Speaker 1: The Around the NFL Podcast would be a good bit
Speaker 1: for Chip Kelly's offense. Welcome to another edition of the
Speaker 1: Around the NFL Podcast. I'm Greg Rosenthal alongside a couple
Speaker 1: of heroes, Mark Sessler and Chris Westling. Hey, Greg, see
Speaker 1: I get no respect? What a pause between that? Yes?
Speaker 1: Of course. If you'll notice our fearless host Dan Handas
Speaker 1: not here today, Happy birthday to day in hand this,
Speaker 1: he gave himself a big birthday present and that was
Speaker 1: staying away from us. Who can blame him? Listen, I'll
Speaker 1: tell you what it's been hot in this studio. Came
Speaker 1: up here about ten minutes ago while TV was fiddling
Speaker 1: around the controls behind the glass, and the heat between
Speaker 1: Rosenthal and west is uncomfortable. Hold on here, you're distancing
Speaker 1: yourself from this? Yes, well, it really started as Mark
Speaker 1: and west arguing about a Josh McCown versus Zach Mettenberger
Speaker 1: who would you rather have? And then it really kick
Speaker 1: started a week long argument that really has threatened to
Speaker 1: tear apart the Around the NFL group about Zach Mettenberger
Speaker 1: between Chris Wesley and myself, which we're really going to
Speaker 1: dive into a little more later in this show. You're excited. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm sure listeners are just hanging on waiting for the
Speaker 1: extra Zach Mettenberger analysis. Well, it's late April. Let's show us.
Speaker 1: You know this heat the scientist eat or any arguments
Speaker 1: between us is you know, not really just manufactured. We're
Speaker 1: talking about whether we're on the podcast or not. I
Speaker 1: guarantee right now Dan Is, when he's listening to this,
Speaker 1: he's like, not enough birthday talk about Dan. We've got
Speaker 1: to talk more about that aspect. Big three five for Danny.
Speaker 1: Oh really, that's a big one. I guess at this point,
Speaker 1: does it really matter he can officially run for US president. Well,
Speaker 1: we will call Dan hands Is a little bit later,
Speaker 1: see if he's there. He doesn't know we're gonna do this,
Speaker 1: so he might not answer. We'll see what happens. He might. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we gotta big show. I mean, we got that. We
Speaker 1: are gonna talk about a little series we're doing re
Speaker 1: drafting and ranking the class of two thousand and fourteen
Speaker 1: draft at different positions. Okay, you know, if we get
Speaker 1: all the draft knicks out there they're studying in all
Speaker 1: the college tape, what about the guys that are actually
Speaker 1: in the league. Let's revisit him a year later, get
Speaker 1: our you know, studying on West did a huge, great
Speaker 1: piece on the wide receivers, one of the best classes
Speaker 1: of all time, maybe the best. I am putting out
Speaker 1: one on the quarterbacks and Mark has the tight end,
Speaker 1: so we'll talk about that a little later. Tight ends. Hey,
Speaker 1: Jason Morrow as a person too, and uh, we also
Speaker 1: have Daniel Jeremiah on the show. With the NFL Draft
Speaker 1: only a week away, we're gonna talk to DJ. Dan
Speaker 1: was here. We pre taped that on Wednesday, and we're
Speaker 1: gonna talk a little draft. Get some knowledge from Danna Jeremiah.
Speaker 1: He had he has another pot. He does something else here, right,
Speaker 1: he does well the Stake's podcast. Check it up. You
Speaker 1: get to the draft talk. I stayed out of that
Speaker 1: segment and I'm not on it because DJ, you know,
Speaker 1: he on Twitter got to me, said a little uncomfortable
Speaker 1: to have to go up with the tape watching that
Speaker 1: you've been doing on some of the defensive tackle prospects
Speaker 1: in line. I said, I'll sit out. This will be
Speaker 1: your thing, but yeah, well you have to listen. There
Speaker 1: was some awkward moments between him and Dan Jansas that
Speaker 1: I don't tell very bubbly DJ. On this episode, he
Speaker 1: was excited to be here. Other than you know, they've
Speaker 1: they've had the heat between Dan and uh. You know
Speaker 1: there's heat between West and I. But of course there's
Speaker 1: a lot of love. I felt bad, really for you
Speaker 1: last night when you almost lost your four thousand word
Speaker 1: opus to the vagaries of your computer. You said you
Speaker 1: were you were literally going to cry in the newsroom
Speaker 1: by yourself at eight o'clock at night. And so when
Speaker 1: I t guys saved you, I was five minutes away
Speaker 1: from rolling into the fetal position and sucking my thumb
Speaker 1: and just calling it quits on every on life. I mean,
Speaker 1: it was just what did it just disappear into it?
Speaker 1: Thought he lost the whole I hit a button called
Speaker 1: save draft, and four thousand words up and disappeared. That
Speaker 1: is a horror movie for a writer, basically, just I
Speaker 1: mean it was hopeless, especially a week and a half
Speaker 1: of film watching, research, note taking, and then crafting the words.
Speaker 1: I went the way I want them all out the window?
Speaker 1: Are you here right now? Like I will still be,
Speaker 1: I will still be. He got back recaptured after like
Speaker 1: a couple of hours, Like they were like oh, you
Speaker 1: just have to email word Press and figure it out,
Speaker 1: because we can't figure anything. It's called different levels of
Speaker 1: work ethic. That's why he's here. I mean, yeah, he
Speaker 1: wasn't messing around. He went and watched this his San
Speaker 1: Antonio Spurs West is my beloved San Antony he key
Speaker 1: big Spurs fan. And then you know, finished the column
Speaker 1: after that. So we'll get to all that later. But
Speaker 1: good game. It was until the Spurs started with that
Speaker 1: hack crap. How about this a little basketball te Mark
Speaker 1: and I are clueless. I'm trying to follow. I'm following.
Speaker 1: We all like the it and I like it. I'm
Speaker 1: following it. All right, let's do a little news. I
Speaker 1: told him to keep his shirt on. Uh that is
Speaker 1: Barry Obama if you missed it at the White House.
Speaker 1: I love Barack Obama. I'm gonna told him to keep
Speaker 1: his shirt on. I've gotta miss I'm gonna miss it.
Speaker 1: You know you can. I don't care what politics you
Speaker 1: have or whatever. You gotta like the singers that Obama
Speaker 1: always comes up with. You don't really like him as
Speaker 1: much as his comedy writers. Well, I love I did
Speaker 1: say he's got a great comedy writers. I mean, his
Speaker 1: best line today was that, you know, he was he
Speaker 1: usually makes a lot of jokes, um, but you know
Speaker 1: he was worried today with the Patriots in town that
Speaker 1: eleven of twelve could fall flat. You know, that's pretty good.
Speaker 1: The newsroom generally found that to be a funny joke.
Speaker 1: You know, he took on blotch. I guess. So he's
Speaker 1: saying his delivery is good. He's he's good at delivery. Absolutely,
Speaker 1: I'll give him whatever. I mean, he's will he follows
Speaker 1: sports two care So it was fun. We're not really
Speaker 1: going to talk about the White House that We'll talk
Speaker 1: about some real news. And it dropped yesterday that Greg Hardy,
Speaker 1: now of the Dallas Cowboys ten game suspension for violating
Speaker 1: the league's conduct policy and really various offenses, uh, the
Speaker 1: new personal conduct policy that includes domestic violence, a bigger
Speaker 1: suspension than a lot of people expected. Do you think
Speaker 1: the Cowboys would have still made this signing if they
Speaker 1: knew he was gonna be suspended ten games. That's a
Speaker 1: good question, because his salary makes a lot more sense
Speaker 1: now that he's been suspended ten games, because he was
Speaker 1: gonna you know, it was built his thirteen million over
Speaker 1: sixteen games. So now it seems more in line with
Speaker 1: you know, the fact that he's gonna miss most of
Speaker 1: the season. I mean, the contract now looks like you said,
Speaker 1: real smart, And I normally would say, at this point,
Speaker 1: you know what, there's still a ton of football to
Speaker 1: go with six games left, and I think this can
Speaker 1: work out. And it can, except you are talking about
Speaker 1: a guy that at this point would not have played
Speaker 1: for what straight regular season games. They did play that
Speaker 1: one week one game, which was so weird last year.
Speaker 1: That's where I came to fifteen plus ten. That's right.
Speaker 1: I don't know what I was thinking there, you go,
Speaker 1: scientist what not? A mathematician? It is. I think that
Speaker 1: the contract, I guess was smart because it was per game.
Speaker 1: But they still, as Ian Rappaport, our NFL Media Insider reported,
Speaker 1: you know, they were thinking it's gonna be anywhere from
Speaker 1: two to four to six. So this is a big
Speaker 1: surprise to them, and they don't have, um, you know,
Speaker 1: pass rushers on that team. I also wasn't surprised on
Speaker 1: in a certain you know, vantage point, because this is
Speaker 1: the post ray Rice world. It's a different world in
Speaker 1: the NFL. And Greg Hardy is kind of the foremost
Speaker 1: example of that. So for them to come down very
Speaker 1: hard on him isn't totally shocking. Well, there's two sides
Speaker 1: to every story. But if what he is alleged to
Speaker 1: have done is true, I have no problem with this,
Speaker 1: of course, Yeah, I think most don't. And like the league,
Speaker 1: one thing is, no matter what they do, you take
Speaker 1: a hard stance like this, they're gonna get attacked on
Speaker 1: Twitter for whatever this was, and they get attack. Did
Speaker 1: they take two weakest stance? And I think that Dave.
Speaker 1: For all the attacking the NFL gets and all the heat,
Speaker 1: I think they kind of stuck to the guns here
Speaker 1: with this one. No bad pun intended there. Uh. The
Speaker 1: only the only problem with Greg Hardy getting ten games
Speaker 1: is that it wouldn't surprise me if it gets reduced
Speaker 1: because he missed last year and he was paid. It
Speaker 1: was not a suspension. But the NFL, they know it
Speaker 1: more than anyone else. Are there in a bad streak
Speaker 1: right now with these appeals. Yeah, they've gotten some things overturned.
Speaker 1: Ray Rice was it was an issue Adrian Peterson's happened
Speaker 1: in court. So this isn't really the end of this story.
Speaker 1: Let's move on to the field, where the Miami Dolphins
Speaker 1: uh continued their off season spending by going after Greg Jennings,
Speaker 1: signing the wide receiver ultimately to play replace Brian Hartline.
Speaker 1: I guess kind of for that that spot in the
Speaker 1: lineup slide up grade. I think Greg Jennings has spent
Speaker 1: most of the last two years in the slot, but
Speaker 1: that's Jarvis Landry's position in Miami, so I guess, and
Speaker 1: he's playing the Z or or the X there. But yeah,
Speaker 1: i've he's an upgrade on the heartline. How much money
Speaker 1: did you get? Was it for eight two years? Eight million,
Speaker 1: which probably means the only year guaranteed is the first year,
Speaker 1: and it's you know, probably three and a half or
Speaker 1: four similar money to your boy heartline. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: I don't think that hardline is gonna change events in Cleveland,
Speaker 1: and I don't think Greg Jennings is gonna completely change
Speaker 1: Miami's But for late April and what was left, not
Speaker 1: a bad signing for the Dolphins. They needed veteran healthy
Speaker 1: other all young guys, Yeah, Kenny Stills, Jervis Landry or
Speaker 1: Shard Matthews. Now Greg Jennings. I don't think this precludes
Speaker 1: them from drafting an early round wide receiver. No way,
Speaker 1: by any stretch, he'll play for them, though. You know
Speaker 1: when I watched them, when I watched the Teddy Bridgewater
Speaker 1: tape lately, he didn't look like he was done by
Speaker 1: any means. No, I think he had some place after
Speaker 1: the catchy. He just looked like he was missing a
Speaker 1: little bit, and he he had a hard time getting
Speaker 1: on the same page with Teddy bridge Riter really more
Speaker 1: than the other receivers there. Yeah, he was outplayed by
Speaker 1: Charles Johnson, but I I agree. I think Greg Jenny
Speaker 1: still is a little bit left in the town. Marvin
Speaker 1: Lewis has got another year left in the tank and
Speaker 1: the bank account to another one year extension. He hasn't
Speaker 1: won a playoff game his entire run in Cincinnati, but
Speaker 1: he gets another contract extension. This is through two thousand
Speaker 1: and sixteen. Connor Or wrote a good piece on the
Speaker 1: five untouchable coaches in the NFL right now that haven't
Speaker 1: necessarily had recent playoffs success, But it just seems like
Speaker 1: they're almost untouchable. They're gonna keep their jobs if they
Speaker 1: just keep their current level. And Marvin Lewis is one
Speaker 1: of those guys. If you were a Bengals fan, Mark Sessler,
Speaker 1: would you be happy about this move? Well, if I
Speaker 1: were a Bengal, if I were still a Bengals fan
Speaker 1: at this point, I would be very frustrated with Marvin Lewis.
Speaker 1: I'd be very frustrated with his decisions at quarterback. And
Speaker 1: basically it boils back down to Wes's boy Mike Brown.
Speaker 1: Who Why is Marvin Lewis untouchable because apparently the Brown
Speaker 1: family does not feel they need to upgrade this situation.
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know what you're gonna get. What
Speaker 1: you get with Marvin Lewis, Well, this is a situation
Speaker 1: and where unless you are from Cincinnati and are very
Speaker 1: familiar with how this this franchise runs, they're a mom
Speaker 1: and pop operation. They don't run their franchise like the
Speaker 1: other thirty one teams, and they have they have the
Speaker 1: most secretive front office formula of any franchise in the league.
Speaker 1: And what's happened is Mike Brown has seeded control to
Speaker 1: a conglomerate of Marvin Lewis, sounds, Eva Duke Tobin, and
Speaker 1: Katie Blackburn Brown and several other several other members of
Speaker 1: the Brown family. So Marvin Lewis has a lot of
Speaker 1: job security by being part of the personnel now like
Speaker 1: he's in he's in the personnel department, and his coaches
Speaker 1: are also have a big say in who they draft.
Speaker 1: So I think that's a big part of it. And
Speaker 1: if you I mean for perspective on on why Marvin
Speaker 1: Lewis has been so successful. One ninety six and two
Speaker 1: is his record, and since Mike Brown took over for
Speaker 1: Paul Brown in all other Bengals coaches I believe are
Speaker 1: fifty five and one forty six, which is a two
Speaker 1: forty winning percentage. So Marvin Lewis has succeeded in an
Speaker 1: operation where every other coach has failed tremendously. From another
Speaker 1: angle that he could argue, we've been We've been to
Speaker 1: the playoffs four straight years. Whether or not you like
Speaker 1: Andy Dalton or you like Marvin Lewis, we're there. We
Speaker 1: got a talented roster. It's not an absolute train wreck,
Speaker 1: but it's just not there's nothing inspiring happening in Cincinnati. Well,
Speaker 1: the other guys on Connor's list, Jeff Fisher, when was
Speaker 1: the last time he made the playoffs? What's the last
Speaker 1: time he didn't go seven and nine. This Sea last
Speaker 1: year at six since then even worse. Uh, Tom Coughlin's
Speaker 1: on that list. He's made the ploffs once in the
Speaker 1: last six years. He's won two Super Bowls. I know,
Speaker 1: I know, but I'm just saying he's under five hundred
Speaker 1: over the last four years. Overall, he's made the playoffs
Speaker 1: once in six years. Brad Childress has made the playoffs
Speaker 1: as often as Tom Coughlin in the last six years.
Speaker 1: Wade Phillips has made the playoffs as often. Todd Haley
Speaker 1: has made the playoffs as often. I'm trying to think
Speaker 1: of some other coaches. I don't know. Did Eric Studesville
Speaker 1: make the playoffs for the Denver Broncos. Probably not, But
Speaker 1: you know, at least Marvin Lewis to get to the
Speaker 1: playoffs with the Bengals is in a comp push, man.
Speaker 1: I think Marvin Lewis would be hired if he lost
Speaker 1: that Bengals job by another team quickly. I don't think
Speaker 1: he'd be hired as a head coach, really, I think
Speaker 1: he'd be hired as a defensive coordinate. I think he
Speaker 1: may be hired as a head coach depending on what
Speaker 1: gaps were oute there. And you know when John Fox
Speaker 1: got hired coming off a disastrous season, but I don't think.
Speaker 1: I don't think Marvin Lewis is quite as respected as
Speaker 1: John FOXX. I disagree. I think the way I think
Speaker 1: he'd get a lot of points for winning in Cincinnati,
Speaker 1: and look at the coaches he's hired. You know, Hugh Jackson,
Speaker 1: he has good contacts. Uh, Jay Gruden gets hired else where,
Speaker 1: Mike Zimmer gets hired else I mean, that's a big
Speaker 1: part of your job as executive. They've done very well drafted.
Speaker 1: I think he probably gets some of the credit for that.
Speaker 1: They're winning with Andy Dalton, which is tough. Now we're
Speaker 1: starting to like the resigning. This is looking I don't
Speaker 1: mind it. I agree. I think that one of his
Speaker 1: most valuable traits is that he brings in great assistance.
Speaker 1: So you worry about how great of a coach he
Speaker 1: is or whether it's the assistance doing the work. But
Speaker 1: he does deserve credit for some of the personnel moves,
Speaker 1: for how good the roster has been lately. I just
Speaker 1: don't know that is actual coaching and game management. To me,
Speaker 1: it's among the worst in the NFL in big spots.
Speaker 1: He's terrible at challenges. He's terrible at making decisions during
Speaker 1: the game. I agree with that, Uh, and he doesn't
Speaker 1: have his team ready to play in in the in
Speaker 1: big games. One of the guys that's UH usually ready
Speaker 1: to play in big games. But his last play was discouraging.
Speaker 1: Definitely not a good decision. Russell Wilson has been talked
Speaker 1: in them news a lot because of his contract. He
Speaker 1: was on NFL Network this week and he's really pushing
Speaker 1: this baseball story and will be quick on this, but
Speaker 1: it's really interesting. He talked with Dan Helly on Total
Speaker 1: Access and he keeps insisting that his interest in baseball
Speaker 1: is not a employ and that if anyone could pull
Speaker 1: off baseball and football at the same time being a quarterback,
Speaker 1: it would be him. What are you? What is this?
Speaker 1: He needs a reality check? Well, let's let's compare him
Speaker 1: to another two sport want to be athletes. Russell Wilson,
Speaker 1: at twenty two years old, straight out of college, has
Speaker 1: been playing baseball the whole time. No layoff, HiT's two
Speaker 1: twenty nine with a walk walk strikeout ratio. Terrible numbers
Speaker 1: in a ball which is supposed to be easy. Michael
Speaker 1: Jordan fifteen years from playing baseball. HiT's two oh two
Speaker 1: with the same exact walk strikeout ratio and double a ball,
Speaker 1: which is a lot harder, and he hadn't played in
Speaker 1: fifteen years. Russell Wilson needs a wake up call. I
Speaker 1: think if you're if you're at his age, you're early twenties,
Speaker 1: and you're hailed around the NFL, is having completely cut
Speaker 1: against the grain of the prototypical NFL quarterback, largely because
Speaker 1: of who you are, how hard you work, how respected
Speaker 1: you are. You've been to two straight Super Bowls, you've
Speaker 1: turned you've created hundreds and thousands of jobs in Seattle.
Speaker 1: You probably believe you can do anything. He really sounds
Speaker 1: like it. You can see that to be a great
Speaker 1: athlete you have to have a certain uh bit of
Speaker 1: irrational confidence exactly naive. I don't know if it's being naive.
Speaker 1: It's just wild belief. It's like it's like TDS belief
Speaker 1: in his own basketball game or whatever it is producing skills.
Speaker 1: It's just wild over confidence. It's founded on the producing front.
Speaker 1: Just you know, I felt like you need to be
Speaker 1: what is up with all this baseball. It's a little ridiculous.
Speaker 1: It is kind of strange. Baseball is the hardest sport
Speaker 1: sport to play. You just can't wake up and be like, oh,
Speaker 1: just because I played it in college for a little while.
Speaker 1: There's a reason you have to master each level of
Speaker 1: the min right before you get to I love it.
Speaker 1: Whenever they asked the Rangers general manager about it, because
Speaker 1: all of his quotes, if you translate them down to
Speaker 1: their essence, are like, are you eff and kidding me?
Speaker 1: Like it's just like, oh, Russell's really competitive. We we
Speaker 1: like him a lot. We think he's got a good
Speaker 1: thing going in football, Like he's like, are you kidding me?
Speaker 1: Why would he equill? Maybe they're getting a cut of
Speaker 1: his new contract. I think it's all brinksmanship, is what
Speaker 1: this is, all right? That is that is the news
Speaker 1: for today, on this beautiful hands, this thirty fifth birthday,
Speaker 1: which gets me thinking, why why don't we call them?
Speaker 1: Let's not save let's not save that mother show. Let's
Speaker 1: just see Okay, let's see if they went the old
Speaker 1: zeuser is up to on his birthday. Alright, TV, let's
Speaker 1: get him on the horn. HI reached Dan. Sorry I
Speaker 1: can't get to the phone right now, but leave a
Speaker 1: message and I'll get back to you as soon as
Speaker 1: I can at the telne Please record your message. When
Speaker 1: you finished recording, you may hang up or press one
Speaker 1: for more options. Hey, Dan, Mark Cesler here, your cohort
Speaker 1: here at NFL Media. I just wanted to wish you
Speaker 1: happy birthday. Also want a side note. Couldn't get you
Speaker 1: on the phone here for the podcast. Could you just
Speaker 1: call me back and give me your true thoughts on
Speaker 1: a Chris Wesley And how do you feel that he
Speaker 1: is as a colleague and be as a boss? Greg
Speaker 1: Rosenthal rate him and through f Okay, what kind of
Speaker 1: birthday message is that? I don't know, Happy birthday, Dan.
Speaker 1: I thought we were gonna sing or something. All right,
Speaker 1: we'll see you. Oh that's it. I guess that didn't
Speaker 1: work out well. I want to get information. I was
Speaker 1: expecting you to go off on some you know, made
Speaker 1: up story or tangent of that. There was a fire
Speaker 1: at NFL Media and he had to come David, and
Speaker 1: I want information from him on the most honest day
Speaker 1: of the day he was born. I'm sure he'll call
Speaker 1: me back. Dan, celebrating today. Also, you know your lovely
Speaker 1: wife Simone, it's her birthday as well. It is a
Speaker 1: little eerie. They were born not only on the same
Speaker 1: month and day, but the same year, within hours of
Speaker 1: each other, not in the same place. Could they be related?
Speaker 1: I don't know. That's the thing. There's it's a mystery
Speaker 1: that has you know, other limbs. We don't know. Have
Speaker 1: you ever thought that dating simone is really the closest
Speaker 1: you could do to indirectly dating your friend Dan Kansas?
Speaker 1: Now I haven't correct, but now I am thinking that,
Speaker 1: and thank you we s that's how I primit. All right,
Speaker 1: let's move on to our talk about the two thousand
Speaker 1: fourteen crop in West I talked about it. You got
Speaker 1: your piece up right now on the best wide receivers
Speaker 1: from the class, and it's a fascinating piece. Everyone should
Speaker 1: check it out, you know, take your time with it,
Speaker 1: nice and long, you know, print it out maybe if
Speaker 1: you ller into paper and whatnot, and you make the
Speaker 1: case that you think there could be ten number one
Speaker 1: receivers in this one class. Well, I think there are
Speaker 1: that many guys with potential. You Odell Beckham, Mike Evans,
Speaker 1: Kelvin Benjamin already are Sammy Watkins I think he is.
Speaker 1: So there's four right off the bat. John Brown who's
Speaker 1: been compared to Marvin Harrison blew me away. When I
Speaker 1: watched his film, he he might have been the guy
Speaker 1: that I was more impressed than I expected to be.
Speaker 1: You've got guys like these raw guys with number one
Speaker 1: receiver talent, but they still need to work on the
Speaker 1: route running and reading defenses, like Martavis Bryant, Cody Lattimer,
Speaker 1: Dante Moncrief, You've got Jordan Matthews. So you think Dante
Speaker 1: Moncrief could be a potential number one receiver with Andrew Luck,
Speaker 1: I do, and and I believe I believe you called
Speaker 1: him that at one point last year that when you
Speaker 1: watched him, you saw a number one receiver. He is
Speaker 1: physically really talented. I was surprised to hear you say that.
Speaker 1: And Jordan Matthews too, So you think he could be
Speaker 1: more than us the slot game. He played the slot
Speaker 1: more than any receiver in the NFL last year percentage wise.
Speaker 1: But it seems like from their off season moves that
Speaker 1: they're gonna move him outside this year, and if he's
Speaker 1: in that number one role for the Eagles, his production
Speaker 1: is going to go through the roof. Just look what
Speaker 1: de Sean Jackson and Jeremy Macklin have done. So I
Speaker 1: think that's that's about ten guys right there. Brandon Cooks,
Speaker 1: who knows what he's going to be. Has anyone I mean,
Speaker 1: obviously the potential for this classes, but maybe the best
Speaker 1: wide receiver group ever because also the position is just
Speaker 1: so much more refined than it used to be as well,
Speaker 1: anyone on this list disappointed you with what they where
Speaker 1: they were drafting, and where they are. You know what,
Speaker 1: there really wasn't a lot of disappointment. I would say
Speaker 1: that Mark Heasley, you need to watch all of his
Speaker 1: games because the first half of the season was just
Speaker 1: a massive failure. He dropped passes, didn't know his assignments,
Speaker 1: didn't make plays, and then right around week thirteen he
Speaker 1: starts to show that explosive run after catchability that he
Speaker 1: was billed to have when he was seen as his
Speaker 1: sophomore year in college the number one receiver in the country.
Speaker 1: So he's a guy that you kind of have to
Speaker 1: watch all of his film and you can see his
Speaker 1: his upside a little bit there. Jarvis Landry, I think
Speaker 1: with him, like I was really impressed during the season
Speaker 1: with his run after catchability, but again limited to the slot.
Speaker 1: He's never gonna be anything but a slot receiver. And
Speaker 1: so many of his passes were manufactured by the play caller,
Speaker 1: not the quarterback. It was quick tosses within four or
Speaker 1: five yards of the line of scrimmage, a lot of
Speaker 1: emotion behind the quarterback, a lot of creativity there. And
Speaker 1: I don't I don't know how much of that is
Speaker 1: his his natural ability and how much is that just
Speaker 1: the play caller making him. Well, call him a destitute
Speaker 1: man's high reward. Well, he does have that physicality to him,
Speaker 1: and he's I'm amazed he's on the slow side. I'm
Speaker 1: amazed you ranked him below Marquis Lee and Allen Robinson.
Speaker 1: I like Allen Robinson. Ellen Robinson's a playmaker. I think
Speaker 1: he's a little on the slow, slow side for a
Speaker 1: deep threat, but if you watch his kind of catch
Speaker 1: radius and his ability to high point his body control,
Speaker 1: it's more impressive than Sammy Watkins. Bortos has a chance
Speaker 1: in this offense to get a lot better in this
Speaker 1: second year with Robinson, Lee and Alan Hearns, who has
Speaker 1: sneaked on the end of the list. Unfortunately, you compared
Speaker 1: him to Kevin Ogletree. It's not really think the most
Speaker 1: you know, flattering comparable. It was hard to come up
Speaker 1: with an Alan Hearns comparison. He's on the thin side. Uh,
Speaker 1: he's not physical, he's not a great athlete, he doesn't
Speaker 1: jump well, how do you NFL receivers normally do all
Speaker 1: those things? So, and he also had there was a
Speaker 1: flukey nature to his big plays where it was a
Speaker 1: lot of blown coverage and a lot of mistackles. And
Speaker 1: I don't know if it's repeatable. It's crazy how deep
Speaker 1: this classes. Because at the end of your article, and
Speaker 1: people should read it right to the last line, you
Speaker 1: even give nuggets about guys like Bruce Ellington, Taylor Gabriel,
Speaker 1: Paul Richardson, and even they have potential. I mean Taylor
Speaker 1: Gabriel for Clearland terrible last last season, Gabriel was second
Speaker 1: on the Browns and receiving yards. And you know Josh
Speaker 1: Huff who there are some people in the Eagles organization
Speaker 1: think he has a higher upside than Jordan Matthews. So
Speaker 1: you're right a lot of I mean, we can go
Speaker 1: twenty five deep in names, but it's hard. It's hard
Speaker 1: to evaluate guys like Michael Campanaro, who only you know,
Speaker 1: played a hundred snaps for the Raven. Now let's talk
Speaker 1: about the guys closer to top. I mean, you had
Speaker 1: Odell Beckham all by himself the number one, number one.
Speaker 1: I think it's it's silly to have anyone else as
Speaker 1: a number one overall pick in that draft. If you
Speaker 1: if you're redrafting, and your comparison for him, I liked
Speaker 1: a lot a souped up Steve Smith slash Antonio Brown
Speaker 1: hybrid with flashes of Michael Jordan's. I mean, that's it.
Speaker 1: We we've kind of been through your love of Odell Beckham.
Speaker 1: I found it interesting you ranked Mike Evans over Sammy
Speaker 1: Watkins and you didn't put numbers next to I say,
Speaker 1: I see what you do, trying to put him in tears,
Speaker 1: and you put it in the tears obviously of great players,
Speaker 1: future Pro bowlers. But ultimately you put Evans his name first,
Speaker 1: Watkins next, and Kelvin Benjamin third of that group. How
Speaker 1: do that's a KG move. I'm a savvy veteran. I
Speaker 1: know that if I put numbers, that that's all I'm
Speaker 1: gonna hear about on Twitter. Fine, but is about the
Speaker 1: numbers and not the analysy I have about be a
Speaker 1: man and take a stand. Ultimately, you have the name
Speaker 1: on top there, Mike Evans. Why do you like him
Speaker 1: better than the other two? Well, Evans and Watkins were
Speaker 1: extremely close, and I went back and forth. I copied
Speaker 1: and pasted one over the other about ten different times.
Speaker 1: Mike Evans makes place at the catch point, he makes
Speaker 1: contested catches and Sammy, Sammy Watkins really didn't. And that's
Speaker 1: Sammy Watsins is a lot, He's a lot more explosive,
Speaker 1: but he didn't help out his quarterbacks, and his quarterbacks
Speaker 1: didn't help out him. Mike Evans definitely helped out his quarterbacks.
Speaker 1: Walk into the moments. He was playing with such a
Speaker 1: bum Josh McCown. Josh McCown got the ball to Mike Evans.
Speaker 1: Kyle Orton could not get the ball to Sammy Watkins.
Speaker 1: His ball placement was horrendous. It surprised me how bad
Speaker 1: Orton was. Watkins also was playing injured all year. He's
Speaker 1: hard to evaluate because of the poor quarterback play and
Speaker 1: he played through groin, rib and hip injury, so he's
Speaker 1: really hard to evaluate. It wouldn't surprise me at all
Speaker 1: if he has a better career than Mike Evans. I
Speaker 1: mean how much when you're watching one year of tape.
Speaker 1: I did tight ends, and I had to factor in
Speaker 1: the quarterback play as well, because with some of these
Speaker 1: quarterbacks that like Sammy Watkins, you are dealing with a
Speaker 1: total issue there. And frankly, honestly the same with Mike Evans.
Speaker 1: What Evans did with going back and forth between two
Speaker 1: quarterbacks last season, he was spectacular down the stretch. Well,
Speaker 1: I would say that another factor that's very important and
Speaker 1: why I had Watkins over Evans a couple of times
Speaker 1: before I changed it. Watkins was doing this against number
Speaker 1: one corners and doubles tang big. Evans was joined it
Speaker 1: against mismatches in number two corners when they play the Browns,
Speaker 1: Evans is getting buster screen, not Joe Hayden. And some
Speaker 1: of those Evans plays were a little flukey too. Yeah,
Speaker 1: some times it was bad and he got away with
Speaker 1: a lot of push offs. But he's a more dynamic athlete.
Speaker 1: Thing you think Calvin Benjamin I ranked below those two
Speaker 1: guys because one way too many drops. I mean, he's
Speaker 1: one of those guys that he makes the hard plays
Speaker 1: look easy and the easy plays look hard. He's also
Speaker 1: one of those guys. Even when he's not open, he's
Speaker 1: open four feet over his head. And that's perfect for
Speaker 1: Am Newton because when he's wild, he's wild high. He's
Speaker 1: the perfect receiver for Cam Newton. Um and and again
Speaker 1: did it against number one corners. Did it again, Desmond Truyfont,
Speaker 1: Jimmy Smith. They trailed him around the field. I I
Speaker 1: love Kelvin Benjamin. I don't know if I would rank
Speaker 1: him second on this list, but just my personal which
Speaker 1: one I like. I like Kevin Benjamin. I think he
Speaker 1: has a chance to be better than those two guys.
Speaker 1: There's another factor. Kevin Benjamin is almost three years older
Speaker 1: than Mike Evans. That that is significantly. He's such a weird,
Speaker 1: interesting receiver because he's a deep threat that's not really
Speaker 1: that fast, which is interesting, and he's just a he's
Speaker 1: just a big guy. You're speed when he's tracking the
Speaker 1: ball though, which is important for for a big guy
Speaker 1: like that, he can be covered. And he's a natural
Speaker 1: receiver though. I mean he is a really natural receiver.
Speaker 1: I think more than Evans. You called Evans a stretch
Speaker 1: forward and cleats it. I can see the upside for Evans,
Speaker 1: but there's something about Benjamin that drops her a problem.
Speaker 1: But it seemed like he maybe isn't all there um
Speaker 1: mentally right now. Is that fair? He has a lot
Speaker 1: to pick up at the NFL level, But that can happen.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think I'm a guy like t O
Speaker 1: when he was entering the league and stuff. I could
Speaker 1: see that guy once he starts figuring things out, that
Speaker 1: he could be. There's another difference to that. Evans has
Speaker 1: an advantage, I think a major advantage and run after catchability.
Speaker 1: They both can high point, they both can win contested catches.
Speaker 1: Benjamin is probably a little bit more physical just because
Speaker 1: he's got that wide body, but Evans is a Evans
Speaker 1: can be a beast after the catch at times, and
Speaker 1: Benjamin really needs space to operate. It's crazy to think
Speaker 1: that the way this goes, they should all be better
Speaker 1: this season. Now, injuries will play apart. But then I
Speaker 1: look at a guy like John Brown because of all
Speaker 1: what happened with the quarterback chaos during that season. Mr. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I and that's one guy that we spent all
Speaker 1: last summer where Steve Kim and the Cardinals were just
Speaker 1: showering praise and I thought, you know, we're gonna get
Speaker 1: fried for these articles, writing one after the other saying
Speaker 1: how he can be touched in practice. But he paid off.
Speaker 1: I thought in games right away he was a difference maker.
Speaker 1: He was. I was so impressed with him watching and
Speaker 1: I wrote a lot of flowery articles, as did you.
Speaker 1: But I also wrote a lot of flowery articles about
Speaker 1: Brandon Cooks, and after watching both of their all of
Speaker 1: their targets, I was way more impressed with John Brown
Speaker 1: than Brandon cook So you draft Brown? Where would you
Speaker 1: draft Brown? Let's say, in a random, just nebulous draft
Speaker 1: like early twenties. Okay, that's pretty good. That's pretty good
Speaker 1: for a guy you got in the fifth third. And
Speaker 1: I think the Cardinals would too if they had to
Speaker 1: do it again. He's a guy where the difference between
Speaker 1: him and Cooks was right away. And this is part
Speaker 1: of why Bruce arians is such a great coach. Has
Speaker 1: him lining up all over the formation. He's doing the usual,
Speaker 1: you know, the jitterbug routes where you give him slants
Speaker 1: and crossers and end a rounds and real quick swing passes.
Speaker 1: He's doing all that stuff, but he's also running sideline
Speaker 1: routes and he's burning guys deep. Sigmund Bloom had a
Speaker 1: great line. He goes and gets that deep ball like
Speaker 1: a frisbee catching dog. You throw that, You throw that
Speaker 1: deep ball and he'll run and go get it. I
Speaker 1: mean he just go under it and he'll burn the
Speaker 1: guy and get it. He goes then go to the
Speaker 1: playoffs because of that. Ultimately, that was like one of
Speaker 1: the best players of the season that he made against
Speaker 1: and he did that what three or four times in
Speaker 1: the first month of the season. You know, it's funny,
Speaker 1: like we so we talked to Larry Fitzgerald yesterday on
Speaker 1: the phone and he like, oh, that's that we I mean,
Speaker 1: did I didn't get on a group phone. TD wasn't there.
Speaker 1: You know, that's you. You're the maybe listening. But we
Speaker 1: talked that's about John Brown, you're the journal and he
Speaker 1: basically said that John Brown, the thing that was most
Speaker 1: impressive was what you just said, how he picked it
Speaker 1: up the offense and played all over the field. And
Speaker 1: I was thinking, wait, that's the knock on Larry Fitzgerald
Speaker 1: last season that he had trouble doing that himself out
Speaker 1: of the gate in that offense. Yeah, it's impressive. That.
Speaker 1: And you heard Steve kim their GM say that his
Speaker 1: his knowledge of the route concepts, coming from tiny Pittsburgh State,
Speaker 1: just blew them out of the water in the first
Speaker 1: mining camp that he already knew exactly where to go.
Speaker 1: He's a really bright guy and interestingly enough nicknamed Smokey. Why,
Speaker 1: by the of people should probably google it. Okay, all right, nothing,
Speaker 1: I don't because he smokes defensive backs. I love or
Speaker 1: illegal elements. I love the comparisons more than anything. Mike
Speaker 1: Evans was Harold Carmichael Light. You know, yeah, d J
Speaker 1: will probably just throwing in the one name comparison to
Speaker 1: some current player. You're going all over and you're just
Speaker 1: you're describing it. Mike Evans is Pierre Garson or Sammy
Speaker 1: Watkins is Pierre Garson turned superhero totally. You know, I
Speaker 1: know what you mean when you say that. You say,
Speaker 1: Kelvin Benjamin is the evolutionary Plexico Burris. I wanted Plexico
Speaker 1: burros after Thanksgiving dinner, but I thought that was not
Speaker 1: kind enough to Kelvin ben Jordan Matthews as mini Marcus Colston. Anyways,
Speaker 1: lots of great stuff. We we will skip the whole
Speaker 1: section of high upside projects with first round talent. I
Speaker 1: love Martavis Bryant, so do you you compared him to
Speaker 1: Chris Henry, which I thought was really interesting. Davante Adams
Speaker 1: has a lot of potential. Cody Latimer was a little
Speaker 1: higher than I expected to be on this list. Adams
Speaker 1: was a guy that adversed how much I liked him.
Speaker 1: He's not a who explodes off the film. He's not fast.
Speaker 1: He's a really good route runner. He's got a great
Speaker 1: double move. You could you could see the difference between
Speaker 1: him and a guy like Alan Robinson where they both
Speaker 1: are using double moves. Robinson's doesn't get him open, but
Speaker 1: Adams does. And I think he's gonna be the McCarthy's
Speaker 1: talking up their offense like it's gonna be really dynamic,
Speaker 1: and I think Adams is one of the reasons why
Speaker 1: that he's gonna be facing third cornerbacks. I like him.
Speaker 1: That's a tough offense to pick up as a rookie.
Speaker 1: He he's slipped in under the radar, finished the season,
Speaker 1: had a couple of games. He really had two big
Speaker 1: games in the season that they wouldn't have won the
Speaker 1: game without Davante Adams. For a rookie to just come
Speaker 1: in and do that is impressive. In that system, They're scary.
Speaker 1: Everyone should read this site. Let's move on, uh to
Speaker 1: one of the other positions. Let's go over to quarterback
Speaker 1: here and uh my piece which will be posting on
Speaker 1: Friday on the site, so it might not be quite
Speaker 1: up when you listen to this ranks the quarterbacks of
Speaker 1: the two thousand and fourteen class. And you know, I
Speaker 1: start by saying, ultimately, the draft process did Teddy Bridgewater dirty.
Speaker 1: Between the pro day and some private workouts and some
Speaker 1: whispers he wasn't truly a leader. Skinny knees, right, he
Speaker 1: somehow got knocked down to the end of the And
Speaker 1: I think they got the best quarterback in this draft,
Speaker 1: or at least the guy that I think is the
Speaker 1: safest and I know for sure is going to be there.
Speaker 1: And then after him, I think there's a group of
Speaker 1: four guys who all I think they all have a chance,
Speaker 1: but I don't really know. And I ranked him Blake
Speaker 1: Boardles number two, Zach Mettenberger all the way up to
Speaker 1: number three. I have him ahead of Derek Carr, and
Speaker 1: I threw Jimmy Garoppolo in that group because even though
Speaker 1: we didn't see a lot out of him. I liked
Speaker 1: what I saw, and I think he has a chance
Speaker 1: moving forward. West has taken me to task for this
Speaker 1: Mettenberger at three, So why why don't we start there? Well,
Speaker 1: I think that it's fun for me that you're gonna
Speaker 1: have Raiders fans, you know, haranguing you. Yeah, I won't
Speaker 1: have to deal with him because I would not have
Speaker 1: ranked Mettenberger over Derek Carr. I mean, I think Derek
Speaker 1: Carr people are going wildly overboard about a mediocre rook season,
Speaker 1: but very mediocre, very media you know, the yards per attempts,
Speaker 1: of the touchdown, the interception ratio, and the fact that
Speaker 1: he just he wasn't David Carr, so that was good.
Speaker 1: And he wasn't JaMarcus Russell and that was even better.
Speaker 1: And so I think everyone just wanted to give him
Speaker 1: a lot of credit, but he was the guy. I
Speaker 1: watched more games than anyone. Uh, I'm counting them up here, sick.
Speaker 1: I think I watched eleven games of his because I
Speaker 1: kept wanting to see more. What am I missing with
Speaker 1: Derek Kark? I didn't see anything special. I saw a
Speaker 1: lot more special out of Zach Mettenberger and Blake Borders.
Speaker 1: I saw some tools there with Derek Carr. He's a
Speaker 1: fast guy. Well, I think that's why scouts like him
Speaker 1: because of the tools. But I didn't see it in
Speaker 1: the games. Yeah, I agree, I didn't see it in
Speaker 1: the games. I saw him doesn't go downfield, he he
Speaker 1: could move in the pocket a little bit. When he
Speaker 1: does go downfield, he was all over the place. I mean,
Speaker 1: guys were open and he missed him and it's just
Speaker 1: dink and dunk. They did not look like a professional offense.
Speaker 1: They couldn't. Well is that a little part of it? Though?
Speaker 1: If you're the Raiders that what they had going on
Speaker 1: with your plague call or last year in the games
Speaker 1: are among the lowest in the NFL. So it's okay.
Speaker 1: I'm not one of these guys that wants to shower
Speaker 1: praise on on on Car, although I think I like
Speaker 1: him more than you do. But part of it is
Speaker 1: just I want to see more patients in general with
Speaker 1: some of these quarterbacks before we flame a guy that's
Speaker 1: twenty one years old or something. I think they all
Speaker 1: I think this group and Grapple is kind of a
Speaker 1: weird guy to throw in there, but I think they
Speaker 1: all have a chance to be long term starters. So
Speaker 1: I'm not burying Derek Carr. I just didn't see it yet.
Speaker 1: I think there's been a lot worse rookie seasons than
Speaker 1: than he's had. J. P. Lassman and Classen and Gather.
Speaker 1: There's some guys that's Alex Smith, Eli Manning right, that's
Speaker 1: start and you think they have no chance. And I
Speaker 1: wouldn't put Derek Carr in that category, but you look
Speaker 1: at what he did versus what Boardles showed. I could
Speaker 1: see the traits from Bordles. I mean, he looks like
Speaker 1: Cam Newton out there. He was more athletic than I
Speaker 1: than I thought. I mean, he there's one place j J. J.
Speaker 1: Watt comes in untouched. He shakes J. J. Watt and
Speaker 1: makes him look like a clown, runs for thirty yards
Speaker 1: and you know in a two minute drill. We can't
Speaker 1: forget what we saw in the preseason. Mark fell in
Speaker 1: love with Bordles last preseason and you were high on
Speaker 1: it too, and I just I can't get that image
Speaker 1: out of my mind. How well he played before. His
Speaker 1: mechanics just devolved during the season where he's throwing like
Speaker 1: a baseball pitcher. So to me, he's the hardest. He is.
Speaker 1: His back foot's coming up and he's winding up on
Speaker 1: his throws. He's losing velocity because of it. I mean,
Speaker 1: he talked and he talked about wasn't it opposed to
Speaker 1: one up yesterday? That he that is what His arm
Speaker 1: just tired out at the end of the year, he was.
Speaker 1: That's one of the challenges of the rookie quarterback. You
Speaker 1: go from playing a certain amount of games to an
Speaker 1: intense season long thing. If you're playing borders, that is
Speaker 1: not easy. They put a lot on his plate more
Speaker 1: than any other rookie. I thought he had the most
Speaker 1: working against him. Everyone wants to see Derek Carr. He
Speaker 1: was stuck on the Raiders, That's true. He had the
Speaker 1: best protection of any of these quarterbacks by far. He
Speaker 1: had very good protection. I would say overall, the Raiders
Speaker 1: had an above average past protection. The Jaguars were terrible.
Speaker 1: They were terrible. He had no chance on a lot
Speaker 1: of plays. It's seventeen nothing half the time before he
Speaker 1: does anything wrong. And I think Mettenberger had a very
Speaker 1: similar situation with a bad offensive line and a bad defense.
Speaker 1: Boardles also who had nothing but rookie wide receivers and
Speaker 1: no tight end. I mean the receivers didn't even know
Speaker 1: where they were going, so that he's got that problem.
Speaker 1: I mean almost to a man. This group of quarterbacks
Speaker 1: played on talent poor offenses with which teams had already
Speaker 1: have coaching. What happened draft in early round quarter It's true,
Speaker 1: but Boardles, five or six plays a game, did something
Speaker 1: that ten or twelve starters in the NFL can't do.
Speaker 1: You know, he would make someone miss, he could, he
Speaker 1: could improvise pretty well. He can throw a big deep
Speaker 1: out across the field. He was very aggressive, and the
Speaker 1: thing that impressed me, I thought he improved a lot
Speaker 1: in his decision making, even though the you know, the
Speaker 1: mechanics kind of fell apart, maybe the arm, you know,
Speaker 1: he seemed more like a veteran quarterback by the end.
Speaker 1: That's why he's number two. Derek Carr was terrible in December.
Speaker 1: If all you had watched was December, he was no
Speaker 1: different than Jimmy Clawson. Boardles I thought, got a little
Speaker 1: bit better as the season went along. Bridgewater was sensational
Speaker 1: in December. Until that point, they were all pretty close,
Speaker 1: but he closed the season with a better five game
Speaker 1: stretch than any rookie completion percentage and finished December is
Speaker 1: pro football focus is number one quarterback. You make a
Speaker 1: good point, then that doesn't shock me. He looked like
Speaker 1: an above average starter, and I like the fact he's
Speaker 1: almost He's not a flashy guy, but he's impressive to watch.
Speaker 1: Here's why this exercise makes sense because if you want
Speaker 1: to go get all caught up and oh look ahead
Speaker 1: to next week's rookies. Right at the top of the article,
Speaker 1: Greg points out that in the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel, eight
Speaker 1: of seventeen personnel folks pulled by the newspaper had Johnny
Speaker 1: Manzel at the top of their list, and he's at
Speaker 1: the bottom of yours, and he should be. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: only two had Bridgewater. I believe only two had and
Speaker 1: one actually had Mettenburger, which is in the shocking too.
Speaker 1: So Johnny Manzel was the consensus guy. He was Mayax guy.
Speaker 1: I don't think he was DJ's guy. To his credit,
Speaker 1: DJ had Bridgewater number one, but he was all the
Speaker 1: big guys guy. And now, I mean, let's be honest,
Speaker 1: where would Johnny Manzel would be drafted if the draft
Speaker 1: was happening right now if we knew what we knew
Speaker 1: right now, Yeah, if it was just starting over. Basically,
Speaker 1: what would a team give up for him in a
Speaker 1: in a trade if he's coming out of school right
Speaker 1: now versus now if he's coming out of rehab and
Speaker 1: you know how he looked as a rookie. I mean,
Speaker 1: unless you want to look at the one very abstract
Speaker 1: instance of a team trading for Brett Farve after he
Speaker 1: came out of when he had all sorts of issues
Speaker 1: off the field. But that's a different player. I don't
Speaker 1: think he got any sixth round draft pick. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: he could be part of another deal, potentially fifth or
Speaker 1: sixth round. I mean, the the game he had against
Speaker 1: Cincinnati was the worst game any any of these rookies played.
Speaker 1: I thought I was discouraged by that game because it
Speaker 1: just looked like he was too small. Yeah. Yes, he
Speaker 1: does not look the part on any level. I thought
Speaker 1: against the Bills after he had the touchdown March and
Speaker 1: then he got flat on the next r have you
Speaker 1: thought this guy is not ready for prime time? There
Speaker 1: were two plays actually was in the Carolina game, which
Speaker 1: to me was his welcome to the NFL moment third
Speaker 1: and long, he's trying to get to the edge and
Speaker 1: star little to Laila beats him there and he doesn't
Speaker 1: get the first down. And then I don't know if
Speaker 1: you remember the play, he got injured and that ended
Speaker 1: his season. Mark was it was a designed run where
Speaker 1: Luke Kickley easily beat him to the edge, hit him,
Speaker 1: and he got hurt and that was it. It was like,
Speaker 1: you're not pulling off any of those cool Johnny football
Speaker 1: improv plays anymore. Yeah. I mean, one of the hardest
Speaker 1: things is to judge how an electric playmaker, you know,
Speaker 1: you last year at this time we all thought that's
Speaker 1: what he was gonna be in college. What second to
Speaker 1: be at the NFL level. I look at Mariota, I'm
Speaker 1: just as concerned about the offense he came from and
Speaker 1: what that means if you stick him into a pro
Speaker 1: style offense. We don't know. Yeah, it's so it's so
Speaker 1: hard to project. I think the difference, you know, Man's
Speaker 1: out seemed like he didn't know the playbook as well
Speaker 1: as he should. If he didn't put it off, you know,
Speaker 1: we know he didn't, right, So it's not exact like
Speaker 1: a scientist going to work here like, yeah, Mariotta, at
Speaker 1: least we think could quickly on Mettenberger. West, you don't.
Speaker 1: You think he's a total statue. And my comparison for
Speaker 1: him is Carry Collins, maybe a little younger Carry Collins
Speaker 1: or early career bled So I disagree. I think there
Speaker 1: was some pocket movement. You know, there was potential. He
Speaker 1: he did make those little slides to open up a
Speaker 1: few extra seconds, but he didn't throw anything out of
Speaker 1: the pocket. He is in nineteen nineties, you know Mark
Speaker 1: Wilson for the Raiders or whatever, nineteen eighties guy on
Speaker 1: tech mobile that just kind of drops back and just
Speaker 1: throws it as hard as he can. I mean, a
Speaker 1: lot of coaches if you have that, they want that over.
Speaker 1: You can run around all over the place, which you
Speaker 1: can't operate from the pocket. Coaches told Greg Cosell. After
Speaker 1: Greg Costell said he would draft Zach Mettenberger over Jamis Winston,
Speaker 1: he said he heard from many NFL guys in the
Speaker 1: coaching community who agreed with him. I thought Mettenberger showed
Speaker 1: a lot. I'm surprised. I'm really surprised that you don't
Speaker 1: like him at all, West, because a lot of the
Speaker 1: things that went against him, I didn't think was his fault,
Speaker 1: and like Bortles, he had a lot of flashy plays
Speaker 1: that were really impressive. Well, I mean, we've we've gone
Speaker 1: over this ground before, but it's all not on the podcast.
Speaker 1: We haven't. I've gotten messages from Titans fans tell me
Speaker 1: to quit picking on Za met A guy. I mean,
Speaker 1: I don't like that. He's got one of the highest
Speaker 1: failed drive percentages in the NFL history. He never won
Speaker 1: a game in six starts. They weren't really competitive. He
Speaker 1: didn't move the offense consistently, which bothers me more than
Speaker 1: it bothers some people. I can't stand watching quarterbacks a lot,
Speaker 1: three or four quarters without moving the offense. Uh, he's
Speaker 1: he's injury prone. Finished the last two years on the sidelines,
Speaker 1: and he's a statue. I believe he's a statue. You
Speaker 1: believe he has a movement. I think he's a late
Speaker 1: career Carrie Collins. He can't escape pressure. He's got a
Speaker 1: long wind up that's gonna get him in trouble, I think,
Speaker 1: and I think he's inaccurate. So I don't see he's
Speaker 1: got a big I don't I don't think he's inaccurate
Speaker 1: at all. He's aggressive, he can he can deliver while
Speaker 1: under pressure, which is a skill in the NFL. I
Speaker 1: don't think he's inaccurate, and I do think there was
Speaker 1: just something to him that I know this is insane,
Speaker 1: but if there was a category for pretty passes that
Speaker 1: were dropped, Mettenberger would be late in the league. There
Speaker 1: were there were a lot of thirty five yard ropes
Speaker 1: down the sidelines over an outstretched hand that that went
Speaker 1: off a Titans you know hand. I can't believe the
Speaker 1: West hasn't used what is maybe the best bit of
Speaker 1: an artillery against Mettenburger's that you've already seen him in
Speaker 1: an offense with Odell Beckham and Jarvis Landry. What more
Speaker 1: is he gonna get? In Tennessee's point, he's a great
Speaker 1: scientific experiment. Can you win in two thousand and fifteen
Speaker 1: being a statue? And can you win with that haircut
Speaker 1: that he's got? All right, let's move to the tight ends.
Speaker 1: I like his haircut. Uh, you've got who well Sessler
Speaker 1: on the top of your list. The the little bit
Speaker 1: of a difference here is because we're coming off a
Speaker 1: wide receiver class, which is maybe the best ever most
Speaker 1: exciting in decades, and the tight end class I thought
Speaker 1: in general compared to some of the hype coming out
Speaker 1: of the draft, especially when the Detroit Lions go out
Speaker 1: and draft Eric Ebron tenth. Overall, the finished results were underwhelming.
Speaker 1: Certainly statistically anyone that picked these guys up in fantasy
Speaker 1: thinking this is gonna save me, it's a big late
Speaker 1: season pick up. Well, it's not like these guys just
Speaker 1: did not pull it off. But what changed my mind
Speaker 1: a little bit about two of them, which was Eric
Speaker 1: Ebron and Austin Seferian Jenkins, was I think there's hope
Speaker 1: for these two. I really do. Looking at them, I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't know what that projects too long term, but
Speaker 1: I looked at the way they were drafted, which was Ebron,
Speaker 1: Seferian Jenkins, and tomorrow. And I don't change that order
Speaker 1: because part of this exerc So how would you change
Speaker 1: it for me? What I saw? I think Ebron is
Speaker 1: the most interesting player still among this group, and he's
Speaker 1: in a good situation there. It's extremely rare for a
Speaker 1: tight end to come in as a rookie and meat expectations,
Speaker 1: much less exceed them. One of the herd like Jimmy Graham,
Speaker 1: you know all kinds of um I can't think of it,
Speaker 1: but there are a lot of gronk. Only as a
Speaker 1: rookie tight end is so hard because you have to learn,
Speaker 1: you have to learn how to block, you have to
Speaker 1: learn how to catch. It's just a lot's going on. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and one looking at kind of some stories about each
Speaker 1: of these guys too, and just hearing their own words
Speaker 1: that kind of they all owned up to the fact
Speaker 1: that they were lost for a big part of the season.
Speaker 1: And that's probably not untrue of the quarterback situation too.
Speaker 1: But they're the only guy out there that's asked to
Speaker 1: be a pass catcher in some cases. And I saw,
Speaker 1: you know, especially with Ebron, like they used him in
Speaker 1: a way which was almost low risk. For part of
Speaker 1: the season. He had a lot of it work in
Speaker 1: the flats and they'd asked him to kind of crack
Speaker 1: off a tackle, quickly turn and catch a pass for
Speaker 1: five yards. They used him in the same pattern over
Speaker 1: and over. But then he showed these flashes. I think
Speaker 1: when he got out of his head a little bit
Speaker 1: and he let his body take over. You start to
Speaker 1: see what's down the road with him and Safarian Jenkins especially.
Speaker 1: I think I think that in Tampa Safarian Jenkins may
Speaker 1: make a big leap this year too, because no one
Speaker 1: part of his situation. They had issues with the quarterback.
Speaker 1: They and they can't keep the quarterback on his feet.
Speaker 1: They had no offensive coordinator last season. You now go
Speaker 1: to Dirk Cotter, who has done a great job with
Speaker 1: tight ends in the past. He's got a full offseason.
Speaker 1: I think he's gonna have a He made double his statistics,
Speaker 1: if not more. Yeah, he was really disappointed to me
Speaker 1: last year because I liked him in that draft. I
Speaker 1: thought he was gonna be a big time huge like
Speaker 1: he brought out a lot of drops, didn't He He
Speaker 1: didn't know, I mean, make a bone headed mistake every
Speaker 1: time I looked. I don't remember, though, I mean that's
Speaker 1: just what you remember from watching the game on TV.
Speaker 1: He did seemed like he wasn't really good at contesting catches.
Speaker 1: Well there was one there a couple of times where
Speaker 1: he's bobbling the catch, and to me, it just seemed
Speaker 1: that he's so up in his head that he couldn't
Speaker 1: just let the gifts that would have been present in
Speaker 1: college even the year before work because he's got the
Speaker 1: size and he's got a great burst. One thing about
Speaker 1: him is like he could he could quickly like get
Speaker 1: past the line, get into space, catch the ball and
Speaker 1: he'd be five years five yards ahead and the flash
Speaker 1: and you pick up that yardage and that burst is
Speaker 1: what separates him from a guy like Richard Rogers, who
Speaker 1: had a better statistical rookie. Sometimes it's in a much
Speaker 1: better quarterback. Yeah, sometimes the NFL has to go the
Speaker 1: way of the players that are coming in at This
Speaker 1: is an ugly tight end class overall, at least to start.
Speaker 1: We'll see Jayson Morrow could get better. You think Richard
Speaker 1: Rodgers definitely showed potential. Crockett Gilmore was a good, you know,
Speaker 1: mid round pick, but this upcoming tight end class is
Speaker 1: also supposed to be terrible. Think about the quarterbacks of
Speaker 1: the last two years. Teddy Bridgewater is the only one
Speaker 1: that I'm really confident is gonna be at least a
Speaker 1: mid level starter. I think his floor is Alex Smith,
Speaker 1: Randy Dalton, and I think his ceiling is somewhere closer
Speaker 1: to Drew Brees or Philip Rivers. But other than that,
Speaker 1: like we could have a couple of straight years without
Speaker 1: really any big time tight ends or quarterbacks. How does
Speaker 1: that happen? It's it's weird, especially at the tight end position,
Speaker 1: because you think we'd start to buy now start to
Speaker 1: see more of these types coming up. But a lot
Speaker 1: of it has to do with what they're asked to
Speaker 1: do with the college level, I guess. I mean some
Speaker 1: guys who made a lot of plays and college didn't
Speaker 1: even appear on this list. Rogers was you were thinking
Speaker 1: about early on being a little higher up? For Well,
Speaker 1: he's the first guy watched and I got a little
Speaker 1: excited about him. But then when I that the thing
Speaker 1: was when I went and watched the others closer, you
Speaker 1: see the difference in their athleticism. I think that Rogers
Speaker 1: really really he only had one drop at a twenty
Speaker 1: one catchable balls, and to me, yes he had. He
Speaker 1: showed good hands, he had some good contested catches, got
Speaker 1: better as the season went on. But that is right,
Speaker 1: that's Aaron Rodgers putting the ball right where it needs
Speaker 1: to be. What about Jason Morrow is to play with
Speaker 1: Geno Smith and Michael Vick that had you have to
Speaker 1: factor into that fact that Tomorrow was in a West
Speaker 1: Coast offense coming from Texas Tech. That's not a good
Speaker 1: fit out of the gate. Might be better with Shan Gailey.
Speaker 1: There was one game with Tomorrow where it looked like
Speaker 1: the light was finally flashing. It was the Broncs game
Speaker 1: where he had ten catchup and he made a few plays.
Speaker 1: He did, he made and he's down field too versus
Speaker 1: just four yards upfield, and then he went back to
Speaker 1: mistakes after that. Yeah, he did. I just think that
Speaker 1: was not a good fit. He He also is someone
Speaker 1: that he hit. The athleticism drop off between the first
Speaker 1: two and Tomorrow was for me, very noticeable. I love it.
Speaker 1: I love getting a little crock At Gilmore into the show.
Speaker 1: Jason Morrow, you had Gilmore five. That's your tight end rankings.
Speaker 1: Those are gonna be dropping over the weekend, really Friday
Speaker 1: into Saturday. You guys can check it out next week.
Speaker 1: NFL dot Com Slash around the NFL. This is a
Speaker 1: nice little football nerdy show. I mean, we're diving into
Speaker 1: the deep, you know, sees of Jarvis Landry and Richard
Speaker 1: Rogers and now we're gonna welcome in one of the
Speaker 1: nerdiest guys at the entire NFL media news group, Daniel Jeremiah.
Speaker 1: This is a segment Mark, you weren't here for it,
Speaker 1: just to warn Yeah, I mean, I'm just telling them again.
Speaker 1: You know, people that love the Sessler you can probably
Speaker 1: turn it off right now. That's a big segment of
Speaker 1: our female population. They just like listening to Mark and
Speaker 1: staring up at the ceiling. All right, let's bring in
Speaker 1: Daniel Jeremiah. Let's talk a little bit about the draft.
Speaker 1: We taped this segment on D Day with Dan hansis
Speaker 1: in the mix, so I'll send it over to Dan. Now.
Speaker 1: All right, here we go our guests in the studio
Speaker 1: right now. Former scout for the Eagles, Browns and Ravens,
Speaker 1: former quarterback at Appalachian State. Yeah, that's cool. He's now
Speaker 1: an anchor of our draft coverage here at NFL Network.
Speaker 1: You can see my Path to the Draft. Check out
Speaker 1: his latest mocks in NFL dot com. He also has
Speaker 1: a podcast, Moved the Sticks. Podcasts available for download right now.
Speaker 1: Daniel Jeremiah, Welcome to the Round the NFL pod about
Speaker 1: imagining that right was? He just is this what normally
Speaker 1: happens around here? He kind of he kind of murmured
Speaker 1: that TD always talks about the same team. Right, we're
Speaker 1: all you know, he does all rolling in the same direction,
Speaker 1: except this has to be. I was gonna say, this
Speaker 1: has to be. And I'm very happy to have DJ
Speaker 1: in the studio. This is exciting. Probably a tough moment
Speaker 1: for TV. He was looking at all his children behind
Speaker 1: the glass. He doesn't know. You know, every every parent
Speaker 1: really has a favorite. They never want to say it,
Speaker 1: but we know who the favorite. Say it? Yeah, man, Kyle,
Speaker 1: give me a break. Yeah. It's like the one time
Speaker 1: you have to choose between Billick and Mary Uchi, which
Speaker 1: you know, scintillating analysis. Did you have to go with DJ?
Speaker 1: Did you know that um Brian Billick does the Coaches
Speaker 1: Show show with the ball and chain and hatched him
Speaker 1: keep him in the studio. It's true story, all right. Anyway,
Speaker 1: DJ is here. How exciting. Uh, the draft is upon us.
Speaker 1: It's very close. Now you'll be heading to Chicago win
Speaker 1: Monday Tuesday, t d Oh, next question? Oh wow, so
Speaker 1: we're going there? Hete hate hate. Hey, I'm beginning to
Speaker 1: think like, oh, to have a conversation with Greg, Greg,
Speaker 1: just a little pick behind the curtain. There was some
Speaker 1: you know, consternation. DJ is tougher to book than the president.
Speaker 1: At this time of year, you just even get ten minutes.
Speaker 1: I feel like by the end of this, I'm just
Speaker 1: saying that didn't help the hands is on the black list.
Speaker 1: I don't want to be there, and I'm just saying
Speaker 1: that didn't help some of the hands this dj B.
Speaker 1: But well, let's talk a little bit at least. All right,
Speaker 1: I'm looking at your mom, I'm looking at your top
Speaker 1: fifty players overall, A ton of a lot of papers up. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I decided to print about why not very environmentally keep
Speaker 1: I keep hearing all the good edge rushers in this class,
Speaker 1: give me a break. I like, I like looking at
Speaker 1: the paper. Okay, go for it. All these ad dressers
Speaker 1: in this class, it's almost hard to keep each one
Speaker 1: of them straight. Who is your favorite addresser? And kind
Speaker 1: of what what separates the top guys for you between
Speaker 1: like Fowler and Shane Ray? You know everyone at the top.
Speaker 1: You got a bunch of them. There's a whole host
Speaker 1: of them. Look in terms of just pure talent. You know,
Speaker 1: my initial list that I came out with had Randy
Speaker 1: Gregory at the very top, and I still believe he's
Speaker 1: the most talented edge rusher in the draft, when you're
Speaker 1: putting together your own personal big board. I I envisioned, Okay,
Speaker 1: if I'm running a team, this is you know how
Speaker 1: I would stack my players. And I ended up moving
Speaker 1: Gregory down because they're significant off field risk involved with him.
Speaker 1: So to me, I look at Dante Fowler. You want
Speaker 1: somebody that's twitched up, that's athletic, that can bend, can
Speaker 1: do all the everything you wanted to see. He does it.
Speaker 1: At Florida. They asked him to drop a lot, so
Speaker 1: the numbers are aren't as great in the sack productions. Okay,
Speaker 1: it's not terrible, but great. Kid plays hard, explosive, all
Speaker 1: that stuff checks the box. So to me, he's the
Speaker 1: top guy. And and then after that, I look at
Speaker 1: Shane Ray from Missouri and some people he talked to scouts,
Speaker 1: some of them are down on him because he's got
Speaker 1: real skinny lower half. He doesn't have kind of that
Speaker 1: ideal body um and he's not a real real fluid athlete.
Speaker 1: But what he does, he's got a lot of shock
Speaker 1: in his hips. He's got a lot of shock in
Speaker 1: his hands. That's what you want shock in the hip.
Speaker 1: You want to be able to roll your hips like
Speaker 1: that could be able to roll your hips and so
Speaker 1: he can do that. Great. I like this kind of
Speaker 1: have to say it's shock in the hip. You know what, Actually,
Speaker 1: while you're talking, you're giving out all these scout terms. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I hear twitchy and he's a twitch quick twitch athlete.
Speaker 1: What does that? What does that even mean? Is one
Speaker 1: of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard.
Speaker 1: It just it means just. It's another word for explosive.
Speaker 1: And and you know people talk about Odell Beckham quit's
Speaker 1: not yet. Yes, it's not just you know a forty
Speaker 1: that's not being quick twitch. I mean quick twitches means
Speaker 1: boom right away, like you get off the line, your sudden.
Speaker 1: That's another word that we would use here. So that's
Speaker 1: kind of definitely. I remember when Adam Archioletta was a
Speaker 1: quick twitch athlete. That's been many moons. What's the hottest
Speaker 1: what's the hottest buzz adjective in the game right now?
Speaker 1: Hottest buzz adjective? Let's get to see he's answering the question, Um, yeah, look,
Speaker 1: come on, we we will work past it or professionals. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's it's sushi dat to day. Do you eat sushi,
Speaker 1: not not here. No. I used to have a rule
Speaker 1: for real that if I can't see water, I'm not
Speaker 1: eating sushi. But I've been lucky the last few times,
Speaker 1: so I've kind of broke my own rule. I like
Speaker 1: our sushi here. Um. But the buzz word in scouting gosh,
Speaker 1: um quick twitches up there, quick twitches way up there?
Speaker 1: Um twitched up. I like that heavy legged waistbender. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we talked. We always talk about guys having FBI, which
Speaker 1: is football intelligence. M I like that one. You're writing
Speaker 1: that one down. Just start using that every day and
Speaker 1: then let me see what else we got here. Is
Speaker 1: verticality verdicality using fast at it? Okay, verticality, that's not
Speaker 1: that's not using like more of an NBA center thing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's j Bill. If if any come up over the
Speaker 1: course you have another question. The two in a row,
Speaker 1: this is good. I might get another C O D
Speaker 1: by the way, is a good one. Dead on arrival
Speaker 1: ce CEO delivery, change the direction, that's good. I like that.
Speaker 1: Athletes are good at changing. I'm looking at you have
Speaker 1: scout potential. I'm looking at Daniel's latest UM two round
Speaker 1: mock draft, which you can find it NFL dot com.
Speaker 1: By the way, the only person in the building that
Speaker 1: refers to me by my full first Daniel. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: love it. You're gonna be out in Johnson. You're gonna
Speaker 1: bake me some cookies to grandma Daniels could talk together.
Speaker 1: Come on bro alright. Um that song, by the way,
Speaker 1: that Elton john song is a kid and it looks
Speaker 1: like that. Yeah, my grandmother used to know. She didn't
Speaker 1: there was the old Slights Heaven for Spain. Yeah, boy, Danny,
Speaker 1: my grandmother play on the but I don't know if
Speaker 1: you've ever listened to the lyrics. Yeah, Daniel is flying
Speaker 1: tonight on a plane. Yes, when you get a little older,
Speaker 1: you start to try to piece together what the song
Speaker 1: is actually about. I spend many an hour trying to
Speaker 1: piece that song together. Um, you have Amari Cooper at
Speaker 1: number nine to the Giants, and uh, that jumps out
Speaker 1: to me. Literally, you're literally scratching your head. Yeah, a
Speaker 1: little bit better. He's talking about my modcraft while he's scratching,
Speaker 1: he said, very subtle, very subtle. So Chris Westling is
Speaker 1: actually literally in love with Odell Beckham with good reason.
Speaker 1: Victor Cruz, a stud before the knee injury. Is this
Speaker 1: DJ's way of saying, perhaps the Giants are already starting
Speaker 1: to look beyond Victor Cruz or no, I just can't pass. Look,
Speaker 1: I don't know, let's see what happ Victor Cruz health.
Speaker 1: But he's gonna play in the slot. That's not gonna
Speaker 1: mess with what you would have on the outside with
Speaker 1: Cooper and with Odell Becking. What would mean? You know,
Speaker 1: obviously our guy from l s U, Reuben Ran, Ruben Randall,
Speaker 1: thank you wouldn't be great for Reuben. Reuben wouldn't love
Speaker 1: that pick. But you know, look, there's talk to different
Speaker 1: people around the league, and there is some school of
Speaker 1: thought where even, look, we had the two physical teams
Speaker 1: in the Super Bowl. I get it. So it's been
Speaker 1: easy for us all to say, Okay, it's about running
Speaker 1: the football, it's about you know, being physical. But there's
Speaker 1: a lot of people, when you talked about the leg
Speaker 1: that feel like the way the rules have changed, the
Speaker 1: way the game has changed, screw it, don't We're just
Speaker 1: gonna try and outscore everybody we play. And so there's
Speaker 1: some thought there. You look at the Giants and man
Speaker 1: that you you look at that matchup situation you'd have
Speaker 1: with those guys on the field the same time. Wow,
Speaker 1: well it's interesting. You don't have any receivers going in
Speaker 1: the top eighty, have four pass thrushers, a couple of
Speaker 1: defensive lignemen, and then two quarterbacks. Well, the Raiders I
Speaker 1: think would take a wide out if Leonard Williams wasn't there.
Speaker 1: But in this situation, with everything I'm hearing and talking to,
Speaker 1: people are saying, Okay, Mario is gonna go to might
Speaker 1: not be Tennessee, but somebody's gonna take him with a
Speaker 1: second pink Tennessee. Uh that's why I everything everybody that
Speaker 1: I've talked to you just said he's going to go second,
Speaker 1: and people that I really really trust. And so there's
Speaker 1: there's either Tennessee or some other suitors. I lean tend
Speaker 1: to lean towards them making a trade and somebody else
Speaker 1: coming in there. Um. But so you take the two
Speaker 1: quarterbacks off the board, then you're at number three. I
Speaker 1: think Jacksonville Leonard Williams is a great player, But you've
Speaker 1: resigned Tyson Alo Alo, You've got uh, you signed the
Speaker 1: guy from Miami, what's his name from Penn State, Jared Odrick.
Speaker 1: You've got some Derek Mark, so I think it is
Speaker 1: one of the best interior pass rushers in the NFL.
Speaker 1: So they Leonard Williams for them is not as big
Speaker 1: a need. They need an edge rusher. So that's why
Speaker 1: I think that just drops Leonard Williams right into the
Speaker 1: lap of the Oakland Raiders, your number one player, which
Speaker 1: surprised me. What do you how do you answer the
Speaker 1: people that say Leonard Williams like very toolsy. You know,
Speaker 1: he looks like the guy that you can project to
Speaker 1: being a great player, but his tape really isn't that
Speaker 1: and maybe maybe a two down player, not a pass rusher.
Speaker 1: That's that's crap. That's because he's here number one player.
Speaker 1: Tell us what, We'll go back and watch him last year.
Speaker 1: First of all, when he's fully healthy. He got a
Speaker 1: high ankle spring like. One of the criticisms he gets
Speaker 1: is against Stanford, which to me is this is why
Speaker 1: fly by scouting is so dangerous when you don't have
Speaker 1: all the information that's a good scouting turn fly by scouting. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's my favorite. Dan wrote that all these draft nicks, um,
Speaker 1: he's got hr speed by the way. There you go, Uh, no,
Speaker 1: but I mean, look, where are we Where are we
Speaker 1: talking last year? So so this year, a lot of
Speaker 1: people have talked about, oh, the Stanford game. You know,
Speaker 1: that's an NFL type offensive line and he didn't do it.
Speaker 1: The guy had a high ankle spring that week in practice,
Speaker 1: He's not supposed to play in the game. He comes
Speaker 1: out for warm ups for like five minutes. They take
Speaker 1: him off the field, which I assume he probably goes
Speaker 1: and gets a shot um. He ends up coming out
Speaker 1: with a heavily wrapped ankle. He plays guts through at
Speaker 1: USC upset Stanford. He played solid. He had a couple
Speaker 1: of destructive plays, but he's not gonna look to use
Speaker 1: the word ultra twitched up when you just had a
Speaker 1: high ankle spring on Tuesday of game week, and so
Speaker 1: so many be like I watched him against I'm like,
Speaker 1: he wasn't even healthy in that game. Go watch him
Speaker 1: when he's healthy last year, and watch we did this year.
Speaker 1: He never comes off the field. I just look, I
Speaker 1: see a guy with length, with strength, he's got quickness.
Speaker 1: What they asked him to do in that defense, a
Speaker 1: three man front, They're asking him to sit there and
Speaker 1: anchor down. He'd do that all day long. He'll press
Speaker 1: off blocks. So who's he like for people I guess
Speaker 1: who don't know what much about Like I've said it,
Speaker 1: I know Max said it before. I've used the Richard
Speaker 1: Seymour comp and to me, it's because he has that
Speaker 1: versatility to move him around and body type wise they're similar.
Speaker 1: They're kind of got like a there long they're they're
Speaker 1: smooth muscled guys, they're not just you know, there's different
Speaker 1: types there. People up and throw him. That's what Seymour
Speaker 1: could do his first few years. He does. He does
Speaker 1: not like Danny Shelton. If you want to watch somebody
Speaker 1: throw people, watch Danny Shelton and Washington watch him against
Speaker 1: Stanford where he literally forklifts dude thanks background, literally like
Speaker 1: he drove a fork to the field and took like
Speaker 1: that lifted him up and dumped him. What's going on
Speaker 1: now that you're rising? By the way, can I give
Speaker 1: you my favorite day? My my favorite you talk about
Speaker 1: scouting terms had an old scout And I've told this
Speaker 1: on on my podcast, which is the Move the Sticks podcast.
Speaker 1: I think this is gonna edit out post. Dan's gonna physically,
Speaker 1: we're gonna we're gonna We're gonna be the master file. Um.
Speaker 1: So we had an old scout his name was Ron
Speaker 1: Marsenack with the Baltimore Ravens, and when he was talking
Speaker 1: about a player one day, I literally lost it in
Speaker 1: the draft for him because he's reading his report. So
Speaker 1: he literally wrote this in the computer and he said, Uh,
Speaker 1: this player, uh you know, it's never not not any production.
Speaker 1: He leads the league in high fives and butt slaps
Speaker 1: because that's he gets there just in time to high
Speaker 1: five a teammate or pat him on the butt for
Speaker 1: making the play. He read. Wrote in his report, it's like, okay,
Speaker 1: my favorite scouting term ever was about a baseball slash
Speaker 1: football player, Adam Dunn. Yeah. Uh, the Red's baseball scout.
Speaker 1: He signed him. I think his name was Julian Mott
Speaker 1: wrote and wrote on the scouner report, so big he
Speaker 1: hunts bear with a switch playing a little football topical. Um,
Speaker 1: you're a couple of months later on that one west
Speaker 1: you are. You are, your profiles rising by the year
Speaker 1: as like a draft nick. Let's face it, you're becoming
Speaker 1: a known quantity in the industry. A big fan of
Speaker 1: that word now because you like draft expert draft analysts
Speaker 1: and draft Nick implies like a basement, and you know
Speaker 1: you don't shade plus plus you give us the NFL.
Speaker 1: And now says, I don't like the draft people that
Speaker 1: all draft all the time. I want a little NFL.
Speaker 1: Now that's true. Now here's here's an interesting point on that,
Speaker 1: because that is true, and I always we always cross checked.
Speaker 1: Not every team does this. Some teams you're a college scout,
Speaker 1: so you just watch college players. That's it. You don't
Speaker 1: have to do with any of the NFL stuff. Um,
Speaker 1: but Ozzy did it, and uh and and Phil Savage
Speaker 1: as well, coming from that school. Was in the training camp,
Speaker 1: we would go out and watch different proteins, would have
Speaker 1: players were responsible for. We'd be ready for cutdown day,
Speaker 1: which was nice because many hands make light work in
Speaker 1: order to look at all the different players. But it
Speaker 1: was always helpful for me to go back and see
Speaker 1: guys in the NFL that you had scouted, to really see, Okay,
Speaker 1: who's doing well, guys I hit on, guys I missed
Speaker 1: on kind of self of value. Wait and then you
Speaker 1: realize what's playing and you look at who's starting. Like
Speaker 1: to me, offensive linement for young scouts is hard because
Speaker 1: you have it in your mind you've got to be
Speaker 1: this long athletic and you know these Jonathan Ogden we
Speaker 1: had in both, like, those guys are so rare. Just
Speaker 1: give me a guy. If you look at the who's
Speaker 1: playing in the NFL the offensive line, you're smart, you're tough,
Speaker 1: and you can anchor. If you can do those three things,
Speaker 1: you can play. So we thought, oh, he's not a
Speaker 1: bad athlete, or he's on the ground here, They're like,
Speaker 1: look around the NFL. Look what's playing it right tackle?
Speaker 1: In this league? Those guys are gonna play. Do you
Speaker 1: think there's too many guys in your business that you know,
Speaker 1: once these guys get drafted, they don't check back in
Speaker 1: on him, and that could lead to I don't know,
Speaker 1: I can't. I think I think it's very helpful to
Speaker 1: do it. It puts me behind, you know, with the
Speaker 1: draft process, because you do the NFL stuff during the
Speaker 1: fall and then all of a sudden boom, we gotta
Speaker 1: change years and really get rolling on the draft. I've
Speaker 1: got a question that will test your micro draft knowledge
Speaker 1: and your macro NFL knowledge is now. I know you
Speaker 1: you probably love the word buzz there's now buzz that
Speaker 1: he could go in the top ten on a macro level.
Speaker 1: Is this devaluation of running backs overrated. If you're a
Speaker 1: three down power back, you're still gonna get money and
Speaker 1: you're still gonna be valued highly. I think so that
Speaker 1: grow micro devaluation money. I feel like this econ class,
Speaker 1: what's going on? You don't act like you're not just
Speaker 1: watching the replay of a EPL game, but it's you're
Speaker 1: doing good. No, look to me, these are two of
Speaker 1: the best backs we've seen come out in quite some time.
Speaker 1: When you look at Gordon and Gurley, I was surprised
Speaker 1: you had them so close together. Yeah, I think I
Speaker 1: think Gordon's a really, really good player. And you know,
Speaker 1: while I was waiting to get medical back on Gurly,
Speaker 1: I'm sitting here saying I know Gordon's healthy. So for
Speaker 1: the first part of it, I had him one spot
Speaker 1: over Girly, and then now the medicals come back pretty
Speaker 1: clean on Girly. So like, Okay, I think I'd rather
Speaker 1: roll with Todd. But both those guys are big time guys,
Speaker 1: and I think we get carried away with a positional
Speaker 1: thing and it's just kind of comes in waves and
Speaker 1: we just haven't had those those backs roll through. And
Speaker 1: I think this year that will put a stop to that.
Speaker 1: I think we'll see both those guys go around one.
Speaker 1: How about LT saying in our air waves that Todd
Speaker 1: Gurley is the best running back prospects since Adrian Peterson.
Speaker 1: A lot of people believe that. I think you pull
Speaker 1: people around the NFL. They get scared when I hear that,
Speaker 1: because exactly what everyone said about Trent Richard zactly No.
Speaker 1: And look, Trent, I didn't have to do Trent when
Speaker 1: he came out. I don't remember. I guess I was
Speaker 1: in Philly. I think it was a Philly that you're
Speaker 1: but he wouldn't. I didn't have to be a convenient
Speaker 1: for you. Now, No, well I did, JaMarcus Russell if
Speaker 1: you want to go down discussion. Um, but uh no,
Speaker 1: But yeah, I mean the way everybody talked about him,
Speaker 1: But there's something there. I mean, I don't think this
Speaker 1: is just a football issue with Trent Richardson because he
Speaker 1: just looks so so lethargic the way he plays sluggle.
Speaker 1: I'll leave that one alone. Um, all right, we should
Speaker 1: let DJ go get his sushi. Momentarily, Greg, do you
Speaker 1: have anything else you want? So many papers in front
Speaker 1: of you, I had imagined there's got to be another
Speaker 1: question in there. Greg once like a private two hour
Speaker 1: conversation with j Well, how about you got you have
Speaker 1: ten receivers in your think, which is outrageous. I think
Speaker 1: I had ten in my top fifty last year, and
Speaker 1: you know what, everybody said, that's crazy. There's no way
Speaker 1: there's ten receivers. And then I'm like, let's go back
Speaker 1: and look at those ten receivers. Which one is when
Speaker 1: didn't play well last year? Oh? Zero? So you're saying
Speaker 1: there this class, basically, this is what college football has
Speaker 1: given us. And there's no cornerbacks. There's very few cornerbacks
Speaker 1: in your top thirty. It's not a great not a
Speaker 1: great group. You like Byron Jones not just a freaking athlete,
Speaker 1: he's a player. No, I think he's gonna go. I
Speaker 1: think he's a really good chance to go in the
Speaker 1: first round if you had to take one of the
Speaker 1: kind of second level wide receivers and running backs, maybe
Speaker 1: guys that won't go in the top twenty who are
Speaker 1: this is like, this is one of my favorite players
Speaker 1: in the draft is David Copp from Minnesota, and I
Speaker 1: think he could go in the fourth round, maybe gets
Speaker 1: into the third round. But just he's we talked about shorty,
Speaker 1: quickness of bet make people missing, tight quarters, vision, all
Speaker 1: that stuff really really good. He's not gonna he's not
Speaker 1: a fourth three guys. No, he's he's he's quick. I
Speaker 1: wouldn't say he's a classic FBI c O d says
Speaker 1: the says the butt slapper and the high fiber over here. Um. No, look,
Speaker 1: I love David Copp from a receiver standpoint. Tyler Lockett
Speaker 1: from Kansas State, who's like a poor man's t Y Hilton,
Speaker 1: but which is not just a compliment. He's he's a
Speaker 1: really really good player. Those guys keep slipping in the
Speaker 1: draft who I helped in John Brown, those pretty well.
Speaker 1: He can he can help you in the return game.
Speaker 1: So I think he's gonna be a good value. And
Speaker 1: just to finish my question that I started, So you're
Speaker 1: you're rising up amongst draft analysts. Wait, he's waving his arm,
Speaker 1: he's saying he's done. Come on, go ahead, go ahead,
Speaker 1: go ahead. Do you have to have like a burner
Speaker 1: phone at this point? Aren't there front office guys coming
Speaker 1: at you all? The time people showing up in trench
Speaker 1: coats whispering thing to handing a hundred dollar bills. What's
Speaker 1: going on next question? Guys, you can read into that. Alright,
Speaker 1: that's it. You know. I love you. I love you too, baby.
Speaker 1: Daniel Jeremiah the Move the Sticks podcast, which really is
Speaker 1: it's you know, something on the rise. It's something you
Speaker 1: should check out if you haven't already. It's the show.
Speaker 1: You can listen to it. Thanks you if you choose
Speaker 1: America allows you to listen to it and also other
Speaker 1: nations around the world. Uh DJ's podcast move This thinks
Speaker 1: you can download it two to roll from me please.
Speaker 1: Uh so, yeah, check that out and thank you d J.
Speaker 1: All right, that was jovial time with Daniel Jeremiah. Learned
Speaker 1: a little bit about the draft. Hopefully you learned a
Speaker 1: little bit about the two thousand and fourteen draft. Den
Speaker 1: Is gonna be really mad because once again the show
Speaker 1: went really long when hands Is the sheriff was not around.
Speaker 1: Happy birthday, Daniel. He's a great friend to all. Just
Speaker 1: imagine if he answered the phone. Thank you, Dan for
Speaker 1: all that you do and thanks to Mark Sessler, Chris
Speaker 1: Wesselen and TV I'm Greg Rosenthal. We're gonna be back
Speaker 1: next week with three big draft shows, including a draft preview.
Speaker 1: Go get my lunch on Monday. Look at my lunch
Speaker 1: clown car looking forward to that. We'll take that before
Speaker 1: West heads over to Chicago, so that will drop on Monday.
Speaker 1: Until then, we'll see you next time.