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Speaker 1: Wind Down with Janet Kramer and I'm Heeart Radio podcast.

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Speaker 2: This week's adult education, we have Sino McFarlan on. He's

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Speaker 2: a dynamic life coach translator at Spiritual Guide. He specializes

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Speaker 2: in cracking open hearts and letting the light in helping

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Speaker 2: clients from all walks of life shift their narrative. So,

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Speaker 2: whether you're top executive, celebrity, athlete, is struggling parent, Sino

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Speaker 2: is committed to guiding you on a transfermative journey of

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Speaker 2: personal growth and empowerment. He's got a podcast where he

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Speaker 2: talks a lot about his thirty eight years of sobriety.

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Speaker 2: He's a sponsor life coach in Los Angeles. He's here,

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Speaker 2: so let's get him on.

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Speaker 3: Good Morning, Good morning morning.

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Speaker 2: You wear your heart on your sleeve.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I little bit I do.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I love that. Hey, I'm Jana. This is my

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Speaker 2: husband Alan.

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Speaker 4: Nice to meet you.

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Speaker 3: Nice to meet you, guys, Good.

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Speaker 2: Morning, Thank you for coming on the show.

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Speaker 3: It's a blessing. Thank you.

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Speaker 2: With doing some research on you and your podcast. First

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Speaker 2: and foremost, let's just dive right into it. On the

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Speaker 2: sobriety piece of things. You've been sober for thirty six.

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Speaker 3: Years thirty eight thirty eight.

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Speaker 2: Now, go on, I'm so sorry. I didn't mean to

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Speaker 2: take those two years. I yeah, okay, that was a

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Speaker 2: that was misinformation and apologies on that. What for you

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Speaker 2: was it alcohol or was it substance both?

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Speaker 1: I mean, I'm I'm an alcoholic, I'm a cocaine attic,

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Speaker 1: I'm a valium attic, I'm sex and love addict.

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Speaker 3: So it's kind of a little bit of everything. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: I got the gift that I got the gift to

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Speaker 3: twenty two. I got sober twenty two at twenty two.

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Speaker 2: Wow, Was there a moment for you that was like that,

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Speaker 2: because they always say that there's that moment where it's

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Speaker 2: you know, you're you're either going to end up in

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Speaker 2: the gutter or you're going to end up dead. You're

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Speaker 2: gonna you know, what was it for you that were like,

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Speaker 2: I have to change my life now.

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Speaker 1: My tap out moment was you know, I'm not a

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Speaker 1: big guy. I'm like one ninety I was. I weighed

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Speaker 1: like one forty three at the time. I was, you know,

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Speaker 1: losing blood from my backside. I was getting ready to

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Speaker 1: go back to prison. There was a contract on my

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Speaker 1: life with some very serious people, and my sister came over.

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Speaker 1: Her name's Toy, and she was nineteen. I was twenty two,

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Speaker 1: and she said, seeing, I love you so much, but

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Speaker 1: you're dying and I can't be around you. But I

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Speaker 1: if you want to come to a meeting, I've got

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Speaker 1: a week of sobriety, come join me.

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Speaker 3: And I went to my meeting the next day and

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Speaker 3: it stuck.

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Speaker 2: Wow. Wow, that's wow, that's amazing. Because I don't I

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Speaker 2: don't know what the percentage is, but for people to relapse,

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Speaker 2: I mean, for you to be thirty eight years strong,

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Speaker 2: that's it's incredible.

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Speaker 3: It's your rights.

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Speaker 1: It's very rare that somebody gets it from the gate,

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Speaker 1: and it's very rare that somebody gets it that young

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Speaker 1: and stays sober this long.

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Speaker 4: Absolutely, especially during a like that pity that you was

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Speaker 4: just this guy to me where you were it was

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Speaker 4: a you were threatened to be your life. You were unhealthy.

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Speaker 4: There's a lot of people would still be in those

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Speaker 4: sad moments and those moments of stress and anxiety and

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Speaker 4: then reach for the drugs or they reach for the

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Speaker 4: alcohol gate to try and get through that. So to

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Speaker 4: go to that initial meeting and then stay still over

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Speaker 4: like Betty years.

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Speaker 1: This pretty yeah, pretty blessed. Yes, very grateful day doesn't

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Speaker 1: go by that. I don't appreciate that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, No, for sure, I'm curious because you know, there's

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Speaker 2: a lot of people that I know, I heard binge

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Speaker 2: drinking is the is a huge problem now. But there's

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Speaker 2: many people that can say, well, I can stop, and

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Speaker 2: you know I can, I cannot have a drink, But

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Speaker 2: then the binging is where the problem is. And but

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Speaker 2: they in their minds they can say, well, I'm fine.

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Speaker 2: I can go a week without drinking, or I can

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Speaker 2: go a month without drinking. It's not a problem. Where

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Speaker 2: do you kind of stand with that piece?

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Speaker 3: Well, my big thing is, you know, go do what

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Speaker 3: you gotta do.

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Speaker 1: And my only thing is that if there's consequences, generally

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Speaker 1: only alcoholics say things like that, you know, And my

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Speaker 1: thing is, you know, go out and test it out.

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Speaker 1: But here's the thing, you know, I earn my living

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Speaker 1: in this field, and to your guys' opening question, in

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Speaker 1: order for somebody to really get sober, it has to

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Speaker 1: be one thing and one thing only. They have to

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Speaker 1: be sick and tired of being sick and tired. I've

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Speaker 1: worked with the best and the brightest in the world

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Speaker 1: who have the most extraordinary things. And it doesn't matter

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Speaker 1: how smart you are, how much money you are, how

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Speaker 1: accomplished you are. There has to be a moment where

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Speaker 1: you say I'm done, I can't do this anymore.

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Speaker 3: But until then, good luck.

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Speaker 1: And sadly most people have to get their ass handed

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Speaker 1: too them before they wave the white flag. And alcoholism

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Speaker 1: is a deadly disease obviously on many fronts, but one

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Speaker 1: of the things that's still the thirty eight years and

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Speaker 1: still as I earn my living in this credible ability

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Speaker 1: for an alcoholic to rationalize his behavior and choices is extraordinary.

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Speaker 2: So basically you're saying too, like what you just said.

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Speaker 2: If someone can say, well I can go without, I

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Speaker 2: don't need to have it every day, that's a justification.

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Speaker 3: Nobody justifies it like an alcoholic. It's exactly.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, true, that's true, because I mean I yeah is

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Speaker 2: that yeah? Yeah, that is true.

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Speaker 4: Well he's trying to normalize everything, Yeah, exactly, exactly.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: What's the what's the worst form of addiction that you've

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Speaker 4: come across as alcohol? Is it drugs? Is it sex?

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Speaker 4: Or are they all lined with the same sort of problems.

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Speaker 3: The worst one I've seen, Like, I mean.

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Speaker 4: As what as the worst? Is it? As alcohol? Is

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Speaker 4: it drugs? In terms of keeping people? And that spiral

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Speaker 4: and that and that look of staying addicted.

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Speaker 3: That's a really tricky question.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you think of fenol addiction, right, but you

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Speaker 1: think of somebody who's got severe alcoholism. They're kind of

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Speaker 1: neck to neck. Okay, yeah, they're kind of neck to neck.

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Speaker 1: I can't say anyone's worse. Honestly, I think a.

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Speaker 2: Love addiction is the worst of all of them. Now,

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Speaker 2: wells agreed, and listen, I got to say I I

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Speaker 2: would have one hundred percent classified myself as a love addiction.

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Speaker 2: Love addicts back in my twenties even early thirties for sure.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I Mean I had a my ex husband was was

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Speaker 2: an SSA, and so I started going to s an

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Speaker 2: on meetings, you know, to try to learn and understand

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Speaker 2: and you know, and just kind of And then I

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Speaker 2: also have a friend who's very public about her love addiction,

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Speaker 2: and she speaks a lot about it, Brion Davis Davies,

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Speaker 2: and she you know, when I'm link thinking about it,

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Speaker 2: I'm like, man, Okay, I can connect with that piece

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Speaker 2: and yeah, that's you know, I would I would do that,

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Speaker 2: you know. So so you start to kind of connect

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Speaker 2: the pieces and realize that love addiction is, you know,

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Speaker 2: one of the I think, a very hard one to break.

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Speaker 2: And then a lot of times too, you know, many

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Speaker 2: people didn't understand my ex's addiction. You know, I think

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Speaker 2: it's very easy to be like, oh, okay, they have

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Speaker 2: there they're an alcoholic or they're a drug addict, and

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Speaker 2: but for sex addiction, it's still very much like, no,

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Speaker 2: they're just an asshole who cheats. You know, they don't.

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Speaker 2: There's no there's no empathy for someone that has a

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Speaker 2: sex addiction because they just think, well, you should know better,

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Speaker 2: you know.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well let me ask you. I'll ask your husband's question.

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Speaker 1: Maybe you're right, because actually love addiction is the is

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Speaker 1: a is a beast. Because if you're an alcoholic, you

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Speaker 1: just go to liquor store and get your bottle. If

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Speaker 1: you're you know, a drug addict, you just wait for

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Speaker 1: the dealer. But love addiction, you're waiting on that text

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Speaker 1: and this is your needle, this is your syringe, and

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Speaker 1: that text might not come.

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Speaker 3: And you know, that's a very tricky thing, and.

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Speaker 1: It's it's it's it's you see, people put their life

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Speaker 1: on hold waiting for somebody hit them over the head.

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Speaker 1: The magic wand is it's it's powerful and scary and

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Speaker 1: love addiction, love addiction. If people don't, if they're in sobriety,

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Speaker 1: they don't get their love and or sex addiction right,

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Speaker 1: they will absolutely relapse. Mm hm so Leah, it's a

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Speaker 1: love addiction is really quite something.

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Speaker 4: As we all know, after thirty eight years, do you

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Speaker 4: do you still have to deal with any sort of

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Speaker 4: temptation on any of your addictions?

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Speaker 3: Every day? Brother?

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Speaker 4: Every day?

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Speaker 3: No, no, no, I thank god.

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Speaker 1: I don't think about drinking or drug And you know,

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Speaker 1: every once in a while somebody finds me first class

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Speaker 1: a nice event because I'm such an orphan, I'll free drinks.

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Speaker 3: That'd be kind of nice. But I'm not tempted.

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Speaker 1: I've been blessed to have a lot of recovery and slaw.

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Speaker 1: You know, that doesn't grab me so much. I have

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Speaker 1: a very I'm very big on routines and I have

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Speaker 1: certain things that I do that I do not go

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Speaker 1: off Like I was in the ocean this morning. I

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Speaker 1: will never miss the ocean. I don't care how I

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Speaker 1: swim without a wetsuit. I have a prayer meditation discipline

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Speaker 1: that I have. I think probably what I have to

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Speaker 1: work on the most is just dark, negative people in

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Speaker 1: the world, not letting put my light out. But as

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Speaker 1: far as centation for chemicals or prostitutes or some pretty

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Speaker 1: girl I met at Arawan, No, thank God, one day

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Speaker 1: at a time.

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Speaker 2: Airwan. Yeah, it's great. It very overly priced, but it's great.

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Speaker 3: It's a great place, a great place to meet your soulmate.

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Speaker 2: Right. No, that sounds straight out of the mouth of yes.

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Speaker 2: Love love addiction. What what have you found the most

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Speaker 2: with people with addiction when you're when you're helping them, Look,

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Speaker 2: what are they trying to fill?

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Speaker 3: They lack purpose, they lack self esteem.

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Speaker 1: You know, I'm I specialized with a lot of people

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Speaker 1: that you know, have been a severe sexual trauma. They

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Speaker 1: need to be reparented and and they're lost, They're stuck

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Speaker 1: in a sad story. My big focus on the work

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Speaker 1: that I do is get people past their sad story.

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Speaker 3: Shift the narrative, shift the consciousness.

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Speaker 1: But it's a it's a it's it's an ability, it's

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Speaker 1: an inability to connect with something higher.

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Speaker 3: It's an inability to look in the.

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Speaker 1: Mirror and say I love myself and they are more

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Speaker 1: committed to the drug or the drink or the person

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Speaker 1: to fill that gap in that wound.

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Speaker 2: As a life coach, what is what is that? What's

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Speaker 2: what's that process look like? What is what is the

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Speaker 2: first things? Like how to get someone to take that

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Speaker 2: step into their self worth and to draw away from

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Speaker 2: that substance and towards their self.

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Speaker 1: Well, the first thing I got to do with somebody

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Speaker 1: is I got to get them sober. First, we got

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Speaker 1: to start that. Number one, we got to stop that,

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Speaker 1: and then i'd all help them do small little actions

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Speaker 1: like I want you rite two affirmations.

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Speaker 3: To yourself and then send them to me. I know

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Speaker 3: it's going to be hard, but that guy who's.

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Speaker 1: Been texting you, who know who's dangerous, who's married and

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Speaker 1: got three kids, Okay, try not to text them today,

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Speaker 1: and I'll do small little things like that.

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Speaker 3: I know it's hard for you to go.

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Speaker 1: To the gym, Can you do seven pushups for me?

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Speaker 1: And then we start from there.

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Speaker 4: Yes, you did a lot of work with a lot

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Speaker 4: of celebrities. So I did about research this morning, and

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Speaker 4: one that interested me was was Mike Tyson. So you've

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Speaker 4: worked with Mike Tyson for many years now, haven't you.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, but eighteen or nineteen years Mike. So, I'm in

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Speaker 3: I'm in Venice.

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Speaker 1: This is I'm here at my office where I do

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Speaker 1: my sessions, and in the back is a residential living

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Speaker 1: where people come and live. Mike's lived here for almost

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Speaker 1: one time, for a year off and on, you know,

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Speaker 1: for a couple of years.

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Speaker 3: But we were inseparable there for a long time.

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Speaker 4: Okay, what's his character like? He always comes across as

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Speaker 4: that you see different and this is completely from the out,

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Speaker 4: from the outside. Then you see different, different sides of them.

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Speaker 4: I've always wondered what he's like as a as a person,

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Speaker 4: because he looks like, you know, when athletes can just

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Speaker 4: ton something on, yeah and be incredible. He looks like

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Speaker 4: it looks like he's got a self destruct butt and

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Speaker 4: also looks like he can ton these his talent on

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Speaker 4: with the click of his fingers.

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Speaker 1: Well, he's one of the most kindest, profound, brilliant people

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Speaker 1: I've ever met. But also you know he can he

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Speaker 1: can be quite destructive and mean and childish and immature

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Speaker 1: and a punk.

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Speaker 2: Okay, we all fall short, right, we.

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Speaker 3: All fall short. But the thing about Michael is.

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Speaker 1: He understands the most important thing for this is the

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Speaker 1: most important thing for people in recovery, is the ability

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Speaker 1: to ask for help and say I don't know, and

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Speaker 1: you know, I tell the story and it really kind

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Speaker 1: of tells you that about the nature of our relationship.

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Speaker 1: When I first started working with Mike, I think he

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Speaker 1: weighed like three hundred and forty six.

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Speaker 3: Okay, he was broke.

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Speaker 1: He was actually getting ready to go back to prison.

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Speaker 1: We were in a very tricky case back in Arizona.

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Speaker 1: He was suicidal and he pretty much had given up

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Speaker 1: on life. And so he came here and we started

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Speaker 1: doing all those things that I talked about. We started

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Speaker 1: training together, working out, praying together, going to meetings together,

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Speaker 1: and you know, we would go out to like a

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Speaker 1: nice restaurant or something down the street here, and the

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Speaker 1: first thought that he would have when he walks in,

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Speaker 1: everyone's looking at him and going, look at that big

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Speaker 1: fat inward, right and right. And so I taught Michael.

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Speaker 1: What we did was Okay, Michael being acceptance that these

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Speaker 1: attacks will happen. They're going to happen. But what he

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Speaker 1: would do is we'd walk in, he would grab my hand, right,

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Speaker 1: you would touch my hand, the baddest amount on the

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Speaker 1: planet would grab my hand and I would look at

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Speaker 1: him and say, Mike, you're safe, you're loved, you're protected.

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Speaker 1: And then we in the African tradition, we would touch heads,

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Speaker 1: and that really kind of tells you kind of who

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Speaker 1: he is. For him to trust me and do that

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Speaker 1: and ask for that kind of help. It's so vulnerable,

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Speaker 1: but that was kind of the magic and the secret

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Speaker 1: sauce of our relationship.

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Speaker 4: Amazing, amazing.

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Speaker 2: What would you say to the friend the spouse that

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Speaker 2: is with someone who has this addiction, has an addiction?

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Speaker 2: What is the best piece of advice that you can

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Speaker 2: give them to help walk through with the person, or

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Speaker 2: or to say like hey, like he has a drinking

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Speaker 2: problem and he won't stop, or you know, how how

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Speaker 2: do I support this?

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Speaker 1: Or Yeah, so it's you know, I'm a big fan

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Speaker 1: of alan On, which is a program for that.

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Speaker 3: I think it's an incredible program. Allen is really about

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Speaker 3: compassionate detachment.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's about how to deal with somebody who's

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Speaker 1: who's dealing with this. It's a very you know, the

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Speaker 1: Big Book of AA is very specific and it says

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Speaker 1: alcoholic is a tornado for people's lives and it's very

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Speaker 1: scary beyond the other end of an alcoholic if they

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Speaker 1: have other addictions, gambling, the rink can't get paid, the

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Speaker 1: morge can't get paid, all kinds of chaos. But the

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Speaker 1: thing they got, the number one thing is they can't

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Speaker 1: fix it. They cannot fix another person. Nobody can fix

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Speaker 1: another person's addiction. That person at some point is going

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Speaker 1: to have to get serious about recovery. And if they

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Speaker 1: don't want to do that, then that person needs to

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Speaker 1: get strong and get boundaries and figure out whether or not.

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Speaker 3: They can still stay in this relationship.

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Speaker 1: But it's it's a it's a very but I'm so

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Speaker 1: big on community. I'm so big in support. I think

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Speaker 1: it's I believe in the rooms and for someone else

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Speaker 1: to hear, don't do you cannot do this thing alone.

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Speaker 1: It's too scary.

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Speaker 2: Well, that's what I was going to ask you. On

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Speaker 2: the other side of it. Can someone be sober and

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Speaker 2: not go to meetings? Can those two worlds exist?

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Speaker 3: Sure?

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Speaker 1: I you know A doesn't have the the uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: the copyright on what works best for people.

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Speaker 3: I'm about whatever works.

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Speaker 1: I just have been blessed to come into the rooms

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Speaker 1: and see the magic.

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Speaker 3: I like it.

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Speaker 1: I like I like a guy who's coming in with

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Speaker 1: three hours of sobriety and then watching him get a job,

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Speaker 1: watching learn how to date, watching them get married, watch

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Speaker 1: them starting a company. But yes, there's other ways to

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Speaker 1: do it. But I'm just a fan of the twelve

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Speaker 1: step for sure.

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Speaker 4: And as part of the power and that is it

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Speaker 4: the sharing of stories.

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Speaker 1: Yes, exactly, it's a sharing story so you don't feel

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Speaker 1: like such a freak.

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Speaker 2: Well I feel like too. It gives you that accountability

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Speaker 2: to when you are with your boys and you want

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Speaker 2: a drink, it's like you know that you have a

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Speaker 2: community of people you can be like, hey, I really

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Speaker 2: would like a drink right now, and but having some

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Speaker 2: people around you to be like you got this or

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Speaker 2: that support because I know for me it's I like

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Speaker 2: to to know that I can talk to someone and

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Speaker 2: you know, and though I don't struggle with an addiction,

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Speaker 2: I feel like we all have something that we can

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Speaker 2: we have faults and if I'm like I'm feeling this,

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Speaker 2: and it's like you still have the friends that know you,

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Speaker 2: and it's like all right, don't be like that or

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Speaker 2: don't do that and holding yourself accountable.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. And I really believe people need a tribe. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: the tribe's very important.

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Speaker 1: It's scary, it's lonely, it's hard to wake up, it's

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Speaker 1: hard to do this. And the tribe and then to

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Speaker 1: hear people like you said, merrit to support you.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 1: We have a sign here on at the entrance as

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Speaker 1: shell says, no shame allowed.

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Speaker 3: We don't do shame here. You leave that shit on

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Speaker 3: the street.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I love that. What is the biggest message

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Speaker 2: that you want your clients that you walk through this

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Speaker 2: with to know?

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Speaker 3: The biggest message say say, we'll ask me one more time, please.

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Speaker 2: The biggest message that you want your clients to feel

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Speaker 2: and know.

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Speaker 3: And and and I don't care what happened to you

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Speaker 3: in the past. We can write.

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Speaker 1: We could absolutely write a new chapter and completely start

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Speaker 1: a new life for yourself. And well, no matter, because

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Speaker 1: what happened for me was I had some really I

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Speaker 1: don't know way if you read about it not some.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, some people who really did some nasty things to me.

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Speaker 1: But I just made that my superpower, you know, and

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Speaker 1: I use that to do incredible things around the world.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, and talk about your podcast. So you've got a

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Speaker 2: podcast you bring people on. What else? What else can

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Speaker 2: our listeners expect.

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Speaker 3: On the on the on my show or on your show. Well,

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Speaker 3: you know we have everybody that not everybody are is addicts.

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Speaker 3: You know that.

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Speaker 1: You know, my brother Tony Robbins is on the show

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Speaker 1: Different you know, change agent in the world. People are

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Speaker 1: doing great things, people that have accomplished things, people that

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Speaker 1: have a positive outlook on life, people that believe the

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Speaker 1: importance of kindness and helping people. We're very big on

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Speaker 1: what are you doing to help your fellow brother and

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Speaker 1: sister And it's just you know, you get a couple

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Speaker 1: of messages, you get a little ted bit ted bits

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Speaker 1: and hopefully you breathe a little differently and.

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Speaker 3: You just pass it on and carry the message.

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Speaker 2: I love that. Thanks yeah, well, thank you for sharing

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Speaker 2: you know, your message and obviously helping so many people,

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Speaker 2: and just keep yeah, keep helping lift up other people.

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Speaker 2: We appreciate what you do.

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Speaker 3: I appreciate it. I really appreciate you guys having me

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Speaker 3: on your show. It's it's very kind to you.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, Thank you, Peculature, Thank you so much, thank