1 00:00:06,200 --> 00:00:08,760 Speaker 1: Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind. My name 2 00:00:08,800 --> 00:00:09,880 Speaker 1: is Robert Lamb. 3 00:00:09,800 --> 00:00:12,760 Speaker 2: And I am Joe McCormick, and it's Saturday. Time for 4 00:00:12,800 --> 00:00:16,960 Speaker 2: a vault episode. This one originally published on April twenty fifth, 5 00:00:17,079 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 2: twenty twenty three, and it's part one of our series. 6 00:00:19,400 --> 00:00:21,480 Speaker 2: Do we call this the Arsy Blows? I think it's 7 00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:26,600 Speaker 2: about the the spout of the whale we did. Yes, 8 00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:28,680 Speaker 2: all right, let's get in there. 9 00:00:32,159 --> 00:00:35,919 Speaker 3: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio. 10 00:00:42,880 --> 00:00:45,040 Speaker 1: Hey you welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. My 11 00:00:45,120 --> 00:00:45,919 Speaker 1: name is Robert. 12 00:00:45,760 --> 00:00:49,840 Speaker 2: Lamb and I'm Joe McCormick. So a few weeks back 13 00:00:49,840 --> 00:00:53,199 Speaker 2: on the show, we did a series of episodes on 14 00:00:53,320 --> 00:00:57,320 Speaker 2: the Pacific gray whale. That series was based on some 15 00:00:57,520 --> 00:01:01,560 Speaker 2: actual travels that you and your family did rob with Uh, 16 00:01:01,960 --> 00:01:05,240 Speaker 2: where you got to encounter these wonderful beasts up close. 17 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:08,440 Speaker 2: But ever since then, I've had a bit of a 18 00:01:08,880 --> 00:01:12,319 Speaker 2: low grade whale fever, and so based on maybe not 19 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:16,360 Speaker 2: physical travels in the world, but literary travels of the mind, 20 00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:20,160 Speaker 2: I've been drawn back to the subject of wales. Today 21 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:24,160 Speaker 2: we are returning to talk not about a particular species 22 00:01:24,200 --> 00:01:28,880 Speaker 2: of whale, but about a particular anatomical feature common to wales, 23 00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:33,720 Speaker 2: the respiratory orifice of the cetacean, known as the spout 24 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:37,760 Speaker 2: or the spiracle, or most commonly today, the blowhole. 25 00:01:38,200 --> 00:01:41,119 Speaker 1: That's right, one of the most famous features of the whale. 26 00:01:41,120 --> 00:01:43,640 Speaker 1: If you know nothing else about the whale. If your 27 00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:47,720 Speaker 1: knowledge of whale anatomy is limited to cartoons and emojis, 28 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:52,560 Speaker 1: you know something of the spout. You may have the 29 00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:54,760 Speaker 1: wrong idea of what it's all about, and we'll get 30 00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 1: into that in this episode. But you know that whales 31 00:01:57,360 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 1: do this right. 32 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:01,800 Speaker 2: The saying is not thar she filter feeds. The saying 33 00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:05,640 Speaker 2: is thar she blows right now. I actually became interested 34 00:02:05,680 --> 00:02:09,680 Speaker 2: in this subject because I was reading a chapter in 35 00:02:09,800 --> 00:02:14,200 Speaker 2: the great American whale novel Moby Dick by Herman Melville. 36 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:19,519 Speaker 2: Basic plot summary. A wandering young man named Ishmael and 37 00:02:19,680 --> 00:02:25,119 Speaker 2: his new companion, queequeg enlist on a whale ship captained 38 00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 2: by a man named Ahab, who is on a revenge 39 00:02:28,639 --> 00:02:33,880 Speaker 2: quest against a sperm whale that previously removed his leg. 40 00:02:34,240 --> 00:02:36,160 Speaker 1: A classic tale. Even if you're not familiar with the 41 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:39,560 Speaker 1: book itself, you've probably seen one of the many film 42 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:40,919 Speaker 1: adaptations over the years. 43 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:43,800 Speaker 2: Yes, though, you know, if you just watch a movie, 44 00:02:44,240 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 2: there is a quality to the text of Moby Dick 45 00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:49,360 Speaker 2: that probably won't quite come across, because this is not 46 00:02:50,080 --> 00:02:53,679 Speaker 2: a strictly plot oriented story. It's not a novel where 47 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:56,000 Speaker 2: the action of the plot always just kind of proceeds 48 00:02:56,040 --> 00:03:00,200 Speaker 2: ahead at a predictable pace. Many chapters of this book 49 00:03:00,639 --> 00:03:07,080 Speaker 2: are more like self contained informational or meditational essays on 50 00:03:07,320 --> 00:03:10,240 Speaker 2: subjects of all kinds. So there are little There are 51 00:03:10,280 --> 00:03:12,920 Speaker 2: chapters that are essays about the tackle and equipment of 52 00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:16,720 Speaker 2: whaling vessels, the monkey rope, the harpoon that, you know, 53 00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:20,400 Speaker 2: all the different things. There are chapters about the accuracy 54 00:03:20,680 --> 00:03:25,839 Speaker 2: or relative lack thereof, of whale illustrations in books. There's 55 00:03:25,880 --> 00:03:29,840 Speaker 2: a chapter about clam chowder. There are chapters about whale heads. 56 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 2: There's one chapter where he does phrenology on a whale head. 57 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:38,920 Speaker 2: There are chapters about whale skin, whale tails, et cetera. Now, 58 00:03:39,080 --> 00:03:43,240 Speaker 2: when it comes to the quote seatology of Moby Dick, 59 00:03:44,360 --> 00:03:46,680 Speaker 2: it seems to be Melville is all over the place, 60 00:03:46,760 --> 00:03:50,760 Speaker 2: sourcing his information in some cases from published works of 61 00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:55,000 Speaker 2: naturalists of his day, which was of course of you know, 62 00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:57,480 Speaker 2: we would judge by the scientific standards of today of 63 00:03:57,560 --> 00:04:00,840 Speaker 2: mixed quality to begin with, and in other cases he 64 00:04:00,880 --> 00:04:03,440 Speaker 2: seems to be relying on kind of the trade knowledge 65 00:04:03,440 --> 00:04:08,120 Speaker 2: of sailors and whalemen. Some of his biological observations I 66 00:04:08,160 --> 00:04:13,200 Speaker 2: think seem fairly keen, and others are bizarre or downright implausible. 67 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:17,040 Speaker 2: A very commonly cited example, though I don't know if 68 00:04:17,080 --> 00:04:20,200 Speaker 2: this represents the personal belief of Melville. Of the author, 69 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:23,200 Speaker 2: the narrator, Ishmael is firmly committed to the claim that 70 00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:27,200 Speaker 2: whales are fish. They are not, they're mammals. In fact, 71 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:30,400 Speaker 2: I was reading about this in a paper called Herman 72 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:34,560 Speaker 2: Melville Marine Biologist by Harold Morowitz, published in The Biological 73 00:04:34,640 --> 00:04:39,280 Speaker 2: Bulletin in twenty eleven. About the idea that whales are mammals, 74 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:43,320 Speaker 2: Morowitz writes, quote, this was not a new finding. Aristotle 75 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:47,320 Speaker 2: in History of Animals, some twenty two hundred years earlier. Oh. Actually, 76 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:52,240 Speaker 2: he's saying earlier than Linaeus had noticed the difference between 77 00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:55,840 Speaker 2: members of the whales and porpoises and other marine inhabitants. 78 00:04:56,000 --> 00:04:59,799 Speaker 2: The fish. He based this distinction on the cetaceans having 79 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:03,080 Speaker 2: the a malian properties of being warm blooded breathing air 80 00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:07,000 Speaker 2: through lungs and feeding the young through memory glands Melville, 81 00:05:07,120 --> 00:05:11,599 Speaker 2: though through his spokesman Ishmael, strongly disagreed and was willing 82 00:05:11,640 --> 00:05:14,680 Speaker 2: to place the anecdotal knowledge of a seaman against the 83 00:05:14,720 --> 00:05:18,400 Speaker 2: formal knowledge of academics. He insists that a whale is quote, 84 00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:21,360 Speaker 2: a spouting fish with a horizontal tail. 85 00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:23,679 Speaker 1: Well, I guess this kind of falls into the whole 86 00:05:24,560 --> 00:05:28,680 Speaker 1: semen versus landsman sort of thing, right, Like what would Aristotle? No, 87 00:05:28,880 --> 00:05:31,120 Speaker 1: he never he never served on a whaling vessel. 88 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:33,360 Speaker 2: That's right. This kind of came up in our Grey 89 00:05:33,360 --> 00:05:36,160 Speaker 2: Whale series two. What was the context? So was it 90 00:05:36,880 --> 00:05:40,040 Speaker 2: arguments about how aggressive actually the gray whale is. 91 00:05:40,600 --> 00:05:44,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, if you go by the accounts of whalers who 92 00:05:44,440 --> 00:05:47,880 Speaker 1: did get to you know, throw in their their their, their, 93 00:05:47,920 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 1: their two cents and name various things about whales as well. Yeah, 94 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:55,279 Speaker 1: according to them, the gray whale is just an absolute monster, 95 00:05:56,120 --> 00:05:58,719 Speaker 1: you know that that would just absolutely destroy anything in 96 00:05:58,720 --> 00:06:02,040 Speaker 1: its path, which it's certainly capable of, as we discuss, 97 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:06,159 Speaker 1: if it has been provoked. But if it's not provoked, 98 00:06:06,160 --> 00:06:08,599 Speaker 1: it as a very peaceful and curious creature. Right. 99 00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:12,480 Speaker 2: So, anyway, the narrator Ishmael's claims about whales, while in 100 00:06:12,520 --> 00:06:16,600 Speaker 2: my opinion always fascinating, are a mixed bag of some 101 00:06:16,839 --> 00:06:22,640 Speaker 2: sharp observations, some weird untruths, as well as ambiguous claims 102 00:06:22,680 --> 00:06:25,560 Speaker 2: somewhere in the middle. And I came across a number 103 00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:29,480 Speaker 2: of all of the above recently in chapter eighty five 104 00:06:29,560 --> 00:06:33,120 Speaker 2: of this book, which is called The Fountain. This chapter 105 00:06:33,440 --> 00:06:37,320 Speaker 2: is a consideration of the blowhole of the whale and 106 00:06:37,360 --> 00:06:40,800 Speaker 2: the towering exhalations from it, which, by the way, are 107 00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:44,520 Speaker 2: of great significance to whalers, because the spoutings of the 108 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:48,120 Speaker 2: blowhole are what whalers use to cite the whales out 109 00:06:48,160 --> 00:06:49,720 Speaker 2: on the open sea and track them down. 110 00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:53,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, thus Varsy blows right. I love that this chapter 111 00:06:53,800 --> 00:06:56,000 Speaker 1: is called the Fountain because, as we'll discuss, like even 112 00:06:56,040 --> 00:06:58,159 Speaker 1: the title this chapter is deceptive. 113 00:06:58,560 --> 00:07:02,320 Speaker 2: Right, So you don't mind. I'm gonna set the themes 114 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:04,719 Speaker 2: here by reading the first couple of paragraphs of this 115 00:07:04,839 --> 00:07:06,039 Speaker 2: chapter excellently. 116 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:09,040 Speaker 1: Are you gonna use the sailor voice from that? I'm gonna. 117 00:07:09,279 --> 00:07:13,880 Speaker 2: I'm not gonna do pirate voice. Okay, I'm not strong enough. Okay. 118 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:16,320 Speaker 2: So this is from Moby Dick by Herman Melville the 119 00:07:16,440 --> 00:07:20,480 Speaker 2: chapter the Fountain, that for six thousand years, and no 120 00:07:20,520 --> 00:07:23,800 Speaker 2: one knows how many millions of ages before, the great 121 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:27,400 Speaker 2: whales should have been spouting all over the sea and 122 00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:31,160 Speaker 2: sprinkling and mystifying the gardens of the deep, as with 123 00:07:31,240 --> 00:07:35,000 Speaker 2: so many sprinkling or mystifying pots. And that for some 124 00:07:35,080 --> 00:07:38,880 Speaker 2: centuries back thousands of hunters should have been close by 125 00:07:39,040 --> 00:07:42,760 Speaker 2: the fountain of the whale, watching these sprinklings and spoutings. 126 00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 2: That all this should be. And yet that down to 127 00:07:45,920 --> 00:07:49,520 Speaker 2: this blessed minute fifteen and a quarter minutes past one 128 00:07:49,560 --> 00:07:53,320 Speaker 2: o'clock pm on this sixteenth day of December eighty eighteen 129 00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:57,720 Speaker 2: fifty one, it should still remain a problem whether these 130 00:07:57,760 --> 00:08:02,800 Speaker 2: spoutings are after all really water or nothing but vapor. 131 00:08:03,320 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 2: This is surely a noteworthy thing. And then, skipping a 132 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:10,240 Speaker 2: bit into the next paragraph, everyone knows that by the 133 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:14,480 Speaker 2: peculiar cunning of their gills, the finny tribes in general 134 00:08:14,920 --> 00:08:17,960 Speaker 2: breathe the air, which at all times is combined with 135 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:21,520 Speaker 2: the element in which they swim. Hence, a herring or 136 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:24,520 Speaker 2: a cod might live a century and never once raise 137 00:08:24,560 --> 00:08:28,280 Speaker 2: its head above the surface, but owing to his marked 138 00:08:28,400 --> 00:08:32,640 Speaker 2: internal structure which gives him regular lungs like a human being's. 139 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:37,240 Speaker 2: The whale can only live by inhaling the disengaged air 140 00:08:37,400 --> 00:08:42,160 Speaker 2: in the open atmosphere, wherefore the necessity for his periodical 141 00:08:42,280 --> 00:08:45,720 Speaker 2: visits to the upper world. But he cannot in any 142 00:08:45,760 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 2: degree breathe through his mouth, for in his ordinary attitude, 143 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:52,600 Speaker 2: the sperm whale's mouth is buried at least eight feet 144 00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 2: beneath the surface. And what is still more, his windpipe 145 00:08:56,280 --> 00:09:00,280 Speaker 2: has no connection with his mouth. No, he breathes through 146 00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:03,560 Speaker 2: his spiracle alone, and this is on the top of 147 00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:04,120 Speaker 2: his head. 148 00:09:04,760 --> 00:09:07,160 Speaker 1: Now, so far, so good. I mean, nothing too out 149 00:09:07,160 --> 00:09:08,520 Speaker 1: of whack and all that, I think. 150 00:09:08,800 --> 00:09:12,079 Speaker 2: Oh sure, And I think this does help give you 151 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:15,079 Speaker 2: a sense of some of the wide eyed admiration and 152 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:18,679 Speaker 2: the power of the mystery in describing whales at this 153 00:09:18,840 --> 00:09:22,640 Speaker 2: time when, like documentary footage was not a thing that existed. 154 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:25,960 Speaker 2: Yet you know, people couldn't like see planet Earth and 155 00:09:26,040 --> 00:09:28,800 Speaker 2: see what whales looked like. So you know, most people 156 00:09:28,840 --> 00:09:31,960 Speaker 2: probably never would have seen any whale in person. Even 157 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:34,160 Speaker 2: if you had, you probably would have only seen them, 158 00:09:34,320 --> 00:09:37,760 Speaker 2: you know, breaching the surface occasionally or spouting from below. 159 00:09:38,080 --> 00:09:41,320 Speaker 2: Like you wouldn't have the kind of familiarity with whales 160 00:09:41,760 --> 00:09:44,800 Speaker 2: that even the average person has today just through being 161 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:46,880 Speaker 2: able to see them in movies and documentaries. 162 00:09:47,280 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 1: Right, and of course, depending on when you're trying, you're 163 00:09:50,520 --> 00:09:53,280 Speaker 1: looking out through the ocean and potentially seeing a whale, 164 00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 1: that the ability to see them might be greatly reduced 165 00:09:56,120 --> 00:10:01,480 Speaker 1: by human whaling enterprise, which you know certainly initially greatly 166 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:03,720 Speaker 1: reduced the number of whales that would have been close 167 00:10:03,760 --> 00:10:06,600 Speaker 1: to shore and then eventually got into those populations that 168 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:07,520 Speaker 1: were further from shore. 169 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:11,920 Speaker 2: Yeah. Now, so this chapter on the fountain, on one hand, 170 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:15,000 Speaker 2: it simply made me want to investigate the blowhole and 171 00:10:15,080 --> 00:10:18,719 Speaker 2: whale respiration as a subject in itself, which we will do. 172 00:10:19,400 --> 00:10:23,400 Speaker 2: But this chapter also raises a number of controversies and 173 00:10:23,840 --> 00:10:27,640 Speaker 2: strange claims that I wanted to further investigate. One of 174 00:10:27,720 --> 00:10:32,679 Speaker 2: the controversies that Melville opens the chapter by acknowledging is 175 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:35,800 Speaker 2: the question of what is the spout or what is 176 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:37,320 Speaker 2: it that comes out of the spout? I guess it 177 00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:39,920 Speaker 2: depends on what you're using the word spout to refer 178 00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:43,120 Speaker 2: to there, But yeah, what is coming out of the blowhole? 179 00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:46,840 Speaker 2: Is it water or is it, as Ishmael says, quote, 180 00:10:46,880 --> 00:10:49,800 Speaker 2: nothing but vapor that's a question that did seem to 181 00:10:49,800 --> 00:10:52,480 Speaker 2: be a live one to some degree in Melville's day. 182 00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:56,240 Speaker 2: But also as far as Strange claims go, here's one 183 00:10:56,280 --> 00:10:58,120 Speaker 2: for you I want to read from later in the chapter. 184 00:10:58,200 --> 00:10:59,040 Speaker 2: Are you ready, Rob? 185 00:10:59,440 --> 00:10:59,640 Speaker 1: Yes? 186 00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:03,560 Speaker 2: Okay, so he says, quote. Nor is it at all 187 00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:06,640 Speaker 2: prudent for the hunter to be over curious touching the 188 00:11:06,720 --> 00:11:10,080 Speaker 2: precise nature of the whale spout. It will not do 189 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 2: for him to be peering into it and putting his 190 00:11:14,000 --> 00:11:16,880 Speaker 2: face in it. You cannot go with your pitcher to 191 00:11:16,960 --> 00:11:19,720 Speaker 2: this fountain and fill it and bring it away. For 192 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:23,520 Speaker 2: even when coming into slight contact with the outer vapory 193 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:27,120 Speaker 2: shreds of the jet, which will often happen, your skin 194 00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:30,800 Speaker 2: will feverishly smart from the acridness of the thing so 195 00:11:31,040 --> 00:11:34,480 Speaker 2: touching it. And I know one who, coming into still 196 00:11:34,559 --> 00:11:38,520 Speaker 2: closer contact with the spout, whether with some scientific object 197 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:42,560 Speaker 2: in view or otherwise, I cannot say, the skin peeled 198 00:11:42,640 --> 00:11:46,800 Speaker 2: off from his cheek and arm. Wherefore, among whalemen the 199 00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:51,320 Speaker 2: spout is deemed poisonous, they try to evade it. Another 200 00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:53,640 Speaker 2: thing I have heard it said, and I do not 201 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:56,680 Speaker 2: much doubt it that if the jet is fairly spouted 202 00:11:56,720 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 2: into your eyes, it will blind you. The wise thing 203 00:12:00,480 --> 00:12:03,520 Speaker 2: the investigator can do, then, it seems to me, is 204 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:08,680 Speaker 2: to let this deadly spout alone. Okay, so I read 205 00:12:08,679 --> 00:12:10,679 Speaker 2: that and I was like, what is going on here? 206 00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:14,000 Speaker 2: That this sounds wrong to me. But I wonder if 207 00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:16,480 Speaker 2: there's some kind of basis to it, or some way 208 00:12:16,559 --> 00:12:19,280 Speaker 2: this rumor could have gotten started that would be identifiable. 209 00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:22,640 Speaker 2: I don't know, So that's another thing I want to explore. 210 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:28,680 Speaker 2: The allegedly deadly, poisonous blinding spout steals your power of sight, 211 00:12:29,200 --> 00:12:31,680 Speaker 2: melts away your flesh like xenomorph blood. 212 00:12:32,080 --> 00:12:37,280 Speaker 1: This is something else. This goes beyond discussions of water 213 00:12:37,480 --> 00:12:43,640 Speaker 1: versus mist, because this is just not true. And you know, 214 00:12:43,800 --> 00:12:46,560 Speaker 1: we mentioned my time with my family down in Mexico 215 00:12:46,600 --> 00:12:49,400 Speaker 1: getting to observe the gray whales. So when we were 216 00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:52,480 Speaker 1: out there, there would often be multiple gray whales around 217 00:12:52,520 --> 00:12:55,679 Speaker 1: the boat constantly, you know, breathing close to the surface. 218 00:12:55,720 --> 00:12:59,280 Speaker 1: And I should point out these were casual breaths. These 219 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:04,040 Speaker 1: were not breaths that were occurring after deep dive or 220 00:13:04,080 --> 00:13:09,480 Speaker 1: anything like that, but still pretty explosive exhalations, a lot 221 00:13:09,480 --> 00:13:12,160 Speaker 1: of mist floating around in the air. I definitely got 222 00:13:12,160 --> 00:13:16,360 Speaker 1: whale spout on me from these mists, and I saw 223 00:13:16,480 --> 00:13:20,880 Speaker 1: on more than one occasion somebody take a rather stiff 224 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:24,440 Speaker 1: blast of the whale spout directly in the face. Now, 225 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:27,000 Speaker 1: I don't recall if they had sunglasses on or what, 226 00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:30,559 Speaker 1: but it was it was alarming, but it wasn't anything 227 00:13:30,600 --> 00:13:33,880 Speaker 1: that caused undue grief or stress. It was one of 228 00:13:33,920 --> 00:13:36,720 Speaker 1: those things you kind of laugh about afterwards you wash 229 00:13:36,760 --> 00:13:40,720 Speaker 1: off your face. And some of my fellow whale watchers, 230 00:13:40,760 --> 00:13:42,360 Speaker 1: they really took it as kind of a point of pride, 231 00:13:42,400 --> 00:13:44,120 Speaker 1: you know, they're like, it's they referred to it as 232 00:13:44,120 --> 00:13:47,280 Speaker 1: a kind of baptism. You know, you're just say you 233 00:13:47,280 --> 00:13:49,400 Speaker 1: wanted to get close to these creatures. It doesn't get 234 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:50,240 Speaker 1: a lot closer than that. 235 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:52,520 Speaker 2: But what about your skin? Did it peel off or 236 00:13:52,559 --> 00:13:53,640 Speaker 2: do you still have your skin on? 237 00:13:54,240 --> 00:13:56,840 Speaker 1: I still have all, I mean all my skin was intact. 238 00:13:56,840 --> 00:14:00,440 Speaker 1: Following each of these episodes out on the water, people 239 00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:03,400 Speaker 1: who were blasted full on in the face also were fine. 240 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:06,319 Speaker 1: So yeah, I mean, the only thing that comes to 241 00:14:06,360 --> 00:14:08,280 Speaker 1: mind is, I guess it seems possible that someone could 242 00:14:08,320 --> 00:14:11,520 Speaker 1: have in some sort of an allergic reaction to something 243 00:14:11,559 --> 00:14:15,600 Speaker 1: in the whale spout, But I've never heard it as 244 00:14:15,640 --> 00:14:16,440 Speaker 1: actually occurring. 245 00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:19,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, it seems to be based on everything I've read 246 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:21,760 Speaker 2: that You're right. I could not find any evidence that 247 00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:25,440 Speaker 2: what comes out of a whales blowhole is actually poisonous 248 00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:28,280 Speaker 2: or acrid to the point that it will burn your 249 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:31,040 Speaker 2: skin away. But we can still come back to this, 250 00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:33,320 Speaker 2: and I don't know, maybe at least try to investigate 251 00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:36,520 Speaker 2: anything we can figure out about the claim itself, despite 252 00:14:36,560 --> 00:14:38,440 Speaker 2: the fact that it seems obviously not true. 253 00:14:38,960 --> 00:14:51,800 Speaker 1: Right, let's get into the basic science of whale spout 254 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 1: or whale blow. What is whale blow Well, it's discussed 255 00:14:55,640 --> 00:14:58,960 Speaker 1: by Mark Carwardine in the Handbook of Whales, Dolphins, and Porpoises, 256 00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:02,400 Speaker 1: an excellent that I referred to several times in our 257 00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:06,160 Speaker 1: previous series on the gray whale. Whale blow or whale 258 00:15:06,200 --> 00:15:09,200 Speaker 1: spout refers to both the whale's act of breathing explosive 259 00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 1: exhalation followed by immediate inhalation, and also it refers to 260 00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:17,479 Speaker 1: the visible misty cloud that hangs in the air afterwards. 261 00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:21,320 Speaker 1: Quote condensed water, a fine spray of mucus from inside 262 00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:24,920 Speaker 1: the lungs, and seawater trapped in the blowholes. And I 263 00:15:24,960 --> 00:15:26,720 Speaker 1: think this was one of the main reasons that I 264 00:15:26,800 --> 00:15:31,640 Speaker 1: did take a little extra care to avoid staring down 265 00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:33,680 Speaker 1: over the side of the boat at a blowhole because 266 00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:35,520 Speaker 1: I did not want to be sneezed full on in 267 00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:40,280 Speaker 1: the face by one of these leviathans. But I was 268 00:15:40,320 --> 00:15:43,760 Speaker 1: not deathly afraid of it and fearful of my sight. 269 00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:46,080 Speaker 2: Well, sure, and you might want to avoid that, not 270 00:15:46,200 --> 00:15:49,600 Speaker 2: just because of the forcefulness of the blow but for 271 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:52,000 Speaker 2: another I mean, one of the same reasons you wouldn't 272 00:15:52,040 --> 00:15:54,400 Speaker 2: want a human to sneeze in your face, which is 273 00:15:54,440 --> 00:15:58,120 Speaker 2: that like when somebody sneezes that mucus might contain significant 274 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:00,840 Speaker 2: loading of bacteria, and yeah, you don't know what that's 275 00:16:00,880 --> 00:16:01,240 Speaker 2: going to be. 276 00:16:02,640 --> 00:16:05,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, So I avoided it, but I also didn't 277 00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:07,320 Speaker 1: feel bad about I certainly got plenty of the mist 278 00:16:07,400 --> 00:16:09,960 Speaker 1: on me, because if you have multiple gray whales in 279 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:12,520 Speaker 1: your vicinity, you're just in a cloud of the stuff. 280 00:16:12,560 --> 00:16:15,480 Speaker 1: So it's unavoidable. Yeah, so, you know, breaking it down 281 00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:18,240 Speaker 1: to brass tax here the obvious whales. Of course, as 282 00:16:18,240 --> 00:16:20,400 Speaker 1: we've stated aquatic mammals, they have to come to the 283 00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:23,880 Speaker 1: surface to breathe, but hold their breath while underwater, and 284 00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:27,720 Speaker 1: according to Hammondadol in the book Whales Their Biology and Behavior. 285 00:16:27,760 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 1: Whales consciously control their breathing, unlike most mammals who are 286 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:35,440 Speaker 1: reflex breathers. Like us. They breathe through their blowholes, which 287 00:16:35,440 --> 00:16:40,240 Speaker 1: are sometimes called their nares, which are essentially evolved nostrils 288 00:16:40,280 --> 00:16:44,560 Speaker 1: which can be muscularly opened and closed. And as the 289 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:47,120 Speaker 1: authors point out quote, the air pressure in the nasal 290 00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:49,960 Speaker 1: passage is higher than the ambient pressure at the surface, 291 00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:53,720 Speaker 1: leading to the explosive release of air from the blowhole. 292 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:58,000 Speaker 1: The exhaled air from the whales inside is warmer than 293 00:16:58,000 --> 00:17:01,400 Speaker 1: the surrounding air and carries moisture, which condenses into the 294 00:17:01,440 --> 00:17:04,240 Speaker 1: visible blow that so often is the first tell tale 295 00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:07,119 Speaker 1: sign of a whale. Now, as we've discussed in the 296 00:17:07,119 --> 00:17:10,919 Speaker 1: show before, baileen whales have two holes, while toothed whales 297 00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:15,240 Speaker 1: have only one. Baileane whales also have a raised blowhole 298 00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:19,920 Speaker 1: with a frontal splash guard. It's the explosive exhalation and 299 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:23,199 Speaker 1: quick inhalation takes a mere second in the smaller whales 300 00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:25,720 Speaker 1: in just a few seconds in the giant, so there's 301 00:17:25,760 --> 00:17:29,080 Speaker 1: a real economy of breathing. In all of this, you 302 00:17:29,600 --> 00:17:32,320 Speaker 1: come up to the surface and Contrary to a lot 303 00:17:32,359 --> 00:17:35,040 Speaker 1: of the illustrations of whales, their whole head does not 304 00:17:35,119 --> 00:17:37,919 Speaker 1: come up. I mean, they can do some of this, 305 00:17:38,000 --> 00:17:40,240 Speaker 1: but it's not necessary for breathing. All they have to 306 00:17:40,240 --> 00:17:41,800 Speaker 1: do is just get the top of their head that 307 00:17:41,840 --> 00:17:45,600 Speaker 1: little blowhole above the water. To pull this off in 308 00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:48,359 Speaker 1: a manner of seconds. And according to the National Marine 309 00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:51,680 Speaker 1: Life Center, just one exhalation pretty much empties a whale's 310 00:17:51,840 --> 00:17:55,800 Speaker 1: entire lungs. One of our exhalations only empties part of 311 00:17:55,800 --> 00:17:56,400 Speaker 1: our lungs. 312 00:17:56,920 --> 00:17:59,359 Speaker 2: Now, this is an interesting fact that I thought was 313 00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:01,280 Speaker 2: worth looking at a little bit deeper, this thing about 314 00:18:01,280 --> 00:18:04,919 Speaker 2: whale lungs and capacity and the extent to which that 315 00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:08,439 Speaker 2: capacity is used. So I started thinking about the comparison 316 00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:14,120 Speaker 2: to underwater breath holding in humans. Most people who have 317 00:18:14,480 --> 00:18:17,960 Speaker 2: no special training can comfortably hold their breath underwater for 318 00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:21,440 Speaker 2: about a minute. I've seen estimates ranging from like one 319 00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:24,440 Speaker 2: to two minutes to thirty to ninety seconds. I don't 320 00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:26,920 Speaker 2: know if that depends on how old the population you're 321 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:29,520 Speaker 2: looking at is, or you know, how physically fit they are, 322 00:18:29,560 --> 00:18:32,119 Speaker 2: but still, you know, the average person is not going 323 00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:34,080 Speaker 2: to be able to stay under that long. Maybe a 324 00:18:34,119 --> 00:18:38,320 Speaker 2: couple of minutes. Now with conditioning, humans can stay under 325 00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:40,920 Speaker 2: water a lot longer. I was actually I was trying 326 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:45,040 Speaker 2: to find the current human record for underwater breath holding, 327 00:18:45,520 --> 00:18:49,639 Speaker 2: and according to Guinness World Records, the record holder is 328 00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:54,840 Speaker 2: a Croatian man named Budimir Shobot, who on March twenty seventh, 329 00:18:54,880 --> 00:18:59,360 Speaker 2: twenty twenty one, stayed underwater for twenty four minutes and 330 00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:03,160 Speaker 2: thirty seven seconds. And at first I was like, wait 331 00:19:03,200 --> 00:19:07,479 Speaker 2: a second, that just cannot be correct. That is too long. 332 00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:11,560 Speaker 2: That is more than two full playthroughs of the album 333 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:15,280 Speaker 2: length version, not the single version of I'd Do Anything 334 00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:18,960 Speaker 2: for Love, but I won't do that. Can't imagine it. 335 00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:24,639 Speaker 2: And to some degree my instincts were confirmed because I 336 00:19:24,640 --> 00:19:28,800 Speaker 2: realized there's a big caveat here. Showbots record and many 337 00:19:28,800 --> 00:19:31,359 Speaker 2: other people who compete for this particular record. This was 338 00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:38,280 Speaker 2: for a special category of breath holding oxygen assisted voluntary 339 00:19:38,359 --> 00:19:41,680 Speaker 2: breath holding. So in this category, before you go under 340 00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:45,680 Speaker 2: the water, you can spend up to thirty minutes ventilating 341 00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:49,479 Speaker 2: with one hundred percent pure oxygen from a tank. So 342 00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:55,560 Speaker 2: this is a pre dive hyperventilation process to like superoxygenate 343 00:19:55,640 --> 00:19:59,119 Speaker 2: your body. Of course, one hundred percent pure oxygen's much 344 00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:01,399 Speaker 2: higher than the the content in the air. We normally 345 00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:04,640 Speaker 2: breathe at twenty one percent oxygen. So yeah, the people 346 00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 2: who do this, they are super oxygenating their body before 347 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:11,080 Speaker 2: they start. And also, of course this guy was highly trained. 348 00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:13,800 Speaker 2: He spent more than three years training six days a week. 349 00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:16,080 Speaker 2: So twenty four and a half minutes is the record 350 00:20:16,119 --> 00:20:21,000 Speaker 2: for this technology assisted hyper ventilation category. But I was 351 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:24,439 Speaker 2: trying to find the not technology assisted version, and I 352 00:20:24,840 --> 00:20:28,119 Speaker 2: found a twenty twenty three article by a University of 353 00:20:28,160 --> 00:20:33,040 Speaker 2: Windsor kinesiologist named Anthony Bain, and he writes that the 354 00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:36,960 Speaker 2: record for breath holding if you don't pregame with pure oxygen, 355 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:41,320 Speaker 2: is less than half that It is possibly eleven minutes 356 00:20:41,359 --> 00:20:43,720 Speaker 2: and thirty five seconds for men, which is a record 357 00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:47,320 Speaker 2: held by Stefan Mifsud. Though there's some dispute about this 358 00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:50,360 Speaker 2: one because there's also a guy named Bronco Petrovitch who 359 00:20:50,359 --> 00:20:53,720 Speaker 2: holds a record accredited by Guinness, but not by this 360 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:58,040 Speaker 2: other organization, a governing body called the International Association for 361 00:20:58,119 --> 00:21:01,040 Speaker 2: the Development of Apnea, which aparently does some kind of 362 00:21:01,800 --> 00:21:04,600 Speaker 2: certification of these records. And I don't want to get 363 00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:07,240 Speaker 2: drawn into a knife fight about which record is legitimate. 364 00:21:07,320 --> 00:21:12,040 Speaker 2: But let's just say the unassisted record for men is 365 00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:15,159 Speaker 2: somewhere between the eleven to twelve minute range, and the 366 00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:18,160 Speaker 2: record for women is nine minutes and two seconds, held 367 00:21:18,200 --> 00:21:20,240 Speaker 2: by Natalia Mulkanova. 368 00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:22,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, we don't want to make any enemies of people 369 00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:24,000 Speaker 1: who can hold their breath this long. 370 00:21:24,400 --> 00:21:26,840 Speaker 2: That does sound dangerous. Just as a side note, speaking 371 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:30,440 Speaker 2: of people who can hold their breath a shockingly long time. 372 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:34,160 Speaker 2: This article also mentioned something I hadn't heard of at all, 373 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:38,840 Speaker 2: Apparently in preparation for the filming of Avatar Too, The 374 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:43,760 Speaker 2: Way of Water. The actress Kate Winslet trained in underwater 375 00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:47,080 Speaker 2: breath holding for several weeks, and on set she was 376 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:51,080 Speaker 2: able to stay underwater for more than seven minutes, something 377 00:21:51,119 --> 00:21:53,639 Speaker 2: that I am sure, no matter how much I trained, 378 00:21:53,680 --> 00:21:56,200 Speaker 2: I could not do. She did this on camera too, 379 00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:57,679 Speaker 2: and you can watch a video of it. When she 380 00:21:57,720 --> 00:21:59,960 Speaker 2: pops up at the end, she asks, am I dead? 381 00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:01,680 Speaker 2: So hat's off to Kate? 382 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:02,639 Speaker 1: Wow. 383 00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:04,679 Speaker 2: By the way, did you see Way of Water? I 384 00:22:04,680 --> 00:22:06,160 Speaker 2: haven't seen it yet. I did. 385 00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:09,879 Speaker 1: Yeah. My family and I just doing the holidays. It 386 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:12,480 Speaker 1: was super cold. One morning we got up and saw 387 00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:17,640 Speaker 1: a morning showing of Avatar two, complete with coffee and 388 00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:21,080 Speaker 1: multiple bathroom breaks because it's super long. But yeah, it's 389 00:22:21,080 --> 00:22:24,040 Speaker 1: fun and it's got space whales in it, so that's 390 00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:24,840 Speaker 1: kind of neat. 391 00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:25,199 Speaker 3: You know. 392 00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:28,200 Speaker 2: There are some whales that can stay underwater without breathing 393 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:30,199 Speaker 2: longer than we can go in a movie without a 394 00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:35,960 Speaker 2: bathroom break, at least when there's coffee involved. Yes, But 395 00:22:36,080 --> 00:22:38,760 Speaker 2: while that is individual records, there are also there are 396 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:44,880 Speaker 2: whole cultures of people who regularly do extended underwater free 397 00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:47,960 Speaker 2: diving and standard for a long period of time. I 398 00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:50,800 Speaker 2: was looking at one study quickly just to mention by 399 00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:55,119 Speaker 2: Ilardo at All published in the journal Cell in twenty 400 00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:59,800 Speaker 2: eighteen called Physiological and Genetic adaptations to Diving in see Nomads, 401 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:05,119 Speaker 2: and this study was examining adaptations in the Sama people 402 00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:10,919 Speaker 2: also known as the Bajoo, a nomadic sea living people 403 00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:14,040 Speaker 2: of Southeast Asia who are well known for their amazing 404 00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:18,280 Speaker 2: free diving skills. In some cases they spend several hours 405 00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:22,000 Speaker 2: a day underwater, not continuously, but they will stay under 406 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 2: continuously for minutes at a time while free diving to 407 00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:29,199 Speaker 2: retrieve things from below, and this is part of been 408 00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:31,719 Speaker 2: part of their culture for thousands of years. And so 409 00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:35,639 Speaker 2: this study did some genomic and anatomical analysis of these 410 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:39,280 Speaker 2: people to see, well, you know, the free diving skill 411 00:23:39,359 --> 00:23:42,280 Speaker 2: is common in their culture, do they typically have any 412 00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:46,160 Speaker 2: differences that assist in that And the study did find, quote, 413 00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:49,520 Speaker 2: using a comparative genomic study, we showed that natural selection 414 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:54,320 Speaker 2: on genetic variants in the PDE one zero a gene 415 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 2: have increased spleen size in the bajow, providing them with 416 00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:03,040 Speaker 2: a larger reservo are of oxygenated red blood cells. We 417 00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:06,400 Speaker 2: also find evidence of strong selections specific to the bajau 418 00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:11,719 Speaker 2: on bdk RB two a gene affecting the human diving reflex. 419 00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,440 Speaker 2: And so they say that people living in this culture 420 00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:20,919 Speaker 2: have developed specific adaptations for hypoxia tolerance, for being better 421 00:24:21,000 --> 00:24:25,119 Speaker 2: at going longer with holding the breath underwater. But anyway, 422 00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:28,520 Speaker 2: to come back to this sort of untrained natural human 423 00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:31,639 Speaker 2: range of people who don't practice diving commonly, you know, 424 00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:34,240 Speaker 2: it's maybe like one to two minutes on average, more 425 00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:38,160 Speaker 2: like nine to twelve minutes at the extreme. Some whale species, 426 00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:41,320 Speaker 2: on the other hand, have, in extreme cases, as we said, 427 00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:44,679 Speaker 2: been observed to stay under the surface for hours. And 428 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:48,800 Speaker 2: while that might not be normal. It's normal for whales 429 00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:52,120 Speaker 2: to stand or for longer than the unassisted record for humans. 430 00:24:52,119 --> 00:24:55,080 Speaker 2: It's commonly cited that sperm whales can stay under for 431 00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:59,040 Speaker 2: ninety minutes while hunting. So the question is how do 432 00:24:59,119 --> 00:25:02,800 Speaker 2: they do this? You might naturally assume the answer is 433 00:25:02,800 --> 00:25:06,399 Speaker 2: that the whales have bigger lungs. They can take a 434 00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:09,679 Speaker 2: deeper breath hold in more air because they've got bigger lungs. 435 00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:13,399 Speaker 2: But actually that's not the case. The strange thing is, 436 00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:18,800 Speaker 2: relative to body size, whales have significantly smaller lungs than humans. 437 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:23,240 Speaker 2: Human lungs are roughly seven percent of body size on average, 438 00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:25,800 Speaker 2: but whale lungs can be less than half that, at 439 00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:28,600 Speaker 2: about three percent of body size. 440 00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:30,480 Speaker 1: That's fascinating, that's a great point. 441 00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:32,879 Speaker 2: Yeah, so how does that work the standard for like 442 00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:38,440 Speaker 2: movie length times while having lungs that are relatively smaller 443 00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:42,800 Speaker 2: than ours. So I was reading about this in a 444 00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:47,199 Speaker 2: book called The Encyclopedia of Marine Mammals edited by burned 445 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:51,639 Speaker 2: In Puran from Academic Press two thousand and nine, and 446 00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:55,440 Speaker 2: there was a chapter on breathing in marine mammals by 447 00:25:55,480 --> 00:25:59,000 Speaker 2: the marine biologist Douglas Wartsock. And here's where we come 448 00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:02,120 Speaker 2: back to what you said right about the relative difference 449 00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:06,040 Speaker 2: in how much the lung can empty. This concerns a 450 00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:11,199 Speaker 2: biological metric known as the tidal volume. Tidal volume is 451 00:26:11,320 --> 00:26:14,920 Speaker 2: the amount of air that is inhaled and exhaled during 452 00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:20,480 Speaker 2: normal respiration. It turns out most animals do not completely 453 00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 2: empty and refill their lungs with each breath. Instead, they're 454 00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:28,639 Speaker 2: always exchanging some fractional percentage of the gas in their 455 00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:32,639 Speaker 2: lungs for fresh air from the outside. What percentage of 456 00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:36,320 Speaker 2: the total lung capacity is exchanged with each breath varies 457 00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:39,560 Speaker 2: by species, and I guess probably also would vary with 458 00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:44,240 Speaker 2: individual animals too, but there are certainly species differences and 459 00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:48,080 Speaker 2: there are trends with groups of animals. According to Wartsock, 460 00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:52,960 Speaker 2: the tidal volume is a bigger percentage of the animal's 461 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:56,760 Speaker 2: total lung capacity when you're looking at marine mammals than 462 00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:00,399 Speaker 2: when you're looking at terrestrial mammals. So you look at 463 00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:05,359 Speaker 2: an average terrestrial mammal, horses, humans, whatever tidal volume is 464 00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:08,879 Speaker 2: going to be something like ten to fifteen percent of 465 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:13,720 Speaker 2: total lung capacity. Meanwhile, for marine mammals, and this would 466 00:27:13,760 --> 00:27:17,000 Speaker 2: include not just whales but other marine mammals, pinnip heads 467 00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:21,400 Speaker 2: and so forth. Average tidal volume is much higher, usually 468 00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:25,240 Speaker 2: more than seventy five percent of total lung capacity, so 469 00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:29,520 Speaker 2: many multiples beyond the depth of gas exchange that we 470 00:27:29,560 --> 00:27:33,560 Speaker 2: accomplish when we breathe. For sea mammals like whales, breathing 471 00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:37,280 Speaker 2: in and out is just a more dramatic activity. They're 472 00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:42,760 Speaker 2: emptying and refilling to a near total extent. And that's 473 00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:47,720 Speaker 2: just for normal respiration. For what works out calls vital capacity. 474 00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:51,680 Speaker 2: Essentially the maximum title volume you're capable of when you're 475 00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:54,359 Speaker 2: like really breathing in and out as deeply as you can. 476 00:27:54,800 --> 00:27:58,760 Speaker 2: That rarely exceeds seventy five percent of lung capacity in 477 00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:02,880 Speaker 2: land based mammals, but marine mammals can go higher than 478 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:06,560 Speaker 2: ninety percent. So even though again whales might have smaller 479 00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:10,800 Speaker 2: lungs relative to body size, they can like almost totally 480 00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:14,800 Speaker 2: collapse that lung to exhale and then reinflate the lung 481 00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:18,760 Speaker 2: totally is like huge exchange of gas. And the question 482 00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:23,080 Speaker 2: would be what makes that difference. Why would marine mammals 483 00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:26,320 Speaker 2: have the ability to sort of crush out their lungs 484 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:28,520 Speaker 2: like that, Well, we can't really do the same thing. 485 00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:33,360 Speaker 2: Wartzok says, quote, Marine mammal lungs contain more elastic tissue 486 00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:37,480 Speaker 2: than those of terrestrial mammals. The ribs contain more cartilage 487 00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:41,280 Speaker 2: and are thus more compliant than those of terrestrial mammals. 488 00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:45,240 Speaker 2: The lung is also more compliant. Marine mammal lungs can 489 00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:50,120 Speaker 2: collapse and reinflate repeatedly, whereas in terrestrial mammals, lung collapses 490 00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:54,720 Speaker 2: a serious situation that requires intervention to reinflate. Although both 491 00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:59,960 Speaker 2: terrestrial mammals and marine mammals inspire actively and expire passively, 492 00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:04,520 Speaker 2: so there's active working of a muscle to breathe in 493 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:09,440 Speaker 2: and then relaxing of the muscle to breathe out. Quote. 494 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:13,680 Speaker 2: The features noted earlier allow much greater elastic recoil of 495 00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:17,320 Speaker 2: the lungs, chest, cavity, and diaphragm, and thus a greater 496 00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:21,440 Speaker 2: tidal volume in proportion to total lung capacity. So he's 497 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:24,080 Speaker 2: almost painting a picture of whale lungs as this kind 498 00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:28,640 Speaker 2: of I don't know, like like super elastic balloon or 499 00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 2: is something that just kind of like springs back and forth. 500 00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:36,360 Speaker 2: And I know this isn't biologically accurate, but to my mind, 501 00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:39,600 Speaker 2: I was thinking about with this, like, you know, naturally 502 00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:42,440 Speaker 2: collapsing lung that's just part of the breathing process. It's 503 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:44,920 Speaker 2: almost in my brain like a whoope cushion being sat 504 00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:46,600 Speaker 2: on every time the whale breathes out. 505 00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:50,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean all of this. I think it brings 506 00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:53,240 Speaker 1: up something that is at once obvious about the whale 507 00:29:53,760 --> 00:29:58,360 Speaker 1: and also you know, a lot more sublime in many 508 00:29:58,400 --> 00:30:00,480 Speaker 1: ways as well. And that is, of course, is that 509 00:30:00,800 --> 00:30:04,440 Speaker 1: when you look back at what whales may have looked like, 510 00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:06,440 Speaker 1: what their bodies may have been like when they were 511 00:30:06,840 --> 00:30:10,200 Speaker 1: land based organisms, or their their ancestors were, and you 512 00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:12,200 Speaker 1: look at their forms now, it's like they have changed 513 00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,160 Speaker 1: so much, they have evolved so much to become these 514 00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:19,440 Speaker 1: masters of the ocean, and there are all these various 515 00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:23,800 Speaker 1: features like this where it's just it's just absolutely alarming 516 00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:26,880 Speaker 1: when you look closer, even though I mean very obviously 517 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:29,000 Speaker 1: this is the nature of the whale, when you just 518 00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:31,320 Speaker 1: look at even just a basic sketch of their anatomy. 519 00:30:31,720 --> 00:30:35,880 Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely, I mean this once eons ago quadrupedal mammal 520 00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:40,040 Speaker 2: that lived an ever increasing amount of its life in 521 00:30:40,080 --> 00:30:43,680 Speaker 2: the water and eventually became a fully marine organism and 522 00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:46,959 Speaker 2: now one of its adaptations is that its lungs almost 523 00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:50,800 Speaker 2: completely collapse when it breathes out and create this forceful 524 00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:54,840 Speaker 2: burst of exhalation that is, in the end what we 525 00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:57,760 Speaker 2: see when the whale, when the whale spouts, or when 526 00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:01,680 Speaker 2: the blowhole opens, and it can be incredibly powerful when 527 00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:06,440 Speaker 2: the lung collapses. Wartsock writes, quote in gray whale calves, 528 00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:10,640 Speaker 2: the duration of expiration and inhalation is closer to half 529 00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:13,200 Speaker 2: a second, but the tidal volume can be as great 530 00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:17,120 Speaker 2: as sixty two liters and the maximum flow rate is 531 00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:20,560 Speaker 2: as great as two hundred and two leaders per second. 532 00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:24,320 Speaker 2: Gas flows through the external nares at speeds of forty 533 00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:28,920 Speaker 2: four meters per second during inspiration and two hundred meters 534 00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:34,040 Speaker 2: per second during expiration, and that also he emphasizes how 535 00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:37,760 Speaker 2: efficient the breathing process is, saying that like the breathing 536 00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:41,520 Speaker 2: out usually begins before the whale actually even breaks the 537 00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:44,600 Speaker 2: surface of the water, so it's like they're coming up 538 00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:48,840 Speaker 2: to break the surface, and then before they reach the surface, 539 00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:51,680 Speaker 2: the exhale starts, so it blasts, and then that might 540 00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:54,440 Speaker 2: create some of the water. You actually see another part 541 00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:56,760 Speaker 2: of what appears to be water coming out of the 542 00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:59,960 Speaker 2: blowhole is the condensing of the vapor from the lung, 543 00:32:00,440 --> 00:32:02,680 Speaker 2: but then it's over the surface for just a little 544 00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:05,040 Speaker 2: bit of time. It uses that time while it's out 545 00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:07,800 Speaker 2: to breathe in suddenly and then it goes back under. 546 00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 1: Yeah. In my experiences out there with the gray whales too, 547 00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:17,160 Speaker 1: the Yeah, it's depending on when they're releasing their exhalation. 548 00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:21,800 Speaker 1: If they're releasing it when the blowhole is above or 549 00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:25,000 Speaker 1: mostly above the surface of the water, that creates one 550 00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:28,560 Speaker 1: type of spout. But if they release it underneath the 551 00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:31,440 Speaker 1: water by even say, you know, a few inches or more, 552 00:32:32,160 --> 00:32:34,520 Speaker 1: you're going to have even more water coming up. It's 553 00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:36,200 Speaker 1: going to be even more of a of a of 554 00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:39,760 Speaker 1: what feels like a fountain to the face or to 555 00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:40,640 Speaker 1: the side of the boat. 556 00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:51,920 Speaker 2: Now, one last thing I wanted to mention about why 557 00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:55,520 Speaker 2: whales can stay under so long. Actually first came across 558 00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:59,160 Speaker 2: this and just an interesting informational video by a marine 559 00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:02,640 Speaker 2: ecologist to the University of New South Whales named Professor 560 00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:06,480 Speaker 2: Tracy Rogers, and this was pointing out, in addition to 561 00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:10,360 Speaker 2: stuff about the lungs, the capacity of cetaceans to just 562 00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:14,000 Speaker 2: store more oxygen in their body tissues, so beyond what 563 00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:18,240 Speaker 2: gas the lungs are capable of holding the storage of 564 00:33:18,280 --> 00:33:21,719 Speaker 2: oxygen in the hemoglobin in red blood cells. You know, 565 00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:25,920 Speaker 2: both humans and whales. Marine mammals and terrestrial mammals store 566 00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:30,680 Speaker 2: oxygen in the hemoglobin, but whales have much more hemoglobin 567 00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:33,840 Speaker 2: in their blood, which is one reason that their blood 568 00:33:33,960 --> 00:33:38,000 Speaker 2: might appear darker red than the blood of terrestrial mammals. 569 00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:39,640 Speaker 2: I don't know if you've ever seen whale blood, but 570 00:33:40,200 --> 00:33:42,760 Speaker 2: I feel like I have noticed this before that it 571 00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:45,720 Speaker 2: comes out so dark red it almost looks kind of 572 00:33:45,800 --> 00:33:47,080 Speaker 2: like black or purple. 573 00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:49,720 Speaker 1: I suppose I've seen it in documentaries. Yeah. 574 00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:53,960 Speaker 2: Yeah. But also whales simply have more blood relative to 575 00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:57,680 Speaker 2: their body size than than terrestrial mammals generally do, and 576 00:33:57,840 --> 00:34:03,160 Speaker 2: they have more myoglobin in their muscles to store oxygen, 577 00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:05,600 Speaker 2: as well as other adaptations that just have to do 578 00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:09,600 Speaker 2: with how the body of the whale uses oxygen once 579 00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:12,600 Speaker 2: it is submerged, So it has adaptations that can say, 580 00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:17,400 Speaker 2: turn off delivery of oxygen to certain body systems that 581 00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:19,960 Speaker 2: are not necessarily being used at the moment while the 582 00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:22,600 Speaker 2: whale is deeply submerged. So if it's you know, a 583 00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:25,040 Speaker 2: deep underwater hunting and it's not going to come up 584 00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:28,760 Speaker 2: for a while. It might sort of reduce oxygen usage 585 00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:31,040 Speaker 2: of its digestive system or something like that. 586 00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:35,200 Speaker 1: Now, we've discussed how the ancestors of whales had frontal 587 00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:37,759 Speaker 1: nostrils at the ends of their snouts before on the show, 588 00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:43,360 Speaker 1: and how the nostrils travel up to the top of 589 00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:46,200 Speaker 1: the head over the course of their evolution, you know, 590 00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:50,000 Speaker 1: becoming the blowhole. We can see evidence of this journey 591 00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:52,560 Speaker 1: and fossil remains, and we can also see this movement 592 00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:57,120 Speaker 1: in their fetal development. We can watch the blowhole move 593 00:34:57,239 --> 00:35:01,360 Speaker 1: up the face and head. I believe we mostly discuss 594 00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:05,239 Speaker 1: the energy efficiency of a snout breather having to bring 595 00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:06,960 Speaker 1: the whole head up as opposed to the top of 596 00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:09,799 Speaker 1: the head, and Hammond dett All also point out that 597 00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:13,520 Speaker 1: this positioning definitely shades down the breathing time over the 598 00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:16,480 Speaker 1: course of evolution. So all they have to do, they 599 00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:19,000 Speaker 1: don't have to bring the snout up to breathe. All 600 00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:21,840 Speaker 1: they have to do is just get the blowhole itself 601 00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:24,120 Speaker 1: above the surface of the water. And like we've been 602 00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:28,520 Speaker 1: saying in so many changes, I mean, the whale is 603 00:35:28,520 --> 00:35:32,160 Speaker 1: a creature that has just been completely transformed by its 604 00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:36,040 Speaker 1: journey into and its mastery of the ocean over the 605 00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:38,600 Speaker 1: course of its evolution, and you can there's so many 606 00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:41,839 Speaker 1: examples of this, but one that came up is this 607 00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:46,000 Speaker 1: that they have no facial sinuses, presumably to avoid complications 608 00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:49,840 Speaker 1: with diving. Anyone out there if you're a diver, and 609 00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:52,920 Speaker 1: you may know some of the complications that can occur 610 00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:55,360 Speaker 1: if you say clogged your sinuses are clogged up or 611 00:35:55,400 --> 00:35:58,400 Speaker 1: something like that. Even if you're flying, you can sometimes 612 00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:01,759 Speaker 1: encounter problems with this, and so this is a this 613 00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:04,879 Speaker 1: is just one problem that the whale has eliminated through 614 00:36:04,920 --> 00:36:09,880 Speaker 1: its evolution. Now, coming back to the visible spout of 615 00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:12,479 Speaker 1: the whale, the blow of the whale, as one would 616 00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:15,759 Speaker 1: see from a distance that ar she blows. It's it's 617 00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:18,600 Speaker 1: worth noting that it's this is something that Mark Carbadine 618 00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:22,560 Speaker 1: discusses in the Hambook of Whales, Dolphins and Porpoises. The 619 00:36:22,600 --> 00:36:25,520 Speaker 1: blow or the spout of a whale is very distinctive 620 00:36:25,719 --> 00:36:29,320 Speaker 1: with larger whales, and it can be categorized by height, shape, 621 00:36:29,360 --> 00:36:32,960 Speaker 1: and visibility. And that's not to say it's easy to do. 622 00:36:33,040 --> 00:36:35,879 Speaker 1: There's an art to it. An experienced whale watcher has 623 00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:39,880 Speaker 1: to take into account various factors such as wind, rain, 624 00:36:40,480 --> 00:36:44,239 Speaker 1: air temperature, light quality, which can all of these can 625 00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:46,200 Speaker 1: you know, distort the shape of the spout or the 626 00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:50,120 Speaker 1: degree to which the spout is visible. And also we 627 00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:53,200 Speaker 1: have to take into account that the first spout after 628 00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:56,239 Speaker 1: a long dive tends to be far stronger, which I 629 00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:58,000 Speaker 1: think we can we can sort of relate to that. 630 00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:01,399 Speaker 1: I mean, that's kind of our experience of breathing after 631 00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:04,480 Speaker 1: holding one's breath for a period of time. Also, individual 632 00:37:04,520 --> 00:37:06,719 Speaker 1: whale size is going to play a role in all 633 00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:10,359 Speaker 1: of this, and also behavior of an individual whale will 634 00:37:10,360 --> 00:37:12,840 Speaker 1: also be a factor. Still, if you know what you're doing, 635 00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:16,120 Speaker 1: you can make out the species of a great whale, 636 00:37:16,200 --> 00:37:20,480 Speaker 1: especially at a distance. To give a few basic examples 637 00:37:20,480 --> 00:37:23,839 Speaker 1: of note here and Joe, I sent you some snapshot 638 00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:27,520 Speaker 1: of some of the illustrations from Carlodiane's book to look 639 00:37:27,560 --> 00:37:30,399 Speaker 1: at in your email there. But the gray whale, which 640 00:37:30,440 --> 00:37:33,319 Speaker 1: we discussed in previous episodes, is known for its heart 641 00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:37,360 Speaker 1: shaped plume up to five meters. The sperm whale is 642 00:37:37,400 --> 00:37:40,759 Speaker 1: also known for its spout. It has a single blowhole 643 00:37:40,840 --> 00:37:44,319 Speaker 1: spout off to the side up to six meters. The 644 00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:47,359 Speaker 1: blue whale spout is a single vertical plume of up 645 00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:51,000 Speaker 1: to twelve meters. Then the North Atlantic right whale is 646 00:37:51,239 --> 00:37:54,160 Speaker 1: interesting like other right whales, it has two spouts, one 647 00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:57,759 Speaker 1: off to either side up to seven meters. And then 648 00:37:57,800 --> 00:38:01,160 Speaker 1: with the orca, which of course discussed at length in 649 00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:04,200 Speaker 1: our gray whale series, up to five meters, bushy at 650 00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:06,800 Speaker 1: the top and projected slightly forward. 651 00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:09,719 Speaker 2: Yeah, these illustrations are lovely and they do almost kind 652 00:38:09,719 --> 00:38:12,960 Speaker 2: of look like silhouettes of different tree species that you 653 00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:15,640 Speaker 2: would identify like that, you know, oh, that's the maple 654 00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:16,200 Speaker 2: and that's the. 655 00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:19,640 Speaker 1: Spruce, right right. So any any book you have, particular 656 00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:23,000 Speaker 1: and in particular the Handbook of Whales, Dolphins and porposes, Yeah, 657 00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:25,960 Speaker 1: it has pages of these where you can compare them. 658 00:38:25,960 --> 00:38:30,399 Speaker 1: But then also each species profiled in the book there 659 00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:32,600 Speaker 1: is they have this image of what it's spout would 660 00:38:32,600 --> 00:38:35,200 Speaker 1: basically look like. Again, you'd have to take into account 661 00:38:35,239 --> 00:38:37,719 Speaker 1: some of these factors though. All right, Well, on that note, 662 00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:40,480 Speaker 1: we're going to go ahead and close out this episode. Well, 663 00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:42,680 Speaker 1: but we'll be back for a part two on all 664 00:38:42,680 --> 00:38:44,400 Speaker 1: of this. I believe this will be a two parter, 665 00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:47,880 Speaker 1: so come back on Thursday. We have more to discuss 666 00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:52,720 Speaker 1: more on this whole idea that the that the Herman 667 00:38:52,760 --> 00:38:56,080 Speaker 1: Melville's talking about, that a whale spout is going to 668 00:38:56,800 --> 00:38:59,960 Speaker 1: burn your skin off, poison you, and blind you. Will 669 00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:04,920 Speaker 1: see what some contemporary critics we're saying about all of that, 670 00:39:05,280 --> 00:39:08,200 Speaker 1: and we'll get into some other areas surrounding whale spout. 671 00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:10,400 Speaker 1: In the meantime, if you would like to check out 672 00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:12,760 Speaker 1: other episodes of Stuff to Blow Your Mind, including checking 673 00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:16,120 Speaker 1: out that multi part series we did on the Gray 674 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:22,040 Speaker 1: Whale and it's travels its relationship with the Orcas, you 675 00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:23,839 Speaker 1: can find that in the Stuff to Blow Your Mind 676 00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:26,800 Speaker 1: podcast feed core episodes on Tuesdays and Thursdays. Some Mondays 677 00:39:26,800 --> 00:39:28,600 Speaker 1: we do a listener mail, on Wednesdays we do a 678 00:39:28,640 --> 00:39:31,600 Speaker 1: short form artifact or monster fact, and on Fridays we 679 00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:33,719 Speaker 1: set aside most serious concerns to just talk about a 680 00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:35,480 Speaker 1: weird film on Weird House Cinema. 681 00:39:35,640 --> 00:39:39,040 Speaker 2: Huge thanks to our audio producer JJ Posway. If you 682 00:39:39,080 --> 00:39:41,280 Speaker 2: would like to get in touch with us with feedback 683 00:39:41,320 --> 00:39:43,720 Speaker 2: on this episode or any other, to suggest a topic 684 00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:46,160 Speaker 2: for the future, or just to say hello, you can 685 00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:56,560 Speaker 2: email us at contact Stuff to Blow Your Mind dot com. 686 00:39:57,400 --> 00:40:00,319 Speaker 3: Stuff to Blow Your mind is production of iHeartRadio. 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