Speaker 1: Warning today's episode Canade spoilers for Mall shadow Lord episodes one,
Speaker 1: five and one O six. He warned, Hello, my name
Speaker 1: is Jason Accepcion and I'm Joelmenique, and welcome back to
Speaker 1: X ray Vision of the podcast where we dive deep
Speaker 1: into your favorite shows, movies, comics and pop culture. Coming
Speaker 1: to you from my Heart podcast where we're bringing you
Speaker 1: through episode a week.
Speaker 2: Rosie is at CinemaCon.
Speaker 1: Cinema Con, Cinema Conn doing the work.
Speaker 2: So I'm filling in today and I am really excited
Speaker 2: to talk about the evolution of two Boots. Where is
Speaker 2: he in his uh boot licking phases?
Speaker 1: I am already talk to him for a reboot on
Speaker 1: two Boots.
Speaker 2: Listen, we'll talk about droid writes of it, we'll talk
Speaker 2: about who is this inquisitor. Lots of spoilers in the
Speaker 2: back end, so you know, we'll give you guys a
Speaker 2: full warning about that. And yeah, five and six big episodes,
Speaker 2: so let's get right into it. Episode five Inquisition with
Speaker 2: Jennifer Corbett is the writer. Saul Rees and Tatiana Drewrek
Speaker 2: Harvin are the directors. The Empire arrives on jan X
Speaker 2: docu tells Devin to let the Empire handle them all.
Speaker 2: He's like, that's no longer concerned surviving is That is
Speaker 2: a direct quote. Don't worry about all of that Jedi
Speaker 2: training you've had, Padawan, It's just survived.
Speaker 1: I remain very, very underwhelmed by Daku.
Speaker 2: That's all moron Daku's underwhelming nature. Later, Chief Crist is
Speaker 2: not happy that two boots sold them out to the Empire,
Speaker 2: but lots and says he was just following protocol. Lieutenant
Speaker 2: Blake of the Empire confronts Christ. Blake accuses Christ of
Speaker 2: trying to hide Mall. He immediately takes over command of
Speaker 2: Janis and orders the Chief to be interrogated. Blake tells
Speaker 2: Lawson to stay nearby, don't go too far. Their copper,
Speaker 2: superior copper, has your number. He's got questions. He's gonna
Speaker 2: get answers. In the under City, Mal's right hand Brooke
Speaker 2: we talked about her a little bit last week, and
Speaker 2: farms Mall of the Empire's arrival, she suggests they switch systems,
Speaker 2: reasonably convinced that Devin is a lost cause. Since you know,
Speaker 2: stab stab lightsaber, lightsaber, they'll be more.
Speaker 1: There'll be more jedis in the in the galaxy. They
Speaker 1: didn't all die. You'll find another one. There'll be more
Speaker 1: for sensitive people being born. It's it's fine.
Speaker 2: But while they all attempt murder, Mall finds that admirable.
Speaker 2: He really wants this one. He's picked. Yes, let him
Speaker 2: have what he wants, okay, Vario. Meanwhile, it's worried about
Speaker 2: his business. He asks whether he is living as a
Speaker 2: prisoner or free to go, which he doesn't get a
Speaker 2: great answer. Meanwhile, the Mandalorians are concerned about their coin.
Speaker 2: Now that the Empire is running things, Rook is losing
Speaker 2: control of her troops. It's not good on team Mall.
Speaker 2: Right now they've got some issues. I mean, he he's
Speaker 2: a leader who cares.
Speaker 1: This was supposed to be a fairly simple, like straightforward
Speaker 1: take over the gangs get money to fund our our
Speaker 1: criminal enterprises situation, and instead Mal has gone on like
Speaker 1: a side quest, trying to do a rule of two situations,
Speaker 1: which I okay, I get that that's a thing too,
Speaker 1: he will do. But now it's turned into an absolute
Speaker 1: clusterfuck with the Empire, like on the planet in Force.
Speaker 1: I think I think, I think Mal's gang makes a
Speaker 1: reasonable request, which is like, let me just like get
Speaker 1: out of here.
Speaker 2: What are we doing from one manager to another? I
Speaker 2: know sometimes you get sidetracked with other projects as they
Speaker 2: come in. That's why you have Rook there. She's your
Speaker 2: project leader. You could just be like, hey, why don't
Speaker 2: you take these guys, establish us a new base somewhere,
Speaker 2: get set up, maybe run a few jobs so these
Speaker 2: guys can get paid while I focus so low because
Speaker 2: you're not bringing people along to help you with the padawan.
Speaker 2: You don't need them. Let them go do their job
Speaker 2: while you do your job.
Speaker 1: Also, like there's a there's an intense cultural pressure that
Speaker 1: I don't think Mal is like recognizing, which is like,
Speaker 1: these are the last Mandalorians, Like don't why are we
Speaker 1: getting involved in a direct conflict with the empire right now?
Speaker 1: Like that was not on the that was not on
Speaker 1: the menu. And these are the folks who, as far
Speaker 1: as they know, are like carrying the entire culture forward.
Speaker 1: We can't get them killed cured on janics for what?
Speaker 1: And Maul's not hearing that.
Speaker 2: I believe it was Bokatan who brought up a problem
Speaker 2: with Mall not being mandled Laurian and not understanding the
Speaker 2: culture and being the leader. You know, maybe following the
Speaker 2: strongest isn't always the best Anyway, Boots cannot detect loss
Speaker 2: and stress. He doesn't really get it. Lawson weirdly has
Speaker 2: like a dozen coffee cups on his desk. Maybe this society.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, but I couldn't understand why there were bajillion cups.
Speaker 1: Well, I guess they're trying to say, like, this is
Speaker 1: a guy, like he's so married to his worry. I
Speaker 1: was worried like about I mean, first of all, coffee.
Speaker 1: What is the coffee analog in Star Wars and on
Speaker 1: Gen X in particular, we don't know, Like, so is
Speaker 1: he addicted to whatever this drink is? I have serious concerns.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is like when kids first discovered red bull
Speaker 2: back in the day. This is not healthy and you
Speaker 2: should clean up after yourself. You've definitely picked up the
Speaker 2: wrong cup and had spoiled coffee and that's no fun.
Speaker 2: I speak from personal experience. Clean your desk. Two. Boots
Speaker 2: is struggling. Christ has been transferred permanently. She's not coming back.
Speaker 2: She's done. Lawson's weapon is taken and he's locked in
Speaker 2: an interrogation room where he can see fingernail marks carved
Speaker 2: into the table. Our boy is in trouble, and no
Speaker 2: more so when a cloaked inquisitor emerges from the shadows
Speaker 2: again more on him later. That should be the end
Speaker 2: of Lawson, if you ask me. Docu tells Devin they're
Speaker 2: going to head out of the city. Devin feels like
Speaker 2: she's wasting her abilities here you are Doctu says he
Speaker 2: can hear Mal's voice in her words and warns her
Speaker 2: not to be swayed. He says Mall is selfish, but
Speaker 2: Devin says he does have a point about the Empire.
Speaker 1: Yeah, come on, we can't call the Empire bad. We
Speaker 1: can't like, we can't criticize the Empire.
Speaker 2: What do we does? Doctor does have a slightly enlightened
Speaker 2: statement where he says the Empire may be our common enemy,
Speaker 2: but Mal will never be our ally. Well, then you
Speaker 2: would say the enemy of my enemy is my what
Speaker 2: my friend? I mean?
Speaker 1: I will just say, like, this is a good encapsulation
Speaker 1: of coalition of coalition politics. We are not getting married
Speaker 1: to Mal, That's what I would say. I understand that
Speaker 1: Mal has different ideas. I'm not getting married to Mal.
Speaker 1: We're like we if we want to achieve something like
Speaker 1: fucking up the empire, we could do that and not
Speaker 1: get involved in all his other stuff. And that goes
Speaker 1: for politics were large in the world. Like accomplish the
Speaker 1: one goal that you both have in common and then
Speaker 1: that's it. You don't have to do more than that.
Speaker 1: Break it off after that point. But it's like, look like, Daku,
Speaker 1: it's two of you, Like, what do you think you're
Speaker 1: going to accomplish if you can't forge aliances beyond the
Speaker 1: two of you?
Speaker 2: Not through wisely states We've seen many a Jedi work
Speaker 2: with mal particularly Ahsoka, several times over the years to
Speaker 2: get a job done. Yes, sometimes that's what you have
Speaker 2: to do. Listen, Okay. So Riley shows up looking for
Speaker 2: Papa Lawson. Boots tells Riley, don't worry about this. Kids.
Speaker 2: Don't worry is the message in this episode.
Speaker 1: Don't worry about it.
Speaker 2: It's like it's just a standard operating procedure. Then he
Speaker 2: kicks Riley out because protocol doesn't allow civilians back here. Lawson, meanwhile,
Speaker 2: in interrogation, is doing his best not to succumb to
Speaker 2: a six foot metal birds glaring red stare better than
Speaker 2: I would I'd to fold it immediately. He does tell
Speaker 2: the inquisitor that they walked into an ambush, but the
Speaker 2: inquisitor is like, how did you survive then if so
Speaker 2: much of your team is dead? Which reasonable? Yeah, sure,
Speaker 2: Docu and Devin planned to stay hidden in a nearby
Speaker 2: villain while is captured. Tyranny is always defeated. We must
Speaker 2: remain hopeful. Is the dumbest thing I have ever heard
Speaker 2: in my life. Tiranny is not always defeated. Uh, Hope
Speaker 2: is not just a feeling, it's an action.
Speaker 1: What are you doing, doctor dou This is like I
Speaker 1: I'm wondering if if you have we'll talk about this more.
Speaker 1: But here my question is this, and does this show
Speaker 1: think they are depicting Jedi ideology as a good thing,
Speaker 1: as a positive, as something to be strived for and
Speaker 1: reached for, or does it understand that it's depicting Jedi
Speaker 1: ideology as like hopelessly naive, weak and out of touch
Speaker 1: with the current moment. It's an interesting question because I'm
Speaker 1: actually not sure. I'm not sure, but there's no question
Speaker 1: that Doco is talking fucking nonsense. Tyranny is always defeated. Sure,
Speaker 1: but like after how like seventy years, Like, how long
Speaker 1: are we talking?
Speaker 2: You were literally just like a freedom fighting force for
Speaker 2: a powerful government. You assumably received taskwork and save the
Speaker 2: outcome of that. Do you want to take any It's
Speaker 2: just crazy to watch. That's a great question, Jason. We'll
Speaker 2: talk about that in our third segment. Uh So, Devin,
Speaker 2: in Doc, you tried to Jedi mind trick themselves out
Speaker 2: of a stormtrooper checkpoint. It works until another stormtrooper spots
Speaker 2: to them, saying like being released without their identification, So
Speaker 2: then they have to fight their way out. It's in
Speaker 2: a classic subway move. They hide in the ceiling. It
Speaker 2: is a cool fight. They hide in the ceiling, but
Speaker 2: the chases heart in Doc is injury and he is
Speaker 2: slowing down. Riley calls his mom, lets her know the
Speaker 2: Empire is on the planet. He asked her to come help,
Speaker 2: and a third adult says if troopers are there, it
Speaker 2: is to keep everyone safe. She says, if they ask
Speaker 2: you to do something, cooperate, trust me, everything will be fine.
Speaker 2: Adults will lead you astray, is the message. And I
Speaker 2: think that's important for the kids to know. The adults
Speaker 2: don't know what they're doing either. Make your own choices
Speaker 2: Devn in Doc you discovered that they can't leave the city,
Speaker 2: Doc who says they need to hide and they must
Speaker 2: rely on their soul contact. Uh oh. The inquisitor investigates
Speaker 2: the scars the lightsaber left where Document Devon faced off
Speaker 2: against the mall. He's getting closer, Rook tells Ma, Devin
Speaker 2: and Doc Whu didn't make it out of the city.
Speaker 2: We get a clearer look at the Dota Marie brothers
Speaker 2: we talked about last week. Lawson is released with the
Speaker 2: Empire's thanks and the return of his gun. Surprising back
Speaker 2: home after the interrogation, Lawson discovers Riley with DOCU and Devin,
Speaker 2: and he is not happy about it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just getting worse and worse for him, worse and.
Speaker 2: Worse if you are a law a Biden cop. It's
Speaker 2: been a spiral of a twenty four hours. Let me
Speaker 2: tell you, all right, let's go to break real quickly.
Speaker 2: Come back. We'll talk about an episode.
Speaker 1: Sick, episode six nine of The Hunted, written by Chris R.
Speaker 1: Yost The Legend, directed by Stuart Lee. Maul is doing
Speaker 1: his morning exercises as morning affirmations. The moves look they
Speaker 1: look like mal moves. They look like things we've seen before.
Speaker 1: Lawson is unhappy to see Jedi docu. Lawson accuses Devin
Speaker 1: of being a thief, which is technically true. Just all
Speaker 1: it's a fruit, technically true.
Speaker 2: It's starting, Oh my god.
Speaker 1: Okay, And Daku, meanwhile, is just like, how do we
Speaker 1: we need to get off this planet? I need to
Speaker 1: get Devin out of here. There's a lot of danger
Speaker 1: all around. We need to how can we do that?
Speaker 1: And Lawson is like, I can't you know, my son, Riley,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of heat right now, the empires here.
Speaker 1: I don't want my son to get in trouble.
Speaker 2: Meanwhile, the first place I've had empathy for los Yeah,
Speaker 2: and it's like, this is a difficult choice. I want
Speaker 2: to be like, make the right choice, but your child
Speaker 2: is on the line. You gotta think about your moves.
Speaker 1: Meanwhile, Riley and Evan are in his room just kind
Speaker 1: of awkward. Yeah, and I think appropriately awkward.
Speaker 2: It's like, yeah, we're yeah, there's a girl who's kind
Speaker 2: of cute is in your room. Like, oh my god,
Speaker 2: Like what is even happening right now?
Speaker 1: That's a lot we and we weren't we learn more
Speaker 1: about him and then that kind of sports ball game
Speaker 1: that he plays called Bodoken and that his mom works
Speaker 1: on Coruscant for the Empire in some former fashion. Who
Speaker 1: do we think she is? The way that we're building
Speaker 1: it up, So she's in.
Speaker 2: The bluish gray fit. That could mean she's, like, I
Speaker 2: think she's middle management somewhere, so you know, important enough
Speaker 2: that like I can't call you in the middle of work,
Speaker 2: like we have base to do, but not so important
Speaker 2: that she has any sway over what they're doing on
Speaker 2: this planet, or she can't talk to anybody or upgrade
Speaker 2: that she's like, just behave and you're gonna be fine.
Speaker 1: You think she's Dedra.
Speaker 2: Do I think she's If Dadra has a secret, I
Speaker 2: would love it, but no.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Okay, Lowson promises that listen, I didn't tell the
Speaker 1: inquisitor anything, which it is true, but also why I
Speaker 1: would not believe this regular guy. I'd be like, you
Speaker 1: don't think you did, but you did.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: The inquisitor shows up, Yeah, and he came. Absolutely. The
Speaker 1: inquisitor shows up. DOCU sends Devin to protect Lawson and Riley,
Speaker 1: but he's injured and he's you know, struggling with a
Speaker 1: powerful force wielder Uh and the Lawson's home because of
Speaker 1: the fight that is happening, begins to to burn down.
Speaker 1: Stormtroopers chase Devin and Lowson across the roof. Doctor joins them.
Speaker 1: He's a good question that you ask here, Joelle in
Speaker 1: this recap, is will anyone die in this series? Besides?
Speaker 2: That was for sure the end of Docu. I was like, oh,
Speaker 2: fight off Green. We're on the roof. It's been a
Speaker 2: long time, we're up here, and then suddenly he appears,
Speaker 2: and I'm like.
Speaker 1: Besides, nameless like cops and other imperials, like, will anybody
Speaker 1: of note die? And I will say that, like, it
Speaker 1: would be very interesting depending on how it happened, if
Speaker 1: if he died, if Docu died, Devin takes command of
Speaker 1: the ship the Quizzer, who's also not dead, fight Stocko
Speaker 1: on the roof, with Devon providing air cover. Docu boards
Speaker 1: the ship in you know, absolutely like action movie. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: action movie type fashion, and they are able to escape,
Speaker 1: but soon, of course, there's Imperial cruisers on them. Devon's
Speaker 1: never flown one of these, but she's doing pretty well.
Speaker 1: But she steals like a new person at it and
Speaker 1: loss and always a cop is like just like squealing
Speaker 1: in the vaccine, Two Boots. He loves the way the
Speaker 1: Empire's working.
Speaker 2: Loves the lick. He's like, can I have more?
Speaker 1: He is by the book, and in fact, like he
Speaker 1: wants other books that are not even applicable to gen X.
Speaker 1: He's like, well, I love the Imperial Book, Like that's great.
Speaker 1: The impart is like ten months old, and two Boots
Speaker 1: is like, I love it. I got to get in
Speaker 1: on this anyway, Well I'll say this and I get it.
Speaker 1: Two Boots, I think is responding to you know, like
Speaker 1: imperial federal jurisdiction, like they can chase criminals from planet
Speaker 1: to planet, and like when a big crime boss is
Speaker 1: doing crimes over here in the outer room, we have
Speaker 1: no idea in gen X, like who he is, what
Speaker 1: that is, what's going on? Like we don't know who
Speaker 1: that person is. And it's like so much more efficient
Speaker 1: when you have all this information and you can chase
Speaker 1: people across the galaxy whatever. You're the worst anyway, Lawson's
Speaker 1: wanted poster at that moment goes up tennant. Blake tells
Speaker 1: two Boots that his shoes have not yet been issued
Speaker 1: to him, and they should therefore be removed so he can't.
Speaker 1: They're not standard uniform. Will this shake two Boots's confidence
Speaker 1: and belief in the efficiency of the Empire and show
Speaker 1: him that like, yes there are they are a much
Speaker 1: bigger bureaucracy, but like also a very tangled bureaucracy as well.
Speaker 1: It's an open it's.
Speaker 2: A difficult and shameless truth. When it hits home, people react,
Speaker 2: so you can be seeing it. His best friend could
Speaker 2: be like, hey, it's bad. We don't trust the Empire.
Speaker 2: Maybe and it's not until someone's like my boots, Oh no,
Speaker 2: the Empire bad. I think we'll see a turn, but
Speaker 2: I don't love it.
Speaker 1: Daku continues to harp on, we need to get off
Speaker 1: the planet. I gotta sell I gotta save Devin, Like
Speaker 1: there's Jedi hunters here now, plus mall in the Empire
Speaker 1: in general, Like we got to get out of here.
Speaker 1: Lawson is like, well, I may know someone my like
Speaker 1: my side piece slash situationship slightly criminal woman who hangs
Speaker 1: out like a canteena casino Rena, and Rena is like,
Speaker 1: it's crazy right now on the planet empires everywhere, heat
Speaker 1: is everywhere, like it's very dangerous to move right now,
Speaker 1: we find out that Rena is a former bounty hunter
Speaker 1: and that they have this kind of they have a
Speaker 1: relationship that stretches back years that involved Lawson, perhaps before
Speaker 1: he was a cop, being involved in some form of
Speaker 1: fashion with bounty hunting. Unclear how that worked.
Speaker 2: If this show were more adult, like I wish it wasn't,
Speaker 2: Maybe we can talk about that more in our last
Speaker 2: section as well. This would be a fascinating, amazing character
Speaker 2: that I think the fandom would immediately become obsessed with.
Speaker 2: But because she's sort of limited by the all ages
Speaker 2: aspect of the show, it's just we can know and
Speaker 2: understand and headcan in these things, but it's like we
Speaker 2: don't get to see the difficulties and complexities of that
Speaker 2: relationship play out, and I think it's a loss for us.
Speaker 2: I'm really intrigued by Rina soul like she runs a casino,
Speaker 2: former bounty hunter, like really intriguing character. I like this
Speaker 2: info dump on her.
Speaker 1: I wonder if this means loss and was once a
Speaker 1: bounty hunter?
Speaker 2: Right right? What's his back? Like I'm going straight, I'm
Speaker 2: become a cop, which is a thing we've seen in
Speaker 2: several flony things I'm thinking of.
Speaker 1: And Jarn is kind of this. He's like, went from
Speaker 1: bounty hunter to Dad.
Speaker 2: And Bain what you're talking about earlier? Yeah, like we
Speaker 2: do see this sort of I wanted to I was
Speaker 2: a bad guy, but I wanted to be good and
Speaker 2: then either I had to go back to being bad
Speaker 2: or I turned into a cop. So this is an
Speaker 2: interest seeing storyline.
Speaker 1: See, yeah, i'd be I'd be fascinating to know, like
Speaker 1: or was he a cop helping her from the law side?
Speaker 1: It's anyway, and then saved but saved each other multiple times.
Speaker 1: Sounds like they did missions together, so this is all
Speaker 1: and all are very interesting. Rook accuses Mal of trying
Speaker 1: to save Devin from the from the Jedi Hunters, which
Speaker 1: he obviously is, and Mal says, like, yeah, I am,
Speaker 1: because you don't get it right. All of this hunting her,
Speaker 1: me hunting her, she fighting me, the inquisitors looking for her.
Speaker 1: That is making her an even better mentor potential mentor
Speaker 1: for me. He says. The strongest medal is forged by
Speaker 1: the Crucible, which all medal is forged in the Crucible
Speaker 1: for one thing, Like that's how you that's how you
Speaker 1: tell you, that's how you make it. But that's fine.
Speaker 1: You can put that aside for now.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: I guess if you were saying, like you find like
Speaker 1: raw met like iron in a stone, just like that way,
Speaker 1: but like anyway whatever. He's right though in I get
Speaker 1: what he's saying, but it's also such a self serving
Speaker 1: statement because it's like all of this trouble that is
Speaker 1: being caused by the hunt for Devin, and that is
Speaker 1: causing us anxiety and stress because we might all get
Speaker 1: captured and or killed. It's actually making it better for
Speaker 1: when we do you find her anyway, you know, He's
Speaker 1: basically like the longer she survives, essentially, he says, the
Speaker 1: more the stronger she will get and the better an
Speaker 1: ally for me she will become. And I noticed that
Speaker 1: he always that he doesn't say we, And that's the
Speaker 1: problem with Maul. With this conversation. He says, quote, she
Speaker 1: need only find her resilience and she will find me
Speaker 1: her ally, What is this? What about we?
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 1: Like that's and that I think mal is the problem.
Speaker 1: We got to figure out how to communicate a little better.
Speaker 1: Let your the Mandalorians are, they're investing a lot in
Speaker 1: you and yeah, and it's never a we situation.
Speaker 2: Rook. I want to hold your hand and say, this
Speaker 2: man is not Polly Okay, he's looking for the one
Speaker 2: and it's it's not you, and it's not the Mandalorian people.
Speaker 2: He wants a force wheeler. Girl, you gotta get out
Speaker 2: of there. Cut Ties, lead your own crew.
Speaker 1: Let's yeah, lead your own Mandalorian group. Unless you can
Speaker 1: lift a rock with your mind, it's not not gonna happen.
Speaker 2: Cause he's not interested.
Speaker 1: The troopers trace Lawson and the escapees to the casino.
Speaker 1: They grab Marina, but Rena's resourceful and a fighter and
Speaker 1: all that it gets turns into a firefight immediately. Uh
Speaker 1: and the kids are kind of shuttled off to safety
Speaker 1: while DOCU and Lawson fight it out with the stormtroopers.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of stormtroopers. Good shootout, big, big shootout,
Speaker 1: and the inquisitors are here as well. Docu promises loss
Speaker 1: and that Devin will protect Riley, which is like, not,
Speaker 1: I can't imagine that's like a huge stress reliever for Lawson.
Speaker 1: But whatever, Lawson says, doc who's you know it basically
Speaker 1: says like that doesn't make me feel better. I don't
Speaker 1: know who this person is. That's like it's also like saying,
Speaker 1: the one person who the entire empire is trying to
Speaker 1: kill and hunt is with your son. Don't worry about it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this makes a giant targetments back. She's a child.
Speaker 2: The rational decision making, years of training, it's not really
Speaker 2: adding up to like exquisite amounts of safety. It's come on, do.
Speaker 1: We get a great great fight between Devon and the
Speaker 1: Inquisitor on this like moving it's kind of moving like
Speaker 1: open open roof kind of train situation, which is very
Speaker 1: very cool. Daddy Mal shows up and he's like, get
Speaker 1: away from her, you bitch.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: The Inquisitor unveils the spinning blades that is the classic
Speaker 1: inquisitor move. Mall pulls out the two sided blade. It's
Speaker 1: it's a great, great, great fight, and they eventually managed
Speaker 1: to like separate the train between so that they are
Speaker 1: one the side that keeps going and the Inquisitors on
Speaker 1: the other side. Devin then moves to take out Mall,
Speaker 1: but he's like, yeah, go ahead, like you're not going
Speaker 1: to do that because I am not your enemy. And
Speaker 1: then he's like, I don't want to fight you, and
Speaker 1: then he says now that you've seen the face of
Speaker 1: your true enemy, basically saying like quick, yeah, basically saying like, hey,
Speaker 1: it's the Empire. The Inquisitors. Those are bad guys, like
Speaker 1: I'm just the guy that like did kidnap you for
Speaker 1: a period of time, but also like wants to be
Speaker 1: your father. And then the inquisitor reports back to his
Speaker 1: master he's in league with two Jedi. How should I
Speaker 1: proceed BOM, Yes, take a quick break and we'll be
Speaker 1: back to talk about this. M hm, and we're back.
Speaker 1: Let's talk briefly about this as an inquisitor. This is
Speaker 1: Eleventh Brother, who yes, that we have seen before. He
Speaker 1: first appeared in Star Wars Tales of the Jedi uh
Speaker 1: season one, episode six, resolve Resolve. Uh, he's got that
Speaker 1: you know, that cool black helmet with like the demon
Speaker 1: bird hype mask and very very cool looking and all
Speaker 1: of which hides the fact that these they're the Inquisitors,
Speaker 1: while very cool, were an unsuccessful attempt at half at
Speaker 1: like somewhat weaker force sensitive lightsaber users that could be
Speaker 1: corrupted and used by the Emperor. But in the end
Speaker 1: he needed Big Daddy Darth. Like the one thing that
Speaker 1: I always think about with the Inquisitors is like this
Speaker 1: was like version one point zero and ultimately like you
Speaker 1: need you'd need the Darth, Like these guys aren't getting
Speaker 1: it done. Darth will whoop the Inquisitor's asses in fact,
Speaker 1: like you don't need but they're they're wrecking house pretty
Speaker 1: much here, although they do fail again multiple times, both
Speaker 1: to figure out what loss and is up to catch
Speaker 1: the Jedi, catch maw All or anything.
Speaker 2: They their mission is you posted before we started the
Speaker 2: call of like what is the goal of what is
Speaker 2: the Empire being here? Really? Because we know they show
Speaker 2: up when they're like, oh, hey there are force users here,
Speaker 2: they think they're kind of coming for Mall. I guess
Speaker 2: that's to do two boots. Reported then they see, well
Speaker 2: there's a fight, so there's multiple force wielders here. But
Speaker 2: we don't ever really see, you know, the chain of
Speaker 2: command come down and be like hey, like specifically get
Speaker 2: these guys. We know that they're absolutely willing to hunt
Speaker 2: down a child, maybe to make her another Inquisitor. Wouldn't
Speaker 2: that be a fun storyline. I think the Inquisitors are
Speaker 2: really interesting characters and I would love someone to please
Speaker 2: do some type of miniseries, probably comic books that we're
Speaker 2: being real, but like, imagine what happens to make a
Speaker 2: former Jedi become an inquisitor and like hunt down the
Speaker 2: last of your people? Like the mental mind fuck of that. There,
Speaker 2: you assume they're getting like young padawans perhaps uh you
Speaker 2: know not quote I forget all that you could be
Speaker 2: a Padawan and then something else and then it's a
Speaker 2: night in the master.
Speaker 1: Yes, right, it's a brother sister grand inquisitor. There's like
Speaker 1: the brother level, which is like the more rank and file,
Speaker 1: and then the grand inquisitors like the leader gotcha, got you?
Speaker 2: So yeah, So I wonder if they're pulling these folks
Speaker 2: in as Padawans or you know, are they like Jedi
Speaker 2: knights with additional training? And then two like we don't
Speaker 2: know who the Crow aka the Eleventh Brother is yet,
Speaker 2: but we do. And you feel free to skip ahead
Speaker 2: if you don't want to hear how that episode of
Speaker 2: Tails of the Jedi goes. I would highly recommend watching it.
Speaker 2: It's a pretty great episode. But Ahsoka kills the Eleventh
Speaker 2: Brother in a fight that reminds me a lot of
Speaker 2: Mal and Obi Wan's fight. It's very Samurai esque in
Speaker 2: that it's a single blade switch. And it's interesting too
Speaker 2: because like when she goes to destroy, like she's lured
Speaker 2: out of hiding and forced to become basically a Jedi
Speaker 2: again because she's like, I cannot stand by and watch
Speaker 2: people's houses burned down. I can't stand by and watch
Speaker 2: people get hurt, even though I've been betrayed in this moment.
Speaker 2: I just think it's funny that every time the Inquisitors
Speaker 2: pop up, it's like, well, I guess that'd be more
Speaker 2: a Jedi than I ever was before.
Speaker 1: Like, I mean, it's interesting. Yeah, the program is interesting.
Speaker 1: I mean, as a Boo noted in the in the chat,
Speaker 1: they were kind of like nerved, like the whole idea
Speaker 1: was not so they couldn't really pose a threat to
Speaker 1: either Vader or Emperor Palpatine. And there were you know what,
Speaker 1: like thirteen fourteen of them, eleven plus some others. There
Speaker 1: was like a pair of them, and then there was
Speaker 1: the one named Lynn that said, if you look at what,
Speaker 1: they all die violently, pretty much killed by the Jedi
Speaker 1: that they were hunting, who were much more skilled than
Speaker 1: they are, because they were again like kind of nerved
Speaker 1: on purpose and finished off internally by Vader, who was
Speaker 1: just proved kind of his worth. Now, I think that
Speaker 1: there's a like higher conspiratorial angle to this, where it's like, well,
Speaker 1: isn't that kind of what Palpatine wanted was like wanted
Speaker 1: one to test Vader's strength and loyalty and by setting
Speaker 1: up this internal system of competition where all of his
Speaker 1: acolytes were trying to kill each other and only the
Speaker 1: strong survive. And that's probably the case. But as a
Speaker 1: in terms of like a their effectiveness with catching Jedi,
Speaker 1: its just it's show me where they were effective one.
Speaker 2: Time seeing it. Yeah, I think with the Equitters who
Speaker 2: came after Jaden and his master, I think so, yeah,
Speaker 2: because they were hiding out for a while in rebels
Speaker 2: and then we see later that he yeah, I think
Speaker 2: maybe the one time unfortunately, But yeah, I like the
Speaker 2: look of the Inquisitors. I'm a big fan of the
Speaker 2: we're at school and it's terrible genre of arts whatever
Speaker 2: we call that. So I wouldn't mind seeing like inside
Speaker 2: the Inquisitors, you know, especially these early years where they're
Speaker 2: newly minted and you know, we're there's apparently tons of
Speaker 2: Jedi who escaped Order sixty six and exploring like who
Speaker 2: made it and who didn't. I think there's a lot
Speaker 2: of area for refinement around that too. You know, I
Speaker 2: think that's a big plot hole for a lot of
Speaker 2: Star Wars fans, like how did so many of these
Speaker 2: folks escape Order sixty six? Let's explore that in an
Speaker 2: inquisitor or investigation. That sounds like fun to me.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about let's talk about docu. I you kind
Speaker 1: of like touched on it. But I think this show
Speaker 1: is doing some really interesting things thematically that if it
Speaker 1: wasn't a more or even like a PG thirteen execution
Speaker 1: m m mm hmm, which I think I guess you
Speaker 1: could argue on a violence from a violence angle, it's
Speaker 1: kind of PG thirteen.
Speaker 2: I could actually argue that it's not because you know
Speaker 2: a lot of kids animation, like you can't show red
Speaker 2: blood in America. That's a hard and fast rule. And
Speaker 2: I've been thinking as we look at the violence, like
Speaker 2: most of it is off screen and really what you're
Speaker 2: seeing is, you know, a fencing fight with cool lights,
Speaker 2: which is great. But I think on the violence, as
Speaker 2: I mean, we do have the pupew's and stuff, and
Speaker 2: there's some explosions, but all of that to me happens
Speaker 2: so far away and from a distance, and not to
Speaker 2: any of the characters that were directly following that, the
Speaker 2: violence feels artificial and not emotionally impactful.
Speaker 1: All of which is to say, there are these really
Speaker 1: interesting themes kind of bubbling under the surface. It's like,
Speaker 1: you know, whether it's loss in and his whatever, his
Speaker 1: relationship with Rina is, like would love to know more
Speaker 1: of that, lawson and his ex wife like that is
Speaker 1: a very complex and meaty kind of would love to know,
Speaker 1: like how that fell apart, like what and the fact
Speaker 1: that she left without her son, Like this is all
Speaker 1: really interesting? Is he hiding from her with the sun?
Speaker 2: Like all of that is fascinating, and she protecting them
Speaker 2: by going to the empire.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of complexity here, like under the surface.
Speaker 1: And then there's the the depiction of like the classic
Speaker 1: struggle between the dark and the light here. And I
Speaker 1: genuinely I think that there is at least a chance
Speaker 1: that this show is doing something really interesting, which is
Speaker 1: being like this is why the jedis fail, Like there
Speaker 1: they're ok, Like I think there's at least a chance
Speaker 1: that they're kind of doing it on purpose. As a
Speaker 1: metaphor for a rule following kind of norm following mindset
Speaker 1: in the face of an enemy that has no shame,
Speaker 1: that has no adherence to laws other than its own power,
Speaker 1: that doesn't care, and there is at least a chance
Speaker 1: again that in creating that contrast, which I think they
Speaker 1: are doing, whether they're doing on purpose, is the question
Speaker 1: that in showing that contrast, they're saying they're implicitly criticizing
Speaker 1: the Jedi, because like at every turn, you're like, doca,
Speaker 1: what are we doing? Don't we like can't we fight
Speaker 1: fire with fire a little bit? Like you're on the
Speaker 1: run for your life? Now, I get that you don't
Speaker 1: want to see and apple, and you shouldn't. I'm not
Speaker 1: saying you should, But do we have to then let
Speaker 1: your potawan I don't even think she's a padawan. Should
Speaker 1: we let your you know, younger Jedi mentee like get arrested?
Speaker 1: She would definitely just like put her in jail. Shouldn't
Speaker 1: we like try and kill mall? Like I don't know
Speaker 1: what is going on here?
Speaker 2: Can't even stand up for her to be like, hey,
Speaker 2: like it's how much is this apple? Costs? Five cents?
Speaker 2: Like we yeah, go to jail is crazy. I think
Speaker 2: it's even crazier to say tyranny is always defeated. Is
Speaker 2: such an affect based on one to tell a person
Speaker 2: look around, Brian defeated like it's happening, and and the
Speaker 2: level of just like, well, what can we do? I'm
Speaker 2: just even this is.
Speaker 1: Why kids becoming prisoners dot go first of all, First of.
Speaker 2: All, and it's it's too It's I just think like
Speaker 2: even if we look at like like non violent individuals
Speaker 2: still find ways to like protect and stand up for
Speaker 2: and stand against violence without enacting it themselves. So I
Speaker 2: really hope that's where they're going, because I think the
Speaker 2: whole like uninformed, ignorant, peaceful monk who just wants piece
Speaker 2: at all, like time, it's it's challenging to watch. And
Speaker 2: then two, I think, you know, in moments when we
Speaker 2: see this, you know our are you know our obi
Speaker 2: wan Kenobi's, our anakins, our qui gons are rule benders,
Speaker 2: let's say. But I think even in those religious yeah,
Speaker 2: yeah exactly. But I think when they were firm on
Speaker 2: the rules and their paddle ons are questioning, that was
Speaker 2: oftentimes some of the best, like Clone Wars writing it's
Speaker 2: sometimes like the most interesting spaces for those characters, because
Speaker 2: which rules are you choosing to follow on? Which ones
Speaker 2: are you choosing to break in?
Speaker 1: Why?
Speaker 2: Uh? I wish we have a little bit more of that,
Speaker 2: like an evolved sense of that friction between this padawan
Speaker 2: and mass because I think.
Speaker 1: I agree with you. I think that there's something interesting
Speaker 1: under the surface if they want to flesh it out.
Speaker 1: There's also the fact that like Doaku's like he there's
Speaker 1: a passivity that is so interesting for a person who's
Speaker 1: like on the run for his life and who's responsible
Speaker 1: for the life of another person. They're putting there all favor. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they're putting like they're putting loss and in his kid
Speaker 1: in danger to say nothing of like whoever you know
Speaker 1: whatever civilians are on the trains or around whenever any
Speaker 1: of these fights like blow up, and all he can
Speaker 1: talk about is like, help me get off the planet,
Speaker 1: help us get off the planet. Okay? And what are
Speaker 1: you what are you offering? Like what in this? Why
Speaker 1: should I do that? How does because it's the right
Speaker 1: thing to do, Explain to me why that's the case,
Speaker 1: and how are exactly are you going to help in
Speaker 1: this situation? You don't have the contacts. You don't, you
Speaker 1: won't fight barely will fight, and you won't use the
Speaker 1: force in any kind of offensive way to help us
Speaker 1: do the stuff we need to do. Instead, you're just
Speaker 1: like asking this regular guy for help. And it just
Speaker 1: makes if the depiction is conscious to make the Jedis
Speaker 1: look this week and shattered in this moment, which they are,
Speaker 1: but like on a personal level, he's a tremendously powerful individual.
Speaker 1: Then I think that's really interesting.
Speaker 2: I do.
Speaker 1: I really do think it's interesting though the way they're
Speaker 1: showing it.
Speaker 2: I think your riot brain is cooking and preparing for
Speaker 2: a lot of plotlines that are not going to come
Speaker 2: to fruition unfortunately. But I like, I like, And I
Speaker 2: think this is the strength of the Star Wars fandom
Speaker 2: is our ability to be like under the surface. Yeah,
Speaker 2: like we can make a story in twenty years that's
Speaker 2: really going to bring all of this to the forefront
Speaker 2: in a way that you won't even believe, so you know, uh, yeah,
Speaker 2: it's it's all there. I do. I'm still rooting for
Speaker 2: this show. I really want to pull. I was higher
Speaker 2: on it last week than I am this week. You
Speaker 2: were just talking about selfishness. Let's talk about Daddy Mal
Speaker 2: in his his selfishness, because I this is the mall
Speaker 2: that I enjoy the most. I think, like the last
Speaker 2: episode four through here, I'd be like, this is the
Speaker 2: mall I wish we could have spent the most time
Speaker 2: with in this series, because Mal is inherently selfish. But
Speaker 2: a character who has to be selfish is interesting to
Speaker 2: me in a way that like a character who chooses
Speaker 2: to be selfish isn't. Mal has never had anyone look out,
Speaker 2: there's no one has his back. Ever. You have to
Speaker 2: be selfish or you will die like it is. That
Speaker 2: is his only choice, and he's too stubborn to die.
Speaker 2: And but he longs. He's a longer. He's like, what
Speaker 2: I want is companionship, someone who understand and me, somebody
Speaker 2: else who has this immense power and has to choose
Speaker 2: how to wield it in a world that is inherently
Speaker 2: unfair and terrifying because literally anyone at any moment might
Speaker 2: betray you. And so here we have him finally interacting
Speaker 2: with Devin, who, as we've been talking about, currently has
Speaker 2: a leader in her life who's making horrible choices. Yes,
Speaker 2: go to jail, don't worry about eating. I'm sorry if
Speaker 2: you seal because you are starving and you have no money.
Speaker 2: I don't care if you feel like to me, your
Speaker 2: right to survive is higher than anyone's right to the
Speaker 2: five cent you're gonna pay for that apple. That's crazy.
Speaker 2: And I I think for Mal to just lay it
Speaker 2: all out there and be like, listen, kid, if it
Speaker 2: would be worth it for you to kill me, for
Speaker 2: me to show you that I am not your enemy,
Speaker 2: it would be worth it for me to like risk
Speaker 2: losing all of the little bit I have built up.
Speaker 2: You know, I do think that the Mandalorians mean, like
Speaker 2: being in command of these people mean something. Tomal. I
Speaker 2: don't think it's completely pointless to him, but she is
Speaker 2: more important. He like the and selfishly, the forging of
Speaker 2: that bond with someone that he might be able to trust,
Speaker 2: that you know. And and two, I'll just say Maul
Speaker 2: only has the rule of two as his guiding star.
Speaker 2: Like that's what he's been told his whole life. It's
Speaker 2: why his mother gave him up, it's what he was raised,
Speaker 2: and it's what he's trying to recreate with his brother.
Speaker 2: Like he needs it and I want him to have it.
Speaker 2: Maybe not with Devin, I wouldn't mind him. FID like,
Speaker 2: find somebody who's maybe like I don't know, older and
Speaker 2: can actually have your back. Not a child who needs
Speaker 2: you to like guide them through the rest of their adolescence,
Speaker 2: but the fact that he's like, I've been treated so
Speaker 2: poorly my whole life, and I can create a space
Speaker 2: and a moment for you, not only to defend you,
Speaker 2: but for you to build trust in me. Yeah, like
Speaker 2: this version of Mallyah and.
Speaker 1: There is deductiveness to the pitch and at the same time,
Speaker 1: like Maul is he's a narcissist. He's he's extremely selfish
Speaker 1: but very seductive. And what I mean by that is, listen,
Speaker 1: if Maul wants found family, then put together the found
Speaker 1: family and go chill on a fucking moon somewhere. Instead,
Speaker 1: it's like, I want this found family now. I want
Speaker 1: to do the most dangerous shit possible with them and
Speaker 1: get them killed and relive my trauma all over again.
Speaker 1: I got them all killed and now it's my fault.
Speaker 1: Now I got to find a new found family and
Speaker 1: get to do again. And it's like, which is very
Speaker 1: feels very huge, Like that's a very human kind of
Speaker 1: trauma cycle where you recognize what you need and you
Speaker 1: broadly recognize the cycle, but you're unable to like break
Speaker 1: out of it. And that's what he's doing, Like he
Speaker 1: wants to forge this relationship with Devon, and you can
Speaker 1: see the I mean, if I'm Devon, I'm I'm thinking
Speaker 1: about it. And you know you mentioned how sure we
Speaker 1: as Star Wars fans have this ability to basically be
Speaker 1: like the writer's room for Star Wars on long term scales,
Speaker 1: and a boot put in the put in the chat
Speaker 1: that he would love a Devon becomes inquisitor arc. Hell yeah.
Speaker 1: But there's even the way he's giving Devin something that
Speaker 1: you could tell that she values on some level and
Speaker 1: would even desire, like more agency in her life, more active,
Speaker 1: an ability to be more active and not just like
Speaker 1: running from every problem. But it's always on Mal's terms.
Speaker 1: The terms are come with me, I will be your ally, okay,
Speaker 1: and then what and then we will fight the empire
Speaker 1: together and you will probably get.
Speaker 2: Killed because the rule of two sis there has to
Speaker 2: be one master in one apprentice, right, And that's where
Speaker 2: we're at, Like I'm the master, you the apprentice. And
Speaker 2: by the way.
Speaker 1: I've made this very chasmic, charismatic deal with everybody else
Speaker 1: in my gang. They all think that they are like
Speaker 1: my number one and together we are allies to take
Speaker 1: on the people who betrayed us. But really it's you
Speaker 1: and ps. At the end of this you will all
Speaker 1: be dead and I will be looking for the new
Speaker 1: versions of you. That is just like such a very
Speaker 1: human type of trauma loop to be caught in where
Speaker 1: it's like you're you're pitching it as this it's all
Speaker 1: like we're a family, it's us together, when really it's
Speaker 1: like your mission only you are the main character in
Speaker 1: your mind, in their lives. But you're pitching in a
Speaker 1: way where it's going to be like, oh yeah, no,
Speaker 1: it's going to be all of us. It's not going
Speaker 1: to be all of you. If you want that found family,
Speaker 1: like get it, go get a hideout on some random
Speaker 1: space rock and just go do stuff, hang.
Speaker 2: Outs out home. His enemy is actually galactically powerful, yeah,
Speaker 2: and evil, so like he has some point, like we
Speaker 2: actually have to end this guy, like it is your
Speaker 2: revenge and it is selfish. You You do not want
Speaker 2: the ultruistic good for the universe. You want to stop
Speaker 2: the guy who has hurt you the most, understandably, but
Speaker 2: I also think too, just again from Devin's point, like
Speaker 2: that guy my enemy too actually and mall maybe not
Speaker 2: so much in this series, but historically pretty good tactician.
Speaker 2: It's just that little revenge bit catches him up every time.
Speaker 2: Can't let it go.
Speaker 1: And what's doaku offering? Like running from place to place
Speaker 1: and like sleeping on the street.
Speaker 2: And he literally said, the only thing we can do
Speaker 2: is beg, Docu, Like you don't get the hell up
Speaker 2: out of here, like there's nothing.
Speaker 1: We can't get any kind of job out here, Like
Speaker 1: we have to only beg. This is crazy. This is
Speaker 1: just insane to me. If that's the.
Speaker 2: Point, we could be juggling entertainers, like we got mad skills.
Speaker 2: I'll hop up on an acrobatic thing. Do they have
Speaker 2: like a basketball thing? I've got force jumps? Ok? Yeah,
Speaker 2: like be a magician or great magician? You really like
Speaker 2: all we could do is big? Like this is sad, Docu,
Speaker 2: what happened to you? Like I have to I need
Speaker 2: a doc who backstory that makes this makes sense. I
Speaker 2: need a man so beaten and destroyed that he's like, well,
Speaker 2: what could we do, and you're like, wow, this is
Speaker 2: so sad. You should not be in charge of a child.
Speaker 2: You need, like everybody in Star Wars, some prescription pills.
Speaker 2: I after. Okay, So I wanted to ask you. We're
Speaker 2: getting close to the end.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think there's ten episodes total. Mm hmmm, so we've
Speaker 2: got four more to go, a little bit past the
Speaker 2: halfway point. How are you feeling about the mall of
Speaker 2: it all as far as like the show having Like
Speaker 2: I don't want to ask a show to justify its existence,
Speaker 2: that's a little bit crazy. But do you feel like
Speaker 2: you're getting insight into this character we've spent a long
Speaker 2: time with.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think so, I like again on a on
Speaker 1: a on a shallower level than I was hoping for,
Speaker 1: But it's all there, like his selfishness, his single mindedness,
Speaker 1: his desire for revenge, but also his ability to to
Speaker 1: frame that revenge as like a team goal for everybody else.
Speaker 1: Don't you want to take down the empire? Don't we
Speaker 1: all want to do that? Wouldn't it be for the best?
Speaker 1: They must be stopped? And it's really just like this
Speaker 1: guy fucked me over and I need to kill him,
Speaker 1: you know, like that's what it's about. And I think
Speaker 1: from that perspective, I find it really and I think
Speaker 1: again as a as a picture of a person who
Speaker 1: is traumatized and who is unable to like see their
Speaker 1: own role in their own retraumatization. Like you're you're in
Speaker 1: a cycle that is making this happen again. There's no
Speaker 1: excusing what happened to you, although you could argue like
Speaker 1: the way that he lost his family was was a
Speaker 1: version of this, like it was his mission. Yeah, yeah, left,
Speaker 1: But still like there's no there's no there's no softening
Speaker 1: that very very painful blow. But it reminds me of
Speaker 1: a kind of loop that you can get into. And
Speaker 1: this is what this is the things that I think
Speaker 1: are really interesting about all where it's like the the
Speaker 1: pain is almost more comfortable, like you could you could
Speaker 1: let go of everything and and check out and go
Speaker 1: hang out with Rook and the rest, just like ambushing
Speaker 1: cargo ships or whatever very quietly in some quiet corner
Speaker 1: of the galaxy. But like who would you be?
Speaker 2: Then? What do you?
Speaker 1: Who would you?
Speaker 2: Who would be?
Speaker 1: Who would you be as a person at that point
Speaker 1: and when your whole identity is wrapped up in pain?
Speaker 1: And anger and revenge. It's the almost the scariest thing
Speaker 1: is to like not do that. And I think that
Speaker 1: part of it is a really fun and interesting character
Speaker 1: study of Mall. I think I wish that it was
Speaker 1: a little deeper, but I do think that we are.
Speaker 1: It's not that we're seeing a new side of the
Speaker 1: Mall in particular, so I guess that part of it
Speaker 1: is a little bit of a letdown, But what we're
Speaker 1: seeing is a kind of underlining and amplification of who
Speaker 1: we know Mall to be. What about you?
Speaker 2: I agree with everything he said, and if the show
Speaker 2: pulls that out by episode ten where he's seeing something
Speaker 2: and making a choice about this instead of just gut check,
Speaker 2: constantly spiraling back into the cycle, and that's very intriguing,
Speaker 2: and I would be like, wow, once again, never doub
Speaker 2: Dave Filoni. You'll get some some humdingers of episodes, but
Speaker 2: then you're geting some great ones down the line, and
Speaker 2: that kind of tends to be the flow of these
Speaker 2: animated series. But no, I think, and again maybe this
Speaker 2: is my fault, like I don't want to judge a
Speaker 2: show on my preconceived notions, but I again, this is
Speaker 2: a character I love Dave has done some and team
Speaker 2: have done really strong writing over the years, and I
Speaker 2: guess I was sort of hoping for like a better
Speaker 2: Call Saul version of Mall where you're like, oh, this
Speaker 2: is like an evolution of this person that helps us
Speaker 2: fully understand like who he is and what he's been
Speaker 2: through and why he ends up going in the direction
Speaker 2: he goes in. But I think when I think about
Speaker 2: what I wanted as a kid, the show is delivering
Speaker 2: on a lot of elements, and for that, I'm glad.
Speaker 2: I think kids need dark shows and dark protagonists. I
Speaker 2: was talking to some friends the other day about how
Speaker 2: I felt really connected to e Or as a kid
Speaker 2: because I was chronically depressed, but I didn't know it
Speaker 2: and was really a comfort to me as a kid
Speaker 2: because I was like, why will no one just leave
Speaker 2: that man in his house for three out? He just
Speaker 2: wants to be alone. And so I think characters like
Speaker 2: Mal who have suffered a lot of abuse, who are
Speaker 2: trying to find their way can be even if they're
Speaker 2: imperfect in how they're searching for solutions, uh, really inspirational
Speaker 2: and good connective tissues. So yeah, I'm I and I
Speaker 2: still think there's too many people.
Speaker 1: There's characters in this that I don't like. I don't
Speaker 1: know why we need Riley unless we're gonna do more
Speaker 1: with Lawson's personal life, like and yeah, should we talk
Speaker 1: about it.
Speaker 2: I think we could a scale back. Yeah, let's finish
Speaker 2: with two boots. Okay. I have complicated feelings about two
Speaker 2: boots because I think I'm okay. Here's what really intrigues me.
Speaker 2: All the droids we've been introduced to have been manipulated
Speaker 2: to be independent thinkers, right. C three PO was Anakin's design,
Speaker 2: and he was like basically jail breaking his three PO unit.
Speaker 2: And that's why we get the different dialectically speaks from
Speaker 2: the others, and the fact that he's, you know, a
Speaker 2: little more inquisitive, even though he's still staunchly a rule follower,
Speaker 2: where he's like his own person R two D two
Speaker 2: similar like way his own person Shopper again, jail broke,
Speaker 2: I think by hera and wild, independent little thing. It's interesting,
Speaker 2: particularly from an institution that's run by the Empire. Ostensibly
Speaker 2: they report to the Empire to have a droid who
Speaker 2: is not jail broken at all. He's sort of been trained,
Speaker 2: he's developed this like desire for a clothes which you
Speaker 2: don't see on Android frequently, and be a connection to it,
Speaker 2: like yes, that's his name sort of swells to boots
Speaker 2: like all androids, but like either he was like that's
Speaker 2: my name and I should have the boots or yeah,
Speaker 2: the boots and they were like, look at this, that's
Speaker 2: really interesting and to watch him wake up could be
Speaker 2: really interesting. But man, is it hard to watch somebody
Speaker 2: like listen to a dearly beloved friend, coworker, partner constantly
Speaker 2: tell them like, hey, this is gonna put us all
Speaker 2: in danger. It's bad, and he's like it anyway, Look
Speaker 2: what are you doing, two Boots?
Speaker 3: Why?
Speaker 2: What are your thoughts? How are you feeling about two
Speaker 2: Boos at this day?
Speaker 1: I like Two Boots as a character. I think what
Speaker 1: he's done is despicable, But I do think to your point,
Speaker 1: we've seen there's been a lot of independent thinking droids
Speaker 1: whose moral alignment mapped to heroic and it would just
Speaker 1: make sense that if there are these independently thinking droids
Speaker 1: throughout the galaxy, and we've seen them before, that some
Speaker 1: of them would be more pro empire or pro following
Speaker 1: the rules or pro the laws in a given region
Speaker 1: and would be against helping good people who are breaking
Speaker 1: the law for reasons of being rule followers. And so
Speaker 1: I think that while I absolutely decry everything two Boots
Speaker 1: is doing, and I think it's terrible, and I think
Speaker 1: he should at least give his fucking partner a heads
Speaker 1: up before he just drops a dime on the empire,
Speaker 1: and I find myself fascinated by him. I do, like
Speaker 1: we said in the recap, I do hope that there
Speaker 1: is a moment, you know, like we got an and
Speaker 1: or for various characters where two Boots seize the true
Speaker 1: face of the Empire and goes, oh shit, fuck, you
Speaker 1: know I made I made a bad choice. I made.
Speaker 1: I made a rational choice, but I made a bad one.
Speaker 1: That said, I also feel like, I mean, Lawson is
Speaker 1: like goes even in this episode, goes to bat for
Speaker 1: two Boots, like even then kind of covers for him,
Speaker 1: and and two Boots is like ready to throw his
Speaker 1: partner like into the grinder, like does not.
Speaker 2: Fucking cares has earned this loyalty.
Speaker 1: It's crazy.
Speaker 2: It is shocking to me. Now, I'm not an advocate
Speaker 2: for a murder, but we've talked about whether we would
Speaker 2: reboot two Boots at the top of this episode, and
Speaker 2: you listen, I is that if we believe, as I believe,
Speaker 2: the droids are actually autonomous beings who've been conscripted into slavery. Uh,
Speaker 2: then yeah, it.
Speaker 1: Would be murdering.
Speaker 2: I I think. So it's a very ghost in the
Speaker 2: shell moment. But I think if you destroy the spirit
Speaker 2: but keep the body alive, that is still a type
Speaker 2: of death. Okay, I'm not I'm not.
Speaker 1: I'm willing to I'm I think it's a I think
Speaker 1: it's a reasonable philosophical reading. I'd be willing to hear
Speaker 1: other other viewpoints. I also feel like if I'm in
Speaker 1: a room with my droid partner, like at work, and
Speaker 1: my droid partner at work is like I'm going to
Speaker 1: call the empire, and I think it's the right thing
Speaker 1: to do, and the only way to stop them was
Speaker 1: to like hold the power button down for five seconds.
Speaker 1: I'd probably do it. I'd probably consider it, and I wouldn't.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I can't give tools names.
Speaker 1: Okay, I would feel super bad about it, and I
Speaker 1: would trust that, like we could rebuild the his personality
Speaker 1: to like eighty percent of what it was, But without
Speaker 1: the call the Empire part.
Speaker 2: You know, I don't know. Some would kick the Pixar
Speaker 2: lamp and I shoud it here, so anything anthropomorphized that
Speaker 2: womman like protect it. But yeah, no, I think you're
Speaker 2: right that ultimately, how could you blame someone who's like,
Speaker 2: don't call the cops, Like that's terrible off do that?
Speaker 2: What if you just turned him off and said aside,
Speaker 2: if if someone turns him back on, he's put him
Speaker 2: in rest Like pause, yeah, yeah, okay, we're fighting it.
Speaker 2: We're fighting it. Let us tell what you guys think.
Speaker 2: Should we be rebooting two Boots or should this autonomous
Speaker 2: being be allowed to make his own decisions and report
Speaker 2: us to the Empire.
Speaker 1: Which is technically what the law says to do. It's
Speaker 1: to be fair, and we doc would say, well, we
Speaker 1: have to let him call.
Speaker 2: You don't have a choice.
Speaker 1: We don't have a choice. We have to let him
Speaker 1: do it. Put that apple back. On the next episode
Speaker 1: of X ray Vision, we're diving into Daredul.
Speaker 3: Two O six and depending Hues Day Black after that's
Speaker 3: This episode of Bye x ray Vision is hosted by
Speaker 3: Jason steps Young and Rosie Knight and is a production
Speaker 3: of iHeart Podcasts.
Speaker 1: Our executive producers are Joel Monique and Aaron Kaufman. Our
Speaker 1: supervising producer is Abusafar. Our producers are Common, Laurent, Dean
Speaker 1: Jonathan and Fay Wack. Our theme song is by Brian Vasquez,
Speaker 1: with alternate theme songs by Aaron Kaufman. Special thanks to
Speaker 1: Soul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman, and Heidi. Our discord moderate,
Speaker 1: though