1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:03,000 Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways is not brought to you by giant headphone 2 00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:05,480 Speaker 1: cans that make you look like a Cyberman from Dr 3 00:00:05,519 --> 00:00:09,240 Speaker 1: Who Now. Instead, TSP is brought to you by sleep Phones, 4 00:00:09,400 --> 00:00:12,600 Speaker 1: the world's most comfortable headphones for sleeping, traveling, or just 5 00:00:12,640 --> 00:00:14,920 Speaker 1: curling up to listen to us sad, scary little mysteries 6 00:00:14,960 --> 00:00:18,040 Speaker 1: like ours this week from the London Underground. You'll find 7 00:00:18,040 --> 00:00:20,720 Speaker 1: out about that soon enough. With sleep Bones you get 8 00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:23,720 Speaker 1: super thin, high quality audio speakers tucked inside of super 9 00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:27,440 Speaker 1: company head been. They're soft and really comfortable to wear. 10 00:00:27,440 --> 00:00:30,520 Speaker 1: I now and Devin, you like them too, right? The 11 00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:33,080 Speaker 1: speakers are thin, the sound is really good, and they're 12 00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:35,560 Speaker 1: just really neat. And if you've got somebody sleep in 13 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 1: your store and right next to you way you're trying 14 00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:39,840 Speaker 1: to tune into our podcast, well, the sleep phones will 15 00:00:39,880 --> 00:00:42,760 Speaker 1: help cancel that out. By the way, there's something for 16 00:00:42,760 --> 00:00:45,680 Speaker 1: you guys. Our listeners can save five bucks off any 17 00:00:45,680 --> 00:00:49,240 Speaker 1: sleephones product at sleep phones dot com just by entering 18 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:54,520 Speaker 1: the promo code sideways at checkout. That's sideways and save 19 00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 1: yourself five bucks when you pick up corded or wireless 20 00:00:57,600 --> 00:01:08,800 Speaker 1: sleep phones at sleep phones dot com. Thinking Sideways broke 21 00:01:08,880 --> 00:01:17,880 Speaker 1: the I don't know stories of things we simply don't 22 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:22,360 Speaker 1: know the answer to get there. And welcome again to 23 00:01:22,360 --> 00:01:26,560 Speaker 1: another episode of Thinking Sideways. I am Steve, as always 24 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:32,920 Speaker 1: joined by Devon Joe, and as usual we've got another 25 00:01:32,959 --> 00:01:36,200 Speaker 1: mystery for you. This week we're gonna be talking about 26 00:01:36,240 --> 00:01:40,560 Speaker 1: the Morgate tube crash, which was suggested to us by Richard. 27 00:01:40,760 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 1: Thanks Richard, yes, so thank you, Richard. I gotta be 28 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:44,960 Speaker 1: honest with you when you first put up, you know, 29 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:46,840 Speaker 1: on our little spreadsheet that you were going to do 30 00:01:46,880 --> 00:01:53,040 Speaker 1: this with like, boy, that's a dumb, super boring dumb. 31 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:59,040 Speaker 1: Actually turns out super interesting, way more interesting than originally anticipating. 32 00:01:59,320 --> 00:02:02,480 Speaker 1: So good job, good job. More controversial too than you 33 00:02:02,480 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 1: would think. Absolutely so. For folks who don't know, let's 34 00:02:05,800 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 1: give a little bit of a primer here, as we 35 00:02:07,400 --> 00:02:12,200 Speaker 1: always like to do. The In nineteen seventy five the 36 00:02:12,240 --> 00:02:15,720 Speaker 1: Morgate Tube grash happened, which was the crash of a 37 00:02:15,880 --> 00:02:19,680 Speaker 1: passenger train in the London underground and that was not 38 00:02:19,720 --> 00:02:22,600 Speaker 1: having it for a landing pilot lost control, not that 39 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:26,040 Speaker 1: at all like that. No, it's a train, not a plane. Wrong, wrong, 40 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:28,920 Speaker 1: wrong aim. For those of you not familiar with the 41 00:02:28,960 --> 00:02:32,880 Speaker 1: London Underground a k a. The Tube. It's London's rapid 42 00:02:32,919 --> 00:02:37,240 Speaker 1: transit system and their rapid transit train system, which is 43 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:41,600 Speaker 1: both above and blowground. It's commuter light rail correct, much 44 00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:44,200 Speaker 1: like the New York subways. The subway. People are familiar 45 00:02:44,240 --> 00:02:46,079 Speaker 1: with the subway in America, we probably don't need to 46 00:02:46,080 --> 00:02:49,200 Speaker 1: spell it out in two graphic. Although the Tube is 47 00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:52,680 Speaker 1: much older. It's started in it's almost as old as 48 00:02:52,720 --> 00:02:56,520 Speaker 1: Boston system. I'm kidding. And I was like, wait a second, 49 00:02:56,560 --> 00:02:59,160 Speaker 1: because you know, London started in nineteen o four, although 50 00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:01,680 Speaker 1: or not London but New York. Although I remember it 51 00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:04,679 Speaker 1: was weird at first the London train or the New 52 00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:10,200 Speaker 1: York train wasn't actually underground, it was just below grade. Partially. 53 00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:12,840 Speaker 1: It was the weirdest train system in the world. But 54 00:03:12,919 --> 00:03:16,919 Speaker 1: that's a completely different conversation. Actually, New York has got 55 00:03:17,040 --> 00:03:19,760 Speaker 1: like this, this phantom subway tunnel. This guy actually got 56 00:03:19,919 --> 00:03:22,959 Speaker 1: a train and everything that's been sealed off for years. Yeah, 57 00:03:23,000 --> 00:03:25,079 Speaker 1: I heard about that to do an episode on it. Yeah, 58 00:03:25,160 --> 00:03:27,640 Speaker 1: this sounds familiar. Yeah, it's not bringing a bell at 59 00:03:27,639 --> 00:03:31,960 Speaker 1: the moment. Yeah. So the accident that we're talking about 60 00:03:32,000 --> 00:03:37,040 Speaker 1: in it takes place on the Highbury branch, which from 61 00:03:37,160 --> 00:03:39,000 Speaker 1: what I can tell from the maps of the time, 62 00:03:40,120 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 1: was a short north south line that ran between two 63 00:03:46,160 --> 00:03:51,040 Speaker 1: larger lines, and it actually connects like three or maybe 64 00:03:51,040 --> 00:03:54,400 Speaker 1: four lines. Well, it has stations, so that's what you need. 65 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:56,320 Speaker 1: That's the thing about the tube is when you read 66 00:03:56,360 --> 00:04:00,280 Speaker 1: that map. I looked at it realized there's five stops, 67 00:04:00,320 --> 00:04:03,640 Speaker 1: but two of those stops are on different partitions portions 68 00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:06,200 Speaker 1: of the same line, and then one's on the north. 69 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:09,040 Speaker 1: But long story short, it was considered to be part 70 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 1: of the North Line. It's no longer in service. Yeah, 71 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:15,640 Speaker 1: it was. I'm not surprised that it's not in service 72 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:18,039 Speaker 1: because it was for passenger trains for the two because 73 00:04:18,040 --> 00:04:21,160 Speaker 1: it was such a teeny tiny little line. Well, it's 74 00:04:21,200 --> 00:04:23,360 Speaker 1: not very efficient if you connect. If you get those 75 00:04:23,400 --> 00:04:26,159 Speaker 1: lines more directly, that means to train rides instead of 76 00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:28,160 Speaker 1: three train rides for a lot of people. I can 77 00:04:28,200 --> 00:04:29,920 Speaker 1: see where a lot of people would favor that. I 78 00:04:30,600 --> 00:04:32,919 Speaker 1: totally have the same thought. I saw where the benefit 79 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:35,560 Speaker 1: for the commuter was, but not for the operator of 80 00:04:35,560 --> 00:04:37,920 Speaker 1: the rail line. Just for history sake, I looked it up. 81 00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:42,240 Speaker 1: The Boston area was eighteen thirty ishes when their railroad, 82 00:04:42,480 --> 00:04:46,240 Speaker 1: their underground railroad started right, yeah? Uh? Is that the 83 00:04:46,279 --> 00:04:53,800 Speaker 1: one for slaves or the one for just commuters? Sorry? Okay, 84 00:04:53,920 --> 00:04:55,960 Speaker 1: to begin at the beginning of the story. On the 85 00:04:56,080 --> 00:05:00,560 Speaker 1: day that things happened, the morning of February, the train 86 00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:04,640 Speaker 1: left from Drayton Park, which was the northernmost stop on 87 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:09,160 Speaker 1: that line, and it left that stop to make its 88 00:05:09,240 --> 00:05:12,680 Speaker 1: third loop of the day that particular train set and 89 00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:16,000 Speaker 1: it left supposedly thirty seconds late. I see it always 90 00:05:16,040 --> 00:05:18,840 Speaker 1: listed as having left at either eight thirty eight or 91 00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:22,320 Speaker 1: eight thirty nine am. I'm not positive which, but I'm 92 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:24,480 Speaker 1: not going to split the thirty seconds to to worry 93 00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:28,040 Speaker 1: about it. At eight forty six, the train was approaching 94 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:31,400 Speaker 1: its final destination, which was Morgate, which was the final 95 00:05:31,440 --> 00:05:42,080 Speaker 1: stops super stubby Yeah, and it includes stops yeah stops 96 00:05:42,200 --> 00:05:45,760 Speaker 1: yeah yeah, got it? Okay, yeah, super stubby line. So 97 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:50,320 Speaker 1: it's approaching its final destination, and the train should have 98 00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:54,159 Speaker 1: been reducing its speed to come into the station, to 99 00:05:54,200 --> 00:05:57,240 Speaker 1: come into that stop. At at most it should have 100 00:05:57,240 --> 00:06:00,839 Speaker 1: been traveling at fifteen miles per hour it translates to 101 00:06:01,279 --> 00:06:05,479 Speaker 1: four kilometers per hour, but instead it was going and 102 00:06:05,720 --> 00:06:10,359 Speaker 1: estimated thirty to forty miles per hour, which translates to 103 00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:13,800 Speaker 1: forty eight to sixty four kilometers an hour, so it 104 00:06:13,880 --> 00:06:19,520 Speaker 1: was full more than double. It's a it's maximum allowable speed. 105 00:06:19,560 --> 00:06:21,680 Speaker 1: I wonder what people on the platform we're doing. I mean, 106 00:06:21,680 --> 00:06:23,440 Speaker 1: I know that I'd be running for the exit, but 107 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:26,000 Speaker 1: I wonder if people just stood there. And it sounds 108 00:06:26,040 --> 00:06:27,960 Speaker 1: like a bunch of people stood there and watched it 109 00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:32,279 Speaker 1: because it happened so fast, just happened too quickly to 110 00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:36,120 Speaker 1: have much time to react. And so what happens is 111 00:06:36,120 --> 00:06:39,400 Speaker 1: that the stop the tunnel for the train doesn't end 112 00:06:39,440 --> 00:06:42,760 Speaker 1: at the end of the platform. It continued on another 113 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:46,880 Speaker 1: sixty six feet, which is twenty so there's twenty more 114 00:06:46,920 --> 00:06:50,040 Speaker 1: of tunnel. And that tunnel had things in it that 115 00:06:50,120 --> 00:06:55,400 Speaker 1: were meant to stop a runaway train. Well, yeah, that's 116 00:06:55,480 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 1: it wasn't meant for something this fast. But it had 117 00:06:57,600 --> 00:07:01,440 Speaker 1: what's called the sand drag, and then it also had 118 00:07:01,800 --> 00:07:05,960 Speaker 1: a hydraulic buffer. So sand drag literally is just sand 119 00:07:06,279 --> 00:07:09,160 Speaker 1: piled on the rails, in this instance two feet deep, 120 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:13,720 Speaker 1: and then the ram. It's basically you've seen this at 121 00:07:13,760 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 1: the end of on TV, probably the end of the line. 122 00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:19,840 Speaker 1: There's a block or a metal frame with a ram 123 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:23,160 Speaker 1: or hydraulic arm that is meant to absorb the speed 124 00:07:23,160 --> 00:07:27,640 Speaker 1: of the train horizontally to stop it without making a 125 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:31,920 Speaker 1: major crash. Well, two problems, as we already identified. First off, 126 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:34,400 Speaker 1: the train is going way too fast and it blew 127 00:07:34,600 --> 00:07:38,280 Speaker 1: through the drag. And the second problem was that the 128 00:07:38,360 --> 00:07:43,640 Speaker 1: hydrafl buffer wasn't working. It was actually broken, So the 129 00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 1: only thing that probably helped slow the train down was 130 00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:49,680 Speaker 1: colliding with the thing and ripping it out of the ground. Yeah. Yeah, 131 00:07:49,680 --> 00:07:51,600 Speaker 1: they probably should have stepped with the other kind of 132 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:53,960 Speaker 1: hydraulic popper, which is just all those fifty five yell 133 00:07:54,000 --> 00:07:56,320 Speaker 1: and dromes filled with water, like having the freeways here 134 00:07:56,360 --> 00:07:59,880 Speaker 1: in the States, right, Yeah, that can't break down too easy. Yeah, no, 135 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:03,160 Speaker 1: oh no, it so so it was bad. I mean really, 136 00:08:03,200 --> 00:08:06,720 Speaker 1: it tore through there, and obviously it hit the end 137 00:08:06,960 --> 00:08:10,040 Speaker 1: of the tunnel because the tunnel did end after that 138 00:08:10,160 --> 00:08:14,920 Speaker 1: hydraulic ram. To make things worse though, is that if 139 00:08:14,920 --> 00:08:17,920 Speaker 1: you think about the tube, it's in a tunnel, and 140 00:08:17,960 --> 00:08:21,040 Speaker 1: that tunnel is designed to only be a little bit 141 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:25,520 Speaker 1: wider all the way around than the trains themselves, which 142 00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:29,840 Speaker 1: if I remember right, I think the tunnel is supposed 143 00:08:29,840 --> 00:08:34,760 Speaker 1: to be about ten feet in diameter, and I which 144 00:08:34,960 --> 00:08:39,120 Speaker 1: is roughly three ms. It's a little less than three meters. Well, 145 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:43,240 Speaker 1: the problem was this particular piece of line was designed 146 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:46,440 Speaker 1: to actually haul cargo cars, so it had they had 147 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:49,559 Speaker 1: to be bigger, so it was actually thirteen feet wide 148 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:55,280 Speaker 1: and sixteen feet tall. That's not great. So the danger 149 00:08:55,320 --> 00:08:57,480 Speaker 1: in that is that this train that comes blowing through 150 00:08:57,760 --> 00:09:00,360 Speaker 1: and should have just hit the end of the tunnel 151 00:09:00,440 --> 00:09:05,400 Speaker 1: and compressed entirely horizontally, is now allowed to jump off 152 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:08,880 Speaker 1: of the tracks, hit the ceiling, hit the walls, ping 153 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:11,440 Speaker 1: pong all around, and bend in a whole bunch of 154 00:09:11,440 --> 00:09:16,079 Speaker 1: places and therefore collapse not only horizontally, but bend vertically. 155 00:09:16,240 --> 00:09:19,880 Speaker 1: And it did. The lead car was bent in three 156 00:09:20,040 --> 00:09:22,200 Speaker 1: or in two places, so it was a total of 157 00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:26,760 Speaker 1: three or something. Yeah, it was more of you almost, Yeah, 158 00:09:26,800 --> 00:09:29,200 Speaker 1: it was. It was really crazy the way the thing 159 00:09:29,400 --> 00:09:32,840 Speaker 1: just I mean it, it did not was not designed 160 00:09:33,000 --> 00:09:35,679 Speaker 1: to take that kind of impact, and it showed based 161 00:09:35,720 --> 00:09:38,880 Speaker 1: on that tunnel. Although actually having a slightly wider tunnel 162 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:42,160 Speaker 1: was beneficial because it allowed us like rescue workers to 163 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:45,280 Speaker 1: squeeze between the train and the tunnel and forward that 164 00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:48,760 Speaker 1: was only benefit that helped a little bit, a little bit. 165 00:09:48,960 --> 00:09:53,760 Speaker 1: I mean, standard tube widths are they're you know, small, right, 166 00:09:53,800 --> 00:09:56,240 Speaker 1: so it's a it's a tight fit, but they are 167 00:09:56,320 --> 00:10:00,480 Speaker 1: designed to be able to vacate people through them. I mean, 168 00:10:00,520 --> 00:10:02,720 Speaker 1: most of them are. I don't know about the London Underground, 169 00:10:02,720 --> 00:10:04,839 Speaker 1: I haven't been in that one in a long time, 170 00:10:05,280 --> 00:10:07,840 Speaker 1: but at least the ones like in Chicago and New York, 171 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:10,440 Speaker 1: like you have to have a way for passengers to 172 00:10:10,600 --> 00:10:14,000 Speaker 1: exit the train and evacuate on either side, so there's 173 00:10:14,120 --> 00:10:16,600 Speaker 1: you know, it's not wide, but it's a couple of feet. 174 00:10:16,960 --> 00:10:18,880 Speaker 1: But in this case, you know when when when the 175 00:10:18,880 --> 00:10:25,120 Speaker 1: trains hit, they sort of like crump. So that's where 176 00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:27,839 Speaker 1: the problem. If it was a properly sized tube that 177 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:29,440 Speaker 1: would have it would have been a ten point two. 178 00:10:29,559 --> 00:10:32,800 Speaker 1: It would have sealed a shut probably yeah yeah, well yeah, 179 00:10:33,240 --> 00:10:35,559 Speaker 1: close to it anyway, yeah yeah yeah. If you look 180 00:10:35,559 --> 00:10:38,000 Speaker 1: at this particular train, and we'll talk about this later, 181 00:10:38,080 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 1: is part of what's known as the Stock and nineteen 182 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:44,600 Speaker 1: and most of the tube trains, they have a curved 183 00:10:44,600 --> 00:10:47,480 Speaker 1: domey rough to them, but then at some point the 184 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:51,560 Speaker 1: sides of the car end up just running vertically up 185 00:10:51,600 --> 00:10:53,880 Speaker 1: and down, because you've gotta have that flat edge, and 186 00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:57,439 Speaker 1: that's the space that would allow people to somewhat make 187 00:10:57,480 --> 00:10:59,520 Speaker 1: their way through, though not easily. They could get their 188 00:10:59,520 --> 00:11:03,280 Speaker 1: way through. As to what you're referring to, So, as 189 00:11:03,360 --> 00:11:09,840 Speaker 1: I always say, not surprisingly, a massive emergency crew was assembled, 190 00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:12,720 Speaker 1: a massive rescue operation. What I want to know isn't 191 00:11:13,120 --> 00:11:15,959 Speaker 1: you probably don't know this, but how big a boom 192 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:19,520 Speaker 1: and how far away wasn't heard? I do not know that, 193 00:11:19,600 --> 00:11:23,280 Speaker 1: to be honest with you. It probably did, but I 194 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:25,320 Speaker 1: don't know how far it would have traveled, actually, because 195 00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:27,480 Speaker 1: if you think about it, it's a lot of brick 196 00:11:27,559 --> 00:11:30,280 Speaker 1: and concrete. But it's also in a tunnel system that 197 00:11:30,360 --> 00:11:34,160 Speaker 1: has other trains making their own noise, and as you know, 198 00:11:34,360 --> 00:11:37,480 Speaker 1: certain noises will help cancel each other out. So I 199 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:42,640 Speaker 1: don't know, I have no idea. But still, boom, Yeah 200 00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:44,160 Speaker 1: it was. It was a hell of a boom. But 201 00:11:44,720 --> 00:11:48,319 Speaker 1: rescue workers they show up, they find that the station 202 00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:53,839 Speaker 1: is dark, it's it's smokey and dusty, and they had 203 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:56,480 Speaker 1: to work to get the people out. Now, what happens 204 00:11:56,520 --> 00:12:01,760 Speaker 1: here is that the train goes into that an extra 205 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:03,760 Speaker 1: bit of tunnel, but the last three cars are still 206 00:12:03,840 --> 00:12:06,679 Speaker 1: at the platform, so the people in those cars they 207 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:10,400 Speaker 1: can open the doors and they can get out, lucky them. 208 00:12:10,440 --> 00:12:12,959 Speaker 1: But for everybody in the front three cars, it wasn't 209 00:12:12,960 --> 00:12:16,600 Speaker 1: as good. And the rescue workers had to go down 210 00:12:16,640 --> 00:12:18,480 Speaker 1: that side of the tunnel on the left and the 211 00:12:18,559 --> 00:12:21,240 Speaker 1: right as you were talking about Devon, and they literally 212 00:12:21,280 --> 00:12:25,040 Speaker 1: had to cut the cars open because the doors were 213 00:12:25,160 --> 00:12:30,400 Speaker 1: just completely few shut in the compression process. I'm assuming 214 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:33,760 Speaker 1: that they were using saws and not torches when they 215 00:12:33,800 --> 00:12:35,800 Speaker 1: were cutting these people out, but I don't know that 216 00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:40,440 Speaker 1: for sure. They might have the temperature, and there a 217 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:45,200 Speaker 1: lot they did because the temperature the fire brigade, I 218 00:12:45,240 --> 00:12:47,600 Speaker 1: can't think of who it was that that one of 219 00:12:47,600 --> 00:12:50,040 Speaker 1: the responders. I read a whole bunch of stuff on 220 00:12:50,080 --> 00:12:52,360 Speaker 1: their site, but they talked about, you know, they show 221 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:56,000 Speaker 1: up in full fire garb, and then they're quickly stripping 222 00:12:56,080 --> 00:13:00,199 Speaker 1: down to basically just T shirts and their pants if 223 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:05,080 Speaker 1: they can. Because the temperatures rose quite quickly to nine 224 00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:10,640 Speaker 1: to a hundred and twenty degrees fahrenheit or converting that, 225 00:13:10,640 --> 00:13:15,120 Speaker 1: that's thirty two degrees celsius. So it's freaking hot. Because 226 00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:17,520 Speaker 1: I just sort of engineers mind, I was sort of 227 00:13:17,559 --> 00:13:20,520 Speaker 1: thinking about the logistics of that situation. I'm thinking that 228 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:25,280 Speaker 1: now I bet they have like some gigantic fans that 229 00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:31,040 Speaker 1: they can break. Wouldn't be for this and something that's magnitude. 230 00:13:31,559 --> 00:13:34,199 Speaker 1: They're probably probably about some gigantic fans to make sure 231 00:13:34,240 --> 00:13:36,719 Speaker 1: this doesn't happen again. Though, Oh my god, it must 232 00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:38,800 Speaker 1: have been uncomfortable down there. This has the heat. I mean, 233 00:13:38,840 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 1: just imagine breathing all that smoke and dust and you know, 234 00:13:41,960 --> 00:13:44,720 Speaker 1: dead bodies and yeah, no, I can't imagine that it 235 00:13:44,840 --> 00:13:47,400 Speaker 1: was good. Now, as we said, you know, they got 236 00:13:47,400 --> 00:13:49,280 Speaker 1: to cut these cars open because they've compressed in. The 237 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:53,480 Speaker 1: doors are all squished shut and sealed. To give you 238 00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:55,679 Speaker 1: a little bit of context, because I've said this a 239 00:13:55,679 --> 00:13:59,480 Speaker 1: couple of times, everything was compressed shut. For context, each 240 00:13:59,480 --> 00:14:02,760 Speaker 1: of the car ours that went into that tunnel was 241 00:14:03,200 --> 00:14:07,240 Speaker 1: they were fifty two ft long. That tunnel was sixty 242 00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:10,400 Speaker 1: six ft long. There was two and a half cars 243 00:14:10,720 --> 00:14:13,360 Speaker 1: crammed into that sixty six ft of tunnel, which means 244 00:14:13,520 --> 00:14:16,600 Speaker 1: take two popkins and just empty popkins and squeeze them 245 00:14:16,600 --> 00:14:18,800 Speaker 1: down to the length of one. And I don't give 246 00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:21,560 Speaker 1: you a really good idea of how much damage that does. 247 00:14:22,400 --> 00:14:30,680 Speaker 1: It's it's pretty phenomenal. Indeed, luckily I wasn't around. Not surprisingly, 248 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:34,880 Speaker 1: not everybody survived the accident. There were a total of 249 00:14:34,920 --> 00:14:38,680 Speaker 1: three hundred people on the train. Of those three hundred, 250 00:14:38,920 --> 00:14:42,600 Speaker 1: forty two people died on the scene, and I see 251 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:46,240 Speaker 1: conflicting accounts that it's either one or two people died 252 00:14:46,440 --> 00:14:49,640 Speaker 1: after the fact from the injuries that they sustained. A 253 00:14:49,640 --> 00:14:54,160 Speaker 1: total of seventy four additional people were treated four injuries 254 00:14:54,160 --> 00:14:57,280 Speaker 1: that they got, So that's that's over a hundred, still 255 00:14:57,280 --> 00:15:00,480 Speaker 1: over a third of the passenger. But somehow like hundred 256 00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:06,760 Speaker 1: and a hundred eighty people walked away with like minor injury. 257 00:15:06,960 --> 00:15:10,040 Speaker 1: So for a crash of this magnitude, that's pretty incredible. 258 00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:13,440 Speaker 1: The people in the first two cars were the majority 259 00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:16,200 Speaker 1: of the death. It's so the people in the back 260 00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:19,640 Speaker 1: back couple of cars. They got tossed around, but they 261 00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:22,440 Speaker 1: were in almost no damage of dying, and they fell 262 00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:25,520 Speaker 1: the wrong way. Crazy. I wonder if there's a major 263 00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:27,600 Speaker 1: trend after that for people to ride in the back 264 00:15:29,320 --> 00:15:32,040 Speaker 1: I you know, I don't know, that's a that's a 265 00:15:32,080 --> 00:15:35,760 Speaker 1: good question. I have no idea. Would in the first 266 00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:38,960 Speaker 1: I think it's in the first eighteen hours all of 267 00:15:39,560 --> 00:15:44,280 Speaker 1: the injured passengers got off the train. The final body 268 00:15:44,640 --> 00:15:47,920 Speaker 1: wasn't removed from the train though, for four days total. 269 00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:50,360 Speaker 1: But do we know how long it took, on average 270 00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:52,760 Speaker 1: for them to remove the rest of the dead bodies. 271 00:15:52,960 --> 00:15:55,240 Speaker 1: We don't. We don't know how long it took to 272 00:15:55,280 --> 00:15:57,640 Speaker 1: remove those those other dead bodies, which I know where 273 00:15:57,640 --> 00:15:59,560 Speaker 1: you're going for labor stuff. We don't. We don't know 274 00:16:00,040 --> 00:16:02,320 Speaker 1: how thought it was like they got almost everybody out 275 00:16:02,360 --> 00:16:05,080 Speaker 1: in the first twenty four hours too. I believe it 276 00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:08,960 Speaker 1: was all of the people who were injured and a 277 00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:11,680 Speaker 1: majority of the casualties. But I have a feeling the 278 00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:14,280 Speaker 1: people that were in the very first car were the 279 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:18,120 Speaker 1: hardest to get because of the way it compressed and bent. Yeah, 280 00:16:18,160 --> 00:16:21,320 Speaker 1: well it took him four days to get Yeah. They 281 00:16:21,400 --> 00:16:24,600 Speaker 1: The last body that they get out is the driver 282 00:16:24,760 --> 00:16:27,880 Speaker 1: of the train, the motor min as they're referred to, 283 00:16:28,560 --> 00:16:33,440 Speaker 1: and the particularly driver. His name was Leslie newsoen He 284 00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:36,120 Speaker 1: and he was a fifty six year old guy. He'd 285 00:16:36,160 --> 00:16:39,480 Speaker 1: been working for the two for about six years at 286 00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:43,040 Speaker 1: that point. He six or seven years though for the 287 00:16:43,080 --> 00:16:46,400 Speaker 1: first until the last year of his life. He'd been 288 00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:49,200 Speaker 1: working as a guard, because you gotta remember, somebody's got 289 00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:51,560 Speaker 1: to walk through and help with the doors and keep 290 00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:55,080 Speaker 1: an eye on the passengers so no bad stuff happens. 291 00:16:55,080 --> 00:16:56,680 Speaker 1: And that's what the guard is for, and that's what 292 00:16:56,760 --> 00:16:58,880 Speaker 1: he did. But we do presume that the guard is 293 00:16:58,920 --> 00:17:03,400 Speaker 1: at least, you know, peripherally trained in do not operation. 294 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:07,120 Speaker 1: That is not the case, not even at all. RED 295 00:17:07,119 --> 00:17:10,960 Speaker 1: guards is supposed to be trained. And how the trains function. Well, 296 00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:13,480 Speaker 1: I understood that they were training in the basic functions, 297 00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:16,760 Speaker 1: but they had to actually go through training to drive 298 00:17:16,920 --> 00:17:18,960 Speaker 1: a train. They might be able to operate. That's why 299 00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:23,720 Speaker 1: I said it's peripherally educated. Okay, yeah, but they understand 300 00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:26,480 Speaker 1: things like especially how the brake systems were. You wouldn't 301 00:17:26,520 --> 00:17:29,639 Speaker 1: need to know how like all that stuff. Okay, I 302 00:17:29,920 --> 00:17:33,359 Speaker 1: guess I was taking that into larger context the Okay, 303 00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:36,600 Speaker 1: now I got you vaguely understand how the thing works. Yes, yes, 304 00:17:37,080 --> 00:17:39,200 Speaker 1: so that if an emergency happened, they could take over, 305 00:17:39,600 --> 00:17:41,680 Speaker 1: like pull the brake handle. Yeah. And actually, I gotta 306 00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:44,680 Speaker 1: tell you, I have seen video of people driving the trains, 307 00:17:44,680 --> 00:17:46,560 Speaker 1: and actually I think I could do it. It's not 308 00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:50,400 Speaker 1: a complex machine to operate, and I will say that. 309 00:17:51,880 --> 00:17:53,479 Speaker 1: I was about to say, I don't believe it's an 310 00:17:53,520 --> 00:17:56,639 Speaker 1: easy machine to operate, but I don't believe it's complex. 311 00:17:56,640 --> 00:17:58,840 Speaker 1: And well I know that, I know that. Right now, 312 00:17:58,880 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 1: there's there's some too operated that's listening to this and 313 00:18:01,600 --> 00:18:03,880 Speaker 1: he's fuming, and I just want to say, dude, i'd 314 00:18:03,880 --> 00:18:06,240 Speaker 1: realize your job was harder than it looks. But set 315 00:18:06,320 --> 00:18:10,679 Speaker 1: us an email. Anyway, Yeah, where were we Well, what 316 00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:12,520 Speaker 1: we were gonna say is we were talking about Leslie 317 00:18:12,560 --> 00:18:15,879 Speaker 1: Newsoon did go les I don't know that, to be honest. 318 00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:18,680 Speaker 1: I thought I've seen it online, people calling him last 319 00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:20,480 Speaker 1: but I was just gonna use his last name to 320 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:23,600 Speaker 1: be safe, right, let's just go Okay. So, by all accounts, 321 00:18:23,680 --> 00:18:26,160 Speaker 1: Newsome was a good driver, and he took his job seriously. 322 00:18:26,280 --> 00:18:28,800 Speaker 1: Like I said, he'd only been driving trains for the 323 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:33,800 Speaker 1: past year, and he according to his his wife and children, 324 00:18:34,119 --> 00:18:36,960 Speaker 1: he wasn't a drinker and when he had a drink drink, 325 00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:38,960 Speaker 1: which was very rare, it was only on holidays and 326 00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:42,840 Speaker 1: he might have one or two brown ales. He only 327 00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:46,119 Speaker 1: called out of work for a total of two days 328 00:18:46,320 --> 00:18:48,520 Speaker 1: in the fire. The six or seven years he worked 329 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:50,879 Speaker 1: for the tube, So that's a good record. And his 330 00:18:50,960 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: coworkers said that he didn't really have many friends, but 331 00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:57,280 Speaker 1: generally he was a very cautious driver. He was known 332 00:18:57,320 --> 00:19:01,520 Speaker 1: to the typical process, and this is a very general statement, 333 00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:04,720 Speaker 1: so please understand that was there was a point where 334 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:07,639 Speaker 1: you should start to begin breaking to get to a 335 00:19:07,640 --> 00:19:10,679 Speaker 1: minimum speed and then stop at the platform. He was 336 00:19:10,800 --> 00:19:15,640 Speaker 1: known for just shutting off the engines before that minimum 337 00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 1: distance and letting the train coast almost entirely, and so 338 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:22,520 Speaker 1: he barely had to use the brakes at all. So 339 00:19:22,560 --> 00:19:25,160 Speaker 1: it seems like a nice smooth ride, yes, which I've 340 00:19:25,160 --> 00:19:28,080 Speaker 1: been on some trains that weren't so so I appreciate 341 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:30,760 Speaker 1: and that might that might have been him. I mean, 342 00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:33,479 Speaker 1: I we'll talk about this a little later. But they 343 00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:35,399 Speaker 1: were also maintenance issues on the train. He might have 344 00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:36,760 Speaker 1: been one of these guys that didn't want to put 345 00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 1: any stress on this brake because he thought, well, I 346 00:19:38,680 --> 00:19:41,640 Speaker 1: might need those something. That is something he was known 347 00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:45,480 Speaker 1: for keeping a logbook of maintenance issues, and so that 348 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:47,720 Speaker 1: is one thing that was found on in his belongings. 349 00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:52,960 Speaker 1: Trains had some maintenance issues. So overall, though the description 350 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:57,520 Speaker 1: that we just gave of Nussen does not jive with 351 00:19:57,800 --> 00:20:03,160 Speaker 1: what the official investigation and found and decided because they 352 00:20:03,240 --> 00:20:08,200 Speaker 1: say that the entire incident was due to operator error. Um. 353 00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:11,480 Speaker 1: When you look at the you guys looked through the 354 00:20:11,480 --> 00:20:14,600 Speaker 1: the accident report, it's quite long, although the map at 355 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:18,399 Speaker 1: the end was really really useful. But according to the 356 00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:21,879 Speaker 1: witnesses who were at the station, Newson was standing up 357 00:20:21,920 --> 00:20:26,000 Speaker 1: and staring straight ahead as the train passed through the 358 00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:30,600 Speaker 1: station with his hand in the full throttle position. Are 359 00:20:30,600 --> 00:20:33,439 Speaker 1: you gonna at some point, I presume we'll talk about 360 00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:38,760 Speaker 1: how these trains are operated, how somebody could say it 361 00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:41,240 Speaker 1: was in the full throttle, probably in much more detail 362 00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 1: than some people really want, because that's the way I 363 00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:47,240 Speaker 1: am with these mechanical bits and pieces. Okay, but we'll 364 00:20:47,280 --> 00:20:49,880 Speaker 1: pause on that until you get there, okay, because well 365 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:51,960 Speaker 1: we'll hold off. This is still kind of the general stuff. 366 00:20:52,960 --> 00:20:55,399 Speaker 1: Uh So, like I said this, the witnesses said that 367 00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:57,840 Speaker 1: they saw him going through the station with his hands 368 00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:01,919 Speaker 1: in the full throttle position. Ordering to the official investigation, 369 00:21:02,480 --> 00:21:06,440 Speaker 1: they they felt like this witness statement was true because 370 00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:10,240 Speaker 1: they say that when his body was removed from the train, 371 00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:14,240 Speaker 1: it appeared that his hands prior to the impact must 372 00:21:14,280 --> 00:21:17,560 Speaker 1: have been in that position. And they also X rayed 373 00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:22,320 Speaker 1: his arms in his hands because, according to the official investigation, 374 00:21:22,680 --> 00:21:26,680 Speaker 1: what they expected to see was that his bones would 375 00:21:26,680 --> 00:21:29,719 Speaker 1: have been broken in a recognizable manner of a person 376 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:32,960 Speaker 1: realizing they're going to run into something doing that defensive 377 00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:35,520 Speaker 1: gesture where you put you cross your arms and put 378 00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:37,600 Speaker 1: them in front of your head. We've all seen this 379 00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:41,800 Speaker 1: on TV and movies. That's what they expected. And because 380 00:21:41,880 --> 00:21:45,359 Speaker 1: the breaks in his arms and hands weren't consistent with 381 00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:47,720 Speaker 1: that position, they said, yeah, I know, his hands must 382 00:21:47,800 --> 00:21:51,879 Speaker 1: have been on the controls. They can't say where the 383 00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:54,639 Speaker 1: controls were, but they say his hands had to have 384 00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:58,640 Speaker 1: been on the actual control that well even I mean, 385 00:21:58,680 --> 00:22:00,600 Speaker 1: but even if they were, they can't say, oh, he 386 00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:04,080 Speaker 1: was frantically trying to break or he was accelerating full throttle. 387 00:22:04,280 --> 00:22:07,000 Speaker 1: All they can say is they were probably in the 388 00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:12,560 Speaker 1: same area where the controls were. Yep, that's absolutely right. 389 00:22:13,119 --> 00:22:16,880 Speaker 1: And and to be honest, the um so the statement 390 00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:20,760 Speaker 1: that of his hands where his hands were is a 391 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:26,719 Speaker 1: bit dodgy to me because drivers typically would operate the train, 392 00:22:27,040 --> 00:22:30,119 Speaker 1: most of them would operate the train without the cab 393 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:32,800 Speaker 1: light on, so it didn't create glare and stuff like 394 00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:35,160 Speaker 1: that so they can see a head well when coming 395 00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:37,760 Speaker 1: into the station. The inquest did a bunch of tests 396 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:40,080 Speaker 1: and they had drivers with light onto, the light off, 397 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:44,080 Speaker 1: with a height off. You can see the general silhouette 398 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:48,879 Speaker 1: of the person, but you can't actually discern what position 399 00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:52,480 Speaker 1: their hands are in. In other words, full power off, 400 00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:55,240 Speaker 1: pulling the brake, not pulling the brake. You can just 401 00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:58,680 Speaker 1: kind of generally see their silhouette. So I would see 402 00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:01,360 Speaker 1: it because I'd be running away. Well. Witness reports are 403 00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:03,879 Speaker 1: often like really hold like having not in the not 404 00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:07,640 Speaker 1: too long ago future, tried to give a witness testimony, 405 00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:10,600 Speaker 1: as you know whatever from something that I thought I 406 00:23:10,600 --> 00:23:13,760 Speaker 1: saw very clearly, and then realizing I actually have no 407 00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:17,240 Speaker 1: idea if what I'm saying is accurate or not, like 408 00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:20,480 Speaker 1: it's I mean, and that is the reason why I 409 00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:26,160 Speaker 1: am inclined to disregard the statement of the witness named 410 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:33,000 Speaker 1: I A. But I kid you not that is his name. Yes, 411 00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:37,479 Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure it's pronounced in this country, but an 412 00:23:37,560 --> 00:23:43,880 Speaker 1: unfortunate name. So this was a horrible, horrible incident. I mean, 413 00:23:44,119 --> 00:23:46,520 Speaker 1: like we said, a lot of people lost their lives, 414 00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:50,680 Speaker 1: a lot of injuries, but The good things that came 415 00:23:50,720 --> 00:23:54,399 Speaker 1: out of it were two. The first of which is 416 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:57,960 Speaker 1: that the speed limits for trains that were coming to 417 00:23:58,040 --> 00:24:01,119 Speaker 1: the the not the the actual end of the line 418 00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:05,120 Speaker 1: dead ends was reduced from fifteen to ten miles per 419 00:24:05,119 --> 00:24:09,679 Speaker 1: hour to help ensure that somebody couldn't be asleep at 420 00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:12,520 Speaker 1: the wheel and driving fifteen and drive all the way through. 421 00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:16,880 Speaker 1: The Other thing that came through is that in night 422 00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:21,680 Speaker 1: the Morgate Protection System was introduced, which it was an 423 00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:25,359 Speaker 1: automated system that if after a certain point a train 424 00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:30,200 Speaker 1: wasn't below a certain speed, it automatically turned on the brakes. 425 00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:34,520 Speaker 1: So truly automated the I shouldn't say truly, but to 426 00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:38,440 Speaker 1: a large extent, automated the brakes so that if somebody's 427 00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:40,920 Speaker 1: not paying attention and they're flying through there, the train 428 00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:43,880 Speaker 1: is gonna stop. Because that's the problem with this incident 429 00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:47,560 Speaker 1: is that, according to everybody, the train never hit its brakes. 430 00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:51,840 Speaker 1: It just flew through full throttle. Here's my favorite part 431 00:24:51,920 --> 00:24:55,040 Speaker 1: about this. Wasn't it the train crash that happened in 432 00:24:55,080 --> 00:24:58,680 Speaker 1: America like two years ago where suddenly they were like, oh, 433 00:24:58,840 --> 00:25:01,640 Speaker 1: you know what we should have on our commuter rail? Yes, 434 00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:06,840 Speaker 1: safety things yeah, you should make some safety stuff because 435 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:09,480 Speaker 1: be safe and stuff. Yeah, that would help, Yeah, you 436 00:25:09,560 --> 00:25:12,600 Speaker 1: know thirty years after if nothing else, you know, maybe 437 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:14,600 Speaker 1: like like a big guy to stand be handed driver 438 00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:16,879 Speaker 1: and sort of step in when things go south and 439 00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:19,639 Speaker 1: say excuse me, just no, not excuse me, just knocking 440 00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:22,000 Speaker 1: out of the way and grab the controls. Um. I 441 00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:24,920 Speaker 1: know we're close to theories here, but just quickly, tube 442 00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:30,440 Speaker 1: drivers do they sit or stand? Stand? Stand in the stock? 443 00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:33,880 Speaker 1: I understood that they stood. I did not ever see 444 00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:38,640 Speaker 1: a seat in any of the photos of the driver's 445 00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:42,680 Speaker 1: section of the train, which suddenly the names escaped me cab, cab, 446 00:25:42,760 --> 00:25:45,760 Speaker 1: thank you. I'll work with that. So, yes, there is 447 00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:48,480 Speaker 1: not a seat that I just wanted to clarify any 448 00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:53,160 Speaker 1: other questions before we know, well, before we get into theories, 449 00:25:53,440 --> 00:26:00,000 Speaker 1: let's take a really quick break. Hi there, Joe here 450 00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:04,000 Speaker 1: from Thinking Sideways the podcast, Well, it finally happened. There's 451 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:06,919 Speaker 1: another podcast out there, and finally somebody cut into a 452 00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:10,280 Speaker 1: great idea and they're doing it too. Uh. And so 453 00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:12,600 Speaker 1: if you do have room in your life for a 454 00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:14,760 Speaker 1: second podcast, do I want to give this one a look? 455 00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:18,800 Speaker 1: Or I guess I'll listen. It's called The First Day Back, 456 00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:23,320 Speaker 1: and it's kind of intriguing sounding. The concept is how 457 00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:26,920 Speaker 1: does a person return from an event that changes them? Uh? 458 00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:29,439 Speaker 1: The news story for this new season apparently it's spent it. 459 00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,439 Speaker 1: This is the second season. It's about a woman who's 460 00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 1: just getting out of prison. She was in prison because 461 00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:38,639 Speaker 1: she accidentally shut and killed her husband. And here's the kicker, 462 00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:40,920 Speaker 1: she has no memory of it, and the show explains 463 00:26:41,040 --> 00:26:43,920 Speaker 1: what happened that night and also just everything that comes after, 464 00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:46,520 Speaker 1: like what's it like to on your first day out 465 00:26:46,520 --> 00:26:49,280 Speaker 1: of prison? How do you readjust how do you find 466 00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:53,840 Speaker 1: a job? Can you reconnect with your family? And all? 467 00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:55,679 Speaker 1: That's the easy part, of course. The hard part is 468 00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:57,240 Speaker 1: figuring out how to live with the guilt of what 469 00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:01,040 Speaker 1: she did and try to find some forgiveness herself. So 470 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:03,679 Speaker 1: that's what it's about. The bottom line is how do 471 00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:05,560 Speaker 1: you come back from the worst thing you've ever done, 472 00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:08,520 Speaker 1: especially when you don't even remember doing it. The show 473 00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:12,520 Speaker 1: is called First Day Back. It's on Stitcher and well 474 00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:18,720 Speaker 1: wherever else you'd listen to podcasts. Okay, and we're back 475 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:23,280 Speaker 1: And I'm a little upset with you, Joe, because where's 476 00:27:23,320 --> 00:27:26,760 Speaker 1: my sandwich? I've had that thing in the fridge for 477 00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:29,160 Speaker 1: a while now, and I've slowly been working my way through, 478 00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:31,240 Speaker 1: and i want to know where my footlong sandwich is 479 00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:37,920 Speaker 1: at here. Here's all you gotta do is follow your nose. Okay, Well, 480 00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:42,560 Speaker 1: let's get onto theories. Theory number one, which shouldn't be 481 00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:45,000 Speaker 1: any surprise to anybody, because this is always there in 482 00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:48,160 Speaker 1: an accident situation, he'll have to start a new life. 483 00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:51,200 Speaker 1: He faked his own death. No, actually, that's wrong kind 484 00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:53,560 Speaker 1: of mystery, wrong kind of mystery. No, this is he 485 00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:59,080 Speaker 1: was drunk, because drunk is always it. People say, well, 486 00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:01,439 Speaker 1: he had to have and drunk to have driven the 487 00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:04,280 Speaker 1: train into the end of the tunnel and and not 488 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:07,520 Speaker 1: have slowed, not applied the brakes. And one of the 489 00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:09,679 Speaker 1: things that is always referred to, and you see this 490 00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:14,000 Speaker 1: in the official inquest, is that when they tested his blood, 491 00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:18,600 Speaker 1: they found that he had eighty milligrams per one milli 492 00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:21,560 Speaker 1: leaders of alcohol in his blood, which by my math 493 00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:25,520 Speaker 1: comes out to point oh eight b a C meaning 494 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:30,960 Speaker 1: legally drunk in this country, in the US, at our 495 00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:35,240 Speaker 1: state high in different places more like four. But I 496 00:28:35,280 --> 00:28:37,240 Speaker 1: could be wrong about that. Well, and there's some things 497 00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:40,479 Speaker 1: to take into consideration here, the first of which is 498 00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:44,160 Speaker 1: that the doctor, and it's referred to strangely in a 499 00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:47,080 Speaker 1: lot of the reporting, but the doctor who took the 500 00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:50,360 Speaker 1: samples and wrote the report said that she took samples 501 00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:53,720 Speaker 1: from eight other bodies that were in the same conditions 502 00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:59,320 Speaker 1: as Nuisance, and that his blood alcohol content was double 503 00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:03,200 Speaker 1: any of the other bodies on and I'm assuming they 504 00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:05,800 Speaker 1: were bodies from that actual accident scene. You know, we've 505 00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:08,600 Speaker 1: talked about this before, but we'll do it again. Is 506 00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:15,040 Speaker 1: that the human body, when it expires, is capable of 507 00:29:15,080 --> 00:29:17,880 Speaker 1: creating alcohol, or I should probably correct that it's the 508 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:21,440 Speaker 1: bacteria that are feeding upon the human body that make 509 00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:25,640 Speaker 1: alcohol as a byproduct. And the warmer it is, the 510 00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:28,840 Speaker 1: faster they work and the faster they grow and eat, 511 00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:35,720 Speaker 1: and therefore about alcohol not alcohol, no, no, but think 512 00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:38,240 Speaker 1: about the conditions we described, which is a tunnel that 513 00:29:38,400 --> 00:29:41,720 Speaker 1: is between ninety two a hundred and twenty degree it 514 00:29:43,440 --> 00:29:45,720 Speaker 1: did it got it gets really hot in there, so 515 00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:48,640 Speaker 1: depending on so there's there's some things that we don't 516 00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:50,600 Speaker 1: we don't we don't get the answers to which is 517 00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:52,800 Speaker 1: we know that his body was in there for four days, 518 00:29:53,280 --> 00:29:56,400 Speaker 1: but we don't know how long the other bodies that 519 00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,880 Speaker 1: were sampled, we're actually in the tunnel before they were moved, 520 00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 1: and I'm presuming sent to a morgue where they were 521 00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:06,040 Speaker 1: then put into a cooler, which would have stopped a 522 00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:11,640 Speaker 1: little bacteria from continuing to generate alcohol. Yeah, he was 523 00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:16,920 Speaker 1: definitely the last out. Yea saying goes first in last out. Yeah, 524 00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:19,280 Speaker 1: that is the old saying. So let's just let's run 525 00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:21,240 Speaker 1: with the theory. Though. Yeah, there are other issues here though, 526 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:23,640 Speaker 1: I mean there are there are. So if we run 527 00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:26,000 Speaker 1: with the theory and we think about this, let's let's 528 00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,880 Speaker 1: think about, well, when could he have had his drinks 529 00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:31,600 Speaker 1: when he could have could have been drinking? Well, there's 530 00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:35,000 Speaker 1: before or on the job. Those are the two simple 531 00:30:35,040 --> 00:30:39,440 Speaker 1: answers there. If we think about on the job. The 532 00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:43,080 Speaker 1: morning of the accident, sometime between six ten and six 533 00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:46,880 Speaker 1: twenty four, which was the start of the shift, Newson 534 00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:49,160 Speaker 1: had tea with some of the other drivers, and one 535 00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:52,080 Speaker 1: of whom asked if he could borrow some milk, and 536 00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:54,400 Speaker 1: he allowed him to, and that driver said the milk 537 00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:58,320 Speaker 1: didn't taste of alcohol, so obviously he wasn't spiking his tea. 538 00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:01,840 Speaker 1: As he was driving through the day. That to me 539 00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:05,160 Speaker 1: means that he must have consumed it, probably before he 540 00:31:05,200 --> 00:31:07,560 Speaker 1: would have gotten to work, because drinking on the job 541 00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:11,560 Speaker 1: is really obvious because it's a semi open cab situation. 542 00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:13,880 Speaker 1: I'll take a little issue with that and say that, 543 00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:17,120 Speaker 1: you know, to go cups are a thing he could 544 00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:19,920 Speaker 1: have you been having a bunch of alcohol in like 545 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:23,320 Speaker 1: a styrofied flask. No, it's like a styrofoam cup that 546 00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:26,280 Speaker 1: looks like coffee or something like that. Those were Those 547 00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:29,320 Speaker 1: were very popular in those days. It is. But the 548 00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:33,120 Speaker 1: thing is is that I can't imagine nobody that nobody 549 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:36,120 Speaker 1: that he interacted with said that he a smelled of 550 00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:39,440 Speaker 1: booze or be acted weird. So it seems a little 551 00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:41,360 Speaker 1: weird that he would have done it beforehand. No, I'm 552 00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:43,880 Speaker 1: just I'm saying I'm taking issue with drinking on the job. 553 00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:45,880 Speaker 1: But the other thing I was going to say is 554 00:31:45,920 --> 00:31:50,440 Speaker 1: that the guard on the train interacted with Nussen through 555 00:31:50,680 --> 00:31:55,840 Speaker 1: the two hour or hour prior to the accident and 556 00:31:56,680 --> 00:31:59,000 Speaker 1: never saw anything. And it's not like the driver can 557 00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:02,480 Speaker 1: hold his cup least driving the train. That's true. Most 558 00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:04,880 Speaker 1: like to see a cup holder mostly just playing Devil's 559 00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:07,320 Speaker 1: after training but I will also mention that maybe the 560 00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:10,480 Speaker 1: testimony of that guard is not the most sounds. He 561 00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:12,680 Speaker 1: was an eighteen year old kid, and he wasn't really 562 00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:16,160 Speaker 1: paying attention. He's actually quite scolded in the report for 563 00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:19,920 Speaker 1: lack of diligence in his duties. Well, and he should have. 564 00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:21,840 Speaker 1: It should have been like mostly at the back of 565 00:32:21,840 --> 00:32:23,640 Speaker 1: the train anyway, so there would have been plenty of 566 00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:25,760 Speaker 1: time it would have been around the driver. But but 567 00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:28,360 Speaker 1: I also agree he probably wasn't drinking before. I mean, 568 00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:31,360 Speaker 1: the co workers. If they went so far to say, well, 569 00:32:31,360 --> 00:32:34,800 Speaker 1: the milk wasn't alcohol, they probably would have gone so 570 00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:37,560 Speaker 1: far to also say, also, he wasn't drunk when we 571 00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:40,280 Speaker 1: were hanging out with him, at least not drunk enough 572 00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:42,960 Speaker 1: to cratch a train. Should have been stumbling at six 573 00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:46,480 Speaker 1: in the morning. To have been that unaware he had to, 574 00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:50,800 Speaker 1: he would have had been super stumbly, you know, belligerently drunk, 575 00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:53,600 Speaker 1: and he did not appear to be that way though 576 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:56,280 Speaker 1: his family they did have booze in the house. There 577 00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:58,600 Speaker 1: was a reporter that went over and she looked, he 578 00:32:58,680 --> 00:33:00,440 Speaker 1: was like, where did you keep the drink cabinet? And 579 00:33:00,480 --> 00:33:03,120 Speaker 1: they looked and sure, if there's Bacardi because everybody says, well, 580 00:33:03,320 --> 00:33:05,880 Speaker 1: he must have been drinking something that didn't have a smell. 581 00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:08,840 Speaker 1: And I gotta tell you that only vodka drinkers and 582 00:33:08,920 --> 00:33:11,760 Speaker 1: sometimes gin drinkers are the ones who believe that you 583 00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:15,400 Speaker 1: can't smell that stuff. But yeah, and they're wrong, they're wrong. 584 00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:20,560 Speaker 1: Everybody else can smell that stuff. So and also adults 585 00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:24,640 Speaker 1: have Bacardi in the house, like, calm down. Yeah, I 586 00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:26,880 Speaker 1: saw that report and it was like she admitted that 587 00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:28,640 Speaker 1: it might be down a little bit in the level, 588 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:30,680 Speaker 1: but she didn't know. She didn't know. And the thing 589 00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:33,320 Speaker 1: about it is is this is like how many months 590 00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:37,200 Speaker 1: or years, nine months after the fact. Yeah, So I mean, 591 00:33:37,280 --> 00:33:38,840 Speaker 1: I gotta tell you it would have been in my 592 00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:42,160 Speaker 1: house that would have been like not down a little bit. Yeah, 593 00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:44,280 Speaker 1: it would have been gone replaced. But I was gonna say, 594 00:33:44,320 --> 00:33:46,160 Speaker 1: I'm going to be in big trouble if I ever 595 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:48,480 Speaker 1: like getting a crash and they're like, well, let's go 596 00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:52,880 Speaker 1: see your alcohol continet. You have alcohol in your house, 597 00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:55,600 Speaker 1: Oh well you must have been drunk. Like I'm I'm 598 00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:58,960 Speaker 1: out of luck at that point that if that's how 599 00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:02,720 Speaker 1: we're doing this now now to give a little bit 600 00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:05,400 Speaker 1: of credence to the he should have been drunk or 601 00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:08,840 Speaker 1: he was drunk theory. If indeed his b a c 602 00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:13,000 Speaker 1: was double the other people on the train, let's just 603 00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:16,640 Speaker 1: say the bacteria created point oh four blood alcohol content. 604 00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:20,280 Speaker 1: That means that he had to have at the time 605 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:23,920 Speaker 1: of the accident had point oh four already in his system. 606 00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:27,000 Speaker 1: So he may not have truly been belligerently blasted drunk. 607 00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:32,440 Speaker 1: But still point oh four, that's that's pretty drunk, and 608 00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:35,360 Speaker 1: you and it should have been smells, behavioral issues, and 609 00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:39,000 Speaker 1: none of that really comes up. So but also, like, 610 00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:42,759 Speaker 1: did he I mean, you know, so he did an 611 00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:45,439 Speaker 1: entire run of a train. He'd been doing runs all morning, right, 612 00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:48,440 Speaker 1: was he having a hard time hitting the stops at 613 00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:50,959 Speaker 1: all the other places? I mean, it's not as though, 614 00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:53,840 Speaker 1: especially in the less than ten minutes it takes to 615 00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:56,560 Speaker 1: do the run. We're not saying like, oh, and you 616 00:34:56,600 --> 00:34:58,920 Speaker 1: know it was weird because he was lurching into every 617 00:34:58,960 --> 00:35:01,680 Speaker 1: single stop he was missing he stops, those were pretty 618 00:35:01,719 --> 00:35:04,680 Speaker 1: hard stops to hit as well, and he made those 619 00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:07,560 Speaker 1: all fine. So what happened in the what two minutes 620 00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:10,399 Speaker 1: between the last stop and the final stuff? I mean, 621 00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:14,399 Speaker 1: I don't know, but I mean it had to have been, 622 00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:15,920 Speaker 1: but it had to have been at the beginning of there. 623 00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:18,560 Speaker 1: I mean, I've been I've been over the legal limit, 624 00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:20,360 Speaker 1: at least I think so. I've never actually blown a 625 00:35:20,719 --> 00:35:22,799 Speaker 1: breathalyzer before, but I'm sure I've been over the leg 626 00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:25,439 Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure you have to. And I have never 627 00:35:25,520 --> 00:35:31,759 Speaker 1: crashed the train. Yeah, So anecdotally, we're proving this theory bad. 628 00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:35,760 Speaker 1: This is a poor theory and and it was dismissed 629 00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:38,120 Speaker 1: by the official inquiry, though there are people who still 630 00:35:38,400 --> 00:35:41,680 Speaker 1: feel that it's correct. But we'll leave that theory behind 631 00:35:41,719 --> 00:35:43,839 Speaker 1: and we'll move to the next one. I hate this one, 632 00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:46,279 Speaker 1: I know you do, and I'm not I'm not very 633 00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:49,600 Speaker 1: keen on it though it's rather popular, which is that 634 00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:55,160 Speaker 1: Nussen was decided to commit suicide and just happened to 635 00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:59,120 Speaker 1: take forty three other poor souls along with him. He 636 00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:01,720 Speaker 1: decided to to you know, it was death by train. 637 00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:04,319 Speaker 1: He decided that was his method to go. There are 638 00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:06,840 Speaker 1: a lot of issues with this. There are the first 639 00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:09,960 Speaker 1: of which is that people say, well, he he obviously 640 00:36:10,080 --> 00:36:12,040 Speaker 1: knew what he was doing, and he did it, did 641 00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:15,160 Speaker 1: it intentionally. That's why he was seen standing upright in 642 00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:19,560 Speaker 1: the cab when he came through the station, and they say, 643 00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:21,799 Speaker 1: you know, the fact that he didn't cover his his 644 00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:25,520 Speaker 1: head with his arms shows that he was also doing 645 00:36:25,560 --> 00:36:28,239 Speaker 1: it willfully and it wasn't um, you know, it wasn't 646 00:36:28,239 --> 00:36:31,000 Speaker 1: it oh crap moment He's like, I'm doing, I'm doing. 647 00:36:31,000 --> 00:36:35,680 Speaker 1: He was just hanging on again, doing it intentionally. But 648 00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:39,399 Speaker 1: as with all suicide theories, this doesn't made up with 649 00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:42,520 Speaker 1: anybody who knows him, because as we've seen this in 650 00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:46,520 Speaker 1: a lot of stories, his family, his co workers, they 651 00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:50,360 Speaker 1: all say that he didn't have any signs of depression, 652 00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:54,080 Speaker 1: he didn't show any signs of being suicidal, nothing like 653 00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:56,880 Speaker 1: that was present. Though we have talked about the fact 654 00:36:56,880 --> 00:37:00,480 Speaker 1: that there can be that spur of the moment, hidden 655 00:37:00,840 --> 00:37:03,760 Speaker 1: hidden feelings people don't want to admit or don't see. 656 00:37:04,080 --> 00:37:06,680 Speaker 1: But the thing that I have a problem with the 657 00:37:06,680 --> 00:37:10,600 Speaker 1: whole suicide theory is that the day before Newson had 658 00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:12,640 Speaker 1: sent his wife to the bank to get three hundred 659 00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:15,520 Speaker 1: pound so that he could then go buy a car 660 00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:18,040 Speaker 1: for his daughter, and he had that money on him, 661 00:37:18,120 --> 00:37:21,000 Speaker 1: which to me indicates he's planning to go from work 662 00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:24,160 Speaker 1: to buy the car, to take the car home, which 663 00:37:24,440 --> 00:37:27,560 Speaker 1: in my estimation would not be the actions of a 664 00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:30,000 Speaker 1: man who was planning to take his own life. Actually, 665 00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:31,640 Speaker 1: it occurs to me he has a daughter who was 666 00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:33,279 Speaker 1: of the age that he was buying a car for, 667 00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:35,399 Speaker 1: so that could account for why the liquor was maybe 668 00:37:35,400 --> 00:37:41,160 Speaker 1: a little lower and originally anticipated. I mean, you know 669 00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:43,480 Speaker 1: there were teenage kids in the house. But no, I 670 00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:45,880 Speaker 1: mean I agree, it's it's that same thing. What was 671 00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:49,440 Speaker 1: the case we talked about recently with the guy who 672 00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:55,480 Speaker 1: apparently stabbed himself three times as as yeah, I mean 673 00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:58,440 Speaker 1: he and again we had that issue where he apparently 674 00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:01,920 Speaker 1: made himself a meal and and stabbed himself again. It's 675 00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:03,840 Speaker 1: it's like, wait that that there's there's a level of 676 00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:07,880 Speaker 1: drunk and get intentional that I don't think so I 677 00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:10,040 Speaker 1: I will agree. I don't know about you, Joe, but 678 00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:15,000 Speaker 1: I personally am willing very easily to discount suicide. Uh yeah, 679 00:38:15,040 --> 00:38:18,160 Speaker 1: I don't really buy it either. I could I could 680 00:38:18,200 --> 00:38:21,440 Speaker 1: picture murder. Actually. Actually, the one thing that sort of 681 00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:23,759 Speaker 1: turns in my head, and this one is like you've 682 00:38:23,800 --> 00:38:25,959 Speaker 1: seen this in the movies or TV or whatever. We're 683 00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:30,640 Speaker 1: there's a guy and for some reason, because some some 684 00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:34,760 Speaker 1: international cabal of the bio terrorists have got the goods 685 00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:38,800 Speaker 1: on him, and they he doesn't the crash the train, 686 00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:41,839 Speaker 1: or they'll kill his family or something, and so I yeah, 687 00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:43,319 Speaker 1: so I sort of I sort of went with that 688 00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:45,160 Speaker 1: theory just for fun, you know, of course, you know 689 00:38:45,239 --> 00:38:47,480 Speaker 1: we've seen in the movies, right, Well, if it happens 690 00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:51,200 Speaker 1: in the movies, it happens in real life. Yeah, so 691 00:38:51,239 --> 00:38:56,560 Speaker 1: there's that. So that would be suicide but not really voluntary. Involuntary, 692 00:38:56,600 --> 00:38:59,600 Speaker 1: so technically murdered, but I don't see any real evidence 693 00:38:59,600 --> 00:39:02,920 Speaker 1: of that. It's a nice one, juicy. Yeah, yeah, there 694 00:39:03,080 --> 00:39:05,759 Speaker 1: yours not the real theory. Um, so let's go to 695 00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:10,359 Speaker 1: our next next theory. He had a medical condition which 696 00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:15,920 Speaker 1: was the cause of the entire accident. The inquisition, they 697 00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:18,160 Speaker 1: looked into a lot of things to try and figure 698 00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:22,320 Speaker 1: out if indeed something had happened. You know, they checked 699 00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:24,640 Speaker 1: his heart to see if maybe he had suffered a 700 00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:30,120 Speaker 1: heart attack. They did tests which I'm not exactly clear on, 701 00:39:30,239 --> 00:39:32,440 Speaker 1: but they were trying to figure out if he had 702 00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:36,200 Speaker 1: had a seizure of some kind that would have locked 703 00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:39,920 Speaker 1: up his muscles so that he couldn't release the controls 704 00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:43,040 Speaker 1: of the train. Those are hard to nothing was found 705 00:39:43,080 --> 00:39:45,360 Speaker 1: from it, well, yeah, especially because I mean I I 706 00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:48,040 Speaker 1: presume that his body took a fair amount of damage 707 00:39:48,120 --> 00:39:53,320 Speaker 1: in the crash, so it would be hard to massive 708 00:39:53,320 --> 00:39:56,239 Speaker 1: trauma to the head massive He would be really hard 709 00:39:56,280 --> 00:39:58,640 Speaker 1: to kind of diagnose any of those things. After the field, 710 00:39:59,600 --> 00:40:01,319 Speaker 1: I think the just about everything would have been kind 711 00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:06,839 Speaker 1: of exploded. They did examine his body to see if 712 00:40:07,200 --> 00:40:10,560 Speaker 1: he had been electrocuted, because the trains, they're electric trains, 713 00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:14,400 Speaker 1: and there was the possibility that a current could have 714 00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:17,400 Speaker 1: for some reason gone through the metal controls that he 715 00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:19,759 Speaker 1: was holding, would have gone through his body and then 716 00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:22,279 Speaker 1: through his feet back into the metal decking. That would 717 00:40:22,280 --> 00:40:25,360 Speaker 1: have been the current. Him standing in the same spot 718 00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:28,759 Speaker 1: and keeping his grip, Yeah, because he's being being shocked 719 00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:31,160 Speaker 1: and therefore all of his muscles are contracted and he 720 00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:34,520 Speaker 1: cannot physically let go. That probably would have left some marks, 721 00:40:34,560 --> 00:40:37,959 Speaker 1: though there were none, so definitely couldn't have been that. 722 00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:42,160 Speaker 1: So I don't believe that that was it. UM. I 723 00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:46,480 Speaker 1: have a couple of medical theories. Okay, Yeah, One thing is, 724 00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:49,200 Speaker 1: you know, fifty three is not that old, but um 725 00:40:49,480 --> 00:40:53,480 Speaker 1: early signs of dementia can't account for UM kind of 726 00:40:53,560 --> 00:40:56,600 Speaker 1: black out locked in syndrome. I kind of looked into 727 00:40:56,640 --> 00:41:00,160 Speaker 1: that and it seems like there should have been a 728 00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:03,880 Speaker 1: lot more symptoms. Well, it's hard. Early signs of dementias 729 00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,920 Speaker 1: particularly are really hard because there are things like you 730 00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:09,840 Speaker 1: are a little more forgetful than you usually are, or 731 00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:13,040 Speaker 1: you have blackouts or you know, blah blah blah, and 732 00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:14,840 Speaker 1: these are all things that you have to self report, 733 00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:17,880 Speaker 1: and especially you know British stiff upper lip. You know, 734 00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:20,160 Speaker 1: at fifty six, it's likely if it was just starting 735 00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:22,120 Speaker 1: to happen, that he would have not even mentioned it, 736 00:41:22,200 --> 00:41:25,400 Speaker 1: or even his wife would have said, it's funny you 737 00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:27,880 Speaker 1: you keep leaving your keys all around, you know, and 738 00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:30,120 Speaker 1: you keep asking me where they are, and they're sitting 739 00:41:30,200 --> 00:41:31,960 Speaker 1: right there. What's you know, what's going on? Oh, it's 740 00:41:32,080 --> 00:41:34,759 Speaker 1: you know, just getting older. It's it's normal aging. And 741 00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:36,960 Speaker 1: I mean that's one thing that could account for it, 742 00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:40,279 Speaker 1: because you you can suffer these like really just blackouts 743 00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:42,759 Speaker 1: basically where your brain just stops functioning but your body 744 00:41:42,800 --> 00:41:48,960 Speaker 1: is still functioning. I So my my one problem with that, well, 745 00:41:49,280 --> 00:41:55,040 Speaker 1: it's it's a very popular reason today. It's it's it's 746 00:41:55,040 --> 00:41:59,719 Speaker 1: the Darling diagnosis. It's it's the diagnosis. Well, no, just 747 00:41:59,719 --> 00:42:04,239 Speaker 1: just for things today, for in our current i'd say 748 00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:06,360 Speaker 1: last decade, it's like, oh, well, I bet you was 749 00:42:06,360 --> 00:42:10,120 Speaker 1: early onset dimension dimension. I feel like I see that 750 00:42:10,239 --> 00:42:13,400 Speaker 1: a lot in stories more than I used to. I 751 00:42:13,400 --> 00:42:16,160 Speaker 1: think they're just getting better at diagnosing it, because I mean, again, 752 00:42:16,160 --> 00:42:18,439 Speaker 1: it's one of those things where, you know, fifty years 753 00:42:18,440 --> 00:42:21,120 Speaker 1: ago people were like, I don't know that he's forgetful, 754 00:42:21,520 --> 00:42:23,560 Speaker 1: but there are there are things that do tend to 755 00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:28,640 Speaker 1: get kind of over diagnosed. Absolutely, but I mean that 756 00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:30,560 Speaker 1: would have been one. And then he also could have, 757 00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:32,759 Speaker 1: you know, had that he could have just had a 758 00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:34,600 Speaker 1: little bit of a seizure or a stroke or something 759 00:42:34,640 --> 00:42:37,520 Speaker 1: like that, and that would be really hard. That would 760 00:42:37,560 --> 00:42:39,920 Speaker 1: be hard, especially for the kind of damage that his 761 00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:44,840 Speaker 1: body took. To figure out post mortem, it would be um. 762 00:42:45,040 --> 00:42:48,520 Speaker 1: It was suggested that along the this kind of I 763 00:42:48,560 --> 00:42:52,799 Speaker 1: know dovetails into the dementia is that it was suggested 764 00:42:52,840 --> 00:42:58,000 Speaker 1: that maybe he was just kind of daydreaming and not Yeah, 765 00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:01,719 Speaker 1: I kind of got hypnotized and that's what caused it. 766 00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:05,120 Speaker 1: Except one thing to keep in mind is that it's 767 00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:08,480 Speaker 1: two sets of rails that go north south, so one 768 00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:10,839 Speaker 1: is the south line, one is the north line, and 769 00:43:11,120 --> 00:43:14,520 Speaker 1: they cross each other just before the platform, and where 770 00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:18,720 Speaker 1: that X happens, there is a notable jump or jolt 771 00:43:18,840 --> 00:43:20,840 Speaker 1: to the train. It's it's a bump, it's you know. 772 00:43:20,920 --> 00:43:24,239 Speaker 1: So that and the noise of the platform, everybody says 773 00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:27,560 Speaker 1: should have been enough that if the motor min was 774 00:43:27,920 --> 00:43:32,600 Speaker 1: literally just gathering wool, he should have come to his 775 00:43:32,719 --> 00:43:36,360 Speaker 1: senses quite quickly based on that alone, and that should 776 00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:38,879 Speaker 1: have jolted him. I guess this is I'm just doing 777 00:43:38,880 --> 00:43:41,560 Speaker 1: the Devil's advocate thing for this one. But haven't you 778 00:43:41,600 --> 00:43:43,319 Speaker 1: ever had those times where you're kind of staring off 779 00:43:43,320 --> 00:43:46,839 Speaker 1: into space and somebody says something and you kind of 780 00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:50,719 Speaker 1: come back, but you keep staring off in a space. 781 00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:53,120 Speaker 1: Do you ever have that? Oh? I get that a 782 00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:56,480 Speaker 1: lot where like actually sometimes I get into physical pain 783 00:43:56,520 --> 00:43:59,080 Speaker 1: if I like snap out of it too fast to 784 00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:02,160 Speaker 1: stare off into space since somebody says something and I'm like, oh, 785 00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:04,720 Speaker 1: here I am, but I have to keep staring off 786 00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:09,000 Speaker 1: or else. Okay, now I can come back, don't come 787 00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:12,640 Speaker 1: back in phase? Is not all at once, but uh, 788 00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:14,920 Speaker 1: one would present that he could have come back in 789 00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:17,759 Speaker 1: a couple of stages and still made it. I think, Yeah, 790 00:44:17,920 --> 00:44:20,480 Speaker 1: just that just doesn't really seem to happen to that 791 00:44:20,520 --> 00:44:23,040 Speaker 1: many people, because if it did, we have a lot 792 00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:25,719 Speaker 1: more dead pedestrians and things like that. You know. So 793 00:44:25,840 --> 00:44:29,040 Speaker 1: you're saying, is I'm weird. I'm saying that you are 794 00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:32,279 Speaker 1: probably not the norm in that. The good news is 795 00:44:32,320 --> 00:44:36,000 Speaker 1: I don't do it when I'm driving. Well, thank goodness. Um, 796 00:44:36,040 --> 00:44:39,440 Speaker 1: Now there were the other thing that and again this 797 00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:42,640 Speaker 1: is the things that were really hard to diagnose properly, 798 00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:45,880 Speaker 1: is there were suggestions that he had he had suffered 799 00:44:46,200 --> 00:44:51,200 Speaker 1: what were some pretty rare or exotic conditions that that 800 00:44:51,360 --> 00:44:54,239 Speaker 1: are a cute you know, they just happened that one 801 00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:57,600 Speaker 1: or two times. That would be akin to like, as 802 00:44:57,600 --> 00:45:00,279 Speaker 1: you said, the locked in scenario, you know, locked in 803 00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:03,160 Speaker 1: his brain but not able to move. But those are 804 00:45:03,200 --> 00:45:07,200 Speaker 1: things that that are just so difficult to diagnose, just 805 00:45:07,200 --> 00:45:10,520 Speaker 1: disregarded by the the investigating committee. Yeah, and again, I 806 00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:13,400 Speaker 1: mean blackouts can be just a one off, you know, 807 00:45:13,400 --> 00:45:15,160 Speaker 1: a couple of time things they don't even have to 808 00:45:15,160 --> 00:45:17,200 Speaker 1: be associated with anything. Your brain can just be like, 809 00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:20,520 Speaker 1: you know, buy for a little bit. And usually granted, 810 00:45:20,560 --> 00:45:24,920 Speaker 1: usually those do coincide with the you collapse or blah blah. 811 00:45:24,960 --> 00:45:27,960 Speaker 1: But it is possible to have your brain go and 812 00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:30,360 Speaker 1: not your body at least for a couple of minutes. 813 00:45:30,520 --> 00:45:33,440 Speaker 1: It seems rather unlikely, though. We're gonna move on to 814 00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:37,080 Speaker 1: the next theory. The next theory is mechanical failure, and 815 00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:39,600 Speaker 1: it's got a couple of subsections to it. So there's 816 00:45:39,640 --> 00:45:42,160 Speaker 1: actually some explanation that I need to do. I was 817 00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:44,440 Speaker 1: gonna say, you need to tell us about the mechanics first, 818 00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:46,959 Speaker 1: I do. I do. So. First off, I talked about 819 00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:49,960 Speaker 1: this earlier, is that the train that was the train 820 00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:53,400 Speaker 1: that was involved, it was a tube stock, and again 821 00:45:53,480 --> 00:45:55,440 Speaker 1: that is the stock of trains that is used in 822 00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:58,880 Speaker 1: the tube. They had been in service at that time 823 00:45:58,920 --> 00:46:03,840 Speaker 1: for over forty years. They did. And you know, these trains, 824 00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:08,080 Speaker 1: they apparently worked well because currently some of them, though 825 00:46:08,120 --> 00:46:12,000 Speaker 1: they've been decommissioned in the tube, there's still some of 826 00:46:12,040 --> 00:46:15,160 Speaker 1: them running on the aisle of White. So those trains 827 00:46:15,600 --> 00:46:19,440 Speaker 1: weren't all that bad that as long as they were maintained. 828 00:46:19,480 --> 00:46:21,600 Speaker 1: I think that was one of the issues. And well, 829 00:46:21,640 --> 00:46:23,560 Speaker 1: we're gonna get into that. But before we get into 830 00:46:23,680 --> 00:46:26,719 Speaker 1: maintenance stuff, let's talk about the train operation, because that 831 00:46:26,719 --> 00:46:29,319 Speaker 1: that's going to really be paramount for the stuff that's 832 00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:32,759 Speaker 1: coming up for I get into the train operation. I 833 00:46:32,880 --> 00:46:37,239 Speaker 1: have to say thank you to both Alistair and Anthony. 834 00:46:37,640 --> 00:46:40,040 Speaker 1: Thank you so much to those guys for helping me 835 00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:44,000 Speaker 1: understand the nuts and bolts of how the cab worked. 836 00:46:44,840 --> 00:46:47,480 Speaker 1: That really really made a big difference for me. So 837 00:46:47,560 --> 00:46:51,560 Speaker 1: here's how the train works. The driver stands in the 838 00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:55,920 Speaker 1: cab and has their left hand and their right hand 839 00:46:56,080 --> 00:46:59,200 Speaker 1: on top of for lack of a better term, two 840 00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:01,759 Speaker 1: columns and left and in the right hand column. The 841 00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:05,600 Speaker 1: left hand column has a control on it that swings 842 00:47:05,640 --> 00:47:07,920 Speaker 1: back and forth, and that is the application of the brakes. 843 00:47:07,920 --> 00:47:12,000 Speaker 1: It's the brake handle. So the right hand column had 844 00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:16,400 Speaker 1: the speed control for the train, which was a lever system. 845 00:47:16,440 --> 00:47:18,920 Speaker 1: So think about if there's a clock laying in a 846 00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:21,839 Speaker 1: plane in front of you. The lever is off when 847 00:47:21,880 --> 00:47:24,840 Speaker 1: it's at the three o'clock position, and then the driver 848 00:47:24,960 --> 00:47:27,359 Speaker 1: would pull it and it would rotate to the six 849 00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:30,920 Speaker 1: o'clock position and out. That's correctly if I'm wrong, but 850 00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:34,360 Speaker 1: I had heard very read they have to push down 851 00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:36,879 Speaker 1: on it. I'm not there yet. I'm not there yet. 852 00:47:36,920 --> 00:47:38,799 Speaker 1: That's the dead man switch part. I'm not there yet, 853 00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:41,839 Speaker 1: So taking this in pieces, so you would move it 854 00:47:41,920 --> 00:47:45,400 Speaker 1: from three o'clock to six o'clock to put the train 855 00:47:45,600 --> 00:47:48,920 Speaker 1: into forward go, you know, to get power, and the 856 00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:52,160 Speaker 1: easy way that there's this whole cereal and parallel thing 857 00:47:52,160 --> 00:47:53,799 Speaker 1: which we'll talk about later, but think of it as 858 00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:56,239 Speaker 1: a low and a high gear. Low gears at six 859 00:47:56,280 --> 00:47:59,000 Speaker 1: o'clock and then when the train had enough speed, you 860 00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:01,480 Speaker 1: would continue to push it to the left in an 861 00:48:01,600 --> 00:48:04,160 Speaker 1: arc to the nine o'clock position, and that's where it's 862 00:48:04,239 --> 00:48:07,960 Speaker 1: high gear. That's the basics of the control of the operation. 863 00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:10,399 Speaker 1: What you were talking about, Joe, is the dead man 864 00:48:10,520 --> 00:48:14,520 Speaker 1: switch component of the control, and that is when it's 865 00:48:14,560 --> 00:48:17,919 Speaker 1: in the three o'clock position. In order to move that lever, 866 00:48:18,440 --> 00:48:20,919 Speaker 1: the operator of the train has to push it down 867 00:48:20,960 --> 00:48:22,920 Speaker 1: and it took fifteen pounds of force to get it 868 00:48:22,960 --> 00:48:26,799 Speaker 1: down enough before it would begin to rotate, and then 869 00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:28,520 Speaker 1: then from there on they had to keep three pounds 870 00:48:28,560 --> 00:48:31,640 Speaker 1: pressure on it. But it is a dead man switch, 871 00:48:31,719 --> 00:48:34,439 Speaker 1: and everybody you know what a dead man switches, whether 872 00:48:34,480 --> 00:48:36,080 Speaker 1: you realize it or not. Because we're going to go 873 00:48:36,120 --> 00:48:38,680 Speaker 1: back to the movies. There's that scene in the movies 874 00:48:38,880 --> 00:48:41,240 Speaker 1: where the bad guy's got a bomb and he's holding 875 00:48:41,280 --> 00:48:44,040 Speaker 1: a switch in his hand. If the good guy shoot 876 00:48:44,080 --> 00:48:46,840 Speaker 1: him and he dies, he'll let go and the bomb 877 00:48:46,840 --> 00:48:51,400 Speaker 1: will go off and drama ensues. But basically it is 878 00:48:51,800 --> 00:48:55,320 Speaker 1: if somebody lets go of the switch and it turns off, 879 00:48:55,920 --> 00:48:59,400 Speaker 1: something is going to happen. Basic simple driver moves it 880 00:48:59,480 --> 00:49:02,200 Speaker 1: to six walk and doesn't keep pressure on it and 881 00:49:02,320 --> 00:49:05,280 Speaker 1: let's go. For some reason the breaks on the train. 882 00:49:05,520 --> 00:49:09,720 Speaker 1: The dead man function would activate the brakes and stop 883 00:49:09,880 --> 00:49:12,960 Speaker 1: the train. So that let's say somebody sneaks up and 884 00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:15,319 Speaker 1: clubs our driver in the back of the head and 885 00:49:15,360 --> 00:49:18,239 Speaker 1: he lets go of the controls, the train is going 886 00:49:18,280 --> 00:49:21,840 Speaker 1: to automatically stop. And he said, how how much weight 887 00:49:21,880 --> 00:49:23,960 Speaker 1: does it to? How much pressure does it take? Three 888 00:49:23,960 --> 00:49:27,360 Speaker 1: pounds of pressure to keep it down? Fifteen pounds to 889 00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:31,520 Speaker 1: initially push it down. It's it's not it's not so 890 00:49:31,560 --> 00:49:34,160 Speaker 1: it takes considerable a bit of force to push it 891 00:49:34,200 --> 00:49:38,120 Speaker 1: down and then to maintain it. It's a notable, noticeable 892 00:49:38,160 --> 00:49:41,600 Speaker 1: force because there is spring or air pressure trying to 893 00:49:41,760 --> 00:49:44,560 Speaker 1: push it up. It's resisting the downward force that your 894 00:49:44,560 --> 00:49:48,920 Speaker 1: hand is keeping on it. Basics overview, very basic of 895 00:49:49,000 --> 00:49:51,799 Speaker 1: how controls work. I wonder how many te drivers like 896 00:49:51,840 --> 00:49:54,920 Speaker 1: you know have had made themselves like a specially weighted 897 00:49:54,960 --> 00:49:57,319 Speaker 1: glove to make it easier. I've heard it's hard to 898 00:49:57,400 --> 00:49:59,719 Speaker 1: do that all day pressed down. I don't think they 899 00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:02,359 Speaker 1: actually made especially way to glove, but as we'll talk 900 00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:04,680 Speaker 1: about later on, they did figure out some tricks to 901 00:50:04,760 --> 00:50:06,440 Speaker 1: make it much easier on themselves. I was going to 902 00:50:07,480 --> 00:50:12,000 Speaker 1: lean on it. That is one way to do it, 903 00:50:12,080 --> 00:50:14,960 Speaker 1: but it's it's it's a it's in a position that 904 00:50:15,080 --> 00:50:17,560 Speaker 1: I think is awkward to lean on. You'd be moving 905 00:50:17,640 --> 00:50:20,759 Speaker 1: back and forth. Because think about like this train in 906 00:50:20,840 --> 00:50:23,960 Speaker 1: less than ten minutes, it made five stops. The longer trains, 907 00:50:24,080 --> 00:50:25,960 Speaker 1: maybe a guy could get away with that. It went 908 00:50:26,680 --> 00:50:29,640 Speaker 1: sorry and the arc went away from you, towards you, 909 00:50:29,760 --> 00:50:31,719 Speaker 1: towards Yeah, so you're in the middle, and so you 910 00:50:31,719 --> 00:50:34,200 Speaker 1: can if it was in the middle position, low gear, 911 00:50:34,760 --> 00:50:37,239 Speaker 1: you could do that. Not so easy when it's in 912 00:50:37,239 --> 00:50:40,880 Speaker 1: the nine o'clock position, which is the high gear, because 913 00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:43,520 Speaker 1: you're going to rotate the train between low and high 914 00:50:43,560 --> 00:50:46,120 Speaker 1: gear for speed based on what you're doing. Yeah. I 915 00:50:46,120 --> 00:50:48,160 Speaker 1: guess the other thing that I'll just go ahead and 916 00:50:48,200 --> 00:50:50,200 Speaker 1: mention right now is that I have an issue with 917 00:50:50,239 --> 00:50:52,600 Speaker 1: the idea that he would have ever gotten into high gear. 918 00:50:52,680 --> 00:50:56,239 Speaker 1: Given the shortness of this route, it's ten minutes. The 919 00:50:56,320 --> 00:51:00,680 Speaker 1: trains accelerate quite quickly, and it's sounds to me like 920 00:51:00,719 --> 00:51:04,120 Speaker 1: they come up to speed very fast and to be 921 00:51:04,160 --> 00:51:06,640 Speaker 1: able to make those stuffs in that time, it sounds 922 00:51:06,680 --> 00:51:09,120 Speaker 1: like you have to go from the six o'clock low 923 00:51:09,200 --> 00:51:13,000 Speaker 1: gear to the nine o'clock position high gear quite frequently, 924 00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:15,000 Speaker 1: because you're you're ramping the train up and then you're 925 00:51:15,080 --> 00:51:17,680 Speaker 1: ramping it back. If you kept it in low gear, 926 00:51:17,760 --> 00:51:20,520 Speaker 1: you would never be on time, is my understanding. I 927 00:51:20,560 --> 00:51:24,160 Speaker 1: could be wrong, but if a stick was shutting it 928 00:51:24,200 --> 00:51:25,839 Speaker 1: off and coasting all the way up, you can see 929 00:51:25,880 --> 00:51:27,440 Speaker 1: what you want. To give it a little blast speed, 930 00:51:27,640 --> 00:51:29,359 Speaker 1: he'd want to be a high gear and then knock 931 00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:31,680 Speaker 1: it back to full neutral and just coast his way 932 00:51:31,719 --> 00:51:37,040 Speaker 1: on in. So let's go with In the mechanical failure theory. 933 00:51:37,360 --> 00:51:41,360 Speaker 1: The first theory is that there was a bad break valve. 934 00:51:41,640 --> 00:51:44,640 Speaker 1: And I'm gonna get into more descriptions of how stuff 935 00:51:44,680 --> 00:51:48,400 Speaker 1: on these trains worked. And I apologize, well, that's tymably 936 00:51:48,440 --> 00:51:51,360 Speaker 1: not true because they know the tube system that they 937 00:51:51,400 --> 00:51:54,640 Speaker 1: said afterwards that they examined the whole brake system and 938 00:51:54,680 --> 00:51:58,600 Speaker 1: it was just flawless. That is knock, that is not 939 00:51:59,080 --> 00:52:02,600 Speaker 1: entirely act. You're at. Joey seem to believe that there 940 00:52:02,680 --> 00:52:05,680 Speaker 1: was absolutely nothing mechanically wrong with that train at all. 941 00:52:06,160 --> 00:52:08,319 Speaker 1: So that's what they said. I know, I know, I know, 942 00:52:08,760 --> 00:52:11,239 Speaker 1: And to follow on what joe is getting at. That's 943 00:52:11,239 --> 00:52:15,759 Speaker 1: the official inquest into the accident, which um what they did. 944 00:52:16,520 --> 00:52:19,520 Speaker 1: The brakes on the train are electro pneumatic, which is 945 00:52:19,560 --> 00:52:22,520 Speaker 1: a fancy way of saying they are air brakes that 946 00:52:22,560 --> 00:52:25,960 Speaker 1: are electronically controlled, and that was actually one set of 947 00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:28,200 Speaker 1: They had two sets of brakes on the train. Yes, 948 00:52:28,280 --> 00:52:31,000 Speaker 1: there's the Westinghouse which is basically a kind of a 949 00:52:31,000 --> 00:52:35,239 Speaker 1: heart brake system, and then the air brake system, the 950 00:52:35,280 --> 00:52:37,440 Speaker 1: ep is it's referred to, so we're just gonna call 951 00:52:37,480 --> 00:52:39,879 Speaker 1: it the air brakes for the moment. But the air 952 00:52:39,920 --> 00:52:42,280 Speaker 1: brake system runs through the entire length of the train, 953 00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:46,360 Speaker 1: and because it's an air system, it's very simple in theory. 954 00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:50,120 Speaker 1: There's a tank that has pressure in it, and when 955 00:52:50,320 --> 00:52:54,279 Speaker 1: the driver or a passenger pulls the right handle, the 956 00:52:54,320 --> 00:52:58,880 Speaker 1: pressure pours into the tube system that controls the brakes 957 00:52:58,880 --> 00:53:02,279 Speaker 1: and that pressure then activates the brakes, which would then 958 00:53:02,600 --> 00:53:05,320 Speaker 1: compress on the wheels. So just like when you step 959 00:53:05,360 --> 00:53:07,680 Speaker 1: on the brake in your car, if it was done 960 00:53:07,680 --> 00:53:12,560 Speaker 1: by air. That's the simplest version of this, except it's 961 00:53:12,560 --> 00:53:15,480 Speaker 1: an air system, so it has a bunch of valves 962 00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:18,600 Speaker 1: in it to be able to turn things off to disconnected. 963 00:53:18,960 --> 00:53:21,319 Speaker 1: And in the inquest, they noted that there was a 964 00:53:21,360 --> 00:53:25,719 Speaker 1: couple of valves that were broken, and they presumed were 965 00:53:25,800 --> 00:53:29,799 Speaker 1: broken because of the accident, because they say they took 966 00:53:29,880 --> 00:53:32,359 Speaker 1: all of the lines off of the train and they 967 00:53:32,440 --> 00:53:35,800 Speaker 1: reassembled them, and when they brought the system up to pressure, 968 00:53:36,280 --> 00:53:39,279 Speaker 1: it came up to pressure. But it sounds like they 969 00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:42,400 Speaker 1: also replaced the broken valves to do so. But I 970 00:53:42,440 --> 00:53:46,280 Speaker 1: don't see anything that says that they actually tested those valves. 971 00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:48,799 Speaker 1: So I wonder if there is a scenario where a 972 00:53:48,920 --> 00:53:52,080 Speaker 1: valve goes bad it therefore dumps all the pressure in 973 00:53:52,080 --> 00:53:54,040 Speaker 1: the tank. So think of an air compressor. If it's 974 00:53:54,040 --> 00:53:55,880 Speaker 1: got no pressure in it and you you hit the button, 975 00:53:55,960 --> 00:54:00,440 Speaker 1: nothing happens, And poor Nussen is sitting there driving the 976 00:54:00,480 --> 00:54:04,920 Speaker 1: train and he's pulling on the lever and nothing is happening. 977 00:54:05,520 --> 00:54:08,280 Speaker 1: It's a situation where I could see a guy just pulling, 978 00:54:08,719 --> 00:54:12,160 Speaker 1: praying to God that the stupid thing will kick in, 979 00:54:12,200 --> 00:54:14,759 Speaker 1: you know, like you only see it again in the 980 00:54:14,800 --> 00:54:18,319 Speaker 1: movies when the brakes fail. Somebody's rapidly stomping on the 981 00:54:18,320 --> 00:54:20,479 Speaker 1: brake pedal trying to get and he's doing the same 982 00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:24,319 Speaker 1: thing with the brake handle, trying to get the sting 983 00:54:24,360 --> 00:54:28,279 Speaker 1: to well, and I kind of wonder too, how you know, 984 00:54:28,480 --> 00:54:30,320 Speaker 1: he must he should have known, but maybe he didn't 985 00:54:30,320 --> 00:54:33,240 Speaker 1: know how far he had to go before the tunnel 986 00:54:33,239 --> 00:54:36,520 Speaker 1: did ended he should know? Yeah, yeah, I mean my 987 00:54:36,640 --> 00:54:39,279 Speaker 1: two problems with that are, like, there's got to be 988 00:54:39,320 --> 00:54:44,760 Speaker 1: a backup auxiliary emergency system somewhere. It's called the Westinghouse, okay. 989 00:54:45,200 --> 00:54:48,480 Speaker 1: And then the other one is it was reported that 990 00:54:48,600 --> 00:54:52,520 Speaker 1: he coasted in to his stops, So why would he 991 00:54:52,560 --> 00:54:56,600 Speaker 1: be going full throttle when he should have been easing 992 00:54:56,640 --> 00:55:01,799 Speaker 1: off the throttle five minutes back. Well, and that's and 993 00:55:01,840 --> 00:55:04,799 Speaker 1: that's a different theory. So that the passengers said that 994 00:55:04,840 --> 00:55:09,120 Speaker 1: it felt like the and the witnesses said it looked 995 00:55:09,120 --> 00:55:14,000 Speaker 1: like and felt like the train was accelerating, but it 996 00:55:14,080 --> 00:55:16,879 Speaker 1: may have been up to speed and it could have 997 00:55:16,960 --> 00:55:21,120 Speaker 1: been going thirty or forty miles and with no breaking 998 00:55:21,520 --> 00:55:24,200 Speaker 1: just like, oh my god, craps flying by. Because you've 999 00:55:24,239 --> 00:55:27,640 Speaker 1: been in a subway and you see things whizzing by, 1000 00:55:27,760 --> 00:55:30,240 Speaker 1: but it's dark and you don't really have a good 1001 00:55:30,280 --> 00:55:33,400 Speaker 1: impression of your speed. But suddenly when there's things for 1002 00:55:33,480 --> 00:55:37,400 Speaker 1: frame of reference, like, holy crap, we're speeding up. Oh wait, no, 1003 00:55:38,239 --> 00:55:41,640 Speaker 1: we're slowing down, like I could see the other side 1004 00:55:41,640 --> 00:55:44,120 Speaker 1: of the coin to what you're saying. Sure, I mean, 1005 00:55:44,200 --> 00:55:45,560 Speaker 1: I don't know that that's the other side of the 1006 00:55:45,560 --> 00:55:48,239 Speaker 1: coin to what I'm saying. But maybe you're saying why 1007 00:55:48,320 --> 00:55:50,960 Speaker 1: was the train speeding up? No, I'm just saying why 1008 00:55:51,040 --> 00:55:52,799 Speaker 1: was it going that fast at all? If he was 1009 00:55:52,920 --> 00:55:56,080 Speaker 1: known to coast in, he should have eased up on 1010 00:55:56,120 --> 00:55:59,640 Speaker 1: the throttle all like, much earlier. And if the breaking 1011 00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:02,640 Speaker 1: sist is not working, he still should be slowing down 1012 00:56:02,640 --> 00:56:05,760 Speaker 1: because he's coasting in because he's not hitting the throttle anymore. 1013 00:56:05,880 --> 00:56:07,680 Speaker 1: And they all he needed to do is let go, 1014 00:56:07,840 --> 00:56:10,719 Speaker 1: let go. Yeah. True in theory. So that's that's what 1015 00:56:10,760 --> 00:56:12,680 Speaker 1: I'm saying, is like, that's the big problem I have 1016 00:56:12,719 --> 00:56:14,759 Speaker 1: with that is that it sounds like he wasn't a 1017 00:56:14,760 --> 00:56:18,560 Speaker 1: big user of the brakes anyway. So why was he 1018 00:56:18,680 --> 00:56:22,279 Speaker 1: going thirty forty miles an hour when he hit that 1019 00:56:22,880 --> 00:56:25,680 Speaker 1: station when he should have been coasting in By all 1020 00:56:25,760 --> 00:56:28,200 Speaker 1: reports of the way, he should tread off the power 1021 00:56:28,320 --> 00:56:32,560 Speaker 1: much earlier. Yeah, and then it wasn't just bad breaks, obviously, 1022 00:56:32,600 --> 00:56:35,759 Speaker 1: something else have been going on. Maybe didn't work either. 1023 00:56:35,840 --> 00:56:38,160 Speaker 1: The breaks theoretically should have been able to stop it, 1024 00:56:38,200 --> 00:56:42,080 Speaker 1: no matter what theoretically they should have And and so 1025 00:56:42,120 --> 00:56:47,760 Speaker 1: we haven't talked about this, but these trains officially got 1026 00:56:47,760 --> 00:56:52,600 Speaker 1: examined for maintenance reasons on quite a rigorous schedule. This 1027 00:56:52,680 --> 00:56:55,560 Speaker 1: is officially speaking. They were looked at once a week 1028 00:56:55,800 --> 00:56:58,399 Speaker 1: I think it was basically once a quarter, and then 1029 00:56:58,440 --> 00:57:01,879 Speaker 1: they were Any major overhaul work was done once a year. 1030 00:57:01,880 --> 00:57:05,600 Speaker 1: And according to the records, this train was spotless. It 1031 00:57:05,680 --> 00:57:09,160 Speaker 1: had gone through its weekly review the night before the accident. 1032 00:57:09,239 --> 00:57:13,080 Speaker 1: Although there were accusations of falsifications, we talked about that. 1033 00:57:13,120 --> 00:57:15,239 Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, because that's what is the name of 1034 00:57:15,239 --> 00:57:18,320 Speaker 1: the guy that you that. There's a guy named Anthony Bright. 1035 00:57:18,840 --> 00:57:20,760 Speaker 1: He used to work for the Tube System and he's 1036 00:57:20,800 --> 00:57:22,720 Speaker 1: he's posted a lot of interesting stuff on the web 1037 00:57:22,760 --> 00:57:25,360 Speaker 1: about He's been a lot of accusations. I'm just gonna 1038 00:57:25,720 --> 00:57:27,480 Speaker 1: I was just gonna go ahead and preface this by 1039 00:57:27,480 --> 00:57:31,600 Speaker 1: saying anything that was commissioned in nineteen thirty eight, right, 1040 00:57:31,640 --> 00:57:36,400 Speaker 1: that's when this train was commissioned, the train was constructed. Yeah. Actually, 1041 00:57:36,800 --> 00:57:38,680 Speaker 1: I don't know that this is an individual one. That's 1042 00:57:38,680 --> 00:57:44,960 Speaker 1: when they first started. It was, he was, but that 1043 00:57:45,080 --> 00:57:47,680 Speaker 1: at least, you know, thirty years old, it's not going 1044 00:57:47,720 --> 00:57:51,320 Speaker 1: to be spotless no matter what, there's gonna be some 1045 00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:56,000 Speaker 1: opponents would have been replaced on a regular basis, engines 1046 00:57:56,120 --> 00:57:59,160 Speaker 1: and brakes and wheels and stuff like. I'm just eating 1047 00:57:59,200 --> 00:58:02,280 Speaker 1: the interior as were replaced. I'm just casting aspersions on 1048 00:58:02,320 --> 00:58:05,479 Speaker 1: the fact that it was quote unquote spotless. There's gonna 1049 00:58:05,480 --> 00:58:07,320 Speaker 1: be minor things that needed to have happened. So I 1050 00:58:07,320 --> 00:58:09,560 Speaker 1: guess what I what I mean when I say spotless 1051 00:58:10,000 --> 00:58:13,080 Speaker 1: is there's always a lemon in the bunch. There's always 1052 00:58:13,120 --> 00:58:16,600 Speaker 1: that one car number fifty two. Look fifty two broke 1053 00:58:16,640 --> 00:58:20,240 Speaker 1: down again. Big shocker there. That kind of when I 1054 00:58:20,280 --> 00:58:23,320 Speaker 1: say that it's it was a regular train. It didn't 1055 00:58:23,360 --> 00:58:27,480 Speaker 1: have any major issues. It got its maintenance officially speaking, 1056 00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:31,040 Speaker 1: and it didn't have any problems. But the accusations that 1057 00:58:31,040 --> 00:58:34,080 Speaker 1: that Joe found in the comments section that I didn't 1058 00:58:34,080 --> 00:58:37,880 Speaker 1: go into, say quite the different story. Uh yeah, now 1059 00:58:38,000 --> 00:58:40,400 Speaker 1: he uh, he said a lot of the maintenance staff 1060 00:58:40,440 --> 00:58:42,640 Speaker 1: at East and I guess that's where they did the maintenance. 1061 00:58:42,840 --> 00:58:45,320 Speaker 1: He said, they were stealing the batteries, stealing the mercury 1062 00:58:45,320 --> 00:58:48,880 Speaker 1: from these retarders that we're part of the breaking system. 1063 00:58:49,360 --> 00:58:51,720 Speaker 1: Basically anything else, as he says, they could sell to 1064 00:58:51,800 --> 00:58:55,120 Speaker 1: the scrappy. To quote him, so, I said, instead of 1065 00:58:55,160 --> 00:58:58,200 Speaker 1: maintaining the trains, they were spending their worktime stealing from 1066 00:58:58,240 --> 00:59:01,480 Speaker 1: the trains. He also makes the accusation which I find 1067 00:59:01,560 --> 00:59:05,040 Speaker 1: interesting because this goes into the next theory, which is 1068 00:59:05,840 --> 00:59:08,560 Speaker 1: I call it the engine theory. One of the things 1069 00:59:08,680 --> 00:59:12,880 Speaker 1: he says is he says that these cars were coupled 1070 00:59:12,880 --> 00:59:16,800 Speaker 1: together in threes. So there were three cars. Yeah yeah, 1071 00:59:16,880 --> 00:59:20,880 Speaker 1: so three cars locked together, then another three cars connected 1072 00:59:20,920 --> 00:59:23,080 Speaker 1: to that. That's how we have the first three cars 1073 00:59:23,160 --> 00:59:28,240 Speaker 1: and the rear three cars. And according to him, you 1074 00:59:28,280 --> 00:59:32,400 Speaker 1: could only drive on the head and the tail or 1075 00:59:32,480 --> 00:59:34,560 Speaker 1: from the head and the tail of that three car system. 1076 00:59:34,600 --> 00:59:37,960 Speaker 1: Even though these cars were technically designed so that any 1077 00:59:38,040 --> 00:59:40,400 Speaker 1: of those three cars could be the head or tail 1078 00:59:40,520 --> 00:59:44,880 Speaker 1: of a group. Because of mechanical issues, they had permanently 1079 00:59:44,920 --> 00:59:49,360 Speaker 1: coupled them together so they could scavenge the controls from 1080 00:59:49,920 --> 00:59:53,800 Speaker 1: the middle car and the interior of the front rear 1081 00:59:53,840 --> 00:59:56,600 Speaker 1: car to have stuff for the prints because there were 1082 00:59:56,680 --> 01:00:01,720 Speaker 1: some mechanical issues with the actual driver level system. According 1083 01:00:01,800 --> 01:00:04,000 Speaker 1: to him, Yeah, no, he said that they were worn 1084 01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:05,640 Speaker 1: out and they needed to be replaced, and so they 1085 01:00:05,680 --> 01:00:10,160 Speaker 1: basically just they scavenged apart from the train and uh 1086 01:00:10,200 --> 01:00:11,760 Speaker 1: and he also said as far as the brooke and 1087 01:00:11,880 --> 01:00:14,800 Speaker 1: valve there he goes, he says, there could have been 1088 01:00:14,800 --> 01:00:17,120 Speaker 1: it could have been like a loose or a defective valve. 1089 01:00:17,520 --> 01:00:20,600 Speaker 1: They said. Also, the valves are throughout the train. He said, 1090 01:00:20,680 --> 01:00:25,360 Speaker 1: somebody opening a valve deliberately or inadvertently could also sabotage 1091 01:00:25,400 --> 01:00:28,200 Speaker 1: the brake system, whether somebody meant to or not being 1092 01:00:28,200 --> 01:00:32,440 Speaker 1: a prankster or just realizing they were causing a mistake 1093 01:00:32,640 --> 01:00:35,640 Speaker 1: or deliberate sabotage. So that that brings you know what, 1094 01:00:35,920 --> 01:00:38,200 Speaker 1: So I hadn't thought about that until just now. But 1095 01:00:38,280 --> 01:00:39,960 Speaker 1: you remember we talked about the eighteen year old kid 1096 01:00:39,960 --> 01:00:42,080 Speaker 1: who was the guard on the train. One of the 1097 01:00:42,160 --> 01:00:45,320 Speaker 1: things he told the inquest when they said, you know 1098 01:00:45,600 --> 01:00:49,520 Speaker 1: something about why didn't you pull the handle and initiate 1099 01:00:49,560 --> 01:00:53,200 Speaker 1: the Westinghouse brakes and stop the train. Is he said, Well, 1100 01:00:53,400 --> 01:00:55,840 Speaker 1: he had gone to the other into the train and 1101 01:00:56,040 --> 01:01:01,160 Speaker 1: was rooting around looking for newspapers to read because obviously 1102 01:01:01,160 --> 01:01:03,480 Speaker 1: it was boring. And then he was reading the paper 1103 01:01:03,560 --> 01:01:05,960 Speaker 1: not paying attention. That's why he didn't pull the brake handle. 1104 01:01:06,080 --> 01:01:08,720 Speaker 1: But what I'm getting at here is if the trains 1105 01:01:08,760 --> 01:01:14,040 Speaker 1: are in the tail section cab and he is rooting around, 1106 01:01:14,680 --> 01:01:17,400 Speaker 1: it's possible he could have knocked a valve. It could 1107 01:01:17,440 --> 01:01:19,400 Speaker 1: have accidentally done it too, or he could I mean, 1108 01:01:19,400 --> 01:01:21,240 Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not blaming this kid at all, but 1109 01:01:21,280 --> 01:01:24,120 Speaker 1: it just suddenly that dawned on me from that that 1110 01:01:24,240 --> 01:01:26,720 Speaker 1: stuff that you're looking at right there. Yeah, And if 1111 01:01:26,760 --> 01:01:29,240 Speaker 1: he had actually, you know, if he had actually understood 1112 01:01:29,280 --> 01:01:32,200 Speaker 1: the operation of it when apparently, according to an Anthony Brake, 1113 01:01:33,120 --> 01:01:38,360 Speaker 1: if a failure of the electro pneumatic system, what that happened. 1114 01:01:38,360 --> 01:01:41,040 Speaker 1: What that causes is a discharge of air from the 1115 01:01:41,080 --> 01:01:44,080 Speaker 1: system into the driver's cab, which he said could be 1116 01:01:44,200 --> 01:01:47,280 Speaker 1: unpleasant because it's like not just air, but it has 1117 01:01:47,360 --> 01:01:52,280 Speaker 1: like its gonna have dust and oil, oil oil droplets 1118 01:01:52,280 --> 01:01:54,640 Speaker 1: and things like that, and so it could have been 1119 01:01:54,680 --> 01:01:57,720 Speaker 1: either a spiteful prank, because I had heard that the 1120 01:01:57,720 --> 01:02:01,000 Speaker 1: two of them, the Harrison and Newson, didn't necessarily get 1121 01:02:01,000 --> 01:02:03,200 Speaker 1: along that well, which is funny because a lot of 1122 01:02:03,240 --> 01:02:06,360 Speaker 1: the times it's referred to as they had an okay 1123 01:02:06,560 --> 01:02:10,160 Speaker 1: working relationship, they just were massively different in ages. So 1124 01:02:10,600 --> 01:02:13,040 Speaker 1: or yeah, or it could have been attended it's kind 1125 01:02:13,040 --> 01:02:15,959 Speaker 1: of a fun little prank. Yeah, he's get this little 1126 01:02:16,000 --> 01:02:20,240 Speaker 1: blast of this little cab with all this crap, you know. Yeah, 1127 01:02:20,280 --> 01:02:22,880 Speaker 1: and maybe so it could have been inadvertence. Well, yeah, 1128 01:02:22,920 --> 01:02:25,680 Speaker 1: I mean it's possible right that there was that it 1129 01:02:25,760 --> 01:02:29,040 Speaker 1: was intended as this. He understood that you would get 1130 01:02:29,040 --> 01:02:30,760 Speaker 1: like the blast of air in the cab. He didn't 1131 01:02:30,840 --> 01:02:33,240 Speaker 1: understand that while you give that blast of air in 1132 01:02:33,280 --> 01:02:37,760 Speaker 1: the cab, you functionally just decimate the brake system the 1133 01:02:38,240 --> 01:02:42,240 Speaker 1: pressure therefore the brakes. I mean, so that's certainly possible. Yeah, 1134 01:02:42,240 --> 01:02:45,320 Speaker 1: but of course that doesn't account for the continued even 1135 01:02:45,320 --> 01:02:47,920 Speaker 1: if the train wasn't accelerating into the station, if it 1136 01:02:47,960 --> 01:02:50,720 Speaker 1: was still going the same speed, the lack of brakes 1137 01:02:50,720 --> 01:02:53,919 Speaker 1: doesn't really account for that. So there's there's Yeah, they're 1138 01:02:54,040 --> 01:02:56,960 Speaker 1: part of the theory of the engines. That I'm looking at. 1139 01:02:57,560 --> 01:03:01,000 Speaker 1: One of the things that I was looking at was 1140 01:03:01,120 --> 01:03:05,200 Speaker 1: the possibility of the fact that the the speed lever 1141 01:03:05,480 --> 01:03:09,360 Speaker 1: was actually stuck in the nine o'clock position because the 1142 01:03:09,520 --> 01:03:12,800 Speaker 1: drive shaft, and I'm presuming that they are referring to 1143 01:03:12,840 --> 01:03:17,840 Speaker 1: the drive shaft of that lever itself was broken. And 1144 01:03:17,880 --> 01:03:20,880 Speaker 1: they said, well, we think that that's broken because of 1145 01:03:20,920 --> 01:03:23,280 Speaker 1: the impact of the train into the end of the tunnel, 1146 01:03:23,280 --> 01:03:27,280 Speaker 1: which is logical, I admit this, but I also wonder 1147 01:03:27,480 --> 01:03:30,480 Speaker 1: if it is a scenario where it is a weekend 1148 01:03:30,560 --> 01:03:33,760 Speaker 1: drive shaft of that lever and he puts it into 1149 01:03:33,840 --> 01:03:39,120 Speaker 1: high and it's the control rods snaps internally that that 1150 01:03:39,520 --> 01:03:43,320 Speaker 1: and suddenly the lever useless. Have you seen what the 1151 01:03:43,360 --> 01:03:47,040 Speaker 1: housing for that lever looks like? Not? So it is 1152 01:03:47,080 --> 01:03:51,520 Speaker 1: a giant metal box, the main the main column. So 1153 01:03:51,600 --> 01:03:55,320 Speaker 1: there's the lever, and does it have like a you 1154 01:03:55,360 --> 01:03:57,920 Speaker 1: push it down and there's a gap in between, like 1155 01:03:58,120 --> 01:04:02,080 Speaker 1: there is a gap? Yes, Okay, So I'm formulating my 1156 01:04:02,200 --> 01:04:07,400 Speaker 1: new theory that that you know, well, prankster McGhee over here, 1157 01:04:07,840 --> 01:04:09,400 Speaker 1: it's like, oh, this will be fun. There will be 1158 01:04:09,400 --> 01:04:11,720 Speaker 1: like a little blast of air, but there's particular and 1159 01:04:11,800 --> 01:04:14,680 Speaker 1: in that particular is a little stone that gets blown 1160 01:04:14,800 --> 01:04:18,880 Speaker 1: up and kicked up into the crevice between the lever 1161 01:04:19,440 --> 01:04:25,120 Speaker 1: and the housing, which functionally jams the throttle. And that 1162 01:04:25,160 --> 01:04:28,040 Speaker 1: could have happened pretty easily when that X we're talking 1163 01:04:28,080 --> 01:04:31,320 Speaker 1: about that train X where it like jumps, that something 1164 01:04:31,360 --> 01:04:34,200 Speaker 1: could have popped up in there. Basically just jams that 1165 01:04:34,360 --> 01:04:38,920 Speaker 1: lever into full throttle position. Would be an amazing coincidence 1166 01:04:38,920 --> 01:04:41,480 Speaker 1: because there's not so yeah, but I mean so to 1167 01:04:41,640 --> 01:04:46,160 Speaker 1: jam it, whatever detritus you're you're you're making up in 1168 01:04:46,200 --> 01:04:49,680 Speaker 1: this scenario would have to come onto. So if the 1169 01:04:49,760 --> 01:04:52,120 Speaker 1: levers in the nine o'clock position, you would have to 1170 01:04:52,240 --> 01:04:56,720 Speaker 1: jam from the three o'clock side to keep the lever 1171 01:04:57,040 --> 01:04:59,919 Speaker 1: pushed down and in that position. Couldn't have just been 1172 01:05:00,080 --> 01:05:03,680 Speaker 1: in the couldn't be. It couldn't have been in under 1173 01:05:03,720 --> 01:05:06,880 Speaker 1: the gap between the nine o'clock position and the center 1174 01:05:06,920 --> 01:05:11,760 Speaker 1: of the clock position because the lever raises up, so 1175 01:05:12,320 --> 01:05:14,360 Speaker 1: it could have been in the backside. But one thing 1176 01:05:14,440 --> 01:05:16,800 Speaker 1: that I did find interesting in the stuff that Joe 1177 01:05:16,880 --> 01:05:21,000 Speaker 1: had earlier that may account for this is that if 1178 01:05:21,040 --> 01:05:25,080 Speaker 1: there's something wrong with the control, Newson could have very 1179 01:05:25,120 --> 01:05:26,919 Speaker 1: well just said okay, you know, it's screwed. I'm gonna 1180 01:05:26,960 --> 01:05:30,160 Speaker 1: I'm gonna pull pressure off and let the dead man 1181 01:05:30,320 --> 01:05:34,400 Speaker 1: switch go. Except according to this guy's information about the 1182 01:05:34,400 --> 01:05:37,760 Speaker 1: maintenance systems, it was notorious for that. Some of those 1183 01:05:37,800 --> 01:05:40,680 Speaker 1: two are not notorious, but some of those tubes would 1184 01:05:40,800 --> 01:05:44,120 Speaker 1: corrode because it's air, and air systems are notorious for 1185 01:05:44,200 --> 01:05:49,200 Speaker 1: having water in them condensation. So it england and it 1186 01:05:49,280 --> 01:05:54,200 Speaker 1: gets crowd in it and its seals and suddenly there's 1187 01:05:54,240 --> 01:05:58,040 Speaker 1: a the pressure that should be released from the pushing 1188 01:05:58,080 --> 01:06:00,720 Speaker 1: down of the lever or the letting go of it 1189 01:06:00,800 --> 01:06:03,800 Speaker 1: is maintained by whatever crud is in the line has 1190 01:06:03,920 --> 01:06:08,320 Speaker 1: fused it shut. So there's that also possibility that's more 1191 01:06:08,320 --> 01:06:12,120 Speaker 1: of the brakes fail side. But there's a lot of 1192 01:06:12,120 --> 01:06:13,800 Speaker 1: stuff in this. I mean, it's just it's such a 1193 01:06:14,760 --> 01:06:17,880 Speaker 1: complicated machine. Yeah it is. Yeah, they're more complicated than 1194 01:06:17,880 --> 01:06:20,720 Speaker 1: they think. And I and I do find the poor 1195 01:06:20,800 --> 01:06:24,760 Speaker 1: maidenance theory to be at least a little bit compelling. Yeah, 1196 01:06:24,800 --> 01:06:27,920 Speaker 1: I think it's super compelling. It also, you know, gives 1197 01:06:28,520 --> 01:06:32,240 Speaker 1: there's a good reason for the inquest to have covered 1198 01:06:32,280 --> 01:06:34,880 Speaker 1: it up, right. You don't want mass hysteria of people 1199 01:06:34,920 --> 01:06:38,520 Speaker 1: suddenly thinking oh my god, the public transportation system is 1200 01:06:38,560 --> 01:06:42,000 Speaker 1: no longer safe. Some some hedge are going to roll right. 1201 01:06:42,120 --> 01:06:45,560 Speaker 1: It's really easy to just say this guy he died 1202 01:06:46,520 --> 01:06:50,400 Speaker 1: is responsible. Passed the buck onto a dude who has 1203 01:06:50,440 --> 01:06:53,600 Speaker 1: already paid the ultimate sacrifice. Really, you know, you're not 1204 01:06:53,680 --> 01:06:58,280 Speaker 1: really slandering that much of his life. I presume that 1205 01:06:58,360 --> 01:07:01,480 Speaker 1: his widow still got her you know, pension checks and 1206 01:07:01,520 --> 01:07:04,200 Speaker 1: all of that stuff. So to me, it makes perfect 1207 01:07:04,200 --> 01:07:07,760 Speaker 1: sense that there was some huge maintenance error and there 1208 01:07:07,800 --> 01:07:12,400 Speaker 1: was like a large cover up. Just from a conspiracy standpoint, 1209 01:07:12,440 --> 01:07:14,760 Speaker 1: that's that that makes sense. And the guys on the 1210 01:07:14,800 --> 01:07:18,480 Speaker 1: platform who witnessed him standing there staring straight ahead, there 1211 01:07:18,520 --> 01:07:22,520 Speaker 1: were how many I think there's there's at least half 1212 01:07:22,640 --> 01:07:26,000 Speaker 1: dozen statements there that many people really yeah, people, well 1213 01:07:26,040 --> 01:07:28,240 Speaker 1: people were waiting to catch the train to go the 1214 01:07:28,320 --> 01:07:31,600 Speaker 1: other direction. Yeah, but we wasn't. One of them was 1215 01:07:32,160 --> 01:07:35,360 Speaker 1: an employee. I think there's something in that thing that 1216 01:07:35,440 --> 01:07:38,800 Speaker 1: you had that said most of the eyewitness reports were 1217 01:07:38,800 --> 01:07:41,760 Speaker 1: actually given by people who were employed by the Underground. 1218 01:07:41,840 --> 01:07:43,880 Speaker 1: Well exactly, there were members of the trade union in 1219 01:07:43,920 --> 01:07:46,919 Speaker 1: the Underground, and so because there's guys that work there, 1220 01:07:46,920 --> 01:07:48,920 Speaker 1: there's guys that made that you know, there's guards and 1221 01:07:48,960 --> 01:07:51,800 Speaker 1: stuff like that. So there is so these were guys 1222 01:07:51,840 --> 01:07:55,360 Speaker 1: who maybe went along with the whole thing because you know, 1223 01:07:55,400 --> 01:07:57,840 Speaker 1: they were probably told by their bosses that, hey, you'll 1224 01:07:57,880 --> 01:08:00,880 Speaker 1: be rewarded for you know, just saying that you saw this, 1225 01:08:00,960 --> 01:08:04,160 Speaker 1: and they probably all those guys probably saw nothing. And 1226 01:08:04,240 --> 01:08:07,800 Speaker 1: there there is stuff that says that I can't gosh, 1227 01:08:07,840 --> 01:08:09,160 Speaker 1: I wish I had his name. I think it was 1228 01:08:09,200 --> 01:08:12,120 Speaker 1: the guard he was, Yeah, it was the guard I 1229 01:08:12,160 --> 01:08:15,840 Speaker 1: think was immediately taken by the police to the police 1230 01:08:15,880 --> 01:08:22,439 Speaker 1: station and question and then taken for a walk like 1231 01:08:22,600 --> 01:08:25,639 Speaker 1: there's some senior old Harris. Right. Yeah, there's some hinky 1232 01:08:25,800 --> 01:08:29,519 Speaker 1: conspiracy level stuff that you're like, whoa, Well, that doesn't 1233 01:08:29,800 --> 01:08:32,840 Speaker 1: doesn't make a lick of sense. And the thing about 1234 01:08:32,840 --> 01:08:35,679 Speaker 1: it is is when you got this smoothed up train, 1235 01:08:35,840 --> 01:08:38,320 Speaker 1: that's just literally I just twisted up piece of wreckage. 1236 01:08:38,760 --> 01:08:42,360 Speaker 1: It's gonna be really hard to prove mechanical failure. Although 1237 01:08:42,400 --> 01:08:46,040 Speaker 1: I gotta tell you people reconstruct crashed airplanes and they 1238 01:08:46,120 --> 01:08:48,960 Speaker 1: figured stuff out. That's true. Well here's the thing though. 1239 01:08:49,040 --> 01:08:52,479 Speaker 1: Here's the thing though, is that if you can let's suppose, 1240 01:08:52,560 --> 01:08:54,600 Speaker 1: for example, you're one of the head of say, the 1241 01:08:54,640 --> 01:08:57,800 Speaker 1: trade unions, and you're also you know, part of the 1242 01:08:57,800 --> 01:09:01,719 Speaker 1: transportation thing in the labor party. So this is your gig, 1243 01:09:01,960 --> 01:09:07,040 Speaker 1: your responsibility. Now, do you really want a detailed inquiry 1244 01:09:07,080 --> 01:09:09,960 Speaker 1: into what's really going on with all these maintenance issues 1245 01:09:10,040 --> 01:09:12,600 Speaker 1: and people stripping the trains and stealing craft? Do you 1246 01:09:12,640 --> 01:09:14,439 Speaker 1: really want that? Or do you want or do you 1247 01:09:14,479 --> 01:09:16,680 Speaker 1: want to put this issue to rest as quickly as 1248 01:09:16,720 --> 01:09:19,720 Speaker 1: you possibly can, which they did, Yeah, they sure did. 1249 01:09:20,200 --> 01:09:22,519 Speaker 1: Two days. I think it took me. Yeah, the in 1250 01:09:22,640 --> 01:09:26,360 Speaker 1: quest actually was four days including lunch breaks, which yeah, 1251 01:09:26,360 --> 01:09:28,400 Speaker 1: which which by the way, today would be you know, 1252 01:09:28,400 --> 01:09:30,840 Speaker 1: how long would it take? Eights? And well no, that's 1253 01:09:30,880 --> 01:09:34,200 Speaker 1: eight sixteen thirty two hours is the amount of time 1254 01:09:34,240 --> 01:09:38,160 Speaker 1: that it took to compile everything in sessions, where for 1255 01:09:38,880 --> 01:09:44,880 Speaker 1: today those investigations take one to three years. But yeah, 1256 01:09:45,000 --> 01:09:47,280 Speaker 1: the but know, that's the thing about it. To me, 1257 01:09:47,320 --> 01:09:50,720 Speaker 1: it was the whole by by getting it right out 1258 01:09:50,720 --> 01:09:53,000 Speaker 1: there right away. Oh saw the driver, he was just 1259 01:09:53,000 --> 01:09:56,400 Speaker 1: standing there staring straight ahead. Obviously he did it, you know, 1260 01:09:56,600 --> 01:09:59,640 Speaker 1: I mean that just that just obvious the need for 1261 01:09:59,680 --> 01:10:02,519 Speaker 1: any sort of strict inquiry into what was really going on. 1262 01:10:02,800 --> 01:10:05,639 Speaker 1: This guy obviously scurred up, is what they're saying. Yeah, 1263 01:10:05,680 --> 01:10:08,280 Speaker 1: and so yeah, and that headed off a lot of unpleasantness, 1264 01:10:08,479 --> 01:10:11,439 Speaker 1: a lot of unpleasantness for a lot of people. Yeah, No, no, 1265 01:10:11,600 --> 01:10:14,320 Speaker 1: you're you're absolutely right. It's not that crazy of a 1266 01:10:14,320 --> 01:10:17,519 Speaker 1: conspiracy theory. No, it's not, it's not. But I did 1267 01:10:17,760 --> 01:10:22,519 Speaker 1: I did read one other thing that made me wonder, 1268 01:10:22,840 --> 01:10:26,880 Speaker 1: maybe to a degree, if this they were right and 1269 01:10:26,960 --> 01:10:31,559 Speaker 1: it was operator error. And that's our final theory, which 1270 01:10:31,600 --> 01:10:34,720 Speaker 1: is that he made a massive mistake. So if we 1271 01:10:34,800 --> 01:10:37,280 Speaker 1: go back to controls of the train, we talked about 1272 01:10:37,400 --> 01:10:40,120 Speaker 1: how much pressure it takes to you know, to push 1273 01:10:40,160 --> 01:10:42,479 Speaker 1: it down from three o'clock and then once it's in 1274 01:10:42,479 --> 01:10:44,360 Speaker 1: the six o'clock position, you know a little bit of 1275 01:10:44,360 --> 01:10:46,800 Speaker 1: pressure to keep it down, but then to go to 1276 01:10:46,840 --> 01:10:50,360 Speaker 1: the nine o'clock position and to keep pressure downward, pressure 1277 01:10:50,360 --> 01:10:52,840 Speaker 1: on it is not easy because that's a straight arm thing. 1278 01:10:53,560 --> 01:10:56,360 Speaker 1: Let's say he's not doing what you suggested, which is 1279 01:10:56,640 --> 01:10:59,559 Speaker 1: leaning on it. Well, I'm I'm envisioning leaning on at 1280 01:10:59,560 --> 01:11:03,400 Speaker 1: six right, at nine, it would be hard. Well, at 1281 01:11:03,439 --> 01:11:04,960 Speaker 1: six o'clock it's right in front of you. Put your 1282 01:11:05,040 --> 01:11:09,679 Speaker 1: arms straight down on right right. Okay, So let's let's 1283 01:11:09,680 --> 01:11:12,639 Speaker 1: go back to the engines, and briefly I talked about 1284 01:11:12,720 --> 01:11:15,759 Speaker 1: they had a low gear and kind of a high 1285 01:11:15,760 --> 01:11:19,400 Speaker 1: gear scenario, so the electric engines, just to get the 1286 01:11:19,439 --> 01:11:23,320 Speaker 1: details covered they had. This is from I'm not an 1287 01:11:23,320 --> 01:11:27,160 Speaker 1: electrical engineer, so please nobody, you know, just put me 1288 01:11:27,200 --> 01:11:30,439 Speaker 1: on the spit for this. But actually that their motors 1289 01:11:30,479 --> 01:11:32,720 Speaker 1: not engines. Not just if you don't want people like 1290 01:11:32,760 --> 01:11:35,120 Speaker 1: you know, making fun of or for Joe to put 1291 01:11:35,160 --> 01:11:37,519 Speaker 1: me on the engine the thing because I called it 1292 01:11:38,120 --> 01:11:41,519 Speaker 1: a an engine instead of a motor, or it's a 1293 01:11:41,520 --> 01:11:46,120 Speaker 1: motor not an engine, or the other way around exactly. Okay, 1294 01:11:46,439 --> 01:11:50,520 Speaker 1: So the point is is that for it from electrical perspective, 1295 01:11:50,880 --> 01:11:53,639 Speaker 1: they had what they referred to as full series, which 1296 01:11:53,680 --> 01:11:58,040 Speaker 1: was the low gear, and then there was par full parallel, 1297 01:11:58,360 --> 01:12:01,240 Speaker 1: which was the high gear the nine o'clock position. Well, 1298 01:12:01,280 --> 01:12:05,760 Speaker 1: there was an interesting little catch in the whole system, 1299 01:12:05,840 --> 01:12:09,720 Speaker 1: which is that once the control was at that nine 1300 01:12:09,760 --> 01:12:14,160 Speaker 1: o'clock full parallel position the high gear, the driver could 1301 01:12:14,720 --> 01:12:18,560 Speaker 1: pull the handle back to the six o'clock position, and 1302 01:12:18,680 --> 01:12:22,799 Speaker 1: as long as nothing interrupted to the speed of the train, 1303 01:12:23,479 --> 01:12:26,400 Speaker 1: it would stay in high gear. So even though it 1304 01:12:26,400 --> 01:12:30,040 Speaker 1: should be transitioning down the low gear, unless the driver 1305 01:12:30,160 --> 01:12:33,439 Speaker 1: moved it back towards three o'clock to disengage the motors 1306 01:12:33,520 --> 01:12:37,320 Speaker 1: and reset it, it would stay in high gear. So 1307 01:12:37,400 --> 01:12:39,920 Speaker 1: what kind of kind of like neutralized as a whole 1308 01:12:39,920 --> 01:12:42,479 Speaker 1: dead man switched thing up. Well, it does to a 1309 01:12:42,560 --> 01:12:44,800 Speaker 1: degree because now it's well, drivers did it all the 1310 01:12:44,800 --> 01:12:47,040 Speaker 1: time because it's much you you cycle up, you get 1311 01:12:47,080 --> 01:12:48,400 Speaker 1: to speed, and then you pull it back to the 1312 01:12:48,439 --> 01:12:50,720 Speaker 1: six o'clock from nine to six, and you put your 1313 01:12:50,720 --> 01:12:52,559 Speaker 1: elbow on it, lean on it right, because it's much 1314 01:12:52,600 --> 01:12:57,000 Speaker 1: easier to hold at six o'clock than the nine o'clock position. Well, 1315 01:12:57,040 --> 01:13:00,280 Speaker 1: I wondered, because about a week prior to the this 1316 01:13:00,320 --> 01:13:02,040 Speaker 1: whole thing, and I think it was the Monday of 1317 01:13:02,080 --> 01:13:05,640 Speaker 1: that week, or maybe the monday before, he was reported 1318 01:13:05,680 --> 01:13:09,400 Speaker 1: to have missed a stop by several cars. He didn't 1319 01:13:09,439 --> 01:13:13,479 Speaker 1: stop in time, and he hadn't been on the job 1320 01:13:13,560 --> 01:13:15,400 Speaker 1: but a year, and doesn't sound like he was doing 1321 01:13:15,439 --> 01:13:18,360 Speaker 1: any of the major lines. But if the experienced guys 1322 01:13:18,400 --> 01:13:21,280 Speaker 1: are doing this and somebody says, oh, hey, Newson, here's dude, 1323 01:13:21,560 --> 01:13:24,360 Speaker 1: here's a trick. This will make so you're not keeping 1324 01:13:24,400 --> 01:13:27,040 Speaker 1: your arm locked out, your shoulders not gonna hurt YadA 1325 01:13:27,120 --> 01:13:29,840 Speaker 1: YadA YadA. Tells him how to do it, but he 1326 01:13:29,920 --> 01:13:35,120 Speaker 1: doesn't get exactly how the motors and the pattern works. 1327 01:13:35,160 --> 01:13:37,320 Speaker 1: So he thinks, okay, I pulled it into the six 1328 01:13:37,360 --> 01:13:40,240 Speaker 1: o'clock position. We're going, and he thinks the processes he 1329 01:13:40,280 --> 01:13:44,160 Speaker 1: has to have go from nine to six to three 1330 01:13:44,280 --> 01:13:48,720 Speaker 1: to disengage the motor incorrectly rather than just kicking it 1331 01:13:48,840 --> 01:13:51,880 Speaker 1: over to the compremately. He just has the timing wrong. 1332 01:13:52,360 --> 01:13:55,759 Speaker 1: He has something about the or the operation of that 1333 01:13:55,760 --> 01:13:59,519 Speaker 1: that little trick wrong. He could have stopped late that 1334 01:13:59,800 --> 01:14:02,040 Speaker 1: time a week ago and then said, well let me 1335 01:14:02,040 --> 01:14:05,880 Speaker 1: give it a try again, and accidentally put it, you know, 1336 01:14:05,920 --> 01:14:08,840 Speaker 1: not understanding put it into high gear and kept it 1337 01:14:08,880 --> 01:14:12,200 Speaker 1: into high gear when he thought that he was shifting 1338 01:14:12,240 --> 01:14:16,920 Speaker 1: it into low or just something broke off inside. Well, yeah, again, 1339 01:14:17,000 --> 01:14:19,080 Speaker 1: that's at the mechanical level. I just looked at this 1340 01:14:19,120 --> 01:14:21,639 Speaker 1: and thought, well, this is this is behavior that drivers 1341 01:14:21,800 --> 01:14:25,679 Speaker 1: did to operate. I wonder if a guy not knowing 1342 01:14:26,160 --> 01:14:30,040 Speaker 1: the right way to do that trick could completely screw 1343 01:14:30,120 --> 01:14:35,720 Speaker 1: it up. I have simple trial, especially when you have 1344 01:14:35,800 --> 01:14:39,320 Speaker 1: a break right there. You know that's true, except I 1345 01:14:39,400 --> 01:14:42,400 Speaker 1: see people driving down the street. The simple thing is 1346 01:14:42,439 --> 01:14:44,760 Speaker 1: you make a turn and if your turn signal doesn't 1347 01:14:44,800 --> 01:14:47,240 Speaker 1: turn off, you turn your turn signal off. Yet I 1348 01:14:47,280 --> 01:14:50,200 Speaker 1: see people driving down the freeway for fifteen minutes with 1349 01:14:50,240 --> 01:14:54,240 Speaker 1: their damn turn signal. That's a simple thing, but doesn't 1350 01:14:54,280 --> 01:14:56,240 Speaker 1: mean people do it right. I recently found out that 1351 01:14:56,360 --> 01:15:00,960 Speaker 1: newer cars often don't have a sound associated with blinkers. Really, yeah, 1352 01:15:01,120 --> 01:15:04,360 Speaker 1: so that explains why people are not doing that, because 1353 01:15:04,400 --> 01:15:07,200 Speaker 1: they don't know that they're blinkers only for cars that are, 1354 01:15:07,400 --> 01:15:09,280 Speaker 1: you know, two or three years old, not for the 1355 01:15:09,360 --> 01:15:12,000 Speaker 1: last sixty years of history. I know that. For me, 1356 01:15:12,080 --> 01:15:15,719 Speaker 1: it's something about my my particular hype. The my steering 1357 01:15:15,720 --> 01:15:20,400 Speaker 1: wheel always blocks the turn signal indicator. You can adjust that, yeah, 1358 01:15:20,479 --> 01:15:23,640 Speaker 1: but yeah, but I haven't. But and and so I do. 1359 01:15:23,840 --> 01:15:25,559 Speaker 1: I found myself doing that sometimes if I'm on the 1360 01:15:25,600 --> 01:15:27,720 Speaker 1: freeway because I'm getting so much freeway now as I 1361 01:15:27,760 --> 01:15:30,160 Speaker 1: can't hear it, you know, and I can't see it 1362 01:15:30,200 --> 01:15:32,280 Speaker 1: because the steering wheels blocking it. So I just like, 1363 01:15:32,439 --> 01:15:36,599 Speaker 1: so I just think back to the theory. The point 1364 01:15:36,720 --> 01:15:38,720 Speaker 1: is that I think that there may have been he 1365 01:15:38,840 --> 01:15:42,000 Speaker 1: may have screwed up in trying to do something with 1366 01:15:42,040 --> 01:15:44,400 Speaker 1: the control. I don't know if this is something wrong 1367 01:15:44,439 --> 01:15:47,240 Speaker 1: with me or like what, But I'm way more prone 1368 01:15:47,280 --> 01:15:52,760 Speaker 1: to believe that there's like wide systematic problems with steelings 1369 01:15:53,000 --> 01:15:56,280 Speaker 1: that people wanted to keep quiet about, Yeah, than like 1370 01:15:56,439 --> 01:15:59,439 Speaker 1: one dude who seems like a wholesome guy making a 1371 01:15:59,479 --> 01:16:01,720 Speaker 1: big mistake like that. I think I would think that 1372 01:16:02,560 --> 01:16:04,040 Speaker 1: if it were me and I was heading to the 1373 01:16:04,120 --> 01:16:05,640 Speaker 1: end of the line and a dead end, and not 1374 01:16:05,800 --> 01:16:09,280 Speaker 1: by the dead end we made solid wall brick wall, 1375 01:16:09,760 --> 01:16:14,400 Speaker 1: I would be more inclined to use, you know, the 1376 01:16:14,439 --> 01:16:17,320 Speaker 1: balls out thing earlier in the line and then say 1377 01:16:17,400 --> 01:16:19,600 Speaker 1: and be a little more conservative as my in my 1378 01:16:19,640 --> 01:16:22,160 Speaker 1: approach to the final station at the end of the line. Yeah, 1379 01:16:22,200 --> 01:16:24,360 Speaker 1: I guess I I agree, I wouldn't be trying out 1380 01:16:24,400 --> 01:16:31,040 Speaker 1: that new thing. What I understand, it sounds like Newson 1381 01:16:31,200 --> 01:16:35,400 Speaker 1: was working the short run a lot, so maybe he 1382 01:16:35,479 --> 01:16:36,920 Speaker 1: had been told that he was going to give the 1383 01:16:36,920 --> 01:16:39,720 Speaker 1: opportunity to work one of the longer lines, and he 1384 01:16:39,760 --> 01:16:42,000 Speaker 1: wanted to figure this thing out before he was on 1385 01:16:42,040 --> 01:16:45,439 Speaker 1: the longer line, and it was a bad idea. Again, 1386 01:16:45,640 --> 01:16:47,720 Speaker 1: I don't think that's what it is. But because I 1387 01:16:47,800 --> 01:16:52,400 Speaker 1: read about that driving habit, it always it piques my 1388 01:16:52,479 --> 01:16:54,519 Speaker 1: interest and I have to ask, I always have to 1389 01:16:54,560 --> 01:16:58,599 Speaker 1: ask the question. I still it seems like even if 1390 01:16:58,640 --> 01:17:00,720 Speaker 1: he's sort of forgotten the whole thing, he still would 1391 01:17:00,760 --> 01:17:03,160 Speaker 1: have figured it out before the end, you would think, so, yeah, 1392 01:17:03,479 --> 01:17:06,200 Speaker 1: which it makes me inclined to believe that either something 1393 01:17:06,320 --> 01:17:09,120 Speaker 1: was wrong with the drive system or something was wrong 1394 01:17:09,160 --> 01:17:12,640 Speaker 1: with brakes. The weird thing about the drive system is 1395 01:17:12,680 --> 01:17:16,200 Speaker 1: you remember how I talked about the motors engines or 1396 01:17:16,200 --> 01:17:20,400 Speaker 1: motors motors? Okay, the motors. They have the full parallel 1397 01:17:20,439 --> 01:17:23,120 Speaker 1: and the high gear and the low gear full parallel series. 1398 01:17:24,640 --> 01:17:26,800 Speaker 1: Don't ask me, Joe, no, no, I know what they mean. 1399 01:17:26,920 --> 01:17:28,720 Speaker 1: But the question is are we talking about more than 1400 01:17:28,720 --> 01:17:31,280 Speaker 1: one motor or more than one battery or both? I 1401 01:17:31,320 --> 01:17:34,320 Speaker 1: don't ask me. What I want to talk about is 1402 01:17:34,360 --> 01:17:39,480 Speaker 1: the fact that when the wheels of the train disconnected 1403 01:17:39,560 --> 01:17:43,880 Speaker 1: from the track, it reset the motor to whatever the 1404 01:17:44,120 --> 01:17:48,400 Speaker 1: current setting of the drive control is. So, for example, 1405 01:17:48,479 --> 01:17:51,000 Speaker 1: if it's in high gear, or it thinks it's in 1406 01:17:51,080 --> 01:17:53,880 Speaker 1: high gear, but the drivers put it in low and 1407 01:17:53,960 --> 01:17:58,160 Speaker 1: it runs across that X, the motor disconnects from the 1408 01:17:58,200 --> 01:18:01,240 Speaker 1: system momentarily as it goes over the as gaps, which 1409 01:18:01,240 --> 01:18:04,360 Speaker 1: would drop it into low gear because that's why that's 1410 01:18:04,600 --> 01:18:09,040 Speaker 1: receiving electrical input from Yes, yes, which makes me what 1411 01:18:09,280 --> 01:18:11,960 Speaker 1: makes me not quite a hundred percent sure that I 1412 01:18:12,000 --> 01:18:15,240 Speaker 1: believe that there was a breakage or a lock up 1413 01:18:15,320 --> 01:18:19,120 Speaker 1: in the dry control system, and more inclined to think 1414 01:18:19,120 --> 01:18:23,400 Speaker 1: that maybe there was something wrong with the breaking system. Yeah, 1415 01:18:23,439 --> 01:18:24,920 Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know either. I think we've 1416 01:18:24,960 --> 01:18:26,479 Speaker 1: gotta need to take a trip to London. I think 1417 01:18:26,479 --> 01:18:27,840 Speaker 1: they have one of these things in museum and we 1418 01:18:27,880 --> 01:18:29,360 Speaker 1: could take it apart. We just go to the Isle 1419 01:18:29,400 --> 01:18:32,479 Speaker 1: of Wight. Yeah, we're running around on the Isle of Wight. Yeah, 1420 01:18:32,840 --> 01:18:34,680 Speaker 1: they're even up above ground, so we don't even have 1421 01:18:34,760 --> 01:18:36,880 Speaker 1: to get you know, dirty in the tunnel in coral 1422 01:18:36,880 --> 01:18:40,439 Speaker 1: around and look at this. I'll do it. Yeah, alright, Okay, 1423 01:18:41,200 --> 01:18:43,720 Speaker 1: well we've we've exhausted this one. Yeah, I'm gonna go. 1424 01:18:43,800 --> 01:18:46,400 Speaker 1: But yeah, final theory, I'm gonna go for the conspiracy 1425 01:18:46,520 --> 01:18:49,439 Speaker 1: to just hush hush up a lot of mouthfeasance. I agree, 1426 01:18:50,000 --> 01:18:54,759 Speaker 1: it's malfeasance for malfeasance's sake, malfeasance all around it. Okay, 1427 01:18:54,760 --> 01:18:58,519 Speaker 1: so well, if you want to read any of the 1428 01:18:58,560 --> 01:19:01,400 Speaker 1: material that we have, we will be putting at least 1429 01:19:01,439 --> 01:19:04,080 Speaker 1: some of the links up on our website. The website 1430 01:19:04,200 --> 01:19:08,200 Speaker 1: is of course Thinking Sideways podcast dot com. You can 1431 01:19:08,600 --> 01:19:10,959 Speaker 1: look through all of our episodes. We have an episode 1432 01:19:11,000 --> 01:19:13,519 Speaker 1: list available as an individual page, so you can search 1433 01:19:13,520 --> 01:19:16,240 Speaker 1: through their fine stories you want. We also have other 1434 01:19:16,280 --> 01:19:20,200 Speaker 1: stuff on the website such as merchandise, so through Zazzle 1435 01:19:20,320 --> 01:19:24,800 Speaker 1: and red Bubble we have shirts and mugs and all 1436 01:19:24,880 --> 01:19:27,920 Speaker 1: kinds of different things available stickers, so go through that 1437 01:19:28,000 --> 01:19:31,519 Speaker 1: and look through those. We will of course have this 1438 01:19:31,560 --> 01:19:35,439 Speaker 1: episode on all of the streaming services, so if you're 1439 01:19:35,560 --> 01:19:40,719 Speaker 1: using Stitcher or Google Play or whatever service you want, 1440 01:19:40,840 --> 01:19:42,720 Speaker 1: we are on there and so you can find all 1441 01:19:42,760 --> 01:19:46,160 Speaker 1: the back catalog. Were of course also on iTunes, which 1442 01:19:46,200 --> 01:19:48,439 Speaker 1: is where a lot of folks find us. If you're 1443 01:19:48,479 --> 01:19:51,160 Speaker 1: on iTunes, your your user of iTunes, do take the 1444 01:19:51,240 --> 01:19:54,000 Speaker 1: time to leave a comment and a rating. That does 1445 01:19:54,040 --> 01:19:56,200 Speaker 1: help us out and then helps other folks find the show, 1446 01:19:56,240 --> 01:19:59,080 Speaker 1: which is the most important thing. We are on all 1447 01:19:59,120 --> 01:20:01,760 Speaker 1: of the social media, so we're on Twitter at Think 1448 01:20:01,880 --> 01:20:04,559 Speaker 1: in Sideways without the G in the middle. We were 1449 01:20:04,600 --> 01:20:08,920 Speaker 1: on Facebook with Facebook group and Facebook page, so like 1450 01:20:09,080 --> 01:20:12,800 Speaker 1: the page, joined the group. Lots of fun conversations constantly 1451 01:20:12,800 --> 01:20:17,200 Speaker 1: going on about in there, and you've got questions, you've 1452 01:20:17,240 --> 01:20:20,000 Speaker 1: got concerns, you disagree with the theory, or you have 1453 01:20:20,040 --> 01:20:22,519 Speaker 1: a theory of your own, feel free to let us know. 1454 01:20:22,760 --> 01:20:25,760 Speaker 1: You can send us an email. Our email address is 1455 01:20:25,920 --> 01:20:30,719 Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways podcast at gmail dot com. And we're still 1456 01:20:30,760 --> 01:20:33,880 Speaker 1: replying to every email. We're getting slower about it, but 1457 01:20:33,960 --> 01:20:37,839 Speaker 1: we're still replying to every email that comes through. Sometimes 1458 01:20:37,840 --> 01:20:43,680 Speaker 1: it takes a couple of days or something. So I 1459 01:20:43,760 --> 01:20:46,679 Speaker 1: guess with that, I'm gonna motor on out of here 1460 01:20:49,040 --> 01:20:56,120 Speaker 1: for me. Yeah, I'm just gonna say, man,