WEBVTT - Cavs Pacers Preview with Tony East 0:00:00.320 --> 0:00:03.200 This crowd rises to speaking. 0:00:02.920 --> 0:00:06.800 What Carl slammed it out? Carlo left wing reball. 0:00:06.640 --> 0:00:07.440 Perfect dar. 0:00:09.080 --> 0:00:11.799 Pop, then he left block the shot at the rim 0:00:12.080 --> 0:00:15.960 pow with the left hand head of fowl. Welcome to 0:00:15.960 --> 0:00:18.000 the Chase Down Podcast, part of the Caves media family. 0:00:18.000 --> 0:00:20.280 I'm your host, Justin Rowan. The Chase Doown is presented 0:00:20.320 --> 0:00:23.000 by Fubo, the official streaming partner of the Calves. Watch 0:00:23.040 --> 0:00:25.639 over three hundred and fifty channels of live sports and TV, 0:00:25.720 --> 0:00:28.800 including fan Duel Sports Network without cable. There's no cost 0:00:28.880 --> 0:00:31.680 and no commitment. Try for free at FuboTV dot com 0:00:31.720 --> 0:00:34.640 Slash Calves. We thought we might have to wait a 0:00:34.640 --> 0:00:37.080 little bit longer to find out who was going to 0:00:37.120 --> 0:00:40.400 be the Calves opponent in the next round. Unfortunately, or 0:00:40.440 --> 0:00:42.960 fortunately depending on how you look at things. Uh, the 0:00:43.120 --> 0:00:46.839 Milwaukee Bucks blew quite the lead in the final seconds 0:00:46.840 --> 0:00:48.919 of the game, and we know that the Caves are 0:00:48.920 --> 0:00:51.880 going to be playing the Indiana Pacers on Sunday. Joining 0:00:51.880 --> 0:00:54.320 me today as always is my co host, Carl Rodriguez. 0:00:54.360 --> 0:00:57.880 Carter, how you doing, buddy, I'm doing well. Uh, really 0:00:57.920 --> 0:01:00.400 really excited for this series. I think it's the best 0:01:00.440 --> 0:01:04.240 basketball series, you know, that they could have had in 0:01:04.280 --> 0:01:08.640 the second round, you know, of anyone in the three 0:01:08.680 --> 0:01:11.920 to you know, the three to six range. I thought 0:01:11.959 --> 0:01:15.800 Andy was the toughest test in that group, and they're 0:01:15.840 --> 0:01:20.559 gonna get to go prove themselves against much stiffer competition 0:01:20.920 --> 0:01:24.119 than they had in the form of the Miami Heat. 0:01:24.440 --> 0:01:25.640 Totally agree, Totally agree. 0:01:25.640 --> 0:01:27.959 In my eyes, Indiana is the third best team in 0:01:27.959 --> 0:01:30.640 the Eastern Conference and joining us today to help break 0:01:30.640 --> 0:01:33.679 it down. Tony East from Locked On Pacers. Tony, how 0:01:33.760 --> 0:01:34.640 you doing, buddy. 0:01:34.840 --> 0:01:37.200 I'm great. I'm really happy to be here, and I'm 0:01:37.280 --> 0:01:40.360 really looking forward to the series, which is perhaps the 0:01:40.480 --> 0:01:44.160 least informative regular season matchups ever for a series that 0:01:44.200 --> 0:01:46.200 I've ever had in my life for a playoffs. 0:01:46.880 --> 0:01:48.880 It's not the first time because when we did the 0:01:49.000 --> 0:01:51.480 next series a couple of years ago, we're like, you know, 0:01:51.560 --> 0:01:53.880 every single one of these games, the Cats were missing 0:01:53.920 --> 0:01:56.360 Jared Allen for almost all of them, Darius was missing, 0:01:56.680 --> 0:02:00.440 like it seemed like there was never a regular matchup. 0:02:00.480 --> 0:02:03.560 But you're right, I think, you know, you could probably 0:02:03.600 --> 0:02:06.800 say one in one, but even there, Tyres Haliburn played 0:02:06.880 --> 0:02:10.760 like a half of you know, the Pacers win in 0:02:10.800 --> 0:02:14.880 that game. From a calf standpoint, that those two games 0:02:14.919 --> 0:02:18.520 happened in January, Max Struz was getting integrated into the lineup. 0:02:18.520 --> 0:02:20.359 He was coming off the bench in favor of Dean 0:02:20.400 --> 0:02:20.920 Waite at the. 0:02:20.919 --> 0:02:24.520 Time, and then we saw those two late season games 0:02:24.600 --> 0:02:28.040 were about as uninformative as possible when it comes to 0:02:28.120 --> 0:02:29.440 what the playoffs are going to look like. 0:02:29.840 --> 0:02:32.600 You aren't expecting the Pacers to illegally play three two 0:02:32.680 --> 0:02:35.560 way players plus two of their and the bench guys. Yeah, 0:02:35.600 --> 0:02:38.520 those games are rather uninformative for this. And yeah, Alburn 0:02:38.560 --> 0:02:40.799 missed half of one game and the entire other one 0:02:40.880 --> 0:02:43.440 right like that, Even if that alone makes it very 0:02:43.520 --> 0:02:46.280 challenging and makes this all the more fun because we 0:02:46.360 --> 0:02:48.320 have no idea what the chess match or battles are 0:02:48.320 --> 0:02:50.000 really going to look like. From two coaches who have 0:02:50.040 --> 0:02:53.239 had great seasons being tactical. 0:02:53.560 --> 0:02:56.799 Yeah, it's a pretty dope matchup, to be honest, And 0:02:56.880 --> 0:02:58.880 like I've said a few times that I do think 0:02:58.919 --> 0:03:01.120 both teams are going to have like, oh wait, we're 0:03:01.120 --> 0:03:04.560 playing someone pretty competent all of a sudden kind of 0:03:04.639 --> 0:03:07.880 shelf shock after like Indy just had had their way 0:03:08.120 --> 0:03:13.280 offensively with Milwaukee pretty much the entire series. Through four games, 0:03:13.320 --> 0:03:16.079 I think they'd assisted on seventy six percent of their 0:03:16.120 --> 0:03:19.600 field goals, which is like a banana's number. I mean, 0:03:19.639 --> 0:03:22.239 they're a high assist team, but not normally like twelve 0:03:22.480 --> 0:03:25.720 fourteen percent higher than second best Tony. What did you 0:03:25.760 --> 0:03:29.000 see from them in that Bucks series? Did anything surprise you? 0:03:29.160 --> 0:03:32.040 Or was it a spot where it's a little hard 0:03:32.040 --> 0:03:35.320 to evaluate because that Bucks team was not in their 0:03:35.360 --> 0:03:36.119 best shape. 0:03:36.720 --> 0:03:39.960 Yeah, it was really interesting because, like I picked the 0:03:39.960 --> 0:03:42.480 Pacers to win in seven games, I thought they'd be better, 0:03:42.600 --> 0:03:45.160 but they were even better than I thought they would be. 0:03:45.320 --> 0:03:47.720 And my big takeaway for why I was a little 0:03:47.760 --> 0:03:49.600 wrong about that is and something that I think they'll 0:03:49.640 --> 0:03:51.880 be hopeful to do again for every series they played 0:03:51.840 --> 0:03:54.160 for the rest of their lives. They generated a good shot, 0:03:54.200 --> 0:03:56.760 like whenever they wanted right, they'd come down the floor. 0:03:56.920 --> 0:03:58.800 Outside of the second half of Game three, which was 0:03:58.840 --> 0:04:01.680 the Bucks only win, they'd get across the timeline. They 0:04:01.680 --> 0:04:04.320 would get into their what they call random offense. One 0:04:04.360 --> 0:04:06.880 action here, one action there. The Bucks are rotating. All 0:04:06.920 --> 0:04:08.920 of a sudden, someone's out of position, or someone's not 0:04:08.960 --> 0:04:11.000 ready for what's coming next, or it's not a good 0:04:11.040 --> 0:04:13.280 chance for the Bucks to switch what they did quite 0:04:13.320 --> 0:04:16.080 a bit, and the Pacers would have a Pascal Siaka 0:04:16.160 --> 0:04:18.320 being defended by a small guy or Tyre Salburn with 0:04:18.360 --> 0:04:20.640 somebody he could get into the pain against, whether that 0:04:20.680 --> 0:04:23.240 was for a passover his own shot or a favorable 0:04:23.240 --> 0:04:25.440 matchup with some other other players who have improved as 0:04:25.760 --> 0:04:28.800 rim attackers, either this season or throughout their careers, and 0:04:28.839 --> 0:04:31.559 they took advantage of that, like it was extremely easy 0:04:31.600 --> 0:04:33.680 for them to score. It's funny because every time I 0:04:33.760 --> 0:04:35.480 go to check, I'm like, Okay, the Pacers surely are 0:04:35.520 --> 0:04:37.680 leading the playoffs on offensive rating. Oh, they're second behind 0:04:37.720 --> 0:04:40.920 the Caves by like twenty points. But they still scored 0:04:41.080 --> 0:04:43.640 very easily in the first round. And not that the 0:04:43.680 --> 0:04:45.920 Bucks were like an awesome defense, but they were top twelve, 0:04:45.920 --> 0:04:47.719 and during the regular season I thought there would be 0:04:48.200 --> 0:04:50.920 some more resistance. They do have size, they do have gianness, 0:04:51.240 --> 0:04:54.040 but outside of that second half of Game three and 0:04:54.440 --> 0:04:56.240 like a little bit of tripping over themselves in Game 0:04:56.279 --> 0:04:58.480 five a couple of days ago, they could just score 0:04:58.560 --> 0:05:00.279 whenever they wanted, and that made it easy for them 0:05:00.320 --> 0:05:02.159 to kind of set the terms of engagement every game. 0:05:02.480 --> 0:05:06.359 Yeah, yeah, just I was just going to say, you know, Indiana, 0:05:06.800 --> 0:05:09.120 the random offense, as he said, what they do with 0:05:09.120 --> 0:05:10.640 the pick and roll and stuff like that. I just 0:05:10.960 --> 0:05:13.720 felt like such a bad matchup for the Bucks. I 0:05:14.160 --> 0:05:16.760 think I picked the Indian in five or six, I 0:05:17.000 --> 0:05:19.279 can't remember. And obviously, you know, I was assuming Dame 0:05:19.360 --> 0:05:22.120 was going to remain healthy throughout the series. But you know, 0:05:22.560 --> 0:05:24.479 even prior to Dame getting hurt, I think it was 0:05:24.560 --> 0:05:26.560 clear that it was just such a different matchup. And 0:05:26.600 --> 0:05:29.280 when you have you know, Brook Lopez playing drop defense, 0:05:29.520 --> 0:05:32.880 you have Bobby Portis out there like that, They're just 0:05:33.000 --> 0:05:36.240 not equipped to handle kind of what Indies Bread and 0:05:36.279 --> 0:05:39.919 Butter is offensively. And to Carter's point, I think this 0:05:40.200 --> 0:05:42.040 series is going to be a shock to the system 0:05:42.080 --> 0:05:45.400 for both teams because I was looking at it and 0:05:45.560 --> 0:05:50.400 Indies and Miami's defenses were identical basically post All Star Break. 0:05:50.600 --> 0:05:52.880 You look at some of the regular season numbers, Miami 0:05:52.960 --> 0:05:56.159 was a bit better shooting from three in comparison to Indiana. 0:05:56.240 --> 0:05:59.840 But despite those numbers, I don't feel that's true. I 0:06:00.839 --> 0:06:03.440 understand that over an eighty two game sample, that's kind 0:06:03.440 --> 0:06:07.000 of how things shook out or whatnot, But how you 0:06:07.040 --> 0:06:10.320 were going to attack Indiana defensively is dramatically different. Miami 0:06:10.360 --> 0:06:13.360 had two week spots that you could pick at consistently 0:06:13.440 --> 0:06:17.840 and Tyler Herro and kelll where I you know, Indiana 0:06:18.040 --> 0:06:20.560 actually has a point guard, and not only a point guard, 0:06:20.640 --> 0:06:22.960 one of the best playmakers that we've really seen in 0:06:23.000 --> 0:06:26.599 Tyrese Halburn. Well, Miami didn't have a point guard, and 0:06:26.800 --> 0:06:29.640 I think that changes how those three pointers get generated 0:06:29.760 --> 0:06:32.600 in such a dramatic way. I just think it's going 0:06:32.680 --> 0:06:35.839 to be so different for both teams from what they 0:06:35.920 --> 0:06:37.119 were playing in the first round. 0:06:37.560 --> 0:06:40.520 Yeah, Tony, what like, oh, go ahead, Carter go I 0:06:40.560 --> 0:06:44.440 was gonna ask you to the point about Indiana's defense 0:06:44.680 --> 0:06:47.400 not having a tremendous amount of weak points. How many 0:06:47.400 --> 0:06:50.000 times do you think that Cleveland Cavaliers scored less than 0:06:50.000 --> 0:06:52.520 one hundred points this regular season? Well? 0:06:52.760 --> 0:06:54.359 I was actually going to bring that up earlier, but 0:06:54.440 --> 0:06:56.240 wasn't sure if it made sense. We were talking about 0:06:56.240 --> 0:06:58.039 if the regular season mattered at all, Like, wasn't that 0:06:58.080 --> 0:07:00.920 their worst game by far offensive? Was that that. 0:07:00.880 --> 0:07:04.279 First had one game under one hundred points and it 0:07:04.360 --> 0:07:06.440 was against your Indiana facers, And I'm not. 0:07:07.560 --> 0:07:10.080 Like I remember the Pacers defending pretty well in that game, 0:07:10.080 --> 0:07:11.640 but not so well that it's like, oh, yeah, they 0:07:11.680 --> 0:07:14.520 should have completely shut down one of the best offenses 0:07:14.520 --> 0:07:15.040 in the had. 0:07:14.960 --> 0:07:15.840 A bad shooting game. 0:07:16.000 --> 0:07:18.960 Yeah, sure, but it was such a wonky game because 0:07:19.120 --> 0:07:22.440 you know, the Caves were up at half, Halliburn's out, 0:07:22.760 --> 0:07:25.040 the Calves go up by sixteen, and I think they 0:07:25.080 --> 0:07:27.320 just took their foot off the gas, like I think 0:07:27.320 --> 0:07:29.480 they were riding like a fifteen game winning streak at 0:07:29.480 --> 0:07:33.000 that point, and you know, they're up sixteen, Haliburn's not playing, 0:07:33.120 --> 0:07:36.040 and then Indy just goes full court press. The Calves 0:07:36.360 --> 0:07:38.680 blow not only you know, blow the lead, they end 0:07:38.800 --> 0:07:41.520 up getting blown out. It was a massive, massive swing 0:07:41.600 --> 0:07:45.800 in the last you know, eighteen minutes of that game. Obviously, 0:07:46.040 --> 0:07:49.240 as I said, Max Struz was working his way back 0:07:49.280 --> 0:07:52.520 No Ty Jerome in that game, and then they played 0:07:52.520 --> 0:07:55.080 the following game, no Haliburn for that one. So we 0:07:55.240 --> 0:07:58.760 really don't have a lot of useful data in this series. Obviously, 0:07:59.080 --> 0:08:03.280 DeAndre Hunter hasn't played against Indiana at all either, so 0:08:03.720 --> 0:08:06.960 we're kind of flying blind. But I do find it 0:08:07.000 --> 0:08:08.920 interesting because I do think that these are teams that 0:08:09.000 --> 0:08:12.200 do play similar styles at least to some extent. 0:08:12.840 --> 0:08:14.600 Yeah, the shock to the system thing is going to 0:08:14.640 --> 0:08:18.160 be fascinating. Like you if you look at full season stats, 0:08:18.440 --> 0:08:20.400 you're gonna like miss a little bit of the boat 0:08:20.440 --> 0:08:22.760 with the Pacers just because they started so bad, like 0:08:22.800 --> 0:08:26.160 they were nine and fourteen and not like doomsday bad, 0:08:26.240 --> 0:08:28.800 but they like couldn't score against the nets and they 0:08:28.840 --> 0:08:31.600 couldn't stop the Hornets and like lost, like all these 0:08:31.680 --> 0:08:33.400 terrible teams are. It's like, man, these guys are just 0:08:33.400 --> 0:08:36.000 gonna be the ten seed the whole season. And they've 0:08:36.040 --> 0:08:37.800 had like the fourth best record in the NBA since 0:08:37.840 --> 0:08:39.959 the NBA Cup and a lot of their numbers since then, 0:08:40.040 --> 0:08:43.040 particularly on defense, are much better. And that's how they 0:08:43.080 --> 0:08:45.640 got to be an actually above average defense this year 0:08:45.679 --> 0:08:47.840 is because of the rise they had. Then they had 0:08:47.880 --> 0:08:50.040 practice time, they got better and jn Nemhard returned that 0:08:50.120 --> 0:08:53.440 obviously alone would have boosted things. Ben Shepherd returned right after. 0:08:53.880 --> 0:08:56.960 So that's a big part of it. But you know, 0:08:57.040 --> 0:08:58.839 the weak points part, and I think that's become a 0:08:58.920 --> 0:09:00.960 theme that people have written about for this playoffs is 0:09:00.960 --> 0:09:03.000 like teams love to attack weak points. That's almost as 0:09:03.000 --> 0:09:05.280 important as like the star parts of the battle, like 0:09:05.480 --> 0:09:08.160 Alberton's been getting picked on at times in the postseason, 0:09:08.160 --> 0:09:10.400 Like he even talked about himself not being the greatest 0:09:10.400 --> 0:09:12.840 defender after their Game five win, right, Like it is 0:09:12.920 --> 0:09:15.079 part of what he knows himself to be, which is 0:09:15.120 --> 0:09:16.920 part of it. He's a good team defender, Like he's 0:09:17.200 --> 0:09:19.200 very aware of what's going on. But you know, they 0:09:19.440 --> 0:09:21.800 they have been very good in spite of that. They 0:09:21.800 --> 0:09:23.760 have all had a lot of guys get better defensively. 0:09:24.440 --> 0:09:27.040 But I think that that will be where the Pacers 0:09:27.080 --> 0:09:28.559 have to figure out, Like, Okay, if we're not gonna 0:09:28.600 --> 0:09:30.880 get run off the floor by Calves team that had 0:09:30.920 --> 0:09:33.600 a one thirty plus offensive rating at the first rowd, 0:09:33.880 --> 0:09:36.200 we're gonna have to figure out where to put tyres 0:09:36.240 --> 0:09:38.240 Alburton had to defend on a string for forty eight minutes, 0:09:38.240 --> 0:09:40.319 because I mean, it's happened to every team, right, I'm 0:09:40.320 --> 0:09:42.280 not breaking a news by talking about Cavalanche, just but like, 0:09:42.360 --> 0:09:44.880 you mess up for three minutes of defense, you're down fifteen, 0:09:44.960 --> 0:09:45.880 Like you just can't do it. 0:09:47.000 --> 0:09:50.520 Is that where if as a as a on the 0:09:50.559 --> 0:09:53.200 Pacers side of the ledger, is that where you're the 0:09:53.280 --> 0:09:58.200 most concerned just their ability to hang offensively with the 0:09:58.240 --> 0:10:02.720 Calves or you know, is it or do you have 0:10:03.000 --> 0:10:07.000 similar concerns in the defensive end in terms of, you know, 0:10:07.440 --> 0:10:10.800 the offense being able to get going against obviously this 0:10:11.240 --> 0:10:13.880 super potent front line in Mobley and Allen. 0:10:14.440 --> 0:10:16.400 I think the Caves defense is very good and the 0:10:16.480 --> 0:10:19.160 size is gonna matter against the Pacers. This is not 0:10:19.200 --> 0:10:21.920 to discredit the Calves, but if they stop the Pacers 0:10:21.960 --> 0:10:23.480 for an entire series, they'll be the first team to 0:10:23.520 --> 0:10:25.720 do it, you know, in the Halberd and Carlisle kind 0:10:25.760 --> 0:10:27.520 of era. I am worried about the other end of 0:10:27.520 --> 0:10:31.480 the four way more than that, Like the Calves had 0:10:31.559 --> 0:10:33.120 could have had as many as four all stars, Like 0:10:33.120 --> 0:10:35.880 they had that many guys who were worthy, and like 0:10:36.000 --> 0:10:38.959 their weakest of those guys just shot what seventy five 0:10:38.960 --> 0:10:40.880 percent for a whole series and like just dunked all 0:10:40.920 --> 0:10:41.679 over people. 0:10:41.440 --> 0:10:44.880 For more steals than missus. Yeah against the Miami Yeah right. 0:10:44.920 --> 0:10:46.839 And you know, for all the things mouse Turner is 0:10:46.840 --> 0:10:48.920 good at, like if you take one step away from 0:10:49.000 --> 0:10:51.319 Jared Allen because someone else on your team got beat, okay, 0:10:51.360 --> 0:10:52.959 the boss is over your head and in the basket, 0:10:53.400 --> 0:10:57.280 so and the rebounding battle has very much skewed towards 0:10:57.280 --> 0:10:59.920 the fro in those Texas on Texas battles down low. 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:03.760 So I think if the Pacers can guard a little bit, 0:11:03.840 --> 0:11:05.480 that will help a lot, because I think they'll be 0:11:05.480 --> 0:11:08.880 able to score enough, but getting stops will be quite 0:11:08.960 --> 0:11:10.720 the chore I think for them, and that that's true 0:11:10.720 --> 0:11:12.440 of everybody against the Cavs. Just ask the he we 0:11:12.520 --> 0:11:14.600 just saw it. But you know, there's a lot of 0:11:14.600 --> 0:11:16.640 particulars that make me think the defense will be the 0:11:16.679 --> 0:11:17.400 story of the series. 0:11:17.640 --> 0:11:20.120 Yeah, and both teams are very similar in terms of 0:11:20.240 --> 0:11:24.040 how they perform offensively in transition. Both teams are in 0:11:24.040 --> 0:11:26.959 the top five in terms of transition offense. Both are 0:11:27.120 --> 0:11:32.360 you know, cas are eleventh in transition defense, Indy's fourteenth. 0:11:32.400 --> 0:11:34.680 Half court offense, both of these teams are great. Indy 0:11:34.800 --> 0:11:36.959 sixth and half court offense, Caves are number one, and 0:11:37.040 --> 0:11:39.560 half court offense. Half court defense is where there's a 0:11:39.559 --> 0:11:44.680 bit of a difference. Caves are fifth, while Indiana is sixteenth. 0:11:44.840 --> 0:11:47.679 I want to get your perspective on the you know, 0:11:48.120 --> 0:11:52.280 defensive strength of Indiana's front court because you know, Miles 0:11:52.280 --> 0:11:55.880 Turner and Pascal Siakam definitely had reputations of being very 0:11:55.880 --> 0:11:59.200 strong defenders. It hasn't felt like they've been as good 0:11:59.200 --> 0:12:02.240 this year, but maybe you know, some of that is 0:12:02.320 --> 0:12:05.440 skewed by me watching more early season matchups. How do 0:12:05.520 --> 0:12:08.760 you feel about them defensively and how they matchup in 0:12:08.800 --> 0:12:11.840 particular with the Kavs Biggs, because I really do feel 0:12:12.080 --> 0:12:16.560 that Mobley and Allen versus Siaka and Turner matchup is 0:12:16.600 --> 0:12:18.199 going to be one of the most important parts of 0:12:18.240 --> 0:12:18.760 this series. 0:12:19.200 --> 0:12:21.240 Yeah, a lot of stuff that Turner got better at 0:12:21.280 --> 0:12:23.040 is the season on a long defensively because ever like 0:12:23.040 --> 0:12:24.720 he was top five defensive player of the Year twice, 0:12:24.760 --> 0:12:27.120 Like he's yeah, at one point was a game wrecker 0:12:27.160 --> 0:12:29.080 on that end of the floor. I think he's still 0:12:29.160 --> 0:12:30.840 leading the playoffs and Blacks, which if he does again 0:12:31.040 --> 0:12:33.480 be the second time of his career. You know, he 0:12:33.760 --> 0:12:37.040 he's still talented on that end. Like when they were struggling, 0:12:37.480 --> 0:12:39.880 it wasn't really like he looked worse, but it wasn't 0:12:39.920 --> 0:12:42.920 necessarily his fault. That the whole game he's being asked 0:12:42.920 --> 0:12:45.959 to cover for someone else who got beat on the perimeter. 0:12:46.000 --> 0:12:47.760 It's like Miles Turner step over and side at the rim. 0:12:47.760 --> 0:12:50.760 Are they're gonna score and and you know you don't. 0:12:50.800 --> 0:12:52.200 You don't want to have to use the mouse trap 0:12:52.240 --> 0:12:54.560 that much. You should just eradicate the mice right, Like 0:12:55.080 --> 0:12:57.440 he's very good, but they didn't. But this season he 0:12:57.520 --> 0:13:00.240 got a lot better like two man game synergy, I 0:13:00.240 --> 0:13:02.640 would say, especially with the Pacers good defenders, like defending 0:13:02.679 --> 0:13:04.160 pick and rolls with them, Hard and Nee Smith have 0:13:04.240 --> 0:13:06.280 looked a lot better. They've been able to mix in 0:13:06.679 --> 0:13:08.800 coverages a little differently in a way that place the 0:13:08.880 --> 0:13:11.800 turner strengths and naturally help their defense. And yeah, Siakam 0:13:11.880 --> 0:13:13.920 last year and even at times really this year was 0:13:14.360 --> 0:13:16.400 a little flimsier than his rep on defense, but like 0:13:17.200 --> 0:13:20.680 there is not a bigger switch in scheme than going 0:13:20.679 --> 0:13:23.800 from Nick Nurse Toronto Raptors style and he planned for 0:13:23.880 --> 0:13:26.760 Darko the last year, but still to the Pacers, right, 0:13:26.840 --> 0:13:30.160 so there's new terminology. You're doing way different things naturally, 0:13:30.440 --> 0:13:33.120 and he's gotten much better as the season has progressed. 0:13:33.640 --> 0:13:37.559 So they they're two most sizeable players they play, are 0:13:37.640 --> 0:13:42.160 good defenders, they're reserve frontcour guys certainly have some weaknesses 0:13:42.200 --> 0:13:45.280 in Thomas Bryant, Obi Topping, like they played those guys 0:13:45.280 --> 0:13:47.120 mostly out of like, hey, we have six fouls for you, 0:13:47.120 --> 0:13:49.880 honest and necessity in the first round. Top it's been 0:13:49.880 --> 0:13:52.079 a good playoff performer before Jaris Walker will hit the 0:13:52.120 --> 0:13:54.960 floor certainly, and he has a nice defensive reputation. But 0:13:55.400 --> 0:13:58.080 you know, the Siakam and Turner's growth on that end 0:13:58.080 --> 0:13:59.240 of the four is actually a big part of the 0:13:59.240 --> 0:14:02.079 Pacers turnaround, because you are right that they have at 0:14:02.080 --> 0:14:03.960 times looked like they'd taken a step back on that end, 0:14:03.960 --> 0:14:06.120 but they needed them to be better to save their 0:14:06.160 --> 0:14:07.000 season and they have been. 0:14:07.640 --> 0:14:11.960 Yeah, something I'm really really interested in is what kind 0:14:12.040 --> 0:14:15.240 of scheme Carlisle comes out of the gate with in 0:14:15.320 --> 0:14:18.760 how they guard the pick and roll. Like the Calves 0:14:18.880 --> 0:14:22.520 were pretty like they kind of deviated from their regular 0:14:22.560 --> 0:14:26.080 season in the sense that they really did go hunt 0:14:26.160 --> 0:14:29.600 Tyler Hero. You know, they kind of in my opinion, 0:14:29.760 --> 0:14:31.760 justin feel free to disagree, they were kind of a 0:14:31.760 --> 0:14:33.560 team like we're just going to keep running our stuff 0:14:33.640 --> 0:14:36.480 until you break. They weren't like mismatch hunters. They're not 0:14:36.560 --> 0:14:39.400 like the Celtics, but in that heat series, they really 0:14:39.440 --> 0:14:42.640 did pick at the scab of Tyler Hero before they 0:14:42.680 --> 0:14:46.560 decided to pick at another scab of kilol Ware in 0:14:46.600 --> 0:14:47.400 the games in Miami. 0:14:47.480 --> 0:14:49.320 There's a lot of slander for an Indiana hoosier. 0:14:49.360 --> 0:14:53.520 I'm very upset, I know, I know, but but you know, 0:14:53.600 --> 0:14:55.360 so they kind of did they kind of did that. 0:14:55.400 --> 0:14:58.240 I'm going to imagine they're going to do the same 0:14:58.280 --> 0:15:02.000 thing with Halliburton. And if they're able to get that switch, 0:15:02.720 --> 0:15:06.360 how do you think that Indy's gonna play that? Because 0:15:07.040 --> 0:15:11.000 switching feels really dangerous for Halliburton, Like, I don't think 0:15:11.000 --> 0:15:13.720 you want him trying to like wrestle Jarrett or Evan 0:15:13.800 --> 0:15:17.120 in the post over and over and over again. You know, 0:15:17.320 --> 0:15:20.880 at a drop is what I think, you know, I got, 0:15:20.920 --> 0:15:24.000 like Turner is most comfortable with. But like good luck 0:15:24.120 --> 0:15:27.120 Mobley and Darius, I'm sorry, Donovan and Darius are like 0:15:27.120 --> 0:15:30.440 two of the best drop that can drop defense attackers 0:15:30.440 --> 0:15:33.040 in the NBA. Like what do you think they will 0:15:33.080 --> 0:15:35.040 do versus what they should do? 0:15:35.640 --> 0:15:38.200 Yeah, it's fascinating, Like the first round gave us no 0:15:38.240 --> 0:15:41.080 indication because the whole defensive plan is like okay, Yannis, 0:15:41.120 --> 0:15:43.640 step is step one, two and three and maybe even 0:15:43.640 --> 0:15:45.600 four and then everybody else figure that out later, right, 0:15:46.000 --> 0:15:48.960 And last year they had Brunson and the rest of 0:15:48.960 --> 0:15:50.400 the Knicks who like were you know, this is the 0:15:50.400 --> 0:15:54.120 most like potent team offense they'll have played in this 0:15:54.200 --> 0:15:55.800 era of their team that they'll have to kind of 0:15:55.840 --> 0:15:57.720 sort of stuff out because it's very easy for me to say, 0:15:58.040 --> 0:16:01.000 I bet Halburn starts the game on Max Streus, Right, Okay, 0:16:01.000 --> 0:16:02.920 that's great. Max Struce goes and sets a screen to 0:16:02.920 --> 0:16:05.320 start a possession, and now, what, like, are you just 0:16:05.480 --> 0:16:07.560 giving something up? Is Streut's just gonna be wide open 0:16:07.600 --> 0:16:09.840 for a three immediately? Gary Trentce just made a trillion 0:16:09.880 --> 0:16:11.560 three's against the Pacers in the first round, right, Like, 0:16:11.600 --> 0:16:14.840 it's not that obviously helps like sometimes, but it's not 0:16:14.920 --> 0:16:17.640 that simple, and he's going to get caught in tradition 0:16:17.640 --> 0:16:20.480 opportunities because of a strue screen whatever in those matchups. 0:16:20.520 --> 0:16:23.600 So yeah, I'd imagine they send Turner up higher because 0:16:23.680 --> 0:16:25.400 of that. Try to get those guards to have to 0:16:25.440 --> 0:16:27.680 turn the corner or see another body or just give 0:16:27.720 --> 0:16:30.200 them off time to scram and have the big man 0:16:30.280 --> 0:16:32.520 get back. But hey, good luck, Like that's hard. Everybody 0:16:32.560 --> 0:16:33.880 has tried this, Like if I can think of it 0:16:33.920 --> 0:16:35.720 obviously and it be a coach can think of it right, 0:16:36.000 --> 0:16:38.360 so maybe someone's coming from the weak side to tagd 0:16:38.360 --> 0:16:40.520 Allan come in to the basket. Oh look, Donovan Mitchell 0:16:40.560 --> 0:16:42.440 has become a better passer this year. Darris Carlan's an 0:16:42.440 --> 0:16:44.320 awesome passer. They'll just throw this skit pass over the top, 0:16:44.400 --> 0:16:48.680 like they're gonna have to be really connected, which is 0:16:48.720 --> 0:16:51.880 like everybody's favorite buzzword for just not messing up basically 0:16:51.920 --> 0:16:54.320 when you're rotating, And that's where the Bucks fell apart 0:16:54.320 --> 0:16:57.240 against the Pacers, right, they would stop the first action 0:16:57.280 --> 0:16:58.640 and the second one and the third one. They were like, 0:16:58.680 --> 0:17:00.320 oh crap, we don't know what to do. I'm not 0:17:00.440 --> 0:17:03.560 ready for whatever this is. And if the Pacers can't 0:17:03.560 --> 0:17:06.520 have that, But the Calves force you to mess up 0:17:06.520 --> 0:17:08.840 because they have a lot of good players. So you know, 0:17:08.840 --> 0:17:11.840 if you involve Albert in the action, which I imagine they'll try, 0:17:11.960 --> 0:17:15.400 or if you just keep running whatever the Calves want 0:17:15.400 --> 0:17:17.840 to run with their two all star level ball handlers, Yeah, 0:17:17.840 --> 0:17:19.720 they're going to generate good shots like a lot, and 0:17:19.760 --> 0:17:22.280 so the Pacers can't have these breakdowns, so they're just 0:17:22.359 --> 0:17:23.360 gonna get run out of the gym. 0:17:23.359 --> 0:17:26.040 Sometimes it does feel sorry justin I'll toss to you 0:17:26.040 --> 0:17:29.199 in just one second. It does feel like they you know, 0:17:29.640 --> 0:17:34.040 there are when you're coaching up a playoff defense, like 0:17:34.080 --> 0:17:36.480 you kind of are on one end. There are two 0:17:36.720 --> 0:17:40.080 ends of the spectrum. One end is simplify, so no 0:17:40.119 --> 0:17:43.560 one messes up, but like you know, talent will kill 0:17:43.600 --> 0:17:49.600 you or go way complicated, really rely on a lot 0:17:49.640 --> 0:17:54.719 of crazy rotation, high effort, high focus things, and like 0:17:54.960 --> 0:17:58.560 your ceiling might go up, but your floor goes way down. 0:17:59.119 --> 0:18:01.720 It does feel like Andy has to lean towards the 0:18:01.840 --> 0:18:04.640 ladder end of the spectrum and just depend on their 0:18:04.680 --> 0:18:06.639 guys to not screw up. 0:18:06.800 --> 0:18:09.560 And also like they just played honest like more complex 0:18:10.200 --> 0:18:12.400 mess if you if you mess up something complex, it's 0:18:12.440 --> 0:18:14.480 like it looks so bad, like there's like a wide 0:18:14.520 --> 0:18:16.800 open path to the basket. And I think they did 0:18:16.840 --> 0:18:19.280 a really good job with their on a scheme, but 0:18:19.320 --> 0:18:21.600 there were just some moments where like, oh, so obviously 0:18:21.640 --> 0:18:24.120 somebody just messed up like that that's the best player 0:18:24.119 --> 0:18:26.240 in the series walking into the rim. So that's where 0:18:26.280 --> 0:18:28.919