1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:05,080 Speaker 1: The fellow ridiculous historians. What is your favorite fairy tale? 2 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:08,680 Speaker 1: They're also dark? Yeah, the real ones, right, the original ones. 3 00:00:08,800 --> 00:00:11,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, the red Shoes. You know about that one cutting 4 00:00:11,080 --> 00:00:13,440 Speaker 2: the feet off. It's like I've heard that referenced in 5 00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:18,000 Speaker 2: a movie recently. But Rapunzel, Uh, the prince I believe 6 00:00:18,040 --> 00:00:21,160 Speaker 2: falls into a briar patch and is blinded, and it's 7 00:00:21,280 --> 00:00:24,040 Speaker 2: you know, all kinds of horrible things happen to that guy. 8 00:00:25,040 --> 00:00:27,800 Speaker 2: I think we've talked about this, Ben, But my exposure 9 00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:29,480 Speaker 2: to a lot of the dark versions of these fairy 10 00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:33,040 Speaker 2: tales came from an anime series that played on Nick 11 00:00:33,159 --> 00:00:35,519 Speaker 2: Junior back in the day that was, I believe just 12 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:39,280 Speaker 2: called Grim's fairy Tales, and it had a version of 13 00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:42,519 Speaker 2: Rapunzel where all of that horrific stuff happened. 14 00:00:43,479 --> 00:00:47,440 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, And like so many other kids growing up 15 00:00:47,520 --> 00:00:51,040 Speaker 1: in the anglosphere, we are familiar with all types of 16 00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:53,720 Speaker 1: fairy tales. When we started to ask ourselves back in 17 00:00:53,760 --> 00:00:58,760 Speaker 1: twenty nineteen whether there was some sort of grain of 18 00:00:58,920 --> 00:01:02,800 Speaker 1: truth to this great game of telephone. So in today's 19 00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:07,560 Speaker 1: classic episode, we're going to ask whether or not a 20 00:01:07,640 --> 00:01:12,200 Speaker 1: lady really used her hair as a ladder h. 21 00:01:12,640 --> 00:01:19,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know that counts very Let's get into it. 22 00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:48,160 Speaker 1: Ridiculous history is a production of iHeartRadio. Man. There are 23 00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:52,280 Speaker 1: so many Catholic saints. Did you know there's a Saint 24 00:01:52,360 --> 00:01:53,920 Speaker 1: Noel and a Saint Benjamin? 25 00:01:54,120 --> 00:01:54,760 Speaker 2: Are you kidding me? 26 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:56,000 Speaker 1: Ben? I am not kidding you. 27 00:01:56,120 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 2: What is the saint of? 28 00:01:57,680 --> 00:02:04,040 Speaker 1: I don't have his his patron saint information here, but 29 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:07,440 Speaker 1: I do know that he was a Jesuit saint, and 30 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:09,800 Speaker 1: I thought it was I thought it was cool. Sometimes 31 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:13,840 Speaker 1: for my friends I search out saints with similar names, 32 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:16,400 Speaker 1: which is not how you decide which you know saint 33 00:02:16,520 --> 00:02:19,200 Speaker 1: is your saint. Yes, I just thought it was neat 34 00:02:19,240 --> 00:02:21,640 Speaker 1: that there was a Benjamin and a noble. 35 00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:24,400 Speaker 2: Both of whom were martyred. Correct? Who were marty Do 36 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:26,160 Speaker 2: you have to be martyred to become a saint? Is 37 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:27,040 Speaker 2: that like a requirement? 38 00:02:27,440 --> 00:02:30,560 Speaker 1: I want to say no, but I am not myself Catholic. 39 00:02:30,560 --> 00:02:32,240 Speaker 2: No, no, nor am I. But I did learn something 40 00:02:32,320 --> 00:02:35,960 Speaker 2: very interesting today. There are several flavors of martyr. Did 41 00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:38,760 Speaker 2: you know this? Yes, there's the proto martyr, who is 42 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:41,720 Speaker 2: like the first martyr in a given region. Then there's 43 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:44,920 Speaker 2: the great martyr, which is like a martyr who was 44 00:02:45,040 --> 00:02:50,040 Speaker 2: martyred under the most nasty of circumstances, like involving torture 45 00:02:50,240 --> 00:02:53,240 Speaker 2: and you know, consternation. You know, Jesus would have been 46 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:56,320 Speaker 2: a great martyr, you know that kind of treatment. And 47 00:02:56,400 --> 00:02:59,480 Speaker 2: that brings us to today's story, which is about fairy tales. 48 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:03,560 Speaker 1: Yes, for anyone curious about the Saint Benjamin, it is 49 00:03:03,600 --> 00:03:05,880 Speaker 1: a deacon. He's a deacon and a martyr as well 50 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:09,400 Speaker 1: in Persia, and he died from merciless torture. 51 00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:12,160 Speaker 2: So a great martyr perhaps, perhaps, Yeah. 52 00:03:11,960 --> 00:03:17,480 Speaker 1: But hopefully we're not torturing our super producer Casey Pegram. 53 00:03:17,919 --> 00:03:19,880 Speaker 2: I just want to give a shout out to Proto Martyr. 54 00:03:20,040 --> 00:03:21,720 Speaker 1: Fantastic band so good. 55 00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 2: I was listening to them today. Yeah, kind of sound 56 00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:29,919 Speaker 2: like Nick Cave meets wire sure and a little bit 57 00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 2: of like television kind of thrown in there. Really really cool. 58 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:35,720 Speaker 2: I highly recommend checking them out as well. Good rat Casey, 59 00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:37,080 Speaker 2: Good rat Casey on the case. 60 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:41,600 Speaker 1: So if you are a fan of this show, odds 61 00:03:41,640 --> 00:03:45,440 Speaker 1: are that you, like us, are fascinated by fairy tales. 62 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:48,560 Speaker 1: I did a lot of research in a different life 63 00:03:48,600 --> 00:03:54,360 Speaker 1: into the origin of fairy tales, which't I'm sure everybody 64 00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:57,040 Speaker 1: knows the origins of fairy tales are much more dark 65 00:03:57,080 --> 00:04:01,360 Speaker 1: and grizzly than the Disney adaptations that you see today. 66 00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:06,080 Speaker 1: Our subject today concerns of fairy tale. It's very well known, 67 00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:11,160 Speaker 1: popularized perhaps by Disney's Tangled film, and that is the 68 00:04:11,200 --> 00:04:15,320 Speaker 1: story of Rapunzel, the trope of a princess locked in 69 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:17,479 Speaker 1: a tower who's got a ton of long hair. 70 00:04:17,839 --> 00:04:20,800 Speaker 2: It's so cool, Ben, because a lot of these stories 71 00:04:20,800 --> 00:04:24,560 Speaker 2: that you're talking about that had very grizzly roots had 72 00:04:24,600 --> 00:04:29,800 Speaker 2: even grizzlier roots before Jacob and Wilhelm Grimm got their 73 00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:32,040 Speaker 2: hands on them and kind of sanitize them, clean them 74 00:04:32,080 --> 00:04:36,000 Speaker 2: up a little bit, because oftentimes the story that led 75 00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:40,159 Speaker 2: to the story was just unbearably grizzly, as we're going 76 00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:42,560 Speaker 2: to get into today. And then when you get to 77 00:04:42,560 --> 00:04:45,479 Speaker 2: stuff like Tangled, another step removed from the Grim Brothers, 78 00:04:45,800 --> 00:04:51,080 Speaker 2: it's even further sanitized. With Rapunzel. It turns out that 79 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 2: the origins of the story of the aforementioned long haired 80 00:04:54,800 --> 00:05:01,880 Speaker 2: princess locked in a tower goes back to pay times. Yeah, yeah, 81 00:05:01,880 --> 00:05:02,719 Speaker 2: you're pagan Rome. 82 00:05:02,960 --> 00:05:05,640 Speaker 1: It goes back to several different places, for sure. A 83 00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:10,400 Speaker 1: lot of fairy tales kind of borrow things from a 84 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:13,920 Speaker 1: lot of earlier, similar, pre existing stories. That's why the 85 00:05:13,960 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 1: Princess locked in a Tower is a trope that occurs 86 00:05:16,600 --> 00:05:21,279 Speaker 1: in more than one place. But this story does have 87 00:05:21,440 --> 00:05:25,719 Speaker 1: a real life incident that happens in Pagan Rome. It 88 00:05:25,880 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 1: concerns someone who became known as Saint Barbara. According to 89 00:05:31,839 --> 00:05:35,240 Speaker 1: the legend, Barbara was the daughter of a wealthy man 90 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:39,120 Speaker 1: living in the third century in a place called Nicomedia, 91 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:43,240 Speaker 1: which is part of modern day Turkey. Her father was 92 00:05:43,400 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 1: super protective and was very, very concerned that the evil 93 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:52,480 Speaker 1: influences of the outside world would corrupt his daughter lead 94 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:56,560 Speaker 1: to her ruination and debauchment. So he locked her in 95 00:05:56,800 --> 00:06:01,359 Speaker 1: a tower, and this gave Barbara a lot of time 96 00:06:01,480 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 1: to think so over her period of isolation, according to 97 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:09,000 Speaker 1: the story, let me amend that this is a legend, 98 00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:13,960 Speaker 1: she what she became convinced that the pagan gods of 99 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:15,760 Speaker 1: Rome weren't all they were cracked. 100 00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:17,599 Speaker 2: Up to be. Yeah, ben I actually saw a version 101 00:06:17,640 --> 00:06:21,400 Speaker 2: of the story where a Catholic priest crept in through 102 00:06:21,440 --> 00:06:25,200 Speaker 2: the window and like schooled her on Catholicism. Because my 103 00:06:25,320 --> 00:06:29,560 Speaker 2: question is if all she knew was the pagan ways. 104 00:06:30,440 --> 00:06:32,200 Speaker 2: How she can all of a sudden have her a 105 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:34,520 Speaker 2: grasp of Christianity. 106 00:06:35,120 --> 00:06:37,479 Speaker 1: Right, that's a great plot hole to point out the 107 00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:40,960 Speaker 1: story where she encounters an agent of the Christian God 108 00:06:41,080 --> 00:06:45,279 Speaker 1: rather than just realizing the Christian God says that the 109 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:48,880 Speaker 1: priest was a Catholic and snuck into her chamber get this, 110 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:52,520 Speaker 1: disguised as a doctor, and that he kept coming and 111 00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:56,520 Speaker 1: over time he taught her the Catholic faith and eventually 112 00:06:57,440 --> 00:06:58,280 Speaker 1: baptized her. 113 00:06:58,360 --> 00:07:00,320 Speaker 2: That's right. There are other versions of the story that 114 00:07:00,360 --> 00:07:02,599 Speaker 2: don't mention the priest at all that implied that she 115 00:07:02,760 --> 00:07:06,080 Speaker 2: was just sort of immaculately gifted with the understanding of 116 00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:09,920 Speaker 2: the Trinity. And this goes back to this idea of 117 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:13,720 Speaker 2: her window arrangement in that tower, right, m. 118 00:07:13,880 --> 00:07:18,520 Speaker 1: Hmmm, Yes, because the story says that originally her father 119 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:21,800 Speaker 1: locked her in a tower that had two windows, but 120 00:07:22,160 --> 00:07:26,520 Speaker 1: when she converted to Christianity, regardless of how she did it, 121 00:07:26,840 --> 00:07:30,360 Speaker 1: she installed a third window in the tower to symbolize 122 00:07:30,880 --> 00:07:33,240 Speaker 1: not a stunning plot twist, the Holy Trinity. 123 00:07:33,320 --> 00:07:35,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, because all that time up there alone, she kind 124 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:36,880 Speaker 2: of figured out masonry too. 125 00:07:36,800 --> 00:07:41,120 Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, and how to make windows, uh, huh yeah. 126 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:43,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, with like what tools exactly. There's another version of 127 00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:46,600 Speaker 2: the story where while her father was away, he had 128 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:50,240 Speaker 2: workmen that were doing some improvements on the land, or 129 00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:53,240 Speaker 2: maybe even installing the windows in the first place, and 130 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:55,800 Speaker 2: that she asked them to put in a third window. 131 00:07:56,120 --> 00:07:59,679 Speaker 2: And then when the father returned and saw this third window, 132 00:08:00,440 --> 00:08:04,120 Speaker 2: he questioned, he said, daughter, what gives she and she 133 00:08:04,160 --> 00:08:06,120 Speaker 2: cops to her new found faith. 134 00:08:06,160 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 1: At which point he yeah, she said, father, I am 135 00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:11,240 Speaker 1: a Christian now, at which point he drew a sword 136 00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:16,400 Speaker 1: to kill her immediately. But she used the power of 137 00:08:16,640 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 1: prayer and created an opening in the wall and then teleported. Essentially, 138 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:25,920 Speaker 1: she was magically transported or I guess in this case 139 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:30,360 Speaker 1: you would say miraculously transported to a mountain gorge and 140 00:08:30,840 --> 00:08:32,679 Speaker 1: two shepherds saw her arrive. 141 00:08:33,280 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, so let's let's take a step back if if 142 00:08:35,920 --> 00:08:39,079 Speaker 2: you're okay with this, Ben, let's pick up the kind 143 00:08:39,160 --> 00:08:42,040 Speaker 2: of more grizzly version, the grim version of the Rapunzel 144 00:08:42,080 --> 00:08:45,200 Speaker 2: story that many people may be unfamiliar with. Do you 145 00:08:45,240 --> 00:08:49,439 Speaker 2: remember a show that was broadcast on Nickelodeon in the 146 00:08:49,480 --> 00:08:53,720 Speaker 2: mid nineties early nineties even that was called Grim's Fairy 147 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:59,880 Speaker 2: tale classics. Yes, so it was a Japanese produced anime SI. 148 00:09:00,240 --> 00:09:01,640 Speaker 2: I think they were like twelve episodes, and I think 149 00:09:01,679 --> 00:09:05,600 Speaker 2: it was distributed in America by ham Saban of Power 150 00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:08,600 Speaker 2: Rangers Fame. And the thing I most remember is that 151 00:09:08,640 --> 00:09:14,120 Speaker 2: the versions of the stories in this cartoon were the 152 00:09:14,200 --> 00:09:17,360 Speaker 2: pretty weird, messed up versions. In the grim version of 153 00:09:17,360 --> 00:09:22,000 Speaker 2: the Rapunzel story, it starts with a married couple. The 154 00:09:22,040 --> 00:09:27,000 Speaker 2: wife is pregnant and she demands some lettuces from this garden, 155 00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:30,240 Speaker 2: this fenced in garden that belongs to it enchantress. Other 156 00:09:30,320 --> 00:09:32,840 Speaker 2: versions say that she's like a medicine woman that has 157 00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 2: the power to use herbs to heal or to her 158 00:09:36,720 --> 00:09:40,800 Speaker 2: or evil witch exactly, and so she finally convinces her 159 00:09:40,880 --> 00:09:43,600 Speaker 2: husband to go in and get her this. It's rampion. 160 00:09:43,679 --> 00:09:46,440 Speaker 2: This is one thing, and also Rapunzel another name for 161 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:48,840 Speaker 2: this kind of root vegetable. You can make a salad 162 00:09:48,840 --> 00:09:51,600 Speaker 2: out of the leaves. And the witch eventually catches him 163 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:56,040 Speaker 2: because he goes back and she agrees not to murder 164 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:59,840 Speaker 2: him on site. But in that classic fairy tale trope, 165 00:10:00,160 --> 00:10:05,040 Speaker 2: he has to surrender his firstborn child that was the 166 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:07,080 Speaker 2: cause of all of this. In the first place right well. 167 00:10:07,080 --> 00:10:10,559 Speaker 1: In her defense, she also, in addition to spirit his life, says, 168 00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:12,319 Speaker 1: I'll give you all the herbs you want. 169 00:10:12,440 --> 00:10:13,319 Speaker 2: That's right, that's right. 170 00:10:13,360 --> 00:10:14,880 Speaker 1: So there's there's another plus. 171 00:10:14,960 --> 00:10:17,280 Speaker 2: But the irony is that the wife only is craving 172 00:10:17,320 --> 00:10:21,400 Speaker 2: these herbs because are the vegetables, because she's pregnant, right, 173 00:10:21,679 --> 00:10:23,080 Speaker 2: And that's a big part of the story too. 174 00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:28,760 Speaker 1: So he agrees, and fast forward to the time that 175 00:10:28,880 --> 00:10:33,520 Speaker 1: the child is born, a girl named Rapunzel of the 176 00:10:33,679 --> 00:10:35,800 Speaker 1: evil witch, by the way many versions of the story, 177 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:39,920 Speaker 1: is named Dame Gothel. How Gothic is that super and 178 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:43,199 Speaker 1: Dame Gothel, upon the child's birth, takes her to raise 179 00:10:43,240 --> 00:10:46,240 Speaker 1: his her own and she actually gives her the name Rapunzel. 180 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:50,800 Speaker 1: And Rapunzel grows up to be a real looker. She 181 00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:53,559 Speaker 1: is the most beautiful child in the world, with long 182 00:10:53,600 --> 00:10:56,560 Speaker 1: golden hair. But as soon as she turns twelve, the 183 00:10:56,600 --> 00:11:00,040 Speaker 1: witch or enchantress locks her up inside a tower in 184 00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:03,160 Speaker 1: the middle of nowhere in the woods. There are no stairs, 185 00:11:03,240 --> 00:11:06,959 Speaker 1: there's no door, there's just one room and one window, 186 00:11:07,520 --> 00:11:11,080 Speaker 1: and the way that the witch visits her is by 187 00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:14,800 Speaker 1: using her hair as rope. So that's where we get 188 00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:18,520 Speaker 1: the famous line Rapunzel, Rapunzel, let down your hair so 189 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:22,120 Speaker 1: that I might climb thy golden stair, or just to 190 00:11:22,160 --> 00:11:26,200 Speaker 1: shout out to prefaf's the more popular modern version. Casey, 191 00:11:26,200 --> 00:11:28,520 Speaker 1: we were talking about this off airic. You guys think 192 00:11:28,520 --> 00:11:30,560 Speaker 1: we could play a clip of that line without getting 193 00:11:30,559 --> 00:11:44,240 Speaker 1: sued perfect perfect, So that's that's not the original line 194 00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:45,760 Speaker 1: is thy golden stairs. 195 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:48,079 Speaker 2: And that's of course the Beastie Boys from the incredible 196 00:11:48,120 --> 00:11:49,200 Speaker 2: album Paul's Boutique. 197 00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:57,760 Speaker 1: And this is how Rapunzel's life is set to be. 198 00:11:57,840 --> 00:11:59,640 Speaker 1: For the rest of her life. As you can imagine, 199 00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:03,480 Speaker 1: she's bored in this tower. She muses herself any number 200 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:06,520 Speaker 1: of ways, combing her incredibly long. 201 00:12:06,280 --> 00:12:08,400 Speaker 2: Hair, possibly learning about masonry. 202 00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:12,960 Speaker 1: Possibly learning masries, singing to herself, building windows, whatever. But 203 00:12:13,080 --> 00:12:13,960 Speaker 1: singing is the key. 204 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:15,880 Speaker 2: Singing is the key because the handsome prince, of course, 205 00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:18,040 Speaker 2: has got to be a handsome prince. Here's this mellifluous 206 00:12:18,080 --> 00:12:21,760 Speaker 2: singing and comes a calling, and then she lets down 207 00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:24,079 Speaker 2: the hair. He doesn't even know. I don't know. It's 208 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:25,439 Speaker 2: unclear to me. How does he get up there in 209 00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:26,920 Speaker 2: the first place. He doesn't know how to ask for 210 00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 2: the hair. 211 00:12:27,880 --> 00:12:28,720 Speaker 1: He stalks her. 212 00:12:28,920 --> 00:12:31,199 Speaker 2: Oh wait, a minute, he does know because he's overheard 213 00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:33,760 Speaker 2: the witch doing it. He stalked her at this point. Yeah, 214 00:12:33,800 --> 00:12:36,720 Speaker 2: that's not creepy at all. He keeps coming back to 215 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:40,640 Speaker 2: listening to singing. It's like, what's going on, I'm so interesting. 216 00:12:40,679 --> 00:12:43,640 Speaker 2: Presumably he even impersonates the voice of the witch to 217 00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:45,439 Speaker 2: get her to let down the hair in the first place, 218 00:12:45,559 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 2: and then all of a sudden he appears to her 219 00:12:47,720 --> 00:12:50,880 Speaker 2: and she's like, whoa, who's this JABBRONI coming in through 220 00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 2: my window? Trying to pretend to be my grandmama, because 221 00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:55,360 Speaker 2: at this point she thinks the witch is like her family. 222 00:12:55,400 --> 00:13:00,280 Speaker 2: She doesn't remember her parents, and they get it on right. 223 00:13:00,320 --> 00:13:04,439 Speaker 1: Eventually, he continues to visit her. The number of visits 224 00:13:04,440 --> 00:13:07,360 Speaker 1: depends on the version you read, and eventually the prince 225 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:10,439 Speaker 1: ask Rapunzel to make an honest man of him, and 226 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:13,600 Speaker 1: they agree to get married, and they say, okay, next 227 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:17,080 Speaker 1: step is that we have to figure out how to 228 00:13:17,200 --> 00:13:21,440 Speaker 1: get you the heck out of here. So they say, look, 229 00:13:21,520 --> 00:13:24,640 Speaker 1: we know when Dame Gothel the enchantress or evil witch 230 00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:27,520 Speaker 1: comes by, So every time the witch comes by, I'll 231 00:13:27,559 --> 00:13:29,760 Speaker 1: be out aside, out of mind, but I'll visit you 232 00:13:29,800 --> 00:13:31,920 Speaker 1: in the night, and when I visit you, I will 233 00:13:31,920 --> 00:13:35,280 Speaker 1: bring you a piece of silk, and I won't bring 234 00:13:35,320 --> 00:13:37,199 Speaker 1: it all at one So just visit night after night, 235 00:13:37,240 --> 00:13:39,679 Speaker 1: bring you a piece of silk, and then you will 236 00:13:40,280 --> 00:13:43,240 Speaker 1: naturally make a ladder out of it, because she has 237 00:13:43,280 --> 00:13:50,400 Speaker 1: also acquired that particular skill or craft. But something goes wrong. 238 00:13:50,440 --> 00:13:52,440 Speaker 2: Well, you know, as things are wont to do in 239 00:13:52,480 --> 00:13:56,960 Speaker 2: the fairy tale world. The witch overhears this plan, and 240 00:13:57,679 --> 00:14:00,920 Speaker 2: while the prince is away, she goes up there, confronts 241 00:14:00,920 --> 00:14:05,000 Speaker 2: her Punzel, lobs off her hair with a butcher's knife 242 00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:07,280 Speaker 2: for like a par of scissors or whatever, depending on 243 00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:11,679 Speaker 2: this the version, and then sends her away into the wilderness. 244 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:16,520 Speaker 1: Yes, in the first edition of the Grim Fairy Tales version, 245 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:21,480 Speaker 1: she says to the witch, without knowing exactly what she's saying, 246 00:14:21,680 --> 00:14:24,640 Speaker 1: that her dress is growing tighter around her waist, which 247 00:14:24,680 --> 00:14:28,520 Speaker 1: is an allusion to pregnancy. That's right, and the and 248 00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:31,120 Speaker 1: the witch catches on. And then in the second edition, 249 00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:34,560 Speaker 1: she cuts off Punzel's hair throws her out in the woods. 250 00:14:35,120 --> 00:14:38,920 Speaker 1: The prince comes calling that night, and the evil witch 251 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:42,440 Speaker 1: lets down the hair that she has cut off. He 252 00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:46,440 Speaker 1: climbs up. You know, we can imagine he's looking forward 253 00:14:46,480 --> 00:14:51,840 Speaker 1: to spending some time with his fiancee, and to his 254 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,480 Speaker 1: utter and abject horror, he meets the witch instead of 255 00:14:55,480 --> 00:14:59,800 Speaker 1: her Punzel, and she says, you're never going to see 256 00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:04,080 Speaker 1: that girl again. She throws him from the tower, which 257 00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:06,200 Speaker 1: I think in most versions of the story, he ends 258 00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:08,600 Speaker 1: up hitting a thornbush and he goes blind. 259 00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:11,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, they poke his eyes out. And that's the thing, dude. 260 00:15:11,680 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 2: In that anime version I was telling you about, it 261 00:15:14,280 --> 00:15:16,880 Speaker 2: does that. It has that happen, and it's sort of 262 00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:19,600 Speaker 2: like it is not like bloody or like you know, scarred, 263 00:15:19,600 --> 00:15:21,920 Speaker 2: weird gouged out eyes or anything, but he's kind of 264 00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:25,040 Speaker 2: got like red, patchy kind of scratch marks all over 265 00:15:25,080 --> 00:15:26,920 Speaker 2: his eyes and they're sort of like closed, you know. 266 00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:31,680 Speaker 2: And then he also wanders the wilderness and eventually here's 267 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:35,360 Speaker 2: that singing that he liked so so well and realizes 268 00:15:35,400 --> 00:15:39,160 Speaker 2: that it's Rapunzel and she has given birth to twin boys, 269 00:15:39,760 --> 00:15:44,280 Speaker 2: I believe according to the Grim version, and then she 270 00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:47,840 Speaker 2: cries tears of joy into his eye holes and he 271 00:15:47,920 --> 00:15:51,080 Speaker 2: is cured and the sight is restored to him. So, 272 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:53,640 Speaker 2: you know, as much trials and tribulation as they go 273 00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:56,000 Speaker 2: through it does ultimately end up with them all living together. 274 00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:57,680 Speaker 2: He takes her back to his kingdom because he can 275 00:15:57,680 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 2: see now and find his way back, and they all happily. 276 00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:02,560 Speaker 2: Ever after, there's. 277 00:16:02,360 --> 00:16:04,840 Speaker 1: A Roguain moment in some versions of the story too, 278 00:16:04,840 --> 00:16:06,680 Speaker 1: because he touched. When he can see again, he touches 279 00:16:06,720 --> 00:16:08,920 Speaker 1: her head and her hair magically grows back, just like 280 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 1: Zup Yep Yep and the evil Witch. When she throws 281 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:16,880 Speaker 1: the guy out of the tower, she ends up dropping 282 00:16:16,960 --> 00:16:20,000 Speaker 1: Rapunzel's hair somehow, and it leaves her trapped in the tower. 283 00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:24,760 Speaker 1: But this, you know, how, we're talking about the amalgamated 284 00:16:24,840 --> 00:16:28,160 Speaker 1: origin of what we call modern fairy tales. We do 285 00:16:28,320 --> 00:16:34,200 Speaker 1: know that Rapunzel itself has, at least the Grimm's version 286 00:16:34,600 --> 00:16:39,640 Speaker 1: does have a more recent than Roman times influence. A 287 00:16:39,720 --> 00:16:44,240 Speaker 1: story called Petro Sinela or Parsley written by a guy 288 00:16:44,280 --> 00:16:48,320 Speaker 1: named Giambattista Basile in his collection of fairy Tales in 289 00:16:48,360 --> 00:16:52,920 Speaker 1: sixteen thirty four. Interesting, and it's kind of the same, 290 00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 1: but it's a little more r rated because the encounters 291 00:16:56,120 --> 00:17:01,480 Speaker 1: between the prince and Rapunzel are much more explicit. Yeah, 292 00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:05,040 Speaker 1: it's a little little more graphic, little more late night 293 00:17:05,240 --> 00:17:09,119 Speaker 1: skinimax got a time, Yeah, indeed, And in the grim version, 294 00:17:09,240 --> 00:17:13,200 Speaker 1: the sex is simply implied by the baby bump, by 295 00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:18,639 Speaker 1: the tightening waist. So back to Saint Barbara. Did she 296 00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:22,040 Speaker 1: have hair long enough to let someone climb up a 297 00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:25,760 Speaker 1: tower using it? Could someone climb up a tower using 298 00:17:25,800 --> 00:17:31,359 Speaker 1: anyone's hair? In Saint Barbara's case, the hair is not 299 00:17:31,359 --> 00:17:34,880 Speaker 1: not as important, it's not really at all. Yeah, it's 300 00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:38,520 Speaker 1: just like you assume she has shared, presumably had a cut, 301 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:39,560 Speaker 1: a pay cut. 302 00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:39,960 Speaker 2: Sure. 303 00:17:40,440 --> 00:17:46,080 Speaker 1: So when we last left Barbara, her father, who in 304 00:17:46,560 --> 00:17:51,720 Speaker 1: this version story is named Diascorus, pursues his daughter somehow 305 00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:57,000 Speaker 1: finds this magic mountain gorge uh, and then he's like, 306 00:17:57,080 --> 00:18:00,679 Speaker 1: where is she? Where is she? And the first share says, 307 00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:02,800 Speaker 1: I don't know, don't talk to me. But the second 308 00:18:02,840 --> 00:18:06,639 Speaker 1: betrays her, and for doing this, this shepherd gets turned 309 00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:09,280 Speaker 1: to stone and all the sheep and his flock are 310 00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:13,880 Speaker 1: turned to locust. And because of this betrayal, Dioscorus does 311 00:18:14,000 --> 00:18:18,399 Speaker 1: find his daughter and he decides what no, not to 312 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:19,480 Speaker 1: kill her himself. 313 00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:22,680 Speaker 2: That's right, well, at least at that moment, but yeah, 314 00:18:23,080 --> 00:18:26,199 Speaker 2: he felt like she deserved, you know, her day in 315 00:18:26,280 --> 00:18:27,320 Speaker 2: kangaroo court. 316 00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:33,119 Speaker 1: Right, which means that she was dragged before the prefect 317 00:18:33,240 --> 00:18:35,639 Speaker 1: of the province, a guy named Martin Aus. 318 00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:39,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, and this is where it really starts to get ugly. 319 00:18:40,640 --> 00:18:44,120 Speaker 2: The court, I guess you could call it, beat her 320 00:18:44,359 --> 00:18:49,919 Speaker 2: mercilessly and beat her with pieces of raw hide on 321 00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:54,080 Speaker 2: her back. They rubbed her wounds with what you'd call 322 00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:56,880 Speaker 2: a fur cloth, I guess, just to kind of exacerbate 323 00:18:56,920 --> 00:19:01,240 Speaker 2: the pain. And at night she, according to this legend 324 00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:06,200 Speaker 2: or story, she prayed to what's referred to in this 325 00:19:06,320 --> 00:19:11,920 Speaker 2: article from OCA dot org as the Heavenly Bridegroom and 326 00:19:12,119 --> 00:19:16,679 Speaker 2: Jesus the Savior. And according to the story of this martyrdom, 327 00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:23,240 Speaker 2: she her wounds were spontaneously healed. And then when they 328 00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:28,280 Speaker 2: found her healed, they beat her and brutalized her even more. 329 00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:31,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, they started to use torches to burn her, or 330 00:19:31,920 --> 00:19:37,240 Speaker 1: attempt to. Those torches went out when they were getting 331 00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:40,760 Speaker 1: close to her body, and they kept trying to torture. 332 00:19:40,920 --> 00:19:45,159 Speaker 1: She kept healing through the power of prayer. OCA, by 333 00:19:45,240 --> 00:19:48,520 Speaker 1: the way, is the Orthodox Church in America website, which 334 00:19:48,600 --> 00:19:53,160 Speaker 1: is a great resource for stories of saints. Eventually, they say, well, look, 335 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:57,680 Speaker 1: she's not going to renounce her Christian faith. She's obviously, 336 00:19:57,880 --> 00:20:04,480 Speaker 1: for some reason, healing very quickly, so they eventually decide 337 00:20:04,960 --> 00:20:09,520 Speaker 1: that they are going to kill her. In one version 338 00:20:09,560 --> 00:20:11,679 Speaker 1: of the story, they say, okay, well, let's see you 339 00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:16,360 Speaker 1: heal from a beheading. In another version, the torture continues 340 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:19,240 Speaker 1: to where her body's raked, wounded with hooks, she's led 341 00:20:19,400 --> 00:20:23,439 Speaker 1: naked through the city as people mock her. Then she 342 00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 1: is eventually beheaded by her father. 343 00:20:27,160 --> 00:20:30,639 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And you know, and this version of the 344 00:20:30,640 --> 00:20:33,879 Speaker 2: story that we're reading is from this religious site, so 345 00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:38,000 Speaker 2: it's kind of presented as fact. It's clearly one version 346 00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:41,600 Speaker 2: of the story that incorporates some of these mystical religious 347 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:46,080 Speaker 2: elements and an added element of come up. And her 348 00:20:46,119 --> 00:20:51,359 Speaker 2: father and the prefect were apparently struck by lightning brought 349 00:20:51,359 --> 00:20:54,359 Speaker 2: on by the wrath of God and instantly killed. 350 00:20:54,600 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 1: What goes around comes around, right. This story continued because, 351 00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:08,160 Speaker 1: as is the case with so many saints, relics of 352 00:21:08,200 --> 00:21:11,760 Speaker 1: her body remained, and in the sixth century, the relics 353 00:21:11,800 --> 00:21:15,040 Speaker 1: of this great martyr Barbara, because as you said, and O, 354 00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 1: there are different types of martyrs, the relics of the 355 00:21:18,160 --> 00:21:22,000 Speaker 1: saint were transferred to Constantinople and then they stayed there 356 00:21:22,040 --> 00:21:25,800 Speaker 1: for six hundred years before they were transferred to Kiev 357 00:21:26,600 --> 00:21:32,359 Speaker 1: by a daughter of the Byzantine emperor Alexius Komenos, who 358 00:21:32,480 --> 00:21:36,200 Speaker 1: was also named Barbara. And that is where these relics 359 00:21:36,400 --> 00:21:41,760 Speaker 1: rest today, at Kiev's Saint Vladimir Cathedral, where an Akathis 360 00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:44,280 Speaker 1: to the Saint is served each Tuesday. 361 00:21:44,359 --> 00:21:48,800 Speaker 2: And here's the thing. The Orthodox Church is largely what 362 00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:53,439 Speaker 2: holds this martyrdom in such high esteem. Because of some 363 00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:58,000 Speaker 2: of the scarcity of real historical records about this she 364 00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:02,000 Speaker 2: actually was taken off the list of martyrs and saints 365 00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:04,960 Speaker 2: in nineteen sixty nine by the Roman Catholic Church. 366 00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:09,360 Speaker 1: It's true, It's absolutely true. But there's pretty compelling evidence 367 00:22:09,400 --> 00:22:14,879 Speaker 1: that this story, this Princess in a tower trope did lend, 368 00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:19,840 Speaker 1: did lend some inspiration to the story that we now 369 00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 1: know as Rapunzel. And of course, if you have seen Tangled, 370 00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:26,720 Speaker 1: a lot of this stuff was cut out of this story. 371 00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:29,360 Speaker 1: And have you seen Tangled? 372 00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:30,360 Speaker 2: No, I have not. 373 00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:32,600 Speaker 1: I have not, But I'm gonna go out on a 374 00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:34,560 Speaker 1: limb and say there probably wasn't a beheading. 375 00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:36,919 Speaker 2: No, I'm pretty sure not. But again, even in that 376 00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:41,040 Speaker 2: I was pretty traumatized by that anime version where the 377 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:44,399 Speaker 2: prince gets his eyes gouged out by thorns, even that 378 00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:47,760 Speaker 2: being the sort of more sanitized version. And it makes sense. 379 00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:53,080 Speaker 2: The Grim brothers were essentially historians, and they collected oral tradition 380 00:22:53,359 --> 00:22:56,720 Speaker 2: of all of these hundreds, I believe, of folk tales 381 00:22:56,840 --> 00:23:01,600 Speaker 2: they then used as inspiration for their Grim's fairy tales. 382 00:23:02,280 --> 00:23:07,280 Speaker 1: And a lot of these older folk tales from an 383 00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:12,280 Speaker 1: academic perspective or a folklore perspective, are immensely and endlessly 384 00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:18,760 Speaker 1: fascinating because they provide a window into the realities of 385 00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:23,480 Speaker 1: the time. Because in the early versions of stories that 386 00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:27,159 Speaker 1: would later inspire this fairy tale or the Grim version 387 00:23:27,280 --> 00:23:30,920 Speaker 1: of the fairy tale, a lot more emphasis is put 388 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:34,920 Speaker 1: on the idea of pregnancy and the use of plants 389 00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:40,600 Speaker 1: as medicinal aids for pregnant women or for people when 390 00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 1: they give birth. And the problem is that this is 391 00:23:43,359 --> 00:23:46,560 Speaker 1: a very dangerous time in a woman's life, because it 392 00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:50,000 Speaker 1: still is. You know, it was such a dangerous time 393 00:23:50,040 --> 00:23:54,359 Speaker 1: because there were many many complications that could result in 394 00:23:54,359 --> 00:23:56,960 Speaker 1: injury or death to the mother or the child. So 395 00:23:57,080 --> 00:24:00,320 Speaker 1: this worry of having to trust someone who who is 396 00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:04,600 Speaker 1: doing things that seem inexplicable, that's right, or him supernatural? 397 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:05,399 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, exactly. 398 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:07,800 Speaker 1: Is a salient and immediate fear. 399 00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:10,800 Speaker 2: I mean it's often a sign of a witchcraft or 400 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:14,480 Speaker 2: seen as such when a woman is close to nature 401 00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:17,000 Speaker 2: and understands how to harness some of these herbs in 402 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:20,120 Speaker 2: ways that the average layperson does not, and that says 403 00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:23,000 Speaker 2: looked upon with suspicion. And it's almost that thing where 404 00:24:23,480 --> 00:24:26,040 Speaker 2: making a bargain with a woman like this, you're sort 405 00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:28,639 Speaker 2: of rolling the dice because you don't know if she 406 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:30,639 Speaker 2: is there to heal or to harm, and you know 407 00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:33,000 Speaker 2: that she potentially has the power to do either, and 408 00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:35,080 Speaker 2: you have to trust her right to do that. So 409 00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:39,719 Speaker 2: it's sort of it's kind of personifying that inherent paranoia 410 00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:42,320 Speaker 2: that comes along with putting your faith in the hands 411 00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:45,560 Speaker 2: of another person who you're not really sure of their 412 00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:46,480 Speaker 2: motives I guess. 413 00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:50,440 Speaker 1: Right, yeah, or you don't trust right sure. And as 414 00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:53,480 Speaker 1: I believe I mentioned in an earlier episode, man, what 415 00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:57,760 Speaker 1: a what a terrible gig to be a healer back 416 00:24:57,800 --> 00:24:59,920 Speaker 1: in that time, because even if you did your best, 417 00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:02,960 Speaker 1: something went wrong, people would decide you were a witch. 418 00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:07,320 Speaker 1: There's one interesting thing that we should probably we have 419 00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:11,359 Speaker 1: to mention right to me, the most fascinating thing about 420 00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:14,439 Speaker 1: saints is that they're often called the patron saint of 421 00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:18,520 Speaker 1: one thing or another. And Barbara des might surprising people 422 00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:24,400 Speaker 1: to learn, is the patron saint of armorers, artillerymen, architects, mathematicians, miners, 423 00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:26,600 Speaker 1: and the Italian Navy, the whole thing. 424 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:30,640 Speaker 2: And if I'm not mistaken, that comes from the idea 425 00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:34,800 Speaker 2: in the story that her abusers were struck dead by lightning, 426 00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:39,560 Speaker 2: because when you're a minor, you're often subject to caven's 427 00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:43,400 Speaker 2: and even explosions from combustible minerals and things like that. 428 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:48,000 Speaker 2: And the idea that Saint Barbara would protect you from 429 00:25:48,119 --> 00:25:51,600 Speaker 2: lightning or from those kind of pitfalls of that profession, 430 00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:52,680 Speaker 2: right yep. 431 00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:56,520 Speaker 1: Absolutely venerated by Catholics who face the danger of sudden 432 00:25:56,560 --> 00:26:01,040 Speaker 1: and violent death at work as well. And her name 433 00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:04,480 Speaker 1: is invoked against thunder and lightning and all accidents arising 434 00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:09,520 Speaker 1: from explosions of gunpowder. And interesting side note, the Spanish 435 00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:15,240 Speaker 1: word Santa Barbara then the corresponding word Santa Barbara signify 436 00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:18,320 Speaker 1: the powder magazine of a ship or a fortress, and 437 00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:21,560 Speaker 1: back in the day it used to be standard operating 438 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:24,280 Speaker 1: procedure to have a statue of this saint at the 439 00:26:24,320 --> 00:26:28,520 Speaker 1: magazine to protect the structure from suddenly exploding. So there's 440 00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:31,800 Speaker 1: the more, you know, star flying over my head. 441 00:26:31,640 --> 00:26:35,120 Speaker 2: In Santa Barbara, California, which is on the coast, has 442 00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:37,639 Speaker 2: a lot of oil and gas fields, and of course 443 00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:41,280 Speaker 2: Santa Barbara is Spanish for Saint Barbara. 444 00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:45,840 Speaker 1: Fascinating, And now we have to ask ourselves what other 445 00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:49,879 Speaker 1: secrets do modern fairy tales or modern versions of fairy 446 00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:53,760 Speaker 1: tales hold for us here in twenty nineteen. We'd like 447 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:57,760 Speaker 1: to hear your story about your favorite fairy tale secrets. 448 00:26:58,040 --> 00:27:00,600 Speaker 1: I'd also like to before we close out the show, 449 00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:04,359 Speaker 1: give a shout out to a new follower I have 450 00:27:04,600 --> 00:27:08,440 Speaker 1: on Twitter that just made my day. I think, Casey Nolan, 451 00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:11,560 Speaker 1: I think you'll both enjoy this. Somebody made a Twitter 452 00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:15,479 Speaker 1: account called ridiculous History out of Context where they just 453 00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:19,879 Speaker 1: take quotes or interactions from us and post them without 454 00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:22,679 Speaker 1: explaining where they came from or what they pertain to. 455 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:24,760 Speaker 2: What we have a joke Twitter account? 456 00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:27,520 Speaker 1: We do, and I don't know who. I don't know 457 00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:29,840 Speaker 1: who does it. I assume you're listening. I just wanted 458 00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:32,320 Speaker 1: to say thanks, so we've arrived. If you want to 459 00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:36,720 Speaker 1: follow them, follow them at out Ridiculous on Twitter. 460 00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:39,680 Speaker 2: I really just do the Instagram thing. You can follow 461 00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:41,440 Speaker 2: me at Embryonic Insider. 462 00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:46,000 Speaker 1: You can follow me at Ben Bollen. You can also 463 00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:48,600 Speaker 1: meet the best part of this show, your fellow listeners 464 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:53,520 Speaker 1: on our Facebook page, Ridiculous Historians. Big thanks as always 465 00:27:53,680 --> 00:27:57,639 Speaker 1: to a super producer, Casey Pegram Casey, I've got to 466 00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:01,000 Speaker 1: look up saints and see which which one you might 467 00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:03,760 Speaker 1: identify with. I'll get back to you over the weekend. 468 00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:07,040 Speaker 2: Big thanks to Alex Williams who composed our theme. Thanks 469 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:11,240 Speaker 2: to Gabe Lucier, our research assistant associate, whatever you want 470 00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:15,000 Speaker 2: to call him. He is the stuff, a genuine gem. 471 00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:18,280 Speaker 2: That guy, Gabe is an absolute gift. We have some 472 00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:21,360 Speaker 2: things coming up for you, so stay tuned. We might 473 00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:25,000 Speaker 2: have some special guests in the mix. We might have 474 00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:29,120 Speaker 2: the return of Christopher Hasiotis. That's right, and in the meantime, 475 00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:31,120 Speaker 2: we would love it very much if you would say 476 00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:34,760 Speaker 2: nice things about the show on iTunes or your podcast 477 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:36,200 Speaker 2: platform of choice. 478 00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:39,760 Speaker 1: Now they'll they'll say that you're supposed to call it 479 00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:41,880 Speaker 1: Apple podcasts now, but don't let them fool. 480 00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:44,440 Speaker 2: You can call it every on. You know what we need. Yeah, 481 00:28:44,840 --> 00:28:54,400 Speaker 2: see you next time, folks. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, 482 00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:57,720 Speaker 2: visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen 483 00:28:57,760 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 2: to your favorite shows.