1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:13,920 Speaker 1: Kay Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast, a 2 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:18,799 Speaker 1: weekly conversation about mental health, personal development, and all the 3 00:00:18,840 --> 00:00:21,919 Speaker 1: small decisions we can make to become the best possible 4 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:26,480 Speaker 1: versions of ourselves. I'm your host, Dr Joy hard and Bradford, 5 00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:31,920 Speaker 1: a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or 6 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:35,400 Speaker 1: to find a therapist in your area, visit our website 7 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:39,160 Speaker 1: at Therapy for Black Girls dot com. While I hope 8 00:00:39,159 --> 00:00:43,040 Speaker 1: you love listening to and learning from the podcast, it 9 00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:46,239 Speaker 1: is not meant to be a substitute for relationship with 10 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:57,279 Speaker 1: a licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much 11 00:00:57,320 --> 00:01:00,240 Speaker 1: for joining me from session to the Therapy for Black 12 00:01:00,280 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 1: Girls Podcast. We'll get right into the episode after a 13 00:01:03,560 --> 00:01:17,240 Speaker 1: word from our sponsors. The fight for reproductive justice has 14 00:01:17,280 --> 00:01:20,840 Speaker 1: become even more significant following a recent law that passed 15 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:24,760 Speaker 1: in Texas making abortions more restrictive. Now more than ever, 16 00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:27,880 Speaker 1: it's important for us to be engaged in and supporting 17 00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:30,280 Speaker 1: the efforts of those fighting for the rights of those 18 00:01:30,360 --> 00:01:34,080 Speaker 1: most marginalized. Joining us today to share about her work 19 00:01:34,080 --> 00:01:38,280 Speaker 1: in this space is Yamani Hernandez. Yamani is a visionary 20 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:43,120 Speaker 1: and strategic queer African American Buddhist leader committed to radical 21 00:01:43,200 --> 00:01:47,360 Speaker 1: compassion and healing justice. She became the executive director of 22 00:01:47,360 --> 00:01:52,120 Speaker 1: the National Network of Abortion Funds in May. During her tenure, 23 00:01:52,520 --> 00:01:56,800 Speaker 1: the organization has grown dramatically in size, framing, and capacity 24 00:01:56,840 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 1: to build cultural and political power with its organism, national 25 00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:04,560 Speaker 1: and individual members as they remove financial and logistical barriers 26 00:02:04,600 --> 00:02:08,280 Speaker 1: to abortion access by centering people who have abortions and 27 00:02:08,400 --> 00:02:12,560 Speaker 1: organizing at the intersections of racial, economic, and reproductive justice. 28 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:16,040 Speaker 1: YOURMANI and I chatted about what leadership looks like in 29 00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:19,640 Speaker 1: this space at this moment, protecting your mental health while 30 00:02:19,680 --> 00:02:21,960 Speaker 1: doing this work, what it looks like to do this 31 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:25,000 Speaker 1: work in the age of social media, and she shared 32 00:02:25,040 --> 00:02:28,160 Speaker 1: ways for you to get involved in supporting this important movement. 33 00:02:28,600 --> 00:02:32,120 Speaker 1: If something resonates with you while enjoying our conversation, please 34 00:02:32,120 --> 00:02:34,800 Speaker 1: share it with us on social media using the hashtag 35 00:02:35,240 --> 00:02:41,400 Speaker 1: TVG in session. Here is our conversation. Thank you so 36 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:44,800 Speaker 1: much for joining me today, your money. Yeah, very excited 37 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:46,520 Speaker 1: to chat with you, So I wonder if you could 38 00:02:46,520 --> 00:02:48,400 Speaker 1: just start by telling us a little bit about your 39 00:02:48,480 --> 00:02:51,680 Speaker 1: role as the executive director of the National Network of 40 00:02:51,720 --> 00:02:55,040 Speaker 1: Abortion Funds and how being black and queer has shaped 41 00:02:55,080 --> 00:02:58,720 Speaker 1: your experience. In this position, I lead a national network 42 00:02:58,919 --> 00:03:03,200 Speaker 1: which of grassroots organizations. There's eighty three members across the 43 00:03:03,240 --> 00:03:05,919 Speaker 1: country who we like to say or make the legal 44 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:10,240 Speaker 1: right to abortion actually possible. So they help pay for 45 00:03:10,520 --> 00:03:16,280 Speaker 1: people's abortions, They help get rides, child care, housing, hotel stays, 46 00:03:16,480 --> 00:03:18,840 Speaker 1: do less support all of the things it takes to 47 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:21,960 Speaker 1: help people get to care. And so in my role, 48 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:26,600 Speaker 1: I am a spokesperson. I am a lead strategist, thing 49 00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:31,680 Speaker 1: about organizational development, infrastructure and how to support this network 50 00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:36,080 Speaker 1: of eighty three members, and to the other part about 51 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:39,520 Speaker 1: what it's been like to be black and queer. In 52 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:44,080 Speaker 1: this role, I think blackness and queerness are not a monolith. 53 00:03:44,680 --> 00:03:48,720 Speaker 1: And I think that has been clear to me repeatedly, 54 00:03:48,760 --> 00:03:52,480 Speaker 1: over and over again. Sometimes they have unexpected opinions for 55 00:03:52,960 --> 00:03:55,480 Speaker 1: what people think a black person or queer person or 56 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 1: a black queer person is supposed to have. And I 57 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:01,600 Speaker 1: think I've learned just that the duties of my job 58 00:04:01,680 --> 00:04:04,560 Speaker 1: and my employer are not the only responsibilities that I have. 59 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:09,920 Speaker 1: But also there's so many expectations, like from my own community, 60 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 1: people who look like me and people who have identify 61 00:04:12,920 --> 00:04:16,080 Speaker 1: with my life experience and my lived experiences that it 62 00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:19,520 Speaker 1: adds another layer to my responsibility about who I'm accountable 63 00:04:19,560 --> 00:04:25,320 Speaker 1: to and when and how. So it's adds a little extra, 64 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:28,960 Speaker 1: little extra to the role. Yeah, and I wonder if 65 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:31,040 Speaker 1: you could talk more about that, right, I mean, because 66 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:33,479 Speaker 1: there is the job, but so much of your work 67 00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:36,000 Speaker 1: it sounds like it's heart centered and like really mission 68 00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:39,159 Speaker 1: focused in community focus, and it does add this other 69 00:04:39,279 --> 00:04:42,919 Speaker 1: layer of like direct accountability I think to the community 70 00:04:42,960 --> 00:04:45,360 Speaker 1: that you say you serve. So how do you feel 71 00:04:45,400 --> 00:04:51,160 Speaker 1: like you've been able to manage that additional layer of accountability. Yeah, 72 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 1: I mean it's been hard at sometimes and other times 73 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:57,400 Speaker 1: we have had pretty proud moments. I'm the first black 74 00:04:57,400 --> 00:05:00,919 Speaker 1: person to lead this organization and it's nearly thirty year history. 75 00:05:00,960 --> 00:05:03,760 Speaker 1: I've been in my role for six years. When I came, 76 00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:07,920 Speaker 1: it was predominantly white folks on staff, and we have 77 00:05:08,120 --> 00:05:12,599 Speaker 1: pretty much a majority about people of color on staff now. 78 00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:15,400 Speaker 1: And I feel really proud about that, and not that 79 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:17,880 Speaker 1: it's like something that I dictated, but I think it's 80 00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:20,680 Speaker 1: part of just like a culture change that has happened 81 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:22,600 Speaker 1: at the organization, and I feel really proud of that. 82 00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:26,680 Speaker 1: I think there's other times where Yeah, I can be disappointing, 83 00:05:26,720 --> 00:05:29,240 Speaker 1: I guess because I think sometimes people think, oh, we 84 00:05:29,320 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 1: hire a black person, that means they're obviously going to 85 00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:34,640 Speaker 1: be like a racial justice expert, and you know they 86 00:05:34,680 --> 00:05:37,480 Speaker 1: will know how to do all the latest d E 87 00:05:37,680 --> 00:05:40,799 Speaker 1: I this then the other, and that that's not actually 88 00:05:40,880 --> 00:05:43,960 Speaker 1: my expertise. And I have my lived experience as a 89 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:48,440 Speaker 1: black mama and you know, socialized as a black girl 90 00:05:48,560 --> 00:05:51,520 Speaker 1: growing up. But I don't have all of those skills. 91 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:54,240 Speaker 1: So I can be disappointing to people what sometimes where 92 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:56,320 Speaker 1: they thought that I was going to deliver something that 93 00:05:56,560 --> 00:05:59,640 Speaker 1: is not in my job description, but you know it's 94 00:05:59,680 --> 00:06:03,440 Speaker 1: just a womb like, oh no, she's black, so this 95 00:06:03,520 --> 00:06:06,920 Speaker 1: is going to happen. And yeah, I think that can 96 00:06:06,920 --> 00:06:09,279 Speaker 1: be some of that just tension. So I'd love to 97 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:12,000 Speaker 1: hear you talk your many about what leadership looks like 98 00:06:12,120 --> 00:06:14,760 Speaker 1: at this moment in history, just fresh off the heels 99 00:06:14,760 --> 00:06:18,039 Speaker 1: of this ruling in Texas, and so I'm just wondering, like, 100 00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:20,480 Speaker 1: what leadership has looked like for you and what are 101 00:06:20,520 --> 00:06:23,680 Speaker 1: you envisioning and looking like going forward. Yeah, I love 102 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:27,400 Speaker 1: that question because it is very active. It's very active 103 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:30,359 Speaker 1: in my mind right now because I think most of 104 00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:33,760 Speaker 1: us are living through a period that we haven't seen 105 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 1: before in our lifetime as far as the restrictions, the 106 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:41,240 Speaker 1: level of restrictions on a portion, And I mean, I'm 107 00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:44,799 Speaker 1: forty three pre road days, was before was pre me days, 108 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:47,120 Speaker 1: I guess. But yeah, I mean I think there's this 109 00:06:47,160 --> 00:06:49,800 Speaker 1: pressure to like know the answers and to know how 110 00:06:49,839 --> 00:06:52,880 Speaker 1: to solve this, and there aren't any easy solutions and 111 00:06:52,920 --> 00:06:56,000 Speaker 1: it's a very horrible place that we're in. I think 112 00:06:56,040 --> 00:06:58,920 Speaker 1: there's always this tension between being a national leader and 113 00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:02,440 Speaker 1: we're in a network, so have literally eight D three organizations, 114 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:05,080 Speaker 1: so there's leaders at all of those organizations as well, 115 00:07:05,640 --> 00:07:08,320 Speaker 1: and so I'm always trying to balance where do I 116 00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:11,560 Speaker 1: show up in my leadership at the national level and 117 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:14,520 Speaker 1: where do I really pass the mic to our local 118 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:17,680 Speaker 1: leaders are local state leaders who are closer to the 119 00:07:17,680 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 1: ground and who are closer to the solutions I think 120 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:24,520 Speaker 1: that are going to be necessary. And so that's me 121 00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:27,960 Speaker 1: is really about sharing power and not thinking that there's one, 122 00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:32,000 Speaker 1: you know, singular charismatic leader that is going to have 123 00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:35,400 Speaker 1: all the answers. This is a group project. And so yeah, 124 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:38,880 Speaker 1: that's hard to balance because sometimes I think in an emergency, 125 00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:44,840 Speaker 1: people are like, where's the somebody tell somebody just answer yeah, exactly, yeah. 126 00:07:44,880 --> 00:07:48,640 Speaker 1: And that's not how we're going to survive this, Uman. 127 00:07:48,920 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 1: The way we're going to survive this is gonna be 128 00:07:51,440 --> 00:07:59,600 Speaker 1: us all kind of lacking hands across the states, cities, neighborhoods, blocks, 129 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:03,880 Speaker 1: And that is different. That's different than some of the 130 00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:07,640 Speaker 1: other times we've lived through, I guess so. So it's 131 00:08:07,680 --> 00:08:11,240 Speaker 1: just it's a lot more localized problem to solve in 132 00:08:11,280 --> 00:08:15,280 Speaker 1: the absence of federal and government solution that we should 133 00:08:15,280 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 1: be able to rely on at this point. And can 134 00:08:19,560 --> 00:08:22,400 Speaker 1: you talk a little bit about what this moment means, 135 00:08:22,800 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 1: particularly for black and brown and queer communities in terms 136 00:08:26,360 --> 00:08:29,280 Speaker 1: of like abortion rights and reproductive rights. How are you 137 00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:32,240 Speaker 1: thinking these communities are going to be most impacted. Well, 138 00:08:32,280 --> 00:08:35,240 Speaker 1: you know the age old saying that folks who can 139 00:08:35,280 --> 00:08:38,160 Speaker 1: afford abortion will always have a way to find it, 140 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:40,760 Speaker 1: be able to get to it, whether it means flying 141 00:08:40,840 --> 00:08:43,679 Speaker 1: to other states, whether it means flying to other countries. 142 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:46,440 Speaker 1: That's always happened in it will continue to happen. So 143 00:08:46,520 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 1: the people who are going to hit, you know, hardest 144 00:08:49,160 --> 00:08:51,600 Speaker 1: by this are the people who can't afford to do that, 145 00:08:52,080 --> 00:08:55,680 Speaker 1: and then this country, we know that economic suffering and 146 00:08:55,800 --> 00:09:00,280 Speaker 1: racism are inextricably linked, So that will be the people 147 00:09:00,320 --> 00:09:02,920 Speaker 1: who are most marginalized, the black people, the brown people, 148 00:09:02,920 --> 00:09:08,080 Speaker 1: with the folks who are undocumented and cannot travel the 149 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:12,440 Speaker 1: same way that other folks can. People you know who 150 00:09:12,640 --> 00:09:16,559 Speaker 1: their gender identities are different than being collapsed into like 151 00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 1: a binary of this person or that person, the sex 152 00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:22,839 Speaker 1: or that sex, the gender that gender, and so yeah, 153 00:09:22,840 --> 00:09:25,800 Speaker 1: it means being further criminalized, and which is something that 154 00:09:25,800 --> 00:09:29,520 Speaker 1: our communities are already dealing with, and so adding this 155 00:09:29,640 --> 00:09:32,920 Speaker 1: layer of also just being criminalized for being able to 156 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:43,120 Speaker 1: actually access healthcare and itself is just it's it is infuriating, upsetting, uh, depressing, 157 00:09:43,559 --> 00:09:45,840 Speaker 1: all of those things. I mean, I'm always trying to 158 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:49,720 Speaker 1: balance the resiliency narratives. I do like to talk about 159 00:09:49,760 --> 00:09:52,000 Speaker 1: the fact that we have always figured out what we 160 00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:55,200 Speaker 1: needed to do to take care of ourselves. I want 161 00:09:55,200 --> 00:09:58,959 Speaker 1: to always root for like our resilience, but I'm also 162 00:09:59,080 --> 00:10:01,560 Speaker 1: just like, when do we ever get to not be 163 00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:05,120 Speaker 1: strong and have to know everything and figure everything out 164 00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:08,080 Speaker 1: for ourselves? When do we have the support that we 165 00:10:08,160 --> 00:10:10,600 Speaker 1: need to not have to just be in survival mode, 166 00:10:11,080 --> 00:10:13,200 Speaker 1: and yeah, this is just one more time where we're 167 00:10:13,240 --> 00:10:15,800 Speaker 1: gonna be trying to figure it out on our own 168 00:10:15,880 --> 00:10:20,080 Speaker 1: without the systemic supports that we need. More from my 169 00:10:20,160 --> 00:10:32,400 Speaker 1: conversation with your money after the break, just given the 170 00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:36,360 Speaker 1: past eighteen months, it just has felt relentless, right, I mean, 171 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:39,640 Speaker 1: we are trying to keep ourselves safe, keep our family safe, 172 00:10:39,760 --> 00:10:43,720 Speaker 1: trying not to get shot in the streets or unfairly targeted. 173 00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:46,760 Speaker 1: I think this ruling in Texas just felt like, oh 174 00:10:46,840 --> 00:10:49,720 Speaker 1: my gosh, like when do we get a break, When 175 00:10:49,800 --> 00:10:52,960 Speaker 1: can we come up for air in the pandemic that 176 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:57,320 Speaker 1: we also have never seen before, where losses of childcare, 177 00:10:57,440 --> 00:11:02,319 Speaker 1: levels of exhaustion, losses of women. Before the pandemic started, 178 00:11:02,360 --> 00:11:06,000 Speaker 1: we had done so much work to build the capacity 179 00:11:06,040 --> 00:11:08,840 Speaker 1: of our membership that abortion funds were starting to be 180 00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:12,320 Speaker 1: able to fund more people than they ever had been before. 181 00:11:12,400 --> 00:11:15,120 Speaker 1: And then the pandemic hit, and then the call volume 182 00:11:15,679 --> 00:11:19,120 Speaker 1: for help doubled, and so then it's just like you said, 183 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:27,480 Speaker 1: this relentless kind of circle of need and exhaustion. I 184 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:30,720 Speaker 1: keep saying, one of the times that our capacity is 185 00:11:30,760 --> 00:11:33,839 Speaker 1: needed the most and we are wounded. I was working 186 00:11:33,880 --> 00:11:37,720 Speaker 1: twenty hours a week most of because school was happening 187 00:11:37,720 --> 00:11:40,360 Speaker 1: in the house and trying to do that and lead 188 00:11:40,400 --> 00:11:43,880 Speaker 1: the organization. And that has been a trend for a 189 00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:47,120 Speaker 1: lot of folks who have been caretaking and you know, 190 00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:51,079 Speaker 1: so it's been rough. Yeah. Yeah, So ant leads me 191 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:53,600 Speaker 1: to my next question, just like how are you taking 192 00:11:53,600 --> 00:11:56,560 Speaker 1: care of yourself? Like how has your mental health been impacted? 193 00:11:56,920 --> 00:11:59,360 Speaker 1: You know, doing this work even before the pandemic, but 194 00:11:59,520 --> 00:12:02,240 Speaker 1: certainly right now. Like what kinds of things that you're 195 00:12:02,240 --> 00:12:05,240 Speaker 1: doing to take care of yourself? Yeah, well, I have 196 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:08,640 Speaker 1: a regular therapy appointment. I also, I like to describe 197 00:12:08,679 --> 00:12:12,720 Speaker 1: myself as warm but boundaried, and I just don't there's 198 00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:15,240 Speaker 1: some things there's just hard limits that I've had to 199 00:12:15,280 --> 00:12:19,080 Speaker 1: have on. I can't work seven, I don't work on 200 00:12:19,120 --> 00:12:21,480 Speaker 1: the weekends, that don't work in the evenings. So more 201 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:23,920 Speaker 1: I'm in boundary. I love that definition. What does that 202 00:12:24,040 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 1: mean to you? It means being friendly, being kind, but 203 00:12:28,679 --> 00:12:34,000 Speaker 1: also having limits and having standards. And so that means 204 00:12:34,040 --> 00:12:36,800 Speaker 1: that I am not available all the time to every person, 205 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:40,959 Speaker 1: and it means that my values rule my decision making, 206 00:12:41,040 --> 00:12:43,760 Speaker 1: and so I'm not going to make decisions that I 207 00:12:43,840 --> 00:12:45,880 Speaker 1: can't live with and that I don't feel are an 208 00:12:45,920 --> 00:12:48,079 Speaker 1: integrity with who I am and what I believe. I 209 00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:51,640 Speaker 1: would be kind and I would be friendly, but I'm 210 00:12:51,760 --> 00:12:53,679 Speaker 1: not going to be pushed over and I'm not going 211 00:12:53,720 --> 00:12:56,040 Speaker 1: to just do whatever anybody wants me to do. M 212 00:12:56,880 --> 00:12:58,679 Speaker 1: And have you found that it's harder to do that 213 00:12:58,760 --> 00:13:02,040 Speaker 1: in times of mean maybe it always seems like a crisis, right, 214 00:13:02,080 --> 00:13:04,960 Speaker 1: but especially now after you know the Texas rulings, has 215 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:08,280 Speaker 1: it been harder to stay boundary or more boundary? Yeah? 216 00:13:08,280 --> 00:13:10,280 Speaker 1: It has. I mean then there's like a guilt, you 217 00:13:10,280 --> 00:13:14,600 Speaker 1: know that comes with just being able to just being like, 218 00:13:14,640 --> 00:13:16,600 Speaker 1: I have to stop today. I have to stop right now. 219 00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:18,720 Speaker 1: I need to make dinner, I need to eat, I 220 00:13:18,800 --> 00:13:21,160 Speaker 1: need to take a walk. My dog's got to go out. 221 00:13:21,440 --> 00:13:24,320 Speaker 1: It is harder because you feel like, oh my god, 222 00:13:24,360 --> 00:13:27,520 Speaker 1: like this is this needs everything that I can give it. 223 00:13:27,559 --> 00:13:29,880 Speaker 1: But I also know that I start making mistakes when 224 00:13:29,920 --> 00:13:33,800 Speaker 1: I'm tired. I start not being as friendly when I'm tired. 225 00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:37,720 Speaker 1: So yeah, I'm like, let me take care of the basics. First. 226 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:42,720 Speaker 1: I got off Twitter in because it was years of 227 00:13:43,240 --> 00:13:46,600 Speaker 1: people calling me a murderer, telling me that I should 228 00:13:46,640 --> 00:13:48,760 Speaker 1: be murdered. You know, I save a lot of those 229 00:13:48,760 --> 00:13:51,240 Speaker 1: things just because I'm like, well, if anything ever happens 230 00:13:51,240 --> 00:13:53,000 Speaker 1: to me, like, I want to have a record of 231 00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:56,200 Speaker 1: the people who openly called for that. Gave a speech 232 00:13:56,280 --> 00:13:59,719 Speaker 1: in sixteen in front of the Supreme Court, and so 233 00:13:59,840 --> 00:14:02,040 Speaker 1: my jumped on stage and tried to push me off. 234 00:14:02,280 --> 00:14:04,240 Speaker 1: So I stopped speaking in front of crowds after that. 235 00:14:04,440 --> 00:14:08,360 Speaker 1: There's just like, yeah, like balancing a need for visibility 236 00:14:08,520 --> 00:14:12,280 Speaker 1: and you know, sort of like showing strong leadership and 237 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:17,920 Speaker 1: also making sure that I remain alive and intact in 238 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:22,520 Speaker 1: terms of my mental health and spiritual wellness. It's a balance. 239 00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:25,280 Speaker 1: So I tried to cheat that really carefully, and I've 240 00:14:25,320 --> 00:14:29,160 Speaker 1: had a real shift in that since and going to 241 00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:32,560 Speaker 1: like impatient care. I remember there was like a statement 242 00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:35,600 Speaker 1: that one of the providers said that was just like 243 00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:38,880 Speaker 1: you have to organize your life around your recovery. And 244 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:42,080 Speaker 1: that's really what I've tried to do is just create 245 00:14:42,120 --> 00:14:45,360 Speaker 1: the conditions that I felt when I had the most 246 00:14:46,080 --> 00:14:52,280 Speaker 1: support and care. Yeah, and it's not always popular for 247 00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:56,520 Speaker 1: for just like productivity, but it is. But it's making 248 00:14:56,560 --> 00:14:59,840 Speaker 1: sure that I'm here. You know, I'm glad you brought 249 00:14:59,840 --> 00:15:02,960 Speaker 1: the because it is something that I've heard like lots 250 00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:07,080 Speaker 1: of like highly visible black women talk about, like especially 251 00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:08,840 Speaker 1: doing the kind of work that you do, Like there 252 00:15:08,920 --> 00:15:12,640 Speaker 1: is a real dangerous and doing side to this work. 253 00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:14,480 Speaker 1: Until it sounds like you've been able to put some 254 00:15:14,520 --> 00:15:17,160 Speaker 1: things in place to really be able to, you know, 255 00:15:17,200 --> 00:15:18,880 Speaker 1: try to take care of yourself the best way that 256 00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 1: you can. But it also feels like there's this struggle, 257 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:24,240 Speaker 1: right because the work in some ways kind of requires 258 00:15:24,280 --> 00:15:27,320 Speaker 1: you to be highly visible. Yeah, it's been attention, to 259 00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:31,040 Speaker 1: be honest, I think we've shifted into this space where 260 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:34,960 Speaker 1: like being on Twitter is almost like required in order 261 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 1: to build a platform or to be visible in a 262 00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:41,640 Speaker 1: certain way. And so yeah, I think that was a 263 00:15:41,640 --> 00:15:44,440 Speaker 1: really hard decision for me to like basically take myself 264 00:15:44,480 --> 00:15:46,440 Speaker 1: out of that space. But I also felt that there 265 00:15:46,520 --> 00:15:49,080 Speaker 1: was enough sort of like toxic aspects of it that 266 00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:53,560 Speaker 1: ended up being the right decision for me. And I'm 267 00:15:53,560 --> 00:15:56,840 Speaker 1: looking for other ways to be able to be visible, 268 00:15:56,920 --> 00:16:01,120 Speaker 1: whether it's blogging or writing a book things like that. 269 00:16:02,680 --> 00:16:05,440 Speaker 1: And how are you talking with the leaders that you 270 00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:08,280 Speaker 1: lead about like how to take care of their mental 271 00:16:08,280 --> 00:16:10,880 Speaker 1: health doing this work. Well, that's a great question we 272 00:16:10,960 --> 00:16:14,520 Speaker 1: have this afternoon a little leadership circle basically with some 273 00:16:14,600 --> 00:16:17,240 Speaker 1: of them members in our network that we haven't done 274 00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:20,960 Speaker 1: as often as I would have liked. It's hopefully a 275 00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:23,760 Speaker 1: space where we can talk about some of that and 276 00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:26,600 Speaker 1: just like I say, space for people to be able 277 00:16:26,640 --> 00:16:29,560 Speaker 1: to say that they're tired and here validation. I think 278 00:16:29,600 --> 00:16:32,360 Speaker 1: sometimes even when we can't solve the problem, we can 279 00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:36,640 Speaker 1: at least validate what people are feeling. And after a 280 00:16:36,680 --> 00:16:39,680 Speaker 1: lot of those bands, the band happened in Texas on 281 00:16:39,760 --> 00:16:43,640 Speaker 1: September one, there was a number of remember organizations that 282 00:16:43,760 --> 00:16:47,080 Speaker 1: decided to take a pause for a week or decided 283 00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:52,480 Speaker 1: to just regroup, and I did get like some frantic 284 00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:55,920 Speaker 1: questions from some other parties that were like, what's happening? 285 00:16:55,920 --> 00:16:58,680 Speaker 1: Why are people taking Gregg's? And I'm like, I support 286 00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:00,960 Speaker 1: them taking amp break. We have to have moments when 287 00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:04,720 Speaker 1: we pause. We can't just endlessly go without ever stopping. 288 00:17:04,920 --> 00:17:08,240 Speaker 1: I think Treasure from then Ministry has a quote about 289 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:11,160 Speaker 1: how will we be able to experience liberation if we're 290 00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:14,520 Speaker 1: too tired to me to know what it feels like. 291 00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:19,359 Speaker 1: I hope to also validate our members taking the breaks 292 00:17:19,400 --> 00:17:22,840 Speaker 1: that they need to be able to regroup, reset replenish 293 00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:26,400 Speaker 1: in order to be able to give to the work. Yeah, 294 00:17:26,440 --> 00:17:29,359 Speaker 1: that is really important. And how have you been able 295 00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:31,960 Speaker 1: to deal with some of the hopelessness maybe for yourself 296 00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:35,399 Speaker 1: and for your leaders that sometimes comes with like this 297 00:17:35,480 --> 00:17:39,560 Speaker 1: heat after heat that feels relentless. Yeah. I think when 298 00:17:39,560 --> 00:17:43,040 Speaker 1: you work on an actual hotline, a helpline, when somebody's 299 00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:46,240 Speaker 1: calling and you're able to concretely get them the help 300 00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:49,320 Speaker 1: that they need, it's something that really chips away at 301 00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:52,520 Speaker 1: that hopelessness. And it's not something that I've done that 302 00:17:52,640 --> 00:17:55,600 Speaker 1: often from where I sit, but I have done it before. 303 00:17:55,600 --> 00:18:00,480 Speaker 1: And I also have helped with some like logistical aspects 304 00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:02,920 Speaker 1: of somebody trying to get to care And it gives 305 00:18:02,960 --> 00:18:05,320 Speaker 1: you just like a very concrete feeling of like I 306 00:18:05,359 --> 00:18:09,520 Speaker 1: am doing something, I am helping the situation was not 307 00:18:09,680 --> 00:18:11,920 Speaker 1: great and now it's better. And that's on a very 308 00:18:12,000 --> 00:18:15,040 Speaker 1: micro individual level. I think sometimes we talk about the 309 00:18:15,040 --> 00:18:18,800 Speaker 1: stuff in very theoretical ways, but yeah, when you are 310 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:23,400 Speaker 1: actually talking to individual people and there texting you and 311 00:18:23,440 --> 00:18:26,320 Speaker 1: calling you and thanking you and saying like you changed 312 00:18:26,359 --> 00:18:28,960 Speaker 1: my life, I don't know what I've would have done 313 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:32,760 Speaker 1: without your help. Those things, I think are what people 314 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:34,840 Speaker 1: help people keep going, And that's what those are things 315 00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:38,760 Speaker 1: that helped me keep going for sure, because yeah, it 316 00:18:38,800 --> 00:18:40,840 Speaker 1: can if you just sort of give and you can't 317 00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:44,560 Speaker 1: give into the like hopelessness. That's what you know, the 318 00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:48,840 Speaker 1: anti choice folks want to maybe, so I'm not going 319 00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:51,960 Speaker 1: to give them that, but yeah, you just you have 320 00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:56,000 Speaker 1: to find the small places of sweetness to counteract like 321 00:18:56,040 --> 00:18:59,720 Speaker 1: all of the cruelty. Mm hmmm. So in addition to 322 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:02,879 Speaker 1: your work as the executive director, you are also trained 323 00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:05,320 Speaker 1: as a doula. Can you tell us a little bit 324 00:19:05,359 --> 00:19:08,520 Speaker 1: more about like your training in it, like would inspired 325 00:19:08,520 --> 00:19:10,400 Speaker 1: you to do that and how that informs your work 326 00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:13,240 Speaker 1: as the executive director. Yeah, thank you for asking that. 327 00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 1: I never get to talk about that. I don't. I 328 00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:17,600 Speaker 1: don't not like actively working as a tool right now, 329 00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:21,399 Speaker 1: but I have in the past. I went to doula 330 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:24,119 Speaker 1: training when I was leading the Illinois Caucus for Adolescent 331 00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:26,879 Speaker 1: Health and we were doing work on youth sexual health 332 00:19:27,119 --> 00:19:31,080 Speaker 1: rights and identities, and we were thinking about starting a 333 00:19:31,119 --> 00:19:34,120 Speaker 1: youth DULA program because we did a lot of work 334 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:36,760 Speaker 1: to support young parents and we were just trying to 335 00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:40,320 Speaker 1: think of what different things will be supportive and a 336 00:19:40,359 --> 00:19:42,800 Speaker 1: few of us decided, well, we can't start the program 337 00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:46,240 Speaker 1: without doing the training ourselves first, and so I went 338 00:19:46,560 --> 00:19:51,240 Speaker 1: to the training in twenty It was at the time 339 00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:56,000 Speaker 1: I see TC International Center for a Traditional child Bearing. 340 00:19:56,520 --> 00:19:59,480 Speaker 1: I think they've changed their name since then, but it 341 00:19:59,560 --> 00:20:06,200 Speaker 1: was based like a culturally specific Black focused DULA training program, which, man, 342 00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:09,800 Speaker 1: it was really life changing for me. I've given birth 343 00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:13,399 Speaker 1: twice and I had not thought critically about those experiences 344 00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:16,920 Speaker 1: and until I went through DULA training and thought about 345 00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:19,000 Speaker 1: where I had support and where I didn't have support. 346 00:20:19,359 --> 00:20:23,240 Speaker 1: And there's a group here called Chicago Volunteer Dulas, and 347 00:20:23,480 --> 00:20:26,240 Speaker 1: I volunteered with them to do just been on call 348 00:20:26,359 --> 00:20:29,000 Speaker 1: DULA for people who were like in labor and needed help. 349 00:20:29,240 --> 00:20:32,600 Speaker 1: And it was again one of those things that just 350 00:20:33,359 --> 00:20:35,800 Speaker 1: really fed me and filled me up to know, like 351 00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:39,320 Speaker 1: to concretely like go to somebody's birth, stand by their side, 352 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:43,280 Speaker 1: you know, it's just like accompaniment, holding space for somebody. 353 00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:45,840 Speaker 1: And that is a lot of what abortion funds do 354 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:49,320 Speaker 1: as well. So I think that also, I always, even 355 00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:52,000 Speaker 1: though my work is very focused on abortion, um like 356 00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:56,840 Speaker 1: operating from a reproductive justice framework, it's about more than abortion, 357 00:20:56,920 --> 00:21:01,320 Speaker 1: thinking about birth, parenting, all of the variances that make 358 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:05,840 Speaker 1: up our reproductive lives, and I try to cut at 359 00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:08,920 Speaker 1: least mentally, those things are all connected to me, and 360 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:12,280 Speaker 1: so I try to remember that in my work and 361 00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:16,080 Speaker 1: remember the individual people that I'm working with. M more 362 00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:29,160 Speaker 1: from my conversation with your MONTI after the break, can 363 00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:31,960 Speaker 1: you give us a breakdown of what people are talking about? 364 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:35,120 Speaker 1: What do we mean when we say reproductive justice. Reproductive 365 00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:39,720 Speaker 1: justice is a framework that was started by black women 366 00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:43,840 Speaker 1: in the early nineties that is really linking reproductive rights 367 00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:47,919 Speaker 1: with social justice and complicating the quote unquote pro choice 368 00:21:48,119 --> 00:21:51,439 Speaker 1: narrative and say like, our choices are political, actually, and 369 00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:55,800 Speaker 1: our choices are also impacted by our societal experience and 370 00:21:55,840 --> 00:21:58,960 Speaker 1: our access to justice. So it's not just a bad 371 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:01,119 Speaker 1: a portion, but the right to have a child, the 372 00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 1: right to not have a child, and also the right 373 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:07,679 Speaker 1: to parent the children that you have without interference. We 374 00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:09,800 Speaker 1: want our children to grow up, you know, as a 375 00:22:09,840 --> 00:22:13,160 Speaker 1: mom of black sons, you know, I'm just like, yeah, 376 00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:15,239 Speaker 1: I want them to be able to grow up. And 377 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:19,520 Speaker 1: I also see the police violence as an issue that 378 00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:22,880 Speaker 1: impacts whether people decide to parent at all. And so 379 00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:27,800 Speaker 1: you can't just say, like abortion is for people who 380 00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:30,679 Speaker 1: don't like children or something like that. It's not that simple. 381 00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:34,720 Speaker 1: Most of the people who have abortions are already parenting, so, 382 00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:37,200 Speaker 1: you know, and don't have the resources that they need 383 00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:39,280 Speaker 1: or the supports that they need to have the families 384 00:22:39,280 --> 00:22:42,560 Speaker 1: that they want to have. So reproductive justice is a 385 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:47,440 Speaker 1: broader framework that is about trying to ensure that all 386 00:22:47,480 --> 00:22:50,960 Speaker 1: of us have the rights and resources to decide if, when, 387 00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:53,600 Speaker 1: and how we have a family. And I think that 388 00:22:53,600 --> 00:22:56,000 Speaker 1: that's helpful to hear because I think sometimes people here 389 00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:59,399 Speaker 1: reproductive justice and the only think abortion, right when there 390 00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:01,879 Speaker 1: are so many other pieces to the puzzle. Yeah, and 391 00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:06,000 Speaker 1: they're related. I had a miscarriage in and I started 392 00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:10,720 Speaker 1: to pay attention more to about like miscarriage narratives and abortion, 393 00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:13,720 Speaker 1: and I realized like, also, oh, this is what happened 394 00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:16,240 Speaker 1: when I was in the hospital. I got my discharged 395 00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:19,879 Speaker 1: paperwork and it said abortion on it, and I was like, oh, 396 00:23:20,040 --> 00:23:22,280 Speaker 1: I didn't have an abortion. I had a miscarriage. Then 397 00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:25,840 Speaker 1: I just just sent me down this spiral of like, oh, 398 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:31,359 Speaker 1: like it actually is technically called an abortion, but because 399 00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:37,200 Speaker 1: that word has been so politicized, like we don't yeah, 400 00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:40,320 Speaker 1: we can't talk about pregnancy loss without or like the 401 00:23:40,400 --> 00:23:45,080 Speaker 1: ending of pregnancy without it being this supercharged conversation. And 402 00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:47,920 Speaker 1: I started to realize that there was these hospitals that 403 00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:52,359 Speaker 1: folks would be going for miscarriage management care and being 404 00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:57,000 Speaker 1: turned away because the help that they needed is very 405 00:23:57,040 --> 00:24:00,080 Speaker 1: similar to what it takes to perform an aboard s. 406 00:24:01,119 --> 00:24:04,080 Speaker 1: So yeah, you can't really separate like some people be like, well, 407 00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:07,280 Speaker 1: you know, a miscarriage somebody didn't means in their pregnancy, 408 00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:09,399 Speaker 1: and it's like, yeah, okay, but they're still dealing with 409 00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:13,399 Speaker 1: the same barriers to care that people who intended to 410 00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:17,600 Speaker 1: determinate their pregnancies. And that's not fair that like everybody 411 00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:20,640 Speaker 1: should have access to the same level care and many 412 00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:22,840 Speaker 1: in the same thing with birth, all of these Black 413 00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:25,840 Speaker 1: women who are the mortality right, the Black women who 414 00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:28,520 Speaker 1: are dying in childbirth, and you can't separate that from 415 00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:31,760 Speaker 1: whether you decide to even carry your pregnancy to term, 416 00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:36,120 Speaker 1: like finding out you're pregnant, and then also reconciling how 417 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:38,520 Speaker 1: many Black women are dying from childbirth. People are like 418 00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:41,359 Speaker 1: I don't want to do that, no, thank you. So 419 00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:46,080 Speaker 1: it's all connected and related, and I don't think we 420 00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:49,800 Speaker 1: get to talk about those connections enough, and always conversations 421 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 1: end up being like very siloed, and so I really 422 00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:56,160 Speaker 1: welcome opportunities to talk about it all together. Are there 423 00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:58,520 Speaker 1: other things that you feel like are left out of 424 00:24:58,520 --> 00:25:01,600 Speaker 1: this conversation or these conversations that you would love for 425 00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:04,960 Speaker 1: people to know. Is there an additional nuance that is 426 00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:07,280 Speaker 1: often left out that you think, oh, this could be 427 00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:11,080 Speaker 1: helpful for people. I think that we definitely as society 428 00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:14,600 Speaker 1: are starting to gain more nuanced and talking about sex 429 00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:16,879 Speaker 1: and gender, but we still have a long way to go. 430 00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:22,560 Speaker 1: I feel really ambivalent about my own gender, and I 431 00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:27,760 Speaker 1: found out after a long time of like having this 432 00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:32,199 Speaker 1: existential dealing or thinking about it, that I am intersex. 433 00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:37,280 Speaker 1: I sometimes feel frustrated in the conversations about like reproductive 434 00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:42,040 Speaker 1: health rights and justice because it is so binary and 435 00:25:42,040 --> 00:25:44,720 Speaker 1: how we talk about it, and there's been sometimes debates 436 00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:48,120 Speaker 1: over like whether we can use support people versus women, 437 00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:51,560 Speaker 1: or recognizing that people of all sexes and people of 438 00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:55,600 Speaker 1: all genders are are having abortions, are having pregnancies, and 439 00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:57,800 Speaker 1: so like more nuanced about that. And I think that 440 00:25:57,800 --> 00:26:00,359 Speaker 1: that leads me to the other thing that I wish 441 00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:03,680 Speaker 1: we talked more about, which is just like sex edge 442 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:07,600 Speaker 1: because there's just so much ignorance. I don't mean that 443 00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:09,840 Speaker 1: in like a pejorative way. I just mean like people 444 00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:12,280 Speaker 1: just don't know. They've never been taught. But I don't 445 00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:15,760 Speaker 1: think that's by accident. But yeah, we don't have comprehensive 446 00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:19,080 Speaker 1: sex ed in this country is widely variable from state 447 00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:22,560 Speaker 1: to state, city to city, and a lot of these 448 00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:25,199 Speaker 1: politicians and lawmakers that are making decisions don't even know 449 00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:27,240 Speaker 1: how the body works. You know. That's where you get 450 00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:31,240 Speaker 1: people saying stuff like, you know, politicians saying stuff like, oh, 451 00:26:31,280 --> 00:26:35,760 Speaker 1: if somebody is raped, then the body just shuts down pregnancy, 452 00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:39,159 Speaker 1: it doesn't happen. Like you're just like, what are you talking? 453 00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:42,840 Speaker 1: What where did you get that? Yeah, there's some really 454 00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:45,240 Speaker 1: you know, great organizations that are putting a lot of 455 00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:47,040 Speaker 1: work into sex ed, but I think it should just 456 00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:52,240 Speaker 1: be a lot more universal priority and thinking about young people. 457 00:26:53,000 --> 00:27:00,800 Speaker 1: The anti choice folks really use young people unfortunately as weapon. 458 00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:03,639 Speaker 1: They trot young people out, They take them on the 459 00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:06,240 Speaker 1: field trips and take them outside of apportion clinics and 460 00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:10,000 Speaker 1: have them stand outside shaming the people going into those clinics, 461 00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:13,440 Speaker 1: you know, by the dozens, by the hundreds. Sometimes they 462 00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:15,800 Speaker 1: have will take like a whole camp, a whole summer camp, 463 00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:19,439 Speaker 1: and just and that's their activity. I think that's terrible 464 00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:23,000 Speaker 1: the way that they are politicizing young people in that way. 465 00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:26,080 Speaker 1: But I also think there's just a huge opportunity for 466 00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:30,359 Speaker 1: us to like counteract that and teaching young people about 467 00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:36,360 Speaker 1: their bodies and talking honestly about sexuality, gender reproduction, all 468 00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:39,080 Speaker 1: of the things. And yeah, a lot of us are 469 00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:42,720 Speaker 1: afraid to do that. So I just think I would 470 00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:47,919 Speaker 1: like to see more sex education. Yeah, it sounds like 471 00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:49,760 Speaker 1: it definitely would help to cut down on at least 472 00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:52,800 Speaker 1: some of the UM confusion, right, and like you mentioned 473 00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:55,320 Speaker 1: the ignorance that people just really don't have the correct 474 00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:59,800 Speaker 1: information sometimes. Yeah. So you mentioned that the need and 475 00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:03,800 Speaker 1: the demand for community services really increased during the pandemic, 476 00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:06,080 Speaker 1: even while you know, those of you doing the work 477 00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:10,520 Speaker 1: have really filed exhausted. What would you say that organizations 478 00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:14,800 Speaker 1: need most right now like that are doing this work. Yeah, 479 00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:22,120 Speaker 1: we need money, people and UM legal support. Honestly, those 480 00:28:22,119 --> 00:28:26,480 Speaker 1: are the biggest things. UM, we need money because there's 481 00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:29,000 Speaker 1: a lot more. What I should say, our members need 482 00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:31,560 Speaker 1: money because when you have a band like the one 483 00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:33,760 Speaker 1: in Texas, that means people need to leave the state, 484 00:28:34,280 --> 00:28:38,480 Speaker 1: and even like driving, so the next states, those most 485 00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:43,840 Speaker 1: immediate states can be overwhelmed. So sometimes it's even more 486 00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:46,840 Speaker 1: prudent to get on a plane and fly to Illinois 487 00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:50,640 Speaker 1: or somewhere else, and so that that's more expensive, but 488 00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:53,360 Speaker 1: that's more expensive than somebody giving a ride. So I've 489 00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:57,720 Speaker 1: been hearing that they expect five times more, they need 490 00:28:57,840 --> 00:29:01,200 Speaker 1: five times more than what they they have been giving 491 00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:04,920 Speaker 1: away to support that need. And then people just case 492 00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:08,840 Speaker 1: management and volunteers are really important. But I don't think 493 00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:11,520 Speaker 1: people know that a lot of abortion funds are volunteer run, 494 00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:15,480 Speaker 1: so that that's something that has been shifting over time 495 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:17,840 Speaker 1: with a lot of effort and fund raising to try 496 00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:20,240 Speaker 1: to get people to be paid for their labor. We 497 00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:23,880 Speaker 1: six years ago we had of our members had paid staff. 498 00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:29,000 Speaker 1: Now about to have at least one paid staff. But 499 00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:33,080 Speaker 1: still there's like a lot that still just have only volunteers. 500 00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:37,760 Speaker 1: And so volunteer management and being able to also have 501 00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:40,840 Speaker 1: enough people to train people, to be able to let 502 00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:43,960 Speaker 1: people rest is important. Like I said, this sort of 503 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,520 Speaker 1: is the sort of like being able to relay pass 504 00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:49,520 Speaker 1: the bouton is somebody Okay, you take it, I'm gonna 505 00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:51,400 Speaker 1: arrest you take it, and I'll take it back. And 506 00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:54,720 Speaker 1: then Yeah, I just think that the legal support is 507 00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:58,640 Speaker 1: really important because all of this criminalization that is happening, 508 00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:02,280 Speaker 1: and there's there's a repro legal defense line that is 509 00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:05,480 Speaker 1: created out of if when how an organization in our movement, 510 00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:07,640 Speaker 1: which is going to be really important. I will add 511 00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:09,560 Speaker 1: one more thing, which is just like talking about the 512 00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:14,640 Speaker 1: issues and not causing more harm by talking about them. 513 00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:19,840 Speaker 1: I think immediately after the bands, people were using phrases 514 00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:24,479 Speaker 1: like Texas Taliman and talking about the Handmaid's Tale and 515 00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:28,160 Speaker 1: all of this, and we don't have to make references 516 00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 1: like to to folks outside of the country like we 517 00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:34,920 Speaker 1: get if anything, we give reference to KKK and a 518 00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:41,480 Speaker 1: white supremacist that make these laws what they are. But yeah, 519 00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:43,960 Speaker 1: I think just like not adding more stigma to the 520 00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:47,840 Speaker 1: issue and talking about it in a way that centers 521 00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:51,080 Speaker 1: the people most impacted, which like we talked about earlier, 522 00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:53,959 Speaker 1: where are like black and brown folks and people who 523 00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:56,920 Speaker 1: are struggling to make ends meet. So what advice would 524 00:30:56,920 --> 00:30:59,400 Speaker 1: you have for young people who are wanting to get 525 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:03,120 Speaker 1: involved in the reproductive justice movement? Well, first of all, 526 00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:08,360 Speaker 1: come on, come on. There's lots of opportunity for sure, 527 00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:12,040 Speaker 1: But I think also there is a new breed of 528 00:31:12,080 --> 00:31:17,040 Speaker 1: like worker quote unquote, where like people are not willing 529 00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:20,959 Speaker 1: to sacrifice their entire lives for their employment. And I 530 00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:23,760 Speaker 1: really support that. So my advice to young leaders is, 531 00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:26,680 Speaker 1: don't collapse yourself into your job. Make space for the 532 00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:28,720 Speaker 1: other things that you care about and the other parts 533 00:31:28,760 --> 00:31:32,520 Speaker 1: of you that are important, and yeah, be a whole person. 534 00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:37,000 Speaker 1: Give what you can give, but don't give everything away. Yeah, 535 00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:41,920 Speaker 1: that sounds very important. So where can people find more 536 00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:44,240 Speaker 1: information your money? You know, if they want to volunteer 537 00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:47,120 Speaker 1: or donate or get involved in any of the organizations, 538 00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:50,760 Speaker 1: where should they go? Yeah, our website is abortion Funds 539 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:53,760 Speaker 1: dot org and we have a tab called need an Abortion. 540 00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:55,720 Speaker 1: If you click on there, there's a list of every 541 00:31:55,800 --> 00:31:58,720 Speaker 1: abortion fund in every state. So you can go to 542 00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:01,000 Speaker 1: our website to find all of the abortion funds. You 543 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:03,080 Speaker 1: can find one that's local to you, You can donate, 544 00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:06,760 Speaker 1: you can volunteer. All the affirmation is there all of 545 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:11,200 Speaker 1: our socials. It's the same across Twitter and Instagram. Abortion 546 00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:15,160 Speaker 1: Funds basically at Abortion Funds and Facebook, National Network of 547 00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:18,880 Speaker 1: abortion Funds perfect Well, thank you so much for sharing 548 00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:21,600 Speaker 1: this with us. I appreciate it. Sure, I appreciate you 549 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:26,520 Speaker 1: having me. I'm so glad your Monty was able to 550 00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:29,600 Speaker 1: share her exercise with us today. To learn more about 551 00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:32,240 Speaker 1: her work or to check out the resources she shared, 552 00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:35,120 Speaker 1: visit the show notes at Therapy for Black Girls dot 553 00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:38,280 Speaker 1: com slash Session too to eight, and don't forget to 554 00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:40,240 Speaker 1: text two of your girls and tell them to check 555 00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:43,160 Speaker 1: out this episode as well. If you're looking for a 556 00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:45,760 Speaker 1: therapist in your area, be sure to check out our 557 00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:49,960 Speaker 1: therapist directory at Therapy for lack Girls dot com slash directory. 558 00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:52,640 Speaker 1: And if you want to continue digging into this topic 559 00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,680 Speaker 1: or just be in community with other sisters, come on 560 00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:58,160 Speaker 1: over and join us in the Sister Circle. It's our 561 00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:01,040 Speaker 1: cozy corner of the Internet design and just for black women. 562 00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:04,000 Speaker 1: You can join us at community dot Therapy for Black 563 00:33:04,040 --> 00:33:07,120 Speaker 1: Girls dot com. Thank you all so much for joining 564 00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:09,720 Speaker 1: me again this week. I look forward to continue in 565 00:33:09,760 --> 00:33:13,360 Speaker 1: this conversation with you all real soon. Take it care