Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to book a f Daily
Speaker 1: with Meet your Girl Danielle Moody. Recording from the Brooklyn Bunker. Folks.
Speaker 1: You know, yesterday I found myself really just I guess
Speaker 1: swimming in nostalgia would be the phrase that I will use.
Speaker 1: And it was because for the first time in five years,
Speaker 1: President Obama, former President Obama, went to the White House.
Speaker 1: And you know, I will tell you that for me,
Speaker 1: the image, the last image that we saw of the
Speaker 1: Obama's leaving the White House in twenty seventeen after the
Speaker 1: inauguration of Satan to become President of the United States,
Speaker 1: was a devastating day. And it was devastating I think
Speaker 1: for you know, tens of millions, if not hundreds of
Speaker 1: millions of Americans. Right the idea that we could have
Speaker 1: experienced the historic administration eight year term of Barack Obama
Speaker 1: to then hand the keys of America to a adamant,
Speaker 1: vocal white supremast islamophobe, homophobe, transphobe, misogynist, criminal piece of
Speaker 1: shit is what was daunting. And I think that we
Speaker 1: spent you know, following that moment of just disbelief. I
Speaker 1: think it's taken the last five years for us to
Speaker 1: really wrap our minds around what this country has been
Speaker 1: through and what Republicans have taken this country through. And
Speaker 1: what I find so troubling is that it, to me,
Speaker 1: is just so fucking obvious how dangerous the Republican Party
Speaker 1: has become. It is so obvious to me that we
Speaker 1: are dealing with an unhinged cult that has no moral fiber,
Speaker 1: that has no value set, that is pretty much using
Speaker 1: guerrilla style political warfare in order to stake their claim
Speaker 1: to power, that they have no thoughts on relinquishing, whether
Speaker 1: it's through election or not. And when I saw Obama,
Speaker 1: you know, standing at the podium in the White House,
Speaker 1: and you know, he was there to discuss the twe
Speaker 1: your anniversary of the Affordable Care Act, and to remind
Speaker 1: Americans that when the Affordable Care Act, Obamacare was rolled out,
Speaker 1: that there was such opposition because Republicans who were in
Speaker 1: the pockets of big farm as are many Democrats, namely
Speaker 1: Kirsten Cinema, who sits in the Senate, but remind you
Speaker 1: she wasn't there at that time, but you know, to
Speaker 1: think about the fact that there was such grave opposition
Speaker 1: to providing Americans with quality healthcare to set up a
Speaker 1: situation where insurance companies, right, we're not able to squeeze
Speaker 1: Americans and American families into a position where they would
Speaker 1: have to make a choice between getting healthcare and I'm
Speaker 1: putting food on their table. And I know that we
Speaker 1: say these things, and for a lot of folks it
Speaker 1: just sounds like a talking point, but it really isn't. Right.
Speaker 1: Like people, more people than not in this country have
Speaker 1: gone fucking bankrupt because of medical bills. That if you
Speaker 1: do not have health insurance and something happens to you,
Speaker 1: or you have shitty health insurance and something happens to
Speaker 1: you and you end up in the hospital for an
Speaker 1: indiscriminate amount of time, you are fucked, right will you
Speaker 1: may have wished that whatever illness, whatever accident took you
Speaker 1: in there, took you all the way the fuck out
Speaker 1: by the time that you come out, and you see
Speaker 1: that now you're swimming in six figure debt. Right. So,
Speaker 1: it was a real triumph for America to start slowly
Speaker 1: to implement this imperfect policy of the ACA, to begin
Speaker 1: to do what other industrialized nations like Canada, our neighbor
Speaker 1: above us, has been doing for decades, Right, I had
Speaker 1: a conversation recently with a friend of mine who had
Speaker 1: had lived in Canada for several years, had lived and
Speaker 1: had worked in Canada, and she said it was mind
Speaker 1: blowing that they covered everything. She goes, even acupuncture. She goes,
Speaker 1: I was able to go to acupuncture, to get massages,
Speaker 1: all of this preventative care. She goes, Yes, those things
Speaker 1: were more expensive, but it was because the government was
Speaker 1: paying for them. And like you being able to get
Speaker 1: eight massages a year, right, and sages are not you know,
Speaker 1: we of course in the United States, that's something that
Speaker 1: we see as a luxury. But to get that kind
Speaker 1: of body work done, to work and allow your blood
Speaker 1: to flow better, to loosen your muscles, to move your ligaments,
Speaker 1: to stretch your body out right, to create more fluidity,
Speaker 1: more nimbleness, prevents a lot of serious injury, prevents the
Speaker 1: need for there to be knee surgeries and hip replacements
Speaker 1: and all of these things. So it isn't just oh
Speaker 1: my god, because you know what Republicans would say, Oh
Speaker 1: my god, we're going to pay for people to go
Speaker 1: to the SPA, because God forbid, our tax dollars go
Speaker 1: to preventative care. So that we don't spend our last
Speaker 1: days and our last dollars inside of a fucking hospital,
Speaker 1: right being held hostage, buy health insurance or medicaid. Right,
Speaker 1: So I think that, and I say medicaid because let
Speaker 1: me tell you something, the amount of paperwork that goes
Speaker 1: into being able to get basic things covered in the
Speaker 1: United States, like you need to have some type of
Speaker 1: law degree and medical degree and accounting degree in order
Speaker 1: to be able to understand, whereas in places like Canada,
Speaker 1: this shit is just basic, right, Like everyone has healthcare,
Speaker 1: everyone has a doctor, Like their medical bills are non
Speaker 1: existent there, you know, like you see all of the benefits.
Speaker 1: Healthcare is actually not even a health issue. It is
Speaker 1: an economic imperative. And that's what former President Obama was
Speaker 1: saying yesterday at the White House before he passed the
Speaker 1: mic over to Biden. But for me, I just want
Speaker 1: to go back to the nostalgia for a moment, because
Speaker 1: there is something about Barack Obama that is so endearing, charismatic,
Speaker 1: the ability to put people at ease. You know what's
Speaker 1: funny is that I talk to you often, you all
Speaker 1: often about disease, right, and the fact that you know
Speaker 1: where does dis ease come from. It comes from not
Speaker 1: being at ease, right, dis ease, right, misaligned right, not
Speaker 1: at ease in agitation in a state. Right that is
Speaker 1: the opposite of ease. And I don't want it to
Speaker 1: be lost on people. But the ability that Obama had,
Speaker 1: the skills that he has to be able to orerate
Speaker 1: in such a casual way that is both relaxing because
Speaker 1: you feel like somebody with sense and charisma and a
Speaker 1: personality and strategy and thoughtfulness is at the helm. So
Speaker 1: as I was sitting at my kitchen table watching the
Speaker 1: TV behind me, I found myself being nostalgic for the
Speaker 1: feeling that he was conjuring this feeling of ease in
Speaker 1: watching the news that I haven't felt in twelve fucking years.
Speaker 1: And that's what dawned on me, right, Like I haven't
Speaker 1: and I don't know if we have as a nation
Speaker 1: felt at ease. And mind you, Obama came into office
Speaker 1: off of like the rise of the tea party, the
Speaker 1: collapse of the housing market, riot, coming off of the
Speaker 1: Internet bubble burst. Like there was so much at play
Speaker 1: when Obama came into office, and so it's not as
Speaker 1: if we were in rosy times, but they are nothing
Speaker 1: incompared to the catastrophe, to the catastrophic, like consistent catastrophic
Speaker 1: events that we have been dealing with over the past
Speaker 1: five fucking years. So I sit here and I was
Speaker 1: just like, man, they really need to deploy this man more,
Speaker 1: right like, because it hearkens back two better times and
Speaker 1: not the quote unquote better times that the Republicans are
Speaker 1: trying to harken people back to when white people were
Speaker 1: to be feared and were the authority, and men were
Speaker 1: the authority in every single place, and so you needed
Speaker 1: to step off sidewalks and watch what you said for
Speaker 1: fear of retribution by the white CIS male authorities. And
Speaker 1: so it is. It's not that going back to that
Speaker 1: time make America great again. But I'm like, make America
Speaker 1: fucking sane again, make America at ease again. Make me
Speaker 1: want to believe that this country is filled with possibilities
Speaker 1: instead of problems. The way that I feel right now
Speaker 1: when I'm watching these rockets haul off into space and
Speaker 1: I'm saying, how do I hitch a ride? Do you
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, Because that's how I'm feeling, not
Speaker 1: only about this country, but about the planet. You had
Speaker 1: general General Millie sit before Congress this week as well
Speaker 1: to speak on the war in Ukraine. And this comes
Speaker 1: off comes off of what we have seen in Bucha
Speaker 1: and what President Zelinski said to the UN that Butcha
Speaker 1: is just the beginning, right that if we think that
Speaker 1: what we are seeing and what we are hearing about
Speaker 1: rape and torture and you know, and and and people
Speaker 1: being put into camps and divided from their families, and
Speaker 1: like those that are left like this is why there
Speaker 1: has been an international another another international refugee crisis with
Speaker 1: up to three and a half or more than at
Speaker 1: this point three and a half million people fleeing the
Speaker 1: Ukraine because of the ship that we just saw in Butcha.
Speaker 1: So you see this, General Millie says before Congress, I
Speaker 1: have never seen in my four decades of service a
Speaker 1: time when when the world has been this dangerous, that
Speaker 1: we are looking at a threat to Europe that we
Speaker 1: have not seen on levels since World War Two. And
Speaker 1: He's like, and let us be clear that I'm not
Speaker 1: just talking about the threats that Europe can sustain. I'm
Speaker 1: talking about the fact that what is happening is a
Speaker 1: threat to the United States and national security. So then
Speaker 1: I think to myself self, if we are living in
Speaker 1: nuclear times, okay, if we are living in nuclear times,
Speaker 1: you have the general saying that the world has never
Speaker 1: been this unstable since World War Two, But you have
Speaker 1: an entire American news outlet, Fox News that has hosts
Speaker 1: that are promoting Kremlin talking points and telling us, don't
Speaker 1: believe your lying eyes, but believe the lion ass words
Speaker 1: that are coming out of my mouth, and that these
Speaker 1: are doctored videos and they're fake, even though our own
Speaker 1: satellites and satellites around the world are like, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: this is not anybody's doctored anything. This is not staged.
Speaker 1: This is Russian war crimes. Right. If we all know
Speaker 1: this to be true, what are we going to do
Speaker 1: about it? Meaning that the world is once again coming
Speaker 1: together this week to decide on more sanctions, more economic sensions,
Speaker 1: shutting down any use by any Russians, event the American
Speaker 1: dollars that they are holding anywhere, We are shutting down
Speaker 1: their ability to trade. Right Germany, which Germans rely a
Speaker 1: lot on the wheat and the oil that comes from Russia,
Speaker 1: and they're getting ready to sanction that. No new businesses,
Speaker 1: no new friends like you know they're drake up in
Speaker 1: this bitch. And so what I'm saying is de escalation
Speaker 1: does not look like it is happening. And while we
Speaker 1: can continue now forty plus days into this war where
Speaker 1: we have all in forty days, if you look at
Speaker 1: a split screen picture of Zelinsky in February, and you
Speaker 1: look at a picture of him now, it looks like
Speaker 1: these last forty days look like forty years on this
Speaker 1: man's face. And so I say that not as like
Speaker 1: a joke or a plug, but the devastation that has
Speaker 1: already been caused is sees no sign of de escalating.
Speaker 1: What it seems as if is if Russian aggression and
Speaker 1: criminality is growing, what is the world going to do
Speaker 1: about it? Again? Are we just trying to avoid the
Speaker 1: inevitable Putin is not going to stop? And when Biden
Speaker 1: said a couple of weeks ago, when the White House
Speaker 1: wanted to walk back what he said, when they should
Speaker 1: have just fucking stood by it, is this motherfucker needs
Speaker 1: to be removed. And I'm not just talking about from office.
Speaker 1: And if the world knows that, and world leaders know that,
Speaker 1: are we waiting for the execution of six millions of
Speaker 1: six million. Is that the number right before the world
Speaker 1: decides to get involved in a ward that is inevitable
Speaker 1: that they are going to have to get involved in
Speaker 1: in order to secure Europe and minimize the threats towards
Speaker 1: the United States? Like, what is the game that we're
Speaker 1: playing right now? That's honestly the question that I have
Speaker 1: because there's no way that you watch this ship and
Speaker 1: you say to yourself, oh, yeah, we'll get them in court.
Speaker 1: Because I'm saying, how many these are not just corpses,
Speaker 1: These are not just like, these are people's loved ones.
Speaker 1: These are grandmothers and friends and cousins and five others
Speaker 1: and sisters that are being slaughtered coming from the store
Speaker 1: with groceries, being tortured and raped. So how do we
Speaker 1: sit back for How long do we sit back and
Speaker 1: take no military action when in fact, all we do
Speaker 1: it's talk talk, talk, talk about our big, bad military,
Speaker 1: if it's so big and bad, and we're all about
Speaker 1: protecting democracy except for when it's under threat in our
Speaker 1: own country and we know that eventually we're going to
Speaker 1: have to get involved. How many lives are we willing
Speaker 1: to watch be stolen before action is actually taken? This
Speaker 1: is the thing that I want to understand, and I
Speaker 1: also want to understand why this admin ministration, excuse me,
Speaker 1: this administration refuses to connect the dots between what is
Speaker 1: happening in Ukraine at the hands of Putin and what
Speaker 1: Republicans want to happen in the United States. Why it
Speaker 1: is so difficult not to also put a target on
Speaker 1: the back of the Tucker Carlson's of the world and
Speaker 1: the Fox News is and how they are an extension
Speaker 1: and an arm of the Kremlin and Putin in the
Speaker 1: United States that he never had before, but thanks to
Speaker 1: Donald Trump and Trumpism, he found his way in after
Speaker 1: motherfucking decades. So how do we not tie these things
Speaker 1: together to create the campaign that is necessary to wage
Speaker 1: against Republicans so that we don't lose in mid terms?
Speaker 1: Because here's what I'm saying, folks, And I said this
Speaker 1: on Twitter yesterday, and I've said it on TikTok, and
Speaker 1: I'll continue to say it until I'm blue in the face.
Speaker 1: These are not a normal election times. We are not
Speaker 1: headed into normal campaign times. We are dealing with an
Speaker 1: unhinged white supremacist cult that has told us that when
Speaker 1: they take power, they are going to impeach the current
Speaker 1: president of the United States on whatever fucking grounds that
Speaker 1: they make up, and then they are going after their
Speaker 1: political enemies, from Hillary Clinton to Barack Obama and anyone
Speaker 1: that gets in their way, they will lock them up
Speaker 1: and throw away the key. And if you think that
Speaker 1: I am fucking kidding that, listen to the things that
Speaker 1: are coming out of the mouths of Lindsey Graham and
Speaker 1: Ted Cruz and Mitch McConnell. They are playing for fucking keeps.
Speaker 1: And if Democrats don't begin to connect the dots between
Speaker 1: what is happening abroad and what is happening here and
Speaker 1: what is happening globally, we're going to be fucked. I
Speaker 1: get into a deeper conversation about this and what it
Speaker 1: is that we see as the Republican strategy and what
Speaker 1: it is that Democrats can do with the time that
Speaker 1: we have left to combat it with my friend, our
Speaker 1: in house doctor, doctor Jonathan Metzo. That conversation is coming
Speaker 1: up next, folks. As always, you know that when it
Speaker 1: is Wednesday, we have one man, one doctor that is
Speaker 1: in the chair with us on Will Gay f and
Speaker 1: that is doctor Jonathan Metsol, our in house doctor and
Speaker 1: the author of Dying of Whiteness Jonathan Really interesting news
Speaker 1: this week to open us up is it is a
Speaker 1: twelve year anniversary of the Affordable Care Act and for
Speaker 1: the first time in five years, President Obama. Former President
Speaker 1: Obama found himself at the White House House with President
Speaker 1: Biden and with Vice President Kamala Harris to talk about
Speaker 1: the Affordable Care Act and that when he left office,
Speaker 1: twenty million people had been able to get insurance that
Speaker 1: had not been able to get insurance before. That number
Speaker 1: is now up to thirty million Americans. He also made
Speaker 1: mention of the fact that over the time that the
Speaker 1: Affordable Care Act was being pushed, that there was absolute
Speaker 1: Republican opposition. Republicans tried and failed over sixty times to
Speaker 1: get rid of Obamacare. They did nothing while they had
Speaker 1: the White House under Donald Trump to make any gains
Speaker 1: or to try and repeal Obamacare. What are your thoughts,
Speaker 1: particularly after if we had not had Obamacare. I'll ask
Speaker 1: this first, if we had not had Obamacare, what would
Speaker 1: have been the ramifications of that during a global health pandemic?
Speaker 1: Because I think that we don't talk enough, and particularly
Speaker 1: at a time when Democrats need to really be looking
Speaker 1: for wins and looking for conversation to offer with regard
Speaker 1: to what they have done. Where do you think we
Speaker 1: would have been as a country in twenty twenty till
Speaker 1: now if Obama Care hadn't of past and we were
Speaker 1: met with COVID nineteen. Well, I think it's important to
Speaker 1: note that actually the Trump administration tried to destroy the
Speaker 1: Affordable Cact three months into the pandemic, and so that's
Speaker 1: not a hypothetical question. The Trump administration filed a brief
Speaker 1: for a case in June twenty twenty that basically, just
Speaker 1: to quote that brief, the entire Affordable CARECT must fall.
Speaker 1: So they tried to destroy the Affordable COCT within four
Speaker 1: or five months of the pandemic starting. And the other
Speaker 1: thing that the Trump administration did was they didn't expand
Speaker 1: medicaid in Red states as the pandemic really hit. And
Speaker 1: so that's that's not a hypothetical scenario. Really. I guess
Speaker 1: the flip side question I ask is how much better
Speaker 1: shape would we have been if we would have expanded
Speaker 1: medicaid across the entire country when the pandemic hit? And
Speaker 1: I can tell you we'd been in much better shape
Speaker 1: than we are when we are now, because it's not
Speaker 1: just about medical treatment and access to medicine. The Affordable
Speaker 1: Care Act also helps with medical bankruptcies, prescription drug costs,
Speaker 1: preventative care, public health, all these other factors. And so
Speaker 1: you know, I did a piece and I'll tweet it
Speaker 1: out after we have this conversation. When when Trump was
Speaker 1: trying to kill the ACA in June twenty twenty, I
Speaker 1: wrote a piece for US News and what I said is,
Speaker 1: just look at the rate of uninsurance before the Affordable
Speaker 1: Care Act for non white Americans. And the data was incredible,
Speaker 1: like the number of Latino African American and particularly a
Speaker 1: bi Americans, like it's unimaginable now because of the Affordable Coact,
Speaker 1: that there were like forty percent of entire demographic populations
Speaker 1: that didn't have health insurance at the time. And so
Speaker 1: what the Affordable Charact did first and foremost was it
Speaker 1: cut the rate of uninsurance in half or more for
Speaker 1: minoritized populations and low income populations, and particularly in Blue states.
Speaker 1: And so really the Affordable Coact has been on one
Speaker 1: hand of resounding success if you look at Blue states,
Speaker 1: but it's also really only half the story because really
Speaker 1: for a healthcare network to work, it's got to cover everybody,
Speaker 1: and the GOP never let that happen, you know, and
Speaker 1: talk to us, Jonathan two, Because again I find that
Speaker 1: the pushback that Democrats tried, I guess at the campaign
Speaker 1: that Democrats tried to age as a pushback to Republicans
Speaker 1: inventing stories like death panels, inventing stories you know that
Speaker 1: that essentially were the basis of part of your book, right,
Speaker 1: which is that white people were willing to not get
Speaker 1: themselves healthcare so long as like the black and brown
Speaker 1: people down the street, we're not going to be able
Speaker 1: to get healthcare that they were. I mean, this is
Speaker 1: this is the the was the idea around you know,
Speaker 1: integrating public swimming pools, right, it's um, we would rather
Speaker 1: our kids not swim and drain the pools that all
Speaker 1: of our all of our country clubs and in all
Speaker 1: of our neighborhoods as opposed to integrating them. And so
Speaker 1: can you talk a bit about how the Republicans were
Speaker 1: able like what were some of the messaging, what was
Speaker 1: some of the messagings that they continue to use that
Speaker 1: get people to vote against their own healthcare even during
Speaker 1: a fucking pandemic. Yeah, well they're There are two parts
Speaker 1: answers to that. Of course, my entire book was about
Speaker 1: the It was about the second part of that question,
Speaker 1: which is, in other words, if you're if you're a
Speaker 1: Republican strategist in the South, you all you have to
Speaker 1: say are three things. Um, this is government intrusion number one.
Speaker 1: This is um, this is an assault on your own
Speaker 1: freedoms and liberties number two. And black people are going
Speaker 1: to cut in front of you inline and take resources
Speaker 1: that are meant for you. You You say those three things
Speaker 1: and you get people to not wear pants basically, I mean,
Speaker 1: you just say you know it. Yes. And so that's
Speaker 1: what we saw when we were doing research on the
Speaker 1: Affordable character on the ground at the time, at the
Speaker 1: time that it rolled out. The first couple of months,
Speaker 1: everybody was for it. I mean, we interviewed all these
Speaker 1: conservatives who were like, man, I'm finally getting some help
Speaker 1: paying for prescription drugs and stuff like that. Like people
Speaker 1: were really for it, and then they started saying those
Speaker 1: three things. You remember, when ACA rolled out, there was
Speaker 1: the Obama African which doctor posters and stuff like that,
Speaker 1: and they'd creeping Uncle Sam with a speculum in the room,
Speaker 1: you know, doing a guyo exam on your wife and
Speaker 1: all these kind of things. And within three months, people
Speaker 1: who were supporting it, we just watched it happened like
Speaker 1: a SlowMo car wreck, you know. Um, we watched people
Speaker 1: turn and say, oh my god, this is government intrusion
Speaker 1: into my life and it's taking away freedoms and liberties.
Speaker 1: And I think black people are going to come in
Speaker 1: front of me in line and take resources that are
Speaker 1: meant for me. Like it's it's just like it's like
Speaker 1: catnip in a way. And so it was just weird
Speaker 1: to watch to watch that happen. Right, People supported it
Speaker 1: and then they were told not to and then they didn't.
Speaker 1: So that's part of it. But the flip side, of course,
Speaker 1: is the other thing we always talk about here, which
Speaker 1: is that Democrats don't know the Democrats know how to
Speaker 1: play politics, right, and so just to say hey, this
Speaker 1: is great, Look we're helping you all those kind of things,
Speaker 1: feel good, come by all that great, you know, Biden
Speaker 1: Obama reunion tour great. But I mean if we were Republicans,
Speaker 1: we would be turning this and it's on its head
Speaker 1: right now, you know, Republicans want to kill your They
Speaker 1: want to kill your fucking grandmother, you know, you know,
Speaker 1: like the Republicans are trying to kill your grandmother, or
Speaker 1: the Republicans are trying to kill white people by taking
Speaker 1: away the affordable I like, you know, play some politics
Speaker 1: with this stuff. Don't just message the field good stuff,
Speaker 1: um and so to development. But Jonathan, I want to
Speaker 1: I want to go to I want to go back
Speaker 1: to the three points that you laid out, because this
Speaker 1: is what Republicans apply to every issue, all right, right,
Speaker 1: so it's so so let's let's just reiterate it again.
Speaker 1: You said first, right, all Republican strategies have to do
Speaker 1: is say what say that this is going to impose
Speaker 1: on your liberty? Number Number one is um, this is
Speaker 1: government intrusion in government intrusion into your life, big government,
Speaker 1: and they did that in the Affordable Care Act. They
Speaker 1: literally had Uncle Sam with a speculum m who and
Speaker 1: Uncle Sam looked really evil. So it was the government
Speaker 1: was so intrusive that it was doing a gynecologic exam
Speaker 1: on your wife. Like that's how that's how, that's how crass.
Speaker 1: The advertisements were at the beginning of your number Number two.
Speaker 1: So number one is the government at tuition Number two
Speaker 1: is the government is then impinging on your freedoms and liberties,
Speaker 1: your freedom to be an individual choice, be a libertarian,
Speaker 1: you know that kind of thing. And then number three,
Speaker 1: of course, is the racial component, which is, these are
Speaker 1: resources that shouldn't be going to you, but instead they're
Speaker 1: going to Mexicans who are pouring over the border and
Speaker 1: stuff like that. And so that's a component of everything.
Speaker 1: That's really a component of everything. And the thing is
Speaker 1: it ties into deep anxieties, like it's not just let
Speaker 1: me just be clear, it's not just the racism gene.
Speaker 1: It is in part, but it's also but it's all
Speaker 1: of those things. It's all of those three things combined.
Speaker 1: I mean, you just nailed the three things that Republicans
Speaker 1: will apply. They'll apply it to abortion, they'll apply it
Speaker 1: to help they'll apply it to general healthcare. They'll apply
Speaker 1: it to voting, they'll apply it to why your taxes
Speaker 1: can't be lowered, they'll apply it to pharmacis. I mean,
Speaker 1: this is it's like, oh, how do we fight back? Well,
Speaker 1: what is the response on each of those three points
Speaker 1: that Democrats need to make? Just let's just use healthcare.
Speaker 1: But if these are the same points that are being
Speaker 1: used to and applied in every single case, then why
Speaker 1: is it so goddamn hard for Democrats to say, these
Speaker 1: are the three things that we need to come up
Speaker 1: with a response to. It's reigning in Nashville today, So
Speaker 1: I feel like swearing for some reason. So I'll just say, like,
Speaker 1: we need to go on the fucking offensive, like we
Speaker 1: played defense every every damn time. And that's the issue
Speaker 1: is we don't we were playing defense all the time.
Speaker 1: So we wait for them to make the three points
Speaker 1: and then we respond to the three points with reason
Speaker 1: and stuff like that, like go on the offensive. Right,
Speaker 1: So I think if we would ever frame the issue
Speaker 1: in advance of having to respond to those three points,
Speaker 1: we'd be in much better shape. I mean again, the
Speaker 1: Affordable Cact is a perfect example. Um, you know, without healthcare,
Speaker 1: the GOP is killing your grandmother, or the GOP hates
Speaker 1: white people because it's denying them help, you know, something
Speaker 1: like like just craft craft your own narrative that puts
Speaker 1: them on the defensive and forces them to answer to
Speaker 1: their own base. We never do that. We only appeal
Speaker 1: to people's common sense and then we wait and play
Speaker 1: defense and so um and so I wish we could
Speaker 1: take the affordable Cactus a perfect example. Like I watched
Speaker 1: this happen where we put out the thing, everybody got healthcare,
Speaker 1: people were happy, and then we assume people were gonna
Speaker 1: you remember this from the time, right, Everybody's like, well,
Speaker 1: the minute people get a benefit, they're never going to
Speaker 1: give it up, like they like it, like Medicare or Medicaid, right,
Speaker 1: And I'm like, it's much hardway from people, right right, Well,
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, that that's true, except that you also,
Speaker 1: I mean that was true for Medicare and Medicaid and
Speaker 1: know your passport and your you know, um whatever kind
Speaker 1: of crap ways to do in the fifties. But now
Speaker 1: like that doesn't it doesn't work that way. You also
Speaker 1: have to craft the narrative now. And so it's not
Speaker 1: just like people are going to see the benefit and
Speaker 1: they like it. You also have to frame that what
Speaker 1: that benefit means. Right, And So what I learned studying
Speaker 1: the Affordable Care Act is the Democrats really appealed to
Speaker 1: common sense and they thought the many people. Yeah and so,
Speaker 1: but the Republicans had a narrative, right, they had this
Speaker 1: really compelling to you know, totalizing narrative. And so I
Speaker 1: don't know, I feel like this is the twelfth anniversary
Speaker 1: of the Affordable CARECT and we should use this as
Speaker 1: an opportunity to go on the offense about the narrative,
Speaker 1: like start going on the offense knowing how the other
Speaker 1: side is going to play it, and really and really
Speaker 1: start hammering that. I mean, right now is a great
Speaker 1: time to do that. And so again, like today, I
Speaker 1: only caught a little bit of that of that, you know,
Speaker 1: I think people should rebel in the success of this
Speaker 1: program against all odds, and the Affordable Charact that was
Speaker 1: passed wasn't even as good as what they thought it
Speaker 1: could be, and it certainly isn't as good as it
Speaker 1: could be now because nobody ever let it improve. But
Speaker 1: it's still a pretty remarkable achievement. So it's important to
Speaker 1: take a victory lap about that. But in the meantime,
Speaker 1: start scaring the crap out of people that the Republicans
Speaker 1: are going to kill your grandmother and so, you know,
Speaker 1: and so I just think we need to go on
Speaker 1: the offense about this thing and create a point of
Speaker 1: making the other side go on the defense or have
Speaker 1: to answer that, and healthcare again is a perfect example
Speaker 1: of that. I mean, but like that, you know, you
Speaker 1: you make the joke about all go ahead and say
Speaker 1: that the Republicans are going to are going to kill
Speaker 1: your grandmother, but they literally said that your grandparents were
Speaker 1: up for being sacrificial lambs during COVID. Yeah. Like, I
Speaker 1: truly watch that in a Fox News clip that I
Speaker 1: thought should have been on SNL. That was just like,
Speaker 1: no grandparents would be willing to sacrifice their life for
Speaker 1: their grandkids. And somehow Republicans turned that bizarre death march
Speaker 1: into some active patriotism as opposed to wearing a fucking
Speaker 1: mask that would keep grandma and grandpa alive. All right,
Speaker 1: I mean we're swimming in f bombs today, in which
Speaker 1: I love, and so let me just say that. You know, again,
Speaker 1: I just think that we should because even with that
Speaker 1: stuff with Grandma and Grandpa, we were appealing to common
Speaker 1: sense and they were casting this narrative that then we
Speaker 1: had to respond to. So I just wish, especially because
Speaker 1: we have these things called the midterms coming up, that
Speaker 1: we start crafting some narratives that put them on the defensive.
Speaker 1: And I think, again, healthcare is a perfect example, because
Speaker 1: people actually do have the benefit in a lot of places.
Speaker 1: And so I think using that to using that to
Speaker 1: craft some aggressive marketing that actually turns this very predictable
Speaker 1: narrative on its head and makes people have to answer
Speaker 1: for it, I think would be now would be a
Speaker 1: great time to do it. I really do think that,
Speaker 1: you know, let's let's shift now with a couple of
Speaker 1: minutes that we have left to talk about the midterms, right,
Speaker 1: because last week when we were when we were chatting,
Speaker 1: we were talking about the lack of messaging, right, the
Speaker 1: lack of clarity, and we were talking about the fact
Speaker 1: that it's not enough to just say that Democrats have
Speaker 1: a big tent and so they can't figure out how
Speaker 1: to message, and it's easier to message to those that
Speaker 1: are a monolith, which it is. We know those things
Speaker 1: to be true. What I find really troubling, though, Jonathan,
Speaker 1: right now, about how even the midterms are being characterized
Speaker 1: on mainstream news is that we're headed into a normal
Speaker 1: midterm with like a normal group of Republicans, and that
Speaker 1: they're not unhinged, that they are not steeped in their
Speaker 1: value set of white supremacy, and that this is not
Speaker 1: a danger a threat to the world, given that even
Speaker 1: their national syndicate, Fox News, who right now is upholding
Speaker 1: talking points from the Kremlin about war crimes in Ukraine
Speaker 1: at the hands of Putin and Russian soldiers. What do
Speaker 1: you say about? What do you say to how we're
Speaker 1: discussing the midterms that are still a couple of months
Speaker 1: away and making it seem as if this is a
Speaker 1: normal election. You know, it's funny because think about what
Speaker 1: you've heard. The only thing any of us have heard
Speaker 1: about the midterms is that we're going to get wiped out, right,
Speaker 1: And I mean if there are a couple of ways
Speaker 1: to think about that strategy. Either that's a conscious strategy
Speaker 1: to let that narrative burn out, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: and like let it let it become so clear that
Speaker 1: we're gonna that we're gonna um lose, and then let
Speaker 1: that burnout before the midterms. That's that's one possibility. Wait,
Speaker 1: because we have short attention spans until a while down
Speaker 1: the road to rally the base, let all this stuff
Speaker 1: play out. I don't, I just it's hard for me
Speaker 1: to know right now, Like, like, what's the strategy? Honestly, Um,
Speaker 1: you know, there's a lot of people saying, now, oh,
Speaker 1: all the powers in the in the in the suburbs,
Speaker 1: like those are the main swing voters. So really you've
Speaker 1: got to start crafting messages that appeal to So, I
Speaker 1: mean basically, because of course the US elections, like there's
Speaker 1: the base, and there's the base, and then there's there's
Speaker 1: like vacillating middle, and whoever wins the middle wins the election, right,
Speaker 1: And so the assumption is, like people hate Brandon so much,
Speaker 1: or they hate what Biden's doing so much, or they
Speaker 1: hate whatever, that it's just going to be a wipeout.
Speaker 1: And of course jerrymandering also, But it's hard for me
Speaker 1: to know, and maybe you can help me here, what's
Speaker 1: the what's the democrats master strategy? Right now? I mean
Speaker 1: Democratic coalition? It feels so fragile, and I think it's
Speaker 1: not just I just feel like people really don't realize
Speaker 1: quite what's at stake with this mid term. So we
Speaker 1: need like one narrative because I do think it's viable
Speaker 1: that if it is true that the Republicans wipe out
Speaker 1: the Democrats, it seems pretty likely that they'll impeach Joe Biden, right,
Speaker 1: I mean it seems pretty likely that it seems pretty
Speaker 1: likely that there would be like a massive constitutional crisis.
Speaker 1: And I just I don't see the urgency about like
Speaker 1: the on the ground mobilization. And this isn't just mobilization
Speaker 1: about like the major things, like you know, we should
Speaker 1: be mobilizing, as we were saying last time, about you know,
Speaker 1: we need some narrative that like gets everybody riled up
Speaker 1: about the school board election and about the people who
Speaker 1: are going to control the elections, who's running for those
Speaker 1: positions and all those kind of things. You know, I
Speaker 1: just feel like, I don't know, I just I feel frustrated, honestly.
Speaker 1: You know, maybe we need our we need counter three points. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think that we need strong counterpoints to the list
Speaker 1: that you just put together. But I also think that
Speaker 1: we need a bucket of cold water dumped on the
Speaker 1: heads of the Democratic establishment as well as voters in
Speaker 1: recognizing that if Republicans do what the posters say right
Speaker 1: now that they're going to do that there is a shellacking.
Speaker 1: In the same way that Obama got completely blown out
Speaker 1: of the water in midterms, this is a different situation.
Speaker 1: We are living in a different environment, right and I
Speaker 1: think that we should have saw the warning signs back
Speaker 1: in the early two thousands with regard to how dangerous
Speaker 1: Republicans were coming, but we're becoming. But we said, like, oh,
Speaker 1: like this is normal. It was never normal for Republican
Speaker 1: Senate to hold the Supreme Court Justice hostage. It was
Speaker 1: never normal to say that you wanted to make a
Speaker 1: president a one term president. It was never normal any
Speaker 1: of the ways in which we watch President Obama be
Speaker 1: treated over those last eight years. But we wanted to
Speaker 1: once again shrug our shoulders and say that I've had
Speaker 1: everything to do with race and not everything to do
Speaker 1: with a longer strategy around race and racism. Right, and
Speaker 1: so they impeach Biden what like, and do so. And
Speaker 1: again we also have to remember, and one of my
Speaker 1: favorite memes that comes out every once in a while
Speaker 1: to remind us that all of the atrocities that we've
Speaker 1: ever talked about and see in the world were legal. Right.
Speaker 1: The genocide against Choose in you know, in the Holocaust
Speaker 1: was legal, Apartheid in South Africa was legal, colonization was legal.
Speaker 1: So being able to come in and remove Joe Biden
Speaker 1: because you don't want a Democrat to be president of
Speaker 1: the United States, and you're going to do everything that
Speaker 1: you can to mar this party because now you have power,
Speaker 1: and when they had power, they did nothing. I mean,
Speaker 1: who's going who who are we to blame right for
Speaker 1: this scenario that we're in right now? Do we just
Speaker 1: blame Republicans you think? Or do we have to blame
Speaker 1: Democrats as well? Well? I mean that's really what I
Speaker 1: was going to ask you, is like, what are the
Speaker 1: Democrats right now? In other words, are the Democrats a
Speaker 1: you know? I mean if the Democrats were like a
Speaker 1: laser focused sink, a strategy that combined a bunch of
Speaker 1: different interests and a bunch of different demographics, but how
Speaker 1: to strategy, then these mofos would never have gotten away
Speaker 1: with like like the minute they start banning books, we
Speaker 1: send ten thousand people, ten million people to to to
Speaker 1: support books. And the minute they start showing up for
Speaker 1: school board, we send ten billion people. In the minute
Speaker 1: their anti mask we are like out there in droves
Speaker 1: supporting masks and vaccines and stuff like that. But we've
Speaker 1: just taken it all lying down. And partially that is
Speaker 1: about just what we're up against, but partially it's that
Speaker 1: the Democrats, you know, I do really kind of feel,
Speaker 1: to be honest, doing a lot of on the ground
Speaker 1: research here, that there's a secret fantasy Centrists feel like
Speaker 1: the Progressives are going to get wiped out. Progressives feel
Speaker 1: like if we get beaten bad enough, the Centrists are
Speaker 1: going to get wiped out. So there's like a fracture
Speaker 1: within the Democrats that I think is very dangerous. And
Speaker 1: I say that because you know, my friend Jason Stanley,
Speaker 1: his work is his work about fascism, talks about the
Speaker 1: biggest thing that gives rise to fascism is a fractured resistance, right,
Speaker 1: and so, and that's what kind of what we're seeing
Speaker 1: is that the Democrats don't have The Democrats are not
Speaker 1: going the same way down the river in a certain
Speaker 1: kind of way. And so, you know, I think again
Speaker 1: there's a fantasy that, oh, the Centrists are going to
Speaker 1: get exposed once and for all, and the Progressives can
Speaker 1: take over and we get have Medicare for all. But
Speaker 1: it ain't going to work that way, you know. So
Speaker 1: I think the Democrats really need a kind of big
Speaker 1: ten approach right now, and and and at least right
Speaker 1: at this moment. I mean, they had it when they
Speaker 1: elected Biden honestly, but then it all fell apart the
Speaker 1: minute the minute the election was over. I think you
Speaker 1: got to figure out how to get that back. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, this is this is where we are, and
Speaker 1: I and I just I want to remind people that
Speaker 1: we are not living in normal times. And I think
Speaker 1: that the what I get really frustrated at is that
Speaker 1: the purpose I always felt that the media had wasn't
Speaker 1: just to you know, have wonderful ratings and bring in,
Speaker 1: you know, billions of dollars that it was actually supposed
Speaker 1: to at least the news anyway, was supposed to educate
Speaker 1: the masses to the issues at hand and to the
Speaker 1: risks that we are, that the danger zones that we
Speaker 1: are in. Um, right now, we just have folks looking
Speaker 1: at the Kremlin and wagging their finger about Russian State
Speaker 1: TV and saying nothing about how they are influencing our
Speaker 1: our body politic right now. Well, Jonathan, as always, we
Speaker 1: appreciate your insights, and we'll continue to discuss this as
Speaker 1: we get closer and closer to midterms and see where
Speaker 1: we land. I mean, somehow I feel like we're gonna
Speaker 1: have no shortage of material. So yeah, there's that everybody
Speaker 1: hanging there as always dear friends. Power to the people
Speaker 1: and to all the people. Power, Get woke and stay
Speaker 1: woke as fuck.