Speaker 1: Hey, Daniel, do you think the planet Earth is getting
Speaker 1: too crowded? Well, you know, we live in southern California,
Speaker 1: so we do experience a good amount of traffic, even
Speaker 1: though I get to wear sandals all year long. Well
Speaker 1: does it make you want to move out of Southern California? Well,
Speaker 1: you know, I'd be hesitant to give up the sandals,
Speaker 1: but I'd love to live in outer space. Well yeah,
Speaker 1: do you think community would be easier in space? Well,
Speaker 1: it can't be much worse than it is down here
Speaker 1: in southern California. Well, I think you better move up
Speaker 1: there soon because space might be getting more crowded than
Speaker 1: you think. Are you talking about Elon Musk's Tesla that
Speaker 1: he launched out there? There's gonna be a traffic jam
Speaker 1: off Tesla's up there pretty soon. Hi. I'm Jorhea, a
Speaker 1: cartoonists and the creator of PhD Comics. I'm Daniel. I'm
Speaker 1: a particle of physicist. But I love all things space,
Speaker 1: even if they don't have aliens in them. And so
Speaker 1: welcome to our podcast, Daniel and Jorge Explain the Universe,
Speaker 1: a production of I Heart Radio in which we take
Speaker 1: a mental tour of the universe zipping from neutron stars
Speaker 1: to black holes to alien planets, and even talk about
Speaker 1: tiny things here on Earth like little particles, electrons and
Speaker 1: quantum tunneling. And the key is to share with you
Speaker 1: the wonders, the mystery, the majesty of this universe in
Speaker 1: a way that's explainable and hopefully makes you laugh and
Speaker 1: maybe cringe once or twice. That are bad jokes only
Speaker 1: but only once or twice. You cringes per episode, and
Speaker 1: then you're cut off, and then you that's right, Then
Speaker 1: you have to keep listening in silence. But yeah, it's
Speaker 1: about all the amazing things we can see from this
Speaker 1: planet Earth that we're sitting on in traffic, right, we're
Speaker 1: sort of in the traffic of the Solar System, right
Speaker 1: behind Mars Venus, next to the crowded asteroid belt. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we're in an unusually dense part of the universe. You know,
Speaker 1: if you took like an average cubic kilometer of the universe,
Speaker 1: it would be pretty empty. Most likely, you just get
Speaker 1: like a chunk of space in between galaxies. Even inside
Speaker 1: the galaxies, most of them don't have planets in them.
Speaker 1: So our neighborhood of the universe is pretty dense, we
Speaker 1: have a star, We've got a bunch of planets. There's
Speaker 1: a lot of rocks out there. Yeah, I hate it
Speaker 1: when the asteroids hunk behind me. It's so annoying. Well, look,
Speaker 1: they've been doing it for billions of years, so they
Speaker 1: hate when like nubies come in and mess up their commute.
Speaker 1: You know, that's right. It's people who don't signal as
Speaker 1: the Earth signal. Lately, which way it's turning, I don't know,
Speaker 1: but we keep launching up stuff into space out there,
Speaker 1: messing up everybody else's commute. So, yeah, we imagine there
Speaker 1: are a lot of you out there listening to this podcast,
Speaker 1: maybe sitting in your cars in traffic, and you're probably
Speaker 1: wondering where all these people came from. Are there too
Speaker 1: many people on Earth? And is it too crowded out here? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Maybe you feel like law eaching all those people out
Speaker 1: into space and you have the four oh five to yourself. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and so we were thinking, are there alternatives? Could you
Speaker 1: live out in space to get away from it all?
Speaker 1: But you might be surprised to discover that space actually
Speaker 1: has a bunch of stuff in it as well. It's
Speaker 1: not a pristine territory. It's the final frontier, but it's
Speaker 1: also filled with traffic. It's getting crowded out there, right,
Speaker 1: that's right. You probably heard about Elon Musk's plans to
Speaker 1: launch thousands and thousands of new satellites to improve your
Speaker 1: download speeds. Yeah, and not just the stuff that's going
Speaker 1: to be launched, but there are a bunch of stuffs
Speaker 1: out there already floating out there right in space. Yea.
Speaker 1: So we thought we'd dive into this topic between the
Speaker 1: Earth surface and the rest of the universe and talk
Speaker 1: about how much stuff is there out there? So to
Speaker 1: the on the program, we'll be tackling the question is
Speaker 1: space crowded? How much stuff is up there? How much
Speaker 1: room is there? And do you need to get a
Speaker 1: fast carporal late cast just to get out to get
Speaker 1: out to Marrows these days, well, traffic in space at
Speaker 1: least would be more complicated because you got another dimension
Speaker 1: to move in, right. I mean, I don't know how
Speaker 1: they will plan to organize it, but you can always
Speaker 1: go over with the car in front of you. That's
Speaker 1: like a double nightmare for me. It's like multidimensional traffic.
Speaker 1: It sounds like there's a zillion more ways to get
Speaker 1: into an accident. I feel like, at least here on Earth,
Speaker 1: if I'm stuck in traffic, I still I can still
Speaker 1: fantasize about flying upwards or digging down and getting away
Speaker 1: from it all. But if you're in space and it's
Speaker 1: space jam, in a traffic jam, uh, you've got nowhere
Speaker 1: to go. I think you owe Michael Jordans ten cents
Speaker 1: for mentioning that was bucks, buddy. Yeah. But you may
Speaker 1: have heard the news that Elon Musk is planning to
Speaker 1: launch a bunch of satellites. They recently deployed a hundred
Speaker 1: and twenty two satellites into low Earth orbit to test
Speaker 1: their Internet from space idea, and his plans are to
Speaker 1: launch a bunch more, not a hundred more, not to
Speaker 1: hundred more, not a thousand more, but something like ten
Speaker 1: thousand in the near future, stretching up to maybe forty
Speaker 1: thousand in the far freiture. And it's all part of
Speaker 1: his plan to create the space fornet. Is that what
Speaker 1: he's calling it? That isn't what he should have. That
Speaker 1: is the best possible there. You know, we got space force,
Speaker 1: why not space Internet? Yeah, and you're probably thinking, hey, look,
Speaker 1: space is big right, I mean, the universe is vast.
Speaker 1: Daniel was just saying how space is mostly empty, how
Speaker 1: could space ever get crowded? And you're right, there is
Speaker 1: a lot of space up there. You know, a quick
Speaker 1: calculation up to high Earth orbit and there's like two
Speaker 1: hundred trillion cubic kilometers of space just surrounding our planet.
Speaker 1: And currently humans have launched about two thousand operational satellites,
Speaker 1: So that doesn't seem like much. I mean, do the math.
Speaker 1: You get about ninety billion cubic kilometers per operational satellite.
Speaker 1: That seems like a lot, right, And it seems that's
Speaker 1: like the ratio between space and currently how many satellites
Speaker 1: there are out there. Yeah, we've got two thousand satellites
Speaker 1: that are running that are doing something that are helping us,
Speaker 1: that are like, you know, telling you where your phone are,
Speaker 1: or spying on North Korea or whatever. It takes all
Speaker 1: the amount of space out there in sort of high
Speaker 1: Earth orbit, and you get ninety billion cubic kilometers per satellite,
Speaker 1: So it seems like plenty of room. It seems like
Speaker 1: plenty of room. But I think the problem is that
Speaker 1: if you run into one of these things in space,
Speaker 1: it's pretty bad news. Yeah, this is very high speed traffic.
Speaker 1: So we thought it'd be fun to talk about whether
Speaker 1: there really is room out there? How dangerous is it
Speaker 1: to launch a satellite? And how long do you have
Speaker 1: to wait after you put on your left turn signal
Speaker 1: before you know it's clear to pull your tesla into
Speaker 1: low Earth orbit? Yeah, because you definitely don't want to
Speaker 1: have a bumper to bumper collision here with a satellite
Speaker 1: going in hundreds or thousands of kilometers per hour. No,
Speaker 1: you certainly don't. I'm pretty sure your insurance doesn't cover it.
Speaker 1: Definitely not the one you got on your rental car.
Speaker 1: So they're about two thousand satellites right now operating out
Speaker 1: in space. But it's not just satellites out there, right,
Speaker 1: there's also space junk. Yeah, So I was wondering if
Speaker 1: people were aware of this problem. Do people know that
Speaker 1: space has more than just operational satellites on it? Do
Speaker 1: people think space is totally empty and there's lots of
Speaker 1: room out there for frontiers people to go out and
Speaker 1: claim their chunk, or do people think that space is
Speaker 1: mostly crowded and already filled with Elon Musk's garbage? What
Speaker 1: are you gonna say, Elon, munk's junk, I should have
Speaker 1: said that that was much better. Maybe he's planning a
Speaker 1: business where he takes your junk and dumps it in space. Oh,
Speaker 1: there you go, one nine hundred got space jusk junk?
Speaker 1: Must what what must I do with my junk? And
Speaker 1: if he didn't plan that, he's probably a listener to
Speaker 1: this podcast because it's awesome and now he's planning it.
Speaker 1: So Elon, we had one percent sticks. So as you show,
Speaker 1: Daniel went out there into the streets and as random strangers.
Speaker 1: If they thought that space was getting too crowded, here's
Speaker 1: what people had to say before you hear their answers.
Speaker 1: Think to yourself, do you think space is overcrowded or
Speaker 1: is there a lot of room for more stuff? I
Speaker 1: would say probably filled with satellites and crowded. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: think it's like dangerous to be up there. I don't
Speaker 1: know if it's totally crowded, but it's probably getting there,
Speaker 1: I would imagine. I would say it was empty, mostly empty,
Speaker 1: so like room for lots more stuff. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: it's definitely still mostly empty. See you, there's lots of
Speaker 1: room for more satellites. Well, I don't think we should
Speaker 1: put a lot more satellites, but I bet there's more
Speaker 1: room of food needed to Oh. I think there's already
Speaker 1: a lot of satellites, and I think more will have
Speaker 1: a big impact on the light quality that astronomers can
Speaker 1: collect data from. Mostly empty mostly empty wise that because
Speaker 1: of the size of space and how you can put
Speaker 1: the satellites in different layers, in different orbits. Do you agree, yes, there,
Speaker 1: I think it's filled with satellites. It feels like that's
Speaker 1: sort of relative, but it's probably as room for more.
Speaker 1: I guess that there's a lot of space junk out there,
Speaker 1: but there's so much. I know there's a lot of
Speaker 1: space up there, so I don't think it's too crowded.
Speaker 1: I know there are collisions, but I don't think they
Speaker 1: happened that often. Um, but I'd say in the near
Speaker 1: future that probably could be a problem. So why do
Speaker 1: you think it's mostly filled up? Just because the amount
Speaker 1: of communication that we have and data exchange, there's gotta
Speaker 1: be satellites, old satellites to suppose satellites. So is there
Speaker 1: like a danger of satellites bumping into each other and stuff?
Speaker 1: I'm sure, but I don't know what they'll do anything,
Speaker 1: But I don't know if they're made of you know,
Speaker 1: but I've heard rumors of space trash too, you know.
Speaker 1: All right, people don't seem too concerned about the crowdedness
Speaker 1: of space. No, but I'm not sure how many of
Speaker 1: these folks actually had like plans to launch anything. So
Speaker 1: it's a bit of an abstract question for them, you know, Oh,
Speaker 1: I see, I see. Do you think that maybe they're
Speaker 1: trying not to be alarmist or maybe they're thinking, Man,
Speaker 1: I got too many things to worry about here, I
Speaker 1: got finals coming up, I got rent to pay. Who
Speaker 1: cares about space junk? M you didn't get a lot
Speaker 1: of concern here. No, but maybe if I told them
Speaker 1: all about space junk and made them worry about the
Speaker 1: future of those satellites, they'd be worried about the next
Speaker 1: time they got on an airplane, whether the satellite that's
Speaker 1: navig that's helping their flight and navigate, is um potentially
Speaker 1: being exposed to high speed garbage. All right, well, let's
Speaker 1: um let's talk about it. The idea is that maybe
Speaker 1: space we're throwing too many things out there into space,
Speaker 1: like as a species, you know, It was exciting when
Speaker 1: we sent the first satellite out there, and it was
Speaker 1: exciting when we sent people out there. But now I
Speaker 1: think there's sort of a growing concern that are we
Speaker 1: basically treating our orbital space as the next big junkyard. Yeah, exactly,
Speaker 1: not a landfill, but a space fill, a space space film. Well,
Speaker 1: I guess technically landfills are space field. Everything is a
Speaker 1: space field from that perspective. Well, I was surprised. I
Speaker 1: did a bit of research, and I was surprised to
Speaker 1: discover sort of the small number and the large number
Speaker 1: of stuff that we have in orbit. Really it's both
Speaker 1: a lot and little. Yeah, it is. I mean the
Speaker 1: small number is the number of operational satellites. Like, we've
Speaker 1: been launching satellites for fifty years, and I know it's expensive.
Speaker 1: It's not just like anybody can launch them, but they're
Speaker 1: not that rare anymore. And you know, governments and spy
Speaker 1: agencies and armies all have their own satellites and companies do.
Speaker 1: So I was surprised to discover there are only about
Speaker 1: two thousand, two hud eighteen operational satellites in orbit. That's
Speaker 1: not really that many. Really, do you think that's not
Speaker 1: a lot. I think it's not a lot. I mean,
Speaker 1: these days it's not that expensive to launch a satellite.
Speaker 1: You know, elementary schools can fund us a micro's cube
Speaker 1: sat that ends up in orbit and takes pictures of stuff.
Speaker 1: So the prices are really coming down. So two thousand,
Speaker 1: two D eighteen not just like the big ones you
Speaker 1: see with the giant solar panels. But it could be
Speaker 1: just like little tiny satellites. Yeah, some of those are
Speaker 1: pretty small. Some of those are pretty small. But we
Speaker 1: only got two thousand, two hundreds. You know, like how
Speaker 1: many cars are on a freeway at any moment. It's
Speaker 1: much bigger number than that, and so, and space is
Speaker 1: really big, and so at first you think, wow, there's
Speaker 1: not that many satellites and space is huge, so there's
Speaker 1: plenty of room for more traffic. Nothing to worry, nothing
Speaker 1: to worry. But but but the problem is that it's
Speaker 1: not just operational satellites that are out there, right, it's
Speaker 1: first of all, unoperational satellites, and then bits of satellites,
Speaker 1: junk of satellites, a little bits of rockets that blew up,
Speaker 1: you know, stuff that astronauts dropped while they were on spacewalks.
Speaker 1: It turns out there's a lot of junk up there
Speaker 1: really and it's all man made? Or is it also
Speaker 1: like you know asteroids to somehow got caught in our
Speaker 1: orbit or things like that. This is just man made
Speaker 1: space junk. I mean there are meteors right that hit
Speaker 1: the Earth and burnham the atmosphere and you see that
Speaker 1: kind of stuff on a nice night when you're seeing
Speaker 1: meteor showers, etcetera. But this is just man made stuff
Speaker 1: that's in or wow, how many do how much? How
Speaker 1: much of this stuff do you think is out there?
Speaker 1: So they did a calculation and you can't count this
Speaker 1: stuff because a lot of it is too small. But
Speaker 1: you know, we have two thousand operational satellites right, but
Speaker 1: in terms of space junk, there's at least twenty thousand
Speaker 1: trackable objects that's just like chunks of stuff that you
Speaker 1: can see that you can see that like you know
Speaker 1: Norad and the Department of Defense and how those folks
Speaker 1: are keeping track of Wow, don't they wonder what they are? Like?
Speaker 1: Could there be spy cameras from aliens? Is what I'm
Speaker 1: where I'm going with this, Daniel Man, I would love
Speaker 1: if there was a spike camera. But if I was
Speaker 1: an alien and I wanted to build a spy camera,
Speaker 1: I would just put it in a rock, you know,
Speaker 1: hide it and make it look like a big asteroid
Speaker 1: or something. But this is just the stuff they're tracking,
Speaker 1: you know, because they don't want their two billion dollars
Speaker 1: spy satellite or ten billion dollars space telescope or whatever
Speaker 1: to bump into a piece of junks. And they track
Speaker 1: this stuff. But that's only the stuff that they can track.
Speaker 1: They track it so that they can so it doesn't
Speaker 1: so they can maneuver around the other space drunk. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like air traffic control, right, you want to get
Speaker 1: this out of the lands, you have to make sure
Speaker 1: now the other planes are too close by, and so
Speaker 1: you've got to manage it. And so they keep track
Speaker 1: of all this stuff. But it's a ten to one ratio. Right.
Speaker 1: Did the two thousand operational objects include the secret space
Speaker 1: spy satellites that they don't really want us to know?
Speaker 1: Or are those in the unknown category? Um, that doesn't
Speaker 1: include the things that the government doesn't want us to know.
Speaker 1: But you know, a reasonable estimates based on launches and
Speaker 1: stuff like that, because it's pretty hard to hide a launch,
Speaker 1: so they can track twenty thou objects. And are these
Speaker 1: small or these like you know, a bolt from that
Speaker 1: slipped out of the space station, or are they pretty big?
Speaker 1: These things are pretty big. You know, they're more than
Speaker 1: ten centimeters across. You know, the largest um fifteen hundred
Speaker 1: of these things wigh a total of nineteen hundred tons,
Speaker 1: and the largest ten thousand of them weigh like five
Speaker 1: thousand five tons, So it's a pretty big amount of stuff.
Speaker 1: And again, this is just the stuff that we can track.
Speaker 1: The stuff falls apart and get smaller, and then the
Speaker 1: numbers get crazy, and this is all just human junk
Speaker 1: in space. Like we've been. We've been that careless in
Speaker 1: space that we have twenty thousand bits of junk out there.
Speaker 1: You showed like a national park and this is like
Speaker 1: littered with people's picnic garbage. I guess if you're out
Speaker 1: in space, what do you do with your junk? Well,
Speaker 1: actually what you do is you drop it on Earth.
Speaker 1: The best thing to do with space junk is to
Speaker 1: push it down into the atmosphere because the atmosphere will
Speaker 1: burn it up. Anything from space is moving pretty quickly,
Speaker 1: and if it hit the atmosphere, you'll just get fried.
Speaker 1: So the best thing to do is to drop it
Speaker 1: on the Earth. The worst thing to do is to
Speaker 1: leave it in orbit around the Earth. I see. The
Speaker 1: best thing to do is to burn it in the
Speaker 1: atmosphere so it rains down in innocent people. Nobody, almost
Speaker 1: nobody has ever been heard by falling space jump. The
Speaker 1: atmosphere is a really good force field against space junk.
Speaker 1: It's so good that what we should do with our
Speaker 1: space junk is throw it against the atmosphere to you know,
Speaker 1: atomize it. Oh, I see. So this is stuff that
Speaker 1: has maybe falling off the space station or slipped out
Speaker 1: of an astronaut's hand, but that stayed in orbit. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and also the products of other collisions. And if you
Speaker 1: look at even smaller stuff, there are nine hundred thousand
Speaker 1: things that are smaller than ten centimeters. That's almost a
Speaker 1: million pieces of space junk, little tiny bits. But those
Speaker 1: they can't track, and they that's just an estimate. These
Speaker 1: are not tiny bits. I mean ten centimeters. You know,
Speaker 1: we're talking to something the size of a baseball. Like
Speaker 1: that thing going at ten kilometers per second is not
Speaker 1: a tiny anything. But you're right, these things are too
Speaker 1: small for them to track. That's a lot of baseballs.
Speaker 1: It's a lot of baseballs. And then if you just
Speaker 1: say like any piece of junk, no matter what size,
Speaker 1: then there are more than a hundred million bits of
Speaker 1: space debris. And so where did all this stuff come from?
Speaker 1: Is it all just from you know, our astronauts being
Speaker 1: litter bugs or litter space bugs. Yeah, you know astronauts
Speaker 1: like the flame and hot cheetohs and they just crumple
Speaker 1: up the package and toss it over their shoulder. No,
Speaker 1: it comes from like satellites falling apart, you know, bits
Speaker 1: of paint flaking off of satellites. Also, we fired a
Speaker 1: lot of rockets into space, and we just sort of
Speaker 1: like leave those spent rocket stages and little bits of
Speaker 1: like frozen fuel that didn't get used up. We just
Speaker 1: generally haven't been thinking carefully about what kind of stuff
Speaker 1: will be left from our exploration of space because we thought, hey,
Speaker 1: space is so big and empty, it doesn't really matter
Speaker 1: if you create a thousand little shards of ice that
Speaker 1: are flying at really high speed. Wow, so it is
Speaker 1: getting crowded with joke. I mean, there aren't that many
Speaker 1: satellite but there's millions of bits of stuff out there.
Speaker 1: There are millions of bits of stuff out there, Yeah,
Speaker 1: flakes of paint, little bits of rocket motors, frozen coolant,
Speaker 1: and you know, sometimes it's stuff that was created sort
Speaker 1: of on purpose. Like in the sixties, the US and
Speaker 1: Russia had anti satellite weapons. We built special missiles we
Speaker 1: could fire at like the enemy's satellites because you know,
Speaker 1: maybe you don't want them flying their spy satellites over Colorado,
Speaker 1: and so you want to fire a missile to take
Speaker 1: out their satellite. Interesting space wars, space wars wars, Yeah,
Speaker 1: and China got in the game about ten years ago.
Speaker 1: They built a system and they tested it and they
Speaker 1: destroyed one of their own satellites, but it created a
Speaker 1: million pieces of space debris that are still up there.
Speaker 1: They blew something up as a test. Yeah, they fired
Speaker 1: a missile into space in two thousand seven, blew up
Speaker 1: one of their own defunct satellites and it created a
Speaker 1: million pieces of space junk. Great, thank you, China. And
Speaker 1: sometimes it is astronauts, you know, like there was one
Speaker 1: time an astraw lost a bag of tools. You know,
Speaker 1: you're out there on a spacewalk, you forget to clip
Speaker 1: it and the oops, it just sort of drifts away
Speaker 1: from you. And that was a Sandra Bullock movie. I
Speaker 1: seen that movie. Then that's the one part of that
Speaker 1: movie that was correct. Um An astronaut ones like lost
Speaker 1: spare glove, you know, so that kind of stuff is
Speaker 1: floating out there, but it's dwarfed by this sort of
Speaker 1: like a little just pieces of junk from satellites that
Speaker 1: are broken or smashed into each other. I wonder how
Speaker 1: that happens. You're like, you're out in space, you might die,
Speaker 1: but you take off your glove just just to like
Speaker 1: pick it a little something, and then whoops. You let
Speaker 1: you gotta open your flame and hot cheetos package, right,
Speaker 1: and you can't do those and those really thick gloves, yeah,
Speaker 1: those big thick fingers, and then you take the cheetos
Speaker 1: up and sort of bang them up against your space helmet.
Speaker 1: You know, this thing through the shooting use velcro fore
Speaker 1: the cheetos. No. I think there must have been an
Speaker 1: extra glove or something. But occasionally astronauts have job stuff
Speaker 1: that's not a big contribution to the space junk. Most
Speaker 1: of it is like flakes of paint and little bits
Speaker 1: of rocket cooliant and stuff like that, but it's still dangerous.
Speaker 1: And how much of that is our space cheetos? There
Speaker 1: are no Cheetos in space that I'm aware of. That's
Speaker 1: her first for you. Also, great, so that that's a
Speaker 1: lot of stuff out there, and so I guess now
Speaker 1: the question is it a problem? Is it going to
Speaker 1: be a problem, and what can we do about it?
Speaker 1: So let's get into that. But first let's take a
Speaker 1: quick break, all right. I know, so there are millions
Speaker 1: of pieces of debris out there in just in our
Speaker 1: immediate orbit, and some of them might be space cheetos,
Speaker 1: some of them might not be. We don't know what
Speaker 1: the Chinese or the Russians have been developing out there
Speaker 1: or testing. Maybe they have a system to launch cheetos
Speaker 1: into space at our satellites. Yeah, maybe cheetos are especially
Speaker 1: good at taking out spy satellites, you know, I mean,
Speaker 1: until you do the experiment, you never know the answer.
Speaker 1: You gotta keep an open minding science, right, Yeah, you
Speaker 1: want you want that um you know that cheesy powder
Speaker 1: that they have to get into the enemy's satellite mechanism,
Speaker 1: And that's the worst, the worst of those gyro mechanisms. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's especially designed by food scientists to be a space weapon,
Speaker 1: gets all over your your spy leans and then it's
Speaker 1: all ruined. Space junk really is a problem. Okay, so
Speaker 1: it is. It is a problem that scientists are concerned
Speaker 1: about right now. It really is. Yeah, And it's a
Speaker 1: problem sort for two reasons. One is that it's a
Speaker 1: danger to the stuff that's out there, and the other
Speaker 1: is that it's likely to make more of itself. So
Speaker 1: first of all, you worry just like is the stuff
Speaker 1: going to bump into something valuable? I mean, you build
Speaker 1: your complicated space telescope or spy side light or whatever,
Speaker 1: and you shoot it up into space, and then somebody's
Speaker 1: junk comes along like ten to fifteen kilometers per second
Speaker 1: and just trashes it. Wow, fifteen kilometers per second? Like,
Speaker 1: is that if it's in a different orbit or like
Speaker 1: you know, like in um you can't tend to think
Speaker 1: in space it's everything being kind of at the same
Speaker 1: speed that you are. But is it possible for things
Speaker 1: to be in a different orbit and come at you
Speaker 1: at that speed? Absolutely? This is not organized self driving
Speaker 1: cars in space right where everything is moving along with
Speaker 1: no relative velocity. There's lots of different orbits that cross right,
Speaker 1: and there's no traffic lights, and so you can free
Speaker 1: for all. It's a free for all exactly. There's no
Speaker 1: cops up there whistling to people to stop or anything,
Speaker 1: and so your orbit path could totally cross somebody else's
Speaker 1: orbital path. That's a problem. Even a flick of paint
Speaker 1: would probably do some harm to your solar panel or
Speaker 1: Cheeto's bag, for sure. A tiny fleck with paint going
Speaker 1: at fifteen kilometers per second is like getting punched by
Speaker 1: Mike Tyson, right, and nobody wants their satellite getting punched
Speaker 1: by Mike Tyson, especially in space. That would be extra embarrassing.
Speaker 1: Maybe NASA should do that, you know, they should have
Speaker 1: like last pre flight check, Mike, please come down and
Speaker 1: punch the satellite and see how it goes. But it's
Speaker 1: a real problem. And you know, sometimes you can protect
Speaker 1: parts of your satellite, we'll talk about that later, but
Speaker 1: some parts you just can't. Like you don't want to
Speaker 1: build a shield in front of the lens of your
Speaker 1: space telescope, that's why you built it right to look
Speaker 1: out into space, or you have these big solar panels.
Speaker 1: You can't really do much to protect them. They're supposed
Speaker 1: to be out there gathering sunlight, so you're really vulnerable.
Speaker 1: And even if you put armor on your satellite, that's
Speaker 1: just gets more expensive, right because every little ounce you
Speaker 1: send it to space because like right, yeah, you can't
Speaker 1: armor your solar panels because that blocks them and that
Speaker 1: they don't work. So it's a real problem. And they
Speaker 1: try to keep track of this stuff and because they
Speaker 1: don't want their expensive satellites to get hit by space junk,
Speaker 1: and so they have you know, as we were saying,
Speaker 1: tracking on like twenty thousand of these things. And they
Speaker 1: observe a lot of close calls. There's something like twenty
Speaker 1: close calls every day between a satellite and some piece
Speaker 1: of trackable junk. Like every day times there's somebody freaking
Speaker 1: out in some control room going turn left, turn left,
Speaker 1: watch out for that space to Yeah, And they're pretty
Speaker 1: careful about this stuff, and so they have to like
Speaker 1: contact the owners of the satellite and say, hey, some
Speaker 1: piece of junk is coming your way. You might want
Speaker 1: to move up or down or let to write or
Speaker 1: just any direction really to get out of the way.
Speaker 1: Oh wow, are there like traffic controllers or space can
Speaker 1: you can I study to be a space traffic controller. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think it's a pretty stressful job. But the Defense
Speaker 1: Department does this, you know, because they've got a lot
Speaker 1: of satellites up there that are pretty valuable and pretty
Speaker 1: important for national security, and so they keep track of
Speaker 1: this stuff and they contact satellite owners if their satellite
Speaker 1: is in the path of some junk. Oh wow, imagine
Speaker 1: getting that call. I think it's not too unusual, you know.
Speaker 1: I think most satellites a few times a year have
Speaker 1: to maneuver around space junk because it's getting kind of
Speaker 1: crowded up there. And we've even had collisions. Really, and
Speaker 1: what happens You just obliterate the satellite or yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's the problem is that when to like defunct satellites
Speaker 1: hit each other or when a piece of space junk
Speaker 1: takes out of satellite, what do you get more space
Speaker 1: junk more? Right, that's the other problem you're saying, And
Speaker 1: he said junk gets junk. Yeah, It's like if you
Speaker 1: litter in the park, somebody else walks are like, Oh,
Speaker 1: looks like this park isn't cleaned up too much. I'll
Speaker 1: just dump all my trash here. Um, But I'm not
Speaker 1: sure that analogy works, but the idea that it's wondering
Speaker 1: how that works. It's more like if you if you
Speaker 1: find a piece of litter in the park and you
Speaker 1: go to grow it, it it turns into two pieces of litter, right, yeah,
Speaker 1: I guess so, or this literal taxi and breaks you
Speaker 1: into pieces of literal in park right covers you and
Speaker 1: Cheetos does It's terrible, um, But the idea is that, yeah,
Speaker 1: that if a piece of space junk is a satellite,
Speaker 1: it causes more space junk, and then the number of
Speaker 1: pieces of space junk grows, and then you have a
Speaker 1: higher chances of making more space junk, which of course
Speaker 1: just makes more space junk. And so you can see
Speaker 1: this sort of cascade effects possible. You get enough stuff
Speaker 1: out there, the chances of collision grow very quickly, and
Speaker 1: then the chances have become almost certain, and then you
Speaker 1: just have spaces just totally filled with junk, right, dangers
Speaker 1: junk right that you can't get through. Yeah. And so
Speaker 1: some sort of space groups, advocacy groups predictlarly sort of
Speaker 1: tipping point where we're gonna get too much junk pretty
Speaker 1: soon that you're gonna get this cascade effect, and it
Speaker 1: might destroy a huge number of things in orbit and
Speaker 1: basically make space unusable. You can actually kind of extrapolate
Speaker 1: and and see the point where it's just the jungle
Speaker 1: just multiply beyond making space reachable. Yeah, because you can't
Speaker 1: fly a rocket with people in it through space if
Speaker 1: it's totally filled with space junk. You can't launch a
Speaker 1: satellite into that orbit if it's totally filled with space junk.
Speaker 1: And if all the satellites that we had out there
Speaker 1: right now ended up getting hit by space junk and
Speaker 1: turning into more space junk, you have an enormous number
Speaker 1: of pieces of junk, and it would make space basically unusable.
Speaker 1: You know what we need, I think, Daniel, we need
Speaker 1: like a giant space vacuum that would totally suck space
Speaker 1: already has a vacuum. Why doesn't space just suck it
Speaker 1: up into outer space? Suck it up space? Um, But
Speaker 1: it's you know, it's already sort of a problem. Like
Speaker 1: we have people out there in space right now in
Speaker 1: the space station, and these folks a few times a
Speaker 1: year or have to move the whole space station like
Speaker 1: into a higher orbit in order to avoid some piece
Speaker 1: of junk that's coming nearby. They're actively doing, you know,
Speaker 1: like Frogger is like changing names all the time. It's
Speaker 1: space space. Yeah, and sometimes they have to like rush
Speaker 1: the astronauts into one of those escape capsules because the
Speaker 1: big pieces of junk is coming that didn't spot soon
Speaker 1: enough and can't get out of the way, and it
Speaker 1: might like you know, debilitate the space station and those
Speaker 1: folks that have to basically fly back down to Earth.
Speaker 1: I feel like you're quoting that Tender Bullet movie again.
Speaker 1: I think it might go the other way around. I
Speaker 1: think the Sandra Bot movie is based on real events.
Speaker 1: So and I think it also happened with the Space
Speaker 1: Shuttle ones right, like it like it actually did some
Speaker 1: damage through the Space Shuttle. All the time, every Space
Speaker 1: Shuttle comes back is pitted with space junk. You'll find
Speaker 1: like holes in the wings, they find scratches in the windshield.
Speaker 1: It's not unusual when the Space Shuttle comes back to
Speaker 1: find like, you know, bits of stuff embedded in the
Speaker 1: windshield all the way down to like half the depth
Speaker 1: of the wind She old, yeah, yeah, exactly. You're like,
Speaker 1: what is that squeak squick? Is that Cheetos? What how
Speaker 1: did that get in there? Yeah, it's a it's a
Speaker 1: dirty environment out there, and so you know how you're
Speaker 1: driving down the highway you end up with like a
Speaker 1: bunch of bugs on your windshield. Imagine those bugs were
Speaker 1: going you know, ten times a speed of sound or something,
Speaker 1: or they were like ball bearings just over the highway.
Speaker 1: That would be pretty dangerous. Yeah, it would be pretty dangerous.
Speaker 1: And so it's a real problem. We got to make
Speaker 1: sure there's not too much space junk up there, and
Speaker 1: we've got to clean it up sort of before it
Speaker 1: gets too late, before it starts to multiply out of control. Okay,
Speaker 1: have a new product idea for elon musk already, I'm
Speaker 1: sure I'm not ready. Giant space windshield wipers. That's what
Speaker 1: we cleanse the atmosphere. Well, you know, we're going to
Speaker 1: talk about solutions to the space junk problem. And that's
Speaker 1: not the dumbest one that's on the list. Oh really,
Speaker 1: all right, it's already taken. It was already in a
Speaker 1: movie with Sender Bullock. So that affects our ability to
Speaker 1: go out into space. Does it affect actually us here
Speaker 1: on Earth if space gets filled with junk? Well, this
Speaker 1: sort of the direct problem and the indirect problem. The
Speaker 1: direct problem is, like, do you have to worry about
Speaker 1: a piece of junk falling out of space and conking
Speaker 1: you on the head? Right, Well, there's about one piece
Speaker 1: of space junk per day that falls out of orbit
Speaker 1: and into the atmosphere, but those burn up. Right, as
Speaker 1: we were saying before, it's actually a good thing for
Speaker 1: space junk to hit the atmosphere because it gets fried,
Speaker 1: it gets shredded, and it's just a nice you know,
Speaker 1: another meteor in the night sky. It's pretty rare for
Speaker 1: this stuff to actually hit the Earth. There was once
Speaker 1: in a woman in Oklahoma was hit by a piece
Speaker 1: of rocket, but usually you don't worry about it. Like
Speaker 1: the Air Force when they launch rockets, they don't even
Speaker 1: really care where they go because they just mostly burn up.
Speaker 1: Of course it had to be Oklahoma, I feel, where
Speaker 1: else are you saying Oklahoma deserves it? Or just like
Speaker 1: weird stuff happens in Oklahoma? And say I was if
Speaker 1: I was writing a Steven Spielberg movie where a piece
Speaker 1: of dunk kids the womin in the head, it would
Speaker 1: probably be an Oklahoma. Alright, that's good to know, but
Speaker 1: I think the more direct issue for people out here
Speaker 1: is that we rely on stuff in space. When your
Speaker 1: flight is taking off, it's using a navigational system that
Speaker 1: relies on satellites. When your phone is locating itself because
Speaker 1: you got lost while going for a hike, it's using GPS.
Speaker 1: So our society really relies on space technology. And if
Speaker 1: all that was destroyed or became unusable, you know, hey,
Speaker 1: listening to Daniel Jorge explain the universe would take longer
Speaker 1: to download, you would get laws trying to get to
Speaker 1: some WiFi or something. Yeah, precisely. So it's important part
Speaker 1: of our society. We want to maintain it. It's not
Speaker 1: really a direct danger to you unless you're an astronaut,
Speaker 1: but it's important that we take care of the space
Speaker 1: near the Earth. Right, it's not good. It's not good.
Speaker 1: It's not good. All right, let's get into what we
Speaker 1: can actually do to maybe clean up some of the
Speaker 1: space junk maybe or prevent it or um work around it.
Speaker 1: But first let's take another quick break. All right, Then
Speaker 1: space is a little bit of a problem, and you're
Speaker 1: also telling me it's kind of a problem or it
Speaker 1: might become a problem for astronomers too. Right, like people
Speaker 1: trying to study space. Yeah, there's been a big uproar
Speaker 1: recently because of Elon Musk's plans to basically fill space
Speaker 1: with satellites. He's launched, you know, something like a hundred
Speaker 1: and twenty these things so far and then sort of
Speaker 1: low Earth orbit and they streak across the sky. And
Speaker 1: if you have really valuable time on a telescope because
Speaker 1: you want to study something super far away and you've
Speaker 1: been waiting months for your like ten hours of telescope time,
Speaker 1: and then Musk satellites you sort of zooming from the lens,
Speaker 1: you know, then you get a big streak. You don't
Speaker 1: want that photo bomb. You don't want that photo bomb.
Speaker 1: And he's only launched a hundred He's planning to launch
Speaker 1: thousands and thou these things. So astronomers are worried. First
Speaker 1: of all, like easy going to be blocking your view.
Speaker 1: Is ground based astronomy going to be impossible in the
Speaker 1: near future just to improve our Internet access. But then
Speaker 1: also from the space junk point of view, like you've
Speaker 1: got thousands of things up there, one of them goes
Speaker 1: wrong bumps into another one, like it could pretty quickly
Speaker 1: go bad. I mean if it was Bill Murray, you'd
Speaker 1: be like, hey, that's a cool photo bomb on my photo.
Speaker 1: But Elon Musk, that's just annoying. Yeah, precisely. And remember,
Speaker 1: you know, you have ten times as many things up there.
Speaker 1: It's a hundred times more likely to get collisions because
Speaker 1: you have many more ways to get collisions. And so
Speaker 1: he's planning to launch thousands of these things and just
Speaker 1: a few of them have to go wrong for it
Speaker 1: to sort of cascade and create a disaster, reached that
Speaker 1: tipping point where it all just pulverizes everything and it
Speaker 1: becomes a deadly, deadly barrier for space travel. Yeah, he's
Speaker 1: thought of this, of course, and he has planned, and
Speaker 1: you know NASA and f A, whatever say that he's
Speaker 1: planning is good and essentially involves making sure that any
Speaker 1: of these satellites that go wrong basically just fall and
Speaker 1: then they get burned up in the atmosphere. And that's
Speaker 1: not a terrible plan because that's what we want. We
Speaker 1: want to push all this stuff, all the space junk
Speaker 1: down into the atmospheres. The atmosphere does the job for us.
Speaker 1: So the friction of the atmosphere basically melts all this stuff.
Speaker 1: So how does that work. So that's one way we
Speaker 1: can kind of avoid the space junk problem is to
Speaker 1: make sure it comes down. But how can they do
Speaker 1: that if it's like, if sanidite becomes disabled, what's going
Speaker 1: to make it actually maneuver into the atmosphere? Well, you
Speaker 1: can just get lucky and hope that it's the way
Speaker 1: that it maneuvered or got disabled makes it fall. But
Speaker 1: you know, there's a lot of stuff out there that's
Speaker 1: in stable orbits, and uh, one thing we can just
Speaker 1: do is wait, you know, stop launching stuff and just
Speaker 1: wait because eventually all this stuff will fall. Remember, the
Speaker 1: atmosphere is not just like a turn off. There's no
Speaker 1: perfect space in near Earth. There's a very slight atmosphere
Speaker 1: and it drags on stuff and slows it down. Right,
Speaker 1: But the problem isn't the problem that it's just one
Speaker 1: piece per per day that falls. Wouldn't that take you know,
Speaker 1: how would take a long time. So that's not really
Speaker 1: a solution. So people have some crazy ideas, you know.
Speaker 1: One of them, of course involves lasers. Of course, Hey, physicists,
Speaker 1: how should we solve the problems lasers? No? No, I
Speaker 1: just really want to comb my hair. Oh yeah, do
Speaker 1: you want to know what the problem is first though,
Speaker 1: just lasers. Lasers, That's right. The solution is always lasers,
Speaker 1: and the answer is always aliens. Um No, But lasers
Speaker 1: is not a terrible idea because if you could shoot
Speaker 1: a laser at this stuff, you could slow it down.
Speaker 1: You could You don't even need to blow it up, right,
Speaker 1: You don't want to blow it up. But you want
Speaker 1: to do is slow it down a little bit so
Speaker 1: it drops and then the atmosphere takes over. So you
Speaker 1: just gotta sort of like a blade it a little
Speaker 1: bit on the side. I remember we talked about those
Speaker 1: guys that are also using lasers to maybe save the
Speaker 1: Earth from incoming asteroids. It's a similar idea. You don't
Speaker 1: have to blow up the whole asteroid. You just got
Speaker 1: to sort of shave off a little at city in
Speaker 1: one side so it misses. In this case, you want
Speaker 1: to just sort of like rough it up a little
Speaker 1: bit so that it falls into the atmosphere. Wow. Like
Speaker 1: literally you'd be like pew pew, pew, pew pew taking
Speaker 1: stuff out of out of the sky. There for the test,
Speaker 1: That's exactly what it sounded like. Oh really, well, why
Speaker 1: imagine that I can foresee what physicists but sound effectively.
Speaker 1: But you know, shooting death rays into the sky, it
Speaker 1: would take a lot of death rays. And so this approach,
Speaker 1: of course has some problems. So people studied about ten
Speaker 1: years ago, but it doesn't seem like it's really going
Speaker 1: to solve sort of the larger scale problems of having
Speaker 1: a hundred million objects. So my son practicing video games
Speaker 1: all this time just to get ready for that job
Speaker 1: of shooting down space degree, I should tell him there's
Speaker 1: no career in that. That's right. Yeah, I think you know,
Speaker 1: that was very impressive long range planning. But I'm hoping
Speaker 1: there are other ways that you're something can make money
Speaker 1: with those skills. Okay, So that's so shooting them down
Speaker 1: with lasers not a great, uh good long term solution.
Speaker 1: What are other ways we can have solved this space
Speaker 1: jump problem. Well, another one is a ship called clean
Speaker 1: Space one which looks, I'm not joking, like a big
Speaker 1: net and the idea is to gather space junk together
Speaker 1: and then again dump it into the atmosphere. Right, it's
Speaker 1: sort of weird, but we're treating the whole Earth is
Speaker 1: like a trash can, and the Clean Space up. What
Speaker 1: you gotta do is gather the stuff and then dump
Speaker 1: it into the trash can. And so this is maybe
Speaker 1: your son could operate this thing, you know, steer this
Speaker 1: thing around, gathering space jump. That's what every parent wants
Speaker 1: for your son to be a space janitor. Thank you,
Speaker 1: Daniel Hey, it's pretty glamorous. I mean space janitors. Come on,
Speaker 1: that's the way you work your way up, right, That's
Speaker 1: how you become an astronaut. You've got space, you get
Speaker 1: a job as a janitor, and then you know, step
Speaker 1: by step, eventually you're piloting the space station I mean spacetaniter.
Speaker 1: It's just like, you know, barely a step above podcaster.
Speaker 1: So at least it's a step up. Um. But that's
Speaker 1: not a joke. You know, this is an idea. Gather
Speaker 1: the stuff and then dump into lower orbit and hope
Speaker 1: that it eventually decay, is down to burn up. So
Speaker 1: this would be what does this look like like a giant?
Speaker 1: Like a giant like four rockets holding a giant net
Speaker 1: in between them. It looks basically, yeah, like a big net.
Speaker 1: You know, it's got like four big arms and some
Speaker 1: lines between them, and they would essentially just like reach
Speaker 1: out like an tuck a huge claw, grab a piece
Speaker 1: of space junk and then drag it down into lower orbit.
Speaker 1: But this would work for you know, maybe like the
Speaker 1: twenty thousand defunct large trackable objects we have, but it
Speaker 1: wouldn't really help clean up all the other tiny stuff,
Speaker 1: all right, So then what can we do about those?
Speaker 1: Not that much? I mean, one thing we can do
Speaker 1: is we can stop adding more stuff. Right when has
Speaker 1: it ever worked with humanity? We could start being responsible,
Speaker 1: I promised, starting today, we're gonna be good. Really this time,
Speaker 1: this time it's gonna be We're gonna be good. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna stop eating those cheetos tomorrow tomorrow. But here, actually
Speaker 1: there's a bit of hope because Americans, at least American
Speaker 1: space agencies have tried to design their rockets to produce
Speaker 1: less space junk, so create like smaller number of larger
Speaker 1: pieces of debris that are more likely to fall into
Speaker 1: the atmosphere. They don't explode bits of coolant into space
Speaker 1: because earlier we're like, oh, I don't care whatever it's
Speaker 1: out in space, But now we do care, And so
Speaker 1: are more recent rockets produced less space junk per launch,
Speaker 1: per launch, or per like if you lose it per
Speaker 1: launcher launch. Every time you launch a rocket there's stages
Speaker 1: of it that are supposed to burn up and don't.
Speaker 1: Always there's bits of coolant that you know, that league
Speaker 1: or solid rocket fuel that wasn't burnt up. And so
Speaker 1: are more recent rockets are better at that. They produced
Speaker 1: less junk per launch, but still they do produce junk.
Speaker 1: So you know that's that's not a way to clean
Speaker 1: it up. It's just a way to like be bad
Speaker 1: less quickly. So I think what I'm getting from you
Speaker 1: is that to solve the space junk problems, scientists have
Speaker 1: come up with a couple of solutions. One is, wait
Speaker 1: a million years. That solves a lot of problems. To
Speaker 1: convince you managed to stop littering that never happened. Or
Speaker 1: three shoot lasers at it. Yeah, and so we're all
Speaker 1: waiting for your son to be good enough at the
Speaker 1: laser to solve this problem. Doesn't sound like there's a
Speaker 1: good solution here. No, there's not a great solution to
Speaker 1: cleaning up space junk. And so in the interim, what
Speaker 1: we've done is just trying to protect our satellites. You
Speaker 1: put a shield around it to try to protect it
Speaker 1: and they're pretty clever. This is really cool design. It's
Speaker 1: called a Whipple shield. And the ideas and don't just
Speaker 1: like make your satellite really heavy with armor, but put
Speaker 1: a really light thin shield, but have it be separated
Speaker 1: from the satellite a little bit. And the idea is
Speaker 1: that it doesn't destroy the space junk, is sort of
Speaker 1: deflects it, it turns it, it breaks it up and
Speaker 1: and changes its direction. Oh interesting, Yeah, and so you're
Speaker 1: more likely to survive impact with space junk, and so
Speaker 1: you know, we have some technology to protect ourselves, but yeah,
Speaker 1: we sort of painted ourselves into a corner here. Space
Speaker 1: is filled with junk and it's not an easy way
Speaker 1: to clean it up. Well, hopefully those um maybe in
Speaker 1: the future space general will be like the most valuable
Speaker 1: profession on the planet. Yeah. I think we also just
Speaker 1: need to find some new way to put the cost
Speaker 1: of making space junk on the people producing it, because
Speaker 1: right now the cost of space junk is on the
Speaker 1: people launching a new satellite. Like you have a billion
Speaker 1: dollar satellite, you have to protect yourself from the space junk.
Speaker 1: The people who satellite made that, they're free and clear,
Speaker 1: they don't really care. So somehow we need to make
Speaker 1: sure that the people who are producing space junk bear
Speaker 1: the cost of it, and maybe that'll help fund to
Speaker 1: clean up somehow. Interesting. It's like carbon credits, but for
Speaker 1: a space junk. Yeah. Or we need everybody have like
Speaker 1: an insurance card so that when things bump into each other, say, hey,
Speaker 1: that was your piece of junk. Now you owe me
Speaker 1: a billion dollars. Oh interesting, So more more like cars
Speaker 1: actually then, you know, for creating a traffic jam up there. Yeah.
Speaker 1: We also lawyers to solve this problem. Space lawyers, space lawyers.
Speaker 1: All right, maybe I'll try to steer my son towards
Speaker 1: that profession. It sounds like it might have law that
Speaker 1: that'll impress his grandparents also. All right, Well, it sounds
Speaker 1: like there are a lot of things out there in
Speaker 1: space that you might run into, and it's going to
Speaker 1: get crowdier crowder in the next couple of years. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and cheesier and cheeto here, that's right, and spicier and
Speaker 1: flaming and flaming hot. Well, hopefully flaming hot, because that
Speaker 1: means it's burning up. Yeah, what happens if you drop
Speaker 1: a space cheeto? Actually, it does get flaming hot. Right
Speaker 1: as it burns up in your entry. So yeah, in space,
Speaker 1: all cheetos are flaming hot. There you go. How can
Speaker 1: we ask for a better adding to So think about
Speaker 1: that next time you were going to launch your own
Speaker 1: micro satellite into space. Do you really need that out
Speaker 1: there or are you just contributing to the problem. So
Speaker 1: next time you look out there into space at night,
Speaker 1: think about that beautiful star you might be looking at
Speaker 1: could be a piece of cheeto. I've got nothing after that.
Speaker 1: And that's it all right, everybody, Thanks are listening. We
Speaker 1: hope you enjoy it. Then thanks everyone, see you next time.
Speaker 1: Before you still have a question after listening to all
Speaker 1: these explanations, please drop us a line. We'd love to
Speaker 1: hear from you. You can find us on Facebook, Twitter,
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Speaker 1: email us at Feedback at Daniel and Jorge dot com.
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening and remember that Daniel and Jorge Explain
Speaker 1: the Universe is a production of I Heart Radio. For
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