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Speaker 1: Hey there, folks. It is Monday, September twenty second, and

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Speaker 1: the President of the United States says, don't take tailan all,

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Speaker 1: don't take it and with that, welcome to this episode

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Speaker 1: of Amy and TJ. Robes. I'm not sure what we

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Speaker 1: just watched, but the President of the United States just

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Speaker 1: came out and told pregnant women that they should not

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Speaker 1: take the only pain reliever that is available to them.

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Speaker 2: He also told us basically like to suck it up.

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Speaker 2: If we're in significant pain, just try to bear it.

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Speaker 2: Just don't take it.

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Speaker 1: You know. That's especially something I want to ask you

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Speaker 1: about because you've been pregnant twice and we're going to

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Speaker 1: get into that. But bottom line, this is the big

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Speaker 1: autism announcement that he teased that the Charlie Kirk memorial.

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Speaker 1: He said this was going to be the announcement, and

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Speaker 1: Robes he stepped out and kind of set us up.

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Speaker 1: He said, this is one of the most important meetings

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Speaker 1: he had hoped for in twenty years or something he's

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Speaker 1: been waiting for, and this was going to be a

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Speaker 1: game changing announcement. Ultimately, the announcement is that they believe

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Speaker 1: there is a whey they say a potential association between

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Speaker 1: thailandol that pregnant women take when they do take it,

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Speaker 1: and an increase risk in autism.

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Speaker 2: I as a woman and having been a pregnant woman,

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Speaker 2: and I definitely took thailand all. Not all the time,

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Speaker 2: but certainly there are things that happened to you, as

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Speaker 2: they happen to any human being, where you get a fever,

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Speaker 2: you're suffering, you're in pain, you have difficulty, and thailand

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Speaker 2: al is the only thing you can take. We can't

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Speaker 2: take at but we can't take aspirin, we can't take

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Speaker 2: any prescription drugs whatsoever. I had a horrific case of

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Speaker 2: poison IVY and I couldn't take pregnant zone and it

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Speaker 2: lasted for over a month. And guess what I took

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Speaker 2: benadryl and thilanol. I was miserable. I was sobbing, and

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Speaker 2: thank god I was able to take those two things. Look,

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Speaker 2: if they could say without a doubt, definitively there was

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Speaker 2: a cause and effect relationship here, of course, But I

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Speaker 2: just think it's a little frightening that they're jumping to

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Speaker 2: conclusions that I don't believe any other organization, reputable medical organization,

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Speaker 2: reputable scientists have even come close to saying, and what.

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Speaker 1: You said as a pregnant woman, that was your only

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Speaker 1: option when you were going through all kinds of hell.

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Speaker 1: You didn't have options. So the President said, don't take it.

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Speaker 1: And he said by not taking it, well, what's the

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Speaker 1: harm in just not taking it? And I see we

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Speaker 1: hear a lot of doctors sounding the alarm from a

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Speaker 1: medical perspective, but just also for a pregnant woman from

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Speaker 1: a comfort perspective.

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Speaker 2: Stress.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he's saying there's no harm in not taking it.

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Speaker 2: And I'm just going to say, as someone who was pregnant,

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Speaker 2: that is offensive because it's also not true. If you

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Speaker 2: are extremely stressed, from severe pain, from severe inflammation, from

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Speaker 2: a significant fever, there are risks to your fetus period.

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Speaker 2: So to dismiss that to say also that at all

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Speaker 2: costs you should suffer and we're not sure you need to,

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Speaker 2: but you should do it anyway because you might possibly

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Speaker 2: but we can't prove that you're doing any harm to

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Speaker 2: your child, but by suffering, you can do harm to

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Speaker 2: your child. I even had my obgyn tell me that

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Speaker 2: in the third trimester. And I know that this has

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Speaker 2: been a controversial thing and we've seen studies where they

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Speaker 2: tell women they can moderately drink or they can, excuse me,

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Speaker 2: be light drinkers and there's no harm to the fetus.

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Speaker 2: You can have a drink a day and essentially it

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Speaker 2: does nothing to your fetus. I remember my obgyn saying, Hey,

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Speaker 2: if you've had a particularly stressful day, and once a

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Speaker 2: week or once a month, whatever, you want to have

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Speaker 2: a glass of wine, have the glass of wine. I'd

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Speaker 2: rather have you be stress free then, and if that's

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Speaker 2: going to help do it. She's like, it's not something

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Speaker 2: you should do every day, it's not something you should

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Speaker 2: do in excess. But it actually isn't what we claim

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Speaker 2: it is.

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Speaker 1: Now.

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Speaker 2: I didn't. I chose not to because I was way

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Speaker 2: too afraid. I said, I don't need drink that bad

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Speaker 2: butt to that point. Now we're telling women they can't

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Speaker 2: even have tailand all if they're suffering and they're in pain.

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Speaker 1: Yes, the President of the United States from the White

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Speaker 1: House today said tailanol is not good, and I quote

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Speaker 1: so taking thailand al is not good. I'll say it,

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Speaker 1: it's not good. The President of the United State gave

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Speaker 1: a directive to pregnant women today that essentially gives them

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Speaker 1: a warning or should we take this differently? Information is good, right,

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Speaker 1: did he tell us anything that we didn't already know,

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Speaker 1: or he just from his pulpit now is sounding an

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Speaker 1: alarm that is going to cause confusion.

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Speaker 2: Babe. I can't take what he said seriously when he

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Speaker 2: also made some other statements that I know aren't serious.

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Speaker 2: For instance him saying that one in twelve boys in

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Speaker 2: California are now autistic.

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Speaker 1: I haven't dragged down those numbers. The ual.

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Speaker 2: Verifiable numbers is that it's one in thirty one, not boys,

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Speaker 2: one in thirty one children.

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Speaker 1: CDC says, yes.

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Speaker 2: That's according to the CDC. He did say that as well,

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Speaker 2: but then he went on to say that it's even

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Speaker 2: more severe in certain areas, and he named California where

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Speaker 2: he said one in twelve boys, not one in twelve children.

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Speaker 2: And then something else he said That makes it pretty

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Speaker 2: difficult for me to take anything he said seriously. Is

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Speaker 2: when he said there are certain groups of people who

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Speaker 2: don't take vaccines and have no autism. And then he

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Speaker 2: turned to RFK Junior and said, is that a correct statement?

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Speaker 1: By the way. Okay, that was a momentum was that

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Speaker 1: our laugh out loud moment. Yes, okay, that was a

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Speaker 1: pretty stunning moment, folks, when you're talking about one of

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Speaker 1: the most important health announcements ever. Is what he said,

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Speaker 1: And he made a statement. He made the President made

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Speaker 1: a statement to America. And then he turned to someone

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Speaker 1: to his right and said, is that a correct statement?

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Speaker 2: By the way, Look, you've heard me. When we're joking

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Speaker 2: around talking about something, I'll say something and then I'll say, wait,

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Speaker 2: I don't know, was that right. We've all done that.

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Speaker 2: You don't do it at a press conference as the

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Speaker 2: president of the United States, saying that you're giving one

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Speaker 2: of the most press conferences, most important press conferences in decades.

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Speaker 1: Hey, I'm giving a benefit of that.

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Speaker 2: And then he tried to say it was the homage,

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Speaker 2: but then he wasn't sure.

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Speaker 1: I mean it. Oh yeah, he's at the omish.

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Speaker 2: He ended up trying to say that the homage, there's

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Speaker 2: no homage people who have autism.

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Speaker 1: And you will have some doctors refute that to say

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Speaker 1: that among vaccinated and unvaccinated. He was trying to make

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Speaker 1: a point later about vaccines even to make that connection.

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Speaker 1: It's just it's it's not the case. According to doctors.

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Speaker 1: This was a it was. It was interesting. It was bizarkrear.

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Speaker 2: May I also point out and look, this just makes

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Speaker 2: me concerned. I've mispronounced words a million times. And when

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Speaker 2: I don't know how to say someone's name, I'll admit it.

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Speaker 2: I'll say something to you like, hey, you got my back.

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Speaker 2: I don't know how to say this athlete.

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Speaker 1: These moments, right, everybody has these.

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Speaker 2: But if you're about to give I'm going to say

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Speaker 2: this again, one of the most important press conferences that

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Speaker 2: is going to radically change healthcare in America, and you've

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Speaker 2: been waiting twenty years for it. You think before you

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Speaker 2: got in front of the mic, you would know the

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Speaker 2: word a set of menefit, which is exactly the drug

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Speaker 2: that's the active ingredient in tilan all. But that is

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Speaker 2: exactly the drug that they are now targeting and saying

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Speaker 2: is no good.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, we all have a moment. It looks

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Speaker 1: funny on paper. If he just had to say it,

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Speaker 1: he probably could have rolled it right off his tongue.

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Speaker 1: But looking down at it, it looks weird, like my

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Speaker 1: first name, right, Lutilius rolls off of the tongue. But

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Speaker 1: if you see it on paper, it'll miss you up.

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Speaker 2: But it'd be like I'm about to marry you and

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Speaker 2: I say I'm taking you and then I don't know

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Speaker 2: how to say your name.

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Speaker 1: Okay, but we were reading equivalent what I'm saying. If

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Speaker 1: you read equivalent, but if you had to read it.

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Speaker 2: Still say its I thrown you saying.

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Speaker 1: Maybe he was a nervous I mean the public speaking,

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Speaker 1: he doesn't do a lot of nervous. What I'm saying

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Speaker 1: is I don't want to get hung up.

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Speaker 2: It was.

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Speaker 1: It was bordering on embarrassing. People have bad moments, but

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Speaker 1: he got really hung up and couldn't say a set

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Speaker 1: of metaphine and almost looked around and asked for help

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Speaker 1: or help on saying the word. It was just it

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Speaker 1: was an.

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Speaker 2: Awful and look for me, I just want to point

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Speaker 2: this out. I am not I am trying to. I'm

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Speaker 2: looking at all of this as a as a journalist,

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Speaker 2: someone who is watching this with an objective viewpoint. So

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Speaker 2: I'm not here to, you know, take a stand on

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Speaker 2: where he is. But I'm just looking at the facts,

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Speaker 2: and I'm looking at how they were presented, and I

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Speaker 2: have a lot of questions, and I have a lot

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Speaker 2: of questions because this is a really serious statement that

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Speaker 2: he's made and a very serious directive that he's making

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Speaker 2: that is going to affect a lot of people, a

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Speaker 2: lot of children, a lot of women. And so I

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Speaker 2: think we have to ask questions. In fact, he even said,

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Speaker 2: in terms of of people who were skeptical about the skepticism,

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Speaker 2: instead of attacking those who ask questions, you should thank them.

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Speaker 2: So I'm actually saying we still need to ask a

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Speaker 2: lot of questions something this serious. And so I'm just

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Speaker 2: when I was watching this press conference, I just I

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Speaker 2: actually couldn't even believe what I was watching.

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Speaker 1: I love that someone would dive into it to want

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Speaker 1: to attract this question. I'm okay, I'm okay with it

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Speaker 1: being on the forefront. I where's the danger there when

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Speaker 1: we're talking about an answer and again, you're a again women,

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Speaker 1: How does a woman take a pregnant woman right now?

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Speaker 1: How does she receive this news?

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Speaker 2: It's scary because you're told, if you want to relieve

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Speaker 2: your pain, you might be permanently neurologically damaging your child.

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Speaker 1: Was there any evidence what evid There wasn't evidence offered today.

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Speaker 1: They didn't direct anyone to any studies. Necessarily, there is

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Speaker 1: a and again they used it today. We talked earlier

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Speaker 1: in the previous episode about language, what correlation and causation,

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Speaker 1: and they use what potential correlation?

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Speaker 2: A potential correlation, not causation, and so there is a

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Speaker 2: distinct difference between those two. But yes, I actually we

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Speaker 2: would encourage you if you haven't listened to the episode

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Speaker 2: before this. We actually did some of the research and

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Speaker 2: went to go see. There's been several recent studies that

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Speaker 2: have been done and they do conflict with each other,

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Speaker 2: but from the most esteemed organizations from UH basically JAMMA

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Speaker 2: to Harvard to Johns Hopkins. So we go through all

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Speaker 2: of this and look, the jury's out is the point,

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Speaker 2: and there is a potential correlation, but no one has

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Speaker 2: claimed there's a causation.

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Speaker 1: I found it. They called it a potential association.

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Speaker 2: There you go.

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Speaker 1: That's the one that RFK Junior use during it.

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Speaker 2: But that's a big difference between a causation and information

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Speaker 2: is good. Doing the research is great. Making sure you

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Speaker 2: know how you feel about things before you take them.

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Speaker 2: That's a personal choice. So I and I, that's awesome

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Speaker 2: to have these things to be able to look to

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Speaker 2: and research and figure out on your own but it

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Speaker 2: is a big deal when the President makes a directive

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Speaker 2: like this.

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Speaker 1: Okay, and yes, we need to be clear. He didn't

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Speaker 1: just come out make statements. They are putting action behind it.

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Speaker 1: They are telling the FDA they are going to direct

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Speaker 1: or send a note a notice out to physicians telling them, yes,

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Speaker 1: in fact, warning them and strongly recommending that women limit

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Speaker 1: the use of tail and all unless medically necessary. Now,

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Speaker 1: the President used some language today that I can wait

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Speaker 1: to get Robot's take on, because the President said on

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Speaker 1: more than one occasion during the press conference today that

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Speaker 1: some women might need to take talent off and maybe

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Speaker 1: be putting their child at risk if they can't tough

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Speaker 1: it out. Hey, we continue here on Amy and TJ.

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Speaker 1: After a pretty incredible press conference that was billed as

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Speaker 1: a really important press conference, a historical one.

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Speaker 2: Yes, he's been waiting to get for twenty years.

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Speaker 1: Yes, in which the President has said they are going

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Speaker 1: to direct the FDA to actually send out notices. Two

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Speaker 1: physicians across the country saying that they believe there is

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Speaker 1: a potential association between pregnant women taking thailanol or ceeda

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Speaker 1: metaphine during pregnancy possible link to autism. The president flat

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Speaker 1: out said to pregnant women, do not take this stuff.

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Speaker 1: He didn't mince words, he made sure he was clear

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Speaker 1: in what he was saying. We got a statement, you've

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Speaker 1: been watching the stock price, Oh goodness for Kinvu. You

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Speaker 1: all don't know that name, Kinvu, but that is the

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Speaker 1: company that makes Thailandol. They came out Talanol has a

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Speaker 1: statement on their website, and they were telling people there's

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Speaker 1: no association. But Kinvu had to put out a statement

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Speaker 1: a short time ago.

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Speaker 2: That's right, and so this is what they had to say.

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Speaker 2: We strongly disagree with any suggestion otherwise and are deeply

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Speaker 2: concerned with the health risk this poses for expecting mothers.

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Speaker 1: And the health risk. The risk there is that some

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Speaker 1: is a woman going to suffer because she now thinks,

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Speaker 1: oh my goodness, talanol is bad, and what she's doing

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Speaker 1: is hurting herself and possibly hurting that child by not

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Speaker 1: treating her fever or an infection or whatever she might

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Speaker 1: have at the time. This is some would say, dangerous

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Speaker 1: stuff and territory that we're in right now.

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Speaker 2: Yes, coming from someone who didn't seem to know what

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Speaker 2: he was even saying in moments, and so that was

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Speaker 2: really difficult. And for him to say to women, yes,

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Speaker 2: if you feel you can't tough it out, if you

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Speaker 2: can't tough it out, if you can't do it, then

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Speaker 2: go ahead, but you shouldn't. That is what he said.

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Speaker 2: I couldn't believe what I was hearing. Think about like

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Speaker 2: you and you're pregnant. You might break an arm, you

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Speaker 2: might break a leg. There's a lot of things that

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Speaker 2: happen to humans, and it happens to humans who were pregnant,

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Speaker 2: and so you're just supposed to tough it out because of

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Speaker 2: a pot like this makes no sense to me. And

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Speaker 2: he even said there isn't an alternative. I'm sorry, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: there's really nothing else you can take, because even oh, advil,

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Speaker 2: He went and talked about advil and your profen and aspernad. Yes,

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Speaker 2: we know we can't take any of those things. But

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Speaker 2: now the one thing we could take, you can't take

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Speaker 2: that either.

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Speaker 1: Oh my god. Okay, there were moments. Now I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: rap with getting your answer to that about toughing it out.

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Speaker 1: I do want to mention there were times as serious

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Speaker 1: as this topic is, that we chuckled because the president.

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Speaker 1: They mentioned vaccines as well, and he was making a

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Speaker 1: point that they now believe that vaccine should be spread out.

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Speaker 1: Don't give it to the baby.

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Speaker 2: At one time, four five times, four times. I was like,

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Speaker 2: I don't really know what you're saying. He's saying to

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Speaker 2: extend it. What he was saying wasn't making sense. I

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Speaker 2: was trying to figure out what he was saying. So

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Speaker 2: he's saying, the current schedule, it's all too consolidate it

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Speaker 2: at one time, so you do it over five times

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Speaker 2: four times. I guess he's saying extend.

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Speaker 1: It, Yeah, over time.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, he didn't say it in a way that

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Speaker 2: made any sense.

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Speaker 1: But he was saying the way he was saying it.

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Speaker 1: Describing an infant getting vaccine, he said, to take this

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Speaker 1: beautiful little baby and they pump them with all of this.

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Speaker 2: Load it up with stuff. They just pump it up.

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Speaker 2: But he basically what my concern was. He made it

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Speaker 2: sound like we are and some people may believe this,

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Speaker 2: and that's fine, but he, without any scientific backing, said

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Speaker 2: that we're basically pumping up and loading up our little beautiful,

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Speaker 2: perfect babies like horses with all of this fluid it

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Speaker 2: and pumping them up.

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Speaker 1: And that was his word. By the way, he like horses,

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Speaker 1: we said that, But what.

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Speaker 2: Vaccines have done. I just need to say this as

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Speaker 2: a daughter of a microbiologist and a sister of a

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Speaker 2: physician who strongly believe in the vaccine protocol. They've saved

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Speaker 2: millions of lives. So these aren't just poisonous, evil things

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Speaker 2: that we're pumping into our perfect children. These are protectors.

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Speaker 2: That is the whole point, not just of your child,

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Speaker 2: but of your neighbor's child. And in the communities we

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Speaker 2: live in, and look, I understand there are a lot

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Speaker 2: of folks who have concerns and want different scheduling, and

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Speaker 2: I think we can all. I think it's great to

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Speaker 2: ask questions. I think it's great to do research. I

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Speaker 2: think it's very good to consider should we spread them out?

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Speaker 2: What's the harm in that? Great? I think all of

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Speaker 2: those things are all plausible and important to consider and

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Speaker 2: reconsider when we have more information. So it's not as

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Speaker 2: if I or I think a lot of folks are

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Speaker 2: against constantly scrutinizing this and making sure we're doing it

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Speaker 2: the right way and when and how we should be.

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Speaker 2: But to just basically demonize all vaccines, That's what I

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Speaker 2: heard from him today, and it was and that is dangerous.

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Speaker 1: It is again the way he said it was it

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Speaker 1: was extraordinary to watch the last thing here. I was

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Speaker 1: thinking about this earlier and how we were going to

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Speaker 1: talk about it right before we came on, and I'm like,

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Speaker 1: I don't have to think about it. I just need

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Speaker 1: to ask you about it. To hear the president you've

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Speaker 1: experienced two pregnancies, and to hear someone and again, I

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Speaker 1: want to give an allow a little for this is

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Speaker 1: just kind of how he talks, like in being colloquial

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Speaker 1: and right tough it out, It is kind of a

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Speaker 1: gruff way he kind of goes about it. I want

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Speaker 1: to allow for a little bit of that's just how

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Speaker 1: he kind of speaks. And he meant no offense, but

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Speaker 1: how does that sound to a woman and who's been pregnant,

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Speaker 1: who's gone through a couple of pregnancies, anyone who's been

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Speaker 1: pregnant To be told that if you can't, if you

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Speaker 1: need medicine, that's just a matter of you not being

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Speaker 1: able to tough it out.

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Speaker 2: It reminds me of some of the shame that I felt.

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Speaker 2: And I think a lot of women who are listening

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Speaker 2: to this might understand. And look, I have nothing against

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Speaker 2: anyone who chooses to have a natural childbirth, But in return,

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Speaker 2: I did not appreciate a lot of the judgment that

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Speaker 2: some people will give you for having an epidural, because

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Speaker 2: they claim putting that epidural in your spinal column could

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Speaker 2: potentially have an impact on the baby, and you're actually

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Speaker 2: being not a good mom from the get go by

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Speaker 2: choosing to have a pain free or a much less

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Speaker 2: painful delivery, because they're not pain free, but a much

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Speaker 2: less painful delivery. And there was a lot Really, are

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Speaker 2: you sure? Have you done the reads search? Are you

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Speaker 2: sure you want the epidural? I just feel like there's

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Speaker 2: so much shame around women's choices as mothers and whether

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Speaker 2: or not their comfort or their bodies matter at all,

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Speaker 2: if all of a sudden, we're just a vessel and

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Speaker 2: we're here just to serve, and what we feel and

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Speaker 2: what we think and what we need don't matter. I

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Speaker 2: think both things matter, and so it is a sore subject,

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Speaker 2: and we could even get into it goes into whether

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Speaker 2: or not I couldn't breastfeed. Suddenly now I'm a bad

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Speaker 2: mother because I'm pulling out formula. It's just I feel

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Speaker 2: like there's just so much shame around choices that sometimes

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Speaker 2: we don't have a choice over, but sometimes just the

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Speaker 2: choices that we do make that are best for us,

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Speaker 2: that are best for our personal lives. So I don't

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Speaker 2: judge anyone else's choice. And they don't want to vaccinate,

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Speaker 2: and they want to live in a community where that's acceptable,

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Speaker 2: that's great, knock yourself out. But I just feel like

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Speaker 2: to have the president tell women to tough, I mean,

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Speaker 2: he really It wasn't even like he implied it or

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Speaker 2: he just said, I know it's hard. It was like,

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Speaker 2: suck it up, buttercup, and.

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Speaker 1: I just I.

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Speaker 2: Did take issue with it. I thought it was wildly

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Speaker 2: insensitive and not based in science that I'm ready to accept.

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Speaker 1: You know, it didn't feel at that point based in sympathy.

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Speaker 1: Just there's some things I will never be able to understand.

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Speaker 1: Men will never be able to I just won't be

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Speaker 1: able to understand what that feels like to be breaknant.

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Speaker 2: Three men standing up there telling women to suck it up. Now,

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Speaker 2: I know I didn't see her eye weird. It turned

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Speaker 2: it off by then, And I know they had mothers

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Speaker 2: there who obviously are hurting and suffering because their children

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Speaker 2: have autism, and I have the deepest sympathy and have

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Speaker 2: friends who are in that position, and so I I

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Speaker 2: don't know personally, but I can sympathize. But it doesn't

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Speaker 2: mean that one size fits all and that suddenly what

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Speaker 2: this press conference was is the remedy to solve the issue.

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Speaker 2: And I do know. I mean I heard RFK acknowledge

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Speaker 2: that it's a multi faceted disease that is not there's

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Speaker 2: no single remedy, So I did at least appreciate that

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Speaker 2: that was acknowledged. But yeah, that was a tough one

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Speaker 2: to watch.

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Speaker 1: Well, folks, this debate will not be over the robes.

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Speaker 1: Appreciate you as always with your honesty. I didn't know

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Speaker 1: I was going to ask you that until the end,

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Speaker 1: but I'm glad I asked you. But I was curious

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Speaker 1: to hear your perspective on being told to tough it out.

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Speaker 2: So I think you already knew my answer. And I

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Speaker 2: am a tough cookie. I've been through a lot, but

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Speaker 2: it doesn't mean that I needed to hear that.

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Speaker 1: Man, you cry about it though, all the time.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I'm an emotional I'm kidding.

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Speaker 1: I'm joking. Geez, all right, folks, Wherever you are, we

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Speaker 1: appreciate you as always hanging with us. We'll talk to

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Speaker 1: you all Rosson