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Speaker 1: Dear let you know USA listener.

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Speaker 2: the episode description and after you do that, then click play.

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Speaker 1: Let's go to the show.

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Speaker 2: Seven years ago, Di Esperanza was a fourteen year old

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Speaker 2: boy from Honduras. He was being held at the Tornillo

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Speaker 2: Facility in Texas, which was one of the immigrant detention

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Speaker 2: camps where the first Trump administration began to hold children

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Speaker 2: and teens.

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Speaker 3: There's the Principio Tousferente.

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Speaker 2: D believed that when he entered the United States, making

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Speaker 2: the trip up from Honduras, that everything in this country

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Speaker 2: would be different.

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Speaker 1: But it wasn't so.

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Speaker 2: While this little boy was detained at Tornillo, writing helped

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Speaker 2: him make sense of all of these fears, and it

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Speaker 2: helped him to hold on to hope. He filled the

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Speaker 2: pages of a black and white composition notebook with poems, drawings,

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Speaker 2: and diary entries. One of those entries starts with still

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Speaker 2: in la Perrera, Still in the dog cage.

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Speaker 1: He continues with.

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Speaker 2: This angry man yelling questions that I don't even understand.

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Speaker 2: It felt like I was in a dream or in

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Speaker 2: a nightmare. After five long months in detention, Dee was released,

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Speaker 2: but he left his notebook behind as a kind of

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Speaker 2: gift of hope for the other boys that he was

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Speaker 2: detained with, friends who had become a kind of family

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Speaker 2: for him. At that very same time he out of

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Speaker 2: the ivan. Morales had a job as a direct care

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Speaker 2: worker at Tornillo.

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Speaker 4: When I found out that the kids were in cages

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Speaker 4: in the summer of twenty eighteen, that was my call

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Speaker 4: to action. I knew it in my heart. I needed

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Speaker 4: to find a way to get involved.

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Speaker 2: Months later, the camp was shut down. The workers were

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Speaker 2: told to throw everything inside of that camp away. There

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Speaker 2: were letters, drawings, children's dreams on paper, but all of

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Speaker 2: it was now trash. Still head out of the ivan

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Speaker 2: felt like he couldn't do that, so he found de

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Speaker 2: Esperanza's notebook and decided to save it.

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Speaker 4: It starts off with reading his poem solmost Migrant This

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Speaker 4: hearing his story, hearing his journey, and then seeing it

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Speaker 4: come to life in this composition notebook.

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Speaker 5: I was in tears years.

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Speaker 2: Later, the two were connected, the little boy held in

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Speaker 2: the cage and the man who was working there and

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Speaker 2: then head out of the I. Ivan decided to do

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Speaker 2: something pretty extraordinary. He decided to help d bring this

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Speaker 2: journal to the world from Fudro Media. It's Latino USA.

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Speaker 2: I'm Maria Josa. Today I sit down to have a

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Speaker 2: conversation with d Esperanza and hed Ivan Morales, co authors

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Speaker 2: of a new book called Detained. It's about the resilience

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Speaker 2: of a boy from Honduras that ended up in a

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Speaker 2: detention camp for children in the United States. There was

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Speaker 2: something unusual about this interview. We connected on a video call,

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Speaker 2: but Di Esperanza's camera was off, so I actually don't

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Speaker 2: know what he looks like. I don't know where he lives,

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Speaker 2: and he asked us for this protection, which is also

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Speaker 2: why we're not using.

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Speaker 1: His real name, No stro culto.

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Speaker 2: He tells me that he doesn't like hiding his identity,

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Speaker 2: and then Ivan explains it wasn't an easy decision for them.

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Speaker 4: I am an immigrant from Mexico and I am very

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Speaker 4: passionate about advocating for human rights and fighting against injustices.

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Speaker 2: You had to make the decision to keep the anonymous

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Speaker 2: and you too are at risk because you're a DOCA recipient,

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Speaker 2: and yet you have a book published through Simon and Schuster.

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Speaker 1: It feels completely dystopian. How are you understanding this.

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Speaker 4: It's been seven years since I had the honor of

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Speaker 4: meeting d Esperanza.

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Speaker 5: It's been a journey to get this story published.

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Speaker 4: And originally the cover of the book was going to

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Speaker 4: have d Esperanza's picture of when he was younger.

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Speaker 5: His name was going to be on the cover.

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Speaker 4: This is his story, and my mission was, how do

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Speaker 4: we get this story in the largest possible platform so

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Speaker 4: that more people can uncover the truth. And so for

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Speaker 4: us to hear the first account from a child, that

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Speaker 4: is important because we have thousands and thousands of unaccompanied

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Speaker 4: miners that come to the United States every single year

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Speaker 4: and no one knows their story. And then, of course

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Speaker 4: things happened in November and we had a meeting with

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Speaker 4: our agent and there was discussion of changing us to

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Speaker 4: pseudonyms for protection. But I am hopeful that this isn't

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Speaker 4: going to be the case forever. So we do want

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Speaker 4: to one day have the ability to have the opportunity

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Speaker 4: in a safe place to share his identity, and with

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Speaker 4: the way the world works, we have to come together

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Speaker 4: and work towards a better future. And I think in

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Speaker 4: that future the world will know who ds Bdansa is

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Speaker 4: by his full name, and we'll see him.

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Speaker 2: To this little boy. D Living Honduras was a way

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Speaker 2: to escape fear.

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Speaker 3: Salidai oh ke de las persona can whenas Benzamento.

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Speaker 2: Staying, he tells me, would have left him and his

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Speaker 2: cousin in the hands of the wrong people.

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Speaker 3: Asumio ket solo.

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Speaker 2: It's a fear, he says, that makes you feel alone.

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Speaker 3: King correer e pres guardarte ia quin.

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Speaker 1: You have no one to run to to protect you.

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Speaker 3: Asumi contio or conkind.

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Speaker 1: It's a fear that never goes away. You wake up

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Speaker 1: with it. You got to sleep with it.

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Speaker 3: Clerro Amiira Umilo constante.

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Speaker 1: It was a constant fear.

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Speaker 3: They cave up Asaroi, they gave up as.

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Speaker 2: He gon Que, and so every night Dee would wonder

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Speaker 2: what was going to happen, and the next day what

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Speaker 2: would he end up having to deal with. In May

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Speaker 2: of twenty eighteen, five months of traveling, you make it

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Speaker 2: across the border, you make it through the base Dah

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Speaker 2: the beast. You are put into detention alone without your cousins.

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Speaker 2: You had this fear in Honduras, now you're in detention

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Speaker 2: in the United States. What was the difference in that

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Speaker 2: kind of fear?

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Speaker 3: When to start at Tenido no Savia Airport, Que no

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Speaker 3: Saria quanto tempet Ray.

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Speaker 2: In the detention camp for children. He didn't know why

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Speaker 2: or for how long he would be held there.

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Speaker 3: Sprimos estamano or staying or as D.

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Speaker 2: Didn't know whether his cousins were there too, or if

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Speaker 2: they had already been.

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Speaker 1: Deported mates masterman.

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Speaker 2: He says it was one of the hardest and most

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Speaker 2: traumatic blows of his life. So Evan, unlike d D,

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Speaker 2: is actually forced to be in this place now closed,

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Speaker 2: and you, as an immigrant from Mexico, you decide, you

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Speaker 2: know what, I think, I'm going to go work at Tornillo.

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Speaker 2: I think I'm going to go work at the detention

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Speaker 2: camp for children. Why did you make that decision?

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Speaker 4: I was living in San Antonio, and I honestly think

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Speaker 4: that it was God who really put it in my

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Speaker 4: heart because the way that everything worked out was the

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Speaker 4: agency that was in charge with a contract with the

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Speaker 4: government was from San Antonio and so I did research

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Speaker 4: and I was like, how do I get involved? And

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Speaker 4: I became a direct care worker and I was there

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Speaker 4: deployed to El Paso to work twelve hours a day,

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Speaker 4: seven days a week, with no days off until after

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Speaker 4: twenty one days. The way that the structure would be

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Speaker 4: is they'd have three adults taking care of twenty children

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Speaker 4: in a tent. All three of us spoke Spanish, so

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Speaker 4: that was the key to connect with the children. And

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Speaker 4: so for me, we had an opportunity to create an

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Speaker 4: environment so that the children could be just children. They

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Speaker 4: could just have fun, play games, and just really show

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Speaker 4: them that we were there for them, to listen to them,

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Speaker 4: to advocate for them. And it was just giving them

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Speaker 4: more information about the process of seeking asylum, about how

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Speaker 4: long they were going to be detained, about how the

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Speaker 4: whole world was looking in and supporting them.

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Speaker 2: But despite these efforts from a few case workers, the situation,

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Speaker 2: he said, was terrible.

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Speaker 1: D I, I just want to quote from your book.

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Speaker 2: Still in la perira, which means still in the dog cage.

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Speaker 2: There's another word, right, and it's called la jelera. You

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Speaker 2: thought that you were just freezing because the guards didn't

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Speaker 2: realize how cold it was, and so you you try

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Speaker 2: to tell the guards, You're like, hey, knocking on the door, Hey,

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Speaker 2: it's they don't pay attention to you. And and it

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Speaker 2: seems at that point that you realize that it really

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Speaker 2: is on.

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Speaker 1: Purposementor perquet.

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Speaker 2: Tender Samento D says he didn't understand then and he

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Speaker 2: still doesn't understand today why the detention camp officials put

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Speaker 2: them through all of that suffering.

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Speaker 3: Or kainos pecano a bebes D.

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Speaker 2: Was fourteen, but there were younger children freezing in those selves.

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Speaker 2: There were babies, he says, I saw the malice behind.

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Speaker 3: This ibebes ailoress Madres we then gear Carmares Erik And

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Speaker 3: for some.

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Speaker 2: Of the babies there, even if they had had their

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Speaker 2: mothers with them, not even their warmth could calm the cold.

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Speaker 3: It's Hellirake de los Uezos Fertes.

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Speaker 1: D says it was so freezing that it hurt your bones.

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Speaker 2: You also write about the fact that you now formed

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Speaker 2: this family in your bunk Alpha thirteen, and that you

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Speaker 2: decide to leave your journal there as a form of

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Speaker 2: inspiration for the others who are being held. So I'm

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Speaker 2: just wondering if you can talk about both things happening

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Speaker 2: at the same time, these horrific circumstances.

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Speaker 1: But on the other hand, you're also wow.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it's amazing that you would call the people

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Speaker 2: that you've met there a new kind of family. D

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Speaker 2: says that while they were being held in that place,

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Speaker 2: the children showed each other empathy that was missing from

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Speaker 2: everyone else.

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Speaker 3: Alga mask familiat, don't de no deja mosque.

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Speaker 2: Oh, we were children building a family, a bond so

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Speaker 2: strong that we didn't let anyone go hungry or feel sadmente.

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Speaker 2: We were constantly supporting each other's says D. But one day,

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Speaker 2: in the middle of the night, he's notified that he's

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Speaker 2: being released to his parents. He wanted to say goodbye

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Speaker 2: to the family that he had built inside that detention camp,

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Speaker 2: but they didn't let.

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Speaker 3: Him montaimi ami memorias.

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Speaker 2: He remembers it like a tattoo in his memory when

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Speaker 2: he saw the children of Alpha thirteen unit for the

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Speaker 2: very last time, all of them sleeping.

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Speaker 3: And tir elfrio il calor q quespandiamosos.

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Speaker 1: Wow, that's pretty incredible.

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Speaker 2: The cold on the outside, but the warmth that you

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Speaker 2: created amongst yourselves, that is incredibly powerful.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for sharing that d coming up on Latino USA.

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Speaker 2: How the finding of a diary in the garbage forged

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Speaker 2: a powerful story of friendship and survival.

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Speaker 4: No one knows what really happens in these child detention centers.

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Speaker 4: No one really understands.

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Speaker 1: Stay with us.

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Speaker 2: Yes, we're back and I'm having a conversation with d

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Speaker 2: Esperanza and head out of though, Ivan Morales. They are

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Speaker 2: co authors of the book Detained, a Boy's Journal of

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Speaker 2: Survival and Resilience. We're gonna jump back into our conversation now.

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Speaker 2: Something in particular happens, Ivan, where after D is gone,

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Speaker 2: he's already been taken out of Tornillo, taken to Nashville

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Speaker 2: where he's with his family, you end up coming across

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Speaker 2: his journal, which is a composition notebook, like the kind

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Speaker 2: that you buy, you know, for your first day of school,

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Speaker 2: the black and white, the one that you don't rip

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Speaker 2: the pages out of. So what happens in that moment

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Speaker 2: when you're like, oh my god, this is D's journal.

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Speaker 5: The child detention center closed in twenty nineteen.

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Speaker 4: As soon as it's closed, I was there till the

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Speaker 4: very end, and everything was trashed, everything was thrown away,

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Speaker 4: So we're talking about children's artwork, drawings, whatever was left

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Speaker 4: behind in these tents was just trashed. And so there

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Speaker 4: were some things that I had just kept with me

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Speaker 4: from my personal experience because it was a very transformative

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Speaker 4: experience for me. So we fast forward to the summer

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Speaker 4: of twenty twenty with everything going on with George Floyd

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Speaker 4: and with the protests and people coming together, and it

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Speaker 4: was that summer where the Supreme Court was making decisions

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Speaker 4: on Daka too. I became very outspoken about immigration and

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Speaker 4: human rights, and I just continued that the advocacy and

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Speaker 4: that experience just kept coming back into my head of

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Speaker 4: like those six months, like no one knows what really

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Speaker 4: happens in these child detention centers.

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Speaker 5: No one really understands.

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Speaker 3: And so.

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Speaker 4: I had the opportunity to reconnect with d Esperanza when

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Speaker 4: he was an adult. He found me on social media

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Speaker 4: and I told him, I still think about that poem.

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Speaker 4: I still think about the story that you wrote inside

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Speaker 4: of your composition notebook.

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Speaker 5: It was very powerful, and at.

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Speaker 4: That moment when we reconnected, I shared with him, I said,

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Speaker 4: would you be open to the idea of seeing if

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Speaker 4: we can publish this, seeing if this story can be

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Speaker 4: shared with the world.

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Speaker 5: And from the very beginning he was on board. He

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Speaker 5: was really excited.

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Speaker 4: He really wanted to advocate for the thousands of children

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Speaker 4: that are still being detained to this day and unfortunately silenced,

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Speaker 4: and so we went on this together.

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Speaker 2: D I'm just wondering when you when you saw that notebook,

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Speaker 2: when you actually held it in your hands after, what

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Speaker 2: was that like, SYNTHI I felt very emotional de sais for.

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Speaker 3: Como An cos.

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Speaker 2: It was like opening a treasure chest that had been

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Speaker 2: hidden away for many years. For connectors, it was like

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Speaker 2: reconnecting with the child that he used to be.

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Speaker 1: Ivan.

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Speaker 2: I'm just wondering, because you you did spend all of

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Speaker 2: those months in Tornillo. You were face to face with

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Speaker 2: children in what's called layelera, basically the ice box where

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Speaker 2: they hold children in freezing conditions, in La Perera, which

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Speaker 2: is a dog cage. If you saw the lack of food,

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Speaker 2: the lack of medical attention. So when you say he

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Speaker 2: may have a special story, but it's not unique, is

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Speaker 2: this the image that you have of just the hundreds

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Speaker 2: of kids who you saw.

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Speaker 1: Circling in and out of this detention camp.

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Speaker 4: One of the hardest things being a part of that

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Speaker 4: detention center was just seeing so many children that were ignored.

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Speaker 4: And I think that it comes down to that they

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Speaker 4: are in the care and custody of the United States,

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Speaker 4: and while they're in the care and custody of the

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Speaker 4: United States, their human dignity must be upheld at all costs.

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Speaker 4: It's a system where the people that are left to

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Speaker 4: be the direct care workers are not qualified people. They're

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Speaker 4: not qualified people to take care of children, let alone

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Speaker 4: children that come from trauma that come from five months

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Speaker 4: of coming to the United States, like d. S. Beranza

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Speaker 4: and having to face cartels, days of hunger, jumping on

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Speaker 4: top of trains, only to be in this situation of imprisonment,

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Speaker 4: and they only add more trauma to these children's life.

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Speaker 4: I mean the simple fact that they couldn't even call

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Speaker 4: them by their name. They were wearing name tags with

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Speaker 4: their names. DS Betanza's name and his picture was right

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Speaker 4: on his name tag, but he became bed number twelve

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Speaker 4: because it was easier to say bed number twelve than

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Speaker 4: his actual name.

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Speaker 2: Stay with us not there, Yes, hey, dear listener, We're

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Speaker 2: back and I'm having a conversation with d Esperanza and

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Speaker 2: head out though Ivan Morales. They are co authors of

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Speaker 2: the book Detained, A Boy's Journal of Survival and Resilience.

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Speaker 2: We're gonna jump back into our conversation now. I'm wondering, Evan,

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Speaker 2: how you're processing knowing that there are hundreds upon hundreds

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Speaker 2: of little kids, babies, toddlers, teenagers who are still being

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Speaker 2: held by the US government.

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Speaker 4: I think the way that I sit with that is

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Speaker 4: I continue advocating for change. I continue advocating for a

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Speaker 4: world where we don't have children in detention centers, so

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Speaker 4: we cannot keep children at the Perera, at the Jelera, like.

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Speaker 4: We need to look back and we need to at

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Speaker 4: least figure out because when it comes to the topic

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Speaker 4: of immigration, it's such a big conversation and there are

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Speaker 4: so many views on immigration, but we can all come together.

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Speaker 4: And I think that that's my mission here with this story,

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Speaker 4: is for us to come together and say that we can,

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Speaker 4: at least as a human being, acknowledge that children need

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Speaker 4: to be protected. We have thousands of children that are

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Speaker 4: still being detained, and no one is doing anything to

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Speaker 4: change that. And that's why this story in DS Bedanz's

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Speaker 4: experience and his words are so important right now because

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Speaker 4: more people that understand and read the story, they can

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Speaker 4: come together to vote for policy and vote for change.

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Speaker 4: And so as we have children being detained right now,

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Speaker 4: we also have this story, this first account of a

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Speaker 4: child who was detained, that is published and that is

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Speaker 4: being celebrated, and so it's really just about radically coming

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Speaker 4: together in solidarity, and that's what kind of keeps me together,

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Speaker 4: and that's what keeps me going.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for that, Evan.

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Speaker 2: Finally, DM, just wondering what would you say to your

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Speaker 2: thirteen year old self as he's getting ready to leave Ondudahs.

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Speaker 3: What would you say to him? Kiledidias, Ldria, ke Forte,

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Speaker 3: quer Camino, Serramonti Ficin.

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Speaker 2: I would tell myself as a little boy, to be

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Speaker 2: strong because the journey will be very difficult.

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Speaker 3: Personals, Okay, consider that's a familiar and I.

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Speaker 2: Would say try to never be apart from the people

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Speaker 2: that you consider your family.

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Speaker 3: Seem pere soufe isu Freke.

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Speaker 2: Also to keep faith and hold your head up high

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Speaker 2: and never be afraid to speak up to that end,

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Speaker 2: dear listener, we want to leave you with a fragment

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Speaker 2: of these poems. We are immigrants which was written in

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Speaker 2: that notebook that Erardo Ivan found here is d and

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Speaker 2: Herado reading it in both English and in Spanish.

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Speaker 3: Somos fortes euonidos inustro. Plan is jegar alos estados unidos.

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Speaker 4: We are strong and united, and our plan is to

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Speaker 4: reach the United States.

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Speaker 3: Sony Americano, tolosivimos pamos and master.

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Speaker 4: Lestino American dream. We all crave it, but very few

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Speaker 4: of us reach our destination.

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Speaker 3: Moriendo nger camino and pianos inenus tolos pivimos.

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Speaker 4: Lomismo dying along the way, elderly and children. We all

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Speaker 4: live the same. We are worth the same life.

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Speaker 3: Malemos lomismo, suvida organismo comosu frimos and ger camino kee conambre,

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Speaker 3: as he said, jemos conambre.

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Speaker 4: One organ We suffer deeply on the way with hunger,

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Speaker 4: so we remain hungry.

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Speaker 1: I almost los migrantes p.

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Speaker 4: Y we get on top of trains. We are poor people,

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Speaker 4: but immigrants, all those who come here. Nothing stops us.

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Speaker 2: Thank you so much, D for your words and for

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Speaker 2: your work, and for having your voice and owning your voice.

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Speaker 2: And thank you Ivan for helping to tell T's story.

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Speaker 5: Thank you so much for the time. We are honored

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Speaker 5: to be here.

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Speaker 2: That was d Esperanza and Heardo Ivan Morales. They are

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Speaker 2: co authors of Detained, a Boy's Journal of Survival and Resilience.

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Speaker 2: Recent court filings show that now under the second Trump administration,

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Speaker 2: children are being detained in unsafe and unsanitary conditions. A

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Speaker 2: recent report from Human Rights Watch revealed that twenty twenty

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Speaker 2: five is the year with the highest number of detained

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Speaker 2: people in the history of US immigration detention. This episode

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Speaker 2: was produced by Adriana Rodriguez. It was edited by Andrea

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Speaker 2: Lopez Cruzado and Benile Ramirez. It was mixed by Julie

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Speaker 2: Cruso and Gabrielle Abiez. Fact checking for this episode by

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Speaker 2: Roxana Aguire. Fernando Echavari is our managing editor. The Latino

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Speaker 2: USA team also includes Jessica Ellis, Rebecca Ibarra, Renaldo Leanoz Junior,

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Speaker 2: Stephanie Lebau Luis, Luna Niman Marquez, Brieta Martinelli, Monica Moreles, Garcia,

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Speaker 2: JJ Grubin, and Nancy Trujillo. Penny Leramrez and I are

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Speaker 2: executive producers and I'm your host. Mariao Josa Latino Usa

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Speaker 2: is part of Iheart's make Ultura podcast network. Executive producers

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Speaker 2: that I Heart are Leo Gomez and Arlene Santana. Join

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Speaker 2: us again on our next episode. In the meantime, I'll

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Speaker 2: see you on all of our social media And don't forget,

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Speaker 2: dear listener, It's.

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Speaker 1: A simple ask.

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Speaker 1: So muches gracias, thank you. Astella proxima notes.

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Speaker 6: Chao Latino Usa is made possible in part by the

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Speaker 6: Tao Foundation.

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Speaker 1: The Annie E.

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Speaker 6: Casey Foundation creates a brighter future for the nation's children

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Speaker 6: by strengthening families, building greater economic opportunity, and transforming communities,

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Speaker 6: and the John D. And Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation