1 00:00:04,440 --> 00:00:12,360 Speaker 1: Welcome to tech Stuff, a production from iHeartRadio. Hey Thearin, 2 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:15,880 Speaker 1: Welcome to tech Stuff. I'm your host, Jonathan Strickland. I'm 3 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:18,520 Speaker 1: an executive producer with iHeartRadio. And how the tech are 4 00:00:18,600 --> 00:00:22,239 Speaker 1: you today? I thought we'd talked about something that's both 5 00:00:22,239 --> 00:00:26,239 Speaker 1: a throwback and it's still very much current, which is 6 00:00:26,239 --> 00:00:30,800 Speaker 1: the networked communication system called us net. While I think 7 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:34,440 Speaker 1: just about everyone is familiar with certain Internet related services, 8 00:00:34,720 --> 00:00:38,960 Speaker 1: you know, like email or web browsing, maybe to a 9 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:43,879 Speaker 1: lesser extent, things like FTP, that sort of thingt I 10 00:00:43,920 --> 00:00:47,199 Speaker 1: think depends on the person. Some of you may have 11 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:51,040 Speaker 1: only heard or seen references to UNT, some of you 12 00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:52,879 Speaker 1: may never have heard of it at all, And of 13 00:00:52,920 --> 00:00:55,400 Speaker 1: course I think some of you are probably very familiar 14 00:00:55,400 --> 00:00:57,720 Speaker 1: with it. In fact, from what I understand you, SET 15 00:00:57,800 --> 00:01:02,800 Speaker 1: is actually kind of experiencing some lot of a renaissance 16 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:07,640 Speaker 1: among younger users like millennial and gen Z users. I 17 00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:10,520 Speaker 1: would not know. I'm gen X, so I'm out of 18 00:01:10,560 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 1: the loop everywhere. We're not even included in those articles 19 00:01:14,240 --> 00:01:17,040 Speaker 1: that are about all the different generations and how they 20 00:01:17,160 --> 00:01:19,880 Speaker 1: differ from each other. Gen X is always left out 21 00:01:19,880 --> 00:01:23,480 Speaker 1: of that, so I don't know what's going on with 22 00:01:23,520 --> 00:01:27,360 Speaker 1: my own generation. But I'm getting off track. So usenet 23 00:01:27,959 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 1: is older than the Web. When Tim berners Lee introduced 24 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:36,120 Speaker 1: the technology that would underlie the Worldwide Web in the 25 00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 1: early nineties, Usenet had already been a thing for more 26 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:43,560 Speaker 1: than a decade at that point. So our story begins 27 00:01:43,640 --> 00:01:47,400 Speaker 1: in North Carolina, primarily at Duke University. You had a 28 00:01:47,440 --> 00:01:51,240 Speaker 1: couple of graduate students at Duke named Jim Ellis and 29 00:01:51,400 --> 00:01:56,720 Speaker 1: Tom Truscott, and they were experimenting. They were creating a protocol. 30 00:01:56,920 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 1: And remember, a protocol is a set of rules, a 31 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:05,160 Speaker 1: set of instructions that a computer follows, and the protocols 32 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:10,639 Speaker 1: define how computers do certain tasks. They were working on 33 00:02:10,639 --> 00:02:15,560 Speaker 1: one called Unix to Unix Copy Protocol or UUCP. Now, 34 00:02:15,600 --> 00:02:18,919 Speaker 1: you also had a student at the University of North 35 00:02:18,960 --> 00:02:24,480 Speaker 1: Carolina Chapel Hill named Stephen Bellevian who would create software 36 00:02:24,520 --> 00:02:28,399 Speaker 1: that would leverage this protocol and allow people to interface 37 00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:31,880 Speaker 1: with it. He would become very important in the creation 38 00:02:32,080 --> 00:02:36,480 Speaker 1: of us neet. In fact, also he ended up writing 39 00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:39,000 Speaker 1: several articles about the history of us net that were 40 00:02:39,040 --> 00:02:42,920 Speaker 1: incredibly useful when I was putting this piece together. He 41 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:45,840 Speaker 1: wrote them for a circleid dot com, so you can 42 00:02:45,880 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 1: go there and read. I think it's a nine part 43 00:02:48,880 --> 00:02:52,760 Speaker 1: series where he goes into detail, sometimes great technical detail, 44 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:55,480 Speaker 1: which I will not be doing for this episode. I 45 00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:57,480 Speaker 1: think it goes beyond the scope of what I want 46 00:02:57,520 --> 00:02:59,919 Speaker 1: to do. Plus I'd be more likely to mess things 47 00:03:00,200 --> 00:03:05,520 Speaker 1: up than to save them correctly. Anyway, this protocol made 48 00:03:05,520 --> 00:03:09,880 Speaker 1: it possible for different computers to exchange files and messages 49 00:03:09,960 --> 00:03:14,200 Speaker 1: if they were networked to one another. And by computers 50 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:17,320 Speaker 1: I'm really talking about like mainframes and mini computers at 51 00:03:17,320 --> 00:03:21,200 Speaker 1: this point, primarily mini computers. Now, a mini computer is 52 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:23,840 Speaker 1: not the same thing as a desktop or a laptop. 53 00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:28,160 Speaker 1: Those would be micro computers. A mini computer was still 54 00:03:28,160 --> 00:03:32,679 Speaker 1: a big old honkin computer system, like back in the seventies. 55 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:36,720 Speaker 1: So a mainframe could potentially take up an entire room 56 00:03:36,840 --> 00:03:39,560 Speaker 1: or sometimes even an entire floor of a building. That's 57 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:43,720 Speaker 1: how big mainframe computers could be. A mini computer might 58 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:47,880 Speaker 1: be as small quote unquote as the size of an 59 00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:52,119 Speaker 1: entire desk or maybe a couple of refrigerators. These machines 60 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 1: often had pretty significant computing power for the time, but 61 00:03:57,200 --> 00:04:00,320 Speaker 1: they were not nearly as powerful as mainframes, or did 62 00:04:00,360 --> 00:04:04,840 Speaker 1: they have the capacity to process as much information per 63 00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 1: unit of time as a mainframe could. They were, however, 64 00:04:08,880 --> 00:04:13,000 Speaker 1: marginally not marginally, they were significantly less expensive than mainframes, 65 00:04:13,160 --> 00:04:16,360 Speaker 1: so they became a core component of computer science departments 66 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:21,839 Speaker 1: of various you know, schools that were specifically centered around technology. 67 00:04:22,400 --> 00:04:26,279 Speaker 1: One of those mini computers was the PDP eleven from 68 00:04:26,480 --> 00:04:31,400 Speaker 1: DC and it could run the Unix operating system. So 69 00:04:31,560 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 1: you know, there's lots of different opring systems out there. 70 00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:38,720 Speaker 1: Unix is one of the big ones, often used in 71 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:41,599 Speaker 1: things like like web servers and things of that nature. 72 00:04:41,720 --> 00:04:45,920 Speaker 1: Unix and Linux, whereas you know, we're mostly familiar with 73 00:04:46,040 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 1: either Mac up Brain system or Windows, depending on the 74 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:53,640 Speaker 1: type of machine you use. Anyway, the mini computer PDP 75 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:58,080 Speaker 1: eleven was the sort of computer system that graduate students 76 00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:02,799 Speaker 1: had access to. This this was before many computers would 77 00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:07,520 Speaker 1: be powerful enough to do anything significant in the computing world. 78 00:05:07,560 --> 00:05:10,960 Speaker 1: Like they were great for hobbyists. They had lots of 79 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:14,880 Speaker 1: useful tasks, but they were extremely limited. They would not 80 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:19,119 Speaker 1: be useful in a research capacity for the most part. 81 00:05:19,400 --> 00:05:23,320 Speaker 1: So the students also had access to dial up modems, 82 00:05:23,320 --> 00:05:26,480 Speaker 1: which at that time ran at a blistering three hundred 83 00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:30,640 Speaker 1: bps that stands for bits per second, so the three 84 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:33,560 Speaker 1: hundred bits per second is actually not blistering. That was 85 00:05:33,760 --> 00:05:38,520 Speaker 1: just a joke. Also, at this point, hardware displays were 86 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:41,400 Speaker 1: really rare. Like computer minors, you just didn't really have 87 00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:43,919 Speaker 1: them in a lot of these systems. So for a 88 00:05:43,920 --> 00:05:46,720 Speaker 1: lot of these mini computers, you would not get your 89 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:50,080 Speaker 1: results displayed on a screen. Instead, it would print on 90 00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:53,159 Speaker 1: a sheet of paper. So you would make some code 91 00:05:53,160 --> 00:05:56,360 Speaker 1: and then you would get a print out of results 92 00:05:56,400 --> 00:05:58,800 Speaker 1: and that would be when you'd find out whether or 93 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:01,520 Speaker 1: not your code was good. If it wasn't, it had 94 00:06:01,520 --> 00:06:04,640 Speaker 1: to go back and fix it and then print out again. 95 00:06:04,720 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 1: It was pretty wild stuff back in those days. Well, 96 00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:10,680 Speaker 1: it gets even better than that. The original use net 97 00:06:10,839 --> 00:06:15,960 Speaker 1: network relied on acoustic coupler modems. So this is the 98 00:06:16,080 --> 00:06:18,960 Speaker 1: kind of modem that, as the name implies, uses sound 99 00:06:19,320 --> 00:06:24,720 Speaker 1: acoustics to make connections between computers. So each computer would 100 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:27,320 Speaker 1: have a modem that would have a coupler, and the 101 00:06:27,360 --> 00:06:31,159 Speaker 1: coupler would hold a handset of a landline telephone, so 102 00:06:31,200 --> 00:06:34,919 Speaker 1: you would take the telephone out of its cradle. You 103 00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:38,200 Speaker 1: would put the telephone into the coupler the right way, 104 00:06:38,320 --> 00:06:40,719 Speaker 1: so that the microphones on one side, the speakers on 105 00:06:40,760 --> 00:06:44,080 Speaker 1: the other. You would then dial the number of the 106 00:06:44,080 --> 00:06:46,640 Speaker 1: computer system that you were hoping to connect to, which 107 00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:50,159 Speaker 1: also would have a handset and a coupler, and then 108 00:06:51,480 --> 00:06:55,280 Speaker 1: your computer would make noises indicating either a zero or 109 00:06:55,320 --> 00:06:58,320 Speaker 1: a one, so bits in other words, through the coupler, 110 00:06:59,080 --> 00:07:02,000 Speaker 1: and these noise would travel over the phone lines, just 111 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:05,240 Speaker 1: as voice communication would if two people were just talking 112 00:07:05,279 --> 00:07:07,440 Speaker 1: on the phone. So the motive on the other end 113 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:10,640 Speaker 1: would receive these noises and the coupler would convert them 114 00:07:10,640 --> 00:07:13,680 Speaker 1: into voltage signals that the computer would then interpret as 115 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 1: bits as zeros are wants, and you could have communication 116 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:20,320 Speaker 1: between computers this way. Now, the reason why the students 117 00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:23,440 Speaker 1: went with this specific method wasn't because that's the only 118 00:07:23,520 --> 00:07:27,200 Speaker 1: technology they had access to. Instead, it was because they 119 00:07:27,200 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 1: were trying to get around some pretty tough regulatory hurdles. 120 00:07:31,880 --> 00:07:34,800 Speaker 1: Back in those days, AT and T essentially had a 121 00:07:34,840 --> 00:07:39,920 Speaker 1: monopoly over phone communications within the United States, so this 122 00:07:40,000 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 1: approach helped sidestep some obstacles they would otherwise have faced 123 00:07:43,400 --> 00:07:46,320 Speaker 1: when trying to connect the systems together. Right because you're 124 00:07:46,320 --> 00:07:49,200 Speaker 1: doing a voice call rather than a data call, at 125 00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:53,160 Speaker 1: least as far as the telephone system is concerned. It's 126 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:57,440 Speaker 1: just sending signals of sound across You're not using it 127 00:07:57,480 --> 00:08:02,760 Speaker 1: as a data connection per se. And so it was 128 00:08:02,800 --> 00:08:05,960 Speaker 1: a way to kind of sidestep the very steep prices 129 00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:07,920 Speaker 1: you would have to pay in order to have a 130 00:08:08,000 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 1: data connection. So, by the way, AT and T tried 131 00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:14,320 Speaker 1: desperately to fight that and to make it so that 132 00:08:14,440 --> 00:08:17,920 Speaker 1: they could still charge enormous amounts of money for those connections, 133 00:08:18,280 --> 00:08:23,120 Speaker 1: but ultimately they lost that particular court battle. Anyway, Stephen 134 00:08:23,160 --> 00:08:27,880 Speaker 1: Bellvan wrote software to create a sort of client, kind 135 00:08:27,920 --> 00:08:30,080 Speaker 1: of like a web browser. It was a client that 136 00:08:30,080 --> 00:08:35,080 Speaker 1: would serve as the interface for use net and the 137 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 1: UUCP protocol, which I know, I just was repetitive. It's 138 00:08:38,679 --> 00:08:42,720 Speaker 1: like saying ATM machine. And also the computer systems and 139 00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:45,559 Speaker 1: modems were all doing the heavy lifting behind the scenes 140 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:49,560 Speaker 1: and stalling the software on different mini computers made it 141 00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:55,360 Speaker 1: possible to exchange information and files between these mini computers INI, 142 00:08:55,600 --> 00:08:58,800 Speaker 1: not A and Y. In fact, there were not very 143 00:08:58,840 --> 00:09:02,560 Speaker 1: many computers connected to use net at all initially, so 144 00:09:02,760 --> 00:09:06,160 Speaker 1: they called it use net, which is short for Users Network. 145 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:09,200 Speaker 1: The first three computers connected to the network were in 146 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:13,440 Speaker 1: Duke University Duke Medical School and the University of North 147 00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:17,680 Speaker 1: Carolina Chapel Hill. Obviously it would grow from there. But 148 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:22,240 Speaker 1: we're gonna have to really sit down and explain what 149 00:09:22,360 --> 00:09:25,160 Speaker 1: use net is and a bit about how it's organized, 150 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:27,920 Speaker 1: to really get an understanding of what makes it special. 151 00:09:28,480 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 1: So if you're at all familiar with Reddit, the description 152 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:34,480 Speaker 1: of use net is going to sound a little bit 153 00:09:34,600 --> 00:09:38,920 Speaker 1: familiar to you on a surface level. So the use 154 00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:43,320 Speaker 1: net network consists of discussion groups. These are called newsgroups. 155 00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:47,080 Speaker 1: These would be a lot like subreddits on Reddit. So 156 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:50,640 Speaker 1: each newsgroup is dedicated to a specific subject or topic. 157 00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:55,280 Speaker 1: Users can read and at least in most cases post 158 00:09:55,760 --> 00:09:59,000 Speaker 1: to newsgroups. There are limitations on that. I'll talk about 159 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:01,800 Speaker 1: that in a bit. And you can subscribe to specific 160 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:04,800 Speaker 1: newsgroups so that you can keep up with the new 161 00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 1: stuff that's posted to them. At least you can do that. Now, 162 00:10:08,040 --> 00:10:10,920 Speaker 1: that's not how it worked initially, because originally the client 163 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:15,960 Speaker 1: that Stephen Bellvan programmed was limited to updating the information 164 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 1: based on the last time you access the newsgroup according 165 00:10:21,080 --> 00:10:24,360 Speaker 1: to the computer's logs, and it would give you all 166 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:27,240 Speaker 1: the updates, so you couldn't just jump around and grab 167 00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:29,640 Speaker 1: just the stuff you were interested in in the one 168 00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:31,920 Speaker 1: newsgroup that you were Let's say that you are just 169 00:10:32,679 --> 00:10:36,520 Speaker 1: absolutely fascinated with Dudgeons and dragons, and that's the only 170 00:10:36,559 --> 00:10:39,040 Speaker 1: newsgroup you wanted to be part of, so that was 171 00:10:39,040 --> 00:10:42,880 Speaker 1: all you were focusing on. Well, with Bellevan's client, you 172 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:46,160 Speaker 1: would get everything, not just that newsgroup. The reason for 173 00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:48,600 Speaker 1: this is that Bellvan felt that usenet wouldn't get that 174 00:10:48,679 --> 00:10:52,080 Speaker 1: much traffic. He thought maybe it would generate an article 175 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:55,560 Speaker 1: or two per day, people would write a piece for 176 00:10:55,800 --> 00:10:58,760 Speaker 1: use net, or maybe you would get two pieces in 177 00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 1: a day, and so it'd be a very small update 178 00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:03,319 Speaker 1: each day. So there's no reason to worry about it 179 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:06,400 Speaker 1: because he was you know, at the time, we were 180 00:11:06,440 --> 00:11:10,240 Speaker 1: talking about three computers, and again there were many computers. 181 00:11:10,240 --> 00:11:11,960 Speaker 1: They were ones that you had to have access to 182 00:11:12,080 --> 00:11:14,520 Speaker 1: as a student to be able to even use in 183 00:11:14,559 --> 00:11:19,440 Speaker 1: the first place, so by by definition, it was limited. 184 00:11:20,600 --> 00:11:23,000 Speaker 1: Plus this is a you know, a newsgroup you would 185 00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:25,560 Speaker 1: only have access to if you had booked time with 186 00:11:25,679 --> 00:11:28,679 Speaker 1: that mini computer, which was a process. Right, you had 187 00:11:28,679 --> 00:11:31,440 Speaker 1: to access it, and that required you to sign up, 188 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:33,719 Speaker 1: and you know, sometimes you had a log book and 189 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:35,480 Speaker 1: everything so that you could have access to it so 190 00:11:35,520 --> 00:11:38,600 Speaker 1: that other students would know that at that time you 191 00:11:38,679 --> 00:11:43,760 Speaker 1: were accessing the computer system. Anyway, we're gonna take a 192 00:11:43,840 --> 00:11:45,560 Speaker 1: quick break. When we come back, I'll talk a little 193 00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:59,600 Speaker 1: bit more about some interesting comparison's contrasts with Reddit. Okay, 194 00:11:59,600 --> 00:12:03,079 Speaker 1: we're so. Reddit tends to be a place where users 195 00:12:03,160 --> 00:12:07,440 Speaker 1: share links to interesting stuff to a relevant subreddit reddit, 196 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 1: and then conversation will flow from there. So a fairly 197 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:15,960 Speaker 1: typical Reddit post might have a headline associated with a 198 00:12:16,040 --> 00:12:19,840 Speaker 1: news story, and you could click through and that will 199 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:22,000 Speaker 1: actually take you to the news story itself, or you 200 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:24,680 Speaker 1: can click into the messages and read the conversation around 201 00:12:24,679 --> 00:12:27,560 Speaker 1: the news item. But I mean, you could just have 202 00:12:27,600 --> 00:12:30,240 Speaker 1: a Reddit post that just is an original piece, a 203 00:12:30,320 --> 00:12:33,680 Speaker 1: user generated piece. Maybe it includes a photo or a 204 00:12:33,679 --> 00:12:37,720 Speaker 1: gift or something like that. But that's typically the way 205 00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:40,480 Speaker 1: reddits work, especially in the subreds I go to. Those 206 00:12:40,480 --> 00:12:46,520 Speaker 1: are almost always about sharing articles and links to interesting stuff. Well, 207 00:12:46,640 --> 00:12:50,200 Speaker 1: us neet was just originally limited to plain old text. 208 00:12:50,840 --> 00:12:53,880 Speaker 1: There was no Worldwide Web yet, so you couldn't hyperlink 209 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:57,040 Speaker 1: to a web page. Web pages didn't exist initially, you 210 00:12:57,080 --> 00:13:01,400 Speaker 1: couldn't upload a file to use net Folks did see 211 00:13:01,400 --> 00:13:03,920 Speaker 1: that would be really useful if you could do that, 212 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:07,040 Speaker 1: if you could create a way to upload and download 213 00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:09,840 Speaker 1: files to and from us net, but it would require 214 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:11,640 Speaker 1: a bit of work in order to make this possible. 215 00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:14,320 Speaker 1: As such, students started to work on a way to 216 00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:18,200 Speaker 1: allow for the uploading and downloading of binary files. So 217 00:13:19,679 --> 00:13:23,760 Speaker 1: binary refers to basic computer language. You know, it's zeros 218 00:13:23,760 --> 00:13:27,280 Speaker 1: and ones. Those zeros and ones can represent anything, you know. 219 00:13:27,320 --> 00:13:32,440 Speaker 1: We're talking everything from software to orchestral symphonies to the 220 00:13:32,600 --> 00:13:35,520 Speaker 1: dancing baby gif that was all the rage on the 221 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:39,440 Speaker 1: internet thanks to Ali mcbeil man. I'm dating myself with 222 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:43,600 Speaker 1: this episode. So these smarty pants students came up with 223 00:13:43,640 --> 00:13:48,400 Speaker 1: a way to encode binary data into text because that's 224 00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:51,319 Speaker 1: what us net could handle. It could handle text. So 225 00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:54,719 Speaker 1: you would take your program. You would then have to 226 00:13:54,760 --> 00:13:57,719 Speaker 1: convert your program into binary code. You would have to 227 00:13:57,760 --> 00:14:02,160 Speaker 1: convert the binary code into text and then upload that. 228 00:14:02,960 --> 00:14:07,920 Speaker 1: Someone else could then grab that thread of posts and 229 00:14:07,960 --> 00:14:12,319 Speaker 1: then use a decoder to decode the text back into binary, 230 00:14:12,440 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 1: and then finally convert the binary into whatever the original 231 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:18,280 Speaker 1: file format was. So there are a lot of steps, 232 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:22,840 Speaker 1: but it would work. But there was a catch because 233 00:14:22,920 --> 00:14:25,640 Speaker 1: used that articles have a limit as to how much 234 00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:29,080 Speaker 1: data they can hold. So typically uploading a file means 235 00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:31,840 Speaker 1: that the file is going to be split across multiple posts, 236 00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:36,000 Speaker 1: and by multiple I mean potentially lots of posts, because 237 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:39,160 Speaker 1: if you're trying to download something significantly large, like today, 238 00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:41,360 Speaker 1: if you were trying to download a high resolution video, 239 00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:44,720 Speaker 1: you could be talking about thousands of posts that make 240 00:14:44,840 --> 00:14:47,280 Speaker 1: up this video. So part of the issue was that 241 00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:51,320 Speaker 1: early encoding methods would inflate the file size significantly, by 242 00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:54,960 Speaker 1: like forty percent, so the file would get even larger 243 00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:57,960 Speaker 1: because of the encoding method Now, fortunately, folks would come 244 00:14:58,040 --> 00:15:01,400 Speaker 1: up with alternatives and they would find ways to encode 245 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:05,280 Speaker 1: the binary into texts that would reduce that overhead. Also, 246 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:07,960 Speaker 1: keep in mind that when us net was a new thing, 247 00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:09,840 Speaker 1: the folks who were using it were relying on those 248 00:15:09,880 --> 00:15:13,120 Speaker 1: dial up modems. They had really hefty limitations and how 249 00:15:13,160 --> 00:15:16,040 Speaker 1: much data they could download per second, so we weren't 250 00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:18,960 Speaker 1: typically talking about big files at least in the early 251 00:15:19,040 --> 00:15:22,840 Speaker 1: days of use net. Anyway, the support for binary files 252 00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:24,880 Speaker 1: meant that us neet would become a way to communicate 253 00:15:24,960 --> 00:15:28,280 Speaker 1: not just through text, but through files as well. This 254 00:15:28,400 --> 00:15:30,520 Speaker 1: is as you might imagine that led to some issues 255 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:34,760 Speaker 1: with piracy, but well that's a matter for another episode, 256 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:36,400 Speaker 1: so we're just going to move on and keep on 257 00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:39,520 Speaker 1: talking about us net. So a fundamental feature of us 258 00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:44,600 Speaker 1: net is that it's not a centralized service. This is 259 00:15:44,640 --> 00:15:47,920 Speaker 1: another way we can contrast it with Reddit. While Reddit 260 00:15:48,040 --> 00:15:51,080 Speaker 1: has some surface level similarities to us net, beneath the 261 00:15:51,080 --> 00:15:55,720 Speaker 1: hood things are very different. So Reddit is essentially centralized. 262 00:15:55,800 --> 00:15:59,280 Speaker 1: It means that the service ultimately runs on servers that 263 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:03,000 Speaker 1: Reddit either owns or leases from, like a cloud competing 264 00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:06,480 Speaker 1: provider such as Amazon Web Services. But the point is 265 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:11,320 Speaker 1: the underlying foundation for Reddit is in a centralized group 266 00:16:11,360 --> 00:16:15,080 Speaker 1: of servers. Centralized in this case doesn't necessarily mean geographically 267 00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:18,240 Speaker 1: by the way. That's because networking gets all whibbly wobbly, 268 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:22,760 Speaker 1: but it does mean that's in this definite, finite number 269 00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:26,680 Speaker 1: of servers, and that is where Reddit lives. Use net, 270 00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:31,240 Speaker 1: on the other hand, is decentralized. Anyone could create a 271 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:34,560 Speaker 1: use net server. You'd have to download the right software, 272 00:16:34,600 --> 00:16:37,680 Speaker 1: but you could do it. So the way use networks 273 00:16:37,760 --> 00:16:40,680 Speaker 1: is more like a peer to peer network. So let's 274 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:44,200 Speaker 1: say you create a use net server. You connect your 275 00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:47,880 Speaker 1: server to the use net network at large, You indicate 276 00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:50,880 Speaker 1: which news groups in particular you want to prioritize on 277 00:16:50,960 --> 00:16:55,560 Speaker 1: your server, and your server will regularly ping other servers, 278 00:16:55,600 --> 00:16:59,320 Speaker 1: the bigger nodes in use Net's network to look for 279 00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:02,800 Speaker 1: updates to those newsgroups and thus pull in new information 280 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:06,280 Speaker 1: whenever there is new information, and then your users on 281 00:17:06,320 --> 00:17:09,520 Speaker 1: your server can access that. Now, let's say that your 282 00:17:09,640 --> 00:17:12,320 Speaker 1: users on your server create a newsgroup that gets a 283 00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:15,400 Speaker 1: lot of popularity, and eventually other servers on the us 284 00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:19,760 Speaker 1: net network are interested in that newsgroup, so they start 285 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:24,400 Speaker 1: pigging your server and they get updates on your user's 286 00:17:24,440 --> 00:17:27,240 Speaker 1: newsgroup and they serve it to their users. So the 287 00:17:27,280 --> 00:17:32,560 Speaker 1: whole network is decentralized and to an extent asynchronous. You 288 00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:35,840 Speaker 1: might access a newsgroup and read an article and some 289 00:17:35,880 --> 00:17:38,440 Speaker 1: of the posts beneath it, and then you decide you 290 00:17:38,520 --> 00:17:40,359 Speaker 1: want to write your own response, So you create your 291 00:17:40,359 --> 00:17:43,640 Speaker 1: own response and you send it to post. Now that's 292 00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:48,119 Speaker 1: going to go to whatever server you're connected to through usnet, 293 00:17:48,560 --> 00:17:53,439 Speaker 1: But that doesn't automatically populate across every use net server 294 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:56,840 Speaker 1: that carries that newsgroup. That you have to wait for 295 00:17:56,920 --> 00:17:59,960 Speaker 1: them all to sort of synchronize, which means that they're 296 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:03,000 Speaker 1: there's going to be a time where some versions of 297 00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:05,320 Speaker 1: that news group are going to have your reply, some 298 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:09,200 Speaker 1: versions are not, and it means that other people might reply. 299 00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:11,440 Speaker 1: They might even make the same point you made. If 300 00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:13,840 Speaker 1: you're unlucky, they might make it better than you did, 301 00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:16,880 Speaker 1: and then you just seem to be, you know, repeating 302 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:19,560 Speaker 1: what someone else said. But when you wrote your post, 303 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:22,360 Speaker 1: you had that that reply didn't exist, or at least 304 00:18:22,400 --> 00:18:25,680 Speaker 1: you hadn't seen it yet because yours had not synchronized 305 00:18:25,960 --> 00:18:29,200 Speaker 1: with the most recent information. So it gets a little 306 00:18:29,320 --> 00:18:34,320 Speaker 1: bit like muddy when you're talking about, you know, what's 307 00:18:34,359 --> 00:18:36,639 Speaker 1: the latest information on us net. Well, it really depends 308 00:18:36,720 --> 00:18:40,800 Speaker 1: upon which server you're talking about and whether or not 309 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:45,280 Speaker 1: that was the point where new material was generated or 310 00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:48,800 Speaker 1: if in fact it's waiting to be propagated across the 311 00:18:48,920 --> 00:18:52,600 Speaker 1: entire network. Now. One benefit of this approach is that 312 00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 1: us net is somewhat shielded against censorship and interference because 313 00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:03,640 Speaker 1: there's no one to shut down it's distributed right now. 314 00:19:03,680 --> 00:19:07,399 Speaker 1: That doesn't mean that an authority cannot try, and even 315 00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:11,040 Speaker 1: in extreme cases, sometimes succeed to take stuff off us net. 316 00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:15,640 Speaker 1: But it ain't easy. It is a pretty tough thing 317 00:19:15,720 --> 00:19:18,480 Speaker 1: to do because there's not any one entity you can 318 00:19:18,520 --> 00:19:20,639 Speaker 1: go to like you can't. You could go to Reddit 319 00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:25,040 Speaker 1: and demand Reddit remove something, which you may or may 320 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:28,080 Speaker 1: not work, depending on the nature of the thing, but 321 00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:29,960 Speaker 1: you can't really do that with us net because again, 322 00:19:30,119 --> 00:19:33,840 Speaker 1: it's not one single entity that controls use net. It's 323 00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:39,280 Speaker 1: it's a hive mind. The structure of newsgroups actually follows hierarchies, 324 00:19:40,680 --> 00:19:45,600 Speaker 1: and that is like large categorizations. Right today, you could 325 00:19:45,680 --> 00:19:49,119 Speaker 1: argue the most famous use net hierarchy is the ALT hierarchy, 326 00:19:49,320 --> 00:19:53,240 Speaker 1: which is funny because the ALT in this case stands 327 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:57,440 Speaker 1: for alternative, specifically an alternative to the big seven newsgroup 328 00:19:57,520 --> 00:20:01,400 Speaker 1: hierarchies that are seen as the more establish but whatever, 329 00:20:01,800 --> 00:20:05,400 Speaker 1: that's not how everything started. There were no seven hierarchies 330 00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:08,400 Speaker 1: when use net first started. In fact, in the beginning, 331 00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:12,320 Speaker 1: there were only three hierarchies of newsgroups, and all that 332 00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:15,320 Speaker 1: was posted should fall under one of the three, and 333 00:20:15,440 --> 00:20:22,000 Speaker 1: it was adequate. So the three hierarchies were net, FA, FA, 334 00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:27,680 Speaker 1: and mod mod, So all newsgroups started with one of 335 00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:30,280 Speaker 1: those designations. So you might have one that says like 336 00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:36,000 Speaker 1: net dot discussion that would be a newsgroup. The net 337 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:38,520 Speaker 1: hierarchy was pretty much the catch all. It started as 338 00:20:38,520 --> 00:20:42,200 Speaker 1: a hierarchy for newsgroups that were focusing on conversations about 339 00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:47,280 Speaker 1: the network itself, but that rapidly expanded to non network topics, 340 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:50,840 Speaker 1: so you would get people creating like net dot politics 341 00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:55,680 Speaker 1: or net dot jokes. The FA hierarchy was an acronym 342 00:20:55,760 --> 00:20:59,879 Speaker 1: for from arpinnet. It got started after a student at 343 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:03,840 Speaker 1: the University of California at Berkeley named Mark Horton joined 344 00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:06,880 Speaker 1: usenet in nineteen eighty and started to add material from 345 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:10,880 Speaker 1: an arpinet mailing list to the network. Access to Arpinet 346 00:21:10,920 --> 00:21:13,600 Speaker 1: was really limited. It was very difficult to get access, 347 00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:16,199 Speaker 1: so what Horton was doing was kind of a service, 348 00:21:16,359 --> 00:21:20,199 Speaker 1: was providing other people the opportunity to read these mailing lists, 349 00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:23,360 Speaker 1: when otherwise they would not have any access to those 350 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:26,359 Speaker 1: mailing lists. So arpinnet was sort of a predecessor to 351 00:21:26,400 --> 00:21:29,479 Speaker 1: the Internet. It was the network where computer scientists and 352 00:21:29,560 --> 00:21:33,480 Speaker 1: engineers were developing the rules that would allow for Internet communication. 353 00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:38,560 Speaker 1: So some people say, like, it's the grandfather of the 354 00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:40,800 Speaker 1: Internet if you think of it that way. I think 355 00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:43,439 Speaker 1: that's a little oversimplification, but it kind of gets the 356 00:21:43,480 --> 00:21:47,240 Speaker 1: idea across. So Horton's contributions would lead to a new 357 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:51,159 Speaker 1: hierarchy dedicated to sharing information from Arbennet mailing lists, the 358 00:21:51,560 --> 00:21:57,400 Speaker 1: FA hierarchy, And originally that was a read only hierarchy, 359 00:21:57,520 --> 00:22:00,000 Speaker 1: so stuff that was posted to that newsgroup you could read, 360 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,440 Speaker 1: but you could not contribute to it unless you were 361 00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:06,600 Speaker 1: one of the authorized entities that could post from mailing 362 00:22:06,600 --> 00:22:13,720 Speaker 1: lists to that hierarchy. Then, as for the mod hierarchy, 363 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:16,360 Speaker 1: that was for newsgroups that needed to be a bit 364 00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:20,280 Speaker 1: more controlled and buttoned up, because it was pretty clear 365 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:24,920 Speaker 1: that as more students started to use Usenet, the tendency 366 00:22:24,960 --> 00:22:28,600 Speaker 1: to do goofy stuff like contributing off topic posts to 367 00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:32,879 Speaker 1: a thread or intentionally trying to start flame wars on 368 00:22:33,000 --> 00:22:36,720 Speaker 1: use net. That's really where that got started. These things would, 369 00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:40,440 Speaker 1: you know, derail conversations or sometimes completely pull focus from 370 00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:44,239 Speaker 1: whatever the topic at discussion was supposed to be. So 371 00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:48,800 Speaker 1: the mod hierarchy was moderated. That's what MOD stood for. 372 00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:52,960 Speaker 1: It was a moderated hierarchy. Every post under the mod 373 00:22:53,040 --> 00:22:57,359 Speaker 1: hierarchy would have to be approved by a moderator before 374 00:22:57,480 --> 00:23:01,359 Speaker 1: it was posted to. A newsgroup is often used for 375 00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:05,560 Speaker 1: stuff like official news and official announcements, that kind of 376 00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:09,879 Speaker 1: stuff where you didn't want the Hoi poloi to start 377 00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:13,440 Speaker 1: mucking everything up and confusing the message. So those were 378 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:18,320 Speaker 1: your three You had your NET, your FA, and your 379 00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:21,720 Speaker 1: MOD and things would carry along that way until we 380 00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:25,679 Speaker 1: would get to the mid eighties. I'll explain more, but 381 00:23:25,720 --> 00:23:33,560 Speaker 1: first let's take another quick break to thank our sponsors. 382 00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:41,160 Speaker 1: So we're up to the mid eighties. So remember us 383 00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:44,560 Speaker 1: NET kind of got start in seventy nine, really got 384 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:47,959 Speaker 1: going in nineteen eighty. We get up to around nineteen 385 00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:50,880 Speaker 1: eighty six and into nineteen eighty seven, and a few 386 00:23:50,920 --> 00:23:53,680 Speaker 1: things happened that would shake things up for us NET 387 00:23:53,720 --> 00:23:57,800 Speaker 1: in a really significant way. For one, graduate students Phil 388 00:23:57,880 --> 00:24:01,720 Speaker 1: Lapsley of the University of California, Berkeley and Brian Cantor 389 00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:05,800 Speaker 1: of University of California, San Diego wrote a Request for 390 00:24:05,920 --> 00:24:09,600 Speaker 1: Comments or RFC in nineteen eighty six in which they 391 00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:14,000 Speaker 1: described the specification for a new set of rules called 392 00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:19,400 Speaker 1: the Network News Transfer Protocol or in INTP. SO from 393 00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:22,520 Speaker 1: nineteen seventy nine to nineteen eighty six, the primary way 394 00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:27,400 Speaker 1: that you know, people were accessing use net was through 395 00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:33,240 Speaker 1: these time shared mini computer systems, So you didn't really 396 00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:36,720 Speaker 1: have access unless you had booked that time with the 397 00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:40,080 Speaker 1: mini computer, and as I said, that had really limited things. 398 00:24:40,760 --> 00:24:45,560 Speaker 1: NNTP made it more possible to access us net using 399 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:49,160 Speaker 1: a microcomputer a personal computer, because by the mid eighties 400 00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:51,639 Speaker 1: these were now a thing that were capable enough to 401 00:24:51,680 --> 00:24:54,280 Speaker 1: be able to do something like that. So you would 402 00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:58,600 Speaker 1: be able to access read and post to use neet 403 00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:05,280 Speaker 1: groups by connectting your mini computer to whatever use net 404 00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:10,880 Speaker 1: server you happened to be able to access. So NNTP 405 00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:13,359 Speaker 1: is what made that all possible, and that would greatly 406 00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:15,840 Speaker 1: extend the access for use net, which meant also that 407 00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:20,760 Speaker 1: volume the posts on us net would increase dramatically as 408 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:25,760 Speaker 1: a result. This then led to the Great Renaming, and 409 00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:28,959 Speaker 1: yes that's what it's referenced as the Great Renaming. It 410 00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:33,440 Speaker 1: gets a bit dramatic, but as I mentioned earlier, Steve Bellevan, 411 00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:37,600 Speaker 1: the guy who created the first use net client, imagine 412 00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:40,520 Speaker 1: that us net would see maybe one to two new 413 00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:43,760 Speaker 1: articles posted there per day, but us net was generating 414 00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:46,879 Speaker 1: way more than that by the mid nineteen eighties, and 415 00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:50,040 Speaker 1: the creation of n NTP would complicate matters because access 416 00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:53,000 Speaker 1: to us net would grow substantially, and so it was 417 00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,200 Speaker 1: becoming a bit of a mess, right, You just had 418 00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:58,879 Speaker 1: these three hierarchies that were trying to handle everything, and 419 00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:02,440 Speaker 1: the really the only differenterentiation between the hierarchies was that 420 00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:05,840 Speaker 1: the net hierarchy was essentially the one where anyone could 421 00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:09,880 Speaker 1: post content. The FA or FAW hierarchy was the one 422 00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:13,840 Speaker 1: that was just for posting content from mailing lists, and 423 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:16,560 Speaker 1: the mod was for moderated posts, and that was it. 424 00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:18,719 Speaker 1: Everything had to fall into those, but it made it 425 00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:23,320 Speaker 1: really hard to organize and find stuff, like if you 426 00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:26,840 Speaker 1: were searching for something specific, it was hard to find. Now, 427 00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:30,639 Speaker 1: the use net network is decentralized, as I mentioned, but 428 00:26:30,840 --> 00:26:34,880 Speaker 1: Stephen Bellivan explained in those incredible posts that I talked 429 00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:38,520 Speaker 1: about on circleid dot com. They're well worth checking out. 430 00:26:39,440 --> 00:26:42,960 Speaker 1: Some of the nodes in this network held more sway 431 00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:46,520 Speaker 1: than others. They saw more traffic, and so the administrators 432 00:26:46,520 --> 00:26:50,600 Speaker 1: for those use net servers had a bit more power 433 00:26:51,080 --> 00:26:53,359 Speaker 1: than someone who's running a server that gets very little 434 00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:56,199 Speaker 1: traffic at all. And those nodes, along with some of 435 00:26:56,200 --> 00:26:59,720 Speaker 1: the folks who actually were responsible for building use net, 436 00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:05,600 Speaker 1: initially they became known as the backbone cabal. This became 437 00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:09,160 Speaker 1: like a long standing joke in usenet circles about whether 438 00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:13,600 Speaker 1: or not this cabal existed or didn't. But really, what 439 00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:16,639 Speaker 1: it just meant was that collectively they had the power 440 00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:20,320 Speaker 1: to decide what would or would not get wide distribution 441 00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:23,200 Speaker 1: across all of use Net. So let's say that there's 442 00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:27,080 Speaker 1: some sort of extraordinary circumstance that comes up and these 443 00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:33,600 Speaker 1: administrators collectively decide that those newsgroups are bad news, like 444 00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:37,600 Speaker 1: it's just it's dangerous or harmful or whatever you may think. 445 00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:40,280 Speaker 1: And it would have to be extraordinary for this to happen, 446 00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:44,359 Speaker 1: but it could happen. So collectively they decide that they're 447 00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:47,879 Speaker 1: not going to propagate that newsgroup. Well, that would limit 448 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:51,440 Speaker 1: the circulation of that newsgroup. It wouldn't prevent it from existing. 449 00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:54,199 Speaker 1: It would still exist on whatever home server it was 450 00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:58,479 Speaker 1: posted to. It just wouldn't propagate to other use Net servers, 451 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:00,240 Speaker 1: or at least not the big ones, which means means 452 00:28:00,520 --> 00:28:03,440 Speaker 1: it would limit the number of people who actually saw 453 00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:07,879 Speaker 1: and could interact with that post. So effectively, it could 454 00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:12,560 Speaker 1: be kind of like censoring that newsgroup. But again, this 455 00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:15,720 Speaker 1: didn't happen that frequently. It's just it was possible because 456 00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:19,679 Speaker 1: of the way usenet works. So this cabal debated and 457 00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:23,680 Speaker 1: discussed creating a new group of hierarchies that thet newsgroups 458 00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:27,080 Speaker 1: could inhabit to make things a little more manageable. This 459 00:28:27,160 --> 00:28:31,000 Speaker 1: in itself became a very long and detailed debate because 460 00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:34,320 Speaker 1: there are so many different ways you can classify information. 461 00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:38,040 Speaker 1: If you don't believe me, ask a librarian, Ask a 462 00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:42,160 Speaker 1: librarian about things like taxonomies and finding out like how 463 00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:46,400 Speaker 1: do you determine where does a book belong in? What 464 00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:50,760 Speaker 1: category should you put any one book? It gets really 465 00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:56,240 Speaker 1: complicated and subjective, So, for example, how would you classify 466 00:28:56,440 --> 00:29:00,680 Speaker 1: video games? Should you put it in like recreation or hobbies? 467 00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:04,320 Speaker 1: Or does it belong in technology or in business or 468 00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:07,600 Speaker 1: in programming. It kind of depends upon the point of view, 469 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:11,520 Speaker 1: So some decisions would appear mostly arbitrary because when you 470 00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:14,320 Speaker 1: get down to it, they kind of were. So the 471 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:17,720 Speaker 1: new big seven hierarchies that were created in this great 472 00:29:17,800 --> 00:29:23,320 Speaker 1: renaming were COMP for computer news, which is self explanatory, 473 00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:30,880 Speaker 1: REC for recreation, CIG for science sci, SoC for social sec, 474 00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:37,280 Speaker 1: TALK for general discussion, and MISK for miscellaneous. These were 475 00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:39,560 Speaker 1: not the only hierarchies, but these were the big ones, 476 00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:44,800 Speaker 1: the ones that had the most newsgroups under them. Then 477 00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:48,200 Speaker 1: you had alt which became the alternative hierarchy for newsgroups 478 00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:50,480 Speaker 1: that didn't really fit into the other ones, or that 479 00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:55,800 Speaker 1: were not being accepted into the other hierarchies. At least initially, 480 00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:58,040 Speaker 1: it was possible for a newsgroup to migrate to a 481 00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:02,920 Speaker 1: different hierarchy over enough time, but yeah, it was it 482 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:07,280 Speaker 1: would make the organization a little wonky. So it again 483 00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:12,280 Speaker 1: extraordinary circumstances. The Big Seven in the nineties would depending 484 00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,120 Speaker 1: on whom you ask, would become the Big Eight because 485 00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:17,880 Speaker 1: there was a hierarchy called Humanities that joined the party 486 00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:21,680 Speaker 1: that some people would say kind of belongs with the 487 00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:26,800 Speaker 1: Big Seven. But honestly, there are hundreds of hierarchies. Some 488 00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:30,400 Speaker 1: of them are also pretty big, like biz biz. That's 489 00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:35,480 Speaker 1: a hierarchy dedicated to business newsgroups. It's a pretty happening 490 00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:40,840 Speaker 1: newsgroup or hierarchy, i should say. So there are lots 491 00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 1: of them out there. Some of them just get very 492 00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:47,600 Speaker 1: specific to things like education, that kind of stuff. And 493 00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:51,480 Speaker 1: so numerous use net groups formed. Some of them flourished, 494 00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:54,920 Speaker 1: some of them failed. Some would become the backbone to 495 00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:59,800 Speaker 1: future web content. IMDb dot Com famously started off as 496 00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:03,200 Speaker 1: a use neet group before it became the Internet Movie database, 497 00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:06,280 Speaker 1: and I'm sure no one thought that it was going 498 00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:08,840 Speaker 1: to grow into something that would later get scooped up 499 00:31:08,840 --> 00:31:11,640 Speaker 1: by Amazon when it was still part of a use 500 00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:15,360 Speaker 1: net group. And usnet is still going on strong today. 501 00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:18,800 Speaker 1: There are news groups that are dead, but that's because 502 00:31:18,800 --> 00:31:22,200 Speaker 1: they were focusing on topics that are themselves obsolete. Today 503 00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:25,360 Speaker 1: it would be very strange to find a lively discussion 504 00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:27,920 Speaker 1: about like five and a quarter inch disk drives. Who 505 00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:32,520 Speaker 1: the heck is using them? Besides like very niche hobbyists, 506 00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:37,840 Speaker 1: use net is very different other types of Internet activity 507 00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:42,200 Speaker 1: as well. Use net does not track user behaviors, So 508 00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:45,760 Speaker 1: that's one major difference between using us net versus the web. 509 00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:49,560 Speaker 1: When you're on the web, everyone wants to track you, right, 510 00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:52,920 Speaker 1: There's so many different ways to track user behaviors and 511 00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:58,000 Speaker 1: user web history, and that information becomes valuable. That is 512 00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:00,720 Speaker 1: the currency of the Internet. That's what's being bought and 513 00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:05,160 Speaker 1: sold by data brokers. That's the stuff that is valuable 514 00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:08,640 Speaker 1: about you. You don't get to realize that value. You 515 00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 1: are the product you are being bought and sold. And 516 00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:14,080 Speaker 1: that's just the way it is when you're using the web. 517 00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:17,480 Speaker 1: Use net though it doesn't track user behavior, so you 518 00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:21,120 Speaker 1: can subscribe to whichever use net groups you want. The 519 00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:24,280 Speaker 1: use net server isn't paying attention to who is doing what, 520 00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:29,400 Speaker 1: and so there's a lot more privacy in that regard 521 00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:32,360 Speaker 1: as to you know what you are actually consuming on 522 00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:36,600 Speaker 1: use net versus on the web. There are lots of 523 00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:38,400 Speaker 1: use net clients out there. There are a lot of 524 00:32:38,440 --> 00:32:41,560 Speaker 1: newsreaders out there that you can use. Some of them 525 00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:44,520 Speaker 1: are built into web browsers. There are also a lot 526 00:32:44,560 --> 00:32:48,160 Speaker 1: of use net service providers out there, some of which 527 00:32:48,200 --> 00:32:50,800 Speaker 1: have subscriptions that you have to pay in order to 528 00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:54,440 Speaker 1: access them, but it means that you can access that 529 00:32:54,560 --> 00:32:58,680 Speaker 1: particular provider and get advantages that you would over say 530 00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:02,440 Speaker 1: a smaller provider, like a really big provider will have 531 00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:05,680 Speaker 1: features that you won't find with smaller providers. One of 532 00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:11,080 Speaker 1: the things that net servers have is a retention policy. 533 00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:16,320 Speaker 1: That's how long they will hold a file before deleting it. 534 00:33:17,280 --> 00:33:21,120 Speaker 1: So you know, if you find one that has a 535 00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:25,720 Speaker 1: retention policy of a thousand days or more, that's pretty good. 536 00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:28,080 Speaker 1: I think I saw one that had more than five 537 00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:32,160 Speaker 1: thousand days retention policy, and that means you'll have access 538 00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:37,680 Speaker 1: to the most files that you can, because ultimately, as 539 00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:40,840 Speaker 1: time passes, they will get deleted off use net. So 540 00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:45,360 Speaker 1: depending on which provider you're using to connect to use net, 541 00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:50,680 Speaker 1: you will have access to certain user generated content. If 542 00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:55,600 Speaker 1: you're on a different provider, they might delete files more frequently, 543 00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:58,360 Speaker 1: you're not going to get access to them. There's also 544 00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:00,760 Speaker 1: like limitations to things like how much you can pull 545 00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:03,960 Speaker 1: down per month for some providers. Some of them offer 546 00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:07,320 Speaker 1: unlimited plans that kind of thing. So there's a lot 547 00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:10,439 Speaker 1: of variety when it comes to the actual providers out there. 548 00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:13,920 Speaker 1: But yeah, that's kind of the lowdown on us net. 549 00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:17,080 Speaker 1: What's interesting to me is that, again I have read 550 00:34:17,080 --> 00:34:20,560 Speaker 1: things that suggested that millennials and Gen Z users are 551 00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:23,279 Speaker 1: kind of migrating over to us net more and more, 552 00:34:23,680 --> 00:34:27,480 Speaker 1: which is news to me. I think that's really interesting, 553 00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:31,560 Speaker 1: and especially since like I associate use net with an 554 00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:36,280 Speaker 1: old method of accessing the Internet. And for the record, 555 00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:39,200 Speaker 1: I had access to use net a little bit in 556 00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:43,320 Speaker 1: my youth and my college years and everything, but truth 557 00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:48,120 Speaker 1: be told, I kind of went from BBS's bulletin board systems, 558 00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:51,440 Speaker 1: which are you know, that's where you're logging into a 559 00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:56,520 Speaker 1: local computer or a single computer not a network, and 560 00:34:56,560 --> 00:35:00,000 Speaker 1: you're getting you're posting and retrieving information to that compute, 561 00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:03,799 Speaker 1: and you're not networked into a larger system. I went 562 00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:07,959 Speaker 1: from that to telnet, and from tel net I went 563 00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:10,200 Speaker 1: to the World Wide Web. So I didn't use us 564 00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:14,000 Speaker 1: net that much when I was in college, which was 565 00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:18,720 Speaker 1: in the early nineties, so this was mostly me learning 566 00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:22,440 Speaker 1: about it because I had only had limited access to usnet. 567 00:35:22,560 --> 00:35:25,279 Speaker 1: I did hear about it quite a bit, like you 568 00:35:25,320 --> 00:35:28,480 Speaker 1: would always hear about the various alt news groups that 569 00:35:28,520 --> 00:35:36,000 Speaker 1: were catering to some rather varied interests. I will say, 570 00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:40,480 Speaker 1: but I never frequented them because I was more too 571 00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:43,240 Speaker 1: busy tell netting into chat rooms and chatting with people 572 00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:47,200 Speaker 1: in other colleges just for the heck of it. So 573 00:35:47,239 --> 00:35:51,279 Speaker 1: that's it. That's our little overview of what us net is. 574 00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:54,080 Speaker 1: I almost said was, but it really is still a thing. 575 00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:57,719 Speaker 1: I hope you are all well, and I will talk 576 00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:08,400 Speaker 1: to you again really soon. Tech Stuff is an iHeartRadio production. 577 00:36:08,680 --> 00:36:13,719 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 578 00:36:13,840 --> 00:36:15,840 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.