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Speaker 1: From the heart of where innovation, money and power COLLI

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Speaker 1: in Silicon Valley and Beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with

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Speaker 1: Emily jay I. Remember Wi Chang in San Francisco, and

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Speaker 1: this is Bloomberg Technology coming up. Ryan Cohen sells out.

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Speaker 1: Shares of bed Bath and Beyond are plunging after the

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Speaker 1: memestock idol sold his stake. Will explain why he did it.

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Speaker 1: And some of Silicon Valley's richest exaction investors are campaigning

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Speaker 1: against multi family housing coming to their neighborhood, including Mark Andreason. Yes,

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Speaker 1: the investor who just gave controversial we Work founder Adam

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Speaker 1: Newman a huge check to re envision well rental housing

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Speaker 1: and last year was the most lavish on record for

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Speaker 1: executive chex by almost any measure. More than thirty public

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Speaker 1: company executives were paid a hundred million dollars according to

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Speaker 1: the Bloomberg Pay Index. We will dig in well, let's

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Speaker 1: get back to that bed Bath and Beyond stock, the

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Speaker 1: latest meme stock target sliding. Activist investor Ryan Cohen first

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Speaker 1: sparked this frenzy when his firm r C Ventures disclosed

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Speaker 1: a nine percent stake back in March and called for

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Speaker 1: a sale of the company shares have plunged now that

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Speaker 1: Cohen has officially taken a steak to zero. I want

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Speaker 1: to bring in Bloomberg's John Edwards for more on this. John,

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Speaker 1: what sort of intel do we have on why Ryan

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Speaker 1: Cohen sold out here? Well, we haven't heard from him

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Speaker 1: directly yet, but it looks like he's just lost patients

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Speaker 1: with this, uh, this struggling retailer. You know, he came

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Speaker 1: in uh you know back in the spring, uh in March,

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Speaker 1: thinking that he could really affect a turnaround here. Uh,

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Speaker 1: and it looks like he has lost patients with that

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Speaker 1: and bailed out. You know. He uh, he made a

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Speaker 1: lot of changes. You know, he brought in three independent directors.

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Speaker 1: Then in June, um, you know, as that patients started

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Speaker 1: wearing thin, Uh, he uh sort of backed the outster

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Speaker 1: of the CEO, Mark Tritton. Uh. And um, you know

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Speaker 1: they thought then, was that Cohen thought that, you know,

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Speaker 1: Bed Bath and Beyond should sell it's uh, either sell

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Speaker 1: it self entirely or sell it's bye bye baby unit,

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Speaker 1: which is doing better than the rest of the chain.

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Speaker 1: But it looks like he is just run out of patients,

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Speaker 1: and bed Bath and Beyond is run out of time

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Speaker 1: with him at least welcome through the timeline because obviously

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Speaker 1: earlier in the day there was this filing from our

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Speaker 1: c ventures they might sell then we learn, uh, they

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Speaker 1: have officially sold out. Is there any potential for regulatory scrutiny?

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Speaker 1: He uh, you know, some uh, some shareholders have made

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Speaker 1: some noise about you know, filing complaint. It's about the

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Speaker 1: way that that Cohen has handled this, you know. He

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Speaker 1: uh again came into the stock with a lot of fanfare,

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Speaker 1: and then uh, you know, there was that filing that

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Speaker 1: was made officially on on Tuesday, but disclosed yesterday that

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Speaker 1: they were thinking about getting out of their entire steak,

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Speaker 1: and then of course the new filing that they have

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Speaker 1: indeed taking their steak down to zero. So a lot

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Speaker 1: of these retail investors who piled into the stock are

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Speaker 1: certainly upset with Cohen at this point, and some might

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Speaker 1: be looking to take action, but it's unclear if if

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Speaker 1: he's actually done anything you know wrong, per sect. All right,

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Speaker 1: we will keep following that blue bus. John Edwards, thank

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Speaker 1: you for that update. Meantime, billionaires living in one of

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Speaker 1: the wealthiest hip codes in the world are pushing back

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Speaker 1: on plans for more housing. Top investors and executives from Apple, Facebook,

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Speaker 1: Google and more. I want to stop all Fornia from

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Speaker 1: allowing businesses and multi family housing in Atherton. One of

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Speaker 1: the most vocal is none other than Mark and Reason,

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg's Ellen here. He wrote about the pushback in Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: Business Week, So talk to us about what's going on here.

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Speaker 1: So there was just this interesting moment where public comment

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Speaker 1: in the town of Atherton was put online and people

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Speaker 1: discovered that, um, you know, even though Mark and Reason

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Speaker 1: has been very vocal publicly about the need for states

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Speaker 1: like California to build more in order to fix its

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Speaker 1: housing shortage, turns out when people propose um changes in

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Speaker 1: the town of Atherton that would allow for multi family housing,

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Speaker 1: the neighbors get very upset. And Atherton is the richest

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Speaker 1: place in America, and that's why the people who are

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Speaker 1: upset tend to be some of the biggest names in

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Speaker 1: tex So. As you mentioned exacts and vcs. So let's

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Speaker 1: we actually have the letter from Mark and Reason. He

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Speaker 1: says he's writing to communicate his immense objection to the

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Speaker 1: creation of multifamily housing in Atherton. Please immediately remove all

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Speaker 1: multi family housing. This is in all caps overlay zoning projects. Um,

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Speaker 1: they will massively decrease our home values and immensely increase

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Speaker 1: the noise, pollution and traffic. And you referenced a blog

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Speaker 1: post that he wrote a couple of years ago that

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Speaker 1: it's time to build, uh, indicating you know it was

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Speaker 1: it was you know, pretty big picture, not a lot

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Speaker 1: of details about what he was saying, it was time

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Speaker 1: to build and how um. But this, of course on

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Speaker 1: the back of a very big check he wrote to

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Speaker 1: the controversial founder of We Work, Adam Newman, to re

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Speaker 1: envision housing. There's some irony. I think it's just the

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Speaker 1: classic Nimby mentality, which stands for, as you probably know,

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Speaker 1: not in my backyard. Of course we want housing, but

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Speaker 1: as soon as it's proposed an Atherton, which many people

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Speaker 1: you know, Atherton is just a strange town. It's extremely wealthy.

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Speaker 1: All the big names lived there, and they like it

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Speaker 1: because it's private, it because it's really not dense, and um,

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Speaker 1: you know, they're surrounded by other very rich neighbors and

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Speaker 1: so there's a strong um, well, of course we like housing,

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Speaker 1: but not you know, not where I live. Um. And

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Speaker 1: I think that's just a very common attitude, and it's

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Speaker 1: funny to see it show up here. And it's not

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Speaker 1: just Mark Andreason you know, a number of different folks

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Speaker 1: posting here. You you singled head to quote from Anthony Nodo,

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Speaker 1: the CEO so FI, talking about how his family has

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Speaker 1: had to get private security because crime is on the rise.

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Speaker 1: Can we substantiate that? No? I mean, I think it's

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Speaker 1: just it's bringing up all these fears that people have

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Speaker 1: about increased housing, which honestly, in my opinion or you

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Speaker 1: tend to be fear around change like they like the

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Speaker 1: town the way it is. You know, one of the

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Speaker 1: quotes in the story is you know Atherton as we

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Speaker 1: know it will come to an end, and only you

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Speaker 1: are to blame for that speaking to the town council's

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Speaker 1: given that you reported so heavily on we Work and

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Speaker 1: Adam Newman, what's your take on this? Andreason check. I

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Speaker 1: think that they want to send a really strong, a

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Speaker 1: little trollish signal saying like, hey, we're not afraid to

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Speaker 1: back founders who have had um you know a lot

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Speaker 1: of bad press around some of their back their past examples,

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Speaker 1: and that we really believe in kind of the iconoclastic,

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Speaker 1: brash person at the head of a company. Um, whether

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Speaker 1: that's going to end up being a smart check or not,

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Speaker 1: I guess we'll see. You know, if you look at

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Speaker 1: we work, the people who really got screwed as investors

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Speaker 1: are the ones who came in later, not the ones

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Speaker 1: who wrote some the earliest checks. So Andrews and may

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Speaker 1: have actually made a pretty smart move here back in

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Speaker 1: Newman early, but it all remains to be seen. We

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Speaker 1: shall see, maybe fought or for another very long podcast someday. Okay,

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Speaker 1: Ellen Hwitt, thank you. The U s housing market is

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Speaker 1: quickly changing. Homes are more unaffordable than they've been in

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Speaker 1: forty years, and home sales have fallen for six month straight.

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Speaker 1: The home buyer Affordability Index is at its lowest point since,

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Speaker 1: which means, in theory, more than half of families can

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Speaker 1: get on the property ladder. Still, the online housing business

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Speaker 1: is growing, and better dot Com wants a leg up

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Speaker 1: on that ladder, partnering with Palenteer to create a new

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Speaker 1: mortgage platform that will into leverage data to help borrowers

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Speaker 1: qualify for better loans. Here to discuss better CEO Vishall

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Speaker 1: Guard Vishall, thank you so much for joining us. So

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Speaker 1: how will this marketplace work exactly? Well, thank you so much, Emily.

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Speaker 1: We have thirty two major institutional investors that are on

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Speaker 1: our platform today that actively buy loans, and what this

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Speaker 1: will prolibrate them to do is to use far more

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Speaker 1: granular data to UH make loans to UH c r

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Speaker 1: A eligible loans, UH Low moderate income eligible loans, loans

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Speaker 1: for homes with solar things that have traditionally been very

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Speaker 1: difficult for mortgage investors to provide discounts on or to

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Speaker 1: make more affordable. Yeah, we're heading into what could be

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Speaker 1: a very prolonged economic downturn. We're already in it. You know,

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Speaker 1: this is never a good time for the housing market.

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Speaker 1: Why do you think now is the right time to

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Speaker 1: launch this? I think affordability matters more than ever before.

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Speaker 1: And we've got three trillion dollars of capital that's been

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Speaker 1: raised for e s G funds and most of it

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Speaker 1: never makes its way into the mortgage market. So by

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Speaker 1: creating Bloomberg for Loans effectively working with Palenteer, what we're

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Speaker 1: going to be able to do is help families that

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Speaker 1: are in sectors that are favored by E s G

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Speaker 1: investors actively connect with those investors and effectively be able

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Speaker 1: to lower their cost of home ownership. Now, what are

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Speaker 1: the challenges that you think you're going to face in

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Speaker 1: trying to build out a home mortgage business at a

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Speaker 1: time when the housing market is slumping, if not crashing.

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Speaker 1: I think the demand for houses is down, but there's

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Speaker 1: still millions of homes being bought and sold every year

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Speaker 1: in the United States today, and better dot Com has

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Speaker 1: grown fairly rapidly. We've grown from nothing to doing almost

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Speaker 1: a hundred billion of mortgages UH this year and um

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Speaker 1: so while the market is down, we are still less

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Speaker 1: than one percent market share, and we hope that we

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Speaker 1: can continue to grow and by making housing more equitable,

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Speaker 1: we can actually grow addressing one of the issues that

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Speaker 1: most homeowners face today. You've got a huge capital infusion

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Speaker 1: from soft Bank. Is this you putting that capital to work?

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Speaker 1: And how else should we see you putting the money

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Speaker 1: to work? Yeah, we we did get a huge capital

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Speaker 1: infusion from soft Bank, and making homeownership more equitable while

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Speaker 1: driving our business is the most wonderful type of innovation

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Speaker 1: that we can hope for. And so this is at

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Speaker 1: the cutting edge. By partnering with Palentteer what we were

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Speaker 1: going to do in five to ten years. We've been

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Speaker 1: able to leverage our soft bank capital to actually make

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Speaker 1: live this year. Now I have to ask you about this.

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Speaker 1: The macro picture, of course, has been challenging for a

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Speaker 1: lot of companies. In the last year, you've had layoffs,

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Speaker 1: laid off nine of the company, nine people you laid

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Speaker 1: off via Zoom than an additional three thousand. I know

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Speaker 1: you've got a lot of heat for that. When you

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Speaker 1: look back on that, what would you have done differently?

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Speaker 1: What do you think went wrong? I think we did

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Speaker 1: a lot of things that were very wrong. Um, I

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Speaker 1: should have handled the layoffs with more care and more empathy.

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Speaker 1: We were very lucky that because of the fact that

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Speaker 1: we're a digital mortgage company and a digital home ownership platform,

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Speaker 1: we were actually able to see the downturn in the

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Speaker 1: market that is evidence today and that you see many

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Speaker 1: many other mortgage originators laying off thousands of people. We

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Speaker 1: were able to see that as early as late last year,

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Speaker 1: and so we've been able to get ahead of it.

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Speaker 1: We've been able to downsize to a burn. We've taken

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Speaker 1: over a billion dollars in expense line items out of

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Speaker 1: the company's cost structure, and we're using that savings to

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Speaker 1: now innovate and continue to serve customers. So what are

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Speaker 1: you doing differently now to manage costs, to manage hiring,

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Speaker 1: to make sure you've learned from those lessons and something

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Speaker 1: like that doesn't happen again. I think managing the up

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Speaker 1: and down cycle of the cyclicality of the mortgage industry

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Speaker 1: is something that's new to us, where again only a

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Speaker 1: six year old company, and there are companies in the

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Speaker 1: mortgage space that have been able to manage that far

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Speaker 1: superior to us. So what we're keeping our pulse on

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Speaker 1: is uh customer demand, customer demands specifically for new products,

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Speaker 1: and legging into growing those new ducts, not at the

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Speaker 1: rate that we did in two thousand twenty, where we

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Speaker 1: grew almost but slowly, legging into customer demand, rather than

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Speaker 1: what in startup whend you get taught to do with

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Speaker 1: just a blitzcale. You're also being sued by one of

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Speaker 1: your former executives, Sarah Pierce, alleging you misled investors in

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Speaker 1: the process of trying to go public Vias back. She's

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Speaker 1: also alleging retaliation. The SEC is now looking into this

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Speaker 1: what's your response to all of this. I think it's

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Speaker 1: very hard for me to comment on matters that are

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Speaker 1: an active litigation or subject of an SEC inquiry. All

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Speaker 1: I can say is every day we wake up and

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Speaker 1: we find gratification in helping make homeownership cheaper, faster and

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Speaker 1: better for more and more American families. And the more

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Speaker 1: we can keep on doing that, the better the world

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Speaker 1: will be. You're also trying to take the company public.

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Speaker 1: I've leaves still Vias back and I know there's a

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Speaker 1: deadline coming up for that. Is that still the plan?

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Speaker 1: And um, you know, especially given that this back market

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Speaker 1: has fizzled, how are you thinking about whether now is

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Speaker 1: really the right time. We're evaluating all of our opportunities,

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Speaker 1: and again I can't comment publicly on it. All I

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Speaker 1: can say is that we remain committed to achieving greater

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Speaker 1: capitalization so that we can have the funding to serve

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Speaker 1: our customers, and we're open to all the different options

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Speaker 1: out there uh than enable us to continue to be

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Speaker 1: really well capitalized. So I'm curious for your thoughts on this.

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Speaker 1: We've been talking a lot about the funding that Adam Newman,

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Speaker 1: the founder of we Work, just received the biggest check

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Speaker 1: ever from Andres and Horowitz to you know, potentially revolutionize

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Speaker 1: residential real estate, or at least that's what Mark and

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Speaker 1: Reason seems to be hoping for according to his blog post,

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Speaker 1: What do you make of that funding? I am so

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Speaker 1: happy that the venture capital community and entrepreneurs are still

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Speaker 1: interested in revolutionizing the residential real estate market. Here we

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Speaker 1: have a forty trillion dollar industry where consumers still pay

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Speaker 1: six percent to buy or sell a home, where consumers

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Speaker 1: spend over ten percent of the value of their home

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Speaker 1: just transacting, where it takes sixty days to transact, and

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Speaker 1: so there are so many aspects of the residential real

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Speaker 1: estate market that need to be optimized and made work

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Speaker 1: for consumers rather than brokers or transactional intermediaries. And uh,

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Speaker 1: we really welcome the fact that there's going to be

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Speaker 1: more innovation and more capital and more innovation in the space,

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Speaker 1: even if it's going to Adam Newman, who at the

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Speaker 1: very least is a very controversial founder. Adam Newman is

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Speaker 1: a controversial founder, but he did revolutionize the idea of

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Speaker 1: office space. Many of our offices are in we Work space.

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Speaker 1: And so while I can't speak to any and all

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Speaker 1: of the opinions that are out there in the market

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Speaker 1: about him. We are delighted users of the product that

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Speaker 1: he helped create, and so if he can do the

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Speaker 1: same for residential real estate, good luck. All right, Ballgard,

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Speaker 1: CEO of Better, We'll be watching your marketplace and following

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Speaker 1: this new partnership with Palenteer. Thank you for joining us.

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Speaker 1: Much more coming up right after this break, This is Bloomberg.

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Speaker 1: Qualcom is taking another run at the market for server

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Speaker 1: chips in an effort to decrease its reliance on smartphones.

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Speaker 1: The company taking customers for a product standing from last

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Speaker 1: year's purchase of the chip startup Nuvia This according to

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg sources. They also say Amazon's a WS is one

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Speaker 1: of the biggest server chip buyers and has agreed to

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Speaker 1: take a look at what Qualcom has to offer. China

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Speaker 1: is lashing out at a fifty two billion dollar program

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Speaker 1: to expand American manufacturing of semiconductors and industry associations, as

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Speaker 1: it contains elements that violate fair market principles and targets

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Speaker 1: China's own efforts to build a chipmaking industry. The legislation

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Speaker 1: prohibits companies that receive funding from expanding production of advanced

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Speaker 1: chips in China, and it's the biggest annual television deal

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Speaker 1: ever for a college sports conference. The Big Ten has

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Speaker 1: reached an agreement on a seven year contract with Fox, CBS,

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Speaker 1: and NBC. According to The Wall Street Journal, this is

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Speaker 1: worth about seven and a half billion dollars. The price

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Speaker 1: of college football broadcast rights has soared, and no one's

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Speaker 1: cashed in more than the Big Ten and the Southeastern Conference,

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Speaker 1: both of which are expanding to sixteen teams. Welcome back

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Speaker 1: to Bloomberg Technology. I'm Emily Chang in San Francisco. Incredible Health,

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Speaker 1: a career marketplace for permanent healthcare workers, announced eighty million

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Speaker 1: dollars in series be funding the company's valuation now one

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Speaker 1: point six five billion Unicorn status. This at a time

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Speaker 1: when the nursing shortage is still a huge problem in

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Speaker 1: the United States, a recent report from McKenzie estimating the

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Speaker 1: US will be short at least two thousand registered nurses.

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Speaker 1: Let's bring in Dr emmon abo zid Now for more

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Speaker 1: on this year's the CEO and co founder of Incredible Health.

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Speaker 1: Doctor obviously great to have you back here on the show.

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Speaker 1: You talked about the nursing short shortage right here earlier

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Speaker 1: in the pandemic, what's that shortage like now? So the

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Speaker 1: big difference has happened in the last twelve months is

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Speaker 1: that this is a this is a workforce that is overworked,

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Speaker 1: burnt out, and experiencing excessive streuss. Our most recent third

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Speaker 1: annual report on nurses in the US showed that one

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Speaker 1: third nurses are considering leaving the profession permanently by the

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Speaker 1: end of the year. So how has the pandemic changed,

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Speaker 1: you know, potentially this industry for the longer term. I mean,

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Speaker 1: are we expecting the impact of the pandemic to impact

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Speaker 1: the availability of nurses for years to come? Absolutely? I

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Speaker 1: mean even before the pandemic, our demand for healthcare as

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Speaker 1: a country kept was increasing because our population is aging.

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Speaker 1: But pandemics are certainly demand shocks on the system that

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Speaker 1: put more constraints on the more strain on the health

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Speaker 1: care system, and and the need for even more healthcare

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Speaker 1: workers to to fill that demand. The CDC just announced

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Speaker 1: a huge overhaul of the agency, acknowledging mistakes they made

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Speaker 1: during the pandemic, acknowledging a need to be more nimble

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Speaker 1: and respond more quickly. What do you think went wrong there.

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Speaker 1: I mean, there was certainly some challenges with how the

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Speaker 1: CDC collaborated and and the way the community they communicated

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Speaker 1: with the public, which you know, they have some responsibility

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Speaker 1: in terms of of how intense and challenging COVID became

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Speaker 1: in the US, and that you know, in effect had

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Speaker 1: affected the healthcare workforce as well. They were massively overworked.

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Speaker 1: Uh and uh and hopefully with these changes when there,

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Speaker 1: when and if there is a future pandemic, uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: it won't affect or decimate the work the healthcare workforce

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Speaker 1: as much as this last pandemic. To what are the

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Speaker 1: implications for the doctor in hospital marketplace? What are you

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Speaker 1: seeing on your platform? Um? You know what what we're

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Speaker 1: seeing is, you know, you know, we now work with

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Speaker 1: over six hundred hospitals and health systems across twenty five states,

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Speaker 1: including very large ones like Kaiser, Permanente and hc A

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Speaker 1: Healthcare and academic medical centers as well like Johns Hopkins

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Speaker 1: and Cedar Sinai and others. And uh, you know, every

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Speaker 1: single one of these hospital executives that we're working with

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Speaker 1: is dealing with this problem. Uh. They are, uh, they

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Speaker 1: are tackling you know, shortages and and understaffing on on

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Speaker 1: all their nursing units. There's even thirty of the employers

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Speaker 1: on our platform are now using US for new graduate nurses,

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Speaker 1: which was not the case before the pandemic. So this,

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Speaker 1: this challenge is continuing to increase and labor expenses and

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Speaker 1: labor costs is negatively impacting hospital financials as well. How

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Speaker 1: do you hope Incredible Health will help bridge some of

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Speaker 1: these gaps? So you know, our our focus is on

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Speaker 1: ensuring that nurses are able to get the best permanent roles,

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Speaker 1: but we also invest heavily in features and tools for

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Speaker 1: nurses that are completely free. We offer free continuing education

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Speaker 1: for nurses, free salary estimators. We even have an advice

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Speaker 1: platform for nurses built into our apps, and we want

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Speaker 1: to continue investing in that, including skill growth, educational scholarships,

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Speaker 1: relocation support in order to make sure that the Incredible

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Speaker 1: Health is a place where nurses can manage their careers

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Speaker 1: instead of only the place where they find their permanent job. Meantime,

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Speaker 1: the US is dealing with another some would call it

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Speaker 1: a crisis, the ROVERSUS Way decision from the Supreme Court. Um,

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Speaker 1: is this at all impacting your platform? And the workers

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Speaker 1: on your platform, especially those working in states where abortion

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Speaker 1: is restricted. So it's not affecting the incredible health platform,

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Speaker 1: but that it does affect the nursing workforce in a

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Speaker 1: couple of different ways. First, there's going to be an

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Speaker 1: increase in volume of patients because when you restrict you

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Speaker 1: know that that care, you know you're gonna have more

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Speaker 1: topic and more more life threatening pregnancies. Um. So that

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Speaker 1: that increases the workload on the healthcare workers. Secondly, you know,

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Speaker 1: they have to consider the legal ramifications when they are

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Speaker 1: supporting and counseling patients, and so they have to be

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Speaker 1: very aware of their code of ethics as well as

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Speaker 1: the legal regulations that they have to follow in their

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Speaker 1: state and in their hospital. Uh. And then finally, you

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Speaker 1: know it will continue. You know, the vaccine band mandates

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Speaker 1: were extremely um uh controversial, and so is Rob Wade,

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Speaker 1: even among healthcare workers. So that you'll have healthcare workers

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Speaker 1: that are going to be on both sides of this

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Speaker 1: of this discussion, which creates more you know, angst than

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Speaker 1: and the debate and discussion and intensity in the workplace.

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Speaker 1: So how are you expecting this to play out over

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Speaker 1: the next several years? Where you know, this could potentially

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Speaker 1: happen in more states, you know, talking about a bottleneck

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Speaker 1: potentially already. You know where are we three years from now?

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Speaker 1: I mean we are. Every report we read, every projection

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Speaker 1: shows that the shortage of workers is projected to continue

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Speaker 1: unless we can do more to support this workforce and

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Speaker 1: grow this workforce. The one positive that came out of

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Speaker 1: the pandemic, and and you know the ce CE changes

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Speaker 1: even will be great, Wade. Is it put more emphasis

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Speaker 1: on the importance of the healthcare workforce and how we

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Speaker 1: need it to deliver care? All right? M on opposide,

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Speaker 1: incredible health CEO and co founder. Good to have you

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Speaker 1: back here on the show, Um, and appreciate all your

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Speaker 1: insights there. Meantime, tech stocks are staging a comeback, generally

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Speaker 1: after a brutal start to the year. The NASTAC one

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Speaker 1: hundred was down a month go. Now it sounds se

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Speaker 1: year to date. Joining me now, Miriam rivera co founder

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Speaker 1: and CEO and managing director of OH Ventures, a seed

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Speaker 1: stage firm with two million dollars in assets under management. Um,

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Speaker 1: how cautious Miriam, would you say you are right now

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Speaker 1: in this investing environment? Well, I've been in Silicon Valley

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Speaker 1: since so, I've gone through many cycles here, and one

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Speaker 1: of the things that tends to happen is that there's

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Speaker 1: a bit of overreaction oftentimes when we have uh these

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Speaker 1: big dips in the public stock markets as well as

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Speaker 1: UM financings that have kind of become so large and

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Speaker 1: have promoted growth at all costs, including profitability, and eventually

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Speaker 1: the pendulum swings in the other direction, but it tends

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Speaker 1: to swing too far. And that's what we're seeing now

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Speaker 1: as I understand it. Your firm actually made a record

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Speaker 1: number of investments in the last quarter twenty investment I

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Speaker 1: believe why is that, Well, we look at risk adjusted return,

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Speaker 1: and while we have seen the risk go up the

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Speaker 1: and we account for that in terms of how we

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Speaker 1: make investment decisions and in our financial models that we

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Speaker 1: use to um power our process. What we see is

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Speaker 1: that a lot of folks don't um They overreact to

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Speaker 1: the news, They don't know where to actually um look

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Speaker 1: at increasing the risk in their models, and oftentimes that

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Speaker 1: generates uh re fear, just fear and makes people hold

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Speaker 1: back capital at a time when actually it's a good

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Speaker 1: time to be investing. Because many people are sitting on

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Speaker 1: the sidelines and not sure how to price, and our

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Speaker 1: financial process really allows us to price at the seed

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Speaker 1: stage very well and to encompass that additional risk in

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Speaker 1: still trying to achieve the same technets probability weighted multiple

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Speaker 1: that we look for in each investment. Well, let's talk

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Speaker 1: about that pricing because it seems investors would be at

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Speaker 1: an advantage right now. You know, we're hearing about flat rounds,

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Speaker 1: down rounds. You know obviously that we're seeing layoffs, there's

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Speaker 1: talk of more laps. What's actually happening behind the scenes, um,

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Speaker 1: you know, as these investments are continuing to be made.

431
00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:17,680
Speaker 1: Those are many of the things that are actually happening

432
00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 1: You've described very well. But a lot of that is

433
00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:24,280
Speaker 1: really happening at the later stages and venture where the

434
00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:27,840
Speaker 1: pricing impact of what happens in the public capital markets

435
00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:31,440
Speaker 1: have a larger impact. What tends to happen UM in

436
00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:35,399
Speaker 1: the earlier stages, such as seed, is that you don't

437
00:26:35,440 --> 00:26:39,280
Speaker 1: see such large fluctuations and valuations UM as you have

438
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:43,120
Speaker 1: seen recently. Kind of towards the end of these cycles,

439
00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:47,080
Speaker 1: where people are doing growth at all costs, you tend

440
00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:50,640
Speaker 1: to have higher pricing at the seed stage, but not

441
00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:54,119
Speaker 1: as much as at later stages, and so we do

442
00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:57,640
Speaker 1: see people doing more flat rounds um. We haven't seen

443
00:26:57,680 --> 00:27:01,040
Speaker 1: a lot of down rounds um yet in our portfolio,

444
00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:04,040
Speaker 1: but I do think that that is not an uncommon

445
00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:08,200
Speaker 1: thing to happen. And these kind of holding the price

446
00:27:08,280 --> 00:27:12,280
Speaker 1: constant right now often does help entrepreneurs to get additional

447
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:15,520
Speaker 1: capital so they can weather these cycles. And these cycles

448
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:17,720
Speaker 1: tend to be, you know, less than a couple of

449
00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:20,040
Speaker 1: years for the most part, so as long as they're

450
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:23,439
Speaker 1: well situated, it's not your price today, it's kind of

451
00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:25,760
Speaker 1: where you think you can be two years from now

452
00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:30,120
Speaker 1: in terms of the metrics and outcomes that your investors

453
00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:31,880
Speaker 1: are going to be looking for at that stage. That's

454
00:27:31,880 --> 00:27:38,480
Speaker 1: really important. Now. Very successful companies were founded during downturns.

455
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:45,080
Speaker 1: The most recent downturn Airbnb, Slack, Instagram, Square, you go

456
00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:49,439
Speaker 1: back to the eighties, Microsoft was founded during a downturn.

457
00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:52,920
Speaker 1: How optimistic are you that you know one of these

458
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:57,800
Speaker 1: world changing companies is being founded right now. Well, I'd

459
00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:00,560
Speaker 1: say that there are more of these world changing companies

460
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 1: being founded today than ever before, and across more technology

461
00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:08,320
Speaker 1: sectors than ever before. So I'm very optimistic. I am

462
00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:13,080
Speaker 1: a very long term investor and believe that technology stocks

463
00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:19,000
Speaker 1: are a place where both individual investors and institutional investors

464
00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:24,760
Speaker 1: should be because the wave of technology that is occurring now.

465
00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:28,480
Speaker 1: In terms of the market sizes that are possible on

466
00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:31,639
Speaker 1: the Internet, there are five billion users on the Internet.

467
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:35,800
Speaker 1: When I first started UM in as counsel on an

468
00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:38,080
Speaker 1: I p O for an Internet company, there were thirty

469
00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:41,680
Speaker 1: nine million users. So these markets are vast. They've never

470
00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:46,080
Speaker 1: been possible to access in this way before, and they're

471
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:48,720
Speaker 1: going to continue to be a dominant force in the

472
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:53,920
Speaker 1: economy moving forward. So curious, Miriam, what your thoughts are

473
00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:57,040
Speaker 1: on Andrews and Harrows recently writing its biggest check ever

474
00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:03,040
Speaker 1: to Adam Newman, obviously troversial founder of We Work. You know,

475
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:05,840
Speaker 1: there's been a lot of criticism of this. We also

476
00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:10,360
Speaker 1: spoke to a founder earlier in the show who praised UM.

477
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:14,400
Speaker 1: The decision by UM Andrews and Horowitz, what's your take.

478
00:29:15,840 --> 00:29:19,120
Speaker 1: I'm always of two minds. One is I believe that

479
00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:23,520
Speaker 1: people make mistakes, and I don't believe in canceling people.

480
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:30,400
Speaker 1: I also believe that we have really benefited UM as

481
00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:34,080
Speaker 1: a technology sector from some of the work of we work. Before,

482
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:38,040
Speaker 1: companies used to have fixed costs in terms of real

483
00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:41,080
Speaker 1: estate space, and now more and more companies have a

484
00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:44,800
Speaker 1: much more variable approach to what was really once a

485
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:48,120
Speaker 1: very large part of their cost curve, so that these

486
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 1: kinds of innovations, UM, they do come with good and bad.

487
00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:54,480
Speaker 1: I remember in your book you talked about um kind

488
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:58,680
Speaker 1: of the pro topia and the culture of venture, and

489
00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:02,080
Speaker 1: also entrepreneurship and Lolcan Valley, and I definitely have a

490
00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:04,960
Speaker 1: lot of issues with that as well, but I also

491
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:10,160
Speaker 1: recognize when innovation has really changed how work gets done

492
00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:14,320
Speaker 1: and where it gets done. Mary mrivera Ventures co founder

493
00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:18,360
Speaker 1: and CEO, appreciate you stopping by. Okay, Next up, the

494
00:30:18,440 --> 00:30:21,880
Speaker 1: Ethere merch finally coming. We've got all the details. Next,

495
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:38,360
Speaker 1: this is Bloombird time now for our crypto report, and

496
00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:41,360
Speaker 1: let's talk about the merge. The core developers working on

497
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:43,920
Speaker 1: the software upgrade of the Ethere and blockchain have now

498
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:48,480
Speaker 1: firmed up September as the likely official date. I want

499
00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:51,959
Speaker 1: to bring in Bloomberg's Olga career for more on this. So, Olga,

500
00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:56,000
Speaker 1: is this the last likely date? How likely is it

501
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:59,320
Speaker 1: it's actually gonna happen? On this date. I know there

502
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:02,480
Speaker 1: has been a bunch of dates thrown around in the

503
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:07,000
Speaker 1: past week or so. Last week we knew it would

504
00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 1: happen probably in September, but now we know it's going

505
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:13,080
Speaker 1: to be probably September fifteenth. But this date could still

506
00:31:13,160 --> 00:31:18,120
Speaker 1: change because Ethereum developers are basically looking to see how

507
00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:22,960
Speaker 1: many computers are supporting the network. If the number of

508
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:26,800
Speaker 1: these computers declines rapidly, they might pull forward the date.

509
00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 1: So could still change. And what will change once the

510
00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:38,960
Speaker 1: merge happens. So basically what will change is the power

511
00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:44,680
Speaker 1: consumption of the Ethereum network. It will decline by more

512
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 1: than so. Today transactions from the network are ordered by

513
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 1: computers cold miners that take up a lot of energy,

514
00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:58,560
Speaker 1: and after this upgrade, it's going to be done differently,

515
00:31:58,560 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 1: in a much more energy efficient way. What are the

516
00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:07,120
Speaker 1: implications for other block chains. I think some of the

517
00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:10,800
Speaker 1: older block chains that still use minors, still use this

518
00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:17,320
Speaker 1: power hungry computers, might feel more pressure to switch to

519
00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:21,320
Speaker 1: something more environmentally friendly as well. But the fact is

520
00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:24,400
Speaker 1: a lot of the newer block chains already use a

521
00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:27,680
Speaker 1: sort of similar technologies to what Ethereum is moving to.

522
00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 1: So um I think we'll see more investments into this

523
00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:36,720
Speaker 1: type of block chains. All right, well, uh, lots to

524
00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:39,600
Speaker 1: continue to watch air. We will hone in on September.

525
00:32:40,920 --> 00:32:55,080
Speaker 1: Bloomberg's ago Curry thank you nine figure paychecks, once a rarity,

526
00:32:55,320 --> 00:32:58,960
Speaker 1: are now proliferating, despite critics on Capitol Hill and beyond

527
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:02,280
Speaker 1: as the US was still grappling with the pandemic and

528
00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:05,720
Speaker 1: new variants. One was in fact the most lavish year

529
00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:09,800
Speaker 1: on record for executive compensation by almost any measure, which

530
00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:11,920
Speaker 1: paid deals of more than a hundred million dollars in

531
00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:15,240
Speaker 1: value according to the Bloomberg Pay Index, and the pack

532
00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:18,120
Speaker 1: is being led once again by Elon Musk. I want

533
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:20,880
Speaker 1: to bring in Bloomberg's Honors Melon for more on this.

534
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:24,120
Speaker 1: So Honors tell us who is getting these paychecks? Ellen

535
00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 1: and who else? It's Ellen, It's Tim Cook, It's the

536
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:31,760
Speaker 1: CEO Subibvian and Lucid. You have a couple of finance

537
00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:37,560
Speaker 1: guys in there, Sprinkling, Brian Armstrong, a coin Base and um.

538
00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:41,000
Speaker 1: The list looks quite similar as it has in past years.

539
00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:43,520
Speaker 1: It's it's a lot of men and most of them

540
00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:46,640
Speaker 1: tend to be white. There are a few women. This year.

541
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:50,000
Speaker 1: There was one woman up there from Coti the Beauty.

542
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:52,600
Speaker 1: You know, I remember the days when Steve Jobs paid

543
00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:56,040
Speaker 1: himself a dollar or something, but obviously I had a

544
00:33:56,120 --> 00:34:02,440
Speaker 1: ton of equity in Apple. How on accedented is this? Well,

545
00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:06,160
Speaker 1: it's interesting. I thought when I started covering executive pay

546
00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:08,359
Speaker 1: a few years ago that you would almost we would

547
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:10,319
Speaker 1: start to see more of a shift to the one

548
00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:13,520
Speaker 1: dollar CEO, because you have a lot of CEOs out

549
00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:17,279
Speaker 1: there that are quite wealthy, especially with the ballmarket that

550
00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:20,600
Speaker 1: ran for so long. But instead it's almost been a

551
00:34:20,600 --> 00:34:22,800
Speaker 1: shift in the opposite direction. And a lot of that

552
00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:27,880
Speaker 1: really harks back to Elon Musk, who got the biggest

553
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:30,920
Speaker 1: pay package that has ever been granted to a company executive,

554
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:34,800
Speaker 1: in which he would earn tens of billions of dollars

555
00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:38,280
Speaker 1: over the course of about a decade through a generous

556
00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:41,879
Speaker 1: grant of stock options with very audacious goals attached to them.

557
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:47,600
Speaker 1: What many companies did was to say, this looks really interesting,

558
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:51,480
Speaker 1: and they went out and they constructed similar pay packages

559
00:34:51,560 --> 00:34:55,280
Speaker 1: for their CEOs. And that's what we're now seeing popping

560
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:57,799
Speaker 1: up here. And they're across corporate America, not just in tech,

561
00:34:58,040 --> 00:35:01,759
Speaker 1: but also another another places too, and that's what's really

562
00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:04,520
Speaker 1: driving this trend. It's interesting to see some of the

563
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:07,120
Speaker 1: names on this list. R J Scourge for example, the

564
00:35:07,160 --> 00:35:09,439
Speaker 1: seeo of Rivian. I mean Rivian just got a car

565
00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:14,960
Speaker 1: on the road. Just how are companies justifying these numbers?

566
00:35:15,880 --> 00:35:18,719
Speaker 1: So I should caveat these figures with saying that this

567
00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:21,200
Speaker 1: is the figures that we published today, is what these

568
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:25,520
Speaker 1: pay packages were worth at the end of fiscale, when

569
00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:28,600
Speaker 1: as we know, equity markets look quite differently than they

570
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:34,200
Speaker 1: do today. However, um we know that historically things have

571
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:37,120
Speaker 1: have tend to pan out pretty well for company executives

572
00:35:37,440 --> 00:35:41,920
Speaker 1: or companies say with these packages, is that this is

573
00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 1: what we need to motivate our top guy or gal.

574
00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:49,360
Speaker 1: But it's most often a guy, and this is reflective

575
00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:52,920
Speaker 1: of his or her skills and what other CEOs out

576
00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:55,719
Speaker 1: there get paid. So a lot of it has to

577
00:35:55,840 --> 00:35:58,200
Speaker 1: do really with what does the rest of the landscape

578
00:35:58,200 --> 00:35:59,920
Speaker 1: look like. And that's why you get these sort of

579
00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:03,279
Speaker 1: butterfly effects from Ellen gets a grant, then somebody else

580
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:04,680
Speaker 1: gets a grant, and then all of a sudden you

581
00:36:04,719 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 1: have the domino effect. Whereas if you saw more a

582
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:12,680
Speaker 1: dollar CEOs, especially high profile CEOs, just taken back and

583
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:14,719
Speaker 1: not nothing more than I think you would see that

584
00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:19,799
Speaker 1: proliferate to to a different extent too. You just wrote

585
00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:22,759
Speaker 1: a piece that crossed about Ryan Cohen that he made

586
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:26,080
Speaker 1: sixty eight million dollars on the sale of his bed,

587
00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:29,400
Speaker 1: bath and beyond stake this week. Some people are not

588
00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:31,480
Speaker 1: happy about it. We were talking about the potential for

589
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:35,080
Speaker 1: regulatory issues earlier. Um, you know, what do we know

590
00:36:35,320 --> 00:36:40,560
Speaker 1: about kind of the timeline, um and why he did this.

591
00:36:41,680 --> 00:36:43,560
Speaker 1: We don't know so much about why he did it.

592
00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:46,120
Speaker 1: We know that he started acquiring the stake back in January,

593
00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:48,080
Speaker 1: he held it for about seven months, and then he

594
00:36:48,440 --> 00:36:51,600
Speaker 1: he offloaded it this week, and it came on the

595
00:36:51,719 --> 00:36:54,280
Speaker 1: heels of a bit of a rally in the stock

596
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:57,319
Speaker 1: after it was disclosed earlier this week that he had

597
00:36:57,400 --> 00:37:00,640
Speaker 1: in fact held onto the mistake for for that long

598
00:37:00,719 --> 00:37:03,799
Speaker 1: and that let's some talking twitter. Um, We're not really

599
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:05,719
Speaker 1: sure about the motives, but we do know that an

600
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:09,600
Speaker 1: quite a nice profit. All right, Well, I'm sure someone's

601
00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:13,400
Speaker 1: looking into that. Bloomberg Saunder's Melon, thank you as always

602
00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:15,919
Speaker 1: for joining us. And that does it for this edition.

603
00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:19,920
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Technology coming up tomorrow, we're gonna hear from Eric Fistria,

604
00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:24,680
Speaker 1: Benchmark Capital, why he thinks Apple is skirting regulators busy

605
00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:27,799
Speaker 1: with Amazon and Facebook. This is Bloomberg