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Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,

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Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of

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Speaker 1: today's best minds. And Attorney General Pam Bondi has shuddered

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Speaker 1: the FBI's Foreign Interference Act. They just don't want to

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Speaker 1: know about it. We have such a great show for

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Speaker 1: you today. The Lincoln Project's own Rick Wilson joins us

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Speaker 1: to discuss Trump's voters learning about his agenda in real time.

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Speaker 1: Then we'll talk to more perfect unions. Josh Miller lewis

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Speaker 1: about the lobbying firm funneling massive influence into Donald Trump's

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Speaker 1: White House. But first the.

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Speaker 2: News Smiley federal employees say they had to justify their

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Speaker 2: existence to Doege College freshmen in fifteen minute interviews. This

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Speaker 2: is a common thing when private equity comes in. I

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Speaker 2: remember there was this documentary about when Bain came to town,

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Speaker 2: you know, and McKinsey time that this is what they do.

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Speaker 1: End.

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Speaker 3: Uh.

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Speaker 2: Well, we're now seeing that culture spread to the US government.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Elon has decided that he is going to make

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Speaker 1: the government efficient. I want to pause for a minute

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Speaker 1: and just talk about efficiency. What is efficiency? So efficiency

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Speaker 1: is in Elon Musk's mind. What he did to X right,

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Speaker 1: he took out the things, the bells and whistles, the

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Speaker 1: things that he felt didn't add to it. So now

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Speaker 1: you get spam and now you sometimes the messages go down,

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Speaker 1: but you know it ultimately works, but it works not

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Speaker 1: as well as it used to. This is sort of

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Speaker 1: I think, his hope for the federal government. But what

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Speaker 1: I think you have to realize about this, And we

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Speaker 1: saw this play out in real time right today when

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Speaker 1: he was tweeting against me. Was like, I said, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's the richest man in the world cutting cancer research,

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Speaker 1: and he was like, no, I'm not. And here's the thing.

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Speaker 1: He's cutting part of the National Institute of Health, right,

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Speaker 1: and it's considered to be overhead. But overhead is like

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Speaker 1: leaning the labs and renting the space and paying for

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Speaker 1: the scientists. Like this is overhead. And the idea here

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Speaker 1: is when you start messing with grants, you start messing

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Speaker 1: with research, and there's less money for research. Now you

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Speaker 1: might have an argument that the government shouldn't be funding

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Speaker 1: cancer research. I would say that is really so stupid,

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Speaker 1: but you could, you know, you could go down this

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Speaker 1: path of what does the government do. But it really

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Speaker 1: isn't up to the richest man in the world, despite

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Speaker 1: how rich he is, to decide what the government should

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Speaker 1: and should not do. Right, We elected people to do

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Speaker 1: that job, and they are not doing it because and

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Speaker 1: I think this is really important when you think about

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Speaker 1: the Republicans in Congress right now, they couldn't legislate this,

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Speaker 1: and so they're just doing it anyway. And there is

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Speaker 1: not a public appetite for less cancer research. There is

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Speaker 1: not a public right. There's just not People aren't like, oh,

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Speaker 1: people were just doing too well with our cancer treatments here.

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Speaker 2: I would love to just see people in my life

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Speaker 2: die because the richest man on earth wants to pay

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Speaker 2: less taxes.

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Speaker 1: Well, And it's also just like even if you ideologically

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Speaker 1: believe that the government should be smaller, I mean, we

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Speaker 1: talk about this so much when we talk about Project

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty five, right, Project twenty twenty five, the Grand

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Speaker 1: Plan to dismantle the administrative state, to end government oversight,

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Speaker 1: but also to end you know, the things that nobody

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Speaker 1: really wants to end, right, cancer research, that kind of

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Speaker 1: stuff because it's expensive and because they don't really feel

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Speaker 1: the government should be paying for that stuff. So when

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Speaker 1: you go down that rabbit hole, the question is where

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Speaker 1: does it end? And then also if it's not being

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Speaker 1: done by elected people, but it's just being done by

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Speaker 1: random rich people, how is that constitutionally okay? And how

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Speaker 1: is that legal? And why even have elected officials right

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Speaker 1: if they are not allowed to control the power of

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Speaker 1: the purse, if they are not legislating, I mean, what

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Speaker 1: are they even doing? Like, and so we're watching here.

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Speaker 1: Besides the fact is very scary because there will be

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Speaker 1: a lot of government services lost, and that will be

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Speaker 1: things like you know, healthcare for veterans, science. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you'll see people in red states where the university is

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Speaker 1: the big employer in the state suddenly panicking because there

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Speaker 1: will be job lost, there will be financial ruin, there

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Speaker 1: will be you know this all this will actually trickle up,

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Speaker 1: believe it or not, to billionaires eventually, but it will

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Speaker 1: also trickle up to the people who are elected to handle.

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Speaker 2: This crashes the economy, which has a lot of potential aduces.

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Speaker 2: These are people are high value spenders of the economy, right,

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Speaker 2: and they're.

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Speaker 1: Also remember like you lose these scientists, they don't come back.

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Speaker 1: I mean, that's the brain drain. Question, right, like, what

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Speaker 1: does it look like to lose scientists? What does any

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Speaker 1: of this look like? And so, I mean, that's what

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Speaker 1: we're setting ourselves up for. So this is the accelerationist

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Speaker 1: case for trump Ism, is that, like, it's better to

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Speaker 1: have him crash and burn now than to slowly lash

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Speaker 1: the federal government the way of John Roberts might. But

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Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not convinced that there's any good coming

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Speaker 1: from any of this.

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Speaker 2: So a federal judge, though, has blocked Doze from accessing

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Speaker 2: Treasury Department records after nineteen States of sued Trump after

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Speaker 2: nineteen states of sued Trump's administration for this, But it

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Speaker 2: also has come with a lot of Elon having rage tweets.

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Speaker 1: What's important to realize here is that none of this

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Speaker 1: is legal. Just because Elon is very rich doesn't mean

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Speaker 1: he gets to just completely rewrite the way we do government.

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Speaker 1: And what is important about this story is that we

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Speaker 1: have these Democratic attorneys generals And remember this summer, Jesse

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Speaker 1: and I interviewed one of them who was talking to

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Speaker 1: us before we were reporting about how they were ready

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Speaker 1: because they really thought that the Democrat was going to

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Speaker 1: lose and that Trump was going to win again. And

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Speaker 1: that was why these blue state attorney generals were getting

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Speaker 1: together and planning the lawsuits that they were going to

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Speaker 1: have to file. They were really organized to fight back

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Speaker 1: against a lot of this stuff. And that's what we're

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Speaker 1: seeing here. So, look, this judge ruled against Elon and

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Speaker 1: doage because it's not okay. Now what's going to happen

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Speaker 1: now is that you know, Muscus is tweeting against him

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Speaker 1: and saying he's a corrupt judge protecting corruption. And again

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Speaker 1: this is like really important here. Part of the double speak,

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Speaker 1: the sort of Orwellian double speak that these people engage in,

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Speaker 1: is this idea that you know, if you are against this,

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Speaker 1: then you are for corruption, that you're if you're against

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Speaker 1: because this is all about how they're going to make

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Speaker 1: the government more efficient. And if you're against efficiency, then

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Speaker 1: your four waste. It's not true and also it's not correct.

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Speaker 1: And also it's just completely not right. And so that's

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Speaker 1: what I would say is like, don't do not, do

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Speaker 1: not do not into this, do not trust it. And

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Speaker 1: also like this judge is doing the right thing because

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Speaker 1: this is illegal. So now are they trying to set

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Speaker 1: the table to ignore the court order? Very possibly. I

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Speaker 1: think that's very likely.

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Speaker 2: They're definitely trying to establish a culture of that being okay.

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Speaker 2: On Twitter through Vans and Charlie Kirk tweets yep.

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Speaker 1: This judge said that it's not okay. But you know,

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Speaker 1: it's interesting. I mean. The other thing that's really interesting

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Speaker 1: a lot of the laws that are being used to

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Speaker 1: correct this corruption or to fight this corruption, or laws

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Speaker 1: that were put in place after Nixon. So we have

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Speaker 1: this violation of the Privacy Act of nineteen seventy four,

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Speaker 1: that's another one of these, after the Empowerment Act, another

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Speaker 1: one of these post Nicksonian reforms, and then the Tax

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Speaker 1: Will Reform Act of nineteen seventy six, as well as

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Speaker 1: other laws. The lawsuits are used also that don't access

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Speaker 1: poses security risks, and you and I both know that

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Speaker 1: these guys are all like, very young, these hackers. One

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Speaker 1: got fire for not respecting privacy at a different job.

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Speaker 1: One tweeted racist stuff. I mean, there's a pretty good

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Speaker 1: case for why the people who are messing with all

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Speaker 1: of our computers should have some kind of security clearance.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Fun stuff.

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Speaker 2: So one of the first actions of O and B

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Speaker 2: director Russell Vought is to get rid of the CFPB.

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Speaker 2: I see just earlier today he tweeted that it is

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Speaker 2: a woke and weaponized agency against disfavored industries and individuals

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Speaker 2: for a long time, and it must end because making

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Speaker 2: sure banks don't charge you extra fees and things like that.

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Speaker 4: Very woke, very woke.

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Speaker 1: Very woke. Yes, anti corruption, very woke. Look, this is again.

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Speaker 1: We are in this world where everything up is down

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Speaker 1: and left is right and anything they don't like is woke.

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Speaker 2: And here we are really is the case for uh,

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Speaker 2: they have a hammer and everything is a nail with

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Speaker 2: the word.

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Speaker 1: That's the woke mind virus to you, baby. Rick Wilson

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Speaker 1: is the founder of the Lincoln Project and the host

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Speaker 1: of the Enemy's List Welcome Back, Too Fast Politics, Rick.

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Speaker 3: Wilson, John, you sound phenomenal. It was good to see this.

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Speaker 3: Last week.

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Speaker 1: Yes, Rick and I went to a book festival called

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Speaker 1: the Rancho Mirage Writers Festival together and we had a

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Speaker 1: great time.

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Speaker 3: We did have a great time. Did not like what we.

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Speaker 1: Said about him, did not like what we said on stage.

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Speaker 4: Somebody was like, send me a message there like, well,

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Speaker 4: it's your fault because you used to work for like,

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Speaker 4: for fuck's sake, We've been doing this for a decade now,

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Speaker 4: and if you'd been there, you would have seen us

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Speaker 4: spanking him.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, he's such an interesting character. Whatever. Let's

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Speaker 1: not talk about Karl Rove, who cares so, but let's

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Speaker 1: talk about Republicans dismantling our government. One of the things

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Speaker 1: I'm struck by is so the Doge project is cutting

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Speaker 1: billions of dollars of wasteful spending, like research into cancer.

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Speaker 4: Obviously cancer being so woke and all woke cancer, wolke cancer,

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Speaker 4: the woke mind virus. I think we are seeing right

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Speaker 4: now that it is not yet sunk in at the

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Speaker 4: state level. What is going to happen here and in

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Speaker 4: states across the country where there are billions of dollars

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Speaker 4: of NIH grants that do not go to Antifa or

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Speaker 4: whatever imaginary demon they have out there. They go to

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Speaker 4: universities that do the cancer research and the scientific research,

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Speaker 4: and the physics research and the computer science research that

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Speaker 4: has made so many people's lives so much better.

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Speaker 1: And it's made America great. Let's if we're gonna worry

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Speaker 1: about American greatness.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, if we're going to actually talk about American greatness,

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Speaker 4: one of the things that made to America great is

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Speaker 4: that we have great research labs all over this country

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Speaker 4: doing great work. And once again, isn't some weird fantasy like, oh,

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Speaker 4: they're all researching lesbian boot Brazilian pan flute music. They

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Speaker 4: are out there looking for the cures to cancer at

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Speaker 4: Alzheimer's and everything else. And all those things that happen

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Speaker 4: at these labs, they are then materially made into research

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Speaker 4: that goes to pharmaceutical companies and technology companies and healthcare

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Speaker 4: systems and doctors and nurses and all of it, Every

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Speaker 4: single bit of it is not about some political agenda.

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Speaker 4: It's about helping people's lives become better.

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Speaker 1: Well, it's about science, right, It's about science. So even

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Speaker 1: if it's not necessarily you know, science, the science that

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Speaker 1: sends rockets, the science that Elon.

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Speaker 5: Uses well, by the way, by the way, by the way,

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Speaker 5: you know, I have to tell you, Elon Musk directly

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Speaker 5: benefits every single day, materially benefits from the research that

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Speaker 5: was done by National Science Foundation grants over and over

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Speaker 5: and over getting.

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Speaker 1: Which is why this is such a mind truck.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Well, and look, I am still waiting for the day

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Speaker 4: and we are starting to hear a little bit of

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Speaker 4: this now. Like I was following some stuff this morning

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Speaker 4: about these Georgia soybean farmers who are the reddest of

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Speaker 4: red states, right, saying things like wait what, we're losing

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Speaker 4: our what?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 4: All this money they've made over the years selling soybeans

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Speaker 4: for overseas markets through aid. Oh my goodness, Suddenly, wo

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Speaker 4: kid is a good thing?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that this is where we are. I mean,

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Speaker 1: this is sort of the craziest part of it is

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Speaker 1: that it's.

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Speaker 3: Just the goofiest timeline.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. But I mean it's also really worrying. And there's

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Speaker 1: a real war on their credits, which is scary, right,

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Speaker 1: I mean that's a real thing. And there is also

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Speaker 1: a real, you know, war on the truths what little

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Speaker 1: is left of it. So let's talk about that for

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Speaker 1: a minute.

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Speaker 6: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Look, I mean, Molly, I think we are right now.

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Speaker 4: If you're going to play the game that Elon and

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Speaker 4: Donald and everybody else is playing, you have to have

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Speaker 4: a contempt for the truth. You have to have a

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Speaker 4: hatred almost for the truth, because you don't wake up

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Speaker 4: in the morning and think, hey, we're going to tell

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Speaker 4: both sides of this lie, and that's going to be

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Speaker 4: equally valid. It's not equally valid. The lie is the

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Speaker 4: lie is the lie, and so so much of this

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Speaker 4: stuff that we're seeing right now. Elon I said, oh,

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Speaker 4: sixty thousand people took the offer that cuts thirty billion dollars. Well,

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Speaker 4: the average federal salary is about sixty five thousand dollars,

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Speaker 4: and sixty five thousand times thirty five thousand is about

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Speaker 4: three point one billion dollars or somewhere in that neighborhood.

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Speaker 4: So it's become very Trumpian, it's become very exaggerated and

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Speaker 4: hyper you know, hyper focused on the on the can

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Speaker 4: we make the Libs cry harder every minute of the day.

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Speaker 4: And I just I think we are right now on

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Speaker 4: a terrible position as a country because for Republicans, the

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Speaker 4: reflexive defense of Trump on everything has now applied to

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Speaker 4: Elon as this guy starts to tear apart the things

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Speaker 4: that they have done in their states and districts. Because

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Speaker 4: even the most dickhead hate fuederal spending, even ran Paul

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Speaker 4: Okay every year is saying going home and saying, by

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Speaker 4: the way, I just got this amazing thing. We're going

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Speaker 4: to build these three bridges in our district. We're gonna

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Speaker 4: provide x number of student lunches in our district. Our

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Speaker 4: state's going to now get a research grant to study

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Speaker 4: Alzheimer's or whatever it is. And the disconnect right now

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Speaker 4: between whether Republicans believe in that they that they represent

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Speaker 4: their constituents anymore is more increasing is increasingly like obvious

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Speaker 4: to me, they don't and they don't want to.

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Speaker 3: They want to.

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Speaker 4: They want to please Trump. Yes, yes, my lord, Donald,

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Speaker 4: only you can save us, blah blah blah, and did

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Speaker 4: I please you today, my lord? It's crazy, but that

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Speaker 4: is what it is.

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Speaker 1: So one of the things happening right now is we're

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Speaker 1: getting ready for the Republicans to ignore the courts. That's

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Speaker 1: what we're seeing online is that the Republicans are trying

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Speaker 1: to make the case that they shouldn't have to rely

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Speaker 1: on the courts, that the Cords are not legit because

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Speaker 1: of one reason or another. One of the things I

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Speaker 1: love about the sort of brain trust here is that

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Speaker 1: they're for they'll like sort of jump around, so you'll say,

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Speaker 1: last night I tweeted about Elon and cancer research, and

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Speaker 1: Elon was very mad and saw that what are you

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Speaker 1: talking about? And then his people were like, cancer research

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Speaker 1: is for cocks.

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Speaker 7: You know.

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Speaker 1: They were like they couldn't quite message it. So they

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Speaker 1: were like, he's not doing that, you mainstream media liar, right,

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Speaker 1: even though like he's.

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Speaker 3: Delayed, he's absolutely well.

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Speaker 1: He's writing about, you know that we're going to cut

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Speaker 1: the NIH which is cancer research, among other things. And

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Speaker 1: then his people are like, private companies should do cancer research.

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Speaker 1: The government has has the cure for cancer. They're just

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Speaker 1: not letting you know, like the.

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Speaker 3: Oh, yes, of course, yes.

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Speaker 1: The response range was so incredibly shade, and yes, it

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Speaker 1: was such a big range that it was clear that

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Speaker 1: they just didn't know how to message it.

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Speaker 6: Right.

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Speaker 4: No, I don't think they do know how to message it, Molly.

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Speaker 4: I think that's part of the problem here, is that

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Speaker 4: they've had a long window where trump Ism was actually

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Speaker 4: a bit disconnected from real impact in their lives. So

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Speaker 4: when during COVID, right, there was a connection between the

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Speaker 4: craziness and the dusts. But now there's a sense, I

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Speaker 4: think that that they're going to have to go out

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Speaker 4: there and work hard to spend the damage that's being done.

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Speaker 4: And this is not about just so everybody's clear on this,

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Speaker 4: this is not about the size of government or about

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Speaker 4: government waste. No one literally a constituency for government waste

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Speaker 4: is zero. There is no one who believes the government

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Speaker 4: waste is.

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Speaker 3: Bad or is good?

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Speaker 1: Is good government waste?

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Speaker 4: Right but right now, what we are seeing from Elon

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Speaker 4: and company, I think is incrediblely silly and dangerous moment

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Speaker 4: because nothing about what he's doing comes down to any

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Speaker 4: sort of sensible approach to governance. And I know that's

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Speaker 4: really hard for August to accept as that you should

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Speaker 4: be sensible about things from time to time. I know

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Speaker 4: how tough that is. Guys, I get it, I really do.

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Speaker 4: I feel your pain. But they don't want good outcomes.

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Speaker 4: They want the chaos. They want the destruction. And I

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Speaker 4: do think by the way, this is sort of a

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Speaker 4: big theory of the case, but a theory of the case. Nonetheless,

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Speaker 4: I think Elon and team tech Bro have all convinced

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Speaker 4: themselves that they're not going to need any of this

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Speaker 4: research because within a year or a month or however

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Speaker 4: long they think it is, AI.

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Speaker 3: Will do everything.

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Speaker 4: I think that's part of their thought process here, is

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Speaker 4: like we can say this is great, and then the

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Speaker 4: AI will figure it all out for us. It is

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Speaker 4: a weird and I think semi apocalyptic viewpoint, but I

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Speaker 4: don't think it's wrong.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think there's certainly a lot of different things

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Speaker 1: going on here. But I think the real question is

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Speaker 1: going to be how long does a government function until

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Speaker 1: this is over? Right?

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Speaker 4: Listen, I think I think the government is functioning right

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Speaker 4: now about like Twitter functions. Now, if you look at

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Speaker 4: the fact that Elon went and he cut seventy percent

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Speaker 4: out of Twitter's headcount when he took over, and a

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Speaker 4: lot of people.

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Speaker 3: Said, oh, yeah, it needed to be cut.

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Speaker 4: It was this, it was that. And if you even

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Speaker 4: take that point, Okay, let's just take that point for

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Speaker 4: a second. He didn't make those cuts with a sense

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Speaker 4: of a plan. He did it because he has a

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Speaker 4: sort of fetishization cuts being good as a signifier of leadership.

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Speaker 4: Does that make sense? Yeah, And I think it's a

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Speaker 4: silly kind of model in a lot of ways, but

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Speaker 4: it is nonetheless one of his models.

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Speaker 1: Right. Well, And the question is do the American people

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Speaker 1: like it or do they not like it? They are

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Speaker 1: they happy with this? And I don't know that we

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Speaker 1: know the answer.

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Speaker 4: Yet, right, I don't think we have the answer yet. Honestly,

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Speaker 4: I don't. I don't think we have an answer on

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Speaker 4: that yet because I think part of this is it

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Speaker 4: we're still in the entertainment phase of this new iteration

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Speaker 4: of trump Ism. There's still a great joy on the

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Speaker 4: right that the Libs are being owned. They absolutely couldn't

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Speaker 4: be happier, how owned the Libs are, how upset people are.

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Speaker 4: That to my mind is like they love people being upset.

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Speaker 4: They love people saying oh, please don't cut cancer research

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Speaker 4: and saying cancers for cooks, Oh drink rail milk, you

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Speaker 4: won't get cancer, right right right?

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Speaker 1: I mean that I think is a big question. There

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Speaker 1: is a question still of like how much Elon can

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Speaker 1: do in the federal computers, right.

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Speaker 4: I think if you just take the scope of what

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Speaker 4: the court orders are saying, look at what Elon has done,

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Speaker 4: and if anyone is comfortable right now that their social

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Speaker 4: Security number, they're privately identifiable information, all that business is

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Speaker 4: has somehow been somehow more secure than it was before

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Speaker 4: a bunch of jacked up in cells when in there

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Speaker 4: and started rifling through your most intimate files. God bless you,

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Speaker 4: God bless y.

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Speaker 1: So today we saw a lot of It's the show

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Speaker 1: airs on Monday. On Sunday, we saw all of MAGA

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Speaker 1: world working this Sunday shows, oh, trying to sell this

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Speaker 1: all sign right.

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Speaker 4: Well, you know, and I got to tell you the

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Speaker 4: Sunday shows have got to step it up. Margaret Brennan's

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Speaker 4: on there today on CBS. And you know, you have

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Speaker 4: this Republican reps and senators and they're asked direct questions

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Speaker 4: of things they absolutely don't believe, and even when confronted,

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Speaker 4: they go right back to the well, we were funding

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Speaker 4: transsexual pan flute bands in Chile. Okay enough, they won't answer. Hey,

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Speaker 4: by the way, do you think this guy Darren Beattie,

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Speaker 4: who is a flaming racist of the highest quality, A

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Speaker 4: guy so racist Elon Musco's ease up their comrade. It

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Speaker 4: should be in the state Department. Blah blah blah blah.

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Speaker 4: I don't know him. They know every detail of the

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Speaker 4: of the usai D budget for South American LGBT spending,

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Speaker 4: but not who's going to be in the State Department

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Speaker 4: the fuck out.

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Speaker 1: A senator from Alabama, Katie Brett, Young, very smart, quite terrifying,

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Speaker 1: says that she realizes that we should maybe have a smarter,

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Speaker 1: more targeted approach to cutting NIH funding. You'll note that

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Speaker 1: the stage largest employer is in fact a Benny ficiary

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Speaker 1: of NIH funding, the University of Alabama at Birmingham.

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Speaker 3: That is a shock, indeed, that Alabama.

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Speaker 4: I think one of the things again I go back

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Speaker 4: to this this idea that Silicon Valley has prospered so

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Speaker 4: extraordinarily from spending on science and technology, and the Red

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Speaker 4: States have too. This is what I find so remarkable

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Speaker 4: is that people like Katie Britt are so effing disingenuous

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Speaker 4: where now they're thinking, oh God, now what do I

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Speaker 4: tell my people? You know who was going to benefit

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Speaker 4: tremendously from the infrastructure bill?

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Speaker 3: Red states?

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Speaker 4: Red States, they would have a ton of spending that

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Speaker 4: was going to help them to prosper and to help

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Speaker 4: them to improve their infrastructure. And trust me, as a

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Speaker 4: Red state guy, I can tell you one thing. It

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Speaker 4: is increasingly like living in the fucking third.

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Speaker 1: World, right, I mean, well, and again, we don't call

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Speaker 1: it the third World. We call it the Global South.

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Speaker 1: Not to be pedantic here because I know, but but

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Speaker 1: I do think you have a really good point here,

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Speaker 1: which is that this spending is actually about making the

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Speaker 1: economy better, also making the infrastructure better. America's had real

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Speaker 1: infrastructure problems. Now, what I think is interesting is that

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Speaker 1: this is one of the many ways in which Trump

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Speaker 1: one point zero has run into trouble with Trump two

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Speaker 1: point zero. You'll remember and Trump one point.

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Speaker 3: Zero infrastructure week.

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Speaker 1: Yes, every week was infrastructure week. Yeah remember that? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So I guess now, no more infrastructure weeks.

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Speaker 4: No infrastructure weeks for cous molly. Yeah, infrastructure weeks are

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Speaker 4: for weak cucks. They're for the deep state, human filth.

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Speaker 1: I'm me and just insane. So what are you going

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Speaker 1: to watch this week?

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Speaker 4: Well, look, I'm going to watch the way in which

439
00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:14,960
Speaker 4: court orders are either obeyed or disobeyed. And I think

440
00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:17,760
Speaker 4: that I think that we are very much at the

441
00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:22,159
Speaker 4: edge of a constitutional crisis, a precipice that really has

442
00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:24,520
Speaker 4: a it's really going to be a moment where we're

443
00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:26,280
Speaker 4: going to decide that this country is going to follow

444
00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:30,600
Speaker 4: the constitution or whether an entire political party is going

445
00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:33,080
Speaker 4: to say, you know what, goodwill will last and let's

446
00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:33,800
Speaker 4: go have some fun.

447
00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:37,080
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, that's not good. And give me a minute

448
00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:41,040
Speaker 1: on like what you think, like what guardrails there are

449
00:23:41,080 --> 00:23:43,720
Speaker 1: still left?

450
00:23:44,560 --> 00:23:45,639
Speaker 3: My dog's thought something.

451
00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:47,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, I thought it was fun.

452
00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:49,200
Speaker 4: I think there are three guardrails we always counted on

453
00:23:49,240 --> 00:23:52,640
Speaker 4: in this country, principal political opposition, a strong press.

454
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:56,640
Speaker 1: Being dismantled, and the courts right being ignored.

455
00:23:56,880 --> 00:24:00,639
Speaker 4: Right now, there is no action that is being in

456
00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:04,119
Speaker 4: the courts to my mind, that is going to be

457
00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:07,679
Speaker 4: honored by the Trump administration. I don't think these people

458
00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:11,280
Speaker 4: have a single intention to say, yeah, you know what,

459
00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:13,360
Speaker 4: we got a federal court order, elon, give us back

460
00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:15,760
Speaker 4: those hard drives with everybody's Social Security data on them.

461
00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:18,960
Speaker 4: I don't think there's a single chance of that. And look,

462
00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:21,720
Speaker 4: there is no honor inside the Republican Party. They do

463
00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:24,280
Speaker 4: not care. They care about Donald Trump. They will not

464
00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:29,800
Speaker 4: ever cross Donald Trump, but they don't care about anything else.

465
00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:30,680
Speaker 3: Right now.

466
00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:34,400
Speaker 4: They are completely oblivious or what not, Well, not oblivious,

467
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:37,240
Speaker 4: they're completely callous in the way that they're treating everything

468
00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:39,600
Speaker 4: else in this country. And I think we're in a

469
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:43,840
Speaker 4: lot of trouble because institutions and the media is And

470
00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:46,399
Speaker 4: I am not a media basher for the five million

471
00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:48,960
Speaker 4: of time, but I think the media has not met

472
00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:51,280
Speaker 4: this moment. I think they are still playing the game

473
00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:54,639
Speaker 4: of allowing a lot of Trump people to go on

474
00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:57,760
Speaker 4: TV and to talk off the record to newspapers, and

475
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:01,280
Speaker 4: they're not presenting with the Americans with a fo implications

476
00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:04,560
Speaker 4: and context of what's happening to our country. I think

477
00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:07,479
Speaker 4: it is so dangerous right now that we don't have

478
00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:09,920
Speaker 4: a press that's willing to go in the briefing room

479
00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:13,240
Speaker 4: every day and not say. Some people say Elon Musk

480
00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:16,600
Speaker 4: is cutting central government programs, but others say he's cutting

481
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:19,399
Speaker 4: Fuck you go in there and call it out for

482
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:22,480
Speaker 4: what it is. This is a takeover of our government

483
00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:26,600
Speaker 4: by insane people, and they are doing things that are

484
00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:30,800
Speaker 4: materially harmful to the people of the United States. How

485
00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:33,680
Speaker 4: hard is that to understand? That, to my mind, is

486
00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:36,800
Speaker 4: one of the great sort of failings we're having as

487
00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:38,200
Speaker 4: a nation right right.

488
00:25:38,200 --> 00:25:41,280
Speaker 1: No now, I mean exactly, and I think we're going

489
00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:42,159
Speaker 1: to see more of that.

490
00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:45,480
Speaker 4: Rick Wilson Moly John Fast A pleasure as always.

491
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:52,200
Speaker 1: Josh Miller Lewis is the senior director of more Perfect Union.

492
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:54,879
Speaker 1: Welcome to Fast Politics.

493
00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:56,440
Speaker 6: Josh, thanks Molly, thanks for having me.

494
00:25:56,640 --> 00:25:59,520
Speaker 1: So first we're going to talk about you are the

495
00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:00,360
Speaker 1: what is.

496
00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:04,639
Speaker 6: Your title, senior editorial director at more Perfect Union, but you.

497
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:08,200
Speaker 1: Come from the world of Bernie Sanders, which I think

498
00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:13,280
Speaker 1: is important to inform the sort of populist, pro union

499
00:26:14,040 --> 00:26:17,080
Speaker 1: wing of the Democratic Party. Is that fair? I feel

500
00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:19,200
Speaker 1: like that is narrow, but it's fair.

501
00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:20,560
Speaker 6: Yeah. Absolutely.

502
00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:24,600
Speaker 1: So First, let's talk about this lobbying firm. You shocked

503
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:28,480
Speaker 1: to see that Donald Trump is once again in bed

504
00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:31,440
Speaker 1: with lobbyist when we were told that he was too

505
00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:33,840
Speaker 1: rich to be corrupted in any way.

506
00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:34,680
Speaker 3: Shocked?

507
00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:35,760
Speaker 1: Shocked?

508
00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:38,440
Speaker 6: Yeah, No, I mean so. I think one of the big,

509
00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:42,000
Speaker 6: sort of undercovered pieces of this administration so far right

510
00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:45,200
Speaker 6: is their relationship with lobbyists in K Street. And as

511
00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:48,760
Speaker 6: you said, trumb on the campaign trail, attack the influence

512
00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:53,679
Speaker 6: of lobbyists. He told his followers that lobbyists play a

513
00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:55,520
Speaker 6: terrible role in Washington.

514
00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:58,840
Speaker 7: And as soon as he got elected, he named Susie

515
00:26:58,880 --> 00:27:02,040
Speaker 7: Wiles as his chief step right. And Susie Wiles comes

516
00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:06,280
Speaker 7: from Ballard Partners, big lobbying firm, big Trump backers since

517
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:10,199
Speaker 7: the early days in twenty fifteen. It won't surprise you

518
00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 7: that in the days after Trump was elected and after

519
00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:17,119
Speaker 7: he named Susie Wiles as his chiefest staff and another

520
00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:22,720
Speaker 7: Ballard partner, Ham Bondy as his Attorney general, that corporations

521
00:27:22,840 --> 00:27:28,359
Speaker 7: have flocked to Ballard Partners. They have added I believe

522
00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:31,760
Speaker 7: the last time I saw forty one new clients since

523
00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:34,720
Speaker 7: Trump was elected. And just to give you some context,

524
00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:37,840
Speaker 7: I think the next highest firm has added fourteen new

525
00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:40,960
Speaker 7: clients in that period. So this is clear that corporate

526
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:45,600
Speaker 7: America sees a path to influence the Trump administration through

527
00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:48,640
Speaker 7: Ballard Partners and through the connections that they now.

528
00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:52,879
Speaker 6: Have at the highest levels of the administration. And you know,

529
00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:56,040
Speaker 6: I think the firms that have been signing up with

530
00:27:56,600 --> 00:27:59,560
Speaker 6: Ballard Partners tell us a little bit about as well,

531
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:02,399
Speaker 6: about out what the key fights are going to be

532
00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:04,160
Speaker 6: over the next four years.

533
00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:08,679
Speaker 1: Oh that, yes, that is exactly the kind of stuff

534
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:12,880
Speaker 1: that I'm so interested in because I want to know

535
00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:16,359
Speaker 1: what are the fights for the next four years. Prayer

536
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:19,639
Speaker 1: hands that he leaves after four years, So tell me.

537
00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:22,280
Speaker 1: I'm not even kidding. I'm just sick about this.

538
00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:24,560
Speaker 6: No, I think there's a few things that, like you

539
00:28:24,640 --> 00:28:27,920
Speaker 6: start to some of this, you know, we're seeing already

540
00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:30,760
Speaker 6: start to play out. But tax cuts obviously is at

541
00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:33,040
Speaker 6: the top of the list, right, and Chevron is a

542
00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:36,760
Speaker 6: big ballot client. They I think they saved two billion

543
00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:40,840
Speaker 6: dollars alone in one year. After the first Trump tax

544
00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:43,640
Speaker 6: cuts are put in place in twenty seventeen, they stand

545
00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 6: to save, you know, billions and billions of dollars sift

546
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:49,320
Speaker 6: the TOX cuts are extended along with the rest of

547
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:54,920
Speaker 6: corporate America. Crypto is just huge topic over the next

548
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:57,520
Speaker 6: four years. Is a number of crypto companies that signed

549
00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:01,960
Speaker 6: up with balot Right, Ripple Labs, Blockchain, and Kraken. They've

550
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:05,520
Speaker 6: all signed up. The Ripple ceo actually met with Trump.

551
00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:08,640
Speaker 6: Brad growing House he met with Trump after the election

552
00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:11,160
Speaker 6: and Trump said that the US will be the crypto

553
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:14,480
Speaker 6: capital of the planet. And the question of well, what

554
00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:17,200
Speaker 6: do they want? Why should we care about crypto? I

555
00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:20,520
Speaker 6: don't own any crypto. Well, I think that the crypto

556
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:26,200
Speaker 6: is intent on infiltrating the global financial system. And so

557
00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:29,760
Speaker 6: whether you own crypto or not, I think you have

558
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:34,360
Speaker 6: to be concerned that this asset that is really not

559
00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:39,160
Speaker 6: based in anything meaningful, that is really just used for

560
00:29:39,280 --> 00:29:43,520
Speaker 6: fraud and scams. That they were prosecuted during the proNT

561
00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:47,200
Speaker 6: during the Biden administration for rampant fraud and obviously stand

562
00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:50,120
Speaker 6: Making Free is the highest profile example of that this

563
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:53,560
Speaker 6: asset could your your retirement savings, your four oh one

564
00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 6: K could end up ultimately being tied to this bubble

565
00:29:57,040 --> 00:29:59,960
Speaker 6: that could collapse at any moment. But in the meantime

566
00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:03,040
Speaker 6: they stand to get very, very wealthy in their very

567
00:30:03,080 --> 00:30:07,440
Speaker 6: intent on influencing the direction of the Trump administration. Tariff's

568
00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:12,120
Speaker 6: is obviously another huge issue. Right number of big importers

569
00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 6: have signed up with Ballard over the last couple of months.

570
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:18,480
Speaker 6: And the thing that I you know, there's this whole

571
00:30:18,520 --> 00:30:20,480
Speaker 6: debate around tarifs, but the thing that I think is

572
00:30:20,520 --> 00:30:24,360
Speaker 6: not getting enough attention is there was a study after

573
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:30,080
Speaker 6: the last Trump administration that found that companies that had

574
00:30:30,280 --> 00:30:36,400
Speaker 6: ties to Republican lobbying firms got more tariff exemptions from

575
00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:40,200
Speaker 6: the Trump administration than any other company. There's an enormous

576
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:44,920
Speaker 6: amount of corruption that's happening within these tariffs that are

577
00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:48,240
Speaker 6: where the Trump administration in the first term at least

578
00:30:48,720 --> 00:30:53,920
Speaker 6: was dolling out favors to companies that were associated with

579
00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:58,160
Speaker 6: the Republican Party. And I fully expect that that same

580
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:00,600
Speaker 6: thing will play out in this administration. And I think

581
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:02,520
Speaker 6: we have to look hard at sort of the corruption

582
00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:05,440
Speaker 6: that that is happening again as a result of the

583
00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:09,800
Speaker 6: connection between Trump and big lobbying firms. And then last,

584
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:13,280
Speaker 6: the last thing to highlight is another consumer protection piece,

585
00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:17,600
Speaker 6: the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, which has played an enormously

586
00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:22,240
Speaker 6: important role in saving millions of Americans' money and protecting

587
00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:24,760
Speaker 6: them from corporate scams. This is they have been a

588
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:29,280
Speaker 6: big target by Zuckerberg, by Mark Andresen. And there's a

589
00:31:29,360 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 6: number of firms under disguise of dbanking, which we could

590
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:35,440
Speaker 6: talk about more firms that are are signing up with

591
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:39,840
Speaker 6: Ballard and are ultimately interested in, in Elon Musk's words,

592
00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:41,120
Speaker 6: deleting the CFPB.

593
00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:45,680
Speaker 1: Right, No, I mean for sure that these are all

594
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 1: really interesting. The cutouts for tariffs, we saw that a

595
00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:51,959
Speaker 1: lot in Trump one point zero and Trump two point zero.

596
00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:54,800
Speaker 1: They said they weren't going to have cutouts for tariffs, right.

597
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:57,080
Speaker 3: L L Yeah, we'll see.

598
00:31:57,080 --> 00:31:59,560
Speaker 6: But you know, there's there's a reason I think that

599
00:32:00,280 --> 00:32:04,120
Speaker 6: Tim Cook and Jeff Bezos and all of these people

600
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:07,560
Speaker 6: who are heavily reliant on producing stuff in China are

601
00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:10,320
Speaker 6: all of a sudden big bands of Donald Trump, right.

602
00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 6: And famously, Apple got huge cut out carveouts in the first.

603
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:18,479
Speaker 1: Yeah, for the iPhone, and that seems really like an

604
00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:22,920
Speaker 1: important point. And again this goes into this cleptocracy thing, right,

605
00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:27,720
Speaker 1: picking winners and losers. Trump Ism is an embraceive crony capitalism,

606
00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:31,959
Speaker 1: and the gas company is super interesting. Donald Trump is

607
00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:36,040
Speaker 1: funded though by Elon Musk. Right, Elon Musk made billions

608
00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:41,440
Speaker 1: of dollars in climate change subsidies because irony is alive,

609
00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:45,480
Speaker 1: and well, how does this not collide? Right, Donald Trump

610
00:32:45,520 --> 00:32:48,160
Speaker 1: is in the pocket of the oil company. He's always

611
00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:51,480
Speaker 1: has been, right, we had Rex Tillerson and the first

612
00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:55,400
Speaker 1: Trump admin did not even try to hide it. So

613
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:58,520
Speaker 1: explain to me the tension there and how you see

614
00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:03,480
Speaker 1: that playing at tension between the tension between Elon and Exon.

615
00:33:03,880 --> 00:33:05,920
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's an interesting thing, But I mean, I think

616
00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:10,040
Speaker 6: there's some interesting things going on though with Tesla. Obviously,

617
00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:16,160
Speaker 6: Tesla benefited enormously, as you were saying, from you know,

618
00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:20,239
Speaker 6: carbon tax credits and that that sort of regime. Right,

619
00:33:20,280 --> 00:33:22,520
Speaker 6: They've sort of built a huge part of their business

620
00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:26,520
Speaker 6: and their revenue on trading like carbon tax credits. But

621
00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:30,480
Speaker 6: I also think in some ways Tesla has benefited the

622
00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:35,320
Speaker 6: least of all the electric car companies from the inflation

623
00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:39,640
Speaker 6: reduction app that Biden passed and this move to promote

624
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:43,120
Speaker 6: electric vehicles. They've lost an enormous amount of market share

625
00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:46,160
Speaker 6: over the last couple of years as other companies like

626
00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:49,719
Speaker 6: Hyundai and US companies like GM have ramped up their

627
00:33:49,760 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 6: electric vehicle output and started to produce better cars. And

628
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:59,200
Speaker 6: I do think that Elon and Tesla to some extent

629
00:33:59,280 --> 00:34:03,720
Speaker 6: have an intro in undermining the progress that was made

630
00:34:03,720 --> 00:34:07,960
Speaker 6: by the RA because they had such a strong foothold

631
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:12,399
Speaker 6: already in this market. The competition is actually ultimately bad

632
00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:14,080
Speaker 6: for Tesla.

633
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:18,600
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, so Elon has Tesla, he has SpaceX, he

634
00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:23,000
Speaker 1: has Twitter. Whatever. That's I think kind of a rounding error.

635
00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:26,480
Speaker 1: But I wonder if you can explain to us, you know,

636
00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:27,799
Speaker 1: there are a lot of different things in the case

637
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:32,160
Speaker 1: and how Elon is sort of functioning in this Trump government.

638
00:34:32,200 --> 00:34:34,759
Speaker 1: But part of it, right, is that he's there for

639
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:37,200
Speaker 1: his companies, right. Part of it is that he's there

640
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:39,400
Speaker 1: for power or part of But if he has all

641
00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:41,560
Speaker 1: these companies, and he does have a vested interest, and

642
00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:43,759
Speaker 1: we have all of these different players all who have

643
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:46,640
Speaker 1: vested interests, right, So, and you talked about this before.

644
00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:50,480
Speaker 1: Tim Cook wants car Vattes for China, and you know,

645
00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:53,640
Speaker 1: you have Andreas and Horowitz has a bunch of portfolio companies.

646
00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:57,360
Speaker 1: They're just everybody has these different instant different you know,

647
00:34:57,360 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 1: they're all sort of trying to curry favor with the

648
00:34:59,760 --> 00:35:03,040
Speaker 1: ma King in order to get what they want because

649
00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:06,480
Speaker 1: Trump is very transactional. So what do you think and

650
00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:09,400
Speaker 1: since you sort of know all these companies Elon is

651
00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:12,480
Speaker 1: doing in the federal government, because you know, from what

652
00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:15,239
Speaker 1: I understand for the people I know who used to

653
00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:17,920
Speaker 1: know him well, of which I know one person, my

654
00:35:18,120 --> 00:35:21,520
Speaker 1: sense is that he cares the most about his companies.

655
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:25,480
Speaker 1: I mean also his weird political stuff, but his companies.

656
00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:28,000
Speaker 1: So my question is, what do you think the sort

657
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:28,680
Speaker 1: of goal there is.

658
00:35:29,120 --> 00:35:31,000
Speaker 6: Yeah, that's a great question. I mean, I think all

659
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:33,080
Speaker 6: you have to do to understand this is look at

660
00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:36,399
Speaker 6: the agencies that he's going after, and recently came out

661
00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:39,000
Speaker 6: right that he the Department of Labor is his next

662
00:35:39,080 --> 00:35:43,080
Speaker 6: target with do Oche, and you look at the labor

663
00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:46,759
Speaker 6: violations that his companies have had over the years. There's

664
00:35:46,800 --> 00:35:51,480
Speaker 6: been workers who die building a Tesla gigafactory at Osha investigated.

665
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 6: You have Tesla, which has been notoriously anti union. Mosque

666
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:59,239
Speaker 6: has talked about how he doesn't believe in unions when

667
00:35:59,239 --> 00:36:02,319
Speaker 6: they have fired where workers for unionizing, They've come under

668
00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:06,800
Speaker 6: fire from the NLRB. SpaceX has also been under fire

669
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:12,040
Speaker 6: for labor violations, a total lack of regard for environmental regulations,

670
00:36:12,120 --> 00:36:15,400
Speaker 6: and you know, really, I think negatively impacted the community

671
00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:18,520
Speaker 6: in Texas that they operate in. You don't see him

672
00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:21,719
Speaker 6: going after the Defense Department where he gets you know,

673
00:36:22,360 --> 00:36:26,040
Speaker 6: billions and billions of dollars in contracts from for SpaceX

674
00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:31,160
Speaker 6: and Starlink. You don't see him going after the agencies

675
00:36:31,200 --> 00:36:35,360
Speaker 6: that ultimately are very beneficial to his business and those contracts.

676
00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:40,880
Speaker 6: But he is intent on tearing down, you know, important

677
00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:47,000
Speaker 6: parts of the federal government that defend workers, that encourage unionization,

678
00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:49,520
Speaker 6: to make sure workers are and it's it's I think,

679
00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:54,080
Speaker 6: clearly ultimately to benefit his company. And you know, I'll

680
00:36:54,080 --> 00:36:56,239
Speaker 6: say this too. I don't think it's just Elon Musk.

681
00:36:56,280 --> 00:37:00,600
Speaker 6: I think all of this sort of tech billion airs

682
00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:05,399
Speaker 6: and major chech corporations that are involved in the Trump

683
00:37:05,480 --> 00:37:10,080
Speaker 6: administration are engaged in a similar effort. They want their

684
00:37:10,120 --> 00:37:13,280
Speaker 6: piece of the pie, and they want to strip away

685
00:37:13,840 --> 00:37:18,040
Speaker 6: the important parts of the federal government that stop sort

686
00:37:18,040 --> 00:37:22,359
Speaker 6: of their rule breaking, in fraud and lawlessness, and they

687
00:37:22,360 --> 00:37:25,040
Speaker 6: see this as their opportunity. With Trump, we're.

688
00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:27,880
Speaker 1: Into Lena Khan world. And I want you and I

689
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:31,600
Speaker 1: to talk about Lena Khan because Lena Khan has made

690
00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:34,400
Speaker 1: all the very rich people very mad. This is like,

691
00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:37,520
Speaker 1: I feel like a great moment from the Biden administration.

692
00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:42,400
Speaker 1: Here is the most important probably person in the admin

693
00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:45,480
Speaker 1: in certain ways. Right, She's a trustbuster. She has made

694
00:37:45,600 --> 00:37:49,839
Speaker 1: everyone furious with her who's wealthy, and in the end,

695
00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:53,920
Speaker 1: the people who would have benefited from what she's doing

696
00:37:54,000 --> 00:37:58,680
Speaker 1: didn't even know she was there. So make us understand.

697
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:02,360
Speaker 1: Because you come from world Bernie, I think was the

698
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:07,239
Speaker 1: last time that Democrats were able to connect with populism,

699
00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 1: despite the fact that their legislation is almost entirely populist.

700
00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:16,879
Speaker 1: So make it make sense why they can't, how they

701
00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:19,000
Speaker 1: could and anything else we want to talk on this

702
00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:19,720
Speaker 1: topic about.

703
00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:23,120
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think one of the things that populists need

704
00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:26,520
Speaker 6: to do, and I think Lena Conda quite well was.

705
00:38:26,760 --> 00:38:28,960
Speaker 3: Root her effort and her.

706
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:32,960
Speaker 6: Work in the fights and the issues that millions of

707
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:36,480
Speaker 6: working class people are concerned about. You look at her

708
00:38:36,840 --> 00:38:41,719
Speaker 6: efforts around housing, efforts to take on big corporate landlords

709
00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:44,640
Speaker 6: or this wasn't her who was DOJ and Cantor, but

710
00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:49,400
Speaker 6: efforts to take on companies like Real Page incredibly powerful

711
00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:53,680
Speaker 6: work that was rooted in essential an issue that millions

712
00:38:53,719 --> 00:38:55,760
Speaker 6: and millions of people are concerned about in this country,

713
00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:59,919
Speaker 6: housing affordability. And you're totally right that it is. It's

714
00:39:00,160 --> 00:39:03,879
Speaker 6: so painful to me that one of I really think

715
00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:06,440
Speaker 6: one of the most effective communicators and someone in the

716
00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:09,960
Speaker 6: administration who was engaged in some of the most important

717
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:12,719
Speaker 6: fights in this country taking on big tech companies that

718
00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:15,600
Speaker 6: have become increasingly powerful. And you heard Joe Biden talk

719
00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:19,480
Speaker 6: about in his farewell speech. She didn't get the sort

720
00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:23,960
Speaker 6: of attention that it deserved. She wasn't uplifted by the

721
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:26,600
Speaker 6: president on a daily basis. The fights that she was

722
00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:29,920
Speaker 6: engaged in were sort of relegated to the background. And

723
00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:35,000
Speaker 6: I think that if you're going to build a populist movement,

724
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:39,200
Speaker 6: we can learn a lot from the sorts of fights

725
00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:43,560
Speaker 6: in the ways that Lena Khan engaged during the administration.

726
00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:47,879
Speaker 6: But it is really important that we talk about that

727
00:39:47,880 --> 00:39:51,200
Speaker 6: that it is front and center that the fights with

728
00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:56,560
Speaker 6: corporate America on behalf of working families are centered in

729
00:39:56,600 --> 00:39:59,760
Speaker 6: our politics and not something that we try to hide

730
00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:03,200
Speaker 6: too often. I feel like Democrats are afraid of that tension.

731
00:40:03,520 --> 00:40:07,239
Speaker 6: They're afraid to have a fight, and the fights are

732
00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:11,000
Speaker 6: what animate and tell people what we care about. They're

733
00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:16,000
Speaker 6: so important to helping people understand what side the Democratic

734
00:40:16,080 --> 00:40:19,640
Speaker 6: Party is on, who we're fighting for, and what we're

735
00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:21,759
Speaker 6: fighting for. And Trump does this every single day and

736
00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:23,560
Speaker 6: it's incredibly effective. Yeah.

737
00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:28,239
Speaker 1: That's my real question is when you're looking at these

738
00:40:29,160 --> 00:40:32,600
Speaker 1: you know, there's almost populous legislation, right, I mean that's

739
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:36,520
Speaker 1: what it is. You know, a lot of populous legislation

740
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:41,200
Speaker 1: boost up the economy. Really, you know, sort of writed

741
00:40:41,239 --> 00:40:43,640
Speaker 1: a lot of the mistakes from two thousand and eight. Yeah,

742
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:46,759
Speaker 1: but could not or would not transmit any of that

743
00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:48,200
Speaker 1: to the American people.

744
00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:53,600
Speaker 6: Yeah. No, we obviously suffered from an inability to communicate

745
00:40:53,920 --> 00:40:57,719
Speaker 6: what we were trying to do, and fundamentally, I think

746
00:40:57,800 --> 00:41:01,960
Speaker 6: outline a vision for what we want America to look like,

747
00:41:02,080 --> 00:41:06,080
Speaker 6: who we care about, the ways in which the system

748
00:41:06,160 --> 00:41:10,359
Speaker 6: is broken, and how we were attempting to fix it.

749
00:41:10,560 --> 00:41:12,960
Speaker 6: I just don't I'm not sure. I do think that

750
00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:15,719
Speaker 6: there was a vision in an ideology that was attached

751
00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:19,040
Speaker 6: to a lot of the progress that President Biden made,

752
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:23,000
Speaker 6: but it was not communicated to people. And I think

753
00:41:23,080 --> 00:41:26,239
Speaker 6: going forward, as we think about, you know, how we

754
00:41:26,280 --> 00:41:29,160
Speaker 6: respond to Trump and how we sort of rebuild the

755
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:33,560
Speaker 6: Democratic Party, we need to do more than just reject

756
00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:37,760
Speaker 6: what Trump has to say. We need to actually build

757
00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:44,080
Speaker 6: an agenda that engages in the most important fights and

758
00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:48,640
Speaker 6: outlines a vision for the American people about what the

759
00:41:48,680 --> 00:41:52,480
Speaker 6: core issues are the Democratic Party stands out. I think

760
00:41:52,520 --> 00:41:55,160
Speaker 6: if we're just in this resistance mode, if we're just

761
00:41:55,239 --> 00:41:58,880
Speaker 6: in it reject everything Trump does if he's bad, sure

762
00:41:58,960 --> 00:42:01,400
Speaker 6: we might be able to win in four years, but

763
00:42:01,520 --> 00:42:03,520
Speaker 6: are we going to actually be able to rebuild a

764
00:42:03,560 --> 00:42:09,080
Speaker 6: working class coalition that can win elections in eight years

765
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:12,239
Speaker 6: in twelve years? I don't think so. I think there

766
00:42:12,280 --> 00:42:16,080
Speaker 6: has to be some real sort of agenda setting and

767
00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:21,719
Speaker 6: we need to reckon with why the Democratic Party has

768
00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:24,920
Speaker 6: lost working class people over the last twenty years.

769
00:42:25,400 --> 00:42:30,080
Speaker 1: Yes, one hundred percent. And also again they voted for

770
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:34,600
Speaker 1: the guy who wanted to do tax cuts for billionaires

771
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:38,960
Speaker 1: because they thought he'd be better for workers. So like,

772
00:42:39,200 --> 00:42:44,680
Speaker 1: obviously something is going terribly wrong here, right, I mean.

773
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:48,800
Speaker 6: Well, I think fundamentally though, Like, what it's really about

774
00:42:49,040 --> 00:42:51,560
Speaker 6: is people are pissed off with the status quo. I

775
00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:55,440
Speaker 6: really don't think that it's about Donald Trump in particular.

776
00:42:55,719 --> 00:42:58,520
Speaker 6: Starting in two thousand and eight, basically people were frustrated

777
00:42:58,520 --> 00:43:01,920
Speaker 6: with the status quo and wanted something fundamentally different, and

778
00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:05,080
Speaker 6: they elected Democrats and a landslide right twenty twelve of

779
00:43:05,080 --> 00:43:07,359
Speaker 6: them was able to hold on, But then you have

780
00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:10,760
Speaker 6: another rejection in twenty sixteen, another rejection in twenty twenty,

781
00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:13,200
Speaker 6: and then another rejection in twenty twenty four. We just

782
00:43:13,280 --> 00:43:15,600
Speaker 6: keep swinging on this pendulum, and the same thing is

783
00:43:15,640 --> 00:43:18,800
Speaker 6: playing out all over the world right where incumbents are losing.

784
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:22,959
Speaker 6: The economic system has been broken now at least since

785
00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:26,120
Speaker 6: two thousand and eight. People want something different, They want

786
00:43:26,160 --> 00:43:29,520
Speaker 6: some sort of change. Neither party is offering that to them.

787
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:32,880
Speaker 1: I just would add, I think you're right for sure,

788
00:43:33,120 --> 00:43:36,360
Speaker 1: But if you look at like government spending around social

789
00:43:36,400 --> 00:43:40,040
Speaker 1: safety net, one party did give it to them. I

790
00:43:40,080 --> 00:43:44,040
Speaker 1: mean again, wealth and equality, you know, we just not rising.

791
00:43:44,239 --> 00:43:47,799
Speaker 1: Inflation is the mind fucked and all mind fucks Like

792
00:43:47,840 --> 00:43:49,920
Speaker 1: I get it. I know what it's like to pay

793
00:43:50,320 --> 00:43:53,359
Speaker 1: you know, one hundred dollars more a week on groceries

794
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:55,279
Speaker 1: or a month on groceries. I mean, I get it,

795
00:43:55,320 --> 00:43:57,960
Speaker 1: but I'm just saying that, like, if you look at

796
00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:00,520
Speaker 1: the numbers, perception is real reality.

797
00:44:00,880 --> 00:44:03,759
Speaker 6: Right, Yes, I agree with you. And this gets back

798
00:44:03,760 --> 00:44:05,520
Speaker 6: to what we were talking about earlier, right, And like

799
00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:09,480
Speaker 6: how do you brain your politics? How do you communicate

800
00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:12,160
Speaker 6: your politics? Do you engage in fights or do you

801
00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:14,880
Speaker 6: shy away from them? I think that that all contributes

802
00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:17,360
Speaker 6: to it. There's no question you're right that the Democratic

803
00:44:17,400 --> 00:44:20,239
Speaker 6: Party has done a lot and has tried to fight

804
00:44:20,280 --> 00:44:21,240
Speaker 6: for working people.

805
00:44:21,600 --> 00:44:24,399
Speaker 1: But it doesn't matter. If you can't transmit, it doesn't matter.

806
00:44:24,560 --> 00:44:24,880
Speaker 6: Josh.

807
00:44:25,120 --> 00:44:27,520
Speaker 1: I hope you will come back. This as really really

808
00:44:27,520 --> 00:44:28,719
Speaker 1: interesting for sure.

809
00:44:28,760 --> 00:44:29,960
Speaker 6: Yeah, thanks for having me.

810
00:44:32,280 --> 00:44:37,080
Speaker 1: No moment, Jesse Cannon.

811
00:44:37,120 --> 00:44:38,000
Speaker 3: Molly Jung Fast.

812
00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:41,680
Speaker 2: So we are seeing a lot of officials say fuck

813
00:44:41,800 --> 00:44:44,240
Speaker 2: off to Trump, trying to get them out of their seats,

814
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:48,360
Speaker 2: and the latest is the FEC commissioner Ellen Wintrump, who's

815
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:51,400
Speaker 2: considering her options after being ousted by Trump.

816
00:44:51,600 --> 00:44:53,479
Speaker 1: You know what part of this is that Trump doesn't

817
00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:57,120
Speaker 1: have the authority to do any of this extracurricular stuff.

818
00:44:57,120 --> 00:44:59,799
Speaker 1: He's not a king. He's part of the government and

819
00:44:59,800 --> 00:45:03,759
Speaker 1: now is I think a really important point here is

820
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:07,080
Speaker 1: that we are really seeing like their right to not

821
00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:10,800
Speaker 1: do that. They're right to not let him go crazy

822
00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:15,000
Speaker 1: on stuff. So Ellen Wintrapp, she was put on this

823
00:45:15,520 --> 00:45:20,480
Speaker 1: bipartisan commission by George W. Bush. Woke George W. Bush Thursday.

824
00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:22,840
Speaker 1: She was fired by a brief letter. At least it

825
00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:25,399
Speaker 1: wasn't a tweet. She shared a copy of the letter

826
00:45:25,600 --> 00:45:28,080
Speaker 1: on X and she said, there's a legal way to

827
00:45:28,160 --> 00:45:31,760
Speaker 1: replace the FEC commissioner. This isn't it. I've been lucky

828
00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:34,880
Speaker 1: to serve the American people again. Look, this is this

829
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:39,399
Speaker 1: idea that trump Ism wants to weaponize every part of

830
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:43,759
Speaker 1: the federal government to protect Trump. And this should not

831
00:45:43,880 --> 00:45:47,400
Speaker 1: surprise anyone. This is what they do, right, This is

832
00:45:47,440 --> 00:45:49,239
Speaker 1: what they told us they were going to do, and

833
00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:52,200
Speaker 1: this is what they're doing. And none of us should

834
00:45:52,239 --> 00:45:55,320
Speaker 1: be surprised. And everyone is going to have to keep going.

835
00:45:55,400 --> 00:45:57,960
Speaker 1: Everyone is going to have to fight against this. There's

836
00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:03,440
Speaker 1: absolutely no reason that anyone should let this happen because

837
00:46:03,800 --> 00:46:06,360
Speaker 1: it's not right and it's not what they were elected

838
00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:10,560
Speaker 1: for and it's not constitutional. That's it for this episode

839
00:46:10,600 --> 00:46:16,680
Speaker 1: of Fast Politics. Tune in every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and

840
00:46:16,960 --> 00:46:20,920
Speaker 1: Saturday to hear the best minds and politics make sense

841
00:46:20,960 --> 00:46:25,320
Speaker 1: of all this chaos. If you enjoy this podcast, please

842
00:46:25,360 --> 00:46:28,400
Speaker 1: send it to a friend and keep the conversation going.

843
00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:30,000
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening.