1 00:00:00,360 --> 00:00:02,520 Speaker 1: Welcome to the newest edition of the Giants Hutle podcast, 2 00:00:02,600 --> 00:00:04,520 Speaker 1: brought to you by Citizens, the Official Bank of the 3 00:00:04,519 --> 00:00:07,320 Speaker 1: New York Giants. Well, we already gave you two huddles 4 00:00:07,360 --> 00:00:09,480 Speaker 1: this week, including the Rapid Reaction, but we thought it 5 00:00:09,480 --> 00:00:12,240 Speaker 1: would be fun to give you a third. Our rotation 6 00:00:12,360 --> 00:00:14,320 Speaker 1: for most of this offseason will be two a week. 7 00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:16,400 Speaker 1: We'll get you three when we get to some busier 8 00:00:16,440 --> 00:00:20,040 Speaker 1: periods here. But we did one final Giants Hangout podcast 9 00:00:20,239 --> 00:00:21,760 Speaker 1: of the season, and go check that out. 10 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:22,000 Speaker 2: Folks. 11 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:24,480 Speaker 1: Search for the Giants hanging Out on your favorite podcast platform, 12 00:00:24,760 --> 00:00:27,440 Speaker 1: find on the Giants moll Blap, or go to Giants 13 00:00:27,480 --> 00:00:31,200 Speaker 1: dot com slash podcast. Our quartet had a lot big 14 00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:33,400 Speaker 1: conversation about what the Giants have done in terms of 15 00:00:33,400 --> 00:00:36,199 Speaker 1: their coaching staff and what the offseason might mean for 16 00:00:36,240 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 1: this team moving forward. 17 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:39,400 Speaker 2: So let's check it out. 18 00:00:39,440 --> 00:00:41,159 Speaker 1: The Giants Huddle is brought to you by Citizens, the 19 00:00:41,159 --> 00:00:43,160 Speaker 1: Official Bank of the Giants. From game day to everyday, 20 00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:45,720 Speaker 1: Citizens has made ready for Giants fans with insights, guidance, 21 00:00:45,720 --> 00:00:48,840 Speaker 1: and solutions. Learn more at Citizens bank dot com. Without 22 00:00:48,920 --> 00:00:52,640 Speaker 1: further ado, here's Lance Metal Ross Salisburg, Howard Cross and 23 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:53,400 Speaker 1: Matt Sietek. 24 00:00:54,080 --> 00:00:57,080 Speaker 3: Welcome to the latest edition of the Giants Hangout Podcast, 25 00:00:57,200 --> 00:01:01,040 Speaker 3: presented by Crestron, a proud partner of the New York Giants. 26 00:01:01,080 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 3: This being the final version of the regular season, we 27 00:01:04,440 --> 00:01:06,200 Speaker 3: had to wait a few days because a lot has 28 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:09,840 Speaker 3: happened since the final game against the Philadelphia Eagles. We 29 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:12,880 Speaker 3: had Joe Shane and Brian Dables press conference and a 30 00:01:12,920 --> 00:01:15,200 Speaker 3: lot of movement on the coaching front, and that's why 31 00:01:15,200 --> 00:01:17,720 Speaker 3: we're going to focus on three themes as we always do, 32 00:01:17,840 --> 00:01:20,040 Speaker 3: but not so much on the X as it Oh's 33 00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:22,480 Speaker 3: instead what some of the moves of the last few 34 00:01:22,520 --> 00:01:26,040 Speaker 3: days means for the Giants this offseason, coaching changes, what 35 00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:28,520 Speaker 3: that means for the outlook of the team as well 36 00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:32,119 Speaker 3: as the quarterback outlook. Lance Meadow, Russ Salzburg, Howard Cross, 37 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:35,000 Speaker 3: and Matt Sytek of Giants dot Com joins us as 38 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:38,119 Speaker 3: well as we put a bow on the twenty twenty 39 00:01:38,160 --> 00:01:41,760 Speaker 3: three campaign, and gentlemen, let's start, of course with the 40 00:01:41,840 --> 00:01:43,600 Speaker 3: coaching changes and Howard. 41 00:01:43,640 --> 00:01:44,960 Speaker 4: When we heard Brian. 42 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:46,959 Speaker 3: Dable and Joe Shane speak to the media on Monday, 43 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:52,120 Speaker 3: there was the term used expectation that Mike Kafka as 44 00:01:52,200 --> 00:01:55,080 Speaker 3: well as wink martin Dal would return now the key 45 00:01:55,200 --> 00:01:59,360 Speaker 3: operating phrases expectation, because at that point Brian Dable did 46 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:02,760 Speaker 3: not have a compation with Wink Martindale, And clearly we 47 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 3: have since learned that Wink Martindale and the team have 48 00:02:05,480 --> 00:02:08,959 Speaker 3: gone their separate ways, with a number of media outlets 49 00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:13,040 Speaker 3: reporting that it was a resignation. So a lot clearly 50 00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:16,760 Speaker 3: transpired from the presser to the news that followed over 51 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:19,800 Speaker 3: the last few days. And change is inevitable, Howard, as 52 00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:21,959 Speaker 3: you can attest to as a former player in the NFL. 53 00:02:22,360 --> 00:02:25,000 Speaker 3: But as far as what this means for the defense, 54 00:02:25,120 --> 00:02:29,200 Speaker 3: I think they were hoping and excited about building continuity 55 00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:32,200 Speaker 3: based on what the defense put forth this past season 56 00:02:32,200 --> 00:02:36,080 Speaker 3: and some of the individual movement on the roster front 57 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:38,839 Speaker 3: in terms of guys putting together career years, and now 58 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:41,000 Speaker 3: unfortunately the Giants are going to have to start fresh 59 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:43,160 Speaker 3: with a new coordinator and a news game. 60 00:02:44,240 --> 00:02:45,919 Speaker 5: Yeah, you get a new coordinator, get a new game. 61 00:02:45,960 --> 00:02:49,240 Speaker 5: I mean it happens a lot and with teams, depending 62 00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:52,160 Speaker 5: on if you have a really great success that somebody 63 00:02:52,240 --> 00:02:54,440 Speaker 5: come by and cherry picks that guy from your team, 64 00:02:54,800 --> 00:02:57,120 Speaker 5: he goes off to be a head coach somewhere else 65 00:02:57,320 --> 00:02:59,600 Speaker 5: or you know, some guys just move on, you know, 66 00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:02,520 Speaker 5: whether resign or get fired, they just move on. So 67 00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:06,360 Speaker 5: it's not an uncommon thing. Guys, are you used to it, 68 00:03:06,440 --> 00:03:08,840 Speaker 5: believe it or not. They they learned schemes, they picked 69 00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:11,079 Speaker 5: things up. You know, two years ago they were running 70 00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:13,680 Speaker 5: something else. They picked up wink scheme. In the year 71 00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:16,080 Speaker 5: of the year before, they had a pretty really good defense. 72 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:19,200 Speaker 5: Last year they played really well. So it's not uncommon 73 00:03:19,240 --> 00:03:22,920 Speaker 5: for them for teams to change coordinators. It just depends 74 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 5: on like one of the guy that comes in, whoever 75 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:26,799 Speaker 5: they got, may be if he's a good teacher and 76 00:03:26,880 --> 00:03:29,280 Speaker 5: able to get the guys together and have them on 77 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:30,760 Speaker 5: the same page. 78 00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:32,600 Speaker 4: And Russ. 79 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:36,880 Speaker 3: As far as what this means from a dramatic standpoint, 80 00:03:36,920 --> 00:03:39,040 Speaker 3: you know, based on the media reports, we heard that 81 00:03:39,120 --> 00:03:41,600 Speaker 3: there perhaps was a lot of back and forth. Maybe 82 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:44,760 Speaker 3: the relationship between Brian Dabele and Wig Martindale wasn't positive. 83 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:47,080 Speaker 3: But the bottom line is now Brian Dable can move 84 00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:49,520 Speaker 3: forward and he can once again put his own stamp 85 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:51,960 Speaker 3: on the defensive side of the ball. Is a new 86 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:53,440 Speaker 3: face and a new voice will come in. 87 00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:59,119 Speaker 6: Listen, I was a big fan, big fan of wink Okay. 88 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:02,720 Speaker 6: I like I thought he did a good job. As 89 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:06,840 Speaker 6: Howard said, change is inevitable. It happens all the time. 90 00:04:07,080 --> 00:04:11,040 Speaker 6: We're seeing change in the world of football these past 91 00:04:11,040 --> 00:04:16,200 Speaker 6: two days between Bill Belichick and Nick Saban. Change is inevitable. 92 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:21,680 Speaker 6: Bigger guys than Wag Martindale have changed jobs. The Giants 93 00:04:21,720 --> 00:04:24,920 Speaker 6: will be fine, The defense will be fine, the players 94 00:04:24,960 --> 00:04:27,880 Speaker 6: will be fine. Players play, coaches, coach. 95 00:04:28,320 --> 00:04:30,640 Speaker 3: And you could throw Pete Carroll into the mix as well. 96 00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:34,080 Speaker 3: Moving on from the sidelines, at least with the Seattle Seahawks, 97 00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:37,839 Speaker 3: it has been an eventful week, and Matt, it's unfortunate 98 00:04:37,960 --> 00:04:40,679 Speaker 3: because you know, relationships are so critical when it comes 99 00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:44,120 Speaker 3: to players and coaches and coaches and coaches, and clearly 100 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:46,600 Speaker 3: there seem to be, at least according to reports, evidence 101 00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:49,040 Speaker 3: of some friction on the relationship front. And that's more 102 00:04:49,040 --> 00:04:51,479 Speaker 3: of a reason why it may be a positive to 103 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:54,000 Speaker 3: bring in a new voice in a new face. But 104 00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:58,080 Speaker 3: the Giants defense at least had some principles to build 105 00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:01,320 Speaker 3: off of. They were extremely opportunists this past season. They 106 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:05,880 Speaker 3: were tied with the Baltimore Ravens in turnover differential and takeaways. 107 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:07,440 Speaker 4: For number one in the NFL. 108 00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:10,360 Speaker 3: So whoever the new defensive coordinator is has some big 109 00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:12,960 Speaker 3: shoes to fill in terms of piggybacking off of that 110 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:16,240 Speaker 3: as well as trying to build off of how many 111 00:05:16,279 --> 00:05:19,880 Speaker 3: players we saw from an individual standpoint, makes some big 112 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:21,120 Speaker 3: strides this season. 113 00:05:21,640 --> 00:05:22,400 Speaker 2: Oh definitely. 114 00:05:22,480 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 7: And you know, as Russ alluded to, like wink, he's 115 00:05:27,000 --> 00:05:29,560 Speaker 7: a good defensive coach. But if you look at the 116 00:05:29,560 --> 00:05:31,880 Speaker 7: Giants defense the last two years, it's not like the 117 00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:34,560 Speaker 7: defense was the best unit in the NFL. I mean, 118 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:38,480 Speaker 7: last year, the twenty twenty two season, the Giants run 119 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:40,400 Speaker 7: dye was clearly the achilles heel. 120 00:05:40,600 --> 00:05:41,320 Speaker 2: Of the defense. 121 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:45,159 Speaker 7: They went into the offseason clearly trying to address that position, 122 00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:51,600 Speaker 7: added A'shawn Robinson, RAKEI Newnez Roachez, Bobby Ocarake, and they 123 00:05:51,640 --> 00:05:55,279 Speaker 7: came back this year and the run defense struggled again. 124 00:05:55,400 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 7: I mean, part of it was definitely, you know, Leonard 125 00:05:58,160 --> 00:06:01,080 Speaker 7: Williams being traded halfway through the season, but that was 126 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:05,560 Speaker 7: a consistent weakness of the defense that just did not 127 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:09,160 Speaker 7: get better over the last two seasons. And as you 128 00:06:09,240 --> 00:06:12,360 Speaker 7: refer to, they are definitely some building blocks on the 129 00:06:12,360 --> 00:06:15,840 Speaker 7: defense for the next defensive coordinator to whoever that may 130 00:06:15,880 --> 00:06:19,880 Speaker 7: be to come build around. Dexter Lawrence has become one 131 00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:22,640 Speaker 7: of the best defensive players in the entire. 132 00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:24,000 Speaker 2: NFL, regardless of position. 133 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:28,640 Speaker 7: Just yesterday, his fellow players across the NFL voted him 134 00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 7: in All Pro on the NFLPA Players All Pro Team. 135 00:06:32,600 --> 00:06:35,880 Speaker 7: So that's clearly how the fellow players around the league 136 00:06:36,200 --> 00:06:37,520 Speaker 7: feel about Dexter Lawrence. 137 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:41,719 Speaker 2: And there Bobby o'carake came in and had a huge 138 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:45,320 Speaker 2: impact on the Giants defense. So there are building blocks 139 00:06:45,720 --> 00:06:48,800 Speaker 2: for whoever comes in next to build around. 140 00:06:49,120 --> 00:06:51,520 Speaker 7: But I do want to say I think just almost 141 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:55,240 Speaker 7: as important as those player building blocks are a couple 142 00:06:55,240 --> 00:06:58,080 Speaker 7: of coaching building blocks that are also currently still in 143 00:06:58,120 --> 00:06:58,560 Speaker 7: the building. 144 00:06:58,960 --> 00:06:59,479 Speaker 2: I don't think. 145 00:06:59,520 --> 00:07:01,839 Speaker 7: I don't know if Dexter Lawrence has as an amazing 146 00:07:01,920 --> 00:07:05,760 Speaker 7: of two season stretch that he's had without the development 147 00:07:05,839 --> 00:07:09,680 Speaker 7: and guidance from Andre Patterson, who has become one of 148 00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:12,720 Speaker 7: the best defensive line coaches, or at least should be 149 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:16,600 Speaker 7: respected as one of the best defensive line coaches in 150 00:07:16,640 --> 00:07:20,520 Speaker 7: the entire NFL, and also Jerome Henderson in the secondary. 151 00:07:20,720 --> 00:07:25,120 Speaker 7: These are two very well respected position coaches around the NFL, 152 00:07:25,240 --> 00:07:27,200 Speaker 7: and You've seen what they have been able to do 153 00:07:27,280 --> 00:07:29,640 Speaker 7: with some of the young players on the Giants team 154 00:07:29,680 --> 00:07:31,840 Speaker 7: that have taken huge steps over the last couple of 155 00:07:31,840 --> 00:07:33,080 Speaker 7: seasons under their guidance. 156 00:07:33,760 --> 00:07:36,360 Speaker 3: I think that's an important element to note because you 157 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:39,200 Speaker 3: look at what Xavier McKinney did the last few seasons. 158 00:07:39,280 --> 00:07:42,160 Speaker 3: You also look at Deontay Banks, the rookie, so he's 159 00:07:42,240 --> 00:07:45,440 Speaker 3: going to at least have his same positional coach. And 160 00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:48,320 Speaker 3: Andre Patterson did a heck of a job in Minnesota 161 00:07:48,400 --> 00:07:51,800 Speaker 3: developing all those defensive linemen, including Daniel Hunter, who was 162 00:07:51,840 --> 00:07:54,440 Speaker 3: in that Pro Bowl All Pro conversation, just like what 163 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:57,120 Speaker 3: we saw with respect to Dexter Lawrence. So Howard, that's 164 00:07:57,240 --> 00:08:00,520 Speaker 3: encouraging because these individuals will be working under the new 165 00:08:00,560 --> 00:08:02,840 Speaker 3: defensive coordinator. But I want to bring up something that 166 00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:04,920 Speaker 3: you hit on every two years. It has been a 167 00:08:04,960 --> 00:08:07,120 Speaker 3: theme now. Part of that in the past was the 168 00:08:07,160 --> 00:08:09,800 Speaker 3: Giants had to hire a new head coach, Pat Shermer 169 00:08:09,920 --> 00:08:13,040 Speaker 3: James Betcher. Then you had Joe Judge and Patrick Graham, 170 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:15,280 Speaker 3: and then of course Brian Dable comes in. He brings 171 00:08:15,320 --> 00:08:18,160 Speaker 3: in his own defensive coordinator. And I don't think there's 172 00:08:18,160 --> 00:08:20,960 Speaker 3: anything wrong with a head coach would always pick who 173 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:23,160 Speaker 3: he wants to work under him. I think it's unhealthy 174 00:08:23,200 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 3: to force a coach on a headman. But now the 175 00:08:26,920 --> 00:08:30,520 Speaker 3: two year increments, Howard continues, and you mentioned that players 176 00:08:30,600 --> 00:08:34,240 Speaker 3: know they've got to continuously evolve, they have to adapt 177 00:08:34,240 --> 00:08:37,080 Speaker 3: to change. But I think Brian Dable year three was 178 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:41,199 Speaker 3: also hoping or operating under the expectation that they can 179 00:08:41,280 --> 00:08:44,000 Speaker 3: at least maintain that continuity aspect. 180 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:46,959 Speaker 5: Well, yeah, you want that to happen, but you know, again, 181 00:08:47,080 --> 00:08:50,440 Speaker 5: personalities are different. You don't know what's going on and 182 00:08:50,760 --> 00:08:55,240 Speaker 5: you have no thought. I guess there were some leaks 183 00:08:55,240 --> 00:08:57,280 Speaker 5: and stuff coming from the locker room, so that would 184 00:08:57,280 --> 00:08:59,600 Speaker 5: mean to one of the coaches was explaining what he 185 00:08:59,600 --> 00:09:01,679 Speaker 5: thought was happening on his end. So that's what you 186 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:05,160 Speaker 5: that's what you're getting out the rumor meal, so to speak. 187 00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:07,440 Speaker 5: But at the end of the day, it's just personality. 188 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:09,120 Speaker 5: So I think that you know, Dave bows is a 189 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:11,480 Speaker 5: class you know, type a personality. I think wink to 190 00:09:11,559 --> 00:09:13,599 Speaker 5: type a personality. I think that that was part of 191 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:17,320 Speaker 5: part of what's going on. We highlighted all year along 192 00:09:17,400 --> 00:09:20,240 Speaker 5: how they offense struggled. I mean it really, really struggled 193 00:09:20,360 --> 00:09:22,040 Speaker 5: and the defense kind of came up and you know, 194 00:09:22,120 --> 00:09:24,599 Speaker 5: you were saying, oh, the defense is making turnovers, that 195 00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:26,959 Speaker 5: they're doing all these different things, and and what is 196 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:29,439 Speaker 5: the offense doing with it. I think that sometimes when 197 00:09:29,480 --> 00:09:31,480 Speaker 5: you're in the locker room, you have to really shield 198 00:09:31,520 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 5: your players from hey, we're in this together no matter what. 199 00:09:34,440 --> 00:09:36,560 Speaker 5: You know, it's not one side wins a game and 200 00:09:36,600 --> 00:09:38,839 Speaker 5: one side loses a game. You have to really keep 201 00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:41,400 Speaker 5: guys like focused. And I'm not saying that's what's happening, 202 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:43,480 Speaker 5: but you know, I've been on teams where that was 203 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:45,920 Speaker 5: part of the conversation where hey, man, you guys got 204 00:09:45,960 --> 00:09:47,199 Speaker 5: to pick it up over there, help us out a 205 00:09:47,240 --> 00:09:49,520 Speaker 5: little bit or do something, and and you would say 206 00:09:49,520 --> 00:09:51,320 Speaker 5: it out loud, and guys will be looking at you, 207 00:09:51,320 --> 00:09:54,080 Speaker 5: you know, giving you the side eye. But you really 208 00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:57,400 Speaker 5: want to keep guys together, keep guys focused, keep guys grinding. 209 00:09:57,400 --> 00:10:01,120 Speaker 5: And if that's you know, like part the personality traits 210 00:10:01,160 --> 00:10:04,360 Speaker 5: of coaches, like hey, we're doing our job kind of conversation, 211 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:07,520 Speaker 5: that's not you know, togetherness, like we're in it together. 212 00:10:07,520 --> 00:10:10,800 Speaker 3: As it's always the answer, Oh you don't want basically 213 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:14,600 Speaker 3: three different facets. I'll throw in special teams and a 214 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:18,640 Speaker 3: team operating on an individual island, and at least if 215 00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:20,720 Speaker 3: you connect some of the dots, Howard, some of that 216 00:10:20,880 --> 00:10:22,240 Speaker 3: was going on in RUSS. I want to bring in 217 00:10:22,280 --> 00:10:25,000 Speaker 3: another example that I think ties into what Howard was saying, 218 00:10:25,000 --> 00:10:28,160 Speaker 3: and this may be a reason why the coaches didn't 219 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:31,080 Speaker 3: necessarily see eye to eye in terms of also the 220 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:33,640 Speaker 3: approach with handling the media. And you were hitting on 221 00:10:33,679 --> 00:10:35,600 Speaker 3: how the reports came out Russ. But if you remember, 222 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:38,679 Speaker 3: there was a point of the season where Xavier McKinney 223 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:42,640 Speaker 3: was frustrated with the communication between the players and the coaches, 224 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:45,240 Speaker 3: and when Wink Martindale met with the media a few 225 00:10:45,320 --> 00:10:50,640 Speaker 3: days later, he voiced his displeasure and disappointment in McKinney, 226 00:10:50,640 --> 00:10:52,880 Speaker 3: explaining that whereas you know, Brian Dable has a much 227 00:10:52,880 --> 00:10:56,760 Speaker 3: different approach. Brian is all about keeping things behind closed doors, 228 00:10:56,960 --> 00:11:00,880 Speaker 3: handling his business, keeping all the skeletons in the closet, 229 00:11:00,920 --> 00:11:03,600 Speaker 3: for the lack of a better phrase, whereas Wink doesn't 230 00:11:03,640 --> 00:11:07,240 Speaker 3: mind maybe discussing that in the eyes of the media, 231 00:11:07,280 --> 00:11:09,480 Speaker 3: And you know, you could maybe now look back and 232 00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:12,600 Speaker 3: wonder was that a sign of how you had two 233 00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:15,520 Speaker 3: coaches on the staff who operated very differently. 234 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:19,120 Speaker 8: I couldn't agree with you more. But here's the thing. 235 00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:23,840 Speaker 6: And while the media, all of us lapped up everything 236 00:11:23,880 --> 00:11:25,920 Speaker 6: that Wink would say because he was charming. 237 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:26,640 Speaker 8: He was great. 238 00:11:26,760 --> 00:11:30,560 Speaker 6: You know, he got that grizzled personality and you liked it, 239 00:11:30,600 --> 00:11:33,959 Speaker 6: you know, from a defensive coordinator. But if the head 240 00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:37,920 Speaker 6: coach wants to handle the different way, and the head 241 00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:42,079 Speaker 6: coach has to get what he wants otherwise it doesn't work, 242 00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:47,839 Speaker 6: that becomes a problem. You know, Howard's old coach, Bill Parcells, 243 00:11:47,920 --> 00:11:49,760 Speaker 6: used to say to us all the time, this is 244 00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:52,760 Speaker 6: back in the day, Howard. If you remember Parcells, he 245 00:11:52,840 --> 00:11:56,880 Speaker 6: had seven assistants, seven assistants. Now it is more like 246 00:11:56,920 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 6: twenty seven assistants on a team, but seven assistants, and 247 00:12:00,440 --> 00:12:04,720 Speaker 6: Bill would say, there's nothing off the record, there's nothing 248 00:12:04,760 --> 00:12:07,280 Speaker 6: that gets gets kept quiet. You know why he goes, 249 00:12:07,679 --> 00:12:12,480 Speaker 6: I got seven assistants, and my seven assistants have seven wives, 250 00:12:12,840 --> 00:12:16,200 Speaker 6: and the seven wives have seven best friends. That's twenty 251 00:12:16,240 --> 00:12:20,160 Speaker 6: one people. Nothing stays quiet. You'll have to be in 252 00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:23,199 Speaker 6: control of that. Bill, as Howard would attest, was in 253 00:12:23,240 --> 00:12:26,080 Speaker 6: control of that. And you know what, to Brian's credit, 254 00:12:26,160 --> 00:12:29,680 Speaker 6: that if Brian wants to handled that way, and Brian 255 00:12:29,960 --> 00:12:32,480 Speaker 6: is the head coach of the New York Football Giants, 256 00:12:32,679 --> 00:12:34,880 Speaker 6: then that's the way it has to be handled. 257 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:38,840 Speaker 3: And we've also heard from many assistants over the course 258 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:42,440 Speaker 3: of NFL history, not just pertaining to the Giants's assistants 259 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:45,600 Speaker 3: view themselves as you're supposed to carry out the vision 260 00:12:45,960 --> 00:12:49,559 Speaker 3: of the head coach, and if that's not happening, then 261 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:52,480 Speaker 3: you can understand the head coach wanting to go in 262 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:56,079 Speaker 3: a different direction. Now that wasn't the only change that 263 00:12:56,280 --> 00:12:59,000 Speaker 3: is occurring with respect to the coaching staff, because we're 264 00:12:59,040 --> 00:13:02,840 Speaker 3: going to have now in offseason where all three facets 265 00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:06,520 Speaker 3: have been impacted. We mentioned Wake Martindal well, the Giants 266 00:13:06,559 --> 00:13:10,079 Speaker 3: part of ways with Thomas mcgahey, longtime special teams coordinator, 267 00:13:10,800 --> 00:13:14,840 Speaker 3: as well as offensive line coach Bobby Johnson, and Jeff Nixon, 268 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:17,760 Speaker 3: the running backs coach is moving on for different reasons. 269 00:13:17,960 --> 00:13:21,120 Speaker 3: He became the Syracuse offensive coordinator. So, Matt, I want 270 00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:23,200 Speaker 3: to bring you in to start turning our attention to 271 00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:25,360 Speaker 3: some of these other moves. And let's start with mcgahey, 272 00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:28,959 Speaker 3: because here's an individual and this just speaks volues of 273 00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:31,560 Speaker 3: what he was able to do for this Giants organization 274 00:13:31,679 --> 00:13:35,320 Speaker 3: considering the turnover rate for coaches. He was here for 275 00:13:35,360 --> 00:13:39,080 Speaker 3: ten seasons. In two stints, he worked under four different 276 00:13:39,120 --> 00:13:42,640 Speaker 3: head coaches each of the last three and I think 277 00:13:42,800 --> 00:13:46,480 Speaker 3: unfortunately for mcgahey this past season, he was a product 278 00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:50,720 Speaker 3: of so many injuries elsewhere on the roster. What happens 279 00:13:50,760 --> 00:13:53,920 Speaker 3: that winds up impacting special teams where there's so much 280 00:13:53,960 --> 00:13:56,720 Speaker 3: movement to begin with that he had to go through 281 00:13:57,000 --> 00:14:00,080 Speaker 3: five different kickers, four of which actually kicked it in 282 00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:05,480 Speaker 3: the game, and multiple gunners and multiple returnment And when 283 00:14:05,559 --> 00:14:08,280 Speaker 3: you have to do that consistently is Thomas mcgahey loves 284 00:14:08,320 --> 00:14:11,000 Speaker 3: to say you use the ingredients at your disposal to 285 00:14:11,040 --> 00:14:13,520 Speaker 3: make the gumbo well on a week to week basis, 286 00:14:13,800 --> 00:14:16,679 Speaker 3: he was changing those ingredients, Matt. And it's not an excuse, 287 00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:20,360 Speaker 3: but I think it's understandable why it wasn't as steady 288 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:24,240 Speaker 3: and consistent as many members of the coaching staff were 289 00:14:24,240 --> 00:14:24,600 Speaker 3: hoping for. 290 00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:28,560 Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean, any NFL coach would tell you you 291 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:32,440 Speaker 7: play the hand that you're dealt, and t mac would 292 00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 7: be the first one to say that, and injuries they happen. 293 00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:38,720 Speaker 2: Is unfortunate that you brought up the kicker situation. 294 00:14:38,840 --> 00:14:41,800 Speaker 7: I can't remember the last time a team had four 295 00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:46,080 Speaker 7: or five different kickers for a season like that's just unbelievable, 296 00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 7: and especially with considering how consistent and how amazing of 297 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:53,120 Speaker 7: a season Graham Gano had last year going into this season, 298 00:14:53,320 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 7: that was probably the last position that anyone on the 299 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:57,720 Speaker 7: team had any sort of concerns about. 300 00:14:57,760 --> 00:15:00,320 Speaker 2: But injuries happen, and. 301 00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:04,440 Speaker 7: You know, it's unfortunate to see te matco because he 302 00:15:04,640 --> 00:15:08,600 Speaker 7: is a very well respected coach both around the league 303 00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:10,080 Speaker 7: inside this building. 304 00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:12,920 Speaker 2: But I mean, as you as you refer. 305 00:15:12,800 --> 00:15:16,160 Speaker 7: To the special teams unit, just it really just did 306 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:19,120 Speaker 7: not get it done this season. It didn't live up 307 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:23,280 Speaker 7: to what Brian Dable was clearly expecting it to. There 308 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:27,440 Speaker 7: are several occasions throughout the season, little mistakes here and there. 309 00:15:27,960 --> 00:15:31,200 Speaker 7: I mean, honestly, we google but go back to Week one. 310 00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:35,440 Speaker 2: The field goal block against the Cowboys changed that game. 311 00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:37,040 Speaker 7: I mean, it was towards the beginning of the game, 312 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:40,320 Speaker 7: of course, but and who knows what might have happened anyway, 313 00:15:40,360 --> 00:15:42,680 Speaker 7: But if that field goal doesn't get blocked in the 314 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:46,920 Speaker 7: first quarter, Andrew Thomas, you know, doesn't get injured trying 315 00:15:46,920 --> 00:15:50,480 Speaker 7: to tackle the defender who's returning it. 316 00:15:50,720 --> 00:15:53,200 Speaker 2: Who knows how the whole entire season could have gone. 317 00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 2: So you know, you. 318 00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:59,240 Speaker 7: Can't use injuries as an excuse. We all know that 319 00:15:59,640 --> 00:16:02,400 Speaker 7: he was dealt a tough hand. But at the end 320 00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:05,080 Speaker 7: of the day, as you said, as Timac always says, 321 00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:08,200 Speaker 7: you were given the ingredients and you got to make 322 00:16:08,240 --> 00:16:11,120 Speaker 7: the best gumbo that you can and unfortunately, the giant 323 00:16:11,160 --> 00:16:14,240 Speaker 7: special teams unit this past season, the gumbo that that 324 00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:16,080 Speaker 7: was made just wasn't very good. 325 00:16:17,720 --> 00:16:20,160 Speaker 3: I think that's a very fair parallel because you know, 326 00:16:20,160 --> 00:16:22,600 Speaker 3: once again, there's only so much seasoning you could put 327 00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:25,240 Speaker 3: into maybe bury some of the ingredients that you had 328 00:16:25,240 --> 00:16:27,840 Speaker 3: to work with that you weren't necessarily hoping. And Howard, 329 00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:30,440 Speaker 3: it goes also back to what you were talking about earlier, 330 00:16:30,440 --> 00:16:32,400 Speaker 3: where you were saying, how many times do we talk 331 00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 3: about this season the defense gets takeaways, but the offense 332 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:39,880 Speaker 3: doesn't capitalize off of that, and it may create some division. Well, 333 00:16:40,080 --> 00:16:43,080 Speaker 3: as Matt was hitting on, how many times perhaps did 334 00:16:43,080 --> 00:16:45,600 Speaker 3: they need the special teams unit to play the game 335 00:16:45,600 --> 00:16:48,640 Speaker 3: of field positioning and maybe something didn't happen and as 336 00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:50,880 Speaker 3: a result, you put the defense in a tough spot. 337 00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:52,800 Speaker 3: Where you put the offense in a tough spot and 338 00:16:53,040 --> 00:16:55,600 Speaker 3: that adds up. It's cumulative is I like to say, 339 00:16:55,600 --> 00:16:58,000 Speaker 3: over the course of a season, you can't just expect 340 00:16:58,000 --> 00:16:59,920 Speaker 3: the offense of the defense to do the heavy lifting. 341 00:17:00,320 --> 00:17:02,640 Speaker 3: You need special teams more often than not to deliver, 342 00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:06,040 Speaker 3: whether it's field positioning or maybe delivering with a field goal, 343 00:17:06,359 --> 00:17:10,600 Speaker 3: which we also saw sometimes decided games. Considering how a 344 00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:13,840 Speaker 3: lot of these affairs were relatively close this year, I. 345 00:17:13,760 --> 00:17:16,200 Speaker 5: Think you go back to the first game where there 346 00:17:16,320 --> 00:17:18,520 Speaker 5: was a field goal block, I think that really affected 347 00:17:18,560 --> 00:17:21,440 Speaker 5: the season from a from the standpoint of hurting Andrew 348 00:17:21,480 --> 00:17:23,119 Speaker 5: Thomas and he was out for a few weeks and 349 00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:25,639 Speaker 5: couldn't be at his top performance for a while. That 350 00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:28,120 Speaker 5: really made a big difference in the game. And right 351 00:17:28,160 --> 00:17:31,600 Speaker 5: after that there were several attempts to block field goals 352 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:34,439 Speaker 5: from other teams because they saw that you could do 353 00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:37,080 Speaker 5: that against us. That was a little bit of a flaw. 354 00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:39,960 Speaker 5: You saw on the punt team guys getting very close 355 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:43,080 Speaker 5: to blocking punts and and that that caused you know, 356 00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:45,240 Speaker 5: the punter the kick it sideways off the side of 357 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:47,840 Speaker 5: the splits sometimes and it just guys who are just 358 00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:51,760 Speaker 5: not not really completing and doing their jobs. Now you 359 00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:54,359 Speaker 5: know team Mack was doing his job. He's telling the 360 00:17:54,359 --> 00:17:57,040 Speaker 5: guys what to do. He's helping guys. Not everybody out 361 00:17:57,040 --> 00:18:00,560 Speaker 5: there is unhealthy. Not everybody out there is hurt, and 362 00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:03,320 Speaker 5: you know everybody is playing it the best of their abilities. 363 00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:05,640 Speaker 5: I get it. But you got to do your job 364 00:18:05,720 --> 00:18:08,040 Speaker 5: no matter what and what position you play. And when 365 00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:10,439 Speaker 5: it's time to do special teams, special teams is, like 366 00:18:10,880 --> 00:18:12,960 Speaker 5: I tell people, it's a barometer of the depth of 367 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:15,960 Speaker 5: the team. Everybody on the special teams has to do 368 00:18:16,040 --> 00:18:18,280 Speaker 5: their job. You have to make the plays, and he did. 369 00:18:18,359 --> 00:18:20,119 Speaker 5: At the end of the year, they did make a 370 00:18:20,119 --> 00:18:22,679 Speaker 5: couple of different, you know, game difference plays with the 371 00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:25,200 Speaker 5: return for a touchdown first one in a long time. 372 00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:27,719 Speaker 5: There were so many other plays, you know. Then the 373 00:18:27,720 --> 00:18:30,160 Speaker 5: mins field goals can't say that much about you get 374 00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:32,320 Speaker 5: your guys. You paid a lot of money too, has 375 00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:35,280 Speaker 5: a knee problem, he's out, You're bringing another guy. He 376 00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:37,680 Speaker 5: pulls a hamstring and he's out. You're bringing another guy. 377 00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:40,080 Speaker 5: So that's not a lot you can say about that part. 378 00:18:40,160 --> 00:18:43,520 Speaker 5: That's just part of the game. Sometimes these guys, they 379 00:18:43,600 --> 00:18:45,480 Speaker 5: they get hurt. But the guys that are around them, 380 00:18:45,520 --> 00:18:47,440 Speaker 5: not the guys that are kicking the balls. The snaps, 381 00:18:47,480 --> 00:18:51,399 Speaker 5: the holes, everything else just wasn't really working. And in 382 00:18:51,480 --> 00:18:55,160 Speaker 5: the return game it struggled until you brought somebody in. 383 00:18:55,200 --> 00:18:57,040 Speaker 5: And you know, and I'm pretty sure that you know, 384 00:18:57,320 --> 00:19:00,879 Speaker 5: he's not making decisions on which received to keep or 385 00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:03,800 Speaker 5: which dB to keep it which running back to Gape, 386 00:19:04,080 --> 00:19:06,359 Speaker 5: He's like, if he could make the decisions on who 387 00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:09,000 Speaker 5: he kept as a returner, he would have kept. He 388 00:19:09,000 --> 00:19:10,720 Speaker 5: would have kept the returner right off the bat, and 389 00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:13,199 Speaker 5: maybe the return game would look differently for the entire season. 390 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:17,840 Speaker 5: So you know, he's he is like the victim of 391 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:21,639 Speaker 5: circumstances of who's on the team, the production he was 392 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:23,639 Speaker 5: getting out of the guys, and how they played. But 393 00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:26,000 Speaker 5: he's a victim of circumstance because he can't do a 394 00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:28,320 Speaker 5: lot other than what's given to him. 395 00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:30,399 Speaker 3: I think what you're hitting on is a guy like 396 00:19:30,480 --> 00:19:33,560 Speaker 3: Jamison Crowder who was with the team earlier this offseason, 397 00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:35,920 Speaker 3: and Joe Shane even addressed this at the bye week. 398 00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:37,800 Speaker 3: They went with the younger guy and Eric Gray, And 399 00:19:37,840 --> 00:19:40,399 Speaker 3: part of that is finances as much as it is 400 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:43,679 Speaker 3: ex as it Owes, So Thomas mcgahey's limited bud in fairness, 401 00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:46,000 Speaker 3: as you hit on, Gunner, Ozchewsky was a really nice 402 00:19:46,119 --> 00:19:49,280 Speaker 3: late addition and did a nice job embracing that role 403 00:19:49,359 --> 00:19:51,239 Speaker 3: after having a rough start with the Steelers and then 404 00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:54,160 Speaker 3: of course giving them that return for a score late 405 00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:57,200 Speaker 3: in the season against the Rams. But Russ, it wasn't 406 00:19:57,280 --> 00:19:59,840 Speaker 3: just special teams that had to navigate a. 407 00:19:59,800 --> 00:20:00,480 Speaker 4: Lot of issues. 408 00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:03,680 Speaker 3: It was also the offensive line because Bobby Johnson in 409 00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:06,280 Speaker 3: the ten different offensive line alignments this season. 410 00:20:06,840 --> 00:20:11,000 Speaker 6: Listen in how It'll tell you nobody likes to see 411 00:20:11,040 --> 00:20:16,400 Speaker 6: coaches lose jobs, but a guy like Bobby Johnson, sometimes 412 00:20:16,440 --> 00:20:20,199 Speaker 6: you have to make hard decisions. Bobby Johnson wasn't just 413 00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:24,040 Speaker 6: a coach with the Giants, he was a very dear, 414 00:20:24,400 --> 00:20:28,080 Speaker 6: close friend of Brian Dabele. You think that was an 415 00:20:28,080 --> 00:20:32,240 Speaker 6: easy decision for Dabel to make. But for whatever reason, 416 00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:36,520 Speaker 6: whether it was injuries or whatever it was, the offensive 417 00:20:36,560 --> 00:20:40,400 Speaker 6: line has had problems quite frankly before Dable got here, 418 00:20:40,600 --> 00:20:43,080 Speaker 6: and it continues to have problems and it's got to 419 00:20:43,119 --> 00:20:47,480 Speaker 6: be straightened out. So sometimes those hard decisions have to 420 00:20:47,520 --> 00:20:49,840 Speaker 6: be made. You know, as we said at the top 421 00:20:49,880 --> 00:20:53,720 Speaker 6: of the show, change becomes inevitable. You know, doesn't mean 422 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:56,720 Speaker 6: Bobby Johnson's a bad coach. No doesn't mean Team app 423 00:20:56,880 --> 00:21:00,800 Speaker 6: was a bad coach. No change has to take if 424 00:21:00,840 --> 00:21:04,080 Speaker 6: the guys under your command are not getting the job done, 425 00:21:04,160 --> 00:21:06,840 Speaker 6: and as you say, for whatever reason injuries are not 426 00:21:07,560 --> 00:21:11,320 Speaker 6: those units weren't getting the job done to a satisfactory 427 00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:13,879 Speaker 6: level for the organization. 428 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:16,960 Speaker 3: And sometimes a new voice can take the team in 429 00:21:17,000 --> 00:21:19,520 Speaker 3: a different direction. And it's the old story in the 430 00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:22,800 Speaker 3: National Football League. You have fifty three players on a roster, 431 00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:27,639 Speaker 3: it's easier from a turnover standpoint to make a change 432 00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:30,560 Speaker 3: at the positional coach or the coordinator is opposed to 433 00:21:30,600 --> 00:21:34,600 Speaker 3: completely revamping the roster, especially based on salary cap restrictions 434 00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:36,479 Speaker 3: and so forth. So I think that's another thing that 435 00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:39,000 Speaker 3: has to be taken into consideration. 436 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:40,040 Speaker 4: And that's why the Giants are going to have a 437 00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:40,840 Speaker 4: lot of new faces. 438 00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:42,840 Speaker 2: Go ahead, Howard, I think so, yes. 439 00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:44,520 Speaker 5: But at the same time, you got to remember, like 440 00:21:44,520 --> 00:21:46,800 Speaker 5: some of these guys come in together, that they travel together, 441 00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:50,720 Speaker 5: like Bobby Johnson and Coach Stable, they they're like really 442 00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:53,679 Speaker 5: close close friends. So him let both his close friend go. 443 00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:56,080 Speaker 5: That had to be a big one for him. 444 00:21:56,440 --> 00:21:59,840 Speaker 3: Without a doubt, and that's why Russ mentioned that because 445 00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:02,480 Speaker 3: they go back to their days together in Buffalo. Bobby 446 00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:05,840 Speaker 3: Johnson and Brian Dable worked alongside one another from twenty 447 00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:09,080 Speaker 3: nineteen to twenty one, and then they both came together 448 00:22:09,160 --> 00:22:11,199 Speaker 3: to East Ruther for New Jersey. So there was a 449 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:14,199 Speaker 3: reason why he brought him along because they developed a 450 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:16,960 Speaker 3: good rapport and a good relationship. Gable was the OC 451 00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:20,359 Speaker 3: Bobby Johnson was the offensive line coach in Buffalo. We 452 00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:23,800 Speaker 3: saw the development of Josh Allen, an improved offensive line 453 00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:24,840 Speaker 3: since Allen's. 454 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:25,880 Speaker 4: Rookie year in twenty eighteen. 455 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:28,800 Speaker 3: All of that doesn't get overlooked, but you're dealing with 456 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:32,679 Speaker 3: new personnel, new dynamics, and the results are not necessarily 457 00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:36,359 Speaker 3: always the same. So that's why Brian Dable decided to 458 00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:39,400 Speaker 3: go in a different direction. And as far as what 459 00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:42,240 Speaker 3: this means, Matt with respect to the roster, we talked 460 00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:44,520 Speaker 3: about what it means for the defense, and they still 461 00:22:44,560 --> 00:22:48,000 Speaker 3: have Andre Patterson and Jerome Henderson on staff. But the 462 00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:50,680 Speaker 3: offensive line, you've got some young guys that were hurt 463 00:22:50,760 --> 00:22:54,280 Speaker 3: last season, and you have some veterans that they may 464 00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:57,639 Speaker 3: move on from and you hope that clearly Evan Neil 465 00:22:57,880 --> 00:23:01,000 Speaker 3: returns to health a critical year for him, still working 466 00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:02,960 Speaker 3: on his rookie contracts. So as much as we want 467 00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:05,680 Speaker 3: to say you're bringing a new offensive line coach, maybe 468 00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:07,920 Speaker 3: that could do wonders a lot, is also going to 469 00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:11,760 Speaker 3: depend on the well being and durability of. 470 00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:14,159 Speaker 4: This young core that they're hoping to build around. 471 00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 2: Oh definitely. 472 00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:17,760 Speaker 7: And you know, we spent a lot of time talking about, 473 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:21,480 Speaker 7: you know, the defensive coordinator position, and I just want 474 00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:24,680 Speaker 7: to say, I think whoever is filled to take over 475 00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:28,120 Speaker 7: as offensive line coach is almost as important. 476 00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:31,040 Speaker 2: Of a higher for Brian Dable as the defensive coordinator position. 477 00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:34,879 Speaker 7: I mean, as several of you guys have noted, the 478 00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:39,280 Speaker 7: offensive line has struggled the less, however many seasons. This 479 00:23:39,359 --> 00:23:42,120 Speaker 7: has been something that the team, the offense has been 480 00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:45,719 Speaker 7: trying to deal with for a while now. And bringing 481 00:23:45,760 --> 00:23:48,399 Speaker 7: in whoever it is they decide to bring in to 482 00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:51,200 Speaker 7: help stabilize this unit is going to be so crucial 483 00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:54,119 Speaker 7: for the future of this Giants team. I mean, this 484 00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:57,760 Speaker 7: past season, the offensive line or the Giants, It's not 485 00:23:57,800 --> 00:24:00,560 Speaker 7: all on the offense line, but the Giants surrendered twenty 486 00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:03,080 Speaker 7: more sacks than any other team in the league this 487 00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:06,600 Speaker 7: year twenty other sacks between them and the number two 488 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:10,040 Speaker 7: team with mostax laud which is insane stat when you 489 00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:10,639 Speaker 7: think about it. 490 00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:12,960 Speaker 2: So stabilizing that unit. 491 00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:16,080 Speaker 7: And you know Andrew Thomas obviously had an all Pro 492 00:24:16,119 --> 00:24:19,200 Speaker 7: season last year. He is their franchise left tackle. They 493 00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:21,280 Speaker 7: just spent a second round pick last year on John 494 00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:24,520 Speaker 7: Michael Schmidtz, and as Joe Shane mentioned at his end 495 00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:27,560 Speaker 7: of season press conference Monday, they feel good about where 496 00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:30,320 Speaker 7: his development and where he could get to both on 497 00:24:30,359 --> 00:24:32,560 Speaker 7: the field and as a leader in the locker room, 498 00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:36,879 Speaker 7: which is something that is definitely important. And you know, 499 00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:39,800 Speaker 7: whoever is brought in to be this next offensive line coach, 500 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:42,320 Speaker 7: it's going to be someone that they think is going 501 00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:45,280 Speaker 7: to help be able to help Evan Neil because that 502 00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:48,600 Speaker 7: could be one of the biggest, I don't want biggest 503 00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:52,160 Speaker 7: deciding factors on how good this unit could be next 504 00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:54,920 Speaker 7: season if they can bring someone in who could help 505 00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:58,640 Speaker 7: get him going, help bring out some of the attributes 506 00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:01,800 Speaker 7: that made him the seventh overall pick and at time 507 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 7: going into the twenty twenty two draft, people thought he 508 00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:06,359 Speaker 7: could be the number one pick in the entire draft. 509 00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:10,120 Speaker 7: So bringing someone in that can get Evan Neil back 510 00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:13,320 Speaker 7: to what he was doing and dominating at Alabama is 511 00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:15,800 Speaker 7: going to be so crucial for this offense and for 512 00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:19,320 Speaker 7: the entire the success of the entire Giants team going 513 00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:20,240 Speaker 7: into twenty twenty four. 514 00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:22,400 Speaker 8: You know, Matt, you're one hundred percent right. 515 00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:25,240 Speaker 6: But whoever comes in the one thing he's got to 516 00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:28,280 Speaker 6: get from Evan Neil. If he can get anything out 517 00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:31,280 Speaker 6: of Evan Neil, he's got to get a healthy Evan Neil. 518 00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:36,520 Speaker 6: That's been a crippling factor to Evan Neil's progress, certainly 519 00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:39,840 Speaker 6: this season. We know he's had his problems, but the injuries. 520 00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:43,000 Speaker 6: If you're playing on bomb ankles all the time, no 521 00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:45,600 Speaker 6: one's going to get the maximum out of Evan Neil. 522 00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:47,919 Speaker 8: So that's parently I agree with you, Matt. 523 00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:51,800 Speaker 6: Maybe whoever comes in can get Evanil going, but you 524 00:25:51,840 --> 00:25:54,960 Speaker 6: can't get Evan going if he can't be healthy and 525 00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:56,720 Speaker 6: right he's on the end. 526 00:25:57,200 --> 00:25:58,320 Speaker 2: You're one hundred percent two. 527 00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:02,240 Speaker 7: And I don't want to compare Evan Neiale to Andrew Thomas, 528 00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:04,479 Speaker 7: but I just I do just want to, you know, 529 00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:08,239 Speaker 7: remind everyone that Andrew Thomas dealt with injuries throughout his 530 00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:10,600 Speaker 7: first two seasons of the NFL too, And it wasn't 531 00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:13,240 Speaker 7: until year three where he really took that next step 532 00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:15,600 Speaker 7: and looked like the Andrew Thomas that we know now. 533 00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:19,120 Speaker 7: So you're one hundred percent right that Evan Neil has 534 00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:21,800 Speaker 7: has got to be healthy going into next year. But 535 00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:24,280 Speaker 7: if he is and they bring in this a new 536 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:26,719 Speaker 7: coach that can help bring out the best of him, 537 00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:29,440 Speaker 7: we could see a totally different Evan Eil in twenty 538 00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:31,560 Speaker 7: twenty four than we've seen the last two seasons. 539 00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:32,919 Speaker 8: I'll go with that. 540 00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:35,399 Speaker 5: Yeah, and don't forget guys. Also, you know as a 541 00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:38,119 Speaker 5: team looked like it sometimes they were getting no overpower. 542 00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:40,360 Speaker 5: They even changed strength coaches, I believe right. 543 00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:43,679 Speaker 3: Well, Craig Fitzgerald moved on to Florida, so they're going 544 00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:45,720 Speaker 3: to have to bring in a new strength and conditioning 545 00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:46,280 Speaker 3: coach as well. 546 00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:46,800 Speaker 2: That's correct. 547 00:26:47,840 --> 00:26:49,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, and all of these factors come into play. But 548 00:26:50,119 --> 00:26:52,280 Speaker 3: just to spell out what you guys were talking about, 549 00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:56,560 Speaker 3: Evan Neil has missed fourteen games over his first two seasons, 550 00:26:56,880 --> 00:27:01,040 Speaker 3: so he's barely played one full season in the National 551 00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:03,760 Speaker 3: Football League when you think about it, even though he 552 00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:06,399 Speaker 3: has been in a Giant's uniform for two years, So 553 00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:09,520 Speaker 3: the sample size is still small, but I think what 554 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:12,280 Speaker 3: we all can at least agree on based on what 555 00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:14,920 Speaker 3: each of you contributed to this conversation is the new 556 00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:17,399 Speaker 3: offensive line coach is going to be responsible for still 557 00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:21,320 Speaker 3: developing talent. This is not an old offensive line Evan 558 00:27:21,400 --> 00:27:24,800 Speaker 3: Neil Young, John Michael Schmidz. As Matt brought up, Young 559 00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:27,000 Speaker 3: just got past his rookie year and he's another guy 560 00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:29,639 Speaker 3: that didn't play an entire rookie year because. 561 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:29,920 Speaker 4: He was hurt. 562 00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:33,920 Speaker 3: What happens with Howard, josh A Zudu and Marcus McKeithen, 563 00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:36,480 Speaker 3: who also are not long in the tooth. 564 00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:38,480 Speaker 4: Can they stay healthy on the field. 565 00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:40,680 Speaker 3: There's a lot of young talent, and I think if 566 00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:43,359 Speaker 3: this line takes a step forward, can you keep the 567 00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:47,440 Speaker 3: guys on the field durability wise as we've all been emphasizing. 568 00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:50,159 Speaker 3: But number two, if they can stay on the field, 569 00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:53,560 Speaker 3: do you fine tune the skill set Howard that they're 570 00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:57,680 Speaker 3: consistent and reliable enough to perform at a good enough 571 00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:00,920 Speaker 3: level to handle themselves and set tone in the trenches. 572 00:28:01,320 --> 00:28:03,120 Speaker 5: Well, what they're gonna have to do is that once 573 00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:05,359 Speaker 5: you get everybody healthy, you get a healthy five guys 574 00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:06,840 Speaker 5: they're gonna have to do the one thing that's been 575 00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:08,840 Speaker 5: plugging the team for the last like five years. They 576 00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:11,240 Speaker 5: got to find some way, somehow to teach these guys 577 00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:14,119 Speaker 5: how to handle the twist and the stunts. If they 578 00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:16,760 Speaker 5: can figure out how to get these guys proficient and 579 00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:19,680 Speaker 5: handling and passing off twists and stunts and getting their 580 00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:22,120 Speaker 5: eyes up so that they're not just locked on one 581 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,080 Speaker 5: guy or following one guy to a spot, then their 582 00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:28,560 Speaker 5: their line play will increase dramatically. That's been the one 583 00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:31,600 Speaker 5: thing that that every line coach has come in has 584 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:33,840 Speaker 5: been having a problem with teaching this group of guys 585 00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:36,520 Speaker 5: or whichever group of guys has been how to pick 586 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:38,160 Speaker 5: those up. And that's the thing that's been plugging them. 587 00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:40,560 Speaker 5: The first game of the season, Dallas started off running 588 00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:42,560 Speaker 5: twist and stunts, and then every team after that ran 589 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:45,120 Speaker 5: them for a while. Then some once they stopped running 590 00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:47,280 Speaker 5: them all of a sudden, the offensive line looks great, 591 00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:49,800 Speaker 5: but that's that's the thing that you got to figure 592 00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:52,800 Speaker 5: out how to pick these guys up, especially the quicker 593 00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:55,680 Speaker 5: guys uh there that are explosive off the ball. You've 594 00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:58,200 Speaker 5: got to be prepared for that and find a way 595 00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:01,480 Speaker 5: to be able to handle. That's before anyone blitzes, before 596 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:03,520 Speaker 5: an extra dot coms or anything. You got to be 597 00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:05,200 Speaker 5: able to pick up those four guys in front of 598 00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:06,920 Speaker 5: you with the twists and stunts, and you've got to 599 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:07,640 Speaker 5: be proficient at it. 600 00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:11,560 Speaker 3: And that's a big reason why, as Matt hit on earlier, 601 00:29:12,160 --> 00:29:15,640 Speaker 3: three Giants quarterbacks were sacked a total of eighty five times, 602 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:18,400 Speaker 3: which is the second most in NFL history, a number 603 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:20,120 Speaker 3: that you have to avoid. Whether you want to put 604 00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:22,000 Speaker 3: it on the qbs or you want to put it 605 00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:25,200 Speaker 3: on the offensive line. It's fair to say both factors contributed, 606 00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:28,160 Speaker 3: which brings us to the quarterback position here before we 607 00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:31,400 Speaker 3: wrap up, because aside from the coaching change, a big 608 00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:34,640 Speaker 3: topic of discussion at the Monday presser was where they're 609 00:29:34,680 --> 00:29:36,880 Speaker 3: going to go, not for the starter necessarily, but the 610 00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:39,960 Speaker 3: quarterback depth chart. So we know Daniel Jones recovering from 611 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:43,600 Speaker 3: the torn acl his timeline for return up in the air, 612 00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:46,920 Speaker 3: and Joe Shane emphasized they have to prepare for the 613 00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:49,840 Speaker 3: worst case scenario that he may not be available for 614 00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:52,520 Speaker 3: Week one. We know that means Tommy DeVito is the 615 00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:56,160 Speaker 3: only quarterback right now currently under contract who is healthy, 616 00:29:56,440 --> 00:30:00,720 Speaker 3: Tyrod Taylor a pending free agent, and they have Russ 617 00:30:00,800 --> 00:30:03,520 Speaker 3: the sixth overall pick. Now, Joe Shane made it clear 618 00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:06,880 Speaker 3: Daniel Jones is their guy and when healthy, he will 619 00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:10,880 Speaker 3: be the starting quarterback. But like any team, and especially 620 00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:14,680 Speaker 3: this year, eleven of the sixteen AFC teams. 621 00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:16,720 Speaker 4: Had to go to a backup quarterback. 622 00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:19,800 Speaker 3: So even if you hope and pray that your quarterback's 623 00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:22,680 Speaker 3: gonna stay healthy, the NFL gods then look at you, 624 00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:25,760 Speaker 3: They laugh at you, and they have a good chuckle 625 00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:28,600 Speaker 3: at your expense. So you have to prepare accordingly. And 626 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:31,760 Speaker 3: I think the Giants need to prioritize. Do you bring 627 00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:34,320 Speaker 3: back Tyrod Taylor that is not off the table, as 628 00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:37,800 Speaker 3: Joe Shane indicated, Do you go younger in the draft. 629 00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:39,880 Speaker 3: Do you have to take that into consideration for the 630 00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:42,120 Speaker 3: salary cap? Or do you feel good enough about Tommy 631 00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:45,200 Speaker 3: Devino that he's the insurance policy. So a lot of 632 00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:48,120 Speaker 3: things Russ that the Giants front office has to weigh here. 633 00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:51,720 Speaker 6: Yeah, and the dollars and cents in particular when you're 634 00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:55,160 Speaker 6: talking about Tyrod Taylor, certainly that becomes a factor. I 635 00:30:55,160 --> 00:31:00,400 Speaker 6: mean Tyrod Taylor, like quite frankly, is your perfect backup quoquarterback. 636 00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:04,160 Speaker 6: He's a veteran guy, he's smart, but who knows what 637 00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:06,040 Speaker 6: it's going to cost. I know in the past it 638 00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:08,920 Speaker 6: was costing him what I think he was making five 639 00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:14,080 Speaker 6: and a half million dollars. Five and a half million dollars, 640 00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:18,160 Speaker 6: you know, a season. You know, quite frankly, I wouldn't 641 00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:21,560 Speaker 6: mind if Tyrod comes back. But if Tyrod is not 642 00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:25,640 Speaker 6: coming back, then what free agent? What veteran free agent? 643 00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:28,520 Speaker 6: What quarterback can we bring in? Or as you say, 644 00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:31,160 Speaker 6: in the draft, who are we going to bring in? 645 00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:31,720 Speaker 4: And do we? 646 00:31:32,720 --> 00:31:36,960 Speaker 6: I firmly believe Daniel Jones is their guy. I don't 647 00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:40,400 Speaker 6: think there's if any but if we're any butts about it. However, 648 00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:42,720 Speaker 6: as you say, you got to prepare for the worst, 649 00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:46,400 Speaker 6: and they have to be ready. So if listen, if 650 00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:49,120 Speaker 6: you're going to draft a quarterback, then Tyrod, whether it's 651 00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:53,320 Speaker 6: and when I say draft the quarterback, I'd be knocked 652 00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:56,160 Speaker 6: over with the feather if they drafted a quarterback with 653 00:31:56,240 --> 00:31:58,440 Speaker 6: their first pick. I don't see that happening at all 654 00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:01,600 Speaker 6: because Daniel Jones is their guy. But if you're going 655 00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:03,880 Speaker 6: to bring it a quarterback, you have to have confidence 656 00:32:03,920 --> 00:32:06,719 Speaker 6: that that guy could be the backup, because this certainly 657 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:09,160 Speaker 6: not going to draft the quarterback and then have Tyrod 658 00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:10,000 Speaker 6: Dale to come back. 659 00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:11,600 Speaker 4: I'm taking notes. 660 00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:13,560 Speaker 3: When we get around the draft, we will run an 661 00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:16,840 Speaker 3: experiment with Russ will tar and feather him in center 662 00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:19,560 Speaker 3: square to determine whether or not he does fall over 663 00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:22,120 Speaker 3: or he stays upright in the event that the Giants 664 00:32:22,240 --> 00:32:23,280 Speaker 3: do draft a quarterback. 665 00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:25,520 Speaker 4: So wherever you are, just make sure that you took 666 00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:26,000 Speaker 4: quarter back. 667 00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:29,520 Speaker 8: Ye, draft a quarterback with their first pick as well, right. 668 00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:31,280 Speaker 3: Yes, with the sixth overall pick. No, I've heard you 669 00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:32,920 Speaker 3: aloud and clear, and we're going to make sure that 670 00:32:32,960 --> 00:32:36,560 Speaker 3: it's documented crystal clear here on the Giants Hangout. We 671 00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:39,920 Speaker 3: take notes, We're studious in everything that we do here 672 00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:42,200 Speaker 3: moving forward. So I'm glad that you at least put 673 00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:46,000 Speaker 3: it in perspective from that standpoint. In fairness, though, Matt 674 00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:47,560 Speaker 3: and I want to bring you into the dialogue too. 675 00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:50,480 Speaker 3: I think Russ brings up a number of interesting points. Now, 676 00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:53,720 Speaker 3: even if they decide to go younger to help some 677 00:32:53,840 --> 00:32:56,440 Speaker 3: of the salary cap constraints, and we've seen a lot 678 00:32:56,440 --> 00:32:58,960 Speaker 3: of teams do that, because, as Russ hit on, it's 679 00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:01,320 Speaker 3: the going rate of about five million dollars a year 680 00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:03,640 Speaker 3: for a veteran backup, and every team does not. 681 00:33:03,920 --> 00:33:04,840 Speaker 4: Have that luxury. 682 00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:07,760 Speaker 3: But you have to ask yourself, if you do draft 683 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:11,320 Speaker 3: a quarterback, is that quarterback ready, especially if Daniel Jones 684 00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:13,440 Speaker 3: is not ready to go week one, to come in 685 00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:15,160 Speaker 3: and help you win football games. 686 00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:16,680 Speaker 4: Because I thought one of the. 687 00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:20,280 Speaker 3: Interesting things that Joe Shane mentioned is they need somebody 688 00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:23,640 Speaker 3: ready to go that can run the offense, compete, and 689 00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:26,200 Speaker 3: help them win football games. If you're bringing in a 690 00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:30,240 Speaker 3: developmental project and Daniel's not ready to go, that doesn't 691 00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:33,160 Speaker 3: put you in any better position than you were perhaps 692 00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:35,320 Speaker 3: this season in handling Daniel's injury. 693 00:33:36,400 --> 00:33:38,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, you just nail it on the head. 694 00:33:38,640 --> 00:33:41,320 Speaker 7: I mean, whether it's if they draft a quarterback, whether 695 00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:44,960 Speaker 7: it's day one, day two, day three, it's it's a 696 00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:47,600 Speaker 7: tall test to have that rookie be ready to go, 697 00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:51,160 Speaker 7: potentially to start week one of the NFL season in 698 00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:53,440 Speaker 7: their first year in the league Like that is a 699 00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:56,120 Speaker 7: big ask, even for a you know, we've seen it 700 00:33:56,160 --> 00:33:58,680 Speaker 7: in recent years with guys that are taking you know, 701 00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:02,959 Speaker 7: number one overall, Top three, top five overall. Those quarterbacks 702 00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:06,000 Speaker 7: you know, you see they tend to whether or not 703 00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:08,960 Speaker 7: they're ready for it. Teams put them in to start 704 00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:12,040 Speaker 7: right from the get go. But who I don't think 705 00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:15,400 Speaker 7: that's necessarily, you know, the best way A for the 706 00:34:15,400 --> 00:34:18,120 Speaker 7: team to win football games and b for those quarterbacks 707 00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:21,000 Speaker 7: to develop. I mean, I don't want to compare any 708 00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:24,160 Speaker 7: quarterback situation to potentially the best quarterback in the league 709 00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:25,040 Speaker 7: and Patrick Mahomes. 710 00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:27,919 Speaker 2: But Patrick Mahomes sat an entire season. 711 00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:30,480 Speaker 7: And his rookie year, only played the very last game 712 00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:33,480 Speaker 7: of his rookie season, and then he started as the 713 00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:36,720 Speaker 7: quarterback starting quarterback for the Chiefs in year two. Aaron 714 00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:39,480 Speaker 7: Rodgers set the first three years of his career before 715 00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:42,000 Speaker 7: he finally got a chance to start football games. So 716 00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:45,600 Speaker 7: I get that, in an ideal world, you would like 717 00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:48,960 Speaker 7: to bring, you know, a rookie quarterback in on a 718 00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:51,880 Speaker 7: rookie contract and have that guy be ready to go 719 00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:55,480 Speaker 7: as your potentially as your insurance plan to start for 720 00:34:55,560 --> 00:34:59,359 Speaker 7: week one in case Daniel's not ready. But if they 721 00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:02,160 Speaker 7: if the job, if any team wants to get their 722 00:35:02,160 --> 00:35:05,840 Speaker 7: season going on the right note, that may not necessarily be, 723 00:35:05,960 --> 00:35:10,680 Speaker 7: you know, the ideal plan as we saw this year sixty. 724 00:35:10,719 --> 00:35:13,720 Speaker 7: I don't know the exact number sixty something quarterbacks started 725 00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:14,319 Speaker 7: a game in the. 726 00:35:14,320 --> 00:35:15,200 Speaker 2: NFL this season. 727 00:35:15,560 --> 00:35:18,680 Speaker 7: It was the second most in NFL history, with the 728 00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:21,560 Speaker 7: first most being twenty twenty two, where there was a 729 00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:24,160 Speaker 7: one or two more quarterbacks that started the game. So 730 00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:27,160 Speaker 7: the last two seasons we have seen more starting quarterbacks 731 00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:31,319 Speaker 7: start a game and ever before in NFL history, So 732 00:35:31,520 --> 00:35:35,759 Speaker 7: which just highlights how crucial the backup quarterback position is. 733 00:35:36,200 --> 00:35:39,759 Speaker 7: And frankly, I couldn't tell you right now which way 734 00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:42,279 Speaker 7: the Giants are going to go with that position, whether 735 00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,800 Speaker 7: it's bring in, bring Tyrod back, bring in a different veteran, 736 00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:49,200 Speaker 7: bring in a rookie. Joe Shane has made it clear 737 00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:51,960 Speaker 7: that they are going to address the position in some capacity, 738 00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:56,520 Speaker 7: but honestly, I think it's a little too early to 739 00:35:56,520 --> 00:36:00,399 Speaker 7: say which route exactly they do go, but you can 740 00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:02,680 Speaker 7: bet that they will be bringing someone in that they 741 00:36:02,719 --> 00:36:05,879 Speaker 7: do feel confident we'll be able to start from week one, 742 00:36:06,120 --> 00:36:09,200 Speaker 7: just in case Daniel Jones is not fully recovered from 743 00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:10,400 Speaker 7: that torn acl. 744 00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:13,200 Speaker 3: Well and Matt, to your point, Cleveland had four different 745 00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:17,040 Speaker 3: quarterbacks start this season and still won double digit games 746 00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:18,920 Speaker 3: and made the playoffs. So if that doesn't spell out 747 00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:21,160 Speaker 3: how crazy this season was then I don't know what 748 00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:23,160 Speaker 3: is and how I want to give you the last word. 749 00:36:23,200 --> 00:36:25,120 Speaker 3: But one other thing that I want you to respond 750 00:36:25,160 --> 00:36:28,040 Speaker 3: to that Matt was hitting on is the timeline here. 751 00:36:28,080 --> 00:36:30,720 Speaker 3: The good news is by the time the draft comes along, 752 00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:33,400 Speaker 3: they'll have a better idea of where Daniel Jones is 753 00:36:33,760 --> 00:36:36,680 Speaker 3: in the rehab process, so it's not as if they 754 00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:40,200 Speaker 3: have to make a decision tomorrow. But free agency comes first, 755 00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:43,480 Speaker 3: and when free agency starts a little bit earlier in 756 00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:46,000 Speaker 3: the year compared to the draft. So if you do 757 00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:48,680 Speaker 3: like the free agent options or you want to bring 758 00:36:48,719 --> 00:36:52,520 Speaker 3: back Tyrod Taylor that you have to operate with before, 759 00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:55,520 Speaker 3: you may have a good grasp of where Daniel's going 760 00:36:55,600 --> 00:36:57,560 Speaker 3: to be closer to the start of the season. 761 00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:00,239 Speaker 5: I think there are a lot of factors have to 762 00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:03,360 Speaker 5: think about, you know, first off, like Daniel's a running quarterback, 763 00:37:03,440 --> 00:37:06,799 Speaker 5: so his legs are his you know, his honey, you 764 00:37:06,840 --> 00:37:09,120 Speaker 5: know most of all. So him coming back at one 765 00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:12,000 Speaker 5: hundred percent is one thing, But him coming back mentally 766 00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:15,000 Speaker 5: one hundred percent being prepared to run to cut for 767 00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:17,719 Speaker 5: people to be around his legs, that's usually you know, 768 00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:19,680 Speaker 5: that takes a lot to get to someone's going to 769 00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:21,920 Speaker 5: have to hit him to get him like okay, I'm 770 00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:24,640 Speaker 5: all right, I'm safe, I'm fine, And that's the hardest 771 00:37:24,680 --> 00:37:27,640 Speaker 5: thing to get by. That's number one. Number two, you 772 00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:29,759 Speaker 5: have taken the factor of why is he hurt in 773 00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:32,440 Speaker 5: the first place, like, okay, well he didn't have a 774 00:37:32,440 --> 00:37:35,360 Speaker 5: lot of protection. You talking about eighty sacks, you know, 775 00:37:35,440 --> 00:37:38,360 Speaker 5: the eighty sacks for the season. You're going to have 776 00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:41,719 Speaker 5: to address that offensive line. I know that we're talking 777 00:37:41,719 --> 00:37:44,760 Speaker 5: about the quarterback constantly, and who can back up Daniel? 778 00:37:44,840 --> 00:37:47,800 Speaker 5: Who who could stand in there for Daniel if Daniel's 779 00:37:47,800 --> 00:37:51,080 Speaker 5: not ready, if there's no no, you know, changing offensive 780 00:37:51,080 --> 00:37:52,960 Speaker 5: lineup to play of the offensive line. If there's not 781 00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:55,600 Speaker 5: another guy that comes in and gets a little bit better, 782 00:37:55,840 --> 00:37:58,480 Speaker 5: then it doesn't matter who they bring in to play quarterback. 783 00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:00,600 Speaker 5: But he's not gonna make it. You speak of these 784 00:38:00,640 --> 00:38:03,279 Speaker 5: teams that have had multiple quarterbacks. You know, they get 785 00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:06,239 Speaker 5: hurt on sometimes a flute play, but they have good 786 00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:08,560 Speaker 5: offensive lines. They're able to move the ball down the field, 787 00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:10,239 Speaker 5: They're able to run the ball, They're able to do 788 00:38:10,719 --> 00:38:12,960 Speaker 5: a lot of different things. They're going to have to 789 00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:16,080 Speaker 5: fix the tires before they start fixing the car. Is 790 00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:18,440 Speaker 5: what I keep telling guys, And I think the quarterback 791 00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:20,759 Speaker 5: position could be filled in the first pick in the 792 00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:23,840 Speaker 5: draft if the right guy failed in the spot. But 793 00:38:24,239 --> 00:38:26,279 Speaker 5: chances are those first three guys will be gone off 794 00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:28,640 Speaker 5: the board in those first three or four picks, So 795 00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:31,279 Speaker 5: you'll be left with probably a wide receiver or something 796 00:38:31,320 --> 00:38:32,960 Speaker 5: that's gonna be the best player of the draft. You're 797 00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:35,319 Speaker 5: not gonna pass pass up one of the you know, 798 00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:41,600 Speaker 5: a career chainer or defining wide receiver to to reach 799 00:38:41,680 --> 00:38:42,280 Speaker 5: for alignment. 800 00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:42,879 Speaker 7: Uh. 801 00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:46,320 Speaker 5: And that's that's gonna be the big issue going forward. 802 00:38:46,400 --> 00:38:48,880 Speaker 5: I think. As for backups, you know, there's gonna be 803 00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:50,640 Speaker 5: a lot of guys out there that they could pick up. 804 00:38:50,680 --> 00:38:52,640 Speaker 5: You know, there will be quarterbacks. You know, the kid 805 00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:55,319 Speaker 5: from Michigan will be a second or third round pick. 806 00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:58,759 Speaker 5: Probably the kid from Washington who you know, who was 807 00:38:59,400 --> 00:39:01,680 Speaker 5: racing up the charts, racing down the charts, racing up 808 00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:05,680 Speaker 5: the charts with those bad knees. But some true ability 809 00:39:05,719 --> 00:39:07,880 Speaker 5: could be a backup quarterback as well. He may not 810 00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:09,759 Speaker 5: be a first round pick, he may ain't be a 811 00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:12,560 Speaker 5: second round pick, depending on how they evaluate his legs 812 00:39:12,560 --> 00:39:14,600 Speaker 5: and stuff. So there are guys in the draft that 813 00:39:14,640 --> 00:39:16,120 Speaker 5: you can probably pick up. There are a couple other 814 00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:18,840 Speaker 5: guys too, they'll be in the draft that are decent 815 00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:22,279 Speaker 5: quarterbacks that could be backup quarterbacks. As far as veterans go, 816 00:39:22,760 --> 00:39:26,680 Speaker 5: there's everything, everything's on the table. You can find one 817 00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:29,200 Speaker 5: of these guys that are backing up now that probably 818 00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:30,759 Speaker 5: when their starter is going to come back, they'll be 819 00:39:30,800 --> 00:39:33,840 Speaker 5: sent to the bench or even cut, so they'll be available. 820 00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:37,960 Speaker 5: You can find guys like Justin Fields who won't be 821 00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:40,279 Speaker 5: released but should be traded. They're not going to get 822 00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:42,200 Speaker 5: a lot form in a trade, whether they want want 823 00:39:42,280 --> 00:39:43,560 Speaker 5: to say that or not. They're not gonna get like 824 00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:45,440 Speaker 5: a first round pick for him. They're not even going 825 00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:47,000 Speaker 5: to third round pick for him. I don't believe they 826 00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:48,600 Speaker 5: might get a fourth round pick for him. So that 827 00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:51,080 Speaker 5: they're gonna be players out there that you can pick 828 00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:54,600 Speaker 5: up in the draft that show potential. But the thing is, 829 00:39:55,080 --> 00:39:57,400 Speaker 5: you want a good backup quarterback. You don't want a 830 00:39:57,400 --> 00:39:59,880 Speaker 5: guy well you're not in theory. You don't want to 831 00:39:59,880 --> 00:40:02,560 Speaker 5: go out here that people and fans are going to 832 00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:06,080 Speaker 5: say could challenge Daniel for his starting role because they 833 00:40:06,239 --> 00:40:09,359 Speaker 5: just as like drama to the team and outside noise 834 00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:10,760 Speaker 5: that you don't want to listen to all the time. 835 00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:15,560 Speaker 4: Well, you want somebody that can help you win football games. Yes, yeah, 836 00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:16,719 Speaker 4: they have had a lot of drama. 837 00:40:16,719 --> 00:40:18,040 Speaker 3: I don't think they want more, but I think the 838 00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:20,880 Speaker 3: bigger priority has to be are you confident the quarterback 839 00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:24,200 Speaker 3: can run your offense, keep your competitive and win football games. 840 00:40:24,200 --> 00:40:27,040 Speaker 3: So that's why to use your car analogy. The tires 841 00:40:27,080 --> 00:40:29,440 Speaker 3: have to be in good shape, so is the infrastructure. 842 00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:32,040 Speaker 3: But even the backup driver matters at the end of 843 00:40:32,080 --> 00:40:34,640 Speaker 3: the day to help navigate things, even if he's got 844 00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:36,440 Speaker 3: to get out of the car and push it himself. 845 00:40:36,920 --> 00:40:40,719 Speaker 3: Try to keep the offensive float. With that being said, yes, 846 00:40:41,160 --> 00:40:44,120 Speaker 3: that is going to wrap up the last regular season 847 00:40:44,239 --> 00:40:48,080 Speaker 3: edition of the Giants Hangout podcast. It is presented by Crestron, 848 00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:50,520 Speaker 3: a proud partner of the New York Giants. We appreciate 849 00:40:50,520 --> 00:40:54,320 Speaker 3: everybody tuning in all throughout the season as we usually 850 00:40:54,560 --> 00:40:57,040 Speaker 3: recap every game and look forward a little bit different 851 00:40:57,360 --> 00:40:59,279 Speaker 3: as we took a look to what should be an 852 00:40:59,320 --> 00:41:02,840 Speaker 3: eventful off and the impact of some of the coaching changes. 853 00:41:03,120 --> 00:41:06,760 Speaker 3: Lance Meadow, Russ Salzburg, Howard Cross, Matt Sytek of Giants 854 00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:09,440 Speaker 3: dot Com with you, you can stay locked to all 855 00:41:09,480 --> 00:41:12,440 Speaker 3: the latest with respect to the Giants on Giants dot com, 856 00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:15,520 Speaker 3: the mobile app, and your favorite podcast platform. 857 00:41:15,680 --> 00:41:18,480 Speaker 1: Have a good one, great job there, awesome conversation by 858 00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:20,360 Speaker 1: the guys. I hope you enjoy it again. 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