1 00:00:01,639 --> 00:00:04,160 Speaker 1: Hey, it's Bill Courtney with an army of normal folks. Again, 2 00:00:05,040 --> 00:00:07,720 Speaker 1: let's continue with part two of our conversation with John 3 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:12,120 Speaker 1: Ponder right after these brief messages from our generous sponsors. 4 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:25,760 Speaker 1: How long of that six and a half years did 5 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:27,280 Speaker 1: you spend in that jail? 6 00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:30,040 Speaker 2: Oh, it was, it was I did the whole Uh 7 00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:33,640 Speaker 2: you know, well you got to get eighty five percent 8 00:00:33,680 --> 00:00:36,839 Speaker 2: of your time, but whatever, whatever, that worked. 9 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:41,360 Speaker 1: Five six years. Well yeah, and so that's that's hard time. Oh, 10 00:00:41,400 --> 00:00:51,760 Speaker 1: it's federal time. Oh yeah, and so John, I love man. 11 00:00:52,200 --> 00:00:58,320 Speaker 1: I'm a I like to understand people. It's it's I 12 00:00:58,360 --> 00:01:02,720 Speaker 1: find it fascinating. I find people fascinating. If I've owned children, fascinating. 13 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:04,920 Speaker 1: Actually I have to find my own children and pain 14 00:01:04,959 --> 00:01:09,200 Speaker 1: of the put most time, but also fascinating. John, you 15 00:01:09,280 --> 00:01:13,520 Speaker 1: have a whole life of crime. You have a whole 16 00:01:13,560 --> 00:01:17,080 Speaker 1: life of game banging. You've told me that you were 17 00:01:17,560 --> 00:01:24,920 Speaker 1: an addict, which makes you, frankly a normal person. And 18 00:01:25,080 --> 00:01:30,440 Speaker 1: it is an amazing story about how you found your 19 00:01:30,520 --> 00:01:33,440 Speaker 1: faith and God founds you and your found your father. 20 00:01:35,560 --> 00:01:41,080 Speaker 1: But you know, almost everybody on their deathbed finds religion. 21 00:01:43,120 --> 00:01:46,399 Speaker 1: And then when you don't die, the religion tends to 22 00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:50,080 Speaker 1: wane in these people. And so I'm hearing your story, 23 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:54,520 Speaker 1: and my question is, you did six years in the 24 00:01:54,520 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 1: federal penitentiary. And in the federal penitentiary, if any of 25 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:00,800 Speaker 1: the stories I've been told by be who've done time 26 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:05,600 Speaker 1: are true, the gangs is rampant inside the jails there out, 27 00:02:05,880 --> 00:02:08,880 Speaker 1: the drugs are is rampant inside the jails out. The 28 00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:16,400 Speaker 1: crime is his rampant inside the jails out. The abuse 29 00:02:17,000 --> 00:02:20,320 Speaker 1: is his rampant inside the jails out. And yeah, you've 30 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:23,119 Speaker 1: made the deal, but you're still the guy that spent 31 00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:28,560 Speaker 1: his whole life in this world? How how did you 32 00:02:29,400 --> 00:02:34,960 Speaker 1: get God led you there? But the real human of 33 00:02:35,000 --> 00:02:38,760 Speaker 1: this you had to have had the grip. Hadn't turned 34 00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:42,200 Speaker 1: a loose yet, There's no way. It's just completely You 35 00:02:42,360 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 1: had to have felt pulled at times. 36 00:02:46,320 --> 00:02:50,480 Speaker 2: Right, you know, I think that just like anything in life, 37 00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:55,880 Speaker 2: when people are looking to change, right, the biggest battle 38 00:02:55,960 --> 00:03:00,960 Speaker 2: that we have is fighting the gravitational pull back into 39 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:02,240 Speaker 2: that life that you're trying to get. 40 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:04,240 Speaker 1: What I'm asking you had six years in the. 41 00:03:04,200 --> 00:03:06,800 Speaker 3: Pen, absolutely, and listen for me. 42 00:03:07,520 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 2: When I went to the pen in my mind and 43 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:14,440 Speaker 2: I remember even the day that I was pulling up 44 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 2: into USB Allenwood in Pennsylvania. Right, the big doors opened 45 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:21,120 Speaker 2: up and it was a bust. They had dogs undereath 46 00:03:21,120 --> 00:03:23,120 Speaker 2: the bus scared when that oh my gosh, I was 47 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:25,600 Speaker 2: scared to death. I was one hund percent scared to death. 48 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:30,280 Speaker 1: It's you know, tough street kid, right, and everybody's got 49 00:03:30,320 --> 00:03:30,840 Speaker 1: this hard. 50 00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:35,160 Speaker 3: But I was scared to death. 51 00:03:35,560 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 2: And when that second door opened up and I looked 52 00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:41,240 Speaker 2: and I saw that big, gigantic seal that said, uh, 53 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:46,360 Speaker 2: you know, maximum Security, United States Federal Penitentiary, Allenwood. That's 54 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 2: when the fear really kicked in. But I sat on 55 00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:53,600 Speaker 2: that bus and I looked up at that sign, and 56 00:03:53,640 --> 00:03:56,880 Speaker 2: I remember the commitment I made to God, and in 57 00:03:56,960 --> 00:04:01,600 Speaker 2: my mind, I changed the words on that sign and 58 00:04:01,640 --> 00:04:06,920 Speaker 2: it said Allenwood, United States Federal Learning Institution. 59 00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:09,520 Speaker 1: That's awesome. 60 00:04:09,560 --> 00:04:13,520 Speaker 2: It was the Bible College for me. Right in my mind, 61 00:04:13,760 --> 00:04:14,920 Speaker 2: that bust, you chuck. 62 00:04:16,600 --> 00:04:17,440 Speaker 1: Bible College. 63 00:04:17,480 --> 00:04:21,039 Speaker 2: And that bus chugged forward and listen, I went in 64 00:04:21,080 --> 00:04:24,400 Speaker 2: there and in here and in here, I went to school. 65 00:04:25,080 --> 00:04:26,479 Speaker 2: In your head, in your heart, in my head, in 66 00:04:26,480 --> 00:04:29,080 Speaker 2: my heart was all the other stupid stuff happened, and 67 00:04:29,120 --> 00:04:31,240 Speaker 2: stuff I was involved. With before was it happening all 68 00:04:31,279 --> 00:04:33,800 Speaker 2: around me all day long? But I know I had 69 00:04:33,839 --> 00:04:37,760 Speaker 2: to stay MANIACI focused on number one, getting to know 70 00:04:37,920 --> 00:04:40,320 Speaker 2: better this God that I just surrendered my life to. 71 00:04:42,120 --> 00:04:45,280 Speaker 2: And I'll tell you is this Passes description. I'm in 72 00:04:45,360 --> 00:04:49,640 Speaker 2: the paraphrase when Paul and Silas in the Book of Acts, 73 00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:52,719 Speaker 2: they were arrested and they were put in prison, right, 74 00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:55,479 Speaker 2: and the Philippi and jailer had them housed. They were 75 00:04:55,520 --> 00:04:58,520 Speaker 2: down in the basement and they were chained, and they 76 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:01,640 Speaker 2: said that pauland Silas was was singing and worshiping. And 77 00:05:02,360 --> 00:05:04,120 Speaker 2: they said they were singing in worshiping in the middle 78 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:06,080 Speaker 2: of night. The walls came down. 79 00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:08,440 Speaker 3: The chains fell off of them, right, but they kept 80 00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:09,600 Speaker 3: singing and worshiping. 81 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:09,880 Speaker 1: Right. 82 00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 2: So the question is is that they were in prison 83 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:16,360 Speaker 2: and that chained and bound in the dungeon of this prison, 84 00:05:16,920 --> 00:05:19,839 Speaker 2: and the walls fell down, the chains came off, and 85 00:05:19,880 --> 00:05:22,080 Speaker 2: the Philippi and jailer was about to kill himself and 86 00:05:22,120 --> 00:05:24,160 Speaker 2: they were like, no, wait, don't do that, We're right here, 87 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:26,279 Speaker 2: because he thought they escaped on his watch. 88 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:26,720 Speaker 1: Right. 89 00:05:27,200 --> 00:05:30,440 Speaker 3: So the reason why Paul and Silas, that's the question, 90 00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:32,480 Speaker 3: why didn't they get up and leave. Why didn't get 91 00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:35,440 Speaker 3: him and run? And they answer lies in the reason 92 00:05:35,440 --> 00:05:38,960 Speaker 3: why they did not get up and run because Paul 93 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:42,880 Speaker 3: and Silas and here was already set. 94 00:05:42,680 --> 00:05:47,000 Speaker 1: Free in their heart and their soul. So they had 95 00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:48,360 Speaker 1: their own liberty inside them. 96 00:05:48,880 --> 00:05:51,760 Speaker 3: Right, So many years ago, while I was in prison, 97 00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:53,200 Speaker 3: you had liberty. 98 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:57,480 Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, I was already set free behind fifty 99 00:05:57,480 --> 00:05:58,560 Speaker 2: foot walls. 100 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:01,480 Speaker 1: So you had you had that liberty, You had your head. 101 00:06:01,520 --> 00:06:04,039 Speaker 3: Absolutely, it didn't matter. 102 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:07,080 Speaker 2: My hope didn't come the day did I walked out 103 00:06:07,120 --> 00:06:10,520 Speaker 2: that back door. That liberty came for me the dyd 104 00:06:10,560 --> 00:06:12,240 Speaker 2: I surrendered my life to Jesus. 105 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 1: Do you know there's another thing that just popped in 106 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:19,680 Speaker 1: my head hearing you, is that Nelson Mandela, when spending 107 00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:24,160 Speaker 1: twenty seven years in jail in South Africa and never 108 00:06:24,200 --> 00:06:26,520 Speaker 1: giving up and then becoming president of the country. 109 00:06:26,480 --> 00:06:27,560 Speaker 3: Ye, phenomenal. 110 00:06:27,839 --> 00:06:30,760 Speaker 1: And what was most phenomenal when he came out is 111 00:06:30,839 --> 00:06:34,840 Speaker 1: he said, we are not going to punish or penalize 112 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:39,039 Speaker 1: those who punished and penalized me. And when asked why 113 00:06:39,080 --> 00:06:41,479 Speaker 1: he could do that, he said it was because he 114 00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:44,840 Speaker 1: made his body had always been locked up, but. 115 00:06:44,920 --> 00:06:47,720 Speaker 3: He was always free. Yes, yes, he was. 116 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:49,800 Speaker 1: Free in his heart mind right, And I hear you 117 00:06:49,839 --> 00:06:56,120 Speaker 1: say that that Nelson Mandela story. So you're free and 118 00:06:56,560 --> 00:06:59,880 Speaker 1: but you but let's be honest. You figured that out. 119 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:03,760 Speaker 1: The vast majority of the two million people incarcerated entry, right, 120 00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:07,160 Speaker 1: don't feel that freedom, right right? So how do you start? 121 00:07:07,360 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 1: Hope for president starts come from right right? 122 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:14,760 Speaker 2: Well, you know, I tell people that hope for prisoners 123 00:07:15,080 --> 00:07:19,040 Speaker 2: was a vision that God impregnated me with when I 124 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:21,800 Speaker 2: was in prison, and I came home to give birth 125 00:07:21,840 --> 00:07:24,480 Speaker 2: to it. Right, invests in every week and moment of 126 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:27,360 Speaker 2: my time while I'm in prison or learning all those 127 00:07:27,400 --> 00:07:28,480 Speaker 2: things that so you're. 128 00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:31,520 Speaker 1: Setting up the infrastructure of it in your mind in prison, 129 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:35,320 Speaker 1: you're fundamentally getting the nuts of bolts. 130 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:40,000 Speaker 2: Absolutely, I got zero money. I don't know what I'm doing. 131 00:07:40,080 --> 00:07:42,840 Speaker 2: I didn't have the background experience and so forth and 132 00:07:42,880 --> 00:07:43,160 Speaker 2: so on. 133 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:45,480 Speaker 1: All I know that that did you think about robbing 134 00:07:45,520 --> 00:07:50,680 Speaker 1: a bank? Just started? I'm just kidding, I guess. 135 00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:54,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, no, I just had to wanted to depend 136 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:57,520 Speaker 2: on I know that if God gave me this vision, 137 00:07:57,560 --> 00:07:59,600 Speaker 2: He's going to give me the provoke, the provision. 138 00:08:00,200 --> 00:08:04,440 Speaker 1: So yeah, again obvious, So you're here, you got you. 139 00:08:04,440 --> 00:08:06,760 Speaker 1: You spent six years building it, right, you got your 140 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:09,560 Speaker 1: own freedom, you got your own hope, I get all that, 141 00:08:10,080 --> 00:08:12,440 Speaker 1: but you get to Vegas and you got this great idea, 142 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 1: but you're not funded. And frankly, if I'm somebody that 143 00:08:19,480 --> 00:08:24,880 Speaker 1: that has the authority and or the funds to help you, 144 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:26,520 Speaker 1: you know, there's a lot of people that come out 145 00:08:26,560 --> 00:08:29,400 Speaker 1: of prison that say they're going to do absolutely and 146 00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:31,560 Speaker 1: so how in the world am I gonna Why am 147 00:08:31,600 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 1: I going to choose to back you versus a thousand 148 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 1: other people that have dreamed up ways to live now 149 00:08:38,120 --> 00:08:43,320 Speaker 1: that the recit division rate says are very unlikely to 150 00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 1: follow through. How did you get it done? Joe? 151 00:08:46,040 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 3: You know, I think that I did it. 152 00:08:47,400 --> 00:08:50,360 Speaker 2: It got done with a lot of prayer, right, and 153 00:08:50,600 --> 00:08:52,800 Speaker 2: it was this And this is a saying that I 154 00:08:52,880 --> 00:08:53,800 Speaker 2: live by in my life. 155 00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:56,120 Speaker 3: Right, I'm not going to sit there and. 156 00:08:56,040 --> 00:08:59,040 Speaker 2: Tell you what I'm gonna do, because people, I'm gonna, 157 00:08:59,040 --> 00:09:02,040 Speaker 2: I'm gonna go, I'm gonna I'm gonna let my actions 158 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:05,200 Speaker 2: speak so loudly that you can barely hear what I'm saying. 159 00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:08,160 Speaker 2: And even when I was moving forward in the world 160 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:11,440 Speaker 2: around me, was slamming doors in my face. I couldn't 161 00:09:11,440 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 2: get in the batter Department of Corrections roll and Probation fund. 162 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:16,880 Speaker 1: Is that is what I'm saying. I can't imagine anybody 163 00:09:16,880 --> 00:09:18,640 Speaker 1: would even listen exactly. 164 00:09:18,720 --> 00:09:21,280 Speaker 2: But what I had to always do when the world 165 00:09:21,320 --> 00:09:24,439 Speaker 2: around me was telling me no, I had to hold 166 00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:26,920 Speaker 2: on to that, Yes, God gave me behind fifty foot 167 00:09:26,960 --> 00:09:29,880 Speaker 2: walls that this is going to happen. You keep digging 168 00:09:29,920 --> 00:09:32,520 Speaker 2: the trenches and you know, I'll be the provider, and 169 00:09:32,559 --> 00:09:36,679 Speaker 2: it just you know, two thousand, two thousand into twenty ten, 170 00:09:36,720 --> 00:09:41,319 Speaker 2: twenty eleven, we hit the ground and never look back. 171 00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:56,000 Speaker 1: We'll be right back. Hope for Prisoners has helped nearly 172 00:09:56,200 --> 00:10:01,840 Speaker 1: thirty five hundred returning citizens reintegrate back into society, and 173 00:10:01,880 --> 00:10:06,240 Speaker 1: they've done it successfully. As we mentioned earlier, they only 174 00:10:06,280 --> 00:10:10,760 Speaker 1: have an eight percent recidivism rate. They're rich programming and 175 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:15,439 Speaker 1: rich love inspires real hope for folks who really haven't 176 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:18,240 Speaker 1: had a lot of hope in their life. The participants 177 00:10:18,240 --> 00:10:22,280 Speaker 1: first enter what they call a prevocational training program, which 178 00:10:22,280 --> 00:10:25,880 Speaker 1: includes courses on soft and hard skills for employment readiness 179 00:10:26,000 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 1: and success in life, like public speaking, leadership, emotional intelligence, 180 00:10:31,080 --> 00:10:34,080 Speaker 1: and things as simple as just how to operate email. 181 00:10:34,920 --> 00:10:37,440 Speaker 1: They're also matched up with a group of mentors for 182 00:10:37,480 --> 00:10:41,560 Speaker 1: the long term who walk alongside them throughout life and 183 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:44,800 Speaker 1: continually provide reference points for what a healthy and productive 184 00:10:44,840 --> 00:10:47,800 Speaker 1: life looks like, something that a lot of these folks 185 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:51,080 Speaker 1: have never had before. And then there's a third element, 186 00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:53,160 Speaker 1: the element that I think is the magic to the 187 00:10:53,200 --> 00:10:55,559 Speaker 1: whole program. And I couldn't really wait to talk to 188 00:10:55,640 --> 00:11:02,120 Speaker 1: John about it. Law enforcement officers tours, the very people 189 00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:06,320 Speaker 1: who once locked them up are now leading their training 190 00:11:06,400 --> 00:11:10,280 Speaker 1: and their mentoring. And get this, the law enforcement officers, 191 00:11:10,320 --> 00:11:13,240 Speaker 1: the police, the FBI, the people involved in the program 192 00:11:13,280 --> 00:11:15,360 Speaker 1: are not being ordered to do it. They're not on 193 00:11:15,440 --> 00:11:18,080 Speaker 1: the clock, they're not getting paid to do it. They 194 00:11:18,240 --> 00:11:25,320 Speaker 1: actually are volunteering to mentor these folks because they simply care. 195 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:31,920 Speaker 3: Again, everything is birth in prayer. 196 00:11:32,400 --> 00:11:32,600 Speaker 1: You know. 197 00:11:32,640 --> 00:11:34,240 Speaker 2: I had the vision to be able to do that 198 00:11:34,320 --> 00:11:36,439 Speaker 2: because the FBI agent that was on my case he 199 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:39,280 Speaker 2: is my dear friend to this day, which is insane. Yeah, 200 00:11:39,320 --> 00:11:42,079 Speaker 2: and he came alongside me when I first came home 201 00:11:42,080 --> 00:11:44,200 Speaker 2: from prison and we developed this friendship. 202 00:11:44,360 --> 00:11:47,200 Speaker 4: Did you call him? I think he reached out to me. 203 00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:51,800 Speaker 4: The man that arrested you FBI to you. He came 204 00:11:51,840 --> 00:11:54,400 Speaker 4: back yep, yepol And listen. 205 00:11:54,520 --> 00:11:57,600 Speaker 2: When I was at the Federal half as in Vegas, 206 00:11:57,840 --> 00:11:59,679 Speaker 2: I'm here for like two days and all of a sudden, 207 00:11:59,679 --> 00:12:02,800 Speaker 2: I get hauled up front and then the FBI agent. 208 00:12:02,880 --> 00:12:05,120 Speaker 2: I come up front the FBI agents there, and he 209 00:12:05,240 --> 00:12:06,520 Speaker 2: was like, Hey, John, how you doing. 210 00:12:06,559 --> 00:12:07,160 Speaker 3: Welcome home? 211 00:12:07,640 --> 00:12:09,960 Speaker 2: And then he leaned into me and he said to me, Hey, 212 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:11,480 Speaker 2: I just want to let you know my wife and 213 00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:14,400 Speaker 2: I have been praying for you since you and right 214 00:12:14,440 --> 00:12:15,559 Speaker 2: there in that moment. 215 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:16,240 Speaker 1: John, are you kidding? 216 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:17,439 Speaker 3: I can't make this up. 217 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:21,400 Speaker 1: The man that arrested you absolutely and your buddies. 218 00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:22,600 Speaker 3: Now and he's my buddy. 219 00:12:22,720 --> 00:12:23,839 Speaker 1: Why did he do that? John? 220 00:12:24,120 --> 00:12:27,000 Speaker 2: You know? I I because I think that And I 221 00:12:27,120 --> 00:12:30,200 Speaker 2: had no idea at the time when he took me 222 00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:32,400 Speaker 2: into customy custody there he was a Christian. 223 00:12:32,760 --> 00:12:36,240 Speaker 1: I had no idea or you wouldn't have cared. Absolutely. 224 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:38,800 Speaker 2: But you know there's another paths of the scripture that 225 00:12:38,960 --> 00:12:42,160 Speaker 2: in classes one thirteen it says that he plucks you 226 00:12:42,240 --> 00:12:45,160 Speaker 2: out of the kingdom of darkness and conveys you into 227 00:12:45,200 --> 00:12:47,400 Speaker 2: the kingdom of the Son of His Love. I believe 228 00:12:47,480 --> 00:12:51,600 Speaker 2: God used FBI agent Richie Beasley to pluck me out 229 00:12:51,600 --> 00:12:52,840 Speaker 2: of the kingdom of darkness. 230 00:12:52,880 --> 00:12:54,760 Speaker 3: He saved my life. 231 00:12:56,040 --> 00:12:58,439 Speaker 2: And put me on this trajectory to who I am today. 232 00:12:58,520 --> 00:13:01,360 Speaker 2: So again him being a long horseman officer and me 233 00:13:01,480 --> 00:13:04,760 Speaker 2: but appreciating those friendships. I just was saying, man, how 234 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:07,840 Speaker 2: could we do this same thing with other law enforcement? 235 00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:12,440 Speaker 1: In other words, the impact he had on your life. Yes, yes, 236 00:13:12,920 --> 00:13:15,160 Speaker 1: I know what that meant to me as a felon. 237 00:13:15,679 --> 00:13:19,600 Speaker 1: I need other felons to see that law enforcement is 238 00:13:19,679 --> 00:13:23,520 Speaker 1: really not bad. Absolutely, and so he helped you with that. 239 00:13:24,280 --> 00:13:27,040 Speaker 2: He started some of it, and then we started, you know, 240 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:30,240 Speaker 2: getting connected with other law enforcement agents. There was a 241 00:13:30,280 --> 00:13:32,600 Speaker 2: you know with the Las Vegas metroupon the police department 242 00:13:32,720 --> 00:13:35,880 Speaker 2: was then a captain named Kevin mcmahill, who's now our 243 00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:39,960 Speaker 2: income and sheriff. He and I was talking, and this 244 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:43,199 Speaker 2: thing has just grown into I mean, we started out 245 00:13:43,240 --> 00:13:46,000 Speaker 2: with just six police officers. Now we have one hundred 246 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:47,680 Speaker 2: and thirty five police officers. 247 00:13:47,840 --> 00:13:51,560 Speaker 1: Don't just stop one hundred and thirty five police officers 248 00:13:51,559 --> 00:13:53,199 Speaker 1: in the Las Vegas metro area. 249 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:58,400 Speaker 2: Yes, never before in the history of reentry nowhere on 250 00:13:58,440 --> 00:14:02,800 Speaker 2: this planet, to this magnitude has law enforcement gotteness engaged 251 00:14:02,840 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 2: in mentoring and training people coming on from the prison system. 252 00:14:06,200 --> 00:14:10,240 Speaker 2: So when you have conversations with them, and it's very methodical, right, 253 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:13,520 Speaker 2: you just got to get people to change their way 254 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:16,320 Speaker 2: of thinking. And if you look across this country, right, 255 00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:20,560 Speaker 2: especially what happened is summer twenty twenty, you know, disrupts 256 00:14:20,560 --> 00:14:21,520 Speaker 2: in the community. 257 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:24,640 Speaker 3: People don't trust police. They just don't trust them. 258 00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:28,240 Speaker 2: But the reason why they don't trust police is because 259 00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:33,760 Speaker 2: they're not in a relationship with the police. And what 260 00:14:33,920 --> 00:14:40,160 Speaker 2: relationship could you ever establish trust unless there's life rubbing 261 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:43,920 Speaker 2: up against life and the spirit of complete transparency that 262 00:14:44,000 --> 00:14:46,680 Speaker 2: we have more in common than we have difference. So 263 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:50,080 Speaker 2: big I no, big, I'll use and out of that 264 00:14:50,120 --> 00:14:56,080 Speaker 2: transparency that comes the relationship. And once that relationship is established, 265 00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:57,680 Speaker 2: we can start working on trust. 266 00:14:59,520 --> 00:15:02,960 Speaker 1: Do you think think there's this is my own and 267 00:15:04,360 --> 00:15:09,280 Speaker 1: it's just my own feeling. Do you think there's a 268 00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:16,040 Speaker 1: danger in people not understanding the humanity of the police. 269 00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:19,240 Speaker 1: In other words, when you think the police, you think 270 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:23,920 Speaker 1: of the structure and the institution of the police rather 271 00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:27,680 Speaker 1: than the human being that just happens to be a policeman. 272 00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:29,920 Speaker 2: Right, That's where I think that we need to do 273 00:15:29,960 --> 00:15:33,880 Speaker 2: a better job at change in that that institution. Right, 274 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:37,760 Speaker 2: that it's a cultural change that needs to take place 275 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:40,920 Speaker 2: on both sides of the equation. Right, Because you know, 276 00:15:41,000 --> 00:15:43,040 Speaker 2: if you look at the police officers are there to 277 00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:46,400 Speaker 2: protect them, to serve, right, could we look at the 278 00:15:46,440 --> 00:15:51,000 Speaker 2: police offices, they're in full uniform. It's that cognitive shift 279 00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:54,160 Speaker 2: that I look at that person, but I see behind 280 00:15:54,200 --> 00:15:57,080 Speaker 2: the badge. Of course you're in full uniform, right, But 281 00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:59,560 Speaker 2: I see behind the badge to the to the wives 282 00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:02,760 Speaker 2: and huss and moms and dads, sisters and brothers, and 283 00:16:02,960 --> 00:16:07,120 Speaker 2: lower league football coaches, and you see the human side 284 00:16:07,160 --> 00:16:09,640 Speaker 2: of them. And again you get to see the human 285 00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:13,240 Speaker 2: side of it by what's happening here within an organization 286 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:17,000 Speaker 2: is the life rubbing up against life and have stories 287 00:16:17,080 --> 00:16:21,000 Speaker 2: that people begin to view and their perceptions begin to change. 288 00:16:21,080 --> 00:16:25,880 Speaker 1: So how does John ponder the citizen, John ponder just 289 00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:30,720 Speaker 1: the citizen, just the member of the society. How do 290 00:16:30,880 --> 00:16:34,600 Speaker 1: you feel what goes on in your heart and head? 291 00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:37,240 Speaker 1: What you've talked about a lot, what goes on in 292 00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:43,520 Speaker 1: your heart and head when you know how vital all 293 00:16:43,640 --> 00:16:49,680 Speaker 1: of the police officers are in your program, that that 294 00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:53,720 Speaker 1: has has changed lives in this city. What happens in 295 00:16:53,760 --> 00:16:57,000 Speaker 1: your heart and head when you hear a national narrative 296 00:16:57,040 --> 00:16:59,000 Speaker 1: that we need to defund these people. 297 00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:04,320 Speaker 2: My gosh, my my heartbreaks. It really is heartbreaking. 298 00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:04,680 Speaker 1: Right. 299 00:17:05,240 --> 00:17:07,760 Speaker 2: And I was on the I was on the radio 300 00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:10,160 Speaker 2: show one time. It's going back a couple of years ago, 301 00:17:10,200 --> 00:17:13,080 Speaker 2: and it was right after something happened. It was an 302 00:17:13,080 --> 00:17:16,200 Speaker 2: office involved shooting, killed in a non black person, whatever 303 00:17:16,200 --> 00:17:19,200 Speaker 2: the case of b And on this radio show that 304 00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:22,040 Speaker 2: the host had said to me, you know, how could 305 00:17:22,080 --> 00:17:23,880 Speaker 2: you support law enforcement? 306 00:17:23,960 --> 00:17:27,399 Speaker 3: You're an African avery man And. 307 00:17:26,400 --> 00:17:30,640 Speaker 1: It was just right. So it's an African American dude, right. Well, 308 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:32,760 Speaker 1: see this is what this is why I'm trying to 309 00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:34,760 Speaker 1: tie together as you're an African American dude. You grew 310 00:17:34,840 --> 00:17:39,639 Speaker 1: up in in Brooklyn, which yeah, and and you you 311 00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:42,920 Speaker 1: you were in and out of jail through thirty six 312 00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:48,320 Speaker 1: forty years old. You're the grandson of a sharecropper and 313 00:17:48,320 --> 00:17:50,040 Speaker 1: the great grandson of a slave. 314 00:17:50,160 --> 00:17:52,080 Speaker 3: Ye m hm. 315 00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:56,280 Speaker 1: And have dealt with all of the institutional racism that 316 00:17:56,400 --> 00:18:00,600 Speaker 1: this country has offered. And that's for another show. But 317 00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:04,320 Speaker 1: I think there's I think we could talk a lot 318 00:18:04,359 --> 00:18:07,919 Speaker 1: about that but clearly the path that your life has 319 00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:15,400 Speaker 1: taken and your heritage, you're supposed to not like the police. John, 320 00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:18,199 Speaker 1: That's what the society tells us, that you're supposed to 321 00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:23,399 Speaker 1: be not liking the police. So as that man to 322 00:18:23,840 --> 00:18:26,439 Speaker 1: hear you say, it breaks your heart hearing about the 323 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:30,359 Speaker 1: defund of the police movement. But then there are unarmed 324 00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:33,560 Speaker 1: people that get killed by the police. How do we John, 325 00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:38,359 Speaker 1: help me, really help me and help our listeners. How 326 00:18:38,359 --> 00:18:40,960 Speaker 1: do we balance it? John? Because we know we need 327 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:46,680 Speaker 1: the police. We don't want people to be unmercifully shot 328 00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:50,720 Speaker 1: or treated bad. We've seen the videos that get sensationalized 329 00:18:50,800 --> 00:18:53,520 Speaker 1: on TV. I think in our mind we know that 330 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:55,359 Speaker 1: ninety nine point nine per some of the people who 331 00:18:55,480 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 1: were bad are good people. But how do we balance 332 00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:02,520 Speaker 1: it all? John? And from your perspective, how do you 333 00:19:02,600 --> 00:19:06,879 Speaker 1: balance and do you get called a sellout being a 334 00:19:06,880 --> 00:19:09,280 Speaker 1: black dude and speaking out against it? I mean, how 335 00:19:09,280 --> 00:19:11,520 Speaker 1: do you balance at all? It's just it's the one 336 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:13,760 Speaker 1: question I couldn't wait to get to is how do 337 00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:16,160 Speaker 1: we balance it? Because it's killing us right now as 338 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:17,080 Speaker 1: a society. 339 00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:18,440 Speaker 3: I think that. 340 00:19:20,080 --> 00:19:22,480 Speaker 2: The way that I approach it is this, right, have 341 00:19:22,600 --> 00:19:26,800 Speaker 2: you ever thought about how close the word enemy comes 342 00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:32,840 Speaker 2: to the inner me. And I spent the lifetime fighting 343 00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:36,280 Speaker 2: enemies on the outside until I took a look at 344 00:19:36,320 --> 00:19:39,560 Speaker 2: the enemies that will land dormant on the inner me. 345 00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:44,320 Speaker 2: And once I conquered the enemies on the enner me, 346 00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:49,119 Speaker 2: the enemies on the outside, disappearing police officers are not 347 00:19:49,240 --> 00:19:53,760 Speaker 2: my enemies. As an Africa averyman, I love and respect 348 00:19:53,800 --> 00:19:56,320 Speaker 2: and appreciative of being out in the community. Do some 349 00:19:56,400 --> 00:19:59,359 Speaker 2: people do some things? You got some maybe not so 350 00:19:59,480 --> 00:20:04,159 Speaker 2: good people out there. Absolutely right. This reporter that was 351 00:20:04,240 --> 00:20:07,160 Speaker 2: interviewed one time, and he tried to push me out 352 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:10,000 Speaker 2: there on that and how can I support and everything 353 00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:12,560 Speaker 2: like that, and he was just going on this little tangent. 354 00:20:12,600 --> 00:20:16,640 Speaker 2: And what I said to him. I asked him if 355 00:20:16,680 --> 00:20:20,879 Speaker 2: he was married, and he said he was married. And 356 00:20:20,920 --> 00:20:23,720 Speaker 2: I asked him that, you know, do you consider yourself 357 00:20:23,760 --> 00:20:26,280 Speaker 2: a good husband? And he said, yeah, I'm a good husband. 358 00:20:26,280 --> 00:20:29,000 Speaker 2: And I said that, you know, I'm married to and 359 00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:31,320 Speaker 2: I like to consider myself a good husband. And I 360 00:20:31,359 --> 00:20:33,160 Speaker 2: know a lot of men that are married and they 361 00:20:33,359 --> 00:20:36,880 Speaker 2: good husbands and loved their wives and they honored them 362 00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:39,600 Speaker 2: and respect them. Then I said that there are some 363 00:20:39,920 --> 00:20:42,960 Speaker 2: men out there who are not good husbands, who beat 364 00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:45,840 Speaker 2: their wives and don't give them the love, the honor 365 00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:49,400 Speaker 2: respect that they need to give them, right. But I 366 00:20:49,520 --> 00:20:53,440 Speaker 2: said to him, do not lump me in with those 367 00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:58,000 Speaker 2: bad husbands, right. 368 00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:00,560 Speaker 3: Don't lump me in there, right, because I'm a good husband. 369 00:21:01,080 --> 00:21:04,480 Speaker 3: But you cannot lump the rest. 370 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:06,800 Speaker 2: Of the good cops are out there putting their life 371 00:21:06,840 --> 00:21:09,720 Speaker 2: on the line for some people that made, you know, 372 00:21:09,800 --> 00:21:11,920 Speaker 2: made a bad call, bad judgment call of you, they 373 00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:13,439 Speaker 2: messed up, or whatever case it be. 374 00:21:13,840 --> 00:21:15,840 Speaker 3: But you can't lump everybody up. 375 00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:24,760 Speaker 1: In there, right. And you see that absolutely, We'll be 376 00:21:24,840 --> 00:21:34,040 Speaker 1: right back. And so I came to visit you today 377 00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:38,119 Speaker 1: in your offices, which is very cool. And before we 378 00:21:38,160 --> 00:21:42,280 Speaker 1: got to sit down and have our discussion today, I 379 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:44,879 Speaker 1: was in a room that had fifty or sixty people 380 00:21:44,920 --> 00:21:49,080 Speaker 1: in it and along the wall of one half of 381 00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:54,040 Speaker 1: the room were parole officers. It looked like Las Vegas 382 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:58,840 Speaker 1: Metro cops and maybe sheriffs. Looked like an undercover guy 383 00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:01,920 Speaker 1: or two. Looked like there was a rabbi in there 384 00:22:01,960 --> 00:22:04,960 Speaker 1: that had a badge on, which was something foreign to me, 385 00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:07,800 Speaker 1: but he was awesome. And then the other half the 386 00:22:07,880 --> 00:22:11,639 Speaker 1: room was a whole bunch of guys, ladies, men and 387 00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:15,240 Speaker 1: women who were on parole, work release, or were fresh 388 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:19,840 Speaker 1: out of jail. Yes, And I watched them all hug 389 00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:23,639 Speaker 1: and I watched them all eat, and I watched people 390 00:22:23,720 --> 00:22:28,440 Speaker 1: who'd been arrested by people in those uniforms hugging them. 391 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:31,760 Speaker 1: And frankly, those people in those uniforms have to deal 392 00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:34,679 Speaker 1: with some pretty nasty people every day, and those people 393 00:22:34,760 --> 00:22:36,840 Speaker 1: represent the nasty people they have to deal with, some 394 00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:38,680 Speaker 1: of which I have tried to hurt them in the past. 395 00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:40,800 Speaker 1: And I watched them hug them back. And I'm watching 396 00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:44,840 Speaker 1: this room full of people that you've assembled, yes, that 397 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:52,480 Speaker 1: are supporting one another. And it was this weird, beautiful, 398 00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:57,600 Speaker 1: odd arrangement. So tell me what that meeting was, Tell 399 00:22:57,600 --> 00:22:58,880 Speaker 1: me what was happening. 400 00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:02,480 Speaker 2: And sure, So, as we're working with the formerly incarcerated 401 00:23:02,520 --> 00:23:04,520 Speaker 2: people that are helping them come home and help them 402 00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:08,280 Speaker 2: successfully reintegrate back in their home, the workplace, in the community, 403 00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:11,320 Speaker 2: we want to wrap services around them. So not only 404 00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:14,720 Speaker 2: the leadership training and invocational training, we want to make 405 00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:17,120 Speaker 2: sure that we can set them up to be successful 406 00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:19,400 Speaker 2: as they reintegrate back into the community. 407 00:23:19,680 --> 00:23:21,960 Speaker 1: So in this partners which a lot of people do 408 00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:25,600 Speaker 1: in this country, right, But the law enforcement part is 409 00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:26,680 Speaker 1: what's so unique. 410 00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:26,920 Speaker 3: Man. 411 00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:29,520 Speaker 2: It is critical, and I wish the people would be 412 00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:31,240 Speaker 2: able to get that because if you think about it, 413 00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:33,480 Speaker 2: let me tell you why that's so important. If we're 414 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:35,480 Speaker 2: going to get men and women to return back to 415 00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:38,240 Speaker 2: the community and be successful members of the community, we 416 00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:40,280 Speaker 2: want to get them to a place where they will 417 00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:42,880 Speaker 2: never reoffend again. In order for us to be able 418 00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:45,040 Speaker 2: to do that, we have to instill in them a 419 00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:49,080 Speaker 2: love of respect or appreciation for the rules and regulations 420 00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:49,720 Speaker 2: out in the land. 421 00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:50,280 Speaker 1: Right. 422 00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:55,480 Speaker 2: We found that something incredible happened when we bought them 423 00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:59,879 Speaker 2: in relationship with those who are upholding the law, they 424 00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:03,680 Speaker 2: respect it more. They have a tendency to not you know, swave. 425 00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:07,679 Speaker 2: It's not knowing us against them, right, you're in relationship, right, 426 00:24:07,760 --> 00:24:10,320 Speaker 2: and it was very powerful. But think about this, if 427 00:24:10,320 --> 00:24:12,640 Speaker 2: you flip the coin around the other side. The thing 428 00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:16,560 Speaker 2: that makes me smile is that this level of partnership 429 00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:20,399 Speaker 2: is forcing law enforcement to do do things that they 430 00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:21,760 Speaker 2: talked about for years. 431 00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:25,679 Speaker 3: Sermunity engagement and serving serve. 432 00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:28,840 Speaker 2: You don't know how many instances we had here where 433 00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:32,879 Speaker 2: there's an officer who sixteen seventeen years ago, he was 434 00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 2: the gang Task Force, hooking and booking people. 435 00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:37,920 Speaker 3: Right, but they've been on the force, you know, seventeen 436 00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:39,080 Speaker 3: eighteen years now. 437 00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:40,360 Speaker 1: And that means they've seen it all. 438 00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:43,760 Speaker 2: Oh, and they're at all and the captains of the 439 00:24:43,840 --> 00:24:46,160 Speaker 2: gang unit. And now all of a sudden, it walks 440 00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:49,520 Speaker 2: through the door. The person they locked up seventeen years 441 00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:53,719 Speaker 2: ago comes to the door and listen today they're best friends. 442 00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:54,520 Speaker 1: Just like you and the FBI, just. 443 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:57,400 Speaker 2: Like the FBI agent, and they're best friends to this day. 444 00:24:58,119 --> 00:24:59,320 Speaker 2: They do not go back. 445 00:24:59,119 --> 00:25:02,480 Speaker 1: To jail, as media would say. Praise God, that's right, 446 00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:07,359 Speaker 1: that's right. You have some hollowlujas that everything else, my 447 00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:13,520 Speaker 1: brother is that is hope for Christeners. Yes, it is 448 00:25:13,560 --> 00:25:18,240 Speaker 1: an amazing story. Now it works, but there's only one 449 00:25:18,320 --> 00:25:21,840 Speaker 1: John Ponder. How can we mimic this? How does this 450 00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:26,920 Speaker 1: country do this elsewhere? And if there's people listen John, 451 00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:30,000 Speaker 1: one of the things that this podcast is for is 452 00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:33,760 Speaker 1: we talk about a lot of different different stuff that 453 00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:39,400 Speaker 1: people do, from holding babies to you're doing. And our 454 00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:43,439 Speaker 1: hope is that they see that John Ponder is just 455 00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:46,080 Speaker 1: a normal guy who's got into a little trouble who's 456 00:25:46,119 --> 00:25:48,760 Speaker 1: done something extraordinary, just like all the people we talked to, right, 457 00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:53,960 Speaker 1: and you're just a normal guy who's done extraordinary things. 458 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:57,000 Speaker 1: And my goal is to create an army of normal 459 00:25:57,040 --> 00:26:01,680 Speaker 1: folks that do extraordinary things across our country. If someone 460 00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:06,080 Speaker 1: is listening to us and says, man, I identify with that, 461 00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:10,919 Speaker 1: how how do we start? How how do we do 462 00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:17,000 Speaker 1: a hope for prisoners in Birmingham? Yes, Milwaukee, Denver, Phoenix, Right, 463 00:26:17,359 --> 00:26:18,399 Speaker 1: how's it work? Love it? 464 00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:18,679 Speaker 3: Love it? 465 00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:19,000 Speaker 1: Love it. 466 00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:20,800 Speaker 3: I get excited at the opportunity. 467 00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:25,359 Speaker 2: We did export our model to Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Have a 468 00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:27,920 Speaker 2: conversation with how we did it, got all the stakeholders 469 00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:30,600 Speaker 2: on board. But then what we have to identify. We 470 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:34,080 Speaker 2: have to identify John Ponder in that area right right 471 00:26:34,119 --> 00:26:36,879 Speaker 2: there are and I say this very humbly, They're there 472 00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:38,719 Speaker 2: are John Ponders all over this country. 473 00:26:38,760 --> 00:26:44,280 Speaker 5: That's because it's folks, right, So you identify those people, 474 00:26:44,359 --> 00:26:47,320 Speaker 5: pour your DNA into them and and just work with 475 00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:48,920 Speaker 5: them and training equipment and lawns. 476 00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:51,119 Speaker 3: We stood Milwaukee up. This is doing phenomenal. 477 00:26:51,440 --> 00:26:54,560 Speaker 1: So we can launch this anywhere absolutely, And. 478 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:57,800 Speaker 2: I think that as we're going across the country right again. 479 00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:01,680 Speaker 2: The idea is to change the landscape reentry. Somebody asked 480 00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:04,120 Speaker 2: me a long time ago, when we've first stopped putting 481 00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:06,000 Speaker 2: the whole for prison together, and they say, well, why 482 00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:07,639 Speaker 2: are you calling it a Hope for prisoners when the 483 00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:10,159 Speaker 2: people that you work with they've gotten you gotten out 484 00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:12,119 Speaker 2: a prison. They said, you don't want to put the 485 00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:15,800 Speaker 2: word prisoners in there because it's got this negative right 486 00:27:16,119 --> 00:27:18,280 Speaker 2: and people don't want to give you money and things 487 00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:18,760 Speaker 2: like that. 488 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:20,359 Speaker 3: And they said, well, why do you want to name 489 00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:21,240 Speaker 3: it Hold for prisons? 490 00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:23,119 Speaker 2: This is what I said to him, was that the 491 00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:25,560 Speaker 2: number one reason why I'm naming it over prison beces 492 00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:26,440 Speaker 2: God told me to a. 493 00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:31,040 Speaker 3: Period, right, got it, Pennsylvania? 494 00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:34,760 Speaker 5: Absolute, absolutely right? 495 00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:36,879 Speaker 2: And I said, the other reason why I'm naming it 496 00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:39,600 Speaker 2: Hope for Prison is because the mission of our organization 497 00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:44,280 Speaker 2: is to help to create a massive amount of people 498 00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:48,879 Speaker 2: who come home from the prison system, and not only 499 00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:52,879 Speaker 2: do they never re offend again, that they begin to 500 00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:55,439 Speaker 2: live levels of life that most people want to dream of. 501 00:27:55,640 --> 00:28:01,640 Speaker 2: When we do that, then they become the Hope four prisoners. 502 00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:08,320 Speaker 1: That's a beautiful thing. Brother. Last thing, if somebody wants 503 00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:10,119 Speaker 1: to talk to you and say Hey, I want to 504 00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:13,560 Speaker 1: try to do this in my town. What is the website? 505 00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:16,680 Speaker 1: How do they reach out? How how do people reach 506 00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:21,360 Speaker 1: into John Ponder's Las Vegas World and find out more? Right? 507 00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:25,400 Speaker 2: They can visit our website at Hope for is Flrprisoners 508 00:28:25,480 --> 00:28:28,920 Speaker 2: dot org. Or you can certainly call out office at 509 00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:32,360 Speaker 2: seven zero two five eight six one three seven to one. 510 00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:35,280 Speaker 2: But if you want to shoot me an email, you 511 00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:38,520 Speaker 2: can certainly email me at j O NP. So It's 512 00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:44,560 Speaker 2: John p at Hope for Flrprisoners dot org. Love to 513 00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:46,040 Speaker 2: be able to have a conversation with you. 514 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:48,040 Speaker 1: John Ponder. I haven't done this yet, but I think 515 00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:49,760 Speaker 1: I'm going to make you an officer in their Army 516 00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:50,520 Speaker 1: of Normal Folks. 517 00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:53,240 Speaker 3: Oh my goodness, I'm in so find me up. 518 00:28:53,360 --> 00:28:55,840 Speaker 1: So far we've done privates and corporals, but my friend, 519 00:28:55,920 --> 00:29:01,120 Speaker 1: you're a cap. It has truly been an honor and 520 00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:02,640 Speaker 1: a pleasure to spend time with you today. 521 00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:05,080 Speaker 2: Well awesome, it is my honors. Thank you guys so 522 00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:06,800 Speaker 2: much for the opportunity. 523 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:17,280 Speaker 1: Okay, buddy, yeah, thank you guys to join the Army 524 00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:20,560 Speaker 1: of normal folks. Go to normal Folks dot us. That's right, 525 00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:24,000 Speaker 1: Normal Folks dot us and sign up to become a 526 00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:27,160 Speaker 1: member of the movement. I genuinely hope you'll join us. 527 00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:30,840 Speaker 1: It only takes committing to doing one new thing this 528 00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:33,840 Speaker 1: year to help another person. And there will be ton 529 00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:36,920 Speaker 1: of awesome ideas on this podcast. When the folks were featuring, 530 00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:40,200 Speaker 1: some of them may resonate with you deeply and others 531 00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:43,040 Speaker 1: may not at all, And that's okay because we're all 532 00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:45,640 Speaker 1: called to do different things with the different talents we've 533 00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:49,560 Speaker 1: been blessed with. But together with each of us doing 534 00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:53,280 Speaker 1: what we can, we genuinely can change this country. We'd 535 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:55,880 Speaker 1: love to hear what you do. And if there's stories 536 00:29:55,920 --> 00:29:58,680 Speaker 1: you've heard of that you think we must tell, write 537 00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:04,160 Speaker 1: me anytime at Bill at normalfolks dot us. As you've heard, 538 00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:08,520 Speaker 1: everyone we're featuring and myself included, are sharing our direct 539 00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:13,040 Speaker 1: contact information. We're genuinely hoping to build a real community. 540 00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:15,360 Speaker 1: It's not just a show. We want to build a 541 00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:19,320 Speaker 1: community that's unlike anything America's ever seen. And if you 542 00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:21,480 Speaker 1: enjoyed this episode, rate it and review it and share 543 00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:24,240 Speaker 1: it with friends on social all these things that will 544 00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:28,760 Speaker 1: help us grow an army of normal folks. I'm Bill 545 00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:30,840 Speaker 1: Courtney can't wait to see you next week.