WEBVTT - Bonus: A spoiler-filled conversation with the cast and creators of 'The Handmaid's Tale' 0:00:04.600 --> 0:00:08.080 I'm really happy to be moderating this for your consideration 0:00:08.160 --> 0:00:11.680 panel with some of the extraordinary people involved in The 0:00:11.760 --> 0:00:16.880 Handmaid's Tale. I'm a ginormous fan of the show, and 0:00:17.239 --> 0:00:19.520 so this is a real thrill for me, and I 0:00:19.520 --> 0:00:22.160 thought we'd start this conversation sort of where the end 0:00:22.200 --> 0:00:26.080 of season four ends up, where uh, you know, Fred 0:00:26.079 --> 0:00:30.200 and Serena asked June for forgiveness and and Bruce, did 0:00:30.240 --> 0:00:35.040 you imagine this turn of events when you were thinking 0:00:35.080 --> 0:00:39.279 about the show, you know, and watching the evolution of 0:00:39.320 --> 0:00:44.120 the storyline and these characters. Did did you kind of 0:00:44.159 --> 0:00:47.120 predict that this would happen or how did how did 0:00:47.159 --> 0:00:51.159 that work for you? Uh? Well, I think you know, 0:00:51.200 --> 0:00:57.960 the show is based on how June feels genuinely versus 0:00:57.960 --> 0:01:02.360 how she's allowed to express herself. Um. So we know 0:01:02.560 --> 0:01:05.759 how she feels about these people. Um. And we know 0:01:05.920 --> 0:01:08.840 if ever, given freedom to express herself, how she would 0:01:08.880 --> 0:01:13.640 express herself. UM. So I think there's an inevitability about it. Um, 0:01:13.640 --> 0:01:16.400 whether it's expressed or unexpressed. What this show is about 0:01:16.520 --> 0:01:20.440 is her bringing these people to terms with what they've done. 0:01:20.760 --> 0:01:22.880 Whether she gets the chance to do it or not 0:01:23.440 --> 0:01:27.840 is the question. But that building up that argument in 0:01:27.920 --> 0:01:30.600 your head saying this is why they're wrong and I'm right, 0:01:30.800 --> 0:01:33.160 and is what the show is about. So I think 0:01:33.160 --> 0:01:36.440 that whether or not we get their characterized or story wise, 0:01:36.520 --> 0:01:39.120 it was always the clash that was, you know, the 0:01:39.440 --> 0:01:42.160 clash of worldviews that the build show has been built 0:01:42.920 --> 0:01:46.960 and Joe, where you were surprised that your character had 0:01:47.040 --> 0:01:52.440 this redemptive arc um and and how did you feel 0:01:52.520 --> 0:02:01.280 when you saw how how the commander evolved? Well, I um, 0:02:01.320 --> 0:02:06.040 I love the idea that he goes through the journey 0:02:06.280 --> 0:02:10.840 um and ends in a place of redemption seemingly um 0:02:10.919 --> 0:02:14.280 and how paradoxical that he might get to that place 0:02:14.320 --> 0:02:17.960 of clarity, even if it's momentarily, and have it snatched 0:02:17.960 --> 0:02:22.080 away somewhat in the finale. But it was it was 0:02:22.160 --> 0:02:24.120 lovely for him to come face to face and I 0:02:24.320 --> 0:02:28.960 so enjoyed that scene with Lizzie where he he apologizes, 0:02:29.160 --> 0:02:31.760 you know, and there are parts of that apology which 0:02:31.800 --> 0:02:36.280 are genuine, and that's parts of Fred old Fred, but 0:02:36.320 --> 0:02:40.000 there's still parts of the sort of predator inside all 0:02:40.000 --> 0:02:42.560 of that apology as well, and sort of reclaiming the 0:02:42.639 --> 0:02:47.320 narrative in his own predatory fashion. But it was lovely 0:02:47.400 --> 0:02:50.240 to go on that journey, and the season is really 0:02:50.240 --> 0:02:55.359 about that but relinquishing and reflecting. Um, but can can 0:02:55.440 --> 0:02:59.400 this character really change his spots? I don't know, But 0:02:59.400 --> 0:03:01.480 but he came close, which was really lovely to be 0:03:01.520 --> 0:03:05.560 invited down that road. What about for you, Yvonne, did 0:03:05.600 --> 0:03:08.800 you envision sort of what that moment would be like 0:03:08.960 --> 0:03:13.400 for serena kind of? Although I don't just because she's, 0:03:13.480 --> 0:03:16.320 you know, having this moment with June, I don't necessarily 0:03:16.360 --> 0:03:19.320 believe that she has come full circle, you know. I 0:03:19.320 --> 0:03:22.560 think she's just so like she just goes from moment 0:03:22.600 --> 0:03:25.040 to moment kind of figuring out what's going to be 0:03:25.080 --> 0:03:28.160 the most ideal situation for me right now. And her 0:03:28.200 --> 0:03:31.240 ideal situation is that she doesn't want to have the 0:03:31.280 --> 0:03:34.400 stress and the regrets or any kind of remorse of 0:03:34.440 --> 0:03:36.480 what she's been doing with June this whole time, I 0:03:36.520 --> 0:03:39.320 feel like, and so what's convenient for her is to 0:03:39.400 --> 0:03:43.600 apologize and beg for forgiveness. And although I do think 0:03:43.600 --> 0:03:45.760 there is like a huge element of truth in it, 0:03:45.840 --> 0:03:48.680 I don't know that it comes from that genuine place 0:03:48.720 --> 0:03:52.080 of I genuinely feel horrible for what I did. I 0:03:52.120 --> 0:03:55.040 think it's more I just need you to forgive me 0:03:55.120 --> 0:03:59.080 so I can have a comfortable pregnancy, you know what 0:03:59.120 --> 0:04:03.880 I mean. So it's it's self serving. Yeah, I kind 0:04:03.880 --> 0:04:05.520 of feel that way. I don't know i'd be interested 0:04:05.560 --> 0:04:08.160 to hear um with some versus rand about that, but 0:04:08.240 --> 0:04:11.880 that that's that's how I felt. Bruce, do you want 0:04:11.920 --> 0:04:15.920 to chime in? Uh? Well, I think, um, people don't 0:04:15.960 --> 0:04:18.839 change very much or very easily. And I think people 0:04:18.960 --> 0:04:22.880 change quickly and easily on television. But what I says 0:04:22.960 --> 0:04:26.560 is exactly right, you know. Uh, it's in the moment. 0:04:26.680 --> 0:04:29.120 We make lots of decisions that we say lots of things, 0:04:29.160 --> 0:04:32.400 but as humans, we don't change that quickly. And and 0:04:32.480 --> 0:04:34.599 I think the show is frustrating in the same way 0:04:34.640 --> 0:04:36.599 that people in our lives are frustrating that they don't 0:04:36.640 --> 0:04:39.080 change quickly enough um, and that more people don't get 0:04:39.080 --> 0:04:42.000 out of North Korea. But those things are complicated parts 0:04:42.040 --> 0:04:44.760 of the real world. And as much as we'd like 0:04:45.600 --> 0:04:51.640 Lawrence and and you know the characters that that seem 0:04:51.680 --> 0:04:55.279 to be on an edge, Lawrence, Lydia and On or everybody, 0:04:55.320 --> 0:04:57.360 I guess Joe, you want them to pick the good 0:04:57.400 --> 0:05:00.840 side and get toss away the bad side, But there 0:05:00.960 --> 0:05:03.160 is no such thing, and it doesn't happen, and they 0:05:03.200 --> 0:05:06.080 are who they are. And and you know, I don't 0:05:06.080 --> 0:05:10.280 know very many people who have, you know, truly had 0:05:10.440 --> 0:05:12.760 the kind of regret in their life for the things 0:05:12.800 --> 0:05:14.920 that these people have done. I don't know that there's 0:05:15.000 --> 0:05:20.279 enough regret muster so and and Lizzie, I think, I 0:05:20.279 --> 0:05:22.320 don't know. There was a scene I wish I had 0:05:22.320 --> 0:05:26.760 written down what you said about what had been taken 0:05:26.760 --> 0:05:31.280 away and the power of men and sort of systemic 0:05:31.800 --> 0:05:36.039 issues with gender and sexism. I don't know that really 0:05:36.040 --> 0:05:38.880 resonated with me. Did that? Are you in the middle 0:05:38.920 --> 0:05:42.760 of sometimes saying your lines and thinking, yes, I I 0:05:42.960 --> 0:05:47.039 feel what June feels about the state of the world. Yeah, 0:05:47.080 --> 0:05:50.160 all the time, all the time, whether or even just 0:05:50.400 --> 0:05:54.200 um you know, sometimes globally, but also sometimes just on 0:05:54.279 --> 0:05:56.960 a on a personal level. You know, she's such a 0:05:56.960 --> 0:06:00.440 personal character to me, Um, and I've put so much 0:06:00.440 --> 0:06:02.680 of myself into her. And at this point, it is 0:06:02.720 --> 0:06:04.360 a great thing that happens when you're on a show 0:06:04.400 --> 0:06:08.320 for a while, which is the relationship between you and 0:06:08.360 --> 0:06:12.000 the writers and the showrunner becomes very fluid, and you know, 0:06:12.040 --> 0:06:14.640 at first you're doing what they're writing, and then they're 0:06:14.640 --> 0:06:16.600 sort of writing to what you're doing, and it kind 0:06:16.600 --> 0:06:20.240 of goes back and forth in this in this wonderful way. 0:06:20.400 --> 0:06:24.039 Um all the time, all the time, And sometimes other 0:06:24.120 --> 0:06:28.000 characters too, will say things that I, uh, that really 0:06:28.040 --> 0:06:31.400 really resonate with me. Um, you know, Lawrence, often when 0:06:31.400 --> 0:06:34.880 you're speaking about June, it resonates with me. I learned 0:06:34.880 --> 0:06:38.600 a lot about June from the other characters, whether I'm 0:06:38.640 --> 0:06:41.800 in the scene or not. Madeline, let me ask you 0:06:41.880 --> 0:06:47.760 about Janine, because, um, she has quite an adventure in 0:06:47.800 --> 0:06:50.920 this this season, and we learn a lot more about 0:06:50.920 --> 0:06:55.640 her backstory, which I really appreciated and enjoyed, and I'm 0:06:55.680 --> 0:06:58.880 curious if you did as well, and how it impacted 0:06:59.200 --> 0:07:02.800 the way you aid her from that moment on, because 0:07:02.920 --> 0:07:06.440 I who knew. Yeah, I mean, I tried for so 0:07:06.480 --> 0:07:09.080 long for the first three seasons really to not make 0:07:09.120 --> 0:07:12.520 any real decisions about who I thought Janine was, just 0:07:12.560 --> 0:07:16.119 because I knew that eventually we would find out, and 0:07:16.280 --> 0:07:18.560 I wanted to be able to just like soak up 0:07:18.560 --> 0:07:20.840 anything that Bruce or you know, j C who who 0:07:20.840 --> 0:07:23.080 had written the episode. I wanted to just kind of 0:07:23.680 --> 0:07:27.240 fully embrace that. And Uh, I was really glad and 0:07:27.480 --> 0:07:29.720 very very proud to be able to tell this kind 0:07:29.800 --> 0:07:33.680 of story, the storyline for Janine, our relationship, the relationship 0:07:33.720 --> 0:07:38.120 between June and Janine and just everything. It just colored 0:07:38.240 --> 0:07:42.120 so many things for me, Um to get this backstory 0:07:42.160 --> 0:07:44.960 and that, you know, the confrontation between June and Janine, 0:07:45.160 --> 0:07:48.000 everything just kind of became a little brighter to me. 0:07:48.760 --> 0:07:51.280 Um about Janine, She's always been like a big part 0:07:51.320 --> 0:07:53.120 of my life and of my heart, and she just 0:07:53.240 --> 0:07:57.000 like she's just a tattooed in there now really, especially 0:07:57.000 --> 0:08:01.280 after this Um doing that episode and episode five as well. 0:08:01.800 --> 0:08:05.280 It's interesting, Bruce, how you the writers and you and 0:08:05.400 --> 0:08:09.000 everyone who's putting this together, how you figure out when 0:08:09.040 --> 0:08:11.360 you tell a backstory of a character. I know, I 0:08:11.440 --> 0:08:14.920 really enjoyed hearing more about Serena and what she was 0:08:15.000 --> 0:08:19.000 like before Gill Lead became Gile Lead. And how do 0:08:19.040 --> 0:08:23.360 you determine who's past or whose history you're going to mind? 0:08:24.160 --> 0:08:29.720 And and and why I think we'd mind everybody's if 0:08:29.760 --> 0:08:33.520 we had the time. I mean, you know, they're all extraordinary, 0:08:33.720 --> 0:08:37.240 extraordinary actors, and we're curious about their backstories. Um, And 0:08:37.280 --> 0:08:40.559 I think that Maddie as much as she was trying 0:08:40.600 --> 0:08:44.040 not to decide. As Lizzie was saying, Maddie was telling 0:08:44.120 --> 0:08:46.920 us that all the writers what Janine's backstory was over 0:08:46.960 --> 0:08:51.280 the last three years slowly, um so she was making decisions. 0:08:51.840 --> 0:08:54.880 But you know, I think all the back stories and 0:08:55.080 --> 0:08:59.720 from the response from the audience are super appealing and satisfying. 0:09:00.520 --> 0:09:03.920 I just wanted to say this year, in particular, under COVID, 0:09:05.280 --> 0:09:08.240 Maddie talks about that that episode like it's a normal episode. 0:09:08.280 --> 0:09:13.360 That episode was incredibly difficult under COVID, and the nine 0:09:14.080 --> 0:09:16.840 scenes we had of her in the past ended up 0:09:16.880 --> 0:09:20.959 being three scenes and everything changed all the time, and 0:09:21.040 --> 0:09:25.680 she was an absolute professional and also managed to get 0:09:25.720 --> 0:09:27.600 as much out of the story as we would have 0:09:27.640 --> 0:09:30.120 gotten in the longer version in the shorter version. And 0:09:30.160 --> 0:09:33.120 that's a testament to her and Christina the director and 0:09:33.760 --> 0:09:38.360 everybody else. Uh it was. It's a remarkable performance under 0:09:39.120 --> 0:09:43.959 under normal circumstances. It's a mark this year. It's breathtaking 0:09:44.000 --> 0:09:47.280 what she was able to do. So in awe of that, 0:09:48.120 --> 0:09:58.760 you're like, truth, my turn, hunt Well, and I want 0:09:58.800 --> 0:10:02.600 to talk to you about aunt Lydia because there's a 0:10:02.640 --> 0:10:07.760 little crack in Gilead for finally, for her, can you 0:10:07.880 --> 0:10:13.040 talk about the evolution of her character? And uh, sort 0:10:13.080 --> 0:10:18.400 of the the reason behind her increased humanity in this season, 0:10:18.520 --> 0:10:25.280 if you could call it that, Well, love is love, 0:10:25.480 --> 0:10:33.240 isn't it? And she loves Janine and she loves June. 0:10:33.880 --> 0:10:35.520 And as much as she likes to put it in 0:10:35.559 --> 0:10:38.960 any other fashion she possibly can, the truth of the 0:10:39.000 --> 0:10:45.360 matter is relationships are profoundly important to her. So I 0:10:45.400 --> 0:10:49.240 think if love creeps its way in walls will begin 0:10:49.320 --> 0:10:51.959 to crumble, whether she would like them to or not. 0:10:53.080 --> 0:10:57.199 And what to me was astonishing about the season for Lydia, 0:10:59.600 --> 0:11:03.040 and I this to the writers, and I give this 0:11:03.120 --> 0:11:07.880 to the other actors and to Elizabeth directing, is that 0:11:08.000 --> 0:11:12.880 things that utterly surprised me, that took me totally off 0:11:12.960 --> 0:11:16.240 card in the way they appeared in the scene, which 0:11:16.280 --> 0:11:19.040 is to say from Lydia, which I didn't have my 0:11:19.120 --> 0:11:22.560 hand on, because season four you can take your hand 0:11:22.640 --> 0:11:26.040 off because by now you know her, she knows you, 0:11:26.679 --> 0:11:28.480 and on the good day she's going to talk to 0:11:28.520 --> 0:11:30.640 you and say, don't worry about it, I've got it. 0:11:31.280 --> 0:11:35.199 And that's what happened season four for me and working 0:11:35.200 --> 0:11:41.080 with Elizabeth who knows her well, and I know her 0:11:41.160 --> 0:11:45.480 well and I love her and she loves me. Sorry 0:11:45.480 --> 0:11:47.720 to turn this into it so proper, but the point 0:11:47.760 --> 0:11:52.600 I'm making something happens there and that's trust and then 0:11:52.640 --> 0:11:55.960 you know, okay, let's drop the barriers and get it done. 0:11:56.600 --> 0:12:01.000 That's what thrilled me is to let her, let her 0:12:02.000 --> 0:12:04.160 come up on her own and see where she goes. 0:12:05.000 --> 0:12:11.079 So that just knocked me out, very grateful for Wow, Lizzy, 0:12:11.160 --> 0:12:16.040 would you like to comment on that? Sorry, good, no pressure, 0:12:16.120 --> 0:12:19.400 goll none of all. No. I mean, I had this 0:12:20.080 --> 0:12:26.800 incredible gift with directing, which was working with these actors, 0:12:27.400 --> 0:12:30.000 and it truly is a kind of extraordinary when you 0:12:30.000 --> 0:12:32.480 work with people for three years and a certain amount 0:12:32.520 --> 0:12:34.960 of episodes and then you put on a different hat 0:12:35.240 --> 0:12:38.000 and all of a sudden, it was just I had 0:12:39.120 --> 0:12:45.640 an entirely new appreciation for how incredibly gifted they all 0:12:45.720 --> 0:12:50.000 are and the trust that they that they gave me 0:12:50.040 --> 0:12:52.560 as a director, especially on my first time out in 0:12:52.600 --> 0:12:56.719 episode three. I'll never forget um the support they gave me. 0:12:56.760 --> 0:13:00.360 I'll never forget. And to tow End's point, you know, 0:13:01.040 --> 0:13:04.239 I've seen not just what you see in the episode 0:13:04.400 --> 0:13:07.319 on on Hulu. But I've seen all of the takes 0:13:07.800 --> 0:13:10.240 that they do before that, I've seen all the other 0:13:10.280 --> 0:13:12.560 things they've tried. I've seen all of the things that 0:13:12.600 --> 0:13:15.600 worked and didn't work, and we've had all these conversations. 0:13:15.600 --> 0:13:18.720 So I did feel like there was an element of 0:13:19.080 --> 0:13:22.080 knowing them as not just their characters but as actors 0:13:22.360 --> 0:13:25.120 that was helpful to us in our in our kind 0:13:25.120 --> 0:13:30.600 of new relationship. Bradley, do you feel I mean, I'm 0:13:30.600 --> 0:13:34.959 curious about You've done a lot of different shows, and 0:13:35.600 --> 0:13:39.240 is there something unique about this project for you and 0:13:39.320 --> 0:13:43.920 about this group of people? And um, I don't know 0:13:44.040 --> 0:13:48.600 how uh serendipitous. Everything seems to have been with a 0:13:48.600 --> 0:13:51.320 lot of hard work of course behind the scenes. But 0:13:51.640 --> 0:13:54.520 I wonder if you could describe for me the specialness 0:13:54.679 --> 0:13:58.800 of this this for you, Well, I feel like an 0:13:58.800 --> 0:14:06.800 obnoxiously lucky actor who's had some wonderful experiences, But there 0:14:06.920 --> 0:14:12.240 is absolutely something unique to me about you know, it's 0:14:12.280 --> 0:14:19.440 always alchemy and the feeling on the set. Uh, it's 0:14:19.440 --> 0:14:27.400 it's it's a weirdly uh loving, gentle, humorous uh set uh. 0:14:27.440 --> 0:14:31.440 And I think that tone is set by Lizzie, who, 0:14:31.440 --> 0:14:35.520 while she does Sophie's choice the series is maybe the 0:14:35.600 --> 0:14:44.280 least pretentious actor I've ever worked with. There is you know, 0:14:44.840 --> 0:14:51.720 we're aware, unfortunately that we're we're doing a show, um 0:14:51.800 --> 0:14:54.800 about a worst case scenario, about something that is all 0:14:54.840 --> 0:14:58.400 too familiar to us. Now. I keep this is another 0:14:58.440 --> 0:15:01.760 one of those moments, um, where I think as a 0:15:01.840 --> 0:15:12.360 country and all across the world, we're being reminded that uh, misogyny, racism, sexism, fascism. 0:15:12.400 --> 0:15:18.000 They're always in the next room doing push ups and UM. 0:15:18.640 --> 0:15:20.400 To be able to be part of a show that 0:15:20.560 --> 0:15:23.720 is uh, that is saying something on top of it 0:15:23.760 --> 0:15:28.120 being this kind of extraordinary for me, a very lucky 0:15:28.200 --> 0:15:34.400 person creative uh experience. There there is uh I know 0:15:35.360 --> 0:15:40.000 doing stuff with with Lizzie, which is an extraordinary thing, uh, 0:15:40.320 --> 0:15:42.040 given the fact that I met her when when she 0:15:42.160 --> 0:15:48.240 was seventeen. Um, there's on this show the takes that work. 0:15:49.000 --> 0:15:53.720 Uh you you and I felt this with Anne too. 0:15:54.080 --> 0:15:57.960 It's like you get surprised, you're you're you're surprised by 0:15:58.000 --> 0:16:01.240 what's happening, and it's a it's a function of the writing. 0:16:01.320 --> 0:16:06.320 I also love what what Anne was saying, combined with 0:16:06.320 --> 0:16:09.640 with what what Bruce is saying in a lesser show, 0:16:09.800 --> 0:16:14.560 people have epiphanies and become heroes. Uh, that's an insult 0:16:14.960 --> 0:16:20.880 to what a character like June is up against. And 0:16:20.960 --> 0:16:24.040 what Anne just said I think is really true is 0:16:24.160 --> 0:16:29.640 that I start feeling this this, this this kind of love, uh, 0:16:29.760 --> 0:16:33.320 you know, for for for aunt Lydia, who I begin 0:16:33.360 --> 0:16:38.560 to feel to understand absolutely for June in a way 0:16:38.880 --> 0:16:44.960 that mirrors what I feel. Um about working with Lizzie 0:16:44.960 --> 0:16:49.400 again after all these years. Um. Some reporters said, you know, 0:16:49.480 --> 0:16:52.560 what does Lawrence feel about her? And I'm like, he 0:16:52.640 --> 0:16:56.720 loves her, he doesn't know, but she's leading him. He 0:16:56.760 --> 0:17:01.000 doesn't even know it. Um, But I realized I feel 0:17:01.040 --> 0:17:04.800 about June. H Lawrence feels about June the way I 0:17:04.840 --> 0:17:08.080 feel about Lizzie. It's it's like it's it's the way 0:17:08.119 --> 0:17:10.120 I feel about my grown up children. It's like, oh 0:17:10.160 --> 0:17:13.400 my god, I can't believe what you became. And and 0:17:14.600 --> 0:17:18.640 you know you're I watched that episode. I was. I 0:17:18.720 --> 0:17:21.720 texted Lizzie. I said, okay, so you can direct to 0:17:22.119 --> 0:17:26.480 like what's next the fucking cello? I mean, it was, 0:17:26.800 --> 0:17:30.359 it was, it was incredible. So that but there's something 0:17:30.400 --> 0:17:33.480 about this show that I love that Anne was talking about, 0:17:33.560 --> 0:17:39.560 which is uh, somewhere in the solution to these intractable problems, 0:17:39.920 --> 0:17:44.040 humanity and love in the darkest of circumstances can shine through. 0:17:47.880 --> 0:18:02.720 We'll be right back, McKenna. I mean, first of all, 0:18:02.800 --> 0:18:07.160 high here you are with this extraordinary group of actors, 0:18:07.240 --> 0:18:10.639 and um, how old are you McKenna? Um, I'll be 0:18:10.680 --> 0:18:15.919 fifteen in June? Holy cow? Okay, So what can you 0:18:16.000 --> 0:18:18.880 describe what it was like for you? First of all, 0:18:18.920 --> 0:18:23.119 your character is so fascinating to me, but just the 0:18:23.280 --> 0:18:27.320 very idea of coming into this group of professionals as 0:18:27.560 --> 0:18:31.520 of almost fifteen year old, right, can you can you 0:18:31.600 --> 0:18:35.199 share with us, uh, just what this experience has been 0:18:35.280 --> 0:18:39.960 like for you? Well, I am new here. It's it's interesting. 0:18:40.000 --> 0:18:42.680 I haven't really had a chance to talk to most 0:18:42.680 --> 0:18:47.240 of the people here yet, so it's it's definitely a 0:18:47.240 --> 0:18:50.120 little bit scary because in preparing for the role, I've 0:18:50.200 --> 0:18:55.680 I've bench watched Handmaids and there's not one bad actor 0:18:55.760 --> 0:18:57.639 on the show. So I did not want to be 0:18:57.680 --> 0:19:02.800 the person to break that perfect track record. It's just 0:19:03.720 --> 0:19:06.119 it's really been a great experience to be able to 0:19:06.119 --> 0:19:08.439 be part of a show that speaks out about so 0:19:08.440 --> 0:19:12.240 many topics and something that reaches such a wide audience, 0:19:14.200 --> 0:19:17.680 especially getting able being able to work with Ms Lizzie 0:19:17.680 --> 0:19:23.040 as a director. That was an incredible experience. She's I 0:19:24.119 --> 0:19:28.200 can I put it into wards. It was absolutely magnificent. 0:19:28.920 --> 0:19:33.600 But it's been something that I really hope that I 0:19:33.640 --> 0:19:38.439 get to come back to and it's I've loved it. 0:19:39.520 --> 0:19:41.800 And when you when you when you set it, you 0:19:41.800 --> 0:19:46.960 know your character is interesting because she's braddy and brave 0:19:47.119 --> 0:19:52.560 at the same time. And um, I how did you 0:19:52.600 --> 0:19:56.760 wrap your head around kind of showing the many sides 0:19:56.840 --> 0:20:00.920 of her? Well, like you said, she is really fascinating, 0:20:01.200 --> 0:20:05.520 And I think it's less um bratty. It's just more 0:20:05.600 --> 0:20:11.800 of this. It's figuring out how to mix uh, how 0:20:12.040 --> 0:20:14.440 mature and like she is the mistress of this household, 0:20:14.440 --> 0:20:15.879 but at the end of the day, she is still 0:20:16.280 --> 0:20:21.320 unabused young lady. It's it's trying to figure out how 0:20:21.400 --> 0:20:26.200 to mix together her immaturity and her being the brave 0:20:26.400 --> 0:20:31.879 young gillyandsa briber that she is, um it and prepare. 0:20:31.960 --> 0:20:35.600 I did watch a lot of um interviews with young 0:20:35.640 --> 0:20:39.639 women who had been abused or had gone through situations 0:20:39.800 --> 0:20:44.320 like Um, she did, so I I wanted to make 0:20:44.359 --> 0:20:46.720 sure that I accurately betrayed her because there is no 0:20:46.920 --> 0:20:54.160 one way to play um Mrs Keith to play her abuse, 0:20:54.400 --> 0:20:57.680 and I just wanted to make sure that I definitely 0:20:57.840 --> 0:21:02.439 did it right, so to say at fifteen, I'm pretty 0:21:02.440 --> 0:21:06.280 blown away by you right now, and Bruce, you need 0:21:06.320 --> 0:21:09.639 to keep her around. And I think regardless, you have 0:21:09.680 --> 0:21:12.879 an incredible future ahead of you. Maybe you could like 0:21:13.040 --> 0:21:18.080 anchor a newscast. I don't know, but you're acting was 0:21:18.160 --> 0:21:21.960 phenomenal and you were obviously wise beyond your years. Max. 0:21:22.000 --> 0:21:26.560 I haven't forgotten about you, Kai Max. You know, I 0:21:26.600 --> 0:21:31.040 think probably with with your character, that again must have 0:21:31.080 --> 0:21:34.880 been a real challenge because you had to incorporate almost 0:21:34.920 --> 0:21:38.760 two different people, um in in your role, staying in 0:21:38.880 --> 0:21:42.560 Giliad and yet wanting the best for June and also 0:21:42.800 --> 0:21:47.600 having this streak of humanity. Um well, I love doing 0:21:47.600 --> 0:21:51.040 the season. I think we we all did. Um. There 0:21:51.119 --> 0:21:55.040 was so much more to explore with all these characters. 0:21:55.119 --> 0:22:00.159 And Nick can be very opaque, right, Um he's so 0:22:00.280 --> 0:22:03.440 spy on a spy on spy and at the same 0:22:03.480 --> 0:22:06.680 time I see him through rose tinted lenses and have 0:22:06.800 --> 0:22:11.040 always been quietly hoping that his moral compasses in the 0:22:11.160 --> 0:22:17.199 right place, and I was very relieved this year. The 0:22:17.240 --> 0:22:19.680 True North seems to be heading in the right direction. 0:22:19.920 --> 0:22:23.520 And just to echo what everyone's been saying, I think, 0:22:23.840 --> 0:22:26.360 you know, getting to work with Lizzie as a filmmaker 0:22:27.160 --> 0:22:30.600 pushed all of us, you know, I think it's the 0:22:30.640 --> 0:22:32.040 best work I've done on the show, with a lot 0:22:32.040 --> 0:22:34.520 of people's best work's done on the show. She she 0:22:34.640 --> 0:22:36.960 had a way of sort of extracting something from us 0:22:36.960 --> 0:22:39.879 that was really exciting and it was a joy to 0:22:39.920 --> 0:22:43.640 do it. Joe, I, I want to have you talk 0:22:43.720 --> 0:22:47.359 a little bit about playing someone and maybe Van you 0:22:47.440 --> 0:22:52.240 could chine in on someone who was just so awful 0:22:53.200 --> 0:22:57.359 and so evil. And I'm sure are we talking about 0:22:57.359 --> 0:23:03.040 the same character. I'm not sure, And I don't know. 0:23:03.240 --> 0:23:07.120 Does that start to kind of permeate your your psyche 0:23:07.119 --> 0:23:11.919 a little bit? And um, you know, just compared to 0:23:12.080 --> 0:23:14.680 many of your other roles that you've you know, you're 0:23:14.880 --> 0:23:19.240 such a distinguished actor. What has been like too to 0:23:19.440 --> 0:23:26.280 play someone, um, someone like this who completely has lost 0:23:27.200 --> 0:23:33.360 his humanity along the way. Well, I feel sometimes I've 0:23:33.359 --> 0:23:38.840 been cast this sort of dashing, um leading guy, and 0:23:38.880 --> 0:23:41.720 I feel in some ways I feel like, um, a 0:23:41.840 --> 0:23:45.119 character actor trapped in a leading man's body. And so 0:23:45.280 --> 0:23:48.720 this this character allows me to sort of get into 0:23:48.760 --> 0:23:51.639 an area I wouldn't normally be cast in. UM. So 0:23:51.720 --> 0:23:55.879 i've I've relished that, UM, but I don't. I haven't 0:23:55.880 --> 0:24:00.199 relished as people might relish playing nasty people. I haven't 0:24:00.200 --> 0:24:03.200 relished actually that part of his psyche because it's something 0:24:03.240 --> 0:24:06.320 that I'm reminded of when I come offset, I read 0:24:06.440 --> 0:24:10.080 an article, I hear something has happened along the lines 0:24:10.160 --> 0:24:14.119 that Fred Waterford might do. And so I just feel 0:24:14.160 --> 0:24:21.320 like in the world of Outward and Bruce and Dystopia, UM, 0:24:21.800 --> 0:24:24.200 I don't feel and I've ever really escaped it, and 0:24:24.480 --> 0:24:28.000 especially as I have two young daughters and an amazing wife, 0:24:28.080 --> 0:24:32.520 and the show has definitely refocused and recalibrated my appreciation 0:24:32.640 --> 0:24:35.399 of the psyche of women and how important they are 0:24:35.400 --> 0:24:38.719 in my life, and so playing someone like Fred, you know, 0:24:38.760 --> 0:24:42.240 I feel, I feel there's a big part of me 0:24:42.359 --> 0:24:47.119 feels kind of a shame that this is what I 0:24:47.200 --> 0:24:50.119 might have to show my daughters one day because it 0:24:50.240 --> 0:24:52.320 is their dad, but he's and it's not their dad, 0:24:52.359 --> 0:24:56.200 but but there are themes that are so pervasive, sadly 0:24:56.240 --> 0:25:01.520 within our society and continue to be so. And so 0:25:01.560 --> 0:25:04.760 I found I found that actually playing it and stepping 0:25:04.760 --> 0:25:08.040 back into the real world and sort of seeing Fred 0:25:08.119 --> 0:25:11.520 on the front pages of a news article or something 0:25:11.560 --> 0:25:14.600 in some way, shape or form in some industry and 0:25:14.680 --> 0:25:19.160 some business elsewhere, that there's sort of the awfulness of patriarchy, 0:25:19.240 --> 0:25:24.240 the awfulness of the pathetic nous of of um, of 0:25:25.280 --> 0:25:30.719 patriarchy really at its words, the michot misogyny and and um. 0:25:30.760 --> 0:25:32.720 So it's been difficult, yeah, and I can't wait to 0:25:32.760 --> 0:25:35.960 shake off that itchy beard because he's that's a synonymous 0:25:36.000 --> 0:25:39.600 with Fred and so um. Yeah, it is weird and 0:25:40.040 --> 0:25:43.800 tough and um and ugly and the tentacles of the 0:25:43.920 --> 0:25:48.240 man are pervasive. But it sounds like it's changed your 0:25:48.760 --> 0:25:51.199 not not changed your personal behavior. I think that's a 0:25:51.200 --> 0:25:55.159 little extreme, but it's made to recognize things that have 0:25:56.359 --> 0:26:01.440 resulted in a deeper, more meaningful, and more enlightened relationship 0:26:02.040 --> 0:26:06.440 with the women in your life. Absolutely, I mean it's 0:26:06.520 --> 0:26:11.640 pulped me um and and it's it's the narrative has 0:26:11.680 --> 0:26:15.840 kept me suspended in a way where I'm deeply reflective. UM. Yeah, 0:26:16.000 --> 0:26:20.879 daily and Evan. I you know, Serena is so fascinating 0:26:20.920 --> 0:26:26.880 to me because she does seem to um vacilate. I mean, 0:26:27.280 --> 0:26:30.320 not not a ton, but you do see these glimmers 0:26:30.320 --> 0:26:35.280 of hope. And I'm always thinking, Uh, you know, Serena, 0:26:36.080 --> 0:26:38.760 You've got it in you. And I'm curious what it 0:26:38.880 --> 0:26:42.199 what it's been like for you to play someone who's 0:26:42.240 --> 0:26:49.040 so complicated and misguided and honestly so lost at certain 0:26:49.040 --> 0:26:54.160 moments in her life. Yeah, I think UM I somewhat 0:26:54.160 --> 0:26:57.480 echo what Joe was saying that it I think at 0:26:57.520 --> 0:27:04.160 first it was really confronting UM to play someone so 0:27:04.240 --> 0:27:07.159 awful and and I think especially as an actress, as 0:27:07.240 --> 0:27:10.919