1 00:00:00,800 --> 00:00:05,039 Speaker 1: From the heart of where innovation, money and power collide 2 00:00:05,360 --> 00:00:10,640 Speaker 1: in Silicon Valley and beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with 3 00:00:10,800 --> 00:00:12,320 Speaker 1: Caroline Hyde and Ed. 4 00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:29,280 Speaker 2: Lovelow live from New York Home Caroline Hyde. 5 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:32,360 Speaker 3: And I'm Jackiet Devowls from San Francisco. This is Bloomberg 6 00:00:32,360 --> 00:00:33,559 Speaker 3: Technology coming up. 7 00:00:33,680 --> 00:00:37,120 Speaker 2: China retaliates with its own tariffs on the United States, 8 00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:40,680 Speaker 2: including a probean to Google plus Pallanteer sauce to a 9 00:00:40,760 --> 00:00:44,599 Speaker 2: new recorder's earning show. Untamed growth for its AI software 10 00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:47,559 Speaker 2: and Spotify shares also surged to a record offer its 11 00:00:47,560 --> 00:00:50,559 Speaker 2: first annual profit. And we start there with a markets 12 00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:53,199 Speaker 2: check amid all the record highs in earnings. Let's get 13 00:00:53,200 --> 00:00:55,400 Speaker 2: to it with the NAZAC currently making up for yesterday's 14 00:00:55,400 --> 00:00:57,480 Speaker 2: sell off. Jackie, we're currently up more than a percentage 15 00:00:57,480 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 2: point at the moment, and in terms of points contributed, 16 00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:02,600 Speaker 2: it's all about Palenteer. Move on and have a look 17 00:01:02,600 --> 00:01:04,880 Speaker 2: at what the fundamentals and certain businesses are doing to 18 00:01:04,959 --> 00:01:08,760 Speaker 2: this index. Valenteer up twenty six percent, a new record high. 19 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:12,280 Speaker 2: This as we see untamed organic growth. When it comes 20 00:01:12,319 --> 00:01:15,040 Speaker 2: to AI. They win on commercial, they win on government. 21 00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:16,920 Speaker 2: We'll get to it later in the show. Spotify also 22 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:19,520 Speaker 2: add a new record up almost ten percent as they 23 00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:23,000 Speaker 2: add to their growing monthly active users, and also the 24 00:01:23,040 --> 00:01:25,760 Speaker 2: first profit ever in terms of an annual profit. They're 25 00:01:25,760 --> 00:01:27,360 Speaker 2: going to continue that out for that up to two 26 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:29,280 Speaker 2: and a half percent. Look, they're coming with their earnings 27 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:31,959 Speaker 2: after the bell all lies on thirteen percent increase in revenue. 28 00:01:31,959 --> 00:01:33,039 Speaker 4: Will get to the earnings in a bit. 29 00:01:33,080 --> 00:01:37,520 Speaker 2: But this is also an anti trust investigation story from China. 30 00:01:38,080 --> 00:01:39,480 Speaker 4: This is we see China. 31 00:01:39,319 --> 00:01:43,080 Speaker 2: Retaliate to the tariff potential coming from the United States. 32 00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:46,119 Speaker 2: We anticipate a call between Shujimping and Trunk coming soon. 33 00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:49,600 Speaker 2: But let's delve into the tech implications. Bloembags Mike Shepherd 34 00:01:49,640 --> 00:01:53,160 Speaker 2: is with us in Washington, and look from a search perspective, 35 00:01:53,440 --> 00:01:56,120 Speaker 2: Google's not there in China, but Android. 36 00:01:55,680 --> 00:01:59,680 Speaker 5: Is, Android is, and Caro. You have to think of 37 00:01:59,720 --> 00:02:03,440 Speaker 5: this also in terms of symbolism as well. Shuchimping is 38 00:02:03,480 --> 00:02:07,720 Speaker 5: trying to send a signal to Washington that hey, I 39 00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:10,440 Speaker 5: can retaliate too and try to make it hurt by 40 00:02:10,520 --> 00:02:14,200 Speaker 5: targeting individual companies. So by going after Google with this 41 00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:17,000 Speaker 5: anti trust probe, Look, the search is not really a 42 00:02:17,000 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 5: factor in China, where it really hasn't been operating since 43 00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:24,799 Speaker 5: twenty ten, but the company does have some advertising, sales 44 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:28,120 Speaker 5: and engineering work done there. It does have three offices 45 00:02:28,120 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 5: in three different Chinese cities, so it's not a zero factor, 46 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:34,360 Speaker 5: but it is a signal that other US entities, perhaps 47 00:02:34,440 --> 00:02:38,640 Speaker 5: Apple and perhaps Intel. We saw the Financial Times reporting 48 00:02:38,960 --> 00:02:42,280 Speaker 5: that officials in Beijing were weighing whether to conduct a 49 00:02:42,360 --> 00:02:46,400 Speaker 5: fuller probe of Intel as well. And also, as you 50 00:02:46,440 --> 00:02:48,880 Speaker 5: and I have talked about before, there is the Nvidia 51 00:02:48,919 --> 00:02:52,880 Speaker 5: anti trust probe being conducted by officials in Beijing, and 52 00:02:52,960 --> 00:02:56,520 Speaker 5: this is over that long ago acquisition by Nvidia of Melanoch. 53 00:02:56,600 --> 00:02:58,720 Speaker 5: So they are trying to send a signal with this 54 00:02:58,800 --> 00:03:01,160 Speaker 5: Google anti trust probe as much as anything else. 55 00:03:02,120 --> 00:03:04,360 Speaker 3: Mike, as you mentioned, there's also an Nvidio probe, So 56 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:07,280 Speaker 3: this isn't the first time that Chi Jimpang is using 57 00:03:07,560 --> 00:03:11,280 Speaker 3: a probe like this to retaliate in the past, have 58 00:03:11,360 --> 00:03:14,560 Speaker 3: you seen it be an effective negotiating tool. 59 00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:16,600 Speaker 4: Well, we're going to. 60 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:20,000 Speaker 5: Find out now whether it works in real time with 61 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:24,400 Speaker 5: Donald Trump, because under the Biden administration it was one equation, 62 00:03:24,720 --> 00:03:27,040 Speaker 5: but under Donald Trump it's a very different one and 63 00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:31,639 Speaker 5: he may not be looking at this as such a 64 00:03:31,800 --> 00:03:36,600 Speaker 5: dangerous signal. Even after having met with Jensen Wang last week, 65 00:03:36,640 --> 00:03:40,560 Speaker 5: it may not be as big a concern. Really, what 66 00:03:40,600 --> 00:03:44,200 Speaker 5: we're looking for is the broader negotiation that is going 67 00:03:44,200 --> 00:03:46,840 Speaker 5: to happen in April. This is really just sort of 68 00:03:46,840 --> 00:03:50,480 Speaker 5: the opening round in the conversation between China and the 69 00:03:50,640 --> 00:03:54,600 Speaker 5: US on trade. The President has ordered US President has 70 00:03:54,720 --> 00:03:57,720 Speaker 5: ordered a review of the Phase one trade agreement that 71 00:03:57,760 --> 00:04:00,040 Speaker 5: he forged at the end of his first term, and 72 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:02,120 Speaker 5: we're going to hear more about that in April. So 73 00:04:02,160 --> 00:04:04,360 Speaker 5: this is just sort of the warm up act to 74 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 5: a bigger conversation. And remember Donald Trump has talked about 75 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:12,280 Speaker 5: imposing tariffs of up to sixty percent additional tariffs of 76 00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:15,400 Speaker 5: up to sixty percent on Chinese goods, and that would 77 00:04:15,440 --> 00:04:20,200 Speaker 5: really hurt Beijing, which is focusing on its exports to 78 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:23,200 Speaker 5: the rest of the world as a way of reviving 79 00:04:23,200 --> 00:04:24,920 Speaker 5: in domestic economy. 80 00:04:25,400 --> 00:04:29,400 Speaker 3: Bloomberg's Mike Shephard, thank you, and as Alpha that faces 81 00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:32,040 Speaker 3: a Chinese probe, the company is set to report results 82 00:04:32,080 --> 00:04:34,440 Speaker 3: today after the closing bell. For what we can expect, 83 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:37,800 Speaker 3: Bloomberg's Ryan les Stelica joins us Now. Ryan when it 84 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:41,120 Speaker 3: comes to Google, there's cloud, search and artificial intelligence as 85 00:04:41,120 --> 00:04:44,000 Speaker 3: of late, what's tep of mind for investors going into 86 00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:44,480 Speaker 3: this report? 87 00:04:45,800 --> 00:04:46,599 Speaker 4: Good afternoon. 88 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:49,120 Speaker 6: I would say that probably the cloud business is probably 89 00:04:49,160 --> 00:04:51,480 Speaker 6: what people are most curious about right now. We did 90 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:54,080 Speaker 6: get Microsoft results last week. There were sort of a 91 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:57,080 Speaker 6: mixed bag. They were growing a little bit slower than expected, 92 00:04:57,120 --> 00:05:00,280 Speaker 6: but that's partially due to some supply constraints. So, you know, 93 00:05:00,360 --> 00:05:02,800 Speaker 6: cloud has become increasingly important to alphabet and I think 94 00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:05,120 Speaker 6: people are curious to see what growth looks like there. 95 00:05:05,160 --> 00:05:07,240 Speaker 6: We also got Meta results last week which painted a 96 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:10,359 Speaker 6: pretty good picture of the market for online advertising, So 97 00:05:10,400 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 6: it seems kind of safe to assume that a Google 98 00:05:12,560 --> 00:05:14,720 Speaker 6: search will be at least pretty strong as well. 99 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:17,880 Speaker 2: Any response to deep seat mentioned, do you think. 100 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:21,200 Speaker 6: Ron, I'm sure they'll address it. It's a sort of 101 00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:24,599 Speaker 6: an interesting position with respected deep seek. If you know, 102 00:05:24,600 --> 00:05:26,560 Speaker 6: they do find a way to make their own AI 103 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:29,200 Speaker 6: model more efficient, more cost effective, that's probably going to 104 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:30,920 Speaker 6: be great for the stock. It's probably going to be, 105 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:32,960 Speaker 6: you know, something that's cheered on Wall Street. But it 106 00:05:32,960 --> 00:05:35,160 Speaker 6: seems like so far, while it did see a little 107 00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:37,800 Speaker 6: bit of volatility last week when the you know, the 108 00:05:37,839 --> 00:05:40,240 Speaker 6: big sell off happened and impacted everyone in tech. It's 109 00:05:40,279 --> 00:05:41,840 Speaker 6: really come back strongly since then. 110 00:05:41,880 --> 00:05:43,360 Speaker 4: It's trading at a record right now. 111 00:05:43,400 --> 00:05:45,840 Speaker 6: It's been able to brush off a lot of issues 112 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:47,719 Speaker 6: that you think would take down a stock like this, 113 00:05:47,839 --> 00:05:51,840 Speaker 6: not only the regulatory and antirut trust stuff out of China, 114 00:05:51,880 --> 00:05:53,240 Speaker 6: but also here in the United States. 115 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:55,800 Speaker 2: I like that you note that shares are at a 116 00:05:55,839 --> 00:05:58,640 Speaker 2: record high round less selica. We thank you. You got MD 117 00:05:58,760 --> 00:06:00,400 Speaker 2: after the bell as well. There's a lot to get 118 00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:03,520 Speaker 2: to from more market perspective. Let's bring in Fiona Scottish, 119 00:06:03,520 --> 00:06:05,799 Speaker 2: a senior analysta City Index Financial Markets. 120 00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:07,279 Speaker 4: Let's just stick with earnings. 121 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:08,960 Speaker 2: For a moment, because've got record high as a bound 122 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:10,920 Speaker 2: on the back of certain earnings today, and we look 123 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 2: towards Alphabet and AMD. What are you looking to in 124 00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:15,960 Speaker 2: terms of generative AI sort being a winning formula for 125 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:16,839 Speaker 2: these companies or not. 126 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:25,720 Speaker 7: I'm continue to way I think we have. 127 00:06:25,720 --> 00:06:27,720 Speaker 2: A technical issue there. We're just going to bring her 128 00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:29,839 Speaker 2: volumes up a little bit more for you. So we 129 00:06:29,920 --> 00:06:32,400 Speaker 2: spend just a moment just anticipating what Fiona is going 130 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:35,080 Speaker 2: to be delving into in terms of generative AI. The 131 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:37,680 Speaker 2: focus on Alphabet whether or not AMD can steal any 132 00:06:37,680 --> 00:06:39,479 Speaker 2: of the market share from in video in terms of 133 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:42,400 Speaker 2: its offering to data centers and servers, and Jackie, I 134 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:44,479 Speaker 2: think we can also be anticipating what all of the 135 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:49,320 Speaker 2: trade tariffs and geopolitical anxiety is currently having on the markets. 136 00:06:49,480 --> 00:06:51,120 Speaker 2: Let's go back to Fiona, now, I think we fix 137 00:06:51,200 --> 00:06:55,080 Speaker 2: your technical issues, just talk about earnings and fundamentals first. 138 00:06:56,200 --> 00:06:56,920 Speaker 8: Yes, that's right. 139 00:06:56,960 --> 00:06:58,719 Speaker 7: You know, I think AI is still going to be 140 00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:01,200 Speaker 7: very much and it is still very much are focus 141 00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:04,000 Speaker 7: as far as earnings are concerned. You know, we know 142 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:07,840 Speaker 7: that the investors are still looking to see whether these 143 00:07:08,000 --> 00:07:12,680 Speaker 7: huge investments that we've seen are going to be bringing returns, 144 00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:15,160 Speaker 7: are going to be bringing in new revenue streams and 145 00:07:15,240 --> 00:07:17,640 Speaker 7: stronger revenue streams, and that I think is what's sort 146 00:07:17,640 --> 00:07:21,360 Speaker 7: of helping to keep these stocks at these record levels. 147 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:24,920 Speaker 7: There is still a lot of optimism surrounding what the AI, 148 00:07:25,720 --> 00:07:27,880 Speaker 7: what AI can do for these stocks, and you know 149 00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:32,560 Speaker 7: the prospect of potentially those costs coming down in the future. Again, 150 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:35,520 Speaker 7: I think that's a positive as far as users of 151 00:07:35,560 --> 00:07:36,840 Speaker 7: AI can be concerned. 152 00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:40,320 Speaker 3: Fiona, I'm curious if there's a divergence between some of 153 00:07:40,320 --> 00:07:43,240 Speaker 3: the software names and hardware names, especially as we're seeing 154 00:07:43,480 --> 00:07:46,200 Speaker 3: geopolitical tensions play out in the forum of tariffs, that 155 00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:48,960 Speaker 3: could take a bigger hit to chip makers for example. 156 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:52,160 Speaker 7: Yes, you know, it's a really good point, and we 157 00:07:52,280 --> 00:07:54,880 Speaker 7: have been noticing that, and I think that's something that's 158 00:07:54,880 --> 00:07:57,679 Speaker 7: going to be very much forefront as we get through 159 00:07:57,720 --> 00:08:00,880 Speaker 7: these earnings as well. Is you know, what is the 160 00:08:00,920 --> 00:08:04,120 Speaker 7: outlook as far as some of those chip stocks are concerned. 161 00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:09,640 Speaker 7: What is the prospect of exports and tariffs being placed 162 00:08:09,680 --> 00:08:14,720 Speaker 7: on them, export limitations which could make the outlook for 163 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:18,560 Speaker 7: those chip socks a little bit more complicated them. Whereas 164 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 7: the sort of more software firms, I think they have 165 00:08:20,680 --> 00:08:23,440 Speaker 7: the potential to have a little bit more freedom as 166 00:08:23,520 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 7: far as their outlook is concerned, and potentially could benefit 167 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:33,360 Speaker 7: from the outlook even as we see trade tariff's discussions 168 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:34,400 Speaker 7: in the market. 169 00:08:35,120 --> 00:08:37,320 Speaker 3: One of the things I'm curious about is in this 170 00:08:37,440 --> 00:08:40,240 Speaker 3: new administration, many think that it's going to be pretty 171 00:08:40,600 --> 00:08:42,720 Speaker 3: friendly when it comes to the Federal Trade Commission. What 172 00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:45,439 Speaker 3: do you think that bodes for technology? 173 00:08:45,880 --> 00:08:48,240 Speaker 7: Yeah, you know, if we do have a sense that 174 00:08:48,280 --> 00:08:51,800 Speaker 7: they're sort of reduced regulation, we know that that could 175 00:08:51,800 --> 00:08:55,040 Speaker 7: be really beneficial for technology, and I think it's a 176 00:08:55,080 --> 00:08:58,640 Speaker 7: really interesting idea, especially when we're considering, you know, what 177 00:08:59,160 --> 00:09:02,960 Speaker 7: regulation there might have been with regards to big tech, 178 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:06,240 Speaker 7: what regulation they could be with regards to this idea 179 00:09:06,400 --> 00:09:09,200 Speaker 7: of AI as well. I think still very much an 180 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 7: open subject of where regulation may have been, but the 181 00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:15,560 Speaker 7: fact that we could be looking at a future at 182 00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:19,760 Speaker 7: least for the next few years of decreased regulation is 183 00:09:19,800 --> 00:09:23,599 Speaker 7: definitely a positive for many stocks in the tech area, 184 00:09:23,679 --> 00:09:26,240 Speaker 7: but also could be outside of the tech area as well. 185 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:27,200 Speaker 4: What are the. 186 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:29,679 Speaker 2: Names fear and that you've been fielding the most cause on. 187 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:33,960 Speaker 7: Oh, that's a good one, you know. I think obviously 188 00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:39,120 Speaker 7: Navidia and Vidia has been hugely in focus because of 189 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 7: those levels of volatility that we've had. We've also seen 190 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:47,080 Speaker 7: Tesla has always been very popular among our clients as well, 191 00:09:47,120 --> 00:09:50,440 Speaker 7: But heading towards this week, Amazon and Alphabet are the 192 00:09:50,520 --> 00:09:52,920 Speaker 7: names that have been up there with our clients. You know, 193 00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:56,240 Speaker 7: we do see this big focus on the Magnificent seven 194 00:09:56,400 --> 00:09:59,880 Speaker 7: and their ability to be able to sort of continue 195 00:10:00,160 --> 00:10:02,160 Speaker 7: impressing the market with their numbers. 196 00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:05,240 Speaker 2: And how do you think the investor base has come 197 00:10:05,240 --> 00:10:08,240 Speaker 2: out in terms of yes, please spend all costs. 198 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:09,400 Speaker 4: This is a rush, this is a war. 199 00:10:09,800 --> 00:10:12,320 Speaker 2: Or on the other side, hold on do we need 200 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:14,560 Speaker 2: this sort of level of data center investment right now? 201 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 4: Where are they falling? 202 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:20,600 Speaker 2: Is to that sort of ultimate dichotomy we see faced 203 00:10:20,600 --> 00:10:21,120 Speaker 2: in the market. 204 00:10:22,120 --> 00:10:24,040 Speaker 7: Yeah, I think you know that when we did see 205 00:10:24,080 --> 00:10:27,360 Speaker 7: that sort of release last week from deep Seek, that 206 00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:30,800 Speaker 7: did just sort of raise questions of disruption and raise 207 00:10:30,880 --> 00:10:34,120 Speaker 7: those questions over the amount of spending which had been 208 00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:37,680 Speaker 7: lingering anyway. But I think at the moment so far, 209 00:10:37,760 --> 00:10:40,720 Speaker 7: and what we've seen from earning seasons so far, from 210 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:43,760 Speaker 7: the calls that we've listened to, it does seem to 211 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:47,319 Speaker 7: be that sense that AKA for now, this still seems 212 00:10:47,360 --> 00:10:50,559 Speaker 7: like an idea that spending in AI, investing in AI 213 00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:53,000 Speaker 7: is still the way to go. There's still plenty of 214 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:55,560 Speaker 7: opportunity out there. I still think we're very much at 215 00:10:55,600 --> 00:10:59,160 Speaker 7: the cusp of understanding what this AI revolution could mean 216 00:10:59,240 --> 00:11:02,120 Speaker 7: for these stock So I think at the moment we're 217 00:11:02,160 --> 00:11:04,720 Speaker 7: just still on that side. I think what the concern 218 00:11:04,800 --> 00:11:07,160 Speaker 7: would be is actually, when we get a little bit 219 00:11:07,280 --> 00:11:09,800 Speaker 7: further down the line and we're not seeing a return 220 00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:13,000 Speaker 7: on those investments, that's when we're going to start potentially 221 00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:16,160 Speaker 7: to see this unraveling, but up to now that hasn't 222 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:16,720 Speaker 7: been the case. 223 00:11:17,640 --> 00:11:19,920 Speaker 3: Fear Now I'm curious, but now that you mentioned kind 224 00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:23,640 Speaker 3: of perhaps companies getting a bit more leeway, especially as 225 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:27,600 Speaker 3: you have President tramp really amping up this idea of 226 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:30,960 Speaker 3: the EI race national competitiveness. How long do you think 227 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:34,400 Speaker 3: investors will give companies to see whether those investments are 228 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:35,320 Speaker 3: actually panning out. 229 00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:38,640 Speaker 7: Yeah, that's a really good question. Yeah, because I think 230 00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:40,760 Speaker 7: this the whole sort of what we've seen over the 231 00:11:40,840 --> 00:11:43,200 Speaker 7: last couple of weeks, the last week particular with this 232 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:47,760 Speaker 7: deep Seek unveiling is sort of that question of innovation, 233 00:11:48,480 --> 00:11:51,520 Speaker 7: is that question of you know what's next? How far 234 00:11:51,600 --> 00:11:55,679 Speaker 7: can this go? And so you know, investors are curious, 235 00:11:55,800 --> 00:11:59,120 Speaker 7: they are optimistic, but they're not going to have an 236 00:11:59,120 --> 00:12:03,000 Speaker 7: everlasting patients. Obviously we've seen from Matter, I mean, they 237 00:12:03,040 --> 00:12:06,880 Speaker 7: were a good example to use from last week's earnings, 238 00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:10,680 Speaker 7: where we've seen sort of really encouraging outlook and numbers, 239 00:12:10,679 --> 00:12:14,480 Speaker 7: and then obviously we've seen Microsoft wasn't so well received. 240 00:12:14,520 --> 00:12:17,440 Speaker 7: So there is sort of this sense that the investors 241 00:12:17,440 --> 00:12:22,200 Speaker 7: do want to see some optimism into the future. But 242 00:12:22,240 --> 00:12:25,520 Speaker 7: I do think that as we head towards the middle 243 00:12:25,520 --> 00:12:27,240 Speaker 7: and the end of twenty twenty five, and I think 244 00:12:27,280 --> 00:12:28,920 Speaker 7: that's when we're going to really need to start to 245 00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:32,680 Speaker 7: see these numbers coming through into stronger revenue streams still 246 00:12:32,840 --> 00:12:33,880 Speaker 7: and profit margins. 247 00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:37,360 Speaker 3: The honest and kard a senior analyst of City Index 248 00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:38,800 Speaker 3: Financial Markets, thank you. 249 00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:39,959 Speaker 4: Coming up. 250 00:12:40,080 --> 00:12:43,240 Speaker 3: Shares of Spotify and Puenteer surge to new records on 251 00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:44,120 Speaker 3: strong earnings. 252 00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:46,760 Speaker 4: More on that. Next, this is Bloomberg. 253 00:12:56,120 --> 00:12:58,719 Speaker 2: Shares of Spotify jumping to a new record as the 254 00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:01,559 Speaker 2: music streaming company posted another quolta better than expect to 255 00:13:01,600 --> 00:13:04,160 Speaker 2: subswabic growth. And so first I have an annual profit 256 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:07,120 Speaker 2: from all openubg's actually common joins us now and more 257 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:09,920 Speaker 2: than a billion delivered in terms of euros that managed 258 00:13:10,040 --> 00:13:11,080 Speaker 2: to control called stag grow. 259 00:13:11,720 --> 00:13:15,400 Speaker 9: Yes, last year was really a story of unfortunately lots 260 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:18,000 Speaker 9: of layoffs at Spotify. They really cut back on their 261 00:13:18,040 --> 00:13:20,959 Speaker 9: podcast spending. And then this year, so I guess actually 262 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:23,040 Speaker 9: twenty twenty four, that was twenty twenty three, twenty twenty 263 00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:26,840 Speaker 9: four was the year of new products, really doubling down 264 00:13:26,920 --> 00:13:30,079 Speaker 9: on these video creators. They say now they're going to 265 00:13:30,120 --> 00:13:33,080 Speaker 9: be focusing more on the music business. So they've they've 266 00:13:33,120 --> 00:13:34,760 Speaker 9: definitely turned a corner. 267 00:13:36,040 --> 00:13:38,440 Speaker 4: Ashley. I'm a huge fan of audio books. 268 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:40,560 Speaker 3: And historically this has kind of been a drag on 269 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:43,440 Speaker 3: margins for Spotify. What did the companies say about its 270 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:45,560 Speaker 3: growth prospects in this particular segment. 271 00:13:46,120 --> 00:13:50,240 Speaker 9: So really, podcasts were what investors were really worried about 272 00:13:50,240 --> 00:13:53,479 Speaker 9: when it came to their margins. So they introduced audiobooks 273 00:13:53,840 --> 00:13:58,000 Speaker 9: back in twenty twenty three, and so far, I mean, 274 00:13:58,040 --> 00:14:01,280 Speaker 9: the company is basically positioning it as they have this profit. 275 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:03,720 Speaker 9: Now they had their full year of profit, they're able 276 00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:09,559 Speaker 9: to reinvest in new verticals like audiobooks, like these video creators. 277 00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:11,680 Speaker 9: They did say on their earnings call today that there's 278 00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:13,560 Speaker 9: going to be a little bit of variability when it 279 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 9: comes to their gross margin moving forward. But again I 280 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:18,720 Speaker 9: think they're sort of couching it as well. We showed 281 00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:21,120 Speaker 9: you guys we could do really well. We do need 282 00:14:21,160 --> 00:14:24,240 Speaker 9: to start innovating again and really putting out new products. 283 00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:30,560 Speaker 3: Bloomberg's Ashley Carmen, thank you. Another earning story, Palenteer stock 284 00:14:30,640 --> 00:14:33,480 Speaker 3: surging to a record after it posted a full year 285 00:14:33,560 --> 00:14:37,040 Speaker 3: revenue forecast that exceeded analyst estimates, driven by a quote 286 00:14:37,160 --> 00:14:41,359 Speaker 3: untamed AI Demand CEO Alex Karp said this on yesterday's 287 00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:41,960 Speaker 3: earnings call. 288 00:14:43,440 --> 00:14:46,080 Speaker 10: We are at the way beginning of our trajectory. We 289 00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:49,280 Speaker 10: are at the way beginning of revolution, and we plan 290 00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:52,560 Speaker 10: to be a cornerstone if not the cornerstone company and 291 00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:56,000 Speaker 10: driving this revolution in the US over the next three 292 00:14:56,000 --> 00:14:57,160 Speaker 10: to five years. 293 00:14:58,760 --> 00:15:01,880 Speaker 3: For more impalentail Gil I'm managing partner at DA Davidson 294 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:03,800 Speaker 3: joins us now. He has a neutral rating on the 295 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:05,760 Speaker 3: stock with a price target of one hundred and five 296 00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:09,480 Speaker 3: dollars gil. Alex Karp called this a revolution. He made 297 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:12,520 Speaker 3: clear that the company is poised to benefit as global 298 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:16,640 Speaker 3: conflict rises, especially with China. But they also touted its 299 00:15:16,680 --> 00:15:19,040 Speaker 3: commercial business on its call and in its letter. What 300 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:21,720 Speaker 3: do you make of that segment and are you confident 301 00:15:21,760 --> 00:15:22,840 Speaker 3: in its growth prospects? 302 00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:28,760 Speaker 11: Yeah, the commercial segment is doing phenomenally well because Palenteer 303 00:15:29,400 --> 00:15:32,960 Speaker 11: is addressing the need in the market. There's a deep 304 00:15:33,040 --> 00:15:37,400 Speaker 11: need in the market for implementing AI solutions that can 305 00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:42,840 Speaker 11: add insight and decision making support. And Palenteer has a 306 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:46,600 Speaker 11: combination of an existing set of products that they've developed 307 00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:49,560 Speaker 11: over the years, as well as a very strong professional 308 00:15:49,640 --> 00:15:54,000 Speaker 11: services group. That can help companies implement AI solutions quickly. 309 00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:58,200 Speaker 11: They're uniquely positioned to do that, and they're really riding 310 00:15:58,240 --> 00:15:59,440 Speaker 11: the AI wave right now. 311 00:15:59,520 --> 00:16:02,760 Speaker 2: So does that vindicate a price to earnings ratio of 312 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:05,800 Speaker 2: four a price versus future earnings that is currently training 313 00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:08,800 Speaker 2: at almost two hundred times. This is a phenomenal valuation. 314 00:16:10,680 --> 00:16:15,720 Speaker 11: Yes, it is. It's orders of magnitude higher than comparable companies. 315 00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:17,880 Speaker 11: But the reality is that right now, there is no 316 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:23,400 Speaker 11: comparable company. Polunteer is the only company at this size 317 00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:26,360 Speaker 11: that is not only going to grow more than thirty percent, 318 00:16:26,560 --> 00:16:29,840 Speaker 11: it's doing so as it accelerates growth. I mean, the 319 00:16:29,880 --> 00:16:33,760 Speaker 11: rest of the software complex it has seen decelerating growth, 320 00:16:34,080 --> 00:16:37,400 Speaker 11: and very few companies at this size can even approach 321 00:16:37,440 --> 00:16:38,160 Speaker 11: thirty percent. 322 00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:40,520 Speaker 2: Let's just talk about that growth though, because if you 323 00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:43,440 Speaker 2: go back to twenty twenty two and we heard from 324 00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:46,840 Speaker 2: William Blair, analyst talking about this, he made a commitment 325 00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:49,000 Speaker 2: to bringing in about four and a half billion in 326 00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:51,800 Speaker 2: terms of revenue, So actually he's undershot that. Are you 327 00:16:51,880 --> 00:16:55,120 Speaker 2: worried about the undershooting of a three year target. 328 00:16:54,800 --> 00:17:00,200 Speaker 11: Here right now? Because again, on the commercial side, they 329 00:17:00,200 --> 00:17:03,600 Speaker 11: have a tremendous amount of momentum with enterprise customers that 330 00:17:03,680 --> 00:17:07,600 Speaker 11: want AI solutions quickly going to Poundteer to do that. 331 00:17:07,920 --> 00:17:11,240 Speaker 11: And then on the government side, they're having great success 332 00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:15,080 Speaker 11: with Department of Defense, which is likely to continue under 333 00:17:15,119 --> 00:17:19,560 Speaker 11: this administration given the focus on digital, given the focus 334 00:17:20,119 --> 00:17:24,760 Speaker 11: the proximity of people Impounteer to this administration. And then 335 00:17:24,760 --> 00:17:28,760 Speaker 11: they also have really big wins in the UK National 336 00:17:28,800 --> 00:17:31,359 Speaker 11: Health Services that drove a lot of the growth this 337 00:17:31,520 --> 00:17:35,080 Speaker 11: quarter as well. So they're hitting on all cylinders right now. 338 00:17:35,400 --> 00:17:38,200 Speaker 11: They have a ramp to continue to grow at these 339 00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:41,520 Speaker 11: rates even if they didn't reach some of those ambitious 340 00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:42,800 Speaker 11: goals they've set in the past. 341 00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:47,200 Speaker 3: Potentially one of those ramps could be Elon Musk's Department 342 00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:49,880 Speaker 3: of Government Efficiency, which came up on last night's call. 343 00:17:49,960 --> 00:17:53,040 Speaker 3: I'm curious if that is factoring into how you're thinking 344 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:53,800 Speaker 3: about the stock. 345 00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:59,240 Speaker 11: It does, because the government is running a lot of 346 00:17:59,280 --> 00:18:03,880 Speaker 11: outdated software that was developed sometimes in the eighties or nineties, 347 00:18:04,359 --> 00:18:08,399 Speaker 11: with code that can only be maintained by people that 348 00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:11,800 Speaker 11: are retiring. There's a huge need to update all the 349 00:18:11,880 --> 00:18:16,119 Speaker 11: software code in the government and again especially in units 350 00:18:16,119 --> 00:18:18,840 Speaker 11: of the Department of Defense. And this is what Palndteer 351 00:18:18,840 --> 00:18:21,679 Speaker 11: has been focused on for more than twenty years. So 352 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:24,040 Speaker 11: with a little bit more of a sense of urgency 353 00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:27,080 Speaker 11: from the government, pound Tier is very well positioned to 354 00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:30,639 Speaker 11: get a lot more of that business, again extending the 355 00:18:30,760 --> 00:18:35,160 Speaker 11: ramp in the government sector, where where previously maybe they 356 00:18:35,160 --> 00:18:38,520 Speaker 11: were still fighting for turf. Now they have a much 357 00:18:39,160 --> 00:18:42,600 Speaker 11: straight line, much more straight line towards getting that progress. 358 00:18:42,920 --> 00:18:46,480 Speaker 2: But international growth, gil that's going to be hit if 359 00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:50,439 Speaker 2: we do see geopolitical tensions and they are seeming to 360 00:18:50,720 --> 00:18:54,119 Speaker 2: lose that sort of growth trajectory in an international sales perspective. 361 00:18:55,240 --> 00:18:58,359 Speaker 11: That's right outside of the US and the UK, they're 362 00:18:58,359 --> 00:19:01,239 Speaker 11: having challenges in Europe, and part of it is the 363 00:19:01,280 --> 00:19:06,040 Speaker 11: political identity. This company is a mission driven company. They 364 00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:10,000 Speaker 11: state very clearly that they're there to defend Western civilization 365 00:19:10,640 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 11: and especially the United States and putting America first, which 366 00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:18,000 Speaker 11: again fits very well with this administration in the US, 367 00:19:18,320 --> 00:19:21,439 Speaker 11: but in Europe that rubs some people the wrong way. 368 00:19:21,760 --> 00:19:24,679 Speaker 11: They don't necessarily see that mission as a reason to 369 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:29,480 Speaker 11: buy software, and that's where polunteers not doing as well. Now. 370 00:19:29,800 --> 00:19:33,640 Speaker 11: There are some political landscape shifts in Europe and we'll 371 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:34,760 Speaker 11: see how those play out. 372 00:19:35,080 --> 00:19:39,640 Speaker 2: And getting real time messages from hedge Fund Telemetry, for example, 373 00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:43,560 Speaker 2: really questioning the market capitalization here, Gil, you talked about 374 00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:48,359 Speaker 2: why it's vindicated, it's unique offering, but just tell us 375 00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:50,560 Speaker 2: about your price point, because it's actually where the price 376 00:19:50,640 --> 00:19:52,679 Speaker 2: is currently for the stock. Would you upgrade it? 377 00:19:54,600 --> 00:19:58,440 Speaker 11: We prefer other companies that have similar growth trajectories and 378 00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:02,680 Speaker 11: similar ramps. Specifically, in this case, Snowflake and Data Dog 379 00:20:03,040 --> 00:20:06,800 Speaker 11: will also ride the AI wave in their own way, 380 00:20:07,119 --> 00:20:09,239 Speaker 11: and they're trading at a fraction of the multiple. So 381 00:20:09,680 --> 00:20:14,160 Speaker 11: if palteers trading at seventy times revenue and one hundred 382 00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:18,159 Speaker 11: and seventy times cash flow, Snowflake and Data Dog are 383 00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:22,760 Speaker 11: trading more like fifteen times revenue and fifty times cash flow, 384 00:20:22,960 --> 00:20:27,480 Speaker 11: which are much more palatable valuations, and that's why those 385 00:20:27,480 --> 00:20:29,159 Speaker 11: are our by ratings in this sector. 386 00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:31,600 Speaker 2: Iilllaria, It's great to catch up with you. Thank you, 387 00:20:31,640 --> 00:20:42,000 Speaker 2: Da Davison. It's time now for talking tech. First up 388 00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:45,520 Speaker 2: salesforce cutting jobs at its latest fiscal year gets underway, 389 00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:47,560 Speaker 2: according to a source who says in fat more than 390 00:20:47,560 --> 00:20:49,959 Speaker 2: a thousand roles will be affected. This comes even as 391 00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:54,040 Speaker 2: the company is simultaneously hiring workers to sell new AI products. 392 00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:57,480 Speaker 2: Plus Grab check out the shares jumping on the back 393 00:20:57,480 --> 00:20:59,320 Speaker 2: of the news that it is weighing a takeover of 394 00:20:59,400 --> 00:21:02,159 Speaker 2: rival Goat at evaluation more than seven billion dollars. The 395 00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:05,120 Speaker 2: firms are the two biggest white hailing providers in Southeast 396 00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:07,800 Speaker 2: Asia and have held on and off talks for years, 397 00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:11,840 Speaker 2: and shares of German Chipmaker and Finian also surging, this 398 00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:14,000 Speaker 2: time the most in nine months, after the company's forecast 399 00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:17,600 Speaker 2: revenue beat analyst expectations. A bright spot in an industry 400 00:21:17,600 --> 00:21:20,840 Speaker 2: that's been grappling with long standing slump, a situation which 401 00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:24,320 Speaker 2: would not be held though by tariffs, says the company CFO. 402 00:21:25,480 --> 00:21:29,639 Speaker 12: A major escalation of the tariffs is not included in 403 00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:34,919 Speaker 12: our guidance because we still are not giving up in 404 00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:38,600 Speaker 12: advocating for free trade. We do not see that as 405 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:42,520 Speaker 12: positive for the industry, so an escalation of tariffs and 406 00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:44,920 Speaker 12: counter tariffs would be negative. 407 00:21:52,840 --> 00:21:55,280 Speaker 2: Welcome back to Bloomberg Technology. I'm Caroline Hyde in New 408 00:21:55,320 --> 00:21:56,280 Speaker 2: York and. 409 00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:57,960 Speaker 3: I'm Jackie Devalas in San Francisco. 410 00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:00,840 Speaker 2: Quick check on these markets, Jackie, because for making up 411 00:22:00,840 --> 00:22:02,680 Speaker 2: for yesterday's sell off, we're up more than one point 412 00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:05,600 Speaker 2: three percent on the NASDAK Big points contribution coming from 413 00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:07,760 Speaker 2: the likes of Nvidia, from Alphabet that has numbers after 414 00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:10,879 Speaker 2: the bell, but also from Pallenteer that had its numbers 415 00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:11,760 Speaker 2: off the bell yesterday. 416 00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:14,080 Speaker 4: Boy, we are riding high. We are new record high. 417 00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:16,840 Speaker 2: Let's moving on to Palenteer that currently jumps twenty six percent. 418 00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:20,240 Speaker 2: The valuation is absolutely extraordinarily on this software stop as 419 00:22:20,240 --> 00:22:24,800 Speaker 2: we're hearing from key Da Davison analysts saying, look, look, ultimately, 420 00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:27,360 Speaker 2: this is a unique story in software, and they continue 421 00:22:27,359 --> 00:22:29,920 Speaker 2: to outperform. We've got government contracts, we've got commercial contracts. 422 00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:32,800 Speaker 2: It's all about the US in this age of geopolitical risk. 423 00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:34,640 Speaker 2: But Jackie, we're looking at plenty more. 424 00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:41,240 Speaker 3: Elon Musk's government takeover has been swift and chaotic. Bloomberg's 425 00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:43,439 Speaker 3: Kirt Wagner rates in today's Tech news letter that just 426 00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:45,840 Speaker 3: in two short weeks, Musk has become a bit of 427 00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:47,760 Speaker 3: a human wrecking ball in Washington. 428 00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:51,080 Speaker 4: He joins us now for more, Kurt, you rate that 429 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:55,200 Speaker 4: this isn't a movie that we haven't seen before. Could 430 00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:55,760 Speaker 4: you walk us through? 431 00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:58,399 Speaker 3: Perhaps the difference is between how Elon Musk is running 432 00:22:58,600 --> 00:23:01,840 Speaker 3: Doze right now versus his previous takeover of Twitter. 433 00:23:03,000 --> 00:23:05,280 Speaker 13: Yeah, Well, the number of similarities is going to be 434 00:23:05,359 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 13: a lot longer, I think than the number of differences. 435 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:10,200 Speaker 13: I think anybody familiar with that Twitter takeover is seeing 436 00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:13,320 Speaker 13: a very familiar playbook play out right here. Right, it's 437 00:23:14,119 --> 00:23:17,680 Speaker 13: you know, showing up cutting off access for people offering 438 00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:21,119 Speaker 13: buyouts with literally the same language in the email that 439 00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:24,440 Speaker 13: he's given people kind of bullying his way into these systems, right, 440 00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:27,080 Speaker 13: and anybody who tries to get in his way is 441 00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:28,560 Speaker 13: you know, suddenly showing up on leave. 442 00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:30,600 Speaker 8: And in Twitter's case, it was it was being fired. 443 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:33,480 Speaker 13: And so I think the biggest difference here, and what 444 00:23:33,520 --> 00:23:35,560 Speaker 13: I wanted to really hammer home in the in this 445 00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:39,119 Speaker 13: morning's Tech newsletter, is that, you know, with Twitter, he 446 00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:41,600 Speaker 13: was doing this with a privately held company that he 447 00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:43,520 Speaker 13: bought with private money. 448 00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:45,120 Speaker 8: Right, this is the US government. 449 00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:48,240 Speaker 13: This is the ramifications of what he's doing to cut 450 00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:50,480 Speaker 13: the government is going to affect all of us as 451 00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:51,359 Speaker 13: citizens here. 452 00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:54,000 Speaker 8: And it doesn't necessarily strike me. 453 00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:56,600 Speaker 13: As well that the the tactics are the same. 454 00:23:56,920 --> 00:24:00,200 Speaker 8: The you know, stakes are much higher here, I think. 455 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:02,560 Speaker 4: They are, but some people like it. 456 00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:06,240 Speaker 2: Kurt look Palenteer, the CTO, was on the call saying 457 00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:08,960 Speaker 2: that Palenti's real competition is a lack of accountability, and 458 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:11,120 Speaker 2: in fact, they think Dog is going to bring meritocracy, 459 00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:14,400 Speaker 2: It's going to bring transparency to government. So even though 460 00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:16,840 Speaker 2: it is this sort of wrecking ball, could it have 461 00:24:17,320 --> 00:24:19,000 Speaker 2: positive impacts for companies here? 462 00:24:19,920 --> 00:24:20,120 Speaker 8: Yeah? 463 00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:22,480 Speaker 13: So, I think in much the same way you know 464 00:24:22,600 --> 00:24:25,399 Speaker 13: he succeeded in cutting costs at Twitter, I have no 465 00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:27,639 Speaker 13: doubt that he will cut costs at the US government 466 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:30,560 Speaker 13: and find things that quite frankly, all of us would 467 00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:33,080 Speaker 13: be scratching our head saying, wait, we were paying for 468 00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:35,320 Speaker 13: what we were spending X number of millions on? 469 00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:35,440 Speaker 5: What? 470 00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:35,800 Speaker 4: Right? 471 00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:37,919 Speaker 13: I have no doubt that those things exist and that 472 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:41,480 Speaker 13: they will hopefully be uncovered. But I also think that 473 00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:44,119 Speaker 13: there are probably a lot more thoughtful ways to go 474 00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:46,320 Speaker 13: about doing this. I think the thing we know from Elon, 475 00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:49,239 Speaker 13: over covering him for years and watching him with all 476 00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:51,920 Speaker 13: his companies as he tends to you know, not worry 477 00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:54,679 Speaker 13: about the collateral damage, right, he just simply says, the 478 00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:56,600 Speaker 13: goal is to cut costs, we will do whatever it 479 00:24:56,640 --> 00:24:58,639 Speaker 13: takes to get there, and you know everything else that 480 00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:01,720 Speaker 13: happens as a side effect, well, those side effects, I 481 00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:04,199 Speaker 13: think at a at a national scale could just be 482 00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:07,560 Speaker 13: really significant, and so for me, I would prefer to 483 00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:10,320 Speaker 13: see someone who's you know, maybe moving a little slower, 484 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:13,160 Speaker 13: you know, to try and make sure that we don't 485 00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:15,399 Speaker 13: have any of these downstream effects that we've seen at 486 00:25:15,400 --> 00:25:17,119 Speaker 13: some of his companies when he moves this quickly. 487 00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:21,000 Speaker 2: Cole Wagner, thanks so much, and do check out, of course, 488 00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:24,280 Speaker 2: the Tech in Depth newsletter from Bloomberg's journalists around the world. 489 00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:27,679 Speaker 2: You can subscribe on bloombg dot com slash newsletters. But 490 00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:29,560 Speaker 2: let's keep this conversation going when it comes to do 491 00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:32,280 Speaker 2: Jennifer Perlker's with our senior fellow at the Nishkin and 492 00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:36,399 Speaker 2: Center and former President Mark Balmer's deputy chief technology officer. 493 00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:39,840 Speaker 2: And interestingly, you just recently co authored a report providing 494 00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:44,800 Speaker 2: perhaps a roadmap for improving government performance structural cultural challenges. 495 00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:47,639 Speaker 2: But do in any way see the positives of this 496 00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:48,840 Speaker 2: doze drive, Jennifer. 497 00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:52,399 Speaker 8: I think I hoped to see positives. 498 00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:56,159 Speaker 14: I've been a big advocate for real significant renovation of 499 00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:59,440 Speaker 14: government for a long time, and as Kurt said, I've 500 00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:02,439 Speaker 14: been hoping that would move faster. I think unfortunately what 501 00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:06,119 Speaker 14: we're seeing is moving far too fast. And not with 502 00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:09,360 Speaker 14: the right intent. So if you want to renovate government, 503 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:11,560 Speaker 14: that's sort of like pulling it back down to the studs. 504 00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:13,880 Speaker 14: What we're seeing now is really pulling up the core 505 00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:18,360 Speaker 14: foundations of our government, the principles on which it was established, 506 00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:22,199 Speaker 14: and that is not going to increase state capacity. 507 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:23,440 Speaker 8: Which is what our report is about. 508 00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:25,800 Speaker 14: State capacity is just the ability of government to achieve 509 00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:29,679 Speaker 14: its policy goals. We have incredibly important challenges that we 510 00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:32,320 Speaker 14: need to face as a government. We need a stronger state, 511 00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:33,560 Speaker 14: not a destroyed state. 512 00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:38,400 Speaker 3: Jennifer, you've talked about how government and perhaps some political 513 00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:41,639 Speaker 3: parties more than others, have focused too much on process, 514 00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:46,120 Speaker 3: not outcomes. How in a perfect world could you see 515 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:50,760 Speaker 3: perhaps those playing a role in advancing technology really helping 516 00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:52,040 Speaker 3: government perform better. 517 00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:56,960 Speaker 14: We certainly do need more focus on outcomes over process. 518 00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:00,080 Speaker 8: We don't need no process. 519 00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:04,200 Speaker 14: And what's happening right now is not just looking deeply 520 00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:08,280 Speaker 14: at what processes could be simplified, but actually not respecting 521 00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:11,160 Speaker 14: the law. And what I had hoped Doge would do 522 00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:13,679 Speaker 14: is go in and say, Okay, these things can be 523 00:27:13,760 --> 00:27:15,520 Speaker 14: cleaned up. Oh and by the way, some of these 524 00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:17,639 Speaker 14: laws are holding us back. Let's go to Congress and 525 00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:20,399 Speaker 14: have them fixed so that we can operate in a 526 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:25,280 Speaker 14: more streamlined and outcomes oriented way. Instead, they're just sort 527 00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:28,000 Speaker 14: of rolling roughshot over the law, which is again through 528 00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:30,359 Speaker 14: the principle of our government, and very dangerous. 529 00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:33,879 Speaker 3: I mean, if you were to give lawmakers perhaps some 530 00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:36,960 Speaker 3: advice on how to clean some of this up, how 531 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:39,800 Speaker 3: to regain some of the trusting credibility that perhaps DOGE 532 00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:41,520 Speaker 3: can bring, what advice would you bring them? 533 00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:44,960 Speaker 14: Well, we have four major pillars that we think need 534 00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:47,240 Speaker 14: to happen, and they should have been regardless of DOGE. 535 00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:50,280 Speaker 14: I think we're in a very chaotic moment, but there 536 00:27:50,320 --> 00:27:52,440 Speaker 14: will be moments when we can look back at this agenda. 537 00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:55,120 Speaker 14: We essentially say four things. If you want a government 538 00:27:55,160 --> 00:27:56,960 Speaker 14: that can do what it says it's going to do, 539 00:27:57,280 --> 00:27:59,000 Speaker 14: you need to be able to hire the right people 540 00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:01,480 Speaker 14: and fire the wrong one. You need to reduce the 541 00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:05,119 Speaker 14: procedural bloat. You need to invest in digital and data 542 00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:08,320 Speaker 14: infrastructure in smart ways, not just cutting people off but 543 00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:12,119 Speaker 14: actually building what does work. And lastly, we need to 544 00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:16,119 Speaker 14: close the loop, the feedback loop between policymakers and the 545 00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:20,440 Speaker 14: outcomes that actually come from our laws and policies. Right now, 546 00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:22,399 Speaker 14: we're just sort of putting things out there and hoping 547 00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:24,879 Speaker 14: that we get what we want without doing what the 548 00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:27,560 Speaker 14: private sector does, which is really say, is this working 549 00:28:27,680 --> 00:28:30,560 Speaker 14: as we're going? Can we check in? Can lawmakers and 550 00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:33,840 Speaker 14: others sort of work with the executive branch in new 551 00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:37,080 Speaker 14: ways to say, let's tweak this as it goes along 552 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:38,880 Speaker 14: so that we get the outcomes that are laws and 553 00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:41,640 Speaker 14: policies intend. I still think all of these things can 554 00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:43,520 Speaker 14: be done, but it's very hard to do it in 555 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:48,040 Speaker 14: the current environment chaos and fear. 556 00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:51,800 Speaker 2: Chaos fere but also speed, and that's all from what 557 00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:54,479 Speaker 2: the private sector brings. And as you say, a lot 558 00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:58,600 Speaker 2: of your offerings and prioritization here feel like very private 559 00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:03,840 Speaker 2: sector orientation of of prioritizing talent, of streamlining processes. Realistically, 560 00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:06,800 Speaker 2: if they didn't, as you quote Ron Roshod, if they 561 00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:07,520 Speaker 2: went along with. 562 00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:09,600 Speaker 4: Congress, how much longer would that take. 563 00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:14,680 Speaker 2: Are the incentives of politicians aligned with ultimately remaking with efficiency? 564 00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:18,320 Speaker 14: I think the incentives of politicians come from the people, 565 00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:20,880 Speaker 14: and that the people need to ask their politicians to 566 00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:23,840 Speaker 14: be more focused on the how of government and not 567 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:27,040 Speaker 14: just the what whatever you want government to do, it 568 00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:29,040 Speaker 14: has to actually be able to do it. And I 569 00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:31,560 Speaker 14: think if the people say, look, this matters how we 570 00:29:31,600 --> 00:29:35,040 Speaker 14: are structured to achieve our policy goals, they will ultimately 571 00:29:35,200 --> 00:29:38,920 Speaker 14: be responsive to that. Right now, again, it's very hard 572 00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:41,920 Speaker 14: because there's so much chaos going on, but I do 573 00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:45,640 Speaker 14: think we'll get to a place where that conversation can happen. Yes, 574 00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:48,160 Speaker 14: it would be a little bit slower, and yes I 575 00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:51,360 Speaker 14: have called for things to move faster, but the core 576 00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:55,200 Speaker 14: foundations of our government are good and we should be 577 00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:56,880 Speaker 14: protecting them right now as well. 578 00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:00,240 Speaker 4: Is Elon is cool. 579 00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:05,640 Speaker 2: Department of Government efficiency the right albitter of this if 580 00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:08,840 Speaker 2: they do it in the right way. 581 00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:13,600 Speaker 14: Elon, I think, has shown that he's not going to 582 00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:15,480 Speaker 14: do it in a way that's consistent with the core 583 00:30:15,520 --> 00:30:18,840 Speaker 14: values of our government. Unfortunately, we still need it done, 584 00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:21,400 Speaker 14: but we need it done probably first at the state 585 00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:23,200 Speaker 14: and local level, so that we can show how to 586 00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:25,000 Speaker 14: do it right and then bring it back to the 587 00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:27,880 Speaker 14: federal government and do it the way that it needs 588 00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:29,240 Speaker 14: to be done for the American people. 589 00:30:31,520 --> 00:30:33,920 Speaker 3: Jennifer polkas senior Fellow at the Nis Canon Center. 590 00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:35,200 Speaker 4: We thank you now. 591 00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:38,360 Speaker 3: Coming up, Edith Young from Race Capital joins us next 592 00:30:38,440 --> 00:30:41,160 Speaker 3: on the state of crypto under the Trump administration. 593 00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:54,040 Speaker 4: This is Bloomberg. Senator Bill. 594 00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:57,480 Speaker 3: Senator Bill Haggerty will introduce legislation today to create a 595 00:30:57,520 --> 00:30:59,880 Speaker 3: framework for stable coins. This is the latest push of 596 00:30:59,880 --> 00:31:03,760 Speaker 3: my Republicans to create a crypto friendly guideline for the industry. 597 00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:06,680 Speaker 3: That's a priority for President Trump. Let's bring in Edith 598 00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:09,840 Speaker 3: Young for today's VC Spotlight, General partner at Race Capital 599 00:31:10,080 --> 00:31:12,840 Speaker 3: in early stage Silicon Valley VC fund investing in all 600 00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:16,440 Speaker 3: things infrastructure. Edith, why don't you walk us through what 601 00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:19,640 Speaker 3: this new administration means for the crypto landscape and how 602 00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:22,400 Speaker 3: you're thinking about potential opportunities going forward. 603 00:31:23,240 --> 00:31:23,440 Speaker 4: Yeah. 604 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:26,480 Speaker 15: So, one of my predictions for twenty twenty five is 605 00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:29,720 Speaker 15: for President Trump to create the Bitcoin Reserve. 606 00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:32,320 Speaker 4: And this is only his third. 607 00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:34,160 Speaker 15: Week in office, and I don't have all the tea 608 00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:38,160 Speaker 15: leaves yet, but I just spent some time digging into 609 00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:44,240 Speaker 15: how the US government holds our other reserved assept today. 610 00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:49,720 Speaker 15: Let's take Goal as an example, is actually managed by 611 00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:55,000 Speaker 15: the Treasure Department, and US actually hold over eighty eighty 612 00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:59,280 Speaker 15: one hundred tons of Goal reserve today and is managed 613 00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:00,520 Speaker 15: by the Treasury Department. 614 00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:02,600 Speaker 4: And what's really interesting is that. 615 00:32:02,600 --> 00:32:08,480 Speaker 15: Particular is being oversight by the Inspector General of Treasure Department, 616 00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:10,800 Speaker 15: and this role is currently vacant. 617 00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:13,080 Speaker 4: No one is in this world today. 618 00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:16,520 Speaker 15: And what's also really interesting is that that role is 619 00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:21,280 Speaker 15: supposed to the custody security audit and set all the 620 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:26,440 Speaker 15: policy around goal. So for us, as you us to 621 00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:28,080 Speaker 15: think about should we have. 622 00:32:28,040 --> 00:32:29,040 Speaker 4: A bitcoin reserve? 623 00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:32,280 Speaker 15: The key thing I think for the administration and of 624 00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:36,160 Speaker 15: course the exacts are cryptosard to think about is why 625 00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:39,360 Speaker 15: do we want a reserve? And historically it's really for 626 00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:44,200 Speaker 15: to hetch against the inflation at the same time, and 627 00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:48,040 Speaker 15: of course we already US already have over two hundred 628 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:52,320 Speaker 15: thousand of bitcoin in custody today. But the key thing 629 00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:55,680 Speaker 15: is really is the government do need to diversify but 630 00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 15: bitcoin is fluctually quite a bit. Is this something that 631 00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:01,680 Speaker 15: we really want to do? Ns this afternoon we'll find 632 00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:02,080 Speaker 15: out more. 633 00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:05,560 Speaker 2: You, of course a well known for your backing of Solana, 634 00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:08,280 Speaker 2: and so perhaps I dare say slight talking of books, 635 00:33:08,320 --> 00:33:11,320 Speaker 2: to say there should be digital asset reserve rather than 636 00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:14,440 Speaker 2: perhaps just a bitcoin reserve, plain and simple. But I'm 637 00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:17,520 Speaker 2: interested as to what the stable coin adoption or indeed 638 00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:22,200 Speaker 2: clarity can bring to actual US using crypto more easily 639 00:33:22,360 --> 00:33:25,440 Speaker 2: with real tangible benefits that isn't just about asset purchases. 640 00:33:26,360 --> 00:33:26,560 Speaker 4: Yeah. 641 00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:31,800 Speaker 15: Absolutely, I'm actually very bullish on stable coin in general. 642 00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:36,080 Speaker 15: I think in twenty twenty four over two hundred billion 643 00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:39,880 Speaker 15: of stable market cap, which is over fifty percent increas 644 00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:43,560 Speaker 15: year over year. And particularly what I'm really interested in 645 00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:48,320 Speaker 15: is the whole concept of open PAYFI infrastructure, and I 646 00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:51,800 Speaker 15: think is really really aligned with President Trump the administration 647 00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:55,840 Speaker 15: with the executive Order, which is all about strengthening American 648 00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:59,720 Speaker 15: leadership in digital finance. So think about it. The more 649 00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:03,640 Speaker 15: the US dominated a stable coin being adopted means we 650 00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:06,840 Speaker 15: need to kind of think about really is the traditional 651 00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:13,319 Speaker 15: PAYFI means credit card remittances across border payment and all 652 00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:18,680 Speaker 15: these old infrastructure is slow, is expensive, and Visa was 653 00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:22,680 Speaker 15: actually dablished in nineteen fifty fifty. 654 00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:25,400 Speaker 4: Eight, sixty six years ago. It's a long time and 655 00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:26,520 Speaker 4: these rail is very old. 656 00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:30,759 Speaker 15: So having like stable coin, particularly US dominated, I think 657 00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:33,640 Speaker 15: it will drive more use case for US dollar and 658 00:34:33,680 --> 00:34:36,719 Speaker 15: it will really really align with and think through the 659 00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:41,359 Speaker 15: whole infrastructure is only not only about transaction layer, which 660 00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:44,520 Speaker 15: is Solana, the finance layer, which is humor, finance, and 661 00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:48,360 Speaker 15: more so it's also compliance KYC security. So there are 662 00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:52,359 Speaker 15: a lot of opportunities for venture to invest and pay 663 00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:53,000 Speaker 15: attention to. 664 00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:56,399 Speaker 3: You mentioned President Trump's executive order. His rhetoric has also 665 00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:57,800 Speaker 3: brought some volatility to the sector. 666 00:34:57,840 --> 00:34:58,520 Speaker 4: I mean, just this. 667 00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:01,480 Speaker 3: Weekend we saw a huge liquidation this risk off trade 668 00:35:01,520 --> 00:35:02,040 Speaker 3: in crypto. 669 00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:03,640 Speaker 4: Curious if you find. 670 00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:06,920 Speaker 3: That US dependency on how the headlines here at home 671 00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:10,239 Speaker 3: are really driving those movements. Is crypto a little too 672 00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:11,720 Speaker 3: s US dependent at the moment. 673 00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:15,719 Speaker 15: Well, I think crypto in some set is the other 674 00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:21,719 Speaker 15: way around. The United States need crypto innovation. Before President Trump, 675 00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:27,560 Speaker 15: the Biden administration really have been using lawsuits to manage 676 00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:30,000 Speaker 15: the whole policy. This is really not the way to go. 677 00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:34,719 Speaker 15: I think the Trump presidencies, in particular with the new cryptosar, 678 00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:38,319 Speaker 15: really set the stage just now. The America wants to 679 00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:42,399 Speaker 15: be the leaders the forefront of this, and I think 680 00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:47,000 Speaker 15: in general is set a really positive tone. Although everything's 681 00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:50,000 Speaker 15: been again, as I said mentioned earlier, it's only been 682 00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:53,080 Speaker 15: third week, and I really don't know what's going to happen, 683 00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:56,440 Speaker 15: but I think the whole world is watching and really 684 00:35:56,480 --> 00:36:00,640 Speaker 15: looking out for the US leadership. In crypto, stable coin 685 00:36:00,719 --> 00:36:01,680 Speaker 15: and bitcoin. 686 00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:04,800 Speaker 2: Should have it involved a meme coin from the president, 687 00:36:04,920 --> 00:36:08,040 Speaker 2: and indeed the first lady. 688 00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:10,839 Speaker 15: I think you know, President Trump is have a lot 689 00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:14,279 Speaker 15: of fun with the Trump and the Millennium Mean coin 690 00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:19,040 Speaker 15: before his inaugurations. And I watched many many of the 691 00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:23,080 Speaker 15: crypto exchange leadership, including Brian's Armstrong, and what they say 692 00:36:23,120 --> 00:36:25,919 Speaker 15: about the meme coin, and all of them basically say 693 00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:28,160 Speaker 15: a lot of things that happened early in their Internet 694 00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:32,160 Speaker 15: all looked like fund and don't really know what it is. 695 00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:34,800 Speaker 15: And I think the key thing for as an investor, 696 00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:38,239 Speaker 15: particularly as a consumer investor, for to pay attention to 697 00:36:39,320 --> 00:36:42,720 Speaker 15: it's really about we need to be careful about speculations. 698 00:36:42,760 --> 00:36:47,520 Speaker 15: The key thing is really about protecting the normal retail investor. 699 00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:51,640 Speaker 15: So it's really the key thing is the power for 700 00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:56,560 Speaker 15: all the different exchanges to determine which token should be 701 00:36:56,680 --> 00:37:00,840 Speaker 15: listed to make sure that the US consumer re'll investor 702 00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:02,200 Speaker 15: is being protected in. 703 00:37:02,239 --> 00:37:05,400 Speaker 4: If you from Race Capital, thanks for joining us today. 704 00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:08,080 Speaker 4: Let's flip gears into another story. 705 00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:10,799 Speaker 2: We're watching Elon Musk stepping up his efforts to block 706 00:37:10,880 --> 00:37:14,040 Speaker 2: open ai from restructuring as a for profit company, claiming 707 00:37:14,040 --> 00:37:16,920 Speaker 2: it would abandon its public spirited mission. Now, Musk's lawyers 708 00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:19,520 Speaker 2: are expected to urge a federal judge to halt open 709 00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:22,200 Speaker 2: AI's conversion plans and a court hearing today. 710 00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:23,120 Speaker 4: All of this is. 711 00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:26,160 Speaker 2: As open a CEOs. Moutman is currently doing another world 712 00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:29,239 Speaker 2: tour with the Global Ai race heating up. Let's get 713 00:37:29,239 --> 00:37:32,080 Speaker 2: to that tour with Rachel Metz and he's been in Japan, 714 00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:34,640 Speaker 2: South Korea. Ultimately, what are we hearing in terms of 715 00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:37,320 Speaker 2: real innovation and partnership that open ai is bringing. 716 00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:41,480 Speaker 16: Yeah, so this is Sam Martman's second world tour over 717 00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:44,080 Speaker 16: the last couple of years. This one he is certainly 718 00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:47,239 Speaker 16: more well known his technology and his company is more established, 719 00:37:47,680 --> 00:37:50,760 Speaker 16: and he is making stopped in a bunch of different countries, 720 00:37:50,800 --> 00:37:54,480 Speaker 16: including South Korea where he had a deal with a 721 00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:58,759 Speaker 16: really large company focused on social media there. And he's 722 00:37:58,880 --> 00:38:02,000 Speaker 16: been meeting with soft Bank in Japan, and there's a 723 00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:05,000 Speaker 16: bunch of other staff stops as well, some are focused 724 00:38:05,040 --> 00:38:10,640 Speaker 16: on meeting with people developers. Also that there's a university 725 00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:12,560 Speaker 16: in Germany that he's going to hit up. So he's 726 00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:15,080 Speaker 16: got like a lot of different kinds of people to 727 00:38:15,120 --> 00:38:17,040 Speaker 16: meet with that are all connected to the company. Or 728 00:38:17,040 --> 00:38:19,520 Speaker 16: that he would like to be connected to the company. 729 00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:23,640 Speaker 3: We Rachel, I'm curious what risks this world tour brings up, 730 00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:27,480 Speaker 3: because obviously the Deep Seek developments of last week really 731 00:38:27,719 --> 00:38:31,400 Speaker 3: amplified this talk about an AI race. Than today we 732 00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:34,520 Speaker 3: see some retaliation from China on alphabet in. 733 00:38:34,480 --> 00:38:35,800 Speaker 4: Response to Trump's tariff. 734 00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:38,520 Speaker 3: So your scene tech companies really get caught in the middle. 735 00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:42,160 Speaker 3: Is by doing this is Sam Altman kind of putting 736 00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:44,240 Speaker 3: himself out there just a little too much. 737 00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:49,759 Speaker 16: That's a really good question. There's a lot of diplomacy 738 00:38:50,120 --> 00:38:53,120 Speaker 16: that needs to come along at this point with heading 739 00:38:53,239 --> 00:38:58,120 Speaker 16: a really powerful AI company, right like, this technology has 740 00:38:58,160 --> 00:39:00,319 Speaker 16: really taken the world by storm over the last couple 741 00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:03,120 Speaker 16: of years, So there's a lot of talking that has 742 00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:05,080 Speaker 16: to happen, meetings that have to happen. You have to 743 00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:07,560 Speaker 16: get a lot of stakeholders invested in what you're doing, 744 00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:11,640 Speaker 16: either literally invested or figuratively at least, you know, interested 745 00:39:11,719 --> 00:39:14,600 Speaker 16: in using the product and buying in So, I mean 746 00:39:14,640 --> 00:39:20,560 Speaker 16: it seems like a reasonably shrewd strategy to meet with 747 00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:22,759 Speaker 16: the people that you need to sort of get at 748 00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:27,120 Speaker 16: least familiarize them with your face and your company, as 749 00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:30,479 Speaker 16: especially as something like deep seek is happening where people 750 00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:32,239 Speaker 16: are saying, wait a minute, do we really need to 751 00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:36,279 Speaker 16: spend this much money to make this AI happen. It's 752 00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:38,279 Speaker 16: a really interesting time for him to be doing this, 753 00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:39,000 Speaker 16: that's for sure. 754 00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:51,520 Speaker 3: Bloomberg's Rachel Mattz thank you. Tesla sales have fallen in 755 00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:55,080 Speaker 3: key markets. The electric vehicle maker registered fewer cars. In 756 00:39:55,080 --> 00:39:58,200 Speaker 3: California throughout twenty twenty four. Sales of Model three fell 757 00:39:58,280 --> 00:40:02,000 Speaker 3: by thirty six percent. Meanwhile, in France, the EU's second 758 00:40:02,040 --> 00:40:06,600 Speaker 3: biggest market for battery vehicle vehicles, Tesla saw registrations plummet 759 00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:07,880 Speaker 3: by sixty three percent. 760 00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:12,160 Speaker 2: CARO Meanwhile, EV competition, well, it's been struggling here in 761 00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:15,480 Speaker 2: the United States as well. Jackie Ford particularly vulnerable with 762 00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:19,240 Speaker 2: no new EV models coming for two years. Keith Norton 763 00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:21,520 Speaker 2: has been writing about this in Bloomberg's Big Take, And 764 00:40:21,560 --> 00:40:26,040 Speaker 2: you call it Ford's EV crisis. Why is it a crisis? 765 00:40:26,080 --> 00:40:29,120 Speaker 2: Why postponing new models is it making it a crisis? 766 00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:29,399 Speaker 4: Keith? 767 00:40:30,120 --> 00:40:32,440 Speaker 17: Yeah, So they are going to face this kind of 768 00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:35,920 Speaker 17: EV desert for the next two years where they won't 769 00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:41,240 Speaker 17: have any new electric vehicle models they made. What CEO 770 00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:44,879 Speaker 17: Jim Frowley called a big pivot. Back in August, they 771 00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:48,600 Speaker 17: canceled plans for a big electric suv. They said it 772 00:40:48,600 --> 00:40:51,040 Speaker 17: would have been too pricey, and now they're going to 773 00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:55,360 Speaker 17: instead focus on lower price dvs below thirty thousand dollars, 774 00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:59,720 Speaker 17: as well as something called an extended range electric vehicle, 775 00:40:59,719 --> 00:41:02,680 Speaker 17: which as a small gas engine that recharges the battery. 776 00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:06,360 Speaker 17: So that's their new two pronged strategy, which is fine, 777 00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:09,760 Speaker 17: but that means they have no new evs to sell 778 00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:12,600 Speaker 17: and their model lineup continues to age for the next 779 00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:13,200 Speaker 17: two years. 780 00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:17,400 Speaker 3: Keith, what does this new administration bode for Ford and 781 00:41:17,400 --> 00:41:20,799 Speaker 3: perhaps other electric vehicle makers, especially with Elon Musk so 782 00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:21,880 Speaker 3: close to President Trump. 783 00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:26,080 Speaker 17: Yeah, and you know Elon Musk's cyber truck is now 784 00:41:26,160 --> 00:41:30,359 Speaker 17: out selling Ford's Flune fifty lightning electric pickup truck, which 785 00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:32,920 Speaker 17: is not a good turn of events for Ford. Ford 786 00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:35,640 Speaker 17: also makes one of its other big electric models, the 787 00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:40,120 Speaker 17: Mustang Mocke, down in Mexico, So if that twenty five 788 00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:43,279 Speaker 17: percent tariff threat comes back, that would add a lot 789 00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:46,279 Speaker 17: of cost to the Mustang Mocke. So there is a 790 00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:49,160 Speaker 17: lot hanging in the balance with the decisions that President 791 00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:49,800 Speaker 17: Trump makes. 792 00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:52,920 Speaker 8: Not you know, the least of which that he wants. 793 00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:54,960 Speaker 17: To get rid of that seventy five hundred dollars tax 794 00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:56,920 Speaker 17: credit given to eed buyers. 795 00:41:57,640 --> 00:42:00,480 Speaker 2: Most Keith Norton is a brilliant big take read it. 796 00:42:00,760 --> 00:42:02,840 Speaker 2: Thanks so much for joining. Now that does it for 797 00:42:02,880 --> 00:42:05,080 Speaker 2: this edition of Bloomberg Technology. Do not forget to check 798 00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:06,720 Speaker 2: out our podcast you can find out on the terminal 799 00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:09,040 Speaker 2: as well as online on Apples, Spotify, and iHeart. And 800 00:42:09,160 --> 00:42:11,600 Speaker 2: do not forget to tune in for Earnings after the 801 00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:14,920 Speaker 2: Bell as well. We've got a whole host alphabet AMD 802 00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:17,879 Speaker 2: plentive to be digesting when it comes to earnings from 803 00:42:17,880 --> 00:42:19,120 Speaker 2: New York and San Francisco. 804 00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:21,360 Speaker 4: This is Bloomberg Technology.