Speaker 1: All right, we have a great story on the Bloomberg
Speaker 1: and Bloomberg dot Com today. It's about the thirty nine
Speaker 1: things that Joe Biden should do first on climate change.
Speaker 1: He has made some big promises. He has um going to,
Speaker 1: i should say, kind of take office having made unprecedented
Speaker 1: commitments to address global warming. He's got a fifteen year
Speaker 1: plan to create carbon neutral electricity across the US on
Speaker 1: the waiter, achieving net zero emissions by twenty fifty. He
Speaker 1: has also promised to spend two trillion on a sweeping
Speaker 1: climate and job agenda. So that's kind of our backdrop
Speaker 1: on this Wednesday. So let's get into that. Our next guest,
Speaker 1: I'm sure has some thoughts on that and really the
Speaker 1: role of solar energy specifically. We welcome Abigail ross Hopper.
Speaker 1: She's President CEO of the Solar Energy Industries Association, former
Speaker 1: director of the Department of the Interiors Bureau of Ocean
Speaker 1: Energy Management. That's where she loved, the agency that oversaw
Speaker 1: the leasing and development of all offshore energy from oil
Speaker 1: and natural gas to offshore wind. And she joins us
Speaker 1: on the phone in Washington, d C. Is so nice
Speaker 1: to have you here with us. Carol, thank you so
Speaker 1: much for having me this afternoon. So I have to say,
Speaker 1: we have a lot of important things to talk about,
Speaker 1: but can I just be quite honest with you that
Speaker 1: from the get go, my producer Paul Brennan, Um, when
Speaker 1: we were talking about who was going to be on
Speaker 1: our show and talking about you joining us, he shared
Speaker 1: your bio and it says a very proud mom of
Speaker 1: three kids, loves to read writer peloton, do hot yoga,
Speaker 1: and lie on the beach. And my producer Paul said
Speaker 1: to me, sounds like you Carol minus two kids, which
Speaker 1: is exactly I have to say. You're my doppelganger. It's
Speaker 1: pretty amazing. That is very funny. I am my Pelison
Speaker 1: was my first quarantine purchase there was, and it was
Speaker 1: really a brilliant purchase and I am totally addicted and
Speaker 1: brand boyle. Now, all right, have you done the Hamilton's Ride?
Speaker 1: I did the Hamilton's Ride on Monday night. I did
Speaker 1: that Beyonce ride ride. I am all in all right. Well,
Speaker 1: so really really wonderful to catch up with you. Um,
Speaker 1: it sounds like we have to have a drink when
Speaker 1: we're back in normal times. UM, So tell me about
Speaker 1: first of all, your world, what it's been like, and
Speaker 1: what the industry's world has been like under COVID. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we have really struggled, Carroll. Under COVID, you know, we
Speaker 1: represent utility scales, so those big projects in the middle
Speaker 1: of the desert, we represent commercial, the ones on top
Speaker 1: of schools and corporates, and then you know, once on
Speaker 1: top of your house and mind residential solar, and they've
Speaker 1: all been hit although the residential solar has been hit
Speaker 1: the hardest. Um it makes sense, right, people don't want
Speaker 1: anyone coming to their home. They can't do door to
Speaker 1: door sales. So our companies have really innovated and figured
Speaker 1: out different ways to sell and incorporated safety mechanisms and
Speaker 1: so sort of the pipeline is starting to build again.
Speaker 1: What we're finding though, is that the tax equity market,
Speaker 1: which is such a critical part of our financing, is
Speaker 1: really tightened up um and these uncertain times, and so
Speaker 1: we see that as a pretty significant challenge that has
Speaker 1: been brought on by COVID. So how do you change that,
Speaker 1: especially in a world where we were talking We've been
Speaker 1: talking with the last few hours of our broadcast, you know,
Speaker 1: just we're watching the headlines and the numbers are just
Speaker 1: going higher soon than do you anticipate that kind of
Speaker 1: what you've been dealing with you're going to have to
Speaker 1: continue to deal with until we get kind of to
Speaker 1: the other side. Yeah, I think, Um, I mean, I
Speaker 1: think on many of our projects, we have figured out
Speaker 1: how to install, how to sell and install and permit safely.
Speaker 1: So um, there is demand there. What we are considered
Speaker 1: now is really about the ability to finance the deals,
Speaker 1: and so we have been asking Congress to make our
Speaker 1: tax credit refundable as opposed to being predicated on a
Speaker 1: tax equity appetite. Um. We've had a lots I mean,
Speaker 1: I live in Washington. We've had lots of meetings with legislators,
Speaker 1: although they've all been via a zoom um, and they
Speaker 1: understand we've lost We've wiped away about five years of
Speaker 1: job growth in the first few months of COVID. So
Speaker 1: it's it's been really devastating on the foot side. You know,
Speaker 1: we can put people back to work really quickly all
Speaker 1: across the country if we have some certainty around our
Speaker 1: our financing mechanism. So okay, So here we are in
Speaker 1: this kind of strange political world right where the transition
Speaker 1: is not going You understand transitions. You've been inside, you know,
Speaker 1: the government, when a transition happens, going from President Obama
Speaker 1: to President Trump. I mean, what are your expectations. Well,
Speaker 1: we'll talk a little bit about that. Then I'm gonna
Speaker 1: do something. We'll come back. But we've got about forty
Speaker 1: seconds here. You know. Are you anticipating that anything gets
Speaker 1: done before January? Are you anticipating anything gets done anytime soon?
Speaker 1: I am very hopeful Um that in the new Congress,
Speaker 1: with President President elect Biden in office, that there will
Speaker 1: be some significant legislation that passes. We can talk after
Speaker 1: the break about the biparts in nature of solar but
Speaker 1: I am optimistic. I'm not particularly optimistic this year end because,
Speaker 1: as you said, everything is just so unprecedented at the moment.
Speaker 1: You as an overused word. So it was interesting in
Speaker 1: the break we talked a little bit Abigail Um about
Speaker 1: who Joe Biden might pick, uh possibly to run the
Speaker 1: Energy Department, and they're one name is being floated around
Speaker 1: as an ex Google official who is kind of on
Speaker 1: the short list. He's a former deputy secretary Um from
Speaker 1: our at the department. But it's interesting in our reporting
Speaker 1: just kind of made the point out that you've got
Speaker 1: to have somebody politically savvy in that department and somebody
Speaker 1: who's technically understands kind of everything at issue. And I
Speaker 1: do think about when you look at maybe the shaping
Speaker 1: up of a new administration, you know, who do we
Speaker 1: need to have in play, especially when it comes to
Speaker 1: things like solar energy, or or alternative energy, or just
Speaker 1: overall our energy policy in this country. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: I listened to your conversation about that. I think, you know,
Speaker 1: we want people in our government who an energy front,
Speaker 1: who are practitioners of energy right, who know how to
Speaker 1: build it, know how to find to know how to
Speaker 1: get it done. If if President elect Biden is going
Speaker 1: to implement his aggressive climate change plan, there has to
Speaker 1: be just even more rapid deployment of solar and wind
Speaker 1: and offshore wind and all of these technologies. So you
Speaker 1: need folks in government who understand how the businesses operate
Speaker 1: and you can get that done. But over and that's
Speaker 1: more like at the Department of the Interior, where they're
Speaker 1: they're actually around execution. But if you think about the
Speaker 1: Departmative Energy, right, that's where so much of the R
Speaker 1: and D happens and having um, you know, an engineer
Speaker 1: and a scientist over there, it makes a ton of
Speaker 1: sense because we're really sort of looking at next gen options,
Speaker 1: right What are we what are we going to do?
Speaker 1: How are we going to find these new technologies to
Speaker 1: even further decarbonize our our economy. What was your what
Speaker 1: was your experience between kind of old energy new energy?
Speaker 1: Because I do feel like we have such um whether
Speaker 1: it's through lobbyists and the money that's still in kind
Speaker 1: of our old energy world, we know that in order
Speaker 1: to protect our climate, we've really got to embrace more
Speaker 1: fully alternative energy. Do you feel like there's enough thinking
Speaker 1: of that going on in the government or we need
Speaker 1: to really kind of take a big leap forward. I
Speaker 1: think we need to take a big leap forward. Um.
Speaker 1: I think that we need to recognize the crisis that
Speaker 1: we're in and take big, bold, aggressive steps. UM. So,
Speaker 1: you know, when I was at the Department of Interior,
Speaker 1: I oversaw oil and gas, as you said, and renewables,
Speaker 1: offshore wind and so one of the most interesting things
Speaker 1: that I noticed, and I noticed it in solar as well,
Speaker 1: is that many of the first of the European oil
Speaker 1: and gas majors and now the American oil and gas
Speaker 1: majors are making big investments and renewables right and solar
Speaker 1: and wind and offshore wind. They see it, you know,
Speaker 1: they understand where the market is going, and they understand
Speaker 1: UM sort of where where consumers and regulators and policy
Speaker 1: makers wants to go, and so are diversifying their offerings UM.
Speaker 1: And that has been a really interesting shift of the
Speaker 1: last few years, is to see the shelves and the
Speaker 1: the dps of the world in addition to the Europeans,
Speaker 1: like you know some of the other European utilities, UM
Speaker 1: and oil majors really invests heavily in electric vehicles, inslar
Speaker 1: in storage because it is going to be a huge
Speaker 1: part of our energy next So help me out here,
Speaker 1: because I think I'm always someone like it feels like
Speaker 1: we were moving along so slowly and like tak e vs.
Speaker 1: I felt like it it took somebody like Elon Musk
Speaker 1: to kind of shake up, you know, the establishment, to say, well,
Speaker 1: win minute, we can do this faster. And I really
Speaker 1: do feel like he really awakened the auto industry, the
Speaker 1: global auto industry. But help me understand since you understand
Speaker 1: this that in terms of kind of you know, the
Speaker 1: old line, Like, it's fascinating to hear what you say
Speaker 1: about Shell and MVP and we we knew this that
Speaker 1: they were looking at, you know, renewables. But does it
Speaker 1: do we have to understand it does take some time
Speaker 1: to kind of shift our world to renewables or are
Speaker 1: there ways that we can be it should be doing
Speaker 1: it faster? And I know you're from the solar industry,
Speaker 1: so you're probably gonna be like, yeah, of course we
Speaker 1: could do it faster. But do you know what I'm
Speaker 1: saying that that that it isn't always so easy to
Speaker 1: kind of shift. We don't necessarily we still are struggling
Speaker 1: with the infrastructure when it comes to E VS. Right, No,
Speaker 1: I so I am both a realists, right. I understand
Speaker 1: how the good works. I understand how the technology works. UM,
Speaker 1: and so there are some challenges to rapid deployment, but
Speaker 1: you're right, you need big out of the box spinkers
Speaker 1: to really um come up with creative solutions. And so
Speaker 1: I and you know my background is from all energy,
Speaker 1: so well, I work at the solar industry. Right now, UM,
Speaker 1: I think I have a pretty holistic to you, and
Speaker 1: I think there are things we can do. I think
Speaker 1: there's things that the president and the agencies can do
Speaker 1: in terms of federal procurement. Right. The obviously, the US
Speaker 1: government and U s M forces are one of the
Speaker 1: the largest fire of energy, um, and so looking at
Speaker 1: their procurement all of the real estate they have, all
Speaker 1: of our public lands and putting solar and wind resources
Speaker 1: on our public lands. You know, we already do oil
Speaker 1: and gas drilling, so it makes sense to have rapid deployment.
Speaker 1: They're thinking about the technology, thinking about the finance, creating
Speaker 1: UM sort of ways that we that the market. You know,
Speaker 1: it's putting the right marketing centers out there and then
Speaker 1: letting companies respond to it. I think, um, there's a
Speaker 1: lot of things that we can do to to move
Speaker 1: this transition even more quickly. Yeah, I think market incentives
Speaker 1: are really a really really big thing when you think
Speaker 1: about what they can do. Um. Alright, So to wrap up,
Speaker 1: I gotta ask you who's your favorite Peloton instructor? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I love Alex Oh. I think he is. He inspires
Speaker 1: me in a way that none other do. How about you, Um,
Speaker 1: I think, like a lot of people, I do like
Speaker 1: Robin Arson. UM, I like Kinna Marie Corbett, and I
Speaker 1: have to say I've actually met raw up in. UM.
Speaker 1: We've covered Peloton as you would imagine. I've talked to
Speaker 1: John Foley a lot um and I've done stories on
Speaker 1: them and met Robin when they have kind of the
Speaker 1: Peloton annual gathering. UM they met in New York and
Speaker 1: it was very cool. You know, she's a lawyer. It's
Speaker 1: just it's a very cool world. I just gotta say,
Speaker 1: it isn't very cool. And her personal story is so fascinating.
Speaker 1: I'm excited to watch her um be pregnant and have
Speaker 1: a baby. Peloton. But you didn't expect to go here. Listen,
Speaker 1: come back because I love it. I love this and
Speaker 1: I love the energy world, and I love that you are,
Speaker 1: like you said, holistic, so you really see all the
Speaker 1: moving parts. So come back anytime, because this was a
Speaker 1: really great conversation. Really appreciate it. And UM, I love
Speaker 1: to check into, especially as we moved towards a Biden administration,
Speaker 1: how it's impacting the solar industry. So great to have
Speaker 1: with us. Abigail ross Hopper, or President and CEO of
Speaker 1: the Solar Energy Industries Association. She is former director of
Speaker 1: the Department of Interiors, Bureau of Ocean Energy Management and,
Speaker 1: of course, joining us on the phone from the nation's capital,