Speaker 1: It's Thursday, October fift I'm Oscar Ramiraz from the Daily
Speaker 1: Dive podcast in Los Angeles, and this is reopening America.
Speaker 1: There was this time early in the pandemic where employers
Speaker 1: thought they would be relying on rapid response tests to
Speaker 1: get employees back to work safely. But as we have
Speaker 1: seen with recent events, testing alone won't stop the spread
Speaker 1: of COVID nineteen. These tests were not designed to be
Speaker 1: used this way, and there's only one part of a
Speaker 1: full response plan. Arian Marshall, staff writer at Wired, joins
Speaker 1: us for how and when tests should be used for
Speaker 1: returning to work. Thanks for joining us, Sorry on, thanks
Speaker 1: for having me. I wanted to talk about testing for
Speaker 1: employers and at the workplace for some time early in
Speaker 1: the pandemic, a lot of people were writing it up
Speaker 1: as testing is going to be the main thing to
Speaker 1: get people back to work. You know, you get your tests,
Speaker 1: make sure you're testing negative, you don't have coronavirus, get
Speaker 1: to work and you're good. And we're all kind of
Speaker 1: waiting for these rapid tests to come on board and
Speaker 1: start being a little cheaper so more people can use them. Well,
Speaker 1: a lot of employers that are relying on these rapid tests.
Speaker 1: Now are kind of rethinking it, and the obviously the
Speaker 1: White House is an example of why that might not work.
Speaker 1: The White House is relying on a lot of rapid
Speaker 1: tests to get to business as usual in people being
Speaker 1: around the president, and now we're seeing a bunch of
Speaker 1: cases there. So Arianna tell us a little bit about
Speaker 1: these rapid tests, tell us about the nuances of how
Speaker 1: these tests should be used and how they should be
Speaker 1: used for for workers to get back to it. It's
Speaker 1: a really difficult problem. I think you're right. In the
Speaker 1: beginning of the pandemic, it felt like, well, if we
Speaker 1: could only get enough tests for everyone, then everything would
Speaker 1: be solved. We can go back to work, we can
Speaker 1: go back to school, life continue as normal. But it's
Speaker 1: become apparent as the pandemic has gone on that a
Speaker 1: lot of tests, in particularly these rapid tests that are
Speaker 1: cheaper and that are quicker, aren't totally totally accurate. You
Speaker 1: sometimes get false positives and you also sometimes get false negatives.
Speaker 1: And the reason that's so bad and so scary is
Speaker 1: because it means that you could test negative, and you
Speaker 1: know what, workplace could say, oh okay, you don't have
Speaker 1: the coronavirus come on in, take off your mask. Let's
Speaker 1: pretend this pandemic isn't happening outside, and we'll continue our lives,
Speaker 1: when in fact you could be asymptomatic and could be
Speaker 1: able to give the coronavirus to your coworkers. And that's
Speaker 1: such a scary proposition for people that now going forward,
Speaker 1: a lot of the really smart workplaces are saying, Okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: we may offer tests, but it's also really important that
Speaker 1: even if you test negative on those tests, you still
Speaker 1: wear a mask and you still do social distancings. We
Speaker 1: try to do everything possible to cut down the risk
Speaker 1: for workers and for people just trying to live their lives.
Speaker 1: And these rapid tests in particular aren't really designed to
Speaker 1: catch asymptomatic cases of the virus. Those are a little
Speaker 1: more tricker. That's why you want these PCR tests, the
Speaker 1: ones that go down to a lab and are analyzed
Speaker 1: completely for any traces of the virus. So that's the
Speaker 1: other part of it is that these tests aren't designed
Speaker 1: for that. It's a tool in a suite of things
Speaker 1: to be used. Yeah. Absolutely, that's actually one of the
Speaker 1: sort of more frightening things about the way the White
Speaker 1: House in particular was using this test. They were using
Speaker 1: it reportedly, according to The New York Times and others,
Speaker 1: they were saying, hey, if you come and take this
Speaker 1: test and you have a negative result, you can interact
Speaker 1: with people like the President at close range without a mask.
Speaker 1: But actually the Trump administration's own Emergency Youth Authorization for
Speaker 1: some of these more recent rapid tests, which came out
Speaker 1: as recently as August, so that they were for use
Speaker 1: particularly for people with symptoms. So if you are asymptomatic
Speaker 1: and you get a negative on this test, it doesn't
Speaker 1: mean you don't have coronavirus. So it's really tricky. One
Speaker 1: of the interesting things that you found out in writing
Speaker 1: your article, though, is that testing does make people feel better.
Speaker 1: It's an important thing. I'm not trying to diminish taking
Speaker 1: these tests, even the rapid test. It's got to be
Speaker 1: used in conjunction with a lot of things. But it
Speaker 1: does make people feel better knowing that somebody has tested negative.
Speaker 1: At least you're not uncomfortable, let's say, working around others.
Speaker 1: And it's a hard thing for employers as a result,
Speaker 1: because they have employees say hey, it would really make
Speaker 1: me feel a lot better if everyone got tests to
Speaker 1: come back to the workplace. So employers are saying, okay, well,
Speaker 1: pony up for these if they make you feel better.
Speaker 1: But everyone should understand again that just because you've taken
Speaker 1: a test, even the more accurate tests, the tests that
Speaker 1: take a longer time, those PCR tests, and it says
Speaker 1: you're negative, that just means that in that very exact moment,
Speaker 1: you don't have coronavirus. But it could be that you
Speaker 1: step into an elevator, you go into a grocery store,
Speaker 1: do something else, interact with other people, and then get it,
Speaker 1: you know, the very next hour. So it's hard. You
Speaker 1: did speak to a couple of businesses and a couple
Speaker 1: of people who offer guidance to businesses also on opening
Speaker 1: up their workplaces. What do they say about these rapid
Speaker 1: tests and really how employers should be getting back to work.
Speaker 1: A lot of them are just like everyone else, working
Speaker 1: through the realities of living with this new virus that
Speaker 1: we've never seen before. And there's still so many open
Speaker 1: questions about how this virus works that you know, they're
Speaker 1: also having trouble, so they are getting new guidance from
Speaker 1: the CDC all the time. About the best ways to
Speaker 1: open up their workplace in a safe way. So the
Speaker 1: way these law firms and testing companies are advising employers
Speaker 1: is they're saying, hey, these are some important caveats when
Speaker 1: using these tests. That these are also why that they
Speaker 1: might be valuable for you. But again keep in mind
Speaker 1: that just having the test isn't going to make you safe.
Speaker 1: If you can in your workplace, please take all the
Speaker 1: possible precautions that are also offered by the CDC and
Speaker 1: other government authorities. Yeah, and as you mentioned, the guidance
Speaker 1: is always changing. Just last month, the CDC recommended against
Speaker 1: these test based strategies. You know, you've got to use
Speaker 1: all the tools that you have, so it is constantly
Speaker 1: a changing thing. Arian Marshall, staff writer at Wired. Thank
Speaker 1: you very much for joining us. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1: I'm Oscar Ramirez and this has been reopening America. Don't
Speaker 1: forget the effort. Today's big news stories. You can check
Speaker 1: me out on the Daily Dive podcast every Monday to Friday,
Speaker 1: So follow us on I Heart Radio or wherever you
Speaker 1: get your podcast.