1 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:21,479 Speaker 1: Pushkin too quick. No, it's perfect push kid stuff. You 2 00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:21,919 Speaker 1: got it. 3 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:39,680 Speaker 2: Fish Mumafukuando had a dream. He wanted to turn ramen 4 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:44,160 Speaker 2: to delicious noodles, delicious noodles from something that was artisanal, 5 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:48,280 Speaker 2: that was made and served fresh in little shops, into 6 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:52,560 Speaker 2: a cheap, mass produced instant food. It's not a dream 7 00:00:52,600 --> 00:00:56,120 Speaker 2: of our moment, but it was a very mid twentieth 8 00:00:56,160 --> 00:00:58,840 Speaker 2: century kind of dream, which was when he was dreaming 9 00:00:58,880 --> 00:01:00,040 Speaker 2: this dreamy. 10 00:00:59,880 --> 00:01:02,760 Speaker 1: Age of science and age of convenience and age where 11 00:01:03,280 --> 00:01:07,200 Speaker 1: where scientists could help us eat faster and more efficiently. 12 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:11,560 Speaker 2: Yes, yes, industrial food as mid twentieth century dream. His 13 00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:14,600 Speaker 2: dream also, as I'll talk about in the show, a 14 00:01:14,720 --> 00:01:19,520 Speaker 2: very post war Japanese economic miracle kind of dream. And 15 00:01:19,600 --> 00:01:23,039 Speaker 2: so Andndo had a friend of his build him a 16 00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:27,520 Speaker 2: shed out back behind his house in Osaka. He bought 17 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:31,440 Speaker 2: a used noodle making machine, brought it home on his bike, 18 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 2: set it up in the shed, and every day for 19 00:01:34,920 --> 00:01:37,520 Speaker 2: a year he is out there in the shed from 20 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:40,800 Speaker 2: five in the morning until to the next morning, trying 21 00:01:40,840 --> 00:01:44,400 Speaker 2: to figure out how to make his instant ramen dream 22 00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:48,640 Speaker 2: come true. He is the Thomas Edison of the instant noodle. 23 00:01:48,560 --> 00:01:50,880 Speaker 1: Kind of seems like he read the Thomas Edison biography 24 00:01:50,920 --> 00:01:52,080 Speaker 1: and is taking. 25 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:55,200 Speaker 2: It to heart. Yes, he's a businessman, he is not 26 00:01:55,520 --> 00:02:00,680 Speaker 2: a chef, but this doesn't stop him. He tries adding eggs, starch, yams, 27 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:04,640 Speaker 2: milk powder, spinach juice. Finally he gets better at making 28 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:09,120 Speaker 2: the noodles, but he's still stuck on this last key step. 29 00:02:09,760 --> 00:02:12,679 Speaker 2: How do you preserve them so that they're not fresh 30 00:02:13,079 --> 00:02:16,279 Speaker 2: and gonna go bad but stable. You can just put 31 00:02:16,320 --> 00:02:18,520 Speaker 2: him in the cabinet and then cook him up in 32 00:02:18,519 --> 00:02:22,160 Speaker 2: an instant whenever you want them. And one day Ono 33 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:25,600 Speaker 2: ses his wife making tempura in the kitchen in the house, 34 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:29,160 Speaker 2: and he notices that the batter is giving off these 35 00:02:29,240 --> 00:02:33,960 Speaker 2: bubbles of moisture in the pan, and he realizes that 36 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:38,639 Speaker 2: by frying the freshly made noodles he could dehydrate them 37 00:02:38,720 --> 00:02:39,920 Speaker 2: and preserve them. 38 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:42,359 Speaker 1: Eureka, this is the moment. 39 00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:45,800 Speaker 2: So he flash fries his noodles, lets them cool, and 40 00:02:45,840 --> 00:02:50,440 Speaker 2: then he adds boiling hot water to the noodles, and voila, 41 00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:55,280 Speaker 2: they rehydrate and cook within minutes. He has invented instant ramen, 42 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:59,040 Speaker 2: a product that human beings on planet Earth will eat 43 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:03,000 Speaker 2: one hundred and twenty three billion, with a bee servings 44 00:03:03,040 --> 00:03:07,960 Speaker 2: of in twenty twenty four in the distant future. This 45 00:03:08,160 --> 00:03:10,720 Speaker 2: is the story that they tell at the Cup Noodle 46 00:03:10,880 --> 00:03:15,440 Speaker 2: Museum in Osaka, Japan. It's a corporate museum, a corporate 47 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:19,359 Speaker 2: museum indeed, that has a full scale replica of the shed. 48 00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:24,280 Speaker 2: They also tell this story at the other Cup Noodle 49 00:03:24,480 --> 00:03:28,600 Speaker 2: Museum in Yokohama, where there is another full scale replica 50 00:03:28,639 --> 00:03:32,040 Speaker 2: of the shed. Maybe it's a replica of the replica, 51 00:03:32,240 --> 00:03:35,480 Speaker 2: one doesn't know. But the official story, this story I 52 00:03:35,600 --> 00:03:40,400 Speaker 2: just told you, leaves out some important details. Perhaps most importantly, 53 00:03:41,120 --> 00:03:43,960 Speaker 2: Momofukuwanda was not the first person to figure out that 54 00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:47,080 Speaker 2: you could preserve ramen by flash frying it. He wasn't 55 00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:50,560 Speaker 2: even the first person to patent instant ramen in Japan. 56 00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:52,600 Speaker 1: They don't want you to know this at the Cup 57 00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:53,880 Speaker 1: Noodle Museum, telling. 58 00:03:53,600 --> 00:03:55,400 Speaker 2: You the things they don't want you to know on 59 00:03:55,560 --> 00:04:00,560 Speaker 2: business history. But look, Hoo was the guy who made 60 00:04:00,640 --> 00:04:04,800 Speaker 2: the instant noodle great, who built pop Ramen and cup 61 00:04:04,840 --> 00:04:12,480 Speaker 2: noodle into global convenience food superpowers, and crucially centrally, he 62 00:04:12,640 --> 00:04:16,120 Speaker 2: was the guy who told his story better than anybody else. 63 00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:17,240 Speaker 2: I'm Jacob Goldstein. 64 00:04:17,279 --> 00:04:20,839 Speaker 1: I'm Robert Smith. This is Business History, a show about 65 00:04:20,840 --> 00:04:22,640 Speaker 1: the history of business today. 66 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:26,960 Speaker 2: On the show, Ramen the foundational product, a foundational product 67 00:04:27,200 --> 00:04:29,799 Speaker 2: of our modern age, fuels higher education. 68 00:04:30,200 --> 00:04:32,760 Speaker 1: Absolutely PhDs only eat. 69 00:04:32,680 --> 00:04:36,640 Speaker 2: Ram only Ramen, and it has a weirdly warm place 70 00:04:36,720 --> 00:04:40,120 Speaker 2: in our hearts, given that it is this industrial, mid 71 00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:41,480 Speaker 2: century food. 72 00:04:41,640 --> 00:04:44,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, the warm place is the salt, salt. 73 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:47,240 Speaker 2: And the hot water, a hot salty water going down 74 00:04:47,279 --> 00:04:47,680 Speaker 2: a lot of. 75 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:49,280 Speaker 1: The salt blood pressure. They go it up. 76 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:53,360 Speaker 2: When I was in elementary school and I was home 77 00:04:53,400 --> 00:04:56,920 Speaker 2: alone in the afternoons on the weekday afternoons, sometimes I'd 78 00:04:56,960 --> 00:04:58,920 Speaker 2: eat a pack of ramen raw. 79 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:01,200 Speaker 1: You ever do that? I have done it. It is 80 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:02,360 Speaker 1: It is kind of delicious. 81 00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:05,240 Speaker 2: The only question is do you go flavor pack or no? 82 00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:07,200 Speaker 2: Like how spicy you feeling? 83 00:05:07,360 --> 00:05:10,640 Speaker 1: No, no flavor pack. My best Ramen moment was when 84 00:05:10,640 --> 00:05:12,920 Speaker 1: I was in South Korea. I was watching baseball game 85 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:17,200 Speaker 1: and instead of peanuts and cracker jack, you go down 86 00:05:17,640 --> 00:05:21,480 Speaker 1: to the convenience store at the stadium by a cup 87 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:24,760 Speaker 1: of ramen at hot water and then you slip it 88 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:26,000 Speaker 1: at your seat. 89 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:30,719 Speaker 2: It is remarkably ubiquitous. You know, people talk about eating 90 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:34,960 Speaker 2: it in Nigeria and in Poland, and you know, rich countries, 91 00:05:35,000 --> 00:05:39,640 Speaker 2: poor countries, Asia, Europe, Africa, the Americas. Ramen has conquered 92 00:05:39,640 --> 00:05:41,960 Speaker 2: the world, right instant. Ramen has conquered the world. So 93 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:44,840 Speaker 2: how did it happen? Why it happened largely because of 94 00:05:44,880 --> 00:05:48,240 Speaker 2: this guy, Momo Fukuwando, So let's talk about him. He 95 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:52,400 Speaker 2: was born in nineteen ten in Taiwan. His name at 96 00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:55,320 Speaker 2: the time was go Peck Huck. I'm not sure if 97 00:05:55,320 --> 00:05:58,760 Speaker 2: I'm pronouncing that correctly. His parents died when he was 98 00:05:58,839 --> 00:06:01,240 Speaker 2: very young. He'd later say he couldn't remember their faces, 99 00:06:01,600 --> 00:06:03,880 Speaker 2: and he was raised by his grandparents. He spent his 100 00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:07,320 Speaker 2: childhood in their textile store doing chores, and when he 101 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:10,200 Speaker 2: was twenty two, he went into the textile business for 102 00:06:10,279 --> 00:06:14,840 Speaker 2: himself with money he inherited from his parents and at 103 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:18,799 Speaker 2: the time at the time, Taiwan was a Japanese colony. 104 00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:21,880 Speaker 2: This was the first part of the twentieth century. And 105 00:06:21,880 --> 00:06:25,320 Speaker 2: Ondo had an uncle near Osaka and that led him 106 00:06:25,320 --> 00:06:29,280 Speaker 2: eventually to move to Osaka. Moved to Japan and set 107 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:32,760 Speaker 2: up a textile company there, and then World War Two started, 108 00:06:32,839 --> 00:06:36,440 Speaker 2: which just took his textile business out of business. But 109 00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:39,120 Speaker 2: one thing that will become clear about Hodo that I 110 00:06:39,120 --> 00:06:41,359 Speaker 2: think is really the essence of history in some ways, 111 00:06:41,600 --> 00:06:44,200 Speaker 2: is he is a hustler. He is a guy who 112 00:06:44,360 --> 00:06:47,120 Speaker 2: just keeps coming up with new businesses, and he's going 113 00:06:47,160 --> 00:06:49,719 Speaker 2: to come up with a lot before he gets to Ramen. 114 00:06:49,839 --> 00:06:53,360 Speaker 2: So during the war, he's selling charcoal, he's selling some 115 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:56,640 Speaker 2: kind of optical equipment for the war effort. But then 116 00:06:56,920 --> 00:07:00,360 Speaker 2: a manager at the factory is suspected a fraud, and 117 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:04,120 Speaker 2: apparently Ondo reports the fraud, but he ends up getting arrested. 118 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:06,520 Speaker 2: That's unclear really what happened, but it is clear that 119 00:07:06,560 --> 00:07:10,480 Speaker 2: he got arrested and he's put in a cell and 120 00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:13,360 Speaker 2: he sees prisoners fighting over tiny servings of food, and 121 00:07:13,400 --> 00:07:15,360 Speaker 2: he'll later say this is part of his impetus to 122 00:07:15,440 --> 00:07:18,680 Speaker 2: want to create this kind of cheap, abundant food. He 123 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:22,360 Speaker 2: gets out forty five days later, and not long after 124 00:07:22,400 --> 00:07:25,720 Speaker 2: he gets out, Japan surrenders and the war is over. 125 00:07:26,760 --> 00:07:30,320 Speaker 2: Around this time, he marries a Japanese woman named Masako, 126 00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:34,720 Speaker 2: Ando takes her name. Actually, Ando changes his first name 127 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:38,840 Speaker 2: to Momofuku. Side note, as some people some listeners may 128 00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:42,880 Speaker 2: have been thinking already, isn't there a fancy basically Ramen 129 00:07:42,960 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 2: Chang food chain in America today called Momofuku. Is it 130 00:07:45,920 --> 00:07:49,520 Speaker 2: a coincidence, Robert, You actually talked to David Chang, right, the. 131 00:07:49,520 --> 00:07:52,720 Speaker 1: Guy, and he said it was a coincidence that Momofuku 132 00:07:52,840 --> 00:07:57,200 Speaker 1: meant good peach, lucky peach. Yeah. Yeah, and so yeah, 133 00:07:57,200 --> 00:07:59,560 Speaker 1: he was not basing it out of MoMA fu, or 134 00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:00,400 Speaker 1: so he says. 135 00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:02,880 Speaker 2: Or so he says. Surely he must have known. Anyway, 136 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:07,320 Speaker 2: So we're in post war Japan now there is a 137 00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:11,360 Speaker 2: profound food shortage. In fact, the US had been, you know, 138 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:16,320 Speaker 2: deliberately cutting off japan supplies of food imports during the war, 139 00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:20,800 Speaker 2: and now after the war, the harvest in Japan is bad. 140 00:08:21,520 --> 00:08:25,200 Speaker 2: It's quite a desperate situation. People are eating peanutshells, they're 141 00:08:25,280 --> 00:08:30,600 Speaker 2: stealing vegetables from the fields. And Ando is this entrepreneurial 142 00:08:30,640 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 2: guy out of prison wants, you know, wants to start 143 00:08:34,640 --> 00:08:37,440 Speaker 2: a business. Also, I think genuinely wants to do something helpful. 144 00:08:37,480 --> 00:08:40,319 Speaker 2: So he starts getting into the food business. He finds 145 00:08:40,319 --> 00:08:44,360 Speaker 2: an abandoned military base on a beach and finds a 146 00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:48,640 Speaker 2: bunch of demobilized soldiers with nothing to do, and opens 147 00:08:48,720 --> 00:08:51,319 Speaker 2: up a salt plant and the soldiers are working for 148 00:08:51,520 --> 00:08:55,439 Speaker 2: making salt on the beach. Another company he starts extracts 149 00:08:55,600 --> 00:08:59,120 Speaker 2: the marrow from discarded animal bones to make some kind 150 00:08:59,160 --> 00:09:05,200 Speaker 2: of nutrition supplement. And around this time a couple things 151 00:09:05,280 --> 00:09:08,680 Speaker 2: come together to plant the seeds of the big idea, 152 00:09:09,320 --> 00:09:13,960 Speaker 2: the Ramen, the instant ramen idea in his mind. One 153 00:09:14,600 --> 00:09:18,720 Speaker 2: the US is occupying Japan, and the US is bringing 154 00:09:18,760 --> 00:09:22,840 Speaker 2: food from the US to help stave off famine. In particular, 155 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:26,920 Speaker 2: the US is bringing in surplus wheat. It's a classic 156 00:09:26,960 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 2: American move. 157 00:09:28,320 --> 00:09:31,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, because we have wheat farmers, and it's a great 158 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:34,400 Speaker 1: way to take our bounty and move it to another place, 159 00:09:34,440 --> 00:09:36,479 Speaker 1: even if they don't traditionally eat much wheat. 160 00:09:36,320 --> 00:09:40,240 Speaker 2: Right, And so they had eaten some bread in Japan, 161 00:09:40,360 --> 00:09:43,560 Speaker 2: and before the Portuguese had brought bread, they didn't eat much. 162 00:09:44,200 --> 00:09:47,680 Speaker 2: But the Americans they're bringing in this flour and turning 163 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:50,720 Speaker 2: it into white bread, which is not a normal thing 164 00:09:50,760 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 2: in a Japanese diet. And there are these like pr 165 00:09:53,600 --> 00:09:56,160 Speaker 2: vans going around, which I think means like the vans 166 00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:58,360 Speaker 2: with the big speaker on top driving around being like 167 00:09:58,760 --> 00:10:01,880 Speaker 2: America is giving you bread, you know, and they're putting 168 00:10:01,920 --> 00:10:03,760 Speaker 2: it in school lunches and this sort of thing. 169 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:08,439 Speaker 1: You're hungry, eat some bread. Bread is good, America good. 170 00:10:09,320 --> 00:10:11,839 Speaker 2: That's the gist. Yeah, so they're trying to get people 171 00:10:11,880 --> 00:10:16,080 Speaker 2: to eat the bread. Ondo knows about this. And there's 172 00:10:16,120 --> 00:10:18,199 Speaker 2: a moment when this is happening that is like a 173 00:10:18,280 --> 00:10:22,480 Speaker 2: key moment according to him, where he's walking by a 174 00:10:22,559 --> 00:10:26,440 Speaker 2: train station and he sees this long line of people 175 00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:30,800 Speaker 2: and they look haggard, you know, their clothes are worn 176 00:10:31,240 --> 00:10:35,120 Speaker 2: and they're kind of downcast, and it's this long line. 177 00:10:35,160 --> 00:10:37,040 Speaker 2: It's like, what is this line? And he looks at 178 00:10:37,040 --> 00:10:39,920 Speaker 2: the front of the line and he sees that the 179 00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:44,280 Speaker 2: people are waiting to get a bowl of ramen noodle's 180 00:10:44,360 --> 00:10:48,520 Speaker 2: hot broth. It just looks so good and so satisfying 181 00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:52,920 Speaker 2: you would wait a long time for it. And Ondo thinks, 182 00:10:54,120 --> 00:10:57,560 Speaker 2: this is ridiculous, Like we're trying to talk people into 183 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:01,320 Speaker 2: eating bread. This food people basically don't want. That is 184 00:11:01,360 --> 00:11:05,199 Speaker 2: not a Japanese food. We should be turning that weat 185 00:11:05,240 --> 00:11:07,920 Speaker 2: into ramen, this food that people are lining up around 186 00:11:07,960 --> 00:11:08,680 Speaker 2: the block for. 187 00:11:08,600 --> 00:11:11,319 Speaker 1: Which is a very smart business thing to notice. There's 188 00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:13,400 Speaker 1: a huge demand for something that has a low supply. 189 00:11:14,120 --> 00:11:16,800 Speaker 1: There's this large supply of bread that no one wants. 190 00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:17,600 Speaker 1: I mean, it's great. 191 00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:22,960 Speaker 2: So there is this sort of corporate autobiography of Ondo 192 00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:27,079 Speaker 2: that talks about this moment, and he says he actually 193 00:11:27,160 --> 00:11:29,679 Speaker 2: goes to a guy from the Ministry of Health with 194 00:11:29,760 --> 00:11:32,360 Speaker 2: this idea, turn the weed into ramen. But he says 195 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:33,240 Speaker 2: there was a problem. 196 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:36,800 Speaker 1: At the time, however, ramen and Japanese udon were solely 197 00:11:36,840 --> 00:11:40,040 Speaker 1: the domain of small scale businesses. There was no pipeline 198 00:11:40,080 --> 00:11:44,240 Speaker 1: connecting us flower surpluses with the structures necessary to produce 199 00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:49,000 Speaker 1: and distribute noodles. The lack of adequate manufacturing facilities amounted 200 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:49,880 Speaker 1: to a bottleneck. 201 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:52,800 Speaker 2: A bottleneck one of the things we often see in 202 00:11:52,920 --> 00:11:53,800 Speaker 2: mystery of business. 203 00:11:54,240 --> 00:11:55,679 Speaker 1: And you can make a lot of money if you 204 00:11:55,720 --> 00:11:58,160 Speaker 1: figure out a way to solve the bottleneck. 205 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:00,760 Speaker 2: We need a printing press, but for ramen noodles, which 206 00:12:00,800 --> 00:12:03,400 Speaker 2: is what he's gonna do. Yeah, I mean, ramen at 207 00:12:03,400 --> 00:12:07,280 Speaker 2: this time is a craft product. I actually thought of 208 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:09,960 Speaker 2: cars before Henry Ford came along. You know, it's made 209 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:12,720 Speaker 2: in small batches, it's made fresh. It's the kind of 210 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:15,360 Speaker 2: thing we sort of fetishized today, like ooh, small batch. 211 00:12:15,440 --> 00:12:17,360 Speaker 2: That sounds nice, but you're not going to feed a 212 00:12:17,440 --> 00:12:21,880 Speaker 2: hungry nation with it. You just can't turn these shiploads 213 00:12:21,920 --> 00:12:25,800 Speaker 2: a wheat into ramen in this way. So Hondo has 214 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:28,760 Speaker 2: this idea, and maybe he would have solved this problem 215 00:12:28,840 --> 00:12:33,960 Speaker 2: right away, but for the fact that he got arrested again, Wow, criminal, 216 00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:37,560 Speaker 2: This time it was for tax evasion. For what it's 217 00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:40,520 Speaker 2: worth Onndo's story is that it was a misunderstanding about 218 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:44,360 Speaker 2: a scholarship program he started for his workers. What really happened, 219 00:12:44,400 --> 00:12:47,120 Speaker 2: I don't know, but again it's clear that he was arrested, 220 00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:49,640 Speaker 2: his assets were seized, and this time he spent two 221 00:12:49,800 --> 00:12:53,160 Speaker 2: years in prison some time. 222 00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:55,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a lot of time to think about, Robin. 223 00:12:56,400 --> 00:12:58,600 Speaker 2: And you don't even have insant ramen to eat while 224 00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:00,520 Speaker 2: you're inventcing because it hasn't been invented yet. So he 225 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:04,440 Speaker 2: gets out and now he is ready to make his 226 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:08,000 Speaker 2: big ramen breakthrough. After he runs a credit union for 227 00:13:08,080 --> 00:13:11,560 Speaker 2: six years until it fails and goes bankrupt. He tries 228 00:13:11,559 --> 00:13:13,079 Speaker 2: a lot of things that don't work. It's what I'm 229 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:14,000 Speaker 2: saying now. 230 00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:16,040 Speaker 1: You know what I have to say. This makes me 231 00:13:16,080 --> 00:13:19,240 Speaker 1: love him, not that he was some lifelong chef who 232 00:13:19,280 --> 00:13:21,679 Speaker 1: wanted to perfect this culinary thing but he's a guy 233 00:13:21,679 --> 00:13:23,960 Speaker 1: who tried a bunch of things. He's just looking for 234 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:24,520 Speaker 1: a way through. 235 00:13:24,559 --> 00:13:27,839 Speaker 2: He just keeps working at it. Okay, now he's ready, Yeah, 236 00:13:27,920 --> 00:13:31,000 Speaker 2: for going out in the shed in the backyard, supposedly 237 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:35,080 Speaker 2: having the breakthrough. This is the late fifties. By nineteen 238 00:13:35,120 --> 00:13:37,199 Speaker 2: fifty eight, he figures it out. Robert Smith, let's go 239 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:38,560 Speaker 2: to the official corporate narrative. 240 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:40,480 Speaker 1: Sure you can read this on a big wall at 241 00:13:40,480 --> 00:13:44,800 Speaker 1: the cup Noodle Museum. On August twenty fifth, nineteen fifty eight, 242 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:49,040 Speaker 1: chicken ramen, the world's first instant noodles, was launched. Since 243 00:13:49,160 --> 00:13:51,560 Speaker 1: chicken ramen, a food ready to eat in just two 244 00:13:51,600 --> 00:13:55,200 Speaker 1: minutes after adding hot water, was a product inconceivable under 245 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:59,760 Speaker 1: the conventional wisdom of the times, it was dubbed magic ramen. 246 00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:03,000 Speaker 2: They may have dubbed the noodles magic ramen. 247 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 1: Nobody else called it magic ramen. They called it magic ramen. 248 00:14:06,360 --> 00:14:09,320 Speaker 2: Yes, the thing that is clear from the historical record, 249 00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:14,400 Speaker 2: these noodles were not in conceivable under the conventional wisdom 250 00:14:14,440 --> 00:14:17,360 Speaker 2: of the time. In fact, someone else seems to have 251 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:23,200 Speaker 2: conceived them before. Momafuguando, Robert, We've got more history, this time, 252 00:14:23,200 --> 00:14:25,560 Speaker 2: not from an official corporate history, but from the book 253 00:14:25,960 --> 00:14:30,000 Speaker 2: The Untold History of Ramen by historian named George. 254 00:14:29,680 --> 00:14:34,400 Speaker 1: Sult, A much smaller company had already released an identical 255 00:14:34,440 --> 00:14:39,400 Speaker 1: product in nineteen fifty five called Flavored Chinese Noodles, three 256 00:14:39,480 --> 00:14:42,040 Speaker 1: years before the release of Chicken Ramen, but the company 257 00:14:42,120 --> 00:14:44,520 Speaker 1: was forced to halt production after a few months due 258 00:14:44,520 --> 00:14:45,520 Speaker 1: to weak sales. 259 00:14:45,840 --> 00:14:50,280 Speaker 2: Interesting, I turned out to exhibit B a Harvard Business 260 00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 2: School case study entitled Momofukuando and the Globalization of Noodles, 261 00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:59,360 Speaker 2: which points out that flash frying noodles to preserve them 262 00:14:59,960 --> 00:15:02,200 Speaker 2: was a technique that had been used since the early 263 00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:04,280 Speaker 2: twentieth century in. 264 00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:05,800 Speaker 1: Taiwan, where he's from. 265 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:10,360 Speaker 2: Where he's from, they called this noodle dish g c 266 00:15:11,040 --> 00:15:13,320 Speaker 2: yan jen pa mispronouncing. But I want to say it 267 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:15,920 Speaker 2: so I can quote directly from the Harvard Business schal 268 00:15:15,960 --> 00:15:21,000 Speaker 2: case study which says Taiwanese families shipped packages of g 269 00:15:21,240 --> 00:15:25,360 Speaker 2: siman to their relatives living in Japan when the country 270 00:15:25,480 --> 00:15:31,920 Speaker 2: experienced post war food shortages. It seems like Momofuku Ando 271 00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:36,120 Speaker 2: did not invent instant ramen. Even if he did go 272 00:15:36,200 --> 00:15:38,360 Speaker 2: to the shack, he wasn't the first guy to figure 273 00:15:38,400 --> 00:15:38,720 Speaker 2: it out. 274 00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:40,800 Speaker 1: You know. I'm okay with that. I'm okay with that. 275 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:43,120 Speaker 1: If there's one thing I've learned during this show, it's 276 00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:46,360 Speaker 1: that you know, invention is fine. Invention's great. I'm glad 277 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:49,600 Speaker 1: there are inventors out there, but ideas are plentiful and 278 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:50,960 Speaker 1: execution is rare. 279 00:15:51,160 --> 00:15:54,760 Speaker 2: Yes, when we did that story about Edison and the movies, 280 00:15:54,800 --> 00:15:57,720 Speaker 2: we talked about the similar theme. Right. Edison basically did 281 00:15:57,720 --> 00:16:01,080 Speaker 2: not invent the movies, but he got credit leased in 282 00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:04,160 Speaker 2: America for inventing the movies. And when we talked about that, 283 00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:10,080 Speaker 2: we talked about Joseph Schumpeter, the famous economists of the 284 00:16:10,080 --> 00:16:12,640 Speaker 2: guy who came up with the term creative struction, which 285 00:16:12,680 --> 00:16:16,400 Speaker 2: they love today in Silicon Valley, and he wrote beautifully 286 00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:20,640 Speaker 2: about the difference between inventors and entrepreneurs, which is what 287 00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:21,360 Speaker 2: we're talking about here. 288 00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:23,480 Speaker 1: So so give us that as long as they are 289 00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:28,000 Speaker 1: not carried into practice, inventions are economically irrelevant. And to 290 00:16:28,040 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 1: carry any improvement into effect is a task entirely different 291 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:34,720 Speaker 1: from the inventing of it, and a task moreover requiring 292 00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:38,920 Speaker 1: entirely different kinds of aptitudes. It is therefore not advisable, 293 00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:41,640 Speaker 1: and it may be downright misleading to stress the element 294 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:46,280 Speaker 1: of inventions as much as many writers do or podcasts do. Yeah, 295 00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:46,560 Speaker 1: we do. 296 00:16:46,720 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 2: That's us. We are stressing it too much because the 297 00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:53,800 Speaker 2: inventor is so fun, right, Like, yes, execution is what matters, 298 00:16:54,120 --> 00:16:56,960 Speaker 2: but like the guy in the shed, try to try 299 00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:58,080 Speaker 2: to come up with how to do it. 300 00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:01,400 Speaker 1: That is delightful. I think we like the lesson that 301 00:17:01,560 --> 00:17:04,600 Speaker 1: anyone can be struck by lightning. The light bulb goes off, 302 00:17:04,760 --> 00:17:07,600 Speaker 1: You come up with an idea and change the world. 303 00:17:08,080 --> 00:17:10,440 Speaker 1: If the real story is now you have to actually 304 00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:14,600 Speaker 1: work hard and do all the hard implementation things to 305 00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:17,199 Speaker 1: change the world. Well, that's not as much fun. That's 306 00:17:17,320 --> 00:17:19,000 Speaker 1: just a job, this drudgery. 307 00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:20,880 Speaker 2: And I used to think, I mean Edison, the guy 308 00:17:20,880 --> 00:17:23,639 Speaker 2: who more than anybody created the inventor narrative, you know, 309 00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:27,560 Speaker 2: is famously has one percent inspiration ninety nine percent perspiration. 310 00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:29,359 Speaker 2: And I used to think that was like what you 311 00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:32,439 Speaker 2: need to get to the invention. But no, it's what 312 00:17:32,520 --> 00:17:36,720 Speaker 2: you need after the invention to get to business success. 313 00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:39,440 Speaker 2: Like once you have the idea, all of the work 314 00:17:39,480 --> 00:17:42,040 Speaker 2: is before you. And I used to think that the 315 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:44,960 Speaker 2: myth of the inventor was an American thing or a 316 00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:49,119 Speaker 2: Silicon valley thing. But this story suggests that no, it 317 00:17:49,200 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 2: is in fact a global human thing. We love an 318 00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:59,240 Speaker 2: origin story, we love an inventor, and so Ando was 319 00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:04,960 Speaker 2: apparently not the inventor creating magic noodles out of one 320 00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:10,960 Speaker 2: percent inspiration, ninety nine percent perspiration and one percent cooking oil. 321 00:18:11,040 --> 00:18:14,879 Speaker 2: I know that is one hundred and one peralt and 322 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:15,359 Speaker 2: you got. 323 00:18:15,320 --> 00:18:16,480 Speaker 1: You've got the secret recipe. 324 00:18:16,520 --> 00:18:19,879 Speaker 2: But he was. He was a great entrepreneur. He was 325 00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:24,440 Speaker 2: the guy who brought instant ramen to the world, which 326 00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:49,920 Speaker 2: we will talk about after the break. Mama fuku Ono's 327 00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:53,679 Speaker 2: first instant ramen. It does seem like it was good ramen. 328 00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:58,560 Speaker 2: It's called chicken ramen because he actually cooked in some 329 00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:01,560 Speaker 2: way cooked the noodles in chicken broth before he flashed 330 00:19:01,600 --> 00:19:01,959 Speaker 2: fried there. 331 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:03,280 Speaker 1: Oh, the flavor was big. 332 00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:06,760 Speaker 2: Flavor was fried right in and so there was no 333 00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:07,480 Speaker 2: flavor packet. 334 00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:07,960 Speaker 1: Initially. 335 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:10,720 Speaker 2: You just add the hot water and you and there 336 00:19:10,800 --> 00:19:12,520 Speaker 2: was in the block of noodle. It was a block 337 00:19:12,520 --> 00:19:15,560 Speaker 2: of noodles like now in a top ramen pack but 338 00:19:15,640 --> 00:19:17,879 Speaker 2: it had a little divot on top, and the idea 339 00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:20,000 Speaker 2: was you crack an egg into that divot and then 340 00:19:20,040 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 2: you pour the hot water over the whole thing, and 341 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:24,480 Speaker 2: the egg kind of poaches while the noodle cooks. 342 00:19:24,520 --> 00:19:25,000 Speaker 1: I like that. 343 00:19:25,640 --> 00:19:28,800 Speaker 2: Bring that one back. Yeah. He calls his ramen company 344 00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:32,760 Speaker 2: Nissin Foods. The official story is that the new name 345 00:19:33,960 --> 00:19:38,280 Speaker 2: symbolizes his desire to create a rich flavor purely each day, 346 00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:43,639 Speaker 2: because Nietzsche means day and chin means pure. Now, we 347 00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:47,560 Speaker 2: could talk about Hondo making instant ramen in his house 348 00:19:47,600 --> 00:19:50,120 Speaker 2: with his family, hundreds of packs a day. We could 349 00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:52,160 Speaker 2: talk about him putting on a suit and doing a 350 00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:54,919 Speaker 2: demo at a fancy department store in Tokyo, calling out 351 00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:57,520 Speaker 2: to passers by. Those things really happened. But you know 352 00:19:57,560 --> 00:19:58,919 Speaker 2: what I want to talk about. I want to talk 353 00:19:58,920 --> 00:20:04,160 Speaker 2: about Momofuku's real edison move suing all his rivals. 354 00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:05,280 Speaker 1: Oh so good. 355 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:09,439 Speaker 2: First, he tries to trademark the chicken ramen name in 356 00:20:09,760 --> 00:20:13,120 Speaker 2: late nineteen fifty nine and finds they're already thirteen other 357 00:20:13,160 --> 00:20:16,439 Speaker 2: companies making a similar product under that name. Goes to 358 00:20:16,520 --> 00:20:20,879 Speaker 2: court wins exclusive rights to the name. Next problem, somebody 359 00:20:20,920 --> 00:20:25,520 Speaker 2: else has already patented his flash frying method. Another guy 360 00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:28,400 Speaker 2: who was born in Taiwan actually and had been running 361 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:30,879 Speaker 2: a noodle shop in Japan, for years by that point, 362 00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:34,440 Speaker 2: and so Ando negotiates with the guy winds up buying 363 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:38,159 Speaker 2: the patent. And according to that HBS case study, the 364 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:43,800 Speaker 2: contract apparently included a provision not to talk publicly about 365 00:20:43,840 --> 00:20:46,480 Speaker 2: any relationship to Momofuku's Chicken. 366 00:20:46,520 --> 00:20:47,960 Speaker 1: Ram He's already building up the myth. 367 00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:49,800 Speaker 2: He's already building up the myth. First rule of buying 368 00:20:49,840 --> 00:20:53,560 Speaker 2: up intellectual property rights. Don't talk about buying up intellectual 369 00:20:53,600 --> 00:20:57,440 Speaker 2: property rights. But I guess somehow the world leaked anyways, 370 00:20:57,520 --> 00:21:02,520 Speaker 2: because a newspaper asked Ando about this deal. Here's what 371 00:21:02,560 --> 00:21:02,960 Speaker 2: he said. 372 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:06,560 Speaker 1: I am not thinking about monopolizing the instant Ramen business. 373 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:08,840 Speaker 1: I want to authorize the use of the patent by 374 00:21:08,840 --> 00:21:12,199 Speaker 1: companies with excellent facilities and technology. If it could we 375 00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:15,320 Speaker 1: used to prevent surplus production and sharp price drops. I 376 00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:19,159 Speaker 1: believe that the industry can be stabilized. You're saying, I 377 00:21:19,160 --> 00:21:21,639 Speaker 1: want to share the miracle that is instant Ramen. 378 00:21:22,320 --> 00:21:26,399 Speaker 2: This sounds like JP Morgan to me. You know, monopolies 379 00:21:26,400 --> 00:21:28,440 Speaker 2: in nineteen hundred, why do we have all these steel 380 00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:31,960 Speaker 2: companies competing with each other and making a chaotic market. 381 00:21:31,960 --> 00:21:34,760 Speaker 2: Wouldn't it be much better if one steel company sold 382 00:21:34,880 --> 00:21:36,600 Speaker 2: all the steel in an orderly fashion. 383 00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:38,040 Speaker 1: I'm not hitting for the bunny. I mean it to 384 00:21:38,040 --> 00:21:40,080 Speaker 1: prevent surplus production of ramen. 385 00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:46,960 Speaker 2: So Ando starts threatening rivals with patent violation lawsuits, reaches 386 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:51,880 Speaker 2: agreements with twenty companies to share patent rights in exchange 387 00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:53,679 Speaker 2: for a portion of their revenues. They're all kind of 388 00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:56,840 Speaker 2: banding together. Some of the other ramen companies, they're a 389 00:21:56,840 --> 00:22:00,200 Speaker 2: lot by this point, hold out and form their own cartels. 390 00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:03,440 Speaker 2: And in the end the government gets involved and broker's 391 00:22:03,680 --> 00:22:06,240 Speaker 2: a deal. Are they fighting in the streets, like do 392 00:22:06,280 --> 00:22:07,800 Speaker 2: they go and hitting each other over the head with 393 00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:08,720 Speaker 2: drive noodles? 394 00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:10,440 Speaker 1: They go to the factory and break all the news 395 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:11,200 Speaker 1: in the little pieces. 396 00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:14,200 Speaker 2: In the end, the government gets involved, broke as a deal, 397 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:18,399 Speaker 2: and there there wind up being three ramen cartels. Onto is, 398 00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:19,920 Speaker 2: you know, kind of at the center of one of them. 399 00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:22,520 Speaker 2: This is important. There is a bigger idea here. This 400 00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:25,960 Speaker 2: is a Japanese economic miracle idea. Right these decades, the 401 00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:31,240 Speaker 2: decades after the Second World War, Japan has this period 402 00:22:31,960 --> 00:22:37,199 Speaker 2: of incredible growth and the government is quite involved. It 403 00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:41,000 Speaker 2: is not free market growth like we might idealize it 404 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:44,280 Speaker 2: in the United States. The Japanese government is doing in 405 00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 2: a lot of industries what it is doing in Ramen. 406 00:22:47,680 --> 00:22:50,520 Speaker 2: It's managing the economy so that there is some competition. 407 00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:53,440 Speaker 1: You want competition because you want innovation, you want people 408 00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:54,720 Speaker 1: to feel motivated every day. 409 00:22:54,920 --> 00:22:57,400 Speaker 2: But there is a limit to that competition too much, 410 00:22:57,520 --> 00:23:00,040 Speaker 2: you know what. You don't want to drive people out 411 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 2: of business, no profit whatsoever. Yeah, that is the government's 412 00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:05,760 Speaker 2: point of view. Whether that is optimal or not, we 413 00:23:05,920 --> 00:23:06,439 Speaker 2: can debate. 414 00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:08,440 Speaker 1: It worked for a lot of East Asian countries around 415 00:23:08,440 --> 00:23:08,720 Speaker 1: this time. 416 00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:11,880 Speaker 2: It did. Indeed, this all comes together in a real 417 00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:17,200 Speaker 2: interesting way in nineteen fifty nine. So you know, right 418 00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:20,679 Speaker 2: at the beginning for Ando's business, when he realizes he 419 00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:25,600 Speaker 2: needs a distribution partner to scale, and he partners with. 420 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:31,280 Speaker 1: Mitsubishi Giant industrial conglomerate. 421 00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:33,680 Speaker 2: Giant and had been around in Japan for a while 422 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:34,240 Speaker 2: at this point. 423 00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:38,159 Speaker 1: I mean cars obviously, but what else, probably finance, probably 424 00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:39,879 Speaker 1: all sorts of actual steal. 425 00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:42,600 Speaker 2: I mean, we'll talk more about Mitsubishi in particular, but 426 00:23:42,640 --> 00:23:45,440 Speaker 2: let me just talk about where it fits in the 427 00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:48,800 Speaker 2: Japanese economy because it's it's it's exactly how the Japanese 428 00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:52,879 Speaker 2: economy works, and so before World War Two, Mitsubishi was 429 00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:58,920 Speaker 2: this giant, family owned conglomerate did basically everything, and there 430 00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:01,560 Speaker 2: were a few of these in Japan. Mitsui was another one. 431 00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:04,159 Speaker 2: And then after the war, the Americans came in and 432 00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:06,600 Speaker 2: essentially took over running Japan, and they were like, what 433 00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:09,080 Speaker 2: is this. This is not how we run an economy, 434 00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:12,560 Speaker 2: and they broke up these family owned conglomerates like Subishi. 435 00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:18,680 Speaker 2: But then after the Americans left, these firms started to reassemble, 436 00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:23,240 Speaker 2: but in a different way. Rather than a single family 437 00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:27,719 Speaker 2: controlling everything, which you had was this association of different 438 00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:30,399 Speaker 2: companies that had similar names, like maybe they all had 439 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:33,359 Speaker 2: Mitsubishi in the name, and they all owned stock in 440 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:36,440 Speaker 2: each other and coordinated with each other. This was called 441 00:24:36,440 --> 00:24:42,119 Speaker 2: a keretsu keretsu, and so Mitsubishi was a caretsu, which 442 00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:44,399 Speaker 2: meant it was a bunch of different companies that made 443 00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:48,320 Speaker 2: steel and chemicals and cars and trucks and ships and planes, 444 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:50,679 Speaker 2: and that sold life insurance, and that was in the 445 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:54,040 Speaker 2: shipping business and did the import export. And at the 446 00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:58,240 Speaker 2: center of it all was a bank, a bank that 447 00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:02,359 Speaker 2: financed all these other businesses, which was key because bank 448 00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:04,800 Speaker 2: capital was the key driver of the economy. At that point, 449 00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:07,880 Speaker 2: there was not some robust venture capital system like. 450 00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:08,359 Speaker 1: We have today. 451 00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:10,600 Speaker 2: There was not a giant stock market where you could 452 00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,120 Speaker 2: just go get money from the market for a new company. 453 00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:17,199 Speaker 2: And I will note that today the biggest bank slash 454 00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:23,240 Speaker 2: financial services firm in Japan is Mitsubishi UFJ Financial Group. 455 00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:25,879 Speaker 1: Similar to what Warren Buffett did, which is if you 456 00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:28,760 Speaker 1: have a lot of different businesses, having the ability to 457 00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:33,320 Speaker 1: allocate capital between the different companies, who's doing well, who 458 00:25:33,359 --> 00:25:37,159 Speaker 1: needs it? You know, who's generating cash, who wants more cash. 459 00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:40,120 Speaker 1: If you can do that correctly, you can build all 460 00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:42,040 Speaker 1: those businesses and grow faster than your competitor. 461 00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:44,919 Speaker 2: And is it right, Robert that the insurance company that 462 00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:47,640 Speaker 2: is at the center of Berkshire Hathaway is the kind 463 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:50,000 Speaker 2: of capital you know, using the float like I've heard that? 464 00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:53,160 Speaker 1: Is that true? Yeah? A lot of them excess cash 465 00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:55,040 Speaker 1: is coming from the insurance companies. 466 00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:56,600 Speaker 2: And financing these other businesses. 467 00:25:56,720 --> 00:25:57,280 Speaker 1: Yeah. 468 00:25:57,320 --> 00:26:00,720 Speaker 2: And this works for the Japanese economy. And it's an 469 00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:04,240 Speaker 2: interesting kind of capitalism, right. It's not just one company, 470 00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:07,679 Speaker 2: it's a few big companies guided by the government. The 471 00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:10,440 Speaker 2: government is quite involved in sort of what they're financing, 472 00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:13,199 Speaker 2: and you know, the Bank of pan is standing behind 473 00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:16,280 Speaker 2: these banks at the center of the Kretzus and you 474 00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:20,840 Speaker 2: get decades of extraordinary economic growth out of this system, which. 475 00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:23,199 Speaker 1: Sort of makes sense if you're talking about cars or 476 00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:27,560 Speaker 1: trucks or building transformers. Seems a little weird that instant 477 00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:30,679 Speaker 1: ramen would fit into this giant industrial system. 478 00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:34,320 Speaker 2: Ondo had a pitch about that. You know, he's this 479 00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:38,959 Speaker 2: little Ramen guy going to this giant global behemoth, and 480 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:41,480 Speaker 2: his pitch is much bigger than just noodles. He's thinking big. 481 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:45,480 Speaker 2: He says, Look, we're getting all this surplus wheat from 482 00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:48,840 Speaker 2: the US, a great deal on our key input for 483 00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:53,680 Speaker 2: our wheat noodles. The key thing for the Mitsubishi executive is, yeah, 484 00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:56,160 Speaker 2: this is import. This is you know, we can get 485 00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:59,439 Speaker 2: in on these wheat imports and maybe build our trade 486 00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:01,600 Speaker 2: relationship with the US, because of course we want to 487 00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:03,960 Speaker 2: be exporting all these things we're making to the US, 488 00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:06,560 Speaker 2: and so maybe Ramen will be like a wedge that 489 00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:10,280 Speaker 2: helps us build our trade relationship with the United States, 490 00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:14,359 Speaker 2: which could be huge for US. And so Mitsubishi becomes 491 00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:19,359 Speaker 2: a distributor for chicken ramen, and pretty soon Mitsubishi starts 492 00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:26,800 Speaker 2: using the motto Mitsubishi from ramen to missiles. It really 493 00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:29,360 Speaker 2: was another time. If you make missiles today, you don't 494 00:27:29,359 --> 00:27:32,040 Speaker 2: say missiles in your ad uh. 495 00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:35,879 Speaker 1: From killing you fast to killing you slow Mitsubishi. 496 00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:40,919 Speaker 2: Now Ando's got his product, he's got his intellectual property, 497 00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:45,840 Speaker 2: he's got his distribution. He just needs one more thing, marketing. 498 00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:49,000 Speaker 2: And if we know one thing about Mama Fukuwando, it 499 00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:52,520 Speaker 2: is that the man knows how to market. His first 500 00:27:52,560 --> 00:27:56,520 Speaker 2: move and I love this, he pushes instant ramen as 501 00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:57,359 Speaker 2: health food. 502 00:27:57,520 --> 00:27:57,879 Speaker 1: Why not? 503 00:27:58,119 --> 00:28:02,560 Speaker 2: Why not? The original ramen packaging has the phrase build 504 00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:06,760 Speaker 2: strength and a full meal boasting the highest nutrition and 505 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:10,760 Speaker 2: great taste. And at the time there was this belief 506 00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:14,159 Speaker 2: that part of the japan lost the war was that 507 00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:18,359 Speaker 2: the American diet made American stronger than the Japanese diet 508 00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:20,120 Speaker 2: made Japanese people rice. 509 00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:23,000 Speaker 1: Bad weak good, I mean in its reduced form. Yes. 510 00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:27,280 Speaker 2: In nineteen sixty Nissen adds B vitamins to its ramen 511 00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:29,920 Speaker 2: and is allowed to market chicken ramen as a government 512 00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:35,160 Speaker 2: certified special health food. Okay, okay, they got a mascot. 513 00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:39,800 Speaker 2: It's a little boy named Chibico. Forgiving me Chibco if 514 00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:42,400 Speaker 2: I'm saying your name wrong. He's got blonde hair, freckles, 515 00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:43,520 Speaker 2: and a baseball cap. 516 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:44,640 Speaker 1: He's a little American boy. 517 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:47,600 Speaker 2: He's a little American boy. Going back to this idea 518 00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:50,600 Speaker 2: that the you know, in post war Japan, the ideal 519 00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:54,680 Speaker 2: of kind of health and strength was American. They sponsored 520 00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:58,240 Speaker 2: a TV show. There's a chicken Ramen song that was 521 00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:00,520 Speaker 2: a hit that alas I couldn't find online. 522 00:29:00,640 --> 00:29:01,400 Speaker 1: You know, I'll say it. 523 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:05,040 Speaker 2: If anybody listening knows the chicken Ramen song, email us 524 00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:07,840 Speaker 2: a voice memo of you singing it. We will put 525 00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:10,800 Speaker 2: it on business history at pushkin dot FM. Please all 526 00:29:10,840 --> 00:29:14,920 Speaker 2: this marketing works. Japan loves instant ramen. Nissen is doing 527 00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:19,480 Speaker 2: great in Japan, but Momofuku always wants more. He wants 528 00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:22,440 Speaker 2: to grow. He has an entrepreneur's heart. He doesn't just 529 00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:25,200 Speaker 2: want to succeed. He wants more. That is the fundamental desire. 530 00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:29,680 Speaker 2: So in nineteen sixty six he flies to California to 531 00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:33,800 Speaker 2: figure out how to sell ramen to the United States 532 00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:34,320 Speaker 2: of America. 533 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:39,040 Speaker 1: I picture a madman esque scene of Momafuku ando in 534 00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:42,560 Speaker 1: his suit with a stack of ramen by the pool. 535 00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:45,120 Speaker 1: Everyone like, go, go, dancers in the sun. 536 00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:47,320 Speaker 2: You know where he goes. I respect him for this. 537 00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:49,160 Speaker 2: He doesn't go to the pool. He's not there to 538 00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:51,880 Speaker 2: you know, dine out on the expense account. He goes 539 00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:55,400 Speaker 2: to a supermarket, a supermarket in La in Los Angeles 540 00:29:55,960 --> 00:29:58,240 Speaker 2: and gives a few of the buyers at the store 541 00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:02,760 Speaker 2: samples of chicken ramen to try, and he watches as 542 00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:07,560 Speaker 2: they get paper coffee cups, break the noodles in half 543 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:10,880 Speaker 2: to fit in the cups, pour hot water on, and 544 00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:16,920 Speaker 2: then eat ramen with forks while they're standing up. Americans Americans, 545 00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:20,480 Speaker 2: And you could imagine him being scandalized by this. You 546 00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:22,800 Speaker 2: don't break the noodles, you don't eat them standing up, 547 00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:24,280 Speaker 2: you don't eat them with a fork. 548 00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:25,760 Speaker 1: There's a ceremony to this. 549 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:31,960 Speaker 2: But Momufuku is not scandalized. He doesn't care what the 550 00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:35,040 Speaker 2: norms are in Japan. He wants to sell noodles to Americans. 551 00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:39,560 Speaker 2: He's an entrepreneur, not a chef. He wants to make 552 00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:43,920 Speaker 2: the noodles in whatever way people will buy them. Here's 553 00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:44,880 Speaker 2: what he writes about it later. 554 00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:48,080 Speaker 1: It seems obvious, but I was reminded that Americans do 555 00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:51,200 Speaker 1: not eat with chopsticks and raben bowls. I believe that 556 00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:54,880 Speaker 1: deliciousness has no borders, but there's a cultural barrier to 557 00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:59,160 Speaker 1: eating habits. This is smart. Yes, we don't have a 558 00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:01,400 Speaker 1: tradition of what do you do with a block of noodles? 559 00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:02,840 Speaker 1: You put in a paper cup. 560 00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:06,719 Speaker 2: So he's sitting there watching those guys eating their noodles 561 00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:15,920 Speaker 2: out of a cup noodles, cup, cup noodles, cup noodles, 562 00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:17,400 Speaker 2: Robert Smith, where is this going? 563 00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:20,760 Speaker 1: He invents cup noodles. He puts the noodles in the cups. 564 00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:22,840 Speaker 1: Sell the cup too. You could charge an extra dollar. 565 00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:25,680 Speaker 1: Thirty cirty cents is closer to it. 566 00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:30,160 Speaker 2: Yes, he invents cup noodles, which in various times and 567 00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:33,680 Speaker 2: places is also called cup noodle and cup o noodles. 568 00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:37,760 Speaker 1: In Ireland it was called cup o noodles. I'm just joking. 569 00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:44,800 Speaker 2: I will say cup noodles is not entirely trivial to 570 00:31:44,800 --> 00:31:46,560 Speaker 2: figure out, and this one, as far as I know, 571 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:50,880 Speaker 2: ando did figure out. I direct your attention now to 572 00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:56,040 Speaker 2: us patent three nine nine seven six seven six a 573 00:31:56,640 --> 00:32:00,240 Speaker 2: instant cooking cup to noodles and a method of producing same. 574 00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:05,160 Speaker 1: Ooh okay, let me read this. The denser top portion 575 00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:09,480 Speaker 1: of the lump prevents the lower portion from losing heat 576 00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:13,960 Speaker 1: and remaining unswelled. Thus you formally heated and swelled noodles 577 00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:17,320 Speaker 1: are achieved. The flat, dense top of the lump can 578 00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:22,640 Speaker 1: advantageously have placed thereon dried meats, vegetables, et cetera, which 579 00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:25,480 Speaker 1: will not fall into the lump and will therefore present 580 00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:29,760 Speaker 1: colorful and tasty appearance. This is complicated. So what we 581 00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:34,400 Speaker 1: did is we actually took a cup noodles and we 582 00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:39,880 Speaker 1: cut away the side. Tell me what's innovative about this 583 00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:40,640 Speaker 1: that we see. 584 00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:43,240 Speaker 2: By the way, if you're listening, you can see this 585 00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:47,880 Speaker 2: happening on YouTube. So yes, So there is something, Robert 586 00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:50,520 Speaker 2: that you didn't describe that is part of the innovation 587 00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:52,640 Speaker 2: here that is elsewhere in the patent, and that is 588 00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:55,040 Speaker 2: if you cut, if you make a cross section of 589 00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:57,280 Speaker 2: a cup of cup noodles, as you have done here, 590 00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:00,880 Speaker 2: you actually see that the block of noodles is suspended 591 00:33:01,600 --> 00:33:03,560 Speaker 2: in the middle of the cup. There space at the 592 00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:05,719 Speaker 2: top and at the bottom. I did not know there 593 00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:08,280 Speaker 2: was space at the bottom of the bottom. They are 594 00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:10,720 Speaker 2: not trying to rip you off. This is not non 595 00:33:10,760 --> 00:33:13,120 Speaker 2: functional slack fills. It's called in the trade. This is 596 00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:18,040 Speaker 2: functional slack fill because what it means is two things. One, 597 00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:20,960 Speaker 2: it gives space for the noodles to expand in both directions. 598 00:33:21,360 --> 00:33:24,640 Speaker 2: But the space underneath means the water goes through and 599 00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:27,800 Speaker 2: then the steam comes up and cooks the noodles. That 600 00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:30,400 Speaker 2: is part of the genius. And it's really quite something 601 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:32,600 Speaker 2: to look at. It really does look like a beautiful 602 00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:35,640 Speaker 2: industrial food when you cut it open from the side. 603 00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:41,000 Speaker 1: Genius And this was an actual invention a MoMA or 604 00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:41,400 Speaker 1: his team. 605 00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:43,959 Speaker 2: His name is on the patent and I think it 606 00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:47,120 Speaker 2: was him, Robert put the cup noodles down. 607 00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:49,240 Speaker 1: We're going to go on with should get the noodles 608 00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:50,800 Speaker 1: to the precise size to put it. 609 00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:54,480 Speaker 2: It's incredible. I think that's in the patent. Actually a plug. 610 00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:57,160 Speaker 2: I think they might call it a plug noodle plug. 611 00:33:57,520 --> 00:34:03,920 Speaker 2: Onto actually rolls out cup noodles first in Japan in 612 00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:07,480 Speaker 2: September of nineteen seventy one, and it does okay, But 613 00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:10,239 Speaker 2: it's not a thing that people in Japan have been 614 00:34:10,319 --> 00:34:12,640 Speaker 2: clamoring for. You know, he was in tired to invent 615 00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:17,239 Speaker 2: it for American leaders. But a few months later, in 616 00:34:17,359 --> 00:34:21,920 Speaker 2: February of nineteen seventy two, cup noodles has its big 617 00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:25,560 Speaker 2: moment in Japan, and it is not the big moment 618 00:34:25,600 --> 00:34:28,719 Speaker 2: that I would have expected. We'll talk about that in 619 00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:51,760 Speaker 2: just a minute. We're back from the break. It's nineteen 620 00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:54,680 Speaker 2: seventy two. Cup Noodles is about to have its big moment, 621 00:34:55,760 --> 00:35:01,720 Speaker 2: and here's what happens. Members of a radical leftist student 622 00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:06,200 Speaker 2: group in Japan called the United Red Army have an 623 00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:10,600 Speaker 2: internal purge. We promise it's about rawman, it's about cup nuts. 624 00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:15,040 Speaker 1: So leftist student group, radicals, they have an internal perch. 625 00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:18,400 Speaker 2: They kill fourteen of their own group's members, along with 626 00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:22,319 Speaker 2: an innocent bystander. The cops are after them, the chases on. 627 00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:25,320 Speaker 2: They flee to a vacation lodge in a resort town. 628 00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:29,520 Speaker 2: At some point they kill two police officers and they 629 00:35:29,560 --> 00:35:32,480 Speaker 2: hole up in this lodge and they take the lodge 630 00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:36,560 Speaker 2: manager's wife hostage, and now there is a ten day 631 00:35:36,719 --> 00:35:44,160 Speaker 2: long hostage standoff. You may be asking yourself, what was 632 00:35:44,200 --> 00:35:48,640 Speaker 2: the deal with this radical leftist student group. I don't know. 633 00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:52,000 Speaker 2: I don't know anything about radical politics in Japan in 634 00:35:52,040 --> 00:35:55,880 Speaker 2: the nineteen seventies. But if you were asking yourself what 635 00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:58,400 Speaker 2: does this have to do with cup Noodles, then you 636 00:35:58,440 --> 00:35:59,200 Speaker 2: are in luck. 637 00:35:59,040 --> 00:36:02,000 Speaker 1: Because we're business history, not radical student movement history. 638 00:36:02,080 --> 00:36:07,080 Speaker 2: The hostage standoff was broadcast live on TV. Basically, everybody 639 00:36:07,080 --> 00:36:12,040 Speaker 2: in Japan is watching this all the time. On and 640 00:36:12,120 --> 00:36:16,520 Speaker 2: his company had been trying to get people in various 641 00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:20,480 Speaker 2: jobs to eat cup noodles, trying to show them it's 642 00:36:20,480 --> 00:36:22,480 Speaker 2: a very convenient food if you're busy, if you're on 643 00:36:22,520 --> 00:36:26,960 Speaker 2: the go. And what everybody in Japan saw as they 644 00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:31,040 Speaker 2: were glued to their TVs during the hostage standoff was tough, 645 00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:36,920 Speaker 2: grizzled Japanese police officers fighting cold and hunger and eating 646 00:36:37,239 --> 00:36:42,920 Speaker 2: cup noodles. Eventually, the heroic police officers, fueled by courage 647 00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:46,080 Speaker 2: and cup noodles, storm the lodge in a morning raid 648 00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:51,560 Speaker 2: and capture the killers. And now cup noodles is a 649 00:36:51,560 --> 00:36:55,800 Speaker 2: phenomenon in Japan. It's in vending machines in Tokyo office buildings, 650 00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:59,759 Speaker 2: second best selling vending machine item after Coca Cola. And 651 00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:03,280 Speaker 2: it's time for cup noodles to go to America. Ondo 652 00:37:03,440 --> 00:37:06,319 Speaker 2: had been selling in America by this point. He had 653 00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:10,200 Speaker 2: started Nissing Foods USA in nineteen seventy, which was a 654 00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:13,120 Speaker 2: joint venture with another food company and his old pals 655 00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:18,319 Speaker 2: at Mitsubishi Good Friends to have shout out Kiretsu, and 656 00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:22,520 Speaker 2: as a baby step, they had started selling a packaged 657 00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:25,480 Speaker 2: drawmen under the brand name top Ramen. It's like the 658 00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:28,640 Speaker 2: top ramen you get today. It didn't do great. The 659 00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:32,640 Speaker 2: cup was the big breakthrough in America. For the US. 660 00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:35,480 Speaker 2: They call it cup O Noodles. They add pork and 661 00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:38,640 Speaker 2: beef flavors, and they make the noodles much shorter than 662 00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:41,640 Speaker 2: the noodles in the Japanese version, half the length. I 663 00:37:41,680 --> 00:37:44,560 Speaker 2: remember'd seen them breaking it. The Harvard Business School case 664 00:37:44,560 --> 00:37:47,920 Speaker 2: study actually explains why the noodles are shorter in the 665 00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:51,080 Speaker 2: American version in language that just delikes me, so I 666 00:37:51,080 --> 00:37:51,839 Speaker 2: want you to read it. 667 00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:54,480 Speaker 1: So the consumers would not have to make a slurping 668 00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:58,000 Speaker 1: sound while eating the product, whereas slurping was regarded as 669 00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:01,000 Speaker 1: part of good eating manners in Japan. The noise was 670 00:38:01,120 --> 00:38:04,480 Speaker 1: highly objectionable to many people in the United States. 671 00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:10,120 Speaker 2: Americans loved their broken in half noodle cup O noodles. 672 00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:11,920 Speaker 1: Just a little slurp, not a big slurp. 673 00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:17,640 Speaker 2: Now got Japan America Anddo and Nissin are off. They're 674 00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:20,160 Speaker 2: going to take over the world with instant noodles, and 675 00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:23,360 Speaker 2: you see this decade after decade they go from country 676 00:38:23,400 --> 00:38:28,680 Speaker 2: to country, opening factories, adapting the cup to suit individual tastes. 677 00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:33,239 Speaker 2: There's Chirosco in Brazil, Crab in Hong Kong, Tamyam in Thailand, 678 00:38:33,600 --> 00:38:37,600 Speaker 2: Masala in India, Miria in Mexico. You can actually get 679 00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:38,760 Speaker 2: that in the US now. 680 00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:40,759 Speaker 1: And it sounds delicious, and this is genius. This is 681 00:38:40,800 --> 00:38:44,040 Speaker 1: a great thing about cup noodles. You can put any 682 00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:45,000 Speaker 1: flavor you want in there. 683 00:38:45,160 --> 00:38:51,480 Speaker 2: They're incredibly ubiquitous. Nissan sells something like two billion cups 684 00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:55,040 Speaker 2: of cup noodle a year. Worldwide. People eat one hundred 685 00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:59,480 Speaker 2: and twenty billion servings of instant ramen per year. That's 686 00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:03,920 Speaker 2: all companies, and of course the researchers in Antarctica will 687 00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:08,280 Speaker 2: eat it there. Basically on every continent people eat instant 688 00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:13,359 Speaker 2: ramen like it is extraordinary wide it has spread, and 689 00:39:13,400 --> 00:39:17,160 Speaker 2: you know, it's also literally across the street from my house. 690 00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:20,120 Speaker 2: Like this morning, I'd been meaning to pick up cup 691 00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:22,920 Speaker 2: noodles as props for the show. I'd forgot, and this 692 00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:25,279 Speaker 2: morning I went to the bodega that is across the 693 00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:27,400 Speaker 2: street from my house, and of course they had it. 694 00:39:27,440 --> 00:39:30,000 Speaker 2: And it is not a big bodega. It's smaller than 695 00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:32,839 Speaker 2: the media in seven to eleven in America. And it's 696 00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:35,359 Speaker 2: not particularly cheap, right bodega's, You're pay a little more 697 00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:39,120 Speaker 2: for the convenience. Two cup noodles were available in abundance 698 00:39:39,160 --> 00:39:41,200 Speaker 2: across the street from my house. Two of them cost 699 00:39:41,280 --> 00:39:42,240 Speaker 2: me three dollars. 700 00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:44,600 Speaker 1: In New York City, you could never be more than 701 00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:46,120 Speaker 1: fifty yards from a cup. 702 00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:50,839 Speaker 2: Noodle, truly, and I suspected much of the world. Mamufukuno's 703 00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:58,560 Speaker 2: last big move was space ram ram and specially designed 704 00:39:58,600 --> 00:40:03,040 Speaker 2: to be eaten in space. He and his team designed 705 00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:06,080 Speaker 2: the noodles to be held together with egg whites to 706 00:40:06,200 --> 00:40:09,359 Speaker 2: cook at a lower temperature because there's not that much 707 00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:11,960 Speaker 2: pressure on a spaceship, so right, so water is gon 708 00:40:12,120 --> 00:40:15,359 Speaker 2: boil at a lower temperature. And in two thousand and five, 709 00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:21,400 Speaker 2: a Japanese astronaut eight space rom in space and it 710 00:40:21,520 --> 00:40:24,040 Speaker 2: made news around the world. 711 00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:29,200 Speaker 1: Momofuku Ando understood the power of a good story. And 712 00:40:29,239 --> 00:40:31,799 Speaker 1: that's just a great story. So good, what do they 713 00:40:31,840 --> 00:40:35,960 Speaker 1: sell one of those space? But it doesn't it doesn't matter. 714 00:40:36,640 --> 00:40:40,160 Speaker 1: We don't care if this is I don't know a 715 00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:42,279 Speaker 1: true story. That he was in the shack and all 716 00:40:42,360 --> 00:40:47,160 Speaker 1: this stuff. What we care about is that there is 717 00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:48,920 Speaker 1: a miracle in the world, and we just want a 718 00:40:48,920 --> 00:40:50,960 Speaker 1: little story that makes us feel better, you know, that 719 00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:54,319 Speaker 1: makes us feel warm and toasty inside, much as the 720 00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:56,640 Speaker 1: hot water does to the noodles in the cup. 721 00:40:58,120 --> 00:41:03,280 Speaker 2: Two years after the Astronaut eight space rom in Space, 722 00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:07,200 Speaker 2: Momofuku Ando died at age ninety six. 723 00:41:07,640 --> 00:41:09,320 Speaker 1: He had no more worlds to conquer. 724 00:41:09,480 --> 00:41:12,000 Speaker 2: He said the secret to long life was golf twice 725 00:41:12,200 --> 00:41:14,280 Speaker 2: week and chicken ramen every day. 726 00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:15,359 Speaker 1: Don't do it. 727 00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:18,960 Speaker 2: His funeral was space themed, was held at a stadium 728 00:41:19,080 --> 00:41:24,480 Speaker 2: in Osaka. Two former prime ministers attended, and it was 729 00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:27,919 Speaker 2: a celebration of the life of the man who, as 730 00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:33,040 Speaker 2: everyone knows, we've heard the story invented instant ramen. What 731 00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:38,239 Speaker 2: food should we do a story about? Tell us? You 732 00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:41,759 Speaker 2: can email us at Business History at pushkin dot fm. 733 00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:46,720 Speaker 2: You can find me on Twitter aka x or on LinkedIn. 734 00:41:47,120 --> 00:41:50,600 Speaker 2: Robert you are at Radio Smith, keeping the radio alive 735 00:41:51,080 --> 00:41:53,840 Speaker 2: one day at a time. Our show Today was produced 736 00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:57,000 Speaker 2: by Gabriel hunter Cheng. It was engineered by Sarah Buguer. 737 00:41:57,440 --> 00:42:00,239 Speaker 2: Our video editor is Matt Nielsen. If you want to 738 00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:03,919 Speaker 2: see a cross section of cup noodles. You can see 739 00:42:03,920 --> 00:42:06,760 Speaker 2: it on our YouTube page. Our showrunner and our editor, 740 00:42:07,560 --> 00:42:10,239 Speaker 2: and a man who calls cup noodles pot noodles I 741 00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:14,040 Speaker 2: think is Ryan Dilly. I'm Jacob Goldstein, I'm Robert Smith. 742 00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:15,440 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening.