WEBVTT - Latest on Vince McMahon | Guest Host - Joel Gertner 0:00:27.280 --> 0:00:30.240 All right, get it going right here, right now. 0:00:30.920 --> 0:00:34.800 This is Eyes up Here, and you're listening to an 0:00:34.800 --> 0:00:39.720 all new Eyes up Here, exclusively on the iHeart Radio network. 0:00:40.560 --> 0:00:42.520 If you didn't know by now, my name is Dad, 0:00:42.600 --> 0:00:44.040 and every single week I'm. 0:00:43.840 --> 0:00:48.839 Here, but the host it's not this week. We all 0:00:48.840 --> 0:00:49.599 know where she is. 0:00:50.280 --> 0:00:55.000 She's on her magical vacation to a place that she. 0:00:55.000 --> 0:00:55.920 Talks about all the time. 0:00:55.960 --> 0:00:57.520 I mean, I don't have to spell it out for you, 0:00:57.520 --> 0:01:02.240 you know, but I have outs and found somebody to 0:01:02.320 --> 0:01:05.640 take her place this week, but did not have to 0:01:05.640 --> 0:01:06.320 go very far. 0:01:06.920 --> 0:01:08.720 All I had to do was look across the room. 0:01:10.040 --> 0:01:15.360 And found a suitable replacement the quintessential stun Muppon himself, 0:01:16.240 --> 0:01:21.360 mister Joel Gertner joining me today, Joel, welcome back to 0:01:21.440 --> 0:01:22.080 Eyes up Here. 0:01:23.280 --> 0:01:25.880 Whoa, whoa, whoa. 0:01:26.640 --> 0:01:30.319 Thank you for having me. For those who don't know. 0:01:30.880 --> 0:01:33.200 Although since all of these people are fans of the 0:01:33.200 --> 0:01:35.959 original ECW, I would imagine or have caught up with 0:01:36.080 --> 0:01:39.080 it by now. If they know Francine, then I'd like 0:01:39.160 --> 0:01:42.240 to think hopefully they're familiar with my work and they 0:01:42.280 --> 0:01:49.280 know that I am the lyrical miracle, the sexual into lectual, 0:01:49.880 --> 0:01:54.480 the cunning linguist. I'll keep stuff like that to a 0:01:54.560 --> 0:01:57.400 dull war here on iHeart Radio. I know it's not 0:01:57.600 --> 0:02:03.840 I bleep Radio and the quintessential stun myuffin. Joel, I'm 0:02:03.880 --> 0:02:09.600 your favorite ECW personality, just like the queen of Extreme 0:02:09.880 --> 0:02:16.720 Friends scene, but unlike her, your older sister and your 0:02:16.880 --> 0:02:22.680 mother underage fifty five love me the most. And this 0:02:22.840 --> 0:02:32.440 week on this episode, I am your substitute host Girdener. 0:02:33.280 --> 0:02:39.320 Keep listening, it still applies. Eyes up here and have 0:02:39.520 --> 0:02:42.079 yourself and ear gazzle. 0:02:43.840 --> 0:02:47.240 Beautiful. What a way to start, Joel. I couldn't be 0:02:47.240 --> 0:02:48.280 happier to have you back. 0:02:51.120 --> 0:02:51.720 Thank you well. 0:02:52.720 --> 0:02:56.200 Joel and I were together yesterday as we're recording this 0:02:56.280 --> 0:03:01.160 in real time. We were in beautiful Jappa, Marilyn outside 0:03:01.200 --> 0:03:03.239 of Baltimore, but I think they do count it as 0:03:03.639 --> 0:03:07.120 Baltimore if you're going to use a city for the 0:03:07.280 --> 0:03:11.400 MCW fan jam And as I was walking around the 0:03:11.480 --> 0:03:15.000 room and exchanging pleasantries with a few folks in the 0:03:15.120 --> 0:03:18.120 near vicinity, we locked eyes. 0:03:18.600 --> 0:03:19.840 You didn't know who I was. 0:03:20.040 --> 0:03:22.480 I went over and introduced myself again since we had 0:03:22.480 --> 0:03:24.520 you on the show a couple of years ago. You 0:03:24.639 --> 0:03:27.320 said the wrong thing and I locked you in for 0:03:27.520 --> 0:03:29.440 eyes up here. It was if you ever. 0:03:29.280 --> 0:03:32.320 Need me, I'm right there, and I grabbed you within 0:03:32.440 --> 0:03:33.160 two seconds. 0:03:33.600 --> 0:03:36.200 And there's no substitute for a substitute. I'm run down, 0:03:36.560 --> 0:03:38.600 I'm a little bit sick as a dog, I'm a 0:03:38.600 --> 0:03:42.480 little bit beat up. But nonetheless, when I heard it 0:03:42.560 --> 0:03:44.400 was for Franny, and when I heard it was for 0:03:44.440 --> 0:03:47.480 this show, of course, out of the kindness of my heart, 0:03:47.920 --> 0:03:48.720 I am here. 0:03:49.480 --> 0:03:50.280 That's awesome too. 0:03:50.560 --> 0:03:52.920 And you know what, and before we get into the 0:03:52.960 --> 0:03:55.720 really bad stuff we're going to talk about today that 0:03:55.800 --> 0:03:57.480 has to do with the World Wrestling, I want to 0:03:57.520 --> 0:04:00.040 talk about the really good stuff that's step bond that 0:03:59.920 --> 0:04:03.280 you guys have, that ECW bond, and you don't see 0:04:03.280 --> 0:04:07.360 it with everybody. You never hear about the WCW guys 0:04:07.360 --> 0:04:10.560 that have the deep bond or those WWF guys that 0:04:10.640 --> 0:04:13.960 have that deep bond. It's that ECW crew that has 0:04:14.040 --> 0:04:16.240 something so special that when you. 0:04:16.120 --> 0:04:17.960 Guys see each other, there's really no. 0:04:18.040 --> 0:04:21.400 Really blood feuds that we know of that are really 0:04:21.440 --> 0:04:24.920 out there, and maybe one or two, but nothing crazy. 0:04:25.880 --> 0:04:28.640 You guys have a real tight group and you're always 0:04:28.720 --> 0:04:30.520 talking and you're always happy to see each other. 0:04:30.720 --> 0:04:32.200 What is it about you guys. 0:04:31.960 --> 0:04:34.599 That you still like, really have a good friendship and 0:04:34.640 --> 0:04:36.320 you always are so happy around each other. 0:04:37.760 --> 0:04:41.800 For most of us, ECW was our break. It was 0:04:41.839 --> 0:04:47.159 our first break. It was our first vehicle in establishing 0:04:47.240 --> 0:04:54.120 our career. We weren't plucked from you know, WWFWCW. You know, 0:04:54.520 --> 0:04:58.039 that was kind of our first stop. And I think 0:04:58.080 --> 0:05:01.000 there's also got to be something to the fact that 0:05:01.040 --> 0:05:04.359 we were all so young. Many of us were in 0:05:04.360 --> 0:05:09.560 our twenties. So between those two things and just the 0:05:09.680 --> 0:05:13.839 nature of being number three in a three entity war, 0:05:14.080 --> 0:05:16.599 you know, just the nature of being as Paul Hayman 0:05:17.000 --> 0:05:19.359 said at a press conference once, you know, in the 0:05:19.400 --> 0:05:22.200 in the soda Wars and the Cola Wars, we were 0:05:22.240 --> 0:05:24.919 Snapple and at the time, he said, we were happy 0:05:24.920 --> 0:05:27.560 to be that, and we were. We were the island 0:05:27.560 --> 0:05:30.679 of misfit toys. We were the little engine that could 0:05:32.080 --> 0:05:35.159 towards the end. We were the pioneers that got the 0:05:35.279 --> 0:05:39.160 arrows in our backs. And it was all of that 0:05:39.720 --> 0:05:42.320 I think helps. You know, you call it a bond. 0:05:43.600 --> 0:05:45.760 I if you're going to talk about blood feud, I 0:05:45.880 --> 0:05:47.839 go the other direction with it, and I'd say I'd 0:05:47.880 --> 0:05:51.840 call it a family, and and yeah, that's that's why 0:05:51.839 --> 0:05:52.560 we're also tight. 0:05:53.800 --> 0:05:54.200 So cool. 0:05:54.240 --> 0:05:58.279 Yeah, Again there's always the cool interactions between the ECW guys. 0:05:58.320 --> 0:06:01.480 And again that's not to despair the other promotions or 0:06:01.520 --> 0:06:03.960 the other locker rooms. But again, you don't see the 0:06:04.200 --> 0:06:08.240 w CW pals, you know, joking around and and and 0:06:08.320 --> 0:06:09.240 hanging out the way. 0:06:09.120 --> 0:06:10.400 You see the ECW guys. 0:06:10.400 --> 0:06:14.680 It's just it's there's something different there, and it's it's magical, 0:06:14.839 --> 0:06:16.600 especially you know if you see it from my point 0:06:16.600 --> 0:06:19.320 of view, because ideal on the booking side, ideal on 0:06:19.360 --> 0:06:22.080 the other side of shows, and there is a close 0:06:22.480 --> 0:06:25.040 relationship with everybody for the most part, and I think 0:06:25.040 --> 0:06:31.200 it's very cool. So yeah, absolutely, all right, So yeah, 0:06:31.240 --> 0:06:33.599 we also saw there was a lot of great people 0:06:33.600 --> 0:06:37.159 in attendance at this show. They were fans out the 0:06:37.240 --> 0:06:41.560 door for some free agents that are still hanging around, 0:06:42.080 --> 0:06:46.880 uh Nick Nemeth, Matt Riddle in attendance, fans clamoring for 0:06:47.160 --> 0:06:50.440 autographs and pictures. But I did see the Steiner brothers 0:06:50.440 --> 0:06:52.279 were kind of over in the area where you were. 0:06:52.320 --> 0:06:55.080 I mean, they they still look great, you know. I 0:06:55.080 --> 0:07:00.480 saw Lex Luger. Conventions are always very cool, but there's 0:07:00.480 --> 0:07:02.680 a guy in the news that links a lot of 0:07:02.720 --> 0:07:05.839 these people together. And you know, I don't like to 0:07:05.880 --> 0:07:11.040 throw this term around very loosely, Joel, but perhaps biggest 0:07:11.160 --> 0:07:16.239 news story of all time as it relates to wrestling still, 0:07:16.560 --> 0:07:20.440 I guess breaking as you go every day, every single day, 0:07:20.560 --> 0:07:22.840 there seems like there's something new coming out as it 0:07:22.880 --> 0:07:27.320 relates to the Vince McMahon story and everything developing. 0:07:27.200 --> 0:07:29.760 And it's becoming like the Kennedy assassination. 0:07:30.120 --> 0:07:33.240 Right, It's almost like, where were you when you found 0:07:33.240 --> 0:07:36.880 out about what happened when the Vince McMahon court filings 0:07:36.920 --> 0:07:39.760 came out? So I'll start with that, Where were you 0:07:39.800 --> 0:07:42.240 when you found out when the Vince McMahon court filings 0:07:42.280 --> 0:07:44.760 came out? Were you as shocked as everybody else was 0:07:45.040 --> 0:07:47.880 to see that Vince McMahon, the guy we've heard so 0:07:48.000 --> 0:07:51.480 many crazy things about over the years, had this finally 0:07:51.680 --> 0:07:52.480 hit the surface. 0:07:53.480 --> 0:07:57.600 I'd heard some rumblings. I'd heard some kind of inside 0:07:57.720 --> 0:08:01.840 kind of remmerse, some kind of inside a little bit 0:08:01.880 --> 0:08:07.120 of baseball. I've got this cough, So I apologize in 0:08:07.160 --> 0:08:13.920 advance of my cough ever known again, I'm still shocked. 0:08:14.920 --> 0:08:16.800 Nothing shocks me. You know, on the other end of 0:08:16.800 --> 0:08:20.200 the coin, it's wrestling, right. So, like you say, even 0:08:20.240 --> 0:08:22.840 if it is, the bit looks so I've been watching 0:08:22.920 --> 0:08:26.720 since I don't know, eighty three, eighty four, so h 0:08:26.800 --> 0:08:30.840 and I've been reading the sheets since eighty nine. Even 0:08:30.880 --> 0:08:37.600 if it is the biggest story ever, there's been so 0:08:37.800 --> 0:08:43.679 much else between the eighties and now that I've seen 0:08:43.760 --> 0:08:48.480 and that I've studied that I mean, you can't be 0:08:48.600 --> 0:08:53.480 shocked or surprised by anything. I again, because I kind 0:08:53.520 --> 0:08:56.079 of you know the inside. You know, whatever I heard 0:08:56.880 --> 0:09:04.320 wasn't substantial, substantive, concert detailed. It wasn't it was you know, 0:09:04.360 --> 0:09:08.000 I mean, you know, the FEDS were investigating him, I think, 0:09:08.679 --> 0:09:13.560 and that was you know, I think different people heard 0:09:13.640 --> 0:09:16.280 rumblings about that at different times and have heard more 0:09:16.320 --> 0:09:21.480 about it or less. But when it comes to these filings, 0:09:22.600 --> 0:09:25.200 I couldn't even tell you where I was at the 0:09:25.240 --> 0:09:31.800 moment that I heard. I'm not sure, because you know, again, 0:09:31.840 --> 0:09:35.280 it's just you know, you just see, you know, when 0:09:35.320 --> 0:09:39.200 ECW closed up, you had to be perceptive, and you 0:09:39.280 --> 0:09:42.720 had to kind of see towards the very end. Week 0:09:42.840 --> 0:09:45.600 by week you had to kind of see writing on 0:09:45.679 --> 0:09:49.079 the wall and That's kind of how it was with 0:09:49.320 --> 0:09:53.640 I think this where like maybe you're hearing the FEDS 0:09:53.960 --> 0:09:58.760 are interested. Maybe you're hearing that there's something having to 0:09:58.840 --> 0:10:02.720 do with Vince being a liability, and it may be 0:10:02.720 --> 0:10:06.960 being something along the lines of the RIDA chattered and thing. 0:10:07.480 --> 0:10:11.600 You know, maybe you know you're hearing this and you're 0:10:11.640 --> 0:10:17.840 hearing that, and I don't know, you know, I kind 0:10:17.840 --> 0:10:19.360 of lost my train of thought. I mean, that's how 0:10:19.440 --> 0:10:22.439 kind of scattered and how kind of you know, scattered 0:10:22.480 --> 0:10:27.400 plot and scattershot at all is because you know, like 0:10:27.440 --> 0:10:30.400 I say, I couldn't tell you where I was, and 0:10:30.720 --> 0:10:35.120 I'm not entirely surprised just because nothing. I don't allow 0:10:35.240 --> 0:10:38.320 anything in wrestling to kind of, you know, shock me. 0:10:39.360 --> 0:10:43.360 And but you know, again, you see different. You know, 0:10:44.280 --> 0:10:48.040 all of a sudden, Kevin Dunn retires, you know, and 0:10:48.080 --> 0:10:52.040 it's like, yeah, Kevin done at this point as an 0:10:52.080 --> 0:10:55.720 older gentleman. He's older than me, he's however old he is, 0:10:56.160 --> 0:10:59.480 he's been with the company whatever four decades. Vince is. 0:10:59.840 --> 0:11:04.520 You know, there's that, but like so some of it 0:11:04.600 --> 0:11:10.559 maybe is Monday morning quarterbacking, right like like kind of hindsight. 0:11:12.080 --> 0:11:17.480 But regardless, like the kind of again, there's been, there's been, 0:11:18.080 --> 0:11:20.440 and I you know, there's writing on the wall, I guess, 0:11:21.200 --> 0:11:24.240 and I don't know what to tell you. Man, No, 0:11:24.400 --> 0:11:26.320 I have no idea where I was when I actually 0:11:27.679 --> 0:11:30.880 heard that her case was being filed. 0:11:31.360 --> 0:11:33.640 It I we gotta, we gotta go through a couple 0:11:33.679 --> 0:11:34.240 of those points. 0:11:34.320 --> 0:11:36.840 One that Kevin dun Thing for sure was to me 0:11:37.480 --> 0:11:40.600 the first thing I thought of, because when I'd read 0:11:40.640 --> 0:11:43.320 through the whole filing, I had some free time throughout 0:11:43.360 --> 0:11:44.160 my regular day. 0:11:44.200 --> 0:11:46.280 I did read the whole sixty. 0:11:45.880 --> 0:11:49.839 Seven page filing, and when it was naming like unnamed executive, 0:11:50.040 --> 0:11:52.960 I'm not despair. I'm not trying to throw anybody's name. 0:11:53.160 --> 0:11:56.880 It's explicitly under the bus. But he was the first name, 0:11:56.920 --> 0:11:58.480 and that popped in my head because he was such 0:11:58.520 --> 0:12:03.680 a high profile name to depart, who was so linked 0:12:03.679 --> 0:12:08.679 to Vince over the years that it's just fishy, as 0:12:08.679 --> 0:12:11.240 we would say, you know, it's just suspicious. 0:12:11.480 --> 0:12:13.920 But again, I could be one hundred dead wrong. And 0:12:13.960 --> 0:12:16.440 I'm not saying it. I'm not saying that. I'm saying it. 0:12:17.200 --> 0:12:19.920 I'm trying to cover my so of course, and maybe 0:12:19.920 --> 0:12:21.719 he was ready to retire, like I said, he's in 0:12:21.800 --> 0:12:23.960 a certain age whatever maybe he was, and he's got 0:12:24.000 --> 0:12:26.280 you know whatever, he's got eight figures worth. It was weird. 0:12:26.400 --> 0:12:27.240 It was very weird. 0:12:27.360 --> 0:12:29.000 But on and on the other end of the coin, 0:12:29.240 --> 0:12:31.960 like that company is his life. Yes, he's one of 0:12:31.960 --> 0:12:35.840 the top people there. Good things are happening right the 0:12:35.880 --> 0:12:44.719 company on various levels, Creative Financial is doing well. Is 0:12:44.800 --> 0:12:51.920 there's interest, it's still popular, it's still mainstream. Here comes Netflix. 0:12:52.880 --> 0:12:57.599 So you know, it was you know, so before WrestleMania, 0:12:58.040 --> 0:12:59.480 you know, you don't yeah, you don't want a big 0:12:59.520 --> 0:13:03.480 send off WrestleMania that closed out your career, right right. 0:13:03.520 --> 0:13:04.720 It was kind of out of nowhere. 0:13:05.040 --> 0:13:05.559 Ye So. 0:13:07.200 --> 0:13:12.319 You know, like I say, I mean, I wasn't surprised, 0:13:12.480 --> 0:13:17.800 and and I just you know, it didn't take me aback. 0:13:17.840 --> 0:13:21.600 It was kind of it kind of you know, I've 0:13:21.880 --> 0:13:26.280 been hearing from certain people that you know, now that 0:13:26.400 --> 0:13:33.280 the Endeavor merger had happened, that maybe Vince, being considered 0:13:33.640 --> 0:13:37.880 a liability of sorts, was going to be pushed out 0:13:37.960 --> 0:13:42.760 and pushed away, and and and it's you know, it's 0:13:42.840 --> 0:13:44.880 I guess it's happening, you know, I guess you know, 0:13:44.960 --> 0:13:47.560 because of the case he's gone ahead, and you know, 0:13:47.800 --> 0:13:50.560 you know, it's it's always a retirement, they always, right, 0:13:50.679 --> 0:13:52.959 I mean, in corporate you know, they always give you 0:13:53.000 --> 0:13:55.000 the option of retiring before they cut you loose and 0:13:55.080 --> 0:14:00.000 let you go. But uh yeah, you know, I don't know, 0:14:00.240 --> 0:14:02.920 it's and it's not over, and it's still going to 0:14:02.960 --> 0:14:06.120 play out. I think I saw on X on Twitter. 0:14:06.559 --> 0:14:09.800 I think I saw, you know, there's kind of from 0:14:09.800 --> 0:14:13.160 the publicity standpoint, from the legal standpoint, the strategicy of 0:14:13.160 --> 0:14:15.520 it all. I think I see that they're trying to 0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:22.800 disseminate the idea that Janelle Grant isn't even so much 0:14:22.960 --> 0:14:27.120 or solely interested in money or settlement, but that she's 0:14:27.200 --> 0:14:29.840 kind of interested in justice resort of you know, that 0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:32.040 kind of thing, so that you know, so I saw 0:14:32.080 --> 0:14:35.640 something in relation to that yesterday or the other day. 0:14:35.760 --> 0:14:39.080 So it's it's not over, you know. I just we 0:14:39.160 --> 0:14:41.560 always think that, oh my god, this is the biggest thing, 0:14:41.760 --> 0:14:44.080 you know, And and in a way, you know, it's 0:14:44.120 --> 0:14:45.720 not that I'm arguing with you, you know, I don't 0:14:45.720 --> 0:14:47.480 want to harp on that. I mean it could very 0:14:47.520 --> 0:14:50.720 well be, and and in certain ways it is, and 0:14:50.760 --> 0:14:53.200 it's you know, and it's arguable and it's debatable. It 0:14:53.240 --> 0:14:58.160 could be the biggest thing. But just like life, just 0:14:58.240 --> 0:15:02.920 like time, the timeline, it's never the end, you know, 0:15:03.160 --> 0:15:05.360 just like wrestling, it's never the end. 0:15:05.600 --> 0:15:05.800 You know. 0:15:06.000 --> 0:15:10.640 It's a never ending story. It's a book with endless chapters. 0:15:11.400 --> 0:15:17.120 And just because this has shaken the world, you know, 0:15:17.680 --> 0:15:21.640 in that you know, Neck of the Woods and with WWE, 0:15:23.000 --> 0:15:27.800 you know, it doesn't mean that there aren't major developments, 0:15:29.640 --> 0:15:35.120 unknown facts. You know, the story I think is still developing. 0:15:35.880 --> 0:15:39.440 And listen, man, I mean, you know, this goes back 0:15:39.480 --> 0:15:42.000 a couple of years ago. People were like, oh, Vince 0:15:42.080 --> 0:15:44.720 is going to sell. They thought he was going to 0:15:44.760 --> 0:15:52.720 sell to the Saudis. Instead, there's an Endeavor merger. But really, 0:15:52.960 --> 0:15:56.960 if we're being honest with each other, it's an endeavor acquisition. 0:15:57.640 --> 0:16:04.040 At least. Now anything could happen they you know, Endeavor 0:16:04.320 --> 0:16:07.840 could decide one day that now that they've raised the 0:16:07.880 --> 0:16:12.640 profile and level of WWE up there with UFC, which 0:16:12.720 --> 0:16:16.520 was their baby first, they could decide to split them 0:16:16.560 --> 0:16:19.360 again and they could sell it to the Saudis, just 0:16:19.400 --> 0:16:21.520 like pfl is with this, you know, just like Live 0:16:21.560 --> 0:16:23.160 golfs with this. You know what I mean, I mean, 0:16:23.880 --> 0:16:26.960 you know, talking about how anything could happen, and it's 0:16:27.000 --> 0:16:32.840 a book with endless chapters. You know, it's twenty twenty four. 0:16:33.240 --> 0:16:36.760 You know, who knows what twenty twenty six holds. Who 0:16:36.800 --> 0:16:39.360 knows what twenty twenty eight holds. You know, we don't know. 0:16:39.960 --> 0:16:43.200 So I don't remember where I was because for as 0:16:43.240 --> 0:16:50.480 big of a story as it is, it just, you know, 0:16:50.560 --> 0:16:52.840 for me, it was whatever day. You know, it was Tuesday, 0:16:52.920 --> 0:16:57.440 you know, it was just it was big. But you know, 0:16:57.600 --> 0:17:00.000 this this is a crazy business. I mean, it's you know, 0:17:00.720 --> 0:17:04.720 ever since I got to the ECW level, ever since 0:17:04.760 --> 0:17:08.879 about ninety five ninety six, nothing surprised me. 0:17:10.119 --> 0:17:10.919 That's very fair. 0:17:11.520 --> 0:17:14.240 You made some great historical points that I want to 0:17:14.280 --> 0:17:16.760 go back to. You know, you're a longtime fan. You 0:17:16.800 --> 0:17:18.960 said you've been watching since eighty three. You know, you've 0:17:19.000 --> 0:17:21.960 been in the sheets since eighty nine. I started watching 0:17:22.040 --> 0:17:24.040 in nineteen eighty seven. You know, I didn't really get 0:17:24.080 --> 0:17:26.880 into the Sheets until I really like hit the internet 0:17:27.320 --> 0:17:31.119 in the late nineties, maybe like ninety six. But I 0:17:31.160 --> 0:17:33.880 listened to the wrestling radio shows that were all over 0:17:34.000 --> 0:17:36.360 the New York area, you know, in the late eighties 0:17:36.400 --> 0:17:40.320 and early nineties. Ye, you know, my uncle would give 0:17:40.359 --> 0:17:42.720 me any kind of information he could the Slammer in 0:17:42.760 --> 0:17:45.000 the Daily News. I got whatever I could get, Right, 0:17:46.040 --> 0:17:49.719 We lived through this stuff, what's that likewise? Yeah, we 0:17:49.800 --> 0:17:52.960 lived through this stuff with Vince already. We lived through scandals. 0:17:53.320 --> 0:17:55.320 We lived through really bad stuff and. 0:17:55.240 --> 0:17:58.960 He was gone for a little while. But this one's bad. 0:17:59.040 --> 0:18:02.680 But we lived through some really really bad stuff if 0:18:02.720 --> 0:18:06.600 there was social media. Let's go back to nineteen ninety two, right, 0:18:06.720 --> 0:18:10.320 the Ring Boy scandal that was really bad. That was 0:18:11.040 --> 0:18:15.280 if you could put that into today's standards, that I 0:18:15.280 --> 0:18:18.959 don't honestly, I don't think the WWF would have survived 0:18:19.359 --> 0:18:22.840 had the Ring Boy scandal hit twenty twenty four. 0:18:23.080 --> 0:18:25.399 Because that's how bad it was. 0:18:25.480 --> 0:18:25.680 Now. 0:18:25.720 --> 0:18:27.879 That is not to say that what's going on with 0:18:28.080 --> 0:18:30.680 the filings and all the stuff that's coming out now 0:18:30.680 --> 0:18:34.320 with Janelle Grant events is not better or worse, but 0:18:34.359 --> 0:18:37.400 that Ring Boy stuff was horrible, and stuff that I've 0:18:37.400 --> 0:18:39.680 heard from guys who were there at the time that's 0:18:39.760 --> 0:18:43.520 not really public. There's some really bad shit that has 0:18:43.600 --> 0:18:47.720 never been told out into the shoot interview ranks of 0:18:47.720 --> 0:18:50.439 the world. And there's a bad stuff with that Ring 0:18:50.520 --> 0:18:53.760 boy scandal and they skirted, and had it been made public, 0:18:54.040 --> 0:18:56.360 I think the WWF would have been gone forever. 0:18:56.960 --> 0:19:00.040 I believe it. And there was the steroid scandal, and 0:19:00.080 --> 0:19:03.160 before that there was Chic and Duggan, and before that 0:19:03.200 --> 0:19:05.639 there was rita Chatterdan. I mean, there's always kind of 0:19:05.640 --> 0:19:08.240 you know, I mean, you know, there's always been kind 0:19:08.240 --> 0:19:12.520 of whispers and secrets and kind of you know, there's 0:19:12.600 --> 0:19:14.399 and then you know, now we find out you know, 0:19:14.920 --> 0:19:19.280 who knows you know, fabulous Mulah is you know, under 0:19:19.280 --> 0:19:22.280 the kind of microscope and people are you know, so 0:19:22.560 --> 0:19:27.560 like there's always kind of been you know, there's always 0:19:27.640 --> 0:19:31.600 been you know a little bit kind of of shady activity. 0:19:32.119 --> 0:19:35.760 You know, it's just but again, you know, just like life, 0:19:35.960 --> 0:19:37.880 you know, I mean it's you know in politics too, 0:19:38.040 --> 0:19:41.359 you know, in in entertainment and mainstream entertainment too. In 0:19:41.359 --> 0:19:47.119 Hollywood there's just uh, you know, every there's scandal. You know, 0:19:47.280 --> 0:19:51.680 it's you know, not everything is one hundred percent peaches 0:19:51.720 --> 0:19:55.320 and cream and and you know roses and you know, 0:19:56.920 --> 0:19:59.480 you know France scenes at Disney World, not everywhere is there. 0:19:59.640 --> 0:20:02.320 You know, everywhere is always the happiest place on earth, 0:20:04.560 --> 0:20:06.479 and it's just kind of the way it is and 0:20:06.520 --> 0:20:11.120 with wrestling, it just you know, it's always had a 0:20:11.200 --> 0:20:15.520 kind of edge. But you know it's you know, you 0:20:15.600 --> 0:20:20.399 got to show like dark side of the ring, so 0:20:20.480 --> 0:20:22.879 there's got to be you know, there is you know, 0:20:22.920 --> 0:20:29.080 it's not completely dark. It's not evil, it's not the 0:20:29.240 --> 0:20:33.679 bad neighborhood on the wrong side of the tracks, but 0:20:33.840 --> 0:20:36.760 there's you know, there is a dark side, you know, 0:20:36.800 --> 0:20:40.080 and there are things that happen, and there are people 0:20:40.960 --> 0:20:42.480 that you know, take liberties. 0:20:44.240 --> 0:20:45.720 What do you kind of stand with that show? With 0:20:45.840 --> 0:20:46.600 Dark Side of the Ring? 0:20:47.119 --> 0:20:49.520 It's I mean, I think there's been episodes that are 0:20:49.520 --> 0:20:54.480 been entertaining, somewhat informative and informational, but then there's some 0:20:54.600 --> 0:20:56.960 I think kind of cross the line, come off a 0:20:56.960 --> 0:20:58.359 little sallacious. 0:20:58.080 --> 0:21:00.800 Maybe a little bit too you know, on this as sleazy. 0:21:01.320 --> 0:21:03.400 But again, you know that's just me as a as 0:21:03.400 --> 0:21:06.200 a fan somebody who's worked around the business, but somebody 0:21:06.200 --> 0:21:07.879 who's in the business like yourself, Like where do you 0:21:07.960 --> 0:21:10.040 kind of fall on the dark side of the Ring discussion? 0:21:10.480 --> 0:21:13.720 I'm glad it's around to critique, you know, like like 0:21:13.720 --> 0:21:17.600 like you say, some episodes are better than others. It 0:21:17.760 --> 0:21:20.800 can you know, depending on your opinion or how what 0:21:20.880 --> 0:21:23.119 you know about a certain story, how much you know 0:21:23.200 --> 0:21:25.879 who you know that kind of thing, you know you 0:21:26.960 --> 0:21:33.399 it is. It is varied and it is eclectic. You know, 0:21:33.880 --> 0:21:39.040 it's not one hundred percent precise. I don't know if 0:21:39.080 --> 0:21:41.520 it's meant to be. I mean they put a lot 0:21:41.560 --> 0:21:46.359 of time, effort, money, and energy into it. They when 0:21:46.400 --> 0:21:51.159 they cast for people who are to look like the 0:21:51.240 --> 0:21:54.560 people that they're portraying and representing, they do a bang 0:21:54.640 --> 0:21:57.080 up job. They do an unbelievable job finding people that 0:21:57.080 --> 0:22:00.760 pretty much look exactly like the wrestling person that they 0:22:01.040 --> 0:22:06.120 are trying to represent. So you know, it's not shoddy, 0:22:06.840 --> 0:22:10.120 it's not ramshackle, and it's not hand fisted. I mean, 0:22:10.280 --> 0:22:13.600 I think they're trying their best and doing their best work, 0:22:14.119 --> 0:22:16.600 and a lot of the time, I think it's worthwhile. 0:22:17.200 --> 0:22:22.360 I think it's informative. I think it's entertaining, and I'm 0:22:22.480 --> 0:22:25.399 glad that it's on the air, that it got green lit, 0:22:25.760 --> 0:22:29.600 that it got produced, that it's aired, and that you know, 0:22:30.240 --> 0:22:32.080 you know that we're able to critique it. You know. 0:22:32.840 --> 0:22:35.880 Yeah, Now there's a couple I mean we reviewed I would. 0:22:35.680 --> 0:22:39.640 Say three or four from this past season. We obviously 0:22:39.680 --> 0:22:42.240 we did Chris and Tammy, we did Bam Bam, and 0:22:42.280 --> 0:22:44.480 we did the Marty Jeanetti episode. And I thought that 0:22:44.520 --> 0:22:48.399 Marty Jeanetti episode, I mean I thought that at the 0:22:48.480 --> 0:22:50.680 end of it, you kind of really like it was more, 0:22:50.920 --> 0:22:54.679 you know, more very depressing than anything. But you know, 0:22:54.680 --> 0:22:57.080 they kind of built you up like always hard partying is, 0:22:57.160 --> 0:22:58.960 isn't that? But it ended up being very sad at 0:22:58.960 --> 0:23:01.560 the end, and you know, we really felt for Marty 0:23:01.640 --> 0:23:03.600 and the pain he's going through with his leg. And 0:23:04.640 --> 0:23:06.639 I don't know what they're going for, you know, what 0:23:06.920 --> 0:23:08.440 are they trying to do or they trying to tell 0:23:08.480 --> 0:23:11.119 you the stories of the guys because they want you 0:23:11.200 --> 0:23:14.600 to know about their careers, or are they trying to 0:23:14.720 --> 0:23:17.560 make them look like sympathetic figures because they want you 0:23:17.840 --> 0:23:18.760 to feel bad for them. 0:23:18.800 --> 0:23:22.040 So I don't know. It's a very weird thing. 0:23:22.080 --> 0:23:24.840 But now you know, we have an episode like Sandman 0:23:25.000 --> 0:23:27.960 is coming up in this new season. I'm dying to 0:23:28.040 --> 0:23:30.000 watch it because I've been around sand Man a lot 0:23:30.080 --> 0:23:32.159 over the last couple of years, and he's a walking 0:23:32.240 --> 0:23:34.880 episode of Dark Southern because he's I think it's gonna 0:23:34.880 --> 0:23:37.480 be one of the best episodes ever because he's great. 0:23:37.640 --> 0:23:40.600 I mean, he's he's he's amazing, So I can't imagine 0:23:40.600 --> 0:23:41.920 what they got out of him for an hour. 0:23:42.440 --> 0:23:48.119 Yeah, he's a genius. Yeah, I think I wouldn't be 0:23:48.160 --> 0:23:50.560 surprised if A lot of what they're going for is 0:23:50.680 --> 0:24:02.359 they want you to see how unique and special and interesting, bizarre, 0:24:02.640 --> 0:24:10.879 whatever the real people behind the wrestling gimmicks are. I 0:24:10.920 --> 0:24:15.640