1 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:05,320 Speaker 1: One of the most significant investment banks in the world 2 00:00:05,360 --> 00:00:08,479 Speaker 1: is Goldman Sachs. It's had a gloried history. Recently, I 3 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:10,360 Speaker 1: had a chance to sit down with the current CEO 4 00:00:10,440 --> 00:00:13,200 Speaker 1: of that firm, David Solomon, to ask him about the 5 00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:16,799 Speaker 1: Federal Reserve, operating Goldman Sachs, and the current economic environment. 6 00:00:17,520 --> 00:00:21,640 Speaker 1: So let's talk about some government matters. Now, you're in Washington, 7 00:00:22,840 --> 00:00:25,119 Speaker 1: the Federal Reserve. You've talked about the importance of the 8 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:29,000 Speaker 1: FED being independent. So are you worried about the independence 9 00:00:29,040 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 1: of the FED? And the Secretary of Treasuries announced five 10 00:00:31,960 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 1: potential next chairs of the FED. Any of them or 11 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:37,640 Speaker 1: all of them acceptable to you? 12 00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:41,479 Speaker 2: Well, let's get right into it. 13 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:41,840 Speaker 1: David. 14 00:00:44,680 --> 00:00:46,279 Speaker 2: First of all, I just say and I think it's 15 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:50,680 Speaker 2: a point that's worth emphasizing central bank independence, not just 16 00:00:50,720 --> 00:00:52,400 Speaker 2: here in the United States, but around the world. I 17 00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:54,760 Speaker 2: think it's served us very very well, and I think 18 00:00:54,800 --> 00:00:57,640 Speaker 2: it's something that we should speak out for, we should 19 00:00:57,640 --> 00:01:00,880 Speaker 2: strive for, and I think it's important. I'm not going 20 00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:02,920 Speaker 2: to comment on the individuals other than to say I 21 00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:06,760 Speaker 2: think all five individuals, you know, carry skills and experience 22 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:09,000 Speaker 2: that could make them credible candidates to be a FED chair. 23 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:11,160 Speaker 2: I think we all know that there's one person that's 24 00:01:11,200 --> 00:01:13,440 Speaker 2: going to make that decision is to the next Ed Shair. 25 00:01:13,280 --> 00:01:16,320 Speaker 1: And sometimes the government of the United States is moving 26 00:01:16,640 --> 00:01:20,120 Speaker 1: oscillating its policies a bit. Going tariffs are the things 27 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:22,800 Speaker 1: Has that made it difficult to do well on Wall 28 00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:25,400 Speaker 1: Street for Wall Street firms or the Wall Street firms 29 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:27,480 Speaker 1: seen to be doing okay? But has the changing in 30 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:29,480 Speaker 1: policy of what the tariff we're having here or not 31 00:01:29,560 --> 00:01:31,640 Speaker 1: having it or other kinds of things, has it been 32 00:01:31,760 --> 00:01:34,679 Speaker 1: difficult for Wall Street firms to deal with what the 33 00:01:34,680 --> 00:01:36,559 Speaker 1: administration is doing or is actually not a big. 34 00:01:36,520 --> 00:01:42,000 Speaker 2: Problem government policy makers? You know, there's always uncertainty, there's 35 00:01:42,040 --> 00:01:47,560 Speaker 2: always unpredictability in all different kinds of administrations. And I 36 00:01:47,560 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 2: think our job as business leaders is to adapt and 37 00:01:50,040 --> 00:01:52,960 Speaker 2: to adjust and deal with it. Can'tidy. I think that's 38 00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:54,400 Speaker 2: that's what I think we do. Right. 39 00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:56,520 Speaker 1: So, the debt of the United States is now thirty 40 00:01:56,560 --> 00:02:00,200 Speaker 1: eight trillion dollars. Some people would say that's a lot. 41 00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:02,840 Speaker 1: Why is the businessman not worried about? As a general, 42 00:02:02,960 --> 00:02:04,400 Speaker 1: they don't seem to be as worried about the thirty 43 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 1: eight trillion as I would have thought they would be well. 44 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:08,079 Speaker 2: I speak to a lot of people in the business 45 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 2: community and a lot of people in the financial community, 46 00:02:09,760 --> 00:02:12,880 Speaker 2: and I think people are worried about the level of 47 00:02:12,960 --> 00:02:16,040 Speaker 2: debt and the fact that we've reached a point. And 48 00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:17,480 Speaker 2: by the way, this is true in the United States, 49 00:02:17,520 --> 00:02:20,239 Speaker 2: but it's true when every developed economy where kind of 50 00:02:20,280 --> 00:02:24,160 Speaker 2: fiscal stimulus and an aggressive fiscal play is really just 51 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:28,400 Speaker 2: kind of embedded in the way these democratic economies are operating. 52 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:32,000 Speaker 2: And it's accelerated meaningfully in the last five years. I 53 00:02:32,000 --> 00:02:35,480 Speaker 2: think the pandemic, you know, played an accelerating role, and 54 00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:37,880 Speaker 2: it doesn't seem like we have an ability to pull 55 00:02:37,919 --> 00:02:40,600 Speaker 2: it back. And so we've taken the debt you know, 56 00:02:40,600 --> 00:02:42,880 Speaker 2: in the last fifteen plus years, kind of since the 57 00:02:42,880 --> 00:02:46,960 Speaker 2: financial crisis, from seven trillion to thirty eight trillion, and 58 00:02:47,120 --> 00:02:50,280 Speaker 2: just refinancing it for the rest of the Decade's what's 59 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:52,560 Speaker 2: got to be refinanced. If you look at current rates, 60 00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:56,200 Speaker 2: you know, is going to grow it into the low forties, 61 00:02:56,320 --> 00:03:00,480 Speaker 2: you know for sure. And we're growing our spending at 62 00:03:00,639 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 2: a reasonable rate still, and so this is an issue 63 00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:06,200 Speaker 2: we have to wrestle with now. The path out really 64 00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:08,040 Speaker 2: isn't a revenue path out. The path out is a 65 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:10,400 Speaker 2: growth path path and you know, if you think about it, 66 00:03:10,440 --> 00:03:13,360 Speaker 2: the difference you know, trend growth is two percent. The 67 00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:15,760 Speaker 2: difference between compound and growth of three percent and two 68 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:18,359 Speaker 2: percent is monstrous in terms of dealing with this issue. 69 00:03:19,040 --> 00:03:21,960 Speaker 2: So there's a lot of discussion about running, you know, 70 00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:24,520 Speaker 2: a real growth play. I think we have some things 71 00:03:24,520 --> 00:03:28,080 Speaker 2: that are going on that give us a better opportunity 72 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:32,239 Speaker 2: to have a higher growth trajectory, particularly you know, technology 73 00:03:32,280 --> 00:03:35,920 Speaker 2: AI getting embedded to the enterprise, the productivity opportunity from that. 74 00:03:36,720 --> 00:03:40,080 Speaker 2: But if we continue on the current course and we 75 00:03:40,280 --> 00:03:43,839 Speaker 2: don't take the growth level up, we will there will 76 00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 2: be a reckoning in this. And the bottom line is 77 00:03:46,440 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 2: we have to find people, you know, to buy and 78 00:03:48,640 --> 00:03:52,480 Speaker 2: finance our debt. And you know, ultimately it's it's not 79 00:03:52,520 --> 00:03:54,040 Speaker 2: going to be other people around the world. If it 80 00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:55,440 Speaker 2: keeps growing, it's going to turn to us. 81 00:03:56,000 --> 00:03:58,360 Speaker 1: Is Wall Street worried about the fact that government is 82 00:03:58,600 --> 00:04:01,760 Speaker 1: shut down? I mean this is for a long shutdown 83 00:04:01,880 --> 00:04:04,000 Speaker 1: or people on Wall Street saying, well, it don't get 84 00:04:04,120 --> 00:04:06,080 Speaker 1: started again at some point, or have you seen the 85 00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:08,680 Speaker 1: adverse impact on your business as a result of the 86 00:04:08,720 --> 00:04:09,480 Speaker 1: government shutdown. 87 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 2: I think we all should be concerned about the fact 88 00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:14,040 Speaker 2: that the government shutdown. And I you know, I think 89 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:16,680 Speaker 2: it's unfortunate that we have government shutdowns, and this one's 90 00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:19,280 Speaker 2: now going on for a period of time. As it 91 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:22,480 Speaker 2: goes on longer, it starts to have an economic impact, right, 92 00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:24,920 Speaker 2: it starts to filter through the economy. And we're getting 93 00:04:25,400 --> 00:04:27,159 Speaker 2: you know, we're getting to that point in. 94 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:29,240 Speaker 1: This Who do you think the shutoffs were for the 95 00:04:29,240 --> 00:04:34,479 Speaker 1: shutdown the government? Right, Well, let me ask you. I 96 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:38,159 Speaker 1: know you're not going to answer that question. So every 97 00:04:38,200 --> 00:04:40,640 Speaker 1: seven years on average, and the US economy has had 98 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:43,560 Speaker 1: a recession seven year own average. We haven't had a 99 00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:46,640 Speaker 1: recession for quite a while. Are you worried about any 100 00:04:47,560 --> 00:04:50,080 Speaker 1: potential recession coming or you think the economy is in 101 00:04:50,080 --> 00:04:50,880 Speaker 1: pretty good shape? 102 00:04:51,240 --> 00:04:53,560 Speaker 2: Well, I think the economy is in pretty good shape 103 00:04:53,560 --> 00:04:55,920 Speaker 2: at the moment. And I think when you look at 104 00:04:56,000 --> 00:04:59,400 Speaker 2: kind of the give gets, you know, in terms of 105 00:04:59,400 --> 00:05:02,120 Speaker 2: tailwinds that winds are there are more tailwinds. 106 00:05:01,720 --> 00:05:02,159 Speaker 1: At the moment. 107 00:05:02,160 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 2: I mean, I go back where we're still running a 108 00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:08,800 Speaker 2: pretty aggressive fiscal you know, fiscal play, the AI infrastructure 109 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:11,000 Speaker 2: investment boom you have, you know, you've got six or 110 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:13,800 Speaker 2: seven large companies that are going to spend three hundred 111 00:05:13,800 --> 00:05:16,840 Speaker 2: and fifty billion dollars you know, this year on AI infrastructure. 112 00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:19,719 Speaker 2: That has an effect on growth. We also, after a 113 00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:24,799 Speaker 2: period of kind of heavier regulatory oversight of business broadly, 114 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:28,919 Speaker 2: there's now a pretty clear by this administration, a pretty 115 00:05:28,920 --> 00:05:33,120 Speaker 2: clear systematic look at regulation and you know, more of 116 00:05:33,160 --> 00:05:35,960 Speaker 2: a view toward what regulation is really necessary and works 117 00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 2: as effective. And that's you know, that's a tailwind for 118 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:42,360 Speaker 2: growth and so you all and you also have as 119 00:05:42,400 --> 00:05:45,200 Speaker 2: AI gets embedded into the enterprise, you have real productivity gains. 120 00:05:45,279 --> 00:05:48,200 Speaker 2: So we've got a big, diverse economy. It's in pretty 121 00:05:48,200 --> 00:05:51,119 Speaker 2: good shape at the moment. There are things we can't 122 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:52,680 Speaker 2: see that could set it off, but I think the 123 00:05:52,800 --> 00:05:55,280 Speaker 2: chance of a recession and the near term is low. 124 00:05:55,760 --> 00:05:58,280 Speaker 2: But that's one of the things about sentiment shifts and 125 00:05:59,160 --> 00:06:02,479 Speaker 2: changes and support. You generally don't see them until they're 126 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:03,279 Speaker 2: right in front of you. 127 00:06:03,760 --> 00:06:06,360 Speaker 1: On AI, some people would say that there's maybe a 128 00:06:06,400 --> 00:06:08,680 Speaker 1: little bit of a bubble in AI. When you have 129 00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:13,000 Speaker 1: companies with market caps of five trillion dollars, you don't 130 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:14,440 Speaker 1: see any bubble there at all. 131 00:06:14,600 --> 00:06:18,760 Speaker 2: Whenever we have an acceleration in technology and people get 132 00:06:18,800 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 2: excited about it. You have significant capital formation around new 133 00:06:23,560 --> 00:06:26,000 Speaker 2: companies that are trying to capitalize on that opportunity. And 134 00:06:26,040 --> 00:06:29,080 Speaker 2: you know, we've seen this before through history, and you're 135 00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:33,760 Speaker 2: seeing it, you're seeing it now. It won't be a 136 00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 2: straight line. The opportunity set with AI is enormous. There 137 00:06:37,000 --> 00:06:41,240 Speaker 2: will be winners and losers, and it's hard to pick 138 00:06:41,240 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 2: the winners and losers now. And certainly a lot of 139 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:48,120 Speaker 2: the capital that's being deployed will not produce adequate returns, 140 00:06:48,120 --> 00:06:50,760 Speaker 2: and a bunch of the capital that's being deployed will actually, 141 00:06:51,160 --> 00:06:53,320 Speaker 2: you know, will actually not produce any returns. 142 00:06:53,320 --> 00:06:56,239 Speaker 1: But dollar is down about eleven percent or so against 143 00:06:56,240 --> 00:06:59,680 Speaker 1: the Euro and some other currencies as well this year. 144 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:02,280 Speaker 2: Yeah year, I mean in the last fifteen years, it's 145 00:07:02,320 --> 00:07:03,640 Speaker 2: up monstrously. 146 00:07:03,160 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 1: Right, But did you worry that it's gone down or 147 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:08,320 Speaker 1: you think it was overvalued? And as a result of 148 00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:10,120 Speaker 1: it having gone down, you think the chance of a 149 00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:13,800 Speaker 1: Plaza core to orchestrated effort to take it down even 150 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:16,760 Speaker 1: further is unlikely? And you think the dollar decline now 151 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 1: is okay, it's suggusted appropriately. 152 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:20,400 Speaker 2: You know, the dollar has been on a pretty good 153 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:22,080 Speaker 2: run over a long period of time, and it's certainly 154 00:07:22,080 --> 00:07:25,040 Speaker 2: given back this year given some of the policy actions, 155 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:28,160 Speaker 2: some of the gains. But fundamentally, the dollar is the 156 00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:30,680 Speaker 2: reserve currency of the world. I don't see anything at 157 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:33,040 Speaker 2: the moment that threatens that. I'm not concerned that there's 158 00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:35,960 Speaker 2: some fundamental shift. And actually, when you think about digitization 159 00:07:36,560 --> 00:07:40,080 Speaker 2: and tokenization and access to the dollar, you know, over 160 00:07:40,160 --> 00:07:43,160 Speaker 2: time it's actually allowing easier access to the dollar around 161 00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:45,280 Speaker 2: the world, which in the long run is a benefit 162 00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:46,920 Speaker 2: for the dollar and the dollar's position in the world. 163 00:07:46,960 --> 00:07:50,880 Speaker 1: What about crypto? Is crypto now important for Wall Street? 164 00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:53,520 Speaker 1: It's an important business? And are you a big believer 165 00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:58,320 Speaker 1: in the viability and the good investment opportunities? And related 166 00:07:58,320 --> 00:07:59,200 Speaker 1: to crypto. 167 00:07:58,960 --> 00:08:01,880 Speaker 2: I'm a big believer in the technology of the blockchain 168 00:08:01,960 --> 00:08:06,080 Speaker 2: and the ability for us to change the financial infrastructure 169 00:08:06,120 --> 00:08:10,240 Speaker 2: the rails to increase speed and decrease friction, and that's 170 00:08:10,240 --> 00:08:13,080 Speaker 2: a very very good thing for the system. That's different 171 00:08:13,120 --> 00:08:16,040 Speaker 2: than a debate on the long term value of bitcoin. 172 00:08:16,080 --> 00:08:18,560 Speaker 2: I don't have a I think bitcoin looks like a 173 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 2: store of value. I don't have a real long term view, 174 00:08:21,640 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 2: you know, on that a strong long term view, but 175 00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:28,480 Speaker 2: I do. I do have a very strong view about tokenization, digitization, 176 00:08:28,640 --> 00:08:32,840 Speaker 2: stable coins, and innovation around the whole financial infrastructure. It's coming, 177 00:08:33,240 --> 00:08:35,800 Speaker 2: it's coming at a very quick pace, and to the 178 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:40,320 Speaker 2: degree that it increases speed, reduces friction, and allows for 179 00:08:40,360 --> 00:08:43,040 Speaker 2: a more secure system, I think that's a very very 180 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:43,439 Speaker 2: good thing. 181 00:08:43,559 --> 00:08:46,440 Speaker 1: So firms like yours seem to have two main businesses. 182 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:49,320 Speaker 1: I'll say one is investment banking and together is trading, 183 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:52,320 Speaker 1: which is stronger. Right now, investment banking or trading are 184 00:08:52,360 --> 00:08:53,079 Speaker 1: both doing well. 185 00:08:53,080 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 2: They're both big, important businesses, and it's evolved a little bit, David, 186 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:58,880 Speaker 2: because the way we run these businesses now we run 187 00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:01,600 Speaker 2: it as one business global banking and markets, and it's 188 00:09:01,640 --> 00:09:05,760 Speaker 2: our investment banking, fixed income, currencies and commodities and equities, 189 00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:08,640 Speaker 2: franchises and the RUE is one business. We've obviously had 190 00:09:08,679 --> 00:09:11,600 Speaker 2: an extraordinary leadership position in investment banking and M and A, 191 00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 2: and we've maintained and strengthened that. But in our trading businesses, 192 00:09:16,040 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 2: we've increased our wallet share with our clients over the 193 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:20,400 Speaker 2: last five years by three hundred and eighty basis points, 194 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:23,320 Speaker 2: and so we've really created an ecosystem by getting these 195 00:09:23,360 --> 00:09:26,360 Speaker 2: businesses to work together as one. Goldman sachs that our 196 00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:29,040 Speaker 2: clients really feel like they've benefited from and so we've 197 00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:32,199 Speaker 2: seen growth in those relatively mature businesses because of that. 198 00:09:32,360 --> 00:09:35,199 Speaker 1: When COVID came, a lot of people work by zoom 199 00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:38,800 Speaker 1: they had to really and then when COVID was over, 200 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:41,680 Speaker 1: people were urging their employees to come back to work. 201 00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:43,680 Speaker 1: And there's still a little bit of a fight on 202 00:09:43,679 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 1: Wall Street about whether people should work in the office 203 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:47,760 Speaker 1: five days a week or four days a week. What 204 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:48,520 Speaker 1: is your policy. 205 00:09:48,640 --> 00:09:52,040 Speaker 2: We don't have a policy. We work. Ours is a 206 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:56,920 Speaker 2: culture of teamwork and collaboration and apprenticeship, and that works 207 00:09:56,920 --> 00:09:59,160 Speaker 2: when people come together. But people also travel to see 208 00:09:59,160 --> 00:10:01,280 Speaker 2: clients and people all so have busy, complex lives and 209 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:04,040 Speaker 2: we have to give them flexibility. We did that before COVID, 210 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:08,000 Speaker 2: we do that now. But fundamentally, people show up, they work. 211 00:10:08,080 --> 00:10:10,600 Speaker 2: We don't have rules. They get their jobs done, they're accountable, 212 00:10:10,840 --> 00:10:14,400 Speaker 2: they're present, and you know, we we come together. 213 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:16,160 Speaker 1: That's what We don't care if they're in the office 214 00:10:16,200 --> 00:10:17,719 Speaker 1: five days or three days, as long as a job 215 00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:18,320 Speaker 1: against done. 216 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:20,079 Speaker 2: As long as as long as they're doing what they 217 00:10:20,080 --> 00:10:21,240 Speaker 2: need to do. And part of what you need to 218 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:22,720 Speaker 2: do is you need to be present, You need to 219 00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:25,240 Speaker 2: mentor people. By the way, young people, they're coming to 220 00:10:25,280 --> 00:10:27,320 Speaker 2: Golden Sacks to learn. All these young people we were 221 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:29,880 Speaker 2: talking about, they want to be present in the office 222 00:10:29,880 --> 00:10:31,320 Speaker 2: and they want senior people around them. 223 00:10:31,360 --> 00:10:33,440 Speaker 1: They want to learn what brings you to Washington other 224 00:10:33,520 --> 00:10:35,640 Speaker 1: than this event, what you're doing and what what are 225 00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:36,640 Speaker 1: you doing in Washington today? 226 00:10:36,679 --> 00:10:39,720 Speaker 2: Principally, fifteen years ago, we created a program at Golden 227 00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:43,959 Speaker 2: Sacks called ten Thousand Small Businesses. We had a thesis 228 00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:50,160 Speaker 2: that if we could provide some boot camp business education 229 00:10:50,360 --> 00:10:54,240 Speaker 2: for small businesses. Given the importance that small businesses play 230 00:10:54,280 --> 00:10:56,920 Speaker 2: in our economy here in the United States, the entrepreneurial spirit. 231 00:10:56,960 --> 00:10:59,599 Speaker 2: I think thirty five percent of the private workforce in 232 00:10:59,640 --> 00:11:02,880 Speaker 2: the United States as small businesses, that if we could 233 00:11:02,920 --> 00:11:06,320 Speaker 2: make an investment in that community and use our expertise, 234 00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:09,000 Speaker 2: our knowledge and transmitted into that community, it would spur 235 00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:11,960 Speaker 2: more investment, more economic growth. A few years ago, we 236 00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:16,120 Speaker 2: created a platform called ten Thousand Businesses Voices to bring 237 00:11:16,320 --> 00:11:20,200 Speaker 2: graduates of that program to d C periodically to go 238 00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:23,200 Speaker 2: up on the hill and spend time with members and 239 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:26,000 Speaker 2: senators on policy issues. And so we have two thousand 240 00:11:26,040 --> 00:11:28,400 Speaker 2: small businesses here. When you think about the power of 241 00:11:28,440 --> 00:11:33,760 Speaker 2: the US economy, you can't understate how important this entrepreneurial spirit. 242 00:11:33,800 --> 00:11:35,640 Speaker 2: It's different from other places in the world. 243 00:11:35,920 --> 00:11:39,080 Speaker 1: Let's talk about your background. Where were you born. 244 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:42,319 Speaker 2: I was born in Westchester County, outside New York City, 245 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:43,360 Speaker 2: White Pins, White Plains. 246 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:45,040 Speaker 1: Name, And what did your parents do. 247 00:11:45,280 --> 00:11:49,520 Speaker 2: My father had a financial printing business, like mutual fund Perspectuses, 248 00:11:49,559 --> 00:11:54,520 Speaker 2: and you know Perspectus is in Manhattan, a small financial 249 00:11:54,520 --> 00:11:57,600 Speaker 2: printing business. He was actually quite smart. He sold it 250 00:11:57,640 --> 00:11:59,680 Speaker 2: in two thousand to one of the big financial printers 251 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:03,040 Speaker 2: that didn't exist after twenty ten. So I think he 252 00:12:03,040 --> 00:12:05,680 Speaker 2: made I think he made a good trade. My mom 253 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:09,200 Speaker 2: was an audiologist at the Berke Rebilitation Hospital in White Plains. 254 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:11,160 Speaker 1: And were you a star student when you were in 255 00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:13,320 Speaker 1: elementary or junior high school or high school? 256 00:12:13,920 --> 00:12:15,839 Speaker 2: I would not say I was a star student. I 257 00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:19,640 Speaker 2: would say that I was a distracted student, meaning I 258 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:23,160 Speaker 2: have lots of interests, and you know, studying hard was 259 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:25,440 Speaker 2: not one of them. There was a point when I 260 00:12:25,480 --> 00:12:27,480 Speaker 2: really kind of got it when I was in college. 261 00:12:27,880 --> 00:12:32,640 Speaker 2: But I would say I coasted more through through high school. 262 00:12:32,400 --> 00:12:34,280 Speaker 1: To an athlete. Were you an athlete? 263 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:36,640 Speaker 2: I was. I was an athlete, but I was extremely mediocre, 264 00:12:36,880 --> 00:12:38,400 Speaker 2: extremely mediocre. 265 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:41,560 Speaker 1: I know the feeling. Okay, So, so you went to 266 00:12:41,600 --> 00:12:44,600 Speaker 1: Hamilton College because you admired Alexander Hamilton or. 267 00:12:44,520 --> 00:12:46,120 Speaker 2: Well, I went to Hamilton College because I didn't get 268 00:12:46,120 --> 00:12:46,720 Speaker 2: into Williams. 269 00:12:48,760 --> 00:12:49,480 Speaker 1: Well, but you're the chair. 270 00:12:49,520 --> 00:12:52,520 Speaker 2: But Hamilton College is a great school. I'm really glad. 271 00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:54,520 Speaker 2: I'm really glad that I went there. 272 00:12:54,600 --> 00:12:55,079 Speaker 1: You're the chair. 273 00:12:55,160 --> 00:12:58,079 Speaker 2: I've voted the last twenty five years to service there 274 00:12:58,320 --> 00:12:59,520 Speaker 2: and I do chair the board. 275 00:12:59,360 --> 00:13:03,200 Speaker 1: Of the board. Now, fantastic enact Congratulations. So are you 276 00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:05,400 Speaker 1: graduated from Hamilton? What did you major in? 277 00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:09,719 Speaker 2: I majored in political science and I thought, I really 278 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:11,120 Speaker 2: thought I was going to go to law school. 279 00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:14,400 Speaker 1: And you didn't miss anything, trust me. 280 00:13:15,760 --> 00:13:19,600 Speaker 2: Well, it was very interesting. You know, all my friends 281 00:13:19,640 --> 00:13:21,320 Speaker 2: were moving to New York and if you really think 282 00:13:21,320 --> 00:13:25,440 Speaker 2: about it was nineteen eighty four and the financial services 283 00:13:25,480 --> 00:13:27,640 Speaker 2: world kind of the bottom of what I would call 284 00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:31,200 Speaker 2: was a long drag from the late sixties to nineteen 285 00:13:31,240 --> 00:13:33,520 Speaker 2: eighty two. I mean the moment would be September fifteenth, 286 00:13:33,559 --> 00:13:36,520 Speaker 2: nineteen eighty two, when the ten year Treasury at fifteen 287 00:13:36,559 --> 00:13:39,040 Speaker 2: point nine percent. We were just starting to come out 288 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 2: of that and see equities start to start to move 289 00:13:41,880 --> 00:13:45,120 Speaker 2: again in banks and financial firms were creating analyst programs 290 00:13:45,160 --> 00:13:49,320 Speaker 2: and banks were creating training programs, and all my friends 291 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:50,960 Speaker 2: were going to New York to do this. I didn't 292 00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:55,079 Speaker 2: really know much about finance, but it was an opportunity 293 00:13:55,160 --> 00:13:58,400 Speaker 2: to kind of continue what we were doing in college 294 00:13:58,440 --> 00:14:01,120 Speaker 2: in an apartment in New York and where you could 295 00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:03,079 Speaker 2: earn a salary of twenty two thousand dollars. So I 296 00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:04,880 Speaker 2: got a job at the Irving Trust Company, which was 297 00:14:04,880 --> 00:14:09,320 Speaker 2: a commercial bank and a bank training program, and I 298 00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:12,800 Speaker 2: went to work on Wall Street, actually literally on Wall Street. 299 00:14:12,840 --> 00:14:15,560 Speaker 2: Irving Trust headquarters was number one Wall Street. 300 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:18,240 Speaker 1: Did you interview for a job at Goldman Sacks and 301 00:14:18,240 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 1: get turned down? 302 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:21,800 Speaker 2: I didn't interview. I sent a letter asking for an interview, 303 00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:23,840 Speaker 2: and I got a reply back saying no, thank you. 304 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:25,240 Speaker 1: After Irving you went where. 305 00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:27,560 Speaker 2: Back in those days, generally speaking, if you wanted a 306 00:14:27,600 --> 00:14:29,240 Speaker 2: career on Wall Street, you had to go to business school. 307 00:14:29,840 --> 00:14:32,960 Speaker 2: And so in the fall of nineteen eighty five and 308 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:35,200 Speaker 2: early nineteen eighty six, I was applying to business school, 309 00:14:36,040 --> 00:14:38,200 Speaker 2: but I got an interview at Drexel Burnham Lambert in 310 00:14:38,200 --> 00:14:41,400 Speaker 2: the Hijo bond department and in a small branch of 311 00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:44,920 Speaker 2: it that was based in New York that basically traded 312 00:14:44,960 --> 00:14:47,520 Speaker 2: and sold junk commercial paper if you can believe that 313 00:14:47,560 --> 00:14:50,320 Speaker 2: product existed. And I took that job and went to 314 00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:53,360 Speaker 2: Drexel burning I had a great experience Atdrexel Burnham. I 315 00:14:53,440 --> 00:14:56,080 Speaker 2: learned a lot. My background was all around hyo bonds 316 00:14:56,120 --> 00:14:56,840 Speaker 2: and credit trading. 317 00:14:57,000 --> 00:14:58,640 Speaker 1: But you left before they went bankrump. 318 00:14:58,760 --> 00:15:01,560 Speaker 2: I did. I I was competing for a piece of 319 00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:04,720 Speaker 2: business with a Goldman sax partner's name was John winkel Read. 320 00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:08,960 Speaker 2: And at the end of competing for that piece of 321 00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:11,440 Speaker 2: business and actually doing that piece of business, it was 322 00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:14,080 Speaker 2: actually a financing for Sheldon Adelson, who was building big 323 00:15:14,080 --> 00:15:17,240 Speaker 2: casino hotels in Las Vegas. We raised them one point 324 00:15:17,280 --> 00:15:21,080 Speaker 2: two billion dollars. In nineteen ninety eight, I started getting 325 00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:23,280 Speaker 2: recruited to come to Goldman Sachs and I had been 326 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:26,200 Speaker 2: in a pretty senior position at bear Stearns, but I 327 00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:28,280 Speaker 2: really thought it was an opportunity to go to work 328 00:15:28,280 --> 00:15:30,840 Speaker 2: for what I believed was, you know, the most extraordinary 329 00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:31,920 Speaker 2: financial firm on Wall Street. 330 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 1: It's very unusual for it my mid to early career 331 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:36,720 Speaker 1: to go to Goldman because usually I'd hire people right 332 00:15:36,760 --> 00:15:38,680 Speaker 1: on business score college and you went kind of as 333 00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:40,800 Speaker 1: a lateral, and that was unusual. I assumed you had. 334 00:15:40,720 --> 00:15:43,680 Speaker 2: That at the time. It wasn't unprecedented, but it was. 335 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:46,680 Speaker 2: It was unusual. The firm was just going public. I 336 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:49,640 Speaker 2: mean I came right after the IPO, and the firm 337 00:15:49,680 --> 00:15:52,120 Speaker 2: in that year had gone out and hired you know, 338 00:15:52,240 --> 00:15:56,400 Speaker 2: five or six partners that had real credibility because the 339 00:15:56,400 --> 00:15:58,280 Speaker 2: firm was trying to grow and expand its footprints. 340 00:15:58,360 --> 00:16:00,320 Speaker 1: So how many years were you there before where you 341 00:16:00,360 --> 00:16:01,520 Speaker 1: became the CEO? 342 00:16:01,800 --> 00:16:03,880 Speaker 2: Well, I became the CEO in twenty eighteen, so that 343 00:16:03,920 --> 00:16:05,240 Speaker 2: means I was there nineteen years. 344 00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:07,000 Speaker 1: So work your way up. Did you think when you 345 00:16:07,080 --> 00:16:08,440 Speaker 1: join you wind up as a CEO? 346 00:16:08,760 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 2: No, I didn't think I would be there for twenty years. 347 00:16:10,640 --> 00:16:12,680 Speaker 2: I remember there was a partner who was a longtime 348 00:16:12,720 --> 00:16:16,920 Speaker 2: partner named Bob Hurst who was talking who it was 349 00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:18,720 Speaker 2: just kind of he was kind of winding down when 350 00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:21,000 Speaker 2: I joined the firm, and I remember being at an 351 00:16:21,080 --> 00:16:23,200 Speaker 2: event with clients and he was talking about all the 352 00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:24,680 Speaker 2: years he had been at the firm, and I remember 353 00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:26,560 Speaker 2: looking him and saying, well, I'll never make that many years. 354 00:16:26,720 --> 00:16:30,520 Speaker 1: You became the CEO in October of twenty eighteen. The 355 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:33,680 Speaker 1: stock is up roughly three hundred percent since then. The 356 00:16:33,680 --> 00:16:37,520 Speaker 1: market capitalization's up roughly three hundred percent, So people are 357 00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:38,440 Speaker 1: pretty happy with you. 358 00:16:38,560 --> 00:16:41,800 Speaker 2: I assume this week, I mean, you know, so you. 359 00:16:41,920 --> 00:16:45,040 Speaker 1: Came out with your earnings, because last week your earnings 360 00:16:45,040 --> 00:16:48,080 Speaker 1: were up per share I guess forty one percent per share, 361 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:50,720 Speaker 1: forty six percent, forty six percent over a year of year. 362 00:16:51,560 --> 00:16:53,560 Speaker 1: But the stock went down two percent. And how can 363 00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:55,320 Speaker 1: that be given how well you did. 364 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:57,360 Speaker 2: I guess they wanted earnings to be up fifty five percent. 365 00:16:57,440 --> 00:17:00,000 Speaker 2: I mean, you know, we we really don't. I mean 366 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:02,360 Speaker 2: it's hard for me because like any human being, you know, 367 00:17:02,600 --> 00:17:04,720 Speaker 2: I have the screen on my desk or on my phone. 368 00:17:05,080 --> 00:17:08,760 Speaker 2: But we're really you know, twenty eighteen, when this leadership 369 00:17:08,760 --> 00:17:11,600 Speaker 2: team started, you know, through twenty eighteen, the end of 370 00:17:11,600 --> 00:17:15,280 Speaker 2: twenty eighteen to twenty nineteen, we really developed a strategy 371 00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:17,320 Speaker 2: to grow the firm, and we've made real progress, and 372 00:17:17,320 --> 00:17:19,520 Speaker 2: we've grown the firm very materially. I mean, the market 373 00:17:19,520 --> 00:17:22,520 Speaker 2: cap has grown as you highlight because we've grown the revenues. 374 00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:25,080 Speaker 2: We've not quite doubled the revenues. We've taken the revenues 375 00:17:25,080 --> 00:17:27,560 Speaker 2: from mid thirties to almost sixty and we've grown the 376 00:17:27,600 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 2: earnings very very materially, and that's grown the market cap. 377 00:17:31,200 --> 00:17:34,240 Speaker 2: And so we're executing on that strategy. And I think 378 00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 2: we've got a great strategy, an incredible team. We've got 379 00:17:37,600 --> 00:17:39,679 Speaker 2: a client. We're incredibly focused on our clients and our 380 00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:43,520 Speaker 2: client franchise, and you know, the stock will follow. Our 381 00:17:43,600 --> 00:17:46,280 Speaker 2: job is to execute, to be patient, to take a 382 00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:48,720 Speaker 2: long view. There will be cycles. At the moment, we're 383 00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:50,600 Speaker 2: in a constructive cycle, so it feels like there are 384 00:17:50,640 --> 00:17:53,359 Speaker 2: lots of tailwinds. There'll be more headwinds, but you know, 385 00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:55,560 Speaker 2: over the next five years, I think we will continue 386 00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:58,280 Speaker 2: to grow the firm, continue to deliver for our clients, 387 00:17:58,280 --> 00:17:59,800 Speaker 2: and continue to deliver for shareholders. 388 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:02,600 Speaker 1: What percentage of your employees are not men? 389 00:18:02,760 --> 00:18:05,600 Speaker 2: We've made a bunch of progress, especially in the senior rankspeicendily, 390 00:18:05,640 --> 00:18:08,879 Speaker 2: not enough and we continue to be focused on creating opportunities, 391 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:10,120 Speaker 2: but it's a long, long road. 392 00:18:10,240 --> 00:18:13,080 Speaker 1: What are the skill sets that enables somebody to rise 393 00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:13,480 Speaker 1: up at. 394 00:18:13,400 --> 00:18:17,680 Speaker 2: Goldman Goldman's no different than any other professional services firm. 395 00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 2: You know, I think one of the things that's important 396 00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:23,040 Speaker 2: to be successful in a professional services firm is you 397 00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:27,840 Speaker 2: have to enjoy interacting with people. It's a people business 398 00:18:27,840 --> 00:18:30,159 Speaker 2: inside the firm because you work collaboratively on teams and 399 00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:33,440 Speaker 2: you work collectively for the betterment of a group out 400 00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:36,000 Speaker 2: of the firm. And you have to like working with clients. 401 00:18:36,040 --> 00:18:37,439 Speaker 2: You have to like serving clients. You have to like 402 00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:40,400 Speaker 2: responding to clients, you have to like talking to being 403 00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:43,920 Speaker 2: with building relationships with clients, and so, you know, those 404 00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:46,679 Speaker 2: are skills that matter. To do those things, you have 405 00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:48,720 Speaker 2: to have to be smart, you have to be motivated. 406 00:18:48,880 --> 00:18:53,680 Speaker 2: We have four core values client service, partnership, integrity, and excellence. 407 00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:57,040 Speaker 2: And you know, all great businesses are underpinned by the 408 00:18:57,080 --> 00:18:59,840 Speaker 2: leadership in the organization living those values and really trying 409 00:18:59,840 --> 00:19:01,560 Speaker 2: to peak to the best of their ability to deliver 410 00:19:01,600 --> 00:19:02,439 Speaker 2: against those values. 411 00:19:02,680 --> 00:19:04,080 Speaker 1: So it used to be the case you had to 412 00:19:04,080 --> 00:19:07,040 Speaker 1: be a man to rise up at Wall Street. Today, 413 00:19:07,760 --> 00:19:11,080 Speaker 1: what percentage of your employees are are not men? 414 00:19:11,680 --> 00:19:14,040 Speaker 2: We've made a bunch of progress, especially in the senior ranks, 415 00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:17,240 Speaker 2: picendily not enough, and we continue to be focused on 416 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:19,320 Speaker 2: creating opportunities. But it's a long you know, to get 417 00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:21,600 Speaker 2: to the top of the funnel. It's a it's a long, 418 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:23,760 Speaker 2: long road. And you know the sample set. I remember 419 00:19:23,840 --> 00:19:26,920 Speaker 2: my training class, you know, it was it was ninety ten, 420 00:19:27,160 --> 00:19:29,119 Speaker 2: you know, men to you know, men to women, you know, 421 00:19:29,160 --> 00:19:29,920 Speaker 2: forty two years ago. 422 00:19:30,160 --> 00:19:32,240 Speaker 1: Many people who go to a place like Goldman say 423 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:33,639 Speaker 1: that if you want to rise up yet they have 424 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:35,880 Speaker 1: an MBA. But you don't have an MBA, And so 425 00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:37,359 Speaker 1: do you think it's necessary to get an MBA to 426 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:39,119 Speaker 1: rise up at Goldman or equivalent firms. 427 00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:42,120 Speaker 2: I think there was a period, you know, thirty years 428 00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:45,360 Speaker 2: ago where it really was, you know, the vast majority 429 00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:47,199 Speaker 2: of people that rose up in the organization did have 430 00:19:47,240 --> 00:19:49,920 Speaker 2: a business degree. I think that's changed, and the vast 431 00:19:49,920 --> 00:19:51,840 Speaker 2: majority of people that rise up in the organization do 432 00:19:51,920 --> 00:19:54,000 Speaker 2: not have a business degree. That doesn't mean that a 433 00:19:54,040 --> 00:19:56,760 Speaker 2: business degree is not a valuable is not a valuable thing, 434 00:19:58,040 --> 00:20:00,680 Speaker 2: but the you know, the world's changed. We can train 435 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:03,600 Speaker 2: and develop people, you know differently, and you know, real 436 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:05,520 Speaker 2: time experience is a valuable thing. And one of the 437 00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:08,400 Speaker 2: strategic things that the business schools did that I think 438 00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:10,800 Speaker 2: had an effect. If you go back to when I 439 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:12,760 Speaker 2: first started, you worked for two years and you went 440 00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:15,920 Speaker 2: to business school. The business schools went to a mode 441 00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:17,760 Speaker 2: where they really wanted people to get four to six 442 00:20:17,840 --> 00:20:20,760 Speaker 2: years or seven years of experience, and so they kind 443 00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:23,480 Speaker 2: of wound up with people went to business school more 444 00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:26,560 Speaker 2: to career change, not to career continue, because if you 445 00:20:26,560 --> 00:20:28,919 Speaker 2: were if you worked in finance for four or five years, 446 00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:31,560 Speaker 2: you had learned a whole bunch of things real time 447 00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:34,960 Speaker 2: on the job, where the value proposition you know, for 448 00:20:35,040 --> 00:20:36,960 Speaker 2: going to business school wasn't the same as it was 449 00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:38,080 Speaker 2: if you were only two years in. 450 00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:41,240 Speaker 1: And if somebody is watching here and you want to 451 00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:44,440 Speaker 1: summarize what you wish somebody would know about Goldman Sachs, 452 00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:45,240 Speaker 1: what would it be. 453 00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:48,440 Speaker 2: It's filled with extraordinary people that are just zealously focused 454 00:20:48,440 --> 00:20:50,800 Speaker 2: on doing the best we can to serve our clients, 455 00:20:51,359 --> 00:20:53,240 Speaker 2: to build trust, to take a long term view, to 456 00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:56,080 Speaker 2: do the right thing, and really have the most be 457 00:20:56,160 --> 00:20:59,359 Speaker 2: a part of and steward what I believe is the 458 00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:01,879 Speaker 2: most extraordinary, very financial institution in the world, and to 459 00:21:01,920 --> 00:21:04,400 Speaker 2: try to make it stronger, better than we found it. 460 00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:06,760 Speaker 1: And your biggest worry today about what's going on in 461 00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:09,240 Speaker 1: the world or the economy. Is there any one worry 462 00:21:09,280 --> 00:21:10,280 Speaker 1: you're worried about. 463 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:12,159 Speaker 2: Or there are always risks, There are always things to 464 00:21:12,160 --> 00:21:14,960 Speaker 2: worry about. We're constantly looking at our processes, looking at 465 00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:17,919 Speaker 2: our risk, thinking about what can go wrong. And the 466 00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:20,720 Speaker 2: reason for that is not because things aren't going to 467 00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:24,240 Speaker 2: go wrong. Things will go wrong. What defines a financial 468 00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:27,000 Speaker 2: institution when things go wrong is how the institution responds 469 00:21:27,000 --> 00:21:30,040 Speaker 2: to it. You know, we are zealously focused on that 470 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:32,919 Speaker 2: because I guarantee things will go wrong. They always do. 471 00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:38,000 Speaker 2: Environments change, bumps come. Risk is risk, and when you 472 00:21:38,040 --> 00:21:40,040 Speaker 2: take risk, you know you have periods of time when 473 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:41,840 Speaker 2: you lose money or it's hard to make money. And 474 00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:45,240 Speaker 2: what defines organizations is how they respond when things are tough, 475 00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:47,320 Speaker 2: not how they respond when things are easy. 476 00:21:47,440 --> 00:21:48,920 Speaker 1: Can you go out to dinner in New York without 477 00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:51,560 Speaker 1: somebody saying, here's a resume or here's a deal. 478 00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:56,600 Speaker 2: The greatest it's a privilege, and there's pleasure that comes 479 00:21:56,600 --> 00:22:00,360 Speaker 2: with it. The greatest privilege is stewarding this firm is 480 00:22:00,359 --> 00:22:02,359 Speaker 2: is the people that you get to work with that 481 00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:05,679 Speaker 2: the firm is filled with the most extraordinary people that 482 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:08,560 Speaker 2: work so incredibly hard. You know, day in and day 483 00:22:08,560 --> 00:22:12,439 Speaker 2: out to serve our clients. They're smart, they're motivated, and 484 00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:14,720 Speaker 2: it's it's it's incredible to work with them, to be 485 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:18,360 Speaker 2: with them, and then also our clients and the opportunity. 486 00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:20,640 Speaker 1: To particularly the private equity clients, the private. 487 00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 2: Equity clients, and it avouves the private equity clients. But 488 00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:26,720 Speaker 2: the I mean, it's just it's it's the most enjoyable 489 00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:29,800 Speaker 2: thing about the business is people and the ability to 490 00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:33,080 Speaker 2: to learn and to be with people and be motivated 491 00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:35,960 Speaker 2: by people and stimulated by people. It's it's it's really extraordinary. 492 00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:39,080 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to hear more of my interviews. You 493 00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:43,240 Speaker 1: can subscribe and download my podcast on Spotify, Apple, or 494 00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:44,040 Speaker 1: wherever you listen.