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Speaker 1: I Am six forty.

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Speaker 2: You're listening to the John Cobel podcast on the iHeartRadio

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Speaker 2: app KFI AM six forty Live everywhere on the iHeartRadio app.

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Speaker 2: This is the KFI News special Hate Modern Anti Semitism.

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Speaker 1: I'm Steve Gregory.

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Speaker 3: This program may contain content not suitable for everyone. Discretion advised.

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Speaker 2: In the last hour, you heard about the state of

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Speaker 2: antisemitism throughout southern California. Nationwide, Organizations like the American Jewish

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Speaker 2: Committee are monitoring anti Semitic activity throughout the United States

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Speaker 2: and around the world. Ted Deutsch is the chief executive

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Speaker 2: officer of the AJAC and in December of twenty twenty,

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Speaker 2: was part of a White House summit on anti Semitism.

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Speaker 2: I asked him about his visit to the White House.

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Speaker 2: In the current state of antisemitism in the US.

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Speaker 4: We know that anti Semitism continue to rise. We saw

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Speaker 4: that in the FBI numbers that have just been released.

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Speaker 4: But AJAC also has released a survey that is really alarming,

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Speaker 4: which shows not just the number of anti Semitic attacks,

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Speaker 4: but the impact that it's having on the community and

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Speaker 4: on America as a whole. Ninety percent of the people

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Speaker 4: in America overall believe that anti Semitism is a serious problem.

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Speaker 4: And four and five Jews say that antisemitism has increased

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Speaker 4: over the last five years. And then finally, most concerning,

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Speaker 4: over forty percent of Jews living in America feel less

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Speaker 4: secure today than they did just a year ago. It's

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Speaker 4: a it's an enormous problem, not only for the Jewish community,

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Speaker 4: because antisemitism never just stops with the Jews. This is

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Speaker 4: a problem that impacts other minority groups, society as a whole,

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Speaker 4: and ultimately the democracy that we live in that that

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Speaker 4: allows us to live free.

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Speaker 2: And in that roundtable ted, did did you discuss the causes,

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Speaker 2: the root issues and why the spike in these hate

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Speaker 2: crimes and just hate in general?

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Speaker 1: There are there was.

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Speaker 4: A conversation about about how this hatred is allowed to spread. Ultimately,

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Speaker 4: anti Semitism, jew hatred is a conspiracy theory and it's

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Speaker 4: it's existed for thousands of years, and the impact of

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Speaker 4: anti Semitism on the Jewish community, as I said, is real.

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Speaker 4: We come to this when someone tweets, someone with millions

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Speaker 4: of followers on social media tweets and shares vitriolic hatred

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Speaker 4: of Jews. It invites the anti Semites who have been

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Speaker 4: under their rocks to come out into public. It normalizes

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Speaker 4: anti Semitism. It says that it's somehow okay to unfurled

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Speaker 4: banners over highway bridges and to distribute anti sim literature

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Speaker 4: and to shine antisemitic statements flat on the sides of buildings.

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Speaker 4: That's the challenge that we have. So it's not a

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Speaker 4: question of where it comes from. Look, there's a spike

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Speaker 4: in the conspiracy spreading of conspiracy theories. We saw this

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Speaker 4: through COVID in particular, but at this moment, we've seen

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Speaker 4: the spread because of the prevalence of anti semitism on

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Speaker 4: social media, the fact that social media companies need to

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Speaker 4: do more to enforce their own rules against this kind

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Speaker 4: of of hate speech that causes trouble in society, imposes

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Speaker 4: a threat to the community.

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Speaker 2: And what were solutions, any solutions offered at this roundtable?

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Speaker 4: Sure there were, Look, there were lots of suggestions, some

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Speaker 4: to deal with the immediate threat and the need to

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Speaker 4: have available resources to harden Jewish facilities, But beyond that,

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Speaker 4: we need a national plan. And AJAC has worked with

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Speaker 4: the White House to really move forward on a whole

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Speaker 4: of government approach. Our call to Action against Anti Semitism

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Speaker 4: provides ways for every sector of government to fight anti

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Speaker 4: Jewish hatred, and this effort that's been launched by the

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Speaker 4: administration as a result of the meeting we had will lead,

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Speaker 4: we hope, to a real national action plan that will

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Speaker 4: provide ways for the federal government, state governments, businesses, law enforcement,

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Speaker 4: all of them to come up with ideas to combat

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Speaker 4: this vile hatred that again poses a risk to society

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Speaker 4: as a whole.

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Speaker 2: Wouldn't you agree that this all starts in the home,

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Speaker 2: that maybe there's not enough being done to educate young

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Speaker 2: people on hate, its impact, the overall I guess, the

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Speaker 2: overall disintegration of values, And I mean, don't you think

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Speaker 2: it really starts in the home?

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Speaker 4: Well, well, it's interesting, it's a really interesting question. On

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Speaker 4: the one hand, sure, but what does that even mean anymore? Again,

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Speaker 4: it's it's not just uh, it's it's not just what

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Speaker 4: gets passed on in a family setting from from parents

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Speaker 4: to kids. It's what kids are seeing every day on

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Speaker 4: social media and the impact that that has. But of

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Speaker 4: course it look, education is a huge part of this.

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Speaker 4: What we've found is that there are so many of

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Speaker 4: these anti Semitic troops, so much language that gets used

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Speaker 4: that that again comes from from this these long standing

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Speaker 4: conspiracy theories that people and don't even recognize as anti Semitism.

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Speaker 4: They don't know the impact it has. That's why AJAC

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Speaker 4: put out a document called Translate Hate, just to give

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Speaker 4: people a better understanding of how the words that are said,

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Speaker 4: words that they may learn at home, words that they

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Speaker 4: may learn by their spending time on the internet, that

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Speaker 4: those words have real impact. And it's true, that's true

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Speaker 4: by the way, across all forms of hatred. Education is

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Speaker 4: key in helping people understand how words can lead to actions.

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Speaker 4: Actions lead to violence. In the case of the Jewish community,

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Speaker 4: that violence has often led to expulsion from countries. It

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Speaker 4: led to the near annihilation of the entire Jewish people

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Speaker 4: during the Holocaust. That's why education is such a key,

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Speaker 4: and that does start at home. Absolutely.

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Speaker 2: Social media, I know is talking with folks from the

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Speaker 2: Lisenthal Center, and social media has played such a huge rolling.

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Speaker 2: As you mentioned, what kinds of conversations and dialogues have

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Speaker 2: you had with the platforms the people that run these platforms.

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Speaker 2: Are they amenable to your solutions? Are they at least

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Speaker 2: letting you have a seat at the table.

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Speaker 4: The good news is social media companies have usually robust

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Speaker 4: hate speech policies, certainly relative to where they were just

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Speaker 4: a few years ago. But given the number of American

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Speaker 4: Jesus of experienced anti semitism online, which is well more

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Speaker 4: than half eighty five percent of young people, we have

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Speaker 4: to do more than just provide lip service. The Facebook

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Speaker 4: and Twitter and other companies.

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Speaker 2: Have.

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Speaker 4: There's a crossroads between free speech and hate speech, and

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Speaker 4: they have to decide which road we're on. And making

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Speaker 4: sure that they're not making it easy for people to

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Speaker 4: transmit hate speech that can lead to violence is a

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Speaker 4: key part of what they do. So look, we think

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Speaker 4: they can remove antisemitic content that violates their own policies.

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Speaker 4: They can strengthen their own hate speech policies to include

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Speaker 4: all forms of anti semitism that there's a modern form

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Speaker 4: of anti semitism that's defined. There's a working definition of

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Speaker 4: that that the International Holocaust Members Alliance has put out

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Speaker 4: that's been adopted by dozens of countries. Social media companies

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Speaker 4: could adopt that. They could ensure greater transparency in drafting

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Speaker 4: their policies. There are algorithms that are used to send

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Speaker 4: the information directly to your feed. There's more transparency that

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Speaker 4: can be provided there to make sure that it's not

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Speaker 4: just sending more and more hatred to further the aims

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Speaker 4: of the anti anti Semites, the hate mongers, others who

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Speaker 4: are trying to use their technology. So there's a lot

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Speaker 4: more community standards, I think is something that could help

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Speaker 4: a great deal well. And we've had conversations, we have

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Speaker 4: ongoing conversations with social media companies and we've had successes

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Speaker 4: and we in terms of taking down Holocaust denial and

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Speaker 4: addressing some of those challenges, but there there's a lot

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Speaker 4: more that can be done make it easier to report

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Speaker 4: anti semitism, that the systems that are in place, the

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Speaker 4: moderation systems to make sure that they're that that they're

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Speaker 4: able to identify coded anti semitism and hate speech, all

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Speaker 4: of these things.

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Speaker 3: We know the kinds of things.

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Speaker 4: That can be done, and we're we're working as best

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Speaker 4: we can to encourage them to do it, but ultimately

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Speaker 4: there's real responsibility that they have to take action themselves.

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Speaker 2: You can hear the complete interview with Ted Deutsch by

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Speaker 2: downloading the Companion podcast to this program on the iHeartRadio app.

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Speaker 2: Coming up, we speak with an Asian American artist who

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Speaker 2: uses his brush on the walls of buildings in downtown

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Speaker 2: Los Angeles to support the Jews. But first, this is

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Speaker 2: the KFI News special Hate Modern Anti Semitism on KFI

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Speaker 2: AM six forty.

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Speaker 5: You're listening to John Cobelt on demand from KFI AM six.

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Speaker 2: Forty KFI AM six forty Live everywhere on the iHeartRadio app.

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Speaker 2: I'm Steve Gregory and this is the KFI News special

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Speaker 2: Hate Modern Anti Semitism. Anytime there's advocacy for a marginalized

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Speaker 2: group or a worthy cause, an artist usually isn't too

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Speaker 2: far away. Andrew Hemm was born during his parents' flight

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Speaker 2: from Cambodia following the Khmer Rouge genocide and was always

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Speaker 2: fascinated by graffiti and developed a unique style of using

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Speaker 2: blues and reds to bring his impressions of culture to life.

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Speaker 2: He is also an accomplished muralist who paid tribute to

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Speaker 2: a woman who was a Holocaust rescuer. We're down here

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Speaker 2: in a very busy street in the Arts district downtown

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Speaker 2: Los Angeles. We're at the intersection of Santa Fe and

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Speaker 2: six Street, tell us what we're looking at.

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Speaker 6: This is a miural the dedicated to Irene Updyke. And

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Speaker 6: for those of you don't know, she's a Polish nurse

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Speaker 6: who saved twelve Jews from the Nazis. And yeah, she

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Speaker 6: just helped protect them and just kept them safe during

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Speaker 6: the whole Nazi time.

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Speaker 1: So what did you learn about her before you put

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Speaker 1: brush to wall?

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Speaker 6: I learned that she just, you know, she was a hero.

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Speaker 6: And for me, like, I didn't know about her, and

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Speaker 6: I feel like most people, probably my age bracket doesn't either.

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Speaker 6: So I feel I hope that this mural, since there's

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Speaker 6: not that much people my shoe knows about her, that

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Speaker 6: it just brings more awareness to her and her heroic deeds.

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Speaker 1: So let's step back for a moment.

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Speaker 2: I want you to give us a word picture of

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Speaker 2: what we're looking including the colors, because the colors are

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Speaker 2: so bright, they're pastel in nature to me. But describe

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Speaker 2: the colors and what your inspiration was for these specific colors.

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Speaker 6: I was given because you know, there's not that much

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Speaker 6: pictures of our online, so I was given a handful

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Speaker 6: of images and they're all black.

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Speaker 3: And white and and and.

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Speaker 6: For me, I saw this black and whe and I

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Speaker 6: just wanted to create vibrancy to it and just not

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Speaker 6: just just this monochromatic, kind of dull depiction.

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Speaker 3: So my key was just hard to make this vibrant.

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Speaker 3: And I'm obsessed with colors.

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Speaker 6: I love colors, so I think it I think it

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Speaker 6: was a challenge for me just trying to transfer this

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Speaker 6: black and white to vivid colors.

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Speaker 3: But I chose a lot of blues.

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Speaker 6: I love blues, greens, pinks, reds, a lot of primary

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Speaker 6: colors that that I just kind of mix together and

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Speaker 6: just try to create this harmonic imagery.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so talk about it, because you actually, when you

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Speaker 2: talk about a mural, in the scope of it, in

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Speaker 2: the size of it, it's very large, but it's got

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Speaker 2: a bunch of little motifs in it.

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Speaker 1: So let's start.

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Speaker 2: I really am curious about this we have on the

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Speaker 2: bottom left side as you look from the street, it's

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Speaker 2: it's purple, and you've got seventy individuals sitting around a

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Speaker 2: coffee table.

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Speaker 6: Okay, well, these seven individual are people that she say,

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Speaker 6: and they're they're obviously in a time bracket, whereas is

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Speaker 6: black and white.

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Speaker 3: So I didn't want to take too far off.

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Speaker 6: Of that whole monochromatic feel, so I want to kept it.

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Speaker 6: I want to keep it monochromatic, but with a little

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Speaker 6: slight hints of purples and pinks, just to show that

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Speaker 6: there's is a.

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Speaker 3: Really dated imagery.

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Speaker 6: And I wanted to make it abstract too, So there's

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Speaker 6: a lot of just like triangular shapes, a lot of

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Speaker 6: blocks and and and and squares, but it's it's it

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Speaker 6: starts off monochromatic, then as it shoots out to.

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Speaker 3: Where her holding, it is.

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Speaker 6: More of a kind of modern day how she is

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Speaker 6: now so obviously is a brighter and more vivid in colors.

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Speaker 1: Did you have a photo of these seven individuals?

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Speaker 3: I did? I did?

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Speaker 1: Is this derived right from the photo from Reference?

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Speaker 3: Yes? This is from Reference?

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Speaker 6: And since the image was smaller, you know, I felt

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Speaker 6: like if I were making more detailed it'll take away

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Speaker 6: from her, So I wanted to make it less readable,

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Speaker 6: so it becomes like a third or fourth read, and

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Speaker 6: I wanted the focus to be on her, and then

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Speaker 6: you know what she's holding.

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Speaker 2: It's interesting to see that, you know, and knowing now

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Speaker 2: that these seven people were saved by her, do you

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Speaker 2: know the circumstances around how that happened.

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Speaker 6: I just know that she, uh, she saved them like

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Speaker 6: she stored, like she needs stored.

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Speaker 3: But she she hit them away.

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Speaker 6: She hit them away, and then once they were eventually found,

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Speaker 6: she offered herself as a favors to keep them safe

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Speaker 6: in a way that she sacrificed her own body to

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Speaker 6: protect these people, which was very heroic.

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Speaker 2: Well, when you look at the colors you've given her,

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Speaker 2: is there any significance to these sort of and I,

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Speaker 2: for lack of a better title for it, I'm looking

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Speaker 2: at like peach and kind of a you know, orange

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Speaker 2: peach it was there? Is that a specific color that

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Speaker 2: you imagined her?

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Speaker 7: You know?

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Speaker 6: Part of the process was I envisured some of this

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Speaker 6: color in my head, kind of like this peach color.

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Speaker 6: But then as I got to the wall, I added

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Speaker 6: oranges and I added stuff, so it just gives it

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Speaker 6: more of a variation of color, but it's also in

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Speaker 6: the same value. But it's just always not just a

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Speaker 6: solid pink. I just improvise and add orange and purples

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Speaker 6: and certain colors. But I feel like a majority of

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Speaker 6: the color was in my head already. As I got

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Speaker 6: to the wall, I added spontaneous colors just to make

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Speaker 6: it more lively.

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Speaker 1: I noticed butterflies.

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Speaker 6: Yeah yeah, So the butterflies is supposed to symbolize Irene

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Speaker 6: because there's a lot of people in the in the piece,

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Speaker 6: so I wanted to to uh, since there's a timeline

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Speaker 6: of uh, when she was younger, when she was older.

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Speaker 6: I wanted the butterfly to show the viewers, Okay, this

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Speaker 6: is her when she was younger, this is her when older,

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Speaker 6: just so that they know this is Irene and not

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Speaker 6: somebody she saved.

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Speaker 1: Got it. So the butterfly is a reference point exactly.

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Speaker 8: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So then as we look back here, tell us what

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Speaker 2: it says here? What are the letters that say in

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Speaker 2: the middle.

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Speaker 6: Well, that's the company that contacted me, the Righteous among

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Speaker 6: the Nation's Global Mirror Project. They asked me if I

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Speaker 6: was interested in doing this piece and this location. And

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Speaker 6: I think oftentimes, you know, I do murals and and

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Speaker 6: and it's kind of like, hey, you know, do what

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Speaker 6: you want, you know, paint what you want. And so

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Speaker 6: I felt like this was a special thing to do

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Speaker 6: where you know, there's a subject matter, and there's a

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Speaker 6: powerful subject matter. So so I was more than happy

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Speaker 6: to do this.

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Speaker 1: What about the other side can we go.

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Speaker 2: I'm curious here as we walked through, what was this

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Speaker 2: picture denoting that you saw?

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Speaker 6: Well, this is somebody that she said, and then it

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Speaker 6: seems like she's just showing this complete love to this

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Speaker 6: human being. And you know, she's kissing her in the cheek,

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Speaker 6: somewhat similar to what a parent would do to their

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Speaker 6: own child.

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Speaker 3: But I think it's very special.

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Speaker 6: How you she's how much she loves somebody like that.

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Speaker 2: I know she also have the words art over hate.

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Speaker 2: Tell me why that's important for you?

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Speaker 7: Well?

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Speaker 3: I think right now.

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Speaker 6: You know, ever since COVID, you know, people see more

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Speaker 6: what I feel like. Anytime there's a natural disaster or anything,

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Speaker 6: people tend to have hate over certain race that they

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Speaker 6: feel like responsible. With ninety eleven, you know, there was

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Speaker 6: a lot of attacks on Middle Eastern With COVID, there

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Speaker 6: was a lot of attacks on Asian Americans. So the

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Speaker 6: first you know, I did for them was during COVID

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Speaker 6: it was stop Asian Hate. And they reached out to

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Speaker 6: me again and said, hey, we would like to do

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Speaker 6: another kind of hate campaign and which would be interested

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Speaker 6: in this? And this is my second time working for them.

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Speaker 6: Both times are just against.

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Speaker 2: A the entire interview with Andrew hamm is on the

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Speaker 2: Companion podcast to this program and can be downloaded on

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Speaker 2: the iHeartRadio app. Coming up an exclusive tour of the

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Speaker 2: only traveling exhibit of Auschwitz. But first, this is the

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Speaker 2: KFI News special Hate Modern Anti Semitism on KFI AM

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Speaker 2: six forty.

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Speaker 5: You're listening to John Cobelt on demand from KFI AM six.

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Speaker 2: Forty KFI AM six forty live everywhere on the iHeartRadio app.

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Speaker 2: This is the KFI News special Hate Modern Anti Semitism.

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Speaker 2: I'm Steve Gregory. One of the most well known and

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Speaker 2: iconic symbols of the Holocaust is Auschwitz, the concentration and

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Speaker 2: extermination camp located in southern Poland. Doctor Michael berenbaums with

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Speaker 2: the American Jewish University in Los Angeles, but was also

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Speaker 2: commissioned to curate the only worldwide traveling.

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Speaker 1: Exhibition of Auschwitz.

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Speaker 2: He took us on a personal tour of the exhibit

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Speaker 2: while it was being installed at the Ronald Reagan Presidential

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Speaker 2: Library in see Me Valley, California.

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Speaker 1: Where do you start? Did Auschwitz tell you what they're

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Speaker 1: going to give you?

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Speaker 2: Or did you request items from them?

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Speaker 8: I always start backwards. If you ask me how I

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Speaker 8: create an exhibition, I always say you have to answer

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Speaker 8: four questions. What, where, with, what and how? What do

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Speaker 8: you want to say and where do you want to

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Speaker 8: say it? And where is not only location physically, but

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Speaker 8: its location in time, meaning where to time for example,

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Speaker 8: where some of the themes of the Holocaust are echoed

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Speaker 8: unfortunately in contemporary life. So you have a section on judgment,

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Speaker 8: and you hear the concept of crimes against humanity. Crimes

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Speaker 8: against humanity were abstract until the invasion of Ukraine. When

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Speaker 8: you hear the president talk about crimes of humanity, you're

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Speaker 8: the president of European countries. You hear Macron, you hear

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Speaker 8: the Prime Minister of Britain, the Chancellor of Germany, all

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Speaker 8: talking about crimes against humanity. The origin of that is

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Speaker 8: here wars of aggression. Again, echoes in certain certain respects.

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Speaker 8: It's not to say that Russia is committing a holocaust

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Speaker 8: saying that you have echoes, faint and sometimes vivid echoes.

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Speaker 8: So I start with what do we have to say?

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Speaker 8: Then I say where are we saying it? Where is

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Speaker 8: the place and time? And also the location. So in

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Speaker 8: the Reagan Library we have a very unique thing because

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Speaker 8: this was done by government. This was all perpetrated by

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Speaker 8: Nazi German government. There were German laws, the German army,

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Speaker 8: the German bureaucracy, the German Justice Department, the German Foreign Ministry,

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Speaker 8: the German army. All of these were instrumentalities of the state.

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Speaker 8: So we have to pay attention to the fact that

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Speaker 8: what is the so far the great achievement of America,

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Speaker 8: which is that the state is restrained by checks and balances,

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Speaker 8: by respect for human dignity and human decency, by the

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Speaker 8: notion of inalienable rights. So where has a very particular

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Speaker 8: poignancy in this place at this time. Also at this

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Speaker 8: time we're doing something else, which is we are in

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Speaker 8: the transitionary moment, the last moment in the life of survivors,

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Speaker 8: transition from lived history to historical memory, and the institution

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Speaker 8: becomes the heir of the survivors. With what I come

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Speaker 8: with a shopping list, they say yes and no, And

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Speaker 8: sometimes you know, if they don't have the fruit you want,

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Speaker 8: you choose another fruit. If they're not willing to sell

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Speaker 8: you the fruit that they have, and this case lend

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Speaker 8: us the fruit that they have. Use a different artifact

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Speaker 8: so for example, we haven't installed that it's not going

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Speaker 8: to be installed. We could have asked for a thousand shoes,

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Speaker 8: or we could have asked and we did ask for

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Speaker 8: one colored shoe to illustrate. And we have a beautiful

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Speaker 8: woman's red shoe, high heels, and you think of in

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Speaker 8: Washington we have five thousand shoes, and we as a poem,

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Speaker 8: we are the shoes of grandparents and grandchildren from Paris, Prague,

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Speaker 8: and Amsterdam. And because we are made of fiber and

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Speaker 8: leather and not of flesh and blood, each of us

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Speaker 8: avoided the hell fire. The shoes were saved, but not

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Speaker 8: the people who wore them. So we think of the

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Speaker 8: one red shoe in a background of thousands of shoes, Think,

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Speaker 8: who is this woman? Did she go dancing in these shoes?

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Speaker 8: Was she a stunning model? Was she? You know? What

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Speaker 8: was her life? What is it that gets you to

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Speaker 8: put on red shoes? Certainly not to go to a funeral,

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Speaker 8: certainly not to go to your doom.

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Speaker 2: When we were walking through, you were gracious enough to

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Speaker 2: give us a personal tour of the exhibit as it's

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Speaker 2: going up.

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Speaker 1: And one of the things that struck me you stopped us.

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Speaker 2: At a chart on a wall, and that chart was

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Speaker 2: I assume the way it looked was a government document,

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Speaker 2: and that document, if I heard you correctly, was sort

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Speaker 2: of the criteria in which someone was labeled a Jew.

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Speaker 8: The Nazis had a problem. The problem was that essentially

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Speaker 8: they came with an antisemitic agenda which targeted the Jews.

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Speaker 8: But then you got to ask yourself the question who

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Speaker 8: are the Jews? And what they did is to divide

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Speaker 8: the population by full Jews, three quarter Jews, based on

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Speaker 8: the religion of your grandparents, half Jews, quarter Jews, eighth Jews.

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Speaker 8: Of course, how many great grandparents do you have? You

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Speaker 8: have eight? And essentially they drew a demarcation line. This

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Speaker 8: was racism incarnate because it was not by the identity

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Speaker 8: you held, the values, who have practiced the tradition to

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Speaker 8: embraced the faith that you worshiped. It was on the

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Speaker 8: religion of your grandparents, namely what was within your blood.

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Speaker 8: And that chart was a way to determine who was

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Speaker 8: and who was not a Jew, who was to be

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Speaker 8: discriminated against, and who was going to be a target

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Speaker 8: of oppression. Later on they discovered they had a second problem,

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Speaker 8: which is unlike for example, black skin or unlike Asian eyes.

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Speaker 8: Jews looked many different ways, so they had to mark

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Speaker 8: the Jews. That's when they put on the yellow star.

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Speaker 8: In most countries or in Poland, they used a white

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Speaker 8: armband to determine who was a Jew. It's called symbolization

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Speaker 8: and identification. They forced you to wear a Jewish star,

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Speaker 8: so they knew whom to target. That's a government chart.

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Speaker 8: The rule of a Jewish star was a government to create,

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Speaker 8: and therefore they knew who to target and how to

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Speaker 8: target them.

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Speaker 2: You said that was racism incarnate.

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Speaker 8: Racism incarnate is what condemns you remember what is Martin

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Speaker 8: Luther King's great line. I want people to be judged

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Speaker 8: by the content of their character, not the color of

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Speaker 8: their skin. What is the opposite of racism when we

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Speaker 8: judge people by who they are in terms of the

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Speaker 8: content of their character, their artistry, their ability, all of

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Speaker 8: those things that are involved, rather than what labeling them

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Speaker 8: because of some element of their identity. And for Jews,

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Speaker 8: the criteria was not faith. In the German world, the

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Speaker 8: criteria was blood and it led to a very unusual thing.

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Speaker 8: The last building standing in the Warsaw Ghetto was a

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Speaker 8: Roman Catholic Church. It was frequented by people who were

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Speaker 8: Roman Catholic priests, Roman Catholic nons, Roman Catholic parishioners, all

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00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:03,280
Speaker 8: of whom were defined by the Nazi government as Jews.

441
00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:11,679
Speaker 8: So they were worshiping Catholics defined as Jews yen blood,

442
00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:13,920
Speaker 8: not identity.

443
00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:18,200
Speaker 2: As we continued our tour, you pointed out a number

444
00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:19,760
Speaker 2: of things, and it's just too many to go into

445
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:23,120
Speaker 2: right now, but another thing that you pointed out were

446
00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:28,280
Speaker 2: these series of illustrations done by someone who was observing

447
00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:32,239
Speaker 2: what was happening, and then he later offered testimony, and

448
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:36,960
Speaker 2: you said that this person, through his drawings, those drawings

449
00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:38,440
Speaker 2: were the testimony.

450
00:27:39,840 --> 00:27:42,800
Speaker 8: We all know that there were Holocaust memoirs by survivors.

451
00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:48,200
Speaker 8: We all know that there were diaries taken by you know,

452
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:52,919
Speaker 8: written in the situation by people who are victims, the

453
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:57,199
Speaker 8: most famous of which is Diary Van Frank. Memoirs like

454
00:27:57,280 --> 00:28:03,240
Speaker 8: eel Visell's Knight or Primo Levi's announcehert. I worked as

455
00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:07,160
Speaker 8: president and CEO of the Showoff Foundation, and we took

456
00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:11,240
Speaker 8: the testimony of fifty two thousand survivors in thirty two

457
00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:16,080
Speaker 8: countries and fifty in fifty seven countries and thirty two languages,

458
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 8: all of whom offered video testimony. But there were a

459
00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:23,480
Speaker 8: unique group of artists who were in the camps who

460
00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:28,240
Speaker 8: didn't offer us written testimony, who didn't offer us verbal testimony.

461
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:33,119
Speaker 8: They offered us art as testimony and the artist's testimony

462
00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:36,800
Speaker 8: of the drawings that they drew to document what they experienced.

463
00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:40,120
Speaker 2: The complete compelling interview with doctor Barnbaum is on the

464
00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:43,560
Speaker 2: Companion podcast to this program and can be downloaded on

465
00:28:43,600 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 2: the iHeartRadio app. Coming up, we asked the big question

466
00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:52,600
Speaker 2: why Jews? But first, this is the KFI News special

467
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:56,680
Speaker 2: Hate Modern Anti Semitism on KFI AM six forty.

468
00:28:57,480 --> 00:29:02,880
Speaker 5: You're listening to John Cobelt on demand from KFI AM sixty.

469
00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:12,920
Speaker 2: KFI AM six forty live everywhere on the iHeartRadio app.

470
00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:17,800
Speaker 2: This is the KFI News special Hate Modern Anti Semitism.

471
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:19,160
Speaker 1: I'm Steve Gregory.

472
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:22,400
Speaker 2: In our final segment of the program, we asked the

473
00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:27,240
Speaker 2: question why are Jews at target? Here's Rabbi Abraham Cooper

474
00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:29,480
Speaker 2: of the Simon Weisenthal Center in Los Angeles.

475
00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:32,040
Speaker 9: Well, I think for the most part of the last

476
00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:35,640
Speaker 9: two thousand years, we were the other. We were always

477
00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:40,320
Speaker 9: the minority in places like Europe and across North Africa.

478
00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:44,680
Speaker 9: We didn't pray the same way as the as the

479
00:29:44,760 --> 00:29:49,920
Speaker 9: main society's prayed. And back then there were no such

480
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:54,520
Speaker 9: things as human rights. We were just an easy mark

481
00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:58,720
Speaker 9: say that you know, from Christian theology back in the

482
00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:03,640
Speaker 9: Middle Ages was that Jewish people deserved to suffer and

483
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:06,280
Speaker 9: to be treated in second and third class and maybe

484
00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:09,640
Speaker 9: being ghettos because they didn't accept Jesus as their savior.

485
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:12,520
Speaker 7: So not to kill them, but not.

486
00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:15,880
Speaker 9: To admit them either. In terms of the of the

487
00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:20,840
Speaker 9: mainstream and you know, coming into the modern period of nationalism,

488
00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:25,160
Speaker 9: well the Germans, the Nazis, of course took it to

489
00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:28,680
Speaker 9: the ultimate, saying the Jews didn't deserve to live, they

490
00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:33,840
Speaker 9: were outside parasites. Never mind that you know, many German

491
00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:36,360
Speaker 9: Jews served with distinction in World War One of the

492
00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 9: German military, not just in Britain or France or the US.

493
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:45,080
Speaker 9: And so you know, for the communists, we're capitalists. For

494
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:51,920
Speaker 9: the capitalists, we're communists. It's you know, ask people who

495
00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:57,880
Speaker 9: are ethnic Chinese in certain countries in South South Asia

496
00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:02,400
Speaker 9: where they're not the majority, but my sometimes you pay

497
00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:07,240
Speaker 9: the price because of the perceived perception that you're doing

498
00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:09,920
Speaker 9: too well in life, and it's but we live in

499
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:12,840
Speaker 9: a democracy. We're supposed to have a level playing field,

500
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:18,120
Speaker 9: and that should not bring about hatred. But again I

501
00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:20,920
Speaker 9: think it should be curiosity we live in now with

502
00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:23,360
Speaker 9: between the Internet, social media and the fact we live

503
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:26,280
Speaker 9: in a democracy, if you have an interest to find out,

504
00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:30,080
Speaker 9: like what did Jews do in synagogue? Well, there are

505
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:33,560
Speaker 9: a lot of synagogues in the area. You know, there

506
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:37,400
Speaker 9: are plenty of books to read up there are Southern California,

507
00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:42,080
Speaker 9: is no shortage of rabbis of all stripes and orientations.

508
00:31:42,280 --> 00:31:44,960
Speaker 9: So I think the most important thing also that I

509
00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:51,560
Speaker 9: learned in my global travels is this tremendous curiosity. I've

510
00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:54,280
Speaker 9: learned to also deal with my own stereotypes when I

511
00:31:54,320 --> 00:31:59,960
Speaker 9: go overseas, and it's sometimes a difficult wall to bring down,

512
00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:04,360
Speaker 9: but it's worthwhile the effort. So education, at the end

513
00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:06,640
Speaker 9: of the day is what mister Weisenthal said would be

514
00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:09,480
Speaker 9: the key. And the other part that he also I

515
00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:12,719
Speaker 9: think I saw by example, and then I always remember

516
00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:16,080
Speaker 9: it is we need to build new alliances and friendships.

517
00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:19,440
Speaker 9: When you talk about friendships and alliances, that means that

518
00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:22,320
Speaker 9: not only do we need help when we have a problem,

519
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:27,560
Speaker 9: when our houses of worship are under potential attack, but

520
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:30,320
Speaker 9: we have to be there for the other communities.

521
00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:36,080
Speaker 2: This is Todd Spitzer, the District Attorney of Orange County, California,

522
00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:38,880
Speaker 2: and creator of that county's Hate Crime Task Force.

523
00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:42,200
Speaker 10: Well, Jews, like Asians, I think, have a reputation of

524
00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:46,240
Speaker 10: being educated and successful. And the argument against Jews has

525
00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:48,840
Speaker 10: been that they control the world, that they control the media,

526
00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:53,560
Speaker 10: that they're manipulative, right, that they're rich, and they control

527
00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:59,120
Speaker 10: the government and decision making, and you know, they have

528
00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:03,400
Speaker 10: to be put down literally and figuratively for that reason.

529
00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:06,320
Speaker 10: So that has been obviously the mantra in the myth

530
00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:09,040
Speaker 10: that is percolated. I think that's why you've seen so

531
00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:13,600
Speaker 10: much Asian hate. Asians have been so successful here in America,

532
00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:19,000
Speaker 10: academically and financially and with the family structure. So I

533
00:33:19,080 --> 00:33:23,120
Speaker 10: just think that groups that have been successful and assimilated

534
00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:26,680
Speaker 10: well in this country, even though it's a melting pot,

535
00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:29,960
Speaker 10: there's been a lot of resentment, and especially when the

536
00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:33,760
Speaker 10: haters feel like they're being pushed out of power, they

537
00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:35,560
Speaker 10: want to go after the groups who they feel are

538
00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:38,360
Speaker 10: jeopardizing their status in society.

539
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 2: And finally, Brandon Cohen, the head of school at a

540
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:44,600
Speaker 2: Jewish day school in Los Angeles.

541
00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:49,200
Speaker 11: Yeah, I mean I laugh because it's like, you know,

542
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:53,520
Speaker 11: the question that's been I think hanging over us for

543
00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 11: all time, right, I mean, this kind of hatred towards

544
00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:04,240
Speaker 11: Jews has been around for thousands of years, and.

545
00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:14,600
Speaker 7: It's the short answer is, I don't know. And I

546
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:15,040
Speaker 7: feel like.

547
00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:24,879
Speaker 11: Any insight I have into it feels like not comprehensive

548
00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:28,879
Speaker 11: enough to fully explain it. So I'm hesitant to even

549
00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:31,560
Speaker 11: like put something out there that really even pretends to

550
00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:40,920
Speaker 11: understand it. You know, I think, at least in my experience,

551
00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:44,840
Speaker 11: more sort of modern Judaism, and really, you know, the

552
00:34:44,920 --> 00:34:47,719
Speaker 11: generations that I've been exposed to is I think Jews

553
00:34:47,760 --> 00:34:53,719
Speaker 11: are really good at assimilation and and it's a.

554
00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:56,280
Speaker 7: Culture that you know, values.

555
00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:06,400
Speaker 11: Education, hard work and those things. And I think that anytime.

556
00:35:05,320 --> 00:35:07,279
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, I headcammer up because I want to.

557
00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:09,520
Speaker 12: I want to get to the heart of is what

558
00:35:09,640 --> 00:35:16,080
Speaker 12: possesses someone to put flyers at someone's doorstep, what possesses

559
00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:20,920
Speaker 12: someone to put a banner on an overpass? What possesses

560
00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:27,440
Speaker 12: people to screen epithets and why.

561
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:31,600
Speaker 11: I appreciate the question, and I ask the same question

562
00:35:32,120 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 11: every time these things happen. I don't I don't know,

563
00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 11: and I don't understand it, and uh, I really it's

564
00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:46,719
Speaker 11: not that I haven't thought about it, and it's not

565
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:48,799
Speaker 11: that I don't like, but I feel like my theory

566
00:35:48,880 --> 00:35:53,880
Speaker 11: is on it change depending on who is the person

567
00:35:54,040 --> 00:35:55,959
Speaker 11: or what their background is, and that's doing it because

568
00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:58,319
Speaker 11: it doesn't it doesn't make sense in some ways because

569
00:35:58,360 --> 00:36:02,719
Speaker 11: it comes from so many different places and it and

570
00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:05,399
Speaker 11: it presents itself in so many you know, all over

571
00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 11: the world in different ways. It feels like it's, uh,

572
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:13,920
Speaker 11: it's like when you're looking for a group to blame,

573
00:36:14,040 --> 00:36:16,000
Speaker 11: it's one of the first groups you go to. But

574
00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:18,640
Speaker 11: it's hard to I can't say why, Like I can't

575
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:19,040
Speaker 11: say why.

576
00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:20,040
Speaker 7: So I wish I could.

577
00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:23,960
Speaker 11: Give you some articulate answer that might add some you know,

578
00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:25,120
Speaker 11: something to the conversation.

579
00:36:25,360 --> 00:36:26,680
Speaker 7: And I think that might be the answer.

580
00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:28,920
Speaker 12: Yeah, you know, I think it's going to be one

581
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:29,720
Speaker 12: of life's mysteries.

582
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:33,320
Speaker 7: Yeah, perhaps that's where I stand. That's how I feel.

583
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:41,720
Speaker 2: Hate Modern anti Semitism is a production of the KFI

584
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:45,640
Speaker 2: News Department for iHeartMedia, Los Angeles, Robin Berta Lucci program

585
00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:49,520
Speaker 2: director Chris Little, news Director. The program is produced by

586
00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:53,719
Speaker 2: Steve Gregory and Jacob Gonzalez. The complete interviews with these

587
00:36:53,719 --> 00:36:57,360
Speaker 2: guests and more are available on the Hate Modern Anti

588
00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:01,400
Speaker 2: Semitism podcast, available on the iHeart art Radio app. To

589
00:37:01,520 --> 00:37:03,919
Speaker 2: learn more about anti Semitism and how you can join

590
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:09,839
Speaker 2: the conversation, go to translatehete dot org. That's translatehete dot org.

591
00:37:10,560 --> 00:37:13,600
Speaker 2: This is KFI AM six forty time now for a

592
00:37:13,600 --> 00:37:24,960
Speaker 2: news update. Hey, you've been listening to the John Cobalt

593
00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:27,319
Speaker 2: Show podcast. You can always hear the show live on

594
00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:30,359
Speaker 2: KFI AM six forty from one to four pm every

595
00:37:30,440 --> 00:37:33,360
Speaker 2: Monday through Friday, and of course, anytime on demand on

596
00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:34,640
Speaker 2: the iHeartRadio app