Speaker 1: Hey, what a welkoman. I'm Doug gottlie This is All Ball.
Speaker 2: Listen.
Speaker 3: We've been doing all ball now for like five years.
Speaker 3: I even have players like Dude, I listen to all Ball.
Speaker 3: So we'll continue with the storytelling. We're gonna start pumping
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Speaker 3: Doug Gottlieb Show is daily three to five Eastern twelve
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Speaker 1: He continues on, there's a podcast for that as well.
Speaker 3: A lot going on in international hoops, not as much
Speaker 3: NBA hoops, and obviously some in college hoops.
Speaker 4: I'll just kind of.
Speaker 1: Give you an update of where I am, where Green
Speaker 1: Bay hoops is. We have.
Speaker 3: Twelve twelve committed scholarship players, nine of whom are on campus,
Speaker 3: and then we have a gaggle of recruited walk ons
Speaker 3: as well, and it's been fascinating. You know, do I
Speaker 3: I don't have experience, but I do have a lot
Speaker 3: of kind of athletic talent, maybe some basketball talent, and
Speaker 3: trying to kind of mold that and matriculate it towards
Speaker 3: getting getting it ready for November fourth, when we play
Speaker 3: our first game. It has been a challenge and it's
Speaker 3: really interesting, right Like people tell you all the time
Speaker 3: the challenges of being a college basketball coach.
Speaker 1: You know, I've heard different ratios.
Speaker 3: Seventy five percent is not coaching, ninety percent is not coaching.
Speaker 3: I would say it's in the sixty percent is not coaching.
Speaker 3: But again, what I feel like is if you as
Speaker 3: coaching isn't just the basketball thing, it's the managing people.
Speaker 1: It's the managing their time.
Speaker 3: It's the getting them, you know, blending the how much
Speaker 3: time do I have them in the gym, how much
Speaker 3: time do I have them in the workout in the
Speaker 3: weight room? How much time do they put into workouts?
Speaker 3: And then how do we blend it with school as well?
Speaker 3: But there is definitely challenges at this level because you
Speaker 3: just don't have the numbers of people helping you out,
Speaker 3: so you have to do things on your own, which
Speaker 3: I love, but as somebody who never says no to anything,
Speaker 3: it does become a lot. But it's been incredibly enjoyable.
Speaker 3: I like my group, like I love my group as
Speaker 3: human beings.
Speaker 1: I like my group.
Speaker 3: I know, I think we've pretty much identified our weaknesses
Speaker 3: and some of our strengths, and I think trying to
Speaker 3: highlight our strengths and minimize our weaknesses is kind of
Speaker 3: the challenge of the next couple of months. But we've
Speaker 3: we have one week left of workouts, and what I've
Speaker 3: committed to doing is playing a full game today and
Speaker 3: playing a full game next week as well, just so
Speaker 3: guys get the feel of competing for for informative wars.
Speaker 3: Understanding TV timeouts, understanding locking in at a timeout, and
Speaker 3: how you know what we're going to run, how we're
Speaker 3: going to defend out of a timeout is incredibly important.
Speaker 1: And really we spend time trying to.
Speaker 3: Teach everything, and my thought on teaching everything, and this
Speaker 3: really comes from coaching youth basketball, and I'll fully admit
Speaker 3: my younger group, so they were I started coaching a
Speaker 3: fourth grade B team, and then the next year I
Speaker 3: had another fourth grade team, which my son was he
Speaker 3: was playing out before, and then he was playing at
Speaker 3: the right level. I would get upset at things that
Speaker 3: I had lightly coached, but I hadn't really taught them
Speaker 3: in a practice, and like, here's The biggest challenge I
Speaker 3: think for coaches is you can't hold players accountable for
Speaker 3: something you have not told them when I try and
Speaker 3: coach the way I want to be coached, Like, hey,
Speaker 3: if you don't listen and pay attention, that's on you.
Speaker 3: But if I don't coach it and then I assume
Speaker 3: that you can do it in the game or you know,
Speaker 3: in a.
Speaker 1: Situation, that's on me.
Speaker 3: So we've tried to go through the summer and teach
Speaker 3: as many little things as possible. You know, don't take
Speaker 3: the ball out underneath the basket. Where are the hashmarks
Speaker 3: on the floor? You know, where's the alley, where's the slot?
Speaker 3: Where's the top of the key? Why do we want
Speaker 3: the ball at the top of the key? Because there's
Speaker 3: no help side all of these different things. And it's
Speaker 3: it's fun, like it's it's incredibly fun. And to answer
Speaker 3: the the the question how good do you think you'd be?
Speaker 3: I have no idea zero, And honestly, I don't care.
Speaker 3: I don't I want my team to play good basketball.
Speaker 3: I want my team to get better. I want them
Speaker 3: to look better next week than they do this week.
Speaker 3: And I think we've accomplished it. Every week, we've looked better,
Speaker 3: and you know, then we'll figure out when we throw
Speaker 3: them into the deep end with somebody's guaranteed games and
Speaker 3: even some of the non guarantee music are games, hard games.
Speaker 3: And I do this where I look at our schedule, like, dude,
Speaker 3: we're going against really good coaches. So it's going to
Speaker 3: be hard for me first year. But I'll learn and
Speaker 3: we'll adjust and we'll get it right. So my staff
Speaker 3: continues to grow, and I want to welcome in Jordan McKay. Now, Jordan,
Speaker 3: we'll have him tell the entirety of his story over
Speaker 3: the next couple podcasts, but the first part of his
Speaker 3: story is he's on my staff.
Speaker 1: Obviously, been on Instagram.
Speaker 3: Superstar for years. Started really he was the guy who
Speaker 3: made Ball of his life something you had to go
Speaker 3: and watch, like, who is this kid from Wisconsin? Holy shit,
Speaker 3: he can handle the baldy pass it and he's got
Speaker 3: some shit to him right. He was like the new
Speaker 3: Jason Williams. And he is the only holdover from Sundance
Speaker 3: Wick's staff. Now, Sonny had just hired him like a
Speaker 3: week before I got the job, and the.
Speaker 1: Whole thing made sense to me.
Speaker 3: And he's not on the recording yet, so I'll just
Speaker 3: tell you he's super impressive, Like he's twenty five going
Speaker 3: on forty, just has a good balance about him, good
Speaker 3: understanding of him, you know, still a little impulsive, as
Speaker 3: so much of us are in our youth. There was
Speaker 3: a player who when I first got here, he's like,
Speaker 3: we got to take this kid, coach, And I have
Speaker 3: total faith in my assistance, like they tell me I
Speaker 3: got to take somebody.
Speaker 1: So it's like, let me watch every Synergy clip we
Speaker 1: have on him. So he watched and I was like, like,
Speaker 1: what don't you like.
Speaker 3: I was like, well, here's what I value and here's
Speaker 3: how what he does. And after that it's been a
Speaker 3: great relationship. And part of it is you have to
Speaker 3: tell people what you're looking for, what you want, and
Speaker 3: again like I have no doubt that some of the
Speaker 3: guys that I want that we brought in that I
Speaker 3: personally evaluated, may not fit, may not be good enough,
Speaker 3: or may not fit. So it's all learning and evaluating process.
Speaker 3: But Jordan star in any business, but especially in this business,
Speaker 3: he'll be a star. I think he'll be a head
Speaker 3: coach within two three years. Because one obviously every kid
Speaker 3: that we go recruit knows him. He's really good with
Speaker 3: the players, at coaching him mentally, emotionally, beating the shit
Speaker 3: out of him, but also like that kissing their ass
Speaker 3: just there was a realness to it.
Speaker 1: And his youth is a strength and he's like me,
Speaker 1: he's up with the crack of ass.
Speaker 3: Now he does go to bed early, which I don't
Speaker 3: really understand, but that's what happens when year twenty five. Anyway,
Speaker 3: let's welcome in. He's Jordan McCabe. We'll talk about Jay
Speaker 3: five's nickname.
Speaker 1: He joins me. Now an all ball as we bring
Speaker 1: in my guest for today.
Speaker 3: He's also one of my assistant coaches and he's he's
Speaker 3: an ig icon as well.
Speaker 1: He's the one and only j five.
Speaker 3: Jordan McCabe joins me, and I just want to get
Speaker 3: your opinion real quick on the I guess it's a
Speaker 3: controversy which has now kind of been muted a little
Speaker 3: bit with Jason Tatum not playing in the first game.
Speaker 3: Terry's Alburton also didn't play in the first games, Like
Speaker 3: no one.
Speaker 1: Even mentioned that, right, and I get it.
Speaker 3: He wasn't first team All NBA's team didn't win an
Speaker 3: be a championship, but Terry's Alberton was an star and
Speaker 3: literally didn't play a minute and no one said a
Speaker 3: word about it, which brings me to a bunch of
Speaker 3: other stuff. Additionally, Game two, Jason Tatum starts and Joel
Speaker 3: Embiid doesn't play a minute, and again very little chatter
Speaker 3: about as they dominate South Sudan. Let me just first
Speaker 3: get kind of get your thoughts. You watched, I know,
Speaker 3: both games. What do you think of the fact that
Speaker 3: that Steve Kerr didn't use Tatum, didn't use Haliburton in
Speaker 3: Game one?
Speaker 4: So I think there's two ends of every spectrum, right,
Speaker 4: Like I think you coach pee wee basketball and you're like,
Speaker 4: I just need two or three guys who can make
Speaker 4: a basket, and then you have USA Basketball where it's
Speaker 4: like I have way too many guys who can wait
Speaker 4: make way too many baskets, and I don't know how
Speaker 4: I'm gonna make this work. So anybody who you know
Speaker 4: wanted to be a Twitter coach on Game one, I
Speaker 4: don't think realizes, you know, the actual challenge there is
Speaker 4: on that end of the spectrum with having World Cup
Speaker 4: class basketball players all the way down here. Last guy
Speaker 4: and it's like any other team. It's like any other game.
Speaker 4: There's only so many minutes and so many rotations that
Speaker 4: make sense.
Speaker 1: Totally true, you know, it's interesting.
Speaker 3: So when I coached Maccabi games in Israel, and again
Speaker 3: I'll start with the premise, I think everybody knows.
Speaker 1: I'm in no way comparing.
Speaker 3: My guys for Maccabi USA with Jason Tatum and Terry's
Speaker 3: Halberd and Joel embiid okay, but the issue still remains
Speaker 3: the same. You have twelve guys you want to get in.
Speaker 3: They're of similar competent talent levels, and you have forty
Speaker 3: minutes in a FEBA game. And oh yeah, by the way, like,
Speaker 3: here's the biggest similarity in the two right, the trying
Speaker 3: to play everybody thing is a big thing. But the
Speaker 3: only thing worse than not getting guys in is losing. Like,
Speaker 3: if you lose, it's the end of the world. It's
Speaker 3: everybody's caught us, You're an idiot. No one blames the players,
Speaker 3: everybody blames the coach. So the first and most important
Speaker 3: thing is to understand when you're coaching, here's how I feel.
Speaker 1: And this is going to be.
Speaker 3: A challenge for us going forward, going to your bench
Speaker 3: can be a great thing, but it's a lot like
Speaker 3: every time you go into surgery, every time you open
Speaker 3: somebody up, there's the chance of something going wrong, of
Speaker 3: changing momentum.
Speaker 1: For the worse.
Speaker 3: Right, It's it's like that's what they say about guys
Speaker 3: that have had ten knee surgeries.
Speaker 1: Right, It's like, look, every.
Speaker 3: Time we want to fix something, but every time you
Speaker 3: going to fix something, you know you can get a
Speaker 3: bacterial infection, you can screw up something else. You know
Speaker 3: you can get scar tissue. Like there is a good
Speaker 3: to fixing it, which you can with subbing. Guy gets tired.
Speaker 3: But you also you change the matchups, you can change momentum.
Speaker 3: And I'll just tell you I love the feeble rules.
Speaker 3: But it's a much more free flowing game. There's a
Speaker 3: lot less stoppages, and there's four less minutes and a
Speaker 3: half eight less minutes a game. And then the last
Speaker 3: part is like as embarrassing as some people make it
Speaker 3: out to be to not play. Jason Tatum and tyres
Speaker 3: Halburton also consider the you get to the fourth quarter,
Speaker 3: you're up twenty, and you know it's more embarrassing than
Speaker 3: that is putting them in garbage time, like it's actually
Speaker 3: worse to go and like, hey man, you want to
Speaker 3: go get five minutes like namm good. You know, especially
Speaker 3: when a guy has never done that in his life
Speaker 3: and they all feel like they're going to get hurt,
Speaker 3: They feel like they embarrassed. It does embarrass them and
Speaker 3: it feels like it embarrassed themselves. Whereas if you just
Speaker 3: go like, hey, this is part of our plan. Kevin
Speaker 3: Durant played way better than we thought and we just
Speaker 3: went with a ten man rotation, like, got it understood.
Speaker 4: So the good news for Steve Kerr is that, you know,
Speaker 4: unlike AU, I don't think John Haliburt and ty Reese's
Speaker 4: dad called Steve Kerr and flipped out on him. You know,
Speaker 4: That's that's what happens in AAU is that dad calls
Speaker 4: and little little Timmy didn't play, and hey, you start
Speaker 4: little Timmy next game, or maybe you won't get the
Speaker 4: fund in for your jerseys next year, so Steve doesn't
Speaker 4: have to worry about that.
Speaker 3: And like you said, it's the hardest shit, the hardest shit,
Speaker 3: and you're like or the or the hey my kid
Speaker 3: came to every practice.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like Yeah, your kid's not as good as you
Speaker 1: other kid.
Speaker 4: He needs five times more practices than we actually hold.
Speaker 1: His four or your kid.
Speaker 3: Every time he came in, he shot the ball, you know,
Speaker 3: because he is you know, he actually made it worse
Speaker 3: and made it made it, made it better. Speaking of which, uh,
Speaker 3: how how close in age your same age is, tyres
Speaker 3: aren't you?
Speaker 4: Yeah? Tyrese and I grew up playing in the same
Speaker 4: conference in Northeast Wisconsin high school basketball. You can, uh
Speaker 4: if you even believe that?
Speaker 1: Did you did you see this? Did you know this
Speaker 1: was was coming from him?
Speaker 4: No? And I would tell him that too, And I
Speaker 4: think that's what he'd probably smile when he heard me
Speaker 4: say no. If anybody knew that he had this level
Speaker 4: of capability was him and only him, especially when he
Speaker 4: was young in high school. He was super lanky, he
Speaker 4: was kind of positionless. His shot was funky, but you know,
Speaker 4: it went in just like it it does now, And
Speaker 4: he knew that but didn't care like that was theful
Speaker 4: thing about Tyreese. The best thing about Tyreee is not
Speaker 4: like the level of basketball player he is. The level
Speaker 4: of human being that man is is unbelievable.
Speaker 1: He's always like, like me, give me example.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so, like, I don't think I've ever seen him
Speaker 4: not smile during a game of basketball, and we were
Speaker 4: in some of the most heated competitive games high school
Speaker 4: games in the area. I don't have a specific example,
Speaker 4: but oh, actually I do. So I had a nonprofit
Speaker 4: organization that we tried to help out some families. We're
Speaker 4: going to do another one here soon in Wisconsin, and
Speaker 4: it was a skills clinic for little kids, and we're
Speaker 4: going to raise money all this stuff. The first person
Speaker 4: I called was Tyrese Alberton because at the time, like
Speaker 4: I was close with him, he was a big name.
Speaker 4: He was starting to kind of gain momentum towards the
Speaker 4: end of his high school career, and he was all in,
Speaker 4: Like he was like, you can take my whole Saturday Sunday,
Speaker 4: let's go do this thing. Ended up raising over like
Speaker 4: fifty grand as some high schoolers just for a family
Speaker 4: that was in need. So that's one one example of Tyres.
Speaker 4: But yeah, he was unbelievable, especially when he got to
Speaker 4: the right spot at Iowa State. Like that was the
Speaker 4: decision maker that in USA basketball took him to a
Speaker 4: completely different level. He was Gatoraye Player of the Year
Speaker 4: in the state. He was really good. Not trying to
Speaker 4: discredit his high school career, but the Olympics, like I don't.
Speaker 4: I don't think anybody from our area when he was
Speaker 4: a sophomore, and I think Tyree would agree, would say
Speaker 4: that's an Olympic basketball player right there. He's a top
Speaker 4: you know, twenty guy in the world, like I never
Speaker 4: not at that time, not at that time.
Speaker 1: It's the whole thing is fascinating. Okay.
Speaker 3: So, and I want to circle back to your story
Speaker 3: as well, but just on Ontario.
Speaker 1: So when you you guys are exact same year in
Speaker 1: high school, correct?
Speaker 4: Correct? Yep?
Speaker 1: Okay, So, who was at Marquette as their point guard?
Speaker 4: Went on visit? I think Howard was that towards the
Speaker 4: end of my career.
Speaker 3: Marcus Howard not because then you're a college career, high
Speaker 3: school career, my high school career, right, So Marcus Howards
Speaker 3: is starting point guard, so and he's not going he
Speaker 3: wasn't going anywhere, right And then do Wisconsin offer you both?
Speaker 4: Oh? Good question on tyresee, Wisconsin did all not offer me?
Speaker 4: And I committed after my sophomore year, going into my
Speaker 4: junior so they did not offer me.
Speaker 1: Why so early?
Speaker 4: You know what, I was always like a super impulsive kid,
Speaker 4: like I think this is one of the ways, like
Speaker 4: the whole prefrontal cortex thing like seven years ago is
Speaker 4: not that far from me, but completely different processing system
Speaker 4: up top. Now I had a big twelve offer. I
Speaker 4: was stoked about it. All I could think about was
Speaker 4: I could get to play Kansas. I didn't think about, Hey,
Speaker 4: you know they're a defensive minded program, right, and you
Speaker 4: don't play defense that well, if at all, in high school, right,
Speaker 4: So all I could think about was the level and
Speaker 4: the lights and all that stuff. And I always tell
Speaker 4: people like I was going to make it fit. Every
Speaker 4: recruit we talked to on the phone is like, oh,
Speaker 4: what are you looking for? I'm looking for the right fit. Well,
Speaker 4: the problem is when you're sixteen and seventeen and you're
Speaker 4: a square peg in West Virginia's a round hole, you're
Speaker 4: so stubborn. I'm so call it egotistical. I'm like, I'll
Speaker 4: make it work, I'll make it fit. And it did it,
Speaker 4: you know so I just made a very quick and
Speaker 4: rash decision, but maybe it was the best one. I
Speaker 4: met my fiance. I have lifelong friends and relationships in
Speaker 4: West Virginia. I'll go back to Morgantown whenever I can.
Speaker 4: My first job was there, Like sure, from a plane perspective,
Speaker 4: horrible idea. I can admit that now, and I tell
Speaker 4: Hugs to his face. Pretty sure I have told him
Speaker 4: at some point. But I love him to death, and
Speaker 4: I love the city to death. And I'm here where
Speaker 4: I am now. So that was kind of the decision.
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Speaker 2: to listen live. Did you did you play any other
Speaker 2: sports growing up? Because I know you hate baseball. You
Speaker 2: made that abundantly clear.
Speaker 1: You have no time for baseball. Do you play anything
Speaker 1: else going up?
Speaker 4: Nobody has time for baseball? Like that's the biggest thing,
Speaker 4: is the time, contrade. So I played little league baseball.
Speaker 4: Didn't love the whole like you know, thirty five percent
Speaker 4: is good. I was crying a lot, throwing stuff. Remember
Speaker 4: prefrontal cortex not all the way there yet, So quit baseball.
Speaker 4: Stuck with football through Pop Warner got reprimanded and Pop
Speaker 4: Warner had a meeting with the commissioner for swearing at
Speaker 4: that age. Wasn't okay.
Speaker 1: I thought, what age?
Speaker 4: What is Pop Warner? I would have been probably like
Speaker 4: eight eight ish seven eight nine, But I mean, I
Speaker 4: mean just bad routes and lack of communication among our
Speaker 4: whole group. And you know, when we got back in
Speaker 4: the huddle, I'd let people have.
Speaker 3: It reprimanded by the commissioner. I played, I played, it
Speaker 3: was it was junior American. I played Pop Warner just
Speaker 3: my eighth grade year.
Speaker 1: I played all growing up. I love football.
Speaker 3: What position, mostly quarterback, a little running back. My first
Speaker 3: year though, playing when I was seven, I played on
Speaker 3: the Orange Raiders the eighties, and I played like I
Speaker 3: was like the littlest kind of team. I played like noseguard,
Speaker 3: and literally that my job was like the ball was
Speaker 3: snapped and I would even try and dive underneath the
Speaker 3: legs of the center to tackle the quarterback to just
Speaker 3: get a foot, you know, just kind of like sneak
Speaker 3: in there.
Speaker 1: And I never got the ball.
Speaker 3: And then my second year, I was swear to god,
Speaker 3: I got pictures to back it up.
Speaker 1: I was on the Orange Packers and I was the
Speaker 1: I was the quarterback and it was awesome. I got named.
Speaker 3: Larry Powers was my coach and the seven to eight
Speaker 3: year olds, which is this youngest division. They always played
Speaker 3: the nine AM games. Nine AM games had eight AM wayans,
Speaker 3: so he'd pick me up from my house. This is
Speaker 3: probably so my dad was either still coaching or they
Speaker 3: had just gotten fought when. It's probably the year they
Speaker 3: goten fired at at Yeah, it was probably the year
Speaker 3: they got fired at Lombey State, so he went up
Speaker 3: to Oregon State for a year. I was like a
Speaker 3: volunteer assistant, so I didn't you know. My mom had
Speaker 3: two other kids at home, and Larry Powers would pick
Speaker 3: me up at seven o'clock. We go to the donut shop,
Speaker 3: have donuts and talk game plan strategy, and then we
Speaker 3: go to the weigh ins and then play. And then
Speaker 3: I'd sit around the football field all day and then
Speaker 3: wait for my brother to show up. My brother played
Speaker 3: in a later game, watching cheer for his game, and
Speaker 3: then my mom would takes all home where we'd go
Speaker 3: to like a.
Speaker 1: Pizza party, you know, all that kind of stuff. So
Speaker 1: I love football. I did love playing baseball.
Speaker 3: The funny thing about football was my dad was convinced
Speaker 3: that I would be too small to play back, which
Speaker 3: at that in that era I was, and I was
Speaker 3: a late growing up that I grew to be huge.
Speaker 3: But the funny part was like, I'm going to play
Speaker 3: basketball and not play football because I was too small,
Speaker 3: which is again that's the old basketball coach is mine.
Speaker 1: So when did you specialize in hoops?
Speaker 4: It was around probably like ten nine, ten years old.
Speaker 4: I kicked. I kicked all of them. I remember vividly
Speaker 4: having a conversation with Jason Otter, who I attested pretty
Speaker 4: much all my player development stuff. The only reason I'm
Speaker 4: able to I was able to have a college career
Speaker 4: at the level I did was because of Jason Otter.
Speaker 4: And he came out. We were living in Seattle, and
Speaker 4: we sat down in the living room and he looked
Speaker 4: at me and he said, how bad do you want this?
Speaker 4: He's a psycho, by the way, like complete. He's talking
Speaker 4: to a ten year old right now. He's like, how
Speaker 4: bad do you want this? I was just sitting there
Speaker 4: watching MTV on my what He's like, how bad do
Speaker 4: you want basketball? And I said I want really bad.
Speaker 4: He's like, well, I need you to do a couple
Speaker 4: of things for me. Number one, no more football, You're done.
Speaker 4: And I was like, okay. He's like, you're gonna need
Speaker 4: all year. You're too small. He's like, you're not fast,
Speaker 4: you can't jump. You're gonna need all the time you
Speaker 4: can get, so you have quit football. Said all right,
Speaker 4: and he goes, your dad told me you have a girlfriend.
Speaker 4: I said, uh, yeah, I mean yeah, and uh it's
Speaker 4: a girl from Issaquo, Washington. Maybe one of my first loves,
Speaker 4: Olivia would be upset if I said this, But Jason said,
Speaker 4: it's it's done, it's gotta go. No more girlfriend. I
Speaker 4: was once again ten years old, so I walked, am
Speaker 4: I allowed to wear on here? No? I walked my guess.
Speaker 4: I walked my happ yess to the garage and I
Speaker 4: sat on those like two steps right by the garage door,
Speaker 4: and I called her. But I called her and I said, look,
Speaker 4: it's not you, it's me, and I need all the
Speaker 4: time I can get. The old saying I I need
Speaker 4: to just focus on basketball. I don't have time for
Speaker 4: a relationship. So I killed it right there, ten years old,
Speaker 4: at ten at ten, and then I watched like all
Speaker 4: the Rocky movies that night and I was ready to
Speaker 4: roll in the morning.
Speaker 1: That's awesome. That's awesome.
Speaker 3: You know, it's interesting because I I'm trying to think
Speaker 3: and I remember when I went all in on basketball.
Speaker 3: It wasn't It wasn't until like I was right before
Speaker 3: high school my dad did was I mean, obviously I
Speaker 3: stayed back. I held back in eighth grade and years.
Speaker 4: Did you reclass too? Yeah, I didn't know that I
Speaker 4: did a seventh grade.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And like my first eighth grade year was such
Speaker 3: a fucking disaster because like they told me, I was
Speaker 3: holding back, right, So.
Speaker 1: You know, I literally like never went to school.
Speaker 4: So all your friends went to high school and you.
Speaker 3: This is the first so the first year, it wasn't
Speaker 3: the first year I was with. It's like a confluence
Speaker 3: of things, right, So this eighth grade year, I was
Speaker 3: a lot like my son, although he's still has he's
Speaker 3: still just now starting to grow, whereas some five feet
Speaker 3: tall eighth grade, you know, not a hair on my body,
Speaker 3: and you know, all my friends are growing and I'm
Speaker 3: already being told I'm staying back. You know, And in California,
Speaker 3: there is no real middle school sports.
Speaker 1: Like we didn't even have a gym. We all the
Speaker 1: middle school teams played outside.
Speaker 3: It was so bad, you know, Like I was my
Speaker 3: my favorite story, which is a terrible story, but it's
Speaker 3: still a favorite one, which is at the end of
Speaker 3: the first semester, I had awful grades.
Speaker 1: And the report cards used.
Speaker 3: To come in the mail and they had like the
Speaker 3: I don't know what that that that black ink paper
Speaker 3: on one side and then you peel it. Often than
Speaker 3: the grades be right there. So what we found out
Speaker 3: you could do is if you got your report card early,
Speaker 3: you could open up and you could just take a
Speaker 3: simple raser and erase the grades. And then and I
Speaker 3: know you've probably never seen when you're life, there is
Speaker 3: something called a typewriter, okay, and you could put that
Speaker 3: thin layer of paper back down, roll in the typewriter
Speaker 3: and type in. You put dots on the paper where
Speaker 3: you needed to type, and you could type in other grades.
Speaker 3: So like I wasn't greedy, I didn't put straight a's,
Speaker 3: but I definitely changed my grades to be way better. Right,
Speaker 3: So my first semester I probably put down I had
Speaker 3: like three a's, two b's in a.
Speaker 1: Seat, you know. So second semester I get in trouble.
Speaker 1: I did I did some I was. I kept going
Speaker 1: to the bathroom in the teacher's bathroom, and.
Speaker 3: Like, again, my son just graduated from this middle school,
Speaker 3: and the juxtaposition of bathrooms is like it was fucking gross.
Speaker 3: And so I kept like sneaking into the teacher's lounge bathroom,
Speaker 3: going to the bathroom, you know, and getting out of there.
Speaker 3: And I kept getting among other things, my grades were bad,
Speaker 3: my attitude wasn't good, and I was going and crap
Speaker 3: at wherever I wanted to crap, right, So they called
Speaker 3: my mom into the the vice principal's office and she's like,
Speaker 3: I don't understand.
Speaker 1: He's got good grades. He's got They're like, what are
Speaker 1: you talking about.
Speaker 3: He's like, well, he's you know, he's got he's got
Speaker 3: one C that we're you know, we talked about. But
Speaker 3: he's got all a's and b's. Missus Gottlieb, here's your
Speaker 3: son's grades. And she was like what And.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I got the ass whooping of my life.
Speaker 3: But there was like a month there where they didn't know,
Speaker 3: maybe even two months there where they didn't know. And
Speaker 3: I was like, this is the best ever. This is
Speaker 3: I don't have to do shit. I'm doing school next year.
Speaker 3: So anyway, so I held back, and then the next
Speaker 3: year I played with a team called b ball in
Speaker 3: LA and named Sam Minor was the coach, and my
Speaker 3: dad would take me up to stay mister Minor's house,
Speaker 3: drop me off on Mondays and Wednesdays, I believe, and
Speaker 3: I would do my homework at his house with his family,
Speaker 3: have dinner, and then we'd go to basketball practice, and
Speaker 3: you know, I was the only white guy whatever.
Speaker 1: His family was incredibly kind.
Speaker 3: And then I think it was Wednesday nights, we'd play
Speaker 3: a game in an LA like city, like middle school
Speaker 3: level league, and I really started to like love it.
Speaker 3: I was still playing baseball, I played tennis, I played
Speaker 3: football as well, and so we got ready for high
Speaker 3: school and I was starting to get pretty good and
Speaker 3: my dad was like, okay, like you want to do this.
Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, we really want to do.
Speaker 3: This, and so we took out a I'm still searching
Speaker 3: for it because my mom is a bit of a
Speaker 3: pack ratch keeps everything, so it exists somewhere in her house,
Speaker 3: which is a like a red spiral notebook. And I'll
Speaker 3: never forget this because in order for me to go
Speaker 3: to Tustin High school. We had to rent an apartment
Speaker 3: in Testin, even though we lived in Orange. He was
Speaker 3: like ten minutes part. So we got this apartment. It's
Speaker 3: like a five minute walk to Tutin High School. And
Speaker 3: we're sitting there and he's like, write down your goals
Speaker 3: and I was like, what do you mean. He's like,
Speaker 3: write down what you want to accomplish. And I wrote
Speaker 3: down like everything I want to accomplish, and he's like,
Speaker 3: is that everything.
Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, that's what I want to do. Say, okay,
Speaker 1: turn the page. Now, let's write down how we want
Speaker 1: to do it.
Speaker 3: And you know, like from that moment forward, it just
Speaker 3: my whole brain kind of changed. And I was I
Speaker 3: was fifteen, and I was solely focused on becoming the
Speaker 3: best player in Orange County, which I became, becoming a
Speaker 3: high school American, which I became playing in a high
Speaker 3: major level, which I did. I wanted to play on
Speaker 3: TV for some reason, like everybody plays on TV. But
Speaker 3: again back then, that was the thing, like I want
Speaker 3: like dick by Taw to call one of my games.
Speaker 3: I want to have my number of times, which it was,
Speaker 3: and I wanted to play. I want to play in
Speaker 3: the NBA I want to play in a Final four
Speaker 3: playing in the NBA, and then I want to broadcast basketball,
Speaker 3: and I want to coach vision I and I have
Speaker 3: literally checked every box except for playing in the Final
Speaker 3: four and playing the NBA. So but it's interesting, right
Speaker 3: because a lot like Tyresee and again like I don't
Speaker 3: profess to have had the career Tyrese had and you
Speaker 3: don't profess to as well. But it's amazing to me
Speaker 3: on how I think people lose track of, like for me,
Speaker 3: regards whether I got this job or whether I I
Speaker 3: broadcast to the level that I've been on a broadcast,
Speaker 3: Like just the fact that I found that motivation that
Speaker 3: got me to college, that made me lifelong friends, Why
Speaker 3: are you talking about West Virginia right? Like Oklahoma State
Speaker 3: is still that's my place, that's my heart. You know,
Speaker 3: changed my life. And I think that we do lose
Speaker 3: track of what the process of deciding you want something
Speaker 3: does for, especially for young guys, because we're all kind
Speaker 3: of scattered and we all need purpose and focus and
Speaker 3: and you learned so much along the way, right, you know,
Speaker 3: learned so much along the way. So wait, you were
Speaker 3: in Seattle. Take me to where you lived before you
Speaker 3: got to Kakanna.
Speaker 4: So I was born in Wisconsin. We moved to North Augusta,
Speaker 4: South Carolina. My dad worked for Kimberly Clark. Before I
Speaker 4: say this preface by not saying he's not in the military,
Speaker 4: because it kind of sounds like we bounced around like
Speaker 4: he was North Augusta, South Carolina. Then we moved to Marinet,
Speaker 4: just on the border of the up in Wisconsin. And uh,
Speaker 4: these each stint is like a few years, you know,
Speaker 4: a handful, never never anywhere for more than five except
Speaker 4: for Wisconsin, Marinette, you know, the Fox Cities again, and
Speaker 4: then out to Seattle. We you know, we did two
Speaker 4: and a half years in Seattle, and then that was
Speaker 4: around what was it, fifth through seventh grade, Yeah, fifth
Speaker 4: through seventh grade in Seattle, and then I did seventh
Speaker 4: grade again, which is when I was you know, held
Speaker 4: back seventh grade again when I got back to Wisconsin,
Speaker 4: which was a weird transition for a kid at that age,
Speaker 4: as you as you know. And then I stayed from
Speaker 4: you know, seventh grade all the way through my high
Speaker 4: school career here in Wisconsin, then West Virginia to Vegas,
Speaker 4: back to West Virginia. Now to Wisconsin, so traveled a
Speaker 4: little bit at this point.
Speaker 1: Yeah, how are you making friends?
Speaker 4: Probably good? Probably too good. When I was young and
Speaker 4: in school, because I think that was where my main
Speaker 4: focus was and not in school, we had a sounds
Speaker 4: like we had a very similar school experience. I didn't
Speaker 4: have a typewriter ever, and by the time I was
Speaker 4: in college, I had chat GPT, which was it's a
Speaker 4: little bit more efficient than a typewriter. They can talk
Speaker 4: to you. Uh So we definitely had a similar experience.
Speaker 4: But I was good at making friends.
Speaker 1: And here's a honest question, okay, and like we deal
Speaker 1: with this. We're gonna deal with this.
Speaker 3: With our players. You and I talked about chat GPT. Okay,
Speaker 3: do you know anybody anybody? I know one person, unequivocally
Speaker 3: I know who did who never ever cheated ever?
Speaker 1: Do you know anybody who never cheated.
Speaker 4: For my teammates in the high school or in college.
Speaker 4: I'd like to plead the fifth but no, no, I don't.
Speaker 4: I don't. It's crazy, right, well, no, hold on, there's
Speaker 4: varying degrees, right, so great degrees like like out and
Speaker 4: now cheating. Yeah, yeah, if you are copying and pasting
Speaker 4: an entire thing from chat GPT into a paper and
Speaker 4: submitting it. That's cheating, that's wrong. But like Olivia would
Speaker 4: get upset. What I'm serious. Olivia would get upset because
Speaker 4: if I would talk to chat GPT about this book
Speaker 4: that I definitely did not read, and I had a
Speaker 4: day to turn a paper in, so I'd ask you, like,
Speaker 4: give me the cliff Notes. Now, let's talk about how
Speaker 4: it applies to the real world now, okay, okay.
Speaker 1: And then our toss it does that. I had no idea.
Speaker 4: Oh man, I don't think you really realized how the
Speaker 4: power of this thing.
Speaker 3: No, I mean I realized it, but don't realize it
Speaker 3: right Like we had We literally had a book that
Speaker 3: you had to buy called cliff Notes, and I always
Speaker 3: just found it stupid, Like, wait, so I don't read
Speaker 3: a book, but I have to read a book about
Speaker 3: a book.
Speaker 1: I didn't read. Like that, that doesn't just tell me
Speaker 1: what it's about.
Speaker 4: Glypt Notes was a physical book, yes, before it was
Speaker 4: a website.
Speaker 1: Yes, it was a yellow book.
Speaker 4: Wow, typewriters, cliff Notes was a book. I'm learning.
Speaker 1: We had maps too.
Speaker 3: We have these physical things you'd open up called a map,
Speaker 3: I mean and that's the great the greatest, the greatest
Speaker 3: map ever was called a What the fuck is that called?
Speaker 1: It's in LA.
Speaker 3: It's uh that people in southern California had, which were amazing,
Speaker 3: that every physically had. Now like there's no business for
Speaker 3: It's like phone books, Like did you ever have to
Speaker 3: use a phone book?
Speaker 4: I've seen a phone book? And I've seen uh, map
Speaker 4: Quest staple all the papers together.
Speaker 1: No, not before map Quest was I know?
Speaker 4: And then I've seen the garment, the first GPS is
Speaker 4: I've seen the solo GPS that you did a suction
Speaker 4: cup to the to the to the windshield. But yes,
Speaker 4: I've seen a notebook.
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, So you're ten and you decide I'm all in.
Speaker 3: When you're back in Wisconsin, you're getting ready for high school.
Speaker 1: You're a freshman. How big are you?
Speaker 4: Well, hold back freshman? I was probably five ten, about nine?
Speaker 1: Okay, And did you play varsity your freshman year?
Speaker 4: I did? Yep, yep. Start Like what's that?
Speaker 1: What were you like as a player your freshman year?
Speaker 4: Freshman year? I was terrified, completely, you know, shell shocked
Speaker 4: and like not sure if I could do it. I
Speaker 4: think I remember our first game, our first game. Ever,
Speaker 4: we played down in Milwaukee, I believe, and just didn't
Speaker 4: play well, you know, had the whole thought process of
Speaker 4: like I'm not good enough to do this, like I'm
Speaker 4: not at this level, And spent kind of the whole
Speaker 4: freshman year just figuring it out, like single digit average score,
Speaker 4: decent distributor, but young, making a lot of dumb mistakes.
Speaker 4: And I just had a coach who was like, you know,
Speaker 4: like mckill up with with Curry, like just let them
Speaker 4: let him figure it out, right, instead of the natural
Speaker 4: instinct of the coaches just like get them out of
Speaker 4: the game. So coach Shallow was amazing for me at Takana.
Speaker 4: But that was my freshman year just figuring it out.
Speaker 4: And then sophomore year is when when we hit a
Speaker 4: little bit of a launch pad there.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: So my freshman year I played for a guy named
Speaker 3: Tom McCluskey Penn State, and they were coming off of
Speaker 3: state championship and the best player was a guy named
Speaker 3: David Bielstein, who was a tremendous, tremendous high school player.
Speaker 3: And so when I came aboard, they still had like
Speaker 3: three guys and they were all perimeter players from the
Speaker 3: state championship team, but they were all kind of secondary
Speaker 3: tertiary Optionsjenshymore was our best player. He was going to TCU.
Speaker 3: But the first game, we're getting ready to play in
Speaker 3: the Tribuco Hills Tournament, and I like, to.
Speaker 1: This day, I will die on this hill.
Speaker 3: And mccluskoll watched this at some point he just retired
Speaker 3: from teaching and coaching.
Speaker 1: That he should have.
Speaker 3: Played me more that year, just because not just it
Speaker 3: would have helped me in the future, but I think
Speaker 3: I could have helped. We lost, like in the semi
Speaker 3: finals of I think we lost to camer Murray and
Speaker 3: Adam Jacobson Seem and Glendora we lost to anyway. But
Speaker 3: my first game, I remember, I was I played varsity
Speaker 3: and JV all summer and was we because you know,
Speaker 3: I didn't know anybody, and I transferred into the school.
Speaker 3: And at that time most public schools in California, guys
Speaker 3: didn't really transfer in.
Speaker 1: Maybe for football they did, but not for basketball.
Speaker 3: You either went to Modern Day if you're really good,
Speaker 3: or maybe one of the other private schools otherwise, or
Speaker 3: you just sucked it up and went to your high school.
Speaker 3: So I didn't know a soul. Most of those guys,
Speaker 3: they weren't really in the AAU world, which I was,
Speaker 3: and so I didn't grow up playing with any of
Speaker 3: these guys, didn't know anybody. So I was kind of
Speaker 3: toggling between both. And I'll never forget our we played.
Speaker 3: We played in the Tribuca Hills Tournament, and I think
Speaker 3: we might have played Tribuca the first night. I can't remember,
Speaker 3: but I just remember like we're getting two things. One
Speaker 3: I got my jersey the day of the game, which
Speaker 3: was awesome, and I remember getting it and going back
Speaker 3: to that same apartment which I talked about and laying
Speaker 3: it on the bed and just like looking at it
Speaker 3: and freaking the fuck out. And it was terrible number
Speaker 3: number thirty one, which is my brother's number, which is
Speaker 3: just I have I still I have to have him
Speaker 3: on the pod to explain why he chose thirty one,
Speaker 3: terrible basketball number. But it was thirty one, and I'm
Speaker 3: like staring at it and putting it on and looking
Speaker 3: in the mirror and trying to flex my muscles. I'm
Speaker 3: like five nine buck twenty right. And and then I
Speaker 3: come back to the gym before getting ready to get
Speaker 3: on the bus and they were like, hey, I think
Speaker 3: you're starting tonight, Like what And what had happened was
Speaker 3: the day before the night before they we had two
Speaker 3: guys arrested and our two starting wings were arrested. They
Speaker 3: were at a party and it got broken up and
Speaker 3: they like refused to leave, like stupid shit, got mouthed
Speaker 3: with a cop, got thrown into the clink.
Speaker 1: And so we go.
Speaker 3: We play in this tournament, and I'm fucking tight, right,
Speaker 3: And we had a guy named Derrick Roach, and we
Speaker 3: basically ran every play for Derreck Roach, and we were
Speaker 3: you know, they were suspended the first two tournaments. And
Speaker 3: so I played a ton and you know, kind of
Speaker 3: like a little bit like college, like kind of scared
Speaker 3: to shoot, just run the team whatever.
Speaker 1: And every time we take the court, our fans would be.
Speaker 3: Like free more Reice, Free more Reese because he was
Speaker 3: in jail.
Speaker 1: It was amazing.
Speaker 3: It was at that moment that I learned about, you know,
Speaker 3: always stay ready, to be ready, you know, and and uh,
Speaker 3: and then I played mostly JV and that was really
Speaker 3: good for me because otherwise I never would have looked
Speaker 3: at the basket with varsity, you know, And in JV,
Speaker 3: I just tried to fucking score every time I got
Speaker 3: the ball, which I needed because with my dad's AU teams,
Speaker 3: he always had such good talent that I didn't really
Speaker 3: need to do shit except for the team because he
Speaker 3: was like kind of old school, traditional point guard type coach. So,
Speaker 3: uh yeah, that's that's that's fascinating. So when did it
Speaker 3: take off? When did you sort of like when did
Speaker 3: it blow up?
Speaker 4: Well, I mean it was it was gradual and it
Speaker 4: was kind of twofold. When you talk about takeoff, Like
Speaker 4: my sophomore year, I definitely took a step. And the
Speaker 4: big thing was is like during my development. I believe
Speaker 4: it was between my freshman and sophomore year during an
Speaker 4: AAU event. We were playing a Chicago team and a
Speaker 4: guy that I still know to this day. His name
Speaker 4: is Scott and he worked for Ball's Life. Happened to
Speaker 4: be watching somebody else. He was covering just Chicago high
Speaker 4: school basketball with his camera and Ball's Life was small,
Speaker 4: and anyways, he filmed the game and I knew he
Speaker 4: was there. I wasn't stupid. I saw it, and I
Speaker 4: you know, I did a little bit more than I
Speaker 4: probably needed to on most plays, just with the handle
Speaker 4: and you know, passing and just the extra shit. Right.
Speaker 4: I did it and I had fun doing it. Didn't
Speaker 4: think anything would come out of it. And then that
Speaker 4: video went out and it did really well, and then
Speaker 4: videos just followed behind and that now you know, it
Speaker 4: kind of became every tournament there was more and more
Speaker 4: cameras over time popped up this whole, this whole movement
Speaker 4: of like mixtape basketball was growing as I was just
Speaker 4: kind of hitting my stride. This was like during the
Speaker 4: Austin Rivers, Like I think I've watched Austin Rivers Ball's
Speaker 4: life or Whop mixtape actually sorry, his who mixtape probably
Speaker 4: a thousand times, just like every other kid my age.
Speaker 4: So that culture was building and I was hitting my stride.
Speaker 4: So that's when the social media side of stuff really
Speaker 4: started to take off. But from the on the court stuff,
Speaker 4: like I said in the beginning, I didn't really take
Speaker 4: a step until I went to Jason Otter. Like I
Speaker 4: could handle the ball, stationary dribbling, I could do all
Speaker 4: that stuff. I couldn't do any sort of game application
Speaker 4: stuff until I met Jason. Like that's just what it was.
Speaker 4: And I think I met him when I was ten
Speaker 4: or eleven. But it took and he told me, he
Speaker 4: was like, it is gonna take years for you to
Speaker 4: get to a point where you even got a shot
Speaker 4: at this right. So that was kind of the playing.
Speaker 1: Did you play a lot of pickup?
Speaker 4: Uh? Yeah. My dad in Seattle would drop me off
Speaker 4: at a twenty four hour fitness and say I'll see
Speaker 4: you at eight and it was like, you know, three o'clock.
Speaker 4: So and he was like playing with all the older guys.
Speaker 4: At the time, I was in middle school.
Speaker 1: So here's good, dude. You know, underwear, but the air there,
Speaker 1: the flow is fucking good.
Speaker 4: So in middle school I spent half my time of
Speaker 4: twenty four hours. If I was at twenty four our
Speaker 4: fitness for five hours, two and a half was walking
Speaker 4: around the gym, probably trying to flirt with girls that
Speaker 4: were way too old for me. The other half was
Speaker 4: in the gym playing against guys who were also way
Speaker 4: too old for me to be playing with and they
Speaker 4: would bust my ass. So that was my That was.
Speaker 1: My world was. We had a place called Raquetball World. Rocket.
Speaker 3: Here's what's amazing about Rackball World. There were only two locations.
Speaker 3: One was in Santa Ana, one was in Fullerton, My
Speaker 3: best friend growing up was Miles Simon. Miles grew up
Speaker 3: playing at the Fullerton One. I grew up playing at
Speaker 3: the sant Ana One. Literally like ships, we were friends.
Speaker 3: We're like we became friends like fifth grade we started
Speaker 3: playing together. Sixth grade we started like sleepovers and everything whenever.
Speaker 3: And I think, like I can count on one hand
Speaker 3: how many times I went to his rackball world. I
Speaker 3: don't think he ever went to mine. And the courts
Speaker 3: were side. We played sideways, and it might have been
Speaker 3: four on four. And I was just that fucking annoying
Speaker 3: little kid that would just sit up there and try
Speaker 3: and play ball. And then my dad would be playing
Speaker 3: racktball and I go downstairs and watch him, and I
Speaker 3: go to the stack bar or whatever. I bullshit around
Speaker 3: and come back and play. It was kind of same thing,
Speaker 3: same thing.
Speaker 2: How do we?
Speaker 1: How do we get?
Speaker 3: I mean, I guess twenty four now, one of the
Speaker 3: twenty four is great because there's a gym everywhere with those.
Speaker 1: Things and there's always some level of basketball in it.
Speaker 3: But twenty four is bad because I think it's killed
Speaker 3: any sort of outside playground basketball, Like it just doesn't
Speaker 3: happen anymore.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it doesn't. I was blessed. My grandpa has a
Speaker 4: full court in his backyard, like at one point, it's
Speaker 4: right down the street and Kakano, I'll take you over
Speaker 4: to see it. It's really cool. And yeah, I played
Speaker 4: out there all the time when I was when I
Speaker 4: was really young. But yeah, the whole like playground culture
Speaker 4: is gone, which is sad because that was like, you know,
Speaker 4: also parallel to the end one culture in the street
Speaker 4: ball and all that was huge for the game of basketball.
Speaker 4: Moved it forward. But yeah, definitely definitely killed it, you know,
Speaker 4: but it's better twenty four fitnesses, a real gym with
Speaker 4: real hardwood, with an ac like you know, it's better
Speaker 4: in some ways. You know, playing outside is cooler. But yeah,
Speaker 4: my dad would just drop me off, kick me out
Speaker 4: of the car and say see you, you know, for dinner,
Speaker 4: and we.
Speaker 1: Did that at Mile Square Park as well.
Speaker 3: Or my dad would drop me off, helped me get
Speaker 3: in the first game, and then you give me five bucks.
Speaker 3: And there's something called a payphone, and if you really
Speaker 3: needed him, you could call collect and then he wouldn't
Speaker 3: accept and then they call you back at that number
Speaker 3: or whatever, or they come get you. But for the
Speaker 3: most part, they never came in. I don't remember ever
Speaker 3: getting picked up early. I remember wasting a lot of
Speaker 3: saturdays just sitting around there waiting for a game whatever,
Speaker 3: and no phone, right, like, no phone, just occupying yourself,
Speaker 3: just shooting hoops or going and hopping in hopping in games.
Speaker 3: Last thing, and then we'll I want to get to
Speaker 3: next one. We'll get to your college career, and then
Speaker 3: we'll get to coaching. But if you had a kid
Speaker 3: getting ready for high school, Yeah, you get a kid
Speaker 3: get ready for high school, how do you balance, Like
Speaker 3: we're in getting into August, this will drop in August.
Speaker 3: You have August, and most high school start end of
Speaker 3: August early September. Obviously we know when the season gets going.
Speaker 3: How would you balance workouts now with pickup ball now
Speaker 3: as you're getting ready for a high school season.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a it's a great question. I think it
Speaker 4: depends on like the agent level obviously of the kid,
Speaker 4: but from like a general standpoint, kids don't play enough.
Speaker 4: I think this conversation has been had a number of times.
Speaker 4: But I do also think, like you know, getting ten
Speaker 4: to play pickup is tough in some small towns. It's
Speaker 4: just a fact, like, especially nowadays with a million other
Speaker 4: options of freaking Fortnite college football video games, girls, Like,
Speaker 4: there's a lot of other options for these guys, and
Speaker 4: getting ten to play pick up at a high level
Speaker 4: is tough. So what I've really started to do now
Speaker 4: and what I would suggest that high school kids, cause
Speaker 4: you might not be able to find ten, you can
Speaker 4: probably find two or three or four and play small
Speaker 4: sided one on one games. And I was just talking
Speaker 4: to a trainer who trains Hyjerome and Max Shrews and
Speaker 4: some guys in Chicago, and that's what they do, is like,
Speaker 4: we'll do a ton of skill and this is what
Speaker 4: we're doing with our groups here at Green Bay is
Speaker 4: like a ton of skill work. Early, we'll do game
Speaker 4: application on top of that skill, and then at the
Speaker 4: end for fifteen to twenty minutes, like you know, a
Speaker 4: third of your workout should be live reads because like
Speaker 4: everybody knows a guy who can do drills at a
Speaker 4: different level than everybody else. He doesn't miss, it's clean,
Speaker 4: it's crisp, he's got rhythm, and then you throw a
Speaker 4: body in front of him and he loses his damn
Speaker 4: mind because he's just not making those live reeds enough
Speaker 4: and he doesn't have any sort of creativity. He has
Speaker 4: the rigidity of skill development and drill work and that's it.
Speaker 4: And that's great if that's what you're trying to do.
Speaker 4: But we're trying to play basketball, so I would say
Speaker 4: you threw a number on it just for fun. Thirty
Speaker 4: percent of your workout should be live reps against somebody
Speaker 4: whoever you can get to just play dummy d You know,
Speaker 4: your younger brother hears ten bucks guard me at the
Speaker 4: end of this workout and rebound the rest like that's
Speaker 4: huge because kids nowadays do so many drills. Because here's
Speaker 4: the great thing about drills. Nobody freaking wins or loses
Speaker 4: a drill and it doesn't hurt as bad. But if
Speaker 4: you play one egos getting bruised. Somebody says and they
Speaker 4: hate it. I hated it. There's definitely points, you know
Speaker 4: where I hated that, that confrontation and competition. But it's
Speaker 4: just like any other muscle. If you if you flex
Speaker 4: it enough, by the time you get in the game,
Speaker 4: you're not as afraid of losing as the guy across
Speaker 4: from you, and that gives you ample more opportunity to win.
Speaker 4: This game or win the matchup or whatever. But you
Speaker 4: got to play. You have to play.
Speaker 3: That's it for for for part one. Jordan McCabe also
Speaker 3: known as J five. Now are we not doing the
Speaker 3: J five thing anymore? I mean, do we want to
Speaker 3: put that to bed? Do you want to continue?
Speaker 4: I think we put it to bed. J five was
Speaker 4: definitely the playing name I do like Coach Archibald calls
Speaker 4: me Mac, and my grandpa was his nickname was Mac.
Speaker 4: So if I'm going to have a nickname, coach Mack
Speaker 4: is fine, or just Jordan works as well.
Speaker 1: You don't want to be called J five at all.
Speaker 4: No, No, it's like a player tag, you know.
Speaker 3: I know, but there's still like a rep to it,
Speaker 3: kind of cool, Like if I had some shit like that,
Speaker 3: I would I would Yeah.
Speaker 4: All right, I mean you might be right, we can
Speaker 4: we can keep this.
Speaker 3: Only this is a lot like Eric Sanders, whose nickname
Speaker 3: is eighth grade, right, like it's one of the great
Speaker 3: nicknames of all time.
Speaker 1: He's like, yeah, I don't be eighth grade anymore.
Speaker 3: Like, bro, if I had a nickname as good as
Speaker 3: eighth grade, why would I didch eighth grade?
Speaker 4: We talked about transitioning in the beginning of the show.
Speaker 4: Everybody's got a transition, right.
Speaker 1: We did, we did.
Speaker 3: It's so it Honestly, the super weird thing is being
Speaker 3: called coach all the time. And as you know, Arch
Speaker 3: has a tendency to say the word coach a lot,
Speaker 3: like I think he'd leave the country a coach. Coach, coach,
Speaker 3: coach that.
Speaker 1: Was that was really good coach, which I was really.
Speaker 3: Good coach, I dude, I just that's a weird That's
Speaker 3: a weird transition for me.
Speaker 4: I just imagine being twenty five and a twenty three
Speaker 4: year old COVID senior having to call you coach, which
Speaker 4: was my position last year. That's a weird one. That
Speaker 4: feels really weird. No matter how you slice it, it's weird. Weird.
Speaker 3: That is weird and weird has been a big talking
Speaker 3: point this week. All right, that's it for me and
Speaker 3: Jordan McKay Part one. We'll do obviously complete kind of
Speaker 3: his story and more. Yaki Yak on hoops throughout the year.
Speaker 3: Make sure you follow him on Instagram, but most of
Speaker 3: you already followed him on Instagram in the meantime, reminded
Speaker 3: the Doug Gottlieb Show airs daily three to five eastern
Speaker 3: twelve two Pacific on iHeartRadio, Foxsports Radio dot Com. There's
Speaker 3: a podcast for that as well, and for this edition,
Speaker 3: I'm Doug Gotlieb.
Speaker 1: He's Jordan McKay. This is all bo