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Speaker 1: All right, welcome back to another episode of Cutting the

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Speaker 1: Distance Podcast. I'm Derk Durham and today our podcast studio

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Speaker 1: is located in eastern Kansas. Would you call that eastern?

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Speaker 1: Would we say southeastern Kansas, Central, Eastern Central, Eastern Kansas. Uh.

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Speaker 1: We got my good friend and colleague Jason Phelps. Jason

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Speaker 1: Glenn Phelps says he goes by on the old ig Instagram.

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Speaker 1: In case you guys don't follow him, well, give him

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Speaker 1: a follow. I know, I know he's he's in he's

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Speaker 1: in a bad way. He can't he can't keep up

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Speaker 1: with me on his followers. And you know that's not

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Speaker 1: that's kind of a humble brag at my part, but

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Speaker 1: you know, I'm just trying to try to give him

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Speaker 1: some love. And so if you guys are on Instagram

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Speaker 1: and you like like Jason Phelps, give him a give

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Speaker 1: him a follow and uh, and you might even send

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Speaker 1: him a DM and just let him know what you

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Speaker 1: think about the podcast.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to thank all three of you that take

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Speaker 2: Dirk's advice and go to Instagram follow me. Yeah, thank you, and.

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Speaker 1: Hopefully they'll have good positive feedback. Only like, hey, first off,

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Speaker 1: my first complaint Phelps, is this, Yeah, I'm always giving.

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Speaker 2: The good thing is, I'm such such a good person

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Speaker 2: at taking criticism, constructive criticism. I take it really well.

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Speaker 2: I just kind of rolls, and I'm no, I joke.

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Speaker 2: In real life, I don't like constructive criticism. I'm not

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Speaker 2: good at dealing with it.

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Speaker 1: So wait, wait, all this time, I've been criticizing your

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Speaker 1: every word and your every move and it's sometimes not

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Speaker 1: that constructively, and you haven't said a thing. I thought

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Speaker 1: you didn't. I thought you liked it.

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Speaker 3: No.

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Speaker 1: Oh wow, well, man, egg on my face. Should have

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Speaker 1: been more self aware all this time. Well, anyway, you know,

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Speaker 1: Phelps and I are on this Turkey trip over here,

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Speaker 1: and we hardly ever get time together because I work remote.

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Speaker 1: I'm in the Boise, Idaho area metropolitan the Greater metropolitan area,

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Speaker 1: you know, the beautiful city of Boise, but I don't

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Speaker 1: live in Boise, but Jason lives in pl and we

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Speaker 1: only get together a few times a year, you know,

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Speaker 1: on a hunting trip or something. So we try to

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Speaker 1: take advantage of those times to record some podcasts. We're

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Speaker 1: gonna knock out a handful of them here while we're together,

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Speaker 1: and hopefully you guys enjoy them. And today we're taking

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Speaker 1: we're talking elk hunting, and we've taken some questions, some

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Speaker 1: listener questions from the Super Secret Hotline. And if you

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Speaker 1: guys ever want to call in and leave a message,

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Speaker 1: you can let me know, you know, any criticisms or

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Speaker 1: instructions for Jason Phelps to you know, be a better

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Speaker 1: podcast or maybe just a better human being, then you

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Speaker 1: can always call in and call in The Super Secret

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Speaker 1: Hotline number is to await two one nine seven to

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Speaker 1: seven zero one and leave a message. It can't be

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Speaker 1: longer than three minutes, I think, so he'll have to

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Speaker 1: be mindful of your time. Your make your question about hunting,

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Speaker 1: elk hunting, deer hunting, turkey hunting, whatever, make a brief

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Speaker 1: question or a comment about, you know, Jason and his

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Speaker 1: lack of hair on his head.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I have to ask though, why is it? Why

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Speaker 2: do you consider it a super secret number? Wouldn't you

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Speaker 2: want people to know the number to call in and

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Speaker 2: then we give it out on a podcast, which kind

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Speaker 2: of makes it unsuper secret.

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Speaker 1: Well, it's it's like being in a selective club or

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Speaker 1: an elite club. Are are dedicated and valued podcast listeners

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Speaker 1: they get to know that number. But Joe Public, he

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Speaker 1: doesn't get that number. Or Jill Jill Public her too,

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Speaker 1: either one of them, they don't get to They don't

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Speaker 1: get to call in. Well, I mean, I wouldn't mind

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Speaker 1: if they did, if you guys share it, but we

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Speaker 1: just don't put that out in the universe. But you know,

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Speaker 1: more questions we get, you know, the more of these

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Speaker 1: kind of episodes we can do. But anyhow, did you

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Speaker 1: have any other criticisms? Jason?

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Speaker 2: No, no, I think this is starting off great.

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Speaker 1: Okay, all right, well good, well, I think we'll just

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Speaker 1: jump it right into the questions here and without further ado.

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Speaker 1: Question number one, Hey.

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Speaker 4: Dirk, Yeah, this is Craig sour Colin, call him from Spokane, Washington.

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Speaker 4: Love your podcast, un Philips, I know how to do

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Speaker 4: it up. So yeah, I definitely got a thirst for

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Speaker 4: ELK information. And I think I've got a question for

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Speaker 4: for your ELK hotline here. So yeah, I'm kind of

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Speaker 4: an old dog learning some new tricks, turning fifty two

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Speaker 4: to this this summer, but hopefully I've got another dozen

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Speaker 4: or so years left in my legs. And yeah, I've

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Speaker 4: done your ELK Collective and quite a few online modules

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Speaker 4: and yeah, I got some questions for you, So to

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Speaker 4: give you some context, Yeah, I'm hunting North Idaho, Fick train,

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Speaker 4: panhandle general tags, so you know, you know what I'm

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Speaker 4: talking about there. So your mission, should you choose to

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Speaker 4: accept it. I think you could do an entire podcast

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Speaker 4: on these questions. Basically two questions. The first one has

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Speaker 4: three subparts. So the first one I'll just fire away

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Speaker 4: here basically trying to formulate more robust day hunt plan.

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Speaker 4: And so I think a day hunt plan would would

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Speaker 4: generally be kind of like three categories that could be

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Speaker 4: broken down into your morning hunt plan, the midday madness

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Speaker 4: so that I think you coined, and then the evening strategy.

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Speaker 4: And so just some specific questions on those three categories.

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Speaker 4: Morning strategy, you know, would would you prefer to be

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Speaker 4: you know, high elevation above them in the morning and

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Speaker 4: kind of descend down on them and negotiate the thermals

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Speaker 4: in the wind or would you rather kind of start

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Speaker 4: at access point low and come high. So that'd kind

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Speaker 4: of be my morning question. Midday I think you could

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Speaker 4: spend a lot of time and if you kind of

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Speaker 4: break down your strategy for for midday Basically the assumption

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Speaker 4: is you know where some elk are at and you've

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Speaker 4: got to get them to talk. Kind of running through that,

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Speaker 4: calling seasonal tendencies to biography, you know, when to be patient,

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Speaker 4: do you just hang out for another couple hours, so

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Speaker 4: on and so forth? And then the evening strategy, you know,

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Speaker 4: is that basically kind of just the reverse of the

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Speaker 4: morning strategy. So kind of breaking down your day hunt

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Speaker 4: plan into those three categories. Last question just kind of

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Speaker 4: for a guy like me's going two hours or so.

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Speaker 4: To my side, I can do h you know, would

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Speaker 4: you rather type deal three four day hunts or would

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Speaker 4: you rather do go all in for a ten day stint?

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Speaker 4: So those are my questions. I hope you can tackle

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Speaker 4: it again. Appreciate your podcast, thanks to.

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Speaker 1: All right Phelps. What do you think? I know that

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Speaker 1: was very specific for North Idaho, but I will say

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Speaker 1: I kind of I had to kind of use the

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Speaker 1: same tactics just about everywhere I go, same kind of mindset,

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Speaker 1: if you will. But what are your thoughts? I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: go ahead and let you ask this answer that question.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so I'm gonna kind of repeat it again. Day

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Speaker 2: hunt plans kind of what are you gonna do in

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Speaker 2: the morning, what do you do in the middle of

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Speaker 2: the day, and then we're gonna do for your evening

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Speaker 2: hunt if you were to break it up into three sections.

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Speaker 2: And I'm pretty similar to you. No matter if I'm

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Speaker 2: in North Idaho and can't see, if I'm in you know,

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Speaker 2: Colorado above tree line, if I'm in western Washington hunt

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Speaker 2: and clearcuts and timber, my morning hunt is always to

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Speaker 2: try to let my glassing, my my optics do the

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Speaker 2: work possible. Anybody that's listened to me talk elk hunting,

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Speaker 2: I'd always prefer to spot elk without half in the bugle,

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Speaker 2: without halving to see him, just so I can observe

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Speaker 2: and do some of that. So my morning is always

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Speaker 2: to usually get on a high point if possible, let

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Speaker 2: my glassing work. Now I'm gonna, you know, recognize that

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Speaker 2: we're in North Idaho and that's probably not going to happen.

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Speaker 2: So then what I want to do if I have

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Speaker 2: to use audible method, I'm going to try to get

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Speaker 2: the high ground. I want to be on a ridge

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Speaker 2: top typically and then just work work those areas, you know,

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Speaker 2: be high. I want to locate elk. You know, whether

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Speaker 2: it's through glassing or audible, get high, lokate elk and

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Speaker 2: then and now some may say, and he talked about it,

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Speaker 2: there are times that if I know elk are going

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Speaker 2: to be in the similar areas day after day, I

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Speaker 2: will start low and just take my chances that I

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Speaker 2: know they're there. I don't need to be high anymore

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Speaker 2: to do that. I'm gonna go get the thermals right

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Speaker 2: because I feel my best play is to try to

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Speaker 2: take advantage before those thermals switch in the morning. And

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Speaker 2: so it's really just, you know, I do a lot

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Speaker 2: of these, you know, being a math nerd, being an engineer,

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Speaker 2: I equate everything too well. If I stay high, spot

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Speaker 2: them and then have to go low, my percentage is

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Speaker 2: seventeen percent chance and I'm gonna kill it. But if

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Speaker 2: I go low, can't see them, but they're there now,

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Speaker 2: my odds are up to thirty.

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Speaker 4: You know.

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Speaker 2: That's it's not necessarily like that, but it's kind of

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Speaker 2: what I'm thinking that what gives me the best chance

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Speaker 2: of killing killing that elk. So in the morning, I

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Speaker 2: need to be able to locate elk. I need to

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Speaker 2: be able to start my day. I need to you know,

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Speaker 2: find out get in the game. So that's that's number one,

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Speaker 2: and then I'll make my adjustments. If if I am

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Speaker 2: high locatable, then I'll do everything in my power to

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Speaker 2: get the wind. If I have to be patient, which

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Speaker 2: I'm not good at, I'll sit and kind of shadow

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Speaker 2: it and tell the thermal switch whatever it needs to be.

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Speaker 2: But number one, in the morning, I'm always trying to

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Speaker 2: find Elk first and foremost, and then I have to

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Speaker 2: deal with the wind that's presented the train vegetation from

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Speaker 2: there mid day and a lot of the mid day

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Speaker 2: is going to depend on how my morning went. So sometimes,

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Speaker 2: especially in New Mexico, we seem to get stuck in

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Speaker 2: the cat and mouse game, and we'll do that and

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Speaker 2: a lot of other places, but more so so, you

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Speaker 2: may follow Elk to bed and then sit there and

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Speaker 2: like figure out the winds and thermals, and you're like, ah,

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Speaker 2: these things are pretty dang smart craters. They betted it

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Speaker 2: in a spot that I can't get to. So we

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Speaker 2: start to think, like, well, if we sit on these

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Speaker 2: all day, is there a bowl in there I want

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Speaker 2: to go after? And I want do I want to

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Speaker 2: go find something else? So sometimes we'll just sit on

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Speaker 2: elk all afternoon, as frustrating as it is, you take

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Speaker 2: a nap, you're in a safe spot, you can observe,

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Speaker 2: you can hear them do their midday bugles. Now, if

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Speaker 2: these elk decide to go to bed and you're waiting

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Speaker 2: for a thermal switch or it's going you're gonna have

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Speaker 2: to methodically and slowly get in there. With the wind.

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Speaker 2: You can go after those elk at times midday. So

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Speaker 2: let's say they're in an area you're not very confident in,

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Speaker 2: Sit and listen, Sit and wait for thermals to change.

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Speaker 2: If I'm presented with that, I love hunting elk in

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Speaker 2: the middle of the day. If I feel I've got

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Speaker 2: an advantage, or the wind isn't an issue and visibilities

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Speaker 2: low and there's no threat of me bumping those things out,

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Speaker 2: I'll make my play and move in very, very slow.

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Speaker 2: If you have the wind right, hopefully you'll smell them

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Speaker 2: before you get too close. And if that bowl continues

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Speaker 2: to bugle from his bed or bugle occasionally throughout the midday,

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Speaker 2: you'll have a very good low you know, a pin

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Speaker 2: on his location. One thing I'd like to caution people

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Speaker 2: with though a lot of times as you approach elk,

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Speaker 2: especially if it's a herd bowl bedded with cows, you know.

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Speaker 2: Maybe not so much on satellites. Is the satellites, if

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Speaker 2: they are there or around, typically will be on that

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Speaker 2: down wind side. Almost is lookouts or you know, scouts

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Speaker 2: for these things. So I would say the majority of

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Speaker 2: the time on bigger herds that I know, herd, bulls

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Speaker 2: and satellites are together, you will somewhere along the way

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Speaker 2: bump or potentially run into those satellites on your way

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Speaker 2: to that herd bowl that may be bugling, So keep

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Speaker 2: that in mind as well. So midday, let's say we

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Speaker 2: didn't get on something right away, midday is going to

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Speaker 2: turn into an ELK finding mission. Right if I'm not

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Speaker 2: on Elk, I'm always trying to find elk. So I'm

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Speaker 2: looking at the train, am I running ridges? Am I

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Speaker 2: looking at like low passes where ELK may have went

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Speaker 2: through that morning. I'm also going to continue to bugle

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Speaker 2: into areas with with some you know, just to see

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Speaker 2: if I can get a response from that bowl in

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Speaker 2: his bed. I'm just looking to find elk that once again,

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Speaker 2: either I can go after right away or two save

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Speaker 2: for the night hunt. So now as we're rolling through

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Speaker 2: on the evening, I'm once again, if I don't have

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Speaker 2: elk found still from the morning or the afternoon, I'm

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Speaker 2: going I'm going back to finding elk one either to

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Speaker 2: hunt them that night or two to find them in

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Speaker 2: which a lot of time, especially if you can use glass,

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Speaker 2: which you can't North Idaho. Specific to this question, you

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Speaker 2: can save them for the morning if the thermals aren't

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Speaker 2: right or you know, let's say you're high on a

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Speaker 2: ridge again, you get bowls to people down to the

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Speaker 2: basin unless the thermals you know, or the thermals won't

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Speaker 2: allow you to make a play unless you can get

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Speaker 2: way below them or or whatnot. So we'll typically leave

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Speaker 2: you know, those things alone and come back in the

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Speaker 2: morning where we've got a different plan. But yeah, I

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Speaker 2: don't want to oversimplify this question, but I also don't

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Speaker 2: want to take up the whole podcast on it. If

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Speaker 2: you oversimplify this, it's find elk and hunt elk or

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Speaker 2: you find out to wait on elk to hunt the

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Speaker 2: elk later, and it's it kind of goes through those

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Speaker 2: three you know, morning, midday, afternoon. Like I said, I'm

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Speaker 2: pretty pretty vanilla on this, get high, locate or locate

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Speaker 2: either glassing or audible find out and go hunt them.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and then what about what about your choice of

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Speaker 1: a like four day hunts versus ten day hunts?

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Speaker 2: Man, it's really six is on this one? You know,

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Speaker 2: it's like half a dozen the one say, there are

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Speaker 2: times where I think a four day or three four

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Speaker 2: day hunts will better, especially if you're unsure of rut

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Speaker 2: timing or pressure. I could see where those work, but

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Speaker 2: I would say the majority of the time I lean

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Speaker 2: towards those longer hunts. It lets me kind of start

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Speaker 2: to figure things out, make a plan, no where pressure's

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Speaker 2: at right then, Versus if you're going in and out,

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Speaker 2: you don't know what's happening during the week, you don't

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Speaker 2: know what happened on the weekends. I prefer that that

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Speaker 2: ten day hunt just because of my mind. I feel

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Speaker 2: like I've I know a little more about what's going on,

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Speaker 2: and maybe I have a little more control over the situation.

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Speaker 2: Versus if I keep showing up and leaving, Yeah, you

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Speaker 2: may hit the rut better or the timing may be better.

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Speaker 2: Versus pressure versus not pressure. Yeah, I it's I would

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Speaker 2: prefer that longer trip.

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Speaker 1: I think, yeah, I've kind of done. But like back

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Speaker 1: when I used to used to have to weaken warrior

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Speaker 1: it for the most part, you know, maybe have a

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Speaker 1: long weekend, like a three day weekend. And I used

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Speaker 1: to work with guys that would have like a they

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Speaker 1: would use spend their their vacation time just like that.

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Speaker 1: They'd take off Mondays and Tuesdays, so they'd hunt Saturday, Sunday,

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Speaker 1: Monday Tuesday, which allowed them to hunt the woods on

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Speaker 1: Mondays and Tuesdays. There are a lot of times there's

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Speaker 1: less people, you know, people have gone home, there's less

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Speaker 1: of those weekend warriors out there. But anytime I've had

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Speaker 1: those smaller like long weekends I've hunted, it seemed like

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Speaker 1: about the time I got into Elk really good and

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Speaker 1: had them nailed down in perfect like Okay, I got

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Speaker 1: them going, and then I have to go to work

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Speaker 1: the next day. So I would always kind of like

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Speaker 1: it would always just kind of like shorten or just

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Speaker 1: like I'd have to just leave bugling Elk when I

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Speaker 1: should be staying longer. So I always kind of felt like,

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Speaker 1: man if I could have those ten day hunts to

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Speaker 1: put it all together, find and put it all together,

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Speaker 1: and then actually hunt those elk that I'd found. It

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Speaker 1: seems to work better. So I kind of agree with you, Jason.

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Speaker 1: But I know some people, you know, just scheduling and

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Speaker 1: maybe it's really hard to get ten consecutive days off,

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Speaker 1: you know, with work schedules and stuff. I can understand that, so,

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Speaker 1: you know, I take advantage of any time off you can.

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Speaker 1: But or maybe you know it's an area you haven't

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Speaker 1: really hunted before and you don't want to commit to

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Speaker 1: a ten day hunt, but this, you know, four day

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Speaker 1: hunts work better for you, you know, you know, three

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Speaker 1: four day hunts or whatever that might just so that

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Speaker 1: way you can hunt every every you know, stage of

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Speaker 1: that September rut and be like, Okay, well these a

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Speaker 1: rut during this week better than they do these other weeks,

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Speaker 1: and maybe next year I'll take my ten day ten

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Speaker 1: days off during this specific week that you found that

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Speaker 1: they seem to be rutting better or or maybe there's

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Speaker 1: less hunting pressure, depending on how you want to hunt it,

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Speaker 1: whether you're calling elk or spot in stock so, but

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Speaker 1: since it's North Idaho, you're probably going to be on

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Speaker 1: to call them rather than spot in stock. There's just

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Speaker 1: not a lot of spot in stock opportunities. I mean

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of country that's you know, it's private tip,

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Speaker 1: private timber country, company ground, also state lands that are

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Speaker 1: logged off, and man, some of these clearcuts are getting

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Speaker 1: savagely large, so you could potentially, you know, glass them

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Speaker 1: up and and make moves off that kind of like

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Speaker 1: what Jason alluded to. There's some big country where you

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Speaker 1: can glass you know, a mile or two away at elk,

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Speaker 1: cannot disturb them and start making plans. Oh, they're they're

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Speaker 1: feeding out in this big block of stuff that's cut

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Speaker 1: and then there's a there's a big block of timber

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Speaker 1: over there. They're going in there into there every morning.

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Speaker 1: So you can then maybe shift your your midday plan

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Speaker 1: to go hunt those elk once you've got them located

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Speaker 1: first thing in the morning. But uh my might go

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Speaker 1: to morning plan for for North Idaho or wherever is

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Speaker 1: cover country. Right, you know, I'm gonna I'm gonna check

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Speaker 1: as soon as I get out of the truck, I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna I'm gonna check for bugles. You know, it's crazy.

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Speaker 1: There's a lot of people who will get out of

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Speaker 1: their truck they'll throw their pack on there, they'll throw

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Speaker 1: their bow on their pack, and they'll just start hiking

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Speaker 1: a trail. You know, if you're a park to the

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Speaker 1: trailhead and there's fifteen pickups spark there and it doesn't

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Speaker 1: look like there's any gonna be any elk around close by,

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Speaker 1: you know, it would make sense to probably do that.

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Speaker 1: But sometimes by checking, like if you're the only one there,

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Speaker 1: I would definitely check you're as soon as you get

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Speaker 1: out of the truck and bugle, because sometimes you know

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Speaker 1: elk are not too far away from the road. And

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Speaker 1: then once you you try to check that low hanging fruit,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna hike out. Whether it's a trail, maybe it's

351
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Speaker 1: a ridge, maybe it's down off into some steep hell hole,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna hike down in there. And I typically, uh,

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Speaker 1: the key thing is hike down or whoever I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna stay high but looking for elk. They're probably

355
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Speaker 1: gonna be below me. So I'm gonna hike around and

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Speaker 1: try to try to find those elk from a high point.

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Speaker 1: And the reason is for me in the country, I hunt.

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Speaker 1: If you're down low, you're a lot of times you're

359
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Speaker 1: at the bottom of the mountain, you're a lot of

360
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Speaker 1: times you're in the bottom of a crick drainage and

361
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Speaker 1: there's a lot of noise from from the water. First off,

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Speaker 1: it's really hard to bugle up into these places without

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Speaker 1: contending with the noise from a creek running, and which

364
00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:09,919
Speaker 1: makes it really difficult to hear bugles distant bugles. And

365
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Speaker 1: also if you're trying to cover the same amount of country.

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Speaker 1: Let's say you're trying to cover a certain drainage, and

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Speaker 1: if you're trying to do it from the bottom side,

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Speaker 1: especially North Idaho, you're gonna have way more nooks and

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Speaker 1: crannies that you'll cover more miles walking from the traveling

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Speaker 1: the bottom end of a drainage versus running ridge tops.

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Speaker 1: There's just way more contours at the bottom, you know,

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Speaker 1: ins and outs and gullies and stuff that you're gonna

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Speaker 1: have to you're gonna have to walk through. And then

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Speaker 1: also the creek bottoms are always full of blowdowns, they

375
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Speaker 1: are always thicker, there's more vegetation just because there's more

376
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Speaker 1: water there, and it can be super difficult to navigate.

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Speaker 1: So I like to stay on top and a lot

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Speaker 1: of the North Idaho roads limb themselves to that kind

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Speaker 1: of hunting. Most of the roads, a lot of the

380
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Speaker 1: roads are on top. You know, there are roads in

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Speaker 1: the bottoms and stuff, but a lot of the roads

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Speaker 1: are on ridgetops, it seems like. So that's what I

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Speaker 1: would do for my morning. And then I'm just gonna hunt.

384
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Speaker 1: You know, I'm gonna I'm gonna cover country until I

385
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Speaker 1: can hear a bugle, and then I'll get the wind right,

386
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Speaker 1: I'll i'll, I'll dive in and and try to drop

387
00:20:17,840 --> 00:20:19,680
Speaker 1: down to their level and try to get get the

388
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Speaker 1: wind right, and then you know, set up for my

389
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Speaker 1: calling cereal, and then as far as midday goes there

390
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Speaker 1: again kind of like what Jason said, whatever the whatever

391
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Speaker 1: intel I've got from that morning will kind of dictate

392
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Speaker 1: how I hunt that afternoon. So maybe I didn't hear anything.

393
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Speaker 1: Maybe I walked out there where I thought I was

394
00:20:41,359 --> 00:20:43,720
Speaker 1: gonna hear stuff and I didn't hear a dang thing.

395
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Speaker 1: So I'll use that afternoon time to just cover country.

396
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Speaker 1: You know, I'm just walking, I'm walking, I'm bugling, and

397
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Speaker 1: I'm just checking every little pocket, every little drainage, every

398
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Speaker 1: little let's say, I'm on a great, big ridge system.

399
00:20:58,320 --> 00:21:00,639
Speaker 1: I may walk back and forth the top of the

400
00:21:00,720 --> 00:21:03,520
Speaker 1: ridge and bugle from one drainage and down into another drainage,

401
00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:08,160
Speaker 1: just kind of leaven every stone unturned. Now, let's say

402
00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:10,760
Speaker 1: I've I've found elk in the morning, and this happens

403
00:21:10,760 --> 00:21:12,960
Speaker 1: a lot. Let's say you hear distant bugles and they're

404
00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:19,359
Speaker 1: it's it's massively hard country to hunt, very steep, big

405
00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:23,520
Speaker 1: deep canyon and lots of you know, blowdowns and thick

406
00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:26,359
Speaker 1: trees and brush. It just takes a long time to

407
00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:28,879
Speaker 1: get there. So sometimes you locate them in the morning

408
00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:31,120
Speaker 1: and then you kind of figure out where they kind

409
00:21:31,119 --> 00:21:33,360
Speaker 1: of slow down and bed down. You hear their last bugles,

410
00:21:33,400 --> 00:21:36,760
Speaker 1: and they their bugles kind of get lazy sounding. It's like, okay,

411
00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:40,280
Speaker 1: those those elk are going to bed up on that

412
00:21:40,160 --> 00:21:42,600
Speaker 1: and that saddle or on that little bench or whatever.

413
00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:44,840
Speaker 1: So a lot of times I'll use that mid day

414
00:21:44,920 --> 00:21:47,920
Speaker 1: to navigate to that spot. It may take half the

415
00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:50,560
Speaker 1: day to hike into some of those places, just because

416
00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:53,800
Speaker 1: you know, as the crow flies are, you know, distance wise,

417
00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:59,000
Speaker 1: it's not that far. But I always say North Idaho

418
00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:02,320
Speaker 1: like three to five miles is like ten hiking ten

419
00:22:02,359 --> 00:22:05,440
Speaker 1: miles in Wyoming or Colorado. It's just it's so thick

420
00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:09,560
Speaker 1: and so difficult to traverse. So sometimes you spend most

421
00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:13,600
Speaker 1: of your midday just closing that gap in some of

422
00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:18,600
Speaker 1: those kind of places, or if or if the elk

423
00:22:18,640 --> 00:22:20,639
Speaker 1: are on your side of the mountains, like, Okay, I've

424
00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:25,240
Speaker 1: located the elk in the morning, I've because of wind

425
00:22:25,359 --> 00:22:27,400
Speaker 1: or whatever, I just didn't want to or maybe how

426
00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:29,479
Speaker 1: fast they were moving, I just didn't want to make

427
00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:31,360
Speaker 1: a move and try to set up on them as

428
00:22:31,359 --> 00:22:35,240
Speaker 1: they were moving that morning. Then I'll I'll you still

429
00:22:35,320 --> 00:22:37,560
Speaker 1: use that time to get close in the midday and

430
00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:42,439
Speaker 1: wait till those midday winds stabilize, and it you have

431
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:44,560
Speaker 1: to kind of sit because you can get kind of fooled.

432
00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:46,840
Speaker 1: What I do, My rule is like once the winds

433
00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:48,640
Speaker 1: kind of stabilize, what I do is I get as

434
00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:50,520
Speaker 1: close as I can where I can be safe from

435
00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:52,960
Speaker 1: the winds filling it up, and I'll sit down and

436
00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:56,280
Speaker 1: I'll kind of watch my clock for about thirty minutes,

437
00:22:56,320 --> 00:22:59,600
Speaker 1: and if the winds remain stable for about thirty minutes,

438
00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:02,119
Speaker 1: then at that point it's like, Okay, I think I

439
00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:04,280
Speaker 1: think we're good to make a move and try to

440
00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:08,639
Speaker 1: get in there, and so then strategically I'm gonna I'm

441
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:11,000
Speaker 1: gonna be very calculated and make sure I move in

442
00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:13,800
Speaker 1: when the winds are right. If the winds never do

443
00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:15,760
Speaker 1: get right, you know, some days are just like that,

444
00:23:16,119 --> 00:23:18,879
Speaker 1: you got winds swirling every witch away because you got

445
00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:22,720
Speaker 1: big puffy clouds overhead or whatever. Then some days I'll

446
00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:26,840
Speaker 1: just spend sitting there waiting until evening time to make

447
00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:31,000
Speaker 1: my move, and then the evening time it's It's the

448
00:23:31,040 --> 00:23:33,200
Speaker 1: same way if I've committed to a big, a big

449
00:23:33,280 --> 00:23:35,240
Speaker 1: day hike where I'm a long waist from the truck,

450
00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:40,560
Speaker 1: you know, I'll I'll continue to hunt till dark, and

451
00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:43,240
Speaker 1: then that's in the dark is when I start hiking out,

452
00:23:43,359 --> 00:23:46,040
Speaker 1: and you know, it may take a while, but usually

453
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:49,240
Speaker 1: I'm trying to hit my a trail or a way

454
00:23:49,280 --> 00:23:51,720
Speaker 1: to get back to the truck easily in the dark,

455
00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:54,400
Speaker 1: because sometimes at North Iidahoa it just is so brushy

456
00:23:54,800 --> 00:23:56,560
Speaker 1: it's hard to navigate in the in the dark with

457
00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:59,959
Speaker 1: a head lamp. A lot of trips and falls and stuff.

458
00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:05,600
Speaker 1: But there again, I'm continuing to search for bugles all

459
00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:07,240
Speaker 1: the way to dark, and then i head back to

460
00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:11,160
Speaker 1: the truck and head back to camp. I will most

461
00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:14,560
Speaker 1: of the time. I won't see camp in the daytime.

462
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:18,040
Speaker 1: I leave before the first light, and I get back

463
00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:21,640
Speaker 1: at nine ten o'clock at night, eat something, go to bed,

464
00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:25,000
Speaker 1: do it all again the next day. So that's that's

465
00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:27,119
Speaker 1: how I do it. Do you have anything else to.

466
00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:29,800
Speaker 2: Add, Jason, No, I think we covered that one. That one,

467
00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:32,040
Speaker 2: like you said, it could have made its own podcast probably.

468
00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:35,639
Speaker 1: I mean, we could really dive deep more into those things,

469
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:37,600
Speaker 1: like if you want to get real specific, but that

470
00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:41,840
Speaker 1: was kind of the broad brush answer there. So all right,

471
00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:46,800
Speaker 1: Jason keeps getting notified. I don't know if his TikTok

472
00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:49,880
Speaker 1: is going viral or what, but he's getting notifications.

473
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:52,840
Speaker 2: I am. I apologize, but hopefully you guys can't hear that.

474
00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:54,520
Speaker 2: But I'm trying to figure out how to silence system.

475
00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:11,600
Speaker 5: Hey, dirt David Mercato at yom in here, I got

476
00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:16,199
Speaker 5: a question for you, l Country related. So in my

477
00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:20,399
Speaker 5: system or part of my strategy trying to kill a

478
00:25:20,440 --> 00:25:23,760
Speaker 5: big herd bowl is I like to try and hunt

479
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:29,560
Speaker 5: them herd bulls before they get hearted up and establish

480
00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:33,679
Speaker 5: their hair with cows. And I don't hear a lot

481
00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:37,439
Speaker 5: of guys talk about that about, you know, trying to

482
00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:42,440
Speaker 5: find that bowl in that small little window when he's

483
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:44,680
Speaker 5: by himself kind of roaming around.

484
00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:47,440
Speaker 6: You know, you don't have to deal with all the cows.

485
00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:50,560
Speaker 6: Sometimes they come in. You can actually call those bulls in.

486
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:56,680
Speaker 6: But what I keep constantly finding myself if I've done

487
00:25:56,720 --> 00:25:59,160
Speaker 6: it before, but it seems like it's just such a

488
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:04,240
Speaker 6: small percentage of strategy and more of luck. And I'm

489
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:06,919
Speaker 6: kind of wondering what your thought is about that, and

490
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:10,480
Speaker 6: if you have a strategy in the ways you do that,

491
00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:16,280
Speaker 6: or is it something also that a lot of these

492
00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:24,280
Speaker 6: bulls are they going from bachelor group straight into a

493
00:26:24,320 --> 00:26:27,800
Speaker 6: herd of cows? Do they not even go solo? You know,

494
00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:32,680
Speaker 6: because it seems like it seems like such a small

495
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:35,000
Speaker 6: window you maybe have like a day or two, But

496
00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:38,480
Speaker 6: it seems like with me every time I swear, sometimes

497
00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:40,560
Speaker 6: I'm like, I think I'm out early enough, and I

498
00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:42,600
Speaker 6: find them big bulls and they're already heard it up.

499
00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:44,959
Speaker 5: I'm like, man, I didn't think they heard it up already.

500
00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:47,920
Speaker 6: Them big bulls have already got cows and it's September ninth,

501
00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:49,960
Speaker 6: you know. So another one of my.

502
00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:52,800
Speaker 4: Questions is what dates do you.

503
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:57,760
Speaker 6: Think are the best to find herd bulls solo before

504
00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:01,639
Speaker 6: they got cows. If you could just kind of, you know,

505
00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:04,600
Speaker 6: go over that a little bit, talk about it a

506
00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:07,959
Speaker 6: little bit, what your experience with that is.

507
00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:11,840
Speaker 5: I really appreciate it. All right, man, keep doing your thing, man.

508
00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:17,840
Speaker 2: But okay, so strategy on early season bowls. I'm gonna

509
00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:19,760
Speaker 2: I know what I know and what I cut my

510
00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:21,719
Speaker 2: teeth on, and what I've spent the most time watching.

511
00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:24,399
Speaker 2: Elk is in my back door. You know. So this

512
00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:27,400
Speaker 2: is Roosevelt, but I'm gonna I've talked to a lot

513
00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:30,240
Speaker 2: of people and there's some similarities. So he had mentioned

514
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:33,200
Speaker 2: maybe being surprise September ninth that they were already heard

515
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:36,320
Speaker 2: it up, which doesn't surprise me. Like around home, you'll

516
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:40,840
Speaker 2: watch by about August twenty fifth ish, you'll start to

517
00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:43,640
Speaker 2: have bulls biggling. You'll start to have bulls with the herd.

518
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:47,840
Speaker 2: But typically happens is the smaller, smaller, more immature bulls

519
00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:50,200
Speaker 2: will round up the herd and run with them, and

520
00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:53,800
Speaker 2: then they will get replaced by the more mature bulls,

521
00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:56,320
Speaker 2: and then ultimately it's like the pecking order from the

522
00:27:56,320 --> 00:27:59,159
Speaker 2: bottom up. You'll have small bulls with the herd biegl

523
00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:01,679
Speaker 2: in pretending like that thing, and then they'll get maybe

524
00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 2: a semi mature bowl, and then you'll ultimately get the

525
00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:06,280
Speaker 2: big bowl that comes in at the end. The weill

526
00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:09,080
Speaker 2: ultimately ends up being the herd Bowl throughout throughout the

527
00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:11,199
Speaker 2: season will end up being that herd Bowl. So it's

528
00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 2: almost like a reverse pecking order. August twenty fifth, you'll

529
00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:15,440
Speaker 2: start to hear these bulls.

530
00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:15,640
Speaker 6: Bh a goal.

531
00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:19,399
Speaker 2: They'll start to split up and not be friends anywhere.

532
00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:21,960
Speaker 2: From August fifteenth to twenty fifth, you'll start to get

533
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:25,440
Speaker 2: these bulls that are are you know, splitting off there.

534
00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:27,719
Speaker 2: They're no longer buddies. They went from being best friends

535
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 2: for the last you know, all summer long since they

536
00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:32,920
Speaker 2: bouchered up after last year's rep. Potentially, you know a

537
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:35,119
Speaker 2: lot of the big big bulls will go solo for

538
00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:37,760
Speaker 2: a while and then they'll join back up, you know,

539
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:40,440
Speaker 2: as they start to put velvet on and and you

540
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:43,600
Speaker 2: know April May, they'll become buddies, and they'll be buddies

541
00:28:43,600 --> 00:28:47,160
Speaker 2: all summer and then they become you know, their their rivals.

542
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 2: From from about August fifteenth on, they'll start to establish

543
00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:55,600
Speaker 2: that pecking order, so we I honestly don't have a

544
00:28:55,680 --> 00:29:01,120
Speaker 2: lot of hunting experience hunting them in that time where

545
00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:03,680
Speaker 2: they're not with the herd or at least thinking about

546
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:07,160
Speaker 2: being with the herd, you know, most of the seasons.

547
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:09,680
Speaker 2: Utah has a very early opener. I think Nevada has

548
00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:12,479
Speaker 2: a couple of early openers. I don't even know when

549
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:15,640
Speaker 2: they can start hunting in Wyoming, isn't it typically September first?

550
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:19,600
Speaker 2: So yeah, which you may like the very first five

551
00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 2: days of September may be able to find that big

552
00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:24,640
Speaker 2: bull off the herd. And typically what he will do

553
00:29:24,720 --> 00:29:27,840
Speaker 2: is he'll come in and check during the the you know,

554
00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:30,800
Speaker 2: at night, check on the cows, and then he'll typically

555
00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:32,560
Speaker 2: leave in the morning. So he may not hang with

556
00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:36,160
Speaker 2: that herd until some of these cows start coming you

557
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:38,960
Speaker 2: know into Estris uh, and then he'll start to hang

558
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:43,760
Speaker 2: with that herd full time. But I do know when

559
00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:48,720
Speaker 2: it comes to I'm still gonna describe strategy when when

560
00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:52,320
Speaker 2: those bulls are solo or staging off is it comes

561
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:54,760
Speaker 2: down to just the pattern you have to pattern those elk.

562
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:59,080
Speaker 2: You can use cow calls, you can use you know,

563
00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:02,560
Speaker 2: calling to your advantag in that late August timeframe. But

564
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:05,840
Speaker 2: you know, talking with Ryan Carter and some of the

565
00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:08,120
Speaker 2: guys that you know, I've got to got to know

566
00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:13,280
Speaker 2: and talk about, you know, these this early season l

567
00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:18,160
Speaker 2: hunting almost pre rut even sooner than that, is you

568
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:20,080
Speaker 2: got a pattern these these big bulls. When I used

569
00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:21,920
Speaker 2: to go out in Washington and just scout, you know,

570
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:24,120
Speaker 2: you could almost you know, some of these bulls, you

571
00:30:24,120 --> 00:30:25,640
Speaker 2: could set your watch to them where they were going

572
00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:27,160
Speaker 2: to be, what clear cut they were going to feed,

573
00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:28,640
Speaker 2: and what patch of timber they were going to go

574
00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:30,840
Speaker 2: bed in. So you know, what I've seen, what I've

575
00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:32,719
Speaker 2: heard of people that actually get to hunt them is

576
00:30:32,960 --> 00:30:34,600
Speaker 2: you need to kill them early. You need to kill

577
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:36,479
Speaker 2: them why they're patternable, and you need to kill him

578
00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 2: before pressure from these hunting seasons starts to move them.

579
00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:43,640
Speaker 2: So that's the best answer I got. I would say,

580
00:30:43,760 --> 00:30:47,160
Speaker 2: unless you're able to hunt somewhere from or excuse me,

581
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:51,200
Speaker 2: August twenty fifth, about that September second or third range,

582
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:53,520
Speaker 2: you're probably not going to catch these big bulls that

583
00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:58,720
Speaker 2: you're talking about by themselves for too long. At some point,

584
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:01,160
Speaker 2: you know, after that, as soon as that first Estra

585
00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:03,880
Speaker 2: cow comes into estrous. He's gonna now join the herd

586
00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:06,560
Speaker 2: and hang out. So that's that's what I got for

587
00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:10,360
Speaker 2: you on those those early season tactics prior to those

588
00:31:10,400 --> 00:31:11,200
Speaker 2: bulls hurding up.

589
00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:17,680
Speaker 1: So for me, every year the rut seems to be

590
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:23,560
Speaker 1: a little different. So year to year can sometimes be

591
00:31:23,680 --> 00:31:27,600
Speaker 1: not very consistent on what I'm finding. So one year,

592
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:33,000
Speaker 1: on the season opener in Idaho, let's say it's August thirtieth,

593
00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:40,080
Speaker 1: and I may not have bowls with cows until the tenth.

594
00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:45,000
Speaker 1: Other years on August thirtieth there'll be a herd bowl

595
00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:48,760
Speaker 1: running cows on the thirtieth. You know, it's just it's weird.

596
00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:53,200
Speaker 1: I think there's you know, rut cycles are different every year.

597
00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:57,840
Speaker 1: Some years or tens and some years are twos. At

598
00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:03,520
Speaker 1: least been my experience. So with that in mind, some

599
00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:07,400
Speaker 1: of the things I've noticed, like I feel like once

600
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:10,840
Speaker 1: those bulls kind of separate their bachelor groups, they they

601
00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:14,400
Speaker 1: shed their velvet, they kind of move away from each other.

602
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:15,960
Speaker 1: Then they go to these little places I kind of

603
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:19,920
Speaker 1: like to call them a little like a bowl bedroom

604
00:32:20,040 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 1: or a little Heidi hole or something. They'll kind of

605
00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:25,120
Speaker 1: go be by themselves and they'll kind of space out

606
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:27,800
Speaker 1: from each other, and maybe they'll probably sometimes they'll stand

607
00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:30,760
Speaker 1: in the same drainage. Sometimes they just completely move out

608
00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:34,080
Speaker 1: of the country, just depending on where those cows are living.

609
00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:38,120
Speaker 1: So if you can kind of identify where those cows

610
00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:41,000
Speaker 1: are living, then those bulls are probably going to stage

611
00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:44,560
Speaker 1: up pretty close, but maybe not with them, so they'll

612
00:32:44,560 --> 00:32:48,560
Speaker 1: be close enough to where when things start happening, they'll

613
00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:53,120
Speaker 1: start smelling the smells, but they're not actively living day

614
00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:56,080
Speaker 1: to day with the cows. They're still in those little

615
00:32:56,080 --> 00:33:00,520
Speaker 1: bull bedrooms. And you'll find those places. You'll have like

616
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:03,160
Speaker 1: a drainage with all these little finger ridges in them,

617
00:33:03,200 --> 00:33:05,920
Speaker 1: and like almost every if there's a lot of elk there,

618
00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:07,959
Speaker 1: almost every little finger ridge, you'll have a bowl on

619
00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:11,960
Speaker 1: that on that ridge, and he'll have a little like

620
00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:15,120
Speaker 1: a little flat spot or a little bench or somewhere

621
00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:18,240
Speaker 1: where he can feel safe, and you'll find a little

622
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:21,120
Speaker 1: bedding area there, typically be on like a north face

623
00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:23,560
Speaker 1: where then you'll find them where they've been they've been

624
00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:27,040
Speaker 1: rubbing their horns in there. You'll see rubs that from

625
00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 1: mid to late August all the way up until like

626
00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:33,320
Speaker 1: the first week of September there and then once it

627
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:35,600
Speaker 1: was cows start coming in heat, they'll disappear from those

628
00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:38,040
Speaker 1: places and go go be with the cows. But if

629
00:33:38,040 --> 00:33:41,880
Speaker 1: you can find that, if you can find those elk,

630
00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 1: you know, I would hunt the opener through the very

631
00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:47,600
Speaker 1: you know opener season. If did he say it was

632
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 1: from Wyoming, I can't remember, Yeah, So I'd hunt the

633
00:33:50,280 --> 00:33:53,240
Speaker 1: Wyoming opener that I take that first ten days. And

634
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:56,200
Speaker 1: you know, year to year may be different on what

635
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:58,640
Speaker 1: you're going to find as far as behavior and where

636
00:33:58,640 --> 00:34:04,000
Speaker 1: the elk are at and how they are receptive to calling.

637
00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:09,120
Speaker 1: But early I found and I've hunted Wyoming early several times.

638
00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:13,319
Speaker 1: And if bulls will bugle sometimes bugles. Sometimes you can't

639
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:16,120
Speaker 1: hardly get a bold of bugle on that early first

640
00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:19,160
Speaker 1: part of the season. Sometimes they they can, but if

641
00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:20,640
Speaker 1: you can get them to bugle and you can get

642
00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:24,319
Speaker 1: in their little on their little their little Heidi hole there,

643
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:26,320
Speaker 1: if you can kind of get in there, bulls a

644
00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:28,040
Speaker 1: lot of times will come and they'll be defensive of

645
00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:33,520
Speaker 1: that spot, and some of the bugling all here in

646
00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:37,360
Speaker 1: that period of time won't be super aggressive bugles. They'll

647
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:40,920
Speaker 1: be more they'll they'll they'll bugle, but you won't hear

648
00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:45,480
Speaker 1: them give you that really nasty, mean bugle like you'd

649
00:34:45,480 --> 00:34:47,000
Speaker 1: get later in the month when they have cow's, like

650
00:34:47,080 --> 00:34:49,719
Speaker 1: I'm gonna come kill you type of bugle, don't. I

651
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:52,319
Speaker 1: don't think they bugle as much like that, though it

652
00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:54,719
Speaker 1: is a possibility. I mean, you never say never when

653
00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:57,920
Speaker 1: you're calling oak, but a lot of times will come

654
00:34:57,960 --> 00:35:00,920
Speaker 1: out of curiosity, like who the heck is this trying

655
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:03,920
Speaker 1: to come into my spot here? This is my spot.

656
00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:06,359
Speaker 1: I want you to leave, and they'll want to come

657
00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:09,000
Speaker 1: push you out of that. So that's worked really well

658
00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:14,400
Speaker 1: for me, But I find in those places is pretty critical.

659
00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:17,399
Speaker 1: And how to do that you just got to It's

660
00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:21,520
Speaker 1: covering tons of country, right, and you know where that

661
00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:25,640
Speaker 1: maybe the cows are, So probably the ridges in the

662
00:35:25,719 --> 00:35:29,280
Speaker 1: mountains above them or very close by are probably gonna

663
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:36,080
Speaker 1: be where those bulls are at. And I've found and this,

664
00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:39,080
Speaker 1: like I said, this isn't always always the case, but

665
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:42,320
Speaker 1: I found more often than not, balls in that early season,

666
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:47,000
Speaker 1: that opening opening week are more receptive to bugles than

667
00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:50,799
Speaker 1: the cow calls. I'm testing both, right, I'm gonna get

668
00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:52,719
Speaker 1: put out caw calls, I'm gonna put out bugles, But

669
00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:54,960
Speaker 1: a lot of times the replies I'm getting are to

670
00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:57,840
Speaker 1: the bugles. So once I kind of find that they're

671
00:35:58,320 --> 00:36:01,719
Speaker 1: only applying to bugle, I kind of cut cut the

672
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:04,239
Speaker 1: cow calls way back. I might still throw out one

673
00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:07,239
Speaker 1: or two here and there, but I'm gonna keep giving

674
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:09,960
Speaker 1: him what he really likes. And and I think it's

675
00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:11,719
Speaker 1: still you know, I think you're in that tail end

676
00:36:11,719 --> 00:36:15,719
Speaker 1: of that pecking order period where they're still you know, like, hey,

677
00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:18,960
Speaker 1: you know I I don't want you in my spot

678
00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:22,879
Speaker 1: or I'm the toughest guy around or whatever. I think

679
00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:27,399
Speaker 1: they're still you know, assuring or continue with that that

680
00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:29,640
Speaker 1: who's the most dominant BWL around. So if you can

681
00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:33,879
Speaker 1: get get close into those little areas and and get

682
00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:36,120
Speaker 1: them fooled into coming in, you know, you know, get

683
00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:38,440
Speaker 1: them get them worked up. I don't I don't typically

684
00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:41,520
Speaker 1: go at him hard out and typically just start cutting

685
00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:43,640
Speaker 1: them off and stuff. I just let things kind of

686
00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:46,239
Speaker 1: build slowly. When I start bugling too a bull in

687
00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:49,799
Speaker 1: those situations, I kind of match his intensity and then

688
00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:52,000
Speaker 1: I kind of let him escalate little by little, and

689
00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:54,080
Speaker 1: then pretty soon he gets wound up enough to where

690
00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:56,200
Speaker 1: here he comes. But you got to be close to

691
00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:59,600
Speaker 1: you can't. You typically can't get him to bugle and

692
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:02,279
Speaker 1: come in and Claire crossed the canyon. In those situations,

693
00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:05,200
Speaker 1: it's it's like you have to be right on his

694
00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:07,920
Speaker 1: little ridge, right on his little little Heidi hole, you know,

695
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:10,720
Speaker 1: within one hundred and two hundred yards of him, because

696
00:37:10,719 --> 00:37:14,280
Speaker 1: he wants to be defensive of that space. So that

697
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:17,040
Speaker 1: that's my my recommendations. I'd go early the first week

698
00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:20,000
Speaker 1: of season, and some years it'll be like, Wow, this

699
00:37:20,200 --> 00:37:22,439
Speaker 1: was great at work, like a charm, and the next

700
00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:25,520
Speaker 1: year you're like, these zelk aren't here. They've they've already

701
00:37:25,560 --> 00:37:28,600
Speaker 1: moved off and they've they've got cows, and then you're

702
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:30,000
Speaker 1: just gonna have to hunt them like that too, and

703
00:37:31,360 --> 00:37:35,120
Speaker 1: herd bulls again. If they got cows, I'm gonna try

704
00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:37,200
Speaker 1: to try to call them out of the bedding area.

705
00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:40,960
Speaker 1: That's usually the best best time they're done running for

706
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:43,000
Speaker 1: the day. They got those cows in a safe place.

707
00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:46,200
Speaker 1: Now they're gonna be very defensive of that spot. And

708
00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:48,520
Speaker 1: you get close and start start calling to them and

709
00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:50,880
Speaker 1: start start challenging them, they're gonna want to come out

710
00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:53,000
Speaker 1: of there and push you out to keep you from

711
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:58,239
Speaker 1: taking their cows. So that's my that's my take on it,

712
00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:02,040
Speaker 1: all right. Question number three, Hey Derek, this.

713
00:38:02,120 --> 00:38:05,440
Speaker 7: Is Andy Reimer out of South Dakota. I got a

714
00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 7: hunt planned in Montana this September, and I'm going middle

715
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:17,000
Speaker 7: of September, but kind of at a conflict because the

716
00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:20,640
Speaker 7: middle of the hunt that I have planned is a

717
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:24,200
Speaker 7: there's a full moon in the dead center of the

718
00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:27,279
Speaker 7: un I have planned. So I don't know how much

719
00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:32,279
Speaker 7: do you take into effect with that? And also on

720
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:38,719
Speaker 7: calling for yourself, how much when if you're bugling with

721
00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 7: a back and forth with a bull, is it a

722
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:45,840
Speaker 7: good idea to stay put or should you move a

723
00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:48,120
Speaker 7: little bit once the boat moves in a close a

724
00:38:48,200 --> 00:38:51,600
Speaker 7: little bit closer and tries a pinion on your location,

725
00:38:53,600 --> 00:38:55,480
Speaker 7: that should be it. Appreciate it.

726
00:38:55,719 --> 00:39:00,880
Speaker 2: Thanks full moon how much. I don't don't put much

727
00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:08,200
Speaker 2: much thought into that full moon. It's it does it

728
00:39:08,239 --> 00:39:12,319
Speaker 2: does have an effect. I will say, when you're on

729
00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:17,799
Speaker 2: those hunts, that full moon will will affect the hunt,

730
00:39:17,880 --> 00:39:21,680
Speaker 2: maybe affect what what looks like the intensity of the rut.

731
00:39:21,719 --> 00:39:24,239
Speaker 2: They will do more of that rutting, you know, late

732
00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:27,200
Speaker 2: at night, early in the morning. But as far as

733
00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:30,799
Speaker 2: planning your hunt, like I would pick a hunt, a

734
00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:33,560
Speaker 2: hunt with a full moon in the peak of the rut,

735
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:35,879
Speaker 2: so I can experience that or be involved in that then,

736
00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:39,759
Speaker 2: you know, similar to question number two, be you know

737
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:42,040
Speaker 2: way early in the season or way way late in

738
00:39:42,080 --> 00:39:44,520
Speaker 2: the season with without a full moon. I now, if

739
00:39:44,520 --> 00:39:46,279
Speaker 2: I had my preference, I would try to pick peak

740
00:39:46,280 --> 00:39:49,399
Speaker 2: of the rut on on the backside of a new moon.

741
00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:52,160
Speaker 2: But uh, you know you can't pick and choose. There's

742
00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:54,919
Speaker 2: only so many days in September. You know, I've got

743
00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:58,080
Speaker 2: the fortune, you know, there to be out there the

744
00:39:58,120 --> 00:40:01,360
Speaker 2: majority of September. But I I wouldn't put too much,

745
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:05,640
Speaker 2: too much weight in the moon. I actually went back.

746
00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:08,320
Speaker 2: This is every reason I think I'm a huge nerd.

747
00:40:08,719 --> 00:40:11,520
Speaker 2: I'd went back. I think it was twenty seventeen or eighteen.

748
00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:13,680
Speaker 2: I had tallied up like all the bulls I had

749
00:40:13,760 --> 00:40:15,840
Speaker 2: killed her and went back and found all my tags

750
00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:18,880
Speaker 2: and looked at it, and I'm like, dang, you've killed

751
00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:21,279
Speaker 2: like I think it was like seventy five percent of

752
00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:23,480
Speaker 2: my bulls, like within three days of the full moon

753
00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:25,879
Speaker 2: on the front side of it. So it's like, well,

754
00:40:26,239 --> 00:40:28,960
Speaker 2: either it's a coincidence, you got really really lucky or

755
00:40:29,040 --> 00:40:31,640
Speaker 2: it just doesn't matter, And so I went and looked

756
00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:33,800
Speaker 2: at that. We also had did it my buddy Trevor

757
00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:36,040
Speaker 2: that you know I used to hunt with the ten

758
00:40:36,080 --> 00:40:39,000
Speaker 2: twelve years ago, like in the early Angry Mountain days

759
00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:42,640
Speaker 2: or the primetime outdoors days. He actually did it on

760
00:40:42,719 --> 00:40:46,880
Speaker 2: trail cameras and there wasn't even that huge of a difference.

761
00:40:46,920 --> 00:40:48,520
Speaker 2: We did it on three or four trail cameras, put

762
00:40:48,520 --> 00:40:50,920
Speaker 2: it in a big Excel spreadsheet and tried to like,

763
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:54,960
Speaker 2: look at you know, or they showing earlier later. I

764
00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:56,920
Speaker 2: think we did see that there was a little bit

765
00:40:56,960 --> 00:40:59,600
Speaker 2: of a shift later in the day on full moon,

766
00:40:59,680 --> 00:41:02,480
Speaker 2: but for the most part, during the rut and pre rut,

767
00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:05,799
Speaker 2: the full moon didn't really seem to affect anything that much.

768
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:09,319
Speaker 2: So that's always been my take on the full moon. Yes,

769
00:41:09,400 --> 00:41:11,439
Speaker 2: it will have an effect, Yes, the rut may seem

770
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:15,440
Speaker 2: to be a little less intense. Everything else, you know, considered,

771
00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:17,200
Speaker 2: But that's my take on that.

772
00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:21,280
Speaker 1: And do you have any advice on hunting by yourself

773
00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:23,160
Speaker 1: and how you would approach calling there.

774
00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:26,799
Speaker 2: So, you know, listeners of the podcast or anybody that's

775
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:29,680
Speaker 2: heard me talk. I think the first bowl I've ever

776
00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:32,560
Speaker 2: had anybody call in for me? And killed was twenty

777
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:35,080
Speaker 2: twenty one. We were in New Mexico? Was it twenty

778
00:41:35,080 --> 00:41:35,720
Speaker 2: one twenty?

779
00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:37,920
Speaker 1: That was twenty twenty twenty.

780
00:41:37,680 --> 00:41:39,720
Speaker 2: Twenty Dirk called the bowl in from me, New Mexico

781
00:41:39,719 --> 00:41:41,319
Speaker 2: and that was my first bowl to date. Prior to that,

782
00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:46,440
Speaker 2: I did everything solo. I call just like I do

783
00:41:46,680 --> 00:41:49,040
Speaker 2: whether it's a guy with me. Now there's a guy

784
00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:50,960
Speaker 2: with me, I will set back ten to fifteen yards

785
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:53,080
Speaker 2: just to kind of keep eyes maybe off of that location.

786
00:41:53,280 --> 00:41:57,840
Speaker 2: But as we get things worked up, as we're calling ELK,

787
00:41:59,120 --> 00:42:02,799
Speaker 2: I just you know, run as the caller. One thing

788
00:42:02,800 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 2: I do like about being a solo caller is we

789
00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:07,879
Speaker 2: talk about getting close and being a threat, and when

790
00:42:07,920 --> 00:42:10,000
Speaker 2: we talk about who the caller is, if you have

791
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:11,920
Speaker 2: a buddy that's twenty yards back, he's not as much

792
00:42:11,960 --> 00:42:14,520
Speaker 2: a threat as I am being twenty yards forward. But

793
00:42:14,600 --> 00:42:16,359
Speaker 2: you also have to give up your location a little

794
00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:19,520
Speaker 2: bit more by making audible noises from it. But I've

795
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:22,560
Speaker 2: always found get tight aggressive is the terrain and vegetation

796
00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:25,279
Speaker 2: will allow me. And I just called just like I

797
00:42:25,320 --> 00:42:28,759
Speaker 2: would whether I was calling for somebody else or you know.

798
00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:30,360
Speaker 2: And then one thing that I like to do. We

799
00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:33,120
Speaker 2: talk about using the wind as the steering wheel to

800
00:42:33,200 --> 00:42:35,040
Speaker 2: make sure I get a decent shot. You know, everybody

801
00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:37,160
Speaker 2: wants to set up with the wind perfectly on their nose,

802
00:42:37,520 --> 00:42:39,480
Speaker 2: and I would rather the wind hit me a little bit,

803
00:42:39,640 --> 00:42:41,919
Speaker 2: you know, even up to ninety degrees on the cheek.

804
00:42:41,920 --> 00:42:43,319
Speaker 2: You know, if it's hitting me in my right ear

805
00:42:43,719 --> 00:42:45,839
Speaker 2: or off my right cheek, that gives me a little

806
00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:48,239
Speaker 2: predictability that I will have a shot somewhere to my

807
00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:50,920
Speaker 2: left of that area that the bull's coming into. Because

808
00:42:51,719 --> 00:42:54,160
Speaker 2: bulls that we call in will typically start to circle

809
00:42:54,239 --> 00:42:56,839
Speaker 2: to get wind on the elk that's calling them to them,

810
00:42:56,920 --> 00:42:59,600
Speaker 2: especially if they can't make a visual confirmation or see

811
00:42:59,640 --> 00:43:03,920
Speaker 2: the elks position. So I will as a solo caller,

812
00:43:04,239 --> 00:43:05,960
Speaker 2: I want to give them the wind a little bit.

813
00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:08,160
Speaker 2: When I say give them the wind, like very very conservative,

814
00:43:08,160 --> 00:43:09,560
Speaker 2: They're not actually going to get the wind, but I'm

815
00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:12,200
Speaker 2: going to give them, you know, ninety degrees of wind

816
00:43:12,320 --> 00:43:14,360
Speaker 2: or forty five degrees of win somewhere in there, and

817
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:16,319
Speaker 2: that will give me a little more predictability on where

818
00:43:16,360 --> 00:43:18,880
Speaker 2: my shot lanes are most likely going to be based

819
00:43:18,920 --> 00:43:22,040
Speaker 2: on the direction the bull's currently coming in from. So yeah,

820
00:43:22,040 --> 00:43:25,480
Speaker 2: I don't. I don't change anything on my calling. You know,

821
00:43:25,520 --> 00:43:27,000
Speaker 2: there's a little bit more to do. You got a

822
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:29,239
Speaker 2: bugle tube to deal with if you are bugling, you know,

823
00:43:29,280 --> 00:43:31,080
Speaker 2: you have to do something with that bugle tube, you know,

824
00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:33,480
Speaker 2: to stick it between your legs, set it down the

825
00:43:33,520 --> 00:43:37,319
Speaker 2: movement it may take. But aside from that, being able

826
00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:40,280
Speaker 2: to run a diaphragm really well, if if you can't,

827
00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:42,880
Speaker 2: may make being a solo caller a little more difficult

828
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:45,040
Speaker 2: as you have to go back and forth with calls

829
00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:47,080
Speaker 2: in your hand, or you know, if you're using something

830
00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:49,400
Speaker 2: like the easy sucker, would give you the ability to

831
00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:52,320
Speaker 2: be hands free and have the ability to make calls.

832
00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:55,160
Speaker 2: But now I don't. I don't know if I answered

833
00:43:55,160 --> 00:43:57,720
Speaker 2: the question correctly. But as far as like guidance on calling,

834
00:43:58,400 --> 00:43:59,920
Speaker 2: you know, kind of the same system we always run.

835
00:43:59,960 --> 00:44:01,879
Speaker 2: You take the temperature of the bull, try to work

836
00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:03,880
Speaker 2: them up. If you can't, you try to use like

837
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:06,880
Speaker 2: the what I would say, like the least aggressive route.

838
00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:08,600
Speaker 2: You know, so you start with cow calls, start with,

839
00:44:08,960 --> 00:44:11,440
Speaker 2: you know, and then you know, escalate to bugles and

840
00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:14,239
Speaker 2: let that bull kind of tell us how we're gonna call.

841
00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:17,320
Speaker 2: But solo is no different than a partner.

842
00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:17,560
Speaker 3: There.

843
00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:23,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, I kind of subscribe to the same concept. I

844
00:44:23,840 --> 00:44:27,480
Speaker 1: do a lot of trickery when I'm when I'm hunting solo,

845
00:44:28,600 --> 00:44:32,440
Speaker 1: as in all bugle, and as soon as I bugle,

846
00:44:32,600 --> 00:44:36,040
Speaker 1: I move up twenty thirty yards forty yards whatever makes sense.

847
00:44:37,280 --> 00:44:41,520
Speaker 1: So I'm I'm constantly like moving that way. If a

848
00:44:41,520 --> 00:44:43,719
Speaker 1: bull hears me, they'll they'll pinpoint. It's like they have

849
00:44:43,760 --> 00:44:45,919
Speaker 1: on X maps in their ears in their brain. Right

850
00:44:46,480 --> 00:44:49,239
Speaker 1: then they can locate like right where you're standing, kind

851
00:44:49,239 --> 00:44:52,360
Speaker 1: of like a turkey. They can really pinpoint within feet

852
00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:55,080
Speaker 1: of where you're standing. So if I can if the

853
00:44:55,080 --> 00:44:57,080
Speaker 1: bull hasn't come in all the way, if he's not

854
00:44:57,080 --> 00:45:00,160
Speaker 1: committed to coming in yet, if he's still on his way,

855
00:45:00,400 --> 00:45:03,960
Speaker 1: then I'll bugle, and then I'll move up thirty forty

856
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:06,000
Speaker 1: fifty yards, and then I'll be quiet for a little

857
00:45:06,040 --> 00:45:10,000
Speaker 1: bit and kind of see assess where he's at. Sometimes

858
00:45:10,120 --> 00:45:13,680
Speaker 1: I'll take my bugle tube and I'll point it directly

859
00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:17,440
Speaker 1: behind me or off to my right or left, whichever

860
00:45:17,520 --> 00:45:19,879
Speaker 1: way I want that bowl maybe to come. Like if

861
00:45:19,880 --> 00:45:23,160
Speaker 1: I want him to come pass me on my left

862
00:45:23,239 --> 00:45:25,880
Speaker 1: or right a little bit, I might point it behind

863
00:45:25,880 --> 00:45:27,440
Speaker 1: me and then up to their left or right, just

864
00:45:27,520 --> 00:45:31,160
Speaker 1: I'm trying to throw my voice. It's almost like it's

865
00:45:31,160 --> 00:45:34,319
Speaker 1: almost like a little bit of trickery, and and it

866
00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:37,880
Speaker 1: does work. I've had that happen several times where you

867
00:45:38,320 --> 00:45:41,799
Speaker 1: bugle the opposite direction and kind of project your your

868
00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:44,839
Speaker 1: calls over in a different area and the sound will

869
00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:48,040
Speaker 1: kind of bounce off trees, vegetation, rocks or whatever, and

870
00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:51,520
Speaker 1: it'll be a little harder to pinpoint your exact location.

871
00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:56,800
Speaker 1: Although so sometimes I'll even I'll even cover my bugle

872
00:45:56,800 --> 00:45:59,520
Speaker 1: tube with my hand, especially if I have a glove on.

873
00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:02,160
Speaker 1: I'll cover into my tube with my hand and I'll

874
00:46:02,239 --> 00:46:05,000
Speaker 1: allow enough air to come escape, so I can make

875
00:46:05,040 --> 00:46:07,680
Speaker 1: a bugle, but it's going to be very muffled. And

876
00:46:07,719 --> 00:46:09,400
Speaker 1: you can make a full bugle. You just have to

877
00:46:09,480 --> 00:46:11,840
Speaker 1: change your air pressure a little bit. You'll have to

878
00:46:11,880 --> 00:46:13,759
Speaker 1: practice this in the off season so you kind of

879
00:46:13,760 --> 00:46:16,200
Speaker 1: know how hard to blow. But you can do a

880
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:21,200
Speaker 1: full bugle. Grunts, everything, anything you want to do into

881
00:46:21,239 --> 00:46:23,840
Speaker 1: that bugle, and I'll point it away from me and

882
00:46:23,880 --> 00:46:26,399
Speaker 1: I'll do it with the tube covered a little bit,

883
00:46:27,080 --> 00:46:30,000
Speaker 1: and it'll give the illusion that I'm further away. They

884
00:46:30,000 --> 00:46:31,880
Speaker 1: may think I'm another one hundred yards behind me, and

885
00:46:31,880 --> 00:46:36,200
Speaker 1: I've had that workout really well before too. Also, sometimes

886
00:46:36,239 --> 00:46:38,920
Speaker 1: I'll even same thing if I have especially if I

887
00:46:38,920 --> 00:46:41,400
Speaker 1: have a glove, because a glove allows a little bit

888
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:43,640
Speaker 1: of airflow to keep going through your hand. It's not

889
00:46:43,719 --> 00:46:46,719
Speaker 1: such a sealed off sound, so i can cow call

890
00:46:46,760 --> 00:46:50,360
Speaker 1: into my hand very quietly, and I'll muffle it with

891
00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:53,040
Speaker 1: the glove a little bit so it'll it'll just give

892
00:46:53,080 --> 00:46:57,160
Speaker 1: the illusion I'm fifty sixty eighty yards behind where I'm

893
00:46:57,160 --> 00:46:59,799
Speaker 1: actually standing, and that'll just get that bowl to come

894
00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:02,760
Speaker 1: in that last little bit for that for that shot.

895
00:47:02,840 --> 00:47:05,760
Speaker 1: You know, sometimes'll hang up and if you start calling

896
00:47:05,880 --> 00:47:10,840
Speaker 1: like you've walked away, then they'll they'll have the confidence

897
00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:13,680
Speaker 1: to come forward and maybe sniff where they they thought

898
00:47:13,680 --> 00:47:16,200
Speaker 1: you were standing before. It's like, who is this this guy?

899
00:47:16,320 --> 00:47:18,279
Speaker 1: Or maybe I heard that cow up there. I'm gonna

900
00:47:18,280 --> 00:47:20,239
Speaker 1: go check and see if she was in heat, and

901
00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:22,960
Speaker 1: they come forward and then you'll have your shot opportunity.

902
00:47:24,560 --> 00:47:28,359
Speaker 1: As far as full moons go, Ah man, I used

903
00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:30,440
Speaker 1: to geek out a lot about this. I would I

904
00:47:30,440 --> 00:47:33,239
Speaker 1: would fret. I would look at the moon calendar and

905
00:47:33,239 --> 00:47:36,040
Speaker 1: I would fret over like Okay, I got have my

906
00:47:36,120 --> 00:47:39,120
Speaker 1: one week, I can take off. I'm like going, I

907
00:47:39,160 --> 00:47:40,719
Speaker 1: really don't want to beat on a full moon because

908
00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:43,799
Speaker 1: I've had full moon times that have been really tough hunting.

909
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:46,320
Speaker 1: I've had other full moon times it didn't really seem

910
00:47:46,360 --> 00:47:51,600
Speaker 1: to matter, but all accumulated. You know, in the moment

911
00:47:51,640 --> 00:47:53,719
Speaker 1: when you're having a tough hunt on a full moon,

912
00:47:54,080 --> 00:47:57,000
Speaker 1: you know you're looking whatever you can to blame. You know,

913
00:47:57,360 --> 00:48:00,359
Speaker 1: the bulls not bugling. Well, it's like, well, it's got

914
00:48:00,400 --> 00:48:02,759
Speaker 1: to be the full moon. But what I've kind of

915
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:05,200
Speaker 1: found over the years is sometimes you just don't have

916
00:48:05,239 --> 00:48:08,160
Speaker 1: the luxury of taken the time off that you want

917
00:48:08,960 --> 00:48:11,839
Speaker 1: during the perfect moon, or the perfect moon doesn't fall

918
00:48:12,920 --> 00:48:15,120
Speaker 1: right in the middle of the peakrette, like like Jason

919
00:48:15,200 --> 00:48:17,200
Speaker 1: was talking about, So you just kind of have to

920
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:20,640
Speaker 1: play the cards you're dealt. And I've found over the years,

921
00:48:20,760 --> 00:48:24,759
Speaker 1: like it hasn't it hasn't really changed my success. It

922
00:48:24,760 --> 00:48:27,200
Speaker 1: hasn't hurt my success at all. But what I've found

923
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:31,080
Speaker 1: is the times, the active periods during the day which

924
00:48:31,080 --> 00:48:35,399
Speaker 1: I'm calling elk have changed. So rather than having more

925
00:48:35,880 --> 00:48:38,080
Speaker 1: calling action, you know, the first two or three hours

926
00:48:38,080 --> 00:48:40,799
Speaker 1: of light, you know, in the morning before they get

927
00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:43,080
Speaker 1: bed down and be quiet. I found that I have

928
00:48:43,160 --> 00:48:45,880
Speaker 1: found more success in the middle of the day and

929
00:48:45,880 --> 00:48:49,360
Speaker 1: then they'll and then early afternoon. So you have to

930
00:48:49,360 --> 00:48:52,200
Speaker 1: think some of those times when, especially once it's pretty

931
00:48:52,200 --> 00:48:54,720
Speaker 1: warm and dry, those those elk will go to bed.

932
00:48:55,400 --> 00:48:57,399
Speaker 1: They'll be in bed at first light. Sometimes I've had

933
00:48:57,440 --> 00:48:59,719
Speaker 1: that happen or within the first hour or two of

934
00:48:59,719 --> 00:49:03,200
Speaker 1: the day, and they lay there cooped up for a

935
00:49:03,239 --> 00:49:07,400
Speaker 1: long time, and by noon or even four o'clock in

936
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:11,399
Speaker 1: the afternoon, they're ready to do something. Now they may

937
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:14,680
Speaker 1: not get up and move to their their nighttime feeding area,

938
00:49:14,719 --> 00:49:16,799
Speaker 1: but they'll get up in their bedding area and like

939
00:49:16,880 --> 00:49:19,840
Speaker 1: browse around, move around, maybe the bowl, slip off to

940
00:49:19,880 --> 00:49:23,200
Speaker 1: a close by wallow or something and wallow around. But

941
00:49:23,280 --> 00:49:26,600
Speaker 1: I found it by positioning myself close to those betting

942
00:49:26,600 --> 00:49:30,400
Speaker 1: areas again and being able to take advantage of that

943
00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:32,359
Speaker 1: when they get up and start moving around in those

944
00:49:32,520 --> 00:49:36,520
Speaker 1: those late afternoons. It's it's worked out great. I went

945
00:49:36,640 --> 00:49:41,480
Speaker 1: from from calling in bowls and killing bowls mostly in

946
00:49:41,520 --> 00:49:45,480
Speaker 1: the mornings because I avoided that full moon, but once

947
00:49:45,480 --> 00:49:47,439
Speaker 1: I had to start kind of hunting that full moon

948
00:49:47,480 --> 00:49:50,359
Speaker 1: just because of scheduling and stuff. I found. I started

949
00:49:50,440 --> 00:49:53,360
Speaker 1: killing bowls in that afternoon period anywhere from middle of

950
00:49:53,400 --> 00:49:55,759
Speaker 1: the day, and a lot of them in that four

951
00:49:55,800 --> 00:49:59,839
Speaker 1: to six pm timeframe. So and I feel like they're

952
00:49:59,880 --> 00:50:02,480
Speaker 1: more active in that four to six pm time frame

953
00:50:02,560 --> 00:50:07,359
Speaker 1: on a full moon. So yeah, if that's if that's

954
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:09,560
Speaker 1: what you're really looking for, you know, you know what

955
00:50:09,600 --> 00:50:12,440
Speaker 1: you really want a certain week to hunt, then I

956
00:50:12,440 --> 00:50:14,880
Speaker 1: wouldn't let that deter you. But you're probably gonna have

957
00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:30,520
Speaker 1: to modify your tactics. All right, we got question. We

958
00:50:30,640 --> 00:50:33,360
Speaker 1: got time for one more question.

959
00:50:33,640 --> 00:50:38,960
Speaker 8: All right, Hey derk Dave mccallo here, Wyoming resident Elk Turner,

960
00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:41,640
Speaker 8: got a scenario for you, wing if you might be

961
00:50:41,640 --> 00:50:44,160
Speaker 8: able to give some tips and tactics for you or

962
00:50:44,200 --> 00:50:44,480
Speaker 8: for me.

963
00:50:45,880 --> 00:50:48,440
Speaker 6: I'm wondering how you go about this happens to me

964
00:50:48,520 --> 00:50:52,120
Speaker 6: every year. How to go about hunting a Google party

965
00:50:52,360 --> 00:50:56,360
Speaker 6: or a rough run frenzy day. You got a you

966
00:50:56,440 --> 00:50:59,640
Speaker 6: got a hillside every morning you know you run into

967
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:02,439
Speaker 6: you go down in there and there's a big herd

968
00:51:02,520 --> 00:51:06,480
Speaker 6: elk in there. But there's like nine ten eleven bulls

969
00:51:06,520 --> 00:51:11,000
Speaker 6: just going crazy, going nuts. You hear bulls, just multiple

970
00:51:11,000 --> 00:51:14,160
Speaker 6: bulls bigle and their balls up, and you know there's

971
00:51:14,480 --> 00:51:18,480
Speaker 6: a good herd bowl in there. There's multiple big bulls

972
00:51:18,520 --> 00:51:20,840
Speaker 6: in there, so it's not just one herd bowl and

973
00:51:20,880 --> 00:51:23,560
Speaker 6: a bunch of satellites. There's multiple big bulls in there,

974
00:51:23,719 --> 00:51:26,759
Speaker 6: a bunch of satellites, bunch of cows. You go in

975
00:51:26,800 --> 00:51:30,680
Speaker 6: on them every morning where they're feeding, but there's every

976
00:51:30,719 --> 00:51:36,080
Speaker 6: morning they slowly feed off away from you, and for me,

977
00:51:36,120 --> 00:51:38,560
Speaker 6: they're always heading on the private so it's a race

978
00:51:38,640 --> 00:51:41,440
Speaker 6: to catch up with them every morning, and it seems

979
00:51:41,480 --> 00:51:45,080
Speaker 6: like every step you take there are ten steps ahead.

980
00:51:45,719 --> 00:51:47,520
Speaker 6: And it's always hard because you don't want to get

981
00:51:47,520 --> 00:51:48,960
Speaker 6: spotted by the cows.

982
00:51:49,280 --> 00:51:50,720
Speaker 4: You don't know, there's trees.

983
00:51:50,840 --> 00:51:53,600
Speaker 6: There's trees involved, so you know, you can't see all

984
00:51:53,640 --> 00:51:57,680
Speaker 6: the bulls, can't tell exactly which one's the herd bull.

985
00:51:58,960 --> 00:51:59,200
Speaker 9: You know.

986
00:51:59,239 --> 00:52:01,080
Speaker 6: It's just every time I try and go after the

987
00:52:01,120 --> 00:52:05,840
Speaker 6: biggest bowl, but you know, I'm always trying a different tactic,

988
00:52:06,000 --> 00:52:08,080
Speaker 6: you know, and then sometimes it's like should I gone

989
00:52:08,160 --> 00:52:11,319
Speaker 6: after that herd bowl or should I have gone after

990
00:52:11,360 --> 00:52:13,919
Speaker 6: a satellite bowl? Every time it seems like the elk

991
00:52:13,960 --> 00:52:17,560
Speaker 6: are beating me. So you know, my main question is

992
00:52:17,600 --> 00:52:20,360
Speaker 6: I'm sure you've ran into that, ran into that instant

993
00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:24,080
Speaker 6: before where you know you're trying to kill you only

994
00:52:24,120 --> 00:52:28,240
Speaker 6: got one tag, but there's you know, nine ten eleven

995
00:52:28,280 --> 00:52:32,800
Speaker 6: bowls going crazy in there with cows. They're feeding away

996
00:52:32,880 --> 00:52:35,160
Speaker 6: from you, and it doesn't even necessarily have to be

997
00:52:35,200 --> 00:52:37,680
Speaker 6: them feeding away from you. Mainly, my main question is

998
00:52:37,760 --> 00:52:42,120
Speaker 6: just how do you hunt something like that where I

999
00:52:42,120 --> 00:52:45,319
Speaker 6: wouldn't say it's necessarily super sick timber, but there is

1000
00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:49,640
Speaker 6: timber in there, and there is you know, there is

1001
00:52:50,360 --> 00:52:54,000
Speaker 6: you know, just different different valleys in there where the

1002
00:52:54,040 --> 00:52:57,360
Speaker 6: elk can hide in and everything. So how would you

1003
00:52:57,400 --> 00:52:59,920
Speaker 6: go about punting that? And I'm talking archery of course,

1004
00:53:00,080 --> 00:53:02,839
Speaker 6: So any tips and tactics you can give on that,

1005
00:53:03,040 --> 00:53:05,320
Speaker 6: I super appreciate it, Thank you very much.

1006
00:53:06,040 --> 00:53:08,359
Speaker 2: Man. I think first step would be to give us

1007
00:53:08,360 --> 00:53:10,360
Speaker 2: an invite out there so we could help them with

1008
00:53:10,360 --> 00:53:12,080
Speaker 2: this problem with too many bowls go in too many

1009
00:53:12,080 --> 00:53:14,880
Speaker 2: different directions, so we can really get a good idea.

1010
00:53:14,960 --> 00:53:17,680
Speaker 1: Right at least give us some on X waypoints.

1011
00:53:17,719 --> 00:53:19,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and then we can evaluate it better.

1012
00:53:19,360 --> 00:53:20,799
Speaker 1: Right now, we can hunt it and then tell you

1013
00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:22,279
Speaker 1: how to hunt it. Now, there's a.

1014
00:53:22,200 --> 00:53:23,879
Speaker 2: Lot of there's a lot of things that went through

1015
00:53:23,880 --> 00:53:26,080
Speaker 2: my mind here and without there, I mean, there's it's

1016
00:53:26,160 --> 00:53:28,640
Speaker 2: it's tough to figure out, you know, from the question.

1017
00:53:28,800 --> 00:53:33,000
Speaker 2: But all joking aside, I'm sure you can't get permission

1018
00:53:33,040 --> 00:53:34,719
Speaker 2: on the private, but that'd be step number one. Can

1019
00:53:34,760 --> 00:53:37,439
Speaker 2: I hunt there? And probably not? So check that one off.

1020
00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:43,440
Speaker 2: Is there room for you to get between the private

1021
00:53:43,600 --> 00:53:48,240
Speaker 2: and where these elk are going? With thermals, with everything involved,

1022
00:53:48,239 --> 00:53:50,160
Speaker 2: could you get there? Could you beat them to where

1023
00:53:50,160 --> 00:53:52,360
Speaker 2: they're going? If it sounds like this is a fairly

1024
00:53:52,440 --> 00:53:55,440
Speaker 2: routine patternable movement that they feed out in the public,

1025
00:53:55,960 --> 00:53:58,319
Speaker 2: beat you the private, or you don't know which bull

1026
00:53:58,400 --> 00:54:01,480
Speaker 2: to chase to. There's a lot of things to tackle here,

1027
00:54:01,520 --> 00:54:03,719
Speaker 2: Like only you can decide whether you should go after

1028
00:54:03,760 --> 00:54:05,560
Speaker 2: the herd bowl or the or the rag. You know,

1029
00:54:05,640 --> 00:54:09,759
Speaker 2: the satellite bulls. Do you care which one that you

1030
00:54:10,320 --> 00:54:12,480
Speaker 2: kill or hunt? Like that's completely up to you. I

1031
00:54:12,480 --> 00:54:14,320
Speaker 2: will say that typically satellite bowls are going to be

1032
00:54:14,360 --> 00:54:16,759
Speaker 2: easier to call in most of the time. There have

1033
00:54:16,800 --> 00:54:19,000
Speaker 2: been some herd bowls if with all the if all

1034
00:54:19,040 --> 00:54:21,200
Speaker 2: the stars align, you get close enough to his herd

1035
00:54:21,239 --> 00:54:23,000
Speaker 2: and do all this. Like I would say that some

1036
00:54:23,040 --> 00:54:24,879
Speaker 2: herd bulls you know it could be just as easy

1037
00:54:24,880 --> 00:54:27,959
Speaker 2: as satellite bowl. So Number one, can you get there

1038
00:54:28,440 --> 00:54:34,160
Speaker 2: undetected by noise, visual smell prior to the morning starting.

1039
00:54:35,000 --> 00:54:40,279
Speaker 2: If so, work that system, you know, try to be

1040
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:42,360
Speaker 2: in front of them. I've always said it's way easier

1041
00:54:42,400 --> 00:54:46,200
Speaker 2: to call elk into or kill elk that you are

1042
00:54:46,360 --> 00:54:49,879
Speaker 2: just in their natural path without anything else going on

1043
00:54:51,200 --> 00:54:54,520
Speaker 2: Number two, which we didn't get enough. Do these elks

1044
00:54:54,560 --> 00:54:57,200
Speaker 2: stay on the private until after dark or you know,

1045
00:54:57,320 --> 00:55:00,600
Speaker 2: almost piggyback on what Dirk just said on the question

1046
00:55:01,040 --> 00:55:05,680
Speaker 2: with the evening sometimes being better. Can you are these

1047
00:55:05,680 --> 00:55:08,319
Speaker 2: all going to be back on that public with with

1048
00:55:08,520 --> 00:55:11,520
Speaker 2: good enough wind to be able to hunt them on

1049
00:55:11,640 --> 00:55:14,440
Speaker 2: the night or the return? Is that is that an option?

1050
00:55:16,080 --> 00:55:17,439
Speaker 2: You know? So that would be two things I would

1051
00:55:17,440 --> 00:55:19,160
Speaker 2: look at. Can I get in there, which I don't

1052
00:55:19,200 --> 00:55:21,520
Speaker 2: know the answer to, can I hunt them at night?

1053
00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:25,160
Speaker 2: And then if not? Number three, which is tough to do,

1054
00:55:25,200 --> 00:55:26,920
Speaker 2: like I said, unless you're after a certain bowl, or

1055
00:55:26,960 --> 00:55:30,640
Speaker 2: you're just after any bowl. I've been in areas like

1056
00:55:30,680 --> 00:55:32,640
Speaker 2: this where there's great l cunting, But I just I've

1057
00:55:32,920 --> 00:55:37,440
Speaker 2: ran enough different programs. You know, I am going to

1058
00:55:37,480 --> 00:55:39,000
Speaker 2: get there early. Well that doesn't work out, and it

1059
00:55:39,040 --> 00:55:40,600
Speaker 2: didn't work out the second or the third time, I'm

1060
00:55:40,640 --> 00:55:42,160
Speaker 2: gonna try to hunt them at night. That didn't work

1061
00:55:42,160 --> 00:55:45,040
Speaker 2: out the second or the third time. At some point

1062
00:55:45,080 --> 00:55:47,280
Speaker 2: you almost have to just like pull up the anchor

1063
00:55:47,320 --> 00:55:49,359
Speaker 2: and go to a new spot at times. So that's

1064
00:55:49,400 --> 00:55:53,200
Speaker 2: my three options. Get down there before dark, before daylight,

1065
00:55:53,719 --> 00:55:55,719
Speaker 2: and see if that'll work, if if the wind and

1066
00:55:55,760 --> 00:55:57,920
Speaker 2: everything allows you to do it, try to hunt them

1067
00:55:57,920 --> 00:56:00,000
Speaker 2: at night. If that doesn't work, sometimes you might just

1068
00:56:00,200 --> 00:56:01,560
Speaker 2: look for their options.

1069
00:56:02,640 --> 00:56:05,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love all that, Jason, that that's exactly how

1070
00:56:05,880 --> 00:56:09,879
Speaker 1: I would have answered it. Sometimes the last one you said,

1071
00:56:09,920 --> 00:56:13,279
Speaker 1: sometimes you may just kind of find another elk, you know,

1072
00:56:13,320 --> 00:56:15,680
Speaker 1: it's other places to hunt, you know, sometimes they're just

1073
00:56:15,880 --> 00:56:19,319
Speaker 1: almost unkillable. But another option you didn't bring up is,

1074
00:56:19,360 --> 00:56:21,840
Speaker 1: you know, I don't know what kind of country it is.

1075
00:56:21,520 --> 00:56:24,239
Speaker 1: Is there a way you can back back in stay

1076
00:56:24,280 --> 00:56:26,920
Speaker 1: the night where you're going to be out of the

1077
00:56:27,080 --> 00:56:31,160
Speaker 1: elk's travel pattern and scent trail as they come through

1078
00:56:31,200 --> 00:56:33,440
Speaker 1: and through the night. You know, maybe you're on the

1079
00:56:33,480 --> 00:56:35,400
Speaker 1: other side of a drainage. You know, you're you're in

1080
00:56:35,400 --> 00:56:37,279
Speaker 1: an area where the elk are just not going to

1081
00:56:37,360 --> 00:56:39,799
Speaker 1: smell you, but you'll be able to get up. You

1082
00:56:39,840 --> 00:56:42,279
Speaker 1: don't have to fight your way through them to you know,

1083
00:56:42,360 --> 00:56:45,600
Speaker 1: maybe cut them off at the pass per se before

1084
00:56:45,640 --> 00:56:49,439
Speaker 1: they go back onto that private I feel like these

1085
00:56:49,440 --> 00:56:52,000
Speaker 1: are the situations you have to man. You just kind

1086
00:56:52,000 --> 00:56:54,000
Speaker 1: of got to like look at some really out of

1087
00:56:54,040 --> 00:56:58,960
Speaker 1: the box solutions and you know, try some off the

1088
00:56:59,000 --> 00:57:01,359
Speaker 1: wall tactics to to try to get it done and

1089
00:57:01,360 --> 00:57:03,759
Speaker 1: and and it may just work or you may not.

1090
00:57:04,040 --> 00:57:07,000
Speaker 1: You know, I know there's a lot of folks that

1091
00:57:07,080 --> 00:57:09,319
Speaker 1: the hunt elk like that, or you know, they got elk.

1092
00:57:09,400 --> 00:57:12,319
Speaker 1: The traveling from public to private a lot and if

1093
00:57:12,360 --> 00:57:15,719
Speaker 1: you can if win the biggest problem is wind. If

1094
00:57:15,760 --> 00:57:18,680
Speaker 1: you can beat the wind on those elk that are

1095
00:57:18,920 --> 00:57:22,600
Speaker 1: going on onto private and back and forth, a lot

1096
00:57:22,640 --> 00:57:25,200
Speaker 1: of times you can capitalize is just getting that getting

1097
00:57:25,240 --> 00:57:27,720
Speaker 1: the wind in your favor and having the timing be right.

1098
00:57:27,920 --> 00:57:30,560
Speaker 1: But that's always that's always seems like for me, is

1099
00:57:30,560 --> 00:57:35,080
Speaker 1: always easier said than done. Okay, I've got two more questions.

1100
00:57:35,960 --> 00:57:37,680
Speaker 1: I really want to get these on this podcast. I

1101
00:57:37,680 --> 00:57:39,600
Speaker 1: said that was the last one, but we're going to

1102
00:57:39,640 --> 00:57:41,360
Speaker 1: go just a little bit longer on this one than

1103
00:57:41,400 --> 00:57:43,800
Speaker 1: we normally do. But I really I want to make

1104
00:57:43,800 --> 00:57:50,800
Speaker 1: sure we answer everybody's question. So question number five, you know.

1105
00:57:50,840 --> 00:57:53,960
Speaker 9: I'm just curious what you're ound about during the fall hunting.

1106
00:57:55,280 --> 00:57:57,240
Speaker 9: There are ways that you can find for ways that

1107
00:57:57,320 --> 00:58:00,000
Speaker 9: you've seen to notice that you're in a spring cat

1108
00:58:00,240 --> 00:58:04,720
Speaker 9: area and just looking to do some more spring bear

1109
00:58:04,800 --> 00:58:06,680
Speaker 9: hunting and like to focus on caving areas. So I

1110
00:58:06,680 --> 00:58:09,680
Speaker 9: didn't know if you guys headways while you're runn around

1111
00:58:09,720 --> 00:58:12,880
Speaker 9: the fall to identify spring calving. So for sure, thing

1112
00:58:12,880 --> 00:58:16,120
Speaker 9: you guys do plus a podcast, but trying.

1113
00:58:15,880 --> 00:58:19,240
Speaker 2: To identify spring calving to take advantage during spring bear season.

1114
00:58:19,400 --> 00:58:21,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, but while you're out in the fall.

1115
00:58:23,120 --> 00:58:25,000
Speaker 2: That's going to depend heavily on whether you're in a

1116
00:58:25,040 --> 00:58:28,040
Speaker 2: migration type unit. Is that a desert unit? Do the

1117
00:58:28,080 --> 00:58:30,480
Speaker 2: olk migrate? Do they live there year round? Like where

1118
00:58:30,520 --> 00:58:32,520
Speaker 2: I live in Southwust, Washington, or elk are in the

1119
00:58:32,520 --> 00:58:36,560
Speaker 2: same place all year long. They have in the same

1120
00:58:36,600 --> 00:58:39,240
Speaker 2: area they run and they live there pretty much within

1121
00:58:39,280 --> 00:58:41,880
Speaker 2: a small home range. Now where some of these areas

1122
00:58:41,880 --> 00:58:43,920
Speaker 2: where we hunt, you know, in the mountains or whether

1123
00:58:43,960 --> 00:58:48,360
Speaker 2: it's Colorado or Idaho or Montana, obviously those elk have

1124
00:58:48,440 --> 00:58:52,800
Speaker 2: to come down and to what you know, a winter migration.

1125
00:58:52,880 --> 00:58:56,280
Speaker 2: They're going to winter until that snow allows them to

1126
00:58:56,320 --> 00:58:59,760
Speaker 2: go back up. From my experience, these elk most of

1127
00:58:59,800 --> 00:59:02,919
Speaker 2: the time want to be as high as the snow

1128
00:59:02,960 --> 00:59:05,760
Speaker 2: will let them. Now, I'm gonna put an asterisk there.

1129
00:59:05,800 --> 00:59:08,280
Speaker 2: There are elk that absolutely love living on private land.

1130
00:59:08,600 --> 00:59:10,600
Speaker 2: They want to be their year round. So I'm saying

1131
00:59:10,600 --> 00:59:12,520
Speaker 2: these elk that would prefer to be in the mountains,

1132
00:59:12,800 --> 00:59:14,960
Speaker 2: they come down. I'm assuming that's the question you're asking,

1133
00:59:14,960 --> 00:59:16,560
Speaker 2: because otherwise we would just be able to answer like, oh,

1134
00:59:16,560 --> 00:59:18,680
Speaker 2: the elk that are always on private land probably don't leave.

1135
00:59:19,920 --> 00:59:24,600
Speaker 2: So if we're looking at migratory elk spring calving, it's

1136
00:59:24,640 --> 00:59:29,600
Speaker 2: really going to be different based on snow levels and

1137
00:59:29,600 --> 00:59:31,280
Speaker 2: where and where those elk are at. They will have

1138
00:59:31,320 --> 00:59:38,320
Speaker 2: their preferred calving grounds. They may revisit those, but a right,

1139
00:59:38,760 --> 00:59:40,439
Speaker 2: I don't got a good answer like where they're gonna

1140
00:59:40,480 --> 00:59:42,680
Speaker 2: drop calves every year. Dirk may have more on this.

1141
00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:45,640
Speaker 2: It's obviously going to be somewhere between where they winter

1142
00:59:45,800 --> 00:59:49,240
Speaker 2: and where they're gonna summer, you know, somewhere along that line.

1143
00:59:49,240 --> 00:59:51,560
Speaker 2: And I would say wherever that snow hits during that

1144
00:59:51,680 --> 00:59:53,960
Speaker 2: calving season for that area. You know some areas and

1145
00:59:54,360 --> 00:59:57,280
Speaker 2: in Utah have late calving due to you know, their

1146
00:59:57,280 --> 01:00:01,080
Speaker 2: cows coming in later. You know, if they have early,

1147
01:00:01,120 --> 01:00:03,479
Speaker 2: it's going to be lower. So wherever that snow line

1148
01:00:03,600 --> 01:00:06,440
Speaker 2: is during the end, if you have an idea where

1149
01:00:06,480 --> 01:00:09,720
Speaker 2: that migration is going to be, so you know the

1150
01:00:09,960 --> 01:00:12,400
Speaker 2: information you're gonna get in the fall is where those elk.

1151
01:00:12,720 --> 01:00:14,640
Speaker 2: Can you draw a line from where you think those

1152
01:00:14,760 --> 01:00:17,000
Speaker 2: elk winner or do you know where those elk winter

1153
01:00:17,360 --> 01:00:18,640
Speaker 2: so you know where they're at in the fall, you

1154
01:00:18,640 --> 01:00:20,240
Speaker 2: know where they're out in the winter, and then it's

1155
01:00:20,240 --> 01:00:22,160
Speaker 2: going to be somewhere along that line where the snow

1156
01:00:22,520 --> 01:00:25,800
Speaker 2: level is at or slightly below. Like I said, I'm

1157
01:00:25,840 --> 01:00:27,880
Speaker 2: just I'm speculating a little bit here because I haven't

1158
01:00:27,920 --> 01:00:32,800
Speaker 2: actually like went through that effort and looked at it

1159
01:00:32,840 --> 01:00:35,160
Speaker 2: and confirmed it. But maybe Dirk will have a better

1160
01:00:35,200 --> 01:00:35,920
Speaker 2: answer than I do.

1161
01:00:36,800 --> 01:00:39,480
Speaker 1: I don't really as far as like as you're scouting

1162
01:00:39,480 --> 01:00:42,640
Speaker 1: in the fall, if you're trying to identify this in

1163
01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:46,560
Speaker 1: the fall, just like you said in their summary, is

1164
01:00:46,600 --> 01:00:51,480
Speaker 1: you know even in Idaho where the elk don't migrate far.

1165
01:00:51,560 --> 01:00:53,440
Speaker 1: I mean they'll migrate a little ways, but it's not

1166
01:00:53,520 --> 01:00:56,480
Speaker 1: like Wyoming where they're going two hundred miles or one

1167
01:00:56,520 --> 01:00:59,360
Speaker 1: hundred miles. You know, they may go five or six miles.

1168
01:00:59,360 --> 01:01:02,080
Speaker 1: They may go from a higher elevation and they'll drop

1169
01:01:02,240 --> 01:01:05,160
Speaker 1: three thousand feet down to a lower elevation and and

1170
01:01:05,200 --> 01:01:09,120
Speaker 1: that's where they're going to be. But so you may

1171
01:01:09,360 --> 01:01:11,840
Speaker 1: have to if you're wanting to, you know, optimize your

1172
01:01:11,880 --> 01:01:14,440
Speaker 1: bear hunting time, you may just have to dedicate some

1173
01:01:14,600 --> 01:01:19,720
Speaker 1: time into finding those areas, finding those elk herds. And

1174
01:01:19,720 --> 01:01:21,680
Speaker 1: the good thing about it in the springtime is elk

1175
01:01:21,680 --> 01:01:25,760
Speaker 1: are way more visible than than bears. Typically, you know,

1176
01:01:26,320 --> 01:01:29,640
Speaker 1: large groups of cows will be way more visible than

1177
01:01:30,200 --> 01:01:32,640
Speaker 1: you know, single bears here and there. So I would

1178
01:01:32,680 --> 01:01:35,080
Speaker 1: I would find the find the elk in the springtime

1179
01:01:35,120 --> 01:01:37,880
Speaker 1: and then and then start hunting close by to that.

1180
01:01:38,680 --> 01:01:42,120
Speaker 1: And you know, typically around Memorial Day weekend you'll start

1181
01:01:42,120 --> 01:01:44,840
Speaker 1: seeing calves hit the ground. So there in the first

1182
01:01:44,880 --> 01:01:47,400
Speaker 1: week of June, you'll start seeing a lot of calves

1183
01:01:47,480 --> 01:01:49,480
Speaker 1: hit the ground, and that'd be a great time to go,

1184
01:01:49,640 --> 01:01:51,720
Speaker 1: you know, capitalize and start start looking.

1185
01:01:51,960 --> 01:01:52,160
Speaker 2: Though.

1186
01:01:52,200 --> 01:01:57,840
Speaker 1: I will say once those cows start dropping calves, they

1187
01:01:57,880 --> 01:01:59,800
Speaker 1: become a little less visible because they kind of go

1188
01:01:59,840 --> 01:02:02,640
Speaker 1: off by themselves. So if you can get there a

1189
01:02:02,640 --> 01:02:05,280
Speaker 1: little early. And I don't know if you're an Idaho

1190
01:02:05,400 --> 01:02:08,320
Speaker 1: resident or not. I guess you did say South Idaho,

1191
01:02:08,520 --> 01:02:10,200
Speaker 1: if you can live, if you live close where you

1192
01:02:10,240 --> 01:02:12,000
Speaker 1: want to go bear hunting, I would just put in

1193
01:02:12,040 --> 01:02:15,760
Speaker 1: the time the weeks leading up to the Memorial Day weekend,

1194
01:02:15,840 --> 01:02:18,120
Speaker 1: just clock on the elk, where are they at? Where

1195
01:02:18,200 --> 01:02:22,480
Speaker 1: they at now? And then as they kind of start disappearing,

1196
01:02:22,640 --> 01:02:25,080
Speaker 1: but you're still seeing some elk, you know here and

1197
01:02:25,120 --> 01:02:28,840
Speaker 1: there singles, you'll know that there's that's probably where they're

1198
01:02:28,840 --> 01:02:33,000
Speaker 1: gonna have their calves, and you could probably target those

1199
01:02:33,000 --> 01:02:35,200
Speaker 1: areas for bears. And then I would I wouldn't be

1200
01:02:35,200 --> 01:02:38,000
Speaker 1: afraid of doing some calling, you know, with calf and

1201
01:02:38,000 --> 01:02:43,360
Speaker 1: distress calls and even normal predator calls to work good

1202
01:02:43,720 --> 01:02:47,400
Speaker 1: in those same areas. But and then if you're if

1203
01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:49,560
Speaker 1: you just don't have that luxury of having the time

1204
01:02:49,760 --> 01:02:52,200
Speaker 1: of getting out there and looking, you're just like, maybe

1205
01:02:52,240 --> 01:02:54,760
Speaker 1: you just have a limited amount of time. I would

1206
01:02:54,880 --> 01:02:57,600
Speaker 1: contact your local biologist, you know from the Idaho Fishing

1207
01:02:57,640 --> 01:03:01,760
Speaker 1: Game and or you know, maybe even better yet, because

1208
01:03:01,760 --> 01:03:03,960
Speaker 1: some biologists they don't leave the office, they're just their

1209
01:03:04,000 --> 01:03:06,960
Speaker 1: data crunchers, right, they're they're not a field biologist. They're

1210
01:03:07,120 --> 01:03:10,440
Speaker 1: they're inside the doors of the of the office. Maybe

1211
01:03:10,760 --> 01:03:14,080
Speaker 1: talk to your local game warden in the area and say, hey,

1212
01:03:14,120 --> 01:03:16,280
Speaker 1: I'm this is what I'm trying to do. Where should

1213
01:03:16,280 --> 01:03:19,320
Speaker 1: I look for those calving areas and focus on bears

1214
01:03:19,360 --> 01:03:23,000
Speaker 1: because I think I think everybody you know is going

1215
01:03:23,040 --> 01:03:25,640
Speaker 1: to try to help you out, you know, notch a

1216
01:03:25,680 --> 01:03:28,040
Speaker 1: tag on a predator. So I feel like that kind

1217
01:03:28,040 --> 01:03:32,120
Speaker 1: of information would be easily accessed from the from like

1218
01:03:32,280 --> 01:03:34,280
Speaker 1: you know, game wardens and state officials that way.

1219
01:03:34,360 --> 01:03:37,280
Speaker 2: So last year I was just before you mentioned game

1220
01:03:37,320 --> 01:03:39,320
Speaker 2: wardens and biologists, I actually worked with some biologists that

1221
01:03:39,320 --> 01:03:41,320
Speaker 2: were out in the field capturing calves. We I went

1222
01:03:41,400 --> 01:03:44,440
Speaker 2: and helped with that Blue Mountain capture and I was

1223
01:03:44,440 --> 01:03:47,240
Speaker 2: there June fifth and sixth, and seventh, and a lot

1224
01:03:47,240 --> 01:03:49,440
Speaker 2: of those you know, one to three day old calves

1225
01:03:49,440 --> 01:03:52,480
Speaker 2: were being dropped there. They had started dropping, you know,

1226
01:03:52,600 --> 01:03:55,040
Speaker 2: May twenty fifth, twenty sixth, So if you can coordinate

1227
01:03:55,160 --> 01:03:58,960
Speaker 2: like snow lines with that time, and then these cows

1228
01:03:59,080 --> 01:04:01,920
Speaker 2: were different. They would drop down in the you know,

1229
01:04:02,000 --> 01:04:05,040
Speaker 2: for those that don't know the Blues area, these these

1230
01:04:05,120 --> 01:04:07,600
Speaker 2: elk would stay low and they would drop into these

1231
01:04:07,640 --> 01:04:11,160
Speaker 2: like calving groups. You know, the cows would obviously drop

1232
01:04:11,200 --> 01:04:13,200
Speaker 2: low some some small bowls, but they would drop and

1233
01:04:13,200 --> 01:04:16,440
Speaker 2: they would drop off into the brakes and drop their

1234
01:04:16,640 --> 01:04:19,000
Speaker 2: typically drop their calve down on the very steep brakes

1235
01:04:19,200 --> 01:04:21,320
Speaker 2: where they could keep them. So they were more looking

1236
01:04:21,520 --> 01:04:24,360
Speaker 2: for the cover they needed to get that calf through

1237
01:04:24,400 --> 01:04:27,080
Speaker 2: the first you know, five to ten days, and then

1238
01:04:27,120 --> 01:04:28,400
Speaker 2: they would come up. So it was a little bit

1239
01:04:28,440 --> 01:04:31,800
Speaker 2: different than what the general you know, habitat and vegetation

1240
01:04:31,920 --> 01:04:35,080
Speaker 2: was around. They were dropping off going solo. Once they

1241
01:04:35,080 --> 01:04:37,000
Speaker 2: got that calf to five to ten days, they would

1242
01:04:37,000 --> 01:04:38,760
Speaker 2: come back and kind of join up with the bigger

1243
01:04:38,760 --> 01:04:40,880
Speaker 2: herd again. So but they go on that little solo

1244
01:04:40,920 --> 01:04:43,240
Speaker 2: mission for five to ten days, which was typically a

1245
01:04:43,280 --> 01:04:44,919
Speaker 2: mile or two away from the rest of the elk

1246
01:04:44,960 --> 01:04:45,919
Speaker 2: that were in a bigger group.

1247
01:04:46,880 --> 01:04:49,120
Speaker 1: Right, and as as the month goes by, you know,

1248
01:04:49,200 --> 01:04:52,560
Speaker 1: those calves are still vulnerable, you know, so maybe as

1249
01:04:52,600 --> 01:04:55,120
Speaker 1: you see them starting to regroup again, you can still

1250
01:04:55,160 --> 01:04:56,640
Speaker 1: you know, look for bears in those areas.

1251
01:04:56,760 --> 01:05:00,200
Speaker 2: So yeah, great, hey, and not I'm gonna I had

1252
01:05:00,440 --> 01:05:02,160
Speaker 2: another tidbit. I know, we're trying to get through this

1253
01:05:02,200 --> 01:05:06,840
Speaker 2: real quick. Bears don't eat as many calves as you

1254
01:05:06,880 --> 01:05:11,480
Speaker 2: think they do. Lions do the majority of the damage.

1255
01:05:11,520 --> 01:05:13,680
Speaker 2: Now bears will take advantage of a free meal. But

1256
01:05:14,080 --> 01:05:15,960
Speaker 2: I was gonna just add the little tidbit. And when

1257
01:05:15,960 --> 01:05:19,080
Speaker 2: I interviewed Paul there on that capture, I think over

1258
01:05:19,120 --> 01:05:21,280
Speaker 2: eighty percent of the calves are killed by cougars, but

1259
01:05:21,360 --> 01:05:25,600
Speaker 2: bears do occasionally. You get one, but after about two

1260
01:05:25,680 --> 01:05:28,680
Speaker 2: to three days, bears can't catch a calf anymore. You

1261
01:05:28,680 --> 01:05:30,240
Speaker 2: have to rely on the cats and the wolves at

1262
01:05:30,240 --> 01:05:30,640
Speaker 2: that point.

1263
01:05:31,000 --> 01:05:32,120
Speaker 1: And that's in the Blue Mountains.

1264
01:05:32,200 --> 01:05:34,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I think anywhere once that calf gets about

1265
01:05:34,680 --> 01:05:37,280
Speaker 2: three days, three to five days, there's a bear can't

1266
01:05:37,360 --> 01:05:38,360
Speaker 2: track it down anymore.

1267
01:05:39,680 --> 01:05:43,240
Speaker 1: Interesting, all right, one last question and then we're gonna

1268
01:05:43,240 --> 01:05:43,960
Speaker 1: wrap things up.

1269
01:05:45,560 --> 01:05:48,400
Speaker 3: Hey Dirk and cutting the distance. Thanks for what you

1270
01:05:48,440 --> 01:05:52,919
Speaker 3: guys do. Then from North Dakota here, can you give

1271
01:05:52,960 --> 01:05:57,800
Speaker 3: me a generalized time frame of when the mountain thermals

1272
01:05:57,960 --> 01:06:01,800
Speaker 3: have a tendency to switch kind of late morning, like

1273
01:06:01,880 --> 01:06:04,800
Speaker 3: what time framework kind of looking at in general? And

1274
01:06:04,880 --> 01:06:06,920
Speaker 3: then the same thing in the evening. Obviously I was

1275
01:06:06,960 --> 01:06:09,560
Speaker 3: gonna be checking a wind checker, but just looking for

1276
01:06:09,600 --> 01:06:13,240
Speaker 3: a generalized timeframe about when to start expecting those thermals

1277
01:06:13,280 --> 01:06:16,720
Speaker 3: to be changing a late morning and then early evening.

1278
01:06:17,160 --> 01:06:18,400
Speaker 3: Thanks guys.

1279
01:06:19,040 --> 01:06:22,200
Speaker 1: I'll start on this with Jason because I watched this

1280
01:06:22,320 --> 01:06:25,960
Speaker 1: a lot and I'm sure you do too. But it

1281
01:06:26,040 --> 01:06:28,919
Speaker 1: kind of depends on where you're hunting as far as

1282
01:06:28,960 --> 01:06:33,880
Speaker 1: like the position of the ridge system you're hunting. For instance,

1283
01:06:35,120 --> 01:06:39,960
Speaker 1: if you're hunting on a north facing slope or an

1284
01:06:39,960 --> 01:06:42,480
Speaker 1: east facing slope, or a west facing slope or a

1285
01:06:42,520 --> 01:06:44,800
Speaker 1: south facing slope, you have to kind of factor those

1286
01:06:44,880 --> 01:06:47,800
Speaker 1: kind of things in. So the time to say okay

1287
01:06:47,800 --> 01:06:50,200
Speaker 1: at eight seventeen that you know the winds are going

1288
01:06:50,240 --> 01:06:53,720
Speaker 1: to switch, it's going to be dependent on the light

1289
01:06:54,160 --> 01:06:57,640
Speaker 1: from the sun hitting the hillside. So, for instance, if

1290
01:06:57,640 --> 01:07:01,360
Speaker 1: you're hunting an east facing slope, as soon as the

1291
01:07:01,400 --> 01:07:04,200
Speaker 1: sun starts coming up, and depends on how big deep

1292
01:07:04,280 --> 01:07:09,520
Speaker 1: the ridges are. If it's fairly flat country, as soon

1293
01:07:09,520 --> 01:07:12,120
Speaker 1: as the sun comes up, you're gonna have winds changing

1294
01:07:12,400 --> 01:07:14,720
Speaker 1: pretty early in the morning. You know, it could be

1295
01:07:14,840 --> 01:07:18,000
Speaker 1: within an hour or less after the first light. Now,

1296
01:07:18,040 --> 01:07:21,520
Speaker 1: if you're really steep and deep canyon country, as that

1297
01:07:21,720 --> 01:07:25,640
Speaker 1: as that sun comes over the horizon and starts hitting

1298
01:07:25,840 --> 01:07:29,600
Speaker 1: on the ridge that you're standing on. On that eastern ridge,

1299
01:07:29,640 --> 01:07:31,960
Speaker 1: you know it's gonna slowly come. You know that the

1300
01:07:31,960 --> 01:07:35,960
Speaker 1: sunlight's gonna slowly creep down towards the bottom, and then

1301
01:07:36,040 --> 01:07:38,920
Speaker 1: you know, by by eight point thirty, you know, the

1302
01:07:39,000 --> 01:07:42,280
Speaker 1: sun may may have hit that hillside and warmed it

1303
01:07:42,480 --> 01:07:45,120
Speaker 1: enough to where the wind's gonna all the winds are

1304
01:07:45,120 --> 01:07:47,440
Speaker 1: gonna start going up now. They may might even get

1305
01:07:47,480 --> 01:07:49,480
Speaker 1: swirly as the time goes by, So you get all

1306
01:07:49,520 --> 01:07:51,960
Speaker 1: the the side of the hillside that's getting really warmed,

1307
01:07:52,120 --> 01:07:54,400
Speaker 1: and then you're done in the shadow line. Still things

1308
01:07:54,440 --> 01:07:56,320
Speaker 1: are going to be a little bit going downhill, and

1309
01:07:56,400 --> 01:07:58,800
Speaker 1: you'll get some swirly stuff going on there too. But

1310
01:07:58,840 --> 01:08:00,919
Speaker 1: if you're on the back side of that same ridge,

1311
01:08:01,000 --> 01:08:03,400
Speaker 1: if you're on the on the west side of that ridge,

1312
01:08:04,240 --> 01:08:09,040
Speaker 1: you may not see a change in thermals until ten

1313
01:08:09,120 --> 01:08:12,440
Speaker 1: eleven o'clock, until that sun depends on the shape of

1314
01:08:12,440 --> 01:08:14,919
Speaker 1: the mountains and stuff, of course, but until that sun

1315
01:08:14,960 --> 01:08:17,519
Speaker 1: comes all the way up crosses you know, the center

1316
01:08:17,560 --> 01:08:20,120
Speaker 1: line of the ridge and starts casting sunlight down on

1317
01:08:20,200 --> 01:08:22,960
Speaker 1: the next on that east on that west facing slope,

1318
01:08:23,200 --> 01:08:24,960
Speaker 1: you may not see that till a little later on

1319
01:08:25,000 --> 01:08:29,559
Speaker 1: the day, and then north and south facing slopes. North

1320
01:08:29,640 --> 01:08:33,320
Speaker 1: is going to keep keep keep the sun, you know,

1321
01:08:33,600 --> 01:08:36,000
Speaker 1: off of it as long as longer than anywhere else

1322
01:08:36,000 --> 01:08:40,720
Speaker 1: whereas the south it's gonna become exposed fairly soon too,

1323
01:08:40,920 --> 01:08:43,080
Speaker 1: So you just have to kind of watch watch the

1324
01:08:43,160 --> 01:08:46,280
Speaker 1: hillside for that particular area. And as you start seeing

1325
01:08:46,400 --> 01:08:49,639
Speaker 1: you know, sun hitting the hillside and you're like, okay, man,

1326
01:08:49,720 --> 01:08:51,840
Speaker 1: it looks like we got about another thirty minutes before

1327
01:08:51,880 --> 01:08:55,200
Speaker 1: this this stuff is gonna change in our current position.

1328
01:08:55,840 --> 01:08:58,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know not to break it all the

1329
01:08:58,320 --> 01:09:00,720
Speaker 2: way down or in so what you already know. But

1330
01:09:00,920 --> 01:09:03,800
Speaker 2: you know, thermals are just a cooling and heating of air.

1331
01:09:03,880 --> 01:09:08,880
Speaker 2: Right when when there's colder air in the valley, it's

1332
01:09:08,920 --> 01:09:12,559
Speaker 2: pulling the draft down and is that air the air

1333
01:09:12,600 --> 01:09:17,280
Speaker 2: temperature within that valley now exceeds you know, it is warmer,

1334
01:09:17,360 --> 01:09:20,000
Speaker 2: it will now flow up. So it's just a I'm

1335
01:09:20,080 --> 01:09:22,240
Speaker 2: not a I'm not a weather guy at all, but

1336
01:09:22,400 --> 01:09:25,360
Speaker 2: it's basically just a science of cold air and hot

1337
01:09:25,360 --> 01:09:29,200
Speaker 2: air and the more consistent day to day. So let's

1338
01:09:29,200 --> 01:09:31,080
Speaker 2: say you've got the same weather for five days in

1339
01:09:31,120 --> 01:09:33,360
Speaker 2: a row. You could start to you know, I'll start

1340
01:09:33,400 --> 01:09:35,600
Speaker 2: to note like I'm on a soyle slope, I'm in

1341
01:09:35,640 --> 01:09:37,880
Speaker 2: the same area, like, oh, yesterday the wind was switched

1342
01:09:37,920 --> 01:09:40,200
Speaker 2: about eight thirty, you know, so that may affect whether

1343
01:09:40,240 --> 01:09:42,000
Speaker 2: I'm going to approach an elk or whether I'm gonna

1344
01:09:42,000 --> 01:09:46,800
Speaker 2: wait it out. But but as Dirk mentioned, you know, south, northwest,

1345
01:09:46,840 --> 01:09:51,479
Speaker 2: east aspects all gonna be different if you, I don't

1346
01:09:51,479 --> 01:09:54,240
Speaker 2: know if you ever experienced it, Dirk, like inversions, right you,

1347
01:09:54,520 --> 01:09:55,840
Speaker 2: It's a really hot day and all of a sudden,

1348
01:09:55,840 --> 01:09:57,599
Speaker 2: a bunch of cloud cover comes at night, but doesn't

1349
01:09:57,600 --> 01:09:59,519
Speaker 2: bring a bunch of cool with it. You'll wake up

1350
01:09:59,560 --> 01:10:01,639
Speaker 2: in the morning You're like, what the heck? The wind's

1351
01:10:01,640 --> 01:10:04,439
Speaker 2: already blowing like hard uphill because the warm air got

1352
01:10:04,479 --> 01:10:06,320
Speaker 2: trapped and now there's colder air up and so it's

1353
01:10:06,360 --> 01:10:07,920
Speaker 2: basically pushing out.

1354
01:10:07,960 --> 01:10:08,160
Speaker 3: You know.

1355
01:10:08,200 --> 01:10:09,840
Speaker 2: So I've been there before too, You're like, what in

1356
01:10:09,840 --> 01:10:11,880
Speaker 2: the heck is going on? The other thing, I like

1357
01:10:11,880 --> 01:10:14,400
Speaker 2: to keep in mind some of this stuff back to

1358
01:10:14,439 --> 01:10:15,840
Speaker 2: the Blues, or some of the stuff I put in

1359
01:10:15,880 --> 01:10:19,479
Speaker 2: an Idaho Colorado very steep box canyon type country, very

1360
01:10:19,520 --> 01:10:22,400
Speaker 2: steep with water, cold water in the bottom. You get

1361
01:10:22,439 --> 01:10:25,400
Speaker 2: down about a third of the way down that drainage

1362
01:10:26,000 --> 01:10:28,760
Speaker 2: and that cool water and some of the shade from

1363
01:10:28,840 --> 01:10:31,680
Speaker 2: big timber. At times it will never lift, right, So

1364
01:10:31,720 --> 01:10:34,599
Speaker 2: there's an inversion in the upper slopes. There's an inversion

1365
01:10:34,720 --> 01:10:37,920
Speaker 2: on the ridges and the main ridge, but sometimes that

1366
01:10:38,000 --> 01:10:41,960
Speaker 2: creek bottom and that tight drainage will never lift. That

1367
01:10:42,000 --> 01:10:44,800
Speaker 2: air will always go down the creek, and we've used

1368
01:10:44,840 --> 01:10:46,479
Speaker 2: that to help our approaches. Right, You're like, well, I

1369
01:10:46,479 --> 01:10:47,960
Speaker 2: got to get in the crick so I can do this,

1370
01:10:48,080 --> 01:10:50,439
Speaker 2: or if I get low enough on this finger ridge

1371
01:10:50,479 --> 01:10:52,800
Speaker 2: down in this base and it's going to suck, and

1372
01:10:52,800 --> 01:10:55,280
Speaker 2: you're using that in order to make your approach. So

1373
01:10:55,880 --> 01:10:59,080
Speaker 2: keep that in mind. Just because you know the thermals

1374
01:10:59,080 --> 01:11:01,479
Speaker 2: have switched, isn't necessarily mean you're gonna climb down in

1375
01:11:01,520 --> 01:11:03,280
Speaker 2: a canyon and it's gonna be up the whole day.

1376
01:11:03,320 --> 01:11:04,680
Speaker 2: You might get down and that's where you get some

1377
01:11:04,720 --> 01:11:08,120
Speaker 2: swirling where you're kind of on that area of you know,

1378
01:11:08,280 --> 01:11:12,640
Speaker 2: cooling creek or shade versus a heated up face. So

1379
01:11:12,760 --> 01:11:15,400
Speaker 2: keep all that in mind. But yeah, you you really can't,

1380
01:11:16,280 --> 01:11:18,040
Speaker 2: you know, set your watch to it, and you got

1381
01:11:18,080 --> 01:11:19,840
Speaker 2: to just kind of play it case by case. Day

1382
01:11:19,840 --> 01:11:22,599
Speaker 2: by day, you know, slope by slope.

1383
01:11:23,160 --> 01:11:26,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm glad you brought that part up about the

1384
01:11:25,680 --> 01:11:28,400
Speaker 1: the little creek draws and stuff. I believe they call

1385
01:11:28,439 --> 01:11:33,320
Speaker 1: that a eco thermal corridor. That's what I've been told.

1386
01:11:33,400 --> 01:11:37,639
Speaker 1: I mean, it's basically science. But another thing to consider

1387
01:11:37,840 --> 01:11:41,160
Speaker 1: is like, are you dead center? Are you square dead

1388
01:11:41,280 --> 01:11:43,160
Speaker 1: center in the middle of the better Root mountains? Are

1389
01:11:43,160 --> 01:11:45,240
Speaker 1: you in? Are you on the edge? You got it? Like,

1390
01:11:45,479 --> 01:11:48,439
Speaker 1: let's say you're in Nevada and you've got miles of

1391
01:11:48,520 --> 01:11:50,679
Speaker 1: desert and then you're right on the front range there

1392
01:11:51,200 --> 01:11:56,960
Speaker 1: the you know, the the dang it phelps what do

1393
01:11:57,000 --> 01:11:59,479
Speaker 1: you call those? The the consistent winds that blow from

1394
01:11:59,479 --> 01:12:03,880
Speaker 1: one direct Yeah, prevailing winds can really affect that too.

1395
01:12:05,400 --> 01:12:06,880
Speaker 1: If you're on the edge of those kind of places

1396
01:12:06,920 --> 01:12:08,599
Speaker 1: you go, you have a whole bunch of flat area,

1397
01:12:08,920 --> 01:12:11,439
Speaker 1: and then you're right on that front range somewhere, the

1398
01:12:11,479 --> 01:12:15,240
Speaker 1: prevailing winds are gonna perhaps change all of that.

1399
01:12:15,320 --> 01:12:19,000
Speaker 2: Yep as well, And keep in mind, the steeper typically

1400
01:12:19,000 --> 01:12:21,360
Speaker 2: the more consistent. If you start to flatten and bowl

1401
01:12:21,400 --> 01:12:25,639
Speaker 2: things out kind of with your prevailing winds messes with everything.

1402
01:12:25,680 --> 01:12:28,519
Speaker 2: Storm systems moving in you high pressure, low pressure. From

1403
01:12:28,600 --> 01:12:31,679
Speaker 2: a more global standpoint, you back out to thirty thousand

1404
01:12:31,720 --> 01:12:34,479
Speaker 2: feet and you've got like a front moving in maybe

1405
01:12:34,520 --> 01:12:36,479
Speaker 2: west to east or north to south wherether your weather

1406
01:12:36,560 --> 01:12:39,599
Speaker 2: comes in. Like that gets really really. You add those

1407
01:12:39,760 --> 01:12:43,799
Speaker 2: moving storm systems in with your thermals, in with flatter terrain,

1408
01:12:44,320 --> 01:12:46,559
Speaker 2: and you're just That's where some of these elk love

1409
01:12:46,600 --> 01:12:48,360
Speaker 2: to live because they just like, now we got you.

1410
01:12:48,360 --> 01:12:50,920
Speaker 2: You can't you can't approach you, you can't predict it, or

1411
01:12:50,920 --> 01:12:52,519
Speaker 2: as soon as you think you got away in, you're

1412
01:12:52,560 --> 01:12:55,599
Speaker 2: gonna get you know, swirled up. So all that stuff

1413
01:12:55,600 --> 01:12:58,000
Speaker 2: will add to wind as well as thermal.

1414
01:12:58,400 --> 01:13:02,080
Speaker 1: I have this place in Idaho that every time, every

1415
01:13:02,120 --> 01:13:05,880
Speaker 1: time I've hunted it, there's always bulls. They bugle, and

1416
01:13:05,920 --> 01:13:09,080
Speaker 1: it's kind of that that rolling type country and you

1417
01:13:09,160 --> 01:13:11,639
Speaker 1: got high mountains around you. But it's kind of kind

1418
01:13:11,640 --> 01:13:14,360
Speaker 1: of this lower not really a basin but kind of,

1419
01:13:14,520 --> 01:13:17,800
Speaker 1: but this lower country there's real rolling, lots of little

1420
01:13:17,840 --> 01:13:20,880
Speaker 1: draws and crick draws and stuff, and you can have

1421
01:13:20,920 --> 01:13:23,080
Speaker 1: that win. You can sit there and be like, all right,

1422
01:13:23,280 --> 01:13:26,759
Speaker 1: I've sat here for thirty minutes and okay, the wind's

1423
01:13:26,840 --> 01:13:28,800
Speaker 1: in my favor. I got a bull screaming up here.

1424
01:13:28,960 --> 01:13:31,719
Speaker 1: I'll climb up that hillside one hundred and fifty yards

1425
01:13:31,760 --> 01:13:34,880
Speaker 1: and that bulk starts coming in and wouldn't you know it,

1426
01:13:35,160 --> 01:13:38,840
Speaker 1: the wind changes and those rolling type areas. Man, they're

1427
01:13:38,880 --> 01:13:42,120
Speaker 1: just really unpredictable, really swirly. I got to the point

1428
01:13:42,160 --> 01:13:45,120
Speaker 1: where I almost won't even go there, and I know,

1429
01:13:45,439 --> 01:13:47,240
Speaker 1: I know that I'm gonna hear a no bugle. But

1430
01:13:47,280 --> 01:13:49,000
Speaker 1: those things are as safe as they can be.

1431
01:13:49,160 --> 01:13:50,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just a time suck. They trick you into

1432
01:13:50,920 --> 01:13:54,160
Speaker 2: thinking you have a chance, and the wind disappoints every.

1433
01:13:53,960 --> 01:13:58,880
Speaker 1: Time, every time. So yeah, but well, anything way, I

1434
01:13:58,920 --> 01:14:00,559
Speaker 1: guess that can wrap things up.

1435
01:14:00,640 --> 01:14:01,879
Speaker 2: Guys and gals.

1436
01:14:02,640 --> 01:14:04,600
Speaker 1: If you have any other questions, if you want to

1437
01:14:04,640 --> 01:14:07,360
Speaker 1: send them in as an email to see t D

1438
01:14:07,560 --> 01:14:11,639
Speaker 1: at Phelpsgamecalls dot com or again, you can send those

1439
01:14:11,720 --> 01:14:14,679
Speaker 1: to the super secret the not so super secret hotline.

1440
01:14:14,720 --> 01:14:17,640
Speaker 1: As Jason says, uh, give us a call it to

1441
01:14:17,800 --> 01:14:22,080
Speaker 1: await two one nine seven seven zero one.

1442
01:14:22,760 --> 01:14:26,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, thanks for thanks for having me on. Yeah,

1443
01:14:26,760 --> 01:14:28,800
Speaker 2: I love these questions. They're good, and like I said,

1444
01:14:28,800 --> 01:14:29,760
Speaker 2: I think a lot of times we can go a

1445
01:14:29,800 --> 01:14:32,360
Speaker 2: lot deeper on on them. So yeah, keep sending them

1446
01:14:32,360 --> 01:14:35,200
Speaker 2: in or hit us up on social media. We're also

1447
01:14:35,240 --> 01:14:37,800
Speaker 2: gonna start doing I'm gonna start posting guests ahead of

1448
01:14:37,840 --> 01:14:39,880
Speaker 2: time so we can really you know, we're getting some

1449
01:14:39,880 --> 01:14:41,760
Speaker 2: really good questions out of that. So look for, you know,

1450
01:14:41,840 --> 01:14:45,120
Speaker 2: social posts for for questions that we want to throw

1451
01:14:45,160 --> 01:14:46,160
Speaker 2: at specific guests.

1452
01:14:46,520 --> 01:14:48,680
Speaker 1: Hey, and I was gonna say, if you guys like

1453
01:14:48,800 --> 01:14:51,519
Speaker 1: hunting stories, if you love hunting stories, let us know.

1454
01:14:51,960 --> 01:14:54,000
Speaker 1: You know, I'm kind of thinking about maybe just spinning

1455
01:14:54,040 --> 01:14:56,000
Speaker 1: some yarns and tell you to tell you about some

1456
01:14:56,080 --> 01:14:58,960
Speaker 1: different hunting stories that I've experienced in my life and

1457
01:14:59,240 --> 01:15:02,240
Speaker 1: less maybe there'll be some little takeaways and stuff. But

1458
01:15:02,520 --> 01:15:05,120
Speaker 1: in another thing, if you like hunting stories, check out

1459
01:15:05,120 --> 01:15:07,880
Speaker 1: the Bear Grease podcast and listen to Brent Reeves on

1460
01:15:07,920 --> 01:15:12,400
Speaker 1: This Country Life. Brent is a natural storyteller and he

1461
01:15:12,479 --> 01:15:15,519
Speaker 1: will tell you stories that make it chuckle a little bit.

1462
01:15:15,600 --> 01:15:18,360
Speaker 1: But anyway, in case you guys aren't listening to that

1463
01:15:18,360 --> 01:15:20,920
Speaker 1: that podcast, check it out. Brent Reeves does a great

1464
01:15:21,000 --> 01:15:22,200
Speaker 1: job on This Country Life.

1465
01:15:22,400 --> 01:15:24,640
Speaker 2: Awesome guy, great storyteller. Yeah, I wish I had a

1466
01:15:24,680 --> 01:15:26,320
Speaker 2: little bit of that. What are we gonna call it

1467
01:15:26,320 --> 01:15:28,560
Speaker 2: a Southern charm or Southern storytelling?

1468
01:15:28,720 --> 01:15:32,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's got that Southern drawl and he's he's got

1469
01:15:32,000 --> 01:15:35,000
Speaker 1: so much little wit built into into his story. It's like, man,

1470
01:15:35,360 --> 01:15:37,639
Speaker 1: I'm jealous. I wish I had that. I sound more

1471
01:15:37,680 --> 01:15:39,320
Speaker 1: like a used car salesman, and I start trying to

1472
01:15:39,360 --> 01:15:42,640
Speaker 1: get you know, polite and storytelling I might have. I

1473
01:15:42,640 --> 01:15:45,040
Speaker 1: can do a pretty good Southern accent. Maybe I'll switch

1474
01:15:45,040 --> 01:15:45,519
Speaker 1: it up for that.

1475
01:15:45,840 --> 01:15:48,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, my story is like there I was, there he was.

1476
01:15:49,000 --> 01:15:54,240
Speaker 2: But that's how good a storytelling? But I recognize it.

1477
01:15:54,280 --> 01:15:56,000
Speaker 2: That's important, knowing that I'm not a good.

1478
01:15:55,840 --> 01:15:58,920
Speaker 1: Story Yeah, well that's good. That's self awareness. Some of

1479
01:15:59,000 --> 01:16:22,160
Speaker 1: us don't have that. All right, Thanks everybody,