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Speaker 1: Now from our nation's capital. This is Bloomberg Sound On.

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Speaker 1: If people think the country is on the wrong track

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Speaker 1: and are upset, it's usually really bad news to the

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Speaker 1: party in Valege that Democrats had a very difficult challenge

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Speaker 1: on their hands when it comes to the mid term

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Sound On, Politics, Policy and Perspective from DC's top Names.

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Speaker 1: If I pick, there's a lot of peck up demand

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Speaker 1: for electing a woman hand. I think could be the

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Speaker 1: year of the woman. I see this demand that he

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Speaker 1: have today as the baseline for the future. It could

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Speaker 1: mean to our economy as a roaring back Bloomberg Sound

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Speaker 1: On with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio. Was it something

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Speaker 1: I said? Where'd everybody go? I see the traffic jam

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Speaker 1: to National Airport. Welcome to get away day in the

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Speaker 1: nation's capital. We're letting the air out of the bubble

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Speaker 1: here as lawmakers head home for the holidays. With build

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Speaker 1: back Better pushing into next year and a lot of

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Speaker 1: questions remaining about the future of President Eiden's economic agenda,

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Speaker 1: Democrats say they're going to pick up where they left

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Speaker 1: off when they get back in January. Republicans, of course,

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Speaker 1: have different ideas and we'll talk about the way forward

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Speaker 1: coming up with Michael Steele, former chair of the Republican

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Speaker 1: National Committee, former Lieutenant Governor of Maryland. And later we'll

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Speaker 1: talk with Bloomberg's Jordan Robertson about a fascinating Bloomberg investigation

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Speaker 1: finding Chinese spies used software from Huahwei to conduct espionage

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Speaker 1: in Australia, if not elsewhere. The panel today, Bloomberg Politics

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Speaker 1: contributor Jeanie Shechanzano is with us, along with Bill McGinley

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Speaker 1: of the Vocal Group. It's the fastest hour in politics.

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Speaker 1: What an evolution we've seen this past week here in Washington.

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Speaker 1: Rewind to a week ago today, last Friday's inflation day

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Speaker 1: of the CBO score. Remember on the reconciliation plan, the

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Speaker 1: one Lindsey Graham asked for. That was all followed early

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Speaker 1: this week by the meeting of the Joes and the

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Speaker 1: meeting of the Federal Reserve, all slowly chipping away at

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Speaker 1: chances that this bill could see the light of day

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Speaker 1: or even get a this year. Just listen to the

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Speaker 1: evolution in the White House briefing room. This is Press

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Speaker 1: Secretary Jen Saki. On Tuesday, Leader Schumer said the work

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Speaker 1: is not yet finished, but we're working hard to put

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Speaker 1: the Senate in a position to get the legislation across

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Speaker 1: the finish line before Christmas. And we've seen we trust

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Speaker 1: his leadership and his efforts to get this done. Senator

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Speaker 1: Mansion said, we're just talking about different iterations. That's all.

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Speaker 1: We're engaged. Remember that we're engaged different iterations. Fast forward

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Speaker 1: to today, Secretary Saki on Air Force one. The President

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Speaker 1: is also someone who has been through many legislative battles,

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Speaker 1: many legislative fights, many that have had ups and downs,

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Speaker 1: but ultimately resultant in victory. Look at the Affordable Care

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Speaker 1: Act as an example from several years ago. It says

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Speaker 1: they're not giving up. And with regard to the child

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Speaker 1: tax Credit, which we've been talking about every day this week,

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Speaker 1: Saki says, remember the last checks went out Wednesday, Saki says,

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Speaker 1: there is still time to save it if we get

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Speaker 1: it done in January. We've talked to Treasury officials and

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Speaker 1: others about doing double payments in is everybody on an

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Speaker 1: airplane but me? But I ask again, what will be

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Speaker 1: different in January? I wonder if Michael Steele has thoughts

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Speaker 1: on that. I bet he does, and he's with us

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Speaker 1: right now, the former chair of the Republican National Committee

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Speaker 1: at one time my lieutenant governor in the great state

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Speaker 1: of Maryland. Mr Steele, I want you to know I

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Speaker 1: have a dozen large waiting for me after this program.

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Speaker 1: It's sixty degrees outside in Washington. Were eating crabs like

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Speaker 1: it's spring outside. Can I join you. I'm counting on it.

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Speaker 1: This is great. I'm glad you're with us. Thank you.

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Speaker 1: And then I want to start here. Is this a story,

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Speaker 1: Michael Steele, of overreach on the part of the Democrats

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Speaker 1: who already passed the American Rescue Plan and infrastructure this year?

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Speaker 1: Or is this a story about democratic discord thanks to

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Speaker 1: a guy named Joe Manchin. It's about both. It's about both,

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Speaker 1: but it starts with overreach. It starts with not reading

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Speaker 1: the room. Uh. And the room is this vast space

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Speaker 1: we call America. And the people in the room, Americans

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Speaker 1: made it very clear what they liked and what they

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Speaker 1: didn't like, what they wanted and what they didn't wanted want,

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Speaker 1: And they were very clear about the infrastructure plan, the roads,

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Speaker 1: the bridges, putting construction workers back in the game and

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Speaker 1: and creating jobs in markets that are still slowly recovering

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Speaker 1: uh from um from COVID. Those jobs would then feed

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Speaker 1: other jobs, right, you know, because that's how does the

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Speaker 1: economy works. Um. And then there's this idea within the

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Speaker 1: Democratic Party. Well see, let's not stop there. Let's follow

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Speaker 1: all of the social safety net issues that we know

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Speaker 1: are going to be important to people and sell that. Well, yeah,

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Speaker 1: there are important to people, but not as important when

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Speaker 1: you start talking about inflation and the impact on on

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Speaker 1: on family, household and income. Uh. And so it was

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Speaker 1: not understanding exactly where we were, and Joe Manson, of course,

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Speaker 1: being Joe Mansion, um, you know, said no, we're not

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Speaker 1: We're not going to build back better now. Um, let's

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Speaker 1: just try to get this little piece out the door. UM.

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Speaker 1: Sell that to the American people. Set up in the

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Speaker 1: narrative in two for the rest of the buying agenda.

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Speaker 1: But um, here we are going into Christmas and you

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Speaker 1: know checks end uh this week uh for some for

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Speaker 1: some folks, and now they're talking about, well maybe we

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Speaker 1: can double up in January. Okay, go try to sell

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Speaker 1: that the folks over the next few weeks while they're

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Speaker 1: waiting for the next check. That isn't coming right. You

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Speaker 1: know that the perception versus reality and politics. If we

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Speaker 1: were talking about build back better, if Democrats said, hey,

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Speaker 1: check it out a month ago, we got it all done.

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Speaker 1: We got infrastructure done, We got the American Rescue Plan.

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Speaker 1: Guess what, Michael Steele, we even raised the debt ceilings

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Speaker 1: so we don't have to worry about it again until

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Speaker 1: after the mid terms. They look like genius is thered

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Speaker 1: be a victory parade in Washington, But this is how

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Speaker 1: it's ending. Instead it is and and you just you

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Speaker 1: just laid out the narrative. Look, you take the win

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Speaker 1: in front of you. You had nineteen Republican senators by

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Speaker 1: into your your heart infrastructure policy, right, um, A trillion

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Speaker 1: dollars of money that Republicans when they had the White

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Speaker 1: House to senate in the House couldn't get done. You

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Speaker 1: got it done, So you go sell that. I mean, look,

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Speaker 1: we did what Republicans couldn't do. Donald Trump bragg for

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Speaker 1: four years about infrastructure. Every week was infrastructure weeks. Well,

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Speaker 1: it was Joe Biden who brought it to your neighborhood.

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Speaker 1: Now it's a muddled message. It's a defensive message because

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Speaker 1: you're on the defense about everything else you're trying to

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Speaker 1: get done and couldn't get done. Um. And you let

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Speaker 1: little things and I'm not disparaging our withdrawal from Afghanistan,

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Speaker 1: but you let little things relative to the bigger thing

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Speaker 1: that was concerning to the American people, like the withdrawal

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Speaker 1: in Afghanistan upset the narrative. Right. Um, now no one's

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Speaker 1: talking about Afghanistan today, but they're still talking about the

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Speaker 1: fact that they're feeling an economic pinch um and they're

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Speaker 1: not sure exactly when all of this now new infrastructive

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Speaker 1: money is going to hit the streets, so to speak.

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Speaker 1: And it's again you're behind in your narrative, which isn't

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Speaker 1: a place you'd never want to be. And and I

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Speaker 1: would say the Democrats, if you want to know how

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Speaker 1: to do this, look how our message. Look how we

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Speaker 1: talked about Obamacare. Look how I got that in front

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Speaker 1: of the American people and kept pushing that even though

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Speaker 1: we lost on the vote in the House and the Senate.

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Speaker 1: It passed, but you paid a price for it in November.

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Speaker 1: Now you've got the success, and you'll probably pay a

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Speaker 1: price for it in the negative sense, because people don't

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Speaker 1: believe in it. They don't think it's real and they

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Speaker 1: don't feel it. It's that very scenario you just outlined, though,

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Speaker 1: because I remember where you were with Obamacare in that

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Speaker 1: whole debate over the c A, and so does Joe

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Speaker 1: Biden and the Democratic Party at large, Nancy Luosi, Chuck Sherman.

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Speaker 1: They said, boy, you know what, we get one chance, guys,

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Speaker 1: we gotta go big, We gotta go early, because once

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Speaker 1: you get into the midterm election year, well, you know,

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Speaker 1: I think the rules are going to change. So did

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Speaker 1: they go too big? I guess is the question. They

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Speaker 1: could have broken this up into pieces. There could have

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Speaker 1: been some other ways to handle this. And now once

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Speaker 1: you walk into January, Michael, it could feel different, and

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Speaker 1: not could it, Wills, It absolutely will feel different, because

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Speaker 1: guess what, Folks will come back to Washington after what

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Speaker 1: a month, you know, three weeks home in their districts,

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Speaker 1: hearing from their constituents, a lot of those concerns you're

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Speaker 1: gonna hear played out on the on the floor and

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Speaker 1: in news articles. Um the first couple of weeks back, Uh,

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Speaker 1: then you're gonna be into February. Uh, primaries start to

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Speaker 1: get uh into full force in shape where you know

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Speaker 1: people are gonna be filing and primaries kick off beginning

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Speaker 1: in late April early May. Um. It's just you just

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Speaker 1: put yourself in a political you know box, um, in

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Speaker 1: which there's a lot of crossfire and you're getting hit

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Speaker 1: by every bullet coming into the box. It's crazy, um.

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Speaker 1: And it's just one of those things that I just

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Speaker 1: don't understand how they couldn't understand the politics here. Get

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Speaker 1: the president to win, let him go out and sell

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Speaker 1: it to the country. You as members didn't go back

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Speaker 1: and say, look what we did. Voters begin to feel

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Speaker 1: a little bit better there, Calm down, Yeah, inflation is

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Speaker 1: gonna be a bullip. It's gonna be this and you

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Speaker 1: and I know you know how that works out in

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Speaker 1: the markets if if you know, some businesses bake it

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Speaker 1: in others don't. But be that is. It will be

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Speaker 1: what it is. Right. You can't control it. It'll be

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Speaker 1: what it is, but you can you can to a

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Speaker 1: certain sce and manage the messaging around it so it

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Speaker 1: doesn't compound on top of other messages. Uh, and gives

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Speaker 1: people this sense of you guys don't have a clue

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Speaker 1: what you're doing, do you? And that's where the Biden

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Speaker 1: administration finds itself going into Chrystal line there. Does Joe

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Speaker 1: Manchin want to run for president? What was that? Does

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Speaker 1: Joe Manchin want to run for president? You know, I

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Speaker 1: don't think so. I've never I've never gotten that vibe

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Speaker 1: from from Joe Manchin. Uh. You know, of course, being

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Speaker 1: in the spotlight for a whole year where you know,

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Speaker 1: you basically boxed the president into a corner you made,

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Speaker 1: that may come to you when people say, hey, so

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Speaker 1: you think about running. But I don't have that vibe

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Speaker 1: from I think he genuinely as as a fiscal hawk, um,

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Speaker 1: notwithstanding the politics of being the only Democrats state wide

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Speaker 1: in the state of West Virginia, um, you know, elected statewide.

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Speaker 1: I think he genuinely, you know, believes philosophically what he's

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Speaker 1: saying and what he's trying to do. And I don't

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Speaker 1: think there's a greater appreciation enough of appreciation of that

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Speaker 1: inside the Democratic Party. They took um and the winds

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Speaker 1: from as a progressive mandate. It was not because you

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Speaker 1: lost House seats. Man, if you picked up twenty seats

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Speaker 1: in the House, five six seat margin in the Senate,

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Speaker 1: hold different conversations. But you you you you know, you

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Speaker 1: lost seats in the House, you lost twelve seats in

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Speaker 1: the House. You barely won the Senate, but for one state, Georgia. Um,

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Speaker 1: you don't have a mandate. So you have to read

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Speaker 1: the room and understand exactly what voters are saying to

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Speaker 1: you and what their expectation is. And and that's the

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Speaker 1: hardest part of politics, is trying to understand and meet

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Speaker 1: those expectations, particularly when you don't listen. I'm totally out

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Speaker 1: of time, Michael Steele. But next year, the midterm election year,

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Speaker 1: Republicans beat the drum on inflation until people vote. They do,

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Speaker 1: they do. And there are some issues, some some x

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Speaker 1: factors that Republicans themselves will have to be concerned about. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And that would be that little building on the hill

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Speaker 1: called the Supreme Court. They could create some pain for

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Speaker 1: Republicans that you know. Uh yeah, the economics maybe one thing,

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Speaker 1: but the socialist policy, Michael Steele, come back and see

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Speaker 1: us in the new year. I'm Joe Matthew. This is Bloomberg.

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Speaker 1: You're listening to Bloomberg Sound On with Joe Matthew on

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Radio Headline on the Terminal Mansions, Hardline has Democrats

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Speaker 1: scrapping to save Biden agenda. Stephen Dennis with the byline, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is all official now. Since we spoke this time yesterday,

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Speaker 1: there's been a presidential statement. Joe Biden made it official.

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Speaker 1: What Bloomberg was reporting all day that Build Back Better

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Speaker 1: goes into two, and I'm guessing the panel has some

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Speaker 1: feelings about this. Genie is with us Bloomberg Politics contributor

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Speaker 1: Geenie shen Zano along with Bill McGinley today principle at

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Speaker 1: the Vocal Group, former Deputy Council at the Republican National Committee.

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Speaker 1: I guess that makes sense following our chat with Michael Steele, Genie,

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Speaker 1: Happy Friday. This is feeling kind of odd here. Sixty

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Speaker 1: degrees in Washington. As I was discussing with Michael, planes

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Speaker 1: are taken off to bring lawmakers home for Christmas. Build

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Speaker 1: Back Better is on ice, and the whole political structure

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Speaker 1: feels upside down. That's right. Everybody's fleeing town, Joe, except

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Speaker 1: for you. You You are. They're ready to eat your clams

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Speaker 1: or whatever. You're making crabs crabs um. You know, this

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Speaker 1: is certainly not the way the Democrats wanted to end

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Speaker 1: this year. You know, you had the majority leader saying

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Speaker 1: that they were going to get this human infrastructure done

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Speaker 1: by Christmas, and you know, Democrats frustrated to learn last

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Speaker 1: night from the President that that's not going to happen.

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Speaker 1: They have said they're going to pivot, pivot rather to

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Speaker 1: voting rights. That doesn't look to me like it's going

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Speaker 1: to happen either, as you have Kristen Cinnemon, Joe Mangin

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Speaker 1: unwilling to talk about restructuring the filibuster. So they are

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Speaker 1: leaving town. And I think you know your your argument

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Speaker 1: to or your argument your question to to Michael Steele

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Speaker 1: made really good sense. Had they just taken the win

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Speaker 1: with what they had done, which was actually a lot

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Speaker 1: in a fifty fifty Senate, they would be in a

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Speaker 1: much better place. But that said, Republicans are also in

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Speaker 1: a pretty difficult place as well with the divisions and

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Speaker 1: their party, although they look better for the mid terms.

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Speaker 1: So it is a strange time in Washington. Indeed, for sure, Bill,

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Speaker 1: I understand that Elon Musk is the person of the Year,

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Speaker 1: as deemed by Time magazine. Shouldn't have been Joe Manchin. Oh,

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Speaker 1: he's certainly the most powerful man in Washington. Uh, that's

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Speaker 1: there is that the Democratic Legislative Christmas stockings are stuffed

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Speaker 1: with West Virginia cole Um. There tried to they tried

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Speaker 1: to really do an ambitious agenda, not having the majorities

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Speaker 1: in the House or the Senate sate um and it

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Speaker 1: was clearly destined to fail. I mean, Joe Manchins had

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Speaker 1: a written piece of paper from Leeder Schumer Um since

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Speaker 1: this last summer saying that his absolute highest amount was

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Speaker 1: one point five trillion half partisan infrastructure dealer deal. And

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Speaker 1: it's a little unclear why they kept going forward. Joe

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Speaker 1: Manchin has has proven to be a man of his word,

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Speaker 1: and when he said this is my ceiling, he is

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Speaker 1: not Budge. Most of that memo has actually come true. Bill.

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Speaker 1: We've used that as a roadmap on this broadcast. It's

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Speaker 1: actually predicted the way the whole thing would go. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and you know, it's amazing to me that UM a

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Speaker 1: lot of the leaders, especially Leader Schumer, allowed Democrats to

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Speaker 1: go out there informed their base that they had a

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Speaker 1: deal around three point five trillion dollars, knowing in a

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Speaker 1: fifty fifty sate they didn't even have their own party

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Speaker 1: on board. All fifty senators and so, uh, it's a

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Speaker 1: real messaging mess for the Democrats. Um, I think it's

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Speaker 1: going to depress their base, um their pivot devoting rights

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Speaker 1: and filibuster reform um as as Jeanie said, you know,

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Speaker 1: Senator Cinemas come out and said, Nope, not going to

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Speaker 1: be in favor of h of amending the filibuster rule.

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Speaker 1: And so it's just really it's it's really been a

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Speaker 1: remarkable December all the way around in both final point is,

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Speaker 1: they just passed the n d a A, which is

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Speaker 1: the Defense Policy Bill, this last week. This is one

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Speaker 1: of the latest dates that we've seen for that bill

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Speaker 1: in a long time. So they pushed a lot of

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Speaker 1: regular business that needs to get done to the sidelines

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Speaker 1: while they tried to pursue this agenda that's ultimately failed

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Speaker 1: for him this year. Well, I'm gonna get your both

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Speaker 1: of your reads on this from your own sort of

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Speaker 1: party's perspective, Genie Democrats strategy here going into the new year.

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Speaker 1: There is a motivator, at least for a brief period

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Speaker 1: of time. It's called the child tax credit. We've spent

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Speaker 1: several days discussing this, and I know how how you

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Speaker 1: feel about it. In terms of its importance, But is

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Speaker 1: it enough to motivate the party to get together and

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Speaker 1: do something here, even if it means a smaller bill,

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Speaker 1: a smaller price tag, maybe fewer programs in that bill,

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Speaker 1: because I'm not sure what else there is to get

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Speaker 1: people moving. Genie, I agree, and I've always thought it

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Speaker 1: would make sense to break this up and do these

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Speaker 1: as standalonees. The child Tracks tax credit is um you know,

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Speaker 1: popular amongst many quarters, and you know, but I just

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Speaker 1: don't think that you've got the will to do that.

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Speaker 1: And I think we need to look at the progressives

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Speaker 1: in the House who are frustrated now. They feel like

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Speaker 1: they put themselves out on a limb with a promise

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Speaker 1: by the president that he could get to fifty. He

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Speaker 1: hasn't been able to do that, and so I'm not

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Speaker 1: sure they're going to be willing to now go and

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Speaker 1: break these things apart. And so I think what we

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Speaker 1: have here is a fundamental misreading on the part of

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Speaker 1: many Democrats of what happened in the election. The election

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Speaker 1: was not as much about a positive embrace of President

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Speaker 1: Biden's agenda. It was really a rejection of President Trump.

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Speaker 1: And so I think we're seeing that with the the

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Speaker 1: pickups that Republicans had in the House in and we're

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Speaker 1: going to continue to see that as we go into

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Speaker 1: the mid term. Progressives feel burned, Bill McGinley, Republicans feel emboldened.

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Speaker 1: What will be the strategy for the GOP coming into January?

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Speaker 1: Is it more the same beat the drum on inflation

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Speaker 1: until the mid terms. Yeah, I think the delook Publicans

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Speaker 1: have a lot of issues to run on, everything from

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Speaker 1: crime to inflation, to education, um to to defense, to

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Speaker 1: all of the foreign policy issues that the country is facing. Um.

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Speaker 1: It's really there's a lot of issues for Republicans to

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Speaker 1: uh to run on. And the one factor that I

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Speaker 1: would add to what Jennie was talking about for next

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Speaker 1: year that is going to play to the Republican advantage.

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Speaker 1: If you look at the schedule for the House and

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Speaker 1: Senate chambers and when they're actually going to be in session,

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Speaker 1: it's very limited because it's an election here, and you

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Speaker 1: know Speaker Pelosi and Leeder Schumer are gonna want their

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Speaker 1: members who are up for election back in the district

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Speaker 1: trying to win re election as opposed in Washington taking

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Speaker 1: tough votes that are going to be used in Republican

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Speaker 1: attack ADS, so even less that's going to happen next year,

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Speaker 1: uh than otherwise would have. Genie and Bill will stay

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Speaker 1: with us for the hour. Our panel for this Friday.

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Speaker 1: Coming up, an exclusive Bloomberg investigation finds Chinese spies may

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Speaker 1: have used technolog G from Wawei in a secret telecom hack.

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Speaker 1: Fascinating story. We'll talk to Jordan Robertson from Bloomberg about it. Next.

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Speaker 1: Traffic and weather on the way. This is Bloomberg broadcasting

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Speaker 1: live from our nation's capital, Bloomberg to New York, Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: eleven Frio to Boston, Bloomberg one O six one to

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Speaker 1: San Francisco, Bloomberg nine sixty to the country, Serious XM

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Speaker 1: Channel one ninety and around the globe the Bloomberg Business

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Speaker 1: app and Bloomberg Radio dot Com. This is Bloomberg Sound

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Speaker 1: On with Joe Matthew. Thanks for spending part of your

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Speaker 1: Friday with us on Bloomberg Radio. The first thing I

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Speaker 1: read on the terminal this morning looking at my phone

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Speaker 1: of Bloomberg Investigation finds a key piece of evidence underpinning

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Speaker 1: the US government's efforts to block Chinese telecom Wawei. This

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Speaker 1: thing reads like a James Bond novel. As Australian intelligence

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Speaker 1: official informed their American counterparts they detected a sophisticated intrusion

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Speaker 1: into the country's telecom systems. It began, they said, with

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Speaker 1: a software upgrade from Huawei that was loaded with malicious code.

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Speaker 1: Jordan's Robertson shares the byline, He'll be with us in

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Speaker 1: a moment to dig into this. Let's bring in Jordan

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Speaker 1: Robertson the Bloombergs. Jordan Robertson joining us from London today

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Speaker 1: to talk about this story that I just mentioned. Chinese

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Speaker 1: spies accused of using Hahwei in secret telecom hack. Jordan's

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Speaker 1: welcome to Bloomberg sound On. Thank you for having me.

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Speaker 1: What specifically did they find in this malware in Australia? Sure,

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Speaker 1: so you know what we reported is that the Australian

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Speaker 1: government detected an attack against it's the country's telecommunication systems

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Speaker 1: in and what the the Australian intelligence agencies found initially

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Speaker 1: was lots and lots of telecom traffic UH exiting Australia

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Speaker 1: and going to places in China that it should not go.

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Speaker 1: UH investigators followed that path backwards and it led to

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Speaker 1: Wahwee equipment. They followed the path again according to our

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Speaker 1: reporting and sources we've spoken with, and and following that

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Speaker 1: path further, what they found was that the Wahwee equipment

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Speaker 1: had been tampered, UH, that it was normally functioning Whahwee

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Speaker 1: equipment prior to a software update that the equipment received.

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Speaker 1: That software update appeared legitimate and in fact, according to

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Speaker 1: our sources, contained some legitimate functionality. However, again according to

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Speaker 1: our sources, it also contained malicious code that did a

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Speaker 1: really really sophisticated thing. It essentially turned on the equivalent

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Speaker 1: of a digital wire tap. It was malicious code that

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Speaker 1: instructed the machine to begin recording and recording everything that

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Speaker 1: passes through it, so metadata who's contacting whom, what systems

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Speaker 1: are talking to, what systems, what are the content of

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Speaker 1: those communications? That was an email, phone, calls, whatever, and

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Speaker 1: topping that data sending it off to China. And then

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Speaker 1: the really slick part of all of those is uh,

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Speaker 1: the code erased itself according to our sources after just

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Speaker 1: about two or three days. It had a self destruction mechanism.

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Speaker 1: You see, Jordan's a self destruct mechanism, right, so that

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Speaker 1: the two key aspects of this attack as we understand

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Speaker 1: it is, you know, Wawei has gotten a lot, has

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Speaker 1: been attacked a lot over the last decade really, but

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Speaker 1: especially the last few years as being a potential national

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Speaker 1: security threat to you know, any networks that use it.

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Speaker 1: The US has mainly driven this this campaign. The problem

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Speaker 1: with the campaign has been it's all been the public

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Speaker 1: discussion has been based on kind of theory and and

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Speaker 1: and the hypothetical scenario where the Chinese government goes to

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Speaker 1: Wawi and forces it to install backdoors and as products.

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Speaker 1: The company has always denied that this is the case.

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Speaker 1: What Australia found was the Chinese government doesn't need a

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Speaker 1: back door in Wawi's hardware. There is an equivalent of

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Speaker 1: a back door, if you will, in the soft or

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Speaker 1: update mechanism. And and the trick about this is telecommunication

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Speaker 1: systems are not like our smartphones, They're not like our laptops.

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Speaker 1: They're really big, expensive, complicated pieces of equipment that handle

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Speaker 1: way more traffic per minute than our phones do all

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Speaker 1: day long. Right, So so the code for running those

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Speaker 1: systems and the code for maintaining them is also really complex.

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Speaker 1: And typically what will happen is the suppliers for that

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Speaker 1: equipment or of that equipment will then be contracted to

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Speaker 1: maintain the equipment. So you have Whahwei engineers updating or

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Speaker 1: pushing updates to Whahwei equipment on customer network. So what

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Speaker 1: the Australians found, according to our reporting, was that the

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Speaker 1: Chinese intelligence services infiltrated the employee ranks of these Huawei

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Speaker 1: engineers who are responsible for maintaining and updating two systems

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Speaker 1: on this Australian telecommunication network, taking question and had them

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Speaker 1: install an update uh that included this malware. That's as

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Speaker 1: opposed to the company conspiring with Beijing itself. That's right. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's really important to note. And as we stated in

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Speaker 1: the story, you know, are reporting revealed that, you know,

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Speaker 1: what the Australians found was an infiltration or an alleged

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Speaker 1: infiltration of Lahwei's employee ranks of these technicians. What what

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Speaker 1: the evidence showed, according to our sources, was not that

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Speaker 1: the founder of the company was approached by you know,

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Speaker 1: somebody from the Chinese government and said, hey, we need

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Speaker 1: to attack one of your customers. How do we do

428
00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:35,760
Speaker 1: it like you know this, There was no evidence of that,

429
00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:37,959
Speaker 1: and you know, but what there was evidence of, according

430
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:41,800
Speaker 1: to our sources, was this intelligence operation to infiltrate those

431
00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:46,200
Speaker 1: employees and to get them to push code that had

432
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:49,000
Speaker 1: been tampered. And if you think about it, you know,

433
00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:52,480
Speaker 1: that is one of the hardest attacks to ever conceivably

434
00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:57,600
Speaker 1: defend against, because these telecodes were paying Lahwei um for

435
00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:00,120
Speaker 1: these updates, you know, I mean, it'd be like saying,

436
00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:03,159
Speaker 1: you know, if Apple pushes an update for iPhones, what

437
00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:05,760
Speaker 1: do you do? Click on it? Because Apple is saying

438
00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:08,480
Speaker 1: you need to fix this problem. Here's the code to

439
00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:11,720
Speaker 1: do it. And so if that process is corrupted, which

440
00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:14,600
Speaker 1: according according to our sources it was in this case,

441
00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:20,840
Speaker 1: that's that's a kind of attack that virtually is is unstoppable. Jordan,

442
00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:24,680
Speaker 1: you confirmed the breach, this Australia breach, with almost two

443
00:25:24,760 --> 00:25:28,439
Speaker 1: dozen you write, former national security officials who were briefed

444
00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:31,320
Speaker 1: on the matter over a period of time. But Hawei

445
00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:34,320
Speaker 1: and China itself, the Chinese government say this is this

446
00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:36,960
Speaker 1: is all not true. Yes, yes, we've confirmed information with

447
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:39,920
Speaker 1: nearly two dozen former national security officials in both the

448
00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:42,280
Speaker 1: US and Australia. You know, one of the things that's

449
00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:45,159
Speaker 1: always unclear to us, you know, in these stories is

450
00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:49,480
Speaker 1: we know how information flows to people whom it flowed to.

451
00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:54,040
Speaker 1: We don't have any information that Whahwei was told about

452
00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:56,399
Speaker 1: this incident, and in fact, we would imagine that Wahwei

453
00:25:56,480 --> 00:25:59,199
Speaker 1: would not be told. So what Huawei has said is,

454
00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:04,200
Speaker 1: you know, they find a comment on specific questions. Lawei said, Essentially,

455
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:06,119
Speaker 1: it's hard to comment on something they say they know

456
00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:08,920
Speaker 1: nothing about. They may be telling the truth. What happens

457
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:12,280
Speaker 1: a lot into investigations is, you know, governments investigate, they

458
00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:15,000
Speaker 1: have very sensitive secret material. They may share it with

459
00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:18,480
Speaker 1: close allies, as Australia apparently did in this case, but

460
00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:22,480
Speaker 1: they wouldn't go to a company like Huawei and say, hey,

461
00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:25,320
Speaker 1: guess what we found. But yeah, Chinese government says we

462
00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:29,360
Speaker 1: would never do hacking attacks. Every country does hacking attacks

463
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:33,320
Speaker 1: for intelligence purposes for different reasons. And Huawei, you know,

464
00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:36,680
Speaker 1: we've made very clear in the story that, as you mentioned,

465
00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:40,960
Speaker 1: this was an alleged infiltration of its employee base, which

466
00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:43,679
Speaker 1: every company has to worry about. What our understanding is,

467
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:48,080
Speaker 1: you know, Australia's evidence showed that this was a Chinese

468
00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:52,359
Speaker 1: infiltration of a Chinese company's employee base to instigate an

469
00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:56,200
Speaker 1: attack against a foreign country. Well, I guess the American

470
00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:59,760
Speaker 1: intelligence then the CIA Defense Department looking pretty smart right

471
00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:03,199
Speaker 1: now after this report. Jordan's what this story shows is

472
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:06,679
Speaker 1: you know, and what sources told us was essentially the

473
00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 1: first kind of concrete evidence gathered by a Western intelligence

474
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:16,119
Speaker 1: service of China's intelligence services using laweis a conduit for espionage,

475
00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:19,040
Speaker 1: and it was hard to find. According to our sources,

476
00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:20,919
Speaker 1: this was not something that jumped out of them. They

477
00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:23,560
Speaker 1: had to work really really hard to find credible. Great

478
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:26,439
Speaker 1: piece of reporting, great bit of journalism. Find it on

479
00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:28,399
Speaker 1: the terminal and read the rest for yourself. There's a

480
00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:30,520
Speaker 1: lot more here that we didn't have a chance to

481
00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:33,359
Speaker 1: get to. Jordan Robertson shares the byline in Jordan, we

482
00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:35,800
Speaker 1: appreciate your insights today. Thanks for bringing this to us.

483
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:38,280
Speaker 1: On sound on, Thanks so much for having me appreciate it.

484
00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:43,200
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg. You're listening to Bloomberg. You sound on

485
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:49,080
Speaker 1: with Joe Maview on Bloomberg Radio. Bloomberg sound On Rochy

486
00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:53,680
Speaker 1: by New Jersey Institute of Technology, ranked top fifty college

487
00:27:53,680 --> 00:27:58,040
Speaker 1: for undergraduate entrepreneurship studies by the Princeton Review. Learn more

488
00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:02,280
Speaker 1: at n j I T A d. U. As we

489
00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:07,399
Speaker 1: reassemble the panel, Bloomberg Politics contributor Jeanie Schanzano is with us,

490
00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:10,080
Speaker 1: along with Bill McGinley, principle of the Vocal Group, former

491
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:14,080
Speaker 1: Deputy Council at the r n C. Genie, that story

492
00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:17,239
Speaker 1: read like a spy novel, as I said earlier, an

493
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:20,040
Speaker 1: incredible result in a quite a piece of journalism here

494
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:22,120
Speaker 1: on the terminal that I do encourage everybody to read.

495
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:24,760
Speaker 1: But it does make me think of the foreign policy

496
00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:28,560
Speaker 1: challenges facing this administration. We've been talking about all domestic

497
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:31,800
Speaker 1: issues so far this hour, and of course we're gonna

498
00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:34,159
Speaker 1: come back in January with Build Back Better. We'll be

499
00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:37,520
Speaker 1: hearing a lot about the child tax credit, maybe voting

500
00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:40,200
Speaker 1: rights and some of the other issues that you pointed

501
00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:42,160
Speaker 1: out that will be coming from the Supreme Court as well.

502
00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:46,080
Speaker 1: But I wonder considering that the window is closing, according

503
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:48,320
Speaker 1: to everyone we're talking to on this program, for a

504
00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:52,640
Speaker 1: lot of these domestic issues well be defined for the

505
00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:57,480
Speaker 1: Biden administration by foreign policy. This issue with China, thousands

506
00:28:57,560 --> 00:29:00,080
Speaker 1: of Russian troops along the Ukrainian border, that's how we

507
00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:03,080
Speaker 1: start the new year, Genie. It is, and it's fascinating

508
00:29:03,080 --> 00:29:05,080
Speaker 1: because I was thinking the same thing. First of all,

509
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:09,320
Speaker 1: an amazing piece of investigative journalism by Jordan and his colleagues.

510
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:12,800
Speaker 1: I mean it, just listening to your interview, I was

511
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:16,680
Speaker 1: hanging on every word and it is really something. And

512
00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:19,400
Speaker 1: and you know, we do spend so much time focused

513
00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:23,280
Speaker 1: on domestic policy, which is critically important, and I think,

514
00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:25,760
Speaker 1: you know, listening to that piece, it reminds you of

515
00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:29,400
Speaker 1: what you said. You know, so many issues confronting us

516
00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:32,600
Speaker 1: are coming from outside the United States. You know, this

517
00:29:32,680 --> 00:29:35,440
Speaker 1: is an administration a president who I think has rightly

518
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:38,360
Speaker 1: said the challenge of the twenty one century is democracy

519
00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:42,520
Speaker 1: versus autocracy. He had the meeting a couple of weeks ago,

520
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:45,000
Speaker 1: I think it was they're supposed to come back next year.

521
00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:48,320
Speaker 1: And you think about the fact that the intelligence community

522
00:29:48,360 --> 00:29:51,160
Speaker 1: in the United States they were right when they were

523
00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:54,479
Speaker 1: warning about this, according to this reporting, and here we

524
00:29:54,520 --> 00:29:57,440
Speaker 1: have evidence of this going back to telve and what

525
00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:00,719
Speaker 1: has happened in the interim we don't still know. And

526
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:04,200
Speaker 1: of course, as you mentioned, so many other issues confronting

527
00:30:04,360 --> 00:30:07,120
Speaker 1: the United States and the rest of the world, from Russia,

528
00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:10,600
Speaker 1: China and elsewhere. And so it is going to be

529
00:30:10,640 --> 00:30:13,240
Speaker 1: fascinating to see how much of that plays into what

530
00:30:13,320 --> 00:30:16,040
Speaker 1: happens next year and what the administration has to confront.

531
00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:19,600
Speaker 1: You read a story like this building Guinley and you think, gosh, okay,

532
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:23,600
Speaker 1: so we're boycotting the Olympics, sort of what more needs

533
00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:28,240
Speaker 1: to be done encountering China in the new year. Well,

534
00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:31,240
Speaker 1: it's it's interesting. Number One. Bloomberg and Jordans really do

535
00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:33,840
Speaker 1: need to be congratulated on this story. It's an incredible

536
00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:37,080
Speaker 1: piece of reporting um that really does pull the curtain

537
00:30:37,120 --> 00:30:40,080
Speaker 1: back so that the American people can understand the nature,

538
00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:43,440
Speaker 1: scope and scale of the threat of this type of

539
00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:47,040
Speaker 1: surveillance and espionage that can happen both in the United

540
00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:51,920
Speaker 1: States and its allies. But foreign policy has already started

541
00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:56,360
Speaker 1: to play a pretty big role in defining this administration

542
00:30:56,480 --> 00:31:01,280
Speaker 1: and what's happening across the globe, starting with fk anistan Uh.

543
00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:03,160
Speaker 1: You know, there's a lot of support to pull out.

544
00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:07,920
Speaker 1: The planning and execution of the pullout did not go well,

545
00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:11,320
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of folks who think that the

546
00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:18,200
Speaker 1: emerging and and continuing progressive behavior from the Communist the

547
00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:22,840
Speaker 1: Chinese Communist Party with the assorties through the Taiwanese airspace,

548
00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:26,520
Speaker 1: the amassing of the Russian troops on the Ukrainian border,

549
00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:29,440
Speaker 1: but some of the other things that are happening in

550
00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:34,040
Speaker 1: the Middle East are all related because the United States

551
00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:37,360
Speaker 1: still is the indispensable nation and we need to be

552
00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:41,120
Speaker 1: projecting strength and leadership across the world. Um as some

553
00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:43,760
Speaker 1: of these other countries are beginning to try and assert

554
00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:48,640
Speaker 1: uh some sort of dominance not only over trade diplomacy,

555
00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:52,280
Speaker 1: but are also beginning to rattle their military sabers. And

556
00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 1: I think it's going to be a year where we're

557
00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:56,560
Speaker 1: all going to have to pay attention to to what's

558
00:31:56,600 --> 00:32:00,320
Speaker 1: happening abroad because it's not only going to impact us

559
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:02,040
Speaker 1: here at home, but I think a lot of our

560
00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:04,600
Speaker 1: allies are looking for America to step up and continue

561
00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:08,600
Speaker 1: its leadership role. These are major tests, Genie, no matter

562
00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:11,040
Speaker 1: who's in the White House, and there's nothing you can

563
00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:13,320
Speaker 1: do to to predict this stuff, you know, and you

564
00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:16,840
Speaker 1: just have to manage the reality. And that is the reality.

565
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:19,840
Speaker 1: Then there's politics, and that's a separate bucket, that's a

566
00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:22,720
Speaker 1: separate view that we tend to talk about more often

567
00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:25,400
Speaker 1: on this broadcast with regard to the mid term elections.

568
00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:28,720
Speaker 1: Though party is not gonna win mid term elections based

569
00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:33,280
Speaker 1: on the way it handles foreign policy, right, it absolutely won't.

570
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:36,320
Speaker 1: I mean, it's seldom that you see foreign policy becoming

571
00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:39,440
Speaker 1: a you know, critical issue in voters minds. At this point,

572
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:42,120
Speaker 1: voters are saying that they are two issues they are

573
00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:45,840
Speaker 1: most worried about, in addition to the pandemic is inflation,

574
00:32:45,920 --> 00:32:49,200
Speaker 1: as we talk so much about, and also crime, and

575
00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:52,720
Speaker 1: those are sort of two key issues on many voters minds.

576
00:32:52,800 --> 00:32:56,360
Speaker 1: You seldom see foreign policy playing role, and yet it

577
00:32:56,480 --> 00:32:58,600
Speaker 1: is critically important to all of our lives. I mean,

578
00:32:58,680 --> 00:33:01,040
Speaker 1: you know, Bill just mentioned the least. We haven't spent

579
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:03,800
Speaker 1: a lot of time in the US talking about the

580
00:33:03,840 --> 00:33:06,360
Speaker 1: fact that there are talks about this a Ran nuclear

581
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:09,160
Speaker 1: agreement going on right now that the US has been

582
00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:13,520
Speaker 1: you know, sidelined, you know, from to a certain extent,

583
00:33:13,920 --> 00:33:16,240
Speaker 1: and you couple that with all of the other issues

584
00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:20,200
Speaker 1: coming from China, Russia, Taiwan, Afghanistan's Bill just pointed out,

585
00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:24,040
Speaker 1: and you've got a recipe for, you know, something combustible

586
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:28,600
Speaker 1: potentially in the new year. What's your thoughts on that bill?

587
00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:31,640
Speaker 1: If you're preparing to run as a Republican in the

588
00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:36,800
Speaker 1: mid terms. Are you focused on inflation, maybe COVID, some

589
00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:39,239
Speaker 1: of the concerns about mandates and so forth. Are you

590
00:33:39,280 --> 00:33:42,160
Speaker 1: digging into the way this president is handling threats from

591
00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:46,400
Speaker 1: China and Russia. If you're a Republican, you're studying the

592
00:33:46,720 --> 00:33:49,600
Speaker 1: political strategy of the Youncan campaign and the victory in

593
00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:53,240
Speaker 1: Virginia UM and also the close call that the Democrats

594
00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:57,880
Speaker 1: had in New Jersey on the domestic issues of education, crime, inflation,

595
00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 1: the real kitchen table issues at families are dealing with

596
00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 1: every single day, including the education of their children. But

597
00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:07,560
Speaker 1: I think if you're running for federal office, you have

598
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:12,080
Speaker 1: to keep a close eye on what's happening abroad in

599
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:15,920
Speaker 1: in our national security and foreign relations because in times

600
00:34:15,960 --> 00:34:19,280
Speaker 1: like these, where people perceive that there is some sort

601
00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 1: of you know, dissidents within the United States, Uh, there

602
00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:26,080
Speaker 1: could be a misconception that there's some weakness and some

603
00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:28,719
Speaker 1: of our adversaries may try to take advantage of that.

604
00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:31,319
Speaker 1: And I think it's something that we really do need

605
00:34:31,360 --> 00:34:33,920
Speaker 1: to keep an eye on because I think does have

606
00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:37,320
Speaker 1: the potential where some of these foreign relations issues could

607
00:34:37,320 --> 00:34:39,439
Speaker 1: come to a head or we may have to take

608
00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:41,879
Speaker 1: some sort of significant action to try and make sure

609
00:34:42,560 --> 00:34:45,840
Speaker 1: uh that the United States and its interests abroad remained secure.

610
00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:49,080
Speaker 1: So back to the to do list your domestically, Genie,

611
00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:52,319
Speaker 1: we know build back better will be addressed immediately. Does

612
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:55,279
Speaker 1: anything else come close? Is it voting rights that Democrats

613
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:57,440
Speaker 1: lean into? Is it is it may be restoring some

614
00:34:57,520 --> 00:34:59,879
Speaker 1: of the climate provisions that didn't end up in this

615
00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:02,880
Speaker 1: reconciliation bill that may or may not see the light

616
00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:04,879
Speaker 1: of day. I think they're going to focus a good

617
00:35:04,920 --> 00:35:07,520
Speaker 1: deal on voting rights, as that's a critical issue for

618
00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:09,960
Speaker 1: the base of the Democratic Party, and as you mentioned,

619
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:12,839
Speaker 1: climate change of course critical. But whether they can get

620
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:15,879
Speaker 1: any of those, you know, past the line in an

621
00:35:15,880 --> 00:35:18,960
Speaker 1: election year, remains to be seen. They are feeling, you know,

622
00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:21,640
Speaker 1: they are feeling or at least saying that they may

623
00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:23,759
Speaker 1: be able to move some of this forward. But you know,

624
00:35:23,800 --> 00:35:26,160
Speaker 1: I think we all have our doubts. Historically that has

625
00:35:26,239 --> 00:35:29,720
Speaker 1: not been the case. I have less than a minute here, Genie.

626
00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:33,160
Speaker 1: In bill bill, how will we remember one? From a

627
00:35:33,160 --> 00:35:37,279
Speaker 1: political perspective? Will it be recovering from COVID? Will it

628
00:35:37,320 --> 00:35:41,760
Speaker 1: be inflation? I think it's going to be inflation crime

629
00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:43,960
Speaker 1: in Afghanistan. I think they're going to be the three

630
00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:48,000
Speaker 1: dominant stories out. Do you think I think inflation. I

631
00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:52,200
Speaker 1: also think the battle for the over the pandemic. Many

632
00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:55,040
Speaker 1: thanks to both of you. Great talk. Bloomberg Politics contributor

633
00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:57,560
Speaker 1: Jennie Schanzano Bill McGinley also with us today from the

634
00:35:57,640 --> 00:36:00,719
Speaker 1: Vocal Group, former Deputy Council at the r NC. Thanks

635
00:36:00,719 --> 00:36:03,080
Speaker 1: to to Michael Steele for being with us earlier in

636
00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:07,440
Speaker 1: the broadcast. What a time we're living in. I'll be

637
00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:09,680
Speaker 1: off next week, so I wish you merry Christmas. Right now,

638
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:13,640
Speaker 1: take the opportunity. One may technically not be done yet,

639
00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:20,120
Speaker 1: but here in Washington, the music is over. I thought

640
00:36:20,120 --> 00:36:21,560
Speaker 1: this should be a good time to kind of sum

641
00:36:21,640 --> 00:36:25,840
Speaker 1: up my view of the year. I said, let's pass

642
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:30,200
Speaker 1: the sugar and then see if they can swallow the spinning.

643
00:36:30,640 --> 00:36:33,880
Speaker 1: So the spinach was left behind, and as we speak today,

644
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:38,839
Speaker 1: they're having a hard time swallowing spi The Senator, as

645
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:41,120
Speaker 1: Mark just said, is about to go into holiday recess

646
00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:43,840
Speaker 1: without achieving President Biden's goal of passing a version of

647
00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:46,560
Speaker 1: the Build Back Better Plan, but with a promise to

648
00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:52,960
Speaker 1: revisit it in the new year. We don't go into specifics.

649
00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:56,160
Speaker 1: We have a policy of not talking about private conversations,

650
00:36:56,239 --> 00:37:01,200
Speaker 1: and even Mansion said that himself. Part of that conversation

651
00:37:01,600 --> 00:37:04,759
Speaker 1: involves of finding ways to restore the Senate so it

652
00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:07,480
Speaker 1: can once again work as it's supposed to, as it

653
00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:10,560
Speaker 1: has worked for generations before the gridlock of the past

654
00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 1: decade or so. These conversations are ongoing, so give us

655
00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:16,520
Speaker 1: a sense of what will be different in January from

656
00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:18,840
Speaker 1: what we had in December that might get some version

657
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:21,640
Speaker 1: of build back better done. I think a little eggnog

658
00:37:21,719 --> 00:37:24,920
Speaker 1: a piece of fruitcake might help everyone when it comes

659
00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:30,879
Speaker 1: to returning to the table. There are some things that

660
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:34,080
Speaker 1: maybe we could find common ground on, but what we're

661
00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:40,040
Speaker 1: being offered the vote on in the center music is

662
00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:43,800
Speaker 1: a complete non starter. No, I think that this is

663
00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:52,000
Speaker 1: called the legislative process, so I'm still hopeful that it

664
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:54,759
Speaker 1: will pass. I'm not going to have a postmortem on

665
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:59,480
Speaker 1: something that hasn't died. Mr Manson is opposed to that,

666
00:38:00,920 --> 00:38:06,440
Speaker 1: as is Uh. I think Senator Cinema is apposed to

667
00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:10,839
Speaker 1: all of them. Opposed to all three. My grandfather just say,

668
00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:13,480
Speaker 1: unmanaged debt will make a coward out of the decisions

669
00:38:13,480 --> 00:38:17,120
Speaker 1: you make. Joe is not a bad guy, and he's

670
00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:19,239
Speaker 1: a friend, and he's always the end of the day,

671
00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:32,520
Speaker 1: come around and voted. I hope I see you next week.

672
00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:38,200
Speaker 1: But if I don't marry everything, Mary Christmas happy in Lagad, Hannah,

673
00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:41,919
Speaker 1: come married everything. Holding this bill hostage is not going

674
00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:46,600
Speaker 1: to work and getting my support for reconciliation though I'm

675
00:38:46,680 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 1: Joe Matthew and this is Bloomberg