WEBVTT - The Jiggle & the Giddy Up

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<v Speaker 1>Pushkin, Hey, Last Archive listeners, It's been here and I

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<v Speaker 1>want to share a story I made with the show

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<v Speaker 1>Revisionist History that I think belongs in the Last Archive

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<v Speaker 1>two because it's about history, democracy, and a question of truth.

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<v Speaker 1>In nineteen thirty six, the Olympic Games were hosted by

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<v Speaker 1>Nazi Germany. The modern Olympic movement was at a low ebb,

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<v Speaker 1>and without the thirty six Games, there's a good chance

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<v Speaker 1>that we wouldn't have the Olympics we have now. But

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<v Speaker 1>participating in games held in Nazi Germany raised a whole

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<v Speaker 1>lot of ethical and political questions. We tend to think

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<v Speaker 1>of Nazism as a geographically bounded thing, something people in

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<v Speaker 1>Germany in the nineteen thirties dealt with, but even just

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<v Speaker 1>a few years after Hitler's rise, before the start of

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<v Speaker 1>the Second World War, the Nazi Olympics forced countries around

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<v Speaker 1>the world to make a decision about whether or not

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<v Speaker 1>they were going to take a stand against Nazism. In

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<v Speaker 1>the US, there was a boycott movement. It failed, but

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<v Speaker 1>the political tensions around the games were fertile ground for myths.

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<v Speaker 1>Myths that tended to justify the choice to go to

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<v Speaker 1>Nazi Germany. In this episode, we look at probably the

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<v Speaker 1>most influential of those myths, a tale about Jesse Owens.

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<v Speaker 1>This episode and the next are two of a series

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<v Speaker 1>that revisionist history host Malcolm Gladwell and I worked on together.

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<v Speaker 1>It's called Hitler's Olympics, and if you like these episodes,

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<v Speaker 1>I strongly encourage you to check out the whole series. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>here's the episode.

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<v Speaker 2>Collet Street tears around the Gray Serger with a speed

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<v Speaker 2>of the wind, increasing his lead with every stride, also.

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<v Speaker 1>Running about four thousand athletes impeded in the nineteen thirty

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<v Speaker 1>six Olympic Games. Jesse Owens is the one people remember.

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<v Speaker 3>Streak Jesse Owens in the one hundred meters at Bulding

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<v Speaker 3>the outca second on him.

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<v Speaker 1>Jesse Owens was born in Alabama, the son of a sharecropper,

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<v Speaker 1>self effacing, soft spoken, and an unbelievable athlete. In nineteen

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<v Speaker 1>thirty five, as a twenty one year old, he had

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<v Speaker 1>already set three world records in a single day, all

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<v Speaker 1>in the same hour. With a bad back, the.

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<v Speaker 4>Worlds most runner makes the others look as if they're

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<v Speaker 4>walking as he wins the final and equals the worlds

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<v Speaker 4>record of time.

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<v Speaker 1>And in nineteen thirty six even the Germans were expecting

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<v Speaker 1>something great from him.

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<v Speaker 5>How many board medals do your host to win?

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<v Speaker 2>The two part time, it's to desire very athlete to

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<v Speaker 2>win a first place in the.

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<v Speaker 1>Inn the Olympic Games in nineteen thirty six, he was

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<v Speaker 1>slated to compete in three events.

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<v Speaker 6>And since I'm in.

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<v Speaker 5>Three events, I hope to emerge with three victory.

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<v Speaker 1>I hope one meters, two broad jump, one hundred meters,

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<v Speaker 1>two hundred meters and the broad jump. Later they added

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<v Speaker 1>a fourth event, the four by one hundred meter relay.

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<v Speaker 1>He would win gold in all four, the only person

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<v Speaker 1>to win four gold medals in the Berlin Olympics. And

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<v Speaker 1>that is why you know the name Jesse Owens. But

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<v Speaker 1>it all could have turned out differently because of that

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<v Speaker 1>broad jump. You've seen a broad jump before today, it's

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<v Speaker 1>called the long jump, and it's one of the more

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<v Speaker 1>dramatic Olympic sports. The jumpers sprint down the runway, hit

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<v Speaker 1>a takeoff board and they look like they're flying and

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<v Speaker 1>then they land in a huge spray of sand. So

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<v Speaker 1>the morning of August fourth, nineteen thirty six, ten thirty

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<v Speaker 1>am in the Reichsportfeld. It's the long jump qualifying rounds.

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<v Speaker 1>Best jumpers gone to the final. Owens had just run

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<v Speaker 1>his heat in the two hundred meters immediately after he

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<v Speaker 1>headed over to the pit. It was the third day

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<v Speaker 1>of the games, and by then he already had his

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<v Speaker 1>first gold medal, so it was a surprise when he

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<v Speaker 1>botched his first jump. By some accounts, he thought it

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<v Speaker 1>was a practice run, no sweat, though he had two

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<v Speaker 1>more tries, so he lined himself back up and started

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<v Speaker 1>jogging down the runway. He took off and came up short.

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<v Speaker 1>He had one jump left. If he screwed up that

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<v Speaker 1>last jump, he'd have been out of the contest, and

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<v Speaker 1>he'd have gone from being the only athlete to win

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<v Speaker 1>four gold medals in nineteen thirty six to one of

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<v Speaker 1>three athletes who'd won three goals, right up there with

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<v Speaker 1>Conrad Frey and Hendrika Mastenbrok, who actually would have had

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<v Speaker 1>more total medals than him. And I asked, be honest,

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<v Speaker 1>have you ever heard of Conrad Frey and Hendrika mastenbrook No,

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<v Speaker 1>And probably if he'd missed that final qualifying drum, you

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<v Speaker 1>wouldn't have heard of Jesse Owens either. So after the

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<v Speaker 1>first two misses, Owens was rattled. But then something miraculous happened,

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<v Speaker 1>something that changed the course of Jesse Owens's life and

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<v Speaker 1>made him a legend.

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<v Speaker 7>I'm Malcolm Gladwell. Welcome to Revisionist History, my show about

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<v Speaker 7>things overlooked and misunderstood. In this episode, Ben and daph

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<v Speaker 7>Haffrey and I are talking about one of the biggest

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<v Speaker 7>stories to emerge from the Berlin Games, A story about

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<v Speaker 7>two athletes making good on the promise of the Olympics,

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<v Speaker 7>cross cultural understanding, sportsmanship against all odds, the moment that

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<v Speaker 7>became key to the Olympic mythology and to the legend

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<v Speaker 7>of Jesse Owens. A powerful, incredibly important story that's hiding

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<v Speaker 7>a very big secret.

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<v Speaker 1>It was cool that day in August. Clouds had rolled

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<v Speaker 1>in over the stadium. Around one hundred thousand people were

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<v Speaker 1>in the stands watching in America's most famous athlete. Jesse Owens,

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<v Speaker 1>was screwing up badly, which makes no sense. All he

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<v Speaker 1>had to do was jump seven point one five meters

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<v Speaker 1>to qualify. He already had a world record for jumping

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<v Speaker 1>a meter farther than that, So what was going wrong?

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<v Speaker 1>Malcolm and I had decided to ask an expert a legend.

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<v Speaker 4>Actually it was about ten years ago or so. The

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<v Speaker 4>age is sixty five, I think. And I jumped further

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<v Speaker 4>than my high school mark.

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<v Speaker 1>Is that right?

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 1>And you're the first American who jumped fifty seven feet.

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<v Speaker 8>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>One of the greatest American triple jumpers of all time,

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<v Speaker 1>Milan Tiff.

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<v Speaker 4>I actually jumped sixty feet, but they didn't wouldn't recognize

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<v Speaker 4>it because I jumped out of the pit.

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<v Speaker 1>And where should you do that?

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<v Speaker 3>Right here?

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<v Speaker 1>You say, wow, Yeah, I jumped.

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<v Speaker 4>I completely jumped over the sand pit and landed on

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<v Speaker 4>the grass. I had grass stands all over the back

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<v Speaker 4>of me.

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<v Speaker 1>Going to see Milan was Malcolm's idea.

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<v Speaker 7>So when I was in high school, starting at the

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<v Speaker 7>age of twelve, I became a competitive runner, and I

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<v Speaker 7>was obsessed with track and field, and I subscribed to

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<v Speaker 7>Track and Field News, the Bible of the sport, as

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<v Speaker 7>it's called. And Miller Tiff was this extraordinary. First of all,

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<v Speaker 7>he was astonishing looking. He looked there was something kind

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<v Speaker 7>of ethereal about him, and he had as a kid,

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<v Speaker 7>he couldn't walk because he had I think polio or something.

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<v Speaker 7>And he was also an artist, really really bright colors

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<v Speaker 7>and kind of wildly imaginative and a little bit psychedelic.

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<v Speaker 7>But I was I was just obsessed with him as

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<v Speaker 7>this kind of like this this strange, otherworldly figure, and

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<v Speaker 7>he was a favorite in nineteen eighty. Had we not

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<v Speaker 7>boycotted the nineteen eighty Games, he might well have won

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<v Speaker 7>a gold medal. Anyway, I cannot wait. He's going to

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<v Speaker 7>be He's going to be a little bit. He might

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<v Speaker 7>be a little I don't know, but I have a

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<v Speaker 7>sense that he might be. He might be a little

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<v Speaker 7>out there.

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<v Speaker 1>This turned out to be pretty prescient. After meeting Milan Tiff,

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<v Speaker 1>I felt like I had taken some kind of intense

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<v Speaker 1>psychedelic the effects of which I've yet to wear off.

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<v Speaker 4>The first humans. It's unbelievable.

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<v Speaker 1>I understood that to walk is just to take a

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<v Speaker 1>number of tiny, long jumps. I found myself transfixed by

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<v Speaker 1>an actually gorgeous painting of Milan's portraying a pair of

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<v Speaker 1>empty tidy whities suspended in a blue abstract space called

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<v Speaker 1>Mysterious slee palm springs.

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<v Speaker 4>And the birds and the trees would all fly down.

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<v Speaker 4>They're just tapped into the same frequency as I have

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<v Speaker 4>when I'm running and jumping.

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<v Speaker 1>We flew out to Los Angeles, where he lives, so

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<v Speaker 1>he could take us out to the UCLA track, And

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<v Speaker 1>when we got there, there were several helicopters hovering above

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<v Speaker 1>us the whole time, which only made everything a little

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<v Speaker 1>more surreal, and Olympic legends just walking up to him,

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<v Speaker 1>literally bowing down this I think because they wouldn't normally

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<v Speaker 1>see him. He told us he prefers to run in

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<v Speaker 1>the morning, by which he meant three am. Tiff took

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<v Speaker 1>us out to the broad jump pit to help us

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<v Speaker 1>get inside Jesse Owens's mind, which we thought he could

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<v Speaker 1>do because he's a master of the approach the part

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<v Speaker 1>Jesse Owens was screwing up, but also because so you

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<v Speaker 1>actually knew Jesse Owens when you were a kid.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, yeah, you know, I sit and he'd tell the stories.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah and not here all the stories. And you know,

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<v Speaker 4>he talked about his experience in Berlin.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, we asked him to tell us about how

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<v Speaker 1>you're supposed to approach a jump.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, you gotta have a gidea up first, that kind

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<v Speaker 4>of rockings. You have to have some or jiggle where

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<v Speaker 4>you will call it. Yeah, you have to have a

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<v Speaker 4>jiggle or a gide up before you even get into

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<v Speaker 4>your run.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that ajustice of your run. Is that why this

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<v Speaker 1>is obviously the broad jump, but lose long. I noticed

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<v Speaker 1>he does this sort of like hitch in his leg

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<v Speaker 1>before he starts running.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, it's like a dance. It's like it's like a preparation.

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<v Speaker 1>Can you show us what your gidea.

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<v Speaker 4>Up was, Well, it's like a one two, three, four five,

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<v Speaker 4>then you start your run.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 4>And I taught it to Willie Banks world record, taught

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<v Speaker 4>it to bike Pile world record.

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<v Speaker 1>We gave it a shot on the track where at

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<v Speaker 1>the very same time actual Olympic athletes were practicing for

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<v Speaker 1>this year's games. Was it embarrassing? It was mortifying. Did

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<v Speaker 1>we set a world record? Not even close. Did we

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<v Speaker 1>become friends with any Olympians? They were otherwise occupied. But

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<v Speaker 1>this is the kind of dedication that deep historical investigations demand.

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<v Speaker 1>What was Did Jesse Owens have a gide yo?

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<v Speaker 4>No, he had a stance start because he was a sprinterer,

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<v Speaker 4>you see. Yeah, that's why he was losing the steps

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<v Speaker 4>all the time. He didn't have a jiggle, Well, he

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<v Speaker 4>didn't have a g no. He didn't have a jiggle

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<v Speaker 4>or a giddy oh yeah, And it took his competitor

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<v Speaker 4>to say, man, come on, you gotta do something first.

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<v Speaker 1>Jesse Owens's competitor, facing down the pit, the export fold

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<v Speaker 1>loots Long Lutz Long was Germany's champion broad jumper, Hitler's champion,

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<v Speaker 1>and he looked the part, a fine ak line nose

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<v Speaker 1>framed by your classic blonde hair and blue eyes. As

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<v Speaker 1>Owens wrote later, Hitler was in the stadium that morning

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<v Speaker 1>to watch. Owens knew that he'd like nothing better than

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<v Speaker 1>to see a black man and lose to an Arian.

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<v Speaker 1>The thought was nanging at him, messing up his focus.

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<v Speaker 1>And then he'd looked up at the box where Hitler

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<v Speaker 1>had been watching the games and saw that when Owens's

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<v Speaker 1>turn came, Hitler had just left. It made his blood boil.

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<v Speaker 1>That's why he was fouling out. He was psyched out

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<v Speaker 1>by all of it, distracted, and when he saw how

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<v Speaker 1>amazing Lutslong was at the broad jump, he began wonder

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<v Speaker 1>if there was something true about all this Arian stuff.

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<v Speaker 1>He was down to his last jump, and then came

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<v Speaker 1>the miracle. In an autobiography he published in nineteen seventy eight,

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<v Speaker 1>Owens wrote, Suddenly I felt a hand on my shoulder.

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<v Speaker 1>It was Lutslong.

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<v Speaker 5>Look, there is no time to waste with manners. What

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<v Speaker 5>has taken your goat?

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<v Speaker 1>Obviously we had to reenact this.

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<v Speaker 5>I had to smile a little in spite of myself

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<v Speaker 5>hearing his mixed up American idiom ah nothing. I said,

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<v Speaker 5>you know how it is? He was silent for a

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<v Speaker 5>few seconds. Yes, he said, finally, I know how it is.

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<v Speaker 5>But I also know you are a better jumper than this. Now,

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<v Speaker 5>what has taken your goat?

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<v Speaker 1>I laughed out loud.

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<v Speaker 5>This time, but I couldn't tell him him above all,

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<v Speaker 5>I glanced over at the broad jump pit I was

0:13:33.675 --> 0:13:37.635
<v Speaker 5>about to be called. Lutz didn't waste words, even if

0:13:37.635 --> 0:13:41.235
<v Speaker 5>he wasn't sure which ones to use. Is it what

0:13:41.475 --> 0:13:46.155
<v Speaker 5>reichkanze Hitler did? He asked. I was thunderstruck that he'd

0:13:46.195 --> 0:13:50.475
<v Speaker 5>say it. I started to answer, but I didn't know

0:13:50.515 --> 0:13:54.915
<v Speaker 5>what to say. I see, he said, Look, we talk

0:13:54.955 --> 0:13:58.995
<v Speaker 5>about that later. Now you must jump, and you must qualify.

0:13:59.835 --> 0:14:01.315
<v Speaker 5>But how I shot back?

0:14:02.235 --> 0:14:02.835
<v Speaker 1>I have thought?

0:14:03.035 --> 0:14:06.435
<v Speaker 5>He said, you are like Aya. You must do it

0:14:06.595 --> 0:14:07.835
<v Speaker 5>one hundred percent?

0:14:08.195 --> 0:14:10.475
<v Speaker 1>Correct? I not yet?

0:14:10.555 --> 0:14:13.595
<v Speaker 5>You must be sure not to foul. I nodded again,

0:14:13.955 --> 0:14:17.115
<v Speaker 5>this time in frustration, and as I did, I heard

0:14:17.155 --> 0:14:21.715
<v Speaker 5>the loudspeaker call my name. Lutz talked quickly. Then you

0:14:21.795 --> 0:14:25.435
<v Speaker 5>do both things, Jesse. You remeasure your steps, You take

0:14:25.475 --> 0:14:28.875
<v Speaker 5>off six inches behind the foul board. You jump as

0:14:28.915 --> 0:14:31.995
<v Speaker 5>hard as you can, but you need not fear to foul.

0:14:33.315 --> 0:14:35.995
<v Speaker 5>All at once, the panic emptied out of me like

0:14:36.035 --> 0:14:36.915
<v Speaker 5>a cloudburst.

0:14:38.075 --> 0:14:40.715
<v Speaker 1>Owens jogged up to the line and laid a towel

0:14:40.755 --> 0:14:43.635
<v Speaker 1>to mark where Long had told him to jump. He

0:14:43.755 --> 0:14:47.835
<v Speaker 1>lined up on the runway, maybe wiped his hands on

0:14:47.875 --> 0:14:52.715
<v Speaker 1>his jersey, and then he ran one step, two steps,

0:14:53.035 --> 0:14:55.675
<v Speaker 1>closer and closer to the pit, and then he hit

0:14:55.715 --> 0:14:58.115
<v Speaker 1>that mark on the towel, leapt into the air.

0:14:58.635 --> 0:15:01.275
<v Speaker 4>And when he finally got that, he qualified.

0:15:01.395 --> 0:15:04.075
<v Speaker 1>And later that day, with Hitler back in the stands,

0:15:04.435 --> 0:15:08.115
<v Speaker 1>in the metal event itself whol record, he set an

0:15:08.115 --> 0:15:13.715
<v Speaker 1>Olympic record. And that's when Lootes along the aryan poster

0:15:13.875 --> 0:15:18.435
<v Speaker 1>child who had just lost to Jesse. Owens hugged him

0:15:18.475 --> 0:15:22.315
<v Speaker 1>in front of Adolph Hitler, and the Hitler was pist man,

0:15:24.275 --> 0:15:28.795
<v Speaker 1>but Long didn't just embrace him. According to Jesse, Owens

0:15:29.235 --> 0:15:33.595
<v Speaker 1>later that night they met up in the Olympic village.

0:15:34.555 --> 0:15:37.795
<v Speaker 1>The hours ticked on and they stayed up late, talking

0:15:37.875 --> 0:15:40.755
<v Speaker 1>about their lives, the state of the world, and the

0:15:40.875 --> 0:15:44.795
<v Speaker 1>uncertain future. Some kind of strange bond had been formed

0:15:44.835 --> 0:15:48.035
<v Speaker 1>between the men that day, because then the next day

0:15:48.395 --> 0:15:52.515
<v Speaker 1>they did it again, and after that, again and again

0:15:53.235 --> 0:15:57.475
<v Speaker 1>and again. Every single night of the Games they met

0:15:57.595 --> 0:16:01.755
<v Speaker 1>up to talk. They became friends. The dream of the

0:16:01.755 --> 0:16:05.475
<v Speaker 1>Olympics was real for them. They bridged an unbridgable gap

0:16:05.515 --> 0:16:11.395
<v Speaker 1>between two cultures, two races. Something unbreakable had bound them.

0:16:11.795 --> 0:16:14.195
<v Speaker 1>After the Games, when Owens was back in America and

0:16:14.275 --> 0:16:17.635
<v Speaker 1>Lutzlang was still in Nazi Germany, they wrote letters to

0:16:17.715 --> 0:16:20.635
<v Speaker 1>each other, even after long was serving in the Wehrmacht

0:16:20.635 --> 0:16:24.915
<v Speaker 1>the Nazi Army, back and forth across the Atlantic for years.

0:16:25.795 --> 0:16:31.035
<v Speaker 1>They kept coming until right before Lutzlang was killed in

0:16:31.075 --> 0:16:35.155
<v Speaker 1>the war. He was stationed in the deserts of North Africa.

0:16:35.915 --> 0:16:39.435
<v Speaker 1>On some lonely desert hour, he sat down to write

0:16:39.515 --> 0:16:41.195
<v Speaker 1>one last letter to his friend.

0:16:42.555 --> 0:16:45.195
<v Speaker 5>I am here, Jesse, where it seems there is only

0:16:45.235 --> 0:16:49.115
<v Speaker 5>the dry sand and the wet blood. I do not

0:16:49.235 --> 0:16:52.715
<v Speaker 5>fear so much for myself, my friend, Jesse. I fear

0:16:52.755 --> 0:16:56.035
<v Speaker 5>for my woman who was at home, and my young son, Karl,

0:16:56.835 --> 0:17:01.555
<v Speaker 5>who has never really known his father. My heart tells me,

0:17:02.355 --> 0:17:05.035
<v Speaker 5>if I be honest with you, that this is the

0:17:05.115 --> 0:17:08.835
<v Speaker 5>last letter I shall ever write. If it is so,

0:17:10.075 --> 0:17:14.595
<v Speaker 5>I ask you something. It is something so very important

0:17:14.635 --> 0:17:18.395
<v Speaker 5>to me. It is you go to Germany when this

0:17:18.515 --> 0:17:23.315
<v Speaker 5>war done. Someday find my Carl and tell him about

0:17:23.355 --> 0:17:27.475
<v Speaker 5>his father. Tell him, Jesse, what times were like when

0:17:27.515 --> 0:17:32.395
<v Speaker 5>we were not separated by war, I am saying, Tell

0:17:32.475 --> 0:17:35.995
<v Speaker 5>him how things can be between men on this earth.

0:17:41.435 --> 0:17:44.675
<v Speaker 1>There are tears in your eyes. You would not be alone.

0:17:44.715 --> 0:17:47.235
<v Speaker 1>This story is a big part of the legend of

0:17:47.315 --> 0:17:51.915
<v Speaker 1>Jesse Owens. If you look up Jesse Owens in the

0:17:52.075 --> 0:17:56.315
<v Speaker 1>Encyclopedia Britannica, there's the story when they made a star

0:17:56.515 --> 0:18:00.435
<v Speaker 1>studied Hollywood film about Jesse Owens's life. Lutslog and that

0:18:00.595 --> 0:18:04.715
<v Speaker 1>qualifying jump are the pivotal moment. Retelling this story would

0:18:04.715 --> 0:18:08.235
<v Speaker 1>help launch the career of the greatest Olympic documentarian of

0:18:08.275 --> 0:18:11.555
<v Speaker 1>all time, Bud Greenspan. And I'm not an auctioneer, but

0:18:11.755 --> 0:18:15.075
<v Speaker 1>I think it is the reason why Lutslog's silver medal

0:18:15.555 --> 0:18:18.915
<v Speaker 1>sold for nearly half a million dollars two years ago,

0:18:19.395 --> 0:18:23.195
<v Speaker 1>about five times the amount earned for any other silver

0:18:23.235 --> 0:18:27.395
<v Speaker 1>medal at auction. It's arguably the most important story in

0:18:27.475 --> 0:18:31.195
<v Speaker 1>Olympic history. It is proof of the Olympic Dream. It

0:18:31.275 --> 0:18:33.915
<v Speaker 1>made the case that it was good that America went

0:18:33.955 --> 0:18:37.155
<v Speaker 1>to the Vilin Games because it made possible this improbable

0:18:37.195 --> 0:18:41.995
<v Speaker 1>friendship that transcended even the Second World War, a story

0:18:42.395 --> 0:19:03.435
<v Speaker 1>that was just too good to be true. This entire series,

0:19:03.595 --> 0:19:06.155
<v Speaker 1>we've been telling stories about the way people made sense

0:19:06.195 --> 0:19:10.595
<v Speaker 1>of having the Olympics in Nazi Germany, the distortions, And

0:19:10.635 --> 0:19:13.715
<v Speaker 1>when I kept hearing about Jesse Owens's friendship with lutzlog,

0:19:13.795 --> 0:19:15.595
<v Speaker 1>I thought we got to do an episode on this.

0:19:16.155 --> 0:19:19.115
<v Speaker 1>Here's two people who saw each other clearly through all

0:19:19.155 --> 0:19:22.915
<v Speaker 1>that moral fog. So I wanted to read more of

0:19:22.955 --> 0:19:25.475
<v Speaker 1>what Owens and Long wrote to each other in those letters.

0:19:26.075 --> 0:19:28.595
<v Speaker 1>I wrote to the Jesse Owens Archive at the University

0:19:28.595 --> 0:19:30.675
<v Speaker 1>of Ohio for copies of the letters, and they didn't

0:19:30.715 --> 0:19:33.955
<v Speaker 1>have any. They suggested I write to the family, but

0:19:34.555 --> 0:19:37.155
<v Speaker 1>they didn't have any either. It seems strange to me

0:19:37.195 --> 0:19:39.595
<v Speaker 1>that no one had kept them. So then I thought,

0:19:40.515 --> 0:19:42.795
<v Speaker 1>maybe I'm just looking in the wrong country.

0:19:44.155 --> 0:19:48.395
<v Speaker 9>My name is gelindorre I was living in Leipzig and

0:19:48.515 --> 0:19:52.155
<v Speaker 9>working in Leipzig for more than thirty years, and the

0:19:52.275 --> 0:19:56.995
<v Speaker 9>last twenty five years as the director of the sports

0:19:57.075 --> 0:19:58.355
<v Speaker 9>Museum in Leipzig.

0:19:59.035 --> 0:20:04.475
<v Speaker 1>And Leipzig has a connection to Long's life, right, that's right.

0:20:06.035 --> 0:20:12.195
<v Speaker 9>Lutslan was born in Leipzig nineteen thirty and he lived

0:20:12.235 --> 0:20:15.195
<v Speaker 9>there almost till the end.

0:20:16.035 --> 0:20:19.155
<v Speaker 1>Roar and her colleague, the sport historian Volka Kluga have

0:20:19.235 --> 0:20:22.515
<v Speaker 1>looked more deeply into the Jesse Owens Luteslong story than

0:20:22.515 --> 0:20:23.155
<v Speaker 1>anyone else.

0:20:23.515 --> 0:20:26.435
<v Speaker 9>We got a lot of questions from all over the

0:20:26.475 --> 0:20:28.675
<v Speaker 9>world about legend.

0:20:29.475 --> 0:20:32.075
<v Speaker 1>Jesse Owens told this story a lot of times. There

0:20:32.075 --> 0:20:34.595
<v Speaker 1>are a few different versions. But Roor dug through the

0:20:34.595 --> 0:20:38.115
<v Speaker 1>official reports about the games. They're over a thousand pages long.

0:20:39.035 --> 0:20:45.235
<v Speaker 9>There is a very good documentation about the Olympics called

0:20:45.715 --> 0:20:50.995
<v Speaker 9>Official Report of the nineteen thirty six Olympics, and they

0:20:51.115 --> 0:20:55.875
<v Speaker 9>describe it very exactly what happens and where.

0:20:57.035 --> 0:21:00.915
<v Speaker 1>Alongside that official report, the most important bit of documentary

0:21:00.955 --> 0:21:04.795
<v Speaker 1>evidence is an article Kluga turned up written by Lutzlong himself.

0:21:05.075 --> 0:21:07.155
<v Speaker 1>He was published about a week into the games, and

0:21:07.195 --> 0:21:11.755
<v Speaker 1>it's called mine kamfmitt Owens I struggle with Owens, which

0:21:11.955 --> 0:21:15.555
<v Speaker 1>I suspect is a deliberate reference to Hitler's memoirs, but

0:21:15.835 --> 0:21:18.915
<v Speaker 1>homages to Hitler aside. The article was part of the

0:21:18.955 --> 0:21:22.435
<v Speaker 1>surprisingly positive press coverage in Germany about Jesse Owens's win,

0:21:23.155 --> 0:21:27.475
<v Speaker 1>including a series of photographs of Jesse Owens and Luteslong

0:21:28.075 --> 0:21:32.435
<v Speaker 1>lying together in the grass of the Reichspoortfeld smiling. The

0:21:32.475 --> 0:21:35.795
<v Speaker 1>photos are sometimes billed as having been taken after the competition,

0:21:36.035 --> 0:21:39.155
<v Speaker 1>when Owens won and Long hugged him. Long's wearing a

0:21:39.235 --> 0:21:42.075
<v Speaker 1>dark turtleneck sweater and it looks like he's cracking a joke.

0:21:42.675 --> 0:21:45.435
<v Speaker 1>Owens is beaming at him and wearing his Team USA

0:21:45.515 --> 0:21:49.235
<v Speaker 1>crew neck. In the photo, they're so close it almost

0:21:49.235 --> 0:21:52.955
<v Speaker 1>looks like they're touching. They look like real friends. So

0:21:53.035 --> 0:21:55.475
<v Speaker 1>Gerlinda Ror and I turned our attention to that.

0:21:56.195 --> 0:22:02.315
<v Speaker 9>So between the first three jumps and the final three jumps,

0:22:02.995 --> 0:22:05.475
<v Speaker 9>these photographs were doing.

0:22:06.275 --> 0:22:09.515
<v Speaker 1>Oh so these photos are taken even before Jesse Owens

0:22:09.595 --> 0:22:14.315
<v Speaker 1>win the gold. Yes, oh wow, so it's even its prior.

0:22:15.635 --> 0:22:17.795
<v Speaker 1>There's a good chance that photo was taken or at

0:22:17.835 --> 0:22:21.555
<v Speaker 1>least commissioned by Lenny Riefenstahl, the legendary filmmaker for the

0:22:21.595 --> 0:22:24.795
<v Speaker 1>Third Reich. The photos float freely around the Internet now

0:22:24.875 --> 0:22:26.955
<v Speaker 1>you can find them on Getty images. But at the

0:22:26.995 --> 0:22:29.955
<v Speaker 1>time they were part of the Nazi propaganda push, meant

0:22:29.955 --> 0:22:32.915
<v Speaker 1>to show that the Nazis weren't as prejudiced as they seemed.

0:22:33.835 --> 0:22:37.075
<v Speaker 1>So we know that Lutzlang and Jesse Owens met at

0:22:37.155 --> 0:22:39.515
<v Speaker 1>least for the time it took to take that photo,

0:22:39.875 --> 0:22:42.915
<v Speaker 1>and they smiled at each other. Who knows what they said.

0:22:44.675 --> 0:22:49.515
<v Speaker 1>But here's the strange thing. In his article, Lutslog mentions

0:22:49.595 --> 0:22:53.835
<v Speaker 1>Jesse Owens's difficulty qualifying. He describes each of the three

0:22:53.915 --> 0:22:57.475
<v Speaker 1>jumps he took, but he doesn't say anything about helping

0:22:57.555 --> 0:23:01.275
<v Speaker 1>him with the approach, which is strange because that's the

0:23:01.315 --> 0:23:05.235
<v Speaker 1>most important detail in the whole story. Owens is Long's

0:23:05.275 --> 0:23:08.715
<v Speaker 1>biggest competitor. Owens is what stands between Long and the gold,

0:23:08.915 --> 0:23:10.915
<v Speaker 1>and yet Long go out of his way to help

0:23:10.955 --> 0:23:13.555
<v Speaker 1>Owens get to the final You would think in an

0:23:13.635 --> 0:23:16.795
<v Speaker 1>article about the Olympic Spirit, Long would mention that they

0:23:16.835 --> 0:23:20.075
<v Speaker 1>were trying to prove that they were unprejudiced. Also, in

0:23:20.155 --> 0:23:22.275
<v Speaker 1>Nazi Germany, it would have been away for an arian

0:23:22.395 --> 0:23:25.715
<v Speaker 1>to take credit for a black man's success, but he

0:23:25.755 --> 0:23:30.395
<v Speaker 1>doesn't mention it. Okay, so maybe all the meaningful stuff

0:23:30.435 --> 0:23:32.555
<v Speaker 1>happened in those long talks in the Olympic village.

0:23:32.715 --> 0:23:37.075
<v Speaker 9>What about those I didn't think that. It cannot be

0:23:37.075 --> 0:23:41.315
<v Speaker 9>because Lutsloan didn't live in the Olympic village. Oh really,

0:23:42.195 --> 0:23:47.635
<v Speaker 9>he didn't live here. I know from his family and

0:23:47.955 --> 0:23:54.555
<v Speaker 9>from photographs and from a diary of his mother that

0:23:55.035 --> 0:23:59.515
<v Speaker 9>after the opening of the Olympic Games he went back

0:23:59.755 --> 0:24:01.875
<v Speaker 9>home from Berlin to Leipzig.

0:24:02.275 --> 0:24:05.435
<v Speaker 1>And did he go home to Leipzig after the broad jump?

0:24:05.635 --> 0:24:07.475
<v Speaker 1>He wasn't. He would go home at the end of

0:24:07.475 --> 0:24:07.915
<v Speaker 1>each day.

0:24:08.235 --> 0:24:14.155
<v Speaker 9>No, not each day. After his competitions started. He lived

0:24:14.315 --> 0:24:16.715
<v Speaker 9>in Berlin in another hotel.

0:24:17.795 --> 0:24:20.995
<v Speaker 1>All right, So the long talks seem less likely, though

0:24:21.035 --> 0:24:24.395
<v Speaker 1>there are two pieces of evidence that cut the other way. First,

0:24:24.595 --> 0:24:27.275
<v Speaker 1>a few days after the broad jump, a newswire service

0:24:27.275 --> 0:24:31.115
<v Speaker 1>wrote that quote something like a damon and Pytheis's friendship

0:24:31.155 --> 0:24:34.995
<v Speaker 1>has sprung up between Ludslog and Jesse Owens. Though I

0:24:35.035 --> 0:24:36.955
<v Speaker 1>think that's just a reference to the hug on the

0:24:36.995 --> 0:24:39.875
<v Speaker 1>field that all the reporters would have seen. But then

0:24:39.955 --> 0:24:42.555
<v Speaker 1>there's an athlete who, decades after the Games claimed that

0:24:42.595 --> 0:24:44.955
<v Speaker 1>she went out drinking in Berlin with Owens and Long,

0:24:45.715 --> 0:24:48.515
<v Speaker 1>But Volka Kluga thinks the timing of her story is

0:24:48.555 --> 0:24:52.715
<v Speaker 1>implausible given her events schedule. Also, I can't find any

0:24:52.755 --> 0:24:55.995
<v Speaker 1>record of it in Owens's Olympic diaries. Owens is on

0:24:56.035 --> 0:24:58.755
<v Speaker 1>the record saying quote, I didn't get a chance to

0:24:58.795 --> 0:25:01.555
<v Speaker 1>go out of the Olympic village. In fact, I never

0:25:01.635 --> 0:25:04.675
<v Speaker 1>did leave the village. The only time that I was

0:25:04.715 --> 0:25:07.235
<v Speaker 1>ever out of the village was at the time when

0:25:07.235 --> 0:25:10.755
<v Speaker 1>we went to the Olympic stadium to compete. I mean,

0:25:10.915 --> 0:25:14.075
<v Speaker 1>they had some intense schedules to keep Actually, even Hitler

0:25:14.115 --> 0:25:16.755
<v Speaker 1>couldn't keep up with their schedules. The feuror liked to

0:25:16.795 --> 0:25:19.555
<v Speaker 1>sleep late. He famously slipt through a lot of d

0:25:19.635 --> 0:25:23.635
<v Speaker 1>Day and probably for the same reason, he wasn't even

0:25:23.635 --> 0:25:26.155
<v Speaker 1>in the stands the morning of the broad drum qualifiers,

0:25:26.515 --> 0:25:29.475
<v Speaker 1>which is why it's not actually possible that he walked

0:25:29.515 --> 0:25:36.515
<v Speaker 1>out on Owens. That leaves us with the letters. So

0:25:36.595 --> 0:25:41.195
<v Speaker 1>then the final piece of the legend is these letters,

0:25:41.235 --> 0:25:44.315
<v Speaker 1>these sort of beautiful letters that Letslong writes to Jesse

0:25:44.435 --> 0:25:49.235
<v Speaker 1>Owens from the front, from the battlefields of the war.

0:25:50.235 --> 0:25:52.555
<v Speaker 1>And I've not been able to find any archival record

0:25:52.555 --> 0:25:53.275
<v Speaker 1>of those letters.

0:25:53.995 --> 0:26:00.035
<v Speaker 9>Have you I asked his middle when she was living

0:26:00.155 --> 0:26:07.475
<v Speaker 9>still in Hamburg, and she said there were letters we

0:26:07.635 --> 0:26:12.595
<v Speaker 9>got to our atmus and she never saw a letter

0:26:13.035 --> 0:26:19.155
<v Speaker 9>from Jesse Owens. No one in the family knows about

0:26:19.395 --> 0:26:21.675
<v Speaker 9>letters from Jesse Owens.

0:26:21.395 --> 0:26:25.275
<v Speaker 1>To Lutz Owens. At one point cites nineteen thirty nine

0:26:25.315 --> 0:26:28.475
<v Speaker 1>as the date of Lutzlang's last letter. He says that

0:26:28.635 --> 0:26:32.115
<v Speaker 1>in it Long writes about his wife and son, But

0:26:32.235 --> 0:26:35.315
<v Speaker 1>Volkar Kluga points out that Long didn't even marry his

0:26:35.355 --> 0:26:38.355
<v Speaker 1>girlfriend until nineteen forty one, and by the way, his

0:26:38.475 --> 0:26:41.035
<v Speaker 1>son wasn't born till then either, And okay, well, then

0:26:41.075 --> 0:26:43.395
<v Speaker 1>there's that other account featuring a letter from Long on

0:26:43.435 --> 0:26:45.955
<v Speaker 1>the front lines of North Africa after he was married

0:26:45.955 --> 0:26:50.035
<v Speaker 1>and after his son was born, except he didn't serve

0:26:50.075 --> 0:26:55.115
<v Speaker 1>in North Africa. He died in Sicily. Also, you couldn't

0:26:55.155 --> 0:26:58.915
<v Speaker 1>even send letters from the Nazi front lines to American citizens.

0:26:59.315 --> 0:27:02.275
<v Speaker 1>I mean, they were fighting a war against each other,

0:27:04.555 --> 0:27:07.115
<v Speaker 1>so then they really wouldn't have been speaking, really beyond

0:27:07.675 --> 0:27:10.675
<v Speaker 1>the competition itself. So probably the most they spoke was

0:27:10.715 --> 0:27:12.115
<v Speaker 1>when they were taking those photos.

0:27:12.315 --> 0:27:18.795
<v Speaker 9>The only time they met each other was during the

0:27:18.915 --> 0:27:24.875
<v Speaker 9>long jump competition in this stadium the only time, never before,

0:27:25.195 --> 0:27:26.235
<v Speaker 9>and never often.

0:27:28.475 --> 0:27:31.315
<v Speaker 1>I looked through Jesse Owens's diary from the nineteen thirty

0:27:31.315 --> 0:27:34.875
<v Speaker 1>six Games. In the back he keeps a list of addresses,

0:27:35.275 --> 0:27:38.675
<v Speaker 1>presumably of people he wants to write to, and there's

0:27:38.715 --> 0:27:42.515
<v Speaker 1>no address for Lutslan in there. It was starting to

0:27:42.555 --> 0:27:47.075
<v Speaker 1>look like this amazing Olympic story just wasn't true. But

0:27:47.115 --> 0:27:50.595
<v Speaker 1>then I was left with a new question. If it's

0:27:50.635 --> 0:27:56.155
<v Speaker 1>not true, how did it catch on? We'll be right back.

0:28:03.635 --> 0:28:07.515
<v Speaker 1>What are the ingredients of a good Olympic story?

0:28:08.195 --> 0:28:10.715
<v Speaker 7>Well, I mean I would start with the mathematics of

0:28:10.755 --> 0:28:14.795
<v Speaker 7>the games, which are tremendously appealing from a storyteller's perspective,

0:28:15.475 --> 0:28:19.355
<v Speaker 7>which is that you have whatever I forgot, how many

0:28:19.395 --> 0:28:23.475
<v Speaker 7>sports fifty going on simultaneously with athletes from all over

0:28:23.475 --> 0:28:27.515
<v Speaker 7>the world, So you have an infinite number of stories

0:28:27.555 --> 0:28:28.595
<v Speaker 7>to choose from.

0:28:28.835 --> 0:28:29.675
<v Speaker 1>Like a farm system.

0:28:29.875 --> 0:28:32.795
<v Speaker 7>It's a farm storytelling, so every year a different one

0:28:33.435 --> 0:28:37.475
<v Speaker 7>bubbles up. You know, Mark Spitz, a dentist whins seven golds.

0:28:37.835 --> 0:28:40.555
<v Speaker 7>Now do you come in each? A kind of beautiful

0:28:40.675 --> 0:28:44.435
<v Speaker 7>waif from Romania. It's this kind of wonderful natural experiment

0:28:44.555 --> 0:28:48.555
<v Speaker 7>in myth making. It just has it has an enormous

0:28:48.595 --> 0:28:51.595
<v Speaker 7>strategic advantage with the other big sports spectacles World Cup,

0:28:52.515 --> 0:28:54.675
<v Speaker 7>super Bowl, those are monocultures.

0:28:55.155 --> 0:28:56.955
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think that's totally true. And like in the

0:28:56.955 --> 0:29:00.715
<v Speaker 1>myth making thing, you have this ancient aura to it. Yes.

0:29:01.515 --> 0:29:08.675
<v Speaker 7>The other thing is it's this playground for healthy prejudice.

0:29:08.835 --> 0:29:12.875
<v Speaker 7>So the the flying fin, the kind of mysterious Pabunermi

0:29:12.875 --> 0:29:16.475
<v Speaker 7>who comes from like the woods of and like you know,

0:29:16.515 --> 0:29:19.835
<v Speaker 7>a baby Bekuila running barefoot through the streets of Rome

0:29:19.955 --> 0:29:21.875
<v Speaker 7>and to in the marathon in nineteen sixty. Of course

0:29:21.875 --> 0:29:25.155
<v Speaker 7>he's berefit, right, he's e Theiopia right on and on

0:29:25.235 --> 0:29:29.595
<v Speaker 7>your your you, you take on the characteristics of your

0:29:30.195 --> 0:29:33.115
<v Speaker 7>of your country, and that's like it's this kind of

0:29:33.155 --> 0:29:38.635
<v Speaker 7>really fun exercise in multicultural ethnocentrism.

0:29:39.275 --> 0:29:42.235
<v Speaker 1>It's like, what's what's in the water over there? Yes,

0:29:42.675 --> 0:29:47.075
<v Speaker 1>that's right. Did you ever cross paths with Bud Greenspan? No,

0:29:48.115 --> 0:29:53.155
<v Speaker 1>Bud green Span, the most legendary Olympic storyteller of all time.

0:29:53.515 --> 0:29:55.715
<v Speaker 8>There are those who believe in the core values of

0:29:55.755 --> 0:30:00.755
<v Speaker 8>the Olympics, no one more so than filmmaker Bud Greenspan.

0:30:02.755 --> 0:30:04.955
<v Speaker 1>At some point in this project, I got a little

0:30:04.955 --> 0:30:08.155
<v Speaker 1>distracted from Jesse Owens and got obsessed with Bud Greenspan.

0:30:08.675 --> 0:30:10.475
<v Speaker 1>He looked like the Buddha, if the Buddha had been

0:30:10.475 --> 0:30:13.035
<v Speaker 1>born far sighted on the Upper West Side of Manhattan.

0:30:13.355 --> 0:30:16.195
<v Speaker 1>He was bald and typically wore his black, thick framed

0:30:16.235 --> 0:30:19.515
<v Speaker 1>glasses on top of his head, like his brain was stargazing.

0:30:20.475 --> 0:30:23.275
<v Speaker 7>Do you ever look at that unappealing negative side of

0:30:23.275 --> 0:30:24.475
<v Speaker 7>the Olympics in your films?

0:30:24.555 --> 0:30:26.235
<v Speaker 8>I've been asked that many times, Jane.

0:30:26.315 --> 0:30:28.195
<v Speaker 2>I think I'd rather spend one hundred percent of my

0:30:28.275 --> 0:30:30.555
<v Speaker 2>time and a ninety percent that's good, and a lot

0:30:30.555 --> 0:30:31.795
<v Speaker 2>of my colleagues who spent one.

0:30:31.755 --> 0:30:33.635
<v Speaker 1>Hundred percent of the time in the ten percent that's

0:30:33.675 --> 0:30:36.835
<v Speaker 1>not so good. Here, I should just acknowledge that he's

0:30:36.875 --> 0:30:40.235
<v Speaker 1>talking about us in our nine part series on Hitler's Olympics,

0:30:40.315 --> 0:30:42.995
<v Speaker 1>which that is fair. I defer to him because Bud

0:30:43.035 --> 0:30:48.355
<v Speaker 1>green Span basically invented modern uplifting Olympic storytelling. When Bob

0:30:48.435 --> 0:30:51.595
<v Speaker 1>cost Us, the Voice of the Olympics on NBC first

0:30:51.635 --> 0:30:53.955
<v Speaker 1>got the big job, you watched like sixteen hours of

0:30:53.955 --> 0:30:57.235
<v Speaker 1>Bud Greenspan documentaries just to get the feeling right.

0:30:58.955 --> 0:31:01.595
<v Speaker 8>Though criticized at times for looking at the games like

0:31:01.635 --> 0:31:05.435
<v Speaker 8>a young boy through rose colored glasses. He has been

0:31:05.475 --> 0:31:08.155
<v Speaker 8>making films on the Olympics for over fifty years.

0:31:09.235 --> 0:31:11.915
<v Speaker 1>That, by the way, is from an ESPN tribute to

0:31:11.915 --> 0:31:14.795
<v Speaker 1>Bud Greenspan, which is why there was all those angelic

0:31:14.875 --> 0:31:18.355
<v Speaker 1>voices in the background. Green Span started reporting on the

0:31:18.355 --> 0:31:22.235
<v Speaker 1>Olympics in the late nineteen forties. He was at every

0:31:22.275 --> 0:31:26.035
<v Speaker 1>single Olympic Games from nineteen eighty four until he died

0:31:26.075 --> 0:31:29.715
<v Speaker 1>in twenty ten. He won eight Emmys, a Lifetime Achievement

0:31:29.755 --> 0:31:32.475
<v Speaker 1>Award from the Director's Guild. Everyone knew Bud green Span,

0:31:33.155 --> 0:31:35.075
<v Speaker 1>and even if you don't know his name, you know

0:31:35.155 --> 0:31:35.675
<v Speaker 1>his style.

0:31:35.955 --> 0:31:36.875
<v Speaker 6>Here's one story.

0:31:37.515 --> 0:31:40.915
<v Speaker 1>Nancy Beffa, Bud Greenspan's partner in life and film.

0:31:41.275 --> 0:31:45.675
<v Speaker 6>Okay, we're at the Metropolitan Opera, which he adored, and

0:31:45.915 --> 0:31:50.595
<v Speaker 6>intermission and having a glasses champagne and managing editor of

0:31:50.595 --> 0:31:53.995
<v Speaker 6>Time magazine you know, comes up to us and goes Bud,

0:31:54.435 --> 0:31:57.635
<v Speaker 6>and he goes, what are you doing here? As if

0:31:58.235 --> 0:32:01.635
<v Speaker 6>you know, oh, you should be at Yankee Stadium or something.

0:32:01.995 --> 0:32:07.675
<v Speaker 1>Oh, there is something so operatic about Olympic stories. So well, yeah,

0:32:07.795 --> 0:32:09.755
<v Speaker 1>so why am I telling you about Bud green Span

0:32:10.235 --> 0:32:13.355
<v Speaker 1>because his love for sport and his love for operatic

0:32:13.395 --> 0:32:17.715
<v Speaker 1>storytelling came together in the holy grail of all Olympic stories,

0:32:18.475 --> 0:32:22.675
<v Speaker 1>the nineteen thirty six Games. In Jesse Owens.

0:32:22.515 --> 0:32:26.235
<v Speaker 6>They were friends. So like when Jesse would come into

0:32:26.275 --> 0:32:29.035
<v Speaker 6>New York, maybe he stayed at his apartment, they'd certainly

0:32:29.115 --> 0:32:33.795
<v Speaker 6>see each other. I remember by telling these stories about

0:32:33.795 --> 0:32:37.835
<v Speaker 6>how he would take Jesse out to dinner and maybe

0:32:37.875 --> 0:32:40.515
<v Speaker 6>it was like a tennis at racket club in New

0:32:40.595 --> 0:32:44.435
<v Speaker 6>York City and they were still segregated, but he talked

0:32:44.435 --> 0:32:46.835
<v Speaker 6>his way into the dining room, and I remember the

0:32:46.915 --> 0:32:50.235
<v Speaker 6>matre g called but just as long as Jesse sits

0:32:50.315 --> 0:32:52.795
<v Speaker 6>with his back to the door, the front door.

0:32:54.075 --> 0:32:57.355
<v Speaker 1>In the nineteen sixties, during the Civil rights movement, Greenspan

0:32:57.475 --> 0:32:59.515
<v Speaker 1>got the idea for a film that fit the era.

0:33:00.155 --> 0:33:03.515
<v Speaker 1>He convinced Jesse Owens to return to Berlin to shoot

0:33:03.555 --> 0:33:06.995
<v Speaker 1>an hour long TV documentary to narrate it too. A

0:33:06.995 --> 0:33:09.075
<v Speaker 1>lot of the film is made up of archival footage

0:33:09.115 --> 0:33:12.275
<v Speaker 1>that Lenny Reef shot of the games, but it's framed

0:33:12.275 --> 0:33:14.675
<v Speaker 1>with these scenes of an older Jesse Owens in a

0:33:14.715 --> 0:33:17.475
<v Speaker 1>suit walking around the reich Sport Feld and for one

0:33:17.475 --> 0:33:21.675
<v Speaker 1>of the film's pivotal scenes, Bud Greenspan invited Lutsloan's son

0:33:21.795 --> 0:33:25.755
<v Speaker 1>Kai to meet Jesse Owens on the track, and that's

0:33:25.795 --> 0:33:29.635
<v Speaker 1>when this happened. Ki.

0:33:29.755 --> 0:33:31.755
<v Speaker 2>You probably don't know it, but your father was greatly

0:33:31.795 --> 0:33:34.915
<v Speaker 2>responsible for my winning the broad jump in nineteen thirty six.

0:33:35.235 --> 0:33:37.155
<v Speaker 3>Well, Jesse, you have been a very important part in

0:33:37.155 --> 0:33:39.875
<v Speaker 3>my life and I'm very often seen pictures from you

0:33:39.955 --> 0:33:42.595
<v Speaker 3>and the photographs of my father. Please tell me about

0:33:42.595 --> 0:33:46.075
<v Speaker 3>this competition here in the stadium, because I have my

0:33:46.155 --> 0:33:49.315
<v Speaker 3>father only scene for three times. I was born nineteen

0:33:49.395 --> 0:33:51.595
<v Speaker 3>forty one and my father has died in ninety forty three.

0:33:51.955 --> 0:33:54.155
<v Speaker 2>Well, it all happened on the other side of the

0:33:54.195 --> 0:33:56.475
<v Speaker 2>field here where we had the premonaries for the running

0:33:56.475 --> 0:34:00.115
<v Speaker 2>broad jump, and on the first two jumps, I fouled

0:34:00.115 --> 0:34:01.995
<v Speaker 2>on one and then go far enough on the other.

0:34:02.475 --> 0:34:05.475
<v Speaker 2>And your father came to my assistance and he helped

0:34:05.515 --> 0:34:07.955
<v Speaker 2>me measure a footback of the takeoff board, and he

0:34:07.955 --> 0:34:10.635
<v Speaker 2>helped the tape until I measured a back as far

0:34:10.675 --> 0:34:13.515
<v Speaker 2>as my takeoff was concerned. And then I came down

0:34:13.555 --> 0:34:16.915
<v Speaker 2>and I hit between these two marks, and therefore I qualified,

0:34:17.035 --> 0:34:19.435
<v Speaker 2>and that led to the victory in the running broad ject.

0:34:22.075 --> 0:34:25.355
<v Speaker 1>The film was a huge hit, and it was written, directed,

0:34:25.475 --> 0:34:28.915
<v Speaker 1>and produced by Bud Greenspan. So I figured case closed.

0:34:29.115 --> 0:34:31.395
<v Speaker 1>Greenspan took that hug on the field and he just

0:34:31.475 --> 0:34:33.235
<v Speaker 1>made up the rest of the myth about Loose Long.

0:34:34.075 --> 0:34:38.835
<v Speaker 1>But Nancy Befer said, not so fast. Bud Greenspan believed

0:34:38.875 --> 0:34:42.875
<v Speaker 1>that story because he'd heard it from Jesse Owens.

0:34:43.075 --> 0:34:44.995
<v Speaker 6>But going back, why did he make it up? I

0:34:45.035 --> 0:34:49.875
<v Speaker 6>don't know. I can't really speculate on that particular thing.

0:34:50.355 --> 0:34:54.275
<v Speaker 6>But obviously you need a storyteller and then a recipient.

0:34:54.555 --> 0:35:00.755
<v Speaker 6>So people must have wanted to hear that story, you know,

0:35:01.075 --> 0:35:04.675
<v Speaker 6>and the notion I mean, So I don't know, And Bud,

0:35:04.915 --> 0:35:09.435
<v Speaker 6>I mean, most important thing was until he died, didn't

0:35:09.475 --> 0:35:11.515
<v Speaker 6>know Jesse made up that story.

0:35:13.755 --> 0:35:17.155
<v Speaker 1>The story came from Jesse Owens, and he first told

0:35:17.195 --> 0:35:19.915
<v Speaker 1>it long before he made that film in the nineteen sixties.

0:35:20.395 --> 0:35:22.875
<v Speaker 1>Ki Long at first heard it from Jesse Owens too,

0:35:22.955 --> 0:35:23.915
<v Speaker 1>a decade earlier.

0:35:24.475 --> 0:35:30.715
<v Speaker 9>Oh, when I first talked to Ky Long, he said,

0:35:31.355 --> 0:35:37.275
<v Speaker 9>for him, it was a completely unexpected situation.

0:35:37.915 --> 0:35:40.075
<v Speaker 1>Again, sport historian Gerlinda Rhorr.

0:35:40.635 --> 0:35:43.795
<v Speaker 9>He was ten years at the time when Jesse Owens

0:35:43.835 --> 0:35:50.435
<v Speaker 9>came to Germany and suddenly ky Long was in a

0:35:50.435 --> 0:35:57.715
<v Speaker 9>lot of journalists and photographs, and he didn't know what

0:35:57.915 --> 0:36:02.155
<v Speaker 9>happened because he couldn't remember his father. He was only

0:36:02.675 --> 0:36:07.395
<v Speaker 9>two and a half year old when Lutzlong had to

0:36:07.515 --> 0:36:13.475
<v Speaker 9>leave the family for the war, and so it was

0:36:13.515 --> 0:36:20.395
<v Speaker 9>a completely a new situation for this young boy. Of course,

0:36:20.435 --> 0:36:24.915
<v Speaker 9>he believed it because he didn't know what really happened.

0:36:24.955 --> 0:36:27.395
<v Speaker 9>He couldn't ask his father. Never.

0:36:29.275 --> 0:36:32.395
<v Speaker 1>Grilinda told me that as Kai Long grew older and

0:36:32.515 --> 0:36:35.635
<v Speaker 1>reporters kept asking him about Jesse Owens and his father,

0:36:36.435 --> 0:36:40.395
<v Speaker 1>Kai started to wonder about the myth, which eventually had

0:36:40.435 --> 0:36:44.435
<v Speaker 1>begun to involve Kai too. In a TV interview, Owen

0:36:44.515 --> 0:36:47.315
<v Speaker 1>said that Kai had his letters' salutes in his scrap book.

0:36:47.715 --> 0:36:50.755
<v Speaker 2>In nineteen fifty one, I had the privilege of meeting

0:36:50.795 --> 0:36:54.435
<v Speaker 2>his son, and after showing the pictures and letters that

0:36:54.515 --> 0:36:55.875
<v Speaker 2>he had, described book that I.

0:36:55.795 --> 0:36:56.635
<v Speaker 1>Had written his father.

0:36:57.315 --> 0:36:57.515
<v Speaker 5>Well.

0:36:57.635 --> 0:36:59.155
<v Speaker 2>As a result of that, today I.

0:36:59.315 --> 0:37:02.955
<v Speaker 1>Know there is no evidence that that's true. Kai published

0:37:02.955 --> 0:37:05.275
<v Speaker 1>a book in twenty fifteen about his father, full of

0:37:05.315 --> 0:37:09.755
<v Speaker 1>family photos and documents. It's in German and impossible to find,

0:37:09.875 --> 0:37:12.835
<v Speaker 1>but the publisher sent me a copy and there are

0:37:12.955 --> 0:37:16.475
<v Speaker 1>just no letters from Omens to Long in it. Surely,

0:37:16.555 --> 0:37:19.955
<v Speaker 1>if Kai had those letters in that scrap book, he'd

0:37:19.955 --> 0:37:21.515
<v Speaker 1>have included them in this book.

0:37:23.115 --> 0:37:30.075
<v Speaker 9>And so he started to think about what's the truth

0:37:30.595 --> 0:37:36.275
<v Speaker 9>and what really happened when he was an adult, and

0:37:36.675 --> 0:37:41.595
<v Speaker 9>he was asked all the time from journalists and when

0:37:41.795 --> 0:37:48.995
<v Speaker 9>he told them, oh, maybe it couldn't be or their

0:37:49.115 --> 0:37:54.755
<v Speaker 9>aren't letters to me, he said, I can tell what

0:37:54.915 --> 0:38:02.315
<v Speaker 9>I want. They want to hear the legends. And so

0:38:03.155 --> 0:38:10.355
<v Speaker 9>he said once to me, Oh, missus, Raw, isn't it

0:38:10.515 --> 0:38:17.635
<v Speaker 9>nice for people to live with this story? Do you

0:38:17.755 --> 0:38:19.955
<v Speaker 9>want to destroy this story?

0:38:21.115 --> 0:38:24.235
<v Speaker 1>Honestly, I don't want to destroy this story. And let

0:38:24.235 --> 0:38:27.835
<v Speaker 1>me say again, a meaningful part of it is clearly true.

0:38:28.035 --> 0:38:31.595
<v Speaker 1>Lutslang and Jesse Owens were true sportsmen. They were good

0:38:31.635 --> 0:38:34.795
<v Speaker 1>to each other on the field. But this whole series

0:38:34.795 --> 0:38:37.395
<v Speaker 1>we're doing is about what happens when we failed to

0:38:37.395 --> 0:38:39.715
<v Speaker 1>see the truth of what is right before our eyes.

0:38:40.275 --> 0:38:43.435
<v Speaker 1>And this legend of the Owens Long friendship has started

0:38:43.475 --> 0:38:45.835
<v Speaker 1>to seem to me like one of the biggest examples

0:38:45.875 --> 0:38:49.115
<v Speaker 1>of failing to see what's right before you first, because

0:38:49.155 --> 0:38:51.995
<v Speaker 1>in so many ways it doesn't add up. And second

0:38:52.235 --> 0:38:54.915
<v Speaker 1>because it doesn't just involve one or two daffy members

0:38:54.955 --> 0:38:58.355
<v Speaker 1>of the IOC, but so many of us for a

0:38:58.395 --> 0:39:02.715
<v Speaker 1>long time now. But why would Jesse Owens make this up?

0:39:04.555 --> 0:39:20.115
<v Speaker 1>The truth at last? Next week? Revisionist History is produced

0:39:20.115 --> 0:39:24.115
<v Speaker 1>by me Ben Thattdiphaffrey, Dalli Emlin, and Nina Bird Lawrence.

0:39:24.675 --> 0:39:28.555
<v Speaker 1>Our editor is Sarah Nix. Fact checking on this episode

0:39:28.835 --> 0:39:33.275
<v Speaker 1>by J. L. Goldfein, Original scoring by Luis Garratt, mastering

0:39:33.515 --> 0:39:38.155
<v Speaker 1>by Sarah Briguier and Jake Korski. Engineering by Nina Bird Lawrence.

0:39:38.795 --> 0:39:43.275
<v Speaker 1>Our executive producer is Jacob Smith. Special thanks to Karen

0:39:43.315 --> 0:39:46.355
<v Speaker 1>Schakerji rufus Wright who read the excerpts of Jesse owens

0:39:46.395 --> 0:39:55.635
<v Speaker 1>autobiography and J. D. Landis. I'm bennatiph Haffrey. That was

0:39:55.675 --> 0:39:58.315
<v Speaker 1>part one of a two part story on Jesse Owens

0:39:58.355 --> 0:40:01.755
<v Speaker 1>from Revisionist Histories nine part series on the Games. Part

0:40:01.835 --> 0:40:03.435
<v Speaker 1>two is in your feeds now