1 00:00:04,210 --> 00:00:06,309 Speaker 1: Hey, and welcome to the Short Stuff. I'm Josh, and 2 00:00:06,350 --> 00:00:09,910 Speaker 1: there's Chuck, and Jerry's here doing the Charleston on Dave's behalf, 3 00:00:09,990 --> 00:00:13,200 Speaker 1: and this is Stuff You Should Know Short Stuff. Let's 4 00:00:13,260 --> 00:00:16,220 Speaker 1: go now. All right. 5 00:00:16,239 --> 00:00:21,239 Speaker 2: The year is 1915, everybody, and the word flapper is 6 00:00:21,280 --> 00:00:24,540 Speaker 2: about to be introduced to the world by way of H. L. Minkin, 7 00:00:24,560 --> 00:00:28,600 Speaker 2: a writer who wrote a, I guess, an essay about 8 00:00:29,130 --> 00:00:33,290 Speaker 2: called the flapper for the literary magazine, The Smart Set. 9 00:00:33,650 --> 00:00:34,450 Speaker 1: What a great mag. 10 00:00:34,950 --> 00:00:35,190 Speaker 2: Yeah. 11 00:00:36,130 --> 00:00:37,989 Speaker 1: By the way, we should say that Private Eye is 12 00:00:38,070 --> 00:00:42,170 Speaker 1: not a rag over in the UK. So sorry, everybody. 13 00:00:42,850 --> 00:00:44,450 Speaker 1: I'm going to go ahead and assume The Smart Set 14 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:50,159 Speaker 1: wasn't either. But in this article or essay, Mencken is 15 00:00:50,240 --> 00:00:53,240 Speaker 1: using a term that's already been established, flapper. It was, 16 00:00:53,280 --> 00:00:58,390 Speaker 1: I think, British slang for a young girl, right? He's saying, no, no, no. 17 00:00:58,810 --> 00:01:01,350 Speaker 1: We need to get more specific. There is a young 18 00:01:01,390 --> 00:01:03,730 Speaker 1: girl that's emerging. They're not here yet, but I can 19 00:01:03,830 --> 00:01:06,890 Speaker 1: see them coming out of the fabric of culture. And 20 00:01:07,020 --> 00:01:11,080 Speaker 1: they are not going to follow these standards and traditions 21 00:01:11,140 --> 00:01:15,000 Speaker 1: and moral codes that are handed down generation after generation. 22 00:01:15,380 --> 00:01:18,370 Speaker 1: There's this new thing called media that is coming up, 23 00:01:18,480 --> 00:01:21,069 Speaker 1: and that's what's going to influence them. And they're going 24 00:01:21,090 --> 00:01:24,410 Speaker 1: to be total trailblazers. And he was right. Yeah. 25 00:01:24,450 --> 00:01:27,229 Speaker 2: So the flapper would come along and kick what was 26 00:01:27,270 --> 00:01:30,150 Speaker 2: known as the Gibson Girl to the curb. The Gibson 27 00:01:30,170 --> 00:01:34,220 Speaker 2: Girl during the 1910s was created and popularized from an 28 00:01:34,250 --> 00:01:37,600 Speaker 2: illustrator named Charles Dana Gibson. And this was like if 29 00:01:37,640 --> 00:01:43,020 Speaker 2: you think of the Edwardian sort of corset wearing, updo 30 00:01:43,100 --> 00:01:48,170 Speaker 2: hair wearing, choker, you know, like choker. dress that goes, 31 00:01:48,230 --> 00:01:49,850 Speaker 2: a skirt that goes all the way to the past 32 00:01:49,870 --> 00:01:52,630 Speaker 2: the ankle and like a choker up to under the chin. 33 00:01:53,170 --> 00:01:56,780 Speaker 2: That's the Gibson girl look. And the flapper came along 34 00:01:56,840 --> 00:01:58,820 Speaker 2: and said, no, no, no, no. We want to have 35 00:01:58,960 --> 00:01:59,820 Speaker 2: more fun than that. 36 00:02:00,700 --> 00:02:03,860 Speaker 1: They did. And they did. And it took the death 37 00:02:03,900 --> 00:02:06,540 Speaker 1: of tens of millions of people to get them there. 38 00:02:07,600 --> 00:02:10,880 Speaker 1: Because World War I and the 1918 flu pandemic were 39 00:02:10,900 --> 00:02:13,990 Speaker 1: a one-two punch that killed a lot of people around 40 00:02:14,030 --> 00:02:17,610 Speaker 1: the world. And in doing so, both of those things 41 00:02:18,389 --> 00:02:22,060 Speaker 1: adjusted gender norms to the extent that all of a sudden, 42 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:25,679 Speaker 1: like the world couldn't afford to just keep women off 43 00:02:25,700 --> 00:02:29,980 Speaker 1: to the side any longer. They were needed more than ever, 44 00:02:30,080 --> 00:02:32,410 Speaker 1: like in the workforce, they needed to be educated. And 45 00:02:32,430 --> 00:02:35,209 Speaker 1: so it opened all these opportunities for women to just 46 00:02:35,250 --> 00:02:36,989 Speaker 1: kind of come out from under the thumb of their 47 00:02:37,010 --> 00:02:39,170 Speaker 1: fathers and then their husbands. Yeah. 48 00:02:39,250 --> 00:02:43,070 Speaker 2: And this kind of happened around 1920. When the Roaring 49 00:02:43,290 --> 00:02:45,310 Speaker 2: Twenties came on the scene, there was a new woman 50 00:02:46,290 --> 00:02:51,410 Speaker 2: emerging from the cocoon that kind of coincided with like, hey, 51 00:02:51,450 --> 00:02:53,830 Speaker 2: we'd like to have a right to vote, kind of 52 00:02:53,910 --> 00:02:57,810 Speaker 2: early feminist causes as well. And both the 18th and 53 00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:00,720 Speaker 2: 19th Amendments were both pretty crucial to the rise of 54 00:03:00,780 --> 00:03:04,520 Speaker 2: this new kind of style of woman, which was prohibition, 55 00:03:05,060 --> 00:03:10,500 Speaker 2: which sent people into underground bars hanging out and then 56 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:13,529 Speaker 2: the right to vote. And both of these things were 57 00:03:13,590 --> 00:03:18,549 Speaker 2: sort of like a rejection of the Victorian code that 58 00:03:18,590 --> 00:03:19,090 Speaker 2: came before. 59 00:03:19,110 --> 00:03:24,620 Speaker 1: Yeah, big time. I mean, this wasn't like a transition over, 60 00:03:24,630 --> 00:03:27,420 Speaker 1: you know, the course of decades that just one piece 61 00:03:27,480 --> 00:03:31,560 Speaker 1: followed another. This was like a razor blade cutting off 62 00:03:31,660 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 1: the old guard and starting anew. And it was led 63 00:03:35,600 --> 00:03:40,290 Speaker 1: by this leading edge of young, like early 20s people. 64 00:03:40,910 --> 00:03:47,950 Speaker 1: late teens girls who just completely just changed everything. They 65 00:03:48,210 --> 00:03:50,890 Speaker 1: went against so many norms. They started smoking. They started drinking. 66 00:03:51,370 --> 00:03:54,330 Speaker 1: Women did not do those things at that time. They 67 00:03:54,350 --> 00:03:57,820 Speaker 1: started wearing makeup. Women did not wear makeup unless you 68 00:03:57,860 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 1: were a sex worker or an actress. They just did 69 00:04:01,520 --> 00:04:03,300 Speaker 1: all this stuff that up to that point was just 70 00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:05,420 Speaker 1: not done. And they just started doing it all of 71 00:04:05,460 --> 00:04:06,620 Speaker 1: a sudden. Yeah. 72 00:04:07,180 --> 00:04:09,100 Speaker 2: Two other big things that kind of spurred this was 73 00:04:09,140 --> 00:04:13,180 Speaker 2: the rise of the automobile. More and more people had cars. 74 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:16,020 Speaker 2: So all of a sudden, not only could young women 75 00:04:16,060 --> 00:04:18,740 Speaker 2: like drive themselves places and they weren't literally sort of 76 00:04:18,920 --> 00:04:20,609 Speaker 2: under lock and key of their of their home or 77 00:04:20,620 --> 00:04:23,630 Speaker 2: their parents homes. But all of a sudden, boys and 78 00:04:23,670 --> 00:04:25,750 Speaker 2: young men could come along and pick them up and 79 00:04:25,830 --> 00:04:28,710 Speaker 2: take them out on a date. And, you know, sometimes 80 00:04:28,930 --> 00:04:31,530 Speaker 2: things would happen in cars and like everything was changing. 81 00:04:32,430 --> 00:04:35,240 Speaker 2: The other big one was the radio. KDKA in Pittsburgh 82 00:04:35,260 --> 00:04:40,180 Speaker 2: was the first, I guess, commercial broadcast station. And by 1924, 83 00:04:40,180 --> 00:04:43,140 Speaker 2: there were more than 600 of those. And all of 84 00:04:43,180 --> 00:04:46,320 Speaker 2: a sudden there was like music happening and movies happening 85 00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:50,040 Speaker 2: that featured different styles and young women like, you know, 86 00:04:50,400 --> 00:04:51,460 Speaker 2: dancing and having fun. 87 00:04:51,839 --> 00:04:56,250 Speaker 1: Yeah. People driving around in convertibles in New York, booming Jay-Z. 88 00:04:56,470 --> 00:04:57,250 Speaker 1: It was amazing. 89 00:04:57,490 --> 00:04:59,110 Speaker 2: Yeah. 90 00:04:59,190 --> 00:05:01,630 Speaker 1: I thought that was so stupid. No, it was great. 91 00:05:01,650 --> 00:05:05,270 Speaker 1: Let's take a break and we'll come back. Chuck and 92 00:05:05,310 --> 00:05:06,969 Speaker 1: I are going to work out whether that was actually 93 00:05:07,010 --> 00:05:07,610 Speaker 1: stupid or not. 94 00:05:09,200 --> 00:05:11,100 Speaker 2: . 95 00:05:10,960 --> 00:05:40,140 Speaker 1: Also, Chuck, before we get started again, 96 00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:42,580 Speaker 1: I want to shout out Conger for writing this. This 97 00:05:42,660 --> 00:05:45,320 Speaker 1: is a Conger joint from How Stuff Works, this article was. 98 00:05:45,730 --> 00:05:49,370 Speaker 2: That's right. Go check out Unladylike, the podcast. It's great. 99 00:05:49,430 --> 00:05:50,089 Speaker 2: And so is Kristen. 100 00:05:50,470 --> 00:05:55,750 Speaker 1: Exactly. So there was a new woman that emerged from 101 00:05:55,910 --> 00:05:58,880 Speaker 1: that right to vote. You can kind of say that 102 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:03,040 Speaker 1: those two amendments that came out so quickly together, the 103 00:06:03,060 --> 00:06:07,250 Speaker 1: 18th and 19th, One was for the flappers. That was 104 00:06:07,290 --> 00:06:10,610 Speaker 1: the prohibition on alcohol because it created speakeasies, like you said. 105 00:06:11,070 --> 00:06:13,750 Speaker 1: The right to vote, that created this kind of other 106 00:06:15,330 --> 00:06:18,610 Speaker 1: thread of women called the new woman who were very 107 00:06:18,670 --> 00:06:24,110 Speaker 1: interested in being active politically and socially. The flappers were like, yeah, 108 00:06:24,150 --> 00:06:25,890 Speaker 1: you go have fun with that. We're going to go 109 00:06:26,050 --> 00:06:30,120 Speaker 1: get wasted and hang out in speakeasies in New York 110 00:06:30,180 --> 00:06:32,920 Speaker 1: and just live our funnest lives. Yeah. 111 00:06:33,180 --> 00:06:36,580 Speaker 2: Or maybe go see a Clara Bow movie because in 1922, 112 00:06:36,580 --> 00:06:41,220 Speaker 2: Clara Bow debuted in Beyond the Rainbow and kind of 113 00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:45,980 Speaker 2: defined the flapper look. She had that hair bobbed. She 114 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:49,540 Speaker 2: had a little bit of makeup on. The flapper style 115 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:52,440 Speaker 2: was really coming in vogue. In real life, you had 116 00:06:53,360 --> 00:06:58,089 Speaker 2: none other than Zelda Fitzgerald as a late teen when 117 00:06:58,150 --> 00:07:01,130 Speaker 2: she was with F. Scott Fitzgerald when he first gained fame. 118 00:07:01,750 --> 00:07:04,330 Speaker 2: I think I think before she was writing even, uh, 119 00:07:05,140 --> 00:07:06,670 Speaker 2: and she was sort of one of the first big 120 00:07:06,750 --> 00:07:10,869 Speaker 2: it girls, uh, and certainly, um, embodied that flapper style. 121 00:07:11,610 --> 00:07:14,030 Speaker 1: Yeah. Also, I don't want, I don't know who I 122 00:07:14,110 --> 00:07:16,590 Speaker 1: said was the first it girl, but I was wrong. 123 00:07:16,670 --> 00:07:19,830 Speaker 1: It was in some other, um, podcast a while back, 124 00:07:20,030 --> 00:07:22,000 Speaker 1: but I, I, whoever it was, was in like the 125 00:07:22,040 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 1: forties or fifties, but I think Clara Bow is the 126 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:28,300 Speaker 1: actual first it girl. Okay. And then I guess Zelda 127 00:07:28,320 --> 00:07:31,250 Speaker 1: Fitzgerald was the first real life it girl, but, Let's 128 00:07:31,270 --> 00:07:33,880 Speaker 1: talk about some of those fashions that people like Claire 129 00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:37,340 Speaker 1: Bow and Zelda Fitzgerald rocked. A lot of it was 130 00:07:37,380 --> 00:07:38,980 Speaker 1: being designed by Coco Chanel. 131 00:07:39,340 --> 00:07:39,560 Speaker 2: Yeah. 132 00:07:39,660 --> 00:07:43,860 Speaker 1: Like the real deal Coco Chanel was designing in Paris 133 00:07:43,920 --> 00:07:48,860 Speaker 1: during this time. And that whole like Victorian era corset 134 00:07:49,580 --> 00:07:53,179 Speaker 1: S figure shape was just thrown totally out the window. 135 00:07:53,600 --> 00:08:00,400 Speaker 1: And instead it was boyish bodies with drapey boxy skirts, essentially. 136 00:08:01,060 --> 00:08:03,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, that was like that sack dress was like the 137 00:08:03,340 --> 00:08:09,100 Speaker 2: flapper uniform. The fabric literally was lighter. Conger found this 138 00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:12,140 Speaker 2: is pretty staggering, but the flapper dress had about seven 139 00:08:12,170 --> 00:08:15,190 Speaker 2: yards of fabric. A Victorian gown had about 20 yards 140 00:08:15,250 --> 00:08:20,710 Speaker 2: of fabric. So they literally shed weight in their clothing 141 00:08:20,790 --> 00:08:26,600 Speaker 2: to just be freer. The flapper dress basically was about 142 00:08:26,740 --> 00:08:30,930 Speaker 2: mid-calf in length. Um, by the late 1920s, it inched 143 00:08:30,970 --> 00:08:33,809 Speaker 2: above the knee a little bit. Um, but you know, 144 00:08:33,970 --> 00:08:36,170 Speaker 2: so they could dance so they could do the Charleston 145 00:08:36,210 --> 00:08:38,890 Speaker 2: and the, and the Foxtrot. Yeah. 146 00:08:39,370 --> 00:08:41,820 Speaker 1: Um, they, people think like it immediately went up. That 147 00:08:41,880 --> 00:08:44,210 Speaker 1: is actually one thing that kind of slowly changed and it, 148 00:08:44,380 --> 00:08:47,319 Speaker 1: it was just that way for a couple of years. Yeah. Um, 149 00:08:47,720 --> 00:08:49,740 Speaker 1: one of the other things that is like, like you said, 150 00:08:49,800 --> 00:08:52,660 Speaker 1: the flapper uniform was the cloche hat. I never knew 151 00:08:52,679 --> 00:08:55,660 Speaker 1: that's what it was called. Yeah. But it's like a 152 00:08:56,480 --> 00:08:59,380 Speaker 1: almost brimless hat. It's very close to the head, usually 153 00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:02,930 Speaker 1: has a big bow. And it would show off their hairdo, 154 00:09:03,010 --> 00:09:05,790 Speaker 1: which is usually quite short. You mentioned that those Gibson 155 00:09:05,809 --> 00:09:09,150 Speaker 1: girls had like the big updo or else like long, 156 00:09:09,270 --> 00:09:12,620 Speaker 1: flowy hair. Another way to rebel against that was to 157 00:09:12,770 --> 00:09:15,060 Speaker 1: cut your hair very short and often very straight. And 158 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:20,079 Speaker 1: sometimes with pomade, that was the flapper girl's haircut. I 159 00:09:20,100 --> 00:09:21,620 Speaker 1: think it was called the Eaton crop. 160 00:09:22,210 --> 00:09:24,650 Speaker 2: Yeah, and they might use the pomade to like slick 161 00:09:24,670 --> 00:09:28,460 Speaker 2: it back like a man might. They would show their– 162 00:09:28,490 --> 00:09:30,910 Speaker 2: a lot of those flapper dresses had no arms, so 163 00:09:30,929 --> 00:09:32,709 Speaker 2: they were showing their arms for the first time. 164 00:09:32,970 --> 00:09:33,530 Speaker 1: Scandalous. 165 00:09:34,090 --> 00:09:36,580 Speaker 2: Very scandalous. A lot of times with a lot of 166 00:09:36,620 --> 00:09:40,620 Speaker 2: like necklaces and bracelets and things like that. And the wool, 167 00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:43,800 Speaker 2: those like heavy black wool stockings went out of fashion 168 00:09:44,300 --> 00:09:48,720 Speaker 2: for a more sheer hosiery. And sometimes– oh, boy. They 169 00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:50,850 Speaker 2: would roll down that hosiery a little bit to like 170 00:09:50,900 --> 00:09:52,120 Speaker 2: a makeshift knee high. 171 00:09:52,809 --> 00:09:53,430 Speaker 1: Not a good look. 172 00:09:54,570 --> 00:09:55,190 Speaker 2: Oh, I think it is. 173 00:09:55,710 --> 00:09:57,630 Speaker 1: Do you? You like the roll down knee high look? 174 00:09:58,429 --> 00:10:00,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, I was raised Baptist, all that stuff. is very titillating. 175 00:10:01,340 --> 00:10:03,640 Speaker 1: I think my problem is I associate that with mama 176 00:10:03,679 --> 00:10:04,679 Speaker 1: for mama's family. 177 00:10:04,700 --> 00:10:07,069 Speaker 2: Yeah, that'll do it. Yeah. 178 00:10:07,770 --> 00:10:12,670 Speaker 1: That'll definitely dampen your thoughts. Yes. So all of this 179 00:10:13,350 --> 00:10:16,320 Speaker 1: flapper party came and went in less than a decade. 180 00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:19,460 Speaker 1: I mean, Clara Bow hit the scene in 1922, and 181 00:10:19,520 --> 00:10:21,700 Speaker 1: she was the one in Beyond the Rainbow that really 182 00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:25,699 Speaker 1: like kind of set the standard. And by 1929, it 183 00:10:25,840 --> 00:10:28,910 Speaker 1: was all over because the Depression hit and everybody's like, 184 00:10:29,510 --> 00:10:31,370 Speaker 1: we don't have time for parties anymore. We got bigger 185 00:10:31,410 --> 00:10:33,189 Speaker 1: fish to fry now. Yeah. 186 00:10:33,490 --> 00:10:36,250 Speaker 2: And that was kind of it. The stock market crash 187 00:10:36,290 --> 00:10:41,390 Speaker 2: was like literally the very end. It was October 29th, 1929. 188 00:10:41,570 --> 00:10:43,189 Speaker 2: And it was just one of those events that kind 189 00:10:43,230 --> 00:10:46,250 Speaker 2: of kind of signified like the end of an era 190 00:10:46,429 --> 00:10:48,610 Speaker 2: and definitely the end of the flapper era. 191 00:10:48,950 --> 00:10:51,810 Speaker 1: Yeah. The fun was over. And so was prohibition, too, 192 00:10:52,030 --> 00:10:55,280 Speaker 1: because America really needed to start drinking again. So there 193 00:10:55,320 --> 00:10:56,960 Speaker 1: went the speakeasy and all that stuff. 194 00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:00,240 Speaker 2: And I think that means short stuff's over, too, though, right? 195 00:11:00,860 --> 00:11:04,320 Speaker 1: Yeah. It's not just over, Chuck. It's out. 196 00:11:07,700 --> 00:11:09,880 Speaker 2: Stuff You Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. 197 00:11:10,440 --> 00:11:14,700 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 198 00:11:14,860 --> 00:11:16,620 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.