1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:03,120 Speaker 1: Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, where I'm finally 2 00:00:03,120 --> 00:00:05,840 Speaker 1: heading home after a trip that's served up a haboob 3 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:09,960 Speaker 1: in Arizona and an earthquake in La Chicago. Cold's actually 4 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:13,040 Speaker 1: looking pretty good at this point. It's Tuesday, March fourth, 5 00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:15,400 Speaker 1: and on today's show, Big Citrus is sitting down to 6 00:00:15,440 --> 00:00:18,680 Speaker 1: discuss one of the toughest tasks for diehard sports fans. 7 00:00:19,040 --> 00:00:21,160 Speaker 1: How do we reconcile the love of a player's game 8 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:24,240 Speaker 1: on the court with controversy off of it? How do 9 00:00:24,280 --> 00:00:27,160 Speaker 1: we react when allegation surface? And how should we respond 10 00:00:27,160 --> 00:00:29,920 Speaker 1: when athletes we admire for their on field heroics do 11 00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:31,800 Speaker 1: shitty things away from their sport. 12 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:33,040 Speaker 2: We'll get into it. 13 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:36,199 Speaker 1: Plus, Nashville got its big finale backlash leads to a 14 00:00:36,280 --> 00:00:40,559 Speaker 1: back out, and in one conference it's love basketball and 15 00:00:40,760 --> 00:00:51,960 Speaker 1: coin tosses. It's all coming up right after this Welcome 16 00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:56,320 Speaker 1: back Slices. Here's what you need to know today. Athletes 17 00:00:56,400 --> 00:00:59,680 Speaker 1: Unlimited Basketball wrapped over the weekend with Matty Siegrist winning 18 00:00:59,720 --> 00:01:03,400 Speaker 1: the seas In four Championship title. Secrist, in her AU debut, 19 00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:05,959 Speaker 1: finished the four week season with the league record seven 20 00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:09,960 Speaker 1: fifty two points, defeating runner up Odyssey Simms by four 21 00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:13,399 Speaker 1: hundred and fifty seven points with record attendance and community 22 00:01:13,440 --> 00:01:16,840 Speaker 1: engagement in Nashville. Athletes Unlimited announced that they will be 23 00:01:16,959 --> 00:01:20,280 Speaker 1: returning on a multi year deal for AU Pro Basketball 24 00:01:20,319 --> 00:01:22,560 Speaker 1: to be in Music City in twenty twenty six and 25 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:27,560 Speaker 1: beyond to Pro hoops. WNBA expansion team Toronto Tempo announced 26 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:29,920 Speaker 1: on Monday the team has a new member of its 27 00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:34,240 Speaker 1: ownership group and it's a name you might recognize, Serena Williams. 28 00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:37,080 Speaker 1: It's the second women's pro team Williams has invested in. 29 00:01:37,319 --> 00:01:40,200 Speaker 1: She and her husband Alexis o'hannion also became co owners 30 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:43,560 Speaker 1: of the NWSL's Angels City FC in twenty twenty two. 31 00:01:43,760 --> 00:01:46,760 Speaker 1: Pera Toronto press release, Williams will also play an active 32 00:01:46,840 --> 00:01:50,200 Speaker 1: role in helping design jerseys and in creating quote unique 33 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:54,680 Speaker 1: merchandise collaborations end quote. We are excited the rollout all 34 00:01:54,680 --> 00:01:58,200 Speaker 1: the visuals for her joining the team. So good to 35 00:01:58,320 --> 00:02:00,840 Speaker 1: soccer where Naomi Germa made her day viue for Chelsea 36 00:02:00,960 --> 00:02:03,720 Speaker 1: over the weekend and fifty nine minutes into the contest 37 00:02:03,720 --> 00:02:05,600 Speaker 1: against Brighton, she suffered an injury. 38 00:02:06,000 --> 00:02:07,240 Speaker 2: Germa had to be subbed out. 39 00:02:07,240 --> 00:02:09,400 Speaker 1: It's not yet clear how serious the injury is, but 40 00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:10,520 Speaker 1: you hate to see it. 41 00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:12,840 Speaker 2: The match ended in a two to two draw. 42 00:02:12,960 --> 00:02:14,760 Speaker 1: Will keep you updated, and we're sending good vibes to 43 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:16,720 Speaker 1: Naomi and hoping she gets back on the pitch soon. 44 00:02:17,680 --> 00:02:18,320 Speaker 2: More soccer. 45 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:20,960 Speaker 1: We told you last month about BFC's decision to hire 46 00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 1: Graham Abel as the club's director of domestic scouting, despite 47 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:28,040 Speaker 1: an investigation from The Oregonian into his tenure as head 48 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:30,360 Speaker 1: coach of the UFO in which more than a dozen 49 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:33,480 Speaker 1: players alleged that he was verbally abusive. At the time 50 00:02:33,520 --> 00:02:36,760 Speaker 1: that that investigation was published, Abel denied the allegations to 51 00:02:36,800 --> 00:02:37,519 Speaker 1: The Oregonian. 52 00:02:37,960 --> 00:02:38,320 Speaker 2: Well. 53 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:40,680 Speaker 1: Just a week after his hiring was announced, and with 54 00:02:40,760 --> 00:02:43,960 Speaker 1: BFC receiving lots of backlash for the move, Abel has 55 00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:47,000 Speaker 1: agreed to resign from his post. In a statement to ESPN, 56 00:02:47,320 --> 00:02:49,560 Speaker 1: Abel said, in part, quote me joining the club has 57 00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:51,960 Speaker 1: become a distraction, which is not fair to the team 58 00:02:52,000 --> 00:02:54,800 Speaker 1: and players, so I've made the difficult decision to resign. 59 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:57,520 Speaker 1: The team should be focusing on what's most important, playing 60 00:02:57,560 --> 00:03:00,799 Speaker 1: the game they love and competing for a championship end quote. 61 00:03:01,320 --> 00:03:04,120 Speaker 1: ESPN also reported that BFC was aware of the allegations 62 00:03:04,120 --> 00:03:07,440 Speaker 1: against Abel prior to hiring him, and that the league 63 00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:10,680 Speaker 1: also signed off on his appointment. So while Abele is out, 64 00:03:10,919 --> 00:03:13,519 Speaker 1: lots of questions still about the hiring practices that led 65 00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:17,359 Speaker 1: to this in the first place. To College Hoops, USC 66 00:03:17,440 --> 00:03:20,040 Speaker 1: clinched the Big Ten regular season title over the weekend, 67 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:23,160 Speaker 1: and Juju Watkins continued to make her case for Player 68 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:26,160 Speaker 1: of the Year honors. The sophomore star recorded thirty points, 69 00:03:26,200 --> 00:03:29,720 Speaker 1: five assists, two steals, and three blocks in USC's second 70 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:32,920 Speaker 1: win of the season over crosstown rival UCLA. And get this, 71 00:03:33,200 --> 00:03:35,680 Speaker 1: Juju Watkins has now scored thirty plus points in her 72 00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:38,960 Speaker 1: last four games against UCLA. The win paid off in 73 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:42,240 Speaker 1: the EP rankings two, which were updated on Monday. USC 74 00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 1: and UCLA flip flopped, with USC now at number two 75 00:03:45,280 --> 00:03:49,680 Speaker 1: and UCLA at number four in SEC hoops, unranked ol 76 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:52,520 Speaker 1: misvisited at number seven LSU on Sunday and gave us 77 00:03:52,560 --> 00:03:54,240 Speaker 1: another upset to buzz about. 78 00:03:54,480 --> 00:03:55,360 Speaker 2: Coach yo Lett. 79 00:03:55,200 --> 00:03:58,200 Speaker 1: Mcew and squad surged back from a thirteen point halftime deficit. 80 00:03:58,440 --> 00:04:01,040 Speaker 1: Thanks to a thirty two point thirty quarter and some 81 00:04:01,080 --> 00:04:04,040 Speaker 1: stifling defense, they pulled out the upset eighty five seventy 82 00:04:04,080 --> 00:04:07,360 Speaker 1: seven Colorado transferred to Mia Sadler paced Ole Miss with 83 00:04:07,440 --> 00:04:10,920 Speaker 1: nineteen points and five steals. Starred Jacobs and KK Dean's 84 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:15,120 Speaker 1: added eighteen and seventeen points, respectively, also got a shout out. 85 00:04:15,160 --> 00:04:18,920 Speaker 1: LSU's Anissa Morrow twenty eight points and twelve rebounds and 86 00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:21,960 Speaker 1: her one hundredth career double double. She's now one of 87 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:24,159 Speaker 1: only two players at NC double A D one history 88 00:04:24,360 --> 00:04:27,240 Speaker 1: to post that. Many also want to note that LSU 89 00:04:27,320 --> 00:04:30,000 Speaker 1: was without Flaje Johnson for the first time this season. 90 00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 2: Due to shin inflammation. 91 00:04:31,400 --> 00:04:33,920 Speaker 1: Coach Kim Moulki told Reporter's post game that Flage won't 92 00:04:33,920 --> 00:04:35,880 Speaker 1: play in the SEC tournament in hopes that she'll be 93 00:04:35,920 --> 00:04:37,839 Speaker 1: ready to go for the NC Double A tournament, which 94 00:04:37,880 --> 00:04:39,000 Speaker 1: begins March nineteenth. 95 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:42,560 Speaker 2: We're setting Eland bibes your way, Flage a little more. 96 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:46,040 Speaker 1: SEC Hoops Conference tournament starts tomorrow and don S Day. 97 00:04:46,160 --> 00:04:48,919 Speaker 1: South Carolina Game Cocks are the top seed thanks to 98 00:04:49,240 --> 00:04:51,560 Speaker 1: hold on, let me make sure I'm reading this right. 99 00:04:52,040 --> 00:04:55,719 Speaker 1: A coin flip, Yeah, a coin flip. South Carolina and 100 00:04:55,760 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 1: Texas both finished fifteen to one in the SEC and 101 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:01,040 Speaker 1: were named Core Bigler's season champs. 102 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 2: But to determine tourney seating, one team had. 103 00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:06,800 Speaker 1: To prevail, and the first two tiebreaker rules couldn't determine 104 00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:09,599 Speaker 1: a winner. So when teams have the same record, advantage 105 00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:11,320 Speaker 1: goes to the group with a better record in their 106 00:05:11,320 --> 00:05:13,440 Speaker 1: head to head matchups, and then did the team with 107 00:05:13,480 --> 00:05:16,080 Speaker 1: a better win loss record against other teams in the league. 108 00:05:16,279 --> 00:05:18,800 Speaker 1: While the Longhorns and the game Cocks split the head 109 00:05:18,839 --> 00:05:21,760 Speaker 1: to head in the regular season, and then they lost 110 00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:22,680 Speaker 1: to nobody else. 111 00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:24,000 Speaker 2: So it's bizarre. 112 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:27,120 Speaker 1: But the last option was to have Conference Commissioner Greg 113 00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:30,000 Speaker 1: Sankie flip a coin. Dot Staley wasn't a fan of 114 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 1: the move until the game Cox won, when she said, quote, 115 00:05:32,920 --> 00:05:36,040 Speaker 1: I feel a little better about it now end quote. 116 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:37,040 Speaker 2: More college hoops. 117 00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:40,520 Speaker 1: Paige Becker's was inducted into Yukon's Huskies of Honor during 118 00:05:40,560 --> 00:05:43,720 Speaker 1: the program's Senior Day celebration this weekend, and a banner 119 00:05:43,760 --> 00:05:46,680 Speaker 1: was unveiled to honor her after the team's game against Marquette, 120 00:05:46,680 --> 00:05:48,679 Speaker 1: which Yukon won ninety two fifty seven. 121 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:52,159 Speaker 2: Take it quick. Listen how she started her speech, thank 122 00:05:52,200 --> 00:05:52,800 Speaker 2: you guys for. 123 00:05:52,720 --> 00:05:56,359 Speaker 3: Coming out, thank you for an amazing four or five 124 00:05:56,520 --> 00:05:57,280 Speaker 3: six years? 125 00:05:59,440 --> 00:06:03,760 Speaker 2: Did she say six years? Six? Interesting? 126 00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:07,080 Speaker 1: Just a reminder, Beckers is currently in her fifth year 127 00:06:07,080 --> 00:06:10,159 Speaker 1: at Yukon, and while all signs indicate she's headed for 128 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:13,680 Speaker 1: the WNBA draft next month, she does technically have an 129 00:06:13,680 --> 00:06:15,799 Speaker 1: option to return for a sixth year if she wants, 130 00:06:15,839 --> 00:06:19,320 Speaker 1: given that she read shirted a season due to injury. Finally, 131 00:06:19,560 --> 00:06:22,240 Speaker 1: USA Today has announced its honorees for twenty twenty five 132 00:06:22,279 --> 00:06:24,320 Speaker 1: Women of the Year, and three women in sports were 133 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:27,600 Speaker 1: named national winners. President of the Women's Sports Foundation and 134 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:31,640 Speaker 1: Paralympic athletes Scout Bassett, rugby superstar Alon Omar and reigning 135 00:06:31,760 --> 00:06:34,360 Speaker 1: WNBA champ with the New York Liberty John Quell Jones, 136 00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:38,320 Speaker 1: also Kansas native and Texas Tech softball star Nijerie Kennedy, 137 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:42,520 Speaker 1: Connecticut Sun president Jennifer Rozzotti, and Pacers Sports and Entertainment 138 00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:45,320 Speaker 1: CEO Mel Rains, who's the top exec for the Pacers 139 00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:47,680 Speaker 1: and the Fever, were each named the Women of the 140 00:06:47,760 --> 00:06:52,200 Speaker 1: Year for their respective states Kansas, Connecticut, and Indiana. Congrats 141 00:06:52,240 --> 00:06:55,960 Speaker 1: to all six winners, but also, seriously, though, what is 142 00:06:55,960 --> 00:06:58,040 Speaker 1: with all these outlets naming women of the Year before 143 00:06:58,040 --> 00:07:00,320 Speaker 1: we're even a quarter into twenty twenty five. 144 00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:05,279 Speaker 2: It's confusing. We got to take a quick break. 145 00:07:05,320 --> 00:07:07,560 Speaker 1: When we come back, it's time for Big Citrus to 146 00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:10,920 Speaker 1: reconvene and just to quick heads up during our upcoming conversation, 147 00:07:11,040 --> 00:07:14,200 Speaker 1: I do mention descriptions of alleged sexual assault. It's later 148 00:07:14,240 --> 00:07:15,840 Speaker 1: in the discussion, but want to give you heads up 149 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:17,280 Speaker 1: in case it's something you want to fast. 150 00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:26,280 Speaker 2: Forward through welcome back slices. 151 00:07:26,760 --> 00:07:30,040 Speaker 1: We felt like nows time for kind of a tough conversation, 152 00:07:30,120 --> 00:07:32,960 Speaker 1: but a necessary one because we're nearing the NCAA Basketball Tournament. 153 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:35,920 Speaker 1: We're super excited about all the parody at the highest level. 154 00:07:36,280 --> 00:07:40,640 Speaker 1: What is expected to be a thrilling, chaotic, insane march madness, 155 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:43,560 Speaker 1: chalk full of superstars, chalk full of teams that could 156 00:07:43,560 --> 00:07:46,360 Speaker 1: beat the next team. But we're also about to face 157 00:07:46,640 --> 00:07:48,880 Speaker 1: sort of head on one of the ultimate conflicts for 158 00:07:48,920 --> 00:07:51,440 Speaker 1: a lot of sports fans. How do you reconcile the 159 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:55,120 Speaker 1: love of a player's game on the court with controversy 160 00:07:55,160 --> 00:07:57,600 Speaker 1: off of it. This is something we've talked about and 161 00:07:57,640 --> 00:07:59,920 Speaker 1: touched on briefly a couple of times throughout the season. 162 00:08:00,520 --> 00:08:03,160 Speaker 1: But just to remind you, this year's tournament will feature 163 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:06,760 Speaker 1: Notre Dame star Hannah Hidalgo, who notably shared an anti 164 00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:11,040 Speaker 1: gay post on social media. We'll see TCUs Sedona Prince, 165 00:08:11,080 --> 00:08:14,600 Speaker 1: who's facing accusations from ex partners of both physical and 166 00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:18,600 Speaker 1: verbal abuse, and South Carolina had Ashland Watkins return mid 167 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:21,600 Speaker 1: season after first degree assault and battery and kidnapping charges 168 00:08:21,640 --> 00:08:24,040 Speaker 1: were dismissed after she did a pre trial intervention. 169 00:08:24,320 --> 00:08:25,679 Speaker 2: Now Watkins is going to miss the tournament. 170 00:08:25,680 --> 00:08:27,520 Speaker 1: She suffered an ACL tear, But there are still some 171 00:08:27,640 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 1: questions that folks had about Don Staley and the team welcoming. 172 00:08:30,600 --> 00:08:31,760 Speaker 2: Her back after all of that. 173 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 1: So we're thinking about that all season long, and then 174 00:08:34,679 --> 00:08:37,280 Speaker 1: we get a question from Slice Amanda Vaalo that sort 175 00:08:37,320 --> 00:08:40,240 Speaker 1: of brings it back up to the forefront, which is, 176 00:08:40,320 --> 00:08:44,120 Speaker 1: in her words, the human condition. She writes, Kobe Bryant 177 00:08:44,200 --> 00:08:47,079 Speaker 1: is always included in goat conversations and idolized in the 178 00:08:47,080 --> 00:08:49,880 Speaker 1: growth of women's sports. He's also a person who admittedly 179 00:08:49,960 --> 00:08:52,400 Speaker 1: cheated on his wife and very possibly raped a nineteen 180 00:08:52,440 --> 00:08:54,520 Speaker 1: year old. I can't help but think about this young 181 00:08:54,559 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 1: woman every time I hear another WNBA star Juel Lloyd 182 00:08:58,040 --> 00:09:00,920 Speaker 1: Sabrina Aliah Edwards pay tribute to him as their greatest 183 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:03,920 Speaker 1: influence and mentor, much like they always note the other 184 00:09:03,960 --> 00:09:06,560 Speaker 1: lives that were lost when the helicopter went down. Shouldn't 185 00:09:06,559 --> 00:09:09,200 Speaker 1: his legacy include that he harmed women in a lifelong, 186 00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:11,839 Speaker 1: scarring way. The only journalists I've ever heard speak to 187 00:09:11,880 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 1: this is Sarah. Could you please say more? How did 188 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:16,800 Speaker 1: those of us who love women's sport hold both Kobe 189 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:18,960 Speaker 1: did some great things for women and the black Mama 190 00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:22,480 Speaker 1: mentality really hurt and preyed upon them. Amanda, This is 191 00:09:22,520 --> 00:09:25,440 Speaker 1: a great question, and it's a conversation that I've had 192 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:29,000 Speaker 1: for years because of how often I've tried to speak 193 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:33,560 Speaker 1: to issues of domestic violence, sexual assault, homophobia, you know, 194 00:09:33,679 --> 00:09:37,040 Speaker 1: issues that intersect with sports so often and are very 195 00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:40,080 Speaker 1: hard to talk about and are very hard to reconcile 196 00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:42,520 Speaker 1: with the players that we love, particularly if they come 197 00:09:42,600 --> 00:09:44,440 Speaker 1: up after we've been watching them for years and have 198 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:48,680 Speaker 1: already made very definitive fandom decisions about them. So I 199 00:09:48,720 --> 00:09:51,080 Speaker 1: wanted to bring big citriest together to talk about this 200 00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:54,240 Speaker 1: and see if the way that we personally handle it 201 00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:57,160 Speaker 1: is useful or helpful to anybody else in there trying to, 202 00:09:57,840 --> 00:10:00,079 Speaker 1: you know, hold both things and figure it out. We 203 00:10:00,120 --> 00:10:02,920 Speaker 1: can maybe talk about the Kobe thing later, but I 204 00:10:02,960 --> 00:10:06,160 Speaker 1: think it's useful to see if either of you have 205 00:10:06,440 --> 00:10:11,120 Speaker 1: very specific ways you process this stuff, or if it's 206 00:10:11,160 --> 00:10:12,599 Speaker 1: a case by case spaces. 207 00:10:13,080 --> 00:10:17,920 Speaker 3: Honestly, Sarah like the underlying response for me, I don't 208 00:10:17,920 --> 00:10:20,120 Speaker 3: have like a here's your step by step how to 209 00:10:20,280 --> 00:10:21,800 Speaker 3: parts out whether or not you can be a fan 210 00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:23,000 Speaker 3: or not be a fan, Like, I don't have a 211 00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:26,319 Speaker 3: checklist for anybody. But one thing I will say is, 212 00:10:26,880 --> 00:10:28,960 Speaker 3: and I've had to change this over time, right, so 213 00:10:29,040 --> 00:10:33,120 Speaker 3: some context, I've grown up watching women's basketball, specifically my 214 00:10:33,240 --> 00:10:34,920 Speaker 3: entire life, you know what I mean. Like, I'm a 215 00:10:34,960 --> 00:10:40,199 Speaker 3: fan fan, capital fan fan. But I got a job 216 00:10:41,040 --> 00:10:44,360 Speaker 3: beat writing for the Washington Mystics, not for the team, 217 00:10:44,360 --> 00:10:46,439 Speaker 3: but for a blog that covered the team, and very 218 00:10:46,520 --> 00:10:49,280 Speaker 3: quickly I had to flip that switch in my brain 219 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:52,720 Speaker 3: to be like, oh, these are whole people, and that's 220 00:10:52,760 --> 00:10:55,000 Speaker 3: the issue I think that's underlying here. I think a 221 00:10:55,040 --> 00:10:57,719 Speaker 3: lot of folks, a lot of sports fans, a lot 222 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 3: of fans of celebrities and entertainment generally, we have a 223 00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:04,120 Speaker 3: tendency to put people on this pedestal, right, and we 224 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:06,880 Speaker 3: never really talk about the whole person. So when we 225 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:10,040 Speaker 3: have controversy come up or allegations come up, it's like, uh, 226 00:11:10,400 --> 00:11:11,560 Speaker 3: it throws us into a tizzy. 227 00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:13,360 Speaker 2: So that's where to me it all starts. 228 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:15,920 Speaker 3: It's like, first and foremost, we have to get out 229 00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:22,160 Speaker 3: of the habit of treating athletes, entertainers, musicians as like 230 00:11:22,520 --> 00:11:24,160 Speaker 3: heroes and what have you. 231 00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:27,120 Speaker 1: The myth makes is what does it It's like because 232 00:11:27,160 --> 00:11:30,760 Speaker 1: they're great at this thing, they must be a great person, 233 00:11:30,960 --> 00:11:32,959 Speaker 1: which when those things are not correlated at all. 234 00:11:33,080 --> 00:11:36,360 Speaker 3: No, And the better we can be generally speaking about 235 00:11:36,480 --> 00:11:41,000 Speaker 3: understanding that, the less I think this would shock people's systems, 236 00:11:41,720 --> 00:11:43,680 Speaker 3: but also I think the more we could openly talk 237 00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:47,480 Speaker 3: about stuff like with Sedona for example, I hadn't heard 238 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:51,240 Speaker 3: Jack squat about what was going on with her in 239 00:11:51,880 --> 00:11:55,360 Speaker 3: big media publications. I had seen a lot on TikTok 240 00:11:55,440 --> 00:11:59,000 Speaker 3: I you know, was it verified confirmed? Not necessarily, but 241 00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:01,640 Speaker 3: you know, those rumors were swirling. And when all of 242 00:12:01,679 --> 00:12:03,920 Speaker 3: this came out and I can't remember who wrote the 243 00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:05,520 Speaker 3: story that we just talked about. 244 00:12:05,520 --> 00:12:07,960 Speaker 4: Molly Hensley Clancy of the Washington Post. 245 00:12:07,760 --> 00:12:09,520 Speaker 3: Thank you for that that we just talked about recently 246 00:12:09,559 --> 00:12:12,400 Speaker 3: on the show. Molly mentioned, Yeah, people have been talking 247 00:12:12,400 --> 00:12:14,440 Speaker 3: about this for months, but nobody had talked about it 248 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:18,000 Speaker 3: on ESPN or you know, wherever else you get your 249 00:12:19,280 --> 00:12:22,480 Speaker 3: wide ranging vetted sports Yeah, you're vetted sports news, and 250 00:12:22,520 --> 00:12:26,360 Speaker 3: so you know, it just has this weird vibe to 251 00:12:26,440 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 3: it where some people are like, well, we know what's happening, 252 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:31,080 Speaker 3: but y'all are still continuing to celebrate, you know, this 253 00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:33,160 Speaker 3: young lady, and some people turn that into well we 254 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:35,280 Speaker 3: shouldn't be talking about her at all. It's like you 255 00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:37,120 Speaker 3: have to talk about her because she's one of the 256 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:38,680 Speaker 3: best players. 257 00:12:38,360 --> 00:12:39,040 Speaker 2: In the country. 258 00:12:39,160 --> 00:12:41,920 Speaker 3: But the more we can understand people as whole people, 259 00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:44,320 Speaker 3: I think, the easier it becomes to have real conversations 260 00:12:44,320 --> 00:12:46,160 Speaker 3: about the fuck them should they do? 261 00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:48,040 Speaker 1: I agree, and I want to quickly just point to 262 00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:50,080 Speaker 1: something you said, like, I think what's very difficult as 263 00:12:50,200 --> 00:12:53,960 Speaker 1: journalists is to understand that there can be TikTok's made 264 00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 1: and tweet scent that are saying with surety that they 265 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:02,079 Speaker 1: know what happened, and if you actually were to follow 266 00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:03,240 Speaker 1: up with them, they would say, well, this is what 267 00:13:03,280 --> 00:13:05,280 Speaker 1: I heard from this person who heard it from this person, 268 00:13:05,880 --> 00:13:09,000 Speaker 1: And when you are trying to operate in a journalistic sense, 269 00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:11,840 Speaker 1: you can't go off of that. And also, in fairness 270 00:13:11,880 --> 00:13:15,960 Speaker 1: to all people, understanding how rumors can spread online, understanding 271 00:13:15,960 --> 00:13:17,840 Speaker 1: how much people who don't have skin in the game 272 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:19,880 Speaker 1: and aren't working in the. 273 00:13:19,840 --> 00:13:22,959 Speaker 2: Business can say things and not care whether they're true 274 00:13:23,040 --> 00:13:23,240 Speaker 2: or not. 275 00:13:23,920 --> 00:13:26,640 Speaker 1: There's no accountability for spreading a rumor if you're not 276 00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:29,440 Speaker 1: someone in the biz, and so I think you have 277 00:13:29,520 --> 00:13:33,400 Speaker 1: to try to be aware of accusations and consider it 278 00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:35,400 Speaker 1: of them when you're talking about these athletes and having 279 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:41,600 Speaker 1: these conversations, but also to presume facts based on things 280 00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:43,400 Speaker 1: like tiktoks, which is where a lot of these people 281 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:45,199 Speaker 1: say like, oh, it's been out there, everybody should know 282 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:47,559 Speaker 1: this by now. Is a very slippery slope and it's 283 00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:49,280 Speaker 1: very unfair to a lot of people who might get 284 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:49,880 Speaker 1: caught up in it. 285 00:13:49,960 --> 00:13:52,280 Speaker 3: And to that end, though, this is why I think 286 00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:55,079 Speaker 3: we need We always say we need more women's sports media, 287 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:59,239 Speaker 3: but this is why we need not less vetted sources necessarily, 288 00:13:59,400 --> 00:14:03,320 Speaker 3: but more shows that get into okay, but what is 289 00:14:03,360 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 3: the pulse of what's happening in this space like it. 290 00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:09,600 Speaker 2: That's a big part of the gap in women's sports media. 291 00:14:09,679 --> 00:14:10,480 Speaker 2: I think, well, and. 292 00:14:10,480 --> 00:14:13,040 Speaker 1: Alex you always talk about the gap in just people 293 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:15,120 Speaker 1: who are covering these things, who are getting paid to 294 00:14:15,200 --> 00:14:18,120 Speaker 1: do the work and be there every day and actually 295 00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:19,920 Speaker 1: be able to report on this correctly. 296 00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:22,560 Speaker 4: Yeah. When I did account last year of the number 297 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:25,320 Speaker 4: of reporters who cover women's sports as their full time job, 298 00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:26,960 Speaker 4: I couldn't get past fifteen. 299 00:14:27,280 --> 00:14:29,200 Speaker 2: That's all of North America. I had to include a 300 00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:30,440 Speaker 2: couple of Canadians in there. 301 00:14:30,760 --> 00:14:33,400 Speaker 4: I think the number's probably gone up by you know, two, 302 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:37,080 Speaker 4: a handful. So for me, one of the things that 303 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:39,200 Speaker 4: I often come back to here is the role of 304 00:14:39,240 --> 00:14:41,200 Speaker 4: the media, and I think one of the things that 305 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:44,080 Speaker 4: doesn't often get talked about is the inherent conflicts of 306 00:14:44,120 --> 00:14:47,720 Speaker 4: interests that occur in sports broadcasting. It's a field unlike 307 00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:51,600 Speaker 4: any other in that you have these companies NBC and 308 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:54,200 Speaker 4: Fox and ESPN and Amazon and all the rest of 309 00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:58,600 Speaker 4: them that are paying leagues millions, billions of dollars in 310 00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:01,800 Speaker 4: order to broadcast a product, a product that is entertainment 311 00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:04,360 Speaker 4: that they are selling ads off of. So then to 312 00:15:04,480 --> 00:15:09,560 Speaker 4: expect those broadcasters to tell well rounded stories about problematic 313 00:15:09,640 --> 00:15:13,680 Speaker 4: people isn't always happening. I think the other part of 314 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:15,800 Speaker 4: it that often comes up in sports, and I've been 315 00:15:15,880 --> 00:15:18,080 Speaker 4: a part of a lot of conversations where there's a 316 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:20,360 Speaker 4: problematic athlete, there's something that came up. 317 00:15:20,400 --> 00:15:22,160 Speaker 2: Sometimes it's even about doping. 318 00:15:21,920 --> 00:15:25,880 Speaker 4: Right like that is something that literally impacts the competition field, 319 00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:29,560 Speaker 4: and oftentimes though it's handled in the pregame show and 320 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:32,080 Speaker 4: then all the people tune in half an hour later 321 00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:35,080 Speaker 4: to watch the actual sport and it never gets mentioned again. 322 00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:39,480 Speaker 4: So I struggle with how to integrate that a little 323 00:15:39,480 --> 00:15:41,880 Speaker 4: bit more sometimes so that we are getting a more 324 00:15:41,920 --> 00:15:44,760 Speaker 4: well rounded idea of who the person is during the 325 00:15:44,760 --> 00:15:47,520 Speaker 4: supporting event itself. And I don't know how to reconcile that, 326 00:15:47,560 --> 00:15:50,160 Speaker 4: but I think that the difference in media space and 327 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:53,560 Speaker 4: what those media outlets are providing in terms of information 328 00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:56,920 Speaker 4: versus journalism versus entertainment plays a really big role here. 329 00:15:57,320 --> 00:15:59,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it plays a huge role in educating people. 330 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:04,680 Speaker 1: And I had those conversations internally, especially at places like ESPN, 331 00:16:04,720 --> 00:16:06,560 Speaker 1: where you do know that the millions of people watching 332 00:16:06,560 --> 00:16:08,320 Speaker 1: the game are going to hear you praise that person 333 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:10,440 Speaker 1: over and over and if you don't use the correct 334 00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:14,080 Speaker 1: language the one time you mention that they have accusations 335 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:16,760 Speaker 1: have been said, you say made a mistake about someone 336 00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:20,080 Speaker 1: who punched a woman or had an incident, instead of 337 00:16:20,120 --> 00:16:23,360 Speaker 1: using specific language. You're making very clear that you prioritize 338 00:16:23,520 --> 00:16:26,680 Speaker 1: the mythologizing of them as an athlete over the realities 339 00:16:26,720 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 1: of their situation. But all that being said, when we 340 00:16:31,320 --> 00:16:33,840 Speaker 1: do find out these things, when it does get to 341 00:16:33,920 --> 00:16:38,480 Speaker 1: us via established media or via social media, and enough 342 00:16:38,520 --> 00:16:41,480 Speaker 1: folks talking about it or the athlete's own actions, like 343 00:16:41,520 --> 00:16:43,920 Speaker 1: in the case of Hanna Hidalgo posting that stuff, we 344 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:45,840 Speaker 1: then as fans have a decision to make. 345 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:50,480 Speaker 2: And there are a lot of fans who just want 346 00:16:50,520 --> 00:16:53,480 Speaker 2: to watch the game. They consider it an escape for them. 347 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:57,000 Speaker 1: I think most of those fans, but not all, have 348 00:16:57,080 --> 00:16:59,520 Speaker 1: a bit of a privilege of being able to separate 349 00:16:59,680 --> 00:17:03,320 Speaker 1: the issues that play many parts of society from. 350 00:17:03,040 --> 00:17:03,760 Speaker 2: The sports role. 351 00:17:04,200 --> 00:17:07,480 Speaker 1: But if you are, for instance, a woman, and you 352 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:10,320 Speaker 1: are being asked repeatedly to ignore that a man has 353 00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:14,240 Speaker 1: been credibly accused multiple times of domestic violence or sexual 354 00:17:14,240 --> 00:17:16,200 Speaker 1: abuse but you should still root for them. 355 00:17:16,280 --> 00:17:17,400 Speaker 2: That's a little more difficult. 356 00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:19,400 Speaker 1: If you are a queer person and you're being asked 357 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:21,879 Speaker 1: to ignore that someone is homophobic, If you are a 358 00:17:21,920 --> 00:17:24,000 Speaker 1: person of color and you're being asked to ignore someone's 359 00:17:24,040 --> 00:17:27,280 Speaker 1: racist remarks, all of these things are much more personal 360 00:17:27,480 --> 00:17:30,000 Speaker 1: to certain fans than maybe other fans who are like 361 00:17:30,119 --> 00:17:31,960 Speaker 1: I just want to escape, right. 362 00:17:32,920 --> 00:17:35,440 Speaker 2: So I can give you a specific example. 363 00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:38,040 Speaker 1: This really solidified it for me because in the moment 364 00:17:38,080 --> 00:17:41,040 Speaker 1: I felt sort of hypocritical. I had already had to 365 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:44,800 Speaker 1: face Patrick Kane on the Chicago Blackhawks, my hockey team, 366 00:17:45,160 --> 00:17:47,960 Speaker 1: being accused of sexual assault. I had already had to 367 00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:51,520 Speaker 1: face Eraaldus Chapman being signed by my favorite baseball team, 368 00:17:51,560 --> 00:17:53,520 Speaker 1: the Chicago Cubs and being a part of their World 369 00:17:53,520 --> 00:17:58,119 Speaker 1: Series run after getting suspended for domestic violence and shooting 370 00:17:58,119 --> 00:18:01,280 Speaker 1: a gun around his partner. I had already had these 371 00:18:01,320 --> 00:18:03,920 Speaker 1: people that were in my sports sphere that I was 372 00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:06,160 Speaker 1: a fan of or at least a fan of the team, 373 00:18:06,400 --> 00:18:07,960 Speaker 1: and had to make a decision of I don't want 374 00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:10,000 Speaker 1: to root for that person anymore, while I still want 375 00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:10,840 Speaker 1: to root for that team. 376 00:18:11,480 --> 00:18:13,679 Speaker 2: But then this weird instance happened with Sewn. 377 00:18:13,400 --> 00:18:16,520 Speaker 1: White, the snowboarder, where I was watching the Olympics like 378 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:21,840 Speaker 1: live and saw him have this great finish and tweeted 379 00:18:21,880 --> 00:18:24,680 Speaker 1: like that's so exciting his last Olympics, like so cool 380 00:18:24,720 --> 00:18:27,439 Speaker 1: to see him get it done, And people started sliding 381 00:18:27,480 --> 00:18:29,399 Speaker 1: into my mentions with hey, did you see about this, 382 00:18:29,600 --> 00:18:31,600 Speaker 1: like the former drummer of his band had filed a 383 00:18:31,640 --> 00:18:37,480 Speaker 1: suit alleging sexual harassment, sexual assault, sexually explicit messages like 384 00:18:37,600 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 1: using his power and position within the band to make 385 00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:45,160 Speaker 1: her life awful, and so in that moment, I could 386 00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:48,280 Speaker 1: either get defensive and start to push back on oh, 387 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:49,600 Speaker 1: I don't know about that, or. 388 00:18:49,640 --> 00:18:50,680 Speaker 2: Well is it proven? 389 00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:54,640 Speaker 1: Or I could say this, this is a line I've 390 00:18:54,880 --> 00:18:58,280 Speaker 1: made for myself personally, and when someone crosses it, I 391 00:18:58,320 --> 00:18:59,760 Speaker 1: can decide that I don't want to root for them 392 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:02,800 Speaker 1: any more. That's not to say guilty before being proven so, 393 00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:05,040 Speaker 1: but it is to say, I'm gonna step back from 394 00:19:05,080 --> 00:19:08,480 Speaker 1: this fandom and go read these accusations and be thoughtful 395 00:19:08,520 --> 00:19:10,919 Speaker 1: about how I feel about them. And I think for 396 00:19:11,040 --> 00:19:13,160 Speaker 1: me that was a turning point, mainly because I had 397 00:19:13,160 --> 00:19:16,320 Speaker 1: to reconcile, like, if I'm going to be open about 398 00:19:16,320 --> 00:19:19,040 Speaker 1: writing these stories and covering athletes like you know, ray 399 00:19:19,119 --> 00:19:21,639 Speaker 1: Rice and other athletes that I've covered in the past, 400 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:24,919 Speaker 1: I can't then make different rules for my teams and 401 00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:26,080 Speaker 1: athletes that I'm a fan of. 402 00:19:27,240 --> 00:19:28,320 Speaker 2: And that's the tough part me. 403 00:19:28,359 --> 00:19:31,119 Speaker 1: She's like, I'm sure you've been there where, Like I 404 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:34,400 Speaker 1: already decided I like this person and their grand Sarah. 405 00:19:34,200 --> 00:19:40,520 Speaker 3: The biggest example of exactly that conundrum Cynthia Cooper, one 406 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:45,360 Speaker 3: of the best women's basketball players of all time, arguably 407 00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:49,119 Speaker 3: to some people the goat, won four straight chips with 408 00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:51,800 Speaker 3: the Houston Comments in the WNBA four Time Finals MVP 409 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:57,560 Speaker 3: like you name it, Coops there, but also a few 410 00:19:57,640 --> 00:20:00,199 Speaker 3: years back had a bunch of her former players when 411 00:20:00,240 --> 00:20:03,280 Speaker 3: she was a college coach accused her of just saying 412 00:20:03,400 --> 00:20:09,359 Speaker 3: really ugly, really demeaning, demoralizing stuff, abusive behavior, sexually leude 413 00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:13,800 Speaker 3: comments like called a player allegedly a sorry ass virgin, 414 00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:16,760 Speaker 3: like all of this horrible stuff. I will never forget 415 00:20:17,320 --> 00:20:19,760 Speaker 3: the day that I read that article. 416 00:20:20,520 --> 00:20:22,040 Speaker 2: It was I literally cried. 417 00:20:23,160 --> 00:20:25,760 Speaker 3: I literally cried because I was like, it was that again, 418 00:20:25,840 --> 00:20:27,320 Speaker 3: that same thing I talked about when I had the 419 00:20:27,359 --> 00:20:31,720 Speaker 3: Mystics job, Like I had to really face the reality of, oh, 420 00:20:31,760 --> 00:20:34,080 Speaker 3: this is a whole person that's not just made of 421 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:35,960 Speaker 3: what she did on a basketball court. At the end 422 00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:38,480 Speaker 3: of the day, allegations are true or not. You can't 423 00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:41,520 Speaker 3: ignore stuff like that. To this day, I still struggle 424 00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:44,959 Speaker 3: with that. Like in the WNBA, she's recognized in the 425 00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:47,480 Speaker 3: WNBA is getting better at recognizing some of the pioneers 426 00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:49,679 Speaker 3: and some of the folks who were stars before you know, 427 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:53,879 Speaker 3: this era of basketball. But whenever she's mentioned or she 428 00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:57,800 Speaker 3: was an honorary coach for something very recently, and I 429 00:20:57,880 --> 00:21:02,200 Speaker 3: was like, man, that's it's hard for me to not 430 00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:05,040 Speaker 3: just be okay with that but just balance all of 431 00:21:05,080 --> 00:21:08,040 Speaker 3: who she is. And I can't say that I've figured out, 432 00:21:08,119 --> 00:21:10,359 Speaker 3: you know, where my line is. I think it really depends. 433 00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:12,399 Speaker 3: I think what you just talked about, you know, in 434 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:15,440 Speaker 3: terms of I'm black, I'm queer, Like there's a lot 435 00:21:15,440 --> 00:21:17,639 Speaker 3: of stuff that is already just going to be a 436 00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:19,600 Speaker 3: hard line in the sand for me. And I'm the 437 00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:21,240 Speaker 3: kind of person who I always kind of want to 438 00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:23,440 Speaker 3: draw a hard line in the sand. But realizing that 439 00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:26,600 Speaker 3: that's just it's a short road to not having a 440 00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:30,000 Speaker 3: fandom of literally anybody, because we can't have shit anymore 441 00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:30,919 Speaker 3: without people. 442 00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:31,440 Speaker 2: You know what I mean. 443 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:34,959 Speaker 1: Well, And it's more difficult in the women's sports space too, 444 00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:38,119 Speaker 1: because in the past there was a lot of parachuting 445 00:21:38,200 --> 00:21:43,119 Speaker 1: in to report on salacious stories of wrongdoing without any 446 00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:46,640 Speaker 1: other coverage, So it felt like you wanted to protect 447 00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:50,119 Speaker 1: women athletes from only being covered when they did wrong. 448 00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:53,480 Speaker 1: But then that protection of someone because they're a woman 449 00:21:53,680 --> 00:21:55,760 Speaker 1: doesn't feel right now, and it feels like an overcorrection. 450 00:21:56,040 --> 00:21:58,879 Speaker 3: It feels like we're treating women athletes with kid gloves 451 00:21:58,960 --> 00:21:59,359 Speaker 3: right now. 452 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:00,239 Speaker 2: Well. 453 00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:02,360 Speaker 1: I think Ashton Watkins is an example of that, where 454 00:22:02,359 --> 00:22:04,520 Speaker 1: we love Don Staley so much, but if this was 455 00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:06,760 Speaker 1: a men's team, would we have had a lot more 456 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:09,879 Speaker 1: to say about a coach welcoming someone back mid season 457 00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:12,119 Speaker 1: right after those accusations. I think Britney Grinder is a 458 00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:14,440 Speaker 1: great example of that. There is so much to love 459 00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:17,439 Speaker 1: about Britney Grinder and she's become another sort of like 460 00:22:17,680 --> 00:22:21,359 Speaker 1: heroic figure, but she has allegations of abuse in her past, 461 00:22:21,440 --> 00:22:25,120 Speaker 1: and when it's women, we tend to have different opinions 462 00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:29,240 Speaker 1: about particularly same sex relationship abuse than we do when 463 00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:30,320 Speaker 1: it's men and women. 464 00:22:30,920 --> 00:22:32,840 Speaker 4: Another thing I try to keep in mind with all 465 00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:36,560 Speaker 4: of this is making sure that I'm not creating false 466 00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:40,199 Speaker 4: equivalencies between people and between allegations. I think sometimes what 467 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,880 Speaker 4: will happen is their allegations made against someone and it's like, oh, 468 00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,240 Speaker 4: we're putting them in the bad column now, and it's like, 469 00:22:46,320 --> 00:22:49,400 Speaker 4: well that's not fair either. There are certain people that 470 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:51,960 Speaker 4: belong in the bad column, and there are other people 471 00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:55,320 Speaker 4: that belong in the complicated column and the to be 472 00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:58,639 Speaker 4: investigated further column. I think the other thing that happens 473 00:22:58,640 --> 00:23:01,760 Speaker 4: a lot in women's sports. To use an example, Britta Curl, 474 00:23:02,080 --> 00:23:05,560 Speaker 4: the hockey player for PWHL Minnesota. Back when she was 475 00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:08,880 Speaker 4: drafted last year, there was backlash because she had posted 476 00:23:08,920 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 4: and reposted tweets that were transphobic and racist. And one 477 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:17,679 Speaker 4: of the things that I struggled with with that is 478 00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:21,679 Speaker 4: I think that fans have a right to respond with 479 00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 4: how they feel about Curl being drafted, But I don't 480 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:29,480 Speaker 4: think anyone in that press conference asked Brita about those tweets. 481 00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:32,639 Speaker 4: And I think sometimes that happens in women's sports. And 482 00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:34,520 Speaker 4: I don't want to blame the reporters that were there, 483 00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:36,800 Speaker 4: because I'm sure a lot of them probably weren't even 484 00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:40,160 Speaker 4: being paid, because that is the reality in women's sports. 485 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:42,960 Speaker 4: But what ends up happening sometimes, and this even gets 486 00:23:43,000 --> 00:23:45,439 Speaker 4: to the point about tiktoks, is you have people that 487 00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:48,400 Speaker 4: have this narrative that has been built, and then when 488 00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:49,680 Speaker 4: you say, oh, has anyone. 489 00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:50,760 Speaker 2: Actually asked the athlete? 490 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:54,040 Speaker 4: And sometimes the pr people that are in charge are 491 00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:56,720 Speaker 4: making it impossible to ask the athlete. I think that 492 00:23:56,760 --> 00:24:00,800 Speaker 4: happened a few years ago Jaylen Daniels, who previous refused 493 00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:03,280 Speaker 4: to play with the US women's national team when they 494 00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:06,280 Speaker 4: were wearing Pride jerseys. She got signed by the North 495 00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:08,600 Speaker 4: Carolina Courage, and I don't think they made her available 496 00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:09,480 Speaker 4: all season long. 497 00:24:10,320 --> 00:24:11,440 Speaker 2: But there are other times. 498 00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:14,000 Speaker 4: Where the athlete is made available and no one asks 499 00:24:14,040 --> 00:24:16,119 Speaker 4: the question. And I think it is unfair to the 500 00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:19,480 Speaker 4: athlete in those cases to be writing about the narrative 501 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:23,879 Speaker 4: without giving them a chance to respond, clarify, provide more details. 502 00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:25,880 Speaker 4: It's just one of those things that I think comes 503 00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:27,399 Speaker 4: along with journalism that you have to do. 504 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:29,560 Speaker 1: And I think one of the things that I've learned 505 00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:32,760 Speaker 1: over the years of having these like really definitive, like 506 00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:37,040 Speaker 1: to your point, bad column thoughts about people even ten 507 00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:39,880 Speaker 1: or fifteen years ago in this business, I as I'm 508 00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:43,920 Speaker 1: mature as an adult, I want them to evolve and change. 509 00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:46,600 Speaker 1: I want to be able to say that you're not 510 00:24:47,320 --> 00:24:52,320 Speaker 1: ruined because of either bad you know, messaging and thoughts 511 00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:53,679 Speaker 1: or actions. 512 00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:54,000 Speaker 2: Right. 513 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:56,440 Speaker 1: You know, there is a part of me that has 514 00:24:56,880 --> 00:24:59,639 Speaker 1: a real sort of I hesitate to even say it, 515 00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:05,400 Speaker 1: but like empathy for Ray Rice as somebody who actually 516 00:25:05,440 --> 00:25:08,040 Speaker 1: did all the stuff after the incident with his fiance 517 00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 1: to try to get better, but will always be held 518 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:14,760 Speaker 1: up as the one example, while there are people who 519 00:25:14,760 --> 00:25:16,920 Speaker 1: have not tried to get better, have not done the work, 520 00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:20,040 Speaker 1: have not been proactive, have not been open with their 521 00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:23,719 Speaker 1: alleged rehabilitation, and why they won't be recidivous and they 522 00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:26,080 Speaker 1: don't get the same publicity because that's how it works 523 00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:28,280 Speaker 1: sort of in the media space, is like the big 524 00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:30,199 Speaker 1: first story or the one that has the video, or 525 00:25:30,200 --> 00:25:32,479 Speaker 1: the one with the person with the biggest name. And 526 00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:34,960 Speaker 1: so I want to also say that what is the 527 00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:38,440 Speaker 1: point of calling people out for this behavior if we 528 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:41,199 Speaker 1: aren't allowing them the potential to change and grow and 529 00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:45,240 Speaker 1: get better. But also we should not be required to 530 00:25:45,359 --> 00:25:48,359 Speaker 1: forgive if there is no proof of change. And that 531 00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:50,840 Speaker 1: is where the biggest issue for me always is, is 532 00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:54,199 Speaker 1: like people will say that was five years ago, or 533 00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:56,439 Speaker 1: why are you still talking about that? And I'm like, 534 00:25:56,480 --> 00:26:01,720 Speaker 1: because this person has never spoken about, addressed, acknowledged, been 535 00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:05,080 Speaker 1: held accountable and responsible for, and so why would I 536 00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:08,840 Speaker 1: believe that they've changed? And so I think I'm trying 537 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:11,200 Speaker 1: to be the kind of person that can hold both 538 00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:13,359 Speaker 1: and say I do hold you accountable. I will not 539 00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:16,800 Speaker 1: root for you, and I hope for you and everyone 540 00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:19,600 Speaker 1: around you that you actually get what you need to 541 00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:24,600 Speaker 1: change and get better. Because we punish for punitive's sake 542 00:26:24,760 --> 00:26:29,560 Speaker 1: and not for rehabilitative sake, we publish for performative publicity, 543 00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:32,160 Speaker 1: and then there's no follow up from teams about why 544 00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:34,840 Speaker 1: we should believe that there won't be recidivism. We need 545 00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:40,280 Speaker 1: that second half of accountability for us as fans to say, Okay, 546 00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:43,520 Speaker 1: I think this person has learned and changed and gotten better. 547 00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:46,280 Speaker 3: That's exactly what we talked about with Corbyn Albert. That 548 00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:49,240 Speaker 3: whole situation too right, when we've had multiple people want 549 00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:53,760 Speaker 3: to talk about her. But you know, from all accounts, 550 00:26:53,760 --> 00:26:57,600 Speaker 3: it seems like that's being handled in house, which like fair, 551 00:26:57,840 --> 00:27:01,240 Speaker 3: you know, totally fair. But as a fan personally of 552 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:04,360 Speaker 3: the US of his national team, it's like I would. 553 00:27:04,200 --> 00:27:06,920 Speaker 2: Love to see the receipts just so I can personally 554 00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:09,440 Speaker 2: feel a little bit. You know, I don't know better 555 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:10,240 Speaker 2: about the situation. 556 00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:12,520 Speaker 1: Well, and I think what Sam Muis said is right. 557 00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:16,320 Speaker 1: If the acts are public, then the rehabilitation can't be 558 00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:18,960 Speaker 1: entirely private. Yes, handle an interior, but you need to 559 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:22,920 Speaker 1: have some statements or progress reports or something. It can't 560 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:27,560 Speaker 1: just be like, oh, we're handling it, trust us. I'll 561 00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:31,240 Speaker 1: briefly talk about Kobe Bryant because I got a lot 562 00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:33,040 Speaker 1: of death threats actually, and like had to call the 563 00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:36,480 Speaker 1: police after I wrote that story. When he passed away, 564 00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:43,760 Speaker 1: I was deeply confused. I was crying about him, about 565 00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:46,760 Speaker 1: the little girls, about the families, about who he had 566 00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:51,280 Speaker 1: become as a person after his basketball career. And also 567 00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:53,800 Speaker 1: I was sitting in my hotel I just landed in 568 00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:56,800 Speaker 1: Miami for the Super Bowl. I was covering the week 569 00:27:57,119 --> 00:28:00,679 Speaker 1: of content stuff and turned on the Grand's and Alicia 570 00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:04,120 Speaker 1: Keys started that ceremony, saying that we felt like maybe 571 00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:06,080 Speaker 1: we shouldn't even have this tonight because we all lost 572 00:28:06,119 --> 00:28:12,879 Speaker 1: a hero. And I imagined the woman that alleges that 573 00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:16,520 Speaker 1: he raped her hearing on this giant stage, not even 574 00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:20,440 Speaker 1: a sports stage, this person being described as a hero. 575 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:27,760 Speaker 1: And I imagine every sexual assault victim trying to move forward, 576 00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,920 Speaker 1: understanding that the world will whitewash what happened to them 577 00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:34,360 Speaker 1: in pursuit of this heroic mythological narrative that we assigned 578 00:28:34,359 --> 00:28:37,800 Speaker 1: to great athletes and for those who don't remember. In 579 00:28:37,840 --> 00:28:41,000 Speaker 1: two thousand and three, Kobe Bryant allegedly asked nineteen year 580 00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:43,680 Speaker 1: old concierge at a hotel to give him a tour. 581 00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:46,320 Speaker 1: According to reports, the inviterer back to his room. According 582 00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 1: to the woman, he groped her, grabbed her neck to 583 00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:50,640 Speaker 1: keep her from leaving, turned her around, pushed he against 584 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:53,520 Speaker 1: a chair, and raped her. According to the police transcript 585 00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:55,440 Speaker 1: of an interview taking with her the next day, she 586 00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:58,640 Speaker 1: said no several times. She said that he repeatedly said, 587 00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:00,960 Speaker 1: you're not going to tell anyone, right. She told a 588 00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:03,440 Speaker 1: bellman front at the hotel immediately after the incident and 589 00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:05,920 Speaker 1: reported it to the police the next day, and a 590 00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:08,440 Speaker 1: hospital exam revealed tears in her vaginal wall and a 591 00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:10,120 Speaker 1: bruise on her neck. There was blood on her underwear. 592 00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:12,680 Speaker 1: There was blood on briant shirt. She told the police. 593 00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:16,080 Speaker 1: He told authorities that it was consensual, despite him not 594 00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:19,560 Speaker 1: explicitly asking for consent, and he was eventually charged with 595 00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:23,000 Speaker 1: melony sexual assault and they went to trial. But during 596 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:26,400 Speaker 1: that fourteen months, friends of hers and family members even 597 00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:29,440 Speaker 1: sold stories, some of them a twist on the truth. 598 00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:32,040 Speaker 1: Some of them outright lies, and she ended up getting 599 00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:35,440 Speaker 1: death threats. Her photos were released, her name was publicly 600 00:29:35,560 --> 00:29:38,440 Speaker 1: used multiple times even though it was supposed to be protected, 601 00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:41,280 Speaker 1: and she became physically ill. As the trial approach, she 602 00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:43,600 Speaker 1: decided to drop the charges. There was a civil case 603 00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:46,960 Speaker 1: settled non disclosure agreement. She's not been able to speak 604 00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:49,920 Speaker 1: about the incident since, and Kobe used that NDA also 605 00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:51,760 Speaker 1: to avoid speaking about it for the rest of his 606 00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,920 Speaker 1: life as well. When I wrote that story, I tried 607 00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:57,440 Speaker 1: to understand how we can remember a person as a 608 00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:01,560 Speaker 1: person and not just a resume, and how we, when 609 00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:03,640 Speaker 1: we think about our own mortality, would love to be 610 00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:04,640 Speaker 1: remembered as only. 611 00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:05,720 Speaker 2: The best parts of ourselves. 612 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:10,400 Speaker 1: But how both for his victim and other victims alleged victim, 613 00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:15,320 Speaker 1: when we do that, it is I can't even imagine 614 00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:18,400 Speaker 1: the pain that someone feels. And so I tried to 615 00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:20,800 Speaker 1: write to all the ways that he seemed like he 616 00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:23,240 Speaker 1: was a wonderful person and cared about change, and was 617 00:30:23,280 --> 00:30:26,480 Speaker 1: open about demons, and was doing amazing things in the 618 00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:30,600 Speaker 1: women's sports space. And also these are the accusations, and 619 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:33,720 Speaker 1: this is the reality of what allegedly happened. And I 620 00:30:33,760 --> 00:30:36,560 Speaker 1: think that's the answer for me is trying to hold 621 00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:40,560 Speaker 1: both but also to not allow myself to make excuses 622 00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:43,400 Speaker 1: for the people I want to like in a way 623 00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:47,920 Speaker 1: that ignores that there are some really charming people, some 624 00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:50,520 Speaker 1: really talented people, some really successful people who also do 625 00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:51,000 Speaker 1: bad things. 626 00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:53,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, And I also think the important thing to remember is, 627 00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:59,440 Speaker 3: like we're talking about allegations of some horrible stuff, but 628 00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:02,680 Speaker 3: all of us, in our day to day lives, in 629 00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:05,240 Speaker 3: the lives we've led to this point, we've been the villain. 630 00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:07,240 Speaker 2: You know what I mean, we have all been the villain. 631 00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:09,720 Speaker 2: We've all done shitty things, We've all you know. 632 00:31:10,080 --> 00:31:13,440 Speaker 3: It just to me has been a realization at twenty seven, 633 00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:17,600 Speaker 3: at this ripe old age. You know, it's been a 634 00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:22,240 Speaker 3: reminder that, Okay, everybody is human and we do need 635 00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:24,160 Speaker 3: to learn how to hold space for people who are 636 00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:26,000 Speaker 3: in community with generally speaking. 637 00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:30,920 Speaker 2: As well, because it just feels like the best course 638 00:31:30,960 --> 00:31:31,320 Speaker 2: of action. 639 00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:33,680 Speaker 1: And I agree with that, and I think especially as 640 00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:35,640 Speaker 1: they get older, especially with a lot of the research 641 00:31:35,640 --> 00:31:38,600 Speaker 1: I did for my book, understanding how the traumas that happened. 642 00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:40,560 Speaker 2: To people create the people that they become. 643 00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:43,480 Speaker 1: Right, Like, most of people doing these things probably had 644 00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:46,560 Speaker 1: things that happened to them that a lot of the 645 00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:49,000 Speaker 1: people that we talk about, maybe even especially in like 646 00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:52,800 Speaker 1: queer relationships where there's abuse or otherwise, like what are 647 00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:55,120 Speaker 1: they bringing to that relationship from what society has told 648 00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:55,880 Speaker 1: them about themselves? 649 00:31:55,920 --> 00:31:56,880 Speaker 2: And like all of that. 650 00:31:57,320 --> 00:31:59,560 Speaker 1: And also what I will say me is just when 651 00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:02,560 Speaker 1: I've report on this stuff for years in the past, 652 00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:04,959 Speaker 1: the number one thing people would come to me with 653 00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:08,239 Speaker 1: like you're perfect, And that to me is not an 654 00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:11,880 Speaker 1: answer to holding people accountable for bad things. The fact 655 00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:13,800 Speaker 1: that we're all human, we've all done shitty things or 656 00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:17,240 Speaker 1: been the villain, is not the same as we shouldn't 657 00:32:17,280 --> 00:32:20,160 Speaker 1: talk about or hold people accountable because we're all human. No, 658 00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:24,200 Speaker 1: because not all of us are committing domestic violence, sexual assault, etc. 659 00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:28,120 Speaker 1: And So I think there's a specificity around that that, yes, 660 00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:31,080 Speaker 1: hold grace for people and hope that they can evolve 661 00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:33,600 Speaker 1: and change and understand that they got that way for 662 00:32:33,600 --> 00:32:36,240 Speaker 1: a reason. And also it serves no good to them 663 00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:38,800 Speaker 1: or anyone around them who's a potential danger for future 664 00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:42,240 Speaker 1: acts if we don't choose to force them to change 665 00:32:42,480 --> 00:32:45,320 Speaker 1: and help them get the help they need to change. 666 00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:49,280 Speaker 4: Yeah, for sure, you're describing the situation with Kobe Sarah 667 00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:51,480 Speaker 4: brings us back to kind of the role of the media, 668 00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:55,440 Speaker 4: and after his death, the media was unhinged. It was 669 00:32:55,520 --> 00:32:58,520 Speaker 4: like people weren't allowed to say a bad word about him. 670 00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:02,000 Speaker 4: There was actually a Washington Post porter who just tweeted 671 00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:07,880 Speaker 4: a story about those charges and those allegations and she 672 00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:14,680 Speaker 4: was suspended. And the ability to wrap up all of 673 00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:18,400 Speaker 4: an individual's complexities, especially when they die, you need to 674 00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:19,200 Speaker 4: be able to look. 675 00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:19,920 Speaker 2: At both sides. 676 00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:24,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's really important and really difficult. So I don't 677 00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:29,080 Speaker 1: know if this conversation will help folks try to understand. I, 678 00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:32,000 Speaker 1: back to Amanda's point, feel the same way about so 679 00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:34,320 Speaker 1: many female athletes who idolize Kobe. 680 00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:37,560 Speaker 2: It's really hard for me. It's really hard for me. 681 00:33:37,800 --> 00:33:40,760 Speaker 4: Whenever I look at the WNBACBA, which you know fairly 682 00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:45,480 Speaker 4: often the tribute for the WNBACBA is a tribute to Kobe. 683 00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:48,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's not easy to try to understand all this stuff. 684 00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:50,960 Speaker 1: And for some people it will be maybe a little 685 00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:52,560 Speaker 1: bit easier to just say, well, I just like watching 686 00:33:52,560 --> 00:33:54,400 Speaker 1: basketball and they're good at basketball. But for those of 687 00:33:54,440 --> 00:33:57,960 Speaker 1: you who struggle like we do, we get it. We're 688 00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:00,480 Speaker 1: here to chat about it. We're doing our best to 689 00:34:00,520 --> 00:34:03,400 Speaker 1: work our way through it as well. And yeah, if 690 00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:05,600 Speaker 1: you have other questions or comments, feel free to let 691 00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:05,880 Speaker 1: us know. 692 00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:08,160 Speaker 2: We'd love to hear what you think about this. We 693 00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:09,160 Speaker 2: got to take another break. 694 00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:19,960 Speaker 1: When we come back, a toast to a roast, Welcome back, slices. 695 00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:21,160 Speaker 2: We always love to hear from you. 696 00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:23,160 Speaker 1: So, like I said, hit us up on email, good 697 00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:25,200 Speaker 1: game at Wondermedia neetwork dot com, or leave us a 698 00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:28,600 Speaker 1: voicemail at eight seven two two four fifty seventy. How 699 00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:32,200 Speaker 1: do you handle the human condition specifically to sports? But 700 00:34:32,360 --> 00:34:34,759 Speaker 1: I mean if you have tips in general, we'd love 701 00:34:34,760 --> 00:34:37,839 Speaker 1: to hear them. It's a struggle right now. Also, don't 702 00:34:37,880 --> 00:34:41,920 Speaker 1: forget to subscribe, rate and review. It's easy watch. Dina 703 00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:46,160 Speaker 1: Tarassi given classic DT on the View last week, rating 704 00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:48,640 Speaker 1: ten out of ten for timing and delivery. 705 00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:49,440 Speaker 2: Review. 706 00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:52,560 Speaker 1: Dina Tarassi appeared on the View shortly after announcing her 707 00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:56,600 Speaker 1: retirement for basketball, and apparently six Olympics worth of gold medals, 708 00:34:56,760 --> 00:34:59,640 Speaker 1: twenty years of pro dominance, and four years of college 709 00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:03,399 Speaker 1: excellent didn't provide enough opportunities for Whoopy Goldberg to learn 710 00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:07,320 Speaker 1: her damn name. Take a listen on the Phoenix Mercury 711 00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:12,399 Speaker 1: Diana Tarisi. Yikes, but DT handled it like a pro, 712 00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:16,000 Speaker 1: a pro who will be forever remembered for throwing shade. 713 00:35:16,239 --> 00:35:19,040 Speaker 2: Good to see you, Whippy, I mean whoopye. That's the same. 714 00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:25,080 Speaker 1: Perfect execution, Deanna, I mean Diana. Now it's your turn. Slices, 715 00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:28,680 Speaker 1: rate and review. Thanks for listening, See you tomorrow. Good game, 716 00:35:28,719 --> 00:35:33,040 Speaker 1: Matti Segrest, Good game, Juju Watkins. You talk about launching 717 00:35:33,120 --> 00:35:34,880 Speaker 1: new women's sports network when you don't know how to 718 00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:37,960 Speaker 1: say Diana Tarassi's name, And no, we still don't know 719 00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:39,120 Speaker 1: anything about that new network. 720 00:35:39,160 --> 00:35:41,840 Speaker 2: And also we're playing whoope, but for real, you gotta 721 00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:42,399 Speaker 2: know that name. 722 00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:47,120 Speaker 5: Good Game with Sarah Spain is an iHeart women's sports 723 00:35:47,120 --> 00:35:50,319 Speaker 5: production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. You 724 00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:53,239 Speaker 5: can find us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or 725 00:35:53,239 --> 00:35:53,759 Speaker 5: wherever you. 726 00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:54,680 Speaker 2: Get your podcasts. 727 00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:58,160 Speaker 5: Production by Wonder Media Network, our producers are Alex Azzie 728 00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:01,240 Speaker 5: and Misha Jones. Our executive produce ucers are Christina Everett, 729 00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:04,480 Speaker 5: Jesse Katz, Jenny Kaplan, and Emily Rutterer. Our editors are 730 00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:08,080 Speaker 5: Emily Rutterer, Britney Martinez and Grace Lynch. Our associate producer 731 00:36:08,120 --> 00:36:10,880 Speaker 5: is Lucy Jones, and I'm your host Sarah Spain.