Speaker 1: There's blessing in the breaking, even if it's just road
Speaker 1: rage as simple as that to maybe losing someone that
Speaker 1: you love. There is no perfect way to heal.
Speaker 2: Hey, everyone, welcome back to On Purpose, to number one
Speaker 2: health podcast in the world. Thanks to each and every
Speaker 2: one of you that come here every week to become happier, healthier,
Speaker 2: and more healed. And you know that. I love sitting
Speaker 2: down with guests who allow us into their lives, who
Speaker 2: allow us into their journeys to understand more, to help
Speaker 2: us not feel alone, to help us feel connected in
Speaker 2: our pain and in our purpose, and to recognize that
Speaker 2: we have so much more in common and that when
Speaker 2: we work together we can truly find the light in
Speaker 2: our lives. Now, today's guest is someone who I believe
Speaker 2: does this with every step, every word, and everything she
Speaker 2: takes on in her life. I've had the fortune of
Speaker 2: getting to know her over the last few years, and
Speaker 2: I can honestly say that not only is she one
Speaker 2: of the most genuine and kind hearted people I know,
Speaker 2: she's also just one of the most loving and soulful
Speaker 2: people who truly wants to change lives. I have to
Speaker 2: start the episode by saying this, I believe today's guest
Speaker 2: is someone who's extremely on purpose. I'm speaking about the
Speaker 2: one and only Selena Gomez, one of the most globally
Speaker 2: and culturally celebrated artists, actors, producers, entrepreneurs, and most importantly,
Speaker 2: I know to her philanthropists of her generation. As a
Speaker 2: recording artist, Selena has sold more than two hundred and
Speaker 2: ten million singles worldwide and as over forty five billion
Speaker 2: global streams. Her upcoming biographical documentary, which I want you
Speaker 2: to go and see, Selena Gomez, My Mind and Me,
Speaker 2: is out right now. I got to see it earlier.
Speaker 2: I'll tell you all about it. And in twenty nineteen,
Speaker 2: Selila launched her beauty line, Rare Beauty, exclusively with Sephora.
Speaker 2: As part of the partnership, Gomez announce the Rare Impact
Speaker 2: Fund pledging to raise This is Outstanding pledging to raise
Speaker 2: one hundred million dollars for mental health services for individuals
Speaker 2: in underserved communities. Philanthropy and activism have been key pillars
Speaker 2: of Selena's career, and she's used her platform to advocate
Speaker 2: for many important causes. Selena has raised millions of dollars
Speaker 2: for charity, including Global Citizen and the Lupus Reatus Research Alliance.
Speaker 2: Please welcome to the show. Selena Gomez, Selena, it is
Speaker 2: so wonderful to be with you.
Speaker 1: That was so nice. I felt very like emotional, and
Speaker 1: I felt so I felt so honored. Thank you for
Speaker 1: saying those kind words.
Speaker 2: I meant every word. I think. Whenever I've sat with you,
Speaker 2: We've always had a conversation about purpose. Ye always had
Speaker 2: a conversation about service, always had a conversation that's reflective.
Speaker 2: But I wanted to start with this because we are
Speaker 2: going to talk about lots of deep and meaningful things today. Yes,
Speaker 2: but I also wanted to start with this because it's
Speaker 2: my first memory of meeting you. And you've you've probably
Speaker 2: forgotten this, but at least for me. Here we go, okay,
Speaker 2: so you'd come over for dinner. There's the first time
Speaker 2: we met, and I remember that we were about to eat.
Speaker 2: My wife had made dinner for us, and we say
Speaker 2: a prayer before we eat. But the prayer is chanted
Speaker 2: and sung somewhat in Sanskrit, which is a language that
Speaker 2: a lot of prayers are in for my practice, and
Speaker 2: I remember having to do it in front of you,
Speaker 2: and then after it's opening my eyes and go I
Speaker 2: just had to sing in front of.
Speaker 3: Actually, do remember.
Speaker 1: You were like, I don't know if I should sing
Speaker 1: in front of you, like please, I thought it was beautiful.
Speaker 1: I thought it was amazing. And also just to say
Speaker 1: the food was incredible. I remember that more than anything.
Speaker 2: I love that well. I wanted to start off by
Speaker 2: just saying to you that I truly believe that this
Speaker 2: documentary is so special. Genuinely, it's powerful, it's inspiring, and
Speaker 2: it's the work that we so deeply need right now.
Speaker 2: And your voice in the conversation, the global conversation around
Speaker 2: well being and mental health is the most powerful voice
Speaker 2: there is. It really is. Thank you, and so when
Speaker 2: you put out a piece like this and you let
Speaker 2: us in, it only strengthens the conversation across the world.
Speaker 2: And that's something that you're doing. So I want to
Speaker 2: just start off by saying that from the bottom of
Speaker 2: my heart, I'm so grateful to you.
Speaker 1: Thank you for saying that. I think that is a
Speaker 1: huge part of why I decided to release it after
Speaker 1: having an internal battle, I mean daily at one point
Speaker 1: maybe I shouldn't do this, Maybe I shouldn't release it,
Speaker 1: and this is too honest, This is too much of
Speaker 1: myself until I realized that ultimately it was meant for
Speaker 1: something bigger. It was just about me, it was about
Speaker 1: other people, and it took a life of its own
Speaker 1: and became what it is now, which I'm still nervous about.
Speaker 1: I'm still anxious about, but I think releasing it is
Speaker 1: a huge healing, a healing process for me, and it's
Speaker 1: me letting go of that version of myself.
Speaker 2: Wow, that's so powerful to hear that. I mean, when
Speaker 2: I hear you say that that, I feel like you're
Speaker 2: one of these people that you serve in order to
Speaker 2: heal and you give in order to let go. And
Speaker 2: that's such a beautiful cycle because I think often we
Speaker 2: think when we're going through things that the more insular
Speaker 2: we go, right, But you're someone who opens up, yeah
Speaker 2: and says, here it is.
Speaker 1: I think, you know, being in moments of my life,
Speaker 1: whether it was my health or personal life, friendships, relationships,
Speaker 1: I feel like giving myself completely to something is just
Speaker 1: the best way I can love. But I never wanted
Speaker 1: the pain that I endured to put some sort of
Speaker 1: guard on myself and armor, if you will, and I
Speaker 1: never I never let that happen because I still believe,
Speaker 1: and I still hope. I hope for love, and I
Speaker 1: hope for healing, and I hope for change, and I
Speaker 1: never want to lose that. Of course, there are days
Speaker 1: where I feel so far away, but I would rather
Speaker 1: continue to get my heart broken than to not feel
Speaker 1: at all.
Speaker 2: That's the greatest sign of strength. I mean, that is
Speaker 2: such a powerful statement. And I think with a statement
Speaker 2: like that, you're encouraging so many people to feel heard.
Speaker 2: I mean, I think most of us feel far away
Speaker 2: from those things, right, and we're scared to admit that.
Speaker 2: I mean, you start the documentary with the promise of
Speaker 2: I'm going to share my darkest secrets. And when I
Speaker 2: heard that, I thought, wow. I was thinking, Selena, what
Speaker 2: was Why is that when we share our doc what
Speaker 2: happens when we share our darker secrets? Not just for you,
Speaker 2: but for any of us? When you're with your friends,
Speaker 2: when you're with your families, Like, what does that do?
Speaker 1: I think at first it's frightening, but I feel like
Speaker 1: if you surround yourself with people who support you and
Speaker 1: love you, you have to be careful with who you share
Speaker 1: your story with. I think that can be dangerous sharing
Speaker 1: something that maybe was really hurtful. Or sharing a story
Speaker 1: about your internal struggles to someone who may not be
Speaker 1: giving you the right advice or guiding you another way
Speaker 1: that will only lead you to more pain is scary.
Speaker 1: So first and foremost, I would say making sure you
Speaker 1: surround yourself with great people, and then I would say,
Speaker 1: learn everything there is to learn once it's out. Once
Speaker 1: you say okay, I'm dealing with depression, then find out
Speaker 1: every single thing you can about what that means. And
Speaker 1: when you have a relationship with depression as opposed to
Speaker 1: allow it to keep sinking and inside of you, it's
Speaker 1: a little bit more freeing. I think. To understand yourself better,
Speaker 1: I want to know what triggers me. I want to
Speaker 1: know why I get depressed, and start asking yourself questions
Speaker 1: to open up yourself instead of you know, it's easier
Speaker 1: so than done, though, I should say, but instead of
Speaker 1: you know, keeping it in, I find that the biggest
Speaker 1: reward is letting it go.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I think there's that statement in the documentary that
Speaker 2: says you said your mom would always say if you're
Speaker 2: afraid of something, learned more about it, and then your
Speaker 2: fear will go away or something. According to those.
Speaker 1: She definitely did that. When I was younger, I lived
Speaker 1: in Texas and we were huge with the tornado scene.
Speaker 1: That was what was happening, and I was terrified. So
Speaker 1: I would bring like a cross, and I'd bring like
Speaker 1: a big pillow and I'd lay in my bathtub because
Speaker 1: that's what I googled is supposedly going to help. And
Speaker 1: my mom would just kind of smile at me. And
Speaker 1: she next day, remember, she got me a bunch of
Speaker 1: books and it was all about thunderstorms and different clouds
Speaker 1: and formations and all this stuff, and she just told me,
Speaker 1: She's like, it's not that scary, you know, it's especially
Speaker 1: when you know that it's just a part of the world.
Speaker 1: And I guess they are still scary, but now I
Speaker 1: understand what happens.
Speaker 2: And yeah, but I love how you're applying that to depression,
Speaker 2: You're applying that to different things in your life.
Speaker 1: I completely agree with. I mean, my favorite thing that
Speaker 1: I say in the documentary is that I have bipolar.
Speaker 1: I just I learn how to live with it and
Speaker 1: I just have made it my friend, because that's truly
Speaker 1: what it can be to me.
Speaker 2: Now, Yeah, and tell us about that process of when
Speaker 2: you first discover something like that. Like you said, it's
Speaker 2: easier so than done. The voices are so loud, there's
Speaker 2: so much inner judgment, you know, are inner critic is
Speaker 2: so painful to live with. And now when you're saying,
Speaker 2: I'm trying to welcome making it a friend, which is
Speaker 2: a beautiful transition, tell us a bit about that journey
Speaker 2: of in a critic to in a friend. Well.
Speaker 1: To be honest, I've been to for treatment centers and
Speaker 1: I have a lot of opinions on you know, rehabs
Speaker 1: if you will, or in places to go. There's a
Speaker 1: lot that I don't agree with. But what I will
Speaker 1: say is throughout all of it learning lessons through dialectical
Speaker 1: behavior therapy or cognitive behavioral therapy, there's something that's always
Speaker 1: been embedded in me throughout all of those different moments
Speaker 1: in my life, and that was always to recognize when
Speaker 1: something was happening to me accepting it. And I think
Speaker 1: once I realized that this was something that wasn't going
Speaker 1: to go away, This wasn't something that was going to
Speaker 1: be fixed by going to these places, it was more so,
Speaker 1: what can I know about myself? Okay? If I kind
Speaker 1: of go down this road, I'm going to get triggered,
Speaker 1: and I know that feeling and I know how to
Speaker 1: avoid it. However, I go to therapy. I also have
Speaker 1: you know, medication that I fully am on that I
Speaker 1: believe in fullheartedly, and it helps me stay balanced. But
Speaker 1: I still have to deal with it, you know. I
Speaker 1: still have days that are pretty low and moments that
Speaker 1: I'm just too over the top and I'm like, I
Speaker 1: want to buy everyone a house and I want to
Speaker 1: save the world. But I just have learned to kind
Speaker 1: of understand it. And the best part about that is
Speaker 1: also my family and friends learning how to live with
Speaker 1: it too. They can be great friends to me in
Speaker 1: that way, and that took a lot of time as well.
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, these are such you know, I know that
Speaker 2: you do so much work in this space, but today
Speaker 2: when I'm hearing you share all these insights and they
Speaker 2: genuinely are insights, they're so powerful because even you just
Speaker 2: saying like I had to realize that I don't have
Speaker 2: to fix it, or that it's not going to go away,
Speaker 2: Like these things make difficult things livable with right, And
Speaker 2: when we look at the seasons or we look at
Speaker 2: the weather, it's like, you know, it's going to rain
Speaker 2: one day, and you know it's going to be dark
Speaker 2: one day, and you know it's going to be sunny
Speaker 2: another day. And when you know that, you stop trying
Speaker 2: to fight it and change it. Yeah, you can accept it,
Speaker 2: which it sounds from what I'm hearing from you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it's taken me a long time. It's
Speaker 1: that's not six years, that's probably ten years in reality.
Speaker 1: But really it's really been interesting, and I feel better
Speaker 1: and I feel great now that I can talk about it.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, the thing you keep mentioning today is letting go.
Speaker 2: And I think all of us are trying to know
Speaker 2: how to let go of old selves, old parts of ourselves,
Speaker 2: or parts that don't serve us anymore. And I remember
Speaker 2: when I lived as a monk, some of the areas
Speaker 2: that we'd live in there were often we'd come across
Speaker 2: a lot of snake skin, and we'd always use snakes
Speaker 2: as an analogy of how we leave behind. So snakes
Speaker 2: don't break out, they don't rip their skin off, they
Speaker 2: slither out, and their skin just kinds of like falls away,
Speaker 2: and then we would naturally not find snakes, thankfully, and
Speaker 2: find the skin. But that analogy always like, really resonated
Speaker 2: with me. The idea that when we're shedding, when we're
Speaker 2: letting go, it's not an aggressive process. How did you
Speaker 2: learn to become compassionate and calmer with yourself because at
Speaker 2: first we can really feel like we're trying to break
Speaker 2: something off.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I tend to blame myself when I
Speaker 1: can't let something go. I feel maybe something is my fault,
Speaker 1: or I should have done more of this or less
Speaker 1: of that, and it starts to become, you know, just
Speaker 1: like a really I kind of turned sad. One thing
Speaker 1: I've noticed when I watched the documentary back for the
Speaker 1: first time, I didn't even recognize that girl anymore. And
Speaker 1: it broke my heart because I was talking about my
Speaker 1: body and my image and I just hate that I
Speaker 1: ever felt those feelings. And I think because I have
Speaker 1: a younger sister, there's been this huge responsibility given to
Speaker 1: me in a way that has helped me. And I
Speaker 1: say this about my fans as well, or people that
Speaker 1: have grown with me. I've almost had to get back
Speaker 1: up every time, more so for them than myself. And
Speaker 1: that's something I've learned to really understand. It's healthy to
Speaker 1: want to be strong for other people, but I needed
Speaker 1: to recognize I needed to be strong for myself. And
Speaker 1: that took a while, and it took things like making
Speaker 1: myself uncomfortable and changing my my thought process, changing the
Speaker 1: things I watch on TV, changing the music I'm listening to,
Speaker 1: little things that I can adjust that will perhaps change
Speaker 1: my mood or make me feel better instead of worse.
Speaker 2: You know, it is some of these small things, isn't it.
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, I love scary movies, but I can't
Speaker 1: watch them all the time. I'm like happy, and I'm like, guys,
Speaker 1: let's watch a scary movie everyone, So why why on
Speaker 1: earth do you want to do that right now? And
Speaker 1: you're kind of like, yeah, you're right.
Speaker 2: Do they manage to persuade you?
Speaker 1: Yeah, most of the time. But it was Halloween, so
Speaker 1: I got by way for a few weeks.
Speaker 2: You did what did you end up? What? Oh?
Speaker 1: We watched Halloween. We watched Freddy Krueger Nightmare on Elm Street.
Speaker 2: Which one ruins your mood the worst? Like?
Speaker 1: Which one makes oh my goodness, probably like hereditary, something
Speaker 1: really dark? But it was it was fun. It was Halloween.
Speaker 1: We were just celebrating.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I always call it Cliffhanger chemicals. Oh yeah. I
Speaker 2: feel like when we watch things that put us in
Speaker 2: the states of anxiety, yeah, or stress, we release all
Speaker 2: these Cliffhanger chemeras and now you're like, well, why can't
Speaker 2: I sleep? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Exactly, why am I having.
Speaker 2: Rather these like that? So my wife's like that, h
Speaker 2: she can't. I have to. She always gets really excited
Speaker 2: to watch things like that. Yeah, I'm like, Raley, we
Speaker 2: can't do this because you would not let me sleep
Speaker 2: for the rest of the night. So funny. Yeah, but
Speaker 2: I think it's really beautiful to hear you said there's
Speaker 2: these little changes, because I think that's what people feel
Speaker 2: hardest to change. And I think when I watched the documentary,
Speaker 2: the greatest challenge you really empathize with is having to
Speaker 2: do this when every time you're in a car, and
Speaker 2: then every time you get out the car, there's cameras,
Speaker 2: there's people, there's opinions, there's you know, that's something very
Speaker 2: few people can relate to. But I think what's so
Speaker 2: brilliant about how the documentary's made is that you really
Speaker 2: feel like we're living that with you. Yeah, and so
Speaker 2: you're like, wow, even though I can't relate to what
Speaker 2: Selina is going through. I can understand how it must
Speaker 2: be really challenging and really stressful. And so what's it
Speaker 2: like having to deal with all of this that all
Speaker 2: of us are dealing with too, but you're dealing with
Speaker 2: it with an added layer of you know, exposure.
Speaker 1: Yeah. To be honest, I don't know any different. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's what's really scary. Sometimes I think that's really sad,
Speaker 1: and other times I just think, well, this is what
Speaker 1: I've been given, and this is the path that I
Speaker 1: want to continue to walk in. And I know any
Speaker 1: moment I can, you know, quit and walk away. And
Speaker 1: you know, that's just not really how I was raised
Speaker 1: to be. So maybe if it had happened to me
Speaker 1: later in life, I would have had a different outcome.
Speaker 1: But because I was raised in and I really had
Speaker 1: to learn learn the hard way and how to deal
Speaker 1: with it, on how to not give if you will,
Speaker 1: that click bait that people want. And I mean I
Speaker 1: think I do. I do my best to try and
Speaker 1: eliminate these negative stories or this or other people illustrating
Speaker 1: my journey. It just I interrupt them with my truth.
Speaker 1: And that's what I will always continue to do. And
Speaker 1: that's what this documentary does as well. It's going to
Speaker 1: be me taking control of my story and no one
Speaker 1: can change that or say any different.
Speaker 2: I actually, I'm so glad you addressed that because I've
Speaker 2: always found that with you, that you always lead with love,
Speaker 2: even in those areas, and I always am so in
Speaker 2: admiration of that and in awe of that because I
Speaker 2: see that whenever there's a narrative, that, whenever there's any narrative,
Speaker 2: your choice will always be the lead with love and
Speaker 2: inject love into that and to recaliber. When did you
Speaker 2: find the strength to start taking control of that narrative,
Speaker 2: because I think that's an amazing skill that today people
Speaker 2: need it more than ever. But yeah, when did you
Speaker 2: start developing the confidence around that needing to do that?
Speaker 1: I would probably say I started beginning to gain that
Speaker 1: confidence when I went through a breakup, and that's something
Speaker 1: that was super public, But all of those things that
Speaker 1: I had felt so bad about myself and just so
Speaker 1: terrible every day, I wanted to debunk those feelings. I
Speaker 1: wanted to take control over that narrative because I did
Speaker 1: feel that way. But the greatest gift I got from
Speaker 1: all of that was me actually being honest with people,
Speaker 1: sharing my story and gaining the confidence to know I
Speaker 1: am enough and I actually work really hard at being
Speaker 1: a good person, and I know I'm a great person,
Speaker 1: and when people paint these unnecessary stories, it actually gives
Speaker 1: me pleasure to just combat it with love, like you said,
Speaker 1: or kindness.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: I think it's it's actually fun for me because it's
Speaker 1: it is who I am. I don't I can't waste
Speaker 1: my time if I'm to be honest with everyone in
Speaker 1: this room, I don't want to waste my time being
Speaker 1: upset or taking in all of the negative things that
Speaker 1: I hear online. And I don't even hear it. It's
Speaker 1: it's just what it gets really bad other people tell me.
Speaker 1: And then I see in humane things happening and people
Speaker 1: talking negatively about other women, and it just drives me
Speaker 1: absolutely crazy. And I think I'll just always be that
Speaker 1: kind of person. And I would say I'm grateful for
Speaker 1: my past because it's made me a lot stronger.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, I want I want you to know that,
Speaker 2: you know, we we see you for that like it
Speaker 2: is it is. Whenever you do that, I am completely
Speaker 2: mind blown because it requires so much self assurance. It
Speaker 2: requires so much commitment to your truth and then also
Speaker 2: for for everyone else. So thank you so much for
Speaker 2: leading the way even in that like other thing like no,
Speaker 2: it's so hard to do, it's so easy to it's
Speaker 2: so easy to be defensive. And you've found because it's
Speaker 2: your truth, you've found a way of sharing your truth
Speaker 2: without making it defensive.
Speaker 1: Of course, that's I mean, thank you. I don't know
Speaker 1: if I intentionally do it, but it works really well.
Speaker 2: So I'm sticking to it. Yeah, stick to it, don't
Speaker 2: don't change it, Teach it exactly, teach it the new masterclass. Yeah. No,
Speaker 2: I genuinely mean that, genuinely that. Hey everyone, it's j
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Speaker 2: Purpose podcast live and in person. Join me in a
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Speaker 2: One of the things that comes through in the documentary
Speaker 2: is we're just getting full access, Like that's what it feels,
Speaker 2: right like full access at all times, and we get
Speaker 2: to see all of your relationships, and you get to
Speaker 2: see the relationships that are long term, you get newer relationships,
Speaker 2: you get all these different people who are interacting with you,
Speaker 2: and they're interacting with you in every element, Like we
Speaker 2: get to see you straight after an interview, straight before
Speaker 2: an interview, and I could tell there was a time
Speaker 2: when you feel a bit of angst because you get
Speaker 2: asked poor questions or like you know, and I could
Speaker 2: see that in you, and that really hit me because
Speaker 2: the reason we set up this conversation, this podcast in
Speaker 2: the first place was I was hoping that it would
Speaker 2: be a place where people like yourself could share your
Speaker 2: true purpose and seeing you share on screen just how
Speaker 2: hard it can be to deal with, just does it
Speaker 2: minimize the work you're trying to do. What happens? Tell
Speaker 2: me what happens when you're asked?
Speaker 1: I actually just feel it like insulted. Sometimes I sit
Speaker 1: in what I work. I mean, I work so hard.
Speaker 1: I love what I do. I love my job. I
Speaker 1: love talking about my job. There's different facets of my
Speaker 1: job that I love talking about for different reasons. And
Speaker 1: when I sit down and I have to do press
Speaker 1: from you know, starting at eight a m. Till you know,
Speaker 1: whenever the night ends, it's frustrating. You want to spend
Speaker 1: that time talking about meaningful, meaningful moments. And I just
Speaker 1: I wanted that to be in the documentary because I
Speaker 1: felt like, I know that a lot of artists, maybe
Speaker 1: not everyone, but I know a lot of artists and
Speaker 1: people in my position feel that way. And I hope
Speaker 1: that it will only you know, maybe shift that a
Speaker 1: bit and maybe stop asking people what word you associate
Speaker 1: with marshmallow, and maybe ask them how they're doing, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe just having a bit of an inspiration to do
Speaker 1: more and be better and Yeah, it actually is pretty
Speaker 1: crazy because that happens.
Speaker 3: It's weird.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it is really weird. Yeah, and it's interesting because
Speaker 2: I feel like there's such a trend that's been created
Speaker 2: about asking people clickbaity buzzy, you know, moment questions, and
Speaker 2: then you think, well, but this is a human totally
Speaker 2: with emotions and ideas and views, and I think often
Speaker 2: people think, oh, well, I've only got them for ten minutes,
Speaker 2: I better ask them all this stuff, but you forget
Speaker 2: that there's a whole person behind that. The documentarily humanizes you.
Speaker 2: What parts of you did? You really want people to
Speaker 2: understand better or see more that you think they haven't
Speaker 2: been able to see over time.
Speaker 1: Just I guess where I was meant to be In
Speaker 1: the beginning, it really made me kind of sad. I
Speaker 1: wanted it to be a documentary that was really fun
Speaker 1: and about me doing this big tour, and instead I
Speaker 1: felt so bad because we were filming these really intense
Speaker 1: moments and then I had to stop filming. And I
Speaker 1: think I really ultimately wanted people to realize that I'm
Speaker 1: not really that put together. I can be, and I
Speaker 1: feel much better now, but I don't want people to
Speaker 1: ever look at me and think she has it all
Speaker 1: and she's figured it out and she is is, you know,
Speaker 1: perfect or whatever. I hope no one thinks that, But
Speaker 1: I just don't ever want to be that kind of
Speaker 1: public figure. I want to be someone that hopefully could
Speaker 1: be a friend, that could just disarm you from the
Speaker 1: celebrity esque part of it. I just want to be
Speaker 1: someone that people can genuinely walk up to it and say, hey,
Speaker 1: I kind of I understand what you walk through. I
Speaker 1: did too, and have a conversation with.
Speaker 2: Yeah, why is that important? Why do you think it's
Speaker 2: important that. I guess for a long time your people
Speaker 2: did consider celebrity to be perfect, or maybe it was
Speaker 2: portrayed that way. Sometimes maybe it wasn't. But why do
Speaker 2: you think it's important for people to see that no
Speaker 2: one in the world, including me, anyone we're talking about,
Speaker 2: there's no one who's perfect. But why is that so important?
Speaker 1: It's important to me because I felt like I had
Speaker 1: to be when I was you know, when I was
Speaker 1: going through relationships, I felt like I had to be
Speaker 1: a certain way. That's why in twenty sixteen, I was
Speaker 1: talking about my body and talking about my appearance and
Speaker 1: talking about how Oh, everyone's going to see me as
Speaker 1: this Disney kid. No one's going to take me seriously
Speaker 1: all of those moments. That's kind of where Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: where all the confusion came from for me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, no, that does make sense. That's a really
Speaker 2: fascinating answer, because yeah, it's almost like you've had to
Speaker 2: live that way. Yeah, and then you're kind of unpacking
Speaker 2: it for everyone and breaking down that image that's created.
Speaker 2: And I think that definitely comes across one of the
Speaker 2: things that stood out to me in that unpacking of
Speaker 2: the perfection element that you're talking about. We're so scared
Speaker 2: of imperfection because it reveals there's parts of us that
Speaker 2: are not ideal by some external comparison or by some
Speaker 2: internal trigger or some past experience where we we have
Speaker 2: that feeling. How do you now deal with your imperfections, Like,
Speaker 2: how do you feel about parts of you that are
Speaker 2: not perfect?
Speaker 1: I'm okay with that. I actually think a lot of
Speaker 1: who I am are just a few things that are
Speaker 1: not perfect, even down to my laugh. Sometimes I used
Speaker 1: to be insecure about my laugh, or you know the
Speaker 1: fact that I'll always talk during a movie, or you know,
Speaker 1: I always do something minuscule, and I think little things
Speaker 1: like that make me happy because I feel like everybody
Speaker 1: else in the world, you know, recent for example, a
Speaker 1: very small example, but Halloween, I was a banana and
Speaker 1: I and I genuinely just like got the cheapest outfit,
Speaker 1: put it on and roam around Times Square with my
Speaker 1: friends and have the best time. And everyone kept sending
Speaker 1: me these memes because every everybody else kind of went
Speaker 1: all out and maybe I could have painted my face
Speaker 1: and done a little more, but everyone looked really sexy
Speaker 1: and fun and literally I was a banana. That's basically
Speaker 1: sums up who I am to a tea and it
Speaker 1: was that to me means that I don't have to
Speaker 1: be perfect all the time.
Speaker 3: I'd rather be that girl.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And how does that apply to work? Like, how
Speaker 2: does that perfectionist mindset work in terms of like music
Speaker 2: or creation or acting? Like, because that's beautiful in your
Speaker 2: personal life. It sounds like there's this acceptance of you know,
Speaker 2: we can be yeah, we can be more inflow. But
Speaker 2: then how does that apply to like writing or creating
Speaker 2: or building?
Speaker 1: Like, well, I think how I I don't Well, I
Speaker 1: always say this in any session, there are no stupid questions.
Speaker 1: I always have to say that out loud, because sometimes
Speaker 1: I genuinely will think, well, what does this mean? And
Speaker 1: how can I unpack this and create a song from this?
Speaker 1: Or how do I unpack this scene and do the
Speaker 1: best I can? You know, there are mistakes that happen
Speaker 1: in the studio and on set that actually end up
Speaker 1: becoming a part of it. You know, me messing up
Speaker 1: a line actually ended up being funny and we kept
Speaker 1: it in the show. Or you know, there's something I
Speaker 1: said in a lyric that was wrong and it ends
Speaker 1: up being the biggest hook that we've got. And I
Speaker 1: look for those moments, Yeah, crave I crave those moments.
Speaker 2: That's a great example. I love all of those. Yeah,
Speaker 2: And that's what feels like magic, right. It's when the
Speaker 2: imperfection can somehow become a part of the process where
Speaker 2: you're just like, wow, this actually feels like we got somewhere.
Speaker 2: And so I think when we start I love that
Speaker 2: idea applied both personally and professionally, because I think even
Speaker 2: the parts of ourselves that we consider to be imperfect,
Speaker 2: the parts of ourselves that we consider to be broken,
Speaker 2: when you start seeing use in those when you start
Speaker 2: seeing purpose.
Speaker 1: In those I always say that there's blessing in the
Speaker 1: breaking and every moment that you encounter in your life,
Speaker 1: even if it's just road rage as simple as that,
Speaker 1: to maybe losing someone that you love. There is no
Speaker 1: perfect way to heal, there's no perfect way of dealing
Speaker 1: with something. It's more just how am I going to
Speaker 1: be a better person? How am I going to make
Speaker 1: the best choice for myself so that I don't end
Speaker 1: up angry at that person on the highway, so that
Speaker 1: I don't end up ruining my day because of what
Speaker 1: someone to me on the four h five. You know,
Speaker 1: I want to also say that how can I turn
Speaker 1: something like losing someone I so dearly love into well,
Speaker 1: how can I celebrate that person and the great things
Speaker 1: that they're that they provided me or that they gave me.
Speaker 1: That takes a lot of work, So I don't say
Speaker 1: that lightly, but I try my hardest to do that,
Speaker 1: and I try to have my friends hold me accountable
Speaker 1: to reminding me, hey, let's try to flip this and
Speaker 1: try to turn it into something else.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I think what what I'm gathering from
Speaker 2: listening to you is that again, it's you're not saying
Speaker 2: I've arrived, and this is how I think. Now you're saying,
Speaker 2: this is what I'm trying to practice, Like, this is
Speaker 2: the this is the approach that I'm mining in my
Speaker 2: own life.
Speaker 1: And absolutely this is practice. Every day is practice. I
Speaker 1: even said it last night at the premiere. I was saying,
Speaker 1: I don't I don't have anything out. I'm definitely not
Speaker 1: like I'm sold, I'm good. It's it's more just this
Speaker 1: is a continuation. My story is not done, and I
Speaker 1: can't wait to find out what's going to happen next.
Speaker 1: And doesn't mean it's going to be easy and sure
Speaker 1: there's going to be bumps that happen, but I'm going
Speaker 1: to learn how to live with them.
Speaker 2: Yeah, as someone who's so committed to moving forward, what
Speaker 2: did it feel like going back to like your school
Speaker 2: and all these old places. I won't give away too
Speaker 2: anybody in the documentary, you go visit, what does that
Speaker 2: do well?
Speaker 1: Going home is like to me, it's it's untainted territory.
Speaker 1: It is safe, it is simple and kind. Where I'm from,
Speaker 1: it is all about you know, being together, loving each other.
Speaker 1: I go home and people are like, welcome home, Miss Gomez.
Speaker 1: They're not you know, treating me any differently. And I
Speaker 1: enjoy and I enjoy visiting you know what made me
Speaker 1: who I am, and it always gives me a good
Speaker 1: sense of like, Oh, I hope I can inspire people
Speaker 1: from where I'm from, because there's not a lot to
Speaker 1: do where I'm from, but I hope I can inspire
Speaker 1: just one person to do something bigger than that.
Speaker 2: Was there any particular place that you went back there
Speaker 2: almost gave you a special feeling or something surprised you
Speaker 2: that you're like, oh, I didn't think this was gonna be.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, my snow cone place, I really I loved
Speaker 1: that place. I would go with my dad all the
Speaker 1: time and my cousin and we would get the pickle
Speaker 1: snow cones with like you know, grape in it, and
Speaker 1: it would just be so yummy and amazing, and it just,
Speaker 1: you know, brought me back to when it would be
Speaker 1: so hot in Texas and I was with my family
Speaker 1: and we would just stop there and sit outside for
Speaker 1: an hour and just talk and it was just the best.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I love that. Yeah, that's that's great to hear.
Speaker 2: I think there's always I have this park in my hometown.
Speaker 2: It's called Broomfield Park, and it's it's still charming to me,
Speaker 2: even though I don't think if anyone else went, I know,
Speaker 2: but when I go back, I know where I used
Speaker 2: to go and buy my my ice cream from, and
Speaker 2: you know where the truck would be, and there's there's
Speaker 2: all these special moments that you that almost but it
Speaker 2: sounds like again like it sounds like it's not like
Speaker 2: you're like, oh, I missed that. It's almost like that
Speaker 2: was a part of me and it's a beautiful thing.
Speaker 2: But now I'm happy to be new. And even today
Speaker 2: when we were just walking over here and we were
Speaker 2: talking about just you finding places that fuel you. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and it seems like you've become open to saying okay,
Speaker 2: it's okay that life is changing and transitioning, and there's
Speaker 2: new places that feel more like home than old places.
Speaker 1: I hate change, I really do. But I felt in
Speaker 1: the past year, which is pretty just it's pretty new,
Speaker 1: I have really really embraced the uncomfortableness of change. And
Speaker 1: I think it's because I get so exhausted of the
Speaker 1: same thing over and over again and it scares me.
Speaker 1: But I did learn that my world can be bigger
Speaker 1: by being in a different destination. I work on my
Speaker 1: show Only Murders in the building. It's in New York
Speaker 1: where I shoot, and I never I've never spent more
Speaker 1: than a week or two in New York, and I'm
Speaker 1: there for months. And just that alone was an uncomfortable,
Speaker 1: you know, experience, But I loved it, and I loved
Speaker 1: the friendships I made and the knowledge that I was gaining,
Speaker 1: the people I was around the park and walking, and
Speaker 1: just how like precious life is. It's celebrated, there's culture.
Speaker 1: It just becomes addicting to want to put yourself in
Speaker 1: these situations and see what happens. So I will say,
Speaker 1: in the past year, I've felt more comfortable with change,
Speaker 1: and I'm grateful for it, and I just I'm going
Speaker 1: to continue to do that. I want that.
Speaker 2: How did you get comfortable with that discomfort? I guess
Speaker 2: in the first place, if you're someone who said, you know,
Speaker 2: like hated change, didn't like change, what I guess obviously
Speaker 2: naturally work and everything like that, But was there something
Speaker 2: internally where you're like, Okay, now I need to because
Speaker 2: you've done this, You've done uncomfortable things your whole life, right, Definitely,
Speaker 2: like you've had to do so many difficult things, whether
Speaker 2: it's going on tour when you're young or transitioning careers,
Speaker 2: You've constantly done uncomfortable things.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I think I had always kind of returned
Speaker 1: to the same behavior and the same pattern of maybe, well,
Speaker 1: I'm nervous of going out because I don't want to
Speaker 1: be seen today, or I'm going to just stay in
Speaker 1: because I feel anxious, or I don't want to go
Speaker 1: out to that event because I don't want to get seen.
Speaker 1: It just I was I was finding my self just
Speaker 1: being terrified of the world, and that just isn't a
Speaker 1: way of living. And it's easy to go do a
Speaker 1: job because well, I'm with a bunch of people. They
Speaker 1: helped me look good. I do my job, I smile,
Speaker 1: and I'm done. But taking spontaneous trips or you know,
Speaker 1: getting out and going to the Balboa Park, which is
Speaker 1: a very simple park, just doing that kind of stuff
Speaker 1: is necessary. And I noticed that New York really helped me.
Speaker 1: It just really opened me up. The show is really great,
Speaker 1: and I think being around a bunch of New Yorkers
Speaker 1: it does something to you. Man, It's good.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, one of the biggest changes in atmosphere that
Speaker 2: you talk about the documentary is you go to Africa, right,
Speaker 2: and that's a that's a big change, definitely, you know,
Speaker 2: even if it's a shorter period of time, but you
Speaker 2: were still there for a.
Speaker 1: There for a week, yes, but I mean that definitely
Speaker 1: wasn't the first time that I had taken trips in
Speaker 1: the vein of wanting to go for a mission. And
Speaker 1: it was one of the most beautiful moments of the
Speaker 1: film for me because we actually thought we were just
Speaker 1: going to make a quick little video about you know,
Speaker 1: what we were there to do, and then we fell
Speaker 1: in love with the people, We fell in love with
Speaker 1: the story, and we started noticing that everywhere in the
Speaker 1: world mental health is very, very real. It's very much
Speaker 1: something that's affecting everyone. And then you kind of realize
Speaker 1: that the world is a small place sometimes because you're
Speaker 1: all kind of walking through pain and you're all looking
Speaker 1: at things in a different way, but ultimately you all
Speaker 1: want to be happy. And I felt like they inspired
Speaker 1: me more than I could have done anything for them.
Speaker 1: It was a really beautiful trip, and yeah, it was
Speaker 1: one of my favorite moments of the film.
Speaker 2: People don't always understand how mental health exists ever in
Speaker 2: the world. When you said that they're also experiencing mental health,
Speaker 2: what was their experience of it compared to what we
Speaker 2: would understand is our experience in the US.
Speaker 1: So yeah, Well, I was talking to a woman named
Speaker 1: Betty and she was, you know, basically kind of the
Speaker 1: person touring giving us the tour around the village and
Speaker 1: the schools, and she was lovely. But when we stopped
Speaker 1: to have a conversation, we just were sitting down and
Speaker 1: she told me her story and how she was dealing
Speaker 1: with suicidal thoughts and not how she went to a
Speaker 1: lake and sat there for two weeks contemplating, not a
Speaker 1: day or an hour of moment, it was two weeks.
Speaker 1: And that was something that I felt floored by because
Speaker 1: that's different. Obviously we can have those thoughts, but she
Speaker 1: dismissed herself from everyone, and she had to find it
Speaker 1: with herself when so many people don't need to walk
Speaker 1: through that alone. But she did, and she did it well,
Speaker 1: and she's proud of it. And now she is in
Speaker 1: an incredible school and she is going to grow up
Speaker 1: to be the best influence for her village, for her sisters,
Speaker 1: for everyone that she's around. That's so so special, and
Speaker 1: I'm just having those conversations as someone from across the world.
Speaker 1: It's mind blowing. You don't really know what people are
Speaker 1: walking through until you do stop and have a conversation
Speaker 1: two weeks that I can't imagine that feeling what you
Speaker 1: must be walking through for two weeks to just be
Speaker 1: sitting there.
Speaker 2: And did she feel the same from your deeper conversation
Speaker 2: with her, did she feel the same feeling that a
Speaker 2: lot of people do here where it's like I don't
Speaker 2: know who to talk to and I don't know a
Speaker 2: dono to trust.
Speaker 1: She thought that she needed to be everything for her family,
Speaker 1: and she felt like she was letting them down, the
Speaker 1: same thing of not feeling good enough, not feeling like
Speaker 1: her being there would even be helpful. And you do
Speaker 1: find the similarities in it, and that's how I felt
Speaker 1: like I bonded with her.
Speaker 2: It's incredible, right a cross culture, cross world, to have
Speaker 2: a human moment like that with someone. What purpose of
Speaker 2: those missions played in your life in terms of, like
Speaker 2: you said, this is not the first time you've been out,
Speaker 2: and I'm sure it's not the last as well. It's
Speaker 2: something that you want to continue to do. I mean,
Speaker 2: there was a moment in the documentary where you don't
Speaker 2: want to leave.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't think I necessarily will always be broadcasting
Speaker 1: when I'm taking these trips or wanting to do more
Speaker 1: and help and travel. So I think that I will
Speaker 1: probably have these quarterly or even just maybe once a year.
Speaker 1: I kind of have to set time apart for that,
Speaker 1: and I make it a priority just because I feel
Speaker 1: personally that everyone is my brother and sister. We're all
Speaker 1: here together, living being and you know, wanting to navigate
Speaker 1: life together. And I want to continue to travel the
Speaker 1: world and be able to spread some sort of message
Speaker 1: or bring change in some form. I don't know something,
Speaker 1: you know. I want to be able to continue to
Speaker 1: always do something, and eventually, I do believe my life
Speaker 1: will We'll end up being something along the lines of
Speaker 1: doing the things that you do. You know, I got
Speaker 1: a few more things to do first, but eventually, yes, well.
Speaker 2: You're already doing them. You know, you're already doing them.
Speaker 2: And yeah, there's that moment. There's the moment in the documentary.
Speaker 2: I think you're asked through a mirror envelope question, what
Speaker 2: is the what is your greatest dream or your ultimate dream,
Speaker 2: I think is the word, and this is exactly where
Speaker 2: you say. You say, I want to find a way
Speaker 2: to change lives, and I want to find a way
Speaker 2: to impact lives. And I think when people think of
Speaker 2: their ultimate dream, that's not the natural thing that comes
Speaker 2: to their mind. When did serving When did helping others
Speaker 2: become such a big understanding others as well? Because it's
Speaker 2: not just I know you feel you're growing from these experiences.
Speaker 2: When did that become an ultimate dream? Like when did that? Yea,
Speaker 2: what was your dream as a little girl? And then
Speaker 2: you know, how did that evolve?
Speaker 1: I think that I was just I was just going
Speaker 1: to say my mom, I mean, from a very young age,
Speaker 1: we didn't have a lot, but it didn't matter. It
Speaker 1: was every Thanksgiving we were going to you know, we
Speaker 1: would go and help out in soup kitchens and my
Speaker 1: mom would talk to me about, you know, why we
Speaker 1: were there and explain to me the way of the world,
Speaker 1: and we would, you know, see really hard things and
Speaker 1: Texas you know, can be very you know, very conservative,
Speaker 1: and my mom would just break those barriers for me
Speaker 1: and explain to me how beautiful people are and how
Speaker 1: complicated and complex things are. About the world. She never
Speaker 1: protected me in a way of not showing me the
Speaker 1: bad things. She showed me everything. And that's what has
Speaker 1: always been a part of my life. I mean down
Speaker 1: to I'd be on set and I'd be talking to
Speaker 1: the director and someone would come give me a water,
Speaker 1: and if my mom noticed that he didn't say thank you,
Speaker 1: she would just remind me gently in a way that
Speaker 1: was like, hey, next time, be aware and be thankful.
Speaker 1: And it's kind of like, oh, yeah, you're right, sorry, Mom,
Speaker 1: but you're right, you are. You got to be aware
Speaker 1: of people, and you have to be aware of what
Speaker 1: people are walking through.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that's such a yeah, yeah no, And
Speaker 2: it's such a I think that's such a beautiful message
Speaker 2: to anyone who is growing up with a little bit
Speaker 2: more in terms of anyone who's grown up even you know,
Speaker 2: everyone goes through so many difficult things. But I felt
Speaker 2: the same when I first went to India. I was
Speaker 2: around nine years old when I first went to India,
Speaker 2: and I remember we didn't have a lot growing up,
Speaker 2: but we were still traveling to India. We were in
Speaker 2: a car and you look out the window and you
Speaker 2: see kids your age. I remember you know, just seeing
Speaker 2: tons of kids my age on the streets and just
Speaker 2: it was just, yeah, it just made me aware that
Speaker 2: there was a whole other world out there of experience
Speaker 2: that I only learned about later on. Yeah, but I
Speaker 2: can agree with you more that when you feel like
Speaker 2: you're a part, even a small part of the solution,
Speaker 2: the problem starts to feel more within reach, right. And
Speaker 2: I feel like sometimes when we pushed the problem away,
Speaker 2: try and keep it out of sight, it just feels
Speaker 2: bigger and harder and more difficult.
Speaker 1: Absolutely ignoring it is not fun. I've done that before.
Speaker 1: It just you end up coping in ways that you
Speaker 1: never thought that you would, and you end up feeling
Speaker 1: disappointed because you just you don't want to ever feel
Speaker 1: like you're doing the wrong thing. I believe that everyone
Speaker 1: deep down knows what's right and what's wrong. And when
Speaker 1: you're at your rock bottom, if you will, because I
Speaker 1: believe that everybody does eventually have one of those moments.
Speaker 1: Hopefully it's just going to get lighter and lighter because
Speaker 1: you can start to attack it in a way where
Speaker 1: how do I approach this and figure out how to
Speaker 1: get myself out of this state of mind? And I've
Speaker 1: learned how to do that in the past few years,
Speaker 1: and I'm really grateful for it. It's a choice sometimes.
Speaker 1: But then I also hate when people say that, because
Speaker 1: sometimes I genuinely wake up in a depressive state and
Speaker 1: I can't get out of bed. But I allow myself
Speaker 1: to have that day and just focus on things that
Speaker 1: can make me feel better instead of pushing it away
Speaker 1: and saying, no, it's fine, I'm going to go out,
Speaker 1: I'm going to go do something, I'm going to go
Speaker 1: get my adrenaline up. I'm going to ignore it and
Speaker 1: ignore it and ignore it. It doesn't help at all.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you just said there that everyone goes through
Speaker 2: a rock bottom moment, Like everyone goes through that in
Speaker 2: their life in different ways. How have you become more
Speaker 2: mindful of your fears and rock bottoms? Because I think
Speaker 2: often we ask people like I look at your life
Speaker 2: and I think you've You've gone through so many difficult things,
Speaker 2: and you know, how do you deal with fears now?
Speaker 2: Because we all still have fears, we all still have worries.
Speaker 2: But I feel like you've found a way to become
Speaker 2: mindful of those things and become a bit more prepared
Speaker 2: for them.
Speaker 1: Well, thank you. I think maybe you are seeing a
Speaker 1: good side of me, because I have the hardest time
Speaker 1: doing it.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 1: My fears are relatively you know, they're quieter. Maybe I
Speaker 1: should say, you know, like for example, this documentary coming out,
Speaker 1: I am still nervous. I'm nervous for the reaction, even
Speaker 1: though I know that I have good intentions behind it.
Speaker 1: I think that I just have to understand that my
Speaker 1: fears are only going to continue to show me what
Speaker 1: I'm capable of. The more that I face my fears,
Speaker 1: the more that I feel I'm gaining strength, I'm gaining wisdom,
Speaker 1: and I just want to keep doing that. And I
Speaker 1: just hope to get better, hope to get smarter. I
Speaker 1: hope to become stronger and be a great person.
Speaker 2: Yeah that's I mean, that's a phenomenal answer. And it's yeah,
Speaker 2: I don't think i'm seeing the I don't think it's
Speaker 2: a good side of you. Cele I think I'm I'm
Speaker 2: like you. I think you know, I I don't think
Speaker 2: it's a good side because I don't believe you have
Speaker 2: a bad side. And and but I but I think
Speaker 2: it's a it's your truth that we're seeing, you know,
Speaker 2: it's it's it's this, it's the it's the essence of
Speaker 2: us that I'm trying to see in you and myself,
Speaker 2: in my anyone around me, anyone I meet, whoever you
Speaker 2: bump into. It's like when you see someone's essence, that
Speaker 2: essence is pure and is genuine. It is like strong
Speaker 2: and powerful and capable, and it's the Everything else is
Speaker 2: not a side of us. It's just stuff that covers
Speaker 2: us up right, right, Like doesn't it feel that way?
Speaker 3: Like you're absolutely right?
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like I feel like I don't have a we
Speaker 2: don't have a I don't have a side of me
Speaker 2: that I don't like. I have stuff that's covering over
Speaker 2: who I really am exactly.
Speaker 1: And it's how to how do you navigate controlling those
Speaker 1: things and in control of your yourself?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, And I love what you just said about
Speaker 2: how confronting your fears is what gives you a sense
Speaker 2: of confidence and strength, because when you get through something.
Speaker 1: Tough, it does it feels incredible. I mean, walking through
Speaker 1: all of those moments that I'm sharing with everybody else,
Speaker 1: it is really great. I Mean it's so sad to watch,
Speaker 1: but I would not be who I am. Of course,
Speaker 1: it's such a cliche if it wasn't for that, But
Speaker 1: facing your fears and tackling them it's the only way
Speaker 1: to get through them.
Speaker 2: I feel, yeah, you said intention is so important there,
Speaker 2: and I think that anyone who's in the public eye
Speaker 2: sometimes all you have is your intention because you can't
Speaker 2: control anything else. Yeah, what role is intention played in
Speaker 2: your life? And then with this work more clearly, what
Speaker 2: is your intention for everyone who's going to watch it? Like,
Speaker 2: what is your hope and wish for the different people
Speaker 2: that will see it? But first of all, what role
Speaker 2: is intention played in your life? Especially as things have
Speaker 2: continued to grow?
Speaker 1: You know, I think maybe in the past five years,
Speaker 1: I felt like projects I was a part of, even endorsements,
Speaker 1: something like that, the intention behind me being a part
Speaker 1: of anything needed to be good. If I did, if
Speaker 1: I got a lot of money, and I'm just being
Speaker 1: super transparent from doing this line for a T shirt
Speaker 1: and I'm just making this up, there's a huge part
Speaker 1: of me that actually feels uncomfortable with the whole idea,
Speaker 1: and that's just me. I have to think, Okay, this
Speaker 1: is thank you, but I need to figure out how
Speaker 1: this is also not going to be just about me.
Speaker 1: It's going to be about everyone that's involved in this.
Speaker 1: How can I turn it into to, hey, we're going
Speaker 1: to do some percentages to this, and this is how
Speaker 1: we're going to do the deal. I then feel more
Speaker 1: comfortable stepping into a situation and accepting it. But I've
Speaker 1: never based my decisions on what will get me to
Speaker 1: the top quicker, what will make me number one? Will
Speaker 1: I break records? All of those things to me are
Speaker 1: just bonuses. They're just great if it happens, it happens
Speaker 1: that way. But that's never been my intention. And some
Speaker 1: people in my position would think that's kind of stupid.
Speaker 1: You know, it's the whole point of doing it is
Speaker 1: to break these records, is to do all that stuff.
Speaker 1: But for me, and I think the reason why I
Speaker 1: am who I am is because just enough is what
Speaker 1: I am. I think that I just want to be
Speaker 1: enough and that doesn't have to be me killing myself
Speaker 1: trying to be number one at something or striving to
Speaker 1: be number one for something. It's exhausting.
Speaker 2: How do you define being just enough? Now? Like? What
Speaker 2: is that evolved? And I'm sure it will change and
Speaker 2: I'm sure, bro, But right now, what is that I.
Speaker 1: Feel, you know, I feel open, I feel ready for
Speaker 1: relationships and change. I will be shooting season three, so
Speaker 1: I'll be in New York for quite a bit and
Speaker 1: I can't wait to see what will happen and all
Speaker 1: the people will meet and all the people I get
Speaker 1: to spend time with again, like Steven Marty, and it'll
Speaker 1: be fun.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I love that. Well, Selena, this has been such
Speaker 2: a beautiful conversation. And the good thing is we don't
Speaker 2: have to end it here, but we get to invite
Speaker 2: we get a very special guest's joining us today, a
Speaker 2: very special gift for my audience here and our community
Speaker 2: and everyone who's listening and watching. We get to have
Speaker 2: your mom on the show, which is amazing.
Speaker 1: It's really fun.
Speaker 2: So I am so excited about this because to be
Speaker 2: able to talk to you both about the incredible work
Speaker 2: you're doing together, her incredible lessons that she shared with
Speaker 2: you over time, that you spoke about so beautifully today,
Speaker 2: and I got to talk to her before we started
Speaker 2: recording as well, and just hearing about how innovative and
Speaker 2: creative she is. I mean, it's amazing. So if you're
Speaker 2: okay with it, I love to love it. Bring out
Speaker 2: your mom, Mandy over in a second, so we will
Speaker 2: go and grab her. Yeah, amazing. So I was so
Speaker 2: excited to have you hear Mandy, this is amazing. This
Speaker 2: is really special. When when I heard that I was
Speaker 2: going to have this opportunity, I think it's always interesting
Speaker 2: hearing about someone's journey through someone else's lens, especially your mom,
Speaker 2: like you know who else in the world. And now
Speaker 2: now my mom's going to be upset that I haven't
Speaker 2: had her on the podcast.
Speaker 1: I have it.
Speaker 2: So now now I feel the pressure.
Speaker 3: Make my podcast. I'll just make one there. I love it.
Speaker 2: But I was going to say, you know, it was
Speaker 2: just so beautiful in the documentary and even just now
Speaker 2: hearing what Selena had to say about the amazing impact
Speaker 2: you've had on her, hearing about you going to the
Speaker 2: soup kitchens when Selena was younger in the documentary, as
Speaker 2: I said before, hearing about how you encourage her to
Speaker 2: learn about things that scared her. Yeah, and that would
Speaker 2: help her. I mean, these are really I hope you
Speaker 2: feel extremely proud of this incredible human being. Quite and
Speaker 2: just you know, from an outsider's point of view, just
Speaker 2: how incredible it is to see someone sharing their truth
Speaker 2: with so much bravery, so much courage and impacting the
Speaker 2: lives and saving the lives of millions of people across
Speaker 2: the world. And I'm sure you feel a big part
Speaker 2: of that.
Speaker 3: So I mean, honestly, I always hope to be a
Speaker 3: role model, is in the sense that I was honest
Speaker 3: about everything with her and who I was and as
Speaker 3: a person, because I feel like sometimes if parents project
Speaker 3: a perfection, then their kids feel like they have to
Speaker 3: like live up to that or achieve more, you know,
Speaker 3: And I just wanted her to always know I'm a
Speaker 3: person I'm gonna mess up, and at I was sixteen,
Speaker 3: so I was even more of a lost person. So
Speaker 3: I'm kind of surprised she came out as great as
Speaker 3: she is, to be honest, But yes, I'm very proud
Speaker 3: of her, and you know, I played a little role
Speaker 3: in it. And then she's like navigated herself into a
Speaker 3: wonderful adult. And there's been ups and downs, but it's
Speaker 3: just been it's been an honor to be her mother.
Speaker 2: What does that feel like, I mean, that's a whole
Speaker 2: another experience having a child at sixteen. I mean, that's
Speaker 2: a very you know, challenging stressful thing for yourself to
Speaker 2: go through.
Speaker 3: You're obviously not mentally in a space to be raising
Speaker 3: a child because you are a child and you're trying
Speaker 3: to figure out who you are. And even in some
Speaker 3: of my really hard times, I feel Selena, I came
Speaker 3: into this world at the perfect time because I was
Speaker 3: really lost myself and I wasn't going down the right path.
Speaker 3: And then when I found I was pregnant, I was like, Oh,
Speaker 3: I have someone who's going to I'm responsible for and
Speaker 3: they're gonna look up to me for guidance. And even
Speaker 3: at a young age, that hit me. And I'm thankful
Speaker 3: that that hit me and that I I did allow
Speaker 3: that pressure to make sure that I was trying to
Speaker 3: do everything right for her. But that was a moment
Speaker 3: that when you're sixteen, in that phase, you're trying to
Speaker 3: figure out your path in life, and I think I
Speaker 3: kind of lost a little path of my life because
Speaker 3: I had something more important to like take over. And
Speaker 3: I think that the delay adolescence is something that I
Speaker 3: felt like even now, you know, I still feel like
Speaker 3: I'm a little bit youthful, even though I'm like creaking
Speaker 3: and pop in when I walk, you know, I still
Speaker 3: sometimes feel like I have a little bit more adolescence
Speaker 3: in me and still things to learn. And so as
Speaker 3: a teen, it was it was really challenging. And it
Speaker 3: was really one of those beautiful like voor Texas of
Speaker 3: being young and being able to keep up with a
Speaker 3: child and having that energy. So I was able to
Speaker 3: go to school. I went to a conservatory after so
Speaker 3: I would take her to school and when she started kindergarten,
Speaker 3: and then I would go to school, and then I
Speaker 3: would go to work, and then i'd come home and
Speaker 3: do her homework and put her to bed, then do
Speaker 3: my homework and do it all over. And I think
Speaker 3: about that now and I'm like, no way, no way.
Speaker 3: I'm like I have a hard time getting up for
Speaker 3: my little one now. So it was like I was
Speaker 3: way too young then, and I'm like way too old. No, no, no,
Speaker 3: you know what I mean. It was just like where
Speaker 3: was the sweet spot? I just kind of skimmed by
Speaker 3: it and you know, accepted the challenge.
Speaker 2: That's incredible. Moms are amazing moms across the world. My
Speaker 2: mom included just unbelievable resilience, unbelievable found tolerance. You know that.
Speaker 2: I mean that sounds like such an incredible journey. And
Speaker 2: you know, as you were telling me earlier, you haven't
Speaker 2: yet managed to watch the documentary. I've seen parts, but
Speaker 2: you haven't been able to bring yourself to actually watch it.
Speaker 2: Tell us about what that feels like and how hard
Speaker 2: that is.
Speaker 3: Well, first, everyone's telling me how fabulous is it is.
Speaker 3: So it's like making me, it's making me more and
Speaker 3: more eager to kind of put that guard down. But
Speaker 3: the reason why is because like, we lived some of
Speaker 3: that together. We've went through that and we've found healing
Speaker 3: and we've moved past some of it. And even if
Speaker 3: it's something that she went through and I didn't know
Speaker 3: she went through it, it's as a mother, it's gonna
Speaker 3: affect me of like, oh, it's gonna hurt my stomach,
Speaker 3: it's gonna put me in that mindset and I'm gonna
Speaker 3: wish I could go and protect her. And she, you know,
Speaker 3: she was amazing and came through so much that I
Speaker 3: already feel like I protect you a lot. Yeah, And
Speaker 3: I was like, maybe I could just get through the
Speaker 3: holidays to not where I'm going up to her all
Speaker 3: the time, going I'm sorry, I didn't know, you know,
Speaker 3: because mothers do, like, you know, you want to take
Speaker 3: away your kids pain. You don't want them to have
Speaker 3: to experience that, even though that is part of developing
Speaker 3: who they're gonna be. And you know, who we all
Speaker 3: are is our pain and our suffering and our growth.
Speaker 3: So it's like, I either I'm gonna have to be
Speaker 3: in that mood where it's that time where I'm just
Speaker 3: like I'm not getting out of bed today and I
Speaker 3: already know I'm gonna be a little funky, and then
Speaker 3: watch it and then just be alone and kind of
Speaker 3: cry and then call her and tell her I'm sorry
Speaker 3: that I wasn't there and that moment, but you know,
Speaker 3: you just can't helicopter parent. So it just it just
Speaker 3: feels like her first breakup she ever had. I cried.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was like, they're both hurting, these four kids.
Speaker 3: I wish I could take their pa.
Speaker 1: Like our date was like a chaperone us to like
Speaker 1: the movies, like.
Speaker 3: They didn't make it.
Speaker 2: So mom's hot though, that's a mom's hot. Like unless
Speaker 2: you're a mom, you can't, you know, you know, it's
Speaker 2: it's hard to fully understand, like yeah, just everything you
Speaker 2: just said there of like wow, We've already lived through that,
Speaker 2: we've healed through that. To revisit that again, that's painful
Speaker 2: to feel a sense of guilt that I wasn't there
Speaker 2: for someone in a certain way. I didn't know what
Speaker 2: they were going through that Carrie's just saying, I mean, Selena,
Speaker 2: hearing that from your mom, Like, what does it feel
Speaker 2: like when she's like she hasn't been able to watch
Speaker 2: it because of all of this, how does that feel?
Speaker 1: Well, It's it's not far off. I've only seen it twice. Wow,
Speaker 1: And I I've premiered it a few times for people,
Speaker 1: and I've stepped away from watching it. I think I
Speaker 1: relate to my mom because some of those moments were
Speaker 1: really hard. And it's not so much if you don't
Speaker 1: mind me like saying this, it's not you not being there.
Speaker 1: It was me not letting you be there. That was
Speaker 1: the heartest part. And it was also not letting most
Speaker 1: of my people, like my family, in because I was
Speaker 1: in so much pain and I was walking through all
Speaker 1: these things. And in a way, I am glad that
Speaker 1: I walked through some of it alone because it made
Speaker 1: me who I am. But at the same time, it
Speaker 1: breaks my heart to know that I had to walk
Speaker 1: through that when I didn't need to do it alone.
Speaker 1: So it's very much I relate to her. I understand
Speaker 1: why she feels that way for sure, and I get it.
Speaker 2: So yeah, it's wonderful hearing both your perspectives on it
Speaker 2: because I think it again just you being him Andy,
Speaker 2: and I'm so grateful that you genuinely are here because
Speaker 2: it it just grounds this back into we're not watching
Speaker 2: a TV show, right, Like I think Alec did such
Speaker 2: a great job with it because I even though I'm
Speaker 2: not silling in his mother, it's like I can feel
Speaker 2: what you're saying through the way the story's told. But
Speaker 2: I think often when we watch things like this, we're like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: that's a TV show. It's not someone's life. And then
Speaker 2: when I'm sitting all of a sudden with you, I'm like,
Speaker 2: oh no, no, this is real life, Like this is
Speaker 2: someone's actual life and emotions, and that you know that
Speaker 2: having your voice in this conversation is so useful for that.
Speaker 3: Well, I mean I look at like kind of go
Speaker 3: when we're going to the premiere last night, I had
Speaker 3: a moment before where I was crying. I'm like, I'm
Speaker 3: going to need to cry and just get it over with,
Speaker 3: even though I was just there to support her and
Speaker 3: I didn't watch the film. The power and of fear,
Speaker 3: which I always call fear the false existence appearing real
Speaker 3: and so like the fear is like everyone is seeing
Speaker 3: you in your darkest moment and that it's out there
Speaker 3: for the world to judge, and they will judge it
Speaker 3: however they will, because even you know, again not seeing
Speaker 3: the documentary, I hear it's very real and raw and
Speaker 3: honest and open to do something like that. It's it's
Speaker 3: for me. I cry out of fear, of like how
Speaker 3: you were feeling and like how I could protect you.
Speaker 3: And then I was like, I know that the little
Speaker 3: bit I did in the interview, I was down a
Speaker 3: week afterwards because it did put me back in that
Speaker 3: place even though we weren't there, and I blacked out
Speaker 3: the minute, you know, Alex said action and he was
Speaker 3: so nice about it. And my lovely friend, dear friend Emily,
Speaker 3: who does my hair and makeup, she looks she's they're good.
Speaker 3: She's all crying and.
Speaker 2: She's like, I don't know.
Speaker 3: I'm like, well, now everyone's going to know, and there's
Speaker 3: something beautiful to that because it's you're exposing a lot,
Speaker 3: and that can be fearful, but you're also giving a lot,
Speaker 3: if that's how you look at it, and so I
Speaker 3: think it can make those dark moments really beautiful.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, well, I think that's something you as a
Speaker 2: family seem to have definitely embodied the idea of using
Speaker 2: your pain to serve others, figuring out a way to
Speaker 2: make sure that these stories are not just told in silos,
Speaker 2: but they help other people feel connected. And you know,
Speaker 2: with what you're doing with Wonder Mine, like, tell us
Speaker 2: a bit about the mission behind why you founded that,
Speaker 2: why you brought that to life, because I feel it
Speaker 2: comes from the same place of like, we're going through
Speaker 2: these things personally, but we also know this is a
Speaker 2: collective global challenge and so we want to be a
Speaker 2: part of supporting those communities.
Speaker 3: When I was really young, uh, and I was about
Speaker 3: seven years old, I did have my first and only
Speaker 3: suicide attempt, however you say, and it it didn't happen
Speaker 3: obviously seven years old, and I think that with traces
Speaker 3: back the time of always not feeling like I like
Speaker 3: nothing around me made sense in my world, and it
Speaker 3: was just like I felt like I was, and you know,
Speaker 3: nothing bad was happening. It's just like this seems strong
Speaker 3: to me, this seems wrong to me, I seem wrong,
Speaker 3: Like how how do I fix this? But from that moment,
Speaker 3: I've always carried I think that moment in my life
Speaker 3: in my mind of like not wanting anyone to ever
Speaker 3: feel that way, which is what led us to Thirteen
Speaker 3: Reasons Why and some of her fans opening up to us.
Speaker 3: When I read that, I knew that needed to be
Speaker 3: a conversational piece, and from the response of what it
Speaker 3: did and opening those conversations, I fired me to do more.
Speaker 3: But it was like about the timing of what we
Speaker 3: wanted to do and how we're going to use it,
Speaker 3: and so collaborating and figuring out what's missing out there
Speaker 3: as a support system was the ecosystem that we're you know,
Speaker 3: planning and working entirely to create where all of it
Speaker 3: is cohesive and you have one place to go to
Speaker 3: see that you know, we actually target it really a
Speaker 3: filter of feelings, so everybody has feelings that might not
Speaker 3: be a diagnosed medical condition, but also how can we
Speaker 3: put out content every day that you know, keeps it light,
Speaker 3: but keeps it real and keeps it open for conversation
Speaker 3: and build a community where everyone will feel safe and
Speaker 3: not ashamed of like a feeling that they're having and
Speaker 3: not ashamed. I heard you guys talking about perfection.
Speaker 2: It's like, I.
Speaker 3: Don't like to pretend there is perfection, you know. I like,
Speaker 3: I think perfection kind of puts a little bit of
Speaker 3: pressure whenever you can just be, like, just be and
Speaker 3: like so, I you know, I'm not a big social
Speaker 3: media fan, but definitely go to wondermind where we share
Speaker 3: positive messages. But I think what you know inspired me
Speaker 3: was creating this for everyone and content for people to
Speaker 3: have access to that can afford to get treatment or
Speaker 3: don't need treatment, but they need someone to say, hey,
Speaker 3: check this out, you know. So it's really for everybody.
Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you so much for sharing your personal experience, though,
Speaker 2: because I can imagine that you know the fact that
Speaker 2: you've held that close to you for this long and
Speaker 2: now that's coming out in this beautiful way, But when
Speaker 2: you're holding onto it, it doesn't feel that beautiful always.
Speaker 2: I mean, cele know, how old were you when you first.
Speaker 1: Learned about well, I don't think and this is probably
Speaker 1: fair enough to say, like she never really hid a
Speaker 1: lot of stuff when I was younger. I never was
Speaker 1: aware that we didn't have enough. I was never She
Speaker 1: did such a great job of I feel we're talking
Speaker 1: about you're in your right ear, But you did, Mama,
Speaker 1: You did of.
Speaker 3: Being was this woman you speak of.
Speaker 1: Like explaining situations to me that we would be in
Speaker 1: and and I feel around eighteen, I kind of started
Speaker 1: to realize more of her story and obviously it broke
Speaker 1: my heart and there are things that I never knew
Speaker 1: were going on, and she did such a great job
Speaker 1: of just letting me have a really great childhood. And
Speaker 1: then once I realized we could be open and honest
Speaker 1: with each other. That's kind of how Undermine started as well.
Speaker 1: We really, you know, ended up working together on an
Speaker 1: interview and we shared such interest with you know, the
Speaker 1: person I was interviewing with us, and we thought, hey,
Speaker 1: this is something we could probably do together. And it
Speaker 1: happened that way, and it was It's been really fun.
Speaker 3: I do want to I know this is like a
Speaker 3: love fest, but like I do want to. There's a
Speaker 3: moment that like you touched me during that time that
Speaker 3: I don't even know if you remember. I remember I
Speaker 3: was doing that, going to school, going to work, trying
Speaker 3: to get her out of the neighborhood I grew up
Speaker 3: in and tried to give her a better life. And
Speaker 3: this was pre her doing anything besides directing films with
Speaker 3: kids on the street. Yep, but she wasn't doing anything professionally.
Speaker 3: I was sitting in front of a mirror and I
Speaker 3: was trying to get ready and I just started crying
Speaker 3: and I was crying. I was crying, and she come
Speaker 3: up behind me, and she was so young, and she
Speaker 3: like started playing my hair, and she like, what's wrong?
Speaker 3: And I said, I just don't know why I'm doing
Speaker 3: what I'm doing, and she goes, you'll figure it out,
Speaker 3: just keep going. And it was like I was like,
Speaker 3: she's already smarter to be so yeah, It's like it's
Speaker 3: it was like a really good, like strong moment, like
Speaker 3: you don't ever want to you know. I think being
Speaker 3: vulnerable in front of her allows, you know, the vulnerability
Speaker 3: to you know, be welcomed.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, Yeah, I think that's I think that's so
Speaker 2: true as we're growing up, it's like we often look
Speaker 2: at our parents as perfect unless they let us in. Yeah,
Speaker 2: or by the time you figure out that they're not.
Speaker 2: And it's interesting that you're saying that at least you
Speaker 2: felt you were just always open and honest with what
Speaker 2: you were going through and with with your own challenges
Speaker 2: and your own struggles when you're when you're going through
Speaker 2: your own stuff and you're watching your child go through
Speaker 2: their stuff, like what's going through there's mind in that situation,
Speaker 2: like how are you dealing with your own stresses and
Speaker 2: pains and trying to be there and often, as as
Speaker 2: Selena said, and you said, children don't want their parents
Speaker 2: involved at a certain time, right, Like I can relate
Speaker 2: to that completely, Like I think you know, I listened
Speaker 2: to everything my parents said up until like I was
Speaker 2: thirteen years old, and then from like thirteen to twenty five,
Speaker 2: I didn't want to hear from them. And then after
Speaker 2: twenty five, I was like, oh, you guys were the best, right, Yeah,
Speaker 2: you're right, but everything and you go through that journey,
Speaker 2: so you know when your child doesn't want your help,
Speaker 2: when your child is not allowing you in, like what
Speaker 2: goes through a parent's mind, especially when they're going through
Speaker 2: their own work themselves.
Speaker 3: I just needed more therapy in a feeling, and you
Speaker 3: feel because I want to use this term lightly, like
Speaker 3: you feel like you feled in some capacity. So then
Speaker 3: you're like, I know, I took that opportunity to try
Speaker 3: to see maybe where were the missteps I took as
Speaker 3: a parent. Was I too open with her? Was I
Speaker 3: too liberal with her? Or you know, should I not
Speaker 3: let her do Barney? You know, like it's just all
Speaker 3: these decisions that you know, you make, you just reflect on,
Speaker 3: and I think I think as parents we have this
Speaker 3: capacity to decompartmentize your feelings and then prioritizing everyone else's.
Speaker 3: Like I was telling you earlier when we were talking,
Speaker 3: it was it's easier to bury your stuff and then
Speaker 3: kind of focus, which then becomes unhealthy for the receiving
Speaker 3: party and for yourself because you're not taking care of yourself.
Speaker 3: So I was. I went through it. A lot of days,
Speaker 3: didn't get out of bed. There was just like a
Speaker 3: lot of crying, a lot of therapy. And I had
Speaker 3: a therapist because I also I had a miscarriage during
Speaker 3: the madness, And you know, I had this therapist who
Speaker 3: gave me the best advice ever. She's like, just I
Speaker 3: need you to leave your house once a day and
Speaker 3: go go to the movies, buy a ticket. I don't
Speaker 3: care if you watch it, but every day you need
Speaker 3: receipts that you left your house. And so I would
Speaker 3: like walk through them all just like crying, being lost
Speaker 3: and you know, not knowing what to do. And I
Speaker 3: would buy stuff and I'd have to go and take
Speaker 3: it to her in each session, and I didn't I
Speaker 3: didn't even ask for the purpose. I was like, she's
Speaker 3: just trying to get me to get out of the house.
Speaker 3: And then I realized the whole Like after about six
Speaker 3: weeks of doing that, I started feeling more comfortable with
Speaker 3: being even more vulnerable because I'm crying and I know
Speaker 3: the world's going to be okay, and nobody's judging me.
Speaker 3: People are asking me, hey, are you okay that kind
Speaker 3: of thing, and you know, I was just like no,
Speaker 3: and then you know, you just keep walking. But like
Speaker 3: that judgment that everybody's afraid of. It shows me that,
Speaker 3: you know, because I was mad that I felt as
Speaker 3: a mother and this is in my eyes, not like you,
Speaker 3: you know, like I felt as Selena's mother. And then
Speaker 3: I also my body hurt my other baby. So I
Speaker 3: was like angry at myself completely and I needed to
Speaker 3: see that oh, the world's alive and there is forgiveness
Speaker 3: and I can still find happiness for myself because I
Speaker 3: was just like being a mom with something and the
Speaker 3: only thing I really knew to do since the age
Speaker 3: of fifteen. So when that's gone, you're you're just like, oh,
Speaker 3: I'm supposed to have all mees that don't tell my child,
Speaker 3: I'm supposed to do things, you know. So it was
Speaker 3: a lot of growing, you know, and it's hard when
Speaker 3: you're in it, but when you get out of it,
Speaker 3: it's fantastic. It really is. It's just you feel lighter
Speaker 3: and you feel like more hopeful, you know, and that
Speaker 3: then when you have that next opportunity or that next
Speaker 3: you know, downtrodden moment, you know you're going to get
Speaker 3: out of it. It's like, all right, I just got
Speaker 3: to get through this, just got to figure it out,
Speaker 3: gotta vibe through it, and then it'll it will pass. Yeah,
Speaker 3: So I think, yeah, you were talking about rock bottom
Speaker 3: a little bit earlier. Yeah, definitely hitting rock bottom it does.
Speaker 3: It feels like you're breaking through.
Speaker 2: What's really refreshing hearing both of you together is just
Speaker 2: I feel like this is going to heal a lot
Speaker 2: of parent children relationships. Like listening to you both today
Speaker 2: because I'm just thinking so often we think our thoughts
Speaker 2: to ourselves and we never share them with the people
Speaker 2: that those thoughts are about. So, you know, I'm sure
Speaker 2: there's so many children out there who their thoughts are like, oh,
Speaker 2: I wish my parents did this better and my parents
Speaker 2: could have done this, and those are valid thoughts. And
Speaker 2: then there's parents out there at the same time having
Speaker 2: the same thought of like I wish I didn't do
Speaker 2: that to them and I you know, and often we
Speaker 2: just never find out. We never know because we don't
Speaker 2: get to have these open, honest dialogues. And so I
Speaker 2: really think this, on top of everything you do, this
Speaker 2: is really going to inspire a lot of parents and kids. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's because it's even even listening to you, I'm just
Speaker 2: I'm thinking of my parents, and I'm thinking of my
Speaker 2: friends parents, and I'm thinking everyone needs to be able
Speaker 2: to open their heart because somewhere everyone's painting themselves the villain,
Speaker 2: and someone's painting themselves as the person who messed up
Speaker 2: and got everything wrong. Yeah, and in our head we're thinking, oh,
Speaker 2: they got away with it, or you know, they're not
Speaker 2: aware of it, So I find I mean, did you
Speaker 2: were you always open to therapy and always open to
Speaker 2: this self work? Was that a part of who you
Speaker 2: were as well? Always? And that was or was that
Speaker 2: something you kind of turned to it a.
Speaker 3: Certain well, I will tell you a haunting little secret
Speaker 3: that when I was really young in junior high, I
Speaker 3: wanted to be a criminal psychologist. So that's why I
Speaker 3: always says that she's making fun of me and murders. Maybe, yes,
Speaker 3: that was I young that person, but I was already
Speaker 3: reading on serial killers at that age because I was
Speaker 3: fascinated with the mindset and I didn't come from, you know,
Speaker 3: an environment where therapy was even talked about, but I
Speaker 3: just at at a certain age, I really felt like
Speaker 3: super depressed, and so I had to go out and
Speaker 3: explore it myself and go through tons of doctors, and
Speaker 3: you know, you would say one thing and it was
Speaker 3: just like they go, hey, are you seeing things? I'm like,
Speaker 3: I saw Black Butterfly the other day and they go, oh,
Speaker 3: so you're hallucinating, and I'm like am I? So like
Speaker 3: I had to go and I wasn't, but it was
Speaker 3: a real black Butterfly, So I had to learn like
Speaker 3: how to understand myself and my mind on my own.
Speaker 3: And finally I also I did I went away to
Speaker 3: a facility and it was the first time I got
Speaker 3: to really spend all that time. Is best twenty eight
Speaker 3: days that I spent, you know, on myself and yeah,
Speaker 3: you just like you have to kind of build that
Speaker 3: relationship with your mind. And I think people are so
Speaker 3: afraid of being honest with themselves because then they have
Speaker 3: to face it. But what like helped me is I realized,
Speaker 3: like you know, in this relationship, I was parenting her
Speaker 3: the way I needed to be parented, not what she
Speaker 3: was needing. And that is how I feel like I
Speaker 3: made my contribution to healing this relationship. Is like, Okay,
Speaker 3: pull back. I need to know her and her needs,
Speaker 3: not like be the mama bear, even though I still
Speaker 3: haven't lost that completely, but like you know, sometimes I
Speaker 3: just need to listen and not fix it. And so
Speaker 3: that was the biggest thing. I think I really went
Speaker 3: on a little tel spin there, but that was the
Speaker 3: biggest thing that I learned through you know, that whole
Speaker 3: time that we were separated. It was like seeing who
Speaker 3: I was and how other people see me and I
Speaker 3: do that every day I'll say something, I'm like, Okay,
Speaker 3: how did that come off to someone else? You know,
Speaker 3: because I have ADHD, so I'm quick to like spurt
Speaker 3: out whatever is in my brain. And then I'm like,
Speaker 3: they really didn't need to know that, but it's out
Speaker 3: there in the world now.
Speaker 2: The self work in this room is amazing. The amount
Speaker 2: of like self reflection and self awareness in this room
Speaker 2: is really strong. This is yeah, yeah, this is very
Speaker 2: powerful stuff. No, and you did not get lost on
Speaker 2: attendent at all. I think everything you just shared with us,
Speaker 2: even you just coming to that conclusion of knowing that
Speaker 2: you're parenting someone that you deeply loved in a way
Speaker 2: that you wanted to be parented, I think that is
Speaker 2: at the core of so much of how we all live. Yeah. Right,
Speaker 2: We're all love people the way we wish we were loved,
Speaker 2: and we're all hurting people the way we wish we
Speaker 2: weren't hurt. And it's so it's just fascinating when we finally,
Speaker 2: you know, look beneath the surface and uncover why it's
Speaker 2: all there and where it is, and to do that
Speaker 2: together and separately. I love this idea that there were
Speaker 2: times when you have to do this at a distance
Speaker 2: from each other as well. I think that's such a
Speaker 2: healthy message to be out there as well. In the world,
Speaker 2: I think we're often all trying to solve all our
Speaker 2: issues in the same place.
Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely. I think there are moments, even you know,
Speaker 1: even in friendships, where it wasn't necessary for me to
Speaker 1: take a step back and figure out what is serving me,
Speaker 1: what's not serving me, what makes me happy, what's challenging me,
Speaker 1: what's helping me move forward, versus what's not.
Speaker 3: I think it's really important.
Speaker 2: I think when we're looking from the outside in, we
Speaker 2: limit people to certain experiences, we remember them for certain people,
Speaker 2: we expect them to be with people that they're meant
Speaker 2: to be around, the way families are meant to be,
Speaker 2: Like there's always meant to be. Yeah, and then it's like,
Speaker 2: well know, in reality, there's space, there's distance, there's reflection,
Speaker 2: there's the need for all of these things. With the
Speaker 2: work that you're talking about earlier with me as well,
Speaker 2: in terms of how you now taking these messages on screen, yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, which you're sharing, which I know is such
Speaker 2: a big part of the work, and I feel so
Speaker 2: excited about that, Like That fills me with the greatest
Speaker 2: amount of joy knowing that we're going to see better
Speaker 2: representation of mental health on screen. I think that's huge.
Speaker 2: Where did you start to realize that from Thirteen Reasons Why,
Speaker 2: as we spoke about earlier, like, where did you start
Speaker 2: to realize that was so important for people to see
Speaker 2: that representation on screen?
Speaker 3: Well, I think it comes back to not wanting people
Speaker 3: to feel like I did at seven years old. It's like,
Speaker 3: I'm so open like with you know, oh, I'm bipolar,
Speaker 3: I have ADHD. You know, I was misdiagnosed for a while,
Speaker 3: so like I was always so open with it, and
Speaker 3: you know, even in a town where they're so accepting
Speaker 3: in certain capacities, it's still like, well she she's not stable.
Speaker 3: And I even would joke and go, yeah, I'm crazy,
Speaker 3: I'm crazy. I'm crazy. And I was like not supporting
Speaker 3: myself in that, and I didn't want anybody to feel
Speaker 3: that way. So, you know, during Thirteen Reasons Why, we
Speaker 3: worked tiresly the entire team to make sure we were
Speaker 3: executing the whole point of it in that you know,
Speaker 3: we're losing teens every day to suicide and it's it's
Speaker 3: horrible and unnecessary and you know, how do we how
Speaker 3: can we as a adult, And that's why it was
Speaker 3: so important, I think for me and Selena to go
Speaker 3: out and talk about it so parents would watch it together,
Speaker 3: you know. And once that got the reaction it got,
Speaker 3: you know, I heard different opinions, and I wanted to
Speaker 3: hear everyone whether they thought it was a bad idea,
Speaker 3: a great idea, it touched them, it offended them. Like
Speaker 3: I really like listen to everything and all the you know, data,
Speaker 3: and I've always been someone who enjoyed storytelling, and so
Speaker 3: I like to tell stories and if I can, you know,
Speaker 3: show and like I was telling you earlier, I like
Speaker 3: using silver Lining's playbook because they're bipolar, but they're having
Speaker 3: a life, they're having a relationship and as it may
Speaker 3: come with challenges, every relationship comes with challenges. It's not
Speaker 3: just a mental mental issue that someone has that causes
Speaker 3: those challenges. We're all people and if we just learn
Speaker 3: to understand each other, they'll be less fear of it,
Speaker 3: and then people will get more treatment and they'll just
Speaker 3: be more happiness. And I know, sometimes I feel like
Speaker 3: being like the world's gonna be happy. You know kind
Speaker 3: of like that, but you know and again like my adolescence,
Speaker 3: that's still there. But I that's what inspires me is
Speaker 3: to I scared off people by talking about myself in
Speaker 3: a negative way and by you know, not sharing enough,
Speaker 3: so it's like or sharing too much. So then it's
Speaker 3: like navigating that and like you know, like I mentioned
Speaker 3: like when It Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest and girl
Speaker 3: interrupted favorite films, love them, but that's not the reality
Speaker 3: Selena or I live in every day. You know, I
Speaker 3: have been in a facility, and but it was not
Speaker 3: like what's being portrayed was. It was a beautiful experience
Speaker 3: and and made me a better person for it. So
Speaker 3: it just like media loves to, you know, tell all
Speaker 3: of the bad stuff. It's like we could use it
Speaker 3: as as like educational without preachy, and so like let's
Speaker 3: just tell stories of real people dealing with mental health
Speaker 3: issues and different capacities and show that you can that
Speaker 3: you're all right, You're gonna make it. It's like, and
Speaker 3: you just need to give yourself that that permission, and
Speaker 3: then once you give yourself that permission, you're gonna come
Speaker 3: out a happier person. I like I embrace my ADHD
Speaker 3: like I really do. We have a lot of fun together.
Speaker 2: Well, I think this is painting a beautiful picture of
Speaker 2: just how like we always want growth to be this
Speaker 2: perfect line, you know, we expect expect growth in families
Speaker 2: individually to just look like, oh, we're just all growing
Speaker 2: at the same time, and isn't this beautiful? And it's like, well, no,
Speaker 2: growth is not that way. Yeah, And growth is being
Speaker 2: patient when my daughter wants to grow this way and
Speaker 2: I'm trying to figure this out, or I'm going to
Speaker 2: be patient while my mom pivots and shifts, and that's
Speaker 2: what growth is. Growth is being patient with each other.
Speaker 2: And growth is holding space and being okay when we're
Speaker 2: not being the nicest people to each other. Like, there's
Speaker 2: so much more to growth, and so I want to
Speaker 2: thank you both for displaying that and sharing that with
Speaker 2: us today. Oh thank you because it's yeah, it's it's
Speaker 2: special seeing it from this perspective for sure, Rather than
Speaker 2: either or. We end every on Purpose episode with a
Speaker 2: final five, which we're gonna ask to both of you,
Speaker 2: so you'll do one question at a time each and
Speaker 2: these are one word to one sentence maximum. They are
Speaker 2: not questions like what's your favorite color? Promise, They're all
Speaker 2: thoughtful questions as you would expect. Okay, so question number
Speaker 2: one is what is the best advice you've ever received
Speaker 2: or heard when it comes to mental health.
Speaker 1: I'm sure it's like in a Brene Brown book.
Speaker 3: I'm right on my roof.
Speaker 1: I think though, the best advice I had been given
Speaker 1: is probably what I have thoroughly said throughout my documentary
Speaker 1: and speaking with you, is learning how to make it
Speaker 1: a part of your life. Like that's why I say
Speaker 1: make it your friend, because I think you have to
Speaker 1: understand why. And sometimes you may not always know why.
Speaker 1: But if you can understand that it's a feeling, like
Speaker 1: my mom said, where maybe this will pass and maybe
Speaker 1: you just got to go through it, and you have
Speaker 1: to have the day in bed crying. You have to
Speaker 1: do those things in order to figure out what it
Speaker 1: is that's going to set you free from it.
Speaker 3: Maybe that would be advice that's make you a practice. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I think mine was take your time. That was what
Speaker 3: I was told when I went to That's Tree. Yeah,
Speaker 3: take your time.
Speaker 1: It's really good.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: What's some of that second question? What's some of the
Speaker 2: worst advice you've ever heard or received when it comes
Speaker 2: to mental health.
Speaker 3: That it's all in my head and I can just
Speaker 3: control it, like stop having bad thoughts.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I was good to say somewhere along the
Speaker 1: lines of like you're fine. I mean yeah. I had
Speaker 1: someone say to me literally like you're so dramatic, you
Speaker 1: make up everything you know.
Speaker 3: And that was so hurtful, the worst I felt the worst.
Speaker 3: Calm down, it's.
Speaker 2: Like good answers, all right. Question number three, how would
Speaker 2: you both define your individually your current purpose in life.
Speaker 1: I fully feel that I am exactly where I meant
Speaker 1: to be. I am meant to share my story and
Speaker 1: in this season of my life, I want to be
Speaker 1: loved the way I love people. I want to give
Speaker 1: the way people have so generously given to me, and
Speaker 1: I want to continue to work on become a becoming
Speaker 1: a better and a happier person every day.
Speaker 3: It's a beautiful purpose I've received, so now I want
Speaker 3: to give awful.
Speaker 2: Wow, this is this is really beautiful answer question of before,
Speaker 2: what's something you used to value that you don't value
Speaker 2: that much anymore?
Speaker 1: Oh, people's opinions? I agree, it's so exhausting. I would
Speaker 1: say it is nice to hear great things. But I
Speaker 1: accept compliments in a manner where I can appreciate them.
Speaker 1: But I have to learn how to just know that.
Speaker 1: I got to keep a straight head. I got to
Speaker 1: like understand that everything is a gift and not to
Speaker 1: let things get to my head.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because I always say, if you accept all the
Speaker 3: compliments internally, then you'll have to accept all the negative.
Speaker 3: So just be careful, just like be selective with what
Speaker 3: you let Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, there's a beautiful quote. I can't remember who
Speaker 2: said it, but it says, don't let compliments get to
Speaker 2: your head and criticism get to your heart. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I love that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I love that. That was very poetic with what it's.
Speaker 2: Been said for just repeatia, no, no, but I think
Speaker 2: it's such a beautiful and Yeah, and I think that's
Speaker 2: also when we're mindful of giving compliments to others. I
Speaker 2: think something that I've learned is that I enjoy and
Speaker 2: we've talked about this today. I really enjoy the art
Speaker 2: of learning to see someone's essence. It's something that I
Speaker 2: try and live by because and then when you want
Speaker 2: to compliment someone, it's like, how do you give a
Speaker 2: compliment that is an empty flattery. L that isn't just
Speaker 2: surface level. And I think when we get compliments like that,
Speaker 2: they don't go to our head, they do go to
Speaker 2: our heart. Yeah, you know, it's different. So I hope
Speaker 2: that we can also learn to compliment each other in more,
Speaker 2: you know, beautiful and genuine ways. Fifth and final question,
Speaker 2: Question number five is if you could create one law
Speaker 2: that everyone in the world had to follow, what would it.
Speaker 3: Be practicing forgiveness?
Speaker 2: Wow?
Speaker 1: I probably would would say something super simple and cheesy,
Speaker 1: but treat others the way you want to be treated.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then we throw in the forgiveness.
Speaker 1: Yeah, honestly that's the biggest thing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, forgiveness. Yeah, yeah, I stayed with campaign.
Speaker 2: Mom forgiveness campaign.
Speaker 3: That's right. Wait, can I ask you a question? Yeah, okay,
Speaker 3: when is the last time you did something for the
Speaker 3: first time?
Speaker 2: Oh? Wow, okay, when was the last time I've been
Speaker 2: practicing this time? The most interesting answer that came to
Speaker 2: mind straight away, even though it was a couple of
Speaker 2: months ago. Now, I went trekking with gorillas in Rwanda.
Speaker 3: Wow, and it was it was amazing.
Speaker 2: It was. Yeah, it was a few months ago and
Speaker 2: it was the most incredible experience.
Speaker 1: Of that sound life wild.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So they're mountain gorilla and they're not you don't
Speaker 2: they don't have any technology on them or you know,
Speaker 2: they're not treated a certain way. They're not in a
Speaker 2: zoo or they're not trapped. You're in their home and
Speaker 2: you have to set out early in the morning to
Speaker 2: go and look for them. And the people that are
Speaker 2: doing these tours they know where they usually are, so
Speaker 2: they take you in that direction. Oh my, and then
Speaker 2: you finally discover like this family of gorillas. And I
Speaker 2: thought i'd see one or two. I was very I
Speaker 2: wasn't skeptical, but I was kind of like, who knows,
Speaker 2: you know, we saw eighteen gorillas, like a family, So no,
Speaker 2: you know, I wish they cuddle each other. Yeah, but
Speaker 2: they don't. They the guides tell us that the only
Speaker 2: thing you have to do is maintain your distance. You're
Speaker 2: not allowed to try and touch them or their kids,
Speaker 2: because they see that is violent. The gorillas are just
Speaker 2: so peaceful and they're so calm, and they have this
Speaker 2: sound that they make. This was my favorite part of
Speaker 2: the experience. So we were told by our guide that
Speaker 2: if you make this sound, it basically tells the gorillas.
Speaker 2: We come in peace, and so this sound is you
Speaker 2: have to make that sound and the gorillas make it
Speaker 2: back to you, or they'll do it to you as
Speaker 2: they come closer, just to let you know, hey, we're
Speaker 2: not trying to harm you. We're just going to walk
Speaker 2: past you.
Speaker 3: I love that.
Speaker 2: Really special. So that was the most recent memory of it.
Speaker 3: Was like, this was beautiful.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was. It was really it was really truly special.
Speaker 2: It was you know, it's just being with another creature,
Speaker 2: that another form of life that is uninterested in you. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's it's very humbling in a good way. This form
Speaker 2: of life doesn't even care that I exist staring at it,
Speaker 2: and the gorilla is just like, yeah, that's a good question.
Speaker 2: It's a good question. Well, Selena and Mandy, you have
Speaker 2: both been so gracious with your time today. You've been
Speaker 2: so kind and generous with your energy. And this documentary
Speaker 2: is going to change so many lives, and it is
Speaker 2: going to shift the culture of how we share our
Speaker 2: pain in a way that truly positively impacts the lives
Speaker 2: of people across the world. And so thank you, Birth
Speaker 2: really appreciate so much. Thank you for sharing your heart
Speaker 2: for years, for sharing your soul and for taking the
Speaker 2: time to create something that's truly going to be talked
Speaker 2: about for years and years to come.
Speaker 1: Thanks, thank you j You're the best.
Speaker 2: And thank you for your friendship as well, of course,
Speaker 2: and thank you for opening up so vulnerably with us
Speaker 2: today about your experiences about you know, all the gifts
Speaker 2: and the challenges that come with loving family and each other.
Speaker 2: And also for leading as part of this movement and
Speaker 2: everything you're doing with wonder Mind and trying to help
Speaker 2: people all across the world with mental health and wellness.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for your commitment to.
Speaker 3: That, and thank you, thank you for everything you do. Yes,
Speaker 3: altogether we can.
Speaker 2: I love it. Thank you perfect, Thank you love that