29,078 Speaker 1: the way, they were playing an away game in Orlando, 54 00:03:30,118 --> 00:03:33,878 Speaker 1: so the split squad game, so the staff stayed behind. 55 00:03:34,238 --> 00:03:37,598 Speaker 1: So Sandy Kofax is going to pitch in Orlando and 56 00:03:37,678 --> 00:03:39,838 Speaker 1: the staff is not there that day, so there's no 57 00:03:39,918 --> 00:03:43,638 Speaker 1: pressure from the pitching coach, the manager, you know, trying 58 00:03:43,678 --> 00:03:45,678 Speaker 1: to perform and make yourself look good in front of 59 00:03:45,678 --> 00:03:48,318 Speaker 1: the brass. He gets on a plane. It was a 60 00:03:48,358 --> 00:03:52,918 Speaker 1: short flight to Orlando and Larry Sherry is his catcher 61 00:03:53,758 --> 00:03:57,638 Speaker 1: and says, let's try something different today. Let's just throttle back. 62 00:03:57,678 --> 00:04:01,318 Speaker 1: Because Kofax was a max effort kind of guy, and 63 00:04:01,398 --> 00:04:04,958 Speaker 1: Larry Sherry just advised him's throttle back on it and 64 00:04:04,998 --> 00:04:08,838 Speaker 1: see what happens. And Sandy Kofax used the term famously. 65 00:04:09,318 --> 00:04:12,758 Speaker 1: I took the grunt out of my fastball, basically not 66 00:04:12,798 --> 00:04:14,798 Speaker 1: trying to throw the ball as hard as he could. 67 00:04:15,718 --> 00:04:19,358 Speaker 1: He was supposed to go five innings, but the pitcher 68 00:04:19,518 --> 00:04:22,238 Speaker 1: behind him in the sequence mapped out for that game 69 00:04:22,478 --> 00:04:25,598 Speaker 1: missed the flight. So now Sandy has to go seven innings, 70 00:04:25,598 --> 00:04:28,998 Speaker 1: so there's even more of incentive for him to throttle 71 00:04:29,038 --> 00:04:33,518 Speaker 1: back on this fastball. Well, he throws seven no hit innings. 72 00:04:33,678 --> 00:04:35,518 Speaker 1: I mean, first of all, the idea of somebody throwing 73 00:04:35,558 --> 00:04:37,478 Speaker 1: seven innings in spring training, you can tell it was 74 00:04:37,518 --> 00:04:42,118 Speaker 1: a different era. But as Sandy Kofax said, I came 75 00:04:42,238 --> 00:04:46,318 Speaker 1: back a different pitcher than I left, and that began 76 00:04:47,158 --> 00:04:50,678 Speaker 1: his years of dominance of Major League baseball. I mean, 77 00:04:50,678 --> 00:04:52,638 Speaker 1: he had three years in a row where he won, 78 00:04:52,958 --> 00:04:54,398 Speaker 1: or three out of four years where he won the 79 00:04:54,398 --> 00:04:57,358 Speaker 1: Major League Baseball Triple Crown, not the League Triple Crown. 80 00:04:57,398 --> 00:05:01,358 Speaker 1: The Major League Triple Crown. It's just fascinating to me 81 00:05:01,638 --> 00:05:04,638 Speaker 1: that it can happen that quickly. Of course, this is 82 00:05:04,678 --> 00:05:07,878 Speaker 1: before technology, before somebody found another pitch through the use 83 00:05:07,918 --> 00:05:11,518 Speaker 1: of high speed cameras or changing their grip on getting 84 00:05:11,598 --> 00:05:13,998 Speaker 1: a different kind of spin access on their breaking ball. 85 00:05:14,798 --> 00:05:17,198 Speaker 1: This was all just old school. Hey, let's try something 86 00:05:17,238 --> 00:05:22,918 Speaker 1: different today. So happy birthday, Sandy Kofax, ninety years old. 87 00:05:23,638 --> 00:05:26,158 Speaker 1: And they also wanted to point out something that I'm 88 00:05:26,198 --> 00:05:29,478 Speaker 1: not sure if you caught this. Sports Illustrated announced their 89 00:05:29,558 --> 00:05:32,078 Speaker 1: end of the Year awards and the Major League Baseball 90 00:05:32,198 --> 00:05:36,518 Speaker 1: Breakout Player of the Year is cal Raley with the 91 00:05:36,598 --> 00:05:40,478 Speaker 1: Seattle Mariners. This is another story I love because, again, 92 00:05:40,558 --> 00:05:42,958 Speaker 1: you talk about someone who you think of as being 93 00:05:42,958 --> 00:05:46,478 Speaker 1: a superstar player, like a Sandy Kofax, but it's the 94 00:05:46,638 --> 00:05:50,838 Speaker 1: journey to get there that made their story so fascinating. 95 00:05:51,198 --> 00:05:55,158 Speaker 1: Most players you see, certainly hitting sixty home runs. I 96 00:05:55,158 --> 00:05:57,358 Speaker 1: mean it's plug and play, man. You see these guys 97 00:05:57,398 --> 00:06:01,358 Speaker 1: coming a mile away. The greatness is obvious at an 98 00:06:01,358 --> 00:06:04,838 Speaker 1: early age. Not so the case with cal Raley. And 99 00:06:04,838 --> 00:06:06,438 Speaker 1: when I talked to him for a story I did 100 00:06:06,438 --> 00:06:09,758 Speaker 1: on SI for winning this award is the breakout player 101 00:06:09,798 --> 00:06:13,038 Speaker 1: of the year. He was so proud of the fact 102 00:06:13,438 --> 00:06:16,678 Speaker 1: that it did not come easy for him because he 103 00:06:16,838 --> 00:06:18,758 Speaker 1: knows all the hard work that he put in. I mean, 104 00:06:18,798 --> 00:06:20,918 Speaker 1: this is a guy who in the minor leagues, he 105 00:06:20,958 --> 00:06:23,718 Speaker 1: bought himself a small machine to fire tennis balls at 106 00:06:23,798 --> 00:06:25,678 Speaker 1: him to learn how to block the ball better behind 107 00:06:25,678 --> 00:06:29,118 Speaker 1: the plate as a catcher. You know, all the years 108 00:06:29,198 --> 00:06:31,518 Speaker 1: and pitches he had from his dad. It was a 109 00:06:31,558 --> 00:06:35,598 Speaker 1: college coach in North Carolina in the batting cage, just 110 00:06:35,758 --> 00:06:39,518 Speaker 1: time after time, trying to really hone his stroke from 111 00:06:39,518 --> 00:06:42,158 Speaker 1: both sides of the plate, which, by the way, he's 112 00:06:42,198 --> 00:06:44,278 Speaker 1: a natural switch hitter. I know you've never heard of 113 00:06:44,318 --> 00:06:46,878 Speaker 1: such a thing, but I asked cal if he was 114 00:06:47,038 --> 00:06:50,198 Speaker 1: natural ready or left. He actually said neither, And it 115 00:06:50,318 --> 00:06:53,678 Speaker 1: is true. As soon as he could stand, his dad 116 00:06:53,718 --> 00:06:56,358 Speaker 1: put one of those big red plastic bats in his 117 00:06:56,398 --> 00:06:59,158 Speaker 1: hand and had him hit from both sides of the plate, 118 00:06:59,438 --> 00:07:02,798 Speaker 1: just literally flipping balls from just almost a foot away 119 00:07:02,798 --> 00:07:05,958 Speaker 1: from him and switching his hands around and changing the 120 00:07:05,998 --> 00:07:09,798 Speaker 1: grip to bat as a switch hitter. As soon as 121 00:07:09,838 --> 00:07:12,198 Speaker 1: he could stand. It's the only thing he's ever known. 122 00:07:12,358 --> 00:07:14,598 Speaker 1: And what his dad, Todd told me was that he 123 00:07:14,678 --> 00:07:16,998 Speaker 1: never wanted his kids to think they had a quote 124 00:07:17,078 --> 00:07:20,198 Speaker 1: unquote weaker side of the plate. And it's true. You 125 00:07:20,198 --> 00:07:23,398 Speaker 1: look at the breakout year that cal Raley had and 126 00:07:23,518 --> 00:07:25,718 Speaker 1: he just smashed the ball from the right hand side. 127 00:07:25,758 --> 00:07:30,398 Speaker 1: He's there's really no platoon split with cal Raley. Definitely 128 00:07:30,438 --> 00:07:34,238 Speaker 1: a platoon neutral in terms of power. And getting back 129 00:07:34,278 --> 00:07:37,358 Speaker 1: to his story, I didn't realize all the things he 130 00:07:37,638 --> 00:07:39,718 Speaker 1: had gone through to get to the major leagues. First 131 00:07:39,718 --> 00:07:43,078 Speaker 1: of all, as a middle school kid, he was cut 132 00:07:43,078 --> 00:07:45,558 Speaker 1: for the baseball team. I mean, how many guys had 133 00:07:45,598 --> 00:07:48,078 Speaker 1: sixty home runs were cut from the middle school team 134 00:07:48,278 --> 00:07:50,518 Speaker 1: growing up. By the way, he was also cut from 135 00:07:50,558 --> 00:07:52,678 Speaker 1: the basketball team that year. Yeah, I mean, you talk 136 00:07:52,718 --> 00:07:54,718 Speaker 1: about a blow to somebody. And this is a kid 137 00:07:54,758 --> 00:07:56,958 Speaker 1: who loved baseball. He's in a cage all his time, 138 00:07:57,078 --> 00:07:59,438 Speaker 1: all the time with his dad. Yeah, he was young 139 00:07:59,518 --> 00:08:02,878 Speaker 1: trying out for the team. But my goodness, what a 140 00:08:02,918 --> 00:08:04,838 Speaker 1: blow for a young kid who just dreams of being 141 00:08:04,878 --> 00:08:07,518 Speaker 1: a baseball player. So he gets to high school, he 142 00:08:07,558 --> 00:08:10,478 Speaker 1: starts playing. He's the catcher on the team, and check 143 00:08:10,518 --> 00:08:14,478 Speaker 1: this out, he's such a poor hitter that the coach 144 00:08:14,998 --> 00:08:18,638 Speaker 1: used the DH for him, not for the pitcher. You know, 145 00:08:18,878 --> 00:08:20,758 Speaker 1: in high school you can use a DH for any 146 00:08:20,758 --> 00:08:23,718 Speaker 1: position on the field. They DHD for cal Rawley in 147 00:08:23,798 --> 00:08:28,518 Speaker 1: high school. Crazy right, Then, as he sort of gets 148 00:08:28,558 --> 00:08:32,158 Speaker 1: bigger and matures, becomes a decent player, he wants to 149 00:08:32,158 --> 00:08:35,238 Speaker 1: play D one college baseball. Why not? And a bunch 150 00:08:35,238 --> 00:08:37,678 Speaker 1: of college coaches are telling him, you'll never be a 151 00:08:37,758 --> 00:08:40,158 Speaker 1: D one player. You're nothing but a D three player. 152 00:08:40,678 --> 00:08:42,998 Speaker 1: I mean, you talk about something that he has worn 153 00:08:43,078 --> 00:08:45,878 Speaker 1: as a chip on his shoulders since he goes to 154 00:08:45,958 --> 00:08:50,438 Speaker 1: Florida State. And you know, he had a thumb injury, 155 00:08:50,518 --> 00:08:53,478 Speaker 1: so he didn't play his summer before his junior year, 156 00:08:53,518 --> 00:08:55,998 Speaker 1: which is going into his draft year, and he had 157 00:08:56,278 --> 00:08:59,118 Speaker 1: kind of a season that was affected by the thumb 158 00:08:59,158 --> 00:09:02,638 Speaker 1: and finger injury as a sophomore. So some of the 159 00:09:02,638 --> 00:09:05,838 Speaker 1: scouts who are high or on cal Ray began to 160 00:09:05,838 --> 00:09:08,318 Speaker 1: cool on him. And that was the year the Seattle 161 00:09:08,478 --> 00:09:13,358 Speaker 1: Mariners started an analytic system where they ranked players in 162 00:09:13,398 --> 00:09:18,278 Speaker 1: the draft according to an algorithm essentially, and they had 163 00:09:18,358 --> 00:09:21,638 Speaker 1: cal Raley in that draft class rated at number three 164 00:09:21,838 --> 00:09:25,998 Speaker 1: hundred and seventy nine. Now they wound up taking him 165 00:09:25,998 --> 00:09:28,398 Speaker 1: in the third round, which is still kind of crazy 166 00:09:28,438 --> 00:09:31,038 Speaker 1: when you think about a guy hitting sixty home runs, 167 00:09:31,158 --> 00:09:32,838 Speaker 1: and by the way, they had Logan Gilbert in the 168 00:09:32,878 --> 00:09:35,718 Speaker 1: first round. You talk about a real good draft. That's 169 00:09:35,758 --> 00:09:39,958 Speaker 1: franchise changing. But cal Raley has worn all those things proudly. 170 00:09:39,998 --> 00:09:41,718 Speaker 1: And by the way, when he got to the major leagues, 171 00:09:41,918 --> 00:09:45,358 Speaker 1: they didn't think he could hit right handed, and they 172 00:09:45,358 --> 00:09:48,718 Speaker 1: had him platooning with a guy named Tom Murphy. Decent player, 173 00:09:49,158 --> 00:09:51,118 Speaker 1: but you look back on it now and you're like, 174 00:09:51,358 --> 00:09:53,678 Speaker 1: cal Rawley wasn't even an everyday player when he first 175 00:09:53,678 --> 00:09:56,198 Speaker 1: got to the major leagues. So here he is in 176 00:09:56,238 --> 00:09:59,998 Speaker 1: twenty twenty five, sixty home runs, the first catcher in 177 00:10:00,038 --> 00:10:03,598 Speaker 1: baseball history with sixty home runs, the only switch hitter 178 00:10:03,598 --> 00:10:07,998 Speaker 1: in base history with sixty home runs, the second youngest 179 00:10:08,198 --> 00:10:11,198 Speaker 1: player to hit sixty home runs. Only Roger Marris back 180 00:10:11,238 --> 00:10:14,918 Speaker 1: in nineteen sixty one was younger. And you think about 181 00:10:14,918 --> 00:10:17,838 Speaker 1: his ascension to sixty. You know, in the auto industry 182 00:10:17,918 --> 00:10:21,158 Speaker 1: they like to measure acceleration by how fast you go 183 00:10:21,198 --> 00:10:25,798 Speaker 1: from zero to sixty. Well, Cal's acceleration to sixty off 184 00:10:25,838 --> 00:10:29,718 Speaker 1: the charts great. Thirty four home runs in twenty twenty four, 185 00:10:30,318 --> 00:10:33,398 Speaker 1: and then he throws out sixty the next year, There's 186 00:10:33,398 --> 00:10:35,918 Speaker 1: only one player to get the sixty home runs who 187 00:10:35,958 --> 00:10:39,078 Speaker 1: got there faster year to year, and that was Sammy 188 00:10:39,158 --> 00:10:42,878 Speaker 1: Sosa back in nineteen ninety eight, who increased his home 189 00:10:42,958 --> 00:10:47,438 Speaker 1: runs from thirty six to sixty six. And make that 190 00:10:48,078 --> 00:10:51,438 Speaker 1: what you will. So I think of Sandy Colefax and 191 00:10:51,598 --> 00:10:53,878 Speaker 1: I think of cal Raley at this time of year 192 00:10:53,998 --> 00:10:56,518 Speaker 1: and how we liked to to find greatness. When I 193 00:10:56,558 --> 00:10:58,438 Speaker 1: look at these Hall of Fame ballots in my hand 194 00:10:58,558 --> 00:11:00,998 Speaker 1: all the time, and it sometimes it's the ones that 195 00:11:01,038 --> 00:11:03,918 Speaker 1: you don't see coming. Cal Raley is the first person 196 00:11:04,798 --> 00:11:07,958 Speaker 1: who was drafted, who is not drafted in the first round, 197 00:11:07,998 --> 00:11:10,638 Speaker 1: to hit sixty home runs. I think that's an honor 198 00:11:10,838 --> 00:11:14,358 Speaker 1: that he wears very proudly. Journey is certainly not over 199 00:11:14,478 --> 00:11:16,798 Speaker 1: for him. It'd be fascinating to see what he does 200 00:11:16,838 --> 00:11:19,518 Speaker 1: in his bounce back season because that was just a 201 00:11:19,598 --> 00:11:22,158 Speaker 1: dream season for cal Raley. I'm not saying he can't 202 00:11:22,198 --> 00:11:26,038 Speaker 1: do it again, but it is difficult for something like 203 00:11:26,078 --> 00:11:28,358 Speaker 1: that to happen as well as it did for him. 204 00:11:28,398 --> 00:11:31,198 Speaker 1: Staying healthy, catching more innings than any catcher in the 205 00:11:31,358 --> 00:11:36,838 Speaker 1: American League, and throwing up sixty home runs. That is 206 00:11:36,878 --> 00:11:40,198 Speaker 1: the story of Kofax and Raleigh not too dissimilar when 207 00:11:40,238 --> 00:11:43,998 Speaker 1: it comes to their path too greatness. Let's see if 208 00:11:44,078 --> 00:11:47,998 Speaker 1: Cal is starting a streak of greatness the way Kofax 209 00:11:47,998 --> 00:11:51,398 Speaker 1: did in the middle sixties. Hey, we're going to take 210 00:11:51,438 --> 00:11:53,278 Speaker 1: a quick break here on the Book of Joe in 211 00:11:53,278 --> 00:11:56,678 Speaker 1: this abbreviated edition. But I wanted to talk about something 212 00:11:56,718 --> 00:12:00,158 Speaker 1: that you've noticed, I'm sure watching any Major League Baseball games, 213 00:12:00,238 --> 00:12:03,758 Speaker 1: especially in the postseason. What is going on with velocity 214 00:12:04,038 --> 00:12:07,318 Speaker 1: in the major leagues? It keeps going up, we know that, 215 00:12:07,758 --> 00:12:10,358 Speaker 1: but can it keep going up? Have we reached the 216 00:12:10,478 --> 00:12:14,278 Speaker 1: point of human ceiling when it comes to how hard 217 00:12:14,318 --> 00:12:17,278 Speaker 1: pitchers can throw? I got some numbers for you that 218 00:12:17,398 --> 00:12:19,958 Speaker 1: might surprise you based on the twenty twenty five season 219 00:12:20,038 --> 00:12:23,158 Speaker 1: looking back on velocity, and we'll do that Ray after 220 00:12:23,198 --> 00:12:38,038 Speaker 1: this on the Book of Joe. Welcome back to the 221 00:12:38,078 --> 00:12:42,198 Speaker 1: Book of Joe. The Joe Less edition of the Book 222 00:12:42,198 --> 00:12:44,878 Speaker 1: of Joe. Joe is a way for the holidays and 223 00:12:45,398 --> 00:12:48,238 Speaker 1: happy New Year, Joe Madden and all of you. I 224 00:12:48,358 --> 00:12:52,038 Speaker 1: mentioned velocity, and if you watch the postseason, you saw 225 00:12:52,278 --> 00:12:54,198 Speaker 1: just the arms coming out of the bullpen for both 226 00:12:54,198 --> 00:12:57,638 Speaker 1: teams and even the starting rotations with Toronto and the 227 00:12:57,758 --> 00:13:01,238 Speaker 1: La Dodgers in the postseason. Man, you too need to 228 00:13:01,278 --> 00:13:03,478 Speaker 1: throw hard. And I realized we talk about this a 229 00:13:03,478 --> 00:13:06,118 Speaker 1: lot here the Book of Joe, that velocity is going 230 00:13:06,638 --> 00:13:09,278 Speaker 1: down in terms of how much it's used, but it's 231 00:13:09,318 --> 00:13:12,358 Speaker 1: going up in terms of raw numbers. Pitchers are throwing 232 00:13:12,638 --> 00:13:16,438 Speaker 1: harder than ever, and yet they're throwing fewer fastballs than ever. 233 00:13:16,918 --> 00:13:19,758 Speaker 1: So I decided to put some numbers on this, looking 234 00:13:19,838 --> 00:13:23,318 Speaker 1: at the twenty twenty five season, looking only at the 235 00:13:23,398 --> 00:13:27,558 Speaker 1: four seam fastball, no sinkers, two seamers. This is the 236 00:13:27,718 --> 00:13:32,798 Speaker 1: traditional backbone of baseball, the bedrock of pitching, the four 237 00:13:32,878 --> 00:13:37,918 Speaker 1: seam fastball, that old country hardball pitch that you know 238 00:13:37,918 --> 00:13:40,598 Speaker 1: when you were growing up and everybody taught you you 239 00:13:40,678 --> 00:13:43,558 Speaker 1: need to establish your fastball and work off of that. 240 00:13:43,758 --> 00:13:47,318 Speaker 1: And the four seam fastball is that pitch. In twenty 241 00:13:47,438 --> 00:13:53,518 Speaker 1: twenty five, four seam fastball average was ninety four point 242 00:13:53,758 --> 00:13:58,038 Speaker 1: five miles per hour. I mean that it's gone up 243 00:13:58,198 --> 00:14:03,598 Speaker 1: literally every year now for the past five years, and 244 00:14:03,678 --> 00:14:07,078 Speaker 1: it has not dropped for the past eighteen years. So 245 00:14:07,278 --> 00:14:12,838 Speaker 1: eighteen straight years the average forcing velocity at worst has 246 00:14:12,838 --> 00:14:15,638 Speaker 1: stayed the same and has gone up otherwise every year 247 00:14:15,758 --> 00:14:19,038 Speaker 1: for eighteen straight years. So how far has it come up? Well, 248 00:14:19,078 --> 00:14:22,118 Speaker 1: if you go back to two thousand and eight started 249 00:14:22,158 --> 00:14:24,958 Speaker 1: this eighteen year run since we've had these kind of measurements, 250 00:14:25,518 --> 00:14:28,798 Speaker 1: it was ninety one point nine back in two thousand 251 00:14:28,798 --> 00:14:30,838 Speaker 1: and eight, So we've gone from ninety one point nine 252 00:14:31,078 --> 00:14:35,838 Speaker 1: to ninety four point five for the average fastball. And 253 00:14:35,958 --> 00:14:38,918 Speaker 1: back in two thousand and eight, the batting average on 254 00:14:38,998 --> 00:14:41,598 Speaker 1: the four seen fastball was two seventy eight and the 255 00:14:41,638 --> 00:14:45,718 Speaker 1: slugging four point fifty one. Well, last year twenty twenty 256 00:14:45,718 --> 00:14:49,358 Speaker 1: five down to two forty nine and the slugging down 257 00:14:49,398 --> 00:14:53,478 Speaker 1: to four thirty three. So in throwing fewer of these 258 00:14:53,518 --> 00:14:57,198 Speaker 1: four seamers, but it increased velocity because we're down to 259 00:14:57,238 --> 00:14:59,798 Speaker 1: about thirty two percent, one out of every three pitches. 260 00:14:59,838 --> 00:15:03,878 Speaker 1: Now you're seeing the foreseen fastball at a higher velot 261 00:15:04,478 --> 00:15:09,238 Speaker 1: being harder to hit. Now, what I also wanted to 262 00:15:09,278 --> 00:15:12,078 Speaker 1: do is tell you how much harder it becomes to 263 00:15:12,158 --> 00:15:14,718 Speaker 1: hit a fastball the harder that it's thrown. So I 264 00:15:14,758 --> 00:15:17,798 Speaker 1: looked at the twenty twenty five numbers and they broke 265 00:15:17,838 --> 00:15:21,638 Speaker 1: them down according to pockets of velocities, starting with ninety 266 00:15:21,718 --> 00:15:26,038 Speaker 1: again fourteen fastballs. From ninety to ninety three miles per hour, 267 00:15:26,558 --> 00:15:30,918 Speaker 1: the batting average was two seventy three. Now the middle nineties, 268 00:15:31,158 --> 00:15:33,558 Speaker 1: ninety four to ninety six, you had a couple of 269 00:15:33,598 --> 00:15:36,678 Speaker 1: ticks on your fastball, it goes from two seventy three 270 00:15:36,758 --> 00:15:40,558 Speaker 1: down the two forty five. Now here's the incentive for 271 00:15:40,598 --> 00:15:43,518 Speaker 1: a pitcher. If you can get your fastball to ninety 272 00:15:43,638 --> 00:15:48,478 Speaker 1: seven and above, it goes down to two eighteen. I mean, 273 00:15:48,598 --> 00:15:52,678 Speaker 1: that's a huge difference. So again, the average fastball is 274 00:15:52,678 --> 00:15:56,918 Speaker 1: between ninety four and ninety five. So those middle ninety velocities, 275 00:15:57,278 --> 00:16:00,478 Speaker 1: the batting average is two forty five. If you're below that, 276 00:16:00,678 --> 00:16:02,878 Speaker 1: it goes up to two seventy three. If you're above that, 277 00:16:03,118 --> 00:16:06,878 Speaker 1: it's two eighty. It's a one. It's no wonder why 278 00:16:06,958 --> 00:16:10,838 Speaker 1: we say everybody is chasing velocity, and what we're seeing 279 00:16:10,878 --> 00:16:14,518 Speaker 1: also now is an increase at the much higher end 280 00:16:14,598 --> 00:16:18,718 Speaker 1: of the velocity scale. Looking at pitches at one hundred 281 00:16:18,758 --> 00:16:21,758 Speaker 1: miles per hour. Remember back in the day when guys 282 00:16:21,798 --> 00:16:24,558 Speaker 1: threw a hundred and you were like, oh my goodness. 283 00:16:24,838 --> 00:16:27,038 Speaker 1: I remember when a rold As Chapman got to the 284 00:16:27,038 --> 00:16:30,198 Speaker 1: big leagues and he was warming up for his first 285 00:16:30,238 --> 00:16:35,478 Speaker 1: major league game in Cincinnati, and people literally ran to 286 00:16:35,558 --> 00:16:38,878 Speaker 1: the bullpen to watch him warm up. I mean it 287 00:16:38,958 --> 00:16:42,638 Speaker 1: was like Barnum Circus had come to town. People had to 288 00:16:42,678 --> 00:16:45,278 Speaker 1: see this thing that they heard about, that this guy 289 00:16:45,318 --> 00:16:47,718 Speaker 1: threw harder than everybody else, and just to watch him 290 00:16:47,758 --> 00:16:50,958 Speaker 1: warm up. People were running there to see how fast 291 00:16:51,038 --> 00:16:54,358 Speaker 1: the rold Is Chapman can throw a fastball. Well, now 292 00:16:54,918 --> 00:16:58,758 Speaker 1: literally every team has a rolled as Chapman. You know, 293 00:16:59,158 --> 00:17:02,918 Speaker 1: the novelty of throwing one hundred has worn off, the 294 00:17:02,958 --> 00:17:08,278 Speaker 1: effectiveness though not. In twenty twenty five, there was a 295 00:17:08,318 --> 00:17:11,718 Speaker 1: record number of pitches thrown at one hundred miles an 296 00:17:11,758 --> 00:17:16,558 Speaker 1: hour or more, two thousand, nine hundred and seventy three. 297 00:17:17,198 --> 00:17:20,038 Speaker 1: It was the first time in Major League Baseball history 298 00:17:20,838 --> 00:17:24,038 Speaker 1: that there were more one hundred mile an hour pitches 299 00:17:24,638 --> 00:17:29,838 Speaker 1: than there were games played. Think about that, more hundred 300 00:17:29,958 --> 00:17:33,278 Speaker 1: mile an hour pitches then games played in the major 301 00:17:33,358 --> 00:17:38,678 Speaker 1: leagues in twenty twenty five. How far have we come? Well, 302 00:17:39,598 --> 00:17:45,078 Speaker 1: going back even just say six years twenty nineteen, there 303 00:17:45,078 --> 00:17:48,558 Speaker 1: were six hundred and twenty pitches clocked at one hundred 304 00:17:48,598 --> 00:17:51,438 Speaker 1: miles an hour. So we've gone from six hundred and 305 00:17:51,478 --> 00:17:56,478 Speaker 1: twenty in twenty nineteen to almost three thousand in twenty 306 00:17:56,558 --> 00:17:59,318 Speaker 1: twenty five. The number of one hundred mile an hour 307 00:17:59,398 --> 00:18:05,358 Speaker 1: pitches has more than quadrupled in just six years. And 308 00:18:05,398 --> 00:18:07,718 Speaker 1: if you want to go farther back, in ancient times, 309 00:18:08,478 --> 00:18:12,918 Speaker 1: two thousand and eight there were one hundred and ninety 310 00:18:12,958 --> 00:18:17,158 Speaker 1: five pitches thrown at one hundred miles an hour, So 311 00:18:17,238 --> 00:18:20,638 Speaker 1: we've got for one ninety five to almost three thousand 312 00:18:21,038 --> 00:18:25,078 Speaker 1: in eighteen years. What's interesting to me, though, is that 313 00:18:25,398 --> 00:18:29,998 Speaker 1: as these pitches become more common, and again they're not 314 00:18:30,238 --> 00:18:32,758 Speaker 1: extremely common, it's still just a small percentage of the 315 00:18:32,758 --> 00:18:37,238 Speaker 1: basketball is being thrown, but hitters are seeing more of them. 316 00:18:37,598 --> 00:18:40,278 Speaker 1: The batting average against pitches one hundred miles an hour 317 00:18:40,318 --> 00:18:43,558 Speaker 1: more actually is going up a little bit. Last year 318 00:18:43,598 --> 00:18:46,678 Speaker 1: twenty twenty five, the batting average on pitches one hundred 319 00:18:46,718 --> 00:18:51,398 Speaker 1: plus was one ninety. Now, among the eighteen years we've 320 00:18:51,438 --> 00:18:56,438 Speaker 1: tracked these numbers, that is the seventh highest batting average 321 00:18:56,478 --> 00:18:58,878 Speaker 1: on pitches one hundred miles an hour or more, so 322 00:18:59,118 --> 00:19:02,438 Speaker 1: essentially middle of the pack results kind of average. So 323 00:19:02,598 --> 00:19:06,398 Speaker 1: hitters are adjusted the more they see pitches at one 324 00:19:06,438 --> 00:19:09,358 Speaker 1: hundred miles an hour more, I mean I don't know 325 00:19:09,358 --> 00:19:11,558 Speaker 1: about you, but these are the things I find fascinating 326 00:19:11,598 --> 00:19:15,718 Speaker 1: that you know, we definitely are able to teach velocity now, 327 00:19:16,438 --> 00:19:18,558 Speaker 1: you know a generation to go. I'm talking only twenty 328 00:19:18,638 --> 00:19:21,238 Speaker 1: years ago. If you saw someone with a good arm, 329 00:19:21,438 --> 00:19:23,718 Speaker 1: you would say, hey, they were blessed with a good arm. 330 00:19:24,518 --> 00:19:26,358 Speaker 1: Now you see someone with a great arm, and you 331 00:19:26,398 --> 00:19:28,278 Speaker 1: can say they were blessed with a good arm, but 332 00:19:28,358 --> 00:19:33,198 Speaker 1: they learned how to throw harder. We definitely can teach velocity. 333 00:19:33,398 --> 00:19:36,078 Speaker 1: We know that it's been proven their systems. People are 334 00:19:36,078 --> 00:19:37,958 Speaker 1: paying a lot of money onto the amateur market to 335 00:19:37,998 --> 00:19:39,998 Speaker 1: get their kids to throw ninety so that a college 336 00:19:40,078 --> 00:19:43,438 Speaker 1: coach will actually look at them. You know, we can 337 00:19:43,478 --> 00:19:46,638 Speaker 1: talk for another day about some of the risks associated 338 00:19:46,638 --> 00:19:49,118 Speaker 1: with that, because you're talking about kids with growth plates 339 00:19:49,158 --> 00:19:52,318 Speaker 1: that are still open and the bodies just physically are 340 00:19:52,358 --> 00:19:55,038 Speaker 1: not equipped to handle the torque that throwing ninety miles 341 00:19:55,038 --> 00:19:57,638 Speaker 1: an hour puts on an entire body, but especially at 342 00:19:57,638 --> 00:20:00,478 Speaker 1: the shoulder at the elbow. So there definitely is a 343 00:20:00,558 --> 00:20:03,998 Speaker 1: risk associated with it. But yes, you can train to 344 00:20:04,158 --> 00:20:06,838 Speaker 1: throw harder. Now, can you take somebody off the street 345 00:20:07,118 --> 00:20:09,518 Speaker 1: who has no athletic ability at all and have him 346 00:20:09,518 --> 00:20:12,438 Speaker 1: thrown ninety No, it doesn't work like that, but you 347 00:20:12,558 --> 00:20:15,118 Speaker 1: can have them enter a training program and under the 348 00:20:15,198 --> 00:20:19,238 Speaker 1: right sort of supervision, add velocity, and that's what is 349 00:20:19,318 --> 00:20:22,838 Speaker 1: driving the amateur market. There's no question about that. So 350 00:20:23,078 --> 00:20:26,998 Speaker 1: once again velocity in the major leagues, unforeseen fastballs. It's 351 00:20:27,038 --> 00:20:30,118 Speaker 1: gone up for a fifth straight year. I don't know 352 00:20:30,198 --> 00:20:34,638 Speaker 1: how much farther it can go, you know. I remember 353 00:20:34,758 --> 00:20:39,238 Speaker 1: talking to Glenn Fleisik, who's one of the biomechanics in 354 00:20:39,318 --> 00:20:43,638 Speaker 1: Alabama at the institute there, and that's been studying biomechanics 355 00:20:43,638 --> 00:20:46,638 Speaker 1: for years and years, and he told me years ago 356 00:20:46,958 --> 00:20:50,558 Speaker 1: they took a cadaver and they stretched the shoulder muscles 357 00:20:50,598 --> 00:20:52,838 Speaker 1: and they put some torque on it and see how 358 00:20:52,878 --> 00:20:56,038 Speaker 1: far it could go. And basically he came up with 359 00:20:56,078 --> 00:20:59,638 Speaker 1: the idea that the human arm is really at the 360 00:20:59,758 --> 00:21:01,678 Speaker 1: end of the envelope when it comes to how much 361 00:21:01,718 --> 00:21:05,118 Speaker 1: stress it can take in throwing. His does these guys throw? 362 00:21:05,598 --> 00:21:08,398 Speaker 1: So will you see a guy throwing consistently one hundred 363 00:21:08,398 --> 00:21:10,238 Speaker 1: and ten one hundred and twenty miles an hour? Is 364 00:21:10,278 --> 00:21:12,798 Speaker 1: that where we're heading? I don't think so. But I 365 00:21:12,798 --> 00:21:16,318 Speaker 1: think where we're heading is a world where every staff 366 00:21:16,558 --> 00:21:19,438 Speaker 1: has two or three guys that can throw one hundred 367 00:21:19,438 --> 00:21:22,558 Speaker 1: miles an hour. Just the universe of elite throwers will 368 00:21:22,558 --> 00:21:25,398 Speaker 1: continue to grow and that will continue to bring the 369 00:21:25,438 --> 00:21:28,318 Speaker 1: velocity up. But once again, we're talking about an era 370 00:21:28,438 --> 00:21:31,678 Speaker 1: where they're throwing fewer of those fastballs because we've learned 371 00:21:31,798 --> 00:21:35,838 Speaker 1: so much more about spin and shaping pitches that the 372 00:21:35,878 --> 00:21:38,438 Speaker 1: coin of the realm now is not so much velocity 373 00:21:38,478 --> 00:21:41,158 Speaker 1: as driving the amateur market, but in the major leagues, 374 00:21:41,238 --> 00:21:45,238 Speaker 1: it's about how well and how often you can spin 375 00:21:45,278 --> 00:22:00,638 Speaker 1: a baseball. Welcome back to the Book of Joe, the 376 00:22:01,118 --> 00:22:04,678 Speaker 1: Joe Less edition of the Book of Joe. So, you know, 377 00:22:04,798 --> 00:22:06,998 Speaker 1: moving on to one of the topic, a little bit 378 00:22:07,038 --> 00:22:10,158 Speaker 1: of news. Traditionally, by the way, one of the quieter 379 00:22:10,318 --> 00:22:13,758 Speaker 1: periods of Major League Baseball off season between Christmas and 380 00:22:13,798 --> 00:22:18,558 Speaker 1: New Year's there was some news that the Oakland Athletics 381 00:22:18,598 --> 00:22:23,398 Speaker 1: signed Tyler Soderstrom to a contract extension of seven years 382 00:22:23,958 --> 00:22:28,438 Speaker 1: and eighty six million dollars. Now they're building something there 383 00:22:28,478 --> 00:22:30,838 Speaker 1: in Oakland. Of course, they're going to Las Vegas in 384 00:22:30,838 --> 00:22:33,358 Speaker 1: a couple of years, and this is what they had 385 00:22:33,398 --> 00:22:36,758 Speaker 1: in mind. With revenues coming in from a planned ballpark, 386 00:22:36,878 --> 00:22:38,918 Speaker 1: they can now extend some people as they have for 387 00:22:38,998 --> 00:22:42,918 Speaker 1: Brent Rooker and Lawrence Butler. Maybe Nick Kurtz Jacob Wilson 388 00:22:42,998 --> 00:22:45,158 Speaker 1: might be next. But they've got the makings of a 389 00:22:45,238 --> 00:22:49,238 Speaker 1: nice team here, especially offensively, and Tyler Soderstrom is a 390 00:22:49,278 --> 00:22:52,078 Speaker 1: big part of that. I thought it was a really 391 00:22:52,118 --> 00:22:55,198 Speaker 1: good extension for him. You're talking about a guy who 392 00:22:55,438 --> 00:22:58,518 Speaker 1: I know. You talk about that ballpark in Sacramento as 393 00:22:58,558 --> 00:23:02,238 Speaker 1: being a hitter friendly park. It definitely is, but his 394 00:23:02,358 --> 00:23:05,998 Speaker 1: splits were pretty neutral when it comes to home and road. 395 00:23:06,438 --> 00:23:09,558 Speaker 1: I love the way that in August and September after 396 00:23:09,638 --> 00:23:13,158 Speaker 1: hitting it, you know, kind of typical young players. Valley 397 00:23:13,198 --> 00:23:15,678 Speaker 1: middle of the season came back August in September his 398 00:23:15,758 --> 00:23:20,118 Speaker 1: slash line three twenty seven batty average, three point eighty 399 00:23:20,238 --> 00:23:23,678 Speaker 1: seven on base and a five thirty three slug that's 400 00:23:23,718 --> 00:23:26,038 Speaker 1: in forty eight games the last two months of the season. 401 00:23:26,158 --> 00:23:31,638 Speaker 1: So that definitely plays. So I love the fact that 402 00:23:32,038 --> 00:23:34,638 Speaker 1: the A's are locking up these guys. A good core 403 00:23:34,758 --> 00:23:38,278 Speaker 1: of young offensive hitters certainly need to add to the 404 00:23:38,718 --> 00:23:41,398 Speaker 1: again the pitching arsenal that they do have. But keep 405 00:23:41,438 --> 00:23:44,438 Speaker 1: your eye on in Oakland. Don't think they're sorry. That's 406 00:23:44,478 --> 00:23:46,478 Speaker 1: my bad. That's a dollar fine. By the way, keep 407 00:23:46,478 --> 00:23:49,678 Speaker 1: your eye on the Athletics, who are gonna make some 408 00:23:49,718 --> 00:23:52,758 Speaker 1: noise in that division. Not quite sure if they're ready 409 00:23:52,798 --> 00:23:56,918 Speaker 1: to win yet, but it's a team that can come quickly. 410 00:23:57,038 --> 00:23:59,318 Speaker 1: I would not rule them out as just being a 411 00:23:59,318 --> 00:24:02,958 Speaker 1: factor in the playoff race in twenty twenty six as 412 00:24:02,958 --> 00:24:05,478 Speaker 1: we look ahead. Last piece I wanted to bring up 413 00:24:05,518 --> 00:24:08,918 Speaker 1: on quote unquote news is Alex Bregman and his situation. 414 00:24:09,798 --> 00:24:12,198 Speaker 1: To me, he's he and Kyle Tucker a the two 415 00:24:12,358 --> 00:24:14,558 Speaker 1: and Cody Bellinger the best free agent still out there. 416 00:24:14,558 --> 00:24:17,798 Speaker 1: The market developing slowly for the top of the market 417 00:24:17,838 --> 00:24:22,038 Speaker 1: for the offensive players. Bregman's an interesting case because he's 418 00:24:22,078 --> 00:24:24,118 Speaker 1: got a good market. Remember he walked out of a 419 00:24:24,158 --> 00:24:27,958 Speaker 1: deal with Boston where he had two years and about 420 00:24:27,998 --> 00:24:30,958 Speaker 1: fifty nine million dollars left on his contract, so he's 421 00:24:30,958 --> 00:24:33,198 Speaker 1: going to do better than that. Of course, in terms 422 00:24:33,278 --> 00:24:36,358 Speaker 1: of length, it wouldn't surprise me if Alex Bregman wants 423 00:24:36,398 --> 00:24:39,158 Speaker 1: a six or seven year deal. Last year, the Tigers 424 00:24:39,198 --> 00:24:40,998 Speaker 1: offered him a six year deal at one hundred and 425 00:24:41,038 --> 00:24:44,318 Speaker 1: seventy one zero point five million dollars. He took the 426 00:24:44,358 --> 00:24:47,158 Speaker 1: shorter term with Boston, the higher AAV and the chance 427 00:24:47,198 --> 00:24:49,238 Speaker 1: to go back out there in the market as he's 428 00:24:49,238 --> 00:24:52,238 Speaker 1: doing right now. I still think Alex Bregman is going 429 00:24:52,238 --> 00:24:54,518 Speaker 1: to have a good market out there. Listen, he did 430 00:24:54,558 --> 00:24:57,758 Speaker 1: have a quad strain last season. He missed seven weeks 431 00:24:57,798 --> 00:24:59,598 Speaker 1: with that injury. He did slump at the end of 432 00:24:59,598 --> 00:25:02,318 Speaker 1: the season. He is entering his age thirty two season, 433 00:25:02,878 --> 00:25:04,958 Speaker 1: so I can see and he's not a big guy 434 00:25:04,998 --> 00:25:09,358 Speaker 1: where there's some trepidation on some teams in terms of 435 00:25:09,478 --> 00:25:12,758 Speaker 1: where this contract is going in terms of length. But 436 00:25:13,038 --> 00:25:15,638 Speaker 1: you know, I see a market when you've got four 437 00:25:15,718 --> 00:25:19,078 Speaker 1: teams involved, four really good teams, the playoff contenders, the 438 00:25:19,078 --> 00:25:21,318 Speaker 1: Blue Jays, the Cubs, the d Backs, and the Tigers. 439 00:25:22,518 --> 00:25:24,278 Speaker 1: To win the bidding, you're probably gonna have to go 440 00:25:24,358 --> 00:25:27,198 Speaker 1: to a level that maybe you're not initially comfortable with. 441 00:25:27,398 --> 00:25:29,638 Speaker 1: I think that's gonna take time, though. I think if 442 00:25:29,638 --> 00:25:32,038 Speaker 1: you're looking at Alex Bregman's signing, it's probably a little 443 00:25:32,038 --> 00:25:36,758 Speaker 1: bit later more so than it is sooner. But you know, Bregman, 444 00:25:37,518 --> 00:25:40,958 Speaker 1: Tucker Bellinger, those are the keys. As I look as 445 00:25:40,958 --> 00:25:46,198 Speaker 1: we turn to January and how this offseason is playing out. Now, 446 00:25:46,318 --> 00:25:48,318 Speaker 1: it's going to be a case like a Bryce Harper 447 00:25:48,358 --> 00:25:50,838 Speaker 1: where teams are already in spring training when the deal 448 00:25:50,878 --> 00:25:53,958 Speaker 1: gets done. Probably not, but I do think those guys 449 00:25:54,238 --> 00:25:57,198 Speaker 1: will get wrapped up before spring training, maybe even before 450 00:25:57,798 --> 00:26:01,478 Speaker 1: the month of January is out. And speaking of January, 451 00:26:01,558 --> 00:26:04,838 Speaker 1: I tease this at the top or it's the season 452 00:26:04,878 --> 00:26:06,878 Speaker 1: when we talk a lot about the Hall of Fame 453 00:26:07,398 --> 00:26:10,078 Speaker 1: and the voting results are coming out in the month 454 00:26:10,078 --> 00:26:13,198 Speaker 1: of January. Of course, Carlos Beltron is the one who 455 00:26:13,198 --> 00:26:16,318 Speaker 1: had the most support coming back. Carlos Beltron Andrew Jones 456 00:26:16,358 --> 00:26:18,398 Speaker 1: on the ballot this year looking to see if they 457 00:26:18,438 --> 00:26:20,278 Speaker 1: can get in. It's going to be really close for 458 00:26:20,358 --> 00:26:22,798 Speaker 1: both of them. I can tell you that in the 459 00:26:22,798 --> 00:26:25,358 Speaker 1: past I have voted for Carlos Beltront. Not in his 460 00:26:25,398 --> 00:26:29,798 Speaker 1: first year. Of course, he's associated with that twenty seventeen 461 00:26:30,358 --> 00:26:33,518 Speaker 1: sign stealing scandal in Houston, and not just associated with it, 462 00:26:33,558 --> 00:26:35,398 Speaker 1: by the way, a guy who has called the Godfather 463 00:26:35,518 --> 00:26:39,038 Speaker 1: because he was so involved with it, kind of spearyheading 464 00:26:39,038 --> 00:26:41,878 Speaker 1: it as one of the true veterans on that team 465 00:26:42,198 --> 00:26:44,438 Speaker 1: who did have a lot of sway in that clubhouse. 466 00:26:44,518 --> 00:26:48,638 Speaker 1: So certainly don't want to minimize his role in that scandal. 467 00:26:48,758 --> 00:26:52,078 Speaker 1: I'd still love to hear him take a little more 468 00:26:52,478 --> 00:26:56,478 Speaker 1: ownership of what he did. He initially pretty much denied 469 00:26:56,798 --> 00:26:59,398 Speaker 1: doing it, and you know it cost him his job 470 00:26:59,438 --> 00:27:02,518 Speaker 1: as manager the New York Mets. So I still think 471 00:27:02,518 --> 00:27:05,678 Speaker 1: he needs to be forthcoming about it. Listen, we all 472 00:27:05,718 --> 00:27:08,478 Speaker 1: move on, right. We know what happened. It's been very 473 00:27:08,558 --> 00:27:12,238 Speaker 1: well detailed and kind of like some of the steroid guys, 474 00:27:12,238 --> 00:27:16,118 Speaker 1: man just come out and take ownership of it. And 475 00:27:16,798 --> 00:27:19,758 Speaker 1: I do think at one point that he will or should, 476 00:27:21,078 --> 00:27:23,198 Speaker 1: But I do think he'll probably get over that seventy 477 00:27:23,198 --> 00:27:25,798 Speaker 1: five percent threshold and get it. It's not a deep ballot. 478 00:27:25,838 --> 00:27:28,598 Speaker 1: You're not going to see any first time ballot guys 479 00:27:28,678 --> 00:27:34,838 Speaker 1: get in this year. Probably looking at Beltron and Jones 480 00:27:34,878 --> 00:27:38,278 Speaker 1: getting in and Jones again not a slam dunk at all. 481 00:27:39,318 --> 00:27:42,198 Speaker 1: It's an interesting case with Andrew Jones had a great 482 00:27:42,438 --> 00:27:45,998 Speaker 1: run early in his twenties and then fell off a cliff, 483 00:27:46,038 --> 00:27:50,158 Speaker 1: basically didn't take care of himself. There's a domestic violence 484 00:27:50,198 --> 00:27:52,958 Speaker 1: incident that a lot of voters look at and say, well, 485 00:27:53,158 --> 00:27:55,718 Speaker 1: I don't know if I could really check that box 486 00:27:55,798 --> 00:28:00,718 Speaker 1: next to his name. And I understand he was a 487 00:28:00,918 --> 00:28:03,878 Speaker 1: fabulous defender in center field, and a big part of 488 00:28:04,078 --> 00:28:06,278 Speaker 1: his case is what he did in center field. But 489 00:28:06,318 --> 00:28:08,918 Speaker 1: a big part of his case also means you have 490 00:28:08,998 --> 00:28:12,998 Speaker 1: to believe in defensive metrics. You have to believe, according 491 00:28:12,998 --> 00:28:17,078 Speaker 1: to the metrics, that Andrew Jones was twice as good 492 00:28:17,118 --> 00:28:20,398 Speaker 1: in center field as Willie Mays. That's what the metrics 493 00:28:20,478 --> 00:28:24,718 Speaker 1: tell people. And I'm sorry, I'm not buying it. You know, 494 00:28:24,758 --> 00:28:28,198 Speaker 1: I saw Andrew Jones play. Was he great? Absolutely? You know, 495 00:28:28,318 --> 00:28:31,958 Speaker 1: so was Tory Hunter. So is Jim Edwins, So was 496 00:28:32,038 --> 00:28:35,918 Speaker 1: Devon White. You know those are elite fly checkers, fly chasers. 497 00:28:35,998 --> 00:28:38,918 Speaker 1: But are you telling me that he was twice the 498 00:28:38,918 --> 00:28:43,678 Speaker 1: center fielder as Willie Mays. Sorry, not buying it. So 499 00:28:43,798 --> 00:28:47,438 Speaker 1: anybody who was looking at war and making a case 500 00:28:47,438 --> 00:28:51,238 Speaker 1: for Andrew Jones, especially based on his defensive war sorry, 501 00:28:51,718 --> 00:28:52,878 Speaker 1: you know, if you want to use it as a 502 00:28:52,918 --> 00:28:57,038 Speaker 1: rule of thumb as an idea of how good somebody was, okay, yeah, fine, 503 00:28:57,398 --> 00:29:01,438 Speaker 1: same with gold gloves. Are you know the empirical data, No, 504 00:29:01,918 --> 00:29:04,358 Speaker 1: it shows you that he's twenty year after what his 505 00:29:04,438 --> 00:29:08,678 Speaker 1: peers thought of him. But as comparing one player to 506 00:29:08,798 --> 00:29:12,638 Speaker 1: another as empirical data, no, stop it don't use that. 507 00:29:14,718 --> 00:29:17,118 Speaker 1: So that's the Hall of Fame vote coming up in January. 508 00:29:17,118 --> 00:29:20,678 Speaker 1: I always look forward to that. It's always controversial, but 509 00:29:20,678 --> 00:29:22,838 Speaker 1: that's a good thing, you know, don't run away from it. 510 00:29:22,838 --> 00:29:25,518 Speaker 1: They're tough decisions to make, you know. I'm making them 511 00:29:25,518 --> 00:29:27,918 Speaker 1: for I don't know more than thirty years, and it's 512 00:29:27,998 --> 00:29:31,038 Speaker 1: never easy, but it is a privilege and I never 513 00:29:31,078 --> 00:29:34,478 Speaker 1: take it lightly. So a lot to look forward to 514 00:29:34,758 --> 00:29:38,838 Speaker 1: in twenty twenty six. But what I wanted to do 515 00:29:38,918 --> 00:29:43,678 Speaker 1: here is as Joe always does in these podcasts, with 516 00:29:44,198 --> 00:29:47,358 Speaker 1: some words of wisdom, and for me, you know, I 517 00:29:47,358 --> 00:29:50,678 Speaker 1: want to go back to something that cal Rawley told 518 00:29:50,718 --> 00:29:54,798 Speaker 1: me as we were having our conversation. And you know, 519 00:29:54,878 --> 00:29:56,678 Speaker 1: he was the one who really brought up a lot 520 00:29:56,718 --> 00:30:00,398 Speaker 1: of the kind of disrespects, if you will, that he 521 00:30:00,478 --> 00:30:03,318 Speaker 1: had growing up, the ability that he had to just 522 00:30:03,518 --> 00:30:06,038 Speaker 1: push it aside and push through and keep going and 523 00:30:06,038 --> 00:30:10,158 Speaker 1: make himself into a sixty home run hitter. It's a 524 00:30:10,278 --> 00:30:13,598 Speaker 1: very instructive story to me, not because he hit sixty 525 00:30:13,638 --> 00:30:19,038 Speaker 1: home runs, but because it didn't stop him. And what 526 00:30:19,118 --> 00:30:21,078 Speaker 1: he told me is and I want to end on this, 527 00:30:21,158 --> 00:30:24,238 Speaker 1: and in Joe Madden's style, here is closing with words 528 00:30:24,238 --> 00:30:28,878 Speaker 1: of wisdom. I asked him about the fact that, you know, 529 00:30:28,958 --> 00:30:32,558 Speaker 1: college coaches especially were telling him that, you know, you're 530 00:30:32,638 --> 00:30:35,438 Speaker 1: not going to be a d one catcher, which is 531 00:30:35,438 --> 00:30:38,118 Speaker 1: all he wanted to do. And here's what he told me. 532 00:30:39,358 --> 00:30:42,278 Speaker 1: I guess a lot of people, a few coaches of mine, 533 00:30:42,798 --> 00:30:44,958 Speaker 1: were telling me there were limits to what I could do. 534 00:30:45,918 --> 00:30:50,038 Speaker 1: And you don't forget those things. Those are the kind 535 00:30:50,078 --> 00:30:54,278 Speaker 1: of things that drive you. I mean, you don't tell 536 00:30:54,518 --> 00:30:58,638 Speaker 1: anybody what their limits are. You let a kid dream 537 00:30:59,118 --> 00:31:02,358 Speaker 1: and you give them as much as you can. You 538 00:31:02,438 --> 00:31:06,198 Speaker 1: want those kids to go out there worrd. Yeah. I 539 00:31:06,278 --> 00:31:09,358 Speaker 1: remember having those conversations and seeing them right on the 540 00:31:09,478 --> 00:31:12,918 Speaker 1: writing on the wall. Those are tough things to swallow, 541 00:31:14,118 --> 00:31:18,838 Speaker 1: but you learn to use those as fuel. I just 542 00:31:18,918 --> 00:31:21,278 Speaker 1: love that coming from a guy like cal Rawley in 543 00:31:21,318 --> 00:31:24,198 Speaker 1: the year that he had, he didn't forget those things. 544 00:31:24,398 --> 00:31:28,358 Speaker 1: It drove him. You know, I tell people all the 545 00:31:28,438 --> 00:31:31,678 Speaker 1: time that when it comes to young people in sports 546 00:31:31,838 --> 00:31:34,638 Speaker 1: and journalism and music, it doesn't matter what a kid 547 00:31:34,678 --> 00:31:38,398 Speaker 1: is pursuing. There are two things that we as adults 548 00:31:38,398 --> 00:31:43,038 Speaker 1: are obligated to provide them, and that those are opportunity 549 00:31:44,078 --> 00:31:49,278 Speaker 1: and encouragement, opportunity and encouragement. Give them the opportunity, make 550 00:31:49,318 --> 00:31:53,518 Speaker 1: yourself available to coach a little league team, to give instruction. 551 00:31:54,798 --> 00:31:58,518 Speaker 1: But then the encouragement is just as important because as 552 00:31:58,558 --> 00:32:00,758 Speaker 1: we all know, baseball is a game built on failures. 553 00:32:00,758 --> 00:32:03,798 Speaker 1: But you know it's so is life, and you know, 554 00:32:04,038 --> 00:32:07,678 Speaker 1: not everybody is great out of the box, and having 555 00:32:07,878 --> 00:32:13,558 Speaker 1: encouragement along with opportunity is super important. So you know, 556 00:32:13,678 --> 00:32:15,918 Speaker 1: I'm really happy that cal Raley brought this up in 557 00:32:15,958 --> 00:32:18,118 Speaker 1: the year that should be celebrated. He went back to 558 00:32:18,198 --> 00:32:21,038 Speaker 1: a time that probably wasn't so easy for him, and 559 00:32:21,078 --> 00:32:22,958 Speaker 1: it would have been easy for him to say, well, 560 00:32:23,238 --> 00:32:24,878 Speaker 1: you know, I guess I'm gonna have to maybe pick 561 00:32:24,878 --> 00:32:28,798 Speaker 1: another sport or pick another interest. But good for him 562 00:32:28,838 --> 00:32:31,478 Speaker 1: that he had the passion to get through this. And 563 00:32:31,518 --> 00:32:35,238 Speaker 1: as he said, you let a kid dream and you 564 00:32:35,358 --> 00:32:39,278 Speaker 1: give them as much as you can. Man those good 565 00:32:39,278 --> 00:32:41,318 Speaker 1: words to live by as we turned the corner on 566 00:32:41,478 --> 00:32:45,238 Speaker 1: twenty twenty six. So thank you, cal Raleigh. Thank you 567 00:32:45,278 --> 00:32:47,758 Speaker 1: to all the listeners here on the Book of Joe podcast. 568 00:32:47,798 --> 00:32:51,558 Speaker 1: Twenty twenty five has been an unbelievable year, capped off 569 00:32:51,598 --> 00:32:54,158 Speaker 1: by one of the greatest postseasons. Certainly one of the 570 00:32:54,198 --> 00:32:57,238 Speaker 1: greatest World series of all time, certainly that I have 571 00:32:57,358 --> 00:33:01,038 Speaker 1: seen in person. Look forward to twenty twenty six, a 572 00:33:01,078 --> 00:33:04,638 Speaker 1: lot coming up, World Baseball Classic, other great year of 573 00:33:04,678 --> 00:33:07,798 Speaker 1: baseball coming up, and another great year of the Book 574 00:33:07,838 --> 00:33:10,838 Speaker 1: of Joe. And we will see you next time on 575 00:33:10,878 --> 00:33:14,198 Speaker 1: the Book of Joe and hopefully with our good buddy 576 00:33:14,398 --> 00:33:17,078 Speaker 1: Joe Madden back in the saddle, see you next time. 577 00:33:24,758 --> 00:33:27,958 Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio. 578 00:33:28,198 --> 00:33:33,078 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 579 00:33:33,278 --> 00:33:35,078 Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts.