WEBVTT - Hayden Panetierre With Abusive Ex At Death; Estranged Mom Speaks Out 0:00:02.200 --> 0:00:06.000 Hey there, folks. It is Wednesday, August nineteenth, and we 0:00:06.200 --> 0:00:09.960 are learning more about the details surrounding the death of 0:00:10.000 --> 0:00:16.439 actress Hayden Penetierre, including who was with her at the 0:00:16.480 --> 0:00:19.239 time of her death. And with this, welcome to this 0:00:19.320 --> 0:00:22.880 episode of Amy and TJ. This is certainly a big 0:00:22.920 --> 0:00:26.320 point of conversation right now, Robes. A lot of people 0:00:26.440 --> 0:00:32.000 might not be aware of her dating history, recent dating history, tumultuous, 0:00:32.320 --> 0:00:35.559 recent dating history. That guy was there, he was the 0:00:35.560 --> 0:00:36.360 one that plays the call. 0:00:36.560 --> 0:00:40.760 Yes, and this is you mentioned contentious, tumultuous, all of that. Yes, 0:00:40.880 --> 0:00:44.199 this is her on again, off again boyfriend that she 0:00:44.280 --> 0:00:49.879 started seeing pretty much as soon as her relationship with 0:00:49.920 --> 0:00:54.040 her fiance ended and her daughter moved over to Ukraine 0:00:54.120 --> 0:00:57.160 with her ex fiance, she pretty much immediately took up 0:00:57.200 --> 0:01:00.400 with this guy, Brian Hickerson is his name, third seven 0:01:00.440 --> 0:01:04.039 years old. And we're not just saying it was tumultuous. 0:01:04.120 --> 0:01:07.160 It's documented, there was legal action. This man is a 0:01:07.160 --> 0:01:11.559 convicted felon because of domestic violence incidents, and I say 0:01:11.560 --> 0:01:12.639 incidents that are. 0:01:12.560 --> 0:01:20.720 Plural involving Yes, Hayden Panetier, Robes, I wasn't that versed 0:01:21.760 --> 0:01:26.080 on her background with this guy, But as soon as 0:01:26.120 --> 0:01:29.000 she passed, a lot of people started bringing his name up, 0:01:29.720 --> 0:01:32.840 and not in an accusatory way, And we need to 0:01:32.840 --> 0:01:34.800 make sure we say that off the top. There is 0:01:34.920 --> 0:01:39.679 no body police included suggesting that this guy is in 0:01:39.720 --> 0:01:42.640 any way responsible for her death. We need to make 0:01:42.720 --> 0:01:46.600 that clear. No signs, nothing suspicious according to the authorities. 0:01:47.120 --> 0:01:50.280 But Robes, they started talking about him, and a lot 0:01:50.280 --> 0:01:54.000 of people are now surprised to hear they were together 0:01:54.720 --> 0:01:57.920 in South Carolina, which is where he is originally from. 0:01:57.640 --> 0:02:01.600 Exactly because look, it do seem as though and we're 0:02:01.600 --> 0:02:04.880 hearing from her mom, whom she wasn't even on speaking 0:02:04.960 --> 0:02:07.760 terms with at the time of her death, now speaking 0:02:07.760 --> 0:02:11.799 out but speaking out against Brian Hickerson again, not saying 0:02:11.840 --> 0:02:15.480 that he's responsible for her death, but frustrated by her 0:02:15.560 --> 0:02:19.200 daughter's continued involvement with him given all of their history. 0:02:19.200 --> 0:02:22.160 And I imagine, no matter what, mom, you are out there, 0:02:22.240 --> 0:02:24.680 you wouldn't want to think that your daughter was still 0:02:24.800 --> 0:02:28.600 with in a relationship with a man who had beaten 0:02:28.680 --> 0:02:32.079 her viciously violently multiple times. 0:02:31.880 --> 0:02:35.600 Over a couple of years. We're going to get into 0:02:35.639 --> 0:02:37.560 more details on that in the moment, but Also, this 0:02:37.639 --> 0:02:40.600 incident report that is out from the police, just to 0:02:40.639 --> 0:02:42.320 tell you some of the nuggets that are in there, 0:02:42.400 --> 0:02:45.480 does list Brian Hickerson, thirty seven year old white male 0:02:45.560 --> 0:02:49.080 as the complainant. Also witness to is Zach Hickerson. His 0:02:49.200 --> 0:02:53.160 brother was there as well. The official notes from the 0:02:53.160 --> 0:02:55.120 police officer and the reports that he was called for 0:02:55.280 --> 0:02:58.960 a call of a victim unresponsive and said quote ems 0:02:59.000 --> 0:03:01.920 attempted to perform life life saving methods for an extended 0:03:01.960 --> 0:03:04.560 amount of time before they called time of death. This 0:03:04.760 --> 0:03:08.919 was fourteen thirty one hours. The dispatch audio is where 0:03:08.960 --> 0:03:12.080 we get some word of their possible cardiac arrests or 0:03:12.160 --> 0:03:16.120 possible overdose. But still the autopsy has done and we 0:03:16.160 --> 0:03:18.520 do not have an official calls or manner of death. 0:03:18.560 --> 0:03:22.720 Let's get now, Robes to Brian Hickerson, who placed the call. 0:03:23.800 --> 0:03:26.400 You explained she started dating this guy almost immediately in 0:03:26.440 --> 0:03:29.880 twenty eighteen after her split from her fiance. But Robes, 0:03:29.880 --> 0:03:35.880 they're dating history and it seemed fairly soon after. Tumult 0:03:35.960 --> 0:03:38.360 is one thing, Robes, violence is another, and this seemed 0:03:38.360 --> 0:03:41.200 to be a violent relationship. 0:03:41.200 --> 0:03:45.440 Absolutely, And look, he actually ended up pleading no contest 0:03:45.960 --> 0:03:49.200 in twenty twenty one to two counts of injuring a 0:03:49.280 --> 0:03:52.280 romantic partner. He was ordered to forty five days in jail. 0:03:52.360 --> 0:03:56.440 He served thirteen days behind bars, But as soon as 0:03:56.520 --> 0:03:59.720 last week before her death, he was trying to get 0:03:59.800 --> 0:04:05.520 his record amended. He wanted to expunge or clean up 0:04:05.640 --> 0:04:08.920 his criminal records, so to speak. He was working on 0:04:08.960 --> 0:04:13.120 that and look as a part of his process of 0:04:13.160 --> 0:04:16.200 going through the adjudication of these types of charges. 0:04:16.200 --> 0:04:18.440 He went through AA. He was. 0:04:20.400 --> 0:04:23.080 Not on parole, but he had a probation officer and 0:04:23.160 --> 0:04:25.240 he'd been going back for the last several years, so 0:04:25.800 --> 0:04:30.000 he was supposedly working on himself as well during this 0:04:30.040 --> 0:04:34.080 period of time. But there were multiple reported incidents of 0:04:34.320 --> 0:04:37.880 domestic violence issues beyond just the moment where he was 0:04:37.920 --> 0:04:40.760 actually charged and served those few days in jails for 0:04:41.120 --> 0:04:42.760 Dan Robes two counts. 0:04:42.960 --> 0:04:45.599 He ended up pleading contests too, but I think there 0:04:45.720 --> 0:04:48.800 was eight counts against him for incidents that happened over 0:04:48.839 --> 0:04:53.720 a two year period. This I did not realize Robes, 0:04:54.240 --> 0:04:58.240 this girl was going through hell, I babe, I did not. 0:04:58.560 --> 0:05:01.440 I'd seen some headlines here, but then reading up about 0:05:01.480 --> 0:05:04.200 it today, Robes the incidents that are described the years 0:05:04.240 --> 0:05:08.440 of this going on. Jesus, it's dark, it's sad. 0:05:08.560 --> 0:05:11.360 Your heart literally breaks for her because while all this 0:05:11.440 --> 0:05:16.039 is going on, she has a non existent relationship with 0:05:16.080 --> 0:05:18.919 her mom, and she spoke publicly about it. She wrote 0:05:18.920 --> 0:05:21.520 about it in her memoir, and she even spoke in 0:05:21.520 --> 0:05:23.839 one of the last interviews she gave about her memoir 0:05:23.880 --> 0:05:25.880 that she left a door open, she left a space open. 0:05:26.000 --> 0:05:26.960 She was hopeful that. 0:05:26.960 --> 0:05:29.920 One day she and her mom could have a relationship, 0:05:30.200 --> 0:05:33.840 that they could finally have that relationship she had always wanted. 0:05:33.880 --> 0:05:37.359 She described her mom as being this mamager basically like 0:05:37.400 --> 0:05:40.200 this business manager, and she said at one point she 0:05:40.240 --> 0:05:42.800 asked her, hey, can we no longer work together because 0:05:42.839 --> 0:05:44.839 I kind of just really need you to be my mom. 0:05:45.200 --> 0:05:47.800 And according to Hayden, her mom said to her, you 0:05:47.880 --> 0:05:51.719 owe me, And she realized she meant financially for all 0:05:51.760 --> 0:05:54.640 the hard work and years of dedication she spent to 0:05:55.279 --> 0:05:58.680 fostering and furthering Hayden's career, and that hit her like 0:05:58.720 --> 0:05:59.640 a gut punch. 0:06:00.160 --> 0:06:05.000 She talked about it, so this young lady who's already 0:06:05.000 --> 0:06:09.400 had struggles postpartum addiction, like these are things she had 0:06:09.400 --> 0:06:11.720 talked about openly already she had gone to rehab. We 0:06:11.839 --> 0:06:14.440 saw this stuff happen to her. And now throw into that, 0:06:14.480 --> 0:06:17.080 you're dealing in an industry robes that is even on 0:06:17.120 --> 0:06:22.120 your best day, you're having a bad day. And her 0:06:22.200 --> 0:06:28.320 daughter is living in across the world from her robes 0:06:28.400 --> 0:06:31.480 and so she doesn't have her mother either either, And 0:06:31.520 --> 0:06:35.400 what support system does she have is she's still surrounded 0:06:35.440 --> 0:06:38.600 by the guy who beat her for years. So I 0:06:38.600 --> 0:06:42.560 think that part is shocking, and it's that part is tragic, 0:06:42.560 --> 0:06:44.560 and I don't know what the relationship was, but just 0:06:44.600 --> 0:06:47.839 as a human being, you go, she's in his she 0:06:48.120 --> 0:06:52.640 died with him being the person that was near her, 0:06:52.760 --> 0:06:57.680 this guy. Something about that robes, I can understand that 0:06:57.760 --> 0:06:58.960 sets people off a little bit. 0:06:59.000 --> 0:07:01.880 I agree because when we first heard word and it 0:07:01.920 --> 0:07:04.520 was shocking, and it's frankly still is shocking that she's 0:07:04.560 --> 0:07:08.400 no longer here. But when you imagined the scene, when 0:07:08.400 --> 0:07:11.320 we heard the initial reports that she was found on responsive, 0:07:12.680 --> 0:07:16.280 I just imagine she was alone. I actually did not 0:07:16.480 --> 0:07:18.760 even think for one second there was someone with her. 0:07:19.200 --> 0:07:22.680 And according to the police reports, when they did show 0:07:22.760 --> 0:07:25.800 up to that Greenville apartment, it was the brother Zach 0:07:25.840 --> 0:07:28.040 who answered the door, and they said, you know, we 0:07:28.120 --> 0:07:30.880 got reports of an unresponsive female. He said, yes, my 0:07:31.040 --> 0:07:35.760 brother's girlfriend. He referred to her as his brother's girlfriend, 0:07:35.840 --> 0:07:40.720 not ex girlfriend or friend, but girlfriend. And they also 0:07:40.920 --> 0:07:45.480 noted that it wasn't until they declared her dead because 0:07:45.480 --> 0:07:47.760 they did work on her, they did try to revive her. 0:07:47.800 --> 0:07:50.440 But when they did declare her dead, that is when 0:07:50.520 --> 0:07:54.600 Hickerson actually showed emotion. Brian Hickerson. They did describe that 0:07:54.640 --> 0:07:58.400 in the police report, but we don't know how it 0:07:58.480 --> 0:08:01.080 got to that point. When it was to something in 0:08:01.120 --> 0:08:03.760 the afternoon, It wasn't even I was thinking when we 0:08:03.800 --> 0:08:06.360 first heard two o'clock, I thought, in the morning, like 0:08:06.400 --> 0:08:09.360 that's when you imagine these types of things happening overnight. 0:08:09.480 --> 0:08:14.800 Someone well, for whatever reason, maybe intentionally or unintentionally, did 0:08:14.840 --> 0:08:17.480 something out of desperation and despair. But in the middle 0:08:17.480 --> 0:08:20.440 of the afternoon, that was shocking to me. And to 0:08:20.480 --> 0:08:23.440 hear she was surrounded or was with two people at 0:08:23.480 --> 0:08:26.680 the time. How does that take place? How does that occur? 0:08:27.040 --> 0:08:29.240 Maybe we'll hear more about that, But that's because I 0:08:29.280 --> 0:08:32.400 wondered that they they were they gone and came back 0:08:32.520 --> 0:08:35.760 and discovered her. Was she asleep and she didn't wake up, 0:08:35.800 --> 0:08:38.480 and they went and checked on what happened? Who knows? 0:08:38.600 --> 0:08:41.400 And according to reports, they had just flown the day 0:08:41.440 --> 0:08:45.560 before from Los Angeles to South Carolina. So it just 0:08:45.760 --> 0:08:48.520 doesn't seem like there was some plan or some intention. 0:08:48.679 --> 0:08:50.480 I mean, we don't know what was going on, but 0:08:50.520 --> 0:08:54.359 we're obviously investigators are looking into figuring out the timeline, 0:08:54.520 --> 0:08:57.600 how things happen, when they happened, what happened, and when 0:08:57.640 --> 0:08:59.200 we get some of those I mean, we got some 0:08:59.280 --> 0:09:01.760 details from the off topsy, but there are still so 0:09:01.880 --> 0:09:05.160 many glaring missing holes as to what happened. 0:09:05.160 --> 0:09:07.720 Which day was this baby that she passed? Was it 0:09:07.760 --> 0:09:08.360 on Sunday? 0:09:08.679 --> 0:09:10.960 It was Sunday at two pm in the afternoon, So 0:09:11.040 --> 0:09:14.440 on Saturday, they traveled from LA to South Carolina, according 0:09:14.480 --> 0:09:15.040 to reports. 0:09:15.080 --> 0:09:17.520 Just so weird. You know, I'm weird like this, bro, 0:09:17.600 --> 0:09:20.360 It's just a weird I don't know, and you know 0:09:20.440 --> 0:09:22.199 I know this, and you know why I know it. 0:09:22.720 --> 0:09:25.840 But when you said two thirty, it triggered this thought. 0:09:26.040 --> 0:09:30.160 She died at two thirty on August the sixteenth. I 0:09:30.200 --> 0:09:33.720 always remember Elvis died at three point thirty on August 0:09:33.720 --> 0:09:38.840 the sixteenth. Wow, forty nine years ago. That's bizarre. It's 0:09:38.960 --> 0:09:41.520 I don't know, it's just a weird little so close 0:09:41.559 --> 0:09:45.040 in times. So August sixteenth, they both down the same day, 0:09:45.080 --> 0:09:47.000 and they were both pronounced dead at around the same 0:09:47.040 --> 0:09:50.520 time in the afternoon. He was in Memphis, she's in Greenville, 0:09:50.520 --> 0:09:51.280 South Comeline. I don't know. 0:09:51.320 --> 0:09:53.600 I'm just no, but that is that is a striking 0:09:53.640 --> 0:09:57.120 coincidence within an hour of each other, forty nine years apart. 0:09:57.280 --> 0:09:59.720 Part I don't get this anyway, I don't know. Yeah, 0:09:59.760 --> 0:10:01.439 you know that's why you're writ yes, because when you 0:10:01.480 --> 0:10:02.960 said two thirty, I was like, wait a minute this. 0:10:03.400 --> 0:10:05.199 And the reason I know that is because my mom's 0:10:05.280 --> 0:10:08.360 due date with me was August sixteenth, nineteen seventy seven. 0:10:08.440 --> 0:10:11.360 That was the day Elvis ended up dying. That's why 0:10:11.440 --> 0:10:14.240 I always know that bit of music history. 0:10:14.400 --> 0:10:15.120 My goodness. 0:10:15.120 --> 0:10:15.400 Wow. 0:10:15.520 --> 0:10:18.360 And look, I'm not even sure what was Elvis's cause 0:10:18.360 --> 0:10:19.000 of death was. 0:10:19.760 --> 0:10:22.080 I think it was hard a heart attack, a heart. 0:10:21.920 --> 0:10:23.960 Attack, but it had nothing to do with an overdose. 0:10:24.040 --> 0:10:26.360 It had nothing to do with any complications leading to 0:10:26.360 --> 0:10:26.920 that heart attack. 0:10:26.920 --> 0:10:28.880 You know, I can't remember where there's official cause of 0:10:28.920 --> 0:10:31.240 death was listed as if it was listed as an overdose. 0:10:31.640 --> 0:10:33.840 They might have actually might have been. 0:10:33.920 --> 0:10:37.920 Wow, because this is also a cardiac issue according to police. 0:10:37.960 --> 0:10:41.360 So that's just so also eerily similar. I mean I 0:10:41.440 --> 0:10:44.000 never thought about that, but that Yes, I'm not as 0:10:44.000 --> 0:10:47.000 familiar with the Elvis cause of death and autopsy, but 0:10:47.480 --> 0:10:50.720 that would read and the official statement from the Greenville 0:10:50.760 --> 0:10:55.080 Police Department is this, an autopsy was completed. At autopsy, 0:10:55.160 --> 0:10:58.439 no signs of trauma were discovered that would have contributed 0:10:58.480 --> 0:11:01.040 to the death. The cause and manner of death remained 0:11:01.160 --> 0:11:05.520 pending further investigation and the completion of additional studies. The 0:11:05.520 --> 0:11:10.119 investigation remains active and ongoing. No further details are available 0:11:10.120 --> 0:11:13.720 for release at this time. But yeah, when you start 0:11:13.760 --> 0:11:17.439 to think about what we do know right now and 0:11:17.480 --> 0:11:20.000 what we know about Elvis's death, that is just a 0:11:20.559 --> 0:11:21.720 bizarre coincidence. 0:11:21.920 --> 0:11:25.160 His official was, yes, it was cardiac arrest. I remember 0:11:25.200 --> 0:11:27.080 that part. But yes, they found all kinds of prescription 0:11:27.440 --> 0:11:30.040 prescription drugs in his system, and they think all that 0:11:30.080 --> 0:11:33.120 you certainly contributed. I don't know, I just said it 0:11:33.480 --> 0:11:33.920 a minute. 0:11:33.960 --> 0:11:37.520 That sounds that is familiar, literally exactly what they are 0:11:37.559 --> 0:11:42.280 saying about Hayden's death right now, Like actually almost forbade 0:11:42.320 --> 0:11:44.079 them the same robes. 0:11:44.120 --> 0:11:47.000 I want to get to this before we take a 0:11:47.120 --> 0:11:52.160 little bit of a pause to two quotes from Hayden 0:11:52.240 --> 0:11:57.160 Penetier about her relationship with this guy. The first one 0:11:57.160 --> 0:12:02.600 here robes she gave after he was arrested for domestic violence. 0:12:03.280 --> 0:12:05.240 And there are things here that jumped out at me. 0:12:05.480 --> 0:12:07.440 And then there's a follow up to that one that 0:12:07.559 --> 0:12:10.320 certainly will jump out as well. And this I'm not 0:12:10.320 --> 0:12:12.320 sure what this tells us about where her head was 0:12:12.360 --> 0:12:15.600 through all this, but the first one was yes, after 0:12:15.600 --> 0:12:17.120 he was arrested, I think in twenty twenty one. 0:12:17.200 --> 0:12:19.600 The first time, yes, she said, I am coming forward 0:12:19.679 --> 0:12:22.280 with the truth about what happened to me, with the 0:12:22.320 --> 0:12:25.880 hope that my story will empower others in abusive relationships 0:12:26.240 --> 0:12:28.880 to get the help they need and deserve. I'm prepared 0:12:28.920 --> 0:12:31.400 to do my part to make sure this man never 0:12:31.640 --> 0:12:34.880 hurts anyone again. I'm grateful for my support system, which 0:12:34.920 --> 0:12:37.800 helped me find the courage to regain my voice and 0:12:37.880 --> 0:12:41.480 my life. So yes, she obviously turned him in. She's 0:12:41.559 --> 0:12:44.960 the reason why he was arrested and served a small 0:12:44.960 --> 0:12:45.520 amount of time. 0:12:45.640 --> 0:12:48.640 A strong statement the aerobes make sure this man never 0:12:48.760 --> 0:12:52.439 hurts anyone again. It is what she said about Brian Hickerson, 0:12:52.440 --> 0:12:56.040 who's called police to say she was unresponsive. This is 0:12:56.080 --> 0:13:00.320 the guy that was supposed to call and help save her. 0:13:00.800 --> 0:13:03.680 This guy she's talking about so far five years ago, okay, 0:13:03.720 --> 0:13:06.840 so follow up then to just four years ago. What 0:13:06.920 --> 0:13:10.440 she said robes what she said to People magazine about 0:13:10.520 --> 0:13:11.720 him in twenty twenty two. 0:13:11.840 --> 0:13:14.400 She said, none of it is okay, and I want 0:13:14.400 --> 0:13:16.800 to make sure that everybody knows that. But I am 0:13:16.840 --> 0:13:19.720 open to people who are willing to get help and 0:13:19.840 --> 0:13:24.160 make amends. He's gone to treatment and done his time, 0:13:24.559 --> 0:13:27.840 and I'm trying to live in a place of forgiveness. 0:13:28.320 --> 0:13:31.200 That was her explanation, I would imagine for continuing a 0:13:31.240 --> 0:13:33.800 relationship with him once he got out of prison, she 0:13:33.880 --> 0:13:36.840 saw him turning his life around, or at least attempting 0:13:36.880 --> 0:13:38.560 to saying he was sorry. 0:13:39.000 --> 0:13:40.319 But it does. 0:13:42.679 --> 0:13:45.200 It's difficult to get your head around the fact that, 0:13:45.320 --> 0:13:49.760 given that history, that he was there with her in 0:13:49.840 --> 0:13:52.320 the role of boyfriend. At least we believe, according to 0:13:52.360 --> 0:13:56.200 what his brother told police. At the time of her 0:13:56.640 --> 0:14:00.600 untimely death, she was just thirty six years old. 0:14:01.000 --> 0:14:03.839 Stay here, we're going to share one more quote from her. 0:14:03.960 --> 0:14:08.480 This is something she shared in a recent interview, and 0:14:08.520 --> 0:14:11.640 I guess you could call it, I guess part three 0:14:12.280 --> 0:14:16.320 of the quotes we've shared, and this one certainly gives 0:14:16.400 --> 0:14:20.080 us more insight to maybe where that relationship was. And 0:14:20.240 --> 0:14:24.200 also we'll let you hear from her mom, who also 0:14:24.440 --> 0:14:27.080 shared how she feels about the boyfriend. 0:14:36.240 --> 0:14:39.240 Welcome back everyone to Amy and TJ. We are getting 0:14:39.320 --> 0:14:43.400 a lot of new details, some new information, and frankly, 0:14:43.920 --> 0:14:48.480 some real insight into what may have happened to Hayden 0:14:48.560 --> 0:14:55.080 Pennetier who died shockingly on Sunday at two thirty one PM, 0:14:55.760 --> 0:14:59.480 and we've just found out that her on again, off again. 0:15:02.680 --> 0:15:06.360 I don't even know how to describe this. Brian Hickerson, 0:15:06.400 --> 0:15:07.640 her boyfriend. 0:15:07.320 --> 0:15:10.760 Did domestic violent boyfriend correct? 0:15:10.840 --> 0:15:13.040 That is, I was going to say something to that extent, 0:15:13.160 --> 0:15:13.720 and I thought it. 0:15:13.720 --> 0:15:14.400 Was actually correct. 0:15:14.560 --> 0:15:17.560 Maybe it was too harsh, but no, that is exactly 0:15:17.640 --> 0:15:21.520 what he was, even at the time of her death. 0:15:21.560 --> 0:15:24.960 And you can see in her statements about him and 0:15:25.000 --> 0:15:27.600 what happened, how she went from saying I demand justice 0:15:27.640 --> 0:15:29.240 and I'm going to make sure he never hurts anyone 0:15:29.240 --> 0:15:32.960 again to saying I'm a forgiving person. I'm here to 0:15:33.520 --> 0:15:37.760 acknowledge that people can change and become better people. And 0:15:37.800 --> 0:15:40.320 then this most recent interview, she was. 0:15:40.280 --> 0:15:42.280 In an interview on a podcast robe and she was 0:15:42.320 --> 0:15:45.800 sharing journal entries from her time, I guess, and things 0:15:45.840 --> 0:15:48.040 about Brian Hickerson. And so that's why I kind of 0:15:48.040 --> 0:15:51.080 did him in sequence and robes you see here. I mean, 0:15:51.200 --> 0:15:54.960 just what she was going through, what her heart was 0:15:55.000 --> 0:15:57.600 going through, with her head. I mean, this. 0:15:57.720 --> 0:16:01.720 Sounds like she really loved this guy, even though he 0:16:01.880 --> 0:16:05.440 physically and I would imagine emotionally abused her for many 0:16:05.640 --> 0:16:08.800 many years. And I feel like this next quote, unfortunately, 0:16:08.880 --> 0:16:11.320 will probably resonate with a lot of women, with a 0:16:11.440 --> 0:16:14.920 lot of women out there, she said, I desperately wanted 0:16:14.960 --> 0:16:18.960 to make him a better person. I wanted to fix him. 0:16:19.360 --> 0:16:22.520 I'm a really strong person at my core, and anyone 0:16:22.520 --> 0:16:25.560 who knows me was shocked that I would ever allow 0:16:25.640 --> 0:16:28.200 anything like this to happen. That is such I just 0:16:28.240 --> 0:16:32.040 got chills. That is such a common response from women 0:16:32.360 --> 0:16:38.120 who have been abused. They on the outside look like strong, 0:16:38.560 --> 0:16:42.200 kick ass independent women, and not that they aren't, but 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:46.040 somehow there's this vulnerability when you love someone, when you 0:16:46.080 --> 0:16:50.200 want someone to love you, this desire to forgive, to 0:16:50.280 --> 0:16:53.320 assume the best, to hope they've changed. I think so 0:16:53.400 --> 0:16:55.880 many women can absolutely relate with that feeling. 0:16:55.880 --> 0:16:59.880 And that's where she was and those things you list 0:17:00.120 --> 0:17:02.960 that makes you make you feel loved and you hope 0:17:02.960 --> 0:17:05.560 for this and that. But Robes, the other thing that 0:17:05.600 --> 0:17:09.080 factors in is a lot of these women do see 0:17:09.160 --> 0:17:13.800 genuine good and there are good traits or can be 0:17:13.880 --> 0:17:16.560 good traits, and a guy who also raises his hand 0:17:17.000 --> 0:17:20.360 a woman is trying to balance that out right. He 0:17:20.440 --> 0:17:24.280 had two bad days out of this month, but hey, 0:17:24.359 --> 0:17:27.520 I'm gonna focus on those twenty eight good days and 0:17:27.600 --> 0:17:31.320 not the two in which he injured me. What was 0:17:31.359 --> 0:17:34.000 she dealing with, Robes? Do we go back to twenty 0:17:34.160 --> 0:17:37.680 that from twenty twenty one saying I am gonna make 0:17:37.720 --> 0:17:41.119 sure I'm sharing my story. He should never hurt anybody 0:17:41.640 --> 0:17:46.160 to him being the one there to potentially save her. 0:17:46.600 --> 0:17:51.000 She had him in her life still in that intimate way. Now, 0:17:51.240 --> 0:17:53.440 I don't know what he's going through and the forgiveness 0:17:53.480 --> 0:17:59.320 and all that. Can that happen? I guess yes, Robes, 0:17:59.320 --> 0:18:01.919 I would like to hope it could. And if she 0:18:02.119 --> 0:18:07.320 accepted it then she accepted it. Robes. But this guy 0:18:07.760 --> 0:18:10.040 clearly had been bad news in her life. 0:18:10.160 --> 0:18:13.240 Yes, and we are hearing now for the first time 0:18:13.359 --> 0:18:19.120 directly from Hayden's own mother, and again like so this 0:18:19.359 --> 0:18:23.320 was Look we've detailed before, and I think anyone who 0:18:23.359 --> 0:18:26.359 has looked into Hayden's life, No, she was a child actress. 0:18:26.359 --> 0:18:29.800 When we say a child actress, she started performing or 0:18:29.840 --> 0:18:33.080 being paid as an actor, starting at eight months old. 0:18:33.560 --> 0:18:38.640 And if you look at her long list of contributions 0:18:38.680 --> 0:18:41.240 to the acting world, I mean they just it never stopped. 0:18:41.320 --> 0:18:44.800 She was a working actress from eight months on. This 0:18:44.960 --> 0:18:48.400 wasn't just a one off. She was in multiple commercials, 0:18:48.480 --> 0:18:52.000 TV shows, movies, and it continued. And who was behind 0:18:52.000 --> 0:18:55.200 the scenes the entire time managing her career her mother? 0:18:56.440 --> 0:19:00.760 Was she a like a successful long running actress soap operas? 0:19:00.800 --> 0:19:03.360 Does she have like a starring role? Her mother? 0:19:03.480 --> 0:19:06.439 Her mom wasn't did something on so she I'm not 0:19:06.480 --> 0:19:08.880 that familiar with her career, but she was an actress. 0:19:08.880 --> 0:19:12.200 But no, Hayden obviously was the star. And it was 0:19:12.240 --> 0:19:14.640 almost Look we see this all the time where you've 0:19:14.640 --> 0:19:17.000 got the stage mom and the mom whose career didn't 0:19:17.040 --> 0:19:19.800 make it to where she wanted it to go. And 0:19:19.840 --> 0:19:25.720 so she relives her lost fame or her what she 0:19:25.760 --> 0:19:28.359 wanted for herself, and she she puts it into her daughter, 0:19:28.400 --> 0:19:31.520 and she pushes her daughter, and she supports her daughter 0:19:31.960 --> 0:19:34.400 to follow her dream. And that does seem like this 0:19:34.440 --> 0:19:36.920 is what happened in this case, not that Hayden didn't 0:19:36.920 --> 0:19:38.720 want to be an actress, not that Hayden wasn't a 0:19:38.760 --> 0:19:42.439 phenomenal actress. I think everyone who's worked with her, and 0:19:42.560 --> 0:19:46.600 certainly who have enjoyed her shows and her movies would 0:19:46.600 --> 0:19:49.800 agree she was a talented young woman. But no one 0:19:49.880 --> 0:19:51.560 decides if they want to be an actress at eight 0:19:51.600 --> 0:19:54.720 months old. No one decides at five that they want 0:19:54.760 --> 0:19:57.439 to keep acting. No, the mom is was the fuel 0:19:57.480 --> 0:20:00.800 behind the catalyst and the fuel behind her career period. 0:20:00.960 --> 0:20:03.480 Yeah, I just saw, I didn't I just make sure 0:20:03.480 --> 0:20:05.880 I didn't miss she was some star and some show 0:20:05.920 --> 0:20:06.680 I didn't watch. 0:20:06.480 --> 0:20:09.280 Into seventeen now, But then, yes, it's so sad to 0:20:09.320 --> 0:20:12.040 see someone who was that invested in her daughter's career 0:20:13.200 --> 0:20:15.520 to no longer be a part of her daughter's life. 0:20:16.400 --> 0:20:17.959 How long did you get a sense of how long 0:20:18.080 --> 0:20:19.199 it's been years? Oh? 0:20:19.320 --> 0:20:22.280 It's been it's been quite some time, I believe. I mean, 0:20:22.320 --> 0:20:26.000 I've seen pictures of them throughout the years, but it 0:20:26.040 --> 0:20:28.600 seems like it had been several several years, and certainly 0:20:28.840 --> 0:20:30.960 this past May, when she went on her book tour 0:20:31.040 --> 0:20:33.359 and started speaking about what was in her book, she 0:20:33.400 --> 0:20:34.879 made it very clear that she and her mom were 0:20:34.920 --> 0:20:39.560 no longer on speaking to terms sucks, totally sucks. And yes, 0:20:40.080 --> 0:20:43.679 her mom did speak to NBC News over the phone, 0:20:44.280 --> 0:20:47.480 and we have some quotes from that interview where we 0:20:47.520 --> 0:20:51.000 hear from her saying, this person in her life that 0:20:51.040 --> 0:20:53.159 we have been trying to get rid of for quite 0:20:53.160 --> 0:20:56.760 some time was with her at her death, and that 0:20:57.359 --> 0:21:00.240 was Brian Hickerson. And when she says we, she mean 0:21:00.640 --> 0:21:03.360 she and her dad, Hayden's dad's skip, which by the way, 0:21:03.400 --> 0:21:06.040 she apparently had a very close relationship with. So look, 0:21:06.080 --> 0:21:07.760 we talk about who she had in her life, who 0:21:07.760 --> 0:21:10.480 could have supported her, who was well intentioned and had 0:21:10.480 --> 0:21:12.760 her best interest at heart. Her father, at least, she 0:21:12.840 --> 0:21:15.960 had him in her life even at the end. They 0:21:16.000 --> 0:21:18.960 never they remained close by all accounts, but her mom 0:21:18.960 --> 0:21:21.800 went on to say, I think Hayden was an amazingly 0:21:22.119 --> 0:21:26.000 talented person in so many departments. And I think young 0:21:26.000 --> 0:21:28.960 people who grow up in the entertainment industry, it is 0:21:29.000 --> 0:21:32.600 a struggle, and it's a very challenging industry, and it's 0:21:32.640 --> 0:21:36.159 not unusual for them to sadly find the wrong path. 0:21:36.640 --> 0:21:39.440 I think it becomes very difficult to be true to yourself, 0:21:39.720 --> 0:21:42.919 and I think Hayden sadly lost her way, and I 0:21:42.960 --> 0:21:45.320 wish it were different. I wish she had stayed true 0:21:45.320 --> 0:21:48.520 to herself because she had many incredible attributes. 0:21:49.000 --> 0:21:52.400 Thought that was so cold. I was just about to say, yeah, 0:21:52.480 --> 0:21:53.760 she could really use her mom. 0:21:54.480 --> 0:21:57.040