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Speaker 1: Hey, welcome in. I'm Doug Gottlieb, and this is all ball,

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Speaker 1: all basketball, all the time. We have a lengthy discussion

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Speaker 1: with my man Mike Lewis, uh former Gatorade Player of

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Speaker 1: the Year in the State of Indiana. But you'll hear

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Speaker 1: an interesting story as far as whether or not he

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Speaker 1: was Mr Basketball in the State of Indiana, played for

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Speaker 1: I you started for four years. Got some Bob Nights stories, um,

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Speaker 1: And then we'll talk about coaching and coaching with with

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Speaker 1: Brad Stevens and what that's really like coaching with Tim

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Speaker 1: Miles this last year now being an assistant coach at

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Speaker 1: u c L A. Plus he played for uh Rick

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Speaker 1: Berry in the usb L. We played against each other,

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Speaker 1: So we got some good stuff going on with with

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Speaker 1: Mike Lewis. He'll join me in a moment. We're less

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Speaker 1: than a week away from the free agency bonanza, and

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Speaker 1: I don't know what to think. You know, this is

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Speaker 1: kind of strangely what we've built up to all year

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Speaker 1: is having nothing to do with actual basketball. Um. I'm

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Speaker 1: torn on the Kyrie Irving thing because I've been somebody

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Speaker 1: who's trying to tell people just how talented he is.

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Speaker 1: But I had no idea how much of a pain

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Speaker 1: the ass he was until I talked to some people

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Speaker 1: that were in Boston and people that have been in Cleveland,

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Speaker 1: and they all kind of say the same thing, which is, like, dude,

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Speaker 1: he's amazingly talented. He's not a leader. And um, he's

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Speaker 1: one of those guys that he's smart enough. It's not

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Speaker 1: like he's Magna cum Latti, like you know, he's a

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Speaker 1: bright enough guy, but he thinks he knows everything. So

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Speaker 1: he tries to look for, you know, higher meaning for

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Speaker 1: every little thing you just want to get, like oh,

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Speaker 1: just wears people out. And because he was kind of

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Speaker 1: brought up in this under Lebron's wing, that's how you lead.

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Speaker 1: He tries to be Lebron James and Evisceray dudes in film,

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Speaker 1: and he's not Lebron James. And even Lebron remember he

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Speaker 1: when when he lights into dudes, which he didn't do

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Speaker 1: this year. This year, he would just turn very negative

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Speaker 1: on guys. He's he's still been Lebron James and all

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Speaker 1: those guys have been brought in, you know, to play

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Speaker 1: with him, whereas you know, Kyrie Irving was brought to

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Speaker 1: the Celtics and then they played without him, and so

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Speaker 1: it's just doesn't have a great feel for the social

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Speaker 1: jiu jitsu. As a friend of mine says of the moment,

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Speaker 1: So I'm Kevin Durant, Like, is that the guy I

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Speaker 1: want to tie my ship too? Like? I have a

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Speaker 1: choice of Steph Curry, who's like, look, is Steph easy

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Speaker 1: to play with? Maybe not? He takes some crazy shots,

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Speaker 1: he turns the ball over. You gotta hide for him defensively,

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Speaker 1: but as a guy, he's easy. Or you got Kyrie Irving,

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Speaker 1: who is a better ball handler, is an incredible shotmaker. Differently,

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Speaker 1: um but does something is actually better than Steph Curry.

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Speaker 1: But it's just every day is heavy. It's not that

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Speaker 1: much fun. I don't know, I've as I just stay

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Speaker 1: in Golden State. Everybody's everybody wants to accomplish all these

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Speaker 1: things off the basket before you have the best way

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Speaker 1: to accomplish things out the BASKETBA floor is win fucking championships.

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Speaker 1: Excuse my language if you have kids listening to this,

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Speaker 1: but this whole idea of you know, if you go

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Speaker 1: to New York, you can lots of guys that played

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Speaker 1: in New York. You see any of them on TV. No,

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Speaker 1: you know why their team sucks. That's why do I

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Speaker 1: see Steph Curry on a bunch of ads? Oakland was

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Speaker 1: in some big market. Steph Curry is awesome. That's it, right,

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Speaker 1: that's it. Lebron James had no trouble getting ads in

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Speaker 1: Akron or in Miami. Why because he's Lebron James. He's awesome.

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Speaker 1: Russell Westbrook has no problem getting ads. Paul George has

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Speaker 1: no problem getting as he played Indianapolis and Oklahma City.

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Speaker 1: If you're really good and you got a good personality,

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Speaker 1: you have option options. Like it is just such a

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Speaker 1: such a bunch of bullshit that you have to, like,

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Speaker 1: you gott to move to New York. Why because rich

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Speaker 1: Climbing lives in New York? Like all right, Like the

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Speaker 1: perfect example actually is billionaire Row for the Golden State Warriors.

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Speaker 1: Why not to New York when all the people with

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Speaker 1: all the money, all the game changers, they're right here.

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Speaker 1: I hate to be that guy, but all the game

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Speaker 1: changers in the world are in Silicon Valley. That's where

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Speaker 1: the money is. Even in our industry. Like we're all

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Speaker 1: just waiting to see when Apple or Facebook or Google

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Speaker 1: or Amazon or Yahoo. They just you know, they just

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Speaker 1: buy something. They're like, all right, we have f you money.

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Speaker 1: Here's f you like they do that. They can buy

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Speaker 1: all of us ten times over. And you want to

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Speaker 1: win to New York. That's the media capital of the world. No,

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Speaker 1: it's not the capital world is in Silicon Valley, Dude,

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Speaker 1: I hate to I hate to be that guys, like,

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Speaker 1: this is not the ES, It's two thousand. All the

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Speaker 1: money is in San Francisco and all the unknown and yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's some pitfalls and played in Golden State. Might not

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Speaker 1: be your team whenever they might only had to call

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Speaker 1: in you to bail them out. You gotta play both ends.

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Speaker 1: Gets a little bit old, Okay, I'll tell you what's worse.

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Speaker 1: The monotony of losing teaching people who have never won

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Speaker 1: a franchise, has never won to win. I just this

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Speaker 1: whole idea of like, you gotta go to New York.

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Speaker 1: Why Jerry Lynn had to go to New York because

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Speaker 1: he was a nobody got an opportunity with a team

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Speaker 1: that was banged up and a co in Mike D'Antoni.

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Speaker 1: You're not jermy Lyne're Kevin Durant. Stay where you are

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Speaker 1: with a bunch of titles. Have the Last Laugh. By

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Speaker 1: the way, you can listen to my daily radio show

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Speaker 1: three to six Eastern or twelve three Pacific on Fox

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Speaker 1: Sports Radio or the I Heart Radio app. Alright, let's

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Speaker 1: get you to Mike Lewis. He has just become a

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Speaker 1: new assistant coach at U c l A. He played

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Speaker 1: in Indiana, He coached at Brett Butler, he coached in

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Speaker 1: Nebraski coach the Eastern Illinois coach of Texas Tech. He

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Speaker 1: coaches Stephen F. Austin without fur their doo. Here's my

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Speaker 1: discussion with U c l A assistant former Indiana player

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Speaker 1: and captain Mike Lewis. All right, let's start at the beginning, right,

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Speaker 1: Jasper Indiana. Right, that's where you were Mr Basketball in

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Speaker 1: the state of Indiana. Um, you're you're like you started

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Speaker 1: whooping when like birth. Right, That's that's an Indiana thing.

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Speaker 1: You grew up whooping the driveway. Did you have a

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Speaker 1: half court out back pick? Give me the picturesque Indiana

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Speaker 1: setting of Mike Lewis's upbringing. Well, I had a basketball

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Speaker 1: goal in the the driveway, but I was I was

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Speaker 1: lucky to have a have a dad that was a

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Speaker 1: basketball coach, um in high school. Coach in high school,

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Speaker 1: and so I was I was lucky enough to tag

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Speaker 1: along the practices and um games, and so I was

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Speaker 1: always I was always in a gym. Um. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean everybody in Indiana grows up. Um. You know,

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Speaker 1: there's there's hoops everywhere. I mean, if you can, you've

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Speaker 1: got a flat side of the building, you can go

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Speaker 1: to basketball whoop on it in Indiana. So it's obviously

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Speaker 1: a great place to grow up. Um. I was always

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Speaker 1: around the game. My grandfather coach. Like I said, my

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Speaker 1: dad coach. My grandfather became the commissioner of the Indiana

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Speaker 1: High School Athletic Association for many years until my junior

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Speaker 1: year of high school when he retired. Um my dad

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Speaker 1: coached all the way up until my junior year high

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Speaker 1: school when he became the athletic director um at our

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Speaker 1: at our high school. And so I just always around

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Speaker 1: the game. UM. Very fortunate from that aspect, probably like

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Speaker 1: you just you know, having a dad that that allows

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Speaker 1: you to develop and grow at your own page as

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Speaker 1: a basketball player. And when when when you're allowed to

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Speaker 1: grow up that way, you learned to love the game

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Speaker 1: and appreciate everything that the game can give you. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So your dad was the coach of Jasper, your entire

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Speaker 1: yours now now we moved, We moved around. Like I

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Speaker 1: was born in Indianapolis. My dad was an assistant coach

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Speaker 1: at Lebanon High School just on the northwest side of

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Speaker 1: Indianapolis for legendary high school coach named Jim rosen Steele

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Speaker 1: who coached Rick Mount way back in the day. And

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Speaker 1: that's where my dad got his start. And then he

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Speaker 1: became a head coach Triton Central High School, Lufton High School,

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Speaker 1: at Frontier High School, and then we moved to Jasper,

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Speaker 1: Indiana when I was going into second grade, and he

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Speaker 1: became the varsity assistant at Jasper and was that held

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Speaker 1: that position when he became the athletic director my junior

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Speaker 1: year high school. So he wasn't then he moved around,

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Speaker 1: We moved around. I was. I was. I Actually, the

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Speaker 1: funny story is I grew up a Purdue fan. When

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Speaker 1: I was a little kid, I went to prede basketball

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Speaker 1: camps and I worked camps as a counselor all the

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Speaker 1: way up and you know, until I got into high school.

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Speaker 1: And and then obviously Jasper from the southwestern part of Indiana,

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Speaker 1: and you're in you're in Merston, and I U culture

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Speaker 1: and and uh that's when it became pretty apparent I

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Speaker 1: was gonna go to Indiana. I had a chance. Why

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Speaker 1: did you like Why why did you like Perdue? Because

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Speaker 1: everybody else, like Indiana was one of those things. Well, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean Frontier High School was twenty minutes from Prince

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Speaker 1: Campas I spent a majority of my younger years up

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Speaker 1: until second grade, I was in northern Indiana. Um, and

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Speaker 1: at that time, like you didn't have you know, ESPN

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Speaker 1: wasn't big, you didn't you got Channel four, and so

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Speaker 1: you saw the games on TV at that time. And

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Speaker 1: in Indiana you got Perdue in Indiana and on football

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Speaker 1: Saturdays you got Notre Dame. So I just grew up

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Speaker 1: around pretty basketball up until second grade when we moved

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Speaker 1: to southwestern Indiana. And uh, you know I was able

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Speaker 1: to My dad worked the camps. I would go with him.

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Speaker 1: I gotta be a counselor at a young age, and uh,

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Speaker 1: I just kind of had that and then and then

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Speaker 1: obviously things changed as I got older. Okay, so, uh,

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Speaker 1: you're in high school, your dad, so your dad wasn't

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Speaker 1: the varsity head coach now he was assistant coach. So

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Speaker 1: what And then when when did you start playing varsity?

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Speaker 1: I started playing as freshman. I started, um um, as

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Speaker 1: a freshman in high school, I played uh my first name,

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Speaker 1: I played three quarters of JV one game of arsity.

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Speaker 1: Um my second game, I've played one quarter of JB,

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Speaker 1: three quarters of varsity, and then I played the rest varsity.

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Speaker 1: So I was I was. Actually I actually had a

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Speaker 1: teammate high school teammate named Scott Roland, who obviously is

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Speaker 1: a Major League baseball fame. So he was a senior

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Speaker 1: when I was a freshman, and and um, you know,

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Speaker 1: it was a great good time. A lot of people

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Speaker 1: don't realize, oh one was what a great basketball player

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Speaker 1: he was. He's Namdi, an all star, sent a scholarship

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Speaker 1: of Georgia. And then obviously I think he made the

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Speaker 1: right decision by pursuing baseball. Um, but out standing high

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Speaker 1: school player. Your childhood hero was who Damon Bailey? Okay,

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Speaker 1: what town did day? I mean, like, I I know

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Speaker 1: the legend of David Bailey and and this is like

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Speaker 1: that you're gonna have a distinct cutoff between anybody our

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Speaker 1: age and anybody like five years younger probably doesn't, right, Like,

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Speaker 1: I just were just being kind of honest. And it

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Speaker 1: was because of it is because of the Season on

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Speaker 1: the Brink really where when Steve Alford was there, who

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Speaker 1: was all everything, all anybody could talk about was Damon Bailey.

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Speaker 1: He committed to Indiana as like a freshman, and uh,

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Speaker 1: it was kind of looming over. Everybody's said the damon

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Speaker 1: Damon Bailey's coming. Um, so so take me through the

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Speaker 1: Damon bailthing. He grew up where he grew up in Bedford.

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Speaker 1: Uh we're actually a small town, um just outside of Bedford,

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Speaker 1: but he went to Bedford North Lawrence High School. Um,

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Speaker 1: I mean it's kind of hard to explain if you

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Speaker 1: weren't growing up or we're if you weren't in Indiana

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Speaker 1: at that time. I mean he was like the Beatles.

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Speaker 1: I mean everywhere he went, every gym was sold out,

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Speaker 1: every game was sold out. Um, he would just get

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Speaker 1: mobbed everywhere he went. And a lot of it was,

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Speaker 1: you know, because of the Season on the Brink book

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Speaker 1: and the notoriety that he got um from that when

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Speaker 1: coach knight Win watched him as an eighth grader, um,

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Speaker 1: but he uh, I mean he and then he had

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Speaker 1: a great, great high school career, had had a really

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Speaker 1: good college career. But just you know, I mean, who

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Speaker 1: can live up to the expectations of what was was

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Speaker 1: put on him at that time? But he was he

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Speaker 1: was everything in anybody in in the n at that

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Speaker 1: time you wanted to grow up and and be Damon Bailey.

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Speaker 1: And then, um, you know, the Pacers had started to

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Speaker 1: get rolling as I got into junior high and so

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Speaker 1: you know, then I guess you know, my second childhood

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Speaker 1: hero would be be Reggie Miller, which is it's kind

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Speaker 1: of ironic now you're sitting sitting on a campus where

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Speaker 1: he once walked around. I was this ball boy a

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Speaker 1: couple of times because I was. I grew up playing

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Speaker 1: with with the Hazard boys, um with you know, Doc

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Speaker 1: Hazard and with Jalil and um Rashid Hazard and so

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Speaker 1: Rashid and I would go be ball boys. And like

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Speaker 1: here here's what people don't know about about Reggie. He

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Speaker 1: was an unbelievable college player as a shooter. But they

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Speaker 1: were terrible. They were massive underachievers, like for for years

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Speaker 1: they they had so much skill, but he pooh Richardson

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Speaker 1: Um Charles Roshlyn like they had his squad, and I

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Speaker 1: remember going to like n I T games and I

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Speaker 1: was like, how are these guys in the n I T.

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Speaker 1: When they at U c l A. Was just kind

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Speaker 1: of a it's kind of one of the things that

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Speaker 1: gets glossed over a little bit, but that that is so.

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Speaker 1: But the n I T was was much bigger at

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Speaker 1: that time, you know. But I remember like, this is

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Speaker 1: not this is not the sixties, dude, or seventies. I'm

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Speaker 1: talking mid eighties. Yeah, so we're talking. We're talking mid

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Speaker 1: eighties U c l A in the mid eighties, in

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Speaker 1: the in the in the in the in the n

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Speaker 1: I T against Fresno State in the Red Wave. Um,

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Speaker 1: that that's not exactly what they were what they were thinking.

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Speaker 1: So well they beat I know, they beat the Hoosiers

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Speaker 1: and that. But I was I was in Indiana All

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Speaker 1: Star after I graduated high school, and and we were

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Speaker 1: working out in Indianapolis since we're getting ready to play Kentucky,

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Speaker 1: and um, you know, Reggie was doing an individual workout

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Speaker 1: on well there's this little workout facility. I mean, I'm

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Speaker 1: not even sure it's still there. Was on I U

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Speaker 1: P UIs campus, which is where we were practicing, and

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Speaker 1: he was kind of finishing up a workout and obviously

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Speaker 1: you've got twelve uh Indiana high school players you know

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Speaker 1: there and and so we you know, they brought Reggie

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Speaker 1: over and introduced this and we actually gotta play you know,

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Speaker 1: a small pickup game you know with him. Um you know,

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Speaker 1: which which I'm sure at that time was a highlight

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Speaker 1: of many of our guys, is you know, careers, you know,

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Speaker 1: to just step on the floor and play against Reggie

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Speaker 1: uh in back in when he was ripping and rawn

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Speaker 1: for for the Pacers. So, um, you know, when you

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Speaker 1: grew up in Indiana, you're you're not you're a you're

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Speaker 1: a produce fan, You're a you're an Indianapolis called sand

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Speaker 1: and you're you're an Indiana Pacer fan. And so to

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Speaker 1: be able to step on the flora with him as

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Speaker 1: a high school player at that time, uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's huge for all of us. Yeah. In fairness, his

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Speaker 1: senior year they did win the pac ten that uh pout.

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Speaker 1: Richardson was a sophomore that him put Richston got named

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Speaker 1: Trevor Wilson, who was like an energizer bunny. Um, Greg

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Speaker 1: Foster was a freshman. Jackie the the late Jack Hayley

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Speaker 1: was there. My boy, Kevin Walker was like a six

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Speaker 1: eleven shooter wh would be like a first round draft

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Speaker 1: pick as a stretch five nowadays. Uh so they they

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Speaker 1: had a squad, but there were a couple of years

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Speaker 1: there with a little murky when uh you're early on

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Speaker 1: when he was at all. Right, So, um, your senior

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Speaker 1: year you were Mr Basketball was Gatorade Player of the

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Speaker 1: Years at the same as Mr Basketball. Actually I was

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Speaker 1: Gatorade Player of the Year. I was runner up on

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Speaker 1: Mr Basketball. A guy named Kevin a guy named Kevin All.

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Speaker 1: He went to Warsaw High School in northern Indiana and

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Speaker 1: went and played at Southwest Missouri Status now Missouri State

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Speaker 1: in the Missouri Valley. UM actually was recruited by Steve

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Speaker 1: Alford Missouri State. He won Mr Basketball. Um, I came

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Speaker 1: in second. We had it. There was a really good

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Speaker 1: player named Roon Cornell's going to Purdue UM that finished

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Speaker 1: under that and you know, honestly, looking back, Um, there

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Speaker 1: was a guy that knew Albany High School, UM that

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Speaker 1: may have been the best player in Indiana that year

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Speaker 1: and then named Lamont Rowland and he he had gone

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Speaker 1: to Ball State, gotten some trouble, went to junior college

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Speaker 1: route and then Um finished his career at l s

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Speaker 1: U UM. But when you get into practices and you

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Speaker 1: get into competing, and you know how it is that

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Speaker 1: guy stand out and and Lamont may have been the

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Speaker 1: most talented player, uh in our class at that time.

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Speaker 1: But no, I I was running up. I was, I

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Speaker 1: was running up to Mr. Basketball. Not not that it's

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Speaker 1: still kind of sticks in my crawl a little bit.

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Speaker 1: I know. I know so no, no so so, and

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Speaker 1: it should here's this is funny. So you know, like

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Speaker 1: I'll tell you I was. We had we had rankings,

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Speaker 1: we had the best in the West rankings. UM and

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Speaker 1: a guy who was there's a there's a guy ahead

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Speaker 1: of I don't know from San Diego I'd never actually

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Speaker 1: heard of. I think he panned out, uh flamed out

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Speaker 1: of sending a statement. The guy who's like ranked behind me,

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Speaker 1: who I never played against, was Jason Terry. And I

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Speaker 1: was like, who's Jason Terry from Seattle, Washington? And uh,

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Speaker 1: the jet actually committed he was going to you Dub

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Speaker 1: and then he changed his mind and went to Arizona.

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Speaker 1: I remember for a long time, but like, dude, that

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Speaker 1: guy I've never even heard of him. Obviously now you know,

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Speaker 1: fast forward, I'm an idiot. He's awesome player. Um. And

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Speaker 1: then for me it was my my second time round

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Speaker 1: after I transferred from Notre Dame, I sat out for

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Speaker 1: a year. Kansas took Ryan Uh. Ryan Robertson was there,

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Speaker 1: and Ryan Robertson was McDonald's All American ahead of me,

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Speaker 1: and like, look the Magic's roundball thing I got to

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Speaker 1: play in. Chauncey Phillips was there, was I was a

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Speaker 1: replacement for Chauncey got hurt and their Stephan Marbury. There's

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Speaker 1: one of the guy Brian Williams went to Alabama. I

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Speaker 1: thought that was better than but Ryan Robertson, like I

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Speaker 1: always had like this personal vendetta against him because I

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Speaker 1: was like, man, how could they take him at Kansas

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Speaker 1: instead of me? And then I was like, he's actually

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Speaker 1: really good. He played in the NBA. He's actually a

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Speaker 1: pretty happy there's no question, go ahead, no, you go ahead.

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Speaker 1: I've never I've never felt helpless on a basketball court.

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Speaker 1: And when I had to guard Chouhnson Bill. So the

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Speaker 1: first round in the n c A tournament my freshman year. Um,

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Speaker 1: I think we're like an a ceed they're a nine seed. Um,

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Speaker 1: you know, we kind of have a little bit of

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Speaker 1: THEU elitist you know, thoughts like who's you know Colorado?

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Speaker 1: You know, blah blah blah. Um. Then we go in

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Speaker 1: and they smoked us. They smoke us in. Um, you know,

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Speaker 1: I mean Chauncey was just like he was just so strong,

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Speaker 1: so under control. Um, you know, I'm a freshman and

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Speaker 1: and uh, he just I mean I think he gave

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Speaker 1: me like thirty four thirty five. I'm still a matter

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Speaker 1: of fact, I'm still waiting on some checks from Chauncey

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Speaker 1: because I think he was about a mid to late

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Speaker 1: first round pick and in the n c A tournament

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Speaker 1: after he dropped us off that I un he was

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Speaker 1: he got into the lottery. So I'm still still hoping

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Speaker 1: maybe to meet up with him, maybe he'll give me

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Speaker 1: a a little bit of that extra money. I didn't

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Speaker 1: feel so bad years later once he, you know, became

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Speaker 1: the NBA Finals MVP, but I was. I've never it's

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Speaker 1: a terrible feeling. I'm sure we've all had it, but

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Speaker 1: I've never felt more helpless on a basketball court been

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Speaker 1: trying to Gordon Chauncey BIPs had played thirty two minutes

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Speaker 1: only at twenty four points. Uh it does yeah right, Um,

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Speaker 1: that's funny. That's really funny. Yeah, here's here's my here's

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Speaker 1: my here's my Chauncey story was he came out. I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna say he was a junior and there used to

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Speaker 1: be these events the Pumps would put on at cal

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Speaker 1: State Domingus Hills and I don't remember who he usually

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Speaker 1: played with, but but everyone had heard of Chauncey. He

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Speaker 1: was like the best guard in the western United States.

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Speaker 1: And so he came and he stayed at my house,

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Speaker 1: and um, and like you know, we played together for

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Speaker 1: a weekend. It was it was a good tournament. Maybe

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Speaker 1: it was for like a week during the summer, and

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Speaker 1: it was like the first week of summer before you

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Speaker 1: go to Vegas. He played with us and stayed at

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Speaker 1: our house. We practiced for a couple of days, and

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Speaker 1: I just remember, like my dad was my dad. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Like I always played point for my dad. My dad

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Speaker 1: was like, you know, you can let bring it, bring

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Speaker 1: it whatever he wants, which was my dad's wave of saying,

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Speaker 1: like he's so much better than you because and and

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Speaker 1: and in fairness, like Chauncey was, you know, and he

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Speaker 1: was a scoring guard where I was obviously if it's

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Speaker 1: even at that level like a facilitator. But um, but

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Speaker 1: I I just I remember playing and it's it's one

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00:20:13,320 --> 00:20:15,000
Speaker 1: of those you have those moments when you're on a

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Speaker 1: basketball floor and you and you're just like, oh, that

390
00:20:17,720 --> 00:20:20,479
Speaker 1: guy is gonna play in the NBA. And and I

391
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Speaker 1: grew and and and in southern California, like you had

392
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Speaker 1: a sense that you know, was Paul Pierce or Ricky

393
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Speaker 1: Price or I grew up? JR. Henderson was on my team,

394
00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:31,360
Speaker 1: Miles Simon. You always thought like those guys are really good.

395
00:20:31,359 --> 00:20:34,000
Speaker 1: But there was a there was like this calm elegance

396
00:20:34,040 --> 00:20:37,159
Speaker 1: to the way he played that is a very unique style.

397
00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:40,399
Speaker 1: Like other guys, they're just a I when I was

398
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Speaker 1: in Georgetown, when I was it Notre Dame, we played Georgetown,

399
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Speaker 1: and like I ressumely just a physical free because he

400
00:20:46,680 --> 00:20:50,200
Speaker 1: was fast and quick. Um, he wasn't. He wasn't very good,

401
00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:51,760
Speaker 1: but he was fast and quick, and so it just

402
00:20:51,800 --> 00:20:53,879
Speaker 1: made him like holy sh it, you just hope he misses.

403
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Speaker 1: But there was there was no kind of uniqueness to

404
00:20:57,200 --> 00:21:00,359
Speaker 1: his study was just a blur. Whereas Chauncey, he was

405
00:21:00,400 --> 00:21:03,840
Speaker 1: like sixteen years old and he just he looked he

406
00:21:03,880 --> 00:21:06,280
Speaker 1: felt like an NBA veteran, like he knew everything about

407
00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:09,280
Speaker 1: everywhere where everyone was supposed to be. He was so any,

408
00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:13,600
Speaker 1: made shots, he was so good. So, uh, your Indiana

409
00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:18,359
Speaker 1: Senior U All Star Team, Like, what's that for people

410
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Speaker 1: who don't know what that's like? What's that like? As

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Speaker 1: an honor? And then how do you who do you

412
00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:26,639
Speaker 1: play against? But it's it's like the culmination of your

413
00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:29,240
Speaker 1: high school career is that you know you got the

414
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Speaker 1: you get Mr Basketball's name, and then you get normally

415
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Speaker 1: have twelve Indiana All Stars, UM, and you know it's

416
00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:38,440
Speaker 1: a huge It's just a huge deal in Indiana to

417
00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:40,680
Speaker 1: finish your high school career. And in Indiana all started

418
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Speaker 1: to be able to say you were an Indiana All Star.

419
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Speaker 1: And back when I was in it, it was a

420
00:21:45,720 --> 00:21:47,880
Speaker 1: two week deal. Like you you met up, you practiced

421
00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:49,720
Speaker 1: four a week, you had a little exhibition game. You

422
00:21:49,720 --> 00:21:52,720
Speaker 1: would play the Kentucky All Star Team, UM, and we

423
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Speaker 1: played them in Lexington on UK's campus. And then you

424
00:21:56,560 --> 00:21:58,520
Speaker 1: would have another week of practice and then you would

425
00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:00,720
Speaker 1: come to Indianapolis and we played him, and then you

426
00:22:00,760 --> 00:22:03,600
Speaker 1: would play the Kentucky All Star team again, UM, and

427
00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:05,280
Speaker 1: we played him in Market Square Arena. It was just

428
00:22:05,480 --> 00:22:07,840
Speaker 1: it was a huge series, a lot of pride between

429
00:22:07,880 --> 00:22:10,880
Speaker 1: both states and UM, he was just a great honor

430
00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:12,919
Speaker 1: and I think it's something that you know, I still remember.

431
00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:15,800
Speaker 1: I'm sure anybody that's been a part of that, that

432
00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:18,119
Speaker 1: experience is something that they remember. And the ones that

433
00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:20,879
Speaker 1: got maybe shinned a little bit. I think it's some

434
00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:24,280
Speaker 1: of that sticks sticks with them for some time. Um.

435
00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:26,760
Speaker 1: You know that they they hold on too, you know,

436
00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:29,359
Speaker 1: and you just like the young guy at Belmont, at

437
00:22:29,720 --> 00:22:32,119
Speaker 1: Dylan Windler that just got you know, it was the

438
00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:34,000
Speaker 1: first round draft pick. He did not make the indian

439
00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:36,480
Speaker 1: All Star Team. And I just read an article the

440
00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:39,240
Speaker 1: other day about about the mistake that was made on him.

441
00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:41,080
Speaker 1: So and I think it's something that he used his

442
00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:43,720
Speaker 1: motivation as he got into college to prove some people wrong.

443
00:22:43,800 --> 00:22:46,359
Speaker 1: So it's just unbelievable on it. Um, you know, to

444
00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:48,680
Speaker 1: grow up in the state where basketball means so much

445
00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:51,359
Speaker 1: and then to be recognized, UM, at the end of

446
00:22:51,359 --> 00:22:52,840
Speaker 1: your career as an Indie All Starting to get to

447
00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:57,720
Speaker 1: compete and represent your state against Kentucky. Um. Some of

448
00:22:57,800 --> 00:22:59,720
Speaker 1: it is some of it is hindsight though, right, Like

449
00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:02,440
Speaker 1: some times guys become better players. Like that's one of

450
00:23:02,520 --> 00:23:04,399
Speaker 1: the things we do a bad job in the media of.

451
00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:06,359
Speaker 1: Like I don't know what Dylan win To looked like

452
00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:09,080
Speaker 1: when he was a high school senior. But some guys

453
00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:11,320
Speaker 1: just get They just get better, and some guys don't get.

454
00:23:11,359 --> 00:23:13,720
Speaker 1: Some guys top out, or some guys go mental, or

455
00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:16,399
Speaker 1: some guys discover girls or you know, women when they

456
00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:21,920
Speaker 1: get to college. You know. Um, So early hyph doesn't

457
00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:24,200
Speaker 1: help these kids. The early high you know, almost hinders

458
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:26,200
Speaker 1: some of these kids. Like when I was when I

459
00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:28,080
Speaker 1: was an assistant coach at Brother we would tell the

460
00:23:28,119 --> 00:23:30,520
Speaker 1: Gordon Hayward story all the time. Like at the end

461
00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:32,800
Speaker 1: of Gordon Hayward's junior year of high school, he wasn't

462
00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:36,080
Speaker 1: considered one of the top twenty players in the in

463
00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:40,359
Speaker 1: his grade in Indiana, and three years later he's the

464
00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:42,960
Speaker 1: eighth pick in the world. Like, I mean, how do

465
00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:47,720
Speaker 1: you you know? But he wanted physically matured, um, and

466
00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:49,960
Speaker 1: he just he worked on his game. He developed, he

467
00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:52,080
Speaker 1: was in the he was in the right situation where

468
00:23:52,119 --> 00:23:54,640
Speaker 1: he experienced some success. He was in the right situation

469
00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:58,040
Speaker 1: where he was able to play uh and contribute right away,

470
00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:01,120
Speaker 1: and then you know, things just snball and he became

471
00:24:01,119 --> 00:24:03,199
Speaker 1: an eighth pick in the draft, and means it's an

472
00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:05,720
Speaker 1: unbelievable story that in three years you're not even top

473
00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:08,440
Speaker 1: twenty in your own state, in your own age group,

474
00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:11,680
Speaker 1: and three years later, you you know, you're you're a

475
00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:14,240
Speaker 1: lottery pick. Um, you know. So, I think a lot

476
00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:16,480
Speaker 1: of that early hype sometimes can can hurt kids, and

477
00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:19,000
Speaker 1: then you know other kids, like people develop a different

478
00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:21,160
Speaker 1: times and they just can continue to work and work

479
00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:23,879
Speaker 1: at Fonso McKinney's, you know, with the with the Warriors,

480
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,280
Speaker 1: everybody likes to talk about offs and McKinney. I was

481
00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:29,560
Speaker 1: on the staff at Eastern Illinois when we recruited. I

482
00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:31,760
Speaker 1: was one of the coaches that was part of the

483
00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:34,080
Speaker 1: staff that didn't He wasn't even in our top eight

484
00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:36,680
Speaker 1: or nine his freshman year at Eastern Illinois. You know,

485
00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:39,640
Speaker 1: we we knew we had this kid that had unbelievable athleticism.

486
00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:42,040
Speaker 1: He was an unbelievable kid. You're trying to figure out

487
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:44,920
Speaker 1: ways the plame and and Um you know, now he's

488
00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:46,920
Speaker 1: contributing on a team that went all the way to

489
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:49,960
Speaker 1: the NBA Finals. So everybody's got their unique story. I

490
00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:54,360
Speaker 1: loved reading about those, um but like what you said,

491
00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:56,879
Speaker 1: people develop at different times and mature a different times,

492
00:24:56,920 --> 00:24:59,520
Speaker 1: and some people work and some people sit back and

493
00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:03,000
Speaker 1: and think about how good they are. Totally no. I

494
00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:05,400
Speaker 1: mean I I used that with my my own son,

495
00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:08,680
Speaker 1: where he wasn't an All Star in baseball last year

496
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:12,720
Speaker 1: and this year he is, and you know, and he

497
00:25:12,840 --> 00:25:14,600
Speaker 1: even has some ups and downs, and I was like, look, dude,

498
00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:16,240
Speaker 1: you gotta you gotta look at how much you've improved,

499
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:19,119
Speaker 1: you know. And last year I would play him up

500
00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:21,240
Speaker 1: in a you not a high level of you, but

501
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:23,680
Speaker 1: like I basically couldn't let him handle the ball because

502
00:25:23,720 --> 00:25:25,920
Speaker 1: he lose it so much. One because he just coming

503
00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:28,000
Speaker 1: from Connecticut to California's such a big jump. And then

504
00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:30,840
Speaker 1: he's playing against older kids and he just didn't have it.

505
00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:33,880
Speaker 1: So now he's able to, you know, bring the ball

506
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:37,440
Speaker 1: up against older competition and do a decent job, you know,

507
00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:38,960
Speaker 1: and then when he plays against his own age roup,

508
00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:41,199
Speaker 1: he's pretty good, and you know, it's it's but it's

509
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:42,960
Speaker 1: hard because You don't want to kill a kid's confidence.

510
00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:44,440
Speaker 1: But the other hand, you want to teach them that

511
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:46,679
Speaker 1: it's it's not about how good yards about how much

512
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:48,960
Speaker 1: better you have gotten since yesterday, how much better you

513
00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:51,919
Speaker 1: can get kind of tomorrow. All Right, you show up

514
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:58,440
Speaker 1: at India. This is nineteen nineties six, right, Um, I

515
00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:01,240
Speaker 1: think you only have like I remember that team, you

516
00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:04,400
Speaker 1: only had one senior, right, wasn't Harris Mazinevitch? The only

517
00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:06,120
Speaker 1: like senior you have in that team? Is a really

518
00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:10,080
Speaker 1: young team for a for a Bob Night team, wasn't it. Yeah?

519
00:26:10,119 --> 00:26:11,840
Speaker 1: We had we had a group of juniors and a

520
00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:15,000
Speaker 1: group of freshmens that, um, you know, I think we're

521
00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:19,520
Speaker 1: heavily relied on and um, you know at that time,

522
00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:23,160
Speaker 1: you know that the junior class was very highly regarded. Um,

523
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:27,520
Speaker 1: you know with Andre Patterson and Neil Reid and Charlie Miller. Um,

524
00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:31,720
Speaker 1: you know, Jason Collier was in Jason Collier was in

525
00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:35,399
Speaker 1: our class who was a McDonald Lall American, Um, A

526
00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:39,480
Speaker 1: j Guyden was very under recruited but ended up being

527
00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:41,119
Speaker 1: the best player. I mean you know that as a

528
00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:44,080
Speaker 1: senior was the first team All American. But um, we

529
00:26:44,440 --> 00:26:46,840
Speaker 1: started three freshman and two juniors our first game that

530
00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:50,359
Speaker 1: year against Connecticut and in the Hoosier Dolman from a

531
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:54,879
Speaker 1: thirty five thousand. So um, it was you know, from

532
00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:57,320
Speaker 1: me going up in Indiana and watching that and being

533
00:26:57,440 --> 00:26:59,120
Speaker 1: being able to be a part of that and obviously

534
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:02,040
Speaker 1: getting a uh getting the start in your first collegian

535
00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:05,399
Speaker 1: game was what's pretty exciting for me? What's that like

536
00:27:05,520 --> 00:27:07,359
Speaker 1: to to run out you got candy stripe pants on

537
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:12,760
Speaker 1: a white Indiana jersey, like like, honestly, I mean, do

538
00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:14,720
Speaker 1: you what is that feeling like to be in the

539
00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:18,639
Speaker 1: locker room and to see your number candy stripe pants

540
00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:20,720
Speaker 1: and realize and you're running out at the Who's your

541
00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:24,520
Speaker 1: Dome against Yukon. Yeah, I mean it's it's one of

542
00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:27,880
Speaker 1: the really cool experiences, you know, of my life because

543
00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 1: you you grow up, you know, it's it's like, you

544
00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:32,720
Speaker 1: know what what you w envision growing up out here?

545
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:35,080
Speaker 1: You know, you you envision growing up out here and

546
00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:37,800
Speaker 1: then running out in Pauli in the U c l

547
00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:40,720
Speaker 1: A uniform like it's the same thing just where I

548
00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:42,679
Speaker 1: grew up. Um, but yeah, it was. It was an

549
00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:45,359
Speaker 1: unbelievable experience in the Union at that time. Recruiting was

550
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:48,119
Speaker 1: much different if you had an opportunity. If you're in

551
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:50,159
Speaker 1: Indiana and you had an opportunity to play it on you,

552
00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:53,399
Speaker 1: that's where you're going. And it always really UM no

553
00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:57,520
Speaker 1: other options, you know, like they had first rider refusal,

554
00:27:57,760 --> 00:27:59,359
Speaker 1: you know, much like I think U. C l A.

555
00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:02,600
Speaker 1: UM has had out here for for a number of

556
00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:04,720
Speaker 1: years and something that that we need to get back

557
00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:07,800
Speaker 1: to UM now that that we're out here and UM,

558
00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:09,919
Speaker 1: it's it's just kind of where you grew up. That's

559
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:12,200
Speaker 1: what you saw, is what you were used to UM,

560
00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:14,840
Speaker 1: and so obviously it was a man a lot to

561
00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:18,600
Speaker 1: me to put put the uniform on and represent UM Indiana.

562
00:28:19,359 --> 00:28:22,000
Speaker 1: That's joke, man, That's that's really really cool. UM. What

563
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:26,760
Speaker 1: was did? Did did coach and I do at home? Visit? No? Man,

564
00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:29,040
Speaker 1: My my recruitings, I might have been one of the

565
00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:32,680
Speaker 1: easiest recruits of all time. Like I started getting recruited

566
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:35,679
Speaker 1: by them my sophomore year of high school. And when

567
00:28:35,720 --> 00:28:38,240
Speaker 1: I stay recruited, they invited myself and my dad, my

568
00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:40,960
Speaker 1: high school coach, to a game UM, and we went

569
00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:44,840
Speaker 1: up to a game UM. And then my junior year UM,

570
00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:46,840
Speaker 1: I kind of had like I lived an hour and

571
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:50,040
Speaker 1: a half away from from Bloomington. So I kind of

572
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:52,600
Speaker 1: could come up anytime I wanted, any any game I wanted,

573
00:28:52,640 --> 00:28:55,400
Speaker 1: And it got to a point, you know, I would

574
00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:57,520
Speaker 1: I would take a buddy, or you know, I take

575
00:28:57,560 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 1: a girlfriend or you know, sometimes my dad would go

576
00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:04,160
Speaker 1: with me. And they were playing Minnesota late late in

577
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:07,880
Speaker 1: the year and back from Minnesota the Shawn Leonard and

578
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:10,920
Speaker 1: I was, uh until called up and told him I

579
00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:13,880
Speaker 1: was coming to the game, and uh, you know, Coach

580
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:15,640
Speaker 1: Dock he was like, hey, why don't you bring your

581
00:29:15,680 --> 00:29:18,120
Speaker 1: mom and dad up? You know, So mom and dad

582
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:20,800
Speaker 1: came with me on this trip and and uh they

583
00:29:20,840 --> 00:29:23,040
Speaker 1: got beat by Minnesota, which did not happen, you know,

584
00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:26,320
Speaker 1: I mean, Indiana didn't lose in Thesembly hall very often

585
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:30,000
Speaker 1: and during that time period, and and uh so we

586
00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:31,760
Speaker 1: were just gonna go home, like we know how things

587
00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:35,120
Speaker 1: you know, could get after a lawsuit, and we're gonna

588
00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:37,640
Speaker 1: go home, and and Dock he came out and said, no, no,

589
00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:39,160
Speaker 1: coach wants to talk to you. Why don't you guys

590
00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:41,920
Speaker 1: stick around? And so I remember sitting down in what

591
00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:44,479
Speaker 1: they called the players lounge, and there was no there

592
00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:46,200
Speaker 1: was no lounge part of it. It was just kind

593
00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:48,080
Speaker 1: of a room with the TV and three chairs, and

594
00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:51,240
Speaker 1: we sat in there for what seemed like an hour,

595
00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:54,880
Speaker 1: and and Coach and I finally walked in with his

596
00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:58,920
Speaker 1: long time media buddy bought him on and the dock

597
00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 1: he was there, and Coach had a sweater off, and

598
00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:03,960
Speaker 1: his collar was half up on one side and down

599
00:30:04,040 --> 00:30:06,680
Speaker 1: on the other and here all disheveled, you know, And

600
00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,000
Speaker 1: he sat down and uh, he said, Mike, I'm going

601
00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:12,320
Speaker 1: hunting tomorrow. Do you know anywhere I can shoot birds

602
00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:15,400
Speaker 1: down and around Jasper? And I'm sixteen years old, Doug, Like,

603
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:17,600
Speaker 1: I don't. I've never been hunting in my life. Like

604
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:19,760
Speaker 1: I had no idea, I said, you know, so I

605
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:21,280
Speaker 1: kind of like Coach, I don't know. You know, I

606
00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:23,280
Speaker 1: got some buddies that do some hunting. I can probably

607
00:30:23,280 --> 00:30:25,040
Speaker 1: help you out, but I really don't. I wouldn't know

608
00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:27,360
Speaker 1: where to tell you to go. And he kind of

609
00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:29,320
Speaker 1: took a deep breath and he said, you want to

610
00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:32,680
Speaker 1: play ball here? And I said yeah. And he stood

611
00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:34,600
Speaker 1: up and he shook my mom and dad's hand, shook

612
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:36,560
Speaker 1: my hand, put his hand on my shoulder and said,

613
00:30:36,560 --> 00:30:39,400
Speaker 1: all right, boy, I see you later. I walked out

614
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:42,640
Speaker 1: and that was that was my dad. That was my

615
00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:45,040
Speaker 1: commendment story. We were my mom and dad. We walked

616
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:48,080
Speaker 1: all the way out to the car, and uh, we

617
00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:49,920
Speaker 1: get to the car and my dad started up and

618
00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:52,120
Speaker 1: before we take off, like nobody has said a word

619
00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:54,120
Speaker 1: up until that point, He's like, what just happened? I said,

620
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:57,160
Speaker 1: I think I'm going to Indiana and and uh that

621
00:30:57,720 --> 00:30:59,480
Speaker 1: was it late in my junior year of high school

622
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:03,240
Speaker 1: and and um, you know, so that was I don't

623
00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:05,920
Speaker 1: think I was really heavily recruited by them, but it

624
00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:09,280
Speaker 1: worked out for everybody in the end, So that was

625
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 1: my recruiting. So I think that probably one of the

626
00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:13,640
Speaker 1: easiest one, you know, he did get. He did get

627
00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:17,600
Speaker 1: Brian Evans on the phone. Call um, and I said, yeah,

628
00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:18,920
Speaker 1: you wanted kind of hit him with the same thing,

629
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:21,680
Speaker 1: you won't play a ball here, and and Brian said,

630
00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:23,080
Speaker 1: I'd like to talk to my mom and dad, and

631
00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 1: I think I think coach said I'll call you back

632
00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:28,520
Speaker 1: in thirty minutes. So I call him back in thirty minutes.

633
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:30,960
Speaker 1: It was done, and Brian Evans was an NBA player

634
00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 1: and Big Ten Player of the Year. So that's just

635
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:35,200
Speaker 1: how it was. Back there. It was. It was a

636
00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:38,760
Speaker 1: different time that recruiting services were now. Um, you know,

637
00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:42,360
Speaker 1: the TV was different, social media wasn't it wasn't around,

638
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 1: and so I think recruiting was much more regionalized. All right,

639
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 1: I'll tell you my U c l A story now,

640
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:50,400
Speaker 1: So because there are u c l A people that

641
00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:52,160
Speaker 1: think I still like have it in for U c

642
00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:56,160
Speaker 1: l A. So, uh, my, my my dad had U

643
00:31:56,240 --> 00:31:59,320
Speaker 1: c l A season tickets since really I think not

644
00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:03,520
Speaker 1: Farmers when Walt Hazard was there, and so we would

645
00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:05,160
Speaker 1: go and what he would do is he would you know,

646
00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:07,760
Speaker 1: either giveaway or sell a lot of the kind of

647
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:09,720
Speaker 1: average games. And then we always go to the Arizona game.

648
00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:12,440
Speaker 1: They played Duke one year when there was both their

649
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:16,560
Speaker 1: top ten teams. Was unbelievable atmosphere. Um, and we would

650
00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:19,040
Speaker 1: go and and you know, if they played Oregon State

651
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:20,960
Speaker 1: was good back then Arizona State, we go to it.

652
00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:22,720
Speaker 1: You know, we go to a couple of weekend games,

653
00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:27,479
Speaker 1: a couple week night games, and um, as I kind

654
00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:30,120
Speaker 1: of got and then Herrick took over and and my

655
00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:33,280
Speaker 1: dad was pretty close with Herrick, and he coached in

656
00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:35,720
Speaker 1: a in a select kind of all star game against

657
00:32:35,720 --> 00:32:38,760
Speaker 1: the Russians. He coached Mitchell Butler and Tracy Murray part

658
00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:42,920
Speaker 1: of an unbelievable recruiting class that went there, and so

659
00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:45,200
Speaker 1: they never And then my sister was a cheerleader there

660
00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:50,280
Speaker 1: and she's uh was she's ninety, she's like five years

661
00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:54,160
Speaker 1: older than me really, so I was always there, Like

662
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:58,120
Speaker 1: I didn't go to practice uh much every once in

663
00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:00,240
Speaker 1: a while, but you know, it's like forty five. It's

664
00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:02,720
Speaker 1: our from my house, but I go to some games

665
00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:04,520
Speaker 1: and the way it's kind of same thing with like

666
00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 1: unofficial visits. So it might have been because we had

667
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:12,040
Speaker 1: season tickets. It was likely because I wasn't that good, right,

668
00:33:12,120 --> 00:33:14,640
Speaker 1: like I was a because I stayed back. I was

669
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:16,840
Speaker 1: like a late bloomer. And most of the guys I

670
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:19,360
Speaker 1: grew up playing with were a class of ninety four,

671
00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:22,160
Speaker 1: which is an awesome class in the state of California.

672
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: That's Toby Bailey, Jarah Henderson, Miles Simon, Gilanni Gardner, Kristin Johnson,

673
00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:32,680
Speaker 1: a bunch of dudes. Um. So I remember like they

674
00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 1: weren't they didn't offer me. And the summer before when

675
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:40,160
Speaker 1: I was rising junior, the first day of summer is

676
00:33:40,200 --> 00:33:42,280
Speaker 1: when they came out with like initial offers back then.

677
00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:44,560
Speaker 1: So they offered Toby Bailey first day of summer. He

678
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:47,520
Speaker 1: took the scholarship. And the way it worked then was

679
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:50,240
Speaker 1: we had there was there was like three different big

680
00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:53,560
Speaker 1: AU programs. A r C Mid Valley that was like

681
00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:56,560
Speaker 1: Cameron Murray played on that team that was like mostly

682
00:33:56,680 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 1: kids from the valley and surrounding areas. There was Slamming

683
00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:02,880
Speaker 1: Jam Victoria Park that was Ricky Price and Toby Bailey

684
00:34:03,320 --> 00:34:06,000
Speaker 1: and later Tremaine Folks who went to Cal then President State.

685
00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:08,160
Speaker 1: And then there's our team which was you know team

686
00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:11,920
Speaker 1: Orange County, and we had Jared Harrison from Bakersfield. We

687
00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:15,880
Speaker 1: had Adam Walton that's that's uh Bill's oldest son. And

688
00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:17,640
Speaker 1: then we had a bunch of Orange County kids as well.

689
00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:19,080
Speaker 1: It's a couple of l A kids that were like

690
00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:21,239
Speaker 1: under the radar, and so there was kind of a

691
00:34:21,360 --> 00:34:24,480
Speaker 1: rivalry there, right, So like like we didn't like, we

692
00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:26,840
Speaker 1: didn't like Toby then, you know, as it was, it

693
00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:28,680
Speaker 1: was weird, like you know, in every tournament, in the

694
00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:32,040
Speaker 1: semifinals and finals of every tournament, it's the same guys

695
00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:34,360
Speaker 1: you're playing against. And this is since like sixth grade,

696
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:37,080
Speaker 1: like No, I didn't fucking like Toby Bailey. I didn't like,

697
00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:39,279
Speaker 1: you know, the the Obannon boys who were there, like

698
00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:41,239
Speaker 1: we those are We wanted to beat them, like now

699
00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:43,279
Speaker 1: we're supposed to play in the same team, like so weird.

700
00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:47,239
Speaker 1: So Miles got pissed and and then you know, he

701
00:34:47,320 --> 00:34:50,359
Speaker 1: ends up going to Arizona and so and I kind

702
00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:53,520
Speaker 1: of wanted, like, you know, like basketball U c l

703
00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:56,480
Speaker 1: A Basketball on TV is big, but there was times,

704
00:34:57,040 --> 00:34:59,120
Speaker 1: you know, it's locally just got swallowed up by the

705
00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:02,000
Speaker 1: Lakers and other off and I don't know, the facilities

706
00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:04,320
Speaker 1: weren't great back then, and so I kind of was

707
00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:05,800
Speaker 1: I had a want. I always want to play a

708
00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:09,840
Speaker 1: duke um. So I went to a game during my

709
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:13,960
Speaker 1: junior year against cal As u c l A. Cow

710
00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:17,080
Speaker 1: and all these other guys that were seniors that had

711
00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:20,520
Speaker 1: committed to going there. We're there. So j R. Henderson

712
00:35:20,640 --> 00:35:23,640
Speaker 1: is my teammate, and Kristin Johnson's my teammate. Like we

713
00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:24,960
Speaker 1: go to the game together. We meet up at the

714
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:29,000
Speaker 1: game and my seats are so fucking high that the

715
00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:31,080
Speaker 1: concession man won't go up there, Like, you know, I

716
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:32,880
Speaker 1: want to be a big baller and go to the player,

717
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:34,600
Speaker 1: you know, get the player tickets, even though we had

718
00:35:34,600 --> 00:35:36,839
Speaker 1: season tickets. And I like told my dad, like, don't

719
00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:39,440
Speaker 1: worry about it. I got there. The teams leaving me tickets,

720
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:44,560
Speaker 1: so they like so they like scramble and they get

721
00:35:44,640 --> 00:35:46,279
Speaker 1: me seats next to the rest of the guys. I

722
00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:48,440
Speaker 1: was like, what the funk, I'm way up. This is bullshit.

723
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:50,840
Speaker 1: So now I'm sitting with these guys and then they

724
00:35:50,880 --> 00:35:53,040
Speaker 1: send some manager out at halftime to listen to Herrick's

725
00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:56,359
Speaker 1: halftime speech and they don't get me. And I mean

726
00:35:56,400 --> 00:35:58,560
Speaker 1: it was like the and my sisters like performing at

727
00:35:58,560 --> 00:36:01,680
Speaker 1: the half or whatever, and uh. I was like, okay,

728
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:03,239
Speaker 1: I guess I know where I stand there, you know.

729
00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:07,840
Speaker 1: So then pass forward to summer of my That next summer,

730
00:36:07,880 --> 00:36:09,480
Speaker 1: some of my senior I'm at that I'm at the

731
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:13,680
Speaker 1: Las Vegas Hilton and Jim Harrick calls me. He's like, Dougie,

732
00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:16,520
Speaker 1: you know you always wanted to be a Ruin and

733
00:36:16,600 --> 00:36:18,279
Speaker 1: I was like, and I was kind of a dick.

734
00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:20,600
Speaker 1: Then I said not then, let against now, and I

735
00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:23,480
Speaker 1: was like, well, coach and all honestly, I always wanted

736
00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:25,279
Speaker 1: to play a duke, but they took Wojo last year

737
00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:27,520
Speaker 1: they took Wojo so and Wojo is a year ahead

738
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:30,640
Speaker 1: of me, and so he said, well, we're offering you

739
00:36:30,640 --> 00:36:32,719
Speaker 1: a scholarship to u c l are like, you won't

740
00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:34,160
Speaker 1: play ball for us, And it was kind of same

741
00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:36,040
Speaker 1: sort of question, you know, and I'm sure he thought

742
00:36:36,680 --> 00:36:39,319
Speaker 1: this is a layup kid grew up dreaming of playing

743
00:36:39,320 --> 00:36:40,879
Speaker 1: at u c l A. And I was like, well,

744
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:42,080
Speaker 1: you know, I want to take a visit. I want

745
00:36:42,080 --> 00:36:43,480
Speaker 1: to think about it. I want to see what else is,

746
00:36:43,600 --> 00:36:45,319
Speaker 1: you know, I mean, I love how you guys play.

747
00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:47,759
Speaker 1: And they had taken a commitment from a game name

748
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:49,680
Speaker 1: illusing me man who was like six four or six

749
00:36:49,760 --> 00:36:52,480
Speaker 1: five your class, like best player in America type kid.

750
00:36:53,040 --> 00:36:56,120
Speaker 1: And he was like, you know, he'll never qualify. He's

751
00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:57,680
Speaker 1: not a really u c l A guy, but he's

752
00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:00,080
Speaker 1: so talented. We gotta take and we take five. We

753
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:03,279
Speaker 1: played five guys, five best players U c l A

754
00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:05,680
Speaker 1: high post offense, not the only offense, just the best.

755
00:37:06,440 --> 00:37:12,480
Speaker 1: So there was so I was so bitter over not

756
00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:15,839
Speaker 1: being recruited whatever, And you know, they wrote me Mark

757
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:18,719
Speaker 1: Godford did a great job and Lorenzo Romar did a

758
00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:20,320
Speaker 1: great job, and they called me I'll never forget. So

759
00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:23,640
Speaker 1: I take an unofficial up there, and it was still

760
00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:26,680
Speaker 1: kind of weird because again, like Toby was a freshman there,

761
00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:31,880
Speaker 1: and um, uh yeah, I'd like I barely knew tayased

762
00:37:31,920 --> 00:37:33,839
Speaker 1: and he was a senior on that team. Ed was there,

763
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:38,880
Speaker 1: was a senior, Charles was there, and I just I

764
00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:41,160
Speaker 1: don't know. I just I didn't get a great vibe.

765
00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:46,000
Speaker 1: And so I was like, so I call coach Herrick

766
00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:49,680
Speaker 1: and tell him I'm going to Notre Dame and Godfrey

767
00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:52,640
Speaker 1: calls me. He goes, I'm gonna promise you something. Now

768
00:37:53,320 --> 00:37:56,560
Speaker 1: we play. We play all like December twenty two of

769
00:37:58,640 --> 00:38:00,239
Speaker 1: not Only were gonna come in and whoop your ass.

770
00:38:00,560 --> 00:38:03,400
Speaker 1: He's like, but it's gonna be so fucking cold that

771
00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:05,759
Speaker 1: you're gonna beg us to come back. And I was like,

772
00:38:06,960 --> 00:38:08,320
Speaker 1: he goes, he goes, but you know, we love you,

773
00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:10,360
Speaker 1: and my sister had been his babysit or whatever, so

774
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:14,560
Speaker 1: uh yeah, I mean and then my when I when

775
00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:18,520
Speaker 1: I left Notre Dame, um, they recruited me, but they're like, look,

776
00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:20,880
Speaker 1: we're gonna take Baron if we can get Barren, and

777
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:25,080
Speaker 1: if we don't get Barren, right, So so I'm not

778
00:38:25,160 --> 00:38:26,879
Speaker 1: bitter over that one, because I mean, if you take

779
00:38:26,960 --> 00:38:29,719
Speaker 1: me ahead of Baron Davis, you're the worst evaluator of town,

780
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:33,000
Speaker 1: you know, all of sports. But I mean, honestly, the

781
00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:36,120
Speaker 1: first time around, it was my choice. And they took

782
00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:39,520
Speaker 1: a dude named Brandon Lloyd, who was who should have

783
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:43,560
Speaker 1: gone to Oaklhom State from Oklahoma. They didn't get staff.

784
00:38:43,560 --> 00:38:45,200
Speaker 1: They thought they were gonna get staff, and if I

785
00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:47,880
Speaker 1: was probably their fallback, like, well we'll get Gottlieb and

786
00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:50,160
Speaker 1: I went to Notre Dame, and so they took Brandon Lloyd,

787
00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:53,360
Speaker 1: who never really panned out at u c l A. Anyway,

788
00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:55,840
Speaker 1: that's my U c l A story, all right, So

789
00:38:56,640 --> 00:39:01,080
Speaker 1: let's get to let's get to eu UM. I looked

790
00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:04,400
Speaker 1: it up, and you guys started out thirteen and one, right,

791
00:39:04,520 --> 00:39:07,319
Speaker 1: like your only loss was to Kentucky. You guys beat

792
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:12,080
Speaker 1: Notre Dame, you guys beat Duke Um, you guys beat Princeton.

793
00:39:12,160 --> 00:39:13,919
Speaker 1: Was good. Back then. You talked about the Yukon game.

794
00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:17,719
Speaker 1: You'd beat Yukon, like you guys were rolling. What was

795
00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:19,560
Speaker 1: it like, You're like a freshman that you had to

796
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:22,880
Speaker 1: be like this is easy, this is cake. When you

797
00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:24,719
Speaker 1: get that it's like when you get all that hype

798
00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:27,680
Speaker 1: as a young player, like then you know you've you've

799
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:29,960
Speaker 1: got to be able to stay stay in the moment

800
00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:32,680
Speaker 1: and try to get better and better. But um, you know,

801
00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:35,719
Speaker 1: it's like like any major program when you're when you're

802
00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:38,080
Speaker 1: winning at a high level at a place like Indiana,

803
00:39:38,080 --> 00:39:40,360
Speaker 1: and when you're winning at a high level, uh you know,

804
00:39:40,480 --> 00:39:42,640
Speaker 1: the place like U C. L A. Or Caroline or

805
00:39:42,719 --> 00:39:46,720
Speaker 1: Duke or Kentucky Like, um, it's everything that you imagine.

806
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:50,239
Speaker 1: You know, it can be like you're you're walking on water. Um,

807
00:39:50,600 --> 00:39:52,960
Speaker 1: everywhere you're going. You walk in a restaurant, you know,

808
00:39:53,040 --> 00:39:55,560
Speaker 1: people are standing up and clapping and wishing you well

809
00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:59,040
Speaker 1: and and all those sorts of things, and um, you

810
00:39:59,080 --> 00:40:01,879
Speaker 1: know it's it's that's what I think is so cool

811
00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:05,239
Speaker 1: about the college basketball experience. Like, um, you know, I

812
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:08,400
Speaker 1: I tell kids in recruiting all the time, like I

813
00:40:09,280 --> 00:40:13,480
Speaker 1: absolutely loved my experience at Indiana. Now every day it

814
00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:16,080
Speaker 1: wasn't teddy bears and rainbows, you know, but it's it's

815
00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:18,000
Speaker 1: not it doesn't matter where you go, it's not going

816
00:40:18,040 --> 00:40:21,400
Speaker 1: to be um, but my experience prepared me for for

817
00:40:21,520 --> 00:40:23,840
Speaker 1: what I'm doing now. And I want the guys that

818
00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:27,080
Speaker 1: that I get the opportunity to coach and be around.

819
00:40:27,120 --> 00:40:30,160
Speaker 1: I want them to feel about their experience the way

820
00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:33,000
Speaker 1: that I feel about mine. I think if they do that, um,

821
00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:36,480
Speaker 1: you know, then then my job as a coach has

822
00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:39,800
Speaker 1: been successful. And I love my my time at Indiana

823
00:40:39,880 --> 00:40:41,879
Speaker 1: part of you know, Indiana basketball is a major part

824
00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:44,440
Speaker 1: of who I am, down to my core, um, and

825
00:40:44,520 --> 00:40:45,920
Speaker 1: I loved it. I would do it again in the

826
00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:49,360
Speaker 1: art beating. And that's that's I understand the way that

827
00:40:49,400 --> 00:40:52,320
Speaker 1: I feel doug about about my time And that's what

828
00:40:53,440 --> 00:40:55,160
Speaker 1: you know, That's what I want these guys here at

829
00:40:55,200 --> 00:40:56,759
Speaker 1: u c l A to feel about U c l

830
00:40:56,840 --> 00:40:59,480
Speaker 1: A and their experience here when when their time here

831
00:40:59,600 --> 00:41:01,480
Speaker 1: is done. That sold. I want the guys that I

832
00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:04,200
Speaker 1: coached at Butler to feel about Butler you know now

833
00:41:04,280 --> 00:41:07,360
Speaker 1: that that that they're away and there's nothing cooler about,

834
00:41:07,719 --> 00:41:09,840
Speaker 1: you know, being a coach. And then you know, getting

835
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:13,360
Speaker 1: phone calls, um from former players asking for help for jobs,

836
00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:16,800
Speaker 1: called from former players invite you to their weddings, or

837
00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:19,359
Speaker 1: calling you you know and talk to that hey coach

838
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:21,839
Speaker 1: on you know, my wife's due to have a baby

839
00:41:21,880 --> 00:41:23,839
Speaker 1: boy here in three months you know those are those

840
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:26,520
Speaker 1: are the really cool experience and that's that's the experience

841
00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:28,680
Speaker 1: that I had where I played, and that's what I

842
00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:32,640
Speaker 1: want for these guys that I come in contact with. Yeah,

843
00:41:32,880 --> 00:41:36,839
Speaker 1: it's it's um, it's it's really and we I'll tell

844
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:39,120
Speaker 1: you the thing about social media, and you don't have

845
00:41:39,239 --> 00:41:40,920
Speaker 1: to agree with you you can you feel free to

846
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:44,480
Speaker 1: discuss it. But I do think that we whether it's

847
00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:47,160
Speaker 1: expectations and I got to be cautious of this with

848
00:41:47,239 --> 00:41:51,840
Speaker 1: my own kid, you know, expectations or uh, you know,

849
00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:54,960
Speaker 1: coaches are always the bad guys and see he is

850
00:41:54,960 --> 00:41:57,520
Speaker 1: always the bad guess whatever it is, like, I don't know.

851
00:41:57,719 --> 00:42:00,560
Speaker 1: I still think it's a very high percentage, but I

852
00:42:00,680 --> 00:42:03,320
Speaker 1: don't know if it's nearly as higher percentage of people

853
00:42:03,480 --> 00:42:07,399
Speaker 1: that get it. Like, look, everybody takes the floor. It's

854
00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:11,319
Speaker 1: like real dudes like me, like real thoughtful, reasonable people.

855
00:42:11,400 --> 00:42:13,520
Speaker 1: You take a basketball floor, and you can pick out

856
00:42:13,560 --> 00:42:15,560
Speaker 1: which guys could really play in the NBA Like you

857
00:42:15,680 --> 00:42:17,680
Speaker 1: and I probably thought, like, you know what if we

858
00:42:17,760 --> 00:42:21,279
Speaker 1: got the right situation where somebody needs our skill set,

859
00:42:21,360 --> 00:42:23,640
Speaker 1: somebody enjoys our leadership, you know, you put me in

860
00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:25,160
Speaker 1: the right spot, like Yeah, why couldn't I be the

861
00:42:25,200 --> 00:42:26,879
Speaker 1: third point guard in the NBA. It's like no doubt,

862
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:28,800
Speaker 1: Like I know what I could do, but you just

863
00:42:28,960 --> 00:42:31,399
Speaker 1: you gotta be You gotta get one team, one guy

864
00:42:31,480 --> 00:42:33,279
Speaker 1: at one team that believes in you, that gives you

865
00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:35,440
Speaker 1: the right opportunity, the right amount of minutes in the

866
00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:37,880
Speaker 1: summer league, signs you to a guarantee. You hang on

867
00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:39,480
Speaker 1: for a year, and then you kind of become an

868
00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:42,719
Speaker 1: NBA player. But but you know, most most of us

869
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:44,520
Speaker 1: look around and like you can tell who's the fucking

870
00:42:44,560 --> 00:42:49,319
Speaker 1: pro and who's not. Right, Um, there's this sense where

871
00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:51,719
Speaker 1: if you're not gonna make it as an NBA player

872
00:42:51,760 --> 00:42:55,279
Speaker 1: at your current school, goes somewhere else, And so there's

873
00:42:55,360 --> 00:42:58,480
Speaker 1: not I think as higher percentage of people that truly

874
00:42:58,640 --> 00:43:04,440
Speaker 1: understand and in enjoy the experience. During the experience, am

875
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:07,080
Speaker 1: I am I making sense? Like like that's what you created, Like, oh,

876
00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:08,960
Speaker 1: you're not playing well, fucking go the coach is never

877
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:10,719
Speaker 1: gonna play you. They can recruit over. You leave, go

878
00:43:10,800 --> 00:43:14,640
Speaker 1: to another school. And part of the part of the

879
00:43:14,680 --> 00:43:18,120
Speaker 1: amazing part about college basketball, this guy comes in and

880
00:43:18,239 --> 00:43:19,719
Speaker 1: you and I got to start as freshman. So this

881
00:43:19,840 --> 00:43:21,239
Speaker 1: is different but a lot of guys that come in

882
00:43:21,640 --> 00:43:23,319
Speaker 1: and they don't get the role they want and they leave,

883
00:43:23,360 --> 00:43:26,040
Speaker 1: Whereas it's way better if you earn the role you

884
00:43:26,160 --> 00:43:29,759
Speaker 1: want at the place you originally enrolled in. Mm hmm.

885
00:43:30,600 --> 00:43:34,120
Speaker 1: It's no, you're you're you're dead on. Like I'd tell

886
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:37,800
Speaker 1: people all the time, like like college, like and and

887
00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:42,760
Speaker 1: you've got to have good adults around the young person.

888
00:43:43,000 --> 00:43:46,080
Speaker 1: But when you're talking to a recruit, like they're so

889
00:43:46,320 --> 00:43:49,359
Speaker 1: self absorbed in what they're doing, Um, they all want

890
00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:50,879
Speaker 1: to go the n B A and and a lot

891
00:43:50,920 --> 00:43:52,120
Speaker 1: of them, you know, when you're at a place like

892
00:43:52,239 --> 00:43:53,600
Speaker 1: U c A, a lot of them you know that

893
00:43:53,719 --> 00:43:56,680
Speaker 1: may be in their future. Um. But but you also

894
00:43:56,760 --> 00:43:58,520
Speaker 1: got to look at college. It's it's it's not a

895
00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:01,040
Speaker 1: three or four year decision. This when when you're choosing

896
00:44:01,080 --> 00:44:04,360
Speaker 1: the university, it's a thirty or forty year decision in it.

897
00:44:04,600 --> 00:44:07,200
Speaker 1: And it I believe that if whether you're at U

898
00:44:07,280 --> 00:44:09,080
Speaker 1: c l A for one or two years and you're

899
00:44:09,080 --> 00:44:10,600
Speaker 1: able to go to the NBA, or if you're here

900
00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:13,000
Speaker 1: for four years, because you're always going to fall back

901
00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:16,799
Speaker 1: on that time period in your life and you're going

902
00:44:16,880 --> 00:44:18,960
Speaker 1: to go back to those people to help you with

903
00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:22,880
Speaker 1: whatever's next after basketball is over. So that's why I

904
00:44:22,960 --> 00:44:24,719
Speaker 1: say it's a third y or forty year decision. And

905
00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:27,600
Speaker 1: I think that's why, Um, I'm so lucky to be

906
00:44:27,680 --> 00:44:29,719
Speaker 1: at a place like u c. L A. Because not

907
00:44:29,840 --> 00:44:32,560
Speaker 1: only does it have the basketball tradition and and all

908
00:44:32,600 --> 00:44:35,520
Speaker 1: the great players and the coaches and and everything that

909
00:44:35,640 --> 00:44:37,600
Speaker 1: comes with it, but are you also sitting on this

910
00:44:37,760 --> 00:44:41,520
Speaker 1: campus with all the unbelievable people that are associated with

911
00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:44,440
Speaker 1: this university and all the alumni are so I mean,

912
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:46,560
Speaker 1: that's that's those guys, those guys, and those guys are

913
00:44:46,560 --> 00:44:50,080
Speaker 1: super tight, like even the ones you know, the Harrick guys,

914
00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:53,160
Speaker 1: the ones that played for laugh Like, they still get together.

915
00:44:53,520 --> 00:44:56,320
Speaker 1: I mean, look, you got Bob Myer's the GM of

916
00:44:56,480 --> 00:44:59,479
Speaker 1: the freaking Warriors, right, there's a connection. You've got people

917
00:44:59,680 --> 00:45:02,400
Speaker 1: in you know, Hollywood types. It's it's really interesting how

918
00:45:02,480 --> 00:45:05,920
Speaker 1: but we have such a narrow site of what college

919
00:45:06,280 --> 00:45:08,480
Speaker 1: well represents. Like if you go to social media, you

920
00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:11,640
Speaker 1: ask people who cover the game. In my position, college

921
00:45:11,680 --> 00:45:14,120
Speaker 1: basketball is only there is a way station for the pros.

922
00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:17,320
Speaker 1: Like that's not it, dude, You get it's the people

923
00:45:17,520 --> 00:45:21,000
Speaker 1: you're around are gonna be the powers in business. Wherever

924
00:45:21,120 --> 00:45:23,480
Speaker 1: you go to, schools have a bigger reach like you

925
00:45:23,560 --> 00:45:26,240
Speaker 1: go to Indiana. Like when you got done playing Indiana,

926
00:45:26,239 --> 00:45:27,920
Speaker 1: if you didn't want to become a basketball coach, you

927
00:45:27,960 --> 00:45:30,160
Speaker 1: could have gone into sales anywhere you wanted in the

928
00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:34,080
Speaker 1: state because you were point guarded. I you M all right,

929
00:45:34,120 --> 00:45:36,040
Speaker 1: so and that that's that's what it gets overlooked, and

930
00:45:36,120 --> 00:45:38,000
Speaker 1: that's that's what we gotta That's what we gotta get

931
00:45:38,040 --> 00:45:40,400
Speaker 1: back to. That's why I'm excited to be at at

932
00:45:40,440 --> 00:45:42,560
Speaker 1: a place like this because everything it has to offer,

933
00:45:42,680 --> 00:45:45,680
Speaker 1: not just from a basketball standpoint, but just like anything

934
00:45:45,760 --> 00:45:48,240
Speaker 1: you want to accomplish, you can get done here because

935
00:45:48,320 --> 00:45:50,879
Speaker 1: the people that haven't been here or are currently here,

936
00:45:51,160 --> 00:45:54,200
Speaker 1: you know. And I think that's a special opportunity. Um, Okay,

937
00:45:54,320 --> 00:45:57,759
Speaker 1: tell me about Ben Howett never talked to me when

938
00:45:57,760 --> 00:45:59,680
Speaker 1: I was a player. I mean, I wouldn't go to

939
00:45:59,760 --> 00:46:01,440
Speaker 1: nothing it recruited like she never talked to me as

940
00:46:01,480 --> 00:46:04,839
Speaker 1: a player. Okay. I've competed against his teams twice when

941
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:07,239
Speaker 1: I was at Nebraska, Okay, and got nothing more than

942
00:46:07,280 --> 00:46:10,000
Speaker 1: the handshake. On the handshake client, I'm at the NBA

943
00:46:10,080 --> 00:46:12,800
Speaker 1: Top D Camp two weeks ago, and I got U

944
00:46:12,880 --> 00:46:14,600
Speaker 1: c l l U c l A on my chest

945
00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:16,719
Speaker 1: and we chatted it up for five minutes with his

946
00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:18,920
Speaker 1: staff and my staff. You know, just because I got

947
00:46:19,040 --> 00:46:20,520
Speaker 1: U c l A on my chest, I mean I've

948
00:46:20,520 --> 00:46:22,200
Speaker 1: been around the guy, competed against the guy, and I

949
00:46:22,320 --> 00:46:24,480
Speaker 1: was just a dude, right, But now I got U

950
00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:26,399
Speaker 1: c U c l A on my chest, and now

951
00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:28,480
Speaker 1: you know, it's like what you said, the connection to

952
00:46:28,520 --> 00:46:30,800
Speaker 1: the part of the family these guys are tightened, and

953
00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:33,040
Speaker 1: it was really cool to be able to talk with

954
00:46:33,120 --> 00:46:37,160
Speaker 1: him for a few moments a couple of weeks ago. Um, okay,

955
00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:40,239
Speaker 1: so take me to the You are famous for a

956
00:46:40,320 --> 00:46:43,279
Speaker 1: lot of things. You're probably most famous for the guy

957
00:46:43,360 --> 00:46:45,880
Speaker 1: who stared down coach night, right. It was? It was

958
00:46:46,200 --> 00:46:49,520
Speaker 1: what year was It was Super Tuesday and you're playing

959
00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:54,200
Speaker 1: Michigan and you I've remember, I've seen the play multiple

960
00:46:54,280 --> 00:46:57,520
Speaker 1: times where somebody from Michigan drives to the basket and

961
00:46:57,800 --> 00:46:59,839
Speaker 1: you're you should be to help man to take the charge.

962
00:46:59,880 --> 00:47:02,440
Speaker 1: Instead you're like fronting in the low post and a

963
00:47:02,480 --> 00:47:06,400
Speaker 1: guy drives right up your butt and lays the ball in. Okay,

964
00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:08,560
Speaker 1: So was that was that one of the was that

965
00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:10,319
Speaker 1: one of the five boys. Was that like Dane five

966
00:47:10,360 --> 00:47:12,120
Speaker 1: who drove up your like I'm trying to trying to

967
00:47:12,160 --> 00:47:16,160
Speaker 1: think years, No, it was all. His first name was

968
00:47:16,280 --> 00:47:20,520
Speaker 1: Robbie I forget his last night. Robbie Reid. Yeah, Robbie Read.

969
00:47:20,719 --> 00:47:22,319
Speaker 1: I believe Robbie Read. His dad was the coach at

970
00:47:22,360 --> 00:47:24,600
Speaker 1: b y U. So Robbie Reid drives up and you're

971
00:47:24,840 --> 00:47:27,480
Speaker 1: and you don't see the ball, and and coach Knight

972
00:47:27,719 --> 00:47:30,520
Speaker 1: lays into you. Give me, what what year is this?

973
00:47:30,600 --> 00:47:33,440
Speaker 1: What year are you in school? I'm a sophomore. I'm

974
00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:36,200
Speaker 1: a sophomore. Um, we're like you said, we're playing Michigan,

975
00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:40,480
Speaker 1: and you know I was, I was out of position

976
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:43,279
Speaker 1: by our defensive rules. But you know we had you know,

977
00:47:43,360 --> 00:47:45,319
Speaker 1: we had walked through the day before and I mean

978
00:47:45,360 --> 00:47:47,560
Speaker 1: Liston was really good. I mean they had you know, Robbie,

979
00:47:47,560 --> 00:47:54,520
Speaker 1: they had Michiel Baston tractor trailer, UM Maurice Taylor, UM

980
00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:58,719
Speaker 1: Louis Bulllock. I mean they were good now and was expensive,

981
00:47:58,960 --> 00:48:03,640
Speaker 1: expensive team right there. They I believe I believe they

982
00:48:03,640 --> 00:48:08,200
Speaker 1: were over the over the cap for that was not

983
00:48:08,280 --> 00:48:11,120
Speaker 1: a cap friendly team. That's that's really what happened. They

984
00:48:11,160 --> 00:48:14,560
Speaker 1: weren't put on n C approbation. They were over the cap.

985
00:48:14,880 --> 00:48:19,680
Speaker 1: So that's that's right, Gerard Ward. Hold on, I'll tell

986
00:48:19,680 --> 00:48:21,239
Speaker 1: you real quick. Gerard Ward was on that team. This

987
00:48:21,280 --> 00:48:24,399
Speaker 1: is the famous grod Ward story. Okay, Groard Ward visits

988
00:48:24,480 --> 00:48:25,920
Speaker 1: u c l A. He's like the number one wing

989
00:48:26,000 --> 00:48:31,759
Speaker 1: in the country and uh he visits u c l A, and, um,

990
00:48:32,239 --> 00:48:36,080
Speaker 1: the Obandon guy boys are like the nicest dude, classiest

991
00:48:36,160 --> 00:48:41,560
Speaker 1: dudes ever. So Charles O'Bannon um chose him around campus.

992
00:48:42,840 --> 00:48:44,319
Speaker 1: And this is back when u c l A, which

993
00:48:44,360 --> 00:48:49,399
Speaker 1: just was picking dudes right, and so Gerard Ward uh

994
00:48:49,960 --> 00:48:51,840
Speaker 1: would would tell people that he's I'm going to be

995
00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:53,919
Speaker 1: better than Michael Jordan like and he believed it coming

996
00:48:53,960 --> 00:49:00,400
Speaker 1: out dead unbelieved it. So um so drod word. He

997
00:49:00,560 --> 00:49:02,840
Speaker 1: gets done with his visit u c l A and

998
00:49:02,920 --> 00:49:05,120
Speaker 1: he's like, tells Charles e Van. You could ask Charles

999
00:49:05,160 --> 00:49:09,160
Speaker 1: when he comes to ones events, Hey man, uh man,

1000
00:49:09,280 --> 00:49:10,840
Speaker 1: thanks for being so nice to me. I don't know

1001
00:49:10,880 --> 00:49:12,479
Speaker 1: why you were. I'm gonna come and take your job

1002
00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:15,920
Speaker 1: so whatever. Like that was like his last words to

1003
00:49:16,040 --> 00:49:17,640
Speaker 1: the u c l A players, like, thanks for being

1004
00:49:17,719 --> 00:49:19,160
Speaker 1: nice to me, but I was gonna come take your job.

1005
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:22,799
Speaker 1: And that team was that was. That was after they

1006
00:49:22,880 --> 00:49:25,520
Speaker 1: fired the staff, right because they got caught cheating, but

1007
00:49:25,600 --> 00:49:29,160
Speaker 1: it was they still mean lou Bullock, Robert Trailer, growd Ward,

1008
00:49:29,239 --> 00:49:34,239
Speaker 1: Maceo Baston, Robbie Reid, uh, Brandon Smith, the transferred played

1009
00:49:34,280 --> 00:49:37,480
Speaker 1: for my brother. Um. That was that was. That was

1010
00:49:37,480 --> 00:49:40,600
Speaker 1: an expensive team. Okay, so Robbie Reid drives up your backside.

1011
00:49:40,680 --> 00:49:43,080
Speaker 1: You're not in health. Oh I'm not in health. But

1012
00:49:43,120 --> 00:49:45,879
Speaker 1: we and walked through they you know, they're running America's player,

1013
00:49:46,160 --> 00:49:49,680
Speaker 1: you know, the cross screen down down. Yeah, so they're

1014
00:49:49,719 --> 00:49:51,640
Speaker 1: you know, Louis Bullocks and a cross screen on the

1015
00:49:51,640 --> 00:49:54,080
Speaker 1: baseline for tractor trailer and then he's getting a dawn

1016
00:49:54,160 --> 00:49:58,080
Speaker 1: screen um from Maurice, you know. And so you know

1017
00:49:58,080 --> 00:49:59,759
Speaker 1: when walks through, I just kind of bumped the cutter

1018
00:49:59,840 --> 00:50:04,280
Speaker 1: and and Chase whoever was mimicking Louis Bulock up the middle,

1019
00:50:04,440 --> 00:50:06,040
Speaker 1: you know, to make sure I'm there when he catches

1020
00:50:06,080 --> 00:50:09,320
Speaker 1: for the three, and uh, you know, Coach explains to

1021
00:50:09,400 --> 00:50:12,520
Speaker 1: me that tractor trailers like two seventy pounds and he's

1022
00:50:12,520 --> 00:50:15,680
Speaker 1: gonna knock me across, you know, into the bleachers if

1023
00:50:15,719 --> 00:50:18,719
Speaker 1: I don't you know, really chuck even, you know, and

1024
00:50:18,760 --> 00:50:21,799
Speaker 1: then just chase, like hell up to the top. Make

1025
00:50:21,840 --> 00:50:23,960
Speaker 1: sure you're there on the catch, you know, for Louis.

1026
00:50:24,600 --> 00:50:27,840
Speaker 1: And so the play comes. I'm sniffing it out. So

1027
00:50:27,960 --> 00:50:30,239
Speaker 1: I turned my back and I mean, back then you

1028
00:50:30,280 --> 00:50:32,680
Speaker 1: could you could really physically bumped Cutters Like now you

1029
00:50:32,760 --> 00:50:36,000
Speaker 1: can't really do it. And so I to two forms

1030
00:50:36,040 --> 00:50:38,360
Speaker 1: in the tractor's chest. I'm trying to bump him, and

1031
00:50:38,400 --> 00:50:41,440
Speaker 1: then I'm just gonna take off run as well. Robbie

1032
00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:43,200
Speaker 1: beats Uh, I forget you. I don't even know who

1033
00:50:43,280 --> 00:50:45,040
Speaker 1: was garden. Robbie just beats him, and he's laying it

1034
00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:49,400
Speaker 1: up right over right over my shoulder. And so Coach

1035
00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:51,759
Speaker 1: gets up and informs me that I was in the

1036
00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:56,719
Speaker 1: wrong defensive position. And um, I said, excuse me. We

1037
00:50:57,320 --> 00:50:59,959
Speaker 1: see we see the street, we see it on TV. Noble,

1038
00:51:00,040 --> 00:51:03,879
Speaker 1: what was what do you really say? Uh, I'm not sure.

1039
00:51:03,960 --> 00:51:06,360
Speaker 1: I think We've probably exchanged a few pleasant tries and

1040
00:51:06,560 --> 00:51:08,160
Speaker 1: and we moved on. You know the thing about the

1041
00:51:08,239 --> 00:51:10,840
Speaker 1: whole of Mint dougas like that happened. It was captured

1042
00:51:10,880 --> 00:51:13,840
Speaker 1: on TV because it was Coach. It it became a

1043
00:51:14,000 --> 00:51:17,360
Speaker 1: huge story. Um, we go down the other end, there

1044
00:51:17,480 --> 00:51:19,960
Speaker 1: was a a whistle, So we come out to a

1045
00:51:20,040 --> 00:51:22,440
Speaker 1: TV time out and that's you know, when what what

1046
00:51:22,600 --> 00:51:25,880
Speaker 1: you're talking about happens. Um, And I said out. He

1047
00:51:25,960 --> 00:51:28,719
Speaker 1: takes me out for about a minute and a half. UM.

1048
00:51:28,960 --> 00:51:30,680
Speaker 1: He talked to me very calmly on the bench, and

1049
00:51:30,719 --> 00:51:32,200
Speaker 1: then I went on and played, and then I never

1050
00:51:32,280 --> 00:51:35,960
Speaker 1: really talked about it again. Uh. And And honestly, from

1051
00:51:36,040 --> 00:51:39,600
Speaker 1: that point on, I think, um, at least from my

1052
00:51:39,920 --> 00:51:44,640
Speaker 1: my standpoint, our player coach relationship grew immensely um for

1053
00:51:44,920 --> 00:51:47,840
Speaker 1: over the next two and a half years, UM, because

1054
00:51:50,080 --> 00:51:52,279
Speaker 1: and I don't know if it was that or if

1055
00:51:52,880 --> 00:51:55,080
Speaker 1: he just felt, like, you know, he had somebody that

1056
00:51:55,200 --> 00:51:57,279
Speaker 1: he could he could trust and believe to help try

1057
00:51:57,320 --> 00:51:59,080
Speaker 1: to lead the team the way that he wanted it done.

1058
00:51:59,120 --> 00:52:01,400
Speaker 1: And I don't know, but from that point on, our

1059
00:52:01,480 --> 00:52:04,480
Speaker 1: relationship was wasn't unbelievable over the next two and a

1060
00:52:04,480 --> 00:52:07,600
Speaker 1: half years in my my career. But UM, you know,

1061
00:52:07,680 --> 00:52:10,520
Speaker 1: it's a it's a it's a thing that happens unfortunately

1062
00:52:10,560 --> 00:52:12,040
Speaker 1: in a in the heat of a moment with with

1063
00:52:12,640 --> 00:52:15,360
Speaker 1: some competitive guys. We've all we've all seen it. It

1064
00:52:15,400 --> 00:52:17,839
Speaker 1: would have been better if it would have been at

1065
00:52:17,880 --> 00:52:20,440
Speaker 1: half time and behind closed doors. Yeah, but it it

1066
00:52:20,560 --> 00:52:23,520
Speaker 1: happened when it happened, and him and I never talked

1067
00:52:23,520 --> 00:52:27,160
Speaker 1: about it again. You were his last point card, right

1068
00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:29,359
Speaker 1: because because we were getting ready to play you guys,

1069
00:52:30,040 --> 00:52:34,799
Speaker 1: We were getting ready to play you guys, get by Pepperdine. Yeah, well,

1070
00:52:34,800 --> 00:52:37,759
Speaker 1: you're bringing up all the great memories. No, I'm I'm well,

1071
00:52:37,800 --> 00:52:41,799
Speaker 1: I mean okay, so so I'll we'll get it. Then

1072
00:52:41,880 --> 00:52:44,360
Speaker 1: we'll do that best memory of playing it. I you,

1073
00:52:47,640 --> 00:52:49,959
Speaker 1: I just I mean, I I don't know. I can't

1074
00:52:50,000 --> 00:52:52,040
Speaker 1: name one. I think, just like I said, the way

1075
00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:54,000
Speaker 1: that I feel about my like sitting here today in

1076
00:52:54,040 --> 00:52:57,040
Speaker 1: my office at U c l A looking back and

1077
00:52:58,120 --> 00:53:00,080
Speaker 1: the feeling that I have when I think about my

1078
00:53:00,200 --> 00:53:04,080
Speaker 1: experience in those four years, that's the best memory, um,

1079
00:53:04,320 --> 00:53:07,239
Speaker 1: And and what the position that it put me in

1080
00:53:08,160 --> 00:53:11,680
Speaker 1: to be sitting here today. Um, The people that I

1081
00:53:11,960 --> 00:53:14,160
Speaker 1: interacted with, the people that I was able to meet

1082
00:53:14,800 --> 00:53:18,759
Speaker 1: and make connections with, and just like the overall foundation

1083
00:53:19,880 --> 00:53:22,600
Speaker 1: to do what I'm doing now is is the number

1084
00:53:22,640 --> 00:53:27,839
Speaker 1: one memory? Um? You were at the Neil Read practice though, right?

1085
00:53:28,280 --> 00:53:31,399
Speaker 1: That was was that your freshman year? That's my freshman year. Yeah,

1086
00:53:32,280 --> 00:53:34,759
Speaker 1: do you do. You don't like at the time that

1087
00:53:34,840 --> 00:53:36,839
Speaker 1: it happened, do you remember it being as big because

1088
00:53:37,000 --> 00:53:40,719
Speaker 1: the video didn't come out til years later? Right, Yeah, yeah,

1089
00:53:40,760 --> 00:53:43,879
Speaker 1: when the time that happened, Like, I don't remember it, um,

1090
00:53:45,239 --> 00:53:48,560
Speaker 1: you know, being you know, something just crazy, like oh

1091
00:53:48,640 --> 00:53:51,480
Speaker 1: my god, you know, like um and the tape you know,

1092
00:53:51,640 --> 00:53:54,759
Speaker 1: came out going into mun state tournament my senior year,

1093
00:53:54,840 --> 00:53:58,000
Speaker 1: so almost three and a half years later. Um, you

1094
00:53:58,080 --> 00:53:59,960
Speaker 1: know that, like I touched on earlier, when you're play,

1095
00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:03,960
Speaker 1: you're you're sol you're so self absorbed, um about how

1096
00:54:04,040 --> 00:54:08,799
Speaker 1: you're playing, Um, whether or not coaches on you or um,

1097
00:54:08,960 --> 00:54:11,320
Speaker 1: you know, how things are going, you know on campus,

1098
00:54:11,480 --> 00:54:14,000
Speaker 1: or how your girlfriend's doing or you know, you're you're

1099
00:54:14,040 --> 00:54:16,440
Speaker 1: just so worried about you that you know, if it

1100
00:54:16,560 --> 00:54:19,480
Speaker 1: didn't directly involve you, sometimes you just don't. You don't

1101
00:54:19,520 --> 00:54:22,239
Speaker 1: pay me that much attention to it. And unfortunately, when

1102
00:54:22,280 --> 00:54:24,240
Speaker 1: you're when you're in those things and you're you're practicing

1103
00:54:24,280 --> 00:54:27,160
Speaker 1: a hundred times a year and you go through the

1104
00:54:27,200 --> 00:54:29,160
Speaker 1: course of your career and you've got four D plus

1105
00:54:29,239 --> 00:54:32,560
Speaker 1: practices plus all your weight sessions and your workout. Um,

1106
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:35,600
Speaker 1: you know, if it didn't really directly involve you. I'm

1107
00:54:35,640 --> 00:54:37,840
Speaker 1: not sure much how much of an inprint it it

1108
00:54:38,000 --> 00:54:43,440
Speaker 1: made on you. One thing that that coach Night taught

1109
00:54:43,520 --> 00:54:47,480
Speaker 1: you that you still use to this death. Do your job.

1110
00:54:49,000 --> 00:54:52,359
Speaker 1: Just do your job, like, don't worry about anything else. Um,

1111
00:54:52,719 --> 00:54:54,040
Speaker 1: you know, do your job. And that was one of

1112
00:54:54,320 --> 00:54:56,000
Speaker 1: the things that he left me with when I was

1113
00:54:56,080 --> 00:54:58,959
Speaker 1: a senior, when you called me in about three quarters

1114
00:54:59,040 --> 00:55:02,120
Speaker 1: away through my senior year and I told him I

1115
00:55:02,200 --> 00:55:05,839
Speaker 1: wanted to coach, you know one day, and uh, he said,

1116
00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:08,440
Speaker 1: just do your job. He said, don't worry about um.

1117
00:55:09,480 --> 00:55:13,279
Speaker 1: Don't don't go into any opportunity and think it's beneath you. Uh.

1118
00:55:13,440 --> 00:55:15,239
Speaker 1: If your first job is to sweep the floor and

1119
00:55:15,280 --> 00:55:17,880
Speaker 1: then be the best, you know, floor sweeper in the country,

1120
00:55:18,280 --> 00:55:20,920
Speaker 1: and it's gonna lead to your next opportunity, and so

1121
00:55:21,080 --> 00:55:23,759
Speaker 1: on and so forth. And he's never been more more

1122
00:55:23,880 --> 00:55:25,800
Speaker 1: righting on anything he's ever said. Like I've tried to

1123
00:55:25,840 --> 00:55:28,239
Speaker 1: get jobs, Like I've reached out to people and tried

1124
00:55:28,280 --> 00:55:30,160
Speaker 1: to get jobs throughout my career and I've never gotten

1125
00:55:30,200 --> 00:55:33,480
Speaker 1: any of them. Every job I've I've ever gotten, um,

1126
00:55:34,600 --> 00:55:36,239
Speaker 1: you know, kind of kind of they came to me

1127
00:55:36,520 --> 00:55:39,160
Speaker 1: or you know, through some kind of mutual person that

1128
00:55:39,640 --> 00:55:42,120
Speaker 1: you know, brought my name up. But I've never gotten

1129
00:55:42,120 --> 00:55:44,879
Speaker 1: a job that I went after. The jobs that i've

1130
00:55:45,160 --> 00:55:47,719
Speaker 1: I've always gotten its kind of come fum my way.

1131
00:55:47,840 --> 00:55:50,880
Speaker 1: And and uh, I think that has happened because of

1132
00:55:51,000 --> 00:55:53,200
Speaker 1: the just doing my job, whatever it is. Just try

1133
00:55:53,239 --> 00:55:54,720
Speaker 1: to do your job and the best of your ability,

1134
00:55:55,160 --> 00:55:56,839
Speaker 1: and if you do it well enough, and then your

1135
00:55:56,880 --> 00:55:59,839
Speaker 1: next opportunity is gonna come your way. You get them

1136
00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:02,239
Speaker 1: playing And we played against each other in the usb L.

1137
00:56:02,480 --> 00:56:07,200
Speaker 1: Rick Barry was your coach. What was he like? Obviously

1138
00:56:07,200 --> 00:56:09,440
Speaker 1: he's one of the greatest players to ever played the game. Um,

1139
00:56:09,760 --> 00:56:14,160
Speaker 1: you know he was, I think, Um, you know, Rick

1140
00:56:14,760 --> 00:56:17,480
Speaker 1: Rick was an interesting character because, like I was, I

1141
00:56:17,600 --> 00:56:19,640
Speaker 1: was all fired up to play for Rick. Obviously it's

1142
00:56:20,040 --> 00:56:22,279
Speaker 1: one of the great coaches and um, you know, but

1143
00:56:22,360 --> 00:56:24,400
Speaker 1: when you're dealing with with guys in the U s

1144
00:56:24,440 --> 00:56:27,440
Speaker 1: BL like, sometimes things don't come as easily to us

1145
00:56:27,760 --> 00:56:30,560
Speaker 1: as it did, you know, to him, And and I

1146
00:56:30,680 --> 00:56:33,640
Speaker 1: think he would get frustrated with that at times. But um,

1147
00:56:33,719 --> 00:56:36,000
Speaker 1: it was a great experience. I mean, obviously, you know

1148
00:56:36,200 --> 00:56:37,960
Speaker 1: it was different than anything I was used do you

1149
00:56:38,040 --> 00:56:40,000
Speaker 1: I was going from Indiana. We were flying on private

1150
00:56:40,040 --> 00:56:42,759
Speaker 1: planes and staying in in great hotels and now you're

1151
00:56:42,800 --> 00:56:45,920
Speaker 1: on the six am flight, um back in the economy

1152
00:56:45,960 --> 00:56:49,480
Speaker 1: and you're staying at a motel six or something and UM,

1153
00:56:50,120 --> 00:56:52,279
Speaker 1: you know, so it's just an overall different experience for

1154
00:56:52,400 --> 00:56:55,759
Speaker 1: me and UM, but it was. It's just part of

1155
00:56:55,800 --> 00:56:57,960
Speaker 1: your story, you know that you you you stacked those

1156
00:56:58,000 --> 00:57:00,040
Speaker 1: experiences and those stories on top of each other, and

1157
00:57:00,120 --> 00:57:01,960
Speaker 1: I kind of make sure who you who you are,

1158
00:57:02,080 --> 00:57:05,359
Speaker 1: and UM, it was a fun time. I'd never Um.

1159
00:57:06,200 --> 00:57:07,520
Speaker 1: It was the first time I ever came off a

1160
00:57:07,560 --> 00:57:09,440
Speaker 1: ball screen. Like, we didn't run ball streams in Indiana.

1161
00:57:09,440 --> 00:57:12,400
Speaker 1: We ran up motion offense coach with hated ball screens,

1162
00:57:12,440 --> 00:57:15,080
Speaker 1: and um, so it was different for me, you know,

1163
00:57:15,160 --> 00:57:16,840
Speaker 1: being a point guard and trying to learn how to

1164
00:57:16,960 --> 00:57:19,080
Speaker 1: play off a ball screens and make all the region

1165
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:22,320
Speaker 1: and U you know, I do know. There was first

1166
00:57:22,360 --> 00:57:26,600
Speaker 1: places to wake up in four Mier, Florida at that time. Yeah,

1167
00:57:26,640 --> 00:57:28,040
Speaker 1: it was nice. It was nice down there. We actually

1168
00:57:28,080 --> 00:57:29,840
Speaker 1: stayed there was some Oklahoma STI this is one of

1169
00:57:29,880 --> 00:57:33,000
Speaker 1: those things that like guys should know. So we're playing

1170
00:57:33,040 --> 00:57:36,160
Speaker 1: for the Oaklhomas, Oklahoma Storm and Enid, Oklahoma, and we

1171
00:57:36,240 --> 00:57:40,400
Speaker 1: had like five Oklahoma stake guys. And our announcer was

1172
00:57:40,400 --> 00:57:42,480
Speaker 1: getting Robert down, who's like has a radio show in

1173
00:57:42,520 --> 00:57:45,520
Speaker 1: Stillwater and he hooks us up there some Oklahoma state

1174
00:57:45,520 --> 00:57:48,800
Speaker 1: alone has got a condo in Santa on Santa bell Island,

1175
00:57:49,360 --> 00:57:51,920
Speaker 1: And so we came down. We played the team in

1176
00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:56,320
Speaker 1: Sara Sota uh Roy Jones team, then we played you guys.

1177
00:57:56,720 --> 00:57:58,479
Speaker 1: Then we played you guys on back to back nights,

1178
00:57:58,920 --> 00:58:01,880
Speaker 1: and then we played Broy Jones team, and then we left.

1179
00:58:01,920 --> 00:58:03,880
Speaker 1: It was like four games. We might have had one

1180
00:58:03,960 --> 00:58:06,280
Speaker 1: day off. Anyway, we stayed in Santa Belle Island. We

1181
00:58:06,320 --> 00:58:09,320
Speaker 1: were like, this is unbelievable. This is so great. Um,

1182
00:58:10,080 --> 00:58:11,840
Speaker 1: who is the who is the best Who's the best

1183
00:58:11,920 --> 00:58:16,520
Speaker 1: player on your team that year? By the way, I'm

1184
00:58:16,560 --> 00:58:18,320
Speaker 1: looking at you your playing cards, a buil, Do you

1185
00:58:18,360 --> 00:58:20,280
Speaker 1: have any of your playing cards? I have one of

1186
00:58:20,320 --> 00:58:22,560
Speaker 1: your playing cards here. I'm not sure I even I

1187
00:58:22,640 --> 00:58:24,640
Speaker 1: didn't know I had one. I didn't know I had one.

1188
00:58:24,720 --> 00:58:26,560
Speaker 1: You know, the best the best experience about the Florida

1189
00:58:26,600 --> 00:58:29,200
Speaker 1: Sea Dragons was um, you know, talking about connections of

1190
00:58:29,240 --> 00:58:32,800
Speaker 1: where you where you were. Um, there was a a

1191
00:58:32,880 --> 00:58:36,680
Speaker 1: guy named Hute Tindler who just passed away this past year.

1192
00:58:37,240 --> 00:58:39,840
Speaker 1: Um was a longtime coach down in that area at

1193
00:58:39,880 --> 00:58:43,120
Speaker 1: at a smaller college. Uh. And he had a beach

1194
00:58:43,160 --> 00:58:46,280
Speaker 1: house and he had like he had like three bedrooms

1195
00:58:46,360 --> 00:58:48,800
Speaker 1: up top, and he had converted like the basement lower

1196
00:58:48,880 --> 00:58:52,680
Speaker 1: level floor in the two one bedroom apartments. And we

1197
00:58:52,840 --> 00:58:55,880
Speaker 1: were staying at like a courtyard. You know. The whole

1198
00:58:55,880 --> 00:58:57,680
Speaker 1: team was just you know, you're in a courtyard. You

1199
00:58:57,760 --> 00:59:01,640
Speaker 1: got a roommate, you know. And uh, he he offered

1200
00:59:01,720 --> 00:59:04,000
Speaker 1: me to come stay out at his his beach house

1201
00:59:04,080 --> 00:59:06,880
Speaker 1: in one of the apartments UM down below where he stayed.

1202
00:59:07,560 --> 00:59:11,040
Speaker 1: Um and gave me an old beat up red truck

1203
00:59:11,120 --> 00:59:13,320
Speaker 1: that he had that he wasn't used. So instead of

1204
00:59:13,360 --> 00:59:15,680
Speaker 1: having to drive in the in the minivans from the

1205
00:59:16,040 --> 00:59:18,920
Speaker 1: courtyard to do everything with everybody else, I actually got

1206
00:59:18,960 --> 00:59:21,480
Speaker 1: my own place out out of four Myers Beach and

1207
00:59:21,480 --> 00:59:24,320
Speaker 1: it was it was a great, great experience. But I

1208
00:59:24,800 --> 00:59:27,120
Speaker 1: couldn't I couldn't tell you who I didn't know. I

1209
00:59:27,200 --> 00:59:29,240
Speaker 1: had a player's card, Doug, I'm not sure who our

1210
00:59:29,280 --> 00:59:31,960
Speaker 1: best player was. You don't remember any team like, dude,

1211
00:59:31,960 --> 00:59:33,400
Speaker 1: We I had it. We had a squad we had

1212
00:59:33,440 --> 00:59:36,160
Speaker 1: I renewable. He played in the NBA, had a squad,

1213
00:59:36,200 --> 00:59:37,640
Speaker 1: a bunch of guys you knew, Like I went down

1214
00:59:37,800 --> 00:59:39,360
Speaker 1: and played with a bunch of guys that that I

1215
00:59:39,480 --> 00:59:43,160
Speaker 1: didn't know. Um and I mean I we got robbed

1216
00:59:43,200 --> 00:59:44,880
Speaker 1: one night down there. So I've tried to block out

1217
00:59:44,880 --> 00:59:47,880
Speaker 1: a lot of those memories from out there. Well you

1218
00:59:47,920 --> 00:59:51,400
Speaker 1: got robs. Oh we we went to uh we went

1219
00:59:51,480 --> 00:59:54,400
Speaker 1: to a nightclub and we were flying out the next

1220
00:59:54,440 --> 00:59:58,320
Speaker 1: morning for some some trip over some road trip. And um,

1221
00:59:58,560 --> 01:00:00,320
Speaker 1: I think we had just gotten our page X and

1222
01:00:01,040 --> 01:00:03,120
Speaker 1: and uh so we went to a there was a

1223
01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:05,800
Speaker 1: concert at this nightclub, and we all went to this

1224
01:00:05,920 --> 01:00:08,640
Speaker 1: nightclub and we left. We left early, a little bit

1225
01:00:08,680 --> 01:00:12,000
Speaker 1: before the concert was over. And uh yeah, we got

1226
01:00:12,480 --> 01:00:16,800
Speaker 1: we got jumped in the parking lot and uh there

1227
01:00:16,920 --> 01:00:19,520
Speaker 1: we two shots were fired through the front windshield of

1228
01:00:19,560 --> 01:00:22,000
Speaker 1: a of an Astral mini van and we had to

1229
01:00:22,040 --> 01:00:23,680
Speaker 1: turn that in the next morning as we're going to

1230
01:00:23,760 --> 01:00:25,920
Speaker 1: hit the airport. So there's nothing like turning in a

1231
01:00:25,960 --> 01:00:28,520
Speaker 1: mini vandom to rick Berry with two bullet holes through

1232
01:00:28,520 --> 01:00:31,880
Speaker 1: the front windshield. Let even know that everybody's okay. So

1233
01:00:33,480 --> 01:00:35,800
Speaker 1: it was a great experience. I have no I had

1234
01:00:35,840 --> 01:00:39,320
Speaker 1: no idea like we had. I mean, we had Willie Burton,

1235
01:00:39,920 --> 01:00:43,680
Speaker 1: we had whose ninth pick of the draft. I mentioned

1236
01:00:43,720 --> 01:00:46,800
Speaker 1: I renewable um. We had. We had a good and

1237
01:00:46,880 --> 01:00:48,400
Speaker 1: then we had the Oaklahoma state guys as well. We

1238
01:00:48,480 --> 01:00:50,920
Speaker 1: had my dad told me, and I think I might

1239
01:00:50,960 --> 01:00:52,800
Speaker 1: have said this in the pod. My dad told me.

1240
01:00:53,360 --> 01:00:56,840
Speaker 1: I remember we were doing training camp and we had

1241
01:00:56,880 --> 01:00:58,680
Speaker 1: Bubble Wells and lead the country and scoring use the

1242
01:00:58,680 --> 01:01:01,760
Speaker 1: second round pick of the Mavericks. I remember my dad

1243
01:01:01,840 --> 01:01:05,760
Speaker 1: said like, hey, there's always a reason. And I go,

1244
01:01:06,280 --> 01:01:07,880
Speaker 1: He's like, there's always a reason these guys are in

1245
01:01:07,920 --> 01:01:11,000
Speaker 1: the NBA. And he's like, he's like, you know, like

1246
01:01:11,120 --> 01:01:14,040
Speaker 1: with you, it's like you mentally you're shooting. It's like

1247
01:01:14,120 --> 01:01:16,200
Speaker 1: but sometimes if somebody eats their way out of the NBA,

1248
01:01:16,880 --> 01:01:21,479
Speaker 1: some people, you know, it's it's women, it's drugs, it's

1249
01:01:21,760 --> 01:01:25,720
Speaker 1: you know, they're gambling. It's like something. And I swear

1250
01:01:25,760 --> 01:01:28,280
Speaker 1: to god, we had every we had a guy that checked.

1251
01:01:28,360 --> 01:01:31,760
Speaker 1: We had somebody checked one of those boxes. I'll throughout

1252
01:01:31,840 --> 01:01:33,480
Speaker 1: we're like, we're like, damn, why is that guy not

1253
01:01:33,640 --> 01:01:36,040
Speaker 1: playing still playing playing in the NBA? And then you

1254
01:01:36,080 --> 01:01:37,600
Speaker 1: hang around him for a week and you're like, oh,

1255
01:01:38,440 --> 01:01:43,360
Speaker 1: oh he's on drugs, no doubt, of course. Uh okay,

1256
01:01:43,400 --> 01:01:46,680
Speaker 1: so then you play then you played over what did

1257
01:01:46,680 --> 01:01:50,160
Speaker 1: you play overseas? I went to UM, I went over

1258
01:01:50,240 --> 01:01:54,800
Speaker 1: to Belgium. Um, and I was in uh what was

1259
01:01:54,840 --> 01:02:03,240
Speaker 1: it to Liam Belgium? Some that was I was there.

1260
01:02:03,720 --> 01:02:05,600
Speaker 1: I'm trying to think. I've been a few places. I

1261
01:02:05,680 --> 01:02:07,200
Speaker 1: guess I got a lot of things going on right

1262
01:02:07,240 --> 01:02:09,080
Speaker 1: I'm trying to get a house in my family. We've

1263
01:02:09,080 --> 01:02:10,840
Speaker 1: got some things going on out here right now. Done.

1264
01:02:10,880 --> 01:02:14,200
Speaker 1: But um in the age, I was in the Age Belgium,

1265
01:02:14,720 --> 01:02:18,720
Speaker 1: and we went out there and had a you know,

1266
01:02:18,960 --> 01:02:20,840
Speaker 1: I had a contract. I felt like it was decent,

1267
01:02:20,960 --> 01:02:26,160
Speaker 1: and we we played one game. Go through training camp,

1268
01:02:26,240 --> 01:02:29,440
Speaker 1: we play game. I got eighteen, um, and you always

1269
01:02:29,440 --> 01:02:31,640
Speaker 1: compare yourself to the American on the other team, right,

1270
01:02:32,000 --> 01:02:34,080
Speaker 1: So the American I guarded on the other team, he

1271
01:02:34,160 --> 01:02:36,400
Speaker 1: had thirteen. They beat us on the last second shot.

1272
01:02:36,440 --> 01:02:39,160
Speaker 1: I get called in the next morning and I'm sitting

1273
01:02:39,160 --> 01:02:44,160
Speaker 1: around this this conference table and in this office, and um,

1274
01:02:44,560 --> 01:02:47,640
Speaker 1: the coaches in there. Uh, the president that I had

1275
01:02:47,680 --> 01:02:49,480
Speaker 1: been introduced to was in there, and then some other

1276
01:02:49,520 --> 01:02:52,400
Speaker 1: guy who I don't know who he was, UM there

1277
01:02:52,440 --> 01:02:54,680
Speaker 1: and there and they're speaking French and then they were

1278
01:02:54,720 --> 01:02:56,640
Speaker 1: speaking English to me, and then they speak French and

1279
01:02:56,640 --> 01:02:58,360
Speaker 1: then he wished to me, and I was like, this

1280
01:02:58,600 --> 01:03:00,800
Speaker 1: is not gonna go well, like you just tell right,

1281
01:03:01,400 --> 01:03:03,440
Speaker 1: And so they informed me that they were releasing me.

1282
01:03:03,920 --> 01:03:08,520
Speaker 1: UM that day after one game and they they had

1283
01:03:09,120 --> 01:03:12,680
Speaker 1: UM informed me that they had signed another point guard

1284
01:03:13,400 --> 01:03:15,960
Speaker 1: and come to find out, it was Michael Huger, who

1285
01:03:16,280 --> 01:03:20,640
Speaker 1: is now the head coach at Bowling Green. And Michael

1286
01:03:20,680 --> 01:03:22,600
Speaker 1: had been like the he had been like m v

1287
01:03:22,720 --> 01:03:25,480
Speaker 1: P or first team All League UM in the in

1288
01:03:25,600 --> 01:03:28,520
Speaker 1: that league the year before UH and had had some

1289
01:03:28,680 --> 01:03:31,640
Speaker 1: problems with his physical with his team. My team was

1290
01:03:31,720 --> 01:03:34,760
Speaker 1: kind of new to the top division. UM, so they

1291
01:03:34,880 --> 01:03:38,000
Speaker 1: cut me and signed Michael Huger, and I was I

1292
01:03:38,160 --> 01:03:41,480
Speaker 1: was out outro and I just remember I landed UM

1293
01:03:41,560 --> 01:03:44,520
Speaker 1: and about two or three days later, UM, all this

1294
01:03:44,640 --> 01:03:48,160
Speaker 1: September eleven, stuff happened and I was out out of that.

1295
01:03:48,280 --> 01:03:49,640
Speaker 1: You know what, Like, I know what I want to do.

1296
01:03:49,720 --> 01:03:52,240
Speaker 1: I'm not a pro. I'm not gonna play in the NBA.

1297
01:03:52,800 --> 01:03:54,800
Speaker 1: It would have been a great experience. I know what

1298
01:03:54,880 --> 01:03:57,280
Speaker 1: I want to do. UM, And so I reached out

1299
01:03:57,280 --> 01:03:58,640
Speaker 1: to coach Nidi was in the source of year in

1300
01:03:58,720 --> 01:04:01,160
Speaker 1: Texas Tech, and he said, hey, you come down here

1301
01:04:01,240 --> 01:04:03,520
Speaker 1: next year and be a grad assistant, you know, And

1302
01:04:03,600 --> 01:04:09,160
Speaker 1: so I think for a year, I went wide, started

1303
01:04:09,240 --> 01:04:11,840
Speaker 1: as a text tech as a grad assistant. I was

1304
01:04:11,880 --> 01:04:15,240
Speaker 1: a grad assistant two years at Texas Tech, and then I, uh,

1305
01:04:15,920 --> 01:04:18,680
Speaker 1: my first Division one job was Stephen F. Austin. Yeah,

1306
01:04:20,120 --> 01:04:23,400
Speaker 1: full time assistant Stephen F. Auston, huge, huge money. I

1307
01:04:23,760 --> 01:04:25,720
Speaker 1: told my wife, I said, hey, you know, the hardest

1308
01:04:25,760 --> 01:04:28,320
Speaker 1: thing in coaching is getting that first opportunity to get

1309
01:04:28,360 --> 01:04:30,640
Speaker 1: on the road and recruit. Everybody wants recruiting the experience,

1310
01:04:30,720 --> 01:04:33,000
Speaker 1: and as a young guy, you're like, you know, listen,

1311
01:04:33,120 --> 01:04:36,040
Speaker 1: like I can develop relationships. I just need an opportunity,

1312
01:04:36,400 --> 01:04:38,760
Speaker 1: you know. And and uh, finally I was giving an

1313
01:04:38,760 --> 01:04:41,160
Speaker 1: opportunity to get on the road. And I remember going

1314
01:04:41,240 --> 01:04:43,800
Speaker 1: back to my wife and telling, hey, you know, I

1315
01:04:43,880 --> 01:04:47,120
Speaker 1: got the job full time. Do you want assistant twelve thousand,

1316
01:04:47,240 --> 01:04:50,800
Speaker 1: five hundred and a FOURD tours you know, and and

1317
01:04:51,000 --> 01:04:52,840
Speaker 1: but but we made it. Then, we've made the big time.

1318
01:04:52,880 --> 01:04:55,360
Speaker 1: We're finally in, you know. And and sometimes that's what

1319
01:04:55,440 --> 01:04:57,760
Speaker 1: it takes me. He just need an opportunity and and uh,

1320
01:04:58,160 --> 01:05:01,880
Speaker 1: I've been very fortunate ever since. Um, when you were

1321
01:05:01,920 --> 01:05:05,960
Speaker 1: at Tech, was Beard on the staff then? Yeah, Chris was.

1322
01:05:06,200 --> 01:05:09,480
Speaker 1: Chris was an assistant coach. Chris was actually, um, kind

1323
01:05:09,520 --> 01:05:12,160
Speaker 1: of the the guy that helped me get um the

1324
01:05:12,280 --> 01:05:15,160
Speaker 1: job as Stephen F. Austin. He had worked for Danny

1325
01:05:15,240 --> 01:05:18,760
Speaker 1: Casper as an assistant when he first got it got started,

1326
01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:23,080
Speaker 1: and Danny had reached out to Chris about um, you know,

1327
01:05:23,200 --> 01:05:25,000
Speaker 1: meaning the young guy to fill a spot, you know,

1328
01:05:25,080 --> 01:05:29,120
Speaker 1: in August. And and so Chris, uh gave me my

1329
01:05:29,240 --> 01:05:32,240
Speaker 1: name and and Danny reached out and where he went

1330
01:05:32,320 --> 01:05:34,240
Speaker 1: from there. So you know, Chris is kind of really

1331
01:05:35,600 --> 01:05:38,880
Speaker 1: the guy that got that ball rolling for me. Did

1332
01:05:38,960 --> 01:05:40,400
Speaker 1: you did you have any idea he would be this

1333
01:05:40,480 --> 01:05:43,720
Speaker 1: kind of coach? No? I did. I mean it's it's

1334
01:05:43,720 --> 01:05:45,640
Speaker 1: hard to like everybody like, oh yeah, I can see it,

1335
01:05:45,720 --> 01:05:47,800
Speaker 1: like you know, I didn't. I mean they I thought,

1336
01:05:48,360 --> 01:05:50,080
Speaker 1: you know, when I was at Tech, I thought they

1337
01:05:50,160 --> 01:05:53,080
Speaker 1: had a really good staff. Um. You know, a guy

1338
01:05:53,160 --> 01:05:55,720
Speaker 1: named Bob Buyer was on the staff, who who's now

1339
01:05:55,800 --> 01:05:59,640
Speaker 1: an assistant in the NBA. Pat Knight was on the staff. Uh,

1340
01:05:59,680 --> 01:06:01,560
Speaker 1: and then Chris beer, you know, and those were the

1341
01:06:01,600 --> 01:06:04,800
Speaker 1: guys that were were coaches assistance during my time there.

1342
01:06:04,840 --> 01:06:06,720
Speaker 1: So it was a great learning experience obviously, you know,

1343
01:06:06,840 --> 01:06:09,840
Speaker 1: being around coach on the other side, uh, and seeing

1344
01:06:09,880 --> 01:06:13,040
Speaker 1: how he attacked each day, how he prepared for practice

1345
01:06:13,080 --> 01:06:15,280
Speaker 1: and games, and just kind of how he managed the

1346
01:06:15,360 --> 01:06:18,560
Speaker 1: office and went about running a college basketball program. Um

1347
01:06:18,720 --> 01:06:20,880
Speaker 1: that you didn't see as a player. To see it

1348
01:06:20,920 --> 01:06:23,000
Speaker 1: on the other side on the people to be in

1349
01:06:23,040 --> 01:06:26,200
Speaker 1: those meetings was was great. And then obviously to be

1350
01:06:26,280 --> 01:06:29,560
Speaker 1: around those three three individuals and and uh, you know,

1351
01:06:29,680 --> 01:06:31,919
Speaker 1: be able to pick their brain every day was really good.

1352
01:06:33,120 --> 01:06:35,080
Speaker 1: You were were you were at Eastern before you went

1353
01:06:35,160 --> 01:06:38,360
Speaker 1: to Butler, right, Yes, I was at Eastern Illinois for

1354
01:06:38,480 --> 01:06:42,160
Speaker 1: six years with Mike Miller, who who I think he

1355
01:06:42,200 --> 01:06:44,200
Speaker 1: has been the head coach of the New York Knicks

1356
01:06:44,520 --> 01:06:49,080
Speaker 1: um G League team for several years. And I believe, uh,

1357
01:06:49,320 --> 01:06:52,200
Speaker 1: if I if I heard correctly, um may just got

1358
01:06:52,360 --> 01:06:54,920
Speaker 1: moved up to the bench on in the NBA. So

1359
01:06:55,440 --> 01:06:59,200
Speaker 1: so congrats him a great a really good basketball coach

1360
01:06:59,200 --> 01:07:03,200
Speaker 1: Eastern Nolinois. Just very difficult job. Okay, So how did

1361
01:07:03,280 --> 01:07:05,000
Speaker 1: how did it come about that you come about that

1362
01:07:05,080 --> 01:07:08,800
Speaker 1: you got the butler. So I actually took a job

1363
01:07:08,880 --> 01:07:11,520
Speaker 1: with Porter Moser at Loola. When he got the job

1364
01:07:11,800 --> 01:07:15,320
Speaker 1: at Chicago, he was looking for a a young guy

1365
01:07:15,400 --> 01:07:19,040
Speaker 1: that could recruit UM in the Midwest and in Indiana

1366
01:07:19,120 --> 01:07:21,960
Speaker 1: and and uh, my name was given to him and

1367
01:07:22,000 --> 01:07:24,560
Speaker 1: he reached out. I took the job. I was actually

1368
01:07:24,640 --> 01:07:27,200
Speaker 1: in Chicago for about two and a half weeks. Uh

1369
01:07:27,320 --> 01:07:30,160
Speaker 1: and Porter. I get a phone call from Porter Um

1370
01:07:30,880 --> 01:07:32,960
Speaker 1: and I was I was actually back in Charleston to

1371
01:07:33,040 --> 01:07:35,760
Speaker 1: see my wife who was getting ready to deliver our

1372
01:07:35,800 --> 01:07:40,000
Speaker 1: second daughter. And Porter goes, hey, Brad Stevens just called me,

1373
01:07:40,680 --> 01:07:42,320
Speaker 1: Um and wants to talk to you about a job.

1374
01:07:42,400 --> 01:07:44,720
Speaker 1: What are you gonna do? And I was like, what

1375
01:07:44,840 --> 01:07:47,280
Speaker 1: are you? What are you talking about? And Um, you

1376
01:07:47,360 --> 01:07:50,680
Speaker 1: know Brad and typical Brad fashion. He called Porter first

1377
01:07:51,560 --> 01:07:54,000
Speaker 1: UM and asked Porter, you know, if you could talk

1378
01:07:54,040 --> 01:07:56,720
Speaker 1: to me about a job near the time, he wasn't great. UM,

1379
01:07:56,960 --> 01:07:59,920
Speaker 1: and I give I give you know, Porter a ton

1380
01:08:00,000 --> 01:08:01,920
Speaker 1: of credit because Brad said, hey, listen, Mike doesn't know

1381
01:08:02,000 --> 01:08:05,440
Speaker 1: about this. Um, you don't have to worry about him

1382
01:08:05,480 --> 01:08:07,600
Speaker 1: getting upset. You know, this is just you and me.

1383
01:08:07,720 --> 01:08:11,120
Speaker 1: Nobody else knows about it. UM And Porter, just taking

1384
01:08:11,160 --> 01:08:13,600
Speaker 1: the job and trying to get get that program rolling.

1385
01:08:14,120 --> 01:08:17,439
Speaker 1: And I've always been dead at the Porter because he

1386
01:08:17,520 --> 01:08:19,519
Speaker 1: gave me the opportunity to talk to Brad about the

1387
01:08:20,040 --> 01:08:23,280
Speaker 1: job and and UM, you know you can't. You got

1388
01:08:23,280 --> 01:08:25,760
Speaker 1: an opportunity to work for Brad Stevens coming off the

1389
01:08:25,840 --> 01:08:28,920
Speaker 1: two final fours A Butler, Um, you know you take it.

1390
01:08:28,960 --> 01:08:31,640
Speaker 1: It's kind of like you know when Mick reached out

1391
01:08:31,680 --> 01:08:33,120
Speaker 1: to me here, like you don't tell U c l

1392
01:08:33,160 --> 01:08:35,640
Speaker 1: A now you know. And and so that's how I

1393
01:08:35,680 --> 01:08:37,360
Speaker 1: got to Butler. I was there for five years, two

1394
01:08:37,360 --> 01:08:40,080
Speaker 1: of them with Brad Um and then before he went

1395
01:08:40,120 --> 01:08:43,080
Speaker 1: to Boston, and then Brandon Miller for a year. The

1396
01:08:43,160 --> 01:08:49,679
Speaker 1: last two years were under Chris Holtman. Um, if you could,

1397
01:08:51,640 --> 01:08:54,280
Speaker 1: m okay, So I asked you about about Coach Night,

1398
01:08:54,520 --> 01:08:56,920
Speaker 1: all right, the same question kind of about Brad, like

1399
01:08:57,080 --> 01:09:02,160
Speaker 1: what is it Brad? Brad is just one. I think

1400
01:09:02,200 --> 01:09:06,120
Speaker 1: he's very comfortable with who he is. UM. He he

1401
01:09:06,360 --> 01:09:12,280
Speaker 1: is uber, uber intelligent. UM. And he's ultimately prepared, overly

1402
01:09:12,360 --> 01:09:15,240
Speaker 1: prepared for every situation like you're you're not ever gonna

1403
01:09:15,320 --> 01:09:20,360
Speaker 1: catch him, um, not prepared. And I think he's very

1404
01:09:20,400 --> 01:09:25,080
Speaker 1: efficient in um, how he works and how he prepares,

1405
01:09:25,160 --> 01:09:28,360
Speaker 1: how he runs a practice. UM. And I tell people,

1406
01:09:28,360 --> 01:09:30,320
Speaker 1: I've told people this before, and they look at me

1407
01:09:30,520 --> 01:09:36,679
Speaker 1: like kind of really really strange. UM, Like what Bob

1408
01:09:36,800 --> 01:09:40,080
Speaker 1: Knight and what Brad Stevens want from their players or

1409
01:09:40,120 --> 01:09:42,400
Speaker 1: want from their program, the type of people that they want,

1410
01:09:43,080 --> 01:09:47,679
Speaker 1: UM their program to stand for, are exactly the same.

1411
01:09:48,439 --> 01:09:52,439
Speaker 1: Now how each one of those individuals go about achieving

1412
01:09:52,520 --> 01:09:55,840
Speaker 1: that our opposite ends of the spectrum, and both worked

1413
01:09:55,880 --> 01:09:59,120
Speaker 1: for each individual. But you know, it's like it's like

1414
01:09:59,200 --> 01:10:02,880
Speaker 1: even elite company. Now you look you look at especially sports,

1415
01:10:02,880 --> 01:10:05,120
Speaker 1: you look at the Patriots, so you look at you know,

1416
01:10:05,200 --> 01:10:08,679
Speaker 1: what the Warriors have done, like like the main components

1417
01:10:08,760 --> 01:10:11,600
Speaker 1: of those things are all the same. Now that how

1418
01:10:11,680 --> 01:10:13,720
Speaker 1: they go about getting them. Sometimes they do it their

1419
01:10:13,760 --> 01:10:15,519
Speaker 1: own personal way, which you have to do. You gotta

1420
01:10:15,520 --> 01:10:18,360
Speaker 1: be who you are, UM. But those guys were very

1421
01:10:18,400 --> 01:10:20,160
Speaker 1: similar in what they wanted. They just go about it

1422
01:10:20,240 --> 01:10:22,640
Speaker 1: in different ways. And they they both have achieved a

1423
01:10:22,680 --> 01:10:27,800
Speaker 1: ton of success. Your second year there, you guys got

1424
01:10:27,880 --> 01:10:30,640
Speaker 1: to I'm gonna say the sweet sixteen? Is that right? Right?

1425
01:10:31,240 --> 01:10:33,560
Speaker 1: Or did you lose? I guess you lost in the

1426
01:10:33,640 --> 01:10:37,200
Speaker 1: second game. You beat Bucknell and then you you lost

1427
01:10:37,280 --> 01:10:40,599
Speaker 1: to Marquette. But but this is and but now you've

1428
01:10:40,600 --> 01:10:42,639
Speaker 1: gotten a chance to be a part like the first

1429
01:10:42,720 --> 01:10:45,679
Speaker 1: year was, I mean, you've lost They lost Gordon Hayward

1430
01:10:45,720 --> 01:10:47,640
Speaker 1: the year before and then they lost Shelvin Mack. Like

1431
01:10:47,800 --> 01:10:50,200
Speaker 1: you lose two of the kind of like all time

1432
01:10:50,280 --> 01:10:53,439
Speaker 1: great Butler players. And so you do, and and the

1433
01:10:53,479 --> 01:10:55,760
Speaker 1: competition got stiffer and you you didn't make the n

1434
01:10:55,800 --> 01:10:58,280
Speaker 1: S a Terman. Second year you do, so you get

1435
01:10:58,360 --> 01:11:01,080
Speaker 1: to see kind of brad at you know, at a

1436
01:11:01,200 --> 01:11:05,320
Speaker 1: championship kind of caliber level in game. What is he like?

1437
01:11:06,960 --> 01:11:09,920
Speaker 1: He's really good, like I said, he's prepared for every situation. Um,

1438
01:11:10,400 --> 01:11:13,040
Speaker 1: you know, and you know, we we beat buck Now

1439
01:11:13,720 --> 01:11:17,720
Speaker 1: pretty pretty handily in the first round. Um, and then

1440
01:11:17,760 --> 01:11:21,120
Speaker 1: we got against Marquette and they were really good and um,

1441
01:11:21,840 --> 01:11:24,800
Speaker 1: you know, we we helped out a boat a ballside

1442
01:11:24,840 --> 01:11:27,800
Speaker 1: corner off a shooter, um and gave up a three

1443
01:11:28,120 --> 01:11:29,519
Speaker 1: for them to take the lead. And then we had

1444
01:11:29,560 --> 01:11:32,120
Speaker 1: an opportunity at the end and we didn't get a

1445
01:11:32,200 --> 01:11:35,560
Speaker 1: great shot. UM you know, was was okay. So so

1446
01:11:35,920 --> 01:11:38,479
Speaker 1: so we don't be asking so for people who don't

1447
01:11:38,520 --> 01:11:43,040
Speaker 1: know you were Brad's offensive coordinator. Correct, No, not that. No,

1448
01:11:43,280 --> 01:11:45,719
Speaker 1: I didn't do that stuff for Brad. Brad did his stuff.

1449
01:11:46,080 --> 01:11:47,880
Speaker 1: Oh that wasn't that was still help put you hole,

1450
01:11:47,920 --> 01:11:52,160
Speaker 1: put you in that position. Yeah, okay. So so, uh

1451
01:11:52,360 --> 01:11:53,920
Speaker 1: they they hit it three. Did you guys call it

1452
01:11:53,960 --> 01:11:56,160
Speaker 1: time out? Did you guys just come into something? Well,

1453
01:11:56,200 --> 01:11:58,320
Speaker 1: we got we got down the other end of the floor. Um,

1454
01:11:58,479 --> 01:12:00,439
Speaker 1: I'm not sure how we got got but we had

1455
01:12:00,479 --> 01:12:03,920
Speaker 1: a side out of bounds with a short clock on

1456
01:12:04,040 --> 01:12:05,760
Speaker 1: the side out of bounds, and that we had a

1457
01:12:05,800 --> 01:12:09,000
Speaker 1: time out. We used the time out. Um. I don't

1458
01:12:09,040 --> 01:12:10,880
Speaker 1: know if we used it or Buzz used it. Um,

1459
01:12:11,080 --> 01:12:13,559
Speaker 1: but there was a time out, and uh the buzz

1460
01:12:13,600 --> 01:12:15,000
Speaker 1: came out in the one three one on the side

1461
01:12:15,000 --> 01:12:18,000
Speaker 1: out of bounds. Um. And it was really really good,

1462
01:12:18,360 --> 01:12:22,439
Speaker 1: really good, and um, you know it gave us some problems.

1463
01:12:22,560 --> 01:12:25,639
Speaker 1: We got the ball to Andrew Smith at the top.

1464
01:12:25,760 --> 01:12:27,439
Speaker 1: He got a shot off, not a great look and

1465
01:12:27,840 --> 01:12:30,720
Speaker 1: and and didn't make it. But um, it was it

1466
01:12:30,840 --> 01:12:35,080
Speaker 1: was a really really good college basketball game. Um. And uh,

1467
01:12:35,479 --> 01:12:37,760
Speaker 1: you know we had we had Rottney Clark on that team,

1468
01:12:37,960 --> 01:12:40,560
Speaker 1: you know, Kelly Dunham on that team. Um, so we

1469
01:12:40,800 --> 01:12:43,680
Speaker 1: we could score some points. Uh, Andrew Smith, you know,

1470
01:12:43,840 --> 01:12:46,880
Speaker 1: Roosevelt Jones was was younger, Kim Woods was younger, So

1471
01:12:46,920 --> 01:12:48,760
Speaker 1: we had some guys that can compete. It is it's

1472
01:12:48,800 --> 01:12:51,599
Speaker 1: just a really good, uh college basketball game. I think

1473
01:12:51,680 --> 01:12:54,240
Speaker 1: we were the sixth seed and I think Marquette was

1474
01:12:54,320 --> 01:12:58,320
Speaker 1: maybe the three um playing down there in Mexington, so

1475
01:12:59,080 --> 01:13:01,240
Speaker 1: it was a obviously a better loss. And then you

1476
01:13:01,320 --> 01:13:04,200
Speaker 1: know that was We're in the eight ten that year.

1477
01:13:04,280 --> 01:13:06,720
Speaker 1: So my time, my five years of Butler, we're in

1478
01:13:06,800 --> 01:13:08,600
Speaker 1: three different leagues. We're in the Horizon League than the

1479
01:13:08,680 --> 01:13:10,519
Speaker 1: eight tun and then ultimately made the move to the

1480
01:13:10,560 --> 01:13:13,400
Speaker 1: Big East. Yeah, and I don't think people understand how

1481
01:13:13,479 --> 01:13:16,400
Speaker 1: hard that is to you know, you go from the Horizon,

1482
01:13:16,479 --> 01:13:18,799
Speaker 1: which is like low major, right most of the league's

1483
01:13:18,800 --> 01:13:21,280
Speaker 1: like low major, to the A ten, which is a

1484
01:13:21,320 --> 01:13:24,720
Speaker 1: good high major league, you know, especially then, and then

1485
01:13:24,800 --> 01:13:26,680
Speaker 1: to the Big East, and you know, it's it's a

1486
01:13:26,800 --> 01:13:29,360
Speaker 1: massive step up in competition because you have teams, you know,

1487
01:13:29,479 --> 01:13:31,599
Speaker 1: Villanova kind of coming down from us from a high

1488
01:13:31,640 --> 01:13:34,640
Speaker 1: major A ten was more mid major, and then the

1489
01:13:34,680 --> 01:13:37,040
Speaker 1: Big East end was like a mix of like the

1490
01:13:37,800 --> 01:13:40,240
Speaker 1: mid you know, high mid majors and low high mid

1491
01:13:40,280 --> 01:13:42,760
Speaker 1: you know, like there's a reason Nova was struggling a

1492
01:13:42,760 --> 01:13:44,120
Speaker 1: little bit in the Old Big East and all of

1493
01:13:44,120 --> 01:13:46,479
Speaker 1: a sudden you come down you're playing against the New

1494
01:13:46,520 --> 01:13:49,080
Speaker 1: Big East competition and they're just throttling people. Right, So

1495
01:13:49,200 --> 01:13:50,920
Speaker 1: it's a it's a different level on day to day

1496
01:13:50,960 --> 01:13:52,960
Speaker 1: in terms of who you're playing against as opposed to

1497
01:13:53,000 --> 01:13:56,640
Speaker 1: who you're previously recruiting and playing against. Is that accurate, no,

1498
01:13:56,840 --> 01:14:00,360
Speaker 1: no question, without a doubt. And and uh, you know

1499
01:14:00,479 --> 01:14:03,439
Speaker 1: we were with having Rottney Clark sitting now um, and

1500
01:14:03,520 --> 01:14:05,920
Speaker 1: we had some talented guy I mean Roosevelt Jones. Those

1501
01:14:05,920 --> 01:14:09,479
Speaker 1: guys were good players, um and killing Downham a good player,

1502
01:14:09,560 --> 01:14:12,000
Speaker 1: and so we were able. We competed very well in

1503
01:14:12,080 --> 01:14:13,400
Speaker 1: the A t and I think we finished third in

1504
01:14:13,400 --> 01:14:14,880
Speaker 1: the A and it was a very strong year for

1505
01:14:14,920 --> 01:14:17,519
Speaker 1: the eight. St. Louis was really good that year, um.

1506
01:14:17,760 --> 01:14:19,400
Speaker 1: And then we got in the Unst A Tournament and

1507
01:14:19,479 --> 01:14:22,439
Speaker 1: then our first year in the Big East. Um, you know,

1508
01:14:22,520 --> 01:14:25,200
Speaker 1: we Roosevelt Jones was hurt. He tore up a risk

1509
01:14:25,640 --> 01:14:28,000
Speaker 1: um on a on a trip to Australia. Our team

1510
01:14:28,040 --> 01:14:30,120
Speaker 1: took our we took our team to Australia on one

1511
01:14:30,160 --> 01:14:32,680
Speaker 1: of those foreign trips um, and he tore up a

1512
01:14:32,800 --> 01:14:36,160
Speaker 1: risk um and was out for the year. And we

1513
01:14:36,280 --> 01:14:40,120
Speaker 1: weren't we weren't prepared from a roster standpoint to make

1514
01:14:40,200 --> 01:14:44,360
Speaker 1: that jump that quickly. Um, and uh for our first

1515
01:14:44,439 --> 01:14:46,280
Speaker 1: year in the in the Big East was not very good.

1516
01:14:46,320 --> 01:14:49,360
Speaker 1: And then the next two years we uh we competed well,

1517
01:14:49,439 --> 01:14:53,680
Speaker 1: got the unst A tournament and uh you know has

1518
01:14:53,800 --> 01:14:56,080
Speaker 1: had some success and and kind of set them up

1519
01:14:56,120 --> 01:14:58,519
Speaker 1: for you know where they are now. But UM, it

1520
01:14:58,640 --> 01:15:01,080
Speaker 1: took us a recruit We're able to get Kelan Martin

1521
01:15:01,360 --> 01:15:04,479
Speaker 1: and one of those eight early recruiting classes, and then

1522
01:15:04,520 --> 01:15:06,479
Speaker 1: you just you know, you have guys like Cam Woods

1523
01:15:06,520 --> 01:15:09,280
Speaker 1: and Roosevelt Jones and coming down him that were left over.

1524
01:15:09,840 --> 01:15:12,400
Speaker 1: Um you piece those guys together. We had a really

1525
01:15:12,439 --> 01:15:17,439
Speaker 1: tough kid that was a walk on named Alex Barlow. Yeah, yeah,

1526
01:15:17,479 --> 01:15:19,519
Speaker 1: baseball guy and now he he you know he works

1527
01:15:20,120 --> 01:15:23,200
Speaker 1: uh in the Celtics organization. Just a just a really

1528
01:15:23,280 --> 01:15:26,840
Speaker 1: tough guy. And UM, you know, when you have those

1529
01:15:26,840 --> 01:15:28,960
Speaker 1: types of competitive people on your team, you've got a chance.

1530
01:15:29,000 --> 01:15:31,519
Speaker 1: And that's that's kind of how we were able to survive.

1531
01:15:32,240 --> 01:15:34,280
Speaker 1: Um there, but learned we had you know, coming down

1532
01:15:34,320 --> 01:15:37,360
Speaker 1: him can shooting and Kelan Martin, you know he rolled

1533
01:15:37,360 --> 01:15:39,880
Speaker 1: out of bed get in eighteen to twenties. So you

1534
01:15:39,960 --> 01:15:41,960
Speaker 1: put those guys together and we were able to, you know,

1535
01:15:42,040 --> 01:15:44,240
Speaker 1: hold and did a great job of kind of holding

1536
01:15:44,280 --> 01:15:47,360
Speaker 1: that whole situation together. And and uh, we had we

1537
01:15:47,439 --> 01:15:49,960
Speaker 1: had a really good group of kids that cared about winning.

1538
01:15:50,479 --> 01:15:53,040
Speaker 1: I really didn't care about how we want, just cared

1539
01:15:53,040 --> 01:15:57,679
Speaker 1: about winning. Um again, so we're able to keep it rolling. Okay,

1540
01:15:57,760 --> 01:16:01,639
Speaker 1: So Bradley, let me go back, which when Brad leaves?

1541
01:16:01,640 --> 01:16:03,479
Speaker 1: Where were you when Bratt when you find out Brad's

1542
01:16:03,520 --> 01:16:07,160
Speaker 1: going to go to the NBA. Brad called. I was

1543
01:16:07,240 --> 01:16:11,120
Speaker 1: sitting in a in Brandon Miller's car. We were heading

1544
01:16:11,160 --> 01:16:14,080
Speaker 1: to get coffee on the last day of camp. It

1545
01:16:14,240 --> 01:16:16,800
Speaker 1: was the last Friday of the four of we had.

1546
01:16:16,880 --> 01:16:18,840
Speaker 1: We ran four weeks of camp but Butler at that time,

1547
01:16:19,560 --> 01:16:23,479
Speaker 1: and we just finished up our camp staff meeting. We

1548
01:16:23,600 --> 01:16:25,679
Speaker 1: had like an hour before the campers we're gonna start

1549
01:16:25,760 --> 01:16:28,880
Speaker 1: rolling in and we had h and I were just

1550
01:16:28,960 --> 01:16:31,040
Speaker 1: getting in the car to go get a cup of

1551
01:16:31,080 --> 01:16:34,920
Speaker 1: coffee and uh, and Brad called to let us know

1552
01:16:35,120 --> 01:16:37,639
Speaker 1: that um, he wasn't gonna be at camp until after

1553
01:16:37,800 --> 01:16:40,880
Speaker 1: lunch that Danny Angel was coming and he was sitting

1554
01:16:40,920 --> 01:16:44,000
Speaker 1: down with him, and we knew, Um, I knew at

1555
01:16:44,040 --> 01:16:46,799
Speaker 1: that time. I knew Brad well enough and been arounding

1556
01:16:46,880 --> 01:16:49,040
Speaker 1: through you know. I mean, every every school was calling

1557
01:16:49,080 --> 01:16:50,560
Speaker 1: Brad at that time. You know, I think if I

1558
01:16:50,680 --> 01:16:52,519
Speaker 1: was eating the time when when U. C. L A

1559
01:16:52,600 --> 01:16:55,320
Speaker 1: reached out to Brad about coming out here. Um, and

1560
01:16:55,400 --> 01:16:57,920
Speaker 1: I knew the fact that he had actually was going

1561
01:16:58,040 --> 01:17:00,920
Speaker 1: to sit down face to face, that that this was real.

1562
01:17:01,000 --> 01:17:03,720
Speaker 1: It wasn't just somebody e gauging interest or Brad just

1563
01:17:04,560 --> 01:17:07,680
Speaker 1: you know, saying things. But no, and and I just

1564
01:17:07,800 --> 01:17:10,800
Speaker 1: remember hanging up the phone, you know, when bringing hung

1565
01:17:10,920 --> 01:17:13,480
Speaker 1: up the phone and and we had had that conversation

1566
01:17:13,520 --> 01:17:15,439
Speaker 1: on speaker phone. I just looked at Brandon. I'm like this,

1567
01:17:15,920 --> 01:17:18,560
Speaker 1: this dude's gone. Man, he's going to Boston. And and

1568
01:17:19,120 --> 01:17:21,600
Speaker 1: and good for him, you know, what a what an opportunity.

1569
01:17:21,640 --> 01:17:23,360
Speaker 1: But yeah, that's that's where I was. I was hading

1570
01:17:23,360 --> 01:17:27,160
Speaker 1: to get a cup of coffee sitting in the Kinklefield

1571
01:17:27,200 --> 01:17:30,720
Speaker 1: House parking lot when I found out. Okay, so did

1572
01:17:30,800 --> 01:17:34,400
Speaker 1: you have a chance to go? No? You know, I

1573
01:17:34,520 --> 01:17:37,200
Speaker 1: really I didn't entertain anything, you know, really like I

1574
01:17:37,520 --> 01:17:39,479
Speaker 1: was really happy in Indianapolis. I thought we had some

1575
01:17:39,560 --> 01:17:43,800
Speaker 1: good stuff going. Um, you know, and no, I never

1576
01:17:44,439 --> 01:17:47,760
Speaker 1: I never asked and I was never off you know.

1577
01:17:48,200 --> 01:17:51,320
Speaker 1: So um I was at that time when Brad left,

1578
01:17:51,360 --> 01:17:53,920
Speaker 1: I tried to get the Butler Hey coaching job. I

1579
01:17:54,000 --> 01:17:56,720
Speaker 1: interviewed with h I interviewed with Barry Color twice. So

1580
01:17:56,840 --> 01:18:00,280
Speaker 1: that's um, you know, I knew how the Butler way worked. UM,

1581
01:18:00,439 --> 01:18:02,680
Speaker 1: I knew the opportunity like this is how hey, this

1582
01:18:02,800 --> 01:18:06,400
Speaker 1: is how um that's how Fad might have got the job.

1583
01:18:06,520 --> 01:18:09,959
Speaker 1: Is how uh you know this is you know, Liquidder

1584
01:18:10,000 --> 01:18:11,640
Speaker 1: got the job. This how Brad got the job, Like

1585
01:18:11,680 --> 01:18:15,080
Speaker 1: this is how this place works, you know. Um, Matthew

1586
01:18:15,160 --> 01:18:19,480
Speaker 1: Graves and had already left to go to um South Alabama,

1587
01:18:19,640 --> 01:18:22,439
Speaker 1: like you know, like if I'm if I'm going to

1588
01:18:22,520 --> 01:18:24,280
Speaker 1: have a shot at this, this may be my shot,

1589
01:18:24,640 --> 01:18:27,320
Speaker 1: you know. And and uh so I tried to prepare

1590
01:18:27,360 --> 01:18:30,839
Speaker 1: in a very short amount of time, uh to interview

1591
01:18:30,880 --> 01:18:32,920
Speaker 1: with Barry and got to sit down with Barry Color

1592
01:18:33,000 --> 01:18:36,640
Speaker 1: twice and and ultimately he hired Brandon Miller. But um,

1593
01:18:36,760 --> 01:18:39,599
Speaker 1: that's kind of where my focus was at that time. Okay,

1594
01:18:39,640 --> 01:18:41,400
Speaker 1: so what's that like to be. Like you said, obvious,

1595
01:18:41,439 --> 01:18:45,120
Speaker 1: you're close to Brandon Miller and you're in the car

1596
01:18:45,320 --> 01:18:47,680
Speaker 1: hang up and you guys are both fighting after the

1597
01:18:47,720 --> 01:18:51,880
Speaker 1: same job. He gets it, You don't you stay? And

1598
01:18:52,520 --> 01:18:56,080
Speaker 1: what was what's that like? I think you're just you're

1599
01:18:56,080 --> 01:18:58,439
Speaker 1: a professional and you do the job like you focused,

1600
01:18:58,479 --> 01:19:01,920
Speaker 1: like you know you you you deal with the initial disappointment, right,

1601
01:19:02,080 --> 01:19:04,000
Speaker 1: I mean there's gonna be a human emotion there. You

1602
01:19:04,120 --> 01:19:08,800
Speaker 1: deal with the initial disappointment of you know, being maybe

1603
01:19:08,840 --> 01:19:11,519
Speaker 1: as close as you're gonna be to that opportunity UM.

1604
01:19:11,600 --> 01:19:13,679
Speaker 1: And really, at that time in my career, the closest

1605
01:19:13,720 --> 01:19:16,120
Speaker 1: I had been to something like that UM and out

1606
01:19:16,160 --> 01:19:20,520
Speaker 1: of school like Butler UM. You know, you're you're you're disappointed,

1607
01:19:20,600 --> 01:19:22,760
Speaker 1: but you're also like, hey, like you also have a

1608
01:19:22,840 --> 01:19:24,400
Speaker 1: job to do. You've got a family you need to

1609
01:19:24,479 --> 01:19:27,720
Speaker 1: take care of. UM, and you've got a team full

1610
01:19:27,760 --> 01:19:31,360
Speaker 1: of of athletes that that you've grown close to, that

1611
01:19:31,520 --> 01:19:34,040
Speaker 1: you care about and you want to you immediately turn

1612
01:19:34,080 --> 01:19:37,040
Speaker 1: your focus, so, hey, what's what's best about for these guys?

1613
01:19:37,080 --> 01:19:39,679
Speaker 1: And get out, get outside of your selfishness, get outside

1614
01:19:39,720 --> 01:19:42,800
Speaker 1: yourself and try to focus on what's what's best for

1615
01:19:42,880 --> 01:19:46,439
Speaker 1: the people, um that lean on you and that are

1616
01:19:46,479 --> 01:19:49,200
Speaker 1: around you, you know what's best for them and so, um,

1617
01:19:49,600 --> 01:19:51,240
Speaker 1: you know it wasn't awkward in any way. You know,

1618
01:19:51,320 --> 01:19:54,000
Speaker 1: we had worked together before. Um, you know he had

1619
01:19:54,040 --> 01:19:56,200
Speaker 1: played there. You know, Barry had recruited him. Like I

1620
01:19:56,320 --> 01:19:58,280
Speaker 1: got all the connections. He was a Butler guy, Like

1621
01:19:58,360 --> 01:20:00,880
Speaker 1: I did it. I respect all that I respect. You know,

1622
01:20:00,960 --> 01:20:04,000
Speaker 1: I played for a program, which tradition, I worked at

1623
01:20:04,040 --> 01:20:05,640
Speaker 1: a program right now, and I talk to you rich

1624
01:20:05,680 --> 01:20:09,720
Speaker 1: and tradition. Butler, you know, has their own tradition, Like

1625
01:20:09,760 --> 01:20:12,240
Speaker 1: I respect that. I understand all that, And so it

1626
01:20:12,400 --> 01:20:15,320
Speaker 1: wasn't really difficult for me once I got back uh

1627
01:20:15,520 --> 01:20:19,439
Speaker 1: into the job to do my job. You Um, and

1628
01:20:19,520 --> 01:20:21,160
Speaker 1: then you work for Holt, who got the job when

1629
01:20:21,200 --> 01:20:25,479
Speaker 1: Brandon takes a leave of absence and who really empowered you. Um.

1630
01:20:25,720 --> 01:20:27,759
Speaker 1: But then you you took a chance. And I remember

1631
01:20:27,800 --> 01:20:30,080
Speaker 1: you and I talking about about going to Nebraska like, look,

1632
01:20:30,080 --> 01:20:33,920
Speaker 1: I gotta you know, I gotta, I gotta try this. Um.

1633
01:20:35,560 --> 01:20:38,519
Speaker 1: What was you know, because there's lots of basketball coaches listeners,

1634
01:20:38,600 --> 01:20:41,080
Speaker 1: what was the decision like to leave Butler where you

1635
01:20:41,160 --> 01:20:43,640
Speaker 1: had Keelan Martin, you had dudes you'd figured out how

1636
01:20:43,680 --> 01:20:46,400
Speaker 1: to compete in the Big East, and you're in You're

1637
01:20:46,439 --> 01:20:49,360
Speaker 1: in your comfort zone in Indianapolis. But there's a you know,

1638
01:20:49,439 --> 01:20:52,280
Speaker 1: you keep bumping into kind of a ceiling there. Um.

1639
01:20:52,400 --> 01:20:54,320
Speaker 1: What was the what was the thought like about about

1640
01:20:54,400 --> 01:20:58,160
Speaker 1: leaving leaving for Nebraska? Well, what you just said, I

1641
01:20:58,240 --> 01:21:00,400
Speaker 1: was in my comfort zone and I felt like for

1642
01:21:00,600 --> 01:21:03,680
Speaker 1: me to to grow, I needed to get outside of

1643
01:21:03,720 --> 01:21:05,840
Speaker 1: my cumber zone. You know. We talked to are our

1644
01:21:05,920 --> 01:21:07,840
Speaker 1: players all the time about workouts, like you've got to

1645
01:21:08,160 --> 01:21:11,040
Speaker 1: You've got become comfortable being uncomfortable. You know, you can't.

1646
01:21:11,080 --> 01:21:12,840
Speaker 1: You're not going to get any better if you work

1647
01:21:12,920 --> 01:21:15,840
Speaker 1: out at a comfortable place or at a comfortable pace.

1648
01:21:15,920 --> 01:21:19,360
Speaker 1: You've got to expand your boundaries. Um, you know. And

1649
01:21:20,439 --> 01:21:24,240
Speaker 1: after year or two with Chris Um, Georgia Tech approached

1650
01:21:24,840 --> 01:21:28,840
Speaker 1: Chris about an opportunity um that he he ended up

1651
01:21:29,240 --> 01:21:32,040
Speaker 1: not doing. And and I knew again going back to

1652
01:21:32,120 --> 01:21:34,080
Speaker 1: the Butler way of promoting from within, I knew how

1653
01:21:34,160 --> 01:21:38,559
Speaker 1: that the whole process you know, took place. And Chris

1654
01:21:38,680 --> 01:21:41,720
Speaker 1: turned that down and and and came to us of

1655
01:21:41,800 --> 01:21:44,160
Speaker 1: the staff and say, hey, I'm gonna sign a longer

1656
01:21:44,320 --> 01:21:46,599
Speaker 1: term deal here with Butler. This is this is where

1657
01:21:46,640 --> 01:21:48,720
Speaker 1: I want to be. This is a lifetime decision for me,

1658
01:21:48,920 --> 01:21:52,080
Speaker 1: and UM, you know, with the timing of everything on

1659
01:21:52,200 --> 01:21:55,640
Speaker 1: Nebraska had a note meaning that that uh, you know,

1660
01:21:55,680 --> 01:21:58,400
Speaker 1: I could get involved with and I just felt like

1661
01:21:58,840 --> 01:22:01,559
Speaker 1: with everything going on, UM, you know, if I wanted

1662
01:22:01,600 --> 01:22:03,680
Speaker 1: to ultimately take the next step that it was this

1663
01:22:03,880 --> 01:22:06,600
Speaker 1: was an opportunity that I had to really considered, you know,

1664
01:22:06,680 --> 01:22:09,479
Speaker 1: as far as one jump into the Big Ten, which

1665
01:22:09,520 --> 01:22:12,080
Speaker 1: I had played in. UM loved being a part of

1666
01:22:12,080 --> 01:22:14,360
Speaker 1: the Big Ten, and you know, it's the highest level

1667
01:22:14,400 --> 01:22:16,439
Speaker 1: of of college basketball. You know, it's one of the

1668
01:22:16,479 --> 01:22:19,160
Speaker 1: premier leagues in the country, and so you get to

1669
01:22:19,240 --> 01:22:23,760
Speaker 1: compete against those coaches, against those players every day from

1670
01:22:23,960 --> 01:22:26,200
Speaker 1: you know, from the basketball point to the to the

1671
01:22:26,280 --> 01:22:29,639
Speaker 1: recruiting and everything that goes with it. UM. And it's

1672
01:22:29,680 --> 01:22:32,519
Speaker 1: just an opportunity to do that and plus get out

1673
01:22:32,560 --> 01:22:35,000
Speaker 1: of my comfort zone a little bit as as a coach.

1674
01:22:35,080 --> 01:22:37,760
Speaker 1: You know, I had grown up uh in Indiana, was

1675
01:22:37,800 --> 01:22:40,920
Speaker 1: coaching in Indiana. You know, when you're at Butler, you

1676
01:22:41,080 --> 01:22:44,120
Speaker 1: kind of you you recruit a certain type of player. UM,

1677
01:22:44,320 --> 01:22:46,439
Speaker 1: a certain type of kid has to fit the Butler way.

1678
01:22:46,600 --> 01:22:49,839
Speaker 1: So to speak, um, and I wanted to to expand

1679
01:22:49,880 --> 01:22:52,479
Speaker 1: myself a little bit and taking on a different challenge.

1680
01:22:52,720 --> 01:22:54,640
Speaker 1: And you know, Chris has given me a ton of

1681
01:22:56,240 --> 01:22:58,840
Speaker 1: responsibility as far as you know, calling the altinates and

1682
01:22:58,920 --> 01:23:01,360
Speaker 1: things there. Get allowed me to grow immensely as a

1683
01:23:01,439 --> 01:23:04,240
Speaker 1: coach because he gave me those responsibilities, and he gave

1684
01:23:04,280 --> 01:23:06,479
Speaker 1: me an opportunity to fail. Like I mean, that's how

1685
01:23:06,560 --> 01:23:08,479
Speaker 1: you learned. Like you fail, you learn from it more

1686
01:23:08,600 --> 01:23:10,920
Speaker 1: and you you don't make that same mistake again. So

1687
01:23:10,960 --> 01:23:13,880
Speaker 1: I felt like, well in my time with with Chris

1688
01:23:14,000 --> 01:23:16,000
Speaker 1: that I had really grown as a coach. I had

1689
01:23:16,000 --> 01:23:19,240
Speaker 1: really expanded, um, my knowledge of the coach as far

1690
01:23:19,320 --> 01:23:21,639
Speaker 1: as you know in game play calling and different things,

1691
01:23:21,720 --> 01:23:24,400
Speaker 1: and and um that it was just the timing of

1692
01:23:24,479 --> 01:23:28,960
Speaker 1: everything in his commitment to to Butler Um that it

1693
01:23:29,040 --> 01:23:30,960
Speaker 1: was time to take the next step. And you know

1694
01:23:31,000 --> 01:23:33,120
Speaker 1: I didn't in hindsight, I didn't realize he was gonna

1695
01:23:33,120 --> 01:23:35,960
Speaker 1: go to Ohio State, you know, twelve months later. But

1696
01:23:36,320 --> 01:23:38,439
Speaker 1: as I'm sitting here at u C, I think everything

1697
01:23:38,600 --> 01:23:41,280
Speaker 1: is has worked out. You just I've always tried to

1698
01:23:41,320 --> 01:23:44,640
Speaker 1: make decisions when they've come up on my plate in

1699
01:23:44,760 --> 01:23:48,599
Speaker 1: my career with the knowledge that I have at hand

1700
01:23:49,080 --> 01:23:51,800
Speaker 1: and and try to make the best decision at that time.

1701
01:23:52,280 --> 01:23:55,000
Speaker 1: And then once you make that decision, I never looked back,

1702
01:23:55,360 --> 01:23:57,559
Speaker 1: like I don't look back to hey, what effort this happened?

1703
01:23:57,600 --> 01:23:59,960
Speaker 1: That happened. Not not at all like everybody says. Everybody

1704
01:24:00,040 --> 01:24:03,320
Speaker 1: says that at all, because I mean, I'm talking about

1705
01:24:03,320 --> 01:24:05,560
Speaker 1: it right now to you, But like I don't, like

1706
01:24:05,680 --> 01:24:07,720
Speaker 1: I made a decision to go to Nebraska, and every

1707
01:24:07,760 --> 01:24:09,720
Speaker 1: day I was at Nebraska, I worked my ass off

1708
01:24:10,080 --> 01:24:12,360
Speaker 1: to make that decision, the right decision. I think that's

1709
01:24:12,400 --> 01:24:15,920
Speaker 1: your job. No, I understand. Look listen, I understand that.

1710
01:24:16,000 --> 01:24:17,840
Speaker 1: But but I but I mean, like, look, if I'm honest,

1711
01:24:18,720 --> 01:24:22,680
Speaker 1: and I was at ESPN for nine years, and I like,

1712
01:24:22,800 --> 01:24:24,920
Speaker 1: all I really, I mean, I wanted to make a

1713
01:24:24,960 --> 01:24:27,320
Speaker 1: certain amount of money. I wanted to continue to grow,

1714
01:24:27,920 --> 01:24:30,479
Speaker 1: and they offered me, honestly, the exact amount of money

1715
01:24:30,560 --> 01:24:33,600
Speaker 1: that I wanted, but they wouldn't promise any growth. And

1716
01:24:33,800 --> 01:24:36,200
Speaker 1: probably you know, like at the moment there, I was

1717
01:24:36,200 --> 01:24:37,960
Speaker 1: a little selfish, and I was like, why don't you

1718
01:24:38,160 --> 01:24:40,960
Speaker 1: you know? All I asked for is like these five things,

1719
01:24:41,200 --> 01:24:42,880
Speaker 1: and you said no, But you said yes to the

1720
01:24:42,920 --> 01:24:46,760
Speaker 1: money that I wanted, and you know, CBS offered me

1721
01:24:47,160 --> 01:24:50,720
Speaker 1: the opportunities that I wanted and uh not, you know

1722
01:24:50,800 --> 01:24:52,679
Speaker 1: a little bit more money, but I had to uproot

1723
01:24:52,760 --> 01:24:56,120
Speaker 1: my family. Like look in hindsight, I don't know. I mean,

1724
01:24:56,120 --> 01:24:57,400
Speaker 1: I would just be honest, like, if I could go

1725
01:24:57,439 --> 01:24:59,680
Speaker 1: back and do it, I wouldn't have gotten to do

1726
01:24:59,720 --> 01:25:02,080
Speaker 1: the fun before. But there was also a lot of moving,

1727
01:25:02,680 --> 01:25:04,559
Speaker 1: a lot of hard stuff with the family in terms

1728
01:25:04,600 --> 01:25:07,000
Speaker 1: of moving. I think it's a reasonable thing to look

1729
01:25:07,040 --> 01:25:09,800
Speaker 1: back and to say was this the right decision? Was

1730
01:25:09,880 --> 01:25:12,920
Speaker 1: it the wrong decision. It doesn't mean you can't like

1731
01:25:13,120 --> 01:25:15,760
Speaker 1: I've I've every day I worked there. Every day I've

1732
01:25:15,800 --> 01:25:18,479
Speaker 1: worked at Fox like I try and you know, kick ass.

1733
01:25:18,600 --> 01:25:20,760
Speaker 1: I think about the Oaklahoma State job I didn't get,

1734
01:25:20,800 --> 01:25:23,000
Speaker 1: like I I think it's I think all these things

1735
01:25:23,040 --> 01:25:24,920
Speaker 1: are reasonable to look back at. Can you you can

1736
01:25:25,000 --> 01:25:28,479
Speaker 1: honestly not look back and have any sort of regret, Like, dude,

1737
01:25:28,479 --> 01:25:30,479
Speaker 1: if you would have stayed there, I don't know. If

1738
01:25:30,520 --> 01:25:33,320
Speaker 1: they hire vout they might. I mean he played at Butler,

1739
01:25:33,400 --> 01:25:35,240
Speaker 1: he was a head coach. You didn't have head coaching experience,

1740
01:25:35,280 --> 01:25:36,439
Speaker 1: but you were there, or you could have gone to

1741
01:25:36,479 --> 01:25:38,760
Speaker 1: a how States still been in the Big ten, you know,

1742
01:25:39,080 --> 01:25:41,120
Speaker 1: at a better spot than Nebraska in terms of getting

1743
01:25:41,160 --> 01:25:43,519
Speaker 1: players Like that, that's not a reasonable thing to at

1744
01:25:43,560 --> 01:25:46,120
Speaker 1: least think about. No, I think you can. I think

1745
01:25:46,160 --> 01:25:48,160
Speaker 1: you can look back and learn from decisions you make.

1746
01:25:48,320 --> 01:25:50,720
Speaker 1: But I don't spend a lot of time wondering what if,

1747
01:25:51,040 --> 01:25:53,519
Speaker 1: Like like, okay, say that does I'm like what you

1748
01:25:53,640 --> 01:25:56,519
Speaker 1: just said, Maybe that that scenario plays out, I'm at

1749
01:25:56,520 --> 01:25:58,320
Speaker 1: O while State. Do I have the opportunity to be

1750
01:25:58,360 --> 01:26:01,040
Speaker 1: at U c l A. Who knows? You don't know?

1751
01:26:01,200 --> 01:26:03,160
Speaker 1: Like That's why I don't spend a lot of time

1752
01:26:03,240 --> 01:26:05,600
Speaker 1: like there's so many waters, there's so many different scenarios.

1753
01:26:05,680 --> 01:26:08,200
Speaker 1: Like all I know is like I made a decision

1754
01:26:08,240 --> 01:26:10,960
Speaker 1: to go to Nebraska. I worked my ass off every

1755
01:26:11,040 --> 01:26:13,880
Speaker 1: day to help that program, you know, get better. In

1756
01:26:14,280 --> 01:26:15,840
Speaker 1: the last two years, we had the best two year

1757
01:26:15,920 --> 01:26:18,680
Speaker 1: run since ninety one. Okay, so I think it's in

1758
01:26:18,720 --> 01:26:21,120
Speaker 1: a better spot than when I when I first got there.

1759
01:26:21,400 --> 01:26:23,400
Speaker 1: And now now I get the opportunity to work at

1760
01:26:23,479 --> 01:26:25,280
Speaker 1: U c l A. If I don't go to Nebraska,

1761
01:26:25,960 --> 01:26:27,519
Speaker 1: maybe I'm not ever here at U c l A.

1762
01:26:27,840 --> 01:26:31,240
Speaker 1: And this is this is a really cool opportunity, uh,

1763
01:26:31,400 --> 01:26:33,479
Speaker 1: you know, for anybody in college basketball to be able

1764
01:26:33,520 --> 01:26:35,920
Speaker 1: to coach you at U c l A. So that's

1765
01:26:35,960 --> 01:26:38,920
Speaker 1: why I think. I think you can look back at

1766
01:26:38,960 --> 01:26:40,960
Speaker 1: the decisions you make. I think you can learn from them.

1767
01:26:41,040 --> 01:26:43,240
Speaker 1: But I don't. I don't spend a lot of time

1768
01:26:43,400 --> 01:26:45,040
Speaker 1: like how I could have done this or what if

1769
01:26:45,120 --> 01:26:46,760
Speaker 1: this would have happened like, because I think it just

1770
01:26:46,840 --> 01:26:49,559
Speaker 1: takes away from from the job that you have at hand.

1771
01:26:49,600 --> 01:26:52,920
Speaker 1: And I've I've been very fortunate by just doing the

1772
01:26:53,040 --> 01:26:55,559
Speaker 1: job I have at hand and trust in the process

1773
01:26:55,640 --> 01:26:58,439
Speaker 1: that it's gonna lead to whatever is next. And like

1774
01:26:58,560 --> 01:27:00,920
Speaker 1: I said, like I get I'm pretty lucky. I've been

1775
01:27:00,960 --> 01:27:03,720
Speaker 1: really lucky to be where I'm at. But that's how

1776
01:27:03,800 --> 01:27:08,639
Speaker 1: I've gone about my my career. And I'm sitting in Westwood.

1777
01:27:08,800 --> 01:27:10,680
Speaker 1: So I'm not too upset. I'm not I'm not going

1778
01:27:10,760 --> 01:27:13,160
Speaker 1: to change, you know. And maybe it's wrong to say,

1779
01:27:13,240 --> 01:27:15,599
Speaker 1: like I never looked at but I don't allow myself

1780
01:27:15,640 --> 01:27:17,680
Speaker 1: to spend a lot of time wondering about the what is,

1781
01:27:18,360 --> 01:27:20,920
Speaker 1: you know, I just thinking about how I can get there.

1782
01:27:20,960 --> 01:27:22,680
Speaker 1: You know, I think you learned from the decisions you make.

1783
01:27:23,240 --> 01:27:25,120
Speaker 1: Um if you had to go back and do it again.

1784
01:27:25,280 --> 01:27:27,920
Speaker 1: Like it all depends on the timing. That's why I say,

1785
01:27:27,960 --> 01:27:30,680
Speaker 1: I just when when a decision comes my way and

1786
01:27:30,760 --> 01:27:32,439
Speaker 1: I have to make a decision to up prove my

1787
01:27:32,520 --> 01:27:34,479
Speaker 1: family or to take the next job or whatever it is,

1788
01:27:34,960 --> 01:27:37,080
Speaker 1: I just used the knowledge that I have at that

1789
01:27:37,240 --> 01:27:39,680
Speaker 1: time and the president to try to make the best

1790
01:27:39,760 --> 01:27:42,720
Speaker 1: decision at that time, and then I spend the rest

1791
01:27:42,800 --> 01:27:46,160
Speaker 1: of my time trying to make whatever decision I decided

1792
01:27:47,160 --> 01:27:49,360
Speaker 1: to make it the best decision. And that's that's how

1793
01:27:49,439 --> 01:27:52,439
Speaker 1: I've gotten here. Okay, so this is this is the

1794
01:27:52,479 --> 01:27:57,200
Speaker 1: first time you were fired, right? Yeah? Yeah? What what

1795
01:27:57,479 --> 01:28:01,320
Speaker 1: what I mean? I couldn't have been terribly enjoyable to

1796
01:28:01,520 --> 01:28:04,880
Speaker 1: go to work because you know, like you're one of

1797
01:28:04,960 --> 01:28:07,640
Speaker 1: your best players is hurt, and there's this kind of

1798
01:28:08,200 --> 01:28:10,920
Speaker 1: cloud looming, right. And there's a lot of discussion over

1799
01:28:11,000 --> 01:28:15,240
Speaker 1: Nebraska basketball last year, and I thought I thought the

1800
01:28:15,280 --> 01:28:17,160
Speaker 1: whole thing was weird, to be honest as an outsider,

1801
01:28:17,200 --> 01:28:19,680
Speaker 1: because like, Nebraska is in the Big Twelve when I

1802
01:28:19,800 --> 01:28:22,599
Speaker 1: was there, obviously, and they were notorious for being talented,

1803
01:28:23,160 --> 01:28:25,200
Speaker 1: terrible on the road. It's never won an n c

1804
01:28:25,280 --> 01:28:29,440
Speaker 1: A tournament game, and you know, they they built incredible facilities.

1805
01:28:29,640 --> 01:28:31,760
Speaker 1: And I think that people think you sprinkle in some

1806
01:28:31,840 --> 01:28:34,600
Speaker 1: pixie dusk and facilities and you're just like all of

1807
01:28:34,640 --> 01:28:36,439
Speaker 1: a sudden gonna be at the top of the Big Ten.

1808
01:28:36,640 --> 01:28:40,240
Speaker 1: Like do you know how good the big and what

1809
01:28:40,400 --> 01:28:43,200
Speaker 1: you're doing, Like do you people have like fans have

1810
01:28:43,479 --> 01:28:47,200
Speaker 1: no excuse my French fucking clue, like the Big Ten,

1811
01:28:47,439 --> 01:28:49,760
Speaker 1: Like you're not the only one trying to be good,

1812
01:28:49,800 --> 01:28:53,559
Speaker 1: like Illinois has Illinois has been good forever and they

1813
01:28:53,640 --> 01:28:56,080
Speaker 1: have an awesome coach and they were at the bottom

1814
01:28:56,120 --> 01:28:59,160
Speaker 1: of the league. Like it's really really hard because all

1815
01:28:59,240 --> 01:29:01,920
Speaker 1: the coaches are good, all the teams are older than

1816
01:29:01,960 --> 01:29:05,479
Speaker 1: the other leagues, you know, and all the crowds are good.

1817
01:29:05,479 --> 01:29:07,599
Speaker 1: The arena is good, Like, yeah, you've got good facilities, great,

1818
01:29:07,760 --> 01:29:10,800
Speaker 1: so does most everybody else in the league. UM, And

1819
01:29:11,040 --> 01:29:13,240
Speaker 1: and they have they have more players that that grew

1820
01:29:13,320 --> 01:29:16,639
Speaker 1: up closer and fans of their program, right, and that's

1821
01:29:16,680 --> 01:29:21,360
Speaker 1: the that's the key to recruiting. UM. But what's what

1822
01:29:21,600 --> 01:29:24,200
Speaker 1: is that feeling like for a guy who you know, look,

1823
01:29:24,240 --> 01:29:27,320
Speaker 1: you've it hasn't been easy. You know, you didn't come

1824
01:29:27,320 --> 01:29:29,479
Speaker 1: out in the NBA Draft. You were in the USBL

1825
01:29:29,600 --> 01:29:32,920
Speaker 1: you did get cut after one game playing overseas, but

1826
01:29:33,800 --> 01:29:35,920
Speaker 1: you've never been fired before. What what is that? Like?

1827
01:29:36,080 --> 01:29:39,040
Speaker 1: Did Tim call you did? Did? How does that work? No?

1828
01:29:39,200 --> 01:29:41,599
Speaker 1: I mean like like we were rolling, we were thirteen

1829
01:29:41,680 --> 01:29:44,519
Speaker 1: and four. I think we're are thirteen and two, thirteen

1830
01:29:44,600 --> 01:29:46,200
Speaker 1: and four, and when we were ranked in the top

1831
01:29:46,280 --> 01:29:50,519
Speaker 1: twenty five and really kind of on on the track

1832
01:29:50,600 --> 01:29:53,840
Speaker 1: to do everything that that they expected, you know, of

1833
01:29:54,520 --> 01:29:56,800
Speaker 1: the team that we had in Nebraska in and and

1834
01:29:57,000 --> 01:29:59,320
Speaker 1: honestly that you know, Nebrasa has never won an nca

1835
01:29:59,400 --> 01:30:02,600
Speaker 1: tournament game. Um. You know, that challenge of doing that

1836
01:30:03,160 --> 01:30:06,160
Speaker 1: excited me. Um. And but the expectation of this year's

1837
01:30:06,160 --> 01:30:08,120
Speaker 1: team was to go to sweet six team, you know.

1838
01:30:08,240 --> 01:30:10,519
Speaker 1: And like that's what you talked about the fans, Like

1839
01:30:10,600 --> 01:30:13,400
Speaker 1: the best thing Nebraska has going for it is the fans.

1840
01:30:13,439 --> 01:30:18,360
Speaker 1: They have unbelievably passionate fans that love the Huskers. Um.

1841
01:30:18,920 --> 01:30:21,240
Speaker 1: But when you have that, you also sometimes get some

1842
01:30:22,080 --> 01:30:26,479
Speaker 1: some expectations and things that can be somewhat unrealistic. And um,

1843
01:30:26,720 --> 01:30:30,160
Speaker 1: the expectation for us was to basically stip a skip

1844
01:30:30,240 --> 01:30:32,519
Speaker 1: a step in the processor too and just you know,

1845
01:30:32,560 --> 01:30:35,240
Speaker 1: wind up in the Sweet sixteen. And and uh, like

1846
01:30:35,479 --> 01:30:37,240
Speaker 1: you know, like you've only been the in state tournament

1847
01:30:37,320 --> 01:30:40,000
Speaker 1: seven times. Somehow has taken me there one of those

1848
01:30:40,040 --> 01:30:42,320
Speaker 1: seven times, Like, let's just win a game and then

1849
01:30:42,360 --> 01:30:45,360
Speaker 1: won't worry about you know, what's what's next. And um,

1850
01:30:45,479 --> 01:30:47,439
Speaker 1: so that that's kind of what drove me as far

1851
01:30:47,479 --> 01:30:50,439
Speaker 1: as you know, the whole Nebraska thing. And I thought

1852
01:30:50,479 --> 01:30:52,280
Speaker 1: we were set up to do that and obviously we

1853
01:30:52,400 --> 01:30:56,160
Speaker 1: had a horrific injury with Isai Copelan turns a c

1854
01:30:56,320 --> 01:30:58,920
Speaker 1: O and you know, things got loose, and um, we

1855
01:30:59,040 --> 01:31:01,160
Speaker 1: just weren't able to win, you know, down the stretch

1856
01:31:01,240 --> 01:31:04,120
Speaker 1: and in the conference. And so you know, going through

1857
01:31:04,160 --> 01:31:06,320
Speaker 1: that whole deal is it's not a pleasant thing. But

1858
01:31:06,400 --> 01:31:09,960
Speaker 1: like you again, you've got to get outside yourself. You've

1859
01:31:09,960 --> 01:31:13,160
Speaker 1: gotta quit worrying about how this affects you and realize that,

1860
01:31:13,760 --> 01:31:18,040
Speaker 1: you know, James Palmer, Glenn Watson, Isaiah Roby, like, this

1861
01:31:18,240 --> 01:31:21,120
Speaker 1: is there one shot to be a college basketball player.

1862
01:31:21,400 --> 01:31:24,080
Speaker 1: You know, I got my opportunity, You've got your opportunity.

1863
01:31:24,280 --> 01:31:26,960
Speaker 1: This is there one shot to be a college basketball player.

1864
01:31:27,000 --> 01:31:28,920
Speaker 1: Now I can be selfiece of the coach, and I

1865
01:31:28,960 --> 01:31:31,000
Speaker 1: can quit working because hey, we're gonna get fired at

1866
01:31:31,000 --> 01:31:33,519
Speaker 1: the end of the year, okay, and I'm just completely

1867
01:31:33,600 --> 01:31:36,479
Speaker 1: be self absorbed or I can. I can put all

1868
01:31:36,520 --> 01:31:38,560
Speaker 1: my energy and trying to make you know, like what

1869
01:31:38,720 --> 01:31:41,280
Speaker 1: I talked about earlier, trying to make their experience for

1870
01:31:41,479 --> 01:31:44,640
Speaker 1: them as good as it possibly can be. And so

1871
01:31:44,800 --> 01:31:46,800
Speaker 1: that's that's kind of what got me to go to

1872
01:31:46,880 --> 01:31:48,960
Speaker 1: work every day and that and to continue to prepare

1873
01:31:49,000 --> 01:31:50,720
Speaker 1: and try to put them in the right positions at

1874
01:31:50,720 --> 01:31:53,080
Speaker 1: the right time. And um, that's how that's how I

1875
01:31:53,120 --> 01:31:54,519
Speaker 1: approach it. I don't know if that's the right way

1876
01:31:54,520 --> 01:31:56,680
Speaker 1: to approach it, that's how I went about it. Um.

1877
01:31:56,960 --> 01:31:59,120
Speaker 1: We had a good staff that that's stuck together and

1878
01:31:59,840 --> 01:32:01,840
Speaker 1: just try to focus our energy on those guys and

1879
01:32:02,439 --> 01:32:04,920
Speaker 1: trying to help him down the stretch. And um, we

1880
01:32:05,000 --> 01:32:07,120
Speaker 1: had a few more injuries come up, and we got

1881
01:32:07,200 --> 01:32:10,320
Speaker 1: down about six fellas at the end, and and the

1882
01:32:10,439 --> 01:32:12,720
Speaker 1: last three weeks of coaching those guys were probably as

1883
01:32:12,760 --> 01:32:15,600
Speaker 1: much fun as I've had in coaching. Um, you know,

1884
01:32:15,680 --> 01:32:19,240
Speaker 1: we had we had three dudes that could go get buckets. Um,

1885
01:32:19,360 --> 01:32:21,400
Speaker 1: and my house was great. Moms just finally told him

1886
01:32:21,400 --> 01:32:22,960
Speaker 1: in the locker room one day and filmily, hey, listen,

1887
01:32:23,880 --> 01:32:26,080
Speaker 1: you three guys go go try to get sixty five,

1888
01:32:26,800 --> 01:32:28,760
Speaker 1: and we'll figure it out with these other three and

1889
01:32:28,800 --> 01:32:31,160
Speaker 1: we're gonna see what we can do. And and um,

1890
01:32:31,360 --> 01:32:33,120
Speaker 1: you know, I think we run we ring off three

1891
01:32:33,200 --> 01:32:38,040
Speaker 1: or four consecutive wins and and hopefully you know, those

1892
01:32:38,120 --> 01:32:40,800
Speaker 1: guys can remember the end of their career for for

1893
01:32:40,880 --> 01:32:43,280
Speaker 1: accomplishing that and kind of forget that no part of

1894
01:32:43,360 --> 01:32:46,600
Speaker 1: the season, but um, it was. It was a it

1895
01:32:46,720 --> 01:32:49,720
Speaker 1: was a different deal. No, I mean no question. What

1896
01:32:50,439 --> 01:32:52,400
Speaker 1: if you were going to religous this night met Tim, Tim,

1897
01:32:52,439 --> 01:32:54,160
Speaker 1: I was going to get another job. Right, He's done

1898
01:32:54,160 --> 01:32:56,720
Speaker 1: a good job every we's been Uh, if there was

1899
01:32:56,800 --> 01:33:00,559
Speaker 1: one thing about how Tim Miles coaches that you will

1900
01:33:00,600 --> 01:33:03,680
Speaker 1: take with you that you will tell other people you

1901
01:33:03,680 --> 01:33:06,400
Speaker 1: should do this or this is what makes him great?

1902
01:33:06,520 --> 01:33:09,240
Speaker 1: What is it? Well? The thing I respect about Tim

1903
01:33:09,960 --> 01:33:12,640
Speaker 1: the most is how he got to a Power of

1904
01:33:12,720 --> 01:33:15,080
Speaker 1: five conference and like listen, like he got fired whatever

1905
01:33:15,200 --> 01:33:17,439
Speaker 1: day it was, he was on a flight six am

1906
01:33:17,600 --> 01:33:19,960
Speaker 1: next morning interviewing for another Power of five job. Like

1907
01:33:20,040 --> 01:33:22,960
Speaker 1: he's a good basketball coach. Um, and I I and

1908
01:33:23,320 --> 01:33:24,800
Speaker 1: I give him a lot of credit because like what

1909
01:33:24,880 --> 01:33:26,880
Speaker 1: I told him, I'm like I said, Tim when you

1910
01:33:26,960 --> 01:33:32,679
Speaker 1: took over Nebraska, UM, somebody with the reputation and stature

1911
01:33:32,840 --> 01:33:35,960
Speaker 1: of Fred Hoiberg wasn't going to be interested in Nebraska.

1912
01:33:36,040 --> 01:33:38,680
Speaker 1: I said, what you've done in seven years, um, and

1913
01:33:38,800 --> 01:33:42,040
Speaker 1: elevated the visibility of the program. To put that program,

1914
01:33:42,360 --> 01:33:44,360
Speaker 1: you know, headed in the right direction. A guy like

1915
01:33:44,479 --> 01:33:47,680
Speaker 1: Fred Hoiberg now once that job and and that what

1916
01:33:47,880 --> 01:33:51,599
Speaker 1: ultimately got you is what you should probably be most

1917
01:33:51,640 --> 01:33:53,760
Speaker 1: proud of is because you've set that job up in

1918
01:33:53,840 --> 01:33:57,000
Speaker 1: the position where somebody like Fred, you know, wants to

1919
01:33:57,080 --> 01:33:59,240
Speaker 1: take over. I think it's a great time, uh, to

1920
01:33:59,320 --> 01:34:01,959
Speaker 1: take over the agram at Nebraska. You've got an unbelievable

1921
01:34:01,960 --> 01:34:04,679
Speaker 1: fan base, facilities, everything. You just got to get players

1922
01:34:05,479 --> 01:34:08,000
Speaker 1: to want to be there. And I said, hopefully they

1923
01:34:08,040 --> 01:34:10,080
Speaker 1: can achieve that. But I think the best thing that

1924
01:34:10,200 --> 01:34:12,320
Speaker 1: I was, the thing I respect the most about him

1925
01:34:12,439 --> 01:34:15,439
Speaker 1: is how he's how he kind of started like he

1926
01:34:15,520 --> 01:34:17,400
Speaker 1: didn't have Like he didn't play Division one like you

1927
01:34:17,479 --> 01:34:19,439
Speaker 1: and I. You know, he like he didn't play for

1928
01:34:19,600 --> 01:34:22,640
Speaker 1: legendary coaches like you and I. UM, like he you know,

1929
01:34:22,800 --> 01:34:25,240
Speaker 1: he was a n a I a guy that you

1930
01:34:25,320 --> 01:34:28,240
Speaker 1: know wasn't good enough to play, became a student assistant

1931
01:34:28,600 --> 01:34:31,320
Speaker 1: and just worked himself all the way up to Nebraska.

1932
01:34:31,400 --> 01:34:33,000
Speaker 1: And I think that's the hell of a story for him,

1933
01:34:33,040 --> 01:34:36,000
Speaker 1: because you don't you don't just wind up in Nebraska,

1934
01:34:36,600 --> 01:34:37,920
Speaker 1: you know, you don't wind up in the power of

1935
01:34:38,000 --> 01:34:40,880
Speaker 1: five head job. Um. And just how he's gone about it,

1936
01:34:41,400 --> 01:34:43,400
Speaker 1: um to get to where he got, I think is

1937
01:34:43,520 --> 01:34:46,040
Speaker 1: an unbelievable story. So just you know, that little ship

1938
01:34:46,160 --> 01:34:48,400
Speaker 1: he has on his on his shoulder to kind of

1939
01:34:48,439 --> 01:34:51,559
Speaker 1: prove everybody wrong. Um, you know, I think is one

1940
01:34:51,600 --> 01:34:56,120
Speaker 1: of his his greatest qualities. So you're cleaning at your

1941
01:34:56,160 --> 01:35:00,719
Speaker 1: garage right at in in Lincoln, but like you're because

1942
01:35:00,720 --> 01:35:02,400
Speaker 1: you're moving or you're just your wife is like, go

1943
01:35:02,560 --> 01:35:06,080
Speaker 1: clean the drage. You're annoying me. No, when when you

1944
01:35:06,160 --> 01:35:09,280
Speaker 1: spend a winter in Lincoln, Nebraska, like you you drag

1945
01:35:09,400 --> 01:35:13,479
Speaker 1: snow and salt all that stuff into your garage and

1946
01:35:14,479 --> 01:35:17,240
Speaker 1: when you're when you're unemployed. Um, you know, I was

1947
01:35:17,360 --> 01:35:21,080
Speaker 1: very fortunate in Nebraska. They had another year on my contract,

1948
01:35:21,160 --> 01:35:22,920
Speaker 1: so I didn't have to do anything. I could have

1949
01:35:23,760 --> 01:35:26,320
Speaker 1: could have kind of been a bump for for twelve months,

1950
01:35:26,360 --> 01:35:29,599
Speaker 1: but our fourteen months whatever it was gonna be. But um,

1951
01:35:30,320 --> 01:35:33,080
Speaker 1: you live in Lincoln, Nebraska. You when the spring comes

1952
01:35:33,120 --> 01:35:34,800
Speaker 1: and the weather breaks, you've got to get all that

1953
01:35:35,439 --> 01:35:38,040
Speaker 1: that snow and winter junk out of your garage. Otherwise

1954
01:35:38,080 --> 01:35:40,840
Speaker 1: you just continue to track it into your house. So, um,

1955
01:35:41,120 --> 01:35:43,400
Speaker 1: when you're unemployed, your your wife's picks a day and

1956
01:35:43,680 --> 01:35:45,519
Speaker 1: and you and her just go to the garage and

1957
01:35:45,720 --> 01:35:48,280
Speaker 1: you're going to clean out the garage. So that's what

1958
01:35:48,400 --> 01:35:50,439
Speaker 1: I was doing. And I got a little people on

1959
01:35:50,479 --> 01:35:54,360
Speaker 1: my phone and happened to be mccron So okay, so

1960
01:35:54,479 --> 01:35:56,400
Speaker 1: you pick up the phone and did you have his

1961
01:35:56,520 --> 01:35:58,840
Speaker 1: number saved? Like did you say mcronin? Or is this

1962
01:35:59,040 --> 01:36:02,519
Speaker 1: like uh Cincinnati number? Is it an l a number game?

1963
01:36:02,560 --> 01:36:05,320
Speaker 1: What is it? No, it was, it was it was

1964
01:36:05,439 --> 01:36:07,360
Speaker 1: I got mixed number on my song like I was

1965
01:36:07,439 --> 01:36:09,120
Speaker 1: at when I was at Eastern Illinois, like he was

1966
01:36:09,160 --> 01:36:11,640
Speaker 1: at Merge State. He was the head coach of Merge State. Um,

1967
01:36:11,800 --> 01:36:13,760
Speaker 1: so we competed against each other a little bit there

1968
01:36:13,880 --> 01:36:17,000
Speaker 1: while as a butler, we played Cincinnati, um, you know,

1969
01:36:17,120 --> 01:36:20,080
Speaker 1: and so we we had a relationship where, um, you know,

1970
01:36:20,160 --> 01:36:23,040
Speaker 1: we've exchanged a few texts, you know, a year of cinema,

1971
01:36:23,920 --> 01:36:26,080
Speaker 1: you know, like the wine emoji or something. After a

1972
01:36:26,160 --> 01:36:29,360
Speaker 1: big win, say congrats to him or something. And I

1973
01:36:29,439 --> 01:36:31,720
Speaker 1: think he would watch our teams play, you know, late

1974
01:36:31,720 --> 01:36:34,559
Speaker 1: at nine different things, and if we won a big game,

1975
01:36:34,640 --> 01:36:36,920
Speaker 1: you know I'd get a you know, a text or

1976
01:36:36,960 --> 01:36:39,280
Speaker 1: two a year congrats or you know, good luck or

1977
01:36:39,360 --> 01:36:42,080
Speaker 1: thinking obvious things like that. We would see each other

1978
01:36:42,200 --> 01:36:44,840
Speaker 1: on the road recruiting always say hi, hit chat a

1979
01:36:44,920 --> 01:36:47,920
Speaker 1: little bit. You know how that stuff goes. But um, yeah,

1980
01:36:48,000 --> 01:36:49,800
Speaker 1: it popped up mccronin and it was just say, just

1981
01:36:49,880 --> 01:36:53,519
Speaker 1: checking in on you, Um, you know, how are things going?

1982
01:36:53,600 --> 01:36:56,519
Speaker 1: And he had he had just recently got the usually job.

1983
01:36:57,080 --> 01:36:59,599
Speaker 1: And uh, you know, as it was you know, things

1984
01:36:59,640 --> 01:37:01,000
Speaker 1: are good, I said, not as good as they're going

1985
01:37:01,080 --> 01:37:04,360
Speaker 1: for you. You know, it's you've just gotten gotten this job.

1986
01:37:04,479 --> 01:37:07,320
Speaker 1: But um, that's kind of how things things got started.

1987
01:37:07,360 --> 01:37:11,320
Speaker 1: And we just started talking from there. So so you

1988
01:37:11,520 --> 01:37:13,120
Speaker 1: you get to have you ever been to u c

1989
01:37:13,200 --> 01:37:15,800
Speaker 1: l A before you took the job? I had driven

1990
01:37:16,080 --> 01:37:19,280
Speaker 1: uh by campus. I've been out here recruiting a few times.

1991
01:37:19,320 --> 01:37:22,439
Speaker 1: There was a there was a big Adida's tournament out here.

1992
01:37:23,080 --> 01:37:25,439
Speaker 1: Um you know that I always come to and and

1993
01:37:25,760 --> 01:37:28,280
Speaker 1: uh it was in the old recruiting calendar. It was

1994
01:37:28,360 --> 01:37:30,920
Speaker 1: the end of the second week. Um, you know, whether

1995
01:37:31,000 --> 01:37:34,320
Speaker 1: it was Verdondall Beach or in Anaheim, A couple of

1996
01:37:34,360 --> 01:37:36,439
Speaker 1: different tournaments that I would come out here in recruit.

1997
01:37:36,520 --> 01:37:39,720
Speaker 1: So I had been in the area a few times, obviously. Um.

1998
01:37:39,880 --> 01:37:41,960
Speaker 1: It doesn't matter where you grow up. You know of

1999
01:37:42,120 --> 01:37:45,000
Speaker 1: U c l A. You know in their basketball program,

2000
01:37:45,080 --> 01:37:47,760
Speaker 1: their history, their tradition, the players like you know, all

2001
01:37:47,840 --> 01:37:51,880
Speaker 1: that stuff. I don't care where you grow up. Um. So,

2002
01:37:52,400 --> 01:37:54,840
Speaker 1: but to get out here in the field every day

2003
01:37:54,880 --> 01:37:57,880
Speaker 1: and to be around it every day, um, obviously, I

2004
01:37:57,960 --> 01:38:01,000
Speaker 1: mean special is not an ad to of it's that's

2005
01:38:01,000 --> 01:38:04,439
Speaker 1: good enough to explain it. But um, you know, I'm

2006
01:38:04,520 --> 01:38:07,479
Speaker 1: kind of a I'm a small town Indiana guy, I respect.

2007
01:38:07,760 --> 01:38:09,920
Speaker 1: I love going to work in Hincklefield House every day

2008
01:38:09,920 --> 01:38:14,400
Speaker 1: because of of you know what that that Jim stood for.

2009
01:38:14,600 --> 01:38:17,720
Speaker 1: I love playing in the sim Way hall. Um. You know,

2010
01:38:17,840 --> 01:38:20,920
Speaker 1: I like the I like the old stuff, like you know,

2011
01:38:21,200 --> 01:38:23,880
Speaker 1: and and to be a part of this, this university.

2012
01:38:23,920 --> 01:38:25,960
Speaker 1: And and just think of the guys who have been

2013
01:38:26,000 --> 01:38:28,519
Speaker 1: here and walking to the PAULI like when you have

2014
01:38:28,680 --> 01:38:32,320
Speaker 1: you ever walked in that hallway, lean out of um downstairs,

2015
01:38:32,439 --> 01:38:34,240
Speaker 1: off the court and into the locker room. Have you

2016
01:38:34,280 --> 01:38:37,960
Speaker 1: ever been in that hallway? But yeah, the greatest hallway

2017
01:38:38,000 --> 01:38:40,760
Speaker 1: in college basketball, they call it. I mean that if

2018
01:38:40,840 --> 01:38:42,680
Speaker 1: that doesn't get you, being like a guy like you

2019
01:38:42,760 --> 01:38:44,720
Speaker 1: and I I mean, I don't know what I mean.

2020
01:38:44,760 --> 01:38:48,719
Speaker 1: It's obviously a special place and I'm very very fortunate

2021
01:38:48,800 --> 01:38:52,000
Speaker 1: too to be able to represent it in a very

2022
01:38:52,080 --> 01:38:55,519
Speaker 1: small way. Um, have you found a good place to

2023
01:38:55,560 --> 01:38:58,840
Speaker 1: get a course? Like? Well, that's that's been the most

2024
01:38:58,920 --> 01:39:01,280
Speaker 1: difficult thing. And like if you were to ask me,

2025
01:39:01,400 --> 01:39:04,640
Speaker 1: what is the most surprising thing about being here at

2026
01:39:04,720 --> 01:39:07,080
Speaker 1: U c. L A Is the difficulty in finding a

2027
01:39:07,360 --> 01:39:10,720
Speaker 1: good ice cold cores? L Um? You know, you go

2028
01:39:10,840 --> 01:39:13,120
Speaker 1: to these different restaurants and everybody's got their own little

2029
01:39:13,800 --> 01:39:16,720
Speaker 1: beer selection and and all the different breweries and I

2030
01:39:16,840 --> 01:39:18,599
Speaker 1: P A s and different things. And I'm a pretty

2031
01:39:18,640 --> 01:39:20,920
Speaker 1: simple guy, as you know, Like I just need an

2032
01:39:20,920 --> 01:39:22,720
Speaker 1: ice cold cores. Like but I did. I found a

2033
01:39:22,760 --> 01:39:26,120
Speaker 1: seven eleven, Um, got it, got it, got a twelve

2034
01:39:26,160 --> 01:39:28,880
Speaker 1: pack and put it in my hotel fridge. And so

2035
01:39:29,160 --> 01:39:33,400
Speaker 1: I'll be okay, so I get settled. Um, okay, Uh,

2036
01:39:35,040 --> 01:39:37,720
Speaker 1: last thing, all of these experiences and and look, you

2037
01:39:37,800 --> 01:39:40,040
Speaker 1: still you want your first job, right, you want your

2038
01:39:40,080 --> 01:39:45,560
Speaker 1: first head head coaching job. UM, what what what is

2039
01:39:45,600 --> 01:39:51,000
Speaker 1: it gonna take for you to get the right opportunity? Well,

2040
01:39:51,800 --> 01:39:55,200
Speaker 1: you know, the older I get, you know, I try

2041
01:39:55,280 --> 01:39:57,479
Speaker 1: not it's like looking back. I try not to look

2042
01:39:57,560 --> 01:40:02,680
Speaker 1: too too far forward. I think, UM, when an opportunity

2043
01:40:02,720 --> 01:40:06,720
Speaker 1: presents itself, it's the right one for me. UM. You know,

2044
01:40:06,800 --> 01:40:08,400
Speaker 1: I have a kind of a vision of what that's

2045
01:40:08,400 --> 01:40:11,240
Speaker 1: going to be. It's gonna be where you Um, you

2046
01:40:11,360 --> 01:40:15,200
Speaker 1: have an opportunity to be successful. UM. You know things

2047
01:40:15,240 --> 01:40:18,519
Speaker 1: are in place to be successful and and UM, that's

2048
01:40:18,840 --> 01:40:21,240
Speaker 1: that's so much more to me than than just the

2049
01:40:21,320 --> 01:40:25,280
Speaker 1: basketball program. Like do you have UM you know, is

2050
01:40:25,360 --> 01:40:29,519
Speaker 1: your your president and the university administration, UM, your athletic

2051
01:40:29,600 --> 01:40:34,240
Speaker 1: director and the athletic administration, UM and myself where we

2052
01:40:34,320 --> 01:40:36,920
Speaker 1: walk in hand in hand and trying to achieve the

2053
01:40:36,960 --> 01:40:40,720
Speaker 1: same things. UM. And I think when you find that,

2054
01:40:41,280 --> 01:40:45,720
Speaker 1: that's that's when you ultimately can have the most success. UM.

2055
01:40:46,120 --> 01:40:48,880
Speaker 1: And I think that that is what we're trying to

2056
01:40:49,000 --> 01:40:50,760
Speaker 1: get to right now here in u c l A.

2057
01:40:50,840 --> 01:40:52,519
Speaker 1: I think it's a great opportunity to come be a

2058
01:40:52,600 --> 01:40:55,000
Speaker 1: part of it. UM. But that's what I'm looking for

2059
01:40:55,240 --> 01:40:58,559
Speaker 1: in my first job. I don't I'm not too concerned

2060
01:40:58,560 --> 01:41:01,680
Speaker 1: about little major and minor major high major like. UM.

2061
01:41:02,160 --> 01:41:05,600
Speaker 1: I just wanna, you know, right now, make um U

2062
01:41:05,680 --> 01:41:07,439
Speaker 1: c l A as good as we possibly can make it.

2063
01:41:07,680 --> 01:41:10,600
Speaker 1: And if we do that, then the next opportunity is

2064
01:41:10,640 --> 01:41:13,240
Speaker 1: gonna come my way. But I do have a vision

2065
01:41:13,280 --> 01:41:15,439
Speaker 1: of what I want to what I wanted to look like,

2066
01:41:15,560 --> 01:41:17,680
Speaker 1: how I wanted to feel. I've been very fortunate to

2067
01:41:17,720 --> 01:41:20,920
Speaker 1: be around um you know, we've talked a little bit

2068
01:41:20,920 --> 01:41:24,880
Speaker 1: about all of them, uh some unbelievable coaches. UM. I

2069
01:41:25,000 --> 01:41:28,320
Speaker 1: know what success feels like. UM, I know the type

2070
01:41:28,360 --> 01:41:30,439
Speaker 1: of people that it that it takes to be around

2071
01:41:30,479 --> 01:41:34,320
Speaker 1: the program to have that type of success. UM and

2072
01:41:34,800 --> 01:41:37,680
Speaker 1: and uh so I realized how fortunate I've been, and

2073
01:41:37,760 --> 01:41:40,160
Speaker 1: I hope to get that opportunity in the future. But

2074
01:41:40,800 --> 01:41:42,880
Speaker 1: when that comes, it will come, you know. Right now,

2075
01:41:42,960 --> 01:41:46,720
Speaker 1: I'm I'm trying to to help these guys enjoy their experience.

2076
01:41:47,120 --> 01:41:49,559
Speaker 1: At three thirty when we work out again. All right,

2077
01:41:49,800 --> 01:41:52,320
Speaker 1: I got I got two or three more. Your favorite

2078
01:41:52,439 --> 01:41:58,519
Speaker 1: high school gym in Indiana is what Memorial Gymnasium, Huntingburg, Indiana.

2079
01:41:58,960 --> 01:42:02,000
Speaker 1: It's it's about seven and miles south of jas where

2080
01:42:02,040 --> 01:42:05,240
Speaker 1: it's where our our sexual tournament was, which was in

2081
01:42:05,280 --> 01:42:08,720
Speaker 1: the first round of the state tournament when I was there. Uh,

2082
01:42:10,160 --> 01:42:12,280
Speaker 1: it's it's kind of like Polly where you just see

2083
01:42:12,320 --> 01:42:14,920
Speaker 1: the roof and it goes down into the ground. Um.

2084
01:42:15,360 --> 01:42:19,799
Speaker 1: It held about seven thousand people on on on tournament

2085
01:42:19,920 --> 01:42:21,960
Speaker 1: nights and it was it was sold out with all

2086
01:42:22,040 --> 01:42:30,639
Speaker 1: the town COMMUNI Huntingburg, Indiana, Huntingburg South roof graders. Yeah,

2087
01:42:30,880 --> 01:42:35,200
Speaker 1: small little town about seven miles south of JASP. So, Um,

2088
01:42:37,880 --> 01:42:39,360
Speaker 1: I could go back, if I could go back and

2089
01:42:39,479 --> 01:42:41,320
Speaker 1: play one more game, Like if I could go back

2090
01:42:41,880 --> 01:42:44,920
Speaker 1: and like the knees don't hurt. Everything is, everything is

2091
01:42:44,960 --> 01:42:47,600
Speaker 1: back when you were eighteen years old. Like that's what

2092
01:42:49,120 --> 01:42:51,840
Speaker 1: I'm looking at pictures of it. Yeah, it's cool. Yeah,

2093
01:42:52,800 --> 01:42:56,040
Speaker 1: it's cool. It was hot in there, it'd be it'd

2094
01:42:56,080 --> 01:42:58,559
Speaker 1: be Oh, it's always so hot in there with all

2095
01:42:58,600 --> 01:43:04,439
Speaker 1: the people. It's right, Okay, Uh favorite favorite big ten arena.

2096
01:43:06,439 --> 01:43:10,479
Speaker 1: Sim I mean that was you getting more softball for me? No,

2097
01:43:10,640 --> 01:43:13,559
Speaker 1: I'm just okay. So tell me something about about I've

2098
01:43:13,600 --> 01:43:16,960
Speaker 1: shared previously. My my, my nightmare. We got blown up.

2099
01:43:16,960 --> 01:43:21,639
Speaker 1: We're down forty fourteen at IU in January, in February

2100
01:43:21,640 --> 01:43:26,439
Speaker 1: and see me in the November of Andre Patterson threw

2101
01:43:26,479 --> 01:43:28,559
Speaker 1: a block a shot. He threw a shot of mine

2102
01:43:28,600 --> 01:43:30,759
Speaker 1: into the third row. I think he hit John Mellencamp

2103
01:43:30,800 --> 01:43:33,880
Speaker 1: actually with the basketball. UM. And that was on the

2104
01:43:33,960 --> 01:43:36,200
Speaker 1: beginning of sports centers, Like are you ready for sports Center?

2105
01:43:36,240 --> 01:43:38,320
Speaker 1: It's like, no, it was like that that was my

2106
01:43:38,400 --> 01:43:41,479
Speaker 1: shot that he just rejected. Uh, you tell me something

2107
01:43:41,520 --> 01:43:44,280
Speaker 1: about you know, you tell me about the greatest was

2108
01:43:44,320 --> 01:43:46,320
Speaker 1: it hallway in college basketball at U c l A.

2109
01:43:46,800 --> 01:43:49,519
Speaker 1: What's that's the coolest part about about Assembly Hall that

2110
01:43:49,640 --> 01:43:55,560
Speaker 1: only somebody who played their nose, Um, I would like.

2111
01:43:55,760 --> 01:43:57,960
Speaker 1: I like going in there when it was when it

2112
01:43:58,080 --> 01:44:01,519
Speaker 1: was empty. Yeah, and like all the lights were on,

2113
01:44:01,720 --> 01:44:03,360
Speaker 1: like just you know, some of the flood lights that

2114
01:44:03,439 --> 01:44:06,040
Speaker 1: they would you know, have on, like when when you

2115
01:44:06,080 --> 01:44:08,160
Speaker 1: were able to get in there when you probably weren't

2116
01:44:08,160 --> 01:44:11,640
Speaker 1: supposed to. Um, you know that was that was my

2117
01:44:11,720 --> 01:44:14,439
Speaker 1: favorite time. He was kind of going there and look

2118
01:44:14,479 --> 01:44:17,160
Speaker 1: around and and uh have that feeling. It was. He

2119
01:44:17,280 --> 01:44:19,280
Speaker 1: was interesting. We took our team that we went there

2120
01:44:19,360 --> 01:44:23,400
Speaker 1: this year. Uh and and we we went and shot

2121
01:44:23,439 --> 01:44:26,599
Speaker 1: around the night before with with some of our guys

2122
01:44:26,640 --> 01:44:28,000
Speaker 1: that went in the night before because we did a

2123
01:44:28,000 --> 01:44:29,800
Speaker 1: shoot around on game day, but the night before we

2124
01:44:30,000 --> 01:44:31,840
Speaker 1: we was always have cyber. These guys want to go

2125
01:44:31,880 --> 01:44:35,400
Speaker 1: get some extra shots and and um, you know, Izy

2126
01:44:35,479 --> 01:44:37,719
Speaker 1: Copeland was still healthy at the time when he was shooting,

2127
01:44:38,040 --> 01:44:41,439
Speaker 1: and uh, he's like, He's like, coach, you can you

2128
01:44:41,520 --> 01:44:44,280
Speaker 1: can like almost feel the history in here, you know,

2129
01:44:44,720 --> 01:44:46,800
Speaker 1: And now I'm I'm coaching a different team in there,

2130
01:44:46,880 --> 01:44:48,599
Speaker 1: you know. So I'm trying to combat that. Like, I mean,

2131
01:44:48,640 --> 01:44:51,800
Speaker 1: I understood exactly what he was saying, but I'm like, dude, listen,

2132
01:44:51,840 --> 01:44:54,519
Speaker 1: those those five banners. They're not playing tomorrow night. You know,

2133
01:44:54,600 --> 01:44:56,840
Speaker 1: those banners. They're not scoring any point. You know. I'm

2134
01:44:56,840 --> 01:44:58,160
Speaker 1: trying to get him out of that mode. But I

2135
01:44:58,240 --> 01:45:01,160
Speaker 1: knew exactly what he was what he was talking about

2136
01:45:01,360 --> 01:45:03,120
Speaker 1: and feeling the history. And you feel that same thing

2137
01:45:03,960 --> 01:45:06,080
Speaker 1: when you're on this campus. You walk into PAULI Like,

2138
01:45:06,160 --> 01:45:08,240
Speaker 1: you look up and you've got those loving banners hanging

2139
01:45:08,320 --> 01:45:10,040
Speaker 1: up there, and you've got the jerseys of those guys

2140
01:45:10,080 --> 01:45:13,719
Speaker 1: hanging up there, like like you feel, uh, you feel

2141
01:45:13,760 --> 01:45:15,920
Speaker 1: that history, you feel that tradition, and that's what makes

2142
01:45:15,960 --> 01:45:18,800
Speaker 1: those places so special. I got I got to share

2143
01:45:18,800 --> 01:45:21,000
Speaker 1: with you. Jason, call your story, so call your visited

2144
01:45:21,080 --> 01:45:23,600
Speaker 1: us at Notre Dame before going to you guys, and

2145
01:45:23,680 --> 01:45:26,479
Speaker 1: we thought we had a shot. And uh, we had

2146
01:45:26,479 --> 01:45:28,840
Speaker 1: a guy named Gary bells as nutfellow freshman, and I

2147
01:45:28,880 --> 01:45:30,680
Speaker 1: remember our coaches called us in. They're like, hey, look

2148
01:45:31,200 --> 01:45:33,840
Speaker 1: we've got Jason Caller coming this week uh with the

2149
01:45:33,920 --> 01:45:36,400
Speaker 1: kid Jason Caller and the and the Babel twins came

2150
01:45:36,439 --> 01:45:39,400
Speaker 1: in same weekend. So like three best white guys in

2151
01:45:39,400 --> 01:45:46,760
Speaker 1: America coming in and uh and um and so uh

2152
01:45:46,880 --> 01:45:49,120
Speaker 1: they call us in and you know, like as freshman,

2153
01:45:49,160 --> 01:45:51,160
Speaker 1: you're gonna be a host and pat Gary is a sophomore,

2154
01:45:51,160 --> 01:45:55,519
Speaker 1: he's a host. Hey look, Caller is a great dude,

2155
01:45:55,560 --> 01:45:57,639
Speaker 1: great player, but he does not drink, he does not smoke,

2156
01:45:57,760 --> 01:46:01,760
Speaker 1: and he doesn't like cursing. It's very leges like all right,

2157
01:46:01,920 --> 01:46:08,439
Speaker 1: well fine, all false information, by the way, all false information. Okay,

2158
01:46:08,800 --> 01:46:12,600
Speaker 1: So so so we which I'm sure, so right, So

2159
01:46:12,720 --> 01:46:15,560
Speaker 1: we get uh they come pick me up in my

2160
01:46:15,640 --> 01:46:17,479
Speaker 1: dorm and then we go rolling. We go down to

2161
01:46:17,560 --> 01:46:19,840
Speaker 1: Gary Bell's dorm which is like two dorms down and

2162
01:46:19,960 --> 01:46:22,799
Speaker 1: literally opened the door and he's got like a cigar

2163
01:46:23,120 --> 01:46:26,000
Speaker 1: in his mouth and forties in his arms, Like, what's

2164
01:46:26,080 --> 01:46:30,840
Speaker 1: up fellas this pregame? You know, Um, but I never

2165
01:46:30,960 --> 01:46:33,640
Speaker 1: forget that, he said. He's like we knew he was

2166
01:46:33,680 --> 01:46:35,840
Speaker 1: going to the end because he's like, man, coach Knight

2167
01:46:35,960 --> 01:46:39,559
Speaker 1: was amazing, Like my grandma loves him. He's so funny

2168
01:46:40,160 --> 01:46:42,519
Speaker 1: to you know, like he people got them all wrong,

2169
01:46:42,600 --> 01:46:44,280
Speaker 1: which people do have him had him kind of them

2170
01:46:44,280 --> 01:46:46,960
Speaker 1: all wrong. But he's like, you know, he doesn't curse

2171
01:46:47,000 --> 01:46:49,000
Speaker 1: all the time. That's like totally overdone. And we're like,

2172
01:46:49,200 --> 01:46:53,840
Speaker 1: a dude, what give me your your How good a

2173
01:46:53,920 --> 01:46:56,160
Speaker 1: host were you when you're at IU when you we

2174
01:46:56,240 --> 01:46:59,519
Speaker 1: had a host a recruit? How good were you? Well?

2175
01:46:59,680 --> 01:47:01,560
Speaker 1: I like to think I was pretty good. We we

2176
01:47:01,680 --> 01:47:04,000
Speaker 1: got we got a lot of the guys I hosted. Um,

2177
01:47:04,520 --> 01:47:08,320
Speaker 1: you know, now like the circasing story, he was he

2178
01:47:08,439 --> 01:47:11,680
Speaker 1: was an NBA draft pick, but um, you know he

2179
01:47:11,800 --> 01:47:15,000
Speaker 1: came to campus and and uh, you know, like hey,

2180
01:47:15,240 --> 01:47:17,439
Speaker 1: you you know there's a party here, there's a party here,

2181
01:47:17,520 --> 01:47:18,680
Speaker 1: you know, like what do you want to do? And

2182
01:47:18,920 --> 01:47:21,600
Speaker 1: he was just like I just I really want some

2183
01:47:21,680 --> 01:47:23,719
Speaker 1: steak and shake and just take me back to the hotel.

2184
01:47:24,080 --> 01:47:26,519
Speaker 1: So I'm like, this guy is from small town Tennessee,

2185
01:47:26,640 --> 01:47:29,000
Speaker 1: like where there's no way we're getting this guy. So

2186
01:47:29,120 --> 01:47:30,840
Speaker 1: we went and got him a couple of cheeseburgers and

2187
01:47:31,439 --> 01:47:33,799
Speaker 1: took his host money and went down to the party

2188
01:47:33,840 --> 01:47:35,840
Speaker 1: and had a hell of a good time. But and

2189
01:47:35,960 --> 01:47:37,960
Speaker 1: he ended up coming in the NIB a pretty good player.

2190
01:47:38,040 --> 01:47:40,360
Speaker 1: But like, I think some of those visits are overrated.

2191
01:47:40,600 --> 01:47:43,160
Speaker 1: You know, each each guy is different, like you see

2192
01:47:43,160 --> 01:47:45,280
Speaker 1: it in recruiting. What they're looking for, what their family

2193
01:47:45,439 --> 01:47:47,880
Speaker 1: looking for, um, And it's just got to be a fit.

2194
01:47:48,080 --> 01:47:49,920
Speaker 1: And I know it was for me when I walked

2195
01:47:49,960 --> 01:47:52,560
Speaker 1: on campus, like you know, like the but now some

2196
01:47:52,640 --> 01:47:54,479
Speaker 1: of the best host times that we had, like and

2197
01:47:54,520 --> 01:47:56,400
Speaker 1: we're like, oh this dude had a blast. Who getting him?

2198
01:47:56,400 --> 01:47:59,760
Speaker 1: Didn't get him getting you know, I know, but I do.

2199
01:48:00,560 --> 01:48:02,600
Speaker 1: I do think that some of it is also for

2200
01:48:03,120 --> 01:48:04,720
Speaker 1: like we used to Oklahoma State. We used to use

2201
01:48:04,760 --> 01:48:07,160
Speaker 1: it because we had a boat. Right there were guys

2202
01:48:07,200 --> 01:48:08,640
Speaker 1: that we went to. We went to the coaches like

2203
01:48:08,960 --> 01:48:12,519
Speaker 1: he's not one of us, Like no, no thanks, and

2204
01:48:12,680 --> 01:48:15,160
Speaker 1: like really like now we we we think this guy

2205
01:48:15,240 --> 01:48:20,479
Speaker 1: is awesome, Like no, not at all. Um, Yeah, and

2206
01:48:20,920 --> 01:48:23,719
Speaker 1: we five his visit. He came in for a football

2207
01:48:23,800 --> 01:48:25,839
Speaker 1: weekend and we were supposed to take him the football

2208
01:48:25,880 --> 01:48:28,519
Speaker 1: game and he didn't want to go, and he wanted

2209
01:48:28,520 --> 01:48:31,680
Speaker 1: to sit in my apartment and eat Buffal Louis and

2210
01:48:31,760 --> 01:48:36,160
Speaker 1: watch Michigan play Michigan football game on on ABC. So

2211
01:48:36,439 --> 01:48:38,360
Speaker 1: when coach asked, hey, what do you guys do yesterday?

2212
01:48:38,360 --> 01:48:39,840
Speaker 1: How was the football game? Like, well, we didn't go,

2213
01:48:40,320 --> 01:48:41,760
Speaker 1: but what do you do? And I was like, well,

2214
01:48:41,800 --> 01:48:43,479
Speaker 1: we set in my apartment at Buffal Louis and we

2215
01:48:43,520 --> 01:48:46,160
Speaker 1: watched Michigan play I don't know whoever they were playing

2216
01:48:46,160 --> 01:48:48,680
Speaker 1: on TV, and like coach Knight was all piste off

2217
01:48:48,720 --> 01:48:50,960
Speaker 1: of me, but we ended up getting, you know. But

2218
01:48:51,400 --> 01:48:52,920
Speaker 1: like he didn't want to go. I don't blame you.

2219
01:48:53,120 --> 01:48:54,800
Speaker 1: We didn't go down you games when I was playing,

2220
01:48:55,200 --> 01:48:56,720
Speaker 1: like you know, like you said at home, we don't

2221
01:48:56,720 --> 01:48:58,400
Speaker 1: watched Michigan Notre Dame and like that's what we did,

2222
01:48:58,720 --> 01:49:01,120
Speaker 1: you know, um, And that's that's what we got. And

2223
01:49:01,240 --> 01:49:03,400
Speaker 1: he wanted to watch Michigan on his iucause he wanted

2224
01:49:03,400 --> 01:49:06,040
Speaker 1: to watch Michigan play football. Um, so that's what we

2225
01:49:06,080 --> 01:49:10,519
Speaker 1: did and we ended up getting. So that's actually amazing.

2226
01:49:10,880 --> 01:49:14,360
Speaker 1: I've had five I've had five, Okay, last thing. Uh,

2227
01:49:15,439 --> 01:49:19,559
Speaker 1: the best guy that you love seeing on the road. Okay,

2228
01:49:20,120 --> 01:49:23,360
Speaker 1: we have like somebody we have not just that You're

2229
01:49:23,360 --> 01:49:26,000
Speaker 1: just like, look, I've been a basketball coach for twenty years.

2230
01:49:26,520 --> 01:49:28,240
Speaker 1: This is a this is a great dude that people

2231
01:49:28,280 --> 01:49:32,480
Speaker 1: should know about. UM, well, I'll give you an assistant,

2232
01:49:32,560 --> 01:49:35,000
Speaker 1: and I'll give you a head coach assistant. Like I

2233
01:49:35,840 --> 01:49:39,880
Speaker 1: met Lucadino who's now at Wishantall State. UM, he's been

2234
01:49:39,920 --> 01:49:42,599
Speaker 1: a friend of mine since we were in college. UM,

2235
01:49:42,880 --> 01:49:45,840
Speaker 1: and so I always enjoy sitting and talking with him,

2236
01:49:45,920 --> 01:49:47,880
Speaker 1: just kind of catching up from like as a friend thing,

2237
01:49:48,520 --> 01:49:53,200
Speaker 1: UM as as a coaching thing. Like I've Um, I

2238
01:49:53,240 --> 01:49:55,880
Speaker 1: don't even know if Roy Williams knows my name, but

2239
01:49:56,479 --> 01:50:00,160
Speaker 1: he has been extremely gracious to me every time I've

2240
01:50:00,200 --> 01:50:03,200
Speaker 1: seen him. And if he doesn't know my name, I

2241
01:50:03,240 --> 01:50:05,560
Speaker 1: wouldn't know it from our interactions. He'll sit down and

2242
01:50:05,680 --> 01:50:09,160
Speaker 1: he'll talk, and you know, we'll we'll end up talking

2243
01:50:09,240 --> 01:50:11,400
Speaker 1: for two or three games, and you know, I'll ask

2244
01:50:11,479 --> 01:50:13,720
Speaker 1: him about you know, he's always got buddies with him

2245
01:50:13,760 --> 01:50:15,880
Speaker 1: and his golf trips and he tells me all about it,

2246
01:50:16,000 --> 01:50:19,759
Speaker 1: and it kind of reminds you of sitting down talking

2247
01:50:19,800 --> 01:50:22,840
Speaker 1: to your grandfather, you know, and just you know, all

2248
01:50:22,880 --> 01:50:24,560
Speaker 1: the good stories he has, and he'll get he's a

2249
01:50:24,640 --> 01:50:27,280
Speaker 1: great storyteller, and he just starts telling all these great stories.

2250
01:50:27,320 --> 01:50:29,880
Speaker 1: And I just enjoy sitting there, you know, listening to him.

2251
01:50:29,920 --> 01:50:31,240
Speaker 1: And unlike I said, I don't even know if he

2252
01:50:31,320 --> 01:50:33,240
Speaker 1: knows he knows what my name is. But every time

2253
01:50:33,320 --> 01:50:37,640
Speaker 1: I see him, um, you know, and we're within a

2254
01:50:37,680 --> 01:50:39,880
Speaker 1: close vicinity, we end up we end up talking, and

2255
01:50:40,560 --> 01:50:42,400
Speaker 1: and I've always enjoyed those times. It's pretty cool. For

2256
01:50:42,439 --> 01:50:45,759
Speaker 1: a guy like me, it's pretty cool. Yeah, for anybody,

2257
01:50:45,760 --> 01:50:49,080
Speaker 1: it's pretty cool. Anybody's pretty cool. He doesn't like me,

2258
01:50:49,200 --> 01:50:52,280
Speaker 1: He's he he doesn't like me. So he used to

2259
01:50:52,360 --> 01:50:53,960
Speaker 1: really be nice to me. He was super nice to

2260
01:50:54,000 --> 01:50:56,720
Speaker 1: my dad, and I always thought he's he's like the

2261
01:50:56,880 --> 01:51:00,640
Speaker 1: world's greatest dude, and he doesn't like me because the

2262
01:51:00,800 --> 01:51:03,280
Speaker 1: information he was given on what I said on CBS

2263
01:51:03,400 --> 01:51:06,559
Speaker 1: was not terribly accurate. But whatever I said, I said,

2264
01:51:07,320 --> 01:51:09,479
Speaker 1: I said, uh, you know, like, look, people wonder this

2265
01:51:09,520 --> 01:51:11,320
Speaker 1: is back when he had his knees were bad and

2266
01:51:11,960 --> 01:51:14,120
Speaker 1: he had the spins. You know, he gets that kind

2267
01:51:14,120 --> 01:51:15,519
Speaker 1: of like once a year. And I was like, look,

2268
01:51:15,560 --> 01:51:17,800
Speaker 1: people wonder if he wins a Nation chanship, he'll retire,

2269
01:51:17,880 --> 01:51:20,360
Speaker 1: like a legit discussion within the sport. And so it

2270
01:51:20,439 --> 01:51:22,519
Speaker 1: got kind of spun around too. I said Roy Williams

2271
01:51:22,600 --> 01:51:24,439
Speaker 1: gonna retire. It's like, no, that's not what I said.

2272
01:51:24,479 --> 01:51:27,439
Speaker 1: But whatever, I do think, I think he's amazing. Uh,

2273
01:51:27,600 --> 01:51:32,719
Speaker 1: he's interesting dude and probably the greatest head coach recruiter

2274
01:51:33,600 --> 01:51:36,160
Speaker 1: that there has ever been. Right, Like, I think self

2275
01:51:36,280 --> 01:51:38,920
Speaker 1: is really good. But you know, like Roy Williams used,

2276
01:51:39,080 --> 01:51:40,880
Speaker 1: he still does. He comes, he sits down in midcourt

2277
01:51:40,880 --> 01:51:43,960
Speaker 1: whoever somebody he wants, he comes and sits down mid courts.

2278
01:51:44,000 --> 01:51:45,840
Speaker 1: Everybody knows Roy Williams there and he makes it a

2279
01:51:45,920 --> 01:51:49,479
Speaker 1: personal quest to get that one guy and or or

2280
01:51:49,600 --> 01:51:52,880
Speaker 1: whatever those guys are. And he has an unbelievable level

2281
01:51:52,920 --> 01:51:56,639
Speaker 1: of energy for recruiting still and uh, and he does.

2282
01:51:56,720 --> 01:51:58,800
Speaker 1: He does have his He he does roll deep like

2283
01:51:58,880 --> 01:52:01,000
Speaker 1: he's funny. He's kind of got a positive like who

2284
01:52:01,080 --> 01:52:04,960
Speaker 1: are those guys? Like those are Roy Williams guys? Like okay, yeah,

2285
01:52:05,400 --> 01:52:07,360
Speaker 1: there there's boys and they're just itching that He's got

2286
01:52:07,400 --> 01:52:08,840
Speaker 1: to watch a game or two and they're itching to

2287
01:52:08,880 --> 01:52:10,920
Speaker 1: get out to hit the hit the golf course or

2288
01:52:10,960 --> 01:52:14,360
Speaker 1: the closest casino and and uh, you know, good for him.

2289
01:52:14,400 --> 01:52:18,160
Speaker 1: I think he's learned that that right to do that stuff. Um.

2290
01:52:18,479 --> 01:52:23,560
Speaker 1: How what's a reasonable what's a reasonable expectation for U

2291
01:52:23,680 --> 01:52:28,920
Speaker 1: C l A Over the first couple of years. Uh,

2292
01:52:29,840 --> 01:52:32,280
Speaker 1: you know, I think that's difficult. Like I'm still learning

2293
01:52:33,040 --> 01:52:36,160
Speaker 1: our personnel. Um. You know, I think when you first

2294
01:52:36,200 --> 01:52:38,920
Speaker 1: get in here with the open recruiting period, you're you're

2295
01:52:39,000 --> 01:52:42,560
Speaker 1: really focused on the recruiting aspect. Um. I think we

2296
01:52:42,640 --> 01:52:45,760
Speaker 1: have some talented kids on this team. Um. I think,

2297
01:52:46,479 --> 01:52:50,320
Speaker 1: um that they will if if we can get them

2298
01:52:51,120 --> 01:52:55,519
Speaker 1: to there's a there's this big misconception about Mick and

2299
01:52:55,680 --> 01:52:59,479
Speaker 1: offensive defense. But if we can get these guys to

2300
01:52:59,600 --> 01:53:02,559
Speaker 1: defend in the way that I believe that they're capable

2301
01:53:02,640 --> 01:53:07,080
Speaker 1: of based on their athleticism, um, and you couple it

2302
01:53:07,240 --> 01:53:09,960
Speaker 1: with their offensive abilities, and then we're going to have

2303
01:53:10,120 --> 01:53:13,800
Speaker 1: an opportunity to have uh some success. Um. Now, if

2304
01:53:13,920 --> 01:53:16,519
Speaker 1: if we don't do that, like like scoring points was

2305
01:53:16,520 --> 01:53:19,519
Speaker 1: not a problem for this basketball team, um, you know,

2306
01:53:19,760 --> 01:53:22,400
Speaker 1: defending guys, you know was And so we've we've got

2307
01:53:22,479 --> 01:53:24,960
Speaker 1: to get that mentality and that focus. They've got to

2308
01:53:25,040 --> 01:53:29,760
Speaker 1: realize UM with all their abilities on one end, if

2309
01:53:29,800 --> 01:53:32,200
Speaker 1: they can if they can pick it up on the other, Uh,

2310
01:53:32,360 --> 01:53:34,080
Speaker 1: it can. It can lead to winning. And that's got

2311
01:53:34,160 --> 01:53:36,240
Speaker 1: to become important to them. You know, the highlight play

2312
01:53:36,600 --> 01:53:38,800
Speaker 1: has got to become secondary. Winning has got to become

2313
01:53:39,840 --> 01:53:42,719
Speaker 1: number one and and everything that they want to achieve

2314
01:53:43,600 --> 01:53:46,120
Speaker 1: will be right their form and and UH, it's been

2315
01:53:46,160 --> 01:53:47,760
Speaker 1: a fun group to work with. Like I'm looking, I'm

2316
01:53:47,760 --> 01:53:49,600
Speaker 1: excited about three thirty to day to get out with

2317
01:53:49,680 --> 01:53:51,519
Speaker 1: them for our second work out of the summer. I

2318
01:53:51,560 --> 01:53:53,760
Speaker 1: gotta work out with them for about about a week

2319
01:53:53,800 --> 01:53:57,439
Speaker 1: when I first got here with the quarter system finishing UM.

2320
01:53:57,560 --> 01:53:59,120
Speaker 1: So we're still kind of get to know each other.

2321
01:53:59,160 --> 01:54:01,200
Speaker 1: They're getting a better feel for make and what he's

2322
01:54:01,240 --> 01:54:03,599
Speaker 1: looking for you to win. A lot of teaching UM,

2323
01:54:03,760 --> 01:54:08,320
Speaker 1: and these guys have been very they've responded very well UM.

2324
01:54:08,560 --> 01:54:11,120
Speaker 1: And and obviously they're trying to impress a new staff

2325
01:54:11,200 --> 01:54:14,000
Speaker 1: and and but I think it's a good group UM

2326
01:54:14,400 --> 01:54:17,360
Speaker 1: with some with a very high ceiling. UM. There's just

2327
01:54:17,439 --> 01:54:21,720
Speaker 1: some some habits that that I've gone awry and we've

2328
01:54:21,760 --> 01:54:24,080
Speaker 1: got to tighten some things up. But it's gonna be

2329
01:54:24,120 --> 01:54:26,080
Speaker 1: fun to work with. And I think if if we

2330
01:54:26,160 --> 01:54:29,559
Speaker 1: can we can recruit the right side of kids um

2331
01:54:30,520 --> 01:54:32,800
Speaker 1: that are about the right things, and you couple that

2332
01:54:32,920 --> 01:54:35,320
Speaker 1: with the level of talent that you can attract your

2333
01:54:35,440 --> 01:54:38,320
Speaker 1: musil a um, then we can do some special things.

2334
01:54:38,400 --> 01:54:41,320
Speaker 1: And that's what I'm looking forward to, no question, no question.

2335
01:54:41,360 --> 01:54:43,680
Speaker 1: All right, man, I've taken enough of your time. Best

2336
01:54:43,720 --> 01:54:46,520
Speaker 1: of luck finding actual watering holes with course light. I

2337
01:54:46,560 --> 01:54:48,840
Speaker 1: will I will make my personal quest. I I think

2338
01:54:48,880 --> 01:54:50,520
Speaker 1: the places you're looking to live you have a better

2339
01:54:50,600 --> 01:54:53,920
Speaker 1: chance than than right around the campus in Westwood in

2340
01:54:53,960 --> 01:54:57,800
Speaker 1: the meantime, But thanks for hunt. When when my family

2341
01:54:57,840 --> 01:54:59,520
Speaker 1: gets up here, and then you're gonna like I made

2342
01:54:59,560 --> 01:55:01,800
Speaker 1: that trip on your spot. Now, when my family gets

2343
01:55:01,840 --> 01:55:04,760
Speaker 1: out here in middle mid July, we'll have you up

2344
01:55:04,760 --> 01:55:06,960
Speaker 1: and have a barbecue, and I promise you I will

2345
01:55:07,000 --> 01:55:10,760
Speaker 1: have found um. I already know what to bring. This

2346
01:55:10,920 --> 01:55:12,680
Speaker 1: is so easy, Like I hate bringing over like a

2347
01:55:12,800 --> 01:55:15,760
Speaker 1: bottle of wine. How about that bad bottle of wine.

2348
01:55:15,760 --> 01:55:17,560
Speaker 1: I hope you threw that bottle of wine. That place

2349
01:55:17,640 --> 01:55:19,720
Speaker 1: I had to stop at next to your house was

2350
01:55:19,920 --> 01:55:23,440
Speaker 1: like the place to go And why did you do that?

2351
01:55:23,720 --> 01:55:25,440
Speaker 1: Why did you do that? Like it was very thoughtful

2352
01:55:25,560 --> 01:55:27,160
Speaker 1: don't get me wrong. It was the first time I

2353
01:55:27,240 --> 01:55:29,040
Speaker 1: was going to meet your wife. It was the first

2354
01:55:29,040 --> 01:55:31,080
Speaker 1: time I was going to meet your wife. And I

2355
01:55:31,280 --> 01:55:32,880
Speaker 1: was like, I gotta show, like I can't just be

2356
01:55:33,000 --> 01:55:35,600
Speaker 1: the dude that just shows up, right. So I don't

2357
01:55:35,640 --> 01:55:38,000
Speaker 1: know I was, I was. I don't know, I was

2358
01:55:38,040 --> 01:55:39,680
Speaker 1: just not being who I am. Like I'm I've got

2359
01:55:39,840 --> 01:55:42,160
Speaker 1: pretty comfortable of my own skin, and I was I

2360
01:55:42,240 --> 01:55:44,600
Speaker 1: was trying to be nice and and and get a

2361
01:55:44,640 --> 01:55:46,320
Speaker 1: bottle of wine. And I'm sure it was. It was

2362
01:55:46,640 --> 01:55:48,080
Speaker 1: very nice, but it's you know, it's like it's like

2363
01:55:48,200 --> 01:55:50,840
Speaker 1: that kiss on the cheek thing that people do like

2364
01:55:51,920 --> 01:55:54,120
Speaker 1: and like you get into, you get into. I go

2365
01:55:54,200 --> 01:55:56,560
Speaker 1: to a party and people like come with you. You're like,

2366
01:55:57,040 --> 01:55:59,920
Speaker 1: we're not French. I don't do that. So I'm not

2367
01:56:00,040 --> 01:56:01,760
Speaker 1: gonna do that because it's not who I am and

2368
01:56:01,920 --> 01:56:04,520
Speaker 1: like and so maybe people think I'm an asshole because

2369
01:56:04,560 --> 01:56:06,720
Speaker 1: I don't bring a bottle one, but I do, you know, like,

2370
01:56:06,880 --> 01:56:09,040
Speaker 1: I will bring it. I'll bring you a twelver of

2371
01:56:09,160 --> 01:56:11,560
Speaker 1: Coors Light. It'll be ice cold. I may have to

2372
01:56:11,680 --> 01:56:13,680
Speaker 1: put it in my jetti so he comes out and

2373
01:56:13,720 --> 01:56:15,800
Speaker 1: I would I will impress you in that way, and

2374
01:56:15,840 --> 01:56:17,080
Speaker 1: then you have to tell me if your wife like

2375
01:56:17,440 --> 01:56:19,560
Speaker 1: likes wine, that will will bring wine. Hey dude, no, no, no,

2376
01:56:20,200 --> 01:56:25,160
Speaker 1: wife like she's good. She like light, she likes bud light.

2377
01:56:25,200 --> 01:56:27,480
Speaker 1: But she'll drink course like. She's like me if it's cold. Mike,

2378
01:56:27,560 --> 01:56:30,440
Speaker 1: we're good now, I know. Wait, hold on, hold on,

2379
01:56:30,640 --> 01:56:35,320
Speaker 1: writens down twelver and a sixer. Bottles or cans. She's

2380
01:56:35,400 --> 01:56:37,840
Speaker 1: don't tell me she's in the cans. No, she's a

2381
01:56:37,880 --> 01:56:39,640
Speaker 1: bottle girl, she says. I mean she's kind of got

2382
01:56:39,760 --> 01:56:46,080
Speaker 1: enough and in her older age she prefers bottles. Now, Mike,

2383
01:56:46,120 --> 01:56:49,040
Speaker 1: thanks for joining us. It's no problem. I appreciated. Dog.

2384
01:56:49,800 --> 01:56:52,000
Speaker 1: Be sure to catch live editions. So the Doug got

2385
01:56:52,040 --> 01:56:55,000
Speaker 1: leaps show wheat days in noon eastern three pm Pacific.

2386
01:56:55,440 --> 01:56:57,240
Speaker 1: All right, that was That was great with Mike Lewis.

2387
01:56:57,440 --> 01:57:00,880
Speaker 1: Let me give you this thought on on the Houston Rockets.

2388
01:57:02,640 --> 01:57:10,360
Speaker 1: You know the Rockets. I understand how they've used analytics,

2389
01:57:11,120 --> 01:57:14,760
Speaker 1: and I am not one of these ostrich put your

2390
01:57:14,760 --> 01:57:18,360
Speaker 1: head in the sand, gonna deny the value of analytics

2391
01:57:18,640 --> 01:57:21,600
Speaker 1: in basketball or in any sport. It's an important part

2392
01:57:21,640 --> 01:57:23,880
Speaker 1: of baseball, it's an important part of football. It's an

2393
01:57:23,880 --> 01:57:29,200
Speaker 1: important part of basketball, but the perfect example of how

2394
01:57:30,560 --> 01:57:33,360
Speaker 1: the Rockets spent too much time with analytics and not

2395
01:57:33,600 --> 01:57:35,480
Speaker 1: enough time building a team, and now they're trying to

2396
01:57:35,560 --> 01:57:39,600
Speaker 1: figure out how to fix what ails them, and they

2397
01:57:39,680 --> 01:57:45,400
Speaker 1: may end up making more of a problem. Look at

2398
01:57:45,400 --> 01:57:47,120
Speaker 1: two years ago when they won. When they lost in

2399
01:57:47,200 --> 01:57:50,400
Speaker 1: Game seven, should be pointed out that in Dex Andrea

2400
01:57:50,480 --> 01:57:52,360
Speaker 1: Dolla's reminding us he didn't play in that game. He's

2401
01:57:52,400 --> 01:57:54,760
Speaker 1: a huge part of the the Warriors. So the Rockets

2402
01:57:54,800 --> 01:57:56,720
Speaker 1: saying when we didn't have Chris Paul, the Warriors didn't

2403
01:57:56,720 --> 01:57:59,240
Speaker 1: have Andrea Dollah is not as good a players Chris Paul,

2404
01:57:59,760 --> 01:58:03,080
Speaker 1: but he is almost as important to what the Warriors

2405
01:58:03,120 --> 01:58:07,040
Speaker 1: are able to do. But the point is, instead of

2406
01:58:07,240 --> 01:58:10,200
Speaker 1: maybe exploiting that mismatch as they had done previously in

2407
01:58:10,240 --> 01:58:12,440
Speaker 1: the series, they became overly reliant on the three point

2408
01:58:12,480 --> 01:58:15,800
Speaker 1: shot and miss seven in a row. On paper, you

2409
01:58:15,880 --> 01:58:19,840
Speaker 1: shouldn't miss and analytics, you shouldn't miss twenty seven in

2410
01:58:19,920 --> 01:58:23,200
Speaker 1: a row. Right that there isn't There isn't that kind

2411
01:58:23,240 --> 01:58:28,160
Speaker 1: of stretch because after you you have the same percentage

2412
01:58:28,240 --> 01:58:31,360
Speaker 1: chance of missing one as you do the next one,

2413
01:58:31,440 --> 01:58:32,760
Speaker 1: as you do the next one as you do the

2414
01:58:32,840 --> 01:58:38,160
Speaker 1: next one. That's how statistics work. It's not you know,

2415
01:58:39,360 --> 01:58:41,800
Speaker 1: this whole water finds its level if you're you know,

2416
01:58:42,360 --> 01:58:44,800
Speaker 1: you know, like like if you're shoot, you're forty percent

2417
01:58:44,800 --> 01:58:47,720
Speaker 1: shoot on every shot that you take. It doesn't believe

2418
01:58:47,760 --> 01:58:50,440
Speaker 1: in hot streaks. Doesn't believe. It does believe in hot spots,

2419
01:58:50,480 --> 01:58:55,240
Speaker 1: but not as much hot streaks. It's statistics, and I

2420
01:58:55,320 --> 01:58:59,040
Speaker 1: think it has value. But the perfect example of why

2421
01:58:59,120 --> 01:59:02,000
Speaker 1: the Rockets are in the mess that they're in being

2422
01:59:02,160 --> 01:59:03,920
Speaker 1: good but not able to be great and win a

2423
01:59:04,040 --> 01:59:08,080
Speaker 1: title is on paper, Chris Paul and James Harden work

2424
01:59:08,320 --> 01:59:11,600
Speaker 1: together when they're both in the lineup. They're incredibly efficient offensively,

2425
01:59:11,880 --> 01:59:15,120
Speaker 1: they're good basketball teams. But Chris Paul, like the rest

2426
01:59:15,160 --> 01:59:17,200
Speaker 1: of us, hates watching James Harden dribble a ball to death,

2427
01:59:17,920 --> 01:59:20,160
Speaker 1: and James Harden, like the rest of us, is like man,

2428
01:59:20,720 --> 01:59:24,680
Speaker 1: Chris Paul kind of seems old, right, and so they

2429
01:59:24,720 --> 01:59:26,760
Speaker 1: struggle to get along with each other. You can't see

2430
01:59:26,760 --> 01:59:30,520
Speaker 1: that in statistical data, because analytically speaking, the team is

2431
01:59:30,560 --> 01:59:31,960
Speaker 1: far better with both of them on the court than

2432
01:59:32,000 --> 01:59:34,800
Speaker 1: they are with either of them off the floor. So

2433
01:59:34,800 --> 01:59:37,680
Speaker 1: now they're gonna ad Jimmy Butler his fourth team in

2434
01:59:37,760 --> 01:59:42,000
Speaker 1: four years. That's paying only attention to we can be

2435
01:59:42,120 --> 01:59:44,960
Speaker 1: more efficient, we can be better, instead of paying attention

2436
01:59:45,000 --> 01:59:47,000
Speaker 1: to how does the team actually feel and how do

2437
01:59:47,040 --> 01:59:53,400
Speaker 1: they get along? Good luck with that. Last thing is this,

2438
01:59:53,960 --> 01:59:59,600
Speaker 1: um we're gonna have more coaches on and basketball people

2439
01:59:59,640 --> 02:00:04,040
Speaker 1: on about the off season. I do think Kansas would

2440
02:00:04,040 --> 02:00:08,480
Speaker 1: be my preseason number one. And UM, I love the

2441
02:00:08,640 --> 02:00:12,120
Speaker 1: idea that the n C is going to continue to

2442
02:00:12,280 --> 02:00:14,480
Speaker 1: try and get back to the cutting down on the waivers.

2443
02:00:15,160 --> 02:00:19,800
Speaker 1: It doesn't mean that, UM, I don't think that some

2444
02:00:20,000 --> 02:00:22,320
Speaker 1: kids transfer home for the right reasons because you have

2445
02:00:22,520 --> 02:00:26,360
Speaker 1: us sick uncle or grandpa, mom or dad. But just

2446
02:00:26,600 --> 02:00:30,480
Speaker 1: enough people have lied about it and have gamed the

2447
02:00:30,600 --> 02:00:34,360
Speaker 1: system where we don't believe anybody anymore. That's really kind

2448
02:00:34,360 --> 02:00:36,960
Speaker 1: of what it is, right. It's the same reason you

2449
02:00:37,080 --> 02:00:40,920
Speaker 1: take off your shoes at a when you go through

2450
02:00:40,960 --> 02:00:43,280
Speaker 1: the airport screener. There's one guy who tried to blow

2451
02:00:43,280 --> 02:00:45,040
Speaker 1: out the world with his shoes. We'll have to take

2452
02:00:45,080 --> 02:00:47,040
Speaker 1: our shoes is like ten years later, more than ten

2453
02:00:47,120 --> 02:00:49,920
Speaker 1: years later. Sorry, one guy kind of ruined it for

2454
02:00:49,920 --> 02:00:53,000
Speaker 1: the rest of us. That's the way it works. And

2455
02:00:53,160 --> 02:00:55,480
Speaker 1: the reality is that if you're going to transfer home,

2456
02:00:56,280 --> 02:00:58,760
Speaker 1: even if for the reasons that you know, you get

2457
02:00:58,800 --> 02:01:01,560
Speaker 1: a grandpost like you can take a year off and

2458
02:01:01,760 --> 02:01:04,240
Speaker 1: help that person get healthy or spend time with them

2459
02:01:04,280 --> 02:01:10,240
Speaker 1: while they're sick. Speaking of being sick, Um arrest in

2460
02:01:10,280 --> 02:01:15,520
Speaker 1: peace too. Tony BARRONI great basketball coach, awesome guy. And

2461
02:01:16,400 --> 02:01:17,960
Speaker 1: he was a coach Tech Sam when I first got

2462
02:01:17,960 --> 02:01:21,680
Speaker 1: Tokoha mistake. And I will never forget the last line

2463
02:01:21,720 --> 02:01:23,640
Speaker 1: I heard him say, as head coach at Tech say

2464
02:01:23,640 --> 02:01:27,960
Speaker 1: at m he had been fired. It was in March,

2465
02:01:28,080 --> 02:01:29,560
Speaker 1: and we were at the Herford House in Kansas City

2466
02:01:29,560 --> 02:01:31,680
Speaker 1: where we always ate the night before the Big twelve tournament,

2467
02:01:32,280 --> 02:01:34,600
Speaker 1: and he comes walking in in his maroon sweats, just

2468
02:01:34,720 --> 02:01:37,680
Speaker 1: with his assistant coaches, and Edie Sutton says, Tony, where's

2469
02:01:37,680 --> 02:01:40,840
Speaker 1: your team? And Tony says, those fucking guys let them

2470
02:01:40,880 --> 02:01:43,120
Speaker 1: at McDonald's. They got my ass fired. How you doing, coach?

2471
02:01:45,040 --> 02:01:47,560
Speaker 1: He coached Anoy Benjamin at Creighton, which should earn him

2472
02:01:48,240 --> 02:01:51,720
Speaker 1: automatic entrance into the gates of heaven. St. Peter got

2473
02:01:51,800 --> 02:01:54,280
Speaker 1: himself an angel, will give him some wings. Tony is

2474
02:01:54,280 --> 02:01:56,840
Speaker 1: a good dude. And then his son just got the

2475
02:01:56,880 --> 02:02:02,160
Speaker 1: head coaching job at Southern Illinois Edwardsville. I believe I

2476
02:02:02,240 --> 02:02:04,480
Speaker 1: think Brian will do an excellent job. Rest in peace

2477
02:02:04,520 --> 02:02:06,840
Speaker 1: to the great Tony Brownie. I'm Doug Gottliebin. This is

2478
02:02:06,880 --> 02:02:07,240
Speaker 1: all ball