1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:03,320 Speaker 1: The Coin Bureau Podcast is a production of I Heart Radio. 2 00:00:03,800 --> 00:00:10,080 Speaker 1: So bitcoin has survived in difference scandals, disasters, survived attempts 3 00:00:10,080 --> 00:00:13,600 Speaker 1: to ban it. It's survived divisions within its community. It 4 00:00:13,680 --> 00:00:17,880 Speaker 1: survived hard forks and price crashes and pandemics. It survived 5 00:00:17,920 --> 00:00:21,640 Speaker 1: Elon Musk. Bitcoin is here to stay and it is 6 00:00:21,800 --> 00:00:36,560 Speaker 1: for now still the big daddy of all cryptos. Welcome 7 00:00:36,600 --> 00:00:39,440 Speaker 1: everybody to the Coin Bureau Podcast. My name is Mooch, 8 00:00:39,800 --> 00:00:43,559 Speaker 1: Mad Mike Mooch, and my name is Guy. And today 9 00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:49,319 Speaker 1: we're going to be talking about bitcoin again again. This 10 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:51,200 Speaker 1: is going to be our fourth and I should say 11 00:00:51,360 --> 00:00:55,000 Speaker 1: final episode on bitcoin. Maybe not ever, but for the 12 00:00:55,200 --> 00:00:58,760 Speaker 1: foreseeable future, certainly for the time being. I think, I think, Yeah, 13 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:00,920 Speaker 1: we're gonna we're going to take it up to the present, 14 00:01:01,000 --> 00:01:02,840 Speaker 1: day to day. So we're going to wrap up some 15 00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:06,080 Speaker 1: of the more recent developments in bitcoin. Last time, we 16 00:01:06,160 --> 00:01:10,399 Speaker 1: looked at those two important and really notorious businesses that 17 00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:13,880 Speaker 1: helped bring bitcoin really into the public consciousness. Obviously, one 18 00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:16,960 Speaker 1: was Mount Cox, the exchange that collapsed, and the other 19 00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:21,039 Speaker 1: was the Silk Road, the drugs online dark web drugs 20 00:01:21,040 --> 00:01:25,479 Speaker 1: marketplace where you could buy pretty much anything. So we're 21 00:01:25,520 --> 00:01:28,480 Speaker 1: going to pick up the story from there, cover a 22 00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:30,720 Speaker 1: few more developments, a few more important things that have 23 00:01:30,760 --> 00:01:33,280 Speaker 1: happened to bitcoin since then. So we're going to pick 24 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:36,520 Speaker 1: up from the from the fall of Mount Cox and 25 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:39,560 Speaker 1: the shutting down of the Silk Road and just look 26 00:01:39,600 --> 00:01:41,640 Speaker 1: at a few more things that have happened to bitcoin, 27 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:44,000 Speaker 1: some important events along the way to to where we 28 00:01:44,040 --> 00:01:47,360 Speaker 1: are today. So, as we saw last time, Silk Road 29 00:01:47,480 --> 00:01:51,000 Speaker 1: was shut down and Ross all Brick was arrested in October, 30 00:01:52,480 --> 00:01:56,320 Speaker 1: Mount Cox collapsed in early so kind of kind of 31 00:01:56,360 --> 00:01:59,800 Speaker 1: happened reaguely around the same time. Not a great period 32 00:01:59,840 --> 00:02:03,640 Speaker 1: as we saw for bitcoin, but a few other notable 33 00:02:03,640 --> 00:02:06,800 Speaker 1: events had taken place place prior to all this, and 34 00:02:06,840 --> 00:02:10,960 Speaker 1: a few worth mentioning. So in June we had the 35 00:02:10,960 --> 00:02:14,160 Speaker 1: founding of coin Base. Now, I think it's probably fair 36 00:02:14,200 --> 00:02:17,840 Speaker 1: to say that anyone listening who's ever heard of crypto 37 00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:20,680 Speaker 1: probably has heard of coin base as well. It was 38 00:02:20,720 --> 00:02:24,000 Speaker 1: an exchange, it's now one of the biggest exchanges out there, 39 00:02:24,080 --> 00:02:27,840 Speaker 1: probably the arguably the best known, and it aimed to 40 00:02:27,919 --> 00:02:31,840 Speaker 1: make it safer, safer and easier to buy bitcoin um. 41 00:02:31,880 --> 00:02:34,280 Speaker 1: And yeah, as we can see, it's been around for 42 00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:38,919 Speaker 1: for ten years now. Back in June twelve it was founded, 43 00:02:39,080 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 1: and yeah, it's huge, and obviously it's gone on to 44 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:44,720 Speaker 1: become the first ever crypto exchange to go public. That 45 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:50,040 Speaker 1: happened back in one um and yeah it was so 46 00:02:50,200 --> 00:02:52,639 Speaker 1: it was a pretty It wasn't a big event back then, 47 00:02:52,720 --> 00:02:55,680 Speaker 1: but in hindsight, June and the founding of coin bases 48 00:02:55,840 --> 00:02:58,600 Speaker 1: has proved to be a big moment in crypto. Then 49 00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:03,400 Speaker 1: on the twelfth of my uchten, the Bitcoin blockchain split 50 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:06,000 Speaker 1: in two for a few hours. This was the result 51 00:03:06,040 --> 00:03:10,480 Speaker 1: of a network upgrade that went wrong. What happened was, um, 52 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:13,919 Speaker 1: yeah that that it's split into and started mining kind 53 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:18,040 Speaker 1: of in parallel, and fortunately the developers working on Bitcoin 54 00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:20,679 Speaker 1: were able to fix it fairly quickly. And I think 55 00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:23,720 Speaker 1: what this shows is that then as now a really 56 00:03:23,760 --> 00:03:26,799 Speaker 1: Bitcoin was a work in progress. It's not by any 57 00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:30,519 Speaker 1: means finished or complete. You know, there are still additions, 58 00:03:30,520 --> 00:03:33,680 Speaker 1: there are still improvements, little tweaks being made to the 59 00:03:33,680 --> 00:03:39,400 Speaker 1: bitcoin network even today. Then in April, just a month 60 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:42,920 Speaker 1: after that, after that little um, that little food bar, 61 00:03:43,600 --> 00:03:48,720 Speaker 1: the bitcoin price crossed a hundred dollars for the first time. Though. Yeah, yeah, 62 00:03:48,760 --> 00:03:51,360 Speaker 1: another big moment and It was also around this time 63 00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:55,280 Speaker 1: that the Wink of Os twins discovered bitcoin and they 64 00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:58,320 Speaker 1: got really into it and began buying up a lot 65 00:03:58,640 --> 00:04:03,200 Speaker 1: of BTC and they used the money from their Facebook 66 00:04:03,200 --> 00:04:04,840 Speaker 1: pay out to do it. So do you remember this 67 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:11,080 Speaker 1: story obviously the movie The Social The Two Rowers. Yeah, yeah, 68 00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:15,080 Speaker 1: these these were the two Harvard Harvard students who were 69 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:17,719 Speaker 1: amazing rowers. They went on to row at the I 70 00:04:17,720 --> 00:04:20,600 Speaker 1: think it was the Two Olympics, and they're the twins 71 00:04:20,680 --> 00:04:24,200 Speaker 1: who are portrayed in the in that movie The Social 72 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:27,880 Speaker 1: Network who who got sort of done over by Mark Zuckerberg. 73 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:31,600 Speaker 1: But they eventually won a fairly hefty payout from him. 74 00:04:31,640 --> 00:04:33,360 Speaker 1: I think it was in the region of about sixty 75 00:04:33,400 --> 00:04:37,839 Speaker 1: five million dollars, and very sensibly they elected to take 76 00:04:38,000 --> 00:04:41,159 Speaker 1: quite a lot of it in Facebook stock rather than cash. 77 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:44,200 Speaker 1: And as Facebook became more and more successful, this stock 78 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:48,560 Speaker 1: obviously shot up in value and they, yeah, they invested 79 00:04:48,640 --> 00:04:52,240 Speaker 1: a lot of that money into bitcoin. So kind of indirectly, 80 00:04:52,320 --> 00:04:58,320 Speaker 1: Mark Zuckerberg helped finance bitcoin around this time. Yeah, yeah, 81 00:04:58,480 --> 00:05:01,039 Speaker 1: And what they did they reckon ignized the importance of it, 82 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:03,280 Speaker 1: and they went around they brought up an awful lot 83 00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:05,600 Speaker 1: they brought up, you know, a fairly credible like a 84 00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:10,800 Speaker 1: percentage at least of actual bitcoin in existence, and the 85 00:05:10,880 --> 00:05:15,040 Speaker 1: wink of os Twins that Winkelby have since become that's 86 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:17,839 Speaker 1: what they're called in the movie. They've become pretty big 87 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:20,360 Speaker 1: players in crypto. There's a there's an exchange they found 88 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:24,240 Speaker 1: in an exchange called Gemini. Obviously twins, and they were 89 00:05:24,279 --> 00:05:26,719 Speaker 1: some of the first, if you like, kind of mainstream 90 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:30,200 Speaker 1: finance types to recognize bitcoins potential. You know, they weren't 91 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:33,240 Speaker 1: they weren't computer geeks, they weren't coders or anything like that. 92 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:36,520 Speaker 1: You know, these guys were very much kind of Wall 93 00:05:36,560 --> 00:05:40,799 Speaker 1: Street material, if you like. So it's yeah, it's clear 94 00:05:40,839 --> 00:05:44,200 Speaker 1: that bitcoin is starting to break into mainstream consciousness. That 95 00:05:44,440 --> 00:05:47,520 Speaker 1: Miami thing last ye ye, yeah they were. Yeah, they're 96 00:05:47,520 --> 00:05:49,919 Speaker 1: they're big figures in the well, not just the bitcoin 97 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:52,719 Speaker 1: community but the crypto community as a whole. But yeah, 98 00:05:52,760 --> 00:05:55,040 Speaker 1: they they are a big noise and I think they're 99 00:05:55,080 --> 00:05:57,839 Speaker 1: I think they're sort of that they're involved quite a 100 00:05:57,839 --> 00:06:02,080 Speaker 1: lot with kind of pushing bitcoin on in Washington and 101 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:04,440 Speaker 1: things like that, you know there, I guess to regulators, 102 00:06:04,800 --> 00:06:07,400 Speaker 1: to the politicians, they're the sort of part of the 103 00:06:07,440 --> 00:06:11,080 Speaker 1: acceptable face of bitcoin, if you like. There's a great 104 00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:14,760 Speaker 1: book which I should mention called Bitcoin Billionaires, which talks 105 00:06:14,760 --> 00:06:17,000 Speaker 1: all about the Wink of Oz twins and their discovery 106 00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:18,880 Speaker 1: of bitcoin, and it's good on the early days of 107 00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:22,320 Speaker 1: bitcoin as well and some of how bitcoin and blockchain works. 108 00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:26,200 Speaker 1: It's by the it's by the author of the original book, 109 00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:29,400 Speaker 1: the Social Network Chap, called Ben Mesrick. I'll leave a 110 00:06:29,400 --> 00:06:30,880 Speaker 1: link to it in the show notes, but it's a 111 00:06:30,920 --> 00:06:33,680 Speaker 1: it's a really good book and very readable if you're 112 00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:37,440 Speaker 1: if you're just sort of new to crypto. And around 113 00:06:37,480 --> 00:06:40,240 Speaker 1: this time bitcoin was starting to be talked about by 114 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:43,800 Speaker 1: celebrities and politicians as well. And Bill Gates and Warren 115 00:06:43,800 --> 00:06:46,520 Speaker 1: Buffett they both discussed it on TV. Bill Gates was 116 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:50,320 Speaker 1: quite impressed. I think he was, you know, he obviously 117 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:52,359 Speaker 1: as a computer as the perhaps the king of the 118 00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:56,320 Speaker 1: computer games. I think he could probably be reasonably expected 119 00:06:56,360 --> 00:07:00,280 Speaker 1: to understand what it was about. Warren by Fit, I 120 00:07:00,320 --> 00:07:03,040 Speaker 1: think was a bit more sort of circumspect around this time. 121 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:06,080 Speaker 1: It wasn't quite so sure. You know, it's these guys, 122 00:07:06,160 --> 00:07:09,600 Speaker 1: these sort of titans, if you like, of of business 123 00:07:09,640 --> 00:07:13,000 Speaker 1: and finance are talking about bitcoin on TV. It's come 124 00:07:13,000 --> 00:07:16,120 Speaker 1: a long way since just being kicked around by the 125 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:21,200 Speaker 1: cipherpunks on the Internet, and of course because of all 126 00:07:21,200 --> 00:07:24,120 Speaker 1: this attention, it's also being talked about in Washington as well. 127 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:27,880 Speaker 1: And as you can imagine, a lot of politicians, perhaps 128 00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:30,760 Speaker 1: the majority of politicians who actually knew about it were 129 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:33,880 Speaker 1: not big fans. So we had a lot around that time. 130 00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:36,600 Speaker 1: We had a lot of politicians coming out and making 131 00:07:36,640 --> 00:07:40,520 Speaker 1: all sorts of anti bitcoin noises and generally being very 132 00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:42,680 Speaker 1: negative and I have to say, very ignorant about it 133 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 1: as well, but they weren't politicians. Yeah. I know, it's surprising, 134 00:07:46,440 --> 00:07:48,800 Speaker 1: isn't it. Would there be an ulterior motive for that? 135 00:07:48,880 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 1: That's quite possibly, yes, but not all of them were 136 00:07:54,800 --> 00:07:59,720 Speaker 1: quite so ignorant. And another big moment in November, Jennifer 137 00:07:59,720 --> 00:08:02,080 Speaker 1: shout Ski Calvary, who worked at the U. S. Treasury 138 00:08:02,120 --> 00:08:06,280 Speaker 1: Department and finn Send the Financial Crimes Enforcement Network, she 139 00:08:06,440 --> 00:08:09,440 Speaker 1: talked very positively about bitcoin during a hearing of the 140 00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:13,920 Speaker 1: Senate Banking Committee. So yeah, again, although although there were 141 00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:17,200 Speaker 1: plenty of detractors, other people were starting to take notice 142 00:08:17,200 --> 00:08:19,600 Speaker 1: of it and and realized that it was it was 143 00:08:19,640 --> 00:08:22,960 Speaker 1: a thing, real deal, and of course, around this time, 144 00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:26,280 Speaker 1: it was also starting to take off in China. It's 145 00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:29,640 Speaker 1: it's easy to think of bitcoin being a bitcoin and 146 00:08:29,680 --> 00:08:33,320 Speaker 1: crypto being very much focused on the US, especially these 147 00:08:33,400 --> 00:08:36,960 Speaker 1: days and international baby, yeah, back then, it really was. 148 00:08:37,320 --> 00:08:40,240 Speaker 1: Ever since, I mean, China has since shot itself in 149 00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:43,559 Speaker 1: the foot by by you know, doing its level best 150 00:08:44,040 --> 00:08:47,319 Speaker 1: to outrule crypto and make it impossible to use crypto 151 00:08:47,360 --> 00:08:50,800 Speaker 1: and it's now illegal to mind crypto in China, and 152 00:08:50,840 --> 00:08:53,160 Speaker 1: all this has done is basically cut it off from 153 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:56,120 Speaker 1: the industry much too much to the benefit of places 154 00:08:56,160 --> 00:08:58,400 Speaker 1: like the US. But back back then, you know, back 155 00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:02,920 Speaker 1: around fourteen that sort of time, Chinese China was a 156 00:09:02,960 --> 00:09:06,600 Speaker 1: big market for bitcoin, and actually most of the bitcoin 157 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:09,720 Speaker 1: mining was beginning to was beginning to happen in China, 158 00:09:10,559 --> 00:09:13,760 Speaker 1: which we will will talk about more later on because 159 00:09:13,760 --> 00:09:18,400 Speaker 1: that becomes very important. And also in November, the Chinese 160 00:09:18,400 --> 00:09:23,240 Speaker 1: government is reported to have allowed Chinese citizens to actually 161 00:09:23,280 --> 00:09:26,240 Speaker 1: trade bitcoin. It I don't think it didn't so much. 162 00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:29,360 Speaker 1: It didn't so much sort of um say, yeah, this 163 00:09:29,400 --> 00:09:33,240 Speaker 1: is absolutely fine, you know where it's it's everything's okay 164 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:35,440 Speaker 1: and above board. But it was sort of like, yeah, 165 00:09:35,520 --> 00:09:37,680 Speaker 1: you can you can trade it. You know, we're we're 166 00:09:37,720 --> 00:09:39,839 Speaker 1: open to it. Let's let's see what happens. I think 167 00:09:39,840 --> 00:09:41,880 Speaker 1: they were. They were kind of sitting back and waiting 168 00:09:41,880 --> 00:09:45,200 Speaker 1: to see what would happen with bitcoin. So remember that 169 00:09:45,280 --> 00:09:47,440 Speaker 1: while all these events are taking place, and while all 170 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:50,160 Speaker 1: these big names are kind of discovering it, actual bitcoin 171 00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:53,160 Speaker 1: adoption is kind of chugging along in the background. More 172 00:09:53,200 --> 00:09:55,320 Speaker 1: people are buying it and more people are using it. 173 00:09:55,640 --> 00:09:59,319 Speaker 1: We've got businesses beginning to accept it. It's it's slowly 174 00:09:59,360 --> 00:10:05,080 Speaker 1: but surely taking off. And obviously, as that as adoption continues, 175 00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:08,960 Speaker 1: the price continues to rise. And at the time mount 176 00:10:08,960 --> 00:10:13,240 Speaker 1: gox collapses in early but the bitcoin price is hovering 177 00:10:13,320 --> 00:10:16,600 Speaker 1: at just over eight hundred dollars. So it's it's it's 178 00:10:16,640 --> 00:10:20,280 Speaker 1: serious money now, I think, I mean, in in hindsight, 179 00:10:20,360 --> 00:10:24,000 Speaker 1: that doesn't seem so much. But yeah, at the time, 180 00:10:24,080 --> 00:10:28,679 Speaker 1: it's it's gone from nothing to eight hundred dollars. It's extraordinary. 181 00:10:29,720 --> 00:10:32,840 Speaker 1: It's obviously still the price is still incredibly volatile, and 182 00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:36,000 Speaker 1: I think this only draws more attention to it because 183 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:38,560 Speaker 1: there are such there's so much money to be made. 184 00:10:38,600 --> 00:10:41,079 Speaker 1: It's possible to you know, to to buy it so 185 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:43,760 Speaker 1: cheap sometimes and see it rock it back up, and 186 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:47,480 Speaker 1: it only brings it more into the public consciousness. Then 187 00:10:47,520 --> 00:10:50,560 Speaker 1: we have the two two thousand and fourteen collapse of 188 00:10:50,559 --> 00:10:54,520 Speaker 1: Mount Cox and this in this and all the other 189 00:10:54,520 --> 00:10:57,160 Speaker 1: developments in bitcoin over the last few years mean that 190 00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 1: public interest is just climbing all the time. And this 191 00:11:01,040 --> 00:11:07,160 Speaker 1: explains an interesting little events that happened in March with 192 00:11:07,360 --> 00:11:11,560 Speaker 1: an article in Newsweek. Now Newsweek is fairly kind of 193 00:11:13,080 --> 00:11:18,440 Speaker 1: long established magazine publication, but it had it had been 194 00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:21,400 Speaker 1: encountering some difficulties and I think it's print edition had 195 00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:25,440 Speaker 1: been suspended for a while, but they decided to relaunch 196 00:11:25,640 --> 00:11:29,160 Speaker 1: the print edition in March fourteen, So not long that, 197 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:33,080 Speaker 1: about a month after Mount Cox had collapsed, with an 198 00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:38,760 Speaker 1: article claiming to have unearthed none other than Satoshi Nakamoto. Kamara, 199 00:11:39,120 --> 00:11:42,520 Speaker 1: that's the guy. So the journalist who wrote the story 200 00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:47,720 Speaker 1: identified so Satoshi Nakamoto as being a guy living in California, 201 00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:52,800 Speaker 1: and he had been born Satoshi Nakamoto. How did they 202 00:11:52,800 --> 00:11:56,080 Speaker 1: find him? I know it beggars believe, doesn't it? How 203 00:11:56,080 --> 00:11:59,360 Speaker 1: on Earth? So yeah, everyone was sort of like, um, 204 00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:05,840 Speaker 1: what this anonymous figure who no one did sorry, did 205 00:12:05,920 --> 00:12:10,079 Speaker 1: no one just go who could this Setoshi Nakamoto guy 206 00:12:10,160 --> 00:12:22,800 Speaker 1: be Google Setoshi Nakamoto. Perhaps it's Starker Press found seven. 207 00:12:24,280 --> 00:12:28,320 Speaker 1: Let's let's go through each one. So um, yeah, it's 208 00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:31,400 Speaker 1: it's slightly more complicated than that. So it was this 209 00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:36,360 Speaker 1: Setoshi Nakamoto had been born Satoshi Nakamoto in Japan around 210 00:12:38,760 --> 00:12:41,040 Speaker 1: and he'd moved to the US as a boy in 211 00:12:41,880 --> 00:12:46,440 Speaker 1: nine and instead adopted the name Dorian Nakamoto. But I 212 00:12:46,480 --> 00:12:48,480 Speaker 1: think his I think he was sort of still kind 213 00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:51,679 Speaker 1: of known as Dorian Satoshi Nakamoto. Anyhow, the surname is 214 00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:55,920 Speaker 1: the same. Now, there were some similarities with how people 215 00:12:56,200 --> 00:12:59,800 Speaker 1: perceived the real Satoshi to be. I mean, this Dorian guy, 216 00:12:59,840 --> 00:13:02,200 Speaker 1: he been an engineer for most of his career, he 217 00:13:02,280 --> 00:13:06,840 Speaker 1: had a physics degree, and he was kind of supposedly 218 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:10,280 Speaker 1: fairly like privacy loving, sort of libertarian in his views. 219 00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:14,319 Speaker 1: So there's a bit of overlap with how Setoshi was 220 00:13:15,480 --> 00:13:19,000 Speaker 1: the profile. Yeah, yeah, it too. To the untrained I 221 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:23,200 Speaker 1: perhaps you could be like, yeah, this makes sense. However, 222 00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:27,360 Speaker 1: it quickly became clear that he wasn't the real setoce. Now, 223 00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:29,079 Speaker 1: I don't want to go too much into this here 224 00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:30,800 Speaker 1: because obviously, as I've said, before we're going to do 225 00:13:30,840 --> 00:13:33,360 Speaker 1: a whole episode at some point on on the hunt 226 00:13:33,400 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 1: for Setoce and all the possible candidates. But basically it 227 00:13:36,760 --> 00:13:41,080 Speaker 1: involved almost the world's press pitching up to this guy's 228 00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:44,920 Speaker 1: house when the story broke, and this guy coming out 229 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:50,880 Speaker 1: and being very sort of bewildered to have basically been 230 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:59,439 Speaker 1: docked by you know, internationally renowned news publication. And yeah, 231 00:13:59,480 --> 00:14:02,400 Speaker 1: it was quite clear that this sort of really kind 232 00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:06,440 Speaker 1: of tragic comic spectacle unfolded where he was sort of 233 00:14:06,440 --> 00:14:09,160 Speaker 1: talking to the press and being driven around in search 234 00:14:09,200 --> 00:14:13,040 Speaker 1: of lunch by by journalists. So basically the world's press 235 00:14:13,120 --> 00:14:15,839 Speaker 1: to send on his doorstep. They're taking him out, they 236 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:18,440 Speaker 1: want the hot scoop. They're all whining and dining him. Yeah, 237 00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:21,320 Speaker 1: they're going along with it. Well, yeah, so he appears 238 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 1: and his and appears sort of very confused and bewildered 239 00:14:24,920 --> 00:14:29,440 Speaker 1: and sort of eventually gets, you know, what they're asking him, 240 00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 1: because obviously it's a scrum of reporters, and then I 241 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:34,160 Speaker 1: think he says something along the lines up like well, 242 00:14:34,160 --> 00:14:36,640 Speaker 1: I'm not gonna you know, I'll talk to one of you, 243 00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:40,560 Speaker 1: but I want lunch. So they so I think, like 244 00:14:40,840 --> 00:14:43,400 Speaker 1: a reporter from like the Associated Press or something like 245 00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:45,760 Speaker 1: that basically says, right, I'll take you for lunch. So 246 00:14:45,840 --> 00:14:48,880 Speaker 1: they're get in this car, this reporter's car, and drive 247 00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 1: off with like all these other journalists just tailing them. 248 00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:55,680 Speaker 1: And it became this really weird thing. And I think 249 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:57,440 Speaker 1: they took him for lunch. I can't remember what it 250 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:01,800 Speaker 1: was where they went, but and this guy was interviewing him, 251 00:15:01,840 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 1: and and this guy, Dorian Nakamoto, he clearly it just 252 00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:10,360 Speaker 1: became clear that he wasn't Satoshi, and I think because 253 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:13,560 Speaker 1: he obviously didn't really know what they were talking about. 254 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:19,920 Speaker 1: And then he started referring to bitcom and seemed to think, 255 00:15:20,080 --> 00:15:21,720 Speaker 1: I think that it was a company or something that 256 00:15:21,800 --> 00:15:27,240 Speaker 1: he's supposed to have started, and yeah, it was well 257 00:15:27,240 --> 00:15:29,320 Speaker 1: it was, yeah, it was something like it was something 258 00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:31,800 Speaker 1: like that. And then I think later on they dug 259 00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:34,600 Speaker 1: up because obviously Satoshi is the real Setosi is only 260 00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:36,960 Speaker 1: known through his writing. We've got things like the Bitcoin 261 00:15:37,000 --> 00:15:39,920 Speaker 1: White Paper and various sort of forum posts that he 262 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:42,040 Speaker 1: made over his time. You know, these are the writings 263 00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:45,960 Speaker 1: of Satoshi, the Sacred Text, if you like. And someone 264 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:50,840 Speaker 1: dug up some Amazon reviews that this Dorian Nakamoto had written, 265 00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:53,360 Speaker 1: and I'll have to find them for for the episode 266 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:57,080 Speaker 1: on on on the Hunt for Setoshi. But yeah, it 267 00:15:57,320 --> 00:16:00,640 Speaker 1: quickly became clear that this probably wasn't the same person. 268 00:16:00,840 --> 00:16:07,200 Speaker 1: You know. It's like this toaster is really great. You know, 269 00:16:07,200 --> 00:16:10,880 Speaker 1: maybe he was hiding in plaints, but yeah, it wasn't 270 00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:18,920 Speaker 1: it clearly clearlymo, I guess I am Stosi Nakamoto, just 271 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:21,800 Speaker 1: not that one, not the one that you're thin with, 272 00:16:21,840 --> 00:16:26,680 Speaker 1: the real st. Nakamoto police exactly. Yeah. It was a 273 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:31,880 Speaker 1: very it was a very very weird story, and um 274 00:16:31,920 --> 00:16:34,000 Speaker 1: it was it was actually it was acted. News Week 275 00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:36,760 Speaker 1: go out of print after no I think they survived, 276 00:16:36,760 --> 00:16:39,160 Speaker 1: but I mean it was. It was a real embarrassment 277 00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:41,720 Speaker 1: for them because this was their big relaunch, you know, 278 00:16:41,800 --> 00:16:44,920 Speaker 1: and they quite clearly the reporter that the reporter who 279 00:16:44,920 --> 00:16:47,960 Speaker 1: had been on the story quite clearly not wider the 280 00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:50,600 Speaker 1: mark on his own research. Yeah. Yeah, it was a 281 00:16:50,680 --> 00:16:52,760 Speaker 1: she actually I can't remember her name, but yeah, she 282 00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 1: I think she got she got a lot of she 283 00:16:54,920 --> 00:16:58,480 Speaker 1: got a lot of hate from it. And Newsweek themselves, 284 00:16:58,840 --> 00:17:02,120 Speaker 1: they actually they kind of screwed up because they published 285 00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:05,399 Speaker 1: photos of where this guy lived. What the hell? I 286 00:17:05,520 --> 00:17:07,720 Speaker 1: know so, and I think you could see his car 287 00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:11,480 Speaker 1: number place in this or something. So this guy and 288 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:14,200 Speaker 1: and remember that if he'd been the real Satoshi, then 289 00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:17,560 Speaker 1: he would have he was known to have mined. Satoshi 290 00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:20,320 Speaker 1: was known to have mined about a million bitcoins at 291 00:17:20,320 --> 00:17:25,040 Speaker 1: that point, which even the million dollars. Yeah, he was 292 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:28,720 Speaker 1: sitting on a lot of money potentially. So they kind 293 00:17:28,760 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 1: of docked him and made his address known and where 294 00:17:31,520 --> 00:17:34,080 Speaker 1: he lived. And there was a lot of anger from 295 00:17:34,080 --> 00:17:36,560 Speaker 1: the bitcoin community about this. And actually I think they 296 00:17:36,560 --> 00:17:39,520 Speaker 1: started I think there was a group on Reddit that 297 00:17:39,600 --> 00:17:42,440 Speaker 1: started a group to raise you know, that you could 298 00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:45,840 Speaker 1: donate bitcoin to um in order to to to sort 299 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:49,960 Speaker 1: of give to this Dorian Nakamoto guys what I'm saying. So, 300 00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:51,880 Speaker 1: I think they raised about a hundred bitcoin for him. 301 00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:57,879 Speaker 1: Talk do you want me to put your address out? Yeah? Um, 302 00:17:58,080 --> 00:18:01,359 Speaker 1: so it kind of I'm yeah, it wasn't great for 303 00:18:01,400 --> 00:18:03,800 Speaker 1: the guy, but he did imagine he was the actual 304 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:06,080 Speaker 1: and it was just all a triple bluff and it's 305 00:18:06,119 --> 00:18:08,840 Speaker 1: like but more, I think a lot of people speculated 306 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:11,399 Speaker 1: that they were like, he's just playing dumb, you know, 307 00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:13,720 Speaker 1: he's he knows that he's been found and he knows 308 00:18:13,760 --> 00:18:15,600 Speaker 1: that the only way is to just sort of go 309 00:18:15,720 --> 00:18:20,000 Speaker 1: the other way. So yeah, the bitcoin community reacted pretty 310 00:18:20,200 --> 00:18:22,880 Speaker 1: pretty angrily this whole Newsweek thing, and they had a point, 311 00:18:22,920 --> 00:18:24,840 Speaker 1: I think, you know, this poor guy had basically been 312 00:18:25,720 --> 00:18:32,360 Speaker 1: his life turned upside down exactly the bitcoin all for all, 313 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:37,240 Speaker 1: for all for lunch, well and a hundred bitcoin. But yeah, 314 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:39,600 Speaker 1: so the bitcoin community, they kind of they were up 315 00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:42,840 Speaker 1: in arms about it, and some of them went out 316 00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:46,200 Speaker 1: and got some money together for this guy. Others, unfortunately, 317 00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:50,119 Speaker 1: went and left death threats on the authors on the 318 00:18:50,119 --> 00:18:53,040 Speaker 1: Newsweek authors journalists twitter page and all that sort of, 319 00:18:53,080 --> 00:18:55,919 Speaker 1: you know, all the kind of completely unacceptable stuff. But 320 00:18:56,160 --> 00:18:59,200 Speaker 1: I think at this point actually mentioning the bitcoin community, 321 00:18:59,240 --> 00:19:01,520 Speaker 1: it's probably a good moment to talk about the bitcoin 322 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:05,400 Speaker 1: community in general, because they are kind of they are 323 00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:10,119 Speaker 1: now kind of central to to the whole bitcoin project really, 324 00:19:10,200 --> 00:19:13,960 Speaker 1: and obviously in the early days, they were the earliest 325 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:17,400 Speaker 1: members of the bitcoin community, were the driving force behind bitcoin, 326 00:19:17,640 --> 00:19:20,000 Speaker 1: helped it, they helped it get out into the wild, 327 00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:23,439 Speaker 1: and it was only because these people believed in this 328 00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:26,879 Speaker 1: and worked on improving it and promoting it that it survived. 329 00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:29,600 Speaker 1: And obviously this takes us back to the hal Finnies 330 00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:32,480 Speaker 1: and the Gavin Andresen's and the Marty Malmie's people like that, 331 00:19:32,520 --> 00:19:35,480 Speaker 1: also Mike Hearn who did a lot of development work 332 00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:39,520 Speaker 1: on bitcoin as well. But we then saw I think, 333 00:19:39,920 --> 00:19:42,040 Speaker 1: if you remember when we started talking about the early 334 00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:44,399 Speaker 1: days of Mount cox, we saw these this new breed 335 00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:47,000 Speaker 1: of bitcoin or emerged, the kind of entrepreneurial type. So 336 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:50,480 Speaker 1: Jed mcleb obviously who who started mount Gox before he 337 00:19:50,720 --> 00:19:53,000 Speaker 1: sold it. And then you have the likes of the 338 00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:55,240 Speaker 1: wink off Os twins who we've talked about, and then 339 00:19:55,560 --> 00:19:58,240 Speaker 1: Brian Armstrong and Fred Urson who were the guys who 340 00:19:58,240 --> 00:20:01,080 Speaker 1: founded coin base. You know, so he's more these guys 341 00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:03,840 Speaker 1: kind of more business focused, if you like, still still 342 00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:07,040 Speaker 1: bitcoin believers, but they've obviously you know that they can 343 00:20:07,080 --> 00:20:11,320 Speaker 1: see that there's there's there's business potential in it. And 344 00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:14,960 Speaker 1: because bitcoin is such a transformative technology and such a 345 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:18,520 Speaker 1: challenge to the status quo, people naturally feel very strongly 346 00:20:18,520 --> 00:20:21,040 Speaker 1: about it. There's no getting around the fact that bitcoin 347 00:20:21,080 --> 00:20:24,639 Speaker 1: has become something of a religion in a lot of ways. 348 00:20:25,320 --> 00:20:28,560 Speaker 1: People feel so strongly about it. So and if you like, 349 00:20:28,640 --> 00:20:31,080 Speaker 1: I mean, it's got this this kind of creation myth. 350 00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:34,480 Speaker 1: If you like this this mysterious god, will he rise 351 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:37,360 Speaker 1: again and reappear? Yeah? Will yeah? Will he come? Will 352 00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:39,280 Speaker 1: he come back to save us all and show us 353 00:20:39,280 --> 00:20:42,640 Speaker 1: the way? And obviously it's it's kind of a new 354 00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:45,080 Speaker 1: way of looking at the world and solving its problems. 355 00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:48,520 Speaker 1: It's and it's got its sacred text like I mentioned earlier, 356 00:20:48,520 --> 00:20:51,120 Speaker 1: the Bitcoin White Paper, and then you know Satoshi's other 357 00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:53,280 Speaker 1: sort of writings is foreign posts and stuff like that. 358 00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:56,760 Speaker 1: That's it's Bible. If you like, You've got kind of 359 00:20:56,760 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 1: persecution from the powers that be a bit like that 360 00:20:59,080 --> 00:21:03,040 Speaker 1: the Romans persecuted the early Christians. And then you've got 361 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:06,600 Speaker 1: a growing band of believers. Some are some are welcoming, 362 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:10,040 Speaker 1: some are hostile. And then of course this is something 363 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:12,600 Speaker 1: that I think is really central to to bitcoin and 364 00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:16,199 Speaker 1: the bitcoin community. You've got conflicting ideas on how the 365 00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:18,600 Speaker 1: whole show should be run. A bit like you have 366 00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:23,000 Speaker 1: Protestant and Catholics and all the others with Christianity. Yeah, 367 00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:25,320 Speaker 1: this this new religion is sort of no one can 368 00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:28,440 Speaker 1: everyone's who's the right idea? Yeah, who's going to be pope? 369 00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:31,160 Speaker 1: Who's in charge? And of course the Bitcoin no one's 370 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:37,760 Speaker 1: in charge. Um, certainly not him, certainly not him. So yeah, 371 00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:41,480 Speaker 1: the bitcoin communities are pretty it's a pretty broad church today. 372 00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:46,879 Speaker 1: And notably we've seen the emergence of bitcoiners who really 373 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:49,960 Speaker 1: don't have any time for the wider world of crypto. 374 00:21:50,320 --> 00:21:53,480 Speaker 1: They believe bitcoin to be the one and only. These 375 00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:58,639 Speaker 1: guys are called bitcoin maximalists. Okay, and yeah, they're becoming 376 00:21:58,800 --> 00:22:01,920 Speaker 1: more and more part of the bitcoin landscape. If you 377 00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:06,840 Speaker 1: like Maxi's Bitcoin Maxi's Yeah, so a couple of exists. 378 00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:09,480 Speaker 1: I mean Jack Dawsey, the guy who founded Twitter and 379 00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:12,880 Speaker 1: is now Square or block as it's now called. He's 380 00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:15,520 Speaker 1: a he's a Bitcoin Maxi. He's Bitcoin above all else. 381 00:22:16,119 --> 00:22:19,080 Speaker 1: And then you also have the Micro Strategy CEO Michael Sailor, 382 00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:22,280 Speaker 1: the guy who who basically spends all his company treasury 383 00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:25,200 Speaker 1: on bitcoin. And you know, it has just become like 384 00:22:25,280 --> 00:22:29,280 Speaker 1: a profit if you like a profit of bitcoin. And 385 00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:32,080 Speaker 1: I should point out at this stage mentioning sort of 386 00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:35,199 Speaker 1: other cryptocurrencies and Bitcoin maxis how they're opposed to it. 387 00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:38,359 Speaker 1: Although we are focusing on Bitcoin here, other cryptos are 388 00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:41,720 Speaker 1: beginning to emerge around this time. So actually light Coin, 389 00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:44,480 Speaker 1: which was one of the perhaps the first old coin, 390 00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 1: if you like that was that was launched in late 391 00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:49,960 Speaker 1: two thousand and eleven, So that's been on the scene 392 00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:53,520 Speaker 1: for a while by this point. And Ethereum the first 393 00:22:53,560 --> 00:22:56,840 Speaker 1: came into the public consciousness sort of early fourteen, I 394 00:22:56,880 --> 00:23:01,160 Speaker 1: think at the actually, weirdly enough, at a bitcoin conference 395 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:05,600 Speaker 1: Vitalic Buteran, who will talk about another episode. He was 396 00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:09,760 Speaker 1: he was deeply into bitcoin, but he yeah, he decided 397 00:23:09,800 --> 00:23:12,159 Speaker 1: to go a different way. And I think Etherorium itself 398 00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:16,600 Speaker 1: actually launched in I think it was. So there are 399 00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:19,399 Speaker 1: kind of rivals, if you like, like Bitcoin is no 400 00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:22,399 Speaker 1: longer the one and only, although the Bitcoin max is 401 00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:24,880 Speaker 1: will will have you believe otherwise. So there are other 402 00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:28,200 Speaker 1: cryptocurrencies starting to emerge at this time, and a lot 403 00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:33,439 Speaker 1: of bitcoiners take very strongly against them, and you know, 404 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:36,119 Speaker 1: many other people, many people embrace these other cryptos and 405 00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:38,840 Speaker 1: the crypto market in general. You know, it's a lot 406 00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:42,400 Speaker 1: of people were kind of, if you like, cryptoagnostic. They 407 00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:44,560 Speaker 1: just believe in crypto. You know that everyone has their 408 00:23:44,560 --> 00:23:48,680 Speaker 1: favorite coins or tokens or projects or whatever. But many 409 00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:51,560 Speaker 1: saw these other cryptos as just poor imitators. A bitcoin 410 00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:54,200 Speaker 1: quite like the idea of like, you know, different currencies, 411 00:23:54,280 --> 00:24:00,760 Speaker 1: different cryptocurrencies to know or here your dollar, those pounds, 412 00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:07,320 Speaker 1: you know, rubles whatever. Yeah, but you've just got Ethereum. 413 00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:09,840 Speaker 1: I think it's and they all do different things. I 414 00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:12,920 Speaker 1: mean a lot, a lot. There are a lot competing 415 00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:16,240 Speaker 1: in the same niche, and you know, not all of 416 00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:18,520 Speaker 1: them will survive in their current form. And I think 417 00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:21,639 Speaker 1: in in the future, as as time goes on, certain 418 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:25,240 Speaker 1: cryptos will disappear, certain certain other ones will emerge, and 419 00:24:25,400 --> 00:24:27,480 Speaker 1: we might be quite surprised looking back on this in 420 00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:30,800 Speaker 1: ten years time, which which ones are powering through and 421 00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:34,120 Speaker 1: which ones are brand new. Yeah. But yeah, I completely 422 00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:37,480 Speaker 1: agree with you. I mean, I'm I'm cryptoagnostic. If you like, 423 00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:40,080 Speaker 1: there are there are There are plenty of cryptos that 424 00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:42,000 Speaker 1: I like. There are quite a few that I don't, 425 00:24:42,560 --> 00:24:44,080 Speaker 1: But I believe in a sort of if you like, 426 00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:48,320 Speaker 1: a multi crypto future. Yeah, And and each crypto project 427 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:50,200 Speaker 1: is going to do a slightly different thing. We see 428 00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:52,760 Speaker 1: this now with Bitcoin and Ethereum. You know, people compare 429 00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:55,119 Speaker 1: them and say, oh, there their rivals, you know, but 430 00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:58,720 Speaker 1: they're not. They do different things. And we'll we'll dig 431 00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:00,280 Speaker 1: into this a lot more when we come to talk 432 00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:05,680 Speaker 1: about Ethereum in particular, but many bitcoiners, for instance, called 433 00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:08,720 Speaker 1: Ethereum a scam when it launched. They were openly hostile 434 00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:10,760 Speaker 1: to it and a lot of other cryptos. And this 435 00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:13,240 Speaker 1: is this is an attitude that persists to this day. 436 00:25:13,560 --> 00:25:16,400 Speaker 1: These views have in fact become kind of more entrenched. 437 00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:19,480 Speaker 1: And bitcoin maxis I mean, there are plenty who are 438 00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:24,160 Speaker 1: you know, just like perfectly perfectly cool and just like, yeah, 439 00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:26,800 Speaker 1: I just love bitcoin and I don't care for all 440 00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:29,840 Speaker 1: the others. Some of them, though, can get pretty aggressive 441 00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:32,640 Speaker 1: about and we'll go to the extent that all other 442 00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:37,679 Speaker 1: cryptos are either scams or just outright ship coins or whatever. 443 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:42,920 Speaker 1: So toxic maximalism, as we now call it, is a thing, 444 00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:46,919 Speaker 1: is a thing. It's tribalism. Yeah. We touched on this 445 00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:50,200 Speaker 1: with with you know, it's kind of like a football 446 00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:53,840 Speaker 1: team and how you're blinded by you know, your action 447 00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:57,080 Speaker 1: for this thing is the same religion as well to 448 00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:01,840 Speaker 1: a certain extent, or politics or yeah. People yeah, people, 449 00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:06,840 Speaker 1: people get behind a certain certain movement of certain ideology. Yeah, 450 00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:09,560 Speaker 1: and it's it's no different with crypto. And of course 451 00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:11,640 Speaker 1: there are plenty of other There are plenty of other 452 00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:13,879 Speaker 1: I mean, there are different MAXI. There are max is 453 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:16,360 Speaker 1: now there are certain people who will say, I mean, 454 00:26:16,440 --> 00:26:20,200 Speaker 1: you have communities like the link Marines for chain Link, 455 00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:24,680 Speaker 1: who will aggressively defend chain link against anyone who criticizes 456 00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:28,640 Speaker 1: the XRP Army would do the same with with x rps. So, yeah, 457 00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:32,000 Speaker 1: this toxic maximalism is a thing, and it's it's a 458 00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:34,720 Speaker 1: thing throughout the whole of crypto, but it's it's particularly 459 00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:38,359 Speaker 1: pronounced with bit. Now we're going to talk a bit 460 00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:40,520 Speaker 1: more about this. Let's take a break first before we 461 00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:57,720 Speaker 1: dig down into toxic maximism. So be wt back. We 462 00:26:57,720 --> 00:27:01,320 Speaker 1: were talking about bitcoin maxis um and called this particular 463 00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:06,520 Speaker 1: section of it differences of opinion, how very very very diplomatically. 464 00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:09,600 Speaker 1: I know, I know, isn't it just so crabs in 465 00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:14,520 Speaker 1: a bucket? Yeah? I like that. Let's rename this this 466 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:17,320 Speaker 1: section crabs in a bucket. I think that's good. Okay. 467 00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:20,359 Speaker 1: So at the heart of the bitcoin community you have 468 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:24,119 Speaker 1: this I guess duality if you like. So it's full 469 00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,960 Speaker 1: of super smart people working hard to advance Bitcoin for 470 00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:31,040 Speaker 1: the benefit of others. That people are building businesses on 471 00:27:31,040 --> 00:27:34,200 Speaker 1: on bitcoin, They're working on improvements to the network, they're 472 00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:36,600 Speaker 1: helping to publicize and promote it and get the word 473 00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:40,520 Speaker 1: out too. And see that not just you know, people 474 00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:42,719 Speaker 1: here in the developed world, here in the West, if 475 00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:45,199 Speaker 1: you like, have access to it, but actually people in 476 00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:47,680 Speaker 1: poorer countries get access to it too and get to 477 00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:52,760 Speaker 1: learn about it. Yeah, the unbanked, Yeah, yeah, which is 478 00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:55,760 Speaker 1: what bitcoin is all about. So you know, these people, 479 00:27:55,760 --> 00:27:57,199 Speaker 1: and there are lots of people, there are far too 480 00:27:57,240 --> 00:27:59,760 Speaker 1: many to mention, but if you like, I mentioned three, 481 00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:01,760 Speaker 1: and you've got the likes of Jack Mallers, who is 482 00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:04,719 Speaker 1: building the Strike app, which is you know, which is 483 00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:08,400 Speaker 1: making use of the Lightning network to basically helped make 484 00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:11,480 Speaker 1: Bitcoin and more kind of viable payment network, if you like, 485 00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:14,639 Speaker 1: and that's being rolled out, you know, especially in El Salvador. 486 00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:18,280 Speaker 1: You've also got Peter Woolley, who is one of the 487 00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:22,159 Speaker 1: Bitcoin core developers sort of you know, constantly working on 488 00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:25,000 Speaker 1: the code. And and then you've got Peter McCormick, who 489 00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:28,360 Speaker 1: is a self self proclaimed bitcoin maxie. He's a he's 490 00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:30,840 Speaker 1: another podcaster. He does he does the What Bitcoin Did 491 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,600 Speaker 1: podcast and he's great as well, you know, all about 492 00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:36,480 Speaker 1: just getting getting the word out about bitcoin, talking to 493 00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:40,400 Speaker 1: people in the Bitcoin community and helping helping people across 494 00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:43,120 Speaker 1: the world get to know about bitcoin and get to 495 00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:46,000 Speaker 1: use it. So you've got these amazing people like those, 496 00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:49,760 Speaker 1: and then you've got tons of developers who work anonymously 497 00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:53,360 Speaker 1: or pseudonymously on the bitcoin core software. They don't really 498 00:28:53,360 --> 00:28:56,840 Speaker 1: get much much credit, but yeah, they're they're working hard, 499 00:28:56,920 --> 00:29:00,480 Speaker 1: they're working selflessly to to make bitcoin better, to get 500 00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:02,560 Speaker 1: it out there into the world. So you've got this, 501 00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:06,320 Speaker 1: You've got this huge part of the bitcoin community who 502 00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:10,000 Speaker 1: are doing great things, you know, great people. You've also 503 00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:15,880 Speaker 1: got quite a lot of douchebags. Hey, Hey, of which 504 00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:18,600 Speaker 1: I count you as perhaps the leader of the of 505 00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:23,160 Speaker 1: the bitcoin community. Yeah. It's yeah, the bitcoin bitcoin community 506 00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:26,240 Speaker 1: is by and large amazing, But I guess, like anything, 507 00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:29,200 Speaker 1: there are I guess perhaps when you go to a 508 00:29:29,280 --> 00:29:33,040 Speaker 1: Chelsea game at Stanford Bridge, most of the Chelsea fans 509 00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:36,600 Speaker 1: there are amazing people just cheering on there to get 510 00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:38,840 Speaker 1: some rotten eggs. Yeah, and then you get some people 511 00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:42,160 Speaker 1: who are just like, I'm yeah, I don't don't want 512 00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:45,120 Speaker 1: to have a drink with you afterwards. Yeah, So it's 513 00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:47,400 Speaker 1: I guess, like you say, it's the same with any 514 00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:52,080 Speaker 1: any thing that people get behind any any community driven thing, 515 00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:53,760 Speaker 1: and that the rule is going to be as you say, 516 00:29:53,840 --> 00:30:00,480 Speaker 1: as you say bad apples, rotten eggs, rotten eggs, I'm sorry, well, um, 517 00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:03,840 Speaker 1: and look, in many ways Bitcoin is well, I mean, 518 00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:06,960 Speaker 1: Bitcoin is the original invest it's it had the fairest 519 00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:10,480 Speaker 1: launch of any crypto, for instance. Now, so Toshi put 520 00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:12,080 Speaker 1: it out into the world for all to use. He 521 00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:14,160 Speaker 1: didn't allocate a whole bunch of coins to himself. I 522 00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:17,760 Speaker 1: mean he did mind them personally, because there was no 523 00:30:17,800 --> 00:30:20,760 Speaker 1: one else doing it. So, but it's not like you 524 00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:23,240 Speaker 1: see a lot of crypto projects launched these days and 525 00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:25,120 Speaker 1: launched back in the I c O boom of sort 526 00:30:25,120 --> 00:30:28,400 Speaker 1: of two thousands seventeen, and you know, huge amounts of 527 00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:31,000 Speaker 1: the coin or token allocated to the founders and to 528 00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:33,320 Speaker 1: the team and to early investors and all that sort 529 00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:36,600 Speaker 1: of stuff. And this is something that Bitcoin Maxi's point 530 00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:38,960 Speaker 1: out a lot, and they've they've got a point. Bitcoin. 531 00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:40,560 Speaker 1: On the other hand, it was just put out if 532 00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:42,240 Speaker 1: you if you wanted to mind it, then you could, 533 00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:45,840 Speaker 1: and you know, good luck to you. And it's also 534 00:30:45,920 --> 00:30:49,000 Speaker 1: the most decentralized crypto of all. There's no single personal 535 00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:51,840 Speaker 1: or entity who has any control over the Bitcoin network, 536 00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:54,000 Speaker 1: and there are thousands, if not tens of thousands of 537 00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:57,880 Speaker 1: notes spread out across the world, and most other cryptos 538 00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:01,720 Speaker 1: a few honorable exceptions, but most other cryptos do have 539 00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:04,760 Speaker 1: some sort of point that can be attacked, either you know, 540 00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:06,960 Speaker 1: either a kind of company that's running it or a 541 00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:11,480 Speaker 1: nonprofit that's responsible for its development, or just a founder, 542 00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:14,680 Speaker 1: you know, a well known figure who can be who 543 00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:17,840 Speaker 1: can be leaned on, who can be you know, hauled 544 00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:20,120 Speaker 1: up in front of a select committee or something like that. 545 00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:27,440 Speaker 1: So lots of cryptocurrencies make large claims about being truly decentralized, 546 00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:31,040 Speaker 1: and the fact is that most of them aren't, and 547 00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:35,120 Speaker 1: they could be. They could be working towards decentralization, and 548 00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,680 Speaker 1: some of them have made great leaps in that direction 549 00:31:37,760 --> 00:31:40,400 Speaker 1: and would be very hard to take down. But Bitcoin 550 00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:43,280 Speaker 1: is the most decentralized crypto of hall and it's really 551 00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:46,760 Speaker 1: important to understand that whatever whatever side of the fence 552 00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:48,800 Speaker 1: you fall on, whether you're a Bitcoin MAXI, whether you're 553 00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:51,920 Speaker 1: an Eath MAXI, or you know, not really fussed either way, 554 00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:54,760 Speaker 1: there's really no getting around the fact that Bitcoin is 555 00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:58,200 Speaker 1: the most decentralized and of course, as a result of that, 556 00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:01,480 Speaker 1: it's the most secure. And again, I know I labor 557 00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:05,280 Speaker 1: this point a lot, but Bitcoin itself has never been 558 00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:10,000 Speaker 1: successfully hacked, and I think it's arguably impossible to destroy. 559 00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:16,240 Speaker 1: Now that the level of inter governmental, international cooperation that 560 00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:20,760 Speaker 1: would have to happen to destroy the Bitcoin network is 561 00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:26,360 Speaker 1: just so fanciful, so unprecedented, I can't I can't see 562 00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:28,760 Speaker 1: it even being possible, even if there was a real 563 00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:32,640 Speaker 1: desire amongst nations to do it, I think it would 564 00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:37,160 Speaker 1: be almost Bitcoin is almost impossible to destroy. And again, 565 00:32:37,200 --> 00:32:40,680 Speaker 1: you can't say this about about any other crypto. I mean, 566 00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:43,720 Speaker 1: Ethereum is kind of it's its nearest rival in in 567 00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:47,480 Speaker 1: terms of decentralization and things like this, and again taking 568 00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:50,760 Speaker 1: down Ethereum would be a tough ask, but Bitcoin is 569 00:32:50,800 --> 00:32:55,680 Speaker 1: the daddy in that respect. Now, what these amazing qualities 570 00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:59,160 Speaker 1: of Bitcoin do have, though, they do present something of 571 00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:04,160 Speaker 1: a drawback because it is very and I mean very 572 00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:08,880 Speaker 1: difficult to actually updo anything, upgrade if you like the 573 00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:11,720 Speaker 1: Bitcoin network. So if there's an improvement to be made, 574 00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:14,120 Speaker 1: if there's a patch to be to be implemented or 575 00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:17,760 Speaker 1: anything like this, actually doing it is tricky as hell 576 00:33:18,040 --> 00:33:21,960 Speaker 1: because of this decentralization. Because there is no one person 577 00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:24,600 Speaker 1: in charge, you can go all right, yep, we're doing this. 578 00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:27,720 Speaker 1: It's there has to be there has to be consensus 579 00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:30,560 Speaker 1: amongst miners. There has to be a majority of miners 580 00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:35,680 Speaker 1: and developers on the network agreeing to implement any any changes. 581 00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:39,400 Speaker 1: Now this doesn't mean that it's it's it's impossible to 582 00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:42,320 Speaker 1: change Bitcoin, to make adjustments to the code. And we 583 00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:45,520 Speaker 1: actually had one fairly recently, an upgrade called tap root, 584 00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:49,360 Speaker 1: which took place I think it was November one, and 585 00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:52,440 Speaker 1: this was I mean, it was fairly sort of fairly 586 00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:55,200 Speaker 1: small as upgrades go, but it was it was it 587 00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:58,680 Speaker 1: was a big moment because it made changes to the 588 00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:02,120 Speaker 1: Bitcoin protocol. And this is, as I say, very difficult 589 00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:06,520 Speaker 1: to do. And it's also because of this kind of 590 00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:09,080 Speaker 1: tied into this, it's actually also very difficult to build 591 00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:13,480 Speaker 1: any applications on top of Bitcoin. It functions as this 592 00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:18,600 Speaker 1: network of exchanging value um, but actually doing anything else 593 00:34:18,680 --> 00:34:21,320 Speaker 1: with it, actually building anything that can run on top 594 00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:25,600 Speaker 1: of the Bitcoin network is also very difficult. Again for 595 00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:29,680 Speaker 1: the same reasons. It's decentralization. This no one point of 596 00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:33,840 Speaker 1: you know, no one person or entity or in the 597 00:34:33,920 --> 00:34:37,720 Speaker 1: decision making process, if you like. And this was why 598 00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:41,839 Speaker 1: Ethereum was actually created. Vitalic buere In, the guy who 599 00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:45,359 Speaker 1: wrote that the Ethereum white paper, he was frustrated. He 600 00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:48,480 Speaker 1: loved bitcoin, he he wrote about it. He was he 601 00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:51,480 Speaker 1: was a big disciple of it. But he saw fairly 602 00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:54,680 Speaker 1: early on the limitations. There were limitations, and that's what 603 00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:57,040 Speaker 1: he set out to do with Ethereum. And again, we'll 604 00:34:57,080 --> 00:34:58,680 Speaker 1: we'll look at this more when we when we talk 605 00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:04,320 Speaker 1: about Ethereum in general. Um. Now, these difficulties, these challenges 606 00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:08,439 Speaker 1: for upgrading Bitcoin ultimately lead to one of the most 607 00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:13,600 Speaker 1: notorious and difficult episodes in bitcoin's history. Now, this is 608 00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:16,120 Speaker 1: this is interesting because it's much more concerned with the 609 00:35:16,120 --> 00:35:20,440 Speaker 1: Bitcoin protocol itself. It isn't some some badly run exchange 610 00:35:20,600 --> 00:35:24,279 Speaker 1: or some drugs net that dark dark web drugs marketplace 611 00:35:24,400 --> 00:35:27,279 Speaker 1: going wrong. Um, you know, it's it's nothing to do 612 00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:30,600 Speaker 1: with a big business or enterprise using bitcoin. It's actually 613 00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:34,040 Speaker 1: to do with bitcoin itself. And this is known as 614 00:35:34,719 --> 00:35:39,680 Speaker 1: the block size wars. Let's have a bit of context 615 00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:43,160 Speaker 1: first about the block size wars. So two thousand and 616 00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:47,320 Speaker 1: fifteen and two thousand and sixteen were as by bitcoin 617 00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:52,200 Speaker 1: standards fairly uneventful and obviously all the mayhem that we've 618 00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:57,000 Speaker 1: seen in preceding years, especially with Mount Cox and Silk Road. Fortunately, 619 00:35:57,040 --> 00:35:59,839 Speaker 1: if you like, we didn't have sort of any kind 620 00:35:59,840 --> 00:36:02,640 Speaker 1: of scandals like this into that in in the following 621 00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:06,760 Speaker 1: couple of years that said, adoption itself continued. More merchants 622 00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:09,960 Speaker 1: carried on accepting it, and these included like big name 623 00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:16,440 Speaker 1: companies Microsoft, Dell, Expedia. They all began accepting bitcoin. So 624 00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:19,360 Speaker 1: it wasn't like nothing was nothing was going on. And 625 00:36:19,360 --> 00:36:21,600 Speaker 1: we also had this explosion in the number of Bitcoin 626 00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:23,480 Speaker 1: a t m s. They were kind of springing up 627 00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:26,400 Speaker 1: all over the place. So yeah, it was taking along, 628 00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:30,399 Speaker 1: but that we didn't have the sort of massive sort 629 00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:32,880 Speaker 1: of events Mount Cox and Silk Road style events that 630 00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:37,759 Speaker 1: we've had before. Although it's worth noting in October the 631 00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:41,800 Speaker 1: EU ruled bitcoin to actually be a currency in Europe, 632 00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:45,520 Speaker 1: which meant that EU citizens didn't have to pay tax 633 00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:47,959 Speaker 1: on trading it. This was quite a big moment because 634 00:36:47,960 --> 00:36:50,440 Speaker 1: there was a lot of a lot of debate, especially 635 00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:53,520 Speaker 1: among regulators, well is this a currency or is it 636 00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:56,920 Speaker 1: an asset? Is the security you know, because if it's 637 00:36:56,960 --> 00:37:00,480 Speaker 1: a currency, then it's a lot easier to exchange it, 638 00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:02,320 Speaker 1: to trade it. You don't have these sort of taxes, 639 00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:06,040 Speaker 1: whereas if it's viewed as an asset as security, like 640 00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:08,960 Speaker 1: like for instance, a stock, then there's all sorts of 641 00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:14,200 Speaker 1: all sorts of implications Ripples going through exactly, yeah, exactly. 642 00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:18,000 Speaker 1: The the the executives of Ripple, the company Ripple which 643 00:37:18,040 --> 00:37:23,239 Speaker 1: issues the x RP cryptocurrency coin, they are being accused 644 00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:29,000 Speaker 1: of by the sec of selling unlicensed securities. And yeah, 645 00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:32,080 Speaker 1: we're still waiting for for that case to be resolved 646 00:37:32,120 --> 00:37:34,799 Speaker 1: as we as we record this, but the outcome of 647 00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:37,040 Speaker 1: that is going to be big for crypto one way 648 00:37:37,120 --> 00:37:40,680 Speaker 1: or another. And if if Ripple is found guilty of that, 649 00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:45,680 Speaker 1: if x RP is deemed to be a security, then yeah, 650 00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:48,319 Speaker 1: it's going to be it's going to be some tough 651 00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:50,480 Speaker 1: times I think for crypto then I mean, nothing that 652 00:37:50,520 --> 00:37:52,520 Speaker 1: can't be survived, but there's going to be a lot 653 00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:55,120 Speaker 1: of Yeah, there's going to be a lot to be 654 00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:57,840 Speaker 1: sorted out if you like, so you know, watch this 655 00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:02,040 Speaker 1: space now. Also in two thousand and fifteen, sixteen, there 656 00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:08,040 Speaker 1: was a who ha around who yeh a barney A barney. Yeah, 657 00:38:08,040 --> 00:38:09,680 Speaker 1: there was a there was a bit of a dust, 658 00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:14,000 Speaker 1: there was handbags around. Craig Rights claims to be Setosce. 659 00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:17,240 Speaker 1: And again more on that in in the Setosi episode themselves. 660 00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:20,920 Speaker 1: Craig Right an Australian computer scientist who came out of 661 00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:23,920 Speaker 1: the woodwork and claimed that he was Setosce. And to 662 00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:28,360 Speaker 1: say this has been a controversial issue is putting it mildly. 663 00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:31,520 Speaker 1: So I'm gonna I'm gonna stay above it for now. Um. 664 00:38:31,560 --> 00:38:34,520 Speaker 1: But so most of two thousand and fifteen, the price 665 00:38:34,920 --> 00:38:37,480 Speaker 1: stayed with the bitcoin price was actually pretty stable. It's 666 00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:41,200 Speaker 1: one of more stable episodes in Bitcoin's prices history. It 667 00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:44,719 Speaker 1: kind of stayed fairly steadily within the two hundred three 668 00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:47,360 Speaker 1: hundred dollar range for most of two thousand and fifteen. 669 00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:51,880 Speaker 1: But as we moved into sixteen and then seventeen, the 670 00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:54,600 Speaker 1: price was really starting to rise. An interest in crypto 671 00:38:54,680 --> 00:38:57,759 Speaker 1: as a whole was really starting to take off. But 672 00:38:58,040 --> 00:39:01,600 Speaker 1: as I've mentioned before, there was trouble in bitcoin land, 673 00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:06,960 Speaker 1: and this trouble manifested itself as the block size wars. 674 00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:09,439 Speaker 1: So there's a bit of context to the block size wars. 675 00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:12,040 Speaker 1: Now let's kind of dig down into what we actually mean. 676 00:39:13,000 --> 00:39:16,799 Speaker 1: So as you'll remember from our episodes on blockchain, which 677 00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:20,920 Speaker 1: you enjoyed so much, Bitcoin transactions very simply are grouped 678 00:39:20,960 --> 00:39:23,560 Speaker 1: together in blocks, and these blocks are then added to 679 00:39:23,640 --> 00:39:26,879 Speaker 1: the Bitcoin blockchain and the whole network chugs along if 680 00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:30,600 Speaker 1: you like. Now Bitcoin is designed again. You'll remember, this 681 00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:33,279 Speaker 1: is designed so that a new block is produced on 682 00:39:33,400 --> 00:39:36,880 Speaker 1: average every ten minutes, and and the Bitcoin protocol dictates 683 00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:40,319 Speaker 1: this as you can't just pile more computing power, more 684 00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:43,960 Speaker 1: hash power onto the Bitcoin network and produce blocks faster, 685 00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:48,160 Speaker 1: because if this happens, the network adjusts the difficulty of 686 00:39:48,200 --> 00:39:52,680 Speaker 1: the mining to keep that ten minute average or around 687 00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:57,040 Speaker 1: about ten minutes, so you can't you can't kind of 688 00:39:57,200 --> 00:40:00,200 Speaker 1: cheat it in any way. The Bitcoin blockchain produces new 689 00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:03,080 Speaker 1: block on average every ten minutes, and there is nothing 690 00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:07,000 Speaker 1: that anyone can do about that. Now, each block also 691 00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:10,280 Speaker 1: has a size limit. It can only contain so much data, 692 00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:12,840 Speaker 1: and that the size limit on the Bitcoin blockchain is 693 00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:16,960 Speaker 1: one megabyte. Now that's not much. Bear in mind, this 694 00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:19,760 Speaker 1: is all transactional data, so this is this is basically 695 00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:21,799 Speaker 1: a whole load of numbers, So they're not it's not 696 00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:24,719 Speaker 1: like they're trying to put video files or audio stuff 697 00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:28,040 Speaker 1: in there. So one megabyte can record a lot of 698 00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:32,160 Speaker 1: transaction history, a lot of letters and numbers, but it's 699 00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:35,880 Speaker 1: still fairly limited. It can only store a certain amount 700 00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:39,600 Speaker 1: one megabyte of transaction data. So this was something I 701 00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:42,480 Speaker 1: must admit that I had missed this. I didn't know 702 00:40:42,520 --> 00:40:44,719 Speaker 1: this until I started digging down into the block size 703 00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:49,080 Speaker 1: wars for this for this podcast. So Toshi only implemented 704 00:40:49,239 --> 00:40:53,759 Speaker 1: this one megabyte size limit in obviously the year after Bitcoin, 705 00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:57,319 Speaker 1: after Bitcoin launched, and it had up to then been 706 00:40:57,520 --> 00:41:01,120 Speaker 1: thirty two megabytes. I never knew this. Yeah, and he 707 00:41:01,239 --> 00:41:05,040 Speaker 1: was actually concerned that large blocks, thirty two megabyte blocks 708 00:41:05,520 --> 00:41:10,160 Speaker 1: would be hard to process, would contain too much data 709 00:41:10,280 --> 00:41:12,919 Speaker 1: and could you not go with an ape? But well, 710 00:41:13,160 --> 00:41:16,680 Speaker 1: m yes, this is this is well we'll see, we'll 711 00:41:16,680 --> 00:41:19,040 Speaker 1: see what people thought of that shortly. But yeah, so 712 00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:24,000 Speaker 1: he cut it down to one megabyte. And and no 713 00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:30,640 Speaker 1: one really knows why he chose one megabyte, and yeah, 714 00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:34,319 Speaker 1: it sa Toshi himself has been a bit unclear on 715 00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:36,640 Speaker 1: all of this, but he decided to do it. Obviously, 716 00:41:36,640 --> 00:41:39,040 Speaker 1: it was it was his choice to do so he 717 00:41:39,080 --> 00:41:41,560 Speaker 1: cut the block size down to one megabyte. I'm sure 718 00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:44,840 Speaker 1: little knowing or mind you he's obviously so clever. Perhaps 719 00:41:44,840 --> 00:41:47,520 Speaker 1: he did, but I can't imagine he would be able 720 00:41:47,560 --> 00:41:51,080 Speaker 1: to predict the who the who hare yes, thank you? 721 00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:54,040 Speaker 1: That would that would come as a result of this 722 00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:56,840 Speaker 1: a few years later. So, as a result of this, 723 00:41:56,920 --> 00:41:59,920 Speaker 1: as a result of this one megabyte limit, the Bitcoin 724 00:42:00,120 --> 00:42:05,399 Speaker 1: network can only process somewhere between three and seven transactions 725 00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:10,600 Speaker 1: per second. Now, this is not very much, especially if 726 00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:12,560 Speaker 1: you compare it to the likes of Visa, which can 727 00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:17,040 Speaker 1: process tens of thousands of transactions per second, and actually 728 00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:21,200 Speaker 1: most other cryptos today leave yeah, leave that in the 729 00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:25,640 Speaker 1: dust as well. Now, transactions per second or TPSS, as 730 00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:28,680 Speaker 1: we say, it's quite a controversial thing, like lots of 731 00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:34,720 Speaker 1: cryptos make fairly large claims about tps and quite often 732 00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:39,239 Speaker 1: don't actually aren't actually able to live up. Yeah, there's 733 00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:42,080 Speaker 1: sort of like top speed or battery life. Yeah. Yeah, 734 00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:44,680 Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, it's like saying, oh, my car, cana, 735 00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:47,240 Speaker 1: my car's got a top speed of a hundred hundred 736 00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:49,800 Speaker 1: fifty miles an hour or whatever, but it just shows 737 00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:55,280 Speaker 1: downhill with exactly. It's like if if it's being driven 738 00:42:55,320 --> 00:43:00,000 Speaker 1: by a hamster. Yeah, and you know, you stripped stripped 739 00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:02,000 Speaker 1: it all back to its basic thing. But yeah, so 740 00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:05,400 Speaker 1: a lot of claims about tps are made, but not 741 00:43:05,640 --> 00:43:09,759 Speaker 1: always particularly valid Anyhow, The upshot of this is that 742 00:43:10,280 --> 00:43:14,120 Speaker 1: bitcoin transactions can take a long time to go through. 743 00:43:14,160 --> 00:43:15,879 Speaker 1: And I think you've found this. You know you've paid, 744 00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:19,759 Speaker 1: you've paid with bitcoin for things before, and it's not instant, No, 745 00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:22,160 Speaker 1: and it can if it's something for quite a large amount. 746 00:43:22,840 --> 00:43:26,200 Speaker 1: It's a nerve racking Yeah, ten minutes. Yeah, you're you're 747 00:43:26,239 --> 00:43:28,640 Speaker 1: waiting there? And did I did I do it right? 748 00:43:28,760 --> 00:43:31,520 Speaker 1: That I right code in? Did I? Yeah? Yeah, it's 749 00:43:31,520 --> 00:43:33,680 Speaker 1: the address right if I just sense like, you know, 750 00:43:33,960 --> 00:43:41,719 Speaker 1: five dollars to basically Yeah, And and because obviously bitcoin transactions, 751 00:43:41,719 --> 00:43:45,480 Speaker 1: crypto transactions can't be reversed once it's on the blockchain, 752 00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:48,279 Speaker 1: that's it. So yeah, as you say, it's it's and 753 00:43:48,320 --> 00:43:50,439 Speaker 1: I still, I mean, you know, when I send, when 754 00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:54,359 Speaker 1: I send crypto today and especially bitcoin um, even though 755 00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:57,560 Speaker 1: I know why it's taking this time, it's still kind 756 00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:00,600 Speaker 1: of like I won't quite be able to lacks until 757 00:44:00,640 --> 00:44:03,680 Speaker 1: I get notification from the wallet that I'm sending it 758 00:44:03,719 --> 00:44:08,360 Speaker 1: to that's arrived safely. So obviously this is not ideal 759 00:44:08,560 --> 00:44:13,000 Speaker 1: for a payment network. And also This can make transaction 760 00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:16,440 Speaker 1: fees on the Bitcoin network more expensive as well, because 761 00:44:16,600 --> 00:44:19,840 Speaker 1: some network users will be willing to pay more to 762 00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:23,319 Speaker 1: have their transactions processed quicker. So you get this kind 763 00:44:23,320 --> 00:44:25,200 Speaker 1: of you get the price being kind of bid up, 764 00:44:25,960 --> 00:44:29,520 Speaker 1: So transaction fees increase for everyone because the average price 765 00:44:29,560 --> 00:44:32,840 Speaker 1: goes up. Now, if you remember, obviously miners who process 766 00:44:32,920 --> 00:44:36,960 Speaker 1: these transactions on the Bitcoin network. Miners make their money 767 00:44:37,040 --> 00:44:39,759 Speaker 1: that are incentivized to do the mining and expend all 768 00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:43,600 Speaker 1: that computing power. Firstly by block rewards, as you remember, 769 00:44:43,640 --> 00:44:46,840 Speaker 1: so you get this, you get this allocation of of 770 00:44:47,400 --> 00:44:51,680 Speaker 1: BTC of bitcoins when you mine a block, which obviously 771 00:44:51,760 --> 00:44:55,200 Speaker 1: today is pretty valuable. But the other way that miners 772 00:44:55,239 --> 00:44:58,360 Speaker 1: make their money is by get charging a small fee 773 00:44:58,520 --> 00:45:01,160 Speaker 1: to include a transact in a block. And it's not 774 00:45:01,280 --> 00:45:03,640 Speaker 1: usually very much. I mean, when the when the network is, 775 00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:07,920 Speaker 1: when the networks all working fine, it's it's fractions of 776 00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:11,440 Speaker 1: a penny. But when the network gets congested, and this 777 00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:13,840 Speaker 1: is this is even more so on on other networks 778 00:45:13,840 --> 00:45:18,799 Speaker 1: like Ethereum, these transaction fees can get obscenely high, and 779 00:45:18,840 --> 00:45:21,960 Speaker 1: obviously you know people are not going to be willing 780 00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:24,640 Speaker 1: to use a network. Sometimes I mean on ethereum today, 781 00:45:24,760 --> 00:45:27,960 Speaker 1: sometimes the actual gas fee as they call it, as 782 00:45:27,960 --> 00:45:30,760 Speaker 1: transaction fees are known, can be more than what you're sending. 783 00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:33,719 Speaker 1: So you're trying to send let's say you're trying to 784 00:45:33,760 --> 00:45:37,000 Speaker 1: send a hundred dollars of ethereum and the gas fees 785 00:45:37,560 --> 00:45:40,680 Speaker 1: and twenty dollars, I mean, that's ridiculous. Yeah, And this 786 00:45:40,760 --> 00:45:43,000 Speaker 1: is this is one of the big problems with ethereum 787 00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:45,160 Speaker 1: at the moment, which is working hard to fix. But 788 00:45:45,239 --> 00:45:47,600 Speaker 1: I should say that this is something that most crypto 789 00:45:47,640 --> 00:45:53,040 Speaker 1: networks experience, and this was this was a problem with Bitcoin, 790 00:45:53,160 --> 00:45:55,920 Speaker 1: and in a way it still is because as we're 791 00:45:55,920 --> 00:45:59,040 Speaker 1: going to see, not much has changed. So the network, 792 00:45:59,520 --> 00:46:02,600 Speaker 1: the network is not fast, it's only transit. It's only 793 00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:06,560 Speaker 1: dealing with a few transactions per second maximum really about 794 00:46:06,600 --> 00:46:10,319 Speaker 1: seven and as I said before, it's only every ten 795 00:46:10,400 --> 00:46:15,840 Speaker 1: minutes that a new block is mind. So concerns around 796 00:46:15,840 --> 00:46:18,720 Speaker 1: this block size, around this one megabyte block size limit 797 00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:21,160 Speaker 1: had been rumbling for a while and actually in two 798 00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:24,319 Speaker 1: back in twenty fifteen, Gavin Andreson do you remember him, 799 00:46:24,320 --> 00:46:27,040 Speaker 1: We've talked about him before. And Mike Hearn, who is 800 00:46:27,080 --> 00:46:29,560 Speaker 1: another guy who's who's done a lot of work on 801 00:46:29,560 --> 00:46:33,719 Speaker 1: on on bitcoin. They proposed increasing the block size to 802 00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:39,319 Speaker 1: twenty megabytes. Now this was this didn't go down well. Well, 803 00:46:39,320 --> 00:46:41,040 Speaker 1: it went down well with a few, but as a 804 00:46:41,280 --> 00:46:44,799 Speaker 1: as a, as we've talked about before, the bitcoin community 805 00:46:45,280 --> 00:46:48,360 Speaker 1: is a broad church, so there are lots and lots 806 00:46:48,360 --> 00:46:52,239 Speaker 1: of different views, So twenty megabytes did not go down well. 807 00:46:52,680 --> 00:46:55,520 Speaker 1: So they later reduced it to eight megabytes, which I 808 00:46:55,520 --> 00:47:00,919 Speaker 1: think was your suggestion. Now you're probably asking, so why why, 809 00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:03,480 Speaker 1: what's wrong with just increasing the block size? Speeded up, 810 00:47:03,640 --> 00:47:06,680 Speaker 1: speed the network up. That's great. Now, the main problem 811 00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:10,040 Speaker 1: with this is that if you increase the block size, 812 00:47:10,400 --> 00:47:14,359 Speaker 1: then the Bitcoin blockchain itself would get much larger. You'd 813 00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:18,120 Speaker 1: be dealing with much larger amounts of data, and as 814 00:47:18,160 --> 00:47:21,239 Speaker 1: a result of this, it would become much harder for 815 00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:26,399 Speaker 1: smaller nodes to store a copy of the Bitcoin blockchain. Now, 816 00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:29,440 Speaker 1: remember you've got minus on the Bitcoin network, who are 817 00:47:29,520 --> 00:47:32,880 Speaker 1: who have processing transactions, minting these blocks and getting paid 818 00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:35,719 Speaker 1: for their for their troubles. But you also have these 819 00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:39,000 Speaker 1: nodes which are often just a very very basic little computer, 820 00:47:39,600 --> 00:47:43,680 Speaker 1: and all they do is store copies of the blockchain 821 00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:47,960 Speaker 1: and validate transactions. So they just check that these transactions 822 00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:50,600 Speaker 1: have gone through, that the balances of the people sending 823 00:47:50,600 --> 00:47:52,520 Speaker 1: and receiving are up to date, all this sort of stuff. 824 00:47:52,840 --> 00:47:57,880 Speaker 1: They're doing fairly basic, low level computing, but they still 825 00:47:57,920 --> 00:48:01,560 Speaker 1: need to store this data. Now, if you suddenly increase 826 00:48:01,600 --> 00:48:04,200 Speaker 1: the block size and ask them to store a much 827 00:48:04,360 --> 00:48:08,200 Speaker 1: larger amount of data, fewer and fewer will actually have 828 00:48:08,239 --> 00:48:11,000 Speaker 1: the capacity to do that. And what that means is 829 00:48:11,040 --> 00:48:14,680 Speaker 1: that you reduce the decentralization of the network because smaller 830 00:48:14,719 --> 00:48:18,440 Speaker 1: nodes start to drop off, and at the same time, 831 00:48:18,880 --> 00:48:23,080 Speaker 1: more power gets handed to larger nodes and larger entities 832 00:48:23,120 --> 00:48:28,680 Speaker 1: and in particular minors. So it's it's bad for decentralization. 833 00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:34,840 Speaker 1: And if decentralization decreases, then so does security. So yeah, 834 00:48:35,080 --> 00:48:39,000 Speaker 1: this was the this was the big objection to larger blocks. 835 00:48:39,160 --> 00:48:41,520 Speaker 1: And I remember I remember when I first read about 836 00:48:41,560 --> 00:48:44,520 Speaker 1: it and not not knowing, not knowing as much as 837 00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:47,720 Speaker 1: I do now, thinking well, yeah, naturally, make the blocks 838 00:48:47,719 --> 00:48:50,479 Speaker 1: bigger and the whole network becomes quicker and more people 839 00:48:50,520 --> 00:48:53,640 Speaker 1: can use it. But actually, this question of decentralization, this 840 00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:57,120 Speaker 1: this this idea of making the network too big is 841 00:48:57,200 --> 00:49:01,160 Speaker 1: a real issue. And around this time crucially, as I 842 00:49:01,200 --> 00:49:05,320 Speaker 1: alluded to earlier, most bitcoin mining was being done in China. 843 00:49:05,680 --> 00:49:09,520 Speaker 1: China was dominated the hash rate, and the worry was 844 00:49:09,800 --> 00:49:13,080 Speaker 1: that Chinese miners would become too powerful. If the blockchain 845 00:49:13,160 --> 00:49:17,120 Speaker 1: got bigger and harder to store, these Chinese miners would 846 00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:22,360 Speaker 1: be would would be would occupy an even greater percentage 847 00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:25,399 Speaker 1: of the network. Now, if this was the case, they 848 00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:30,280 Speaker 1: could theoretically collude to manipulate the network, or perhaps more crucially, 849 00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:33,439 Speaker 1: they could be coerced into doing it because as we 850 00:49:33,960 --> 00:49:40,440 Speaker 1: as we know, the Chinese Communist Party are very honorable. Yes, yes, 851 00:49:40,719 --> 00:49:44,400 Speaker 1: and I'd like to welcome all our listeners in China 852 00:49:44,640 --> 00:49:46,319 Speaker 1: as we as. I think it's fair to say the 853 00:49:46,400 --> 00:49:49,520 Speaker 1: Chinese Communist Party their way or the highway. Yeah, they 854 00:49:49,600 --> 00:49:52,480 Speaker 1: can be a little on the coercive side. They can 855 00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:56,680 Speaker 1: be a liver persuasive. Yeah, they have ways of making 856 00:49:56,680 --> 00:50:01,759 Speaker 1: you they want. So this was a big problem and 857 00:50:01,800 --> 00:50:04,719 Speaker 1: a big concern, And there was also a concern that 858 00:50:04,800 --> 00:50:09,680 Speaker 1: bigger blocks would actually reduce transaction fees. Now, again, on 859 00:50:09,719 --> 00:50:11,640 Speaker 1: the face of it, why is that about the thing? No, 860 00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:15,800 Speaker 1: incentered them for the miners exactly exactly, Yeah, miners need 861 00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:19,200 Speaker 1: these transaction fees to incentivize them to maintain the network. 862 00:50:19,680 --> 00:50:23,520 Speaker 1: So if transaction fees are going down, smaller miners will 863 00:50:23,600 --> 00:50:26,120 Speaker 1: drop off because it becomes is that is that what 864 00:50:26,280 --> 00:50:30,680 Speaker 1: happens when the last block is mind then the transaction 865 00:50:30,719 --> 00:50:35,279 Speaker 1: fees will go up to keep the network going. Yes, 866 00:50:35,360 --> 00:50:38,319 Speaker 1: that's a that's a good question. Um. Yeah, there's some 867 00:50:38,520 --> 00:50:41,680 Speaker 1: debate debate over this because we're quite a we're quite 868 00:50:42,280 --> 00:50:46,040 Speaker 1: quite a long way away decades from the last block 869 00:50:46,120 --> 00:50:48,160 Speaker 1: being mined, but a lot of people are thinking about 870 00:50:48,200 --> 00:50:51,640 Speaker 1: this already. What happens when the block rewards is no longer, 871 00:50:52,440 --> 00:50:55,960 Speaker 1: you know, it doesn't exist anymore. And yeah, the people 872 00:50:56,000 --> 00:50:59,319 Speaker 1: are concerned that, well, I mean, transaction fees will be 873 00:50:59,360 --> 00:51:03,160 Speaker 1: how my as, yeah, how miners make their make their money. 874 00:51:03,719 --> 00:51:07,160 Speaker 1: But in order to in order to make it worthwhile 875 00:51:07,280 --> 00:51:09,239 Speaker 1: for lots of miners, which is what you want, then 876 00:51:09,760 --> 00:51:11,800 Speaker 1: people are pointing out that transaction fees will have to 877 00:51:11,840 --> 00:51:14,560 Speaker 1: go up in order to cover it. So yeah, it's 878 00:51:14,560 --> 00:51:16,480 Speaker 1: a it's a very good question something that a lot 879 00:51:16,480 --> 00:51:21,319 Speaker 1: of don't you add more megabytes then well and then 880 00:51:21,360 --> 00:51:26,080 Speaker 1: it becomes bigger, computing powerably more by then, So the 881 00:51:26,600 --> 00:51:30,520 Speaker 1: four small nodes that should be able to handle it. Possibly, Yeah, 882 00:51:30,840 --> 00:51:33,080 Speaker 1: you might Moore's law, I think, which is the one 883 00:51:33,120 --> 00:51:36,120 Speaker 1: that says that computing power can increases sort of exponentially 884 00:51:36,160 --> 00:51:41,560 Speaker 1: over time. That could mean that there are more that 885 00:51:42,040 --> 00:51:44,960 Speaker 1: the average person perhaps has a computer bit like now 886 00:51:45,200 --> 00:51:50,040 Speaker 1: compared with years my computer now to my computer in 887 00:51:50,080 --> 00:51:52,520 Speaker 1: two thousands seventeen when I got into it, a very 888 00:51:52,520 --> 00:51:57,640 Speaker 1: different beasts. It's yeah, it's it's something that's that's that 889 00:51:57,760 --> 00:52:02,520 Speaker 1: bitcoiners do talk about this idea, and yeah, it's hard 890 00:52:02,560 --> 00:52:05,080 Speaker 1: to know exactly what's going to happen at that time, 891 00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:07,560 Speaker 1: you know, I mean, you can't predict the future because 892 00:52:07,800 --> 00:52:11,879 Speaker 1: the block reward is going to decrease ever more. I mean, 893 00:52:11,960 --> 00:52:15,239 Speaker 1: at the moment, the block rewards is six point to 894 00:52:15,600 --> 00:52:20,360 Speaker 1: five bitcoin and six point to five btc, and it 895 00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:23,879 Speaker 1: decreases sort of on every roughly every four years. So 896 00:52:24,480 --> 00:52:27,640 Speaker 1: it's about two years since the last harving, the bitcoin 897 00:52:27,719 --> 00:52:30,399 Speaker 1: harving is what it's called. So we've got about another 898 00:52:30,440 --> 00:52:32,360 Speaker 1: two years and then it's going to decrease to three 899 00:52:32,480 --> 00:52:36,799 Speaker 1: point three and an eight whatever it is. So yeah, 900 00:52:36,840 --> 00:52:39,239 Speaker 1: this is this is going to be a problem. Now 901 00:52:39,280 --> 00:52:42,000 Speaker 1: you'd argue that perhaps if the price of bitcoin continues 902 00:52:42,040 --> 00:52:45,080 Speaker 1: to go up. Then in two years time, three three 903 00:52:45,080 --> 00:52:48,479 Speaker 1: and an eighth bitcoin is still going to be nice work, 904 00:52:48,520 --> 00:52:52,040 Speaker 1: thank you very much. But yeah, basically, transaction fees are 905 00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:54,799 Speaker 1: going to play a part in the future one way 906 00:52:54,880 --> 00:53:00,120 Speaker 1: or another because miners need to be incentivized. So this 907 00:53:00,320 --> 00:53:02,960 Speaker 1: was Yeah, this is another concern around this idea of 908 00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:06,080 Speaker 1: big blocks. Transaction fees would go down, fewer miners would 909 00:53:06,120 --> 00:53:09,680 Speaker 1: have the incentive to maintain the network. Therefore, the smaller 910 00:53:09,680 --> 00:53:12,319 Speaker 1: miners would drop off. And again this would will there 911 00:53:12,360 --> 00:53:15,680 Speaker 1: be a lot less energy used because you're not mining 912 00:53:15,680 --> 00:53:19,919 Speaker 1: as much as more just transactions or yeah, I mean yeah, 913 00:53:20,040 --> 00:53:22,560 Speaker 1: so a lot of miners would would probably pack it 914 00:53:22,600 --> 00:53:26,000 Speaker 1: in because the smaller miners unless they unless they pull 915 00:53:26,080 --> 00:53:29,560 Speaker 1: their mining their hash power together, it's harder for them 916 00:53:29,560 --> 00:53:32,879 Speaker 1: to win block rewards. So they a lot of them, 917 00:53:32,880 --> 00:53:36,040 Speaker 1: I think, rely mostly on on transaction fees in order 918 00:53:36,080 --> 00:53:40,560 Speaker 1: to you know, for their income. So, but remember that 919 00:53:40,680 --> 00:53:44,680 Speaker 1: the bitcoin net, that the Bitcoin Protocol dictates that as 920 00:53:44,719 --> 00:53:47,880 Speaker 1: computing power changes, as the hash rate goes up or down, 921 00:53:48,160 --> 00:53:51,200 Speaker 1: the difficulty adjusts as well. So let's say a whole 922 00:53:51,200 --> 00:53:54,360 Speaker 1: load of so let's say you made bigger blocks, you 923 00:53:54,640 --> 00:53:59,960 Speaker 1: therefore had smaller transaction fees, so smaller miners would be disincentive, 924 00:54:00,200 --> 00:54:03,200 Speaker 1: so they may they may just pack it in, they 925 00:54:03,239 --> 00:54:07,919 Speaker 1: may stop mining, which means less computing power. But then 926 00:54:08,320 --> 00:54:10,960 Speaker 1: the ease of mining, the difficulty level, if you like, 927 00:54:11,040 --> 00:54:14,800 Speaker 1: goes down more miners. Yeah, and actually what it becomes 928 00:54:14,800 --> 00:54:17,759 Speaker 1: as an opportunity for big, well established miners to just 929 00:54:17,840 --> 00:54:21,600 Speaker 1: add more hashpower themselves because they're better resourced. So again 930 00:54:21,680 --> 00:54:25,080 Speaker 1: you have this concentration of power into the hands of 931 00:54:25,880 --> 00:54:30,040 Speaker 1: an ever shrinking number of powerful entities. And again, because 932 00:54:30,080 --> 00:54:33,120 Speaker 1: a lot of these powerful miners were based in China, 933 00:54:33,239 --> 00:54:35,960 Speaker 1: there was there was a lot of disquiet over it. 934 00:54:36,840 --> 00:54:39,680 Speaker 1: So it's fascinating really because again it's sort of the 935 00:54:39,719 --> 00:54:43,359 Speaker 1: thing on on the face of it, you go yeah, 936 00:54:43,480 --> 00:54:44,960 Speaker 1: and then you dig down into it a bit and 937 00:54:44,960 --> 00:54:49,440 Speaker 1: you're actually, yeah, I see your point. So without getting 938 00:54:49,520 --> 00:54:51,359 Speaker 1: too deep into the weeds of it all, I mean 939 00:54:51,400 --> 00:54:53,200 Speaker 1: I think we have got quite deep into the weeds. 940 00:54:53,200 --> 00:54:56,560 Speaker 1: So without going any deeper, the block size issue split 941 00:54:56,680 --> 00:55:00,920 Speaker 1: the bitcoin community and the whole thing got really pretty bitter. 942 00:55:01,080 --> 00:55:05,000 Speaker 1: Just where bitcoin cash came. Yeah exactly, exactly, Yeah, we're 943 00:55:05,040 --> 00:55:08,960 Speaker 1: we're leading up to that. So you you basically had it. 944 00:55:09,080 --> 00:55:12,720 Speaker 1: Essentially it became about the small blockers versus the baby blockers, 945 00:55:13,080 --> 00:55:15,839 Speaker 1: and the two did not see eye to why. It's 946 00:55:15,840 --> 00:55:20,080 Speaker 1: fair to say so the small blockers believed that Bitcoin 947 00:55:20,200 --> 00:55:24,080 Speaker 1: should basically stick to its founding principles. Okay, they wanted 948 00:55:24,080 --> 00:55:27,160 Speaker 1: to focus on the long term growth of the network, 949 00:55:27,200 --> 00:55:29,200 Speaker 1: and that's and the key is the key term there 950 00:55:29,239 --> 00:55:35,320 Speaker 1: is long term and maintain decentralization, censorship, resistance, etcetera, etcetera. 951 00:55:35,400 --> 00:55:38,760 Speaker 1: So and the transaction for the argument, it also shows 952 00:55:39,320 --> 00:55:41,560 Speaker 1: you know, a long term vision for Bitcoin again, like 953 00:55:41,600 --> 00:55:45,919 Speaker 1: you said, were looking beyond just block rewards. So that's 954 00:55:45,960 --> 00:55:49,840 Speaker 1: the small blocker argument. The big blockers obviously, as we've discussed, 955 00:55:49,840 --> 00:55:52,920 Speaker 1: they wanted to see Bitcoin grow more quickly and become 956 00:55:53,080 --> 00:55:55,880 Speaker 1: more user friendly because they their argument was where you 957 00:55:55,920 --> 00:55:59,799 Speaker 1: can't have a payments network that takes at least ten 958 00:56:00,080 --> 00:56:02,880 Speaker 1: it's and often a lot longer to settle a payment. 959 00:56:02,920 --> 00:56:05,760 Speaker 1: This is not We're not going to compete with Visa 960 00:56:05,960 --> 00:56:10,960 Speaker 1: or indeed any other cryptocurrencies like this. So I mean, 961 00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:13,120 Speaker 1: I think it's fair to say both groups have a point, 962 00:56:13,960 --> 00:56:17,680 Speaker 1: and it's you know, it was it was very easy. 963 00:56:17,920 --> 00:56:21,800 Speaker 1: It's very easy then, as I remember and very easy 964 00:56:21,880 --> 00:56:25,960 Speaker 1: now to to see both sides of the argument, but 965 00:56:26,040 --> 00:56:28,680 Speaker 1: of course there were plenty in the bitcoin community who 966 00:56:29,160 --> 00:56:33,840 Speaker 1: didn't and fundamentally and angrily disagreed with the other. And 967 00:56:33,880 --> 00:56:36,480 Speaker 1: it's also worth pointing out that small blockers themselves were 968 00:56:36,520 --> 00:56:41,520 Speaker 1: adamant that the bitcoin code should not be fundamentally altered 969 00:56:41,560 --> 00:56:45,560 Speaker 1: because doing so would set a really dangerous precedent. And 970 00:56:45,600 --> 00:56:48,920 Speaker 1: I this was the sort of like the amendments to 971 00:56:48,960 --> 00:56:53,360 Speaker 1: the Constitution, people don't like too many of that, Yeah, exactly, exactly, 972 00:56:53,360 --> 00:56:56,279 Speaker 1: even though there are amendments on it. Yeah, even though 973 00:56:56,280 --> 00:57:00,080 Speaker 1: there are amendments, you don't want to get too many 974 00:57:00,239 --> 00:57:04,239 Speaker 1: because when you go down that road, it's sort of yeah, okay, well, 975 00:57:04,560 --> 00:57:06,920 Speaker 1: so we've got an amendment to the Amendment to the 976 00:57:06,960 --> 00:57:11,120 Speaker 1: Amendment of the Amendment. Yeah, it's it's a slippery slope. 977 00:57:11,440 --> 00:57:14,399 Speaker 1: And this, for me, this this kind of argument kind 978 00:57:14,400 --> 00:57:16,520 Speaker 1: of got me onto the onto the small blocker side 979 00:57:16,560 --> 00:57:18,760 Speaker 1: in that it was like, yeah, you know, where where 980 00:57:18,800 --> 00:57:21,000 Speaker 1: do you stop? You go? Okay, right, we're going to 981 00:57:21,040 --> 00:57:25,160 Speaker 1: increase the block size. Well, that is firstly very difficult 982 00:57:25,200 --> 00:57:26,760 Speaker 1: to do because you've got to get ahole load of 983 00:57:26,760 --> 00:57:29,480 Speaker 1: people to agree on it, and then someone's actually got 984 00:57:29,480 --> 00:57:32,920 Speaker 1: to go and change the code, and and what happens 985 00:57:32,960 --> 00:57:35,000 Speaker 1: after that, you know, something else comes along. All right, 986 00:57:35,040 --> 00:57:36,640 Speaker 1: we're going to change it now. We're going to change 987 00:57:36,640 --> 00:57:40,760 Speaker 1: it now. Their argument is that bitcoin should just exist. 988 00:57:41,160 --> 00:57:44,680 Speaker 1: It should be beyond the power of any person or 989 00:57:44,720 --> 00:57:48,480 Speaker 1: even group of people to change it. Bitcoin is bitcoin. 990 00:57:48,680 --> 00:57:51,080 Speaker 1: You've got to we've got to live with it. We've 991 00:57:51,080 --> 00:57:53,440 Speaker 1: got to we've got to celebrate it for what it is. 992 00:57:53,760 --> 00:57:56,600 Speaker 1: If we start going and change, chopping and changing, making 993 00:57:56,640 --> 00:58:01,880 Speaker 1: these alterations, then we are doing yeah, and bitcoin is 994 00:58:01,880 --> 00:58:03,800 Speaker 1: is going to suffer as a result. And it's a 995 00:58:03,920 --> 00:58:06,360 Speaker 1: it's a really it's a really good point. I think 996 00:58:06,440 --> 00:58:09,600 Speaker 1: it makes. It makes a lot of sense. And although 997 00:58:09,720 --> 00:58:12,880 Speaker 1: again that big block argument, you can see the you 998 00:58:12,920 --> 00:58:16,440 Speaker 1: can see what they were driving at. Yeah, this idea 999 00:58:16,480 --> 00:58:19,400 Speaker 1: that if you suddenly start making changes, then what's to 1000 00:58:19,480 --> 00:58:21,800 Speaker 1: stop more changes being made? And what's to stop a 1001 00:58:21,920 --> 00:58:24,600 Speaker 1: government coming along go, hey, you made this change. That 1002 00:58:24,720 --> 00:58:28,480 Speaker 1: was good. How about making it's just change? Yeah, because 1003 00:58:28,520 --> 00:58:31,600 Speaker 1: we'd like that, about making making it so as we 1004 00:58:31,640 --> 00:58:34,360 Speaker 1: can see how you know, who owns what wallet? You know, 1005 00:58:35,600 --> 00:58:39,440 Speaker 1: it's a slippery slope. And if the rules of bitcoin 1006 00:58:39,520 --> 00:58:41,760 Speaker 1: could be changed on this point, they could be changed 1007 00:58:41,760 --> 00:58:44,400 Speaker 1: again in the future. So small blockers, they were arguing 1008 00:58:44,400 --> 00:58:49,360 Speaker 1: that bitcoin had to exist without interference to maintain its integrity, 1009 00:58:49,560 --> 00:58:54,800 Speaker 1: and integrity is key, code is law. And the battle 1010 00:58:54,880 --> 00:58:57,480 Speaker 1: lines of you like, were drawn out, the big blockers 1011 00:58:57,480 --> 00:59:01,600 Speaker 1: and the small blockers and kind of powerful industry figures, 1012 00:59:01,600 --> 00:59:03,480 Speaker 1: if you like, who were as we've seen, we're kind 1013 00:59:03,520 --> 00:59:06,880 Speaker 1: of getting into bitcoin now. They generally lined up behind 1014 00:59:06,920 --> 00:59:09,600 Speaker 1: the big blocks because they saw the you know, they 1015 00:59:09,600 --> 00:59:11,800 Speaker 1: saw the kind of business advantage of it, if you like, 1016 00:59:12,440 --> 00:59:15,240 Speaker 1: while the small block has tended to be, but not exclusively, 1017 00:59:15,320 --> 00:59:17,640 Speaker 1: but you know, tended to be sort of smaller entities 1018 00:59:17,640 --> 00:59:21,200 Speaker 1: and individuals, you know, kind of loan voices all piping 1019 00:59:21,280 --> 00:59:24,040 Speaker 1: up together, going no, we have to keep this, We 1020 00:59:24,120 --> 00:59:27,680 Speaker 1: have to maintain this in this this thing's integrity. This 1021 00:59:27,760 --> 00:59:31,120 Speaker 1: is not for business people. This is not for companies 1022 00:59:31,240 --> 00:59:34,080 Speaker 1: or hedge funds or governments anyone like that to come 1023 00:59:34,080 --> 00:59:36,040 Speaker 1: in and say how this should be run. We keep 1024 00:59:36,080 --> 00:59:42,640 Speaker 1: the blocks small, goddamnit. So the the ins and outs 1025 00:59:42,800 --> 00:59:47,160 Speaker 1: of the block size war get pretty convoluted. So let's cut. 1026 00:59:47,240 --> 00:59:50,040 Speaker 1: Let's cut to the chase. Long story short. The small 1027 00:59:50,040 --> 00:59:54,680 Speaker 1: blockers one. Okay, the price of all this was a 1028 00:59:54,840 --> 00:59:57,760 Speaker 1: hard fork of the bitcoin blockchain. Now, this was something 1029 00:59:57,800 --> 01:00:03,720 Speaker 1: that really everyone wanted to avoid, and it became clear 1030 01:00:04,120 --> 01:00:06,360 Speaker 1: that that it was just going to have to happen. 1031 01:00:06,400 --> 01:00:09,320 Speaker 1: There were all sorts of proposals made. People came up 1032 01:00:09,320 --> 01:00:12,040 Speaker 1: with all sorts of things that could be done. There 1033 01:00:12,120 --> 01:00:15,479 Speaker 1: was something called segregated witness or SegWit, which was which 1034 01:00:15,520 --> 01:00:19,600 Speaker 1: was suggested, and eventually people managed to agree that it 1035 01:00:19,640 --> 01:00:22,560 Speaker 1: should be implemented. I won't go into what. SegWit gets 1036 01:00:22,640 --> 01:00:26,120 Speaker 1: quite complex. I remember this. I remember not really knowing 1037 01:00:26,160 --> 01:00:28,040 Speaker 1: what I kind of lumped in and I was like, 1038 01:00:28,320 --> 01:00:33,200 Speaker 1: I'm not sure what's happening here? Am I about to 1039 01:00:33,240 --> 01:00:36,440 Speaker 1: get half my bitcoin? Am I about to get a 1040 01:00:36,480 --> 01:00:41,200 Speaker 1: whole bunch? New? What's going on? What is segwits? And 1041 01:00:41,240 --> 01:00:44,640 Speaker 1: then there was some kind of SegWit two, and yeah 1042 01:00:45,080 --> 01:00:48,120 Speaker 1: it was it was I thought folk happened all the time. 1043 01:00:48,640 --> 01:00:51,160 Speaker 1: I thought it was like there are forks, but not 1044 01:00:51,240 --> 01:00:54,040 Speaker 1: a hard folk. Yeah, yeah, there are soft forks and 1045 01:00:54,040 --> 01:00:56,080 Speaker 1: there are hard forks. We'll we'll talk about Yeah, we'll 1046 01:00:56,080 --> 01:00:58,200 Speaker 1: go into forks another time. Again. This gets this gets 1047 01:00:58,360 --> 01:01:01,919 Speaker 1: very very tricky and very techy but basically the hard 1048 01:01:01,960 --> 01:01:06,000 Speaker 1: for a hard fork is the chain splits into and 1049 01:01:06,320 --> 01:01:09,560 Speaker 1: miners on the chain have a choice. They can either 1050 01:01:09,640 --> 01:01:13,280 Speaker 1: so they can either keep mining blocks on the original chain, 1051 01:01:14,000 --> 01:01:16,959 Speaker 1: or they can switch to mining blocks on the new chain. 1052 01:01:17,400 --> 01:01:20,360 Speaker 1: And basically what usually happens is the longest chain wins. 1053 01:01:20,720 --> 01:01:25,240 Speaker 1: So eventually a majority of miners will mind on either 1054 01:01:25,280 --> 01:01:27,560 Speaker 1: one chain or another, and that's the one that that's 1055 01:01:27,560 --> 01:01:30,560 Speaker 1: the one that continues. Now. A soft fork is generally 1056 01:01:30,560 --> 01:01:34,640 Speaker 1: done with the consensus of the of of the mining 1057 01:01:34,680 --> 01:01:37,560 Speaker 1: community for that particular crypto. It's to me, it's to 1058 01:01:37,680 --> 01:01:41,040 Speaker 1: make a particular adjustment to the protocol. But kind of 1059 01:01:41,040 --> 01:01:43,440 Speaker 1: everyone agrees. It's like, yeah, we're gonna, we're gonna, we're 1060 01:01:43,440 --> 01:01:46,720 Speaker 1: gonna fork, but we're all going to mind this new fork, 1061 01:01:46,760 --> 01:01:49,280 Speaker 1: and everyone's going to stop mining the old one, and 1062 01:01:49,360 --> 01:01:51,800 Speaker 1: therefore that the change to the network can be sort 1063 01:01:51,840 --> 01:01:55,480 Speaker 1: of smoothly implemented. But a hard fork is when you 1064 01:01:55,560 --> 01:01:58,600 Speaker 1: don't have that agreement, and some people are going, no, 1065 01:01:59,120 --> 01:02:01,240 Speaker 1: we're going to mind the new chain, and other people 1066 01:02:01,280 --> 01:02:03,400 Speaker 1: are going, no, we're gonna mind the original chain, and 1067 01:02:03,440 --> 01:02:07,720 Speaker 1: this is what happened. So the small blockers that those 1068 01:02:07,760 --> 01:02:10,360 Speaker 1: in favor and those miners who were in favor of 1069 01:02:10,480 --> 01:02:13,720 Speaker 1: keeping the block size at one megabyte. When this hard 1070 01:02:13,760 --> 01:02:20,080 Speaker 1: fork occurred in August, the small blockers kept mining the 1071 01:02:20,120 --> 01:02:24,200 Speaker 1: original one megabyte bitcoin blockchain, but the big blockers started 1072 01:02:24,240 --> 01:02:28,720 Speaker 1: mining the new chain, which had obviously bigger blocks, and 1073 01:02:28,960 --> 01:02:34,600 Speaker 1: this new chain became known as bitcoin cash. Yeah. Yeah, 1074 01:02:34,640 --> 01:02:37,400 Speaker 1: so this was you've got some free money essentially. Yeah, 1075 01:02:37,440 --> 01:02:43,600 Speaker 1: so all bitcoin holders got an equivalent amount of bitcoin cash. 1076 01:02:43,920 --> 01:02:45,960 Speaker 1: Do you remember that? Yeah? Yeah, I still have it. 1077 01:02:46,880 --> 01:02:52,160 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, oh really, probably should have got rid of that. Yeah, Well, now, 1078 01:02:52,280 --> 01:02:56,160 Speaker 1: I mean I I I sold mine, yeah, fairly, fairly 1079 01:02:56,200 --> 01:02:58,280 Speaker 1: soon after. I mean I sort of kept hold of 1080 01:02:58,320 --> 01:03:01,000 Speaker 1: it because it was go up quite a lot in 1081 01:03:01,040 --> 01:03:04,840 Speaker 1: price and there was a lot of I'm still holding on. 1082 01:03:04,920 --> 01:03:08,400 Speaker 1: In fact, I might lump everything in. It's still I mean, 1083 01:03:08,440 --> 01:03:13,160 Speaker 1: bitcoin cash is still going. Um. Obviously it has larger blocks, 1084 01:03:13,200 --> 01:03:19,600 Speaker 1: so it's transactions are faster, but it's much much more centralized. Um. 1085 01:03:20,120 --> 01:03:23,080 Speaker 1: And to be honest, it's still going, but it's market 1086 01:03:23,120 --> 01:03:26,240 Speaker 1: cap is is kind of dwindling. Should I probably sell now? 1087 01:03:26,720 --> 01:03:29,640 Speaker 1: I'm not going to say. I mean it's not financial advice, 1088 01:03:29,800 --> 01:03:31,560 Speaker 1: not financial of it. It's one of these things. I mean, 1089 01:03:31,600 --> 01:03:34,919 Speaker 1: bitcoin cash will will tick up in price when when 1090 01:03:34,960 --> 01:03:38,760 Speaker 1: the rest of the crypto market goes up in price. Um, 1091 01:03:38,880 --> 01:03:43,200 Speaker 1: but yeah, it's still bitcoin cash is still quite widely accepted, 1092 01:03:43,240 --> 01:03:47,000 Speaker 1: and quite often when when a business announces that it's 1093 01:03:47,000 --> 01:03:50,440 Speaker 1: going to start accepting crypto, it usually starts with a 1094 01:03:50,520 --> 01:03:54,080 Speaker 1: small handful. Usually it usually starts with about four and 1095 01:03:54,160 --> 01:04:00,080 Speaker 1: those are umlcoin, bitcoin, and yeah. So it's it does. 1096 01:04:00,240 --> 01:04:02,439 Speaker 1: It does have quite a lot of utility. Even though 1097 01:04:02,440 --> 01:04:05,280 Speaker 1: it's market cap is shrinking and its price hasn't really 1098 01:04:05,320 --> 01:04:10,280 Speaker 1: done anything spectacular recently, it's still got a lot of traction. 1099 01:04:10,480 --> 01:04:14,000 Speaker 1: It's still used. So you could argue in a way 1100 01:04:14,680 --> 01:04:18,320 Speaker 1: that it's that it's succeeded up to a point, although 1101 01:04:18,440 --> 01:04:22,240 Speaker 1: obviously it's you know that the original bitcoin, if you like, 1102 01:04:22,680 --> 01:04:26,520 Speaker 1: has gone from strength to strength. Although that said, it 1103 01:04:26,680 --> 01:04:32,280 Speaker 1: still has small block sizes, transactions are still not instantaneous, 1104 01:04:32,440 --> 01:04:35,280 Speaker 1: still got the same issues, It's still got the same issues. Yeah, 1105 01:04:35,320 --> 01:04:39,880 Speaker 1: but the hardcore bitcoiners will will say one of the foibles, 1106 01:04:39,960 --> 01:04:42,840 Speaker 1: but we love it. Yeah, yeah, it's not perfect, but 1107 01:04:42,880 --> 01:04:44,760 Speaker 1: we love it just we love it all the more 1108 01:04:44,800 --> 01:04:48,800 Speaker 1: because of that. It's still super decentralized, super secure, and 1109 01:04:48,880 --> 01:04:53,880 Speaker 1: actually bitcoin cash itself then went through several hard forks 1110 01:04:54,440 --> 01:04:57,840 Speaker 1: real yeah, which really sort of damaged its credibility. It's 1111 01:04:57,840 --> 01:05:00,840 Speaker 1: split off. So there's now I get more money than 1112 01:05:02,520 --> 01:05:06,360 Speaker 1: my money just getting doubling, and then more of these 1113 01:05:06,400 --> 01:05:08,880 Speaker 1: big random coins that I don't use. I'm not sure. 1114 01:05:08,920 --> 01:05:11,360 Speaker 1: I don't having not held bitcoin cash for a while. 1115 01:05:11,480 --> 01:05:15,040 Speaker 1: Because there's now there's bitcoin SV which stands for Bitcoin 1116 01:05:15,120 --> 01:05:19,280 Speaker 1: Satoshi's vision, and I think there's also bitcoin cash ABC, 1117 01:05:20,600 --> 01:05:22,720 Speaker 1: and there may there may well be more. There's bitcoin 1118 01:05:22,840 --> 01:05:24,520 Speaker 1: gold as well. I think that might be a fork. 1119 01:05:24,920 --> 01:05:29,640 Speaker 1: I love bitcoin gold. Yeah, not many people do. Um, 1120 01:05:30,720 --> 01:05:34,960 Speaker 1: so yeah, so bitcoin cash was This whole episode was 1121 01:05:34,960 --> 01:05:39,600 Speaker 1: was pretty it was a tough time. Let's talk about 1122 01:05:39,600 --> 01:05:43,640 Speaker 1: the fallout from the block size wars, because obviously they 1123 01:05:43,760 --> 01:05:49,560 Speaker 1: exposed the pretty deep divisions within the bitcoin community, and sadly, 1124 01:05:49,640 --> 01:05:52,479 Speaker 1: people like Gavin Andreason, who we've mentioned before, and also 1125 01:05:52,560 --> 01:05:54,760 Speaker 1: rodger Vie, who we touched on I think in the 1126 01:05:54,840 --> 01:06:00,640 Speaker 1: last episode. Rodger Vie was well still is a bitcoin evangelist. 1127 01:06:00,680 --> 01:06:02,960 Speaker 1: He was known for a while as Bitcoin Jesus because 1128 01:06:02,960 --> 01:06:06,080 Speaker 1: he would just give out bitcoin. He was very early 1129 01:06:06,120 --> 01:06:09,880 Speaker 1: to the bitcoin Party, but both Gavin and Roger supported 1130 01:06:09,960 --> 01:06:14,040 Speaker 1: larger blocks, and as a result, bitcoin cash and their 1131 01:06:14,080 --> 01:06:18,480 Speaker 1: reputations have never really recovered. I think it's fair to 1132 01:06:18,480 --> 01:06:21,280 Speaker 1: say that they're not bad guys in any way, shape 1133 01:06:21,360 --> 01:06:23,680 Speaker 1: or form, but they their crime, if you like, is 1134 01:06:23,720 --> 01:06:26,560 Speaker 1: to have fallen on the wrong side of history, and 1135 01:06:27,000 --> 01:06:29,640 Speaker 1: I think I think that's a real shame because especially 1136 01:06:29,720 --> 01:06:32,040 Speaker 1: we've talked a lot about Gavin Andreason and all the 1137 01:06:32,080 --> 01:06:34,360 Speaker 1: work that he did in Bitcoin's early days. He really 1138 01:06:34,440 --> 01:06:38,480 Speaker 1: is in many ways central to the Bitcoin story at 1139 01:06:38,520 --> 01:06:41,000 Speaker 1: that time, and I think I think it's a real 1140 01:06:41,000 --> 01:06:44,600 Speaker 1: shame that he's because he hitched his wagon to bigger 1141 01:06:44,600 --> 01:06:47,480 Speaker 1: blocks and bitcoin cash, that his his stock has gone 1142 01:06:47,480 --> 01:06:50,800 Speaker 1: down so much, if you like. But that, unfortunately is 1143 01:06:50,800 --> 01:06:54,480 Speaker 1: is crypto. You if you back the wrong horse, you 1144 01:06:54,560 --> 01:06:56,920 Speaker 1: can be kind of cast out into the wilderness. To 1145 01:06:57,040 --> 01:06:59,880 Speaker 1: round this section off, I think Bitcoin, yeah, it's still 1146 01:07:00,040 --> 01:07:03,600 Speaker 1: has the scalability issues, the block size. The block size 1147 01:07:03,640 --> 01:07:06,400 Speaker 1: debate though has kind of gone away because these scalability 1148 01:07:06,440 --> 01:07:09,040 Speaker 1: issues are being addressed in other ways, and perhaps the 1149 01:07:09,040 --> 01:07:13,040 Speaker 1: most notable of those is the Lightning network, and this 1150 01:07:13,720 --> 01:07:16,920 Speaker 1: is seeking to I suppose, in a nutshell, the Lightning 1151 01:07:16,960 --> 01:07:21,200 Speaker 1: network is looking to settle Bitcoin transactions off the main 1152 01:07:21,280 --> 01:07:25,919 Speaker 1: Bitcoin blockchain and then validate them on the main chain 1153 01:07:26,000 --> 01:07:30,080 Speaker 1: later on. So these kind of like they're they're often 1154 01:07:30,120 --> 01:07:35,440 Speaker 1: they're often known as scaling solutions or side chain solutions. 1155 01:07:36,000 --> 01:07:39,480 Speaker 1: That that's what's now being explored in order to solve 1156 01:07:39,560 --> 01:07:43,680 Speaker 1: this problem of the Bitcoin blockchain essentially so slow and clunky. 1157 01:07:43,800 --> 01:07:47,760 Speaker 1: So the big blocks idea has been consigned to history, 1158 01:07:47,800 --> 01:07:50,760 Speaker 1: but not before it managed to do a lot of 1159 01:07:50,840 --> 01:07:54,439 Speaker 1: damage in the Bitcoin community, which I could I would 1160 01:07:54,480 --> 01:07:57,600 Speaker 1: say kind of we still live with today. And I'll 1161 01:07:57,680 --> 01:08:01,120 Speaker 1: just finished by saying that scale liability is in fact 1162 01:08:01,160 --> 01:08:03,960 Speaker 1: an issue for all cryptos, it's not just Bitcoin. And 1163 01:08:04,000 --> 01:08:06,600 Speaker 1: this ties into what we were talking about with transactions 1164 01:08:06,640 --> 01:08:10,240 Speaker 1: per second earlier on. You know, this is a fast 1165 01:08:10,360 --> 01:08:16,040 Speaker 1: TPS score is something that all crypto blockchains are desperate 1166 01:08:16,040 --> 01:08:19,440 Speaker 1: to achieve because that would mean that they can compete 1167 01:08:19,479 --> 01:08:21,400 Speaker 1: with the likes of Visa. You know, they can be 1168 01:08:21,479 --> 01:08:23,640 Speaker 1: they can be faster, they can be more efficient, they 1169 01:08:23,640 --> 01:08:27,240 Speaker 1: can be more usable. So it's not just Bitcoin that 1170 01:08:27,439 --> 01:08:30,800 Speaker 1: is looking to solve this scalability issue. But yeah, I 1171 01:08:30,840 --> 01:08:34,200 Speaker 1: think the large that the big blocks, the big blockers 1172 01:08:34,320 --> 01:08:39,960 Speaker 1: versus small blockers has fortunately simmered down, and now for 1173 01:08:41,439 --> 01:08:43,760 Speaker 1: let's take a quick break and we will be back 1174 01:08:43,800 --> 01:08:46,200 Speaker 1: with part three in just a moment. And in part three, 1175 01:08:46,240 --> 01:08:49,559 Speaker 1: we're going to quickly counter through from the end of 1176 01:08:49,560 --> 01:08:52,000 Speaker 1: the block size wars and bring bitcoin up into the 1177 01:08:52,160 --> 01:09:10,120 Speaker 1: present day. And we're back for part three, the final 1178 01:09:10,680 --> 01:09:19,559 Speaker 1: part about bitcoin for now. I promise, are you sick 1179 01:09:19,600 --> 01:09:22,320 Speaker 1: of bitcoin? I love it. It's it's my favorite one. 1180 01:09:22,360 --> 01:09:24,599 Speaker 1: I'm a maximum list And if you say any other 1181 01:09:25,160 --> 01:09:29,000 Speaker 1: cryptocurrency is anything else but shit, I will fight you. 1182 01:09:28,640 --> 01:09:32,400 Speaker 1: You're just lean apart from Songbird, which I got given 1183 01:09:32,520 --> 01:09:35,599 Speaker 1: some we've discovered because I hold a little bit of Ripple, 1184 01:09:36,040 --> 01:09:42,000 Speaker 1: another doomed coin. You're always no coins doing well when 1185 01:09:42,000 --> 01:09:46,120 Speaker 1: they give you more coins, it's it's not always. It's 1186 01:09:46,160 --> 01:09:49,800 Speaker 1: not always a good sign. So I think by this point, 1187 01:09:49,880 --> 01:09:52,120 Speaker 1: I mean there's so many there's so many events that 1188 01:09:52,120 --> 01:09:54,840 Speaker 1: have happened around bitcoin, so many important moments, so many 1189 01:09:54,880 --> 01:09:58,400 Speaker 1: important people, and I think we've tracked up to now 1190 01:09:58,760 --> 01:10:01,559 Speaker 1: the big ones if you like. So let's look at Yeah, 1191 01:10:01,600 --> 01:10:03,960 Speaker 1: let's look at some of the milestones in bitcoins history 1192 01:10:04,080 --> 01:10:06,320 Speaker 1: between the end of the block size wars and the 1193 01:10:06,360 --> 01:10:09,920 Speaker 1: present day. Seen when the block size wars were coming 1194 01:10:09,960 --> 01:10:14,639 Speaker 1: to a head. Was just a wild year for crypto. Well, yeah, 1195 01:10:14,720 --> 01:10:17,400 Speaker 1: we'll all remember this. A lot of a lot of 1196 01:10:17,439 --> 01:10:20,240 Speaker 1: people listening may have may have been kind of watching 1197 01:10:20,240 --> 01:10:23,400 Speaker 1: from the sidelines and seeing and hearing about all this happening. 1198 01:10:23,400 --> 01:10:25,799 Speaker 1: But others like us, I mean, we were we were involved, 1199 01:10:25,840 --> 01:10:28,760 Speaker 1: We were invested in the traditional's time. So this was 1200 01:10:28,800 --> 01:10:30,880 Speaker 1: the time that we saw the what was known as 1201 01:10:30,920 --> 01:10:33,280 Speaker 1: the i c O boom, the initial coin offering boom. 1202 01:10:33,360 --> 01:10:36,960 Speaker 1: This was when loads of startup crypto projects realized that 1203 01:10:37,000 --> 01:10:40,479 Speaker 1: this they had this amazing way of earning startup capital, 1204 01:10:40,479 --> 01:10:45,160 Speaker 1: of earning money. They basically held these coin sales. They 1205 01:10:45,200 --> 01:10:47,360 Speaker 1: issued a coin or a token, and then they sold 1206 01:10:47,400 --> 01:10:50,720 Speaker 1: it in in in the i c O and some 1207 01:10:50,880 --> 01:10:54,439 Speaker 1: of them raked in absolutely obscene amounts of money, some 1208 01:10:54,520 --> 01:10:59,000 Speaker 1: of them in seconds. The world basically just went crypto crazy, 1209 01:10:59,080 --> 01:11:02,040 Speaker 1: and all coins really for the first time ever shared 1210 01:11:02,080 --> 01:11:06,360 Speaker 1: the limelight with bitcoin, and but also the bitcoin price 1211 01:11:06,439 --> 01:11:10,439 Speaker 1: itself went bananas towards the end of it just took off. 1212 01:11:10,479 --> 01:11:13,800 Speaker 1: And remember that, yes, the bitcoin the price peaked just 1213 01:11:14,000 --> 01:11:18,200 Speaker 1: shy of twenty dollars and late in December, and this 1214 01:11:18,280 --> 01:11:22,040 Speaker 1: was the time that bitcoin futures on the Chicago Mercantile 1215 01:11:22,080 --> 01:11:25,960 Speaker 1: Exchange were launched, and this, as we later found out, 1216 01:11:26,200 --> 01:11:29,240 Speaker 1: signaled the very top of the market. This was this 1217 01:11:29,280 --> 01:11:32,720 Speaker 1: was an opportunity for institutional investors to get involved more. 1218 01:11:33,200 --> 01:11:35,599 Speaker 1: Not not just people like you and me, you know, 1219 01:11:35,680 --> 01:11:38,280 Speaker 1: just people who kind of suddenly discovered krypto and we're 1220 01:11:38,320 --> 01:11:42,000 Speaker 1: just putting our savings into it or whatever. But this 1221 01:11:42,080 --> 01:11:44,280 Speaker 1: is you know, the big guys that the real the 1222 01:11:44,360 --> 01:11:47,040 Speaker 1: big barons of Wall Street. This was an opportunity for 1223 01:11:47,120 --> 01:11:51,639 Speaker 1: institutional traders to wade wade in and as you say, 1224 01:11:51,760 --> 01:11:58,960 Speaker 1: we then ticked over into and yeah it things Things 1225 01:11:58,960 --> 01:12:04,920 Speaker 1: got a little painful, didn't they. Yeah, Basically, early January 1226 01:12:05,760 --> 01:12:07,920 Speaker 1: what we now record what we now refer to as 1227 01:12:07,960 --> 01:12:13,400 Speaker 1: crypto winter set in and prices absolutely tanked and it was, yeah, 1228 01:12:13,479 --> 01:12:17,559 Speaker 1: it was tough. So when this crypto winter sets in 1229 01:12:17,560 --> 01:12:20,720 Speaker 1: in early January eighteen, this is when kind of mainstream 1230 01:12:20,760 --> 01:12:23,200 Speaker 1: criticism of bitcoin seems to kind of bubble up to 1231 01:12:23,200 --> 01:12:25,479 Speaker 1: the surface again, and you have people like Warren Buffett. 1232 01:12:25,520 --> 01:12:30,400 Speaker 1: He called it rap poison squared, which doesn't make sense. No, 1233 01:12:30,520 --> 01:12:33,040 Speaker 1: it doesn't, really, it doesn't, but it certainly didn't make 1234 01:12:33,080 --> 01:12:35,360 Speaker 1: it any easier to hear. Warren Buffett is obviously the 1235 01:12:35,439 --> 01:12:38,360 Speaker 1: darling of of of investors everywhere, you know, the big 1236 01:12:38,640 --> 01:12:41,200 Speaker 1: the name that always comes up when when you talk 1237 01:12:41,200 --> 01:12:45,160 Speaker 1: about investing. So for someone like him to to beat 1238 01:12:45,200 --> 01:12:47,560 Speaker 1: down on bitcoin was was not great, not what we 1239 01:12:47,640 --> 01:12:52,040 Speaker 1: wanted to hear. And then it got worse, unfortunately, because 1240 01:12:52,080 --> 01:12:56,080 Speaker 1: then the following month, February, the Chinese government announced a 1241 01:12:56,160 --> 01:13:01,160 Speaker 1: ban on crypto exchanges. And this, i remember again was 1242 01:13:01,160 --> 01:13:04,920 Speaker 1: was a real tough blow because, as we've talked about, China, 1243 01:13:05,040 --> 01:13:07,400 Speaker 1: along with the US, was the big market for it, 1244 01:13:07,439 --> 01:13:11,000 Speaker 1: and the Chinese were pretty crypto crazy, they were really 1245 01:13:11,040 --> 01:13:13,559 Speaker 1: fond of it, they were really keen on it. So 1246 01:13:14,080 --> 01:13:17,479 Speaker 1: it became clear that China, it became clear from about 1247 01:13:17,479 --> 01:13:21,160 Speaker 1: this point on, from about early that China and crypto 1248 01:13:21,360 --> 01:13:24,840 Speaker 1: we're not going to mix. The Communist Party is just 1249 01:13:25,080 --> 01:13:28,559 Speaker 1: not a fan and this is something that has only 1250 01:13:28,600 --> 01:13:32,600 Speaker 1: accelerated since then. So it's fair to say that was 1251 01:13:32,640 --> 01:13:35,719 Speaker 1: a tough year both for bitcoin and for crypto in general, 1252 01:13:35,800 --> 01:13:38,200 Speaker 1: and a lot of people felt that the whole thing 1253 01:13:38,240 --> 01:13:41,720 Speaker 1: was a bubble that had burst, and sadly, a lot 1254 01:13:41,800 --> 01:13:44,960 Speaker 1: of investors had lost a lot of money, especially through 1255 01:13:45,000 --> 01:13:47,280 Speaker 1: these I c O s, these initial coin offerings, and 1256 01:13:47,800 --> 01:13:50,640 Speaker 1: I mean some of them have survived and still and 1257 01:13:50,680 --> 01:13:55,080 Speaker 1: are still going, and others basically went to zero, and unfortunately, 1258 01:13:55,200 --> 01:13:57,679 Speaker 1: as I say, a lot of people lost out big time. 1259 01:13:57,720 --> 01:13:59,639 Speaker 1: And of course a lot of people who piled into 1260 01:13:59,640 --> 01:14:02,840 Speaker 1: bitco when it was hovering around the twenty dollar mark, 1261 01:14:03,040 --> 01:14:06,320 Speaker 1: they also saw their their net worth take a real 1262 01:14:06,400 --> 01:14:10,720 Speaker 1: hit below the waterline as well. So, yeah, crypto if 1263 01:14:10,720 --> 01:14:13,960 Speaker 1: you like it, kind of it went pretty quiet, and 1264 01:14:14,200 --> 01:14:17,519 Speaker 1: actually the bitcoin price dropped to as low as three thousand, 1265 01:14:17,520 --> 01:14:24,479 Speaker 1: two hundred dollars, remember at five and going do I sell? Yeah, well, 1266 01:14:24,520 --> 01:14:28,479 Speaker 1: if you managed to hold it was it's it's good work, really, 1267 01:14:28,840 --> 01:14:31,040 Speaker 1: because this is the thing, and I know we've talked 1268 01:14:31,040 --> 01:14:33,439 Speaker 1: about this a few times, but a lot of people 1269 01:14:33,560 --> 01:14:36,679 Speaker 1: often say, oh, I just imagine if you got into 1270 01:14:36,720 --> 01:14:39,679 Speaker 1: bitcoin when it was a dollar, or when you could 1271 01:14:39,720 --> 01:14:42,599 Speaker 1: buy five thousand for five dollars like that guy, that 1272 01:14:42,840 --> 01:14:45,599 Speaker 1: New Liberty Standard guy. Did I've only I'd got into 1273 01:14:45,680 --> 01:14:50,280 Speaker 1: it then. But you have to realize that so many people, 1274 01:14:50,360 --> 01:14:53,160 Speaker 1: even people who got in early, a lot of them 1275 01:14:53,240 --> 01:14:56,519 Speaker 1: sold at some point. There are very very few people 1276 01:14:56,760 --> 01:15:00,400 Speaker 1: who have held on through thick and thin. And obviously 1277 01:15:00,400 --> 01:15:02,799 Speaker 1: people have all sorts of different reasons for selling. Sometimes 1278 01:15:02,800 --> 01:15:05,280 Speaker 1: they just need to sell. Sometimes, you know, especially if 1279 01:15:05,320 --> 01:15:07,639 Speaker 1: you're in the States, you might have a hospital bill. 1280 01:15:08,080 --> 01:15:10,519 Speaker 1: I mean that's I think hospital bills are the leading 1281 01:15:10,520 --> 01:15:13,439 Speaker 1: cause of bankruptcy in the United States, did you know. Yeah, 1282 01:15:13,720 --> 01:15:16,559 Speaker 1: I mean, we were so lucky here with our National 1283 01:15:16,560 --> 01:15:19,680 Speaker 1: Health Service that you know, something goes wrong, you get 1284 01:15:19,760 --> 01:15:22,559 Speaker 1: scraped off the road, you get you go in and 1285 01:15:22,560 --> 01:15:24,479 Speaker 1: you get treated, and you that you don't get asked 1286 01:15:24,479 --> 01:15:28,080 Speaker 1: for a penny. It's not the case in many countries, 1287 01:15:28,080 --> 01:15:31,160 Speaker 1: in the US in particular. So yeah, lots of people 1288 01:15:31,160 --> 01:15:33,840 Speaker 1: have different reasons for selling. And yeah, people might have gone, well, 1289 01:15:33,880 --> 01:15:36,000 Speaker 1: do you know what, I bought it at ten dollars, 1290 01:15:36,120 --> 01:15:38,080 Speaker 1: I'm going to sell it at five thousand dollars. That's 1291 01:15:38,120 --> 01:15:41,040 Speaker 1: still a pretty good return. Because no one can predict 1292 01:15:41,040 --> 01:15:42,960 Speaker 1: the future. No one would know that eventually it would 1293 01:15:42,960 --> 01:15:48,599 Speaker 1: climb up to sixty dollars. Yes, So again it's worth 1294 01:15:48,640 --> 01:15:51,640 Speaker 1: thinking sometimes when you when you think, oh, I'm just 1295 01:15:51,920 --> 01:15:53,920 Speaker 1: I'm just too late to this. This is this is 1296 01:15:54,000 --> 01:15:56,439 Speaker 1: a train that left the station a long time ago. 1297 01:15:57,400 --> 01:16:00,479 Speaker 1: Not everyone has stayed on the train. It's some people 1298 01:16:00,520 --> 01:16:02,880 Speaker 1: have got off at later stations. This is a bit 1299 01:16:02,920 --> 01:16:05,280 Speaker 1: of a labored metaphor, isn't it. Some quite ironic with 1300 01:16:05,439 --> 01:16:10,479 Speaker 1: the train going post hopefully that will be nicely sound 1301 01:16:10,520 --> 01:16:14,240 Speaker 1: tracking it. And some people have fallen spectacularly off the 1302 01:16:14,320 --> 01:16:17,599 Speaker 1: roof of the train. So it's not been It's not 1303 01:16:17,640 --> 01:16:21,200 Speaker 1: been an easy ride for anyone, even those who got 1304 01:16:21,240 --> 01:16:25,080 Speaker 1: on right at the start. So is generally a year 1305 01:16:25,160 --> 01:16:28,160 Speaker 1: that we like to us people in crypto, we like 1306 01:16:28,240 --> 01:16:30,200 Speaker 1: to forget about. I don't like to think about it 1307 01:16:30,240 --> 01:16:35,160 Speaker 1: too much. And was also kind of slow, although bitcoin 1308 01:16:35,360 --> 01:16:41,519 Speaker 1: was starting to climb up and around May it started 1309 01:16:41,520 --> 01:16:44,360 Speaker 1: there was a kind of noticeable uptick, and then of 1310 01:16:44,360 --> 01:16:49,519 Speaker 1: course we had and and and again, wasn't again wasn't 1311 01:16:49,520 --> 01:16:52,559 Speaker 1: too eventful, but things were at least going up. And 1312 01:16:52,600 --> 01:16:59,920 Speaker 1: then March COVID came along and bitcoin too many people surprise, 1313 01:17:00,080 --> 01:17:03,439 Speaker 1: including mine. To a point at the time, bitcoin tanked 1314 01:17:03,439 --> 01:17:05,600 Speaker 1: along with everything else we saw that we store the 1315 01:17:05,680 --> 01:17:09,160 Speaker 1: stock market tank, the bitcoin price tank, all cryptos tank. 1316 01:17:09,240 --> 01:17:12,280 Speaker 1: It was yeah. And that was on the announcement from 1317 01:17:12,320 --> 01:17:15,600 Speaker 1: the World Health Organization that we're officially in a pandemic, 1318 01:17:18,760 --> 01:17:22,960 Speaker 1: it was yeah, And it was brutal. It was brutal, 1319 01:17:23,800 --> 01:17:28,400 Speaker 1: but things didn't stay brutal for long because May was 1320 01:17:28,479 --> 01:17:31,960 Speaker 1: a really important date because that was the bitcoin harving. 1321 01:17:32,040 --> 01:17:34,080 Speaker 1: Now we've talked about this, just cover it quickly again. 1322 01:17:34,120 --> 01:17:37,559 Speaker 1: This is when the block reward for mining a bitcoin 1323 01:17:37,600 --> 01:17:41,000 Speaker 1: block is cut in half. So it had been twelve 1324 01:17:41,000 --> 01:17:44,320 Speaker 1: and a half btc, it was cut down to six 1325 01:17:44,400 --> 01:17:48,080 Speaker 1: point to five six and a quarter btc. Now, this 1326 01:17:48,400 --> 01:17:51,280 Speaker 1: is a lot of people have identified the bitcoin harving 1327 01:17:51,320 --> 01:17:55,559 Speaker 1: that happens roughly every four years as being the start 1328 01:17:55,960 --> 01:17:59,840 Speaker 1: of a bullmarket cycle, and in this case it was 1329 01:18:00,439 --> 01:18:04,000 Speaker 1: the prices prices for bitcoin and other crypto started creeping 1330 01:18:04,600 --> 01:18:08,719 Speaker 1: slowly back up. Crypto was basically becoming news again. And 1331 01:18:10,040 --> 01:18:13,200 Speaker 1: obviously a big part of a big thing for crypto 1332 01:18:13,240 --> 01:18:15,599 Speaker 1: back then, because we were all suddenly all found ourselves 1333 01:18:15,600 --> 01:18:18,800 Speaker 1: lockdown in our houses with not an awful lot to do. 1334 01:18:19,600 --> 01:18:22,280 Speaker 1: Interest in crypto went through the roof. And I remember 1335 01:18:22,520 --> 01:18:25,479 Speaker 1: we were the Coin Bureau itself was just over a 1336 01:18:25,560 --> 01:18:28,360 Speaker 1: year old, that the channel was just over a year 1337 01:18:28,360 --> 01:18:32,480 Speaker 1: old at that time, and we've been seeing our subscriber 1338 01:18:32,560 --> 01:18:36,679 Speaker 1: numbers sort of go up slowly but steadily, and suddenly 1339 01:18:36,800 --> 01:18:39,920 Speaker 1: they just exploded because people were stuck at home. They 1340 01:18:39,920 --> 01:18:41,920 Speaker 1: were like, you know what, I'm going to look into crypto. 1341 01:18:42,000 --> 01:18:43,400 Speaker 1: I'm going to see what this is all about. I 1342 01:18:43,400 --> 01:18:45,320 Speaker 1: haven't had the time, I haven't had the you know, 1343 01:18:45,439 --> 01:18:48,559 Speaker 1: the inclination. And now that I've actually got some free 1344 01:18:48,600 --> 01:18:51,400 Speaker 1: time for the first time in my adult life, I'm 1345 01:18:51,439 --> 01:18:53,599 Speaker 1: going to find out what this whole crypto thing is about. 1346 01:18:53,800 --> 01:18:58,639 Speaker 1: And and thanks to you, thanks Joy, you are welcome. 1347 01:19:00,280 --> 01:19:02,840 Speaker 1: It was. It was a crazy, crazy time because the 1348 01:19:02,920 --> 01:19:05,559 Speaker 1: prices were going up and the interest was going up, 1349 01:19:06,080 --> 01:19:09,800 Speaker 1: and all of a sudden, people were again, people were 1350 01:19:09,800 --> 01:19:13,559 Speaker 1: talking about crypto again. But it has to be said 1351 01:19:13,640 --> 01:19:16,479 Speaker 1: that although this retail interest went up, although all these 1352 01:19:16,840 --> 01:19:19,439 Speaker 1: people like you and me were suddenly becoming interested in 1353 01:19:19,479 --> 01:19:21,559 Speaker 1: it again, the man in the street, if you like, 1354 01:19:22,320 --> 01:19:26,719 Speaker 1: late and early one were all about the big money, 1355 01:19:26,760 --> 01:19:30,719 Speaker 1: big money, yeah, the big boys piling into bitcoin especially, 1356 01:19:30,720 --> 01:19:33,920 Speaker 1: but crypto more generally as well. And this was this 1357 01:19:33,960 --> 01:19:37,240 Speaker 1: has been the theme really of of the last couple 1358 01:19:37,240 --> 01:19:42,519 Speaker 1: of years. Not only not only big investments vehicles, investment 1359 01:19:42,520 --> 01:19:45,479 Speaker 1: companies and the like piling in, but also companies as well. 1360 01:19:45,520 --> 01:19:49,519 Speaker 1: So for example, October twenty PayPal announced that it was 1361 01:19:49,560 --> 01:19:51,719 Speaker 1: going into crypto and it was going to allow users 1362 01:19:51,760 --> 01:19:54,920 Speaker 1: to actually buy and sell various cryptos through its app. 1363 01:19:54,960 --> 01:19:59,080 Speaker 1: And again it was still quite limited Bitcoin ethereum like coin, 1364 01:19:59,560 --> 01:20:03,559 Speaker 1: bitcoin in cash, but this was a huge, huge step 1365 01:20:03,600 --> 01:20:08,559 Speaker 1: towards mainstream adoption. And you had again sort of big names, 1366 01:20:08,600 --> 01:20:11,040 Speaker 1: big investors if you like in finance, you know, big 1367 01:20:11,120 --> 01:20:13,200 Speaker 1: kind of wolves of Wall Street for want of a 1368 01:20:13,240 --> 01:20:17,040 Speaker 1: better term, started to make encouraging noises about bitcoin again. 1369 01:20:17,120 --> 01:20:21,400 Speaker 1: And and then January one was another big date. Tesla 1370 01:20:21,439 --> 01:20:24,200 Speaker 1: announced that it was going to accept BTC for its cars, 1371 01:20:24,720 --> 01:20:26,479 Speaker 1: and then the following month it revealed that it had 1372 01:20:26,520 --> 01:20:32,599 Speaker 1: bought one point five billion dollars worth just a little 1373 01:20:32,720 --> 01:20:35,320 Speaker 1: just a little dabble. No, let's just have a let's 1374 01:20:35,320 --> 01:20:36,840 Speaker 1: just have a look. Let's just have a look, just 1375 01:20:36,880 --> 01:20:41,280 Speaker 1: going low, let's say one one point five billion dollars. 1376 01:20:41,560 --> 01:20:44,080 Speaker 1: How do you buy that much? Because it just it's 1377 01:20:44,240 --> 01:20:46,439 Speaker 1: just so much to buy. It is a lot to buy. 1378 01:20:46,760 --> 01:20:49,120 Speaker 1: The big guys do it slightly differently. The big guys 1379 01:20:49,160 --> 01:20:52,320 Speaker 1: don't generally go through exchanges. They'll do what are called 1380 01:20:52,320 --> 01:20:55,120 Speaker 1: o TC or over the counter trads, So they'll do 1381 01:20:55,200 --> 01:20:57,880 Speaker 1: it with a kind of separate broker and there, and 1382 01:20:57,880 --> 01:20:59,720 Speaker 1: And the reason they do this is because I think 1383 01:20:59,720 --> 01:21:01,960 Speaker 1: it out sort of slightly cheaper for because if you're 1384 01:21:02,000 --> 01:21:03,400 Speaker 1: buying that much, and it's just going to go up 1385 01:21:03,400 --> 01:21:04,800 Speaker 1: and up and up and up and up from the 1386 01:21:04,880 --> 01:21:08,160 Speaker 1: Yeah O O t C trades are useful for big 1387 01:21:08,160 --> 01:21:10,840 Speaker 1: institutions because it allows them to buy large amounts of 1388 01:21:10,840 --> 01:21:13,720 Speaker 1: crypto without moving the price, whereas if you were if 1389 01:21:13,720 --> 01:21:16,559 Speaker 1: you were to do that on in exchange, suddenly people 1390 01:21:16,560 --> 01:21:19,280 Speaker 1: would notice, hang on, someone just bought one point five billion, 1391 01:21:19,320 --> 01:21:21,960 Speaker 1: and yeah, the price goes right up. So yeah, the 1392 01:21:22,000 --> 01:21:26,280 Speaker 1: institutions have their own little back channels like which is 1393 01:21:26,280 --> 01:21:29,160 Speaker 1: probably the least surprising news Young one rule for them, 1394 01:21:29,200 --> 01:21:32,599 Speaker 1: one rule for the rest of us. UM. And then 1395 01:21:32,640 --> 01:21:35,439 Speaker 1: you had Elon Musk tweeting his support for bitcoin. This 1396 01:21:35,520 --> 01:21:38,120 Speaker 1: was sort of Elon's entry into the bitcoin world, which 1397 01:21:38,160 --> 01:21:41,519 Speaker 1: I think many of us would rather he hadn't done, 1398 01:21:41,680 --> 01:21:45,920 Speaker 1: because he's been very vocal about bitcoin and crypto, and 1399 01:21:46,200 --> 01:21:49,040 Speaker 1: not always for the best. He's now a big sort 1400 01:21:49,080 --> 01:21:56,040 Speaker 1: of doge coin fanaticum which yeah sometimes although he's although 1401 01:21:56,080 --> 01:22:01,160 Speaker 1: he has been good for UM for for putting crypto 1402 01:22:01,240 --> 01:22:05,479 Speaker 1: in the headlines, not always for the right reasons. So yeah, 1403 01:22:05,520 --> 01:22:08,080 Speaker 1: he's a bit of a divisive figure in cryptos. Elon Musk, 1404 01:22:08,280 --> 01:22:10,280 Speaker 1: I mean, I think he's just divisive generally, isn't he. 1405 01:22:11,040 --> 01:22:14,120 Speaker 1: And then in March one, after this big buy from 1406 01:22:14,160 --> 01:22:17,519 Speaker 1: Tesla and these big announcements, the bitcoin market cap hit 1407 01:22:17,600 --> 01:22:21,840 Speaker 1: one trillion dollars for the first time. Just extraordinary, something 1408 01:22:21,880 --> 01:22:26,040 Speaker 1: that would have been seemed utterly impossible even just a 1409 01:22:26,120 --> 01:22:29,840 Speaker 1: year before or a couple of years before. It was extraordinary. 1410 01:22:30,040 --> 01:22:32,479 Speaker 1: And you had investment banks the likes of JP Morgan, 1411 01:22:32,520 --> 01:22:35,360 Speaker 1: who had been very rude about crypto up to that point. 1412 01:22:35,560 --> 01:22:38,760 Speaker 1: Suddenly they were offering bitcoin exposure to their clients because 1413 01:22:38,760 --> 01:22:41,920 Speaker 1: their clients were all going, hey, what, why can't we 1414 01:22:41,960 --> 01:22:46,520 Speaker 1: get involved? This is amazing again, just an amazing turnaround. 1415 01:22:47,600 --> 01:22:51,519 Speaker 1: Then May two thousand and eleven, crypto crashed because Tesla 1416 01:22:51,560 --> 01:22:56,080 Speaker 1: announced that it was suspending it's bitcoin payments over concerns 1417 01:22:56,160 --> 01:22:59,160 Speaker 1: around the environmental impact of bitcoin mining. This is something 1418 01:22:59,200 --> 01:23:00,960 Speaker 1: again that we discuss in the episode on the point, 1419 01:23:01,200 --> 01:23:04,800 Speaker 1: isn't bitcoin mining being very computer intensive, requires a lot 1420 01:23:04,800 --> 01:23:08,800 Speaker 1: of electricity And this treads on the toes of e 1421 01:23:08,960 --> 01:23:13,040 Speaker 1: s G. Environmental, Social and governance investing guidelines, which are 1422 01:23:13,160 --> 01:23:17,280 Speaker 1: all all the rage at the moment um, so this 1423 01:23:17,360 --> 01:23:22,040 Speaker 1: was a big concern. So Tesla Tesla stopped suspended bitcoin 1424 01:23:22,120 --> 01:23:25,639 Speaker 1: payments and this the markets didn't didn't react to well 1425 01:23:25,680 --> 01:23:29,080 Speaker 1: to this, and we saw what's known as a flash crash. 1426 01:23:29,360 --> 01:23:32,200 Speaker 1: It's sort of it dipped very quickly, and it was 1427 01:23:32,240 --> 01:23:34,880 Speaker 1: a nasty couple of months. But actually you couldn't really 1428 01:23:34,960 --> 01:23:39,160 Speaker 1: keep it down because by July there was more good news. 1429 01:23:39,200 --> 01:23:42,680 Speaker 1: Germany decided to allow its financial institutions to hold up 1430 01:23:42,680 --> 01:23:46,080 Speaker 1: to twent of their assets in bitcoin. And I mean 1431 01:23:46,439 --> 01:23:49,960 Speaker 1: that's a lot. That is a hefty allocation to this, 1432 01:23:50,120 --> 01:23:51,760 Speaker 1: to this thing that was kind of seen as an 1433 01:23:51,760 --> 01:23:55,559 Speaker 1: outlaw their assets in CRYPTI should say, not not purely, 1434 01:23:56,040 --> 01:24:00,200 Speaker 1: which is even more extraordinary really. And again, yeah, this 1435 01:24:00,200 --> 01:24:01,960 Speaker 1: this thing that had been sort of seen as an 1436 01:24:01,960 --> 01:24:05,360 Speaker 1: outlaw sector just a few years before, suddenly even the German, 1437 01:24:05,560 --> 01:24:09,760 Speaker 1: even German banks are piling in. Then we have the 1438 01:24:09,800 --> 01:24:13,919 Speaker 1: Bitcoin Miami conference in June of one, where the president 1439 01:24:14,000 --> 01:24:17,240 Speaker 1: of El Salvador and Nagibo, Kelly, announces that his country 1440 01:24:17,360 --> 01:24:21,639 Speaker 1: will adopt bitcoin BTC as legal tender. And this came 1441 01:24:21,680 --> 01:24:25,200 Speaker 1: into effect a few months later in September one. And 1442 01:24:25,240 --> 01:24:29,599 Speaker 1: again this probably of all the recent developments in bitcoin, 1443 01:24:29,800 --> 01:24:33,280 Speaker 1: this has got to be the biggest. Really, and again 1444 01:24:33,640 --> 01:24:37,719 Speaker 1: I've said it before several times, but just in relation 1445 01:24:37,760 --> 01:24:39,920 Speaker 1: to everything that had gone before, even just a few 1446 01:24:40,040 --> 01:24:42,920 Speaker 1: years ago, in the depths of the crypto winter in 1447 01:24:43,640 --> 01:24:46,800 Speaker 1: if you've said in about three years time there will 1448 01:24:46,840 --> 01:24:52,160 Speaker 1: be a country accepting BTC as legal tender, you you 1449 01:24:52,200 --> 01:24:55,000 Speaker 1: wouldn't have got you wouldn't have got a very receptive 1450 01:24:55,000 --> 01:24:58,120 Speaker 1: audience people. You would have been laughed out of town 1451 01:24:58,120 --> 01:25:00,519 Speaker 1: by all but the most hardcore bit points. I think 1452 01:25:00,479 --> 01:25:06,400 Speaker 1: it would just impossible to imagine. And I'm sure, I'm 1453 01:25:06,400 --> 01:25:08,320 Speaker 1: sure El Salvador is not going to be the last. 1454 01:25:08,640 --> 01:25:11,360 Speaker 1: There are going to be more countries adopting adopting this 1455 01:25:11,439 --> 01:25:15,960 Speaker 1: is legal tender. El Salvador's bitcoin experiment is is fascinating. 1456 01:25:16,000 --> 01:25:19,519 Speaker 1: I mean, you know that they're converted giving their giving 1457 01:25:19,520 --> 01:25:22,519 Speaker 1: their citizens access. They have their own um sort of 1458 01:25:22,600 --> 01:25:25,720 Speaker 1: national bitcoin wallets, the chiev oh wallet, which they have 1459 01:25:25,800 --> 01:25:28,160 Speaker 1: been sort of bumps along the road. It's it's not 1460 01:25:28,200 --> 01:25:32,160 Speaker 1: been all plain sailing, but again it's just this most extraordinary, 1461 01:25:33,200 --> 01:25:36,439 Speaker 1: extraordinary event. Suddenly a country was going to take this 1462 01:25:36,880 --> 01:25:42,080 Speaker 1: magic Internet money as as legal tender. A few more things, 1463 01:25:42,479 --> 01:25:47,160 Speaker 1: a few more noteworthy points around that time. In September one, 1464 01:25:47,240 --> 01:25:51,200 Speaker 1: we also saw China banning crypto mining. So even though 1465 01:25:51,200 --> 01:25:53,800 Speaker 1: it'd been even though it banned exchanges a long time ago, 1466 01:25:54,360 --> 01:25:57,240 Speaker 1: it's still it's still been possible to mine bitcoin and 1467 01:25:57,280 --> 01:26:00,519 Speaker 1: other cryptos in China, but that was no more. And 1468 01:26:00,880 --> 01:26:04,959 Speaker 1: really all this did was hand its portion of bitcoin's 1469 01:26:04,960 --> 01:26:08,000 Speaker 1: hash rate over over to the US. Yeah, there's a 1470 01:26:08,080 --> 01:26:13,880 Speaker 1: there's this bitcoin Russell Oh Kung Kung, American footballer who 1471 01:26:13,880 --> 01:26:18,040 Speaker 1: took half of his contract. Oh yeah in bitcoin, Yeah, 1472 01:26:19,120 --> 01:26:22,439 Speaker 1: million dollar contract. He took half of it cooin. Yeah, 1473 01:26:22,600 --> 01:26:24,120 Speaker 1: there are a few. I think there are a few. 1474 01:26:24,160 --> 01:26:29,360 Speaker 1: American football is doing it now. Okay, it's extraordinary, um okay. 1475 01:26:29,400 --> 01:26:32,120 Speaker 1: And in September one as well, we had some other 1476 01:26:32,160 --> 01:26:34,559 Speaker 1: big news which was less good. This was the fact 1477 01:26:34,640 --> 01:26:39,439 Speaker 1: that China was banning crypto mining. And basically all this 1478 01:26:39,520 --> 01:26:43,320 Speaker 1: did was hand much of bitcoin's hash rate to the 1479 01:26:43,400 --> 01:26:46,000 Speaker 1: United States. So I think it's fair to say that 1480 01:26:46,080 --> 01:26:50,240 Speaker 1: China really shot itself in the foot there because, yeah, 1481 01:26:50,280 --> 01:26:53,320 Speaker 1: all its concerns, I mean, they cited sort of things 1482 01:26:53,320 --> 01:26:56,720 Speaker 1: like environmental concerns. Really, China wants to launch its own 1483 01:26:56,920 --> 01:27:01,320 Speaker 1: central bank digital currency, which will which is has some 1484 01:27:01,400 --> 01:27:05,240 Speaker 1: similarities to cryptocurrency and the run on a blockchain, but 1485 01:27:05,400 --> 01:27:07,519 Speaker 1: is in fact nothing like a cryptocurrency at all. But 1486 01:27:07,520 --> 01:27:11,960 Speaker 1: obviously China doesn't want to an autonomous form of money 1487 01:27:12,040 --> 01:27:17,880 Speaker 1: challenging its central bankshit. Yeah, and they probably don't want 1488 01:27:17,920 --> 01:27:22,040 Speaker 1: it to be decentralized. No, no, China does not that 1489 01:27:22,040 --> 01:27:25,920 Speaker 1: that the Chinese Communist Party does not like decentralization. It 1490 01:27:26,000 --> 01:27:31,599 Speaker 1: likes things to be centralized nicely, nicely amongst its, nicely 1491 01:27:31,920 --> 01:27:36,639 Speaker 1: around it. Basically. Yeah, so this this wasn't great news 1492 01:27:36,680 --> 01:27:39,280 Speaker 1: for crypto, but it kind of took it in its stride. Really. 1493 01:27:39,600 --> 01:27:43,719 Speaker 1: Obviously China had kind of in inverted commas band crypto before, 1494 01:27:43,760 --> 01:27:46,680 Speaker 1: and that it has stopped its citizens being able to 1495 01:27:46,760 --> 01:27:49,439 Speaker 1: use exchanges and you know, use the Great Firewall of 1496 01:27:49,520 --> 01:27:52,320 Speaker 1: China to cut off a lot of access. But actually 1497 01:27:52,320 --> 01:27:55,479 Speaker 1: banning crypto mining itself was a fairly big moment, but 1498 01:27:55,800 --> 01:27:58,400 Speaker 1: one that I don't think has done China any real good, 1499 01:27:59,160 --> 01:28:01,240 Speaker 1: although it has argue really been much better for bitcoin 1500 01:28:01,320 --> 01:28:05,240 Speaker 1: because we've seen the hash rate move away from a country, 1501 01:28:05,640 --> 01:28:10,960 Speaker 1: an authoritarian country, which is great. October one, we had 1502 01:28:11,080 --> 01:28:13,880 Speaker 1: the SEC the Securities and Exchange Commission over in the 1503 01:28:13,920 --> 01:28:19,759 Speaker 1: US approved the first American Bitcoin futures et F, although 1504 01:28:19,840 --> 01:28:23,320 Speaker 1: actually such instruments did already exist in Canada and elsewhere, 1505 01:28:23,360 --> 01:28:25,280 Speaker 1: that the US is a bit behind the curve here. 1506 01:28:26,120 --> 01:28:29,880 Speaker 1: And then just to round things off, in October one, 1507 01:28:30,000 --> 01:28:33,360 Speaker 1: we saw bitcoin here's an all time high of sixty 1508 01:28:33,520 --> 01:28:40,080 Speaker 1: six thousand, nine d and seventy four dollars, just amazing, amazing, 1509 01:28:40,120 --> 01:28:44,120 Speaker 1: and of course bitcoin being bitcoin, crypto being crypto, that 1510 01:28:44,439 --> 01:28:50,000 Speaker 1: it's it's down quite significantly from that from that, from 1511 01:28:50,040 --> 01:28:52,639 Speaker 1: that all time high, So the roller coaster goes on. 1512 01:28:53,400 --> 01:28:57,000 Speaker 1: The Bitcoin story is is just getting started. Really, That's 1513 01:28:57,080 --> 01:28:58,800 Speaker 1: that's one of the things that so exciting about it. 1514 01:28:58,800 --> 01:29:02,599 Speaker 1: It's only thirteen years old. It's evolving all the time, 1515 01:29:02,680 --> 01:29:05,439 Speaker 1: it's growing all the time. There is so much more 1516 01:29:05,439 --> 01:29:09,280 Speaker 1: ahead of it, and at the moment we have it's 1517 01:29:09,360 --> 01:29:12,920 Speaker 1: matured greatly because now we have global macro concerns, things 1518 01:29:12,960 --> 01:29:16,280 Speaker 1: like concerns over interest rate rises from the US Federal Reserve, 1519 01:29:16,960 --> 01:29:19,400 Speaker 1: the selling off of risk on assets like stocks and 1520 01:29:19,439 --> 01:29:22,519 Speaker 1: crypto in favor of things like bonds. We've also got 1521 01:29:22,520 --> 01:29:26,639 Speaker 1: global uncertainty around war in Ukraine. We've got a world 1522 01:29:26,680 --> 01:29:30,280 Speaker 1: economy that's still struggling in the wake of covid Um, 1523 01:29:30,320 --> 01:29:33,920 Speaker 1: and Bitcoin is now so closely tied to these, to 1524 01:29:34,080 --> 01:29:37,320 Speaker 1: these bigger factors. It's no, it's kind of broken free 1525 01:29:37,439 --> 01:29:40,000 Speaker 1: of it's of the krypto niche in a way. It's 1526 01:29:40,000 --> 01:29:43,200 Speaker 1: a global asset now. Um, So we really I think, 1527 01:29:43,240 --> 01:29:46,040 Speaker 1: ticked over into a into a new era, into it 1528 01:29:46,120 --> 01:29:49,760 Speaker 1: into bitcoin's teens, and I think the next few years, 1529 01:29:49,760 --> 01:29:52,720 Speaker 1: as with any teenager, are going to be are going 1530 01:29:52,760 --> 01:29:56,200 Speaker 1: to be colorful, yeah, full of ups and downs. Bitcoin 1531 01:29:56,320 --> 01:29:59,320 Speaker 1: is here to stay and it is for now still 1532 01:29:59,520 --> 01:30:03,120 Speaker 1: the big daddy of all cryptos. People talk about Ethereum's 1533 01:30:03,240 --> 01:30:07,439 Speaker 1: market cap maybe overtaking bitcoins someday that I think is possible, 1534 01:30:07,960 --> 01:30:10,720 Speaker 1: But really, because there are two big projects in in 1535 01:30:10,840 --> 01:30:13,519 Speaker 1: the crypto space, which is growing itself all the time, 1536 01:30:14,200 --> 01:30:16,200 Speaker 1: the one the idea of which one has the bigger 1537 01:30:16,240 --> 01:30:19,800 Speaker 1: market cap, I think is no longer it's um. Yeah, 1538 01:30:19,880 --> 01:30:23,120 Speaker 1: that bitcoin and crypto are bigger than bigger than all 1539 01:30:23,160 --> 01:30:28,800 Speaker 1: that now. So Bitcoin has survived in difference scandals, disasters, 1540 01:30:28,840 --> 01:30:32,960 Speaker 1: It's survived attempts to ban it, It's survived divisions within 1541 01:30:32,960 --> 01:30:37,120 Speaker 1: its community, it survived hard forks and price crashes and pandemics. 1542 01:30:37,439 --> 01:30:42,840 Speaker 1: It survived Elon Musk and it's surviving global uncertainty at 1543 01:30:42,880 --> 01:30:47,360 Speaker 1: the moment. It's right all at just thirteen. Just imagine 1544 01:30:47,400 --> 01:30:49,439 Speaker 1: what it's going to be like the sweet sixty empoint 1545 01:30:49,520 --> 01:30:51,639 Speaker 1: is going to be growing. Oh yeah, so Bitcoin, Yeah, 1546 01:30:51,640 --> 01:30:53,760 Speaker 1: it can't be killed, it can't be stopped. It's only 1547 01:30:53,800 --> 01:30:57,040 Speaker 1: going to get stronger as the years go by. And yeah, 1548 01:30:57,120 --> 01:31:02,519 Speaker 1: bitcoin is now digital gold. Yeah, so that's bitcoin. As 1549 01:31:02,520 --> 01:31:04,800 Speaker 1: I said, for the time being, we will we will 1550 01:31:04,840 --> 01:31:06,400 Speaker 1: circle back to it at some point. As I say, 1551 01:31:06,439 --> 01:31:09,320 Speaker 1: there's still so much ahead of it. So now, folks, 1552 01:31:09,520 --> 01:31:12,000 Speaker 1: in future episodes, we're going to move away from bitcoin 1553 01:31:12,040 --> 01:31:15,320 Speaker 1: a bit and we're going to journey deeper into the 1554 01:31:15,360 --> 01:31:18,360 Speaker 1: wider world of crypto, because there is so much more 1555 01:31:18,840 --> 01:31:22,439 Speaker 1: to crypto than just bitcoin, despite what those Bitcoin maxi's 1556 01:31:22,479 --> 01:31:25,840 Speaker 1: might say. So in the next episode, we're going to 1557 01:31:26,160 --> 01:31:27,960 Speaker 1: we're going to be a bit more relaxed, and we're 1558 01:31:27,960 --> 01:31:30,559 Speaker 1: going to explain some of the jargon, some of the 1559 01:31:30,600 --> 01:31:34,360 Speaker 1: popular terms that you'll encounter as you journey deeper into 1560 01:31:34,400 --> 01:31:37,160 Speaker 1: the crypto verse, lift the lid on all that on 1561 01:31:37,200 --> 01:31:44,080 Speaker 1: all those complicated things that hoddling, hoddling, biddling, diamond hands, 1562 01:31:44,560 --> 01:31:46,840 Speaker 1: all these sort of laser eyes. Laser eyes. Yeah, what 1563 01:31:47,000 --> 01:31:49,240 Speaker 1: laser eyes mean. You'll find out here. I hope you 1564 01:31:49,240 --> 01:31:51,839 Speaker 1: can join it. For us folks, I hope this journey 1565 01:31:51,840 --> 01:31:55,040 Speaker 1: through bitcoin has been useful stick with us. Plenty more 1566 01:31:55,080 --> 01:31:57,519 Speaker 1: to come. Thank you so much for listening to the 1567 01:31:57,560 --> 01:32:00,920 Speaker 1: coin Bureau podcast. If you'd like to learn more about cryptocurrency, 1568 01:32:01,160 --> 01:32:04,240 Speaker 1: you can visit our YouTube channel at YouTube dot com 1569 01:32:04,280 --> 01:32:07,000 Speaker 1: forward slash coin Bureau. You can also go to coin 1570 01:32:07,040 --> 01:32:10,240 Speaker 1: bureau dot com for loads more information about all things crypto. 1571 01:32:10,640 --> 01:32:13,080 Speaker 1: You can follow me on Twitter at coin burea or 1572 01:32:13,120 --> 01:32:16,240 Speaker 1: one word, and I'm also active on TikTok and Instagram 1573 01:32:16,280 --> 01:32:19,479 Speaker 1: as well. First of all, it's not thank you for listening. 1574 01:32:19,720 --> 01:32:24,400 Speaker 1: You're welcome for great content. Yeah, Like this is free 1575 01:32:24,800 --> 01:32:28,000 Speaker 1: and they're learning about a fairly great topic in a 1576 01:32:28,040 --> 01:32:30,800 Speaker 1: non boring way. If you'd like to visit me and 1577 01:32:30,840 --> 01:32:33,760 Speaker 1: hear more about me, go to mooch about, m O 1578 01:32:33,760 --> 01:32:37,599 Speaker 1: O C H A, b O U T or else. 1579 01:32:47,160 --> 01:32:49,920 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from I Heart Radio, visit the I 1580 01:32:50,080 --> 01:32:54,280 Speaker 1: heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever we get your podcasts. 1581 01:33:02,040 --> 01:33:05,360 Speaker 1: The coin Gera podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.