1 00:00:09,920 --> 00:00:10,360 Speaker 1: What is up? 2 00:00:10,360 --> 00:00:12,600 Speaker 2: Mets fans, Welcome back to another episode of the Mets 3 00:00:12,680 --> 00:00:17,479 Speaker 2: Up Podcast. We've got a pitching coach. Apparently, Justin Willard 4 00:00:17,960 --> 00:00:20,840 Speaker 2: is supposedly the new pitching coach. It's not official yet, 5 00:00:20,880 --> 00:00:23,119 Speaker 2: but we've been seeing all the reports, all the rumors, 6 00:00:23,160 --> 00:00:25,880 Speaker 2: all signs are leading to Justin Willard being the new 7 00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 2: guy in charge at the major league level. Before you 8 00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 2: get more, Before you get going into it more, make 9 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:33,680 Speaker 2: sure you are subscribed to the Mets Up podcast and 10 00:00:33,680 --> 00:00:36,640 Speaker 2: if you're listening to us Apple podcasts, Spotify, Google drops 11 00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:38,920 Speaker 2: the rating, drops, review, download, and subscribe. James, I know 12 00:00:38,960 --> 00:00:41,159 Speaker 2: you're exciting to talk about this one. Could this be 13 00:00:41,240 --> 00:00:43,560 Speaker 2: the new Hefner Jersey for you? Are were going to 14 00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:46,240 Speaker 2: see a Willard pitching coach Jersey in the Chiano future. 15 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:48,080 Speaker 3: I feel like the Heft thing was once in a 16 00:00:48,120 --> 00:00:50,160 Speaker 3: lifetime just because of the way the podcast was growing 17 00:00:50,200 --> 00:00:51,920 Speaker 3: at the time and how much people just liked having 18 00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:53,880 Speaker 3: it even before we started this show. But this is 19 00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:58,320 Speaker 3: by all accounts a very exciting again potential apparent hire 20 00:00:58,320 --> 00:00:58,760 Speaker 3: by the Mets. 21 00:00:58,760 --> 00:00:59,800 Speaker 4: All the signs are pointing that way. 22 00:01:00,040 --> 00:01:02,520 Speaker 3: Samon reported our merged as a front runner very close 23 00:01:02,560 --> 00:01:05,000 Speaker 3: to official. It all seems like this will happen because 24 00:01:05,040 --> 00:01:06,800 Speaker 3: kind of we know the nature of these higher Sometimes 25 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:07,720 Speaker 3: you got weigh a little. 26 00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 2: Bit and by the time you guys are listening to this, 27 00:01:09,360 --> 00:01:11,160 Speaker 2: it very well could be official totally. 28 00:01:11,200 --> 00:01:13,160 Speaker 3: He's probably got across some te's dots, some eyes do 29 00:01:13,280 --> 00:01:16,080 Speaker 3: all stuff. But this is definitely something that's just great 30 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:18,920 Speaker 3: for the Mets pitching development, player development going forward. We 31 00:01:18,959 --> 00:01:21,240 Speaker 3: talked about the fact that it made sense to move 32 00:01:21,280 --> 00:01:23,800 Speaker 3: on from Jeremy Heffner after this offseason, but you did 33 00:01:23,840 --> 00:01:25,800 Speaker 3: not want an overhaul. You did not want to change 34 00:01:25,840 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 3: a lot of the things that was making this organization 35 00:01:28,920 --> 00:01:32,200 Speaker 3: very successful. Pitching development something that we'd become accustomed to 36 00:01:32,319 --> 00:01:34,880 Speaker 3: for the last few years. And Willard is someone who 37 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:37,279 Speaker 3: kind of fits in the mold. He worked with Hefner 38 00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:38,880 Speaker 3: a long time ago, worked at least under him in 39 00:01:38,920 --> 00:01:40,480 Speaker 3: the same organization as him in Minnesota the. 40 00:01:40,440 --> 00:01:41,040 Speaker 4: Way back when. 41 00:01:41,360 --> 00:01:44,200 Speaker 3: But also definitely some connections Eric Jaeger's coming from the 42 00:01:44,240 --> 00:01:47,000 Speaker 3: Red Sox, working with Craig Blastrow and Kyle Body. There 43 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:50,800 Speaker 3: seems to be a great continuation consistency here with this 44 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:54,640 Speaker 3: Higher while getting a new prominent, strong voice in the room. 45 00:01:54,880 --> 00:01:57,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, and it doesn't seem like the stuff is too 46 00:01:57,000 --> 00:02:00,080 Speaker 2: far off of what Hefner's philosophy and stuff was as well, 47 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:02,800 Speaker 2: which is, you gotta have nasty stuff. We want stuff, 48 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:04,600 Speaker 2: we want stuff, we want stuff. How do we make 49 00:02:04,600 --> 00:02:06,920 Speaker 2: this stuff better? The biggest difference here, and I don't 50 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:09,560 Speaker 2: think this is anti Hefner, It's just that Willard is 51 00:02:09,760 --> 00:02:12,040 Speaker 2: very very simple and that you gotta have good stuff 52 00:02:12,080 --> 00:02:13,560 Speaker 2: and you gotta throw it in the zone because if 53 00:02:13,600 --> 00:02:15,640 Speaker 2: you don't throw strikes, we can't get out. And if 54 00:02:15,680 --> 00:02:17,359 Speaker 2: we're not getting outs, we're not doing our job as 55 00:02:17,360 --> 00:02:20,079 Speaker 2: a pitcher. And we saw that all season with the Mets. 56 00:02:20,320 --> 00:02:22,639 Speaker 2: They had a massive issue, every single one of them 57 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:24,440 Speaker 2: throwing shrikes consistently. 58 00:02:24,760 --> 00:02:27,240 Speaker 3: And it's the confident to throw strikes in the zone. 59 00:02:27,240 --> 00:02:29,560 Speaker 3: But you have that confidence by having the nasty stuff 60 00:02:29,560 --> 00:02:31,080 Speaker 3: to throw in the zone. So we have a great 61 00:02:31,440 --> 00:02:33,359 Speaker 3: a couple of great quotes here from Ian Brownpiece and 62 00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:35,960 Speaker 3: LB dot Com where he interviewed Willard. This was before 63 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:39,720 Speaker 3: last season January of twenty twenty four. Willard said he 64 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:41,560 Speaker 3: has a really simple approach when it comes to his 65 00:02:41,639 --> 00:02:44,760 Speaker 3: pitching philosophy. Throw nasty stuff in the zone. You could 66 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:47,440 Speaker 3: have nasty stuff, but it's not going to be maximized 67 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:50,119 Speaker 3: if you're not in the zone, and then vice versa, 68 00:02:50,160 --> 00:02:52,200 Speaker 3: if you're in the zone and you're getting hit. We've 69 00:02:52,200 --> 00:02:55,359 Speaker 3: got to develop better stuff, I think most importantly defining 70 00:02:55,400 --> 00:02:57,600 Speaker 3: that for players and defining what the scoreboard is. 71 00:02:58,080 --> 00:02:58,320 Speaker 1: Yeah. 72 00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:01,040 Speaker 2: I mean it's kind of funny because it is sometimes 73 00:03:01,040 --> 00:03:03,960 Speaker 2: that simple. Throw really good pictures in the zone and 74 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:05,880 Speaker 2: if they're getting hit, the pictures need to be better. 75 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 2: I know that sounds stupid and to people maybe listening 76 00:03:08,560 --> 00:03:10,560 Speaker 2: to this or watching this, they might be like, yeah, 77 00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:12,000 Speaker 2: no shit, like this is the guy we. 78 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:13,840 Speaker 1: Hired, what a what a novel idea? 79 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:16,480 Speaker 2: But this is always this is the conversation we have 80 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 2: with you guys where when we talk about these free agents, 81 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:20,640 Speaker 2: we talk about these pictures that we are are not 82 00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:22,720 Speaker 2: interested in a lot of the time, it does come 83 00:03:22,760 --> 00:03:24,360 Speaker 2: down to the stuff that they. 84 00:03:24,160 --> 00:03:25,400 Speaker 4: Have totally end. 85 00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:27,200 Speaker 3: It's about kind of and of course this was going 86 00:03:27,240 --> 00:03:28,960 Speaker 3: to happen any modern hire that we had. 87 00:03:28,800 --> 00:03:30,919 Speaker 4: But this is a this is a process guy. 88 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:32,760 Speaker 3: I know you guys know how much we love process 89 00:03:33,080 --> 00:03:35,240 Speaker 3: on this on this podcast. But I went and found 90 00:03:35,240 --> 00:03:37,640 Speaker 3: an interview that Kevin Willard did again about a year 91 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 3: ago now with something called. 92 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:39,920 Speaker 4: The Socks Prospects. 93 00:03:39,960 --> 00:03:40,920 Speaker 1: You call him Kevin Willard. 94 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 3: I keep calling Kevin Willard because that's the same Hall 95 00:03:43,360 --> 00:03:45,560 Speaker 3: coach right well, Maryland. Now at each point somewhere else 96 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:48,160 Speaker 3: people hate him for Justin Willard, Justin Wood. It's gonna 97 00:03:48,160 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 3: be a think for me on my home as long 98 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:52,840 Speaker 3: as he's here now. But Socks prospect pod this was 99 00:03:52,880 --> 00:03:54,640 Speaker 3: it was. These guys were doing were really sharp. I 100 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:56,800 Speaker 3: only had like three hundred views this podcast, only about 101 00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:58,720 Speaker 3: two thousand describers on YouTube. If you guys like Red 102 00:03:58,760 --> 00:04:00,280 Speaker 3: Sox podcast, I'm happy to shout them. 103 00:04:00,240 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 4: Out right now. 104 00:04:00,840 --> 00:04:04,320 Speaker 3: But Willard was just he was spitting fire on this 105 00:04:04,400 --> 00:04:06,560 Speaker 3: whole thing. It's like a forty five minute interview, which 106 00:04:06,600 --> 00:04:08,360 Speaker 3: is even cool. This guy with a prominent role with 107 00:04:08,360 --> 00:04:10,040 Speaker 3: the Red Sox was doing an interview like this with 108 00:04:10,080 --> 00:04:12,600 Speaker 3: small scale podcasts could bud well for guys like us 109 00:04:12,640 --> 00:04:15,400 Speaker 3: over the next few weeks. But just some amazing quotes 110 00:04:15,400 --> 00:04:17,440 Speaker 3: he had on this. He talked a lot about pitchers, 111 00:04:17,520 --> 00:04:20,080 Speaker 3: especially pitchers the team would draft or sign. In terms 112 00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:22,919 Speaker 3: of poker hands, he was like, no matter what, you 113 00:04:23,000 --> 00:04:24,360 Speaker 3: have a really good chance to win, but you kind 114 00:04:24,360 --> 00:04:26,240 Speaker 3: of have to see how everything falls to determine what's 115 00:04:26,279 --> 00:04:28,400 Speaker 3: going to happen with this guy he called Paul Skean's 116 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:30,040 Speaker 3: pocket Rockets. He's like, you get a guy like Skians 117 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:32,560 Speaker 3: the organization, like, you know, he's going to succeed. Probably 118 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:33,760 Speaker 3: at least he's a better chance than a lot of 119 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:35,320 Speaker 3: other guys you succeed. He still have to get to 120 00:04:35,320 --> 00:04:37,000 Speaker 3: the end of it. But then he said, most of 121 00:04:37,040 --> 00:04:39,360 Speaker 3: the guys that you're getting and developing the drafts are 122 00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:41,680 Speaker 3: like two seven off suits and it's really about you 123 00:04:41,760 --> 00:04:43,880 Speaker 3: being able to play the hand, figuring out what everybody 124 00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:45,479 Speaker 3: else has and seeing what you can get out of 125 00:04:45,480 --> 00:04:47,840 Speaker 3: these guys. And just there was again there was tons 126 00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 3: of heat in this thing. I listened to the whole 127 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:50,440 Speaker 3: thing on two X speed. I was like, wow, over 128 00:04:50,560 --> 00:04:51,640 Speaker 3: this morning, this is awesome. 129 00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:52,320 Speaker 1: I do like that. 130 00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:54,000 Speaker 2: I like the idea of you know, Skins as the 131 00:04:54,000 --> 00:04:56,880 Speaker 2: pocket aces you should win, but again you're not guaranteed 132 00:04:56,920 --> 00:04:58,800 Speaker 2: because seven to two you get a couple seven and 133 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:00,280 Speaker 2: two is on the board with that hand and all 134 00:05:00,320 --> 00:05:02,920 Speaker 2: of a sudden you're cooking. So it's like, that's an 135 00:05:02,960 --> 00:05:04,800 Speaker 2: interesting way to put it. I like the way that 136 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:07,039 Speaker 2: this guy's even thinking just on the base level. 137 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:09,279 Speaker 3: Oh, there's even so many more good ones, great ones. 138 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:11,799 Speaker 3: He talks about big rocks in terms of player development. 139 00:05:11,880 --> 00:05:12,799 Speaker 1: You have to big rocks. 140 00:05:12,839 --> 00:05:15,320 Speaker 3: You keep moving big rocks, like big rocks is like fitness, 141 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:17,200 Speaker 3: but then other rocks inside those big rocks is like 142 00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 3: you're nutrition and your sleep, but then your biomechanical stuff. 143 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:23,160 Speaker 2: Which also that seems super in line too with what 144 00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:25,880 Speaker 2: the Mets new hires have been so far, like Snickers, 145 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:29,880 Speaker 2: very very biomechanical, making sure all the things are working right. 146 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 4: He talked about. 147 00:05:31,480 --> 00:05:34,359 Speaker 3: Also, he kept using the phrase over the plate success, 148 00:05:34,360 --> 00:05:36,120 Speaker 3: which again I think goes off that ethos that we 149 00:05:36,120 --> 00:05:37,720 Speaker 3: shared with you guys a few minutes ago, where it's 150 00:05:37,720 --> 00:05:40,080 Speaker 3: like this you want to be a strike throwing team, 151 00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:42,240 Speaker 3: kept saying over the plate success, over the plate success, 152 00:05:42,320 --> 00:05:45,280 Speaker 3: kept talking about velocity, adding velocity onto guys. But then 153 00:05:45,320 --> 00:05:47,279 Speaker 3: he also goes and like kind of pulls it out 154 00:05:47,480 --> 00:05:50,360 Speaker 3: and talks about using models, just using advanced data in 155 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:52,760 Speaker 3: decision making process. But he says something interesting where he says, 156 00:05:52,960 --> 00:05:55,800 Speaker 3: predictive models are necessary in organizations, but they can never 157 00:05:55,839 --> 00:05:58,760 Speaker 3: be everything. And he specifically in this interview he did 158 00:05:58,760 --> 00:06:00,720 Speaker 3: in the small scale Red Sox pocket a year ago 159 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:02,919 Speaker 3: brought up why would the race trade the guy like 160 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:05,080 Speaker 3: Joe Ryan for something that seemed like not so much 161 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:08,040 Speaker 3: of the time. And it's because at the time with 162 00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:10,400 Speaker 3: the Rays were trying to model with their fastball models 163 00:06:10,440 --> 00:06:13,000 Speaker 3: how they were approaching and perceiving stuff. They just never 164 00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:16,240 Speaker 3: thought that while Ryan's fastball was it was. 165 00:06:16,200 --> 00:06:17,200 Speaker 4: Bad, but it was so weird. 166 00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:18,600 Speaker 3: They didn't know if it was actually translated to get 167 00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:20,279 Speaker 3: major legue hiters out, so they thought they were able 168 00:06:20,320 --> 00:06:22,279 Speaker 3: to sell high in a guy with minor league helium. 169 00:06:22,360 --> 00:06:24,440 Speaker 3: But then this was I don't know if this is 170 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:27,600 Speaker 3: exactly the prushure over. When Willard was with the Twins, 171 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:28,919 Speaker 3: he said they got them because the figured it'd at 172 00:06:28,960 --> 00:06:30,880 Speaker 3: least be good enough, but maybe just not three times 173 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:31,440 Speaker 3: through the order. 174 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:33,120 Speaker 4: And then they kept kind of helping work on it. 175 00:06:33,160 --> 00:06:33,960 Speaker 4: They kept helping him. 176 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:36,800 Speaker 3: Buil velosity, and that's how Joe Ryan has become Joe Ryan. 177 00:06:36,960 --> 00:06:38,960 Speaker 3: This is another great quote you're going to love. We're 178 00:06:39,000 --> 00:06:41,960 Speaker 3: not playing the Era game. We're here the predict future outcomes. 179 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 1: There it is anti Era podcast. 180 00:06:44,400 --> 00:06:46,599 Speaker 3: And then people talked about I remember because people talked 181 00:06:46,600 --> 00:06:48,680 Speaker 3: about Trey Savage during this last round about like, wow, 182 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:50,400 Speaker 3: why do you even get promoted from double A when 183 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:52,160 Speaker 3: he had like a four to six cra and they they. 184 00:06:52,040 --> 00:06:53,640 Speaker 4: Don't even give a shit about that. I don't think 185 00:06:53,640 --> 00:06:55,919 Speaker 4: these teams are ever looking at a minor league's ZRA. 186 00:06:55,920 --> 00:06:57,400 Speaker 3: Just want to see that stuff's number. They want to 187 00:06:57,440 --> 00:06:59,919 Speaker 3: see what these pitchers look like, and how they're in 188 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 3: interacting with each other, and how hitters are approaching them, 189 00:07:02,400 --> 00:07:03,080 Speaker 3: see what this is. 190 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:05,280 Speaker 4: So again just he just being more modern. 191 00:07:05,520 --> 00:07:08,000 Speaker 2: And again the reason we talk about not caring about 192 00:07:08,040 --> 00:07:11,240 Speaker 2: especially minor league era One, a lot of times guys 193 00:07:11,240 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 2: are working on stuff, they're making changes, They're constantly tinkering 194 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:15,520 Speaker 2: down there to try and make sure that they can 195 00:07:15,520 --> 00:07:17,560 Speaker 2: get to where these organizations want them. And then two, 196 00:07:18,320 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 2: you have parks like the one in Nashville that have 197 00:07:20,080 --> 00:07:22,320 Speaker 2: like two seventy down the line in right field. You 198 00:07:22,400 --> 00:07:25,120 Speaker 2: have Coney Island where it's impossible for left handed hitters 199 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:27,640 Speaker 2: to hit home runs. These parks are not built to 200 00:07:27,680 --> 00:07:30,960 Speaker 2: be standardized to what ERA is around baseball, where it's 201 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:34,040 Speaker 2: like all the parks are somewhat ish close to each 202 00:07:34,080 --> 00:07:36,640 Speaker 2: other in baseball, like they're all within the same group. 203 00:07:37,080 --> 00:07:39,680 Speaker 2: Minor leagues, it's it's the wild Wild West out there. 204 00:07:40,000 --> 00:07:42,240 Speaker 3: And then also you're facing a minor league team in 205 00:07:42,320 --> 00:07:44,000 Speaker 3: Double A. This might be a team chock full of 206 00:07:44,040 --> 00:07:46,080 Speaker 3: future major leaguers, but you might be facing another one 207 00:07:46,080 --> 00:07:47,440 Speaker 3: that has no one's ever going to. 208 00:07:47,440 --> 00:07:48,080 Speaker 4: Get past that lie. 209 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:50,240 Speaker 2: Like if you're facing the Braves minor league system, like 210 00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:53,440 Speaker 2: there's three good prospects in that entire farm system right now, 211 00:07:53,480 --> 00:07:55,240 Speaker 2: like that playing their Double A team, they might have 212 00:07:55,240 --> 00:07:56,640 Speaker 2: twenty eight year olds on that team. 213 00:07:56,760 --> 00:07:58,120 Speaker 3: And then a few years ago when the Mets had 214 00:07:58,160 --> 00:08:00,680 Speaker 3: to face the Norfolk Ties, when those all the prospects 215 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:02,920 Speaker 3: coming through and it was like seven future major leaguers 216 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 3: in that lineup. And then you don't have that many 217 00:08:04,800 --> 00:08:06,680 Speaker 3: teams in these leagues. You're playing the same like six 218 00:08:06,680 --> 00:08:08,040 Speaker 3: to seven teams over and over again. 219 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:10,080 Speaker 2: Or the Triple A Red Sox this year Wooster where 220 00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:12,440 Speaker 2: it's like Roman Anthony and Christian Campbell and guys like that. 221 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:15,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, Brandon's brokes getting he rais about six beerre like, yeah, 222 00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:17,080 Speaker 3: a lot of those are just Roman Anthony home runs 223 00:08:17,120 --> 00:08:18,760 Speaker 3: and he's got one to twenty five bets hit. There's 224 00:08:18,800 --> 00:08:21,000 Speaker 3: the major league baseball already. But it's very interesting. I 225 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:23,160 Speaker 3: love hearing him talk like this, and there's more philosophy. 226 00:08:23,160 --> 00:08:26,160 Speaker 3: Maybe we could talk more about just Justin Surler's history now. 227 00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:28,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, because he does have a fascinating history. 228 00:08:28,760 --> 00:08:29,080 Speaker 4: Crazy. 229 00:08:29,120 --> 00:08:31,160 Speaker 3: We always love, especially when we get the nitty gritty 230 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:33,280 Speaker 3: on this show when you mets hire new guys, going 231 00:08:33,320 --> 00:08:34,080 Speaker 3: straight to LinkedIn. 232 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 4: Yes, it's such a funny. 233 00:08:35,600 --> 00:08:38,240 Speaker 3: Little thing to do, but going to Justin willis LinkedIn. 234 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:41,560 Speaker 3: First of all, he worked again under Jeremy Hefner to 235 00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:44,520 Speaker 3: a degree in Minnesota. Hefner was the assistant pitcher coach 236 00:08:44,559 --> 00:08:46,760 Speaker 3: the twenty nineteen season with the Twins. After he was 237 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:49,120 Speaker 3: I think on field or pitching game coordinator something in 238 00:08:49,160 --> 00:08:51,720 Speaker 3: a lower scale role or a special assistant, special advisor, 239 00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 3: something like that. And then Willard became the team's minor 240 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:57,120 Speaker 3: league pitching coach in twenty eighteen through twenty twenty, so 241 00:08:57,120 --> 00:08:59,240 Speaker 3: that was when they had the overlap with Hefner, and 242 00:08:59,280 --> 00:09:01,920 Speaker 3: then promoted to the pitching coordinated minor league pitching coordinator 243 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:04,120 Speaker 3: for the Twins in twenty twenty one. But then right 244 00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:06,600 Speaker 3: when Craig Breslo got hired to be the top executive 245 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:08,880 Speaker 3: in Boston for Hine Bloom. This was the first guy 246 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:11,280 Speaker 3: he brought in. I didn't know this until doing this research, 247 00:09:11,320 --> 00:09:14,760 Speaker 3: but Breslo was the Cubs director of pitching before getting 248 00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:15,800 Speaker 3: this job at the Red Sox. 249 00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:19,240 Speaker 2: Did not know that either. I just thought he went 250 00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:21,080 Speaker 2: from being a player to executive. 251 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:22,680 Speaker 4: No, it was director of pitching. 252 00:09:22,679 --> 00:09:24,720 Speaker 3: But with being director of pitching, he also worked closely 253 00:09:24,760 --> 00:09:26,360 Speaker 3: with Epstein and was considered. 254 00:09:25,920 --> 00:09:27,600 Speaker 1: I think the special assistant theo Epstein. 255 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:30,240 Speaker 4: Theo Epstein theo Epstein. 256 00:09:31,360 --> 00:09:33,760 Speaker 3: The special assistant to the lead executive too, So he 257 00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 3: kind of bridged those two roles together and that's how 258 00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:38,120 Speaker 3: he got this top executive job in Boston. And then 259 00:09:38,320 --> 00:09:40,719 Speaker 3: Kyle Body, who we always talked about the architect of 260 00:09:40,800 --> 00:09:42,800 Speaker 3: drive Line, he came there the year after as a 261 00:09:43,400 --> 00:09:44,600 Speaker 3: special advisor to the Red Sox. 262 00:09:44,640 --> 00:09:45,400 Speaker 4: He's been there since. 263 00:09:45,559 --> 00:09:47,720 Speaker 3: And we know he's very connected with Eric Jegers because 264 00:09:47,960 --> 00:09:51,160 Speaker 3: those two together both instrumental development of drive Lines six 265 00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:52,720 Speaker 3: or seven years ago when it really got going. So 266 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:55,840 Speaker 3: there's a lot of a lot of things interwoven webs 267 00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:57,120 Speaker 3: in this thing, and I think is really cool for 268 00:09:57,160 --> 00:09:57,680 Speaker 3: the Mets to have. 269 00:09:57,800 --> 00:10:00,840 Speaker 5: Now, Hey, if you want to take care of yourself, 270 00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:05,200 Speaker 5: your body and everything that goes into health, fitness, and nutrition. 271 00:10:05,720 --> 00:10:09,920 Speaker 5: Superpower provides crafts what I would call the pro experience 272 00:10:10,120 --> 00:10:12,760 Speaker 5: for the everyday person, one. 273 00:10:12,760 --> 00:10:15,560 Speaker 6: Hundred percent super easy. 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I'm gonna go ahead 278 00:10:29,600 --> 00:10:32,920 Speaker 6: and look at that in my daily workouts which they 279 00:10:32,960 --> 00:10:36,800 Speaker 6: give so many different ideas of how to make sure 280 00:10:36,840 --> 00:10:39,880 Speaker 6: your deficiencies become some of your superpowers. 281 00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:42,800 Speaker 5: Superpower used to cost four in your ninety nine dollars. 282 00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:45,679 Speaker 5: Head to superpower dot com right now to learn more 283 00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:47,840 Speaker 5: and lock in the special one hundred and ninety nine 284 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:50,240 Speaker 5: dollars price while it lasts. After you sign up, they'll 285 00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:52,040 Speaker 5: ask you how you heard about them, and make sure 286 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:57,200 Speaker 5: you mention ft your biology decoded, your blueprint activated with 287 00:10:57,360 --> 00:10:59,600 Speaker 5: Superpower to. 288 00:10:59,520 --> 00:11:01,840 Speaker 2: Talk about the red sox pitching development too. While he 289 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:04,040 Speaker 2: was there, a lot of guys I don't want to 290 00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:05,800 Speaker 2: say popping up out of nowhere, but the red sox 291 00:11:05,840 --> 00:11:08,080 Speaker 2: pitching development has been a lot better over the last 292 00:11:08,080 --> 00:11:10,800 Speaker 2: few years than it previously was even guys like Connolly 293 00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:13,400 Speaker 2: early getting to the major league level and Peyton Totley 294 00:11:13,440 --> 00:11:14,240 Speaker 2: as quickly as he did. 295 00:11:14,320 --> 00:11:16,600 Speaker 1: I know he was a higher pick, Peyton totally. 296 00:11:16,679 --> 00:11:19,440 Speaker 2: But these guys being able to have the success in 297 00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:21,760 Speaker 2: the miners, seeing the things that we talked about with you, 298 00:11:21,800 --> 00:11:24,720 Speaker 2: Savage and even Tongue and guys that have gone through 299 00:11:24,760 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 2: the miners quickly, you get to these pitch shapes, you 300 00:11:27,080 --> 00:11:29,520 Speaker 2: get to these numbers, these we can see what these 301 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:31,760 Speaker 2: pitches look like. We know they're going to be major 302 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:34,760 Speaker 2: leag capable pitchers, and it seems like Justin Willard has 303 00:11:34,800 --> 00:11:37,120 Speaker 2: the ability to one get those guys to get to 304 00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:39,800 Speaker 2: those kind of I don't again, I hate like making 305 00:11:39,840 --> 00:11:42,320 Speaker 2: it sound like, yeah, these that there's numbers and if 306 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:44,360 Speaker 2: you do this, you're good, because obviously there's. 307 00:11:44,200 --> 00:11:46,400 Speaker 1: More to it but a mental yes and mentals. 308 00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:48,240 Speaker 2: But we know that if pitches can look like this, 309 00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:50,440 Speaker 2: if we can get this guy's fastball to this spot, 310 00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:52,520 Speaker 2: if we can get his sweep or his slider to 311 00:11:52,640 --> 00:11:54,640 Speaker 2: move as much as this, we know that we can 312 00:11:54,640 --> 00:11:56,760 Speaker 2: build major league pitching again seemingly out of nothing. And 313 00:11:56,800 --> 00:11:59,079 Speaker 2: now at the major league level we have all these 314 00:11:59,120 --> 00:12:01,480 Speaker 2: young guys coming in who have been using all this 315 00:12:01,640 --> 00:12:04,079 Speaker 2: data with Eric Gagers and the miners and the guys there, 316 00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:05,920 Speaker 2: it's nice that we're gonna have someone who can help 317 00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:08,520 Speaker 2: translate that even more to them. Not that Hefner couldn't, 318 00:12:08,640 --> 00:12:10,960 Speaker 2: but it seems like Willard is also very good at this. 319 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:13,720 Speaker 3: And there's also the idea and Willard talked about this 320 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:16,360 Speaker 3: a lot again in that same podcast I listened to 321 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:20,360 Speaker 3: with the two Red Sox guys about understanding players archetypes 322 00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:22,680 Speaker 3: and how to build pitches and repertoires that fit best 323 00:12:22,720 --> 00:12:25,160 Speaker 3: for them because not every guy has the Peyton totally 324 00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:28,079 Speaker 3: fastball where he is a massive dude with huge extension 325 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:30,000 Speaker 3: and a lower of the release board. He talked about 326 00:12:30,040 --> 00:12:31,760 Speaker 3: that specifically. He said, we decided to go in on 327 00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:34,680 Speaker 3: Peyton Tolely because we knew with that fastball, the extension, 328 00:12:34,760 --> 00:12:37,520 Speaker 3: the release height, the approach angle, the velocity, it would 329 00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:39,720 Speaker 3: get Hithers out for a long time. He basically said 330 00:12:39,720 --> 00:12:42,080 Speaker 3: that fastball you just know based on that college pitch 331 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:45,040 Speaker 3: data is a foundational piece. They said very differently with 332 00:12:45,080 --> 00:12:47,360 Speaker 3: Connley early and these two guys are going to probably 333 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:49,240 Speaker 3: become the new front. The guys who are going to 334 00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:51,680 Speaker 3: flank Eric Crochet the most in Boston these next few years. 335 00:12:51,800 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 3: For him, it was a lot of the mental thing, 336 00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:54,720 Speaker 3: and it was about the ability to spin things and 337 00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:58,120 Speaker 3: knowing that Connley Early's fastballs would be good but not great. 338 00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:00,439 Speaker 3: It's about developing the other things, because just because fastballs 339 00:13:00,440 --> 00:13:02,120 Speaker 3: is not great doesn't mean you can't use it. But 340 00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:04,079 Speaker 3: then moving the round, figuring other things out. I talked 341 00:13:04,080 --> 00:13:07,720 Speaker 3: a lot about Richard fitz too and Hunter Dobbins. Fish, 342 00:13:07,800 --> 00:13:09,880 Speaker 3: you guys are very different fastballs than they talked about. 343 00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:12,439 Speaker 3: Is it David Sandler, Nick Sandler, the one they traded 344 00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:13,079 Speaker 3: with the Royals. 345 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:14,000 Speaker 1: It's a really good question. 346 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:15,920 Speaker 4: It's one of them, one of those two Sandals. 347 00:13:15,920 --> 00:13:17,240 Speaker 3: We just talked about it again, how all of these 348 00:13:17,240 --> 00:13:20,200 Speaker 3: guys are very different than what they have. And he 349 00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:22,079 Speaker 3: also talked about the fact that why he left the 350 00:13:22,120 --> 00:13:24,520 Speaker 3: Twins joined the Red Sox as a director of pitching. 351 00:13:24,559 --> 00:13:26,600 Speaker 3: He said one of the biggest things was that he 352 00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:29,240 Speaker 3: wanted to work more closely with the major league staff, 353 00:13:29,559 --> 00:13:30,520 Speaker 3: but with the Twins it. 354 00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:32,600 Speaker 4: Was development role, and the Twins was actually not time. 355 00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:33,440 Speaker 4: We're developing tons of. 356 00:13:33,440 --> 00:13:35,400 Speaker 1: Great pictures, so many good pictures. 357 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:37,599 Speaker 4: Like pictures that we are even still putting around to 358 00:13:37,640 --> 00:13:37,880 Speaker 4: this day. 359 00:13:37,920 --> 00:13:39,480 Speaker 3: The Twins kind of got brain drained though, so it 360 00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:41,000 Speaker 3: doesn't seem like they want to pay their top talent 361 00:13:41,040 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 3: top talent money. But he said he came to Boston 362 00:13:43,920 --> 00:13:46,160 Speaker 3: from Minnesota because he wanted to impact all levels and 363 00:13:46,160 --> 00:13:47,840 Speaker 3: he spent a lot of time working with Andrew Bailey, 364 00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:49,760 Speaker 3: who's law there's one of the better picture coaches in 365 00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:52,080 Speaker 3: the league with the Red Sox, and said together they 366 00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:55,440 Speaker 3: would break down video data, biomechanical pitch movement to boost 367 00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:56,200 Speaker 3: pitchers results. 368 00:13:56,240 --> 00:13:58,559 Speaker 4: And it just seems like this is a maniac on 369 00:13:58,720 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 4: to god. 370 00:13:59,280 --> 00:14:01,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean baseball rats, right. 371 00:14:01,160 --> 00:14:03,560 Speaker 2: We talked about how we want baseball rats all the 372 00:14:03,600 --> 00:14:06,760 Speaker 2: time being around these guys helping out. We had Jeremy Hefner, 373 00:14:06,760 --> 00:14:08,080 Speaker 2: wh we thought was a little bit of a rat 374 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:11,000 Speaker 2: guy who was just a pitcher that stuck around forever, 375 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:11,720 Speaker 2: loves pitching. 376 00:14:11,880 --> 00:14:13,640 Speaker 1: Even Antoine and Richards didn't think about it. 377 00:14:13,720 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 2: He was a rat in terms of like the first 378 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:18,160 Speaker 2: base coach, just good rat, good rat. 379 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:20,840 Speaker 1: He was a baseball rat where loves baseball around it. 380 00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:22,400 Speaker 2: And that seems like the guys that they're trying to 381 00:14:22,400 --> 00:14:25,280 Speaker 2: get around Mendoza on this major league staff is not 382 00:14:25,840 --> 00:14:28,680 Speaker 2: these flashy guys who had major league careers and maybe 383 00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:31,360 Speaker 2: were great third basemen and didn't make All Star teams 384 00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:34,080 Speaker 2: but had great seasons out in Oakland. They want guys 385 00:14:34,120 --> 00:14:38,560 Speaker 2: who were more grinding, working hard, obsessed with baseball. They 386 00:14:38,560 --> 00:14:41,040 Speaker 2: maybe didn't have the ability, but they have the coach ability, 387 00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:43,320 Speaker 2: They have the understanding to make everybody else around them 388 00:14:43,320 --> 00:14:44,120 Speaker 2: better totally. 389 00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:46,200 Speaker 3: I think Willard kind of goes into that lot because 390 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:49,040 Speaker 3: he was a pitcher at Concord University, and then right 391 00:14:49,120 --> 00:14:50,880 Speaker 3: after that, I think he knew the playing career was over. 392 00:14:50,960 --> 00:14:52,960 Speaker 4: He went to Radford to get his NBA. 393 00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:55,640 Speaker 1: Well whoa Radford? What the hell? Why do we talk 394 00:14:55,640 --> 00:14:56,880 Speaker 1: about Radford so much? 395 00:14:56,960 --> 00:14:58,840 Speaker 3: And right when he went there to do it, he 396 00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:00,840 Speaker 3: was a graduate baseball coach. First the one year at 397 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:02,840 Speaker 3: concor and then bang he went right in their assistant 398 00:15:02,880 --> 00:15:06,200 Speaker 3: baseball coach recruiting coordinators. So he was in there right 399 00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:08,720 Speaker 3: the second the baseball playing stopped, It went right into coaching. 400 00:15:08,800 --> 00:15:10,600 Speaker 3: I think there also is something so I want to 401 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:12,120 Speaker 3: talk a little bit more about Willard and also go 402 00:15:12,120 --> 00:15:13,640 Speaker 3: through some of the Red Sox guys last year just 403 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:15,800 Speaker 3: to give a sense of what I think he is. 404 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:18,960 Speaker 3: But it seems like we are seeking this kind of 405 00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:21,680 Speaker 3: installation from a lot of the coaches that we're hiring 406 00:15:21,720 --> 00:15:25,400 Speaker 3: on this staff, possibly from we don't know, Carslson. Doze 407 00:15:25,440 --> 00:15:27,240 Speaker 3: is going to be a manager in two years. You 408 00:15:27,320 --> 00:15:30,280 Speaker 3: saw that Mets how Troy Snicker really close ties to 409 00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:33,680 Speaker 3: Jeff Albert. Now the Mets are hiring Justin Willard. Seems 410 00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:36,480 Speaker 3: like there are at least close circumstantial ties to Eric Jaegers. 411 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:39,160 Speaker 3: It seems like we're trying to build these player development 412 00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:45,160 Speaker 3: organizational infrastructures that are a bit not disconnected, but maybe 413 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:48,400 Speaker 3: independent a bit of what's going to be happening day 414 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:50,400 Speaker 3: by day with Mendoza in the Major League. 415 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:55,680 Speaker 2: Dugout Now, technically, or I shouldn't say technically, philosophically speaking, 416 00:15:55,920 --> 00:15:59,360 Speaker 2: I think that makes sense, because definitely does the manager 417 00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:03,440 Speaker 2: should re just be managing, and everything else around him 418 00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:06,520 Speaker 2: should be able to exist with or without him. Obviously, 419 00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 2: you hope that their synergy and that the manager fits 420 00:16:08,520 --> 00:16:11,280 Speaker 2: in and takes in all of this that's going around him. 421 00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:14,480 Speaker 2: But as weird as it sounds, you should be building 422 00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:17,640 Speaker 2: an organization where the manager can be swapped in and 423 00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:19,800 Speaker 2: out if he's not a good fit, and I. 424 00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:22,040 Speaker 3: Think that is what the Mets are trying to build 425 00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:24,200 Speaker 3: because there's so much more that happens in this organization. 426 00:16:24,240 --> 00:16:25,560 Speaker 3: And we talked about this a lot this year and 427 00:16:25,560 --> 00:16:28,280 Speaker 3: what was a disgustingly miserable year for the Mets major 428 00:16:28,320 --> 00:16:30,720 Speaker 3: league team, it was one of the best minor league 429 00:16:30,760 --> 00:16:33,240 Speaker 3: seasons the Mets organization has literally ever had. So it's 430 00:16:33,280 --> 00:16:35,320 Speaker 3: about finding success there and if you do want to 431 00:16:35,360 --> 00:16:38,880 Speaker 3: build a true sustainable winner that can win repeatedly, over 432 00:16:38,920 --> 00:16:42,560 Speaker 3: and over again, it does start with the organizational practices. 433 00:16:42,560 --> 00:16:44,960 Speaker 3: And I do think now with these two hires together, 434 00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:48,800 Speaker 3: Willard and Snicker working again seemingly under guys that we 435 00:16:48,880 --> 00:16:50,640 Speaker 3: like a lot, even though Eric Jegers it's like four 436 00:16:50,680 --> 00:16:52,840 Speaker 3: or five years younger than Justin Willard, which is crazy. 437 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:53,400 Speaker 4: It's crazy. 438 00:16:53,440 --> 00:16:55,040 Speaker 3: He's like our age and we're doing this podcast and 439 00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:57,000 Speaker 3: he's been running Mets pitching development for a few years now. 440 00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:57,600 Speaker 4: It's just crazy. 441 00:16:57,640 --> 00:17:01,240 Speaker 3: But there's a lot of there's a lot interconnectivity between 442 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:03,760 Speaker 3: these guys who are going to seemingly take this entire 443 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:07,960 Speaker 3: organization forward, whether or not it is including Carlos Mendoza. 444 00:17:08,600 --> 00:17:11,080 Speaker 2: Tell me some things that he made changes with with 445 00:17:11,119 --> 00:17:13,360 Speaker 2: the Red Sox, because that's probably what the people really 446 00:17:13,359 --> 00:17:14,840 Speaker 2: want to hear the most. Right now, we got all 447 00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:17,959 Speaker 2: the background, what are some of the actual fundamental changes 448 00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:18,960 Speaker 2: we saw with the Red Sox. 449 00:17:19,320 --> 00:17:21,960 Speaker 3: I think the big one would be Garrett Crochet. I 450 00:17:21,960 --> 00:17:24,800 Speaker 3: think Gary Crochet kind of because he was so good 451 00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:26,719 Speaker 3: last year and so good this year. I guess everyone's 452 00:17:26,720 --> 00:17:30,000 Speaker 3: like Garat Crochet, finished product, finished product. Nothing really happened there, right, 453 00:17:30,040 --> 00:17:32,520 Speaker 3: But he made major changes to who he was as 454 00:17:32,520 --> 00:17:34,280 Speaker 3: a pitcher this season, and I think you should if 455 00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:36,520 Speaker 3: you're a guy the Crochet because one and this is 456 00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:39,480 Speaker 3: ana challenge. I couldn't really tell going through this Willard stuff, 457 00:17:39,480 --> 00:17:41,520 Speaker 3: the Red Sox stuff, if they're playing a lot for 458 00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:43,360 Speaker 3: their ballpark or if they're just playing for strengths in general, 459 00:17:43,400 --> 00:17:45,160 Speaker 3: because one of the most difficult plays to pitch in baseball. 460 00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:46,800 Speaker 4: We talked about that a lot, which city fields not. 461 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:49,000 Speaker 4: But Crochet was the White Sox. He did not have 462 00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:50,600 Speaker 4: a singer. It was the fastball in the color, and 463 00:17:50,640 --> 00:17:51,000 Speaker 4: he kind. 464 00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:53,640 Speaker 3: Of just got by by being a moose, overpowering guys 465 00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:55,960 Speaker 3: with those two pitches, getting in kitchens, never really being 466 00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:58,439 Speaker 3: afraid to challenge So with that, and again this is 467 00:17:58,440 --> 00:18:01,119 Speaker 3: part of Willer's ethos challenge of guys nasty stuff in 468 00:18:01,160 --> 00:18:03,800 Speaker 3: the strike zone, he developed the sinker. This year, the 469 00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:06,840 Speaker 3: sinker became his most Crochet's most thrown pitch against left 470 00:18:06,840 --> 00:18:09,520 Speaker 3: handed batters, and it had his highest run value overall, 471 00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:11,480 Speaker 3: and it had one of his highest in zone rates. 472 00:18:11,480 --> 00:18:13,960 Speaker 3: And Garrett Crochet this year all of the fastballs that 473 00:18:14,000 --> 00:18:15,880 Speaker 3: he threw had a higher zone rate than the major 474 00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:17,639 Speaker 3: of the gaverage. And really the only pitch who was 475 00:18:17,640 --> 00:18:19,840 Speaker 3: consistently not throwing in the zone but still in line with. 476 00:18:19,800 --> 00:18:22,280 Speaker 4: His pitches average was the sweeper, the swing and miss pitch. 477 00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:24,520 Speaker 3: So I do think that giving guy the Crochet, who 478 00:18:24,520 --> 00:18:27,119 Speaker 3: seems like he has everything, a new thing that became 479 00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:29,960 Speaker 3: his most useful weapon, especially inside the strike zone. 480 00:18:30,359 --> 00:18:32,440 Speaker 4: I liked seeing that from a player development standpoint. 481 00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:35,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean taking taking anybody and making them better. 482 00:18:35,440 --> 00:18:37,359 Speaker 2: Like you said, people thought Crochet was kind of a 483 00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:39,679 Speaker 2: finished product, you know what he is. Being able to 484 00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:42,960 Speaker 2: boost his game even more is huge because while the 485 00:18:42,960 --> 00:18:46,760 Speaker 2: Mets have some good pitchers, Noel McLain love him, need 486 00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:48,359 Speaker 2: to get better, still want to get better. 487 00:18:48,359 --> 00:18:49,520 Speaker 1: Want all these guys get better. 488 00:18:49,520 --> 00:18:51,639 Speaker 2: Then we even saw it with mclan It's not like 489 00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:53,840 Speaker 2: he's a cy Young Award winner ed. There can still 490 00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:55,800 Speaker 2: be improvements from everybody on this staff. 491 00:18:56,200 --> 00:18:58,200 Speaker 3: Willard also mentioned the fact that he doesn't like pitchers 492 00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:00,560 Speaker 3: to ever fully shut down from throwing the off season. 493 00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:03,520 Speaker 4: You scale back, but you never stopped throwing once, he said. 494 00:19:03,680 --> 00:19:05,560 Speaker 3: And that was also something we saw with Crochet the 495 00:19:05,640 --> 00:19:07,439 Speaker 3: year before with the White Sox, which was cool and 496 00:19:07,480 --> 00:19:09,760 Speaker 3: Crochet this year he took a little bit off himself 497 00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:11,879 Speaker 3: velocity wise, took down his arm angle a little bit, 498 00:19:11,920 --> 00:19:14,040 Speaker 3: seemingly just takes pressure off that bar of his body, 499 00:19:14,280 --> 00:19:16,920 Speaker 3: but then also was able to steamroll to a career 500 00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:19,160 Speaker 3: high innings and seemingly do it in a very very 501 00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:22,480 Speaker 3: sustainable right this year. Yeah, and then his last start 502 00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:24,240 Speaker 3: of the year against the Yankees, he was the best 503 00:19:24,240 --> 00:19:26,480 Speaker 3: he'd been all season, throwing the hardest he'd thrown all seasons. 504 00:19:26,520 --> 00:19:30,600 Speaker 3: So there's definitely this added importance on your own What's 505 00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:32,560 Speaker 3: where we're looking for you is your own physical fitness, 506 00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:33,280 Speaker 3: your own endurance. 507 00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:35,320 Speaker 4: But the endurance isn't exactly start to start thing. It's 508 00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:37,480 Speaker 4: like a twelve month thing, which I think is very cool. 509 00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:40,280 Speaker 1: Brian Beao also took big steps forward this year. 510 00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:42,480 Speaker 2: He went from being a pitcher that was like frustrating 511 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:45,119 Speaker 2: to watch, where you're like, this stuff feels good, it 512 00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:47,119 Speaker 2: seems like you should be better than you are, but 513 00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:49,240 Speaker 2: you can't ever get through the fourth inning. And then 514 00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:51,280 Speaker 2: this year, while he was still I don't think he's 515 00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:53,520 Speaker 2: reached his potential, he was a hell of a lot 516 00:19:53,520 --> 00:19:54,960 Speaker 2: better than we thought he was gonna. 517 00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:55,680 Speaker 4: Be quite good. 518 00:19:55,720 --> 00:19:57,760 Speaker 3: I think this was another thing where again you can 519 00:19:57,880 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 3: feel this coming through be nasty in the zone. 520 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:01,679 Speaker 4: Beyo kind of struggled in the zone a little bit. 521 00:20:02,160 --> 00:20:04,680 Speaker 1: He was a nibbler and that was a thing. 522 00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:07,000 Speaker 3: So this year mid season was about June, all of 523 00:20:07,040 --> 00:20:08,879 Speaker 3: a sudden, Brian BeO had a color going on, and 524 00:20:08,880 --> 00:20:11,840 Speaker 3: then August September that was his most consistent pitch in 525 00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:13,920 Speaker 3: the strike zone. So I think seeing that happen again 526 00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:15,840 Speaker 3: in seasons cool too. And also we've talked a lot 527 00:20:15,840 --> 00:20:18,400 Speaker 3: about the Mets pitchings development the last few years, focusing 528 00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:21,359 Speaker 3: on this fastball triangle, having a four two seamer sinker 529 00:20:21,400 --> 00:20:24,720 Speaker 3: and a color that was crochet, completing the fastball triangle. 530 00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:27,399 Speaker 3: Getting that sinker, this was BeO completing the fastball triangle 531 00:20:27,480 --> 00:20:29,400 Speaker 3: getting that color and then also a guy like Bayo. 532 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:31,919 Speaker 4: Again, you kind of want to make sure you're pitching 533 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:34,320 Speaker 4: to your own platoon strengths. Beo's best pitch was a 534 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:34,719 Speaker 4: change up. 535 00:20:34,720 --> 00:20:36,639 Speaker 3: He tried to throw the change up against righty's, but 536 00:20:36,760 --> 00:20:39,040 Speaker 3: change up righty, righty. Change ups aren't exactly the best 537 00:20:39,040 --> 00:20:41,359 Speaker 3: thing in the world. When this col came in, he 538 00:20:41,600 --> 00:20:43,960 Speaker 3: quit throwing that change up's righties, and he especially kept 539 00:20:43,960 --> 00:20:46,160 Speaker 3: throwing that change up in the zone. So change up 540 00:20:46,200 --> 00:20:48,920 Speaker 3: is not an in zone pitch. No, off speed pitches 541 00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:50,320 Speaker 3: are really in zone pitches, Which are going to be 542 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:52,040 Speaker 3: funny to see how this fit works with someone like 543 00:20:52,320 --> 00:20:54,679 Speaker 3: Code that saying. But this year the Red Sox, you 544 00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:57,520 Speaker 3: take all three fastballs together, four seamers, sinkers, and colors, 545 00:20:57,840 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 3: they had the second highest rate of the combination of 546 00:21:00,119 --> 00:21:02,800 Speaker 3: those three pitches in all of baseball. But that was 547 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:07,200 Speaker 3: specifically second highest for color, tenth fewest for four seam fastball. 548 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:10,600 Speaker 2: Okay, all right, I mean, yeah, you mentioned you mentioned 549 00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:12,080 Speaker 2: Code I there, and he's the one that I think 550 00:21:12,119 --> 00:21:14,439 Speaker 2: about all the time because he again, he could be 551 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:16,040 Speaker 2: a make or break guy for this team, kind of 552 00:21:16,040 --> 00:21:18,320 Speaker 2: like he was in twenty twenty five, where if we 553 00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:20,000 Speaker 2: get a good version of Code I Sangle, all of 554 00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:21,919 Speaker 2: a sudden, this pitching staff looks a hell of a 555 00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:24,520 Speaker 2: lot better. We get the twenty twenty five second half 556 00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:26,480 Speaker 2: version of Code I Sanger, you're like, oh, yeah, we 557 00:21:26,560 --> 00:21:28,680 Speaker 2: have one major league pitcher on this roster right now. 558 00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:31,000 Speaker 3: And the key for code that, like we've said a lot, 559 00:21:31,119 --> 00:21:33,520 Speaker 3: is finding something else that can beat hitters in the zone. 560 00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:36,119 Speaker 3: Because as as the ghost fork is, it's just not 561 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:36,800 Speaker 3: his own pitch. 562 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:37,160 Speaker 4: It isn't. 563 00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:39,520 Speaker 3: I think Coda even got into more trouble this season. 564 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:42,040 Speaker 3: We tried to start making that in zone pitch because 565 00:21:42,040 --> 00:21:43,639 Speaker 3: he had nothing else to put in the zone, and 566 00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:44,960 Speaker 3: all of a sudden he had nothing left. 567 00:21:44,960 --> 00:21:46,360 Speaker 2: And then I mean it's also kind of the Reid 568 00:21:46,400 --> 00:21:49,879 Speaker 2: Garrett thing too, where it's like the splitter. It's splitter 569 00:21:49,920 --> 00:21:51,440 Speaker 2: is not a strike pitch either, that's a pitch that 570 00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:53,840 Speaker 2: you got guys to chase. Reid Garrett started throwing that 571 00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:55,960 Speaker 2: splitter in the zone, need to fill up the zone, 572 00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:58,360 Speaker 2: and then started getting absolutely smacked. 573 00:21:58,320 --> 00:22:00,359 Speaker 3: Especially when teams are kind of a bit more aware 574 00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:01,400 Speaker 3: of what you're trying to do them. 575 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:02,720 Speaker 4: And in this offseason, I think this. 576 00:22:02,680 --> 00:22:06,199 Speaker 3: Specifically this World Series, the splither has become like a 577 00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:08,120 Speaker 3: bit of a like a general like people talking about 578 00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:10,560 Speaker 3: the splither right now, like it's going to revolutionize baseball. 579 00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:13,360 Speaker 3: But this Red Sox team, and again, splitters are very 580 00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:15,879 Speaker 3: player driven pitch. Not everyone can throw. 581 00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:17,359 Speaker 1: A split Yeah, only certain guys can. 582 00:22:17,840 --> 00:22:19,440 Speaker 3: And it's the thing that a lot of guys even 583 00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:21,040 Speaker 3: want to throw because it is the end at the 584 00:22:21,119 --> 00:22:22,879 Speaker 3: end of the day, one of the most difficult pitches 585 00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:26,080 Speaker 3: to control consistently. And even if you group the splither 586 00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:29,200 Speaker 3: with fourk balls, with screwballs, with changeups, the Red Sox 587 00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:31,680 Speaker 3: had the third few lowest rate of any off speed 588 00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:34,040 Speaker 3: pitch this year of any team, So it does seem 589 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:36,920 Speaker 3: like this is going to be a more fastball heavy team. 590 00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:38,280 Speaker 3: And also the Red Socks are middle in the road 591 00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:40,199 Speaker 3: with breaking balls. I remember last year, the whole thing 592 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:41,520 Speaker 3: was like the Red Sox is going to breaking ball 593 00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:42,840 Speaker 3: their way all the way to the top, and then 594 00:22:43,080 --> 00:22:45,120 Speaker 3: that stopped working. Then they brought the fast balls back. 595 00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:48,160 Speaker 3: But offspeed pitchers are not known for being zone pitches. 596 00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:50,080 Speaker 3: Fast balls are known for being zone pitches. I think 597 00:22:50,080 --> 00:22:51,720 Speaker 3: that there's going to be a huge move by the 598 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:53,399 Speaker 3: Mets this year to throw more. 599 00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:55,040 Speaker 4: Pitches in the strike zone. I'm sure you guys are 600 00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:55,480 Speaker 4: thrilled about. 601 00:22:55,560 --> 00:22:56,399 Speaker 1: Gotta be pumped about it. 602 00:22:56,400 --> 00:22:58,440 Speaker 2: You've listened to twenty minutes about the pitching coach there 603 00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:01,359 Speaker 2: it is more fast falls in the zone seems to 604 00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:02,920 Speaker 2: be the plan for the Mets this year, which would 605 00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:04,360 Speaker 2: be should be really nice. 606 00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:05,479 Speaker 1: I'm tired of seeing walks. 607 00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:06,680 Speaker 4: It's very tired. 608 00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:08,399 Speaker 3: And then just to give one Red Sox story that 609 00:23:08,440 --> 00:23:10,840 Speaker 3: maybe wasn't much of a success. Tanner Hawk, why I've 610 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:12,440 Speaker 3: told you, was one of my least favorite pitchers in 611 00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:12,959 Speaker 3: all baseball. 612 00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:13,199 Speaker 4: Guy. 613 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:15,679 Speaker 3: I think this guy could ever succeed, but first round pick, 614 00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:18,159 Speaker 3: not that long ago and right before the regimes changed. 615 00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:21,120 Speaker 3: But he has a more similar coe that I approach, 616 00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:23,600 Speaker 3: where there's not a lot of me as a wider arsenal, 617 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:25,320 Speaker 3: but there's not a lot of pitches. It's just sweeper, 618 00:23:25,400 --> 00:23:28,280 Speaker 3: sink or splither and hard to throw two of those 619 00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:29,919 Speaker 3: in the strike zone. So then a guy like Tanner 620 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:32,800 Speaker 3: Hawk really got into trouble because especially as a righty 621 00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:35,080 Speaker 3: face sing lefties like you're just here, here's a here's 622 00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:36,879 Speaker 3: a sinker middle middle for you guys, and if the 623 00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:37,920 Speaker 3: splither can't land. 624 00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:39,080 Speaker 4: You're kind of dead. 625 00:23:39,119 --> 00:23:41,639 Speaker 3: So again talk about some guys who found success and 626 00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:42,440 Speaker 3: one guy who did not. 627 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:44,440 Speaker 1: I think that's pretty good. 628 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:47,040 Speaker 2: I think that's twenty dents minutes on what could be 629 00:23:47,080 --> 00:23:48,960 Speaker 2: the new Mets pitching coach, Justin Willard. You're gonna be 630 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:50,400 Speaker 2: really fucked if they don't hire him. 631 00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:52,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just wasted episode. But a couple other funny 632 00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:55,040 Speaker 3: things about Willard. Just did this scroll in this tweather. 633 00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:57,919 Speaker 3: He already followed me, which I thought I followed him. 634 00:23:57,960 --> 00:24:01,000 Speaker 3: I followed the Mets potential pitching coach back, which hilarious 635 00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:03,159 Speaker 3: and I love. I love when like coaches like this. 636 00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:04,639 Speaker 3: Just tweet the cornya shit in the world. 637 00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:05,560 Speaker 1: Ah. 638 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:08,520 Speaker 3: He posted an image from October twenty second of last year, 639 00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:10,320 Speaker 3: the secret And this is an image. This is something 640 00:24:10,359 --> 00:24:12,520 Speaker 3: he typed, like, let me see it's a Google image. 641 00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:14,360 Speaker 3: I got the link for you here. But the secret 642 00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:18,120 Speaker 3: is there is no secret. Consistency over intensity, progress over perfection, 643 00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:21,119 Speaker 3: fundamentals over fads, over and over again. And on his 644 00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:24,879 Speaker 3: Twitter and his Instagram, his bio is seek progress, not perfection. 645 00:24:25,440 --> 00:24:28,040 Speaker 2: Hey, if it works, it works. If it works, it works, 646 00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:30,480 Speaker 2: that's all I care about. I it's not my vibe, 647 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:31,840 Speaker 2: but hey, be a good pitching coach. 648 00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:32,399 Speaker 1: I'm happy. 649 00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:34,119 Speaker 4: Yeah, that's just funny, but I do hope he is 650 00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:34,680 Speaker 4: the pitching coach. 651 00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:36,200 Speaker 3: We've heard a lot of things from people around the 652 00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:38,560 Speaker 3: game that this guy's great. I know the Red Sox 653 00:24:39,080 --> 00:24:41,080 Speaker 3: really want to keep a guy like this in the building. 654 00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:42,879 Speaker 3: I'm sure that they do, especially I don't know if 655 00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:45,119 Speaker 3: Kyle Body wants up taking this job back, but it's 656 00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:48,160 Speaker 3: it's nice to hearing him talk a lot and old 657 00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:50,920 Speaker 3: stuff we found about him. I'm over the moon, excited 658 00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:52,920 Speaker 3: and confident what he can be as a pitching coach. 659 00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:53,919 Speaker 1: So that's of difference. 660 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,480 Speaker 2: Twenty five minutes on a possible pitching coach higher for 661 00:24:56,480 --> 00:24:59,040 Speaker 2: the New York Mets. Guys, thank you so much for listening. 662 00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:01,160 Speaker 1: For watching. Make sure you're subscribe to Mets up over 663 00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:01,720 Speaker 1: on YouTube. 664 00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:04,120 Speaker 2: If you're listening to US Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Drops 665 00:25:04,119 --> 00:25:06,240 Speaker 2: the Rting drops the review, download and subscribe. 666 00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:08,040 Speaker 1: You can follow James on social media. 667 00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:11,400 Speaker 2: At James Hiano just like Justin Willer and I'm Draftnick 668 00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:12,080 Speaker 2: Mark with a C. 669 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,080 Speaker 1: Thank you guys for listening, Thanks for watching. We'll catch 670 00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:16,360 Speaker 1: you on the next one. Peace out, peace out guys, 671 00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:16,920 Speaker 1: go Mets.