WEBVTT - Justin Baldoni interviews Jay Shetty ON: Self-Compassion & Finding Your Purpose Through Service 0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:03.520 Hey everyone, and welcome back to On Purpose. This is 0:00:03.640 --> 0:00:07.560 a very very special episode. I had the opportunity to 0:00:07.600 --> 0:00:09.920 sit down with three hosts, and one of them has 0:00:09.960 --> 0:00:12.800 been on here before. Someone we all love and admire, 0:00:12.920 --> 0:00:15.960 an incredibly talented friend of mine. I'm a big fan 0:00:16.000 --> 0:00:20.120 of his new book, Man Enough, Undefining My Masculinity, where 0:00:20.160 --> 0:00:24.560 he helps readers think outside of the traditional definition of masculinity. 0:00:24.680 --> 0:00:27.120 He opens up to everyone, allows himself to be vulnerable, 0:00:27.200 --> 0:00:30.560 and admits that he is still working on healing himself. Everyone, 0:00:30.560 --> 0:00:33.920 please welcome back Justin Boldoni and someone who hopes his 0:00:33.960 --> 0:00:37.240 book will inspire other men to let themselves be vulnerable 0:00:37.400 --> 0:00:39.760 as well. This is one that I don't want you 0:00:39.800 --> 0:00:42.080 to miss. Can't wait for you to hear this conversation. 0:00:42.200 --> 0:00:52.000 There's some big reveals in this one. Welcome to the 0:00:52.080 --> 0:00:56.920 Man Enough podcast. Man Enough is a conversation about what 0:00:56.960 --> 0:01:00.280 it means to be a man today and undefining all 0:01:00.280 --> 0:01:04.600 of the stereotypical, traditional ideas of masculinity to make room 0:01:04.680 --> 0:01:07.479 for anybody who identifies as a man to be allowed 0:01:08.000 --> 0:01:10.600 to be a man. We want to create a world 0:01:10.600 --> 0:01:14.440 where there is more unity and equality, and that starts 0:01:14.720 --> 0:01:18.600 with uncomfortable conversations where we go deep and we are 0:01:18.680 --> 0:01:21.400 growing and learning in real time. We have not arrived, 0:01:21.520 --> 0:01:23.959 We're just beginning. Check us out at man enough dot 0:01:23.959 --> 0:01:25.920 com or you can like it and subscribe to us 0:01:25.920 --> 0:01:30.360 wherever you get your podcast. Hello and welcome back to 0:01:30.840 --> 0:01:35.679 man Enough. I'm Justin Baldoni here with the incredible list Plank, 0:01:36.000 --> 0:01:39.080 Jamie Heath, and the one and only, my dear friend 0:01:39.920 --> 0:01:45.039 mister Jay Shetty Dude. We're finally doing that. We're doing it. 0:01:45.160 --> 0:01:47.480 Thank you for having me. Guys, you have you been 0:01:47.480 --> 0:01:51.600 on a podcast. I've never been on a podcast three 0:01:51.680 --> 0:01:54.680 co host, so this is not yours. This is special. 0:01:54.840 --> 0:01:56.760 This is very special. I just wanted this to be 0:01:56.760 --> 0:01:59.640 your first podcast, but he's never been on any podcast. 0:02:01.120 --> 0:02:03.120 This is This is the first time I've been on 0:02:03.160 --> 0:02:09.200 a podcast which has such a beautiful, clear purpose to 0:02:09.200 --> 0:02:11.440 help people redefine who they want to be in the world. 0:02:11.480 --> 0:02:14.760 And so it is the first time, and it's the 0:02:14.800 --> 0:02:17.440 first time that I'm being interviewed by Justin. I've had 0:02:17.520 --> 0:02:19.520 him on the podcast before, which has been really special. 0:02:19.600 --> 0:02:22.919 It's the first time we are meeting and Liz have 0:02:23.040 --> 0:02:25.919 been a huge fan of for like the last five years. 0:02:25.960 --> 0:02:28.240 I've just been name dropping all of her video names 0:02:28.240 --> 0:02:30.760 since we've met. And I'm so grateful to get to 0:02:30.760 --> 0:02:32.960 meet you today, Jamie. Indeed, thank you for having me, 0:02:33.120 --> 0:02:40.200 Thanks for being gotcha. You're just You're just special. You're 0:02:40.240 --> 0:02:45.320 a special man. It's like you meet people that you know, 0:02:45.400 --> 0:02:49.679 we're sent by God to with a purpose to just 0:02:49.840 --> 0:02:53.480 like make it a little better. And you're one of 0:02:53.480 --> 0:02:56.800 those people. You are a bestselling author, you are a 0:02:56.880 --> 0:03:01.360 former monk and a purpose coach. You're the host of 0:03:01.400 --> 0:03:05.760 an incredibly popular podcast on Purpose, Speaking of Purpose, which 0:03:05.760 --> 0:03:09.200 has more than sixty four million downloads. Your YouTube videos 0:03:09.240 --> 0:03:11.959 have been streamed two billion times. That's like a third 0:03:12.000 --> 0:03:16.760 of the planet. And I hope you find success. Maybe 0:03:16.760 --> 0:03:20.959 one day you can be on the podcast. When you guys, 0:03:21.080 --> 0:03:24.720 you finished your studies, you turned down jobs in the 0:03:24.760 --> 0:03:27.280 business world to go live in India and become a 0:03:27.280 --> 0:03:30.280 full time monk. That inspired your book, Think Like a Monk. 0:03:30.440 --> 0:03:33.400 It came out in September twenty twenty during this pandemic, 0:03:33.480 --> 0:03:36.000 and I know you've talked about it so much. Hopefully 0:03:36.040 --> 0:03:37.640 we will get to talk about it and so many 0:03:37.680 --> 0:03:41.240 more other things. But it's it's sold out so many copies, 0:03:41.240 --> 0:03:44.240 and with that in mind, love to welcome you our 0:03:44.280 --> 0:03:47.720 show to men enough thank you for embarrassing me is 0:03:47.920 --> 0:03:50.240 awkward to just like here you're you know, even a 0:03:50.280 --> 0:03:53.640 portion of your life story and your successes, right, yeah, 0:03:53.920 --> 0:03:56.760 perceive successes? Well, I get it, you know, I no, 0:03:57.280 --> 0:03:59.839 I value everything you just shared, like I'm so great 0:04:00.080 --> 0:04:03.040 and blessed to have that. But I have this practice 0:04:03.080 --> 0:04:07.800 that we were trained in as monks that when someone 0:04:07.960 --> 0:04:10.160 notices something good about you, even what you were just 0:04:10.200 --> 0:04:14.160 saying earlier, you accept and you receive it, but you 0:04:14.200 --> 0:04:16.640 think of the person that helped you get that skill 0:04:17.040 --> 0:04:21.960 or ability or habit or practice that helped you develop 0:04:22.080 --> 0:04:24.840 that intentionally on intentionally, and you pass it on to them. 0:04:24.880 --> 0:04:26.920 So I love doing this because I can just sit 0:04:26.960 --> 0:04:28.880 here and think about all my teachers and monk teachers 0:04:28.920 --> 0:04:31.359 and pass it back to them and thank them in 0:04:31.440 --> 0:04:33.880 my heart. So it's an opportunity to be thankful and grateful. 0:04:33.920 --> 0:04:36.800 So I love that you've been on the podcast for 0:04:36.839 --> 0:04:40.600 thirty five seconds and you've already dropped something that's helpful 0:04:40.600 --> 0:04:42.919 to me because I have a hard time accepting compliments. 0:04:43.440 --> 0:04:45.679 I just have a hard time with it and I love. 0:04:46.839 --> 0:04:50.400 I love that I can accept it and thank somebody. 0:04:49.839 --> 0:04:52.720 I can do that. Yeah, it's simple. I can do 0:04:52.760 --> 0:04:55.920 that because I stand on the shoulder of giants. Right, 0:04:57.120 --> 0:05:00.200 I appreciate that. All right, all right, thank you. I've 0:05:00.240 --> 0:05:02.920 noticed too before you before I hope you don't mind 0:05:02.960 --> 0:05:06.960 me putting this out. Before we started, I saw you. 0:05:07.400 --> 0:05:09.039 I looked over you, and your eyes were closing. You 0:05:09.080 --> 0:05:12.400 just look like thirty fifty sixty seconds. Is that something 0:05:12.400 --> 0:05:21.360 that you learned during your Yeah, what monastery? During your time? Yeah, 0:05:21.440 --> 0:05:25.599 it was the idea of using any opportunity before you 0:05:25.760 --> 0:05:31.520 begin something, you're setting your intention for service. So before 0:05:31.560 --> 0:05:33.880 you begin anything in the day, whether it's eating or 0:05:33.920 --> 0:05:37.200 even sleeping or spending time with someone or I mean, 0:05:37.240 --> 0:05:39.919 we literally are serving humanity through Justin and all of 0:05:39.960 --> 0:05:42.000 you and the incredible work that man enough to us. 0:05:42.080 --> 0:05:44.760 So to just set your intention and be like, Okay, 0:05:44.839 --> 0:05:47.160 let me get out of my own way, let me 0:05:47.200 --> 0:05:49.800 be a channel, let me serve, let me you know not. 0:05:50.279 --> 0:05:53.480 So it's not really a prayer. It's a prayer. You 0:05:53.480 --> 0:05:55.440 could call it a prayer, absolutely, Yeah, you could call 0:05:55.480 --> 0:05:59.239 it a prayer. But the clear thing is you're setting 0:05:59.279 --> 0:06:03.080 your intention for service. Yeah, so a prayer to be 0:06:03.160 --> 0:06:07.600 of service. Absolutely. So I'd like to start by asking 0:06:07.640 --> 0:06:11.520 you when was a time where you just didn't feel 0:06:11.520 --> 0:06:15.480 like you were man enough. I'd probably see him my 0:06:15.520 --> 0:06:19.719 whole life like it's it feels like such a real 0:06:19.800 --> 0:06:23.159 thing because when I was growing up as a young boy, 0:06:23.240 --> 0:06:26.280 I was overweight and I was one of the few 0:06:26.400 --> 0:06:30.159 ethnic minorities in my area, and so I was bullied 0:06:30.200 --> 0:06:35.200 at primary school and I'd always be picked on or 0:06:35.680 --> 0:06:37.599 the mick taken out of whether it was racism or 0:06:38.200 --> 0:06:40.800 whether it was about my weight or body image and 0:06:40.839 --> 0:06:43.640 all of those kind of issues. And I actually didn't 0:06:43.680 --> 0:06:46.320 take it that personally because I'd go home and my 0:06:46.360 --> 0:06:48.719 mom loved me a lot, and so I was raised. 0:06:48.720 --> 0:06:50.479 I feel like I was literally raised by my mom, 0:06:50.520 --> 0:06:52.039 And that's one of the reasons why I never felt 0:06:52.040 --> 0:06:55.560 man enough, because my mother was the most involved parent. 0:06:55.640 --> 0:06:59.000 My dad was very much aloof let me make my decisions, 0:06:59.040 --> 0:07:02.520 failure's choice is, but my mother was always there. My 0:07:02.520 --> 0:07:05.320 mother taught me how to shave my face, she taught 0:07:05.320 --> 0:07:08.640 me my skincare routine. She taught like my mother was 0:07:08.680 --> 0:07:10.920 like the first person to teach me a lot of 0:07:10.920 --> 0:07:14.360 what people's dads usually teach them, and that wasn't because 0:07:14.360 --> 0:07:16.040 my dad was a bad father. It's just that that 0:07:16.120 --> 0:07:18.640 was his style. And we have a great friendship now. 0:07:19.280 --> 0:07:21.160 But with my mom, she was the one of mold. 0:07:21.200 --> 0:07:23.680 So I never felt man enough because I didn't have 0:07:23.720 --> 0:07:26.640 a man teaching me man things, or however you want 0:07:26.640 --> 0:07:29.720 to put it. I was always surrounded by my mother 0:07:29.760 --> 0:07:33.720 and my sister and powerful women in my life, and 0:07:34.120 --> 0:07:36.400 I wasn't really exposed to how for males or any 0:07:36.440 --> 0:07:39.560 of those figures. So how's that manifest? Like people call 0:07:39.640 --> 0:07:41.920 your mama's boy? Did they call your names? Yeah? All 0:07:41.920 --> 0:07:44.000 of it. I remember when when someone would pick on 0:07:44.040 --> 0:07:45.480 me at school, I'd go tell my mom that my 0:07:45.520 --> 0:07:47.720 mum would come to school to like, you know, like 0:07:47.800 --> 0:07:49.280 they're like, why are you treating my son like this? 0:07:49.360 --> 0:07:51.720 And that's like the worst night I've ever a kid, right, 0:07:51.960 --> 0:07:54.840 Like It's like everyone in the school is like, oh Goshler, 0:07:54.920 --> 0:07:57.800 it's Jay's mom again. And you know, my mom can 0:07:57.840 --> 0:08:01.320 be pretty protective of me, especially when I was younger, 0:08:01.840 --> 0:08:04.600 and so she'd get right in there with the headmistress's 0:08:04.600 --> 0:08:07.520 office or the dean's office and just be like, can't 0:08:07.560 --> 0:08:09.440 have this happen, and then everyone would find out and 0:08:09.440 --> 0:08:12.440 then and would laugh at you more. And so I 0:08:12.040 --> 0:08:15.400 think I think it ended up. I actually think it 0:08:15.560 --> 0:08:17.840 just made me more of who I am today. But 0:08:18.320 --> 0:08:20.520 when I went to high school, I started to crave 0:08:20.880 --> 0:08:23.400 more male attention. So going from that, I then went 0:08:23.440 --> 0:08:26.480 to an all boys school. Oh wow, So I went 0:08:26.520 --> 0:08:28.040 to an all boys school from the age of eleven 0:08:28.080 --> 0:08:31.480 to eighteen. And at that point you have no one 0:08:31.520 --> 0:08:34.600 else's validation or recognition to get apart from other boys. 0:08:34.800 --> 0:08:36.480 Right now, I want to fit in, did you? So? 0:08:36.600 --> 0:08:40.319 Did you seek or crave that attention? Absolutely? That's when 0:08:40.360 --> 0:08:43.040 I was like, oh, now I want to be seen 0:08:43.080 --> 0:08:45.120 as strong, and I want to be seen as cool, 0:08:45.200 --> 0:08:47.440 and I want to be seen as the guy, and 0:08:47.480 --> 0:08:49.120 I want to be seen as this and that. And 0:08:49.200 --> 0:08:53.480 so I think that manifested in being quite competitive. And 0:08:53.559 --> 0:08:55.680 so I wanted to get a spot on the school's 0:08:55.760 --> 0:08:57.480 rugby team. I wanted to get a spot on the 0:08:57.480 --> 0:08:59.719 school's swimming team. I wanted to get a spot on 0:08:59.720 --> 0:09:01.880 the stool I did. I think a big part of 0:09:01.880 --> 0:09:05.480 it was that masculine feeling that it gave me. And 0:09:05.520 --> 0:09:08.760 so I think it manifested in insecurities at high school. 0:09:09.120 --> 0:09:11.760 So as I got older, I actually think between fourteen 0:09:11.760 --> 0:09:16.120 to eighteen, it manifested as insecurities of seeking validation and 0:09:16.240 --> 0:09:21.160 recognition for that which was not me. So I wasn't 0:09:21.280 --> 0:09:26.559 looking to be loved because I was empathetic and compassionate 0:09:26.600 --> 0:09:29.120 and kind, which is how my mom raised me. I 0:09:29.160 --> 0:09:33.280 was looking to be liked because I was bold and 0:09:33.600 --> 0:09:37.719 courageous and strong and physical and competitive, and so you 0:09:37.760 --> 0:09:40.440 almost start looking for validation for the things that you're not, 0:09:40.559 --> 0:09:45.080 so you became you were performing absolutely every day, absolutely absolutely. 0:09:45.600 --> 0:09:49.520 Masculinity feels like like it's a total dance, right, It's 0:09:49.520 --> 0:09:51.800 a total choreography, and you're kind of watching other men 0:09:52.400 --> 0:09:54.280 like do it right, Like even the handshake, Like how 0:09:54.280 --> 0:09:56.320 am I supposed to like do the hug? Then the pole, 0:09:56.400 --> 0:10:02.640 then the there's like a pole, there's a tap sometimes. Yeah, 0:10:02.640 --> 0:10:05.760 there's a lot of different It's very funny, not funny, 0:10:05.840 --> 0:10:07.200 but you can be entertaining it as a woman to 0:10:07.240 --> 0:10:08.640 just kind of watch that and be like, I'm so 0:10:08.720 --> 0:10:11.840 happy I don't have to figure that out, but but 0:10:11.880 --> 0:10:13.920 I want to come back to the you know, your 0:10:13.920 --> 0:10:17.439 point about service, which you really opened up our conversation 0:10:17.480 --> 0:10:22.319 with I feel like we overemphasize service for women, right 0:10:22.440 --> 0:10:25.120 that you are at the service of the people around 0:10:25.120 --> 0:10:27.440 you and that's your value in the world, and we 0:10:27.559 --> 0:10:31.960 kind of under emphasize service for men. And it seems 0:10:32.000 --> 0:10:36.720 like for you finding service as purpose was really very 0:10:36.760 --> 0:10:40.320 meaningful part of your identity. I'm wondering how you see, 0:10:40.760 --> 0:10:43.240 you know, us being able to make that connection, what 0:10:43.280 --> 0:10:46.200 a service look like for men, and how is it 0:10:46.280 --> 0:10:49.440 tied to masculinity. Yeah, I mean I saw. What I 0:10:49.480 --> 0:10:51.839 was saying was I saw my mother's sacrifice growing up. 0:10:52.360 --> 0:10:55.680 So my mother was raising me and my sister deeply 0:10:55.679 --> 0:10:57.720 would love have always felt love by my mother. And 0:10:57.760 --> 0:10:59.440 then she would also have her own business, so I 0:10:59.440 --> 0:11:01.680 didn't even know. I didn't know she was an entrepreneur. 0:11:01.720 --> 0:11:04.280 But she was an entrepreneur, which was so weird because 0:11:04.520 --> 0:11:07.800 she never made herself out to be an entrepreneur. And 0:11:07.880 --> 0:11:10.120 so she had her own business. She started it so 0:11:10.200 --> 0:11:13.800 that she could work more flexibly, and she was taking 0:11:13.840 --> 0:11:15.680 care of my sister. She'd drop us to school, she'd 0:11:15.679 --> 0:11:18.320 pick us up, she'd make us dinner. She'd be working 0:11:18.360 --> 0:11:20.400 as well, and at one point became the main breadwinner 0:11:20.440 --> 0:11:22.720 in the family as well, and so I saw my 0:11:22.800 --> 0:11:26.920 mum serve or sacrifice in this way, and so I 0:11:26.960 --> 0:11:30.520 feel like I got trained by watching her and observing her. 0:11:31.080 --> 0:11:34.400 And then when I met the monks, who the predominant 0:11:34.440 --> 0:11:37.200 monks that I lived with were all men, and service 0:11:37.360 --> 0:11:40.960 was at the core of their entire being. So our 0:11:41.000 --> 0:11:43.800 teachers would always tell us that the only way a 0:11:43.880 --> 0:11:47.839 culture succeeds is if everyone wants to serve everyone else. 0:11:48.400 --> 0:11:51.160 And so that was like the encouragement of that culture. 0:11:51.200 --> 0:11:53.720 And that's where it became so real to me and 0:11:53.760 --> 0:11:57.360 for me, service and masculinity go hand in hand, but 0:11:57.520 --> 0:12:00.840 service and humanity go hand in hand. And I think 0:12:00.880 --> 0:12:03.400 this is it's slightly veering off from where we are, 0:12:03.440 --> 0:12:05.640 but I think it's an important point to make. Is 0:12:06.080 --> 0:12:09.000 when I lived as a monk, we stopped identifying as 0:12:09.080 --> 0:12:13.400 men and women, and we were asked to identify as consciousness. 0:12:14.440 --> 0:12:19.760 And that distinction and difference just kind of created this 0:12:20.600 --> 0:12:23.360 huge like weight of my shoulders because now I was like, Oh, 0:12:23.400 --> 0:12:25.760 I'm not masculine or feminine, or I'm not this or that. 0:12:25.880 --> 0:12:29.160 I'm just I'm just I'm just consciousness. I'm a human, 0:12:29.200 --> 0:12:33.120 I'm a soul. Whatever, you want to call it, I'm energy, 0:12:33.200 --> 0:12:37.640 and that energy is wired for service, and so the 0:12:37.800 --> 0:12:40.120 energy inside each of us at this table is wired 0:12:40.200 --> 0:12:42.920 for service. So the way it connects is that we've 0:12:42.920 --> 0:12:46.720 been designed to serve. But unfortunately, and I've heard that 0:12:46.760 --> 0:12:50.160 a lot from women, is that often it turns into 0:12:50.200 --> 0:12:53.360 being a martyr or going to the point of self 0:12:53.400 --> 0:12:57.280 sacrifice and self sabotage because of how it's encouraged more 0:12:57.960 --> 0:13:01.400 and I was speaking at this event and a man 0:13:01.480 --> 0:13:03.160 came up to me. He was probably in his forties, 0:13:04.040 --> 0:13:06.520 and I had just told a story about how when 0:13:06.520 --> 0:13:09.280 I met the monks at eighteen, they shifted my perspective 0:13:09.520 --> 0:13:12.240 to service. And he said to me, he goes, You're 0:13:12.280 --> 0:13:14.720 so lucky that you got that at eighteen, and I 0:13:14.760 --> 0:13:16.520 was like, yeah, I no, trust me, Like I'm so 0:13:16.600 --> 0:13:18.480 grateful to my teachers. He goes, no, no, no, really, 0:13:18.520 --> 0:13:23.000 he goes, I only realized that someone else mattered when 0:13:23.000 --> 0:13:25.520 I had a child, And he was like, that's the 0:13:25.679 --> 0:13:28.640 only that was the first time I realized that someone 0:13:28.679 --> 0:13:32.960 apart from me mattered. And you know, he was obviously 0:13:32.960 --> 0:13:35.679 being really vulnerable, and I appreciated him sharing that, and 0:13:35.840 --> 0:13:37.800 I met it with compassion. But I think that's the 0:13:37.840 --> 0:13:40.160 case that for a lot of men that I don't 0:13:40.200 --> 0:13:44.040 think we're trained early on in our life to realize 0:13:44.120 --> 0:13:47.480 that not just to our kids matter or our partners matter, 0:13:47.520 --> 0:13:50.800 but everyone matters, and more people matter. Well, you're rewarded 0:13:50.800 --> 0:13:53.440 if you don't, right, like on the rugby team, you know, 0:13:53.480 --> 0:13:55.959 sort of the culture you're describing where you get rewarded 0:13:56.000 --> 0:13:59.280 if you are individualistic, competitive, and you know, have this 0:13:59.400 --> 0:14:03.120 kind of added to And again for women it's the opposite. 0:14:02.920 --> 0:14:05.600 We get heavily punished when we when we take on 0:14:05.640 --> 0:14:09.640 those characteristics. That's true. Yeah, but that ungendering is so interesting, right, 0:14:09.679 --> 0:14:14.040 that happened, and that surplus of energy that you felt 0:14:14.200 --> 0:14:17.079 is something that we could all access, right if we 0:14:17.080 --> 0:14:21.400 weren't weight down by these gender stereotypes. It's like the freedom, right. Yeah. 0:14:21.440 --> 0:14:24.720 So you're saying that you had sight, you had knowledge 0:14:24.760 --> 0:14:29.120 growing up by your mother, and you kind of held 0:14:29.120 --> 0:14:31.840 that to yourself. I gave it up because I saw 0:14:31.840 --> 0:14:34.160 it as less than So it's not even that I 0:14:34.240 --> 0:14:36.920 held it back. I gave it up and substituted it, 0:14:37.040 --> 0:14:40.800 traded it in for your man card, correct for this toxicity, 0:14:40.840 --> 0:14:43.480 which then obviously encouraged more people to go down that path. 0:14:44.240 --> 0:14:46.720 And then I think the best thing I've done to 0:14:46.800 --> 0:14:50.560 try and remove that is when I became a monk. 0:14:50.600 --> 0:14:52.400 I became the mentor to a lot of young men 0:14:52.400 --> 0:14:56.840 in London. And those young men are still involved in 0:14:56.880 --> 0:14:58.240 my life. So I've known them since they were like 0:14:58.280 --> 0:15:00.280 sixteen to eighteen years old. They were like twenty to 0:15:00.280 --> 0:15:03.280 twenty eight years old now, and so I feel like 0:15:03.400 --> 0:15:05.560 those twenty five guys, they know who they are, Like, 0:15:06.000 --> 0:15:10.640 those are like my favorite success story because those they 0:15:10.720 --> 0:15:13.160 I just see them make amazing decisions with their partners, 0:15:13.720 --> 0:15:16.720 their careers, Like they're all most of them in relationships now, 0:15:16.760 --> 0:15:19.640 and I see the husbands and the fathers they're becoming, 0:15:19.760 --> 0:15:22.400 and I mean it's it's you know, many of them 0:15:22.400 --> 0:15:25.359 become fathers before I am one, And it's just inspiring 0:15:25.400 --> 0:15:28.800 that they're also leading that way and showing me that 0:15:28.840 --> 0:15:31.360 people don't have to make as bad a mistakes or 0:15:31.440 --> 0:15:33.880 go as far as I did. Right, where do you go, 0:15:34.240 --> 0:15:36.120 like when you're struggling, you know, when you and your 0:15:36.160 --> 0:15:38.080 wife are having a fight, or if you ever have 0:15:38.080 --> 0:15:39.680 a fight. I don't know if you guys have fights, 0:15:40.960 --> 0:15:43.240 where do you go? And share that because you are 0:15:43.520 --> 0:15:47.000 you are a spiritual gurroof to millions of people now, 0:15:47.320 --> 0:15:49.640 right and in many ways, and so many people look 0:15:49.640 --> 0:15:51.200 to you for advice, But who do you go to? 0:15:51.280 --> 0:15:53.440 Where do you go when you need help? Yeah? So 0:15:54.080 --> 0:15:56.640 the first thing I'm going to address that they're arguing 0:15:56.720 --> 0:15:58.920 my wife, because I think that's such a good thing 0:15:58.960 --> 0:16:02.280 to talk about. This is what I find fascinating about 0:16:02.320 --> 0:16:05.600 the way humans are wired. And and I'll give an example. 0:16:05.680 --> 0:16:10.040 So my wife's been my first guest every year when 0:16:10.080 --> 0:16:11.960 we launched a new season other podcast. So she's been 0:16:11.960 --> 0:16:14.040 on the podcast three times, the guest we've had on 0:16:14.080 --> 0:16:16.560 the most. And every time we'll do like a one 0:16:16.600 --> 0:16:18.960 and a half hour episode of everything we struggled with 0:16:19.000 --> 0:16:21.520 that year, and so we talk about like the mistakes, 0:16:21.600 --> 0:16:24.880 the failures, the things that went wrong, and the number 0:16:24.880 --> 0:16:27.840 one comment will be relationship goals, and then I'm on 0:16:27.880 --> 0:16:30.160 comment will be couple goals. And what I found is 0:16:30.200 --> 0:16:36.280 that the human desire to be inspired and want someone 0:16:36.680 --> 0:16:42.040 to project perfection onto anyone is so strong that my 0:16:42.240 --> 0:16:44.720 honest comment back is always please listen to what we 0:16:44.800 --> 0:16:47.760 just said. Yeah, and I'm listening right like yeah, like 0:16:47.840 --> 0:16:50.160 and not in not listening in like, and I know 0:16:50.200 --> 0:16:52.720 you don't mean it's not in an attacking Please just 0:16:52.720 --> 0:16:54.880 listen to me. Like, I just told you that when 0:16:54.880 --> 0:16:57.280 I first started dating my wife, I thought she wanted 0:16:57.320 --> 0:16:58.960 to be wooed like in the movies of Hollywood, and 0:16:59.000 --> 0:17:00.920 I got it all wrong because I was doing all 0:17:00.920 --> 0:17:03.560 this flashy stuff and my wife's actually a simple person, 0:17:03.600 --> 0:17:05.400 did not want any of that. I just told you. 0:17:05.400 --> 0:17:08.520 You don't we have the same story. Yeah, yeah, we haven't. 0:17:08.560 --> 0:17:10.120 I didn't know that. I don't think. I don't think 0:17:10.119 --> 0:17:11.440 we had on a double day. We didn't talk about 0:17:11.480 --> 0:17:14.680 we did not talk about identical story. Really, yeah, keep going, 0:17:14.680 --> 0:17:17.199 please keep going. So so my point is being like, 0:17:17.280 --> 0:17:19.400 if I've just told you that, actually, for the first 0:17:19.400 --> 0:17:21.960 two years of our marriage, sorry two years of our relationship, 0:17:22.280 --> 0:17:26.239 we didn't understand each other. Don't just look at us 0:17:26.240 --> 0:17:28.000 and go like, oh, yeah, you guys got green eyes 0:17:28.000 --> 0:17:29.840 and they match, and so you match, and like, you know, 0:17:29.880 --> 0:17:31.879 it's there's just so much more to it. And I 0:17:31.920 --> 0:17:37.200 find that as humans, we so want people to be 0:17:37.280 --> 0:17:41.680 perfect that we create a pedestal even if someone's telling 0:17:41.720 --> 0:17:44.199 you the truth. And I think if we just sit 0:17:44.280 --> 0:17:46.960 and all listen to each other. Then a we won't 0:17:46.960 --> 0:17:48.800 be let down by people and be we won't put 0:17:48.800 --> 0:17:51.119 people on the pedestal. But but who do I go to? 0:17:51.240 --> 0:17:53.400 So the first thing I definitely turned to my texts, 0:17:54.000 --> 0:17:55.480 and I know we share this in common. But the 0:17:55.520 --> 0:17:59.840 bugod Geeta has has been such a companion and guided 0:17:59.880 --> 0:18:02.480 my life from so long since I was eighteen, that 0:18:02.600 --> 0:18:05.880 I turned to it all the time. My monk teacher 0:18:06.160 --> 0:18:10.720 who's now seventy years old, who you actually met, Yeah, 0:18:10.720 --> 0:18:12.640 when he came to my home, so you've you've met him, 0:18:13.119 --> 0:18:15.240 And he's now seventy years old. He grew up in 0:18:15.320 --> 0:18:18.400 Chicago and hitched hike to India at the age of nineteen. 0:18:19.480 --> 0:18:23.880 Stories insane, Yeah, he's And And so when I'm when 0:18:23.920 --> 0:18:26.080 I'm struggling with something in a major way, when it's 0:18:26.080 --> 0:18:28.840 like a real like like I feel like it's a 0:18:28.880 --> 0:18:30.879 tragedy at this point, then he's the person I go 0:18:30.960 --> 0:18:34.639 to because he always helps me see the reality and 0:18:34.680 --> 0:18:38.240 see the truth. Again, there's monks in between that journey, 0:18:38.240 --> 0:18:39.680 So he's like kind of at the top of the order. 0:18:39.720 --> 0:18:41.800 But then there's other ones that are more like older brothers, 0:18:41.800 --> 0:18:44.280 and I can be more vulnerable with them than I 0:18:44.280 --> 0:18:51.159 don't feel like. So you have monks, are like monks 0:18:51.240 --> 0:18:53.920 and they're there to help you, like just recalibrate, bring 0:18:53.920 --> 0:18:56.480 yourself to accounts. So for men who don't have monks 0:18:56.760 --> 0:18:59.920 one dial, what is what is your advice for that 0:19:00.200 --> 0:19:04.119 to do business in a more spiritual way. So spirituality 0:19:04.160 --> 0:19:07.000 and business is an interesting concept because a lot of 0:19:07.040 --> 0:19:11.720 people today see it as an oxymoron or you know, 0:19:12.119 --> 0:19:17.200 mutually exclusive. And the truth is that spirituality is so 0:19:17.240 --> 0:19:21.360 powerful that it actually spreads across everything. And I know 0:19:21.640 --> 0:19:25.240 all of you understand that, but it's like, if spirituality 0:19:25.280 --> 0:19:27.560 is what we all say it is, then it has 0:19:27.680 --> 0:19:32.359 the purity and the power to spread across anything. And 0:19:32.440 --> 0:19:35.440 again going back to our previous theme, the key element 0:19:36.240 --> 0:19:40.840 is is this for service of humanity for others or 0:19:40.960 --> 0:19:42.879 is this in the service of myself? Now that's a 0:19:42.920 --> 0:19:46.359 fine line, and I've been on the wrong side of 0:19:46.400 --> 0:19:49.000 that line plenty of times. So there's plenty of times 0:19:49.000 --> 0:19:51.600 when I assess options and opportunities in front of me 0:19:51.960 --> 0:19:54.440 and I realize I'm only taking that option because there's 0:19:54.480 --> 0:19:57.600 ego involved. I'm only taking that option because there's an 0:19:57.640 --> 0:19:59.960 opportunity or there's a big payout or there's a nice 0:20:00.640 --> 0:20:02.879 dollar sign next to it, and I'm only doing it 0:20:02.920 --> 0:20:05.280 for that. And I've said yes to stuff like that 0:20:05.680 --> 0:20:08.359 plenty of times to know that I'm not perfect. But 0:20:08.560 --> 0:20:12.320 the awareness is what I would encourage people to do 0:20:12.520 --> 0:20:15.320 is having the ability to be like, here are the 0:20:15.359 --> 0:20:18.080 three four options in my life right now, let me 0:20:18.119 --> 0:20:20.560 write a word above them, which is the intention of 0:20:20.560 --> 0:20:24.200 why I'm choosing that. And if the word isn't love 0:20:24.960 --> 0:20:28.280 or service, it's not going to feel good after over 0:20:28.359 --> 0:20:31.680 finish it. And so that's what I would encourage people 0:20:31.680 --> 0:20:34.400 to do as a reflection without needing anyone in their 0:20:34.440 --> 0:20:37.879 life or anyone around them. I love that. I love that. 0:20:37.920 --> 0:20:41.040 There's this quote. I don't know the quote exactly, but 0:20:42.119 --> 0:20:44.480 one of the central figures in the Behagh faith talks 0:20:44.520 --> 0:20:48.239 about abdul Baha that when you are suffering and when 0:20:48.280 --> 0:20:50.520 you are going through something and you cannot find a 0:20:50.560 --> 0:20:54.119 way out, to immediately go be of service to another. 0:20:55.000 --> 0:20:57.879 Because when you are service to others, you find that 0:20:57.960 --> 0:21:02.280 your own pains and things, um just dissipate through that. 0:21:02.560 --> 0:21:05.000 So when you talked about earlier about being wired for service, 0:21:06.240 --> 0:21:10.600 So while I think that also there are some people 0:21:10.680 --> 0:21:14.080 that are put into service toward two others, not to 0:21:14.160 --> 0:21:17.800 be of pure service, because they're forced to be put there. Um, 0:21:18.000 --> 0:21:23.080 women are some wives oftentimes unless we do something different. 0:21:23.359 --> 0:21:25.240 I have these conversations with Liz all the time. The 0:21:25.400 --> 0:21:28.040 service that I've always seen with women in my life, 0:21:28.160 --> 0:21:32.920 my mother, grandma, all of them, they it was, it was. 0:21:33.240 --> 0:21:35.400 There was a lot of sexism going on as well, 0:21:36.400 --> 0:21:41.439 not necessarily by my father, certainly, I want to I 0:21:41.480 --> 0:21:44.040 want to say no, but all of the stuff that 0:21:44.119 --> 0:21:46.560 was being experienced. So I think that this idea of 0:21:46.600 --> 0:21:50.600 service being elevated, but service being forced, how do we 0:21:50.840 --> 0:21:53.600 how do we really talk and how does service and 0:21:53.680 --> 0:21:57.959 cabitalism right like which feel at odds m How do 0:21:58.000 --> 0:22:00.920 you how do you reconcile that. Yeah, there's a beautiful 0:22:00.960 --> 0:22:04.399 statement by Peter Diamandis and he says that we should 0:22:04.440 --> 0:22:08.639 redefine the word billionaire to be someone who impacts the 0:22:08.680 --> 0:22:12.159 lives of a billion people. Now, whether you think of 0:22:12.240 --> 0:22:16.760 that from spirituality or from a money perspective, the wealthiest 0:22:16.800 --> 0:22:21.480 people in the world are creating something that services the 0:22:21.520 --> 0:22:25.359 most amount of people. And the scale of the problem 0:22:25.400 --> 0:22:28.560 you're solving and the depth of the issue is how 0:22:28.600 --> 0:22:31.200 much money you make. So if someone created a cure 0:22:31.240 --> 0:22:34.359 for cancer and was able to scale it across the world, 0:22:34.400 --> 0:22:36.960 they would probably be the wealthiest person on the planet 0:22:37.000 --> 0:22:41.640 because they created something out of service. Now you may say, well, Jay, 0:22:41.640 --> 0:22:44.200 well no, many people out of wanting the money will 0:22:44.240 --> 0:22:47.720 figure that out. I'd say that they may, but I'm 0:22:47.720 --> 0:22:50.480 hoping that on that journey they'll upgrade in their desire 0:22:50.520 --> 0:22:53.600 and their intention will be purified. And I think this 0:22:53.680 --> 0:22:55.880 was what I loved learning from the Barge Ghita, which 0:22:55.920 --> 0:23:00.320 was this idea of there is no pure intention. All 0:23:00.520 --> 0:23:06.560 intentions are percentages and divided. So when you first start something, 0:23:06.560 --> 0:23:09.200 you may have a seventy percent pure intention, but there's 0:23:09.200 --> 0:23:11.480 thirty percent of ego in that. Or when you start 0:23:11.480 --> 0:23:13.360 it's probably the other way around twenty five percent good 0:23:13.359 --> 0:23:16.560 intention then seventy five percent ego, but it's purified in 0:23:16.600 --> 0:23:19.560 the process. So even if you look at people who've 0:23:19.840 --> 0:23:22.080 set out their lives, and I work with many of them, 0:23:22.200 --> 0:23:23.840 who set out at the beginning of their lives to 0:23:23.880 --> 0:23:26.919 become wealthy and famous. When they became wealthy and famous, 0:23:26.960 --> 0:23:29.040 they then realized that wasn't the point, and they were 0:23:29.080 --> 0:23:33.359 purified in the process of achieving their goal. And so 0:23:33.640 --> 0:23:35.920 the way I think about it is that in a 0:23:36.040 --> 0:23:42.080 capitalist society, even the people that are succeeding are succeeding 0:23:42.119 --> 0:23:45.000 because of service, whether it's conscious or not conscious, whether 0:23:45.000 --> 0:23:48.359 it's intentional or unintentional, there's still only like Amazon is 0:23:48.400 --> 0:23:52.000 successful because we all want its service, Like we want 0:23:52.040 --> 0:23:55.560 to be served by Amazon, right, And I'm not promoting 0:23:55.640 --> 0:23:57.760 or deep promoting Amazon. I'm just making the point that 0:23:58.320 --> 0:24:01.800 because it serves a daily need for the majority of 0:24:01.800 --> 0:24:05.960 the population, they are financially successful because of it. Does 0:24:05.960 --> 0:24:08.399 that make senseless? I don't know if I'm answering your question. Well, 0:24:08.480 --> 0:24:09.960 and I want to and I see your face, so 0:24:09.960 --> 0:24:12.359 I'm like, I want to, well, because I feel like 0:24:12.440 --> 0:24:16.720 it doesn't purify like Jeff Bezos. Actually, I don't care 0:24:16.760 --> 0:24:20.199 about pissing off Jeff Bezos doing it with love. Um, 0:24:20.400 --> 0:24:23.439 you know, Jeff Bezos, I don't think. I don't I 0:24:23.480 --> 0:24:26.200 don't have any evidence that he was purified by becoming 0:24:26.240 --> 0:24:28.560 a billionaire, Like he still has twenty eight bathrooms, but 0:24:28.600 --> 0:24:32.320 then he's preventing his workers from unionizing, right, So like, yeah, 0:24:32.440 --> 0:24:36.840 I guess I'm still wondering how to reconcile those things. 0:24:36.880 --> 0:24:40.920 And we've talked about the intersection of masculinity and risk 0:24:41.920 --> 0:24:44.520 about how you know, women are willing to take big 0:24:44.600 --> 0:24:47.600 risks when it comes to redistribution, when it comes to 0:24:47.640 --> 0:24:50.280 more taxation, when it comes to the environment, and it's 0:24:50.280 --> 0:24:55.760 actually men who and particularly white men. Sorry that I'm 0:24:55.840 --> 0:24:59.400 just talking. I'm just speaking the data. It's particularly white 0:24:59.440 --> 0:25:02.280 men because yeah, the ten most wealthy of those people 0:25:02.359 --> 0:25:04.560 are are white men. Um, you know, they have the 0:25:04.600 --> 0:25:07.080 most to lose. So I think about that all the time, 0:25:07.240 --> 0:25:09.560 you know, I and I you know, I'm bringing this 0:25:09.600 --> 0:25:11.840 up because it's something that that I grapple with. Yeah, 0:25:11.960 --> 0:25:15.359 where I feel like my heart is in the right place, 0:25:15.400 --> 0:25:18.400 and I've known when it's not, or when I've done 0:25:18.400 --> 0:25:20.879 something I'm like, this was not for the right reason. 0:25:21.320 --> 0:25:24.200 But yeah, how do we do how do we reconcile 0:25:24.200 --> 0:25:28.200 those things? I think? And yeah, whether anyone's been purified 0:25:28.320 --> 0:25:30.280 or not, and where their journey of life goes, well, 0:25:30.320 --> 0:25:34.000 we'll find out, right with everyone. I really believe that 0:25:34.560 --> 0:25:38.520 everyone's on this recurring journey of life and it's all 0:25:38.520 --> 0:25:41.120 to get people to realize that service is the only goal. 0:25:41.920 --> 0:25:45.359 And we kind of have to keep having life experiences 0:25:45.400 --> 0:25:47.960 and failures and shortcomings and issues and everything going wrong 0:25:48.000 --> 0:25:50.240 to only remind you of that and that being the 0:25:50.280 --> 0:25:55.280 only satisfying thing. The way you reconcile it is only 0:25:55.320 --> 0:25:58.400 through stillness and solitude. Like if you don't spend enough 0:25:58.440 --> 0:26:02.720 time alone every day and try to hear yourself and 0:26:02.840 --> 0:26:06.200 try to hear the words of your spiritual teachers, guides texts, 0:26:07.040 --> 0:26:09.280 then you are only going to hear the noise from 0:26:09.440 --> 0:26:11.879 society outside, and that's what you'll end up following. Or 0:26:11.920 --> 0:26:13.879 if you're switching off the noise to listen to a 0:26:13.960 --> 0:26:17.320 podcast like this and all the other episodes that I've seen, 0:26:17.400 --> 0:26:19.399 the guests you've had on, and the types of conversations 0:26:19.400 --> 0:26:23.320 you're having on, you're all performing a service. And by 0:26:23.359 --> 0:26:26.920 the way, everyone who's listening is also serving by learning, 0:26:27.359 --> 0:26:29.679 So it's not only the giver that is serving, the 0:26:29.760 --> 0:26:32.760 receiver is also serving. I think the bigger challenge is 0:26:32.800 --> 0:26:39.800 also that we've just lacked examples of that, And so 0:26:40.400 --> 0:26:42.840 to me, it's like I would be traveling with one 0:26:42.840 --> 0:26:45.560 of our senior monk leaders. You know this gentleman seventy 0:26:45.640 --> 0:26:50.520 years old. I'm like twenty one years old and every 0:26:50.600 --> 0:26:54.040 day we'd wake up in the morning and he would 0:26:54.560 --> 0:26:58.080 bow down before me on the floor to honor the 0:26:58.200 --> 0:27:01.520 soul that's within my heart. And I would do the 0:27:01.600 --> 0:27:04.280 same bag, but he would always beat me to it, 0:27:04.320 --> 0:27:06.879 and there was no one watching. There were no fanfare, 0:27:06.920 --> 0:27:08.560 there was no audience, there was no one to do 0:27:08.560 --> 0:27:11.719 it for. I wasn't Jay shed like. I was just 0:27:11.760 --> 0:27:15.440 a kid who's twenty one years old, And that's how 0:27:15.720 --> 0:27:17.760 we were taught to behave with each other with that 0:27:17.880 --> 0:27:19.720 much level of respect. Now, he would have done that 0:27:19.760 --> 0:27:22.119 with anyone in the room. So the reason I'm sharing 0:27:22.160 --> 0:27:27.200 that is, like, when I experienced that level of masculine 0:27:27.280 --> 0:27:28.959 or whatever you want to call that, Like, you know, 0:27:29.000 --> 0:27:32.639 if when I experienced that, it gave me faith that 0:27:32.720 --> 0:27:36.479 a man could be extremely powerful by being extremely humble, 0:27:37.040 --> 0:27:40.440 that a man could be extremely could penetrate my heart 0:27:40.480 --> 0:27:43.840 by being really kind and caring and compassionate. But if 0:27:43.840 --> 0:27:47.200 you've never experienced that, how are you to believe that 0:27:47.200 --> 0:27:50.000 that's possible? Yeah, I think the first step is to 0:27:50.119 --> 0:27:53.000 seek and find. Like, I think it's hard to tell 0:27:53.040 --> 0:27:57.040 anyone to the formula for how to navigate that without 0:27:57.119 --> 0:28:00.560 them finding a purpose that is bigger than themselves. Yeah, 0:28:00.560 --> 0:28:04.920 like it's hard for anyone to navigate life. Sometimes your purpose, 0:28:04.960 --> 0:28:07.480 bigger than yourself becomes your family and your love for 0:28:07.520 --> 0:28:09.960 your family, and that's as far and wide as your 0:28:10.000 --> 0:28:12.639 mind wants to go. And that's beautiful. And for some 0:28:12.680 --> 0:28:14.720 people it becomes the world, and for some people becomes 0:28:14.720 --> 0:28:18.400 their town and their city. But everyone has to have something, 0:28:18.440 --> 0:28:21.119 you know, those beautiful words of Martin Luther, King of 0:28:21.560 --> 0:28:22.879 You know, if you have nothing to die for, you 0:28:22.880 --> 0:28:26.240 have nothing to live for. Like that to me is 0:28:26.720 --> 0:28:29.800 the clear purpose of life where we have to seek 0:28:29.800 --> 0:28:32.479 out what it is that we really care about and 0:28:32.480 --> 0:28:34.920 what we really believe in. And that can be your family. 0:28:35.320 --> 0:28:37.119 That's totally fine. Like this doesn't have to be like 0:28:37.160 --> 0:28:39.120 a I'm going to become an activist and change the 0:28:39.160 --> 0:28:44.160 world conversation. This is I care about the quality of 0:28:44.240 --> 0:28:48.880 life my family has, but I think about quality based 0:28:48.920 --> 0:28:51.160 on the depth of their experience of life, not just 0:28:51.240 --> 0:28:55.760 what they have. And I'm going to live my life 0:28:55.840 --> 0:28:58.200 or try and live my life in that way. And 0:28:58.280 --> 0:29:03.520 so to me, the first step is to seek mentors, coaches, guides, guidance. 0:29:03.600 --> 0:29:06.120 It has to be it always is. I had the 0:29:06.160 --> 0:29:10.040 fortune of interviewing Walter Isaacson. He's famously known to write 0:29:10.080 --> 0:29:13.680 the biographies of the biggest icons of all time. So 0:29:13.720 --> 0:29:17.280 he wrote the official biography of Leonardo da Vinci, Einstein, 0:29:17.840 --> 0:29:20.800 Steve Jobs like you know, just it's insane. And he 0:29:20.880 --> 0:29:24.960 worked at CNN and Time before that. And he wrote 0:29:25.000 --> 0:29:28.520 a new book about a lady named Jennifer Dowdner who 0:29:29.160 --> 0:29:34.760 is the founder of gene editing. Now. She's a female 0:29:34.760 --> 0:29:38.640 scientist who was told by her school teachers that women 0:29:38.680 --> 0:29:41.960 don't become scientists, right like women's can't be scientists. She 0:29:42.080 --> 0:29:46.800 just won the Nobel Prize for her discovery, so amazing, 0:29:46.840 --> 0:29:48.479 and he just wrote a book about her life. It's 0:29:48.520 --> 0:29:51.520 called Codebreaker. The reason why I'm sharing all of that 0:29:51.760 --> 0:29:55.560 is that some girls going to pick up that book, 0:29:55.640 --> 0:29:58.040 or guy both or anyone or they are going to 0:29:58.120 --> 0:30:01.000 pick up that book and they are going to find 0:30:01.200 --> 0:30:05.240 their role model in that book. We all find we 0:30:05.320 --> 0:30:07.000 may not have a monk on speed Dow we may 0:30:07.040 --> 0:30:08.720 not have met a monk when you're eighteen, but you're 0:30:08.800 --> 0:30:11.720 going to find when you start searching and looking, and 0:30:11.760 --> 0:30:13.640 when you find that, you're going to read it, You're 0:30:13.640 --> 0:30:15.760 going to internalize it. And it's going to change how 0:30:15.800 --> 0:30:18.560 you think. And I just feel that encouraging people to 0:30:18.720 --> 0:30:22.440 find coaches, guides, and mentors is the best thing I 0:30:22.440 --> 0:30:25.680 can do, because there's no one we admire that doesn't 0:30:25.720 --> 0:30:29.280 have that. Whether they're an athlete, whether they're a singer, 0:30:29.320 --> 0:30:32.320 whether they're a musician, whether they're a videographer or editor. 0:30:32.640 --> 0:30:35.600 Everyone's had mentors, guides, and coaches, but it's become so 0:30:36.480 --> 0:30:39.800 far removed from our lives today that everyone thinks they 0:30:39.840 --> 0:30:41.640 have to figure out for themselves, and that's where the 0:30:41.720 --> 0:30:44.440 mess is created from. It sounds like an obvious point, 0:30:44.520 --> 0:30:46.880 but it's almost like we obviously haven't pushed it enough. 0:30:47.440 --> 0:30:50.000 Because as a man, to take another person as your 0:30:50.040 --> 0:30:53.440 mentor also requires you to have humility. You've got to 0:30:53.480 --> 0:30:56.240 forgive yourself, You've got to be compassionate to yourself. So 0:30:56.280 --> 0:31:01.040 the simple act of taking on a mentor actually does 0:31:01.120 --> 0:31:04.680 more for your masculinity than anything else. And also being 0:31:04.720 --> 0:31:09.200 a mentor, yes, right, you reach, you reach a place 0:31:10.240 --> 0:31:12.640 and you have your success or you have achieved something, 0:31:12.680 --> 0:31:15.920 and then being of service to that person who's sending 0:31:15.920 --> 0:31:18.280 the elevator back down. But it's the biggest, it's the 0:31:18.320 --> 0:31:20.200 biggest myth of masculinity that we have to do it 0:31:20.240 --> 0:31:22.440 by ourselves. Yes, like that. We you know that we 0:31:22.480 --> 0:31:24.080 can't ask for help, We can't ask for guidance, We 0:31:24.080 --> 0:31:27.240 can't ask for those things. Yeah. Yeah, I want to 0:31:27.240 --> 0:31:31.240 ask you something real quick, Jay, because because I don't 0:31:31.280 --> 0:31:34.440 know how you do it. And social media, I want 0:31:34.440 --> 0:31:37.560 to talk about social media for a second. We talked 0:31:37.600 --> 0:31:40.160 about a little bit when I joined your podcast, But 0:31:42.040 --> 0:31:44.040 we know what social media in many ways does to 0:31:44.080 --> 0:31:46.520 our brains. We get dopamine hits left and right, much 0:31:46.560 --> 0:31:49.479 more than you know we ever have in human history, 0:31:49.720 --> 0:31:53.680 like dislike, followers, comments, all of which are contributing, I 0:31:53.720 --> 0:31:59.040 think to a different kind of pandemic, which is like 0:31:59.200 --> 0:32:02.960 extremely low self worth, seeking external validation, and everybody wanting 0:32:02.960 --> 0:32:07.240 to become the center of attention, an influencer, to have influence. 0:32:08.000 --> 0:32:10.280 And then you mix in like what's becoming trendy or 0:32:10.320 --> 0:32:13.800 popular or woke in culture, and then you have service, right, 0:32:14.120 --> 0:32:17.080 and these lines get very blurred, like I've struggle like 0:32:17.120 --> 0:32:18.920 do I post that? Doing not post that? Like oh 0:32:18.920 --> 0:32:20.520 that didn't get as many likes? And I still have 0:32:20.600 --> 0:32:24.320 those thoughts, And I just imagine fifteen year olds and 0:32:24.320 --> 0:32:26.240 twelve year olds now that are getting social media and 0:32:26.280 --> 0:32:28.080 all of these things. And I remember watching this, like 0:32:28.240 --> 0:32:30.000 I swear she was eight years old. She was doing 0:32:30.160 --> 0:32:33.720 she was by herself in a CVS doing a TikTok, 0:32:33.920 --> 0:32:35.840 holding the phone by herself, and I was really confused. 0:32:35.840 --> 0:32:38.000 And I looked at that and my heartbroke just thinking 0:32:38.000 --> 0:32:42.400 about the performative aspect of what social media does. How 0:32:43.360 --> 0:32:50.320 have you stayed above water? How have you not been affected? 0:32:50.560 --> 0:32:53.160 Or are you ever affected? And I guess that's my 0:32:53.240 --> 0:32:55.480 question is are you also affected by if something doesn't 0:32:55.480 --> 0:32:57.160 have a lot of likes or if a podcast doesn't 0:32:57.160 --> 0:32:59.600 have a lot of downloads. Because you seem impermeable in 0:32:59.640 --> 0:33:02.040 that way, like you have the teachings. You're so rooted 0:33:02.040 --> 0:33:03.960 in the teachings and in your meditation and your practice 0:33:04.480 --> 0:33:06.600 that it's like if you're not shaken by the outside world, 0:33:06.640 --> 0:33:09.920 but you're teaching people this wisdom, this ancient wisdom, but 0:33:10.000 --> 0:33:11.640 yet you're doing it from the swamp. How do you 0:33:11.680 --> 0:33:14.160 stay out of it? And do you struggle? Ever? You 0:33:14.280 --> 0:33:17.200 fall in and you fall in again all the time. 0:33:17.560 --> 0:33:21.560 Social media was my last resort to try and share 0:33:21.560 --> 0:33:24.960 a message that I deeply believe the world needed and 0:33:25.000 --> 0:33:26.480 so if I had it my way, I would never 0:33:26.520 --> 0:33:28.640 have taken to social media. I would have done it 0:33:28.640 --> 0:33:31.280 through one of these official channels that wouldn't give me 0:33:31.320 --> 0:33:34.360 a chance. And I think people don't think that. People think, oh, yeah, 0:33:34.360 --> 0:33:35.880 you joined social media because you want to get it. 0:33:36.120 --> 0:33:38.200 It's like I joined social media because I didn't know 0:33:38.280 --> 0:33:41.400 any other way to spread the message. So going back 0:33:41.400 --> 0:33:45.160 to mistakes on social media or failures, I've fallen into 0:33:45.200 --> 0:33:46.880 it so many times that I fall into on a 0:33:46.960 --> 0:33:51.400 daily basis. If your life revolves around serving through social media, 0:33:51.560 --> 0:33:56.200 you have to become phenomenal at social media strategy. It's 0:33:56.320 --> 0:34:00.000 you can't separate the two. You have to The problem 0:34:00.120 --> 0:34:05.280 is when the strategy overtakes the sincerity. The problem is 0:34:05.280 --> 0:34:09.719 when the strategy overtakes the creativity or overshadows the creativity. 0:34:09.920 --> 0:34:12.360 The problem is when the strategy just becomes a game 0:34:13.080 --> 0:34:15.560 and now you're just living in this fake world you've created. 0:34:15.840 --> 0:34:17.600 And that's the problem. When you just look at the 0:34:17.640 --> 0:34:20.200 likes and you don't look at the comments, when you 0:34:20.239 --> 0:34:23.160 look at the views, but you don't look at the engagement. 0:34:23.200 --> 0:34:25.239 And when I say engagement, I mean the depth of it. 0:34:25.560 --> 0:34:28.200 What are people saying, how are they feeling? That's what 0:34:28.480 --> 0:34:31.320 humanizes it again for me. So that's what I'm holding 0:34:31.360 --> 0:34:34.719 onto is the humanizing of it, of seeing like, how 0:34:34.800 --> 0:34:38.520 is this genuinely having a human impact not a data impact. 0:34:38.960 --> 0:34:41.759 And I think that's where our mindset is strategist versus 0:34:41.760 --> 0:34:45.800 spiritualist goes is. As a strategist, you're meant to think data, 0:34:45.960 --> 0:34:49.040 but as a spiritualist you're meant to think depth, and 0:34:49.080 --> 0:34:53.239 so you can't let data overshadow depth. And what I 0:34:53.400 --> 0:34:56.960 love about algorithms is that they always keep you humble. 0:34:58.040 --> 0:35:01.279 You will never beat the algorithm. It will always keep 0:35:01.320 --> 0:35:04.920 you humble. So if you're actually doing it for likes 0:35:05.080 --> 0:35:08.640 and love and hearts, you will give up. But if 0:35:08.680 --> 0:35:10.680 you're doing it because you just want to find what 0:35:10.880 --> 0:35:14.200 is going to connect with people, what is going to resonate, 0:35:14.200 --> 0:35:17.080 what is going to cut through, then that's something that 0:35:17.080 --> 0:35:19.320 will keep you humble in the process of it, because 0:35:19.320 --> 0:35:22.880 you'll never win. You've been able to separate how a 0:35:22.960 --> 0:35:26.920 video does or performs from your own self worth, oh 0:35:26.960 --> 0:35:29.600 for sure. And I think that is really kind of 0:35:29.640 --> 0:35:32.320 the key and the question for when that TikTok or 0:35:32.360 --> 0:35:37.120 the Instagram video turns off, they're left with themselves. Yeah, 0:35:37.480 --> 0:35:38.920 and you know, one of the things you teach us 0:35:38.960 --> 0:35:40.600 being with yourself. But if they don't know how to 0:35:40.640 --> 0:35:43.000 be with theirselves, so I guess this is this is 0:35:43.000 --> 0:35:46.680 an opportunity. I'm asking you to talk to them. If 0:35:46.920 --> 0:35:50.560 someone's listening right now, who's struggling with that, because I 0:35:50.600 --> 0:35:52.920 have struggled with it, especially from a service perspective, like 0:35:52.960 --> 0:35:54.400 I'm here to be of service. Why am I making 0:35:54.440 --> 0:35:56.600 this about? Why do I care? Why should I care? 0:35:56.840 --> 0:35:59.680 I don't care? Do I care? I do care? I 0:35:59.719 --> 0:36:01.719 care too much? No, I didn't get you know. And 0:36:01.760 --> 0:36:03.480 it's like, should I post that? No, But this is 0:36:03.520 --> 0:36:05.120 my platform. I want to post whatever I want. I 0:36:05.120 --> 0:36:06.840 want to post the picture of the sunset, but no 0:36:06.840 --> 0:36:08.920 one's gonna like the picture of the sunset, justin to 0:36:09.040 --> 0:36:12.560 post something. And I've had these conversations with myself and 0:36:12.560 --> 0:36:14.680 the fact that I'm having them drive me crazy. And 0:36:14.719 --> 0:36:16.319 you just strike me as somebody who doesn't have them 0:36:16.320 --> 0:36:18.919 as much. And maybe that's because you have a sense 0:36:18.960 --> 0:36:23.280 of self. A practical answer is all the work goes 0:36:23.760 --> 0:36:27.759 in thinking about something up front. So when you set 0:36:27.760 --> 0:36:29.759 your intention, when you're creating a piece of content. So 0:36:30.000 --> 0:36:33.880 my books the biggest, deepest, most meaningful thing I put 0:36:33.920 --> 0:36:38.000 out in the world, in my opinion, And I spent 0:36:38.080 --> 0:36:42.040 a lot of time writing it, researching it, thinking about 0:36:42.040 --> 0:36:44.520 the every day you were on a mission three four 0:36:44.520 --> 0:36:47.000 hours a day, you were literally yeah, yeah, and we 0:36:47.600 --> 0:36:49.759 I knew that I wanted science in it, and I 0:36:49.760 --> 0:36:51.879 wanted monk research in it, and so I had had 0:36:51.920 --> 0:36:55.680 monks resetting, I had a scientific research ye Like. It 0:36:55.719 --> 0:36:58.640 was a real team project to get it to be 0:36:58.680 --> 0:37:02.680 what I wanted it to be. And I put in 0:37:02.920 --> 0:37:06.399 all the work up front because my intention was if 0:37:06.440 --> 0:37:10.040 you create something with the love, with the service, with 0:37:10.200 --> 0:37:13.160 the intention of that, then that's what people are going 0:37:13.200 --> 0:37:15.719 to feel. Whereas if I create it with the intention 0:37:15.760 --> 0:37:19.239 of going viral or which would you can't actually do 0:37:19.360 --> 0:37:24.080 because viral, by nature and by what it is, means 0:37:24.120 --> 0:37:27.080 that you can't predict it like people can do that. 0:37:28.360 --> 0:37:31.399 People decide that with the book. If you're obsessed with 0:37:32.000 --> 0:37:35.960 X result, it ruins the process. So for me, when 0:37:35.960 --> 0:37:38.880 I'm in the process, I really shut my windows and 0:37:38.920 --> 0:37:41.239 I close the doors, and I'm like, this process has 0:37:41.320 --> 0:37:44.600 to be as pure as possible, as possible, as possible. 0:37:44.719 --> 0:37:46.359 So it's not one hundred percent, but it's as good 0:37:46.360 --> 0:37:50.000 as it can get. And when we look at and 0:37:50.120 --> 0:37:51.800 you know, when we talk about how do we share 0:37:51.840 --> 0:37:54.759 this with the world, let's also make the process really good. 0:37:54.760 --> 0:37:56.479 Are we sharing in the right places? Are we getting 0:37:56.520 --> 0:37:59.359 it right? And then when you share it, you know 0:37:59.440 --> 0:38:02.880 that you've done everything you possibly could to make it worthwhile, 0:38:03.560 --> 0:38:06.000 and if it doesn't work, you can take that because 0:38:06.000 --> 0:38:08.680 you've done everything. The problem is when you put something 0:38:08.680 --> 0:38:11.279 out with the desire of, oh, it's going to do great. 0:38:11.320 --> 0:38:14.200 I know, I'm masterminded this, it's perfect, and then it 0:38:14.239 --> 0:38:16.560 doesn't do well, then it affects you. Whereas when you've 0:38:16.560 --> 0:38:18.799 built all your self worth in the process of that. 0:38:19.200 --> 0:38:23.279 And so I sent my publishers an email and I'm 0:38:23.280 --> 0:38:25.120 saying this because I'm proud of myself doing this, and 0:38:25.160 --> 0:38:27.440 I'm going to say that here. I send them an 0:38:27.440 --> 0:38:29.279 email the day before the book came out and we 0:38:29.280 --> 0:38:30.839 had no idea what was going to happen or anything, 0:38:30.880 --> 0:38:32.080 and I said, I just want to thank you for 0:38:32.120 --> 0:38:34.120 this process. It's been the best process I've ever had. 0:38:34.440 --> 0:38:37.839 I love you guys. It's been amazing. It's You've been 0:38:37.880 --> 0:38:39.560 the best team I've ever worked with that I really 0:38:39.600 --> 0:38:42.720 appreciate you, from the editor down to the fact checker, 0:38:42.760 --> 0:38:44.600 down to this whatever, everyone on the team, and I 0:38:44.640 --> 0:38:46.000 just want you to know I'm already proud of what 0:38:46.000 --> 0:38:49.080 we've achieved. And I send that email after them, and 0:38:49.200 --> 0:38:50.839 I remember the president of the company that I work 0:38:50.880 --> 0:38:52.480 with he replied to me, because Jay, we never get 0:38:52.480 --> 0:38:54.480 one of these emails the day before the book comes out. 0:38:54.800 --> 0:38:56.640 It was like, we always get this if the book 0:38:56.680 --> 0:38:58.000 does well or whatever. And I was like, no, I 0:38:58.040 --> 0:39:01.160 genuinely feel so proud of what we've achieved already. Whatever 0:39:01.200 --> 0:39:03.920 happens happens. I had my UK publisher tell me, Jay, 0:39:04.000 --> 0:39:05.600 you know what, we're probably not going to hit number 0:39:05.680 --> 0:39:09.319 one on the Sunday Times in the UK because you 0:39:09.360 --> 0:39:11.239 know there's some big hitters in the UK coming out 0:39:11.280 --> 0:39:12.920 this week. Are you okay with it? I was like, dude, 0:39:13.080 --> 0:39:15.480 I have written the best book I possibly could. We've 0:39:15.520 --> 0:39:17.960 done the best launch that I probably could have done. 0:39:18.000 --> 0:39:19.920 I couldn't have done anymore. I'm good, like whatever, I 0:39:19.960 --> 0:39:23.000 don't care. And it's like, to me, that's the only 0:39:23.040 --> 0:39:25.359 way to not care is that you put all your 0:39:25.400 --> 0:39:28.560 heart into the creation. So that's the practical answer, the 0:39:28.600 --> 0:39:35.600 philosophical answer, and the more spiritual answer is I'm flawed. 0:39:36.760 --> 0:39:39.480 I do seek validation in what people think of me. 0:39:40.480 --> 0:39:44.200 I do get upset if someone doesn't like my videos 0:39:44.200 --> 0:39:47.600 and like someone else's. And I forgive myself. I'm compassionate, 0:39:47.600 --> 0:39:51.080 and I start over again. That's just the real answer, Like, 0:39:51.480 --> 0:39:54.680 that's just the truth. I mess up, I fall down. 0:39:55.239 --> 0:39:58.640 I get that I'm I do get worried about, Oh, well, 0:39:58.640 --> 0:40:01.319 will I be relevant next year? Oh? I do get 0:40:01.360 --> 0:40:03.759 worried about, like, oh will people care about me? I 0:40:03.800 --> 0:40:05.680 do get worried about like have I said anything good 0:40:05.680 --> 0:40:07.960 on this podcast right now? Like? Is there anything that 0:40:08.000 --> 0:40:10.680 I've said that is actually even worth this podcast? I 0:40:10.680 --> 0:40:13.040 do think about that, like every time I think about it, 0:40:13.080 --> 0:40:15.600 every time I record a solo episode of my podcast, 0:40:17.120 --> 0:40:18.400 and I think about it all the time. But what 0:40:18.440 --> 0:40:21.759 do I do I allow myself to feel that, I 0:40:21.760 --> 0:40:25.720 allow myself to experience it. I forgive myself for judging myself, 0:40:25.800 --> 0:40:28.560 and then I start again, and I start every day 0:40:28.600 --> 0:40:31.520 as if it was new. And my wife and I 0:40:31.560 --> 0:40:33.600 have this amazing ability we both have. It is that 0:40:33.640 --> 0:40:35.480 we can go to sleep, forget the night before, and 0:40:35.520 --> 0:40:37.920 start again, and I think my memory literally does that. 0:40:38.200 --> 0:40:41.040 I erase all of my failures and mistakes from the 0:40:41.080 --> 0:40:43.160 day before and just start afresh every day, because it's 0:40:43.200 --> 0:40:46.440 the only way I know to allow myself to have 0:40:46.480 --> 0:40:49.680 another go at it. Just the idea of allowing yourself 0:40:49.719 --> 0:40:52.520 to have some compassion for yourself. And I think everyone 0:40:52.520 --> 0:40:55.440 who's sitting out there who's judging themselves accept that you 0:40:55.520 --> 0:40:59.560 judge yourself, be compassionate, but then seek to redirect that energy. 0:41:00.080 --> 0:41:04.560 Whatever table you're at and whoever's at that table is 0:41:04.600 --> 0:41:07.839 what you judge yourself by. So when we heard that 0:41:07.880 --> 0:41:11.839 famous quote of you are the average of the five 0:41:11.880 --> 0:41:14.520 people you spend the most time with, actually what the 0:41:14.520 --> 0:41:17.600 truth is, your values become the average of the five 0:41:17.640 --> 0:41:20.920 people and their values. I love that. When we talked 0:41:21.120 --> 0:41:23.799 you and I did like a pandemic check in with 0:41:23.840 --> 0:41:26.160 like a man enough kind of check in, and you 0:41:26.200 --> 0:41:29.719 had admitted that you were addicted to video games for 0:41:29.719 --> 0:41:32.520 a little bit. I was, and and that was big 0:41:32.520 --> 0:41:34.800 In the book, I talked about, you know, an ongoing 0:41:34.840 --> 0:41:36.840 struggle I've had with porn since I was you know, 0:41:36.880 --> 0:41:39.319 a kid, and and you said it caught you by 0:41:39.360 --> 0:41:42.799 surprise that you were addicted. You found yourself like, you know, 0:41:43.000 --> 0:41:45.839 taking all of this emotion and just playing video games 0:41:45.840 --> 0:41:48.560 and hours would pass by. Yeah, I'm curious which one. 0:41:48.600 --> 0:41:54.400 By the way, So FIFA, NBA two K, two K 0:41:54.520 --> 0:41:59.120 twenty one now I have and Assassin's Creed. It's is 0:41:59.239 --> 0:42:04.680 really mess Wait wait an playing Assassin's Creed. Yes, yes, 0:42:05.440 --> 0:42:07.520 so I'm curious how bad did it get and what 0:42:07.640 --> 0:42:09.760 pulled you out or or is that still an ongoing 0:42:09.840 --> 0:42:12.000 thing that you're you're just struggling with a little bit, 0:42:12.320 --> 0:42:14.719 or is it a you know, oh my gosh. So yeah, 0:42:15.080 --> 0:42:17.359 we just found out as the pandemic, I realized we 0:42:17.360 --> 0:42:18.920 were going to be stuck indoors. I thought maybe this 0:42:18.960 --> 0:42:20.920 is gonna be last a month, That's what I thought. 0:42:21.560 --> 0:42:25.600 And I was like, all right, well, what am I 0:42:25.600 --> 0:42:27.279 going to do with this time? Like a lot of 0:42:27.280 --> 0:42:29.399 things were getting canceled at the time and things like that, 0:42:30.160 --> 0:42:32.439 and we had a friends staying my wife's friends staying 0:42:32.480 --> 0:42:34.759 with us, so they would always be spending time together 0:42:34.800 --> 0:42:36.239 and everything. So I was pretty much on my own 0:42:36.719 --> 0:42:40.759 and instead of meditating more or reading more, I ordered 0:42:40.760 --> 0:42:43.839 a PlayStation, which, by the way, I hadn't played video 0:42:43.840 --> 0:42:46.799 games for ten years, like I just hadn't. I hadn't 0:42:46.800 --> 0:42:50.359 watch TV religious like properly, like watch the series on TV. 0:42:50.400 --> 0:42:52.360 I'd watched movies. I love movies. I dodn't watch a 0:42:52.400 --> 0:42:54.839 TV show for like ten years, but I literally would 0:42:54.840 --> 0:42:57.360 sit there and play how was an? How was it? 0:42:57.480 --> 0:43:00.440 Video games? And I think I didn't stop playing for 0:43:00.480 --> 0:43:03.040 like it took like three to four weeks before I 0:43:03.080 --> 0:43:05.280 realized that I'd been playing video games for eight hours 0:43:05.320 --> 0:43:10.400 a day, eight hours time was wasted. All of I 0:43:10.840 --> 0:43:13.200 thought I was dealing well with what was going on, 0:43:13.320 --> 0:43:16.240 but actually I was just using that as my escape 0:43:16.280 --> 0:43:20.200 to what was actually happening in the world. And I 0:43:20.239 --> 0:43:22.920 know it sounds stupid. It's like our video games, but 0:43:22.920 --> 0:43:24.600 it's not. It's terrible. I mean when I would play 0:43:24.600 --> 0:43:27.000 Assassin's Creed, I would walk out there. My wife was 0:43:27.040 --> 0:43:29.120 just like, you look like you've just exited a war. 0:43:29.239 --> 0:43:31.480 Are you okay? Like she would literally look at me, 0:43:31.560 --> 0:43:34.800 like our camera crews laughing, they're like, oh, I feel that. 0:43:34.880 --> 0:43:37.200 She was literally like are you Like she would see 0:43:37.239 --> 0:43:38.800 me come out of the room. I'd come out of 0:43:38.800 --> 0:43:40.799 the cave of like, She's like, are you like? I 0:43:40.800 --> 0:43:42.919 don't think that game's good for you, Like I don't 0:43:42.920 --> 0:43:45.640 think that game's good for your energy. And it was 0:43:45.680 --> 0:43:47.560 like three to four weeks in where I realized I 0:43:47.640 --> 0:43:49.759 was like, God, the world suffering right now, Like I 0:43:49.800 --> 0:43:52.799 should be serving. I'm sitting here playing video games. But 0:43:53.320 --> 0:43:55.399 I have to allow myself and cut myself some slack. 0:43:55.520 --> 0:43:58.160 That that that was my escape at the time. I just 0:43:58.280 --> 0:44:02.040 hadn't slowed down and I hadn't stopped for like the 0:44:02.120 --> 0:44:05.320 last three to four years. Yeah, I hadn't allowed myself 0:44:05.560 --> 0:44:08.200 to have any downtime because I was building and serving 0:44:08.200 --> 0:44:12.720 and creating that that was my outlet. You still realize 0:44:12.719 --> 0:44:15.279 that it starts to damage your relationships, Like my mom 0:44:15.360 --> 0:44:17.600 was like, why not calling? Like, I'm not calling my 0:44:17.680 --> 0:44:19.840 mom and I'm playing a I was a video again. Yeah, 0:44:19.880 --> 0:44:21.640 I'm not calling my system. I'm playing I was a 0:44:21.680 --> 0:44:23.239 video games. They're not spending time on my wife. From 0:44:23.360 --> 0:44:25.319 you know, it's kind of like anything that doesn't have 0:44:25.440 --> 0:44:28.200 moderation involved. Yeah, then it's toxic, right, and you drink 0:44:28.200 --> 0:44:31.160 too much water. And then my therapist put it this way, 0:44:31.280 --> 0:44:34.480 if it's fine, it's acceptable behavior if you're doing it, 0:44:34.520 --> 0:44:38.120 and afterwards you don't feel any shame. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, 0:44:38.200 --> 0:44:40.480 but if you feel bad they're terrible and that you 0:44:40.520 --> 0:44:42.319 do it again, then you should look at it. Well, 0:44:42.360 --> 0:44:44.400 there are bad things you men can do that they 0:44:44.400 --> 0:44:48.520 don't feel about. Well, yeah, I'm for somebody who's like, 0:44:48.719 --> 0:44:50.440 by the time you get to therapy and you're actually 0:44:50.480 --> 0:44:52.279 working on that thing and you're like, hey, you're trying 0:44:52.320 --> 0:44:55.360 to understand it, by that point, it's like, okay, well 0:44:55.640 --> 0:44:58.160 this is probably unhealthy for you if you're if you're 0:44:58.160 --> 0:45:01.560 that reflective and you're already there, right, So yeah, it's 0:45:01.600 --> 0:45:04.000 it's it's interesting that it seems to be the women 0:45:04.040 --> 0:45:06.680 in your life that sort of pointed that out. Always, 0:45:06.719 --> 0:45:09.960 like the women women like my mother, my sister, and 0:45:09.960 --> 0:45:13.040 from my wife. I've just learned, like like I dedicate 0:45:13.040 --> 0:45:16.120 my book to her because she is more monk than 0:45:16.160 --> 0:45:19.279 I'll ever be, and that's so humbling. When when we 0:45:19.320 --> 0:45:21.400 got married, I was like the guy who'd been a 0:45:21.400 --> 0:45:24.040 monk and meditating for all these years, and even some 0:45:24.120 --> 0:45:27.560 of my spirit spiritual friends were like, oh, you can't 0:45:27.560 --> 0:45:30.040 marry her, she's new to spirituality, et cetera, et cetera. 0:45:30.719 --> 0:45:35.000 And my wife, like, my wife wakes up earlier than 0:45:35.040 --> 0:45:37.120 I do. She meditates for longer than I do. She 0:45:37.239 --> 0:45:40.640 is she's amazing, Like she's far more spiritual than I'll 0:45:40.680 --> 0:45:44.279 ever be. And and I love that because I need 0:45:44.320 --> 0:45:46.319 that she's amazing. Yeah, and I need that. If she 0:45:46.480 --> 0:45:48.399 wasn't that, maybe I wouldn't be who I am today, 0:45:48.480 --> 0:45:50.880 Like maybe I would have got more deviated from the 0:45:50.920 --> 0:45:53.680 path and lost my way. Jay, You're you're incredible. We're 0:45:53.680 --> 0:45:57.080 going to go to these last questions. Welcome to this 0:45:57.120 --> 0:46:00.920 week's Man Enough Podcast Rapid Fire Question, Lau, do you 0:46:00.920 --> 0:46:04.399 want to start all right? The rapid fire question? When 0:46:04.520 --> 0:46:09.080 is the last time that you cried? It was probably 0:46:09.080 --> 0:46:11.080 when I was you know what, I yeah, it was 0:46:11.080 --> 0:46:13.640 probably this Because I don't live in the same country 0:46:13.640 --> 0:46:15.520 as my mom anymore, and because of the pandemic, I 0:46:15.520 --> 0:46:17.000 don't get to see her as much anymore. I used 0:46:17.000 --> 0:46:19.319 to go back regularly. I feel like whenever I'm leaving 0:46:19.400 --> 0:46:24.200 London and my mom cries, I cry because it's my mom, 0:46:24.280 --> 0:46:25.879 Like I love it, like she did every She's done 0:46:25.880 --> 0:46:28.960 everything for me. And the thing about love is there's 0:46:29.040 --> 0:46:32.800 no way of repaying it, so you can only keep trying. 0:46:33.640 --> 0:46:35.960 And I think that that's the beauty of love. And 0:46:36.040 --> 0:46:39.120 also the hard part of love is that you can't 0:46:39.200 --> 0:46:41.680 repay real love. And I feel like I'm always in 0:46:41.719 --> 0:46:44.200 debt to my mom in a good way. And so, yeah, 0:46:44.320 --> 0:46:47.440 i'd say that tell me something that other people value 0:46:47.920 --> 0:46:57.200 that you don't, I'd say it's probably being understood. I'm 0:46:57.200 --> 0:47:00.800 okay with being misunderstood. Wow, I just think it's reality. 0:47:00.840 --> 0:47:03.480 I just don't think you will ever be understood by everyone, 0:47:03.520 --> 0:47:06.600 and so it's okay. Like I don't value being understood 0:47:06.600 --> 0:47:08.440 any I used to. I used to love being I 0:47:08.480 --> 0:47:11.680 want to take that as a superpower. Yeah, I'm going 0:47:11.760 --> 0:47:15.200 to add one, What are you afraid of? I'm afraid 0:47:15.480 --> 0:47:19.520 of not reaching my potential. I'm genuinely afraid of that. 0:47:20.040 --> 0:47:22.760 I do think about that, like I think about the future, 0:47:22.760 --> 0:47:25.919 and I'm like, I don't want to die having thought 0:47:25.960 --> 0:47:28.040 that I didn't try my best to do everything that 0:47:28.080 --> 0:47:32.400 I was meant to do. And my teacher told me 0:47:32.440 --> 0:47:36.600 something once which which set the pedestal of potential much higher. 0:47:37.160 --> 0:47:39.080 And he asked me once, he said, well, what are 0:47:39.080 --> 0:47:40.759 you doing right now? As an update? And so I 0:47:40.760 --> 0:47:42.240 was telling him. I was like, I'm doing this podcast 0:47:42.280 --> 0:47:44.400 and we've launched this book, and I was just sharing 0:47:44.400 --> 0:47:48.359 it out of love and gratitude to him. And he said, 0:47:48.400 --> 0:47:50.640 he said to me, Goes, you know, for all of 0:47:50.680 --> 0:47:54.759 these things that you're doing, I have no expectation, but 0:47:54.800 --> 0:47:59.000 I simply demand the purity of your heart. And I 0:47:59.080 --> 0:48:02.439 was just like, oh, that's a lot harder. And that's 0:48:02.480 --> 0:48:04.399 my biggest fear that I don't live up to that, 0:48:04.520 --> 0:48:07.440 because I feel like I would have wasted all the 0:48:07.480 --> 0:48:09.200 love that he's given me over the years and the 0:48:09.760 --> 0:48:11.840 amount of investment that these teachers are put into a 0:48:11.920 --> 0:48:14.600 random kid from London who is on his way to 0:48:14.600 --> 0:48:16.799 do all the stupid things that people do. And they've 0:48:16.840 --> 0:48:21.080 they've they've loved me through so much and it upsets 0:48:21.080 --> 0:48:26.239 me to think that I mess it up. So, yeah, 0:48:26.400 --> 0:48:30.240 when was the last time you apologize to someone? Today? 0:48:30.280 --> 0:48:32.880 To my wife, we were doing a video together and 0:48:32.920 --> 0:48:35.440 I was rushing to come here or somewhere else and 0:48:35.480 --> 0:48:36.920 I was I had the worst and energy, and she 0:48:36.960 --> 0:48:38.239 stopped me and she looked me in the face and 0:48:38.280 --> 0:48:40.680 she was like, are you okay? Like what's up? Like 0:48:40.760 --> 0:48:42.440 I can tell that you're just frustrated to be here, 0:48:42.440 --> 0:48:44.120 but you need to do this right now, and are 0:48:44.120 --> 0:48:46.480 you okay with that? And and then I was like, 0:48:46.520 --> 0:48:47.920 all right, let's just do it. I don't like your 0:48:48.040 --> 0:48:50.160 energy right now. And then I went back to it 0:48:50.200 --> 0:48:52.080 and I gave her rug and its like I'm really sorry, look, 0:48:52.080 --> 0:48:53.839 I'm just you know, I've had a lot on this 0:48:53.880 --> 0:48:56.520 last week and whatever. So yeah, that was sure. And 0:48:56.640 --> 0:49:01.600 the final question, what does it mean to be man enough? Oh? 0:49:01.719 --> 0:49:03.840 I think, in my opinion, what it means to be 0:49:03.880 --> 0:49:11.560 mad enough is to There's a beautiful statement by Russell 0:49:11.600 --> 0:49:16.800 Barkley where he said that people who need the most 0:49:16.880 --> 0:49:20.760 love often ask for it in the most unloving ways. 0:49:21.960 --> 0:49:23.560 And I think what it means to be mad enough 0:49:23.680 --> 0:49:26.919 is to be able to approach everyone with that love, 0:49:27.520 --> 0:49:31.600 recognizing that the pain they're causing you or anyone else 0:49:31.800 --> 0:49:34.520 is coming from a place of them being unloved at 0:49:34.600 --> 0:49:39.320 some point in their life. Wet, you're my friend or 0:49:39.440 --> 0:49:42.880 man enough. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you, Liz, 0:49:43.040 --> 0:49:46.560 thanks so much for you. I know I know you 0:49:46.560 --> 0:49:47.759 had to move a lot of stuff run to make 0:49:47.800 --> 0:49:49.800 us happen, So thank you so much. This is so special. 0:49:49.840 --> 0:49:52.840 I learned some sweet If you want even more videos 0:49:52.920 --> 0:49:55.560 just like this one makes you subscribe and click on 0:49:55.600 --> 0:49:58.520 the boxes over here. I'm also excited to let you 0:49:58.560 --> 0:50:01.400 know that you can now yet my book Think Like 0:50:01.680 --> 0:50:05.640 a Monk, from thinkli amnkbook dot com. Check below in 0:50:05.680 --> 0:50:08.160 the description to make sure you order today.