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Speaker 1: From the heart of where innovation, money and power collive

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Speaker 1: in Silicon Valley and beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with

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Speaker 1: Emily jay I rememerly Chang in San Francisco, and this

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Speaker 1: is Bloomberg Technology coming up in the next hour. Well,

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Speaker 1: it could have been worse. That's what analysts are saying

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Speaker 1: about Netflix results. Shares jumping in late trade despite losing

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Speaker 1: almost a million subscribers could add solve the company's problems.

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Speaker 1: We will discuss plus Twitter wins for now. A judge

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Speaker 1: grants the company's request to fast track its lawsuit against

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Speaker 1: Elon Musk. The trial now scheduled to start in October.

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Speaker 1: We'll explore this particular judges record and what it tells

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Speaker 1: us about which side has a better shot. And as

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Speaker 1: a major crypto lender and hedge fund collapse, is regulation

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Speaker 1: the answer? The head of US policy of coin Based

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Speaker 1: joins us to talk about the way out of the

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Speaker 1: ashes of the crypto crash. Let's stay with Netflix now,

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Speaker 1: I'm bringing down morgantin, your portfolio manager at sent Novis Trust.

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Speaker 1: So Dan, explain this to me. Why are shares up

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Speaker 1: if they've still lost almost a million subscribers. Well, it's

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Speaker 1: kind of a confusing report, Emily, isn't it. I mean,

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Speaker 1: if you think about it, it's kind of a sigh

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Speaker 1: of relief, I think by a lot of people coming

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Speaker 1: to the numbers. I mean, obviously, the projections going into

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Speaker 1: the third quarter below expectations. In terms of number of

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Speaker 1: new subscribers. They're saying they're going to add a million.

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Speaker 1: The street was looking for one point eight million. They

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Speaker 1: did lose less, right than expected in the second quarter.

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Speaker 1: I think there were a lot of estimates. Some people

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Speaker 1: are saying as many as two million. They came in

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Speaker 1: losing seventy thousand. The other thing that's kind of confusing

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Speaker 1: to Emily is that if you look at their guidance

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Speaker 1: going into revenues and earnings for the third quarter, they

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Speaker 1: are also below consensus, and yet the stock was up.

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Speaker 1: And the only thing I can think of, Emily, is

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Speaker 1: that they're kind of addressing a lot of their issues, right.

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Speaker 1: They talked in their shareholder letter about how they're going

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Speaker 1: to address the issues with all these people a hundred

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Speaker 1: million people you know that are using the service for

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Speaker 1: free um and they talked a little bit about free

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Speaker 1: cash flow and various other things. So I think maybe

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Speaker 1: people are just saying they're addressing their issues. It was

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Speaker 1: as worse as we thought, and hopefully things will get

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Speaker 1: better in the future. And that's how we have to

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Speaker 1: leave it because the stock is up. Let's talk about

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Speaker 1: this crackdown on password sharing, because let's be honest, Netflix

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Speaker 1: has been giving Netflix away for free for a while

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Speaker 1: to a lot of people who just haven't paid up.

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Speaker 1: If they cracked down on the passports, how big an

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Speaker 1: impact do you think that will actually have in getting

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Speaker 1: some of those people to pay up. Well's teteresting him

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Speaker 1: because in the shareholder letter they mentioned they're going to

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Speaker 1: test two approaches in Latin America and they're going to

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Speaker 1: charge to nine a month, and they're going to try

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Speaker 1: to work something to try to to get these able

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Speaker 1: to start pain. So I'm kind of curious to learn

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Speaker 1: a little bit more about that. That seems pretty low

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Speaker 1: to me, right tone a month. I pay close to

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Speaker 1: twenty dollars a month for my Netflix subscription here in

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Speaker 1: the United States. But so it's gonna be kind of

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Speaker 1: interesting to see how they roll that out and put

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Speaker 1: that together and and try to monetize these people and

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Speaker 1: bring them in. How So, I think we need to

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Speaker 1: just learn a little bit more about how they're going

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Speaker 1: to do it. But that's a huge number, a hundred million,

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Speaker 1: So advertising be the answer to Netflix's problems, you know, Emily,

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Speaker 1: it's kind of interesting because I'm curious to see how

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Speaker 1: that's going to play out. Right, they signed the agreement

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Speaker 1: with Microsoft to help them last week. On that. I'm

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Speaker 1: just wondering. And I could ask you, because you're a

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Speaker 1: big user Netflix, if they got to the point where

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Speaker 1: they're offering an add you know, streaming service and there's

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Speaker 1: not that many ads, maybe it's every fifteen minutes, which

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Speaker 1: is you'd be willing to maybe just say, hey, I'm

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Speaker 1: not going to pay the fifteen twenty dollars a month

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Speaker 1: and just go straight for the free ad streaming service.

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Speaker 1: So that's interesting. And then the other thing component is

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Speaker 1: they have two or twenty million people using their system

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Speaker 1: right now. How many people do they add to this

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Speaker 1: new ad streaming service and do they start competing against

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Speaker 1: the like so let's say a Facebook or Google in

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Speaker 1: terms of garnering all this revenue through advertising. So I

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Speaker 1: don't know how that's going to come together for them.

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Speaker 1: They're gonna let us know more and they're introducing some

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Speaker 1: new services, I guess in two thousand twenty three, So

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Speaker 1: it's going to be interesting to see what happens with

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Speaker 1: this new ad streaming Netflix right. Time is precious, and

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Speaker 1: so is money down. I mean, I think i'd have

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Speaker 1: to look at the numbers and also the ad experience.

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Speaker 1: You know, what kind of ads are these? How long

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Speaker 1: am I watching them? Are they pleasing? Are they really

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Speaker 1: tailored to me? The thing is, and and this point

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Speaker 1: has been made. You know, the companies that are brought

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Speaker 1: up as competitors Disney Plus, m Hulu, Amazon, HBO. Disney

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Speaker 1: Plus isn't necessarily a substitute for Netflix, is it? What

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Speaker 1: Dosney Plus is interesting because they have about a hundred

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Speaker 1: million subscribers, are the largest competitor next to Netflix. They're

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Speaker 1: targeting about two hundred and forty million subscribers by two

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Speaker 1: thousand twenty four, which seems like a really big number

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Speaker 1: for them. But I think you're right, Emily, Disney Plus

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Speaker 1: seems a little bit more different in terms of their

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Speaker 1: content than what we find on Netflix. You were talking

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Speaker 1: earlier about the various uh, you know, series that they

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Speaker 1: have and how people get hooked on them. A little

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Speaker 1: bit of a different component as Disney has that huge

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Speaker 1: library of movies and content through all the years of

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Speaker 1: Disney production, so it is a little bit different. But

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Speaker 1: there's no doubt that Disney in terms of number of

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Speaker 1: subscribers is the closest in terms of Netflix in terms

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Speaker 1: of their having the you know, hundred million, which is

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Speaker 1: pretty close to two or twenty million. The rest of

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Speaker 1: the other players have much less subscribers. So here's the

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Speaker 1: other thing. Is the return on content space spending, paying

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Speaker 1: off or dropping off. If Stranger Things is costing reportedly

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Speaker 1: thirty million dollars an episode, is that worth it? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: It's interesting, Emily. You look at their content expense projection

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Speaker 1: for this year, it's about seventeen point nine billion, which

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Speaker 1: is pretty much in line with they projected last year,

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Speaker 1: which is around seventeen billions. So it seems to me

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Speaker 1: like Netflix is getting a little more cautious in regards

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Speaker 1: to this attitude We're just going to spend tons of money,

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Speaker 1: create tons of content, and we're going to get the

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Speaker 1: subscribers and we'll be able to pay for it. Seems

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Speaker 1: like they're starting to pull back a little bit in

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Speaker 1: regards to their content budgets. And expectations. It's starting to

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Speaker 1: be a little bit more careful on margins and so forth.

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Speaker 1: So you bring up a good point, where do you

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Speaker 1: just keep spending and spending and spending if you're not

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Speaker 1: getting the subscriber growth because your subscriber growth is negative.

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Speaker 1: Doesn't make sense to keep spending more and more money

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Speaker 1: on content. You need to bring it back in a

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Speaker 1: little bit and kind of refocus, and it appears that

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Speaker 1: they're starting to do that instead of this growth at

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Speaker 1: all cost model, which is what they were doing in

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Speaker 1: the past. All right, well, we're going to continue to

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Speaker 1: digest these Netflix results to have a bit more later

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Speaker 1: in the show, Dan Always get to have you here,

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Speaker 1: Dan Morgan, Novist Trust. All right, coming up, Twitter gets

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Speaker 1: the green light to take Elon Musk to court and fast.

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Speaker 1: We will talk about what's next in Twitter v. Musk

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Speaker 1: with a Columbia law professor and our very own Kurt Wagner, Mr.

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Speaker 1: Is Bloomberg. Round one goes to Twitter. The company was

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Speaker 1: granted its request a fast track its lawsuit against Elon

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Speaker 1: Musk as he attempts to walk away from the fort

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Speaker 1: four billion dollar deal. Delaware Judge Kathleen McCormick set a

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Speaker 1: five day trial to start in October. For more, we're

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Speaker 1: joined by Eric Talley, Columbia Law School professor and faculty

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Speaker 1: co director of its Millstein Center, along with our very

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Speaker 1: own Kurt Wagner, who of course covers Twitter for us.

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Speaker 1: So what actually happened in court today? And by in

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Speaker 1: court I mean virtual corp? The judge actually has COVID,

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Speaker 1: Yes she does, so, I was listening on the dial

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Speaker 1: in the public die Island, actually, which felt very interesting

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Speaker 1: to listen to arguments that way. But both sides kind

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Speaker 1: of presented their case. Obviously they had already submitted written, um,

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Speaker 1: you know, elements to this. The judge took a little

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Speaker 1: bit of time to review and think about things and

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Speaker 1: then and issued a pretty quick verdict. You know, she said,

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Speaker 1: based on the evidence, based on the arguments that had

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Speaker 1: been made, I feel that it makes sense to speed

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Speaker 1: this up. Not quite as fast as Twitter wanted. They

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Speaker 1: were hoping to do a trial in September, but she

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Speaker 1: still thought that, you know, the longer this thing drags out,

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Speaker 1: the more chance there is for damage to Twitter's business

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Speaker 1: and brand. And as a result, she said, we should

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Speaker 1: do this in October. Versus the Musk team wanted to

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Speaker 1: wait all the way till February. Now, Professor Tally, you

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Speaker 1: actually know the judge here and know her record well.

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Speaker 1: I understand she's a seller friendly judge, or at least

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Speaker 1: has made seller friendly decisions in the past. What can

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Speaker 1: you tell us about her? Yeah, I think she's largely

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Speaker 1: right down the middle in terms of her predilections. But

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Speaker 1: she's very good. She works harder than just about any

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Speaker 1: judge I've ever met, and it's extremely smart. Now, the

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Speaker 1: thing to remember is that the Delaware courts have seen

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Speaker 1: a fair number of these cases in which buyers get

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Speaker 1: cold feet and try to walk away, whether it's because

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Speaker 1: of COVID the financial crisis. So in many ways, this

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Speaker 1: is the most recent chapter. And Chancellor McCormick actually had

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Speaker 1: one of these cases that came up during COVID about

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Speaker 1: a year ago, and she did hold for the seller.

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Speaker 1: Basically told the buyer, you know what, You're gonna be

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Speaker 1: required to go forward with this transaction by the company

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Speaker 1: that you're now trying to walk away from. And I

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Speaker 1: don't even care that your financing has fallen through because

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Speaker 1: you sort of made that happen. You sort of engineered

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Speaker 1: or sabotage your own deal. So during the argument today,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of argument from Twitter's lawyers about whether

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Speaker 1: Elon Musk had similarly been trying to sabotage the deal.

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Speaker 1: Now we haven't gotten to any of those matters yet.

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Speaker 1: The key question is whether this deal, this this litigation

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Speaker 1: was gonna get fast tracked or put on the slow track.

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Speaker 1: And we're definitely on the fast track. While Twitter lawyers

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Speaker 1: didn't get exactly what they were hoping for, they ended

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Speaker 1: up missing it by only about a couple of weeks,

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Speaker 1: and she pushed what they had hoped to be a

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Speaker 1: September trial into October. So largely one would chalk this

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Speaker 1: up to a victory, at least as of today, to Twitter.

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Speaker 1: So the question is how big a victory. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you talk about precedent here, but was that other case

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Speaker 1: of forty four billion dollar deal, and did it involve

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Speaker 1: taking on Elon Musk Unless there are cake decorating companies

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Speaker 1: that are worth forty four billion dollars, No, it wasn't.

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Speaker 1: This was a small deal. It wasn't even a publicly

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Speaker 1: traded company. And so there is a kind of an

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Speaker 1: interesting question about whether when the stakes get ratcheted up

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Speaker 1: like this, Chancellor McCormick is similarly going to be unsympathetic

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Speaker 1: towards a buyer that wants to walk away. However, Uh,

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Speaker 1: this particular deal, and everyone knew this because it was

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Speaker 1: out there in the public domain. Uh, you know, Elon

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Speaker 1: Musk went after Twitter. They were a reluctant seller. They

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Speaker 1: finally signed up the deal when he said, hey, I'll

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Speaker 1: make this a really sell her friendly deal. I won't

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Speaker 1: do any diligence on a bunch of these technical aspects.

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Speaker 1: And only after the deal got signed up did he

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Speaker 1: start to seem to have problems with bots. And I

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Speaker 1: think a lot of people, including Twitter's lawyers, said, you know,

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Speaker 1: this is a pretext. This is essentially the beginning of

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Speaker 1: an elaborate set of demands that was really intended to

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Speaker 1: engineer an exit ramp for Elon must So one of

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Speaker 1: the key um claims that he made was, oh, this

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Speaker 1: to be. But that was never really in the document itself.

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Speaker 1: It was never in the agreement itself. It's sort of

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Speaker 1: something that he injected into the picture. And I think

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Speaker 1: one of the key questions that people were looking at

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Speaker 1: today was whether the judge was going to be willing

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Speaker 1: to take a long term litigation approach, which would be

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Speaker 1: kind of a signal that she might be more willing

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Speaker 1: to listen to some of this bought count war, and

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Speaker 1: instead she's fast tracted. There's still gonna be arguments about bots,

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Speaker 1: don't get me wrong, but they're not going to be

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Speaker 1: the sort of blown out thing that Elon must and

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Speaker 1: his lawyers wanted. You know, the professor makes a really

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Speaker 1: good point. So much has happened you almost forget that

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Speaker 1: Twitter didn't want to do this deal in the first place,

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Speaker 1: and now here we are. What are you hearing from

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Speaker 1: your Twitter sources about what they are going to be

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Speaker 1: doing over the next few weeks. Well, obviously there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of preparation that will go into this. But I

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Speaker 1: think this, you know, as Eric mentioned, like, this is

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Speaker 1: a good win for Twitter because it shows that their

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Speaker 1: argument is already being well received, right, which I think

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Speaker 1: was the big thing. I think they've already sort of

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Speaker 1: one a little bit in the court of public opinion here.

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Speaker 1: I don't know, I certainly on on my Twitter feed.

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Speaker 1: You know, there was a lot of support for Twitter

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Speaker 1: from their lawsuit. I've I've certainly seen employees seem to

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Speaker 1: be happy with how the company has handled this. So

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Speaker 1: I think at this point it's about trying to remove

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Speaker 1: a lot of the uncertainty, right because the company has

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Speaker 1: been in this weird state for months where they you know,

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Speaker 1: they say, hey, it's business as usual, but you can't

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Speaker 1: imagine that, you know, you're gonna be putting a six

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Speaker 1: months twelve month product roadmap out the door when you

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Speaker 1: have Elon Musk covering there. So I think at this

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Speaker 1: point again, they want to do this as quick as

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Speaker 1: possible so that they can get back to doing things

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Speaker 1: like shipping products, doing things like, you know, improving the business. Indeed,

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Speaker 1: um Professor Tally, how do you think Elon Musk's larger

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Speaker 1: than life personality, the fact that he has a hundred

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Speaker 1: million Twitter followers himself. I mean, there's a pretty uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, if if we're talking about the court of

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Speaker 1: public opinion, Elon Musk has a lot of fans. How

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Speaker 1: do you think that will influence this trial? Well, there's

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Speaker 1: a sense in which it already has. One of the

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Speaker 1: arguments that Twitter's lawyers made today was that you just

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Speaker 1: can't leave this deal in limbo when it may just

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Speaker 1: be thrown into utter chaos if we're going to be

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Speaker 1: going into another year's worth of litigation, and that may

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Speaker 1: be in part due to their arguments about the amount

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Speaker 1: of damage that Elon must could potentially do here. Now,

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Speaker 1: it's definitely true that that you know, there is this

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Speaker 1: There has long been this kind of question about whether

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Speaker 1: Mr Musk has some sort of I don't know, Elon

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Speaker 1: exceptionalism that wouldn't that wouldn't make him bound to the

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Speaker 1: same rules that applied everyone else. This is an early

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Speaker 1: shot across the bow that suggests that this judge in

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Speaker 1: particular is willing to treat this case just like she

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Speaker 1: would any other case. And when you've got a deal

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Speaker 1: that has gotten signed up on very seller friendly terms

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Speaker 1: with very little due diligence in what seems like, at

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Speaker 1: least at present, to be a bit of a drummed

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Speaker 1: up reason to want to walk away. Uh, you know

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Speaker 1: that the the musque team probably has an uphill battle

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Speaker 1: to climb here. Uh you know, I think there is

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Speaker 1: a real sense as well that Delaware courts view this

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Speaker 1: is kind of their um look in the mirror moment.

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Speaker 1: They are widely reputed to be, and they embraced this

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Speaker 1: as the place where sort of grown ups go to

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Speaker 1: to to transact with one another. And if you put

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Speaker 1: something down on paper and you promise it, um, they're

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Speaker 1: gonna hold you to it. And so on some level, yes,

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Speaker 1: Elon Musk has a has a larger than life presence,

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Speaker 1: but that also has a countervailing effect that the Delaware

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Speaker 1: courts might have an opportunity to say, even for this person,

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Speaker 1: we're going to hold into his agreements. Fascinating. Well, I'm

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Speaker 1: sure there will be many more twists and turns between

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Speaker 1: now and October. Eric Talley, Columbia Law School Professor, thank you,

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Speaker 1: as well as our very own Kurt Wagner, who has

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Speaker 1: a day in Delaware court in October. A newly released

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Speaker 1: memo is raising alarm about competitive practices in Silicon Valley

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Speaker 1: and helping to shape regulation. An internal document prepared for

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Speaker 1: Mark Zuckerberg by Facebook executives, now released by the House,

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Speaker 1: reveals the company is more worried about threats from its

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Speaker 1: own products like Instagram and What'sapp then threats from rivals.

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Speaker 1: This memo has helped lawmakers put together the American Innovation

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Speaker 1: and Choice Online Act that would curb some of Meta's powers.

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Speaker 1: Here to discuss Bloomberg's Lee and Nilan who covers regulation

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Speaker 1: in washing too, and so Lea tell us exactly what

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Speaker 1: was in this memo and why it matters. Yeah, So

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Speaker 1: this memo was written in twenty eight keen by a

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Speaker 1: senior data scientist and economist at Facebook, Thomas Cummeningham, and

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Speaker 1: he actually analyzed the ways in which Facebook's own products

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Speaker 1: compete with each other, So the ways in which Instagram

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Speaker 1: and Facebook compete against each other, the ways in which

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Speaker 1: Facebook Messenger and What'sapp compete against each other, and how

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Speaker 1: um those were growing or shrinking. And that was really

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Speaker 1: interesting because this entire memo is about how Facebook's own

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Speaker 1: products are really cannibalizing each other and seen as like

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Speaker 1: the biggest competitors against Facebook's main product instead of any rivals.

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Speaker 1: There aren't that many external companies that are even mentioned

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Speaker 1: in this memo, you know, like YouTube gets a very

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Speaker 1: small shout out, Apple's I message gets a very small

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Speaker 1: shout out. TikTok isn't even mentioned in here, and that

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Speaker 1: was what is so was so interesting to house investigators

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Speaker 1: is it's sort of backs up the idea that Facebook

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Speaker 1: had bought these properties to sort of extend its monopoly

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Speaker 1: in social networking. So what's the impact that this memo

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Speaker 1: could have on pending regulation and impact essentially on Facebook's

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Speaker 1: laws that Facebook is ultimately potentially going to have to

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Speaker 1: abide by. Yeah, so Congress right now is considering this legislation,

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Speaker 1: the American Innovation and Choice Act, that would prevent some

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Speaker 1: of the big tech platforms like Facebook from self preferencing,

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Speaker 1: so giving advantages to its own products over those of rivals.

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Speaker 1: So one thing that Facebook does, for example, is make

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Speaker 1: it really easy to cross post between Facebook and Instagram,

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Speaker 1: right this legislation would force them to make it easier

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Speaker 1: for other platforms to also cross post to their own

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Speaker 1: to their social networks. Um, this UH legislation has advanced

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Speaker 1: in both the House and the Senate, but it still

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Speaker 1: needs a floor vote, and so there's been a lot

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Speaker 1: of pressure um in the Senate and for particular, for

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Speaker 1: this to come up for a vote before the August

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Speaker 1: recess and lawmakers sort of leave for the month and

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Speaker 1: then when they come back they really are focused on

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Speaker 1: the November elections. So this is seen as like the

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Speaker 1: really large and last window for Congress to actually act

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Speaker 1: on the NHS legislation if something is going to happen

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Speaker 1: this year quickly any response from Facebook about this, I

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Speaker 1: mean Facebook is actually the one that handed over the

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Speaker 1: memo to the House in the first place. Yeah, they said,

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Speaker 1: you know this is old news, this is from you know,

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Speaker 1: the landscape has shifted since then. They do like to

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Speaker 1: bring up now you know that TikTok Is is a

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Speaker 1: very emerging rival, and um, you know they think that

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Speaker 1: there's still a lot of competition in the social networking space.

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Speaker 1: All Right, something will continue to follow Bloombergs Leon Nilan,

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Speaker 1: thank you for that context. Welcome back to bloomber Technology

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Speaker 1: and Emily changing in San Francisco. I want to get

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Speaker 1: back to our top story, and that is Netflix share

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Speaker 1: still jumping after hours after the streaming giant reported lower

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Speaker 1: a lower than expected loss in subscribers in the second quarter,

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Speaker 1: but the forecast still slower than expected recovery in the

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Speaker 1: current quarter. Ross Gerber, CEO of Gerbert Kawasaki, joins us. Now, Ross,

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Speaker 1: do you like what you see? I know you're a

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Speaker 1: big Netflix holder, but here we are having lost another

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Speaker 1: million subscribers. Well, yes and no, I mean obviously losing

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Speaker 1: subscribers is not a great headline, but you have to

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Speaker 1: look at it in the context of obviously rising prices

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Speaker 1: in the United States and the fact that they don't

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Speaker 1: have a way to monetize people who don't want to pay,

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Speaker 1: which is turns out about people who watch Netflix don't pay,

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Speaker 1: and that's really why I think people are so bullish.

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Speaker 1: Is the strategy that Netflix is going to be employing

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Speaker 1: to get these people to pay is a two pronged

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Speaker 1: strategy that I think will be very effective. One is

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Speaker 1: the ad supported tier, which I think is a wonderful

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Speaker 1: opera tunity to address a global market if you're an

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Speaker 1: advertiser and a very engaged audience. So as an advertiser myself,

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Speaker 1: I would definitely put ads on Netflix, and then secondly

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Speaker 1: um from getting some add on sub revenue from the

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Speaker 1: people who use their mom's accounts. So you know, essentially

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Speaker 1: this is a wake up call to millennials across America

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Speaker 1: that they're going to have to watch ads if they

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Speaker 1: don't want to pay for Netflix or their mom can

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Speaker 1: pay another couple bucks a month. But the days of

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Speaker 1: free streaming are definitely over for Netflix. What's your take

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Speaker 1: on their content spending strategy. Yes, there are huge hits,

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Speaker 1: they spend a lot on those hits, But it seems

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Speaker 1: like Netflix makes a lot of stuff. Well, when you're

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Speaker 1: serving the world, essentially, you have a huge audience to

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Speaker 1: make happy, you know, so like a lot of content

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Speaker 1: they make is really for niche audiences one way or

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Speaker 1: another that they're trying to serve all throughout the world.

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Speaker 1: But you have to look at it from this, you know,

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Speaker 1: like how much goes out and how much comes in

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Speaker 1: versus and what they get for what they're spending. And

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Speaker 1: I think one of the things in the report that

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Speaker 1: I found really interesting was the fact that Netflix is

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Speaker 1: now getting to a point where they're amortizing the same

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Speaker 1: amount as they're spending on content, and they used to

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Speaker 1: spend a lot more than they're amortizing, And so what

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Speaker 1: we're really getting out of their financials there's a real

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Speaker 1: number of profitability on the content spend that they have.

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Speaker 1: So if any group of people that I trust spending

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Speaker 1: content is the group of people at Netflix. They just

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Speaker 1: make amazing content and they have a great team. Now,

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Speaker 1: obviously valuations have dropped out there, and I wonder what

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Speaker 1: you think about M and A could Netflix potentially acquire

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Speaker 1: some you know, new capabilities here. What about a Roku

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Speaker 1: or a theater chain. Well, I was kind of pushing

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Speaker 1: towards the theater chain idea because I love putting Ryan

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Speaker 1: Reynolds movie in the theater, which I think it could

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Speaker 1: generate a hundred million plus that Netflix isn't going to

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Speaker 1: get and as a user, I would wait another two

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Speaker 1: weeks to watch it on Netflix. You know, it wouldn't

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Speaker 1: matter to me. So, you know, it makes me sad

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Speaker 1: they're not moving that action. But I'm I'm in the

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Speaker 1: gaming business too, and they're moving towards gaming, and their

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Speaker 1: partnered with Microsoft, which is one of our top holdings

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Speaker 1: in my fund g K and as well as Netflix.

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Speaker 1: So I'm really happy with Microsoft and Netflix moving into

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Speaker 1: the gaming area together. If you look at the way

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Speaker 1: Disney is monetized i P at Marvel, that's what Netflix

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Speaker 1: is really thinking about in their futures. How do we

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Speaker 1: monetize our i P better? How do we get more

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Speaker 1: revenue dollars per user? Maybe it's live events, and we

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Speaker 1: saw that with the Netflix comedy specials, which were actually

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Speaker 1: live events that Netflix sold tickets to but then put

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Speaker 1: on the platform as well, so I think that's really

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Speaker 1: the thinking they're Um, we're a very big company with

432
00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:41,080
Speaker 1: lots of subscribers, and we still want to grow, but

433
00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:43,560
Speaker 1: there's a huge amount of revenue and profits. We have

434
00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:46,439
Speaker 1: a tapped from this audience that they're really focused on,

435
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:49,360
Speaker 1: and I think that approach is really, you know, attractive

436
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:51,440
Speaker 1: to me as a sharehold. I also want to ask

437
00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:54,399
Speaker 1: you about Tesla and Twitter. I know you're a big

438
00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:58,480
Speaker 1: Tesla holder. As I understand it, you held Twitter until

439
00:22:58,880 --> 00:23:01,000
Speaker 1: Elon must decide and he wanted to pull out of

440
00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:05,359
Speaker 1: the deal. Now we're seeing this judge fast track the

441
00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:08,360
Speaker 1: trial as Twitter wanted them to do, and there are

442
00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:12,320
Speaker 1: certainly signs that this Delaware court could force Elon Musk

443
00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:15,439
Speaker 1: to do the deal. What's your take. I'm not a lawyer,

444
00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:17,399
Speaker 1: so I just want to say I have a pretty

445
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:20,760
Speaker 1: good understanding of law. But but I'm not a professional lawyer.

446
00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:24,160
Speaker 1: But my take on this, and I've spoken to many

447
00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:26,760
Speaker 1: legal people about this as well, and my own experience

448
00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:29,760
Speaker 1: in watching mergers over my life, is that Elon has

449
00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:32,840
Speaker 1: made a big mistake and this is a mess. You know,

450
00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:35,920
Speaker 1: there was a material effect on Twitter and you can't

451
00:23:35,960 --> 00:23:39,040
Speaker 1: deny it, and pulling out of this deal has severely

452
00:23:39,119 --> 00:23:42,840
Speaker 1: damaged Twitter and and you know, their future, so I

453
00:23:43,280 --> 00:23:46,480
Speaker 1: you know, I think Ellen is at risk to potentially

454
00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:49,400
Speaker 1: losing billions of dollars and damages. But I don't see

455
00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:51,920
Speaker 1: a court forcing a person to run a company they

456
00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:54,720
Speaker 1: don't want to run. I mean, that's not really the

457
00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:58,600
Speaker 1: solution to this. Twitter has been damaged, and the question

458
00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:01,200
Speaker 1: is whether they find that damn is to be Elon's

459
00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:04,840
Speaker 1: fault or not because of the information that he received

460
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:08,840
Speaker 1: from Twitter, which no question was questionable. But in my mind,

461
00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:11,479
Speaker 1: they had a merger agreement and and he breached it,

462
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:13,639
Speaker 1: and it's going to be a costly encounter for Elon.

463
00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:16,399
Speaker 1: I think doesn't damage Tesla too, I mean, doesn't make

464
00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:20,240
Speaker 1: you concerned as a Tesla shareholder. No, it's a real

465
00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:22,760
Speaker 1: positive for Tesla that he's not going to be the

466
00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:25,280
Speaker 1: CEO of Twitter. I mean, you know, as much as

467
00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:28,440
Speaker 1: yet he's not going to be the CEO of Twitter.

468
00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:30,439
Speaker 1: I can tell you that. I mean, he doesn't want

469
00:24:30,440 --> 00:24:32,560
Speaker 1: anything to do with it. That's the bottom line. He's

470
00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:35,400
Speaker 1: gonna lose billions of dollars, which he knows very wealthy man,

471
00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:39,520
Speaker 1: so he'll survive. But from a Tesla perspective. Tesla's in

472
00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:43,040
Speaker 1: massive growth mode right now. I mean, it couldn't be

473
00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:45,800
Speaker 1: a better environment to sell electric vehicles, and they got

474
00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:48,600
Speaker 1: two brand new factories and ramp mode at the same time.

475
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:51,720
Speaker 1: His focus needs to be on Tesla right now because

476
00:24:51,760 --> 00:24:54,440
Speaker 1: the next twelve months, the eighteen months are the most

477
00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:57,960
Speaker 1: consequential months for Tesla's future that I've seen in the

478
00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:00,560
Speaker 1: eight years i've been an investor in Tesla. So so

479
00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:04,480
Speaker 1: I'm I'm you know, happy that I mean, this is

480
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:06,960
Speaker 1: still a waste of time, and it's still distracting, but

481
00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:09,720
Speaker 1: I'm happy he's not gonna end up being CEO of Twitter,

482
00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:13,119
Speaker 1: and hopefully he'll learn his lesson and really focus on

483
00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:15,280
Speaker 1: what he's done great, which is Tesla, and and I

484
00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:18,840
Speaker 1: think that's what he's learned. Well, stranger things have happened, Ross,

485
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:22,160
Speaker 1: and I'm going to keep using that pun. Ross Kerberg

486
00:25:22,240 --> 00:25:26,000
Speaker 1: or Wakawasaki CEO. Always great to have you, Thank you, Okay.

487
00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:29,640
Speaker 1: Coming up, calls for clear crypto regulation are getting louder,

488
00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:32,639
Speaker 1: but SEC chair Gary Gensler says there are laws in

489
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:36,960
Speaker 1: place and crypto platforms aren't coming forward. Well on that, next,

490
00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:41,439
Speaker 1: Mrs Bloomberg there's a lot of non compliance, meaning like

491
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:45,960
Speaker 1: if you raise money from the public and and that

492
00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:51,560
Speaker 1: public is anticipating based on your efforts, UH, some profit

493
00:25:52,200 --> 00:25:55,320
Speaker 1: that comes into the securities laws. We at the SEC

494
00:25:55,400 --> 00:25:58,359
Speaker 1: are going to do what we can. But right now

495
00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:03,600
Speaker 1: there's far too many of these platforms that haven't come

496
00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:08,280
Speaker 1: in uh to basically comply with the law and register.

497
00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:26,560
Speaker 1: When you look back, there was very little self regulation. Uh.

498
00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:33,320
Speaker 1: There was inane risk management where companies took massive leverage,

499
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:36,880
Speaker 1: took asset liability mismatch, which means they had short term

500
00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:39,879
Speaker 1: deposits they lent them out long. I mean, those are

501
00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:46,240
Speaker 1: the two ways people always go bankrupt. Galaxy Digitals, Mike

502
00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:48,960
Speaker 1: novograts they're saying crypto companies might have needed to better

503
00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:52,040
Speaker 1: self regulate. He was at the Bloomber Crypto summer earlier

504
00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:55,080
Speaker 1: in New York, along with coin bases out of the

505
00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:59,000
Speaker 1: US policy. Cara Calvert, who joins US now to unpack

506
00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:03,160
Speaker 1: it all, also look a couple of competing narratives here, Kara.

507
00:27:03,520 --> 00:27:06,560
Speaker 1: One that there is regulation, this according to the Chair

508
00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:11,600
Speaker 1: of the SEC former Chair of the SEC, but that

509
00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:16,280
Speaker 1: companies aren't listening, aren't coming forward. What do you think

510
00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:19,480
Speaker 1: well a coin base. We actually have really founded ourselves

511
00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:21,840
Speaker 1: and pride ourselves on and on being compliant on being

512
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:24,160
Speaker 1: the trust and most secure, and so we are regulated

513
00:27:24,160 --> 00:27:26,520
Speaker 1: by more than forty two state forty two state licenses.

514
00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:28,640
Speaker 1: We have a bit license, we have a trust charter,

515
00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:31,560
Speaker 1: so we actually view ourselves as very well regulated. We

516
00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:34,760
Speaker 1: are regulated at the federal level by CFTC, by the SEC.

517
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:36,879
Speaker 1: We have a dormant broker dealer license. Two of them

518
00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:39,440
Speaker 1: actually were regulated by SINS and so we actually think

519
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:41,959
Speaker 1: that there is a regulatory framework in place that is

520
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:44,960
Speaker 1: that is pretty effective. But we think really what we

521
00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:46,960
Speaker 1: need to do is make sure that we modernize those

522
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:49,600
Speaker 1: rules and bring them into into a space that can

523
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:53,520
Speaker 1: really and truly understand the technological capabilities of blockchain and

524
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:57,679
Speaker 1: digital assets and actually help consumers achieve and understand those benefits. So,

525
00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:01,480
Speaker 1: if those rules were modernized, do you think that the

526
00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:04,960
Speaker 1: spectacular crash we've just seen could have been avoided? The

527
00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:07,600
Speaker 1: collapse of you know, a major crypto hedge fund, a

528
00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:10,919
Speaker 1: major crypto lender, could have been avoided. I think it's

529
00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:13,159
Speaker 1: difficult to predict what may have happened, but I do

530
00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:15,919
Speaker 1: think that there certainly if we had clear rules of

531
00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:18,920
Speaker 1: the road for all different types of the all different

532
00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:21,639
Speaker 1: companies engaged in the crypto ecosystem. We certainly would have

533
00:28:21,680 --> 00:28:24,800
Speaker 1: more clarity where it comes to disclosures or um certain

534
00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:27,200
Speaker 1: requirements on how on you know, how you may address

535
00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:29,840
Speaker 1: different business risks or different needs. What we saw through

536
00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:32,400
Speaker 1: the recent volatility is that the issue is really a

537
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:35,960
Speaker 1: credit problem, not a crypto problem. And so what we're

538
00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:38,360
Speaker 1: hoping for again is these consistent rules that will help

539
00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:41,480
Speaker 1: consumers understand what they're getting into when they have crypto,

540
00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:44,360
Speaker 1: and that you have businesses and and innovators and new

541
00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:46,520
Speaker 1: projects that can come to the table and instead of

542
00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:49,600
Speaker 1: hiring a team of lawyers to comply with what can

543
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:52,080
Speaker 1: be considered some vague rules, and so they can go

544
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:54,320
Speaker 1: out and innovate and create the next big thing for consumers.

545
00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:58,520
Speaker 1: There's a crypto bill being pushed by Senators Lummis and

546
00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:02,320
Speaker 1: Jilla Brand. I actually recently spoke with both of them

547
00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:05,360
Speaker 1: about the bill and why they think this could be

548
00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:08,040
Speaker 1: the answer to take a listen to this from Senator Lamas.

549
00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:13,960
Speaker 1: The bill in one piece, as a total bill is

550
00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:18,720
Speaker 1: more likely to be deferred until next year. Uh, it's

551
00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:22,560
Speaker 1: a it's a big topic, it's comprehensive, and it's still

552
00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:26,520
Speaker 1: new to many U S. Senators. Do you like this

553
00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:28,959
Speaker 1: legislation and do you think it will pass? I'm so

554
00:29:29,080 --> 00:29:31,480
Speaker 1: really glad you yus this legislation for two reasons. One,

555
00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:33,600
Speaker 1: I'm from the great state of Wyoming, so i hold

556
00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:36,120
Speaker 1: all the work that Senator Lamas is doing very near

557
00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:38,080
Speaker 1: and dear to my heart, and so does my grandmother,

558
00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:39,680
Speaker 1: who turns on her and two and still lives there.

559
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:42,120
Speaker 1: She she very much believes in it. So I really

560
00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:45,640
Speaker 1: appreciate Senator lemass work for the Cowboy State. Second, this

561
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:48,640
Speaker 1: bill is by far and away the most comprehensive, detailed.

562
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:52,480
Speaker 1: Really the intellectual rigor that was put into building it

563
00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:54,560
Speaker 1: is really impressive, and I think it will create very

564
00:29:54,600 --> 00:29:58,320
Speaker 1: much a foundation for for future legislation. And I think

565
00:29:58,360 --> 00:30:00,680
Speaker 1: she's right that at the end of the day, legislation

566
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:02,680
Speaker 1: can take a very long time to get across the

567
00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:05,920
Speaker 1: finish line. And this is very complex. Her bill includes

568
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:10,680
Speaker 1: CFCC juristiction sec juristiction, tax reform, it includes UM sections

569
00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:13,800
Speaker 1: on stable coins. It's very complex and putting this puzzle

570
00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:17,560
Speaker 1: together will take time. A lot of different committees leadership,

571
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:20,240
Speaker 1: It will take the administration. So once we get all

572
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:22,440
Speaker 1: these pieces together, I do think we're set up for

573
00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:26,160
Speaker 1: success in the coming year. Coin Base is very much

574
00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:29,000
Speaker 1: aspiring to be a global company, and cryptos, you know,

575
00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:32,200
Speaker 1: certainly a global market. Are other companies, excuse me, other

576
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:35,680
Speaker 1: governments doing this better than the US or are they

577
00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 1: ahead of the US on regulation? Some of the countries

578
00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:41,960
Speaker 1: actually are, I think ahead of where the U S is.

579
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:44,240
Speaker 1: And part of that is is by just by by

580
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:45,920
Speaker 1: nature of the fact that they may be set up

581
00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:47,920
Speaker 1: with a with a single regulator, for example in the

582
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 1: UK or in in this instance of EU, they're actually

583
00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:54,640
Speaker 1: putting forward a very comprehensive approach to digital assets. We're

584
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:59,320
Speaker 1: seeing additional work in India, in Singapore, and Japan and Australia,

585
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:01,400
Speaker 1: so they're a lot of different countries that are coming

586
00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:04,480
Speaker 1: to the table and working with stakeholders and industry participants

587
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:07,920
Speaker 1: and consumers to understand what the impact of digital assets are.

588
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:10,080
Speaker 1: I think that's where we need to get in terms

589
00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:14,000
Speaker 1: of the United States, is really creating a rulemaking process

590
00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:17,520
Speaker 1: and going through a regulatory process that's transparent, that is

591
00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:21,400
Speaker 1: engaging stakeholders. It's thinking about both retail and institution and

592
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:23,360
Speaker 1: really how we can move for in a way that's

593
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:26,479
Speaker 1: really includes all of the different viewpoints. That's what we're

594
00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:29,120
Speaker 1: missing in the United States right now. Alright, Coin based

595
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:32,120
Speaker 1: head of US policy Karat Calibert, thanks for giving us

596
00:31:32,160 --> 00:31:44,640
Speaker 1: your view. In this week's Teconomics, Controlling a computer with

597
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:46,960
Speaker 1: your brain. This might sound like something out of a

598
00:31:47,000 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 1: sci fi movie, but the technology already exists, and for

599
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:55,400
Speaker 1: the first time, a brain computer interface device has been

600
00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:59,880
Speaker 1: implanted into the brain of a US patient. Sanchron is

601
00:31:59,880 --> 00:32:02,080
Speaker 1: the company that makes it, and its founder Tom Arksley

602
00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:06,000
Speaker 1: joins us now with more So, who is this patient

603
00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:08,920
Speaker 1: and why did they decide to do this? Tom. We're

604
00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:11,520
Speaker 1: not talking too much about the patient, Emily out of

605
00:32:11,680 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 1: his respect for privacy, but I can say it's a

606
00:32:14,360 --> 00:32:18,640
Speaker 1: patient that has a severe paralysis due to a LS

607
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:21,400
Speaker 1: and he is not able to use his hands, he's

608
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:25,320
Speaker 1: not able to speak, and he depends on assistive technologies

609
00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:28,720
Speaker 1: to communicate with his family and friends, and he's looking

610
00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:31,480
Speaker 1: for a way to improve that capability. So how will

611
00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:34,920
Speaker 1: this implant help him? The concept with a b c

612
00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:38,640
Speaker 1: I is essentially the idea that we have become dependent

613
00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:42,680
Speaker 1: on digital devices to engage with the world that there's

614
00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:45,640
Speaker 1: a part of the brain that controls our fingers. We

615
00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:48,200
Speaker 1: use our fingers to do point and click. And if

616
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:50,240
Speaker 1: we can go straight to the source in the brain

617
00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:53,480
Speaker 1: that controls the intention to do point and click, put

618
00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:56,400
Speaker 1: a sensor in there. You can decode the information out

619
00:32:56,400 --> 00:32:58,640
Speaker 1: of the brain and then control point and click without

620
00:32:58,680 --> 00:33:01,120
Speaker 1: the need for your hands. Do that comes ditically from

621
00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:03,320
Speaker 1: the brain. What are you hoping to learn from this

622
00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:08,120
Speaker 1: patient's experience? This has been a long journey the we

623
00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:11,120
Speaker 1: became the first company to get a IDEA approval from

624
00:33:11,120 --> 00:33:13,880
Speaker 1: the FDA to conduct the study of a permanently implanted

625
00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:17,840
Speaker 1: b c I. We're still primarily focused on safety, but

626
00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:21,720
Speaker 1: we're now starting to test out the how we measure efficacy.

627
00:33:21,840 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 1: So the FDA has publicly stated that it's not obvious

628
00:33:25,200 --> 00:33:28,240
Speaker 1: how we would quantify the effectiveness of the b c I,

629
00:33:28,680 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 1: and we're starting to test out some of those parameters

630
00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:34,560
Speaker 1: with a view towards preparing that packet for FDA approval

631
00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:37,800
Speaker 1: and then going to commercial launch. Now, as I understand it,

632
00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:41,920
Speaker 1: your technology is ahead of what Elon Musk has accomplished

633
00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:46,040
Speaker 1: so far at Neuralink. How how much farther ahead, and

634
00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:48,080
Speaker 1: how is what you're trying to do different than what

635
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:50,239
Speaker 1: he is trying to do. I would say we're at

636
00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:53,920
Speaker 1: the beginning of a renaissance of brain science, and I

637
00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:56,680
Speaker 1: think this is going to be a huge problem that's

638
00:33:56,680 --> 00:33:59,640
Speaker 1: solved for many, many patients, and there are many ways

639
00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:02,160
Speaker 1: to try to solve the problem. The way that we're

640
00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:04,920
Speaker 1: doing it is going into the brain through the blood vessels.

641
00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:08,400
Speaker 1: Were on a particular path with FDA, and we've been

642
00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:11,760
Speaker 1: able to leverage decades of knowledge around safety of leaving

643
00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:14,759
Speaker 1: devices in blood vessels um and the way that we

644
00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:17,520
Speaker 1: can expect the body to react to that. So it's

645
00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:20,560
Speaker 1: a different approach. It's a big problem, and I think

646
00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 1: there are going to be many approaches needed. But we're

647
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:26,120
Speaker 1: excited to be finally getting into the clinical stage in

648
00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:29,960
Speaker 1: the US, after you know, five years of discussion with

649
00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:34,359
Speaker 1: FDA and demonstration of safety and testing about our technology.

650
00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:36,560
Speaker 1: So who do you imagine we'll be doing this in

651
00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:40,760
Speaker 1: the nearer term future and in the longer term future.

652
00:34:40,840 --> 00:34:45,759
Speaker 1: Is this something that you see anyone opting to do well?

653
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 1: I think paralysis is a massive problem. We probably all

654
00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:53,560
Speaker 1: know someone who's lost the ability to use their hands, strokes,

655
00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:59,560
Speaker 1: spinal cord injury, als, muscular distribute multiple sclerosis, um many

656
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:02,759
Speaker 1: condition and make our body ineffective while our brain is

657
00:35:02,800 --> 00:35:06,360
Speaker 1: still working. So our big focus is to show that

658
00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:10,360
Speaker 1: this technology is effective for the for a patient population initially,

659
00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:12,560
Speaker 1: and I think the way I think about where this

660
00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:15,160
Speaker 1: technology is going, it's going to be something like lasic.

661
00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:19,160
Speaker 1: It's an elective procedure. It helps you engage with technology more,

662
00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:23,080
Speaker 1: you reconnect with the world, you overcome physical disabilities, and

663
00:35:23,120 --> 00:35:27,080
Speaker 1: you re establish a digital um digital your digital world.

664
00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:30,960
Speaker 1: So you think that in the future, putting a device

665
00:35:31,080 --> 00:35:33,839
Speaker 1: inside your brain will be as easy and simple and

666
00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:38,600
Speaker 1: desirable as getting lasic eye surgery. Well, lasic eye surgery

667
00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:41,720
Speaker 1: is a minor procedure, still a laser on your eyeball.

668
00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:44,080
Speaker 1: It comes with risk, and it takes a couple of hours.

669
00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:47,239
Speaker 1: It's in a day procedure unit. That's the type of

670
00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:51,120
Speaker 1: position that are putting in stents and pacemakers are using

671
00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:53,799
Speaker 1: the same technology that would be putting in a brain

672
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:56,600
Speaker 1: computer interface if it goes through the blood vessels. So

673
00:35:56,640 --> 00:35:59,640
Speaker 1: that's a cat lab and they thousands of them across

674
00:35:59,640 --> 00:36:01,960
Speaker 1: the country, tree with many many physicians who can perform

675
00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:04,960
Speaker 1: the procedure. It's a day procedure. It's invisible to the

676
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:08,759
Speaker 1: outside world, and it helps you reconnect and it offsets

677
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:11,319
Speaker 1: our you know, all of the things that come with

678
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:14,560
Speaker 1: the human body that can fail for a number of reasons.

679
00:36:15,120 --> 00:36:18,799
Speaker 1: Absolutely fascinating. I understand you've done this a handful of

680
00:36:18,840 --> 00:36:23,400
Speaker 1: times in Australia to date, but your first US patient

681
00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:27,239
Speaker 1: now has a syn chron brain implant. We'll we'll keep

682
00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:31,719
Speaker 1: following your progress, Tom Sinn Chrong founder Tom Oxley, thank

683
00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:34,040
Speaker 1: you for joining us. That does it for this edition

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00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:37,600
Speaker 1: of Bloomberg Technology. Don't forget to check out our podcast.

685
00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:40,920
Speaker 1: You can find it wherever you get your podcast. As always,

686
00:36:41,040 --> 00:36:43,960
Speaker 1: I'm Emily Changing in San Francisco. This is Bloomberg