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Speaker 1: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome back to the pod Least That's Podcast.

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Speaker 1: My guest today the CEO of Artist Meet International Agent

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Speaker 1: Dennis Alfan. Dennis, good to have you on the podcast

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Speaker 1: and nice to be a Okay, we were talking on

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Speaker 1: the phone and you stay to listening to the Repeto

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Speaker 1: podcast and he was talking about agents and you wanted

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Speaker 1: to give your perspective on what he had to say,

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Speaker 1: So why don't you let it ripped there? Well, I

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Speaker 1: thought Michael had a lot of very intelligent and wise

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Speaker 1: things that he said. Um, but the one factor that

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Speaker 1: I thought should be addressed was how the agency game

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Speaker 1: is affected by the buying game of major touring companies.

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Speaker 1: And a lot of times the one say an artist

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Speaker 1: is repped by a Live Nation a G A lot

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Speaker 1: of the artists don't see the need to have to

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Speaker 1: pay the same commission anymore because a lot of the

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Speaker 1: services that they provide are now provided by the promoter.

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Speaker 1: So the A game, the A list, A lot of

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Speaker 1: agencies have been affected by this and therefore it's very

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Speaker 1: hard for them to maintain that commission level. Therefore, the

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Speaker 1: A game is very much threatened by um, you know

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Speaker 1: the big bucks that the major promoters pay out. Okay,

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Speaker 1: you're the agent from Metallica. Metallica made an overall deal

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Speaker 1: with Live Nation on their last big tour. As the agent,

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Speaker 1: did you still commission Metallica or you squeezed out? Yes,

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Speaker 1: we still and we still have a relationship, but our

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Speaker 1: our relationship was directly affected by their relationship with Metallica.

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Speaker 1: Just to be very clear, you're talking about your financial relationship. Yes,

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Speaker 1: that's all the financial relationship. Okay, So when someone makes

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Speaker 1: an overall deal with a G or Live Nation, what

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Speaker 1: services does the agent still provide? Well, you know, it

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Speaker 1: all depends on the agent or the agency I mean

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Speaker 1: some agents. I mean sometimes the agent just gets a

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Speaker 1: free ride. I mean, may do the routing, may participate

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Speaker 1: in putting the packages together, may have overall marketing viewpoints.

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Speaker 1: But um, many times, um, you know. But but certainly

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Speaker 1: the agent isn't going out there and most of the

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Speaker 1: time making the building deals, the agent isn't going out there.

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Speaker 1: And you know, and um, basically a lot of the

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Speaker 1: agency skills are negated by Live Nations or a G. Okay,

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Speaker 1: just in terms of your experience, not only your own agency.

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Speaker 1: When people make the overall touring deals with a big

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Speaker 1: corporate entity to most of them keep the regent or

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Speaker 1: most squeeze their agent out. I mean sometimes sometimes the

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Speaker 1: agent gets squeezed out. Sometimes the agent gets you know,

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Speaker 1: um has a limited roles. Sometimes the agent tries to

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Speaker 1: act like they're very involved a lot of times. Uh hey,

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Speaker 1: there are there are promoters within Live Nation who go

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Speaker 1: to their touring their national touring partners to buy acts locally,

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Speaker 1: not necessarily to the agents. I mean, there are promoters

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Speaker 1: who actually just buy within the their own their own

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Speaker 1: promotion company to be able to secure acts. Okay, just

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Speaker 1: to be clear, every level of act or just the superstars.

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Speaker 1: Uh well, I would say, uh that can exist for

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Speaker 1: every level of an act, but superstars certainly uh are

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Speaker 1: numero uno. Okay, let's let's just assume whether you're getting

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Speaker 1: paid or not, the Live Nation or age is promoting

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Speaker 1: the tour. Do you think that they do as good

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Speaker 1: a job as what an independent agent would do making deals? Well,

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Speaker 1: let me put it here this way. Most agents are

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Speaker 1: booking agents. And if I was managing a superstar band

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Speaker 1: that could sell out basically every arena or stadium, I

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Speaker 1: would probably not need the agent because most most promoters

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Speaker 1: are more fluent and more educated about what's inside a

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Speaker 1: deal than an agent. Many of the agents is uh,

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Speaker 1: many of the agencies are in a volume business. They

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Speaker 1: don't have the time to be into all of this detail.

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Speaker 1: They don't have the time to focus on all the

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Speaker 1: nuances that really go inside a deal. So if I

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Speaker 1: was a manager and I had a superstar act, there's

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Speaker 1: very few agents in the world that can actually, um

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Speaker 1: know where all the bodies are buried in all the

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Speaker 1: deals you can count on one hand and not only

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Speaker 1: know about it in America, but Europe, Australia, around the world.

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Speaker 1: There's very few agents you can count on one hand

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Speaker 1: that booked the world. Okay, so let's assume you can

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Speaker 1: you do a better job than the big corporate entay,

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Speaker 1: and what do you do differently? Well, I can certainly, um,

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Speaker 1: I have the ability to do as well um as anybody.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know, earlier in my career, I remember

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Speaker 1: one time I had a superstar film agent in the

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Speaker 1: dressing room of one of my artists and he says, oh,

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Speaker 1: I'm not hitting on the artists money. And it became

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Speaker 1: my goal to never have anybody a promoter. Anybody can say,

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Speaker 1: I can get you more money for your artists than

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Speaker 1: you can. So I made it my business to become

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Speaker 1: an expert in the touring nuances. And then you deals

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Speaker 1: and all the ancilliaries. There's the gross and then there's

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Speaker 1: the gross gross, and I become a student of that game.

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Speaker 1: And I you know, so when we have deals with

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Speaker 1: some of our artists, Um, if you can do better

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Speaker 1: than me, then you're losing money. Okay, let's just say

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Speaker 1: in a perfect world, the band is offered a deal

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Speaker 1: by a major entity, or they could go market by

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Speaker 1: market using you. Which would way would you say to

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Speaker 1: go me? Because because I have an overview of the

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Speaker 1: whole world. Again, there's only a very few. There's a

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Speaker 1: few promoters that have an overview, but very few have

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Speaker 1: an overview of the whole world. And so I would um,

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Speaker 1: and you know, and then sometimes it depends on what

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Speaker 1: flavor ice cream you like. Some like vanilla, so I'm

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Speaker 1: like chocolate. You may like somebody else as opposed to me.

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Speaker 1: You may like somebody else's personality, but at least we

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Speaker 1: can compete on an equal playing field. And there aren't

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Speaker 1: many that compete on that playing that that that elite

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Speaker 1: playing field, um that you can. You know that that

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Speaker 1: that most can compete with, and I think there's very

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Speaker 1: few agents and there's very few promoters on that level. Okay. Now,

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Speaker 1: if you're the act, Live Nation is writing you a check,

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Speaker 1: it's their obligation to sell the tickets. Whereas if you

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Speaker 1: go market by market, anything could happen. Okay, you could

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Speaker 1: have a cancelation, you could have a COVID for some reason,

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Speaker 1: sales or weak. So if you're saying, hey, I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: sell by market by market, someone else might say, yeah,

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Speaker 1: if I take the lups some I'm guaranteed. I'm not

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Speaker 1: quite clear what you're saying. I'm trying to say is

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Speaker 1: let's say I'm an act and I'm going to do

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Speaker 1: a thirty day tour and Live Nation offers me X

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Speaker 1: They're gonna pay me that, irrelevant of how many tickets

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Speaker 1: are sold. Okay, they're guaranteeing me that. Whereas if I

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Speaker 1: go market by market. Are you saying that you can

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Speaker 1: equal that guarantee? Sure, no problem. Sure, Hey I can

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Speaker 1: sell it to Live Nation or a g okay and

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Speaker 1: be the one still overseeing what's going on, and I

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Speaker 1: still listen. I live with Live Nation and a G

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Speaker 1: all the time. They're my partners and and and and

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Speaker 1: many of my deals. But it's but the quarterbacking comes

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Speaker 1: here from here, not necessarily from them. I may be

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Speaker 1: directing how my artists should be presented, not having them

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Speaker 1: tell me how my audis should be presented. So I

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Speaker 1: am directing the game and were yeah, using um, you

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Speaker 1: know their strengths and and and and so um. That's

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Speaker 1: the difference is I can work with them, except I'm

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Speaker 1: quarterbacking as opposed to them quarterbacking me. Okay, a couple

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Speaker 1: of questions. Let's just assume go back to that thirty

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Speaker 1: state thirty day tour in America. Live Nature Age will

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Speaker 1: say I'm writing you a check for X. Let's say

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Speaker 1: you're saying the act, don't take that check. I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: go to independence market by market. Okay, assuming you do that.

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Speaker 1: If you add up all the guarantees, will those equal

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Speaker 1: the Live Nation guarantee. It doesn't have to be either

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Speaker 1: or it doesn't have to be independence. You can have

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Speaker 1: the same result, and you can you know, working with

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Speaker 1: Live Nation or independence or a e G or um.

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Speaker 1: You know you can have that same result without having

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Speaker 1: to give up control. So that's what I'm talking about

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Speaker 1: is control there your partner, and it takes a village,

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Speaker 1: but you don't have to give up control, as opposed

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Speaker 1: to somebody else buying the tour and they took control.

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Speaker 1: They're determining which Marcus to play, They're determining what the

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Speaker 1: prices should be. They may consult you, but with me,

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Speaker 1: it's tries to try to be it's the other way around.

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Speaker 1: I'm quarterbacking. Okay, let me try to drive to a

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Speaker 1: very small point here. Let's say you're you know, Pink

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Speaker 1: Floyd led Zeppelin, and you're gonna get back together where

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Speaker 1: you think you're you know, you should go clean absolutely

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Speaker 1: everywhere all over the world. Okay, can you make more

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Speaker 1: money making individual deals than you can if you take

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Speaker 1: the lump sum? You can? You know? Um you know.

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Speaker 1: When uh the Metallica deal went down, I was asked

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Speaker 1: to review the deal and tell and tell the management

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Speaker 1: whether the numbers were right? With these the right numbers

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Speaker 1: that we're getting, Are we getting what an act of

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Speaker 1: superstar caliber of Metallica? Are we making those kind of dollars?

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Speaker 1: And the answer was yes. But I could answer the question, Okay,

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Speaker 1: if you're making an overall deal, but I can break that.

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Speaker 1: I can break that down individually too, you know. So

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Speaker 1: when I see the markets in the cities and I

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Speaker 1: see what all the deals are, I then under I

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Speaker 1: can take a look at it and say, yes, you

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Speaker 1: are making the maximum out of these cities and out

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Speaker 1: of these venues, or you're not. Okay if you're making

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Speaker 1: an overall deal. Generally speaking, whether and there's two categories,

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Speaker 1: you and the full of other people who understand everything.

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Speaker 1: Are you leaving money on the table to have a

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Speaker 1: guaranteed sum. I think there's a risk reward. I think

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Speaker 1: you know, I mean I I don't think of it.

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Speaker 1: Here's what I'm aware. If I'm leaving something on the table,

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Speaker 1: I'm aware of what I left on the table, and

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Speaker 1: I'm aware of what everybody's making. So pending on what

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Speaker 1: your risk is to me has a lot to do

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Speaker 1: with what your reward should be if you if it is.

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Speaker 1: There are promoters that will offer artists and no guarantee,

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Speaker 1: and they basically throw every side back into the deal

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Speaker 1: that they're gonna make, but they're not taking they're not

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Speaker 1: taking much of a risk except paying the venue. Course. Now,

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Speaker 1: somebody who's guaranteeing somebody four or five million dollars a

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Speaker 1: night or whatever the number is. That's taken a risk,

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Speaker 1: so they may you may let them, you know, um

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Speaker 1: take a greater a greater profit, so you really So

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Speaker 1: that's that's up to the the the artist, the manager,

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Speaker 1: the you know, the agent who has ever involved to

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Speaker 1: make that decision. But at least you need to have

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Speaker 1: the knowledge of what the whole picture looks like it

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Speaker 1: before you can decide what's the fair game to play. Okay,

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Speaker 1: you talk about this knowledge and a handful of people

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Speaker 1: who have it. As we go forward, no one's gonna

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Speaker 1: live forever. Is this going to be a lost art

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Speaker 1: or will there be new people with this knowledge? Are

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Speaker 1: we talking about people are just agents or managers are promoters? Well,

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Speaker 1: we're talking about people who don't work for the big corporation,

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Speaker 1: whether it be individual agents or individual managers. I listen,

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Speaker 1: it's a skill set um that one can develop. And

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Speaker 1: and you know, if if you in my opinion, and

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Speaker 1: there are people who maintain artists without for that are

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Speaker 1: superstars and they have a relationship and make money with

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Speaker 1: people for a long time without having the skill set.

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Speaker 1: I just think, um, having The skill set doesn't guarantee

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Speaker 1: you maintain or you even attract new relationships, but I

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Speaker 1: know that it's it's a very important tool in my

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Speaker 1: box to be able to be successful in moving forward.

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Speaker 1: Is having the skill set? Um, you know, my agents,

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Speaker 1: I try to share information and for them to develop

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Speaker 1: the skill set. And I've been fortunate. I've had some

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Speaker 1: superstar racks that I've needed to have the skill set

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Speaker 1: to be able to maintain my relationships. Okay, you talk

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Speaker 1: about this skill set, tell me a couple of things

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Speaker 1: you learned where people need to know. Well, the the

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Speaker 1: skill set is, as I said, is at least certainly

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Speaker 1: in the skill set. From a financial point of view,

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Speaker 1: I think there's multiple skill sets. I think you as

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Speaker 1: an agent have to have a real sense of being

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Speaker 1: a promoter. You have to understand how you want your

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Speaker 1: artists and how that your artist wants to be represented

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Speaker 1: in the world. So I think the I think the

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Speaker 1: skill set is having a promoter a mentality. I think

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Speaker 1: a skill set is understanding the markets, understanding the difference

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Speaker 1: between Atlanta and San Juan, Puerto Rico and San Francisco,

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Speaker 1: and and and and understanding that and understanding the climate

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Speaker 1: changes in different markets throughout the world. And then it's

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Speaker 1: developing a skill set. I mean, if you have a

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Speaker 1: band that can sell out places, um, everywhere in the

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Speaker 1: country or or the world, you you need to develop

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Speaker 1: a skill set to know the maximum dollars that you

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Speaker 1: can make. Now, there are countries and there are places

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Speaker 1: you're never gonna see what's really behind, what really exists

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Speaker 1: in some of these kinds, some of these venues. And

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Speaker 1: if that's the case, the only thing I can do

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Speaker 1: is is really try to secure as much money from

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Speaker 1: whoever I'm selling the day to, whether it be the

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Speaker 1: venue or a local promoter. But I don't know. I

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Speaker 1: think the art of that skill set to some degree

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Speaker 1: has been lost, certainly in the big agency because a

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Speaker 1: lot of them have territories. A lot of them, Um,

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Speaker 1: you know, the the requirements are different. But I just

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Speaker 1: feel that as UH as an agent, as a representative

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Speaker 1: of an artist, you need to know, um, you need

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Speaker 1: to have this information so that they can be able

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Speaker 1: to get the most from from you. Otherwise they can

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Speaker 1: go somewhere else. Okay, what are some of the markets

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Speaker 1: where you really don't know what's going on with the money.

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Speaker 1: One of the markets I think, you know, it could

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Speaker 1: be China. I mean, Japanese is not necessarily easy to

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Speaker 1: go to Japan and you know, try to see Japanese

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Speaker 1: backup and know what the what what the actual costs are. Um,

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Speaker 1: you know, I'm more South America could be relatively difficult sometimes. Okay,

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Speaker 1: you talk about being able to see all the costs.

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Speaker 1: I have sat with the promoter with two sets of books,

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Speaker 1: but they're showing the act in their real net do

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Speaker 1: they actually you have to guess what's going on in

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Speaker 1: their books. How much information are you actually getting and

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Speaker 1: how you're getting it? Uh I listen, there's no there's

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Speaker 1: not any more sequence anymore in terms of all the

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Speaker 1: ancillary where where all the money is, Because if you

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Speaker 1: go into a venue, I mean, you know, there's the

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Speaker 1: peanuts and the popcorn, and the facility fees and the

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Speaker 1: ticketing rebates and the and the sweet tickets and the

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Speaker 1: unmanifested seats and the parking and these are all the

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Speaker 1: things you calculate, and everybody has has different economics in

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Speaker 1: their particular facility. But uh so this is there's there's

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Speaker 1: a lot of information. I mean again, you there's the

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Speaker 1: gross and then there's the gross gross. I mean I

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Speaker 1: have to actually played buildings, gotten a hundred percent of

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Speaker 1: the gross, you have to tax and have had the

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Speaker 1: venue make hundreds of thousands of dollars. Just for the uninitiated,

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Speaker 1: where did they make that money? Uh? Ticketing rebates, UH,

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Speaker 1: facility fee, UH, merchandise UM, suits, parking UM. Trying to

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Speaker 1: think what else? Uh you know I might have what

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Speaker 1: in general? That's that's that's kind of the uh the base. Okay,

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Speaker 1: let's go back to when we start to have consolidation

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Speaker 1: in retrospect? Was consolidation in touring concert promotion good or

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Speaker 1: bad for you? In the acts? I'm not talking about

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Speaker 1: the deals where the making overall deals, just in general

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Speaker 1: in terms of money and how the businesses run. Well.

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Speaker 1: It went from a millionaires business to a billionaires business

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Speaker 1: is what really changed. It existed before it existed with

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Speaker 1: concerts West and Jerry Wine troub and so you know

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Speaker 1: when Jerry weintraud basically in concerts where they had a

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Speaker 1: tremendous domination and of superstars and and a list artists.

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Speaker 1: So basically they were doing it. You know, prior they

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Speaker 1: had the Zeppelins and the the b g s and

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Speaker 1: you know, all the Elvis Presley, all the A list.

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Speaker 1: So it really just continued and it was just a

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Speaker 1: buy up of a lot of the major promoters. But

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Speaker 1: it went from a millionaire business to a billionaire business.

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Speaker 1: And and and now Concerts West and Jerry Winintroud have

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Speaker 1: been replaced by Live Nation and a g well need

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Speaker 1: Let's say Live Nation is a company that worth it

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Speaker 1: is worth billions public company, but has the money trickled

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Speaker 1: down to the acts and to you? Yes? And you

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Speaker 1: attribute that too. I think that Live Nation to maintain

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Speaker 1: their domination, has to pay the acts because they need

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Speaker 1: they they need the inventory to feed all their um

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Speaker 1: you know, their sponsorships that they need to feel to

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Speaker 1: feed their business. And I think they're very good at

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Speaker 1: um uh yeah, at taking care of the artists that

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Speaker 1: they that they acquire and represent. Okay, staying with sponsorship

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Speaker 1: just by owning or controlling as much as Live Nation

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Speaker 1: does they make these overall sponsorship deals. Do you just

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Speaker 1: have to shrug and leave that money with them or

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Speaker 1: with a superstar? Do you try to get into some

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Speaker 1: of that money? Well, again, you know, if there's a

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Speaker 1: million dollars on the table, and you know where there's

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Speaker 1: a million two with all their money, you make your

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Speaker 1: your deal with how much of that million two can

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Speaker 1: you get? You know, It's like they don't necessarily try

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Speaker 1: to hide what they make. They but so that's your

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Speaker 1: negotiation with them. It's like anybody it's say, hey, this

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Speaker 1: is we're making a million to a night. You know,

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Speaker 1: that's your negotiation you with them? How much of a

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Speaker 1: million two is yours? What's your negotiation style? Some people

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Speaker 1: are screamers, some people who are quiet. What do you

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Speaker 1: do well? You know you're listen. Competition, you know, competition

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Speaker 1: is the best. I'm not a I'm not a screamer.

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Speaker 1: Was probably more of a screamer in my early days.

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Speaker 1: I'm not a screamer or a calculator, uh, trying to

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Speaker 1: calculate or what's the best strategy and how I can

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Speaker 1: make the maximum dollars. I also want wants to promoter.

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Speaker 1: I want them to make money. It takes a vility.

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Speaker 1: Everyone's gotta win, so I approach it. The artist is

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Speaker 1: my first concern. My acts have to win and they

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Speaker 1: have to feel that they're making the maximum money. But

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Speaker 1: but the promoter live nation a g they gotta win too.

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Speaker 1: So so you look at the pot and again go

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Speaker 1: back to risk rewood, what are you risking and what

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Speaker 1: should you be rewarded? And now there's sometimes that that

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Speaker 1: equation is very much in the favor of the promoter.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes it's very much in favor of the artist, especially

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Speaker 1: if the artist doesn't, you know, sell the tickets and

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Speaker 1: the promoter takes a risk and they lose. But most

341
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Speaker 1: of the time, Um, but but if you but your job,

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Speaker 1: I believe is to have the knowledge about how the

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Speaker 1: pot is getting divided. But you have to know what's

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Speaker 1: in the pot before you can know what's divided. And

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Speaker 1: my thing is, how many of us really know what's

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Speaker 1: in the pot? Not in not that many? Okay, In

347
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Speaker 1: the old days before rolloups, frequently if you had a

348
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Speaker 1: losing date, you would give the promoter money back because

349
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Speaker 1: you have to be in business with them in the future,

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Speaker 1: whether it be other after the act wanted to return.

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Speaker 1: It seems like nobody gives money back to Live Nation.

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Speaker 1: It's a public company. What's your take on that, Well,

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Speaker 1: that's true. I mean there's a certain security. Um, you

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Speaker 1: want to work with people who are financially solvent, I do,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I don't want to be looking over my shoulder, Uh,

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Speaker 1: concerned that my artist isn't gonna get paid. And and

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Speaker 1: if there is that kind of risk, then I need

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Speaker 1: to share that prior to making a deal. And and

359
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Speaker 1: and payment terms are very important in a negotiation, but

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Speaker 1: being solvents is very important. I don't want to really

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Speaker 1: be looking over my shoulder about being paid. And it

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Speaker 1: happens very rarely now, it happens once in a while.

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Speaker 1: And uh, but you know, prefer to be with people

364
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Speaker 1: and then and and if I'm not sure if somebody

365
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Speaker 1: we just asked them to pay the money upfront, qual

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Speaker 1: of it. Okay, let's assume let's start at the beginning.

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Speaker 1: Let's talk about the stack things you know innately but

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Speaker 1: not everybody does. Let's assume you're still you're representing a

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Speaker 1: superstar client. Do you ever tell the act I think

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Speaker 1: you should go on the road or you're always waiting

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Speaker 1: for the manager to call? And what's that conversation as

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Speaker 1: far as what the timing is of recording, of of touring, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it depends. I mean, uh, you know, I feel that

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Speaker 1: I have the ability to Sometimes people ask me what

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Speaker 1: my job is and I sometimes describe Sometimes, Um, I

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Speaker 1: build the car, and sometimes I just put the gas

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Speaker 1: in it. I have the ability and the talent to

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Speaker 1: build the car, but sometimes you just want me to

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Speaker 1: put the gas in it. So sometimes the artists, they're

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Speaker 1: telling me, the manager is telling me what they want

381
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Speaker 1: and that's all. Then they just want me to route

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Speaker 1: a tour. They just may want my opinion on certain things.

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Speaker 1: On the on the other hand, an artist may say,

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Speaker 1: put it all together versus show us what you would do,

385
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Speaker 1: show us where you would go, show us who you

386
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Speaker 1: would work with, tell us the venues you would play.

387
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Speaker 1: So it's just a very individual thing. But you know,

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Speaker 1: I having the ability to build it, to build a

389
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Speaker 1: car and have now or sometimes like I said, put

390
00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:06,840
Speaker 1: the gas in it. Whatever you need. But but I

391
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:10,080
Speaker 1: kind of have a menu to offer in a perfect world.

392
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Speaker 1: What do you prefer? I would generally, uh if I

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Speaker 1: think so, you know, listen, I work with some very

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Speaker 1: very bright people, and um I have uh, you know,

395
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Speaker 1: I have a kind of a philosophy. It takes the

396
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Speaker 1: village and if you function as an island, you die

397
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Speaker 1: as an island. So I prefer to function as a

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Speaker 1: village with people. And you know, some of these some

399
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Speaker 1: of my artists have wonderful input. My I worked with

400
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Speaker 1: some managers are very bright. They don't have to have

401
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:41,800
Speaker 1: my particular skill set, but they have different skill sets

402
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Speaker 1: that that that I need for the artist career to

403
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Speaker 1: be complete. Okay, in the old days, everybody paid ten percent.

404
00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:52,000
Speaker 1: You know, everybody's looking for a discount today. So what's

405
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Speaker 1: the deal there, especially with your menu as services? Well,

406
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Speaker 1: I mean, you know there are times. I mean, we

407
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Speaker 1: had one client who came to us from another agency,

408
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Speaker 1: you know, look for a deal and ended up paying

409
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Speaker 1: us more because of how much more they earned with

410
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Speaker 1: us and they didn't with that previous UM agency. So

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Speaker 1: you know that is hey, you hopefully people will pay

412
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Speaker 1: you for what you're worth. Sometimes people overpay you, not

413
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Speaker 1: a little bit to my but and there are sometimes

414
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 1: I get underpaid. But hopefully UM the artists and and

415
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:36,840
Speaker 1: and their team will recognize your value that you add

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Speaker 1: to the equation and we'll pay you for it. Well,

417
00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:43,840
Speaker 1: you said someone came from another agency to what degree today?

418
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Speaker 1: Is their radiant poaching other other agencies? Oh, I think

419
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Speaker 1: that that that exists always quietly. I know people will

420
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Speaker 1: deny it, but that's a lot of bullshit. I think

421
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Speaker 1: there's a lot I think there's I think internally some

422
00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:03,600
Speaker 1: of the agencies this poetry within there. You know, there's

423
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:07,359
Speaker 1: a lot of paranoia, you know, but but you know

424
00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:10,960
Speaker 1: poasting always exists. I mean, you know that's the d

425
00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:13,359
Speaker 1: n A of a lot of agents. They see an

426
00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:18,360
Speaker 1: opportunity or sometimes I'm I could be uh, I can

427
00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:21,240
Speaker 1: represent an act and I'm hearing about another agent constantly

428
00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 1: knocking on the door. It's it's it's there, it's seed.

429
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:27,720
Speaker 1: Be naive to think it's not okay. If you look

430
00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:31,199
Speaker 1: at the agency landscape, you know, the big cahunas W M, E,

431
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:34,159
Speaker 1: C A A. Then in a tier below you have U,

432
00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:38,320
Speaker 1: T A and Wasserman and overall I'm not talking good

433
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:41,960
Speaker 1: better otherwise, but your footprint is smaller. What is your

434
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:49,639
Speaker 1: pitch to go with you as opposed to these larger agencies. Well,

435
00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:53,720
Speaker 1: as I said, I you know, uh, we have a

436
00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:58,080
Speaker 1: worldwide knowledge. I think we're experts and the and the

437
00:27:58,200 --> 00:28:02,200
Speaker 1: and the touring business that we are the uh, maybe

438
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:05,000
Speaker 1: the only agency on a lot of levels that can

439
00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:08,720
Speaker 1: really compete with the promoters in terms of of of

440
00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:12,399
Speaker 1: what that what an artist can make. I mean I

441
00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:16,119
Speaker 1: sat with one superstar agent from one of these agents agencies.

442
00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:18,000
Speaker 1: And he said to me one day at all one

443
00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:20,560
Speaker 1: he says, I wish I could do what you do.

444
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:25,720
Speaker 1: I wish I had the time to do what you do.

445
00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:30,320
Speaker 1: And um, and the focus because I got a thousand bands,

446
00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:33,200
Speaker 1: I gotta be a friend too. And you know, I

447
00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:35,600
Speaker 1: always say a man with a thousand friends has none.

448
00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:39,240
Speaker 1: You can be everywhere and know every deal when you

449
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:42,000
Speaker 1: gotta you know your your your job is to be

450
00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:44,640
Speaker 1: an ambassador a lot of a lot of acts. It's

451
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:46,680
Speaker 1: very difficult to focus on of this kind of the

452
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:50,720
Speaker 1: kind of detail you're talking about. It the big the

453
00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:54,000
Speaker 1: big agencies, the big agencies. Yes, and you're saying that

454
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:58,680
Speaker 1: so one of the pictures irrelevant of the veracity. As

455
00:28:58,760 --> 00:29:01,160
Speaker 1: you go and see any A, W M A U

456
00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:03,880
Speaker 1: t A, they can say, WHOA, we're gonna book your tours,

457
00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:06,680
Speaker 1: when we're gonna get you in television, we're gonna get

458
00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:12,440
Speaker 1: your sponsorship. What do you say to that? Sometimes? Yes,

459
00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:15,800
Speaker 1: sometimes now a lot of times it's a big air game.

460
00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, I spent five years in my

461
00:29:19,160 --> 00:29:21,560
Speaker 1: career at William Mars. You know, at a different time,

462
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:23,960
Speaker 1: and there was there's a lot of there's a lot

463
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:27,200
Speaker 1: of air to it. So that's that's the game. I mean,

464
00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 1: you walk in there, you know, with nine agents and

465
00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:34,960
Speaker 1: different film people, and sometimes the team really works, and

466
00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:39,680
Speaker 1: sometimes it's just an air game, and sometimes people get disappointed. Hey,

467
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:41,560
Speaker 1: one of the problems. You can be at one of

468
00:29:41,560 --> 00:29:44,760
Speaker 1: the major agencies and maybe it's maybe it's the literary

469
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:48,000
Speaker 1: agent that's that you go, this person is done. When

470
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:51,240
Speaker 1: I was at William Mars, there was some very uh,

471
00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:53,800
Speaker 1: you know, there was some agents that I represented, some

472
00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:57,320
Speaker 1: very big artists in the film and television business. Some

473
00:29:57,400 --> 00:29:59,640
Speaker 1: of them were quite capable, and some of them will

474
00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:03,840
Speaker 1: lose and um, you know, and and sometimes you can

475
00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:06,280
Speaker 1: get stuck with somebody from another area that you don't

476
00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:08,840
Speaker 1: really want and you don't really think is you know

477
00:30:08,880 --> 00:30:12,120
Speaker 1: it has it's good and it's bad. But uh, you

478
00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:14,040
Speaker 1: know a lot of it is there. Sometimes it's not,

479
00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:16,560
Speaker 1: and it depends what the artist needs are. But there

480
00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:20,400
Speaker 1: aren't many rock stars who become major film stars, that's

481
00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:24,320
Speaker 1: for sure. How much of your business is servicing as

482
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:28,040
Speaker 1: opposed to just doing the work, showing up at gigs,

483
00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:31,680
Speaker 1: calling people, sending presents. Is that important or is just

484
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:37,320
Speaker 1: the nuts and bolts important. Hey, some people have survived

485
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:42,160
Speaker 1: very well showing off, bringing gifts, uh, sending presents for

486
00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:46,120
Speaker 1: the kids. You know, it takes all flavors and sometimes

487
00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:49,520
Speaker 1: that really works. That is not what I could depend

488
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:52,440
Speaker 1: and that's not my number one skill set, so if

489
00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:54,360
Speaker 1: I had to depend on that, But I've seen others,

490
00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:57,800
Speaker 1: and I've seen other successful agents basically thrived that way,

491
00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:01,240
Speaker 1: and I think it's amazing. I couldn't do it, but

492
00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:03,680
Speaker 1: I think it's amazing. So let's assume you have a

493
00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:08,320
Speaker 1: band that does good business for a year, if they're

494
00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:10,720
Speaker 1: not going on tour for another year, how much contact

495
00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:13,760
Speaker 1: will you have for the manager or anybody else involved. No,

496
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:18,200
Speaker 1: stay in touch, absolutely, but it's certainly. Hey, the artists

497
00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:21,840
Speaker 1: want to know the landscape. They want to know new information,

498
00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:25,960
Speaker 1: they want to know who's doing well. They want to know, um,

499
00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:30,680
Speaker 1: what's what, what? What you see in the future for them? Absolutely,

500
00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:33,520
Speaker 1: try to keep them informed new things that are going on,

501
00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:37,920
Speaker 1: new changes, gossip. Absolutely, well, let's talk about new changes.

502
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:41,239
Speaker 1: Let's talk as we speak right now, COVID and the

503
00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:49,160
Speaker 1: touring landscape. What's your take there, It's pretty fucked up. Um.

504
00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:55,280
Speaker 1: I think that the indoor situation is very concerning at

505
00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:59,360
Speaker 1: this time, and in the fact that, uh, putting shows

506
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:03,440
Speaker 1: on sale right now is a very difficult climate. It's uh,

507
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:06,560
Speaker 1: there's a lot of people don't want to certainly sit

508
00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:09,960
Speaker 1: indoors next to um, you know, in a in a

509
00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:15,440
Speaker 1: closed quarters. So the indoor business is slightly altered and

510
00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:21,760
Speaker 1: the outdoor business not as much. But it's very concerning.

511
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:23,680
Speaker 1: There are a lot of people who will not sit

512
00:32:23,760 --> 00:32:26,320
Speaker 1: at a concert. So you gotta you gotta anticipate you're

513
00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:30,040
Speaker 1: gonna lose some percentage of people going on sale now

514
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:33,240
Speaker 1: it's not it's not a normal what what what? What

515
00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:35,840
Speaker 1: was a normal on sale? It's not a normal on

516
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:38,960
Speaker 1: sale at this point. You know, if you sell out

517
00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:41,200
Speaker 1: an arena, you might have been able to sell out too.

518
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:44,800
Speaker 1: If you you gotta figure you'll gonna lose ten percent,

519
00:32:44,880 --> 00:32:47,400
Speaker 1: you can lose twenty, you can lose five percent, but

520
00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:51,200
Speaker 1: you're gonna lose some percentage. This isn't an ideal time now.

521
00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:54,760
Speaker 1: We we all need to move forward, so sometimes we

522
00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:59,800
Speaker 1: have no choice, but it is. It is a more

523
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:04,000
Speaker 1: difficult environment and climate right at this moment than it

524
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:06,840
Speaker 1: normally is. Okay, so we're talking today, what do you

525
00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:11,040
Speaker 1: see for the next couple of months. I think when

526
00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:14,760
Speaker 1: kids start to get vaccinated that will help loosen things up.

527
00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:19,160
Speaker 1: I think the world in general is very difficult. It's

528
00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:22,600
Speaker 1: very hard to plan a worldwide tour now though some

529
00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:25,719
Speaker 1: are doing it, but it's very difficult in terms of

530
00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:28,640
Speaker 1: what countries are going to be open, and a lot

531
00:33:28,680 --> 00:33:31,080
Speaker 1: of times we're just we're winging it. We hope it's

532
00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:34,840
Speaker 1: going to be okay in March or April or next September,

533
00:33:35,800 --> 00:33:38,640
Speaker 1: but it's it's it's still a crapshoot right now. There's

534
00:33:38,680 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 1: nothing that's defined that you can Hey, Australia, I've got

535
00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 1: a tour in Australia that was supposed to happen last February.

536
00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:51,760
Speaker 1: That's now maybe it's supposed to start in March. That

537
00:33:51,840 --> 00:33:55,680
Speaker 1: now maybe moved to next March. So how do you

538
00:33:55,800 --> 00:34:00,480
Speaker 1: plan a tour? You know, it's just it's it's very difficult.

539
00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:03,760
Speaker 1: At this point. You just have to I think you

540
00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:06,560
Speaker 1: have to just be prepared when the bell rings to go.

541
00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:09,320
Speaker 1: And then there are sometimes some artists are going to

542
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:12,239
Speaker 1: dictate to you what they want to do and they say,

543
00:34:12,320 --> 00:34:14,239
Speaker 1: let's go, we want to go in the spring. We

544
00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:15,759
Speaker 1: want to go in the summer. We want to go

545
00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:18,560
Speaker 1: in the winter, and it's a craft shoot. You may

546
00:34:18,719 --> 00:34:22,360
Speaker 1: you may try to, but you may not get there. Okay,

547
00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:26,440
Speaker 1: artist comes to you looking for your expertise today about

548
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:29,600
Speaker 1: touring within the next three months to a year. What

549
00:34:29,640 --> 00:34:37,480
Speaker 1: do you tell them? You're better off at this moment, Uh,

550
00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:40,759
Speaker 1: if you can play outdoors. I would suggest that for

551
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:44,240
Speaker 1: the late spring summer. I would suggest that I would

552
00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:48,719
Speaker 1: just say, uh, and you would lose most probably some

553
00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:52,920
Speaker 1: percentage of business being indoors. And you go and you

554
00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:55,520
Speaker 1: take a big risk if you want to be indoors

555
00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:58,960
Speaker 1: in January, February, March. The first quarter. I think the

556
00:34:58,960 --> 00:35:02,920
Speaker 1: first quarter of this year is is pretty screwed up already.

557
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:06,960
Speaker 1: I I think it's uh, it's it's there's there's just

558
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:10,680
Speaker 1: an element of risk and and and the other problem

559
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:13,840
Speaker 1: is you go city by city, you have different rules everywhere,

560
00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 1: and the rules changed. It's such a moving target. I'm

561
00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:18,800
Speaker 1: going here, I'm going there. No, you're not going this

562
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:23,240
Speaker 1: this mandate so hopefully I can't predict how the virus

563
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:26,400
Speaker 1: will you know, uh, but the life of the virus

564
00:35:26,440 --> 00:35:28,920
Speaker 1: will be. I don't think anyone knew or believe there

565
00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:32,439
Speaker 1: was a delta variants eight weeks ago when the show

566
00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:36,759
Speaker 1: started going back on sale. But it's just, um, it's

567
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:39,520
Speaker 1: just a very it's it's a crapshoot, you know, and

568
00:35:39,600 --> 00:35:41,680
Speaker 1: some people are willing to take it and move forward.

569
00:35:41,719 --> 00:35:43,520
Speaker 1: And you know, it used to be like let's go

570
00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:45,640
Speaker 1: out and celebrate on the road. Now let's go out

571
00:35:45,640 --> 00:35:49,759
Speaker 1: and survive on the road. Okay, in the old days,

572
00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:52,839
Speaker 1: you know, you tend to I'm talking about going back

573
00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:56,839
Speaker 1: a couple of decades, people toured all year. Now a

574
00:35:56,880 --> 00:36:00,759
Speaker 1: lot of stuff is concentrated in the summer. What's your

575
00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:07,719
Speaker 1: take on that. Well, you know, there's, first of all,

576
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:12,759
Speaker 1: there's more opportunities in the summer because of the outdoor events.

577
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:18,440
Speaker 1: So that's that's why there's a greater concentration obviously, whether

578
00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:24,640
Speaker 1: it's um UM fairs and you know i amphitheater shows

579
00:36:24,680 --> 00:36:31,040
Speaker 1: and festivals. Hey, whether whether when the weather is available

580
00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:36,239
Speaker 1: for shows that that's why there's always um you know,

581
00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:39,480
Speaker 1: whether it plays a factor in opportunity. And so when

582
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:41,880
Speaker 1: you get to the winter, I mean people can create

583
00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 1: indoor that you know, trying to indoor events, but it's

584
00:36:46,239 --> 00:36:48,520
Speaker 1: it's it's much more difficult. It's much easier to have

585
00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:52,280
Speaker 1: a rib roast and in Ohio and you know, and somewhere,

586
00:36:52,400 --> 00:36:55,239
Speaker 1: and so there's just a lot more opportunity. And that's

587
00:36:55,239 --> 00:36:58,240
Speaker 1: why there's much more touring in the summer. What about

588
00:36:58,239 --> 00:37:01,399
Speaker 1: the issue of the on sale date and how much

589
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:04,520
Speaker 1: money people have? Let's start with on sale date. Used

590
00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:07,000
Speaker 1: to be concerts. You know, it could be a couple

591
00:37:07,000 --> 00:37:08,920
Speaker 1: of weeks, the tickets would go on said nothing go

592
00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:12,760
Speaker 1: on sale two years before. What do you think should

593
00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:17,680
Speaker 1: be done well with COVID? I mean, you know, you know,

594
00:37:17,960 --> 00:37:20,480
Speaker 1: I'm a student of this game as well as uh

595
00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:24,640
Speaker 1: you know, um, I practice it. I watch what others do?

596
00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:27,960
Speaker 1: I mean, I watched I watched the Elton John on

597
00:37:28,080 --> 00:37:32,640
Speaker 1: sale where he actually went on sale in cities and

598
00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:35,720
Speaker 1: play in stadiums and cities where he had arena dates

599
00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:39,000
Speaker 1: to play prior. That was amazing to me, and he

600
00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:42,560
Speaker 1: did well. So I learned from that. Can you really

601
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:45,400
Speaker 1: do that? Can you really pull this off? Can you?

602
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:48,840
Speaker 1: And nobody really knows prior to what happening when you

603
00:37:49,120 --> 00:37:52,680
Speaker 1: get to gauge what the public does. So I'm a

604
00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:57,279
Speaker 1: student and I'm always observing what I see, and and

605
00:37:57,280 --> 00:38:00,920
Speaker 1: and and and all of that feeds it feeds my

606
00:38:01,000 --> 00:38:05,080
Speaker 1: brain as far as how how to move forward. But

607
00:38:06,560 --> 00:38:09,880
Speaker 1: so right now, on sales, it's it's, it's. It's a

608
00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:13,840
Speaker 1: very unusual time because of the COVID situation to be

609
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:16,719
Speaker 1: able to say this is how on sales should be.

610
00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:19,439
Speaker 1: I mean there are times, I mean I might think

611
00:38:19,440 --> 00:38:23,840
Speaker 1: of going on sale six weeks in advance, which which

612
00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:28,720
Speaker 1: we haven't done in in third thirty years. I might think, now,

613
00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:31,720
Speaker 1: let's go on sale six weeks for a show because

614
00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:36,279
Speaker 1: our window was open, where before I would not consider that,

615
00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:39,120
Speaker 1: and I would consider being on sale over a year

616
00:38:39,160 --> 00:38:42,919
Speaker 1: in front because the window was open. Now also, as

617
00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 1: time goes on and the COVID situation hopefully gets better,

618
00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:48,840
Speaker 1: there's gonna be a on of shows. It's gonna be

619
00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:58,319
Speaker 1: a cluster funk out there. Okay, let's see. Let's look

620
00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:03,040
Speaker 1: pre COVID pre COVID it what's a reasonable amount of time? Uh,

621
00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 1: the on sale before the Deep plays three four months?

622
00:39:08,840 --> 00:39:11,200
Speaker 1: You can go on sale October for a February show.

623
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:13,719
Speaker 1: And what do you think about the the acts who

624
00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:21,520
Speaker 1: going on sale like a year before? Uh? Listen, there's

625
00:39:21,840 --> 00:39:26,719
Speaker 1: no one formula that guarantees you success. Uh, listen a

626
00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:29,560
Speaker 1: lot of times and when I say three four months,

627
00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:32,480
Speaker 1: that's America, Europe. It's very natural to go on SAILI

628
00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:37,080
Speaker 1: a year in front. So you know, there's different parameters

629
00:39:37,120 --> 00:39:40,200
Speaker 1: for different countries. What's what's the norm here and what's

630
00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:43,520
Speaker 1: the norm in Australia is very different sometimes, or what's

631
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:46,960
Speaker 1: what's the norm here? What's the northern Germany? So you

632
00:39:47,080 --> 00:39:52,399
Speaker 1: just acqui acquiesced to what the population and what the

633
00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:56,480
Speaker 1: habits are of that particular country. Okay, so there are

634
00:39:56,520 --> 00:39:59,480
Speaker 1: people say, hey, I want my day to play earlier

635
00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:01,319
Speaker 1: in the summer because the kids are going to run

636
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:05,319
Speaker 1: out of money. Do you think that's a factor. I

637
00:40:05,360 --> 00:40:07,839
Speaker 1: think that's a factor. I think there are a lot

638
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:10,640
Speaker 1: of factors, I think, you know, but that is absolutely

639
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:13,080
Speaker 1: a factor. How much competitions in the market, who else

640
00:40:13,239 --> 00:40:16,359
Speaker 1: is coming you know, all of you know, yeah, all

641
00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:20,440
Speaker 1: of this is a factor. Um. Oh, you can live

642
00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:23,880
Speaker 1: in a city that's being supported by uh, you know,

643
00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:26,480
Speaker 1: a major company that's moving out, and there's a lot

644
00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:29,719
Speaker 1: of factors. But that go into an on sale competition

645
00:40:29,840 --> 00:40:32,720
Speaker 1: is probably is as fierce as anything. How many other

646
00:40:32,880 --> 00:40:38,239
Speaker 1: artists are going on sale in my genre? In that city.

647
00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:42,880
Speaker 1: Speaking of genres, you made your bones in the rock world.

648
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:47,279
Speaker 1: Certainly in terms of the Spotify top fifty, rock isn't

649
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:54,439
Speaker 1: even there. What's gonna sell as we go forward? Well,

650
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:56,799
Speaker 1: I think pop is the only thing right now that's

651
00:40:56,840 --> 00:41:03,120
Speaker 1: moving the needle. I mean, it's uh, if you right now,

652
00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:07,879
Speaker 1: you can build a career on cont having enough pop hits.

653
00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:11,120
Speaker 1: And what I what I've observed through the years now

654
00:41:11,400 --> 00:41:13,520
Speaker 1: that they used to be you would be a team

655
00:41:13,640 --> 00:41:17,560
Speaker 1: flash and you'd be gone, and that doesn't exist anymore.

656
00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:23,720
Speaker 1: It's you have enough hits. Britney Spears justin Timberlake, Spice Girls,

657
00:41:23,760 --> 00:41:28,400
Speaker 1: these Backstreet Boys, new kids on the block. These artists

658
00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:32,800
Speaker 1: have super careers, you know. And they were pop artists

659
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:35,719
Speaker 1: that that, and they were Steen stars and then in

660
00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:38,839
Speaker 1: the earlier days they would have their running they'd be over.

661
00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:43,600
Speaker 1: Now the audiences grow with them, so uh, there's no

662
00:41:43,719 --> 00:41:48,680
Speaker 1: longer that uh, you know, so pop to pop today

663
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:51,040
Speaker 1: some of the artists Bruno Mars for the rest of

664
00:41:51,080 --> 00:41:53,440
Speaker 1: your life, paint to paint for the rest of your life.

665
00:41:53,719 --> 00:41:57,000
Speaker 1: These people have careers the rest of their lives. There

666
00:41:57,040 --> 00:41:59,399
Speaker 1: will be people seeing them in forty years from now

667
00:41:59,800 --> 00:42:04,920
Speaker 1: and they are the new Billie Joel's and Paul McCartney's

668
00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:07,840
Speaker 1: and you know all you know, these kind of artists

669
00:42:07,920 --> 00:42:12,239
Speaker 1: who have tons of hits that most of them will

670
00:42:12,280 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 1: sustain and carry an audience with them for for a lifetime.

671
00:42:16,600 --> 00:42:22,359
Speaker 1: What about the hip hop business, I think that will

672
00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:26,720
Speaker 1: happen also. I think some of the you know, Travis Scott,

673
00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:29,640
Speaker 1: he could have a career for you know, uh, I

674
00:42:29,800 --> 00:42:34,200
Speaker 1: think his following will stay with him post Malone. I

675
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:37,000
Speaker 1: think a lot of these superstars, these people people grow

676
00:42:37,080 --> 00:42:39,799
Speaker 1: up in a certain period of time and they identify

677
00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:43,200
Speaker 1: with the culture at that time, and that's what they

678
00:42:43,280 --> 00:42:46,399
Speaker 1: remember and and and then twenty years go by and

679
00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:49,440
Speaker 1: that's what they you know, that's what they remember that

680
00:42:49,520 --> 00:42:51,959
Speaker 1: they went out with their girlfriend and they met here

681
00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:54,400
Speaker 1: and they went you know, and that's the soundtrack of

682
00:42:54,480 --> 00:42:57,279
Speaker 1: their lives. And so I really believe a lot of

683
00:42:57,320 --> 00:43:03,040
Speaker 1: the superstars will will sustain for a long time. Okay,

684
00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:07,440
Speaker 1: let's talk about ticket prices. On one extreme, you have

685
00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:10,439
Speaker 1: the Stones who completely flex price, it's almost like buying

686
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:15,200
Speaker 1: an airline ticket. Then you have other acts a doll

687
00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:18,759
Speaker 1: tailor's we are trying to get every last dollar out

688
00:43:18,760 --> 00:43:22,480
Speaker 1: of the market. You have a superstar act, what do

689
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:25,560
Speaker 1: you tell them? What are your protections? Metallica has certainly

690
00:43:25,600 --> 00:43:28,799
Speaker 1: not wanted to overcharge or even you know, play it

691
00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:35,960
Speaker 1: what the market will bear. You know, it's an end festival.

692
00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:40,839
Speaker 1: The artist controls the picture. I I make suggestions, it's

693
00:43:41,760 --> 00:43:44,680
Speaker 1: if if you know, it's but you have to know

694
00:43:44,880 --> 00:43:49,080
Speaker 1: sometimes when you may hit a wall and you may

695
00:43:49,120 --> 00:43:53,239
Speaker 1: say you know. The dynamic pricing is uh. I think

696
00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:57,560
Speaker 1: a very important feature to now be part of an

697
00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:00,920
Speaker 1: on sale so that you can maximum eise or dollars

698
00:44:01,400 --> 00:44:04,760
Speaker 1: when you put a show on sale. But I really

699
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:09,280
Speaker 1: believe if you and people will flex and reduce the price.

700
00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:14,480
Speaker 1: And but in general, I feel you want to max

701
00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:17,560
Speaker 1: the dollars. I'm not comfortable. And again it's up to

702
00:44:17,640 --> 00:44:21,480
Speaker 1: the artists, but I'm not comfortable trying to have the

703
00:44:21,600 --> 00:44:25,080
Speaker 1: public being the one to horror as many dollars and

704
00:44:25,200 --> 00:44:29,600
Speaker 1: be that kind of uh, you know, solicitor. But again

705
00:44:29,680 --> 00:44:31,319
Speaker 1: I work for the artists, and if they want me

706
00:44:31,360 --> 00:44:34,880
Speaker 1: to maximize every dollar any which way, I will do

707
00:44:34,920 --> 00:44:37,800
Speaker 1: what they want. I will share with them my thoughts

708
00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:45,120
Speaker 1: about UM, about potentially hurting your fan base UM, and

709
00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:48,080
Speaker 1: maybe they'll care. Maybe they won't. But all I can

710
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:51,200
Speaker 1: do is offer my advice in my opinion, But it

711
00:44:51,239 --> 00:44:53,319
Speaker 1: really is up to the artists and what they want

712
00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:57,240
Speaker 1: me to do. Knowing knowing the uh, you know the position.

713
00:44:57,840 --> 00:45:01,120
Speaker 1: So you talk about high prices, do high prices hurt

714
00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:07,239
Speaker 1: the AX career their fan base? It can? We'll go

715
00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:09,920
Speaker 1: a little deeper it can, you can? You can know

716
00:45:10,040 --> 00:45:12,960
Speaker 1: it can? I mean, if if you're pushing, I mean,

717
00:45:12,960 --> 00:45:15,880
Speaker 1: if you're gonna go push five fifty dollars, let's a

718
00:45:15,920 --> 00:45:18,640
Speaker 1: ticket or you know, you know whatever, and that's what

719
00:45:18,719 --> 00:45:21,439
Speaker 1: you're putting out there the public. You're gonna you're gonna

720
00:45:21,480 --> 00:45:23,880
Speaker 1: hit a wall and then you're gonna not gonna sell tickets,

721
00:45:24,560 --> 00:45:28,320
Speaker 1: and uh, then you're hurting your artists. So there's different

722
00:45:28,320 --> 00:45:31,719
Speaker 1: ways people try to disguise how they might do it.

723
00:45:31,800 --> 00:45:35,400
Speaker 1: A platinum v I p there's uh, there's all kinds

724
00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:38,600
Speaker 1: of ways to be able to obtain the dollars without

725
00:45:38,719 --> 00:45:43,640
Speaker 1: necessarily prostituting yourself. So I am not a believer in

726
00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:47,759
Speaker 1: prostituting yourself if you um, and I'm also you know,

727
00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:50,359
Speaker 1: but but the goal is to try to take as

728
00:45:50,440 --> 00:45:52,759
Speaker 1: much money as you can and not leave it on

729
00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:56,160
Speaker 1: the secondary market. I think dynamic ticketing, I think the

730
00:45:56,320 --> 00:45:59,360
Speaker 1: V I think there are platforms that we have that

731
00:45:59,560 --> 00:46:03,320
Speaker 1: help you to take in most of the money. Okay,

732
00:46:03,360 --> 00:46:08,040
Speaker 1: so those would be you know, V I P. Platinum.

733
00:46:08,080 --> 00:46:09,880
Speaker 1: What else helps you take in most of the money.

734
00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:13,200
Speaker 1: Aisle seats. I think aisle seats now is a very

735
00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:17,160
Speaker 1: big income earner. A lot of people would prefer to

736
00:46:17,280 --> 00:46:20,160
Speaker 1: sit you know, four seats in and would pay extra money.

737
00:46:20,719 --> 00:46:26,520
Speaker 1: The uh you know, there's so there's uh, there's there's

738
00:46:26,600 --> 00:46:33,319
Speaker 1: many different ways to maximize Hey, dynamic, dynamic pricing can

739
00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:38,600
Speaker 1: can basically get you with the market bears and uh

740
00:46:38,800 --> 00:46:44,880
Speaker 1: so I would find that, you know, again, I'm not

741
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:47,560
Speaker 1: in favor. I mean, some people will sell the first

742
00:46:47,600 --> 00:46:50,640
Speaker 1: two rows a thousand dollars and and and that's fine,

743
00:46:50,680 --> 00:46:54,040
Speaker 1: that's kind of unique. But and I and I think

744
00:46:54,080 --> 00:46:56,799
Speaker 1: it's fine that you know, but I think I think,

745
00:46:57,160 --> 00:46:59,440
Speaker 1: I think you want to avoid the image that you're

746
00:46:59,560 --> 00:47:02,600
Speaker 1: prostent do it to yourself. That's all. Whatever works within

747
00:47:02,640 --> 00:47:08,400
Speaker 1: the confines of your artists that that doesn't prostitute yourself. Okay,

748
00:47:08,440 --> 00:47:12,239
Speaker 1: you and me both know that the fees are outside

749
00:47:12,239 --> 00:47:15,480
Speaker 1: of the deal, so that the act can't commission them.

750
00:47:15,520 --> 00:47:20,239
Speaker 1: So ultimately Ticketmaster or whatever ticketing company takes all the heat.

751
00:47:21,239 --> 00:47:28,200
Speaker 1: What is going to happen with the fees going forward? Well,

752
00:47:28,360 --> 00:47:33,560
Speaker 1: I mean I don't know ultimately where ticketing goes. And uh,

753
00:47:34,000 --> 00:47:36,000
Speaker 1: I mean I you know, I have the fantasy that

754
00:47:36,080 --> 00:47:38,480
Speaker 1: one day that the artists will be able to have

755
00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:40,560
Speaker 1: every artists will be able to have their own ticketing

756
00:47:40,920 --> 00:47:42,960
Speaker 1: and be able to charge their own fees and do

757
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:45,239
Speaker 1: it directly and be in control of that pick their

758
00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:47,480
Speaker 1: ticketing company. I mean, I would love to see us

759
00:47:47,520 --> 00:47:51,880
Speaker 1: have our own ticketing company and and choose that going

760
00:47:51,920 --> 00:47:54,759
Speaker 1: on sale. Let's kind of out of our that that

761
00:47:54,840 --> 00:47:58,759
Speaker 1: doesn't exist yet, and I'm not technologically advanced to know

762
00:47:59,200 --> 00:48:05,760
Speaker 1: how eventually about to happen. But the until certain bigger

763
00:48:05,840 --> 00:48:11,680
Speaker 1: things change in the overall um scaled I don't believe.

764
00:48:12,000 --> 00:48:14,600
Speaker 1: I believe the fee game will continue as it is

765
00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:17,320
Speaker 1: at the moment, but it's going to take a bigger

766
00:48:17,320 --> 00:48:21,120
Speaker 1: picture to change it. As an agent, how much power

767
00:48:21,160 --> 00:48:23,560
Speaker 1: do you have over the fees? And do you ever

768
00:48:23,719 --> 00:48:28,120
Speaker 1: have acts who share in the fees? Yes, we have

769
00:48:28,200 --> 00:48:30,760
Speaker 1: acts to share in the fees. It depends on the act.

770
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:34,320
Speaker 1: The act is the power if you've got a superstar act,

771
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:37,879
Speaker 1: you can, you can, you can participate in a lot

772
00:48:37,880 --> 00:48:40,840
Speaker 1: of revenue. It's it's like if you're selling out a

773
00:48:40,920 --> 00:48:43,799
Speaker 1: venue and I'm walking into your venue and I'm gonna

774
00:48:43,800 --> 00:48:47,320
Speaker 1: sell out forty thousand tickets, that's that you have building

775
00:48:47,360 --> 00:48:51,120
Speaker 1: power and you can. You know, there's a lot of

776
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:53,799
Speaker 1: money to be made for the buildings and so sometimes

777
00:48:53,880 --> 00:48:56,920
Speaker 1: and the venues and the promoters, so in order to

778
00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:00,360
Speaker 1: have you, they're willing to give up for it. About

779
00:49:00,360 --> 00:49:02,719
Speaker 1: an act, it's further down the food chain where it's

780
00:49:02,760 --> 00:49:05,000
Speaker 1: actually a negotiation where you know it's not going to

781
00:49:05,080 --> 00:49:09,200
Speaker 1: go instantly clean in the stadium or an arena. You

782
00:49:09,400 --> 00:49:14,480
Speaker 1: you have, you have, you have less, you have less um,

783
00:49:15,560 --> 00:49:20,319
Speaker 1: you have less power or um negotiating strength. In those cases, Hey,

784
00:49:20,320 --> 00:49:22,759
Speaker 1: a lot of times you know you haven't acted. Let's

785
00:49:22,760 --> 00:49:26,640
Speaker 1: they can do. Hey, you know sometimes you are a

786
00:49:26,640 --> 00:49:30,000
Speaker 1: real to negotiation as when you guarantee again, it's first reward.

787
00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:33,200
Speaker 1: So I if I get them, if I can sell

788
00:49:33,239 --> 00:49:37,040
Speaker 1: them all, I deserve I deserve it all. If I can't,

789
00:49:37,120 --> 00:49:39,640
Speaker 1: I don't deserve it all. I mean I have artists

790
00:49:39,719 --> 00:49:42,319
Speaker 1: that don't expect to make as much as some of

791
00:49:42,360 --> 00:49:45,799
Speaker 1: my other artists. That's all they know. Well, this is

792
00:49:45,840 --> 00:49:50,120
Speaker 1: a superstar. They will get this more than I will. However,

793
00:49:50,560 --> 00:49:53,680
Speaker 1: I can at least tell them what the scoreboard is

794
00:49:53,880 --> 00:49:56,240
Speaker 1: and try to get them as much within their ranks

795
00:49:56,239 --> 00:49:59,279
Speaker 1: as they possibly can get, knowing what else is left

796
00:49:59,280 --> 00:50:02,320
Speaker 1: on the table. Okay, let's go back to the beginning.

797
00:50:02,360 --> 00:50:05,520
Speaker 1: Where are you from? I grew up. I grew up

798
00:50:05,560 --> 00:50:09,400
Speaker 1: in Bayside Queen's basically. And what did your parents do

799
00:50:09,520 --> 00:50:14,480
Speaker 1: for a living? My father was in the garment industry

800
00:50:15,200 --> 00:50:19,120
Speaker 1: and my mom was a homemaker with four boys. Four boys?

801
00:50:19,120 --> 00:50:21,799
Speaker 1: Where are you in the hierarchy? I was third. I

802
00:50:21,840 --> 00:50:24,040
Speaker 1: have a younger brother who's ten years younger than me,

803
00:50:24,680 --> 00:50:27,920
Speaker 1: so I was the baby for ten years. Okay, and

804
00:50:28,120 --> 00:50:32,160
Speaker 1: you graduate from high school, what's the next step? I

805
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:36,960
Speaker 1: went to NASA Community College, finished NASA Community College, and

806
00:50:36,960 --> 00:50:41,360
Speaker 1: two an a half years I met a I met somebody,

807
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:45,839
Speaker 1: a dear friend of mine, Corky Abdo from who used

808
00:50:45,880 --> 00:50:48,759
Speaker 1: to play in a local bar band when I went

809
00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:50,400
Speaker 1: and I used to go see the band. I was

810
00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:52,160
Speaker 1: nineteen years old. He used to go to the club

811
00:50:52,239 --> 00:50:56,319
Speaker 1: see the band, and uh we met at that I

812
00:50:56,360 --> 00:50:58,880
Speaker 1: didn't know he went to Nassau Community College. But we

813
00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:01,919
Speaker 1: met at the college and I was kind of a

814
00:51:01,960 --> 00:51:04,400
Speaker 1: little lost in my world, and he offered me a

815
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:08,319
Speaker 1: job to be their roadie, which I remember bringing home

816
00:51:08,360 --> 00:51:11,279
Speaker 1: a van with equipment in it and uh my dad says, oh,

817
00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:14,680
Speaker 1: you're a movie man, and uh wait wait. What they

818
00:51:14,760 --> 00:51:17,239
Speaker 1: learned for me is that I really wasn't very good

819
00:51:17,239 --> 00:51:20,200
Speaker 1: with my hands and that I had a gift to gab.

820
00:51:20,880 --> 00:51:24,920
Speaker 1: So about six or eight weeks later, I became their manager,

821
00:51:25,239 --> 00:51:28,600
Speaker 1: which was really booking clubs in Long Island and New

822
00:51:28,680 --> 00:51:33,120
Speaker 1: York City. And that's really how I always started. Okay,

823
00:51:33,120 --> 00:51:35,960
Speaker 1: and were you a big music fan before that? I

824
00:51:36,000 --> 00:51:38,560
Speaker 1: was a music fan. Yes, as a matter of fact,

825
00:51:38,880 --> 00:51:41,640
Speaker 1: when I would when I first went to one of

826
00:51:41,640 --> 00:51:43,080
Speaker 1: the clubs and I had a job, and I said,

827
00:51:43,080 --> 00:51:47,920
Speaker 1: wait a second, there's music, there's girls, they're getting high.

828
00:51:48,200 --> 00:51:52,719
Speaker 1: This is I could do this for a little So yes,

829
00:51:52,840 --> 00:51:55,120
Speaker 1: I was very attractive as a matter of fact, when

830
00:51:55,120 --> 00:51:59,200
Speaker 1: I realized that I could actually do this for real,

831
00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:03,640
Speaker 1: and I I was all in. I have found I

832
00:52:03,960 --> 00:52:07,759
Speaker 1: was very fortunate. I had found a passion, and um,

833
00:52:08,280 --> 00:52:12,160
Speaker 1: I wanted to be in this game. I wanted to

834
00:52:12,239 --> 00:52:17,520
Speaker 1: play on a major league level, and I was, uh,

835
00:52:17,680 --> 00:52:21,439
Speaker 1: you know, I was very committed. Two I was only

836
00:52:21,520 --> 00:52:23,960
Speaker 1: the start for it. That's basically where it's at. I was,

837
00:52:25,000 --> 00:52:29,360
Speaker 1: did you starve? Yes, basically I was. I struggled for

838
00:52:29,400 --> 00:52:32,520
Speaker 1: a long time. I lived on unemployment. I you know,

839
00:52:33,200 --> 00:52:38,320
Speaker 1: I had I had jobs in the music business. Um.

840
00:52:38,360 --> 00:52:42,239
Speaker 1: I went from uh when my origin goes. When I

841
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:46,600
Speaker 1: was nineteen, I worked with the Salvation Maybe. Um that's

842
00:52:46,600 --> 00:52:49,280
Speaker 1: how I met Billy Joel by the way. They opened

843
00:52:49,280 --> 00:52:53,040
Speaker 1: for Billy's band in the Hamptons, and Billy and I

844
00:52:53,040 --> 00:52:54,960
Speaker 1: had a vibe with each other. He was we were

845
00:52:55,000 --> 00:52:57,480
Speaker 1: both lifeers. He saw me as a synergetic kind of

846
00:52:57,520 --> 00:52:59,919
Speaker 1: guy and I and Billy was kind of the star

847
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:02,600
Speaker 1: are in his in his band, the Hassles, and I

848
00:53:02,640 --> 00:53:05,640
Speaker 1: thought we could do something. And anyway, I went on

849
00:53:05,840 --> 00:53:08,320
Speaker 1: from there and wait, just wait, once you start managing,

850
00:53:08,360 --> 00:53:13,080
Speaker 1: school is done. School. Yeah. Once I got yeah, I lost.

851
00:53:13,560 --> 00:53:16,399
Speaker 1: I think I peaked in the eighth grade and uh,

852
00:53:17,160 --> 00:53:20,640
Speaker 1: I think it started going downhill from there. And by

853
00:53:20,640 --> 00:53:23,600
Speaker 1: the time I was in college, I really didn't have

854
00:53:23,960 --> 00:53:27,799
Speaker 1: a lot of interest in college. I didn't uh you know,

855
00:53:28,040 --> 00:53:30,120
Speaker 1: it was like I didn't have another place to go,

856
00:53:30,640 --> 00:53:33,319
Speaker 1: but I didn't really have UH, I didn't really have

857
00:53:33,360 --> 00:53:37,319
Speaker 1: a path. I was kind of lost. You're managing Salvation

858
00:53:37,480 --> 00:53:41,759
Speaker 1: Army Band, You're right, and you're going to uh you

859
00:53:41,800 --> 00:53:45,799
Speaker 1: meet Billy Joel. Then what happens? Well, you know, I

860
00:53:45,920 --> 00:53:51,040
Speaker 1: eventually got myself a job at this company called Universal

861
00:53:51,080 --> 00:53:53,600
Speaker 1: Attractions would still exist, and they were really an R

862
00:53:53,680 --> 00:53:56,080
Speaker 1: and B agency, and they wanted me to be like

863
00:53:56,120 --> 00:53:59,680
Speaker 1: the White Hippie Department and go find bands. And I

864
00:53:59,680 --> 00:54:02,839
Speaker 1: actually really found this band called the Frost, who were

865
00:54:02,880 --> 00:54:09,759
Speaker 1: from Michigan. And and so I was about one and

866
00:54:09,800 --> 00:54:12,120
Speaker 1: I was managed and I became the Frost manager. I

867
00:54:12,160 --> 00:54:13,920
Speaker 1: went out and saw them, and I'm coming from this

868
00:54:14,000 --> 00:54:16,960
Speaker 1: agency and now I was being a booking agent and

869
00:54:17,200 --> 00:54:19,919
Speaker 1: Universal and here I am meeting this band, the Frost

870
00:54:19,960 --> 00:54:23,400
Speaker 1: and became their manager. And I was twenty one years old.

871
00:54:23,760 --> 00:54:26,840
Speaker 1: And I remember we played Cobo Hall, which was the

872
00:54:26,840 --> 00:54:29,640
Speaker 1: arena at that time in Detroit, and we were second

873
00:54:29,680 --> 00:54:31,520
Speaker 1: on the bill because they had a real big following

874
00:54:31,560 --> 00:54:34,040
Speaker 1: in the state of Michigan. And we were second on

875
00:54:34,080 --> 00:54:37,840
Speaker 1: the bill. It was three Dog Night and uh, Frost

876
00:54:37,920 --> 00:54:40,200
Speaker 1: was second. And there I am a Cobo Hall and

877
00:54:40,239 --> 00:54:42,200
Speaker 1: this is kind of but I liked this but it

878
00:54:42,239 --> 00:54:45,719
Speaker 1: was a little bit over my head, but I um,

879
00:54:45,760 --> 00:54:48,759
Speaker 1: I was kind of uh So what happened is the

880
00:54:48,760 --> 00:54:51,440
Speaker 1: band eventually broke up and there was a guitar player

881
00:54:51,480 --> 00:54:54,239
Speaker 1: named Dick Wagner who was in that band, and Dick

882
00:54:54,280 --> 00:54:57,319
Speaker 1: and I. Dick and I formed a relationship and I

883
00:54:57,360 --> 00:55:00,680
Speaker 1: tried to put a band together with Dick Wagner, one

884
00:55:00,680 --> 00:55:03,440
Speaker 1: of the drummer from the Salvation Navy and Billy Joel.

885
00:55:03,920 --> 00:55:06,960
Speaker 1: Billy came down to one session and that was it

886
00:55:07,239 --> 00:55:11,879
Speaker 1: and he moved on to his own solo career. Dick

887
00:55:12,600 --> 00:55:16,160
Speaker 1: Um and myself and we had this guy, Gregor Rama

888
00:55:16,200 --> 00:55:18,480
Speaker 1: from the m Boy Dukes. We formed the band called

889
00:55:18,600 --> 00:55:22,560
Speaker 1: URSA Major We try to we we hearst recorded and

890
00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:24,080
Speaker 1: just when we were going to run out of money

891
00:55:24,120 --> 00:55:27,480
Speaker 1: to keep the band alive, a producer named Bob Ezram

892
00:55:27,640 --> 00:55:31,600
Speaker 1: showed up and UH did an amazing, amazing job producing

893
00:55:31,600 --> 00:55:35,520
Speaker 1: their record and we were signed to our c A

894
00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:38,759
Speaker 1: and UM, But at the end of the day it

895
00:55:38,800 --> 00:55:41,920
Speaker 1: didn't work out. We disbanded and I ended up getting

896
00:55:41,960 --> 00:55:44,920
Speaker 1: a job at twenty three making a hundred bucks at

897
00:55:44,960 --> 00:55:49,560
Speaker 1: an agency called Sutton Artists, and UH the biggest contemporary

898
00:55:49,560 --> 00:55:51,560
Speaker 1: act was all Over Gut three at the time, and

899
00:55:51,640 --> 00:55:55,560
Speaker 1: again I was like, go out there and you know,

900
00:55:55,680 --> 00:55:58,840
Speaker 1: and find acts. And what they did let me do though,

901
00:55:58,960 --> 00:56:03,600
Speaker 1: because in between this experience I also promoted concerts at

902
00:56:03,680 --> 00:56:07,480
Speaker 1: Sunny New Balls, where I met my white money. You're

903
00:56:07,520 --> 00:56:11,040
Speaker 1: promoting concerts. Where's the money coming from the Sunny Pool?

904
00:56:11,840 --> 00:56:14,840
Speaker 1: You know what happened is um my, my. I go

905
00:56:14,960 --> 00:56:18,759
Speaker 1: back to my friend Cooky. He he found two dentists.

906
00:56:19,160 --> 00:56:23,480
Speaker 1: They gave us twenty five thousand dollars to promote concerts

907
00:56:23,520 --> 00:56:27,240
Speaker 1: at Sunny New Balls. And this goes back like seventy three.

908
00:56:27,640 --> 00:56:33,120
Speaker 1: So I bought Frank Zappa. I overpaid. I overpaid for everybody.

909
00:56:33,200 --> 00:56:36,320
Speaker 1: So I lost the all day of money and and

910
00:56:36,520 --> 00:56:39,359
Speaker 1: but I did make relationships with the people at New

911
00:56:39,480 --> 00:56:42,640
Speaker 1: pal To eventually at Queen's College, and they let me

912
00:56:42,760 --> 00:56:46,440
Speaker 1: be their buyer, buy their concerts and paid me a commission.

913
00:56:46,480 --> 00:56:49,879
Speaker 1: And the agencies at Sutton they let me do that

914
00:56:49,960 --> 00:56:53,080
Speaker 1: to subsidize my salary. And what I kept doing is

915
00:56:53,080 --> 00:56:56,400
Speaker 1: buying Billy Joel because now Billy had a hit single

916
00:56:56,400 --> 00:56:58,600
Speaker 1: and had uh you know, and and we had a

917
00:56:58,600 --> 00:57:01,719
Speaker 1: connection and a relation ship and he was with another agency,

918
00:57:01,800 --> 00:57:04,439
Speaker 1: and I was like, Jesus, I really want to work

919
00:57:04,480 --> 00:57:07,680
Speaker 1: with Billy and and when I heard the Piano Man album,

920
00:57:08,080 --> 00:57:10,680
Speaker 1: I was just I mean, I was blown away. I

921
00:57:10,719 --> 00:57:13,080
Speaker 1: didn't know that this guy was talented. I knew he

922
00:57:13,120 --> 00:57:15,720
Speaker 1: was something special, but I didn't know he was this special.

923
00:57:15,960 --> 00:57:18,000
Speaker 1: So I was kind of blown away. I was a fan.

924
00:57:18,080 --> 00:57:20,240
Speaker 1: I thought it was an amazing artist, and I really

925
00:57:20,280 --> 00:57:22,520
Speaker 1: wanted to work with him. And that was one that

926
00:57:22,600 --> 00:57:26,000
Speaker 1: was the way I kept going was I kept buying him.

927
00:57:26,200 --> 00:57:28,880
Speaker 1: I kept seeing him a Queen's College, at Nupolt's and

928
00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:32,200
Speaker 1: you know, we continued, Okay, so you're buying, You're staying

929
00:57:32,200 --> 00:57:35,320
Speaker 1: in business, You're buying Billy Joel. Keep going, so I

930
00:57:35,320 --> 00:57:38,480
Speaker 1: I I. So I stayed in touch with Billy and um,

931
00:57:38,520 --> 00:57:41,520
Speaker 1: I'm working as Sutton Artists and I seeing Billy and

932
00:57:41,880 --> 00:57:43,479
Speaker 1: you know, one day I went up to his house

933
00:57:43,520 --> 00:57:46,200
Speaker 1: and he told me, uh, you know, I should go

934
00:57:46,240 --> 00:57:51,040
Speaker 1: speak to his wife Elizabeth at the time and uh

935
00:57:51,080 --> 00:57:53,960
Speaker 1: and at the time it was a kind of an

936
00:57:54,000 --> 00:57:57,680
Speaker 1: ironic thing that happened. There was a festival in more Self, France,

937
00:57:57,720 --> 00:58:00,840
Speaker 1: and Jazz Festival, and we represented for Man and Tony

938
00:58:00,880 --> 00:58:04,640
Speaker 1: Williams lifetime and so, and Elizabeth was working on this

939
00:58:04,760 --> 00:58:10,120
Speaker 1: festival herself, so we both went over to southern France

940
00:58:10,640 --> 00:58:13,360
Speaker 1: and we didn't go to the festival. We went to

941
00:58:13,360 --> 00:58:17,960
Speaker 1: Santo pay together. And I knew at that weekend and

942
00:58:18,000 --> 00:58:20,760
Speaker 1: now Billy's career at that point he had this was

943
00:58:20,800 --> 00:58:25,240
Speaker 1: he put out his third album, is kind of not

944
00:58:25,400 --> 00:58:28,520
Speaker 1: really making them, you know, taking him to the next step,

945
00:58:29,040 --> 00:58:34,240
Speaker 1: and there was internal change going on and uh, and

946
00:58:34,280 --> 00:58:38,040
Speaker 1: that's why Billy suggested I meet with Elizabeth and and Uh.

947
00:58:38,360 --> 00:58:41,360
Speaker 1: Elizabeth and I spent the weekend together and we became

948
00:58:41,400 --> 00:58:43,919
Speaker 1: close friends. And I knew that weekend I was gonna

949
00:58:43,960 --> 00:58:49,560
Speaker 1: be Billy's agent and m On August sixteenth, nineteen seventy six, me,

950
00:58:49,760 --> 00:58:52,360
Speaker 1: Billy and Elizabeth had a mock meeting in their town

951
00:58:52,400 --> 00:58:56,760
Speaker 1: house and we both voted for me to be the agent,

952
00:58:57,400 --> 00:58:59,920
Speaker 1: and me and Elizabeth voted for her to be the manager,

953
00:59:01,160 --> 00:59:04,920
Speaker 1: and I left Sutton Artists. They wanted me to be

954
00:59:05,000 --> 00:59:07,880
Speaker 1: in business on my own, so I started. They were

955
00:59:07,960 --> 00:59:10,360
Speaker 1: home run management and I was home run agency at

956
00:59:10,360 --> 00:59:16,360
Speaker 1: the time, and that's how my career second. Did you

957
00:59:16,360 --> 00:59:21,360
Speaker 1: think you're up to the gig? Yes, yes, I was

958
00:59:22,720 --> 00:59:25,560
Speaker 1: as Gary Busey said to Joe Cocka one night when

959
00:59:25,600 --> 00:59:28,440
Speaker 1: I was there at the Greek Theater. Success is when

960
00:59:28,480 --> 00:59:33,680
Speaker 1: opportunity meets preparation. I was well prepared. I understood. I

961
00:59:33,840 --> 00:59:36,400
Speaker 1: was somebody. I was a student of this game. I

962
00:59:36,520 --> 00:59:39,720
Speaker 1: was a sponge. I understood what to do. I had

963
00:59:39,720 --> 00:59:43,360
Speaker 1: a philosophy about what to do. Uh. You know, it

964
00:59:43,520 --> 00:59:46,760
Speaker 1: was like and nobody knew me. I was a nobody,

965
00:59:46,840 --> 00:59:50,280
Speaker 1: so it was like, why are you going to this guy?

966
00:59:50,440 --> 00:59:53,520
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, and uh, I remember one time

967
00:59:54,120 --> 00:59:56,960
Speaker 1: they had me meet with their attorney and he just

968
00:59:57,080 --> 01:00:00,240
Speaker 1: quizzed me to see if does does he know he's

969
01:00:00,240 --> 01:00:03,520
Speaker 1: doing And the answer was yes. And I had a

970
01:00:03,520 --> 01:00:05,520
Speaker 1: philosophy when I started with Billy, was like, we're not

971
01:00:05,640 --> 01:00:08,760
Speaker 1: opening for anybody. You know, if we played fifteen under seats,

972
01:00:08,720 --> 01:00:11,120
Speaker 1: if we played two thousand and open for anybody, you

973
01:00:11,200 --> 01:00:13,800
Speaker 1: go headline, because when you go headline, they'll come back

974
01:00:13,840 --> 01:00:16,840
Speaker 1: and we'll get the next time. So that became really

975
01:00:17,000 --> 01:00:20,880
Speaker 1: there was a real philosophy about how to how to

976
01:00:21,000 --> 01:00:23,560
Speaker 1: do this. But I was prepared. I was prepared for

977
01:00:23,600 --> 01:00:27,840
Speaker 1: an opportunity though I was only one who knew it. Okay,

978
01:00:27,840 --> 01:00:30,200
Speaker 1: if you did, you're on a home run. I mean,

979
01:00:30,240 --> 01:00:32,720
Speaker 1: you have your home run agency. It's a very tight network.

980
01:00:32,960 --> 01:00:34,800
Speaker 1: Are you on a percentage or to give you a

981
01:00:34,800 --> 01:00:39,280
Speaker 1: salary discurse? Yes? Now, Actually, um, when I first started,

982
01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:41,800
Speaker 1: I went from like I think I was making a

983
01:00:41,840 --> 01:00:46,000
Speaker 1: hundred fifty and I went to to five hundred, like

984
01:00:46,200 --> 01:00:48,440
Speaker 1: on Friday and making a hundred and fifty on Monday

985
01:00:48,440 --> 01:00:50,840
Speaker 1: and making five hundred. It was like I can get

986
01:00:50,880 --> 01:00:52,720
Speaker 1: rid of the toyota. I got a cougar. I moved

987
01:00:52,760 --> 01:00:55,600
Speaker 1: into the city from Queens. I mean it was a

988
01:00:55,600 --> 01:00:59,200
Speaker 1: life changer, but it wasn't you know. I wasn't like, hey,

989
01:00:59,240 --> 01:01:01,320
Speaker 1: you made it, but it was the beginning of of

990
01:01:02,680 --> 01:01:06,880
Speaker 1: seeing a new world. Okay, you have the home run agency,

991
01:01:07,600 --> 01:01:10,120
Speaker 1: when do you start signing your acts? In addition to

992
01:01:10,200 --> 01:01:13,920
Speaker 1: billion who were there, well, we I ended up signing

993
01:01:14,000 --> 01:01:22,720
Speaker 1: Phoebe Snow and Harry Chapin and Garland Jefferies and you

994
01:01:22,760 --> 01:01:27,080
Speaker 1: know then and and then, um, I I got the

995
01:01:27,120 --> 01:01:31,760
Speaker 1: Beach Boys and uh actually he was doing quite well.

996
01:01:31,840 --> 01:01:34,160
Speaker 1: And then I lost the Beach Boys, and I lost

997
01:01:34,200 --> 01:01:39,400
Speaker 1: Harry and and the uh in nineteen one. You know, um,

998
01:01:40,200 --> 01:01:44,320
Speaker 1: I was I didn't know if I could um sustain

999
01:01:44,400 --> 01:01:47,280
Speaker 1: an agency sustain a business. Elizabeth was now out of

1000
01:01:47,280 --> 01:01:51,280
Speaker 1: the picture, and so, uh probably out of fear of

1001
01:01:51,320 --> 01:01:54,320
Speaker 1: not being able to sustain myself, I went and worked

1002
01:01:54,320 --> 01:01:57,320
Speaker 1: at William Mars five years. Okay. It was Billy cool

1003
01:01:57,360 --> 01:02:01,800
Speaker 1: with that. Yeah, okay, So did you approach them or

1004
01:02:01,840 --> 01:02:07,200
Speaker 1: were they to approach you? Uh, I don't remember how

1005
01:02:07,200 --> 01:02:11,960
Speaker 1: their relationship worked out. I was available. I had have

1006
01:02:11,960 --> 01:02:16,360
Speaker 1: been approached by others before. But uh I remember though,

1007
01:02:16,520 --> 01:02:19,080
Speaker 1: Um I was at William Morris for about three weeks

1008
01:02:19,120 --> 01:02:21,640
Speaker 1: and I had a body tremble. It was like it

1009
01:02:21,800 --> 01:02:25,560
Speaker 1: was like it was just it was just the wrong fit.

1010
01:02:26,280 --> 01:02:29,520
Speaker 1: But it was very educational. For five years, I understand

1011
01:02:29,600 --> 01:02:32,880
Speaker 1: learned a lot as far as how it worked, and

1012
01:02:33,200 --> 01:02:36,240
Speaker 1: and you know, a lot of the bullshit. And you know,

1013
01:02:36,240 --> 01:02:39,800
Speaker 1: I met some very wonderful people, and people became stars

1014
01:02:39,840 --> 01:02:43,000
Speaker 1: in their fields, and and uh I and I learned

1015
01:02:43,000 --> 01:02:45,880
Speaker 1: a lot of the bullshit that existed there, and and

1016
01:02:45,880 --> 01:02:49,240
Speaker 1: and the bureaucracy and and and and and how these

1017
01:02:49,280 --> 01:02:51,760
Speaker 1: guys were. I remember one time when I was gone

1018
01:02:51,800 --> 01:02:55,160
Speaker 1: and I ran into one of the senior agents on

1019
01:02:55,200 --> 01:02:58,320
Speaker 1: a plane and he's introduced, introducing me as an alumni.

1020
01:02:58,680 --> 01:03:02,600
Speaker 1: And I'm going alumni. I fucking quit, you know, but uh,

1021
01:03:02,680 --> 01:03:05,400
Speaker 1: you know, but it was a good experience and the

1022
01:03:05,440 --> 01:03:08,320
Speaker 1: fact that it it just it exposed me to a

1023
01:03:08,360 --> 01:03:13,760
Speaker 1: world that uh, I really didn't know about. Okay, And

1024
01:03:13,880 --> 01:03:18,680
Speaker 1: did you make good money? Well not really. I remember

1025
01:03:18,720 --> 01:03:20,640
Speaker 1: one year I was making about a hundred and fifty

1026
01:03:20,640 --> 01:03:23,760
Speaker 1: thousand dollars, like win a million dollars in commission, I

1027
01:03:23,760 --> 01:03:26,160
Speaker 1: mean literally a million dollars. Was in the early eighties,

1028
01:03:26,600 --> 01:03:30,480
Speaker 1: and I got a dollar raise. And I remember one

1029
01:03:30,520 --> 01:03:33,400
Speaker 1: of the other agents because at the time, the agents

1030
01:03:33,440 --> 01:03:36,919
Speaker 1: that were in the music age, so william Mars, most

1031
01:03:36,920 --> 01:03:39,040
Speaker 1: of them didn't have any real clients. It was really

1032
01:03:39,040 --> 01:03:42,240
Speaker 1: a hotchpotch of people, and their their game was to

1033
01:03:42,280 --> 01:03:46,960
Speaker 1: beat the management. You know, let's not they weren't um,

1034
01:03:47,280 --> 01:03:49,040
Speaker 1: they weren't trying to get an act. They were trying

1035
01:03:49,040 --> 01:03:51,000
Speaker 1: to fool the management to keep their jobs. And one

1036
01:03:51,040 --> 01:03:53,320
Speaker 1: guy says to me, hey man, we should just be

1037
01:03:53,400 --> 01:03:56,880
Speaker 1: happy we have jobs, and I'm like, wait, wait, wait, wait.

1038
01:03:56,920 --> 01:03:59,760
Speaker 1: You know, but that with that that day, I knew

1039
01:03:59,840 --> 01:04:02,200
Speaker 1: I was done. I was out of william Mars. This

1040
01:04:02,280 --> 01:04:04,480
Speaker 1: is never gonna work for me, you know, they were

1041
01:04:04,560 --> 01:04:07,120
Speaker 1: It was just uh, they didn't take care of the

1042
01:04:07,120 --> 01:04:11,000
Speaker 1: people at that time that wasn't there their mantra. So

1043
01:04:11,200 --> 01:04:20,520
Speaker 1: I left. Okay, how long did you contemplate leaving and

1044
01:04:20,560 --> 01:04:24,480
Speaker 1: what you do for startup funds for your new agency. Well,

1045
01:04:24,600 --> 01:04:29,400
Speaker 1: Roddy Damesfield, who was my client, said to me, I

1046
01:04:29,400 --> 01:04:31,840
Speaker 1: mean he had a real prejudice. He felt that the

1047
01:04:31,920 --> 01:04:36,160
Speaker 1: senior agents, William Mars, just to abuse him. He was

1048
01:04:36,200 --> 01:04:39,160
Speaker 1: just not a fan of theirs, and he hated paying

1049
01:04:39,160 --> 01:04:42,400
Speaker 1: meat and percent and going to them. So he told

1050
01:04:42,440 --> 01:04:44,880
Speaker 1: me one day, if you don't get out of here,

1051
01:04:44,920 --> 01:04:48,960
Speaker 1: I'm leaving. I'm not I'm not uh. And I had

1052
01:04:49,000 --> 01:04:52,760
Speaker 1: a bunch of different circumstances come around and and obviously

1053
01:04:52,800 --> 01:04:54,880
Speaker 1: I just said how they didn't really take care of you.

1054
01:04:55,440 --> 01:04:58,920
Speaker 1: So I I was gonna leave. And it took me

1055
01:04:58,960 --> 01:05:01,200
Speaker 1: about a year. You're an half. I was waiting on.

1056
01:05:01,560 --> 01:05:05,000
Speaker 1: I had pursued some another client that I was trying

1057
01:05:05,040 --> 01:05:07,440
Speaker 1: to get that ended up not working out though I

1058
01:05:07,480 --> 01:05:09,440
Speaker 1: was promised the client, but it didn't work out. And

1059
01:05:09,440 --> 01:05:12,640
Speaker 1: I finally woke up and said, hey, I'm out of

1060
01:05:12,680 --> 01:05:14,680
Speaker 1: my mind. I should be out of here. And Rodney

1061
01:05:15,000 --> 01:05:17,440
Speaker 1: was the one who advanced me forty three thousand dollars

1062
01:05:17,680 --> 01:05:22,120
Speaker 1: to start my own business. Hmm. And believe me, he

1063
01:05:22,200 --> 01:05:24,840
Speaker 1: told me for many years how I owed him, but

1064
01:05:25,120 --> 01:05:29,560
Speaker 1: he but he did advance me forty three thousand dollars.

1065
01:05:29,640 --> 01:05:34,200
Speaker 1: And I remember Adam Cornfeld has worked me for over

1066
01:05:34,280 --> 01:05:36,840
Speaker 1: fourty years. We hopped out, he hopped We hopped out

1067
01:05:36,840 --> 01:05:41,120
Speaker 1: of William Morris and opened up on office across the street.

1068
01:05:41,200 --> 01:05:45,920
Speaker 1: And our clients who are Rodney, Billy, Ted Nugent. Um,

1069
01:05:45,960 --> 01:05:48,720
Speaker 1: I think John Caffey and the Beaver Brown Band and

1070
01:05:48,760 --> 01:05:51,680
Speaker 1: the Beach Boys, and uh, we had a little bit

1071
01:05:51,720 --> 01:05:54,640
Speaker 1: of we had a little bit of a game going. Okay,

1072
01:05:54,680 --> 01:05:58,160
Speaker 1: just for a second. What was Rodney really like? And

1073
01:05:58,240 --> 01:06:00,360
Speaker 1: this was when he really started to make get and

1074
01:06:00,400 --> 01:06:03,320
Speaker 1: how to what degree were you involved in that? Now?

1075
01:06:03,400 --> 01:06:06,960
Speaker 1: I was very close to Rodney. Um. I was thirty

1076
01:06:06,960 --> 01:06:09,000
Speaker 1: one when I thought of representing Rodney, and I think

1077
01:06:09,000 --> 01:06:12,240
Speaker 1: he was fifty nine. Rodney was a young man's comic.

1078
01:06:12,320 --> 01:06:14,640
Speaker 1: I mean, he can really better to me than he

1079
01:06:14,680 --> 01:06:17,600
Speaker 1: could to contemporary. We were more on the same page.

1080
01:06:18,080 --> 01:06:21,480
Speaker 1: And he his DNA was he it was all comedy.

1081
01:06:21,840 --> 01:06:25,320
Speaker 1: He was just uh. I mean he first of all,

1082
01:06:25,360 --> 01:06:28,439
Speaker 1: nobody made me laugh like he did. I mean when

1083
01:06:28,440 --> 01:06:31,160
Speaker 1: you're hanging with somebody, and he was fast and things

1084
01:06:31,240 --> 01:06:34,520
Speaker 1: he would see you, he was It was just extraordinary.

1085
01:06:34,560 --> 01:06:37,760
Speaker 1: He was just absolutely brilliant. But he also taught me

1086
01:06:38,240 --> 01:06:43,640
Speaker 1: very clearly had to be rich, famous and miserable, and um,

1087
01:06:43,680 --> 01:06:45,920
Speaker 1: you know, Rodney was also very depressed. Came from a

1088
01:06:46,000 --> 01:06:49,000
Speaker 1: very difficult background with his mom and stuff. But he

1089
01:06:49,080 --> 01:06:52,360
Speaker 1: was a brilliant comedy a comedian. He introduced me to

1090
01:06:52,400 --> 01:06:55,760
Speaker 1: the world of comedy. He I would travel with him

1091
01:06:56,480 --> 01:07:00,920
Speaker 1: and um, you know many times and uh he you know,

1092
01:07:01,000 --> 01:07:03,640
Speaker 1: he made good money. He was always you know, he's

1093
01:07:04,480 --> 01:07:07,960
Speaker 1: well played casinos and I had a lot of great,

1094
01:07:08,000 --> 01:07:11,120
Speaker 1: wonderful experiences Rodney. I was with Rodney till for twenty

1095
01:07:11,160 --> 01:07:14,040
Speaker 1: three years until he passed. And as a matter of fact,

1096
01:07:14,120 --> 01:07:18,160
Speaker 1: I always remember when I went to his funeral. Um,

1097
01:07:18,200 --> 01:07:20,120
Speaker 1: I probably hadn't cried in the years, and I saw

1098
01:07:20,280 --> 01:07:25,840
Speaker 1: Rodney's daughter, Melody, and she we hugged and I started

1099
01:07:25,880 --> 01:07:30,920
Speaker 1: to cry, and she said, he trusted you. And um.

1100
01:07:30,960 --> 01:07:33,120
Speaker 1: But I think to him, and I quote him many

1101
01:07:33,160 --> 01:07:35,520
Speaker 1: times in my life. I think of lines that he said,

1102
01:07:35,560 --> 01:07:37,919
Speaker 1: you know, uh one am I sweating for I got

1103
01:07:37,960 --> 01:07:40,000
Speaker 1: the job? I think of that that all the time.

1104
01:07:40,120 --> 01:07:42,560
Speaker 1: How about how I approached life because a lot of

1105
01:07:42,600 --> 01:07:46,080
Speaker 1: times I gotta remember I I got the job, I

1106
01:07:46,120 --> 01:07:49,000
Speaker 1: already won, and um, I don't have to function with

1107
01:07:49,080 --> 01:07:52,520
Speaker 1: that fear and uh that might go into a situation.

1108
01:07:52,680 --> 01:07:56,160
Speaker 1: So to what degree were you involved in his film career?

1109
01:07:57,840 --> 01:08:02,320
Speaker 1: Very little? I mean actually the woman he had a manager,

1110
01:08:02,400 --> 01:08:06,760
Speaker 1: a Stell Endlow, who actually produced and oversaw the easy

1111
01:08:06,800 --> 01:08:10,000
Speaker 1: of the Back to School, which was his biggest success.

1112
01:08:10,600 --> 01:08:14,880
Speaker 1: And uh, she passed, she died of cancel and once

1113
01:08:15,080 --> 01:08:19,879
Speaker 1: she passed, I felt that the film career went astray.

1114
01:08:20,240 --> 01:08:23,680
Speaker 1: Rodney became as the manager of Rodby and you know

1115
01:08:23,920 --> 01:08:27,519
Speaker 1: that had limited success, but he was a phenomena, of course,

1116
01:08:27,560 --> 01:08:29,599
Speaker 1: and he was he really made his bones on late

1117
01:08:29,720 --> 01:08:33,280
Speaker 1: night TV. To what degree with the manager handle that?

1118
01:08:34,479 --> 01:08:36,800
Speaker 1: It was? Really it was once a Stell passed, it

1119
01:08:36,880 --> 01:08:39,960
Speaker 1: really wasn't a manager. I mean, uh, I remember when

1120
01:08:40,040 --> 01:08:42,000
Speaker 1: Jay Leno, he told me Jay Leno he had an

1121
01:08:42,040 --> 01:08:44,920
Speaker 1: open invitation. He could go up on Jay anytime he wanted.

1122
01:08:45,320 --> 01:08:48,760
Speaker 1: He really, Uh, he was a godfather. He was a

1123
01:08:48,800 --> 01:08:50,640
Speaker 1: golf he was and he was the godfather of the

1124
01:08:50,680 --> 01:08:53,840
Speaker 1: young comic. I mean he you know, I Andrew Dice

1125
01:08:53,960 --> 01:08:57,400
Speaker 1: Clay who we still still worked with and loved Ice

1126
01:08:57,880 --> 01:09:01,560
Speaker 1: and I got him from Rodney and you know, um

1127
01:09:01,600 --> 01:09:04,840
Speaker 1: he all of these whether it was Kennethon Seinfeld and

1128
01:09:04,960 --> 01:09:07,879
Speaker 1: Rosanne Barr and it was just a WHOSU those hbos

1129
01:09:08,000 --> 01:09:13,080
Speaker 1: specials were just and and he loved the the talent.

1130
01:09:13,120 --> 01:09:16,240
Speaker 1: They were like his children. Okay, see now you have

1131
01:09:16,320 --> 01:09:20,240
Speaker 1: your own agency and you're calling it what q b

1132
01:09:20,400 --> 01:09:27,439
Speaker 1: Q because quality before quantity because after my experience and William,

1133
01:09:27,439 --> 01:09:29,880
Speaker 1: I don't remember one time we had there was a

1134
01:09:29,920 --> 01:09:33,479
Speaker 1: meeting and there was an artist that the fair guy,

1135
01:09:34,040 --> 01:09:37,800
Speaker 1: the Fair department wanted the agency to represent. Nobody wanted

1136
01:09:37,840 --> 01:09:41,240
Speaker 1: to represent the guy, but we ended up representing him.

1137
01:09:41,360 --> 01:09:43,760
Speaker 1: And I said to myself, can you imagine if the

1138
01:09:43,880 --> 01:09:47,519
Speaker 1: artists only knew that nobody wanted him? But here he

1139
01:09:47,600 --> 01:09:50,160
Speaker 1: is the Fair agents is pushing him and that and

1140
01:09:50,200 --> 01:09:54,240
Speaker 1: I and so the philosophy of quality before quantity is,

1141
01:09:54,520 --> 01:09:57,599
Speaker 1: which is really a philosophy of mine anyway, who's just

1142
01:09:57,640 --> 01:10:01,800
Speaker 1: like um? So that so we were qb Q. That's

1143
01:10:02,080 --> 01:10:04,920
Speaker 1: that was how we started and what played out at

1144
01:10:04,960 --> 01:10:11,479
Speaker 1: qb Q q b Q UM actually and we started

1145
01:10:11,520 --> 01:10:17,040
Speaker 1: in eighties six and and and a eight was we

1146
01:10:17,240 --> 01:10:21,040
Speaker 1: just boomed. I mean, we started really making money. I

1147
01:10:21,040 --> 01:10:24,519
Speaker 1: mean we had the dirty Dancing to her, which was

1148
01:10:24,600 --> 01:10:26,719
Speaker 1: just huge. I mean we sold that eight radio city

1149
01:10:26,800 --> 01:10:29,680
Speaker 1: musicals with just an ad I mean so and that

1150
01:10:29,720 --> 01:10:32,760
Speaker 1: came from a client, Eric Carman. It ticked me off

1151
01:10:32,800 --> 01:10:38,000
Speaker 1: about that. And Debbie Gibson exploded in and and and

1152
01:10:38,000 --> 01:10:42,080
Speaker 1: and Billy obviously was a continued superstar. So we were

1153
01:10:42,200 --> 01:10:45,719
Speaker 1: just we were just rocking. We were just smoking and

1154
01:10:45,800 --> 01:10:49,600
Speaker 1: you know, um and and and that. You know that continued.

1155
01:10:49,920 --> 01:10:53,960
Speaker 1: Um So the agency was was basically very healthy in

1156
01:10:54,000 --> 01:10:57,280
Speaker 1: the in the early nineties. We got uh the Q

1157
01:10:57,479 --> 01:11:01,080
Speaker 1: Prime guys brought over there rocks that us so that

1158
01:11:01,160 --> 01:11:07,080
Speaker 1: became Metallica and def Leopard and you know and uh

1159
01:11:07,720 --> 01:11:11,360
Speaker 1: Tesler and and their roster. So that became a part

1160
01:11:11,400 --> 01:11:15,680
Speaker 1: of you know, and then um Alan Kovac, who had

1161
01:11:15,720 --> 01:11:18,800
Speaker 1: been a very close associate, he gave us. We were

1162
01:11:19,120 --> 01:11:23,720
Speaker 1: introduced to Motley Crewe and and and that. So you know,

1163
01:11:23,800 --> 01:11:28,320
Speaker 1: we just had established we we established a relationship with

1164
01:11:28,439 --> 01:11:31,920
Speaker 1: credibility of being very good at what we did. And

1165
01:11:32,760 --> 01:11:35,000
Speaker 1: there were a lot of you know, and and people

1166
01:11:35,000 --> 01:11:37,719
Speaker 1: were drawn to us, and we were hustled. We hustled

1167
01:11:37,720 --> 01:11:41,080
Speaker 1: people we we went out hustling and worked very hard

1168
01:11:41,120 --> 01:11:46,120
Speaker 1: to uh to get clients and and it was. And

1169
01:11:46,120 --> 01:11:49,679
Speaker 1: then then in the late nineties I sold the business

1170
01:11:49,680 --> 01:11:54,120
Speaker 1: to Bob Silliman. Okay, but he did end up buying

1171
01:11:54,160 --> 01:11:56,040
Speaker 1: all the other agencies. People thought he was going to

1172
01:11:56,120 --> 01:11:58,040
Speaker 1: roll up the age. What was going on there? Well,

1173
01:11:58,080 --> 01:11:59,960
Speaker 1: we were, we were going to do it. We did.

1174
01:12:00,080 --> 01:12:04,639
Speaker 1: We had five agencies under our umbrella. And then Bob

1175
01:12:04,680 --> 01:12:09,200
Speaker 1: sold the Clear Channel and uh he he said to

1176
01:12:09,280 --> 01:12:11,920
Speaker 1: me when he sold, you know we had five there

1177
01:12:12,000 --> 01:12:14,800
Speaker 1: was you know, he paid everybody's lawyers fees and you

1178
01:12:14,840 --> 01:12:18,320
Speaker 1: know that put in the time and energy. And two

1179
01:12:18,400 --> 01:12:22,679
Speaker 1: of the agencies, which was I, T. B and John Giddings,

1180
01:12:23,080 --> 01:12:26,519
Speaker 1: continued and made deals the Clear Channel, which became Live Nations,

1181
01:12:26,560 --> 01:12:29,400
Speaker 1: So they continued. The others didn't happen. But MAB paid

1182
01:12:29,439 --> 01:12:33,680
Speaker 1: the legal piece and and he took care of me.

1183
01:12:33,800 --> 01:12:35,960
Speaker 1: He gave me my business back, which I was only

1184
01:12:35,960 --> 01:12:37,720
Speaker 1: there with him for two and a half years, and

1185
01:12:37,760 --> 01:12:40,639
Speaker 1: he gave my business back and he paid me start

1186
01:12:40,720 --> 01:12:46,040
Speaker 1: from the beginning. Why did you make the deal? Well,

1187
01:12:46,080 --> 01:12:47,760
Speaker 1: it was at the time of the roll up. I

1188
01:12:48,200 --> 01:12:52,920
Speaker 1: just saw it as as an opportunity to besides make money. UM,

1189
01:12:53,760 --> 01:12:56,439
Speaker 1: I just sort of as uh. I liked what he

1190
01:12:56,479 --> 01:12:59,880
Speaker 1: was doing. I thought he was making smart buys. I

1191
01:13:00,080 --> 01:13:03,160
Speaker 1: mean at that time buying pace and sell a door

1192
01:13:03,200 --> 01:13:06,880
Speaker 1: and uh Delstner and coppolit I mean I thought he

1193
01:13:06,920 --> 01:13:09,040
Speaker 1: was he was he was, he was making good picks.

1194
01:13:09,680 --> 01:13:11,320
Speaker 1: So I wanted to be part of that team. I

1195
01:13:11,360 --> 01:13:16,760
Speaker 1: was interested in that. And I remember um meeting with

1196
01:13:16,840 --> 01:13:20,880
Speaker 1: Mitch later and um, you know, he says, you always

1197
01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:23,439
Speaker 1: make money, and then he introduced me and I had

1198
01:13:23,439 --> 01:13:27,160
Speaker 1: a meeting with Bob and Bob was talking. Then they

1199
01:13:27,200 --> 01:13:31,639
Speaker 1: have the meeting was Rodney jokes and uh, Bob made

1200
01:13:31,640 --> 01:13:36,679
Speaker 1: me an offer and I became part of his team. Okay,

1201
01:13:36,760 --> 01:13:39,479
Speaker 1: so it ends with the sailor you get your business back.

1202
01:13:41,360 --> 01:13:46,360
Speaker 1: What goes on there. Well, my experience was so good

1203
01:13:46,720 --> 01:13:51,360
Speaker 1: that I was open to be acquired again. And actually

1204
01:13:51,360 --> 01:13:55,800
Speaker 1: it did happen. Uh several years later, when um I

1205
01:13:55,880 --> 01:13:59,599
Speaker 1: made a deal with Van burkele my son Jared came

1206
01:13:59,640 --> 01:14:01,960
Speaker 1: into the business and he said, hey, if I'm going

1207
01:14:02,000 --> 01:14:04,639
Speaker 1: to come in, I want to grow the business and

1208
01:14:04,760 --> 01:14:07,880
Speaker 1: we needed to find a rabling and uh so we

1209
01:14:08,000 --> 01:14:10,800
Speaker 1: spent you know, Jack Kennedy. As a matter we'd have

1210
01:14:10,880 --> 01:14:14,800
Speaker 1: financial people I would be saying, well, where did we

1211
01:14:14,880 --> 01:14:17,280
Speaker 1: leave off with this one? What's the status of this one?

1212
01:14:17,360 --> 01:14:20,160
Speaker 1: But we started to realize that we needed somebody who

1213
01:14:20,200 --> 01:14:23,479
Speaker 1: understood or had a sense of the entertainment space. Not

1214
01:14:23,680 --> 01:14:27,320
Speaker 1: somebody and not just people who are financial people, but

1215
01:14:27,400 --> 01:14:31,320
Speaker 1: people who at that time could certainly understand, uh, the

1216
01:14:31,479 --> 01:14:35,040
Speaker 1: entertainment space. And we identified Ron Barkel, who had interest

1217
01:14:35,160 --> 01:14:38,280
Speaker 1: in that space and investment in that space. And we

1218
01:14:38,320 --> 01:14:42,439
Speaker 1: took some meetings and our lawyer knew somebody connected to

1219
01:14:42,479 --> 01:14:45,439
Speaker 1: Wrong and you know, and and ten years ago we

1220
01:14:45,479 --> 01:14:49,400
Speaker 1: made a deal with Wrong. And was he an eager

1221
01:14:49,479 --> 01:14:52,960
Speaker 1: buyer or you had to sell it to him? I

1222
01:14:53,000 --> 01:14:55,519
Speaker 1: think it was mutual. I think the I think timing

1223
01:14:55,600 --> 01:14:58,840
Speaker 1: is everything. I think they were open to expand in

1224
01:14:58,880 --> 01:15:03,160
Speaker 1: their entertainment game. And uh, and I had such a

1225
01:15:03,160 --> 01:15:08,360
Speaker 1: great experience with Bob Sulliman, you know that, why wouldn't

1226
01:15:08,400 --> 01:15:16,800
Speaker 1: I want to do this again? Right? So, ultimately, you know,

1227
01:15:17,080 --> 01:15:21,080
Speaker 1: brokeled in by other agencies. What's going on there? Well,

1228
01:15:21,360 --> 01:15:24,000
Speaker 1: we've we've done two deals since then, you know, we've

1229
01:15:24,000 --> 01:15:26,320
Speaker 1: done several deals. We brought in Marshall Alassa, who is

1230
01:15:26,360 --> 01:15:30,600
Speaker 1: a superstar agent and as a major roster, and we

1231
01:15:30,720 --> 01:15:33,320
Speaker 1: brought in K two from England with John Jackson or

1232
01:15:33,360 --> 01:15:37,040
Speaker 1: his Metallica and Iron Maiden worldwide. And then we just

1233
01:15:37,120 --> 01:15:40,360
Speaker 1: made a deal in association with x Ray who represents

1234
01:15:40,360 --> 01:15:45,200
Speaker 1: Coldplay and Guerrillas and um, M and M. So we've

1235
01:15:45,240 --> 01:15:49,840
Speaker 1: made some some major in roads over the uh you know, UM,

1236
01:15:49,880 --> 01:15:52,920
Speaker 1: you know, we're not we're not trying to be UM

1237
01:15:53,880 --> 01:15:56,519
Speaker 1: you know, we we're not trying to be CIA, but

1238
01:15:56,640 --> 01:15:59,920
Speaker 1: we've made some uh I think some very calculated, small

1239
01:16:00,080 --> 01:16:02,640
Speaker 1: intelligent moves or some great people to who are you

1240
01:16:02,680 --> 01:16:08,679
Speaker 1: trying to be? We're trying to be prepared. I mean,

1241
01:16:09,040 --> 01:16:13,400
Speaker 1: you know, I I one time, like I believe ultimately

1242
01:16:14,040 --> 01:16:18,360
Speaker 1: that um, you know, if there was ever you know,

1243
01:16:18,960 --> 01:16:22,120
Speaker 1: just like in the philosophy of my would we started

1244
01:16:22,160 --> 01:16:25,799
Speaker 1: this interview out and we talked about the a artists

1245
01:16:26,479 --> 01:16:32,960
Speaker 1: being compromised in the agency world because you know, the

1246
01:16:32,960 --> 01:16:35,440
Speaker 1: the artist didn't want to pay for the same services

1247
01:16:35,520 --> 01:16:40,040
Speaker 1: or similar services twice. And I felt that the only

1248
01:16:40,160 --> 01:16:43,040
Speaker 1: way that if that if you're if you're going to

1249
01:16:43,120 --> 01:16:45,479
Speaker 1: be threatened or your business is gonna be threatened, then

1250
01:16:45,560 --> 01:16:48,840
Speaker 1: you may have to get into the promotion business and

1251
01:16:49,280 --> 01:16:53,200
Speaker 1: why should I lose an artist to somebody that I've

1252
01:16:53,240 --> 01:16:55,240
Speaker 1: developed and have a relationship with it. I have a

1253
01:16:55,240 --> 01:16:58,520
Speaker 1: foresight because I just don't have the money to go compete.

1254
01:16:59,160 --> 01:17:03,439
Speaker 1: So um by now having a lot of you know,

1255
01:17:03,640 --> 01:17:09,080
Speaker 1: agents that have relationships with their artists that um you

1256
01:17:09,120 --> 01:17:11,960
Speaker 1: know that kind of at the same time, as much

1257
01:17:12,000 --> 01:17:15,600
Speaker 1: as we're building an agency business, we're building you know,

1258
01:17:16,000 --> 01:17:18,600
Speaker 1: or we have the accessibility if we need it to

1259
01:17:18,680 --> 01:17:21,160
Speaker 1: be in that space. We can be in that space.

1260
01:17:22,040 --> 01:17:24,040
Speaker 1: We can play in that space if we have there

1261
01:17:24,080 --> 01:17:26,759
Speaker 1: as long as we have the resources. It's not necessarily

1262
01:17:26,760 --> 01:17:29,679
Speaker 1: where I'm going, but it's a possibility. Okay, So you're

1263
01:17:29,720 --> 01:17:32,880
Speaker 1: saying theoretically, if you want to go into from motion business,

1264
01:17:33,360 --> 01:17:38,320
Speaker 1: Ron has deep enough pockets to support you. Ron can

1265
01:17:38,760 --> 01:17:41,360
Speaker 1: and you know, if Ron shows that that that's you know,

1266
01:17:41,560 --> 01:17:44,960
Speaker 1: it's just hey, Ron's available for an opportunity. There's some

1267
01:17:45,000 --> 01:17:49,479
Speaker 1: great opportunities now, you know, as as as long as

1268
01:17:49,520 --> 01:17:52,280
Speaker 1: it works out with others, we don't need that. But

1269
01:17:52,600 --> 01:17:55,960
Speaker 1: if it didn't and our business was threatened, then I

1270
01:17:56,000 --> 01:17:58,160
Speaker 1: think we got to step up to the plate. And

1271
01:17:58,240 --> 01:18:00,120
Speaker 1: I think you go, you know, and I think to

1272
01:18:00,200 --> 01:18:05,080
Speaker 1: be aligned with others and hey, and and if if

1273
01:18:05,120 --> 01:18:09,320
Speaker 1: I can give my arts the same opportunities as somebody else,

1274
01:18:09,680 --> 01:18:11,439
Speaker 1: why wouldn't you want to stay with me who you

1275
01:18:11,479 --> 01:18:18,240
Speaker 1: already know? So you're saying there's room for more competitors

1276
01:18:18,240 --> 01:18:21,439
Speaker 1: beyond as a major scale, beyond a g and live

1277
01:18:21,520 --> 01:18:25,120
Speaker 1: nation if necessary, if the agent is now now now

1278
01:18:25,120 --> 01:18:27,280
Speaker 1: as long if the agents don't want to promote, the

1279
01:18:27,320 --> 01:18:31,519
Speaker 1: agencies don't want to promote, well that's their that's their choice.

1280
01:18:31,520 --> 01:18:35,439
Speaker 1: But I think that's the only way to eventually um

1281
01:18:35,479 --> 01:18:40,200
Speaker 1: neutralize the game. I mean, otherwise, you know, you're always

1282
01:18:40,200 --> 01:18:43,160
Speaker 1: gonna be the tail wagging the dog. But you know

1283
01:18:43,600 --> 01:18:45,639
Speaker 1: what would be the trigger to go down that road?

1284
01:18:47,479 --> 01:18:52,080
Speaker 1: Keep taking my ax, keep you know, if I can't compete,

1285
01:18:52,360 --> 01:18:55,160
Speaker 1: if I can't compete with you, and I'm gonna, you know,

1286
01:18:55,280 --> 01:18:59,240
Speaker 1: become somebody that was making you know, seven figures a

1287
01:18:59,320 --> 01:19:03,240
Speaker 1: year and beduce to uh, you know, to uh you know,

1288
01:19:03,360 --> 01:19:06,200
Speaker 1: to you know, to a small sum of money. You're

1289
01:19:06,280 --> 01:19:08,960
Speaker 1: you're you're now costing me my income, You're taking my

1290
01:19:09,040 --> 01:19:12,000
Speaker 1: living away. So how how am I going to protect myself?

1291
01:19:12,200 --> 01:19:15,519
Speaker 1: I gotta compete with you? And why do I want

1292
01:19:15,560 --> 01:19:19,280
Speaker 1: to give up these primary relationships? Because you have the

1293
01:19:19,320 --> 01:19:23,280
Speaker 1: resources that I don't have. And yeah, maybe agencies don't

1294
01:19:23,280 --> 01:19:25,840
Speaker 1: want to take risks, and I understand that, but that's

1295
01:19:25,880 --> 01:19:29,479
Speaker 1: the game you're in. And how did you convince Marsha

1296
01:19:29,520 --> 01:19:33,559
Speaker 1: to come with you? I think that I think what

1297
01:19:33,880 --> 01:19:38,160
Speaker 1: we offered is the I think Marsha can be an

1298
01:19:38,160 --> 01:19:43,639
Speaker 1: independent within an organization. She's she's Marsha doing her thing,

1299
01:19:44,400 --> 01:19:47,599
Speaker 1: but she also has us, and she has a bigger

1300
01:19:47,600 --> 01:19:50,800
Speaker 1: picture and and and other players when she wants to,

1301
01:19:51,600 --> 01:19:53,840
Speaker 1: and she doesn't have to have us when she does.

1302
01:19:54,120 --> 01:19:58,360
Speaker 1: She's you know, it's like it's she's she's an independent

1303
01:19:58,880 --> 01:20:01,400
Speaker 1: and and and a paul of a bigger picture. So

1304
01:20:01,479 --> 01:20:04,840
Speaker 1: she can draw from our resources other experiences with other

1305
01:20:05,000 --> 01:20:07,639
Speaker 1: artists are doing. But she's able to run her own business.

1306
01:20:08,240 --> 01:20:11,000
Speaker 1: So your CEO, you essentially never tell her how to

1307
01:20:11,080 --> 01:20:14,240
Speaker 1: run her business. Now, I don't tell her. I share

1308
01:20:14,320 --> 01:20:16,280
Speaker 1: with her. I talked to her all the time, we

1309
01:20:16,360 --> 01:20:19,840
Speaker 1: share information. She'll bounce things off of me. I'll bounce

1310
01:20:19,920 --> 01:20:24,400
Speaker 1: things off of her. Where where friends? Where you? And

1311
01:20:24,479 --> 01:20:27,600
Speaker 1: But I don't tell her what to do? Okay? And

1312
01:20:27,600 --> 01:20:31,240
Speaker 1: with the English company, what's the history there? Same thing?

1313
01:20:31,400 --> 01:20:34,599
Speaker 1: I mean, it's like I think our philosophy is we

1314
01:20:34,680 --> 01:20:38,200
Speaker 1: want to give everybody. We want to encourage the entrepreneurs

1315
01:20:38,200 --> 01:20:40,800
Speaker 1: and the star ages to be star agents. We're just

1316
01:20:41,000 --> 01:20:44,920
Speaker 1: we're just giving you an umbrella with certain resources that

1317
01:20:45,320 --> 01:20:49,240
Speaker 1: you can you can extract from. So we really encourage

1318
01:20:49,439 --> 01:20:52,280
Speaker 1: I try to avoid all the politics. I mean, listen,

1319
01:20:52,400 --> 01:20:54,840
Speaker 1: it's not my business. But some of these agencies, you'd

1320
01:20:54,880 --> 01:20:57,760
Speaker 1: be surprised em many unhappy people. There are people who

1321
01:20:57,800 --> 01:21:02,439
Speaker 1: are miserable politically. It's a s and it's not out there,

1322
01:21:02,479 --> 01:21:04,400
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of honesty about that that's not

1323
01:21:04,479 --> 01:21:06,759
Speaker 1: out there. But there's a lot of very unhappy people

1324
01:21:07,280 --> 01:21:09,840
Speaker 1: and a lot of people stay there at a fear

1325
01:21:10,040 --> 01:21:13,599
Speaker 1: comfort all that kind of stuff. But I'm I try

1326
01:21:13,640 --> 01:21:16,080
Speaker 1: to be if you're a star, I try to we

1327
01:21:16,160 --> 01:21:19,800
Speaker 1: try to encourage your independence. We try to encourage, you know,

1328
01:21:20,240 --> 01:21:24,320
Speaker 1: the best of both worlds, security and independence at the

1329
01:21:24,360 --> 01:21:28,320
Speaker 1: same time. Well, you know, it used to be that,

1330
01:21:29,000 --> 01:21:34,240
Speaker 1: especially in the seventies, music was huge income for these

1331
01:21:34,320 --> 01:21:39,160
Speaker 1: major agencies. Now the agencies are really like you know

1332
01:21:39,280 --> 01:21:42,600
Speaker 1: in sports, the UFC, I mean, what's going through the

1333
01:21:42,640 --> 01:21:45,559
Speaker 1: head of these agents there? Music agents are getting no respect.

1334
01:21:47,280 --> 01:21:50,960
Speaker 1: Well not in my world, you know, I mean, you know,

1335
01:21:51,040 --> 01:21:55,599
Speaker 1: and God bless, you know the entrepreneurship and um and

1336
01:21:55,840 --> 01:21:58,800
Speaker 1: you know, and you know and how they've diversed and

1337
01:21:59,320 --> 01:22:03,679
Speaker 1: you know, it's it's you know, I'm I admire what

1338
01:22:03,840 --> 01:22:07,920
Speaker 1: many many people have done. However, um, that's not where

1339
01:22:07,960 --> 01:22:10,160
Speaker 1: i am. I'm not. I'm not some of these people.

1340
01:22:10,240 --> 01:22:13,880
Speaker 1: I'm a music business. I'm to Sarrio, i am not

1341
01:22:14,040 --> 01:22:16,280
Speaker 1: in the sports business. I'm a sports fan. I'm not

1342
01:22:16,360 --> 01:22:18,680
Speaker 1: in the sports business. I'm not you know, we have

1343
01:22:19,080 --> 01:22:21,920
Speaker 1: we have alignments with people. We have a sponsorship group

1344
01:22:21,920 --> 01:22:25,439
Speaker 1: that we that we have an alignment with. But I'm

1345
01:22:25,479 --> 01:22:28,840
Speaker 1: you know, I admire and God bless, but I'm not

1346
01:22:28,880 --> 01:22:31,160
Speaker 1: in the shoe business. I'm in the music business. I

1347
01:22:31,160 --> 01:22:33,080
Speaker 1: have a lane, I have a niche, I have a

1348
01:22:33,120 --> 01:22:36,720
Speaker 1: way of what I know and what I'm an expert in.

1349
01:22:36,760 --> 01:22:39,160
Speaker 1: I'm not a you know, I'm not a jack of

1350
01:22:39,200 --> 01:22:43,760
Speaker 1: all trades. And the way you tell your story is

1351
01:22:43,760 --> 01:22:47,040
Speaker 1: a little different from other agents. Other te agents tell

1352
01:22:47,080 --> 01:22:49,760
Speaker 1: the story although they were going out six nights a

1353
01:22:49,800 --> 01:22:54,160
Speaker 1: week networking looking for talent, did we not hear that

1354
01:22:54,280 --> 01:22:56,080
Speaker 1: or that you didn't just didn't do it that way?

1355
01:22:57,600 --> 01:23:00,080
Speaker 1: I did it that way. I mean Hey, I I

1356
01:23:00,200 --> 01:23:02,400
Speaker 1: go to l A, and I go to Howard Coftins,

1357
01:23:02,400 --> 01:23:04,920
Speaker 1: and I visit people I was chasing all the time.

1358
01:23:05,400 --> 01:23:10,800
Speaker 1: I never have considered myself, uh a great signer, though

1359
01:23:10,880 --> 01:23:14,599
Speaker 1: we we ended up having, you know, a very good roster.

1360
01:23:15,160 --> 01:23:18,040
Speaker 1: But I, you know, I would be out there. I mean,

1361
01:23:18,760 --> 01:23:22,679
Speaker 1: but there's different ways of being out there, and and

1362
01:23:23,000 --> 01:23:25,400
Speaker 1: you know, and that evolves and and then you grow

1363
01:23:25,520 --> 01:23:27,800
Speaker 1: your business. And we've had a lot of people who

1364
01:23:27,800 --> 01:23:30,240
Speaker 1: have been with us for a long time and they'd

1365
01:23:30,240 --> 01:23:33,479
Speaker 1: be at on the street and and and sometimes you party.

1366
01:23:33,520 --> 01:23:35,400
Speaker 1: You're really you know, you have a relationship with one

1367
01:23:35,439 --> 01:23:38,000
Speaker 1: manager and he signs bands and he loves your work,

1368
01:23:38,160 --> 01:23:40,519
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden you're representing more bands from

1369
01:23:40,520 --> 01:23:45,799
Speaker 1: their roster. So there's just many ways to obtain a roster.

1370
01:23:46,040 --> 01:23:48,960
Speaker 1: And uh, hey, there are some some agencies that's hire

1371
01:23:49,000 --> 01:23:52,120
Speaker 1: fifty agents and see what sticks to the wall. I mean,

1372
01:23:52,160 --> 01:23:54,519
Speaker 1: we haven't been that kind of That's not been our

1373
01:23:54,920 --> 01:24:00,240
Speaker 1: motus operendum, but hey, there are other I would like

1374
01:24:00,400 --> 01:24:02,439
Speaker 1: to be in the country business. Now, am I personally

1375
01:24:02,479 --> 01:24:05,400
Speaker 1: gonna be in the country business. Not really, But if

1376
01:24:05,400 --> 01:24:08,559
Speaker 1: I can find and and and the superstar agent, that

1377
01:24:08,640 --> 01:24:12,679
Speaker 1: would seek what we offer, um, and you know that

1378
01:24:12,680 --> 01:24:13,960
Speaker 1: that would be the way I'd want to be in

1379
01:24:13,960 --> 01:24:16,760
Speaker 1: the country business. I wouldn't necessarily myself stop going door

1380
01:24:16,840 --> 01:24:19,520
Speaker 1: to door, but I need somebody else who's a superstar,

1381
01:24:19,920 --> 01:24:24,120
Speaker 1: who has who can go beyond the big agency or

1382
01:24:24,320 --> 01:24:28,040
Speaker 1: feel that you know, would would have the you know

1383
01:24:28,600 --> 01:24:31,560
Speaker 1: kind of I guess, the courage, the entrepreneurship and the

1384
01:24:31,960 --> 01:24:34,439
Speaker 1: spirit to uh to make a move. I mean, there

1385
01:24:34,439 --> 01:24:38,000
Speaker 1: aren't very many independence out there anymore. I think everybody's

1386
01:24:38,000 --> 01:24:41,200
Speaker 1: looking for safety net. So how many people work for

1387
01:24:41,240 --> 01:24:44,160
Speaker 1: you in New York twenty two twenty two? And how

1388
01:24:44,160 --> 01:24:48,920
Speaker 1: many your agents? And okay, now you're only one person,

1389
01:24:49,640 --> 01:24:52,040
Speaker 1: So how much can you handle? And if I sign

1390
01:24:52,120 --> 01:24:54,160
Speaker 1: with you, are you doing the work or somebody else

1391
01:24:54,200 --> 01:24:59,200
Speaker 1: doing the work? Um? Both? I mean sometimes sometimes I'm

1392
01:24:59,240 --> 01:25:02,240
Speaker 1: the parent. Sometimes I al, we signed the band, why

1393
01:25:02,280 --> 01:25:07,400
Speaker 1: don't we the boy band, which so I believe is

1394
01:25:07,479 --> 01:25:10,679
Speaker 1: gonna be you know, superstar band. I'm right in there.

1395
01:25:10,880 --> 01:25:13,360
Speaker 1: We've resenting worldwide. I am right in there. I'm there

1396
01:25:13,400 --> 01:25:17,680
Speaker 1: with my my son Jared and with Adam Quintfeld, and

1397
01:25:17,920 --> 01:25:21,160
Speaker 1: I'm I'm right in there doing the work. I mean,

1398
01:25:21,240 --> 01:25:23,719
Speaker 1: but again, it takes the village, and I have different

1399
01:25:23,760 --> 01:25:29,680
Speaker 1: relationships within different networks and um and uh so, but

1400
01:25:29,920 --> 01:25:34,360
Speaker 1: uh yeah, I you know, sometimes I'm the parent sometimes

1401
01:25:34,400 --> 01:25:37,680
Speaker 1: but I delegate. Well I'm a good delegator, but I

1402
01:25:37,760 --> 01:25:43,840
Speaker 1: also melodically on and I oversee. Okay, what's your personal future?

1403
01:25:43,880 --> 01:25:46,200
Speaker 1: You're gonna do this till you drop? Well, listen, I

1404
01:25:46,280 --> 01:25:51,120
Speaker 1: got you know, we have the last year we were

1405
01:25:51,160 --> 01:25:54,160
Speaker 1: supposed to have the Death Weap in Motley Cruz Poison

1406
01:25:54,240 --> 01:25:56,960
Speaker 1: Stadium Tour, which was probably the biggest tour in America

1407
01:25:57,040 --> 01:26:00,280
Speaker 1: last year and I was just hugely successful. And now

1408
01:26:00,320 --> 01:26:03,920
Speaker 1: our next years it's going to be the third time

1409
01:26:04,120 --> 01:26:06,760
Speaker 1: that this thing is gonna be scheduled. So here we

1410
01:26:06,840 --> 01:26:10,480
Speaker 1: are and Billy Joel doing stadiums and Metallica doing stadiums.

1411
01:26:10,920 --> 01:26:14,080
Speaker 1: I mean, why would I want to let go of this?

1412
01:26:14,080 --> 01:26:17,280
Speaker 1: This is a blast? I mean, to me, what an

1413
01:26:17,280 --> 01:26:20,280
Speaker 1: August and it is to walk into a stadium of

1414
01:26:20,400 --> 01:26:25,280
Speaker 1: forty people and your artist is playing and I'm having

1415
01:26:25,320 --> 01:26:28,240
Speaker 1: a blast. So why would I want to You know,

1416
01:26:28,280 --> 01:26:29,599
Speaker 1: It's like if you said to me if I could

1417
01:26:29,600 --> 01:26:32,360
Speaker 1: still pitch baseball and win twenty games a year, and

1418
01:26:32,840 --> 01:26:35,840
Speaker 1: then he said to me, hey, you when you're gonna

1419
01:26:35,840 --> 01:26:37,720
Speaker 1: retired as long as I get to keep If I

1420
01:26:37,720 --> 01:26:40,040
Speaker 1: can still win twenty games, why would I'm having a blast.

1421
01:26:40,560 --> 01:26:42,640
Speaker 1: So I'm having a great time. If you told me

1422
01:26:42,680 --> 01:26:45,160
Speaker 1: I had a big bar, bands and and and what

1423
01:26:45,320 --> 01:26:46,880
Speaker 1: crawl my way, I don't know if I could do that,

1424
01:26:47,240 --> 01:26:50,840
Speaker 1: but I could do this. This is fun, okay? And

1425
01:26:50,920 --> 01:26:53,559
Speaker 1: you're doing this? Is this seven? Or you have any

1426
01:26:53,560 --> 01:26:57,840
Speaker 1: other interests I do? I have. I have another life.

1427
01:26:58,640 --> 01:27:02,240
Speaker 1: I you know, I I play golf. I still pitch softball.

1428
01:27:02,640 --> 01:27:04,200
Speaker 1: I don't know how long that will keep going on.

1429
01:27:04,560 --> 01:27:07,200
Speaker 1: I'm a big sports fan. UM. I have a lot

1430
01:27:07,240 --> 01:27:10,439
Speaker 1: of you know, some very significant other I'm very close

1431
01:27:10,479 --> 01:27:12,920
Speaker 1: to my family, my daughter and my son and my grandson,

1432
01:27:13,000 --> 01:27:17,600
Speaker 1: and and and some very close family. And I have

1433
01:27:17,720 --> 01:27:20,240
Speaker 1: some very very close friends that have nothing to do

1434
01:27:20,320 --> 01:27:23,000
Speaker 1: with the business. I don't know. The best friends is

1435
01:27:23,120 --> 01:27:26,800
Speaker 1: a shrink and uh sometimes I'll sit there with him

1436
01:27:26,920 --> 01:27:30,000
Speaker 1: and I can talk to him and and get a

1437
01:27:30,000 --> 01:27:34,839
Speaker 1: whole different perspective of of the world psychologically or what

1438
01:27:34,560 --> 01:27:37,040
Speaker 1: what what people are thinking in a way I may

1439
01:27:37,080 --> 01:27:41,559
Speaker 1: not have seen something and UH find it, um, you know,

1440
01:27:42,000 --> 01:27:45,799
Speaker 1: UH find it very intriguing. So I have a network

1441
01:27:45,840 --> 01:27:49,040
Speaker 1: of which most people really don't know of people that

1442
01:27:49,439 --> 01:27:53,000
Speaker 1: just have nothing to do with my daily world. Have

1443
01:27:53,160 --> 01:27:57,400
Speaker 1: you ever been in therapy? Yes, As a matter of fact,

1444
01:27:57,640 --> 01:28:03,000
Speaker 1: my therapist, my my buddy more um who I drove

1445
01:28:03,080 --> 01:28:05,519
Speaker 1: with him from New York when he went to school

1446
01:28:05,520 --> 01:28:11,280
Speaker 1: of psychology in San Diego and he um and and

1447
01:28:11,280 --> 01:28:13,840
Speaker 1: and I watched Mawkie had to go through analysis and

1448
01:28:13,920 --> 01:28:17,400
Speaker 1: all of this too, um, you know, to to become

1449
01:28:17,439 --> 01:28:20,720
Speaker 1: a doctor. And I watched him go through this whole process.

1450
01:28:21,120 --> 01:28:23,519
Speaker 1: But he and he was getting so happy. It was

1451
01:28:23,560 --> 01:28:26,520
Speaker 1: like he was really working himself out and really understanding

1452
01:28:26,600 --> 01:28:29,120
Speaker 1: himself in a very deep level. And I says, man,

1453
01:28:29,200 --> 01:28:33,840
Speaker 1: I love this ship. And and so my therapist for

1454
01:28:34,040 --> 01:28:40,160
Speaker 1: seven years was one of his teachers, and Stanley was

1455
01:28:40,240 --> 01:28:43,920
Speaker 1: just brilliant. I mean, Stanley wouldn't give you much, but Stanley,

1456
01:28:43,960 --> 01:28:46,240
Speaker 1: you know, definitely helped me sort out a lot of

1457
01:28:47,200 --> 01:28:54,960
Speaker 1: you know, parent understanding and parent issues. And it paved

1458
01:28:54,960 --> 01:28:59,560
Speaker 1: the way, um for for for me to have a

1459
01:29:00,280 --> 01:29:04,920
Speaker 1: happy life. I took a lot of lessons out of that.

1460
01:29:05,040 --> 01:29:08,800
Speaker 1: And um, I'm you know, wisdom is very important to

1461
01:29:08,880 --> 01:29:12,559
Speaker 1: be smart. You'd be smart about yourself being emotionally healthy,

1462
01:29:12,840 --> 01:29:15,560
Speaker 1: It's very very important to me and to surround you

1463
01:29:15,720 --> 01:29:17,880
Speaker 1: people that kind of support that. Like when I go

1464
01:29:17,920 --> 01:29:20,960
Speaker 1: out with my buddy, my string friend, Dr. Markminson, and

1465
01:29:21,040 --> 01:29:24,960
Speaker 1: we're talking. I mean sometimes I had the stimulation and

1466
01:29:25,000 --> 01:29:27,200
Speaker 1: the things we get into and he talks to me

1467
01:29:27,240 --> 01:29:30,680
Speaker 1: about his patients and it's just uh said, all that

1468
01:29:30,760 --> 01:29:32,519
Speaker 1: stuff to be to be worked out and to be

1469
01:29:32,560 --> 01:29:37,120
Speaker 1: emotionally happy is is a journey of life. And I, um,

1470
01:29:37,160 --> 01:29:39,800
Speaker 1: you know that's that That's the essence of who I am.

1471
01:29:39,840 --> 01:29:42,400
Speaker 1: I want to be happy. How many times you've been

1472
01:29:42,439 --> 01:29:47,000
Speaker 1: married once. I'm married to my lovely wife Bonnie for

1473
01:29:47,000 --> 01:29:51,840
Speaker 1: forty two years. We've had two children, and hey, we

1474
01:29:51,920 --> 01:29:55,000
Speaker 1: have a goal. We have great life. I'm very blessed.

1475
01:29:55,360 --> 01:29:58,720
Speaker 1: You're buried in the late seventies. You know, this is

1476
01:29:58,760 --> 01:30:00,920
Speaker 1: a business that to me, ends a lot of time.

1477
01:30:01,560 --> 01:30:08,320
Speaker 1: How is she with that? Bonnie Bonnie Bonnie vicariously plays

1478
01:30:08,400 --> 01:30:10,519
Speaker 1: this game. I mean she doesn't live. You know, she

1479
01:30:10,560 --> 01:30:15,320
Speaker 1: could sit here with me and she has um. You know,

1480
01:30:15,479 --> 01:30:17,800
Speaker 1: the beginning she traveled with me and went with me.

1481
01:30:17,920 --> 01:30:20,040
Speaker 1: Now she doesn't go so much, has been gone for

1482
01:30:20,040 --> 01:30:23,080
Speaker 1: for a while. And she said to me, Um, a

1483
01:30:23,120 --> 01:30:26,040
Speaker 1: bunch of years ago. Um, it was sent to me

1484
01:30:26,040 --> 01:30:28,479
Speaker 1: not too long ago. She said, Oh, I stopped going

1485
01:30:28,479 --> 01:30:30,880
Speaker 1: with you when you made it. I never knew that

1486
01:30:31,000 --> 01:30:34,320
Speaker 1: she realized that I had made it. She didn't. Uh.

1487
01:30:34,400 --> 01:30:37,760
Speaker 1: But Bonnie was a great asset. And first of all,

1488
01:30:38,439 --> 01:30:42,600
Speaker 1: I needed to marry a woman who wasn't depressed. Um.

1489
01:30:42,680 --> 01:30:47,240
Speaker 1: I remember one time taking a beautiful woman to see

1490
01:30:47,439 --> 01:30:50,240
Speaker 1: Eric Harman at the bottom Line, and this woman wanted

1491
01:30:50,280 --> 01:30:53,080
Speaker 1: to make it with Eric Harman, not me, and you know,

1492
01:30:53,200 --> 01:30:56,439
Speaker 1: and I I and but I needed I need somebody,

1493
01:30:56,439 --> 01:31:00,840
Speaker 1: you who who got the game but wasn't impressed, And

1494
01:31:00,880 --> 01:31:03,240
Speaker 1: that was Bonnie. And I could take Bonnie. She could

1495
01:31:03,280 --> 01:31:05,960
Speaker 1: work a room. The girls would always love her, would

1496
01:31:05,960 --> 01:31:09,080
Speaker 1: be Billie's band, and the wives and always liked her.

1497
01:31:09,320 --> 01:31:12,519
Speaker 1: She was bubbly, she was up, she was beautiful. And

1498
01:31:13,080 --> 01:31:16,919
Speaker 1: I remember when I went to William Morris and UH

1499
01:31:17,160 --> 01:31:19,120
Speaker 1: for the first meeting, and I'm sitting there with the

1500
01:31:19,240 --> 01:31:21,920
Speaker 1: chairman on the West Coast and he's sitting on her

1501
01:31:22,320 --> 01:31:24,400
Speaker 1: and he was sitting in the meeting and this guy's

1502
01:31:24,439 --> 01:31:27,360
Speaker 1: trying to get laid with my wife right there. But

1503
01:31:27,600 --> 01:31:30,479
Speaker 1: you know, but Bonnie was she was you know, she

1504
01:31:30,600 --> 01:31:32,960
Speaker 1: was just a great asset that way, and she understood

1505
01:31:33,000 --> 01:31:35,040
Speaker 1: the game. She still does now. She sits there and

1506
01:31:35,080 --> 01:31:37,799
Speaker 1: gives me her her opinions sometimes, you know, many times,

1507
01:31:38,280 --> 01:31:41,920
Speaker 1: you know, And so she's she it's almost like it's

1508
01:31:41,960 --> 01:31:45,080
Speaker 1: like I'm a board game to her. She just you know,

1509
01:31:45,479 --> 01:31:48,600
Speaker 1: comments and who she likes and who she doesn't and

1510
01:31:48,640 --> 01:31:52,360
Speaker 1: this is smart and whatever. But she's she's been uh,

1511
01:31:52,439 --> 01:31:55,439
Speaker 1: and I've only been lucky with Bonnie, you know. So

1512
01:31:55,600 --> 01:31:59,040
Speaker 1: it's been uh, it's it's been a great relationship when

1513
01:31:59,080 --> 01:32:01,760
Speaker 1: we've raised two beauty for children and my son who

1514
01:32:01,800 --> 01:32:06,800
Speaker 1: runs the company, and uh, my my my confidante and

1515
01:32:06,280 --> 01:32:09,800
Speaker 1: m and my daughter and and it's just it's just been, uh,

1516
01:32:09,960 --> 01:32:13,919
Speaker 1: I've been very blessed. And though I'm on the road, um,

1517
01:32:15,000 --> 01:32:18,280
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, I'm doing what I have to do.

1518
01:32:18,439 --> 01:32:21,920
Speaker 1: And but my base, my my home base has been

1519
01:32:21,960 --> 01:32:24,800
Speaker 1: a very stable factor of my life. How did you

1520
01:32:24,840 --> 01:32:28,960
Speaker 1: meet Bonnie? I met her promoting concerts at Suny New

1521
01:32:29,040 --> 01:32:32,280
Speaker 1: Pauls and we and we had a guy who was

1522
01:32:32,320 --> 01:32:35,280
Speaker 1: our box office. Our box office was you walk into

1523
01:32:35,320 --> 01:32:38,360
Speaker 1: the entrance of the of the main building and there

1524
01:32:38,439 --> 01:32:41,200
Speaker 1: was a booth and we were selling tickets for Poco's

1525
01:32:41,280 --> 01:32:46,519
Speaker 1: Apple Judy college and his girlfriend, Um was Bonnie's roommate.

1526
01:32:46,720 --> 01:32:48,719
Speaker 1: And one day we had a party after the Poco

1527
01:32:48,800 --> 01:32:52,120
Speaker 1: show and I saw her and I and I walked

1528
01:32:52,120 --> 01:32:54,760
Speaker 1: there with my buddy Corky, and it was like, oh, man,

1529
01:32:55,520 --> 01:32:57,800
Speaker 1: I you know. So we had a kind of a

1530
01:32:57,880 --> 01:33:01,400
Speaker 1: rocky courtship for a few years. But then um we

1531
01:33:01,439 --> 01:33:06,240
Speaker 1: got married in uh seventy nine, and you know, and

1532
01:33:06,320 --> 01:33:08,839
Speaker 1: I look back and I look back at the pictures

1533
01:33:08,880 --> 01:33:11,880
Speaker 1: of us, and I go, man, she what had a

1534
01:33:11,920 --> 01:33:15,160
Speaker 1: great choice I made? Was she hot? But she's still hot?

1535
01:33:15,200 --> 01:33:18,160
Speaker 1: But she was really hot. But anyway, that was important

1536
01:33:18,200 --> 01:33:21,360
Speaker 1: to me. She was intelligent, she was beautiful, and uh

1537
01:33:21,479 --> 01:33:24,920
Speaker 1: and and and she's a great mom. And that's really

1538
01:33:24,920 --> 01:33:27,479
Speaker 1: what she wanted to do. But when the first few

1539
01:33:27,560 --> 01:33:29,960
Speaker 1: years of our life, if she had a career, she

1540
01:33:29,960 --> 01:33:32,720
Speaker 1: would never have been with me. She you know, we

1541
01:33:32,720 --> 01:33:36,960
Speaker 1: would never have been together. Ifew we would have been apart. So, um,

1542
01:33:37,000 --> 01:33:39,479
Speaker 1: you know, there's good and bad sometimes when your wife

1543
01:33:39,479 --> 01:33:42,680
Speaker 1: works and doesn't work. But I kind of encouraged her

1544
01:33:42,720 --> 01:33:46,240
Speaker 1: to follow my path and she didn't, you know when

1545
01:33:46,360 --> 01:33:48,599
Speaker 1: so we had a lot of experience together. We we

1546
01:33:48,600 --> 01:33:50,280
Speaker 1: went to it, we went around the world. We went

1547
01:33:50,280 --> 01:33:54,000
Speaker 1: to Australia and Israel and Japan and took our son

1548
01:33:54,160 --> 01:33:56,640
Speaker 1: and you know, we we we did a lot of

1549
01:33:56,680 --> 01:33:59,240
Speaker 1: the road and eventually, I'll tell you one thing that

1550
01:33:59,320 --> 01:34:01,920
Speaker 1: was very funny. Bunny when she knew it wasn't for her.

1551
01:34:02,000 --> 01:34:04,400
Speaker 1: We were when I was representing the Beach Boys. I mean,

1552
01:34:04,439 --> 01:34:07,400
Speaker 1: we went to Buffalo, got there, checked into the hotel.

1553
01:34:07,880 --> 01:34:10,720
Speaker 1: Four hours later, do a day show, gone, Banny, come on,

1554
01:34:10,760 --> 01:34:13,040
Speaker 1: we're leaving that we have another show tonight in Toronto.

1555
01:34:13,400 --> 01:34:19,280
Speaker 1: She goes, this isn't for me, you know so, But

1556
01:34:19,280 --> 01:34:22,040
Speaker 1: but now she's, hey, that's very important. You have to

1557
01:34:22,080 --> 01:34:25,320
Speaker 1: have the uh, the right woman to handle the tembent

1558
01:34:25,720 --> 01:34:28,640
Speaker 1: and you gotta have a balance. I was always you know,

1559
01:34:28,760 --> 01:34:33,000
Speaker 1: sensitive to like I wasn't. I wasn't somebody. If I

1560
01:34:33,080 --> 01:34:36,200
Speaker 1: was a road manager, she could never have made the

1561
01:34:36,920 --> 01:34:42,400
Speaker 1: marriage work. But as a um, as an agent, I didn't.

1562
01:34:42,400 --> 01:34:44,559
Speaker 1: I didn't go on the road for three weeks. Maybe

1563
01:34:44,560 --> 01:34:46,400
Speaker 1: I went to Australia, I'd be gone for a week,

1564
01:34:46,439 --> 01:34:49,920
Speaker 1: but it didn't go. You know, um, you know that

1565
01:34:50,200 --> 01:34:52,800
Speaker 1: wasn't that and I didn't want that. I mean, there

1566
01:34:52,800 --> 01:34:55,559
Speaker 1: are a lot of people when they travel, they it's

1567
01:34:55,600 --> 01:34:58,400
Speaker 1: like there, it's the circus, it's goodbye to your family.

1568
01:34:58,720 --> 01:35:00,960
Speaker 1: I didn't really have that. I didn't. I didn't. I

1569
01:35:01,000 --> 01:35:03,880
Speaker 1: had that at times, but never goodbye to see it

1570
01:35:03,920 --> 01:35:06,160
Speaker 1: for two months. It wasn't like that. It wasn't what

1571
01:35:06,200 --> 01:35:15,320
Speaker 1: I wanted. You've been very successful. What have you done

1572
01:35:15,360 --> 01:35:20,720
Speaker 1: with all your money? Well, I I try to uh

1573
01:35:21,040 --> 01:35:24,240
Speaker 1: live comfortably, live live, you know, I try to. You know,

1574
01:35:24,280 --> 01:35:27,080
Speaker 1: I think the American dream would or whether America or

1575
01:35:27,080 --> 01:35:28,880
Speaker 1: the dream, is to be able to live off your

1576
01:35:28,920 --> 01:35:33,920
Speaker 1: money and you know, independent of making money. And I

1577
01:35:33,960 --> 01:35:38,680
Speaker 1: think I've accomplished that, and um so and uh, I

1578
01:35:38,840 --> 01:35:44,080
Speaker 1: just trying to really you know. Uh it's not like, um,

1579
01:35:44,120 --> 01:35:45,600
Speaker 1: I have so much money where I can buy a

1580
01:35:45,600 --> 01:35:51,160
Speaker 1: baseball team, which but um, you know, I I you know,

1581
01:35:51,280 --> 01:35:54,120
Speaker 1: it's uh most of my money. You know. It just

1582
01:35:54,160 --> 01:35:57,439
Speaker 1: helps me live my life, that's all. It's just me

1583
01:35:57,439 --> 01:35:59,040
Speaker 1: gives me a lot of freedom. I mean I make,

1584
01:35:59,120 --> 01:36:01,040
Speaker 1: you know, make good money now and I have a

1585
01:36:01,040 --> 01:36:07,599
Speaker 1: good lifestyle. But you know, uh nothing, just just preserving myself.

1586
01:36:07,680 --> 01:36:10,720
Speaker 1: We we we we've invested certain charities. I take care

1587
01:36:10,720 --> 01:36:14,720
Speaker 1: of certain people. I have a brother who's uh schizophrenics

1588
01:36:14,720 --> 01:36:19,599
Speaker 1: since um, you know, you know, you know that needs

1589
01:36:19,640 --> 01:36:23,240
Speaker 1: help and care. So a lot of my you know,

1590
01:36:23,280 --> 01:36:25,759
Speaker 1: some of my giving is taking care of my family

1591
01:36:25,840 --> 01:36:31,320
Speaker 1: and different different situations. And so okay, now you had

1592
01:36:31,320 --> 01:36:34,559
Speaker 1: a hard times at the beginning. There are people who

1593
01:36:34,720 --> 01:36:37,960
Speaker 1: are successful and it's all show. They don't count their pennies.

1594
01:36:38,400 --> 01:36:41,240
Speaker 1: On the other hand, there are people who never forget

1595
01:36:41,240 --> 01:36:43,320
Speaker 1: where they came from. Where are you at? Like if

1596
01:36:43,320 --> 01:36:46,640
Speaker 1: you say, okay, it's a gig, Yeah, I'm not flying commercial,

1597
01:36:46,720 --> 01:36:50,520
Speaker 1: let's higher a plane. Where are you on that continuum?

1598
01:36:50,520 --> 01:36:54,240
Speaker 1: As far as um, well, I would always choose to

1599
01:36:54,280 --> 01:36:57,400
Speaker 1: fly fly privately when I can, especially in COVID times.

1600
01:36:58,080 --> 01:37:03,360
Speaker 1: But um, you know, uh, you know it's um some

1601
01:37:03,439 --> 01:37:07,160
Speaker 1: of the things that I've obtained materially, I would never

1602
01:37:07,240 --> 01:37:11,519
Speaker 1: work for them. I would never, like, um, bust my

1603
01:37:11,600 --> 01:37:15,400
Speaker 1: ass to have a Bentley or if I if if

1604
01:37:15,400 --> 01:37:18,880
Speaker 1: it ended up happening by what I did, great, But

1605
01:37:19,040 --> 01:37:22,360
Speaker 1: it's not like I would work for a car or

1606
01:37:22,640 --> 01:37:25,960
Speaker 1: I never worked to make money and you know, like

1607
01:37:26,000 --> 01:37:28,200
Speaker 1: I'm going to try to be rich, I never thought

1608
01:37:28,240 --> 01:37:30,840
Speaker 1: of that. That was never my goal. My goal was

1609
01:37:31,000 --> 01:37:34,360
Speaker 1: this was Everything that happened to me was more of

1610
01:37:34,400 --> 01:37:38,320
Speaker 1: an outgrowth of me just doing my job well. And

1611
01:37:38,360 --> 01:37:42,639
Speaker 1: then I had to learn about money. But it wasn't

1612
01:37:42,920 --> 01:37:47,720
Speaker 1: um you know, I never was somebody who had, oh,

1613
01:37:47,840 --> 01:37:49,960
Speaker 1: this is my dream. My dream is to have this

1614
01:37:50,040 --> 01:37:52,800
Speaker 1: house or I own this place in Florida. And I

1615
01:37:52,880 --> 01:37:55,360
Speaker 1: never thought that way. It just it was just what

1616
01:37:55,479 --> 01:37:57,880
Speaker 1: came out of the success of doing my job well.

1617
01:37:58,520 --> 01:38:01,639
Speaker 1: It was never never thought about that. Let's assume you're

1618
01:38:01,680 --> 01:38:07,519
Speaker 1: on vacation. You on the phone, Yes, okay, I'm I'm

1619
01:38:07,360 --> 01:38:12,640
Speaker 1: I'm seven, I'm I'm neurotically on. This is the business

1620
01:38:12,640 --> 01:38:15,400
Speaker 1: that nobody needs you. I mean, it's a it's a

1621
01:38:15,479 --> 01:38:19,600
Speaker 1: luxury business. And if you're not available, you think I

1622
01:38:19,640 --> 01:38:21,960
Speaker 1: can sit there and get a phone call from a

1623
01:38:22,040 --> 01:38:26,680
Speaker 1: manager or um and and somebody, and and my responses,

1624
01:38:26,720 --> 01:38:31,480
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, I'm ondcation, you know. And And when I

1625
01:38:31,520 --> 01:38:34,880
Speaker 1: when I started, I swore that nobody would outwork me,

1626
01:38:35,640 --> 01:38:39,800
Speaker 1: not that I would never lose my job because of

1627
01:38:39,840 --> 01:38:43,760
Speaker 1: my effort. And that still maintains. And as long as

1628
01:38:43,800 --> 01:38:47,519
Speaker 1: I want this, which I still do. That's what it takes.

1629
01:38:48,160 --> 01:38:50,479
Speaker 1: This is what to me, this is what it takes

1630
01:38:50,520 --> 01:38:52,599
Speaker 1: to keep it together. I can get an email at

1631
01:38:52,600 --> 01:38:56,479
Speaker 1: ten thirty on a Saturday night with an author. You know,

1632
01:38:56,640 --> 01:39:00,360
Speaker 1: am I responding right away? No? But I'm all Emily,

1633
01:39:00,439 --> 01:39:03,679
Speaker 1: will you know, I'm I'm in the game, whatever it takes.

1634
01:39:03,720 --> 01:39:08,480
Speaker 1: That's you know. I I like my Sunday's. I love Christmas,

1635
01:39:08,880 --> 01:39:11,360
Speaker 1: I love you know, certain holidays where I don't think

1636
01:39:11,360 --> 01:39:14,799
Speaker 1: I'm gonna be bothered. But you know, there are sometimes

1637
01:39:14,840 --> 01:39:16,599
Speaker 1: there's more that goes on on a Sunday that goes

1638
01:39:16,640 --> 01:39:19,679
Speaker 1: on on a Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday. There are certain people

1639
01:39:19,760 --> 01:39:26,040
Speaker 1: that you did are communicating differently. So, um, it's it's

1640
01:39:26,040 --> 01:39:29,240
Speaker 1: a lifestyle. It's just it's all you know. And in

1641
01:39:29,320 --> 01:39:31,400
Speaker 1: certain ways, a lot of my life and my family

1642
01:39:31,439 --> 01:39:34,040
Speaker 1: life has always revolved around my business and where does

1643
01:39:34,120 --> 01:39:39,240
Speaker 1: dad have to go? Where's Billy working with Steph Leopard?

1644
01:39:39,760 --> 01:39:43,040
Speaker 1: The younger generation in the agency business and a lot

1645
01:39:43,040 --> 01:39:47,360
Speaker 1: of businesses can do everything via email. Older generation is

1646
01:39:47,400 --> 01:39:51,800
Speaker 1: all phone, Where are you in that game? I am

1647
01:39:51,880 --> 01:39:54,640
Speaker 1: Probably I do. I do phone, but I do a

1648
01:39:54,640 --> 01:39:57,040
Speaker 1: lot of emails. A matter of fact, my wife would

1649
01:39:57,320 --> 01:39:58,800
Speaker 1: would sit there with me and I can be on

1650
01:39:58,840 --> 01:40:00,439
Speaker 1: the beach, and she said, oh yeah, not getting that

1651
01:40:00,479 --> 01:40:03,679
Speaker 1: many calls. I've been off the email, you know, So yes,

1652
01:40:03,840 --> 01:40:06,160
Speaker 1: I'm emailing, as a matter of fact, what I do

1653
01:40:06,240 --> 01:40:10,519
Speaker 1: every night, and sometimes it's it's painful because I don't

1654
01:40:10,760 --> 01:40:13,120
Speaker 1: go through all my emails. During the day I'm doing

1655
01:40:13,479 --> 01:40:16,800
Speaker 1: I'm calling, I'm I got. At night, I sit there,

1656
01:40:16,840 --> 01:40:19,320
Speaker 1: I go through my emails and I make notes. I'm

1657
01:40:19,320 --> 01:40:21,800
Speaker 1: always making notes so I'm prepared for the next day.

1658
01:40:22,120 --> 01:40:24,840
Speaker 1: I have things to move along, different processes that I'm

1659
01:40:24,840 --> 01:40:28,400
Speaker 1: working on, so I'm always writing down lists of what

1660
01:40:28,520 --> 01:40:30,639
Speaker 1: I need to do the next day. But a lot

1661
01:40:30,680 --> 01:40:34,320
Speaker 1: of email. Email is taken over a lot um. I

1662
01:40:34,400 --> 01:40:36,479
Speaker 1: speak on the phone a bit, but not nearly as

1663
01:40:36,560 --> 01:40:38,920
Speaker 1: much it used to be, obviously a little phone, but

1664
01:40:39,040 --> 01:40:41,880
Speaker 1: I do a lot of emailing. Okay, we were sitting

1665
01:40:41,880 --> 01:40:45,080
Speaker 1: in the House of Blues at a Newgen concert like

1666
01:40:45,120 --> 01:40:47,920
Speaker 1: a decade ago, and you were telling me two things.

1667
01:40:48,200 --> 01:40:50,320
Speaker 1: You were telling me you're gonna sell your company again,

1668
01:40:51,040 --> 01:40:53,559
Speaker 1: and you were also telling me you were gonna do

1669
01:40:53,640 --> 01:40:58,680
Speaker 1: the monthly gig at Madison Square Garden with Billy. So

1670
01:40:59,680 --> 01:41:02,400
Speaker 1: that is your idea, tell me that whole story where

1671
01:41:02,400 --> 01:41:09,760
Speaker 1: it is today. Well, the Billy the Billy thing is uh. Well,

1672
01:41:09,760 --> 01:41:11,679
Speaker 1: but first of all, I did sell my company again

1673
01:41:11,800 --> 01:41:15,599
Speaker 1: to Ron, and uh so that that that did happen,

1674
01:41:16,080 --> 01:41:21,360
Speaker 1: and uh, you know, and I'm very I'm very proud

1675
01:41:21,360 --> 01:41:24,080
Speaker 1: of that. And and I've had a great relationship with

1676
01:41:24,160 --> 01:41:28,120
Speaker 1: Want through these years and and and the great How

1677
01:41:28,120 --> 01:41:30,559
Speaker 1: often do you have contact with Ron? Sometimes I can

1678
01:41:30,760 --> 01:41:34,280
Speaker 1: we we email, you know, Sometimes I can email Ron

1679
01:41:34,760 --> 01:41:38,519
Speaker 1: several times, uh, you know in a week. Sometimes we

1680
01:41:38,560 --> 01:41:40,800
Speaker 1: can go by, you know, not speak for a month.

1681
01:41:41,280 --> 01:41:44,720
Speaker 1: But the interesting thing is is and Ron is very

1682
01:41:44,760 --> 01:41:49,599
Speaker 1: good at letting his entrepreneurs be their entrepreneurs. So most

1683
01:41:49,640 --> 01:41:52,439
Speaker 1: people don't even know I have ownership. I am still

1684
01:41:52,479 --> 01:41:55,800
Speaker 1: perceived very much as an independent agent and an agency

1685
01:41:56,080 --> 01:42:01,160
Speaker 1: and uh Ron, and but and that and that's perfect.

1686
01:42:01,560 --> 01:42:05,160
Speaker 1: I mean if there's many times, like I say, and

1687
01:42:05,160 --> 01:42:09,080
Speaker 1: that's and that's why I don't function much differently than

1688
01:42:09,320 --> 01:42:12,080
Speaker 1: I did prior to my relationship with Ron. And for

1689
01:42:12,160 --> 01:42:14,720
Speaker 1: that fact, even one was with Bob Sullivan. Because I'm

1690
01:42:14,760 --> 01:42:17,240
Speaker 1: in the kind of business you can own my money,

1691
01:42:17,280 --> 01:42:19,840
Speaker 1: but you can't own me because I don't own me.

1692
01:42:20,000 --> 01:42:24,040
Speaker 1: I my artists owned me. I my artists run my life,

1693
01:42:24,520 --> 01:42:29,400
Speaker 1: not me, so you can there's only you know, I

1694
01:42:29,400 --> 01:42:32,360
Speaker 1: if and if I don't represent my artists, well I

1695
01:42:32,400 --> 01:42:35,280
Speaker 1: will lose them, so you need me to represents. You

1696
01:42:35,320 --> 01:42:38,800
Speaker 1: can't control me because they do. And that's so to me.

1697
01:42:38,960 --> 01:42:41,599
Speaker 1: I I always there's no such thing as owning me.

1698
01:42:42,040 --> 01:42:44,160
Speaker 1: You you can own my money, but you can't own

1699
01:42:44,200 --> 01:42:49,880
Speaker 1: me because, um, it doesn't exist. I'm you know, the

1700
01:42:50,000 --> 01:42:54,559
Speaker 1: artists are who supplies us with our income? Okay, the

1701
01:42:54,600 --> 01:43:02,400
Speaker 1: Billy story So um Billy play. Uh closed Shaye Stadium

1702
01:43:02,920 --> 01:43:07,960
Speaker 1: in two thousand and eight, which was, um, maybe the

1703
01:43:07,960 --> 01:43:10,840
Speaker 1: greatest gig of that I've ever been involved with in

1704
01:43:10,880 --> 01:43:13,840
Speaker 1: my life. I remember right after the gig, Body and

1705
01:43:13,880 --> 01:43:16,120
Speaker 1: I flew down to Anguila. It took us a week

1706
01:43:16,160 --> 01:43:18,320
Speaker 1: to come down. It was like it was just this

1707
01:43:18,479 --> 01:43:22,479
Speaker 1: electric hi. I mean, um, you know it was whether

1708
01:43:22,479 --> 01:43:25,479
Speaker 1: it was Steven Tyler and Don Henley and John Mayer

1709
01:43:25,760 --> 01:43:30,880
Speaker 1: and um, it was just a Roger Daltrey. It was

1710
01:43:30,920 --> 01:43:35,519
Speaker 1: just who's who. And the funny thing about that is

1711
01:43:35,600 --> 01:43:40,240
Speaker 1: the Mets had um come to us and we we

1712
01:43:40,280 --> 01:43:43,000
Speaker 1: we and they wanted us to play the year before

1713
01:43:43,479 --> 01:43:47,719
Speaker 1: at Shaye Stadium and um because they wanted McCartney to close.

1714
01:43:48,680 --> 01:43:51,519
Speaker 1: And I said, We're only playing Shafe Stadium if we close.

1715
01:43:52,840 --> 01:43:55,080
Speaker 1: So and and if you didn't get McCartney you got

1716
01:43:55,080 --> 01:43:59,559
Speaker 1: no butt and and about I don't know. Six months

1717
01:43:59,640 --> 01:44:05,000
Speaker 1: later they came back and said, you can close, and um,

1718
01:44:04,760 --> 01:44:10,280
Speaker 1: ironically McCartney did close because he came to say stadium

1719
01:44:10,520 --> 01:44:14,240
Speaker 1: and um, you know, ended the concert with Billy doing

1720
01:44:14,439 --> 01:44:16,599
Speaker 1: uh let it be And I saw her standing there

1721
01:44:17,160 --> 01:44:21,439
Speaker 1: and I remember, um. On on the way home, Dave Howard,

1722
01:44:21,720 --> 01:44:23,720
Speaker 1: who was the Met executive at the time when we

1723
01:44:23,760 --> 01:44:27,040
Speaker 1: made to deal with he is on the phone. Misses, hey, Dave,

1724
01:44:27,400 --> 01:44:29,599
Speaker 1: you got your cake and you ate it really close

1725
01:44:29,760 --> 01:44:33,120
Speaker 1: and you got McCartney. So but it was well, that

1726
01:44:33,200 --> 01:44:38,040
Speaker 1: whole the whole thing was just uh spectacular. So here's Billy,

1727
01:44:38,240 --> 01:44:41,799
Speaker 1: who's so iconic in New York. How do you follow

1728
01:44:42,000 --> 01:44:46,240
Speaker 1: up Shay Stadium? We played Yankee Stadium, the old Yankee Stadium.

1729
01:44:46,280 --> 01:44:49,679
Speaker 1: We had played the Giant Stadium, you know multiple times

1730
01:44:49,680 --> 01:44:54,679
Speaker 1: with Elton John What do you do? And and and

1731
01:44:54,680 --> 01:44:58,000
Speaker 1: and and uh So one night, Um, I was in

1732
01:44:58,040 --> 01:45:01,520
Speaker 1: Turks and Tikos with my Fami Emilee and with Ja Marciano,

1733
01:45:01,560 --> 01:45:03,920
Speaker 1: who at that time was president of the Garden and

1734
01:45:03,960 --> 01:45:07,000
Speaker 1: now obviously one's a g and and out of that

1735
01:45:07,120 --> 01:45:10,880
Speaker 1: dinner evolved the idea of doing a once a month

1736
01:45:10,920 --> 01:45:14,519
Speaker 1: in and it didn't happen for a couple of years later.

1737
01:45:14,680 --> 01:45:16,920
Speaker 1: Remember J and I we actually had a deal in place,

1738
01:45:17,600 --> 01:45:21,680
Speaker 1: and uh when we did it, um, you know, uh,

1739
01:45:21,800 --> 01:45:24,360
Speaker 1: and then the Garden and Jay was now no longer there,

1740
01:45:24,360 --> 01:45:27,320
Speaker 1: and the Garden came and they talked about making Billy

1741
01:45:27,320 --> 01:45:31,360
Speaker 1: a franchise, and the Knicks and the Ranges and and uh,

1742
01:45:31,400 --> 01:45:34,360
Speaker 1: you know, I believe we would sell out twelve the

1743
01:45:34,400 --> 01:45:37,759
Speaker 1: first year, which was in two thousand fourteen. That I believe,

1744
01:45:37,800 --> 01:45:40,200
Speaker 1: because in two thousand and six we had sold out

1745
01:45:40,240 --> 01:45:42,920
Speaker 1: twelve and I think the record at the time was

1746
01:45:43,600 --> 01:45:47,080
Speaker 1: the Dead had sold out like thirteen or Bruce or whatever.

1747
01:45:47,880 --> 01:45:50,880
Speaker 1: And so the idea once we went on that we

1748
01:45:50,880 --> 01:45:54,760
Speaker 1: would sell twenty four two years once a month, and

1749
01:45:54,800 --> 01:45:58,600
Speaker 1: we sell nineteen thousand, we sell the whole building. But

1750
01:45:58,720 --> 01:46:01,559
Speaker 1: the idea that we could possibly sell twenty four was

1751
01:46:01,640 --> 01:46:05,160
Speaker 1: just amazing to me. Well we did it. We saw

1752
01:46:05,240 --> 01:46:10,679
Speaker 1: that the twenty four and now we're up to seventy. Um,

1753
01:46:10,800 --> 01:46:14,360
Speaker 1: we're up to seventy three. We actually have six shows

1754
01:46:14,439 --> 01:46:17,720
Speaker 1: that have been rescheduled UM that we're supposed to take

1755
01:46:17,720 --> 01:46:20,920
Speaker 1: place since the virus, so we're really up to seventy nine.

1756
01:46:21,000 --> 01:46:25,280
Speaker 1: When we finished next April, we're starting this again. Billy

1757
01:46:25,400 --> 01:46:29,040
Speaker 1: returns to the Guarden November five, so we would have

1758
01:46:29,280 --> 01:46:32,000
Speaker 1: We have been at the Garden for seven years. I

1759
01:46:32,000 --> 01:46:34,719
Speaker 1: mean we've seen people go through college, We've seen people

1760
01:46:34,760 --> 01:46:38,439
Speaker 1: go from high school, they graduated, we've seen people have children.

1761
01:46:38,560 --> 01:46:40,400
Speaker 1: It's you know, we say, hey, you know, watch seven

1762
01:46:40,439 --> 01:46:45,439
Speaker 1: years go by, and we are now up to like

1763
01:46:45,520 --> 01:46:47,920
Speaker 1: I said, we finished the seventy nine, will he'll be

1764
01:46:48,000 --> 01:46:50,599
Speaker 1: up to his eight show is something like a hundred

1765
01:46:50,640 --> 01:46:53,000
Speaker 1: and thirty something lifetime, which I've been to every one

1766
01:46:53,040 --> 01:46:57,400
Speaker 1: of them, and it's it's it's it's a phenomena. And

1767
01:46:57,439 --> 01:47:00,960
Speaker 1: I and I remember Billy saying to me at one point,

1768
01:47:01,360 --> 01:47:05,240
Speaker 1: are you sure this is gonna work? And um, you

1769
01:47:05,240 --> 01:47:07,880
Speaker 1: know it did. But I tell you the truth, as

1770
01:47:07,920 --> 01:47:11,040
Speaker 1: as as proud as the sighted, and and and and

1771
01:47:11,240 --> 01:47:13,519
Speaker 1: first of all, it's so amazing to have an artist

1772
01:47:13,760 --> 01:47:15,960
Speaker 1: that you can represent. You can dream all you want,

1773
01:47:15,960 --> 01:47:18,160
Speaker 1: but I have somebody that can do it. I mean

1774
01:47:18,160 --> 01:47:20,439
Speaker 1: that he's capable of doing that, he can actually draw,

1775
01:47:20,680 --> 01:47:24,160
Speaker 1: that's you know, So the fact that Billy can do this,

1776
01:47:24,640 --> 01:47:27,280
Speaker 1: and and it's always been my philosophy. I always wanted

1777
01:47:27,280 --> 01:47:32,760
Speaker 1: to do rock God, rock God things, things that confirm

1778
01:47:33,080 --> 01:47:36,479
Speaker 1: who you are in the world. So if you if

1779
01:47:36,520 --> 01:47:43,000
Speaker 1: if if, if you are playing um uh stadiums or

1780
01:47:43,200 --> 01:47:47,360
Speaker 1: doing what you do with the Garden God, that's who

1781
01:47:47,400 --> 01:47:50,479
Speaker 1: you are. You know, that's you know. And that again

1782
01:47:50,920 --> 01:47:54,439
Speaker 1: and and that you can do this, uh these kind

1783
01:47:54,479 --> 01:47:59,240
Speaker 1: of events is very very rarefied air, and so I

1784
01:47:59,280 --> 01:48:02,719
Speaker 1: always looked to do that. I always look to prove

1785
01:48:03,479 --> 01:48:05,920
Speaker 1: who we are and who he is, to show who

1786
01:48:05,960 --> 01:48:09,280
Speaker 1: he is. And but one of the proudest things is

1787
01:48:09,400 --> 01:48:12,000
Speaker 1: that I am of him and his career. That he's

1788
01:48:12,000 --> 01:48:14,720
Speaker 1: a stadium act. I mean we weren't a stadium ac.

1789
01:48:15,000 --> 01:48:17,040
Speaker 1: I mean this guy could sell a stadium anywhere, and

1790
01:48:17,120 --> 01:48:20,200
Speaker 1: it's whether it's Kansas City or Buffalo or Green Bay,

1791
01:48:20,760 --> 01:48:23,920
Speaker 1: and that with no hit record, but it's it's all

1792
01:48:23,960 --> 01:48:27,719
Speaker 1: a testament to his body of work. But the idea

1793
01:48:28,160 --> 01:48:31,519
Speaker 1: that in the last eight years we went basically from

1794
01:48:31,560 --> 01:48:33,559
Speaker 1: an arena ract to clean me up to play every

1795
01:48:33,560 --> 01:48:37,439
Speaker 1: stadium anywhere is just that is what I am most

1796
01:48:37,439 --> 01:48:40,560
Speaker 1: proud of. That he can do that, and that becomes

1797
01:48:41,600 --> 01:48:46,679
Speaker 1: that that that existed out there and that that's where

1798
01:48:46,720 --> 01:48:48,880
Speaker 1: he went and when we were able to do that

1799
01:48:49,479 --> 01:48:53,640
Speaker 1: with nothing, with nothing more than his catalog is a

1800
01:48:53,720 --> 01:48:56,040
Speaker 1: great testament to him. And that's something I'm just so

1801
01:48:56,080 --> 01:49:00,160
Speaker 1: proud about. Is he still into it? Oh yeah, I

1802
01:49:00,160 --> 01:49:04,639
Speaker 1: mean you know he's um. You know, Billy doesn't get

1803
01:49:04,680 --> 01:49:07,400
Speaker 1: ever too high and too low. But yes, he's I

1804
01:49:07,400 --> 01:49:10,080
Speaker 1: think he's very proud of it. I mean his Rapino

1805
01:49:10,160 --> 01:49:14,000
Speaker 1: said in his interview, he is something with you. You

1806
01:49:14,000 --> 01:49:16,960
Speaker 1: you are what you can sell and what venues you

1807
01:49:17,000 --> 01:49:21,160
Speaker 1: can play. And and hey, I do certain things because

1808
01:49:21,160 --> 01:49:23,880
Speaker 1: others can't. I mean, you know, we played we we

1809
01:49:23,960 --> 01:49:26,679
Speaker 1: played in Kansas City, the first show at Coaufman Stadium

1810
01:49:26,680 --> 01:49:29,559
Speaker 1: with the Royals played baseball thirty eight years. I heard

1811
01:49:29,600 --> 01:49:32,400
Speaker 1: that I couldn't wait with a hook thirty eight years

1812
01:49:32,400 --> 01:49:34,800
Speaker 1: with the first show, and we blew it right out.

1813
01:49:34,880 --> 01:49:37,839
Speaker 1: So I like the way I like to do things,

1814
01:49:37,880 --> 01:49:41,040
Speaker 1: Like hey, when I hear buffalo and I hear nobody

1815
01:49:41,080 --> 01:49:43,560
Speaker 1: sells that buffalo over hey, we sold that buffalo on

1816
01:49:43,600 --> 01:49:46,800
Speaker 1: the onset. I mean I like to do things. We

1817
01:49:46,920 --> 01:49:50,080
Speaker 1: played Fenway Park seven years in a row, We played

1818
01:49:50,120 --> 01:49:52,720
Speaker 1: Wrigley Field five years in a row. He played Citizens

1819
01:49:52,720 --> 01:49:56,120
Speaker 1: Bank Bullpark six years in a row. Why because nobody

1820
01:49:56,200 --> 01:49:58,360
Speaker 1: else can do that you know you can go there once?

1821
01:49:58,360 --> 01:49:59,920
Speaker 1: Can you go there every year and sell it out?

1822
01:50:00,439 --> 01:50:02,280
Speaker 1: And we're not the grateful day? Well, well you know

1823
01:50:02,360 --> 01:50:05,360
Speaker 1: we're not fish. We don't have that. So that's an

1824
01:50:05,400 --> 01:50:11,320
Speaker 1: amazing testament to his work. And so I love doing

1825
01:50:11,400 --> 01:50:17,960
Speaker 1: things that most don't. They can't Okay, most acts coming

1826
01:50:17,960 --> 01:50:21,280
Speaker 1: through New York City, they played Medicine Square Garden for

1827
01:50:21,280 --> 01:50:24,320
Speaker 1: the status. They can't make any money. So I assume

1828
01:50:24,400 --> 01:50:26,600
Speaker 1: you have a special deal that this is lucrative for

1829
01:50:26,640 --> 01:50:29,680
Speaker 1: you and Billy, I would hope. So, I mean, you know,

1830
01:50:29,840 --> 01:50:33,240
Speaker 1: not the Okay, let's go back to history for a second.

1831
01:50:34,320 --> 01:50:38,759
Speaker 1: How did the Olton and Billy thing come together? And

1832
01:50:39,120 --> 01:50:41,800
Speaker 1: I know Abilly needed an operation? Why did it never

1833
01:50:41,880 --> 01:50:46,320
Speaker 1: happen again? Well, it came together. I'll tell you. I

1834
01:50:46,400 --> 01:50:49,760
Speaker 1: remember one night we were in Toronto and I'm saying, hey, Billy,

1835
01:50:49,840 --> 01:50:52,160
Speaker 1: let's do some stadiums, and well, you know when he

1836
01:50:52,280 --> 01:50:55,320
Speaker 1: was like, well, I don't really think I think we

1837
01:50:56,000 --> 01:50:57,640
Speaker 1: I don't think it's a bang for the buck for

1838
01:50:57,680 --> 01:51:00,160
Speaker 1: the fan. We've got to give him somebody else we

1839
01:51:00,240 --> 01:51:02,840
Speaker 1: should be we should put something together. So we're all

1840
01:51:02,920 --> 01:51:07,759
Speaker 1: sitting around and and we came up with Elton, and

1841
01:51:07,800 --> 01:51:11,080
Speaker 1: I said, okay, Um, well, hey Dennis, Well when went

1842
01:51:11,160 --> 01:51:14,679
Speaker 1: to Carey went to call Elton's people. So I call

1843
01:51:14,760 --> 01:51:17,120
Speaker 1: Howard Rose out of the blue, and this is exactly

1844
01:51:17,160 --> 01:51:20,439
Speaker 1: how the conversation went. I go, Howard, would you be

1845
01:51:20,560 --> 01:51:24,200
Speaker 1: interested in going out with us? And Howard goes there's

1846
01:51:24,200 --> 01:51:27,000
Speaker 1: a pause on the phone, and he goes, how many

1847
01:51:27,120 --> 01:51:31,000
Speaker 1: nights you think we could sell out Philadelphia? That's how

1848
01:51:32,560 --> 01:51:36,479
Speaker 1: and we sold out three And that's exactly how it

1849
01:51:36,680 --> 01:51:40,800
Speaker 1: how it it started, and um, and actually it was

1850
01:51:40,960 --> 01:51:44,240
Speaker 1: so unique in that uh. And I love Howard Rose,

1851
01:51:44,360 --> 01:51:46,800
Speaker 1: I mean I do, I I had. He was such

1852
01:51:46,800 --> 01:51:51,559
Speaker 1: a wonderful partner through the whole process and um, and

1853
01:51:51,680 --> 01:51:56,479
Speaker 1: he represented Elton with the passion that I represented Billy.

1854
01:51:57,120 --> 01:52:01,439
Speaker 1: And we were equal and there was never and he

1855
01:52:01,439 --> 01:52:04,120
Speaker 1: he never and we we were both and we had

1856
01:52:04,320 --> 01:52:07,960
Speaker 1: arguments and all kinds of stuff, but he was as

1857
01:52:08,200 --> 01:52:11,800
Speaker 1: genuine to Elton as I was to Billy, and we

1858
01:52:11,840 --> 01:52:14,760
Speaker 1: were kind of both in the same position. And it

1859
01:52:14,800 --> 01:52:19,280
Speaker 1: was it was just, uh, it was great. And we

1860
01:52:19,400 --> 01:52:22,759
Speaker 1: you know, we we played stadiums like the tour remember

1861
01:52:22,800 --> 01:52:27,280
Speaker 1: started a ninety fourd San Diego, um bill Silver Presents

1862
01:52:28,080 --> 01:52:31,599
Speaker 1: and uh, it was. It was just an amazing and

1863
01:52:31,680 --> 01:52:35,240
Speaker 1: today you couldn't. You couldn't put it together because they

1864
01:52:35,240 --> 01:52:37,920
Speaker 1: don't they don't need each other. Financially, you can't afford it.

1865
01:52:38,160 --> 01:52:41,040
Speaker 1: What can you do? You can double the prices, you

1866
01:52:41,080 --> 01:52:46,720
Speaker 1: can't get It's almost economically not possible unless worldwide. Who

1867
01:52:46,760 --> 01:52:52,240
Speaker 1: could sell more tickets? Elton or Billy worldwide? Am I

1868
01:52:52,280 --> 01:52:55,280
Speaker 1: announcing a reunion too? I mean I know no, no, no,

1869
01:52:55,280 --> 01:52:57,640
Speaker 1: no not. I'm just asking no when they when you

1870
01:52:57,680 --> 01:53:01,920
Speaker 1: put the tour together? Okay, I thought was Elton was

1871
01:53:01,960 --> 01:53:04,320
Speaker 1: a bigger act. We're not talking to forget the music,

1872
01:53:04,400 --> 01:53:07,639
Speaker 1: let's just stock selling tickets, okay. But now at this

1873
01:53:07,760 --> 01:53:12,760
Speaker 1: late day, it looks like Billy's the bigger act. You know, um,

1874
01:53:12,840 --> 01:53:16,280
Speaker 1: el you know one thing like like I always believe

1875
01:53:16,360 --> 01:53:19,000
Speaker 1: with Billy, you know, he was always an underdog. He

1876
01:53:19,080 --> 01:53:24,120
Speaker 1: never got the notoriety that Bruce, Michael Jackson, a lot

1877
01:53:24,160 --> 01:53:28,360
Speaker 1: of artists Elton, you know, you know, Billy was kind

1878
01:53:28,400 --> 01:53:32,920
Speaker 1: of we just he just won quietly. Up until the

1879
01:53:33,000 --> 01:53:36,559
Speaker 1: early nineties, he was the number one selling artist in

1880
01:53:36,560 --> 01:53:39,640
Speaker 1: in America behind the Beatles. And you know now he

1881
01:53:39,640 --> 01:53:43,360
Speaker 1: hasn't put out a record since ninety three. But um,

1882
01:53:43,720 --> 01:53:47,719
Speaker 1: but Elton, you know Elton, you know, I would say

1883
01:53:47,840 --> 01:53:51,680
Speaker 1: probably at that time worldwide. I mean we we got

1884
01:53:51,720 --> 01:53:54,759
Speaker 1: a lot of exchanges. There were different cities and different countries.

1885
01:53:55,240 --> 01:53:59,879
Speaker 1: I mean, m Elton. Elton played a lot more England,

1886
01:54:00,040 --> 01:54:03,040
Speaker 1: and you know, his touring was different. He'd played many

1887
01:54:03,080 --> 01:54:05,240
Speaker 1: different kind of venues. It wasn't like Elton was just

1888
01:54:05,479 --> 01:54:08,800
Speaker 1: touring stadiums throughout Europe and then we came along. He

1889
01:54:08,840 --> 01:54:12,160
Speaker 1: would play all kinds of different venues and and things

1890
01:54:12,200 --> 01:54:15,200
Speaker 1: that that you know, that that the Billy would do.

1891
01:54:15,720 --> 01:54:20,400
Speaker 1: So I think at the time it was, um, it

1892
01:54:20,560 --> 01:54:23,960
Speaker 1: worked for both of them. They both could it. Just

1893
01:54:24,240 --> 01:54:27,280
Speaker 1: it took them up a level. We kind of in

1894
01:54:27,320 --> 01:54:30,240
Speaker 1: the billy world. We did the arenas, we did the

1895
01:54:30,320 --> 01:54:35,400
Speaker 1: multiple arenas. We needed to go to another level. And um,

1896
01:54:35,400 --> 01:54:37,240
Speaker 1: it wasn't like we're gonna stary having a hit record.

1897
01:54:37,480 --> 01:54:40,360
Speaker 1: This was the next level. And um, hey listen, a

1898
01:54:40,360 --> 01:54:44,560
Speaker 1: lot of artists emulated that package. That was the home

1899
01:54:44,800 --> 01:54:49,240
Speaker 1: of the of two of the greats. And uh, you

1900
01:54:49,280 --> 01:54:53,000
Speaker 1: know you'll probably never see it again, at least, you know,

1901
01:54:53,080 --> 01:54:55,520
Speaker 1: you can never say never. I know Billy and Elton

1902
01:54:56,040 --> 01:54:59,560
Speaker 1: still close or still still communicate, to each other, but

1903
01:55:00,680 --> 01:55:06,400
Speaker 1: it's it's just um, you know, uh, you know they're

1904
01:55:06,440 --> 01:55:09,320
Speaker 1: they're they're both you know, it's just it both doing

1905
01:55:09,720 --> 01:55:13,560
Speaker 1: amazing at this time. I mean, Billy was Elton, now

1906
01:55:13,600 --> 01:55:17,560
Speaker 1: on his retirement tour, has done spectacular business and uh

1907
01:55:17,640 --> 01:55:23,360
Speaker 1: and Billy Hey quietly has done amazing. I mean, Billy

1908
01:55:23,520 --> 01:55:26,080
Speaker 1: is is this is what you aspire to be, is

1909
01:55:26,120 --> 01:55:31,440
Speaker 1: what Billy Joel is doing. Okay, two best shows you

1910
01:55:31,480 --> 01:55:35,920
Speaker 1: ever saw LED's Zeppe one at the film Worice when

1911
01:55:35,920 --> 01:55:38,240
Speaker 1: I was nineteen. I was sitting in the seventh row

1912
01:55:38,840 --> 01:55:41,360
Speaker 1: and they were headlining for the first time in America

1913
01:55:41,400 --> 01:55:45,200
Speaker 1: and they had to prove it. That is still a memory.

1914
01:55:45,240 --> 01:55:47,440
Speaker 1: I mean it was like the greatest four of musicians

1915
01:55:47,480 --> 01:55:51,040
Speaker 1: I've ever seen. Robert Plant was the ultimate frontman sexy.

1916
01:55:51,400 --> 01:55:53,000
Speaker 1: You know, he s took his jeans. I was a

1917
01:55:53,040 --> 01:55:56,440
Speaker 1: guy who just like this guy. I mean, you know,

1918
01:55:56,480 --> 01:55:59,440
Speaker 1: it's like it wasn't my thing, but you know every

1919
01:55:59,440 --> 01:56:02,360
Speaker 1: girl wanted fuck him and you know, uh and you

1920
01:56:02,400 --> 01:56:05,000
Speaker 1: know Page and Bonham and John's it was just bottom was.

1921
01:56:05,160 --> 01:56:11,480
Speaker 1: It was just incredible and you know, certainly I Billy

1922
01:56:11,520 --> 01:56:16,040
Speaker 1: at Say Stadium was uh, it was as as great

1923
01:56:16,080 --> 01:56:18,680
Speaker 1: as it can be. Bruce at the bottom Line. I

1924
01:56:18,720 --> 01:56:22,080
Speaker 1: saw Bruce's bottom line in seventy four and he he

1925
01:56:22,160 --> 01:56:25,600
Speaker 1: took im talk about the year before born to Run. Yeah,

1926
01:56:25,640 --> 01:56:29,400
Speaker 1: Bruce when it was an amazing moment that he was

1927
01:56:29,440 --> 01:56:34,360
Speaker 1: a guy playing this four hundred sea club and he

1928
01:56:35,040 --> 01:56:39,320
Speaker 1: was breaking around the world as a superstar, and it

1929
01:56:39,480 --> 01:56:42,920
Speaker 1: was like all coming from this little club. It was

1930
01:56:43,040 --> 01:56:47,160
Speaker 1: just you know, so that that was probably an amazing

1931
01:56:47,360 --> 01:56:51,680
Speaker 1: moment of watching an artist being celebrated in this bar

1932
01:56:51,800 --> 01:56:55,480
Speaker 1: that was now becoming a worldwide phenomena. But you know,

1933
01:56:55,600 --> 01:56:59,560
Speaker 1: Billy at Shay Stadium was h you know, like I

1934
01:56:59,640 --> 01:57:02,240
Speaker 1: say I said before, it took me a week to

1935
01:57:02,280 --> 01:57:06,600
Speaker 1: come down from that. But um, but Jeppelin at UH

1936
01:57:06,640 --> 01:57:08,520
Speaker 1: and I was a major Doors fan. I went to

1937
01:57:08,720 --> 01:57:14,120
Speaker 1: I saw the Doors um multiple times in my um

1938
01:57:14,160 --> 01:57:17,040
Speaker 1: in my life, and it was Jim Morrison was a

1939
01:57:17,160 --> 01:57:19,360
Speaker 1: very big influence. You know, it was actually one of

1940
01:57:19,400 --> 01:57:22,920
Speaker 1: the great influences of my life. Was Terry Knight really

1941
01:57:23,280 --> 01:57:28,560
Speaker 1: Terry Knight in the pack Crook? Well, I don't I

1942
01:57:28,600 --> 01:57:31,920
Speaker 1: can't speak for what he did internally, and I you know,

1943
01:57:32,280 --> 01:57:37,920
Speaker 1: but I but he took a band and those days,

1944
01:57:38,640 --> 01:57:40,280
Speaker 1: in those days, how do to you either be from

1945
01:57:40,280 --> 01:57:43,720
Speaker 1: England or San Francisco. You how you know it was

1946
01:57:44,240 --> 01:57:47,720
Speaker 1: it was um you know, you had to get radio play,

1947
01:57:47,840 --> 01:57:50,080
Speaker 1: you had to be hit. And he took three guys

1948
01:57:50,120 --> 01:57:53,240
Speaker 1: from Michigan who got no airplay, who look who were

1949
01:57:53,320 --> 01:57:58,400
Speaker 1: supposed to be uncool, and and they got and and

1950
01:57:58,480 --> 01:58:01,800
Speaker 1: he and they came the biggest band in the world.

1951
01:58:01,840 --> 01:58:05,840
Speaker 1: They sold out, Chase stayed even seventy two, fastened the Beatles,

1952
01:58:05,920 --> 01:58:09,920
Speaker 1: and his campaign, I mean I emulated and I still do.

1953
01:58:10,000 --> 01:58:12,800
Speaker 1: And I remember one time Chef Gordon and I when

1954
01:58:12,800 --> 01:58:15,160
Speaker 1: we when he was talking about the Alice Cooper campaign,

1955
01:58:15,200 --> 01:58:18,360
Speaker 1: we talked about Terry Knight. But I emulated what this

1956
01:58:18,440 --> 01:58:21,320
Speaker 1: guy does, what he did, and I still use some

1957
01:58:21,400 --> 01:58:24,560
Speaker 1: of the things that he did. He'd buy six pages

1958
01:58:24,600 --> 01:58:27,959
Speaker 1: in Billboard or cash box in those days with pictures

1959
01:58:27,960 --> 01:58:30,520
Speaker 1: of the guys, and I would go and I was,

1960
01:58:30,600 --> 01:58:32,760
Speaker 1: you know, and I was one of those at the time.

1961
01:58:33,240 --> 01:58:35,920
Speaker 1: I was a student learning, and I was like, they

1962
01:58:36,040 --> 01:58:39,120
Speaker 1: have to be big. Look at this, you know. I mean,

1963
01:58:39,320 --> 01:58:42,400
Speaker 1: he sold me on how big they were before they were.

1964
01:58:43,080 --> 01:58:47,480
Speaker 1: And I've used through the years some of his strategies

1965
01:58:47,680 --> 01:58:51,000
Speaker 1: in the marketing and the making of an artist. It

1966
01:58:51,080 --> 01:58:54,000
Speaker 1: was like, if you tell the industry, they will tell

1967
01:58:54,000 --> 01:58:57,920
Speaker 1: the public. That's your best shot. So but he did.

1968
01:58:58,000 --> 01:59:01,000
Speaker 1: I remember one time on the US to the Home album,

1969
01:59:01,200 --> 01:59:04,160
Speaker 1: he took his billboard out on Times Square. It was

1970
01:59:04,240 --> 01:59:07,080
Speaker 1: just huge, and there was a painter strike that their

1971
01:59:07,160 --> 01:59:11,480
Speaker 1: pictures were hanging on that billboard for months, and it

1972
01:59:11,520 --> 01:59:15,440
Speaker 1: was just it was like only people that were stars,

1973
01:59:15,800 --> 01:59:18,520
Speaker 1: big stars, would get this, and they weren't yet, but

1974
01:59:18,600 --> 01:59:21,640
Speaker 1: they had to be. So he sold me and I

1975
01:59:21,680 --> 01:59:25,120
Speaker 1: bought into it, and and years later I represented them

1976
01:59:25,120 --> 01:59:27,320
Speaker 1: for a while. I represented them to kind of when

1977
01:59:27,320 --> 01:59:29,200
Speaker 1: it was the end of the Grand Fund, when Mark,

1978
01:59:29,320 --> 01:59:33,000
Speaker 1: Donnie and Mel were still all together and David Fisher

1979
01:59:33,200 --> 01:59:35,640
Speaker 1: was managing them at the time, I had a chance

1980
01:59:36,000 --> 01:59:39,200
Speaker 1: of representing them for a while and it was so

1981
01:59:39,400 --> 01:59:40,760
Speaker 1: and I was a fan. It was one of the

1982
01:59:40,800 --> 01:59:42,640
Speaker 1: few times I was like, really, I'm such a fan,

1983
01:59:43,320 --> 01:59:45,720
Speaker 1: but I was a fan of the phenomenon. Okay, if

1984
01:59:45,760 --> 01:59:48,560
Speaker 1: you got the original members back together as their demand

1985
01:59:48,600 --> 01:59:55,560
Speaker 1: for that today, you mean for for Grand Fund right today?

1986
01:59:56,600 --> 02:00:02,600
Speaker 1: You know, Um, there's some demands. I mean, you know, uh,

1987
02:00:03,040 --> 02:00:05,560
Speaker 1: it's it's kind of been warded down over the years.

1988
02:00:05,640 --> 02:00:09,960
Speaker 1: I don't know, um, you know, I'm sure it certainly

1989
02:00:09,960 --> 02:00:11,960
Speaker 1: wouldn't be the demand that it was, and it's prime.

1990
02:00:12,800 --> 02:00:16,560
Speaker 1: You know, it's not like uh some other combinations would

1991
02:00:16,640 --> 02:00:19,760
Speaker 1: would that if if this member came back to the band,

1992
02:00:19,800 --> 02:00:24,280
Speaker 1: that would enhance them. Anybody you have who you don't represent,

1993
02:00:24,400 --> 02:00:28,680
Speaker 1: that you'd like to represent, we have a vision how

1994
02:00:28,720 --> 02:00:31,600
Speaker 1: to do it? Oh, I think that all the time.

1995
02:00:32,200 --> 02:00:35,920
Speaker 1: I'm I'm I'm a student. I think of things. I

1996
02:00:37,200 --> 02:00:40,320
Speaker 1: wouldn't say that because I'd like the artist to hear it,

1997
02:00:40,360 --> 02:00:42,960
Speaker 1: but I it wouldn't really be fair. But I think

1998
02:00:42,960 --> 02:00:45,480
Speaker 1: of certain artists that should be doing things that would

1999
02:00:45,600 --> 02:00:48,840
Speaker 1: enhance them if they're doing arenas, why they're how they

2000
02:00:48,840 --> 02:00:52,000
Speaker 1: can get the stadiums, what they're not doing. Oh, absolutely,

2001
02:00:52,440 --> 02:00:55,240
Speaker 1: I definitely see that. I mean, I definitely think I

2002
02:00:55,280 --> 02:00:59,840
Speaker 1: can help move some people's career to hey, Leopard and

2003
02:01:00,400 --> 02:01:03,960
Speaker 1: playing stadiums, def Leopards playing stadiums for the second tour

2004
02:01:04,000 --> 02:01:06,800
Speaker 1: in a row in America, I mean, you know, and

2005
02:01:06,920 --> 02:01:10,280
Speaker 1: making a huge money. I mean that wasn't happening. Now.

2006
02:01:10,320 --> 02:01:13,360
Speaker 1: There's a perception def Leopards a fucking a huge band

2007
02:01:13,880 --> 02:01:16,920
Speaker 1: and and and and crew. So you know, but there's

2008
02:01:16,960 --> 02:01:20,280
Speaker 1: definitely things that um, I would love to do if

2009
02:01:20,320 --> 02:01:23,920
Speaker 1: I had the opportunity to. You know, that's you know,

2010
02:01:24,040 --> 02:01:27,920
Speaker 1: make the help, enhance people to be bigger, make make

2011
02:01:28,000 --> 02:01:32,040
Speaker 1: moves dea Leopard lose, leaves, Q Prime goes to Howard Kaufman.

2012
02:01:32,320 --> 02:01:35,600
Speaker 1: How do you remain the agent? I used to go

2013
02:01:35,680 --> 02:01:37,840
Speaker 1: to l A when you when you said to me,

2014
02:01:38,200 --> 02:01:41,600
Speaker 1: um earlier you said, um, you know, to go on

2015
02:01:41,640 --> 02:01:45,600
Speaker 1: the street to go to clubs. I visited managers and

2016
02:01:45,760 --> 02:01:49,320
Speaker 1: I used to visit Howard and I didn't have any

2017
02:01:49,320 --> 02:01:53,680
Speaker 1: clients with him, but he would see me. And and

2018
02:01:53,720 --> 02:01:57,280
Speaker 1: then when you know, when Leopard left and went to Howard,

2019
02:01:57,640 --> 02:02:00,960
Speaker 1: Howard stayed with me. That's that, you know, just from

2020
02:02:00,960 --> 02:02:05,320
Speaker 1: those meetings, he stayed with me. And I became very

2021
02:02:05,320 --> 02:02:07,680
Speaker 1: close to Howard. And we'll be you know, as a

2022
02:02:07,680 --> 02:02:09,960
Speaker 1: matter of fact, to give me poison you really admired

2023
02:02:10,080 --> 02:02:15,360
Speaker 1: might work. We had a very good relationship and um,

2024
02:02:16,000 --> 02:02:20,080
Speaker 1: you know he uh, you know, I was fortunate. I

2025
02:02:20,080 --> 02:02:22,680
Speaker 1: I could have lost it at that moment, but um,

2026
02:02:22,840 --> 02:02:25,000
Speaker 1: he stayed with me. That's as simple as that. And

2027
02:02:25,040 --> 02:02:27,760
Speaker 1: then when he passed, Mike Kobe Ash has done a

2028
02:02:27,760 --> 02:02:33,720
Speaker 1: great job with the band. Uh you know everything's you know, Um, Mike,

2029
02:02:33,800 --> 02:02:36,400
Speaker 1: I have a great relationship and he's helped elevate I mean,

2030
02:02:36,440 --> 02:02:39,840
Speaker 1: Howard rest in peace. He'd be sitting here rooting Mike

2031
02:02:39,920 --> 02:02:42,040
Speaker 1: and me on, like you guys have done such a

2032
02:02:42,040 --> 02:02:45,120
Speaker 1: great job taking it, taken the mantle to the next step,

2033
02:02:45,160 --> 02:02:48,520
Speaker 1: and we're so proud of it. On that note, I

2034
02:02:48,520 --> 02:02:51,440
Speaker 1: think we're gonna end for today. This has been wonderful. Dennis.

2035
02:02:51,960 --> 02:02:54,120
Speaker 1: You know I want to do you because you're opening honest,

2036
02:02:54,160 --> 02:02:57,080
Speaker 1: You'll hold no punchers. Thanks so much for taking the time.

2037
02:02:57,880 --> 02:03:00,840
Speaker 1: Bob A lot of fun. It's nice listen to myself

2038
02:03:00,920 --> 02:03:03,440
Speaker 1: tell all these things because I never did, but it

2039
02:03:03,480 --> 02:03:06,280
Speaker 1: was it was cool. I like, like fun. Thank you, Bob.

2040
02:03:06,400 --> 02:03:08,880
Speaker 1: Until next time. This is Bob Love sex