1 00:00:02,440 --> 00:00:06,760 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:08,760 --> 00:00:11,920 Speaker 2: Oil can be a winning lottery ticket for a country, 3 00:00:11,960 --> 00:00:15,960 Speaker 2: transforming economies wherever it's found. But what happens when you 4 00:00:16,079 --> 00:00:17,840 Speaker 2: can't get the oil out? 5 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:21,239 Speaker 3: A perfect storm is gathering in South Sudan. 6 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:25,720 Speaker 4: Oil fueled Sudan's bloody two decade long civil war, but 7 00:00:25,880 --> 00:00:28,880 Speaker 4: now for the black goal to keep flowing to China, 8 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:32,320 Speaker 4: its main buyer, both sides need each other. 9 00:00:32,800 --> 00:00:36,280 Speaker 2: South Sudan, the world's youngest country, depends on oil to 10 00:00:36,320 --> 00:00:39,800 Speaker 2: fund its economy, but a blocked pipeline has left the 11 00:00:39,840 --> 00:00:44,040 Speaker 2: already crisis rocked country rapidly running out of money and 12 00:00:44,120 --> 00:00:47,520 Speaker 2: with the world's attention elsewhere, unable to get enough help. 13 00:00:48,120 --> 00:00:53,040 Speaker 3: Uncertainties in the face of critical political events necessary for 14 00:00:53,159 --> 00:00:59,800 Speaker 3: a peaceful transition a rapidly deteriorating economy, exacerbated by the 15 00:01:00,880 --> 00:01:05,400 Speaker 3: in critical oil infrastructure and oil revenue. Time is running out, 16 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:09,199 Speaker 3: and the costs of inaction at this juncture are too great. 17 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:12,840 Speaker 2: On this episode of The Next Africa podcast, we'll look 18 00:01:12,880 --> 00:01:15,760 Speaker 2: at what's gone wrong in South Sudan and how the 19 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:18,880 Speaker 2: impacts of a failing state are being felt. 20 00:01:18,520 --> 00:01:20,280 Speaker 5: On the streets of the nation's capital. 21 00:01:22,319 --> 00:01:25,800 Speaker 2: I'm Jennifer Zabasajep and this is the Next Africa Podcast, 22 00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:29,160 Speaker 2: bringing you one story each week from the continent, driving 23 00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:32,560 Speaker 2: the future of global growth with the context only Bloomberg 24 00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:38,759 Speaker 2: can provide. Joining us this week is our reporter at large, 25 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:42,160 Speaker 2: Simon Marx. He's been reporting on this story for Bloomberg 26 00:01:42,200 --> 00:01:44,640 Speaker 2: News and he's with us now. Hi, Simon, how are 27 00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:45,319 Speaker 2: you hi? 28 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:45,839 Speaker 1: That great? 29 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:48,080 Speaker 5: Thanks thanks for being on the podcast this week. 30 00:01:48,160 --> 00:01:51,840 Speaker 2: So let's just start with the little history of South Sudan. 31 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:55,880 Speaker 2: It's known as the world's youngest country. How did it 32 00:01:55,960 --> 00:01:59,040 Speaker 2: manage to gain its independence just a little over a 33 00:01:59,080 --> 00:01:59,520 Speaker 2: decade ago? 34 00:01:59,600 --> 00:02:00,480 Speaker 5: Take us back to that. 35 00:02:01,640 --> 00:02:04,320 Speaker 6: Yeah, so South Sudan, as you say, it does have 36 00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:08,040 Speaker 6: this tagline as the world's youngest country. It got its 37 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:12,440 Speaker 6: independence in July twenty and eleven after a referendum was 38 00:02:12,480 --> 00:02:16,480 Speaker 6: held in the country, and this happened after long standing 39 00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:21,760 Speaker 6: tensions with Sudan in the north. Obviously Sudan South Sudan 40 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:27,080 Speaker 6: used to be unified, but because the capital Khartum controlled 41 00:02:27,160 --> 00:02:30,160 Speaker 6: all the finances and took a lot of the money 42 00:02:30,760 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 6: from the South, which is oil rich, there's always been 43 00:02:34,120 --> 00:02:38,120 Speaker 6: this standoff between these two countries. Over who gets the 44 00:02:38,160 --> 00:02:41,480 Speaker 6: lion's share of that, and so that led eventually to 45 00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:43,839 Speaker 6: a referendum and the country's independence. 46 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:47,640 Speaker 2: You talked a bit about this, but the natural resource 47 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:52,760 Speaker 2: what makes this country really rich in theory is oil, right, 48 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:55,639 Speaker 2: But how much oil are we we actually talking about here? 49 00:02:56,000 --> 00:02:59,160 Speaker 6: Yeah, In the case of South Sudan, oil revenues really 50 00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:02,000 Speaker 6: account or nearly all government revenues. 51 00:03:02,080 --> 00:03:06,080 Speaker 1: It's over ninety percent of what the government earns. 52 00:03:06,160 --> 00:03:10,399 Speaker 6: Comes from a series of oil fields, mainly in the 53 00:03:10,440 --> 00:03:14,120 Speaker 6: north of the country and in total, before war broke 54 00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:17,640 Speaker 6: out in neighboring Sudan last year, it was producing about 55 00:03:17,840 --> 00:03:20,480 Speaker 6: one hundred and fifty thousand barrels a day of oil 56 00:03:21,160 --> 00:03:23,919 Speaker 6: and that was going through a pipeline all the way 57 00:03:24,040 --> 00:03:26,839 Speaker 6: to the Red Sea coast where it was exported out 58 00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 6: of Port Sudan. Earlier this year, in around February, there 59 00:03:31,840 --> 00:03:36,920 Speaker 6: were rumors that began perculating that the oil pipeline just 60 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 6: inside Sudan, its northern neighbor where there's a civil war underway. 61 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:45,360 Speaker 1: Had burst and that oil production had stopped. 62 00:03:46,040 --> 00:03:49,480 Speaker 6: And eventually information came out from the government that indeed 63 00:03:49,520 --> 00:03:52,520 Speaker 6: there had been a blockage in the pipeline that was 64 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:56,680 Speaker 6: caused from a lack of diesel to run generators and 65 00:03:56,800 --> 00:04:00,480 Speaker 6: equipment that thinned the crude because South Sudan's crude oil 66 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:03,800 Speaker 6: is actually very sick and access to this area was 67 00:04:03,840 --> 00:04:08,560 Speaker 6: obviously very difficult and engineers initially anyway, could not get 68 00:04:08,600 --> 00:04:09,800 Speaker 6: there to fix the problem. 69 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:13,720 Speaker 2: And this has been several months that this has gone on, Simon. 70 00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:16,000 Speaker 1: Correct, Yeah, so at least since February. 71 00:04:16,160 --> 00:04:20,080 Speaker 6: Confirmation of this rupture came through in February via Sudan's 72 00:04:20,080 --> 00:04:24,240 Speaker 6: Minister of Energy and Petroleum, and ever since there's been 73 00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:27,720 Speaker 6: very little oil getting out and that has resulted in 74 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:32,120 Speaker 6: pretty pretty disastrous eventualities for the government. 75 00:04:32,880 --> 00:04:36,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, Simon, maybe you can talk us through that, because 76 00:04:36,839 --> 00:04:41,400 Speaker 2: surely it's trickling down to everyday people, South Sudanese people. 77 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:44,440 Speaker 5: How is this being materialized, I guess on the ground. 78 00:04:44,880 --> 00:04:49,200 Speaker 6: Yeah, So, prior to this happening, South Sudan was already 79 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:53,000 Speaker 6: in a pretty disastrous situation. You know, it's been through 80 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:57,200 Speaker 6: years of civil war after its independence. Civil war broke 81 00:04:57,240 --> 00:05:00,920 Speaker 6: out in South Sudan between its president and Vice President 82 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:05,440 Speaker 6: Rick Macha, and despite there being a peace deal in 83 00:05:05,440 --> 00:05:08,719 Speaker 6: twenty eighteen, there's been a lot of violence in the 84 00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 6: country ever since that date, however, what's happened with the 85 00:05:13,240 --> 00:05:18,760 Speaker 6: oil revenues has just compounded and already terrible humanitarian situation 86 00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:21,839 Speaker 6: in South Sudan. It's a country where millions of people 87 00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:25,720 Speaker 6: were displaced even before this oil problem. But you know, 88 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:29,680 Speaker 6: we've had access in the capital Juba. We're really seeing 89 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:34,360 Speaker 6: a complete meltdown of the civil service of public amenities, 90 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:38,680 Speaker 6: from hospitals to schools, where teachers are no longer going 91 00:05:38,720 --> 00:05:42,279 Speaker 6: to work because they're not getting their salaries. We've spoken 92 00:05:42,320 --> 00:05:45,120 Speaker 6: to teachers who are now just working odd jobs on 93 00:05:45,160 --> 00:05:47,720 Speaker 6: the site, forming their own little restaurant, of their own 94 00:05:47,800 --> 00:05:50,000 Speaker 6: little shop at the side of the road, for example. 95 00:05:50,680 --> 00:05:54,080 Speaker 6: So that's resulted in kids not going to school. Hospitals 96 00:05:54,200 --> 00:05:57,480 Speaker 6: where there used to be power are now very often 97 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:02,159 Speaker 6: facing outages. That's resulted in some cases loss of life 98 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:05,839 Speaker 6: inside hospitals due to the lack of power. So yeah, 99 00:06:06,160 --> 00:06:07,560 Speaker 6: it's a really terrible situation. 100 00:06:08,040 --> 00:06:11,160 Speaker 2: And how then, Simon, I mean, if what you're describing 101 00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:14,000 Speaker 2: is the situation on the ground, how is the government 102 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:17,599 Speaker 2: then functioning? What is the government doing at this point 103 00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:20,920 Speaker 2: about the deteriorating situation in the country. 104 00:06:21,279 --> 00:06:24,839 Speaker 6: So the South Studentese government, in order to try and 105 00:06:24,920 --> 00:06:30,440 Speaker 6: alleviate the problem with its public finances, has reached out 106 00:06:30,680 --> 00:06:34,120 Speaker 6: to foreign players, mainly in the Gulf. We've spoken to 107 00:06:34,200 --> 00:06:37,960 Speaker 6: officials and diplomats who are aware of what South Dudan 108 00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:41,360 Speaker 6: has been up to, who have confirmed that there's been 109 00:06:41,400 --> 00:06:45,839 Speaker 6: senior officials visit Dubai, for example, in the United Arab Emirates. 110 00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:50,039 Speaker 6: It's to date putty unclear if they've managed to get 111 00:06:50,080 --> 00:06:53,479 Speaker 6: any funds out of such countries. It does seem though 112 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:56,880 Speaker 6: that they're having to cut costs everywhere. There's even in 113 00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,719 Speaker 6: ministries where they had air conditioning. 114 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:01,280 Speaker 1: Uba is a very hot city. 115 00:07:01,960 --> 00:07:04,719 Speaker 6: Everything's turned off and civil servants just don't turn up 116 00:07:04,760 --> 00:07:07,760 Speaker 6: to work and they're unable to pay in many cases 117 00:07:07,839 --> 00:07:13,360 Speaker 6: salaries for your average state worker. So the state pretty 118 00:07:13,440 --> 00:07:15,840 Speaker 6: much is on the verge of bankruptcy. 119 00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:18,720 Speaker 2: Stick with us, Simon. When we come back, we'll look 120 00:07:18,760 --> 00:07:21,160 Speaker 2: more into what daily life is like at the moment 121 00:07:21,200 --> 00:07:24,640 Speaker 2: in South Sudan and whether there's any hope for improvement. 122 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:31,880 Speaker 5: We'll be right back. Welcome back today. 123 00:07:31,880 --> 00:07:35,040 Speaker 2: On the podcast, we're digging into South Sudan and how 124 00:07:35,080 --> 00:07:39,120 Speaker 2: a broken oil pipeline has left the country desperately short 125 00:07:39,160 --> 00:07:42,160 Speaker 2: of any income. Simon Marx has been following this story 126 00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:45,320 Speaker 2: very closely. Simon, you were taking us through a lot 127 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:48,360 Speaker 2: of the stories of daily life for people there. I 128 00:07:48,400 --> 00:07:52,520 Speaker 2: wonder if there's any person or story that really stuck 129 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:56,960 Speaker 2: out to you that you think really describes or encapsulates 130 00:07:57,000 --> 00:07:59,480 Speaker 2: the situation that South Sudan is in right now. 131 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:02,280 Speaker 6: There are many stories on the ground there of people 132 00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:08,560 Speaker 6: suffering to access basic services that the government ordinarily would provide. 133 00:08:09,080 --> 00:08:12,080 Speaker 6: There was one story when we spoke to a woman, 134 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:15,440 Speaker 6: her name is Sarah at Teng. She was stood outside 135 00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:19,320 Speaker 6: the Al Sabah Children's Hospital in the capital where she 136 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:22,200 Speaker 6: was trying to get access to medicine for her one 137 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:26,920 Speaker 6: year old daughter who had problems respiratory problems, and she 138 00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:31,840 Speaker 6: told us that essentially there was no medication left inside 139 00:08:31,840 --> 00:08:35,000 Speaker 6: the hospital and she'd been going back to the hospital 140 00:08:35,600 --> 00:08:40,640 Speaker 6: continuously since February when the oil pipeline ruptured, to try 141 00:08:40,679 --> 00:08:42,839 Speaker 6: and get some medication for her. 142 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:44,480 Speaker 1: Daughter and just hadn't been able to do it. 143 00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:49,400 Speaker 6: And I think, you know, her situation really encapsulated some 144 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:52,400 Speaker 6: of the desperation on the streets of Juba, the capital 145 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:55,880 Speaker 6: of this country, and in theory, the place where you 146 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:58,960 Speaker 6: would go to get help if you have a sick child. 147 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:02,200 Speaker 2: Would you say that there's an awareness from the international 148 00:09:02,200 --> 00:09:06,600 Speaker 2: community of just how bad it is and how pressing 149 00:09:06,760 --> 00:09:10,280 Speaker 2: AID needs to get into South Sudan. 150 00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:17,160 Speaker 6: I think, you know, inside NGOs and UN agencies there 151 00:09:17,320 --> 00:09:20,960 Speaker 6: is a sense of how disastrous the situation is there, 152 00:09:20,960 --> 00:09:26,079 Speaker 6: but unfortunately it's totally overshadowed by what's happening just north 153 00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:29,600 Speaker 6: in Sudan, where there's a full blown civil war that's 154 00:09:29,640 --> 00:09:32,360 Speaker 6: been going on for over a year now, and all 155 00:09:32,400 --> 00:09:35,400 Speaker 6: the focus is there, where a famine has been announced 156 00:09:36,040 --> 00:09:39,240 Speaker 6: and tens of thousands of civilians are dying amid the 157 00:09:39,280 --> 00:09:43,600 Speaker 6: warfare there. So in comparison, unfortunately, South Sudan really is 158 00:09:44,200 --> 00:09:45,880 Speaker 6: somewhat forgotten about that. 159 00:09:45,880 --> 00:09:47,199 Speaker 1: There also seems to be a. 160 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:50,960 Speaker 6: Fair amount of apathy around trying to make this country 161 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:54,080 Speaker 6: actually work. There was so much hope in the beginning 162 00:09:54,720 --> 00:09:58,120 Speaker 6: to create this new nation, and two years after its 163 00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:02,439 Speaker 6: independence it fell into civil war. Orn's never really managed 164 00:10:02,960 --> 00:10:07,960 Speaker 6: to hold proper elections and get the ball rolling on 165 00:10:08,040 --> 00:10:13,120 Speaker 6: forming its state. So unfortunately, the people I talk to, though, 166 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:16,839 Speaker 6: there is quite a lot of simply almost giving up. 167 00:10:17,840 --> 00:10:22,280 Speaker 2: And that's even despite the fact that potentially there is 168 00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:25,600 Speaker 2: an outcome in which the oil pipeline is fixed and 169 00:10:25,640 --> 00:10:28,840 Speaker 2: it's turned back on again. Are there still people that 170 00:10:28,880 --> 00:10:31,839 Speaker 2: are holding out hope for that eventuality? 171 00:10:32,360 --> 00:10:35,160 Speaker 1: Yes, there is some light at the end of the tunnel. 172 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:40,199 Speaker 6: Very recently, officials from South Sudan's Petroleum Ministry have visited 173 00:10:40,240 --> 00:10:45,880 Speaker 6: Port Sudan to inspect equipment at the port there ahead 174 00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:49,199 Speaker 6: of what they say is an imminent resumption of oil production. 175 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:52,840 Speaker 6: But you know, we're still waiting. They say it could 176 00:10:52,840 --> 00:10:57,319 Speaker 6: happen any day now. Officials within the consortium the oil 177 00:10:57,559 --> 00:11:02,520 Speaker 6: operators do also confirm that aiming at end of October 178 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:03,600 Speaker 6: beginning of November. 179 00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:07,120 Speaker 2: So then what's next to look out for, Simon? Is 180 00:11:07,120 --> 00:11:09,960 Speaker 2: it when potentially the taps turn back on. What is 181 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:11,440 Speaker 2: it that you're closely watching? 182 00:11:12,200 --> 00:11:15,160 Speaker 6: Yeah, I think the next thing to watch it will 183 00:11:15,200 --> 00:11:19,680 Speaker 6: be if the oil can flow again, But also what 184 00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:23,560 Speaker 6: happens to the money that the government earns as a 185 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 6: result of this, and if they start providing services to 186 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:31,840 Speaker 6: its people or if they continue to take advantage of 187 00:11:31,880 --> 00:11:35,200 Speaker 6: some of that money for themselves. One aspect of this 188 00:11:35,240 --> 00:11:39,319 Speaker 6: whole thing that we spotted is everyone who's been investing 189 00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:42,680 Speaker 6: in oil working in the oil industry. When that sector 190 00:11:42,760 --> 00:11:46,480 Speaker 6: dried up, they began investing in land in Jubrn and 191 00:11:46,640 --> 00:11:50,280 Speaker 6: this has produced a spike in land praises in some cases. 192 00:11:50,920 --> 00:11:54,200 Speaker 6: And we've reported that to these businessmen involved in the 193 00:11:54,200 --> 00:11:57,360 Speaker 6: oil sector at some points coming into the city with 194 00:11:57,440 --> 00:12:01,000 Speaker 6: bags of cash to speculatively get their hands on land. 195 00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:06,320 Speaker 6: So yeah, you can see the sort of other spillover effects. 196 00:12:05,920 --> 00:12:08,199 Speaker 1: Through this from the lack of oil production. 197 00:12:09,120 --> 00:12:13,360 Speaker 2: Would you say there's a hope amongst the population that 198 00:12:13,480 --> 00:12:16,760 Speaker 2: things could potentially turn around soon for them. 199 00:12:17,120 --> 00:12:21,800 Speaker 6: I think there's a lot of dissatisfaction generally amongst the 200 00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:23,680 Speaker 6: public in the current government. 201 00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:26,280 Speaker 1: Elections were supposed to be held this year. 202 00:12:26,920 --> 00:12:31,640 Speaker 6: The country's partners, including the US, are not endorsing elections 203 00:12:31,679 --> 00:12:34,199 Speaker 6: this year because they feel they won't be free and fair, 204 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:39,800 Speaker 6: and so the population definitely they want services back, but 205 00:12:39,960 --> 00:12:44,199 Speaker 6: I think they also want more responsible leaders running government 206 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:45,880 Speaker 6: to go hand in hand with that. 207 00:12:46,320 --> 00:12:49,160 Speaker 2: And you can read Simon's piece for Bloomberg City Labs 208 00:12:49,200 --> 00:12:51,400 Speaker 2: on Bloomberg News platforms right now. 209 00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:55,680 Speaker 5: Here's a few other stories we're following in the region. 210 00:12:56,360 --> 00:12:57,040 Speaker 1: Mosim began. 211 00:12:57,160 --> 00:13:01,439 Speaker 2: Opposition politician Venancio Mundlin has called for a country wide 212 00:13:01,440 --> 00:13:04,920 Speaker 2: strike to protest preliminary results that put him in second 213 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:08,600 Speaker 2: place in the country's presidential election. He urged supporters to 214 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:11,520 Speaker 2: paralyze the country, according to a video posted to his 215 00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:16,679 Speaker 2: social media channels, including YouTube, on Wednesday. Mundlin has repeatedly 216 00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:20,599 Speaker 2: said he was winning, and the US has offered intelligence 217 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:23,559 Speaker 2: sharing to both the DRC and Rwanda in a bid 218 00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:26,480 Speaker 2: to bring about a ceasefire in the conflict that has 219 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:30,400 Speaker 2: displaced more than two million people. US officials have touted 220 00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:33,960 Speaker 2: the success of their intelligence diplomacy, but it hasn't yet 221 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:37,559 Speaker 2: led to a stable end to hostilities. You can follow 222 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:41,480 Speaker 2: these stories across Bloomberg, including the Next African Newsletter. We'll 223 00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:45,839 Speaker 2: put a link to that in the show notes. This 224 00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:50,040 Speaker 2: program was produced by Adrian Bradley. Don't forget to follow 225 00:13:50,080 --> 00:13:53,240 Speaker 2: and review this show wherever you usually get your podcasts. 226 00:13:53,679 --> 00:13:56,360 Speaker 5: I'm Jennifer's Abasaja. Thanks as always for listening.